from jcollier@siu.edu Tue Feb 1 08:46:07 2000 Subject: Small stream 3-4wt Hey guys, I'm looking for a short (7ft - 7 1/2ft) 3 to 4wt. Prefer amediumaction. E-mail me off list if you have something you are willing to get ridof. ThanksJohn Collier from mschaffer@mindspring.com Tue Feb 1 10:31:21 2000 Subject: Testing before final assembly ot tomato stake alert! boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0072_01BF6CA7.95090DC0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0072_01BF6CA7.95090DC0 Guys,I've got what is probably a very rookie question for you but I would, =nonetheless, like a serious answer.Is there some way to 'test flight' a rod before gluing on the ferrules. =Why I'm asking is that due to inexperience (especially with this flamed =rod) I'm not overly sure whether or not the rod will function and was =wondering how to test cast it (a 3 pc.) without gluing the ferrules- of =course if that's the only way to test it, then no problem, because I can =always remove and reuse the ferrules if the rod is a bust. Any help would be mucho appreciated!! Mike ------=_NextPart_000_0072_01BF6CA7.95090DC0 Guys,I've got what is probably a very rookie= Is there some way to 'test flight' a = gluing on the ferrules. Why I'm asking is that due to inexperience = with this flamed rod) I'm not overly sure whether or not the rod will = and was wondering how to test cast it (a 3 pc.) without gluing the = course if that's the only way to test it, then no problem, because I can = remove and reuse the ferrules if the rod is a bust. Any help would be mucho =appreciated!! Mike ------=_NextPart_000_0072_01BF6CA7.95090DC0-- from TSmithwick@aol.com Tue Feb 1 11:19:14 2000 Subject: Re: Testing before final assembly ot tomato stake alert! In a message dated 2/1/0 4:33:47 PM, mschaffer@mindspring.com writes: Mike-- I don't think there is anything really definitive you can do at this stage. I would relax and finish the rod. Unless you are really way off on your tolerances you should be OK. Ever if you are way off you may still get something usable. You can always take comfort from A.J. McClane'sobservation that there is no such thing as a fly rod that nobody likes. from caneman@clnk.com Tue Feb 1 13:50:22 2000 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35)with SMTP id com; Tue, 1 Feb 2000 10:36:45 -0600 Subject: Re: Testing before final assembly ot tomato stake alert! boundary="----=_NextPart_000_02A7_01BF6CA0.3CEA04C0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_02A7_01BF6CA0.3CEA04C0 Michael,Go ahead and glue on the ferrules... a little heat will take them =back off if you decide to scrap the rod. Tape the guides on with =electrical tape where you plan to permanently mount them, slip a tight =fitting grip on it, and tape the reel in place with electrical tape. =Cast it, if you like it, start finishing, if not... well, back to the = Later,Bob-----Original Message-----From: michael Date: Tuesday, February 01, 2000 10:31 AMSubject: Testing before final assembly ot tomato stake alert! Guys,I've got what is probably a very rookie question for you but I =would, nonetheless, like a serious answer.Is there some way to 'test flight' a rod before gluing on the =ferrules. Why I'm asking is that due to inexperience (especially with =this flamed rod) I'm not overly sure whether or not the rod will =function and was wondering how to test cast it (a 3 pc.) without gluing =the ferrules- of course if that's the only way to test it, then no =problem, because I can always remove and reuse the ferrules if the rod =is a bust. Any help would be mucho appreciated!! Mike ------=_NextPart_000_02A7_01BF6CA0.3CEA04C0 Michael, and glue on the ferrules... a little heat will take them back off if you = to permanently mount them, slip a tight fitting grip on it, and tape the = finishing, if not... well, back to the planing form. Later,Bob -----Original = rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= <rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= Tuesday, February 01, 2000 10:31 AMSubject: Testing = final assembly ot tomato stake alert!Guys,I've got what is probably a very = answer.Is there some way to 'test flight' = (especially with this flamed rod) I'm not overly sure whether or not = will function and was wondering how to test cast it (a 3 pc.) = the ferrules- of course if that's the only way to test it, then no = bust. appreciated!! Mike ------=_NextPart_000_02A7_01BF6CA0.3CEA04C0-- from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Tue Feb 1 14:15:02 2000 Tue, 1 Feb 2000 12:14:56 -0800 Subject: Snake Brand guides Friends,Thought I would echo what Wayne Cattanach said a few weeks ago.I just received a very large ($3000+) order of guides from Mike McCoy atSnake Brand guides. I've never seen guides this nice. Nice to knowI'll never have to grind guide feet again!!I have no financial connection to Mike. I'm just a verysatisfied customer. When you need some guides, you will want to givethese serious consideration. Look for his website at www.snakebrand.com Harry --Harry Boydhttp://HarryBoydbamboorods.eboard.com/ from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Tue Feb 1 14:31:33 2000 Subject: Re: Snake Brand guides Ooops,Wrong url. Try this link: http://www.snakeguides.com/ Sorry,Harry Harry Boyd wrote: Friends,Thought I would echo what Wayne Cattanach said a few weeks ago.I just received a very large ($3000+) order of guides from Mike McCoy atSnake Brand guides. I've never seen guides this nice. Nice to knowI'll never have to grind guide feet again!!I have no financial connection to Mike. I'm just a verysatisfied customer. When you need some guides, you will want to givethese serious consideration. Look for his website atwww.snakebrand.com Harry --Harry Boydhttp://HarryBoydbamboorods.eboard.com/ --Harry Boydhttp://HarryBoydbamboorods.eboard.com/ from plaisanc@pacifier.com Tue Feb 1 17:25:30 2000 Subject: help,anyone? boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0005_01BF6AA8.5E86B640" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01BF6AA8.5E86B640 I recently purchased (real cheap )a 3 piece split bamboo spin/fly combo =in a wooden box,the box is marked "sure strike"with a leaping fish .The =rod itself needs some work(not much)but all in all is in pretty good =shape.My question is has anyone heard of this brand,if so what can you =tell me about it.I appreciate any info.you can provide.thank you ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01BF6AA8.5E86B640 I recently purchased (real cheap )a 3 = bamboo spin/fly combo in a wooden box,the box is marked "sure = leaping fish .The rod itself needs some work(not much)but all in all is = pretty good shape.My question is has anyone heard of this brand,if so = you ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01BF6AA8.5E86B640-- from nobler@satx.rr.com Tue Feb 1 17:46:23 2000 SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.197.19);Tue, 1 Feb 2000 17:46:46 -0600 Subject: Re: help,anyone? boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0082_01BF6CDC.6995E7A0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0082_01BF6CDC.6995E7A0 I'm pretty sure you have one of the "kits" put out from Japan, in the =post WWII era. They came in many packages, some with 6 or 8 pieces for =different types of casting. I'm sure there are some fine rods, that come = from Japan now, but I'm afraid you have one of those that were pretty =poor in quality. GMA Sent: Sunday, January 30, 2000 12:29 AMSubject: help,anyone? I recently purchased (real cheap )a 3 piece split bamboo spin/fly =combo in a wooden box,the box is marked "sure strike"with a leaping fish =.The rod itself needs some work(not much)but all in all is in pretty =good shape.My question is has anyone heard of this brand,if so what can =you tell me about it.I appreciate any info.you can provide.thank you ------=_NextPart_000_0082_01BF6CDC.6995E7A0 I'm pretty sure you have one of the "kits" put out from Japan, in = WWII era. They came in many packages, some with 6 or 8 pieces for = types of casting. I'm sure there are some fine rods, that come from = but I'm afraid you have one of those that were pretty poor in =quality. GMA ----- Original Message ----- Plaisance = Sent: Sunday, January 30, 2000 = AMSubject: help,anyone? I recently purchased (real cheap )a 3= bamboo spin/fly combo in a wooden box,the box is marked "sure = leaping fish .The rod itself needs some work(not much)but all in all = pretty good shape.My question is has anyone heard of this brand,if so = you ------=_NextPart_000_0082_01BF6CDC.6995E7A0-- from jbperez@mi.madritel.es Tue Feb 1 18:46:17 2000 (Netscape Messaging Server 3.5) with SMTP id AAA4879 +0100 Subject: bamboo boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0036_01BF6D1F.29D1EAE0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0036_01BF6D1F.29D1EAE0 Thanks toall those people that you are helping me in, neither it =consults about thebamboo.I am sure it will be very useful,at the moment I am novice in the "art =of fishing rods",but I have carried out test with bamboo of low =quality, that I have boughtin gardenig centers,to practice the assembly techniques and in principle =I don=B4t need big quantities of bamboo canes, until it manufactures two=or three canes in a correct way. Ian kearney,Tony Specio,Ray Gould,Jagusch Rainer and Dany twang. from today you have a friend in Spain.GOOD FISHING!!!!! To Dany:Please,send me the e-mail adress and web page of your =distribuitor in denmark,thanks. ------=_NextPart_000_0036_01BF6D1F.29D1EAE0 Thanks toall those people that you are helping me = it consults about thebamboo.I am sure it will be very useful,at the = in gardenig centers,to practice the assembly = principle I don=B4t need big quantities of bamboo canes, until it = or three canes in a correct way. Ian kearney,Tony Specio,Ray Gould,Jagusch Rainerand = twang. from today you have a friend in Spain.GOOD FISHING!!!!! To Dany:Please,send me the e-mail adress and web = distribuitor in denmark,thanks. ------=_NextPart_000_0036_01BF6D1F.29D1EAE0-- from ernie2@pacbell.net Tue Feb 1 18:55:12 2000 sims.3.5.1999.09.16.21.57.p8)with SMTP id for Subject: Re: Splicing Block Thanks to everyone that supplied information about splicing blocks. Thisisa great group.Ernie Harrison from pmgoodwin@earthlink.net Tue Feb 1 19:26:50 2000 Subject: snake guide size and placement Hi, how does one determine the number and size of guides on a rod? Paul from listreader@codemarine.com Tue Feb 1 19:31:12 2000 codemarine.209.170.128.193 with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet MailService Version5.5.2448.0) Subject: RE: snake guide size and placement I've wondered this as well. One of the books (Maurer) I have hasplacement/size charts placementalgorithmn, isn't there? Steve Zimmermansteve@codemarine.com -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Tuesday, February 01, 2000 8:24 PM Subject: snake guide size and placement Hi, how does one determine the number and size of guides on a rod? Paul from saltwein@swbell.net Tue Feb 1 20:08:42 2000 (Sun Internet Mail Server sims.3.5.1999.09.16.21.57.p8)with ESMTP id for Subject: Re: snake guide size and placement Steve, I use one more guide then the length of the rod, plus the stripper. I start from 4-4.5inches from the tip and place the stripper from 28-32 inches from the end.I then playwith the guides in betweento get a natural progression. Deleting a guide if I find it fits the rodbetter. Regards, SteveIndependence, MO Steve Zimmerman wrote: I've wondered this as well. One of the books (Maurer) I have hasplacement/size charts placementalgorithmn, isn't there? Steve Zimmermansteve@codemarine.com -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Tuesday, February 01, 2000 8:24 PM Subject: snake guide size and placement Hi, how does one determine the number and size of guides on a rod? Paul from dpvbkjs@somtel.com Tue Feb 1 20:12:39 2000 Subject: file for planing form I happened upon a Stanley Short Cut saw sharpening kit (Part # 22-434) atmy local salvage center that seems like would make a great tool fortuningup planing forms. It is about 8" long and about 3/8" on a side with twosides with teeth. It has no taper and about half of it is coated withplastic to make a "handle". It seems like it could be easily attached to ablock. Any thoughts.... David from twinpinesrods@mindspring.com Tue Feb 1 21:01:29 2000 Subject: Hello again Just a quick note to say hello. I've been off the list for a while but I'm still alive and kicking. Jobconstraints have slowed my rod building but I still manage to generate agood pile of shavings now and then. The good news (for me) is that I haverecently moved to Colorado. I feel fortunate to have lived in the warmwater fishing paradise that Florida is and now to be in Colorado 10minutes from the cold water streams that I enjoy so much. Life is good. I lookforward to being part of the list again and hope that I can contribute fromtime to time. from d_price@global2000.net Tue Feb 1 21:06:53 2000 WAA00914 Subject: Re: snake guide size and placement Disregard my last post, this is how my bamboo rods are!. Thanks Dave Price Steve Trauthwein wrote: Steve, I use one more guide then the length of the rod, plus the stripper. I start from 4-4.5inches from the tip and place the stripper from 28-32 inches from the end.I then playwith the guides in betweento get a natural progression. Deleting a guide if I find it fits the rodbetter. Regards, SteveIndependence, MO Steve Zimmerman wrote: I've wondered this as well. One of the books (Maurer) I have hasplacement/sizecharts for various rods, but it's not comprehensive. Clearly there is somesort ofplacement algorithmn, isn't there? Steve Zimmermansteve@codemarine.com -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu GoodwinSent: Tuesday, February 01, 2000 8:24 PM Subject: snake guide size and placement Hi, how does one determine the number and size of guides on a rod? Paul from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Tue Feb 1 21:47:16 2000 Subject: Re: snake guide size and placement Steve,Wayne Cattanach's book includes a computer disk which contains aprogram for givingyou an even guide spacing. You index all the guides off of the one nearesttheferrule(s). I'm not sure you canstill download the newer versions of that program off of Wayne's site,but you could atone time. At any rate, the 2nd edition of his book should be out before toolong, andI'm sure it will have thatsame program. Harry Steve Zimmerman wrote: I've wondered this as well. One of the books (Maurer) I have hasplacement/sizecharts for various rods, but it's not comprehensive. Clearly there is somesort ofplacement algorithmn, isn't there? Steve Zimmermansteve@codemarine.com -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu GoodwinSent: Tuesday, February 01, 2000 8:24 PM Subject: snake guide size and placement Hi, how does one determine the number and size of guides on a rod? Paul --Harry Boydhttp://HarryBoydbamboorods.eboard.com/ from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Tue Feb 1 21:51:54 2000 Tue, 1 Feb 2000 19:51:38 -0800 Subject: Re: file for planing form What do the "teeth" look like? That makes a lot of difference in howaggressively the file cuts. Harry Boyd "D.P. Van Burgel & K.J. Scott" wrote: I happened upon a Stanley Short Cut saw sharpening kit (Part # 22-434)atmy local salvage center that seems like would make a great tool fortuningup planing forms. It is about 8" long and about 3/8" on a side with twosides with teeth. It has no taper and about half of it is coated withplastic to make a "handle". It seems like it could be easily attached to ablock. Any thoughts.... David --Harry Boydhttp://HarryBoydbamboorods.eboard.com/ from nsflyrods@ns.sympatico.ca Wed Feb 2 03:56:28 2000 Wed, 2 Feb 2000 05:55:55 -0400 Subject: Re: Snake Brand guides I've heard so many good things about Snake brand that I want to give thematry, however most tapers I am building recommend down to a 3/0 andsometimes4/0 guide. The smallest that Snake brand comes in is 2/0. What do youguysdo, just substitute another brand for the small ones or replace them with2/0's? Shawn Harry Boyd wrote: Friends,Thought I would echo what Wayne Cattanach said a few weeks ago.I just received a very large ($3000+) order of guides from Mike McCoy atSnake Brand guides. I've never seen guides this nice. Nice to knowI'll never have to grind guide feet again!!I have no financial connection to Mike. I'm just a verysatisfied customer. When you need some guides, you will want to givethese serious consideration. Look for his website atwww.snakebrand.com Harry --Harry Boydhttp://HarryBoydbamboorods.eboard.com/ from Danny.Twang@porsgrunnsdagblad.no Wed Feb 2 04:16:06 2000 (HELO localhost) Wed, 02 Feb 2000 11:14:45 +0100 munin.funn.no(Data Fellows SMTPRS 2.04) with ESMTP id;Wed, 02 Feb 2000 11:15:26 +0100 Subject: Re: bamboo A9FA34C6219EDEB3FA79B1EB" --------------A9FA34C6219EDEB3FA79B1EB HOLA PEREZ There is no distributor in Denmark.It was my mentor, helping me out with a couple of culms when I firststarted building.He also came over 50 culms that we split between us. As i wrote, I don'tthink there is morebamboo to find here up north..... regardsdanny Juan B. Perez wrote: Thanks toall those people that you are helping me in, neither itconsults about thebamboo. To Dany:Please,send me the e-mail adress andweb page of your distribuitor in denmark,thanks. --------------A9FA34C6219EDEB3FA79B1EB HOLA PEREZ There is no distributor in Denmark.It was my mentor, helping me out with a couple of culms when I firststarted building.He also came over 50 culms that we split between us. As i wrote, Idon't think there is morebamboo to find here up north..... regardsdanny Juan B. Perez wrote: Thanks toallthose people that you are helping me in, neither it consults about Dany:Please,send me the e-mail adress and web page of your distribuitorin denmark,thanks. --------------A9FA34C6219EDEB3FA79B1EB-- from jfreeman@cyberport.com Wed Feb 2 05:38:01 2000 Subject: Re: snake guide size and placement All, Interesting article in RodMaker (not BRMM) magazine on guide placement - basically, one takes an 8' x 4' piece of peg board; clamps the rod to theupper part (long side); bend the rod where the tip is about 90 deg. from thebutt; and hold in place. Number of guides starts with 1 each per foot ofrod, but can change if needed. Divide the total rod length by the guides tocome up with an equidistant measurement. Lay this out on the side of theboard (short side) using the 1" hole spacing and carry over to the rod. Dueto the bend in the rod, the spacing becomes graduated. Haven't tried it yet, so don't kill the messenger. Looks good to me though. TaJim----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: snake guide size and placement Steve, I use one more guide then the length of the rod, plus the stripper. Istart from 4-4.5 inches from the tip and place the stripper from 28-32inches from the end. I then play with the guides in betweento get a natural progression. Deleting a guide if I find it fits the rodbetter. Regards, SteveIndependence, MO Steve Zimmerman wrote: I've wondered this as well. One of the books (Maurer) I have hasplacement/size charts for various rods, but it's not comprehensive.Clearlythere is some sort of placement algorithmn, isn't there? Steve Zimmermansteve@codemarine.com -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu GoodwinSent: Tuesday, February 01, 2000 8:24 PM Subject: snake guide size and placement Hi, how does one determine the number and size of guides on a rod? Paul from stuart.tod@virgin.net Wed Feb 2 06:02:14 2000 (InterMail vM.4.01.02.00 201-229-116) with SMTP Wed, 2 Feb 2000 12:02:08 +0000 Subject: Re: bamboo boundary="----=_NextPart_000_001A_01BF6D76.761F6240" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_001A_01BF6D76.761F6240 All, if you're looking for Tonkin in europe, try Mr. LK Moss of: The Centre Cane CompanyUnit 16Shakletons Rectory EstateOngarEssexCM5 9ATUK Tel 01277 363285 fax 01277 364985 I bought my last bundle of culms from him, =A388.30 plus VAT, free =delivery (in UK)10 x 12' culms per bundle, 2"-2.5" diameter, absolutely no complaints!! =There are price reductions for buying more than one bale..... No interest, etc, just very good cane. Stuart Sent: Wednesday, February 02, 2000 10:23 AMSubject: Re: bamboo It was my mentor, helping me out with a couple of culms when I first = He also came over 50 culms that we split between us. As i wrote, I = Thanks toall those people that you are helping me in, neither it =consults about thebamboo. To Dany:Please,send me the e-mail adress and =web page of your distribuitor in denmark,thanks. ------=_NextPart_000_001A_01BF6D76.761F6240 All, if you're looking for Tonkin in europe,= Moss of: The Centre CaneCompanyUnit 16Shakletons RectoryEstateOngarEssexCM5 9ATUK Tel 01277 363285 fax 01277 =364985 I bought my last bundle of culms from= plus VAT, free delivery (in UK)10 x 12' culms per bundle, 2"-2.5" = absolutely no complaints!! There are price reductions for buying more = bale..... No interest, etc, just very good =cane. Stuart ----- Original Message ----- Danny Twang Cc: rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= Sent: Wednesday, February 02, = AMSubject: Re: bamboo There is no distributor in Denmark. It was my mentor, helping = with a couple of culms when I first started building. He also came = culms that we split between us. As i wrote, I don't think there is = Thanks toall those people that you are helping me = ------=_NextPart_000_001A_01BF6D76.761F6240-- from harry37@epix.net Wed Feb 2 07:32:10 2000 IAA19958; Subject: Re: snake guide size and placement Look in the archives--Fri March 13, 1998-Art Port posted the formula for guide spacing determination. Had todust off the brain to remember the algebra, but it works. Greg Steve Zimmerman wrote: I've wondered this as well. One of the books (Maurer) I have hasplacement/size charts placementalgorithmn, isn't there? Steve Zimmermansteve@codemarine.com -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Tuesday, February 01, 2000 8:24 PM Subject: snake guide size and placement Hi, how does one determine the number and size of guides on a rod? Paul from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Wed Feb 2 07:33:48 2000 Wed, 2 Feb 2000 05:33:39 -0800 Subject: Re: Snake Brand guides Shawn,In my opinion, today's plastic fly lines won't work with guides smallerthan2/0. They simply won't go through the opening. Unless you're buildingrods forsilk lines only, you need larger guides. What I do when a pattern calls forsay, 4/0 - 1/0, is move up two sizes to 2/0 - 2.Hope this helps,Harry Shawn Pineo wrote: I've heard so many good things about Snake brand that I want to givethem atry, however most tapers I am building recommend down to a 3/0 andsometimes4/0 guide. The smallest that Snake brand comes in is 2/0. What do youguysdo, just substitute another brand for the small ones or replace themwith2/0's? Shawn Harry Boyd wrote: Friends,Thought I would echo what Wayne Cattanach said a few weeks ago.I just received a very large ($3000+) order of guides from Mike McCoyatSnake Brand guides. I've never seen guides this nice. Nice to knowI'll never have to grind guide feet again!!I have no financial connection to Mike. I'm just a verysatisfied customer. When you need some guides, you will want to givethese serious consideration. Look for his website atwww.snakebrand.com Harry --Harry Boydhttp://HarryBoydbamboorods.eboard.com/ --Harry Boydhttp://HarryBoydbamboorods.eboard.com/ from nobler@satx.rr.com Wed Feb 2 08:17:56 2000 SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.197.19);Wed, 2 Feb 2000 08:18:27 -0600 Subject: Re: Snake Brand guides I agree. These newer lines are so slick, they need larger guides to alloweasier movement. Small guides really cut down on the shoot. GMA----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Snake Brand guides Shawn,In my opinion, today's plastic fly lines won't work with guidessmaller than2/0. They simply won't go through the opening. Unless you're buildingrods forsilk lines only, you need larger guides. What I do when a pattern callsforsay, 4/0 - 1/0, is move up two sizes to 2/0 - 2.Hope this helps,Harry Shawn Pineo wrote: I've heard so many good things about Snake brand that I want to givethem atry, however most tapers I am building recommend down to a 3/0 andsometimes4/0 guide. The smallest that Snake brand comes in is 2/0. What do youguysdo, just substitute another brand for the small ones or replace themwith2/0's? Shawn Harry Boyd wrote: Friends,Thought I would echo what Wayne Cattanach said a few weeksago.I just received a very large ($3000+) order of guides from Mike McCoyatSnake Brand guides. I've never seen guides this nice. Nice to knowI'll never have to grind guide feet again!!I have no financial connection to Mike. I'm just a verysatisfied customer. When you need some guides, you will want togivethese serious consideration. Look for his website atwww.snakebrand.com Harry --Harry Boydhttp://HarryBoydbamboorods.eboard.com/ --Harry Boydhttp://HarryBoydbamboorods.eboard.com/ from mschaffer@mindspring.com Wed Feb 2 09:24:10 2000 Subject: Technical question- practically speaking boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0023_01BF6D67.5907B680" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0023_01BF6D67.5907B680 Guys,While measuring some of my strips the other night, I started to wonder =about the technical aspects of the tapers vs. the practical aspects.In the experience of whomever wants to comment, just how far 'off' of =the dimensions can one stray (+ or -) yet have the rod feel and fish the =same as one made to within .00001" accuracy. Granted in theory there =would be a difference with any deviation from the stated taper =dimensions, but from a practical standpoint what do you think, or what =has been your actual experience? I realize this is just some more of my weird questions, but it helps to =fill in gaps in the knowledge bank. Thanks, Mike ------=_NextPart_000_0023_01BF6D67.5907B680 Guys,While measuring some of my strips the= I started to wonder about the technical aspects of the tapers vs. the = aspects.In the experience of whomever wantsto = just how far 'off' of the dimensions can one stray (+ or -) yet have the = feel and fish the same as one made to within .00001" accuracy. Granted = there would be a difference with any deviation from the stated taper = but from a practical standpoint what do you think, or what has been your = experience? I realize this is just some more of my= questions, but it helps to fill in gaps in the knowledge =bank. Thanks, Mike ------=_NextPart_000_0023_01BF6D67.5907B680-- from TSmithwick@aol.com Wed Feb 2 10:20:04 2000 Subject: Re: Technical question- practically speaking In a message dated 2/2/0 3:30:22 PM, mschaffer@mindspring.com writes: Mike - There is a lot that could be said on this one. I am not qualified to get into mathematical specifics, but my understanding of the general situation is that the force that is exerted by a spring is related to the square of it's thickness. In other words the effect of thickness variations is exponential, and that is why we obsess over the things. I feel strongly that tolerances should be thought of in terms of percentage of thickness, rather than in thousandths of an inch. Lets say you have a .005 error. It will probably be noticeable at the tip end, and if consistent might throwyou off a line weight, near the butt the same error will hardly be noticeable.To try to answer your question, I suspect an error in the 1-2% range willnot make much difference, 4-5% would make a noticeable difference. I can'tprove any of this, and a lot would depend on where the error is and how long the out of tolerance section is. A bump or dip at a node, for example, may notbe a display of great craftsmanship, but won't have much effect on the way arod casts. from lars32@gateway.net Wed Feb 2 11:45:37 2000 Subject: Sandpaper boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0099_01BF6D73.9551DCE0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0099_01BF6D73.9551DCE0 A sourse for cheap sandpaper 35 cents a sheet.No Interest etc.Abrasive Outlet1-800-814-7358abrasive@pro-ns.netDave N. ------=_NextPart_000_0099_01BF6D73.9551DCE0 A sourse for cheap sheet.No Interest etc.Abrasive Outlet1-800-814-7358abrasive@pro- ns.netDaveN. ------=_NextPart_000_0099_01BF6D73.9551DCE0-- from flytyr@southshore.com Wed Feb 2 11:51:06 2000 Subject: Sodium Carbonate Toning. Will attempt to do some toning this weekend usingsodium carbonate. Would it be better to remove theenamel before treating or just leave it on as Iwould normally when heat treating.Thanks in advance,Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com from tom@cet-inc.com Wed Feb 2 12:09:49 2000 0000 Subject: RE: Sodium Carbonate Toning. Tony,I think you mean "ammonium" carbonate, not sodium. My experience is thatyoucan leave the enamel on as you normally would.Tom -----Original Message----- Subject: Sodium Carbonate Toning. Will attempt to do some toning this weekend usingsodium carbonate. Would it be better to remove theenamel before treating or just leave it on as Iwould normally when heat treating.Thanks in advance,Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com from darrell@rockclimbing.org Wed Feb 2 12:38:45 2000 sims.3.5.1999.09.16.21.57.p8)with SMTP id for Subject: RE: FE Thomas Special Streamer Rod Taper - Correction Hi, Thanks to all for the enlightenment... I used my NEW dial caliper and yes,my measurements are off by AT LEAST .1"... please disregard the previousmeasurements. I will remeasure with the suggestions provided. Darrellwww.bamboorods.homepage.com -----Original Message----- Subject: FE Thomas Special Streamer Rod Taper After MANY requests for this taper, I took the measurements. This is a 9' 3piece rod. Notes:The tip section was 1/2" short at the tip top. First measurement would beapproximately 2" below where the original length section would have beenor1.5" from the top of the current length of the rod today. measurement was 33"- .294" and 37" - .302". Or you can decide on yourownnumber. All measurements were a single measurement. This rod was completed January 30, 1941 and the first owner was S.S.Bauerswho bought it on May 20, 1941. This has a half Wells grip and is a 6 oz rodaccording to the original FE Thomas records. .178 2".197 7".219 etc. 5" inter- vals.240.263.272.283.298.312.340.365.370.380.390.395.404.415.435.458.555 Sorry, this is my first attempt at measuring a rod... I'm willing toremeasure if someone wants to give me some pointers... But it has to beASAPas this rod is sold and will be packaged and shipped in a couple of hours.If this is good, please let me know so I can go ahead and pack the rod. Darrell Leewww.bamboorods.homepage.com from rsgould@cmc.net Wed Feb 2 13:01:08 2000 Subject: Re: Technical question- practically speaking boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000E_01BF6D6C.C6131C60" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000E_01BF6D6C.C6131C60 Hi Michael,This one is a subjective matter with some practical aspects of =manufacturing tied to it. My opinion is that if you're within 0.002" to =0.003" across the flats of the target number you're doing well. On a tip =section of 0.070" across the flats you'd be within 4% or so and at a =butt section of 0.350" you'd be less than 1% off.Ray Sent: Wednesday, February 02, 2000 7:22 AMSubject: Technical question- practically speaking Guys,While measuring some of my strips the other night, I started to wonder =about the technical aspects of the tapers vs. the practical aspects.In the experience of whomever wants to comment, just how far 'off' of =the dimensions can one stray (+ or -) yet have the rod feel and fish the =same as one made to within .00001" accuracy. Granted in theory there =would be a difference with any deviation from the stated taper =dimensions, but from a practical standpoint what do you think, or what =has been your actual experience? I realize this is just some more of my weird questions, but it helps =to fill in gaps in the knowledge bank. Thanks, Mike ------=_NextPart_000_000E_01BF6D6C.C6131C60 Hi Michael,This one is a subjective matter with = aspects of manufacturing tied to it. My opinion is that if you're within = to 0.003" across the flats of the target number you're doing well. On a = section of 0.070" across the flats you'd be within 4% or so and at a = section of 0.350" you'd be less than 1% off.Ray ----- Original Message ----- michael = Sent: Wednesday, February 02, = AMSubject: Technical question- = speaking Guys,While measuring some of my stripsthe = night, I started to wonder about the technical aspects of the tapers = practical aspects.In the experience of whomever wants= just how far 'off' of the dimensions can one stray (+ or -) yet have = feel and fish the same as one made to within .00001" accuracy. Granted = theory there would be a difference with any deviation from the stated = dimensions, but from a practical standpoint what do you think, or what = been your actual experience? I realize this is just some more of = questions, but it helps to fill in gaps in the knowledge =bank. Thanks, Mike ------=_NextPart_000_000E_01BF6D6C.C6131C60-- from rsgould@cmc.net Wed Feb 2 13:05:27 2000 Subject: Re: Sodium Carbonate Toning. Hi Tony,My experience is in the use of ammonia carbonate and apply it with theenamel on and the strips not glued but bound with cotton string. Thesestrips have been roughed down close to final size at this point.Ray----- Original Message ----- Subject: Sodium Carbonate Toning. Will attempt to do some toning this weekend usingsodium carbonate. Would it be better to remove theenamel before treating or just leave it on as Iwould normally when heat treating.Thanks in advance,Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com from mark_lang@tnb.com Wed Feb 2 13:32:33 2000 with Novell_GroupWise; Wed, 02 Feb 2000 13:33:03 -0600 Subject: Re: Sodium Carbonate Toning. Ray, In general do you heat treat strips that are tapered (.020 - .030 over size)or justbeveled (no taper)? Mark "Ray Gould" 02/02/00 01:05PM >>>Hi Tony,My experience is in the use of ammonia carbonate and apply it with theenamel on and the strips not glued but bound with cotton string. Thesestrips have been roughed down close to final size at this point.Ray----- Original Message ----- Subject: Sodium Carbonate Toning. Will attempt to do some toning this weekend usingsodium carbonate. Would it be better to remove theenamel before treating or just leave it on as Iwould normally when heat treating.Thanks in advance,Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com from mcdowellc@lanecc.edu Wed Feb 2 15:19:09 2000 13:31:58 PST Subject: Dave LeClair's e-mail Does anyone have Dave LeClair's e-mail address? Thanks. Chrismcdowellc@lanecc.edu from dannyt@frisurf.no Wed Feb 2 16:04:50 2000 Wed, 2 Feb 2000 23:04:38 +0100 (MET) Subject: Re: Dave LeClair's e-mail The address is LECLAIR123@aol.com regardsdanny ----------From: "CHRISTOPHER C MCDOWELL" Subject: Dave LeClair's e-mailDate: ons 2. feb 2000 22:31 Does anyone have Dave LeClair's e-mail address? Thanks. Chrismcdowellc@lanecc.edu from flytyr@southshore.com Wed Feb 2 16:52:49 2000 Wed, 2 Feb 2000 16:52:43 -0600 "rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu" Subject: Re: Sodium Carbonate Toning. You are right,I don't know where my head was.!!!!!!! Don't tell me.Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com Tom Whittle wrote: Tony,I think you mean "ammonium" carbonate, not sodium. My experience isthat youcan leave the enamel on as you normally would.Tom -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Wednesday, February 02, 2000 12:47 PM Subject: Sodium Carbonate Toning. Will attempt to do some toning this weekend usingsodium carbonate. Would it be better to remove theenamel before treating or just leave it on as Iwould normally when heat treating.Thanks in advance,Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com from flytyr@southshore.com Wed Feb 2 16:56:36 2000 Wed, 2 Feb 2000 16:56:27 -0600 "rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu" Subject: Re: Sodium Carbonate Toning. Thanks Ray,I thought that is the way it was done. I guess you know I did not meanSodium.Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com Ray Gould wrote: Hi Tony,My experience is in the use of ammonia carbonate and apply it with theenamel on and the strips not glued but bound with cotton string. Thesestrips have been roughed down close to final size at this point.Ray----- Original Message -----From: Tony Spezio Sent: Wednesday, February 02, 2000 9:46 AMSubject: Sodium Carbonate Toning. Will attempt to do some toning this weekend usingsodium carbonate. Would it be better to remove theenamel before treating or just leave it on as Iwould normally when heat treating.Thanks in advance,Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com from nsflyrods@ns.sympatico.ca Wed Feb 2 19:58:37 2000 Subject: Thomas and Thomas tapers Does anyone out there have tapers for a Thomas and Thomas rod? I amparticularly interested in their 5wt and under rods. Any otherinfo/opinions on their rods are welcome. Thanks,Shawn from Danny.Twang@porsgrunnsdagblad.no Thu Feb 3 04:00:13 2000 (HELO localhost) Thu, 03 Feb 2000 10:59:06 +0100 munin.funn.no(Data Fellows SMTPRS 2.04) with ESMTP id;Thu, 03 Feb 2000 10:59:48 +0100 "rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu" Subject: T&T Hello Shawn Its Your lucky day, this afternoon I'm going to pick up T&T Caenis 7`6"#3 and Orvis Battenkill 7/4 7`#4. If any other than Shawn wants thistapers, I will post them to the list.................... BTW What are You European builders use as adhesive for the splits? Havenot had any luck , finding what You americans use.................... regardsdanny from Danny.Twang@porsgrunnsdagblad.no Thu Feb 3 04:23:50 2000 (HELO localhost) Thu, 03 Feb 2000 11:22:48 +0100 munin.funn.no(Data Fellows SMTPRS 2.04) with ESMTP id;Thu, 03 Feb 2000 11:23:34 +0100 Subject: Rules All I came to think of this issue..... -is there a unwritten rules about sharing tapers of currently producedrods from the big manufactures ............since I never see this tapers? regardsdanny from avyoung@iinet.net.au Thu Feb 3 05:26:36 2000 Thu, 3 Feb 2000 19:25:31 +0800 Subject: Re: T&T "rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu" Danny,please post to the list. Tony At 11:07 AM 2/3/00 +0100, Danny Twang wrote:Hello Shawn Its Your lucky day, this afternoon I'm going to pick up T&T Caenis 7`6"#3 and Orvis Battenkill 7/4 7`#4. If any other than Shawn wants thistapers, I will post them to the list.................... BTW What are You European builders use as adhesive for the splits? Havenot had any luck , finding what You americans use.................... regardsdanny /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html And this our life, exempt from public haunt,Finds tongues in trees, books in running brooks,Sermons in stones, and good in everything. William Shakespeare, As You Like It /*************************************************************************/ from avyoung@iinet.net.au Thu Feb 3 05:27:46 2000 Thu, 3 Feb 2000 19:27:21 +0800 Subject: Re: Rules Can't see there can be a problem with sharing what can be measured, itcomes down to what people will do with it. I for one plan on keeping it forprosperity ;-) Tony At 11:31 AM 2/3/00 +0100, Danny Twang wrote:All I came to think of this issue..... -is there a unwritten rules about sharing tapers of currently producedrods from the big manufactures ............since I never see this tapers? regardsdanny /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html And this our life, exempt from public haunt,Finds tongues in trees, books in running brooks,Sermons in stones, and good in everything. William Shakespeare, As You Like It /*************************************************************************/ from KlingB@health.missouri.edu Thu Feb 3 08:33:31 2000 ,Shawn Pineo, rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: RE: T&T I'm definitely interested. And speaking of such things....I've often heard how sweet Winston's bamboorods are but have not seen tapers. Does anyone have any to share? Barry -----Original Message----- Subject: T&T Hello Shawn Its Your lucky day, this afternoon I'm going to pick up T&T Caenis 7`6"#3 and Orvis Battenkill 7/4 7`#4. If any other than Shawn wants thistapers, I will post them to the list.................... BTW What are You European builders use as adhesive for the splits? Havenot had any luck , finding what You americans use.................... regardsdanny from dati@selway.umt.edu Thu Feb 3 08:36:21 2000 07:36:16 -0700 Subject: final dimension I carefully planed the first butt strip of my first rod down to finaldimension and you know what? I was off by 0.010" at the butt end. Thiserror reduced as I moved up the strip to the tip end. I am not sure why Iwas off by so much at the butt end and off only between 0.001 and0.005" at the tip end. My wife told me last night that it was all right because if I wereperfect at planing then it wouldn't be fun anymore. Anyway, I have a lot of room to improve. Thanks to all on this list forthe helpful advice. I look forward to finishing the rod and fishing it. Darin Law from Danny.Twang@porsgrunnsdagblad.no Thu Feb 3 08:40:39 2000 (HELO localhost) Thu, 03 Feb 2000 15:39:19 +0100 munin.funn.no(Data Fellows SMTPRS 2.04) with ESMTP id;Thu, 03 Feb 2000 15:40:07 +0100 "rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu" Subject: Re: T&T Kling, Barry W. wrote: I'm definitely interested. And speaking of such things....I've often heard how sweet Winston'sbamboorods are but have not seen tapers. Does anyone have any to share? Barry Hi there I have borrowed T&T Caenis, Orvis 7/4, Ritz Fario Club 8`5" #5, and HardyPalakona 8`6" #7-if there is any interesting in this tapers, I will post them to the list. regardsdanny from FlyfishT@aol.com Thu Feb 3 10:44:15 2000 Subject: T&T,winston I also am interested in T&T and Winston tapers. Thanks,Tom from darrell@rockclimbing.org Thu Feb 3 12:27:08 2000 sims.3.5.1999.09.16.21.57.p8)with SMTP id for Subject: FW: FE Thomas Special Streamer Rod Taper FE Thomas Special Streamer Rod Taper This is the powerhouse rod that Marty Keane speaks so fondly about in hisbook that he devotes about 1 1/2 pages to this rod. I re-took the measurements. This is a 9' 3 piece rod. Notes:The tip section was 1/2" short at the tip top. First measurement starts atthe butt end because of the short tip. Average varnish thickness. All measurements were averaging three measurements, flat to flat unlesstwoflats measurements were the same, then that diameter was used. Rod is a swelled butt, blond cane rod. This rod was completed January 30, 1941 and the first owner was S.S.Bauerswho bought it on May 20, 1941. This has a half Wells grip and is a 6 oz rodaccording to the original FE Thomas records. Wood spacer reel seat, 7-8wtrod. Butt11.5" .46815" .38220" .34025 .32530 .31035 at ferrule estimate .30540 .30045 .28550 .27555 .25560 .23465 .21870 .20575 .18680 .17585 .16890 .14995 .128100 .098105 .082107" .080tip top Jan Nystrom has one of these also and was planning to measure his for agiggle, will be interested in the comparison. Sorry about the wacky first measurement... new dial caliper and used thewrong scale... still faster than using a micrometer. If anyone builds this rod, I'd like to hear their results. Darrell Leewww.bamboorods.homepage.com from JaguschR@aol.com Thu Feb 3 12:36:50 2000 Subject: Re: T&T (Glue) Hello Danny I in Germany have bought a cann of glue from one off our professional rodmakers.It works very well and has cost me around 50.- German Marks (~25). Ithink i will glue up to 80 - 100 rods with this amount. The glue looks a bit like Ponal witch is a glue for wood but it is much thinner.If it is interresting for you i can give you the Adress. CURainereat..sleep..go fishing!! from ernie2@pacbell.net Thu Feb 3 13:08:32 2000 sims.3.5.1999.09.16.21.57.p8)with SMTP id for Subject: Easier way to make splices. Hans Kohl's e-mail in the archives seems like the best way to taperbamboosections for splicing. He suggests using a sanding disc instead of asplicing block. Any of you nodeless rod makers using this? If so how doyou like it?Ernie from watson@cape-consult.co.uk Thu Feb 3 13:42:06 2000 Subject: Info on Wheeler pleas boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000C_01BF6E7F.0026ADA0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000C_01BF6E7F.0026ADA0 Can some of you clever lot give me some information on a Rodmaker by the=name of Wheeler? All I know is that he was/is American.ThanksTim ------=_NextPart_000_000C_01BF6E7F.0026ADA0 Can some of you clever lot give mesome = = American.ThanksTim ------=_NextPart_000_000C_01BF6E7F.0026ADA0-- from watson@cape-consult.co.uk Thu Feb 3 13:48:26 2000 Subject: Nickel Silver Spec. boundary="----=_NextPart_000_001E_01BF6E7F.E2E629E0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_001E_01BF6E7F.E2E629E0 Please can someone let me know what specification/composition Nickel =Silver is being used for fittings etc?ThanksTim. ------=_NextPart_000_001E_01BF6E7F.E2E629E0 Please can someone let me know etc?ThanksTim. ------=_NextPart_000_001E_01BF6E7F.E2E629E0-- from rp43640@online-club.de Thu Feb 3 14:51:36 2000 Thu, 3 Feb 2000 21:51:15 +0100 (MET) "rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu" Subject: Re: T&T Danny,read your mail about your danish mentor, was this Preben DorphJårgensen?I use epoxy for gluing rods. There are different brands which you can use.There are UHU 300, Araldit and also some epoxies from 3M. Christian Danny Twang schrieb: Hello Shawn Its Your lucky day, this afternoon I'm going to pick up T&T Caenis 7`6"#3 and Orvis Battenkill 7/4 7`#4. If any other than Shawn wants thistapers, I will post them to the list.................... BTW What are You European builders use as adhesive for the splits? Havenot had any luck , finding what You americans use.................... regardsdanny from rp43640@online-club.de Thu Feb 3 15:00:46 2000 Thu, 3 Feb 2000 22:00:37 +0100 (MET) Subject: Re: Nickel Silver Spec. Tim, CuNi18Zn20CuNi12Zn24in Germany it is nearly impossible to buy CuNi18Zn20 unless you arewilling to order a ton of it.So most ferrules here are made of CuNi12Zn24. Christian Watson's schrieb: Please can someone let me know what specification/composition NickelSilver is being used for fittings etc?ThanksTim. from rp43640@online-club.de Thu Feb 3 15:06:58 2000 Thu, 3 Feb 2000 22:06:52 +0100 (MET) "rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu" Subject: Re: T&T Danny, please send tusind tak Christian Danny Twang schrieb: Hello Shawn Its Your lucky day, this afternoon I'm going to pick up T&T Caenis 7`6"#3 and Orvis Battenkill 7/4 7`#4. If any other than Shawn wants thistapers, I will post them to the list.................... BTW What are You European builders use as adhesive for the splits? Havenot had any luck , finding what You americans use.................... regardsdanny from dannyt@frisurf.no Thu Feb 3 16:15:10 2000 (MET) Subject: T&T and Orvis boundary="MS_Mac_OE_3032550858_87891_MIME_Part" THIS MESSAGE IS IN MIME FORMAT. Since your mail reader does notunderstandthis format, some or all of this message may not be legible. --MS_Mac_OE_3032550858_87891_MIME_Part To Tony, Shawn, Christian and all............ Here You have the tapers on T&T Caenis 7'6" 3 and Orvis Battenkill 7/4 #33piece. The measurement is the average between the three flats. I believe You, Tony, will like the Caenis. It has an action very much likemy Perfectionist, maybe a little softer......That is based on my wee-wing the stick in the living room:-))) I am not impressed of the workmanship, the Orvis have an uneven uglylookingglue line, but very little diff. from flats to flat.Looks like they use some kind of epoxy, the glueline is filled withtranslucent glue.T&T have a finish I only could dream for, on my rods at my stage, but thereadings differ between the flats by more, mentioned on the list the otherday................ Anyway here it is, with section length and guidespacing: Orvis Battenkill 7/4 # 3 piece, tip is 28 11/16", mid and butt 28 7/16"Guidespacing from tip: 4 3/4, 10 6/16, 16 10/16, 23 1/2, 30 2/4, 377/16, 442/4, 51 and 59 6/16 1 1/2 - ,062 30 - ,143 56 3/4- ,2195 1/2 - ,076 35 - ,160 60- ,2229 3/4 - ,089 40 - ,168 65- ,22815 - ,111 45 2/16- ,176 70- ,24820 - ,124 50 - ,187 723/4 - ,26025 - ,135 54 2/4 - ,196 T&T Caenis 7'6" #3 2 piece (VARNISH NOT SUBTRACTED)Guidespacing from tip:5 1/4, 11 1/4, 17 3/4, 24 3/4, 32 3/4, 41 1/4, 511/4and 62 1/2 1 - .058 47 - ,1955 - ,070 50 - ,20010 - ,088 55 - ,21415 - ,108 60 - ,23020 - ,123 65 - ,23925 - ,141 70 - ,25430 - ,155 75 - ,26535 - ,171 79 1/2 - ,27940 - ,185 80 1/2 - ,360 swell cont. under windings44 - ,194 I just have to attach a picture on the swelled butt on the T&T, hope therenot is a rule I've overlooked...You need special equipment to manage this, its laying beside the butt Ihavemade (F.E. Thomas 7" #3) Hope You understand my english:-) regardsdanny --MS_Mac_OE_3032550858_87891_MIME_Part T&T and Orvis To Tony, Shawn, Christian and all............ Batt=enkill 7/4 #3 3 piece. The measurement is the average between the threeflat=s. I believe You, Tony, will like the Caenis. It has an action very much like =my Perfectionist, maybe a little softer......That is based on my wee-wing the stick in the living room:-))) I am not impressed of the workmanship, the Orvis have an uneven uglylookin=g glue line, but very little diff. from flats to flat.Looks like they use some kind of epoxy, the glueline is filled with translu=cent glue.T&T have a finish I only could dream for, on my rods at my stage, butt=he readings differ between the flats by more, mentioned on the list theothe=r day................ Anyway here it is, with section length and guidespacing: Orvis Battenkill 7/4 # 3 piece, tip is 28 11/16", mid and butt 287/16="Guidespacing from tip: 4 3/4, 10 6/16, 16 10/16, 23 1/2, 30 2/4, 377/16, 4=4 2/4, 51 and 59 6/16 48 bsp;,187 T&T Caenis 7'6" #3 2 piece (VARNISH NOT S=UBTRACTED)Guidespacing from tip:5 1/4, 11 1/4, 17 3/4, 24 3/4, 32 3/4, 41 1/4, 511/4=and 62 1/2 I just have to attach a picture on the swelled butt on the T&T, hopeth=ere not is a rule I've overlooked...You need special equipment to manage this, its laying beside the butt Ihav=e made (F.E. Thomas 7" #3) Hope You understand my english:-) regardsdanny --MS_Mac_OE_3032550858_87891_MIME_Part-- from jczimny@dol.net Thu Feb 3 16:20:10 2000 Subject: Re: Nickel Silver Spec. boundary="------------D84FAC87BF75CC39B1EF23FD" --------------D84FAC87BF75CC39B1EF23FD It is alloy 752.John Z Watson's wrote: Please can someone let me know what specification/composition NickelSilver is being used for fittings etc?ThanksTim. --------------D84FAC87BF75CC39B1EF23FD It is alloy 752.John ZWatson's wrote: Pleasecan someone let me know what specification/composition Nickel Silver isbeing used for fittings etc?ThanksTim. --------------D84FAC87BF75CC39B1EF23FD-- from nobler@satx.rr.com Thu Feb 3 16:38:08 2000 SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.197.19);Thu, 3 Feb 2000 16:38:43 -0600 Subject: Lost name boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0033_01BF6E65.3D507AE0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0033_01BF6E65.3D507AE0 Last Sept. during discussions here, about the Rodmakers group meeting in=Ark., there was a retired military man, living in Corpus Christi, Texas, =that I had contact with. I'm planning to make the March meeting, and =wondering if this gentleman would like to attend too ? Please make contact, if you are still on our list. GMA ------=_NextPart_000_0033_01BF6E65.3D507AE0 = in Ark., there was a retired military man, living in Corpus Christi, = I had contact with. I'm planning to make the March meeting, and = this gentleman would like to attend too ? Please make contact, if you are still on our list. GMA ------=_NextPart_000_0033_01BF6E65.3D507AE0-- from dannyt@frisurf.no Thu Feb 3 17:23:03 2000 Fri, 4 Feb 2000 00:22:55 +0100 (MET) Subject: boundary="MS_Mac_OE_3032554936_333188_MIME_Part" THIS MESSAGE IS IN MIME FORMAT. Since your mail reader does notunderstandthis format, some or all of this message may not be legible. --MS_Mac_OE_3032554936_333188_MIME_Part To Harry, and all. Thank You Harry, now I don't have to worry about writhing to the list:-) There was no trouble, I enjoyed it, and taking this as a part of myrodmaking education.Beside most of You have done the same, just look at all the tapersavailableon the Rodmakers. BTW, have any of You heard about a reel called "Mitre-Hardy 3 1/4, Jewel"Ibought it with aHGH silkline in mint condition. Costed me ca $35,- regardsdanny--MS_Mac_OE_3032554936_333188_MIME_Part To Harry, and all. Thank You Harry, now I don't have to worry about writhing to the list:-) There was no trouble, I enjoyed it, and taking this as a part of myrodmaking education.Beside most of You have done the same, just look at all the tapersavailabl=eon the Rodmakers. BTW, have any of You heard about a reel called "Mitre-Hardy 3 1/4,Jew=el" Ibought it with aHGH silkline in mint condition. Costed me ca $35,- regardsdanny --MS_Mac_OE_3032554936_333188_MIME_Part-- from jkcerise@rof.net Thu Feb 3 17:39:16 2000 Subject: Bamboo Spinner Anyone out there able to tell me anything about an old Bamboo a friend ofmine picked up? The thing is a spin-cast configuration with a flatteneddiamond logo having UTK stamped into it. It had a reel seat that has ahook don't know enough to tell him much about it. It has been rewound if onecould stretch his imagination that far!!! Looks like a real junker but he'scurious about it, so I'm askin'?? Any help out there in this vast store of bamboo knowledge??? TIA, John Cerise from lars32@gateway.net Thu Feb 3 17:43:26 2000 Subject: Bluing N.S. boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0056_01BF6E6E.B99A0540" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0056_01BF6E6E.B99A0540 I fought with Birchwood Casey's brass black for 10 rods or so. Results =were fair. I could never tell how it would come out. Sometimes a whole =section would peel right off and I would have to start over. I got a =bottle of Dave LeClair's blue and tried it today on two ferrule sets. It =is superb! No Comm. Int. etc. Why did I wait so long?Dave N. ------=_NextPart_000_0056_01BF6E6E.B99A0540 I fought with Birchwood Casey's = 10 rods or so. Results were fair. I could never tell how it would come = Sometimes a whole section would peel right off and I would have to start= got a bottle of Dave LeClair's blue and tried it today on two ferrule = is superb! No Comm. Int. etc. Why did I wait so long?DaveN. ------=_NextPart_000_0056_01BF6E6E.B99A0540-- from mcdowellc@lanecc.edu Thu Feb 3 17:44:27 2000 15:57:46 PST Subject: re: Bamboo Spinner It sounds sort of Horrock-Ibbotsenish. Chris---------- Original Text ---------- Anyone out there able to tell me anything about an old Bamboo a friend ofmine picked up? The thing is a spin-cast configuration with a flatteneddiamond logo having UTK stamped into it. It had a reel seat that has ahook don't know enough to tell him much about it. It has been rewound if onecould stretch his imagination that far!!! Looks like a real junker but he'scurious about it, so I'm askin'?? Any help out there in this vast store of bamboo knowledge??? TIA, John Cerise from lblove@cableone.net Thu Feb 3 17:46:12 2000 MicrosoftSMTPSVC(5.5.1877.117.11);Thu, 3 Feb 2000 16:45:59 -0700 Subject: Re: Nickel Silver Spec. boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000A_01BF6E6E.3A7A1340" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000A_01BF6E6E.3A7A1340 hey guys,CA792 or CA752?? I have been told earlier(offlist) that it was CA792.since we are talking material spec. anyone know what type of bronze is =used for plane bodies or real seats??CA544(phosphor bronze),CA655(silicon bronze), or CA954(aluminum =bronze). I am pretty sure that it is not CA932(sae 660) bushing bronze.TIABrad Sent: Thursday, February 03, 2000 3:33 PMSubject: Re: Nickel Silver Spec. Please can someone let me know what specification/composition Nickel=Silver is being used for fittings etc?ThanksTim. ------=_NextPart_000_000A_01BF6E6E.3A7A1340 hey guys, that it was CA792. know = of bronze is used for plane bodies or real seats??CA544(phosphor bronze), CA655(silicon bronze), CA954(aluminum bronze). I am pretty sure that it is not CA932(sae 660) = bronze.TIABrad ----- Original Message ----- J. C. =Zimny Cc: Rodmakers Sent: Thursday, February 03, = PMSubject: Re: Nickel Silver =Spec. Please can someone let me know= etc?ThanksTim. ------=_NextPart_000_000A_01BF6E6E.3A7A1340-- from nobler@satx.rr.com Thu Feb 3 18:00:25 2000 SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.197.19);Thu, 3 Feb 2000 17:50:37 -0600 Subject: Re: Bamboo Spinner The diamond decal sounds like H-I, but the UTK sounds more Japanese. GMA----- Original Message ----- Subject: Bamboo Spinner Anyone out there able to tell me anything about an old Bamboo a friend ofmine picked up? The thing is a spin-cast configuration with a flatteneddiamond logo having UTK stamped into it. It had a reel seat that has ahook Idon't know enough to tell him much about it. It has been rewound if onecould stretch his imagination that far!!! Looks like a real junker buthe'scurious about it, so I'm askin'?? Any help out there in this vast store of bamboo knowledge??? TIA, John Cerise from HomeyDKlown@worldnet.att.net Thu Feb 3 18:08:09 2000 with ESMTP id ;Fri, 4 Feb 2000 00:07:33 +0000 Subject: Re: T&T and Orvis Danny, Your English is fine. Thank you for publishing the tapers. Dennis Hope You understand my english:-) regardsdanny from channer1@rmi.net Thu Feb 3 18:08:55 2000 Subject: Re: final dimension At 07:36 AM 02/03/2000 -0700, Darin J Law wrote: I carefully planed the first butt strip of my first rod down to finaldimension and you know what? I was off by 0.010" at the butt end. Thiserror reduced as I moved up the strip to the tip end. I am not sure why Iwas off by so much at the butt end and off only between 0.001 and0.005" at the tip end. My wife told me last night that it was all right because if I wereperfect at planing then it wouldn't be fun anymore. Anyway, I have a lot of room to improve. Thanks to all on this list forthe helpful advice. I look forward to finishing the rod and fishing it. Darin Law Darin;Sounds to me like you have a bad tip on your dial indicator, from yourmeasurement errors i think it is more than 60d, so the deeper thewsetting,the greater the error. If you have bought a cheap one somewhere, replace itwith a Starrett pointthey can be counted on to be a true 60d.John from flyh2o@worldnet.att.net Thu Feb 3 18:09:41 2000 with ESMTP id ;Fri, 4 Feb 2000 00:09:08 +0000 "rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu" Subject: Re: T&T Danny,I woould like to see the Fario Club taper to compare to the one onRodmakerswhich came from a rod I have..... Danny Twang wrote: Kling, Barry W. wrote: I'm definitely interested. And speaking of such things....I've often heard how sweet Winston'sbamboorods are but have not seen tapers. Does anyone have any to share? Barry Hi there I have borrowed T&T Caenis, Orvis 7/4, Ritz Fario Club 8`5" #5, andHardyPalakona 8`6" #7-if there is any interesting in this tapers, I will post them to the list. regardsdanny --Mike LeitheiserLake Oswego, Oregon "When the trout are lost, smash the state."Tom McGuane from darrell@rockclimbing.org Thu Feb 3 18:50:56 2000 sims.3.5.1999.09.16.21.57.p8)with SMTP id for Subject: RE: Bamboo Spinner UTK was also a trademark used by H-I. Can't tell what model with rod asdescribed. You can try posting it on the "Name That Rod Forum" here's the link... www.bamboorods.homepage.com/namethatrod.htm Darrellwww.bamboorods.homepage.com -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Bamboo Spinner The diamond decal sounds like H-I, but the UTK sounds more Japanese. GMA----- Original Message ----- Subject: Bamboo Spinner Anyone out there able to tell me anything about an old Bamboo a friend ofmine picked up? The thing is a spin-cast configuration with a flatteneddiamond logo having UTK stamped into it. It had a reel seat that has ahook Idon't know enough to tell him much about it. It has been rewound if onecould stretch his imagination that far!!! Looks like a real junker buthe'scurious about it, so I'm askin'?? Any help out there in this vast store of bamboo knowledge??? TIA, John Cerise from dpvbkjs@somtel.com Thu Feb 3 20:03:49 2000 Subject: Re: Info on Wheeler pleas Date: Thu, 3 Feb 2000 20:57:34 -0400 From:dpvbkjs@somtel.com (D.P. Van Burgel & K.J. Scott)Subject:Re: Info on Wheeler pleas Can some of you clever lot give me some information on a Rodmaker bythename of Wheeler? All I know is that he was/is American.ThanksTim Hi Tim, Charles Wheeler was the son of a gunsmith (A. G.) in Farminton, Maine, 20miles from our home. According to A. J. Campbell's Classic and AntiqueFly-fishing Tackle, a New Yorker named George Shepard Page used aMurphysix-stripped fly rod north of here on the famous Rangely Lakes, and a NewEngland businessman named Isaac Cutler was impressed with the rod. Somuchso, that he approached the Wheelers about making them. Charles was intoangling, and made an impressive rod that pleased Cutler so much that heencouraged him to make more on speculation, according to the book. Thatwas in 1868, and by 1876, Wheeler's rods won him a medal and diploma ofexcellence at the International Exposition in Philadelphia. There was also a minor Conneticut maker, Campbell says, W. R. Wheeler. Maybe others on the list have told you more, and we could give you moreinformation from the book, if you'd like. If Charles is your guy, and you'd like, we could scan in a pic of hiswooden shop in Farminton (we just took one last week) and e-mail it as anattachment. The music hall where he was a bandleader still stands nextdoor. Hope this helps, Kat and David from martinjensen@home.com Thu Feb 3 20:54:54 2000 (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with SMTP ;Thu, 3 Feb 2000 18:54:50 -0800 Subject: RE: final dimension This is the first strip you have planed? If you are off by .010 you couldhave set the form wrong but this also might just be due to lack ofexperience. My first spline, I was off by at least .010. I started to getworried and look all over the place but then I realized (or thought) thatprecision will take care of it's self as you become more experienced. Idecided that it was more important for me to get a completed rod undermybelt then get a perfect rod. That would come with time ( I'm still workingon it). I mean check your form, set it and plane a test section, but reallythe more rods you do the better the tolerances will get without eventhinking about it.Another thing is that if you are using a dial indicator with a 60 degreepoint the tip might be crushed. Since you are probably using the tip to zeroout your indicator this would give you a false reading. you need to take youform and determine the depth of a spot with a drill rod and some mathcalculations. I have used the instructions on how to accurately determinethe depth of a vee by using a known diameter of round stock. Drill bitsworkfine. Once you know how deep a spot is, you set your indicator over thislocation and set it for the depth. Now when you set the indicator back on aflat surface to "zero" it out you can see how much of the tip is reallygone. I "zero" my indicator to (I think it is +.003) to make up for theflattened tip. Once you have done this, it really doesn't matter if the tipis crushed ( in fact I bet all brands are to some extent) because you neverindex off the tip anyway. As long as you know what to set it for is all thatis important. As far as the math to figure this out, someone here mustremember it I don't have it handy anymore. Martin Jensen -----Original Message----- Subject: final dimension I carefully planed the first butt strip of my first rod down to finaldimension and you know what? I was off by 0.010" at the butt end. Thiserror reduced as I moved up the strip to the tip end. I am not sure why Iwas off by so much at the butt end and off only between 0.001 and0.005" at the tip end. My wife told me last night that it was all right because if I wereperfect at planing then it wouldn't be fun anymore. Anyway, I have a lot of room to improve. Thanks to all on this list forthe helpful advice. I look forward to finishing the rod and fishing it. Darin Law from stpete@netten.net Thu Feb 3 21:09:59 2000 Thu, 3 Feb 2000 21:12:35 -0600 Subject: Re: Nickel Silver Spec. John or anyone else with experience, Can you tell a novice whether it is best to ream or bore the insidesurfaces of the NS tube for ferrules? If reaming is the way to go, will I be able to make a 'D' style reamer from reamer/drill stock or would I be wasting my time? What minimumandmaximum should I plan on reaming/boring the NS tube? is .002 too little,or is .004 too much? Finally, what type of insert or tool should I use to cut and finish theNS tube. Positive rake? HSS or coated inserts? If you don't mind, Icould use the help. thanks, Rick C. J. C. Zimny wrote: It is alloy 752.John Z Watson's wrote: Please can someone let me know whatspecification/composition Nickel Silver is being used forfittings etc?ThanksTim. from martinjensen@home.com Thu Feb 3 22:55:30 2000 (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with SMTP ;Thu, 3 Feb 2000 20:55:17 -0800 Subject: RE: Technical question- practically speaking boundary="----=_NextPart_000_003F_01BF6E88.EB1FCA40" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_003F_01BF6E88.EB1FCA40 I hope I can assume that you have "tongue in cheek" when you mention.00001tolerance. Or did you hic-up when you typed the zero's. Martin Jensen ----- Original Message -----From: michael Sent: Wednesday, February 02, 2000 7:22 AMSubject: Technical question- practically speaking Guys,While measuring some of my strips the other night, I started to wonderabout the technical aspects of the tapers vs. the practical aspects.In the experience of whomever wants to comment, just how far 'off' ofthe dimensions can one stray (+ or -) yet have the rod feel and fish thesame as one made to within .00001" accuracy. Granted in theory therewouldbe a difference with any deviation from the stated taper dimensions, but from a practical standpoint what do you think, or what has been youractualexperience? I realize this is just some more of my weird questions, but it helps tofill in gaps in the knowledge bank. Thanks, Mike ------=_NextPart_000_003F_01BF6E88.EB1FCA40 I can assume that you have "tongue in cheek" when you mention .00001 = Or did you hic-up when you typed the zero's. Martin Jensen ----- Original Message ----- michael = Sent: Wednesday, February 02, = AMSubject: Technical question- practically speaking Guys,While measuring some of my strips= night, I started to wonder about the technical aspects of the tapers = practical aspects.In the experience of whomeverwants = just how far 'off' of the dimensions can one stray (+ or -) yet have = feel and fish the same as one made to within .00001" accuracy. = theory there would be a difference with any deviation from the = dimensions, but from a practical standpoint what do you think, or = been your actual experience? I realize this is just some more of = questions, but it helps to fill in gaps in the knowledge =bank. Thanks, Mike ------=_NextPart_000_003F_01BF6E88.EB1FCA40-- from saweiss@flash.net Thu Feb 3 23:39:49 2000 Subject: Re: T&T Danny,I'd like to also see the Fario Club.Thanks,Steve I have borrowed T&T Caenis, Orvis 7/4, Ritz Fario Club 8`5" #5, andHardyPalakona 8`6" #7-if there is any interesting in this tapers, I will post them to the list. regardsdanny from darrell@rockclimbing.org Thu Feb 3 23:41:32 2000 sims.3.5.1999.09.16.21.57.p8)with SMTP id for Subject: RE: Info on Wheeler pleas I'd enjoy a copy of the pic... Thanks for the extra info... I love stuff onthe old guys... Darrell-----Original Message----- K.J. Scott Subject: Re: Info on Wheeler pleas Date: Thu, 3 Feb 2000 20:57:34 -0400 From:dpvbkjs@somtel.com (D.P. Van Burgel & K.J. Scott)Subject:Re: Info on Wheeler pleas Can some of you clever lot give me some information on a Rodmaker bythename of Wheeler? All I know is that he was/is American.ThanksTim Hi Tim, Charles Wheeler was the son of a gunsmith (A. G.) in Farminton, Maine, 20miles from our home. According to A. J. Campbell's Classic and AntiqueFly-fishing Tackle, a New Yorker named George Shepard Page used aMurphysix-stripped fly rod north of here on the famous Rangely Lakes, and a NewEngland businessman named Isaac Cutler was impressed with the rod. Somuchso, that he approached the Wheelers about making them. Charles was intoangling, and made an impressive rod that pleased Cutler so much that heencouraged him to make more on speculation, according to the book. Thatwas in 1868, and by 1876, Wheeler's rods won him a medal and diploma ofexcellence at the International Exposition in Philadelphia. There was also a minor Conneticut maker, Campbell says, W. R. Wheeler. Maybe others on the list have told you more, and we could give you moreinformation from the book, if you'd like. If Charles is your guy, and you'd like, we could scan in a pic of hiswooden shop in Farminton (we just took one last week) and e-mail it as anattachment. The music hall where he was a bandleader still stands nextdoor. Hope this helps, Kat and David from Danny.Twang@porsgrunnsdagblad.no Fri Feb 4 00:57:45 2000 (HELO localhost) Fri, 04 Feb 2000 07:56:24 +0100 munin.funn.no(Data Fellows SMTPRS 2.04) with ESMTP id;Fri, 04 Feb 2000 07:57:15 +0100 "rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu" Subject: Re: T&T Mike Leitheiser wrote: Danny,I woould like to see the Fario Club taper to compare to the one onRodmakerswhich came from a rod I have..... Hi Mike Will do tonight.The rod is not a Pezone et Michel , but made by Sharps of Aberdeen.Got the numbers wrong, the Fario is 8`6" and the Hardy 8`9", I'm not usedto theinch yet....to many numbers. Cant figure out all that dividing of the inch, 1/4, 1/16,1/64......... danny from mschaffer@mindspring.com Fri Feb 4 04:39:38 2000 Subject: Ron's mail Well, I've just tried for the 6th time to send an email to Ron Barch(rbarch@remc8.k12.mi.us) and have been told service is unavailable.Can anyone help?Thanks, Mike from nobler@satx.rr.com Fri Feb 4 07:21:35 2000 SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.197.19);Fri, 4 Feb 2000 07:11:37 -0600 Subject: Re: T&T It's easier by far if you convert to decimals, i.e. 1/4" = .250", and 1mm =.03937" Radio Shack sells a neat calculator for under $15, that has allmetric conversions from inches, and visa versa. GMA----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: T&T Mike Leitheiser wrote: Danny,I woould like to see the Fario Club taper to compare to the one onRodmakerswhich came from a rod I have..... Hi Mike Will do tonight.The rod is not a Pezone et Michel , but made by Sharps of Aberdeen.Got the numbers wrong, the Fario is 8`6" and the Hardy 8`9", I'm not usedto theinch yet....to many numbers. Cant figure out all that dividing of the inch, 1/4, 1/16,1/64......... danny from nobler@satx.rr.com Fri Feb 4 08:32:30 2000 SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.197.19);Fri, 4 Feb 2000 08:22:35 -0600 Subject: Re: Technical question- practically speaking boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000C_01BF6EEA.8C4FB5E0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000C_01BF6EEA.8C4FB5E0 That would be pretty tough tolerance to hold when working with cane ! =However, I work to that sort of tolerances in metal, every day. BTW, on reaming of holes for ferrules. There will be a certain amount of ="bell mouth" effect, in that the opening will be a bit larger, than the =bottom of the hole. (female ferrule) Some, like Winston, used a Sunnen =hone, to hone the inside perfectly straight. That is the bottom of the =hole is honed, to make it the same as the mouth. In small quantity, this =can be done with a male lap. The lap would only make contact for the =first 1/4" to 3/8", so the cutting would be down inside, rather at the =mouth. GMA Sent: Thursday, February 03, 2000 10:54 PMSubject: RE: Technical question- practically speaking I hope I can assume that you have "tongue in cheek" when you mention =.00001 tolerance. Or did you hic-up when you typed the zero's. Sent: Wednesday, February 02, 2000 7:22 AMSubject: Technical question- practically speaking Guys,While measuring some of my strips the other night, I started to =wonder about the technical aspects of the tapers vs. the practical =aspects.In the experience of whomever wants to comment, just how far 'off' =of the dimensions can one stray (+ or -) yet have the rod feel and fish =the same as one made to within .00001" accuracy. Granted in theory there=would be a difference with any deviation from the stated taper =dimensions, but from a practical standpoint what do you think, or what =has been your actual experience? I realize this is just some more of my weird questions, but it =helps to fill in gaps in the knowledge bank. Thanks, Mike ------=_NextPart_000_000C_01BF6EEA.8C4FB5E0 That would be pretty tough tolerance to hold when working with cane= However, I work to that sort of tolerances in metal, every day. BTW, on reaming of holes for ferrules. There will be a certain = "bell mouth" effect, in that the opening will be a bit larger, than the = of the hole. (female ferrule) Some, like Winston, used a Sunnen hone, to = the inside perfectly straight. That is the bottom of the hole is honed, = it the same as the mouth. In small quantity, this can be done with a = The lap would only make contact for the first 1/4" to 3/8", so the = be down inside, rather at the mouth. GMA ----- Original Message ----- Jensen rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= Sent: Thursday, February 03, = PMSubject: RE: Technical = practically speaking hope I can assume that you have "tongue in cheek" when you mention = tolerance. Or did you hic-up when you typed the =zero's. Martin Jensen ----- Original Message ----- = michael Sent: Wednesday, February = 7:22 AMSubject: Technical = practically speaking Guys,While measuring some of my strips= night, I started to wonder about the technical aspects of the = the practical aspects.In the experience of whomever = comment, just how far 'off' of the dimensions can one stray (+ or = accuracy. Granted in theory there would be a difference with any = from the stated taper dimensions, but from a practical standpoint = you think, or what has been your actual experience? I realize this is just some more = bank. Thanks, Mike ------=_NextPart_000_000C_01BF6EEA.8C4FB5E0-- from cbogart@shentel.net Fri Feb 4 10:24:00 2000 "dati@selway.umt.edu" Subject: Re: final dimension Darin First insure you had good angles on the strip that you planed - checkallthree dimensions on the strip, if they are the same then: Three things to check: The form itself, The tip of the depth gauge, and then calibration ofthedepth gauge - Your problem may be one or any combination of the aforementioned. Chris I carefully planed the first butt strip of my first rod down to finaldimension and you know what? I was off by 0.010" at the butt end. Thiserror reduced as I moved up the strip to the tip end. I am not sure why Iwas off by so much at the butt end and off only between 0.001 and0.005" at the tip end. My wife told me last night that it was all right because if I wereperfect at planing then it wouldn't be fun anymore. Anyway, I have a lot of room to improve. Thanks to all on this list forthe helpful advice. I look forward to finishing the rod and fishing it. Darin Law from cbogart@shentel.net Fri Feb 4 10:28:46 2000 "ernie2@pacbell.net" Subject: Re: Easier way to make splices. Ernie It is not the best way nor the quickest. A sanded surface is no where as good as a planed surface for gluing.You willnot get the strength - ask any woodworker. Second, I can plane a splice in 5-8 seconds - so you have no real timesavings in that step of building nodeless. You spend far more time in thestrippreparationand gluing phases of the process. Chris On Thu, 03 Feb 2000 10:51:47 -0800, Ernie Harrison wrote: Hans Kohl's e-mail in the archives seems like the best way to taperbamboosections for splicing. He suggests using a sanding disc instead of asplicing block. Any of you nodeless rod makers using this? If so how doyou like it?Ernie from darrell@rockclimbing.org Fri Feb 4 10:56:09 2000 sims.3.5.1999.09.16.21.57.p8)with SMTP id for Subject: RE: FE Thomas Special Streamer Rod Taper Rod Makers Resending... FE Thomas Special Streamer Rod Taper This is the powerhouse rod that Marty Keane speaks so fondly about in hisbook that he devotes about 1 1/2 pages to this rod. I re-took the measurements. This is a 9' 3 piece rod. Notes:The tip section was 1/2" short at the tip top. First measurement starts atthe butt end because of the short tip. Average varnish thickness. All measurements were averaging three measurements, flat to flat unlesstwoflats measurements were the same, then that diameter was used. Rod is a swelled butt, blond cane rod. This rod was completed January 30, 1941 and the first owner was S.S.Bauerswho bought it on May 20, 1941. This has a half Wells grip and is a 6 oz rodaccording to the original FE Thomas records. Wood spacer reel seat, 7-8wtrod. Butt11.5" .46815" .38220" .34025 .32530 .31035 at ferrule estimate .30540 .30045 .28550 .27555 .25560 .23465 .21870 .20575 .18680 .17585 .16890 .14995 .128100 .098105 .082107" .080tip top Jan Nystrom has one of these also and was planning to measure his for agiggle, will be interested in the comparison. Sorry about the wacky first measurement... new dial caliper and used thewrong scale... still faster than using a micrometer. If anyone builds this rod, I'd like to hear their results. Darrell Leewww.bamboorods.homepage.com from stetzer@csd.uwm.edu Fri Feb 4 11:02:57 2000 batch3.csd.uwm.edu (8.8.4/8.6.8) with ESMTP id LAA29533 for; (8.8.4/8.6.8) withESMTP id LAA12325 for ; Fri, 4 Feb 2000 Subject: Re: Easier way to make splices. Ernie, I get my strips prep'd and organized and cut the splice on a small bandsaw with a little jig that slides in the miter slot. (Use a blade with small, sharp teeth.) (You get lots of little bamboo spearpoints on the floor.) Then in the splicing block and just a couple plane strokes gets the splice ready to glue.......................................................................Frank Stetzer "...a cheerful comrade is betterstetzer@uwm.edu than a waterproof coat and a Employed by, but not speaking for foot-warmer." Henry Van Dyke,Univ of Wisconsin-Milwaukee, USA "Fisherman's Luck", 1899. On Thu, 03 Feb 2000 10:51:47 -0800, Ernie Harrison wrote: Hans Kohl's e-mail in the archives seems like the best way to taperbamboosections for splicing. He suggests using a sanding disc instead of asplicing block. Any of you nodeless rod makers using this? If so how doyou like it?Ernie from Mackelvane@aol.com Fri Feb 4 11:31:44 2000 Subject: steel planing forms Hello all. What started out as a simple curiosity has morphed into ahealthy infatuation. I'm getting tools together in an attempt to start building my own rods. I was wondering if anyone has plans for steel planing forms. Ihave full access to a machine shop and count several skilled machinists amongmy friends. Any help here would be greatly appreciated. Thanks,Jeremy from JaguschR@aol.com Fri Feb 4 11:45:45 2000 Subject: Re: T&T (Glue) Hi Danny i am very sorry but i can't tell you what this glue is based on. He said it is a special mixture wich was developed expasily for him.All i can say that it is 1 compound an it has a white coulor which gets absolute clear when it has dryed.The working time is about 15-20 minutes. And here is the Adress Michael HèlsenbeckAm Walde 142929 Wermelskirchen-Dhènn Phone:02196-89311Fax:02196-702304 No e-mail Adress or Website :-( If you want one and resive any problems simply send me a Mail an i willget one for you. CURainereat..sleep..go fishing!! from jhewitt@cmn.net Fri Feb 4 13:28:09 2000 Subject: Carved Handles To the list...I am seeking information on anyone who produces carvedwooden grips for flyrods. Any info is appreciated, thanks in advance.John Hewitt from paul.blakley@dtn.ntl.com Fri Feb 4 13:30:30 2000 helo=dtn.ntl.com) Subject: Re:Hardy -Mitre Danny, Mitre -Hardy was to the best of my knowledge an English make which triedto capitalise on the good name of 'Hardy'but to which it had noconnection.Mitre- Hardy rods are quite an easy find here in England andone can expect to pay little more than say £50 sterling for a goodexample.I suspect the name of your reel i.e Mitre -Hardy Jewel was a marketingattempt at trying to copy the name of the 'Hardy ' Gem fly reel .I alsosuspect that these reels were made by Youngs of Redditch but cannot becertain of this .I hope all of this is of some interest. Tight Lines......Paul B Danny Twang wrote: To Harry, and all. Thank You Harry, now I don't have to worry about writhing to thelist:-) There was no trouble, I enjoyed it, and taking this as a part of myrodmaking education.Beside most of You have done the same, just look at all the tapersavailableon the Rodmakers. BTW, have any of You heard about a reel called "Mitre-Hardy 3 1/4,Jewel" Ibought it with aHGH silkline in mint condition. Costed me ca $35,- regardsdanny from rsgould@cmc.net Fri Feb 4 13:41:22 2000 Subject: Re: Bamboo Spinner Hi John,The rod you have is a Horrocks-Ibbotson and the diamond shaped symbolstamped into the reel seat UTK was one of their trademarks. That symbolwasused in the period from 1905 -1919 so it's an old rod and not often seen.Horrocks Ibbotson was one of the mass producers of fairly inexpensiverodsand made thousands of fly rods and apparently some spin cast rods aswell.Ray----- Original Message ----- Subject: Bamboo Spinner Anyone out there able to tell me anything about an old Bamboo a friend ofmine picked up? The thing is a spin-cast configuration with a flatteneddiamond logo having UTK stamped into it. It had a reel seat that has ahook Idon't know enough to tell him much about it. It has been rewound if onecould stretch his imagination that far!!! Looks like a real junker buthe'scurious about it, so I'm askin'?? Any help out there in this vast store of bamboo knowledge??? TIA, John Cerise from listreader@codemarine.com Fri Feb 4 14:13:16 2000 bycodemarine.209.170.128.193 with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet MailService Version5.5.2448.0) Subject: Various questions... Hello, all. My progress towards getting my first set of rod(s) completed continues. Ihave threeCattanach taper (7' 3pc #3/4) blanks and one Gould taper (5' 1pc #4) blankawaiting aferrule order and varnishing. I taped a reel seat, grip, and a few guides tothe 5' blankand casted it by kneeling down in my hallway last night--loads of fun andI can't wait tohave these rods done so I can fish with them (and start on the next one). Two questions... (1) I've had a hard time getting the blanks straight, especially right aftergluing. I'musing Nyatex epoxy, binding and straightening by hand, letting it sit anhour or two,straightening again, and finally heating about 10 minutes to cure beforeremoving thebinding thread. After scraping/sanding off the glue, I finally was able toget the blanksfairly straight with a heat gun by taping on guides and eyeing down theshaft. Tediouswork. I'm using a flat board as a roller, a paint roller, etc to straightenduring gluingbut the blanks still require heat-gun work after drying. Any tricks? (2) I'm getting ready to varnish using heated Pratt & Lambert Varmor R10in aslow-draining dip tube. Any gotchas I should be aware of? I'm assuming Ithat I do NOTthin this type of varnish. I've read contradictory opinions as to whether ornot I need aspecial polish. Advice? Thanks a lot for the help so far. I'll post screen shots of the finishedproduct ifpeople are interested in getting a chuckle or two out of a newbie effort. Steve Zimmermansteve@codemarine.com from leroyt@involved.com Fri Feb 4 14:17:51 2000 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61049U4500L450S0V35)with SMTP id com; Fri, 4 Feb 2000 12:17:45 -0800 Subject: Re: steel planing forms Go to the Rodmakers site and look for a Thomas Penrose. Has a good articleonmaking metal forms, Jack Howell book, Wayne C's book and lastlyGarrisonsbook.Leroy......... from richard.nantel@videotron.ca Fri Feb 4 14:39:16 2000 Internet Mail Serversims.3.5.1999.12.14.10.29.p8)with SMTP id forrodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu; Fri, Subject: Philadelphia Sorry if this is a bit off topic but I'll be in Philadelphia in two weekson business and was wondering if there are any top-rated fly shops orsellers of rod building suppliers I should visit. Please e-mail me off list. Thanks, Richard from richard.nantel@videotron.ca Fri Feb 4 14:39:17 2000 Internet Mail Serversims.3.5.1999.12.14.10.29.p8)with SMTP id forrodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu; Fri, Subject: RE: Various questions... Here's the number one trick to straighten a freshly glued blank. I learnedthis from this list about a year ago and it works fabulously well. Also, ittakes about 2 minutes to do. 1. Don't bind the rod too tightly. The sections must be able to slideagainst each other in straightening;2. Hold the glued section by the butt and whack the rod against ahorizontal flat surface.3. Turn the section to the next flat and whack it again.4. Continue whacking on all flats if needed. Usually, about 4-5 whacks are all you need to get the blank arrow straightand twist-less. My apologies to the person who taught me this. I can't remember thesourceof this valuable info. I do remember a thread about this technique workingwell on six-sided rods but not on pentas or quadrates. Richard (1) I've had a hard time getting the blanks straight,especially right after gluing. I'm using Nyatex epoxy,binding and straightening by hand, letting it sit an hour ortwo, straightening again, and finally heating about 10minutes to cure before removing the binding thread. Afterscraping/sanding off the glue, I finally was able to get theblanks fairly straight with a heat gun by taping on guidesand eyeing down the shaft. Tedious work. I'm using a flatboard as a roller, a paint roller, etc to straighten duringgluing but the blanks still require heat-gun work afterdrying. Any tricks? from nsflyrods@ns.sympatico.ca Fri Feb 4 16:18:45 2000 Subject: Herter's rod I know this is not bamboo related, but a friend of mine asked forsome help and I said I would try. He has a Herters fiberglass rod thatwas his grandfather's and he wants me to redo the wraps. I suggestedthatwe research it a little first.The rod is brown , 2pc about 9' long, has rainbow wraps(orange,yellow, green),it has a aluminum d/l reel seat and a reverse tapered grip. Below theHerters logo there is a # KB610. I don't know what the ferrules aremade of but would guess they are cheap plated.The reel is a Hardy Viscount 150 that doesn't seem as old??I would appreciate any info on these items and their makers.Thanks, Shawn from caneman@clnk.com Fri Feb 4 16:27:21 2000 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35)with SMTP id com; Fri, 4 Feb 2000 16:24:33 -0600 Subject: Re: Various questions... Steve,#1 thing you need is a well tuned binder. I know, there are some thatare going to say that you can hand bind just as easily as you can with abinder, BUT, my blanks come out of the binder almost perfect and needverylittle "tweeking". There have been a few occasions, where I got the stringoff, did a little sanding, looked down the blank, and did nothing more thansmile! Later,Bob -----Original Message----- Subject: Various questions... Hello, all. My progress towards getting my first set of rod(s) completed continues. Ihave three Cattanach taper (7' 3pc #3/4) blanks and one Gould taper (5'1pc#4) blank awaiting a ferrule order and varnishing. I taped a reel seat,grip, and a few guides to the 5' blank and casted it by kneeling down in myhallway last night--loads of fun and I can't wait to have these rods donesoI can fish with them (and start on the next one). Two questions... (1) I've had a hard time getting the blanks straight, especially rightafter gluing. I'm using Nyatex epoxy, binding and straightening by hand,letting it sit an hour or two, straightening again, and finally heatingabout 10 minutes to cure before removing the binding thread. Afterscraping/sanding off the glue, I finally was able to get the blanks fairlystraight with a heat gun by taping on guides and eyeing down the shaft.Tedious work. I'm using a flat board as a roller, a paint roller, etc tostraighten during gluing but the blanks still require heat-gun work afterdrying. Any tricks? (2) I'm getting ready to varnish using heated Pratt & Lambert Varmor R10ina slow-draining dip tube. Any gotchas I should be aware of? I'm assuming Ithat I do NOT thin this type of varnish. I've read contradictory opinions asto whether or not I need a special polish. Advice? Thanks a lot for the help so far. I'll post screen shots of the finishedproduct if people are interested in getting a chuckle or two out of anewbieeffort. Steve Zimmermansteve@codemarine.com from caneman@clnk.com Fri Feb 4 16:29:01 2000 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35)with SMTP id com; Fri, 4 Feb 2000 16:26:21 -0600 Subject: Re: Various questions... Richard,I can see how that might work with a straight taper, but what about acompound taper... wouldn't you be whacking a crook in the rod at everyflat? Bob -----Original Message----- rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Subject: RE: Various questions... Here's the number one trick to straighten a freshly glued blank. I learnedthis from this list about a year ago and it works fabulously well. Also, ittakes about 2 minutes to do. 1. Don't bind the rod too tightly. The sections must be able to slideagainst each other in straightening;2. Hold the glued section by the butt and whack the rod against ahorizontal flat surface.3. Turn the section to the next flat and whack it again.4. Continue whacking on all flats if needed. Usually, about 4-5 whacks are all you need to get the blank arrowstraightand twist-less. My apologies to the person who taught me this. I can't remember thesourceof this valuable info. I do remember a thread about this techniqueworkingwell on six-sided rods but not on pentas or quadrates. Richard (1) I've had a hard time getting the blanks straight,especially right after gluing. I'm using Nyatex epoxy,binding and straightening by hand, letting it sit an hour ortwo, straightening again, and finally heating about 10minutes to cure before removing the binding thread. Afterscraping/sanding off the glue, I finally was able to get theblanks fairly straight with a heat gun by taping on guidesand eyeing down the shaft. Tedious work. I'm using a flatboard as a roller, a paint roller, etc to straighten duringgluing but the blanks still require heat-gun work afterdrying. Any tricks? from stpete@netten.net Fri Feb 4 16:30:58 2000 Fri, 4 Feb 2000 16:33:24 -0600 Subject: Re: steel planing forms Jeremy, Use the machine shop to purchase and cut in half the steel keystock,drill and tap the holes, and to mill a lathe tool block as diagramed byBruce Conner (available via 'Rodmakers'). Truing up or squaring thekeystock and cutting the groove might best be done by hand. See ThomasPenrose's page via 'Rodmakers'. There has been more than one person onthis list who met disappointment and trouble setting up the mill to facethe stock (warps badly under the mill) and cut the tapered groove. It'snot that hard to do. Just lots of elbow grease and a few calluses. Rick C. Mackelvane@aol.com wrote: Hello all. What started out as a simple curiosity has morphed into ahealthyinfatuation. I'm getting tools together in an attempt to start building myown rods. I was wondering if anyone has plans for steel planing forms. Ihavefull access to a machine shop and count several skilled machinistsamong myfriends. Any help here would be greatly appreciated. Thanks,Jeremy from bob@downandacross.com Fri Feb 4 16:47:31 2000 (envelope- from bob@downandacross.com) Subject: Re: Bamboo Spinner Isn't 1910 even a bit early for spin-casting rods? Maybe it is a baitcaster? At 11:41 AM 2/4/00 -0800, you wrote:Hi John,The rod you have is a Horrocks-Ibbotson and the diamond shaped symbolstamped into the reel seat UTK was one of their trademarks. That symbolwasused in the period from 1905 -1919 so it's an old rod and not often seen.Horrocks Ibbotson was one of the mass producers of fairly inexpensiverodsand made thousands of fly rods and apparently some spin cast rods aswell.Ray----- Original Message -----From: John K. Cerise Sent: Thursday, February 03, 2000 3:39 PMSubject: Bamboo Spinner Anyone out there able to tell me anything about an old Bamboo a friendofmine picked up? The thing is a spin-cast configuration with aflatteneddiamond logo having UTK stamped into it. It had a reel seat that has ahook Idon't know enough to tell him much about it. It has been rewound if onecould stretch his imagination that far!!! Looks like a real junker buthe'scurious about it, so I'm askin'?? Any help out there in this vast store of bamboo knowledge??? TIA, John Cerise Bob Maulucci==================================================downandacross.combob@downandacross.com from bob@downandacross.com Fri Feb 4 17:04:42 2000 (envelope- from bob@downandacross.com) Subject: Re: Herter's rod I have a Herter's 7' glass rod. Wraps sound the same. Are these rods worth anything. Got mine when hunting down a reel.Bob At 06:10 PM 2/4/00 -0400, you wrote:I know this is not bamboo related, but a friend of mine asked forsome help and I said I would try. He has a Herters fiberglass rod thatwas his grandfather's and he wants me to redo the wraps. I suggestedthat we research it a little first.The rod is brown , 2pc about 9' long, has rainbow wraps(orange,yellow, green),it has a aluminum d/l reel seat and a reverse tapered grip. Below theHerters logo there is a # KB610. I don't know what the ferrules aremade of but would guess they are cheap plated.The reel is a Hardy Viscount 150 that doesn't seem as old??I would appreciate any info on these items and their makers.Thanks, Shawn from brewer@teleport.com Fri Feb 4 17:32:06 2000 "hamachi"via SMTP by relay1.teleport.com, id smtpdAAA05LFhP; Fri Feb 4 15:31:272000 Subject: Varnish Heating I would appreciate suggestions on what you folks do to warm the varnishonthose cold winter nights. Forgive me if this was covered recently. [2-3 teaspoons] in a paper cup? If so, how much time should I try? Whatdidyou tell your wife when you did this? I use an aluminum dip tube and have CAREFULLY heated it with a heat gunonlow. I don't feel comfortable doing this, as I have a fear of immolatingeverything near the varnish, including me. Is this a recipe for disaster? Iloosen the cap on the top of the tube to account for expansion and don't putthe gun near the opening. I'm not sure how flammable Varathane is and Idon't want to find out the hard way. I tried the previously mentioned cold water pipe heater, but I got the HomeDepot version that had a thermostat also, and we know that didn't work. Asource for one that didn't have a thermostat would be helpful if anyoneknows of one. Thanks, and stay warm! Randy Brewerbrewer@teleport.com from dpfitch@collins.rockwell.com Fri Feb 4 17:33:59 2000 2000 17:33:51 -0600 gatekeeper.collins.rockwell.com via smap (V4.2) 5-20-1999)) id8625687B.008176E9 ; Fri, 4 Feb 2000 17:34:05 -0600 Subject: Re: Various questions... Steve: I've only built nodeless thus far and had very little (almost no)needto straighten after the Epon cured. Now studying construction with node. I'veread sections of four books that discuss the subject. The surface you usetostraighten needs to be flat. I've heard of guys who have a marble top fromanold dresser, another has a piece of plate glass, and another uses theFormicacounter in his kitchen. Start straightening at the butt end and work up. Notsure about a paint roller; did you mean one of the small, hard rubber orwoodwallpaper seam rollers? Tedious process, nonetheless (just having done alittleof it). RE dipping: I've had a couple of gents tell me they don't thin, and theirfinishes aren't the best I've seen. I built a finishing tube and dryingcabinet(9 feet tall). Pull rods from the finish tube versus draining. To date, usedtung oil base P&L spar, thinned 10%. (A friend of mine uses urethanethinned15%). I hesitate (about 1-2 mins at each wrap/guide as I pull. Even withthis process, I've had the slightest hint of a sag at the at a couple ofwraps.So, I think thinning is appropriate--especially if you don't heat the varnishinthe tube. When I replace my current varnish, I plan to thin to 20%, but I'vehad guys that tell me they've thinned 40%. One said 50%. Not sure if theyweredoing urethane or spar varnish. The potential for a sag on the rod isreduced way, I pull at speeds between 1.75 and 4.25 inches per MINUTE (by a smallDCmotor that I rigged with a on off switch. I control speed by using a DCpowersupply with different power levels (1.5v to 12v). If your drain is fasterthan4 inch p/minute, or you're dipping wrapped rods, I'd thin for sure. Worstcaseis another dip of the rod. By the way, Wayne Cattanach thins, says hesandsalmost all of every coat of vanish off--except the last. Wayne has verynicefinishes! Thicker varnish means a thicker coat--assuming the pull rate andtempof varnish are the same. Like all other things you might finish, morethinnercoats is better than a few (or one) thick coat. Good luck. I expect allot of other folks will chime in. Just about everyonehas an opinion about finishes, including that they have very little tonothingto do with how a rod performs. Dave "Steve Zimmerman" on 02/04/2000 02:16:15PM Please respond to listreader@codemarine.com Subject: Various questions... Hello, all. My progress towards getting my first set of rod(s) completed continues. Ihavethree Cattanach taper (7' 3pc #3/4) blanks and one Gould taper (5' 1pc #4)blankawaiting a ferrule order and varnishing. I taped a reel seat, grip, and a fewguides to the 5' blank and casted it by kneeling down in my hallway lastnight--loads of fun and I can't wait to have these rods done so I can fishwiththem (and start on the next one). Two questions... (1) I've had a hard time getting the blanks straight, especially right aftergluing. I'm using Nyatex epoxy, binding and straightening by hand, letting itsit an hour or two, straightening again, and finally heating about 10minutes tocure before removing the binding thread. After scraping/sanding off theglue, Ifinally was able to get the blanks fairly straight with a heat gun by tapingonguides and eyeing down the shaft. Tedious work. I'm using a flat board as aroller, a paint roller, etc to straighten during gluing but the blanks stillrequire heat-gun work after drying. Any tricks? (2) I'm getting ready to varnish using heated Pratt & Lambert Varmor R10in aslow-draining dip tube. Any gotchas I should be aware of? I'm assuming Ithat Ido NOT thin this type of varnish. I've read contradictory opinions as towhetheror not I need a special polish. Advice? Thanks a lot for the help so far. I'll post screen shots of the finishedproductif people are interested in getting a chuckle or two out of a newbie effort. Steve Zimmermansteve@codemarine.com from dannyt@frisurf.no Fri Feb 4 17:40:54 2000 (MET) Subject: Fario boundary="MS_Mac_OE_3032642397_109346_MIME_Part" THIS MESSAGE IS IN MIME FORMAT. Since your mail reader does notunderstandthis format, some or all of this message may not be legible. --MS_Mac_OE_3032642397_109346_MIME_Part To all Here it is, Fario 8'5" #5-6, impregnated, build by Sharps of Aberdeen. Guidespacing: 4 2/8, 10 5/8, 18 1/4, 26 1/4, 34, 41 3/4, 49 3/4/// 591/2,67 3/4 and 76 Tip: 1392 mm Butt: 1222 mm 1 1/4 - ,086 57 - ,2675 - ,100 60 - ,26910 - ,114 65 - ,27715 - ,131 70 - ,28620 - ,144 75 - ,29625 - ,158 80 - ,30030 - ,172 85 - ,31035 - ,190 90 - ,32240 - ,20545 - ,22549 - ,23652 1/2 - ,248 Enjoydanny--MS_Mac_OE_3032642397_109346_MIME_Part Fario To all Here it is, Fario 8'5" #5-6, impregnated, build by Sharps ofAberdeen.= Guidespacing: 4 2/8, 10 5/8, 18 1/4, 26 1/4, 34, 41 3/4, 49 3/4/// 591/2, =67 3/4 and 76 5  = 9 p;,114 p;,131 p;,144 p;,158 p;,172 p;,190 p;,205 p;,225 p;,236 Enjoydanny --MS_Mac_OE_3032642397_109346_MIME_Part-- from bob@downandacross.com Fri Feb 4 18:17:57 2000 (envelope- from bob@downandacross.com) Subject: Re: Varnish Heating and pipe heaters Hi Randy,I cut out the thermostat on one of those and rewired it. No big deal. Works great. Takes about 45 minutes to heat to 90* or so. My basement is about 55* and this still works okay for me. I think the flash point ( right term?) on most varnishes is higher than 150*, but I am not sure on that. A friend who sprays guitar varnishes says he can heat the varnish up toabout 5 degrees below the "flash point" and he gets his best results. He said the "flash point" on his varnish is 158* but he uses a traditional type, not a urethane like I do.I am still a newbie, but I can say that my finishes all sucked until I started really warming them up to 90 or 95*. Now they are almost good enough to show someone! Ha ha! I really want to get the varnish thing right because we all know that it is the first thing people scrutinize over. Even if you never intend to sell a rod (I don't really plan to), I would take pride in the finish. With a good amount of care sanding, I feel it is attainable by anybody. I haven't even rigged up a motor yet! I use a reel and figured out that the rate is almost one reel turn for every 4" of withdrawal. I watch my wristwatch and try to pace myself through it. Not rocket science, but I am no Payne either and never said I was.Best regards, At 03:08 PM 2/4/00 -0800, you wrote:I would appreciate suggestions on what you folks do to warm the varnishonthose cold winter nights. Forgive me if this was covered recently. varnish[2-3 teaspoons] in a paper cup? If so, how much time should I try? Whatdidyou tell your wife when you did this? I use an aluminum dip tube and have CAREFULLY heated it with a heat gunonlow. I don't feel comfortable doing this, as I have a fear of immolatingeverything near the varnish, including me. Is this a recipe for disaster? Iloosen the cap on the top of the tube to account for expansion and don'tputthe gun near the opening. I'm not sure how flammable Varathane is and Idon't want to find out the hard way. I tried the previously mentioned cold water pipe heater, but I got theHomeDepot version that had a thermostat also, and we know that didn't work. Asource for one that didn't have a thermostat would be helpful if anyoneknows of one. Thanks, and stay warm! Randy Brewerbrewer@teleport.com Bob Maulucci==================================================downandacross.combob@downandacross.com from can@telusplanet.net Fri Feb 4 19:18:52 2000 telusplanet.net") by smtp1.telusplanet.net with ESMTP Subject: Leonard 37 Taper Does anybody have a taper for this rod, I am led to believe it's a 7' 3wt. Also what is the signifigance of designaters such as H, L DH withLeonard rods I see in the Archives?-- CheersCraig from richard.nantel@videotron.ca Fri Feb 4 20:27:02 2000 Internet Mail Serversims.3.5.1999.12.14.10.29.p8)with SMTP id forrodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu; Fri, Subject: RE: Various questions... rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Bob, I turned to this system specifically because compound tapers weresucha drag to do using the traditional hand-rolling method. For some reason,this works, even on butt sections that have a swelled butt. I think thereason it works is that it isn't the surface which is straightening thesection but rather the inertia of having all the sections pulled bycentrifugal force when they come to a sudden stop. I'm not an engineer,though, and this is speculation. Richard -----Original Message----- Sent: Friday, February 04, 2000 5:26 PM rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Re: Various questions... Richard,I can see how that might work with a straight taper, butwhat about acompound taper... wouldn't you be whacking a crook in the rodat every flat? Bob from martinjensen@home.com Fri Feb 4 21:53:34 2000 (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with SMTP ;Fri, 4 Feb 2000 19:53:18 -0800 Subject: RE: Technical question- practically speaking boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0056_01BF6F49.6AD12390" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0056_01BF6F49.6AD12390 That must just kill you to only build a rod to ..001 tolerance when you usesuch tight tolerances in your day to day work. I just changed careers fromamarine machinist to computers and as a machinist ..001 was generally apretty close tolerance. A pretty easy jump to rod building as far astolerances go... Martin Jensen -----Original Message----- Sent: Friday, February 04, 2000 6:34 AM rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Re: Technical question- practically speaking That would be pretty tough tolerance to hold when working with cane !However, I work to that sort of tolerances in metal, every day. BTW, on reaming of holes for ferrules. There will be a certain amount of"bell mouth" effect, in that the opening will be a bit larger, than thebottom of the hole. (female ferrule) Some, like Winston, used a Sunnenhone,to hone the inside perfectly straight. That is the bottom of the hole ishoned, to make it the same as the mouth. In small quantity, this can bedonewith a male lap. The lap would only make contact for the first 1/4" to3/8",so the cutting would be down inside, rather at the mouth. GMA----- Original Message -----From: Martin Jensen Sent: Thursday, February 03, 2000 10:54 PMSubject: RE: Technical question- practically speaking I hope I can assume that you have "tongue in cheek" when you mention.00001 tolerance. Or did you hic-up when you typed the zero's. Martin Jensen ----- Original Message -----From: michael Sent: Wednesday, February 02, 2000 7:22 AMSubject: Technical question- practically speaking Guys,While measuring some of my strips the other night, I started towonder about the technical aspects of the tapers vs. the practical aspects.In the experience of whomever wants to comment, just how far 'off'of the dimensions can one stray (+ or -) yet have the rod feel and fish thesame as one made to within .00001" accuracy. Granted in theory therewouldbe a difference with any deviation from the stated taper dimensions, but from a practical standpoint what do you think, or what has been youractualexperience? I realize this is just some more of my weird questions, but it helpsto fill in gaps in the knowledge bank. Thanks, Mike ------=_NextPart_000_0056_01BF6F49.6AD12390 must just kill you to only build a rod to ..001 tolerance when you use = tight tolerances in your day to day work. I just changed careers from a = machinist to computers and as a machinist ..001 was generally a pretty = go... Jensen rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Re: Technical question- practically speakingThat would be pretty tough tolerance to hold when working with = However, I work to that sort of tolerances in metal, every day. BTW, on reaming of holes for ferrules. There will be a certain = "bell mouth" effect, in that the opening will be a bit larger, than = of the hole. (female ferrule) Some, like Winston, used a Sunnen hone, = the inside perfectly straight. That is the bottom of the hole is = make it the same as the mouth. In small quantity, this can be done = lap. The lap would only make contact for the first 1/4" to 3/8", so = cutting would be down inside, rather at the mouth. GMA ----- Original Message ----- Jensen rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= Sent: Thursday, February 03, = PMSubject: RE: Technical = practically speaking hope I can assume that you have "tongue in cheek" when you mention = tolerance. Or did you hic-up when you typed the =zero's. Martin Jensen ----- Original Message ----- = michael Sent: Wednesday, February = 7:22 AMSubject: Technical = practically speaking Guys,While measuring some of my = night, I started to wonder about the technical aspects of the = the practical aspects.In the experience of whomever = comment, just how far 'off' of the dimensions can one stray (+ = have the rod feel and fish the same as one made to within = accuracy. Granted in theory there would be a difference with any = deviation from the stated taper dimensions, but from a practical = experience? I realize this is just some = bank. Thanks, Mike ------=_NextPart_000_0056_01BF6F49.6AD12390-- from richjez@enteract.com Fri Feb 4 22:04:44 2000 (envelope- from richjez@enteract.com) , Subject: Re: T&T boundary="=====================_12395488==_.ALT" --=====================_12395488==_.ALT You can find conversation programs at www.shareware.com. They arefreeware or shareware.Rich Jezioro At 07:22 AM 2/4/00 -0600, nobler wrote:It's easier by far if you convert to decimals, i.e. 1/4" = .250", and 1mm =.03937" Radio Shack sells a neat calculator for under $15, that has allmetric conversions from inches, and visa versa. GMA----- Original Message -----From: "Danny Twang" Sent: Friday, February 04, 2000 1:05 AMSubject: Re: T&T Mike Leitheiser wrote: Danny,I woould like to see the Fario Club taper to compare to the one onRodmakerswhich came from a rod I have..... Hi Mike Will do tonight.The rod is not a Pezone et Michel , but made by Sharps of Aberdeen.Got the numbers wrong, the Fario is 8`6" and the Hardy 8`9", I'm notusedto theinch yet....to many numbers. Cant figure out all that dividing of the inch, 1/4,1/16,1/64......... danny *________________________________)// Rich Jezioro@/||/____/||_________________________________________||/\))):> > ))):>-- =====================_12395488==_.ALT You can find conversation programs atwww.shareware.com.They are freeware or shareware. Rich Jezioro At 07:22 AM 2/4/00 -0600, nobler wrote:It's easier by far if you convert to decimals,i.e. 1/4" =3D .250", and 1mm =3D.03937" Radio Shack sells a neat calculator for under $15, that hasallmetric conversions from inches, and visa versa. GMA----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: T&T onRodmakers Aberdeen. 8`9", I'm not usedto the 1/16, *_____________ ___________________) @/ ||/ ____/||_________________________________________ p;/\ ; / bsp; --=====================_12395488==_.ALT-- from HomeyDKlown@worldnet.att.net Fri Feb 4 22:24:57 2000 with ESMTP id Subject: Hollow rods All, I'm almost ready to start my latest project rod. I want to make aHolbrook 9 wt rod, but I want to make it hollow. At the PA Rodmakers'Gathering, Tom Smithwick had a really nice rod that was hollow builtaccording to the "Powell method", though I'm not familiar with it. Ialso know Per Brandin does a fine hollow rod that's feather light. Somy question is how should I go about tackling the Holbrook Mod. 310, 81/2 ft 9 wt.? I'd like to use it as a bass/pike rod for fishing inCanada this summer. Any input would be most welcome. TIA, Dennis from stpete@netten.net Fri Feb 4 22:52:26 2000 Fri, 4 Feb 2000 22:55:11 -0600 Subject: Re: Varnish Heating I varnish in my attic where my workshop is located. It is usually about72+ degrees up there, so I don't use a heater, but I have a heating cordmade for starting seedlings that some good nurseries carry. They comein different lengths, mine is about 8 ft long total. It gets up toabout 70* and is waterproof of course. You can soon use it to starttomatoes with after you varnish your rod :) Rick Randy Brewer wrote: I would appreciate suggestions on what you folks do to warm the varnishonthose cold winter nights. Forgive me if this was covered recently. varnish[2-3 teaspoons] in a paper cup? If so, how much time should I try? Whatdidyou tell your wife when you did this? I use an aluminum dip tube and have CAREFULLY heated it with a heat gunonlow. I don't feel comfortable doing this, as I have a fear of immolatingeverything near the varnish, including me. Is this a recipe for disaster? Iloosen the cap on the top of the tube to account for expansion and don'tputthe gun near the opening. I'm not sure how flammable Varathane is and Idon't want to find out the hard way. I tried the previously mentioned cold water pipe heater, but I got theHomeDepot version that had a thermostat also, and we know that didn't work.Asource for one that didn't have a thermostat would be helpful if anyoneknows of one. Thanks, and stay warm! Randy Brewerbrewer@teleport.com from mschaffer@mindspring.com Sat Feb 5 06:47:09 2000 Subject: Re: Technical question- practically speaking boundary="----=_NextPart_000_003A_01BF6FAF.57797200" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_003A_01BF6FAF.57797200 Martin,I was just speaking to someone the other day who does and is well known= reply was that due to the modern tooling we have available to us now, =the rods built today are far and away more accurate than those by the ="classic" builders.Apparently a number of the classic rods had tolerances of =3D or - .004 =and larger, but this apparently didn't affect the rod's useablilty. So, = Another point brought up by noted builders that a given numerical =tolerance ie .001, .002 is not necessarily a totally valid figure when =the tapering design of the rod is considered. Hence the use of a =percentage figure appears more valid; which is to say, 4% tolerance in =measurements is acceptable over the length of the rod.Using this approach, which I like for what that's worth, you will get a =different tolerance figure for each rod section while still staying =within the tolerance you select.So much for my gabbing, but I do want to thank all those who have had =input on this questionand I don't want to belabor the point, but at =least now I have a different and I feel better way to try to establish =an accuracy goal for my own meager efforts!Thanks to all, Mike -----Original Message-----From: Martin Jensen ; rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu = Date: Friday, February 04, 2000 10:58 PMSubject: RE: Technical question- practically speaking That must just kill you to only build a rod to ..001 tolerance when =you use such tight tolerances in your day to day work. I just changed =careers from a marine machinist to computers and as a machinist ..001 =was generally a pretty close tolerance. A pretty easy jump to rod =building as far as tolerances go... -----Original Message----- Sent: Friday, February 04, 2000 6:34 AM rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Re: Technical question- practically speaking That would be pretty tough tolerance to hold when working with =cane ! However, I work to that sort of tolerances in metal, every day. BTW, on reaming of holes for ferrules. There will be a certain =amount of "bell mouth" effect, in that the opening will be a bit larger, =than the bottom of the hole. (female ferrule) Some, like Winston, used a =Sunnen hone, to hone the inside perfectly straight. That is the bottom =of the hole is honed, to make it the same as the mouth. In small =quantity, this can be done with a male lap. The lap would only make =contact for the first 1/4" to 3/8", so the cutting would be down inside, =rather at the mouth. GMA Sent: Thursday, February 03, 2000 10:54 PMSubject: RE: Technical question- practically speaking I hope I can assume that you have "tongue in cheek" when you =mention .00001 tolerance. Or did you hic-up when you typed the zero's. Sent: Wednesday, February 02, 2000 7:22 AMSubject: Technical question- practically speaking Guys,While measuring some of my strips the other night, I =started to wonder about the technical aspects of the tapers vs. the =practical aspects.In the experience of whomever wants to comment, just =how far 'off' of the dimensions can one stray (+ or -) yet have the rod =feel and fish the same as one made to within .00001" accuracy. Granted =in theory there would be a difference with any deviation from the stated =taper dimensions, but from a practical standpoint what do you think, or =what has been your actual experience? I realize this is just some more of my weird =questions, but it helps to fill in gaps in the knowledge bank. Thanks, Mike ------=_NextPart_000_003A_01BF6FAF.57797200 Martin,I wasjust = someone the other day who does and is well known for his rods and the = tooling we have available to us now, the rods built today are far and = accurate than those by the "classic" builders.Apparently a number of the classic rods had = So, tolerances of .001" are seemingly just fine. Another point brought up by noted builders that a = numerical tolerance ie .001, .002 is not necessarily a totally valid = the tapering design of the rod is considered. Hence the use of a = figure appears more valid; which is to say, 4% tolerance in measurements= acceptable over the length of the rod.Usingthis = like for what that's worth, you will get a different tolerance figure = rod section while still staying within the tolerance you =select.So much I do want to thank all those who have had input on this questionand I = to belabor the point, but at least now I have a different and I feel = to try to establish an accuracy goal for my own meager =efforts!Thanks to all, Mike -----Original = ; rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= <rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= Friday, February 04, 2000 10:58 PMSubject: RE: = question- practically speakingThat must just kill you to only build a= ..001 tolerance when you use such tight tolerances in your day to = I just changed careers from a marine machinist to computers and as a = machinist ..001 was generally a pretty close tolerance. A pretty = to rod building as far as tolerances go... Jensen rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Re: Technical = practically speakingThat would be pretty tough tolerance to hold when working = ! However, I work to that sort of tolerances in metal, every =day. BTW, on reaming of holes for ferrules. There will be a = amount of "bell mouth" effect, in that the opening = bit larger, than the bottom of the hole. (female ferrule) Some, = Winston, used a Sunnen hone, to hone the inside perfectly = is the bottom of the hole is honed, to make it the same as the = small quantity, this can be done with a male lap. The lap would = make contact for the first 1/4" to 3/8", so the = be down inside, rather at the mouth. GMA ----- Original Message ----- = Martin Jensen Sent: Thursday, = 2000 10:54 PMSubject: RE: = question- practically speaking I hope I can assume that you have= "tongue in cheek" when you mention .00001 = did you hic-up when you typed the =zero's. Martin =Jensen ----- Original = michael Sent: = Subject: = question- practically speaking Guys,While measuring = strips the other night, I started to wonder about = aspects.In the experience = wants to comment, just how far 'off' of the = one stray (+ or -) yet have the rod feel and fish = as one made to within .00001" accuracy. Granted = theory there would be a difference with any = the stated taper dimensions, but from a practical = experience? I realize this is = more of my weird questions, but it helps to fill in = the knowledge bank. Thanks, Mike ------=_NextPart_000_003A_01BF6FAF.57797200-- from nsflyrods@ns.sympatico.ca Sat Feb 5 07:03:34 2000 Sat, 5 Feb 2000 09:03:00 -0400 Subject: Re: Dickerson tapers boundary="------------2AC6C89B73B2E25530D28020" --------------2AC6C89B73B2E25530D28020 Sixto,On the Hardy CC de France taper you posted, does this rod haveon offset ferrule or something? Unless I am mistaken it looks as if yourmeasurements show the ferrule at 46" point instead of 42.5". Is thiscorrect? That would make the butt longer than the tip.Shawn"Sixto F. Saez" wrote: Thanks for the tapers. Attached are the tapers in the Excelspreadsheet in text form. Sorry for the delay but I spent the last twodays working on my next rod. My company was closed for 2 days becauseof the snow so I decided to spend this unexpected bonus on my rodinstead of on the 'net. You may have the Payne tapers because I thinkI got those from the Rod Makers web site. My second rod was theCattenach taper. It certainly has lived up to it's description. It'smy favorite trout rod, short enough for most brushy streams but withenough backbone to throw a 6wt line a fishable distance when I forgotto bring the reel with the 4wt line. -----Original Message----- Sent: Tuesday, January 25, 2000 13:54 Subject: Dickerson tapers "Shawn Pineo, New Scotland Flyrods" wrote: Hey Sixto,sorry I took so long to get these to you.Please excuse the text format, but I'm still new atcomputers and I don't have a document program yet. Ihaven't built any of these yet and this is all the info Ihave on them. Sixto I couldn't read those tapers because Idon't have Exel...pitty. ... --------------2AC6C89B73B2E25530D28020 Sixto, deFrance taper you posted, does this rod have on offset ferrule orsomething?Unless I am mistaken it looks as if your measurements show the ferruleat 46" point instead of 42.5". Is this correct? That would make the buttlonger than the tip. Shawn"Sixto F. Saez" wrote: form. Sorry for the delay but I spent the last two days working on my nextrod. My company was closed for 2 days because of the snow so I decidedto spend this unexpected bonus on my rod instead of on the 'net. You mayhave the Payne tapers because I think I got those from the Rod Makers website. My second rod was the Cattenach taper. It certainly has lived upto it's description. It's my favorite trout rod, short enough for mostbrushy streams but with enough backbone to throw a 6wt line a fishabledistance when I forgot to bring the reel with the 4wtline. -----OriginalMessage----- Sent: Tuesday, January 25,2000 13:54 sf_saez@email.msn.comSubject: Dickersontapers "Shawn Pineo, New Scotland Flyrods" wrote:Hey Sixto, sorry I took so long to get these to you. Please excuse the text format,but I'm still new at computers and I don't have a document program yet.I haven't built any of these yet and this is all the info I have on them.Sixto I couldn't read those tapers because I don't have Exel...pitty. --------------2AC6C89B73B2E25530D28020-- from mschaffer@mindspring.com Sat Feb 5 07:12:35 2000 Subject: John Parker John,Someone told me you used to beat some iron too!Give me a buzz, Mike from nobler@satx.rr.com Sat Feb 5 08:02:52 2000 SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.197.19);Sat, 5 Feb 2000 08:03:19 -0600 Subject: Re: Varnish Heating from past experiences, it seems pretty clear that heating the varnish toatleast 90* F., will produce not only better penetration, but a nicer finish,with less chance of runs. When applying epoxies, heating the surface to bepainted, or glues results in better penetration of the glue, and a smootherapplication of the enamel. It seems a worthwhile test to see how hot the varnish can be, and stillworkwell. When applying heat to decrease the set up time of epoxy, too muchheatwill cause unwanted bubbling. Getting the temperature just below thispoint,would seem to be ideal. Has anyone here done anything like this ? GMA----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Varnish Heating I varnish in my attic where my workshop is located. It is usually about72+ degrees up there, so I don't use a heater, but I have a heating cordmade for starting seedlings that some good nurseries carry. They comein different lengths, mine is about 8 ft long total. It gets up toabout 70* and is waterproof of course. You can soon use it to starttomatoes with after you varnish your rod :) Rick Randy Brewer wrote: I would appreciate suggestions on what you folks do to warm thevarnishonthose cold winter nights. Forgive me if this was covered recently. varnish[2-3 teaspoons] in a paper cup? If so, how much time should I try?Whatdidyou tell your wife when you did this? I use an aluminum dip tube and have CAREFULLY heated it with a heatgunon