from ajthramer@hotmail.com Fri Mar 1 02:50:08 2002 g218o7813091 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 02:50:07 -0600 Fri, 1 Mar 2002 00:50:02 -0800 Fri, 01 Mar 2002 08:50:02 GMT Subject: Warped forms FILETIME=[136C85F0:01C1C0FE] Don't worry about forms that are warped along their length, most of us who made forms from the first edition of Garrisons book quickly found that there was an error in the dimensions for the tip side of the forms. The solution was to mill or grind .020 off of one side of the CR steel forms leading to a 1/4 to 3/8" bow in the forms. I kind of wonder if that is how Garrisons forms were warped also. Anyway, lots of well planed rods have been made from warped forms. If you are having problems with the integrity of the glued up sections you should look elsewhere.A.J. _________________________________________________________________MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx from homes-sold@attbi.com Fri Mar 1 03:37:25 2002 g219bO813755 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 03:37:24 -0600 Subject: Old Rods & Reels Neighbor of mine husband past away a few months ago she ask me if I knew =the worth of some fishing gear. Knowing that her husband was a saltwater = Turns out there are three 9' 3 piece bamboo rods, small casting reel, =automatic fly reel, and some flys still in the box. The rods belonging to his father are: Hardy, Devine & a custom rod. =Pat's father, Lunsford Dickson Fricks, was born in 1873 & retired in =1937 a famous doctor. Pat never used the rods so they have been in rod = The custom rod has a unique case, it looks like a 2x2 cover with a =velvet. Each face of the 2x2 has inlets the shape of the rod sections, =butt including the grip, mid section and the other two surfaces hold the =two tips. It even has indentations for the guides to fit and protect =them. Ends of the case are covered with leather and there are two small =leather straps to hold the sections in their grooves, clever ! Casting reel, says Julius Vom Hofe, Pat Nov 17 85 & Oct 8 1889.Fly reel, Diamond Automatic, Pat Nov 19' 07 & has a silk line on it. Anyone care to give some words of wisdom to tell this lady? I have some pictures I can send on request. TIA, Don Neighbor of mine husband past away a = she ask me if I knew the worth of some fishing gear. Knowing that her = was a saltwater guy I naturally thought that was the type of gear, = Turns out there are three 9' 3 piece = box. The rods belonging to his father are: = & retired in 1937 a famous doctor. Pat never used the rods so they = in rod bags and cases forever. Look in pretty good shape. The custom rod has a unique case, it = rod sections, butt including the grip, mid section and the other two = hold the two tips. It even has indentations for the guides to fit and = them. Ends of the case are covered with leather and there are two small = straps to hold the sections in their grooves, clever ! Reels: Casting reel, says Julius Vom Hofe, Pat= Fly reel, Diamond Automatic, Pat Nov = & has a silk line on it. Anyone care to give some words of = this lady? request. TIA,Don from petermckean@netspace.net.au Fri Mar 1 04:42:30 2002 g21AgS814374 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 04:42:28 -0600 g21AgJO68311; Subject: Re: Delamination city You know, Gerald, I may be missing the point here; but in my opinion itwould need to be a REALLY good lot of cane to be worth all that buggerisingabout. You would do it quicker, and probably better, from scratch, wouldn't you? Cheers Peter from petermckean@netspace.net.au Fri Mar 1 05:05:42 2002 g21B5f814735 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 05:05:41 -0600 g21B5ZV71369; Subject: Re: Old Rods & Reels Don Vom who? Was that "Hope"? Or "Rofe" maybe? Nah, cannot possibly be of any use to anyone! Send it over and I'll get rid of it for you. Don't bother to thank me - gladto help. Peter from briansr@point-net.com Fri Mar 1 07:10:14 2002 g21DAD815983 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 07:10:13 -0600 Fri, 1 Mar 2002 08:45:31 -0500 Subject: Re: Old Rods & Reels DonA Julius Vom Hofe casting reel usually goes between 350 to 500 $U.S.More =if it's mint.Cheers Brian Subject: Old Rods & Reels Neighbor of mine husband past away a few months ago she ask me if I =knew the worth of some fishing gear. Knowing that her husband was a = Turns out there are three 9' 3 piece bamboo rods, small casting reel, =automatic fly reel, and some flys still in the box. The rods belonging to his father are: Hardy, Devine & a custom rod. =Pat's father, Lunsford Dickson Fricks, was born in 1873 & retired in =1937 a famous doctor. Pat never used the rods so they have been in rod = The custom rod has a unique case, it looks like a 2x2 cover with a =velvet. Each face of the 2x2 has inlets the shape of the rod sections, =butt including the grip, mid section and the other two surfaces hold the =two tips. It even has indentations for the guides to fit and protect =them. Ends of the case are covered with leather and there are two small =leather straps to hold the sections in their grooves, clever ! Casting reel, says Julius Vom Hofe, Pat Nov 17 85 & Oct 8 1889.Fly reel, Diamond Automatic, Pat Nov 19' 07 & has a silk line on it. Anyone care to give some words of wisdom to tell this lady? I have some pictures I can send on request. TIA, Don DonA Julius Vom Hofe casting reel usually goes between= $U.S.More if it's mint.Cheers Brian ----- Original Message ----- Schneider Sent: March 1, 2002 4:41 =AMSubject: Old Rods & =Reels Neighbor of mine husband past away a = ago she ask me if I knew the worth of some fishing gear. Knowing that = husband was a saltwater guy I naturally thought that was the type of = wrong! Turns out there are three 9' 3 piece = box. The rods belonging to his father are: = Devine & a custom rod. Pat's father, Lunsford Dickson = born in 1873 & retired in 1937 a famous doctor. Pat never used the = they have been in rod bags and cases forever. Look in pretty good = The custom rod has a unique case, it = rod sections, butt including the grip, mid section and the other two = hold the two tips. It even has indentations for the guides to fit and = them. Ends of the case are covered with leather and there are two = leather straps to hold the sections in their grooves, clever =! Reels: Casting reel, says Julius Vom Hofe, = Fly reel, Diamond Automatic, Pat Nov = & has a silk line on it. Anyone care to give some words of = this lady? request. TIA, =Don from wendt@kingcrab.nrl.navy.mil Fri Mar 1 07:43:35 2002 g21DhY816577 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 07:43:34 -0600 g21DhVdd000659 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 08:43:31 -0500 Subject: Re: Warped forms AJ, Hmmm, I just had my forms built per the Garrison specs, also from the first edition. Where is the dimensional error? I don't have the book here at work, and I'm in the process of tuning my forms at home. Thanks,Mark At 08:50 AM 3/1/2002 +0000, you wrote: Don't worry about forms that are warped along their length, most of us who made forms from the first edition of Garrisons book quickly found that there was an error in the dimensions for the tip side of the forms. The solution was to mill or grind .020 off of one side of the CR steel forms leading to a 1/4 to 3/8" bow in the forms. I kind of wonder if that is how Garrisons forms were warped also. Anyway, lots of well planed rods have been made from warped forms. If you are having problems with theintegrity of the glued up sections you should look elsewhere.A.J. _________________________________________________________________MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx from FISHWOOL@aol.com Fri Mar 1 08:47:30 2002 g21ElT818966 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 08:47:29 -0600 Subject: Re: Grand Experiment To all,Can anyone tell me the dates for Grayrock this coming June? I'd like to be there this year.Regards,Hank. from avyoung@iinet.net.au Fri Mar 1 08:56:09 2002 g21Eu7819457 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 08:56:08 -0600 Subject: Re: Warped forms They could almost be in an S shape as long as the groove is correct unless you plan on laying the glued blank in the form to let it cure straight which it wouldn't IF the form was almost an S shape.Meaning I can't see it matters. Tony At 08:50 AM 3/1/2002 +0000, you wrote: Don't worry about forms that are warped along their length, most of us who made forms from the first edition of Garrisons book quickly found that there was an error in the dimensions for the tip side of the forms. The solution was to mill or grind .020 off of one side of the CR steel forms leading to a 1/4 to 3/8" bow in the forms. I kind of wonder if that is how Garrisons forms were warped also. Anyway, lots of well planed rods have been made from warped forms. If you are having problems with the integrity of the glued up sections you should look elsewhere.A.J. _________________________________________________________________MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx /*************************************************************************/AV YoungVisit my web site at:"http://www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html" Yea, though I walk in the river of very shallow depth I fear no failure, My rod and my reel they comfort me. /*************************************************************************/ from wendt@kingcrab.nrl.navy.mil Fri Mar 1 09:02:54 2002 g21F2r819986 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 09:02:53 -0600 g21F2qdd002402 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 10:02:52 -0500 Subject: Re: New Workbench, and wood vise Mark, I used to build planes for guys too. Got burned out on that too. Stopped making airplanes for almost three years. Good thing I had a good stock of already finished birds in the hangar. I've gotten away from the war bird stuff, and have gotten back to my first passion in flying - pattern. There's nothing quite like a graceful 2 meter pattern ship going through it's paces, and even when not practicing precision aerobatics, they are just so graceful flying around burning holes in the sky. Another great way to escape from the every day stresses. I'm currently flying a 2 meter Sequel, with a YS 120 AC for power, running 30% fuel through it with a 15" x 12" APC pattern prop on the front. The bird weighs in at just over 10 lbs, and will go vertical forever. If you think 'boo rod builders are anal, you should see pattern flyers when they build their ships.... Measuring wing incidence down to less than 1/2 of a degree, control throws to less than 1/10 of a degree using laser throw meters, using gram scales to measure balsa so they can get the lightest wings, etc.... Probably why I'm going to enjoy building bamboo. I've spent the last three nights tuning up my forms, and there's something to be said for a draw file going down the forms, and taking off little metal bits.... Kinda like the Neanderthal planers, and the music they hear when they are planing wood.... Mark At 08:19 PM 2/28/2002 -0500, you wrote: In a message dated 2/28/02 8:10:41 AM Central Standard Time,wendt@kingcrab.nrl.navy.mil writes: I think you were in a similar situation to me. I did not make "kits" but Ibuilt models for other people and did set up for a couple of local shops. Acouple of my friends are prolific modelers. the designer of th IO andCallisto Sailplanes,the designer of the Chuperosa sailplane (I have anoriginal prototype of LeRoys first Chup') are both friends. Paul McIlrath,who designed several gummyband free flighters for Sig is a friend (the 29er,the Cabinaire, the Customaire) and I built something like 29 sig "wonders"Which are ablout the same scale as a 1/12 warbird. My last one had slightlyclipped wings (foam with tagboard skins) of about 32 inches and a Fox BB.15.My favorite "Russian" color scheme. though, ya know, the 48 inch wingversion was probably more manouverable (that one was a spitfire-ishcovering)and it had a plain bearing .15 from a chinese engine maker or somethign. TheFox BB .15 version was BLINDINGLY fast! Scary! The little Fox turned19,000rpm and sounded like a huge mosquito! A very angry mosquito! Fun. I hadthe ailerons sized up and set on "stun" I could get it to blur! yeah baby!But at this point I am not building or flying much. I have a Lil'Birdsailplane (2 M) that is about the best flying sailplane I have ever owned,but have not launched it in about 2 years.Ah well, life is like that. The junque goes and the good stuff stays! mark from splitcane@t-online.de Fri Mar 1 09:08:43 2002 g21F8g820394 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 09:08:42 -0600 id 16goeB-0003X8-04; Fri, 01 Mar 2002 16:08:35 +0100 fwd11.sul.t-online.com Subject: Re: Warped forms Hi Mr. Kifer,your problem and all suggestions of the list sound familiar [:)] . I'ld just liketo ad one thing: heat that da**d steel up to 1000ŸC and let it cool off slowly.(you should have done it before working your a** off on this uncooperativebarof iron [:)] cuMichael W Kifer schrieb: Hello all, Anyone know an inexpensive way to straighten cold rolled forms? I finishedmy forms to within .005 on the grooves with the intention of finishing witha triangle stone. I recently got them out to finish and found they bowedslightly from end to end. Maybe 3/8" high in the middle when laid flat.Youcan see the bow when sighting down the forms. They are still flat side toside. I don't know why I didn't notice this when working on them earlier.It's been suggested I clamp them to a flat surface, finish the grooves, anduse them anyway. Being somewhat obsessive about accuracy I know it'sgoingto bug the heck out of me knowing they're not flat. I'm also concerned withplaning accuracy. Barring any way to straighten them, I could use suggestions on alternativetypes of steel. The one and only supplier in the area can't get stressrelieved square stock. Any constructive suggestions would be appreciated. Thanks,Wayne from dickay@alltel.net Fri Mar 1 09:43:22 2002 g21FhH822236 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 09:43:17 -0600 Fri, 1 Mar 2002 09:43:12 -0600 Subject: Re: Grand Experiment Hank, It's usually the weekend after Father's Day. Wouldn't that be June20- 23Dick Fuhrman----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Grand Experiment To all,Can anyone tell me the dates for Grayrock this coming June? I'd like to be there this year.Regards,Hank. from Troy.Miller@BakerOilTools.com Fri Mar 1 10:09:45 2002 g21G9i823653 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 10:09:44 -0600 (bhihdcimc01.bakerhughes.com [204.253.245.34] (may be forged)) (5.5.2653.19) id ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 09:54:39 -0600 Subject: RE: Warped forms Hi Wayne. I would not invest 1 hour of work on a set of bars that were notstress-relieved. I've seen some parts here in our plant that were machinedand complete. Then they dropped the part and it distorted in a way thatsimply boggles the mind. Not just simple brinelling of the part at thepoint of impact, but the whole part went haywire.... When tracing back the heat lot of the steel, it was found that they left outthe stress-relieving. Mechanical shock, temperature variations, who knowswhat else, can set off an internal "explosion" within the steel'scrystalline structure. It's horrific, and I could imagine how I'd feelafter investing 50+ hours (like I have in my forms), only to have themrendered unusable due to internal stresses.... I would say that would be the most critical property of the steel that youpurchase. More important than minimum yield strength, elongation, Charpy'simpact resistance, corrosion resistance, etc. Find another supplier if hecan't get you stress relieved bar. I would agree with all the posts thatsay they'll be fine to use as-is, but my concern would be that the surfacesmay not stay flat to each other, the groove may not stay perpendicular tothe surface (twisting), etc down the road. Guess I'm a glass- half-emptysorta guy when it comes to materials..... MHO -- TAM-----Original Message----- Subject: Warped forms Hello all, Anyone know an inexpensive way to straighten cold rolled forms? I finished my forms to within .005 on the grooves with the intention of finishing with a triangle stone. I recently got them out to finish and found they bowed slightly from end to end. Maybe 3/8" high in the middle when laid flat.You can see the bow when sighting down the forms. They are still flat side to side. I don't know why I didn't notice this when working on them earlier. It's been suggested I clamp them to a flat surface, finish the grooves, and use them anyway. Being somewhat obsessive about accuracy I know it's going to bug the heck out of me knowing they're not flat. I'm also concerned with planing accuracy. Barring any way to straighten them, I could use suggestions on alternative types of steel. The one and only supplier in the area can't get stress relieved square stock. Any constructive suggestions would be appreciated. Thanks,Wayne from trpgo@msn.com Fri Mar 1 10:09:52 2002 g21G9p823663 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 10:09:51 -0600 Fri, 1 Mar 2002 08:09:42 -0800 Subject: Bumped off list FILETIME=[7F3474E0:01C1C13B] Just a question to find out why I have been bumped off the Rodmakers list=twice this week. Has this been happening to anyone else? Tom Just aquestio=n to find out why I have been bumped off the Rodmakers list twice this we= Tom from wkifer@harborside.com Fri Mar 1 11:17:56 2002 g21HHt827274 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 11:17:55 -0600 Subject: Forms --=======477F7B41======= ascii; format=flowed Thanks all, I believe I'll finish them as is, build a new set later. Yes, I'm a bit anal about this kind of thing. I admit it. I appreciate all the feedback. Wayne --=======477F7B41=======-- from caneman@clnk.com Fri Mar 1 13:01:28 2002 g21J1S802302 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 13:01:28 -0600 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35) Fri, 1 Mar 2002 12:59:57 -0600 Subject: Tradition in Rodmaking This morning I got an email that made me think a little bit about our =craft. We do things because it is "tradition" and many times never =bother to investigate WHY. We do things like use only silk thread, only =Nickel Silver reel seats, only use particular types of finishes, only =use certain style guides, etc., etc., etc., mostly because it's ="tradition" to use these things. This little story has a pretty good =point to it. I thought it pretty much applied to all of us =rodmonkeys... er, uh.. RodMakers. Enjoy it! Later,Bob Tradition Start with a cage containing five monkeys. Inside the cage, hang abanana on a string and place a set of stairs under it. Before long, amonkey will go to the stairs and start to climb towards the banana. Assoon as he touches the stairs, spray all of the other monkeys with coldwater.After a while, another monkey makes an attempt with the same result- all the other monkeys are sprayed with cold water. Pretty soon, whenanother monkey tries to climb the stairs, the other monkeys will try toprevent it.Now, put away the cold water. Remove one monkey from the cage andreplace it with a new one. The new monkey sees the banana and wants toclimb the stairs. To his surprise and horror, all of the other monkeysattack him. After another attempt and attack, he knows that if he triesto climb the stairs, he will be assaulted.Next, remove another of the original five monkeys and replace itwith a new one. The newcomer goes to the stairs and is attacked. Theprevious newcomer takes part in the punishment with enthusiasm!Likewise, replace a third original monkey with a new one, then a fourth, =then thefifth.Every time the newest monkey takes to the stairs, he is attacked.Most of the monkeys that are beating him have no idea why they were notpermitted to climb the stairs or why they are participating in thebeating of the newest monkey.After replacing all the original monkeys, none of the remainingmonkeys have ever been sprayed with cold water. Nevertheless, no monkeyever again approaches the stairs to try for the banana. Why not? Becauseas far as they know that's just the way it's always been done. And that, my friends, is how TRADITION begins. This morning I got an email that made me think a little bit = Silver reel seats, only use particular types of finishes, only use = guides, etc., etc., etc., mostly because it's "tradition" to use these = it! Later,Bob Tradition cage, hang abanana on a string and place a set of stairs under it. = long, amonkey will go to the stairs and start to climb towards the = Assoon as he touches the stairs, spray all of the other monkeys with = makes = attempt with the same result- all the other monkeys are sprayed with = water. Pretty soon, whenanother monkey tries to climb the stairs, = water. Remove one monkey from the cage andreplace it with a new one.= monkey sees the banana and wants toclimb the stairs. To his surprise = horror, all of the other monkeysattack him. After another attempt = monkeys and replace itwith a new one. The newcomer goes to the = monkey takes to the stairs, he is attacked.Most of the monkeys that = beating him have no idea why they were notpermitted to climb the = the remainingmonkeys have ever been sprayed with cold water. = no monkeyever again approaches the stairs to try for the banana. Why= from jvswan@earthlink.net Fri Mar 1 13:15:26 2002 g21JFP803228 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 13:15:26 -0600 (216.160.236.98) User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/9.0.1.3108Subject: Re: Tradition in Rodmaking understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. --B_3097829724_2207202 Reminds me of the urban legend about the new bride who cut the end off herham roasts before cooking the thing. Having never seen ham prepared thisway, the new husband asked why she did that. She said because that is howone cooks a ham, silly. Well, the husband asked the mother and got thesam=eresponse. When he asked the girls grandmother, though, he found out thatshe only had short pans and usually needed to do that so that the ham wouldfit. So, the real rodmakers=B9 question I want to ask is this, what are thesacrosanct traditions? I know rodmakers who use polyurethane finishes. Ihave seen many aluminum reel seats. Are the traditions cosmetic,generally=?Or are there some procedural traditions that may be superfluous? Jason On 3/1/02 11:59 AM, "Bob Nunley" wrote: This morning I got an email that made me think a little bit about our cra= ft. We do things because it is "tradition" and many times never bother toinvestigate WHY. We do things like use only silk thread, only Nickel Sil= ver reel seats, only use particular types of finishes, only use certain styleguides, etc., etc., etc., mostly because it's "tradition" to use these th= ings. This little story has a pretty good point to it. I thought it pretty muc= h applied to all of us rodmonkeys... er, uh.. RodMakers. Enjoy it! Later,Bob Tradition Start with a cage containing five monkeys. Inside the cage, hang abanana on a string and place a set of stairs under it. Before long, amonkey will go to the stairs and start to climb towards the banana. Assoon as he touches the stairs, spray all of the other monkeys with coldwater.After a while, another monkey makes an attempt with the same result- all the other monkeys are sprayed with cold water. Pretty soon, whenanother monkey tries to climb the stairs, the other monkeys will try toprevent it.Now, put away the cold water. Remove one monkey from the cage andreplace it with a new one. The new monkey sees the banana and wants toclimb the stairs. To his surprise and horror, all of the other monkeysattack him. After another attempt and attack, he knows that if he triesto climb the stairs, he will be assaulted.Next, remove another of the original five monkeys and replace itwith a new one. The newcomer goes to the stairs and is attacked. Theprevious newcomer takes part in the punishment with enthusiasm!Likewise, replace a third original monkey with a new one, then a fourth, = then thefifth.Every time the newest monkey takes to the stairs, he is attacked.Most of the monkeys that are beating him have no idea why they were notpermitted to climb the stairs or why they are participating in thebeating of the newest monkey.After replacing all the original monkeys, none of the remainingmonkeys have ever been sprayed with cold water. Nevertheless, no monkeyever again approaches the stairs to try for the banana. Why not? Becauseas far as they know that's just the way it's always been done. And that, my friends, is how TRADITION begins. --B_3097829724_2207202 Re: Tradition in Rodmaking Reminds me of the urban legend about the newbride who= never=seen ham prepared this way, the new husband asked why she did that. gr=andmother, though, he found out that she only had short pans and usuallynee=ded to do that so that the ham would fit. So, the real rodmakers’ question I want to ask is this, what are the = finishes.= cosmet= sup=erfluous? Jason wrote: Thismorning I got a= because it is "tradition" and many times never bother toinvestiga= l seats, only use particular types of finishes, only use certain style guide=s, etc., etc., etc., mostly because it's "tradition" to use these = oy it! Later,Bob Tradition monkeys=. Inside the cage, hang abanana on a string and place a set of stairs under it. Before long, amonkey will go to the stairs and start to climb towards the banana. Assoon as he touches the stairs, spray all of the other monkeys with coldwater. with=the same result- all the other monkeys are sprayed with cold water. Pretty soon, whenanother monkey tries to climb the stairs, the other monkeys will try toprevent it. monkey fro=m the cage andreplace it with a new one. The new monkey sees the banana and wantstoclimb the stairs. To his surprise and horror, all of the other monkeysattack him. After another attempt and attack, he knows that if hetriesto climb the stairs, he will be assaulted. a=nd replace itwith a new one. The newcomer goes to the stairs and is attacked. Theprevious newcomer takes part in the punishment with enthusiasm!Likewise, replace a third original monkey with a new one, then a fourth, th=en thefifth. stairs, h=e is attacked.Most of the monkeys that are beating him have no idea why they werenotpermitted to climb the stairs or why they are participating in thebeating of the newest monkey. t=he remainingmonkeys have ever been sprayed with cold water. Nevertheless, nomonkeyever again approaches the stairs to try for the banana. Why not?Because as far as they know that's just the way it's always been done. how TR=ADITION begins. --B_3097829724_2207202-- from ctcaneman@yahoo.com Fri Mar 1 13:26:14 2002 g21JQD804064 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 13:26:13 -0600 01 Mar 2002 11:26:13 PST Subject: Re: Tradition in Rodmaking Monkeys can make cane rods? --- Bob Nunley wrote: This morning I got an email that made me think alittle bit about our craft. We do things because itis "tradition" and many times never bother toinvestigate WHY. We do things like use only silkthread, only Nickel Silver reel seats, only useparticular types of finishes, only use certain styleguides, etc., etc., etc., mostly because it's"tradition" to use these things. This little storyhas a pretty good point to it. I thought it prettymuch applied to all of us rodmonkeys... er, uh..RodMakers. Enjoy it! Later,Bob Tradition Start with a cage containing five monkeys.Inside the cage, hang abanana on a string and place a set of stairs underit. Before long, amonkey will go to the stairs and start to climbtowards the banana. Assoon as he touches the stairs, spray all of theother monkeys with coldwater.After a while, another monkey makes an attemptwith the same result- all the other monkeys are sprayed with cold water.Pretty soon, whenanother monkey tries to climb the stairs, the othermonkeys will try toprevent it.Now, put away the cold water. Remove one monkey from the cage andreplace it with a new one. The new monkey sees thebanana and wants toclimb the stairs. To his surprise and horror, all ofthe other monkeysattack him. After another attempt and attack, heknows that if he triesto climb the stairs, he will be assaulted.Next, remove another of the original fivemonkeys and replace itwith a new one. The newcomer goes to the stairs andis attacked. Theprevious newcomer takes part in the punishment withenthusiasm!Likewise, replace a third original monkey with a newone, then a fourth, then thefifth.Every time the newest monkey takes to thestairs, he is attacked.Most of the monkeys that are beating him have no permitted to climb the stairs or why they areparticipating in thebeating of the newest monkey.After replacing all the original monkeys, noneof the remainingmonkeys have ever been sprayed with cold water.Nevertheless, no monkeyever again approaches the stairs to try for thebanana. Why not? Becauseas far as they know that's just the way it's alwaysbeen done.And that, my friends, is howTRADITION begins. __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Greetings - Send FREE e-cards for every occasion!http://greetings.yahoo.com from ttalsma@macatawa.org Fri Mar 1 13:28:47 2002 g21JSl804434 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 13:28:47 -0600 id ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 14:21:35 -0500 id F563CFLS; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 14:21:32 -0500 Subject: Re: Tradition in Rodmaking As with business (I'm sure noone has ever heard this before), just askthe question, "Why do we do it that way?" The response, "Because that'sthe way we've always done it." About drives me nuts when I hear this. Kudos to all of those out there that question tradition and come up withnew ways of building rods. Jason Swan wrote: Reminds me of the urban legend about the new bride who cut the end offher ham roasts before cooking the thing. Having never seen hamprepared this way, the new husband asked why she did that. She saidbecause that is how one cooks a ham, silly. Well, the husband askedthe mother and got the same response. When he asked the girlsgrandmother, though, he found out that she only had short pans andusually needed to do that so that the ham would fit. So, the real rodmakers' question I want to ask is this, what are thesacrosanct traditions? I know rodmakers who use polyurethanefinishes. I have seen many aluminum reel seats. Are the traditionscosmetic, generally? Or are there some procedural traditions that maybe superfluous? Jason On 3/1/02 11:59 AM, "Bob Nunley" wrote: This morning I got an email that made me think a little bitabout our craft. We do things because it is "tradition" andmany times never bother to investigate WHY. We do thingslike use only silk thread, only Nickel Silver reel seats,only use particular types of finishes, only use certainstyle guides, etc., etc., etc., mostly because it's"tradition" to use these things. This little story has apretty good point to it. I thought it pretty much appliedto all of us rodmonkeys... er, uh.. RodMakers. Enjoy it! Later,Bob Tradition Start with a cage containing five monkeys. Inside thecage, hang abanana on a string and place a set of stairs under it.Before long, amonkey will go to the stairs and start to climb towards thebanana. Assoon as he touches the stairs, spray all of the othermonkeys with coldwater.After a while, another monkey makes an attempt with thesame result- all the other monkeys are sprayed with cold water. Prettysoon, whenanother monkey tries to climb the stairs, the other monkeyswill try toprevent it.Now, put away the cold water. Remove one monkey from thecage andreplace it with a new one. The new monkey sees the bananaand wants toclimb the stairs. To his surprise and horror, all of theother monkeysattack him. After another attempt and attack, he knows thatif he triesto climb the stairs, he will be assaulted.Next, remove another of the original five monkeys andreplace itwith a new one. The newcomer goes to the stairs and isattacked. Theprevious newcomer takes part in the punishment withenthusiasm!Likewise, replace a third original monkey with a new one,then a fourth, then thefifth.Every time the newest monkey takes to the stairs, he isattacked.Most of the monkeys that are beating him have no idea whythey were notpermitted to climb the stairs or why they are participatingin thebeating of the newest monkey.After replacing all the original monkeys, none of theremainingmonkeys have ever been sprayed with cold water.Nevertheless, no monkeyever again approaches the stairs to try for the banana. Whynot? Becauseas far as they know that's just the way it's always beendone. And that, my friends, is how TRADITIONbegins. -- Todd Talsma 8412 North Maple Court Zeeland MI 49464 ------ email: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/ Bamboo Tips site:http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo/ Bamboo Sources site:http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo_Sources/ home page:http://external.sligh.com/~toddt/ genealogy pages: Under construction from dmanders@telusplanet.net Fri Mar 1 14:08:30 2002 Received: from g21K8T806646 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 edtnes03-hme0.telusplanet.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.01 201-253-122-122- X-Sender:dmanders/pop.telusplanet.net@pop3.norton.antivirus X-Mailer: Windows caneman@clnk.com From: Don & Sandy AndersenSubject: Re: Tradition in Rodmaking Cc: "Rod dmanders@telusplanet.net Sender: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu X- Listprocessor-Version: 8.2.09/990901/11:28 -- ListProc(tm) by CREN Bob,Best way I've ever heard it said: "tradition is no excuse" catch ya' Don At12:59 PM 3/1/02 -0600, Bob Nunley wrote: arialThis morning I gotanemail that made me think a little bit about our craft. We do thingsbecause it is "tradition" and many times never bother to investigate WHY.We do things like use only silk thread, only Nickel Silver reel seats,only use particular types of finishes, only use certain style guides,etc., etc., etc., mostly because it's "tradition" to use these things.This little story has a pretty good point to it. I thought it prettymuch applied to all of us rodmonkeys... er, uh.. RodMakers. Enjoy it! Later, Bob Tradition arial Start with a cagecontainingfive monkeys. Inside the cage, hang a banana on a string and place a set of stairs under it. Before long, a monkey will go to the stairs and start to climb towards the banana. As soon as he touches the stairs, spray all of the other monkeys with cold water. After a while, another monkey makes an attempt with the same result - all the other monkeys are sprayed with cold water. Pretty soon, when another monkey tries to climb the stairs, the other monkeys will try to prevent it. Now, put away the cold water. Remove one monkey from the cage and replace it with a new one. The new monkey sees the banana and wants to climb the stairs. To his surprise and horror, all of the other monkeys attack him. After another attempt and attack, he knows that if he tries to climb the stairs, he will be assaulted. Next, remove another of the original five monkeys and replace it with a new one. The newcomer goes to the stairs and is attacked. The previous newcomer takes part in the punishment with enthusiasm! Likewise, replace a third original monkey with a new one, then a fourth,then the fifth. Every time the newest monkey takes to the stairs, he is attacked. Most of the monkeys that are beating him have no idea why they were not permitted to climb the stairs or why they are participating in the beating of the newest monkey. After replacing all the original monkeys, none of the remaining monkeys have ever been sprayed with cold water. Nevertheless, no monkey ever again approaches the stairs to try for the banana. Why not? Because as far as they know that's just the way it's always been done. And that, my friends, is how TRADITION begins. ffff,0000,0000http://www.telusplanet.net/public/dmanders/index.html from kenealyj@gwi.net Fri Mar 1 14:09:20 2002 g21K9I807023 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 14:09:18 -0600 Subject: Re: Tradition in Rodmaking I prove that one every day! [;-)] ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Tradition in Rodmaking Monkeys can make cane rods? --- Bob Nunley wrote: This morning I got an email that made me think alittle bit about our craft. We do things because itis "tradition" and many times never bother toinvestigate WHY. We do things like use only silkthread, only Nickel Silver reel seats, only useparticular types of finishes, only use certain styleguides, etc., etc., etc., mostly because it's"tradition" to use these things. This little storyhas a pretty good point to it. I thought it prettymuch applied to all of us rodmonkeys... er, uh..RodMakers. Enjoy it! Later,Bob Tradition Start with a cage containing five monkeys.Inside the cage, hang abanana on a string and place a set of stairs underit. Before long, amonkey will go to the stairs and start to climbtowards the banana. Assoon as he touches the stairs, spray all of theother monkeys with coldwater.After a while, another monkey makes an attemptwith the same result- all the other monkeys are sprayed with cold water.Pretty soon, whenanother monkey tries to climb the stairs, the othermonkeys will try toprevent it.Now, put away the cold water. Remove one monkey from the cage andreplace it with a new one. The new monkey sees thebanana and wants toclimb the stairs. To his surprise and horror, all ofthe other monkeysattack him. After another attempt and attack, heknows that if he triesto climb the stairs, he will be assaulted.Next, remove another of the original fivemonkeys and replace itwith a new one. The newcomer goes to the stairs andis attacked. Theprevious newcomer takes part in the punishment withenthusiasm!Likewise, replace a third original monkey with a newone, then a fourth, then thefifth.Every time the newest monkey takes to thestairs, he is attacked.Most of the monkeys that are beating him have no permitted to climb the stairs or why they areparticipating in thebeating of the newest monkey.After replacing all the original monkeys, noneof the remainingmonkeys have ever been sprayed with cold water.Nevertheless, no monkeyever again approaches the stairs to try for thebanana. Why not? Becauseas far as they know that's just the way it's alwaysbeen done.And that, my friends, is howTRADITION begins. __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Greetings - Send FREE e-cards for every occasion!http://greetings.yahoo.com from kenealyj@gwi.net Fri Mar 1 14:12:36 2002 g21KCZ808619 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 14:12:35 -0600 Subject: Re: Tradition in Rodmaking Someone said, I think that it was on this list, that the old timers used thebest of what was available to them. I use titanium guides, because I think they are better than other types(justmy opinion, not pushing it on anyone!!!!!!!! I don't want to start anargument over guide choice). Some traditions are nice, though, like silk thread- it looks nice and theguides will stay on for years. I think the original point is correct, we shouldn't hang on to traditionsjust because they are traditions. John K----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Tradition in Rodmaking As with business (I'm sure noone has ever heard this before), just askthe question, "Why do we do it that way?" The response, "Because that'sthe way we've always done it." About drives me nuts when I hear this. Kudos to all of those out there that question tradition and come up withnew ways of building rods. Jason Swan wrote: Reminds me of the urban legend about the new bride who cut the end offher ham roasts before cooking the thing. Having never seen hamprepared this way, the new husband asked why she did that. She saidbecause that is how one cooks a ham, silly. Well, the husband askedthe mother and got the same response. When he asked the girlsgrandmother, though, he found out that she only had short pans andusually needed to do that so that the ham would fit. So, the real rodmakers' question I want to ask is this, what are thesacrosanct traditions? I know rodmakers who use polyurethanefinishes. I have seen many aluminum reel seats. Are the traditionscosmetic, generally? Or are there some procedural traditions that maybe superfluous? Jason On 3/1/02 11:59 AM, "Bob Nunley" wrote: This morning I got an email that made me think a little bitabout our craft. We do things because it is "tradition" andmany times never bother to investigate WHY. We do thingslike use only silk thread, only Nickel Silver reel seats,only use particular types of finishes, only use certainstyle guides, etc., etc., etc., mostly because it's"tradition" to use these things. This little story has apretty good point to it. I thought it pretty much appliedto all of us rodmonkeys... er, uh.. RodMakers. Enjoy it! Later,Bob Tradition Start with a cage containing five monkeys. Inside thecage, hang abanana on a string and place a set of stairs under it.Before long, amonkey will go to the stairs and start to climb towards thebanana. Assoon as he touches the stairs, spray all of the othermonkeys with coldwater.After a while, another monkey makes an attempt with thesame result- all the other monkeys are sprayed with cold water. Prettysoon, whenanother monkey tries to climb the stairs, the other monkeyswill try toprevent it.Now, put away the cold water. Remove one monkey from thecage andreplace it with a new one. The new monkey sees the bananaand wants toclimb the stairs. To his surprise and horror, all of theother monkeysattack him. After another attempt and attack, he knows thatif he triesto climb the stairs, he will be assaulted.Next, remove another of the original five monkeys andreplace itwith a new one. The newcomer goes to the stairs and isattacked. Theprevious newcomer takes part in the punishment withenthusiasm!Likewise, replace a third original monkey with a new one,then a fourth, then thefifth.Every time the newest monkey takes to the stairs, he isattacked.Most of the monkeys that are beating him have no idea whythey were notpermitted to climb the stairs or why they are participatingin thebeating of the newest monkey.After replacing all the original monkeys, none of theremainingmonkeys have ever been sprayed with cold water.Nevertheless, no monkeyever again approaches the stairs to try for the banana. Whynot? Becauseas far as they know that's just the way it's always beendone. And that, my friends, is how TRADITIONbegins. --Todd Talsma8412 North Maple CourtZeeland MI 49464------ web design business page: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo Tips site: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo/Bamboo Sources site: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo_Sources/home page: http://external.sligh.com/~toddt/genealogy pages: Under construction from rodsupstream@exploremaine.com Fri Mar 1 14:33:02 2002 g21KX1809977 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 14:33:01 -0600 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 15:32:56 -0500 Subject: radition in Rodmaking Does this apply to sic sided plastics?????? Upstream Always, Tim DoughtyRod Maker name="winmail.dat" filename="winmail.dat" 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 from tgoodman@mail.as.miami.edu Fri Mar 1 15:05:28 2002 g21L5R812488 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 15:05:28 -0600 id ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 16:05:22 -0500 Subject: RE: Tradition in Rodmaking this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. A fair critique, this monkey business, on all counts; we humans often don'tlike to change, and aren't half-aware of why we do things the way we do.Every new idea is worthy of consideration, and so is every old one, so everyaccepted practice in making split cane rods may be examined. The membersofthis list seem as innovative as you are traditional-but few will supportchange for the sake of change, all the same. There are values- aesthetic,cultural-worth defending on other than practical grounds. A. K. Bestdoesn't tie flies with natural materials for practical reasons or, at least,not only for practical reasons; numerous innovations have emerged fromusingsynthetic materials that are both cheaper and more widely available than thetraditional materials. But to go that route would mean missing the fun ofcollecting road kill. After all-to slide right down the slippery slope of questioning methods andtraditions-we know that most folks who fish don't fly fish, and of those whodo, most of them use graphite rods. There's little practical value inmaking and fishing rods from the lovely reed. I preach to the choir ofcourse in saying that we hold with split cane and Pearsalls' and Perfects(substitute as you like) because we like the properties of bamboo as amaterial, and the aesthetics too. (Okay; maybe it is worth noting that wehave little or no problem using an innovative reel on a classically maderod). On the technical process side, I'm sure, questions ought to beraised, and they will be: milling versus hand planing, Bob Milward'sheterodox analyses, etc. But there's a limit to our questions, isn't there?That is, we're committed to the material, and to much else. Among themanyreasons not to cast plastic is that one of the values in the livelytradition of cane rodmaking lies not only what you can do with bamboo butalso, I'd say, in what making does for the maker: what bamboo does to you.But I ain't arguing with Bob, either. --Tom CleanCleanDocumentEmail MicrosoftInternetExplorer4 table.MsoNormalTable {mso-style-name:"Table Normal"; mso-tstyle- rowband-size:0; mso-tstyle-colband-size:0; mso-style-noshow:yes; mso- style-parent:""; mso-padding-alt:0in 5.4pt 0in 5.4pt; mso-para- margin:0in; mso-para-margin-bottom:.0001pt; mso-pagination:widow- orphan; font-size:10.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman";} A=faircritique, this monkey business, on all counts; we humans often don't =liketo change, and aren't half-aware of why we do things the way we =do.=A0 Every new idea is worthy of =consideration, andso is every old one, so every accepted practice in making split cane =rods maybe examined.=A0 The membersof =this listseem as innovative as you are traditional-but few will support change =forthe sake of change, all the same.=A0 =Thereare values-aesthetic, cultural-worth defending on other thanpractical grounds.=A0 A. K. =Best doesn'ttie flies with natural materials for practical reasons or, at least, =not only syntheticmaterials that are both cheaper and more widely available than the =traditionalmaterials. But to go that route would mean missing the fun of =collecting roadkill.=A0 = After all-toslide right down the slippery slope of questioning methods and =traditions-weknow that most folks who fish don't fly fish, and of those who do, mostof them use graphite rods.=A0 =There'slittle practical value in making and fishing rods from the lovely =reed.=A0 I preach to the choir of course =in sayingthat we hold with split cane and Pearsalls' =andPerfects (substitute as you like) because we like the properties of =bamboo as amaterial, and the aesthetics too.=A0 =(Okay;maybe it is worth noting that we have =little orno problem using an innovative reel on a classically made rod).=A0 On the technical process side, =I'm sure,questions ought to be raised, and they will be: milling versus hand =planing, Bob Milward's heterodoxanalyses, etc.=A0 But there's a=limitto our questions, isn't there?=A0 =Thatis, we're committed to the material, and to much else.=A0 Among the many reasons not to =cast plastic isthat one of the values in the lively tradition of cane rodmakinglies not only what you can do with bamboo but also, I'd say, in whatmaking does for the maker: what bamboo does to you.=A0 But I ain'targuing with Bob, either.=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0 --Tom = from briansr@point-net.com Fri Mar 1 16:07:41 2002 g21M7e816656 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 16:07:40 -0600 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 17:42:59 -0500 Subject: St David's day Happy St. David's day ,everyoneCheersBrian from rcurry@ttlc.net Fri Mar 1 16:42:05 2002 g21Mg4818548 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 16:42:04 -0600 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:0.9.4)Gecko/20011019 Netscape6/6.2 Subject: Source for waxes and Cascamite I noticed Rydenor -- http://www.rydenor.co.uk/ -- as a source for some interesting waxes and Cascamite (not Vegemite), a urea formaldehyde glue in powder form. Since the powder has a longer shelf life, this might be a cheap alternative to other UFs.-- Best regards, Reed http://www.overmywaders.com/ >Frompaul.blakley@ntlworld.com Fri Mar 1 17:07:42 2002 Received: from mta03- g21N7f819751 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 mta03-svc.ntlworld.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127- paul.blakley@ntlworld.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en]C-CCK-MCD (Win98; I) X- Subject: Re: Source for waxes andCascamite References: Content-Type: rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu X-Listprocessor- Version:8.2.09/990901/11:28 -- ListProc(tm) by CREN Cascamite is readillyavailable in any DIY / Ironmongers here in the UK. It has a very long shelf life(providing it is stored away from moisture ) , it's very cheap and is availablein sufficiently small quantities to be opened , used and thrown away !Likewise it's available in bulk and can be stored for long periods . It was thefavoured adhesive for UK rodbuilders in the 50's and 60's but is still usedtoday by some ..........Paul Reed Curry wrote: I noticed Rydenor -- http://www.rydenor.co.uk/ -- as a source for someinteresting waxes and Cascamite (not Vegemite), a urea formaldehyde gluein powder form. Since the powder has a longer shelf life, this might bea cheap alternative to other UFs.--Best regards,Reedhttp://www.overmywaders.com/ from pohl@earthlink.net Fri Mar 1 17:11:58 2002 g21NBv820104 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 17:11:57 -0600 helo=kathypohl) id 16gwBw-00070D-00 for rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu; Fri, 01 Mar 2002 15:11:56 -0800 Subject: making a lathe I've been lathe surfing on the net, trying to find one for rod building.Whati've been finding is either one with a small spindle bore (3/8") or one withthe center to center distance that's too short (12" is too short in myopinion). However, there is the ideal lathe from sherline (model 4400) thatfits the bill but is out of budget (~ $700, WOW!). I'm just looking forsomething to turn my ferrule stations and the cork..... I've thought ofbuilding my own, any ideas? One of mine has been to take a zyliss lathe(comes with bed and tailstock, drill is mounted for motor) and adding ahead. Or start from scratch with a couple of pillow bearings and a shaft.But where would i get the parts like the spindle (with a bore), chuck, bedand tailstock. Any help would be great! Thanks, Mark from bob@downandacross.com Fri Mar 1 17:22:31 2002 g21NMU820952 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 17:22:30 -0600 ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 18:22:19 -0500 Subject: Wiring help Hi Guys:Please help the wiring challenged. There is a diagram from a motor I havehere:http://www.downandacross.com/wiring.gif The motor is wired to 220, but I want to run at 110. Where in the diagramwould I attach the black, white, and green wires for the power cord. Blackis hot and white neutral, green is ground? What goes to AB in the 110 wiringscheme, what goes to CD? ALso, what is the best way to run a ground? Towhat? I greatly appreciate you even looking. I did order a Baldor motor to replacethis one, but why not try to run it? I know 220 is preferred, but I wouldhave to have someone come out and rewire the shop/run a 220 receptacleandadd a breaker to accomodate it. I would like to try 110 first. Thanks, Best regards, Bob M. from tausfeld@frontiernet.net Fri Mar 1 17:23:43 2002 g21NNg821122 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 17:23:42 -0600 Subject: Re: Tradition in Rodmaking The last time I used nylon thread some big guy came in my shop and sprayedme with cold water!!!never again....tom----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Tradition in Rodmaking Someone said, I think that it was on this list, that the old timers used the best of what was available to them. I use titanium guides, because I think they are better than other types(just my opinion, not pushing it on anyone!!!!!!!! I don't want to start anargument over guide choice). Some traditions are nice, though, like silk thread- it looks nice and theguides will stay on for years. I think the original point is correct, we shouldn't hang on to traditionsjust because they are traditions. John K----- Original Message -----From: "Todd Talsma" Cc: ; "Rodmakers" Sent: Friday, March 01, 2002 2:25 PMSubject: Re: Tradition in Rodmaking As with business (I'm sure noone has ever heard this before), just askthe question, "Why do we do it that way?" The response, "Because that'sthe way we've always done it." About drives me nuts when I hear this. Kudos to all of those out there that question tradition and come up withnew ways of building rods. Jason Swan wrote: Reminds me of the urban legend about the new bride who cut the endoffher ham roasts before cooking the thing. Having never seen hamprepared this way, the new husband asked why she did that. She saidbecause that is how one cooks a ham, silly. Well, the husband askedthe mother and got the same response. When he asked the girlsgrandmother, though, he found out that she only had short pans andusually needed to do that so that the ham would fit. So, the real rodmakers' question I want to ask is this, what are thesacrosanct traditions? I know rodmakers who use polyurethanefinishes. I have seen many aluminum reel seats. Are the traditionscosmetic, generally? Or are there some procedural traditions thatmaybe superfluous? Jason On 3/1/02 11:59 AM, "Bob Nunley" wrote: This morning I got an email that made me think a little bitabout our craft. We do things because it is "tradition" andmany times never bother to investigate WHY. We do thingslike use only silk thread, only Nickel Silver reel seats,only use particular types of finishes, only use certainstyle guides, etc., etc., etc., mostly because it's"tradition" to use these things. This little story has apretty good point to it. I thought it pretty much appliedto all of us rodmonkeys... er, uh.. RodMakers. Enjoy it! Later,Bob Tradition Start with a cage containing five monkeys. Inside thecage, hang abanana on a string and place a set of stairs under it.Before long, amonkey will go to the stairs and start to climb towards thebanana. Assoon as he touches the stairs, spray all of the othermonkeys with coldwater.After a while, another monkey makes an attempt with thesame result- all the other monkeys are sprayed with cold water. Prettysoon, whenanother monkey tries to climb the stairs, the other monkeyswill try toprevent it.Now, put away the cold water. Remove one monkey from thecage andreplace it with a new one. The new monkey sees the bananaand wants toclimb the stairs. To his surprise and horror, all of theother monkeysattack him. After another attempt and attack, he knows thatif he triesto climb the stairs, he will be assaulted.Next, remove another of the original five monkeys andreplace itwith a new one. The newcomer goes to the stairs and isattacked. Theprevious newcomer takes part in the punishment withenthusiasm!Likewise, replace a third original monkey with a new one,then a fourth, then thefifth.Every time the newest monkey takes to the stairs, he isattacked.Most of the monkeys that are beating him have no idea whythey were notpermitted to climb the stairs or why they are participatingin thebeating of the newest monkey.After replacing all the original monkeys, none of theremainingmonkeys have ever been sprayed with cold water.Nevertheless, no monkeyever again approaches the stairs to try for the banana. Whynot? Becauseas far as they know that's just the way it's always beendone. And that, my friends, is how TRADITIONbegins. --Todd Talsma8412 North Maple CourtZeeland MI 49464------ web design business page: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo Tips site: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo/Bamboo Sources site: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo_Sources/home page: http://external.sligh.com/~toddt/genealogy pages: Under construction from bob@downandacross.com Fri Mar 1 17:27:31 2002 g21NRU821539 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 17:27:30 -0600 1 Mar 2002 18:27:23 -0500 Subject: RE: St David's day Hi Brian:Same to you. I never knew who St. David was until you posted that. I foundsome info here. http://www.sucs.org/~rhys/stdavid.htmlMyself, I am a good Itralian St. Joe's celebrating boy.Best regards,Robert Rocky Maulucci (yep, that's really my name, but I win a lot of $because no one can ever guess what the middle R is for) -----Original Message----- Subject: St David's day Happy St. David's day ,everyoneCheersBrian from Troy.Miller@BakerOilTools.com Fri Mar 1 17:40:36 2002 g21NeZ822322 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 17:40:35 -0600 (bhihdcimc01.bakerhughes.com [204.253.245.34] (may be forged)) for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 17:40:30 -0600 (5.5.2653.19) id ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 17:25:42 -0600 Subject: Casting Clinics Y'all, I just wanted to tell you about my last couple of casting clinics. And you wouldn't believe the results. I am now of the opinion that maybegraphite is not the easiest thing to learn to cast with. I know, you'resaying "Duh, get with it Miller!" Call me a little slow.... It started when one of the students that has taken one of my classesbefore,wanted his daughter to learn to flyfish. He's been bringing her every week,and he is into cane himself, so we talk about bamboo rods all the time. Itold him that I had bought a new R.L. Nunley with a neato bamboo ferrule,and why I thought it was so smooth casting. Of course, that was likeshoving a beer in front of an alcoholic's face. Soon, everyone in the classwanted to cast it. And there was not a student that didn't reallyappreciate casting that rod. May have sold you a couple rods, there,Bob..... They all commented that they could feel everything that was goingon, and that it seemed easier to cast than their own rod, somehow. I think there is a whole undiscovered market out there, but I don't knowthat they are being reached. Of course, it is difficult with the barrage ofmarketing hype on plastic rods. But I think that this thing Ralph isputting together in Livingston, which I am so proud to help with, could be akey to getting people informed about the many benefits of cane. Until youactually feel and see a modern bamboo rod, you can't possibly come to gripswith how awesome they are (no pun intended). Preaching to the choir, Iknow.... Maybe we can do some preaching to the congregation now! : ) Those of you who are teaching casting classes, are you doing it with grassor carbon? TAM from bob@downandacross.com Fri Mar 1 18:46:27 2002 g220kQ823990 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 18:46:26 -0600 "rodmakers@wugate.wustl.e" Subject: RE: Wiring help, Thanks for the help Guys. Got the motor working. Thanks for all the replies and the help.Tomorrow, off to the mill! Hurrah.Bob -----Original Message----- Subject: Wiring help Hi Guys:Please help the wiring challenged. There is a diagram from a motor I havehere:http://www.downandacross.com/wiring.gif The motor is wired to 220, but I want to run at 110. Where in the diagramwould I attach the black, white, and green wires for the power cord. Blackis hot and white neutral, green is ground? What goes to AB in the 110 wiringscheme, what goes to CD? ALso, what is the best way to run a ground? Towhat? I greatly appreciate you even looking. I did order a Baldor motor to replacethis one, but why not try to run it? I know 220 is preferred, but I wouldhave to have someone come out and rewire the shop/run a 220 receptacleandadd a breaker to accomodate it. I would like to try 110 first. Thanks, Best regards, Bob M. from bob@downandacross.com Fri Mar 1 18:51:57 2002 g220pu824228 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 18:51:56 -0600 Subject: RE: Casting Clinics Troy:I agree with what you find. My casting improved a lot when I tried a mediumactioned cane. I think the next time I manage to get my wife out fishing, Iwill hand her a cane rod instead of a T&T graphite.Best regards, Bob -----Original Message----- Subject: Casting Clinics Y'all, I just wanted to tell you about my last couple of casting clinics. And you wouldn't believe the results. I am now of the opinion that maybegraphite is not the easiest thing to learn to cast with. I know, you'resaying "Duh, get with it Miller!" Call me a little slow.... from Notsooyoun@aol.com Fri Mar 1 19:22:08 2002 g221M7824943 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 19:22:08 -0600 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 20:21:59 -0500 Subject: Polishing I'm still having trouble polishing a rod section that I dipped when the varnish was too cold. I tried using micromesh in 3600 and 6000 grit, and it just removes the varnish, and dulls the finish that remains. So I sprayed the area I was trying to polish and it left a fisheye appearance. I'm using a spar polyurethane. Any advice would be greatly appreciated. A not of minor interest or perhaps not, but it is only 57 days until trout season opens in Michigan.Thanks as alwaysGary "notso" from jsschaeffer@hotmail.com Fri Mar 1 19:27:46 2002 g221Rj825212 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 19:27:45 -0600 Fri, 1 Mar 2002 17:27:36 -0800 Subject: Re: making a lathe FILETIME=[6F5BC4D0:01C1C189] I made a lathe out of an old black and decker valve grinding machine I foundat a garage sale. Tore it down, cleaned and lubed everything, then mountedit to a board. Got a live center from woodcraft. It is still working. Now,valve grinding machines are not common items at garage sales, but if youlook long enough you can find anything. I would check out storage unitrepossession sales. It is truly amazing what people abandon. Avoid pawnshops. Everything is overpriced, and the tools have usually seen betterdays. Of course, this comment will hopefully draw at least five "Oh yeah?Guess what I found?" stories. I hope it is at least five. Jeff Schaeffer from Troutgetter@aol.com Fri Mar 1 20:49:54 2002 g222ns826337 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 20:49:54 -0600 Subject: Re: Wiring help, Thanks for the help Ahh come on! What was the right answer!Mike Mike's Bamboo Rod ShopMontclair, CAhttp://www.mshaybamboo.gq.nu/ from FISHWOOL@aol.com Fri Mar 1 21:03:14 2002 g2233D826671 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 21:03:13 -0600 Subject: Re: Tradition in Rodmaking Bob et al.,Are you trying to tell us that we're all monkeys in a cage? I like my cage.Traditionally,Hank. from FISHWOOL@aol.com Fri Mar 1 21:03:21 2002 g2233K826694 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 21:03:20 -0600 Subject: RE: Casting Clinics rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu To all.Using a moderate action cane rod in a beginners' casting clinic makes all the difference over a graphite (you'll excuse the word). The student "feels" the rod action more readily. My wife doesn't like to see me use my cane rods Regards,Hank. from atlasc1@earthlink.net Fri Mar 1 21:03:47 2002 g2233k826878 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 21:03:46 -0600 ([209.179.149.29] helo=computer) id 16gzoE-0001Oc-00; Fri, 01 Mar 2002 19:03:43 -0800 Subject: Re: Tradition in Rodmaking A smart monkey can make can rod and so can a dumb ass! LOL The only person who controls how I make rods is the same person who paysformy tools and time...and that just happens to be me. Adam Vigil----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Tradition in Rodmaking Monkeys can make cane rods? --- Bob Nunley wrote: This morning I got an email that made me think alittle bit about our craft. We do things because itis "tradition" and many times never bother toinvestigate WHY. We do things like use only silkthread, only Nickel Silver reel seats, only useparticular types of finishes, only use certain styleguides, etc., etc., etc., mostly because it's"tradition" to use these things. This little storyhas a pretty good point to it. I thought it prettymuch applied to all of us rodmonkeys... er, uh..RodMakers. Enjoy it! Later,Bob Tradition Start with a cage containing five monkeys.Inside the cage, hang abanana on a string and place a set of stairs underit. Before long, amonkey will go to the stairs and start to climbtowards the banana. Assoon as he touches the stairs, spray all of theother monkeys with coldwater.After a while, another monkey makes an attemptwith the same result- all the other monkeys are sprayed with cold water.Pretty soon, whenanother monkey tries to climb the stairs, the othermonkeys will try toprevent it.Now, put away the cold water. Remove one monkey from the cage andreplace it with a new one. The new monkey sees thebanana and wants toclimb the stairs. To his surprise and horror, all ofthe other monkeysattack him. After another attempt and attack, heknows that if he triesto climb the stairs, he will be assaulted.Next, remove another of the original fivemonkeys and replace itwith a new one. The newcomer goes to the stairs andis attacked. Theprevious newcomer takes part in the punishment withenthusiasm!Likewise, replace a third original monkey with a newone, then a fourth, then thefifth.Every time the newest monkey takes to thestairs, he is attacked.Most of the monkeys that are beating him have no permitted to climb the stairs or why they areparticipating in thebeating of the newest monkey.After replacing all the original monkeys, noneof the remainingmonkeys have ever been sprayed with cold water.Nevertheless, no monkeyever again approaches the stairs to try for thebanana. Why not? Becauseas far as they know that's just the way it's alwaysbeen done. And that, my friends, is howTRADITION begins. __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Greetings - Send FREE e-cards for every occasion!http://greetings.yahoo.com from Troutgetter@aol.com Fri Mar 1 21:05:32 2002 g2235V827170 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 21:05:31 -0600 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 22:05:17 -0500 Subject: Fwd: making a lathe Mike's Bamboo Rod ShopMontclair, CAhttp://www.mshaybamboo.gq.nu/ Full-name: Troutgetter Subject: Re: making a lathe Since this seems to come up from time to time, check out this link below. http://www.littlemachineshop.com/LMS/products/product_view.php?ProductID=1525 I use a 7x10 mini lathe and have for years. I also mostly use mine for turning ferrule stations and grips, which I consider really basic. I'm saving my pennies for the bed extension, but because the 10" bed is still doing everything I need, I haven't put a priority on it. There are a lot of guys on this list who use the little Chinese lathes and are happy with them. $350.00 or less for the machine and $140.00 for the extension still keeps you under $700.00. There are better lathes available and I'm sure it would be fun to make your own, but ... Mike Shay Mike's Bamboo Rod ShopMontclair, CAhttp://www.mshaybamboo.gq.nu/ from kurt.clement@flashmail.com Fri Mar 1 21:39:37 2002 g223da827873 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 21:39:36 -0600 Subject: Re: making a lathe Mark, I built my lathe years ago. It is a wood lathe, but I'm thinking of gettinga three jaw chuck to turn ferrule stations. Hand fitting them so far hasgone well though. My lathe has hard maple 2x6 for the rails, a 1 1/2" headstick shaft #2morsetaper bored out to 3/8. I had a machinist turn the spindle and the morsetaper, mounted the shaft on 1 1/2" flange bearings, bolted the whole thingdown to a 300# base and it is solid. 48" between centers which I needed forbuilding a rocking chair for my wife and our first child. Since then I'veturned everything from table tops (outboard) to reel seats and ferruleplugs. When we were moving every 3 or 4 years it was very amusing to watch themoving crew tackle it, then offer to take it apart for them. There is a plan somewhere on the rodbuilding web for making a turningapparatus from copper pipe fittings and pillow blocks. I think it was just Good luck KurtNixa, MO -----Original Message----- Subject: making a lathe I've been lathe surfing on the net, trying to find one for rod building.What i've been finding is either one with a small spindle bore (3/8") or one with the center to center distance that's too short (12" is too short in myopinion). However, there is the ideal lathe from sherline (model 4400) thatfits the bill but is out of budget (~ $700, WOW!). I'm just looking forsomething to turn my ferrule stations and the cork..... I've thought ofbuilding my own, any ideas? One of mine has been to take a zyliss lathe(comes with bed and tailstock, drill is mounted for motor) and adding ahead. Or start from scratch with a couple of pillow bearings and a shaft.But where would i get the parts like the spindle (with a bore), chuck, bedand tailstock. Any help would be great! Thanks, Mark from ttalsma@macatawa.org Fri Mar 1 21:54:53 2002 g223sp828401 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 21:54:51 -0600 Subject: Re: St David's day Got you beat Bob, Todd H. Talsma. That's it. Nope, just the initial.My parents didn't want to stick me with Harvey for a middle name, sothey just gave me an "H." Bob Maulucci wrote: Hi Brian:Same to you. I never knew who St. David was until you posted that. Ifoundsome info here. http://www.sucs.org/~rhys/stdavid.htmlMyself, I am a good Itralian St. Joe's celebrating boy.Best regards,Robert Rocky Maulucci (yep, that's really my name, but I win a lot of$because no one can ever guess what the middle R is for) -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Friday, March 01, 2002 5:03 PM Subject: St David's day Happy St. David's day ,everyoneCheersBrian --Todd Talsma8412 North Maple CourtZeeland MI 49464------ web design business home: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo Rodmaking Tips site: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo/Bamboo Rodmaking Sources site:http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo_Sources/home page: http://external.sligh.com/~toddt/index.htmgenealogy home page: Under Construction from Troutgetter@aol.com Fri Mar 1 22:03:13 2002 g2243C828781 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 22:03:12 -0600 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 23:03:00 -0500 Subject: review Mike's Bamboo Rod ShopMontclair, CAhttp://www.mshaybamboo.gq.nu/ from avyoung@iinet.net.au Fri Mar 1 22:08:41 2002 g2248e829038 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 22:08:40 -0600 Subject: Re: Tradition in Rodmaking No question about it, that is exactly what it's all about. Tony At 12:59 PM 3/1/02 -0600, Bob Nunley wrote: This morning I got an email that made me think a little bit about our craft. We do things because it is "tradition" and many times never bother to investigate WHY. We do things like use only silk thread, only Nickel Silver reel seats, only use particular types of finishes, only use certain style guides, etc., etc., etc., mostly because it's "tradition" to use these things. This little story has a pretty good point to it. I thought it pretty much applied to all of us rodmonkeys... er, uh.. RodMakers. Enjoy it! Later,Bob Tradition Start with a cage containing five monkeys. Inside the cage, hang abanana on a string and place a set of stairs under it. Before long, amonkey will go to the stairs and start to climb towards the banana. Assoon as he touches the stairs, spray all of the other monkeys with coldwater.After a while, another monkey makes an attempt with the same result- all the other monkeys are sprayed with cold water. Pretty soon, whenanother monkey tries to climb the stairs, the other monkeys will try toprevent it.Now, put away the cold water. Remove one monkey from the cage andreplace it with a new one. The new monkey sees the banana and wants toclimb the stairs. To his surprise and horror, all of the other monkeysattack him. After another attempt and attack, he knows that if he triesto climb the stairs, he will be assaulted.Next, remove another of the original five monkeys and replace itwith a new one. The newcomer goes to the stairs and is attacked. Theprevious newcomer takes part in the punishment with enthusiasm!Likewise, replace a third original monkey with a new one, then a fourth, then thefifth.Every time the newest monkey takes to the stairs, he is attacked.Most of the monkeys that are beating him have no idea why they were notpermitted to climb the stairs or why they are participating in thebeating of the newest monkey.After replacing all the original monkeys, none of the remainingmonkeys have ever been sprayed with cold water. Nevertheless, no monkeyever again approaches the stairs to try for the banana. Why not? Becauseas far as they know that's just the way it's always been done. And that, my friends, is how TRADITION begins. /*************************************************************************/AV YoungVisit my web site at:"http://www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html" Yea, though I walk in the river of very shallow depth I fear no failure, My rod and my reel they comfort me. /*************************************************************************/ from bob@downandacross.com Fri Mar 1 22:09:53 2002 g2249q829182 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 22:09:52 -0600 1 Mar 2002 23:09:46 -0500 Subject: RE: Wiring help, Thanks for the help Mike:Green is ground, use bolt in the "peckerhead" (the wiring box on the motor)to ground it. Then black to AB and White to CD. Motor ran great.Bob -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Wiring help, Thanks for the help Ahh come on! What was the right answer!Mike Mike's Bamboo Rod ShopMontclair, CAhttp://www.mshaybamboo.gq.nu/ from dr.matro@airmail.net Fri Mar 1 22:18:15 2002 g224IF829613 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 22:18:15 -0600 id 16h0xb-000CqH-00; Fri, 01 Mar 2002 22:17:27 -0600 ring.iadfw.net sender: Organization: KC Graphics Subject: Re: Casting Clinics All, I always keep the cane close at hand when teaching, normally in my hand.If the student just isn't feeling it, I cane 'em. Ken from avyoung@iinet.net.au Fri Mar 1 23:11:14 2002 g225BC801127 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 23:11:12 -0600 Subject: RE: Tradition in Rodmaking I think the problem here is that there is a certain amount of confusion in the market as to just what a bamboo rod is all about.I like to use them for trout because I like the action better than plastic and as we all know presentation is everything in trout fishingbut when I was salt fly fishing a bit all I used was graphite because it's better for that kind of use where all that matters is blasting the lure out and wrestling with the fish. Ultimatelty I stopped salt fly fishing too because catching tuna or wahoo on a 12 wt and non reversing reel is not really fly fishing IMHO so I went back to game gear.Living in Perth there is a lot of salt water flyfishing done and I've been asked to make rods to 12 wt. When ever I asked why a bamboo rod in 12 wt ship. I have nothing against these emotions but it says a lot about why people want a bamboo rod.I never made any of these rods because I think they'd have been disappointed in the rod compared with boron and graphite for the purpose. When it comes to the rods I've made for people living here in Australia where Hardy were the big name there seems to be a real desire for many people to have long rods and intermediates and ring guides rather thansnakes.I draw the line at this point and insist on snakes but it can be very hard to get around the intermediates.I know I could have sold more than twice the number of rods I have locally if I just went along with what they wanted but the whole thing seems so stupid to me I generally don't do it in the end if I detect a problem to save the inevitable hassle and I think this is mainly because these guys are after everything except casting qualities which means we have a serious case of monkey tag going on.Again, here in Australia the few dealers are dealing in old rods mainly and also assembled Partridge blanks with buggy whip actions and are selling on tradition. I know many makers have no problems with dealers and in fact prefer to use them but they are the ones setting the standard and pushing the plough we all must sow in if we want to sell a few rods. Tony At 04:05 PM 3/1/02 -0500, Goodmann, Tom wrote: A fair critique, this monkey business, on all counts; we humans often don't like to change, and aren't half-aware of why we do things the way we do. Every new idea is worthy of consideration, and so is every old one, so every accepted practice in making split cane rods may be examined. The members of this list seem as innovative as you are traditional-but few will support change for the sake of change, all the same. There are values-aesthetic, cultural-worth defending on other than practical grounds. A. K. Best doesn't tie flies with natural materials for practical reasons or, at least, not only for practical reasons; numerous innovations have emerged from using synthetic materials that are both cheaper and more widely available than the traditional materials. But to go that route would mean missing the fun of collecting road kill. After all-to slide right down the slippery slope of questioning methods and traditions-we know that most folks who fish don't fly fish, and of those who do, most of them use graphite rods. There's little practical value in making and fishing rods from the lovely reed. I preach to the choir of course in saying that we hold with split cane and Pearsalls' and Perfects (substitute as you like) because we like the properties of bamboo as a material, and the aesthetics too. (Okay; maybe it is worth noting that we have little or no problem using an innovative reel on a classically made rod). On the technical process side, I'm sure, questions ought to be raised, and they will be: milling versus hand planing, Bob Milward's heterodox analyses, etc. But there's a limit to our questions, isn't there? That is, we're committed to the material, and to much else. Among the many reasons not to cast plastic is that one of the values in the lively tradition of cane rodmaking lies not only what you can do with bamboo but also, I'd say, in what making does for the maker: what bamboo does to you. But I ain't arguing with Bob, either. --Tom /*************************************************************************/AV YoungVisit my web site at:"http://www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html" Yea, though I walk in the river of very shallow depth I fear no failure, My rod and my reel they comfort me. /*************************************************************************/ from avyoung@iinet.net.au Fri Mar 1 23:11:15 2002 g225BD801149 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 23:11:13 -0600 "Rodmakers" Subject: Re: Tradition in Rodmaking I blame dealers for the most part not wanting to offer anything different to punters and where the makers are not using dealers they have to offer what the punter thinks he wants because that's what a bamboo rod should be of course. Tony At 12:15 PM 3/1/02 -0700, Jason Swan wrote: Reminds me of the urban legend about the new bride who cut the end offher ham roasts before cooking the thing. Having never seen ham prepared this way, the new husband asked why she did that. She said because that is how one cooks a ham, silly. Well, the husband asked the mother and got the same response. When he asked the girls grandmother, though, he foundout that she only had short pans and usually needed to do that so that the ham would fit. So, the real rodmakers question I want to ask is this, what are the sacrosanct traditions? I know rodmakers who use polyurethane finishes. I have seen many aluminum reel seats. Are the traditions cosmetic, generally? Or are there some procedural traditions that may besuperfluous? Jason On 3/1/02 11:59 AM, "Bob Nunley" wrote:This morning I got an email that made me think a little bit about our craft. We do things because it is "tradition" and many times never bother to investigate WHY. We do things like use only silk thread, only Nickel Silver reel seats, only use particular types of finishes, only use certain style guides, etc., etc., etc., mostly because it's "tradition" to use these things. This little story has a pretty good point to it. I thought it pretty much applied to all of us rodmonkeys... er, uh.. RodMakers. Enjoy it!Later,BobTraditionStart with a cage containing five monkeys. Inside the cage, hang abanana on a string and place a set of stairs under it. Before long, amonkey will go to the stairs and start to climb towards the banana. Assoon as he touches the stairs, spray all of the other monkeys with coldwater.After a while, another monkey makes an attempt with the same result- all the other monkeys are sprayed with cold water. Pretty soon, whenanother monkey tries to climb the stairs, the other monkeys will try toprevent it.Now, put away the cold water. Remove one monkey from the cage andreplace it with a new one. The new monkey sees the banana and wants toclimb the stairs. To his surprise and horror, all of the other monkeysattack him. After another attempt and attack, he knows that if he triesto climb the stairs, he will be assaulted.Next, remove another of the original five monkeys and replace itwith a new one. The newcomer goes to the stairs and is attacked. Theprevious newcomer takes part in the punishment with enthusiasm!Likewise, replace a third original monkey with a new one, then a fourth, then thefifth.Every time the newest monkey takes to the stairs, he is attacked.Most of the monkeys that are beating him have no idea why they were notpermitted to climb the stairs or why they are participating in thebeating of the newest monkey.After replacing all the original monkeys, none of the remainingmonkeys have ever been sprayed with cold water. Nevertheless, no monkeyever again approaches the stairs to try for the banana. Why not? Becauseas far as they know that's just the way it's always been done. And that, my friends, is how TRADITION begins. /*************************************************************************/AV YoungVisit my web site at:"http://www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html" Yea, though I walk in the river of very shallow depth I fear no failure, My rod and my reel they comfort me. /*************************************************************************/ from avyoung@iinet.net.au Fri Mar 1 23:11:17 2002 g225BF801157 for ; Fri, 1 Mar 2002 23:11:16 -0600 Subject: Re: Source for waxes and Cascamite I use Cascamite powder for almost all gluing purposes around the house and a lot of uses on my boat too. My Ash oars are glued with it and are going strong and my boat tender is a glued lap construction dingy glued together only with Cascomite and no nails or screws at all. I've towed this at least 1,000 miles and it lives under a tree on the bank of the river opposite my boat and has survived all weather and kids (so far, the local kids will be it's end I'm sure. I'm surprised it hasn't been used as a bar b que).It's good stuff. I have to try a rod with it some time during the Winter. The only problem with it is it's hard to increase the pot life on warmer day though sitting the pot in another with ice cubes would work. Make sure to lid is very tightly shut or it'll harden in the container. I've had this happen and just broken the lumps that formed up and used it in the normal way but it must have reduced qualities if this happens.Cascomite is mixed with only water and used right away. It used to be called cold water glue.I once spoke to the boat builder who built my boat in 1958. He told me the scarfs of the planks on my boat were glued with Cascomite and riveted. None of the leading edges of the scarfs are showing signs of failure so it can't be too bad. The glue I've been using and like a lot is a liquid UF with a liquid hardener. This is very good too and as there is a hardener it's easy to extent the pot life by adjusting the amount of hardener used.You are right though, the Cascomite does have a longer shelf life, I went to use some UF a week back and it's hardened in the bottle. Tony At 05:46 PM 3/1/02 -0500, Reed Curry wrote: I noticed Rydenor -- http://www.rydenor.co.uk/ -- as a source for some interesting waxes and Cascamite (not Vegemite), a urea formaldehyde glue in powder form. Since the powder has a longer shelf life, this might be a cheap alternative to other UFs.--Best regards,Reedhttp://www.overmywaders.com/ /*************************************************************************/AV YoungVisit my web site at:"http://www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html" Yea, though I walk in the river of very shallow depth I fear no failure, My rod and my reel they comfort me. /*************************************************************************/ from aport@si.rr.com Sat Mar 2 06:31:06 2002 g22CV5809259 for ; Sat, 2 Mar 2002 06:31:05 -0600 Sat, 2 Mar 2002 07:30:55 -0500 Subject: Re: making a lathe Hi Mark,I don't know if you're as loony as some of us on this list, but thebooks this guy writes are aimed at nuts like us! I haven't atempted any ofhis projects, but a friend who was knowledgeable in metalworking fullyintended to build his foundry and some others of the tools that come from itbefore he died unexpectedly and way too young. Even if you're not going touse his plans, I'll bet they give you some great ideas to fold into your ownwork. http://www.lindsaybks.com/dgjp/djgbk/series/index.html Lindsay Books, the name at the bottom of the page, has a bunch of greattitles and probably could cobble together something on cane if they knew howmany of us out here would buy the damn thing!! Don't be put off by theirlead title, which is something like "How To Perform Your Own Pre- frontalLobotomy", they have some great stuff. Lots of it is reprints of manuals from the 1900s to '20s before everything came in a crate with instructionson how to throw it away included *G*. Just the sort of stuff we'dappreciate.As usual, ain't got NO interest in the company, etc, etc,...Art Ps: Just be careful you don't get into another, equally time-consuming hobbyalong the way! from petermckean@netspace.net.au Sat Mar 2 06:48:35 2002 g22CmX809603 for ; Sat, 2 Mar 2002 06:48:33 -0600 g22CmQT35702; Subject: Re: tapers Kyle Not an expert on the subject (not that that has ever been known to deteranybody from giving plenty of opinions), but I agree with your choice of theDickerson, and would add the Payne 101 as an alternative; the Payne is myall-time favourite, and it is a pattern that, while pretty fast to beginwith does lend itself to tweaking here and there to speed it even more. Ihave made the Dickerson as well, and am going to build another. The 8015 isalso pretty quick, but a bit big for my taste. In the medium class, I would put forward the name of the Sir D. It is adelight to cast, and is certainly a good medium rod. I was amazed recentlywhen I sent a Sir D to a bloke in Melbourne who was keen to try a bamboorod with a view to buying one - I sent him the Sir D with some misgiving asthis bloke is a graphite man, and when he tells you what graphites he likesit sounds like a litany of stiff! I sent it to him for the simple reasonthat it was the only rod I had at the time that I wasn't seeing an immediateneed for, and warned him that he might find it a little relaxed for hisstyle; imagine my surprise when he got back in touch to say that he felt itwas quite a quick rod, much quicker than he had been expecting, and that hejust loved it. I may have a little trouble getting it back. Figure that one out if you can. Perhaps the rods he has been fishing are theones dictated by fashion and by the Accepted International Rules for PissingCompetitions, and maybe they are all just too damn fast for his castingstyle; maybe this is the first rod that he has ever fished with thatspecifically suits his natural rhythm. I really cannot explain it. I am areally crappy caster, and certainly not in any position to analyse castinglikes and dislikes. But that Sir D is a very, very different proposition from any rod that this bloke has ever fished with, and he just loves it. Also in the medium category I would put the 6'3" 3-weight of wayneCattanach's. I am really glad that humans have 2 hands, as that means thatwhen finally they have to prise open my cold dead fingers to remove thebamboo rods, there will be room for this rod as well as for the Payne! I wouldn't like to split the 2 PHY's, personally; they are bothprogressive- actioned rods, and I wouldn't call either of them slow. If youwant slow, go try an English rod from the 1950's - back cast, read a book,forward cast, read a book; it's why so many English fishermen from that eraappear so well educated - they had all this time to fill in while they weretrying to cast with their Hardy's. Also the Pezon & Michel Parabolics. I must say they are a bit beyond mycapabilities, so they don't interest me much. Actually, for a lucidexplanation of this phenomenon, read Nunley's Theory of Simian Aversion; Ihave been bucketed so comprehensively by rods of this type that I'mdiscouraged for good. There, I told you that lack of knowledge never gets in the way of opinions,didn't I? Cheers Peter from wendt@kingcrab.nrl.navy.mil Sat Mar 2 07:31:38 2002 g22DVb810200 for ; Sat, 2 Mar 2002 07:31:37 -0600 g22DVXdd018691 for ; Sat, 2 Mar 2002 08:31:34 -0500 Subject: Re: making a lathe Mark, If you're only interested in turning ferrule stations and cork, why not look at a wood lathe? They give you a much bigger swing and bed length, much cheaper than a metal lathe. Mark At 06:06 PM 3/1/02 -0500, you wrote: I've been lathe surfing on the net, trying to find one for rod building.Whati've been finding is either one with a small spindle bore (3/8") or one withthe center to center distance that's too short (12" is too short in myopinion). However, there is the ideal lathe from sherline (model 4400) thatfits the bill but is out of budget (~ $700, WOW!). I'm just looking forsomething to turn my ferrule stations and the cork..... I've thought ofbuilding my own, any ideas? One of mine has been to take a zyliss lathe(comes with bed and tailstock, drill is mounted for motor) and adding ahead. Or start from scratch with a couple of pillow bearings and a shaft.But where would i get the parts like the spindle (with a bore), chuck, bedand tailstock. Any help would be great! Thanks, Mark from rodsupstream@exploremaine.com Sat Mar 2 07:36:01 2002 g22Da0810409 for ; Sat, 2 Mar 2002 07:36:00 -0600 for ; Sat, 2 Mar 2002 08:35:55 -0500 Subject: Test: delete Test: Upstream Always, Tim DoughtyRod Maker name="winmail.dat" filename="winmail.dat" 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 from dpvbkjs@somtel.com Sat Mar 2 08:20:13 2002 g22EKC811945 for ; Sat, 2 Mar 2002 08:20:12 -0600 Subject: Re: Casting Clinics I haven't actually used cane for the casting part of my 15 week middleschool fly fishing activity, but I'll have to this year. Two weeks ago, when the head of the local TU was showing my dozen kids thevarious types of fly rods out there, he'd pull each rod out of the bag andlay it on the library table in front of them... something like : an oldstyle fiberglass, followed by an early Sage, a nice Loomis, then abeautiful Winston, each with a matching reel (single action, then largearbor, etc). BUT, when he pulled out the bamboo rod and laid it with theothers, there was a collective gasp (honest to goodness) and thenuninhibited 7th and 8th grade oooos and ahhhs. Of course, the first student to recover turned to me and asked if they weregoing to get to try that kind of rod, too [:-)] Kat from Dennishigham@cs.com Sat Mar 2 09:09:22 2002 g22F9L812936 for ; Sat, 2 Mar 2002 09:09:21 -0600 for ; Sat, 2 Mar 2002 10:09:10 -0500 Subject: Re: Polishing Gary,I polish w/ micromesh but I start w/ 6000 and wet sand w/ water to 12000then go to Meguires plastic cleaner (#17) and finally Meguires plastic polish (#10)..Perfect-it works well too. Leaves me with a nice soft gloss finish. If I have a drip I start w/ 4000 micromesh. Don't get too agressive with the 3600-6000 grit or you'll polish right down to bamboo! Ask me how I know :-} Dennis from Dennishigham@cs.com Sat Mar 2 09:09:23 2002 g22F9M812940 for ; Sat, 2 Mar 2002 09:09:22 -0600 Subject: Re: Grand Experiment Hank,Grayling starts Thur night the 20th thru Sun morn the 23rd. It's always the third weekend in June/ weekend after Father's day. Un-officially it starts whenever the first participant arrives usually sometime over Father's day weekend. Dennis from jojo@ipa.net Sat Mar 2 09:16:22 2002 g22FGL813922 for ; Sat, 2 Mar 2002 09:16:21 -0600 helo=default) id 16hBFD-0001HJ-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Sat, 02 Mar 2002 10:16:20 -0500 Subject: Re: making a lathe Don't forget Dave Gingery's books, available from Lindsay's. I think the manhas made every tool possible, even resorting to casting his own cast-iron.Lindsay's has more cool books than you could ever read and absorb. M-D Hi Mark,I don't know if you're as loony as some of us on this list, but thebooks this guy writes are aimed at nuts like us! I haven't atempted any ofhis projects, but a friend who was knowledgeable in metalworking fullyintended to build his foundry and some others of the tools that come from it before he died unexpectedly and way too young. Even if you're not going touse his plans, I'll bet they give you some great ideas to fold into your own work. http://www.lindsaybks.com/dgjp/djgbk/series/index.html Lindsay Books, the name at the bottom of the page, has a bunch of great titles and probably could cobble together something on cane if they knew how many of us out here would buy the damn thing!! Don't be put off by theirlead title, which is something like "How To Perform Your Own Pre- frontalLobotomy", they have some great stuff. Lots of it is reprints of manuals from the 1900s to '20s before everything came in a crate withinstructionson how to throw it away included *G*. Just the sort of stuff we'dappreciate.As usual, ain't got NO interest in the company, etc, etc,...Art Ps: Just be careful you don't get into another, equally time-consuming hobby along the way! from rcurry@ttlc.net Sat Mar 2 09:25:16 2002 g22FPF814247 for ; Sat, 2 Mar 2002 09:25:15 -0600 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:0.9.4)Gecko/20011019 Netscape6/6.2 Subject: More on Cascamite I used powdered urea formaldehyde resin in Canada years ago for veneering panels with excellent results. At that time you could buy it in the local hardware store, though I don't recall the brand name. The only source I can find in the U.S. is the illustrious Custom-Pak (see http://www.custompak.com/Adhesives/Powdered%20Plastic%20Resin.htm ).John Zimny, what do you think of this adhesive?-- Best regards, Reed http://www.overmywaders.com/ >Fromavyoung@iinet.net.au Sat Mar 2 09:53:07 2002 Received: from g22Fr1814726 for ; Sat, 2 Mar 2002 2002 15:52:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO tony.iinet.net.au) 0000 Message-Id:X-Sender:avyoung@mail.iinet.net.au X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 , From: Tony Young References: avyoung@iinet.net.au Sender: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu X- Listprocessor-Version: 8.2.09/990901/11:28 -- ListProc(tm) by CREN Ihave a lot of the Gingery books and I can recommend them highly. They getright to the point and there isn't a spare word used. I've read the book onmaking a lathe as well as vertical and horizontal mills and provided you don'tmind putting in the time they look really good. Be warned though the Gingerysare fans of casting rather than fabrication so if you don't want to go downthat road the books on machinery may not be of much vale to you. I do castiron and bronze etc from time to time and while it's not rocket science it's anew skill you'll need to learn as well as tool up for. I think by the time you toolup and actually make the lathe it's probably not worth the savings UNLESSyou want to learn a new black art so you can make use of this knowledgelater. Should you decide to do this get their book on metal casting as well.Personally I think you can never know too many black arts but that's just me.The various Hasluck titles are also good reading. Tony At 07:28 AM 3/2/02 -0500, arthur port wrote: Hi Mark,I don't know if you're as loony as some of us on this list, but thebooks this guy writes are aimed at nuts like us! I haven't atempted any ofhis projects, but a friend who was knowledgeable in metalworking fullyintended to build his foundry and some others of the tools that come fromitbefore he died unexpectedly and way too young. Even if you're not going touse his plans, I'll bet they give you some great ideas to fold into your ownwork. http://www.lindsaybks.com/dgjp/djgbk/series/index.html Lindsay Books, the name at the bottom of the page, has a bunch of greattitles and probably could cobble together something on cane if they knewhowmany of us out here would buy the damn thing!! Don't be put off by theirlead title, which is something like "How To Perform Your Own Pre- frontalLobotomy", they have some great stuff. Lots of it is reprints of manuals from the 1900s to '20s before everything came in a crate with instructions on how to throw it away included *G*. Just the sort of stuff we'dappreciate.As usual, ain't got NO interest in the company, etc, etc,...Art Ps: Just be careful you don't get into another, equally time- consuminghobbyalong the way! /*************************************************************************/AV YoungVisit my web site at:"http://www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html" Yea, though I walk in the river of very shallow depth I fear no failure, My rod and my reel they comfort me. /*************************************************************************/ from jcbyrd@direct-pest.com Sat Mar 2 10:00:29 2002 g22G0S815012 for ; Sat, 2 Mar 2002 10:00:28 -0600 by direct-pest.com [208.27.26.103] for ; Sat, 02 Mar 2002 11:00:26 -0500 Subject: Re: More on Cascamite You can pick up the same type of powdered Urea Formaldehyde at your localHome Depot/Lowe's store here stateside. Its called DAP Weldwood PlasticResin Glue. Comes in two colors. I use the tan because it blends with thenatural color of a blond rod. I have glued up 3 rods with this and have hadgood results. Pot life at 70 degrees is 4 hours, and it cleans up withwater. I must give credit for my discovery of this glue to Jerry Wall of JWFlyrods. He is the one that recommended it to me, and because I live in thefreaking boonies, he had to even send me some. Joe =================================================Lost in the Hills of East Tennessee with a Bamboo Fly Rod in one handand a cigar in the other....."What a Great Life". Visit my bambooflyrod site at http://www.direct-pest.com/rodmaker----- Original Message ----- Subject: More on Cascamite I used powdered urea formaldehyde resin in Canada years ago forveneering panels with excellent results. At that time you could buy itin the local hardware store, though I don't recall the brand name. Theonly source I can find in the U.S. is the illustrious Custom-Pak (seehttp://www.custompak.com/Adhesives/Powdered%20Plastic%20Resin.htm).John Zimny, what do you think of this adhesive?--Best regards,Reedhttp://www.overmywaders.com/ from avyoung@iinet.net.au Sat Mar 2 10:10:28 2002 g22GAQ815358 for ; Sat, 2 Mar 2002 10:10:27 -0600 "rod" Subject: Re: More on Cascamite There is also a UF glue that is just like this but also has a small amount of melamine so it's a three part jobbie in that it's a resin, hardener and melamine.This makes an unbelievably strong bond even when gluing very thick laminates which you shouldn't really do. It's probably not as strong as resorcinol but it's not as fussy as resorcinol when it comes to gap filling and working temperature range. Tony At 10:58 AM 3/2/02 -0500, Bamboo Joe wrote: You can pick up the same type of powdered Urea Formaldehyde at your localHome Depot/Lowe's store here stateside. Its called DAP Weldwood PlasticResin Glue. Comes in two colors. I use the tan because it blends with thenatural color of a blond rod. I have glued up 3 rods with this and have hadgood results. Pot life at 70 degrees is 4 hours, and it cleans up withwater. I must give credit for my discovery of this glue to Jerry Wall of JWFlyrods. He is the one that recommended it to me, and because I live in thefreaking boonies, he had to even send me some. Joe =================================================Lost in the Hills of East Tennessee with a Bamboo Fly Rod in one handand a cigar in the other....."What a Great Life". Visit my bambooflyrod site at http://www.direct-pest.com/rodmaker----- Original Message -----From: "Reed Curry" Sent: Saturday, March 02, 2002 10:29 AMSubject: More on Cascamite I used powdered urea formaldehyde resin in Canada years ago forveneering panels with excellent results. At that time you could buy itin the local hardware store, though I don't recall the brand name. Theonly source I can find in the U.S. is the illustrious Custom-Pak (see http://www.custompak.com/Adhesives/Powdered%20Plastic%20Resin.htm ).John Zimny, what do you think of this adhesive?--Best regards,Reedhttp://www.overmywaders.com/ /*************************************************************************/AV YoungVisit my web site at:"http://www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html" Yea, though I walk in the river of very shallow depth I fear no failure, My rod and my reel they comfort me. /*************************************************************************/ from flytyr@southshore.com Sat Mar 2 10:46:04 2002 g22Gk3816128 for ; Sat, 2 Mar 2002 10:46:03 -0600 g22Gk2E32317 for ; Sat, 2 Mar 2002 10:46:02 -0600 Subject: Re: More on Cascamite I have used in aircraft building and repairs in the days of wood wing spars.Used to buy it in Hardware stores. Never thought about using it for rods. Willgive it a go if I can find it here in the Arkansas boonies.Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com Bamboo Joe wrote: You can pick up the same type of powdered Urea Formaldehyde at yourlocalHome Depot/Lowe's store here stateside. Its called DAP Weldwood PlasticResin Glue. Comes in two colors. I use the tan because it blends with thenatural color of a blond rod. I have glued up 3 rods with this and have hadgood results. Pot life at 70 degrees is 4 hours, and it cleans up withwater. I must give credit for my discovery of this glue to Jerry Wall of JWFlyrods. He is the one that recommended it to me, and because I live in thefreaking boonies, he had to even send me some. Joe =================================================Lost in the Hills of East Tennessee with a Bamboo Fly Rod in one handand a cigar in the other....."What a Great Life". Visit my bambooflyrod site at http://www.direct-pest.com/rodmaker----- Original Message -----From: "Reed Curry" Sent: Saturday, March 02, 2002 10:29 AMSubject: More on Cascamite I used powdered urea formaldehyde resin in Canada years ago forveneering panels with excellent results. At that time you could buy itin the local hardware store, though I don't recall the brand name. Theonly source I can find in the U.S. is the illustrious Custom-Pak (see http://www.custompak.com/Adhesives/Powdered%20Plastic%20Resin.htm ).John Zimny, what do you think of this adhesive?--Best regards,Reedhttp://www.overmywaders.com/ from bamboorules@ns.sympatico.ca Sat Mar 2 10:58:37 2002 g22Gwb816619 for ; Sat, 2 Mar 2002 10:58:37 -0600 Sat, 2 Mar 2002 13:00:12 -0400 Organization: New Scotland Fly Rods Subject: Re: making a lathe Mark,if ferrule stations and cork is all you want to do, check out myfranken lathe on www.eboard.shawnsbamboopage.comit is a very simple, inexpensive tool that you can make in an afternoon and itworks!Chucks for wood lathes are impractical as by the time you buy a woodlathe and 3 jaw chuck, you might as well just buy a metal lathe,Shawn Mark & Kathy Pohl wrote: I've been lathe surfing on the net, trying to find one for rod building.Whati've been finding is either one with a small spindle bore (3/8") or one withthe center to center distance that's too short (12" is too short in myopinion). However, there is the ideal lathe from sherline (model 4400) thatfits the bill but is out of budget (~ $700, WOW!). I'm just looking forsomething to turn my ferrule stations and the cork..... I've thought ofbuilding my own, any ideas? One of mine has been to take a zyliss lathe(comes with bed and tailstock, drill is mounted for motor) and adding ahead. Or start from scratch with a couple of pillow bearings and a shaft.But where would i get the parts like the spindle (with a bore), chuck, bedand tailstock. Any help would be great! Thanks, Mark from paul.blakley@ntlworld.com Sat Mar 2 11:08:47 2002 g22H8k817183 for ; Sat, 2 Mar 2002 11:08:46 -0600 Subject: ebay Has the ebay server crashed out ?..........Paul from jbbamboo@hotmail.com Sat Mar 2 12:11:57 2002 g22IBu818352 for ; Sat, 2 Mar 2002 12:11:57 -0600 Sat, 2 Mar 2002 10:11:51 -0800 Sat, 02 Mar 2002 18:11:46 GMT Subject: Tradition FILETIME=[BA1DC720:01C1C215] And now, the rest of the story. snowshoes, and a closet full of bamboo flyrods. Why, not because I wasthreatened with a whippin from others for not falling in line, but because Ilike wearing something that my grandpa wore. Makes me feel good fishing traditional to improve upon. I'm not talking about my micro wave oven, long g!one, sold at a garage sale or replaced by another new latest and greatestitem. Many of my traditional belongings are still with me. Still got those wing my bamboo rods will always have two footed snake guides, silk thread andcork handle. If you want to use ceramic guides, a foam handle and the latestvibration dampening wrap under the handle, good for you. I'm sure it will lookgreat in your PVC rod tube. I'm no lemming and not a purist either and yet Ifind myself liking my traditionl belongings more and more. what changes have taken place. New adhesive's, every building techniqueunder the sun being tried, including such things like, new tapers, differingheat treating methods, bevellers, taper mills, node presses and everything isanalized and re analized. No wonder the best rods ever made are being madetoday. I think we've got the best of both worlds, but single foot guides, not from beadman@mac.com Sat Mar 2 12:22:27 2002 g22IMQ818789 for ; Sat, 2 Mar 2002 12:22:26 -0600 2002)) Subject: Re: Grand Experiment At 10:08 AM -0500 , 3/2/02, Dennishigham@cs.com wrote about Re: Grand Experiment Hank, Thanks, all, for the info about comparing measurements. Claude from rmoon@ida.net Sat Mar 2 12:26:19 2002 g22IQI819044 for ; Sat, 2 Mar 2002 12:26:18 -0600 Subject: Re: Tradition --------------2F12883FC01B1AF0F9B5104E Amen JimRalph Jim Bureau wrote: And now, the rest of the story. I'm a traditionalist of sorts, havea pair of winged tip shoes, a old wool hunting mackinac coat, doublebarrel shotgun, rawhide snowshoes, and a closet full of bambooflyrods. Why, not because I was threatened with a whippin from others grandpa wore. Makes me feel good fishing with cane like Garrison did.I'm 55 years old and spent a small fortune on the latest and greatestitem of whatever came down the pike and in many cases, have little toshow for it. I've bought and sold five perfectly good automaticshotguns and yet I still own my traditional double guns, no need toget a new one of them, they're just to traditional to improve upon.I'm not talking about my micro wave oven, my color TV, or my Simm'sWaders. You'd have to fight me for the waders. Much of my nontraditional stuff is long g! one, sold at a garage sale or replaced byanother new latest and greatest item. Many of my traditionalbelongings are still with me. Still got those wing tips and theplatform shoes are long gone. Many traditional items have stood thetest of time and people have come to respect them for that veryreason, myself included. Sorry to disagree with you guys but my bamboorods will always have two footed snake guides, silk thread and corkhandle. If you want to use ceramic guides, a foam handle and thelatest vibration dampening wrap under the handle, good for you. I'msure it will look great in your PVC rod tube. I'm no lemming and not apurist either and yet I find myself liking my traditionl belongingsmore and more. As to the construction of modern bamboo rods, it'samazing what changes have taken place. New adhesive's, every buildingtechnique under the sun being tried, including such things like, newtapers, differing heat treating methods, bevellers, taper mills, nodepresses and everything is analized and re analized. No wonder the bestrods ever made are being made today. I think we've got the best ofboth worlds, but single foot guides, not on any bamboo rod I'll everbuild. Jim -----------------------------------------------------------------------Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: Click Here --------------2F12883FC01B1AF0F9B5104E Amen JimRalphJim Bureau wrote: I'm a traditionalist of sorts, have a pair of winged tip shoes, a old woolhunting mackinac coat, double barrel shotgun, rawhide snowshoes, and acloset full of bamboo flyrods. Why, not because I was threatened with awhippin from others for not falling in line, but because I like wearingsomething that my grandpa wore. Makes me feel good fishing with cane likeGarrison did. I'm 55 years old and spent a small fortune on the latest have little to show for it. I've bought and sold five perfectly good automaticshotguns and yet I still own my traditional double guns, no need to geta new one of them, they're just to traditional to improve upon. I'm not Waders. stuff is long g! one, sold at a garage sale or replaced by another newlatest and greatest item. Many of my traditional belongings are still withme. Still got those wing tips and the platform shoes are long gone. Many to respect them for that very reason, myself included. Sorry to disagreewith you guys but my bamboo rods will always have two footed snake guides,silk thread and cork handle. If you want to use ceramic guides, a foamhandle and the latest vibration dampening wrap under the handle, good foryou. I'm sure it will look great in your PVC rod tube. I'm no lemming andnot a purist either and yet I find myself liking my traditionl belongings amazing what changes have taken place. New adhesive's, every buildingtechniqueunder the sun being tried, including such things like, new tapers, differingheat treating methods, bevellers, taper mills, node presses and everythingis analized and re analized. No wonder the best rods ever made are beingmade today. I think we've got the best of both worlds, but single foot Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: ClickHere --------------2F12883FC01B1AF0F9B5104E-- from Lazybee45@aol.com Sat Mar 2 12:44:58 2002 g22Iiw819575 for ; Sat, 2 Mar 2002 12:44:58 -0600 for ; Sat, 2 Mar 2002 13:44:45 -0500 Subject: Re: making a lathe In a message dated 3/2/02 7:32:21 AM Central Standard Time, wendt@kingcrab.nrl.navy.mil writes: Yuh! At the local "Re-tool" store (a reconditioned and second hand tool store) A decent Wood lathe is available WITH turning tools for less than $200. IF I remember correctly. the other mark visit Wood Art Custom Designs http://hometown.aol.com/lazybee45/myhomepage/business.html Hand crafted items made to order! from bennetts@cybermesa.com Sat Mar 2 13:00:54 2002 g22J0r820020 for ; Sat, 2 Mar 2002 13:00:53 -0600 for ; Sat, 2 Mar 2002 12:08:22 -0700 Subject: Gatherings Would some of you care to comment about the various bamboo gatherings =around the country (or the world for that matter)? I would love to =attend one or more this year but I don't have any info as to size, =dates, locations, etc. Usually by the time I hear about some event, it =is too late for me to make plans to attend because my wife has already = Thanks! Scott List, Would some of you care to commentabout = I would love to attend one or more this year but I don't have any info = it is too late for me to make plans to attend because my wife has = Scott from rmoon@ida.net Sat Mar 2 13:21:37 2002 g22JLa820584 for ; Sat, 2 Mar 2002 13:21:36 -0600 Subject: Re: Gatherings --------------43A8A6D26296807BC29D010F The FFF Bamboo Rod Symposium is in August. See the urlwww.ida.net/users/rmoonRalph"C. Scott Bennett" wrote: List, Would some of you care to comment about the various bamboogatherings around the country (or the world for that matter)? I wouldlove to attend one or more this year but I don't have any info as tosize, dates, locations, etc. Usually by the time I hear about someevent, it is too late for me to make plans to attend because my wifehas already made plans for me. That's why I love her... Thanks!Scott --------------43A8A6D26296807BC29D010F www.ida.net/users/rmoonRalph"C. Scott Bennett" wrote: some of you care to comment about the various bamboo gatherings around one or more this year but I don't have any info as to size, dates, locations, Scott --------------43A8A6D26296807BC29D010F-- from bamboorules@ns.sympatico.ca Sat Mar 2 13:34:05 2002 g22JY4821254 for ; Sat, 2 Mar 2002 13:34:05 -0600 Sat, 2 Mar 2002 15:35:45 -0400 Organization: New Scotland Fly Rods Subject: Re: making a lathe OOOPS sorry all, its been a while. The link should bewww.shawnsbamboopage.eboard.comShawn Shawn Pineo wrote: Mark,if ferrule stations and cork is all you want to do, check out myfranken lathe on www.eboard.shawnsbamboopage.comit is a very simple, inexpensive tool that you can make in an afternoon anditworks!Chucks for wood lathes are impractical as by the time you buy a woodlathe and 3 jaw chuck, you might as well just buy a metal lathe,Shawn Mark & Kathy Pohl wrote: I've been lathe surfing on the net, trying to find one for rod building.Whati've been finding is either one with a small spindle bore (3/8") or one withthe center to center distance that's too short (12" is too short in myopinion). However, there is the ideal lathe from sherline (model 4400)thatfits the bill but is out of budget (~ $700, WOW!). I'm just looking forsomething to turn my ferrule stations and the cork..... I've thought ofbuilding my own, any ideas? One of mine has been to take a zyliss lathe(comes with bed and tailstock, drill is mounted for motor) and adding ahead. Or start from scratch with a couple of pillow bearings and a shaft.But where would i get the parts like the spindle (with a bore), chuck, bedand tailstock. Any help would be great! Thanks, Mark from KlingB@health.missouri.edu Sat Mar 2 13:38:23 2002 g22JcN821524 for ; Sat, 2 Mar 2002 13:38:23 -0600 Sat, 2 Mar 2002 13:38:17 -0600 content-class: urn:content-classes:messageSubject: RE: More on Cascamite Thread-Topic: More on CascamiteThread-Index: AcHCA3qI2DdgdC3sEda4KABglOouXwAHnd9w "rod" FILETIME=[CD3DC010:01C1C221] g22JcN821527 Could you tell me what kind of heat is needed to straighten sections (notthat mine every need it....), say compared to PU or other known glues? Also,is it as toxic as URAC 185 and the similar liquid glues used by manyrodmakers? Thanks.... Barry -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: More on Cascamite You can pick up the same type of powdered Urea Formaldehyde at your localHome Depot/Lowe's store here stateside. Its called DAP Weldwood PlasticResin Glue. Comes in two colors. I use the tan because it blends with thenatural color of a blond rod. I have glued up 3 rods with this and have hadgood results. Pot life at 70 degrees is 4 hours, and it cleans up withwater. I must give credit for my discovery of this glue to Jerry Wall of JWFlyrods. He is the one that recommended it to me, and because I live in thefreaking boonies, he had to even send me some. Joe =================================================Lost in the Hills of East Tennessee with a Bamboo Fly Rod in one handand a cigar in the other....."What a Great Life". Visit my bambooflyrod site at http://www.direct-pest.com/rodmaker----- Original Message ----- Subject: More on Cascamite I used powdered urea formaldehyde resin in Canada years ago forveneering panels with excellent results. At that time you could buy itin the local hardware store, though I don't recall the brand name. Theonly source I can find in the U.S. is the illustrious Custom-Pak (seehttp://www.custompak.com/Adhesives/Powdered%20Plastic%20Resin.htm).John Zimny, what do you think of this adhesive?--Best regards,Reedhttp://www.overmywaders.com/ from jojo@ipa.net Sat Mar 2 14:12:17 2002 g22KCG822176 for ; Sat, 2 Mar 2002 14:12:16 -0600 helo=default) id 16hFrW-0005pg-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Sat, 02 Mar 2002 15:12:10 -0500 Subject: Re: Tradition Same here. There is much of tradition that appeals to me. Not just =because it is tradition, per se, but because it has stood the test of =time, has proven itself, and despite the latest and greatest having come =onto the world scene, it's still perfectly adequate and possibly even =better at doing it's job. I quite readily take and use the best of all =things, and discard the rest -- the worldly equivalent of Jeet Kune Do.Archery is another good example of something that has at its roots a =basic premise that has been expanded into mindbogglingness. I learned to =shoot on a selfbow, then moved into a fiberglass reinforced recurve. =Shooting was as easy as it gets. Then along comes the compound, and I =bought a Bear Whitetail Hunter, just to be sure that this was what I =wanted, then quickly ended up buying a Bear Alaskan, which at that time =was the top of the line. Lo and behold, only scant years later comes =along the cambow, an eccentric shape to the normally round wheels of the =compound. Speed and letoff were dramatically enhanced, not to mention =that the overdraw came into being, allowing one to shoot shorter and =lighter arrows at amazing speeds (for an arrow). Wow, we're really into =the technology end of things now. So, after a few years of that I sold =it all, and went back to my stickbow. I can more consistently shoot =accurately, even at moving targets, by only looking at the spot I want =the arrow to penetrate -- instinct shooting at its best. They took the =simplest thing in the world, flinging an arrow from a taut string and =wood, and complicated it no end with all manner of gadgets, sighting =devices, and mechanical "advantages". Now anyone can be an "archer". =Egad. M-D I'm a traditionalist of sorts, have a pair of winged tip shoes, a =old wool hunting mackinac coat, double barrel shotgun, rawhide =snowshoes, and a closet full of bamboo flyrods. Why, not because I was =threatened with a whippin from others for not falling in line, but =because I like wearing something that my grandpa wore. Makes me feel =good fishing with cane like Garrison did. I'm 55 years old and spent a =small fortune on the latest and greatest item of whatever came down the =pike and in many cases, have little to show for it. I've bought and =sold five perfectly good automatic shotguns and yet I still own my =traditional double guns, no need to get a new one of them, they're just =to traditional to improve upon. I'm not talking about my micro wave =oven, my color TV, or my Simm's Waders. You'd have to fight me for the =waders. Much of my non traditional stuff is long g! one, sold at a =garage sale or replaced by another new latest and greatest item. Many of =my traditional belongings are still with me. Still got those wing tips =and the platform shoes are long gone. Many traditional items have stood =the test of time and people have come to respect them for that very =reason, myself included. Sorry to disagree with you guys but my bamboo =rods will always have two footed snake guides, silk thread and cork =handle. If you want to use ceramic guides, a foam handle and the latest =vibration dampening wrap under the handle, good for you. I'm sure it =will look great in your PVC rod tube. I'm no lemming and not a purist =either and yet I find myself liking my traditionl belongings more and = As to the construction of modern bamboo rods, it's amazing what =changes have taken place. New adhesive's, every building technique under =the sun being tried, including such things like, new tapers, differing =heat treating methods, bevellers, taper mills, node presses and =everything is analized and re analized. No wonder the best rods ever =made are being made today. I think we've got the best of both worlds, =but single foot guides, not on any bamboo rod I'll ever build. Jim Same here. There ismuch = that appeals to me. Not just because it is tradition, per se, but = stood the test of time, has proven itself, and despite the latest and = having come onto the world scene, it's still perfectly adequate and = of all things, and discard the rest -- the worldly equivalent of Jeet = Do.Archery is anothergood = mindbogglingness. I learned to shoot on a selfbow, then moved into a = compound, and I bought a Bear Whitetail Hunter, just to be sure that = time was the top of the line. Lo and behold, only scant years later = lighter arrows at amazing speeds (for an arrow). Wow, we're really into = the arrow to penetrate -- instinct shooting at its best. They took the = Egad. M-D Bureau And now, the rest of the story. snowshoes, and a closet full of bamboo flyrods. Why, not because I was = threatened with a whippin from others for not falling in line, but = like wearing something that my grandpa wore. Makes me feel good = them, they're just to traditional to improve upon. I'm not talking = another new latest and greatest item. Many of my traditional = still with me. Still got those wing tips and the platform shoes are = Sorry to disagree with you guys but my bamboo rods will always have = snake guides, silk thread and cork handle. If you want to use ceramic = a foam handle and the latest vibration dampening wrap under the = not a purist either and yet I find myself liking my traditionl = and more. changes have taken place. New adhesive's, every building technique = sun being tried, including such things like, new tapers, differing = treating methods, bevellers, taper mills, node presses and everything = analized and re analized. No wonder the best rods ever made are being = today. I think we've got the best of both worlds, but single foot = = Jim = from KlingB@health.missouri.edu Sat Mar 2 17:22:50 2002 g22NMn824633 for ; Sat, 2 Mar 2002 17:22:50 -0600 Sat, 2 Mar 2002 17:22:44 -0600 content-class: urn:content-classes:messageSubject: RE: Tradition Thread-Topic: TraditionThread-Index: AcHCFfC1TG3bOi4GEda4KABglOouXwAKffWQ FILETIME=[28271FC0:01C1C241] Jim -- When you say, if you like it then do it and good for you, I agree. Butthen you just can't resist adding "I'm sure it will look great in yourPVC rod tube." Kind of like saying, If you like that couch, good foryou, I'm sure it will look good in your double-wide with the velvetElvis paintings. If this is tolerance I'd hate to see snobbery. Barry -----Original Message----- Subject: Tradition I'm a traditionalist of sorts, have a pair of winged tip shoes, a oldwool hunting mackinac coat, double barrel shotgun, rawhide snowshoes,and a closet full of bamboo flyrods. Why, not because I was threatenedwith a whippin from others for not falling in line, but because I likewearing something that my grandpa wore. Makes me feel good fishing withcane like Garrison did. I'm 55 years old and spent a small fortune onthe latest and greatest item of whatever came down the pike and in manycases, have little to show for it. I've bought and sold five perfectlygood automatic shotguns and yet I still own my traditional double guns,no need to get a new one of them, they're just to traditional to improveupon. I'm not talking about my micro wave oven, my color TV, or mySimm's Waders. You'd have to fight me for the waders. Much of my nontraditional stuff is long g! one, sold at a garage sale or replaced byanother new latest and greatest item. Many of my traditional belongingsare still with me. Still got those wing tips and the platform shoes arelong gone. Many traditional items have stood the test of time and peoplehave come to respect them for that very reason, myself included. Sorryto disagree with you guys but my bamboo rods will always have two footedsnake guides, silk thread and cork handle. If you want to use ceramicguides, a foam handle and the latest vibration dampening wrap under thehandle, good for you. I'm sure it will look great in your PVC rod tube.I'm no lemming and not a purist either and yet I find myself liking my As to the construction of modern bamboo rods, it's amazing whatchanges have taken place. New adhesive's, every building technique underthe sun being tried, including such things like, new tapers, differingheat treating methods, bevellers, taper mills, node presses andeverything is analized and re analized. No wonder the best rods evermade are being made today. I think we've got the best of both worlds,but single foot guides, not on any bamboo rod I'll ever build. Jim Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: ClickHere v\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}o\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}w\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}.shape {behavior:url(#default#VML);} 0DocumentEmail Ji=m -- Wh=en yousay, if you like it then do it and good for you, I agree. But then you =justcan’t resist adding “I'm you,I’m sure it will look good in your double-wide with the velvet =Elvis paintings.If this is tolerance I’d hate to see snobbery.= Barry -----OriginalMessage-----From: Jim Bureau Sent: Saturday, March02, =200212:12 PM RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.eduSubject: =Tradition And now, therest of the story. traditionalist of sorts, have a pair of winged tip shoes, a old wool =hunting =closetfull of bamboo flyrods. Why, not because I was threatened with a whippin =fromothers for not falling in line, but because I like wearing something =that mygrandpa wore. Makes me feel good fishing with cane like Garrison did. =I'm 55 five just totraditional to improve upon. I'm not talking about my micro wave oven, = waders. agarage sale or replaced by another new latest and greatest item. Many of =mytraditional belongings are still with me. Still got those wing tips and =the test reason,myself included. Sorry to disagree with you guys but my bamboo rods will =alwayshave two footed snake guides, silk thread and cork handle. If you want =to useceramic guides, a foam handle and the latest vibration dampening wrap =under thehandle, good for you. I'm sure it will look great in your PVC rod tube. =I'm nolemming and not a purist either and yet I find myself liking my =traditionlbelongings more and more. the construction of modern bamboo rods, it's amazing what changes have =taken place.New adhesive's, every building technique under the sun being tried, =includingsuch things like, new tapers, differing heat treating methods, =bevellers, tapermills, node presses and everything is analized and re analized. No =wonder thebest rods ever made are being made today. I think we've got the best of =both everbuild. Jim Send andreceive Hotmail on your mobile device: ClickHere from channer@frontier.net Sat Mar 2 17:55:27 2002 g22NtQ825199 for ; Sat, 2 Mar 2002 17:55:26 -0600 for ; Sat, 2 Mar 2002 16:55:32 -0700 Subject: Re: Tradition Hey!;Lets not be knockin PVC rod tubes!!!!If it weren't for schedule 40 pvc,mine would have to just rattle around in the back of the van uncovered.john(cheep in durango)and yes, they go real well with the decor in the doublewide LOL! from jcbyrd@direct-pest.com Sat Mar 2 18:02:23 2002 g2302M825473 for ; Sat, 2 Mar 2002 18:02:23 -0600 by direct-pest.com [208.27.26.103] for ; Sat, 02 Mar 2002 19:01:48 -0500 "rod" Subject: Re: More on Cascamite Using a low constant heat with your heat gun you can straighten without anyproblems. Manufacturer recommends using gloves when handling the glue. I can'tcomment about the toxicity. Because I don't really know. Thanks Joe =================================================Lost in the Hills of East Tennessee with a Bamboo Fly Rod in one handand a cigar in the other....."What a Great Life". Visit my bambooflyrod site at http://www.direct-pest.com/rodmaker----- Original Message ----- Subject: RE: More on Cascamite Could you tell me what kind of heat is needed to straighten sections (notthat mine every need it....), say compared to PU or other known glues? Also,is it as toxic as URAC 185 and the similar liquid glues used by manyrodmakers? Thanks.... Barry -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: More on Cascamite You can pick up the same type of powdered Urea Formaldehyde at your localHome Depot/Lowe's store here stateside. Its called DAP Weldwood PlasticResin Glue. Comes in two colors. I use the tan because it blends with thenatural color of a blond rod. I have glued up 3 rods with this and have hadgood results. Pot life at 70 degrees is 4 hours, and it cleans up withwater. I must give credit for my discovery of this glue to Jerry Wall of JWFlyrods. He is the one that recommended it to me, and because I live in thefreaking boonies, he had to even send me some. Joe =================================================Lost in the Hills of East Tennessee with a Bamboo Fly Rod in one handand a cigar in the other....."What a Great Life". Visit my bambooflyrod site at http://www.direct-pest.com/rodmaker----- Original Message ----- Subject: More on Cascamite I used powdered urea formaldehyde resin in Canada years ago forveneering panels with excellent results. At that time you could buy itin the local hardware store, though I don't recall the brand name. Theonly source I can find in the U.S. is the illustrious Custom-Pak (seehttp://www.custompak.com/Adhesives/Powdered%20Plastic%20Resin.htm).John Zimny, what do you think of this adhesive?--Best regards,Reedhttp://www.overmywaders.com/ from bdcbfr@chartermi.net Sat Mar 2 18:22:21 2002 g230MK825928 for ; Sat, 2 Mar 2002 18:22:20 -0600 g230PR013533; Subject: Re: Casting Clinics Speaking of tradition. I used to be a teaching assistant for shootingsports in college. We had a really plain old Belgian Browning O/U skeet gunthat we'd use if someone just couldn't get the hang of swinging through thebird. The balance of the gun was such that once you got it going it wantedto keep going, unlike the school's Remington 1100's. Brian----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Casting Clinics I haven't actually used cane for the casting part of my 15 week middleschool fly fishing activity, but I'll have to this year. Two weeks ago, when the head of the local TU was showing my dozen kidsthevarious types of fly rods out there, he'd pull each rod out of the bag andlay it on the library table in front of them... something like : an oldstyle fiberglass, followed by an early Sage, a nice Loomis, then abeautiful Winston, each with a matching reel (single action, then largearbor, etc). BUT, when he pulled out the bamboo rod and laid it with theothers, there was a collective gasp (honest to goodness) and thenuninhibited 7th and 8th grade oooos and ahhhs. Of course, the first student to recover turned to me and asked if they were going to get to try that kind of rod, too [:-)] Kat from robertgkope@attbi.com Sat Mar 2 18:30:00 2002 g230Tx826214 for ; Sat, 2 Mar 2002 18:29:59 -0600 Subject: displacing nodes I had some questions for Tony Spezio about node displacing, but thought =the subject was interesting enough to put on the list. Besides, I know =that others are using this method and may also have advice to =contribute. Tony's article on node displacing in the latest issue of Powerfibers has =me interested enough to give it a try, but I still don't get how to =proceed after flattening the nodes. On most nodes, the crooks in the =strip going side to side are much more pronounced than the bumps in the =vertical dimension. After flattening the node, don't the bumps come =back when you reheat the node to straighten the strip? How about when =heat treating? I haven't tried soaking strips yet, but I've heard that =soaked strips shrink by nearly 20% when heat treated. Doesn't this make =the string so loose that the nodes go back to their original shape? TIA, Robert Kope I had some questions for Tony Spezio = displacing, but thought the subject was interesting enough to put on the = advice to contribute. Tony's article on node displacing in = issue of Powerfibers has me interested enough to give it a try, but I = crooks in the strip going side to side are much more pronounced than the = string so loose that the nodes go back to their original =shape? TIA, RobertKope from avyoung@iinet.net.au Sat Mar 2 18:35:32 2002 g230ZU826489 for ; Sat, 2 Mar 2002 18:35:31 -0600 ,"rod" Subject: RE: More on Cascamite I'm unsure as to how toxicity is rated but I read recently (within the last 2 years) UFs toxicity in general were down graded and are not nearly as bad as it was previously thought. Tony At 01:38 PM 3/2/02 -0600, Kling, Barry W. wrote: Could you tell me what kind of heat is needed to straighten sections (not that mine every need it....), say compared to PU or other known glues? Also, is it as toxic as URAC 185 and the similar liquid glues used by many rodmakers? Thanks.... Barry -----Original Message----- Sent: Saturday, March 02, 2002 9:59 AM Subject: Re: More on Cascamite You can pick up the same type of powdered Urea Formaldehyde at your localHome Depot/Lowe's store here stateside. Its called DAP Weldwood PlasticResin Glue. Comes in two colors. I use the tan because it blends with thenatural color of a blond rod. I have glued up 3 rods with this and have hadgood results. Pot life at 70 degrees is 4 hours, and it cleans up withwater. I must give credit for my discovery of this glue to Jerry Wall of JWFlyrods. He is the one that recommended it to me, and because I live in thefreaking boonies, he had to even send me some. Joe =================================================Lost in the Hills of East Tennessee with a Bamboo Fly Rod in one handand a cigar in the other....."What a Great Life". Visit my bambooflyrod site at http://www.direct-pest.com/rodmaker----- Original Message -----From: "Reed Curry" Sent: Saturday, March 02, 2002 10:29 AMSubject: More on Cascamite I used powdered urea formaldehyde resin in Canada years ago forveneering panels with excellent results. At that time you could buy itin the local hardware store, though I don't recall the brand name. Theonly source I can find in the U.S. is the illustrious Custom-Pak (see http://www.custompak.com/Adhesives/Powdered%20Plastic%20Resin.htm ).John Zimny, what do you think of this adhesive?--Best regards,Reedhttp://www.overmywaders.com/ /*************************************************************************/AV YoungVisit my web site at:"http://www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html" Yea, though I walk in the river of very shallow depth I fear no failure, My rod and my reel they comfort me. /*************************************************************************/ from avyoung@iinet.net.au Sat Mar 2 18:55:16 2002 g230tF826967 for ; Sat, 2 Mar 2002 18:55:15 -0600 Subject: Re: Casting Clinics Well, one is a gun and the other is just a bang stick. TY At 07:21 PM 3/2/02 -0500, Brian D. Creek wrote: Speaking of tradition. I used to be a teaching assistant for shootingsports in college. We had a really plain old Belgian Browning O/U skeet gunthat we'd use if someone just couldn't get the hang of swinging through thebird. The balance of the gun was such that once you got it going it wantedto keep going, unlike the school's Remington 1100's. Brian----- Original Message -----From: "D.P. Van Burgel & K.J. Scott" Sent: Saturday, March 02, 2002 9:24 AMSubject: Re: Casting Clinics I haven't actually used cane for the casting part of my 15 week middleschool fly fishing activity, but I'll have to this year. Two weeks ago, when the head of the local TU was showing my dozen kidsthevarious types of fly rods out there, he'd pull each rod out of the bag andlay it on the library table in front of them... something like : an oldstyle fiberglass, followed by an early Sage, a nice Loomis, then abeautiful Winston, each with a matching reel (single action, then largearbor, etc). BUT, when he pulled out the bamboo rod and laid it with theothers, there was a collective gasp (honest to goodness) and thenuninhibited 7th and 8th grade oooos and ahhhs. Of course, the first student to recover turned to me and asked if they were going to get to try that kind of rod, too [:-)] Kat /*************************************************************************/AV YoungVisit my web site at:"http://www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html" Yea, though I walk in the river of very shallow depth I fear no failure, My rod and my reel they comfort me. /*************************************************************************/ from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Sat Mar 2 19:17:11 2002 g231HA827355 for ; Sat, 2 Mar 2002 19:17:10 -0600 (authenticated) Sat, 2 Mar 2002 17:17:03 -0800 Subject: Re: Gatherings --------------C31F0686952FF66FF7CB9504 Scott, Last weekend of October is the Southern (US)Rodmakers Gathering. More info at:http://www.curro.net/SRG/index2002.html Harry "C. Scott Bennett" wrote: List, Would some of you care to comment aboutthe various bamboo gatherings around the country(or the world for that matter)? I would love toattend one or more this year but I don't haveany info as to size, dates, locations, etc.Usually by the time I hear about some event, itis too late for me to make plans to attendbecause my wife has already made plans for me.That's why I love her... Thanks! Scott -- -- Harry Boyd --http://www.canerods.com/ -- Bamboo Rods -- http://www.fbcwin.com/ -- Our Church -- --------------C31F0686952FF66FF7CB9504 Scott, Rodmakers "C. Scott Bennett" wrote: some of you care to comment about the various bamboo gatherings around one or more this year but I don't have any info as to size, dates, locations, Scott -- -- Bamboo Rods -- --------------C31F0686952FF66FF7CB9504-- from jojo@ipa.net Sat Mar 2 19:24:25 2002 g231OO827633 for ; Sat, 2 Mar 2002 19:24:24 -0600 helo=default) id 16hKjd-0004Gi-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Sat, 02 Mar 2002 20:24:22 -0500 Subject: Re: displacing nodes Robert, I have two small vises. One is set up much as the one pictured in Tony's =article. The other has two wooden blocks of hard maple on one side, =spaced approx. 5/8" apart. On the other jaw is a single wooden block of =hard maple that will just fit between the space on the opposite side. I =use this vise and its jaws to straighten by displacement the doglegs at =the nodes. I've been thinking for some time to make a curved set of =jaws, as this would allow me to straighten a wider area. Maybe something =like Ray Gould has in his book. What I do is heat the node, work the sides of the node, and quickly put =the strip into the other vise for flattening the node. It really only =takes me about a minute and a half per node to heat and straighten, =though invariably some nodes take longer. Soaking the strips for an extended period of time has a great affect on =how well the nodes stay displaced. By soaking a minimum of 3 days, =though I think 4-5 is better, the nodes stay as they were when I began =the heat treating. The only time I've noticed nodes popping back is from =not having soaked the strips long enough. I believe this is due to the =lack of moisture content of the bamboo, and it not providing a good =heat transfer into the strip. The greater moisture content, coupled with =extreme heat seems to get deep into the strip, and all the displacing =stays put, yet the strip seems to suffer no damage. Yes, the strips shrink by a considerable amount, and yes the string is =somewhat more loose than when put into the oven, but no the nodes don't =pop back. M-D I had some questions for Tony Spezio about node displacing, but =thought the subject was interesting enough to put on the list. Besides, =I know that others are using this method and may also have advice to =contribute. Tony's article on node displacing in the latest issue of Powerfibers =has me interested enough to give it a try, but I still don't get how to =proceed after flattening the nodes. On most nodes, the crooks in the =strip going side to side are much more pronounced than the bumps in the =vertical dimension. After flattening the node, don't the bumps come =back when you reheat the node to straighten the strip? How about when =heat treating? I haven't tried soaking strips yet, but I've heard that =soaked strips shrink by nearly 20% when heat treated. Doesn't this make =the string so loose that the nodes go back to their original shape? TIA, Robert Kope Robert, I have two small vises.= much as the one pictured in Tony's article. The other has two wooden = hard maple on one side, spaced approx. 5/8" apart. On the other jaw is a = opposite side. I use this vise and its jaws to straighten by = doglegs at the nodes. I've been thinking for some time to make a curved = like Ray Gould has in his book. What I do is heat the = sides of the node, and quickly put the strip into the other vise for = the node. It really only takes me about a minute and a half per node to = straighten, though invariably some nodes take =longer. Soaking the strips foran = period of time has a great affect on how well the nodes stay displaced. = soaking a minimum of 3 days, though I think 4-5 is better, the nodes = they were when I began the heat treating. The only time I've noticed = popping back is from not having soaked the strips long enough. I believe = good heat transfer into the strip. The greater moisture content, coupled = put, yet the strip seems to suffer no damage. Yes, the strips shrink considerable amount, and yes the string is somewhat more loose than when = into the oven, but no the nodes don't pop back. M-D Kope I had some questions for Tony Spezio = displacing, but thought the subject was interesting enough to put on = have advice to contribute. Tony's article on node displacing in = issue of Powerfibers has me interested enough to give it a try, but I = crooks in the strip going side to side are much more pronounced than = shape? TIA, Robert =Kope from Troutgetter@aol.com Sat Mar 2 20:12:14 2002 g232CD828260 for ; Sat, 2 Mar 2002 20:12:13 -0600 for ; Sat, 2 Mar 2002 21:11:51 -0500 Subject: chat room anyone having trouble getting Todd's chat room to load up?Mike Mike's Bamboo Rod ShopMontclair, CAhttp://www.mshaybamboo.gq.nu/ from Grnmtrds@aol.com Sat Mar 2 20:51:20 2002 g232pK828756 for ; Sat, 2 Mar 2002 20:51:20 -0600 for ; Sat, 2 Mar 2002 21:50:59 -0500 Subject: tradition Jim, What's the matter with sched 40 pipe? It fits in great with my furniture. Especially with the couch next to my three washing machines in the living room. Jim/Vermont from bennetts@cybermesa.com Sat Mar 2 21:12:33 2002 g233CW829152 for ; Sat, 2 Mar 2002 21:12:32 -0600 Subject: Re: Tradition John, Your rods were so nice to look at and cast I never would have noticed theschedule 40 tubes if you had not pointed them out to me! Thanks for thedayfishing. Scott ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Tradition Hey!;Lets not be knockin PVC rod tubes!!!!If it weren't for schedule 40 pvc,mine would have to just rattle around in the back of the van uncovered.john(cheep in durango)and yes, they go real well with the decor in the doublewideLOL! from saltwein@worldnet.att.net Sun Mar 3 05:51:34 2002 g23BpY809839 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 05:51:34 -0600 Subject: Question for the metallurgists I was curious as to what is necessary to stress relieve steel bars? Is =this a diy project, and if not what kind of industry must one go to? Regards, SteveIndependence, MO I was curious as to what is necessary = relieve steel bars? Is this a diy project, and if not what kind of = one go to?TIA. Regards, SteveIndependence, =MO from gdabrowski@yahoo.com Sun Mar 3 06:50:52 2002 g23Coo810620 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 06:50:50 -0600 Sun, 03 Mar 2002 04:50:45 PST Subject: stress relieving Steve; Stress relieving is a process of reducing internal stresses byheating to a subcritical temperature long enough to assureuniformity, followed by slow cooling which will prevent thereintroduction of stresses. Normally heat to 1100 to 1300F and dwell shutting the oven off and letting it cool to below 500F. Stress relieving is done by Heat Treating Firms, usually in a batchprocess having a minimum charge of about $80 to 110 or more dependingon the oven required etc. You could DIY IF you can CONTROL the heating and cooling in a waythat does not introduce thermal stresses into your steel. Gary --- Steven trauthwein wrote: I was curious as to what is necessary to stress relieve steel bars?Is this a diy project, and if not what kind of industry must one goto?TIA. Regards, SteveIndependence, MO __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Sports - sign up for Fantasy Baseballhttp://sports.yahoo.com from paul.blakley@ntlworld.com Sun Mar 3 07:15:59 2002 g23DFx810995 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 07:15:59 -0600 Sun, 3 Mar 2002 13:15:57 +0000 Subject: Re: stress relieving The 'rule of thumb' for carbon steels is to allow 1hr per inch ofthickness at circa 620 Centigrade.........Paul Gary Dabrowski wrote: Steve; Stress relieving is a process of reducing internal stresses byheating to a subcritical temperature long enough to assureuniformity, followed by slow cooling which will prevent thereintroduction of stresses. Normally heat to 1100 to 1300F and dwell shutting the oven off and letting it cool to below 500F. Stress relieving is done by Heat Treating Firms, usually in a batchprocess having a minimum charge of about $80 to 110 or more dependingon the oven required etc. You could DIY IF you can CONTROL the heating and cooling in a waythat does not introduce thermal stresses into your steel. Gary --- Steven trauthwein wrote: I was curious as to what is necessary to stress relieve steel bars?Is this a diy project, and if not what kind of industry must one goto?TIA. Regards, SteveIndependence, MO __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Sports - sign up for Fantasy Baseballhttp://sports.yahoo.com from earsdws@duke.edu Sun Mar 3 08:19:39 2002 g23EJc812160 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 08:19:39 -0600 g23EJOH18130 for ; by yefremov.acpub.duke.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) id JAA24496 for rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 09:19:24 -0500 Subject: Grizzley 3/4" bit Gang,A while back someone described using the Grizzley 3/4" tumbnail (C1215) bit for mortising reel seats. I can't recall how successful the enterprise was. Anyone out there have any experience with this, or similar bits?Thanks, dws. from aebersold@ou.edu Sun Mar 3 09:02:34 2002 g23F2X812826 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 09:02:34 -0600 id ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 09:02:31 -0600 Subject: Double Taper I am reading Milward's book and he says a DT line requires .004 increase inthe taper compared to using a WF line. That is almost the same as movingupone line weight. I was just comparing tapers on one of my WF and DT lines.The WF doesn't hit the running line for 40 feet. If I had on a ten footleader it doesn't look to me like the rod would see any difference until Iwas picking 50ft of line off the water and I would be casting with therunning line in the guides vs. the back belly of a DT which doens't happentoo often. Any thoughts?-dDennis Aebersold from flytyr@southshore.com Sun Mar 3 09:09:04 2002 g23F93813061 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 09:09:03 -0600 g23F91O14980 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 09:09:02 -0600 Subject: Re: Grizzley 3/4" bit That is what I use and I find it to be just fine.If you would like to see the set up and results I can send you some shots.Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com earsdws@duke.edu wrote: Gang,A while back someone described using the Grizzley 3/4" tumbnail (C1215)bit for mortising reel seats. I can't recall how successful theenterprise was. Anyone out there have any experience with this, orsimilar bits?Thanks, dws. from carstenjorgensen@mail.dk Sun Mar 3 09:30:42 2002 g23FUf813539 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 09:30:41 -0600 Subject: Sv: Double Taper g23FUg813540 Hi Dnnes Got Milards book a fewdays ago and noticed the same thing.I agree with You. If I regularly was casting + 60 feet I'd go downone line size in DT in order not to overload the rod. regards, Carsten ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Double Taper I am reading Milward's book and he says a DT line requires .004 increase inthe taper compared to using a WF line. That is almost the same as movingupone line weight. I was just comparing tapers on one of my WF and DT lines.The WF doesn't hit the running line for 40 feet. If I had on a ten footleader it doesn't look to me like the rod would see any difference until Iwas picking 50ft of line off the water and I would be casting with therunning line in the guides vs. the back belly of a DT which doens't happentoo often. Any thoughts?-dDennis Aebersold from atlasc1@earthlink.net Sun Mar 3 09:34:30 2002 g23FYT813753 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 09:34:29 -0600 ([209.179.147.65] helo=computer) id 16hY0J-00043z-00; Sun, 03 Mar 2002 07:34:28 -0800 Subject: Re: Gatherings The Great Western Rodmakers Gathering will be in October. This will =occurr in Bishop CA. in the Eastern Sierras. Adam Vigil The Great Western RodmakersGathering = October. This will occurr in Bishop CA. in the Eastern =Sierras. Adam =Vigil from rvenneri@ulster.net Sun Mar 3 09:38:58 2002 g23Fcw813980 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 09:38:58 -0600 Organization: Venneri's Custom Components Subject: message for Harry Boyd Guys sorry for the bandwidth. My email and Harrys are not speaking toeach other. Im not sure why. Harry,I shipped the day we spoke. Ups has them in Cach IL. Not sure why tho.Here is a tracking # so you can track them too. I hate UPS I really do.1z1297060341761302 Best RegardsBob v from Dennishigham@cs.com Sun Mar 3 09:50:04 2002 g23Fo3814360 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 09:50:03 -0600 Subject: Re: Gatherings Scott,The Grayling, Michigan gathering is the 3rd weekend in June....starts Thur. evening (20th) with dinner @ whispering pines campground and ends Sat night with the Trout-Bum-Bar-B-Q. Checkout www.curro.net/grayrock2002 formore info. We're still working on the program so you won't see a published program Roscoe, New York the weekend after Labor day. Chris Bogart is trying to get Hap Mills to attend. More info from Chris @ cbogart@shentel.netThe Southern Rodmakers Gathering...the last weekend in October on theWhite River in Arkansas. Checkout www.curro.net/SRG/index2002.html. Thisprogram is under construction and more info will be available later this year. Dennis from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Sun Mar 3 10:01:46 2002 g23G1j814701 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 10:01:45 -0600 (authenticated) Sun, 3 Mar 2002 08:01:40 -0800 Subject: Re: message for Harry Boyd Bob, and list... I too apologize, but Bob is correct -- our emails will not talk too eachother. Tried sending this off list to no avail. Thanks Bob... If my package to you hasn't arrived, give me a call thisafternoon while the rates are cheap. Harry Robert Venneri wrote: Guys sorry for the bandwidth. My email and Harrys are not speaking toeach other. Im not sure why. --Harry Boyd http://www.canerods.com/ Bamboo Rodshttp://www.fbcwin.com/ Our Church from bennetts@cybermesa.com Sun Mar 3 10:06:33 2002 g23G6W814917 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 10:06:33 -0600 Subject: Re: Gatherings Mike, Concerning the Bishop gathering, is there a registration procedure or dopeople just show up? I better look at a map! Scott ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Gatherings Scott,Bishop CA mid OctoberBest to you,Mike Shay Mike's Bamboo Rod ShopMontclair, CAhttp://www.mshaybamboo.gq.nu/ from atlasc1@earthlink.net Sun Mar 3 10:06:43 2002 g23G6g814922 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 10:06:43 -0600 ([209.179.146.99] helo=computer) id 16hYVV-0007ga-00 for rodmakers@mail.wustl.edu; Sun, 03 Mar 2002 08:06:41 -0800 Subject: PVC rod tubes? Oh Yea! Some may not like the PVC for rod tubes for cane but they do perform =great. A wood tube is pretty but is best suited for home storage and =presentation. A $65 aluminum rod tube is great but they do get scratched =and scared easily and if you travel give thieves a lot of ideas. A PVC =rod tube for travel is very strong. I throw them into the trunk with all =kinds of crap and if they get scratch who cares. They are plain and draw =no attention. They are more heat resistant then aluminum. This is a plus =when your rod is in your car on a hot summer day. If you get a sense of joy pulling your rod out of a aluminum tube that =is OK. Just do not leave it on the back seat of your car or you may come =back to a broken window and some of your gear gone. A PVC rod tube just =does not seem to get attention. Besides for $2 bucks it is hard to = I guess if the old time rodmakers were against changing tradition they =never would have switched to aluminum in the first place. It is rather a =new material. And if there are those set on following what the old =makers did remember they either started to make fiberglass rods or they =went out of business. I am not interested in following that tradition. Adam Vigil Some may not like the PVC for rodtubes = but they do perform great. A wood tube is pretty but is best suited for = storage and presentation. A $65 aluminum rod tube is great but they do = scratched and scared easily and if you travel give thieves a lot of = rod tube for travel is very strong. I throw them into the trunk with all = of crap and if they get scratch who cares. They are plain and draw no = They are more heat resistant then aluminum. This is a plus when your rod = your car on a hot summer day. out of a aluminum tube that is OK. Just do not leave it on the back seat = = = changing tradition they never would have switched to aluminum in the = place. It is rather a new material. And if there are those set on = the old makers did remember they either started to make fiberglass rods = tradition. AdamVigil from atlasc1@earthlink.net Sun Mar 3 10:17:00 2002 g23GH0815514 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 10:17:00 -0600 ([209.179.146.99] helo=computer) id 16hYfQ-0001SJ-00; Sun, 03 Mar 2002 08:16:57 -0800 Subject: Re: Double Taper It seems to be TRADITION. To make the specs on your rods larger if you useaDT. If you are fishing within normal trout distances of up to 40 then theline weight is not much difference from a WF. If you are going up to theoccasional 60' your rod will still handle it OK. Tradition is a wonderful thing. But has anyone been hit by a monkeyrecently? Or maybe it Spanked by a Monkey? Adam Vigil----- Original Message ----- Subject: Double Taper I am reading Milward's book and he says a DT line requires .004 increase in the taper compared to using a WF line. That is almost the same as moving up one line weight. I was just comparing tapers on one of my WF and DT lines. The WF doesn't hit the running line for 40 feet. If I had on a ten footleader it doesn't look to me like the rod would see any difference until Iwas picking 50ft of line off the water and I would be casting with therunning line in the guides vs. the back belly of a DT which doens't happentoo often. Any thoughts?-dDennis Aebersold from iank@ts.co.nz Sun Mar 3 10:18:54 2002 g23GIr815711 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 10:18:53 -0600 by sage.ts.co.nz (8.11.3/8.11.3) id g23GS4228809 for rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu.KAV; Mon, 4 Mar 2002 05:28:04+1300 Mon, 4 Mar 2002 05:28:03 +1300 Subject: Re: Gatherings Scott, true Southern gathering in New Zealand, held this year on the 9th and = Attendees this year include overseas participants Jerry Madigan, Bob =Nunley, the Demarests, Danny Twang, Bob Milardo, Mike Roberts and a = We are now getting some more settled weather and rivers are looking = Subject: Gatherings Would some of you care to comment about the various bamboo gatherings=around the country (or the world for that matter)? I would love to =attend one or more this year but I don't have any info as to size, =dates, locations, etc. Usually by the time I hear about some event, it =is too late for me to make plans to attend because my wife has already = Thanks! Scott Scott, year on the 9th and 10th of March. The next one will be in about 2 years = Attendees this year include overseas = Jerry Madigan, Bob Nunley, the Demarests, Danny Twang, Bob Milardo, Mike = We are now getting some more settled= rivers are looking great . Ian ----- Original Message ----- Bennett Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2002 = AMSubject: Gatherings List, Would some of you care to comment = about some event, it is too late for me to make plans to attend = Scott from atlasc1@earthlink.net Sun Mar 3 10:34:19 2002 g23GYI816135 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 10:34:18 -0600 ([209.179.146.130] helo=computer) id 16hYwB-0006iE-00; Sun, 03 Mar 2002 08:34:16 -0800 Subject: Re: Gatherings Scott, We will want to have a head count. And will have more details later. But weare looking forward to having demos on a lot of the details of rodmaking:cane selection, splitting, node pressing, flaming and heat treating with thetorch, nodeless making, A lot of information for beginning rodmakers andthe curious. We will have a lot of experience there and hope to have a lotof helping hands this year. Fishing is 10 minutes away and the weather willis always great. drop me an email. There a several of us already willing to help out ChuckIrvine this year and any help or donations will not be refused. Adam Vigil ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Gatherings Mike, Concerning the Bishop gathering, is there a registration procedure or dopeople just show up? I better look at a map! Scott ----- Original Message -----From: Sent: Saturday, March 02, 2002 12:15 PMSubject: Re: Gatherings Scott,Bishop CA mid OctoberBest to you,Mike Shay Mike's Bamboo Rod ShopMontclair, CAhttp://www.mshaybamboo.gq.nu/ from paul.blakley@ntlworld.com Sun Mar 3 10:49:29 2002 g23GnS816668 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 10:49:28 -0600 Sun, 3 Mar 2002 16:49:26 +0000 Subject: Re: Gatherings ......and don't forget the UK one in early November !........Paul from stoltz10@attbi.com Sun Mar 3 11:01:26 2002 g23H1P817070 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 11:01:25 -0600 Subject: Gudebrod thread I was at the fabric store and noticed a large selection of Gudebrod silk =thread, has anyone had any experience with this thread? I was at the fabric store and noticed a= selection of Gudebrod silk thread, has anyone had any experience with = thread? from Troutgetter@aol.com Sun Mar 3 11:21:56 2002 g23HLt817534 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 11:21:55 -0600 Subject: Re: Gatherings Scott,Registration is required (sort of). The gathering is held at Chuck Irvine's home in Bishop and his wife needs to know how much food to buy. LastOctober it was $10.00 a head. Go to the URL below to take a look. This page is set up 2002 event. but directions to Chuck's is there. If you need to know how to get to Bishop, US 395 runs through the center of town. I'm not sure where you'd be coming from, let me know and we'll figure it out! http://orphanlaptops.com/gw2001.htm Mike Mike's Bamboo Rod ShopMontclair, CAhttp://www.mshaybamboo.gq.nu/ from jbbamboo@hotmail.com Sun Mar 3 11:23:09 2002 g23HN8817713 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 11:23:08 -0600 Sun, 3 Mar 2002 09:22:58 -0800 Sun, 03 Mar 2002 17:22:58 GMT Subject: RE: Tradition FILETIME=[1088CD90:01C1C2D8] Barry: never been snoobish about what any builder wants to do with his rods orcases or anything else for that matter. Use whatever you like, that's what I opinion as to what's traditional bother's you, I can live with agree. But in your good for velvet Tradition shoes, a old snowshoes, threatened because I like good fishing with fortune on pike and in many perfectly double guns, to improve TV, or my Much of my non replaced by traditional belongings shoes are time and people included. Sorry have two footed use ceramic wrap under the rod tube. liking my amazing what technique under differing and rods ever both worlds, Chat with friends online, try MSNMessenger: ClickHere from kurt.clement@flashmail.com Sun Mar 3 11:45:39 2002 g23Hjc818226 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 11:45:38 -0600 Subject: Re: Grizzley 3/4" bit Works very well. The radius of the actual cut is 5/16", or 5/8" diameterwhich fits the reel foot nicely. Make a jig to hold the insert per JackHowell's book, or see Powerfibers #3. Take light cuts and make sure thecenter of the fingernail is centered on the reel seat. KurtNixa, MO ------Original Message----- Subject: Grizzley 3/4" bit Gang,A while back someone described using the Grizzley 3/4" tumbnail (C1215)bit for mortising reel seats. I can't recall how successful theenterprise was. Anyone out there have any experience with this, orsimilar bits?Thanks, dws. from kurt.clement@flashmail.com Sun Mar 3 11:45:47 2002 g23Hjk818235 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 11:45:46 -0600 Subject: Re: displacing nodes Yes, the strips shrink by a considerable amount, and yes the string is =somewhat more loose than when put into the oven, but no the nodes don't =pop back. I have not measured a strip before soaking, but I bet it swells during =soaking, then shrinks again during the heat treating. Of course you =have to take this into consideration when rough planing, but I would =think that if a strip was measured, soaked and heat treated, that the =final dimension would be very close to the original. I too soak and displace. Struggled a long time on my first rod trying = KurtNixa, MO-----Original Message-----From: Jojo DeLancier Subject: Re: displacing nodes Robert, I have two small vises. One is set up much as the one pictured in =Tony's article. The other has two wooden blocks of hard maple on one =side, spaced approx. 5/8" apart. On the other jaw is a single wooden =block of hard maple that will just fit between the space on the opposite =side. I use this vise and its jaws to straighten by displacement the =doglegs at the nodes. I've been thinking for some time to make a curved =set of jaws, as this would allow me to straighten a wider area. Maybe =something like Ray Gould has in his book. What I do is heat the node, work the sides of the node, and quickly =put the strip into the other vise for flattening the node. It really =only takes me about a minute and a half per node to heat and straighten, =though invariably some nodes take longer. Soaking the strips for an extended period of time has a great affect =on how well the nodes stay displaced. By soaking a minimum of 3 days, =though I think 4-5 is better, the nodes stay as they were when I began =the heat treating. The only time I've noticed nodes popping back is from =not having soaked the strips long enough. I believe this is due to the =lack of moisture content of the bamboo, and it not providing a good =heat transfer into the strip. The greater moisture content, coupled with =extreme heat seems to get deep into the strip, and all the displacing =stays put, yet the strip seems to suffer no damage. Yes, the strips shrink by a considerable amount, and yes the string =is somewhat more loose than when put into the oven, but no the nodes =don't pop back. M-D I had some questions for Tony Spezio about node displacing, but =thought the subject was interesting enough to put on the list. Besides, =I know that others are using this method and may also have advice to =contribute. Tony's article on node displacing in the latest issue of =Powerfibers has me interested enough to give it a try, but I still don't =get how to proceed after flattening the nodes. On most nodes, the =crooks in the strip going side to side are much more pronounced than the =bumps in the vertical dimension. After flattening the node, don't the =bumps come back when you reheat the node to straighten the strip? How =about when heat treating? I haven't tried soaking strips yet, but I've =heard that soaked strips shrink by nearly 20% when heat treated. =Doesn't this make the string so loose that the nodes go back to their =original shape? TIA, Robert Kope Yes, the strips shrink considerable amount, and yes the string is somewhat more loose than when = into the oven, but no the nodes don't pop back. I have not measured a strip before= planing, but I would think that if a strip was measured, soaked and heat = original. KurtNixa, MO -----Original = Saturday, March 02, 2002 7:34 PMSubject: Re: = nodesRobert, I have two small = set up much as the one pictured in Tony's article. The other has two = blocks of hard maple on one side, spaced approx. 5/8" apart. On = between the space on the opposite side. I use this vise and its jaws = straighten by displacement the doglegs at the nodes. I've been = book. What I do is heat the = the sides of the node, and quickly put the strip into the other vise = flattening the node. It really only takes me about a minute and a = longer. Soaking the strips = extended period of time has a great affect on how well the nodes = displaced. By soaking a minimum of 3 days, though I think 4-5 is = nodes stay as they were when I began the heat treating. The only = noticed nodes popping back is from not having soaked the strips long = and it not providing a good heat transfer into the strip. The = moisture content, coupled with extreme heat seems to get deep into = no damage. Yes, the strips = considerable amount, and yes the string is somewhat more loose than = into the oven, but no the nodes don't pop =back. M-D Robert Kope I had some questions for Tony = node displacing, but thought the subject was interesting enough = may also have advice to contribute. Tony's article on node = latest issue of Powerfibers has me interested enough to give it = but I still don't get how to proceed after flattening the = On most nodes, the crooks in the strip going side to side are = flattening the node, don't the bumps come back when you reheat = haven't tried soaking strips yet, but I've heard that soaked = shape? TIA, Kope from tedknott@cogeco.ca Sun Mar 3 11:51:41 2002 g23Hpe818721 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 11:51:40 -0600 Subject: Re: Gatherings The Canadian "Grand" Gathering, named after the river and location insouthern Ontario, is held every two years. The next meeting is scheduled Attendance is around 70 persons who come from all over Canada and thenorthern states. I'll post more info as soon as planning gets underway,probably late fall of this year. The 26th Canadian Fly Fishing Forum (the oldest fly fishing show in N.A.?)will be held at Exhibition Place in toronto, April 6 and 7. In addition tothe many seminars on fly fishing and fly tying there will be area bamboo rodmakers demonstrating rod making and show casing some of their bamboorods. from carstenjorgensen@mail.dk Sun Mar 3 11:52:10 2002 g23Hq6818802 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 11:52:10 -0600 ;Sun, 3 Mar 2002 18:52:05 +0100 Subject: Sv: Gudebrod thread regards, Carsten Subject: Gudebrod thread I was at the fabric store and noticed a large selection of Gudebrod =silk thread, has anyone had any experience with this thread? It is OK stuff. regards, Carsten ----- Original Message ----- Tim Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2002 = PMSubject: Gudebrod thread I was at the fabric store and noticed = selection of Gudebrod silk thread, has anyone had any experience with = thread? from harms1@pa.net Sun Mar 3 12:20:04 2002 g23IK3819471 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 12:20:03 -0600 , Subject: Re: Casting Clinics They're both just "bang-sticks," but at least the B/B is well-made. Now, aBoss, HH, Woodward, Rigby, Purdy, Fabbri--now, THOSE are some guns! cheers, Bill ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Casting Clinics Well, one is a gun and the other is just a bang stick. TY At 07:21 PM 3/2/02 -0500, Brian D. Creek wrote: Speaking of tradition. I used to be a teaching assistant for shootingsports in college. We had a really plain old Belgian Browning O/U skeet gun that we'd use if someone just couldn't get the hang of swinging through the bird. The balance of the gun was such that once you got it going it wanted to keep going, unlike the school's Remington 1100's. Brian----- Original Message -----From: "D.P. Van Burgel & K.J. Scott" Sent: Saturday, March 02, 2002 9:24 AMSubject: Re: Casting Clinics I haven't actually used cane for the casting part of my 15 week middleschool fly fishing activity, but I'll have to this year. Two weeks ago, when the head of the local TU was showing my dozenkids the various types of fly rods out there, he'd pull each rod out of the bag and lay it on the library table in front of them... something like : an old style fiberglass, followed by an early Sage, a nice Loomis, then abeautiful Winston, each with a matching reel (single action, then large arbor, etc). BUT, when he pulled out the bamboo rod and laid it with the others, there was a collective gasp (honest to goodness) and thenuninhibited 7th and 8th grade oooos and ahhhs. Of course, the first student to recover turned to me and asked if they were going to get to try that kind of rod, too [:-)] Kat /*************************************************************************/ AV YoungVisit my web site at:"http://www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html" Yea, though I walk in the river of very shallow depth I fear no failure, My rod and my reel they comfort me. /*************************************************************************/ from bdcbfr@chartermi.net Sun Mar 3 12:35:34 2002 g23IZT819935 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 12:35:29 -0600 g23IYxo08796; Subject: Re: Gatherings Send us some pictures when you can. Brian Subject: Re: Gatherings Scott, true Southern gathering in New Zealand, held this year on the 9th and = Attendees this year include overseas participants Jerry Madigan, Bob =Nunley, the Demarests, Danny Twang, Bob Milardo, Mike Roberts and a = We are now getting some more settled weather and rivers are looking = Subject: Gatherings Would some of you care to comment about the various bamboo =gatherings around the country (or the world for that matter)? I would =love to attend one or more this year but I don't have any info as to =size, dates, locations, etc. Usually by the time I hear about some =event, it is too late for me to make plans to attend because my wife has = Thanks! Scott Send us some pictures when you =can. Brian ----- Original Message ----- Ian Kearney= rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= Sent: Monday, March 04, 2002 = AMSubject: Re: Gatherings Scott, year on the 9th and 10th of March. The next one will be in about 2 = Attendees this year include overseas = Jerry Madigan, Bob Nunley, the Demarests, Danny Twang, Bob Milardo, = Roberts and a number of other lesser known but equally illustrious = We are now getting some more settled= rivers are looking great . Ian ----- Original Message ----- Scott Bennett Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2002 = AMSubject: Gatherings List, Would some of you care to comment = about some event, it is too late for me to make plans to attend = Scott from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Sun Mar 3 13:01:55 2002 g23J1s820636 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 13:01:54 -0600 (authenticated) Sun, 3 Mar 2002 11:01:44 -0800 Subject: Re: PVC rod tubes? Oh Yea! --------------9ADA99A36F3EFD59A3D668FC Adam, A small issue needs to be raised concerning PVC tubes,especially the lighter weight Schedule 10 and Schedule 20stuff. If left leaning in a corner at a severe angle, in ahot place, they will take a set, and so will the rodinside... Trust me, I seem to learn every lesson the hardway. Schedule 40 seems impervious to heat up to about 200*,but is more expensive, and heavier than aluminum. Also, by the time one pays for $3 worth of PVC tubing,and $8 worth of end cap and male and female screw fittings time and effort. For $17 each I buy nice aluminum tubes,black powder coated with my logo silk screened on them.Guess which ones I buy? If you are worried about themgetting stolen, store them in the trunk of your car, orunder the seat of your truck. Landmark Components(970)278-1311, no website, and tell Ron Cilli that I sentyou. (no interest, etc.) They do an adequate job of protecting the rod, thoughthey are not bomb proof. I can't imagine paying $65 for analuminum tube though, and would agree with you that that'stoo much money to pay. Harry Adam Vigil wrote: Some may not like the PVC for rod tubes for cane but theydo perform great. A wood tube is pretty but is best suited is great --Harry Boyd http://www.canerods.com/ Bamboo Rodshttp://www.fbcwin.com/ Our Church --------------9ADA99A36F3EFD59A3D668FC Adam, tubes, If left leaning in a corner at a severe angle, in a hot place, they will to about 200*, but is more expensive, and heavier than aluminum. tubing,and $8 worth of end cap and male and female screw fittings for the PVC, $17 each I buy nice aluminum tubes, black powder coated with my logo silk about them getting stolen, store them in the trunk of your car, or under website, though tube though, and would agree with you that that's too much money to pay. Adam Vigil wrote: Somemay not like the PVC for rod tubes for cane but they do perform great.A wood tube is pretty but is best suited for home storage and presentation.A $65 aluminum rod tube is great--Harry Boyd --------------9ADA99A36F3EFD59A3D668FC-- from carstenjorgensen@mail.dk Sun Mar 3 13:09:46 2002 g23J9j820956 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 13:09:45 -0600 ;Sun, 3 Mar 2002 20:09:44 +0100 , Subject: Sv: Casting Clinics g23J9k820957 Bill I humbly disagree: The BB is per tradition not as esteemed asPurdy, Churchill and others. BUT: it is a very well made toolbuilt to last and shoots well. regards, carsten ----- Original Message ----- ; Subject: Re: Casting Clinics They're both just "bang-sticks," but at least the B/B is well-made. Now, aBoss, HH, Woodward, Rigby, Purdy, Fabbri--now, THOSE are some guns! cheers, Bill ----- Original Message -----From: "Tony Young" Sent: Saturday, March 02, 2002 8:01 PMSubject: Re: Casting Clinics Well, one is a gun and the other is just a bang stick. TY At 07:21 PM 3/2/02 -0500, Brian D. Creek wrote: Speaking of tradition. I used to be a teaching assistant for shootingsports in college. We had a really plain old Belgian Browning O/U skeet gun that we'd use if someone just couldn't get the hang of swinging through the bird. The balance of the gun was such that once you got it going it wanted to keep going, unlike the school's Remington 1100's. Brian----- Original Message -----From: "D.P. Van Burgel & K.J. Scott" Sent: Saturday, March 02, 2002 9:24 AMSubject: Re: Casting Clinics I haven't actually used cane for the casting part of my 15 weekmiddleschool fly fishing activity, but I'll have to this year. Two weeks ago, when the head of the local TU was showing my dozenkids the various types of fly rods out there, he'd pull each rod out of the bag and lay it on the library table in front of them... something like : an old style fiberglass, followed by an early Sage, a nice Loomis, then abeautiful Winston, each with a matching reel (single action, then large arbor, etc). BUT, when he pulled out the bamboo rod and laid it with the others, there was a collective gasp (honest to goodness) and thenuninhibited 7th and 8th grade oooos and ahhhs. Of course, the first student to recover turned to me and asked ifthey were going to get to try that kind of rod, too [:-)] Kat /*************************************************************************/ AV YoungVisit my web site at:"http://www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html" Yea, though I walk in the river of very shallow depth I fear no failure, My rod and my reel they comfort me. /*************************************************************************/ from bdcbfr@chartermi.net Sun Mar 3 13:31:36 2002 g23JVZ821418 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 13:31:35 -0600 g23JYbL21373; Subject: Re: PVC rod tubes? Oh Yea! Ron's a really great guy to deal with. He also has some nice aluminum =screwlock reel seats. NS too, though they are a little heavy. NFI, =....... Brian Subject: Re: PVC rod tubes? Oh Yea! A small issue needs to be raised concerning PVC tubes, especially =the lighter weight Schedule 10 and Schedule 20 stuff. If left leaning =in a corner at a severe angle, in a hot place, they will take a set, and =so will the rod inside... Trust me, I seem to learn every lesson the =hard way. Schedule 40 seems impervious to heat up to about 200*, but is = Also, by the time one pays for $3 worth of PVC tubing, and $8 =worth of end cap and male and female screw fittings for the PVC, you've =got $11 in the PVC tube, plus glue and time and effort. For $17 each I =buy nice aluminum tubes, black powder coated with my logo silk screened =on them. Guess which ones I buy? If you are worried about them getting =stolen, store them in the trunk of your car, or under the seat of your =truck. Landmark Components (970)278-1311, no website, and tell Ron = They do an adequate job of protecting the rod, though they are not =bomb proof. I can't imagine paying $65 for an aluminum tube though, and = Some may not like the PVC for rod tubes for cane but they do perform =great. A wood tube is pretty but is best suited for home storage and =presentation. A $65 aluminum rod tube is great Ron's a really great guy to deal = Brian ----- Original Message ----- Harry= Cc: rodmakers@mail.wustl.edu= Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2002 = PMSubject: Re: PVC rod tubes? Oh =Yea! leaning in a corner at a severe angle, in a hot place, they will take = and $8 worth of end cap and male and female screw fittings for the = buy nice aluminum tubes, black powder coated with my logo silk = getting stolen, store them in the trunk of your car, or under the seat = Some may not like the PVC for rod = cane but they do perform great. A wood tube is pretty but is best = from jbbamboo@hotmail.com Sun Mar 3 13:44:23 2002 g23JiM821740 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 13:44:22 -0600 Sun, 3 Mar 2002 11:44:13 -0800 Sun, 03 Mar 2002 19:44:12 GMT Subject: Re: tradition FILETIME=[CB848F90:01C1C2EB] Hey Jim: something nicer. See you at Grayrocks. my furniture. machines in the living Chat with friends online, try MSNMessenger: ClickHere from flytyr@southshore.com Sun Mar 3 13:49:57 2002 g23Jnu822005 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 13:49:56 -0600 g23JnsO18178 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 13:49:54 -0600 Subject: Tapping photos and flat head screws.Fingetmail bit I think I sent the photos to all that wantedthem. There were quite a few requests so I mightof missed some of you. If you requested the shotsand did not get them, let me know. Will send outthe Fingernail setup later today or tomorrow.Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com from HalManas@aol.com Sun Mar 3 14:23:35 2002 g23KNY822850 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 14:23:34 -0600 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 15:23:18 -0500 Subject: Green List,What's with the GRRREEEENN! backgrounds? Hal from jojo@ipa.net Sun Mar 3 15:27:38 2002 g23LRc824235 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 15:27:38 -0600 helo=default) id 16hdW5-0006Lc-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Sun, 03 Mar 2002 16:27:37 -0500 Subject: Re: Green Apparently Scott is enthralled with Caterpillar Gut Green and HTML. Sure didliven things up around here. M-D List,What's with the GRRREEEENN! backgrounds? Hal from KlingB@health.missouri.edu Sun Mar 3 15:34:44 2002 g23LYh824492 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 15:34:43 -0600 Sun, 3 Mar 2002 15:34:34 -0600 content-class: urn:content-classes:message Subject: RE: Tradition Thread-Topic: TraditionThread-Index: AcHC2BFEEaHEtC7KEda4KABglOouXwAImc5g FILETIME=[3632C000:01C1C2FB] Jim - No bother, Jim, and I certainly didn't mean to offend, just anapparently poor attempt at a semi-humorous observation. And I do getpretty sensitive about my velvet Elvis paintings - you'll notice thatPVC has defenders on the list, but not ONE of them mentioned my Elvises.Maybe I can find a Velvet Elvis list where they have some respect forbamboo. Enjoy your traditions! Barry -----Original Message----- Subject: RE: Tradition Barry:It matter nothing to me as to what you or anyone else uses for yourrod tubes, be they PVC or a gunny sack. I've never been snoobish aboutwhat any builder wants to do with his rods or cases or anything else forthat matter. Use whatever you like, that's what I do. I just don'tconsider a PVC rod tube to be traditional for a bamboo rod. Same thingsgoes for the single foot snake guides. If my pesonal opinion as towhat's traditional bother's you, I can live with it.Jim wearing something that my grandpa wore. Makes me feel good fishing with the latest and greatest item of whatever came down the pike and in many good automatic shotguns and yet I still own my traditional double guns, no need to get a new one of them, they're just to traditional to another new latest and greatest item. Many of my traditional belongings are still with me. Still got those wing tips and the platform shoes are long gone. Many traditional items have stood the test of time and have come to respect them for that very reason, myself included. to disagree with you guys but my bamboo rods will always have two guides, a foam handle and the latest vibration dampening wrap under the handle, good for you. I'm sure it will look great in your PVC rod tube. changes have taken place. New adhesive's, every building technique Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: ClickHere v\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}o\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}w\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}.shape {behavior:url(#default#VML);} 0DocumentEmail Ji=m – No=bother,Jim, and I certainly didn’t mean to offend, just an apparently =poor attempt ata semi-humorous observation. And I do get pretty sensitive about my =velvet Elvispaintings – you’ll notice that PVC has defenders on the =list, but not ONE ofthem mentioned my Elvises. Maybe I can find a Velvet Elvis list where =they havesome respect for bamboo. En=joy yourtraditions! Ba=rry -----OriginalMessage-----From: Jim Bureau Sent: Sunday, March 03,=2002 11:23AM RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.eduSubject: RE: =Tradition Barry: to what builderwants to do with his rods or cases or anything else for that matter. Usewhatever you like, that's what I do. I just don't consider a PVC rod =tube to be footsnake guides. If my pesonal opinion as to what's traditional bother's =you, Ican live with it. Jim "Kling, Barry W." = RE: Tradition Sat, 2 Mar 2002 17:22:44 -0600 say, if you like it then do it and good for you, I agree. But = just can't resist adding "I'm sure it will look great in your = tube." Kind of like saying, If you like that couch, good for = sure it will look good in your double-wide with the velvet = paintings. If this is tolerance I'd hate to see snobbery. = Message----- Saturday, March 02, 2002 12:12 PM RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu Tradition the rest of the story. traditionalist of sorts, have a pair of winged tip shoes, a old = hunting mackinac coat, double barrel shotgun, rawhide snowshoes, = closet full of bamboo flyrods. Why, not because I was threatened = whippin from others for not falling in line, but because I like = something that my grandpa wore. Makes me feel good fishing with = Garrison did. I'm 55 years old and spent a small fortune on = latest and greatest item of whatever came down the pike and in many = have little to show for it. I've bought and sold five perfectly = automatic shotguns and yet I still own my traditional double guns, = to get a new one of them, they're just to traditional to improve = not talking about my micro wave oven, my color TV, or my = Waders. You'd have to fight me for the waders. Much of my non = stuff is long g! one, sold at a garage sale or replaced by = new latest and greatest item. Many of my traditional belongings = with me. Still got those wing tips and the platform shoes are = Many traditional items have stood the test of time and people = to respect them for that very reason, myself included. Sorry = disagree with you guys but my bamboo rods will always have two footed = guides, silk thread and cork handle. If you want to use ceramic = foam handle and the latest vibration dampening wrap under the = good for you. I'm sure it will look great in your PVC rod tube. = lemming and not a purist either and yet I find myself liking my = belongings more and more. the construction of modern bamboo rods, it's amazing what = have taken place. New adhesive's, every building technique under = being tried, including such things like, new tapers, differing = treating methods, bevellers, taper mills, node presses and = is analized and re analized. No wonder the best rods ever = being made today. I think we've got the best of both worlds, = single foot guides, not on any bamboo rod I'll ever build. = receive Hotmail on your mobile device: Click Here Chat withfriends online, try MSN Messenger: ClickHere from jbbamboo@hotmail.com Sun Mar 3 15:58:53 2002 g23Lwq825133 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 15:58:52 -0600 Sun, 3 Mar 2002 13:56:39 -0800 Sun, 03 Mar 2002 21:56:38 GMT Subject: Re: Green FILETIME=[4BC9C280:01C1C2FE] Green, are you talking RED GREEN. He's the man, long live duct discussion group" and HTML. Sure did liven things up around here. Join the world's largest e-mail servicewith MSN Hotmail. ClickHere from bennetts@cybermesa.com Sun Mar 3 16:12:11 2002 g23MC9825541 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 16:12:10 -0600 Subject: Re: Green Gee, I thought everybody had "caterpillar gut green" background. And whatdoes "HTML" mean anyway? I'll change it if you tell me how. Computer illiterate, Scott ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Green Apparently Scott is enthralled with Caterpillar Gut Green and HTML. Sure did liven things up around here. M-D From: List,What's with the GRRREEEENN! backgrounds? Hal from jojo@ipa.net Sun Mar 3 17:37:04 2002 g23Nb4828713 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 17:37:04 -0600 helo=default) id 16hfXK-0005zI-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Sun, 03 Mar 2002 18:37:03 -0500 Subject: Re: displacing nodes The strips certainly swell while soaking. I tie tip strips together ,and buttstrips together when soaking, and thethread is always tighter when I remove the strips from the water. I've nevermeasured dry strips vs. wet, as I onlycared about the final outcome. Without doubt the strips after heat treatingare smaller than before. I suspect that isthe case for non-soaked strips, as well. M-D Yes, the strips shrink by a considerable amount, and yes the string issomewhat more loose than when put into the oven,but no the nodes don't pop back. I have not measured a strip before soaking, but I bet it swells during soaking,then shrinks again during the heattreating. Of course you have to take this into consideration when roughplaning, but I would think that if a strip wasmeasured, soaked and heat treated, that the final dimension would be veryclose to the original. I too soak and displace. Struggled a long time on my first rod trying tostraighted strips dry until the list suggestedsoaking. KurtNixa, MO Robert, I have two small vises. One is set up much as the one pictured in Tony'sarticle. The other has two wooden blocks ofhard maple on one side, spaced approx. 5/8" apart. On the other jaw is asingle wooden block of hard maple that willjust fit between the space on the opposite side. I use this vise and its jaws tostraighten by displacement the doglegsat the nodes. I've been thinking for some time to make a curved set of jaws,as this would allow me to straighten awider area. Maybe something like Ray Gould has in his book. What I do is heat the node, work the sides of the node, and quickly put thestrip into the other vise for flattening thenode. It really only takes me about a minute and a half per node to heat andstraighten, though invariably some nodestake longer. Soaking the strips for an extended period of time has a great affect on howwell the nodes stay displaced. By soaking aminimum of 3 days, though I think 4-5 is better, the nodes stay as they werewhen I began the heat treating. The onlytime I've noticed nodes popping back is from not having soaked the stripslong enough. I believe this is due to the lackof moisture content of the bamboo, and it not providing a good heattransfer into the strip. The greater moisturecontent, coupled with extreme heat seems to get deep into the strip, and allthe displacing stays put, yet the stripseems to suffer no damage. Yes, the strips shrink by a considerable amount, and yes the string issomewhat more loose than when put into the oven,but no the nodes don't pop back. M-D I had some questions for Tony Spezio about node displacing, but thought thesubject was interesting enough to put on thelist. Besides, I know that others are using this method and may also haveadvice to contribute. Tony's article on node displacing in the latest issue of Powerfibers has meinterested enough to give it a try, but Istill don't get how to proceed after flattening the nodes. On most nodes, thecrooks in the strip going side to sideare much more pronounced than the bumps in the vertical dimension. Afterflattening the node, don't the bumps come backwhen you reheat the node to straighten the strip? How about when heattreating? I haven't tried soaking strips yet,but I've heard that soaked strips shrink by nearly 20% when heat treated. Doesn't this make the string so loose thatthe nodes go back to their original shape? TIA, Robert Kope from bamboorules@ns.sympatico.ca Sun Mar 3 17:41:06 2002 g23Nf5829514 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 17:41:05 -0600 Sun, 3 Mar 2002 19:40:25 -0400 Organization: New Scotland Fly Rods Subject: Re: PVC rod tubes? Oh Yea! --------------E70E0BD1C0ED0D1B6CF2583A HMMMMM,I can see a point here, I thought I was gettingcarried away when I started making a Nova Scotia Tartan rod bag AND aNova Scotia Tartan bag for the $100+ aluminum rod tubes I use.I agree $100 is allot for a rod tube, just crazy Iguess, oh by the way those ones are almost bomb proof!Shawn Harry Boyd wrote: Adam, A small issue needs to be raised concerning PVC tubes, especiallythe lighter weight Schedule 10 and Schedule 20 stuff. If left leaningin a corner at a severe angle, in a hot place, they will take a set,and so will the rod inside... Trust me, I seem to learn every lessonthe hard way. Schedule 40 seems impervious to heat up to about 200*,but is more expensive, and heavier than aluminum. Also, by the time one pays for $3 worth of PVC tubing, and $8worth of end cap and male and female screw fittings for the PVC,you've got $11 in the PVC tube, plus glue and time and effort. For$17 each I buy nice aluminum tubes, black powder coated with my logosilk screened on them. Guess which ones I buy? If you are worriedabout them getting stolen, store them in the trunk of your car, orunder the seat of your truck. Landmark Components (970)278-1311, nowebsite, and tell Ron Cilli that I sent you. (no interest, etc.) They do an adequate job of protecting the rod, though they are notbomb proof. I can't imagine paying $65 for an aluminum tube though,and would agree with you that that's too much money to pay. Harry Adam Vigil wrote: Some may not like the PVC for rod tubes for cane but they do performgreat. A wood tube is pretty but is best suited for home storage andpresentation. A $65 aluminum rod tube is great --Harry Boyd http://www.canerods.com/ Bamboo Rodshttp://www.fbcwin.com/ Our Church --------------E70E0BD1C0ED0D1B6CF2583A HMMMMM, I can see a point here, I thought I was getting carried away when I startedmaking a Nova Scotia Tartan rod bag AND a Nova ScotiaTartanbag for the $100+ aluminum rod tubes I use. I agree $100 is allot for a rod tube, just crazy I guess, oh by the waythose ones are almost bomb proof! ShawnHarry Boyd wrote:Adam, tubes, If left leaning in a corner at a severe angle, in a hot place, they will to about 200*, but is more expensive, and heavier than aluminum. tubing,and $8 worth of end cap and male and female screw fittings for the PVC, $17 each I buy nice aluminum tubes, black powder coated with my logo silk about them getting stolen, store them in the trunk of your car, or under website, though tube though, and would agree with you that that's too much money to pay. Adam Vigil wrote: Somemay not like the PVC for rod tubes for cane but they do perform great.A wood tube is pretty but is best suited for home storage and presentation.A $65 aluminum rod tube is great--Harry Boyd Bamboo Rods Our Church --------------E70E0BD1C0ED0D1B6CF2583A-- from LECLAIR123@aol.com Sun Mar 3 17:47:05 2002 g23Nl4800645 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 17:47:04 -0600 Subject: Re: displacing nodes Hi all, I don't know if anyone else has tried this, but I thoughtyou mite like to know this. I soaked my strips for 48 hours, then planed using aMorgan Hand Mill. I decided to take a strip all the way to finaldimension and see how much shrinkage I would get. I wiped the strip down with a towel and started planing.I took my time, around 15 minutes, to get to the final dimension.The strip seemed fairly dry by then. I took measurements at different locations and wrote them down. I came back out 24 hours later and measured again. Nochange! I came back out another 24 hours later (48hours total)and measured again. No change in my measurements. It looks to me, that the strips can't be swelling too muchwhen soaking, or shrinking much when drying. As the dimensions were the same when I paned them wet and rechecked them48 hours after drying. Just thought you mite like to know. Have a good one, Dave L. check out our new site at- flyandrodroom.com AOL site- http://hometown.aol.com/leclair123/index.html from jojo@ipa.net Sun Mar 3 17:54:45 2002 g23Nsi801451 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 17:54:44 -0600 helo=default) id 16hfoR-0000q2-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Sun, 03 Mar 2002 18:54:43 -0500 Subject: Re: displacing nodes That's interesting, Dave. In the drying tests I did, it took 26 hours to go fromcomplete saturation to original weightof a test piece. Granted, this was but a small piece, and certainly it wouldtake longer for a complete strip to dry. I know, only from observation, that the strips do swell while being soaked butnot by how much, and have no idea whathappens after that. Now you've given me something else to which I must payattention. ;o) I just today heat treated somestrips, and I know what the dimension was prior to heat treating. I'll checkthem tomorrow and see how much they mighthave shrunk. M-D Hi all,I don't know if anyone else has tried this, but I thoughtyou mite like to know this. I soaked my strips for 48 hours, then planed using aMorgan Hand Mill. I decided to take a strip all the way to finaldimension and see how much shrinkage I would get. I wiped the strip down with a towel and started planing.I took my time, around 15 minutes, to get to the final dimension.The strip seemed fairly dry by then. I took measurements atdifferent locations and wrote them down. I came back out 24 hours later and measured again. Nochange! I came back out another 24 hours later (48hours total)and measured again. No change in my measurements. It looks to me, that the strips can't be swelling too muchwhen soaking, or shrinking much when drying. As the dimensionswere the same when I paned them wet and rechecked them48 hours after drying. Just thought you mite like to know. Have a good one, Dave L. check out our new site at- flyandrodroom.com AOL site- http://hometown.aol.com/leclair123/index.html from LECLAIR123@aol.com Sun Mar 3 18:04:18 2002 g2404H802926 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 18:04:17 -0600 Subject: Re: displacing nodes In a message dated 03/03/2002 6:55:19 PM Eastern Standard Time,jojo@ipa.net writes: Yes, I think the strips will shrink some when heat treating.I rough out my strips with my power mill and then heat treat.Then I soak them prior to the final planing. I was usually taking them down to around .020" oversize and then let them dry for a day or so, before taking them to final size.I decided to take them to final size, when wet and see whatdifference, if any, it would make. What I came up with was a surprise to me. I thought the stripswould shrink, at least a little. But, from what I can tell, they didn'tshrink at all, from wet to dry. So, from now on, I will plane all the way to final dimensionswith wet strips. It will be a lot faster than what I was doing. Dave check out our new site at- flyandrodroom.com AOL site- http://hometown.aol.com/leclair123/index.html from harms1@pa.net Sun Mar 3 18:37:31 2002 g240bU807861 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 18:37:31 -0600 ,, Subject: Re: Casting Clinics Carsten, I think that's sort of what I said, wasn't it? I have a couple BelgianBrownings and I like them very much. They're good, reliable guns, andthey'll take as many birds (clay or feathered) as some of my best guns. Cheers, Bill ----- Original Message ----- ; Subject: Sv: Casting Clinics Bill I humbly disagree: The BB is per tradition not as esteemed asPurdy, Churchill and others. BUT: it is a very well made toolbuilt to last and shoots well. regards, carsten ----- Original Message -----From: WILLIAM HARMS ; Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2002 7:16 PMSubject: Re: Casting Clinics They're both just "bang-sticks," but at least the B/B is well-made. Now, a Boss, HH, Woodward, Rigby, Purdy, Fabbri--now, THOSE are some guns! cheers, Bill ----- Original Message -----From: "Tony Young" Sent: Saturday, March 02, 2002 8:01 PMSubject: Re: Casting Clinics Well, one is a gun and the other is just a bang stick. TY At 07:21 PM 3/2/02 -0500, Brian D. Creek wrote: Speaking of tradition. I used to be a teaching assistant for shooting sports in college. We had a really plain old Belgian Browning O/U skeet gun that we'd use if someone just couldn't get the hang of swinging through the bird. The balance of the gun was such that once you got it going it wanted to keep going, unlike the school's Remington 1100's. Brian----- Original Message -----From: "D.P. Van Burgel & K.J. Scott" Sent: Saturday, March 02, 2002 9:24 AMSubject: Re: Casting Clinics I haven't actually used cane for the casting part of my 15 week middle school fly fishing activity, but I'll have to this year. Two weeks ago, when the head of the local TU was showing mydozen kids the various types of fly rods out there, he'd pull each rod out of the bag and lay it on the library table in front of them... something like : an old style fiberglass, followed by an early Sage, a nice Loomis, then abeautiful Winston, each with a matching reel (single action, then large arbor, etc). BUT, when he pulled out the bamboo rod and laid it with the others, there was a collective gasp (honest to goodness) and thenuninhibited 7th and 8th grade oooos and ahhhs. Of course, the first student to recover turned to me and asked if they were going to get to try that kind of rod, too [:-)] Kat /*************************************************************************/ AV YoungVisit my web site at:"http://www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html" Yea, though I walk in the river of very shallow depth I fear no failure, My rod and my reel they comfort me. /*************************************************************************/ from harms1@pa.net Sun Mar 3 18:42:15 2002 g240gF808329 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 18:42:15 -0600 Subject: Re: displacing nodes David, I wonder what might happen if you were to pop the strip you mentioned intothe oven at 225 degrees for half an hour. It sure would be great if therewere still no change. cheers, Bill ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: displacing nodes Hi all,I don't know if anyone else has tried this, but I thoughtyou mite like to know this. I soaked my strips for 48 hours, then planed using aMorgan Hand Mill. I decided to take a strip all the way to finaldimension and see how much shrinkage I would get. I wiped the strip down with a towel and started planing.I took my time, around 15 minutes, to get to the final dimension.The strip seemed fairly dry by then. I took measurements atdifferent locations and wrote them down. I came back out 24 hours later and measured again. Nochange! I came back out another 24 hours later (48hours total)and measured again. No change in my measurements. It looks to me, that the strips can't be swelling too muchwhen soaking, or shrinking much when drying. As the dimensionswere the same when I paned them wet and rechecked them48 hours after drying. Just thought you mite like to know. Have a good one, Dave L. check out our new site at- flyandrodroom.com AOL site- http://hometown.aol.com/leclair123/index.html from bamboorules@ns.sympatico.ca Sun Mar 3 18:45:49 2002 g240jm808572 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 18:45:48 -0600 Sun, 3 Mar 2002 20:47:30 -0400 Organization: New Scotland Fly Rods Subject: Re: chat room Yeah I am,page seems slow to load then chat room can't be found,wonder if it will be up later tonight??Shawn Troutgetter@aol.com wrote: anyone having trouble getting Todd's chat room to load up?Mike Mike's Bamboo Rod ShopMontclair, CAhttp://www.mshaybamboo.gq.nu/ from bamboorules@ns.sympatico.ca Sun Mar 3 18:52:50 2002 g240qn809165 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 18:52:49 -0600 Organization: New Scotland Fly Rods Subject: Re Chatroom --------------CD144DE8D5786033E63264DE This must be why we can't getting and haven't heard from Todd, Hopeall's well in cyber-Todd- dom!Shawnhttp://www.bravenet.com/ --------------CD144DE8D5786033E63264DE Content-Base: "http://www.bravenet.com/"Content-Location: "http://www.bravenet.com/" Bravenet Web Services Service Temporarily Unavailable Dear Members and Visitors, On Saturday March 2, we detected an unauthorized breach into the Bravenet disabled outside access until we are confident that the integrity of theserver system has not been compromised. At this time, we cannot give you an exact time frame for when all serviceswill be restored to normal, as we not only are analyzing security issues, but we also want to ensure that there are no malicious filesor corrupt data on the servers when the system is round-the-clock task to review each system. Unfortuately, we expect this will take several days. While we understand that this inconveniences members and visitors alike, itis imperative that we are 100% confident that we can restore public access, and ensure normal and secure operation oncemore. We have experienced minimal data loss, but we are doing our best to recover Thank you for your understanding,we are working as fast as we can. Dave, Brad and the gang,Bravenet.com --------------CD144DE8D5786033E63264DE-- from flyfish@gbronline.com Sun Mar 3 19:09:08 2002 g24197810333 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 19:09:07 -0600 Subject: guide spacing Does anyone have a guide spacing for what I'm guessing is a 9043Granger? from KlingB@health.missouri.edu Sun Mar 3 19:10:24 2002 g241AO810505 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 19:10:24 -0600 Sun, 3 Mar 2002 19:10:18 -0600 content-class: urn:content-classes:message Subject: RE: displacing nodes Thread-Topic: displacing nodesThread-Index: AcHDDcQOczBrOy7+Eda4KABglOouXwACt6hA FILETIME=[5988C9A0:01C1C319] g241AO810506 Dave - Very interesting. At what point were the strips heat treated, if they were atall? Barry -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: displacing nodes Hi all, I don't know if anyone else has tried this, but I thoughtyou mite like to know this. I soaked my strips for 48 hours, then planed using aMorgan Hand Mill. I decided to take a strip all the way to finaldimension and see how much shrinkage I would get. I wiped the strip down with a towel and started planing.I took my time, around 15 minutes, to get to the final dimension.The strip seemed fairly dry by then. I took measurements at different locations and wrote them down. I came back out 24 hours later and measured again. Nochange! I came back out another 24 hours later (48hours total)and measured again. No change in my measurements. It looks to me, that the strips can't be swelling too muchwhen soaking, or shrinking much when drying. As the dimensions were the same when I paned them wet and rechecked them48 hours after drying. Just thought you mite like to know. Have a good one, Dave L. check out our new site at- flyandrodroom.com AOL site- http://hometown.aol.com/leclair123/index.html from KlingB@health.missouri.edu Sun Mar 3 19:10:25 2002 g241AO810507 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 19:10:24 -0600 Sun, 3 Mar 2002 19:10:20 -0600 content-class: urn:content-classes:message Subject: RE: displacing nodes Thread-Topic: displacing nodesThread-Index: AcHDECo/czBujy7+Eda4KABglOouXwACLFlg FILETIME=[5A61C480:01C1C319] g241AO810510 Tony Spezio soaks his strips before heat treating, then rough planes, binds,and dries/heat treats. I'm trying this method and I'll try to remember tomeasure and weigh some of my strips before and after soaking. It would make sense that heat treated bamboo does not change dimensionmuch (at all?) when soaked, given what we know about the effects of heattreating. I'll bet that's not true for untempered bamboo but we'll see... Barry -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: displacing nodes In a message dated 03/03/2002 6:55:19 PM Eastern Standard Time,jojo@ipa.net writes: Yes, I think the strips will shrink some when heat treating.I rough out my strips with my power mill and then heat treat.Then I soak them prior to the final planing. I was usually taking them down to around .020" oversize and then let them dry for a day or so, before taking them to final size.I decided to take them to final size, when wet and see whatdifference, if any, it would make. What I came up with was a surprise to me. I thought the stripswould shrink, at least a little. But, from what I can tell, they didn'tshrink at all, from wet to dry. So, from now on, I will plane all the way to final dimensionswith wet strips. It will be a lot faster than what I was doing. Dave check out our new site at- flyandrodroom.com AOL site- http://hometown.aol.com/leclair123/index.html from jfreeman@cyberport.com Sun Mar 3 19:17:52 2002 g241Hp811042 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 19:17:51 -0600 , Subject: Re: Casting Clinics spam. How about some American guns? Parker, LC Smith, Ithaca, etc. I've got afeatherweight Smith that shoots a lot better than I do. Jim ----- Original Message ----- ; Subject: Re: Casting Clinics They're both just "bang-sticks," but at least the B/B is well-made. Now, a Boss, HH, Woodward, Rigby, Purdy, Fabbri--now, THOSE are some guns! cheers, Bill ----- Original Message -----From: "Tony Young" Sent: Saturday, March 02, 2002 8:01 PMSubject: Re: Casting Clinics Well, one is a gun and the other is just a bang stick. TY At 07:21 PM 3/2/02 -0500, Brian D. Creek wrote: Speaking of tradition. I used to be a teaching assistant for shootingsports in college. We had a really plain old Belgian Browning O/U skeet gun that we'd use if someone just couldn't get the hang of swinging through the bird. The balance of the gun was such that once you got it going it wanted to keep going, unlike the school's Remington 1100's. Brian----- Original Message -----From: "D.P. Van Burgel & K.J. Scott" Sent: Saturday, March 02, 2002 9:24 AMSubject: Re: Casting Clinics I haven't actually used cane for the casting part of my 15 week middle school fly fishing activity, but I'll have to this year. Two weeks ago, when the head of the local TU was showing my dozen kids the various types of fly rods out there, he'd pull each rod out of the bag and lay it on the library table in front of them... something like : an old style fiberglass, followed by an early Sage, a nice Loomis, then abeautiful Winston, each with a matching reel (single action, then large arbor, etc). BUT, when he pulled out the bamboo rod and laid it with the others, there was a collective gasp (honest to goodness) and thenuninhibited 7th and 8th grade oooos and ahhhs. Of course, the first student to recover turned to me and asked if they were going to get to try that kind of rod, too [:-)] Kat /*************************************************************************/ AV YoungVisit my web site at:"http://www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html" Yea, though I walk in the river of very shallow depth I fear no failure, My rod and my reel they comfort me. /*************************************************************************/ from tedknott@cogeco.ca Sun Mar 3 19:30:26 2002 g241UP811613 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 19:30:25 -0600 ,, Subject: Re: displacing nodes Many years ago, when I first got into rod making, I measured several teststrips, baked at different temps, then re-measured when cool. I found up to10% shrinkage! Also accounted for why the butt sections were undersize inmy first couple of rods. from HalManas@aol.com Sun Mar 3 19:39:01 2002 g241d0812123 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 19:39:00 -0600 Subject: Re: Green Scott,Thanks!Hal from jsschaeffer@hotmail.com Sun Mar 3 19:42:14 2002 g241gD812362 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 19:42:13 -0600 Sun, 3 Mar 2002 17:42:04 -0800 Subject: Re: Orvis mighty-mite on ebay FILETIME=[C991FBA0:01C1C31D] I am not sure I spelled it right, but I have a question about this rod. Isthe cork reel seat mortised? Or are the slip rings slightly oversized? Wouldlove to get the reel seat diameter and I.D. ring dimensions on this type ofhandle. Other comments about the utility and longevity of this reel seatdesign would be welcome. Also, has anyone ever cast one of these? what did you think of the taper? Jeff Schaeffer from jojo@ipa.net Sun Mar 3 19:46:35 2002 g241kZ812604 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 19:46:35 -0600 helo=default) id 16hhYe-0008UD-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Sun, 03 Mar 2002 20:46:33 -0500 Subject: Re: displacing nodes In some of the testing I've done the strips were completely saturated, thenallowed to return to their original weight,then heat treated, then re- immersed in water. They achieved the exact sameweight after heat treating as they did priorto it. Now, I could only measure in grams and grains, and I suspect that whenwe say that the heat treated cane can nolonger hold as much moisture that we are applying this on a molecular level,or bound moisture. Everything I've done ona "free" moisture level shows that heat treating has no effect. What I'vedone, however, is in no way conclusive.Other testing has shown a change in measurements prior to heat treatingand afterward of: width -- 4% -5%; depth -- 2% -6%, and length -- Tony Spezio soaks his strips before heat treating, then rough planes, binds,and dries/heat treats. I'm trying thismethod and I'll try to remember to measure and weigh some of my stripsbefore and after soaking. It would make sense that heat treated bamboo does not change dimensionmuch (at all?) when soaked, given what we knowabout the effects of heat treating. I'll bet that's not true for untemperedbamboo but we'll see... Barry In a message dated 03/03/2002 6:55:19 PM Eastern Standard Time,jojo@ipa.netwrites: Yes, I think the strips will shrink some when heat treating.I rough out my strips with my power mill and then heat treat.Then I soak them prior to the final planing. I was usually taking them down to around .020" oversize andthen let them dry for a day or so, before taking them to final size.I decided to take them to final size, when wet and see whatdifference, if any, it would make. What I came up with was a surprise to me. I thought the stripswould shrink, at least a little. But, from what I can tell, they didn'tshrink at all, from wet to dry. So, from now on, I will plane all the way to final dimensionswith wet strips. It will be a lot faster than what I was doing. Dave check out our new site at- flyandrodroom.com AOL site- http://hometown.aol.com/leclair123/index.html from FISHWOOL@aol.com Sun Mar 3 19:50:02 2002 g241o2812865 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 19:50:02 -0600 Subject: RE: displacing nodes kurt.clement@flashmail.com,jojo@ipa.net, RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu Barry and Dave,I've been heat treating before soaking, then final planing and I, too, have found no shrinking after the strips dry. Of course, being an old f- -t, what do I know?Regards,Hank. from bennetts@cybermesa.com Sun Mar 3 19:50:27 2002 g241oP812922 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 19:50:25 -0600 Subject: Re: Green OK, how does this look? I always wondered about that green. My brother inlaw set up my system years ago. I'm not taken aback in the least. This list is great. First you answer myquestions, THEN you poke a little fun. Scott ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Green Scott, This happens every time someone uses a colored background for their postings, so don't be too taken aback by it. ;o) from jojo@ipa.net Sun Mar 3 20:07:35 2002 g2427Z813563 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 20:07:35 -0600 helo=default) id 16hht0-0003gw-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Sun, 03 Mar 2002 21:07:34 -0500 Subject: RE: displacing nodes Dave, Hank, et al Given the contemporary thought that it is the moisture in the cane that setsup the conditions conducive to rods takinga set, not being as stiff, etc. do you guys who heat treat, then soak andplane, notice any adverse effects in yourrods? M-D Barry and Dave,I've been heat treating before soaking, then final planing and I, too,have found no shrinking after the strips dry. Of course, being an old f-- t,what do I know?Regards,Hank. from bdcbfr@chartermi.net Sun Mar 3 20:12:02 2002 g242C2813831 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 20:12:02 -0600 g242FCL08934; Subject: Re: Re Chatroom Bravenet Web ServicesDon't know if it is the reason, but it's been =snowing over here in west Michigan like mad. Cable went out for a =while. Maybe the chat room is having a snow day. Brian This must be why we can't getting and haven't heard from Todd, Hopeall's well in cyber-Todd- dom!Shawnhttp://www.bravenet.com/ -------------------------------------------------------------------------=----- Dear Members and Visitors, On Saturday March 2, we detected an unauthorized =breach into the Bravenet server system. As a result, we have temporaily =disabled outside access until we are confident that the integrity of the =server system has not been compromised. At this time, we cannot give you an exact time frame = analyzing security issues, but we also want to ensure that there are no =malicious files or corrupt data on the servers when the system is =restored. As our server network is very large, it will be an enormous, =round-the-clock task to review each system. Unfortuately, we expect this =will take several days. While we understand that this inconveniences members =and visitors alike, it is imperative that we are 100% confident that we =can restore public access, and ensure normal and secure operation once =more. We have experienced minimal data loss, but we are =doing our best to recover as much as we possibly can. We have put =together a page of common questions and a way to contact us here: FAQ =and Contact Page Thank you for your understanding,we are working as fast as we can. Dave, Brad and the gang,Bravenet.com Bravenet Web Services Don't know if it is the reason, but = Brian ----- Original Message ----- Shawn Pineo = Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2002 = PMSubject: Re Chatroom This must be why we can't getting and haven't heard = =cyber-Todd- Shawnhttp://www.bravenet.com/ Service Temporarily = Dear Members and = Saturday March 2, we detected an unauthorized breach = temporaily disabled outside access until we are = that the integrity of the server system has not been = compromised.At this time, we cannot give you = exact time frame for when all services will be = normal, as we not only are analyzing security = also want to ensure that there are no malicious = be an enormous, round-the-clock task to review each = days.While we understand that this = members and visitors alike, it is imperative that we = 100% confident that we can restore public access, = normal and secure operation once more.We = experienced minimal data loss, but we are doing our = together a page of common questions and a way to = PageThank you for your = working as fast as we can.Dave, Brad and the = =gang,Bravenet.com from bdcbfr@chartermi.net Sun Mar 3 20:17:45 2002 g242Hi814163 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 20:17:44 -0600 g242KuL09135; Subject: Re: displacing nodes SOAK FIRST -- Then do the nodes -- rough plane -- and THEN heat 'em up. And I put the finished strips in the oven at 150 F or so for a while beforeI go to glue up now. What I usually do is turn the oven on, let it heat up,put the strips in, wait for the thing to stabilize again, unplug the ovenand go to bed. Then I glue the nest day. Seems to help where set isinvolved. Brian ----- Original Message ----- Subject: RE: displacing nodes Dave, Hank, et al Given the contemporary thought that it is the moisture in the cane that sets up the conditions conducive to rods taking a set, not being as stiff, etc. do you guys who heat treat, then soak and plane, notice any adverse effects in your rods? M-D From: Barry and Dave,I've been heat treating before soaking, then final planing and I, too, have found no shrinking after the strips dry. Of course, being an old f--t, what do I know?Regards,Hank. from Troutgetter@aol.com Sun Mar 3 20:18:23 2002 g242IM814264 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 20:18:22 -0600 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 21:18:12 -0500 Subject: Fwd: PVC rod tubes? Oh Yea! Mike's Bamboo Rod ShopMontclair, CAhttp://www.mshaybamboo.gq.nu/ Full-name: Troutgetter Subject: Re: PVC rod tubes? Oh Yea! Hi Shawn,Thanks for the info about Bravenet.I would normally agree with Harry about $65.00 being to much for analuminum tube.However, they come with a solid machined brass cap, collar and bottom, and really have a great "heft" to them and when the tube is anodized bronze and include engraving on the cap and suddenly ... whola!(sp?) If a customer wants to shell out the extra cash for this tube, I won't argue much, and then I'll recommend he buy one of Shawn's rod tube bags and sell that to the guy too! Because he's gonna need it! But they DO look classy! (I think!)Mike Shay In a message dated 3/3/2002 3:41:30 PM Pacific Standard Time, bamboorules@ns.sympatico.ca writes: HMMMMM, I can see a point here, I thought I was getting carried away when I started making a Nova Scotia Tartan rod bag AND aNova Scotia Tartan bag for the $100+ aluminum rod tubes I use. I agree $100 is allot for a rod tube, just crazy I guess, oh by the way those ones are almost bomb proof! Shawn Mike's Bamboo Rod ShopMontclair, CAhttp://www.mshaybamboo.gq.nu/ Hi Shawn,Thanks for the info about Bravenet.I would normally agree with Harry about $65.00 being to much for analuminum tube.However, they come with a solid machined brass cap, collar and bottom, andreally have a great "heft" to them and when the tube is anodized bronze andinclude engraving on the cap and suddenly ... whola!(sp?) If a customer wantsto shell out the extra cash for this tube, I won't argue much, and then I'llrecommend he buy one of Shawn's rod tube bags and sell that to the guy too!Because he's gonna need it! But they DO look classy! (I think!)Mike Shay In a message dated 3/3/2002 3:41:30 PM Pacific Standard Time,bamboorules@ns.sympatico.ca writes: HMMMMM, see a point here, I thought I was getting carried away when I started makinga Nova Scotia Tartan rod bag AND a Nova Scotia Tartanbag for the $100+ aluminum rod tubes I use. is allot for a rod tube, just crazy I guess, oh by the way those ones arealmost bomb proof! Mike's Bamboo Rod ShopMontclair, CAhttp://www.mshaybamboo.gq.nu/ from bdcbfr@chartermi.net Sun Mar 3 20:20:24 2002 g242KN814587 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 20:20:23 -0600 g242NZL09228; Subject: Re: displacing nodes Sorry, didn't read Hank's post. But he's an old farmer and a Virginian.He's can't be expected to follow conventions. And he builds nice fly rods,too. Brian ----- Original Message ----- Subject: RE: displacing nodes Dave, Hank, et al Given the contemporary thought that it is the moisture in the cane that sets up the conditions conducive to rods taking a set, not being as stiff, etc. do you guys who heat treat, then soak and plane, notice any adverse effects in your rods? M-D From: Barry and Dave,I've been heat treating before soaking, then final planing and I, too, have found no shrinking after the strips dry. Of course, being an old f--t, what do I know?Regards,Hank. from Grnmtrds@aol.com Sun Mar 3 20:30:02 2002 g242U1815076 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 20:30:01 -0600 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 21:29:53 -0500 Subject: GREEN Remember, If you ain't handsome you got to be handy. Red Green from jojo@ipa.net Sun Mar 3 20:35:53 2002 g242Zr815457 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 20:35:53 -0600 helo=default) id 16hiKN-0006Ad-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Sun, 03 Mar 2002 21:35:51 -0500 Subject: Re: GREEN Hmmm, and some of us are both. M-D Remember, If you ain't handsome you got to be handy. Red Green from tjtrodmaker@yahoo.com Sun Mar 3 20:50:18 2002 g242oI815950 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 20:50:18 -0600 Sun, 03 Mar 2002 18:50:17 PST Subject: florida letme hear from you. what's been going on? timothy ====="Gooda' mornin', mister bear!" ...Ride, boldly ride,"The shade replied, -"If you seek for Eldorado!" -- E.A.Poe __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Sports - sign up for Fantasy Baseballhttp://sports.yahoo.com from TSmithwick@aol.com Sun Mar 3 20:58:16 2002 g242wF816294 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 20:58:15 -0600 Subject: Re: Orvis mighty-mite on ebay In a message dated 3/4/2 1:42:45 AM, jsschaeffer@hotmail.com writes: I have only cast one of them. It was a straight line taper and was too stiff at the tip. I think it was really a spin rod taper with a fly rod grip installed. I used the taper as the basis for the 5 1/2' taper at the rodmakers site. I stretched it 6 inches and revised the tip to somethingmore suitable for a fly rod. A lot of people like it. To be fair, I have heard of Mighty Mites that cast well, so I suspect the folks at Orvis tended to use what was available for a blank when making this rod. from jojo@ipa.net Sun Mar 3 21:01:03 2002 g24313816559 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 21:01:03 -0600 helo=default) id 16hiik-0000ha-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Sun, 03 Mar 2002 22:01:02 -0500 Subject: Re: florida Timothy, Could you be a little less cryptic? M-D letme hear from you. what's been going on? timothy ====="Gooda' mornin', mister bear!" ...Ride, boldly ride,"The shade replied, -"If you seek for Eldorado!" -- E.A.Poe from ttalsma@macatawa.org Sun Mar 3 21:13:21 2002 g243DJ818271 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 21:13:19 -0600 Subject: Chat room at the Bamboo Tips Archive. All, I just found out that there was a server breach detected at the companywhere the chat room is hosted. I'm not sure when their server will beback up, but I'll let everyone know. DANG!!!! And I was staying up toget in there tonight. Sorry for any problems that this has caused anyone. Let's shoot forWednesday night like Bob Maulucci suggested. --Todd Talsma8412 North Maple CourtZeeland MI 49464------ web design business home: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo Rodmaking Tips site: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo/Bamboo Rodmaking Sources site:http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo_Sources/home page: http://external.sligh.com/~toddt/index.htmgenealogy home page: Under Construction from rextutor@yahoo.com Sun Mar 3 21:17:24 2002 g243HO818625 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 21:17:24 -0600 03 Mar 2002 19:17:23 PST Subject: Re: Chat room at the Bamboo Tips Archive. "rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu" What time Wednesday ?TIA--- Todd Talsma wrote: All, I just found out that there was a server breachdetected at the companywhere the chat room is hosted. I'm not sure whentheir server will beback up, but I'll let everyone know. DANG!!!! AndI was staying up toget in there tonight. Sorry for any problems that this has caused anyone. Let's shoot forWednesday night like Bob Maulucci suggested. --Todd Talsma8412 North Maple CourtZeeland MI 49464------ web design business home: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo Rodmaking Tips site: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo/Bamboo Rodmaking Sources site:http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo_Sources/home page: http://external.sligh.com/~toddt/index.htmgenealogy home page: Under Construction __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Sports - sign up for Fantasy Baseballhttp://sports.yahoo.com from dybam@oct.net Sun Mar 3 21:26:32 2002 g243QW819090 for ; Sun, 3 Mar 2002 21:26:32 -0600 Subject: Re: displacing nodes Communications, Inc. Dave,Are the strips that much easier to plane when wet?Also is there lessproblems with chinking and gouging of the strips?Mark----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: displacing nodes Hi all,I don't know if anyone else has tried this, but I thoughtyou mite like to know this. I soaked my strips for 48 hours, then planed using aMorgan Hand Mill. I decided to take a strip all the way to finaldimension and see how much shrinkage I would get. I wiped the strip down with a towel and started planing.I took my time, around 15 minutes, to get to the final dimension.The strip seemed fairly dry by then. I took measurements atdifferent locations and wrote them down. I came back out 24 hours later and measured again. Nochange! I came back out another 24 hours later (48hours total)and measured again. No change in my measurements. It looks to me, that the strips can't be swelling too muchwhen soaking, or shrinking much when drying. As the dimensionswere the same when I paned them wet and rechecked them48 hours after drying. Just thought you mite like to know. Have a good one, Dave L. check out our new site at- flyandrodroom.com AOL site- http://hometown.aol.com/leclair123/index.html from ajthramer@hotmail.com Mon Mar 4 02:23:20 2002 g248NJ824755 for ; Mon, 4 Mar 2002 02:23:19 -0600 Mon, 4 Mar 2002 00:23:13 -0800 Mon, 04 Mar 2002 08:23:13 GMT dpvbkjs@somtel.com, rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Re: Casting Clinics FILETIME=[D3F379B0:01C1C355] Hmmm , pretty fond of my Berreta O/U. It did cost more than my beat up old truck so you know that I have my priorities [:)] A.J. From: "WILLIAM HARMS" , Subject: Re: Casting ClinicsDate: Sun, 3 Mar 2002 13:16:40 -0500 They're both just "bang-sticks," but at least the B/B is well-made. Now, aBoss, HH, Woodward, Rigby, Purdy, Fabbri--now, THOSE are some guns! cheers, Bill ----- Original Message -----From: "Tony Young" Sent: Saturday, March 02, 2002 8:01 PMSubject: Re: Casting Clinics Well, one is a gun and the other is just a bang stick. TY At 07:21 PM 3/2/02 -0500, Brian D. Creek wrote: Speaking of tradition. I used to be a teaching assistant for shootingsports in college. We had a really plain old Belgian Browning O/U skeetgun that we'd use if someone just couldn't get the hang of swinging through the bird. The balance of the gun was such that once you got it going it wanted to keep going, unlike the school's Remington 1100's. Brian----- Original Message -----From: "D.P. Van Burgel & K.J. Scott" Sent: Saturday, March 02, 2002 9:24 AMSubject: Re: Casting Clinics I haven't actually used cane for the casting part of my 15 week middle school fly fishing activity, but I'll have to this year. Two weeks ago, when the head of the local TU was showing my dozen kidsthe various types of fly rods out there, he'd pull each rod out of the bagand lay it on the library table in front of them... something like : an old style fiberglass, followed by an early Sage, a nice Loomis, then abeautiful Winston, each with a matching reel (single action, then large arbor, etc). BUT, when he pulled out the bamboo rod and laid it withthe others, there was a collective gasp (honest to goodness) and thenuninhibited 7th and 8th grade oooos and ahhhs. Of course, the first student to recover turned to me and asked if they were going to get to try that kind of rod, too [:-)] Kat /*************************************************************************/ AV YoungVisit my web site at:"http://www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html" Yea, though I walk in the river of very shallow depth I fear no failure, My rod and my reel they comfort me. /*************************************************************************/ _________________________________________________________________Join the world's largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com from petermckean@netspace.net.au Mon Mar 4 04:33:12 2002 g24AXB825977 for ; Mon, 4 Mar 2002 04:33:11 -0600 g24AWqH65595; Subject: Re: Double Taper Dennis In those days, there were giants upon the earth. Peter from petermckean@netspace.net.au Mon Mar 4 04:50:53 2002 g24Aop826314 for ; Mon, 4 Mar 2002 04:50:51 -0600 g24Aogt69746; Subject: Re: Casting Clinics Bill I shoot quail and ducks, and occasionally partridge, with a Nitro- proofedDamascus-barrelled Stephen Grant best London sidelock ejector. It was left to me years ago by a good old friend, who bought it in the UKwhen he was there during WW2; he flew a Lancaster for the famous "DamBuster" squadron of the RAF. It is a gun of amazing quality, and is an absolute delight to shoot. Thereis a point here, though, that is worth making apropos bamboo rods. I shot pretty serious trap, including Olympic Trench, for some years, and Iwas pretty good at it too. None of your wussy Vandalia stuff![:-)] I would no more have dreamed of trying to do it with the Grant than Iwould have thought of riding bare-arsed to Bourke on a razor blade. Horses for courses. Same with fishing rods. Peter from petermckean@netspace.net.au Mon Mar 4 04:56:04 2002 g24Au3826560 for ; Mon, 4 Mar 2002 04:56:03 -0600 g24Atst70845; Subject: Re: Casting Clinics In defense of the Browning, in all grades - I know trapshooters who ahve putover a quarter of a million trap shells through an A-grade Browning, and whocannot recall ever having had a malfunction called against them because ofthe gun. You could never call them classy, although in the higher grades they areflashy enough, but Heavens ,they do shoot well! Peter from horsesho@ptd.net Mon Mar 4 05:09:13 2002 g24B9D826899 for ; Mon, 4 Mar 2002 05:09:13 -0600 by uid 50002 with qmail-scanner-1.10 (uvscan: v4.1.60/v4187. .Clear:0. Processed in 0.554274 secs); 04 Mar 2002 11:05:45 -0000 sender ) User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:0.9.4)Gecko/20011019 Netscape6/6.2 Subject: Re: Orvis mighty-mite on ebay Hi Tom, I have a Mitey Mite but mine is marked for a #4 line. I like it but rather than a midge rod it's more a midget trout rod. Need some line out to get it to cast properly. I always thought the taper was a spin rod taper but after miking Orvis's 5' Superlight spin I found out the Mitey Mite is MUCH lighter. I also have an Orvis 5'9" Ultralight Fly rod that is a much nicer rod. Interestingly that rod is the marriage of a Mitey Mite butt section and a 61/2' Deluxe tip section. Nice rod!.Best, Marty TSmithwick@aol.com wrote: In a message dated 3/4/2 1:42:45 AM, jsschaeffer@hotmail.com writes: I have only cast one of them. It was a straight line taper and was too stiff at the tip. I think it was really a spin rod taper with a fly rod grip installed. I used the taper as the basis for the 5 1/2' taper at the rodmakers site. I stretched it 6 inches and revised the tip to somethingmore suitable for a fly rod. A lot of people like it. To be fair, I have heard of Mighty Mites that cast well, so I suspect the folks at Orvis tended to use what was available for a blank when making this rod. from petermckean@netspace.net.au Mon Mar 4 05:10:03 2002 g24BA1827057 for ; Mon, 4 Mar 2002 05:10:02 -0600 g24B9t373590; Subject: Re: chat room me too peter from horsesho@ptd.net Mon Mar 4 05:22:22 2002 g24BMM827479 for ; Mon, 4 Mar 2002 05:22:22 -0600 by uid 50002 with qmail-scanner-1.10 (uvscan: v4.1.60/v4187. .Clear:0. Processed in 0.874734 secs); 04 Mar 2002 11:22:21 -0000 sender ) User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:0.9.4)Gecko/20011019 Netscape6/6.2 Subject: Re: Orvis mighty-mite on ebay Jeff, Grip length 4 1/4", Seat 3 1/4" and is mortied eliptically, Slide ring ID .700 +or-. Grip tapers from the blank (Philippe style) to .975" at the center point to .800 at the end. A short fat grip. Marty Jeff Schaeffer wrote: I am not sure I spelled it right, but I have a question about this rod. Isthe cork reel seat mortised? Or are the slip rings slightly oversized? Wouldlove to get the reel seat diameter and I.D. ring dimensions on this type ofhandle. Other comments about the utility and longevity of this reel seatdesign would be welcome. Also, has anyone ever cast one of these? what did you think of the taper? Jeff Schaeffer from dnorl@qwest.net Mon Mar 4 06:03:56 2002 g24C3t828126 for ; Mon, 4 Mar 2002 06:03:55 -0600 (63.228.45.135) bdcbfr@chartermi.net, dpvbkjs@somtel.com, rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Re: Casting Clinics I have a 16 ga. side by side Gustaf Genchow that I have shot for 45 years.double triggers, splinter fore-end straight stock.Be lost without it.If God wanted you to shot over and unders he'd have stacked your eyes.----- Original Message----- ; bdcbfr@chartermi.net ;dpvbkjs@somtel.com ; rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Subject: Re: Casting Clinics Hmmm , pretty fond of my Berreta O/U. It did cost more than my beat upoldtruck so you know that I have my priorities [:)] A.J. From: "WILLIAM HARMS" , Subject: Re: Casting ClinicsDate: Sun, 3 Mar 2002 13:16:40 -0500 They're both just "bang-sticks," but at least the B/B is well-made. Now, a Boss, HH, Woodward, Rigby, Purdy, Fabbri--now, THOSE are some guns! cheers, Bill ----- Original Message -----From: "Tony Young" Sent: Saturday, March 02, 2002 8:01 PMSubject: Re: Casting Clinics Well, one is a gun and the other is just a bang stick. TY At 07:21 PM 3/2/02 -0500, Brian D. Creek wrote: Speaking of tradition. I used to be a teaching assistant for shootingsports in college. We had a really plain old Belgian Browning O/U skeetgun that we'd use if someone just couldn't get the hang of swinging through the bird. The balance of the gun was such that once you got it going it wanted to keep going, unlike the school's Remington 1100's. Brian----- Original Message -----From: "D.P. Van Burgel & K.J. Scott" Sent: Saturday, March 02, 2002 9:24 AMSubject: Re: Casting Clinics I haven't actually used cane for the casting part of my 15 week middle school fly fishing activity, but I'll have to this year. Two weeks ago, when the head of the local TU was showing mydozen kidsthe various types of fly rods out there, he'd pull each rod out of the bagand lay it on the library table in front of them... something like : an old style fiberglass, followed by an early Sage, a nice Loomis, then abeautiful Winston, each with a matching reel (single action, then large arbor, etc). BUT, when he pulled out the bamboo rod and laid it withthe others, there was a collective gasp (honest to goodness) and thenuninhibited 7th and 8th grade oooos and ahhhs. Of course, the first student to recover turned to me and asked if they were going to get to try that kind of rod, too [:-)] Kat /************************************************************************* / AV YoungVisit my web site at:"http://www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html" Yea, though I walk in the river of very shallow depth I fear no failure, My rod and my reel they comfort me. /************************************************************************* / _________________________________________________________________Join the world's largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail.http://www.hotmail.com from ttalsma@macatawa.org Mon Mar 4 07:22:44 2002 g24DMh829530 for ; Mon, 4 Mar 2002 07:22:43 -0600 id ; Mon, 4 Mar 2002 08:15:30 -0500 id F563CF74; Mon, 4 Mar 2002 08:15:24 -0500 Subject: Re: Chat room at the Bamboo Tips Archive. Rex, I think (Bob M. correct me here) that it was going to be at 10:00 pmEastern time. I'm going to be looking at some alternatives to the chat service, justto get us through the meantime. Rex Tutor wrote: What time Wednesday ?TIA--- Todd Talsma wrote: All, I just found out that there was a server breachdetected at the companywhere the chat room is hosted. I'm not sure whentheir server will beback up, but I'll let everyone know. DANG!!!! AndI was staying up toget in there tonight. Sorry for any problems that this has caused anyone.Let's shoot forWednesday night like Bob Maulucci suggested. --Todd Talsma8412 North Maple CourtZeeland MI 49464------ web design business home:http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo Rodmaking Tips site:http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo/Bamboo Rodmaking Sources site:http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo_Sources/home page:http://external.sligh.com/~toddt/index.htmgenealogy home page: Under Construction __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Sports - sign up for Fantasy Baseballhttp://sports.yahoo.com -- Todd Talsma 8412 North Maple Court Zeeland MI 49464 ------ email: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/ Bamboo Tips site:http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo/ Bamboo Sources site:http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo_Sources/ home page:http://external.sligh.com/~toddt/ genealogy pages: Under construction from FISHWOOL@aol.com Mon Mar 4 07:41:00 2002 Received: from imo- g24Df0800331 for ; Mon, 4 Mar 2002 m06.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v32.5.) id 1.172.47af1f1 (3702); Mon, 4 Mar Date: Mon, 4 Mar 2002 08:40:45 EST FISHWOOL@aol.com Sender: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu X- Listprocessor-Version: 8.2.09/990901/11:28 -- ListProc(tm) by CREN Daveand Bill, I've been heating strips at 225 deg. F. for 30 min., then 325 deg. F. , ,References: Subject: Re: Casting rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu X-Listprocessor- Version:8.2.09/990901/11:28 -- ListProc(tm) by CREN Jim. Parker built somebeautiful guns, but nearly all are extremely heavy for field use--with hugebeavertails and pistol grips. They were all reliable guns, but nowadays areabsolutely wildly overpriced. Very, very few of even the best Parkers wereas nicely fit and finished (particularly the barrels) as an ordinary Birminghamor London SxS. Same thing with L.C. Smith, Fox and Ithaca Lefever guns.None of these latter makers gained the reputation of the Parkers, eventhough there has never been a good reason for that. (In fact, Foxes built upto 1915 or so, may have been better than the Parkers). Fox guns are utterlyreliable, as are the NIDs, while the LC Smiths can sometimes be a littlequirky, and all but the NIDs offered beautiful custom work. If you can find anAmerican gun in 16 or 20 guage with 26-28 inch barrels with splinter forendand straight grip (one that's not "doglegged" with excessive drop), you'll verylikely have a superb upland game gun. American gunmakers sought adifferent clientele with different shooting habits from those in England andEurope, and the guns, of course, reflect that. American guns run the gamut from Edsels to Eldorados, while English guns typically run the gamut fromAustin Healys to Aston-Martins. That said, there's not a reason in the worldto think that a really nice American gun won't serve you every bit as well inall respects as a "London best." Just as a nice Granger may suit you everybit as well as the finest Garrison, Payne, Dickerson and so forth. (Had tokeep this thread about fly rods). Cheers, Bill ----- Original Message ----- From: ; ; ;Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2002 9:06 PMSubject: Re: Casting Clinics How about some American guns? Parker, LC Smith, Ithaca, etc. I've got afeatherweight Smith that shoots a lot better than I do. Jim ----- Original Message -----From: "WILLIAM HARMS" ; Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2002 10:16 AMSubject: Re: Casting Clinics They're both just "bang-sticks," but at least the B/B is well-made. Now, a Boss, HH, Woodward, Rigby, Purdy, Fabbri--now, THOSE are some guns! cheers, Bill ----- Original Message -----From: "Tony Young" Sent: Saturday, March 02, 2002 8:01 PMSubject: Re: Casting Clinics Well, one is a gun and the other is just a bang stick. TY At 07:21 PM 3/2/02 -0500, Brian D. Creek wrote: Speaking of tradition. I used to be a teaching assistant for shooting sports in college. We had a really plain old Belgian Browning O/U skeet gun that we'd use if someone just couldn't get the hang of swinging through the bird. The balance of the gun was such that once you got it going it wanted to keep going, unlike the school's Remington 1100's. Brian----- Original Message -----From: "D.P. Van Burgel & K.J. Scott" Sent: Saturday, March 02, 2002 9:24 AMSubject: Re: Casting Clinics I haven't actually used cane for the casting part of my 15 week middle school fly fishing activity, but I'll have to this year. Two weeks ago, when the head of the local TU was showing mydozen kids the various types of fly rods out there, he'd pull each rod out of the bag and lay it on the library table in front of them... something like : an old style fiberglass, followed by an early Sage, a nice Loomis, then abeautiful Winston, each with a matching reel (single action, then large arbor, etc). BUT, when he pulled out the bamboo rod and laid it with the others, there was a collective gasp (honest to goodness) and thenuninhibited 7th and 8th grade oooos and ahhhs. Of course, the first student to recover turned to me and asked if they were going to get to try that kind of rod, too [:-)] Kat /*************************************************************************/ AV YoungVisit my web site at:"http://www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html" Yea, though I walk in the river of very shallow depth I fear no failure, My rod and my reel they comfort me. /*************************************************************************/ from harms1@pa.net Mon Mar 4 09:01:07 2002 g24F16803984 for ; Mon, 4 Mar 2002 09:01:06 -0600 Subject: Re: Casting Clinics Amen! And you can still have a custom-built O/U built for you in Belgium,if you feel like spending the cash. Even so, the tag will be about half thecost of a fine Boss. cheers, Bill ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Casting Clinics In defense of the Browning, in all grades - I know trapshooters who ahve put over a quarter of a million trap shells through an A-grade Browning, and who cannot recall ever having had a malfunction called against them because of the gun. You could never call them classy, although in the higher grades they areflashy enough, but Heavens ,they do shoot well! Peter from harms1@pa.net Mon Mar 4 09:06:13 2002 g24F6C804527 for ; Mon, 4 Mar 2002 09:06:13 -0600 , , Subject: Re: Casting Clinics I agree. Ain't nothing like a fine, little SxS for quick handling in thefield and drop-dead class! Clay targets are a different matter, but I stillprefer my SxS, just 'cause I like 'em. cheers, Bill ----- Original Message ----- ; ; Subject: Re: Casting Clinics I have a 16 ga. side by side Gustaf Genchow that I have shot for 45 years.double triggers, splinter fore-end straight stock.Be lost without it.If God wanted you to shot over and unders he'd have stacked your eyes.----- Original Message-----From: Allen Thramer ; bdcbfr@chartermi.net ;dpvbkjs@somtel.com ;rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Date: Monday, March 04, 2002 2:24 AMSubject: Re: Casting Clinics Hmmm , pretty fond of my Berreta O/U. It did cost more than my beat up old truck so you know that I have my priorities [:)] A.J. From: "WILLIAM HARMS" , Subject: Re: Casting ClinicsDate: Sun, 3 Mar 2002 13:16:40 -0500 They're both just "bang-sticks," but at least the B/B is well-made. Now, a Boss, HH, Woodward, Rigby, Purdy, Fabbri--now, THOSE are some guns! cheers, Bill ----- Original Message -----From: "Tony Young" Sent: Saturday, March 02, 2002 8:01 PMSubject: Re: Casting Clinics Well, one is a gun and the other is just a bang stick. TY At 07:21 PM 3/2/02 -0500, Brian D. Creek wrote: Speaking of tradition. I used to be a teaching assistant for shooting sports in college. We had a really plain old Belgian Browning O/U skeetgun that we'd use if someone just couldn't get the hang of swinging through the bird. The balance of the gun was such that once you got it going it wanted to keep going, unlike the school's Remington 1100's. Brian----- Original Message -----From: "D.P. Van Burgel & K.J. Scott" Sent: Saturday, March 02, 2002 9:24 AMSubject: Re: Casting Clinics I haven't actually used cane for the casting part of my 15 week middle school fly fishing activity, but I'll have to this year. Two weeks ago, when the head of the local TU was showing mydozen kidsthe various types of fly rods out there, he'd pull each rod out of the bagand lay it on the library table in front of them... something like : an old style fiberglass, followed by an early Sage, a nice Loomis, then a beautiful Winston, each with a matching reel (single action, then large arbor, etc). BUT, when he pulled out the bamboo rod and laid it withthe others, there was a collective gasp (honest to goodness) and thenuninhibited 7th and 8th grade oooos and ahhhs. Of course, the first student to recover turned to me and asked if they were going to get to try that kind of rod, too [:-)] Kat /************************************************************************* / AV YoungVisit my web site at:"http://www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html" Yea, though I walk in the river of very shallow depth I fear no failure, My rod and my reel they comfort me. /************************************************************************* / _________________________________________________________________Join the world's largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail.http://www.hotmail.com from patrick.w.coffey@boeing.com Mon Mar 4 09:55:37 2002 g24Ftb809173 for ; Mon, 4 Mar 2002 09:55:37 -0600 JAA02946 for ; Mon, 4 Mar 2002 09:55:36 -0600 HAA01954 for ; Mon, 4 Mar 2002 07:55:35 -0800 g24Ftt108470 for ; Mon, 4 Mar 2002 07:55:55 -0800 (5.5.2650.21) id ; Mon, 4 Mar 2002 07:55:28 -0800 Subject: crud mail today I started getting x rated email here at work, I guess it's my turnnow! How do I get off their email list? Have windows 200 and MS outlook foremail. Patrick W. CoffeyAOG Incident Repair PlanningPhone: 425-234-2901Fax: 425-237-0083M-2112 M/C 61-79 from KyleDruey@aol.com Mon Mar 4 09:56:37 2002 g24Fua809306 for ; Mon, 4 Mar 2002 09:56:36 -0600 for ; Mon, 4 Mar 2002 10:56:15 -0500 0304105615; Mon, 04 Mar 2002 10:56:15 -0500 Subject: Garrison Reel Seat List, Can the cap be glued directly to a cork reel seat on a Garrison style all corkcap and ring reel seat? Any other insights needed when building this style ofreel seat? Thanks for your help, Kyle from wlwalter77us@yahoo.com Mon Mar 4 10:35:50 2002 g24GZo812103 for ; Mon, 4 Mar 2002 10:35:50 -0600 Mon, 04 Mar 2002 08:35:49 PST Subject: Re: displacing nodes RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu Dave, at 48 hours, its likely that the strip isn'tgetting soaked all the way through and planning tofinal actually takes you past the soaked cane intomostly dry. This is good to know. Perhaps soaking for3 to 4 days for handmill users is not in our bestinterest. When doing the final planning I don't soak,only soak when I'm roughing, but I'm starting torethink this based on what you've learned. Bill W. --- LECLAIR123@aol.com wrote: Hi all, I don't know if anyone else hastried this, but I thoughtyou mite like to know this. I soaked my strips for 48 hours,then planed using aMorgan Hand Mill. I decided to take a strip allthe way to finaldimension and see how much shrinkage I would get. I wiped the strip down with a toweland started planing.I took my time, around 15 minutes, to get to thefinal dimension.The strip seemed fairly dry by then. I tookmeasurements at different locations and wrote them down. I came back out 24 hours later andmeasured again. Nochange! I came back out another 24 hours later(48hours total)and measured again. No change in mymeasurements. It looks to me, that the strips can'tbe swelling too muchwhen soaking, or shrinking much when drying. Asthe dimensions were the same when I paned them wet and recheckedthem48 hours after drying. Just thought you mite like to know. Have a good one, Dave L. check out our new site at- flyandrodroom.com AOL site-http://hometown.aol.com/leclair123/index.html __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Sports - sign up for Fantasy Baseballhttp://sports.yahoo.com from Troy.Miller@BakerOilTools.com Mon Mar 4 13:47:04 2002 g24Jl4822883 for ; Mon, 4 Mar 2002 13:47:04 -0600 (bhihdcimc01.bakerhughes.com [204.253.245.34] (may be forged)) (5.5.2653.19) id ; Mon, 4 Mar 2002 12:10:02 -0600 Subject: RE: Casting Clinics Yep, I was a little apprehensive about it at first, but I just stood rightnext to the student casting it the ENTIRE time. This is my baby.... I am thinking that I might need to make about six "no frills" rods, that arenice, but with an easy-casting taper. I would dedicate these rods tocasting classes, and not worry too much about the extreme fine cosmetics.It would also be a good way to make lots of rods and not get hung up on eachone being the ultimate. Any good advice? Gotta get me a beveller made.....TAM -----Original Message----- rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Re: RE: Casting Clinics To all.Using a moderate action cane rod in a beginners' casting clinic makesall the difference over a graphite (you'll excuse the word). The student "feels" the rod action more readily. My wife doesn't like to see me use my cane rods Regards,Hank. from fiveside@net-gate.com Mon Mar 4 14:35:25 2002 g24KZP826543 for ; Mon, 4 Mar 2002 14:35:25 -0600 Subject: Off The Subject To the List?While we are off the subject, I've used a matched set of 12 and 20 Ga. =Model 12's for over 50 years and see no need to change. Over that period =I've enjoyed the company of 8 black Labs and again see no need to =change. Bill To the List? matched set of 12 and 20 Ga. Model 12's for over 50 years and see no = change. Over that period I've enjoyed the company of 8 black Labs and = from rcurry@ttlc.net Mon Mar 4 15:00:44 2002 g24L0h828619 for ; Mon, 4 Mar 2002 15:00:43 -0600 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:0.9.4)Gecko/20011019 Netscape6/6.2 Subject: Feb Overmywaders Contest Winner Gerald Johnson of Laramie, WY won the RushRiverRods NS rod hardware. Thanks to Tony Larson for contributing the prize. The correct answer to "Who wrote of the Golden Witch streamer fly that it is "Strictly for decorating ladies' hats or possibly mens' hats, etc.."? is George Leonard Herter. He wrote this in his "Professional Fly Thing, Spinning and Tackle Making Manual".-- Best regards, Reed http://www.overmywaders.com/ >Fromrcurry@ttlc.net Mon Mar 4 15:16:52 2002 Received: from mail.ttlc.net 16:20:58 -0500 From: Reed Curry User-Agent:Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:0.9.4) Gecko/20011019 , rod Subject: Re: Feb Overmywaders Contest Winner References: 8.2.09/990901/11:28 -- ListProc(tm) by CREN Oops! That's "Fly Tying". Bestregards, Reed http://www.overmywaders.com/ Miller, Troy wrote: Is that the name of the book? Professional Fly Thing? That is a prettystrange title.... -----Original Message----- Sent: Monday, March 04, 2002 3:05 PM Subject: Feb Overmywaders Contest Winner Gerald Johnson of Laramie, WY won the RushRiverRods NS rod hardware. Thanks to Tony Larson for contributing the prize. The correct answer to "Who wrote of the Golden Witch streamer fly that it is "Strictly for decorating ladies' hats or possibly mens' hats, etc.."? is George Leonard Herter. He wrote this in his "Professional Fly Thing, Spinning and Tackle Making Manual". -- > from bob@downandacross.com Mon Mar 4 15:17:41 2002 Received: from g24LHe801896 for ; Mon, 4 Mar 2002 From: "Bob Maulucci" Subject: RE: Garrison Reel Seat Date: Mon, 4Mar 2002 16:17:19 -0500 Message-ID: Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Importance: Normal Sender: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu X- Listprocessor-Version:8.2.09/990901/11:28 -- ListProc(tm) by CREN I would drill through and pinit. Actually, it is not a bad idea on any reel seat cap. -----Original Message----- rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu]On Behalf Of KyleDruey@aol.com Sent: Monday, Garrison Reel Seat List, Can the cap be glued directly to a cork reel seat on aGarrison style all cork cap and ring reel seat? Any other insights neededwhen building this style of reel seat? Thanks for your help, Kyle >Frombob@downandacross.com Mon Mar 4 15:20:29 2002 Received: from g24LKS802782 for ; Mon, 4 Mar 2002 Cc: "Rodmakers" Subject: RE: Casting Clinics Date: Mon, 4 Mar 2002 16:20:15 -0500 Message- Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X- Importance: Normal Sender: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu X- Listprocessor-Version:8.2.09/990901/11:28 -- ListProc(tm) by CREN Try the Garrison based "easycast" taper from Bob Milward's book. I have not made that one next, buteverything that Bob has said otherwise about the tapers in his book is true.That 6'6" taper is absloutely fantastic. I think the Driggs would be anothervery easy casting taper in my opinion. Best regards, Bob -----Original rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu]On Behalf Of Miller, Troy Sent: Monday, March Casting Clinics Yep, I was a little apprehensive about it at first, but I juststood right next to the student casting it the ENTIRE time. This is my baby....I am thinking that I might need to make about six "no frills" rods, that arenice, but with an easy-casting taper. I would dedicate these rods to castingclasses, and not worry too much about the extreme fine cosmetics. It wouldalso be a good way to make lots of rods and not get hung up on each onebeing the ultimate. Any good advice? Gotta get me a beveller made..... TAM from Troy.Miller@BakerOilTools.com Mon Mar 4 15:47:25 2002 Received: g24LlO805726 for ; Mon, 4 Mar 2002 (bhihdcimc01.bakerhughes.com [204.253.245.34] (may be forged)) by Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Mon, 4 Mar 200215:32:02 -0600 Message-ID:From: "Miller, Troy" Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-Type: 8.2.09/990901/11:28 -- ListProc(tm) by CREN You know, I have never castthe Driggs, that I can recall. But EVERYONE who speaks of it has nothing butpraise for the taper. I will have to make one of those, early on and see how Ilike it. Or, better yet, someone bring one to Conclave! Now there is an idea.How about everyone bring a copy of their very favorite taper, and we canadmire how the finest designs perform? TAM -----Original Message----- From: Rodmakers Subject: RE: Casting Clinics Try the Garrison based "easy cast"taper from Bob Milward's book. I have not made that one next, but everythingthat Bob has said otherwise about the tapers in his book is true. That 6'6"taper is absloutely fantastic. I think the Driggs would be another very easycasting taper in my opinion. Best regards, Bob >FromChristopherO@epicimaging.com Mon Mar 4 16:00:52 2002 Received: fromepic01.epic.local (mail.epicrad.com [208.161.98.101] (may be forged)) by g24M0p806608 for ; Mon, 4 Mar 2002 Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Mon, 4 Mar 2002 13:56:30 -0800 From: KyleDruey@aol.com, rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Subject: RE: Garrison Reel rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu X-Listprocessor- Version:8.2.09/990901/11:28 -- ListProc(tm) by CREN If you look in garrison's book,he glued a wooden plug to the end of the rod shaft, turned it to size on thelathe, and then glued the cap to this wood ring, not the cork (to get a goodsolid connection between the rodshaft and the reel foot). Chris. List, Can thecap be glued directly to a cork reel seat on a Garrison style all cork cap andring reel seat? Any other insights needed when building this style of reelseat? Thanks for your help, Kyle > from bdcbfr@chartermi.net Mon Mar 416:39:36 2002 Received: from proxy1-grandhaven0.chartermi.net References:Subject: Re: Off The bdcbfr@chartermi.net Sender: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu X- Listprocessor-Version: 8.2.09/990901/11:28 -- ListProc(tm) by CREN This "corn shuckers" make great trap guns, are really good duck and = goose 04, 2002 3:33 PM Subject: Off The Subject To the List? While we are off thesubject, I've used a matched set of 12 and 20 = Ga. Model 12's for over 50years and see no need to change. Over that = period I've enjoyed thecompany of 8 black Labs and again see no need to = change. Bill ------ Model 12 "corn To the List? Bill ------ tjtrodmaker@yahoo.com Mon Mar 4 17:36:15 2002 Received: from g24NaE811168 for ; Mon, 4 Mar 2002 Received: from [12.221.112.197] by web11207.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 04 Mar bdcbfr@chartermi.net, fiveside@net-gate.com, rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu tjtrodmaker@yahoo.com Sender: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu X- Listprocessor-Version: 8.2.09/990901/11:28 -- ListProc(tm) by CREN sincewe are all talking about double guns, does anyone have a bernadeli or opinionabout them? timothy --- "Brian D. Creek" wrote: Model 12 "corn shuckers" make great trap guns, arereally good duck and goose guns, and seem to lastforever. Brian----- Original Message ----- From: William R. Fink Subject: Off The Subject To the List?While we are off the subject, I've used amatched set of 12 and 20 Ga. Model 12's for over 50years and see no need to change. Over that periodI've enjoyed the company of 8 black Labs and againsee no need to change. Bill ====="Gooda' mornin', mister bear!" ...Ride, boldly ride,"The shade replied, -"If you seek for Eldorado!" -- E.A.Poe __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Sports - sign up for Fantasy Baseballhttp://sports.yahoo.com from blitzenrods@yahoo.com Mon Mar 4 19:39:18 2002 g251dC814258 for ; Mon, 4 Mar 2002 19:39:17 -0600 Mon, 04 Mar 2002 17:39:05 PST Subject: Re: Off The Subject I've been regularly visiting a Vincenzo BernardelliRoma 6e at a local gunshop for about 3 yrs. EverytimeI talk myself into buying her, I realize my Fulton andmy Union Armera (Grulla) will do everything I need. rod so I could flaunt it, and so it sits therebeckoning to me month after month. It's probably 20 yrs. old, but new in the case. V.Bernardelli's have sideplates but are boxlocks and notsidelocks, machined engraving (I'm pretty sure)although it is complex and beautiful. Splinterforearms and English stocks in figured walnut andtight engraving. I've corresponded with a few long time V. BernardelliRoma owners in my research and they all speakfavorably of them as outlasting other more "respected"doubles. No failures and high quality. I think thebetter Roma's are currently valued in the $1800-$2100range depending of course on condition and grade. There is also a P. Bernardelli that is a lower end gunimported under names like "Gamecock" I think. I don'tthink these guns have the fit and finish that theVincenzo guns do and are valued lower accordingly. Anyway, there are some bulletin board sites that cangive you a wealth of information on all your doublegun inquiries. www.gunshop.com andwww.shootingsportsmen.com are two that I know of. Alot of experts visit these sites and are willing toshare information. Good luck. --- timothy troester wrote: since we are all talking about double guns, doesanyone have a bernadeli or opinion about them? timothy --- "Brian D. Creek" wrote: Model 12 "corn shuckers" make great trap guns, arereally good duck and goose guns, and seem to lastforever. Brian----- Original Message ----- From: William R. Fink 3:33 PMSubject: Off The Subject To the List?While we are off the subject, I've used amatched set of 12 and 20 Ga. Model 12's for over 50 years and see no need to change. Over that periodI've enjoyed the company of 8 black Labs and againsee no need to change. Bill ====="Gooda' mornin', mister bear!" ...Ride, boldly ride,"The shade replied, -"If you seek for Eldorado!" -- E.A.Poe __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Sports - sign up for Fantasy Baseballhttp://sports.yahoo.com __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Sports - sign up for Fantasy Baseballhttp://sports.yahoo.com from FISHWOOL@aol.com Mon Mar 4 19:45:05 2002 g251j3814520 for ; Mon, 4 Mar 2002 19:45:03 -0600 Subject: RE: RE: Casting Clinics Troy,I would think a 5 wgt. straight taper would do well as a beginner's rod. Let me know how they turn out. Hank. from LECLAIR123@aol.com Mon Mar 4 19:51:06 2002 g251p4814782 for ; Mon, 4 Mar 2002 19:51:05 -0600 Subject: Re: displacing nodes RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu In a message dated 03/03/2002 8:10:42 PM Eastern Standard Time, KlingB@health.missouri.edu writes: I rough mill the strips, then heat treat, then soak for a day ortwo, then final plane them. Dave check out our new site at- flyandrodroom.com AOL site- http://hometown.aol.com/leclair123/index.html from Troy.Miller@BakerOilTools.com Mon Mar 4 19:51:52 2002 g251po814927 for ; Mon, 4 Mar 2002 19:51:50 -0600 (bhihdcimc01.bakerhughes.com [204.253.245.34] (may be forged)) (5.5.2653.19) id ; Mon, 4 Mar 2002 19:36:42 -0600 Subject: RE: RE: Casting Clinics Anybody got a "for instance" for this taper virgin? Thanks -- TAM -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: RE: RE: Casting Clinics Troy,I would think a 5 wgt. straight taper would do well as a beginner's rod. Let me know how they turn out. Hank. from LECLAIR123@aol.com Mon Mar 4 20:06:24 2002 g2526M815373 for ; Mon, 4 Mar 2002 20:06:22 -0600 Subject: Re: displacing nodes In a message dated 03/03/2002 9:08:19 PM Eastern Standard Time,jojo@ipa.net writes: I don't notice any difference myself. I think once theyare heat treated, then soaking, it doesn't seem to make anydifference. Now, if you soaked the strips before heat treating,then I think you would see a difference in the softness of thecane. But, then once you heat treat the strips, everything is stiff again. It seems to me, that the heat treating does somethingto the cane and even soaking it and then letting it dry, doesn'tseem to bother it, once it is heat treated. Dave check out our new site at- flyandrodroom.com AOL site- http://hometown.aol.com/leclair123/index.html from LECLAIR123@aol.com Mon Mar 4 20:12:14 2002 g252CC815654 for ; Mon, 4 Mar 2002 20:12:13 -0600 Subject: Re: displacing nodes RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu In a message dated 03/03/2002 10:26:56 PM Eastern Standard Time, dybam@oct.net writes: Mark,You can't believe the difference in planing wet strips from dry ones. I can only take off around .002 " at a time withdry strips, as the strength it takes to push the Hand Mill downthe length of the bed is quite a bit. Being I only weigh 125lbs. Now, with wet/soaked strips. I can take off .006-.008 "at a time with very little effort. You won't believe it, until youtry it. You will never go back to dry strips. And there is no gouging or chattering or anything else. Dave check out our new site at- flyandrodroom.com AOL site- http://hometown.aol.com/leclair123/index.html from jojo@ipa.net Mon Mar 4 20:12:30 2002 g252CU815697 for ; Mon, 4 Mar 2002 20:12:30 -0600 helo=default) id 16i4R6-0008RS-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Mon, 04 Mar 2002 21:12:17 -0500 Subject: Re: displacing nodes Thanks, Dave. I wondered about that. Having been told of one rod that hadremained submersed for awhile, then dried out, with no apparent difference in its action, even whencompared to a new rod ofthe same taper, I really have to wonder about some of our thinking.I do think you're correct about when the cane is wet and being softer, butwhen it dries out itdoesn't seem to really matter. M-D In a message dated 03/03/2002 9:08:19 PM Eastern Standard Time,jojo@ipa.netwrites: I don't notice any difference myself. I think once theyare heat treated, then soaking, it doesn't seem to make anydifference. Now, if you soaked the strips before heat treating,then I think you would see a difference in the softness of thecane. But, then once you heat treat the strips, everything isstiff again. It seems to me, that the heat treating does somethingto the cane and even soaking it and then letting it dry, doesn'tseem to bother it, once it is heat treated. Dave check out our new site at- flyandrodroom.com AOL site- http://hometown.aol.com/leclair123/index.html from LECLAIR123@aol.com Mon Mar 4 20:17:07 2002 g252H6816086 for ; Mon, 4 Mar 2002 20:17:06 -0600 Subject: Re: displacing nodes RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu In a message dated 03/04/2002 11:36:20 AM Eastern Standard Time, wlwalter77us@yahoo.com writes: You may be right. That it isn't going all the through the cane, only down to about where I. Finnish planing. Which is good!That's probably why the dimensions didn't change after I let it dry Dave check out our new site at- flyandrodroom.com AOL site- http://hometown.aol.com/leclair123/index.html from rkrees@mcn.net Mon Mar 4 20:37:06 2002 g252b5816633 for ; Mon, 4 Mar 2002 20:37:05 -0600 id 16i4ot-0003To-00; Mon, 04 Mar 2002 18:36:52 -0800 , , Subject: Re: displacing nodes ?At Tom's advice I too started soaking strips but I have found that overnight seems to do it forme. I have no problems with nodes and I cut to finale and it seems to work.On the lighter sideonce as a lad my grandfather and I found a cane pole on the Prove river(about 1967 if you lostit). After cleaning moss off and drying for a few weeks it seemed to castjust fine and still today from time to time although it hasn't been fished in awhile.Ron from avyoung@iinet.net.au Mon Mar 4 21:41:15 2002 g253fD818185 for ; Mon, 4 Mar 2002 21:41:14 -0600 Subject: RE: Casting Clinics There are certain things you can just take as an article as faith, the Driggs is one of them. Tony At 03:47 PM 3/4/02 -0600, Miller, Troy wrote: You know, I have never cast the Driggs, that I can recall. But EVERYONEwhospeaks of it has nothing but praise for the taper. I will have to make oneof those, early on and see how I like it. Or, better yet, someone bring oneto Conclave! Now there is an idea. How about everyone bring a copy oftheir very favorite taper, and we can admire how the finest designsperform?TAM -----Original Message----- Sent: Monday, March 04, 2002 3:20 PM Cc: RodmakersSubject: RE: Casting Clinics Try the Garrison based "easy cast" taper from Bob Milward's book. I havenotmade that one next, but everything that Bob has said otherwise about thetapers in his book is true. That 6'6" taper is absloutely fantastic. I thinkthe Driggs would be another very easy casting taper in my opinion.Best regards,Bob /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html Christmas Gift Tips Avoid at any cost Christmas crackers with the label: Made in Afghanistan /*************************************************************************/ from HomeyDKlown@att.net Mon Mar 4 21:42:16 2002 g253gF818459 for ; Mon, 4 Mar 2002 21:42:15 -0600 Subject: Was Off The Subject. Now Shotguns Jeez!! I feel like Charlie Brown when he kept saying "I got a rock"! I have anold, semi-beat up Remington 870 Wingmaster that I bought used. It's a goodutilitarian popgun that basically works for me. It's my all around shooter.I also have a side b'side IGA coach gun (Stoeger), made in Brazil I think,in 410 that's good for dusting upland critters, but I donn't use it much. I keep thinking of that refrain from Wayne's World... "We're not worthy,we're not worthy..." Anyway... I love all my "children" . They have a special place in mytree fort, better known as my home. Dennis (aka Blockhead) PS: No jokes or I'll sick my sister Sally on you! -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Off The Subject I've been regularly visiting a Vincenzo BernardelliRoma 6e at a local gunshop for about 3 yrs. EverytimeI talk myself into buying her, I realize my Fulton andmy Union Armera (Grulla) will do everything I need. rod so I could flaunt it, and so it sits therebeckoning to me month after month. It's probably 20 yrs. old, but new in the case. V.Bernardelli's have sideplates but are boxlocks and notsidelocks, machined engraving (I'm pretty sure)although it is complex and beautiful. Splinterforearms and English stocks in figured walnut andtight engraving. I've corresponded with a few long time V. BernardelliRoma owners in my research and they all speakfavorably of them as outlasting other more "respected"doubles. No failures and high quality. I think thebetter Roma's are currently valued in the $1800-$2100range depending of course on condition and grade. There is also a P. Bernardelli that is a lower end gunimported under names like "Gamecock" I think. I don'tthink these guns have the fit and finish that theVincenzo guns do and are valued lower accordingly. Anyway, there are some bulletin board sites that cangive you a wealth of information on all your doublegun inquiries. www.gunshop.com andwww.shootingsportsmen.com are two that I know of. Alot of experts visit these sites and are willing toshare information. Good luck. --- timothy troester wrote: since we are all talking about double guns, doesanyone have a bernadeli or opinion about them?timothy --- "Brian D. Creek" wrote: Model 12 "corn shuckers" make great trap guns, arereally good duck and goose guns, and seem to lastforever. Brian----- Original Message -----From: William R. Fink Sent: Monday, March 04, 2002 3:33 PMSubject: Off The Subject To the List?While we are off the subject, I've used amatched set of 12 and 20 Ga. Model 12's for over 50 years and see no need to change. Over that periodI've enjoyed the company of 8 black Labs and againsee no need to change. Bill ====="Gooda' mornin', mister bear!" ...Ride, boldly ride,"The shade replied, -"If you seek for Eldorado!" -- E.A.Poe __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Sports - sign up for Fantasy Baseballhttp://sports.yahoo.com __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Sports - sign up for Fantasy Baseballhttp://sports.yahoo.com from bennetts@cybermesa.com Mon Mar 4 23:04:26 2002 g2554P822639 for ; Mon, 4 Mar 2002 23:04:25 -0600 Subject: Re: Green Peter, TOO well! Since 1963. Now will this start a brother in law thread? Scott ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Green Better! Much better! How well do you know the brother-in-law? Peter from bdcbfr@chartermi.net Mon Mar 4 23:39:33 2002 g255dW823254 for ; Mon, 4 Mar 2002 23:39:33 -0600 g255dUK01276; Subject: Re: displacing nodes You're right. John Z. suggested that I mist the sections prior to glue =up and I always do, and have had no trouble. I just want the moisture =to be on the surface and used up in the glueing process. I also cure my =strips (use perkins L-100 glue) in the oven once they are straightened =as well as I can get them, again on 150 degrees, unplug the box and go =away for a day. I've had some tips that were really prone to taking a =set before I added the drying stage before glue-up. I know other guys =do it different and don't have trouble. This is just what's worked for =me. Brian Subject: Re: displacing nodes Brian, I've experinced a few delaminations when the root cause seemed to be =cane that we too dry and now you're confusing me with a possiblity that =something else may have failed.I even mist my rods with water to make sure that the cane is not too =dry. Have been told that cane should be about 8% prior to gluing. Don At 09:17 PM 3/3/02 -0500, you wrote:SOAK FIRST -- Then do the nodes -- rough plane -- and THEN heat 'em =up. And I put the finished strips in the oven at 150 F or so for a while =beforeI go to glue up now. What I usually do is turn the oven on, let it =heat up,put the strips in, wait for the thing to stabilize again, unplug the =ovenand go to bed. Then I glue the nest day. Seems to help where set isinvolved. Brian ----- Original Message -----From: "Jojo DeLancier" Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2002 9:06 PMSubject: RE: displacing nodes Dave, Hank, et al Given the contemporary thought that it is the moisture in the cane =thatsets up the conditions conducive to rods takinga set, not being as stiff, etc. do you guys who heat treat, then =soak andplane, notice any adverse effects in yourrods? M-D From: Barry and Dave,I've been heat treating before soaking, then final planing and I,too,have found no shrinking after the strips dry. Of course, being an =oldf-- t,what do I know?Regards,Hank. http://www.telusplanet.net/public/dmanders/index.html Don, oven once they are straightened as well as I can get them, again on 150 = prone to taking a set before I added the drying stage before = what's worked for me. Brian ----- Original Message ----- & Sandy Andersen Sent: Monday, March 04, 2002 = PMSubject: Re: displacing =nodesBrian,I've experinced a few delaminations when = cause seemed to be cane that we too dry and now you're confusing me = possiblity that something else may have failed.I even mist my rods = water to make sure that the cane is not too dry. Have been told that = should be about 8% prior togluing.DonAt = = from tausfeld@frontiernet.net Tue Mar 5 02:30:02 2002 g258U2825453 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 02:30:02 -0600 Subject: RE: Casting Clinics Troy, You might want to try .070" at the tip, ferrule dimension =.200" andbutt(10" above the end of the rod) = .300" Extrapolate out a linear taper.This cast pretty nice.A 5 wt 7'6" would work out to be something like: 0 .0705 .08410 .09815 .11220 .12625 .14030 .15435 .16840 .18245 .200 45 .20050 .21455 .22860 .24265 .25670 .27075 .28480 .30085 .30090 .300 tom Anybody got a "for instance" for this taper virgin? Thanks -- TAM -----Original Message----- Sent: Monday, March 04, 2002 7:44 PM Cc: rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Re: RE: RE: Casting Clinics Troy,I would think a 5 wgt. straight taper would do well as a beginner's rod. Let me know how they turn out.Hank. from petermckean@netspace.net.au Tue Mar 5 03:57:40 2002 g259vc826733 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 03:57:38 -0600 g259vVD97059; Subject: Re: Off The Subject Chris I'd be really surprised if the engraving on your "mistress" was not handengraving. I think that if you even say the words "machine engraving" up there in theVal Trompia, they kill you. Have you ever seen the book "Modern Firearms Engraving", by Mario Abbiaticoof Armi Famars? You might or might not like the style of engraving, but it is absolutelymind- blowing! Peter from avyoung@iinet.net.au Tue Mar 5 04:00:37 2002 g25A0Z826997 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 04:00:36 -0600 Subject: Re: Off The Subject It's bloody ugly but it is mind blowing in a crass sort of way. Tony Have you ever seen the book "Modern Firearms Engraving", by MarioAbbiaticoof Armi Famars? You might or might not like the style of engraving, but it is absolutelymind- blowing! Peter /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html Christmas Gift Tips Avoid at any cost Christmas crackers with the label: Made in Afghanistan /*************************************************************************/ from splitcane@t-online.de Tue Mar 5 05:25:47 2002 g25BPk827909 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 05:25:46 -0600 id 16iD4d-0006xs-05; Tue, 05 Mar 2002 12:25:39 +0100 fwd09.sul.t-online.com Subject: Re: displacing nodes LECLAIR123@aol.com schrieb: In a message dated 03/03/2002 9:08:19 PM Eastern Standard Time,jojo@ipa.netwrites: Dave, Hank, et al stuff deleted >> I don't notice any difference myself. I think once they. It seems to me, that the heat treating does somethingto the cane and even soaking it and then letting it dry, doesn'tseem to bother it, once it is heat treated. Dave check out our new site at- flyandrodroom.com AOL site- http://hometown.aol.com/leclair123/index.html Hi Dave et all. If one heat treat the bamboo in the right manner (not above 180Ÿ Celsius)thebamboo is undergoing a process called hydrophobic. I don't recall the correctdatas but roughly spoken: the heat treatment conditions the bamboo so it'llbeonly be able to regain a certain amount of humidity (which is less then beforeheat treatment).tight linesMichael from kenealyj@gwi.net Tue Mar 5 06:12:45 2002 g25CCi828589 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 06:12:44 -0600 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 07:12:40 -0500 Subject: Anybody heard of... A rodmaker named "Joe Trainor." I had a guy bring in a bunch of cane rods for a friend of his who's =grandfather worked for South Bend, some of these are supposed to be ="prototypes." He didn't know any more than that. A few of these rods had the Joe Trainor signiature. Any hlp would be appreciated. thanks,John K A rodmaker named "Joe =Trainor." I had a guy bring in a bunch of cane = that. A few of these rods had the Joe Trainor= signiature. Any hlp would be =appreciated. thanks,JohnK from Jkvseafood@aol.com Tue Mar 5 07:48:10 2002 g25Dm9800038 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 07:48:09 -0600 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 08:48:00 -0500 Subject: leonard parts hello group, i could use your help. i have a 3/2 13 ft leonard. the rod had english bronze snakes and an unknown stripper. the butt, mid and one tip section has been stripped. chris tucker was kind enought to send me some of the thread (thanks again chris). i think i will have trouble finding used original leonard parts but hope i may. i have one part that has me concerned, the rod had a red rubber butt cap that screwed into ns butt cap. i don't remember who told me maybe darrell lee that he knew of someone that had afew of these caps, i could really use one. if any of you can help i would appreciate all the help i can get. thank you, john from Jkvseafood@aol.com Tue Mar 5 07:53:43 2002 g25Drh800358 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 07:53:43 -0600 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 08:53:27 -0500 Subject: impregnating me again,could use some help finding a resource does any of you know where i can get a book on impregnating. i am making two 8 ft 7 wt rods for saltwater fishing and wish to build one rod varnished and the other impregnated. both will be hollow built. is there any changes that i should make to the taper if impregnated? thanks, john from LambersonW@missouri.edu Tue Mar 5 09:09:05 2002 g25F94803162 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 09:09:04 -0600 content-class: urn:content-classes:message Subject: RE: impregnating Thread-Topic: impregnatingThread-Index: AcHETcYvWzwwTDBAEdarXwAErEws8gACj/NA g25F94803163 John, I am not aware of any book on impregnating and don't recall if Bob Milwardaddresses it, but I'll take a shot at a qualitative answer to your question. Ihave used impregnation for a few rods. Depending on the method used theremay be an increase in weight of the rod. The effect of the weight is greaterat the tip than at the butt, I suppose because it has a greater range ofmotion during casting. That weight tends to slow the rod action, in somerespects similarly to using a heavy set of guides. The impregnating agentmay have other effects on the action as well, I don't know. To account forthe weight effect and achieve an action similar to that of a varnished versionof the same taper, the taper should be modified to speed the rod up a bit. How much? It depends on the amount of weight added. Good luck. Bill Lamberson -----Original Message----- Subject: impregnating me again,could use some help finding a resource does any of you know where i can get a book on impregnating. i am making two 8 ft 7 wt rods for saltwater fishing and wish to build one rod varnished and the other impregnated. both will be hollow built. is there any changes that i should make to the taper if impregnated? thanks, john from jojo@ipa.net Tue Mar 5 09:11:18 2002 g25FBH803436 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 09:11:17 -0600 helo=default) id 16iGat-0005kQ-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Tue, 05 Mar 2002 10:11:12 -0500 Subject: Re: displacing nodes Indeed heat treating does condition the bamboo to regain less moisture thanit previously had.Ranges of moisture regain ran the gamut between .2g- .5g, with most being.3g. Considering that thethought-to-be original moisture contents ran from .2g-.9g, with most running.6g, it follows thatwe've done something to the bamboo to cause it to have a reduced ability tohold moisture, and thatsomething is a crosslinking of molecules within the lignin, brought about bythe liberation of themoisture and volatile oils, leaving -OH (hydroxyl) groups, which are strongbonders, that seek outthe proper molecular chains with which to bond. At least this is what happenswith other celluloseproducts, and there's no reason for me to believe that bamboo is anydifferent. Besides, who caresas long as it works, right?Soaking strips is an entirely different thing though. In my experience they willattain the sameweight after heat treating as they did before. The primary difference is thatthey apparently willdry to the same, or nearly the same, level of equilibrium moisture content. Itdoes, however, takeseveral days to achieve a saturation of the strips, and one or two days is notsufficient to achievethis saturation, in my experience. M-D Hi Dave et all. If one heat treat the bamboo in the right manner (not above 180Ÿ Celsius)thebamboo is undergoing a process called hydrophobic. I don't recall the correctdatas but roughly spoken: the heat treatment conditions the bamboo so it'llbeonly be able to regain a certain amount of humidity (which is less then beforeheat treatment).tight linesMichael from flytyr@southshore.com Tue Mar 5 09:29:02 2002 g25FT1804624 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 09:29:01 -0600 g25FSx312612 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 09:28:59 -0600 Subject: Requests for photos Todd has put these on his web site. Got too manyrequests to send them out individually.If you can't get them for any reason, get back tome.Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com Here is Todd's message to me. I have the tapping shots on the site. Here is theaddress: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo_Cont/Contraptions/Planing_Forms/Spezio__Tony/spezio__tony.html Is the router bit setup this one?http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo_Cont/Contraptions/Jigs__Other/jigs__other.html from harms1@pa.net Tue Mar 5 09:52:03 2002 g25Fq3806163 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 09:52:03 -0600 , , Subject: Re: displacing nodes David, I'm not so sure about this one. I believe that a very large strip probablyneeds to be soaked longer than 48 hours, but a strip that has already beenrough-beveled to 60 degrees is considerably smaller and will very quicklyabsorb about as much water as it can within 48 hours. Moreover, when a wet strip is planed (or milled) to final dimensions, theenamel side would not have had its saturated surfaces removed--and this ismostly what remains after planing. I just don't think the "48-hour-factor" would play into (or against) yourobservations, David. cheers, Bill ----- Original Message ----- ; Subject: Re: displacing nodes In a message dated 03/04/2002 11:36:20 AM Eastern Standard Time,wlwalter77us@yahoo.com writes: Dave, at 48 hours, its likely that the strip isn'tgetting soaked all the way through and planning tofinal actually takes you past the soaked cane intomostly dry. This is good to know. Perhaps soaking for3 to 4 days for handmill users is not in our bestinterest. When doing the final planning I don't soak,only soak when I'm roughing, but I'm starting torethink this based on what you've learned. Bill W. >> You may be right. That it isn't going all the through the cane, only down to about where I. Finnish planing. Which is good!That's probably why the dimensions didn't change after I let it dry Dave check out our new site at- flyandrodroom.com AOL site- http://hometown.aol.com/leclair123/index.html from aebersold@ou.edu Tue Mar 5 10:00:32 2002 g25G0V806956 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 10:00:31 -0600 id ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 10:00:31 -0600 Subject: soaking Let me summarize and ask a quesiton. I've heard all of the steps below.Which would you leave out and why? 1. Flame2a, Split2. Soak3. Rough Bevel4. Bind and heat treat5. Soak6. Final Plane7. Minor heat again8. Glue9. Heat to set glue. -dDennis Aebersold from cw@vanion.com Tue Mar 5 10:02:50 2002 g25G2n807377 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 10:02:49 -0600 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 09:07:43 -0700 Subject: Bellinger Rough Beveler Hi Guys, There's a Bellinger Rough-out beveler for sale on ebay, was =wondering if anyone using or has used the machine could give some =feedback on it.Thanks, Chad Hi Guys, There's a Bellinger = give some feedback on it.Thanks, =Chad from tausfeld@frontiernet.net Tue Mar 5 11:01:47 2002 g25H1k810967 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 11:01:46 -0600 sender ) Subject: Re: displacing nodes.. now gluing and moisture Hello all,When talking about moisture content and gluing, I think it would be =appropriate to mention the type of glue being used as to elinmate =confusion. I know URAC needs moisture to cure, I believe epoxy doesn't =(not sure, I'm sure someone will correct me). Not sure of other types =of glue, (tightbond), as I use URAC exclusively. Misting the strips =seems like overkill, but Jimmy Z is more of an expert than I. thanks Subject: Re: displacing nodes Brian, I've experinced a few delaminations when the root cause seemed to be =cane that we too dry and now you're confusing me with a possiblity that =something else may have failed.I even mist my rods with water to make sure that the cane is not too =dry. Have been told that cane should be about 8% prior to gluing. Don At 09:17 PM 3/3/02 -0500, you wrote:SOAK FIRST -- Then do the nodes -- rough plane -- and THEN heat 'em =up. And I put the finished strips in the oven at 150 F or so for a =while beforeI go to glue up now. What I usually do is turn the oven on, let it =heat up,put the strips in, wait for the thing to stabilize again, unplug =the ovenand go to bed. Then I glue the nest day. Seems to help where set isinvolved. Brian ----- Original Message -----From: "Jojo DeLancier" Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2002 9:06 PMSubject: RE: displacing nodes Dave, Hank, et al Given the contemporary thought that it is the moisture in the =cane thatsets up the conditions conducive to rods takinga set, not being as stiff, etc. do you guys who heat treat, then =soak andplane, notice any adverse effects in yourrods? M-D From: Barry and Dave,I've been heat treating before soaking, then final planing and =I,too,have found no shrinking after the strips dry. Of course, being =an oldf--t,what do I know?Regards,Hank. http://www.telusplanet.net/public/dmanders/index.html Hello all,When talking about moisture content and gluing, I = would be appropriate to mention the type of glue being used as to = like overkill, but Jimmy Z is more of an expert than I. thanks ----- Original Message ----- & Sandy Andersen Sent: Monday, March 04, 2002 = PMSubject: Re: displacing =nodesBrian,I've experinced a few delaminations = root cause seemed to be cane that we too dry and now you're = with a possiblity that something else may have failed.I even = rods with water to make sure that the cane is not too dry. Have been = gluing.DonAt 09:17 PM 3/3/02 - "Rodmakers discussion group" = = from dongreife@hotmail.com Tue Mar 5 11:18:01 2002 g25HI0812131 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 11:18:00 -0600 Tue, 5 Mar 2002 09:17:54 -0800 HTTP; Tue, 05 Mar 2002 17:17:54 GMT Subject: RE: impregnating FILETIME=[B02ACE10:01C1C469] John,, Mark Wendt recently had a process for impregnating a cane rod the archives.. Don Greife , if Bob Milward addresses it, but I'll take a shot at a qualitative answer toyour question. I have used impregnation for a few rods. Depending on themethod used there may be an increase in weight of the rod. The effect ofthe weight is greater at the tip than at the butt, I suppose because it has agreater range of motion during casting. That weight tends to slow the rodaction, in some respects similarly to using a heavy set of guides. Theimpregnating agent may have other effects on the action as well, I don'tknow. To account for the weight effect and achieve an action similar to thatof a varnished version of the same taper, the taper should be modified tospeed the rod up a bit. How much? It depends on the amount of weight added. impregnating know where i can get saltwater fishing impregnated. both will be taper if Send and receive Hotmail on yourmobile device: ClickHere from wendt@kingcrab.nrl.navy.mil Tue Mar 5 11:28:44 2002 g25HSd812951 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 11:28:39 -0600 g25HSYdd004104 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 12:28:35 -0500 Subject: RE: impregnating Don, snarfedthat from Bob Nunley's article in article in the July 2001 issue of great read on making cane ferrules, and impregnating them.Mark At 11:17 AM 3/5/2002 -0600, you wrote:John,, Mark Wendt recently had aprocess for impregnating a cane rod and published it on the listserve on Greife Milward addresses it, but I'll take a shot at a qualitative answer toyour question. I have used impregnation for a few rods. Depending on themethod used there may be an increase in weight of the rod. The effect ofthe weight is greater at the tip than at the butt, I suppose because ithas a greater range of motion during casting. That weight tends to slowthe rod action, in some respects similarly to using a heavy set ofguides. The impregnating agent may have other effects on the action aswell, I don't know. To account for the weight effect and achieve anaction similar to that of a varnished version of the same taper, thetaper should be modified to speed the rod up a bit. How much? It dependson the amount of weight added. can get fishing will be Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device:ClickHere from KyleDruey@aol.com Tue Mar 5 11:59:17 2002 g25HxG814989 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 11:59:16 -0600 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 12:58:42 -0500 0305125842; Tue, 05 Mar 2002 12:58:42 -0500 Subject: Touch Up with Kodak Fixer List, how well can fittings be touched up using Kodak Fixer, and what theprocedure? This would be in the context of: -a reel seat cap that has been blued/darkened by immersion in the KodakFixer solution, then -the above reel seat cap is then pinned, and the wire filed/polished flush withthe fitting but now the pin hole area needs to be blued/darkened again fortouch up TIA, Kyle from KlingB@health.missouri.edu Tue Mar 5 13:44:48 2002 g25Jil821981 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 13:44:47 -0600 Tue, 5 Mar 2002 13:44:47 -0600 content-class: urn:content-classes:message Subject: RE: Touch Up with Kodak Fixer Thread-Topic: Touch Up with Kodak FixerThread-Index: AcHEb4QJlgDKkjBdEda4KQBglOouXwADoATA FILETIME=[34D43390:01C1C47E] g25Jim821982 I haven't had exactly your situation, but I've darkened them by simply rubbingthe solution onto the surface for several minutes. I mixed my fixer doublestrength last time, but regular strength works, too.....Barry -----Original Message----- Subject: Touch Up with Kodak Fixer List, how well can fittings be touched up using Kodak Fixer, and what theprocedure? This would be in the context of: -a reel seat cap that has been blued/darkened by immersion in the KodakFixer solution, then -the above reel seat cap is then pinned, and the wire filed/polished flush withthe fitting but now the pin hole area needs to be blued/darkened again fortouch up TIA, Kyle from petermckean@netspace.net.au Tue Mar 5 16:06:25 2002 g25M6N808934 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 16:06:24 -0600 g25M6Eh97080; Subject: Re: Touch Up with Kodak Fixer Kyle Just swab the stuff on with a cotton bud - "Q-tip", I believe you know themas; move the solution around, and rinse it off under running water when youhave got the darkness you need. Couple of minutes, tops. Buy Ilford fixer. It's liquid, and saves a lot of buggerising around mixingit up. Now we get to the heresy bit. I KNOW all that has been said about thefunction of Hardener in the photo process, and how it's supposed to funtionto toughen the protein phase of the surface emulsion of film, and I KNOWhowit cannot therefore have any effect at all on bluing nickel silver, and IKNOW that anybody who thinks that it does or can possibly improve thebluingmust be (a) stupid (b) mislead (c) inept (d) in cloud cuckoo land (e) awanker, or (f) all of the above! But it does! Cheers Peter abcdef from bcombest@iclub.org Tue Mar 5 16:55:27 2002 g25MtQ811382 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 16:55:26 -0600 ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 17:55:51 -0500 Subject: replacing strip I am new to this endeavor and have some questions. When you have final planned a strip and decide that it is sub-standard =and you wish to replace it with another strip, how do you heat treat a =single strip and what is the procedure? I am new to this endeavor and havesome = questions. When you have final planned a strip and= it is sub-standard and you wish to replace it with another strip, how do = heat treat a single strip and what is the =procedure? from bcombest@iclub.org Tue Mar 5 16:55:34 2002 g25MtW811396 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 16:55:33 -0600 ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 17:55:55 -0500 Subject: Degloss Varnish I am new to this endeavor and have another question. I have used spar varnish in a dip tank and am pleased with the coverage =but is there a good way to de-gloss the hight sheen on the final coat? I am new to this endeavor and have = question. I have used spar varnish in a dip tank = pleased with the coverage but is there a good way to de-gloss the hight = the final coat? from cdn@ticon.net Tue Mar 5 17:33:28 2002 g25NXR813491 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 17:33:27 -0600 Subject: Re: replacing strip Bruce- what I've done in that situation is make up a set of dummyrough strips out of maple and just bind up your replacement bamboostrip with 5 of the dummy strips.This will keep your replacementstrip straight and the entire bundle will have about the same thermalmass as the original bundle of six bamboo stripsand as long as you treat at the same time/temp as your originaltreatment the replacement strip should be very close.good luckNed Bruce Combest wrote: I am new to this endeavor and have some questions. When you have final planned a strip and decide that it is sub-standardand you wish to replace it with another strip, how do you heat treat asingle strip and what is the procedure? from bob@downandacross.com Tue Mar 5 18:21:37 2002 g260La815736 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 18:21:36 -0600 5 Mar 2002 19:11:22 -0500 Subject: RE: replacing strip Bruce. I ususally bind an extra piece to the outside of the bundle when Iheat treat. You might want to seek out one of Martin-Darrell's new heattreating set ups. They are extruded metal (aluminum?) that nestle the stripswhen put in the oven. I just got mine MOnday, but man they look nice. Theyshould work as well for one strip as they do 6.M-D, any ideasBob-----Original Message----- From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Tuesday, March 05, 2002 12:55 PM Subject: replacing strip I am new to this endeavor and have some questions. When you have final planned a strip and decide that it is sub-standard andyou wish to replace it with another strip, how do you heat treat a singlestrip and what is the procedure? ususally bind an extra piece to the outside of the bundle when I heat = might want to seek out one of Martin-Darrell's new heat treating set = are extruded metal (aluminum?) that nestle the strips when put in the = just got mine MOnday, but man they look nice. They should work as well = strip as they do 6. Bob CombestSent: Tuesday, March 05, 2002 12:55 RodmakersSubject: replacing stripI am new to this endeavor and have = questions. When you have final planned a strip = that it is sub-standard and you wish to replace it with another strip, = procedure? from bob@downandacross.com Tue Mar 5 18:21:38 2002 g260Lb815740 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 18:21:37 -0600 5 Mar 2002 19:11:36 -0500 Subject: RE: Degloss Varnish Rottenstone?-----Original Message-----From: owner- rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Tuesday, March 05, 2002 12:58 PM Subject: Degloss Varnish I am new to this endeavor and have another question. I have used spar varnish in a dip tank and am pleased with the coveragebut is there a good way to de-gloss the hight sheen on the final coat? Rottenstone? CombestSent: Tuesday, March 05, 2002 12:58 RodmakersSubject: Degloss Varnish I am new to this endeavor and have = question. I have used spar varnish in a dip = pleased with the coverage but is there a good way to de-gloss the = on the final coat? from bdcbfr@chartermi.net Tue Mar 5 18:23:59 2002 g260Nx816092 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 18:23:59 -0600 g260R2P10930; Subject: Re: soaking You left out 3a. Straighten and flatten nodes. As I said earlier, I skip5, but it sounds like several guys find planing wet strips to be muchquicker and easier.Brian----- Original Message ----- Subject: soaking Let me summarize and ask a quesiton. I've heard all of the steps below.Which would you leave out and why? 1. Flame2a, Split2. Soak3. Rough Bevel4. Bind and heat treat5. Soak6. Final Plane7. Minor heat again8. Glue9. Heat to set glue. -dDennis Aebersold from FISHWOOL@aol.com Tue Mar 5 18:42:13 2002 g260gB817148 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 18:42:12 -0600 Subject: RE: Casting Clinics FISHWOOL@aol.com Tom and Troy,The following is not exactly a straight taper but almost. It's done very well for me:0" .062 45" .1925" .084 50" .20810" .096 55" .220 Good Luck,15" .108 60" .242 Hank.20" .122 65" .26825" .136 70" .28230" ,150 75" .30435" .164 80" .30640" .180 85" .30845" .192 90" .310 from saltwein@worldnet.att.net Tue Mar 5 18:48:36 2002 g260mZ817558 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 18:48:35 -0600 ;Wed, 6 Mar 2002 00:48:20 +0000 Subject: Re: replacing strip Bruce, I have taken a number of strips from the original culm and bundled them =up as well as possible to heat treat for one. I now carry four extra =strips all the way through the rod building process to rough planing in =case I need extras. I will have to make a rod from the remainders some =day. Regards, SteveIndependence, MO Sent: Tuesday, March 05, 2002 11:54 AMSubject: replacing strip I am new to this endeavor and have some questions. When you have final planned a strip and decide that it is sub-standard =and you wish to replace it with another strip, how do you heat treat a =single strip and what is the procedure? Bruce, I have taken a number of strips from = culm and bundled them up as well as possible to heat treat for one. I = four extra strips all the way through the rod building process to rough = in case I need extras. I will have to make a rod from the remainders = day. Regards, SteveIndependence, MO ----- Original Message ----- Bruce= Sent: Tuesday, March 05, 2002 = AMSubject: replacing strip I am new to this endeavor and have = questions. When you have final planned a strip = that it is sub-standard and you wish to replace it with another strip, = procedure? from robertgkope@attbi.com Tue Mar 5 18:54:53 2002 g260sq817959 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 18:54:52 -0600 Wed, 6 Mar 2002 00:54:39 +0000 Subject: Re: Touch Up with Kodak Fixer Exactly. I don't bother bluing ferrules until they're mounted now. It'stoo much bother to try to clean up the tabs without messing up the bluing.I just swab on the fixer before I wrap them. -- Robert----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Touch Up with Kodak Fixer Kyle Just swab the stuff on with a cotton bud - "Q-tip", I believe you know them as; move the solution around, and rinse it off under running water when you have got the darkness you need. Couple of minutes, tops. Buy Ilford fixer. It's liquid, and saves a lot of buggerising around mixing it up. Now we get to the heresy bit. I KNOW all that has been said about thefunction of Hardener in the photo process, and how it's supposed to funtion to toughen the protein phase of the surface emulsion of film, and I KNOW how it cannot therefore have any effect at all on bluing nickel silver, and IKNOW that anybody who thinks that it does or can possibly improve the bluing must be (a) stupid (b) mislead (c) inept (d) in cloud cuckoo land (e) awanker, or (f) all of the above! But it does! Cheers Peter abcdef from flytyr@southshore.com Tue Mar 5 19:08:22 2002 g2618L819680 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 19:08:21 -0600 g2618HO06195; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 19:08:17 -0600 Subject: Re: displacing nodes Robert,All of this is based on un flamed rods. That isall I have made. It seems that it works on flamedrods from some of the recent posts.I found that soaking for at least four days andcutting the relief the back side of the node keepsthe bump from coming back up. I soak for five tosix days. This may not be traditional but it is alot easier on my old hands. After displacing thenode, the only thing protruding is the littleridge. That is filed off with a few strokes of thefile. If you have to take a kink out of the stripat the node, do that first then flip it to theenamel side and displace the node, all in onemotion. Leave that strip in the vise and start onthe next strip. Keep the strips that you are notworking on it the water. While the strips are wet,they are beveled and partial tapered. I guess Ihave said it a hundred times, once you plane wetstrips you will never go back to dry planingexcept for the final taper.I do two strips at a time, displace, bevel andpartial taper. When the 18 strips are finished,they are bound ( as they will be glued) with thepith side out and put in the oven to dry. They canbe air dried also. I believe with the pith sideout they dry a lot faster and more complete. Afterthe strips are dried they are pretty straight, Idon't find the bumps re appearing. I re bind inthe normal way to heat treat.The binding cord will be somewhat loose afterdrying.Now on heating the nodes, the wet strips only take30 to 45 seconds to be soft enough to displace.Not at all like dry strips. There is no burning orhardening of the node. When you plane over a wetnode it is not felt at all unless the strip is dryin the middle.I do believe the sticks need to be DRY beforefinal planing. I try to heat treat, final planeand glue all in one session. Next session, heatset, sand and apply a coat of Tung varnish to sealthe blankHope I shed some light on your questions.No pun intended, I may be all wet on this deal.Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com Robert Kope wrote: I had some questions for Tony Spezio about nodedisplacing, but thought the subject wasinteresting enough to put on the list. Besides,I know that others are using this method and mayalso have advice to contribute. Tony's articleon node displacing in the latest issue ofPowerfibers has me interested enough to give ita try, but I still don't get how to proceedafter flattening the nodes. On most nodes, thecrooks in the strip going side to side are muchmore pronounced than the bumps in the verticaldimension. After flattening the node, don't thebumps come back when you reheat the node tostraighten the strip? How about when heattreating? I haven't tried soaking strips yet,but I've heard that soaked strips shrink bynearly 20% when heat treated. Doesn't this makethe string so loose that the nodes go back totheir original shape? TIA, Robert Kope from fquinchat@locl.net Tue Mar 5 19:18:39 2002 g261Ic821435 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 19:18:38 -0600 "Rodmakers" Subject: Re: Degloss Varnish Bob, Please expain the procedure for using both rottenstone and pumice stone. =How do you use pumice to remove slight blemishes without deglossing? I =have never used either. Dennis Bertram-----Original Message-----From: Bob Maulucci Rottenstone?-----Original Message-----From: owner- rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu = Sent: Tuesday, March 05, 2002 12:58 PM I am new to this endeavor and have another question. I have used spar varnish in a dip tank and am pleased with the =coverage but is there a good way to de-gloss the hight sheen on the =final coat? Bob, Please expain the procedure for using both = Dennis Bertram -----Original = bcombest@iclub.org = Rodmakers <rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= Tuesday, March 05, 2002 7:22 PMSubject: RE: Degloss = Rottenstone? -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.w= CombestSent: Tuesday, March 05, 2002 12:58 = RodmakersSubject: Degloss Varnish I am new to this endeavor and have = question. I have used spar varnish in a dip = pleased with the coverage but is there a good way to de-gloss the = sheen on the final =coat? from jojo@ipa.net Tue Mar 5 19:23:08 2002 g261N8822296 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 19:23:08 -0600 helo=default) id 16iQ90-0002oK-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Tue, 05 Mar 2002 20:23:03 -0500 Subject: Re: replacing strip Bob, Being able to heat treat single, double, etc., strips was one of the =design criteria, so yeah, it works fine. I actually think it better to =heat two strips minimum when doing this, one directly across from the =other, to minimize or counteract the stresses. M-D Bruce. I ususally bind an extra piece to the outside of the bundle =when I heat treat. You might want to seek out one of Martin-Darrell's =new heat treating set ups. They are extruded metal (aluminum?) that =nestle the strips when put in the oven. I just got mine MOnday, but man =they look nice. They should work as well for one strip as they do 6.M-D, any ideasBobOn Behalf Of Bruce Combest I am new to this endeavor and have some questions. When you have final planned a strip and decide that it is =sub-standard and you wish to replace it with another strip, how do you =heat treat a single strip and what is the procedure? Bob, Being able to heattreat = double, etc., strips was one of the design criteria, so yeah, it works = actually think it better to heat two strips minimum when doing this, one = stresses. M-D Maulucci ususally bind an extra piece to the outside of the bundle when I heat = You might want to seek out one of Martin-Darrell's new heat treating = They are extruded metal (aluminum?) that nestle the strips when put in = oven. I just got mine MOnday, but man they look nice. They should work = Bob On Behalf Of Bruce CombestI am new to this endeavor and have = questions. When you have final planned a strip = that it is sub-standard and you wish to replace it with another = procedure? from channer@frontier.net Tue Mar 5 19:27:30 2002 g261RT823058 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 19:27:29 -0600 Subject: Re: Touch Up with Kodak Fixer Peter;Quit beating around the bush and come to the point, we're all wonderingwhat you really think!LOLjohn Peter McKean wrote: Kyle Just swab the stuff on with a cotton bud - "Q-tip", I believe you know themas; move the solution around, and rinse it off under running water whenyouhave got the darkness you need. Couple of minutes, tops. Buy Ilford fixer. It's liquid, and saves a lot of buggerising around mixingit up. Now we get to the heresy bit. I KNOW all that has been said about thefunction of Hardener in the photo process, and how it's supposed tofuntionto toughen the protein phase of the surface emulsion of film, and I KNOWhowit cannot therefore have any effect at all on bluing nickel silver, and IKNOW that anybody who thinks that it does or can possibly improve thebluingmust be (a) stupid (b) mislead (c) inept (d) in cloud cuckoo land (e) awanker, or (f) all of the above! But it does! Cheers Peter abcdef from jojo@ipa.net Tue Mar 5 19:29:12 2002 g261TC823417 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 19:29:12 -0600 helo=default) id 16iQEx-0004r0-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Tue, 05 Mar 2002 20:29:12 -0500 Subject: Re: displacing nodes Looks like an intentional pun, with malice aforethought, to me. M-D No pun intended, I may be all wet on this deal.Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com from channer@frontier.net Tue Mar 5 19:30:05 2002 g261U5823632 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 19:30:05 -0600 Subject: Re: Degloss Varnish Bruce,Sure is, just use it awhile, it will dull down soon enoughjohn Bruce Combest wrote: I am new to this endeavor and have another question. I have used spar varnish in a dip tank and am pleased with thecoverage but is there a good way to de-gloss the hight sheen on thefinal coat? from dnorl@qwest.net Tue Mar 5 20:26:34 2002 g262QX827823 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 20:26:33 -0600 (63.228.45.133) KyleDruey@aol.com Subject: Re: Touch Up with Kodak Fixer And it doesn't mark the cane?-----Original Message----- KyleDruey@aol.com Subject: Re: Touch Up with Kodak Fixer Exactly. I don't bother bluing ferrules until they're mounted now. It'stoo much bother to try to clean up the tabs without messing up the bluing.I just swab on the fixer before I wrap them. -- Robert----- Original Message -----From: "Peter McKean" Cc: "rodmakers" Sent: Tuesday, March 05, 2002 2:05 PMSubject: Re: Touch Up with Kodak Fixer Kyle Just swab the stuff on with a cotton bud - "Q-tip", I believe you know them as; move the solution around, and rinse it off under running water when you have got the darkness you need. Couple of minutes, tops. Buy Ilford fixer. It's liquid, and saves a lot of buggerising around mixing it up. Now we get to the heresy bit. I KNOW all that has been said about thefunction of Hardener in the photo process, and how it's supposed to funtion to toughen the protein phase of the surface emulsion of film, and I KNOW how it cannot therefore have any effect at all on bluing nickel silver, and IKNOW that anybody who thinks that it does or can possibly improve the bluing must be (a) stupid (b) mislead (c) inept (d) in cloud cuckoo land (e) awanker, or (f) all of the above! But it does! Cheers Peter abcdef from kurt.clement@flashmail.com Tue Mar 5 20:27:48 2002 g262Rl827908 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 20:27:47 -0600 Subject: Effect of Soaking on Strip Dimensions - An Experiment I have begun an experiment to document the effects of soaking on bamboo =strip dimensions.Two methods will be used in the experiment as well as a control. Three =strips from the butt section of a cane will be used, one strip for each =of two methods and a control. Strips are 50 inches long and sample =points will be located at intervals along the strip. Sample point C =will be located on a node. 1. Measure strip width and thicknes at 5 points (a, b, c, d, e).2. Soak strip in water for 24 hours. Measure same 5 points.3. Air dry for 48 hours and measure same 5 points.4. Heat treat at 350 for 30 minutes cool to room temp and measuresame 5=points. (no planing) Method B.1. Measure strip width and thicknes at 5 points (a, b, c, d, e).2. Heat treat at 350 for 30 minutes cool to room temp and measure.3. Soak strip in water for 24 hours. Measure same 5 points.4. Air dry for 48 hours and measure same 5 points. Control1. Measure strip width and thicknes at 5 points (a, b, c, d, e).2. 4 days later measure same strip at the 5 points. Testing - Method AStep 1 - measure strip dryPoint Width ThicknessA .258 .244B .274 .243C .265 .245D .301 .245E .295 .238 Step 2 - soak 24 hoursPoint Width ThicknessA .267 .254B .283 .253C .276 .253D .312 .253E .311 .248 I have begun an experiment to = effects of soaking on bamboo strip dimensions.Two methods will be used in the = 1. Measure strip width and thicknes at 5 points (a, = e). Measure same 5 points. points.4. Heat treat at 350 for 30 minutes cool to room = measuresame 5 points. (no planing) Method B. 1. Measure strip width and thicknes at 5 points (a, = e). 2. Heat treat at 350 for 30 minutes cool to room = measure. Measure same 5 points.4. Air dry for 48 hours andmeasure = points. Control 1. Measure strip width and thicknes at 5 points (a, = e). points. Testing - Method =AStep 1 -measure =strip dry Thickness Step 2 - soak 24 hours Thickness from kurt.clement@flashmail.com Tue Mar 5 20:50:22 2002 g262oK828607 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 20:50:21 -0600 Subject: Re: soaking That 3a would be AFTER 3 right? I soak, do the node work then rough plane.I skip step 5 also. -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: soaking You left out 3a. Straighten and flatten nodes. As I said earlier, I skip5, but it sounds like several guys find planing wet strips to be muchquicker and easier.Brian----- Original Message -----From: "Aebersold, Dennis R" Sent: Tuesday, March 05, 2002 11:00 AMSubject: soaking Let me summarize and ask a quesiton. I've heard all of the steps below.Which would you leave out and why? 1. Flame2a, Split2. Soak3. Rough Bevel4. Bind and heat treat5. Soak6. Final Plane7. Minor heat again8. Glue9. Heat to set glue. -dDennis Aebersold from KyleDruey@aol.com Tue Mar 5 21:01:16 2002 g2631F829049 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 21:01:15 -0600 Subject: Re: Touch Up with Kodak Fixer I thought Peter was being just a little too harsh on himself, especially the part about being a wanker... [:)] In a message dated 03/05/2002 5:28:00 PM Pacific Standard Time, channer@frontier.net writes: Peter;Quit beating around the bush and come to the point, we're all wonderingwhat you really think!LOLjohnPeter McKean wrote:KyleJust swab the stuff on with a cotton bud - "Q-tip", I believe you know themas; move the solution around, and rinse it off under running water when youhave got the darkness you need. Couple of minutes, tops.Buy Ilford fixer. It's liquid, and saves a lot of buggerising around mixingit up.Now we get to the heresy bit. I KNOW all that has been said about thefunction of Hardener in the photo process, and how it's supposed to funtionto toughen the protein phase of the surface emulsion of film, and I KNOW howit cannot therefore have any effect at all on bluing nickel silver, and IKNOW that anybody who thinks that it does or can possibly improve the bluingmust be (a) stupid (b) mislead (c) inept (d) in cloud cuckoo land (e) awanker, or (f) all of the above!But it does!CheersPeter abcdef----------------------- Headers ---------------------------- ----Return-Path: Received: from rly-yg01.mx.aol.com (rly-yg01.mail.aol.com Tue, 05 Mar 2002 20:27:59 -0500Received: from cadmium.frontier.net (cadmium.frontier.net 0305202737; Tue, 05 Mar 2002 20:27:37 -0500Received: from frontier.net (ppp29.pm3-06.durango.frontier.net[66.118.194. Message-ID: Date: Tue, 05 Mar 2002 18:28:01 -0700From: channer X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.74 [en]C-CCK-MCD NS4xx/Winxx/EZN (Win95; U)X-Accept- Language: en Cc: KyleDruey@aol.com, rodmakers Subject: Re: Touch Up with Kodak FixerReferences: mckean> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit from kurt.clement@flashmail.com Tue Mar 5 21:04:15 2002 g2634E829253 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 21:04:15 -0600 Subject: Re: displacing nodes What units of moisture gain are you refering to? If these are grams, whatis the original weight of the sample, or what is the conversion in %moisture content? Ranges of moisture regain ran the gamut between .2g-.5g, with most being .3g. Considering that the thought-to-be original moisture contents ran from .2g-.9g, with most running .6g, it follows that I've started a small experiment on soaking, dimensional changes and theaffect of heat treating before or after soaking on changes. It will takeabout a week. KurtNixa, MO -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: displacing nodes Indeed heat treating does condition the bamboo to regain less moisturethan it previously had. Ranges of moisture regain ran the gamut between .2g-.5g, with most being .3g. Considering that the thought-to-be original moisture contents ran from .2g-.9g, with most running .6g, it follows that we've done something to the bamboo to cause it to have a reduced ability to hold moisture, and that something is a crosslinking of molecules within the lignin, brought about moisture and volatile oils, leaving -OH (hydroxyl) groups, which are strong bonders, that seek out the proper molecular chains with which to bond. At least this is what happens with other cellulose products, and there's no reason for me to believe that bamboo is any different. Besides, who cares as long as it works, right?Soaking strips is an entirely different thing though. In my experience they will attain the same weight after heat treating as they did before. The primary difference is that they apparently will dry to the same, or nearly the same, level of equilibrium moisture content. It does, however, take several days to achieve a saturation of the strips, and one or two days is not sufficient to achieve this saturation, in my experience. M-D From: "Splitcane" Hi Dave et all. If one heat treat the bamboo in the right manner (not above 180Ÿ Celsius) the bamboo is undergoing a process called hydrophobic. I don't recall the correct datas but roughly spoken: the heat treatment conditions the bamboo so it'll be only be able to regain a certain amount of humidity (which is less then before heat treatment).tight linesMichael from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Tue Mar 5 21:06:05 2002 g26364829432 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 21:06:04 -0600 (authenticated) Tue, 5 Mar 2002 19:05:52 -0800 Subject: Re: Degloss Varnish --------------6BF75DAD29992DBC8FFE8CF5 Bruce, MaGuire's auto polish, in the tan bottle, #2, will do quite nicely. As you might suspect, testit before you start rubbing away on your rod. Harry Boyd Bruce Combest wrote: I am new to this endeavor and have anotherquestion. I have used spar varnish in a dip tankand am pleased with the coverage but is there agood way to de- gloss the hight sheen on thefinal coat? -- -- Harry Boyd --http://www.canerods.com/ -- Bamboo Rods -- http://www.fbcwin.com/ -- Our Church -- --------------6BF75DAD29992DBC8FFE8CF5 Bruce, away on your rod. Bruce Combest wrote: Iam new to this endeavor and have another question. Ihave used spar varnish in a dip tank and am pleased with the coverage butis there a good way to de- gloss the hight sheen on the finalcoat?-- -- Bamboo Rods -- --------------6BF75DAD29992DBC8FFE8CF5-- from FISHWOOL@aol.com Tue Mar 5 21:11:51 2002 g263Bn829767 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 21:11:50 -0600 Subject: Re: Touch Up with Kodak Fixer petermckean@netspace.net.au,KyleDruey@aol.com Nope.Hank. from jojo@ipa.net Tue Mar 5 21:24:19 2002 g263OJ800278 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 21:24:19 -0600 helo=default) id 16iS2L-0002F2-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Tue, 05 Mar 2002 22:24:18 -0500 Subject: Re: Touch Up with Kodak Fixer No. I rather think that if Pete sees himself as a wanker, then wanker he be. M-D I thought Peter was being just a little too harsh on himself, especially the part about being a wanker... [:)] channer@frontier.net writes: Peter;Quit beating around the bush and come to the point, we're all wonderingwhat you really think!LOLjohnPeter McKean wrote:KyleNow we get to the heresy bit. I KNOW all that has been said about thefunction of Hardener in the photo process, and how it's supposed to funtionto toughen the protein phase of the surface emulsion of film, and I KNOW howit cannot therefore have any effect at all on bluing nickel silver, and IKNOW that anybody who thinks that it does or can possibly improve the bluingmust be (a) stupid (b) mislead (c) inept (d) in cloud cuckoo land (e) awanker, or (f) all of the above!But it does!CheersPeter abcdef----------------------- Headers ----- ---------------------------Return-Path: Received: from rly-yg01.mx.aol.com (rly-yg01.mail.aol.com Tue, 05 Mar 2002 20:27:59 -0500Received: from cadmium.frontier.net (cadmium.frontier.net 0305202737; Tue, 05 Mar 2002 20:27:37 -0500Received: from frontier.net (ppp29.pm3-06.durango.frontier.net[66.118.194. Message-ID: Date: Tue, 05 Mar 2002 18:28:01 -0700From: channer X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.74 [en]C-CCK-MCD NS4xx/Winxx/EZN (Win95; U)X-Accept- Language: en Cc: KyleDruey@aol.com, rodmakers Subject: Re: Touch Up with Kodak FixerReferences: mckean> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit from KlingB@health.missouri.edu Tue Mar 5 21:37:07 2002 g263b6800829 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 21:37:06 -0600 Tue, 5 Mar 2002 21:36:57 -0600content-class: urn:content- classes:messageSubject: RE: Touch Up with Kodak Fixer Thread-Topic: Touch Up with Kodak FixerThread-Index: AcHEkiMs/Mlv1TCAEda4KQBglOouXwALf1jQ FILETIME=[2B0D4760:01C1C4C0] g263b6800830 Dear Dr. McKean: OK, let's get this straight. Only a stupid wanker (etc) would say the hardenerHELPs the bluing. But what am I if I've used Kodak powdered fixer (mixeddouble strength), which includes a hardener, and found that it still works OK?I kind of like the sound of "Wanker" but am unsure where I stand. Signed, Mixed Up In MIssouri -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Touch Up with Kodak Fixer Kyle Just swab the stuff on with a cotton bud - "Q-tip", I believe you know themas; move the solution around, and rinse it off under running water when youhave got the darkness you need. Couple of minutes, tops. Buy Ilford fixer. It's liquid, and saves a lot of buggerising around mixingit up. Now we get to the heresy bit. I KNOW all that has been said about thefunction of Hardener in the photo process, and how it's supposed to funtionto toughen the protein phase of the surface emulsion of film, and I KNOWhowit cannot therefore have any effect at all on bluing nickel silver, and IKNOW that anybody who thinks that it does or can possibly improve thebluingmust be (a) stupid (b) mislead (c) inept (d) in cloud cuckoo land (e) awanker, or (f) all of the above! But it does! Cheers Peter abcdef from jojo@ipa.net Tue Mar 5 21:45:57 2002 g263ju801180 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 21:45:56 -0600 helo=default) id 16iSNH-0007fW-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Tue, 05 Mar 2002 22:45:55 -0500 Subject: Re: Touch Up with Kodak Fixer Thy wanketh, also. M-D Dear Dr. McKean: OK, let's get this straight. Only a stupid wanker (etc) would say the hardenerHELPs the bluing. Butwhat am I if I've used Kodak powdered fixer (mixed double strength), whichincludes a hardener, andfound that it still works OK? I kind of like the sound of "Wanker" but amunsure where I stand. Signed, Mixed Up In MIssouri from rextutor@yahoo.com Tue Mar 5 21:56:58 2002 g263uu801683 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 21:56:57 -0600 05 Mar 2002 19:56:56 PST Subject: RE: replacing strip Rodmakers BobI have never heard of Martin-Darrell's new heattreating set ups. What are they , where can we see oneTIA--- Bob Maulucci wrote: Bruce. I ususally bind an extra piece to the outsideof the bundle when Iheat treat. You might want to seek out one ofMartin-Darrell's new heattreating set ups. They are extruded metal(aluminum?) that nestle the stripswhen put in the oven. I just got mine MOnday, butman they look nice. Theyshould work as well for one strip as they do 6.M-D, any ideasBob-----Original Message----- From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Of Bruce CombestSent: Tuesday, March 05, 2002 12:55 PM Subject: replacing strip I am new to this endeavor and have some questions. When you have final planned a strip and decidethat it is sub-standard andyou wish to replace it with another strip, how doyou heat treat a singlestrip and what is the procedure? __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Try FREE Yahoo! Mail - the world's greatest free email!http://mail.yahoo.com/ from rextutor@yahoo.com Tue Mar 5 22:07:58 2002 g2647v802161 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 22:07:57 -0600 05 Mar 2002 20:07:57 PST Subject: replacing strip BruceI used to make 7 strips for 6 strips rods - in fact onmy first 6 rods. I never used them and made a sectionout of them. Then I made several rods without problemsuntil I cut a very thin tip section with a plane. Iused two pieces of fresh bamboo with outsides/ enamlefacing up and down in the oven. It worked with about1/2 the time for the 6 sections. But I did watch thebake carefully for the correct color. I pulled themout a few times and rotated as well as turned themover (like Garrison).good luck __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Try FREE Yahoo! Mail - the world's greatest free email!http://mail.yahoo.com/ from avyoung@iinet.net.au Tue Mar 5 22:10:38 2002 g264Aa802357 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 22:10:37 -0600 petermckean@netspace.net.au Subject: Re: Touch Up with Kodak Fixer I'd have thought so too but I do have to wonder why the hardener would be of any use in the bluing process, I haven't tried the hardener as Peter obviously has though.I wonder if it separates out, jells and forms a sort of barrier over the bluing?One thing's for sure and that's the Ilford hardener does make a nice finish. Tony At 10:00 PM 3/5/02 -0500, KyleDruey@aol.com wrote: I thought Peter was being just a little too harsh on himself, especially thepart about being a wanker... [:)] In a message dated 03/05/2002 5:28:00 PM Pacific Standard Time,channer@frontier.net writes: Peter;Quit beating around the bush and come to the point, we're all wonderingwhat you really think!LOLjohn Peter McKean wrote: Kyle Just swab the stuff on with a cotton bud - "Q-tip", I believe you knowthemas; move the solution around, and rinse it off under running water whenyouhave got the darkness you need. Couple of minutes, tops. Buy Ilford fixer. It's liquid, and saves a lot of buggerising aroundmixingit up. Now we get to the heresy bit. I KNOW all that has been said about thefunction of Hardener in the photo process, and how it's supposed tofuntionto toughen the protein phase of the surface emulsion of film, and I KNOW howit cannot therefore have any effect at all on bluing nickel silver, and I KNOW that anybody who thinks that it does or can possibly improve thebluingmust be (a) stupid (b) mislead (c) inept (d) in cloud cuckoo land (e) awanker, or (f) all of the above! But it does! Cheers Peter abcdef ----------------------- Headers --------------------------------Return-Path: Received: from rly-yg01.mx.aol.com (rly-yg01.mail.aol.com 0305202759; Tue, 05 Mar 2002 20:27:59 -0500Received: from cadmium.frontier.net (cadmium.frontier.net 0305202737; Tue, 05 Mar 2002 20:27:37 -0500Received: from frontier.net (ppp29.pm3-06.durango.frontier.net [66.118.194. Message-ID: Date: Tue, 05 Mar 2002 18:28:01 -0700From: channer X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.74 [en]C-CCK-MCD NS4xx/Winxx/EZN (Win95; U)X-Accept- Language: en Cc: KyleDruey@aol.com, rodmakers Subject: Re: Touch Up with Kodak FixerReferences: mckean> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html Christmas Gift Tips Avoid at any cost Christmas crackers with the label: Made in Afghanistan /*************************************************************************/ from avyoung@iinet.net.au Tue Mar 5 22:23:28 2002 g264NQ802858 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 22:23:26 -0600 Subject: RE: Touch Up with Kodak Fixer Dear Mixed Up In Missouri,the sound of the word wanker may seem to those unaccustomed to it'susage be sweet to the ear but in fact it's best to not aspire to be one.It denotes a combination of jerkoff/dick head and general walloper. It's worse than being a "wally" and even worse again than being a "steamingwally". These terms are never used as friendly gestures as are being called a "stupid bast_rd", wombat, wanker (but only when said with a smile) etc.It's all very confusing and indeed seemingly contradictory, as far as I know there is no dictionary to assist nor courses to take to get a real grasp of the colourful use of Strine except to live here a while.I do think Peter was being a bit hard on himself. Tony At 09:36 PM 3/5/02 -0600, Kling, Barry W. wrote: Dear Dr. McKean: OK, let's get this straight. Only a stupid wanker (etc) would say the hardener HELPs the bluing. But what am I if I've used Kodak powdered fixer (mixed double strength), which includes a hardener, and found that it still works OK? I kind of like the sound of "Wanker" but am unsure where I stand. Signed, Mixed Up In MIssouri -----Original Message----- Sent: Tuesday, March 05, 2002 4:05 PM Cc: rodmakersSubject: Re: Touch Up with Kodak Fixer Kyle Just swab the stuff on with a cotton bud - "Q-tip", I believe you know themas; move the solution around, and rinse it off under running water when youhave got the darkness you need. Couple of minutes, tops. Buy Ilford fixer. It's liquid, and saves a lot of buggerising around mixingit up. Now we get to the heresy bit. I KNOW all that has been said about thefunction of Hardener in the photo process, and how it's supposed tofuntionto toughen the protein phase of the surface emulsion of film, and I KNOWhowit cannot therefore have any effect at all on bluing nickel silver, and IKNOW that anybody who thinks that it does or can possibly improve thebluingmust be (a) stupid (b) mislead (c) inept (d) in cloud cuckoo land (e) awanker, or (f) all of the above! But it does! Cheers Peter abcdef /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html Christmas Gift Tips Avoid at any cost Christmas crackers with the label: Made in Afghanistan /*************************************************************************/ from rodwrapp@swbell.net Tue Mar 5 22:44:15 2002 g264iE803628 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 22:44:14 -0600 (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 (built May 7 2001)) Subject: Re: Touch Up with Kodak Fixer KyleDruey@aol.com Where do you get this Kodak Fixer?? Thanks Dave----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Touch Up with Kodak Fixer Exactly. I don't bother bluing ferrules until they're mounted now. It'stoo much bother to try to clean up the tabs without messing up the bluing.I just swab on the fixer before I wrap them. -- Robert----- Original Message -----From: "Peter McKean" Cc: "rodmakers" Sent: Tuesday, March 05, 2002 2:05 PMSubject: Re: Touch Up with Kodak Fixer Kyle Just swab the stuff on with a cotton bud - "Q-tip", I believe you know them as; move the solution around, and rinse it off under running water when you have got the darkness you need. Couple of minutes, tops. Buy Ilford fixer. It's liquid, and saves a lot of buggerising around mixing it up. Now we get to the heresy bit. I KNOW all that has been said about thefunction of Hardener in the photo process, and how it's supposed to funtion to toughen the protein phase of the surface emulsion of film, and I KNOW how it cannot therefore have any effect at all on bluing nickel silver, and I KNOW that anybody who thinks that it does or can possibly improve the bluing must be (a) stupid (b) mislead (c) inept (d) in cloud cuckoo land (e) awanker, or (f) all of the above! But it does! Cheers Peter abcdef from KyleDruey@aol.com Tue Mar 5 23:53:58 2002 g265rv805343 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2002 23:53:57 -0600 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 00:53:49 - Subject: Re: Touch Up with Kodak Fixer just for the record, I think the good Doctor McKean referred to himself as a stupid, misleading, inept, in cloud cuckoo land, type of wanker... [:)] This really is the worst kind. But he seems to have his blueing down cold. In a message dated 03/05/2002 7:37:19 PM Pacific Standard Time, KlingB@health.missouri.edu writes: Dear Dr. McKean:OK, let's get this straight. Only a stupid wanker (etc) would say the hardener HELPs the bluing. But what am I if I've used Kodak powdered fixer(mixed double strength), which includes a hardener, and found that it still works OK? I kind of like the sound of "Wanker" but am unsure where Istand.Signed, from petermckean@netspace.net.au Wed Mar 6 04:16:37 2002 g26AGZ810198 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 04:16:35 -0600 g26AGPR27522; Subject: Re: Touch Up with Kodak Fixer Barry Now that's really interesting! The Kodak product contains hardener, does it really? I have spoken to somany people who use the Kodak stuff, and they have very consistent results. I started to use it because the bluing kit that REC sells contains Part Aand Part B, which are fixer and hardener. They were helpful enough not tosell me any, because they thought it was a little silly to be sending fixeracross the world, but just told me what the parts were. I used the Ilford product, because I have heaps of their X-ray fixer andhardener always on hand. I get the feeling that Kodak has probably got aless firm grip on the market here than in the US, so it is as easy to getone as the other. And fixer is pretty much fixer. Now I am going to have to go out and get some of the Kodak stuff to try,aren't I? Cheers Peter from kenealyj@gwi.net Wed Mar 6 04:40:35 2002 g26AeY810830 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 04:40:34 -0600 ,"Rodmakers" Subject: Re: replacing strip I just got my set this past Monday, and they are pretty nifty! I haven'tused them yet, but I can see how they may revolutionize heat treating. and,yes, M-D gives me half his profit and promised me his first born.They are extruded aluminum and come 6' long(you cut to your desiredlength). from an end view, they look like a snowflake. they have six "V" s that runthe length and you bind the strips into each "V" and put them in the oven.A set is 3, 1 for butt and 2 tips.I'm in central Maine, if that helps you. John K----- Original Message ----- Subject: RE: replacing strip BobI have never heard of Martin-Darrell's new heattreating set ups. What are they , where can we see oneTIA--- Bob Maulucci wrote: Bruce. I ususally bind an extra piece to the outsideof the bundle when Iheat treat. You might want to seek out one ofMartin-Darrell's new heattreating set ups. They are extruded metal(aluminum?) that nestle the stripswhen put in the oven. I just got mine MOnday, butman they look nice. Theyshould work as well for one strip as they do 6.M-D, any ideasBob-----Original Message----- From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Of Bruce CombestSent: Tuesday, March 05, 2002 12:55 PM Subject: replacing strip I am new to this endeavor and have some questions. When you have final planned a strip and decidethat it is sub-standard andyou wish to replace it with another strip, how doyou heat treat a singlestrip and what is the procedure? __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Try FREE Yahoo! Mail - the world's greatest free email!http://mail.yahoo.com/ from DCURTIS@satx.rr.com Wed Mar 6 05:31:12 2002 g26BVB812123 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 05:31:11 -0600 g26BX7hw006972 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 05:33:14 -0600 Subject: RE: Touch Up with Kodak Fixer This is the definition from Encarta. wanker wank.er [wangkr ] (plural wank.ers) noun U.K. Australia, New Zealand (taboo) 1. a taboo term for somebody who masturbates 2. a taboo term for an unpleasant, self-indulgent, pretentious, or arrogantperson [Mid-20th century] from bob@downandacross.com Wed Mar 6 05:57:44 2002 g26Bvh812997 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 05:57:44 -0600 "Rodmakers" Subject: RE: Degloss Varnish Dennis:I do not do this to my finish, but I think the recommended way is to use theRottenstone with an oil of some sort. The only thing else I can say is thatin my few attempts to use semi gloss, I think buffing down from gloss ispreferrable to using the semi. That stuff is hard to work with.Best regards,Bob Subject: Re: Degloss Varnish Bob, Please expain the procedure for using both rottenstone and pumice stone.How do you use pumice to remove slight blemishes without deglossing? Ihavenever used either. Dennis Bertram-----Original Message-----From: Bob Maulucci Subject: RE: Degloss Varnish Rottenstone?-----Original Message-----From: owner- rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Tuesday, March 05, 2002 12:58 PM Subject: Degloss Varnish I am new to this endeavor and have another question. I have used spar varnish in a dip tank and am pleased with thecoverage but is there a good way to de-gloss the hight sheen on the finalcoat? Dennis:I do notdo = finish, but I think the recommended way is to use the Rottenstone with = some sort. The only thing else I can say is that in my few attempts to = gloss, I think buffing down from gloss is preferrable to using the semi. = stuff is hard to work with.Best Bob 8:18 = RodmakersSubject: Re: Degloss Varnish = Bob, Please expain the procedure for using both = Dennis Bertram -----Original = bcombest@iclub.org = <rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= Tuesday, March 05, 2002 7:22 PMSubject: RE: Degloss= Rottenstone? -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.w= = CombestSent: Tuesday, March 05, 2002 12:58 = RodmakersSubject: Degloss Varnish I am new to this endeavor and = question. I have used spar varnish in a dip = pleased with the coverage but is there a good way to de-gloss the = coat? from bob@downandacross.com Wed Mar 6 06:01:40 2002 g26C1d813259 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 06:01:39 -0600 , "Rodmakers" Subject: RE: replacing strip Rex, that's it. Maybe M-D will give details or if he is having moreextruded.Bob -----Original Message----- RodmakersSubject: Re: replacing strip I just got my set this past Monday, and they are pretty nifty! I haven'tused them yet, but I can see how they may revolutionize heat treating. and,yes, M-D gives me half his profit and promised me his first born.They are extruded aluminum and come 6' long(you cut to your desiredlength). from an end view, they look like a snowflake. they have six "V" s that runthe length and you bind the strips into each "V" and put them in the oven.A set is 3, 1 for butt and 2 tips.I'm in central Maine, if that helps you. from wendt@kingcrab.nrl.navy.mil Wed Mar 6 06:26:42 2002 g26CQf813797 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 06:26:41 -0600 g26CQfdd019535 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 07:26:41 -0500 Subject: Re: Grizzley 3/4" bit Tony, Yes I did. Thanks for the information. As usual, this group comes through again, with the folks that come up with the ideas, and the folks like Todd that manage a place to put all this stuff. Great work guys! Mark At 06:27 PM 3/5/2002 -0600, you wrote: MarkWere you able to get them from Todd's site. If not, let me know.Tony Mark Wendt wrote: Tony, I'd be interested in taking a peek at the setup. Thanks,Mark At 09:05 AM 3/3/02 -0600, you wrote: That is what I use and I find it to be just fine.If you would like to see the set up and results I can send you someshots.Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com earsdws@duke.edu wrote: Gang,A while back someone described using the Grizzley 3/4" tumbnail(C1215)bit for mortising reel seats. I can't recall how successful theenterprise was. Anyone out there have any experience with this, orsimilar bits?Thanks, dws. from avyoung@iinet.net.au Wed Mar 6 06:33:50 2002 g26CXm814093 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 06:33:48 -0600 "Kling, Barry W." Subject: Re: Touch Up with Kodak Fixer g26CXo814094 This below is from Ilford's site.As you'd be aware there are quite a few different products made by Ilford including different fixers and hardeners as well as films and papers so what is recommended for one is not necessarily recommended for all and the requirements vary depending upon the task required.To add to that some chemicals are recommended for negs, some for printsand also some will do both. In Peter's case of developing x-ray pics these are basically negatives that will be experiencing a lot of handling so the resin, medium and processing are all geared that way and the use of a hardener is required.As you'll read below if you get that far using a hardener is not recommended in some cases because it doesn't actually add anything to the hardness of the neg and in some cases is not compatible but it all depends on the required end result and I very much doubt Ilford are making this stuff to blue NS ferrules. So, even though REC use a two part mix for their blue and Peter uses a two part mix that does not necessarily mean it's required but it does depend on what fixer you use.I'm using Ilford Hypam Rapid Fixer which I've always used for photography which is a non hardening fixer that fixer can be added to for negs though it's not recommended for Ilford paper prints.No matter what it does seem to me that the hardener only really hardens the coating of the paper or resin and not the blued effect on NS BUT in Peter's case using chemicals designed for use with x-rays it could be different. IMHO you don't need to use hardener if you varnish over the blued bits and pieces. Tony FIX HARDENERILFORD RAPID FIXER and ILFORD ILFOFIX II mustnot be used with fix hardeners as they are notcompatible with them. If a fix hardener is requiredthen only ILFORD HYPAM fixer can be used. AddILFORD HYPAM HARDENER to turn HYPAM into ahardening fixer.Generally for most applications modern camerafilms are sufficiently hardened at manufacture.Additional hardening from a fixer hardener is notusually needed or recommended for manualprocessing in spiral tanks or dishes/trays ormachine processing in a rotary processor, unlessthe processing temperature is above 30·C/86·F orpoor drying performance is being experienced. agent added to water, it helps the film to dryrapidly and evenly. Start by using 5ml/l of rinsewater (1+200), however the amount of ILFOTOLThe amount of HYPAM HARDENER that can beadded to the fixer is dependant on the film andprocess conditions used. In some processors thefull amount of hardener cannot be used as the fixand wash times cannot be extended adequately. Inthese circumstances we recommend starting withthe minimum amount of hardener to have someeffect. This is around 3_6mls of hardener per litreof working strength HYPAM used. This increasesthe film hardness slightly but has a negligible effecton the fix and wash efficiency.When fix and washtimes are restricted the maximum amount ofHYPAM HARDENER recommended is 10_20mls ofhardener per litre of working strength HYPAMused. This higher amount will give a definiteincrease to the hardness of the films processed andwhile fixing and washing efficiency are reducedthe films will be adequately fixed and washed formost purposes.When fix and wash times can be extended themaximum amount of HYPAM HARDENER neededto achieve fully hardened films is 1 part to 40parts working strength HYPAM. i.e. 24 ml/l. At 09:15 PM 3/6/02 +1100, Peter McKean wrote: Barry Now that's really interesting! The Kodak product contains hardener, does it really? I have spoken to somany people who use the Kodak stuff, and they have very consistentresults. I started to use it because the bluing kit that REC sells contains Part Aand Part B, which are fixer and hardener. They were helpful enough not tosell me any, because they thought it was a little silly to be sending fixeracross the world, but just told me what the parts were. I used the Ilford product, because I have heaps of their X-ray fixer andhardener always on hand. I get the feeling that Kodak has probably got aless firm grip on the market here than in the US, so it is as easy to getone as the other. And fixer is pretty much fixer. Now I am going to have to go out and get some of the Kodak stuff to try,aren't I? Cheers Peter /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html Christmas Gift Tips Avoid at any cost Christmas crackers with the label: Made in Afghanistan /*************************************************************************/ from avyoung@iinet.net.au Wed Mar 6 06:36:57 2002 g26Cat814314 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 06:36:55 -0600 Subject: RE: Touch Up with Kodak Fixer This is the way the term normally applied: 2. a taboo term for an unpleasant, self-indulgent, pretentious, or arrogantperson The feeling behind the term is usually more than can be expressed in words but it depends on who and why the term is used.There is a Canadian who sometimes makes a ram raid to the list this applies to in spades. TY /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html Christmas Gift Tips Avoid at any cost Christmas crackers with the label: Made in Afghanistan /*************************************************************************/ from pvansch@wethersfield.k12.ct.us Wed Mar 6 06:48:08 2002 g26Cm7814728 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 06:48:07 -0600 Subject: RE: Degloss Varnish Organization: Wethersfield Public Schools Bruce, I lightly rub down with steal wool 00 enough to get rid of gloss and anyblemishes or dust, then polish with bowling alley wax to protect. Pete -----Original Message----- Subject: Degloss Varnish I am new to this endeavor and have another question. I have used spar varnish in a dip tank and am pleased with the coveragebut is there a good way to de-gloss the hight sheen on the final coat? Message Bruce, lightly rub down with steal wool 00 enough to get rid of gloss and any = or dust, then polish with bowling alley wax to =protect. Pete -----Original Message----- owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu = On Behalf Of Bruce CombestSent: Tuesday, March05, = I am new to this endeavor and have = question. I have used spar varnish in a dip = pleased with the coverage but is there a good way to de-gloss the = on the final coat? from aebersold@ou.edu Wed Mar 6 07:01:49 2002 g26D1n815380 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 07:01:49 -0600 id ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 07:01:48 -0600 Dennis Bertram , bcombest@iclub.org,Rodmakers Subject: RE: Degloss Varnish this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. Moisten a small piece of felt, actually don't have it dripping but put agood amount of linseed oil on it. put on the felt enough Rottenstone sothat you can't see any powder. Rub the finish until you get the look youwant. Wipe with mineral spirits. I use Behlen Buffer's Polish. It comesin #1, #2, #3 and finishing. #1 will put a satin sheen on the finish. Workyour way up the numbers until you have the finish you are looking for. Ifyou go all the way it will shine/gloss better than when you started becauseyou will have rubbed out any minute inperfections-dennis -----Original Message----- Subject: RE: Degloss Varnish Dennis:I do not do this to my finish, but I think the recommended way is to use theRottenstone with an oil of some sort. The only thing else I can say is thatin my few attempts to use semi gloss, I think buffing down from gloss ispreferrable to using the semi. That stuff is hard to work with.Best regards, Bob Subject: Re: Degloss Varnish Bob, Please expain the procedure for using both rottenstone and pumice stone.How do you use pumice to remove slight blemishes without deglossing? Ihavenever used either. Dennis Bertram -----Original Message----- Subject: RE: Degloss Varnish Rottenstone? -----Original Message----- Subject: Degloss Varnish I am new to this endeavor and have another question. I have used spar varnish in a dip tank and am pleased with the coverage butis there a good way to de-gloss the hight sheen on the final coat? Moisten a small piece of felt, actually don't have it dripping but put a you you started because you will have rubbed out any minute inperfections -----Original Message-----From: Bob Maulucci 06, 2002 5:57 RodmakersSubject: RE: DeglossVarnishDennis:I do not dothis to my finish, but I think the recommended way is to use the Rottenstone with anoil of some sort. The only thing else I can say is that in my few attempts touse semi gloss, I think buffing down from gloss is preferrable to using the semi. That stuff is hard to work with.Best regards, Bob Dennis Bertram 8:18 RodmakersSubject: Re: Degloss Varnish Bob, Please expain the procedure for using both rottenstoneand without Dennis Bertram -----Original Message-----From: bcombest@iclub.org Rodmakers Tuesday, March 05, 2002 7:22 PMSubject: RE:Degloss Varnish Rottenstone? -----Original Message-----From: owner- rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu]On Behalf Of Bruce CombestSent: Tuesday, March 05, 2002 12:58 I am new to this endeavor and have another question. I have used spar varnish in a dip tank and am pleased with the coverage but is there a good way to de-gloss the hight sheen on the final coat? from aport@si.rr.com Wed Mar 6 07:15:38 2002 g26DFb816771 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 07:15:37 -0600 Wed, 6 Mar 2002 08:15:33 -0500 "Rodmakers" Subject: Re: Degloss Varnish Bruce,I have a block of wood with a 1/2" thick slab of felt glued to it =that I use for rubbing out the finish on cabinetwork. I apply some =mineral oil to it and dab it into some rottenstone and rub it lengthwise =on the strip, counting the passes so as to get all sides to the same =point. Works for me!Art Bruce, glued to it that I use for rubbing out the finish on cabinetwork. I = mineral oil to it and dab it into some rottenstone and rub it lengthwise = strip, counting the passes so as to get all sides to the same point. = me!Art from mmihalas@mindspring.com Wed Mar 6 07:24:13 2002 g26DOC817298 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 07:24:12 -0600 helo=smaug) id 16ibOt-0001xh-00 for rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu; Wed, 06 Mar 2002 08:24:12 -0500 Subject: Removing Ferrules I just glued my first set of ferrules on last night and I am not all thatpleased with how they turned out. The tabs didn't flatten against the rodlike they should have. I guess because I used cotton thread to bind them? I glued the ferrules with Devcon 5-minute. Is there a way to remove themeasily and cleanly without damage to the cane? Thanks, Mike Mihalas from lblove@omniglobal.net Wed Mar 6 07:39:28 2002 g26DdS817883 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 07:39:28 -0600 (63.114.42.80) Subject: Re: Touch Up with Kodak Fixer but is there a rabbit on the bottom of the bowl... *********** REPLY SEPARATOR *********** On 3/6/02 at 12:53 AM KyleDruey@aol.com wrote: just for the record, I think the good Doctor McKean referred to himselfas a stupid, misleading, inept, in cloud cuckoo land, type of wanker... [:)] from kenealyj@gwi.net Wed Mar 6 07:52:01 2002 g26Dq0818436 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 07:52:00 -0600 Subject: Re: Removing Ferrules Mike, the 5 minute loosens easily with a bit of heat, like from an alcohol lamp.It doesn't take much. John K----- Original Message ----- Subject: Removing Ferrules I just glued my first set of ferrules on last night and I am not all thatpleased with how they turned out. The tabs didn't flatten against the rodlike they should have. I guess because I used cotton thread to bind them? I glued the ferrules with Devcon 5-minute. Is there a way to remove themeasily and cleanly without damage to the cane? Thanks, Mike Mihalas from cw@vanion.com Wed Mar 6 07:58:03 2002 g26Dw2818809 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 07:58:03 -0600 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 07:03:00 -0700 Subject: Thanks I really appreciate all the imfo, and advice on the Bellinger Rough-out =Beveler. All you guys are great. This site is wonderful. Thanks, Chad I really appreciate all the imfo, = the Bellinger Rough-out Beveler. All you guys are great. This site is = Thanks, Chad from jojo@ipa.net Wed Mar 6 08:11:43 2002 g26EBh819466 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 08:11:43 -0600 helo=default) id 16ic8n-0006XJ-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Wed, 06 Mar 2002 09:11:37 -0500 Subject: Heat Treating Fixtures Well, John pretty much summed it up. With the fixtures the way they are,one can do individualstrips or any number up to six. Besides this, they conduct heat directly intoand throughout thestrips, rather than have them exposed only on the enamel side, plus thebound bundle is as straightas can be, without having to straighten it after binding.They are made of 6063 T5 aluminum alloy, stress relieved, and anodized.These are for hex rods, or60Ÿ strips only, but quads will be available in the coming months. Thediameter of each fixture isapprox. .541 x 6' in length. As John pointed out, they can be cut to length tosuit.They come in sets of 3, but more pieces are available. I have approx. 150pieces left. If anyone isinterested, please contact me off list. M-D Rex, that's it. Maybe M-D will give details or if he is having moreextruded.Bob I just got my set this past Monday, and they are pretty nifty! I haven'tused them yet, but I can see how they may revolutionize heat treating. and,yes, M-D gives me half his profit and promised me his first born.They are extruded aluminum and come 6' long(you cut to your desiredlength). from an end view, they look like a snowflake. they have six "V" s that runthe length and you bind the strips into each "V" and put them in the oven.A set is 3, 1 for butt and 2 tips.I'm in central Maine, if that helps you. from Jkvseafood@aol.com Wed Mar 6 08:25:18 2002 g26EPH820723 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 08:25:17 -0600 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 09:25:04 -0500 Subject: web address does anyone have ron kusse's web or email address? john from bhoy551@earthlink.net Wed Mar 6 08:27:58 2002 g26ERv821014 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 08:27:57 -0600 Wed, 6 Mar 2002 09:27:54 -0500 "Rodmakers" Subject: Re: replacing strip FILETIME=[1A997CE0:01C1C51B] I routed shallow v-grooves in a long piece of wood and bind them into that. Somebody suggested this in a planing form several issues ago, but he used a maple dowel. Couldn't figure out how to rout a straight groove in a dowel. bill At 06:48 PM 3/5/2002 -0600, Steven trauthwein wrote: Bruce, I have taken a number of strips from the original culm and bundled them up as well as possible to heat treat for one. I now carry four extra strips all the way through the rod building process to rough planing in case I need extras. I will have to make a rod from the remainders some day. Regards, SteveIndependence, MO----- Original Message -----From: Bruce Combest Sent: Tuesday, March 05, 2002 11:54 AMSubject: replacing strip I am new to this endeavor and have some questions. When you have final planned a strip and decide that it is sub-standard and you wish to replace it with another strip, how do you heat treat a single strip and what is the procedure? from ttalsma@macatawa.org Wed Mar 6 08:45:42 2002 g26Ejf822358 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 08:45:41 -0600 id ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 09:38:23 -0500 id F563CHPK; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 09:38:13 -0500 Subject: Re: web address http://www.ronkusse.com/ Jkvseafood@aol.com wrote: does anyone have ron kusse's web or email address? john -- Todd Talsma 8412 North Maple Court Zeeland MI 49464 ------ email: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/ Bamboo Tips site:http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo/ Bamboo Sources site:http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo_Sources/ home page:http://external.sligh.com/~toddt/ genealogy pages: Under construction from KlingB@health.missouri.edu Wed Mar 6 08:48:52 2002 Received: from g26Emq822626 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 2002 08:48:51 -0600 content-class: urn:content-classes:message Subject: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.5762.3 Message-ID:X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: Touch Up with KodakFixer Thread-Index: AcHFA5Z6uTC5TDDjEda4KQBglOouXwAGhM9A From: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 06 Mar 200214:48:51.0610 (UTC) FILETIME=[07F25FA0:01C1C51E] Content-Transfer- 8.2.09/990901/11:28 -- ListProc(tm) by CREN Thanks very much. I find thisvery reassuring. I am called much worse most days - but then I work at aUniversity. Barry -----Original Message----- From: Darrin Curtis This is the definition from Encarta. wanker wank.er [wangkr ] (pluralwank.ers) noun U.K. Australia, New Zealand (taboo) 1. a taboo term forsomebody who masturbates 2. a taboo term for an unpleasant, self-indulgent, pretentious, or arrogant person [Mid-20th century] >FromKlingB@health.missouri.edu Wed Mar 6 08:48:53 2002 Received: from umh- g26Emq822628 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 2002 08:48:51 -0600 content-class: urn:content-classes:message Subject: X- MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: Touch Up with Kodak Fixer Thread- Index:AcHE9/3NuTCkwDDjEda4KQBglOouXwAJAJZg From: "Kling, Barry W." Cc: "rodmakers"X-OriginalArrivalTime: 06 Mar 200214:48:51.0267 (UTC) FILETIME=[07BE0930:01C1C51E] Content-Transfer- 8.2.09/990901/11:28 -- ListProc(tm) by CREN Peter -- Now that Tony Y.has educated me about wankers, let me say that there are various chemicalsused as hardener in fixers, which may have different effects on bluing. Anyfixer with the traditional fixing compound (I believe it is sodiumthiophosphate, but so-called rapid fixers use a different thiophosphate therest of which escapes me at the moment, I can look it up if anyone cares)should work. Have you found that the liquid hardeners actually interfere withthe blueing, or merely don't help? My guess would be they simply don't helpbut do no harm, but I'm not clear on what you experienced. Did you use rapidor regular fixer? The Kodak powder I used is a regular fixer, but they alsomake two-part liquid rapid fixer with separate hardener. Ilford chemicals arereadily available here, too, by the way. An on-line source for any of these iswww.calumetphoto.com, for anyone who doesn't live near a photo shop sellingdarkroom supplies. Barry -----Original Message----- From: Peter McKean Fixer Barry Now that's really interesting! The Kodak product containshardener, does it really? I have spoken to so many people who use the Kodakstuff, and they have very consistent results. I started to use it because thebluing kit that REC sells contains Part A and Part B, which are fixer andhardener. They were helpful enough not to sell me any, because they thoughtit was a little silly to be sending fixer across the world, but just told me whatthe parts were. I used the Ilford product, because I have heaps of their X-rayfixer and hardener always on hand. I get the feeling that Kodak has probablygot a less firm grip on the market here than in the US, so it is as easy to getone as the other. And fixer is pretty much fixer. Now I am going to have togo out and get some of the Kodak stuff to try, aren't I? Cheers Peter >FromKlingB@health.missouri.edu Wed Mar 6 08:49:02 2002 Received: from umh- g26En1822643 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 2002 08:48:56 -0600 content-class: urn:content-classes:message Subject: X- MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: Touch Up with Kodak Fixer Thread- Index:AcHFCygohCPewDD6Eda4KQBglOouXwAEsKUA From: "Kling, Barry W." Cc: "rodmakers"X-OriginalArrivalTime: 06 Mar 200214:48:56.0025 (UTC) FILETIME=[0A940C90:01C1C51E] Content-Transfer- 8.2.09/990901/11:28 -- ListProc(tm) by CREN I think it's very clear thathardener in fixer does NOTHING to harden nickel silver. It's made to harden agel-like emulsion of silver nitrate and other stuff on the surface of anegative or photographic print (not the silver itself, just the emulsion inwhich it is suspended) once it has dried. The only question is whether thehardener interferes with the darkening of the metal. BK -----Original Kling, Barry W. Cc: rodmakers Subject: Re: Touch Up with Kodak Fixer Thisbelow is from Ilford's site. As you'd be aware there are quite a few differentproducts made by Ilford including different fixers and hardeners as well asfilms and papers so what is recommended for one is not necessarilyrecommended for all and the requirements vary depending upon the taskrequired. To add to that some chemicals are recommended for negs, some these are basically negatives that will be experiencing a lot of handling so theresin, medium and processing are all geared that way and the use of ahardener is required. As you'll read below if you get that far using a hardeneris not recommended in some cases because it doesn't actually add anythingto the hardness of the neg and in some cases is not compatible but it alldepends on the required end result and I very much doubt Ilford are makingthis stuff to blue NS ferrules. So, even though REC use a two part mix fortheir blue and Peter uses a two part mix that does not necessarily mean it'srequired but it does depend on what fixer you use. I'm using Ilford HypamRapid Fixer which I've always used for photography which is a non hardeningfixer that fixer can be added to for negs though it's not recommended forIlford paper prints. No matter what it does seem to me that the hardeneronly really hardens the coating of the paper or resin and not the blued effecton NS BUT in Peter's case using chemicals designed for use with x-rays itcould be different. IMHO you don't need to use hardener if you varnish overthe blued bits and pieces. Tony FIX HARDENER ILFORD RAPID FIXER and ILFORDILFOFIX II must not be used with fix hardeners as they are not compatiblewith them. If a fix hardener is required then only ILFORD HYPAM fixer can beused. Add ILFORD HYPAM HARDENER to turn HYPAM into a hardening fixer.Generally for most applications modern camera films are sufficientlyhardened at manufacture. Additional hardening from a fixer hardener is notusually needed or recommended for manual processing in spiral tanks ordishes/trays or machine processing in a rotary processor, unless theprocessing temperature is above 30·C/86·F or poor drying performance isbeing experienced. For a final rinse use ILFORD ILFOTOL wetting agent addedto water, it helps the film to dry rapidly and evenly. Start by using 5ml/l ofrinse water (1+200), however the amount of ILFOTOL The amount of HYPAMHARDENER that can be added to the fixer is dependant on the film andprocess conditions used. In some processors the full amount of hardenercannot be used as the fix and wash times cannot be extended adequately. Inthese circumstances we recommend starting with the minimum amount ofhardener to have some effect. This is around 3-6mls of hardener per litre ofworking strength HYPAM used. This increases the film hardness slightly buthas a negligible effect on the fix and wash efficiency. When fix and washtimes are restricted the maximum amount of HYPAM HARDENERrecommended is 10-20mls of hardener per litre of working strength HYPAMused. This higher amount will give a definite increase to the hardness of thefilms processed and while fixing and washing efficiency are reduced the filmswill be adequately fixed and washed for most purposes. When fix and washtimes can be extended the maximum amount of HYPAM HARDENER needed toachieve fully hardened films is 1 part to 40 parts working strength HYPAM.i.e. 24 ml/l. At 09:15 PM 3/6/02 +1100, Peter McKean wrote: Barry Now that's really interesting! The Kodak product contains hardener, does it really? I have spoken to somany people who use the Kodak stuff, and they have very consistentresults. I started to use it because the bluing kit that REC sells contains Part Aand Part B, which are fixer and hardener. They were helpful enough not tosell me any, because they thought it was a little silly to be sending fixeracross the world, but just told me what the parts were. I used the Ilford product, because I have heaps of their X-ray fixer andhardener always on hand. I get the feeling that Kodak has probably got aless firm grip on the market here than in the US, so it is as easy to getone as the other. And fixer is pretty much fixer. Now I am going to have to go out and get some of the Kodak stuff to try,aren't I? Cheers Peter /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html Christmas Gift Tips Avoid at any cost Christmas crackers with the label: Made in Afghanistan /*************************************************************************/ from patrick.w.coffey@boeing.com Wed Mar 6 09:12:35 2002 g26FCY825056 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 09:12:34 -0600 HAA08364; HAA14085; g26FCk120176; (5.5.2650.21) id ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 07:12:25 -0800 Dennis Bertram , bcombest@iclub.org,Rodmakers Subject: RE: Degloss Varnish this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. If you use it with tres bien furniture polish (non silicone) its as easy asputting on hand lotion. In varnishing instruments I sand with 220, hit itwith 0000 steel wool and tres bien and then go over it with rotten stone andtres bien and you can comb your hair in the gloss. from start to finishtakes maybe one hour to sand and polish a upright bass. Patrick W. Coffey AOG Incident Repair Planning Phone: 425-234-2901 Fax: 425-237-0083 M-2112 M/C 61-79 -----Original Message----- Subject: RE: Degloss Varnish Dennis:I do not do this to my finish, but I think the recommended way is to use theRottenstone with an oil of some sort. The only thing else I can say is thatin my few attempts to use semi gloss, I think buffing down from gloss ispreferrable to using the semi. That stuff is hard to work with.Best regards, Bob Subject: Re: Degloss Varnish Bob, Please expain the procedure for using both rottenstone and pumice stone.How do you use pumice to remove slight blemishes without deglossing? Ihavenever used either. Dennis Bertram -----Original Message----- Subject: RE: Degloss Varnish Rottenstone? -----Original Message----- Subject: Degloss Varnish I am new to this endeavor and have another question. I have used spar varnish in a dip tank and am pleased with the coverage butis there a good way to de-gloss the hight sheen on the final coat? If you use it with tres bien furniture polish (non silicone) its as easy as putting on hand lotion. In varnishing instruments I sand with 220, hit it with 0000 steel wool and tres bien and then go over it with rotten stone and tres bien andyou can comb your hair in the gloss. from start to finish takes maybe one hourto sand and polish a upright bass. Patrick W. CoffeyAOG Incident Repair Planning 61-79 -----Original Message-----From: Bob Maulucci 06, 2002 3:57 RodmakersSubject: RE: Degloss Varnish Dennis:I do not dothis to my finish, but I think the recommended way is to use the Rottenstone with anoil of some sort. The only thing else I can say is that in my few attempts touse semi gloss, I think buffing down from gloss is preferrable to using the semi. That stuff is hard to work with.Best regards, Bob Dennis Bertram 8:18 RodmakersSubject: Re: Degloss Varnish Bob, Please expain the procedure for using both rottenstoneand without Dennis Bertram -----Original Message-----From: bcombest@iclub.org Rodmakers Tuesday, March 05, 2002 7:22 PMSubject: RE:Degloss Varnish Rottenstone? -----Original Message-----From: owner- rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu]On Behalf Of Bruce CombestSent: Tuesday, March 05, 2002 12:58 I am new to this endeavor and have another question. I have used spar varnish in a dip tank and am pleased with the coverage but is there a good way to de-gloss the hight sheen on the final coat? from ttalsma@macatawa.org Wed Mar 6 09:45:30 2002 g26FjT827120 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 09:45:29 -0600 id ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 10:38:15 -0500 id F563CHSK; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 10:38:07 -0500 Subject: Chat - Brave souls needed for help I need some brave souls to help me test a new chat room. You can go tothe following address:http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo_Cont/Chat_Room/Test_Chat/test_chat.html I'm currently out there. Thanks.-- Todd Talsma 8412 North Maple Court Zeeland MI 49464 ------ email: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/ Bamboo Tips site:http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo/ Bamboo Sources site:http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo_Sources/ home page:http://external.sligh.com/~toddt/ genealogy pages: Under construction from bhoy551@earthlink.net Wed Mar 6 10:06:46 2002 Received: from KlingB@health.missouri.edu, "Peter McKean"From: Bill Hoy Subject: RE: Touch Up with Kodak Fixer Cc: "rodmakers" format=flowed X-OriginalArrivalTime: 06 Mar 2002 16:06:43.0186 (UTC) owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu X-Listprocessor- Version:8.2.09/990901/11:28 -- ListProc(tm) by CREN HI Barry, It's sodiumthiosulphate. Rapid Fixer is ammonium thiosulphate. Just thought I'd clarify incase any chemists out there thought about mixing some up. No idea whatthiophosphate would do. Bill (former photographer fond of chemicals, notpixels). At 08:48 AM 3/6/2002 -0600, Kling, Barry W. wrote: Peter -- Now that Tony Y. has educated me about wankers, let me say that thereare various chemicals used as hardener in fixers, which may have different effects on bluing. Any fixer with the traditional fixing compound (I believe it is sodium thiophosphate, but so-called rapid fixers use a different thiophosphate the rest of which escapes me at the moment, I can look it up if anyone cares) should work. Have you found that the liquid hardeners actually interfere with the blueing, or merely don't help? My guess would be they simply don't help but do no harm, but I'm not clear on what you experienced. Did you use rapid or regular fixer? The Kodak powder I used is a regular fixer, but they also make two-part liquid rapid fixer with separate hardener. Ilford chemicals are readily available here, too, Barry -----Original Message----- Sent: Wednesday, March 06, 2002 4:15 AM Cc: rodmakersSubject: Re: Touch Up with Kodak Fixer Barry Now that's really interesting! The Kodak product contains hardener, does it really? I have spoken to somany people who use the Kodak stuff, and they have very consistentresults. I started to use it because the bluing kit that REC sells contains Part Aand Part B, which are fixer and hardener. They were helpful enough not tosell me any, because they thought it was a little silly to be sending fixeracross the world, but just told me what the parts were. I used the Ilford product, because I have heaps of their X-ray fixer andhardener always on hand. I get the feeling that Kodak has probably got aless firm grip on the market here than in the US, so it is as easy to getone as the other. And fixer is pretty much fixer. Now I am going to have to go out and get some of the Kodak stuff to try,aren't I? Cheers Peter from pvansch@wethersfield.k12.ct.us Wed Mar 6 10:50:04 2002 g26Go3801518 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 10:50:03 -0600 Subject: FW: [Fwd: E-MAIL WORM WARNING] Organization: Wethersfield Public Schools -------- Original Message -------- Subject: E-MAIL WORM WARNING Wed, 06 Mar 2002 10:02:13 -0500 help_desk@bah.com Organization: BAH An e-mail worm known as the Hybrid Klez is spreading rapidly on theInternet. This e-mail worm attempts to disable anti-virus softwareinstalled on the infected computer and arrives with one of the followingsubject lines: How are you Let's be friends Darling Don't drink too much Your password Honey Some questions Please try again Welcome to my hometown the Garden of Eden introduction on ADSL Meeting notice Questionnaire Congratulations Sos! japanese girl VS playboy Look,my beautiful girl friend Eager to see you Spice girls' vocal concert Japanese lass' sexy pictures The body text may be blank. The attached filename is random and may havea PIF, SCR, EXE, or BAT extension. If you receive this message, do not open it and delete it immediately.ZDNet and Symantec provideadditional information on this worm on their websites. To help protect yourself from virus and worm attacks, be sure that thelatest virus definitions from Norton Anti-Virus are installed on yourcomputer. You must then run the virus scan to ensure your computer isprotected. For instructions on how to run Live Update, click on theappropriate link below. * Click here to runLive Update forWindows2000 * Click here to runLive Update forWindows95/98 If you have questions or need assistance, please contact the Help Deskat 1- 877-927-8278. Message E-MAIL WORM WARNING Wed, 06 Mar 2002 10:02:13 -0500 "Corporate Systems" help_desk@bah.com BAHAn e-mail worm known as the Hybrid Klez is spreading rapidly on the = This e-mail worm attempts to disable anti-virus software installed on = How are you Let's be friends Darling Don't drink too much= Your password Honey Some questions Please try again = to my hometown the Garden of Eden introduction on ADSL = notice Questionnaire Congratulations Sos! japanese girl= playboy Look,my beautiful girl friend Eager to see you Spice = The body text may be blank. The attached filename is random and may = If you receive this message, do not open it and delete it = and Sy= To help protect yourself from virus and worm attacks, be sure that = virus definitions from Norton Anti-Virus are installed on your computer. = instructions on how to run Live Update, click on the appropriate link = Click = Click = Live Update for Windows 95/98 If you have questions or = assistance, please contact the Help= at 1-877-927-8278. from bamboorules@ns.sympatico.ca Wed Mar 6 12:04:46 2002 g26I4j805844 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 12:04:46 -0600 Wed, 6 Mar 2002 14:06:28 -0400 Organization: New Scotland Fly Rods Subject: Re: Chat - Brave souls needed for help Hi Todd,went there but saw no one,Shawn Todd Talsma wrote: I need some brave souls to help me test a new chat room. You can go tothe following address: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo_Cont/Chat_Room/Test_Chat/test_chat.html I'm currently out there. Thanks.--Todd Talsma8412 North Maple CourtZeeland MI 49464------ web design business page: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo Tips site: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo/Bamboo Sources site: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo_Sources/home page: http://external.sligh.com/~toddt/genealogy pages: Under construction from rextutor@yahoo.com Wed Mar 6 12:12:30 2002 g26ICT806316 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 12:12:29 -0600 06 Mar 2002 10:12:28 PST Subject: Re: Chat - Brave souls needed for help I went there last night ( lost track and thought itwas Wednesday ) no one there . Hit self on foreheadand remembered planned chat was tommorrow.I went again today and it seems to be working.--- Todd Talsma wrote: I need some brave souls to help me test a new chatroom. You can go tothe following address: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo_Cont/Chat_Room/Test_Chat/test_chat.html I'm currently out there. Thanks.-- Todd Talsma8412 North Maple CourtZeeland MI 49464------ web design business page: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo Tips site: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo/Bamboo Sources site: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo_Sources/home page: http://external.sligh.com/~toddt/genealogy pages: Under construction __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Try FREE Yahoo! Mail - the world's greatest free email!http://mail.yahoo.com/ from kenealyj@gwi.net Wed Mar 6 13:44:45 2002 g26Jii810739 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 13:44:44 -0600 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 14:44:43 -0500 Subject: Wilmington show Hi All, I have a booth(Mountain Valley Flies) at the Fly Fishing Expo in =Wilmington, MA this weekend. If anyone is planning on attending, please look me up so we can say ="hi." John K Hi All, I have a booth(Mountain Valley = Fly Fishing Expo in Wilmington, MA this weekend. If anyone is planning on attending, = up so we can say "hi." JohnK from rodsupstream@exploremaine.com Wed Mar 6 14:45:09 2002 g26Kj9816300 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 14:45:09 -0600 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 15:45:11 -0500 Subject: Wilmington show: Hi list, I will have booth at show, if you attend look for Upstream Custom Rods, hopeto see you there. Tim. Upstream Always, Tim DoughtyRod Maker name="winmail.dat" filename="winmail.dat" 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 from ttalsma@macatawa.org Wed Mar 6 14:50:49 2002 g26Kom817511 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 14:50:48 -0600 id ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 15:43:34 -0500 id F563CH65; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 15:43:26 -0500 Subject: Chat and all that OK. Thanks to everyone who stopped by the chat room to test it for me. We've had a few glitches, but overall, it seemed to work well. There is a scheduled chat set for tonight at 10pm Eastern time. Soundslike Harry, Ralph etal have some stuff cooked up, so let's see how itflies tonight. The new link to get directly into the chat room is as follows: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo_Cont/Chat_Room/chat_room.html Please be sure to read the information about the nicknames. Have fun and "see" you tonight.-- Todd Talsma 8412 North Maple Court Zeeland MI 49464 ------ email: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/ Bamboo Tips site:http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo/ Bamboo Sources site:http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo_Sources/ home page:http://external.sligh.com/~toddt/ genealogy pages: Under construction from HalManas@aol.com Wed Mar 6 15:59:46 2002 Received: from imo- g26Lxj822495 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 r07.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v32.5.) id 4.cb.1e799b9e (4543) for rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu X-Listprocessor- Version:8.2.09/990901/11:28 -- ListProc(tm) by CREN List: I have not been veryhappy with my torch and I went by Harbor Freight today to see what theyhave. I remember that Onis (I think) uses one from there. I found a long onethat connects to a large tank like you use on a grill. It is #36346 and has anend that looks like a can. It is made in Italy and has the name Dealgas Co. &C. on the packaging. Does anyone use this one? Does it put out enough heat?Do you have any other suggestions? Thanks in advance, Hal >Frombdcbfr@chartermi.net Wed Mar 6 16:02:53 2002 Received: from proxy1-grandhaven0.chartermi.net (24.247.15.40.gha.mi.chartermi.net "Rodmakers List" Subject: Re: Chat - Brave souls needed for help Was there during lunch with many sage (No, Not SAGE) rodmakers. Much funwas had at Bob N.'s expense. Hope he is able to join us there sometime anddefend himself. BC----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Chat - Brave souls needed for help I went there last night ( lost track and thought itwas Wednesday ) no one there . Hit self on foreheadand remembered planned chat was tommorrow.I went again today and it seems to be working.--- Todd Talsma wrote: I need some brave souls to help me test a new chatroom. You can go tothe following address: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo_Cont/Chat_Room/Test_Chat/test_chat.html I'm currently out there. Thanks.--Todd Talsma8412 North Maple CourtZeeland MI 49464------ web design business page:http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo Tips site:http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo/Bamboo Sources site:http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo_Sources/home page: http://external.sligh.com/~toddt/genealogy pages: Under construction __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Try FREE Yahoo! Mail - the world's greatest free email!http://mail.yahoo.com/ from thardy@blarg.net Wed Mar 6 17:33:12 2002 g26NXB827081 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 17:33:12 -0600 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 15:33:11 - for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 15:33:10 -0800User-Agent: Microsoft-Outlook- Express-Macintosh-Edition/5.02.2022 Subject: Re: Torch for flaming understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. I use that one, and it seems to be just about right. When you hit the airlever on it it blasts way hotter than you would ever need. I use it onlyoutdoors on rainy days. A Pyromaniac's dream. Be careful! Tom Hardy From: HalManas@aol.com Date: Wed, 6 Mar 2002 16:59:33 EST Subject: Torch for flaming List:I have not been very happy with my torch and I went by Harbor Freighttoday to see what they have. I remember that Onis (I think) uses one fromthere. I found a long one that connects to a large tank like you use on agrill. It is #36346 and has an end that looks like a can. It is made inItaly and has the name Dealgas Co. & C. on the packaging. Does anyone usethis one? Does it put out enough heat? Do you have any othersuggestions?Thanks in advance, Hal Re: Torch for flaming I use that one, and it seems to be just about right. When you hit the a=ir lever on it it blasts way hotter than you would ever need. I use it only =outdoors on rainy days. A Pyromaniac's dream. Be careful! Tom Hardy uses=one from use on a It is made in es anyone use oth= from canazon@mindspring.com Wed Mar 6 17:45:09 2002 g26Nj9827717 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 17:45:09 -0600 helo=oemcomputer) id 16il5R-0004Aa-00; Wed, 06 Mar 2002 18:44:45 -0500 , Subject: Re: Touch Up with Kodak Fixer ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Touch Up with Kodak Fixer And it doesn't mark the cane? dave,i just did some up last nite. no, it doesn't affect the cane. although idon't know if it will do anything to the epoxy i mounted the ferrules with.mike from bhoy551@earthlink.net Wed Mar 6 17:54:10 2002 g26Ns9828234 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 17:54:09 - helo=bhoy.earthlink.net) id 16ilES-0001WO-00 for RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.edu; Wed, 06 Mar 2002 15:54:05 -0800 Subject: ferrule station cutters Has anyone had any experience with Dave LeClair's new version of his ferrule station cutters? Would there be any advantage for a part-time (4-8 rods a year) maker? I've used dave's stuff before, and it's all top notch, just wondering if the improvements would be worth the higher price. I appreciate hardened cutting edges and micro tolerances, but is there much of a design difference with the original cutters which are still available? Thanks, Bill from jsschaeffer@hotmail.com Wed Mar 6 18:23:24 2002 g270NN829223 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 18:23:23 -0600 Wed, 6 Mar 2002 16:23:14 -0800 Subject: Re: Removing Ferrules FILETIME=[458EDEB0:01C1C56E] Heat them gently, then put them in a cup of ice for several minutes. Youwill be surprised how little heat it takes. Do not overdo the heat or youwill melt the solder joints (if your ferrules have any of those). You need avery strong thread to bind down the ferrule tabs. Kevlar works, as well asthe ferrule tab binding thread sold by Golden Witch. Do not be afraid toreally put the pressure on the tabs. You will need to clean the inside ofthe ferrules completely before reglueing. Jeff Schaeffer from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Wed Mar 6 18:32:34 2002 g270WX829553 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 18:32:33 -0600 (authenticated) for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 16:32:31 -0800 Subject: Latest article Friends, Several folks have asked about my latest article atwww.globalflyfisher.com. My sincere thanks to Kyle Druey,Timothy Troester, and Don Anderson for their help inproviding pictures. Since I cannot remember everyone whoasked to be notified when the article came out, here's theurl for everyone:http://www.globalflyfisher.com/rodbuilding/bamboo4/ Harry --Harry Boyd http://www.canerods.com/ Bamboo Rodshttp://www.fbcwin.com/ Our Church from channer@frontier.net Wed Mar 6 18:41:56 2002 g270ft829901 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 18:41:55 -0600 Subject: Re: Removing Ferrules Mike;Heat and ice, as was said, and when you reset them, get some worthwhileepoxy, 5 minute isn't any good for ferrules. Use at least 2 ton, if notAccraglas or golf club epoxy.john Mike Mihalas wrote: I just glued my first set of ferrules on last night and I am not all thatpleased with how they turned out. The tabs didn't flatten against the rodlike they should have. I guess because I used cotton thread to bind them? I glued the ferrules with Devcon 5-minute. Is there a way to remove themeasily and cleanly without damage to the cane? Thanks, Mike Mihalas from erjmjj@mhtc.net Wed Mar 6 18:51:40 2002 g270pd800318 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 18:51:39 -0600 Subject: Advise on Depth Gauge and Base I am looking for advise on purchasing a depth gauge and a base. Couldanybody point me in the right direction? Eric J. from bob@downandacross.com Wed Mar 6 19:08:13 2002 g2718C800927 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 19:08:12 -0600 6 Mar 2002 20:07:53 -0500 Subject: RE: Latest article Great job as usual Harry. Very nice pics as well.Thanks for the heads up.Bob -----Original Message----- Subject: Latest article Friends, Several folks have asked about my latest article atwww.globalflyfisher.com. My sincere thanks to Kyle Druey,Timothy Troester, and Don Anderson for their help inproviding pictures. Since I cannot remember everyone whoasked to be notified when the article came out, here's theurl for everyone:http://www.globalflyfisher.com/rodbuilding/bamboo4/ Harry --Harry Boyd http://www.canerods.com/ Bamboo Rodshttp://www.fbcwin.com/ Our Church from LECLAIR123@aol.com Wed Mar 6 19:22:42 2002 g271Mf801380 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 19:22:42 -0600 Subject: Re: Advise on Depth Gauge and Base In a message dated 03/06/2002 7:52:34 PM Eastern Standard Time, erjmjj@mhtc.net writes: Check with Golden Witch. They carry a couple of different styles and prices. Goldenwitch.com check out our new site at- flyandrodroom.com AOL site- http://hometown.aol.com/leclair123/index.html from jcbyrd@direct-pest.com Wed Mar 6 19:28:30 2002 g271ST801740 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 19:28:29 - by direct-pest.com [208.27.26.103] for ; Wed, 06 Mar 2002 20:27:12 -0500 Subject: Re: ferrule station cutters Bill: I have recently received the new ferrule station cutters from Dave LeClair,and have just completed my latest article for PowerFibers which is about theUltimate Ferrule Station Cutters. Even at 4-8 rods per year, I think it is well worth the investment. Staytuned to see the article in the Mar 15 PowerFibers Joe =================================================Lost in the Hills of East Tennessee with a Bamboo Fly Rod in one handand a cigar in the other....."What a Great Life". Visit my bambooflyrod site at http://www.direct-pest.com/rodmaker----- Original Message ----- Subject: ferrule station cutters Has anyone had any experience with Dave LeClair's new version of hisferrule station cutters? Would there be any advantage for a part-time (4-8 rods a year) maker? I've used dave's stuff before, and it's all top notch, just wondering ifthe improvements would be worth the higher price. I appreciate hardenedcutting edges and micro tolerances, but is there much of a designdifference with the original cutters which are still available? Thanks, Bill from bob@downandacross.com Wed Mar 6 19:45:33 2002 g271jW802340 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 19:45:32 - 6 Mar 2002 20:44:54 -0500 Subject: RE: ferrule station cutters APRIL 15th. Oh please don't rush me. I need to get this mill cutting canebefore I lose my eyesight laying that beast out! LOL.Thanks Joe,Bob -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: ferrule station cutters Bill: I have recently received the new ferrule station cutters from Dave LeClair,and have just completed my latest article for PowerFibers which is about theUltimate Ferrule Station Cutters. Even at 4-8 rods per year, I think it is well worth the investment. Staytuned to see the article in the Mar 15 PowerFibers Joe from robertgkope@attbi.com Wed Mar 6 20:37:05 2002 g272b4803448 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 20:37:04 -0600 Subject: Re: Touch Up with Kodak Fixer As others have said, it doesn't seem to mark the cane, though I've alwaysbeen careful to try and keep the fixer off of the cane while bluing, andrinsed it thoroughly with water when I reached the shade I wanted. -- Robert----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Touch Up with Kodak Fixer And it doesn't mark the cane?-----Original Message-----From: Robert Kope KyleDruey@aol.com Cc: rodmakers Date: Tuesday, March 05, 2002 6:56 PMSubject: Re: Touch Up with Kodak Fixer Exactly. I don't bother bluing ferrules until they're mounted now. It'stoo much bother to try to clean up the tabs without messing up the bluing. I just swab on the fixer before I wrap them. -- Robert----- Original Message -----From: "Peter McKean" Cc: "rodmakers" Sent: Tuesday, March 05, 2002 2:05 PMSubject: Re: Touch Up with Kodak Fixer Kyle Just swab the stuff on with a cotton bud - "Q-tip", I believe you know them as; move the solution around, and rinse it off under running water when you have got the darkness you need. Couple of minutes, tops. Buy Ilford fixer. It's liquid, and saves a lot of buggerising around mixing it up. Now we get to the heresy bit. I KNOW all that has been said about thefunction of Hardener in the photo process, and how it's supposed to funtion to toughen the protein phase of the surface emulsion of film, and I KNOW how it cannot therefore have any effect at all on bluing nickel silver, and I KNOW that anybody who thinks that it does or can possibly improve the bluing must be (a) stupid (b) mislead (c) inept (d) in cloud cuckoo land (e) awanker, or (f) all of the above! But it does! Cheers Peter abcdef from channer@frontier.net Wed Mar 6 20:43:22 2002 g272hL803727 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 20:43:21 -0600 Subject: Re: Advise on Depth Gauge and Base Enco,MSC, McMaster-Carr, and probably Grizzly and Harbor-Freight aswell. These things are like cars, you can spend as much as you want, butall of them will most likely get you from point A to point B.john Eric Johannesen wrote: I am looking for advise on purchasing a depth gauge and a base. Couldanybody point me in the right direction? Eric J. from Troutgetter@aol.com Wed Mar 6 20:44:14 2002 g272iD803859 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 20:44:14 -0600 Subject: Re: Torch for flaming Be careful of this one. There was something on the list awhile back about a product recall on this unit. This is supposed to be for burning weeds, (kind of the same thing I guess!) There is another from H-F that also works fine and is for soldering pipe and what-not.Mike Mike's Bamboo Rod ShopMontclair, CAhttp://www.mshaybamboo.gq.nu/ from tjtrodmaker@yahoo.com Wed Mar 6 20:50:56 2002 g272ot804339 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 20:50:55 -0600 Wed, 06 Mar 2002 18:50:55 PST Subject: Re: Advise on Depth Gauge and Base Rodmakers discussion group jeff wagner sells a good one. timothy --- Eric Johannesen wrote: I am looking for advise on purchasing a depth gaugeand a base. Couldanybody point me in the right direction? Eric J. ====="Gooda' mornin', mister bear!" ...Ride, boldly ride,"The shade replied, -"If you seek for Eldorado!" -- E.A.Poe __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Try FREE Yahoo! Mail - the world's greatest free email!http://mail.yahoo.com/ from dongreife@hotmail.com Wed Mar 6 21:05:57 2002 g2735u804874 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 21:05:56 -0600 Wed, 6 Mar 2002 19:05:50 -0800 HTTP; Thu, 07 Mar 2002 03:05:50 GMT Subject: Re: Advise on Depth Gauge and Base FILETIME=[FCC023D0:01C1C584] Grizzly, has a dial indicator (1/2") that I recently bought,, and made aholder for it on my table saw and drill press. They also have brass rods in thesizes needed for depth measurements on your planing form, that are 12"lengths and very reasonably priced,,,or you can go the 60 deg triangular Johannesen Freight as you want, but and a base. Could MSN Photos is the easiest way toshare and print your photos: Click Here from robertgkope@attbi.com Wed Mar 6 21:11:22 2002 g273BL805218 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 21:11:21 -0600 Thu, 7 Mar 2002 03:11:11 +0000 Subject: Re: displacing nodes Thanks Tony. This does help. Reading this and re-reading your article in Powerfibersmade me realize that I've been using a variation of "node displacing" for acouple of years, but without soaking. I have been splitting, and thencarefully filing off the enamel, just down to the fibers, at the nodes.Then I run the strips between a wood screw protruding from a block of woodand a small sanding drum in my drill press to make the strips a uniformthickness at the nodes. I can't remember who originally posted this idea,but it works great. With the strips a uniform thickness and the powerfibersintact, when you clamp the strip in the vise, it displaces the node ratherthan compressing it. One additional touch I've added is that I made a pair of covers for the jawsof my vise from a piece of aluminum angle. The covers have a couple of 45degree v- grooves in them that match up so when the jaws are closed therearesquare channels between them at a 45 degree angle running across the jawsofthe vise. The 2 sets of grooves are different depths for butts and tips,and they allow me to straighten the nodes and flatten them by just clampingthem once in the vise. This works most of the time, but sometimes I have togo back and do some additional work on them by hand, and once in a while Iwind up crushing a node. It sounds like soaking the strips will make straightening and rough planingmuch easier, regardless of the methods used for straightening. I willcertainly give it a try. -- Robert----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: displacing nodes Robert,All of this is based on un flamed rods. That isall I have made. It seems that it works on flamedrods from some of the recent posts.I found that soaking for at least four days andcutting the relief the back side of the node keepsthe bump from coming back up. I soak for five tosix days. This may not be traditional but it is alot easier on my old hands. After displacing thenode, the only thing protruding is the littleridge. That is filed off with a few strokes of thefile. If you have to take a kink out of the stripat the node, do that first then flip it to theenamel side and displace the node, all in onemotion. Leave that strip in the vise and start onthe next strip. Keep the strips that you are notworking on it the water. While the strips are wet,they are beveled and partial tapered. I guess Ihave said it a hundred times, once you plane wetstrips you will never go back to dry planingexcept for the final taper.I do two strips at a time, displace, bevel andpartial taper. When the 18 strips are finished,they are bound ( as they will be glued) with thepith side out and put in the oven to dry. They canbe air dried also. I believe with the pith sideout they dry a lot faster and more complete. Afterthe strips are dried they are pretty straight, Idon't find the bumps re appearing. I re bind inthe normal way to heat treat.The binding cord will be somewhat loose afterdrying.Now on heating the nodes, the wet strips only take30 to 45 seconds to be soft enough to displace.Not at all like dry strips. There is no burning orhardening of the node. When you plane over a wetnode it is not felt at all unless the strip is dryin the middle.I do believe the sticks need to be DRY beforefinal planing. I try to heat treat, final planeand glue all in one session. Next session, heatset, sand and apply a coat of Tung varnish to sealthe blankHope I shed some light on your questions.No pun intended, I may be all wet on this deal.Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Wed Mar 6 21:13:40 2002 g273Dd805470 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 21:13:39 -0600 (authenticated) for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 19:13:36 -0800 Subject: Chat tonight Friends, There's supposed to be a chat tonight,starting about 15 minutes ago, at Todd's site. Apologies,Harry -- -- Harry Boyd --http://www.canerods.com/ -- Bamboo Rods -- http://www.fbcwin.com/ -- Our Church -- from rextutor@yahoo.com Wed Mar 6 21:34:09 2002 g273Y8806107 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 21:34:08 -0600 06 Mar 2002 19:34:02 PST Subject: Re: Advise on Depth Gauge and Base Rodmakers discussion group I got mine at goldenwitch.com and really have likedit. --- Eric Johannesen wrote: I am looking for advise on purchasing a depth gaugeand a base. Couldanybody point me in the right direction? Eric J. __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Try FREE Yahoo! Mail - the world's greatest free email!http://mail.yahoo.com/ from jsschaeffer@hotmail.com Wed Mar 6 22:22:43 2002 g274Mg807393 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 22:22:42 -0600 Wed, 6 Mar 2002 20:22:37 -0800 Subject: Re: displacing nodes FILETIME=[B64D02A0:01C1C58F] I have been using a trick that was posted a while back. I filed a smallnotch in my vise. Split the cane, but leave the nodal ridge alone. Heat andpress in the vise, and the ridge fits into the notch. You are left with atiny ridge sticking above a very flat surface. A few hits with a small filetakes it off. It really works, and I do not remove any material on the pithside. The real advantage is that I never have to worry about gouging thecane with the big file that was needed to do the nodal ridge first. And youhardly need to remove any material. Jeff Schaeffer from atlasc1@earthlink.net Wed Mar 6 22:52:31 2002 g274qV808222 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 22:52:31 -0600 ([209.179.148.30] helo=computer) id 16iptE-0006Uk-00; Wed, 06 Mar 2002 20:52:29 -0800 Subject: Re: Removing Ferrules Mike, Make life easy for yourself and use Pliobond. Super strong and easy toremove. It has held on ferrules for decades. Adam Vigil----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Removing Ferrules Mike;Heat and ice, as was said, and when you reset them, get some worthwhileepoxy, 5 minute isn't any good for ferrules. Use at least 2 ton, if notAccraglas or golf club epoxy.john Mike Mihalas wrote: I just glued my first set of ferrules on last night and I am not all that pleased with how they turned out. The tabs didn't flatten against the rod like they should have. I guess because I used cotton thread to bind them? I glued the ferrules with Devcon 5-minute. Is there a way to remove themeasily and cleanly without damage to the cane? Thanks, Mike Mihalas from thardy@blarg.net Wed Mar 6 22:53:06 2002 g274r5808329 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 22:53:05 -0600 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 20:53:04 - for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 20:53:04 -0800User-Agent: Microsoft-Outlook- Express-Macintosh-Edition/5.02.2022 Subject: Chat Help I can't get onto Todd's chat room at all. 'Teenchat' yes, but 'Bamboo'isn't there. from atlasc1@earthlink.net Wed Mar 6 23:00:22 2002 g2750L808789 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 23:00:22 -0600 ([209.179.148.30] helo=computer) id 16iq0B-0006Lt-00; Wed, 06 Mar 2002 20:59:40 -0800 , "Rodmakers discussion group" Subject: Re: Advise on Depth Gauge and Base You can get the dial indicator off ebay cheap from Nolan Tools. As for thebase I went with a sloted one from Munro Rod Co. It allows measureing thestrip while it sits in the form. You just do it without the tip. I do notuse a dial indicator at all to measure strips. You will know exactly howmuch more cane needs to be remove. Adam Vigil----- Original Message ----- discussion group" Subject: Re: Advise on Depth Gauge and Base jeff wagner sells a good one. timothy --- Eric Johannesen wrote: I am looking for advise on purchasing a depth gaugeand a base. Couldanybody point me in the right direction? Eric J. ====="Gooda' mornin', mister bear!" ...Ride, boldly ride,"The shade replied, -"If you seek for Eldorado!" -- E.A.Poe __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Try FREE Yahoo! Mail - the world's greatest free email!http://mail.yahoo.com/ from thardy@blarg.net Wed Mar 6 23:04:14 2002 g2754D809094 for ; Wed, 6 Mar 2002 23:04:13 -0600 Wed, 6 Mar 2002 21:04:12 -0800User-Agent: Microsoft-Outlook- Express-Macintosh-Edition/5.02.2022 Subject: Re: Chat Help Thanks for the note. I think I'm having trouble partly because I'm on a Mac.Todd's site actually crashes me about half the time. Is there any way to godirectly to the chat site and not get there through the tips site? Tom From: "Jojo DeLancier" Date: Wed, 6 Mar 2002 22:56:22 -0600 Subject: Re: Chat Help Tom, Harry had problems, too. I don't know why some do, and some don't. It doestake a while for theapplet to load, though. What, exactly, is it doing? M-D ----- Original Message -----From: "Tom Hardy" Sent: Wednesday, March 06, 2002 2:52 PMSubject: Chat Help I can't get onto Todd's chat room at all. 'Teenchat' yes, but 'Bamboo'isn't there. from Dennishigham@cs.com Thu Mar 7 08:22:19 2002 g27EMI817065 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 08:22:18 -0600 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 09:21:58 -0500 Subject: Re: Removing Ferrules "You need a very strong thread to bind down the ferrule tabs. Kevlar works, as well asthe ferrule tab binding thread sold by Golden Witch. Do not be afraid toreally put the pressure on the tabs." Waxed Dental Floss works great too! Dennis from jojo@ipa.net Thu Mar 7 08:30:39 2002 g27EUc817478 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 08:30:39 -0600 helo=default) id 16iyuj-00000k-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Thu, 07 Mar 2002 09:30:37 -0500 Subject: Re: Removing Ferrules Old airline pilot trick. M-D "You need a very strong thread to bind down the ferrule tabs. Kevlar works, as well asthe ferrule tab binding thread sold by Golden Witch. Do not be afraid toreally put the pressure on the tabs." Waxed Dental Floss works great too! Dennis from Harris.James@ev.state.az.us Thu Mar 7 08:59:01 2002 g27Ex0818844 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 08:59:00 -0600 g27EvE315749 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 07:57:14 -0700 07:57:01 2002 -0700 with Novell_GroupWise; Thu, 07 Mar 2002 07:58:51 -0700 Subject: Re: displacing nodes g27Ex1818845 Guys The 45 degree groves in the vise covers is an idea I got to try. I'm going totry soaking first as well. Node work is my least favorite part of the rodmaking process. I'm all ears to anything that makes the process faster orbetter. Thanks! Jim H One additional touch I've added is that I made a pair of covers for the jawsof my vise from a piece of aluminum angle. The covers have a couple of 45degree v- grooves in them that match up so when the jaws are closed therearesquare channels between them at a 45 degree angle running across the jawsofthe vise. from jojo@ipa.net Thu Mar 7 09:08:24 2002 g27F8N819540 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 09:08:23 -0600 helo=default) id 16izVG-0001Bc-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Thu, 07 Mar 2002 10:08:23 -0500 Subject: Flats Boots For Sale Guys, I have one pair of the Patagonia Flats Stalkers, size 12, for sale -- only wornonce. I wear an 11 -111/2, and these fit well. Retail is $120.00, I want $85.00 shipping included.Please contact me offlist. M-D from jojo@ipa.net Thu Mar 7 09:15:11 2002 g27FFB820047 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 09:15:11 -0600 helo=default) id 16izbq-0001Ts-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Thu, 07 Mar 2002 10:15:10 -0500 Subject: Re: Flats Boots For Sale That is supposed to be Marlwalker, not Flats Stalker. Close but no cee- gar,huh? ;o) M-D Guys, I have one pair of the Patagonia Flats Stalkers, size 12, for sale -- onlyworn once. I wear an 11 - 111/2, and these fit well. Retail is $120.00, I want $85.00 shippingincluded. Please contact me offlist. M-D from jojo@ipa.net Thu Mar 7 09:26:35 2002 g27FQZ820916 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 09:26:35 -0600 helo=default) id 16izmq-0007Sq-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Thu, 07 Mar 2002 10:26:33 -0500 Subject: Other Bamboo Blanks Since the List seems to always get itself into a lather whenever someonementions the Chinesegetting into the bamboo rod market (assuming there is such a thing), Ithought I'd put this outthere for y'all, in case some of you haven't had your daily ration of emotionalturmoil. Mud Hole Custom Tackle and Rod Building Supply ( from whom I will never, everbuy anything again, andthat has nothing to do with these blanks) has for sale in their latest catalog,bamboo blanks madein Japan. IZCH is the brand name. Don't know much about them other than themarketing blatherwritten along side the ad, but the price is $495.00 for a 2/1, which is closeto what I charge($550.00). They range from 7'3" 3wt to 8'6" 6 wt. There ya' go, guys. Have fun!! ;o) M-D from bhoy551@earthlink.net Thu Mar 7 09:27:10 2002 g27FR9821012 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 09:27:09 -0600 Thu, 7 Mar 2002 10:27:03 -0500 Subject: Re: Removing Ferrules FILETIME=[88512EA0:01C1C5EC] Someone posted a brief message on this subject a while back. He (who?) recommended small electrical cable ties. I assume these are the ones with the slot on one end that you feed the tail end thru. I haven't tried it, but it looks promising. Does this work? I hate all those fibers embedded in the glue. Kevlar is strong, but it still leaves black fibers which have to be dealt with. Bill At 08:27 AM 3/7/2002 -0600, Jojo DeLancier wrote: Old airline pilot trick. M-D From: "You need a very strong thread to bind down the ferrule tabs. Kevlar works,as well asthe ferrule tab binding thread sold by Golden Witch. Do not be afraid toreally put the pressure on the tabs." Waxed Dental Floss works great too! Dennis from canazon@mindspring.com Thu Mar 7 09:45:17 2002 g27FjH822318 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 09:45:17 -0600 helo=oemcomputer) id 16j03X-0002pl-00; Thu, 07 Mar 2002 10:43:48 -0500 "Eric Johannesen" , ,"Rodmakers discussion group" Subject: Re: Advise on Depth Gauge and Base adam, erici have two dial indicators with 60* points broken off in the bottom ofthe indicator. panic set in as i was preparing to plane.necessity forced me to use the method you have described. i have foundthat this method is the simplest and the fastest. i just take a premeasuredstrip and lay it in the form, and subtract the indicator reading from thestrip measurement. that leaves me the depth of the form at that point. i dothis at each station. i try not to use a test strip a whole lot bigger thanthe groove in the form, especially at the tip.i originally used the method described on chris bogarts web site, but iwas using that method to measure each station and all the math took awhileto do. i think everyone should use drill rods at some point to ensure thatyour forms are accurate.mike----- Original Message ----- ; "Rodmakers discussion group" Subject: Re: Advise on Depth Gauge and Base You can get the dial indicator off ebay cheap from Nolan Tools. As for thebase I went with a sloted one from Munro Rod Co. It allows measureing thestrip while it sits in the form. You just do it without the tip. I do notuse a dial indicator at all to measure strips. You will know exactly howmuch more cane needs to be remove. Adam Vigil----- Original Message -----From: "timothy troester" discussion group" Sent: Wednesday, March 06, 2002 6:50 PMSubject: Re: Advise on Depth Gauge and Base jeff wagner sells a good one. timothy --- Eric Johannesen wrote: I am looking for advise on purchasing a depth gaugeand a base. Could anybody point me in the right direction? Eric J. ====="Gooda' mornin', mister bear!" ...Ride, boldly ride,"The shade replied, -"If you seek for Eldorado!" -- E.A.Poe __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Try FREE Yahoo! Mail - the world's greatest free email!http://mail.yahoo.com/ from ttalsma@macatawa.org Thu Mar 7 09:48:58 2002 g27Fmw822737 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 09:48:58 -0600 id ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 10:41:43 -0500 id F563C2K5; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 10:41:39 -0500 Subject: Re: Flats Boots For Sale Must have been too much shmoozing with those Yankee-Wanker- Bastardslastnight M-D. TEE HEE HEE Jojo DeLancier wrote: That is supposed to be Marlwalker, not Flats Stalker. Close but no cee- gar,huh? ;o) M-D Guys, I have one pair of the Patagonia Flats Stalkers, size 12, for sale -- onlyworn once. I wear an 11 - 111/2, and these fit well. Retail is $120.00, I want $85.00 shippingincluded. Please contact me offlist. M-D -- Todd Talsma 8412 North Maple Court Zeeland MI 49464 ------ email: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/ Bamboo Tips site:http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo/ Bamboo Sources site:http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo_Sources/ home page:http://external.sligh.com/~toddt/ genealogy pages: Under construction from tedknott@cogeco.ca Thu Mar 7 10:08:44 2002 Received: from From: "Ted" "Rodmakers discussion group" References: Subject: Re: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu X-Listprocessor- Version:8.2.09/990901/11:28 -- ListProc(tm) by CREN When pre-fitting the ferrulesI press the tabs flat to the bamboo by ironing them with a piece of keystock.When gluing the ferrules the function of the binding cord is to hold the tabstightly in place, not to "pull" them into place. > from avyoung@iinet.net.au ThuMar 7 10:17:39 2002 Received: from mail.iinet.net.au (symphony- X-Sender:avyoung@mail.iinet.net.au X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 jojo@ipa.net From: Tony Young Subject: Re: FlatsBoots For Sale Cc: Rodmakers List In-Reply- owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu X-Listprocessor- Version:8.2.09/990901/11:28 -- ListProc(tm) by CREN Boy, that's pretty savagestuff there. TY At 10:45 AM 3/7/02 -0500, Todd Talsma wrote: Must have been too much shmoozing with those Yankee-Wanker- Bastardslastnight M-D. TEE HEE HEE Jojo DeLancier wrote: That is supposed to be Marlwalker, not Flats Stalker. Close but no cee-gar, huh? ;o) M-D Guys, I have one pair of the Patagonia Flats Stalkers, size 12, for sale -- only worn once. I wear an 11 - 111/2, and these fit well. Retail is $120.00, I want $85.00 shipping included. Please contact me off list. M-D --Todd Talsma8412 North Maple CourtZeeland MI 49464------ web design business page: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo Tips site: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo/Bamboo Sources site: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo_Sources/home page: http://external.sligh.com/~toddt/genealogy pages: Under construction /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html Christmas Gift Tips Avoid at any cost Christmas crackers with the label: Made in Afghanistan /*************************************************************************/ from ttalsma@macatawa.org Thu Mar 7 10:23:29 2002 g27GNS825084 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 10:23:28 -0600 id ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 11:16:14 -0500 id F563C2L5; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 11:16:03 -0500 Subject: Re: Flats Boots For Sale Yeah Tony, but I was talking about me! You had to be in the chat roomlast night. It was a fun time had by all, I think. Tony Young wrote: Boy, that's pretty savage stuff there. TY At 10:45 AM 3/7/02 -0500, Todd Talsma wrote: Must have been too much shmoozing with those Yankee-Wanker- Bastardslastnight M-D. TEE HEE HEE Jojo DeLancier wrote: That is supposed to be Marlwalker, not Flats Stalker. Close but no cee-gar, huh? ;o) M-D Guys, I have one pair of the Patagonia Flats Stalkers, size 12, for sale -- only worn once. I wear an 11 - 111/2, and these fit well. Retail is $120.00, I want $85.00 shipping included. Please contact me off list. M-D --Todd Talsma8412 North Maple CourtZeeland MI 49464------ web design business page: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo Tips site: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo/Bamboo Sources site: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo_Sources/home page: http://external.sligh.com/~toddt/genealogy pages: Under construction /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html Christmas Gift Tips Avoid at any cost Christmas crackers with the label: Made in Afghanistan /*************************************************************************/ -- Todd Talsma 8412 North Maple Court Zeeland MI 49464 ------ email: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/ Bamboo Tips site:http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo/ Bamboo Sources site:http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo_Sources/ home page:http://external.sligh.com/~toddt/ genealogy pages: Under construction from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Thu Mar 7 10:25:10 2002 Received: from g27GP0v125932; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 08:25:02 -0800 Message-ID:Date: Thu, 07 Mar 2002 10:24:30 -0600 From: Harry Boyd X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.76 [en] Removing Ferrules References: Content-Type: fbcwin@3g.quik.com Sender: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu X- Listprocessor-Version: 8.2.09/990901/11:28 -- ListProc(tm) by CREN Ted,Wish I had read this five years ago. Only on my last few rods have I finallyfigured out how to get the tabs to lie flat. And here you go sharing it withthe entire rodmakers list! :-)) I do basically the same thing as you, with a cutoff section of bamboo. I very lightly tap it with a nylon hammer, to geteverything good and tight before I bind it down. Thanks for sharing, HarryTed wrote: When pre-fitting the ferrules I press the tabs flat to the bamboo by ironingthem with a piece of keystock. When gluing the ferrules the function ofthebinding cord is to hold the tabs tightly in place, not to "pull" them intoplace. --Harry Boyd http://www.canerods.com/ Bamboo Rodshttp://www.fbcwin.com/ Our Church from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Thu Mar 7 10:28:16 2002 g27GSF825696 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 10:28:15 -0600 (authenticated) for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 08:28:08 -0800 Subject: Re: Latest article Folks,Several sharp-eyed listers have questioned me about thefirst photo in this article, asking if it were upside-down andbackwards. Truth is I stood on my head to take the picture,so it is right-side up.Just kidding, it WAS upside down, but now looks better, Ithink. Harry Boyd wrote: here's the url for everyone:http://www.globalflyfisher.com/rodbuilding/bamboo4/ Harry --Harry Boyd http://www.canerods.com/ Bamboo Rodshttp://www.fbcwin.com/ Our Church --Harry Boyd http://www.canerods.com/ Bamboo Rodshttp://www.fbcwin.com/ Our Church from stoltz10@attbi.com Thu Mar 7 10:29:41 2002 g27GTf825934 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 10:29:41 -0600 Thu, 7 Mar 2002 16:29:35 +0000 Subject: Re: Latest article Great article, I did not know that web sight existed.----- Original Message ----- Subject: Latest article Friends, Several folks have asked about my latest article atwww.globalflyfisher.com. My sincere thanks to Kyle Druey,Timothy Troester, and Don Anderson for their help inproviding pictures. Since I cannot remember everyone whoasked to be notified when the article came out, here's theurl for everyone:http://www.globalflyfisher.com/rodbuilding/bamboo4/ Harry --Harry Boyd http://www.canerods.com/ Bamboo Rodshttp://www.fbcwin.com/ Our Church from avyoung@iinet.net.au Thu Mar 7 10:31:10 2002 g27GV8826215 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 10:31:08 -0600 Subject: Re: Flats Boots For Sale g27GV9826216 I'm glad to read that or we'd have a cold wind from the North situation without him to chair it [:-)] TY At 11:19 AM 3/7/02 -0500, Todd Talsma wrote: Yeah Tony, but I was talking about me! You had to be in the chat roomlast night. It was a fun time had by all, I think. Tony Young wrote: Boy, that's pretty savage stuff there. TY At 10:45 AM 3/7/02 -0500, Todd Talsma wrote: Must have been too much shmoozing with those Yankee-Wanker-Bastards lastnight M-D. TEE HEE HEE Jojo DeLancier wrote: That is supposed to be Marlwalker, not Flats Stalker. Close but no cee-gar, huh? ;o) M-D Guys, I have one pair of the Patagonia Flats Stalkers, size 12, for sale -- only worn once. I wear an 11 - 111/2, and these fit well. Retail is $120.00, I want $85.00 shipping included. Please contact me off list. M-D --Todd Talsma8412 North Maple CourtZeeland MI 49464------ web design business page: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo Tips site: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo/Bamboo Sources site: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo_Sources/home page: http://external.sligh.com/~toddt/genealogy pages: Under construction /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html Christmas Gift Tips Avoid at any cost Christmas crackers with the label: Made in Afghanistan /*************************************************************************/ --Todd Talsma8412 North Maple CourtZeeland MI 49464------ web design business page: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo Tips site: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo/Bamboo Sources site: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo_Sources/home page: http://external.sligh.com/~toddt/genealogy pages: Under construction /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html Christmas Gift Tips Avoid at any cost Christmas crackers with the label: Made in Afghanistan /*************************************************************************/ from rcurry@ttlc.net Thu Mar 7 10:38:11 2002 g27GcB826981 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 10:38:11 -0600 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:0.9.4)Gecko/20011019 Netscape6/6.2 Subject: re:Removing ferrules Picture hanging wire (cable actually) works well and allows you to apply more heat and tighten more, just by twisting the ends. Put one loop around the ferrule, holding both ends and slide the loop onto the tabs. Put a second turn around, still pulling tight, and then twist the ends together.-- Best regards, Reed http://www.overmywaders.com/ > from jojo@ipa.netThu Mar 7 10:50:25 2002 Received: from hall.mail.mindspring.net 0006A8-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Thu, 07 Mar 2002 11:50:20 - 0500 Message-ID: From: References: Subject: Re: Flats Boots For Sale 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu X-Listprocessor- Version:8.2.09/990901/11:28 -- ListProc(tm) by CREN Yes, Todd. I think I must stillbe drunk with all the excitement. M-D From: "Todd Talsma"Must have been too much shmoozing with thoseYankee-Wanker-Bastards last night M-D. TEE HEE HEE Jojo DeLancier wrote: That is supposed to be Marlwalker, not Flats Stalker. Close but no cee- gar,huh? ;o) M-D Guys, I have one pair of the Patagonia Flats Stalkers, size 12, for sale -- onlyworn once. I wear an 11 - 111/2, and these fit well. Retail is $120.00, I want $85.00 shippingincluded. Please contact me off list. M-D --Todd Talsma8412 North Maple CourtZeeland MI 49464------ web design business page: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo Tips site: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo/Bamboo Sources site: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo_Sources/home page: http://external.sligh.com/~toddt/genealogy pages: Under construction from ttalsma@macatawa.org Thu Mar 7 10:57:22 2002 g27GvJ828892 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 10:57:19 -0600 id ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 11:50:04 -0500 id F563C2MY; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 11:49:54 -0500 Subject: Re: Flats Boots For Sale Yep, I thought you and Harry were getting pretty giddy with the"Northern Experience" Jojo DeLancier wrote: Yes, Todd. I think I must still be drunk with all the excitement. M-D From: "Todd Talsma" Must have been too much shmoozing with those Yankee-Wanker- Bastardslastnight M-D. TEE HEE HEE Jojo DeLancier wrote: That is supposed to be Marlwalker, not Flats Stalker. Close but no cee-gar, huh? ;o) M-D Guys, I have one pair of the Patagonia Flats Stalkers, size 12, for sale -- onlyworn once. I wear an 11 - 111/2, and these fit well. Retail is $120.00, I want $85.00 shippingincluded. Please contact me off list. M-D --Todd Talsma8412 North Maple CourtZeeland MI 49464------ web design business page: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo Tips site: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo/Bamboo Sources site: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo_Sources/home page: http://external.sligh.com/~toddt/genealogy pages: Under construction -- Todd Talsma 8412 North Maple Court Zeeland MI 49464 ------ email: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/ Bamboo Tips site:http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo/ Bamboo Sources site:http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo_Sources/ home page:http://external.sligh.com/~toddt/ genealogy pages: Under construction from alan.grombacher@pioneer.com Thu Mar 7 11:01:19 2002 Received: g27H1I829459 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 Mar 2002 12:01:18 -0500 Received: from orion.phibred.com by Mar 2002 12:00:49 -0500 Received: by orion.phibred.com with Internet MailService (5.5.2653.19) id ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 11:00:49 -0600 Subject: long rod tapers. Date: Thu, 7 Mar alan.grombacher@pioneer.com Sender: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. ------ fellas lately. The late Len Wright wrote about long rods. He mentioned using a10 foot Payne (a light lined rod). Does anyone know about this rod and taper?What about any other light lined rod tapers 9 feet and larger? Cheers, about any other light lined rod tapers 9 feet and Mar 7 11:03:01 2002 Received: from q4.quik.com (q4.quik.com Date: Thu, 07 Mar 2002 11:02:22 -0600 From: Harry Boyd X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.76 [en] ttalsma@macatawa.org CC: Rodmakers List Subject: Re: Flats Boots For Sale References: Content-Type: text/plain; fbcwin@3g.quik.com Sender: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu X- Listprocessor-Version: 8.2.09/990901/11:28 -- ListProc(tm) by CREN Todd,Yeah, I guess we were just feeling sorry for those of you in the frozen north.High today here in Winnsboro, Louisiana, US of A is supposed to be 72*F.Partly cloudy, and I have some free time this afternoon, so lookout localbluegills and crappies. Harry PS- back to rodmaking now, okay? Todd Talsmawrote: Yep, I thought you and Harry were getting pretty giddy with the --Harry Boyd http://www.canerods.com/ Bamboo Rodshttp://www.fbcwin.com/ Our Church from jojo@ipa.net Thu Mar 7 11:11:52 2002 g27HBp800571 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 11:11:51 -0600 helo=default) id 16j1Qj-0002RM-00 for rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu; Thu, 07 Mar 2002 12:11:50 -0500 Subject: Re: Flats Boots For Sale No, Todd. That was nausea, not giddiness. Now, will someone PLEASE buy myboots? ;o) M-D Yep, I thought you and Harry were getting pretty giddy with the"Northern Experience" Jojo DeLancier wrote: Yes, Todd. I think I must still be drunk with all the excitement. M-D From: "Todd Talsma" Must have been too much shmoozing with those Yankee-Wanker- Bastardslastnight M-D. TEE HEE HEE Jojo DeLancier wrote: That is supposed to be Marlwalker, not Flats Stalker. Close but no cee-gar, huh? ;o) M-D Guys, I have one pair of the Patagonia Flats Stalkers, size 12, for sale -- onlyworn once. I wear an 11 - 111/2, and these fit well. Retail is $120.00, I want $85.00 shippingincluded. Please contact me off list. M-D --Todd Talsma8412 North Maple CourtZeeland MI 49464------ web design business page: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo Tips site: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo/Bamboo Sources site: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo_Sources/home page: http://external.sligh.com/~toddt/genealogy pages: Under construction --Todd Talsma8412 North Maple CourtZeeland MI 49464------ web design business page: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo Tips site: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo/Bamboo Sources site: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo_Sources/home page: http://external.sligh.com/~toddt/genealogy pages: Under construction from jbbamboo@hotmail.com Thu Mar 7 11:15:45 2002 g27HFi800968 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 11:15:44 -0600 Thu, 7 Mar 2002 09:15:35 -0800 Thu, 07 Mar 2002 17:15:35 GMT Subject: Re: Flats Boots For Sale FILETIME=[B1C0F2C0:01C1C5FB] Harry: weather like that. We just got through Feb with 91.9 inches of snow in thecounty next to me. We'll probably not need the lawnmower till the 4th of July. the frozen north. High today here in Partly cloudy, and I have some free time this with the Join the world's largest e-mail servicewith MSN Hotmail. ClickHere from jbbamboo@hotmail.com Thu Mar 7 11:29:40 2002 g27HTd801875 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 11:29:39 -0600 Thu, 7 Mar 2002 09:29:34 -0800 Thu, 07 Mar 2002 17:29:34 GMT Subject: Re: long rod tapers. FILETIME=[A5ED88D0:01C1C5FD] Alan: I'm well aware of a great wet fly rod, currently owned be Reed Curry. I believeit's a 10 ft 6 wt and is a classic wet fly action. Sloooow and smooooth. Reed been posted somewhere in the archive's. This rod will roll cast like no otherI've tried and it's one I intend to build for myself someday. Sixty foot roll late Len Payne (a light What about any Join the world's largest e-mail servicewith MSN Hotmail. ClickHere from atlasc1@earthlink.net Thu Mar 7 11:31:59 2002 g27HVw802196 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 11:31:58 -0600 ([209.179.148.238] helo=computer) id 16j1jQ-0005PX-00; Thu, 07 Mar 2002 09:31:08 -0800 "Eric Johannesen" , ,"Rodmakers discussion group" Subject: Re: Advise on Depth Gauge and Base Opps, I meant I do not use a caliper to measure strips. Adam Vigil----- Original Message ----- ; "Rodmakers discussion group" Subject: Re: Advise on Depth Gauge and Base You can get the dial indicator off ebay cheap from Nolan Tools. As for thebase I went with a sloted one from Munro Rod Co. It allows measureing thestrip while it sits in the form. You just do it without the tip. I do notuse a dial indicator at all to measure strips. You will know exactly howmuch more cane needs to be remove. Adam Vigil----- Original Message -----From: "timothy troester" discussion group" Sent: Wednesday, March 06, 2002 6:50 PMSubject: Re: Advise on Depth Gauge and Base jeff wagner sells a good one. timothy --- Eric Johannesen wrote: I am looking for advise on purchasing a depth gaugeand a base. Couldanybody point me in the right direction? Eric J. ====="Gooda' mornin', mister bear!" ...Ride, boldly ride,"The shade replied, -"If you seek for Eldorado!" -- E.A.Poe __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Try FREE Yahoo! Mail - the world's greatest free email!http://mail.yahoo.com/ from KyleDruey@aol.com Thu Mar 7 11:32:06 2002 g27HW5802217 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 11:32:05 -0600 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 12:31:15 -0500 0307123129; Thu, 07 Mar 2002 12:31:29 -0500 Subject: Re: Flats Boots For Sale I don't how you can live in that kind of climate. I just had to turn on the lawnsprinklers again 3 weeks ago...(San Joaquin Valley in CA) In a message dated Thu, 7 Mar 2002 12:16:29 PM Eastern Standard Time,"Jim Bureau" writes: Harry: Just how do you expect to skii and snowshoe in weather like that. We justgot through Feb with 91.9 inches of snow in the county next to me. We'llprobably not need the lawnmower till the 4th of July. From: Harry Boyd Rodmakers List Subject: Re: Flats Boots For Sale Date: Thu, 07 Mar 2002 11:02:22 -0600 Todd, Yeah, I guess we were just feeling sorry for those of you in the frozennorth. High today here in Winnsboro, Louisiana, US of A is supposed to be 72*F. Partly cloudy, and Ihave some free time this afternoon, so lookout local bluegills and crappies. Harry PS- back to rodmaking now, okay? Todd Talsma wrote: Yep, I thought you and Harry were getting pretty giddy with the -- Harry Boyd http://www.canerods.com/ Bamboo Rods http://www.fbcwin.com/ Our Church Join the world’s largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. Click Here from atlasc1@earthlink.net Thu Mar 7 11:38:14 2002 g27HcD802984 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 11:38:13 -0600 ([209.179.148.238] helo=computer) id 16j1qE-0001HS-00; Thu, 07 Mar 2002 09:38:11 -0800 Subject: Re: Removing Ferrules I do the same but use a piece a of cane with the enamel on. It presses thetabs quickly. Adam----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Removing Ferrules Ted, Wish I had read this five years ago. Only on my last few rods have Ifinally figured out how to get the tabs to lie flat. And here you go sharing it with the entire rodmakers list! :-))I do basically the same thing as you, with a cut off section of bamboo. I very lightly tap it with a nylon hammer, to get everything good and tight before I bind it down. Thanks for sharing,Harry Ted wrote: When pre-fitting the ferrules I press the tabs flat to the bamboo by ironing them with a piece of keystock. When gluing the ferrules the function of the binding cord is to hold the tabs tightly in place, not to "pull" them into place. --Harry Boyd http://www.canerods.com/ Bamboo Rodshttp://www.fbcwin.com/ Our Church from tedknott@cogeco.ca Thu Mar 7 11:38:20 2002 g27HcK803006 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 11:38:20 -0600 Subject: Re: long rod tapers. Somewhere in my files I have tapers for a 9' 6" heddon #8, and a 9' 0" =#4 Leonard. is this what you are looking for? Somewhere in my files I have tapers for= for? from jbbamboo@hotmail.com Thu Mar 7 12:42:41 2002 g27Ige806073 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 12:42:40 -0600 Thu, 7 Mar 2002 10:42:34 -0800 Thu, 07 Mar 2002 18:42:34 GMT Subject: Re: Flats Boots For Sale FILETIME=[D8EAECF0:01C1C607] Kyle: build bamboo rods, tie fly's, ice fish, skii, play hockey, snowshoe, snowmobile, doing. I always thought it would be boaring to have grown up living anywherewhere I didn't have the four seasons and especially winter to enjoy. Startcoaching your son's hockey team and you'll care less if summer ever gethere. Now that I'm getting close to retirement and don't do most of thatstuff, I'm wondering what the hell I am doing up here in gods country.Anybody know of a nice house for sale in the Florida Keys, e-mail me offlist. Jim turn on the lawn sprinklers again 3 weeks ago...(San Joaquin Valley in CA) Standard Time, "Jim Bureau" writes: weather like that. We just got through Feb with 91.9 inches of snow in thecounty next to me. We'll probably not need the lawnmower till the 4th of July. Rodmakers List those of you in the frozen north. High today here in 72*F. Partly cloudy, and I have some free time this pretty giddy with the Hotmail. Click Here Send and receive Hotmail on yourmobile device: ClickHere from kenealyj@gwi.net Thu Mar 7 14:54:06 2002 g27Ks5816265 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 14:54:05 -0600 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 15:54:04 -0500 Subject: Guillermo's Leaders Hey all, Just wanted to share: M-D sent me one of Guillermo Magarinos' (list member from =Argentina)furled leaders to try out.As you all know, things are worse than bad in Argentina and M-D, in an =effort to help a friend asked me, and I think some other list members, =to try a leader with thoughts that if I liked it, I would carry them in =my shop. I hadn't had a chance to cast it until this morning and loved it! I had =looked it over and all and it is made wonderfully. anyway, I emailed =M-D to let him know that I was interested in them. This afternoon a fellow came in to try out one of Scott's new Superply(I =know graphite-flame away!) and we got to talking leaders-he hasn't been =all that happy with what he's been using. I suggested that he try the =furled leader. We loaded up one of my 7' 4wt cane rods and went out to =cast. He had never cast a cane rod before and was a little =apprehensive. Anyway- he loved both!! He said that he would definitely =buy some of the leaders if I carry them and he ended up ordering a cane =rod also!! Not a bad day. Yes, I suppose I do(will) have a financial interest in these leaders, =but they will not make or break me and if I can help out a friend of =M-D's, all the better. John k Hey all, Just wanted to share: M-D sent me one of GuillermoMagarinos' = member from Argentina)furled leaders to try out.As you all know, things are worse than= Argentina and M-D, in an effort to help a friend asked me, and I think = other list members, to try a leader with thoughts that if I liked it, I = carry them in my shop. I hadn't had a chance to cast it until = in them. This afternoon a fellow came in to try = would definitely buy some of the leaders if I carry them and he ended up = Yes, I suppose I do(will) have a = a friend of M-D's, all the better. Johnk from OSEGAL@glcc.com Thu Mar 7 15:13:52 2002 g27LDp817673 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 15:13:51 -0600 with Novell_GroupWise; Thu, 07 Mar 2002 16:13:43 -0500 Subject: Re: Guillermo's Leaders I suppose Guillermo will read this message. If you do, please contact me. =I live in Buenos Aires, phone number (011) 4737-0422 (home), (011) =4732- 0070 (office); (15 11) 4175-9690 (mobile). Otherwise, John, Regards, Oscar "John Kenealy" 03/07/02 05:58PM >>> Hey all, Just wanted to share: M-D sent me one of Guillermo Magarinos' (list member from Argentina)furled=leaders to try out.As you all know, things are worse than bad in Argentina and M-D, in an =effort to help a friend asked me, and I think some other list members, to =try a leader with thoughts that if I liked it, I would carry them in my =shop. I hadn't had a chance to cast it until this morning and loved it! I had =looked it over and all and it is made wonderfully. anyway, I emailed M-D =to let him know that I was interested in them. This afternoon a fellow came in to try out one of Scott's new Superply(I =know graphite-flame away!) and we got to talking leaders-he hasn't been =all that happy with what he's been using. I suggested that he try the =furled leader. We loaded up one of my 7' 4wt cane rods and went out to =cast. He had never cast a cane rod before and was a little apprehensive. =Anyway- he loved both!! He said that he would definitely buy some of the =leaders if I carry them and he ended up ordering a cane rod also!! Not a =bad day. Yes, I suppose I do(will) have a financial interest in these leaders, but =they will not make or break me and if I can help out a friend of M-D's, =all the better. John k I suppose Guillermo will read this message. If you do,= contact me. I live in Buenos Aires, phone number (011) 4737-0422 (home), = 4732-0070 (office); (15 11) 4175-9690 (mobile). Otherwise, John, Regards, Oscar Hey all, Just wanted to share: M-D sent me one of GuillermoMagarinos' = member from Argentina)furled leaders to try out.As you all know, things are worse than= Argentina and M-D, in an effort to help a friend asked me, and I think = other list members, to try a leader with thoughts that if I liked it, I = carry them in my shop. I hadn't had a chance to cast it until = in them. This afternoon a fellow came in to try = = would definitely buy some of the leaders if I carry them and he ended = Yes, I suppose I do(will) have a = a friend of M-D's, all the better. Johnk from rkrees@mcn.net Thu Mar 7 15:28:22 2002 g27LSK818568 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 15:28:20 -0600 id 16j5Qw-00007C-00; Thu, 07 Mar 2002 13:28:19 -0800 Subject: Re: Guillermo's Leaders Could you please post how we all my help out, maybe we can do a group =buy or something. I know that I would love to try these leaders but have =no outlet for them nor the time to make them.Ron Could you please post how we all my help out, maybe= a group buy or something. I know that I would love to try these leaders = no outlet for them nor the time to make them.Ron from luu_andrew@hotmail.com Thu Mar 7 15:30:16 2002 g27LUF818805 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 15:30:15 -0600 Thu, 7 Mar 2002 13:30:02 -0800 Thu, 07 Mar 2002 21:30:02 GMT Subject: Depth gauge, base,accessories, Stanley 9 1/2 for sale, delete if notinterested FILETIME=[3DC4FB90:01C1C61F] Hello Everyone, Two weeks ago I posted on the list the rod making equipments I am selling, I have sold almost all of them (I hope you all are happy with the equipments) except for a depth gauge and the base and accessories, and an older stanley 9 1/2 plane that you may be interested in. I have one depth gauge and base that I bought from Lon Blauvelts at the same time I bought the Wagner'sform but also have never had a chance to use it. You can find more about it here: http://members.tripod.com/~BambooFlyRods/gauges.html I am asking for $75 + $6 shipping including this detph gauge setup, 2 staretts 60* checks, 3 of the 60* points, and a calibration block from John Linvet. I am asking $25 + 5 shipping for the older stanley 9 1/2 in good condition with no rust Please let me know if any of these interest you, off the list of course. Best regards,Andrew _________________________________________________________________Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com from luu_andrew@hotmail.com Thu Mar 7 15:51:00 2002 g27Lox820408 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 15:50:59 -0600 Thu, 7 Mar 2002 13:50:53 -0800 Thu, 07 Mar 2002 21:50:53 GMT Subject: Re: Depth gauge, base,accessories, Stanley 9 1/2 for sale, delete ifnot interes FILETIME=[277792A0:01C1C622] All are gone. Thank you very much once again for putting up with me posting these equipments for sale. I rather have rodmakers get a first look at it before it's going on ebay. Good luck to you all. Best regards, Andrew _________________________________________________________________Join the world's largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com from ccurrojr@voyager.net Thu Mar 7 15:56:37 2002 g27Lub820824 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 15:56:37 -0600 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 16:55:46 -0500 Subject: Grayrock Rodmakers & Friends --------------5A2DAD25578163BEAACA3AF6 Dear listers Since I've been off the list for awhile, I'm not sure if anything hasbeen posted regarding some news from those of us who admit (publicly) tobeing associated with the Rodmakers at Grayrock. But, here goes . . . The 2002 Makers Rod Stream Restoration Raffle officially kicks off thisweekend at the Midwest Fly Fishing Expo at Southfield (near Detroit). Alot of rodmakers we all know pooled their efforts and made one gorgeousrod. The rest of the prize package ain't bad either. You can find outall about the Makers Rod project and order your ticket by visiting thisweb page - http://www.curro.net/makersrod. Also - you can preregister for the Grayrock gathering by going here - http://www.curro.net/grayrock2002. We're gonna have a TON of rods tocast up here this year. At least that's what Dennis Higham said. And for those of you who are chomping-at-the-bit to sign up for SRG 2002so you can watch Harry Boyd attempt to split cane like a REAL man does(namely, Bob "Crack-em-with-yer-fingers" Nunley), well, you will justhave to wait until the middle of April. We'll get a preregistration webpage up by then. Bless you all and over&out.cc --------------5A2DAD25578163BEAACA3AF6 Dear listersSince I've been off the list for awhile, I'm not sure if anything hasbeen posted regarding some news from those of us who admit (publicly) tobeing associated with the Rodmakers at Grayrock. But, here goes . . .The 2002 Makers Rod Stream Restoration Raffle officially kicks off thisweekend at the Midwest Fly Fishing Expo at Southfield (near Detroit). Alot of rodmakers we all know pooled their efforts and made one gorgeousrod. The rest of the prize package ain't bad either. You can find out allabout the Makers Rod project and order your ticket by visiting this webpage - http://www.curro.net/makersrod.Also - you can preregister for the Grayrock gathering by going here- http://www.curro.net/grayrock2002. We're gonna have a TONof rods to cast up here this year. At least that's what Dennis Higham said.And for those of you who are chomping-at-the-bit to sign up for SRG2002 so you can watch Harry Boyd attempt to split cane like a REAL mandoes (namely, Bob "Crack-em-with-yer-fingers" Nunley), well, you will justhave to wait until the middle of April. We'll get a preregistration webpage up by then.Bless you all and over&out.cc --------------5A2DAD25578163BEAACA3AF6-- from Harris.James@ev.state.az.us Thu Mar 7 16:49:36 2002 g27Mna823150 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 16:49:36 -0600 g27Mlp324858 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 15:47:51 -0700 15:47:40 2002 -0700 with Novell_GroupWise; Thu, 07 Mar 2002 15:49:29 -0700 Subject: New Binder g27Mna823151 Just checked out Tom Hardy's new binder on Todds Tips webpage. Suggestyou do the same. Look in What's New or Contraptions. Beautiful work Tom! from ddeloach@pcisys.net Thu Mar 7 17:07:50 2002 g27N7n824068 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 17:07:49 -0600 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 16:07:44 -0700 env- from (ddeloach@pcisys.net) Subject: Non-rodmaking: bulk fly order Gentlemen,I am soliciting participants in a wholesale group fly order from one of themajor wholesalers in Africa I've been sent a sample dozen of different patterns and I must say the fliesare of excellent quality. They are well hackled and on top quality hooks.The wholsaler lists Fishwest flies and several other US customers asreferences. from what I've seen I am convinced that these are very highquality fly shop caliber flies that Fishwest charges over a dollar each for. The best part is the wholesale prices are VERY inexpensive, but the minimumorder is 100 dozen plus shipping. When I asked for a quote they said that arecent order of 100 dozen sent to the US was $57 to ship. Could be slightlyhigher or lower they said. I've attached the price list they gave me (dries at $3/dozen wow!) Forcomplete list of available patterns check http://bygraceflies.netfirms.com/ Anyway please contact me off list if interested in getting in on a grouporder. Personally I don't want more than about 30 or 40 dozen so if I canfind a few guys to help me make it to 100 dozen I'll do it. NFI of course, and thanksDon DeLoach Prices (In US dollars per dozen) Dry Flies3.0 Wet Flies2.5 Streamers3.5 Beadhead3.7 Muddler3.8 Nymphs2.5 Salmon6.0 Stimulator5.0 Standard Salt Water8.0 Steel Head9.5 TubeFlies10.0 Epoxy Saltwater8.5 Bassbugs7.5 from bob@downandacross.com Thu Mar 7 18:11:50 2002 g280Bn825937 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 18:11:49 -0600 7 Mar 2002 19:11:43 -0500 Subject: RE: Grayrock Rodmakers & Friends Hi Charlie:Will the book be available for others? It would be a neat item to have.Thanks for the info.Bob-----Original Message-----From: owner- rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Thursday, March 07, 2002 4:56 PM Subject: Grayrock Rodmakers & Friends Dear listersSince I've been off the list for awhile, I'm not sure if anything has beenposted regarding some news from those of us who admit (publicly) to beingassociated with the Rodmakers at Grayrock. But, here goes . . . The 2002 Makers Rod Stream Restoration Raffle officially kicks off thisweekend at the Midwest Fly Fishing Expo at Southfield (near Detroit). A lotof rodmakers we all know pooled their efforts and made one gorgeous rod.Therest of the prize package ain't bad either. You can find out all about theMakers Rod project and order your ticket by visiting this web page - http://www.curro.net/makersrod. Also - you can preregister for the Grayrock gathering by going here - http://www.curro.net/grayrock2002. We're gonna have a TON of rods tocast uphere this year. At least that's what Dennis Higham said. And for those of you who are chomping-at-the-bit to sign up for SRG 2002so you can watch Harry Boyd attempt to split cane like a REAL man does(namely, Bob "Crack-em-with-yer-fingers" Nunley), well, you will just haveto wait until the middle of April. We'll get a preregistration web page up Bless you all and over&out.cc Charlie: have. the info.Bob CurroSent: Thursday, March 07, 2002 4:56 rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Grayrock Rodmakers& = Since I've been off the list for awhile, I'm not sure if anything = posted regarding some news from those of us who admit (publicly) to = The 2002 Makers Rod Stream Restoration Raffle officially kicks off = weekend at the Midwest Fly Fishing Expo at Southfield (near Detroit). = rodmakers we all know pooled their efforts and made one gorgeous rod. = of the prize package ain't bad either. You can find out all about the = Also - you can preregister for the Grayrock gathering by going here =- http://www.curro.net/grayrock2= We're gonna have a TON of rods to cast up here this = And for those of you who are chomping-at-the-bit to sign up for SRG = you can watch Harry Boyd attempt to split cane like a REAL man does = Bob "Crack-em-with-yer-fingers" Nunley), well, you will just have to = until the middle of April. We'll get a preregistration web page up by = Bless you all and over&out. cc = from rkrees@mcn.net Thu Mar 7 18:18:18 2002 g280IH826234 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 18:18:18 -0600 id 16j85Q-0004aB-00 for rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu; Thu, 07 Mar 2002 16:18:17 -0800 Subject: Drip Tubes ?For those of you using clear plastic fluorescent light tube protector's fordrip tubes, have youtried using regular pvc cement and if so have you had any bad reactions withyour varnish?Ron from rextutor@yahoo.com Thu Mar 7 19:08:34 2002 g2818Y827382 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 19:08:34 -0600 07 Mar 2002 17:08:33 PST Subject: Re: Drip Tubes RonThe glue I used is 5 min epoxy on my clear plasticfluorescentlight tube protector's for my drip tube. Noreaction to varnish . I used a pvc cap and th glue hasvery little chance to contact the varnish. I used ahot water spit cock value which I cut threads for sono glue there. WHat happened to your varnish ? GoodLuck --- "Ronnie L. Rees" wrote: ?For those of you using clear plastic fluorescentlight tube protector's fordrip tubes, have youtried using regular pvc cement and if so have youhad any bad reactions withyour varnish?Ron __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Try FREE Yahoo! Mail - the world's greatest free email!http://mail.yahoo.com/ from erjmjj@mhtc.net Thu Mar 7 19:13:20 2002 g281DJ827640 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 19:13:19 -0600 "Rodmakers discussion group" Subject: 60* Starret Tips Dear Chat Group: I found a dial indicator thanks to the advice of the chat group last night.However, somebody gave me the information about the Starret 60* tipavailable from Enco. They informed me that it was tip number 84629800. Ihave tried to find this on the Enco site and have had no luck. Couldsomebody point me in the right direction. Eric J. from rkrees@mcn.net Thu Mar 7 19:13:48 2002 g281Dl827764 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 19:13:48 -0600 id 16j8x7-00075O-00; Thu, 07 Mar 2002 17:13:46 -0800 Subject: Re: Drip Tubes RexNothing I have just relocated the shop and the old dip system stayed in thefloor at the old place. I thought that I would try this sence space is at alimit and the new shop will not be built for about a year. I bought fiveminute but thought that I would try PVC and see how it worked just for theease of things and I thought that I might ask othersThanks Ron from edriddle@mindspring.com Thu Mar 7 19:17:54 2002 g281Hs828116 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 19:17:54 -0600 helo=oemcomputer) id 16j915-0000LF-00; Thu, 07 Mar 2002 20:17:51 -0500 Subject: Re: Drip Tubes Ron:A buddy of mine glued up the pvc piece on the bottom of my tube with whathecalled "pvc glue" and I've run a dozen or sorods through the tube in the last couple years with no problems. The tubefits inside the pvc piece, no glue on inside of tube.Ed ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Drip Tubes ?For those of you using clear plastic fluorescent light tube protector's for drip tubes, have youtried using regular pvc cement and if so have you had any bad reactions with your varnish?Ron from rmoon@ida.net Thu Mar 7 19:19:03 2002 g281J3828255 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 19:19:03 -0600 Subject: Off the subject I was just browsing, and found Charley Curro's non trout bum page on theJordan River. It just reminded me of things I have yet to do. Likestop and smell the flowers. Try it you will like itRalph http://www.curro.net/Tbbqv/jordan/river.htm --http://www.ida.net/users/rmoon from rextutor@yahoo.com Thu Mar 7 19:27:47 2002 g281Rk828718 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 19:27:46 -0600 07 Mar 2002 17:27:44 PST Subject: Re: Drip Tubes Like I saw in another email , the cap is 2 inches andfit the tube tight - little or no glue contact withvarnishPiece of cake --- "Ronnie L. Rees" wrote: RexNothing I have just relocated the shop and the olddip system stayed in thefloor at the old place. I thought that I would trythis sence space is at alimit and the new shop will not be built for about ayear. I bought fiveminute but thought that I would try PVC and see howit worked just for theease of things and I thought that I might ask othersThanks Ron __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Try FREE Yahoo! Mail - the world's greatest free email!http://mail.yahoo.com/ from HARRISTRIBE@aol.com Thu Mar 7 19:34:08 2002 g281Y7829067 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 19:34:07 -0600 Subject: Re: Drip Tubes Ron if your trying to put a cap on the bottom there is a simple round PVC connector that will fit inside the clear tube and the cap will fit on the outside of the tube. When you put them all together they will press fit so sweetly that you will not need to use PVC cement. I'm on my second driptube setup and I've never lost a drop with this connection. Off hand I can't remember the proper name for that part. But it looks like a PVC sleeve that is made for this application. Just look around in the various boxes until you find it. Grab one of the HD clear tubes so you can check the fit. The other nice thing is that when you change tubes down the road you will reuse the fittings. JimH Ron if your trying to put a cap on the bottom thereis a simple round PVC connector that will fit inside the clear tube and the cap they will press fit so sweetly that you will not need to use PVC other nice thing is that when you change tubes down the road you will reusethe fittings. JimH from edriddle@mindspring.com Thu Mar 7 19:36:04 2002 g281a3829278 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 19:36:03 -0600 helo=oemcomputer) id 16j9If-0004yQ-00 for rodmakers@mail.wustl.edu; Thu, 07 Mar 2002 20:36:02 -0500 Subject: Fw: 60* Starret Tips Eric:I couldn't find this item at Enco either a couple months ago. I found it onthe Starrett website, but since they don't ship direct, I had to arrange toget it through a local outlet that carried Starrett stuff ( list of dealerson their website as I recall). Cost approx. $3.00.Ed ----- Original Message ----- discussiongroup" Subject: 60* Starret Tips Dear Chat Group: I found a dial indicator thanks to the advice of the chat group last night. However, somebody gave me the information about the Starret 60* tipavailable from Enco. They informed me that it was tip number 84629800. Ihave tried to find this on the Enco site and have had no luck. Couldsomebody point me in the right direction. Eric J. from mrc@mars.plala.or.jp Thu Mar 7 19:44:49 2002 g281il829677 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 19:44:47 -0600 id g281ije11466 for ; Fri, 8 Mar 200210:44:45 +0900 (JST) id KAA11531 for ; Fri, 8 Mar 200210:44:44 +0900 (JST) Subject: The diameter of reel foot curve Hi friends, Have some of you measured the diameter of your reel foot?Yes, it is the curve which is turned on the back side of reel foot. If not, would you please measure and report it on the list? I am gathering the measurements of various reel's foot for a pupose. I had been using a router bit of woodline (wl1091) and reshaped the bradeinto V~V shape by myself. But this bit has a smaller diameter of bead.A router bit with smaller bead diameter will turn the surface of real seatfiller to a smaller diameter. Thus, the reel would slip right and left on the filler while fishing eventhough it is fixed withreel seat ring. It is appreciated if you could measure your reel foot and post themeasurement, withreal maker, model and diameter value. To measure the diameter of reel foot, 1. Prepare a round stock bar (wood or metal) with various diameters, from0.6" to 0.8".2. Place reel foot on it.3. Report the most fit diameter with your reel. The reels which I have are as follows; (please do not confuse betweendiameter and R, R is half a diameter) Maker Size/Model diameter (2x R)------------ ----------- --------- -----Orvis: all sizes 19.5mm (0.768")Ross: #4 19.5mm (0.768")Trutta: #3 19.5mm (0.768")Hardy Marquis Silver face 18.0mm (0.708") Thanks, Max from bdcbfr@chartermi.net Thu Mar 7 19:52:08 2002 g281ps800113 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 19:51:54 -0600 Subject: Re: Grayrock Rodmakers & Friends what book? Subject: RE: Grayrock Rodmakers & Friends Hi Charlie:Will the book be available for others? It would be a neat item to =have.Thanks for the info.Bob-----Original Message-----From: owner- rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu = Sent: Thursday, March 07, 2002 4:56 PM Subject: Grayrock Rodmakers & Friends Since I've been off the list for awhile, I'm not sure if anything =has been posted regarding some news from those of us who admit =(publicly) to being associated with the Rodmakers at Grayrock. But, here = The 2002 Makers Rod Stream Restoration Raffle officially kicks off =this weekend at the Midwest Fly Fishing Expo at Southfield (near =Detroit). A lot of rodmakers we all know pooled their efforts and made =one gorgeous rod. The rest of the prize package ain't bad either. You =can find out all about the Makers Rod project and order your ticket by = Also - you can preregister for the Grayrock gathering by going here =- http://www.curro.net/grayrock2002. We're gonna have a TON of rods to = And for those of you who are chomping-at-the-bit to sign up for SRG =2002 so you can watch Harry Boyd attempt to split cane like a REAL man =does (namely, Bob "Crack-em-with-yer-fingers" Nunley), well, you will =just have to wait until the middle of April. We'll get a preregistration = what book? ----- Original Message ----- Maulucci Sent: Thursday, March 07, 2002 = PMSubject: RE: Grayrock Rodmakers= Friends Charlie: have. the info.Bob -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.w= = CurroSent: Thursday, March 07, 2002 4:56 rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= Grayrock Rodmakers & FriendsDear Since I've been off the list for awhile, I'm not sure if anything = been posted regarding some news from those of us who admit = being associated with the Rodmakers at Grayrock. But, here goes . . = The 2002 Makers Rod Stream Restoration Raffle officially kicks = weekend at the Midwest Fly Fishing Expo at Southfield (near = of rodmakers we all know pooled their efforts and made one gorgeous = rest of the prize package ain't bad either. You can find out all = Makers Rod project and order your ticket by visiting this web page - = Also - you can preregister for the Grayrock gathering by going =here - http://www.curro.net/grayrock2= We're gonna have a TON of rods to cast up here this = And for those of you who are chomping-at-the-bit to sign up for = so you can watch Harry Boyd attempt to split cane like a REAL man = (namely, Bob "Crack-em-with-yer-fingers" Nunley), well, you will = to wait until the middle of April. We'll get a preregistration web = from edriddle@mindspring.com Thu Mar 7 20:02:57 2002 g2822u800581 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 20:02:56 -0600 helo=oemcomputer) id 16j9ig-0004ui-00 for rodmakers@mail.wustl.edu; Thu, 07 Mar 2002 21:02:55 -0500 Subject: Gone Fishing Going salt water (N.C. coast) fishing for a week...lotta reading to do whenI get back no doubt.Ed from jsschaeffer@hotmail.com Thu Mar 7 20:15:47 2002 g282Fl801004 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 20:15:47 -0600 Thu, 7 Mar 2002 18:15:41 -0800 Subject: Re: The diameter of reel foot curve FILETIME=[25705120:01C1C647] This brings up an interesting point. I had a reel seat with an off- centermortise. It looked like hell, so I took a file and cut the mortise awayleaving a flat surface. It is the weirdest looking reel seat I have everseen, and it holds any reel like a vise. I can't decide whether it looksincredibly cool, or incredibly tasteless. Your vote counts. Jeff Schaeffer from bob@downandacross.com Thu Mar 7 20:19:58 2002 g282Jv801255 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 20:19:58 -0600 Subject: RE: Grayrock Rodmakers & Friends The one mentioned with the Maker's rod. Had pics of the makers and bios.Looked pretty neat.-----Original Message----- Sent: Thursday, March 07, 2002 8:51 PM rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Re: Grayrock Rodmakers & Friends what book? ----- Original Message -----From: Bob Maulucci Subject: RE: Grayrock Rodmakers & Friends Hi Charlie:Will the book be available for others? It would be a neat item to have.Thanks for the info.Bob-----Original Message-----From: owner- rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Thursday, March 07, 2002 4:56 PM Subject: Grayrock Rodmakers & Friends Dear listersSince I've been off the list for awhile, I'm not sure if anything hasbeen posted regarding some news from those of us who admit (publicly) tobeing associated with the Rodmakers at Grayrock. But, here goes . . . The 2002 Makers Rod Stream Restoration Raffle officially kicks offthis weekend at the Midwest Fly Fishing Expo at Southfield (near Detroit). Alot of rodmakers we all know pooled their efforts and made one gorgeousrod.The rest of the prize package ain't bad either. You can find out all aboutthe Makers Rod project and order your ticket by visiting this web page - http://www.curro.net/makersrod. Also - you can preregister for the Grayrock gathering by going here - http://www.curro.net/grayrock2002. We're gonna have a TON of rods tocast uphere this year. At least that's what Dennis Higham said. And for those of you who are chomping-at-the-bit to sign up for SRG2002 so you can watch Harry Boyd attempt to split cane like a REAL mandoes(namely, Bob "Crack-em-with-yer-fingers" Nunley), well, you will just haveto wait until the middle of April. We'll get a preregistration web page up Bless you all and over&out.cc mentioned with the Maker's rod. Had pics of the makers and bios. Looked = neat. 2002 = rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Re: Grayrock Rodmakers= Friendswhat book? ----- Original Message ----- Maulucci Sent: Thursday, March 07, = PMSubject: RE: Grayrock = Friends Charlie: have. Bob -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.w= CurroSent: Thursday, March 07, 2002 4:56 = Grayrock Rodmakers & FriendsDear Since I've been off the list for awhile, I'm not sure if = been posted regarding some news from those of us who admit = being associated with the Rodmakers at Grayrock. But, here goes . = The 2002 Makers Rod Stream Restoration Raffle officially kicks = weekend at the Midwest Fly Fishing Expo at Southfield (near = lot of rodmakers we all know pooled their efforts and made one = rod. The rest of the prize package ain't bad either. You can find = about the Makers Rod project and order your ticket by visiting = Also - you can preregister for the Grayrock gathering by going = http://www.curro.net/grayrock2= We're gonna have a TON of rods to cast up here this = And for those of you who are chomping-at-the-bit to sign up for = 2002 so you can watch Harry Boyd attempt to split cane like a REAL = does (namely, Bob "Crack-em-with-yer-fingers" Nunley), well, you = have to wait until the middle of April. We'll get a = from mrc@mars.plala.or.jp Thu Mar 7 20:35:47 2002 g282Zk801767 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 20:35:46 -0600 id g282ZiK00200; Fri, 8 Mar 2002 11:35:44 +0900 (JST) id LAA15102; Fri, 8 Mar 2002 11:35:43 +0900 (JST) Subject: Re: The diameter of reel foot curve Hi Jeff, A flat surface can stand any reel foot on it! But it is scratched with theedge.Reel will sea-saw on a surface with smaller diameter.I am asking to measure your reel's foot, not your reel seat! Do not destroyyour reel seat too much! Max This brings up an interesting point. I had a reel seat with an off- centermortise. It looked like hell, so I took a file and cut the mortise awayleaving a flat surface. It is the weirdest looking reel seat I have everseen, and it holds any reel like a vise. I can't decide whether it looksincredibly cool, or incredibly tasteless. Your vote counts. Jeff Schaeffer from lblan@provide.net Thu Mar 7 20:39:53 2002 g282dr801994 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 20:39:53 -0600 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 21:39:51 -0500 Subject: RE: Off the subject A great place Ralph. This, btw is Wayne C's favorite retreat from the world,and the birthplace of the Sir D. Watch your step if you stop to smell theflowers though, it's a tough wade, just ask a few of the folks Wayne hastaken there. Larry Blan -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Thursday, March 07, 2002 8:19 PM Subject: Off the subject I was just browsing, and found Charley Curro's non trout bum page on theJordan River. It just reminded me of things I have yet to do. Likestop and smell the flowers. Try it you will like itRalph http://www.curro.net/Tbbqv/jordan/river.htm --http://www.ida.net/users/rmoon from pohl@earthlink.net Thu Mar 7 20:43:33 2002 g282hW802273 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 20:43:32 -0600 helo=kathypohl) id 16jALz-0007Mk-00 for rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu; Thu, 07 Mar 2002 18:43:31 -0800 Subject: Binder questions I have a couple of questions regarding building a binder. I've located =some pulleys at the HW store with ~ 1/4" channel in them, is this too = I have a couple of questions regarding = in them, is this too wide or doesn't it matter? What should i use for a = Thanks, Mark from ddeloach@pcisys.net Thu Mar 7 20:48:14 2002 g282mD802597 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 20:48:13 -0600 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 19:48:12 -0700 env- from (ddeloach@pcisys.net) Subject: bulk fly order HURRY List, I have already received an overwhelming response from folks interestedin the wholesale fly order. In fact it getting to be too big already. So Iwill have to cut off this order in one hour, at appx 8:45PM Mountain time. shoot me an email right away if you're interested. thanksDon DeLoach from cw@vanion.com Thu Mar 7 20:51:02 2002 g282p2802819 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 20:51:02 -0600 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 19:55:57 -0700 Subject: Diameter of reelfoot As a carpenter by trade, I have only one finger nail bit, and it is 1 =1/2" size. [used it on counter top edges] I tried it to make a Payne =type mortice, which turned out pretty flat, but with some arch. The =thing is, the reel is anchored REALLY solid as it is not sitting on an =arch that lets it rotate. Has anyone done this type of mortice before? =I've got an order in for the small size bits too, but kinda like this.Chad As a carpenter by trade, I haveonly = nail bit, and it is 1 1/2" size. [used it on counter top edges] I = to make a Payne type mortice, which turned out pretty flat, but with = The thing is, the reel is anchored REALLY solid as it is not sitting on = that lets it rotate. Has anyone done this type of mortice before? I've = order in for the small size bits too, but kinda like this.Chad from TBOWDEN@halcyon.com Thu Mar 7 21:07:41 2002 g2837e803371 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 21:07:40 -0600 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 19:07:33 -0800 Subject: Re: Fw: 60* Starret Tips I ordered mine directly from Starrett. Their part number was 6332/6. At 08:38 PM 3/7/2002 -0500, Ed Riddle wrote: Eric:I couldn't find this item at Enco either a couple months ago. I found it onthe Starrett website, but since they don't ship direct, I had to arrange toget it through a local outlet that carried Starrett stuff ( list of dealerson their website as I recall). Cost approx. $3.00.Ed ----- Original Message -----From: "Eric Johannesen" discussiongroup" Sent: Thursday, March 07, 2002 8:14 PMSubject: 60* Starret Tips Dear Chat Group: I found a dial indicator thanks to the advice of the chat group last night. However, somebody gave me the information about the Starret 60* tipavailable from Enco. They informed me that it was tip number84629800. Ihave tried to find this on the Enco site and have had no luck. Couldsomebody point me in the right direction. Eric J. from TBOWDEN@halcyon.com Thu Mar 7 21:10:45 2002 g283Aj803659 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 21:10:45 -0600 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 19:10:41 -0800 Subject: Re: long rod tapers. Try the AJ Thramer 9' 4wt. in the taper archive on the Rodmaker web site. I made one last year & really enjoyed it for float tube fishing. Tom At 11:00 AM 3/7/2002 -0600, Grombacher, Alan wrote: Hey Folks, I've been discussing long rods with a few fellas lately. The late Len Wright wrote about long rods. He mentioned using a 10 foot Payne (a light lined rod). Does anyone know about this rod and taper? What about any other light lined rod tapers 9 feet and larger? Cheers, Alberta Al from rcrensha@midsouth.rr.com Thu Mar 7 21:18:28 2002 g283IR804100 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 21:18:27 -0600 g283IFb16765; Subject: Re: Drip Tubes Ron, for what it's worth, I used PVC cement. You only need a tiny bit. Thestandard PVC fittng fit mine (can't recall the size) and would have probablyheld the varnish fine, but I didn't want to flood my floor with varnishshould the tube fall over. Rick----- Original Message ----- Subject: Drip Tubes ?For those of you using clear plastic fluorescent light tube protector's fordrip tubes, have youtried using regular pvc cement and if so have you had any bad reactions withyour varnish?Ron from jojo@ipa.net Thu Mar 7 21:19:43 2002 g283Jh804273 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 21:19:43 -0600 helo=default) id 16jAuw-0000hy-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Thu, 07 Mar 2002 22:19:38 -0500 Subject: Re: Binder questions You can use either a round leather, or round urethane drive belt. The ==BC" wide groove shouldn't be a problem, and you can get the belting in ==BC", too. M-D I have a couple of questions regarding building a binder. I've located =some pulleys at the HW store with ~ 1/4" channel in them, is this too = You can use either a = problem, and you can get the belting in =BC", too. M-D Mark = Pohl I have a couple of questions = channel in them, is this too wide or doesn't it matter? What should i = a belt? Thanks, Mark from TBOWDEN@halcyon.com Thu Mar 7 21:37:52 2002 g283bp804904 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 21:37:51 -0600 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 19:37:48 -0800 Subject: Thread for blued ferrules/guides I've decided to blue the ferrules on the rod I'm working on. It's a Para-17 that's for saltwater, and will have a black anodized reel seat & black guides. Would like some opinions on thread color over blued components. I've used either tan or the Pearsall classic chestnut on my previous rods - all with silver ferrules & guides. The wraps come out semi-transparent, and I'm concerned that this will look funny with dark components. I was thinking of using a darker color thread. Will probably run some tests to see for myself, but thought I'd see what others think. TIA Tom from jojo@ipa.net Thu Mar 7 21:42:40 2002 g283gd805161 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 21:42:40 -0600 helo=default) id 16jBHD-0003GA-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Thu, 07 Mar 2002 22:42:39 -0500 Subject: Re: Thread for blued ferrules/guides Personally, I don't find the black tabs showing underneath the thread to beunattractive. TheClassic Chestnut or Java Brown both look nice, but use the Naples on largerrods. M-D I've decided to blue the ferrules on the rod I'm working on. It's a Para- 17that's for saltwater, and will have a black anodized reel seat & black guides. Would like some opinions on thread color over blued components. I've usedeither tan or the Pearsall classic chestnut on my previous rods - all withsilver ferrules & guides. The wraps come out semi-transparent, and I'mconcerned that this will look funny with dark components. I was thinking ofusing a darker color thread. Will probably run some tests to see formyself, but thought I'd see what others think. TIA Tom from avyoung@iinet.net.au Thu Mar 7 21:49:34 2002 g283nX805490 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 21:49:33 -0600 Subject: Re: Guillermo's Leaders I asked Guillermo to send me a leader and he mentioned that payment was problematical which it is. In case you aren't aware Argentina is in the middle of a financial and political crisis and people can't get to their own bank accounts. Also their currency has been devalued from level pegging the greenback to something much less meaning any funds in the bank are worth a lot less now so US funds would be of great assistance to anybody who can get them.A group order would be a good thing for those interested because it would mean a single transaction for Guillermo to access somehow.I hope I haven't stepped over the line here on Guillermo's behalf but he may not want to say these things himself.Definately no self interest here. Tony At 02:30 PM 3/7/02 -0700, Ronnie L. Rees wrote: Could you please post how we all my help out, maybe we can do a group buy or something. I know that I would love to try these leaders but have no outlet for them nor the time to make them.Ron /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html Christmas Gift Tips Avoid at any cost Christmas crackers with the label: Made in Afghanistan /*************************************************************************/ from kurt.clement@flashmail.com Thu Mar 7 22:02:27 2002 g2842Q805958 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 22:02:26 -0600 Subject: Re: Binder questions Mark, I used something similar, rollers from a patio door - got them at Lowes, =brass with bushings about 1/4 in groove. I built my binder ala Garison =design, but have modified it per a suggestion on the list. Make a =second main drive pulley and stack them together. Wind one pulley full =of 50# braided nylon masons twine - I anchored the twine by drilling a =small hole for a screw, sticking the end of the drive belt/string in the =hole and screwing the screw in. Do the same think with the end of the =belt on the empty drive pulley. Crank the pulleys backwards to rewind =all of the belt onto the other pulley. Thread the belt through your =pulleys and around a 1/4 test dowel, hang your weight on the belt and =away you go. The benefit is NO slipping of the belt, and NO bump as the =splice or knot in the belt traverses the rod. I use Polyurethane glue =and run the belt back and forth through a cloth dampened with paint =thinner after glueup. Use the appropriate solvent for your glue for =cleanup. KurtNixa, MO-----Original Message-----From: Mark & Kathy Pohl Subject: Binder questions I have a couple of questions regarding building a binder. I've =located some pulleys at the HW store with ~ 1/4" channel in them, is =this too wide or doesn't it matter? What should i use for a belt? = Mark, I used something similar, rollers from a patio door = ala Garison design, but have modified it per a suggestion on the = full of 50# braided nylon masons twine - I anchored the twine by = small hole for a screw, sticking the end of the drive belt/string in the = around a 1/4 test dowel, hang your weight on the belt and away you = benefit is NO slipping of the belt, and NO bump as the splice or knot in = appropriate solvent for your glue for cleanup. Good luck, KurtNixa, MO -----Original = =rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= <rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= questionsI have a couple of questions = 1/4" channel in them, is this too wide or doesn't it matter? = should i use for a belt? Thanks, Mark = from jojo@ipa.net Thu Mar 7 22:18:55 2002 g284It806451 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 22:18:55 -0600 helo=default) id 16jBqI-0004Ko-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Thu, 07 Mar 2002 23:18:54 -0500 Subject: Re: Guillermo's Leaders You guys are just too good. I think a group order would be a really good thing,and I'll be glad todo it since Guillermo and I have been working on this financial thing. Let metalk to him about thisgroup order, then I'll post to the list with the particulars. M-D I asked Guillermo to send me a leader and he mentioned that payment wasproblematical which it is. In case you aren't aware Argentina is in themiddle of a financial and political crisis and people can't get to theirown bank accounts. Also their currency has been devalued from level peggingthe greenback to something much less meaning any funds in the bank areworth a lot less now so US funds would be of great assistance to anybodywho can get them.A group order would be a good thing for those interested because it wouldmean a single transaction for Guillermo to access somehow.I hope I haven't stepped over the line here on Guillermo's behalf but hemay not want to say these things himself.Definately no self interest here. Tony At 02:30 PM 3/7/02 -0700, Ronnie L. Rees wrote: Could you please post how we all my help out, maybe we can do a group buyor something. I know that I would love to try these leaders but have nooutlet for them nor the time to make them.Ron /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html Christmas Gift Tips Avoid at any cost Christmas crackers with the label: Made in Afghanistan /*************************************************************************/ from channer@frontier.net Thu Mar 7 22:28:23 2002 g284SM806793 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 22:28:22 -0600 Subject: Re: Thread for blued ferrules/guides Tom,Don't blue the part that gets wrapped over.john Tom Bowden wrote: I've decided to blue the ferrules on the rod I'm working on. It's a Para- 17that's for saltwater, and will have a black anodized reel seat & blackguides. Would like some opinions on thread color over blued components. I've usedeither tan or the Pearsall classic chestnut on my previous rods - all withsilver ferrules & guides. The wraps come out semi-transparent, and I'mconcerned that this will look funny with dark components. I was thinking ofusing a darker color thread. Will probably run some tests to see formyself, but thought I'd see what others think. TIA Tom from bob@downandacross.com Thu Mar 7 22:28:43 2002 g284Sg806826 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 22:28:42 -0600 Subject: RE: Thread for blued ferrules/guides Tom:I have been using the Gudebrod varnish on the ferrule wraps to keep themopaque. It does darken the color, but I like the opaque look at the ferrulesquite a bit. Actually, I like the look on guides too. I use this on my rodsthat I fish.Best regards, Bob -----Original Message----- Subject: Thread for blued ferrules/guides I've decided to blue the ferrules on the rod I'm working on. It's a Para- 17that's for saltwater, and will have a black anodized reel seat &black guides. Would like some opinions on thread color over blued components. I've usedeither tan or the Pearsall classic chestnut on my previous rods - all withsilver ferrules & guides. The wraps come out semi-transparent, and I'mconcerned that this will look funny with dark components. I was thinking ofusing a darker color thread. Will probably run some tests to see formyself, but thought I'd see what others think. TIA Tom from jojo@ipa.net Thu Mar 7 22:39:16 2002 g284dG807355 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 22:39:16 -0600 helo=default) id 16jC9z-0001Hw-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Thu, 07 Mar 2002 23:39:15 -0500 Subject: Fw: A new urban name for you. A new urban name for you. yo momma give ya, get yo'self a new handle, boy. Word be bond. Or, if you need a porn screen name http://www.jasonschock.com/gangsta/porn_name.php Have fun, kids! BTW, Todd Talsma's gangsta name is: Drunken Daddy aka Doctor Tittles, =onscreen. M-D A new urban name for you. = handle, boy. Word be bond.http://www.jasonschock.com/gangsta/ Or, if you need a porn= name http://www.jaso=nschock.com/gangsta/porn_name.php Have fun, =kids! BTW, Todd Talsma's = Drunken Daddy aka Doctor Tittles, onscreen. M-D from KyleDruey@aol.com Thu Mar 7 22:48:03 2002 g284m2807738 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 22:48:02 -0600 Subject: Re: 60* Starret Tips Eric, That is the MSC part number, do a websearch for MSC, enter the partnumber using their search engine and you will find it. Kyle In a message dated 03/07/2002 5:13:49 PM Pacific Standard Time, erjmjj@mhtc.net writes: Dear Chat Group:I found a dial indicator thanks to the advice of the chat group last night.However, somebody gave me the information about the Starret 60* tipavailable from Enco. They informed me that it was tip number 84629800. Ihave tried to find this on the Enco site and have had no luck. Couldsomebody point me in the right direction.Eric J. from saweiss@flash.net Thu Mar 7 23:45:12 2002 g285jB808902 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 23:45:11 -0600 g285j6h24084 for ; Fri, 8 Mar 2002 00:45:06 -0500 Subject: Re: Ferrules Organization: Prodigy Internet Do you also floss between the tabs?Steven Weiss, D.D.S. "You need a very strong thread to bind down the ferrule tabs. Kevlar works, as well asthe ferrule tab binding thread sold by Golden Witch. Do not be afraid toreally put the pressure on the tabs." Waxed Dental Floss works great too! Dennis from avyoung@iinet.net.au Thu Mar 7 23:57:15 2002 g285vE809242 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2002 23:57:14 -0600 Subject: The real Great Southern in NZ Anybody heard anything from the people attending the Great Southern in NZ? TY /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html "How can I lose to such an idiot?"- A shout from chessmaster Aaron Nimzovich (1886- 1935)/*************************************************************************/ from ajthramer@hotmail.com Fri Mar 8 01:44:50 2002 g287in811092 for ; Fri, 8 Mar 2002 01:44:49 -0600 Thu, 7 Mar 2002 23:44:36 -0800 Fri, 08 Mar 2002 07:44:36 GMT Subject: Re: Removing Ferrules FILETIME=[189E8600:01C1C675] Some ideas about getting the tabs to lie flat, it help immensly if you anneal the tabs of the ferrules, I pin the ferrule in place then reheat the tab area and roll the tabs onto the cane with a burnisher that is used for scrapers, I have also used the smooth part of a round saw file.tabless in OregonA.J. From: "Ted" group" Subject: Re: Removing FerrulesDate: Thu, 7 Mar 2002 11:06:39 -0500 When pre-fitting the ferrules I press the tabs flat to the bamboo by ironingthem with a piece of keystock. When gluing the ferrules the function of thebinding cord is to hold the tabs tightly in place, not to "pull" them intoplace. _________________________________________________________________Join the world's largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com from petermckean@netspace.net.au Fri Mar 8 05:00:46 2002 g28B0j813234 for ; Fri, 8 Mar 2002 05:00:45 -0600 g28B0SH79343; Subject: Re: Removing Ferrules I use fuse wire to bind down the ferrule tabs, and I find that it worksvery well. There is no tendency for it to loosen as you wrap it and cinch it, you canput as much tension on it as you like, and when you come to take it offthere is no problem with undoing it, and there is no textile thread materialleft to be cleaned out from between the tabs etc etc. Cheers Peter from cattanac@wmis.net Fri Mar 8 06:18:37 2002 g28CIb814315 for ; Fri, 8 Mar 2002 06:18:37 -0600 Subject: Re: Off the subject RalphI do just that - and at that very spot - it is where I taughts the kidsto fly fish and where my rodmaking career started some 21 years ago - itwasalso the inspiration for the Sir D - a stretch of tangle called Section 13Creek - I have introduce many of those that attend GrayRock to The Valley -Some have never forgiven me for it Wayne ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Off the subject I was just browsing, and found Charley Curro's non trout bum page on theJordan River. It just reminded me of things I have yet to do. Likestop and smell the flowers. Try it you will like itRalph http://www.curro.net/Tbbqv/jordan/river.htm --http://www.ida.net/users/rmoon from twilhelm@occasionalrod.com Fri Mar 8 06:26:04 2002 g28CQ4814612 for ; Fri, 8 Mar 2002 06:26:04 -0600 Fri, 8 Mar 2002 07:26:26 -0500 Subject: Re: Removing Ferrules Certainly when using an epoxy you need to bind the tabs down since it takesa while for the epoxy to set. I've used ferrultite for ferrules and didn'thave the time to bind the tabs down before it set up. Is it necesary to bind the tabs when using ferrultite? ThanksTim from bob@downandacross.com Fri Mar 8 07:03:29 2002 g28D3R815267 for ; Fri, 8 Mar 2002 07:03:28 -0600 ; Fri, 8 Mar 2002 08:03:22 -0500 Subject: Quadrate Forms I had an inquiry for quadrate forms the other day. Anyone know if any areavailable? I have not checked Grindstone yet, but I think they may be out.Appreciate your help.Best regards,Bob from dnorl@qwest.net Fri Mar 8 07:04:00 2002 g28D3x815369 for ; Fri, 8 Mar 2002 07:03:59 -0600 (63.228.45.124) Subject: Re: Thread for blued ferrules/guides I point the tabs with a small jewlers file and wrap the ferrules with thesame thread as the guides. I use light colored thread that matches the cane.The pointed tabs show with the transparency of the light thread.on theferrules just as they do on the guide feet. I also use tipping on all mywraps. I like the look.Dave-----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Thread for blued ferrules/guides Tom,Don't blue the part that gets wrapped over.john Tom Bowden wrote: I've decided to blue the ferrules on the rod I'm working on. It's a Para-17 that's for saltwater, and will have a black anodized reel seat & black guides. Would like some opinions on thread color over blued components. I've usedeither tan or the Pearsall classic chestnut on my previous rods - all with silver ferrules & guides. The wraps come out semi-transparent, and I'mconcerned that this will look funny with dark components. I was thinking of using a darker color thread. Will probably run some tests to see formyself, but thought I'd see what others think. TIA Tom from splitcane@attbi.com Fri Mar 8 07:06:26 2002 g28D6P815655 for ; Fri, 8 Mar 2002 07:06:25 -0600 Subject: Special Cork Ring Purchase... Hi All, I was able to make a special purchase on some very nice Cork Rings,to get a better price I purchased more then I will ever need. So I'm passingon the saving to you, 100 1 1/4" x 1/2" x 7/16" boar for $45.00 PostagePaid. Click on link below to view photos of a random sample in stock now... http://home.attbi.com/~denverdaveinc/cork.html I build 7' to 9' rods with a swelled butt as a norm so the 7/16" ( .437" )boar is perfect for me in most cases, it might be a little large if youbuild small rods without the swell. In this case I tape off each end underthe grip, put in rod turner, apply a good coat of flex coat and turn for onehour, then remove tape and turn for another hour. On less dramaticdifferences I wrap size "A" to "E" thread under the grip, apply Gorilla Glueand slide rings on for a nice fit... In any event I thought I would pass on the deal to those interested, therenice to have around for the larger diameter rods and complement the 1/4"bore rings you all ready have in stock... PS, All reel seats have been sent and should be in your possession now, ifnot please drop me a line... * * * * * * * * * * ------------------------------------------* * * * * * * * * *-------- ----------------------------------* * * * * * * * * * ------------------------------------- -----* * * * * * * * * *------------------------------------------* * * * * * * * * * --- --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---------------------------------------" United We Stand " Take Care, Dave Denver Dave's Vintage Bamboo Rodswww.denverdave.net from pvansch@wethersfield.k12.ct.us Fri Mar 8 08:06:12 2002 g28E6B817459 for ; Fri, 8 Mar 2002 08:06:11 -0600 Subject: RE: The diameter of reel foot curve Organization: Wethersfield Public Schools I know what you are looking for but don't have a way to measure, if yourlooking for a reel with a smaller diameter foot to fit seats withsliding rings, I would recommend looking at the G Loomis Adventureseries. I use double slide band seats, tried many, many different reelsto fit these seats, never had a reel fall off, where I have with Orvisreels and some of the other high end stuff. They are light, quiet - Ijust like them. No financial interest, just my input. Pete -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: The diameter of reel foot curve Hi Jeff, A flat surface can stand any reel foot on it! But it is scratched withthe edge. Reel will sea-saw on a surface with smaller diameter. I amasking to measure your reel's foot, not your reel seat! Do not destroyyour reel seat too much! Max This brings up an interesting point. I had a reel seat with an off-center mortise. It looked like hell, so I took a file and cut the mortise away leaving a flat surface. It is the weirdest looking reel seat I have ever seen, and it holds any reel like a vise. I can't decide whether it looks incredibly cool, or incredibly tasteless. Your vote counts. Jeff Schaeffer from JNL123141@msn.com Fri Mar 8 08:40:29 2002 g28EeS818850 for ; Fri, 8 Mar 2002 08:40:28 -0600 Fri, 8 Mar 2002 06:40:19 -0800 Subject: Grand Experiment FILETIME=[2B7922A0:01C1C6AF] Friends,The day I received my copy of The Planing Form, my web server, MSN decide=d all email from the list was junk mail and without warning or notificati=on, started putting mail from the list into a junk mail folder in a hot-m=ail folder which I didn't even know I had.After doing the UNSUB and SUBSCRIBE many times without success andcontac=ting Mike Biondo, I finally stumbled on to what happened and am now back =receiving the list again.Anyway, I have yet to see any of the comments about the Grand Exp.becaus=e that junk mail folder was doing an auto delete after a couple of days. =As soon as the comments show up in the archives, I'll be able to respond=. To all those who liked the article, "Thank You!" It's really cranking=me up not knowing how the article was received other than a few off list=kudo's. I'll be responding if and when I see the messages. I enjoyed d=oing the experiment even with the headaches of not having custody of some=of the rods and also the responsibility of having so many beautiful rods= When I return from Corbett Lake, I will begin returning the rods to their=makers so they can get some use out of them. Happy to be back on the list,John Friends,=The day I received my copy of The Planing Form, my web server, MSN=decided all email from the list was junk mail and without warning or noti=fication, started putting mail from the list into a junk mail folder in a=hot-mail folder which I didn't even know I had. After doing t= Mik=e Biondo, I finally stumbled on to what happened and am now back receivin=g the list again. Anyway, I have yet to see any of the comment=s about the Grand Exp. because that junk mail folder was doing an auto de= experiment even with the headaches of not having custody of some of the r=ods and also the responsibility of having so many beautiful rods in my po= from homes-sold@attbi.com Fri Mar 8 08:49:10 2002 g28En9819275 for ; Fri, 8 Mar 2002 08:49:09 -0600 Fri, 8 Mar 2002 14:48:55 +0000 Subject: Re: long rod tapers. Hi Al,I think the rod Jim is referring to is/was orginally thought to be a =B.F. Nichols 10ft 6wt.I'm building one for my next trip to the Bow.Don Rod Length120 Ferrule Location 1:40 Action Length105 Ferrule Weight 1:0.194 Line Weight518 Ferrule Location 2:80 Line Length100 Ferrule Weight 2:0.437 Line to Fish40 Tip Impact Factor2.179 B. F. Nichols 10ft x 6wt 3pc PointsDimensionsStresses Point 1.07500 043107 Point 2.07850 075465 Point 3.08200 099936 Point 4.08550 118291 Point 5.08900 131944 Point 6.09220 143355 Point 7.09540 151997 Point 8.09860 158429 Point 9.10180 163093 Point 10.10500 166339 Point 11.10640 177142 Point 12.10780 187210 Point 13.10920 196596 Point 14.11060 205350 Point 15.11200 213518 Point 16.11420 216527 Point 17.11640 218980 Point 18.11860 220947 Point 19.12080 222491 Point 20.12300 223664 Point 21.12600 220264 Point 22.12900 216812 Point 23.13200 213338 Point 24.13500 209870 Point 25.13800 206428 Point 26.14060 204764 Point 27.14320 203045 Point 28.14580 201285 Point 29.14840 199498 Point 30.15100 197695 Point 31.15260 199762 Point 32.15420 201728 Point 33.15580 203598 Point 34.15740 205380 Point 35.15900 207079 Point 36.16140 205611 Point 37.16380 204147 Point 38.16620 202690 Point 39.16860 201245 Point 40.17100 199814 Point 41.17480 194884 Point 42.17860 190160 Point 43.18240 185637 Point 44.18620 181307 Point 45.19000 177163 Point 46.19160 179232 Point 47.19320 181241 Point 48.19480 183192 Point 49.19640 185087 Point 50.19800 186930 Point 51.20080 185360 Point 52.20360 183812 Point 53.20640 182291 Point 54.20920 180796 Point 55.21200 179330 Point 56.21500 177398 Point 57.21800 175519 Point 58.22100 173692 Point 59.22400 171917 Point 60.22700 170193 Point 61.22860 171635 Point 62.23020 173061 Point 63.23180 174469 Point 64.23340 175862 Point 65.23500 177239 Point 66.23740 176802 Point 67.23980 176372 Point 68.24220 175950 Point 69.24460 175536 Point 70.24700 175132 Point 71.24920 175158 Point 72.25140 175185 Point 73.25360 175213 Point 74.25580 175244 Point 75.25800 175277 Point 76.25980 176124 Point 77.26160 176966 Point 78.26340 177802 Point 79.26520 178634 Point 80.26700 179461 Point 81.27280 173187 Point 82.27860 167294 Point 83.28440 161754 Point 84.29020 156540 Point 85.29600 151629 Point 86.29780 153002 Point 87.29960 154361 Point 88.30140 155707 Point 89.30320 157039 Point 90.30500 158359 Point 91.30600 160921 Point 92.30700 163490 Point 93.30800 166065 Point 94.30900 168645 Point 95.31000 171231 Point 96.31400 168887 Point 97.31800 166620 Point 98.32200 164426 Point 99.32600 162305 Point 100.33000 160252 Point 101.33260 160274 Point 102.33520 160297 Point 103.33780 160322 Point 104.34040 160348 Point 105.34300 160377 Hey Folks, I've been discussing long rods with a few fellas lately. The late Len =Wright wrote about long rods. He mentioned using a 10 foot Payne (a =light lined rod). Does anyone know about this rod and taper? What =about any other light lined rod tapers 9 feet and larger? Cheers, Alberta Al Hi Al, I'm building one for my next trip to = Bow.Don Rod Length 120 Ferrule Location 1: 40 Action Length 105 Ferrule Weight 1: 0.194 Line Weight 518 Ferrule Location 2: 80 Line Length 100 Ferrule Weight 2: 0.437 Line to Fish 40 Tip Impact Factor 2.179 B. F. Nichols 10ft x 6wt 3pc Points Dimensions Stresses Point 1 .07500 043107 Point 2 .07850 075465 Point 3 .08200 099936 Point 4 .08550 118291 Point 5 .08900 131944 Point 6 .09220 143355 Point 7 .09540 151997 Point 8 .09860 158429 Point 9 .10180 163093 Point 10 .10500 166339 Point 11 .10640 177142 Point 12 .10780 187210 Point 13 .10920 196596 Point 14 .11060 205350 Point 15 .11200 213518 Point 16 .11420 216527 Point 17 .11640 218980 Point 18 .11860 220947 Point 19 .12080 222491 Point 20 .12300 223664 Point 21 .12600 220264 Point 22 .12900 216812 Point 23 .13200 213338 Point 24 .13500 209870 Point 25 .13800 206428 Point 26 .14060 204764 Point 27 .14320 203045 Point 28 .14580 201285 Point 29 .14840 199498 Point 30 .15100 197695 Point 31 .15260 199762 Point 32 .15420 201728 Point 33 .15580 203598 Point 34 .15740 205380 Point 35 .15900 207079 Point 36 .16140 205611 Point 37 .16380 204147 Point 38 .16620 202690 Point 39 .16860 201245 Point 40 .17100 199814 Point 41 .17480 194884 Point 42 .17860 190160 Point 43 .18240 185637 Point 44 .18620 181307 Point 45 .19000 177163 Point 46 .19160 179232 Point 47 .19320 181241 Point 48 .19480 183192 Point 49 .19640 185087 Point 50 .19800 186930 Point 51 .20080 185360 Point 52 .20360 183812 Point 53 .20640 182291 Point 54 .20920 180796 Point 55 .21200 179330 Point 56 .21500 177398 Point 57 .21800 175519 Point 58 .22100 173692 Point 59 .22400 171917 Point 60 .22700 170193 Point 61 .22860 171635 Point 62 .23020 173061 Point 63 .23180 174469 Point 64 .23340 175862 Point 65 .23500 177239 Point 66 .23740 176802 Point 67 .23980 176372 Point 68 .24220 175950 Point 69 .24460 175536 Point 70 .24700 175132 Point 71 .24920 175158 Point 72 .25140 175185 Point 73 .25360 175213 Point 74 .25580 175244 Point 75 .25800 175277 Point 76 .25980 176124 Point 77 .26160 176966 Point 78 .26340 177802 Point 79 .26520 178634 Point 80 .26700 179461 Point 81 .27280 173187 Point 82 .27860 167294 Point 83 .28440 161754 Point 84 .29020 156540 Point 85 .29600 151629 Point 86 .29780 153002 Point 87 .29960 154361 Point 88 .30140 155707 Point 89 .30320 157039 Point 90 .30500 158359 Point 91 .30600 160921 Point 92 .