from saltwein@swbell.net Sat Apr 1 05:46:35 2000 (Sun Internet Mail Server sims.3.5.2000.01.05.12.18.p9)with ESMTP id for Subject: Re: Varnish tube I like this idea except for two reasons. My stair is close to my furnace,probably nothing to worry about really. I have berber carpet on the stairandas this would have to be a removable top portion, I am not too sure howwell itwould patch when the tube was not in use. I would like to take this opportunity to thank everyone for their input. Youdefinitely have me thinking. Quite an accomplishment in and of itself. Regards, SteveIndependence, MO Martin Jensen wrote: I can plug up a three inch hole in the stair case pretty easily. Now if youhave hardwood stairs that is another thing. Actually you could patch thatpretty easily also. Martin Jensen -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Friday, March 31, 2000 6:16 PM Subject: Varnish tube I would give serious thought to a drip tube before drilling a holeanywhere.Ed from lars32@gateway.net Sat Apr 1 06:21:27 2000 Subject: Re: Dip Finish If you look at Wayne Cattanach's book it shows a finishing booth that alsoserves as a drying cabinet. I would think that moving the rod out of the dipstation into a drying cabinet would result in dust on the rod blank. WithWayne's method the rod stays right in the dip station and with the additonof an air filter the finish is dust free.Works for me!Dave Norling----- Original Message----- Subject: Re: Dip Finish Steve,I have a slab floor in my workshop, so the problem was the same asyours.I drilled through the floor with a borrowed impact drill. Expect a hugeamount of dust and noise, so use ear, nose, and eye protection and coveranystuff in the basement that you don't want coated in concrete dust. Iwoundup having to vacuum every square inch of my workshop, because once I gotthat impact drill going, I was so compulsive that I didn't stop until thathole was done!I located the hole in a corner of the shop so it was easy to build adust-tight cabinet to house the dipping assembly. The dia.of the hole wassufficient to allow a 10" piece of PVC to be installed in the hole. Thedepth will depend on the lifting space your ceiling will allow and thelength of sections you plan to dip. Mine has a 2' deep hole. I installedthePVC with about 2" above the slab and concreted around it and in thebottomof the hole to seal it off from the dirt.The cabinet encloses it all an goes up to the ceiling. Another cabinetis built next to the dipping cabinet to serve as the drying cabinet. Iwiredboth cabinets for electrical connections.Steve WeissI have been playing around with different means of applying poly. Thebest results to date have been with the latex stretched over acontainer. This still leaves something to be desired with my efforts. I am going to go for a dip tank and the only way I have room for that iswith a hole in the basement floor. My question is, for those of you whohave gone this way, how big (or preferably small) of a hole did youneed? Regards, SteveIndependence, MO from nsflyrods@ns.sympatico.ca Sat Apr 1 07:05:51 2000 Subject: Hardener for Urac 185 I have been experimenting with Urac mixtures and searching thearchives for a little while now and was curious about the substitutionof ammonium chloride for hardener. First of all some people said it wasammonium chloride and some said ammonium carbonate (the stuff used forbrown toning cane). I believe it is the chloride?The directions are not really clear. Do you mix the ACpowder/water combo into the resin or into the resin with walnut shellhardener already added?What are the mixture ratios? What makes this better than thestandard mix?It is thinner and doesn't have the gap filling properties. The onlybenefit I see is that it has a longer pot life. Why the heat drying withthis one as opposed to normal urac/hardener?Shawn from lars32@gateway.net Sat Apr 1 07:18:44 2000 Subject: Re: bamboo sources C&D Trading have the best cork in my book!Dave Norling-----Original Message- ---- RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.edu Subject: Re: bamboo sources Hi Shawn,I have a couple comments. First in regards to the bamboo I have trust andconfidence in the C.H. Demarest Co. and believe it is wise to continue topurchase from them especially since I know they have personally visitedthetonkin cane forests and their suppliers so that we might receive bettercaneand so that we receive the right species. Harold Demarest has attendedmostall of our west coast work shops at Corbett Lake and at Troutdale andknowsmany of us personally and makes an effort to obtain good productson ourbehalf. That being said I see little reason to change. On the issue ofgetting good cork we've put together a group order at our Corbettworkshopsand gotten good cork from C&D Trading by ordering their best grade.You'llneed to check with them to get current pricing and minimum order size.Thelast email address I have for them is dpeter@pconline.com.RayRay----- Original Message -----From: Shawn Pineo Sent: Friday, March 31, 2000 2:27 PMSubject: bamboo sources I have noticed lately that there are a lot of different suppliers forbamboo. When I first got into this there was only Demarest and TuxedoCane (I think) but now there are new ones popping up all over. Mrs.Demarest was most helpful when I ordered my first order (and in allcorrespondence afterward) which goes a long way in my books but I wasdebating trying one of these other ones out for a change next order. Myquestion is for people who have ordered from these "other" guys, Istheir cane as good as the pictures they have on their web sites? I meansome of this stuff looks phenomenal. I know that a picture tells athousand words, but not all of those words are necessarily truths.One new one I noticed and haven't heard much about isbamboopoles.comHas anyone anything to tell me about these or any other suppliers as itwill soon be time to order more.I am also looking for a new source for quality cork. My last stuffwas Extra select from REC but I am wondering if I could find evenbetter? Shawn from lars32@gateway.net Sat Apr 1 07:18:58 2000 Subject: Re: bamboo sources C&D Trading has the best cork in my book!Dave Norling-----Original Message-- --- RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.edu Subject: Re: bamboo sources Hi Shawn,I have a couple comments. First in regards to the bamboo I have trust andconfidence in the C.H. Demarest Co. and believe it is wise to continue topurchase from them especially since I know they have personally visitedthetonkin cane forests and their suppliers so that we might receive bettercaneand so that we receive the right species. Harold Demarest has attendedmostall of our west coast work shops at Corbett Lake and at Troutdale andknowsmany of us personally and makes an effort to obtain good productson ourbehalf. That being said I see little reason to change. On the issue ofgetting good cork we've put together a group order at our Corbettworkshopsand gotten good cork from C&D Trading by ordering their best grade.You'llneed to check with them to get current pricing and minimum order size.Thelast email address I have for them is dpeter@pconline.com.RayRay----- Original Message -----From: Shawn Pineo Sent: Friday, March 31, 2000 2:27 PMSubject: bamboo sources I have noticed lately that there are a lot of different suppliers forbamboo. When I first got into this there was only Demarest and TuxedoCane (I think) but now there are new ones popping up all over. Mrs.Demarest was most helpful when I ordered my first order (and in allcorrespondence afterward) which goes a long way in my books but I wasdebating trying one of these other ones out for a change next order. Myquestion is for people who have ordered from these "other" guys, Istheir cane as good as the pictures they have on their web sites? I meansome of this stuff looks phenomenal. I know that a picture tells athousand words, but not all of those words are necessarily truths.One new one I noticed and haven't heard much about isbamboopoles.comHas anyone anything to tell me about these or any other suppliers as itwill soon be time to order more.I am also looking for a new source for quality cork. My last stuffwas Extra select from REC but I am wondering if I could find evenbetter? Shawn from edriddle@mindspring.com Sat Apr 1 08:14:55 2000 Subject: Fw: Bamboo flyrod magazine Ouch:It was April 1 on part of this planet, but not here...I was caught out ofSeason. No releasing me...I swallowed the hook. :-(Ed-----Original Message-- --- Subject: Re: Bamboo flyrod magazine B.That's shocking.....Did anyone else get theirs? I didn't.Ed-----Original Message-----From: Robert Milardo Rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Date: Friday, March 31, 2000 5:19 PMSubject: Re: Bamboo flyrod magazine Actually Shawn I got mine last week. Awlfully nice article in thereaboutthemaritimes. Are you sure you paid your subscription fees? B. At 05:49 PM 3/31/00 -0400, Shawn Pineo wrote:Hey guess what guys,I received an issue of BFRtoday!.............Not! Happy April fool's day a little early! That wascruel but I figured things are pretty slow on here and I'd take my kickat the can trying to start something.So has anyone heard anything more about BFR? Last I heard thelatest issue was supposed to be "in their office" and that they would besent out EARLY LASTmonth? What is the hold up?Someone?Shawn Robert M. Milardo, Ph.D.Professor of Family Relations17 Merrill HallUniversity of MaineOrono, ME 04469(207) 581-3128(207) 581-3120 FAX from ernie2@pacbell.net Sat Apr 1 09:21:00 2000 sims.3.5.2000.01.05.12.18.p9)with SMTP id for Subject: Re: bamboo sources The law of supply and demand will always prevail unless the governmentgetsinvolved.Ernie -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: bamboo sources I suppose that it is in our interest as rodmakers to have severalsources of every item, including bamboo. However, seeing that themarket for rod quality Tonkin is probably a pitance compared to thetotal market for imported cane and rattan, which these suppliers bringin each year, wouldn't it be in our BEST interest to have a REGULAR andDEPENDABLE supply each and every year? Rick C. from 76250.1771@compuserve.com Sat Apr 1 09:37:01 2000 Subject: planing form Rodmakers Jan/Feb was the last I got. Dennis from mcdowellc@lanecc.edu Sat Apr 1 10:27:11 2000 8:36:10 PST Subject: Heddon Reel Seat Hardware What is the reelseat hardware on the plastic downlocking "common"Heddon reelseat made from. It won't oxidizeso I've ruled out nickel silver. Is it aluminum? I've painted them withblack lacquer in the past, andthat's fine, but if it's aluminum I though I might try that aluminumblacking agent sold at gunshops, anyonetried that? The hardware patina has a slight green cast to it. Thanks for the help. Chris McDowellmcdowellc@lanecc.edu from leroyt@involved.com Sat Apr 1 10:41:24 2000 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61049U4500L450S0V35)with SMTP id com; Sat, 1 Apr 2000 08:41:20 -0800 Subject: RE: bamboo sources Have always felt that competition was good for the consumer and kepteverybody on the toes.Leroy............ -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Saturday, April 01, 2000 6:43 AM Subject: Re: bamboo sources The law of supply and demand will always prevail unless thegovernment getsinvolved.Ernie -----Original Message-----From: Rick C. Date: Saturday, April 01, 2000 12:27 AMSubject: Re: bamboo sources I suppose that it is in our interest as rodmakers to have severalsources of every item, including bamboo. However, seeing that themarket for rod quality Tonkin is probably a pitance compared to thetotal market for imported cane and rattan, which these suppliers bringin each year, wouldn't it be in our BEST interest to have a REGULAR andDEPENDABLE supply each and every year? Rick C. from martinj@aa.net Sat Apr 1 10:59:41 2000 Sat, 1 Apr 2000 08:59:35 -0800 "Rodmakers" Subject: RE: Dip Finish I move the rods from my dip tube to my drying cabinet and have never hadaproblem with dust. I use Poly and it does seem to "tack" over pretty quick.Sometimes I leave it in the tube for about 15 minutes. That seems to beenough for the surface to tack. Now when I used Spar varnish, that waslikea dust magnet. I had a real hard time with dust but not so with poly. I quitusing spar. Only poly now Martin Jensen -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Dip Finish If you look at Wayne Cattanach's book it shows a finishing booth that alsoserves as a drying cabinet. I would think that moving the rod out of the dipstation into a drying cabinet would result in dust on the rod blank. WithWayne's method the rod stays right in the dip station and with the additonof an air filter the finish is dust free.Works for me!Dave Norling----- Original Message----- Subject: Re: Dip Finish Steve,I have a slab floor in my workshop, so the problem was the same asyours.I drilled through the floor with a borrowed impact drill. Expect a hugeamount of dust and noise, so use ear, nose, and eye protection and coveranystuff in the basement that you don't want coated in concrete dust. Iwoundup having to vacuum every square inch of my workshop, because once I gotthat impact drill going, I was so compulsive that I didn't stop until thathole was done!I located the hole in a corner of the shop so it was easy to build adust-tight cabinet to house the dipping assembly. The dia.of the hole wassufficient to allow a 10" piece of PVC to be installed in the hole. Thedepth will depend on the lifting space your ceiling will allow and thelength of sections you plan to dip. Mine has a 2' deep hole. I installedthePVC with about 2" above the slab and concreted around it and in thebottomof the hole to seal it off from the dirt.The cabinet encloses it all an goes up to the ceiling. Another cabinetis built next to the dipping cabinet to serve as the drying cabinet. Iwiredboth cabinets for electrical connections.Steve WeissI have been playing around with different means of applying poly. Thebest results to date have been with the latex stretched over acontainer. This still leaves something to be desired with my efforts. I am going to go for a dip tank and the only way I have room for that iswith a hole in the basement floor. My question is, for those of you whohave gone this way, how big (or preferably small) of a hole did youneed? Regards, SteveIndependence, MO from martinj@aa.net Sat Apr 1 11:07:22 2000 Sat, 1 Apr 2000 09:07:18 -0800 Subject: RE: Varnish tube As far as the carpet I understand your concern. In order for me to controlthe dust, I got a couple long 3 or 4 inch diameter cardboard shipping tubes.The whole setup from the basement floor to the top is sealed inside thistube. The rod comes out the top section above the stairs from a crude doorIfashioned by cutting a 4 ft section about 1/3rd round and taping one sideback on for a hinge. My shop is directly behind the stairs. A plus for me. Ithink I have a couple of pics if your interested in seeing this. Martin Jensen -----Original Message----- Trauthwein Subject: Re: Varnish tube I like this idea except for two reasons. My stair is close to my furnace,probably nothing to worry about really. I have berber carpet on the stairandas this would have to be a removable top portion, I am not too sure howwellitwould patch when the tube was not in use. I would like to take this opportunity to thank everyone for their input. Youdefinitely have me thinking. Quite an accomplishment in and of itself. Regards, SteveIndependence, MO Martin Jensen wrote: I can plug up a three inch hole in the stair case pretty easily. Now ifyouhave hardwood stairs that is another thing. Actually you could patch thatpretty easily also. Martin Jensen -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Friday, March 31, 2000 6:16 PM Subject: Varnish tube I would give serious thought to a drip tube before drilling a holeanywhere.Ed from dickay@alltel.net Sat Apr 1 12:57:29 2000 MAA10957 Subject: BFR boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0078_01BF9BD8.C0537780" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0078_01BF9BD8.C0537780 George,I'm with you. I haven't yet received Issue #5/6. I've never received =Issue #1. I've contacted Mark about this and he promised to send them =to me post haste. That was in late January. Nothing yet. They have no =creditability with me.Dick Fuhrman ------=_NextPart_000_0078_01BF9BD8.C0537780 George, They have no creditability with me.Dick Fuhrman ------=_NextPart_000_0078_01BF9BD8.C0537780-- from Canerods@aol.com Sat Apr 1 13:10:48 2000 Subject: Re: Heddon Reel Seat Hardware In a message dated 4/1/00 8:31:36 AM Pacific Standard Time, mcdowellc@lanecc.edu writes: Chris, I've wondered about that too. They don't seem to rust, so it's not steel or plated steel. The color is about that of NS - so not pure chrome or tin. Isn't magnetic - so most likely not S.S or chrome. Doesn't seem to be a "pot" metal alloy - seems stamped, not molded. It doesn't "feel" like an AL part and since it isn't anodized when blackened. Heddon always painted them if they weren't left bright. So I'd rule out AL. Since some feet have two "ears" brazed/silver soldered to the inside of it, I'd guess they're pure heavy nickel-plating over brass or nickel alloy. Don Burns from darrell@rockclimbing.org Sat Apr 1 13:23:57 2000 sims.3.5.2000.01.05.12.18.p9)with SMTP id for Subject: RE: Heddon Reel Seat Hardware I thought the hardware was NS. Some of my Heddon reelseats have thatgreentarnish typical of NS. There are probably some low end Heddons that mighthave used a different material or also during war time something elsecouldhave been substituted... or perhaps chromed? What grade rod is the seatfrom? Darrellwww.vfish.net -----Original Message----- MCDOWELL Subject: Heddon Reel Seat Hardware What is the reelseat hardware on the plastic downlocking "common"Heddonreelseat made from. It won't oxidize so I've ruled out nickel silver. Isit aluminum? I've painted them with black lacquer in the past, and that'sfine, but if it's aluminum I though I might try that aluminum blackingagentsold at gunshops, anyone tried that? The hardware patina has a slight green cast to it. Thanks for the help. Chris McDowellmcdowellc@lanecc.edu from nobler@satx.rr.com Sat Apr 1 14:15:37 2000 SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.357.35);Sat, 1 Apr 2000 14:16:25 -0600 Subject: Re: Heddon Reel Seat Hardware boundary="----=_NextPart_000_002E_01BF9BE5.10E19AE0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_002E_01BF9BE5.10E19AE0 I'd guess at brass, either nickel or chrome plated. None of these are =magnetic, and the brass and nickel can produce the greenish caste. GMA Sent: Saturday, April 01, 2000 1:10 PMSubject: Re: Heddon Reel Seat Hardware mcdowellc@lanecc.edu writes: Chris, They don't seem to rust, so it's not steel or plated steel. The color = about that of NS - so not pure chrome or tin. Isn't magnetic - so most likely not S.S or chrome. Doesn't seem to be a "pot" metal alloy - seems stamped, not molded. It = doesn't "feel" like an AL part and since it isn't anodized when = Heddon always painted them if they weren't left bright. So I'd rule =out AL. Since some feet have two "ears" brazed/silver soldered to the inside = I'd guess they're pure heavy nickel-plating over brass or nickel =alloy. Don Burns ------=_NextPart_000_002E_01BF9BE5.10E19AE0 I'd guess at brass, either nickel or chrome plated. None of = caste. GMA ----- Original Message ----- = Sent: Saturday, April 01, 2000 = PM HardwareIn a message dated 4/1/00 8:31:36 AM Pacific Standard= = them with black lacquer in the past, and that's fine, but if it's = I though I might try that aluminum blacking agent sold at = seem to rust, so it's not steel or plated steel. The color is = of NS - so not pure chrome or tin.Isn't magnetic - so most = S.S or chrome.Doesn't seem to be a "pot" metal alloy - seems = not molded. It doesn't "feel" like an AL part and since it isn't = when blackened. Heddon always painted them if they weren't = brazed/silver soldered to the inside of it, I'd guess they're pure = Burns ------=_NextPart_000_002E_01BF9BE5.10E19AE0-- from nobler@satx.rr.com Sat Apr 1 14:17:15 2000 SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.357.35);Sat, 1 Apr 2000 14:18:09 -0600 Subject: Re: BFR boundary="----=_NextPart_000_003C_01BF9BE5.4EDA2B00" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_003C_01BF9BE5.4EDA2B00 A very strange set of circumstances. Obviously his major problem in ="making it" is communication, and keeping his word ! GMA Sent: Saturday, April 01, 2000 12:49 PMSubject: BFR George,I'm with you. I haven't yet received Issue #5/6. I've never received =Issue #1. I've contacted Mark about this and he promised to send them =to me post haste. That was in late January. Nothing yet. They have no =creditability with me.Dick Fuhrman ------=_NextPart_000_003C_01BF9BE5.4EDA2B00 A very strange set of circumstances. Obviously his major = "making it" is communication, and keeping his word ! GMA ----- Original Message ----- Dick = Fuhrman Sent: Saturday, April 01, 2000 = PMSubject: BFR George, Dick Fuhrman ------=_NextPart_000_003C_01BF9BE5.4EDA2B00-- from horsesho@ptd.net Sat Apr 1 14:21:49 2000 0000 (204.186.33.98) Subject: Re: Heddon Reel Seat Hardware Canerods@aol.com wrote: In a message dated 4/1/00 8:31:36 AM Pacific Standard Time,mcdowellc@lanecc.edu writes: What is the reelseat hardware on the plastic downlocking "common"Heddonreelseat made from. It won't oxidize so I've ruled out nickel silver. Is italuminum? I've painted them with black lacquer in the past, and that'sfine,but if it's aluminum I though I might try that aluminum blacking agentsoldat gunshops, anyone tried that? The hardware patina has a slight green cast to it. Thanks for the help. Chris McDowellmcdowellc@lanecc.edu >> Chris, I've wondered about that too. They don't seem to rust, so it's not steel or plated steel. The color isabout that of NS - so not pure chrome or tin. Isn't magnetic - so most likely not S.S or chrome. Doesn't seem to be a "pot" metal alloy - seems stamped, not molded. Itdoesn't "feel" like an AL part and since it isn't anodized when blackened. Heddon always painted them if they weren't left bright. So I'd rule outAL. Since some feet have two "ears" brazed/silver soldered to the inside ofit,I'd guess they're pure heavy nickel-plating over brass or nickel alloy. Don BurnsAll Heddon fly rods I have seen have been NS. Some bait rods have beenNPB. Have you polished the NS real well before blueing? I have triedAlum. Blk before without any luck. Marty from fiveside@net-gate.com Sat Apr 1 15:16:58 2000 SMTP id QAA05103 for ; Sat, 1 Apr 2000 Subject: Up- Down Revisited To the List,Turned inserts made of fancy woods are indeed beautiful, but againGarrison had it right. With few exceptions he used cork throughout. Overtime, cork inserts seem to give me complete reel locking security onlight-weight down-locking pocket and ring combos or just 2 rings. Evenwinebottle corks work well. Loose no reel before its time. Bill from bob@downandacross.com Sat Apr 1 15:50:21 2000 (envelope- from bob@downandacross.com) (envelope- from bob@downandacross.com) Subject: opening day Finally got 7 on the Driggs today on opening day here afterbeing skunked on the open winter tribs. Stockers, but hey, that's okaywhen there's nothing hatching anyway. When I told my wife about the two year old browns they planted and howthe spin fishermen were whacking every one, she replied, "Whowantsto eat a two year old fish?" Bob Maulucci==================================================downandacross.com bob@downandacross.com from paul.blakley@dtn.ntl.com Sat Apr 1 17:13:26 2000 helo=dtn.ntl.com) Subject: Pfleuger Medallist Can anyone on the list advise a suitable source to try for a PfleugerMedallist 1492 2 3/4" Fly reel?I understand these are a common reel in the States but they areimpossible to find here in the UK.Please contact me directly off line , many thanks.......Paul B from saltwein@swbell.net Sat Apr 1 17:57:13 2000 (Sun Internet Mail Server sims.3.5.2000.01.05.12.18.p9)with ESMTP id for Subject: Re: BFR boundary="------------02B4735183B71D3346289D37" --------------02B4735183B71D3346289D37 Has anyone noticed that there are a number of BFR items on sale on eBay, from someone in Orange County, hats and the like. I was curious if someinventory was being cleared out? Regards, Steve nobler wrote: A very strange set of circumstances. Obviously his major problem in"making it" is communication, and keeping his word ! GMA ----- Original Message -----From: Dick & Kathy Fuhrman Sent: Saturday, April 01, 2000 12:49 PMSubject: BFRGeorge,I'm with you. I haven't yet received Issue #5/6.I've never received Issue #1. I've contacted Mark aboutthis and he promised to send them to me post haste. Thatwas in late January. Nothing yet. They have nocreditability with me.Dick Fuhrman --------------02B4735183B71D3346289D37 Has anyone noticed that there are a number of BFR items on sale on eBay, some inventory was being cleared out?Regards, Stevenobler wrote: A very strange set of circumstances.Obviously his major problem in "making it" is communication, and keeping ----- Original Message ----- From:Dick &Kathy Fuhrman List Sent: Saturday, April 01, 2000 12:49PM Subject: BFR --------------02B4735183B71D3346289D37-- from bob@downandacross.com Sat Apr 1 18:02:48 2000 (envelope- from bob@downandacross.com) (envelope- from bob@downandacross.com) Subject: the Book 1. I received my $50 copy of the Book today.http://www.wildadv.comThanks for the tip on this one. $50 shipped is a greatdeal. I can now retire my pages photocopied from the public librarycopy. 2. The new Tom Morgan Rodsmiths site is now up. It looks fantastic.http://www.troutrods.comGreat info on the Hand Mill. Nice pics also. No commercial interest. Just good people. Bob Maulucci==================================================downandacross.com bob@downandacross.com from sniderja@email.uc.edu Sat Apr 1 18:28:25 2000 Subject: Re: Up- Down Revisited I much prefer cork reel seats. However, over time, everyone of them hasfailed on me at some point. Compression, then steam, compress thensteam torenew. Eventually, however, on a heavy used rod it has been my experiencethat they eventually fail. Perhaps I am just too hard on rods?J. Snider At 04:14 PM 04/01/2000 -0500, Bill Fink wrote:To the List,Turned inserts made of fancy woods are indeed beautiful, but againGarrison had it right. With few exceptions he used cork throughout. Overtime, cork inserts seem to give me complete reel locking security onlight-weight down-locking pocket and ring combos or just 2 rings. Evenwinebottle corks work well. Loose no reel before its time. Bill from nobler@satx.rr.com Sat Apr 1 19:18:28 2000 SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.357.35);Sat, 1 Apr 2000 19:19:21 -0600 Subject: Re: BFR boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000E_01BF9C0F.62D916A0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000E_01BF9C0F.62D916A0 I haven't looked much lately, but it doesn't surprise me. GMA Sent: Saturday, April 01, 2000 7:58 PMSubject: Re: BFR Has anyone noticed that there are a number of BFR items on sale on =eBay, from someone in Orange County, hats and the like. I was curious = A very strange set of circumstances. Obviously his major problem in = ----- Original Message -----From: Dick & Kathy Fuhrman Sent: Saturday, April 01, 2000 12:49 PMSubject: BFRGeorge,I'm with you. I haven't yet received Issue #5/6. I've =never received Issue #1. I've contacted Mark about this and he promised =to send them to me post haste. That was in late January. Nothing yet. = ------=_NextPart_000_000E_01BF9C0F.62D916A0 me. GMA ----- Original Message ----- Trauthwein Cc: Rodmakers List Sent: Saturday, April 01, 2000 = PMSubject: Re: BFRHas anyone noticed that there are a number of BFR items= A very strange set of circumstances. Obviously his major problem = "making it" is communication, and keeping his word = ----- Original Message ----- Kathy Fuhrman Sent: Saturday, April 01, = PMSubject: = ------=_NextPart_000_000E_01BF9C0F.62D916A0-- from martinj@aa.net Sat Apr 1 19:33:25 2000 Sat, 1 Apr 2000 17:33:10 -0800 Subject: RE: Up- Down Revisited I would agree (except I don't prefer cork). I have worn out 2 cork reelseats and not one wood insert in my years fly fishing.Martin Jensen -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Up- Down Revisited I much prefer cork reel seats. However, over time, everyone of them hasfailed on me at some point. Compression, then steam, compress thensteam torenew. Eventually, however, on a heavy used rod it has been my experiencethat they eventually fail. Perhaps I am just too hard on rods?J. Snider At 04:14 PM 04/01/2000 -0500, Bill Fink wrote:To the List,Turned inserts made of fancy woods are indeed beautiful, but againGarrison had it right. With few exceptions he used cork throughout. Overtime, cork inserts seem to give me complete reel locking security onlight-weight down-locking pocket and ring combos or just 2 rings. Evenwinebottle corks work well. Loose no reel before its time. Bill from bob@downandacross.com Sat Apr 1 19:34:27 2000 (envelope- from bob@downandacross.com) (envelope- from bob@downandacross.com) Subject: Re: BFR Saw the hats and stuff. The funny thing I saw on eBay today was a listing Otherwise excellent." Some insane people there.Bob Has anyone noticedthat there are a number of BFR items on sale on eBay, from someone in was being cleared out? Regards, Steve Bob Maulucci==================================================downandacross.com bob@downandacross.com from nsflyrods@ns.sympatico.ca Sat Apr 1 19:35:45 2000 0400 Subject: Re: Hardener for Urac 185 Does anyone know of a Canadian supplier for Ammonium Chloride? Inoticed onthe WHIMIS data sheet that it also comes in a liquid form. Would that bebetter? Shawn Shawn Pineo wrote: I have been experimenting with Urac mixtures and searching thearchives for a little while now and was curious about the substitutionof ammonium chloride for hardener. First of all some people said it wasammonium chloride and some said ammonium carbonate (the stuff usedforbrown toning cane). I believe it is the chloride?The directions are not really clear. Do you mix the ACpowder/water combo into the resin or into the resin with walnut shellhardener already added?What are the mixture ratios? What makes this better than thestandard mix?It is thinner and doesn't have the gap filling properties. The onlybenefit I see is that it has a longer pot life. Why the heat drying withthis one as opposed to normal urac/hardener?Shawn from mcdowellc@lanecc.edu Sat Apr 1 19:42:25 2000 17:51:32 PST Subject: RE: Heddon Reel Seat Hardware Thanks to all for the advice. To answer a few questions it's an early #17. Has the spiral "Heddon" acrossthe bottom flats with "#17" just above the hookkeeper on the bottom flat.No specs. are written on the rod. Ithink it is a transition rod around 1938. The reelseat is not the wood onefound on the earliest Heddons yetthe "#17" alone is an early period mark. It's original, but was in rough shape. I've refinished it for the son of theoriginal owner who bought it newat some unknown date and passed away in 1957. The rod has not beenfished since, but now will get to gofishing again in the future. These circumstances and potential make thewhole project more then worthwhile. I did not polish out the hardware prior to applying an oxidizing agent, butsince the components are worn backto primarily silver with only traces of the black coloring I assume if itwas nickel silver it would havedarkened some even if unevenly and it didn't. That's why I assumed someother material. The ferrules arenickel silver of course and the stripper guide darkened when the oxidizerwas applied. Well, thanks again for the advice. I'll forgo the aluminum blacking agentand lacquer the parts. Chris McDowellmcdowellc@lanecc.edu from FISHWOOL@aol.com Sat Apr 1 20:25:20 2000 Subject: Re: One Fly Ernie,Is that fly related to the xxxxHercules or the telephone crank bomber?Hank. from FISHWOOL@aol.com Sat Apr 1 20:25:39 2000 Subject: Re: Locks, Up and Down Bill,Amen to downlocking.Hank. from FISHWOOL@aol.com Sat Apr 1 20:26:22 2000 Subject: Re: RE: Locks, Up and Down Martin,As I must use my little finger of my good hand to hold both rod and line the line often ends up around the butt when it is shot. The uplocking seat tends to cause that more often, hence my preference for downlocking reel seats.Regards,Hank. from tomrichard@email.msn.com Sat Apr 1 20:55:22 2000 SMTPSVC;Sat, 1 Apr 2000 18:54:48 -0800 Subject: MEMBER ID HELP! I HAVE SET UP A NEW ACCOUNT WITH MICRO SOFT ANDDID NOT UNSUBSCRIBE THE OLD ACCOUNT BEFORE IT WASCANCELED. NOW I CAN'T SEEM TO SUBSCRIBE FOR THE NEW ACCOUNT.I HAVE TRIED TWICE AND STILL DO NOT GET ANY MAIL. HOW DO I UNSUBSCRIBE THE OLD USER NAME SO THAT ICAN SUBSCRIBE UNDER THE NEW NAME? TOM PETERS from richard.nantel@videotron.ca Sat Apr 1 22:04:22 2000 Internet Mail Serversims.3.5.1999.12.14.10.29.p8)with SMTP id forrodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu; Sat, 1 Apr 2000 23:03:37 Subject: Ferrule dimensions Would anyone know where I could find out the machining dimensions offerrules (ie, length of slide, total length of male and female parts, etc).I'd like to attempt to make them. Thanks in advance, Richard from lars32@gateway.net Sat Apr 1 22:38:21 2000 Subject: Re: Up- Down Revisited On an uplock reel seat the weight of the reel tends to tighten ring-----Original Message----- ; rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Subject: RE: Up- Down Revisited I would agree (except I don't prefer cork). I have worn out 2 cork reelseats and not one wood insert in my years fly fishing.Martin Jensen -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Saturday, April 01, 2000 4:32 PM Subject: Re: Up- Down Revisited I much prefer cork reel seats. However, over time, everyone of them hasfailed on me at some point. Compression, then steam, compress thensteam torenew. Eventually, however, on a heavy used rod it has been myexperiencethat they eventually fail. Perhaps I am just too hard on rods?J. Snider At 04:14 PM 04/01/2000 -0500, Bill Fink wrote:To the List,Turned inserts made of fancy woods are indeed beautiful, but againGarrison had it right. With few exceptions he used cork throughout. Overtime, cork inserts seem to give me complete reel locking security onlight-weight down-locking pocket and ring combos or just 2 rings. Evenwinebottle corks work well. Loose no reel before its time. Bill from martinj@aa.net Sat Apr 1 23:14:15 2000 Sat, 1 Apr 2000 21:14:09 -0800 Subject: RE: Locks, Up and Down No kidding! Never had that problem. Only with the hook keeper. I built acouple of rods without them for that reason but I really like the use of oneso they are back on the rod. As I said before though, I am going to work onmaking down locking seats now that I have the material (plus a lathe!) Martin Jensen -----Original Message----- FISHWOOL@aol.com Subject: RE: Locks, Up and Down Martin,As I must use my little finger of my good hand to hold both rod and linethe line often ends up around the butt when it is shot. The uplocking seattends to cause that more often, hence my preference for downlocking reelseats.Regards,Hank. from martinj@aa.net Sat Apr 1 23:18:07 2000 Sat, 1 Apr 2000 21:18:04 -0800 Subject: RE: MEMBER ID I had that same problem. I was fortunate enough to still have my oldaccountactive. I re-configured my computer to connect with the old ISP and loggedon and unsubscribed. If this is not an option you may have to contact MikeBiondo. I believe he keeps up the list. check out the rodmakers website andsee.http://www.canerod.com/rodmakers/ Martin Jensen -----Original Message----- Subject: MEMBER ID HELP! I HAVE SET UP A NEW ACCOUNT WITH MICRO SOFT ANDDID NOT UNSUBSCRIBE THE OLD ACCOUNT BEFORE IT WASCANCELED. NOW I CAN'T SEEM TO SUBSCRIBE FOR THE NEW ACCOUNT.I HAVE TRIED TWICE AND STILL DO NOT GET ANY MAIL. HOW DO I UNSUBSCRIBE THE OLD USER NAME SO THAT ICAN SUBSCRIBE UNDER THE NEW NAME? TOM PETERS from saweiss@flash.net Sat Apr 1 23:39:15 2000 Subject: Re: Dip Finish Right Dave, I have several hooks in my dip tank booth and I leave thesections in there for a couple of hours to tack off, then shift them to thedrying cabinet for longer-term drying. I also have an air filter in the diptank booth.Steve If you look at Wayne Cattanach's book it shows a finishing booth thatalsoserves as a drying cabinet. I would think that moving the rod out of thedipstation into a drying cabinet would result in dust on the rod blank. WithWayne's method the rod stays right in the dip station and with theadditonof an air filter the finish is dust free.Works for me!Dave Norling--- --Original Message-----From: Steven Weiss Date: Friday, March 31, 2000 1:35 PMSubject: Re: Dip Finish from teekay35@interlynx.net Sun Apr 2 00:15:47 2000 Subject: Re: Hardener for Urac 185 Shawn, you can buy ammonium chloride at the drug store. They probablywon't have it in stock but can get it for you in a few days. Cost of a 100gram bottle is about $10 here in ontario. ----------From: Shawn Pineo Subject: Re: Hardener for Urac 185Date: Saturday, April 01, 2000 8:31 PM Does anyone know of a Canadian supplier for Ammonium Chloride? Inoticedonthe WHIMIS data sheet that it also comes in a liquid form. Would that bebetter? Shawn Shawn Pineo wrote: I have been experimenting with Urac mixtures and searching thearchives for a little while now and was curious about the substitutionof ammonium chloride for hardener. First of all some people said itwasammonium chloride and some said ammonium carbonate (the stuff usedforbrown toning cane). I believe it is the chloride?The directions are not really clear. Do you mix the ACpowder/water combo into the resin or into the resin with walnut shellhardener already added?What are the mixture ratios? What makes this better than thestandard mix?It is thinner and doesn't have the gap filling properties. The onlybenefit I see is that it has a longer pot life. Why the heat dryingwiththis one as opposed to normal urac/hardener?Shawn from nsflyrods@ns.sympatico.ca Sun Apr 2 06:21:34 2000 Subject: Rattan grips Does anyone out there know about making rattan grips? I am looking Shawn from mep@mint.net Sun Apr 2 06:59:06 2000 Subject: Re: One Fly boundary="------------CAA5DD60DF268FFB879C3039" --------------CAA5DD60DF268FFB879C3039 Depends on what you mean by spring April and first week or so of May, a grey ghost. After that a lightbrown parachute #10 or 12. Mike Ray Gould wrote: Ok. Winter is over. The rods are made. Now here's the question - ifyou were limited to one single fly pattern for your spring troutfishing what would it be?Ray --------------CAA5DD60DF268FFB879C3039 Depends on what you mean by springApril and first week or so of May, a grey ghost. After that a lightbrown parachute #10 or 12.MikeRay Gould wrote: Ok.Winter is over. The rods are made. Now here's the question - if you werelimited to one single fly pattern for your spring trout fishing what wouldit be?Ray --------------CAA5DD60DF268FFB879C3039-- from brookie@frii.com Sun Apr 2 08:01:34 2000 Subject: Bamboo FlyRod Mag What *I* wonder is why there aren't some entrepeneurs out theresomewherethat are willing to either take over the mag, and/or start another one ... from nsflyrods@ns.sympatico.ca Sun Apr 2 08:29:25 2000 Subject: What a gorgeous day! I was outside just now working on a rod and my wife is at work so Ihad my two young daughters out with me. It is a really great day hereand as I worked I watched my kids playing in the yard and thought tomyself "this is what life should be like all the time!!" Although Irealize that it's not always that sweet for you, I envy those of you whocan do this full time! I can't wait till the day I can retire from themilitary, open a tackle store and build rods full time.I wonder if I would jinx the weather if I drug the computer outsidetoo! ;^) Maybe I should invest in a laptop?I hope that it is at least as nice in your area today! And thanks toall for their input lately.Shawn from jfreeman@cyberport.com Sun Apr 2 09:28:10 2000 "Rodmakers" Subject: Re: Dip Finish All, I've got to agree - the set-up ah la Wayne works great. I hang right in thetube. I use a piece of sheepwool to wipe down the PVC to set up a staticcharge, and I've had very, very little trouble with dust motes - maybe oneor two small specks per section. I'm sold, but the drawback is expense.PVCthat size is not cheap! By the way, I work in a room with 15' ceilings, andthe whole assemble is above ground. Jim----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Dip Finish If you look at Wayne Cattanach's book it shows a finishing booth thatalsoserves as a drying cabinet. I would think that moving the rod out of thedipstation into a drying cabinet would result in dust on the rod blank. WithWayne's method the rod stays right in the dip station and with theadditonof an air filter the finish is dust free.Works for me!Dave Norling--- --Original Message-----From: Steven Weiss Date: Friday, March 31, 2000 1:35 PMSubject: Re: Dip Finish Steve,I have a slab floor in my workshop, so the problem was the same asyours.I drilled through the floor with a borrowed impact drill. Expect ahugeamount of dust and noise, so use ear, nose, and eye protection and coveranystuff in the basement that you don't want coated in concrete dust. Iwoundup having to vacuum every square inch of my workshop, because once Igotthat impact drill going, I was so compulsive that I didn't stop untilthathole was done!I located the hole in a corner of the shop so it was easy to build adust-tight cabinet to house the dipping assembly. The dia.of the holewassufficient to allow a 10" piece of PVC to be installed in the hole. Thedepth will depend on the lifting space your ceiling will allow and thelength of sections you plan to dip. Mine has a 2' deep hole. I installedthePVC with about 2" above the slab and concreted around it and in thebottomof the hole to seal it off from the dirt.The cabinet encloses it all an goes up to the ceiling. Anothercabinetis built next to the dipping cabinet to serve as the drying cabinet. Iwiredboth cabinets for electrical connections.Steve WeissI have been playing around with different means of applying poly. Thebest results to date have been with the latex stretched over acontainer. This still leaves something to be desired with my efforts. I am going to go for a dip tank and the only way I have room for thatiswith a hole in the basement floor. My question is, for those of you whohave gone this way, how big (or preferably small) of a hole did youneed? Regards, SteveIndependence, MO from nobler@satx.rr.com Sun Apr 2 09:36:54 2000 SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.357.35);Sun, 2 Apr 2000 09:37:46 -0500 Subject: Re: MEMBER ID boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0021_01BF9C87.4C6D1B00" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0021_01BF9C87.4C6D1B00 I just unsubscribed from the old ISP address, and subscribed with the =new address I have when going to cable service. GMA Sent: Sunday, April 02, 2000 12:16 AMSubject: RE: MEMBER ID I had that same problem. I was fortunate enough to still have my old =accountactive. I re-configured my computer to connect with the old ISP and =loggedon and unsubscribed. If this is not an option you may have to contact =MikeBiondo. I believe he keeps up the list. check out the rodmakers =website andsee.http://www.canerod.com/rodmakers/ Martin Jensen -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Saturday, April 01, 2000 6:49 PM Subject: MEMBER ID HELP! I HAVE SET UP A NEW ACCOUNT WITH MICRO SOFT ANDDID NOT UNSUBSCRIBE THE OLD ACCOUNT BEFORE IT WASCANCELED. NOW I CAN'T SEEM TO SUBSCRIBE FOR THE NEW ACCOUNT.I HAVE TRIED TWICE AND STILL DO NOT GET ANY MAIL. HOW DO I UNSUBSCRIBE THE OLD USER NAME SO THAT ICAN SUBSCRIBE UNDER THE NEW NAME? TOM PETERS ------=_NextPart_000_0021_01BF9C87.4C6D1B00 I just unsubscribed from the old ISP address, and = the new address I have when going to cable service. GMA ----- Original Message ----- Martin =Jensen rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= Sent: Sunday, April 02, 2000 = AMSubject: RE: MEMBER IDI had that same problem. I was fortunate enough to = my old accountactive. I re-configured my computer to connect with = ISP and loggedon and unsubscribed. If this is not an option you = to contact MikeBiondo. I believe he keeps up the list. check out = rodmakers website andsee.http://www.canerod.com/rodmake= Jensen-----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.w= rodmakers@w= =rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= MEMBER IDHELP!I HAVE SET UP A NEW ACCOUNTWITH = WASCANCELED.NOW I CAN'T SEEM TO SUBSCRIBE FOR THE ACCOUNT.I HAVE TRIED TWICE AND STILL DO NOT GET ANY = UNSUBSCRIBE THE OLD USER NAME SO THAT ICAN SUBSCRIBE UNDERTHE NEW = NAME?TOM PETERS ------=_NextPart_000_0021_01BF9C87.4C6D1B00-- from nobler@satx.rr.com Sun Apr 2 09:45:07 2000 SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.357.35);Sun, 2 Apr 2000 09:46:01 -0500 Subject: Re: Rattan grips boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0032_01BF9C88.736D6E20" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0032_01BF9C88.736D6E20 As far as durability is concerned, I have what I think is a very old =Daniels, that has a rattan type grip. It's some sort of white material, =that has a camfor odor, when cleaned with Citristrip paint stripper, so =it may not be real rattan. I would think that the methods used in =wrapping rattan chairs, would apply here. This material is available in =many diameters, even in craft stores, along with instruction books on =doing rattan. At any rate, I have a couple in real rattan, that have not cracked or =come loose. GMA Sent: Sunday, April 02, 2000 5:17 AMSubject: Rattan grips Does anyone out there know about making rattan grips? I am =looking Shawn ------=_NextPart_000_0032_01BF9C88.736D6E20 As far as durability is concerned, I have what I think is a = old Daniels, that has a rattan type grip. It's some sort of white = not be real rattan. I would think that the methods used in wrapping = chairs, would apply here. This material is available in many diameters, = craft stores, along with instruction books on doing =rattan. At any rate, I have a couple in real rattan, that have not = or come loose. GMA ----- Original Message ----- Shawn Pineo = Sent: Sunday, April 02, 2000 = AMSubject: Rattan grips = Shawn ------=_NextPart_000_0032_01BF9C88.736D6E20-- from nobler@satx.rr.com Sun Apr 2 09:50:54 2000 SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.357.35);Sun, 2 Apr 2000 09:51:48 -0500 Subject: Re: What a gorgeous day! boundary="----=_NextPart_000_003F_01BF9C89.425543C0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_003F_01BF9C89.425543C0 I would caution anyone against trying to make a living at their chosen =hobby ! Those who make it today, in this "discount house world", have a =worse success rate than the restaurant business ! This is at a rate of =80% failure ! The worst thing though, is you have no time to do what you love the =most, as far as spare time activity is concerned ! GMA Sent: Sunday, April 02, 2000 7:25 AMSubject: What a gorgeous day! I was outside just now working on a rod and my wife is at work so Ihad my two young daughters out with me. It is a really great day hereand as I worked I watched my kids playing in the yard and thought tomyself "this is what life should be like all the time!!" Although Irealize that it's not always that sweet for you, I envy those of you =whocan do this full time! I can't wait till the day I can retire from themilitary, open a tackle store and build rods full time.I wonder if I would jinx the weather if I drug the computer =outsidetoo! ;^) Maybe I should invest in a laptop?I hope that it is at least as nice in your area today! And thanks =toall for their input lately.Shawn ------=_NextPart_000_003F_01BF9C89.425543C0 I would caution anyone against trying to make a living at = chosen hobby ! Those who make it today, in this "discount house world", = worse success rate than the restaurant business ! This is at a rate of = failure ! The worst thing though, is you have no time to do what you= most, as far as spare time activity is concerned ! GMA ----- Original Message ----- Shawn Pineo = Sent: Sunday, April 02, 2000 = AMSubject: What a gorgeous =day! wife is at work so Ihad my two young daughters out with me. It is = great day hereand as I worked I watched my kids playing in the = thought tomyself "this is what life should be like all the time!!" = Although Irealize that it's not always that sweet for you, I envy = you whocan do this full time! I can't wait till the day I can = Shawn ------=_NextPart_000_003F_01BF9C89.425543C0-- from horsesho@ptd.net Sun Apr 2 10:05:35 2000 0000 (204.186.33.169) Subject: Re: What a gorgeous day! I would caution anyone against trying to make a living at their chosenhobby ! Those who make it today, in this "discount house world", havea worse success rate than the restaurant business ! This is at a rateof 80% failure ! The worst thing though, is you have no time to do what you love themost, as far as spare time activity is concerned ! GMA ----- Original Message -----From: Shawn Pineo Sent: Sunday, April 02, 2000 7:25 AMSubject: What a gorgeous day! I was outside just now working on a rod and my wife is atwork so Ihad my two young daughters out with me. It is a really greatday hereand as I worked I watched my kids playing in the yard andthought tomyself "this is what life should be like all the time!!"Although Irealize that it's not always that sweet for you, I envythose of you whocan do this full time! I can't wait till the day I canretire from themilitary, open a tackle store and build rods full time.I wonder if I would jinx the weather if I drug thecomputer outsidetoo! ;^) Maybe I should invest in a laptop?I hope that it is at least as nice in your area today!And thanks toall for their input lately.ShawnYou can make a living at this if you can turn a rod out from culm tofinish in 10 hours. If it takes 40 hours(of course taking in accountLabor, Material, Overhead , Ins. etc.) you might as well work atMcDonalds. It's best not to turn something you love to do into a JOB.Marty from nobler@satx.rr.com Sun Apr 2 10:30:37 2000 SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.357.35);Sun, 2 Apr 2000 10:31:21 -0500 Subject: Re: What a gorgeous day! boundary="----=_NextPart_000_005C_01BF9C8E.C9250980" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_005C_01BF9C8E.C9250980 I speak from hard "learned" experience ! The good thing is I'm turning =back to fishing and rod building, for pure fun, and not to earn money ! GMA Sent: Sunday, April 02, 2000 10:03 AMSubject: Re: What a gorgeous day! I would caution anyone against trying to make a living at their =chosenhobby ! Those who make it today, in this "discount house world", =havea worse success rate than the restaurant business ! This is at a =rateof 80% failure ! The worst thing though, is you have no time to do what you love themost, as far as spare time activity is concerned ! GMA ----- Original Message -----From: Shawn Pineo Sent: Sunday, April 02, 2000 7:25 AMSubject: What a gorgeous day! I was outside just now working on a rod and my wife is atwork so Ihad my two young daughters out with me. It is a really greatday hereand as I worked I watched my kids playing in the yard andthought tomyself "this is what life should be like all the time!!"Although Irealize that it's not always that sweet for you, I envythose of you whocan do this full time! I can't wait till the day I canretire from themilitary, open a tackle store and build rods full time.I wonder if I would jinx the weather if I drug thecomputer outsidetoo! ;^) Maybe I should invest in a laptop?I hope that it is at least as nice in your area today!And thanks toall for their input lately.ShawnYou can make a living at this if you can turn a rod out from culm tofinish in 10 hours. If it takes 40 hours(of course taking in accountLabor, Material, Overhead , Ins. etc.) you might as well work atMcDonalds. It's best not to turn something you love to do into a JOB.Marty ------=_NextPart_000_005C_01BF9C8E.C9250980 I speak from hard "learned" experience ! The good thing is = turning back to fishing and rod building, for pure fun, and not to earn = ! GMA ----- Original Message ----- marty = = Sent: Sunday, April 02, 2000 = AMSubject: Re: What a gorgeous =day! worst thing though, is you have no time to do what you love = Sent: Sunday, April 02, 2000 7:25 = outside = now working on a rod and my wife is = = I = in a = = ShawnYou can make a living at this if you can turn a rod out from = accountLabor, Material, Overhead , Ins. etc.) you might as well = atMcDonalds. It's best not to turn something you love to do into a = JOB.Marty ------=_NextPart_000_005C_01BF9C8E.C9250980-- from nsflyrods@ns.sympatico.ca Sun Apr 2 10:49:51 2000 0300 Subject: Re: What a gorgeous day! Well the rod building will not be the main source, just a side specialty.I do agree about mixing hobbies and work though, I used to take outcharterswhen I lived in Alberta and after a couple of weeks of 18 hour days evenfishing can get a little tedious at times!Shawn Shawn Pineo wrote: I was outside just now working on a rod and my wife is at work so Ihad my two young daughters out with me. It is a really great day hereand as I worked I watched my kids playing in the yard and thought tomyself "this is what life should be like all the time!!" Although Irealize that it's not always that sweet for you, I envy those of you whocan do this full time! I can't wait till the day I can retire from themilitary, open a tackle store and build rods full time.I wonder if I would jinx the weather if I drug the computer outsidetoo! ;^) Maybe I should invest in a laptop?I hope that it is at least as nice in your area today! And thanks toall for their input lately.Shawn from flytyr@southshore.com Sun Apr 2 11:25:20 2000 Subject: Re: What a gorgeous day! boundary="------------15692CB9AF4EAE0EC52FAC39" --------------15692CB9AF4EAE0EC52FAC39 Tell me about it. I started tying a few flies fora resort and in three years it almost became afull time job. Lost a lot of time on the river.This season I just said NO. Need to do some morebending of that Sir D with a smallmouth doing thebending.This morning it is raining, a good day to get somerodmaking done. Split a culm last night and amstraightening and flattening the nodes today. Thiswill be a Granger Taper.Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com nobler wrote: I would caution anyone against trying to make aliving at their chosen hobby ! Those who make ittoday, in this "discount house world", have aworse success rate than the restaurant business! This is at a rate of 80% failure ! The worstthing though, is you have no time to do what youlove the most, as far as spare time activity isconcerned ! GMA ----- Original Message -----From: Shawn Pineo Sent: Sunday, April 02, 2000 7:25 AMSubject: What a gorgeous day!I was outside just now working ona rod and my wife is at work so Ihad my two young daughters out withme. It is a really great day hereand as I worked I watched my kidsplaying in the yard and thought tomyself "this is what life should belike all the time!!" Although Irealize that it's not always thatsweet for you, I envy those of you who can do this full time! I can't waittill the day I can retire from themilitary, open a tackle store andbuild rods full time.I wonder if I would jinx theweather if I drug the computer outside too! ;^) Maybe I should invest in alaptop?I hope that it is at least as nicein your area today! And thanks toall for their input lately.Shawn --------------15692CB9AF4EAE0EC52FAC39 Tell me about it. I started tying a few flies for a resort and in threeyears it almost became a full time job. Lost a lot of time on the river.This season I just said NO. Need to do some more bending of that Sir Dwith a smallmouth doing the bending.This morning it is raining, a good day to get some rodmaking done.Split a culm last night and am straightening and flattening the nodestoday.This will be a Granger Taper. nobler wrote: I would caution anyone againsttrying to make a living at their chosen hobby ! Those who make it today,in this "discount house world", have a worse success rate than therestaurant though, is you have no time to do what you love the most, as far as spare ----- Original Message ----- From:ShawnPineo Sent: Sunday, April 02, 2000 7:25AM Subject: What a gorgeous day! is at work so Ihad my two young daughters out with me. It is a really great day hereand as I worked I watched my kids playing in the yard and thought tomyself "this is what life should be like all the time!!" Although Irealize that it's not always that sweet for you, I envy those of youwhocan do this full time! I can't wait till the day I can retire fromthemilitary, open a tackle store and build rods full time. computer outsidetoo! ;^) Maybe I should invest in a laptop? today! And thanks toall for their input lately. Shawn --------------15692CB9AF4EAE0EC52FAC39-- from bob@downandacross.com Sun Apr 2 13:43:24 2000 (envelope- from bob@downandacross.com) (envelope- from bob@downandacross.com) Subject: lost someones e-mail If anyone has the e-mail for listmember Fred Bohls, could yousend to me via private e-mail. Thanks. Fred if you are out there get a hold of me.Thanks,Bob Bob Maulucci==================================================downandacross.com bob@downandacross.com from paul.blakley@dtn.ntl.com Sun Apr 2 14:17:33 2000 helo=dtn.ntl.com) Subject: Pfleuger Medallist To everyone who contacted me 'off the list ' on this subject .....thankyou.....I will be in direct contact with those of interest.....Paul B from saunder@worldnet.att.net Sun Apr 2 15:46:52 2000Received: frommtiwmhc27.worldnet.att.net (mtiwmhc27.worldnet.att.net (InterMail vM.4.01.02.39 201-229-119-122) with ESMTP Subject: old rod I PICKED UP AN OLD ROD WITH A JC HIGGINS LOGO ON IT, I FIRST THOUGHTIT WASBAMBOO AS IT LOOKS VERY MUCH LIKE ONE, IT APPEARED TO BE A TWOPIECE 4/5WTAND THE TIP WAS PULLED from THE FORWARD PART OF THE FERREL, UPON CLOSEREXAMINATI0N THEFERRELSEEMS TO BE ONE PIECE AND THE ROD MADE OF SOLID WOOD OR AT LEAST ICAN SEENO SEEMS AT ALL. ANYONE OUT THERE HAVE ANY KNOWLEDGE OF SUCH AFISHING ROD IEIS THEFERREL JUST AN IMATION, AND THE ROD MENT TO BE A ONE PIECE. ANDWHAT KINDOF WOOD WOULD BE USED TO GIVE SUCH A GOOD REPLICATION OF BAMBOO. IT WILLHOWEVERMAKE A GOOD DECORATION FOR MY DEN. HUTCH from rmoon@ida.net Sun Apr 2 15:51:19 2000 0000 Subject: Nodeless boundary="------------D1B7FBC264C5470805D8EF86" --------------D1B7FBC264C5470805D8EF86 I remember reading when I first got Garrison and Carmichael's bookthat Mr. Garrison had made a rod in which he had cut out the nodes andspliced the pieces together. The way Mr. Carmichael described the eventI gained the impression that Garrison was the first to use thistechnique. Then when very soon after a couple of friends showed metheir nodeless rods I was impressed. Today I would venture to guessthat there are almost as many builders using nodeless technique as not.Everyone knows that Samuel Phillipe is given credit for making thefirst 6 strip cane rod, although there is still some dispute overthis. Nevertheless there is ample evidence that there were English rodmakers predating Samuel Phillipe making at least sections of rent andglued bamboo rods. I was reading just the other day James Henschall'sBook of the Black Bass published in 1881. Therein I was amazed to findthis brief quoted passage. "Rods formed of several pieces of wood, thatis from two to four longitudinal mitred (sic) and glued together, weremade in England many years ago; and Aldred of London, made rod tips, oras they are called in England, "tops," of split bamboo long before thesplit bamboo rod proper was made in this country. Aldred's tops,however, were necessarily a failure, from the faulty method of theirconstruction. He made them of many short pieces, sawn from between theknots or leaf-ridges, of the male cane, and spliced to form continuouslengths. So much for the original idea." I have no idea why nodeless was a faulty technique, but the conceptpredates even the six strip construction cane rod.Ralph --------------D1B7FBC264C5470805D8EF86 book that Mr. Garrison had made a rod in which he had cut out the nodes the event I gained the impression that Garrison was the first to use this showed guess that there are almost as many builders using nodeless technique asnot. credit were English rod makers predating Samuel Phillipe making at leastsections James formedof several pieces of wood, that is from two to four longitudinal mitred(sic) and glued together, were made in England many years ago; and Aldredof London, made rod tips, or as they are called in England, "tops," ofsplit bamboo long before the split bamboo rod proper was made in this Aldred's tops, however, were necessarily a failure, from the faulty sawn from between the knots or leaf-ridges, of the male cane, and spliced I have no idea why nodeless was a faulty technique, but the conceptpredates even the six strip construction cane rod.Ralph --------------D1B7FBC264C5470805D8EF86-- from flytyr@southshore.com Sun Apr 2 17:23:42 2000 Sun, 2 Apr 2000 17:28:19 -0500 Subject: Re: Nodeless boundary="------------371B03E4A3786DF3156C56D2" --------------371B03E4A3786DF3156C56D2 I have a friend in N.J. that picked up a SamuelPhillipe rod at a yard sale. The women said, youcan have that old thing for 1.00 . This was abouteight years ago. Goes to show there are stillbargains to be found. He has turned down severalgood offers for it.Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com Ralph W Moon wrote: Everyone knows that Samuel Phillipe is givencredit for making the first 6 strip cane rod,although there is still some dispute over this.Nevertheless there is ample evidence that therewere English rod makers predating SamuelPhillipe making at least sections of rent andglued bamboo rods. I was reading just the otherday James Henschall's Book of the Black Basspublished in of --------------371B03E4A3786DF3156C56D2 I have a friend in N.J. that picked up a Samuel Phillipe rod at a yardsale. The women said, you can have that old thing for 1.00 . This was abouteight years ago. Goes to show there are still bargains to be found. Hehas turned down several good offers for it. Ralph W Moon wrote: credit were English rod makers predating Samuel Phillipe making at leastsections James of --------------371B03E4A3786DF3156C56D2-- from martinj@aa.net Sun Apr 2 19:12:43 2000 Sun, 2 Apr 2000 17:12:33 -0700 Subject: RE: Nodeless boundary="----=_NextPart_000_001F_01BF9CC6.72DA25A0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_001F_01BF9CC6.72DA25A0 It may have been as simple as the quality of the glue at the time. Martin Jensen -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Sunday, April 02, 2000 12:43 AM Subject: Nodeless [Martin Jensen] ..... I have no idea why nodeless was a faulty technique,but the concept predates even the six strip construction cane rod.Ralph ------=_NextPart_000_001F_01BF9CC6.72DA25A0 have been as simple as the quality of the glue at the =time. Jensen technique, but the concept predates even the six strip construction = Ralph ------=_NextPart_000_001F_01BF9CC6.72DA25A0-- from darrell@rockclimbing.org Sun Apr 2 19:42:48 2000 sims.3.5.2000.01.05.12.18.p9)with SMTP id for Subject: RE: Nodeless boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0019_01BF9CCA.838F59C0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0019_01BF9CCA.838F59C0 New Ideas are few and far between, apparently... Darrell-----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Sunday, April 02, 2000 12:43 AM Subject: Nodeless I remember reading when I first got Garrison and Carmichael's book thatMr. Garrison had made a rod in which he had cut out the nodes and splicedthe pieces together. The way Mr. Carmichael described the event I gainedthe impression that Garrison was the first to use this technique. Thenwhenvery soon after a couple of friends showed me their nodeless rods I wasimpressed. Today I would venture to guess that there are almost as manybuilders using nodeless technique as not.Everyone knows that Samuel Phillipe is given credit for making thefirst 6 strip cane rod, although there is still some dispute over this.Nevertheless there is ample evidence that there were English rod makerspredating Samuel Phillipe making at least sections of rent and gluedbamboorods. I was reading just the other day James Henschall's Book of the BlackBass published in 1881. Therein I was amazed to find this brief quotedpassage. "Rods formed of several pieces of wood, that is from two to fourlongitudinal mitred (sic) and glued together, were made in England manyyears ago; and Aldred of London, made rod tips, or as they are called inEngland, "tops," of split bamboo long before the split bamboo rod properwasmade in this country. Aldred's tops, however, were necessarily a failure, from the faulty method of their construction. He made them of many shortpieces, sawn from between the knots or leaf-ridges, of the male cane, andspliced to form continuous lengths. So much for the original idea."I have no idea why nodeless was a faulty technique, but the conceptpredates even the six strip construction cane rod.Ralph ------=_NextPart_000_0019_01BF9CCA.838F59C0 Darrell rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: = that Mr. Garrison had made a rod in which he had cut out the nodes and = the impression that Garrison was the first to use this = when very soon after a couple of friends showed me their = knows that Samuel Phillipe is given credit for making the first 6 = there is ample evidence that there were English rod makers predating = reading just the other day James Henschall's Book of the = to four longitudinal mitred (sic) and glued together, were made in = many years ago; and Aldred of London, made rod tips, or as they are = England, "tops," of split bamboo long before the split bamboo rod = many short pieces, sawn from between the knots or leaf-ridges, of the = I have no idea why nodeless was a faulty technique, but the concept = ------=_NextPart_000_0019_01BF9CCA.838F59C0-- from Zeneca@netzero.net Sun Apr 2 22:10:21 2000 w98sysrec) (4.54.15.93) Subject: Winding a rod... Hey, I have been looking for a good winder to wind my rods after gluing. does anyone have any digrams of an old favorite that works well, or a web address where I might order a moderately priced unit? Jason Martin_____________________________________________NetZero - Defenders of the Free WorldClick here for FREE Internet Access and Emailhttp://www.netzero.net/download/index.html from avyoung@iinet.net.au Sun Apr 2 22:15:37 2000 Mon, 3 Apr 2000 11:14:36 +0800 Subject: RE: Nodeless types="text/plain,text/html";boundary="=====================_1054593==_.ALT" --=====================_1054593==_.ALT I think you might be right Martin,If the glue is not up to the task you'll have 100% failure. Tony At 05:11 PM 4/2/00 -0700, Martin Jensen wrote: It may have been as simple as the quality of the glue at the time. Martin Jensen -----Original Message----- From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Sunday, April 02, 2000 12:43 AM Subject: Nodeless [Martin Jensen] ..... I have no idea why nodeless was a faultytechnique, butthe concept predates even the six strip construction cane rod. Ralph /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html And this our life, exempt from public haunt,Finds tongues in trees, books in running brooks,Sermons in stones, and good in everything. William Shakespeare, As You Like It /*************************************************************************/ --=====================_1054593==_.ALT I think you might be right Martin,If the glue is not up to the task you'll have 100% failure. Tony At 05:11 PM 4/2/00 -0700, Martin Jensen wrote: Itmay have been as simple as the quality of the glue at thetime. MartinJensen -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu[ Behalf Of Ralph W MoonSent: Sunday, April 02, 2000 12:43 AM Subject: Nodeless [Martin Jensen] ..... I have no the six strip construction cane rod. Ralph /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: And this our life, exempt from public haunt,Finds tongues in trees, books in running brooks,Sermons in stones, and good in everything. /*************************************************************************/ --=====================_1054593==_.ALT-- from Zeneca@earthling.net Sun Apr 2 22:21:31 2000 w98sysrec) (4.54.15.93) Subject: Change in E-mail Also, there has been a change to my email..... I am no longer using Zeneca@netzero.net. Please ignore that and use Zeneca@earthling.net ment to change that before I posted... Jason_____________________________________________NetZero - Defenders of the Free WorldClick here for FREE Internet Access and Emailhttp://www.netzero.net/download/index.html from irish-george@pacbell.net Mon Apr 3 00:06:32 2000 sims.3.5.2000.01.05.12.18.p9)with SMTP id for Subject: Re: Bamboo FlyRod Mag It really isn't all that common to sell a business (except large, publiclytraded corporations). Usually, there is just a sale of the assets involved(no one wants to take on someone else's liabilities). Regarding assets,probably everything (printing, distribution, etc.) is contracted out. Thatjust leaves goodwill. George -----Original Message----- Subject: Bamboo FlyRod Mag What *I* wonder is why there aren't some entrepeneurs out theresomewherethat are willing to either take over the mag, and/or start another one ... from nsflyrods@ns.sympatico.ca Mon Apr 3 07:02:02 2000 Mon, 3 Apr 2000 09:01:29 -0300 Subject: Re: Winding a rod... Jason,How about a free one? Or close to free? It works just fine.Here's the link.http://www.Shawnsbamboopage.eboard.com Shawn Zeneca@netzero.net wrote: Hey, I have been looking for a good winder to wind my rods aftergluing. does anyone have any digrams of an old favorite that workswell, or a web address where I might order a moderately pricedunit? Jason Martin_____________________________________________NetZero - Defenders of the Free WorldClick here for FREE Internet Access and Emailhttp://www.netzero.net/download/index.html from nsflyrods@ns.sympatico.ca Mon Apr 3 07:06:41 2000 Mon, 3 Apr 2000 09:06:08 -0300 Subject: Re: Change in E-mail Jason,how does a free binder sound? Well its close to free dependinghow much stuff you have around. Here's the link,Shawnhttp://www.Shawnsbamboopage.eboard.com Zeneca@earthling.net wrote: Also, there has been a change to my email..... I am no longerusing Zeneca@netzero.net. Please ignore that and use Zeneca@earthling.net ment to change that before I posted... Jason_____________________________________________NetZero - Defenders of the Free WorldClick here for FREE Internet Access and Emailhttp://www.netzero.net/download/index.html from sniderja@email.uc.edu Mon Apr 3 07:34:36 2000 Subject: Re: Winding a rod... Jason, don't be afraid to bind your first couple of rods by hand. It works,and some folks still prefer this method.Also, you might want to check out Tom Smithwick's amazing little binder.Simplicity in itself, cheap as heck and, more importantly, it works! Ibelieve that I built mine for ca. $20.J. Snider At 11:10 PM 04/02/2000 -0400, Zeneca@netzero.net wrote:Hey, I have been looking for a good winder to wind my rods after gluing. does anyone have any digrams of an old favorite that works well, or a web address where I might order a moderately priced unit? Jason Martin_____________________________________________NetZero - Defenders of the Free WorldClick here for FREE Internet Access and Emailhttp://www.netzero.net/download/index.html from nsflyrods@ns.sympatico.ca Mon Apr 3 07:46:29 2000 Mon, 3 Apr 2000 09:45:54 -0300 Subject: Re: Winding a rod... That's right Jerry,I almost forgot about Tom's binder! It is a very neatlittle rig. I have some pictures if you interested Jason, Tom wouldprobablyhave better ones or maybe even blueprints.Shawn Jerry Snider wrote: Jason, don't be afraid to bind your first couple of rods by hand. It works,and some folks still prefer this method.Also, you might want to check out Tom Smithwick's amazing littlebinder.Simplicity in itself, cheap as heck and, more importantly, it works! Ibelieve that I built mine for ca. $20.J. Snider At 11:10 PM 04/02/2000 -0400, Zeneca@netzero.net wrote:Hey, I have been looking for a good winder to wind my rods aftergluing. does anyone have any digrams of an old favorite that workswell, or a web address where I might order a moderately pricedunit? Jason Martin_____________________________________________NetZero - Defenders of the Free WorldClick here for FREE Internet Access and Emailhttp://www.netzero.net/download/index.html from jmpio@nhbm.com Mon Apr 3 09:27:36 2000 (5.0.1459.74) Subject: RE: the Book Got mine Saturday also. Nice boxed setup. Were prior versions donethis way? I'm not sure if the box is gonna be useful over the long run,depends on whether one uses the book as a bench reference or as alibrary item.----- Original Message-----From: bob maulucci [SMTP:bob@downandacross.com]Sent: Saturday, April 01, 2000 5:00 PM Subject: the Book 1. I received my $50 copy of the Book today.://www.wildadv. comThanks for the tip on this one. $50 shippedis a great deal. I can now retire my pages photocopied from the publiclibrary copy. 2. The new Tom Morgan Rodsmiths site is now up. It looks fantastic.com Greatinfoon the Hand Mill. Nice pics also. No commercial interest. Just good people.Bob Maulucci==================================================downandacross.com bob@downandacross.com from darrell@rockclimbing.org Mon Apr 3 11:40:37 2000 sims.3.5.2000.01.05.12.18.p9)with SMTP id for Subject: RE: Change in E-mail Is that earthling.net or earthlink.net... -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Change in E-mail Jason,how does a free binder sound? Well its close to free dependinghow much stuff you have around. Here's the link,Shawnhttp://www.Shawnsbamboopage.eboard.com Zeneca@earthling.net wrote: Also, there has been a change to my email..... I am no longerusing Zeneca@netzero.net. Please ignore that and use Zeneca@earthling.net ment to change that before I posted... Jason_____________________________________________NetZero - Defenders of the Free WorldClick here for FREE Internet Access and Emailhttp://www.netzero.net/download/index.html from steve@hamiltonrods.com Mon Apr 3 13:25:04 2000 Subject: Wrap colors I've been experimenting with various wrap colors--solid black, cherry red,dark green tipped with yellow, etc. using an off-white thread that turnsessentially transparent when varnished. Three questions: (1) Anyone else out there like the transparent (not just translucent) lookon a flamed rod?(2) What other thread colors are typical for a flamed rod?(3) Is there a photo archive of traditional rod wrap styles and colors? --Steve from jwt4639@ritvax.isc.rit.edu Mon Apr 3 13:41:35 2000 with ESMTPA id forrodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 14:40:50 EDT Subject: Communication from Editor Mark, I'am still looking for the explanation that you were going to post inreply to my call last month. By the posts I have seen since in regardsto your magazine it appears you have very little regards for yoursubscribers and even less for those who sent me wishes of 'bamboslivers' under my nails for suggesting the removal of your subscriptionnotice from Rodmakers list. In the sake of ethics I believe you should pull your subscription notice from Rodmakers if you are not going to be able to deliver the product.I'am not talking flyboxes and hats but the magazine itself. With Regrets,Jim Tefft from KlingB@health.missouri.edu Mon Apr 3 14:50:28 2000 Subject: RE: Winding a rod... Where can we find info on Tom Smithwick's binder? B. Kling -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Winding a rod... Jason, don't be afraid to bind your first couple of rods by hand. It works,and some folks still prefer this method.Also, you might want to check out Tom Smithwick's amazing little binder.Simplicity in itself, cheap as heck and, more importantly, it works! Ibelieve that I built mine for ca. $20.J. Snider At 11:10 PM 04/02/2000 -0400, Zeneca@netzero.net wrote:Hey, I have been looking for a good winder to wind my rods after gluing. does anyone have any digrams of an old favorite that works well, or a web address where I might order a moderately priced unit? Jason Martin_____________________________________________NetZero - Defenders of the Free WorldClick here for FREE Internet Access and Emailhttp://www.netzero.net/download/index.html from watson@cape-consult.co.uk Mon Apr 3 16:26:46 2000 (BST) Subject: Rod Winders boundary="----=_NextPart_000_001C_01BF9DBC.37614FC0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_001C_01BF9DBC.37614FC0 Has anyone out there got and/or used one of the 'Master Track Wrapping =Machines' that are on Golden Witch. They look great but before I do =anyhting I thought I would check to see if there are any users or what =others do.ThanksTim. ------=_NextPart_000_001C_01BF9DBC.37614FC0 Has anyone out there got and/or= any users or what others do.ThanksTim. ------=_NextPart_000_001C_01BF9DBC.37614FC0-- from Patrick.Coffey@PSS.Boeing.com Mon Apr 3 16:32:28 2000 OAA01563 ESMTP; Mon, 3 Apr 2000 14:32:46 -0700 (5.5.2650.21) "'watson@cape-consult.co.uk'" Subject: RE: Rod Winders After seeing how good D. Whitehead's tips came out and talking to himabout it I got one of the Bellingerbinders from Goldenwich and it's absolutely great. Tips come out realstraight like the Medved binder. Patrick W. CoffeyAOG Incident Repair PlanningPhone: 425-234-2901Fax: 425-237-0083M-2112 M/C 61-79 ----------From: Watson's[SMTP:watson@cape-consult.co.uk] Sent: Monday, April 03, 2000 2:30 PM Subject: Rod Winders Has anyone out there got and/or used one of the 'Master Track WrappingMachines' that are on Golden Witch.They look great but before I do anyhting I thought I would check to see ifthere are any users or what othersdo.ThanksTim. from bob@downandacross.com Mon Apr 3 17:02:55 2000 (envelope- from bob@downandacross.com) (envelope- from bob@downandacross.com) Subject: RE: Rod Winders I agree. The Bellinger binder is great. My tips came out very straight.Although I changed from the nylon that Russ sent to a bit heavier gauge.I was breaking thread too easily. With the nylon embroidery thread I use,it is fantastic. I will post the thread if any one wants to know.Bob At 02:32 PM 4/3/00 -0700, you wrote:After seeing how good D. Whitehead's tips cameout and talking to him about it I got one of the Bellinger binders fromGoldenwich and it's absolutely great. Tips come out real straight likethe Medved binder. Patrick W. CoffeyAOG Incident Repair PlanningPhone: 425-234-2901 79 April 03, 2000 2:30 PM Winders before I do anyhting I thought I would check to see if there are anyusers or what others do. Bob Maulucci==================================================downandacross.com bob@downandacross.com from anglport@con2.com Mon Apr 3 17:05:20 2000 (SMTPD32-6.00) id A4E72C6C0150; Mon, 03 Apr 2000 18:02:15 -0400 Subject: RE: Winding a rod... Barry, Try:http://www.canerod.com/Main1/ Noodle around in there and you'll find all sortsa good "stuff". http://www.canerod.com/Tools/Index.html and LO! there is the Smithwick binder.Enjoy!Art At 02:50 PM 04/03/2000 -0500, Kling, Barry W. wrote: Where can we find info on Tom Smithwick's binder? B. Kling -----Original Message----- Sent: Monday, April 03, 2000 7:37 AM Subject: Re: Winding a rod... Jason, don't be afraid to bind your first couple of rods by hand. It works,and some folks still prefer this method.Also, you might want to check out Tom Smithwick's amazing little binder.Simplicity in itself, cheap as heck and, more importantly, it works! Ibelieve that I built mine for ca. $20.J. Snider At 11:10 PM 04/02/2000 -0400, Zeneca@netzero.net wrote:Hey, I have been looking for a good winder to wind my rods after gluing. does anyone have any digrams of an old favorite that works well, or a web address where I might order a moderately priced unit? Jason Martin_____________________________________________NetZero - Defenders of the Free WorldClick here for FREE Internet Access and Emailhttp://www.netzero.net/download/index.html from KlingB@health.missouri.edu Mon Apr 3 17:15:11 2000 Subject: RE: Rod Winders I think the question was about a rig for wrapping guides/ferrules etc....BK -----Original Message----- Subject: RE: Rod Winders I agree. The Bellinger binder is great. My tips came out very straight.Although I changed from the nylon that Russ sent to a bit heavier gauge. Iwas breaking thread too easily. With the nylon embroidery thread I use, itis fantastic. I will post the thread if any one wants to know.Bob At 02:32 PM 4/3/00 -0700, you wrote: After seeing how good D. Whitehead's tips came out and talking to himaboutit I got one of the Bellinger binders from Goldenwich and it's absolutelygreat. Tips come out real straight like the Medved binder. Patrick W. CoffeyAOG Incident Repair PlanningPhone: 425-234-2901Fax: 425-237-0083M-2112 M/C 61-79 ----------From: Watson's[SMTP:watson@cape-consult.co.uk] Sent: Monday, April 03, 2000 2:30 PM Subject: Rod Winders Has anyone out there got and/or used one of the 'Master Track WrappingMachines' that are on Golden Witch. They look great but before I doanyhting I thought I would check to see if there are any users or whatothers do.ThanksTim. Bob Maulucci==================================================downandacross.com bob@downandacross.com from bob@downandacross.com Mon Apr 3 17:27:01 2000 (envelope- from bob@downandacross.com) (envelope- from bob@downandacross.com) Subject: RE: Rod Winders Oh. In that case, I got the $8 one from Cabellas. It works fine for nylonor silk. I like the one from GW. If it was worth it, I would fork up thecash. This would be worth it, since you know that the wrapping is one ofthose things everyone scrutinizes over. It is also one of the things thatI struggle with when my eyes are tired. Bob At 05:15 PM 4/3/00 -0500, you wrote:I think the question was about a rig forwrapping guides/ferrules etc....BK -----Original Message----- Subject: RE: Rod Winders I agree. The Bellinger binder is great. My tips came out verystraight.Although I changed from the nylon that Russ sent to a bit heavier gauge.Iwas breaking thread too easily. With the nylon embroidery thread I use,itis fantastic. I will post the thread if any one wants to know.Bob At 02:32 PM 4/3/00 -0700, you wrote: After seeing how good D. Whitehead's tips came out and talking to himaboutit I got one of the Bellinger binders from Goldenwich and it'sabsolutelygreat. Tips come out real straight like the Medved binder. Patrick W. CoffeyAOG Incident Repair PlanningPhone: 425-234-2901 79 Watson's[SMTP:watson@cape-consult.co.uk] April03, 2000 2:30 PM Wrapping doanyhting I thought I would check to see if there are any users orwhatothers do. Bob Maulucci==================================================downandacross.com bob@downandacross.com Bob Maulucci==================================================downandacross.com bob@downandacross.com from nobler@satx.rr.com Mon Apr 3 17:46:10 2000 SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.357.35);Mon, 3 Apr 2000 17:34:37 -0500 Subject: Re: Wrap colors boundary="----=_NextPart_000_009F_01BF9D94.D264B840" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_009F_01BF9D94.D264B840 I've always liked a light beige, with varnish finish, as it sort of =blends with the dark areas of the flamed cane. Just a classy look, if =it's done neatly. GMA Sent: Monday, April 03, 2000 1:26 PMSubject: Wrap colors I've been experimenting with various wrap colors--solid black, cherry =red, dark green tipped with yellow, etc. For my latest rod, I'm working =on a tiger- flamed look and I'm considering using an off-white thread =that turns essentially transparent when varnished. Three questions: (1) Anyone else out there like the transparent (not just translucent) =look on a flamed rod?(2) What other thread colors are typical for a flamed rod?(3) Is there a photo archive of traditional rod wrap styles and =colors? --Steve ------=_NextPart_000_009F_01BF9D94.D264B840 I've always liked a light beige, with varnish finish, as it = blends with the dark areas of the flamed cane. Just a classy look, if = neatly. GMA ----- Original Message ----- Zimmerman Sent: Monday, April 03, 2000 = PMSubject: Wrap colorsI've been experimenting with various wrap colors-- solid= cherry red, dark green tipped with yellow, etc. For my latest rod, I'm = on a tiger-flamed look and I'm considering using an off-white thread = turns essentially transparent when varnished. Three = Anyone else out there like the transparent (not just translucent) look = rod?(3) Is there a photo archive of traditional rod wrap styles = colors?--Steve ------=_NextPart_000_009F_01BF9D94.D264B840-- from watson@cape-consult.co.uk Mon Apr 3 17:54:15 2000 Mon, 3 Apr 2000 23:54:07 +0100 (BST) Subject: Re: Rod Winders Yes, apologies for not using the right words. I was talking about whippingon the guides and ferrules as Barry saysTim.----- Original Message ----- Subject: RE: Rod Winders I think the question was about a rig for wrapping guides/ferrulesetc....BK -----Original Message----- Sent: Monday, April 03, 2000 5:00 PM Cc: rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: RE: Rod Winders I agree. The Bellinger binder is great. My tips came out very straight.Although I changed from the nylon that Russ sent to a bit heavier gauge. Iwas breaking thread too easily. With the nylon embroidery thread I use,itis fantastic. I will post the thread if any one wants to know.Bob At 02:32 PM 4/3/00 -0700, you wrote: After seeing how good D. Whitehead's tips came out and talking to himaboutit I got one of the Bellinger binders from Goldenwich and it's absolutelygreat. Tips come out real straight like the Medved binder. Patrick W. CoffeyAOG Incident Repair PlanningPhone: 425-234-2901Fax: 425-237-0083M-2112 M/C 61-79 ----------From: Watson's[SMTP:watson@cape-consult.co.uk] Sent: Monday, April 03, 2000 2:30 PM Subject: Rod Winders Has anyone out there got and/or used one of the 'Master Track WrappingMachines' that are on Golden Witch. They look great but before I doanyhting I thought I would check to see if there are any users or whatothers do.ThanksTim. Bob Maulucci==================================================downandacross.combob@downandacross.com from horsesho@ptd.net Mon Apr 3 18:06:47 2000 (204.186.211.72) Subject: Re: Rod Winders bob maulucci wrote: I agree. The Bellinger binder is great. My tips came out verystraight. Although I changed from the nylon that Russ sent to a bitheavier gauge. I was breaking thread too easily. With the nylonembroidery thread I use, it is fantastic. I will post the thread ifany one wants to know.Bob At 02:32 PM 4/3/00 -0700, you wrote: After seeing how good D. Whitehead's tips came out and> talking tohim about it I got one of the Bellinger binders from Goldenwich and it's absolutely great. Tips come outreal straight like the Medved binder. Patrick W. CoffeyAOG Incident Repair PlanningPhone: 425-234-2901Fax: 425-237-0083M-2112 M/C 61-79 ----------From: Watson's[SMTP:watson@cape-consult.co.uk] Sent: Monday, April 03, 2000 2:30 PM Subject: Rod Winders Has anyone out there got and/or used one of the 'MasterTrack Wrapping Machines' that are on Golden Witch. Theylook great but before I do anyhting I thought I would checkto see if there are any users or what others do.ThanksTim. Bob Maulucci==================================================downandacross.combob@downandacross.comHi Bob, I also use the Bellinger Binder and although my tips come outstraight they do have a twist to them that I can only get out with heatafter the glue cures. Any idea what the problem is? I used for years aMillward type binder that I made and it never put a twist in thesection. Marty from bob@downandacross.com Mon Apr 3 18:07:01 2000 (envelope- from bob@downandacross.com) (envelope- from bob@downandacross.com) Subject: Re: Wrap colors Hi Steve:On flamed rods, I like the black myself, tipped with gold. This is how mySB Cross Sylph is, and since it was the first great rod I ever owned, Iguess I am a sucker for that combination. I also like the java beige thatI got from Munro a while back. It's 6/0 though, and I find it a bear touse. I am now experimenting with YLI 3/0 in several shades of brown. Saw a rod this weekend wrapped in that Pearsall's chestnut from GW anditlooked stunning. It was a transparent orangish brown. Just great on amedium flamed rod. I might also add that the rod was a fantastic caster.Thanks, Joe P for letting me cast it. (Am I right on the thread part?) I also finished off a blond rod in purple of all colors, tipped black. Itis not as tacky as you might expect. I like the effect I got. It is kindof a grape over the light blond rod, and I like it a lot.Bob At 05:48 PM 4/3/00 -0500, you wrote:I've always liked a light beige, withvarnish finish, as it sort of blends with the dark areas of the flamedcane. Just a classy look, if it's done neatly. GMA----- Original Message ----- From: SteveZimmerman Sent: Monday, April 03, 2000 1:26 PMSubject: Wrap colors I've been experimenting with various wrap colors--solid black, cherry red,dark green tipped with yellow, etc. using an off-white thread that turnsessentially transparent when varnished. Three questions: (1) Anyone else out there like the transparent (not just translucent) lookon a flamed rod?(2) What other thread colors are typical for a flamed rod?(3) Is there a photo archive of traditional rod wrap styles and colors? --Steve Bob Maulucci==================================================downandacross.com bob@downandacross.com from bob@downandacross.com Mon Apr 3 18:43:19 2000 (envelope- from bob@downandacross.com) (envelope- from bob@downandacross.com) Subject: Thread for binding thread in the Bellinger binder:Coats and Clark brand (gold and blue label)T26NylonUpholstery137m 150 yds.I purchased it at Joanne Fabrics. Any local craft store should haveit. They also make a comparable weight glaced cotton that I have for heattreating. I found that I was breaking the GW nylon constantly. This stuffworks great at $2 a pop. I bought white for flamed rods and dark blue forlight blond rods. I like to see the binding thread easily on the blank.Size wise, it is close to size A nylon wrapping thread I wouldguess.Bob Bob Maulucci==================================================downandacross.com bob@downandacross.com from channer1@rmi.net Mon Apr 3 18:55:09 2000 Subject: Re: Rod Winders bob maulucci wrote: I agree. The Bellinger binder is great. My tips came out verystraight. Although I changed from the nylon that Russ sent to a bitheavier gauge. I was breaking thread too easily. With the nylonembroidery thread I use, it is fantastic. I will post the thread ifany one wants to know.Bob At 02:32 PM 4/3/00 -0700, you wrote: After seeing how good D. Whitehead's tips came out and talking tohim about it I got one of the Bellinger binders from Goldenwich andit's absolutely great. Tips come out real straight like the Medvedbinder. Patrick W. CoffeyAOG Incident Repair PlanningPhone: 425-234-2901Fax: 425-237-0083M-2112 M/C 61-79 ----------Thanks for the encouraging posts guys, I am going to be glueing up a rodwith mine for the first time this weekend, I hope my tip troubles areover!John from nobler@satx.rr.com Mon Apr 3 19:12:55 2000 SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.357.35);Mon, 3 Apr 2000 19:01:17 -0500 Subject: Re: Thread for binding boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0102_01BF9DA0.EE345B00" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0102_01BF9DA0.EE345B00 My, such fine thread for binding ? I tho't most used a much heavier =cotton cord in the binders. GMA Sent: Monday, April 03, 2000 6:40 PMSubject: Thread for binding the Bellinger binder:Coats and Clark brand (gold and blue label)T26NylonUpholstery137m 150 yds.I purchased it at Joanne Fabrics. Any local craft store should have =it. They also make a comparable weight glaced cotton that I have for =heat treating. I found that I was breaking the GW nylon constantly. This =stuff works great at $2 a pop. I bought white for flamed rods and dark =blue for light blond rods. I like to see the binding thread easily on =the blank. Size wise, it is close to size A nylon wrapping thread I =would guess. Bob Maulucci==3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D==3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= ------=_NextPart_000_0102_01BF9DA0.EE345B00 My, such fine thread for binding ? I tho't most used a much= cotton cord in the binders. GMA ----- Original Message ----- maulucci = Sent: Monday, April 03, 2000 = PMSubject: Thread for =binding the Bellinger binder:Coats and Clark brand (gold and blue label)T26NylonUpholstery137m 150 yds.I purchased it at Joanne Fabrics. Any local craft store should = They also make a comparable weight glaced cotton that I have for treating. I found that I was breaking the GW nylon constantly. This = works great at $2 a pop. I bought white for flamed rods and dark blue = light blond rods. I like to see the binding thread easily on the = wise, it is close to size A nylon wrapping thread I would = =Maulucci=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D==3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D==3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3Ddownandacross.com bob@downandacross.com = ------=_NextPart_000_0102_01BF9DA0.EE345B00-- from nobler@satx.rr.com Mon Apr 3 19:15:47 2000 SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.357.35);Mon, 3 Apr 2000 19:04:13 -0500 Subject: Re: Wrap colors boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0108_01BF9DA1.56D5A240" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0108_01BF9DA1.56D5A240 I have an original Cross S.B. that is blond, and its chestnut, and =reddish brown wraps are very nice, and blend nicely. It has a very =light, alum. reel seat, that I've never seen before ! GMA Sent: Monday, April 03, 2000 6:03 PMSubject: Re: Wrap colors Hi Steve:On flamed rods, I like the black myself, tipped with gold. This is how =my SB Cross Sylph is, and since it was the first great rod I ever owned, =I guess I am a sucker for that combination. I also like the java beige =that I got from Munro a while back. It's 6/0 though, and I find it a =bear to use. I am now experimenting with YLI 3/0 in several shades of = Saw a rod this weekend wrapped in that Pearsall's chestnut from GW and=it looked stunning. It was a transparent orangish brown. Just great on a =medium flamed rod. I might also add that the rod was a fantastic caster. = I also finished off a blond rod in purple of all colors, tipped black. =It is not as tacky as you might expect. I like the effect I got. It is =kind of a grape over the light blond rod, and I like it a lot.Bob At 05:48 PM 4/3/00 -0500, you wrote: I've always liked a light beige, with varnish finish, as it sort of =blends with the dark areas of the flamed cane. Just a classy look, if =it's done neatly. GMA Sent: Monday, April 03, 2000 1:26 PMSubject: Wrap colors I've been experimenting with various wrap colors--solid black, =cherry red, dark green tipped with yellow, etc. For my latest rod, I'm =working on a tiger- flamed look and I'm considering using an off-white =thread that turns essentially transparent when varnished. Three =questions: (1) Anyone else out there like the transparent (not just =translucent) look on a flamed rod?(2) What other thread colors are typical for a flamed rod?(3) Is there a photo archive of traditional rod wrap styles and =colors? --Steve Bob Maulucci==3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D==3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= ------=_NextPart_000_0108_01BF9DA1.56D5A240 I have an original Cross S.B. that is blond, and its = reddish brown wraps are very nice, and blend nicely. It has a very = reel seat, that I've never seen before ! GMA ----- Original Message ----- maulucci = Sent: Monday, April 03, 2000 = PMSubject: Re: Wrap colorsHi Steve:On flamed rods, I like the black myself, = with gold. This is how my SB Cross Sylph is, and since it was the = rod I ever owned, I guess I am a sucker for that combination. I also = java beige that I got from Munro a while back. It's 6/0 though, and I = a bear to use. I am now experimenting with YLI 3/0 in several shades = Saw a rod this weekend wrapped in that Pearsall's chestnut from GW= looked stunning. It was a transparent orangish brown. Just great on a = flamed rod. I might also add that the rod was a fantastic caster. = P for letting me cast it. (Am I right on the thread part?) I also = off a blond rod in purple of all colors, tipped black. It is not as = you might expect. I like the effect I got. It is kind of a grape over = light blond rod, and I like it a lot.BobAt 05:48 PM 4/3/00 = you wrote:I've always liked a light beige, with = finish, as it sort of blends with the dark areas of the flamed cane. = classy look, if it's done = ----- Original Message ----- = Steve Zimmerman = RodMakers = Monday, April 03, 2000 1:26 PMSubject: Wrap = been experimenting with various wrap colors--solid black, cherry = green tipped with yellow, etc. For my latest rod, I'm working on a = tiger-flamed look and I'm considering using an off-white thread = essentially transparent when varnished. Three = else out there like the transparent (not just translucent) look on = flamed rod?(2) What other thread colors are typical for a = rod?(3) Is there a photo archive of traditional rod wrap = =Maulucci=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D==3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D==3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3Ddownandacross.com bob@downandacross.com = ------=_NextPart_000_0108_01BF9DA1.56D5A240-- from mschaffer@mindspring.com Tue Apr 4 04:27:33 2000 Subject: Help needed-airlines tickets-best websites Guys,Please forgive the semi-rodmakers bandwidth, but I need some help infindingthe best website for discount airline tickets to the FFF meeting inMontanain August. Any help would be mucho appreciated! Thanks, Mike from chris@artistree.com Tue Apr 4 05:00:45 2000 Subject: Re: Help needed-airlines tickets-best websites Mike,I've been extreamly happy with the fares from Cheap Tickets. Their website is http://www.cheaptickets.com I'm all ears if anyone else has some other suggestions. -- Regards, Chris Wohlfordemail: chris@artistree.com Mike Shaffer wrote: Guys,Please forgive the semi-rodmakers bandwidth, but I need some help infindingthe best website for discount airline tickets to the FFF meeting inMontanain August. Any help would be mucho appreciated! Thanks, Mike from Eastkoyfly@aol.com Tue Apr 4 08:42:29 2000 Subject: Re: Wrap colors Bob, Yes it is Pearsall's classic chestnut, came out very nice, the Pearsall's is marvelous to work with [no fuzzy's].Your Drigg's looks good with the purple wraps.I really like the delicate black tipping, greatcasting rod also. You did a great job on your first rod.Joe from carinad@netactive.co.za Tue Apr 4 10:23:51 2000 sims.3.5.1999.03.02.17.58.p5)with SMTP id forrodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 17:23:13 +0200 (SAT) Subject: Planing BOUNDARY="Boundary_(ID_NdUjWYxd1EVNZHLlOAIQCg)" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --Boundary_(ID_NdUjWYxd1EVNZHLlOAIQCg) I hope that you can help me with a problem building my first rod. I can =not seem to hold the bamboo split in the planing form without it =slipping once I start planing. How do I hold it still? Please help. Thanks, Dirk de Villiers --Boundary_(ID_NdUjWYxd1EVNZHLlOAIQCg) I hope that you can help me with a = my first rod. I can not seem to hold the bamboo split in the planing = without it slipping once I start planing. How do I hold it still? Please = help. Thanks, Dirk de =Villiers --Boundary_(ID_NdUjWYxd1EVNZHLlOAIQCg)-- from nsflyrods@ns.sympatico.ca Tue Apr 4 10:36:13 2000 Tue, 4 Apr 2000 12:35:40 -0300 Subject: Re: Planing boundary="------------EFD3BADCED04B022408E7AA5" --------------EFD3BADCED04B022408E7AA5 Dirk,Sounds like you may be trying to take too thick a cut atonce.This causes the plane to "stick"and drag the bamboo along with it.Try taking a very thin shaving and make sure your blades are deadlysharp.Also, try planing from butt to tip.Hope this helps,Shawn Fables wrote: I hope that you can help me with a problem building my first rod. Ican not seem to hold the bamboo split in the planing form without itslipping once I start planing. How do I hold it still? Pleasehelp. Thanks, Dirk de Villiers --------------EFD3BADCED04B022408E7AA5 Dirk, tryingto take too thick a cut at once.This causes the plane to "stick"and dragthe bamboo along with it. Try taking a very thin shaving and make sureyour blades are deadly sharp. buttto tip. Hope this helps, ShawnFables wrote: Ihope that you can help me with a problem building my first rod. I can notseem to hold the bamboo split in the planing form without it slipping onceI start planing. How do I hold it still? Please de Villiers --------------EFD3BADCED04B022408E7AA5-- from caneman@clnk.com Tue Apr 4 11:00:34 2000 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35)with SMTP id com; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 10:57:00 -0500 Subject: Re: Planing boundary="----=_NextPart_000_02E5_01BF9E24.AAAF7520" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_02E5_01BF9E24.AAAF7520 Dirk,Could be that your blade in your plane is not sharp enough or that =you are trying to take too much material off. Also could be that the =foot on your plane (the gap forward of your blade) is too small, not =allowing the shavings to pass through.First, check the sharpness of your blade. If it doesn't strike fear =in your heart to try to shave with it, then it isn't sharp enough. If =that isn't the problem, then adjust your plane, and take smaller passes. Bob-----Original Message-----From: Fables Date: Tuesday, April 04, 2000 10:26 AMSubject: Planing I hope that you can help me with a problem building my first rod. I =can not seem to hold the bamboo split in the planing form without it =slipping once I start planing. How do I hold it still? Please help. Thanks, Dirk de Villiers ------=_NextPart_000_02E5_01BF9E24.AAAF7520 Dirk, = your plane is not sharp enough or that you are trying to take too much = blade) is too small, not allowing the shavings to pass =through. the = your plane, and take smaller passes. Bob -----Original = rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= <rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= PlaningI hope that you can help me with a = building my first rod. I can not seem to hold the bamboo split in = planing form without it slipping once I start planing. How do I hold = still? Please help. Thanks, Villiers ------=_NextPart_000_02E5_01BF9E24.AAAF7520-- from nobler@satx.rr.com Tue Apr 4 11:36:28 2000 SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.357.35);Tue, 4 Apr 2000 11:24:44 -0500 Subject: Re: Planing Form boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0021_01BF9E2A.51B69B00" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0021_01BF9E2A.51B69B00 Can anyone give me an Email address for the Planing Form. I received 2 =issues last time, and need to check and see if I subscribed twice ! Thanks, GMA Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2000 11:31 AMSubject: Re: Planing Sounds like you may be trying to take too thick a cut at =once.This causes the plane to "stick"and drag the bamboo along with it. =Try taking a very thin shaving and make sure your blades are deadly = I hope that you can help me with a problem building my first rod. I =can not seem to hold the bamboo split in the planing form without it =slipping once I start planing. How do I hold it still? Please help. =Thanks, Dirk de Villiers ------=_NextPart_000_0021_01BF9E2A.51B69B00 Can anyone give me an Email address for the Planing Form. I= received 2 issues last time, and need to check and see if I subscribed = ! Thanks, GMA ----- Original Message ----- Shawn Pineo Cc: rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2000 = AMSubject: Re: Planing = like you may be trying to take too thick a cut at once.This causes the = to "stick"and drag the bamboo along with it. Try taking a very thin = = = = I hope that you can help me with= building my first rod. I can not seem to hold the bamboo split in = planing form without it slipping once I start planing. How do I hold = Villiers ------=_NextPart_000_0021_01BF9E2A.51B69B00-- from nsflyrods@ns.sympatico.ca Tue Apr 4 12:16:42 2000 Subject: transparent wraps I have used semi transparent silk wraps on all of my bamboo (nylonthread on fiberglass / graphite doesn't seem to have have this problem)and love the look. I have been using Bellding Cortecelli antique goldwhich turns a beautiful semi transparent dark caramel color when I puthelmsman spar urethane over it without color preserver. I have hadsomeone ask that the wraps not be semi transparent i.e. they don't wantto see the guide feet and ferrule crowns.How do I go about that? A graphite building friend suggested justkeep applying layers of thread till it isn't clear anymore, but thatsounds unrealistic. Shawn from mcdowellc@lanecc.edu Tue Apr 4 12:32:20 2000 10:32:47 PDT Subject: re: transparent wraps Shawn, If you finish the blank prior to wrapping and then brush the finish on the wraps then use a color preserver to get away from the transparent look. Clear lacquer will retain a darker color then the water based Flex Coat, which maintains the spool color pretty well, but I've used either and they work fine. If you dip the sections after you have wrapped then my suggestion wouldbe to stay with your transparent look. Dipping over preserved wraps can be an ongoing struggle. It requires quite a build of preserver layers to keep the varnish from seeping in. This results in wraps that may be a bit bulkier then you prefer. If a few dark splotches where the varnish bleeds through doesn't bother you then go for it, but if you want the wraps to be perfectly uniform in color retention, preservation is a can of worms. This is my opinion of course, there are probably others who dip over their preserved wraps with no complications. Chris---------- Original Text ---------- I have used semi transparent silk wraps on all of my bamboo (nylonthread on fiberglass / graphite doesn't seem to have have this problem)and love the look. I have been using Bellding Cortecelli antique goldwhich turns a beautiful semi transparent dark caramel color when I puthelmsman spar urethane over it without color preserver. I have hadsomeone ask that the wraps not be semi transparent i.e. they don't wantto see the guide feet and ferrule crowns.How do I go about that? A graphite building friend suggested justkeep applying layers of thread till it isn't clear anymore, but thatsounds unrealistic. Shawn from rsgould@cmc.net Tue Apr 4 12:49:15 2000 Subject: Re: Planing boundary="----=_NextPart_000_001A_01BF9E23.542DE0C0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_001A_01BF9E23.542DE0C0 Hi Dirk,To hold the strip in place while you are planing and assuming you're =right handed, put rubber finger cots on you left hand. Press the strip =down into the groove with the left hand planing from the deep end of the =form groove towards the shallow end of the form groove. Press down with=the left hand closer to you, that is behind the right hand so that the =strip does not buckle while planing. The strip will tend to slip endwise =less as it gets closer to an actual triangle and nearer to final size.Ray Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2000 8:28 AMSubject: Planing I hope that you can help me with a problem building my first rod. I =can not seem to hold the bamboo split in the planing form without it =slipping once I start planing. How do I hold it still? Please help. Thanks, Dirk de Villiers ------=_NextPart_000_001A_01BF9E23.542DE0C0 Hi Dirk,To hold the strip in place while you = and assuming you're right handed, put rubber finger cots on you left = Press the strip down into the groove with the left hand planing from the = end of the form groove towards the shallow end of the form groove. Press= with the left hand closer to you, that is behind the right hand so that = strip does not buckle while planing. The strip will tend to slip endwise = it gets closer to an actual triangle and nearer to final =size.Ray ----- Original Message ----- Fables = Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2000 = AMSubject: Planing I hope that you can help me with a = building my first rod. I can not seem to hold the bamboo split in the = form without it slipping once I start planing. How do I hold it still? = help. Thanks, Villiers ------=_NextPart_000_001A_01BF9E23.542DE0C0-- from teekay35@interlynx.net Tue Apr 4 13:05:00 2000 Subject: Re: transparent wraps Shawn, try using Varathane varnish as a preserver on the thread wraps. Itwill give you a solid transluscent finish which will be almost the same asthe dry thread colour. Since its a flooring varnish it also drys fast, ie,you can put on several coats a day. Varathane is also compatible withsparvarnish, so there is no problem with the two varnishes reacdting to eachother. ----------From: Shawn Pineo Subject: transparent wrapsDate: Tuesday, April 04, 2000 2:11 PM I have used semi transparent silk wraps on all of my bamboo (nylonthread on fiberglass / graphite doesn't seem to have have this problem)and love the look. I have been using Bellding Cortecelli antique goldwhich turns a beautiful semi transparent dark caramel color when I puthelmsman spar urethane over it without color preserver. I have hadsomeone ask that the wraps not be semi transparent i.e. they don't wantto see the guide feet and ferrule crowns.How do I go about that? A graphite building friend suggested justkeep applying layers of thread till it isn't clear anymore, but thatsounds unrealistic. Shawn from caneman@clnk.com Tue Apr 4 13:06:26 2000 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35)with SMTP id com; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 13:02:54 -0500 "Rod Makers List Serve" Subject: Re: transparent wraps Shawn,A couple of different methods... coat the wraps with 3 or 4 coats ofclear laquer which will act as a color preserver. There are somecommercially available color preservers out there, but in the past I haveused white glue, thinned 50% with water, and applied 4 coats of that onthewraps before varnishing. Keep in mind that if you color preserve, that youwill get the TRUE color of the thread, so your dark carmel color won't bethere. If that is what you want, then get the color silk you want and colorpreserve it, then varnish over the top. Later,Bob-----Original Message----- Subject: transparent wraps I have used semi transparent silk wraps on all of my bamboo (nylonthread on fiberglass / graphite doesn't seem to have have this problem)and love the look. I have been using Bellding Cortecelli antique goldwhich turns a beautiful semi transparent dark caramel color when I puthelmsman spar urethane over it without color preserver. I have hadsomeone ask that the wraps not be semi transparent i.e. they don't wantto see the guide feet and ferrule crowns.How do I go about that? A graphite building friend suggested justkeep applying layers of thread till it isn't clear anymore, but thatsounds unrealistic. Shawn from rsgould@cmc.net Tue Apr 4 13:07:58 2000 Subject: Re: transparent wraps Shawn,Here's an idea for you. Make up some sample sticks, that is a section of afly rod blank, with various colors and sizes of thread wrapped over guides.Label each guide with the thread and finish. Some could have colorpreserverand varnish, some just varnished, Some can be silk and some can be nylon.Ifthe customer really wants non-transparent wraps show him/her somewith nylonNCP (you can't see thru this at all). I note that on my sample sticks I haveCorticelli antique gold finished with varnish and you can't really see theguide foot color thru the varnish as it is a carmel color. In that way thecustomer can pick out what's desired and there'll be no surprises.Ray----- Original Message ----- Subject: transparent wraps I have used semi transparent silk wraps on all of my bamboo (nylonthread on fiberglass / graphite doesn't seem to have have this problem)and love the look. I have been using Bellding Cortecelli antique goldwhich turns a beautiful semi transparent dark caramel color when I puthelmsman spar urethane over it without color preserver. I have hadsomeone ask that the wraps not be semi transparent i.e. they don't wantto see the guide feet and ferrule crowns.How do I go about that? A graphite building friend suggested justkeep applying layers of thread till it isn't clear anymore, but thatsounds unrealistic. Shawn from caneman@clnk.com Tue Apr 4 13:08:17 2000 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35)with SMTP id com; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 13:04:45 -0500 Subject: Re: transparent wraps One more option, Shawn... find the color you want in NCP nylon thread anduse that. doesn't change color under varnish, and looks OK... not as niceas 6/0 silk, but if wrapped good, looks very good. Gary Howells, Winston,and others use NCP Nylon and their rods are "classy" to say the least. Bob-----Original Message----- Subject: transparent wraps I have used semi transparent silk wraps on all of my bamboo (nylonthread on fiberglass / graphite doesn't seem to have have this problem)and love the look. I have been using Bellding Cortecelli antique goldwhich turns a beautiful semi transparent dark caramel color when I puthelmsman spar urethane over it without color preserver. I have hadsomeone ask that the wraps not be semi transparent i.e. they don't wantto see the guide feet and ferrule crowns.How do I go about that? A graphite building friend suggested justkeep applying layers of thread till it isn't clear anymore, but thatsounds unrealistic. Shawn from steve@hamiltonrods.com Tue Apr 4 13:39:45 2000 codemarine.209.170.128.193 with SMTP (MicrosoftExchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2448.0) Subject: Re: transparent wraps When building my first rod, I was unaware that the wrap colors woulddarken when varnished. D'oh!! I ended upbuying additional, lighter colored thread so that it would darken to thedesired color. But I also did severalcolor preserver tests with wraps on top of an already varnished blank. Itried head cement among other things,but ended up using nail polish thinned significantly with nail polishremover (something like 70% remover to30% polish). The nail polish applicator brush was nice to work with andcolor preservation was pretty darngood--only very slight darkening with little or no seeping. Keep in mindthat I was varnishing the wraps aftervarnishing the blanks, tho. What I didn't like about my color preserver treatment was the fact thatthe preserver (i.e. thinned nailpolish) prevented the top coats of varnish from fully bonding the wraps tothe blank. I expected the headcement to bond the wraps to the varnished blank, but it only did a partialjob. Using an xacto knife, I wasactually able to cut through the wraps and peel them off in one neat strip--not exactly a great bond with theblank. In fact, on a couple of the guides wrapped with color preserver, Inoticed that I could actually slidethe guide back and forth a bit underneath the wrap. I was able to fix that glue between the guide foot and the blank--but I concluded that my ownpreference will be to use a lightercolored thread with no preserver and let it darken and become translucent.It's an acquired taste perhaps, butI like the look. Well, actually, I don't like the look of the ferrule tabsunderneath the wraps, but I'll justuse black thread! --Steve ----- Original Message ----- Subject: transparent wraps I have used semi transparent silk wraps on all of my bamboo (nylonthread on fiberglass / graphite doesn't seem to have have this problem)and love the look. I have been using Bellding Cortecelli antique goldwhich turns a beautiful semi transparent dark caramel color when I puthelmsman spar urethane over it without color preserver. I have hadsomeone ask that the wraps not be semi transparent i.e. they don't wantto see the guide feet and ferrule crowns.How do I go about that? A graphite building friend suggested justkeep applying layers of thread till it isn't clear anymore, but thatsounds unrealistic. Shawn from mep@mint.net Tue Apr 4 15:20:49 2000 Tue, 4 Apr 2000 16:20:38 -0400 Subject: Re: transparent wraps What I do is apply a clear latex based "varnish" over the silk. The varnishthen goes on over that. I use Benjamin Moore Interior. It's water based. Ihad a can left over when I built the house ten years ago and am still usingit. I thin it 50/50 with water. It will darken the thread so try some on afew practice wraps on a left over piece of bamboo first The wraps willturnout opaque. Shawn Pineo wrote: I have used semi transparent silk wraps on all of my bamboo (nylonthread on fiberglass / graphite doesn't seem to have have this problem)and love the look. I have been using Bellding Cortecelli antique goldwhich turns a beautiful semi transparent dark caramel color when I puthelmsman spar urethane over it without color preserver. I have hadsomeone ask that the wraps not be semi transparent i.e. they don't wantto see the guide feet and ferrule crowns.How do I go about that? A graphite building friend suggested justkeep applying layers of thread till it isn't clear anymore, but thatsounds unrealistic. Shawn from nsflyrods@ns.sympatico.ca Tue Apr 4 15:32:50 2000 Tue, 4 Apr 2000 17:32:16 -0300 Subject: Re: transparent wraps Thanks everyone,all these methods are compatible with spar varnishbut how about spar urethane?I agree with Steve, the durability of a heated,thinned urethane coat that goes right through to the blank seems to morethanoffset the translucent effect! That way I know that the only way thethread iscoming off is to grind it off. Shawn mep wrote: What I do is apply a clear latex based "varnish" over the silk. The varnishthen goes on over that. I use Benjamin Moore Interior. It's water based. Ihad a can left over when I built the house ten years ago and am stillusingit. I thin it 50/50 with water. It will darken the thread so try some on afew practice wraps on a left over piece of bamboo first The wraps willturnout opaque. Shawn Pineo wrote: I have used semi transparent silk wraps on all of my bamboo (nylonthread on fiberglass / graphite doesn't seem to have have this problem)and love the look. I have been using Bellding Cortecelli antique goldwhich turns a beautiful semi transparent dark caramel color when I puthelmsman spar urethane over it without color preserver. I have hadsomeone ask that the wraps not be semi transparent i.e. they don'twantto see the guide feet and ferrule crowns.How do I go about that? A graphite building friend suggested justkeep applying layers of thread till it isn't clear anymore, but thatsounds unrealistic. Shawn from nsflyrods@ns.sympatico.ca Tue Apr 4 15:55:59 2000 2000 17:51:08 -0400 Subject: Robert Venneri's reel seats Just a quick note to say how happy I was to see Robert's reelseats arrive in my mailbox today! They are a true work of art. Roberthas found a happy, repeat customer in me! They are by far the nicestones I've seen (including the Bellinger, Sage and Struble ones I nowhave).Once again, no commercial interest, just due credit for a very,very good product and a super guy to deal with!Shawn PineoNew Scotland FlyRods from rmoon@ida.net Tue Apr 4 16:00:28 2000 0000 Subject: Re: Planing The replies from Bob and Shawn will probably be the answer to yourproblem, but i would add the caveat that this is most dangerous.. Morethan once I have sliced four fingers nearly to the bone. You should tryto hold the strip with something other than your hand. An eraser,finger cots, rubbergloves, kevlar gloves--it doesn't matter much as longas you have more friction on the strip. Then if it does slide all isnot delayed while the surgeon sews the ends of your fingers back on.But above all use a really sharp blade and take a thin cut.Ralph from caneman@clnk.com Tue Apr 4 16:25:58 2000 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35)with SMTP id com; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 16:22:26 -0500 Subject: Re: Planing Ralph,You are absolutely right about using something on your fingers. Ididn't say anything, because I am the worlds worst about NOT usinganything.Just a mental thing, I guess, but I like to feel the bamboo in the forms.Unfortunately, my fingers have been cut so many times during finalplaningthat most times they don't even bleed anymore. This is not a good thing! Iguess the scar tissue has built up to the point that it has to go prettydeep before I bring blood these days...SO.... all of you out there that are just starting out... use gloves orfinger cots, or erasers or something to keep that strip from slipping in theforms, lest your fingertips become scarred up and lacking sensitivity likemine. Bob -----Original Message----- rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Subject: Re: Planing The replies from Bob and Shawn will probably be the answer to yourproblem, but i would add the caveat that this is most dangerous.. Morethan once I have sliced four fingers nearly to the bone. You should tryto hold the strip with something other than your hand. An eraser,finger cots, rubbergloves, kevlar gloves--it doesn't matter much as longas you have more friction on the strip. Then if it does slide all isnot delayed while the surgeon sews the ends of your fingers back on.But above all use a really sharp blade and take a thin cut.Ralph from nsflyrods@ns.sympatico.ca Tue Apr 4 16:45:55 2000 Tue, 4 Apr 2000 18:45:18 -0300 Subject: Re: Planing Ralph,Sagely Advice!! Nothing sucks worse than being bandaged up andhaving a rod half planed out, sitting there mocking, taunting.... Ahhhooops, I was getting carried away there for a second. You get the pointthough.I still plane with bare finger but I've learned to go slow, takingthin shavings and have acquired a keen sense of feel for when the rod isabout to slip! It's a miracle that I can feel anything through the scartissue on my finger tips! ;^) Shawn Ralph W Moon wrote: The replies from Bob and Shawn will probably be the answer to yourproblem, but i would add the caveat that this is most dangerous.. Morethan once I have sliced four fingers nearly to the bone. You should tryto hold the strip with something other than your hand. An eraser,finger cots, rubbergloves, kevlar gloves--it doesn't matter much as longas you have more friction on the strip. Then if it does slide all isnot delayed while the surgeon sews the ends of your fingers back on.But above all use a really sharp blade and take a thin cut.Ralph from punky@integratedmillsystems.com Tue Apr 4 16:54:35 2000 Subject: Re: Planing Hope that doesn't mean you're losing your touch! ;-) Keith SO.... all of you out there that are just starting out... use gloves orfinger cots, or erasers or something to keep that strip from slipping intheforms, lest your fingertips become scarred up and lacking sensitivity likemine. from dmanders@telusplanet.net Tue Apr 4 17:22:09 2000 hme0.telusplanet.net(InterMail vM.4.01.02.11 201-229-116-111) with SMTP Tue, 4 Apr 2000 16:22:06 -0600 Subject: Re: transparent wraps Shawn, I usually test my wrap choices in the area where the cork grip is mounted.That way you know the blank vs thread color and cover the testing areawithcork. Donhttp://www.telusplanet.net/public/dmanders/index.html from if6were9@bellsouth.net Tue Apr 4 17:22:42 2000 SAA19610; Subject: Re: Wrap colors If you want a real nice effect for a flamed rod, get a spool of white threadand some yellow, red, and blacksharpies. Mark up the thread with the sharpies and wrap. With a bit ofpractice you can come up with somevery nice looking flamed thread wraps. Finish without colorpreserver and the white thread disappears leaving only the color behind. from nobler@satx.rr.com Tue Apr 4 17:23:56 2000 SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.357.35);Tue, 4 Apr 2000 17:24:46 -0500 Subject: Re: Robert Venneri's reel seats boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0015_01BF9E5A.DF568DA0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0015_01BF9E5A.DF568DA0 Robert who ? Where ?. etc. ? GMA Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2000 4:51 PMSubject: Robert Venneri's reel seats Just a quick note to say how happy I was to see Robert's reelseats arrive in my mailbox today! They are a true work of art. Roberthas found a happy, repeat customer in me! They are by far the nicestones I've seen (including the Bellinger, Sage and Struble ones I nowhave).Once again, no commercial interest, just due credit for a very,very good product and a super guy to deal with!Shawn PineoNew Scotland =FlyRods ------=_NextPart_000_0015_01BF9E5A.DF568DA0 Robert who ? Where ?. etc. ? GMA ----- Original Message ----- Shawn Pineo = Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2000 = PMSubject: Robert Venneri's seats = happy I was to see Robert's reelseats arrive in my mailbox today! = a true work of art. Roberthas found a happy, repeat customer in = are by far the nicestones I've seen (including the Bellinger, Sage = commercial interest, just due credit for a very,very good product = = = New Scotland FlyRods ------=_NextPart_000_0015_01BF9E5A.DF568DA0-- from caneman@clnk.com Tue Apr 4 17:34:10 2000 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35)with SMTP id com; Tue, 4 Apr 2000 17:30:37 -0500 "Rod Makers List Serve" Subject: Re: Planing Keith,Only with the ladies, it would seem! LOL -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Planing Hope that doesn't mean you're losing your touch! ;-) Keith SO.... all of you out there that are just starting out... use glovesorfinger cots, or erasers or something to keep that strip from slipping intheforms, lest your fingertips become scarred up and lacking sensitivitylikemine. from nsflyrods@ns.sympatico.ca Tue Apr 4 18:10:20 2000 Tue, 4 Apr 2000 20:09:39 -0300 Subject: Re: Robert Venneri's reel seats boundary="------------E2A7287AEAA6614C21DD1147" --------------E2A7287AEAA6614C21DD1147 Robert Vennarirvennari@ulster.nethttp://www.ulster.net/~rvennari/index.html Someone correct me if this is wrong, but I think these are thecontacts Shawn. nobler wrote: Robert who ? Where ?. etc. ? GMA ----- Original Message -----From: Shawn Pineo Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2000 4:51 PMSubject: Robert Venneri's reel seatsJust a quick note to say how happy I was to seeRobert's reelseats arrive in my mailbox today! They are a true work ofart. Roberthas found a happy, repeat customer in me! They are by farthe nicestones I've seen (including the Bellinger, Sage and Strubleones I nowhave).Once again, no commercial interest, just due credit very good product and a super guy to deal with!ShawnPineoNewScotland FlyRods --------------E2A7287AEAA6614C21DD1147 Robert Vennarirvennari@ulster.nethttp://www.ulster.net/~rvennari/index.html are the contacts Shawn.nobler wrote: ----- Original Message ----- From:ShawnPineo Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2000 4:51PM Subject: Robert Venneri's reelseats I was to see Robert's reelseats arrive in my mailbox today! They are a true work of art. Roberthas found a happy, repeat customer in me! They are by far the nicestones I've seen (including the Bellinger, Sage and Struble ones I nowhave). just due credit for a very,very good product and a super guy to deal with! Shawn Pineo New Scotland FlyRods --------------E2A7287AEAA6614C21DD1147-- from rmoon@ida.net Tue Apr 4 18:15:44 2000 0000 Subject: Re: Planing BobHow do you measure with all that scar tissue. My fingers are my #1micrometer. I think that you should try to sand the callouses and scartissue off with 80 grit sandpaper. I am like you though, I do not like anything on my hands, and everytimeI am teaching someone how to plane it is "do as I say, Not as I do." Ralph from Nodewrrior@aol.com Tue Apr 4 18:35:00 2000 Subject: Jekyl/Hyde Gillum Forgive me, but when I happen to come across a unique taper, I alwayshave to blab on the list...Just casted the 7'8" 3pc Gillum on page 49 of Howell's "The Lovely Reed".It throws the DT#5 beautifully, downright gracefully for such a powerfulrod. Then the 6...wow. The rod casts the 6 like a fiend, a ton of thrust and dead smooth. It's really hard to decide which line is better, kind of like the Winston 7'9"4/5 quad. He's to be my small creek smallmouth rod, not what I'd use foreveryday dry fly fishing, but good for streamers and nymphs. But its got me looking forward to the Hex hatch at Grayrock 2000!I took off the recommended 6 thou for varnish, and made the tip to .070(w/o varnish) Thank you for the bandwidth,, Rob Hoffhines from rclarke@eou.edu Tue Apr 4 19:25:02 2000 17:24:33 -0700 "rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu" Subject: RE: Planing Dirk, it could also be that the strips are too wide. They need to sit downin the form a fair way for them tobe held in place when you pass the plane over them. I had a similar problem when I started, and (with some great advice fromthe list) after I split them smaller,was able to plane the strips much nicer. If they are wide, that is probablythe biggest contributor to yourproblem in my opinion. Best of luck, Robert Clarkecathcreek@hotmail.com -----Original Message----- Subject: Planing I hope that you can help me with a problem building my first rod. I can notseem to hold the bamboo split inthe planing form without it slipping once I start planing. How do I hold itstill? Please help. Thanks, Dirk de Villiers from HomeyDKlown@worldnet.att.net Tue Apr 4 20:12:08 2000 (InterMail vM.4.01.02.39 201-229-119-122) with ESMTP ;Wed, 5 Apr 2000 01:11:34 +0000 Subject: Re: Robert Venneri's reel seats Guys, Bob's address is rvenneri@ulster.net. His name is spelt RobertVenneri, and he and John Miller make a bunch of awesome products! Dennis PS: No interest other than a satisfied customer, blah, blah... Shawn Pineo wrote: Robert Vennarirvennari@ulster.nethttp://www.ulster.net/~rvennari/index.html Someone correct me if this is wrong, but I think these are thecontacts Shawn. nobler wrote: Robert who ? Where ?. etc. ? GMA ----- Original Message -----From: Shawn Pineo Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2000 4:51 PMSubject: Robert Venneri's reel seatsJust a quick note to say how happy I was to seeRobert's reelseats arrive in my mailbox today! They are a true work ofart. Roberthas found a happy, repeat customer in me! They are by farthe nicestones I've seen (including the Bellinger, Sage and Strubleones I nowhave).Once again, no commercial interest, just due credit very good product and a super guy to deal with! Shawn PineoNewScotland FlyRods from nsflyrods@ns.sympatico.ca Tue Apr 4 21:24:44 2000 Tue, 4 Apr 2000 23:24:10 -0300 Subject: Re: Robert Venneri's reel seats OOOps,sorry on the typoShawn Dennis Haftel wrote: Guys, Bob's address is rvenneri@ulster.net. His name is spelt RobertVenneri, and he and John Miller make a bunch of awesome products! Dennis PS: No interest other than a satisfied customer, blah, blah... Shawn Pineo wrote: Robert Vennarirvennari@ulster.nethttp://www.ulster.net/~rvennari/index.html Someone correct me if this is wrong, but I think these are thecontacts Shawn. nobler wrote: Robert who ? Where ?. etc. ? GMA ----- Original Message -----From: Shawn Pineo Sent: Tuesday, April 04, 2000 4:51 PMSubject: Robert Venneri's reel seatsJust a quick note to say how happy I was to seeRobert's reelseats arrive in my mailbox today! They are a true work ofart. Roberthas found a happy, repeat customer in me! They are by farthe nicestones I've seen (including the Bellinger, Sage and Strubleones I nowhave).Once again, no commercial interest, just due credit very good product and a super guy to deal with! Shawn PineoNewScotland FlyRods from Michael.Roberts@health.wa.gov.au Tue Apr 4 21:33:42 2000 E-Mail VirusWall NT); Wed, 05 Apr 200010:32:29 +0800 (5.5.2651.58) rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: RE: Planing Hi Dirk,one solution I came up with, before I completely destroyed thefingers on my left hand, was to make my strips six or eight inches longerthan I needed. Being one of those psychotic types who chooses to buildnodeless, this poses no problem. I then placed a VERY strong spring clampat the end of the strip to hold it in the form and planed away, swappingsides every couple of passes until I was done. It's a bit fiddly andprobably doesn't look too professional but it does the job. You end up witha swelled "butt" on all sections but this is cut off as excess.Having said all this, I tend to agree that VERY SHARP planeblades and not trying to take off too much material at once are the mostimportant things. Good luck Mike -----Original Message----- Subject: Planing I hope that you can help me with a problem building my first rod. I can notseem to hold the bamboo split in the planing form without it slipping onceIstart planing. How do I hold it still? Please help. Thanks, Dirk de Villiers from DNHayashida@aol.com Wed Apr 5 00:02:10 2000 Subject: Fwd: Post boundary="part1_1a.1bfe6f2.261c22ae_boundary" --part1_1a.1bfe6f2.261c22ae_boundary I was asked by Mark to forward this to the List. I'm only the messenger,if you have any comments please send to him at Bam-fly@pacbell.net.Darryl --part1_1a.1bfe6f2.261c22ae_boundary 19:07:41 -0400 byrly-yh02.mx.aol.com (v71.10) with ESMTP; Tue, 04 Apr 2000 19:07:29- 0400 sims.3.5.2000.01.05.12.18.p9)with ESMTP id forDNHayashida@aol.com; Subject: Post Organization: Pacific Bell Internet Services The Bamboo Fly Rod magazine is not, repeat not, going out of business.We are currently in the process of refinancing and then we will publishagain. If you have any questions by all means contact our offices.Thank You. TBFR --part1_1a.1bfe6f2.261c22ae_boundary-- from steve@hamiltonrods.com Wed Apr 5 06:18:31 2000 Subject: Re: Post I sure hope the magazine works out--I'll certainly subscribe when it does.But while the financing is gettingworked out, the only honest thing to do is *immediately* refundeveryone's unused subscription money--or atleast send all paid subscribers a letter giving them the option to get theirmoney back. To do otherwise isdishonest and classless. I admit those are fairly sharp words, but imagine a rodbuilder taking fullpayment from hundreds of peoplepromising to build each of them a bamboo rod and then spending the moneywithout delivering the rods or eveninforming those customers when/if the rods would ever be built. --Steve ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Fwd: Post I was asked by Mark to forward this to the List. I'm only the messenger,if you have any comments please send to him at Bam-fly@pacbell.net.Darryl from sniderja@email.uc.edu Wed Apr 5 07:56:23 2000 Subject: Re: Post It IS frustrating for most of us to watch what many feel is apparently theslow demise of The Bamboo Fly Rod Magazine. I, too, am frustrated, havinginvested monies for subscriptions, etc. Since it IS an entrepreneurialenterprise, folks who have subscribed have legitimate complaints. Manyofus who don't like these criticisms do so simply because anything to dowithbamboo rods we feel is a labor of passion and should be encouragedregardless. A similar situation existed way back in the early years ofThe Fly Fisherman magazine when it was a one man operation working outofSt. Louis (back when it was still considered a novelty to be a fly fisher,let alone to use a bamboo fly rod) and still an interesting magazine. Itwas existing from hand to mouth.Obviously, bamboo rod makers are a patient lot by their nature (certainly,I am an exception to this, usually providing knee-jerk reactions when Ishouldn't). However, having said that, I just wish that Mark were morecentrally located. Even though it is a business venture I, for one, wouldbe happy to volunteer my time (and any minor talents I may have) to seethat the magazine is successful--whether this be wrapping copies forshipment, (yes, even licking stamps!), sorting, doing minor (very!)editing, helping with the web site, etc. However, I certainly draw the lineat moving to (shudder!!) California in order to do this (just kidding,folks!). My simple- minded rationale for this is that since it has to dowith bamboo fly rods, it MUST be a good thing! I fear to see the day whenwe will outgrow this--and it likely WILL come to pass.Sorry for the bandwidth, but passion sometimes overcomes good sense.J. Snider At 07:19 AM 04/05/2000 -0400, Steve Zimmerman wrote:I sure hope the magazine works out--I'll certainly subscribe when itdoes. But while the financing is getting worked out, the only honest thing to do is *immediately* refund everyone's unused subscription money--or atleast send all paid subscribers a letter giving them the option to get theirmoney back. To do otherwise is dishonest and classless. I admit those are fairly sharp words, but imagine a rodbuilder taking full payment from hundreds of people promising to build each of them abamboo rod and then spending the money without delivering the rods or eveninforming those customers when/if the rods would ever be built. --Steve ----- Original Message ----- From: Sent: Wednesday, April 05, 2000 1:01 AMSubject: Fwd: Post I was asked by Mark to forward this to the List. I'm only the messenger,if you have any comments please send to him at Bam-fly@pacbell.net.Darryl from Eastkoyfly@aol.com Wed Apr 5 07:57:35 2000 Subject: Re: Post Darryl,Why can't Mark speak for himself? from Canerods@aol.com Wed Apr 5 08:27:11 2000 Subject: Grayrock? All, What's the status of the Grayrock 2000 get-together? What's the dates, etc, etc..... Don Burns from nobler@satx.rr.com Wed Apr 5 08:33:40 2000 SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.357.35);Wed, 5 Apr 2000 08:21:57 -0500 Subject: Re: Post boundary="----=_NextPart_000_005C_01BF9ED9.F518D380" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_005C_01BF9ED9.F518D380 I think you echo many of our feelings Jerry ! I've been on the down side =of a corp., simply because of lack of backing/cash flow, when interest =rates were over 20%. I also know that being up front, can often be of =huge benefit ! His failure to even fill back issue, paid orders, leaves =much doubt ! GMA Sent: Wednesday, April 05, 2000 7:58 AMSubject: Re: Post It IS frustrating for most of us to watch what many feel is apparently =theslow demise of The Bamboo Fly Rod Magazine. I, too, am frustrated, =havinginvested monies for subscriptions, etc. Since it IS an entrepreneurialenterprise, folks who have subscribed have legitimate complaints. =Many ofus who don't like these criticisms do so simply because anything to do =withbamboo rods we feel is a labor of passion and should be encouragedregardless. A similar situation existed way back in the early years =ofThe Fly Fisherman magazine when it was a one man operation workingout =ofSt. Louis (back when it was still considered a novelty to be a fly =fisher,let alone to use a bamboo fly rod) and still an interesting magazine. =Itwas existing from hand to mouth.Obviously, bamboo rod makers are a patient lot by their nature =(certainly,I am an exception to this, usually providing knee-jerk reactions when =Ishouldn't). However, having said that, I just wish that Mark were morecentrally located. Even though it is a business venture I, for one, =wouldbe happy to volunteer my time (and any minor talents I may have) to =seethat the magazine is successful--whether this be wrapping copies forshipment, (yes, even licking stamps!), sorting, doing minor (very!)editing, helping with the web site, etc. However, I certainly draw the =lineat moving to (shudder!!) California in order to do this (just kidding,folks!). My simple- minded rationale for this is that since it has to =dowith bamboo fly rods, it MUST be a good thing! I fear to see the day =whenwe will outgrow this--and it likely WILL come to pass.Sorry for the bandwidth, but passion sometimes overcomes good sense.J. Snider At 07:19 AM 04/05/2000 -0400, Steve Zimmerman wrote:I sure hope the magazine works out--I'll certainly subscribe when it = But while the financing is getting worked out, the only honest thing = is *immediately* refund everyone's unused subscription money--or at = send all paid subscribers a letter giving them the option to get = back. To do otherwise is dishonest and classless. I admit those are fairly sharp words, but imagine a rodbuilder taking = payment from hundreds of people promising to build each of them a = and then spending the money without delivering the rods or even = those customers when/if the rods would ever be built. --Steve From: Sent: Wednesday, April 05, 2000 1:01 AMSubject: Fwd: Post I was asked by Mark to forward this to the List. I'm only the =messenger,if you have any comments please send to him at Bam-fly@pacbell.net.Darryl ------=_NextPart_000_005C_01BF9ED9.F518D380 I think you echo many of our feelings Jerry ! I've been on = side of a corp., simply because of lack of backing/cash flow, when = rates were over 20%. I also know that being up front, can often be of = doubt ! GMA ----- Original Message ----- Snider = Cc: Bam-fly@pacbell.net Sent: Wednesday, April 05, 2000= AMSubject: Re: PostIt IS frustrating for most of us to watch what many = apparently theslow demise of The Bamboo Fly Rod Magazine. I, too, = frustrated, havinginvested monies for subscriptions, etc. Since it = complaints. Many ofus who don't like these criticisms do so simply = anything to do withbamboo rods we feel is a labor of passion and = = the early years ofThe Fly Fisherman magazine when it was a one man= operation working out ofSt. Louis (back when it was still = novelty to be a fly fisher,let alone to use a bamboo fly rod) and = interesting magazine. Itwas existing from hand to = bamboo rod makers are a patient lot by their nature (certainly,I = exception to this, usually providing knee-jerk reactions when = However, having said that, I just wish that Mark were = located. Even though it is a business venture I, for one, wouldbe = volunteer my time (and any minor talents I may have) to seethat = magazine is successful--whether this be wrapping copies = even licking stamps!), sorting, doing minor (very!)editing, = (shudder!!) California in order to do this (just kidding,folks!). = simple-minded rationale for this is that since it has to dowith = rods, it MUST be a good thing! I fear to see the day whenwe will = this--and it likely WILL come to pass.Sorry for the bandwidth, but = sometimes overcomes good sense.J. SniderAt 07:19 AM = = subscribers a letter giving them the option to get their money = fairly sharp words, but imagine a rodbuilder taking full = hundreds of people promising to build each of them a bamboo rod = then spending the money without delivering the rods or even <rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= to him at Bam- ------=_NextPart_000_005C_01BF9ED9.F518D380-- from ernie2@pacbell.net Wed Apr 5 08:58:24 2000 sims.3.5.2000.01.05.12.18.p9)with SMTP id for Subject: Re: Post rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Hi Jerry,I didn't know Mark was located in California, what city? I don't knowhow many subscriptions he has, do you know how many people belong tothislist? He obviously isn't trying to make a living from the magazine. Iwonder if there is enough material on bamboo rod building to sustain amagazine. How often is it supposed to be published? trout. It takes years to grow large trout in the rivers and streams whichare not very alkaline, but we have the Sierra Nevada Mountains with 400miles on the Western side and 400 miles on the Eastern side and some ofthewildest and most beautiful country you will ever see. ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Post It IS frustrating for most of us to watch what many feel is apparentlytheslow demise of The Bamboo Fly Rod Magazine. I, too, am frustrated,havinginvested monies for subscriptions, etc. Since it IS an entrepreneurialenterprise, folks who have subscribed have legitimate complaints. Manyofus who don't like these criticisms do so simply because anything to dowithbamboo rods we feel is a labor of passion and should be encouragedregardless. A similar situation existed way back in the early years ofThe Fly Fisherman magazine when it was a one man operation workingout ofSt. Louis (back when it was still considered a novelty to be a fly fisher,let alone to use a bamboo fly rod) and still an interesting magazine. Itwas existing from hand to mouth.Obviously, bamboo rod makers are a patient lot by their nature(certainly,I am an exception to this, usually providing knee-jerk reactions when Ishouldn't). However, having said that, I just wish that Mark were morecentrally located. Even though it is a business venture I, for one, wouldbe happy to volunteer my time (and any minor talents I may have) to seethat the magazine is successful--whether this be wrapping copies forshipment, (yes, even licking stamps!), sorting, doing minor (very!)editing, helping with the web site, etc. However, I certainly draw thelineat moving to (shudder!!) California in order to do this (just kidding,folks!). My simple- minded rationale for this is that since it has to dowith bamboo fly rods, it MUST be a good thing! I fear to see the day whenwe will outgrow this--and it likely WILL come to pass.Sorry for the bandwidth, but passion sometimes overcomes good sense.J. Snider from DNHayashida@aol.com Wed Apr 5 09:20:11 2000 Subject: Re: Post Darryl,Why can't Mark speak for himself? He is not subscribed on Rodmakers, and the wayMike Biondo has the list set up, only subscriberscan post on it.Darryl from mcanultj@svm.vetmed.wisc.edu Wed Apr 5 09:34:49 2000 Wed, 5 Apr 2000 09:31:15 -0500 R8.31.00.5) Subject: Re[2]: Planing As a relative newbie compared to many on this list, I would add that I had this problem as well. It was from too thick cuts but was also caused by too fast planing. For some reason I seemed to want to just zip the strips off. I found that slowing down the stroke eliminated most of this problem and gave me much more control.$0.02Jon ______________________________ Reply Separator_________________________________Subject: RE: Planing Author: at Internet-Mail Hi Dirk,one solution I came up with, before I completely destroyed thefingers on my left hand, was to make my strips six or eight inches longer than I needed. Being one of those psychotic types who chooses to build nodeless, this poses no problem. I then placed a VERY strong spring clamp at the end of the strip to hold it in the form and planed away, swapping sides every couple of passes until I was done. It's a bit fiddly and probably doesn't look too professional but it does the job. You end up with a swelled "butt" on all sections but this is cut off as excess.Having said all this, I tend to agree that VERY SHARP planeblades and not trying to take off too much material at once are the most important things. Good luck Mike -----Original Message----- Subject: Planing I hope that you can help me with a problem building my first rod. I can not seem to hold the bamboo split in the planing form without it slipping onceI start planing. How do I hold it still? Please help. Thanks, Dirk de Villiers from DNHayashida@aol.com Wed Apr 5 09:49:56 2000 Subject: Re: Post Jerry Snider writes:However, having said that, I just wish that Mark were morecentrally located. Even though it is a business venture I, for one, wouldbe happy to volunteer my time (and any minor talents I may have) to seethat the magazine is successful The No. 1 thing the people on this list can do iswrite articles for the magazine. Magazines are made upof (surprise!) articles. People buy magazines to readthem. Have you ever seen Woodworker magazine? It hasa community of ordinary woodworkers contributing tothe content in every issue. Contributions can range from a picture and a paragraph of your latest completedrod to fishing trips (with a bamboo rod of course) tofull blown multipage articles. And, let me stress this,not only on rod making. We recently had a flurry ofposts on a mint Hardy. That would make a nice article.Instead of standing by and watching, take an active roleand contribute! I have. All the way from cleaning outthe warehouse to building workbenches to reviewingsubmitted articles.Darryl from sniderja@email.uc.edu Wed Apr 5 10:19:01 2000 rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Subject: Re: Post Oops! Perhaps I am mistaken about the location? If so, sorry. As abotanist, over the years I have done a considerable amount of plant studiesin California. The wild country I love--the cities are like any other(smile!). Now if only Mark Metcalf were located in Montana... ! At 06:39 AM 04/05/2000 -0700, Ernie Harrison wrote:Hi Jerry,I didn't know Mark was located in California, what city? I don't knowhow many subscriptions he has, do you know how many people belong tothislist? He obviously isn't trying to make a living from the magazine. Iwonder if there is enough material on bamboo rod building to sustain amagazine. How often is it supposed to be published? trout. It takes years to grow large trout in the rivers and streams whichare not very alkaline, but we have the Sierra Nevada Mountains with 400miles on the Western side and 400 miles on the Eastern side and some ofthewildest and most beautiful country you will ever see. ----- Original Message -----From: "Jerry Snider" Cc: Sent: Wednesday, April 05, 2000 5:58 AMSubject: Re: Post It IS frustrating for most of us to watch what many feel is apparentlytheslow demise of The Bamboo Fly Rod Magazine. I, too, am frustrated,havinginvested monies for subscriptions, etc. Since it IS an entrepreneurialenterprise, folks who have subscribed have legitimate complaints.Many ofus who don't like these criticisms do so simply because anything to dowithbamboo rods we feel is a labor of passion and should be encouragedregardless. A similar situation existed way back in the early years ofThe Fly Fisherman magazine when it was a one man operation workingout ofSt. Louis (back when it was still considered a novelty to be a fly fisher,let alone to use a bamboo fly rod) and still an interesting magazine. Itwas existing from hand to mouth.>> Obviously, bamboo rod makers are apatient lot by their nature (certainly,I am an exception to this, usually providing knee-jerk reactions when Ishouldn't). However, having said that, I just wish that Mark were morecentrally located. Even though it is a business venture I, for one, wouldbe happy to volunteer my time (and any minor talents I may have) to seethat the magazine is successful--whether this be wrapping copies forshipment, (yes, even licking stamps!), sorting, doing minor (very!)editing, helping with the web site, etc. However, I certainly draw thelineat moving to (shudder!!) California in order to do this (just kidding,folks!). My simple- minded rationale for this is that since it has to dowith bamboo fly rods, it MUST be a good thing! I fear to see the daywhenwe will outgrow this--and it likely WILL come to pass.Sorry for the bandwidth, but passion sometimes overcomes good sense.J. Snider from michael@wugate.wustl.edu Wed Apr 5 10:22:01 2000 Subject: Re: Grayrock? Don asks... What's the status of the Grayrock 2000 get-together? What's the dates, etc, etc..... Yes Grayrock2000 is definitely a go. *Official* date is the weekend ofJune 24th. However, folks will start showing up as early as June 18th fora full week of fun&frolic, fishing&fishstories, eating&homebrew...oh yeah,some rodmaking too! Other highlights include the Rodmakers Rod Raffle, TroutBumBBQ, SportingFlies competition and JackPineSavage Spotting. For more informationcheckout:http://www.troutbums.com/ More details will be forthcoming as the time draws near. Hope to see y'allthere... Mike BiondoRODMAKERS Listguy from kbuch@mail.stlnet.com Wed Apr 5 10:22:30 2000 Subject: Re: Post Darryl, Your reply, to Jerry's comments, hits the long ball. There is no betterplace to expect the articles to come from than the users of this list.In addition, it would be a good network source for Mark to be a part of,if he is truly concerned for the future of his magazine. Regards, Kevin from sniderja@email.uc.edu Wed Apr 5 10:33:18 2000 Subject: Re: Post W -e-l-l Darryl, since you live nearby, you are most fortunate. However,since you have opened the door... . Mark and I have been negotiating onseveral fly fishing photographs. Some requested to be added to his webpage(at his request, not mine), some for purchase (at his request) to be usedin the magazine. Some of these were sent MONTHS ago (for the web site),and still have not shown up. He keeps informing me that he will get to it.We have communicated about release forms to the original photographerforpublishable photos, that they will be sent, etc., but nothing has yet cometo fruition. It DOES get frustrating! Why would one want to sell a photo(or submit an article) when it may not see the light of day for a couple ofYEARS? Get real here. (huge smile!). Nevertheless, I am TOTALLY and COMPLETELY supportive of Mark making ago ofit. Move to Montana, and when I retire next year I might just volunteer towork for free (articles, photographs, licking stamps, and all!)I have not simply been standing by and watching.J. Snider At 10:49 AM 04/05/2000 -0400, DNHayashida@aol.com wrote: Jerry Snider writes:However, having said that, I just wish that Mark were morecentrally located. Even though it is a business venture I, for one, wouldbe happy to volunteer my time (and any minor talents I may have) to seethat the magazine is successful The No. 1 thing the people on this list can do iswrite articles for the magazine. Magazines are made upof (surprise!) articles. People buy magazines to readthem. Have you ever seen Woodworker magazine? It hasa community of ordinary woodworkers contributing tothe content in every issue. Contributions can range from a picture and a paragraph of your latest completedrod to fishing trips (with a bamboo rod of course) tofull blown multipage articles. And, let me stress this,not only on rod making. We recently had a flurry ofposts on a mint Hardy. That would make a nice article.Instead of standing by and watching, take an active roleand contribute! I have. All the way from cleaning outthe warehouse to building workbenches to reviewingsubmitted articles.Darryl from DNHayashida@aol.com Wed Apr 5 10:37:53 2000 Subject: Re: Post Mark already gets a couple hundred emails a day.Subscribing to a list would make his mail volumealmost impossible to keep up with.Darryl Darryl, Your reply, to Jerry's comments, hits the long ball. There is no betterplace to expect the articles to come from than the users of this list.In addition, it would be a good network source for Mark to be a part of,if he is truly concerned for the future of his magazine. Regards, Kevin from mcdowellc@lanecc.edu Wed Apr 5 11:28:47 2000 9:29:32 PDT Subject: The Makers Magazine Maybe we could do a fundraiser for BFR along the same lines as the"makers" rod. Everyone could donate a page to the "makers" magazine and someonecould staple it all together, then raffle it with the proceeds going to the BFR. Chris from rclarke@eou.edu Wed Apr 5 11:49:56 2000 -0700 "RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.edu" Subject: RE: The Makers Magazine Great idea! Who donates the staples? Rob -----Original Message----- Subject: The Makers Magazine Maybe we could do a fundraiser for BFR along the same lines as the"makers" rod. Everyone could donate a page to the "makers" magazine and someonecould staple it all together, then raffle it with the proceeds going to the BFR. Chris from mcdowellc@lanecc.edu Wed Apr 5 11:54:27 2000 9:55:12 PDT Subject: Heddon Reelseat Hardware Follow-Up Well, I sit corrected. Initially I assumed the Heddon #17 reelseathardware I talked about earlier was not nickel silver because it wouldn't oxidize. Someone suggested that I be sure to clean it up first. I used steel wool to remove whatever was there back to bright hardware. Now it oxidized fine,so apparently even though the hardware color was worn or faded away, therewas still some kind of finish over the nickel silver. Chris from arnold.jl@pg.com Wed Apr 5 12:08:45 2000 notes082.na.pg.com [155.125.116.193] 1999)) id 852568B8.005E2B6D ; Wed, 5 Apr2000 13:08:35 -0400 Subject: Re: Post Darryl, everyone would agree that it is most important to have articlessubmitted to help with the magazine. The thing that is so frustrating isthatthere has been talk of the next issue stacked up in Mark's office formonths.Mostly what we heard was of logistics not being worked out, or not enoughof asupport staff-- not the lack of articles. I hope they can make a go of it, but it doesn't look good! Jeff Arnold Note: Sir D, please don't take this as a flame against you. (Just venting!) Internet Mail Message Received from host: wugate.wustl.edu [128.252.120.1] Envelope Sender: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Please respond to dnhayashida@aol.com Subject: Re: Post Jerry Snider writes:However, having said that, I just wish that Mark were morecentrally located. Even though it is a business venture I, for one, wouldbe happy to volunteer my time (and any minor talents I may have) to seethat the magazine is successful The No. 1 thing the people on this list can do iswrite articles for the magazine. Magazines are made upof (surprise!) articles. People buy magazines to readthem. Have you ever seen Woodworker magazine? It hasa community of ordinary woodworkers contributing tothe content in every issue. Contributions can range from a picture and a paragraph of your latest completedrod to fishing trips (with a bamboo rod of course) tofull blown multipage articles. And, let me stress this,not only on rod making. We recently had a flurry ofposts on a mint Hardy. That would make a nice article.Instead of standing by and watching, take an active roleand contribute! I have. All the way from cleaning outthe warehouse to building workbenches to reviewingsubmitted articles.Darryl from chris@artistree.com Wed Apr 5 14:03:06 2000 Subject: Re: Post Ernie...shhhhh! The Sierra Nevada with it's 2000 lakes, just as manystreams and 15 major river systems is not a secret you need to letEVERYONE on to. - - Chris Ernie Harrison wrote: wildtrout. It takes years to grow large trout in the rivers and streams whichare not very alkaline, but we have the Sierra Nevada Mountains with 400miles on the Western side and 400 miles on the Eastern side and some ofthewildest and most beautiful country you will ever see. from jpsnbs@erols.com Wed Apr 5 14:04:36 2000 ([207.172.93.113] helo=default) Subject: Lie Nielson Planes Anyone interested in buying a Lie Nielson Low Angle Plane, with extrairon,and/or a Lie Nielson Standard Angle Plane, with extra iron, contact me offlist. Although both are finely crafted tools, I prefer my old Record. Bothare NOT grooved. Sorry for taking up list space.Thanks, Joe Swam from chris@artistree.com Wed Apr 5 14:24:55 2000 Subject: Re: Post Now....Jerry. You need to come out and visit us in San Francisco. Thenumber 2 tourist's destination in the world behind Paris. BTW - if anyof you do decide to come be sure to visit the Golden Gate Angling &Casting Club ( http://www.ggacc.org ). The door and pools are open toall. Especially if you bring a cane rod. (smile) -- Best Regards, Chris Wohlfordemail: chris@artistree.com Jerry Snider wrote:The wild country I love--the cities are like any other... ! from DNHayashida@aol.com Wed Apr 5 14:51:17 2000 Subject: Re: Post As long as we are on the subject, I'd like to explainPostal permits for magazines. But, one of the qualifications to getting the permitis an inspector goes to the BFR office and randomlypicks out around 100 subscribers records. A certainnumber of them (I don't know exactly how many) haveto be paid in full. If not, the postal permit is notgranted. It then costs $1.53 to mail each magazine.Mark has been constantly on the phone and sending outpostcards because he needs to get the paid subscribernumber up. Believe it or not there are several hundredsubscribers who have received all of the first year'smagazines but haven't paid for that year, and sincethe subscriber base is relatively small, the unpaidsubscribers are a rather large percentage. Subscribermoney is not the cash that keeps a magazine going. Itis advertiser money. If companies do not advertise ina magazine, the magazine goes bust. But subscriberpayment is a factor that will get the magazines mailed.Darryl Darryl, everyone would agree that it is most important to have articlessubmitted to help with the magazine. The thing that is so frustrating isthatthere has been talk of the next issue stacked up in Mark's office formonths.Mostly what we heard was of logistics not being worked out, or notenough of asupport staff-- not the lack of articles. I hope they can make a go of it, but it doesn't look good! Jeff Arnold Note: Sir D, please don't take this as a flame against you. (Just venting!) Internet Mail Message Received from host: wugate.wustl.edu [128.252.120.1] Envelope Sender: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu From: dnhayashida@aol.com on 04/05/2000 10:49 AM Please respond to dnhayashida@aol.com cc: (bcc: Jeff Arnold-JL/PGI)Subject: Re: Post Jerry Snider writes:However, having said that, I just wish that Mark were morecentrally located. Even though it is a business venture I, for one, wouldbe happy to volunteer my time (and any minor talents I may have) toseethat the magazine is successful The No. 1 thing the people on this list can do iswrite articles for the magazine. Magazines are made upof (surprise!) articles. People buy magazines to readthem. Have you ever seen Woodworker magazine? It hasa community of ordinary woodworkers contributing tothe content in every issue. Contributions can range from a picture and a paragraph of your latest completedrod to fishing trips (with a bamboo rod of course) tofull blown multipage articles. And, let me stress this,not only on rod making. We recently had a flurry ofposts on a mint Hardy. That would make a nice article.Instead of standing by and watching, take an active roleand contribute! I have. All the way from cleaning outthe warehouse to building workbenches to reviewingsubmitted articles.Darryl from arnold.jl@pg.com Wed Apr 5 15:37:30 2000 notes082.na.pg.com [155.125.116.193] 1999)) id 852568B8.00714452 ; Wed, 5 Apr2000 16:37:10 -0400 Subject: Re: Post Darryl, thank you for the explanation! You have cleared up a great deal ofquestions that we have all had concerning the trouble with the BFR. It would have been great to hear this from Mark some 12 months ago! Jeff Internet Mail Message Received from host: wugate.wustl.edu [128.252.120.1] Envelope Sender: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Please respond to dnhayashida@aol.com Subject: Re: Post As long as we are on the subject, I'd like to explainPostal permits for magazines. But, one of the qualifications to getting the permitis an inspector goes to the BFR office and randomlypicks out around 100 subscribers records. A certainnumber of them (I don't know exactly how many) haveto be paid in full. If not, the postal permit is notgranted. It then costs $1.53 to mail each magazine.Mark has been constantly on the phone and sending outpostcards because he needs to get the paid subscribernumber up. Believe it or not there are several hundredsubscribers who have received all of the first year'smagazines but haven't paid for that year, and sincethe subscriber base is relatively small, the unpaidsubscribers are a rather large percentage. Subscribermoney is not the cash that keeps a magazine going. Itis advertiser money. If companies do not advertise ina magazine, the magazine goes bust. But subscriberpayment is a factor that will get the magazines mailed.Darryl Darryl, everyone would agree that it is most important to have articlessubmitted to help with the magazine. The thing that is so frustrating isthatthere has been talk of the next issue stacked up in Mark's office formonths.Mostly what we heard was of logistics not being worked out, or notenough of asupport staff-- not the lack of articles. I hope they can make a go of it, but it doesn't look good! Jeff Arnold Note: Sir D, please don't take this as a flame against you. (Just venting!) Internet Mail MessageReceived from host: wugate.wustl.edu[128.252.120.1] Envelope Sender: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu From: dnhayashida@aol.com on 04/05/2000 10:49 AM Please respond to dnhayashida@aol.com cc: (bcc: Jeff Arnold-JL/PGI)Subject: Re: Post Jerry Snider writes:However, having said that, I just wish that Mark were morecentrally located. Even though it is a business venture I, for one, wouldbe happy to volunteer my time (and any minor talents I may have) toseethat the magazine is successful The No. 1 thing the people on this list can do iswrite articles for the magazine. Magazines are made upof (surprise!) articles. People buy magazines to readthem. Have you ever seen Woodworker magazine? It hasa community of ordinary woodworkers contributing tothe content in every issue. Contributions can range from a picture and a paragraph of your latest completedrod to fishing trips (with a bamboo rod of course) tofull blown multipage articles. And, let me stress this,not only on rod making. We recently had a flurry ofposts on a mint Hardy. That would make a nice article.Instead of standing by and watching, take an active roleand contribute! I have. All the way from cleaning outthe warehouse to building workbenches to reviewingsubmitted articles.Darryl from Canerods@aol.com Wed Apr 5 16:00:00 2000 Subject: Re: Post All, I've met Mark and have had several conversations with him. He's a heck ofa nice guy and is driven to see this magazine succeed. I wish him well and won't attempt what he's trying to do. Over the years I have subscribed to a few startup magazines for small specialized markets. Most have failed or have been sold to largercompanies that used the customer list to sent out some other magazine with thehopes that a few would continue with thier own sub'ed magazine. So asking a small way underfunded magazine to refund your money isn'tvery smart unless you want them either go out of business or sell out. How would you like to find out that Bigmagazine.com has just purchasedBFR and they will send you 18 mts of their "Graphite Golf Club Shaftmaker"? If Mark folds up his tent and bales out - it's over folks! Got That!!! I doubt if anyone will ever again attempt to start a second bamboo rod magazine and then for many many years. (like forever!) The market is justtoo small. Look at how many fly fishing or fly tying magazines have failed! What's the income generated off something like "The Planing Forum"? Zip, point diddley! And that's not a full blown magazine. I doubt if Mark is getting rich off the dribbles of cash that comes in and to expect him to work for nothing would most likey make him laugh - he's no doubt got all of his worldly possessions poured into the magazine andhaving no income would be better than what's he's going through now. So what do we do? Hold you nose and write a check! Yes, that stinks! Yes, you've got issues or a refund due. Pony up folks! It's time to say to yourself - "Do I want a bamboo rod magazine bad enoughto chuck $25.00 or $30.00 more dollars away? If yes - send in a year's subscription money and write it off even if you don't ever get anything for your money. Then pray that Mark is dumb enough to keep on trying to pull it off. Yes, Pray. I'll bet that he's in it up to his eyebrows and most likely should just walk away. If he continued to eat rice and beans and do manage to get a couple of magazines published and gets some cash flow going - GREAT! Else - forget it. My $0.02 from the left coast! Don Burns PS - Not connected in any way with BFR except by subscribing. My secondcheck will go out this week. from dpeaston@wzrd.com Wed Apr 5 16:09:53 2000 Subject: Re: Post I must agree with Jerry. Nothing ventured nothing gained. I enjoyed theissues I got and I hope to enjoy more. I am not a masochist, just arealist. I would not expect to get my money back. At 07:19 AM 04/05/2000 -0400, Steve Zimmerman wrote:I sure hope the magazine works out--I'll certainly subscribe when itdoes. But while the financing is getting worked out, the only honest thing todo is *immediately* refund everyone's unused subscription money--or atleast send all paid subscribers a letter giving them the option to get theirmoney back. To do otherwise is dishonest and classless. I admit those are fairly sharp words, but imagine a rodbuilder takingfull payment from hundreds of people promising to build each of them abamboorod and then spending the money without delivering the rods or eveninforming those customers when/if the rods would ever be built. --Steve ----- Original Message ----- From: Sent: Wednesday, April 05, 2000 1:01 AMSubject: Fwd: Post I was asked by Mark to forward this to the List. I'm only themessenger,if you have any comments please send to him at Bam-fly@pacbell.net.Darryl Doug EastonTonawanda, NY from sniderja@email.uc.edu Wed Apr 5 16:14:53 2000 Subject: Re: Post I'm smiling.......since I really did put foot-in-mouth and asked for it!!Might just take you up on that offer, Chris. Certainly has to be betterthan Cincinnati, Ohio!!J. Snider At 12:25 PM 04/05/2000 -0700, Chris Wohlford wrote:Now....Jerry. You need to come out and visit us in San Francisco. Thenumber 2 tourist's destination in the world behind Paris. BTW - if anyof you do decide to come be sure to visit the Golden Gate Angling &Casting Club ( http://www.ggacc.org ). The door and pools are open toall. Especially if you bring a cane rod. (smile) -- Best Regards, Chris Wohlfordemail: chris@artistree.com Jerry Snider wrote:The wild country I love--the cities are like any other... ! from sniderja@email.uc.edu Wed Apr 5 16:17:21 2000 Subject: Re: Post Absolutely no disagreement here at all, Don. Well said!J. Snider At 04:59 PM 04/05/2000 -0400, Canerods@aol.com wrote:All, I've met Mark and have had several conversations with him. He's a heck ofa nice guy and is driven to see this magazine succeed. I wish him well and won't attempt what he's trying to do. Over the years I have subscribed to a few startup magazines for small specialized markets. Most have failed or have been sold to largercompanies that used the customer list to sent out some other magazine with thehopes that a few would continue with thier own sub'ed magazine. So asking a small way underfunded magazine to refund your money isn'tvery smart unless you want them either go out of business or sell out. How would you like to find out that Bigmagazine.com has just purchasedBFR and they will send you 18 mts of their "Graphite Golf Club Shaftmaker"? If Mark folds up his tent and bales out - it's over folks! Got That!!! I doubt if anyone will ever again attempt to start a second bamboo rod magazine and then for many many years. (like forever!) The market is justtoo small. Look at how many fly fishing or fly tying magazines have failed! What's the income generated off something like "The Planing Forum"? Zip, point diddley! And that's not a full blown magazine. I doubt if Mark is getting rich off the dribbles of cash that comes in andto expect him to work for nothing would most likey make him laugh - he's no doubt got all of his worldly possessions poured into the magazine andhaving no income would be better than what's he's going through now. So what do we do? Hold you nose and write a check! Yes, that stinks! Yes, you've got issues or a refund due. Pony up folks! It's time to say to yourself - "Do I want a bamboo rod magazine badenough to chuck $25.00 or $30.00 more dollars away? If yes - send in a year's subscription money and write it off even if you don't ever get anything for your money. Then pray that Mark is dumb enough to keep on trying to pull it off. Yes, Pray. I'll bet that he's in it up to his eyebrows and most likely should just walk away. If he continued to eat rice and beans and do manage to get a couple of magazines published and gets some cash flow going - GREAT! Else - forget it. My $0.02 from the left coast! Don Burns PS - Not connected in any way with BFR except by subscribing. My secondcheck will go out this week. from steve@hamiltonrods.com Wed Apr 5 16:20:09 2000 Subject: Re: Post Point and counterpoint I guess. I'm coming at this from the perspective of(1) a new bamboo fly rod builder,(2) a "struggling," self-employed business owner, and (3) a past magazinecolumnist and I hafta stand by myoriginal gut feel. But being new to the hobby, I wasn't around at the magazine's inception. Iguess if someone said "I'm going tostart a bamboo rod magazine so how'd you like to donate funds to thecause" then I'd be likely to donate. But if someone sent me a subscription card and I filled it out and providedan AMEX number that was charged inthe amount of $40 bucks or so, I'd be pretty upset if I hadn't seen anyissues a year later. --Steve from channer1@rmi.net Wed Apr 5 18:06:59 2000 Subject: Re: Post Don;You hit that nail on the head so hard you sunk it right thru thefloorboards!John Canerods@aol.com wrote: All, I've met Mark and have had several conversations with him. He's a heck ofanice guy and is driven to see this magazine succeed. I wish him well andwon't attempt what he's trying to do. Over the years I have subscribed to a few startup magazines for smallspecialized markets. Most have failed or have been sold to largercompaniesthat used the customer list to sent out some other magazine with thehopesthat a few would continue with thier own sub'ed magazine. So asking a small way underfunded magazine to refund your money isn'tverysmart unless you want them either go out of business or sell out. How would you like to find out that Bigmagazine.com has just purchasedBFRand they will send you 18 mts of their "Graphite Golf Club Shaftmaker"? If Mark folds up his tent and bales out - it's over folks! Got That!!! I doubt if anyone will ever again attempt to start a second bamboo rodmagazine and then for many many years. (like forever!) The market isjust toosmall. Look at how many fly fishing or fly tying magazines have failed! What's the income generated off something like "The Planing Forum"?Zip,point diddley! And that's not a full blown magazine. I doubt if Mark is getting rich off the dribbles of cash that comes in andtoexpect him to work for nothing would most likey make him laugh - he'snodoubt got all of his worldly possessions poured into the magazine andhavingno income would be better than what's he's going through now. So what do we do? Hold you nose and write a check! Yes, that stinks! Yes, you've got issuesora refund due. Pony up folks! It's time to say to yourself - "Do I want a bamboo rod magazine badenough tochuck $25.00 or $30.00 more dollars away? If yes - send in a year's subscription money and write it off even if youdon't ever get anything for your money. Then pray that Mark is dumb enough to keep on trying to pull it off. Yes,Pray. I'll bet that he's in it up to his eyebrows and most likely shouldjustwalk away. If he continued to eat rice and beans and do manage to get acouple of magazines published and gets some cash flow going - GREAT! Else - forget it. My $0.02 from the left coast! Don Burns PS - Not connected in any way with BFR except by subscribing. My secondcheckwill go out this week. from nsflyrods@ns.sympatico.ca Wed Apr 5 18:16:31 2000 Subject: Help to locate a book I am trying to find a book. I am unsure of the exact title, but I nowit was one of those Popular Mechanics type encyclopedias from the 50'sor 60's. When I first started seriously thinking about bamboo rods itwas an article in this book that finally inspired me to leap in withboth feet!On page 176 there is an article by L.U. Beitz, a rod maker fromAustin, Texas. In the article he takes you step by step (in brief butclear and simplified form) through the building of a 7'6" Garrison 5 wt. I have a photocopy of the article, unfortunately there is not a pagein it that has the books title. I would dearly like to know the title ofthis book so I could track one down for my growing library. It would bea good article for newbies to cut their teeth on as well. It shows theforms, binder, node stagger, thread wrapping and the taper for the rod.There is even a picture of his rod spread over the 6 pages. TIA, Shawn from nsflyrods@ns.sympatico.ca Wed Apr 5 18:20:34 2000 Subject: light wt Gillums Does anyone have any tapers/info on Gillum Light line wt rods? I haven'tseen anything below a 6 wt from him. I am looking for any info on theserods to go with the light line tapers because I haven't been able tofind much on his smaller rods. Thanks,Shawn from Canerods@aol.com Wed Apr 5 18:27:30 2000 Subject: Re: Post In a message dated 4/5/00 2:33:38 PM Pacific Daylight Time, steve@hamiltonrods.com writes: Steve, I've been trying to put a few bucks away to buy my first set of taperforms, something always seems to need the money more. So I understand how youfeel about tossing money away. I guess Mark should have been (still should be) more open with his money problems. But then again, who would send subscription money to someonethat said that it's underfunded? If he's in need of a means of turning the completed text into somethingthat can be called a magazine and can't afford to get it processed - maybe I can help. I can suggest some cheaper methods. It won't be a glossy gee wizzissue like the first ones, but maybe something is better than nothing for now. BFR could alway switch back to glossy stock later. However, if all he needs is some slave labor to get the magazine off thedime - how about a list of things he needs done! I believe Mark needs to publish (here or by postcard) some realistic milestone dates based upon his cashflow. I know he said that he needed tobuy out some partners to get the magazine going and semed like he felt hecould do it all himself. But people will only believe the soon-to-be-published BS He showed off a very nice, 10' long, timeline long scroll of bamboorodmakers at the 1st annual Bishop, CA gathering. Nice work! I wonder how manyhours went into that? He needs to stick to just publishing the magazine at this point! So no more pet projects and no call for more articles! If he doesn't have enough articles after all this time, the fat lady has warmed up and iscoming to stage front! Just get the next issue out. Period. End of statement. One final publishing idea. Anyone else remember BYTE? One of the first personal computer magazines. Well, it's not out of business - do a websearch and you'll find out that it's now "published" weekly on the net! ** No mailing costs! No paper costs! No printing houses to deal with! Why not digitally publish BFR for now? Pay for a subscription and you can access it on the web! I'm sure someone could help Mark get that going. Works for me! (I've got access to networked color copiers. ) Don B. ** I still think Jerry Pornelle's user column is the best ever for "real" world PC users. All the warts, plug and pray hardware/software glitches, general bumps in the road and well-hidden cables that fall off at 2 AM are talked about a manner that tells me that our computers still suck. Plus ifwe had to buy bamboo from BG - then we'd all be casting rods that would only work with Microsoft reels. from lblove@cableone.net Wed Apr 5 18:53:51 2000 Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.117.11);Wed, 5 Apr 2000 16:53:43 -0700 Subject: Re: Post This is just my opinion(any flaming can be directed to lblove@cableone.net) A few of the cane suppliers subscribe to this list, some component makerssubscribe to this list, some people who don't even fly fish subscribe tothis list. If the gentleman who has a vested interest in rodmaking,restoration, or resale won't subscribe to the list, it appears that hedoesn't really care about bamboo rods, their makers or making money. NowIunderstand the problem, I have only been on the list since Dec. 99 and itseems that once a month this little problem shows its ugly head. On the subject of advertising, if a company advertises in a publicationthere is a need to get that advertisement to the readers if not the moneyiswasted. Do you think that a small firm would throw money at somethingafterthere has been a lack of return?? I would send him a check for an ad if Ifelt sure the ad would get to the readers. May be Mr. Metcalf shouldreevaluate his marketing methods and what he wish to get accomplished. Bradley Love ps I can supply the staples and a stapler if needed(I'll go buy a stapler ifit is needed)sorry for the ranting a raving from a land locked lunatic, and the bogartingof bandwidth ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Post Darryl, Your reply, to Jerry's comments, hits the long ball. There is no betterplace to expect the articles to come from than the users of this list.In addition, it would be a good network source for Mark to be a part of,if he is truly concerned for the future of his magazine. Regards, Kevin from chris@artistree.com Wed Apr 5 18:58:47 2000 Subject: Re: Help to locate a book Shawn,Unsure if it's the same article but it is the same author dealing withthe same techniques. Fine Woodworking on Woodshop Specialties, Taunton Press [1987] -Published by Fine Woodworking Magazine. Contains 6 page reprint frommagazine on bamboo rod building by L.U. Beitz-- Regards, Chris WohlfordThe Ultimate Bamboo Fly Rod Libraryhttp://www.artistree.com/SplitCaneLibrary/ Shawn Pineo wrote: I am trying to find a book. I am unsure of the exact title, but I nowit was one of those Popular Mechanics type encyclopedias from the 50'sor 60's. When I first started seriously thinking about bamboo rods itwas an article in this book that finally inspired me to leap in withboth feet!On page 176 there is an article by L.U. Beitz, a rod maker fromAustin, Texas. In the article he takes you step by step (in brief butclear and simplified form) through the building of a 7'6" Garrison 5 wt. I have a photocopy of the article, unfortunately there is not a pagein it that has the books title. I would dearly like to know the title ofthis book so I could track one down for my growing library. It would bea good article for newbies to cut their teeth on as well. It shows theforms, binder, node stagger, thread wrapping and the taper for the rod.There is even a picture of his rod spread over the 6 pages. TIA, Shawn from edriddle@mindspring.com Wed Apr 5 19:21:48 2000 Subject: BFR I'm reluctant to join the fray regarding the magazine's problems but sinceI issue, #5/6, I suppose I'm entitled. I wasn't around for the magazine's start, but I've since bought issue #'s 2,3 & 4 from folks on the net and have really enjoyed the content. I sentDarryl an email, which he forwarded to Mark , that basically asked whywasn't Mark providing some communication with his customer base. Marksubsequently telephoned me at home and explained the problems withpersonnelturnover and unpaid subscriptions, etc. and assured me that these hurdleswould soon be cleared. I encouraged him to put out a statement on hiswebsite to that effect believing, as I still do, that although nothingreplaces positive results, time can be bought with communication. Forwhatever reason, he has elected not to do so. I'm not asking for a refund,I've blown $20+ before. However, I'm at a loss as to why he will notdampenthe rhetoric with a little P.R. Maybe it's Monday morning quarterbacking, but why would one fulfillseveralhundred unpaid subscriptions? Also, why would one maintain that samesubscription list to be audited by the P.O. for current issue distribution?Also, is there a reason he can't list these "several hundred" deadbeats onhis website? My city and county governments lists names of people in thelocal newspaper that are delinquent in property taxes...hey we ain't talkingabout public flogging! I'm pulling for the magazine to succeed. Sorry forthe bandwidth, my $ .06 worth.Ed I'm hoping everything works out from Patrick.Coffey@PSS.Boeing.com Wed Apr 5 19:41:52 2000 RAA28944 ESMTP; Wed, 5 Apr 2000 17:42:09 -0700 (5.5.2650.21) "'edriddle@mindspring.com'" Subject: RE: BFR As someone who paid for the maximum years before the magazine waspublished I suggest Mark get a hold of thesepeople: http://www.nwflyfishing.net/ and find out how they did it. This a start up flyfishing magazine thats onlya year old and seems toflourishing. Issues actually arrive and on the right date. Patrick W. CoffeyAOG Incident Repair PlanningPhone: 425-234-2901Fax: 425-237-0083M-2112 M/C 61-79 ----------From: Ed Riddle[SMTP:edriddle@mindspring.com] Sent: Wednesday, April 05, 2000 6:20 PM Subject: BFR I'm reluctant to join the fray regarding the magazine's problems butsince Isent a check back in Dec. for a year's subscription and only received oneissue, #5/6, I suppose I'm entitled. I wasn't around for the magazine's start, but I've since bought issue #'s2,3 & 4 from folks on the net and have really enjoyed the content. I sentDarryl an email, which he forwarded to Mark , that basically asked whywasn't Mark providing some communication with his customer base. Marksubsequently telephoned me at home and explained the problems withpersonnelturnover and unpaid subscriptions, etc. and assured me that thesehurdleswould soon be cleared. I encouraged him to put out a statement on hiswebsite to that effect believing, as I still do, that although nothingreplaces positive results, time can be bought with communication. Forwhatever reason, he has elected not to do so. I'm not asking for a refund,I've blown $20+ before. However, I'm at a loss as to why he will notdampenthe rhetoric with a little P.R. Maybe it's Monday morning quarterbacking, but why would one fulfillseveralhundred unpaid subscriptions? Also, why would one maintain that samesubscription list to be audited by the P.O. for current issue distribution?Also, is there a reason he can't list these "several hundred" deadbeats onhis website? My city and county governments lists names of people inthelocal newspaper that are delinquent in property taxes...hey we ain'ttalkingabout public flogging! I'm pulling for the magazine to succeed. Sorry forthe bandwidth, my $ .06 worth.Ed I'm hoping everything works out from DNHayashida@aol.com Wed Apr 5 19:42:56 2000 Subject: Re: BFR Maybe it's Monday morning quarterbacking, but why would one fulfillseveralhundred unpaid subscriptions? Also, why would one maintain that samesubscription list to be audited by the P.O. for current issuedistribution?Also, is there a reason he can't list these "several hundred" deadbeats onhis website? My city and county governments lists names of people inthelocal newspaper that are delinquent in property taxes...hey we ain't talkingabout public flogging! I'm pulling for the magazine to succeed. Sorryforthe bandwidth, my $ .06 worth. How many magazines do you know of that wait for full payment beforethey send you the magazine? Mark has considered sending them to acollection agency, but I think he still believes cane rod people are betterthan that.The Post office would definitely revoke the permit if they found addressesthey mailed to not in the subscription list,and Mark could list a couple hundred "deadbeats" just on this list alone.Mark will probably chew me out for letting the numbers out, but it is 550"deadbeats" out of a subscriber base of 2500.Darryl from djk762@hotmail.com Wed Apr 5 19:52:57 2000 Wed, 05 Apr 2000 17:52:24 PDT Subject: Off Post Rodmakers- I have met two men from the BFR mag, Mark Metcalf and Jack Parker.Mark was at Bishop 99. He brought some interesting rods and was very informative on all aspects of Bamboo Rods. He also put together a great presentation on the history and the construction of cane rods at the San Mateo Sportsman's Expo the same year.I met Jack at a local Flyfishing club. We soon found out that we had bamboo in common. Within a month of meeting Jack arranged it so that Icould cast five rods from his collection of E.C.Powell hollow builts. He is an intelligent and generous man.The mag has obviously had major problems with circulation. Many of the articles are not examples of great writing. But the individuals involvedare dedicated to cane rods and the people involved with cane rods.The mag is worth the wait. David KashubaFair Oaks CA.The March Browns are out onYuba.______________________________________________________Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com from nobler@satx.rr.com Wed Apr 5 20:02:05 2000 SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.357.35);Wed, 5 Apr 2000 20:02:52 -0500 Subject: Re: Post boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0073_01BF9F3A.21010DE0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0073_01BF9F3A.21010DE0 I'll be darned ! I had just about decided the same thing ! I waste more =than that on coffee money ! GMA Sent: Wednesday, April 05, 2000 3:59 PMSubject: Re: Post All, I've met Mark and have had several conversations with him. He's a heck = nice guy and is driven to see this magazine succeed. I wish him well = won't attempt what he's trying to do. Over the years I have subscribed to a few startup magazines for specialized markets. Most have failed or have been sold to larger = that used the customer list to sent out some other magazine with the = So asking a small way underfunded magazine to refund your money isn't = How would you like to find out that Bigmagazine.com has just purchased= and they will send you 18 mts of their "Graphite Golf Club =Shaftmaker"? I doubt if anyone will ever again attempt to start a second bamboo rod = magazine and then for many many years. (like forever!) The market is = small. Look at how many fly fishing or fly tying magazines have =failed! What's the income generated off something like "The Planing Forum"? = point diddley! And that's not a full blown magazine. I doubt if Mark is getting rich off the dribbles of cash that comes in = expect him to work for nothing would most likey make him laugh - he's = doubt got all of his worldly possessions poured into the magazine and = no income would be better than what's he's going through now. Hold you nose and write a check! Yes, that stinks! Yes, you've got = It's time to say to yourself - "Do I want a bamboo rod magazine bad = If yes - send in a year's subscription money and write it off even if = Then pray that Mark is dumb enough to keep on trying to pull it off. = Pray. I'll bet that he's in it up to his eyebrows and most likely = walk away. If he continued to eat rice and beans and do manage to get = couple of magazines published and gets some cash flow going - GREAT! Else - forget it. My $0.02 from the left coast! Don Burns PS - Not connected in any way with BFR except by subscribing. My = will go out this week. ------=_NextPart_000_0073_01BF9F3A.21010DE0 I'll be darned ! I had just about decided the same thing ! = more than that on coffee money ! GMA ----- Original Message ----- = Sent: Wednesday, April 05, 2000= PMSubject: Re: PostAll,I've met Mark and have had several = with him. He's a heck of a nice guy and is driven to see this = do.Over the years I have subscribed to a few startup magazines= small specialized markets. Most have failed or have been sold to = companies that used the customer list to sent out some other = the hopes that a few would continue with thier own sub'ed = So asking a small way underfunded magazine to refund your = very smart unless you want them either go out of business or sell = How would you like to find out that Bigmagazine.com has just = Shaftmaker"?If Mark folds up his tent and bales out - it's = Got That!!! I doubt if anyone will ever again attempt = a second bamboo rod magazine and then for many many years. (like = The market is just too small. Look at how many fly fishing or fly = magazines have failed!What's the income generated off = "The Planing Forum"? Zip, point diddley! And that's not a full = magazine.I doubt if Mark is getting rich off the dribbles of = comes in and to expect him to work for nothing would most likey = laugh - he's no doubt got all of his worldly possessions poured = magazine and having no income would be better than what's he's = through now.So what do we do? Hold you nose and write= Yes, that stinks! Yes, you've got issues or a refund due. = magazine bad enough to chuck $25.00 or $30.00 more dollars If yes - send in a year's subscription money and write it off = you don't ever get anything for your money. Then pray that = dumb enough to keep on trying to pull it off. Yes, Pray. I'll bet = he's in it up to his eyebrows and most likely should just walk = continued to eat rice and beans and do manage to get a couple of = published and gets some cash flow going - GREAT!Else - it.My $0.02 from the left coast!Don BurnsPS -= connected in any way with BFR except by subscribing. My second check = go out this week. ------=_NextPart_000_0073_01BF9F3A.21010DE0-- from edriddle@mindspring.com Wed Apr 5 20:10:18 2000 Subject: Re: BFR I'm not in the magazine business, but if I were you'd get just one issue from me before you paid in full, you implied Mark mailed "fullsubscriptions" to non-payors. As a former Auditor, I would acceptsubscriber non-payment as reason for parrying a subscription list inpreparation of current issue distribution. Maybe I'm not understandingwhatyou're trying say. Based on your numbers, sounds like "some" cane peopleare no better than "most" politicians.Ed-----Original Message----- Subject: Re: BFR Maybe it's Monday morning quarterbacking, but why would one fulfillseveralhundred unpaid subscriptions? Also, why would one maintain thatsamesubscription list to be audited by the P.O. for current issuedistribution?Also, is there a reason he can't list these "several hundred" deadbeatsonhis website? My city and county governments lists names of people inthelocal newspaper that are delinquent in property taxes...hey we ain'ttalkingabout public flogging! I'm pulling for the magazine to succeed. Sorryforthe bandwidth, my $ .06 worth. How many magazines do you know of that wait for full payment beforethey send you the magazine? Mark has considered sending them to acollection agency, but I think he still believes cane rod people are betterthan that.The Post office would definitely revoke the permit if they foundaddressesthey mailed to not in the subscription list,and Mark could list a couple hundred "deadbeats" just on this list alone.Mark will probably chew me out for letting the numbers out, but it is 550"deadbeats" out of a subscriber base of 2500.Darryl from mcdowellc@lanecc.edu Wed Apr 5 20:13:59 2000 18:14:50 PDT Subject: Heddon #17 8 1/2' 3 pc. 7/8 wt. This was measured with varnish removed. I know, not very exciting,but..... what the heck. Chris 1" .0875" .10010" .11615" .13220" .14725" .15830" .17735" .19140" .20445" .22150" .23755" .25060" .26265" .27570" .29575" .30780" .32085" .32590" .36192" .398 from edriddle@mindspring.com Wed Apr 5 20:40:11 2000 Subject: Re: Heddon #17 8 1/2' 3 pc. 7/8 wt. Chris:What's the ferrule size?Thanks.Ed-----Original Message----- Subject: Heddon #17 8 1/2' 3 pc. 7/8 wt. This was measured with varnish removed. I know, not very exciting,but.....what the heck. Chris 1" .0875" .10010" .11615" .13220" .14725" .15830" .17735" .19140" .20445" .22150" .23755" .25060" .26265" .27570" .29575" .30780" .32085" .32590" .36192" .398 from weakley.hollow@gte.net Thu Apr 6 02:47:20 2000 Subject: Re: Post folks, i do believe that the nice gent who began woodenboat magazine has doneverywell. the odds are, however, that tbbfrm will not become a similarsuccess, simply because most niche magazines (and ours is a pretty smallniche) probably are destined to remain on the edges of success. i'd guessthat tbbfrm was started with very limited capitalization. its layout mightnot be the equal of the new yorker, but it's pretty darn good, and thecontent is a treat. if they can get their admin and business act together,i'll sign up for another year. seems to me like it's nice having a magazineon this particular subject. not a bad thing to help along. darn. i promised myself that i wouldn't post on this. glm At 04:59 PM 4/5/00 EDT, you wrote:I've met Mark and have had several conversations with him. He's a heck ofa nice guy and is driven to see this magazine succeed. I wish him well and won't attempt what he's trying to do. --------------------gary mischcdr, usn (ret.) from LECLAIR123@aol.com Thu Apr 6 02:50:37 2000 Subject: Re: Help to locate a book Content-Language: en In a message dated 04/05/2000 8:01:38 PM Eastern Daylight Time, chris@artistree.com writes: Shawn, I think this is the same book that I have in my shop.If not, I'll let you know. Dave http://hometown.aol.com/leclair123/index.html from LECLAIR123@aol.com Thu Apr 6 02:53:10 2000 Subject: Re: Help to locate a book In a message dated 04/05/2000 7:18:46 PM Eastern Daylight Time, nsflyrods@ns.sympatico.ca writes: from mcdowellc@lanecc.edu Thu Apr 6 04:00:04 2000 18:56:57 PDT Subject: Re: Heddon #17 8 1/2' 3 pc. 7/8 wt. Ed, I didn't measure the I.D. of the Heddon ferrules. It's a pre-1939 rod. from graphing the taper it calls for a size 18 and size 12. If I were to make this rod I might use a size 19 on the butt/mid. I came up with the 7/8 designation based on stresses at 40'-60', so no hands on casting with this rod. Sorry I can't give more details on casting characteristics etc. I don't use the big rods like this and it was a refinish for the owner. Chris---------- Original Text ---------- Chris:What's the ferrule size?Thanks.Ed-----Original Message----- Subject: Heddon #17 8 1/2' 3 pc. 7/8 wt. This was measured with varnish removed. I know, not very exciting,but.....what the heck. Chris 1" .0875" .10010" .11615" .13220" .14725" .15830" .17735" .19140" .20445" .22150" .23755" .25060" .26265" .27570" .29575" .30780" .32085" .32590" .36192" .398 from irish-george@pacbell.net Thu Apr 6 05:10:49 2000 sims.3.5.2000.01.05.12.18.p9)with SMTP id for Subject: Re: BFR This doesn't make any sense at all. You are saying that Mark IS sendingmagazines to about 550 people who haven't paidand most of the complaints on this list (mine included) are from peoplewho've paid but aren't receiving the magazine. What kindof message does this sort of behavior (on BFR's part) send??? George -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: BFR Maybe it's Monday morning quarterbacking, but why would one fulfillseveralhundred unpaid subscriptions? Also, why would one maintain thatsamesubscription list to be audited by the P.O. for current issuedistribution?Also, is there a reason he can't list these "several hundred" deadbeatsonhis website? My city and county governments lists names of people inthelocal newspaper that are delinquent in property taxes...hey we ain'ttalkingabout public flogging! I'm pulling for the magazine to succeed. Sorryforthe bandwidth, my $ .06 worth. How many magazines do you know of that wait for full payment beforethey send you the magazine? Mark has considered sending them to acollection agency, but I think he still believes cane rod people are betterthan that.The Post office would definitely revoke the permit if they foundaddressesthey mailed to not in the subscription list,and Mark could list a couple hundred "deadbeats" just on this list alone.Mark will probably chew me out for letting the numbers out, but it is 550"deadbeats" out of a subscriber base of 2500.Darryl from ttalsma@macatawa.org Thu Apr 6 07:06:56 2000 Subject: Re: Post Oh!!! Wow!!! You really got me thinking now. I had been sitting on thesidelines for this whole conversation and then...slap...hit me rightacross the face. What a great idea. Publishing on the web. It reallywouldn't be that tough to do! I for one would be more than happy tochip in and get the information published on the web. Heck, I'd behappy to set up the web site. Hey Daryll, maybe you could put some ofus in contact with Mark to "talk" about this possibility. Canerods@aol.com wrote : One final publishing idea. Anyone else remember BYTE? One of the firstpersonal computer magazines. Well, it's not out of business - do a websearchand you'll find out that it's now "published" weekly on the net! ** No mailing costs! No paper costs! No printing houses to deal with! Why not digitally publish BFR for now? Pay for a subscription and youcanaccess it on the web! I'm sure someone could help Mark get that going. Works for me! (I've got access to networked color copiers. ) Don B. -- Todd Talsma8412 North Maple CourtZeeland MI 49464------ home page: http://members.xoom.com/ttalsma/index.htmgenealogy pages:http://members.xoom.com/ttalsma/family/index.htm from Eastkoyfly@aol.com Thu Apr 6 07:44:50 2000 Subject: catskill gathering Hello to all,Do any of you know if and when the catskill gathering will be T.I.AJoe from nobler@satx.rr.com Thu Apr 6 07:45:04 2000 SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.357.35);Thu, 6 Apr 2000 07:45:56 -0500 Subject: Re: Help to locate a book boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0043_01BF9F9C.583A6600" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0043_01BF9F9C.583A6600 I'd sure like to get a copy of this article. Happy to pay charges. GMA Sent: Wednesday, April 05, 2000 9:08 PMSubject: Re: Help to locate a book nsflyrods@ns.sympatico.ca writes: charges. GMA ----- Original Message ----- LECLAIR123@aol.com RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.edu= Sent: Wednesday, April 05, 2000= PMSubject: Re: Help to locate a =bookIn a message dated 04/05/2000 7:18:46 PM Eastern = building of a 7'6" Garrison 5 = a photocopy of the article, unfortunately there is not a = = = = Dave LeClairhttp://hometown.ao=l.com/leclair123/index.html ------=_NextPart_000_0043_01BF9F9C.583A6600-- from edriddle@mindspring.com Thu Apr 6 07:52:05 2000 Subject: Re: Heddon #17 8 1/2' 3 pc. 7/8 wt. Sorry Chris for my not being more specific with the question. I've got oneof these with size 2F and just wondered if your posted specs were for it.Thanks again for the info.Ed-----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Heddon #17 8 1/2' 3 pc. 7/8 wt. Ed, I didn't measure the I.D. of the Heddon ferrules. It's a pre-1939 rod.Fromgraphing the taper it calls for a size 18 and size 12. from dhaftel@att.com Thu Apr 6 08:15:05 2000 JAA17597 (8.8.8+Sun/ATTEMS-1.4.1 sol2) (5.5.2650.21) RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: RE: catskill gathering Joe, It is usually held the weekend after Labor Day. This year that's September9th and 10th. See you there. Dennis -----Original Message----- Subject: catskill gathering Hello to all,Do any of you know if and when the catskill gathering will be T.I.AJoe from Canerods@aol.com Thu Apr 6 08:21:56 2000 Subject: Re: Heddon #17 8 1/2' 3 pc. 7/8 wt. In a message dated 4/6/00 2:02:50 AM Pacific Daylight Time, mcdowellc@lanecc.edu writes: from graphing the taper it calls for a size 18 and size 12. If I were to make this rod I might use a size 19 on the butt/mid. I came up with the 7/8 designation based on stresses at 40'-60', so no hands on casting with this rod. Sorry I can't give more details on casting characteristics etc. I don't use the big rods like this and it was a refinish for the owner. Chris >> All, Per Michael Sinclair's Heddon book, the 8'6" 2F rod has 18/64ths and11/64ths ferrules; the 2-1/2F rod has 19/ths and 12/64ths. Sounds like an 8'6" 2-1/2F rod. I don't think I've ever seen one myself, only the much more common 2F and 1-3/4F rods. That must be one stout mama! Don Burns from Ddrochejr@aol.com Thu Apr 6 08:22:09 2000 Subject: Test Post Test from ernie2@pacbell.net Thu Apr 6 08:45:19 2000 sims.3.5.2000.01.05.12.18.p9)with SMTP id for Subject: Test 4/6/00 6:45AM from andrew_harsanyi@ibi.com Thu Apr 6 08:49:30 2000 0400 Subject: RE: Post I wonder how many of those "deadbeats" are like me. I sent an emailover a year ago subscribing. Luckily I purposely did not include acredit card number (I already had my doubts). I received nothing...nomagazine, not even a confirmation. Then one day recently I got anicely printed card thanking me for my subscription and asking formoney. Perhaps I should have sent the money and considered righting itoff as a donation (worst case scenario), but I just lost allconfidence so I threw it out. Now if he would have communicated better and given me some hope, orasked for a donation, I probably would have forked over the money. Assomeone else said, it's one thing to contribute to a cause and anotherto buy a product that isn't delivered. I might even still consider adonation if asked...but all I really see is zero customerservice...and THAT should be a top priority. from DNHayashida@aol.com Thu Apr 6 09:13:59 2000 Subject: Re: Post Hey Daryll, maybe you could put some ofus in contact with Mark to "talk" about this possibility. Bam-fly@pacbell.netDarryl from destinycon@mindspring.com Thu Apr 6 09:18:15 2000 Subject: Re: Post Friends,I said I was not going to sick my dog on this one but after more thanthirty posts.....I was talking to a lady that publishes a Wedding magazine, fromstart-up.After explaining the plight of TBFR, including my peeve. That is not thefact that the magazine has not fulfilled it's obligations of publishing andsuppling magazines to people that have paid the subscription price butwhenthey did send the last issue, #5/#6, they said...here's two in one. What adeal, pay for two get one. (Excuse me but I digress) Her one comment was"A MAGAZINE THAT DOES NOT PUBLISH IS NOT A MAGAZINE". That prettymuchsums it up. I'm as sorry as everyone else but can't we all take a realitycheck here? We are talking about a good idea, we all wished would haveworked, but did not, for what ever reasons. We have all been there!!! Ifyou haven't, you are young, you will be. It's not as though Mr. Metcalftook the money and ran. He tried to get TBFR off the ground but apparentlycould not, it even seems as though he is still trying. Far be it from meto tell anyone what to do with or how to feel about their hard earnedmoneybut the monies we all spent, on this magazine, were not enough to get thisworked up about. Boy, I feel better now that I've had my turn atbeatingthis horse....... Best regards,Gary H. _________________________________________________________________________ The idea that we may be able to add something to angling knowledge isstimulating, but we can't take it too seriously. Our subject istechnological, but our mission is entertainment. These are wholesome andabsorbing activities, with a background of physical fitness, for the playhours of adults. Even our most astounding discoveries are not going toalter the destiny of civilization, although they may give us a lot ofpersonal satisfaction. Letcher Lambuth "The Angler's Workshop" from brian.thoman@neonsoft.com Thu Apr 6 09:44:47 2000 (5.5.2650.21) Subject: Reel Seat Tubing I have lots of nickel silver tubing in sizes .720 x .650 and .650x 590. Please contact me off list, if interested. Brian Brian ThomanChattahoochee Rodshttp://www.bambooflyrods.com303.805.5733 from BJCarlson@webtv.net Thu Apr 6 10:08:21 2000 ESMTP id 678D61BA7 221.iap.bryant.webtv.net (8.8.8-wtv-e/mt.gso.26Feb98) id ETAtAhR5ii8u4oIQ9OCO8Y4kBuuHtxMy/wIVAKBOi4cnl+rd/vBiEvN0D30ZzFVo Subject: Heddon #17 This Heddon must have been very popular. I have just picked up an 8 ft3/2 model 17 that is very light. According to M. Sinclair book this wascalled Extra Lite Trout. Checks with 1 1/2F (16/64) and 10/64 tipferrule. Some of the varnish is flaking off and needs rewrap. Veryfine tips. As soon as I get it documented will strip it and measuretaper. Casts a DT3 wt very well. Bob from dhaftel@att.com Thu Apr 6 10:44:39 2000 LAA21671 (8.8.8+Sun/ATTEMS-1.4.1 sol2) (5.5.2650.21) Subject: RE: Post Gary, I never even received my last issue. Dennis -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Post Friends,I said I was not going to sick my dog on this one but after morethanthirty posts.....I was talking to a lady that publishes a Wedding magazine, fromstart-up.After explaining the plight of TBFR, including my peeve. That is not thefact that the magazine has not fulfilled it's obligations of publishing andsuppling magazines to people that have paid the subscription price butwhenthey did send the last issue, #5/#6, they said...here's two in one. What adeal, pay for two get one. (Excuse me but I digress) Her one comment was"A MAGAZINE THAT DOES NOT PUBLISH IS NOT A MAGAZINE". That prettymuchsums it up. I'm as sorry as everyone else but can't we all take a realitycheck here? We are talking about a good idea, we all wished would haveworked, but did not, for what ever reasons. We have all been there!!! Ifyou haven't, you are young, you will be. It's not as though Mr. Metcalftook the money and ran. He tried to get TBFR off the ground but apparentlycould not, it even seems as though he is still trying. Far be it from meto tell anyone what to do with or how to feel about their hard earnedmoneybut the monies we all spent, on this magazine, were not enough to get thisworked up about. Boy, I feel better now that I've had my turn atbeatingthis horse....... Best regards,Gary H. _________________________________________________________________________ The idea that we may be able to add something to angling knowledge isstimulating, but we can't take it too seriously. Our subject istechnological, but our mission is entertainment. These are wholesome andabsorbing activities, with a background of physical fitness, for the playhours of adults. Even our most astounding discoveries are not going toalter the destiny of civilization, although they may give us a lot ofpersonal satisfaction. Letcher Lambuth "The Angler's Workshop" from arnold.jl@pg.com Thu Apr 6 12:06:00 2000 notes082.na.pg.com [155.125.116.193] 1999)) id 852568B9.005DEA49 ; Thu, 6 Apr2000 13:05:48 -0400 Subject: Re: Post That is a great idea! Put the magazine on the web with a printable formatoption. When/if the mag. gets legs then run to a printing house for theglossyversion. I hope Mark will at least consider this. I've found a dusty Jacksoninmy pocket. I believe I'll send it to Mark to help out with the magazine. Mark when you get the $20.00 could you send a confirmation by email? Orperhapsthe latest issue that is stacked in your office? I believe the $20.00 willcoverthe postage. Jeff Internet Mail Message Received from host: wugate.wustl.edu [128.252.120.1] Envelope Sender: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Please respond to dnhayashida@aol.com Subject: Re: Post Hey Daryll, maybe you could put some ofus in contact with Mark to "talk" about this possibility. Bam-fly@pacbell.netDarryl from rp43640@online-club.de Thu Apr 6 13:40:21 2000 Thu, 6 Apr 2000 20:40:08 +0200 (METDST) Subject: Re: Help to locate a book Shawn, the book is called Fine Wood Working Techniques 6, ISBN 0-918804-22-1I got one of the last copies from the Fine Woodworking Library. Christian Shawn Pineo schrieb: I am trying to find a book. I am unsure of the exact title, but I nowit was one of those Popular Mechanics type encyclopedias from the 50'sor 60's. When I first started seriously thinking about bamboo rods itwas an article in this book that finally inspired me to leap in withboth feet!On page 176 there is an article by L.U. Beitz, a rod maker fromAustin, Texas. In the article he takes you step by step (in brief butclear and simplified form) through the building of a 7'6" Garrison 5 wt. I have a photocopy of the article, unfortunately there is not a pagein it that has the books title. I would dearly like to know the title ofthis book so I could track one down for my growing library. It would bea good article for newbies to cut their teeth on as well. It shows theforms, binder, node stagger, thread wrapping and the taper for the rod.There is even a picture of his rod spread over the 6 pages. TIA, Shawn from rp43640@online-club.de Thu Apr 6 14:13:24 2000 Thu, 6 Apr 2000 21:13:04 +0200 (METDST) RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Re: Help to locate a book Planing Form Issue #35 Sept/Oct contains this article. Christian nobler schrieb: I'd sure like to get a copy of this article. Happy to pay charges. GMA ----- Original Message -----From: LECLAIR123@aol.com Sent: Wednesday, April 05, 2000 9:08 PMSubject: Re: Help to locate a bookIn a message dated 04/05/2000 7:18:46 PM Eastern DaylightTime,nsflyrods@ns.sympatico.ca writes: I am trying to find a book. I am unsure of the exacttitle, but I nowit was one of those Popular Mechanics type encyclopedias from the 50'sor 60's. When I first started seriously thinking aboutbamboo rods itwas an article in this book that finally inspired me toleap in withboth feet!On page 176 there is an article by L.U. Beitz, a rodmaker fromAustin, Texas. In the article he takes you step by step (inbrief butclear and simplified form) through the building of a 7'6"Garrison 5 wt. I have a photocopy of the article, unfortunately thereis not a pagein it that has the books title. I would dearly like to knowthe title ofthis book so I could track one down for my growing library.It would bea good article for newbies to cut their teeth on as well.It shows theforms, binder, node stagger, thread wrapping and the taper There is even a picture of his rod spread over the 6pages. TIA, Shawn Shawn,I have a copy of that book out in myshop. It is a woodworkingmagazine. I'll check it out tomorrow night, when I goback in my shop andgetback to you with the name,year, month, etc. of the book. DaveLeClair http://hometown.aol.com/leclair123/index.html from fiveside@net-gate.com Thu Apr 6 14:30:55 2000 SMTP id PAA20737 for ; Thu, 6 Apr 2000 Subject: Carryon Rods To the List,Who better to ask than the world travelers on our list: Heading west toMontana, can I expect any particular new problems in carrying on myflyrods?Heard the airlines tightened up. Thanks. Bill from FlyfishT@aol.com Thu Apr 6 16:18:04 2000 Subject: bamboo-blem HI all,I have a problem with the bale of cane i bought. When i slit the cane there is a GRAY color around the dam areas . When i bevel the strips the gray is in the node areasin between the fibers is this mold? I test the strips by making a complete circle with them some seem to brake there.Has any one run in to this ? should i write the bamboo off as junk?TIA TOM from rsgould@cmc.net Thu Apr 6 16:22:36 2000 Subject: Re: Carryon Rods Hi Bill,I didn't have any problem carrying fly rods on board until I got toAustralia- then no soap fella! Check it in and pick it up later at a specialwindow. Use one heck of a stout rod case too!!Ray----- Original Message ----- Subject: Carryon Rods To the List,Who better to ask than the world travelers on our list: Heading west toMontana, can I expect any particular new problems in carrying on myflyrods?Heard the airlines tightened up. Thanks. Bill from dpeaston@wzrd.com Thu Apr 6 18:45:14 2000 Subject: Re: BFR Darryl, If Mark did publish the list I would be on it. He says I did not pay but I issue was out. He sent the year's subscription to me and when I enquiredbye mail as to how I should sign up for the next year, after a couple ofweeks he informed me that I had not payed for the first. This was news tome! Yes, this is a big SNAFU, but I am hardly a "deadbeat." I tendered paymentand Mark didn't collect. Like Don I am willing to let bygones be bygones, Iwill even pay an arrears, but if push comes to shove and names are to becalled, then all power to Steve!!! Darryl, this part of it is not your fight. I hope you do not encourageMark in this "subscriber beating" because many will be slandered and nonewill be served. Regards to all, -Doug Easton At 08:42 PM 4/5/2000 EDT, DNHayashida@aol.com wrote: Maybe it's Monday morning quarterbacking, but why would one fulfillseveralhundred unpaid subscriptions? Also, why would one maintain thatsamesubscription list to be audited by the P.O. for current issuedistribution?Also, is there a reason he can't list these "several hundred" deadbeatsonhis website? My city and county governments lists names of people inthelocal newspaper that are delinquent in property taxes...hey we ain't talkingabout public flogging! I'm pulling for the magazine to succeed. Sorryforthe bandwidth, my $ .06 worth. How many magazines do you know of that wait for full payment beforethey send you the magazine? Mark has considered sending them to acollection agency, but I think he still believes cane rod people are betterthan that.The Post office would definitely revoke the permit if they foundaddressesthey mailed to not in the subscription list,and Mark could list a couple hundred "deadbeats" just on this list alone.Mark will probably chew me out for letting the numbers out, but it is 550"deadbeats" out of a subscriber base of 2500.Darryl Doug EastonTonawanda, NY from DNHayashida@aol.com Thu Apr 6 19:28:56 2000 Subject: Re: BFR Darryl, this part of it is not your fight. I hope you do not encourageMark in this "subscriber beating" because many will be slandered andnonewill be served. "Deadbeat" was not my word - that's why it was in quotes. Go back andread my reply. It was the original posters word and idea to publish the list of - nonpayers. I was defending what Mark has done so far with -nonpayers.Darryl from saltwein@swbell.net Thu Apr 6 19:30:19 2000 (Sun Internet Mail Server sims.3.5.2000.01.05.12.18.p9)with ESMTP id for Subject: Re: Help to locate a book/Article RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.edu boundary="------------9DC25C7038D6DE77C1A08998" --------------9DC25C7038D6DE77C1A08998 The article is in a collection of articles titled "Fine Woodworking onWoodshop Specialties" it was published in 1987 by Taunton press. Ipicked mine up from ebay, the bamboo article, as mentioned before, is byL. U. Beitz and is six pages long. It is interesting in an historical perspective but I don't think thereis a lot of information to be gained if other more up to date sourceshave been read. One can probably find the booklet on eBay. It is a collection of 27articles. Regards, SteveIndependence, MO nobler wrote: I'd sure like to get a copy of this article. Happy to pay charges. GMA ----- Original Message -----From: LECLAIR123@aol.com Subject: Re: Help to locate a bookIn a message dated 04/05/2000 7:18:46 PM Eastern DaylightTime,nsflyrods@ns.sympatico.ca writes: I am trying to find a book. I am unsure of the exacttitle, but I nowit was one of those Popular Mechanics type encyclopedias from the 50'sor 60's. When I first started seriously thinking aboutbamboo rods itwas an article in this book that finally inspired me toleap in withboth feet!On page 176 there is an article by L.U. Beitz, a rodmaker fromAustin, Texas. In the article he takes you step by step (inbrief butclear and simplified form) through the building of a 7'6"Garrison 5 wt. I have a photocopy of the article, unfortunately thereis not a pagein it that has the books title. I would dearly like to knowthe title ofthis book so I could track one down for my growing library.It would bea good article for newbies to cut their teeth on as well.It shows theforms, binder, node stagger, thread wrapping and the taper There is even a picture of his rod spread over the 6pages. TIA, Shawn Shawn,I have a copy of that book out in myshop. It is a woodworkingmagazine. I'll check it out tomorrow night, when I goback in my shop andgetback to you with the name,year, month, etc. of the book. DaveLeClair http://hometown.aol.com/leclair123/index.html --------------9DC25C7038D6DE77C1A08998 The article is in a collection of articles titled "Fine Woodworking onWoodshop Specialties" it was published in 1987 by Taunton press. I pickedmine up from ebay, the bamboo article, as mentioned before, is by L. U.Beitz and is six pages long.It is interesting in an historical perspective but I don't think thereis a lot of information to be gained if other more up to date sources havebeen read.One can probably find the booklet on eBay. It is a collection of 27articles.Regards, SteveIndependence, MOnobler wrote: I'd sure like to get a copy of ----- Original Message ----- From:LECLAIR123@aol.com ; RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Wednesday, April 05, 2000 9:08PM Subject: Re: Help to locate abook nsflyrods@ns.sympatico.cawrites:<< title, but I now the 50's rods it leap in with Beitz,a rod maker from but Garrison5 wt. unfortunatelythere is not a page title of would be shows the the rod. TIA, I have a copy of that book out in my shop. It is a woodworking back in my shop andget Dave LeClair http://hometown.aol.com/leclair123/index.html --------------9DC25C7038D6DE77C1A08998-- from HomeyDKlown@worldnet.att.net Thu Apr 6 19:42:52 2000 (InterMail vM.4.01.02.39 201-229-119-122) with ESMTP ;Fri, 7 Apr 2000 00:42:19 +0000 Subject: Re: bamboo-blem Tom, I ran into this problem not too long ago. I took a piece (the worstlooking one) of the off colored cane and broke it in my hands. I thentook a piece of cane of the same thickness that passed my stringentquality control (I looked real hard and guessed) standard of"perfection" and broke that too. I was satisfied that the cane was OKwhen they both broke using the same force and with the same splinteredpattern at the break point. To make a good omelette you have to break some eggs... Good luck, Dennis FlyfishT@aol.com wrote: HI all,I have a problem with the bale of cane i bought. When i slit the canethere is a GRAY color around the dam areas . When i bevel the strips thegray is in the node areasin between the fibers is this mold? I test thestrips by making a complete circle with them some seem to brake there.Hasany one run in to this ? should i write the bamboo off as junk?TIA TOM from bob@downandacross.com Thu Apr 6 20:19:10 2000 (envelope- from bob@downandacross.com) (envelope- from bob@downandacross.com) Subject: casting clubs After Chris's post with a link to the Golden Gate CastingClub, I have been checking these clubs and events out. Here's a site withsome great info:http://home.att.net/~slowsnap/index.htm I never realized it was so big a deal, although I must say that thereferences to tournaments in BFR did interest me. (Bought at the flyshop, I was not a stiff!) Anyone in NY in a club? Bob Maulucci==================================================downandacross.com bob@downandacross.com from nobler@satx.rr.com Thu Apr 6 20:19:24 2000 SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.357.35);Thu, 6 Apr 2000 20:20:17 -0500 Subject: Re: BFR boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000D_01BFA005.BA10B140" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000D_01BFA005.BA10B140 I did the same thing when I first heard of the BFR. I was then informed =sometime later that they didn't take credit cards ! I guess I fall into =the same class with you ! (grin) Just for the heck of it, I'm going to =pay the sub. rate, and then see if I even get my back issues ! GMA Sent: Thursday, April 06, 2000 6:44 PMSubject: Re: BFR Darryl, If Mark did publish the list I would be on it. He says I did not pay =but Isent my credit card # to his web site (on the order form) before the =firstissue was out. He sent the year's subscription to me and when I =enquired bye mail as to how I should sign up for the next year, after a couple ofweeks he informed me that I had not payed for the first. This was news =to me! Yes, this is a big SNAFU, but I am hardly a "deadbeat." I tendered =paymentand Mark didn't collect. Like Don I am willing to let bygones be =bygones, Iwill even pay an arrears, but if push comes to shove and names are to =becalled, then all power to Steve!!! Darryl, this part of it is not your fight. I hope you do not =encourageMark in this "subscriber beating" because many will be slandered and =nonewill be served. Regards to all, -Doug Easton At 08:42 PM 4/5/2000 EDT, DNHayashida@aol.com wrote: Maybe it's Monday morning quarterbacking, but why would one =fulfillseveralhundred unpaid subscriptions? Also, why would one maintain that =samesubscription list to be audited by the P.O. for current issuedistribution?Also, is there a reason he can't list these "several hundred" =deadbeats onhis website? My city and county governments lists names of people =in thelocal newspaper that are delinquent in property taxes...hey we = talkingabout public flogging! I'm pulling for the magazine to succeed. =Sorryforthe bandwidth, my $ .06 worth. How many magazines do you know of that wait for full payment beforethey send you the magazine? Mark has considered sending them to acollection agency, but I think he still believes cane rod people are =betterthan that.The Post office would definitely revoke the permit if they found =addressesthey mailed to not in the subscription list,and Mark could list a couple hundred "deadbeats" just on this list =alone.Mark will probably chew me out for letting the numbers out, but it is =550"deadbeats" out of a subscriber base of 2500.Darryl Doug EastonTonawanda, NY ------=_NextPart_000_000D_01BFA005.BA10B140 I did the same thing when I first heard of the BFR. I was = informed sometime later that they didn't take credit cards ! I guess I = the same class with you ! (grin) Just for the heck of it, I'm going to = sub. rate, and then see if I even get my back issues ! GMA ----- Original Message ----- Douglas = Easton = Sent: Thursday, April 06, 2000 = PMSubject: Re: BFRDarryl,If Mark did publish the list I would be = He says I did not pay but Isent my credit card # to his web site = order form) before the firstissue was out. He sent the year's = to me and when I enquired bye mail as to how I should sign up for = year, after a couple ofweeks he informed me that I had not payed = first. This was news to me!Yes, this is a big SNAFU, but I am = "deadbeat." I tendered paymentand Mark didn't collect. Like Don I = willing to let bygones be bygones, Iwill even pay an arrears, but = slandered and nonewill be served.Regards to = city and county governments lists names of people in = = office would definitely revoke the permit if they found = ------=_NextPart_000_000D_01BFA005.BA10B140-- from jbarber@verinet.com Thu Apr 6 21:03:51 2000 Subject: Thread Puzzle List, Is there a simple test to tell if wrapping thread is silk or nylon.Thanks, John from Rcolo@ix.netcom.com Thu Apr 6 21:11:17 2000 WAA14626; "rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu" Subject: Re: casting clubs F3B5CD37518C1251D7F41A83" --------------F3B5CD37518C1251D7F41A83 Bob,Thanks for the site......great info. Rich bob maulucci wrote: After Chris's post with a link to the Golden Gate Casting Club, I havebeen checking these clubs and events out. Here's a site with somegreat info:http://home.att.net/~slowsnap/index.htmI never realized itwas so big a deal, although I must say that the references totournaments in BFR did interest me. (Bought at the fly shop, I was nota stiff!) Anyone in NY in a club?Bob Maulucci==================================================downandacross.combob@downandacross.com --------------F3B5CD37518C1251D7F41A83 Bob, bob maulucci wrote:After Chris's post with a link to the Golden GateCasting Club, I have been checking these clubs and events out. Here's asite with some great info:http://home.att.net/~slowsnap/index.htmInever realized it was so big a deal, although I must say that thereferencesto tournaments in BFR did interest me. (Bought at the fly shop, I was nota stiff!) Anyone in NY in a club?BobMaulucci==================================================downandacross.combob@downandacross.com --------------F3B5CD37518C1251D7F41A83-- from pmgoodwin@earthlink.net Thu Apr 6 21:16:06 2000 Subject: Re: Thread Puzzle A match will do it. If the thread is a manmade material it will melt. If it is natural it willburn and leave an ash. So put a strand up to the flame and see what it does. Caution: Match may be hot. Don't burn youself... Paul ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Thread Puzzle List, Is there a simple test to tell if wrapping thread is silk or nylon.Thanks, John from lblan@provide.net Thu Apr 6 23:13:21 2000 Subject: RE: Post Whew... after all the discussion I could only think of one thing to do...pay for another year! -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu DNHayashida@aol.comSent: Thursday, April 06, 2000 10:13 AM Subject: Re: Post Hey Daryll, maybe you could put some ofus in contact with Mark to "talk" about this possibility. Bam-fly@pacbell.netDarryl from Michael.Roberts@health.wa.gov.au Thu Apr 6 23:23:06 2000 E-Mail VirusWall NT); Fri, 07 Apr 200012:21:24 +0800 (5.5.2651.58) Subject: Old rod Hi everyone, A friend recently purchased a couple of old cane rods and asked me to havealook at them. One is a cheap and nasty Japanese fly/spin combo that willspend the rest of its days in a picture box HIGH up the wall of this chap'sden. The other is a bit more interesting though. It is an 8' 6" two piecewith full intermediate wraps every 3/4". The ferrule is brass with afinelyknurled lip on the female which is also stamped with the number 9. Thereelseat appears to be either bakelite or a very dark wood with a pinned onhood for the threaded downlocking system that is used. The thread forthisis quite coarse and while the pinned on hood appears to be chrome or NS,thethreaded components seem to be aluminium. Stamped around the metalring atthe base of the reelseat (before the rubber plug) are the words: J.J.S.WALKER BAMPTON & Co. 26678 MAKERS ALNWICK. On the blank itself intheusual place for inscriptions is the name "Joe Longa" and 9' 3" written inspiral fashion up the blank. As I've already mentioned the rod is actually8' 6" but it has obvious signs of repair although both sections are almostexactly the same length. Can any of you tell me a bit about this rod? Idon't think its worth much but a bit of history would be interesting. Oh yeah. We tried casting a WF7 which felt about right and seemed toperform ok but I can't say I enjoyed the experience. This rod isSLOOOWWWWand REAAALLLLLLY HEAAAVVVVY. It felt like a floppy, waterlogged,timberpower pole. TIA Mike from petermckean@netspace.net.au Fri Apr 7 06:25:50 2000 VAA22707; "'RODMAKERS'" Subject: Re: Old rod MikeI live in Australia, where old English rods like this are as common as thecold. They are all(!) heavy and noodly and feel like wet power poles. It'sthe reason that people like me subscribe to lists in the USA and build theirown cane rods - the American makers got it right; the English went inearly rod,the "CC de France"which was just passable, but when you've said thatyou'vesaid it all.Your previous item about slippage of the strips when planing; I am anewcomer to this business, and my opinion is probably just that, but themost useful tip I have seen was in Planing Form. What you do is raise theform about 3 or 4 inches off the surface of the bench, which I do with acouple of wooden blocks routed out to accept the forms, and attatched tothebench with dowels(for easy removal). The point is that you can get yourthumb under the whole thing and your fingers on top, which dramaticallyincreases your grip and tends to stop slippage, cuttage, and bleedage!Peter----- Original Message ----- Subject: Old rod Hi everyone, A friend recently purchased a couple of old cane rods and asked me tohavealook at them. One is a cheap and nasty Japanese fly/spin combo that willspend the rest of its days in a picture box HIGH up the wall of thischap'sden. The other is a bit more interesting though. It is an 8' 6" twopiecewith full intermediate wraps every 3/4". The ferrule is brass with afinelyknurled lip on the female which is also stamped with the number 9. Thereelseat appears to be either bakelite or a very dark wood with a pinnedonhood for the threaded downlocking system that is used. The thread forthisis quite coarse and while the pinned on hood appears to be chrome or NS,thethreaded components seem to be aluminium. Stamped around the metalringatthe base of the reelseat (before the rubber plug) are the words: J.J.S.WALKER BAMPTON & Co. 26678 MAKERS ALNWICK. On the blank itselfin theusual place for inscriptions is the name "Joe Longa" and 9' 3" written inspiral fashion up the blank. As I've already mentioned the rod isactually8' 6" but it has obvious signs of repair although both sections are almostexactly the same length. Can any of you tell me a bit about this rod? Idon't think its worth much but a bit of history would be interesting. Oh yeah. We tried casting a WF7 which felt about right and seemed toperform ok but I can't say I enjoyed the experience. This rod isSLOOOWWWWand REAAALLLLLLY HEAAAVVVVY. It felt like a floppy, waterlogged,timberpower pole. TIA Mike from rcurry@ttlc.net Fri Apr 7 07:41:05 2000 (SMTPD32-6.00) id A8573450154; Fri, 07 Apr 2000 08:45:11 -0400 Subject: Re: Just Curious - reels All,Just home from travel and found 393 list emails. But this is one I wanttoanswer.I use mostly old Pfleugers, all sizes from Delite to 1498. But lately,I'vebeen using mostly the old Johnson Magnetics. I use the #5 for 6wt and up,andthe #3 for anything smaller. Nice feel, no overrun, and no click.Best regards,Reed from flyrod@pop.digisys.net Fri Apr 7 08:50:30 2000 Subject: question anad apology first off a big I'm sorry to the list operators i have been sending mail toi the wrong address! oopsnow a questionA freind of mine is looking at buying an okder cane rod (pre WW1)made by Wright &McGill. and has the following markings on it (so Ive been told havent seen the rod yet)Granger R Steelie No. MDF 8 1/2 ft.She may have it in posession in a week or so and will take some digital pics if it would help in identifying. main question is what it might be worth as far as purchase price? Irealize without seeing it it's not possible but is therre a general range ? TIA Great list!Jim in MontanaForgive me, I build plastic rods, but dream of doing cane some day! from DNHayashida@aol.com Fri Apr 7 11:53:04 2000 Subject: Re: BFR I know for a fact Mark does takes credit cards...Darryl I did the same thing when I first heard of the BFR. I was then informed sometime later that they didn't take credit cards ! I guess I fall into the same class with you ! (grin) Just for the heck of it, I'm going to pay the sub. rate, and then see if I even get my back issues ! from brewer@teleport.com Fri Apr 7 12:32:27 2000 "taliesin"via SMTP by relay1.teleport.com, id smtpdAAAa0gyg_; Fri Apr 7 10:32:142000 Subject: Re: BFR I paid by check for two years in advance, so I don't think it's a questionof how or when you paid. If it were, I would expect to see some issues. Iexpect that it is just a cash shortage, which is common for many smallbusinesses. I would very much like to know what kind of resources they DOneed to get back in operation (by that I mean actually sending allmagazinesout on schedule). If that was known, we could make an informed decisionabout how much we wanted to help out financially to get the thing goingagain. My $.02- Randy Brewer ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: BFR I know for a fact Mark does takes credit cards...Darryl I did the same thing when I first heard of the BFR. I was then informedsometime later that they didn't take credit cards ! I guess I fall intothesame class with you ! (grin) Just for the heck of it, I'm going to paythesub. rate, and then see if I even get my back issues ! from macbarn@hotmail.com Fri Apr 7 12:50:58 2000 Fri, 07 Apr 2000 10:50:25 PDT Subject: New Member Just joined this week and have enjoyed listing in. Have been building rods first Magazine. Bought a two year subscription by credit card .The last issue is vol.1 no4. Was this the last one pub? Lost a Paul Young Midgemany years ago on the Brueal in Minn. Made for my father. Mr. H.Y. barnes. Has any one seen it. His name is on the rod. thanks you, Sandy Barnes______________________________________________________Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com from watson@cape-consult.co.uk Fri Apr 7 13:46:22 2000 Fri, 7 Apr 2000 19:46:00 +0100 (BST) "'RODMAKERS'" Subject: Re: Old rod Walker BamptonNorthern Rod and Reel WorksHotspur PlaceAlnwick (pronounced Annick)were in business from 1921 to 1968beyond that I can only tell you that they built a 13'2", 12', 11', 10'6",9'6" and 9'3". They may have built more but I have no reference to that.Sorry not to be of more use.Tim ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Old rod Hi everyone, A friend recently purchased a couple of old cane rods and asked me tohavealook at them. One is a cheap and nasty Japanese fly/spin combo that willspend the rest of its days in a picture box HIGH up the wall of thischap'sden. The other is a bit more interesting though. It is an 8' 6" twopiecewith full intermediate wraps every 3/4". The ferrule is brass with afinelyknurled lip on the female which is also stamped with the number 9. Thereelseat appears to be either bakelite or a very dark wood with a pinnedonhood for the threaded downlocking system that is used. The thread forthisis quite coarse and while the pinned on hood appears to be chrome or NS,thethreaded components seem to be aluminium. Stamped around the metalringatthe base of the reelseat (before the rubber plug) are the words: J.J.S.WALKER BAMPTON & Co. 26678 MAKERS ALNWICK. On the blank itselfin theusual place for inscriptions is the name "Joe Longa" and 9' 3" written inspiral fashion up the blank. As I've already mentioned the rod isactually8' 6" but it has obvious signs of repair although both sections are almostexactly the same length. Can any of you tell me a bit about this rod? Idon't think its worth much but a bit of history would be interesting. Oh yeah. We tried casting a WF7 which felt about right and seemed toperform ok but I can't say I enjoyed the experience. This rod isSLOOOWWWWand REAAALLLLLLY HEAAAVVVVY. It felt like a floppy, waterlogged,timberpower pole. TIA Mike from mschaffer@mindspring.com Fri Apr 7 14:33:01 2000 Subject: 600 grit eraser. Just wanted to thank everyone who suggested putting on a coat or two offinish before writing on the rod, then when dry, overcoating the writingwith another coat or two.I was lookng at the wirting on my first rod and came to the conclusionthatit looked like it had been applied with a paint roller--major ugly!! So....Igot out the 600 grit 'eraser', took off the writing and re-inked. Well,after drying and refinishing, I can't tell where the original even was onthe rod!! My sig. may not be museum quality, but it doesn't look like itwas done by a kindergarten class any longer either!Thanks guys, Mike from paul.blakley@dtn.ntl.com Fri Apr 7 15:25:20 2000 helo=dtn.ntl.com) "'RODMAKERS'" Subject: Re: Old rod Walker Bampton also made some 8'6" rods with a very similar action tothe CCde France.They are quite common in the UK and typically go forabout £50- £75 on the used rod scene.One of the former rod makers is still in business making and repairingrods......he still lives in Alnwick .I have always suspected that Walker Bampton were ex Hardy employeeswhoset up their own business...........Paul B Watson's wrote: Walker BamptonNorthern Rod and Reel WorksHotspur PlaceAlnwick (pronounced Annick)were in business from 1921 to 1968beyond that I can only tell you that they built a 13'2", 12', 11', 10'6",9'6" and 9'3". They may have built more but I have no reference to that.Sorry not to be of more use.Tim ----- Original Message -----From: Roberts, Michael Sent: Friday, April 07, 2000 5:20 AMSubject: Old rod Hi everyone, A friend recently purchased a couple of old cane rods and asked me tohavealook at them. One is a cheap and nasty Japanese fly/spin combo thatwillspend the rest of its days in a picture box HIGH up the wall of thischap'sden. The other is a bit more interesting though. It is an 8' 6" twopiecewith full intermediate wraps every 3/4". The ferrule is brass with afinelyknurled lip on the female which is also stamped with the number 9. Thereelseat appears to be either bakelite or a very dark wood with apinnedonhood for the threaded downlocking system that is used. The thread forthisis quite coarse and while the pinned on hood appears to be chrome orNS,thethreaded components seem to be aluminium. Stamped around the metalringatthe base of the reelseat (before the rubber plug) are the words: J.J.S.WALKER BAMPTON & Co. 26678 MAKERS ALNWICK. On the blank itselfin theusual place for inscriptions is the name "Joe Longa" and 9' 3" writteninspiral fashion up the blank. As I've already mentioned the rod isactually8' 6" but it has obvious signs of repair although both sections arealmostexactly the same length. Can any of you tell me a bit about this rod? Idon't think its worth much but a bit of history would be interesting. Oh yeah. We tried casting a WF7 which felt about right and seemed toperform ok but I can't say I enjoyed the experience. This rod isSLOOOWWWWand REAAALLLLLLY HEAAAVVVVY. It felt like a floppy, waterlogged,timberpower pole. TIA Mike from bluefin_1999@yahoo.com Fri Apr 7 15:42:40 2000 2000 13:42:08 PDT Subject: Re: BFR...ENOUGH BFR COME ON GUYS LETS TRY AND STAY FOCUSED ON RODMAKING.. Thankyou, B.F. --- Randy Brewer wrote:I paid by check for two years in advance, so I don'tthink it's a questionof how or when you paid. If it were, I would expectto see some issues. Iexpect that it is just a cash shortage, which iscommon for many smallbusinesses. I would very much like to know what kindof resources they DOneed to get back in operation (by that I meanactually sending all magazinesout on schedule). If that was known, we could makean informed decisionabout how much we wanted to help out financially toget the thing goingagain. My $.02- Randy Brewer ----- Original Message -----From: Sent: Friday, April 07, 2000 9:52 AMSubject: Re: BFR I know for a fact Mark does takes credit cards...Darryl I did the same thing when I first heard of theBFR. I was then informedsometime later that they didn't take creditcards ! I guess I fall intothesame class with you ! (grin) Just for the heckof it, I'm going to paythesub. rate, and then see if I even get my backissues ! __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger.http://im.yahoo.com from tklein@amgen.com Fri Apr 7 16:53:21 2000 smtp.amgen.com via smap (V4.2) Subject: RE: BFR Uh oh! The magazines web page looks like it's gone. It doesn't appear to simply be offline. I got a directory listing and theredon't appear to be any files in the directory. Did Mark finally get sick of dealing with the whole thing, or did hisprovider have some sort of problem? Tim from Canerods@aol.com Fri Apr 7 17:41:55 2000 Subject: Re: question anad apology In a message dated 4/7/00 6:55:52 AM Pacific Daylight Time, flyrod@pop.digisys.net writes: A freind of mine is looking at buying an okder cane rod (pre WW1)made by Wright &McGill. and has the following markings on it (so Ive been told havent seen the rod yet)Granger R Steelie No. MDF 8 1/2 ft.She may have it in posession in a week or so and will take some digital pics if it would help in identifying. main question is what it might be worth as far as purchase price? Irealize without seeing it it's not possible but is therre a general range ? TIA Great list!Jim in Montana Jim, W&M bought out the Goodwin Granger Company after WWII - so to find apre- WWII Granger rod you'd need to find a GOODWIN GRANGER rod. Also, the markings that you describe does't sound like a any era Granger BAMBOO rod - might be a W&M Eagle Claw fiberglass or steel rod? Don Burns from Canerods@aol.com Fri Apr 7 18:12:29 2000 Subject: Re: BFR In a message dated 4/7/00 3:32:59 PM Pacific Daylight Time,tklein@amgen.com writes: Uh oh! The magazines web page looks like it's gone. It doesn't appear to simply be offline. I got a directory listing and theredon't appear to be any files in the directory. Did Mark finally get sick of dealing with the whole thing, or did hisprovider have some sort of problem? Tim Tim (and all), How strange, I'm afraid to guess what that means! Yesterday (thursday), I received an email from Mark regarding my BFRposts about how close to the money my comments were - I replied ASAP. So far my reply to him has bounced twice! I had hoped to generate a more positive attitude toward him and TBBFR and wanted to see if we couldn't re-jumpstart his efforts. I hope I didn't have the opposite effect! Darryl, can you offer any ideas or comments as to what's what? Don Burns from rclarke@eou.edu Fri Apr 7 18:37:04 2000 -0700 "tklein@amgen.com","rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu" Subject: RE: BFR(with appologies) Don, I used to get my emails to Mark bounced as well. I think it is theservice he is using. Have not spoketo Mark in some time, but he has always been very good to me. Sorry tokeep this thread running. Hope wedon't beat up on him to much as he is a good fellow with a noble effort. I had planned on contributing more to the mag than I have (cartoon, issue 4(i think??)), but work and familyhas not allowed. I hope he makes it. Robert Clarkecathcreek@hotmail.com -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: BFR In a message dated 4/7/00 3:32:59 PM Pacific Daylight Time,tklein@amgen.com writes: Uh oh! The magazines web page looks like it's gone. It doesn't appear to simply be offline. I got a directory listing and theredon't appear to be any files in the directory. Did Mark finally get sick of dealing with the whole thing, or did hisprovider have some sort of problem? Tim Tim (and all), How strange, I'm afraid to guess what that means! Yesterday (thursday), I received an email from Mark regarding my BFRposts about how close to the money my comments were - I replied ASAP. So far my reply to him has bounced twice! I had hoped to generate a more positive attitude toward him and TBBFR and wanted to see if we couldn't re-jumpstart his efforts. I hope I didn't have the opposite effect! Darryl, can you offer any ideas or comments as to what's what? Don Burns from rafick@3riversweb.net Fri Apr 7 18:50:36 2000 0000 Subject: Re: BFR I received an e mail from Mark, a week or two ago, that The Bamboo FlyrodMagazine would be moving their web site to a new location.So this isn't unexpected, nor does it mean anything like y'all are thinking. RA R.A.Fick Bamboo FlyrodsThe best rods are being made today.www.angelfire.com/in2/rafickrods/-----Original Message----- Subject: Re: BFR In a message dated 4/7/00 3:32:59 PM Pacific Daylight Time,tklein@amgen.comwrites: Uh oh! The magazines web page looks like it's gone. It doesn't appear to simply be offline. I got a directory listing andtheredon't appear to be any files in the directory. Did Mark finally get sick of dealing with the whole thing, or did hisprovider have some sort of problem? Tim Tim (and all), How strange, I'm afraid to guess what that means! Yesterday (thursday), I received an email from Mark regarding my BFRpostsabout how close to the money my comments were - I replied ASAP. So far my reply to him has bounced twice! I had hoped to generate a more positive attitude toward him and TBBFRandwanted to see if we couldn't re-jumpstart his efforts. I hope I didn't havethe opposite effect! Darryl, can you offer any ideas or comments as to what's what? Don Burns from nsflyrods@ns.sympatico.ca Fri Apr 7 19:01:59 2000 Subject: change of topic I think I've heard just about enough about BFR until there issome new info (hopefully news that it is up and running and my copy isat the mailbox).Seeing how it's Friday night and other than BFR things are alittle slow I figured I would throw a little question in the ring. Lastweek it was "one fly" this week I would like to ask "If you were toldyou could only use 3 cane rods for the rest of your life, what wouldthey be?"I can't wait to see the results of this one even though I canforesee one strong contender!My personal favorite?......1) PHY Perfectionist 7'6"4wt2)Payne 97 7'0" 4/5 wt3)Cattanach Sir D 6'3"2wt 3pcsor maybe............Shawn from horsesho@ptd.net Fri Apr 7 19:20:20 2000 0000 (204.186.211.32) Subject: Re: change of topic Shawn Pineo wrote: I think I've heard just about enough about BFR until there issome new info (hopefully news that it is up and running and my copy isat the mailbox).Seeing how it's Friday night and other than BFR things are alittle slow I figured I would throw a little question in the ring. Lastweek it was "one fly" this week I would like to ask "If you were toldyou could only use 3 cane rods for the rest of your life, what wouldthey be?"I can't wait to see the results of this one even though I canforesee one strong contender!My personal favorite?......1) PHY Perfectionist 7'6"4wt2)Payne 97 7'0" 4/5 wt3)Cattanach Sir D 6'3"2wt 3pcsor maybe............ShawnOnly 3 eh? 1. 7' Granger taper2. 71/2' Granger Taper3. 5'-9" Orvis Ultralite taperMarty from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Fri Apr 7 19:46:36 2000 Subject: Re: New Member Sandy,I can't help you with the PHY, but welcome to the list! Harry Boyd MM Barnes wrote: Just joined this week and have enjoyed listing in. Have been buildingrods Thefirst Magazine. Bought a two year subscription by credit card .The lastissue is vol.1 no4. Was this the last one pub? Lost a Paul Young Midgemanyyears ago on the Brueal in Minn. Made for my father. Mr. H.Y. barnes. Hasany one seen it. His name is on the rod. thanks you, Sandy Barnes______________________________________________________Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com --Harry Boydhttp://HarryBoydbamboorods.eboard.com/ from oakmere@carol.net Fri Apr 7 19:54:36 2000 Subject: RE: Flyrod Carry On Hi Folks: Was just over and back to the UK. Took a couple of 4 piecers along over andthere was no problem. Also brought back a longer 3 piece rod in a separaterod case and it fit the overhead rack and I had no problems. Was flyingDelta. FrankFrank Paul, GreyFox2932 North Bayshore DriveSeneca, SC 29672fwpaul@ces.clemson.edu (work)oakmere@carol.net (home) from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Fri Apr 7 20:05:49 2000 Fri, 7 Apr 2000 18:05:29 -0700 Subject: Re: change of topic Just to save a little bandwidth, here's what a bunch of us determined sometime ago about the 25 best tapers ever made. Bill Lamberson was theoriginalcompiler of the list.Might be interesting to start again, though, since there seems to besomenew blood on the list.Harry The list of 25 tapers is up to 37. I have lost track of some of thenominators, but I think this is the complete list of rods. Bill LambersonYoung Driggs Tony Young Dell CoppockYoung Para 15 Tony Young Tom SmithwickYoung Midge Tony Young Davy RiggsYoung Perfectionist Carsten JorgensenSir D Tony Young Steve TrauthweinGarrison l93 AlexGarrison 212E Tom Smithwick John ZimnyGarrison 221Garrison 201E Rob HoffhinesLeonard 50 Rob HoffhinesLeonard 38H 7' #4 AnonymousLeonard model 50 1/2, 8 1/2ft 3pc 5wghtPayne 98 Rob HoffhinesPayne 200 Rob Hoffhines Max SatohGranger Special Steve ( from TomMaxwell)Cross Bataviakill Davy RiggsCross Sylph Dell CoppockF. E. Thomas Browntone Light Trout Davy RiggsFE Thomas 71/2 4wt Rob HoffhinesOrvis Flea Anonymous> Hardy C. C. deFrance or Tarantino DavyRiggsKretchman 6' 6" #3 Reed CurryHeddon 9' 2 * F 3 pc # 7/8 Don BurnsFarlow made Norm Thompson 6' 2 *" 2 pc # 4/5 Don BurnsDawn Holbrook 8.5' tapers for a #7 or #8 lines Rob NielsenThramer 6' 472Dx Chris McDowellA.J. Thamer's 8' Dx John ChannerWinston Little FellerWinston 8' #7 Dell CoppockDickerson 8013 John ChannerHardy Perfection Carsten JorgensenMerritt Hawes 9ft 3pc 6wght Alan GrombacherMike Clark 8ft 2pc 6wght Alan GrombacherJohn Zimny Model 98 7 ft quad Bill Fink Reed CurryP&M Ritz Parabolic PPP Colorado 7'7" #5 Morten LovstadChris Bogart's Shenandoah Supreme #4 Max Satoh marty wrote:Only 3 eh? 1. 7' Granger taper 2. 71/2' Granger Taper 3. 5'-9" OrvisUltralite taperMarty from oakmere@carol.net Fri Apr 7 20:10:01 2000 Fri, 7 Apr 2000 21:09:56 -0400 rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Subject: RE: Writing on Rods Mike and others: I have been working to develop my approach for writing on rods (bambooandothers). My approach uses waterbased acrylic artist paint from the tube.Thin it with water so you can write on the rod with a "dip" type ink pen. Iuse Krylon clear fixer spray as a base and then also put it overtop of theacrylic writing before varnishing or coating. The Krylon seals thewaterbased acrylic painting writing and keeps it from running before finalvarnish or epoxy. The spray must be put on is short bursts so that it doesnot run. It is best to make several coats. I am sure there are other waysto do it but this has worked for me. Also, this approach lets you use anycolor you want for writing - black, white, yellow, or whatever. FrankFrank Paul, GreyFox2932 North Bayshore DriveSeneca, SC 29672fwpaul@ces.clemson.edu (work)oakmere@carol.net (home) from rsgould@cmc.net Fri Apr 7 21:12:09 2000 Subject: Re: change of topic Hi Marty,Perhaps this isn't very humble of me but when it comes to fishing withonly3 rods I wouldn't be without my own RR-95- 8 1/4ft x 2pc x 7wt. I madethatrod in 1991 and have used it steadily ever since. Incorporated in thedesignis a "swell in the butt" and an 18" graphite insert in the handle area ofthe butt section. The reason I like this rod so much is that it casts aCortland 444 7F/S (sink tip) better than any other rod I've tried and I findthis a really effective way to go after the big kamloops trout in B.C. Thentoo, there's something special about designing and building your owntapersand rods that gives a sense of accomplishment.Ray----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: change of topic Shawn Pineo wrote: I think I've heard just about enough about BFR until there issome new info (hopefully news that it is up and running and my copy isat the mailbox).Seeing how it's Friday night and other than BFR things are alittle slow I figured I would throw a little question in the ring. Lastweek it was "one fly" this week I would like to ask "If you were toldyou could only use 3 cane rods for the rest of your life, what wouldthey be?"I can't wait to see the results of this one even though I canforesee one strong contender!My personal favorite?......1) PHY Perfectionist 7'6"4wt2)Payne 97 7'0" 4/5 wt3)Cattanach Sir D 6'3"2wt 3pcsor maybe............ShawnOnly 3 eh? 1. 7' Granger taper2. 71/2' Granger Taper3. 5'-9" Orvis Ultralite taperMarty from ernie2@pacbell.net Fri Apr 7 21:45:36 2000 sims.3.5.2000.01.05.12.18.p9)with SMTP id for Subject: Re: change of topic That's nice Harry, but where can I find the tapers?Ernie ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: change of topic Just to save a little bandwidth, here's what a bunch of us determinedsometime ago about the 25 best tapers ever made. Bill Lamberson was theoriginalcompiler of the list.Might be interesting to start again, though, since there seems to besomenew blood on the list.Harry The list of 25 tapers is up to 37. I have lost track of some of thenominators, but I think this is the complete list of rods. Bill LambersonYoung Driggs Tony Young Dell CoppockYoung Para 15 Tony Young Tom SmithwickYoung Midge Tony Young Davy RiggsYoung Perfectionist Carsten JorgensenSir D Tony Young Steve TrauthweinGarrison l93 AlexGarrison 212E Tom Smithwick John ZimnyGarrison 221Garrison 201E Rob HoffhinesLeonard 50 Rob HoffhinesLeonard 38H 7' #4 AnonymousLeonard model 50 1/2, 8 1/2ft 3pc 5wghtPayne 98 Rob HoffhinesPayne 200 Rob Hoffhines Max SatohGranger Special Steve ( from TomMaxwell)Cross Bataviakill Davy RiggsCross Sylph Dell CoppockF. E. Thomas Browntone Light Trout Davy RiggsFE Thomas 71/2 4wt Rob HoffhinesOrvis Flea AnonymousHardy C. C. deFrance or Tarantino Davy RiggsKretchman 6' 6" #3 Reed CurryHeddon 9' 2 * F 3 pc # 7/8 Don BurnsFarlow made Norm Thompson 6' 2 *" 2 pc # 4/5 Don BurnsDawn Holbrook 8.5' tapers for a #7 or #8 lines Rob NielsenThramer 6' 472Dx Chris McDowellA.J. Thamer's 8' Dx John ChannerWinston Little FellerWinston 8' #7 Dell CoppockDickerson 8013 John ChannerHardy Perfection Carsten JorgensenMerritt Hawes 9ft 3pc 6wght Alan GrombacherMike Clark 8ft 2pc 6wght Alan GrombacherJohn Zimny Model 98 7 ft quad Bill Fink Reed CurryP&M Ritz Parabolic PPP Colorado 7'7" #5 Morten LovstadChris Bogart's Shenandoah Supreme #4 Max Satoh marty wrote:Only 3 eh? 1. 7' Granger taper 2. 71/2' Granger Taper 3. 5'-9"OrvisUltralite taperMarty from Grhghlndr@aol.com Fri Apr 7 21:52:31 2000 Subject: Re: BFR Mark told me the other day that they were changing providers and that it might be down a couple of days from rmoon@ida.net Fri Apr 7 22:03:37 2000 0000 Subject: Re: change of topic My 6' My71/2' My8' Like you Ray I like my own tapers best.Ralph from fquinchat@locl.net Sat Apr 8 06:26:32 2000 corsair.locl.net (8.9.0/8.7.3) with SMTP idGAA25815 for ; Sat, 8 Apr 2000 06:26:28 - Subject: Color preserver boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0004_01BFA124.9D3739C0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0004_01BFA124.9D3739C0 When using color preserver, how do you get the silk completely =encapulated. I'm having trouble with the varnish darkening the wraps as =it seeps in under the guide feet. Dennis ------=_NextPart_000_0004_01BFA124.9D3739C0 When using color preserver, howdo = the wraps as it seeps in under the guide feet. Dennis ------=_NextPart_000_0004_01BFA124.9D3739C0-- from TSmithwick@aol.com Sat Apr 8 07:16:09 2000 Subject: Re: Color preserver In a message dated 4/8/0 11:30:51 AM, fquinchat@locl.net writes: Dennis - Thinning the first coat will probably help. Also, don't be completely neat when applying the stuff. The problem comes when varnishis drawn under the wraps by capillary action. The only way to fight it is to make sure the wrap edges are sealed. In the area of the guide foot, use the tip of the brush to drive in a bit of preserver. from nobler@satx.rr.com Sat Apr 8 07:52:15 2000 SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.357.35);Sat, 8 Apr 2000 07:53:03 -0500 Subject: Re: Color preserver boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0011_01BFA12F.ACD5F0A0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0011_01BFA12F.ACD5F0A0 Yes, the thinner the first few coats are, the better. I mean like water =! The tip of a fine brush under the small gap on either side of the =guide feet is also important. I carefully wipe the brush against the =foot, to get more inside these areas. Even if it takes 20 coats, it's =worth the trouble, if you don't want the varnish to penetrate. After =several ultra thin coats, you can start putting on thicker coats the =same way, looking to completely fill the vacant areas around the guide =feet. GMA Sent: Saturday, April 08, 2000 7:15 AMSubject: Re: Color preserver In a message dated 4/8/0 11:30:51 AM, fquinchat@locl.net writes: completely neat when applying the stuff. The problem comes when = drawn under the wraps by capillary action. The only way to fight it is = make sure the wrap edges are sealed. In the area of the guide foot, = tip of the brush to drive in a bit of preserver. ------=_NextPart_000_0011_01BFA12F.ACD5F0A0 like water ! The tip of a fine brush under the small gap on either side = guide feet is also important. I carefully wipe the brush against the = get more inside these areas. Even if it takes 20 coats, it's worth the = if you don't want the varnish to penetrate. After several ultra thin = can start putting on thicker coats the same way, looking to completely = vacant areas around the guide feet. GMA ----- Original Message ----- TSmithwick@aol.com = Sent: Saturday, April 08, 2000 = AMSubject: Re: Color =preserver writes:<< I'm having trouble with the varnish darkening = Thinning the first coat will probably help. Also, don't be = when applying the stuff. The problem comes when varnish is drawn = wraps by capillary action. The only way to fight it is to make = wrap edges are sealed. In the area of the guide foot, use the tip = brush to drive in a bit of preserver. ------=_NextPart_000_0011_01BFA12F.ACD5F0A0-- from snooker_e@yahoo.com Sat Apr 8 08:06:38 2000 2000 06:06:34 PDT Subject: Re: Color preserver I'm usually just a listener, but try using theGuedbrod #811 color preserver and thin it to 20%alcohol 80% color preserver. It will only take twocoats and the guedbrod has the best color retention ofany of the CP's I have tried. You should get noblotching with this CP. Good Luck and hope thishelps. Eric --- Dennis Bertram wrote:When using color preserver, how do you get the silkcompletely encapulated. I'm having trouble with thevarnish darkening the wraps as it seeps in under theguide feet. Dennis =====New Smyrna Beach, FL __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger.http://im.yahoo.com from bluefin_1999@yahoo.com Sat Apr 8 09:10:48 2000 2000 07:10:16 PDT Subject: Re: BFR TAKE THIS ELSEWHERE rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu ENOUGH IS ENOUGH --- Grhghlndr@aol.com wrote:Mark told me the other day that they were changingproviders and that it might be down a couple of days __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger.http://im.yahoo.com from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Sat Apr 8 09:11:03 2000 Sat, 8 Apr 2000 07:10:13 -0700 Subject: Re: change of topic I think nearly every one of them has been posted to this list at one time oranother. I've got most of them saved. Let me know what you want, and I'llgladly forward a copy. Harry Ernie Harrison wrote: That's nice Harry, but where can I find the tapers?Ernie ----- Original Message -----From: "Harry Boyd" Cc: Sent: Friday, April 07, 2000 6:02 PMSubject: Re: change of topic Just to save a little bandwidth, here's what a bunch of us determinedsometime ago about the 25 best tapers ever made. Bill Lamberson was theoriginalcompiler of the list.Might be interesting to start again, though, since there seems to besomenew blood on the list.Harry The list of 25 tapers is up to 37. I have lost track of some of thenominators, but I think this is the complete list of rods. Bill LambersonYoung Driggs Tony Young Dell CoppockYoung Para 15 Tony Young Tom SmithwickYoung Midge Tony Young Davy RiggsYoung Perfectionist Carsten JorgensenSir D Tony Young Steve TrauthweinGarrison l93 AlexGarrison 212E Tom Smithwick John ZimnyGarrison 221Garrison 201E Rob HoffhinesLeonard 50 Rob HoffhinesLeonard 38H 7' #4 AnonymousLeonard model 50 1/2, 8 1/2ft 3pc 5wghtPayne 98 Rob HoffhinesPayne 200 Rob Hoffhines Max SatohGranger Special Steve ( from TomMaxwell)Cross Bataviakill Davy RiggsCross Sylph Dell CoppockF. E. Thomas Browntone Light Trout Davy RiggsFE Thomas 71/2 4wt Rob HoffhinesOrvis Flea AnonymousHardy C. C. deFrance or Tarantino Davy RiggsKretchman 6' 6" #3 Reed CurryHeddon 9' 2 * F 3 pc # 7/8 Don BurnsFarlow made Norm Thompson 6' 2 *" 2 pc # 4/5 Don BurnsDawn Holbrook 8.5' tapers for a #7 or #8 lines Rob NielsenThramer 6' 472Dx Chris McDowellA.J. Thamer's 8' Dx John ChannerWinston Little FellerWinston 8' #7 Dell CoppockDickerson 8013 John ChannerHardy Perfection Carsten JorgensenMerritt Hawes 9ft 3pc 6wght Alan GrombacherMike Clark 8ft 2pc 6wght Alan GrombacherJohn Zimny Model 98 7 ft quad Bill Fink Reed CurryP&M Ritz Parabolic PPP Colorado 7'7" #5 Morten LovstadChris Bogart's Shenandoah Supreme #4 Max Satoh marty wrote:Only 3 eh? 1. 7' Granger taper 2. 71/2' Granger Taper 3. 5'-9"OrvisUltralite taperMarty --Harry Boydhttp://HarryBoydbamboorods.eboard.com/ from bob@downandacross.com Sat Apr 8 10:54:06 2000 (envelope- from bob@downandacross.com) (envelope- from bob@downandacross.com) Subject: Hand Mill set up and surface I would like to address this question to the Hand Mill usersout there. I am hoping you can help me out again.I received the base unit for my long bed Hand Mill on Tuesday. Ihave yet to receive the second box from UPS. I am wondering three thingsas I work to get it up and running:1. How big does my surface have to be to set the Hand Mill on foroperation? Are there supports in Box 2 that I need to compensatefor?2. What kind of surface is best for setting the Hand Mill on? Woulda standard 2x10x8 work? I have a bench top made of 2x10x6s and I thoughtI might just replace the closest section with an 8 ft. piece.3. Do I need to level the bed inserts before use? Would yourecommend Tom's flat cutting piece so as to do that with the Hand Millitself, or is this not necessary?Suggestions?Thanks very much, Bob Maulucci==================================================downandacross.com bob@downandacross.com from if6were9@bellsouth.net Sat Apr 8 17:14:56 2000 Subject: Jet Lathe I have a chance to get a Jet model BD-920N that is less than a year old experience with Jet I know nothing about them and was hoping someone onthe list could either tell me what kind of machine they are, or perhapsdirect me a source of information on this lathe.I would love to get a lathe for the price on this one, but I wouldrather spend the money on a good machine if the quality of the Jet lineis poor. Thanks in advance for any help. from petermckean@netspace.net.au Sat Apr 8 17:25:01 2000 IAA28438 Subject: Robert Milardo boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0023_01BFA1FC.B20B9FC0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0023_01BFA1FC.B20B9FC0 Robert Could you possibly give me your e-mail address, as the list members =probably don't want to know where I LIVE. My address is petermckean@netspace.net.au Peter ------=_NextPart_000_0023_01BFA1FC.B20B9FC0 Robert Could you possibly give me your e-mail= the list members probably don't want to know where I LIVE. My address is petermckean@netspace.net.au Peter ------=_NextPart_000_0023_01BFA1FC.B20B9FC0-- from nobler@satx.rr.com Sat Apr 8 17:27:18 2000 SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.357.35);Sat, 8 Apr 2000 17:28:11 -0500 Subject: Re: Jet Lathe boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0019_01BFA180.054BC200" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0019_01BFA180.054BC200 There are at least two models of Jet lathes, in the 10" size and up. The =finer grade comes with a spec. sheet attesting to its accuracy. Any Jet =is far superior to these cheaper versions on sale in so many places. =These are mostly from mainland China, and have many short comings. Any Jet, at half price, that's so new, is a super buy ! GMA Sent: Saturday, April 08, 2000 5:10 PMSubject: Jet Lathe I have a chance to get a Jet model BD-920N that is less than a year =old experience with Jet I know nothing about them and was hoping someone =onthe list could either tell me what kind of machine they are, or =perhapsdirect me a source of information on this lathe.I would love to get a lathe for the price on this one, but I wouldrather spend the money on a good machine if the quality of the Jet =lineis poor. Thanks in advance for any help. ------=_NextPart_000_0019_01BFA180.054BC200 There are at least two models of Jet lathes, in the 10" = up. The finer grade comes with a spec. sheet attesting to its accuracy. = is far superior to these cheaper versions on sale in so many places. = mostly from mainland China, and have many shortcomings. ! GMA ----- Original Message ----- Tumblin = Sent: Saturday, April 08, 2000 = PMSubject: Jet LatheI have a chance to get a Jet model BD-920N that is less = had anyexperience with Jet I know nothing about them and was = someone onthe list could either tell me what kind of machine they = perhapsdirect me a source of information on this lathe.I would = get a lathe for the price on this one, but I wouldrather spend the = advance for any help. ------=_NextPart_000_0019_01BFA180.054BC200-- from pmgoodwin@earthlink.net Sat Apr 8 19:28:25 2000 Subject: Re: Jet Lathe Up until a couple of years ago I used to ghost write reviews for a coupleeditorson woodworking and construction magazines. I've had a lot of jet tools inmyshop for testing and they were mine to keep - if I wanted them. I did notkeep asingle jet tool because they are not worth the floor space even if they arefree. A friend bought a bunch of Jet lathes for his business. Against my advice Imightadd. Their primary use was to hold buffing wheels to polish silver piecesforthe flutes he makes. After 6 months he threw them all out because thebearings were shot. There are some good tools coming out of Tiawan but Jet isn't one of them. Paul ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Jet Lathe I have a chance to get a Jet model BD-920N that is less than a year old experience with Jet I know nothing about them and was hoping someoneonthe list could either tell me what kind of machine they are, or perhapsdirect me a source of information on this lathe.I would love to get a lathe for the price on this one, but I wouldrather spend the money on a good machine if the quality of the Jet lineis poor. Thanks in advance for any help. from nobler@satx.rr.com Sat Apr 8 20:04:13 2000 SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.357.35);Sat, 8 Apr 2000 19:52:30 -0500 Subject: Re: Jet Lathe boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000B_01BFA195.F2A59480" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000B_01BFA195.F2A59480 Are you speaking of metal working machines ? I know some very good =machinists who swear by their Jet's. The high grade lathe, as documented= I know nothing about their wood working machines . Good bearings are =easily replaced. I'm no particular fan of most imports, but know too =many who like them in metal working. GMA Sent: Saturday, April 08, 2000 7:27 PMSubject: Re: Jet Lathe Up until a couple of years ago I used to ghost write reviews for a =coupleeditorson woodworking and construction magazines. I've had a lot of jet tools =in myshop for testing and they were mine to keep - if I wanted them. I did =notkeep asingle jet tool because they are not worth the floor space even if =they arefree. A friend bought a bunch of Jet lathes for his business. Against my =advice Imightadd. Their primary use was to hold buffing wheels to polish silver =piecesforthe flutes he makes. After 6 months he threw them all out because thebearings were shot. There are some good tools coming out of Tiawan but Jet isn't one of =them. Paul ----- Original Message -----From: "Pat Tumblin" Sent: Saturday, April 08, 2000 6:10 PMSubject: Jet Lathe I have a chance to get a Jet model BD-920N that is less than a year =old experience with Jet I know nothing about them and was hoping someone=onthe list could either tell me what kind of machine they are, or =perhapsdirect me a source of information on this lathe.I would love to get a lathe for the price on this one, but I wouldrather spend the money on a good machine if the quality of the Jet =lineis poor. Thanks in advance for any help. ------=_NextPart_000_000B_01BFA195.F2A59480 Are you speaking of metal working machines ? I know some= machinists who swear by their Jet's. The high grade lathe, as documented= at less than .00001". I know nothing about their wood working machines . Good = are easily replaced. I'm no particular fan of most imports, but know too = who like them in metal working. GMA ----- Original Message ----- Goodwin = Sent: Saturday, April 08, 2000 = PMSubject: Re: Jet LatheUp until a couple of years ago I used to ghost write = = a lot of jet tools in myshop for testing and they were mine to = wanted them. I did notkeep asingle jet tool because they are = the floor space even if they arefree.A friend bought a = Jet lathes for his business. Against my advice Imightadd. = primary use was to hold buffing wheels to polish silver = thebearings were shot.There are some good tools comingout = Tiawan but Jet isn't one of them.Paul----- = <rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= = a chance to get a Jet model BD-920N that is less than a year = experience with Jet I know nothing about them and was hoping would love to get a lathe for the price on this one, but I = ------=_NextPart_000_000B_01BFA195.F2A59480-- from Canerods@aol.com Sat Apr 8 20:23:10 2000 Subject: WTD: Heddon dark brown reelseat spacer Needed: Original Heddon Reedseat spacer. I have a 7'6" Heddon-made rodthat has had a pair of pliers used to remove it's reelseat at sometime in the past. Because the rod has some decent value I'd like to install a better reelseat spacer on it. The original spacer is a dark brown marblized color and I'd like to install the same color spacer. I could steal a different color sparer for a project rod if all else fails. Will buy or trade. Thx and PLEASE REPLY OFF LIST, Don BurnsCanerods@aol.com from mrmac@tcimet.net Sat Apr 8 22:19:48 2000 (envelope- from mrmac@tcimet.net) Subject: Re: Color preserver Which alcohol do you use for thinner? Isopropyl, denatured ethanol, ormethanol? Have you used it over light colors like yellow without bleedthrough? thanks - mac from lars32@gateway.net Sat Apr 8 22:20:38 2000 Subject: Bill Baylan Reels boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0004_01BFA1A9.9E6DBC80" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0004_01BFA1A9.9E6DBC80 Anyone know Baylans E Mail address?Dave ------=_NextPart_000_0004_01BFA1A9.9E6DBC80 Anyone know Baylans E Mail =address?Dave ------=_NextPart_000_0004_01BFA1A9.9E6DBC80-- from mevans@acxiom.com Sat Apr 8 22:26:26 2000 (router,SLMail V4.0); Sat, 08 Apr 2000 22:28:37 -0500 Interim Build)) with SMTP (router,SLMail V3.2); Sat, 08 Apr 2000 22:23:51 -0500 (204.107.111.23::mail daemon; unverified,SLMail V3.2); Sat, 08 Apr2000 22:23:51 -0500 popmail.conway.acxiom.com ; Sat Apr 08 22:23:50 2000 -0500 (5.5.2650.21) Subject: Which Taper Wins? Was RE: change of topic I don't remember seeing this list ordered by "the best" on down.If it hasn't been done, and there's interest, I'll volunteer totally some voting into a top 10 list. Maybe this would work witha simple criteria like best all around trout rod. Please don't start sending votes yet. If there's interest,I can send out another note in a day or so. Mark ----- Original Message -----From: "Harry Boyd" Cc: Sent: Friday, April 07, 2000 6:02 PMSubject: Re: change of topic... (clipped)Might be interesting to start again, though, since there seems to besomenew blood on the list.Harry The list of 25 tapers is up to 37. I have lost track of some of thenominators, but I think this is the complete list of rods. Bill LambersonYoung Driggs Tony Young Dell CoppockYoung Para 15 Tony Young Tom SmithwickYoung Midge Tony Young Davy RiggsYoung Perfectionist Carsten JorgensenSir D Tony Young Steve TrauthweinGarrison l93 AlexGarrison 212E Tom Smithwick John ZimnyGarrison 221Garrison 201E Rob HoffhinesLeonard 50 Rob HoffhinesLeonard 38H 7' #4 AnonymousLeonard model 50 1/2, 8 1/2ft 3pc 5wghtPayne 98 Rob HoffhinesPayne 200 Rob Hoffhines Max SatohGranger Special Steve ( from TomMaxwell)Cross Bataviakill Davy RiggsCross Sylph Dell CoppockF. E. Thomas Browntone Light Trout Davy RiggsFE Thomas 71/2 4wt Rob HoffhinesOrvis Flea AnonymousHardy C. C. deFrance or Tarantino Davy RiggsKretchman 6' 6" #3 Reed CurryHeddon 9' 2 * F 3 pc # 7/8 Don BurnsFarlow made Norm Thompson 6' 2 *" 2 pc # 4/5 Don BurnsDawn Holbrook 8.5' tapers for a #7 or #8 lines Rob NielsenThramer 6' 472Dx Chris McDowellA.J. Thamer's 8' Dx John ChannerWinston Little FellerWinston 8' #7 Dell CoppockDickerson 8013 John ChannerHardy Perfection Carsten JorgensenMerritt Hawes 9ft 3pc 6wght Alan GrombacherMike Clark 8ft 2pc 6wght Alan GrombacherJohn Zimny Model 98 7 ft quad Bill Fink Reed CurryP&M Ritz Parabolic PPP Colorado 7'7" #5 Morten LovstadChris Bogart's Shenandoah Supreme #4 Max Satoh marty wrote:Only 3 eh? 1. 7' Granger taper 2. 71/2' Granger Taper 3. 5'-9"OrvisUltralite taperMarty --Harry Boydhttp://HarryBoydbamboorods.eboard.com/ from dan_cooney@attglobal.net Sat Apr 8 23:12:50 2000 SMTP +0000 Subject: Re: Bill Baylan Reels boundary="------------47353CAA3D0E9880AD307EF1" --------------47353CAA3D0E9880AD307EF1 Try ballan@flyfishingstore.com Dan ----------------------lars32 wrote: Anyone know Baylans E Mail address?Dave --------------47353CAA3D0E9880AD307EF1 Try ballan@flyfishingstore.comDan----------------------lars32 wrote: know Baylans E Mail address?Dave --------------47353CAA3D0E9880AD307EF1-- from iank@nelson.planet.org.nz Sun Apr 9 01:37:29 2000 SMTP id SAA11914 for ; Sun, 9 Apr 200018:37:15 +1200 Subject: snake guide duribility I spent a few hours last Friday looking over the production facilities ofthe New Zealand fishing rod manufacturer , "Kilwell sports". They are thelargest producer of rods in NZ but only produce graphite rods thesedays.They also have the finest collection of old fishing reels and rods inNew Zealand and were very helpfull in offering to supply me with anycomponents they use at their cost( which is a lot less then mine imported from the USA) This includes such items as corks which they buy in 10,000lot boxes , reel seats , made up handles etc. It was nice to find these guysreally were as helpfull and supportive as they could be and reasonablycomplimentary regarding my rods. They did raise one matter that concerned me however. When theirproductionmanager , who had been making quite a few thousand rods a year for thelast40 years, saw my guides he said he would be concerned with the duribilityofthem . Mine were made out of paino wire using a "snake maker " from DaveLeClair. He said they used to make their own from similar steel in the1960's but since then used either the hard chrome guides or more recentlythe dark brown hard metal ones ( I forgot the material he said they were)Hesaid prior to that they had had problems with some guides wearing throughin2-3 years of heavy use , particually in the Taupo area where there is a lotof volcanic pumice dust. Has anyone any experience with paino wire snake guides duribility orabilityto withstand heavy use ? Ian Kearney from chris@artistree.com Sun Apr 9 02:23:22 2000 Subject: Re: Jet Lathe Pat,I've owned the Jet 920 metal lathe for a few years now. Mine has beenvery dependable, is very accurate and parts can easily be obtained forit. The only complaint I might have is that it can be a bit loud as itis gear driven and it's VERY heavy (make sure you have a strong friendand a solid table or stand). Other than that it's been great companionin my rod building.-- Best Regards, Chris Wohlfordemail: chris@artistree.com Pat Tumblin wrote: I have a chance to get a Jet model BD-920N that is less than a year old experience with Jet I know nothing about them and was hoping someoneonthe list could either tell me what kind of machine they are, or perhapsdirect me a source of information on this lathe.I would love to get a lathe for the price on this one, but I wouldrather spend the money on a good machine if the quality of the Jet lineis poor. Thanks in advance for any help. from nobler@satx.rr.com Sun Apr 9 08:24:20 2000 SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.357.35);Sun, 9 Apr 2000 08:25:13 -0500 Subject: Re: Color preserver boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000F_01BFA1FD.55C47740" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000F_01BFA1FD.55C47740 Most color preservers are either nitrate, or possibly butyrate based. =Nitrate thinners will only mix with nitrate, but butyl based thinners =will work in both. The best thinners are those with slow drying =additives, to prevent blushing. Blushing is caused by the surface drying =too quickly, and retaining moisture. Many acrylic lacquer thinners will thin most any volatile based =substance, and these will prevent the faster drying we don't desire. =These are preferable to the various alcohols, which tend to attract and =retain water readily. What we need with a color preserver, is total penetration of all the =thread fibers. Using a thin, slow drying base product, and using =multiple coats, will prevent the very slow drying varnishes from getting =into the thread fibers and changing the color. When I say slow drying, =in reference to the preserver, it's still many times faster drying than =varnish. GMA Sent: Saturday, April 08, 2000 10:19 PMSubject: Re: Color preserver Which alcohol do you use for thinner? Isopropyl, denatured ethanol, =ormethanol? Have you used it over light colors like yellow without bleedthrough? thanks - mac ------=_NextPart_000_000F_01BFA1FD.55C47740 Most color preservers are either nitrate, or possibly = based. Nitrate thinners will only mix with nitrate, but butyl based = will work in both. The best thinners are those with slow drying = prevent blushing. Blushing is caused by the surface drying too quickly, = retaining moisture. Many acrylic lacquer thinners will thin most any volatile = substance, and these will prevent the faster drying we don't desire. = preferable to the various alcohols, which tend to attract and retain = readily. What we need with a color preserver, is total penetration = the thread fibers. Using a thin, slow drying base product, and using = coats, will prevent the very slow drying varnishes from getting into the = fibers and changing the color. When I say slow drying, in reference to = preserver, it's still many times faster drying than =varnish. GMA ----- Original Message ----- Ralph= Cc: Rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= Sent: Saturday, April 08, 2000 = PMSubject: Re: Color =preserver denatured ethanol, ormethanol?Have you used it over light = -mac ------=_NextPart_000_000F_01BFA1FD.55C47740-- from TSmithwick@aol.com Sun Apr 9 08:34:01 2000 Subject: Re: snake guide duribility In a message dated 4/9/0 6:40:25 AM, iank@nelson.planet.org.nz writes: Ian - I can't give you definite guidelines, but I can tell you that the wear resistance of a guide is directly related to it's surface hardness. My feeling is that the music wire is fine for general use, but will eventually wear. It will probably take a long time, however, unless there areespecially harsh conditions.I have never seen a hard chrome guide fail, even on heavily used salt water rods. My belief is that there is a point somewhere between Rockwellhardness C50 and C60 where the guide becomes impervious to wear for all practicalpurposes. All it has to do, really, is outlast the varnish finish. The more modern coatings, like Titanium Nitride, are overkill in myopinion. They do come in some attractive colors, however, and are worthconsidering I often use the old style tungsten steel guides because of their classic appearance and have no wear problems, but I always use a modern blackchrome tip top, and a strong stripper. These are the real wear points. from nobler@satx.rr.com Sun Apr 9 08:37:47 2000 SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.357.35);Sun, 9 Apr 2000 08:38:39 -0500 Subject: Re: snake guide duribility boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0026_01BFA1FF.3609AF40" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0026_01BFA1FF.3609AF40 Ian, I assume you are speaking of piano wire, which is highly tempered spring =steel. While this material is very strong, and resilient, it is not rust =proof in any way. There is spring tempered, stainless steel, and I =wonder if you may possibly be using such a material. While this material =is very tough, and has good tensile strength, it is not know for its =high abrasion resistance. There are few materials that are harder, and more resistant to wear than=chrome, so I suspect this is why it is so popular in the manufacture of =guides. The Space Age has brought us ceramics, and many other advances, =but so far, chrome plated fly rod guides offer the most for the cost. GMA Sent: Sunday, April 09, 2000 1:37 AM I spent a few hours last Friday looking over the production facilities =ofthe New Zealand fishing rod manufacturer , "Kilwell sports". They are =thelargest producer of rods in NZ but only produce graphite rods thesedays.They also have the finest collection of old fishing reels and =rods inNew Zealand and were very helpfull in offering to supply me with anycomponents they use at their cost( which is a lot less then mine =imported from the USA) This includes such items as corks which they buy in =10,000lot boxes , reel seats , made up handles etc. It was nice to find =these guysreally were as helpfull and supportive as they could be and reasonably They did raise one matter that concerned me however. When their =productionmanager , who had been making quite a few thousand rods a year for the =last40 years, saw my guides he said he would be concerned with the =duribility ofthem . Mine were made out of paino wire using a "snake maker " from =DaveLeClair. He said they used to make their own from similar steel in the1960's but since then used either the hard chrome guides or more =recentlythe dark brown hard metal ones ( I forgot the material he said they =were) Hesaid prior to that they had had problems with some guides wearing =through in2-3 years of heavy use , particually in the Taupo area where there is =a lot Has anyone any experience with paino wire snake guides duribility or =abilityto withstand heavy use ? ------=_NextPart_000_0026_01BFA1FF.3609AF40 Ian, I assume you are speaking of piano wire, which is highly = spring steel. While this material is very strong, and resilient, it is = if you may possibly be using such a material. While this material is = resistance. There are few materials that are harder, and moreresistant = than chrome, so I suspect this is why it is so popular in the = guides. The Space Age has brought us ceramics, and many other advances, = far, chrome plated fly rod guides offer the most for the =cost. GMA ----- Original Message ----- Kearney = Sent: Sunday, April 09, 2000 = AMSubject: snake guide duribility = I spent a few hours last Friday looking over the = facilities ofthe New Zealand fishing rod manufacturer , "Kilwell = They are thelargest producer of rods in NZ but only produce = thesedays.They also have the finest collection of old fishing = rods inNew Zealand and were very helpfull in offering to supply me = anycomponents they use at their cost( which is a lot less then = buy in 10,000lot boxes , reel seats , made up handles etc. It was = find these guysreally were as helpfull and supportive as they = reasonablycomplimentary regarding my rods. They did raise= matter that concerned me however. When their productionmanager , = been making quite a few thousand rods a year for the last40 years, = guides he said he would be concerned with the duribility ofthem . = were made out of paino wire using a "snake maker " from = said they used to make their own from similar steel in the1960's = then used either the hard chrome guides or more recentlythe dark = hard metal ones ( I forgot the material he said they were) Hesaid = that they had had problems with some guides wearing through in2-3= heavy use , particually in the Taupo area where there is a lotof = pumice dust. Has anyone any experience with paino wire snake = duribility or abilityto withstand heavy use ?Ian = ------=_NextPart_000_0026_01BFA1FF.3609AF40-- from rsgould@cmc.net Sun Apr 9 09:34:31 2000 Subject: Re: snake guide duribility Hi Ian,My experience is similar to that reported by Tom Smithwick's and I agreethecritical spot seems to be the tip top. I've used the stainless hard chromeplated guides for a long time now with no problem. However I've justordereda set of "Recoil" guides from REC and will mount them on a rod I'm takingtothe Corbett lake workshop on April 27th. The recoil guides are made fromaNickel Titanium alloy which is flexible yet very hard (they claim). Theadvantages touted are reduced weight, no guide placement flat spots(stiffness where the guide is mounted) and they are flexible ( you can bendone down after it's mounted and it pops back into position), and higher linespeed. The wire diameter is quite small (about 1/3 of normal) and thisgivesme some concern so I'll run a test and see for myself.Ray----- Original Message ----- Subject: snake guide duribility I spent a few hours last Friday looking over the production facilities ofthe New Zealand fishing rod manufacturer , "Kilwell sports". They are thelargest producer of rods in NZ but only produce graphite rods thesedays.They also have the finest collection of old fishing reels and rods inNew Zealand and were very helpfull in offering to supply me with anycomponents they use at their cost( which is a lot less then mineimported from the USA) This includes such items as corks which they buy in10,000lot boxes , reel seats , made up handles etc. It was nice to find theseguysreally were as helpfull and supportive as they could be and reasonablycomplimentary regarding my rods. They did raise one matter that concerned me however. When theirproductionmanager , who had been making quite a few thousand rods a year for thelast40 years, saw my guides he said he would be concerned with theduribilityofthem . Mine were made out of paino wire using a "snake maker " fromDaveLeClair. He said they used to make their own from similar steel in the1960's but since then used either the hard chrome guides or morerecentlythe dark brown hard metal ones ( I forgot the material he said they were)Hesaid prior to that they had had problems with some guides wearingthroughin2-3 years of heavy use , particually in the Taupo area where there is alotof volcanic pumice dust. Has anyone any experience with paino wire snake guides duribility orabilityto withstand heavy use ? Ian Kearney from nobler@satx.rr.com Sun Apr 9 10:19:52 2000 SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.357.35);Sun, 9 Apr 2000 10:08:07 -0500 Subject: Re: Tony Spezio boundary="----=_NextPart_000_003C_01BFA20D.7A5DB7A0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_003C_01BFA20D.7A5DB7A0 I just received a note from Tony's son, that he's in the hospital ! =Nothing said as to the cause, but I think we all can offer a special =prayer for a speedy recovery, for such a nice guy ! GMA Sent: Saturday, April 08, 2000 5:10 PMSubject: Jet Lathe I have a chance to get a Jet model BD-920N that is less than a year =old experience with Jet I know nothing about them and was hoping someone =onthe list could either tell me what kind of machine they are, or =perhapsdirect me a source of information on this lathe.I would love to get a lathe for the price on this one, but I wouldrather spend the money on a good machine if the quality of the Jet =lineis poor. Thanks in advance for any help. ------=_NextPart_000_003C_01BFA20D.7A5DB7A0 I just received a note from Tony's son, that he's in the = Nothing said as to the cause, but I think we all can offer a special = a speedy recovery, for such a nice guy ! GMA ----- Original Message ----- Tumblin = Sent: Saturday, April 08, 2000 = PMSubject: Jet LatheI have a chance to get a Jet model BD-920N that is less = had anyexperience with Jet I know nothing about them and was = someone onthe list could either tell me what kind of machine they = perhapsdirect me a source of information on this lathe.I would = get a lathe for the price on this one, but I wouldrather spend the = advance for any help. ------=_NextPart_000_003C_01BFA20D.7A5DB7A0-- from nobler@satx.rr.com Sun Apr 9 10:21:23 2000 SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.357.35);Sun, 9 Apr 2000 10:09:39 -0500 Subject: Re: Heat Treat Ovens boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0049_01BFA20D.B0F9D1E0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0049_01BFA20D.B0F9D1E0 Is there anyone who offers a decent oven for heat treating cane ? GMA Sent: Saturday, April 08, 2000 5:10 PMSubject: Jet Lathe I have a chance to get a Jet model BD-920N that is less than a year =old experience with Jet I know nothing about them and was hoping someone =onthe list could either tell me what kind of machine they are, or =perhapsdirect me a source of information on this lathe.I would love to get a lathe for the price on this one, but I wouldrather spend the money on a good machine if the quality of the Jet =lineis poor. Thanks in advance for any help. ------=_NextPart_000_0049_01BFA20D.B0F9D1E0 Is there anyone who offers a decent oven for heat treating= ? GMA ----- Original Message ----- Tumblin = Sent: Saturday, April 08, 2000 = PMSubject: Jet LatheI have a chance to get a Jet model BD-920N that is less = had anyexperience with Jet I know nothing about them and was = someone onthe list could either tell me what kind of machine they = perhapsdirect me a source of information on this lathe.I would = get a lathe for the price on this one, but I wouldrather spend the = advance for any help. ------=_NextPart_000_0049_01BFA20D.B0F9D1E0-- from nobler@satx.rr.com Sun Apr 9 10:49:25 2000 SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.357.35);Sun, 9 Apr 2000 10:37:42 -0500 Subject: Fw: Tony boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0019_01BFA211.9C77BDA0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0019_01BFA211.9C77BDA0 This just received ! GMA Subject: Re: Tony Thank you for your prayers. He went in Thursday evening with chest =pains. They think it was a start of a major attack but it was caught in =time. He is in good spirits and wants to get out of there. They have =more tests to run on Monday. So he maybe out Monday evening but most =likely it wont be till Tuesday. I'll keep you informed on what's going = Good grief, I hope it's not too serious ! The last of my worries is =the cane, with him ill ! Please keep me informed of his condition, and =give him my best for a speedy recovery ! My prayers will be with him, =GMA ------=_NextPart_000_0019_01BFA211.9C77BDA0 This just received ! GMA From: Spezio Sent: Sunday, April 09, 2000 10:29 AMSubject: Re: TonyThank you for your prayers. He went in Thursday evening = chest pains. They think it was a start of a major attack but it was = time. He is in good spirits and wants to get out of there. They have = to run on Monday. So he maybe out Monday evening but most likely it wont= Tuesday. I'll keep you informed on what's going on and your wishes for a = Good grief, I hope it's not too serious ! The last of my worries is = cane, with him ill ! Please keep me informed of his condition, and = ------=_NextPart_000_0019_01BFA211.9C77BDA0-- from TSmithwick@aol.com Sun Apr 9 10:50:28 2000 Subject: Re: snake guide duribility rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu In a message dated 4/9/0 2:35:48 PM, rsgould@cmc.net writes: Ray - I have seen the guides demonstrated, and they are remarkable. They claim a Rockwell hardness in the C70's, which is really way up there. I had the same question about increased drag or line wear from the smalldiameter. I hope you will let us know the results of your test. from MasjC1@aol.com Sun Apr 9 11:02:20 2000 Subject: Re: Which Taper Wins? Was RE: change of topic Mark, I think that before we start the best thread again we should decide "best what"? Perhaps a series of categories would be helpful. Most of my fishingis done for trout in high mountain streams where a short, light line, packable rod works well. My favorite for this setting is not necessarily the best for larger rivers. May I suggest that we first decide on some use definitions before posting the "best". My suggestions to start are: Trout:Small streamsDrysNymphsLarge riversDrysNymphs Lakes/pondsDrysNymphs Salmon: Bass: I'm sure there are other categories that should be added. Mark Cole from nobler@satx.rr.com Sun Apr 9 11:03:16 2000 SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.357.35);Sun, 9 Apr 2000 10:51:33 -0500 Subject: Fw: Tony boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0047_01BFA213.8BC22CA0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0047_01BFA213.8BC22CA0 Subject: Tony We are making sure that everything is being checked out. They were goingto release him on Friday because his EKG came back OK but then earlyFriday morning he had a low pulse rate and that is when they decided torun everything they can on him. That is one thing for living in a smallarea like we do the medical care is first rate. Thank You again for yourconcern.Catch Ya Later,Bob ------=_NextPart_000_0047_01BFA213.8BC22CA0 From: Spezio Sent: Sunday, April 09, 2000 10:58 AMSubject: TonyWe are making sure that everything is being checked out. = were goingto release him on Friday because his EKG came back OK but= earlyFriday morning he had a low pulse rate and that is when they = smallarea like we do the medical care is first rate. Thank You again = yourconcern.Catch Ya Later,Bob ------=_NextPart_000_0047_01BFA213.8BC22CA0-- from goodaple@tcac.net Sun Apr 9 11:25:11 2000 Subject: Re: Tony boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0030_01BFA216.B5A2F880" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0030_01BFA216.B5A2F880 I hope all goes well with Tony. He is one fine fellow and often shares =very usefull information with others. I hope he finds himself at his =workbench very soon. Randall Gregory (NW Arkansas) Sent: Sunday, April 09, 2000 10:51 AMSubject: Fw: Tony This just received ! GMA Sent: Sunday, April 09, 2000 10:29 AMSubject: Re: Tony Thank you for your prayers. He went in Thursday evening with chest =pains. They think it was a start of a major attack but it was caught in =time. He is in good spirits and wants to get out of there. They have =more tests to run on Monday. So he maybe out Monday evening but most =likely it wont be till Tuesday. I'll keep you informed on what's going = Good grief, I hope it's not too serious ! The last of my worries is =the cane, with him ill ! Please keep me informed of his condition, and =give him my best for a speedy recovery ! My prayers will be with him, =GMA ------=_NextPart_000_0030_01BFA216.B5A2F880 I hope all goes well with Tony. He is = fellow and often shares very usefull information with others. I hope he = himself at his workbench very soon. Randall Gregory (NW =Arkansas) ----- Original Message ----- nobler Sent: Sunday, April 09, 2000 = AMSubject: Fw: Tony This just received ! GMA From: Spezio Sent: Sunday, April 09, 2000 10:29 AMSubject: Re: TonyThank you for your prayers. He went in Thursday evening= chest pains. They think it was a start of a major attack but it was = time. He is in good spirits and wants to get out of there. They have = tests to run on Monday. So he maybe out Monday evening but most likely = be till Tuesday. I'll keep you informed on what's going on and your = Good grief, I hope it's not too serious ! The last of my worries = cane, with him ill ! Please keep me informed of his condition, and = ------=_NextPart_000_0030_01BFA216.B5A2F880-- from kjc@epix.net Sun Apr 9 11:59:42 2000 MAA04723 Subject: LATHE I am new to rodbuilding and looking for a metal lathe. I located thisitemat harborfreight. My question is, would this lathe be suitable forrodbuilding?Any suggestions would be appreciated. http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/taf/Displayitem.taf?itemnumber=33684 Manufacturer: Central MachineryDistance between centers: 10''Swing over bed 7"Swing over saddle: 3.9"Spindle bore: 3/4"Threads: 18 threads from 12 to 52 TPITailstock taper: MT No. 2Volts: 110Speeds (RPM): low-186 to 1100; high-440 to3000RPM--reversibleThrough chuck capacity: 5/8"Shipping weight 89 lbs. from martinj@aa.net Sun Apr 9 12:09:09 2000 Sun, 9 Apr 2000 10:09:05 -0700 Subject: RE: LATHE I (personally) think that you will find this too small. You could make somesmall parts but you would be really cramped. Martin Jensen -----Original Message----- Subject: LATHE I am new to rodbuilding and looking for a metal lathe. I located thisitemat harborfreight. My question is, would this lathe be suitable forrodbuilding?Any suggestions would be appreciated. http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/taf/Displayitem.taf?itemnumber=33684 Manufacturer: Central MachineryDistance between centers: 10''Swing over bed 7"Swing over saddle: 3.9"Spindle bore: 3/4"Threads: 18 threads from 12 to 52 TPITailstock taper: MT No. 2Volts: 110Speeds (RPM): low-186 to 1100; high-440 to3000RPM--reversibleThrough chuck capacity: 5/8"Shipping weight 89 lbs. from nsflyrods@ns.sympatico.ca Sun Apr 9 13:02:01 2000 Sun, 9 Apr 2000 15:01:27 -0300 Subject: Re: Heat Treat Ovens boundary="------------B5E5BBD869433F0A073787CB" --------------B5E5BBD869433F0A073787CB George,I use a modified version of the one on Frank Neuneman's pageand it works great! Easy to build too. I thought I posted it to myfranken page but I haven't yet. I have some pics if you want let meknow,Shawn nobler wrote: Is there anyone who offers a decent oven for heat treating cane ? GMA ----- Original Message -----From: Pat Tumblin Sent: Saturday, April 08, 2000 5:10 PMSubject: Jet LatheI have a chance to get a Jet model BD-920N that is lessthan a year old had anyexperience with Jet I know nothing about them and was hopingsomeone onthe list could either tell me what kind of machine they are,or perhapsdirect me a source of information on this lathe.I would love to get a lathe for the price on this one, but Iwouldrather spend the money on a good machine if the quality ofthe Jet lineis poor. Thanks in advance for any help. --------------B5E5BBD869433F0A073787CB George, I use a modified version of the one on Frank Neuneman's page and it worksgreat! Easy to build too. I thought I posted it to my franken page butI haven't yet. I have some pics if you want let me know, Shawnnobler wrote: Is there anyone who offers a decent ----- Original Message ----- From:PatTumblin Sent: Saturday, April 08, 2000 5:10PM Subject: Jet Lathe old anyexperience with Jet I know nothing about them and was hopingsomeoneonthe list could either tell me what kind of machine they are, or perhapsdirect me a source of information on this lathe.I would love to get a lathe for the price on this one, but I wouldrather spend the money on a good machine if the quality of the Jetline --------------B5E5BBD869433F0A073787CB-- from castafly@gbis.com Sun Apr 9 13:07:51 2000 Subject: Bluing Threaded Reel Seat I just received a beautiful Robert Venneri nickel silver downlocking reelseat. I want to blue the seat with the Payne blue formula that I have, butI am unsure about how to blue the threads so they will retain the blue.Would you coat the blue with some sort of clear sealer, and if so, howdurable would that be? Any suggestions? Thanks! from rvenneri@ulster.net Sun Apr 9 13:45:59 2000 0400 Subject: Re: Bluing Threaded Reel Seat Jeff Ferguson wrote: I just received a beautiful Robert Venneri nickel silver downlocking reelseat. I want to blue the seat with the Payne blue formula that I have,butI am unsure about how to blue the threads so they will retain the blue.Would you coat the blue with some sort of clear sealer, and if so, howdurable would that be? Any suggestions? Thanks!Jeff,I always coat with Stay Brite clear gloss laquer. This is a gloss spraylaquer. this will help keep the parts from wearing off in use. i wouldthink any spray laquer would work if you can not find Stay Brite. I usestay brite because it is used to coat brass Best RegardsBob VVenneri's21 Chuck HIll RdSaugerties NY 12477914 246 5882http://www.ulster.net/~rvenneri/index.html from mschaffer@mindspring.com Sun Apr 9 16:52:25 2000 Subject: Question re storage after heat treating Guys,Having just finished heat treating a set of strips, I was wondering if Ishould immediately after heat treating place the hot strips into my pvcpipeor wait until cool then put them in. The pipe contain silica gel in a bagin the bottom and I was wondering the concensus of when the stripsshould beput in the pipe. Any suggestions are welcome!Thanks, Mike from bob@downandacross.com Sun Apr 9 17:00:27 2000 (envelope- from bob@downandacross.com) (envelope- from bob@downandacross.com) Subject: Re: Question re storage after heat treating Mike:I put them in slightly cool. I wait 5+ minutes or so. Make sure that bagis permeable or the effects will be negligible. That's why I use a sock.It lets the moisture get to the silica gel.Bob At 05:50 PM 4/9/00 -0400, you wrote:Guys,Having just finished heat treating a set of strips, I was wondering ifIshould immediately after heat treating place the hot strips into my pvcpipe a bagin the bottom and I was wondering the concensus of when the stripsshouldbeput in the pipe. Any suggestions are welcome!Thanks, Mike Bob Maulucci==================================================downandacross.com bob@downandacross.com from darrell@rockclimbing.org Sun Apr 9 17:59:35 2000 sims.3.5.2000.01.05.12.18.p9)with SMTP id for Subject: RE: Post Look at the bright side... a copy of the first issue sold on ebay for about$25.00... Darrellwww.vfish.net -----Original Message----- weakley.hollow@gte.net Subject: Re: Post folks, i do believe that the nice gent who began woodenboat magazine has doneverywell. the odds are, however, that tbbfrm will not become a similarsuccess, simply because most niche magazines (and ours is a pretty smallniche) probably are destined to remain on the edges of success. i'd guessthat tbbfrm was started with very limited capitalization. its layout mightnot be the equal of the new yorker, but it's pretty darn good, and thecontent is a treat. if they can get their admin and business act together,i'll sign up for another year. seems to me like it's nice having a magazineon this particular subject. not a bad thing to help along. darn. i promised myself that i wouldn't post on this. glm At 04:59 PM 4/5/00 EDT, you wrote:I've met Mark and have had several conversations with him. He's a heck ofanice guy and is driven to see this magazine succeed. I wish him well andwon't attempt what he's trying to do. --------------------gary mischcdr, usn (ret.) from BambooRods@aol.com Sun Apr 9 19:27:19 2000 Subject: Info: Riverside Rod Jimmy Acord (the leather artisit that made the rod case for the firstmakers rod) called me today after doing a swap for a bamboo rod. He hoped that someone on the list could offer some more info. The rod is made by Abbeyand Imbrie, it is a 9' 3 piece. He isn't sure about the six but thinks it might be a 6# or 7#. The decal says "Riverside". Is this the same as the South Bend stuff? I will forward any info to him or his address is: turtles@bright.net if you want to copy him. Doug Hall from FISHWOOL@aol.com Sun Apr 9 19:45:04 2000 Subject: Re: change of topic Ralph, Ray, et al.,Yep, my 7', 7 1/2' and 8'. Although I've had the pleasure of casting some great rods at Grayrock.Hank. from FISHWOOL@aol.com Sun Apr 9 19:45:31 2000 Subject: Re: transparent wraps Shawn,I'm late in replying as I've been too busy to download e-mail lately. In any case my philosophy about translucent wraps is : "If you don't like 'em, go elsewhere". It sounds arrogant but if I build to suit everyone I'll go nuts (more so than I am already). All of the light colored rods I'm building now have translucent wraps with red tipping and I'm too crotchety tochange. If you're building a lot of rods for the trade the inventory requirements to suit everybody would break you. Build a rod (or rods) in your style. Of course if you're building just a few for friends and the occasional paying customer that's a different story. You've gotten several good tips on preserving wrap colors-find one that suits you and good luck.Regards,HankP.S. I never use color preserver-I just test the varnish on various threads wrapped on light or flamed pieces of cane. from nobler@satx.rr.com Sun Apr 9 20:06:35 2000 SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.357.35);Sun, 9 Apr 2000 19:54:45 -0500 Subject: Re: Riverside Rod boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0007_01BFA25F.6F08BE20" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0007_01BFA25F.6F08BE20 I have and A&I that is almost surely a Montague. If it has the stepped =down female ferrules, it most likely is a Monty ! This one I got, was =badly darkened by very old varnish. When cleaned down to bare cane, the =tips were pure blond, while the other two sections were flame darkened. =It's pretty clear the tips were cheap replacements ! GMA Sent: Sunday, April 09, 2000 7:26 PMSubject: Info: Riverside Rod Jimmy Acord (the leather artisit that made the rod case for the first = rod) called me today after doing a swap for a bamboo rod. He hoped = someone on the list could offer some more info. The rod is made by = Imbrie, it is a 9' 3 piece. He isn't sure about the six but thinks it = be a 6# or 7#. The decal says "Riverside". Is this the same as the = Bend stuff? I will forward any info to him or his address is: = turtles@bright.net if you want to copy him. Doug Hall ------=_NextPart_000_0007_01BFA25F.6F08BE20 I have and A&I that is almost surely a Montague. If it = stepped down female ferrules, it most likely is a Monty ! This one I = badly darkened by very old varnish. When cleaned down to bare cane, the = were pure blond, while the other two sections were flame darkened. It's = clear the tips were cheap replacements ! GMA ----- Original Message ----- BambooRods@aol.com = Cc: turtles@bright.net Sent: Sunday, April 09, 2000 = PMSubject: Info: Riverside =RodJimmy Acord (the leather artisit that made the rod case= first makers rod) called me today after doing a swap for a = He isn't sure about the six but thinks it might be a 6# or = if you want to copy him.DougHall ------=_NextPart_000_0007_01BFA25F.6F08BE20-- from bob@downandacross.com Sun Apr 9 20:08:57 2000 (envelope- from bob@downandacross.com) (envelope- from bob@downandacross.com) Subject: Re: transparent wraps Hank:Amen to that!Bob (Although I must admit I am still deciding upon colors because I like 'em all!) In any case my philosophy about translucent wraps is : "If you don't like 'em,go elsewhere". It sounds arrogant but if I build to suit everyone I'll gonuts Build a rod (or rods) in your style. from stpete@netten.net Sun Apr 9 20:18:41 2000 UAA03106;Sun, 9 Apr 2000 20:19:01 -0500 Subject: Re: LATHE Keith, I have this lathe. It's main positive attributes are:1) it is small enough and light enough to move around the work shop,2) it runs on 110 and will not throw the breaker on a 15 amp circuit,3) it is relatively inexpensive (often on sale for $329 - delivered!.Grizzly is closing their 7x10 out for $319 and may have free delivery aswell),4) uses 5/16 to 3/8 tooling depending on who's at the milling machinethat day I suppose,5) has enough guts to take real cuts on all types of metals,6) it has thread cutting capabilities, unlike the Sherline and othersmall lathes,7) it has a reverse switch so you can run lathe forwards, backward, runthe spindle forward, backwards, etc. This comes in real handy if youhave to turn threads to a shoulder. The disadvantages are:1) out of the box, it is often not very accurate, but is possible totune it up, sometimes easily, sometimes not so easily. Sometimes folksget lucky and the lathe is quite accurate out of the box. Don't counton it!2) the distance between centers is just about as small as one can go forturning grips, but it can be done by putting the butt in the morse tapertailstock spindle,3) It is Taiwanese made and it can take some many months to get someparts. Other parts are readily available - just depends. I know that there is more than one rodmaker using this little tyke of alathe. I simply have no room for a large lathe and I found this one ata local Grizzly as a return for $244. I took it and ran. It is quiteaccurate enough for our purposes after some days of tinkering around onit. Check out the following sites. There is quite a following for thislittle lathe. In fact, Onis C. has been on the minilathe list for awhile. I saw the other day that our own Terry A. has found the list andis chiming in with his good and honest advice in his usual inimitablestyle. http://www.pioneer.net/~felice/hf.htmlhttp://www.cctrap.com/~varmint/alath.htmhttp://www.egroups.com/list/7x10minilathe/ Good luck,Rick C. Keith Clinton wrote: I am new to rodbuilding and looking for a metal lathe. I located thisitemat harborfreight. My question is, would this lathe be suitable forrodbuilding?Any suggestions would be appreciated. http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/taf/Displayitem.taf?itemnumber=33684 Manufacturer: Central MachineryDistance between centers: 10''Swing over bed 7"Swing over saddle: 3.9"Spindle bore: 3/4"Threads: 18 threads from 12 to 52 TPITailstock taper: MT No. 2Volts: 110Speeds (RPM): low-186 to 1100; high-440 to3000RPM--reversibleThrough chuck capacity: 5/8"Shipping weight 89 lbs. from kbuch@mail.stlnet.com Sun Apr 9 20:20:40 2000 Subject: Re: Tony Spezio Tony is the best. I was just with him on Monday. Prayer said. KMB from nsflyrods@ns.sympatico.ca Sun Apr 9 21:08:24 2000Received: from Subject: bamboo moisture While cooking some bamboo the other night, I recalled someconversations about heat treating and it occurred to me that we heattemper to drive the moisture out ( and temper the cane) then we turnaround and re-introduce moisture with the glue!Is a short stint in the drying cabinet after glue up enough to drivewhat is left of this moisture back out? Do we want all the moisture out?I remember reading somewhere that you should actually have a littlemoisture to aid the bonding of the glue...hmmmm?Just food for thought,Shawn from grau@buchlang.com Mon Apr 10 07:38:23 2000 (MET DST) Subject: Greenheart/Lancewood After severla years of bamboorod-building, i`m interested in make agreenherat odr lancewood-rod for myself; Any Ideas/help/tips/links where i can find more info-material (mabyeover the web) like plans, books etc. sincerly Stefan from stetzer@csd.uwm.edu Mon Apr 10 08:42:49 2000 (8.8.4/8.6.8) with ESMTP id IAA28045 for (8.8.4/8.6.8) with ESMTP id IAA28832 for Subject: Re: bamboo moisture I was contemplating wet planing and I did an experiment to seehow fast moisture entered and left a piece of tempered cane. Iwas expecting to be able to saturate cane by immersing it in water days of soaking before it stopped gaining weight. So I figured thatit would require an equally long time to dry the cane in my dryingtube, but a day later it was down below its initial weight. It mayhave been dry much sooner but I wasn't expecting it to dry that fastso I didn't check. My drying tube is a lot hotter than most people's varnish-dryingcabinet would be (120F) but I'd guess a day or 2 at 90F would removeany moisture that entered from the glue. If you've got a sensitivescale like a reloading scale its easy enough to check.......................................................................Frank Stetzer "...a cheerful comrade is betterstetzer@uwm.edu than a waterproof coat and a Employed by, but not speaking for foot-warmer." Henry Van Dyke,Univ of Wisconsin-Milwaukee, USA "Fisherman's Luck", 1899. On Sun, 9 Apr 2000, Shawn Pineo wrote: While cooking some bamboo the other night, I recalled someconversations about heat treating and it occurred to me that we heattemper to drive the moisture out ( and temper the cane) then we turnaround and re-introduce moisture with the glue!Is a short stint in the drying cabinet after glue up enough to drivewhat is left of this moisture back out? Do we want all the moisture out?I remember reading somewhere that you should actually have a littlemoisture to aid the bonding of the glue...hmmmm?Just food for thought,Shawn from nsflyrods@ns.sympatico.ca Mon Apr 10 09:16:59 2000 jubilee.ns.sympatico.ca(Post.Office MTA v3.5.2 release 221 Mon, 10 Apr 2000 11:16:26 -0300 Subject: Re: Greenheart/Lancewood Stefan,I have heard that there is a builder here in Nova Scotia,Canada building Lancewood/Greenheart rods. I have also heard that thereare blanks available. I will let you know if I find anything out.Shawn Stefan Grau wrote: After severla years of bamboorod-building, i`m interested in make agreenherat odr lancewood-rod for myself; Any Ideas/help/tips/links where i can find more info-material (mabyeover the web) like plans, books etc. sincerly Stefan from nobler@satx.rr.com Mon Apr 10 09:23:35 2000 SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.357.35);Mon, 10 Apr 2000 09:24:30 -0500 Subject: Re: bamboo moisture boundary="----=_NextPart_000_001E_01BFA2CE.C8ECFB80" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_001E_01BFA2CE.C8ECFB80 Gee, I shouldn't worry about a drying cabinet too much. The back of my =Minivan gets to 140 deg. F., most any day during the summer months ! The =relative humidity is often in the 20-30% range too. GMA Sent: Monday, April 10, 2000 8:42 AMSubject: Re: bamboo moisture I was contemplating wet planing and I did an experiment to seehow fast moisture entered and left a piece of tempered cane. I days of soaking before it stopped gaining weight. So I figured thatit would require an equally long time to dry the cane in my dryingtube, but a day later it was down below its initial weight. It mayhave been dry much sooner but I wasn't expecting it to dry that fastso I didn't check. My drying tube is a lot hotter than most people's varnish-dryingcabinet would be (120F) but I'd guess a day or 2 at 90F would removeany moisture that entered from the glue. If you've got a sensitivescale like a reloading scale its easy enough to check.......................................................................Frank Stetzer "...a cheerful comrade is better Employed by, but not speaking for foot-warmer." Henry Van Dyke,Univ of Wisconsin-Milwaukee, USA "Fisherman's Luck", 1899. On Sun, 9 Apr 2000, Shawn Pineo wrote: While cooking some bamboo the other night, I recalled someconversations about heat treating and it occurred to me that we =heattemper to drive the moisture out ( and temper the cane) then we turnaround and re-introduce moisture with the glue!Is a short stint in the drying cabinet after glue up enough to =drivewhat is left of this moisture back out? Do we want all the moisture =out?I remember reading somewhere that you should actually have a littlemoisture to aid the bonding of the glue...hmmmm?Just food for thought,Shawn ------=_NextPart_000_001E_01BFA2CE.C8ECFB80 Gee, I shouldn't worry about a drying cabinet too much. The= my Minivan gets to 140 deg. F., most any day during the summer months ! = relative humidity is often in the 20-30% range too. GMA ----- Original Message ----- Stetzer = Sent: Monday, April 10, 2000 = AMSubject: Re: bamboo =moistureI was contemplating wet planing and I did an experiment= seehow fast moisture entered and left a piece of tempered = Iwas expecting to be able to saturate cane by immersing it in = dryingtube, but a day later it was down below its initial = mayhave been dry much sooner but I wasn't expecting it to dry that = fastso I didn't check.My drying tube is a lot hotter than = people's varnish-dryingcabinet would be (120F) but I'd guess a day = = =check................................................................= = = should = = ------=_NextPart_000_001E_01BFA2CE.C8ECFB80-- from caneman@clnk.com Mon Apr 10 10:15:11 2000 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35)with SMTP id com; Mon, 10 Apr 2000 10:11:31 -0500 Subject: Re: bamboo moisture Frank Just a thought, but possibly the water has a quicker evaporation ratethan the natural resins in the bamboo. I flamed a culm a couple of weeksago, that has been sitting in the varnish room for about 6 months (sincetheSRG) and got a sticky, foamy "sap" out of the ends of the culm. Bob-----Original Message----- Subject: Re: bamboo moisture I was contemplating wet planing and I did an experiment to seehow fast moisture entered and left a piece of tempered cane. Iwas expecting to be able to saturate cane by immersing it in water days of soaking before it stopped gaining weight. So I figured thatit would require an equally long time to dry the cane in my dryingtube, but a day later it was down below its initial weight. It mayhave been dry much sooner but I wasn't expecting it to dry that fastso I didn't check. My drying tube is a lot hotter than most people's varnish-dryingcabinet would be (120F) but I'd guess a day or 2 at 90F would removeany moisture that entered from the glue. If you've got a sensitivescale like a reloading scale its easy enough to check.......................................................................Frank Stetzer "...a cheerful comrade is betterstetzer@uwm.edu than a waterproof coat and aEmployed by, but not speaking for foot-warmer." Henry Van Dyke,Univ of Wisconsin-Milwaukee, USA "Fisherman's Luck", 1899. On Sun, 9 Apr 2000, Shawn Pineo wrote: While cooking some bamboo the other night, I recalled someconversations about heat treating and it occurred to me that we heattemper to drive the moisture out ( and temper the cane) then we turnaround and re-introduce moisture with the glue!Is a short stint in the drying cabinet after glue up enough to drivewhat is left of this moisture back out? Do we want all the moistureout?I remember reading somewhere that you should actually have a littlemoisture to aid the bonding of the glue...hmmmm?Just food for thought,Shawn from stetzer@csd.uwm.edu Mon Apr 10 11:07:48 2000 (8.8.4/8.6.8) with ESMTP id LAA18694 for (8.8.4/8.6.8) with ESMTP id LAA24559 for Subject: Re: bamboo moisture Bob, I suspect that if you want to saturate cane (ie for wet planing) it might be faster do to it with water vapor than by soaking.It would be a small bother but you could build a warm "terrariumenvironment" and maybe get the cane really wet in less than a day.I'll have to rig up something and try it. I'd like to try wet planing to see if it works for me, but I'mreluctant to put my strips in water for days/weeks on endbecause I don't get to build rods on a regular schedule, just an evening here and there. If I could get the cane wet on 12 hours notice maybe it would be OK. If anyone out there is having trouble using my Hexrod program itsbecause I accidentally deleted some files. I'll have them restored from backup later today.......................................................................Frank Stetzer "...a cheerful comrade is betterstetzer@uwm.edu than a waterproof coat and a Employed by, but not speaking for foot- warmer." Henry Van Dyke,Univ of Wisconsin-Milwaukee, USA "Fisherman's Luck", 1899. On Mon, 10 Apr 2000, Bob Nunley wrote: Frank Just a thought, but possibly the water has a quicker evaporation ratethan the natural resins in the bamboo. I flamed a culm a couple of weeksago, that has been sitting in the varnish room for about 6 months (sincetheSRG) and got a sticky, foamy "sap" out of the ends of the culm. Bob from steve@hamiltonrods.com Mon Apr 10 11:24:39 2000 codemarine.209.170.128.193 with SMTP (Microsoft ExchangeInternet Mail Service Version 5.5.2448.0) Subject: Re: bamboo moisture I don't doubt that the strips continue to take in water for days, but I'vefound that soaking the strips in aPVC tube overnight seems to get them plenty waterlogged to make themeasier to rough plane. On the other hand,it's my impression that the soaking appears to partially reverse the nodeflattening and straightening--but Idon't have any empirical evidence to prove it. But with the two rods I'vebuilt using the soaking approach, myimpression upon examining the wet strips has been "I thought I did abetter job on those nodes." I'll try towatch carefully on this next rod and report my results. --Steve ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: bamboo moisture I suspect that if you want to saturate cane (ie for wet planing) it might be faster do to it with water vapor than by soaking.It would be a small bother but you could build a warm "terrariumenvironment" and maybe get the cane really wet in less than a day.I'll have to rig up something and try it. from danny.twang@porsgrunnsdagblad.no Mon Apr 10 12:31:35 2000 Subject: Re: bamboo moisture I tried the soaking method last winter. I simply put the strip in a PVC tube I could easily plan of huge shavings with no "lifts" in the strips. I've also heard soaking the raw strips in water prior to node straightening,makes the job mucheasier. I've never tried it myself though..... danny Steve Zimmerman wrote: I don't doubt that the strips continue to take in water for days, but I'vefound that soaking the strips ina PVC tube overnight seems to get them plenty waterlogged to make themeasier to rough plane. On the otherhand, it's my impression that the soaking appears to partially reverse thenode flattening andstraightening--but I don't have any empirical evidence to prove it. Butwith the two rods I've built using thesoaking approach, my impression upon examining the wet strips has been"I thought I did a better job on thosenodes." I'll try to watch carefully on this next rod and report my results. --Steve ----- Original Message -----From: "Frank Stetzer" Sent: Monday, April 10, 2000 12:07 PMSubject: Re: bamboo moisture I suspect that if you want to saturate cane (ie for wet planing)it might be faster do to it with water vapor than by soaking.It would be a small bother but you could build a warm "terrariumenvironment" and maybe get the cane really wet in less than a day.I'll have to rig up something and try it. from darrell@rockclimbing.org Mon Apr 10 13:52:39 2000 sims.3.5.2000.01.05.12.18.p9)with SMTP id for Subject: RE: Greenheart/Lancewood Speaking of Greenheart, I have an ancient Orvis, I'm guessing Civil Warera... a 15ft 4pc 30 oz... yes, Martha that's thirty ounces... that has aoak handle (the size of a baseball bat) and I believe the rest of the rod isGreenheart. It has one of the tips that is short, has anyone ever scarfed around Greenheart tip? I don't think I would with this rod as it is missingthe huge agate tip top which I will never find... Darrellwww.vfish.net -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Greenheart/Lancewood Stefan,I have heard that there is a builder here in Nova Scotia,Canada building Lancewood/Greenheart rods. I have also heard that thereare blanks available. I will let you know if I find anything out.Shawn Stefan Grau wrote: After severla years of bamboorod-building, i`m interested in make agreenherat odr lancewood-rod for myself; Any Ideas/help/tips/links where i can find more info-material (mabyeover the web) like plans, books etc. sincerly Stefan from darrell@rockclimbing.org Mon Apr 10 14:17:50 2000 sims.3.5.2000.01.05.12.18.p9)with SMTP id for Subject: RE: Riverside Rod rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0000_01BFA2E6.2334BDA0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0000_01BFA2E6.2334BDA0 I believe that A&I was acquired by H-I so I suspect that your rod mighthavebeen made by H-I. On the low end H-I's and Monty's it is sometimes hard totell the difference, on the high end ones they are pretty easy to tell themapart. my "Name That Rod Forum" on my website so that the rodmakers here don'tgetbored with the collectors questions. Darrellwww.vfish.net-----Original Message-----From: owner- rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Sunday, April 09, 2000 6:09 PM Cc: turtles@bright.netSubject: Re: Riverside Rod I have and A&I that is almost surely a Montague. If it has the steppeddown female ferrules, it most likely is a Monty ! This one I got, was badlydarkened by very old varnish. When cleaned down to bare cane, the tipswerepure blond, while the other two sections were flame darkened. It's prettyclear the tips were cheap replacements ! GMA----- Original Message -----From: BambooRods@aol.com Cc: turtles@bright.netSent: Sunday, April 09, 2000 7:26 PMSubject: Info: Riverside Rod Jimmy Acord (the leather artisit that made the rod case for the firstmakersrod) called me today after doing a swap for a bamboo rod. He hoped thatsomeone on the list could offer some more info. The rod is made byAbbey andImbrie, it is a 9' 3 piece. He isn't sure about the six but thinks itmightbe a 6# or 7#. The decal says "Riverside". Is this the same as theSouthBend stuff? I will forward any info to him or his address is:turtles@bright.net if you want to copy him. Doug Hall ------=_NextPart_000_0000_01BFA2E6.2334BDA0 believe that A&I was acquired by H-I so I suspect that your rod = been made by H-I. On the low end H-I's and Monty's it is sometimes hard = apart. questions such as this one, you can also try posting your questions on = That Rod Forum" on my website so that the rodmakers here don't get bored= the collectors questions. Darrellwww.vfish.net noblerSent: Sunday, April 09, 2000 6:09 = turtles@bright.netSubject: Re: Riverside =RodI have and A&I that is almost surely a Montague. If = the stepped down female ferrules, it most likely is a Monty ! This one = was badly darkened by very old varnish. When cleaned down to bare = tips were pure blond, while the other two sections were flame = pretty clear the tips were cheap replacements ! GMA ----- Original Message ----- BambooRods@aol.com = Cc: turtles@bright.net Sent: Sunday, April 09, 2000 = PMSubject: Info: Riverside =RodJimmy Acord (the leather artisit that made the rod = the first makers rod) called me today after doing a swap for a = Hall ------=_NextPart_000_0000_01BFA2E6.2334BDA0-- from gabriele.moultrie@multimedica.de Mon Apr 10 14:44:08 2000 2000 19:37:17 UT Mon, 10 Apr 2000 21:39:51 +0200 fwproxy.multimedica.de 10 Apr 2000 19:36:38 UT 194.138.18.99 (Norton AntiVirus for InternetEmail Gateways 1.0) ; Mon, 10 Apr 2000 11:48:22 0000 (GMT) fwcommunity.multimedica.de 10 Apr 2000 19:36:36 UT Subject: German Rodmakers Are there any German rodmakers on the list? I need to get some help finding a few things here in Germany (Or Europeas a whole - perhaps some British rodmakers could help). Also has any body here tried the Tonkin Cane from Centre Cane Company inU.K ? I know that they are somehow connected to Andy Royer and I waswondering if it is the same cane just shipped to the U.K for sale inEurope or is it a completely seperate setup? Thanks Stuart from paul.blakley@dtn.ntl.com Mon Apr 10 15:28:16 2000 helo=dtn.ntl.com) Subject: Re: German Rodmakers Is it Gabriele or stuart at the end of this line ?The centre cane company are 100% reliable and the service offered by theproprietor Loenard Moss is very good.On occasion we have had bad cane from him but this has always been exchanged or a refund been given untila good shipment has arrived.When ordering from him make sure you tell him the cane is for rodbuilding......regards........Paul Gabriele Moultrie wrote: Are there any German rodmakers on the list? I need to get some help finding a few things here in Germany (Or Europeas a whole - perhaps some British rodmakers could help). Also has any body here tried the Tonkin Cane from Centre Cane CompanyinU.K ? I know that they are somehow connected to Andy Royer and I waswondering if it is the same cane just shipped to the U.K for sale inEurope or is it a completely seperate setup? Thanks Stuart from stpete@netten.net Mon Apr 10 16:15:51 2000 Subject: Dickerson 8615 Any comments from those who have made and/or cast this taper? I'd liketo have a longish 6 wt in my arsenal. Is this the rod? Rick C. from stpete@netten.net Mon Apr 10 16:21:52 2000 Subject: Kretchman 6'6" 3 wt. / Cattanach 6'3" 3 wt. I have simply got to try a three weight and have about made up my mind,but before I start to taper my roughed out splines, I'd like to hear from those who have cast/made the Kretchman 3 wt from the Grayrocktapers. Is this taper too strong for a true 3 wt. Now, I really want a longer rod, but, while we're at it, who can commenton Wayne's 6'3" 3 wt. I've heard one very high recommendation. Now,I'm not expecting anyone to denigrate Wayne's taper here online. I justwant a description of the casting action and what situations you felt itsuited best. Rick C. from stpete@netten.net Mon Apr 10 16:24:04 2000 Subject: Re: 8615 *AND* Payne 204 Forgot to add that I'm also looking at the Payne 204 8'6" 6 wt. Anyinfo on that taper? Rick C. Rick C. wrote: Any comments from those who have made and/or cast this taper? I'dliketo have a longish 6 wt in my arsenal. Is this the rod? Rick C. from rhd360@maine.edu Mon Apr 10 16:53:07 2000 Level 310) via TCP with SMTP ; Mon, 10Apr 2000 17:52:21 EDT Subject: Oops, fixing a split tip Ice was out last week and fishing is usually fine at that time with togueand landlock salmon on surface flies. It was saturday, fishing was ok, butfun to get out. I returned to the truck to disassembled an 8' 7wt, andwhen the tip section released with some force the tip struct thepavement.It was a side blow to the tip top. Well, I won't say how I felt at thatmoment. This is what I thought was my best rod yet in terms of craft etc.I didn't really expect to be getting extra practice at repairs but maybethat's what this event is all about. The break is odd and I going to try to describe it. Actually it is not aclean break, but a small section that splits off and runs down about fourinches. The split starts at the first node, which is just below thefirst snake guide. It is as if someone took a tiny chisel and cut into thenode, then lifted up. So the split section starts at a node, is about aswide as the strip, and run down to the next guide. On one side the splitruns into the adjoining section, and on the other side is sort of follows aglue line. Looking at it, I don't think a glue line failed really. Thesplit section is not very deep, about .02, and only involves some surfacefibers. I'm not sure what to make of this. Was it a weak node that I didn't happento notice? ( I usually check sections by flexing, but heck I don't do itall the consistently, or at least it's not been a obsession. I seem tohave a growing list of rodmaking obsessions.) Ever seen a break like this? I'm guessing I can repair it with epoxy, but comment on the choice ofadhesive if you like. (The rod was URACed.) How much of the split wouldyou cover with silk? I think it's going to look like hell but I mightjust try it so I'll have the rod available for the season. (I only builtone tip.) Thanks in advace, Bob. Robert M. Milardo, Ph.D.Professor of Family Relations17 Merrill Hall University of MaineOrono, ME 04469(207) 581-3128(207) 581-3120 FAX from mcdowellc@lanecc.edu Mon Apr 10 17:12:55 2000 15:15:16 PDT Subject: re: Oops, fixing a split tip Robert, I recenlty fixed the tip of a Battenkill with a break like you describe, except it was only 1 1/2" rather then 4" long and I don't recall it being in conjuction to a node area. I believe it was in an internodal area. Anyway, I glued it down with Probond Polyurethane glue, bound the glue job to eliminate a seam, and when dried I scraped the excess glue away from the Impregnated surface. We opted to leave off the silk overwrap I would normally use over a repair. I flexed the rod and gave it a casting action without any failure. This break was parallel with the surface as you describe and not even as deep as the one you describe, perhaps .010". In the case of this rod it was primarily a cosmetic repair as I'm notconvinced the rod wouldn't hold up just fine with the shallow splinter completely removed. Chris---------- Original Text ---------- Ice was out last week and fishing is usually fine at that time with togueand landlock salmon on surface flies. It was saturday, fishing was ok, butfun to get out. I returned to the truck to disassembled an 8' 7wt, andwhen the tip section released with some force the tip struct thepavement.It was a side blow to the tip top. Well, I won't say how I felt at thatmoment. This is what I thought was my best rod yet in terms of craft etc.I didn't really expect to be getting extra practice at repairs but maybethat's what this event is all about. The break is odd and I going to try to describe it. Actually it is not aclean break, but a small section that splits off and runs down about fourinches. The split starts at the first node, which is just below thefirst snake guide. It is as if someone took a tiny chisel and cut into thenode, then lifted up. So the split section starts at a node, is about aswide as the strip, and run down to the next guide. On one side the splitruns into the adjoining section, and on the other side is sort of follows aglue line. Looking at it, I don't think a glue line failed really. Thesplit section is not very deep, about .02, and only involves some surfacefibers. I'm not sure what to make of this. Was it a weak node that I didn't happento notice? ( I usually check sections by flexing, but heck I don't do itall the consistently, or at least it's not been a obsession. I seem tohave a growing list of rodmaking obsessions.) Ever seen a break like this? I'm guessing I can repair it with epoxy, but comment on the choice ofadhesive if you like. (The rod was URACed.) How much of the split wouldyou cover with silk? I think it's going to look like hell but I mightjust try it so I'll have the rod available for the season. (I only builtone tip.) Thanks in advace, Bob. Robert M. Milardo, Ph.D.Professor of Family Relations17 Merrill Hall University of MaineOrono, ME 04469(207) 581-3128(207) 581-3120 FAX from wgray@uidaho.edu Mon Apr 10 17:33:20 2000 PAA01285; SMTP; 10 Apr 2000 22:31:45 UT Subject: Re: German Rodmakers Gabriele, Try Frank Neunemann's page, link from the rodbuilders page. He is a contributor from Germany, and has always been very knowledgeable and helpful.RODMAKERShttp://www.canerod.com/rodmakers/then click on the rodmakers button and then Frank's listing. Wilson Date sent: Mon, 10 Apr 2000 21:44:21 +0200 Subject: German Rodmakers Are there any German rodmakers on the list? I need to get some help finding a few things here in Germany (Or Europeas a whole - perhaps some British rodmakers could help). Also has any body here tried the Tonkin Cane from Centre Cane CompanyinU.K ? I know that they are somehow connected to Andy Royer and I waswondering if it is the same cane just shipped to the U.K for sale inEurope or is it a completely seperate setup? Thanks Stuart from goodaple@tcac.net Mon Apr 10 19:03:01 2000 Subject: boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0009_01BFA31F.E07152A0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0009_01BFA31F.E07152A0 To fellow listmembers, I was visiting a site a moment ago and noticed an=article about the current strategy and funding for whirling disease. The =article talks specifically to the proposed funding cuts being offered up =at this time in Washington. Apparently politicians have succeeded in =removing some of the past funding to help battle this disease. I am not =in any way affiliated with this but only concerned. I feel it is only a =matter of time before the disease comes to my local rivers due to =widespread popularity. I as a rodmaker feel that without healthy fish =there wouldn't be much reason for quality cane rods. I would like to see =my children someday fishing my rods on the same local area of water that=I have fished myself. To fund the prevention of that happening is a =worthwhile effort. I also realize that the Govt. tries to allocate =funding as is necessary to other venues. We have an opportunity to speak =up for ourselves and our children. There is an article at The Virtual =Flyshop(Rocky Mtn. Reports) that allows us an opportunity to send a =letter to the politicians involved(Via E-mail). Again this is =off- subject yet can impact our interests. I hope that no one has found =offense for it was not intended.Randall Gregory(NW Arkansas) ------=_NextPart_000_0009_01BFA31F.E07152A0 To fellow listmembers, I was visitinga = moment ago and noticed an article about the current strategy and funding= whirling disease. The article talks specifically to the proposed funding = being offered up at this time in Washington. Apparently politicians have = succeeded in removing some of the past funding to help battle this = not in any way affiliated with this but only concerned. I feel it is = matter of time before the disease comes to my local rivers due to = popularity. I as a rodmaker feel that without healthy fish there = much reason for quality cane rods. I would like to see my children = fishing my rods on the same local area of water that I have fished = fund the prevention of that happening is a worthwhile effort. I also = that the Govt. tries to allocate funding as is necessary to other = have an opportunity to speak up for ourselves and our children. There is = article at The Virtual Flyshop(Rocky Mtn. Reports) that allows us an = off-subject yet can impact our interests. I hope that no one has found = Arkansas) ------=_NextPart_000_0009_01BFA31F.E07152A0-- from brewer@teleport.com Mon Apr 10 19:23:25 2000 0000 (216.26.32.203) Subject: Granger 'Lime' Green If anyone has a spool of silk in Granger 'Lime' Green [or very close] thatthey would be willing to sell or trade, please contact me off list. A spool of this stuff is like a tennis racquet or an airline pilot; when youneed one, nothing else will do! Randy Brewerbrewer@teleport.com541-342-3572 from edriddle@mindspring.com Mon Apr 10 19:36:22 2000 Subject: Preserving Spar Varnish I use a Drip Tube and have been recently been storing the Spar in adiscarded (plastic?)gallon milk container. Prior to first use, a couplemonths ago, I thinned it 10% with mineral spirits. Today, I found that ithas thickened up and has some "globs" in it. I added more mineral spiritsand filtered with a conical paper paint filter and that seemed to work forthe moment. Any suggestions on how I might better preserve unusedportionbased on what I'm doing now?Thanks in advance.Ed from nobler@satx.rr.com Mon Apr 10 20:16:02 2000 SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.357.35);Mon, 10 Apr 2000 20:16:58 -0500 Subject: Re: boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0027_01BFA329.EECF1A80" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0027_01BFA329.EECF1A80 Nothing the Clinton administration does will surprise me anymore ! GMA Sent: Monday, April 10, 2000 7:06 PM To fellow listmembers, I was visiting a site a moment ago and noticed =an article about the current strategy and funding for whirling disease. =The article talks specifically to the proposed funding cuts being =offered up at this time in Washington. Apparently politicians have =succeeded in removing some of the past funding to help battle this =disease. I am not in any way affiliated with this but only concerned. I =feel it is only a matter of time before the disease comes to my local =rivers due to widespread popularity. I as a rodmaker feel that without =healthy fish there wouldn't be much reason for quality cane rods. I =would like to see my children someday fishing my rods on the same local =area of water that I have fished myself. To fund the prevention of that =happening is a worthwhile effort. I also realize that the Govt. tries to =allocate funding as is necessary to other venues. We have an opportunity =to speak up for ourselves and our children. There is an article at The =Virtual Flyshop(Rocky Mtn. Reports) that allows us an opportunity to =send a letter to the politicians involved(Via E-mail). Again this is =off- subject yet can impact our interests. I hope that no one has found =offense for it was not intended.Randall Gregory(NW Arkansas) ------=_NextPart_000_0027_01BFA329.EECF1A80 Nothing the Clinton administration does will surprise me = ! GMA ----- Original Message ----- Randall= Sent: Monday, April 10, 2000 = PM To fellow listmembers, I wasvisiting = moment ago and noticed an article about the current strategy and = whirling disease. The article talks specifically to the proposed = being offered up at this time in Washington. Apparently politicians = succeeded in removing some of the past funding to help battle this = am not in any way affiliated with this but only concerned. I feel it = matter of time before the disease comes to my local rivers due to = popularity. I as a rodmaker feel that without healthy fish there = much reason for quality cane rods. I would like to see my children = fishing my rods on the same local area of water that I have fished = fund the prevention of that happening is a worthwhile effort. I also = that the Govt. tries to allocate funding as is necessary to other = have an opportunity to speak up for ourselves and our children. There = opportunity to send a letter to the politicians involved(Via E-mail). = this is off-subject yet can impact our interests. I hope that no one = Arkansas) ------=_NextPart_000_0027_01BFA329.EECF1A80-- from mrmac@tcimet.net Mon Apr 10 20:45:08 2000 (envelope- from mrmac@tcimet.net) Subject: Re: Preserving Spar Varnish Boy - AMEN to *that* problem! My first spar, Pratt & Lambert R7, gotthicklike jello across the top - maybe an inch thick or so, (and the remainder inthe can as well). I thinned it with paint thinner, and that seemed to hold bottles that I keep aside for wraps got jelled across the top, including theone with thinner. Mixed about 50/50 with a different manufacturer's spar(AceHardware) and some mineral spirits. The result seemed to be workingwell andstaying liquid, but I had some other contamination problems with little"grits" in my finish, so I filtered through a paper coffee filter. After Idid that, the same batch that had been working well jelled over at the topinthe tube, *again*. I have now really laced it with boththinner and mineral spirits. It's probably a little too thin, but I figured Ican build up with multiple coats easier than wrestle with the jelly at thispoint. I have not had similar problems with my other tube that has polyurethaneinit. Seemed to be a lot easier to work with, but if there's a magic bullet ofsome kind to prevent the jelling, I'll be very interested, too, since I'd likethe option of either. TIA, here too. mac Ed Riddle wrote: I use a Drip Tube and have been recently been storing the Spar in adiscarded (plastic?)gallon milk container. Prior to first use, a couplemonths ago, I thinned it 10% with mineral spirits. Today, I found that ithas thickened up and has some "globs" in it. I added more mineral spiritsand filtered with a conical paper paint filter and that seemed to workforthe moment. Any suggestions on how I might better preserve unusedportionbased on what I'm doing now?Thanks in advance.Ed from goodaple@tcac.net Mon Apr 10 20:59:51 2000 Subject: Re: Preserving Spar Varnish There is a product available that you can spray inside the can to preventpremature jelling. I think it is called Bloxygen or something of the sort. Ihave seen it at woodcraft stores but never tried it. I have also had theparticle issue and resolved it by thinning and filtering thru an old pair ofpanty hose. Worked alright for me.Good luck, Randall Gregory(NW Arkansas)----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Preserving Spar Varnish Boy - AMEN to *that* problem! My first spar, Pratt & Lambert R7, gotthicklike jello across the top - maybe an inch thick or so, (and the remainderinthe can as well). I thinned it with paint thinner, and that seemed tohold littlebottles that I keep aside for wraps got jelled across the top, includingtheone with thinner. Mixed about 50/50 with a different manufacturer'sspar(AceHardware) and some mineral spirits. The result seemed to be workingwellandstaying liquid, but I had some other contamination problems with little"grits" in my finish, so I filtered through a paper coffee filter. AfterIdid that, the same batch that had been working well jelled over at thetopinthe tube, *again*. I have now really laced it with boththinner and mineral spirits. It's probably a little too thin, but Ifigured Ican build up with multiple coats easier than wrestle with the jelly atthispoint. I have not had similar problems with my other tube that haspolyurethaneinit. Seemed to be a lot easier to work with, but if there's a magic bulletofsome kind to prevent the jelling, I'll be very interested, too, since I'dlikethe option of either. TIA, here too. mac Ed Riddle wrote: I use a Drip Tube and have been recently been storing the Spar in adiscarded (plastic?)gallon milk container. Prior to first use, a couplemonths ago, I thinned it 10% with mineral spirits. Today, I found thatithas thickened up and has some "globs" in it. I added more mineralspiritsand filtered with a conical paper paint filter and that seemed to workforthe moment. Any suggestions on how I might better preserve unusedportionbased on what I'm doing now?Thanks in advance.Ed from k5vkq@ix.netcom.com Mon Apr 10 21:14:30 2000 Subject: Re: Preserving Spar Varnish Since the jelling is due to reaction to the atmosphere, one way to reducethe jelling is to remove the atmosphere. After I ordered my Epon fromMiller- Stephenson, they sent me a box of other goodies. One was a can ofAero- Duster; Tetrafluroethane but propane or butane lighter fluid wouldprobably also work. I have been inverting the can to spray enough of theliquid into my varnish container, a half gallon glass jug. It has stoppedthe jelling. Hope this helps. Regards,Onisk5vkq@ix.netcom.com At 09:45 PM 4/10/00 -0400, Ralph MacKenzie wrote:Boy - AMEN to *that* problem! My first spar, Pratt & Lambert R7, gotthicklike jello across the top - maybe an inch thick or so, (and the remainderinthe can as well). I thinned it with paint thinner, and that seemed to hold bottles that I keep aside for wraps got jelled across the top, includingtheone with thinner. Mixed about 50/50 with a different manufacturer'sspar(AceHardware) and some mineral spirits. The result seemed to be workingwell andstaying liquid, but I had some other contamination problems with little"grits" in my finish, so I filtered through a paper coffee filter. After Idid that, the same batch that had been working well jelled over at the topinthe tube, *again*. I have now really laced it with boththinner and mineral spirits. It's probably a little too thin, but Ifigured Ican build up with multiple coats easier than wrestle with the jelly atthispoint. I have not had similar problems with my other tube that has polyurethaneinit. Seemed to be a lot easier to work with, but if there's a magic bulletofsome kind to prevent the jelling, I'll be very interested, too, since I'dlikethe option of either. TIA, here too. mac Ed Riddle wrote: I use a Drip Tube and have been recently been storing the Spar in adiscarded (plastic?)gallon milk container. Prior to first use, a couplemonths ago, I thinned it 10% with mineral spirits. Today, I found that ithas thickened up and has some "globs" in it. I added more mineralspiritsand filtered with a conical paper paint filter and that seemed to workforthe moment. Any suggestions on how I might better preserve unusedportionbased on what I'm doing now?Thanks in advance.Ed from nobler@satx.rr.com Mon Apr 10 21:20:53 2000 SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.357.35);Mon, 10 Apr 2000 21:21:45 -0500 Subject: Re: Preserving Spar Varnish boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0014_01BFA332.FC139FA0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0014_01BFA332.FC139FA0 Nitrogen gas will do this too. It's heavy, so sinks down on top of the =liquid, to keep it dry. I'd think one could call P&L, and get help with =this happening to their product. GMA Sent: Monday, April 10, 2000 9:13 PMSubject: Re: Preserving Spar Varnish Since the jelling is due to reaction to the atmosphere, one way to =reducethe jelling is to remove the atmosphere. After I ordered my Epon =fromMiller- Stephenson, they sent me a box of other goodies. One was a can =ofAero- Duster; Tetrafluroethane but propane or butane lighter fluid =wouldprobably also work. I have been inverting the can to spray enough of =theliquid into my varnish container, a half gallon glass jug. It has =stoppedthe jelling. Hope this helps. Regards,Onisk5vkq@ix.netcom.com At 09:45 PM 4/10/00 -0400, Ralph MacKenzie wrote:Boy - AMEN to *that* problem! My first spar, Pratt & Lambert R7, got =thicklike jello across the top - maybe an inch thick or so, (and the =remainder inthe can as well). I thinned it with paint thinner, and that seemed =to hold littlebottles that I keep aside for wraps got jelled across the top, =including theone with thinner. Mixed about 50/50 with a different manufacturer's =spar(AceHardware) and some mineral spirits. The result seemed to be working =well andstaying liquid, but I had some other contamination problems with =little"grits" in my finish, so I filtered through a paper coffee filter. =After Idid that, the same batch that had been working well jelled over at =the top inthe tube, *again*. I have now really laced it with =boththinner and mineral spirits. It's probably a little too thin, but Ifigured Ican build up with multiple coats easier than wrestle with the jelly =at thispoint. I have not had similar problems with my other tube that has =polyurethane init. Seemed to be a lot easier to work with, but if there's a magic =bullet ofsome kind to prevent the jelling, I'll be very interested, too, since =I'dlikethe option of either. TIA, here too. mac Ed Riddle wrote: I use a Drip Tube and have been recently been storing the Spar in adiscarded (plastic?)gallon milk container. Prior to first use, a =couplemonths ago, I thinned it 10% with mineral spirits. Today, I found =that ithas thickened up and has some "globs" in it. I added more mineral =spiritsand filtered with a conical paper paint filter and that seemed to =work forthe moment. Any suggestions on how I might better preserve unused =portionbased on what I'm doing now?Thanks in advance.Ed ------=_NextPart_000_0014_01BFA332.FC139FA0 Nitrogen gas will do this too. It's heavy, so sinks down on = the liquid, to keep it dry. I'd think one could call P&L, and get = this happening to their product. GMA ----- Original Message ----- Cogburn Cc: Rodmakers Sent: Monday, April 10, 2000 = PM VarnishSince the jelling is due to reaction to the atmosphere, = to reducethe jelling is to remove the = I ordered my Epon fromMiller-Stephenson, they sent me a box of = = inverting the can to spray enough of theliquid into my varnish = helps.Regards,Onisk5vkq@ix.netcom.comAt = about 50/50 with a different manufacturer's = = similar problems with my other tube that has polyurethane = use a Drip Tube and have been recently been storing the Spar in = ------=_NextPart_000_0014_01BFA332.FC139FA0-- from channer1@rmi.net Mon Apr 10 21:44:17 2000 Subject: Re: Preserving Spar Varnish Ed Riddle wrote: I use a Drip Tube and have been recently been storing the Spar in adiscarded (plastic?)gallon milk container. Prior to first use, a couplemonths ago, I thinned it 10% with mineral spirits. Today, I found that ithas thickened up and has some "globs" in it. I added more mineral spiritsand filtered with a conical paper paint filter and that seemed to workforthe moment. Any suggestions on how I might better preserve unusedportionbased on what I'm doing now?Thanks in advance.EdEd;anytime you expose varnish to air, it will start to set up, at least onthe surface. This includes straining, stirring thinner in to large orsmall bottles, or anything else that causes air to be mixed into it.Keep your varnish in a container just large enough to hold it(use cleanmarbles or something similar to bring the varnish level up to the top)and float a bit of thinner on top of it to provide a laver between thevarnish and any remaining air in the bottle. I use a dip tube and keepit to the proper level and I have had the same varnish in it for 2 yrsor more. When you get grit in it, just throw it out and start over, for15 bucks a quart it's not worth the agravation.John from saweiss@flash.net Mon Apr 10 23:49:22 2000 Subject: Re: bamboo moisture Frank,I soak mine overnight in a PVC tube. When I put the strips in and fill withwater, they float and I cap the tube to submerse the strips. The nextmorning, the strips have sunk to the bottom. That's plenty wet forstraightening and rough planing.Steve Bob, I suspect that if you want to saturate cane (ie for wet planing)it might be faster do to it with water vapor than by soaking.It would be a small bother but you could build a warm "terrariumenvironment" and maybe get the cane really wet in less than a day.I'll have to rig up something and try it. I'd like to try wet planing to see if it works for me, but I'mreluctant to put my strips in water for days/weeks on endbecause I don't get to build rods on a regular schedule, just anevening here and there. If I could get the cane wet on 12 hoursnotice maybe it would be OK. If anyone out there is having trouble using my Hexrod program itsbecause I accidentally deleted some files. I'll have them restored from backup later today.......................................................................Frank Stetzer "...a cheerful comrade is betterstetzer@uwm.edu than a waterproof coat and aEmployed by, but not speaking for foot- warmer." Henry Van Dyke,Univ of Wisconsin-Milwaukee, USA "Fisherman's Luck", 1899. On Mon, 10 Apr 2000, Bob Nunley wrote: Frank Just a thought, but possibly the water has a quicker evaporationratethan the natural resins in the bamboo. I flamed a culm a couple ofweeksago, that has been sitting in the varnish room for about 6 months (sincetheSRG) and got a sticky, foamy "sap" out of the ends of the culm. Bob from SSteinzor@atg.state.vt.us Tue Apr 11 07:50:37 2000 0400 Subject: RE: Preserving Spar Varnish Wine snobs do something similar, inject a heavy gas into open winebottlesto keep the leftovers from oxidizing. You can get the paraphernalia atwell-stocked wine stores. I'm told its fairly cheap. -----Original Message-----From: nobler [SMTP:nobler@satx.rr.com]Sent: Monday, April 10, 2000 10:23 PM Cc: RodmakersSubject: Re: Preserving Spar Varnish Nitrogen gas will do this too. It's heavy, so sinks down on top of theliquid, to keep it dry. I'd think one could call P&L, and get help withthis happening to their product. GMA ----- Original Message ----- From: Onis Cogburn edriddle@mindspring.com Cc: Rodmakers Sent: Monday, April 10, 2000 9:13 PMSubject: Re: Preserving Spar Varnish Since the jelling is due to reaction to the atmosphere, one way toreducethe jelling is to remove the atmosphere. After I ordered my EponfromMiller- Stephenson, they sent me a box of other goodies. One was acan ofAero- Duster; Tetrafluroethane but propane or butane lighter fluidwouldprobably also work. I have been inverting the can to spray enoughof theliquid into my varnish container, a half gallon glass jug. It hasstoppedthe jelling. Hope this helps. Regards,Onisk5vkq@ix.netcom.com At 09:45 PM 4/10/00 -0400, Ralph MacKenzie wrote:Boy - AMEN to *that* problem! My first spar, Pratt & Lambert R7,got thicklike jello across the top - maybe an inch thick or so, (and theremainder inthe can as well). I thinned it with paint thinner, and that seemedto hold the littlebottles that I keep aside for wraps got jelled across the top,including theone with thinner. Mixed about 50/50 with a differentmanufacturer's spar(AceHardware) and some mineral spirits. The result seemed to beworking well andstaying liquid, but I had some other contamination problems withlittle"grits" in my finish, so I filtered through a paper coffee filter.After Idid that, the same batch that had been working well jelled over atthe top inthe tube, *again*. I have now really laced itwith boththinner and mineral spirits. It's probably a little too thin, butIfigured Ican build up with multiple coats easier than wrestle with the jellyat thispoint. I have not had similar problems with my other tube that haspolyurethane init. Seemed to be a lot easier to work with, but if there's a magicbullet ofsome kind to prevent the jelling, I'll be very interested, too,since I'dlikethe option of either. TIA, here too. mac Ed Riddle wrote: I use a Drip Tube and have been recently been storing the Spar inadiscarded (plastic?)gallon milk container. Prior to first use, acouplemonths ago, I thinned it 10% with mineral spirits. Today, I foundthat ithas thickened up and has some "globs" in it. I added moremineral spiritsand filtered with a conical paper paint filter and that seemed towork forthe moment. Any suggestions on how I might better preserveunused portionbased on what I'm doing now?Thanks in advance.Ed from nobler@satx.rr.com Tue Apr 11 07:51:39 2000 SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.357.35);Tue, 11 Apr 2000 07:39:51 -0500 "Robert Spezio" Subject: Re: Tony boundary="----=_NextPart_000_001C_01BFA38B.1BA45780" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_001C_01BFA38B.1BA45780 Please give him my best wishes, and tell him all of us on the Rodmaker's =list wish him well, and lots of cane slivers soon ! GMA Sent: Monday, April 10, 2000 10:15 PMSubject: Re: Tony Sorry I haven't gotten back to you before this. I've been tied up all =day. They have found 2 leaky valves and his heart wall is thickening so =the heart isn't pumping right. We are still waiting for all the tests =results to come back to know if he is going to need surgery or if meds =will take care of it. We should know tomorrow. He is still in the =hospital. But his spirits are still high and like he told the nurse He = Any news ? A bunch of us are very concerned ! GMA ------=_NextPart_000_001C_01BFA38B.1BA45780 Please give him my best wishes, and tell him all of us on = Rodmaker's list wish him well, and lots of cane slivers soon =! GMA ----- Original Message ----- Spezio Sent: Monday, April 10, 2000 = PMSubject: Re: TonySorry I haven't gotten back to you before this. I've = up all day. They have found 2 leaky valves and his heart wall is = the heart isn't pumping right. We are still waiting for all the tests = to come back to know if he is going to need surgery or if meds will = of it. We should know tomorrow. He is still in the hospital. But his = are still high and like he told the nurse He guess at 70 he's going to = ------=_NextPart_000_001C_01BFA38B.1BA45780-- from destinycon@mindspring.com Tue Apr 11 08:09:10 2000 Subject: RE: Preserving Spar Varnish At 08:53 AM 4/11/00 -0400, you wrote:Wine snobs do something similar, inject a heavy gas into open winebottlesto keep the leftovers from oxidizing. You can get the paraphernalia atwell-stocked wine stores. I'm told its fairly cheap. I don't know if I'm a wine snob but I drink a lot of it and do use WinePreserver (brand name) at about $10.00 a can (N2, CO2 & Ar). Works forme.Regards,Gary H. from sniderja@email.uc.edu Tue Apr 11 08:17:52 2000 Subject: modified Smithwick Glued on the reel seat, grip, ferrules last night on a modified TomSmithwick special. I extended the rod length from 5'6" to 6'0", and builtit as a 2 pc. nodeless. Fitted the ferrules this morning. Rod sure feels"quick" in the hand. Anxious to get home this evening, tape on a fewguides, and cast it in the back yard. It supposedly is a 5 wt.-- hope itturns out that way. I never ceased to be amazed at how a bamboo rodreallycomes together when the hardware and grips are attached. Same feelingwhenthat first coat of varnish is applied to the raw bamboo. The wood reallyseems to come alive. And, if it doesn't cast as well as I would like,without doubt I will have the best looking tomato stakes in theneighborhood (or perhaps it will become a short, 6 wt smallmouth rod foruse on local streams)!J. Snider from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Tue Apr 11 08:34:13 2000 Subject: Need help fast Friends,I'm finishing out a rod for a friend, and need somehelp quickly. I'm using Pittsburgh Paints 77-5 polyurethanevarnish. I've now got five coats on the entire rod. Thefinish is showing some real problems with "fish-eyes," andI'm not sure what to do about it.Someone is sure to mention problems with silicone,and I don't think that is the problem. The only way thatsilicone could have been introduced is through the siliconcarbide sandpaper. I'm using the same finish, same types ofrags, and so on that I have used successfully in the past.I wet-sanded the first two coats almost completelyaway with 1000 grit sandpaper. The fisheyes first appearedafter the third coat. I wet-sanded that coat very smoothwith 2000 grit. Even more fisheyes. Same thing after thefourth coat. Fisheyes are worse than ever.What I need from you great people is a solution.How do I get rid of the problem????? Harry--Harry Boydhttp://HarryBoydbamboorods.eboard.com/ from Grhghlndr@aol.com Tue Apr 11 08:42:14 2000 Subject: Re: Preserving Spar Varnish One way I have found thru the years to keep it from skinning over is turnthe can upside down so all the varnish sits on the lid and the air space is in the bottom of the can.bret from nobler@satx.rr.com Tue Apr 11 08:48:28 2000 SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.357.35);Tue, 11 Apr 2000 08:49:24 -0500 Subject: Re: Need help fast boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0096_01BFA393.0C1FE4C0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0096_01BFA393.0C1FE4C0 In all the years of painting with various mediums, oil is the main =fisheye producer. In some cases, a wipe down with a good thinner, or =clean alcohol, while wearing rubber gloves will do it. A tack rag works =well with lacquer/dope, but varnish could be another matter. There are various "fish eye eliminators", available from auto paint shop =suppliers. I recall getting one for enamels, to stop fish eye, when =spraying the first epoxy enamels. This was in the 1960's, but I believe =it was for auto enamel. GMA Sent: Tuesday, April 11, 2000 8:31 AMSubject: Need help fast Friends,I'm finishing out a rod for a friend, and need somehelp quickly. I'm using Pittsburgh Paints 77-5 polyurethanevarnish. I've now got five coats on the entire rod. Thefinish is showing some real problems with "fish-eyes," andI'm not sure what to do about it.Someone is sure to mention problems with silicone,and I don't think that is the problem. The only way thatsilicone could have been introduced is through the siliconcarbide sandpaper. I'm using the same finish, same types ofrags, and so on that I have used successfully in the past.I wet-sanded the first two coats almost completelyaway with 1000 grit sandpaper. The fisheyes first appearedafter the third coat. I wet-sanded that coat very smoothwith 2000 grit. Even more fisheyes. Same thing after thefourth coat. Fisheyes are worse than ever.What I need from you great people is a solution.How do I get rid of the problem????? Harry--Harry Boydhttp://HarryBoydbamboorods.eboard.com/ ------=_NextPart_000_0096_01BFA393.0C1FE4C0 In all the years of painting with various mediums, oil is = fisheye producer. In some cases, a wipe down with a good thinner, or = alcohol, while wearing rubber gloves will do it. A tack rag works well = lacquer/dope, but varnish could be another matter. There are various "fish eye eliminators", available from = shop suppliers. I recall getting one for enamels, to stop fish eye, when = spraying the first epoxy enamels. This was in the 1960's, but I believe = GMA ----- Original Message ----- Harry = = Sent: Tuesday, April 11, 2000 = AMSubject: Need help fast = = problems with silicone,and I don't think that is the = = = = problem?????Harry--Harry Boydhttp://HarryBoydbamboorod=s.eboard.com/ ------=_NextPart_000_0096_01BFA393.0C1FE4C0-- from rperry@suffolk.lib.ny.us Tue Apr 11 08:51:52 2000 Subject: Re: Need help fast Hi Harry, Maybe try the finish on a different clean test piece (don't use any of therags or sandpaper from the first try). If it fisheyes again, get rid ofthe poly. Regards, Bobflysupplies@yahoo.comflysupplies.homepage.com/ On Tue, 11 Apr 2000, Harry Boyd wrote: Friends,I'm finishing out a rod for a friend, and need somehelp quickly. I'm using Pittsburgh Paints 77-5 polyurethanevarnish. I've now got five coats on the entire rod. Thefinish is showing some real problems with "fish-eyes," andI'm not sure what to do about it.Someone is sure to mention problems with silicone,and I don't think that is the problem. The only way thatsilicone could have been introduced is through the siliconcarbide sandpaper. I'm using the same finish, same types ofrags, and so on that I have used successfully in the past.I wet-sanded the first two coats almost completelyaway with 1000 grit sandpaper. The fisheyes first appearedafter the third coat. I wet-sanded that coat very smoothwith 2000 grit. Even more fisheyes. Same thing after thefourth coat. Fisheyes are worse than ever.What I need from you great people is a solution.How do I get rid of the problem????? Harry--Harry Boydhttp://HarryBoydbamboorods.eboard.com/ from ernie2@pacbell.net Tue Apr 11 08:54:35 2000 sims.3.5.2000.01.05.12.18.p9)with SMTP id for Subject: Re: Preserving Spar Varnish Gary,That's interesting. I met a fellow selling head cement for fly tying atthe San Francisco Sportsman's Expo. one year. He had treated some headcement with something so it didn't evaporate. He said it was an oldpharmacist's trick. I bought a bottle and sure enough, I used that cementdown to the last drop and didn't have to thin it.Ernie Harrison ----- Original Message ----- Subject: RE: Preserving Spar Varnish At 08:53 AM 4/11/00 -0400, you wrote:Wine snobs do something similar, inject a heavy gas into open winebottlesto keep the leftovers from oxidizing. You can get the paraphernalia atwell-stocked wine stores. I'm told its fairly cheap. I don't know if I'm a wine snob but I drink a lot of it and do use WinePreserver (brand name) at about $10.00 a can (N2, CO2 & Ar). Works forme.Regards,Gary H. from morten@flash.net Tue Apr 11 08:57:32 2000 Subject: Re: Need help fast Harry,Try cleaning the sanded polyurethane with amonia diluted in water. Use asmall sponge and give it a good cleaning. This has worked for me when Ihave had problems with epoxy fisheying on older rods being redone. Yourpolyurethane may be contaminated, or the problem could be from yourhands; handsoap, lotion, shampoo etc.Morten -- 3119 Georgia Pine Dr.Spring, TX 77373(281) 353 5725http://www.flash.net/~morten from pmgoodwin@earthlink.net Tue Apr 11 08:58:21 2000 Subject: Re: Need help fast Tell your friend it a new and very expensive process and he's getting it forfree. Seriously, is this a new can of finish? did you thin it with somethingdifferent,maybe accidently. Try using the finish on a scrap piece and see if you getthesame results. was there any silcon used recently in your shop or home. I suspect you are going to have to strip it and start with all new varnish,etc. Paul ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Need help fast Friends,I'm finishing out a rod for a friend, and need somehelp quickly. I'm using Pittsburgh Paints 77-5 polyurethanevarnish. I've now got five coats on the entire rod. Thefinish is showing some real problems with "fish-eyes," andI'm not sure what to do about it.Someone is sure to mention problems with silicone,and I don't think that is the problem. The only way thatsilicone could have been introduced is through the siliconcarbide sandpaper. I'm using the same finish, same types ofrags, and so on that I have used successfully in the past.I wet-sanded the first two coats almost completelyaway with 1000 grit sandpaper. The fisheyes first appearedafter the third coat. I wet-sanded that coat very smoothwith 2000 grit. Even more fisheyes. Same thing after thefourth coat. Fisheyes are worse than ever.What I need from you great people is a solution.How do I get rid of the problem????? Harry--Harry Boydhttp://HarryBoydbamboorods.eboard.com/ from bhoy@inmind.com Tue Apr 11 09:00:12 2000 Tue, 11 Apr 2000 10:37:19 -0400 Subject: Re: Preserving Spar Varnish I have also heard that the canned air that photographers use to clean negatives etc. works,tho I have not tested it. It's a lot cheaper than bloxigen and I would assume safer than butane. What you are looking for is any inert gas that is heavier than air that will lie in a layeron top of the varnish to keep the oxygen out. At 10:13 PM 4/10/00, Onis Cogburn wrote:Since the jelling is due to reaction to the atmosphere, one way to reducethe jelling is to remove the atmosphere. After I ordered my Epon fromMiller-Stephenson, they sent me a box of other goodies. One was a can ofAero-Duster; Tetrafluroethane but propane or butane lighter fluid wouldprobably also work. I have been inverting the can to spray enough of theliquid into my varnish container, a half gallon glass jug. It has stoppedthe jelling. Hope this helps. Regards,Onisk5vkq@ix.netcom.com At 09:45 PM 4/10/00 -0400, Ralph MacKenzie wrote:Boy - AMEN to *that* problem! My first spar, Pratt & Lambert R7, gotthicklike jello across the top - maybe an inch thick or so, (and the remainderinthe can as well). I thinned it with paint thinner, and that seemed tohold bottles that I keep aside for wraps got jelled across the top, includingtheone with thinner. Mixed about 50/50 with a different manufacturer'sspar(AceHardware) and some mineral spirits. The result seemed to be working well andstaying liquid, but I had some other contamination problems with little"grits" in my finish, so I filtered through a paper coffee filter. After Idid that, the same batch that had been working well jelled over at the top inthe tube, *again*. I have now really laced it with boththinner and mineral spirits. It's probably a little too thin, but Ifigured Ican build up with multiple coats easier than wrestle with the jelly atthispoint. I have not had similar problems with my other tube that haspolyurethane init. Seemed to be a lot easier to work with, but if there's a magic bullet ofsome kind to prevent the jelling, I'll be very interested, too, since I'dlikethe option of either. TIA, here too. mac Ed Riddle wrote: I use a Drip Tube and have been recently been storing the Spar in adiscarded (plastic?)gallon milk container. Prior to first use, a couplemonths ago, I thinned it 10% with mineral spirits. Today, I found thatithas thickened up and has some "globs" in it. I added more mineralspiritsand filtered with a conical paper paint filter and that seemed to workforthe moment. Any suggestions on how I might better preserve unusedportionbased on what I'm doing now?Thanks in advance.Ed from nobler@satx.rr.com Tue Apr 11 09:10:22 2000 SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.357.35);Tue, 11 Apr 2000 09:11:16 -0500 Subject: Re: Oops, fixing a split tip boundary="----=_NextPart_000_00CB_01BFA396.1A5EB720" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_00CB_01BFA396.1A5EB720 The long split is indicative of good cane, from what little I know. I =had one tip of my PHY Midge split in long 3" splinters, when I first was =stringing it up ! I was so crest fallen, I didn't know what to do. Years =later, I was informed that I had just over stressed the area, and that =this showed what good cane it was. It was repaired then, and the white =silk over wrap was done. It's fished perfectly ever since. This was back =in 1953, so it's been around a long time. So late we get so smart ! GMA Sent: Monday, April 10, 2000 5:15 PMSubject: re: Oops, fixing a split tip Robert, I recenlty fixed the tip of a Battenkill with a break like you = except it was only 1 1/2" rather then 4" long and I don't recall it = conjuction to a node area. I believe it was in an internodal area. = eliminate a seam, and when dried I scraped the excess glue away from = normally use over a repair. I flexed the rod and gave it a casting = describe and not even as deep as the one you describe, perhaps .010". = the case of this rod it was primarily a cosmetic repair as I'm not = the rod wouldn't hold up just fine with the shallow splinter = Chris---------- Original Text ---------- From: "Robert Milardo" , on 4/10/00 2:55 PM: Ice was out last week and fishing is usually fine at that time with =togueand landlock salmon on surface flies. It was saturday, fishing was =ok, butfun to get out. I returned to the truck to disassembled an 8' 7wt, =andwhen the tip section released with some force the tip struct the =pavement.It was a side blow to the tip top. Well, I won't say how I felt at =thatmoment. This is what I thought was my best rod yet in terms of craft =etc.I didn't really expect to be getting extra practice at repairs but =maybethat's what this event is all about. The break is odd and I going to try to describe it. Actually it is =not aclean break, but a small section that splits off and runs down about =fourinches. The split starts at the first node, which is just below thefirst snake guide. It is as if someone took a tiny chisel and cut =into thenode, then lifted up. So the split section starts at a node, is about =aswide as the strip, and run down to the next guide. On one side the =splitruns into the adjoining section, and on the other side is sort of =follows aglue line. Looking at it, I don't think a glue line failed really. =Thesplit section is not very deep, about .02, and only involves some =surfacefibers. I'm not sure what to make of this. Was it a weak node that I didn't =happento notice? ( I usually check sections by flexing, but heck I don't do =itall the consistently, or at least it's not been a obsession. I seem =tohave a growing list of rodmaking obsessions.) Ever seen a break like this? I'm guessing I can repair it with epoxy, but comment on the choice ofadhesive if you like. (The rod was URACed.) How much of the split =wouldyou cover with silk? I think it's going to look like hell but I =mightjust try it so I'll have the rod available for the season. (I only =builtone tip.) Thanks in advace, Bob. Robert M. Milardo, Ph.D.Professor of Family Relations University of MaineOrono, ME 04469(207) 581-3128(207) 581-3120 FAX ------=_NextPart_000_00CB_01BFA396.1A5EB720 The long split is indicative of good cane, from what little = I had one tip of my PHY Midge split in long 3" splinters, when I first = stringing it up ! I was so crest fallen, I didn't know what to do. Years = I was informed that I had just over stressed the area, and that this = good cane it was. It was repaired then, and the white silk over wrap was = It's fished perfectly ever since. This was back in 1953, so it's been = long time. So late we get so smart ! GMA ----- Original Message ----- MCDOWELL = Sent: Monday, April 10, 2000 = PMSubject: re: Oops, fixing a = tipRobert,I recenlty fixed the tip of a Battenkill = break like you describe, except it was only 1 1/2" rather then 4" = Polyurethane glue, bound the glue job to eliminate a seam, and = = the case of this rod it was primarily a cosmetic repair as I'm not = convinced the rod wouldn't hold up just fine with the shallow = 4/10/00 = PM:Ice was out last week and fishing is usually fine at that = an 8' 7wt, andwhen the tip section released with some force the = = in terms of craft etc.I didn't really expect to be getting extra = at repairs but maybethat's what this event is all = split section starts at a node, is about aswide as the strip, and = section, and on the other side is sort of follows aglue = = obsessions.)Ever seen a break like this?I'm guessing I = repair it with epoxy, but comment on the choice ofadhesive if mightjust try it so I'll have the rod available for the = only builtone tip.)Thanks in advace, = 581-3120 FAX ------=_NextPart_000_00CB_01BFA396.1A5EB720-- from nobler@satx.rr.com Tue Apr 11 09:13:56 2000 SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.357.35);Tue, 11 Apr 2000 09:14:13 -0500 Subject: Re: Preserving Spar Varnish boundary="----=_NextPart_000_00D6_01BFA396.83FBC380" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_00D6_01BFA396.83FBC380 Some hobby shops carry nitrogen gas in spray cans. It is sold to put a =dry layer of gas, on top of the model engine fuel, that remains in a =gal. plastic bottle. Te brand name of the producer is Powermaster. GMA Sent: Tuesday, April 11, 2000 8:45 PMSubject: Re: Preserving Spar Varnish negatives etc. works,tho I have not tested it. It's a lot cheaper than bloxigen and I = assume safer than butane. What you are looking for is any inert gas that is heavier than air =