Subject: Howells ferrule overwraps Gary Howells overwrapped the ferrules on most of his rods because he =used Duronze ferrules. A tough material, great for ferrules, that has =been used by not only Gary Howells, but by Winston for decades, it is =not the most attractive material in the world, thus it was overwrapped. = I may be wrong on this, but I believe the last few years that Gary =was making rods, he went to Nickel Silver ferrules (again, maybe Tom =Morgan can give us more detail on this) and stopped overwrapping. The =last Howells rod I had (wish I still had it now) was a made in '82 and =had duronze ferrules with overwraps. It was an 8'6" 5 wt and very light =and comfortable to cast. The amount of thread and varnish it takes to =overwrap a ferrule does not any a perceptable amount of weight. Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com Sent: Saturday, March 23, 2002 1:30 PMSubject: Howells Rod on Ebay Interesting how Howell over-wrapped the female ferrule(all the way to =the welt) on that rod. It seems that would add alot of unnecessary =weight to the midpoint of the rod. Anyone else do this? Just curious. =Randall R. Gregory Randall, and anyone else interested. decades, it is not the most attractive material in the world, thus it = last few years that Gary was making rods, he went to Nickel Silver = weight. Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com ----- Original Message ----- Randall Gregory Sent: Saturday, March 23, 2002 = PMSubject: Howells Rod on =Ebay Interesting how Howell over-wrapped = alot of unnecessary weight to the midpoint of the rod. Anyone else do = Gregory from FISHWOOL@aol.com Sat Mar 23 20:38:49 2002 g2O2cm407572 for ; Sat, 23 Mar 2002 20:38:48 - Subject: RE: Fiberglass Rods The softer action graphite fly rods are already on the market but themodern fiberglass ones are nearer to cane action.Hank. from FISHWOOL@aol.com Sat Mar 23 20:38:50 2002 g2O2co407576 for ; Sat, 23 Mar 2002 20:38:50 - Subject: Re: How soon can I try them out? Mark and John,Who waits months to try a new rod out? Not me!As soon as the varnish won't "fingerprint" go to it.Hank. from robertgkope@attbi.com Sat Mar 23 21:58:39 2002 g2O3wc409197 for ; Sat, 23 Mar 2002 21:58:39 -0600 Subject: Heat treating with Nylon thread (heresy) In response to my earlier question about the melting point of Nylon I =got several warnings, but still I wondered. Then I remembered that I =had a set of strips that I had burned one end of before I put a heat =shield inside my heat-gun oven where the blast from the heat gun hits =the inside tube. I had never thrown these strips away, so I decided to =do an experiment. I took off the cotton thread, re-bound the strips with Nylon, and put =them in the oven. I gradually took the temperature up to 350 degrees =over about 1/2 hr, and then held it between 340 and 350 degrees for 15 =minutes. At one point the temperature spiked to 355 degrees. This is =substantially hotter than I normally heat treat. I usually try to keep =the temperature between 320 and 330 for 20 minutes. The strips started out blonde, but came out a dark caramel color all the =way through. The thread held and retained it's elasticity too, but when =I unwrapped the strips it broke in a couple of places. The nodes =actually came out flatter than they went in! They had popped up a =little the first time they went through the oven bound with the cotton =thread, but after heat treating with the Nylon, they were as flat as =they were right after rough planing. I wouldn't recommend this to others, because I suspect that I had the =thread very close to the point of failure in the oven. But I think I =might experiment some more with this. -- Robert Kope In response to my earlier question = melting point of Nylon I got several warnings, but still I = I remembered that I had a set of strips that I had burned one end of = put a heat shield inside my heat-gun oven where the blast from the heat = decided to do an experiment. gradually took the temperature up to 350 degrees over about 1/2 hr, and = The strips started out blonde, but came= it's elasticity too, but when I unwrapped the strips it broke in a = had popped up a little the first time they went through the oven bound = cotton thread, but after heat treating with the Nylon, they were as flat = were right after rough planing. this. -- Robert Kope from rodwrapp@swbell.net Sat Mar 23 23:53:15 2002 g2O5rF410823 for ; Sat, 23 Mar 2002 23:53:15 - (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 (built May 7 2001)) Subject: unsubscribe ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: fish lic.- not rodmaking I remember that and it was very funny though I did notice a few peoplescratching their heads wondering what the joke was [:-)] Though now I think about it maybe it was at the beach in Queensland I sawthe vacant stares [:-)] Up until the last few years I've always thought Aust and NZ shouldformalize closer economic and possibly constitutional ties mainly tobenefit NZ but the last 6 months to a year of some very questionableshenanigans over here have made me very thankful NZ has kept to the truepath and I can't wait to get there and never come back if it becomes par Tony At 06:53 AM 3/22/02 +1200, Ian Kearney wrote: Tony reminds me of a quote from a well known New Zealand politicianwhen he was asked by an Aussie newspaper reporter what action Australia should take regarding the NZ " dole blunders and dropouts" who were moving to Australia to collect the higher Australian dole and surf on the Queens beaches. His response " Australia should do nothing as the migration of these people to Australia is improving the average IQ of both countries" Ian /*************************************************************************/ AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Forks Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from stuart.rod@gmx.de Sun Mar 24 03:27:58 2002 g2O9Rv413466 for ; Sun, 24 Mar 2002 03:27:57 - (149.225.84.226) Rodmakers Subject: Re: Epifanes Dip Hi David, I brush varnished two rods using firstly normal hair brushes and then foambrushes. The hair brush finish was difficult, I kept the varnish warm (waterbath) and brushed from tip to butt, it was difficult (for me) to keep thethickness of the varnish equal over the entire length of the rod. I also triedturning the rod section during brushing which was a mistake. On the advice ofalist member, sorry I have managed to delete the E-mail, I then tried usingfoambrushes, thinned the varnish 5% and brushed two flats at the same time.Thisworked much better but I still did not get the finish that I was hoping for,this no doubt was my fault as the person who gave me the information wasgettingwonderful finishes. I then moved on to a drip tube setup using a perspex tube in a drying cabinettokeep the varnish warm, better than my brushing attempts but it may havebeen aproblem with the thinner reacting with the perspex tube that caused the rodtohave "eyes" on the second layer of varnish. After that it went down hill withmetrying various thinning % and basically messing around in the hope ofstumblingover the perfect drip tube setup. We moved house and I now have enough headroom for a dip tube. I purchasedabrilliant dip tube from a German rodmaker, It is a steel inner dip tubecontained in a second outer tube with water inbetween the two tubes. Thewateris heated and circulated by an aquarium heater/filter. It is pumped from thebottom to the top of the outer tube at a fairly fast rate by the heater/filterand so and stays at a constant temperature. I find the idea brilliant, no lightbulbs or heating cables to mess around with, and a truly constanttemperature.He built the dip tubes himself and it must have been a very difficult weldingjob (the inner tube is completely encased in the airtight outer tube). I havejust started dipping with this setup using a dowel to try it out. I have notthinned the Epifanes at all. I can post the results if you like. Stuart David Parker schrieb: I am interested in trying Epifanes. I would like to try the brush finishingmethod. It seems that thinning the solution down by a factor of 5% (byvolume) is the general conclusion. Any thinner than this is likely to causeproblems according to the "experts" I've asked.You tried brushing and you say it worked "O.K." Why do you want to go todipping? What were the problems you experienced with brushing thevarnishon?Did you try lightly heating rod sections in a heating set-up after brushingthe varnish on? How about a rotation set up as the finish set up?I would appreciate any comments. David Parker ----- Original Message -----From: "Stuart Moultrie" Sent: Saturday, March 23, 2002 10:06 AMSubject: Epifanes Dip Hi everybody, Is there anybody on the list dipping their rods in Epifanes sparvarnish? I have tried brushing (foam) and a drip tube system and thoseworked o.k but have just installed a fantastic dip tube setup aftermoving to a place with enough headroom in the attic.The question is (asever) what % are you thinning the varnish? I tried 20% and 5% in thedrip tube and brush methods. I am heating the varnish to about 25ŸC (ŸF ?), perhaps I don't need tothin it down at all, any experiences with a dip tube and Epifanes wouldhelp. Also if I keep the varnish at a constant temperatur (25ŸC) in thedip tube will I have to mix the varnish before every use or will theheat keep it moving in the tube so that it doesn't settle. Thanks Stuart from petermckean@netspace.net.au Sun Mar 24 04:42:46 2002 g2OAgh414216 for ; Sun, 24 Mar 2002 04:42:44 - g2OAgUs65162; Subject: Re: eBay-cool rod saracasm at it worse Yeah, Adam, and while we're about it let's get someone to slap a coat ofacrylic white on the ceiling of that damned Sistine Chapel thingy![:-)] Peter from petermckean@netspace.net.au Sun Mar 24 05:18:19 2002 g2OBIH414687 for ; Sun, 24 Mar 2002 05:18:17 - g2OBICY70164 for ; Sun, 24 Mar 2002 22:18:13 Subject: Epon My humble apologies! I have always thought that those of you who say that they have to sand offthe binding string with Epon if you don't get it off quickly enough wereprobably exaggerating.I have been gluing with PU now for about 12 rods, and am currentlyfinishing two Payne 101 wannabe's, so thought it would be a good opportunityto compare glues; yesterday I glued one with Epon, and hung it up in thedrying cabinet. I hung up the second tip at 1645, ambient temperature about25 Celsius. I have one 100 watt globe burning in the cabinet.Usually, with the Epon, I would pull off the string about 12 - 18 hourslater, and not expect to have any trouble at all.Last night, for some reason that is not clear to me, I went down to checkon the sections at about 2200, and they were firm and set, so I thought thatI should probably take off the string a bit early.No way!Today I sanded the stuff off; I still think it's great glue, though you cansmell it for bloody days, even through nitrile gloves and face masks, butthat sanding is no fun at all!I am going to glue up the other clone with PU tomorrow, to see if there isany subjective difference in the blanks. I mean, I know that there WON'Tbe, but I'm going to do it anyway.... Anyone else have any experience like that with Epon (mixed 3:1) ? Peter from atlasc1@earthlink.net Sun Mar 24 06:20:28 2002 g2OCKR415343 for ; Sun, 24 Mar 2002 06:20:27 - ([209.179.146.68] helo=computer) id 16p6yx-00039M-00; Sun, 24 Mar 2002 04:20:19 -0800 Subject: Re: Epon Peter, With Epon wipe it down with a white vinegar on a cloth and let the sectiondry up. The string will unzipped easily. And sanding is almost a joke, thatis to say, easy. Adam----- Original Message ----- Subject: Epon My humble apologies! I have always thought that those of you who say that they have to sandoffthe binding string with Epon if you don't get it off quickly enough wereprobably exaggerating.I have been gluing with PU now for about 12 rods, and am currentlyfinishing two Payne 101 wannabe's, so thought it would be a good opportunity to compare glues; yesterday I glued one with Epon, and hung it up in thedrying cabinet. I hung up the second tip at 1645, ambient temperature about 25 Celsius. I have one 100 watt globe burning in the cabinet.Usually, with the Epon, I would pull off the string about 12 - 18 hourslater, and not expect to have any trouble at all.Last night, for some reason that is not clear to me, I went down to checkon the sections at about 2200, and they were firm and set, so I thought that I should probably take off the string a bit early.No way!Today I sanded the stuff off; I still think it's great glue, though you can smell it for bloody days, even through nitrile gloves and face masks, butthat sanding is no fun at all!I am going to glue up the other clone with PU tomorrow, to see if there isany subjective difference in the blanks. I mean, I know that there WON'Tbe, but I'm going to do it anyway.... Anyone else have any experience like that with Epon (mixed 3:1) ? Peter from atlasc1@earthlink.net Sun Mar 24 06:22:33 2002 g2OCMW415577 for ; Sun, 24 Mar 2002 06:22:32 - ([209.179.146.68] helo=computer) id 16p711-0004BF-00; Sun, 24 Mar 2002 04:22:28 -0800 Subject: Re: eBay-cool rod saracasm at it worse You are right Peter, because all we can do it look at it and what good isthat? Anything that advances the art of rodmaking is good. How many of us sinceseeing that Jus Swell rod are thinking "How did they do that?"Adam----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: eBay-cool rod saracasm at it worse Yeah, Adam, and while we're about it let's get someone to slap a coat ofacrylic white on the ceiling of that damned Sistine Chapel thingy![:-)] Peter from channer@frontier.net Sun Mar 24 06:54:06 2002 g2OCs5416222 for ; Sun, 24 Mar 2002 06:54:05 - for ; Sun, 24 Mar 2002 05:54:07 - Subject: Re: Epon Peter;I have used Epon for 4 years now, on about 2 dozen rods, and I havenever had to sand the thread off. I mix it 1-1, bind em up and hang em shop, in the winter they come in the house and hang in the varnishingcabinet with the light on, about 95f. Sometimes I get impatient and heatcure one at 200 for 2 hrs. The sanding part is most always the same,unless I attempt to sand too soon, in which case it just makes a gooeymess out of the sandpaper. I use cotton covered polyester thread foreverything and it comes off fairly easy no matter how I've cured theglue, sometimes it can be a bit more trouble getting it off the heatcured sections, but not much.. I also just did a small experiment. Ijust glued up a rod the other day and thought I would try to find outjust how much the Epon was ading to the dimension of the sections. Iplaned each strip to 1/2 the rod dimensions, measured very carefully all3 directions at every station, then when I taped it together for glueup, I taped on either side of the station marks and remeasured thesections at each station. I wrote those numbers down and managed toavoid breaking my own arm patting myself on the back for doing such afantastic planing job! After cleaning the sections yesterday, I remarkedthe 5" stations on them and remeasured and can report that, at 75degreesF and 30% humidity in Durango ,Co., at an approximate alttitude of 7,000ft. above sea level, Epon seems to add a fairly consistent .004" at eachstation for the full length of the rod. FWIWjohn Peter McKean wrote: My humble apologies! I have always thought that those of you who say that they have to sandoffthe binding string with Epon if you don't get it off quickly enough wereprobably exaggerating. from TSmithwick@aol.com Sun Mar 24 08:13:57 2002 g2OEDv417260 for ; Sun, 24 Mar 2002 08:13:57 - Subject: Re: Epon Peter - My experience with Epon is similar to John's. If you take the string off within 24 hours, the glue will be "soft" and the string will come right off. If you wait a few days, or heat set the glue you will have a problem with the string, and the glue will be much harder to get off the blank. If you are working with soft glue, a cabinet scraper will do a much cleaner and quicker job of removing excess from the blank than sandpaper. If the glue is hard, the scraper will leave chatter marks, and you have no choice except to use files and sandpaper. If you want to heat set, it's easier to take the string and excess glue off after 12-24 hours, rebind, and then heat set. from rextutor@yahoo.com Sun Mar 24 09:19:54 2002 g2OFJr418407 for ; Sun, 24 Mar 2002 09:19:53 - 24 Mar 2002 07:19:46 PST Subject: Re: Rod ID Dave ,Michael Sinclair has a short chapter on the Weberrods. 1920 to 1929 the rods were built by Edwardswhile 1930 to end (37+ ?) the blanks came from Heddon.The Heddon is more common and of better quality.He mentions a model Henshall MasterKraft but not aStreamline . He only lists a group of Heddon made rodmodels. You may have an Edwards model pre 1930.--- Dave Norling wrote: Can anyone tell me who made a J.A. HenshallStreamline (marked with a decal on the shaft of buttsection) for Weber Life like Fly Company of Stevenspoint Wisconsin (marked on reel seat)? Dave Norling __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Movies - coverage of the 74th Academy Awardshttp://movies.yahoo.com/ from HARRISTRIBE@aol.com Sun Mar 24 09:48:42 2002 g2OFmg419022 for ; Sun, 24 Mar 2002 09:48:42 - for ; Sun, 24 Mar 2002 10:48:25 - Subject: 9' for 6wt, 2/2 Good Sunday morning to you all.I need some help guys. I need a medium fast, 2 piece, 9 foot for 6 wt. taper. Bass and light salt. I've searched the archives and all the 9' for 6wt tapers are for 3 piece rods. I don't know how to make a properconversion to a 2 piece. I also found an EC Powell 5wt. but again I am found wanting in the conversion department. Any help with making the conversions or sharing an existing taper will be appreciated greatly.JimH. Good Sunday morning to you all. archives and all the 9' for 6wt tapers are for 3 piece rods. I don't know how help with making the conversions or sharing an existing taper will beappreciated greatly.JimH. from dpvbkjs@somtel.com Sun Mar 24 10:01:40 2002 g2OG1d419408 for ; Sun, 24 Mar 2002 10:01:39 - Subject: public interest in bamboo Hi, All, Yesterday was the LL Bean Fly Fishing (and Spring Shooting) Expo, and theinterest in bamboo rods was amazing. We were doing our usual "dog and ponyshow" (books and how a rod is made basics) in the lobby, and we started at8am pretty much non-stop until 4pm. While everybody in Maine seems tohavea bamboo rod story, they were often five or six deep asking questionsranging from "how do you turn that stick of cane down on a lathe torod-size?" to "how does impregnation affect the casting quality of therod?" Some were merely curious, and some were downright smitten. Quitefun. Beans, by the way, doesn't carry anything bamboo except "Moose" andmaybe some lawn furniture, so it was nice on their part to have us in. Hope the interest is catching elsewhere. Kat and David from caneman@clnk.com Sun Mar 24 12:37:32 2002 g2OIbV421408 for ; Sun, 24 Mar 2002 12:37:31 - (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35) Subject: Re: public interest in bamboo The interest in Cane Rods is definitely coming up! I did a short (2 hour)program at the Sowbug Roundup on the Making of Bamboo Rods, and thereweretwice as many attendees as I expected. Loads of questions, mostly good.The only question I avoided was about comparing graphite to cane. I skippedaround that by saying "I know graphite has it's place... it just isn't in myhands".The program was supposed to be over at 3pm I think, but it lasted untilcloser to four, and after that, a few stayed around to ask specificquestions and show some old rods that were Dad's or Grandpa's. I waspleasantly surprised at the amount of curiousity and participation. Justhope the interest in bamboo keeps climbing!!! Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com- ---- Original Message ----- Subject: public interest in bamboo Hi, All, Yesterday was the LL Bean Fly Fishing (and Spring Shooting) Expo, and theinterest in bamboo rods was amazing. We were doing our usual "dog and pony show" (books and how a rod is made basics) in the lobby, and we started at8am pretty much non-stop until 4pm. While everybody in Maine seems to have a bamboo rod story, they were often five or six deep asking questionsranging from "how do you turn that stick of cane down on a lathe torod-size?" to "how does impregnation affect the casting quality of therod?" Some were merely curious, and some were downright smitten. Quitefun. Beans, by the way, doesn't carry anything bamboo except "Moose" andmaybe some lawn furniture, so it was nice on their part to have us in. Hope the interest is catching elsewhere. Kat and David from tjtrodmaker@yahoo.com Sun Mar 24 12:43:20 2002 g2OIhJ421702 for ; Sun, 24 Mar 2002 12:43:19 - Sun, 24 Mar 2002 10:43:19 PST Subject: Re: public interest in bamboo wasn't bill waara quoted as saying "bamboo is the rodmaterial of the future" or something similiar? timothy --- Bob Nunley wrote: The interest in Cane Rods is definitely coming up! I did a short (2 hour)program at the Sowbug Roundup on the Making ofBamboo Rods, and there weretwice as many attendees as I expected. Loads ofquestions, mostly good.The only question I avoided was about comparinggraphite to cane. I skippedaround that by saying "I know graphite has it'splace... it just isn't in myhands".The program was supposed to be over at 3pm Ithink, but it lasted untilcloser to four, and after that, a few stayed aroundto ask specificquestions and show some old rods that were Dad's orGrandpa's. I waspleasantly surprised at the amount of curiousity andparticipation. Justhope the interest in bamboo keeps climbing!!! Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com- ---- Original Message -----From: "D.P. Van Burgel & K.J. Scott" Sent: Sunday, March 24, 2002 10:06 AMSubject: public interest in bamboo Hi, All, Yesterday was the LL Bean Fly Fishing (and Spring Shooting) Expo, and the interest in bamboo rods was amazing. We were doing our usual "dog andpony show" (books and how a rod is made basics) in the lobby, and we started at 8am pretty much non-stop until 4pm. While everybody in Maine seems tohave a bamboo rod story, they were often five or six deep asking questions ranging from "how do you turn that stick of cane down on a lathe to rod-size?" to "how does impregnation affect the casting quality of the rod?" Some were merely curious, and some were downright smitten. Quite fun. Beans, by the way, doesn't carry anything bamboo except "Moose" and maybe some lawn furniture, so it was nice on their part to have us in. Hope the interest is catching elsewhere. Kat and David ====="Gooda' mornin', mister bear!" ...Ride, boldly ride,"The shade replied, -"If you seek for Eldorado!" -- E.A.Poe __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Movies - coverage of the 74th Academy Awardshttp://movies.yahoo.com/ from goodaple@cox-internet.com Sun Mar 24 12:54:57 2002 g2OIsu422098 for ; Sun, 24 Mar 2002 12:54:56 -0600 (InterMail vK.4.03.05.03 201-232-132-103 license180e1de7f543f89455b24e508f9cca39) Subject: Todd T"S site Anyone have the link for Todd's tips site and for the chatroom? Thanks, =Randall R. Gregory NW AR. Anyone have the link for Todd's tips = the chatroom? Thanks, Randall R. Gregory NW =AR. from ajthramer@hotmail.com Sun Mar 24 13:05:49 2002 g2OJ5n422514 for ; Sun, 24 Mar 2002 13:05:49 - Sun, 24 Mar 2002 11:05:47 -0800 Sun, 24 Mar 2002 19:05:47 GMT Subject: Re: public interest in bamboo FILETIME=[E83050D0:01C1D366] My short reply to the inevitable question of comparing graphite to cane is that graphite is for casting and bamboo is for fishing. Of course I have a long answer too. [:)] A.J. From: "Bob Nunley" Subject: Re: public interest in bambooDate: Sun, 24 Mar 2002 12:39:01 - 0600 The interest in Cane Rods is definitely coming up! I did a short (2 hour)program at the Sowbug Roundup on the Making of Bamboo Rods, and thereweretwice as many attendees as I expected. Loads of questions, mostly good.The only question I avoided was about comparing graphite to cane. I skippedaround that by saying "I know graphite has it's place... it just isn't in myhands".The program was supposed to be over at 3pm I think, but it lasted untilcloser to four, and after that, a few stayed around to ask specificquestions and show some old rods that were Dad's or Grandpa's. I waspleasantly surprised at the amount of curiousity and participation. Justhope the interest in bamboo keeps climbing!!! Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com- ---- Original Message -----From: "D.P. Van Burgel & K.J. Scott" Sent: Sunday, March 24, 2002 10:06 AMSubject: public interest in bamboo Hi, All, Yesterday was the LL Bean Fly Fishing (and Spring Shooting) Expo, and the interest in bamboo rods was amazing. We were doing our usual "dog and pony show" (books and how a rod is made basics) in the lobby, and we started at 8am pretty much non-stop until 4pm. While everybody in Maine seems to have a bamboo rod story, they were often five or six deep asking questionsranging from "how do you turn that stick of cane down on a lathe torod-size?" to "how does impregnation affect the casting quality of therod?" Some were merely curious, and some were downright smitten. Quitefun. Beans, by the way, doesn't carry anything bamboo except "Moose" and maybe some lawn furniture, so it was nice on their part to have us in. Hope the interest is catching elsewhere. Kat and David _________________________________________________________________MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx from rextutor@yahoo.com Sun Mar 24 13:41:00 2002 g2OJex423334 for ; Sun, 24 Mar 2002 13:41:00 -0600 24 Mar 2002 11:40:59 PST Subject: Re: Todd T"S site http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo/ the chat is a button from the above home page--- Randall Gregory wrote: Anyone have the link for Todd's tips site and forthe chatroom? Thanks, Randall R. Gregory NW AR. __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Movies - coverage of the 74th Academy Awardshttp://movies.yahoo.com/ from rodwrapp@swbell.net Sun Mar 24 13:49:19 2002 g2OJnI423706 for ; Sun, 24 Mar 2002 13:49:18 -0600 (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 (built May 7 2001)) Subject: unsubscribe ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Todd T"S site http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo/ the chat is a button from the above home page--- Randall Gregory wrote: Anyone have the link for Todd's tips site and forthe chatroom? Thanks, Randall R. Gregory NW AR. __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Movies - coverage of the 74th Academy Awardshttp://movies.yahoo.com/ from goodaple@cox-internet.com Sun Mar 24 14:05:01 2002 g2OK50424206 for ; Sun, 24 Mar 2002 14:05:00 -0600 (InterMail vK.4.03.05.03 201-232-132-103 license180e1de7f543f89455b24e508f9cca39) Subject: Re: Todd T"S site Thanks, Everyone for Todd's site info. Randall G. NW AR.----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Todd T"S site Randall,The URL is I hope this is what you need. Hal from flyfish@gbronline.com Sun Mar 24 14:22:16 2002 g2OKMF424683 for ; Sun, 24 Mar 2002 14:22:15 - Subject: Handle adhesives What's anyone's favorite adhesive to glue up cork rings? I've used PU and epoxies with equal success--I tend to lean a littletoward the epoxies because they fill voids well, but they don't givemuch working time. Thoughts, anyone? Greg from bob@downandacross.com Sun Mar 24 14:26:56 2002 g2OKQs424967 for ; Sun, 24 Mar 2002 14:26:55 - Subject: RE: Handle adhesives I usually use Tite Bond II. Bob -----Original Message----- Subject: Handle adhesives What's anyone's favorite adhesive to glue up cork rings? I've used PU and epoxies with equal success--I tend to lean a littletoward the epoxies because they fill voids well, but they don't givemuch working time. Thoughts, anyone? Greg from twilhelm@occasionalrod.com Sun Mar 24 14:29:46 2002 g2OKTj425329 for ; Sun, 24 Mar 2002 14:29:45 - Sun, 24 Mar 2002 15:29:44 -0500 Subject: In search of Kushner Taper I have probably bitten off more than I can chew. I realize I'm notexperienced enough to hold a class, but at our recent TU banquet I offered and the materials necessary to build the rod of the winners choice. Well it seems that the guy that bought the "opportunity" used to work forMorris Kushner. He went on to tell me that Kushner never sold his rodsinstead giving all of his rods away at no cost. When he asked Kushnerabout a rod, Kushner told him that he would have to build his own first andthen Kushner would give him one. At least that is what I understood thestory to be. Anyhow, it occurred to me that this guy might get a real kick out ofbuilding a rod using one of Kushner's tapers. I haven't heard much on thelist about him but did find the article on Reed's website concerning him. So my question is: Does anyone have any tapers that can be attributed toKushner? ThanksTim from paul.blakley@ntlworld.com Sun Mar 24 14:32:31 2002 g2OKWU425602 for ; Sun, 24 Mar 2002 14:32:30 - Sun, 24 Mar 2002 20:32:28 +0000 Subject: Re: Handle adhesives Bostik Clear............Paul Greg Kuntz wrote: What's anyone's favorite adhesive to glue up cork rings? I've used PU and epoxies with equal success--I tend to lean a littletoward the epoxies because they fill voids well, but they don't givemuch working time. Thoughts, anyone? Greg from Troutgetter@aol.com Sun Mar 24 15:34:35 2002 g2OLYY426966 for ; Sun, 24 Mar 2002 15:34:34 - Subject: Re: Handle adhesives Tite-Bond 2Mike Mike's Bamboo Rod ShopMontclair, CAhttp://www.mshaybamboo.gq.nu/ from TSmithwick@aol.com Sun Mar 24 16:48:33 2002 g2OMmW428449 for ; Sun, 24 Mar 2002 16:48:32 - for ; Sun, 24 Mar 2002 17:48:22 - Subject: Bill Fink's penta g2OMmX428450 I posted the original one piece version of this rod a week or so ago, and highly recommend it if you can build and/or carry it. Here is a computer generated two piece version for those who can't.Bill Fink's ultra DF action 7'3" 4-5 weight penta (strip dimensions). I suggest a #13 truncated ferrule. 0 -.03055 -.03910-.05015-.06625-.07330-.08035-.08640-.09245-.09950- .10655-.11360-.12065-.12770-.13575-.145bal - .155 OBTW, I noticed in one of the machine tool catalogs there is a special micrometer for measuring 5 fluted cutters. The anvil is a 108Ÿ notch. If you want to spend about $400, you can measure a glued up 5 strip rod with confidence. I think I'll wait for Harbor Freight to come out with the Chinese version. from harms1@pa.net Sun Mar 24 17:44:00 2002 g2ONhx429614 for ; Sun, 24 Mar 2002 17:43:59 - Subject: Re: Handle adhesives Greg, I have always used Titebond. It bonds well, sets quickly, sands easily and leaves no glue line. cheers, Bill ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Handle adhesives What's anyone's favorite adhesive to glue up cork rings? I've used PU and epoxies with equal success--I tend to lean a littletoward the epoxies because they fill voids well, but they don't givemuch working time. Thoughts, anyone? Greg from channer@frontier.net Sun Mar 24 18:07:25 2002 g2P07O400292 for ; Sun, 24 Mar 2002 18:07:24 - for ; Sun, 24 Mar 2002 17:07:32 - Subject: Re: Handle adhesives Greg;I use Epon, it doesn't take much and I have to buy the stuff by thequart anyway. It works best if you put a slight amount on, then scrapeas much of it off again as you possibly can, just be sure to coat thewhole surfac e first. Ralph O'Quinn of U-40 tipped me off to that methodand it works really well, no glue lines at all. It also helps to washthe cork rings first, gets rid of the bleaching so yu don't get whiterings between every cork.john Greg Kuntz wrote: What's anyone's favorite adhesive to glue up cork rings? I've used PU and epoxies with equal success--I tend to lean a littletoward the epoxies because they fill voids well, but they don't givemuch working time. Thoughts, anyone? Greg from channer@frontier.net Sun Mar 24 18:12:01 2002 g2P0C1400664 for ; Sun, 24 Mar 2002 18:12:01 - for ; Sun, 24 Mar 2002 17:12:09 - Subject: Re: Epon Tom;Actually, I don't usually have any trouble taking the thread off nomatter how hard the glue is. The trick is the cotton covered polyesterthread, glace cotton is weak as a kitten, polyester is much stronger(and not affected by normal heat treating b.t.w.).john TSmithwick@aol.com wrote: Peter - My experience with Epon is similar to John's. If you take the stringoff within 24 hours, the glue will be "soft" and the string will come rightoff. If you wait a few days, or heat set the glue you will have a problemwith the string, and the glue will be much harder to get off the blank. Ifyou are working with soft glue, a cabinet scraper will do a much cleaner andquicker job of removing excess from the blank than sandpaper. If the glueishard, the scraper will leave chatter marks, and you have no choice excepttouse files and sandpaper. If you want to heat set, it's easier to take thestring and excess glue off after 12-24 hours, rebind, and then heat set. from atlasc1@earthlink.net Sun Mar 24 18:23:30 2002 g2P0NT401186 for ; Sun, 24 Mar 2002 18:23:29 - ([209.179.146.102] helo=computer) id 16pIGl-0000zU-00; Sun, 24 Mar 2002 16:23:28 -0800 Subject: Re: Epon John, That is exactly what I have found here in So. Calif. and I am 30 minutes from the beach, 30 min. from the Mountains and 30 minutes from theDesert. Iguess the stuff is rather consistent. Adam Vigil----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Epon Epon seems to add a fairly consistent .004" at each station for the full length of the rod. FWIWjohn from dpvbkjs@somtel.com Sun Mar 24 18:40:16 2002 g2P0eG401895 for ; Sun, 24 Mar 2002 18:40:16 - Subject: Re: public interest in bamboo Good answers! We actually had a rather edgy question put to us, something like "Why wouldanybody want to fish with one of those old kind of rods?" Inquiring mindswanna know. I was left to field the question since the individual askingseemed liked she'd rather squash males beneath her heels than listen to ananswer from one. My big three reasons go something like: The rod isn'thollow so it isn't as likely to break beneath your heel, er, foot, and thetapers allow the maker to select/design the rod to suit you better, andit's a natural material hand crafted by an individual. I'd accept any coaching. Kat My short reply to the inevitable question of comparing graphite to cane isthat graphite is for casting and bamboo is for fishing. Of course I have along answer too. [:)] A.J. The interest in Cane Rods is definitely coming up! I did a short (2 hour)program at the Sowbug Roundup on the Making of Bamboo Rods, and thereweretwice as many attendees as I expected. Loads of questions, mostly good.The only question I avoided was about comparing graphite to cane. Iskippedaround that by saying "I know graphite has it's place... it just isn't inmyhands".The program was supposed to be over at 3pm I think, but it lasteduntilcloser to four, and after that, a few stayed around to ask specificquestions and show some old rods that were Dad's or Grandpa's. I waspleasantly surprised at the amount of curiousity and participation. Justhope the interest in bamboo keeps climbing!!! Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com Hi, All, Yesterday was the LL Bean Fly Fishing (and Spring Shooting) Expo, and the interest in bamboo rods was amazing. We were doing our usual "dog and pony show" (books and how a rod is made basics) in the lobby, and we started at 8am pretty much non-stop until 4pm. While everybody in Maine seemsto have a bamboo rod story, they were often five or six deep asking questionsranging from "how do you turn that stick of cane down on a lathe torod-size?" to "how does impregnation affect the casting quality of therod?" Some were merely curious, and some were downright smitten. Quitefun. Beans, by the way, doesn't carry anything bamboo except "Moose" and maybe some lawn furniture, so it was nice on their part to have us in. Hope the interest is catching elsewhere. Kat and David _________________________________________________________________MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos:http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx from DCURTIS@satx.rr.com Sun Mar 24 19:28:41 2002 g2P1Se402937 for ; Sun, 24 Mar 2002 19:28:40 -0600 g2P1Xt6D018373 for ; Sun, 24 Mar 2002 19:33:58 -0600 Subject: RE: public interest in bamboo I like to tell people that if I wait all year to get out to Montana/Wyomingto fly fish, I expect more from the trip than catching a few fish. I go onto picture the setting, talking of snow capped mountains in the background,the only sound heard is the stream passing underneath you as you stand inknee high water that is ice cold. Do you want a man made substance in yourfly rod or a piece of nature that has been hand crafted into an elegantpiece of fishing equipment. Fly fishing to me is more of a state of mindand not at all about catching fish. If they say it is all about catchingfish tell them to go to one of those pay by the pound fishing ponds whereyou expect to catch a fish on about every cast. Just my opinion. Darrin Curtis -----Original Message----- Subject: RE: public interest in bamboo I like to tell people that if I wait all year to get out to Montana/Wyomingto fly fish, I expect more from the trip than catching a few fish. I go onto picture the setting, talking of snow capped mountains in the background,the only sound heard is the stream passing underneath you as you stand inknee high water that is ice cold. Do you want a man made substance in yourfly rod or a piece of nature that has been hand crafted into an elegantpiece of fishing equipment. Fly fishing to me is more of a state of mindand not at all about catching fish. If they say it is all about catchingfish tell them to go to one of those pay by the pound fishing ponds whereyou expect to catch a fish on about every cast. Just my opinion. Darrin Curtis -----Original Message----- K.J. Scott Subject: Re: public interest in bamboo Good answers! We actually had a rather edgy question put to us, something like "Why wouldanybody want to fish with one of those old kind of rods?" Inquiring mindswanna know. I was left to field the question since the individual askingseemed liked she'd rather squash males beneath her heels than listen to ananswer from one. My big three reasons go something like: The rod isn'thollow so it isn't as likely to break beneath your heel, er, foot, and thetapers allow the maker to select/design the rod to suit you better, andit's a natural material hand crafted by an individual. I'd accept any coaching. Kat My short reply to the inevitable question of comparing graphite to cane isthat graphite is for casting and bamboo is for fishing. Of course I have along answer too. [:)] A.J. The interest in Cane Rods is definitely coming up! I did a short (2 hour)program at the Sowbug Roundup on the Making of Bamboo Rods, and thereweretwice as many attendees as I expected. Loads of questions, mostly good.The only question I avoided was about comparing graphite to cane. Iskippedaround that by saying "I know graphite has it's place... it just isn't inmyhands".The program was supposed to be over at 3pm I think, but it lasteduntilcloser to four, and after that, a few stayed around to ask specificquestions and show some old rods that were Dad's or Grandpa's. I waspleasantly surprised at the amount of curiousity and participation. Justhope the interest in bamboo keeps climbing!!! Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com Hi, All, Yesterday was the LL Bean Fly Fishing (and Spring Shooting) Expo, and the interest in bamboo rods was amazing. We were doing our usual "dog and pony show" (books and how a rod is made basics) in the lobby, and we started at 8am pretty much non-stop until 4pm. While everybody in Maine seemsto have a bamboo rod story, they were often five or six deep asking questionsranging from "how do you turn that stick of cane down on a lathe torod-size?" to "how does impregnation affect the casting quality of therod?" Some were merely curious, and some were downright smitten. Quite fun. Beans, by the way, doesn't carry anything bamboo except "Moose" and maybe some lawn furniture, so it was nice on their part to have us in. Hope the interest is catching elsewhere. Kat and David _________________________________________________________________MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos:http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx from TSmithwick@aol.com Sun Mar 24 20:02:16 2002 g2P22G403764 for ; Sun, 24 Mar 2002 20:02:16 - Subject: Re: public interest in bamboo In a message dated 3/25/2 12:41:02 AM, dpvbkjs@somtel.com writes: Hi Kat - A few years back I wrote an article for our local TU newsletter swatting down a surly upstart (whom we have since converted), who askedthe same question.Among other things I suggested that a cane rod is composed of naturalfibers. So are the muscles in your arm. They will soon come in tune with each other to produce the hard to describe, but very evident phenomenon known as"bamboo feel". Once you have felt it, you will never go back to plastic.To elaborate on A.J.'s short answer let me tell a secondhand story. Several years ago I had the good fortune to spend some time fishing with a groupthat included the great salt water fisherman, Chico Fernandez. The man is awealth of information, and the evenings were filled with stories. While Chico is known as a saltwater man, he is also a fine trout fisherman. He told us one night that he had two three weights, an upscale graphite, and a Gary Howells. He began to notice that he always caught more fish with the Howells andcould not figure out why. One day he was fishing with George Harvey, and asked George to watch him with both rods and explain the mystery. Mr. Harvey's answer was " When you use the graphite rod you are casting, when you usethe cane rod you are fishing". from jojo@ipa.net Sun Mar 24 20:14:01 2002 g2P2E0404258 for ; Sun, 24 Mar 2002 20:14:00 -0600 helo=default) id 16pJze-0007j4-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Sun, 24 Mar 2002 21:13:55 -0500 Subject: Re: Epon I concur. M-D Peter - My experience with Epon is similar to John's. If you take the string off within 24 hours, the glue will be "soft" and the string will come right off. If you wait a few days, or heat set the glue you will have a problem with the string, and the glue will be much harder to get off the blank. If you are working with soft glue, a cabinet scraper will do a much cleaner and quicker job of removing excess from the blank than sandpaper. If the glue is hard, the scraper will leave chatter marks, and you have no choice except to use files and sandpaper. If you want to heat set, it's easier to take the string and excess glue off after 12-24 hours, rebind, and then heat set. from jojo@ipa.net Sun Mar 24 20:43:10 2002 g2P2hA404965 for ; Sun, 24 Mar 2002 20:43:10 -0600 helo=default) id 16pKRs-0003g2-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Sun, 24 Mar 2002 21:43:05 -0500 Subject: Re: public interest in bamboo This isn't unlike the long answer that I give the more inquisitive. I tell themthat both plasticand bamboo are simply different substrates from which a rod is made, thateach has its own inherentadvantages and disadvantages, that while fish may be caught on both,bamboo is a natural materialand becomes an extension of yourself. This becomes evident in short order.Besides, contemplatingthe beauty of a plastic rod whilst resting the water, or myself, is notsomething I ever did.The man who owns the advertising agency which we use is a good friend. Inthe beginning, he couldn'tunderstand what the big deal was with having a bamboo fly rod. His majorconcern was over the weightissue, to which I always responded that only a wuss wouldn't be able to heft abamboo trout rod allday. Well, long story short, I let him cast a Payne 96 taper one day, and hehasn't been the samesince. He asked me the other day when his rod was going to be ready -- andanother convert is made.;o) M-D In a message dated 3/25/2 12:41:02 AM, dpvbkjs@somtel.com writes: Hi Kat - A few years back I wrote an article for our local TU newsletterswatting down a surly upstart (whom we have since converted), who askedthesame question.Among other things I suggested that a cane rod is composed of naturalfibers.So are the muscles in your arm. They will soon come in tune with each otherto produce the hard to describe, but very evident phenomenon known as"bamboofeel". Once you have felt it, you will never go back to plastic.To elaborate on A.J.'s short answer let me tell a secondhand story. Severalyears ago I had the good fortune to spend some time fishing with a groupthatincluded the great salt water fisherman, Chico Fernandez. The man is awealthof information, and the evenings were filled with stories. While Chico isknown as a saltwater man, he is also a fine trout fisherman. He told us onenight that he had two three weights, an upscale graphite, and a Gary Howells.He began to notice that he always caught more fish with the Howells andcouldnot figure out why. One day he was fishing with George Harvey, and askedGeorge to watch him with both rods and explain the mystery. Mr. Harvey'sanswer was " When you use the graphite rod you are casting, when you usethecane rod you are fishing". from JNL123141@msn.com Sun Mar 24 21:44:44 2002 g2P3ih406296 for ; Sun, 24 Mar 2002 21:44:43 - Sun, 24 Mar 2002 19:44:38 -0800 "DaveandKathy" ,"RodmakersPost" Subject: Re: public interest in bamboo FILETIME=[634B2090:01C1D3AF] ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: public interest in bamboo wasn't bill waara quoted as saying "bamboo is the rodmaterial of the future" or something similiar?timothy --- Bill made that statement about 1995 to a chorus of laughter. It was =at the Southfield Expo in the hospitality suite at a roundtable B.S. sess=ion. He recognized the growing interest then. ----- Original Message ----- From: timothy troester Sent:Sun= rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Subject: Re: public interest in = "bam=boo is the rodmaterial of the future" or something similiar?timot=hy--- Bill made that statement about 1995 to a chorus oflaughter= from JNL123141@msn.com Sun Mar 24 21:46:16 2002 g2P3kF406510 for ; Sun, 24 Mar 2002 21:46:16 - Sun, 24 Mar 2002 19:46:10 -0800 "RodmakersPost" Subject: Re: public interest in bamboo FILETIME=[9A43D9C0:01C1D3AF] It's a contagious disease!! john ----- Original Message ----- Subject: public interest in bamboo Hi, All, Yesterday was the LL Bean Fly Fishing (and Spring Shooting) Expo, and theinterest in bamboo rods was amazing. We were doing our usual "dog and ponyshow" (books and how a rod is made basics) in the lobby, and we started at8am pretty much non-stop until 4pm. While everybody in Maine seems tohavea bamboo rod story, they were often five or six deep asking questionsranging from "how do you turn that stick of cane down on a lathe torod-size?" to "how does impregnation affect the casting quality of therod?" Some were merely curious, and some were downright smitten. Quitefun. Beans, by the way, doesn't carry anything bamboo except "Moose" andmaybe some lawn furniture, so it was nice on their part to have us in. Hope the interest is catching elsewhere. Kat and David It's acontagi= dpvbkjs@somt=el.com Sent: Sunday, March2= rodmake=rs@wugate.wustl.edu Subject:= All,Yesterd=ay was the LL Bean Fly Fishing (and Spring Shooting) Expo, and theint= =ponyshow" (books and how a rod is made basics) in the lobby, and we s= in=Maine seems to havea bamboo rod story, they were often five or six d=eep asking questionsranging from "how do you turn that stick of cane =down on a lathe torod-size?" to "how does impregnation affect the cas= wer= doesn't=carry anything bamboo except "Moose" andmaybe some lawn furniture,s=o it was nice on their part to have us in.Hope the interest is ca=tching elsewhere.Kat andDavid from dybam@oct.net Sun Mar 24 22:09:00 2002 g2P490407257 for ; Sun, 24 Mar 2002 22:09:00 - Subject: Re: public interest in bamboo Communications, Inc. Would you rather watch a home run while at the ball park or on TV.T.V. is more convenient but oh the feeling when at the park.Ask any hitter worth his salt if he would rather use a wooden bat or analuminum one. It's all in the feeling.Mark----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: public interest in bamboo Good answers! We actually had a rather edgy question put to us, something like "Why would anybody want to fish with one of those old kind of rods?" Inquiring mindswanna know. I was left to field the question since the individual askingseemed liked she'd rather squash males beneath her heels than listen to ananswer from one. My big three reasons go something like: The rod isn'thollow so it isn't as likely to break beneath your heel, er, foot, and thetapers allow the maker to select/design the rod to suit you better, andit's a natural material hand crafted by an individual. I'd accept any coaching. Kat My short reply to the inevitable question of comparing graphite to cane is that graphite is for casting and bamboo is for fishing. Of course I have a long answer too. [:)] A.J. The interest in Cane Rods is definitely coming up! I did a short (2 hour) program at the Sowbug Roundup on the Making of Bamboo Rods, andthere were twice as many attendees as I expected. Loads of questions, mostlygood.The only question I avoided was about comparing graphite to cane. Iskippedaround that by saying "I know graphite has it's place... it just isn't in myhands".The program was supposed to be over at 3pm I think, but it lasteduntilcloser to four, and after that, a few stayed around to ask specificquestions and show some old rods that were Dad's or Grandpa's. I waspleasantly surprised at the amount of curiousity and participation. Just hope the interest in bamboo keeps climbing!!! Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com Hi, All, Yesterday was the LL Bean Fly Fishing (and Spring Shooting) Expo, and the interest in bamboo rods was amazing. We were doing our usual "dog and pony show" (books and how a rod is made basics) in the lobby, and we started at 8am pretty much non-stop until 4pm. While everybody in Maineseems to have a bamboo rod story, they were often five or six deep asking questionsranging from "how do you turn that stick of cane down on a lathe torod-size?" to "how does impregnation affect the casting quality of the rod?" Some were merely curious, and some were downright smitten. Quite fun. Beans, by the way, doesn't carry anything bamboo except"Moose" and maybe some lawn furniture, so it was nice on their part to have us in. Hope the interest is catching elsewhere. Kat and David _________________________________________________________________MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos:http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx from Nodewrrior@aol.com Sun Mar 24 22:18:57 2002 g2P4Iu407630 for ; Sun, 24 Mar 2002 22:18:56 - for ; Sun, 24 Mar 2002 23:18:42 - Subject: Re: Handle adhesives Golf mart shafting epoxy.Long pot life and a nice tan color to boot. Rob Hoffhines from avyoung@iinet.net.au Sun Mar 24 22:53:57 2002 g2P4rt408646 for ; Sun, 24 Mar 2002 22:53:55 - Subject: Re: public interest in bamboo Same with canoe paddles. Actually, same with canoes too. TY At 10:03 PM 3/24/02 -0600, Mark Dyba wrote: Would you rather watch a home run while at the ball park or on TV.T.V. is more convenient but oh the feeling when at the park.Ask any hitter worth his salt if he would rather use a wooden bat or analuminum one. It's all in the feeling.Mark----- Original Message -----From: D.P. Van Burgel & K.J. Scott Sent: Sunday, March 24, 2002 6:45 PMSubject: Re: public interest in bamboo Good answers! We actually had a rather edgy question put to us, something like "Why would anybody want to fish with one of those old kind of rods?" Inquiring mindswanna know. I was left to field the question since the individual asking /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Forks Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from dnhayashida@yahoo.com Sun Mar 24 23:38:25 2002 g2P5cO409689 for ; Sun, 24 Mar 2002 23:38:24 -0600 24 Mar 2002 21:38:15 PST Subject: Re: public interest in bamboo I'm a little more practical than most of theseanswers. If I was able to manipulate tapers withgaphite as easily as I can with bamboo, I would bemaking graphite rods. Long ago I decided that mostrods were not casting the way I would have liked themto. I didn't want to leave it up to some designer in arod company to decide what kind of taper I liked. Iactually looked into what it would take to make agraphite rod myself. The oven, getting the prepregmaterial, the cellophane tape wrapping machine, allwas do-able, but the mandrels were just aboutimpossible to make myself. And they were so expensiveto have them made that I wouldn't be able to have onemade just to see how a rod made with it would cast.Too expensive to experiment with. Bamboo allows me tomade a one-off taper, and if I don't like it, no bigdeal, another blank in the fireplace. I guess my short answer is bamboo allows me to designmy own tapers. Darryl Hayashida __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Movies - coverage of the 74th Academy Awardshttp://movies.yahoo.com/ from dannyt@frisurf.no Mon Mar 25 02:47:47 2002 g2P8lj413038 for ; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 02:47:45 - User-Agent: Microsoft-Outlook-Express-Macintosh-Edition/5.02.2022 Subject: Re: 9' for 6wt, 2/2 understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. Ask Ian to measure that 2 piece 9=B4 #7 rod I gave him. It=B4s built by theoldNorwegian company Asbjoern Hoergaard, and is hollow built in the butt. It i=sa real cannon of a rod, and I=B4m sure all the makers attending the Real SRGwould agree. later, =B4=AF'=B7.=B8=B8..>.=B7=B4=AF'=B7.=B8=B8.=B7=B4=AF'=B7.=B8>=B8.=B7=B4=AF'=B7.=B8. ,....=B7=B4=AF'=B7..>>=B8.=B7=B4=AF'=B7.=B8.=B7=B4=AF'=B7...=B8>=B8.=B7=B4=AF'=B7.=B8. ,. Danny Twang94 Bayswater ave.Bayswater, AucklandNew Zealand dannyt@frisurf.no+64 9 445 8949 Subject: 9' for 6wt, 2/2 Good Sunday morning to you all.I need some help guys. I need a medium fast, 2 piece, 9 foot for 6 wt.taper. Bass and light salt. I've searched the archives and all the 9' fo=r6wt tapers are for 3 piece rods. I don't know how to make a properconversion to a 2 piece. I also found an EC Powell 5wt. but again I amfound wanting in the conversion department. Any help with making theconversions or sharing an existing taper will be appreciated greatly. Re: 9' for 6wt, 2/2 Hi Jim, Ask Ian to measure that 2 piece 9=B4 #7 rod I gave him. It=B4s built by theold=Norwegian company Asbjoern Hoergaard, and is hollow built in the butt. It i=s a real cannon of a rod, and I=B4m sure all the makers attending the RealSRG=would agree. later, =B8. ,. Danny Twang94 Bayswater ave.Bayswater, AucklandNew Zealand dannyt@frisurf.no+64 9 445 8949 From: HARRISTRIBE@aol.com Date: Sun, 24 Mar 2002 10:48:25 EST Subject: 9' for 6wt, 2/2 Good Sundaymorning to you al=l. f= arc=hives and all the 9' for 6wt tapers are for 3 piece rods. I don't know how t= 5wt= =with making the conversions or sharing an existing taper will be appreciated=greatly.JimH. from petermckean@netspace.net.au Mon Mar 25 04:09:06 2002 g2PA94414033 for ; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 04:09:04 - g2PA8q439691; Subject: Re: Epon Mark The Epon 828 that I get from a company in Sydney comes with a hardenercalled L-139, and there is no doubt that the recommended mix is 3:1. The puzzling thing here is that I have used this brew for quite a few rodswithout ever having experienced this anomalous quick set-up everbefore. Looks the same, smells the same, cleans up the same, just sets upfaster. This particular sub-species of Epon is a structural adhesive, and in allrespects on which I am able to comment, it seems to be an excellent andfunctional glue; the suppliers are prepared to wax lyrical about its abilityto stick things to concrete, but are pretty non-committal about bamboo. Iwill probably go back to using PU in the main, mainly because it doesn'tsmell so bad, but the Epon is a good product with an adequate working time. Cheers Peter from avyoung@iinet.net.au Mon Mar 25 09:21:27 2002 g2PFLQ420133 for ; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 09:21:26 - Subject: Re: Epon Peter,be careful about locally made Epon and hardeners. I'm not sure about the ins and outs of a local maker using an established name or if the Epon is being imported and the hardener is locally made or what ever but I know I was using what was sold to me as Shell Epon with the proscribed hardener that worked great until the hardener was modified. I wasn't told of the modification and had all 5 nodeless rods made with that batch fail on me.The modification was made to assist elasticity for use mixed with or applied under or over marine paints on steel vessels apparentlyI guess as long as you're not making nodeless rods it's unlikely you'll have problems no matter what is done so long as it sticks but as far as I'm concerned it's once bitten twice shy and Bingham Archery is the only place to get the stuff and I don't sell nodeless rods at all. Tony At 09:07 PM 3/25/02 +1100, Peter McKean wrote: Mark The Epon 828 that I get from a company in Sydney comes with a hardenercalled L-139, and there is no doubt that the recommended mix is 3:1. The puzzling thing here is that I have used this brew for quite a few rodswithout ever having experienced this anomalous quick set-up everbefore. Looks the same, smells the same, cleans up the same, just setsupfaster. This particular sub-species of Epon is a structural adhesive, and in allrespects on which I am able to comment, it seems to be an excellent andfunctional glue; the suppliers are prepared to wax lyrical about its abilityto stick things to concrete, but are pretty non-committal about bamboo. Iwill probably go back to using PU in the main, mainly because it doesn'tsmell so bad, but the Epon is a good product with an adequate workingtime. Cheers Peter /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Forks Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from patrick.w.coffey@boeing.com Mon Mar 25 10:38:01 2002 g2PGc0424128 for ; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 10:38:00 - IAA20440 for ; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 08:37:57 - IAA05775 for ; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 08:37:54 - g2PGbnx00019 for ; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 08:37:49 - (5.5.2650.21) id ; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 08:37:35 -0800 Subject: FW: environmental quality? This was an actual letter sent to Ryan De Vries from the MichiganDepartmentofEnvironmental Quality, State of Michigan. Wait till you read this guy'sresponse - but read the entire letter before you get to the response. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------Mr. Ryan De Vries2088 DaggetPierson, MI 49339 SUBJECT: DEQ File No. 97-59-0023; T11N; R10W, Sec. 20; MontcalmCounty Dear Mr. De Vries It has come to the attention of the Department of Environmental Qualitythat there has been recent unauthorized activity on the above referencedparcelofproperty. You have been certified as the legal landowner and/orcontractorwhodid the following unauthorized activity: Construction and maintenance of two wood debris dams across the outletstreamof Spring Pond. A permit must be issued prior to the start of this typeofactivity. A review of the Department's files shows that no permits havebeenissued. Therefore, the Department has determined that this activity is inviolationofPart 301, Inland Lakes and Streams, of the Natural Resource andEnvironmentalProtection Act, Act 451 of the Public Acts of 1994, being sections324.30101to324.30113 of the Michigan Compiled Laws, annotated. The Department hasbeeninformed that one or both of the dams partially failed during a recentrainevent, causing debris and flooding at downstream locations. We findthatdamsof this nature are inherently hazardous and cannot be permitted. The Department therefore orders you to cease and desist all activitiesatthislocation, and to restore the stream to a free-flow condition by removingall wood and brush forming the dams from the stream channel. Allrestorationworkshall be completed no later than January 31,1998. Please notify this office when the restoration has been completed sothat afollow-up site inspection may be scheduled by our staff. Failure tocomplywith this request or any further unauthorized activity on the site mayresultin this case being referred for elevated enforcement action. We anticipate and would appreciate your full cooperation in this matter.Pleasefeel free to contact me at this office if you have any questions. Sincerely,David L. PriceDistrict Representative Land and Water Management Division ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ RESPONSERe: DEQ File No. 97-59-0023; T11N; R10W, Sec. 20; Montcalm County Dear Mr. PriceYour certified letter dated 12/17/97 has been handed to me to respondto.Firstof all, Mr. Ryan De Vries is not the legal landowner and/or contractorat2088Dagget, Pierson, Michigan. I am the legal owner and a couple of beaversareinthe (State unauthorized) process of constructing and maintaining twowood "debris" dams across the outlet stream of my Spring Pond. While Ididnotpay for, authorize, nor supervise their dam project, I think they wouldbehighly offended that you call their skillful use of natural buildingmaterials "debris." I would like to challenge your department to attempttoemulate their dam project any time and/or any place you choose. Ibelieve I can safely state there is no way you could ever match their dam skills,theirdam resourcefulness, their dam ingenuity, their dam persistence, theirdamdetermination and/or their dam work ethic. As to your request, I do notthinkthe beavers are aware that they must first fill out a dam permit priortothestart of this type of dam activity. My first dam question to you is: (1) Are you trying to discriminate against my Spring Pond Beavers or (2) Do you require all beavers throughout this State to conform to saiddamrequest? If you are not discriminating against these particular beavers, throughtheFreedom of Information Act I request completed copies of all those otherapplicable beaver dam permits that have been issued. Perhaps we willsee if there really is a dam violation of Part 301, Inland Lakes and Streams,oftheNatural Resource and Environmental Protection Act, Act 451 of the PublicActsof 1994, being sections 324.30101 to 324.30113 of the Michigan CompiledLaws,annotated. I have several concerns. My first concern is - aren't the beavers entitled to legalrepresentation?TheSpring Pond Beavers are financially destitute and are unable to pay forsaid representation-so the State will have to provide them with a dam lawyer. The Department's dam concern that either one or both of the dams failedduringa recent rain event causing flooding is proof that this is a naturaloccurrence, which the Department is required to protect. In otherwords, we should leave the Spring Pond Beavers alone rather than harassing themandcalling their dam names. If you want the stream "restored" to a damfree-flowcondition-please contact the beavers but if you are going to arrest them(theyobviously did not pay any attention to your dam letter being unable toreadEnglish) so be it. In my humble opinion, the Spring Pond Beavers have arightto build their unauthorized dams as long as the sky is blue, the grassisgreenand water flows downstream. They have more dam right than I do to liveandenjoy Spring Pond. If the Department of Natural Resources andEnvironmental Protection lives up to its name, it should protect the natural resources(Beavers) and the environment (Beavers' Dams). So, as far as the beavers and I are concerned, this dam case can bereferred The Spring Pond Beavers may be under the dam ice then and there will be nowayforyou or your dam staff to contact/harass them then. In conclusion, I would like to bring to your attention a realenvironmentalquality (health) problem in the area. It is the bears. Bears areactuallydefecating in our woods. I definitely believe you should be persecutingthe defecating bears and leave the beavers alone. If you are going toinvestigatethe beaver dam, watch your step! (The bears are not careful where theydump!)Being unable to comply with your dam request, and being unable tocontactyouon your dam answering machine, I am sending this response to your dayoffice via another government organization-the dam USPS. Maybe, someday, itwillgetthere. Sincerely, Stephen L. Tvedtenluvsteen from quiet_reed@hotmail.com Mon Mar 25 11:38:29 2002 g2PHcT427345 for ; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 11:38:29 - Mon, 25 Mar 2002 09:38:22 -0800 Mon, 25 Mar 2002 17:38:21 GMT Subject: 2002 NW Bamboo Rod Casting Demonstration FILETIME=[DC43F6B0:01C1D423] Hi: This is probably the final update on the Bamboo Rod Casting Demonstration. The event will be held as part of the Annual Fly Fishing Fair of the Santiam Fly Casters of Salem, Oregon. The Fair will be held in the Sparks Center of Willamette University in Salem, Oregon. The date is Saturday, April 6th, 2002, from 10 AM to 3 PM. The fair includes fly tying demonstration and instruction, fly fishing instruction, and a casting area. In previous years, graphite and fiberglass rods have been a part of the casting area. This year the Santiam Fly Casters have invited bamboo rod makers in the area to bring their rods and allow interested folk to cast their rods. For many people, the idea of bamboo is linked to heavy, hard to cast rods, or post-second World War rods from Japan. For others, it is the realm of the wealthy, beyond the pale of most fly fishers. This event is meant to dispel both misconceptions. Plus, it will be an opportunity to talk with the rodmakers themselves. Casting may be either in thegymnasium or the playing field outside, depending on weather. This several rodmakers have agreed to bring their rods and talk with visitors: AJ Thramer (Eugene), Chris McDowell (Eugene), Bill Bennett (Salem), Stephen Kiley (West Linn), and Gary Lohkamp (Gresham). Other rodmakers, including Cal Hudspeth, Chet Croco, Tim Stoltz, and of course, yours truly will also be in attendance. Please invite anyone who might be interested to come on down and have a great time. Send me some email for any other information, or contact anyof the Salem, Oregon fly shops: Creekside Fly Fishing, Fly Country Outfitters, and Valley Fly Fisher. BTW, I attended the Annual Fly Tyers Expo in Eugene on Saturday. Great show. Don ChenPO Box 1933Corvallis, OR 97339-1933quiet_reed@hotmail.com541- 750-8741 (messages) _________________________________________________________________Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com from pvansch@wethersfield.k12.ct.us Mon Mar 25 11:54:13 2002 g2PHsC428322 for ; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 11:54:13 - Subject: RE: environmental quality? Organization: Wethersfield Public Schools Dam, this is funny!! Government at its' best! -----Original Message----- Subject: FW: environmental quality? This was an actual letter sent to Ryan De Vries from the MichiganDepartment of Environmental Quality, State of Michigan. Wait till youread this guy'sresponse - but read the entire letter before you get to the response. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------Mr. Ryan De Vries2088 DaggetPierson, MI 49339 SUBJECT: DEQ File No. 97-59-0023; T11N; R10W, Sec. 20; MontcalmCounty Dear Mr. De Vries It has come to the attention of the Department of Environmental Qualitythat there has been recent unauthorized activity on the above referencedparcel of property. You have been certified as the legal landownerand/or contractor who did the following unauthorized activity: Construction and maintenance of two wood debris dams across the outletstream of Spring Pond. A permit must be issued prior to the start ofthis type of activity. A review of the Department's files shows that nopermits have been issued. Therefore, the Department has determined that this activity is inviolation of Part 301, Inland Lakes and Streams, of the Natural Resourceand Environmental Protection Act, Act 451 of the Public Acts of 1994,being sections 324.30101 to 324.30113 of the Michigan Compiled Laws,annotated. The Department has been informed that one or both of the damspartially failed during a recent rain event, causing debris and floodingat downstream locations. We find that dams of this nature areinherently hazardous and cannot be permitted. The Department therefore orders you to cease and desist all activitiesat this location, and to restore the stream to a free-flow condition byremoving all wood and brush forming the dams from the stream channel. Allrestoration work shall be completed no later than January 31,1998. Please notify this office when the restoration has been completed sothat a follow-up site inspection may be scheduled by our staff. Failureto comply with this request or any further unauthorized activity on thesite may result in this case being referred for elevated enforcementaction. We anticipate and would appreciate your full cooperation in this matter.Please feel free to contact me at this office if you have any questions. Sincerely,David L. PriceDistrict Representative Land and Water Management Division ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ RESPONSERe: DEQ File No. 97-59-0023; T11N; R10W, Sec. 20; Montcalm County Dear Mr. PriceYour certified letter dated 12/17/97 has been handed to me to respondto. First of all, Mr. Ryan De Vries is not the legal landowner and/orcontractor at 2088 Dagget, Pierson, Michigan. I am the legal owner anda couple of beavers are in the (State unauthorized) process ofconstructing and maintaining two wood "debris" dams across the outletstream of my Spring Pond. While I did not pay for, authorize, norsupervise their dam project, I think they would be highly offended thatyou call their skillful use of natural building materials "debris." Iwould like to challenge your department to attempt to emulate their damproject any time and/or any place you choose. I believe I can safely state there is no way you could ever match their dam skills,their dam resourcefulness, their dam ingenuity, their dam persistence,their dam determination and/or their dam work ethic. As to your request,I do not think the beavers are aware that they must first fill out a dampermit prior to the start of this type of dam activity. My first dam question to you is: (1) Are you trying to discriminate against my Spring Pond Beavers or (2) Do you require all beavers throughout this State to conform to saiddam request? If you are not discriminating against these particular beavers, throughthe Freedom of Information Act I request completed copies of all thoseother applicable beaver dam permits that have been issued. Perhaps wewill see if there really is a dam violation of Part 301, Inland Lakes and Streams,of the Natural Resource and Environmental Protection Act, Act 451 of thePublic Acts of 1994, being sections 324.30101 to 324.30113 of theMichigan Compiled Laws, annotated. I have several concerns. My first concern is - aren't the beavers entitled to legalrepresentation? The Spring Pond Beavers are financially destitute andare unable to pay for said representation-so the State will have to provide them with a dam lawyer. The Department's dam concern that either one or both of the dams failedduring a recent rain event causing flooding is proof that this is anatural occurrence, which the Department is required to protect. Inother words, we should leave the Spring Pond Beavers alone rather than harassing themand calling their dam names. If you want the stream "restored" to a damfree- flow condition-please contact the beavers but if you are going toarrest them (they obviously did not pay any attention to your dam letterbeing unable to readEnglish) so be it. In my humble opinion, the Spring Pond Beavers have aright to build their unauthorized dams as long as the sky is blue, thegrass is green and water flows downstream. They have more dam rightthan I do to live and enjoy Spring Pond. If the Department of NaturalResources and Environmental Protection lives up to its name, it should protect the natural resources(Beavers) and the environment (Beavers' Dams). So, as far as the beavers and I are concerned, this dam case can bereferred The Spring Pond Beavers may be under the dam ice then and there will be noway for you or your dam staff to contact/harass them then. In conclusion, I would like to bring to your attention a realenvironmental quality (health) problem in the area. It is the bears.Bears are actually defecating in our woods. I definitely believe youshould be persecuting the defecating bears and leave the beavers alone. If you are going toinvestigate the beaver dam, watch your step! (The bears are not carefulwhere theydump!)Being unable to comply with your dam request, and being unable tocontact you on your dam answering machine, I am sending this response toyour day office via another government organization-the dam USPS. Maybe, someday, itwill get there. Sincerely, Stephen L. Tvedtenluvsteen from Troy.Miller@BakerOilTools.com Mon Mar 25 12:58:26 2002 g2PIwP401424 for ; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 12:58:25 - (bhihdcimc01.bakerhughes.com [204.253.245.34] (may be forged)) (5.5.2653.19) id ; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 12:42:24 -0600 rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: RE: public interest in bamboo Has anyone heard the song by the country group Rascal Flatts, called "LongSlow Beautiful Dance"? Whenever I hear that song, I think of my newinfatuation with bamboo. With all respect, AJ, cane is for casting,fishing, admiring, and anything else we want to derive from it. I thank youall for helping me realize this. Bamboo is profoundly impacting myflyfishing existence, day by day..... TAM -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: public interest in bamboo My short reply to the inevitable question of comparing graphite to cane is that graphite is for casting and bamboo is for fishing. Of course I have a long answer too. [:)] A.J. from tjtrodmaker@yahoo.com Mon Mar 25 13:46:41 2002 g2PJke403895 for ; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 13:46:40 -0600 Mon, 25 Mar 2002 11:46:39 PST Subject: Re: public interest in bamboo --- Jojo DeLancier wrote: This isn't unlike the long answer that I give themore inquisitive. I tell them that both plasticand bamboo are simply different substrates fromwhich a rod is made, that each has its own inherentadvantages and disadvantages, that while fish may becaught on both, bamboo is a natural materialand becomes an extension of yourself. This becomesevident in short order. Besides, contemplatingthe beauty of a plastic rod whilst resting thewater, or myself, is not something I ever did.The man who owns the advertising agency which we useis a good friend. In the beginning, he couldn'tunderstand what the big deal was with having abamboo fly rod. His major concern was over theweightissue, to which I always responded that only a wusswouldn't be able to heft a bamboo trout rod allday. Well, long story short, I let him cast a Payne96 taper one day, and he hasn't been the samesince. He asked me the other day when his rod wasgoing to be ready -- and another convert is made.;o) M-D From: In a message dated 3/25/2 12:41:02 AM,dpvbkjs@somtel.com writes: Hi Kat - A few years back I wrote an article for ourlocal TU newsletterswatting down a surly upstart (whom we have sinceconverted), who asked thesame question.Among other things I suggested that a cane rod iscomposed of natural fibers.So are the muscles in your arm. They will soon comein tune with each otherto produce the hard to describe, but very evidentphenomenon known as "bamboofeel". Once you have felt it, you will never go backto plastic.To elaborate on A.J.'s short answer let me tell asecondhand story. Severalyears ago I had the good fortune to spend some timefishing with a group thatincluded the great salt water fisherman, ChicoFernandez. The man is a wealthof information, and the evenings were filled withstories. While Chico isknown as a saltwater man, he is also a fine troutfisherman. He told us onenight that he had two three weights, an upscalegraphite, and a Gary Howells.He began to notice that he always caught more fishwith the Howells and couldnot figure out why. One day he was fishing withGeorge Harvey, and askedGeorge to watch him with both rods and explain themystery. Mr. Harvey'sanswer was " When you use the graphite rod you arecasting, when you use thecane rod you are fishing". ====="Gooda' mornin', mister bear!" ...Ride, boldly ride,"The shade replied, -"If you seek for Eldorado!" -- E.A.Poe __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Movies - coverage of the 74th Academy Awardshttp://movies.yahoo.com/ from dryfly@erols.com Mon Mar 25 13:56:13 2002 g2PJuC404584 for ; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 13:56:12 - ([208.58.202.174] helo=erols.com) id 16paZf-0001qV-00 for rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 14:56:11 -0500 Subject: Straightening with Epon Need to do some minor straightening to a nodeless rod that I glued upwith Titebond II (splices) and Epon (strips). What is the bestway....apply heat from a heat gun to specific areas or place strip inoven at 180 degrees and then straighten? ThanksBob from gwclark.vernmhp@state.ut.us Mon Mar 25 14:28:46 2002 g2PKSf406684 for ; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 14:28:45 - with Novell_GroupWise; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 13:28:14 -0700 Subject: Question about grooved planes.... g2PKSk406695 I've been reading everything I can lay my hands on and find on the Internetconcerning rod building in preparation of getting my own set of forms andstarting off on this madness of converting grass into fly rods. My question is; what is the purpose of grooving the bottom of planes used inrodmaking? I see that some rod builders use grooved planes and othersdon't. Why? Are the forms set up differently when using grooved planes asopposed to non-grooved planes? Thanks in advance, Gary W. Clark - NB7BNetwork AdministratorNortheastern Counseling CenterPOB 1908 Vernal, UT 84078OFC: 435-789-6326FAX: 435-789- 6325gwclark.vernmhp@state.ut.us "If everything is going great, don't try to figure it out" from rodsupstream@exploremaine.com Mon Mar 25 14:46:17 2002 g2PKkG407906 for ; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 14:46:17 - for ; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 15:46:35 -0500 Subject: RE: public interest in bamboo Here are some excerpts from today's e-mail about the natural materialsusedto make bamboo rods. I've used PU and epoxies with equal success, Epon is a structural adhesiveGolf mart shafting epoxycotton covered polyesterthreadnot to mention the impregnation of bamboo, reel seat inserts, and all theother modern methods used to construct the modern bamboo rod. I guessthequestion becomes, what qualifies as a true bamboo rod? If what you aredescribing is a feel or action this two can be repeated in other materials,but what I am most curious about is what is casting and what isfishing????????? Upstream Always, Tim DoughtyRod MakerUpstream Custom Rods name="winmail.dat" filename="winmail.dat" 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from Harris.James@ev.state.az.us Mon Mar 25 15:04:35 2002 g2PL4Y409245 for ; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 15:04:34 - g2PL1BH11240 for ; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 14:01:11 -0700 14:02:32 2002 -0700 with Novell_GroupWise; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 14:04:23 -0700 Subject: RE: environmental quality? another point of view g2PL4Y409248 (Not directed at my friends Patrick or Peter but to the list in general) You know who the real culprit is here, don't you? Well, having a littleexperience in maters such as these I can tell you. Mr. Stephen L.Tvedtenluvsteen has a sadly misinformed down stream neighbor thatreported the dams to DEQ as stated. The DEQ is obligated under law torespond to all reports and start an investigation. Law that the people ofMichigan voted into place. The DEQ writes these letters in order to initiateaction, stimulate a response and gather information. Better to get a letterthan to have a big 4X4 with a state seal parked in your driveway. Thesystem worked here! If Mr. Tvedtenluvsteen was building dams than he wouldhave been in violation of state law. If Mr. Tvedtenluvsteen's upstreamneighbor was building an upstream dam that flooded his land, I guarantee youhe would be crying to the DEQ for them to do there dam job. The people atDEQ are stuck in a no win situation and letters such as these just makematters worse. Ever wander why the perso!n answering the phone at a state agency sounds annoyed, well this is one ofthe reasons. A little kindness will get you much further down the road. Thiskind of response is like bad mouthing the police and fire departments whenyour neighbor reports your BBQ as a house fire. They will respond, and youwill get questioned, because failure for state workers to follow the letter ofthe law will result in even more criticisms. Bad mouthing the DEQ is alsoabout as productive as badmouthing the police or fire department. A lot ofgood a smartass is going to be for himself or the environment. Believe me,if David L. Price wanted to, he could demanded any number of further actionsof Mr. Tvedtenluvsteen and be completely within the law. He provably didn'tthough, because the world is full dam clowns and the best thing to do, incases such as these, is try and understand everyone's dam point of view anddo your dam job. JimH from Troy.Miller@BakerOilTools.com Mon Mar 25 15:34:30 2002 g2PLYU411080 for ; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 15:34:30 - (bhihdcimc01.bakerhughes.com [204.253.245.34] (may be forged)) (5.5.2653.19) id ; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 15:15:14 -0600 Subject: RE: public interest in bamboo I'm not so sure that casting is a "what", I think is is more a "where". Ifind that it is a place that I escape to whenever I need to forget for abrief instant that I am a husband, or an employee, or a dad, or a son, or alawn care dude, or an automechanic, or a ..... Amabilis lets me sink deeper and more rapidly into this place. TAM -----Original Message----- Sent: Monday, March 25, 2002 2:47 PM Subject: RE: public interest in bamboo Here are some excerpts [Miller, Troy] -- Snip -- what I am most curious about is what is casting and what isfishing????????? Upstream Always, Tim DoughtyRod MakerUpstream Custom Rods from tjtrodmaker@yahoo.com Mon Mar 25 15:49:06 2002 g2PLn5412216 for ; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 15:49:05 -0600 Mon, 25 Mar 2002 13:48:55 PST Subject: straighening does anyone use a cloths iron to straighten rod blanks you use steam? which setting do you use, polyester,cotton, wool or linen? timothy ====="Gooda' mornin', mister bear!" ...Ride, boldly ride,"The shade replied, -"If you seek for Eldorado!" -- E.A.Poe __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Movies - coverage of the 74th Academy Awardshttp://movies.yahoo.com/ from caneman@clnk.com Mon Mar 25 18:21:50 2002 g2Q0Ln421928 for ; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 18:21:49 - (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35) Mon, 25 Mar 2002 18:19:04 -0600 Subject: rod article Just thought some of you might be interested in the new article aboutrodmakers on FlyAnglers Online at www.flyanglersonline.com . You can findit on the front page of the site, entitled, "Traditional Rod Making?" Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com from dryfly@erols.com Mon Mar 25 18:59:12 2002 g2Q0xC423236 for ; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 18:59:12 - ([208.58.194.28] helo=homeserver) id 16pfIs-0000GT-00; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 19:59:10 -0500 Subject: Re: rod article Sorry I wasted the time to read it. from jojo@ipa.net Mon Mar 25 19:10:56 2002 g2Q1At423754 for ; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 19:10:55 -0600 helo=default) id 16pfU8-0005kn-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 20:10:49 -0500 Subject: Re: rod article Nunley, you shit stirrer. Reedwanker makes some good points, and ones thatperhaps neededclarification. There is another article, somewhere on the 'net, wherein theauthor makes the reverseclaim that all handplaning is inferior to machine tapering, and a host of otherinaccuracies. Onething about it, the author of that article at least had the testicular fortitudeto sign his ownname. Not that I blame the Reedwanker for not, under the circumstances. M-D Just thought some of you might be interested in the new article aboutrodmakers on FlyAnglers Online at www.flyanglersonline.com . You can findit on the front page of the site, entitled, "Traditional Rod Making?" Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com from ChristopherO@epicimaging.com Mon Mar 25 19:16:12 2002 be forged)) g2Q1GB424062 for ; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 19:16:11 - id ; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 17:11:06 -0800 Rod Makers List Serve Subject: RE: rod article - yellow journalism (should be called national fl y anglers enquirer online) And just like the last cane rod article, it contains enough grains of truthto be dangerous, mixed in with gross inaccuracies, from which mr"weedwacker" (certainly seems like some kind of "whacker") proceeds tomakeinflammatory, false and inaccurate statements. One wonders if he is being subsidized by the plastic rod industry tosabotage consumer interest in bamboo rods. And he's too cowardly even take credit for his words. Christopher obuchowski -----Original Message----- Subject: rod article Just thought some of you might be interested in the new article aboutrodmakers on FlyAnglers Online at www.flyanglersonline.com . You can findit on the front page of the site, entitled, "Traditional Rod Making?" Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com from bob@downandacross.com Mon Mar 25 19:48:52 2002 g2Q1mp425001 for ; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 19:48:51 - Subject: RE: rod article Well, Bob...I think we could have a few guesses as to who might propagatesuch messages. I was looking through many of the rodmaking books and canfind images of Leonard, Jordan, and Dickerson's planing set up. The bevelerwas a manufacturing device.I think the article is right on the money in many ways (taper duplication,etc...), but what was the point? It just seems nasty and cowardly to notsign your own name.Now to that message board.Bob Maulucci -----Original Message----- Subject: rod article Just thought some of you might be interested in the new article aboutrodmakers on FlyAnglers Online at www.flyanglersonline.com . You can findit on the front page of the site, entitled, "Traditional Rod Making?" Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com from rmoon@ida.net Mon Mar 25 19:55:20 2002 g2Q1tJ425352 for ; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 19:55:19 - Rod Makers List Serve Subject: Re: rod article - yellow journalism (should be called national fly anglers enquirer online) Guys. The identity of Reedwhacker is not that difficult to ascertain. He is along time rod builder, who has achieved a lasting stature among rod builders.He is however, a maker who does not waste an inordinate amout of time onhandplaning. I personally was a little offended by his attack on"non- professionals" particularly since one of those "non'professionals" hadjust recently given him a great accolade, Trouble is I don't want to get in themiddle of this; suffice it to say, that Weedshackers article was probablyintended to be controversial, and might better not have been written. "Christopher A. Obuchowski, MD" wrote: And just like the last cane rod article, it contains enough grains of truthto be dangerous, mixed in with gross inaccuracies, from which mr"weedwacker" (certainly seems like some kind of "whacker") proceeds tomakeinflammatory, false and inaccurate statements. One wonders if he is being subsidized by the plastic rod industry tosabotage consumer interest in bamboo rods. And he's too cowardly even take credit for his words. Christopher obuchowski -----Original Message----- Sent: Monday, March 25, 2002 4:22 PM Subject: rod article Just thought some of you might be interested in the new article aboutrodmakers on FlyAnglers Online at www.flyanglersonline.com . You can findit on the front page of the site, entitled, "Traditional Rod Making?" Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com --http://www.ida.net/users/rmoon from rmoon@ida.net Mon Mar 25 19:58:24 2002 g2Q1wN425593 for ; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 19:58:24 - 0000 Subject: Re: addendum to my reply to rod article I rather think that the author of the article was not afraid to sign his name,It is more likely that the article was published anonymously by the editor.Ralph - http://www.ida.net/users/rmoon from wlwalter77us@yahoo.com Mon Mar 25 20:15:39 2002 g2Q2Fc426331 for ; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 20:15:38 - Mon, 25 Mar 2002 18:15:37 PST Subject: Re: rod article What's up with FlyAnglersOnline, do they have an axeto grind of some kind? Or, are they doing this tocause controversy and get readership as a result? Bill W.--- Bob Nunley wrote: Just thought some of you might be interested in thenew article aboutrodmakers on FlyAnglers Online atwww.flyanglersonline.com . You can findit on the front page of the site, entitled,"Traditional Rod Making?" Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Movies - coverage of the 74th Academy Awardshttp://movies.yahoo.com/ from channer@frontier.net Mon Mar 25 20:23:25 2002 g2Q2NP426697 for ; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 20:23:25 - ,Rod Makers List Serve Subject: Re: rod article - yellow journalism (should be called national fly anglers enquirer online) C'mon Ralph, call a spade a spade, you know as well as i do that it wasTerry, who else would write such stuff?john "Ralph W. Moon" wrote: Guys. The identity of Reedwhacker is not that difficult to ascertain. He isalong time rod builder, who has achieved a lasting stature among rodbuilders.He is however, a maker who does not waste an inordinate amout of time onhandplaning. I personally was a little offended by his attack on"non-professionals" particularly since one of those "non'professionals" hadjust recently given him a great accolade, Trouble is I don't want to get inthemiddle of this; suffice it to say, that Weedshackers article was probablyintended to be controversial, and might better not have been written. "Christopher A. Obuchowski, MD" wrote: And just like the last cane rod article, it contains enough grains of truthto be dangerous, mixed in with gross inaccuracies, from which mr"weedwacker" (certainly seems like some kind of "whacker") proceeds tomakeinflammatory, false and inaccurate statements. One wonders if he is being subsidized by the plastic rod industry tosabotage consumer interest in bamboo rods. And he's too cowardly even take credit for his words. Christopher obuchowski -----Original Message----- Sent: Monday, March 25, 2002 4:22 PM Subject: rod article Just thought some of you might be interested in the new article aboutrodmakers on FlyAnglers Online at www.flyanglersonline.com . You canfindit on the front page of the site, entitled, "Traditional Rod Making?" Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com --http://www.ida.net/users/rmoon from tjtrodmaker@yahoo.com Mon Mar 25 20:28:52 2002 g2Q2Sq427011 for ; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 20:28:52 - Mon, 25 Mar 2002 18:28:51 PST Subject: RE: rod article - yellow journalism (should be called national fl yanglers enquirer online) ,Rod Makers List Serve you know, the proof is in the puding so to speak andat least it's being talked about. that sure makespeople intrested and curious. it does get my hair up alittle but as my dad always said," if you chuck abrick into a pack of dogs you always know which onegets hit!". in this case there are alot of "anti's"doing alot of yelping. i think this person just did usall a favor. timothy--- "Christopher A. Obuchowski, MD"wrote: And just like the last cane rod article, it containsenough grains of truthto be dangerous, mixed in with gross inaccuracies, from which mr"weedwacker" (certainly seems like some kind of"whacker") proceeds to makeinflammatory, false and inaccurate statements. One wonders if he is being subsidized by the plasticrod industry tosabotage consumer interest in bamboo rods. And he's too cowardly even take credit for hiswords. Christopher obuchowski -----Original Message----- Sent: Monday, March 25, 2002 4:22 PM Subject: rod article Just thought some of you might be interested in thenew article aboutrodmakers on FlyAnglers Online atwww.flyanglersonline.com . You can findit on the front page of the site, entitled,"Traditional Rod Making?" Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com ====="Gooda' mornin', mister bear!" ...Ride, boldly ride,"The shade replied, -"If you seek for Eldorado!" -- E.A.Poe __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Movies - coverage of the 74th Academy Awardshttp://movies.yahoo.com/ from canazon@mindspring.com Mon Mar 25 20:37:16 2002 g2Q2bG427471 for ; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 20:37:16 - helo=oemcomputer) id 16pgpf-00003d-00; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 21:37:07 -0500 Subject: Re: rod article bob,sounds like this guy is not making enough money from his business, sohe's gonna try and slam the competition. he is obviously envious of the factthat some people can build a rod and then have time to fish it.in another letter he suggests going on the list and using the searchengine to find out how long people have been making rods. i guess he musthave been around for quite awhile, and he wants to make sure you buy fromsomeone (him) who has a reputation or experience. he seems angry thatsomeone could have the "luxury of unlimited time" to make a rod.that's like telling Monet or Picasso your work is shit because it tookyou to long to paint it.mike kind of reminds me of our friend up in the northlands from rmoon@ida.net Mon Mar 25 20:40:39 2002 g2Q2ec427790 for ; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 20:40:39 - Subject: Re: rod article I am sorry that I spoke before engaging the clutch. I was wrong in mypreviouspost indicating that I knew who the Reedwhacker was. I just didn't readcorrectly and now I am the dark as much as the rest of you. Please forgiveme. Ralph --http://www.ida.net/users/rmoon from tausfeld@frontiernet.net Mon Mar 25 20:43:22 2002 g2Q2hM428100 for ; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 20:43:22 - "Rod Makers List Serve" Subject: Re: rod article Great, a bunch of H-I class rods coming in the market....Maybe he'll sell them to big distributers, I imagine the top three sellerswould be:The Walmart, The K-Marts, and The Target. tom ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: rod article bob,sounds like this guy is not making enough money from his business, sohe's gonna try and slam the competition. he is obviously envious of the fact that some people can build a rod and then have time to fish it.in another letter he suggests going on the list and using the searchengine to find out how long people have been making rods. i guess he musthave been around for quite awhile, and he wants to make sure you buyfromsomeone (him) who has a reputation or experience. he seems angry thatsomeone could have the "luxury of unlimited time" to make a rod.that's like telling Monet or Picasso your work is shit because it took you to long to paint it.mike kind of reminds me of our friend up in the northlands from cattanac@wmis.net Mon Mar 25 20:58:33 2002 g2Q2wX428698 for ; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 20:58:33 - Subject: Re: rod article - yellow journalism (should be called national fl yanglers enquirer online) No the author wasn't a "Wind from The North" but rather someone thatmayhave more years of rod making under his belt than the average age of thegroup here - And he did reflect some of the atitudes that he may have hadput in his face over the years - but what I think is being misunderstoodhere is that Ron is really talking to one or two individuals - and as Raplhso wisely pointed out - the people the article was focused to are few andare of the kind that won't read it.What you are witnessing is a fact of life - a slice of human - the bestexplanation I can see here without going into details is - the differencebetween a Hunter and the Sportsman - Ron was focusing his comments attheHunters of rod making - and trust me Ron isn't the only one that has seenthis rare species in the rodmaking community over the years - Fortunatelythe species is rare from channer@frontier.net Mon Mar 25 21:00:57 2002 g2Q30v429045 for ; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 21:00:57 - Subject: Re: rod article and that's why I think it was Ackland, QC wouldn't be bothered with thelist or the rodmaker's homepage. He's told me any number of times thathe never looks around at other maker's sites.john mike canazon wrote: bob,sounds like this guy is not making enough money from his business, sohe's gonna try and slam the competition. he is obviously envious of thefactthat some people can build a rod and then have time to fish it.in another letter he suggests going on the list and using the searchengine to find out how long people have been making rods. i guess he musthave been around for quite awhile, and he wants to make sure you buyfromsomeone (him) who has a reputation or experience. he seems angry thatsomeone could have the "luxury of unlimited time" to make a rod.that's like telling Monet or Picasso your work is shit because it tookyou to long to paint it.mike kind of reminds me of our friend up in the northlands from Eastkoyfly@aol.com Mon Mar 25 21:11:01 2002 g2Q3B0429690 for ; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 21:11:00 - Subject: Re: rod article - yellow journalism (should be called national fl yanglers e... Wayne,With all do respect, what the heck are you talking about? Joseph A. Perrigowww.geneseevalleyrods.com5733 Griffith Rd.Portageville,NY 14536585-493-2637 from KyleDruey@aol.com Mon Mar 25 21:12:52 2002 g2Q3Cq429902 for ; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 21:12:52 - for ; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 22:12:38 - Subject: Re: rod article - yellow journalism (should be called national fly anglers e... I think you hit the proverbial nail on the head. Its all about content and promotion for those in the media business. When you have a limitedoperating budget there is not a more cost effective means of promotion than togenerate controversy in the absence of quality content. Seems as if Mr.Weedwacker's handlers have enabled him to accomplish this. In a message dated 03/25/2002 5:55:47 PM Pacific Standard Time,rmoon@ida.net writes: Guys. The identity of Reedwhacker is not that difficult to ascertain. He is along time rod builder, who has achieved a lasting stature among rod builders. He is however, a maker who does not waste an inordinate amout of time on handplaning. I personally was a little offended by his attack on"non- professionals" particularly since one of those "non'professionals" hadjust recently given him a great accolade, Trouble is I don't want to get in themiddle of this; suffice it to say, that Weedshackers article was probablyintended to be controversial, and might better not have been written."Christopher A. Obuchowski, MD" wrote:And just like the last cane rod article, it contains enough grains of truthto be dangerous, mixed in with gross inaccuracies, from which mr"weedwacker" (certainly seems like some kind of "whacker") proceeds to makeinflammatory, false and inaccurate statements. One wonders if he is being subsidized by the plastic rod industry tosabotage consumer interest in bamboo rods. And he's too cowardly even take credit for his words. Christopher obuchowski -----Original Message----- Sent: Monday, March 25, 2002 4:22 PM Subject: rod article Just thought some of you might be interested in the new article aboutrodmakers on FlyAnglers Online at www.flyanglersonline.com . You can find it on the front page of the site, entitled, "Traditional Rod Making?" Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com- -http://www.ida.net/users/rmoon----------------------- Headers ----------------- ---------------Return-Path: Received: from rly-yg03.mx.aol.com (rly-yg03.mail.aol.com Mon, 25 Mar 2002 20:55:47 -0500 rly- Mon, 25 Mar 2002 20:55:34 -0500 g2Q1tV425394; g2Q1tJ425352 Received: (qmail 8676 invoked from network); 26 Mar 2002 01:55:18 -0000Received: from unknown (HELO ida.net) (208.141.176.31) Message-ID: Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 18:55:17 -0700From: "Ralph W. Moon" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (Windows NT 5.0; U)X-Accept-Language: en CC: "'caneman@clnk.com'" ,Rod Makers List Serve Subject: Re: rod article - yellow journalism (should be called national fly anglers enquirer online)References: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduX-Listprocessor-Version: 8.2.09/990901/11:28 -- ListProc(tm) by CREN from bdcbfr@chartermi.net Mon Mar 25 21:13:33 2002 g2Q3DW400096 for ; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 21:13:32 - Subject: Re: rod article It sure sounds like vintage Terry. Especially the dig in the FAOL bullitinboard about not buying a rod from anyone without a pedegree. With thedown-turn in the economy maybe some of those mean old hand planers aretaking sales from the real, true, machine-age professionals. Guys like Bob Summers and Ron QC are never going to be able to keep up withthe demand for their work because they have a great reputation and buildquality rods. Whatever the rest of us do they'll happily go along doingjust fine, thank you. But there are those folks out there that aren't happydoing their best. They want to run everybody else down in the bargain.Just be glad you don't have to live in their skin. Brian----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: rod article and that's why I think it was Ackland, QC wouldn't be bothered with thelist or the rodmaker's homepage. He's told me any number of times thathe never looks around at other maker's sites.john mike canazon wrote: bob,sounds like this guy is not making enough money from his business, so he's gonna try and slam the competition. he is obviously envious of the fact that some people can build a rod and then have time to fish it.in another letter he suggests going on the list and using the searchengine to find out how long people have been making rods. i guess he must have been around for quite awhile, and he wants to make sure you buy from someone (him) who has a reputation or experience. he seems angry thatsomeone could have the "luxury of unlimited time" to make a rod.that's like telling Monet or Picasso your work is shit because it took you to long to paint it.mike kind of reminds me of our friend up in the northlands from jojo@ipa.net Mon Mar 25 21:34:23 2002 g2Q3YM400926 for ; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 21:34:22 -0600 helo=default) for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 22:34:21 -0500 Subject: Internal Security Here, y'all need something else to talk about. M-D Beware of the words 'internal security,' for they are the eternal cry of = Here, y'all need = talk about. M-D Beware of the words 'internal security,' for they are the eternal = -- Voltaire from crmitchell@ocsonline.com Mon Mar 25 22:07:10 2002 g2Q479401793 for ; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 22:07:10 - helo=ocsonline.com) id 16piD9-0002xN-00 for rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 23:05:27 -0500 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:0.9.4)Gecko/20011128 Netscape6/6.2.1 Subject: Melting Point of Nylon Maybe I can clear up some of the confusing results re the melting point of nylon. There are 2 types of nylon, which we call Type-6 and Type 6,6, the names referring to the chemical precursors. Most physical properties are similar, except for melting point. T-6,6 melts at 260C (500F) while T-6 melts at 215C (420F); either can melt a few degrees either way depending on specific production attributes. The simplest way of differentiating is to measure the melt point. T-6 begins to soften around 350F and begins to get sticky not far above, so if you get hold of some of that type you'll have a problem - and it comprises most of the world's production. Both have elasticity in the 20% range. Bottom line, cotton is safer to use. from eamon_lee@hotmail.com Mon Mar 25 22:20:03 2002 g2Q4K2402297 for ; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 22:20:02 - Mon, 25 Mar 2002 20:19:50 -0800 Tue, 26 Mar 2002 04:19:49 GMT Subject: Re: rod article FILETIME=[789389A0:01C1D47D] All- Without knowing EXACTLY who Reedwhacker is, perhaps we should sit on our thoughts regarding his or her identity and whatever agenda they may or may not have. "Hard tellin not knowin" Now as for as the article itself, I fail to see what good it does. It is generally negative, is combative in nature, uses sweeping generalizations, and fails to account for a lot of facts. In short, it's moronic and I'm surprised at some of you for even responding to it. I mean-read it! Read it 5 times! The more you read it, the worse it gets. The more you read it, the more ignorant and pathetic the author becomes. It's a farce. My beef is with "Lady-fisher." The fact that this beauty was allowed to hit the web at all is ludicrous. Is this supposed to be informative? Educational? Is it supposed to enrich our sport? What good does it do!!?? Ladyfisher, what exactly are you REALLY trying to acheive by posting this "article?" The only thing the article got right is that we, the "rodmakers of today", have indeed picked up the torch. In this time of "bigger and faster is better" we do carry on the "craft" of rodmaking that is virtuously inefficient, un- ecconomical and fallibly hand-made. Our rods will always have the patina that only human hands can leave. If I wanted something "professional", I'd buy a Sage. Lady-fisher, I would like you to know this. When a young flyfisher comes up to me at a TU event and asks me if he can try that "old timey cane rod," I'll say "Yes you can, I made it myself last week. I made it to fish with. Try it, maybe you'll like it!" instead of "No way kid! Get lost! I waited 3 years for that puppy, it cost me $2000, and do I look crazy to you?" I am a rodmaker and I make available a facet of the sport that had almost become unattainable to the average fly-fisher, however "un-traditional" my methods may be. I perpetuate the sport and it's history. What you do for the sport is unclear to me. Shame on you for printing that junk. Eamon Christopher Lee476 Summerhaven NorthEast Syracuse, NY 13057H- 315-637-4943W-315-422-6161 I am not a coward and will back up 100% of my words with 100% accountability. _________________________________________________________________Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com from cattanac@wmis.net Mon Mar 25 22:46:34 2002 g2Q4kX403263 for ; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 22:46:33 - "Rod Makers List Serve" Subject: Re: rod article - yellow journalism (should be called national fl yanglers enquirer online) Isn't it interesting how - different folks read the same article andcome away with such different meaning - The article - written by whoever -brought back a memory to me that - besides myself - John Z and a coupleothers may only have seen. I don't see it as a slam to hand planers per se.I see it more as a challenge for a few to come back closer to reality. Andhere I suspect that I am treading on dearly thin ice. 14 years ago there wasthis person - the in your face type person - that made rods - the rods hemade were classics - as John and I were told - and we were also told that wewere only good enough to be 'Nipping at his heels" - as if John and I weretrailing the pack. The biggest difference that I saw - between this personand the others - was common sense - and how the product was beingrepresented to the public.See - I didn't read the article as a direct slam to those of us thathand plane - but rather as a reality check as to how we perceive what theend product is - most of us have a common sense vision of what that endproduct is - and that others around us have that same common sense ofthatas well. What I read was this. That for some reason the author felt thatthey had faced enough folks trying to represent their product to be morethan what it truly might be - enough so that they felt they needed to speakout. Is that a commonplace situation - I would hope not Yet if you searchthe archives this same thread has occassionally been talked about on thelist - however in a more gentle way And yes - there are familiar sounds tothis - those that come from thenorth as a cold chill in the winter. By the way - the maker that John and Iwere 'challenged' by disappeared many years ago - when asked no one seemstohave seen him. So my example of the Hunter and Sportsman - the Sportsman has abalancedsense of his sport - he is well aware of what the realities afield are - andhe is willing to put back as much as he takes if not more - the Hunter isout to takes takes takes - and his methods and actions seem to distancethemselves and others - Geeeee Does someone feel a draft ???? As I opened with - the article triggered a real life experience - from mrc@mars.plala.or.jp Mon Mar 25 22:58:38 2002 g2Q4wb403688 for ; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 22:58:37 - id g2Q4wS103815 for ; Tue, 26 Mar2002 13:58:28 +0900 (JST) id NAA20786 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 200213:58:27 +0900 (JST) Subject: Re: rod article Hello Friends, Why are you worry about that kind of article?There are such guys anywhere in this world who tries todistinguish oneself from others. I don't think the real professionalism is the matter of how to make butresults ofhow much one devoted time on it, how deeply one considered to enhanceone'sproduct. Considering that a tremendous numbers of rodmakers are making bamboorodsnow in the world,rodmaking is getting near to the world of every day's cooking among ourwives.Can you say that my wife is the best cook in the world as she usesmicrowaveoven? I rather point if she still loves me (?), if her food is good enough... Max========================================Max Satoh - Bamboo Fly Fishing Rod Makerhttp://maxrod.tripod.comMax Rod Craft - Online Shophttp://m-r- c.tripod.com======================================== from avyoung@iinet.net.au Mon Mar 25 23:09:04 2002 g2Q592404145 for ; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 23:09:02 -0600 Subject: Re: rod article When I finished reading the article I thought his name was Reedwanker but thought that was just too good to be true so had to read it again, too bad.He has made a point about mills etc though I've always been unable to see why it mattered if the rod made in a form is slightly different to the original unless you wanted an exact copy. Even if it only agrees with the original at every 5 inches and that's nonsense in most cases anyhow if the rod made is a good rod so what? If all you're doing is using the taper to make a rod in a form and the rod turns out to be a good casting and fishing rod so what if it's not exactly the same as the original??I simply don't understand this argument against forms, the rods turn out fine so what's the beef? As for comparing rodmakers and "true rodmakers" with sailors who are them selves compared with people who like messing about in boats I know a lot of people who enjoy "messing about in boats" who've messed about in themdoing solo world circumnavigations and Sydney To Hobart races. I bet Reewhacker gets sea sick in a boat on a dry dock. TY At 07:09 PM 3/25/02 -0600, Jojo DeLancier wrote: Nunley, you shit stirrer. Reedwanker makes some good points, and onesthat perhaps neededclarification. There is another article, somewhere on the 'net, wherein the author makes the reverseclaim that all handplaning is inferior to machine tapering, and a host of other inaccuracies. Onething about it, the author of that article at least had the testicular fortitude to sign his ownname. Not that I blame the Reedwanker for not, under the circumstances. M-D From: "Bob Nunley" Just thought some of you might be interested in the new article aboutrodmakers on FlyAnglers Online at www.flyanglersonline.com . You can findit on the front page of the site, entitled, "Traditional Rod Making?" Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Forks Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from atlasc1@earthlink.net Mon Mar 25 23:14:07 2002 g2Q5E7404441 for ; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 23:14:07 -0600 ([209.179.148.97] helo=computer) id 16pjHT-0004Tr-00; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 21:14:00 -0800 Subject: Re: public interest in bamboo Actually it would be interesting to talk to the Steffen Bros. of Arizona.They make and manufacture their own graphite rods. Blanks and all. I haveone and it is one of the few graphite rods I even consider fishing. Adam Vigil----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: public interest in bamboo I'm a little more practical than most of theseanswers. If I was able to manipulate tapers withgaphite as easily as I can with bamboo, I would bemaking graphite rods. Long ago I decided that mostrods were not casting the way I would have liked themto. I didn't want to leave it up to some designer in arod company to decide what kind of taper I liked. Iactually looked into what it would take to make agraphite rod myself. The oven, getting the prepregmaterial, the cellophane tape wrapping machine, allwas do-able, but the mandrels were just aboutimpossible to make myself. And they were so expensiveto have them made that I wouldn't be able to have onemade just to see how a rod made with it would cast.Too expensive to experiment with. Bamboo allows me tomade a one-off taper, and if I don't like it, no bigdeal, another blank in the fireplace. I guess my short answer is bamboo allows me to designmy own tapers. Darryl Hayashida __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Movies - coverage of the 74th Academy Awardshttp://movies.yahoo.com/ from avyoung@iinet.net.au Mon Mar 25 23:29:09 2002 g2Q5T7405059 for ; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 23:29:08 - Subject: Re: rod article - yellow journalism (should be called nationalfl y anglers enquirer online) Well that may be well and good but it doesn't read like that. I reads like if you use forms you're having yourself and others on. That's total BS.IMHO the object of the game is to make decent rods one way or another be that using a sausage making machine like TA's or Sistine Chappel like rods one at a time.If the author of this had a beef with a few people on a personal level attempting to make readers of his message believe anybody using forms is putting out inferior rods for a few reasons but primarily because the tapers are not exactly correct is bad.Like I wrote before, an exact copy of the original taper (ie, 1 inch or 3 inch centres) is not required IF the rod built on 5 inch centres is a good one and that seems to be the case in almost every taper you choose to lookat. Who ever the person and whatever the reason I'm not terribly impressed with either. Sounds more to me like dealers wanting to drive up the price of existing original maker's rods and certain current maker's rods who havemills.If that's not the case, I'm completely bamboozled as to the purpose of the story. TY At 09:53 PM 3/25/02 -0500, Wayne Cattanach wrote: No the author wasn't a "Wind from The North" but rather someone thatmayhave more years of rod making under his belt than the average age of thegroup here - And he did reflect some of the atitudes that he may have hadput in his face over the years - but what I think is being misunderstoodhere is that Ron is really talking to one or two individuals - and as Raplhso wisely pointed out - the people the article was focused to are few andare of the kind that won't read it.What you are witnessing is a fact of life - a slice of human - the bestexplanation I can see here without going into details is - the differencebetween a Hunter and the Sportsman - Ron was focusing his comments attheHunters of rod making - and trust me Ron isn't the only one that has seenthis rare species in the rodmaking community over the years - Fortunatelythe species is rare /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Forks Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from mrc@mars.plala.or.jp Mon Mar 25 23:43:36 2002 g2Q5hZ405561 for ; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 23:43:35 - id g2Q5hWl18804; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 14:43:32 +0900 (JST) id OAA23569; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 14:43:31 +0900 (JST) Subject: Re: Question about grooved planes.... Gary, My question is; what is the purpose of grooving the bottom of planes used in rodmaking? I see that some rod builders use grooved planes and othersdon't. Why? Are the forms set up differently when using grooved planes asopposed to non-grooved planes? I am an user of grooved plane and love it. The goodness of grooved plane are; 1. As its brade does not scratch the surface of planing form, the number ofhoning gets less.In other words, you can plane more strips by the same brade.When using a normal plane, I honed a brade once or twice for planing onestrip.Now I hone once for 6 strips. 2. At the very last stage of planing a strip, both sides of the plane solewill slip on the surface of form.As a result, the plane will not roll. It will result in a flat surface of astrip. This will dramatically reduceschips (gaps) between strips when they are glued. 3. As the brade will not touch with the planing form surface, it allows touse a wooden planing form which iseasier to make than steel form. Down side are; 1. Since the brade is not touching to the surface of planing form, thedimension of the stripbecomes a little bit thicker. To avoid this, it is needed to adjust the PFsetting to the effects, a little narrower. 2. Grooved plane is priced higher than normal plane if you buy it.To make grooved sole youself, you can glue two thin metal plates on bothsides of the sole. Hope this helps. Max ========================================Max Satoh - Bamboo Fly Fishing Rod Makerhttp://maxrod.tripod.comMax Rod Craft - Online Shophttp://m-r- c.tripod.com======================================== from atlasc1@earthlink.net Tue Mar 26 00:22:35 2002 g2Q6MY406709 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 00:22:34 -0600 ([209.179.149.38] helo=computer) id 16pkLo-0003KO-00 for rodmakers@mail.wustl.edu; Mon, 25 Mar 2002 22:22:33 -0800 Subject: an analogy of the FAOL article Hi I am Henry Ford weedwhacker is my nickname, I know a lot about making cars, I invented them for goodness sake. I =developed the assembly line and I know how to make a car in the = I have looked at several car manufactures websites. I can not believe =their claims. They say things like we make the best car, we make them =one at a time. This gives the erroneous impression that hand built cars =are better. I mean where do these guys at Lamborghini, Ferrari, Rolls =Royce get off saying they make cars. I invented the car and if it is not =made my way then it is hardly a car but merely a sad attempt of a copy. Now a Model T is a car, great paint job and state of the art in =suspension. I mean come on...these guy claim to make a car but a car is =a Ford. Their cars are not made like a Ford, do not drive like a Ford =and because of this they are not a good car, but merely a sad attempt =to copy what I have made. According to all the information about car makers from greats like "ME" =cars are made on an assembly line. I mean how can Lamborghini or Rolls =Royce claim to be making a car when they are doing it by hand? They =claim to keep tolerances close but come on! They don't even have =machines putting the panels on the bodies!. Cars were manufactured in the old days by assembly line workers who had =to make a living from producing them to survive. Making a car by hand is =an amateurs attempt and no serious car manufacture would ever attempt to=do it. Are they car makers? Sure, just as those who "write articles on the =internet" are writers. Hi I am Henry Ford weedwhacker is nickname, I know a lot about making cars, I = goodness sake. I developed the assembly line and I know how to make a = traditional way. I have looked at several car = I can not believe their claims. They say things like we make the best = make them one at a time. This gives the erroneous impression that hand = cars are better. I mean where do these guys at Lamborghini, Ferrari, = get off saying they make cars. I invented the car and if it is not made = then it is hardly a car but merely a sad attempt of a copy. Now a Model T is a car, great paint job = of the art in suspension. I mean come on...these guy claim to make a car = car is a Ford. Their cars are not made like a Ford, do not drive like a = what I have made. According to all the information about = Lamborghini or Rolls Royce claim to be making a car when they are doing = have machines putting the panels on the bodies!. Cars were manufactured in the old days= line workers who had to make a living from producing them to survive. = car by hand is an amateurs attempt and no serious car manufacture would = attempt to do it. Are they car makers? Sure, just as = Henry = from mrc@mars.plala.or.jp Tue Mar 26 00:25:48 2002 g2Q6Pl407005 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 00:25:47 -0600 id g2Q6Pk316905; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 15:25:46 +0900 (JST) id PAA26276; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 15:25:44 +0900 (JST) Subject: Re: straightening Timothy, does anyone use a cloths iron to straighten rod blanks you use steam? which setting do you use, polyester,cotton, wool or linen? timothy Clothes iron is very effective for straightening when your glued tip has atwist or doglegs.Since bamboo also comprises fibers, fibers can be stretched by clothes iron. run theiron on 6 flats in turn slowly, about 6 inches per second.It would work for mid section too but effect is less on butt section. lever after heating the portion especially. After running the iron on the tip section, sometimes tip remains a very slowcurve entire the section when its taper is not perfectly straight. In thatcase, it works sometimes for you to pull the blank under the sole of ironwhere you do not move iron. Repeat this for every flat. Do not use steam for a glued blank. The blank will get moisture back.Steamed iron may be used to straighten a strip before planing or heattreatment.It works better for thinner strips. Heat gun or alcohol lamp seems to befaster for this. There is such a way of getting dimples (beside a node) back to a flatsurface by using a clothes iron, for eigher of triangle strips or flatstips. It is sometimes usable if you do not want to burn the edge of atriangle strip before final planing. Prepare a round bar stock of metal, brass or nickel siver or whatever, withabout 0.8" diameter and about 4" long.Make three depths of V grooves on it by lathe (using male threading byte),one for butt, one for mid. and one for tip. Place the bar srock on a flattable and place a triangle strip with enamel side up in one of the grooves.Press the strip by clothes iron and move the iron back and forth until thestrip is get heated. You will get the dimple back to the flat surfacethough the entire strip is curved inside (pith side). You can straightenthe slow curve on the V groove of planing form lator. Iron works better for thinner strips! Max ========================================Max Satoh - Bamboo Fly Fishing Rod Makerhttp://maxrod.tripod.comMax Rod Craft - Online Shophttp://m-r- c.tripod.com======================================== from ajthramer@hotmail.com Tue Mar 26 00:58:33 2002 g2Q6wW407931 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 00:58:33 - Mon, 25 Mar 2002 22:58:27 -0800 Tue, 26 Mar 2002 06:58:27 GMT Subject: Re: rod article FILETIME=[A15D4590:01C1D493] At least it was brief. An unsigned article carries little weight with me but with the proliferation of internet 'legends' there must be quite a few who do not critically examine their source of information. Dickersons tapers were calculated at 5" intervals. Classic rods are far from uniform from one rod to another so the problem of not reproducing the taper 'exactly' is simply preposterous. Past that there is some truth in what he said. The amateurs have raised the bar of what is acceptable in a professional rod very high indeed. A good thing for the cane rod business I think. I think most of you know that I have chosen to build reasonably priced rods, I thought that the proverbial good 5 cent cigar would be a viable commodity. If you think that you can get away with building crap you are dead wrong. A high value /cost rod is made by employing efficient machinery where it won't downgrade the finished product, paying very close attention to the true value (not cost) of the components selected, standardization, carefully adhered to methods of production, lots of practice so there is no head scratching going on, ability to instantly discard what you are working on if there is an insurmoutable problem, and a rigidly adhered to production schedule including lots of overtime if needed. Some have dismissed my rods as junk due to the cost, they do that at their own peril. BUT, I don't do custom work, I prefer to deal through reputable dealers to limit the amount of 'phone down time' I have,and I don't do trade shows, retail shows or gatherings much. I just live to build rods. Still these whackos at the anglersonline site seem to have a pretty serious bug up their ass. I would check to see who their buddies and pals are to see who would have an axe to grind. The combination of poor journalism ethics and and a scared rodmaker whos time is coming to an end is a a stinking cauldron. In the end the rods will have to stand on their own merits, hyperbole and BS will only take you so far. A.J. From: "Bob Nunley" Subject: rod articleDate: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 18:22:15 -0600 Just thought some of you might be interested in the new article aboutrodmakers on FlyAnglers Online at www.flyanglersonline.com . You can findit on the front page of the site, entitled, "Traditional Rod Making?" Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com _________________________________________________________________Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com from avyoung@iinet.net.au Tue Mar 26 01:17:40 2002 g2Q7Hc408428 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 01:17:39 -0600 Subject: Re: an analogy of the FAOL article You forgot to mention Model T cars were built to go not stop, hence the lousy brakes.ALSO, when the good people at Ford discovered the rear axles NEVER brokein use they made them thinner and of a lesser grade of steel so they had wear and tear that matched the other parts of the car. No point in all those good axles on the scrap heap when nothing else was going though it must be said the Model T was the car of the times and does deserve recognition for that.Then there's the colour but that's such a hackneyed point it's hardly worth the mention.Yep, nothing like Mc Donalds style "stuff"Also, in just the same vein of people taking credit where it's not due it's wrong to credit Ford as the originators of the production line. The production line method was actually developed in the Northern states of the Civil War in the manufacture of rifles. Specifically gun stocks but the entire rifle in time though there is some argument a mob in the UK was doing something (can't remember what but it may have been wooden planes planing wood that is) at the same time and say they invented the production line of manufacture. Apparently it took about 8 minutes to make a regular style plane with the use of steam powered machinery, men cleaning up and finishers. TY At 10:22 PM 3/25/02 -0800, Adam Vigil wrote: Hi I am Henry Ford weedwhacker is my nickname, I know a lot about making cars, I invented them for goodness sake. I developed the assembly line and I know how to make a car in the traditional way. I have looked at several car manufactures websites. I can not believe their claims. They say things like we make the best car, we make them one at a time. This gives the erroneous impression that hand built cars are better. I mean where do these guys at Lamborghini, Ferrari, Rolls Royce get off saying they make cars. I invented the car and if it is not made my way then it is hardly a car but merely a sad attempt of a copy. Now a Model T is a car, great paint job and state of the art in suspension. I mean come on...these guy claim to make a car but a car is a Ford. Their cars are not made like a Ford, do not drive like a Ford and because of this they are not a good car, but merely a sad attempt to copy what I have made. According to all the information about car makers from greats like "ME" cars are made on an assembly line. I mean how can Lamborghini or Rolls Royce claim to be making a car when they are doing it by hand? They claim to keep tolerances close but come on! They don't even have machines putting the panels on the bodies!. Cars were manufactured in the old days by assembly line workers who hadto make a living from producing them to survive. Making a car by hand is an amateurs attempt and no serious car manufacture would ever attempt todo it. Are they car makers? Sure, just as those who "write articles on the internet" are writers. Henry Ford /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Forks Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from avyoung@iinet.net.au Tue Mar 26 01:20:08 2002 g2Q7K7408698 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 01:20:07 - rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Subject: Re: rod article Three cheers for AJ. TY At 06:58 AM 3/26/02 +0000, Allen Thramer wrote: At least it was brief. An unsigned article carries little weight with me but with the proliferation of internet 'legends' there must be quite a few who do not critically examine their source of information. Dickersons tapers were calculated at 5" intervals. Classic rods are far from uniform from one rod to another so the problem of not reproducing the taper 'exactly' is simply preposterous. Past that there is some truth in what he said. The amateurs have raised the bar of what is acceptable in a professional rod very high indeed. A good thing for the cane rod business I think. I think most of you know that I have chosen to build reasonably priced rods, I thought that the proverbial good 5 cent cigar would be a viable commodity. If you think that you can get away with building crap you are dead wrong. A high value /cost rod is made by employing efficient machinery where it won't downgrade the finished product, paying very close attention to the true value (not cost) of the components selected, standardization, carefully adhered to methods of production, lots of practice so there is no head scratching going on, ability to instantly discard what you are working on if there is an insurmoutable problem, and a rigidly adhered to production schedule including lots of overtime if needed. Some have dismissed my rods as junk due to the cost, they do that at their own peril. BUT, I don't do custom work, I prefer to deal through reputable dealers to limit the amount of 'phone down time' I have,and I don't do trade shows, retail shows or gatherings much. I just live to build rods. Still these whackos at the anglersonline site seem to have a pretty serious bug up their ass. I would check to see who their buddies and pals are to see who would have an axe to grind. The combination of poor journalism ethics and and a scared rodmaker whos time is coming toan end is a a stinking cauldron. In the end the rods will have to stand on their own merits, hyperbole and BS will only take you so far. A.J. From: "Bob Nunley" Subject: rod articleDate: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 18:22:15 -0600 Just thought some of you might be interested in the new article aboutrodmakers on FlyAnglers Online at www.flyanglersonline.com . You canfindit on the front page of the site, entitled, "Traditional Rod Making?" Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com _________________________________________________________________Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Forks Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from petermckean@netspace.net.au Tue Mar 26 04:51:18 2002 g2QApG411488 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 04:51:16 - g2QAnpw86792; Subject: Re: public interest in bamboo Hello, Tim Good point! We make a great thing about "natural" materials, don't we; but then we goahead and use the most unnatural peripherals. But I believe that the point is exactly that - the core material is stillnatural bamboo. You are able to vary the peripherals across a huge range ofmaterials, but you will still have a bamboo rod at the end. If you usehome- produced silk to bind, and hide glue to hold it all together, andfinish with tung oil hand rubbed; if you get really obsessive and ferrule itwith a bamboo ferrule, you will no doubt have a more idealogically purebamboo rod. But it is still a bamboo rod if it has nickel silver, nylon, andPU glues and varnish. On the other hand, you can keep up the purity of the peripherals all youwant, and it will never be a bamboo rod if you use anything else other thancane as a core material. Just look at all those hexagraphs, and WaltonPowell sort-of- hexagraphs. Same with the fishing thing - if the core activity is to interface withfish, you are fishing, even if you use a hand line of 120lb breaking strainon a yellow plastic soft drink bottle and heave it out there using a 4 ozsinker and a pilchard. If the core activity is to cast tight loops, and to put out 90 feet-plus offly line, with the possibility of contacting a fish coming down the prioritylist a way, then that is "casting". Neither is bad; neither inherently good. Nor are the two activitiesmutually exclusive. Cheers Peter from petermckean@netspace.net.au Tue Mar 26 05:00:11 2002 g2QB09411797 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 05:00:09 - g2QAxww89200; Subject: Re: rod article Bob Whacker by name, and whacker by nature! Peter from avyoung@iinet.net.au Tue Mar 26 05:41:55 2002 g2QBfr412465 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 05:41:54 - Subject: Re: public interest in bamboo I knew a rock climber who was later killed on Everest who always climbed with bare feet to be more in tune with nature. Considering he's still at 28,000 feet 15 years after his death I'd say he's achieved his intention even though to get where he still is he used Goretex clothing, nylon tents and plastic boots though he didn't use bottled oxygen.Hard as I appear in the above I was a very good friend of Fred's and we all knew the dangers of climbing, Fred lucked out on his 30th birthday. Nat Herresshoff the early 1900's boat builder used cutting edge technology to design hulls, boilers and any materials that would make a better boat while Francis Herresshoff 50 years on had only disdain for modern materials such as ply wood which he called laminated wood and fiber glass which he called "congealed snot".He harped long and hard about the modern price of labor and how when hewas a boy boat builders worked from 7am till 7pm week days then 7am till mid day and Sunday off and just how happy the workers were to get $5 per week problem with that as much as this idea that nothing modern is up to the standards of years gone by even when it's demonstratively better now. It's this attempt to hark back to the glory days that seems to cause confusion in people's minds with certain things, bamboo rods because they often can't determine just why they want one (apart from the wank value some are after).It's hard to draw the line in purity. Usually people refer to the past to try but that's pointless because people in the past used what ever was available as well.This is the same reason Reedwhacker harps on about the inaccuracies inherent in the use of forms when making rods originally made on mills and the good old days where every rod sold was bread in your mouth. He simply can't see times they have a changed while in many cases the rods built on forms to these tapers haven't, they just look nicer.Even if they aren't exact copies they're so good it's not an issue. It's for everybody to decide on where they stand. I'm more than happy to eschew synthetic fibers preferring to wear only cotton, wool and hemp for no other reason than I like to, though wearing hemp is a sort of meaningless stand against Du Pont and politics. I like wooden boats for the same reason I like to wear natural fibers.Bamboo rods have an action and certain magic pretty much regardless ofhow it's made. Knowing that is enough for me and I see no reason to try to justify my reasons beyond that.If others can't see it, so what? TY At 09:48 PM 3/26/02 +1100, Peter McKean wrote: Hello, Tim Good point! We make a great thing about "natural" materials, don't we; but then we goahead and use the most unnatural peripherals. But I believe that the point is exactly that - the core material is stillnatural bamboo. You are able to vary the peripherals across a huge range ofmaterials, but you will still have a bamboo rod at the end. If you usehome- produced silk to bind, and hide glue to hold it all together, andfinish with tung oil hand rubbed; if you get really obsessive and ferrule itwith a bamboo ferrule, you will no doubt have a more idealogically purebamboo rod. But it is still a bamboo rod if it has nickel silver, nylon, andPU glues and varnish. On the other hand, you can keep up the purity of the peripherals all youwant, and it will never be a bamboo rod if you use anything else other thancane as a core material. Just look at all those hexagraphs, and WaltonPowell sort-of- hexagraphs. Same with the fishing thing - if the core activity is to interface withfish, you are fishing, even if you use a hand line of 120lb breaking strainon a yellow plastic soft drink bottle and heave it out there using a 4 ozsinker and a pilchard. If the core activity is to cast tight loops, and to put out 90 feet-plus offly line, with the possibility of contacting a fish coming down the prioritylist a way, then that is "casting". Neither is bad; neither inherently good. Nor are the two activitiesmutually exclusive. Cheers Peter /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Forks Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from avyoung@iinet.net.au Tue Mar 26 06:00:18 2002 g2QC0G412825 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 06:00:17 - Subject: taper I hate to do this because it's actually rod related but has anybody out there ever made a PHY Brightwater. Doesn't matter if it was on a mill or planing form [:-)] What's it like as a rod and what sort of stream or style is it good for? Tony /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Forks Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from wendt@kingcrab.nrl.navy.mil Tue Mar 26 06:26:17 2002 g2QCQG413273 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 06:26:16 - g2QCQAdd017324 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 07:26:10 - Subject: Re: Knurls James, I haven't tried changing the wheels yet, but it looks like the axle is a press fit into the scissor jaws, and the wheels spin on the axle. I'm going to order a set of wheels that have the knurling going in the same direction, so I can experiment with the "poor" man's rope knurl. It kind of depends on the material as to what speed you run the lathe at. I haven't knurled anything harder than brass yet on my 7 x 12, so I've been spinning at about half speed on the low speed range, and on the brass it came out pretty nice. from what information I've gotten on the 7 x 10 mailing list, if you're going to knurl something that's longer than a couple of inches, you need to use the tail stock to support the piece, because the knurler can put quite a bit of side load on the bearings. The biggest difference between knurling and cutting on the lathe, is when you cut, you're removing the metal by slicing the metal away. When you knurl, you're actually "pushing" metal away from the knurling lines, and forcing the metal to flow into the valleys between the ridges. That's why it puts more pressure on the piece, and in turn, on the head stock's bearings. I've knurled two pieces so far with the scissors knurler, and I've set the gap between the wheels so that they ride on the upper and lower 1/3 of the piece ( it was 1 - 1/2" in diameter), then slowly moved the knurler into the piece, until it started knurling, then moved the compound to knurl the length that I wanted, then pushed it in a little more, and moved the compound backwards over the area I had just knurled. Repeated this until I got the correct depth of knurl that I wanted. Came out pretty nice. I made a clone of Russ Gooding's depth gauge base out of brass, and it came out pretty nice. Once I get the pictures developed, I'll scan them in here at work. Mark At 03:21 PM 3/25/2002 -0500, you wrote: I also purchased the same knurling tool from Little Machine Shop. I haven't tried it out yet (it looks good), but it was also not obvious to me how to change out the knurls. Have you successfully taken out the knurls and replaced them? Any advice would be appreciated. Also, what have you found to be the best way to use the tool -- slowing clamping down while the lathe is running at a slow speed, or some other method? Thanks From: Mark Wendt Subject: Re: KnurlsDate: Fri, 22 Mar 2002 12:15:24 -0500 Bill, I have the Homier 7 x 12 mini lathe. I purchased a scissorknurler from http://www.littlemachineshop.com and it works justfine. Ijust finished a depth gauge base, and used the knurler on it and itworkedvery nice. The knurling wheels are the standard size, so if youhave toreplace them, you can get them just about anywhere. This web siteisdedicated to the mini lathes and mini mills, and also stocks a lotofreplacement parts for most mini lathes and mini mills. Another question to the guys that are doing rope knurls ontheirstuff. What kind of tool are you using and where do you get it? Thanks,Mark from petr.pavel@medicon.cz Tue Mar 26 06:35:14 2002 g2QCZC413626 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 06:35:12 - for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 13:35:11+0100 (CET) for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 13:50:55+0100 (CET) Subject: Valspar and Minwax Hi all,my name is Peter Pavel, I am new to the list. I am writing from Czechia =(formerly Czechoslovakia), small country in the centre of Europe, famous = (for at least 50 years) dealing with bamboo rod building. I am the only =one (first one in this century). As I learned, the very best =polyurethane for split cane rods is Varathane and here in Czechia only =water-thinned poly is available. Well, so I went to Ft. Lauderdale, =Florida in January with an address of the Lowe=B4s store in my pocket. I =have received this info from oficial Flecto corp. internet webb pages. I =was surprised, gents in the store had no idea what Varathane would be, =they actualy had no Flecto produts. So I=B4ve bought Valspar =polyurethane and Minwax polyurethane. Should I throw them away? Have =you, guys, any experience with these laquers? Thank you for your reply.Peter Hi all,my name is Peter Pavel, I am new= I am writing from Czechia (formerly Czechoslovakia), small country in = noone in my country (for at least 50 years) dealing with bamboo rod = water-thinned poly is available. Well, so I went to Ft. Lauderdale, = January with an address of the Lowe=B4s store in my pocket. I have = info from oficial Flecto corp. internet webb pages. I was surprised, = the store had no idea what Varathane would be, they actualy had no = produts. So I=B4ve bought Valspar polyurethane and Minwax polyurethane. = laquers?Thank you for your =reply.Peter from bcombest@iclub.org Tue Mar 26 07:29:37 2002 g2QDTa414478 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 07:29:36 - ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 08:30:14 -0500 Subject: Reel Seat Mortise Good Morning, When cutting the mortise in the wood, what specific router bit is used? Bruce CombestBerea. Ky Good Morning,I have a question concerning the making= seat insert. When cutting the mortise in the wood, = router bit is used? Bruce CombestBerea. Ky from rcolo@ix.netcom.com Tue Mar 26 07:50:59 2002 g2QDox415244 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 07:50:59 - id 16prLh-00066a-00 for rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 08:50:54 -0500 Subject: article Hi Folks, An unsigned article on the internet has the weight of graphite10....(whenever they get to that number) Rich Colo from flyfish@gbronline.com Tue Mar 26 07:51:36 2002 g2QDpa415325 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 07:51:36 -0600 Subject: Re: an analogy of the FAOL article --------------E97FF3E5E9A6BD62CD2A70F8 Don't just suspect an "anonymous" author---FAOL is probably just as guilty of stirring the pot as Reedwhacker.I had a friend who did a book review for FAOL about two years ago. Ihad the opportunity to see what he had written, and then later read whatwas published on the website. About the only similarity I could see wasthat both were written about the same book. Beyond that, there waslittle--they took many statements, and in the cause of "editing",totally twisted statements to use the reviewer's name and his reputationto promote themselves. The only problem is that they didn't use hisarticle, only the title and his name.I think this is another example of FAOL simply trying to market to theyuppie snob crowd. I'm concerned the yuppies are on their way to ruinanother of my cherished activities--so far they've ruined truckownership and cigar smoking--all they've done is drive up prices so thatthey're out of reach for 90% of the population.I'm not defending anyone, but I would guess that FAOL took ReedWhacker'scomments, probably already antagonistic by themselves, and pushed themto the next level, simply for the purpose of sensationalizing. Lookwhat it's done for their hit count--I read it last night, and got backon again this morning, and that's two more times than I usually go totheir website. About the only thing I do with FAOL is registerperiodically for their drawings--I never have any illusion of winning,but the kid in me always hopes to.I have taken the symbolic step of erasing their URL from my bookmarks,though! done ranting for now-- Greg Adam Vigil wrote: Hi I am Henry Ford weedwhacker is my nickname, I know a lot aboutmaking cars, I invented them for goodness sake. I developed theassembly line and I know how to make a car in the traditional way. Ihave looked at several car manufactures websites. I can not believetheir claims. They say things like we make the best car, we make themone at a time. This gives the erroneous impression that hand builtcars are better. I mean where do these guys at Lamborghini, Ferrari,Rolls Royce get off saying they make cars. I invented the car and ifit is not made my way then it is hardly a car but merely a sad attemptof a copy. Now a Model T is a car, great paint job and state of theart in suspension. I mean come on...these guy claim to make a car buta car is a Ford. Their cars are not made like a Ford, do not drivelike a Ford and because of this they are not a good car, but merely asad attempt to copy what I have made. According to all theinformation about car makers from greats like "ME" cars are made on anassembly line. I mean how can Lamborghini or Rolls Royce claim to bemaking a car when they are doing it by hand? They claim to keeptolerances close but come on! They don't even have machines puttingthe panels on the bodies!. Cars were manufactured in the old days byassembly line workers who had to make a living from producing them tosurvive. Making a car by hand is an amateurs attempt and no seriouscar manufacture would ever attempt to do it. Are they car makers?Sure, just as those who "write articles on the internet" arewriters. Henry Ford --------------E97FF3E5E9A6BD62CD2A70F8 Don't just suspect an "anonymous" author---FAOL is probably just as guilty of stirring the pot as Reedwhacker.I had a friend who did a book review for FAOL about two years I had the opportunity to see what he had written, and then later read what was little--they took many statements, and in the cause of "editing", totallytwisted statements to use the reviewer's name and his reputation topromote only the title and his name. their way to ruin another of my cherished activities--so far they've ruinedtruck ownership and cigar smoking--all they've done is drive up pricesso that they're out of reach for 90% of the population.I'm not defending anyone, but I would guess that FAOL tookReedWhacker's Look what it's done for their hit count--I read it last night, and gotback on again this morning, and that's two more times than I usually goto their website. About the only thing I do with FAOL is register periodically me always hopes to.I have taken the symbolic step of erasing their URL from my bookmarks,though!done ranting for now--GregAdam Vigil wrote: Hi know a lot about making cars, I invented them for goodness sake. I developedthe assembly line and I know how to make a car in the traditional have looked at several car manufactures websites. I can not believe theirclaims. They say things like we make the best car, we make them one ata time. This gives the erroneous impression that hand built cars are better.I mean where do these guys at Lamborghini, Ferrari, Rolls Royce get offsaying they make cars. I invented the car and if it is not made my waythen it is hardly a car but merely a sad attempt of a a Model T is a car, great paint job and state of the art in suspension.I mean come on...these guy claim to make a car but a car is a Ford. Theircars are not made like a Ford, do not drive like a Ford and because of to all the information about car makers from greats like "ME" cars aremade on an assembly line. I mean how can Lamborghini or Rolls Royce claim keep tolerances close but come on! They don't even have machines putting were manufactured in the old days by assembly line workers who had tomakea living from producing them to survive. Making a car by hand is an amateursattempt and no serious car manufacture would ever attempt to do they car makers? Sure, just as those who "write articles on the internet" Ford --------------E97FF3E5E9A6BD62CD2A70F8-- from dmanders@telusplanet.net Tue Mar 26 07:59:10 2002 g2QDx9415811 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 07:59:09 -0600 (InterMail vM.5.01.04.01 201-253-122-122-101-20011014) with Subject: The Article Guys, Looks like Ackland - see his posting on the BB run by FlyAnglers. Campbelltrimmed weedwhacker's feathers a tad there. But what he says is not totally wrong. Most rod were built on mills by guysthat made their living from making rods. Most of the rest is crap. regards, Don ffff,0000,0000http://www.telusplanet.net/public/dmanders/index.html from rcurry@ttlc.net Tue Mar 26 08:22:14 2002 g2QEMD416812 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 08:22:13 - User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:0.9.4)Gecko/20011019 Netscape6/6.2 Subject: Rod article thread locked I am embarrassed by Deanna'a actions on FAOL. I always thought she was a person of integrity; however, when she printed an invidious article anonymously...and now she has locked the thread that arose in response... sad, very sad. I fear her recent success has overwhelmed her sense of propriety and fairplay.-- Best regards, Reed http://www.overmywaders.com/ >Frompatrick.w.coffey@boeing.com Tue Mar 26 08:26:40 2002 Received: from blv- g2QEQd417182 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) id ; Tue, 26 Mar 200206:26:32 - 0800 Message-ID:From: "Coffey, Patrick W" , Rod Makers List ServeSubject: RE: rod article - yellow journalism(should be called national fl y anglers enquirer online) Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 patrick.w.coffey@boeing.com Sender: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu X- Listprocessor-Version: 8.2.09/990901/11:28 -- ListProc(tm) by CREN righton the money Wayne!!! Patrick W. Coffey AOG Incident Repair Planning Phone:425-234-2901 Fax: 425-237-0083 M-2112 M/C 61-79 -----Original Message- yellow journalism (should be called national fl y anglers enquirer online) No theauthor wasn't a "Wind from The North" but rather someone that may havemore years of rod making under his belt than the average age of the grouphere - And he did reflect some of the atitudes that he may have had put inhis face over the years - but what I think is being misunderstood here is thatRon is really talking to one or two individuals - and as Raplh so wisely pointedout - the people the article was focused to are few and are of the kind thatwon't read it. What you are witnessing is a fact of life - a slice of human -the best explanation I can see here without going into details is - thedifference between a Hunter and the Sportsman - Ron was focusing hiscomments at the Hunters of rod making - and trust me Ron isn't the only onethat has seen this rare species in the rodmaking community over the years -Fortunately the species is rare > from lblan@provide.net Tue Mar 26 g2QEY3417704 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 ) by provide.net (CommuniGate Pro WebUser 3.5.2) withHTTP id 16086217; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 09:34:02 -0500 From: rcurry@ttlc.net, rod ,publisher@flyanglersonline.com X-Mailer: CommuniGate Pro Web Mailer v.3.5.2 I am embarrassed by Deanna'a actions on FAOL. I alwaysthought she was a person of integrity; however, when sheprinted an invidious article anonymously...and now shehas locked the thread that arose in response... sad,very sad. I fear her recent success has overwhelmed her sense ofpropriety and fairplay.-- Best regards,Reedhttp://www.overmywaders.com/ from pvansch@wethersfield.k12.ct.us Tue Mar 26 08:34:23 2002 g2QEYN417749 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 08:34:23 - Subject: RE: rod article Organization: Wethersfield Public Schools Reedwhacker must be shoulderless the chip is so big! I read on a daily basis what you all have to share, in my opinion, therodmakers of today are just doing something they love to do , want todo, therefore they share their knowledge here on this list, pass alongthis information to future rodmakers in the interest of keeping a"traditional" craft alive. Keep up the good work and don't let a foolish article like this bringyou down. I for one, would rather purchase a rod from someone who lovedwhat they are doing, rather than from someone trying to make rich at it. Peter -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: rod article At least it was brief. An unsigned article carries little weight with mebut with the proliferation of internet 'legends' there must be quite a fewwho do not critically examine their source of information. Dickersons tapers were calculated at 5" intervals. Classic rods are far from uniform fromone rod to another so the problem of not reproducing the taper 'exactly' is simply preposterous. Past that there is some truth in what he said. The amateurs have raised the bar of what is acceptable in a professional rod very high indeed. A good thing for the cane rod business I think. Ithink most of you know that I have chosen to build reasonably priced rods, I thought that the proverbial good 5 cent cigar would be a viablecommodity. If you think that you can get away with building crap you are deadwrong. A high value /cost rod is made by employing efficient machinery where itwon't downgrade the finished product, paying very close attention to the true value (not cost) of the components selected, standardization, carefully adhered to methods of production, lots of practice so there is no head scratching going on, ability to instantly discard what you are workingon if there is an insurmoutable problem, and a rigidly adhered to production schedule including lots of overtime if needed. Some have dismissed myrods as junk due to the cost, they do that at their own peril. BUT, I don'tdo custom work, I prefer to deal through reputable dealers to limit theamount of 'phone down time' I have,and I don't do trade shows, retail shows or gatherings much. I just live to build rods. Still these whackos at the anglersonline site seem to have a pretty serious bug up their ass. Iwould check to see who their buddies and pals are to see who would have an axeto grind. The combination of poor journalism ethics and and a scaredrodmaker whos time is coming to an end is a a stinking cauldron. In the end the rods will have to stand on their own merits, hyperboleand BS will only take you so far. A.J. From: "Bob Nunley" Subject: rod articleDate: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 18:22:15 -0600 Just thought some of you might be interested in the new article about rodmakers on FlyAnglers Online at www.flyanglersonline.com . You can find it on the front page of the site, entitled, "Traditional Rod Making?" Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com _________________________________________________________________Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com from bob@downandacross.com Tue Mar 26 08:46:09 2002 g2QEk8418619 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 08:46:08 - Subject: RE: Rod article thread locked Reed:I agree with you completely. Look at the BB and the Rodmakers section.Checkout the thread "A little bamboo engineering." Is the purpose of FAOL to kissup to Ron Kusse? I am telling you, Lady Fisher is out to discredit everybodybut QC. It is sad. If you recall the Global Flyfisher article about theirCast-In, you very well could even get the impression that QC is Reedwhacker.That would be an even sadder affair.If she doesn't see it as being bad journalism to print articles with strongbiases and no byline, then she is wrong. Maybe the guys who sponsor FAOLandare supported by "hand- planers" need to be made aware of the unfairtreatment. I recall Deanna asking Harry, myself, and others to sponsor FAOLa few weeks back. Maybe we should have. Now we are under attack.Best regards,Bob PS., I am sure this list is under watch as well. -----Original Message----- Subject: Rod article thread locked I am embarrassed by Deanna'a actions on FAOL. from tausfeld@frontiernet.net Tue Mar 26 08:58:42 2002 g2QEwg419387 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 08:58:42 - 0000 sender ) Subject: Re: Rod article thread locked I don't go to the FAOL often. But from what I have read, I'm not impressed.She comes off as a jerk, attacking instead of condescendingly (if thats evena word) trying to make her point. I did notice that this month's sponser was Redington. I bet she gets morefree rods from plastic makers than bamboo makers... The threadlock was absolutely uncalled for, unless of course she realizedher true colors showed through. I have lost all respect for her and theFAOL. I go to the site now out of morbid curiosity, as in " What BS do they havethe gall to write now?" tom from Harris.James@ev.state.az.us Tue Mar 26 08:59:44 2002 g2QExi419577 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 08:59:44 - g2QEuLH18709 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 07:56:21 -0700 07:57:46 2002 -0700 with Novell_GroupWise; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 07:59:37 -0700 Subject: Re: Knurls g2QExi419578 Mark, Try opening the gap between your rollers to the point where they justsqueeze your work. Back it off and close the gap just slightly more. Turn onthe lathe and push the rollers into the work slowly to the point where thewheels are riding at top and bottom. Not on the sides. This takes all thepressure off your bearings because the forces are apposing and you won'tneed the tail stock unless your knurling something long. This is the beauty ofthe scissor knurl. Now, slowly move the rollers across the surface to theend. At this point you probably don't have the full depth of the knurl so pullthe knurl back off the work and go over it again in the same direction, onlythis time close the gap between the rollers slightly more. Repeat until yourhappy. JimH When you knurl, you're actually "pushing" metal away from the knurling lines, and forcing the metal to flow into the valleys between the ridges. That's why it puts more pressure on the piece, and in turn, on the head stock's bearings. I've knurled two pieces so far with the scissors knurler, and I've set the gap between the wheels so that they ride on the upper and lower 1/3 of the piece ( it was 1 - 1/2" in diameter), then slowly moved the knurler into the piece, until it started knurling, then moved the compound to knurl the length that I wanted, then pushed it in a little more, and moved the compound backwards over the area I had just knurled. from baconrod@gsmrinc.com Tue Mar 26 09:00:23 2002 g2QF0M419707 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 09:00:22 -0600 0000 Subject: Re: Rod article thread locked Reed and OthersThe problem that I have with the article is the inaccuracy of thestatement that the bevelers used by the rodmakers were set at every Threeinches. What a lie, the steel patterns were cut every inch. I measured andhave the original steel patterns for both Leonard and Payne and both was cutto 4 place .0000" every inch. I agree that hand planing can't duplicate thebeveler pattern inch for inch, So what. Hand planing comes Darn close.Best Hal Bacon----- Original Message ----- Subject: Rod article thread locked I am embarrassed by Deanna'a actions on FAOL. I always thought she was aperson of integrity; however, when she printed an invidious articleanonymously...and now she has locked the thread that arose inresponse... sad, very sad. I fear her recent success has overwhelmed her sense of propriety andfairplay.--Best regards,Reedhttp://www.overmywaders.com/ from tausfeld@frontiernet.net Tue Mar 26 09:09:17 2002 g2QF9G420551 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 09:09:16 - 0000 sender ) Subject: Re: Rod article thread locked opps,,,She comes off as a jerk, attacking instead of condescendingly (if thatseven a word) trying to make her point. Should've said:She comes off as a condescending jerk, attacking instead of nicely trying tomake her point.sorrytom ----- Original Message -----From: Jill and Tom Ausfeld Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2002 9:59 AMSubject: Re: Rod article thread locked I don't go to the FAOL often. But from what I have read, I'm not impressed. She comes off as a jerk, attacking instead of condescendingly (if thats even a word) trying to make her point. I did notice that this month's sponser was Redington. I bet she gets more free rods from plastic makers than bamboo makers... The threadlock was absolutely uncalled for, unless of course she realized her true colors showed through. I have lost all respect for her and theFAOL. I go to the site now out of morbid curiosity, as in " What BS do they have the gall to write now?" tom from atlasc1@earthlink.net Tue Mar 26 09:15:59 2002 g2QFFw421053 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 09:15:58 -0600 ([209.179.146.143] helo=computer) id 16psfr-00003y-00; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 07:15:48 -0800 Subject: Re: Rod article thread locked Hal, You know what? Coming from you that statement carries some weight. Adam Vigil "I agree that hand planing can't duplicate thebeveler pattern inch for inch, So what. Hand planing comes Darn close."Best Hal Bacon from bamboorules@ns.sympatico.ca Tue Mar 26 09:16:20 2002 g2QFGJ421144 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 09:16:19 - Tue, 26 Mar 2002 11:18:11 -0400 Organization: New Scotland Fly Rods rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Re: rod article Did I miss something??? What article????Shawn Tony Young wrote: Three cheers for AJ. TY At 06:58 AM 3/26/02 +0000, Allen Thramer wrote: At least it was brief. An unsigned article carries little weight with mebut with the proliferation of internet 'legends' there must be quite a fewwho do not critically examine their source of information. Dickersonstapers were calculated at 5" intervals. Classic rods are far from uniform from one rod to another so the problem of not reproducing the taper 'exactly' is simply preposterous. Past that there is some truth in what hesaid. The amateurs have raised the bar of what is acceptable in aprofessional rod very high indeed. A good thing for the cane rod businessI think. I think most of you know that I have chosen to build reasonablypriced rods, I thought that the proverbial good 5 cent cigar would be aviable commodity. If you think that you can get away with building crapyou are dead wrong. A high value /cost rod is made by employing efficientmachinery where it won't downgrade the finished product, paying verycloseattention to the true value (not cost) of the components selected,standardization, carefully adhered to methods of production, lots ofpractice so there is no head scratching going on, ability to instantlydiscard what you are working on if there is an insurmoutable problem, anda rigidly adhered to production schedule including lots of overtime ifneeded. Some have dismissed my rods as junk due to the cost, they dothatat their own peril. BUT, I don't do custom work, I prefer to deal throughreputable dealers to limit the amount of 'phone down time' I have,and Idon't do trade shows, retail shows or gatherings much. I just live tobuild rods. Still these whackos at the anglersonline site seem to have apretty serious bug up their ass. I would check to see who their buddiesand pals are to see who would have an axe to grind. The combination ofpoor journalism ethics and and a scared rodmaker whos time is coming toanend is a a stinking cauldron. In the end the rods will have to stand on their own merits, hyperbole andBS will only take you so far. A.J. From: "Bob Nunley" Subject: rod articleDate: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 18:22:15 -0600 Just thought some of you might be interested in the new article aboutrodmakers on FlyAnglers Online at www.flyanglersonline.com . You canfindit on the front page of the site, entitled, "Traditional Rod Making?" Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com _________________________________________________________________Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Forks Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from cathcreek@hotmail.com Tue Mar 26 09:43:13 2002 g2QFhC422805 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 09:43:12 - Tue, 26 Mar 2002 07:43:03 -0800 Tue, 26 Mar 2002 15:43:02 GMT Subject: Re: Rod article thread locked FILETIME=[EA5CD2D0:01C1D4DC] At least you guys aren't arrogant and attacking Ron Kusse and Bob Sommersas I clearly did. Man, now I see why I don't normally look at those sites! She ignored the points I was trying to make and focused on my little closing which I thought was harmless. I would never in a millions years attack another rodmakers work! I have never seen Kusse's or Sommers' rods, let alone suggest that I am better than them. I was trying to make that point when the thread was locked. OK, after all that (actually a little before it), I was considering a roughing beveller from JW rods. Any of you have experience with one of his? Thanks and I hope I didn't offend anyone on that crazy site. I was trying to make a point, but it appears to have been lost along the way. Rob Clarke From: "Jill and Tom Ausfeld" Subject: Re: Rod article thread lockedDate: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 10:10:02 - 0500 opps,,,She comes off as a jerk, attacking instead of condescendingly (if thatseven a word) trying to make her point. Should've said:She comes off as a condescending jerk, attacking instead of nicely trying tomake her point.sorrytom ----- Original Message -----From: Jill and Tom Ausfeld Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2002 9:59 AMSubject: Re: Rod article thread locked I don't go to the FAOL often. But from what I have read, I'm not impressed. She comes off as a jerk, attacking instead of condescendingly (if thats even a word) trying to make her point. I did notice that this month's sponser was Redington. I bet she gets more free rods from plastic makers than bamboo makers... The threadlock was absolutely uncalled for, unless of course she realized her true colors showed through. I have lost all respect for her and the FAOL. I go to the site now out of morbid curiosity, as in " What BS do they have the gall to write now?" tom _________________________________________________________________Join the world's largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com from ldboyko@cpinternet.com Tue Mar 26 09:56:34 2002 g2QFuX423838 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 09:56:33 - g2QFtJpC016011 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 09:55:25 - Subject: bamboo help... Starting to final plane me strips, and have decided to go with Epon, won =the rofmakers web site, it lists Shell Epon Epoxy, Epon Resin 828 and =also one other, I believe all are sold by Stephenson co. Help me with =this one, just what should I order having never used this before, I =believe the epoxy and resen 828, Also the last few days on the list guys =are complaining they are not getting the same results with what they are =using now compared to some ordered earlier. I have decided on Epdon due =to the working time, so just the correct product to order and from =whom... thanks Lew ldboyko@cpinternet.com Starting to final plane me strips, and = to go with Epon, won the rofmakers web site, it lists Shell = Epon Resin 828 and also one other, I believe all are sold by Stephenson = me with this one, just what should I order having never used this = believe the epoxy and resen 828, Also the last few days on the list guys = complaining they are not getting the same results with what they are = compared to some ordered earlier. I have decided on Epdon due to the = from pvansch@wethersfield.k12.ct.us Tue Mar 26 10:02:17 2002 g2QG1x424350 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 10:01:59 - Subject: Article on FAOL Organization: Wethersfield Public Schools I think I figured out the author - Reedwhacker Bob Nunley posted an Email back on 3/1 - Tradition in Rodmakingsnip; Start with a cage containing five monkeys. Inside the cage,hang abanana on a string and place a set of stairs under it. Before long, amonkey will go to the stairs and start to climb towards the banana. Assoon as he touches the stairs, spray all of the other monkeys with coldwater. I think the first monkey removed had enough intelligence to write! The "handle" Reedwhacker should say enough about the integrity of thewriter, the name would imply (and be condescending to ones' self) thatthis person does not know "rodmaking" I enjoy the knowledge and wisdom of this list - Keep it up. Peter from Eastkoyfly@aol.com Tue Mar 26 10:17:10 2002 g2QGH9425412 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 10:17:09 - Subject: Re: Rod article thread locked Who was it that said rodmaking is not a brutal back stabbing business? How long do you have to make rods to be respected or should I say how many rods do you have to make. I am sickened over this and I take it as a direct insult on me and my family. I have been making rods FULL TIME PROFESSIONALLY almost three years, I say WE on my web site (in serious need of upgrade) because it is a joint effort and my whole family is involved, it is not easy and I am not rich. My kids still need the things everybody else's kids need. I try not to toot my own horn, but I am very proud of my and my wife's work. There are people from all around the world that own and fish with OUR RODS and WE have many repeat clients, I have never slammed any ones work forOUR personal gain, financial or other wise. I made my post on FAOL to purchase one Reedwhackers rod, and if he answers my post I WILL PURCHASE ONE, Iwould like to see what all the self centered glory is about. I do not post to hammer people down. But maybe it is time to play hardball with some folks. I think I already know were to get one of Reedwackers rods. I work withbamboo 7 days a week and will not let my hard work and determination be judged by someone that will not sign there name on an article. Also If anyone can show me 5 rods of the same make and model from the Golden AGE of bamboo thatwere made on mills and measure out the same+/- .002 I will donate a rod to your favorite conservation charity. I am not slamming mills I would love to have one, it would be a tremendous relief on my body, all that planing, sanding does take a toll. Also all this talk of 5" centers that is about the most irrelevant claim I have heard yet! I have one set of forms on 2 1/2 " centers so I guess I can make a dickerson more of a dickerson than the man himself. Like I said I am not slamming mills but the argument always falls on which method is better, I don't think there should be an argument at all if there are NO GLUE LINES VISIBLE and the angles are reasonably accuratethen the outcome is the same. As A.J has said the bar has risen and some will not rise to it. All the best to all of you. Joseph A. Perrigowww.geneseevalleyrods.com5733 Griffith Rd.Portageville,NY 14536585-493-2637 from KlingB@health.missouri.edu Tue Mar 26 10:22:59 2002 g2QGMw426078 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 10:22:59 - Tue, 26 Mar 2002 10:22:50 -0600 content-class: urn:content-classes:message Subject: RE: rod article Thread-Topic: rod articleThread-Index: AcHUk9aRfgpGtTosSlyqt6L+jyLRGwAThpMA FILETIME=[7904A710:01C1D4E2] g2QGMx426081 As usual that's a very good point, AJ. Aside from that, the worst part of thearticle was that last line claiming "cosmetics has replaced performance." While rodmakers vary a great deal regarding the balance between a rod as aperfected object and a rod as a fishing tool (there's room in my world forboth views), the idea that current rods look good but perform poorly isridiculous. It is, however, a blessing to have incompetent opponents. Barry-----Original Message----- Subject: Re: rod article At least it was brief. An unsigned article carries little weight with me but with the proliferation of internet 'legends' there must be quite a few who do not critically examine their source of information. Dickersons tapers were calculated at 5" intervals. from caneman@clnk.com Tue Mar 26 10:25:01 2002 g2QGP0426417 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 10:25:00 - (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35) Subject: Re: Valspar and Minwax Peter,First, welcome to the list. Glad to have a newcomer on board.As for the varnishes, I use Varmor R-10 and can only get it through =Sherwin Williams Paint stores here. I've never seen it at a Lowe's or =any other of the big chain stores. Now, I can't advise you on =Varathane, but I have tried Minwax in the past and it definitely makes a =good varnish. Maybe others on the list have tried Varthane for =finishing a rod and can advise you on that. Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com Subject: Valspar and Minwax Hi all,my name is Peter Pavel, I am new to the list. I am writing from =Czechia (formerly Czechoslovakia), small country in the centre of =Europe, famous for its good hockey players and best beer. There is =noone in my country (for at least 50 years) dealing with bamboo rod =building. I am the only one (first one in this century). As I learned, =the very best polyurethane for split cane rods is Varathane and here in =Czechia only water-thinned poly is available. Well, so I went to Ft. =Lauderdale, Florida in January with an address of the Lowe=B4s store in =my pocket. I have received this info from oficial Flecto corp. internet =webb pages. I was surprised, gents in the store had no idea what =Varathane would be, they actualy had no Flecto produts. So I=B4ve bought =Valspar polyurethane and Minwax polyurethane. Should I throw them away? =Have you, guys, any experience with these laquers?Thank you for your reply.Peter Peter, Glad to have a newcomer on board. use = R-10 and can only get it through Sherwin Williams Paint stores = can't advise you on Varathane, but I have tried Minwax in the past and = Varthane for finishing a rod and can advise you on that. Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com ----- Original Message ----- Pavel Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2002 = AMSubject: Valspar and =Minwax Hi all,my name is Peter Pavel, I am new= list. I am writing from Czechia (formerly Czechoslovakia), small = the centre of Europe, famous for its good hockey players and best = There is noone in my country (for at least 50 years) dealing with = the very best polyurethane for split cane rods is Varathane and here = Lauderdale, Florida in January with an address of the Lowe=B4s store = pocket. I have received this info from oficial Flecto corp. internet = pages. I was surprised, gents in the store had no idea what Varathane = be, they actualy had no Flecto produts. So I=B4ve bought Valspar = experience with these laquers?Thank you for your =reply.Peter from KlingB@health.missouri.edu Tue Mar 26 10:26:10 2002 g2QGQ9426633 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 10:26:09 - Tue, 26 Mar 2002 10:26:04 -0600 content-class: urn:content-classes:message Subject: RE: Valspar and Minwax Thread-Topic: Valspar and MinwaxThread-Index: AcHUwtG/5ZfALDMbTUmme3JNH8P4UAAH+m/Q FILETIME=[ECC8E210:01C1D4E2] Welcome to the list, Peter! I've used Minwax Polyurethane Spar Varnish and had good results, both on =the wraps and on the rest of the rod. In general Minwax is a pretty good =brand. Barry Kling -----Original Message----- Subject: Valspar and Minwax Hi all,my name is Peter Pavel, I am new to the list. I am writing from Czechia =(formerly Czechoslovakia), small country in the centre of Europe, famous = (for at least 50 years) dealing with bamboo rod building. I am the only =one (first one in this century). As I learned, the very best = polyurethane for split cane rods is Varathane and here in Czechia only =water-thinned poly is available. Well, so I went to Ft. Lauderdale, =Florida in January with an address of the Lowe=B4s store in my pocket. I =have received this info from oficial Flecto corp. internet webb pages. I =was surprised, gents in the store had no idea what Varathane would be, =they actualy had no Flecto produts. So I=B4ve bought Valspar =polyurethane and Minwax polyurethane. Should I throw them away? Have =you, guys, any experience with these laquers?Thank you for your reply.Peter 0DocumentEmail We=lcome tothe list, Peter! I&=#8217;ve usedMinwax Polyurethane Spar Varnish and had good results, both on the wraps =and onthe rest of the rod. In general Minwax is a pretty good =brand. Ba=rry Kling -----OriginalMessage-----From: Petr Pavel Sent: Tuesday, March 26,=2002 6:34AM rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Valspar and =Minwax Hi all, my name is Peter Pavel, I am new to the list. I am writing =fromCzechia (formerly Czechoslovakia), small country in the centre of =Europe, in mycountry (for at least 50 years) dealing with bamboo rod building. I am =the only polyurethane water-thinnedpoly is available. Well, so I went to Ft. Lauderdale, Florida in January =withan address of the Lowe=B4s store in my pocket. I have received this info =fromoficial Flecto corp. internet webb pages. I was surprised, gents in the =storehad no idea what Varathane would be, they actualy had no Flecto produts. =So I=B4vebought Valspar polyurethane and Minwax polyurethane. Should I throw them = Have you, guys, any experience with these laquers? Thank you for your reply. Peter from TSmithwick@aol.com Tue Mar 26 10:39:20 2002 g2QGdJ427749 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 10:39:19 - for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 11:39:05 - 0326113905; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 11:39:05 -0500 Subject: FAOL thread locked I'm sure the other "Gray hairs" on the list remember long time Speaker ofthe House of Representatives Sam Rayburn, a political master if there everwas one. I believe I am correctly quoting one of his adages:'Never get into a spraying contest with a skunk."That seems to be especially true if the skunk gets to define the rules ofengagement. from harms1@pa.net Tue Mar 26 10:43:14 2002 g2QGhD428167 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 10:43:13 -0600 Subject: Re: Rod article thread locked Hal, The argument that champions exact replication is specious anyway, asanyonewho has mic'd rods by the old masters knows that even their OWN rods donotexcactly duplicate one another. Whether we measure in 1, 3, 5 or 6 inchincrements, at some point along the length, no two rods of the same modelagree within even O .003." And the flat-to flat measurements of each rod will vary by at least as much.Which flat should one choose as revealing the "true" half-dimension to whichthe mill was set? Of course, what we do is to average the three readings,but in doing so, out the window goes Reed Wanker's case for "exactness." The old masters couldn't "exactly" duplicate even their own tapers, if weare to take Reed Wanker's definition of the term at face value. Moreover,why should one assume that only the tapers by the old masters areworthy--even if one COULD exactly duplicate them? Is the measure of a goodrod maker that he can duplicate another maker's work? I mean, the issue isalmost too silly to discuss! The article is rife with absurdities, and the editor should be ashamed ofherself. Cheers, Bill ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Rod article thread locked Reed and OthersThe problem that I have with the article is the inaccuracy of thestatement that the bevelers used by the rodmakers were set at everyThreeinches. What a lie, the steel patterns were cut every inch. I measured andhave the original steel patterns for both Leonard and Payne and both was cut to 4 place .0000" every inch. I agree that hand planing can't duplicate the beveler pattern inch for inch, So what. Hand planing comes Darn close.Best Hal Bacon----- Original Message -----From: "Reed Curry" Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2002 9:27 AMSubject: Rod article thread locked I am embarrassed by Deanna'a actions on FAOL. I always thought she wasaperson of integrity; however, when she printed an invidious articleanonymously...and now she has locked the thread that arose inresponse... sad, very sad. I fear her recent success has overwhelmed her sense of propriety andfairplay.--Best regards,Reedhttp://www.overmywaders.com/ from Grhghlndr@aol.com Tue Mar 26 10:57:57 2002 g2QGvv429256 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 10:57:57 -0600 Subject: Re: Rod article thread locked First and foremost. Why even worry at all what was written in this article and the site in which it came from. I for one do not put much precedence in anything I ever read on that site and as a matter of fact that is the first time in forever that I have even looked at it. If the author didn't have enough balls to sign his name and if the webmaster didn't have enough moral conviction to #1 not put this on and #2 to have blocked any and allresponses to it I don't think it is worth our time and effort. Why oh why do you guys even worry about people such as this. Heck I know some of the more well known guys out there who have no more respect for the guys that handplane than they do for anyone trying to make a little money at this. I have been privy to conversations with some of these guys who think handplaners are s- -t. And I see so many of us that just continue to suck up to them all the time. Quit worrying about people like this and get back to matters at hand. I don't like some of the guys who have been around for years because of this fact but I still respect them for what they make and what they are trying to do. Oh yeh and you know what I know some of them don't like me as well.Cest le vie!!!!!!Bret http://bretsovens.bravepages.com/ First and in anything I ever read on that site and as a matter of fact that is the first enough balls to sign his name and if the webmaster didn't have enough moralconviction to #1 not put this on and #2 to have blocked any and all some of the more well known guys out there who have no more respect forthe guys that hand plane than they do for anyone trying to make a little continue to suck up to them all the t! because of this fact but I still respect them for what they make and what don't like me as well. Cest le vie!!!!!!Bret http://bretsovens.bravepages.com/ from jvswan@earthlink.net Tue Mar 26 10:59:22 2002 g2QGxL429372 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 10:59:21 - (216.160.236.98) User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/9.0.1.3108 Subject: Swedish (OFF TOPIC-apologies) Do any of our list members speak Swedish? I have managed to get on someSwedish email list (at least I think it is Swedish, their website ishttp://www.pcfynd.se/) for what looks to be electronic equipment. I don'tknow how to get myself off. Can anyone help me? I would sincerely appreciate it. Jason from rextutor@yahoo.com Tue Mar 26 11:06:38 2002 g2QH6a400155 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 11:06:36 - 26 Mar 2002 09:06:35 PST Subject: RE: Valspar and Minwax Petr I think you will like the Minwax Polyurethane SparVarnish . I thin it with mineral spirits . I haverestored over 60 rods and built 18 mostly using clearor satin types. It keeps the water off , looks nice.Good luck --- "Kling, Barry W." wrote: Welcome to the list, Peter!I've used Minwax Polyurethane Spar Varnish and hadgood results, both on the wraps and on the rest ofthe rod. In general Minwax is a pretty good brand.Barry Kling-----Original Message----- Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2002 6:34 AM Subject: Valspar and MinwaxHi all,my name is Peter Pavel, I am new to the list. I amwriting from Czechia (formerly Czechoslovakia),small country in the centre of Europe, famous forits good hockey players and best beer. There isnoone in my country (for at least 50 years) dealingwith bamboo rod building. I am the only one (firstone in this century). As I learned, the very bestpolyurethane for split cane rods is Varathane andhere in Czechia only water-thinned poly isavailable. Well, so I went to Ft. Lauderdale,Florida in January with an address of the Lowe'sstore in my pocket. I have received this info fromoficial Flecto corp. internet webb pages. I wassurprised, gents in the store had no idea whatVarathane would be, they actualy had no Flectoproduts. So I've bought Valspar polyurethane andMinwax polyurethane. Should I throw them away? Haveyou, guys, any experience with these laquers?Thank you for your reply.Peter __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Movies - coverage of the 74th Academy Awardshttp://movies.yahoo.com/ from gjm80301@yahoo.com Tue Mar 26 11:21:11 2002 g2QHLA401512 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 11:21:11 - Tue, 26 Mar 2002 09:21:10 PST Subject: Re: rod article This article falls short in a number of areas. Too bad that thethread was closed, since the immediate reaction by any of us would bepartially emotional, and not our best. Clearly, the article is internally inconsistent on the traditionalstanding of planing versus milling. In paragraph two, it states that"all rodmakers......used bevellers or mills". In paragraph three,the author then refers to old-time hand-planers. OK, which is it? Well, it seems to be both. Both sides can safely claim to betraditional. On the taper replication issue, there is room for debate. I feelcomfortable that the better contemporary makers can replicate theaction of the production company tapers, even if they don't set theforms or mill at each inch. In fact, I'll bet that the rods are moreconsistent from one to the next. We have bantered about the labelingissue here before and have proven that there is room for discussion. I agree with his statement about mnay non-professional rodmakerstoday being afforded the luxury of time. However, I don't believethat the point advances the argument that the rods made with thatluxury are in any way inferior. It is in the last two, totally unsupported sentences that the articlefalls apart and, no doubt, raised teh most hackles. While the bar oncosmetics has clearly been raised, that does not mean that the samerods are not exceptioanl fishing tools. The last sentence is atotally gratuitous slam and should never have been published. Jerry --- Bob Nunley wrote: Just thought some of you might be interested in the new articleaboutrodmakers on FlyAnglers Online at www.flyanglersonline.com . Youcan findit on the front page of the site, entitled, "Traditional RodMaking?" Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Movies - coverage of the 74th Academy Awardshttp://movies.yahoo.com/ from KyleDruey@aol.com Tue Mar 26 11:21:37 2002 g2QHLb401609 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 11:21:37 - for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 12:21:15 - 0326122115; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 12:21:15 -0500 Subject: Casting a Para 15 Hi List, I need some advice on casting a Para 15, for which I am only able to castabout 40’. I am not a very good caster, and wouldn’t be ableto recognize a double haul from a U-Haul trailer, but I was under theimpression that somehow a Para 15 can handle 80’ of line in the airwith relative ease. Distance casting isn’t a priority for me, but I justwant to know if there is something wrong with this rod or if it is just thecaster. About the rod: it is the second rod I have completed, and the taper wasslimmed down a bit so it would handle a 5 wt line. It can cast a 5wt up close,and to about 30’-35’ with relative ease... but that’sabout it. I can’t really get much more out of it. Am I doingsomething wrong... not doing something I should be doing... or is the rod justdoing what it should be doing based on my limited casting skills? I am going from a Sage 9’ 5wt to bamboo, and was never really able to getmore than 50’ out of my plastic rod with my casting abilities. Overall I am pleased with the rod, although I am not sure yet if it is going tobe on my preferred taper list. It is fun to cast and casts very smooth. Itfeels like its not going to have much power because it is so much slower thanmy plastic rod, but you can feel the rod respond positively as it loads. A bigdifference I have noticed is the weight! This is an 8’ 3 piece rod andit feels much heavier than my 9’ plastic rod. I think I am going tolook in to hollow fluting. Any ideas on how to make a hollow fluting jig for arouter based, Medved style, roughing beveler? List, you are terrific, thanks again to all of you for your help in getting methis far. Kyle from ctcaneman@yahoo.com Tue Mar 26 11:26:53 2002 g2QHQr402297 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 11:26:53 - Tue, 26 Mar 2002 09:26:52 PST Subject: Reedwhacker if you are out there! Reed Whacker, I just finished my first rod and it sucks, can yousell me one cheaper than people one the the list byopening day in CT April 20? If so, contact me offlist. Thanks, Paul __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Movies - coverage of the 74th Academy Awardshttp://movies.yahoo.com/ from KyleDruey@aol.com Tue Mar 26 11:41:25 2002 g2QHfP403837 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 11:41:25 - for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 12:41:11 - MAILINID102-0326124111; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 12:41:11 -0500 Subject: try again - Re: Casting a Para 15 sorry folks, let me try this again, my pathetic aol email client doesn't likecertain characters... Hi List, I need some advice on casting a Para 15, for which I am only able to castabout 40 ft. I am not a very good caster, and wouldnt be able to recognize adouble haul from a U-Haul trailer, but I was under the impression thatsomehow a Para 15 can handle 80 ft of line in the air with relative ease. Distance casting isnt a priority for me, but I just want to know if there issomething wrong with this rod or if it is just the caster. About the rod: it is the second rod I have completed, and the taper wasslimmed down a bit so it would handle a 5 wt line. It can cast a 5wt up close,and to about 30ft - 35ft with relative ease... but thats about it. I cant reallyget much more out of it. Am I doing something wrong... not doing somethingI should be doing... or is the rod just doing what it should be doing based onmy limited casting skills? I am going from a Sage 9ft 5wt to bamboo, andwas never really able to get more than 50ft out of my plastic rod with mycasting abilities. Overall I am pleased with the rod, although I am not sure yet if it is going tobe on my preferred taper list. It is fun to cast and casts very smooth. Itfeels like its not going to have much power because it is so much slower thanmy plastic rod, but you can feel the rod respond positively as it loads. A bigdifference I have noticed is the weight! This is an 8ft 3 piece rod and it feelsmuch heavier than my 9ft plastic rod. I think I am going to look in to hollowfluting. Any ideas on how to make a hollow fluting jig for a router based,Medved style, roughing beveler? List, you are terrific, thanks again to all of you for your help in getting methis far. Kyle from carstenjorgensen@mail.dk Tue Mar 26 12:38:01 2002 g2QIc0407150 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 12:38:00 - ;Tue, 26 Mar 2002 19:37:59 +0100 Subject: Sv: Swedish (OFF TOPIC-apologies) g2QIc1407151 Hi Jason Although I am danish, swedish should not be too hard to read for me.(We danes ruled Sweden centuries ago:-) So mail the stuff to me. regards, Carsten Jorgensen www.daniaflyrods.com from Grhghlndr@aol.com Tue Mar 26 12:39:31 2002 g2QIdU407263 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 12:39:30 -0600 Subject: Feeling better rcurry@ttlc.net I want to take the time and thank everyone on the list that took the time to e-mail me and send cards concerning my recent heart attack. I am feeling a lot better today and I am back to my old ornery self and have even layed out two new rods over the weekend. I am getting ready to go out and shovel the new snow out of the driveway that we got overnight and during the day sowish me luck ha ha. Thanks again guys.Bret http://bretsovens.bravepages.com/ I want to take the timeand thank everyone on the list that took the time to e-mail me and send today and I am back to my old ornery self and have even layed out two new new snow out of the driveway that we got overnight and during the day so Bret http://bretsovens.bravepages.com/ from jvswan@earthlink.net Tue Mar 26 12:40:38 2002 g2QIeb407565 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 12:40:37 - (216.160.236.98) User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/9.0.1.3108Subject: Re: Casting a Para 15 Hi Kyle, Having never cast the Para 15 I can't say for sure, but my experience withcasting in general, and other rods I have used, is that to get 80' of linein the air (and keep it there for a false cast or two) is not really an easything to do, no matter what kind of rod you are casting. When working thatlength of line a great deal of your success will boil down to timing yourstroke. Keeping that in mind, the timing required to keep a lot of line inthe air is a very subjective thing, and depends a lot on the rod. So, whatI suggest, and no offense is intended, is that the rod is probably not atfault. I'm sure it is a fantastic rod. It is more likely that you need tospend more time with the rod to get a feel for the timing and the amount ofpower you need to apply to the stroke in order to keep your line movingwithout any dead spots. Now the real question is... Where are you fishing that you need to be ableto keep 80 feet of line in the air? Does that mean you need to be able toshoot it to about 130 feet or so? Best of luck. Jason On 3/26/02 10:21 AM, "KyleDruey@aol.com" wrote: Hi List, I need some advice on casting a Para 15, for which I am only able to castabout 40’. I am not a very good caster, and wouldn’t beable torecognize a double haul from a U-Haul trailer, but I was under theimpressionthat somehow a Para 15 can handle 80’ of line in the air withrelativeease. Distance casting isn’t a priority for me, but I just want toknowif there is something wrong with this rod or if it is just the caster. About the rod: it is the second rod I have completed, and the taper wasslimmed down a bit so it would handle a 5 wt line. It can cast a 5wt upclose, and to about 30’-35’ with relative ease... butthat’sabout it. I can’t really get much more out of it. Am I doingsomethingwrong... not doing something I should be doing... or is the rod just doingwhat it should be doing based on my limited casting skills? I am going fromaSage 9’ 5wt to bamboo, and was never really able to get more than50’ out of my plastic rod with my casting abilities. Overall I am pleased with the rod, although I am not sure yet if it is goingto be on my preferred taper list. It is fun to cast and casts very smooth.It feels like its not going to have much power because it is so much slowerthan my plastic rod, but you can feel the rod respond positively as it loads.A big difference I have noticed is the weight! This is an 8’ 3 piecerod and it feels much heavier than my 9’ plastic rod. I think I amgoing to look in to hollow fluting. Any ideas on how to make a hollow flutingjig for a router based, Medved style, roughing beveler? List, you are terrific, thanks again to all of you for your help in getting methis far. Kyle from ChristopherO@epicimaging.com Tue Mar 26 12:51:58 2002 g2QIpv408290 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 12:51:57 - id ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 10:46:58 -0800 Subject: RE: rod article - yellow journalism (should be called national fl y anglers enquirer online) Look at the vast majority of production cane rods (the montagues, H & I's,Chub's, Devine's, or the Japanese and Korean hardware store rods) and tellme that rods made one at a time, by modern craftsmen, aren't as good (orfarbetter). It's amazing how some people see only what they want to. chris -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: rod article - yellow journalism (should be called national flyanglers enquirer online) Guys. The identity of Reedwhacker is not that difficult to ascertain. Heis along time rod builder, who has achieved a lasting stature among rodbuilders.He is however, a maker who does not waste an inordinate amout of time onhandplaning. I personally was a little offended by his attack on"non-professionals" particularly since one of those "non'professionals" hadjust recently given him a great accolade, Trouble is I don't want to get inthemiddle of this; suffice it to say, that Weedshackers article was probablyintended to be controversial, and might better not have been written. "Christopher A. Obuchowski, MD" wrote: And just like the last cane rod article, it contains enough grains of truth to be dangerous, mixed in with gross inaccuracies, from which mr"weedwacker" (certainly seems like some kind of "whacker") proceeds to make inflammatory, false and inaccurate statements. One wonders if he is being subsidized by the plastic rod industry tosabotage consumer interest in bamboo rods. And he's too cowardly even take credit for his words. Christopher obuchowski -----Original Message----- Sent: Monday, March 25, 2002 4:22 PM Subject: rod article Just thought some of you might be interested in the new article aboutrodmakers on FlyAnglers Online at www.flyanglersonline.com . You can findit on the front page of the site, entitled, "Traditional Rod Making?" Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com --http://www.ida.net/users/rmoon from bob@downandacross.com Tue Mar 26 13:11:55 2002 g2QJBs409616 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 13:11:54 - Subject: FAOL Sponsorship and Article I would like to apologize for bringing anyone else's names into this melee.I have been told by Deanna, FAOL Publisher, that she has never solicitedsponsorship in the chatroom to myself and other group members individuallyor collectively. I guess I misunderstood the posts that night. I can livewith that, and I have no problems retracting my statements about that onebit. I am not intending to be sarcastic by posting this, I am being sincere.I am not trying to make my case through lying. I am not trying to attackanyone, although I guess I have. The point of my statements about sponsorship and the like were intended toshow that many of the people who have taken offense to the piece are closerto the site than FAOL had thought. Look at the "With Bamboo" archives...itis a list of the greatest hand planers of all time. But the piece still leaves a bad taste in my mouth. I cannot help that part.Cordially,Bob Maulucci from ChristopherO@epicimaging.com Tue Mar 26 13:40:10 2002 g2QJeA411316 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 13:40:10 - id ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 11:35:11 -0800 rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: RE: taper I haven't cast the rod, but I did post the taper last fall (along with ahost of other PHY tapers) in the archives. The rod was owned by a friend, but I never got his opinion on it (he fishedalmost exclusively with the driggs, occasionally with the perfectionist) chris -----Original Message----- Subject: taper I hate to do this because it's actually rod related but has anybody out there ever made a PHY Brightwater. Doesn't matter if it was on a mill or planing form [:-)] What's it like as a rod and what sort of stream or style is it good for? Tony /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Forks Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from p.h.e@frisurf.no Tue Mar 26 14:00:29 2002 g2QK0N412534 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 14:00:23 - for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 21:00:08+0100 (MET) Subject: taper request Pasted from ebay auction: This is an extreamly rare fly rod designed inFrance by Pezon et Michel. It is the 6 foot "Super Parabolic Midget" bamboofly rod (Midget: 6' - 2x2 - 4 wt) - Anybody have and would share the taperon this rod? Pöl H. Eliassen (Norway) from dybam@oct.net Tue Mar 26 14:04:01 2002 g2QK40412899 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 14:04:00 -0600 Subject: Re: Internal Security Communications, Inc. M.D. Remember, Voltaire was one of the real jerks in history.Regarding the =French revolution he was a liar from beginning to end.Mark Sent: Monday, March 25, 2002 9:32 PMSubject: Internal Security Here, y'all need something else to talk about. M-D Beware of the words 'internal security,' for they are the eternal cry = M.D. was = real jerks in history.Regarding the French revolution he was a liar from = beginning to end.Mark ----- Original Message ----- Jojo =DeLancier Sent: Monday, March 25, 2002 = PMSubject: Internal =Security Here, y'all need = talk about. M-D Beware of the words 'internal security,' for they are the = = -- Voltaire from bob@downandacross.com Tue Mar 26 14:32:59 2002 g2QKWw414859 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 14:32:58 - 26 Mar 2002 15:32:11 -0500 Subject: RE: taper request Hi Pöl:There is a version of that taper here.http://www.canerod.com/rodmakers/tapers/pm/pm.htmlGood luck.Bob -----Original Message----- Subject: taper request Pasted from ebay auction: This is an extreamly rare fly rod designed inFrance by Pezon et Michel. It is the 6 foot "Super Parabolic Midget" bamboofly rod (Midget: 6' - 2x2 - 4 wt) - Anybody have and would share the taperon this rod? Pöl H. Eliassen (Norway) from ddeloach@pcisys.net Tue Mar 26 15:03:44 2002 g2QL3h416821 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 15:03:44 - for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 14:03:38 - env- from (ddeloach@pcisys.net) Subject: Re: public interest in bamboo, modern skiing All this has gotten me thinking about the parallels of modern alpine skiingto modern fly fishing. Fly fishing and skiing both used to be a lot more difficult to access andeven more difficult to become truly good at. A similiar phenomenon hasoccured in both: recent technology has recreated the experince for bothsports (some would say ruined it) The proliferation of the new high speed lifts paralleled the development andmarketing of faster graphite rods in the 80's and 90's. The lifts broughtmore people uphill at a faster rate than ever before. Thus ski resorts thatwere designed and developed before '81 when the first high speed lifts wentin were suddenly faced with a significant problem: more people getting uphill faster meant resorts were crowded overnight--this is the precisecontradiction of why people used to ski in the first place--to avoid otherpeople and the rigors of everyday interaction. These older resorts had toexpand terrain, services, new lifts, restaurants. Prices went up. Temperswent up. People were discovering skiing at a faster rate then the resortscould handle. Nowadays skiing at the big name resorts here in Colorado is reminiscent offighting the crowds at a suburban shopping mall. Everything is expensive andpopular because the resort developers have made it too easy for theaverageJoe to come skiing. At a resort nowdays (like many crowded rivers) you'remain concern is avoiding crowds not enjoying the experience. So the trend in modern skiing is thus: some of the best skiers in the U.S.,and those that are of the "old School" have rediscovered the unspoiled olderresorts that don't have the high speed lifts : Alta, Monarch, ArapahoeBasin, etc. Some of them have even quit the lift-serviced experiencealtogether in favor of backcountry skiing where fewer people got in theirway. Sound familiar? After reaching the "pinnacle" of ffing with faster rods andbigger and bigger fish on more crowded "name" rivers like the South Platteand Frying Pan, the real fishermen are returning to a simpler, more pureexperience: a seven foot cane rod and small stream with tiny fish. -Don from KyleDruey@aol.com Tue Mar 26 15:04:52 2002 g2QL4q417031 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 15:04:52 - 0326160427; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 16:04:27 -0500 Subject: Re: Casting a Para 15 Hi Jason, Thanks for the response. You are probably right that it has more to do withthe caster than it does with the rod, no offense taken at all. The rod casts35ft of line real easy and smooth, and add to that a 9ft leader and 8ft ofrod... thats plenty of distance for the type of fishing I do. I wish I had areason to make 80ft casts while fishing, but I dont, I just thought it might befun to do on the front lawn. Thanks, Kyle In a message dated Tue, 26 Mar 2002 12:55:59 PM Eastern Standard Time,"Jason Swan" writes: Hi Kyle, Having never cast the Para 15 I can't say for sure, but my experience withcasting in general, and other rods I have used, is that to get 80' of linein the air (and keep it there for a false cast or two) is not really an easything to do, no matter what kind of rod you are casting. When workingthatlength of line a great deal of your success will boil down to timing yourstroke. Keeping that in mind, the timing required to keep a lot of line inthe air is a very subjective thing, and depends a lot on the rod. So, whatI suggest, and no offense is intended, is that the rod is probably not atfault. I'm sure it is a fantastic rod. It is more likely that you need tospend more time with the rod to get a feel for the timing and the amountofpower you need to apply to the stroke in order to keep your line movingwithout any dead spots. Now the real question is... Where are you fishing that you need to be ableto keep 80 feet of line in the air? Does that mean you need to be able toshoot it to about 130 feet or so? Best of luck. Jason On 3/26/02 10:21 AM, "KyleDruey@aol.com" wrote: Hi List, I need some advice on casting a Para 15, for which I am only able to castabout 40’. I am not a very good caster, and wouldn’t beable torecognize a double haul from a U-Haul trailer, but I was under theimpressionthat somehow a Para 15 can handle 80’ of line in the air withrelativeease. Distance casting isn’t a priority for me, but I just want toknowif there is something wrong with this rod or if it is just the caster. About the rod: it is the second rod I have completed, and the taper wasslimmed down a bit so it would handle a 5 wt line. It can cast a 5wt upclose, and to about 30’-35’ with relative ease... butthat’sabout it. I can’t really get much more out of it. Am I doingsomethingwrong... not doing something I should be doing... or is the rod just doingwhat it should be doing based on my limited casting skills? I am going from aSage 9’ 5wt to bamboo, and was never really able to get morethan50’ out of my plastic rod with my casting abilities. Overall I am pleased with the rod, although I am not sure yet if it is goingto be on my preferred taper list. It is fun to cast and casts verysmooth.It feels like its not going to have much power because it is so muchslowerthan my plastic rod, but you can feel the rod respond positively as itloads.A big difference I have noticed is the weight! This is an 8’ 3piecerod and it feels much heavier than my 9’ plastic rod. I think I amgoing to look in to hollow fluting. Any ideas on how to make a hollowflutingjig for a router based, Medved style, roughing beveler? List, you are terrific, thanks again to all of you for your help in gettingmethis far. Kyle from jvswan@earthlink.net Tue Mar 26 15:36:26 2002 g2QLaP419013 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 15:36:25 - (216.160.236.98) User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/9.0.1.3108Subject: Re: Casting a Para 15 Well, one thing is for sure, Kyle. If anyone saw you cast 80 feet with abamboo rod, they will most likely want to take another look. Even a good 50foot cast would likely make an impression. You might considerdemonstratingat your local club's next public meeting. I'm sure with some time to get toknow the rod an 80 cast is not out of the question. BTW, I have never been opposed to "parking lot" casts, either. It's a funchallenge that maybe only the most pragmatic of casters don't appreciate. Enjoy, Jason On 3/26/02 2:04 PM, "KyleDruey@aol.com" wrote: Hi Jason, Thanks for the response. You are probably right that it has more to dowiththe caster than it does with the rod, no offense taken at all. The rodcasts35ft of line real easy and smooth, and add to that a 9ft leader and 8ft ofrod... thats plenty of distance for the type of fishing I do. I wish I had areason to make 80ft casts while fishing, but I dont, I just thought it mightbe fun to do on the front lawn. Thanks, Kyle In a message dated Tue, 26 Mar 2002 12:55:59 PM Eastern Standard Time,"JasonSwan" writes: Hi Kyle, Having never cast the Para 15 I can't say for sure, but my experiencewithcasting in general, and other rods I have used, is that to get 80' of linein the air (and keep it there for a false cast or two) is not really an easything to do, no matter what kind of rod you are casting. When workingthatlength of line a great deal of your success will boil down to timing yourstroke. Keeping that in mind, the timing required to keep a lot of line inthe air is a very subjective thing, and depends a lot on the rod. So, whatI suggest, and no offense is intended, is that the rod is probably not atfault. I'm sure it is a fantastic rod. It is more likely that you need tospend more time with the rod to get a feel for the timing and the amountofpower you need to apply to the stroke in order to keep your line movingwithout any dead spots. Now the real question is... Where are you fishing that you need to be ableto keep 80 feet of line in the air? Does that mean you need to be able toshoot it to about 130 feet or so? Best of luck. Jason On 3/26/02 10:21 AM, "KyleDruey@aol.com" wrote: Hi List, I need some advice on casting a Para 15, for which I am only able to castabout 40’. I am not a very good caster, and wouldn’t beable torecognize a double haul from a U-Haul trailer, but I was under theimpressionthat somehow a Para 15 can handle 80’ of line in the air withrelativeease. Distance casting isn’t a priority for me, but I just want toknowif there is something wrong with this rod or if it is just the caster. About the rod: it is the second rod I have completed, and the taper wasslimmed down a bit so it would handle a 5 wt line. It can cast a 5wt upclose, and to about 30’-35’ with relative ease... butthat’sabout it. I can’t really get much more out of it. Am I doingsomething wrong... not doing something I should be doing... or is the rod just doingwhat it should be doing based on my limited casting skills? I am goingfromaSage 9’ 5wt to bamboo, and was never really able to get morethan50’ out of my plastic rod with my casting abilities. Overall I am pleased with the rod, although I am not sure yet if it is goingto be on my preferred taper list. It is fun to cast and casts verysmooth.It feels like its not going to have much power because it is so muchslowerthan my plastic rod, but you can feel the rod respond positively as itloads.A big difference I have noticed is the weight! This is an 8’ 3piecerod and it feels much heavier than my 9’ plastic rod. I think Iamgoing to look in to hollow fluting. Any ideas on how to make a hollowflutingjig for a router based, Medved style, roughing beveler? List, you are terrific, thanks again to all of you for your help in gettingmethis far. Kyle from MasjC1@aol.com Tue Mar 26 15:48:48 2002 g2QLml419831 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 15:48:47 - for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 16:48:23 - Subject: Re: public interest in bamboo, modern skiing Don, Liked your analogy. You left out Ski Copper where the 10th Mountain got it start. Mark Cole Don, Liked your analogy. You left out Ski Copper where the 10th Mountain gotit start. Mark Cole from bcombest@iclub.org Tue Mar 26 16:20:53 2002 g2QMKq421997 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 16:20:52 - ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 17:21:33 -0500 Subject: Fw: Reel Seat Mortise HEY LIST MEMBERS!I guess that my request got lost in the discussion(?) over the FAOL =posts, or what ever.I cannot find a "fingernail 5/8" router bit, is there another name for =this. Any other suggestions for making the mortise in the reel seat.Bruce Subject: Reel Seat Mortise Good Morning, When cutting the mortise in the wood, what specific router bit is used? Bruce CombestBerea. Ky HEY LIST MEMBERS!I guess that my request got lost in the= discussion(?) over the FAOL posts, or what ever.I cannot find a "fingernail 5/8" router = in the reel seat.Bruce From:Bruce = Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2002 8:29 AMSubject: Reel Seat Mortise Good Morning,I have a question concerning the making= seat insert. When cutting the mortise in the wood, = router bit is used? Bruce CombestBerea. Ky from JNL123141@msn.com Tue Mar 26 16:30:09 2002 g2QMU9422599 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 16:30:09 - Tue, 26 Mar 2002 14:30:03 -0800 "RodmakersPost" Subject: Re: Rod article thread locked FILETIME=[C5F594C0:01C1D515] I have a JW Beveler and it works great. I also have a Medved Beveler and=it also works great. ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Rod article thread locked At least you guys aren't arrogant and attacking Ron Kusse and BobSommers=asI clearly did. Man, now I see why I don't normally look at those sites!She ignored the points I was trying to make and focused on my little clos=ingwhich I thought was harmless. I would never in a millions years attackanother rodmakers work! I have never seen Kusse's or Sommers' rods, letalone suggest that I am better than them. I was trying to make that poin=twhen the thread was locked. OK, after all that (actually a little before it), I was considering aroughing beveller from JW rods. Any of you have experience with one of h=is? Thanks and I hope I didn't offend anyone on that crazy site. I was tryin=gto make a point, but it appears to have been lost along the way. Rob Clarke From: "Jill and Tom Ausfeld" Subject: Re: Rod article thread lockedDate: Tue, 26 Mar 2002 10:10:02 - 0500 opps,,,She comes off as a jerk, attacking instead of condescendingly (if th= ats even a word) trying to make her point. Should've said:She comes off as a condescending jerk, attacking instead of nicely tryin= g tomake her point.sorrytom ----- Original Message -----From: Jill and Tom Ausfeld Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2002 9:59 AMSubject: Re: Rod article thread locked I don't go to the FAOL often. But from what I have read, I'm not impressed. She comes off as a jerk, attacking instead of condescendingly (if thats even a word) trying to make her point. I did notice that this month's sponser was Redington. I bet she ge= ts more free rods from plastic makers than bamboo makers... The threadlock was absolutely uncalled for, unless of course she realized her true colors showed through. I have lost all respect for her an= d the FAOL. I go to the site now out of morbid curiosity, as in " What BS do th= ey have the gall to write now?" tom _________________________________________________________________Join the world=E2=80=99s largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail.http://www.hotmail.com I have a JWBe= Clark=e Sent: Tuesday, March 26,2= tausfeld@fr=ontiernet.net; rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Subject: Re: Rod article thread locked = ok at those sites!She ignored the points I was trying to make and foc= never seen Kusse's or Sommers' rods, letalone suggest that I ambette= was=locked.OK, after all that (actually a little before it), I was c= exp=erience with one of his?Thanks and I hope I didn't offend anyone = to have been lost along the way.Rob 2002= come= Sho= = th= = than= = ___________Join the world=E2=80=99s largest e-mail service withMSN H=otmail.http://www.hotmail.com from bamboorules@ns.sympatico.ca Tue Mar 26 16:42:46 2002 g2QMgj423524 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 16:42:45 - Tue, 26 Mar 2002 18:44:36 -0400 Organization: New Scotland Fly Rods Subject: Re: rod article --------------896B2D9F65F5EFF2CCBF4850 All,I assume all this activity is about the article where "REEDWHACKER" saidto search the Rodmakers archive for peoples credentials?? Or did I stumbleonsomething else by whacker??Perhaps if Reedwhacker wasn't so spineless and posted his real name,people could search the archives and find out, if I am correct what a S#*Tdisturber he is, has been, and more than likely will continue to be!If it wasn't for the fact that you have to be a "registered member" topost a reply I would love to have my say. FOAL continues to leave a "justkicked in the N*TS type sick feeling in the pit of my stomach". I have seensome cliquey organizations in my time, but these guys take the cake. I'll havenothing more to do with their crowd!Seems they take great joy in popularizing cane while at the same timecutting down builders other than the cliques elite golden children! As well asallowing rubbish on their web page, by a unidentified individual no less,Supporting his bull, then protecting themselves by locking out responses.This seems like an sneaky, underhanded attack on all builders outsidethis clique by someone who is too spineless to let people know who he is andwhat a cut throat he is!Not scared (or ashamed) to say,Shawn Pineo,New Scotland Fly Rods, Take yourbest shot REEDWHACKO!!! SNIPPED from FAOL>>> reedwhackerNew Memberposted 25 March 2002 02:33 PM Hi, rodand have become confused after making a web search anddiscovering just how many "new" rod makers are out there.Unless the maker is selling through a reputable dealer whoisendorsing them, it is difficult to know because of the self promoting nature of rod maker web sites!After checking out all the web pages here is a tip to helpnarrowthe field and also provide some amusement.Just about all of the contemporary rod makers have, orstillbelong to the "Rodmakers" list. Find the list then go intothearchives, then click on the Stetzer search engine and youwillthen fill in the "author box" the name rodmaker you areinterested in. This will give you all the posts that theguy hasever made. You will then discover when he he asked the,"it'smy first rod" type of question to offering "expert advice"This will give you an idea of how long the guy has beenmakingrods and should help you decide as to whether you shouldinvest or not.Reedwhacker --------------896B2D9F65F5EFF2CCBF4850 All, where "REEDWHACKER" said to search the Rodmakers archive for peoplescredentials??Or did I stumble on something else by whacker?? and posted his real name, people could search the archives and find out,if I am correct what a S#*T disturber he is, has been, and more than likelywill continue to be! to be a "registered member" to post a reply I would love to have my say.FOAL continues to leave a "just kicked in the N*TS type sick feeling inthe pit of my stomach". I have seen some cliquey organizations in my time,but these guys take the cake. I'll have nothing more to do with their crowd! whileat the same time cutting down builders other than the cliques elite goldenchildren! As well as allowing rubbish on their web page, by a unidentifiedindividual no less, Supporting his bull, then protecting themselves bylocking out responses. attackon all builders outside this clique by someone who is too spineless tolet people know who he is and what a cut throat he is! (orashamed) to say, Shawn Pineo, New Scotland Fly Rods, SNIPPED from FAOL>>>reedwhacker posted 25 March 2002 02:33 PM Hi, and have become confused after making a web search and discovering just how many "new" rod makers are out there. Unless the maker is selling through a reputable dealer who is endorsing them, it is difficult to know because of the self promoting nature of rod maker web sites! After checking out all the web pages here is a tip to help narrow the field and also provide some amusement. Just about all of the contemporary rod makers have, or still belong to the "Rodmakers" list. Find the list then go into the archives, then click on the Stetzer search engine and you will then fill in the "author box" the name rodmaker you are interested in. This will give you all the posts that the guy has ever made. You will then discover when he he asked the, "it's my first rod" type of question to offering "expert advice" This will give you an idea of how long the guy has been making rods and should help you decide as to whether you should invest or not. Reedwhacker --------------896B2D9F65F5EFF2CCBF4850-- from jcbyrd@direct-pest.com Tue Mar 26 16:43:18 2002 g2QMhH423629 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 16:43:17 - by direct-pest.com [208.27.26.103] for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 17:26:30 -0500 Subject: Re: Reel Seat Mortise Bruce: Grizzly sells them. Tony Spezio has the exact part no. from Grizzly. I =don't have it in front of me right now. Joe and a cigar in the other....."What a Great Life". Visit my bamboo Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2002 5:20 PMSubject: Fw: Reel Seat Mortise HEY LIST MEMBERS!I guess that my request got lost in the discussion(?) over the FAOL =posts, or what ever.I cannot find a "fingernail 5/8" router bit, is there another name for =this. Any other suggestions for making the mortise in the reel seat.Bruce Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2002 8:29 AMSubject: Reel Seat Mortise Good Morning, When cutting the mortise in the wood, what specific router bit is =used? Bruce CombestBerea. Ky Bruce: = now. Joe http://www.direct-pest.com/r= ----- Original Message ----- Bruce= Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2002 = PMSubject: Fw: Reel Seat =Mortise HEY LIST MEMBERS!I guess that my request got lost in = discussion(?) over the FAOL posts, or what ever.I cannot find a "fingernail 5/8" = mortise in the reel seat.Bruce From:Bruce = Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2002 8:29 AMSubject: Reel Seat Mortise Good Morning,I have a question concerning the = seat insert. When cutting the mortise in the wood, = specific router bit is used? Bruce CombestBerea. Ky from jcbyrd@direct-pest.com Tue Mar 26 16:46:42 2002 g2QMkf424151 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 16:46:41 - by direct-pest.com [208.27.26.103] for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 17:30:00 -0500 Subject: Re: Reel Seat Mortise Bruce: Just looked it up. The Grizzly part no. is C1215 and you can purchase =at www.grizzly.com, the price is $15.95. No financial interest, etc etc. Joe and a cigar in the other....."What a Great Life". Visit my bamboo Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2002 5:20 PMSubject: Fw: Reel Seat Mortise HEY LIST MEMBERS!I guess that my request got lost in the discussion(?) over the FAOL =posts, or what ever.I cannot find a "fingernail 5/8" router bit, is there another name for =this. Any other suggestions for making the mortise in the reel seat.Bruce Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2002 8:29 AMSubject: Reel Seat Mortise Good Morning, When cutting the mortise in the wood, what specific router bit is =used? Bruce CombestBerea. Ky Bruce: can purchase at www.grizzly.com, = is $15.95. No financial interest, etc etc. Joe http://www.direct-pest.com/r= ----- Original Message ----- Bruce= Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2002 = PMSubject: Fw: Reel Seat =Mortise HEY LIST MEMBERS!I guess that my request got lost in = discussion(?) over the FAOL posts, or what ever.I cannot find a "fingernail 5/8" = mortise in the reel seat.Bruce From:Bruce = Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2002 8:29 AMSubject: Reel Seat Mortise Good Morning,I have a question concerning the = seat insert. When cutting the mortise in the wood, = specific router bit is used? Bruce CombestBerea. Ky from JNL123141@msn.com Tue Mar 26 16:47:44 2002 g2QMlg424333 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 16:47:43 - Tue, 26 Mar 2002 14:47:37 -0800 Subject: Re: Swedish (OFF TOPIC-apologies) FILETIME=[3A279AD0:01C1D518] I can speak Swenglish for sure, don't ya know. ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Swedish (OFF TOPIC-apologies) Do any of our list members speak Swedish? I have managed to get on someSwedish email list (at least I think it is Swedish, their website ishttp://www.pcfynd.se/) for what looks to be electronic equipment. I don'tknow how to get myself off. Can anyone help me? I would sincerely appreciate it. Jason I can speakSw= ----- Original Message ----- From: Jason Swan Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2002 12:01 man=aged to get on someSwedish email list (at least I think it is Swedish=, their website ishttp://www.pcfynd.se/) for what looks to be electro= any=one help me?I would sincerely appreciateit.Jason= from rmoon@ida.net Tue Mar 26 16:54:25 2002 g2QMsP425137 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 16:54:25 - 0000 Subject: Re: public interest in bamboo, modern skiing Don A little further parallel. I used to ski on A & T Ridge Top laminated skis, SunValley Model cost $22,50 a pair. Now we have all of those composite skis athundreds of dollars a pair. Natural vs. synthetic? We had more fun in the old days. Skiing unbroken powder three feet deep atAlta. Oh where oh where is it now.?Ralph http://www.ida.net/users/rmoon from jojo@ipa.net Tue Mar 26 17:04:34 2002 g2QN4Y425952 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 17:04:34 -0600 helo=default) id 16pzzQ-0003XR-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 18:04:29 -0500 Subject: Re: Internal Security Yes, but you ignore the truth of his remark, seeking to denigrate him, =which is the same sort of ad hominem attack recently witnessed against =certain List members who posted on FAOL. Doesn't matter to me, one way =or the other, but at least you're talking about something else, and =that, after all, *was* the point. ;o) M-D M.D. Remember, Voltaire was one of the real jerks in history.Regarding the =French revolution he was a liar from beginning to end.Mark Here, y'all need something else to talk about. M-D Beware of the words 'internal security,' for they are the eternal = Yes, but you ignore the= remark, seeking to denigrate him, which is the same sort of ad hominem = ;o) M-D MarkDyba = M.D. was = real jerks in history.Regarding the French revolution he was a liar = beginning to end.Mark Jojo =DeLancier Here, y'all need = to talk about. M-D Beware of the words 'internal security,' for they are the = = -- Voltaire from carstenjorgensen@mail.dk Tue Mar 26 17:23:07 2002 g2QNN6426951 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 17:23:06 - ;Wed, 27 Mar 2002 00:23:05 +0100 Subject: Sv: try again - Re: Casting a Para 15 g2QNN7426952 Hi Kyle A few comments to Your mail: In no way is this meant as a flame, but "slimming a taper down a bit" on Yoursecond rod!!! Are You absolutely sure it is done properly? A properly executed Para 15should cast 60 - 70 feet without any problems, a good caster should be able to layout an entire line when double hauling. About casting a para: S-L-O-O-O-W is the thing. You gotta let that rod do itsthing thenlay the rod forward, dont throw it forward, pulling the line with Your left hand(presumingYou are a right hand caster) letting the line go, and whammo the line will flyforward.If You try to sling the line forward at a faster pace than the rods own rhytm,You willsurely fail. This baby is very slow compared with a Sage. You MUST wait untillYou feel the line through the rod. Dont panick, You will have the necessarytimemove the rod in its backward and forward stroke. The rhytm could bedescribedlike 1-2-3 where 1 is moving the rod, and 2-3 are the pause. A bit like awaltz. Hope this is of use to You. regards, Carsten Jorgensen from p.h.e@frisurf.no Tue Mar 26 17:25:54 2002 g2QNPr427309 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 17:25:53 - for ; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 00:25:38+0100 (MET) Subject: tapers Thanks for all replys, I had the PM-taper all the time when I looked throughmy papers, and Rodmakers have many "new" PM-tapers since last time Ichecked. Just trying to enter something rod related [:-)] What about aquestion about what is youre favorite 3 weight rod. I have a nr.3 Phoenixline, but no 3 weight rod. Danny T has a sweet 3-piece Driggs for #3 lineand I have started on 2 PHY Midge rods, should I make one of those a 3weight. Any thoughts and favorits? reg. PHE from ChristopherO@epicimaging.com Tue Mar 26 17:31:34 2002 g2QNVX427822 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 17:31:33 - id ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 15:26:34 -0800 Subject: RE: tapers g2QNVY427829 If someone would like to share the #3 driggs adaptation, I for one wouldlike to see it. chris -----Original Message----- Subject: tapers Thanks for all replys, I had the PM-taper all the time when I looked throughmy papers, and Rodmakers have many "new" PM-tapers since last time Ichecked. Just trying to enter something rod related [:-)] What about aquestion about what is youre favorite 3 weight rod. I have a nr.3 Phoenixline, but no 3 weight rod. Danny T has a sweet 3-piece Driggs for #3 lineand I have started on 2 PHY Midge rods, should I make one of those a 3weight. Any thoughts and favorits? reg. PHE from Jkvseafood@aol.com Tue Mar 26 18:02:00 2002 g2R01t429099 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 18:02:00 - Subject: Re: Swedish (OFF TOPIC-apologies) rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu yaa das goud? from irish-george@chartermi.net Tue Mar 26 18:23:18 2002 g2R0NH400157 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 18:23:17 - 2002 19:23:17 -0500 Subject: test sorry for the bandwidth...just checking to see if I am back on(I expected a boatload of messages checking email today...first time in =several days...but had none.) sorry for the bandwidth...just checking= am back on(I expected a boatload of messages = today...first time in several days...but had =none.) from rextutor@yahoo.com Tue Mar 26 18:24:20 2002 g2R0OJ400353 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 18:24:19 - 26 Mar 2002 16:24:14 PST Subject: Re: Fw: Reel Seat Mortise BruceYou did get lost - I never saw your request. SorryThey are fequently called fingernail bits but are alittle harder to find than most router bitsTRYhttp://www.woodbits.com/and email me if you can't find one and I will dig outthe catalogs - I have 100s and sort out the fingernailrouter bits but I am pretty sure this is where I gotmine,Another avenue is catalogcity.com - you can order abunch of catalogs on routers and workworking and dosome cost analysis.Good luck--- Bruce Combest wrote: HEY LIST MEMBERS!I guess that my request got lost in thediscussion(?) over the FAOL posts, or what ever.I cannot find a "fingernail 5/8" router bit, isthere another name for this. Any other suggestions Bruce----- Original Message ----- From: Bruce Combest Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2002 8:29 AMSubject: Reel Seat Mortise Good Morning,I have a question concerning the making of a reelseat insert. When cutting the mortise in the wood, what specificrouter bit is used? Bruce CombestBerea. Ky __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Movies - coverage of the 74th Academy Awardshttp://movies.yahoo.com/ from stetzer@csd.uwm.edu Tue Mar 26 18:34:46 2002 g2R0Yk401093 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 18:34:46 - SAA18662 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 Subject: Re: Casting a Para 15 Kyle, My second rod was Wayne C's "the force" which is very similar toa para 15. It was supposed to be a 6wt, but I couldn't cast itwell until I went up to a 7. Maybe try a 6wt line on yours and see if you like it better. I'm not that good with parabolicsand I think that a size heavier line helps me sense the loading.Once that parabolic kicks it, it will launch a line a long ways.Put a beadhead on the end and you can hunt small game.......................................................................Frank Stetzer "...a cheerful comrade is betterstetzer@uwm.edu than a waterproof coat and a Employed by, but not speaking for foot-warmer." Henry Van Dyke,Univ of Wisconsin-Milwaukee, USA "Fisherman's Luck", 1899. from irish-george@chartermi.net Tue Mar 26 18:39:13 2002 g2R0dD401445 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 18:39:13 - 2002 19:39:12 -0500 Subject: Re: Fw: Reel Seat Mortise Isn't a "fingernail" bit more commonly called a "beading" bit? If not, howare they different? George ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Fw: Reel Seat Mortise BruceYou did get lost - I never saw your request. SorryThey are fequently called fingernail bits but are alittle harder to find than most router bitsTRYhttp://www.woodbits.com/and email me if you can't find one and I will dig outthe catalogs - I have 100s and sort out the fingernailrouter bits but I am pretty sure this is where I gotmine,Another avenue is catalogcity.com - you can order abunch of catalogs on routers and workworking and dosome cost analysis.Good luck from dannyt@frisurf.no Tue Mar 26 18:43:30 2002 g2R0hS401852 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 18:43:29 - User-Agent: Microsoft-Outlook-Express-Macintosh-Edition/5.02.2022 Subject: Re: tapers g2R0hU401853 Hi Pöl, how are You, any snow the last few days:-? My best #3 wt rods are as following, my Driggs converted to 3 piece 3wt,Midge converted to 3, Dickerson 6611 converted to 3 and last but not theleast Garrison #193, hell You should know, You have casted them all!! BTW where did You got that Phoenix silk line from, another present fromYourbeloved wife? cheers,danny,lost in NZ Thanks for all replys, I had the PM-taper all the time when I looked throughmy papers, and Rodmakers have many "new" PM-tapers since last time Ichecked. Just trying to enter something rod related [:-)] What about aquestion about what is youre favorite 3 weight rod. I have a nr.3 Phoenixline, but no 3 weight rod. Danny T has a sweet 3-piece Driggs for #3 lineand I have started on 2 PHY Midge rods, should I make one of those a 3weight. Any thoughts and favorits? reg. PHE from jojo@ipa.net Tue Mar 26 18:44:43 2002 g2R0ig402022 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 18:44:42 -0600 helo=default) id 16q1YG-0002mq-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 19:44:33 -0500 Subject: Motor Info Needed Guys, Who among us is well versed in DC motor applications, torque loading, etc?Please contact me OffList. M-D from LECLAIR123@aol.com Tue Mar 26 18:46:23 2002 g2R0kM402296 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 18:46:23 - Subject: Re: Fw: Reel Seat Mortise Bruce,Check with Grizzly imports. They carry the fingernail bitsyour looking for. They bought out Cascade tools. Dave check out our new site at- flyandrodroom.com AOL site- http://hometown.aol.com/leclair123/index.html from Lazybee45@aol.com Tue Mar 26 18:47:30 2002 g2R0lU402498 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 18:47:30 - Subject: Re: rod article In a message dated 3/25/02 6:22:26 PM Central Standard Time,caneman@clnk.com writes: Certainly does not seem to be very complimentary now, does it! mark visit Wood Art Custom Designs http://hometown.aol.com/lazybee45/myhomepage/business.html Hand crafted items made to order! from harms1@pa.net Tue Mar 26 18:51:14 2002 g2R0pE403017 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 18:51:14 - "rodmakers@wugate.wustl.e" Subject: Re: FAOL Sponsorship and Article Bob, No need to "tip-toe" around the article or the publisher of FAOL. Thearticle was uninformed rubbish, and the editor demonstrated an absence ofprofessional judgment in presenting it. That's about all there is to thewhole matter. Even she doesn't want to hear any more about it. Cheers, Bill ----- Original Message ----- Subject: FAOL Sponsorship and Article I would like to apologize for bringing anyone else's names into this melee. I have been told by Deanna, FAOL Publisher, that she has never solicitedsponsorship in the chatroom to myself and other group membersindividuallyor collectively. I guess I misunderstood the posts that night. I can livewith that, and I have no problems retracting my statements about that onebit. I am not intending to be sarcastic by posting this, I am being sincere. I am not trying to make my case through lying. I am not trying to attackanyone, although I guess I have. The point of my statements about sponsorship and the like were intendedtoshow that many of the people who have taken offense to the piece are closer to the site than FAOL had thought. Look at the "With Bamboo" archives...itis a list of the greatest hand planers of all time. But the piece still leaves a bad taste in my mouth. I cannot help that part. Cordially,Bob Maulucci from KyleDruey@aol.com Tue Mar 26 18:57:36 2002 g2R0vZ403506 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 18:57:35 - 0326195714; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 19:57:14 -0500 Subject: Re: Sv: try again - Re: Casting a Para 15 g2R0va403507 Hi Carsten, When I researched the Para 15 most folks seemed to think the light tip wasdesigned for a 6 weight. I wanted an 8 ft, 5 weight, 3 pc rod for nymphingthis spring (plunk lead with 'boo, shudder!). I used Garrison math to changethe taper using the lighter line and the extra ferrule. This lowered thedimensions at all the stations by about 0.002 to 0.004 on average. The 5 wtline feels very good with this rod. Many have suggested I try a 6 wt line tosee how it casts, and I will do that. I am a very poor caster, so I think my distance problems have more to dowith technique than the rod itself (I hope!). I was not shooting line when I wasmaxing out at 35ft to 40ft. Thanks for the pointers, though, I will give it atry on the front lawn after I finish dripping the rod over the next few weeks. When you mention that the Para 15 should be able to cast 60ft to 70ft, doyou mean after shooting line, or it should have 60ft to 70ft of line in the airwhile casting? Kyle In a message dated Tue, 26 Mar 2002 6:23:59 PM Eastern Standard Time,Carsten Jorgensen writes: Hi Kyle A few comments to Your mail: In no way is this meant as a flame, but "slimming a taper down a bit" onYour second rod!!! Are You absolutely sure it is done properly? A properly executed Para 15should cast 60 - 70 feet without any problems, a good caster should be able to layout an entire line when double hauling. About casting a para: S-L-O-O-O-W is the thing. You gotta let that rod doits thing thenlay the rod forward, dont throw it forward, pulling the line with Your lefthand (presumingYou are a right hand caster) letting the line go, and whammo the line will flyforward.If You try to sling the line forward at a faster pace than the rods ownrhytm, You willsurely fail. This baby is very slow compared with a Sage. You MUST waituntillYou feel the line through the rod. Dont panick, You will have the necessarytimemove the rod in its backward and forward stroke. The rhytm could bedescribedlike 1-2-3 where 1 is moving the rod, and 2-3 are the pause. A bit like awaltz. Hope this is of use to You. regards, Carsten Jorgensen from lblan@provide.net Tue Mar 26 18:59:17 2002 g2R0xG403723 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 18:59:17 - for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 19:59:15 - Subject: RE: FAOL Sponsorship and Article I believe we have dignified the article far beyond it's worth by ourcomments. I have to wonder how an article whose contents were verified byKusse and then managed to end up on the front page, could just bethe result of a lapse of judgement. Larry Blan -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2002 7:47 PM Cc: publisher@flyanglersonline.comSubject: Re: FAOL Sponsorship and Article Bob, No need to "tip-toe" around the article or the publisher of FAOL. Thearticle was uninformed rubbish, and the editor demonstrated an absence ofprofessional judgment in presenting it. That's about all there is to thewhole matter. Even she doesn't want to hear any more about it. Cheers, Bill ----- Original Message -----From: "Bob Maulucci" Cc: Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2002 2:11 PMSubject: FAOL Sponsorship and Article I would like to apologize for bringing anyone else's names into this melee. I have been told by Deanna, FAOL Publisher, that she has never solicitedsponsorship in the chatroom to myself and other group members individually or collectively. I guess I misunderstood the posts that night. I can live with that, and I have no problems retracting my statements about that one bit. I am not intending to be sarcastic by posting this, I am being sincere. I am not trying to make my case through lying. I am not trying to attackanyone, although I guess I have. The point of my statements about sponsorship and the like were intended to show that many of the people who have taken offense to the piece are closer to the site than FAOL had thought. Look at the "With Bamboo" archives...it is a list of the greatest hand planers of all time. But the piece still leaves a bad taste in my mouth. I cannot help that part. Cordially,Bob Maulucci from conranch@ipeg.com Tue Mar 26 19:03:46 2002 g2R13j404147 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 19:03:45 - for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 17:05:33 -0800 Subject: Beading bit vs fingernail bits A beading bit for either a shaper or router cuts a bead that is one =half of a circle. The fingernail bit cuts only a portion of the one half = So a 5/8" beading bit would cut a half circle that measures 5/8".A 5/8" fingernail bit would make a cut that measures 1/2", but is only a =lesser part of the half circle. This is what we want and use for making =the reel seat inlet in our inserts. The Grizzly bit #C1215 makes a cut =measuring only 1/2", ear to ear. across the cord, measurement. Denny Dennis ConradCONRANCH HACKLES http://members.tripod.com/CONRANCH/http://www.flyanglersonline.com (top site for all related ff info) A beading bit for either a shaper or router = the one half circle. So a 5/8" beading bit would cut a half circle = measures 5/8".A 5/8" fingernail bit would make a = 1/2", but is only a lesser part of the half circle. This is what we want = cut measuring only 1/2", ear to ear. across the cord, =measurement.I hope I have not confused anyone. = Denny http://members.tripod.com/CO= site for all related ff info) from bob@downandacross.com Tue Mar 26 19:30:18 2002 g2R1UH405030 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 19:30:17 - 26 Mar 2002 20:28:42 -0500 "rodmakers@wugate.wustl.e" Subject: RE: FAOL Sponsorship and Article Thanks Bill -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: FAOL Sponsorship and Article Bob, No need to "tip-toe" around the article or the publisher of FAOL. Thearticle was uninformed rubbish, and the editor demonstrated an absence ofprofessional judgment in presenting it. That's about all there is to thewhole matter. Even she doesn't want to hear any more about it. Cheers, Bill from cw@vanion.com Tue Mar 26 20:28:50 2002 g2R2Sn406807 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 20:28:49 - for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 19:33:42 - Subject: reelseat bit Woodworker's Supply catalog has the bit listed as External Bull Nose, =Half radius, pt # 819-839. 5/8" is $22.99, and made by Woodtek. =woodworker.com or 1-800-645-9292 Woodworker's Supply catalog hasthe = as External Bull Nose, Half radius, pt # 819-839. 5/8" is $22.99, = 9292 from avyoung@iinet.net.au Tue Mar 26 21:00:03 2002 g2R301407678 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 21:00:01 - Subject: Re: public interest in bamboo, modern skiing I can't help seeing parallels in the various climbing games too. At the same time the gear improves the attitude shown by more and more peopleworsens.Was a time you'd hang around the crags for days waiting for a like minded (deranged) person to show so you could climb and you invariably got along.Now the crags are full of climbers mainly because rock climbing has become safer than the drive to get to the crags, hardly anybody gets along and it's simply no fun any more not that I've climbed for 15 years or more.A friend of mine at about the time we both more or less dropped climbing hazardous, now it's the other way around".This kind of thing just keeps happening. The more esoteric the better I like it. Tony At 02:02 PM 3/26/02 -0700, Don DeLoach wrote: All this has gotten me thinking about the parallels of modern alpine skiingto modern fly fishing. Fly fishing and skiing both used to be a lot more difficult to access andeven more difficult to become truly good at. A similiar phenomenon hasoccured in both: recent technology has recreated the experince for bothsports (some would say ruined it) ************************************************************************/ AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Forks Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from oakmere@carol.net Tue Mar 26 21:03:26 2002 g2R33P407996 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 21:03:26 -0600 g2R33Jb12469 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 22:03:19 -0500 Subject: RE: Rod Information Hi Folks: I have a rod that has the following characteristics. I have consultedSinclair, Keane, Homel, and Campbell as book references. Pack Rod: 7' 4 piece with 2 tips bamboo; all sections full length; 4English snake guides; no stipper guide; wraps look original on rod; snakewraps are black; a patterned set of intermediate wraps that are red andblack; cork sheet wrap over wood handle; metal reel seat 4.75 inches long;rolled welt brass plated ferrules; 1 inch long metal winding check; nomarkings on the rod anywhere; assembled rod is in fair condition; all gluelines look tight. My estimate is it is 1900 to 1920's era low end pack rod. Any one have aclue to company that would have made this pack rod? Owner purchased fromashop on the west coast. Thanks in advance for any information or insight onthe making company. Best, FrankFrank Paul, "GreyFox"TroutBeck Fly and RodBamboo Rod Refinishing and Restoration;Graphite and Glass Rod Repair;Trout Flies, Seneca, SC Summer Residence: Troutbeck Cottage, Waterville, PA; 570-753- 8121fwpaul@ces.clemson.edu (work), Clemson University; 864-656- 7471oakmere@carol.net (home), South Carolina; 864-882-0077 from rmoon@ida.net Tue Mar 26 21:50:58 2002 g2R3ow409258 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 21:50:58 - 0000 Subject: Re: public interest in bamboo, modern skiing Tony The parade goes on. I used to play 45-90 holes of golf per week. No need toworryabout green fees, my dad was a charter member. My clubs were wood shaftdropforged sawed off to fit me. The balls were salvaged out of the pond on thecourse,the greens were sand, and we used only dirt tees. Everyone knew theetiquette andfollowed it. Want to play a round at Pebble Beach today?Ralph Tony Young wrote: I can't help seeing parallels in the various climbing games too. At thesame time the gear improves the attitude shown by more and more peopleworsens.Was a time you'd hang around the crags for days waiting for a like minded(deranged) person to show so you could climb and you invariably got along.Now the crags are full of climbers mainly because rock climbing hasbecomesafer than the drive to get to the crags, hardly anybody gets along andit's simply no fun any more not that I've climbed for 15 years or more.A friend of mine at about the time we both more or less dropped climbing washazardous, now it's the other way around".This kind of thing just keeps happening. The more esoteric the better Ilike it. Tony At 02:02 PM 3/26/02 -0700, Don DeLoach wrote: All this has gotten me thinking about the parallels of modern alpine skiingto modern fly fishing. Fly fishing and skiing both used to be a lot more difficult to access andeven more difficult to become truly good at. A similiar phenomenon hasoccured in both: recent technology has recreated the experince for bothsports (some would say ruined it) ************************************************************************/ AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Forks Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ --http://www.ida.net/users/rmoon from avyoung@iinet.net.au Tue Mar 26 22:42:02 2002 g2R4g0410763 for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2002 22:42:00 - Subject: Re: public interest in bamboo, modern skiing I played golf only while at high school one football season I was out due to injury. I quite enjoyed it and used to think it was very nice in the open but alone apart from your partner but still in the suburbs. I'm a terrible golfer though and if I started out with less than 10 or so balls I knew I would be in trouble before the 18th [:-)] My golf balls were also salvaged from the water traps but even then most partners were a bit up them selves IMHO though in a bearable way.One of the kids I played with actually got a hole in one on a par three. It was complete arse and even he agreed there was no real skill involved. Makes you think about the possibility of almost anything when that kind of thing happens. That little hole from that distance, quite extraordinary. TY At 08:50 PM 3/26/02 -0700, Ralph W. Moon wrote: Tony The parade goes on. I used to play 45-90 holes of golf per week. No need to worryabout green fees, my dad was a charter member. My clubs were woodshaft dropforged sawed off to fit me. The balls were salvaged out of the pond on the course,the greens were sand, and we used only dirt tees. Everyone knew the etiquette andfollowed it. Want to play a round at Pebble Beach today?Ralph Tony Young wrote: I can't help seeing parallels in the various climbing games too. At thesame time the gear improves the attitude shown by more and morepeople worsens. Was a time you'd hang around the crags for days waiting for a likeminded(deranged) person to show so you could climb and you invariably gotalong.Now the crags are full of climbers mainly because rock climbing hasbecomesafer than the drive to get to the crags, hardly anybody gets along andit's simply no fun any more not that I've climbed for 15 years or more.A friend of mine at about the time we both more or less dropped climbing washazardous, now it's the other way around".This kind of thing just keeps happening. The more esoteric the better Ilike it. Tony At 02:02 PM 3/26/02 -0700, Don DeLoach wrote: All this has gotten me thinking about the parallels of modern alpine skiing to modern fly fishing. Fly fishing and skiing both used to be a lot more difficult to access andeven more difficult to become truly good at. A similiar phenomenon hasoccured in both: recent technology has recreated the experince forbothsports (some would say ruined it) ************************************************************************/ AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Forks Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ --http://www.ida.net/users/rmoon /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Forks Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from bob@downandacross.com Wed Mar 27 07:06:05 2002 g2RD64418024 for ; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 07:06:04 - Wed,27 Mar 2002 08:03:32 -0500 Subject: FW: Info on Asbjorn Horgard rods Could amyone help me answer this question for a friend in OR? Thanks,Bob--- --Original Message----- Subject: Info on Asbjorn Horgard rods I was hoping that you could point me in a good direction to find out moreabout the value of the pole. I have the Lillemor (Little Mother) model. Itdoesn't appear to have ever been fished, because there is no dent in thecork from a reel ever being attached. The finish of the bamboo is inexcellent condition, as are the eyelets. It comes in a canvas bag with theAsbjorn Horgard logo. The top and bottom eyelets appear to be made ofsilver or nickel, with what appears to be glass in the eyelets. from Troy.Miller@BakerOilTools.com Wed Mar 27 07:41:51 2002 g2RDfo418878 for ; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 07:41:50 - (bhihdcimc01.bakerhughes.com [204.253.245.34] (may be forged)) (5.5.2653.19) id ; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 07:25:54 -0600 Subject: RE: Sv: try again - Re: Casting a Para 15 Kyle -- It takes a very good caster to hold 60 feet of 5 wt line in the air with anyrod, and closer to expert to carry 70', IMHO. TAM ** snip ** When you mention that the Para 15 should be able to cast 60ft to 70ft, doyou mean after shooting line, or it should have 60ft to 70ft of line in theair while casting? Kyle from Grhghlndr@aol.com Wed Mar 27 08:01:49 2002 g2RE1m419533 for ; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 08:01:48 - for ; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 09:01:35 - Subject: You need a cup of this every AM! DO NOT open if offended by the Fword http://bretsovens.bravepages.com/ http://bretsovens.bravepages.com/ MAILINXA12-0327085504; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 08:55:04 -0500 Wed, 27 Mar 2002 08:54:53 -0500 with Novell_GroupWise; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 08:47:22 -0500 Subject: Fwd: You need a cup of this every am! by hcri.org; Fri, 22 Mar 2002 12:30:40 -0500 22 11:36:03 2002 -0600 Fri, 22 Mar 2002 11:37:54 -0600 with Novell_GroupWise; Fri, 22 Mar 2002 11:37:45 -0600 "JoAnne Michalski" , ,, , Subject: You need a cup of this every am! FILETIME=[4C6F6E00:01C1D1C8] Jennifer ReiterWinston & Strawn35 W. Wacker DriveChicago, IL 60601(312) 558-5244jereiter@winston.com by wschigwia.winston.com; Fri, 22 Mar 2002 11:34:58 -0600 Fri, 22 Mar 2002 11:34:57 -0600 11:33:02 2002 -0600 JeReiter@winston.com; Fri, Subject: FW: You need a cup of this every am! "'Nick Suranyi'" , firejumper305@aol.com,"'Jim Albright'" FILETIME=[E2CE42F0:01C1D1C7] -----Original Message----- Halstead (E-mail); Brady, Jon (CORP, GEAccess); Meghjee, Abbas (CORP,GEAccess); Gichuru, John (CORP, GEAccess); Ket (E-mail); Soria (E- mail);Lucey, Peter (CORP, GEAccess)Subject: You need a cup of this every am! ? ? ? ?? ? Clean? Clean? DocumentEmail? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? MicrosoftInternetExplorer4????st1\:*{behavior:url(#default#ieooui) }?? ?? /* Style Definitions */ ?table.MsoNormalTable? {mso-style-name:"Table Normal";? mso-tstyle-rowband-size:0;? mso-tstyle-colband-size:0;? mso- style-noshow:yes;? mso-style-parent:"";? mso-padding-alt:0in 5.4pt 0in5.4pt;? mso-para-margin:0in;? mso-para-margin- bottom:.0001pt;? mso-pagination:widow-orphan;? font- size:10.0pt;? font-family:"Times New Roman";}?? -----Original Message-----From: Lucey, Peter (CORP, Sent: Friday, March 22, 2002 12:11PM Cc: Linky (E-mail); Denis Thornton(E-mail); 'alo@donnell.com'; Lisa Halstead (E-mail); Brady, Jon (CORP,GEAccess); Meghjee, Abbas (CORP, GEAccess); Gichuru, John (CORP,GEAccess); Ket(E-mail); Soria (E-mail); Lucey, Peter (CORP, GEAccess)Subject: You need a cup of thisevery am! from rodsupstream@exploremaine.com Wed Mar 27 08:03:11 2002 g2RE3A419702 for ; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 08:03:10 - for ; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 09:03:31 -0500 Subject: Maine Sportsman Show: Hi, If anybody should be going to the show stop by the booth and say hello, takecare, Tim. Upstream Always, Tim DoughtyRod MakerUpstream Custom Rods name="winmail.dat" filename="winmail.dat" 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 from lblove@omniglobal.net Wed Mar 27 08:59:13 2002 g2RExB422110 for ; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 08:59:12 - 0000 (63.71.237.238) Subject: Re: rod article just one quick question about the FAOL site...why do they log ip's when comments are posted to their site??is this a common practice on new bulletin boards? Also do you have to be a registered member to show up at any oftheir activities?? if not, Hey Troy wanna crash the gate with cane inhand(hand planed on 5" centers of course)?? Bradhttp://lblove.users.omniglobal.net*********** REPLY SEPARATOR *********** On 3/25/02 at 6:22 PM Bob Nunley wrote: Just thought some of you might be interested in the new article about from ttalsma@macatawa.org Wed Mar 27 09:30:49 2002 g2RFUn423735 for ; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 09:30:49 - id ; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 10:23:24 -0500 id HR1PZ32A; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 10:23:19 -0500 Subject: Re: rod article Brad, Usually IP's are logged so that they can be recorded and later banned ifthe need arises. Brad Love wrote: just one quick question about the FAOL site...why do they log ip's when comments are posted to their site??is this a common practice on new bulletin boards? Also do you have to be a registered member to show up at any oftheir activities?? if not, Hey Troy wanna crash the gate with cane inhand(hand planed on 5" centers of course)?? Bradhttp://lblove.users.omniglobal.net*********** REPLY SEPARATOR *********** On 3/25/02 at 6:22 PM Bob Nunley wrote: Just thought some of you might be interested in the new article about -- Todd Talsma 8412 North Maple Court Zeeland MI 49464 ------ email: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/ Bamboo Tips site:http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo/ Bamboo Sources site:http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo_Sources/ home page:http://external.sligh.com/~toddt/ genealogy pages: Under construction from blitzenrods@yahoo.com Wed Mar 27 10:19:07 2002 Received: from g2RGJ2426539 for ; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 Received: from [198.237.11.132] by web20202.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 27 Mar blitzenrods@yahoo.com Sender: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu X- Listprocessor-Version: 8.2.09/990901/11:28 -- ListProc(tm) by CREN HiFrank, I once looked over a rod similar to what you describe, and based onthe grip, ferrules, reelseat/handle, and winding check I guessed it to be aHorrocks Ibbotsen, but I didn't know for sure. Chris McDowell --- "Frank W.Paul" wrote: Hi Folks: I have a rod that has the following characteristics.I have consultedSinclair, Keane, Homel, and Campbell as bookreferences. Pack Rod: 7' 4 piece with 2 tips bamboo; allsections full length; 4English snake guides; no stipper guide; wraps lookoriginal on rod; snakewraps are black; a patterned set of intermediatewraps that are red andblack; cork sheet wrap over wood handle; metal reelseat 4.75 inches long;rolled welt brass plated ferrules; 1 inch long metalwinding check; nomarkings on the rod anywhere; assembled rod is infair condition; all gluelines look tight. My estimate is it is 1900 to 1920's era low end packrod. Any one have aclue to company that would have made this pack rod?Owner purchased from ashop on the west coast. Thanks in advance for anyinformation or insight onthe making company. Best, FrankFrank Paul, "GreyFox"TroutBeck Fly and RodBamboo Rod Refinishing and Restoration;Graphite and Glass Rod Repair;Trout Flies, Seneca, SC Summer Residence: Troutbeck Cottage, Waterville, PA;570-753- 8121fwpaul@ces.clemson.edu (work), Clemson University;864-656- 7471oakmere@carol.net (home), South Carolina;864-882-0077 __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Movies - coverage of the 74th Academy Awardshttp://movies.yahoo.com/ from Troy.Miller@BakerOilTools.com Wed Mar 27 10:20:05 2002 g2RGK5426646 for ; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 10:20:05 - (bhihdcimc01.bakerhughes.com [204.253.245.34] (may be forged)) for ; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 10:19:59 - (5.5.2653.19) id ; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 10:04:09 -0600 Subject: Rodmakers Worst Nightmare I have been silent during this ugly affair, and decided to mail Mr. Whackerpersonally. I asked a simple question concerning his identity, and hiscowardice showed through on his reply. Mr. Curry, I apologize forshortening his name to yours. I have no doubts that this is NOT you! I amsorry to see this attack on our list, but y'all will carry on, and continueto make the finest rods you know how. Why? Because you are called to.Warmest regards -- TAM -----Original Message----- Subject: RE: FAOL Article Reed -- I have no personal emotional reaction to your FAOL article, since I havenever made a cane rod. Further, I am an engineer by degree and profession,and tend to look at things from a very logical, pragmatic stance. In tryingto discover the root cause for your overtly antagonistic "journalism", Ihave only come up with two possibilities. First, financial. Money is the root of all that is unkind. I will deduce from Ladyfisher's later discussion on the BB, that you make a living, orportion of a living, from selling rods that you make on a beveller or mill.It is possible that by bashing those that you call "non-traditional" handplaners, that you seek to elevate the worth of your own output. Any personof intelligence could clearly see through your skeletal arguments.Certainly the greatness of any rod or rodmaker must be based on the outputitself, not merely the methods used to produce the product. I read yourarticle as nothing more than unsubstantiated marketing rhetoric, equivalentto that which you describe from the websites of the heathen planers. Second reason could be a deep-rooted hatred for one or more hand planers.If you cannot legally, nor what you might perceive as "ethically" bring downan individual within the bamboo community, you can certainly try bydiscrediting the group to which he belongs. The end result would be thesame? I can only imagine this scenario, as I have never harbored suchcontempt for anyone who is devoted to the same activity that I am. Howmuchhate is that? Flyfishers are my brothers and sisters. You are my brother.How could you do this? I suppose a final reason would be power/prestige. It is possible that atone time, you were considered to be one of the greatest makers. I canenvision you watching the up-and-comers, desperate to try anything to knocktheir legs out from under them. You may succeed for a while. But even "TheGreatest" himself, Muhammad Ali knew when his race was run, and hegracefully bowed to his successors. I never liked him while he wasfighting, but I now have deep respect for the man. If the latter is the situation for Reedwhacker, it would be the saddest forme. I live my life hoping each day to earn just a bit more respect from mypeers. Not command it, but genuinely earn it. My justification for askingyour identity, is that I wanted to know who I should never consider as modelmaker. You have undermined your own respect by writing and havingpublishedsuch a blitzkrieg article as Traditional Rod Making. Please, for a moment,reflect on the turmoil you've caused among rodmakers and their potentialcustomers. If you are not the least bit ashamed, God have mercy on yourmisguided soul. Troy A. Miller539 Meadow Creek Rd.Bellville, TX 77040 P.S. -- Your underhanded BB post telling customers to subscribe to Rodmakers andspyon the makers is deplorable. That is a forum for the open discussion ofrodmaking topics, not a one-way mirror for the general public to observetheir makers at work. If a maker asks a naive question on the list, thatdoes not brand him a bad maker. 50 years of experience does not qualify anartisan. Didn't Mozart make the king weep at the tender age of 6? Vision,determination, introspection, unwillingness to compromise at any cost --those are traits that define greatness to me. You are lacking, from theglimpse you've shown the world. I hope your rods are more worthy than yourwriting. -----Original Message----- Subject: RE: FAOL Article "Miller, Troy" wrote: Reed -- Who are you? Would you tell me if I solemnly promise not to tell anyone?TAM I am the rod makers worst nightmare! -- __________________________________________________________________ Your favorite stores, helpful shopping tools and great gift ideas.Experience the convenience of buying online with Shop@Netscape!http://shopnow.netscape.com/ Get your own FREE, personal Netscape Mailaccount today at http://webmail.netscape.com/ >Frompatrick.w.coffey@boeing.com Wed Mar 27 10:29:05 2002 Received: from stl- g2RGSt427507 for ; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 (5.5.2650.21) id ; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 08:23:00 -0800 Message- Subject: humor Date: Wed, 27 Mar 2002 patrick.w.coffey@boeing.com Sender: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu X- Listprocessor-Version: 8.2.09/990901/11:28 -- ListProc(tm) by CREN This format, some or all of this message may not be legible. from tausfeld@frontiernet.net Wed Mar 27 10:37:55 2002 g2RGbt428187 for ; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 10:37:55 - 0000 Subject: Re: Rodmakers Worst Nightmare If he is my worst nightmare, then he is a crooked blank!tom Reed -- Who are you? Would you tell me if I solemnly promise not to tell anyone?TAM I am the rod makers worst nightmare! -- __________________________________________________________________Your favorite stores, helpful shopping tools and great gift ideas.Experience the convenience of buying online with Shop@Netscape!http://shopnow.netscape.com/ Get your own FREE, personal Netscape Mail account today athttp://webmail.netscape.com/ from Eastkoyfly@aol.com Wed Mar 27 10:55:15 2002 g2RGtF429308 for ; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 10:55:15 - for ; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 11:54:54 - Subject: (no subject) Any body have the URL for the rodmakers page Joseph A Perrigowww.geneseevalleyrods.com5733 Griffith Rd.Portageville,NY 14536585-493-2637 from tjtrodmaker@yahoo.com Wed Mar 27 11:17:49 2002 g2RHHm401001 for ; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 11:17:49 - Wed, 27 Mar 2002 09:17:48 PST Subject: Re: (no subject) MMMMMMMMMM!? Ya checkin' up on us Joe? TIMOTHY --- Eastkoyfly@aol.com wrote: Any body have the URL for the rodmakers page Joseph A Perrigowww.geneseevalleyrods.com5733 Griffith Rd.Portageville,NY 14536585-493-2637 ====="Gooda' mornin', mister bear!" ...Ride, boldly ride,"The shade replied, -"If you seek for Eldorado!" -- E.A.Poe __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Movies - coverage of the 74th Academy Awardshttp://movies.yahoo.com/ from wlwalter77us@yahoo.com Wed Mar 27 11:39:31 2002 g2RHdU402376 for ; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 11:39:31 - Wed, 27 Mar 2002 09:39:30 PST Subject: Re: Rodmakers Worst Nightmare Rodmakers I think he's a troller and doesn't deserve anybodyrespect/ire or otherwise. If you seen his recent replyto an innocent question over on the FlyAnglersOnlinebulletin board you'll know what I mean. For crying outloud, someone asked an innocent question that probablyhad nothing to do with cane and bushwacker answered ina nasty, sarcastic manner. Ex FlyAnglersOnline reader,Bill Walters --- Jill and Tom Ausfeld wrote: If he is my worst nightmare, then he is a crookedblank!tom Reed -- Who are you? Would you tell me if I solemnly promise not to tell anyone? TAM I am the rod makers worst nightmare! -- __________________________________________________________________ Your favorite stores, helpful shopping tools and great gift ideas. Experience the convenience of buying online with Shop@Netscape! http://shopnow.netscape.com/ Get your own FREE, personal Netscape Mail account today at http://webmail.netscape.com/ __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Movies - coverage of the 74th Academy Awardshttp://movies.yahoo.com/ from johanyga@online.no Wed Mar 27 11:49:39 2002 g2RHnb403120 for ; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 11:49:38 - Wed, 27 Mar 2002 18:49:20 +0100 (MET) "rodmakers@wugate.wustl.e" Subject: SV: Info on Asbjorn Horgard rods Bob and List, When Hoergaard stopped making bamboo rods in 1983/84 the Lillemor cost1320NOK, ca.$ 150.In Hoergaard's 1976 catalog the same rod cost 405 NOK.($90).When I bought my first Hoergaard rod in 1968 their trout rods cost between150-200 NOK ($16-22).In comparison an Orvis Battenkill with a single tip then cost $100 and aWinston cost $120 with one tip.Today, I think you can get about 2000 NOK ca. $ 230 for the Lillemor in mintcondition. regards,Johan(Norway) -----Opprinnelig melding-----Fra: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sendt: 27. mars 2002 14:03Til: rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eEmne: FW: Info on Asbjorn Horgard rods Could amyone help me answer this question for a friend in OR? Thanks,Bob--- --Original Message----- Subject: Info on Asbjorn Horgard rods I was hoping that you could point me in a good direction to find out moreabout the value of the pole. I have the Lillemor (Little Mother) model. Itdoesn't appear to have ever been fished, because there is no dent in thecork from a reel ever being attached. The finish of the bamboo is inexcellent condition, as are the eyelets. It comes in a canvas bag with theAsbjorn Horgard logo. The top and bottom eyelets appear to be made ofsilver or nickel, with what appears to be glass in the eyelets. from rextutor@yahoo.com Wed Mar 27 12:03:10 2002 g2RI39404141 for ; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 12:03:09 -0600 27 Mar 2002 10:03:05 PST Subject: RE: Rod Information FrankHow does it cast / feel ? Whats the diameter above thegrip? Node pattern ? I know that HI had the ladiessometime choose 2 colors to wrap and so you see twocolors there. Check for patents on the tiptop andreel seat as Chub did that and sold his stuff toMontague. If I had to guess it's a Montague from thecork sheet handle. I have seen a Monty pack rod fromthat era. good luck --- Chris McDowell wrote: Hi Frank, I once looked over a rod similar to what youdescribe,and based on the grip, ferrules, reelseat/handle,andwinding check I guessed it to be a HorrocksIbbotsen,but I didn't know for sure. Chris McDowell --- "Frank W. Paul" wrote: Hi Folks: I have a rod that has the following characteristics. I have consultedSinclair, Keane, Homel, and Campbell as bookreferences. Pack Rod: 7' 4 piece with 2 tips bamboo; allsections full length; 4English snake guides; no stipper guide; wraps lookoriginal on rod; snakewraps are black; a patterned set of intermediatewraps that are red andblack; cork sheet wrap over wood handle; metal reel seat 4.75 inches long;rolled welt brass plated ferrules; 1 inch long metal winding check; nomarkings on the rod anywhere; assembled rod is infair condition; all gluelines look tight. My estimate is it is 1900 to 1920's era low end pack rod. Any one have aclue to company that would have made this pack rod? Owner purchased from ashop on the west coast. Thanks in advance for anyinformation or insight onthe making company. Best, FrankFrank Paul, "GreyFox"TroutBeck Fly and RodBamboo Rod Refinishing and Restoration;Graphite and Glass Rod Repair;Trout Flies, Seneca, SC Summer Residence: Troutbeck Cottage, Waterville, PA; 570-753-8121fwpaul@ces.clemson.edu (work), Clemson University;864-656- 7471oakmere@carol.net (home), South Carolina;864-882-0077 __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Movies - coverage of the 74th Academy Awardshttp://movies.yahoo.com/ __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Movies - coverage of the 74th Academy Awardshttp://movies.yahoo.com/ from Eastkoyfly@aol.com Wed Mar 27 12:20:12 2002 g2RIKB405150 for ; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 12:20:11 - Subject: Re: (no subject) Thanks everyone. I'm clean! Joseph A Perrigowww.geneseevalleyrods.com5733 Griffith Rd.Portageville,NY 14536585-493-2637 from jvswan@earthlink.net Wed Mar 27 12:49:09 2002 g2RIn9406320 for ; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 12:49:09 - (216.160.236.98) User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/9.0.1.3108 Subject: Bamboo splitter Hi folks, I am looking for one of those star-type bamboo splitters. I have seen theones on the Hida Tool web site. However, I would really like to find one ofthe kinds that you whack with the mallet (like the kind used in the Winstonvideo and seen on several web sites). It has a steel shaft fixed at thecenter of the blades and allows for the splitter to be rammed through usingan extension pole. The splitters at Hida have handles and would seem to bea little more difficult to use because they rely more on strength than massand momentum. Any ideas where I can find one of those? Thanks, Jason from cathcreek@hotmail.com Wed Mar 27 13:31:18 2002 g2RJVH408440 for ; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 13:31:17 - Wed, 27 Mar 2002 11:31:12 -0800 Wed, 27 Mar 2002 19:31:12 GMT Subject: Fwd: bamboo fiyfishing rods from China FILETIME=[F41DECC0:01C1D5C5] Maybe we should send this to BushWhacker? Rob From: "Zhu You Xin" Subject: bamboo fiyfishing rods from China Date: Thu, 28 Mar 200203:07:53 Hello,We are bamboo flyfishing rod builders from China.There are a lot of Tonkin bamboo in my hometown and many traditionalworkers are making bamboo rods and rod blanks by hand.We hope you find it interesting, and look forward to hearing from you.I many hope doing some business with you.Thank you very much for your time.Best Regards,Zhu YouXin.http://www.zhusrods.com _________________________________________________________________MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx from CALucker@aol.com Wed Mar 27 13:43:48 2002 g2RJhl409686 for ; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 13:43:47 - Subject: Re: Bamboo splitter In a message dated 3/27/02 10:50:01 AM Pacific Standard Time, jvswan@earthlink.net writes: The splitters at Hida have handles and would seem to bea little more difficult to use because they rely more on strength than massand momentum. The Hida ones are easy to use. I have a twelve splitter and six splitter. You do need bigger diameter culms for the twelve because the blob of cast metal in the center. The six will work with medium culms. I would like a star splitter such as those used by Dickerson, Winston, Talbot, LaVoy and others. The advantage to this splitter is that it has a slimmer center than the Hida splitter. There must be a welder on this list who can make the blanks and sell them to us to do our own sharpening? What about Goldenwitch? Sounds like a good project.Chris Lucker In a message dated 3/27/02 10:50:01 AM PacificStandard Time, jvswan@earthlink.net writes: The splitters at Hidahave handles and would seem to bea little more difficult to use because they rely more on strength thanmassand momentum. culms. I would like a star splitter such as those used by Dickerson, Winston, Talbot, list who can make the blanks and sell them to us to do our own project.Chris Lucker from goodaple@cox-internet.com Wed Mar 27 15:14:01 2002 g2RLE0416176 for ; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 15:14:00 -0600 (InterMail vK.4.03.05.03 201-232-132-103 license180e1de7f543f89455b24e508f9cca39) Subject: Rods from China Wow! 295.00 and 395.00. Does this take into account any exchange rates!! =I would like to see a close up of those rods! Randall R. Gregory NW AR. Wow! 295.00 and 395.00. Does thistake = any exchange rates!! I would like to see a close up of those rods! = Gregory NW AR. from eamon_lee@hotmail.com Wed Mar 27 16:13:16 2002 g2RMDF419813 for ; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 16:13:15 - Wed, 27 Mar 2002 14:13:10 -0800 Wed, 27 Mar 2002 22:13:09 GMT Subject: Wanted: Quad Blank FILETIME=[9468C4A0:01C1D5DC] Hey Yal'I was wondering if one of you guys wanted to part with a quad blank. Preferrably a blonde 7-7 1/2 ft. 2/2 4wt proven taper (one you have fished yourself). I would like to try my hand at finishing one out before I take the Nestea plunge and tool up to make them. I'll be glad to pay or trade. Pleae contact me off list. P.S. I hope this is kosher?! Eamon _________________________________________________________________Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer athttp://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp. from mcanultj@svm.vetmed.wisc.edu Wed Mar 27 16:30:52 2002 g2RMUq421125 for ; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 16:30:52 - 743.svm.vetmed.wisc.edu) 2002 16:30:52 -0600 Subject: Re: Photos from NZ PArt II- with and assist from Todd Talsma No, the problem is that the URL wraps to the second line depending on the line length specified in your email reader. The hot link only encompasses the one line and loses the last part. The rest of the URL should be pasted onto the address after you click on it and get the error message and then its fine.Jon At 01:17 PM 7/19/2002 +1200, Danny Twang wrote: I think Ya'll must be on some microsoft PC's, I have no problem justclicking the URL, the sits pop up right away.............MAC Rules:-)danny from mcanultj@svm.vetmed.wisc.edu Wed Mar 27 16:34:10 2002 g2RMY9421466 for ; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 16:34:10 - 743.svm.vetmed.wisc.edu) 2002 16:34:09 -0600 Subject: Re: Photos from NZ PArt II- with and assist from Todd Talsma Any chance there will be some captions on the photos? Never having met the guys in this group it would be cool to know who is who and what they are demoing in the shots.Cheers.Jon At 09:38 AM 7/19/2002 +1200, Danny Twang wrote: Todd has set up some of my photos from NZ, at his site: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo_Cont/Photo_Galleries/Danny_Twang_s_RSRG_Photos/danny_twang_s_rsrg_photos.html The image resoloution is keept small for easy browsing. regardsdanny from fcfp@ix.netcom.com Wed Mar 27 16:41:34 2002 g2RMfX422066 for ; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 16:41:33 - helo=0zlaw.ix.netcom.com) id 16qM6a-0001T9-00 for rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 17:41:22 -0500 Subject: Off Topic --=====================_37582373==_.ALT I have a request of our New Zealand friends: I have come across a really good hot sauce that is made in New Zealand. Kaitaia Fire I have found a web-site but have not had a response to a request to purchase products. If I send a list of things can you arrange a purchase? Please contact me off-list. f. _________________________Fred Bohls3519 Ada DriveMechanicsburg, PA 17050-2213 Home: (717) 732-5050Fax: (717) 732-2414 MAKE IT A GREAT DAY !!!!!! --=====================_37582373==_.ALT I have a request of our New Zealand friends:I have come across a really good hot sauce that is made in New FireI have found a web-site but have not had a response to a request to purchase?Please contact me off-list. _________________________FredBohls3519 Ada DriveMechanicsburg, PA 17050-2213 MAKEIT A GREAT DAY !!!!!! --=====================_37582373==_.ALT-- from dongreife@hotmail.com Wed Mar 27 16:53:22 2002 g2RMrL422897 for ; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 16:53:21 - Wed, 27 Mar 2002 14:53:15 -0800 HTTP; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 22:53:15 GMT Subject: Stabilizing Wood FILETIME=[2E467860:01C1D5E2] The LIST has a few posts on thesubject of stabilizing wood reel seats. Most were questions concerning 'howto'. One post provided a process which suggested using a piece of metal pipe, disolved in acetone) to cover the wood while inside the metal pipe, andsubjected to air pressure. If there are a few more details available on thisprocess, they would be much appreciated,,like 'how much plexaglass/acetone share and print your photos: Click Here from dannyt@frisurf.no Wed Mar 27 17:21:12 2002 g2RNLA424259 for ; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 17:21:10 - User-Agent: Microsoft-Outlook-Express-Macintosh-Edition/5.02.2022 Subject: Driggs 7'2" #3wt, 3piece After many recuest for this taper, here it is.enjoy,danny Rod Length: 7 ft 2 in (= 86 inches)Line Weight: 3Pieces: 3Line Fished: 30 ftTip Factor: 1.048Ferrule Type: StandardFerrule #1: Size 10/64; Wt 0.162 oz.; Rod Dim 9.91/64 @ 29 inFerrule #2: Size 15/64; Wt 0.358 oz.; Rod Dim 14.87/64 @ 57 in Station Rod Dimension Station SettingTip Section0 0.068 0.03405 0.088 0.044010 0.106 0.053015 0.123 0.061520 0.138 0.069025 0.148 0.074030 0.157 0.0785Mid Section25 0.148 0.074030 0.157 0.078535 0.184 0.092040 0.200 0.100045 0.211 0.105550 0.218 0.109055 0.227 0.113560 0.244 0.1220Butt Section55 0.227 0.113560 0.244 0.122065 0.258 0.129070 0.266 0.133075 0.267 0.133580 0.268 0.134085 0.269 0.134590 0.270 0.1350 from jojo@ipa.net Wed Mar 27 18:11:18 2002 g2S0BH425978 for ; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 18:11:17 -0600 helo=default) id 16qNVb-00006E-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 19:11:15 -0500 Subject: Chinese Rods Anyone interested in doing a group buy on Chinese rods and/or blanks, =please contact me off list. M-D Anyone interested in = list. M-D from rcurry@ttlc.net Wed Mar 27 18:55:39 2002 g2S0tc427424 for ; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 18:55:38 - User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:0.9.4)Gecko/20011019 Netscape6/6.2 Subject: Bumped off list - test Did I miss much today? This is a test.-- Best regards, Reed http://www.overmywaders.com/ >Fromkurt.clement@flashmail.com Wed Mar 27 19:36:04 2002 Received: from g2S1a3428774 for ; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 Mar 2002 01:34:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO shop) "Kurt Clement" From: "Kurt Clement" Subject: Re: Stabilizing Wood Date: Wed, 27Mar 2002 19:33:57 -0600 Message-ID: rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu X-Listprocessor- Version:8.2.09/990901/11:28 -- ListProc(tm) by CREN This is a multi-part message epoxy, thinned 1-1 = with denatured alchohol as a sealer. Finish turn the reelseat spacer = and finish sand it. Mix up the epoxy, thin 1-1 or even more with= denatured alchohol and slop it on the spacer inside and out for about 10 =minutes. Hang it up in a warm place for several days until it no longer = are using the acetone/plexiglass method (I have not done this) I = would thinkthat repeated cycles of pressure and release would act to = drive thesolution into the wood pores. Unless you are using an = unstable burl orspalted wood, I would not think that impregnation would = be needed. Just rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Date: LIST has a few posts on the subject of stabilizing wood reel = seats. Most denatured alchohol and slop it on the spacer inside and out for about 10 = rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= <rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= Wednesday, March 27, 2002 4:53 PMSubject:Stabilizing = Wood The LIST has a few posts on the subject of stabilizing wood = Most were questions concerning 'how to'. from CAIrvinerods@aol.com Wed Mar 27 20:32:08 2002 g2S2W7400481 for ; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 20:32:08 - for ; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 21:32:01 - Subject: Stablizing Reel Seat Wood Don, I will tell you how I do it and as you know from being on the list lots of folks may have other ideas. I melt as much Plexiglas in acetone as I can to get a varnish thickness. This can take a day or so but once it is at that thickness I place the wood inserts, which are sanded and ready to go, into the mixture. I do not pull a vacuum but if I could I would. I let them set out and drain. After they are dry, I buff with Bronell's white compound. You may have to go through the outside layer but buff away until you get the finish that you want and it is tough. I really do not want to claim any fame Fibers, it has lots of possibilities, we are only limited by our imaginations. Tight Lines, Chuck Don, I will tell you how I do it and as you know from being on the list lots of folksmay have other ideas. I melt as much Plexiglas in acetone as I can to get avarnish thickness. This can take a day or so but once it is at that thickness Iplace the wood inserts, which are sanded and ready to go, into the mixture. Ido not pull a vacuum but if I could I would. I let them set for at least a weekor two, they usually sink to the bottom, I then pull them out and drain. Afterthey are dry, I buff with Bronell's white compound. You may have to gothrough the outside layer but buff away until you get the finish that youwant and it is tough. I really do not want to claim any fame for this techniqueas I got the idea from Bob Newney's article in Power Fibers, it has lots ofpossibilities, we are only limited by our imaginations. Tight Lines, Chuck from lblan@provide.net Wed Mar 27 20:47:45 2002 g2S2lj401067 for ; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 20:47:45 - Subject: RE: Stablizing Reel Seat Wood Let me add one thing... I'll never tell who told me this of course, but make sure you are using Plexiglass (acrylic), not Lexan (polycarbonate). Larry Blan-----Original Message-----From: owner- rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu CAIrvinerods@aol.com Subject: Stablizing Reel Seat Wood Don, I will tell you how I do it and as you know from being on the list lots offolks may have other ideas. I melt as much Plexiglas in acetone as I can toget a varnish thickness. This can take a day or so but once it is at thatthickness I place the wood inserts, which are sanded and ready to go, intothe mixture. I do not pull a vacuum but if I could I would. I let them set them out and drain. After they are dry, I buff with Bronell's whitecompound. You may have to go through the outside layer but buff away untilyou get the finish that you want and it is tough. I really do not want toclaim any fame for this technique as I got the idea from Bob Newney'sarticle in Power Fibers, it has lots of possibilities, we are only limited Tight Lines, Chuck add one thing... I'll never tell who told me this of course, but make = (polycarbonate). Larry Blan CAIrvinerods@aol.comSent: Wednesday, March 27, 2002= Seat WoodDon,I will tell you= and as you know from being on the list lots of folks may have other = melt as much Plexiglas in acetone as I can to get a varnish thickness. = can take a day or so but once it is at that thickness I place the wood = inserts, which are sanded and ready to go, into the mixture. I do not = vacuum but if I could I would. I let them set for at least a week or = usually sink to the bottom, I then pull them out and drain. After they = dry, I buff with Bronell's white compound. You may have to go through = outside layer but buff away until you get the finish that you want and = tough. I really do not want to claim any fame for this technique as I = we are only limited by our imaginations.Tight Lines, = from jvswan@earthlink.net Wed Mar 27 21:53:38 2002 g2S3rb402770 for ; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 21:53:37 - (216.160.236.98) "Patrick W Coffey" ,"timothy troester" User-Agent: Microsoft- Entourage/9.0.1.3108Subject: Re: Bamboo splitter I appreciate all of you who took the time to respond to my splitter query. what I expected to learn. So far, no one has been able to identify a source However, I did get many encouraging responses from people who have beenusing the Hida, or pie, style splitter. It is, apparently, not astroublesome as it may appear. In fact, when the splitter gets into thebamboo, there seems to be a lot of whacking going on. By lifting thehandle, the bamboo comes up and a good sharp whack drives it even furtherdown the culm. So, reassured that there is some brute force and "whacking" involved (maybethat is how Reed got his name???), it looks like I will most likely get aHida. However, if anyone ever follows up on that custom tool order, pleasepost it to the list. I would still be interested in one. Thanks again for all the replies. This really is a generous group ofpeople. A great incubator for a newbie such as myself. Jason from atlasc1@earthlink.net Wed Mar 27 21:57:18 2002 g2S3vH403050 for ; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 21:57:17 -0600 ([209.179.148.214] helo=computer) id 16qR2K-0001Ml-00 for rodmakers@mail.wustl.edu; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 19:57:16 -0800 Subject: Who is it? Could the notorious author be GG? TA knows cane is more then $10 a culm. =But when GG bought a ton of it I bet that is what he paid for it. Could the notorious author be GG? TA = more then $10 a culm. But when GG bought a ton of it I bet that is what = from atlasc1@earthlink.net Wed Mar 27 22:08:50 2002 g2S48n403580 for ; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 22:08:49 -0600 ([209.179.148.214] helo=computer) id 16qRDU-00009u-00 for rodmakers@mail.wustl.edu; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 20:08:48 -0800 Subject: Mini lathe I have to say I am rather happy with the new 7x10 HF lathe. I was able =to turn some aluminum and it was in good alignment and performed =admiralby. I then bolted it to my work bench, turned some more stock, =turn it off but I forgot to turn down the speed controller. When I =turned it back on it would only go at one speed....fast. Well I do not =know squat about electronics. So I wrapped it up took it back to HF =thinking what a hassle it is going to be to return it. I walk in the =door with the lathe, no easy task, put it on the floor and told the guy =the problem. Within 5 min. I was out the door with new lathe no =questions asked. I feel better about HF Adam Vigil Chino, Ca 7x10 HF lathe. I was able to turn some aluminum and it was in good = performed admiralby. I then bolted it to my work bench, turned some more = turn it off but I forgot to turn down the speed controller. When I = back on it would only go at one speed....fast. Well I do not know squat = electronics. So I wrapped it up took it back to HF thinking what a = going to be to return it. I walk in the door with the lathe, no easy = it on the floor and told the guy the problem. Within 5 min. I was out = with new lathe no questions asked. I feel better about HF Adam Vigil Chino,Ca from lblan@provide.net Wed Mar 27 22:10:04 2002 g2S4A4403770 for ; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 22:10:04 -0600 for ; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 23:09:59 -0500 Subject: RE: Who is it? Read it again, Adam. He was claiming $10 per rod, $20 per culm, rounded off Larry Blan -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Wednesday, March 27, 2002 10:57 PM Subject: Who is it? Could the notorious author be GG? TA knows cane is more then $10 a culm.But when GG bought a ton of it I bet that is what he paid for it. off Larry Blan VigilSent: Wednesday, March 27, 2002 10:57 rodmakers@mail.wustl.eduSubject: Who is =it?Could the notorious author be GG? TA = is more then $10 a culm. But when GG bought a ton of it I bet that is = paid for it. from Troutgetter@aol.com Wed Mar 27 22:16:08 2002 g2S4G8404140 for ; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 22:16:08 -0600 Subject: Re: Mini lathe You broke it? Already?Nice company name!LaterMike Mike's Bamboo Rod ShopMontclair, CAhttp://www.mshaybamboo.gq.nu/ from Troutgetter@aol.com Wed Mar 27 22:19:47 2002 g2S4Jl404515 for ; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 22:19:47 -0600 Subject: Re: Off Topic I feel a group order coming on!Mike Mike's Bamboo Rod ShopMontclair, CAhttp://www.mshaybamboo.gq.nu/ from atlasc1@earthlink.net Wed Mar 27 22:22:24 2002 g2S4MN404821 for ; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 22:22:23 -0600 ([209.179.148.214] helo=computer) id 16qRQa-0000pD-00; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 20:22:21 -0800 Subject: Re: Who is it? I saw that is his other post. I never figured TA for a coward. I kind of =like his antagonistic mentality. Maybe reedwhacker was the one who wrote =the nasty 9/11 post on this website...I hope not Terry Say it isnt SO!!! Adam VigilRiseform Fly RodsChino, CA. Subject: RE: Who is it? Read it again, Adam. He was claiming $10 per rod, $20 per culm, =rounded off -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu = Sent: Wednesday, March 27, 2002 10:57 PM Subject: Who is it? Could the notorious author be GG? TA knows cane is more then $10 a =culm. But when GG bought a ton of it I bet that is what he paid for it. I saw that is his other post. I never = reedwhacker was the one who wrote the nasty 9/11 post on this = not Terry Say it isnt SO!!! Adam VigilRiseform Fly =RodsChino, CA. ----- Original Message ----- Larry = = Sent: Wednesday, March 27, 2002= PMSubject: RE: Who is it? off Larry Blan -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.w= VigilSent: Wednesday, March 27, 2002 10:57 = Who is it?Could the notorious author be GG? = is more then $10 a culm. But when GG bought a ton of it I bet that = he paid forit. from atlasc1@earthlink.net Wed Mar 27 22:25:40 2002 g2S4Pe405129 for ; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 22:25:40 -0600 ([209.179.148.214] helo=computer) id 16qRTm-0004kR-00; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 20:25:38 -0800 Subject: Re: Mini lathe Yep! I busted it. As for the name I have used it for years on ebay and formy other email address ,I decided to stop being lazy and putting on mypost. Adam VigilRiseform Fly RodChino, CA.----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Mini lathe You broke it? Already?Nice company name!LaterMike Mike's Bamboo Rod ShopMontclair, CAhttp://www.mshaybamboo.gq.nu/ from bob@downandacross.com Wed Mar 27 22:26:00 2002 g2S4Pw405222 for ; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 22:25:59 - 27 Mar 2002 23:25:48 -0500 "Patrick W Coffey" ,"timothy troester" Subject: RE: Bamboo splitter Jason, I am sorry I didn;t get to respond. Know full well that the Hida (Ihave an 8 way) is about the most fun part of rodbuilding. Whack thebejeebers outta that culm. Very therapeutic, especially good before thepending straightening.Best regards,Bob -----Original Message----- So, reassured that there is some brute force and "whacking" involved (maybethat is how Reed got his name???), from tausfeld@frontiernet.net Wed Mar 27 22:50:57 2002 g2S4ou406299 for ; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 22:50:56 -0600 0000 sender ) Subject: Re: Who is it? Adam and all, thankstom Subject: Who is it? Could the notorious author be GG? TA knows cane is more then $10 a =culm. But when GG bought a ton of it I bet that is what he paid for it. Adam and all, thankstom ----- Original Message ----- Vigil Sent: Wednesday, March 27, 2002= PMSubject: Who is it? Could the notorious author be GG? TA = is more then $10 a culm. But when GG bought a ton of it I bet that is = paid for it. from atlasc1@earthlink.net Wed Mar 27 23:01:50 2002 g2S51n406881 for ; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 23:01:49 -0600 ([209.179.147.194] helo=computer) id 16qS2W-0007Nr-00; Wed, 27 Mar 2002 21:01:33 -0800 Subject: Re: Who is it? Tom, We are just having fun. Nothing so serious at to have to "let it go". =Delete is your option. I do it all the time. There I just did it again. Adam VigilRiseform Fly RodsChino, CA Subject: Re: Who is it? Adam and all, thankstom Subject: Who is it? Could the notorious author be GG? TA knows cane is more then $10 a =culm. But when GG bought a ton of it I bet that is what he paid for it. Tom, We are just having fun. Nothing so = have to "let it go". Delete is your option. I do it all the time. There = did it again. Adam VigilRiseform Fly =RodsChino, CA ----- Original Message ----- and Tom Ausfeld = Sent: Wednesday, March 27, 2002= PMSubject: Re: Who is it? Adam and all, thankstom ----- Original Message ----- Vigil = Sent: Wednesday, March 27, = PMSubject: Who is it? Could the notorious author be GG? = is more then $10 a culm. But when GG bought a ton of it I bet that = he paid forit. from jojo@ipa.net Thu Mar 28 00:37:51 2002 g2S6bo408927 for ; Thu, 28 Mar 2002 00:37:50 -0600 helo=default) id 16qTXd-0004x7-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Thu, 28 Mar 2002 01:37:45 -0500 Subject: Chinese Rod for Sale Here boys! Check this out. http://pub12.ezboard.com/fclarksclassicflyrodforumflytackleforsaletradewanted.showMessage?topicID=673.topic M-D from petermckean@netspace.net.au Thu Mar 28 03:55:57 2002 g2S9tt411722 for ; Thu, 28 Mar 2002 03:55:55 - g2S9tkZ30159 for ; Thu, 28 Mar 2002 20:55:47 Subject: sealing signature - Tung oil Here's a question; I am making a rod with a hand rubbed Tung oil finish,and so far I think it looks really exceptional. I am at the stage of rubbing on the tenth coat of Tung oil, and the blankis starting to glow with a lustre that is really worth looking at. I have been fly fishing for trout since 1966, and I have never really had awet rod in all that time that I couldn't quickly and easily dry off, so Idon't feel that I am going to suffer at all from any loss of waterproofingquality. Anyway, the rod is glued with Epon and that ought to be about aswater resistant as you can get. BUT - how the hell do you seal the signature on oil finished rods, except byslopping on a section of varnish???? Thanks Peter from goodaple@cox-internet.com Thu Mar 28 04:34:30 2002 internet.com [208.180.118.48] (may be forged)) g2SAYT412240 for ; Thu, 28 Mar 2002 04:34:29 -0600 (InterMail vK.4.03.05.00 201-232-132 license180e1de7f543f89455b24e508f9cca39) Subject: Re: sealing signature - Tung oil Peter, Putting in a late night in the shop too I see. As for your answer. Istarted back in 1995 using tung oil as a rod varnish. Still do sometimes. Ialways used India ink for the signature directly on the surface of the cane.Then I very carefully started coating my rod with the tung oil by SOFTLYrubbing on consecutive coats to the desired result. Since you already haveseveral coats on your rod try this. Let those coats cure up a bit. Thengently with say 1000 or 1500 grit sand paper lightly rough up the flatswhere you want to write. This will allow your writing to adhere better aswell as allow the tung oil to properly adhere as well. At first you mightthink it will ruin that area of the rod, but once you coat the signature andthe roughed up varnish it will turn clear again. I would rub on at least 2more coats to do this( after you sign the rod). Hope this helps. Randall R.Gregory NW AR.----- Original Message ----- Subject: sealing signature - Tung oil Here's a question; I am making a rod with a hand rubbed Tung oil finish,and so far I think it looks really exceptional. I am at the stage of rubbing on the tenth coat of Tung oil, and the blankis starting to glow with a lustre that is really worth looking at. I have been fly fishing for trout since 1966, and I have never really had a wet rod in all that time that I couldn't quickly and easily dry off, so I don't feel that I am going to suffer at all from any loss of waterproofingquality. Anyway, the rod is glued with Epon and that ought to be about aswater resistant as you can get. BUT - how the hell do you seal the signature on oil finished rods, except by slopping on a section of varnish???? Thanks Peter from jcbyrd@direct-pest.com Thu Mar 28 05:59:46 2002 g2SBxk413316 for ; Thu, 28 Mar 2002 05:59:46 - by direct-pest.com [208.27.26.103] for ; Thu, 28 Mar 2002 06:40:15 -0500 Subject: Re: Bamboo splitter Jason: If you will reply to me off list I will give you the complete details as towhere to find the star splitter as in the Winston Video. A gentleman in Montana, Tom Wandashin makes them. They aren't cheap. Idon't own one. Joe =================================================Lost in the Hills of East Tennessee with a Bamboo Fly Rod in one handand a cigar in the other....."What a Great Life". Visit my bambooflyrod site at http://www.direct-pest.com/rodmaker----- Original Message ----- Subject: Bamboo splitter Hi folks, I am looking for one of those star-type bamboo splitters. I have seen theones on the Hida Tool web site. However, I would really like to find one of the kinds that you whack with the mallet (like the kind used in the Winston video and seen on several web sites). It has a steel shaft fixed at thecenter of the blades and allows for the splitter to be rammed through using an extension pole. The splitters at Hida have handles and would seem to be a little more difficult to use because they rely more on strength than mass and momentum. Any ideas where I can find one of those? Thanks, Jason from Grhghlndr@aol.com Thu Mar 28 06:35:22 2002 g2SCZK413845 for ; Thu, 28 Mar 2002 06:35:20 -0600 Subject: Re: Who is it? rodmakers@mail.wustl.edu I agree with TOM let this drop. Why do any of you guys even care who this friggen moron is. he did not do any of us any harm in any way and all you are doing is giving him a big smile every time you post anything that shows concern over this. I for one think we should all quit reading or participating in anything FAOL ever does again. I have totally deleted anything I ever had from them and I unbookmarked them as well. If I am not mistaken these people used to host on AOLs watering Hole and got kicked out of there for similar crap.Bret http://bretsovens.bravepages.com/ I agree with TOM let this giving him a big smile every time you post anything that shows concern over these people used to host on AOLs watering Hole and got kicked out of there http://bretsovens.bravepages.com/ from rcurry@ttlc.net Thu Mar 28 07:14:10 2002 g2SDE9414528 for ; Thu, 28 Mar 2002 07:14:09 - User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:0.9.4)Gecko/20011019 Netscape6/6.2 Subject: Why to ignore FAOL Its apparent that the publishers of FAOL intended the (cowardly unsigned) barbs toward cane rodmakers, just look at their motto for the week "Every flower must grow through Dirt.". Even one of their number recognized that the article was a self-serving attack by Reedwhacker, but that didn't elicit an apology from FAOL, just a lock-out so we could say nothing more. I have removed their link from my website, a small gesture, but something. Now I will leave them in their dirt.-- Best regards, Reed http://www.overmywaders.com/ >Frombob@downandacross.com Thu Mar 28 07:33:16 2002 Received: from g2SDXF415158 for ; Thu, 28 Mar 2002 "rodmakers" Subject: RE: sealing signature -Tung oil Date: Thu, 28 Mar 2002 08:32:57 -0500 Message-ID: Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Importance: Normal Sender:owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu X- Listprocessor-Version:8.2.09/990901/11:28 -- ListProc(tm) by CREN What about wax? Bob -----Original Message----- From: owner- rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu signature - Tung oil Here's a question; I am making a rod with a hand rubbedTung oil finish, and so far I think it looks really exceptional. I am at the stageof rubbing on the tenth coat of Tung oil, and the blank is starting to glowwith a lustre that is really worth looking at. I have been fly fishing for troutsince 1966, and I have never really had a wet rod in all that time that Icouldn't quickly and easily dry off, so I don't feel that I am going to suffer atall from any loss of waterproofing quality. Anyway, the rod is glued with Eponand that ought to be about as water resistant as you can get. BUT - how thehell do you seal the signature on oil finished rods, except by slopping on asection of varnish???? Thanks Peter > from bob@downandacross.com Thu From: "Bob Maulucci" Subject: RE: sealing signature - Tung oil Date:Thu, 28 Mar 2002 08:32:58 - 0500 Message-ID: Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Importance:Normal Sender: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu X- Listprocessor-Version: 8.2.09/990901/11:28 -- ListProc(tm) by CREN Peter, sorry Imissed the point of that question. Wax would only be good to help the waterresistence. Duh. Bob -----Original Message----- From: owner- rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu I don't feel that I am going to suffer at all from any loss of waterproofingquality. Anyway, the rod is glued with Epon and that ought to be about aswater resistant as you can get. BUT - how the hell do you seal the signature on oil finished rods, except by slopping on a section of varnish???? Thanks Peter from tausfeld@frontiernet.net Thu Mar 28 07:36:40 2002 g2SDad415595 for ; Thu, 28 Mar 2002 07:36:39 -0600 0000 sender ) Subject: Re: Who is it? Bret, I don't think a big boycott is in order. As you said it was harmless, Ithink they lacked judgement in giving the article air time, but they did.Hopefully in the future, they won't. Mistakes are ok to make, as long asyou only make them once. It angered alot of people, but that's reedwhackersMO. He posted 5 times to the FAOL, and 5 times he got someone wriled. FAOLwould do itself a favor by banning rw. from what I have read (please correct me if I'm wrong Deanna), graphiteseems to be the tool of choice amoung the majority of the readership.Why??? By the responses from the regular readers of FAOL, they don't knowor care about cane. Going by the articles I have read regarding cane postedthere, they probably never will. They appear to be mis-informed or notinformed at all. I forgot what the last article was about, but I remember acouple of us getting upset. Maybe its time for an article about the valuesof cane and why we prefer it and why they should try it.regardstom ----- Original Message ----- rodmakers@mail.wustl.edu Subject: Re: Who is it? I agree with TOM let this drop. Why do any of you guys even care who thisfriggen moron is. he did not do any of us any harm in any way and all youare doing is giving him a big smile every time you post anything that showsconcern over this. I for one think we should all quit reading orparticipating in anything FAOL ever does again. I have totally deletedanything I ever had from them and I unbookmarked them as well. If I am notmistaken these people used to host on AOLs watering Hole and got kicked outof there for similar crap.Bret http://bretsovens.bravepages.com/ from ttalsma@macatawa.org Thu Mar 28 07:39:33 2002 g2SDdW415900 for ; Thu, 28 Mar 2002 07:39:32 - id ; Thu, 28 Mar 2002 08:32:07 -0500 id HR1PZ38R; Thu, 28 Mar 2002 08:32:04 -0500 Subject: Winston Waters Does anyone have the link for this video online. I seem to havemisplaced my bookmark. Thanks.-- Todd Talsma 8412 North Maple Court Zeeland MI 49464 ------ email: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/ Bamboo Tips site:http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo/ Bamboo Sources site:http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo_Sources/ home page:http://external.sligh.com/~toddt/ genealogy pages: Under construction from rcristant@isgtransport.com Thu Mar 28 09:06:03 2002 Received: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: test Thread-Index: AcHWahNcbK0k2UZDRDiaDtPb8XDwLA== From: 8.2.09/990901/11:28 -- ListProc(tm) by CREN This is a multi-part message CleanCleanDocumentEmail =0 =0 MicrosoftInternetExplorer4 st1\:*{behavior:url(#default#ieooui) } table.MsoNormalTable {mso-style-name:"Table Normal"; mso-tstyle-rowband- size:0; mso-tstyle-colband-size:0; mso-style-noshow:yes; mso-style- parent:""; mso-padding-alt:0in 5.4pt 0in 5.4pt; mso-para-margin:0in; mso- para-margin-bottom:.0001pt; mso-pagination:widow-orphan; font- size:10.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman";} Cristant Customer Relations & DevelopmentManager ISG Transportation =Inc. 7965 = Goreway Unit # 2 Brampton, = L6T = from rcristant@isgtransport.com Thu Mar 28 09:22:26 2002 Received: content-class: urn:content-classes:message Subject: Proper Plane Angle X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: Proper Plane Angle Thread-Index:AcHWbF09cHUgGGGlQ4+bVpiySLH4IQ== From: "Robert Cristant" rcristant@isgtransport.com Sender: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu X- Listprocessor-Version: 8.2.09/990901/11:28 -- ListProc(tm) by CREN This today involves what people think the proper plane sharpening angle should be.More specifically I am interested in your opinions about whether to go with alow angle block plane (@ 12 degrees) or to stick with the standard blockplane (@ 20 degrees). I have been given many different opinions on thematter and am interested in a few more. My take on the whole matter is thatit is probably better to go with a low angle block plane because it is easier toget behind the plane to move it along the planning form. In doing so, however,I believe that we must compensate on the angle of the plane blade, making itsteeper. How much? I am not sure of (would guess @ 40 degrees). All CleanCleanDocumentEmail =0=0 MicrosoftInternetExplorer4 table.MsoNormalTable {mso-style-name:"Table Normal"; mso-tstyle- rowband-size:0; mso-tstyle-colband-size:0; mso-style-noshow:yes; mso- style-parent:""; mso-padding-alt:0in 5.4pt 0in 5.4pt; mso-para- margin:0in; mso-para-margin-bottom:.0001pt; mso-pagination:widow- orphan; font-size:10.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman";} My question today involves what people think the =proper More specifically I am interested in your opinions about whether =to gowith a low angle block plane (@ 12 degrees) or to stick with the =standard block have beengiven many different opinions on the matter and am interested in a few whole =matteris that it is probably better to go with a low angle block plane because =it is that we (would guess opinions wouldbe greatly appreciated. Robert =00 from avyoung@iinet.net.au Thu Mar 28 09:30:28 2002 g2SFUQ421980 for ; Thu, 28 Mar 2002 09:30:27 - Subject: Re: Why to ignore FAOL It's OK to get pissed at this kind of thing as long as it doesn't eat you up.Weed wanker is having a good giggle just now but sooner or later his bad karma will catch up as it always does. I hate to mention rock climbing again but I can't help remembering a jerk that appeared on the scene one season at my home crag who basicallydecided none of the normal gentlemanly rules applied because he was well above it.As a rule any hardware left on a route is considered fair game if it's been abandoned but on this day we were rained off and it took two raps to reach the ground meaning we left two seriously expensive for a bum climber (me) caming devices new (then) on the market called friends. We went to the cafe to wait out the storm but this guy decided to rappel down from the top while it was raining and steal the gear. We came to blows over it back in the pub and the cops arrived so it wasn't finished and I never saw the gear again.6 Months later I came across this jerk one pitch up on a 12 pitch aid route called Lord Gumtree at Mt Buffalo. He and his (same) partner were still asleep in their hammocks at the top of the first pitch presumably the empty 4lt cask of wine at the base of the climb was the cause and left a rope hang to 20 feet off the ground presumably because they were too knackered to bring it up by the time they made it to the top of the first pitch. Without the slightest qualms I found the longest stick I could and attached a jummar (rope climbing device) to it so I could grab the rope.I and the bloke I was with then pulled as hard as we could to take out all the stretch and cut the rope. It shot back like a bullet and woke them up.There was lots of yelling and threats etc.They had a second rope used to haul the "third man" which is the sack with all the gear you haul after you've made it to the next belay as well as the rope used to set up the hammocks so by joining this and the cut rope they made it back to the ground with a lot of messing about expected by angry hung over types that took a bit of time and as they weren't using two full ropes they needed two belays to make it to the ground.We disappeared into the bush to watch and laugh, they thought we'd gone back to the car park so the stouch to come would be in public so that's where they went. What we actually and it wasn't planned it just kind of happened was climb a ridge that is close to the first pitch of Lord Gumtree, rap down it and traverse to the belay these guys were on. Grab the gear and scoot. When we made it I couldn't believe all the hardware they hadn't cleaned from the route before setting up the hammocks, presumably night caught them out but it was like Christmass with all the gear there.Better fun than climbing and I wound up with more gear [:-)] That was about 20 years ago and I still have no sympathy for him. So if you're out there reed wanker and I think you are, just make sure you don't leave any rope laying about because given enough you'll hang yourself with it. Tony At 08:19 AM 3/28/02 -0500, Reed Curry wrote: Its apparent that the publishers of FAOL intended the (cowardly unsigned) barbs toward cane rodmakers, just look at their motto for the week "Every flower must grow through Dirt.". Even one of their number recognized that the article was a self-serving attack by Reedwhacker, but that didn't elicit an apology from FAOL, just a lock-out so we could say nothing more. I have removed their link from my website, a small gesture, but something. Now I will leave them in their dirt.--Best regards,Reedhttp://www.overmywaders.com/ /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Forks Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from tausfeld@frontiernet.net Thu Mar 28 09:45:30 2002 g2SFjT423050 for ; Thu, 28 Mar 2002 09:45:29 - 0000 Subject: Re: Proper Plane Angle There are people on the list more knowledgable than me on this. But, I =promised I would post a rod making subject as penance for past sins. I would go with the standard plane. The angle on the blade should be =about 40 degrees. I have used lower angles with good results, but had to =sharpen more frequently. If moving the plane along the form is too =hard, the blade is not sharp enough. tom Subject: Proper Plane Angle My question today involves what people think the proper plane =sharpening angle should be. More specifically I am interested in your =opinions about whether to go with a low angle block plane (@ 12 degrees) =or to stick with the standard block plane (@ 20 degrees). I have been =given many different opinions on the matter and am interested in a few =more. My take on the whole matter is that it is probably better to go =with a low angle block plane because it is easier to get behind the =plane to move it along the planning form. In doing so, however, I =believe that we must compensate on the angle of the plane blade, making =it steeper. How much? I am not sure of (would guess @ 40 degrees). All =opinions would be greatly appreciated. Robert CleanCleanDocumentEmail =0=0 MicrosoftInternetExplorer4 P.MsoNormal { FONT-FAMILY: "Times New Roman"; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; MARGIN: 0in 0in0pt; =mso-style-parent: ""; mso-pagination: widow-orphan; =mso-fareast-font-family: "Times New Roman"}LI.MsoNormal { FONT- FAMILY: "Times New Roman"; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; MARGIN: 0in 0in0pt; =mso- style-parent: ""; mso-pagination: widow-orphan; =mso-fareast-font-family: "Times New Roman"}DIV.MsoNormal { FONT-FAMILY: "Times New Roman"; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; MARGIN: 0in 0in0pt; =mso-style-parent: ""; mso-pagination: widow-orphan; =mso-fareast-font-family: "Times New Roman"}A:link { COLOR: blue; TEXT-DECORATION: underline; text-underline: single}SPAN.MsoHyperlink { COLOR: blue; TEXT-DECORATION: underline; text-underline: single}A:visited { COLOR: purple; TEXT-DECORATION: underline; text-underline: single}SPAN.MsoHyperlinkFollowed { COLOR: purple; TEXT-DECORATION: underline; text-underline: single}SPAN.EmailStyle17 { COLOR: windowtext; FONT-FAMILY: Arial; mso- style-type: =personal-compose; mso-style-noshow: yes; mso-ansi-font-size: 10.0pt; =mso-bidi-font-size: 10.0pt; mso-ascii-font-family: Arial; =mso- hansi-font-family: Arial; mso-bidi-font-family: Arial}DIV.Section1 { page: Section1} table.MsoNormalTable {mso-style-name:"Table Normal"; mso-tstyle- rowband-size:0; mso-tstyle-colband-size:0; mso-style-noshow:yes; mso- style-parent:""; mso-padding-alt:0in 5.4pt 0in 5.4pt; mso-para- margin:0in; mso-para-margin-bottom:.0001pt; mso-pagination:widow- orphan; font-size:10.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman";} Robert, There are people on the list more knowledgable than= past sins. about 40 degrees. I have used lower angles with good results, = the blade is not sharp enough. tom ----- Original Message ----- Robert Cristant Sent: Thursday, March 28, 2002 = AMSubject: Proper Plane =Angle My question today = your opinions about whether to go with a low angle block plane (@ 12 = = is probably better to go with a low angle block plane because it is = we must compensate on the angle of the plane blade, making it = = would be greatly appreciated. Robert from avyoung@iinet.net.au Thu Mar 28 09:50:08 2002 g2SFo6423463 for ; Thu, 28 Mar 2002 09:50:07 - Subject: Re: Proper Plane Angle As it just so happens I just made a high angle plane the same dimensions as the 9-1/2. It's a dovetailed steel body with an adjustable throat etc just like the 9-1/2 but I'm using a HSS iron set at about 55 degrees with a chip breaker.I had tennis elbow first in one arm then the other then they swapped again couldn't plane.I'm right now in the process of getting somebody to make me somesharpened carbide sections so I can braze them to mild steel and see how they go but I must say the HSS cutter blades Ian K famously of NZ gave me are bloodygood.Anyhow the plane works great, no tearouts at all even with lots being hoged off which is what I expected and obviously it works well for fine cuts also BUT and there always is the high angle makes this a two hand planing job even though the plane is small also as expected.The higher angle really does increase the resistance but it also planes better.What I'll do is drill three holes in the butt of the splines and fix a piece of steel with pins that fit the three holes. This I'll crimp to some SS wire I have laying about and firmly attached to my bench. The steel and pins idea can from seeing Jerry Young's Morgan Mill set up if you've ever seen this you'll know exactly what I mean.The pinned steel attached to the bench basically takes the place of your hand holding the spline, plane a bit and flip it, plane a bit and return it sort of thing. Tony At 10:22 AM 3/28/02 -0500, Robert Cristant wrote: My question today involves what people think the proper plane sharpening angle should be. More specifically I am interested in your opinions about whether to go with a low angle block plane (@ 12 degrees) or to stick with the standard block plane (@ 20 degrees). I have been given many different opinions on the matter and am interested in a few more. My take on the whole matter is that it is probably better to go with a low angle block plane because it is easier to get behind the plane to move it along the planning form. In doing so, however, I believe that we must compensate on the angle of the plane blade, making it steeper. How much? I am not sure of (would guess @ 40 degrees). All opinions would be greatly appreciated. Robert /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Forks Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from rextutor@yahoo.com Thu Mar 28 11:05:46 2002 g2SH5j427450 for ; Thu, 28 Mar 2002 11:05:45 - 28 Mar 2002 09:05:43 PST Subject: Re: Proper Plane Angle Robert ,Reading and experience has led me to 35 degrees.good luck --- Jill and Tom Ausfeld wrote: Robert, There are people on the list more knowledgable thanme on this. But, I promised I would post a rodmaking subject as penance for past sins. I would go with the standard plane. The angle onthe blade should be about 40 degrees. I have usedlower angles with good results, but had to sharpenmore frequently. If moving the plane along the formis too hard, the blade is not sharp enough. tom----- Original Message ----- From: Robert Cristant AMSubject: Proper Plane Angle My question today involves what people think theproper plane sharpening angle should be. Morespecifically I am interested in your opinions aboutwhether to go with a low angle block plane (@ 12degrees) or to stick with the standard block plane(@ 20 degrees). I have been given many differentopinions on the matter and am interested in a fewmore. My take on the whole matter is that it isprobably better to go with a low angle block planebecause it is easier to get behind the plane to moveit along the planning form. In doing so, however, Ibelieve that we must compensate on the angle of theplane blade, making it steeper. How much? I am notsure of (would guess @ 40 degrees). All opinionswould be greatly appreciated. Robert __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Movies - coverage of the 74th Academy Awardshttp://movies.yahoo.com/ from chris_wohlford@yahoo.com Thu Mar 28 11:21:15 2002 g2SHLE429377 for ; Thu, 28 Mar 2002 11:21:14 - Thu, 28 Mar 2002 09:21:13 PST Subject: Fwd: Edwards Quadrate #52 and #34 Can anyone on the list help this gentleman out? Regards,Chris --- Chris Lovell wrote: From: "Chris Lovell" Subject: Edwards Quadrate #52 and #34Date: Thu, 28 Mar 2002 10:39:48 - 0500 Hi! I was wondering if you could help me determine what lineweight these two rods would use, how old they were etc. They were givento me by an old friend now since passed away. He purchased them in the1940s or 1950s in Stratford Connecticut. Unfortunately the cases and clothsacks are missing. Any information you could provide would be most helpful. Sincerely, Chris Lovell __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Movies - coverage of the 74th Academy Awardshttp://movies.yahoo.com/ from bob@downandacross.com Thu Mar 28 11:50:57 2002 g2SHou401397 for ; Thu, 28 Mar 2002 11:50:56 - 28 Mar 2002 12:50:46 -0500 Subject: RE: Edwards Quadrate #52 and #34 Hi Chris:According to my catalog:#52 8' 4.75 oz. -stiff dry fly (Would be .5 oz. lighter with cork seat) $90#34 8' 4-4.25 oz. Cork skeleton seat. $60 I am going to guess based on the tapers I have seen and the Edward's I havecast, the #52 is a 6 and the #34 a 5/6 line weight rod.Bob M. -----Original Message----- Subject: Fwd: Edwards Quadrate #52 and #34 Can anyone on the list help this gentleman out? Regards,Chris --- Chris Lovell wrote: From: "Chris Lovell" Subject: Edwards Quadrate #52 and #34Date: Thu, 28 Mar 2002 10:39:48 - 0500 Hi! I was wondering if you could help me determine what lineweight these two rodswould use, how old they were etc. They were givento me by an old friendnow since passed away. He purchased them in the1940s or 1950s in StratfordConnecticut. Unfortunately the cases and clothsacks are missing. Anyinformation you could provide would be most helpful. Sincerely, Chris Lovell __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Movies - coverage of the 74th Academy Awards.http://movies.yahoo.com/ from rcurry@ttlc.net Thu Mar 28 12:03:19 2002 g2SI3I402239 for ; Thu, 28 Mar 2002 12:03:19 - User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:0.9.4)Gecko/20011019 Netscape6/6.2 Subject: Re: Response to Reedwanker Harry, I regret that you are supporting FAOL in this manner. They behaved abominably: first in printing an unsigned inflammatory article, then in attacks on naysayers, finally on locking out discussion. Now you are encouraging them to profit from these egregious acts by supplying a free article. Forgiveness follows repentance, c'est ca? Let Deanna write an article apologizing for her actions... that would be far more appropriate. Best regards,Reedhttp://www.overmywaders.com/ Harry Boyd wrote: Friends, Deanna Birkholm from FlyAnglers Online has asked me towrite a response to Reedwanker's article. I think I'vecalmed down enough to do so in a positive spirit. I'masking for your help. My article will be titled, "Why Roll Your Own." And no,not those left-handed cigarettes . Why should someonebuild his own bamboo fly rods? And if he should beginhand-planing, why is that the best way to begin? Or is it?Are hand-planed rods as "good" as milled rods? The article will be mine. I'm just looking for ideas.I will not quote you. I will not plagiarize your thoughts,either. Any help you offer will be greatly appreciated. Harry --Harry Boyd http://www.canerods.com/ Bamboo Rodshttp://www.fbcwin.com/ Our Church . -- > from twilhelm@occasionalrod.com Thu Mar 28 12:14:37 2002 Received: g2SIEb403000 for ; Thu, 28 Mar 2002 Mar 2002 13:14:34 -0500 Message-ID: From: "Tim Wilhelm" List" References:Subject: Re: Winston Waters Date: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express V6.00.2600.0000 Sender: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu X- Listprocessor-Version: 8.2.09/990901/11:28 -- ListProc(tm) by CREN Todd,Here's the link to Winston Waters:http://www.westernflyfisher.com/index.asp?i=0101p4v11&t=1 I was lookingat it last night, trying to sort something out when I noticed somethinginteresting. Look at the culm that is being split. There is no check split! I'mcurious if anyone has an explanation? Tim ----- Original Message ----- From: Sent: Thursday, March 28, 2002 8:35 AMSubject: Winston Waters Does anyone have the link for this video online. I seem to havemisplaced my bookmark. Thanks.--Todd Talsma8412 North Maple CourtZeeland MI 49464------ web design business page: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo Tips site: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo/Bamboo Sources site: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo_Sources/home page: http://external.sligh.com/~toddt/genealogy pages: Under construction from cathcreek@hotmail.com Thu Mar 28 12:36:38 2002 g2SIac404014 for ; Thu, 28 Mar 2002 12:36:38 - Thu, 28 Mar 2002 10:36:32 -0800 Thu, 28 Mar 2002 18:36:32 GMT Subject: Re: Response to Reedwanker FILETIME=[7BAE3CF0:01C1D687] Reed, I think Harry is trying to smooth things. I know my comments on FAOL probably have not helped. I think Harry can do a good job to show how misleading the WeakWhacker article was while not being combative. Rob From: Reed Curry Subject: Re: Response to ReedwankerDate: Thu, 28 Mar 2002 13:08:13 - 0500 Harry,I regret that you are supporting FAOL in this manner. They behavedabominably: first in printing an unsigned inflammatory article, then inattacks on naysayers, finally on locking out discussion. Now you areencouraging them to profit from these egregious acts by supplying a freearticle.Forgiveness follows repentance, c'est ca? Let Deanna write an articleapologizing for her actions... that would be far more appropriate. Best regards,Reedhttp://www.overmywaders.com/ Harry Boyd wrote: Friends, Deanna Birkholm from FlyAnglers Online has asked me towrite a response to Reedwanker's article. I think I'vecalmed down enough to do so in a positive spirit. I'masking for your help. My article will be titled, "Why Roll Your Own." And no,not those left-handed cigarettes . Why should someonebuild his own bamboo fly rods? And if he should beginhand-planing, why is that the best way to begin? Or is it?Are hand-planed rods as "good" as milled rods? The article will be mine. I'm just looking for ideas.I will not quote you. I will not plagiarize your thoughts,either. Any help you offer will be greatly appreciated. Harry --Harry Boyd http://www.canerods.com/ Bamboo Rodshttp://www.fbcwin.com/ Our Church . -- _________________________________________________________________Join the world's largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Thu Mar 28 13:13:57 2002 g2SJDu406276 for ; Thu, 28 Mar 2002 13:13:56 - (authenticated) for ; Thu, 28 Mar 2002 11:13:53 -0800 Subject: Re: Response to Reedwanker Reed, I'm sorry you felt it necessary to place this notice onthe Rodmakers list.I certainly did not. I only sent this note to a few folkswho had responded onthe FAOL Bulletin Board to Reedwhacker's article andsubsequent Bulletin Boardposts, plus two additional good friends. In fact, I hid thenote's recipientlist, because I really didn't want anyone else knowing whowas involved. PerhapsI should have spelled that out in the note, but I thought itwas self-evident. Fly Anglers Online has been only good to me. I havesold two rods through mycontacts there, and have hopes of selling others in thefuture. At their 2001Fish-In, Deanna and Jim had only nice things to say aboutone of my rods in areview on another site. I don't like the fact that they ranReedwhacker'sarticle without a name, but that is their choice. Notmine. And myunderstanding is that the author, Reedwhacker, asked to havehis name with-held. I hope she will run my article substantially as writtenand will include myname. I won't say anything privately that I would hesitateto say publicly. I do not agree with everything FAOL does. Citingexamples here would serveno good purpose. But theirs is probably the busiest site onthe web devoted tofly fishing only. Heck, I do not agree with everything, oreven much ofanything, that my own Southern Baptist Convention does. ButI still supportthem, even while vociferously trying to change things. I'lldo the same withFAOL. I do not agree that Deanna owes rod makers everywhere anapology. She didwhat she thought was right, and has been willing to take theheat for it. I doagree that the thread should not have been locked, though.I wish that had notbeen done. Though Deanna owes us no apology, I feel you owe me one to the Rodmakers List. If it comes, great. If it does not,well, I have longbelieved that though forgiveness follows repentance inDivine to humaninteractions, man to man it is often only forgiveness thatproduces repentance.So my forgiveness towards you has already been accomplished. Also, enough of this on Rodmakers. Let's take anyfurther correspondence offline, please. All my best,Harry --Harry Boyd http://www.canerods.com/ Bamboo Rodshttp://www.fbcwin.com/ Our Church from bassflyrodder@hotmail.com Thu Mar 28 13:39:55 2002 g2SJds407941 for ; Thu, 28 Mar 2002 13:39:54 - Thu, 28 Mar 2002 11:39:45 -0800 Thu, 28 Mar 2002 19:39:45 GMT Subject: Re: Response to Reedwanker FILETIME=[508CE450:01C1D690] Guys,I know that the article sucked the big wet one but do not get so worked up about it. If you looked at the last time the bamboo section of that site had a decent article you will find it has been a while a long while. I would not be surprised if Reed Whacker is not either Ladyfisher or J C (all I like to do is talk about myself). They have stirred up attention to get responses. Looks like they did a good job. Now they will more than likely get someone to submitt decent articles to set the record straight. I think the thing to do is just let it go and blew them off. I am not fond of those two but I have met and made some friends on there too. It is not all bad just the two that run it. Keep your plane sharp, Pete From: Reed Curry Subject: Re: Response to ReedwankerDate: Thu, 28 Mar 2002 13:08:13 - 0500 Harry,I regret that you are supporting FAOL in this manner. They behavedabominably: first in printing an unsigned inflammatory article, then inattacks on naysayers, finally on locking out discussion. Now you areencouraging them to profit from these egregious acts by supplying a freearticle.Forgiveness follows repentance, c'est ca? Let Deanna write an articleapologizing for her actions... that would be far more appropriate. Best regards,Reedhttp://www.overmywaders.com/ Harry Boyd wrote: Friends, Deanna Birkholm from FlyAnglers Online has asked me towrite a response to Reedwanker's article. I think I'vecalmed down enough to do so in a positive spirit. I'masking for your help. My article will be titled, "Why Roll Your Own." And no,not those left-handed cigarettes . Why should someonebuild his own bamboo fly rods? And if he should beginhand-planing, why is that the best way to begin? Or is it?Are hand-planed rods as "good" as milled rods? The article will be mine. I'm just looking for ideas.I will not quote you. I will not plagiarize your thoughts,either. Any help you offer will be greatly appreciated. Harry --Harry Boyd http://www.canerods.com/ Bamboo Rodshttp://www.fbcwin.com/ Our Church . -- _________________________________________________________________Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com from ttalsma@macatawa.org Thu Mar 28 13:47:37 2002 g2SJlb408687 for ; Thu, 28 Mar 2002 13:47:37 - id ; Thu, 28 Mar 2002 14:40:12 -0500 id HR1PZPJV; Thu, 28 Mar 2002 14:40:09 -0500 Subject: Re: Response to Reedwanker Not only that, but they've gotten all of us to go to their site. Hmmm. Looks like they may be trying to pad their old hit counter. Didn'tsomebody say that they were trying to get sponsership? "Look how muchexposure your ad will get, because of the content we've added, look atour rise in readership!" Good ploy, but still not the way to do it. Stay tuned, there's bound to be some good (globalflyfisher.com comes tomind) bamboo content out there. Needless to say, I wouldn't be the least bit worried about anything inthese posts on their site. For me and my house, we'll hand plane thecane. Well...at least most of the time. ;^) Peter Lawrence wrote: Guys,I know that the article sucked the big wet one but do not get so worked upabout it. If you looked at the last time the bamboo section of that sitehad a decent article you will find it has been a while a long while. Iwould not be surprised if Reed Whacker is not either Ladyfisher or J C (allI like to do is talk about myself). They have stirred up attention to getresponses. Looks like they did a good job. Now they will more than likelyget someone to submitt decent articles to set the record straight. I thinkthe thing to do is just let it go and blew them off. I am not fond of thosetwo but I have met and made some friends on there too. It is not all badjust the two that run it. Keep your plane sharp, Pete From: Reed Curry Subject: Re: Response to ReedwankerDate: Thu, 28 Mar 2002 13:08:13 - 0500 Harry,I regret that you are supporting FAOL in this manner. They behavedabominably: first in printing an unsigned inflammatory article, then inattacks on naysayers, finally on locking out discussion. Now you areencouraging them to profit from these egregious acts by supplying a freearticle.Forgiveness follows repentance, c'est ca? Let Deanna write an articleapologizing for her actions... that would be far more appropriate. Best regards,Reedhttp://www.overmywaders.com/ Harry Boyd wrote: Friends, Deanna Birkholm from FlyAnglers Online has asked me towrite a response to Reedwanker's article. I think I'vecalmed down enough to do so in a positive spirit. I'masking for your help. My article will be titled, "Why Roll Your Own." And no,not those left-handed cigarettes . Why should someonebuild his own bamboo fly rods? And if he should beginhand-planing, why is that the best way to begin? Or is it?Are hand-planed rods as "good" as milled rods? The article will be mine. I'm just looking for ideas.I will not quote you. I will not plagiarize your thoughts,either. Any help you offer will be greatly appreciated. Harry --Harry Boyd http://www.canerods.com/ Bamboo Rodshttp://www.fbcwin.com/ Our Church . -- _________________________________________________________________Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com -- Todd Talsma 8412 North Maple Court Zeeland MI 49464 ------ email: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/ Bamboo Tips site:http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo/ Bamboo Sources site:http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo_Sources/ home page:http://external.sligh.com/~toddt/ genealogy pages: Under construction from raymondttodd@mindspring.com Thu Mar 28 14:55:13 2002 Received: from maynard.mail.mindspring.net (maynard.mail.mindspring.net 37ka8nf.dialup.mindspring.com ([207.69.34.239] helo=default) by rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu From: "raymond t. todd" raymondttodd@mindspring.com Sender: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu any one with an interest, at woodply.com/classified.htm there are many LieNielsen planes for sale, plus other assorted wood working tools. Looks like acabinet maker is selling out. He indicates he will "deal". No financial interest, Istumbled on this while looking for wood turning blocks for reel seats. Bestregards, Tom Todd > from rcurry@ttlc.net Thu Mar 28 15:07:52 2002 g2SL7o413295 for ; Thu, 28 Mar 2002 2002 16:08:49 -0500 Message-ID: Date:Thu, 28 Mar 2002 16:12:48 -0500 From: Reed Curry User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:0.9.4) 8.2.09/990901/11:28 -- ListProc(tm) by CREN To whom it may concern (ifanyone), I caused offense to my friend Harry Boyd today, but I sincerelyapologized for my wrongdoing and was most graciously, and instantly,forgiven. All is well. Best regards, Reed http://www.overmywaders.com/ from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Thu Mar 28 15:24:48 2002 Received: from g2SLOg265848 for ; Thu, 28 Mar 200213:24:43 -0800 Message-ID: Date:Thu, 28 Mar 2002 15:24:09 -0600 From: Harry Boyd - no rodmaking content References: Amen, da rev [:-)] Reed Curry wrote: To whom it may concern (if anyone),I caused offense to my friend Harry Boyd today, but I sincerelyapologized for my wrongdoing and was most graciously, and instantly,forgiven. All is well. Best regards,Reedhttp://www.overmywaders.com/ --Harry Boyd http://www.canerods.com/ Bamboo Rodshttp://www.fbcwin.com/ Our Church from rcristant@isgtransport.com Thu Mar 28 15:30:08 2002 g2SLU8414798 for ; Thu, 28 Mar 2002 15:30:08 - content-class: urn:content-classes:messageSubject: RE: Proper Plane Angle Thread-Topic: Proper Plane AngleThread-Index: AcHWes1hx50oI9h8S+u3ld2qqI/ISwAJMpxw g2SLU8414799 Thank you to everyone for their input, it was greatly appreciated. Robert -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Proper Plane Angle Robert ,Reading and experience has led me to 35 degrees.good luck --- Jill and Tom Ausfeld wrote: Robert, There are people on the list more knowledgable thanme on this. But, I promised I would post a rodmaking subject as penance for past sins. I would go with the standard plane. The angle onthe blade should be about 40 degrees. I have usedlower angles with good results, but had to sharpenmore frequently. If moving the plane along the formis too hard, the blade is not sharp enough. tom----- Original Message ----- From: Robert Cristant AMSubject: Proper Plane Angle My question today involves what people think theproper plane sharpening angle should be. Morespecifically I am interested in your opinions aboutwhether to go with a low angle block plane (@ 12degrees) or to stick with the standard block plane(@ 20 degrees). I have been given many differentopinions on the matter and am interested in a fewmore. My take on the whole matter is that it isprobably better to go with a low angle block planebecause it is easier to get behind the plane to moveit along the planning form. In doing so, however, Ibelieve that we must compensate on the angle of theplane blade, making it steeper. How much? I am notsure of (would guess @ 40 degrees). All opinionswould be greatly appreciated. Robert __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Movies - coverage of the 74th Academy Awards(r)http://movies.yahoo.com/ from iank@ts.co.nz Thu Mar 28 16:12:54 2002 g2SMCq417060 for ; Thu, 28 Mar 2002 16:12:52 - by sage.ts.co.nz (8.11.3/8.11.3) id g2SMP7q12043 for rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu.KAV; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 10:25:07+1200 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 10:25:06 +1200 Subject: some cannons from the South Several people have asked for the tapers of a couple of the rods mentionedat the Southern rodmakers gathering. After some delay due to a flat batteryin my digital callipers here they are. 1. Danny's norwegian rod. A hollow butt rod, quite light, powerful andrelatively fast action, but not as fast as a Dickerson 8015 guide special. #7. It is 9' 0"Measured over relatively light varnish say .003 to .004. Sectionmeasurements averaged but variation usually within .002Hollowed section had a diameter of .194 at the bottom of the butt, abouthalf of the total cross section. 1" .0855" .11410" .13615" .15220" .16425" .17630" .19035" .20040" .22445" .25050" .27152 " .27155 ferrule58" .27960" .28665" ..29970" .31975" .33480" .35385" .36690" .38395" .39897 handle 2.Walker Brampton " Joe Frost Tonga" . Joe Frost was a guide in the Taupoarea in the 1950's and this rod was designed to his specifications forcasting heavy lures in big rivers for steel head trout.It is a slow action , feels heavy but that may have been the balance withthe reel being used , but an absolute cannon with a lot of power for liftingsunk lines and casting them a long way. It is 9'3", and #7.Measured over relatively heavy varnish allow .004 to .006. Thesemeasurements are an average of the 3 flats . There was variation up to .008between flats , but where this happened there was generally close toconsistancy between 2 flats and the other was higher. I attributed this tothe inconsistancy in the over varnishing and tended to discard the highreading when this occurred. 1" .1165" . 12210" .14715" .16420" .18325" .19730" .21635" .235 ( these measurements were double checked)40 . .237 ( these measurements were double checked)45" .24650 .25753 .257ferrule58" .27160 .27565" .28770" .29875" .30780" .31885" .33190" .34095" .34299" .360handle As can be seen these are two quite different rods, both of which cast a #7line very very well. Ian from horsesho@ptd.net Thu Mar 28 16:45:36 2002 g2SMjZ418754 for ; Thu, 28 Mar 2002 16:45:35 - by uid 50002 with qmail-scanner-1.10 (uvscan: v4.1.60/v4193. .Clear:0. Processed in 0.739448 secs); 28 Mar 2002 22:45:35 -0000 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:0.9.4)Gecko/20011019 Netscape6/6.2 Subject: Returning home. Hi All , I have just returned home from the Hospital and surgury. My Mitral heart valve was unrepairable so I am now a proud owner of a Cow's valve (beef just won't taste the same). All my arteries were clear so no other work was needed. I am on blood thinners now that can be stopped in 2 months. After a couple month recoup I should be back to normal. I wish to thank all list members for thier thoughts, prayers, and good wishes.Again, thanks to the entire list and it's good to be back. Marty from bob@downandacross.com Thu Mar 28 17:06:32 2002 g2SN6V419752 for ; Thu, 28 Mar 2002 17:06:31 - "rod" Subject: Mountain climbing and stealing stuff Man Tony, let me know when you're over here in the States. I will have tolearn to pee in the brush with cane rod in havd.Bob -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Why to ignore FAOLAs a rule any hardware left on a route is considered fair game if it's beenabandoned 20 years ago and I still have no sympathy for him. Tony from cathcreek@hotmail.com Thu Mar 28 17:18:13 2002 g2SNIC420428 for ; Thu, 28 Mar 2002 17:18:12 - Thu, 28 Mar 2002 15:18:06 -0800 Thu, 28 Mar 2002 23:18:06 GMT rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Re: Mountain climbing and stealing stuff FILETIME=[D17B5920:01C1D6AE] Bob, there is a joke in there somewhere, but I think I will let it go! Rob From: "Bob Maulucci" Subject: Mountain climbing and stealing stuffDate: Thu, 28 Mar 2002 18:06:10 -0500 Man Tony, let me know when you're over here in the States. I will have tolearn to pee in the brush with cane rod in havd.Bob -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Thursday, March 28, 2002 10:20 AM Subject: Re: Why to ignore FAOLAs a rule any hardware left on a route is considered fair game if it's beenabandoned 20 years ago and I still have no sympathy for him. Tony _________________________________________________________________Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com from OSEGAL@glcc.com Thu Mar 28 17:38:49 2002 g2SNcm421246 for ; Thu, 28 Mar 2002 17:38:48 - with Novell_GroupWise; Thu, 28 Mar 2002 18:38:33 -0500 Subject: Re: Returning home. God Bless you Marty and lots of health for many years!! Oscar Segal Cow's valve (beef just won't taste the same). All my arteries were = years!! Oscar Segal 03/28/02 = surgury. My Mitral heart valve was unrepairable so I am now a proud = a Cow's valve (beef just won't taste the same). All my arteries were = so no other work was needed. I am on blood thinners now that can stopped in 2 months. After a couple month recoup I should be back = normal. I wish to thank all list members for thier thoughts, = and good wishes. Again, thanks to the entire list and it's = be back. Marty from bdcbfr@chartermi.net Thu Mar 28 18:50:55 2002 g2T0os423022 for ; Thu, 28 Mar 2002 18:50:54 - "rod" Subject: Re: Mountain climbing and stealing stuff Hey Bob, All the real, traditional builders could pee with a cane rod in their hands.You Poser! Brian ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Mountain climbing and stealing stuff Man Tony, let me know when you're over here in the States. I will have tolearn to pee in the brush with cane rod in havd.Bob -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Thursday, March 28, 2002 10:20 AM Subject: Re: Why to ignore FAOLAs a rule any hardware left on a route is considered fair game if it's been abandoned 20 years ago and I still have no sympathy for him. Tony from bob@mcelvain.org Thu Mar 28 19:01:29 2002 g2T11S423377 for ; Thu, 28 Mar 2002 19:01:28 -0600 Mar 2002 18:13:14 -0700 MST Subject: Re: Bamboo Splitter To Bamboo Joe:Please post the name and address of the Montana bamboo splitter on thelist.=A0 I have sent you requests directly but they have all been returnedbecause your ISP thinks I am a spam source?=A0=A0 Other rod makers willwantto know the maker.=A0 Thanks.Bob McElvain from twilhelm@occasionalrod.com Thu Mar 28 19:19:00 2002 g2T1Ix424004 for ; Thu, 28 Mar 2002 19:18:59 - Thu, 28 Mar 2002 20:18:50 -0500 Subject: an idea for measuring culms for spliting Wanted to try a couple of things different on this next rod. First I triedthe splitting method that Nunley uses and that was pretty cool. I came upwith real consistent and straight strips this time. The other thing I thought I would try, and that seems to work pretty wellwas a way to determine or measure where to split. I took a piece of elastic from my wife's sewing kit and wanted to use it a measuring tape that couldvary in length. The elastic is about 1/2 wide and I stretched it around a culm marking it oneither side of the check split. I then put a mark halfway between those twomarks. After that I marked the elastic in thirds on either side of thecenter mark. Once I had it marked, I stretched the elastic around the culmto where the marks touch the check split, mark the center and split it inhalf. Then I stretched the elastic from the center mark to the outside markand then marked the half culm in thirds. You can take this down to 1/4strips but at this time I "eyeballed" splitting the strips in half and thenhalf again. Seemed to work real well and should work regardless of a culm's diametersince the elastic stretches. Only trouble I noticed is that you have to becareful that it is uniformly tensioned around the culm. LaterTim from jojo@ipa.net Thu Mar 28 19:41:19 2002 g2T1fI424794 for ; Thu, 28 Mar 2002 19:41:18 -0600 helo=default) id 16qlOH-00023t-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Thu, 28 Mar 2002 20:41:17 -0500 Subject: Assistance, please Guys, Does anyone know how I might contact Ari t'Hart? E-mail will be fine with me.I have a piece ofequipment that he personally made quite some years ago, and need someparts information. Thanks! M-D from jsschaeffer@hotmail.com Thu Mar 28 20:00:35 2002 g2T20Y425345 for ; Thu, 28 Mar 2002 20:00:34 - Thu, 28 Mar 2002 18:00:25 -0800 Subject: Re: sealing signature - Tung oil FILETIME=[7E17E0C0:01C1D6C5] After you sign the rod, mask off the signature on each side with tape. Put acoat of spar varnish over the signature. If you do it with care, you won'tget any on the adjacent flats. The signature coating will be glossier thanthe tung finish. You can rub it down with rottenstone or cutting compound tocut down the gloss, or leave it as is depending on your taste. Jeff Schaeffer from johanyga@online.no Thu Mar 28 20:32:07 2002 g2T2W5426266 for ; Thu, 28 Mar 2002 20:32:06 -0600 Fri, 29 Mar 2002 03:31:52 +0100 (MET) Subject: SV: Assistance, please Hi,I think his E-mail address is as follows; info@arihart.comregardsJohan -----Opprinnelig melding-----Fra: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sendt: 29. mars 2002 02:35Til: Rodmakers discussion groupEmne: Assistance, please Guys, Does anyone know how I might contact Ari t'Hart? E-mail will be fine withme. I have a piece ofequipment that he personally made quite some years ago, and need somepartsinformation. Thanks! M-D from kurt.clement@flashmail.com Thu Mar 28 20:45:48 2002 g2T2jl426773 for ; Thu, 28 Mar 2002 20:45:47 - 0000 "Rodmakers List" Subject: Re: Winston Waters Perhaps it was stored in a bundle and dried slowly. I have seen culmswithout splits. If it was not flamed and had been dried slowly perhaps itdid not slit. Alternatively, perhaps they knock out the nodal dams whenthey get the culms with a long steel rod. This may also prevent splitingand would aid in drying also. KurtNixa, MO -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Winston Waters Todd, Here's the link to Winston Waters: http://www.westernflyfisher.com/index.asp?i=0101p4v11&t=1 I was looking at it last night, trying to sort something out when I noticedsomething interesting. Look at the culm that is being split. There is nocheck split! I'm curious if anyone has an explanation? Tim----- Original Message ----- from kurt.clement@flashmail.com Thu Mar 28 20:45:52 2002 g2T2jp426778 for ; Thu, 28 Mar 2002 20:45:51 - 0000 Subject: Re: Proper Plane Angle A bedding angle of 20* with a blade bevel of 35* will give a cutting surfaceangle of 55*. (The bevel is mounted UP in a block plane and DOWN in a benchplane). The tradeoffsThe lower the blade bevel, the easier it is to get a sharp edge.At higher blade bevels the edge will last longer At lower cutting angles (blade bevel + bedding angle) the plane will beeasier to pushAt higher cutting angles you will get fewer lifts and tearouts and the planewill be harder to push. As Tony Young described - the cutting angle should be 45* to 55*. It's a dovetailed steel body with an adjustable throat etc justlike the 9-1/2 but I'm using a HSS iron set at about 55 degrees with a chip breaker. Good luck Robert KurtNixa, MO -----Original Message----- rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Subject: Re: Proper Plane Angle Robert ,Reading and experience has led me to 35 degrees.good luck --- Jill and Tom Ausfeld wrote: Robert,There are people on the list more knowledgable thanme on this. But, I promised I would post a rodmaking subject as penance for past sins. I would go with the standard plane. The angle onthe blade should be about 40 degrees. I have usedlower angles with good results, but had to sharpenmore frequently. If moving the plane along the formis too hard, the blade is not sharp enough. tom----- Original Message -----From: Robert Cristant Sent: Thursday, March 28, 2002 10:22 AMSubject: Proper Plane Angle My question today involves what people think theproper plane sharpening angle should be. Morespecifically I am interested in your opinions aboutwhether to go with a low angle block plane (@ 12degrees) or to stick with the standard block plane(@ 20 degrees). I have been given many differentopinions on the matter and am interested in a fewmore. My take on the whole matter is that it isprobably better to go with a low angle block planebecause it is easier to get behind the plane to moveit along the planning form. In doing so, however, Ibelieve that we must compensate on the angle of theplane blade, making it steeper. How much? I am notsure of (would guess @ 40 degrees). All opinionswould be greatly appreciated. Robert __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Movies - coverage of the 74th Academy Awardshttp://movies.yahoo.com/ from caneman@clnk.com Thu Mar 28 20:55:19 2002 g2T2tI427371 for ; Thu, 28 Mar 2002 20:55:18 -0600 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35) Subject: Re: Assistance, please M-D, his webite address is now http://www.dutchreels.com/ and the emailaddress has changed to info@dutchreels.comGreat reels... I think you should buy me one and send it as a show ofappreciation for sending you this URL! *S* Later,Rat R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com- ---- Original Message ----- Subject: Assistance, please Guys, Does anyone know how I might contact Ari t'Hart? E-mail will be fine with me. I have a piece of equipment that he personally made quite some years ago, and need some parts information. Thanks! M-D from cw@vanion.com Thu Mar 28 21:18:34 2002 g2T3IX428128 for ; Thu, 28 Mar 2002 21:18:33 - for ; Thu, 28 Mar 2002 20:23:36 - Subject: Finger nail bits Just got a MLCS catalog today, they're carring half radius bits, # 6583 =5/8 bead 1/4" shaft @ $17.00, 1/2" shaft @ $17.00 #8883. 1/2" bead/ 1/4=shaft # 6582 @ $16.00 , #8882 1/2" bead/ 1/2"shaft @ $16.00 Free =shipping. Just got a MLCS catalog today, = 1/2" shaft @ $17.00 #8883. 1/2" bead/ 1/4 shaft # 6582 @ = shipping. from jojo@ipa.net Thu Mar 28 21:57:28 2002 g2T3vR429032 for ; Thu, 28 Mar 2002 21:57:27 -0600 helo=default) id 16qnW2-0003YX-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Thu, 28 Mar 2002 22:57:27 -0500 Subject: Re: Assistance, please Thanks, Rodent and Johan I contacted them last night, and got a note back from the Pres that Ari hadnot been involved withthe company for over a year, and they would not be able to help me.Thanks for the info, though. (Nunley, you're just SOL.)Anyone else? M-D M-D, his webite address is now http://www.dutchreels.com/ and the emailaddress has changed to info@dutchreels.comGreat reels... I think you should buy me one and send it as a show ofappreciation for sending you this URL! *S* Later,Rat R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com Guys, Does anyone know how I might contact Ari t'Hart? E-mail will be fine with me. I have a piece of equipment that he personally made quite some years ago, and need some parts information. Thanks! M-D from flyrod@pop.digisys.net Thu Mar 28 21:59:49 2002 g2T3xl429272 for ; Thu, 28 Mar 2002 21:59:48 - g2T3xGZ00201; Subject: Re: Returning home. so I am now a proud owner of a Cow's valve (beef just won't taste the same). Glad you got mooooooved back home. Jim from jvswan@earthlink.net Thu Mar 28 23:33:03 2002 g2T5X2401346 for ; Thu, 28 Mar 2002 23:33:03 - (216.160.236.98) User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/9.0.1.3108Subject: Bamboo splitters Hi all, I just got an email from Bamboo Joe. He has spoken with a fellow in Montanawho makes those star splitters that are shown in the Winston Home Watersvideo. They are designed to be inserted into the end of a culm and rammeddown the center to split the thing. As far as I can tell, this is the onlysource for these tools (at least the only source I have heard of so far).If any of you have seen the Winston video, then you know how incredibly coolthe process looks. Fun, too. Kind of like making julienne fries, one punchof the machine, and PRESTO! A whole bundle of nicely split strips. Thewhole thing took maybe 10 seconds from setting the tool to gathering thestrips. Joe tells me that the tool is well made and has removable blades that allow arranged to split 3, 6, 9, 12, 15, or 18 strips). The person who makes thetool usually sells them for $750.00, but Joe says if there are 10 peopleinterested in purchasing one, the can be had for $550.00. Custom tools areusually expensive, but they are often worth the money. Joe has offered to make a group order. If you are interested, please sendan email to Joe: jcbyrd@direct-pest.com. I don't know what the paymentarrangements are like, but Joe will surely explain that at the time ofordering. Regards, Jason from dnorl@qwest.net Fri Mar 29 01:09:23 2002 g2T79M403275 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 01:09:22 -0600 0000 (63.228.46.109) Subject: Response to Reedwanker Maybe someone can explain to me why it is not OK for Reedwanker to have =his own view of bamboo rodmakers good or bad and why it is OK for us to =judge people who are judging people.Dave Maybe someone can explain to mewhy = = is OK for us to judge people who are judging people.Dave from dnorl@qwest.net Fri Mar 29 01:10:27 2002 g2T7AQ403434 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 01:10:26 -0600 0000 (63.228.46.109) Subject: winding guides Solved the problem of having the guide windings creep over onto the =cradles while winding and varnishing guides. Tiny doll size spring =clothes pins from a craft store clip onto the blank on either side of =the guide and keeps the blank from moving onto the winding. they come in =bags of 100 and are only a couple of bucks. Put the cradle in between =the clothes pins on the blank and your troubles are over.Dave Solved the problem of having the = creep over onto the cradles while winding and varnishing guides. Tiny = spring clothes pins from a craft store clip onto the blank on either = guide and keeps the blank from moving onto the winding. they come in = and are only a couple of bucks. Put the cradle in between the clothes = the blank and your troubles are over.Dave from dnorl@qwest.net Fri Mar 29 01:11:06 2002 g2T7B5403623 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 01:11:05 -0600 0000 (63.228.46.109) Subject: polishing PU varnish Noticed that the tube of Flitz that I use to polish my ferrules and reel =seat harware said metal and fibreglass. I tried it on PU varnish and it =works like a million bucks. 1000 grit wet dry glued to a popsicle stick =as per Bob Nunley to sand down the booger and Flitz polishes it back so =you cannot see where it was. Only 24 hours later too.Dave Noticed that the tube of Flitz that= polish my ferrules and reel seat harware said metal and fibreglass. I = on PU varnish and it works like a million bucks. 1000 grit wet dry glued = popsicle stick as per Bob Nunley to sand down the booger and Flitz = back so you cannot see where it was. Only 24 hours later =too.Dave from cathcreek@hotmail.com Fri Mar 29 01:28:04 2002 g2T7S3404264 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 01:28:03 -0600 Thu, 28 Mar 2002 23:27:58 -0800 Fri, 29 Mar 2002 07:27:58 GMT Subject: Re: Response to Reedwanker FILETIME=[4029E910:01C1D6F3] Dave, you are right:RO 2:1 "You, therefore, have no excuse, you who pass judgment on someone else, for at whatever point you judge the other, you are condemning yourself, because you who pass judgment do the same things." Then again, he makes it pretty tempting. My excuses to the reverand for stealing his show. Rob From: "Dave Norling" Subject: Response to ReedwankerDate: Thu, 28 Mar 2002 16:42:57 -0600 Maybe someone can explain to me why it is not OK for Reedwanker to havehis own view of bamboo rodmakers good or bad and why it is OK for us to judge people who are judging people.Dave Robert ClarkeCatherine Creek Rodscathcreek@hotmail.comhttp://ccr_2.tripod.com/bamboo/index.html1974 Honda CB750 K4 Dunstall-esqueSOHC Club member #2230 _________________________________________________________________Join the world's largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com from caneman@clnk.com Fri Mar 29 01:59:37 2002 g2T7xb404995 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 01:59:37 -0600 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35) Subject: Re: polishing PU varnish I use Flitz to polish my ferrules, checks and reelseat hardware, and =I never thought of using it to polish out a bad spot on a rod. Thanks, = Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com Subject: polishing PU varnish Noticed that the tube of Flitz that I use to polish my ferrules and =reel seat harware said metal and fibreglass. I tried it on PU varnish =and it works like a million bucks. 1000 grit wet dry glued to a popsicle =stick as per Bob Nunley to sand down the booger and Flitz polishes it =back so you cannot see where it was. Only 24 hours later too.Dave Dave, and reelseat hardware, and I never thought of using it to polish out a = Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com ----- Original Message ----- Dave =Norling Sent: Thursday, March 28, 2002 = PMSubject: polishing PU =varnish Noticed that the tube of Flitz = polish my ferrules and reel seat harware said metal and fibreglass. I = on PU varnish and it works like a million bucks. 1000 grit wet dry = popsicle stick as per Bob Nunley to sand down the booger and Flitz = back so you cannot see where it was. Only 24 hours later =too.Dave from avyoung@iinet.net.au Fri Mar 29 03:33:12 2002 g2T9XA406340 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 03:33:11 -0600 Subject: Re: Response to Reedwanker Bloody hell you guys this is sounding like a revival meeting. The guy wrote remarks that were at the very least inaccurate and certainly inflationary and intentionally divisive. If the writer was intending to single out a few he painted with a broad brush a lot of others as well.Yes reed wanker has a right to his/her opinion but so does every body else and there's no need to feel any sympathy for him/her unless that person lets it be know who that person is and explains what was behind what was written. It may not be an opinion as much as vested interest speaking in which case it's not even opinion. Tony At 07:27 AM 3/29/02 +0000, Robert Clarke wrote: Dave, you are right:RO 2:1 "You, therefore, have no excuse, you who pass judgment on someone else, for at whatever point you judge the other, you are condemning yourself, because you who pass judgment do the same things." Then again, he makes it pretty tempting. My excuses to the reverand for stealing his show. Rob /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from bamboorules@ns.sympatico.ca Fri Mar 29 06:10:56 2002 g2TCAu407990 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 06:10:56 -0600 Organization: New Scotland Fly Rods Subject: Who is going to Toronto Show?? All,I will be un subscribing :^( this weekend and before I did Iwanted to get a list of names of guys that were going to the Big show inToronto next weekend and what days they would be there so we could tryand hook up if I make it down.I have acquired a laptop so I may be able to re subscribe to thelist if I can access free internet from my barracks, albeit at a blazing28.8 modem and P100 processor speed. Guess I'll be missing my DSL andgetting in touch with why guys complain about large attachments ;^PI don't know if I'll make it down stateside while in Ontario now asI hear they are cracking down and a passport is necessary, can't getcaught up in all that while on course, the military frowns on being AWOLafter a weekend away! It's a shame as I was looking forward to seeingsome of you guys, was even thinking of trying to get down to Grayrock?? Shawn from pabix@aol.com Fri Mar 29 06:30:22 2002 g2TCUL408445 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 06:30:21 -0600 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 07:30:08 - Subject: New guy question This is my first message to the members of the list, but not my first exposure to it. I started my rod making adventure about six months agousing the George M and Wayne C books. Various steps were modified/changed formy convenience as I poured throught the archives of the Tips page. Since I wasn't going to cut any holes in the floors of my house, the Sir D drip method really came through for me. I have obvious flaws in my first rod but I made a second one as I went along and it is a little better, but none the less, not perfect. The problems for me have been:1. Getting 24 tip strips from a culm2. Wrapping ferrules3. Gaps in wraps4. My own weak eyesight(55 yrs old) ..you guys/gals in the same boat know what I mean5. Getting that last couple thous. on tip stripsHowever, all that aside, the rods both look good. (to me). this is rater lenghy way to get to a question but Gerge M says 3 to 6 months curingbefore fishing. Is this what everyone does? I am getting itchy to try them out. I used MOW spar. Bill Bixler from dannyt@frisurf.no Fri Mar 29 06:56:52 2002 g2TCun408883 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 06:56:49 -0600 User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/10.0.0.1309 Subject: Re: New guy question Hi Bill, Welcome to the List! Have You read about the Bob Nunley way of splitting by hand? Make a searchin the archive, and You'll find a description there. I too had problemsplitting, but when I start using my hands, its no problem getting 24 ormore splitts from a culm. Before You glue the ferrules to the blank, make sure You sand the tabs down,paper thin. You can also apply a little drop of epoxy, give it a sec over aheat gun or alcohol lamp, while You turn the blank. The epoxy will get thinand float to make a nice transition from cane to metal. When it is cured,You can lightly sand to make it even better. Use plenty of light, magnifier if You having problem to see the gaps. Usinglight color silk also helps "hiding" the flaws. What is the problem, doesn't the plane cut? Try a cabinet scraper or planeblade and give the strips a couple of stokes. If that doesn't help, Yourform probably needs to be closed a couple of thos. If the varnish is tack dry, go fishing today:-)) Cheers,danny BTW. Happy Easter 1. Getting 24 tip strips from a culm2. Wrapping ferrules3. Gaps in wraps4. My own weak eyesight(55 yrs old) ..you guys/gals in the same boat knowwhat I mean5. Getting that last couple thous. on tip stripsHowever, all that aside, the rods both look good. (to me). this is raterlenghy way to get to a question but Gerge M says 3 to 6 months curingbeforefishing. Is this what everyone does? I am getting itchy to try them out. Iused MOW spar. Bill Bixler from channer@frontier.net Fri Mar 29 06:56:57 2002 g2TCuv408888 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 06:56:57 -0600 Subject: Re: New guy question Bill;A week or two, if you can stand it that long, on the varnish works goodenuf for me. Oh, you might get a crack at the base of the ferrule, butyou might get the same crack even if you wait a year. I don't know aboutanyone else, but the most indispensible tool I have for rodmaking is mypair of 3.25x bifocals. When you get the culm split down to quarteres orsixths, try starting the split with a knife, then tuck it under your armand pull the strips apart, use your forearm to leverage the split tostear it. I find it works better for me to start the split with autility knife when they get small enough. I generally split to doubletip strips, then plane the pith side flat, then split once more. Welcometo the list, have fun!john pabix@aol.com wrote: This is my first message to the members of the list, but not my firstexposure to it. I started my rod making adventure about six months agousingthe George M and Wayne C books. Various steps were modified/changed convenience as I poured throught the archives of the Tips page. Since Iwasn't going to cut any holes in the floors of my house, the Sir D dripmethod really came through for me. I have obvious flaws in my first rodbut Imade a second one as I went along and it is a little better, but none theless, not perfect. The problems for me have been:1. Getting 24 tip strips from a culm2. Wrapping ferrules3. Gaps in wraps4. My own weak eyesight(55 yrs old) ..you guys/gals in the same boat knowwhat I mean5. Getting that last couple thous. on tip stripsHowever, all that aside, the rods both look good. (to me). this is raterlenghy way to get to a question but Gerge M says 3 to 6 months curingbeforefishing. Is this what everyone does? I am getting itchy to try them out. Iused MOW spar. Bill Bixler from dannyt@frisurf.no Fri Mar 29 07:01:30 2002 g2TD1T409460 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 07:01:29 -0600 User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/10.0.0.1309 Subject: New virus? I just got an mail with no subject, hidden sender and with an attachment.Can't remember the name of the file, but it was a .exe file. I don't know ifit is a virus, just wanted to let You guys know. Be careful out there, HappyEaster, Cheers,danny from rawhitejr@adelphia.net Fri Mar 29 07:16:08 2002 g2TDG7409887 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 07:16:07 -0600 29 Mar 2002 08:10:57 -0500 Subject: Re: New guy question ----- Original Message ----- Subject: New guy question This is my first message to the members of the list, but not my firstexposure to it. I started my rod making adventure about six months ago using the George M and Wayne C books. Various steps were modified/changed (text deleted) lenghy way to get to a question but Gerge M says 3 to 6 months curing before fishing. Is this what everyone does? I am getting itchy to try them out. Iused MOW spar. Bill Bixler Bill, There were several printing errors in Georges rodmaking book, one of the being the comment about curing for 3 to 6 months. 3 to 6 days would beOK. Bob White from carstenjorgensen@mail.dk Fri Mar 29 07:49:59 2002 g2TDnw410580 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 07:49:58 -0600 ;Fri, 29 Mar 2002 14:49:52 +0100 Subject: Sv: New guy question g2TDnx410581 Bob wrote: Bill, There were several printing errors in Georges rodmaking book, oneof the being the comment about curing for 3 to 6 months. 3 to 6 days wouldbeOK. Bob White Bob, I disagree in your last statement. Varnish, poly or others, take morethan 3-6 days to cure.If You wrap after varnishing wait at least 14 daysbefore doing so, or You wont be able to have the turns lying close together,as the silk/nylon makes marks in the varnish. regards, Carsten from bob@downandacross.com Fri Mar 29 08:02:16 2002 g2TE2F411034 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 08:02:15 -0600 Subject: RE: Response to Reedwanker Dave:It is okay for him to have that opinion, but he never signed his name (asyou did), he has the facts way off, and he is purposefully trying to takesales away from some honest people. I like to sell rods because I like tomake more than I possibly ever could use or afford to assemble and giveaway. There are several list members who are doing rods full time and arebeing told by RW that their rods are inferior. That just seems wrong to me.I am not in any way offended that he states milled rods are better, but I amoffended by his purpose and anonymity. If said writer had 8 or 9 rods fromthese hand planers and he reviewed them and showed pics of problems andslammed them with his observations on their performance, that would bebetter in my mind than what he did.You are absolutely right about people having a right to their opinions, butlike I tell my students: there are two types of opinions, supported andunsupported. I just personally feel that RW's opinion was too full of greyareas and stereotypes. Also, like school work, if you do not put you name onit for credit, why bother doing it?I have learned something from writing this...I have said way to much on it.BUT, I would like to hear the List's opinions on Hand Milled vs. Hand Planedvs. Milled.Cordially,Bob----- Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Thursday, March 28, 2002 5:43 PM Subject: Response to Reedwanker Maybe someone can explain to me why it is not OK for Reedwanker to havehis own view of bamboo rodmakers good or bad and why it is OK for us tojudge people who are judging people.Dave Dave: than I possibly ever could use or afford to assemble and give away. = several list members who are doing rods full time and are being told by = offended that he states milled rods are better, but I am offended by his = and anonymity. If said writer had 8 or 9 rods from these hand planers = reviewed them and showed pics of problems and slammed them with his = tell my students: there are two types of opinions, supported and = stereotypes. Also, like school work, if you do not put you name on it = credit, why bother doing it? learned something from writing this...I have said way to much on it. = would like to hear the List's opinions on Hand Milled vs. Hand Planed = Milled.Cordially,Bob NorlingSent: Thursday, March 28, 2002 5:43 ReedwankerMaybe someone can explain to me why it is not OK = Reedwanker to have his own view of bamboo rodmakers good or bad and = OK for us to judge people who are judging people.Dave from Dennishigham@cs.com Fri Mar 29 08:07:49 2002 g2TE7m411405 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 08:07:48 -0600 Subject: Re: New guy question Bill, Welcome to the list... check out "Rat" Nunley's hand splitting method (check the archives). If you can make Grayling or SRG there are a number of us who could show you how to split by hand. Splitting just takes a little practice. Also, you don't HAVE to split to 24 strips unless you have to make two rods out of a culm. I frequently get less because of leaf nodes or makers marks,etc. Thicker strips just means more planning. Regarding wraps, make sure you have a bright light...I don't think you can have too much light. Magnifiers work great they're available up to 3.5x, Orvis is carrying a set of 5x but they're about 50.00. Last couple of thou.....make sure your plane blade is really sharp and take your time. I wait at least 48 hours before lawn casting a rod but try to wait a week to 10 days before fishing....I have a nice 7',4wt that I put in a tube 3 days after varnishing last year so I could bring it to SRG....you should see the chips & chatter marks in the varnish ..the edge of the tube really chewed up the finish..:-} Dennis from Jkvseafood@aol.com Fri Mar 29 08:51:08 2002 g2TEp7412770 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 08:51:07 -0600 Subject: Re: Response to Reedwanker agreed. i felt this article was in very poor taste and would never subscribe to this mag. also irritated, john from Jkvseafood@aol.com Fri Mar 29 09:13:38 2002 g2TFDc414034 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 09:13:38 -0600 Subject: Tung oil rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu hello guys, if i could again pick your brains on this. how wuld tung oil work as a finish for a rod used in salt water only? thanks, john from Jkvseafood@aol.com Fri Mar 29 09:42:42 2002 g2TFgf415789 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 09:42:41 -0600 Subject: Re: Response to Reedwanker rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu i know i am new to bamboo rod building. however i have been making rods for over 20 years. there are many things to consider in a rod of excellent quality. if you can make a great rod on a mill or on planes they must have the qualities that make them great. the spacing of the nobes, spline of the rod, finish, checking for imperfections (worm roles etc.), glues, glue lines, keeping the finish from cracking at the ferrules and saw marks. the list can go on forever and i'm sure most of you with 20-50 years of bambooexperience can easily name 20 more things to add. my point being that a great rod canbe milled or hand planed, as long as it is made correctly. mills and bevelers can just save you time. i found that article to be offensive, argumentative and unnecessary, john from harms1@pa.net Fri Mar 29 09:47:08 2002 g2TFl7416243 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 09:47:08 -0600 Subject: Off-topic: on judgment Well, I'm not a theologian, but it seems to me that the question here is notso much whether or not one passes judgment, but rather what sort ofjudgmentis at issue. It is one thing to pass judgment on a person's behavior andviews, and quite another to judge the ultimate value of the man himself. Idon't believe I have been reading the latter on this list. Judgment is passed by all of us all the time--morals, ethics, legalities,proprieties, manners and codes of decency, and so on. Deferring to Harry onthe matter, nevertheless I doubt that RO 2:1 forbids all such practice. Onthe contrary, I believe we're obliged to call out judgment on many matters,and sometimes even on the people responsible for those matters as well. If some among us have been mistaken or excessive in our views of"Reedwacker's" performance, well then, that's the way it goes. But let noman throw a Bible at me, telling me that I may not criticize the behavior orthe views of another, lest I, in turn, risk being judged as some sort ofinfidel. I grew up in a place where, at every turn, somebody wanted tochuck their favorite quote from the Bible into my face and judge meaccordingly. So I've become more than a little dubious about piety of thatsort. I approve of "Reedwacker's" right to say what he wishes, as well as of"Ladyfisher's" right to publish what she chooses. That is not to say,however, that I must desist from judging their views and/or behavior astrash if that's the way I see it. Certainly, everyone has a right to anopinion and a choice of behavior, but that does not make the opinion or thebehavior good, nor does RO 2:1 prevent me from saying it is not. I am free to express my views and you are free to pass judgment on thewisdom both of those views and my decision to express them. You are alsofree NOT to do so if something in you prevents it. That is also just fine.I think that's why we call this place "America." We have freedoms, choices,responsibilities and consequences. RO 2:1, I think, does not mean to eraseall that. Cheers, Bill ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Response to Reedwanker Dave, you are right:RO 2:1 "You, therefore, have no excuse, you who pass judgment onsomeoneelse, for at whatever point you judge the other, you are condemningyourself, because you who pass judgment do the same things." Then again, he makes it pretty tempting. My excuses to the reverand forstealing his show. Rob From: "Dave Norling" Subject: Response to ReedwankerDate: Thu, 28 Mar 2002 16:42:57 -0600 Maybe someone can explain to me why it is not OK for Reedwanker tohave his own view of bamboo rodmakers good or bad and why it is OK for us tojudgepeople who are judging people.Dave Robert ClarkeCatherine Creek Rodscathcreek@hotmail.comhttp://ccr_2.tripod.com/bamboo/index.html1974 Honda CB750 K4 Dunstall-esqueSOHC Club member #2230 _________________________________________________________________Join the world's largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail.http://www.hotmail.com from rmoon@ida.net Fri Mar 29 09:49:12 2002 g2TFnB416540 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 09:49:11 -0600 Subject: Re: Planed vs. Milled --------------6C634617C013B108F75278B2 Bob, I am reluctant to make a blanket statement covering all milledrods and planed rods, but it is experience that even with novice rodmakers, the tolerances are better than a whole bunch of milled rods. Ihave spotted gaping glue seams in rods like Orvis, Some of the lowerquality production rods are almost noted for the shoddy work. Iremember vividly GG who spent a ton of money trying to stabilize hismill. I don't know if he ever solved his problems. I am furtherconvinced that a maker who is responsible for the rod as a whole asopposed to those who do only an assembly line portion of the whole hasmore interest in doing quality work. That old feeling that the "Oldgus" made up for this by having pride and loyalty to the company isquite frankly bull****. Every company and every employee will in thecrunch be for one person: HIMSELFAre there better milled rods than planed rods? Sure! and there arebetter planed rods than were ever milled.We should not lose sight of what we are doing. We are making atool to enable an individual to achieve a goal. Add to that theadditional purpose to provide pleasure for that individual. I don'tcare how pretty, or how perfect, or how innovative a fly rod is. If itdoes not cast a line with a fly attached it is worthless whether it e aPayne, or Dickerson, or Garrison or Moon. Even a poorly made rod can bea good fly rod. I once had a dog of a Montague Sunbeam brought to me She asked. I explained that the rod was almost worthless, and the costwould far outweigh any good it might bring. I lived to eat thosewords. After I worked on the rod, the glue seams were just as bad asever, the rod was still as far out of tolerances as it had been. Itlooked good. New grip and reelseat, new ferrules, and beautifulfinish. It cast like a dream. One of the really best rods I have evercast., Go figure. One of the worst rods I ever cast was a Garrison, byGarrison. I'll plane, you can do as you wish.Weed Wanker is entitled to his opinion, but he looking so narrowly atthe whole issue that his whole premise collapses. Just as well arguewhether Urac or Epon is the superior glue. (Nunley I can talk aboutthis too!,) Building quality fly rods is the whole issue. Ralph Bob Maulucci wrote: BUT, I would like to hear the List's opinions on Hand Milled vs. HandPlaned vs. Milled.Cordially,Bob -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu NorlingSent: Thursday, March 28, 2002 5:43 PM Subject: Response to ReedwankerMaybe someone can explain to me why it is not OK forReedwanker to have his own view of bamboo rodmakers good orbad and why it is OK for us to judge people who are judgingpeople.Dave --http://www.ida.net/users/rmoon --------------6C634617C013B108F75278B2 rod makers, the tolerances are better than a whole bunch of milled I remember vividly GG who spent a ton of money trying to stabilize his convinced that a maker who is responsible for the rod as a whole as opposedto those who do only an assembly line portion of the whole has more interest Every company and every employee will in the crunch be for one HIMSELF are better planed rods than were ever milled. it is worthless whether it e a Payne, or Dickerson, or Garrison or I explained that the rod was almost worthless, and the cost would faroutweigh I worked on the rod, the glue seams were just as bad as ever, the rod was Weed Wanker is entitled to his opinion, but he looking so narrowly about this too!,)Building quality fly rods is the whole issue.Ralph Bob Maulucci wrote: I would like to hear the List's opinions on Hand Milled vs. Hand Planedvs. Milled.Cordially,Bob -----OriginalMessage-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu]OnBehalf Of Dave NorlingSent: Thursday, March28,2002 5:43 PM rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Response toReedwankerMaybe someone can explain to me why it is not OK forReedwankerto have his own view of bamboo rodmakers good or bad and why it is OK forus to judge people who are judging people.Dave --http://www.ida.net/users/rmoon --------------6C634617C013B108F75278B2-- from harms1@pa.net Fri Mar 29 10:02:03 2002 g2TG1q417439 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 10:01:52 -0600 , Subject: Re: Tung oil John, Again, there's tung oil and there's "tung oil." One of them is 100% tungoil and never cures, while the other (much more commonly available product)is a rubbing oil that is actually blended with resins or polymers. Thislatter does cure, but even so, neither product will yield the kind ofmoisture retarding qualities that a good spar varnish will. The glow oftung oil is lovely, to be sure, but unless many, many coats are applied, youdon't get a lot of protection. As to salt water, it's not the water itself (or its accompanying salt) thatpresents much of a threat. It's the water vapor, or humidity. I reallydon't know if saline molecules would (or could) enter along with ambienthumidity, or, even if they did, what effect this might have upon thestructure of the cane. But, in the end, I would guess that the rod'shardware would be more vulnerable to potential salt damage than the roditself. Wax everything well, flush it, and wipe it all down after each use.Between use, store the rod in a particularly dry place. Cheers, Bill ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Tung oil hello guys, if i could again pick your brains on this. how wuld tung oilwork as a finish for a rod used in salt water only? thanks, john from bdcbfr@chartermi.net Fri Mar 29 10:08:17 2002 g2TG8H417977 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 10:08:17 -0600 Subject: Re: Planed vs. Milled What Ralph said. Brian Subject: Re: Planed vs. Milled Bob, I am reluctant to make a blanket statement covering all milled =rods and planed rods, but it is experience that even with novice rod =makers, the tolerances are better than a whole bunch of milled rods. I =have spotted gaping glue seams in rods like Orvis, Some of the lower =quality production rods are almost noted for the shoddy work. I =remember vividly GG who spent a ton of money trying to stabilize his =mill. I don't know if he ever solved his problems. I am further =convinced that a maker who is responsible for the rod as a whole as =opposed to those who do only an assembly line portion of the whole has =more interest in doing quality work. That old feeling that the "Old =gus" made up for this by having pride and loyalty to the company is =quite frankly bull****. Every company and every employee will in the = Are there better milled rods than planed rods? Sure! and there are = We should not lose sight of what we are doing. We are making a =tool to enable an individual to achieve a goal. Add to that the =additional purpose to provide pleasure for that individual. I don't =care how pretty, or how perfect, or how innovative a fly rod is. If it =does not cast a line with a fly attached it is worthless whether it e a =Payne, or Dickerson, or Garrison or Moon. Even a poorly made rod can be =a good fly rod. I once had a dog of a Montague Sunbeam brought to me = She asked. I explained that the rod was almost worthless, and the cost =would far outweigh any good it might bring. I lived to eat those words. =After I worked on the rod, the glue seams were just as bad as ever, the =rod was still as far out of tolerances as it had been. It looked good. =New grip and reelseat, new ferrules, and beautiful finish. It cast like =a dream. One of the really best rods I have ever cast., Go figure. =One of the worst rods I ever cast was a Garrison, by Garrison. I'll = Weed Wanker is entitled to his opinion, but he looking so narrowly at =the whole issue that his whole premise collapses. Just as well argue =whether Urac or Epon is the superior glue. (Nunley I can talk about = BUT, I would like to hear the List's opinions on Hand Milled vs. = From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu = Subject: Response to ReedwankerMaybe someone can explain to me why it is not OK for Reedwanker to =have his own view of bamboo rodmakers good or bad and why it is OK for =us to judge people who are judging people.Dave What Ralph said. Brian ----- Original Message ----- Ralph W. =Moon Cc: dnorl@qwest.net ; rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= Sent: Friday, March 29, 2002 = AMSubject: Re: Planed vs. =Milled all milled rods and planed rods, but it is experience that even = novice rod makers, the tolerances are better than a whole bunch of = the lower quality production rods are almost noted for the shoddy = I remember vividly GG who spent a ton of money trying to stabilize his = convinced that a maker who is responsible for the rod as a whole as = those who do only an assembly line portion of the whole has more = Every company and every employee will in the crunch be for one = = worthless whether it e a Payne, or Dickerson, or Garrison or = rod was almost worthless, and the cost would far outweigh any good it = you can do as you wish. Weed Wanker is entitled to his opinion, = looking so narrowly at the whole issue that his whole premise = would like to hear the List's opinions on Hand Milled vs. Hand = -----Original Message----- From: = rodmakers@w= Behalf Of Dave Norling Sent: Thursday, March 28, 2002 5:43 = rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Subject: Response to =ReedwankerMaybe someone can explain to me why it is not OK for = have his own view of bamboo rodmakers good or bad and why it is OK = to judge people who are judging = from KyleDruey@aol.com Fri Mar 29 10:09:44 2002 g2TG9h418210 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 10:09:43 -0600 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 11:09:35 - MAILINID44-0329110935; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 11:09:35 -0500 Subject: Re: polishing PU varnish check out the Flitz web page, in addition to the polishing compound they'vegot some interesting looking waxes: http://www.flitz.com/ Kyle In a message dated Fri, 29 Mar 2002 3:00:15 AM Eastern Standard Time,"Bob Nunley" writes: Dave, I use Flitz to polish my ferrules, checks and reelseat hardware, and I never thought of using it to polish out a badspot on a rod. Thanks, again... two great tips in a row. Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com ----- Original Message ----- From: Dave Norling PMSubject: polishing PU varnish Noticed that the tube of Flitz that I use to polish my ferrules and reel seat harware said metal and fibreglass. I triedit on PU varnish and it works like a million bucks. 1000 grit wet dry glued to a popsicle stick as per Bob Nunley to sand down the booger and Flitz polishesit back so you cannot see where it was. Only 24 hours later too.Dave from stoltz10@attbi.com Fri Mar 29 10:13:44 2002 g2TGDh418838 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 10:13:43 -0600 Subject: Re: New guy question as soon as the varnish is dry to the touch, fish it.----- Original Message ----- Subject: New guy question This is my first message to the members of the list, but not my firstexposure to it. I started my rod making adventure about six months ago using the George M and Wayne C books. Various steps were modified/changed convenience as I poured throught the archives of the Tips page. Since Iwasn't going to cut any holes in the floors of my house, the Sir D dripmethod really came through for me. I have obvious flaws in my first rod but I made a second one as I went along and it is a little better, but none theless, not perfect. The problems for me have been:1. Getting 24 tip strips from a culm2. Wrapping ferrules3. Gaps in wraps4. My own weak eyesight(55 yrs old) ..you guys/gals in the same boat knowwhat I mean5. Getting that last couple thous. on tip stripsHowever, all that aside, the rods both look good. (to me). this is raterlenghy way to get to a question but Gerge M says 3 to 6 months curing before fishing. Is this what everyone does? I am getting itchy to try them out. Iused MOW spar. Bill Bixler from tjtrodmaker@yahoo.com Fri Mar 29 10:26:27 2002 g2TGQQ419767 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 10:26:26 -0600 29 Mar 2002 08:26:25 PST Subject: Re: New guy question go fish! --- pabix@aol.com wrote: This is my first message to the members of the list,but not my first exposure to it. I started my rod making adventureabout six months ago using the George M and Wayne C books. Various steps weremodified/changed for my convenience as I poured throught the archives of theTips page. Since I wasn't going to cut any holes in the floors of myhouse, the Sir D drip method really came through for me. I have obviousflaws in my first rod but I made a second one as I went along and it is a littlebetter, but none the less, not perfect. The problems for me have been:1. Getting 24 tip strips from a culm2. Wrapping ferrules3. Gaps in wraps4. My own weak eyesight(55 yrs old) ..you guys/galsin the same boat know what I mean5. Getting that last couple thous. on tip stripsHowever, all that aside, the rods both look good.(to me). this is rater lenghy way to get to a question but Gerge M says 3to 6 months curing before fishing. Is this what everyone does? I am gettingitchy to try them out. I used MOW spar. Bill Bixler ====="Gooda' mornin', mister bear!" ...Ride, boldly ride,"The shade replied, -"If you seek for Eldorado!" -- E.A.Poe __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Greetings - send holiday greetings for Easter, Passoverhttp://greetings.yahoo.com/ from KyleDruey@aol.com Fri Mar 29 10:29:50 2002 g2TGTn420288 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 10:29:50 -0600 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 11:29:33 - MAILINID42-0329112933; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 11:29:33 -0500 Subject: Re: Response to Reedwanker What I find most useful from the article is the part about accuracy. I believeDickerson tried to achieve a tolerance of 0.004 in. vesus the flat to flatdimension and he milled. Seems like this tolerance can be achieved by handplaning. Any of the gray hairs want to weigh in? Kyle In a message dated Fri, 29 Mar 2002 10:43:02 AM Eastern Standard Time,Jkvseafood@aol.com writes: i know i am new to bamboo rod building. however i have been making rods over 20 years. there are many things to consider in a rod of excellent quality. if you can make a great rod on a mill or on planes they must have the qualities that make them great. the spacing of the nobes, spline of the rod, finish, checking for imperfections (worm roles etc.), glues, glue lines, keeping the finish from cracking at the ferrules and saw marks. the listcan go on forever and i'm sure most of you with 20-50 years of bambooexperience can easily name 20 more things to add. my point being that a great rod canbe milled or hand planed, as long as it is made correctly. mills and bevelers can just save you time. i found that article to be offensive, argumentative and unnecessary, john from bdcbfr@chartermi.net Fri Mar 29 10:36:16 2002 g2TGaF420831 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 10:36:15 -0600 "Rodmakers List" Subject: Re: Winston Waters Is the machine that looks like a beveler tapering those strips orhollow-fluting them? I couldn't see how you could build in a taper the waythey are running the strips without a template. Brian ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Winston Waters Todd, Here's the link to Winston Waters: http://www.westernflyfisher.com/index.asp?i=0101p4v11&t=1 I was looking at it last night, trying to sort something out when I noticed something interesting. Look at the culm that is being split. There is nocheck split! I'm curious if anyone has an explanation? Tim----- Original Message -----From: "Todd Talsma" Sent: Thursday, March 28, 2002 8:35 AMSubject: Winston Waters Does anyone have the link for this video online. I seem to havemisplaced my bookmark. Thanks.--Todd Talsma8412 North Maple CourtZeeland MI 49464------ web design business page: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo Tips site: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo/Bamboo Sources site: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo_Sources/home page: http://external.sligh.com/~toddt/genealogy pages: Under construction from avyoung@iinet.net.au Fri Mar 29 10:38:58 2002 g2TGct421230 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 10:38:55 -0600 Subject: RE: Response to Reedwanker Milled or planed, so what? Of all the rods you try out who can really tell. If you wanted to mic every rod you'd likely find less variation on a milled rod mainly due to minor variation of pressure of the plane *possibly* but then again if you were a really critical hand planer I guess you could be 100% bang on provided you were prepared to reject any spline with any variation at all depending on your own critique but that would have to be the extent of it. The rest is up to the person making the rod. I really like the Morgan mill and really would like to own one but prob never will so for my part for now I plane. It seems though it goes beyond the quality of the rod. According to the gospel of reed wanker a rod shouldn't look too good, nor have had too much time taken on it for to do so is to in some way reduce the rod's true meaning and purpose of existance.Also even if every thing is in accordance with the one true faith it all counts for zip if the maker is employed in any other activity not ofrodmaking.The TRUE rodmaker must live or die by his craft or he's just playing around and not worth a second thought like so many dogs nipping at the fringes of the flock of punters just waiting to be fleeced.Apparently. Tony At 08:58 AM 3/29/02 -0500, Bob Maulucci wrote: Dave:It is okay for him to have that opinion, but he never signed his name (as you did), he has the facts way off, and he is purposefully trying to take sales away from some honest people. I like to sell rods because I like to make more than I possibly ever could use or afford to assemble and give away. There are several list members who are doing rods full time and are being told by RW that their rods are inferior. That just seems wrong to me. I am not in any way offended that he states milled rods are better, but I am offended by his purpose and anonymity. If said writer had 8 or 9 rods from these hand planers and he reviewed them and showed pics of problems and slammed them with his observations on their performance,that would be better in my mind than what he did.You are absolutely right about people having a right to their opinions, but like I tell my students: there are two types of opinions, supported and unsupported. I just personally feel that RW's opinion was too full of grey areas and stereotypes. Also, like school work, if you do not put you name on it for credit, why bother doing it?I have learned something from writing this...I have said way to much on it. BUT, I would like to hear the List's opinions on Hand Milled vs. Hand Planed vs. Milled.Cordially,Bob----- Original Message----- rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu]On Behalf Of Dave NorlingSent: Thursday, March 28, 2002 5:43 PM Subject: Response to Reedwanker Maybe someone can explain to me why it is not OK for Reedwanker to have his own view of bamboo rodmakers good or bad and why it is OK for us to judge people who are judging people.Dave /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from avyoung@iinet.net.au Fri Mar 29 10:41:35 2002 g2TGfX421613 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 10:41:33 -0600 Subject: Re: New guy question I've been thinking for a while now there are two things all new comers to the list should be sent upon signing up.One is the sequence of events of the naming of the Sir D WC 7" # 4 rod and the other is the Rodent Nunley method of splitting.Both invariably sooner or later come up and both are required learning sooner or later and the sooner they are learned the happier all are [:-)] Tony At 09:07 AM 3/29/02 -0500, Dennishigham@cs.com wrote: Bill,Welcome to the list... check out "Rat" Nunley's hand splitting method (checkthe archives). If you can make Grayling or SRG there are a number of uswhocould show you how to split by hand. Splitting just takes a little practice.Also, you don't HAVE to split to 24 strips unless you have to make tworodsout of a culm. I frequently get less because of leaf nodes or makersmarks,etc. Thicker strips just means more planning. Regarding wraps, makesure you have a bright light...I don't think you can have too much light.Magnifiers work great they're available up to 3.5x, Orvis is carrying a setof 5x but they're about 50.00. Last couple of thou.....make sure your planeblade is really sharp and take your time. I wait at least 48 hours beforelawn casting a rod but try to wait a week to 10 days before fishing....I havea nice 7',4wt that I put in a tube 3 days after varnishing last year so Icould bring it to SRG....you should see the chips & chatter marks in thevarnish ..the edge of the tube really chewed up the finish..:-} Dennis /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from Darryl.Hayashida@phs.com Fri Mar 29 10:46:41 2002 g2TGke422067 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 10:46:40 -0600 pri.pacificare.com 2002 16:50:59 UT (Tumbleweed ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 08:45:30 -0800 Subject: RE: Planed vs. Milled I had the opportunity to closely observe the very milling machine the GGended up buying. In fact I had an opportunity to buy it before George did. Idecided to pass on it. The machine was great considering that a "homehobbiest" made it, although he was an aerospace engineer and so was betterthan what most guys could make. The machine was "fiddly". That is, it wascapable of making very precise and repeatable strips, but you had to reallyknow the machine. Of course the maker knew the machine inside and out, butanew operator would have to ruin quite a few strips to get to the point ofmaking good strips. Add to that that the mill fell over in the truck as itwas being transported to Oregon and got tweaked out of alignment, and I cansee why George had the problems that he did. I have also seen a Bellinger final taper mill in operation, and myimpression is the same - it is the care and experience of the operator thatdetermines the strip quality. Hand planing is the same - I have seen horrendous gaps in a hand planed rod,but most hand planed rods are pretty good to perfect. Again it is the careand experience of the operator. Quality is up to the person making the rod no matter what the process thatis used. Darryl Hayashida -----Original Message----- Sent: Friday, March 29, 2002 8:08 AM Cc: dnorl@qwest.net; rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Re: Planed vs. Milled What Ralph said.Brian ----- Original Message ----- bob@downandacross.com > Cc:dnorl@qwest.net ;rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu > Subject: Re: Planed vs. Milled Bob, I am reluctant to make a blanket statement covering all milledrods and planed rods, but it is experience that even with novice rodmakers, the tolerances are better than a whole bunch of milled rods. Ihave spotted gaping glue seams in rods like Orvis, Some of the lowerquality production rods are almost noted for the shoddy work. I remembervividly GG who spent a ton of money trying to stabilize his mill. I don'tknow if he ever solved his problems. I am further convinced that a makerwho is responsible for the rod as a whole as opposed to those who do onlyan assembly line portion of the whole has more interest in doing qualitywork. That old feeling that the "Old gus" made up for this by havingpride and loyalty to the company is quite frankly bull****. Every companyand every employee will in the crunch be for one person: HIMSELF Are there better milled rods than planed rods? Sure! and there arebetter planed rods than were ever milled. We should not lose sight of what we are doing. We are makinga tool to enable an individual to achieve a goal. Add to that theadditional purpose to provide pleasure for that individual. I don't carehow pretty, or how perfect, or how innovative a fly rod is. If it doesnot cast a line with a fly attached it is worthless whether it e a Payne,or Dickerson, or Garrison or Moon. Even a poorly made rod can be a goodfly rod. I once had a dog of a Montague Sunbeam brought to me forrenovation. I refused to do it, The customer was indignant. Why? Sheasked. I explained that the rod was almost worthless, and the cost wouldfar outweigh any good it might bring. I lived to eat those words. AfterI worked on the rod, the glue seams were just as bad as ever, the rod wasstill as far out of tolerances as it had been. It looked good. New gripand reelseat, new ferrules, and beautiful finish. It cast like a dream.One of the really best rods I have ever cast., Go figure. One of theworst rods I ever cast was a Garrison, by Garrison. I'll plane, you cando as you wish. Weed Wanker is entitled to his opinion, but he looking so narrowlyat the whole issue that his whole premise collapses. Just as well arguewhether Urac or Epon is the superior glue. (Nunley I can talk about thistoo!,) Building quality fly rods is the whole issue. Ralph Bob Maulucci wrote: BUT, I would like to hear the List's opinions on HandMilled vs. Hand Planed vs. Milled.Cordially,Bob -----Original Message----- From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu []On Behalf Of Dave Norling Sent: Thursday, March 28, 2002 5:43 PM Maybe someone can explain to me why it is not OK forReedwanker to have his own view of bamboo rodmakers good or bad andwhy itis OK for us to judge people who are judging people.Dave -- This electronic message transmission, including any attachments, containsinformation from PacifiCare Health Systems Inc. which may be confidentialor privileged. The information is intended to be for the use of the individualor entity named above. If you are not the intended recipient, be aware thatany disclosure, copying, distribution or use of the contents of thisinformation is prohibited. If you have received this electronic transmission in error, please notify thesender immediately by a "reply to sender only" message and destroy allelectronic and hard copies of the communication, including attachments. from Darryl.Hayashida@phs.com Fri Mar 29 10:49:44 2002 g2TGnh422448 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 10:49:44 -0600 pri.pacificare.com 2002 16:54:02 UT (Tumbleweed ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 08:48:33 -0800 Subject: RE: New guy question Maybe it's about time somebody did a list FAQ?Darryl Hayashida -----Original Message----- Sent: Friday, March 29, 2002 8:49 AM Subject: Re: New guy question I've been thinking for a while now there are two things all new comers to the list should be sent upon signing up.One is the sequence of events of the naming of the Sir D WC 7" # 4 rodand the other is the Rodent Nunley method of splitting.Both invariably sooner or later come up and both are required learning sooner or later and the sooner they are learned the happier all are [:-)] Tony At 09:07 AM 3/29/02 -0500, Dennishigham@cs.com wrote: Bill,Welcome to the list... check out "Rat" Nunley's hand splitting method (check the archives). If you can make Grayling or SRG there are a number of us who could show you how to split by hand. Splitting just takes a little practice. Also, you don't HAVE to split to 24 strips unless you have to make two rods out of a culm. I frequently get less because of leaf nodes or makersmarks,etc. Thicker strips just means more planning. Regarding wraps,makesure you have a bright light...I don't think you can have too much light.Magnifiers work great they're available up to 3.5x, Orvis is carrying a set of 5x but they're about 50.00. Last couple of thou.....make sure your plane blade is really sharp and take your time. I wait at least 48 hours beforelawn casting a rod but try to wait a week to 10 days before fishing....I have a nice 7',4wt that I put in a tube 3 days after varnishing last year so Icould bring it to SRG....you should see the chips & chatter marks in thevarnish ..the edge of the tube really chewed up the finish..:-} Dennis /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ This electronic message transmission, including any attachments, containsinformation from PacifiCare Health Systems Inc. which may be confidentialor privileged. The information is intended to be for the use of the individualor entity named above. If you are not the intended recipient, be aware thatany disclosure, copying, distribution or use of the contents of thisinformation is prohibited. If you have received this electronic transmission in error, please notify thesender immediately by a "reply to sender only" message and destroy allelectronic and hard copies of the communication, including attachments. from bhoy551@earthlink.net Fri Mar 29 10:50:28 2002 g2TGoQ422627 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 10:50:26 -0600 Fri, 29 Mar 2002 11:50:19 -0500 rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Subject: Re: New guy question FILETIME=[CF7B3990:01C1D741] Sounds like a FAQ is in the offinig :> bh At 12:48 AM 3/30/2002 +0800, Tony Young wrote: I've been thinking for a while now there are two things all new comers to the list should be sent upon signing up.One is the sequence of events of the naming of the Sir D WC 7" # 4 rod and the other is the Rodent Nunley method of splitting.Both invariably sooner or later come up and both are required learning sooner or later and the sooner they are learned the happier all are [:-)] Tony At 09:07 AM 3/29/02 -0500, Dennishigham@cs.com wrote: Bill,Welcome to the list... check out "Rat" Nunley's hand splitting method(checkthe archives). If you can make Grayling or SRG there are a number of uswhocould show you how to split by hand. Splitting just takes a little practice.Also, you don't HAVE to split to 24 strips unless you have to make tworodsout of a culm. I frequently get less because of leaf nodes or makersmarks,etc. Thicker strips just means more planning. Regarding wraps,makesure you have a bright light...I don't think you can have too much light.Magnifiers work great they're available up to 3.5x, Orvis is carrying a setof 5x but they're about 50.00. Last couple of thou.....make sure yourplaneblade is really sharp and take your time. I wait at least 48 hours beforelawn casting a rod but try to wait a week to 10 days before fishing....Ihavea nice 7',4wt that I put in a tube 3 days after varnishing last year so Icould bring it to SRG....you should see the chips & chatter marks in thevarnish ..the edge of the tube really chewed up the finish..:-} Dennis /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from ttalsma@macatawa.org Fri Mar 29 10:56:24 2002 g2TGuO423273 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 10:56:24 -0600 id ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 11:48:58 -0500 id HR1PZPZV; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 11:48:57 -0500 Subject: Re: New guy question If someone wants to write one, I'll post it on the tips archive. Bill Hoy wrote: Sounds like a FAQ is in the offinig :> bh At 12:48 AM 3/30/2002 +0800, Tony Young wrote: I've been thinking for a while now there are two things all new comers tothe list should be sent upon signing up.One is the sequence of events of the naming of the Sir D WC 7" # 4 rodandthe other is the Rodent Nunley method of splitting.Both invariably sooner or later come up and both are required learningsooner or later and the sooner they are learned the happier all are [:-)] Tony At 09:07 AM 3/29/02 -0500, Dennishigham@cs.com wrote: Bill,Welcome to the list... check out "Rat" Nunley's hand splitting method(checkthe archives). If you can make Grayling or SRG there are a number of uswhocould show you how to split by hand. Splitting just takes a little practice.Also, you don't HAVE to split to 24 strips unless you have to make tworodsout of a culm. I frequently get less because of leaf nodes or makersmarks,etc. Thicker strips just means more planning. Regarding wraps,makesure you have a bright light...I don't think you can have too much light.Magnifiers work great they're available up to 3.5x, Orvis is carrying asetof 5x but they're about 50.00. Last couple of thou.....make sure yourplaneblade is really sharp and take your time. I wait at least 48 hours beforelawn casting a rod but try to wait a week to 10 days before fishing....Ihavea nice 7',4wt that I put in a tube 3 days after varnishing last year so Icould bring it to SRG....you should see the chips & chatter marks in thevarnish ..the edge of the tube really chewed up the finish..:-} Dennis /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ -- Todd Talsma 8412 North Maple Court Zeeland MI 49464 ------ email: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/ Bamboo Tips site:http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo/ Bamboo Sources site:http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo_Sources/ home page:http://external.sligh.com/~toddt/ genealogy pages: Under construction from cathcreek@hotmail.com Fri Mar 29 10:57:34 2002 Received: from Fri, 29 Mar 2002 08:57:27 -0800 Received: from 140.211.60.66 bylw7fd.law7.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 16:57:27 GMT X- dnorl@qwest.net, rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Subject: Re: Off-topic: on text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID:X-OriginalArrivalTime: 29Mar 2002 16:57:27.0809 (UTC) FILETIME=[CEA92710:01C1D742] Sender:owner- rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu X-Listprocessor- Version:8.2.09/990901/11:28 -- ListProc(tm) by CREN Hey folks, I was just tryingto say something different and then put a little humor in it. Look at FAOL, Iam in there as much as anyone giving Wanker a hard time. I am by no meansperfect and was not suggesting that I am, nor that Wanker is blameless. Ijust think that in the big picuture it probabay doesn't make much difference.Rob From: "WILLIAM HARMS" Subject: Off-topic: on judgmentDate: Fri, 29 Mar 2002 10:42:49 -0500 Well, I'm not a theologian, but it seems to me that the question here is notso much whether or not one passes judgment, but rather what sort of judgmentis at issue. It is one thing to pass judgment on a person's behavior andviews, and quite another to judge the ultimate value of the man himself. Idon't believe I have been reading the latter on this list. Judgment is passed by all of us all the time--morals, ethics, legalities,proprieties, manners and codes of decency, and so on. Deferring to Harry onthe matter, nevertheless I doubt that RO 2:1 forbids all such practice. Onthe contrary, I believe we're obliged to call out judgment on many matters,and sometimes even on the people responsible for those matters as well. If some among us have been mistaken or excessive in our views of"Reedwacker's" performance, well then, that's the way it goes. But let noman throw a Bible at me, telling me that I may not criticize the behavior orthe views of another, lest I, in turn, risk being judged as some sort ofinfidel. I grew up in a place where, at every turn, somebody wanted tochuck their favorite quote from the Bible into my face and judge meaccordingly. So I've become more than a little dubious about piety of thatsort. I approve of "Reedwacker's" right to say what he wishes, as well as of"Ladyfisher's" right to publish what she chooses. That is not to say,however, that I must desist from judging their views and/or behavior astrash if that's the way I see it. Certainly, everyone has a right to anopinion and a choice of behavior, but that does not make the opinion or thebehavior good, nor does RO 2:1 prevent me from saying it is not. I am free to express my views and you are free to pass judgment on thewisdom both of those views and my decision to express them. You are alsofree NOT to do so if something in you prevents it. That is also just fine.I think that's why we call this place "America." We have freedoms, choices,responsibilities and consequences. RO 2:1, I think, does not mean to eraseall that. Cheers, Bill ----- Original Message -----From: "Robert Clarke" Sent: Friday, March 29, 2002 7:27 AMSubject: Re: Response to Reedwanker Dave, you are right:RO 2:1 "You, therefore, have no excuse, you who pass judgment onsomeoneelse, for at whatever point you judge the other, you are condemningyourself, because you who pass judgment do the same things." Then again, he makes it pretty tempting. My excuses to the reverandforstealing his show. Rob From: "Dave Norling" Subject: Response to ReedwankerDate: Thu, 28 Mar 2002 16:42:57 -0600 Maybe someone can explain to me why it is not OK for Reedwanker tohave his own view of bamboo rodmakers good or bad and why it is OK for us to judge people who are judging people.Dave Robert ClarkeCatherine Creek Rodscathcreek@hotmail.comhttp://ccr_2.tripod.com/bamboo/index.html1974 Honda CB750 K4 Dunstall-esqueSOHC Club member #2230 _________________________________________________________________Join the world's largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail.http://www.hotmail.com _________________________________________________________________Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com from avyoung@iinet.net.au Fri Mar 29 11:00:34 2002 g2TH0W424213 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 11:00:32 -0600 petermckean@netspace.net.au,rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Subject: Re: Tung oil I don't know for certain but salt water is very good at leaching oils and finishes in general. It and nothing else for that matter last very long on tillers and toe rails in my experience. I'd be inclined to use a polyurethane. Tony At 10:13 AM 3/29/02 -0500, Jkvseafood@aol.com wrote: hello guys, if i could again pick your brains on this. how wuld tung oilwork as a finish for a rod used in salt water only? thanks, john /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from KyleDruey@aol.com Fri Mar 29 11:08:37 2002 g2TH8b424766 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 11:08:37 -0600 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 12:08:21 - 0329120821; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 12:08:21 -0500 Subject: RE: Planed vs. Milled Oh jeeeeze, I thought GG was referring to Goodwin Granger, I can't believe youused those initials for the Gink! Such sacrilege during this Easter season... Make sure to put the story of the Gink on Tony Young's list of requiredreading for newbies. I stumbled across the Gink's website just after readingBruce Connor's bamboo faq so I am familiar with the legend. Kyle In a message dated Fri, 29 Mar 2002 11:47:04 AM Eastern Standard Time,"Hayashida Darryl" writes: I had the opportunity to closely observe the very milling machine the GGended up buying. In fact I had an opportunity to buy it before George did. Idecided to pass on it. The machine was great considering that a "homehobbiest" made it, although he was an aerospace engineer and so wasbetterthan what most guys could make. The machine was "fiddly". That is, itwascapable of making very precise and repeatable strips, but you had toreallyknow the machine. Of course the maker knew the machine inside and out,but anew operator would have to ruin quite a few strips to get to the point ofmaking good strips. Add to that that the mill fell over in the truck as itwas being transported to Oregon and got tweaked out of alignment, and Icansee why George had the problems that he did. I have also seen a Bellinger final taper mill in operation, and myimpression is the same - it is the care and experience of the operatorthatdetermines the strip quality. Hand planing is the same - I have seen horrendous gaps in a hand planedrod,but most hand planed rods are pretty good to perfect. Again it is thecareand experience of the operator. Quality is up to the person making the rod no matter what the processthatis used. Darryl Hayashida -----Original Message----- Sent: Friday, March 29, 2002 8:08 AM Cc: dnorl@qwest.net; rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Re: Planed vs. Milled What Ralph said.Brian ----- Original Message ----- bob@downandacross.com > > > Cc:dnorl@qwest.net ;rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu >Sent: Friday, March 29, 2002 10:48 AMSubject: Re: Planed vs. Milled Bob, I am reluctant to make a blanket statement covering all milledrods and planed rods, but it is experience that even with novice rodmakers, the tolerances are better than a whole bunch of milled rods. Ihave spotted gaping glue seams in rods like Orvis, Some of the lowerquality production rods are almost noted for the shoddy work. Iremembervividly GG who spent a ton of money trying to stabilize his mill. I don'tknow if he ever solved his problems. I am further convinced that amakerwho is responsible for the rod as a whole as opposed to those who doonlyan assembly line portion of the whole has more interest in doing qualitywork. That old feeling that the "Old gus" made up for this by havingpride and loyalty to the company is quite frankly bull****. Everycompanyand every employee will in the crunch be for one person: HIMSELF Are there better milled rods than planed rods? Sure! and there arebetter planed rods than were ever milled. We should not lose sight of what we are doing. We are makinga tool to enable an individual to achieve a goal. Add to that theadditional purpose to provide pleasure for that individual. I don't carehow pretty, or how perfect, or how innovative a fly rod is. If it doesnot cast a line with a fly attached it is worthless whether it e a Payne,or Dickerson, or Garrison or Moon. Even a poorly made rod can be agoodfly rod. I once had a dog of a Montague Sunbeam brought to me forrenovation. I refused to do it, The customer was indignant. Why? Sheasked. I explained that the rod was almost worthless, and the costwouldfar outweigh any good it might bring. I lived to eat those words. AfterI worked on the rod, the glue seams were just as bad as ever, the rodwasstill as far out of tolerances as it had been. It looked good. New gripand reelseat, new ferrules, and beautiful finish. It cast like a dream.One of the really best rods I have ever cast., Go figure. One of theworst rods I ever cast was a Garrison, by Garrison. I'll plane, you cando as you wish. Weed Wanker is entitled to his opinion, but he looking so narrowlyat the whole issue that his whole premise collapses. Just as well arguewhether Urac or Epon is the superior glue. (Nunley I can talk about thistoo!,) Building quality fly rods is the whole issue. Ralph Bob Maulucci wrote: BUT, I would like to hear the List's opinions on HandMilled vs. Hand Planed vs. Milled.Cordially,Bob -----Original Message----- From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu []On Behalf Of DaveNorling Sent: Thursday, March 28, 2002 5:43 PM ReedwankerMaybe someone can explain to me why it is not OK forReedwanker to have his own view of bamboo rodmakers good or badand why itis OK for us to judge people who are judging people.Dave -- This electronic message transmission, including any attachments,contains information from PacifiCare Health Systems Inc. which may beconfidential or privileged. The information is intended to be for the use ofthe individual or entity named above. If you are not the intended recipient, beaware that any disclosure, copying, distribution or use of the contents ofthis information is prohibited. If you have received this electronic transmission in error, please notifythe sender immediately by a "reply to sender only" message and destroy allelectronic and hard copies of the communication, including attachments. from avyoung@iinet.net.au Fri Mar 29 11:10:49 2002 g2THAl425047 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 11:10:47 -0600 Subject: Re: Off-topic: on judgment After getting a few private messages and reading postings to the list it seems I may have unintentionally caused a slight to Harry with my remark about the revival meeting etc.It's a cultural thing. It was obviously something that has more meaning in some places to some people than here and I most certainly did not intend it as anything more than an off hand remark to show my low regard to theneed of making a serious olive branch reply to reed wacker than what I think of Harry. I think very highly of Harry but I don't see the need to make a serious reply to an un named person.Harry, if I caused offence none was intended. Tony At 10:42 AM 3/29/02 -0500, WILLIAM HARMS wrote: Well, I'm not a theologian, but it seems to me that the question here is notso much whether or not one passes judgment, but rather what sort ofjudgmentis at issue. It is one thing to pass judgment on a person's behavior andviews, and quite another to judge the ultimate value of the man himself. Idon't believe I have been reading the latter on this list. /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from avyoung@iinet.net.au Fri Mar 29 11:17:47 2002 g2THHk425659 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 11:17:46 -0600 rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Subject: Re: New guy question Where's Todd? Tony At 11:50 AM 3/29/02 -0500, Bill Hoy wrote: Sounds like a FAQ is in the offinig :> bh At 12:48 AM 3/30/2002 +0800, Tony Young wrote: I've been thinking for a while now there are two things all new comers to the list should be sent upon signing up.One is the sequence of events of the naming of the Sir D WC 7" # 4 rod and the other is the Rodent Nunley method of splitting.Both invariably sooner or later come up and both are required learning sooner or later and the sooner they are learned the happier all are [:-)] Tony /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from avyoung@iinet.net.au Fri Mar 29 11:22:46 2002 g2THMj426270 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 11:22:45 -0600 Subject: RE: Planed vs. Milled That's a good idea re. GG. It could go under the title of something like The Charge Of The Gerke Brigade or The Perils Of Knowing It All or something like that.It's good reading, recomended. Tony At 12:08 PM 3/29/02 -0500, KyleDruey@aol.com wrote: Oh jeeeeze, I thought GG was referring to Goodwin Granger, I can't believe you used those initials for the Gink! Such sacrilege during this Easter season... Make sure to put the story of the Gink on Tony Young's list of required reading for newbies. I stumbled across the Gink's website just after reading Bruce Connor's bamboo faq so I am familiar with the legend. Kyle In a message dated Fri, 29 Mar 2002 11:47:04 AM Eastern StandardTime, "Hayashida Darryl" writes: I had the opportunity to closely observe the very milling machine theGGended up buying. In fact I had an opportunity to buy it before George did. I decided to pass on it. The machine was great considering that a "homehobbiest" made it, although he was an aerospace engineer and so was better than what most guys could make. The machine was "fiddly". That is, itwascapable of making very precise and repeatable strips, but you had to really know the machine. Of course the maker knew the machine inside and out, but a new operator would have to ruin quite a few strips to get to the pointofmaking good strips. Add to that that the mill fell over in the truck as it was being transported to Oregon and got tweaked out of alignment,and I can see why George had the problems that he did. I have also seen a Bellinger final taper mill in operation, and myimpression is the same - it is the care and experience of the operator that determines the strip quality. Hand planing is the same - I have seen horrendous gaps in a hand planed rod, but most hand planed rods are pretty good to perfect. Again it is the care and experience of the operator. Quality is up to the person making the rod no matter what the process that is used. Darryl Hayashida -----Original Message----- Sent: Friday, March 29, 2002 8:08 AM Cc: dnorl@qwest.net; rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Re: Planed vs. Milled What Ralph said. Brian ----- Original Message -----From: Ralph W. Moon Cc: dnorl@qwest.net ;rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Friday, March 29, 2002 10:48 AMSubject: Re: Planed vs. Milled Bob, I am reluctant to make a blanket statement covering all milledrods and planed rods, but it is experience that even with novice rodmakers, the tolerances are better than a whole bunch of milled rods. Ihave spotted gaping glue seams in rods like Orvis, Some of the lowerquality production rods are almost noted for the shoddy work. I remember vividly GG who spent a ton of money trying to stabilize his mill. I don't know if he ever solved his problems. I am further convinced that a maker who is responsible for the rod as a whole as opposed to those who do only an assembly line portion of the whole has more interest in doing quality work. That old feeling that the "Old gus" made up for this by havingpride and loyalty to the company is quite frankly bull****. Every company and every employee will in the crunch be for one person: HIMSELFAre there better milled rods than planed rods? Sure! and there arebetter planed rods than were ever milled.We should not lose sight of what we are doing. We are makinga tool to enable an individual to achieve a goal. Add to that theadditional purpose to provide pleasure for that individual. I don't care how pretty, or how perfect, or how innovative a fly rod is. If it doesnot cast a line with a fly attached it is worthless whether it e a Payne, or Dickerson, or Garrison or Moon. Even a poorly made rod can be a good fly rod. I once had a dog of a Montague Sunbeam brought to me forrenovation. I refused to do it, The customer was indignant. Why? She asked. I explained that the rod was almost worthless, and the cost would far outweigh any good it might bring. I lived to eat those words. After I worked on the rod, the glue seams were just as bad as ever, the rod was still as far out of tolerances as it had been. It looked good. New grip and reelseat, new ferrules, and beautiful finish. It cast like a dream. One of the really best rods I have ever cast., Go figure. One of theworst rods I ever cast was a Garrison, by Garrison. I'll plane, you can do as you wish.Weed Wanker is entitled to his opinion, but he looking so narrowlyat the whole issue that his whole premise collapses. Just as well argue whether Urac or Epon is the superior glue. (Nunley I can talk about this too!,) Building quality fly rods is the whole issue. Ralph Bob Maulucci wrote: BUT, I would like to hear the List's opinions on HandMilled vs. Hand Planed vs. Milled.Cordially,Bob -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu []On Behalf Of DaveNorlingSent: Thursday, March 28, 2002 5:43 PM Subject: Response to ReedwankerMaybe someone can explain to me why it is not OK forReedwanker to have his own view of bamboo rodmakers good or badand why it is OK for us to judge people who are judging people.Dave -- This electronic message transmission, including any attachments, contains information from PacifiCare Health Systems Inc. which may be confidential or privileged. The information is intended to be for the use of the individual or entity named above. If you are not the intended recipient, be aware that any disclosure, copying, distribution or use of the contents of this information is prohibited. If you have received this electronic transmission in error, please notify the sender immediately by a "reply to sender only" message and destroy all electronic and hard copies of the communication, including attachments. /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from mbiondo@wuacn.wustl.edu Fri Mar 29 11:23:11 2002 g2THNA426368 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 11:23:10 -0600 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 11:23:10 -0600 Organization: Washington University in St. Louis Subject: FAQ Darryl seez... Maybe it's about time somebody did a list FAQ? Darryl, you are oh so right! A Rodmakers Frequently Asked Questions is long over do for this list. Harry Boyd stepped up a couple years ago a wrote the Information file that is sent to each person when they subscribe. So how about a volunteer for the FAQ? Better yet, how about a small group, working together, take on the task. Would anyone like to head up the group... Darryl??? ;-))) Mike BiondoRodmakers Listguy from stoltz10@attbi.com Fri Mar 29 11:26:09 2002 g2THQ8426914 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 11:26:08 -0600 Subject: Re: Winston Waters from what they are saying I think it is the fluting machine. ----- Original Message ----- "Rodmakers List" Subject: Re: Winston Waters Is the machine that looks like a beveler tapering those strips orhollow-fluting them? I couldn't see how you could build in a taper the way they are running the strips without a template. Brian ----- Original Message -----From: "Tim Wilhelm" Sent: Thursday, March 28, 2002 1:07 PMSubject: Re: Winston Waters Todd, Here's the link to Winston Waters: http://www.westernflyfisher.com/index.asp?i=0101p4v11&t=1 I was looking at it last night, trying to sort something out when I noticed something interesting. Look at the culm that is being split. There is no check split! I'm curious if anyone has an explanation? Tim----- Original Message -----From: "Todd Talsma" Sent: Thursday, March 28, 2002 8:35 AMSubject: Winston Waters Does anyone have the link for this video online. I seem to havemisplaced my bookmark. Thanks.--Todd Talsma8412 North Maple CourtZeeland MI 49464------ web design business page: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo Tips site: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo/Bamboo Sources site: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo_Sources/home page: http://external.sligh.com/~toddt/genealogy pages: Under construction from stoltz10@attbi.com Fri Mar 29 11:37:28 2002 g2THbS427786 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 11:37:28 -0600 Subject: Re: Planed vs. Milled Don't most of you who use milling machine do your final clean up by handplaning?----- Original Message ----- Subject: RE: Planed vs. Milled Oh jeeeeze, I thought GG was referring to Goodwin Granger, I can't believe you used those initials for the Gink! Such sacrilege during this Easterseason... Make sure to put the story of the Gink on Tony Young's list of required reading for newbies. I stumbled across the Gink's website just afterreading Bruce Connor's bamboo faq so I am familiar with the legend. Kyle In a message dated Fri, 29 Mar 2002 11:47:04 AM Eastern StandardTime, "Hayashida Darryl" writes: I had the opportunity to closely observe the very milling machine the GG ended up buying. In fact I had an opportunity to buy it before George did. I decided to pass on it. The machine was great considering that a "homehobbiest" made it, although he was an aerospace engineer and so was better than what most guys could make. The machine was "fiddly". That is, it was capable of making very precise and repeatable strips, but you had to really know the machine. Of course the maker knew the machine inside andout, but a new operator would have to ruin quite a few strips to get to the point of making good strips. Add to that that the mill fell over in the truck as it was being transported to Oregon and got tweaked out of alignment,and I can see why George had the problems that he did. I have also seen a Bellinger final taper mill in operation, and myimpression is the same - it is the care and experience of the operator that determines the strip quality. Hand planing is the same - I have seen horrendous gaps in a hand planed rod, but most hand planed rods are pretty good to perfect. Again it is the care and experience of the operator. Quality is up to the person making the rod no matter what the process that is used. Darryl Hayashida -----Original Message----- Sent: Friday, March 29, 2002 8:08 AM Cc: dnorl@qwest.net; rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Re: Planed vs. Milled What Ralph said. Brian ----- Original Message -----From: Ralph W. Moon Cc: dnorl@qwest.net ;rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Friday, March 29, 2002 10:48 AMSubject: Re: Planed vs. Milled Bob, I am reluctant to make a blanket statement covering all milled rods and planed rods, but it is experience that even with novice rod makers, the tolerances are better than a whole bunch of milled rods. I have spotted gaping glue seams in rods like Orvis, Some of the lower quality production rods are almost noted for the shoddy work. I remember vividly GG who spent a ton of money trying to stabilize his mill. I don't know if he ever solved his problems. I am further convinced that a maker who is responsible for the rod as a whole as opposed to those who do only an assembly line portion of the whole has more interest in doing quality work. That old feeling that the "Old gus" made up for this by having pride and loyalty to the company is quite frankly bull****. Every company and every employee will in the crunch be for one person: HIMSELFAre there better milled rods than planed rods? Sure! and there are better planed rods than were ever milled.We should not lose sight of what we are doing. We are making a tool to enable an individual to achieve a goal. Add to that theadditional purpose to provide pleasure for that individual. I don't care how pretty, or how perfect, or how innovative a fly rod is. If it does not cast a line with a fly attached it is worthless whether it e a Payne, or Dickerson, or Garrison or Moon. Even a poorly made rod can be a good fly rod. I once had a dog of a Montague Sunbeam brought to me forrenovation. I refused to do it, The customer was indignant. Why? She asked. I explained that the rod was almost worthless, and the cost would far outweigh any good it might bring. I lived to eat those words. After I worked on the rod, the glue seams were just as bad as ever, the rod was still as far out of tolerances as it had been. It looked good. New grip and reelseat, new ferrules, and beautiful finish. It cast like a dream. One of the really best rods I have ever cast., Go figure. One of the worst rods I ever cast was a Garrison, by Garrison. I'll plane, you can do as you wish.Weed Wanker is entitled to his opinion, but he looking so narrowlyat the whole issue that his whole premise collapses. Just as well argue whether Urac or Epon is the superior glue. (Nunley I can talk about this too!,) Building quality fly rods is the whole issue. Ralph Bob Maulucci wrote: BUT, I would like to hear the List's opinions on HandMilled vs. Hand Planed vs. Milled.Cordially,Bob -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu []On Behalf Of DaveNorlingSent: Thursday, March 28, 2002 5:43 PM Subject: Response to ReedwankerMaybe someone can explain to me why it is not OK forReedwanker to have his own view of bamboo rodmakers good or badand why it is OK for us to judge people who are judging people.Dave -- This electronic message transmission, including any attachments, contains information from PacifiCare Health Systems Inc. which may beconfidential or privileged. The information is intended to be for the use ofthe individual or entity named above. If you are not the intended recipient,be aware that any disclosure, copying, distribution or use of the contentsof this information is prohibited. If you have received this electronic transmission in error, please notify the sender immediately by a "reply to sender only" message anddestroy all electronic and hard copies of the communication, includingattachments. from Darryl.Hayashida@phs.com Fri Mar 29 11:41:58 2002 g2THfw428210 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 11:41:58 -0600 pri.pacificare.com 2002 17:46:16 UT (Tumbleweed ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 09:40:47 -0800 Subject: RE: Planed vs. Milled The Morgan Handmill goes all the way to final dimensions. Since I have noquad or penta forms, I can't "clean up" those strips by hand planing.Darryl Hayashida -----Original Message----- Sent: Friday, March 29, 2002 9:37 AM Subject: Re: Planed vs. Milled Don't most of you who use milling machine do your final clean up by handplaning?----- Original Message -----From: Sent: Friday, March 29, 2002 9:08 AMSubject: RE: Planed vs. Milled Oh jeeeeze, I thought GG was referring to Goodwin Granger, I can't believeyou used those initials for the Gink! Such sacrilege during this Easterseason... Make sure to put the story of the Gink on Tony Young's list of required reading for newbies. I stumbled across the Gink's website just afterreading Bruce Connor's bamboo faq so I am familiar with the legend. Kyle In a message dated Fri, 29 Mar 2002 11:47:04 AM Eastern StandardTime, "Hayashida Darryl" writes: I had the opportunity to closely observe the very milling machine theGG ended up buying. In fact I had an opportunity to buy it before Georgedid. I decided to pass on it. The machine was great considering that a "home hobbiest" made it, although he was an aerospace engineer and so was better than what most guys could make. The machine was "fiddly". That is, itwas capable of making very precise and repeatable strips, but you had to really know the machine. Of course the maker knew the machine inside and out,but a new operator would have to ruin quite a few strips to get to the pointof making good strips. Add to that that the mill fell over in the truck as it was being transported to Oregon and got tweaked out of alignment, andI can see why George had the problems that he did. I have also seen a Bellinger final taper mill in operation, and myimpression is the same - it is the care and experience of the operatorthat determines the strip quality. Hand planing is the same - I have seen horrendous gaps in a hand planed rod, but most hand planed rods are pretty good to perfect. Again it is thecare and experience of the operator. Quality is up to the person making the rod no matter what the processthat is used. Darryl Hayashida This electronic message transmission, including any attachments, containsinformation from PacifiCare Health Systems Inc. which may be confidentialor privileged. The information is intended to be for the use of the individualor entity named above. If you are not the intended recipient, be aware thatany disclosure, copying, distribution or use of the contents of thisinformation is prohibited. If you have received this electronic transmission in error, please notify thesender immediately by a "reply to sender only" message and destroy allelectronic and hard copies of the communication, including attachments. from bob@downandacross.com Fri Mar 29 11:43:04 2002 g2THh3428405 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 11:43:03 -0600 Subject: RE: Response to Reedwanker Thanks Tony and Ralph. How about this...which one theoretically should havethe best edges for glue up? I realize that maybe this is pointless, but I amtrying to better understand why one could say a milled rod is better.Granted, my mill is still running shakey, but of all three methods I havemade up glued blanks by (HM, mill, plane), the planed rods were better byleaps and bounds.Best regards,Bob -----Original Message----- Milled or planed, so what? from caneman@clnk.com Fri Mar 29 11:43:53 2002 g2THhp428578 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 11:43:51 -0600 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35) Subject: Re: New guy question R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com- ---- Original Message ----- Subject: New guy question This is my first message to the members of the list, but not my firstexposure to it. I started my rod making adventure about six months ago using the George M and Wayne C books. Various steps were modified/changed convenience as I poured throught the archives of the Tips page. Since Iwasn't going to cut any holes in the floors of my house, the Sir D dripmethod really came through for me. I have obvious flaws in my first rod but I made a second one as I went along and it is a little better, but none theless, not perfect. The problems for me have been:1. Getting 24 tip strips from a culm2. Wrapping ferrules3. Gaps in wraps4. My own weak eyesight(55 yrs old) ..you guys/gals in the same boat knowwhat I mean5. Getting that last couple thous. on tip stripsHowever, all that aside, the rods both look good. (to me). this is raterlenghy way to get to a question but Gerge M says 3 to 6 months curing before fishing. Is this what everyone does? I am getting itchy to try them out. Iused MOW spar. Bill Bixler from caneman@clnk.com Fri Mar 29 11:51:04 2002 g2THp3429321 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 11:51:03 -0600 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35) Subject: Re: New guy question Oops, hit that send button too fast on the last one.Bill, splitting will get better the more you do it. Get a trash culm ortwo and practice different methods until you find one you can do moreefficiently and practice it until you get it down.Getting that last couple of thousands off of the tip strips is dependanton a smooth planing stroke and a VERY sharp blade.Wraps... on the ferrules, be sure to feather the tabs down as thin asyou can at their tips and they'll wrap much smoother. Gaps in the wraps...one word... OPTIVISOR! Middle aged rodmakers best friend. I use a 3.5XOptivisor to wrap with and it makes it much easier to see when the wraps aregoing on right. Just like the splitting, the more you wrap the betterthey'll get.As for the varnish curing, I think someone on here a couple of weeksago said that if they could press their thumb against the varnish and itdidn't leave a thumbprint, they would cast it. There are a lot of membersout there that know more about varnishes than i do, but I use MOW spar onrestorations and I put them in a drying box for a few days and have neverhad trouble with the varnish after I take them out. I have NEVER waited 3to 6 months to cast a rod or fish with one. Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com- ---- Original Message ----- Subject: New guy question This is my first message to the members of the list, but not my firstexposure to it. I started my rod making adventure about six months ago using the George M and Wayne C books. Various steps were modified/changed convenience as I poured throught the archives of the Tips page. Since Iwasn't going to cut any holes in the floors of my house, the Sir D dripmethod really came through for me. I have obvious flaws in my first rod but I made a second one as I went along and it is a little better, but none theless, not perfect. The problems for me have been:1. Getting 24 tip strips from a culm2. Wrapping ferrules3. Gaps in wraps4. My own weak eyesight(55 yrs old) ..you guys/gals in the same boat knowwhat I mean5. Getting that last couple thous. on tip stripsHowever, all that aside, the rods both look good. (to me). this is raterlenghy way to get to a question but Gerge M says 3 to 6 months curing before fishing. Is this what everyone does? I am getting itchy to try them out. Iused MOW spar. Bill Bixler from KyleDruey@aol.com Fri Mar 29 11:51:40 2002 g2THpd429416 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 11:51:39 -0600 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 12:51:31 - MAILINID114-0329125131; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 12:51:31 -0500 Subject: RE: Planed vs. Milled, now Gink http://www.uncleginkscave.com I haven't visited Ginkster's site in several months, but there's quite a bitadded to it now. Today is typically a slow work day, if any of youse are in thesame situation as I am then reading his self promoting tabloid style drivel isan entertaining way to pass an hour. I see his prices have increased significantly. I guess he found out the hardway that there are overhead costs involved with running a business. Eventhough his style does not agree with me, I admire the Ginkster's ruggedindividualism and entrepreneurial spirit... flame away because its all in fun. Kyle In a message dated Fri, 29 Mar 2002 12:08:21 PM Eastern Standard Time,Kyle Druey writes: Oh jeeeeze, I thought GG was referring to Goodwin Granger, I can't believeyou used those initials for the Gink! Such sacrilege during this Easterseason... Make sure to put the story of the Gink on Tony Young's list of requiredreading for newbies. I stumbled across the Gink's website just after readingBruce Connor's bamboo faq so I am familiar with the legend. Kyle In a message dated Fri, 29 Mar 2002 11:47:04 AM Eastern StandardTime, "Hayashida Darryl" writes: I had the opportunity to closely observe the very milling machine theGGended up buying. In fact I had an opportunity to buy it before Georgedid. Idecided to pass on it. The machine was great considering that a "homehobbiest" made it, although he was an aerospace engineer and so wasbetterthan what most guys could make. The machine was "fiddly". That is, itwascapable of making very precise and repeatable strips, but you had toreallyknow the machine. Of course the maker knew the machine inside andout, but anew operator would have to ruin quite a few strips to get to the pointofmaking good strips. Add to that that the mill fell over in the truck as itwas being transported to Oregon and got tweaked out of alignment,and I cansee why George had the problems that he did. I have also seen a Bellinger final taper mill in operation, and myimpression is the same - it is the care and experience of the operatorthatdetermines the strip quality. Hand planing is the same - I have seen horrendous gaps in a hand planedrod,but most hand planed rods are pretty good to perfect. Again it is thecareand experience of the operator. Quality is up to the person making the rod no matter what the processthatis used. Darryl Hayashida -----Original Message----- Sent: Friday, March 29, 2002 8:08 AM Cc: dnorl@qwest.net; rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Re: Planed vs. Milled What Ralph said.Brian ----- Original Message ----- bob@downandacross.com > > > > Cc:dnorl@qwest.net ;rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Friday, March 29, 2002 10:48 AMSubject: Re: Planed vs. Milled Bob, I am reluctant to make a blanket statement covering all milledrods and planed rods, but it is experience that even with novice rodmakers, the tolerances are better than a whole bunch of milled rods. Ihave spotted gaping glue seams in rods like Orvis, Some of the lowerquality production rods are almost noted for the shoddy work. Iremembervividly GG who spent a ton of money trying to stabilize his mill. Idon'tknow if he ever solved his problems. I am further convinced that amakerwho is responsible for the rod as a whole as opposed to those who doonlyan assembly line portion of the whole has more interest in doingqualitywork. That old feeling that the "Old gus" made up for this by havingpride and loyalty to the company is quite frankly bull****. Everycompanyand every employee will in the crunch be for one person: HIMSELF Are there better milled rods than planed rods? Sure! and there arebetter planed rods than were ever milled. We should not lose sight of what we are doing. We are makinga tool to enable an individual to achieve a goal. Add to that theadditional purpose to provide pleasure for that individual. I don't carehow pretty, or how perfect, or how innovative a fly rod is. If it doesnot cast a line with a fly attached it is worthless whether it e aPayne,or Dickerson, or Garrison or Moon. Even a poorly made rod can be agoodfly rod. I once had a dog of a Montague Sunbeam brought to me forrenovation. I refused to do it, The customer was indignant. Why? Sheasked. I explained that the rod was almost worthless, and the costwouldfar outweigh any good it might bring. I lived to eat those words. AfterI worked on the rod, the glue seams were just as bad as ever, the rodwasstill as far out of tolerances as it had been. It looked good. New gripand reelseat, new ferrules, and beautiful finish. It cast like a dream.One of the really best rods I have ever cast., Go figure. One of theworst rods I ever cast was a Garrison, by Garrison. I'll plane, you cando as you wish. Weed Wanker is entitled to his opinion, but he looking so narrowlyat the whole issue that his whole premise collapses. Just as wellarguewhether Urac or Epon is the superior glue. (Nunley I can talk aboutthistoo!,) Building quality fly rods is the whole issue. Ralph Bob Maulucci wrote: BUT, I would like to hear the List's opinions on HandMilled vs. Hand Planed vs. Milled.Cordially,Bob -----Original Message----- From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu []On Behalf Of DaveNorling Sent: Thursday, March 28, 2002 5:43 PM ReedwankerMaybe someone can explain to me why it is not OK forReedwanker to have his own view of bamboo rodmakers good or badand why itis OK for us to judge people who are judging people.Dave -- This electronic message transmission, including any attachments,contains information from PacifiCare Health Systems Inc. which may beconfidential or privileged. The information is intended to be for the use ofthe individual or entity named above. If you are not the intended recipient, beaware that any disclosure, copying, distribution or use of the contents ofthis information is prohibited. If you have received this electronic transmission in error, please notifythe sender immediately by a "reply to sender only" message and destroy allelectronic and hard copies of the communication, including attachments. from cathcreek@hotmail.com Fri Mar 29 11:55:06 2002 g2THt6429993 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 11:55:06 -0600 Fri, 29 Mar 2002 09:55:00 -0800 Fri, 29 Mar 2002 17:55:00 GMT rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: RE: Response to Reedwanker FILETIME=[D8B86740:01C1D74A] Hey guys, if I wanted to build-let's say 20 rods a year, would a beveller make a huge difference for me in time? Rob From: "Bob Maulucci" Subject: RE: Response to ReedwankerDate: Fri, 29 Mar 2002 12:42:36 -0500 Thanks Tony and Ralph. How about this...which one theoretically should havethe best edges for glue up? I realize that maybe this is pointless, but I amtrying to better understand why one could say a milled rod is better.Granted, my mill is still running shakey, but of all three methods I havemade up glued blanks by (HM, mill, plane), the planed rods were better byleaps and bounds.Best regards,Bob -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Milled or planed, so what? _________________________________________________________________Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer athttp://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp. from bob@downandacross.com Fri Mar 29 12:01:35 2002 g2TI1Y400567 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 12:01:34 -0600 Subject: Gink Anyone tried this? http://www.rodbuilding.com/RB-Nodes.html -----Original Message----- Subject: RE: Planed vs. Milled, now Gink http://www.uncleginkscave.com from avyoung@iinet.net.au Fri Mar 29 12:03:18 2002 g2TI3H400854 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 12:03:17 -0600 Subject: RE: Response to Reedwanker Well I'm only guessing but assuming both the forms and mill are well made and as accurate as possible the splines cut on a mill would IMHO be more constantly regular because the pressure on the spline as it's milled would be more constant than a plane on a form because the amount of pressure applied over the entire length of the cut must alter because the cut starts near your body and finishes further away mainly because when hand planing you're holding the spline as you plane it while a mill makes the taper on both sides and you either walk the length of the cut in the case of a Morgan Mill or in the case of machine the hold downs should be keeping things under control.When hand planing on a form and you measure the 5" stations they wouldshow the correct dimensions assuming they are correct but you can't really tell between centres.I think this is what Reed Curry has been saying all along. When planing you can meet the measurements at the stations but what's happening inbetween?I've seen Jerry Young's work off the Morgan mill and they look as perfect as possible one after another.You're right though, properly set up apart from a saving in time there isn't any real reason for one to be any better provided the gear is good in the first place.That's the way I see it anyhow.Tony At 12:42 PM 3/29/02 -0500, Bob Maulucci wrote: Thanks Tony and Ralph. How about this...which one theoretically should havethe best edges for glue up? I realize that maybe this is pointless, but I amtrying to better understand why one could say a milled rod is better.Granted, my mill is still running shakey, but of all three methods I havemade up glued blanks by (HM, mill, plane), the planed rods were better byleaps and bounds.Best regards,Bob -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Milled or planed, so what? /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from avyoung@iinet.net.au Fri Mar 29 12:10:38 2002 g2TIAa401469 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 12:10:37 -0600 rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Subject: RE: Response to Reedwanker yes At 05:55 PM 3/29/02 +0000, Robert Clarke wrote: Hey guys, if I wanted to build-let's say 20 rods a year, would a beveller make a huge difference for me in time? Rob From: "Bob Maulucci" Subject: RE: Response to ReedwankerDate: Fri, 29 Mar 2002 12:42:36 -0500 Thanks Tony and Ralph. How about this...which one theoretically shouldhavethe best edges for glue up? I realize that maybe this is pointless, but I amtrying to better understand why one could say a milled rod is better.Granted, my mill is still running shakey, but of all three methods I havemade up glued blanks by (HM, mill, plane), the planed rods were better byleaps and bounds.Best regards,Bob -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Milled or planed, so what? _________________________________________________________________Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer athttp://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp. /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from bob@downandacross.com Fri Mar 29 12:10:54 2002 g2TIAq401500 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 12:10:52 -0600 29 Mar 2002 13:10:46 -0500 Subject: RE: Response to Reedwanker Thanks for your reply Tony. You know, something no one hasconsidered...whycouldn't you have planing forms with stations less than 5"? There's a simplesolution.Bob -----Original Message----- rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: RE: Response to ReedwankerI think this is what Reed Curry has been saying all along. When planing youcan meet the measurements at the stations but what's happening inbetween?I've seen Jerry Young's work off the Morgan mill and they look as perfectas possible one after another.You're right though, properly set up apart from a saving in time thereisn't any real reason for one to be any better provided the gear is good inthe first place.That's the way I see it anyhow.Tony from Darryl.Hayashida@phs.com Fri Mar 29 12:15:09 2002 g2TIF8402107 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 12:15:08 -0600 pri.pacificare.com 2002 18:19:26 UT (Tumbleweed ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 10:13:49 -0800 Subject: RE: FAQ Just to make sure we are all on the same page,I was thinking of the "old fashioned" FAQ - a file sent at sign up or adownloadable file actually on wustl.edu somewhere since the rodmakers listis not as closely coupled with a web site as some other lists are. BruceConner has a FAQ on rodmaking, but his association with this list is ratherloose and new guys usually don't know about his web site. Even theRodmakersweb site doesn't really deal much with the culture of this list.Darryl -----Original Message----- Sent: Friday, March 29, 2002 9:23 AM Subject: FAQ Darryl seez... Maybe it's about time somebody did a list FAQ? Darryl, you are oh so right! A Rodmakers Frequently Asked Questions is long over do for this list. Harry Boyd stepped up a couple years ago a wrote the Information file that is sent to each person when they subscribe. So how about a volunteer for the FAQ? Better yet, how about a small group, working together, take on the task. Would anyone like to head up the group... Darryl??? ;-))) Mike BiondoRodmakers Listguy This electronic message transmission, including any attachments, containsinformation from PacifiCare Health Systems Inc. which may be confidentialor privileged. The information is intended to be for the use of the individualor entity named above. If you are not the intended recipient, be aware thatany disclosure, copying, distribution or use of the contents of thisinformation is prohibited. If you have received this electronic transmission in error, please notify thesender immediately by a "reply to sender only" message and destroy allelectronic and hard copies of the communication, including attachments. from tedknott@cogeco.ca Fri Mar 29 12:16:22 2002 g2TIGL402309 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 12:16:21 -0600 Subject: Re: Who is going to Toronto Show?? Shawn, I and a few southern Ontario rodmakers will be at the Canadian FlyFishing Forum, April 6, 7, demonstrating bamboo rod making. The demos areongoing all day, both days. The focus of the demos is to showcase the workarea rodmakers are doing and to have bamboo rods available to try out. Oneof my rods will be in the conservation fund raising silent auction. I'll bethere both days. from eamon_lee@hotmail.com Fri Mar 29 12:24:09 2002 g2TIO8402883 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 12:24:09 -0600 Fri, 29 Mar 2002 10:24:03 -0800 Fri, 29 Mar 2002 18:24:02 GMT Subject: UV Curing Varnish FILETIME=[E7788220:01C1D74E] Anyone ever come to any conclusions on rapid curing varnish with UV light? I beleive advanced aquariium dudes use UV sterilizers. A powerful UV light is enclosed in a tube/filter and a pump recirculates the tanks water through it and it kills things that mechanical and biological filtration can't handle. I also was at the dentist last week and had a tooth filled with some sort of white filling. It was soft when he put it in and he hit it with a UV light would like a UV light...... :-O Anyway, anyone have any luck with this? TIA,Eamon _________________________________________________________________Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com from caneman@clnk.com Fri Mar 29 12:30:02 2002 g2TIU1403342 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 12:30:01 -0600 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35) Subject: Re: Planed vs. Milled Tim,I've been working on a milling machine for several years that will gointo operation within a few months of when I get the new shop is built, andNO, when it's complete, there will be no need for any final cleanup. Now,if the ground will dry up enough to work on the shop, we'll be alright! *S* Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com- ---- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Planed vs. Milled Don't most of you who use milling machine do your final clean up by handplaning?----- Original Message -----From: Sent: Friday, March 29, 2002 9:08 AMSubject: RE: Planed vs. Milled Oh jeeeeze, I thought GG was referring to Goodwin Granger, I can't believe you used those initials for the Gink! Such sacrilege during this Easterseason... Make sure to put the story of the Gink on Tony Young's list of required reading for newbies. I stumbled across the Gink's website just afterreading Bruce Connor's bamboo faq so I am familiar with the legend. Kyle In a message dated Fri, 29 Mar 2002 11:47:04 AM Eastern StandardTime, "Hayashida Darryl" writes: I had the opportunity to closely observe the very milling machine the GG ended up buying. In fact I had an opportunity to buy it before George did. I decided to pass on it. The machine was great considering that a "home hobbiest" made it, although he was an aerospace engineer and so was better than what most guys could make. The machine was "fiddly". That is, it was capable of making very precise and repeatable strips, but you had to really know the machine. Of course the maker knew the machine inside and out, but a new operator would have to ruin quite a few strips to get to the point of making good strips. Add to that that the mill fell over in the truck as it was being transported to Oregon and got tweaked out of alignment, and I can see why George had the problems that he did. I have also seen a Bellinger final taper mill in operation, and myimpression is the same - it is the care and experience of the operator that determines the strip quality. Hand planing is the same - I have seen horrendous gaps in a hand planed rod, but most hand planed rods are pretty good to perfect. Again it is the care and experience of the operator. Quality is up to the person making the rod no matter what the process that is used. Darryl Hayashida -----Original Message----- Sent: Friday, March 29, 2002 8:08 AM Cc: dnorl@qwest.net; rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Re: Planed vs. Milled What Ralph said. Brian ----- Original Message -----From: Ralph W. Moon Cc: dnorl@qwest.net ;rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Friday, March 29, 2002 10:48 AMSubject: Re: Planed vs. Milled Bob, I am reluctant to make a blanket statement covering all milled rods and planed rods, but it is experience that even with novice rod makers, the tolerances are better than a whole bunch of milled rods. I have spotted gaping glue seams in rods like Orvis, Some of the lower quality production rods are almost noted for the shoddy work. I remember vividly GG who spent a ton of money trying to stabilize his mill. I don't know if he ever solved his problems. I am further convinced that a maker who is responsible for the rod as a whole as opposed to those who do only an assembly line portion of the whole has more interest in doing quality work. That old feeling that the "Old gus" made up for this by having pride and loyalty to the company is quite frankly bull****. Every company and every employee will in the crunch be for one person: HIMSELFAre there better milled rods than planed rods? Sure! and there are better planed rods than were ever milled.We should not lose sight of what we are doing. We are making a tool to enable an individual to achieve a goal. Add to that theadditional purpose to provide pleasure for that individual. I don't care how pretty, or how perfect, or how innovative a fly rod is. If it does not cast a line with a fly attached it is worthless whether it e a Payne, or Dickerson, or Garrison or Moon. Even a poorly made rod can be a good fly rod. I once had a dog of a Montague Sunbeam brought to me forrenovation. I refused to do it, The customer was indignant. Why? She asked. I explained that the rod was almost worthless, and the cost would far outweigh any good it might bring. I lived to eat those words. After I worked on the rod, the glue seams were just as bad as ever, the rod was still as far out of tolerances as it had been. It looked good. New grip and reelseat, new ferrules, and beautiful finish. It cast like a dream. One of the really best rods I have ever cast., Go figure. One of the worst rods I ever cast was a Garrison, by Garrison. I'll plane, you can do as you wish.Weed Wanker is entitled to his opinion, but he looking so narrowly at the whole issue that his whole premise collapses. Just as well argue whether Urac or Epon is the superior glue. (Nunley I can talk about this too!,) Building quality fly rods is the whole issue. Ralph Bob Maulucci wrote: BUT, I would like to hear the List's opinions on HandMilled vs. Hand Planed vs. Milled.Cordially,Bob -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu []On Behalf Of Dave Norling Sent: Thursday, March 28, 2002 5:43 PM Subject: Response to ReedwankerMaybe someone can explain to me why it is not OK forReedwanker to have his own view of bamboo rodmakers good orbad and why it is OK for us to judge people who are judging people.Dave -- This electronic message transmission, including any attachments, contains information from PacifiCare Health Systems Inc. which may beconfidential or privileged. The information is intended to be for the use of the individual or entity named above. If you are not the intended recipient, be aware that any disclosure, copying, distribution or use of the contentsof this information is prohibited. If you have received this electronic transmission in error, please notify the sender immediately by a "reply to sender only" message anddestroy all electronic and hard copies of the communication, includingattachments. from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Fri Mar 29 12:38:12 2002 g2TIcB403894 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 12:38:11 -0600 (authenticated) Fri, 29 Mar 2002 10:38:03 -0800 Subject: Re: FAQ Mike, Darryl sounds like a good candidate to me! Harry Mike Biondo wrote: Darryl seez... Maybe it's about time somebody did a list FAQ? Darryl, you are oh so right! A Rodmakers Frequently Asked Questionsis long over do for this list. Harry Boyd stepped up a couple years ago a wrote the Information filethat is sent to each person when they subscribe. So how about avolunteer for the FAQ? Better yet, how about a small group, workingtogether, take on the task. Would anyone like to head up the group... Darryl??? ;-))) Mike BiondoRodmakers Listguy -- -- Harry Boyd --http://www.canerods.com/ -- Bamboo Rods -- http://www.fbcwin.com/ -- Our Church -- from caneman@clnk.com Fri Mar 29 12:39:18 2002 g2TIdI404088 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 12:39:18 -0600 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35) ,, Subject: Does a Beveller/Mill help save time? Hey guys, if I wanted to build-let's say 20 rods a year, would a bevellermake a huge difference for me in time?Rob Rob,A roughing mill would make a lot of difference. I think you'd be amazedat the time you save with a good roughing mill. Now, preparation is thesame, so you still have to split, press nodes and straighten, but myroughing mill takes about 5 minutes to set up. Last night, I started atabout 6:30 pm on setup, and well before 7pm I had it broke down and putaway. In that 30 minutes, I set up the roughing mill and attached thevacuum to it, untaped the bundle of 30 strips that I had leaning against thebench, turned it on, milled the strips, shut it down and put it away. Evenwith setup and breakdown time that's less than 1 minute per strip, and whenyou're actually rough milling, it only takes about 20 seconds or so from thetime you start one strip until you start the next. That's with one manoperating it. If one of my son's is here when I need to rough strips, itgoes much faster than that because one man can put them in, one can takethem out. Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com from dryfly@erols.com Fri Mar 29 12:44:56 2002 g2TIiu404671 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 12:44:56 -0600 ([208.58.202.187] helo=erols.com) id 16r1Ms-00040K-00; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 13:44:55 -0500 Subject: Re: New guy question I am using both a Morgan handmill and a set of Bellinger forms and handplaningon the Bellinger forms is still producing a better rod than on the handmill.However, I'm not giving up on the handmill. Bob Bob Nunley wrote: R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com- ---- Original Message -----From: Sent: Friday, March 29, 2002 6:30 AMSubject: New guy question This is my first message to the members of the list, but not my firstexposure to it. I started my rod making adventure about six months ago using the George M and Wayne C books. Various steps were modified/changed convenience as I poured throught the archives of the Tips page. Since Iwasn't going to cut any holes in the floors of my house, the Sir D dripmethod really came through for me. I have obvious flaws in my first rod but I made a second one as I went along and it is a little better, but none theless, not perfect. The problems for me have been:1. Getting 24 tip strips from a culm2. Wrapping ferrules3. Gaps in wraps4. My own weak eyesight(55 yrs old) ..you guys/gals in the same boatknowwhat I mean5. Getting that last couple thous. on tip stripsHowever, all that aside, the rods both look good. (to me). this is raterlenghy way to get to a question but Gerge M says 3 to 6 months curing before fishing. Is this what everyone does? I am getting itchy to try them out. Iused MOW spar. Bill Bixler from ttalsma@macatawa.org Fri Mar 29 12:45:13 2002 g2TIjC404755 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 12:45:12 -0600 id ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 13:37:46 -0500 id HR1PZP6K; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 13:37:41 -0500 Subject: Re: Response to Reedwanker All, After thinking about this for a long time and reading all of themessages RE: Reedwanker, I think we should thank him. WHAT!!!! How can I say that????? Look at the discussion that's been generated (after we got done beingdefensive, that is). All of talk about hand planing vs. hand mill vs.mechanized mill alone has been worth the riling up that we've gotten. Yes, most of us will look at the article in a negative light, butthere's a silver lining in every cloud. Choosing to see the bright side on a grey day (it's raining here). ToddTalsma Bob Maulucci wrote: Thanks for your reply Tony. You know, something no one hasconsidered...whycouldn't you have planing forms with stations less than 5"? There's asimplesolution.Bob -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Friday, March 29, 2002 1:10 PM rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: RE: Response to ReedwankerI think this is what Reed Curry has been saying all along. When planing youcan meet the measurements at the stations but what's happening inbetween?I've seen Jerry Young's work off the Morgan mill and they look as perfectas possible one after another.You're right though, properly set up apart from a saving in time thereisn't any real reason for one to be any better provided the gear is good inthe first place.That's the way I see it anyhow.Tony -- Todd Talsma 8412 North Maple Court Zeeland MI 49464 ------ email: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/ Bamboo Tips site:http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo/ Bamboo Sources site:http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo_Sources/ home page:http://external.sligh.com/~toddt/ genealogy pages: Under construction from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Fri Mar 29 12:48:39 2002 Received: from g2TImYO186262 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 200210:48:35 -0800 Message-ID: Date: Fri,29 Mar 2002 12:47:44 -0600 From: Harry Boyd X- owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu X-Listprocessor- Version:8.2.09/990901/11:28 -- ListProc(tm) by CREN -------------- don't even remember them, and I'm sure not going to dig through the Trashfolder looking for them. Lots of us have had our collective panties in a wadover Reedwanker's stuff; me as much or more than anyone. I should neverhave worded my response to Reed Curry so strongly, as a matter of fact.Wish I hadn't done that. If you're worried about offending me, fuggedaboutit.It ain't gonna happen. I haven't always been a Baptist preacher, you know! Infact, I really think it's fun to smile and laugh and have a good time. Anyonewho's ever attended SRG knows that. Now embarrassing me? That's adifferent story. I'll let Rodent and Billie tell that story. [:-)] So -- let's allsettle down, get back to building fishing poles, and not take ourselves quiteso doggone seriously. And I'm speaking first and foremost to myself. Harry -- -- Harry Boyd -- http://www.canerods.com/ -- Bamboo Rods -- http://www.fbcwin.com/ -- Our Church -- -------------- going to dig through the Trash folder looking for them. never have worded my response to Reed Curry so strongly, as a matter of down, get back to building fishing poles, and not take ourselves quite so and foremost to myself. DF6275B6DB911C9EB61C73AB-- > from ajthramer@hotmail.com Fri Mar 2912:49:54 2002 Received: from hotmail.com (f240.law9.hotmail.com Fri, 29 Mar 2002 18:49:48 GMT X-Originating-IP: [206.102.29.52] From: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID:X- OriginalArrivalTime: 29 ajthramer@hotmail.com Sender: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu X- Listprocessor-Version: 8.2.09/990901/11:28 -- ListProc(tm) by CRENWould anyone have any interest in a saw beveler? Call or e-mail. A.J.(541)736- 5989_________________________________________________________________ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device:http://mobile.msn.com > from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Fri Mar 29 12:52:03 g2TIq2405870 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 2002 10:51:59 -0800 Message-ID: X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept- Re: Does a Beveller/Mill help save time? References: Content-Type: fbcwin@3g.quik.com Sender: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu X- Listprocessor-Version: 8.2.09/990901/11:28 -- ListProc(tm) by CRENBobbo, Might wanna make it clear that yours is a true, one-pass, roughingbeveller, not a router based setup. My router based roughing beveller savesme some time, and some elbow grease, but not NEARLY that much. Harry BobNunley wrote: A roughing mill would make a lot of difference. I think you'd be amazedat the time you save with a good roughing mill. -- Harry Boyd --http://www.canerods.com/ -- Bamboo Rods -- http://www.fbcwin.com/ -- Our Church -- from caneman@clnk.com Fri Mar 29 12:59:06 2002 g2TIx6406395 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 12:59:06 -0600 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35) Subject: Re: New guy question Robert,One thing about the Handmill is that it requires a bit more preparationof the strips than planing forms do. With planing forms, if a node is just"Kinda Straight", a good sharp plane blade will plane right through it withno problems. As I'm sure you've found on the hand mill, a slightly crookednode and the mill follows the grain of the node. Get the nodes straight,get the mill set up right and it will produce great strips and extremelyconsistent dimensions... much more consistent than I had ever been able toobtain with a set of planing forms. Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com- ---- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: New guy question I am using both a Morgan handmill and a set of Bellinger forms and hand planing on the Bellinger forms is still producing a better rod than on the handmill. However, I'm not giving up on the handmill. Bob Bob Nunley wrote: R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com- ---- Original Message -----From: Sent: Friday, March 29, 2002 6:30 AMSubject: New guy question This is my first message to the members of the list, but not my firstexposure to it. I started my rod making adventure about six monthsago using the George M and Wayne C books. Various steps weremodified/changed convenience as I poured throught the archives of the Tips page. Since I wasn't going to cut any holes in the floors of my house, the Sir D drip method really came through for me. I have obvious flaws in my first rod but I made a second one as I went along and it is a little better, but none the less, not perfect. The problems for me have been:1. Getting 24 tip strips from a culm2. Wrapping ferrules3. Gaps in wraps4. My own weak eyesight(55 yrs old) ..you guys/gals in the same boat know what I mean5. Getting that last couple thous. on tip stripsHowever, all that aside, the rods both look good. (to me). this is rater lenghy way to get to a question but Gerge M says 3 to 6 months curing before fishing. Is this what everyone does? I am getting itchy to try them out. I used MOW spar. Bill Bixler from ChristopherO@epicimaging.com Fri Mar 29 13:00:43 2002 g2TJ0g406710 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 13:00:42 -0600 id ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 10:55:34 -0800 rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: RE: Planed vs. Milled The morgan hand mill (MHM) and a powered beveler have nothing in commonbesides the name "mill". One is a true powered milling/beveling cutter, theother a sophisticated bench planing apparatus (with two cuttingirons,instead of one, providing a fixed, constant, 60 degree apex- angle)withadjustable accurancy of .001 and smaller. Taking a strip off the mill, and then re-cutting with a block plane andforms, would be going backwards from more accurate to less. chris -----Original Message----- Subject: RE: Planed vs. Milled The Morgan Handmill goes all the way to final dimensions. Since I have noquad or penta forms, I can't "clean up" those strips by hand planing.Darryl Hayashida -----Original Message----- Sent: Friday, March 29, 2002 9:37 AM Subject: Re: Planed vs. Milled Don't most of you who use milling machine do your final clean up by handplaning? from kurt.clement@flashmail.com Fri Mar 29 13:05:13 2002 g2TJ5C407093 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 13:05:12 -0600 0000 Subject: Short Station Planing Form WAS Re: Response to Reedwanker Bob, 2.5 inches bewteen stations sounds workable, and should leave space for theadjusting bolts. You would be able to extrapolate standard tapers easily aswell. But what would it give you? ( Other than the ability to say your rods arebetter than anyone elses becaus you use 2.5" centers? 8-) ) If formsare made well there should be a very linear change from station to stationunless there is a drastic step change in the taper which could introducedistortion farther down the form. KurtNixa, MO -----Original Message----- rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Subject: RE: Response to Reedwanker Thanks for your reply Tony. You know, something no one hasconsidered...whycouldn't you have planing forms with stations less than 5"? There's a simple solution.Bob -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Friday, March 29, 2002 1:10 PM rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: RE: Response to ReedwankerI think this is what Reed Curry has been saying all along. When planing youcan meet the measurements at the stations but what's happening inbetween?I've seen Jerry Young's work off the Morgan mill and they look as perfectas possible one after another.You're right though, properly set up apart from a saving in time thereisn't any real reason for one to be any better provided the gear is good inthe first place.That's the way I see it anyhow.Tony from bhoy551@earthlink.net Fri Mar 29 13:25:37 2002 g2TJPb408663 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 13:25:37 -0600 Fri, 29 Mar 2002 14:25:30 -0500 Subject: Re: Does a Beveller/Mill help save time? FILETIME=[7D33D500:01C1D757] I'm not much of a power tool guy, but my router based beveller does save a lot of time. Instead of at least two evenings at a roughing form, I I can bevel a rod in less than an hour. But that's not why I love it. I could rarely get good angles at a roughing form because the strips kept wriggling all over the place and it's hard to keep a plane level when you are hogging off cane. The beveller almost always give me perfect 60* angles and a uniform strip width. Medved rules! bill At 12:51 PM 3/29/2002 -0600, Harry Boyd wrote: Bobbo, Might wanna make it clear that yours is a true, one-pass, roughing beveller,not a router based setup. My router based roughing beveller saves mesome time,and some elbow grease, but not NEARLY that much. Harry Bob Nunley wrote: A roughing mill would make a lot of difference. I think you'd be amazed at the time you save with a good roughing mill. -- Harry Boyd --http://www.canerods.com/ -- Bamboo Rods -- http://www.fbcwin.com/ -- Our Church -- from tedknott@cogeco.ca Fri Mar 29 13:27:28 2002 g2TJRR408927 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 13:27:27 -0600 ,, , Subject: Re: Does a Beveller/Mill help save time? I use an electric plane to "hand Plane" the rough strips in a pine boardplaning form, followed by intermediate planing in the metal form with a two-handed #4 1/2 Bailley plane. The pine board has vee grooves of variousdepths, so I make one pass in a deep groove, a second pass in the nextdeepest groove, which is usually enough. I plane down to about .020"oversize with the Bailley, then heat treat, then finish plane to size with aHSS blade in a Stanley #9 1/2. It all goes pretty quick. I make 20 to 25rods a year, usually no two in succession are the same, so I have to re-setthe forms for each rod, but this goes pretty quick also. If demand for myrods increased I would probably build a mill. from channer@frontier.net Fri Mar 29 13:28:31 2002 g2TJSU409114 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 13:28:30 -0600 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 12:29:11 -0700 Subject: Re: Response to Reedwanker Which is one of the reason's he does this from time to time, not mentionthe fun he gets out of getting everybody at each other's throats. It'samazing that one person can consistently get so many people screamingwith so little effort on his part. You got to give the guy credit, hereally knows which buttons to push.john Todd Talsma wrote: All, After thinking about this for a long time and reading all of themessages RE: Reedwanker, I think we should thank him. WHAT!!!! How can I say that????? Look at the discussion that's been generated (after we got done beingdefensive, that is). All of talk about hand planing vs. hand mill vs.mechanized mill alone has been worth the riling up that we've gotten.Yes, most of us will look at the article in a negative light, butthere's a silver lining in every cloud. Choosing to see the bright side on a grey day (it's raining here). ToddTalsma Bob Maulucci wrote: Thanks for your reply Tony. You know, something no one hasconsidered...whycouldn't you have planing forms with stations less than 5"? There's asimplesolution.Bob -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Friday, March 29, 2002 1:10 PM rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: RE: Response to ReedwankerI think this is what Reed Curry has been saying all along. When planing youcan meet the measurements at the stations but what's happening inbetween?I've seen Jerry Young's work off the Morgan mill and they look as perfectas possible one after another.You're right though, properly set up apart from a saving in time thereisn't any real reason for one to be any better provided the gear is good inthe first place.That's the way I see it anyhow.Tony --Todd Talsma8412 North Maple CourtZeeland MI 49464------ web design business page: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo Tips site: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo/Bamboo Sources site: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo_Sources/home page: http://external.sligh.com/~toddt/genealogy pages: Under construction from channer@frontier.net Fri Mar 29 13:38:37 2002 g2TJcb409714 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 13:38:37 -0600 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 12:39:18 -0700 Subject: Re: Gink Bob;Paul Whitely started that site and sold it to ginky along with the mill.All george has done is change the art on the front page, Paul wrote thearticle.john Bob Maulucci wrote: Anyone tried this? http://www.rodbuilding.com/RB-Nodes.html -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu KyleDruey@aol.comSent: Friday, March 29, 2002 12:52 PM Subject: RE: Planed vs. Milled, now Gink http://www.uncleginkscave.com from tedknott@cogeco.ca Fri Mar 29 13:40:01 2002 g2TJe1409975 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 13:40:01 -0600 ,, Subject: Re: Short Station Planing Form WAS Re: Response to Reedwanker On some of the Canadian planing forms I asked the manufacturer to installadjusting screws every 2 1/2" on the last 30" of the tip groove. I did thisbecause I wanted accurate control over the taper. I have several forms,some with this feature and some without. My conclusions at this time afterusing them for a few years is that it makes no difference if your forms openand close smoothly. from dryfly@erols.com Fri Mar 29 13:46:53 2002 g2TJkq410389 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 13:46:52 -0600 ([208.58.202.187] helo=erols.com) id 16r2Kl-0004L0-00; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 14:46:48 -0500 avyoung@iinet.net.au, rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Re: Short Station Planing Form WAS Re: Response to Reedwanker Ted Appreciate the information and opinion, hopefully everyone hasn't alreadyplacedtheir order for new forms with 2 1/2' stations. Bob Ted wrote: On some of the Canadian planing forms I asked the manufacturer to installadjusting screws every 2 1/2" on the last 30" of the tip groove. I did thisbecause I wanted accurate control over the taper. I have several forms,some with this feature and some without. My conclusions at this timeafterusing them for a few years is that it makes no difference if your formsopenand close smoothly. from caneman@clnk.com Fri Mar 29 13:50:41 2002 g2TJoe410741 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 13:50:40 -0600 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35) Subject: Re: Does a Beveller/Mill help save time? Harry's right, I didn't make that clear. My roughing mill is not a router based mill, rather is a dickerson style rougher that uses 2 ea. 60Ÿ millcutters. You set it to the dimension you want and push a square stripthrough and it comes out the other end a perfect roughed strip. Singlepass... Later,bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com- ---- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Does a Beveller/Mill help save time? Bobbo, Might wanna make it clear that yours is a true, one-pass, roughing beveller, not a router based setup. My router based roughing beveller saves mesome time, and some elbow grease, but not NEARLY that much. Harry Bob Nunley wrote: A roughing mill would make a lot of difference. I think you'd be amazed at the time you save with a good roughing mill. -- Harry Boyd --http://www.canerods.com/ -- Bamboo Rods -- http://www.fbcwin.com/ -- Our Church -- from bob@downandacross.com Fri Mar 29 14:05:22 2002 g2TK5L411618 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 14:05:21 -0600 29 Mar 2002 15:05:15 -0500 Subject: RE: Short Station Planing Form WAS Re: Response to Reedwanker Hi Kurt and Tony:I agree wholeheartedly, BUT that was one of ReedWhacker's comments...thatwecould not possibly be handplaning to the exact tapers that the millingmachine guys are. Technically, we could if we had 2 or 3" center forms.Bob PS., I know I promised not to discuss this any more...sorry. -----Original Message----- rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Short Station Planing Form WAS Re: Response to Reedwanker Bob, 2.5 inches bewteen stations sounds workable, and should leave space for theadjusting bolts. You would be able to extrapolate standard tapers easily aswell. But what would it give you? ( Other than the ability to say your rods arebetter than anyone elses becaus you use 2.5" centers? 8-) ) If formsare made well there should be a very linear change from station to stationunless there is a drastic step change in the taper which could introducedistortion farther down the form. Kurt from dnorl@qwest.net Fri Mar 29 14:47:28 2002 g2TKlR413546 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 14:47:27 -0600 0000 (63.228.45.176) Subject: Re: New guy question Optivisor indeed!It puts you right in the front row.Dave -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: New guy question Oops, hit that send button too fast on the last one.Bill, splitting will get better the more you do it. Get a trash culm or two and practice different methods until you find one you can do moreefficiently and practice it until you get it down.Getting that last couple of thousands off of the tip strips is dependant on a smooth planing stroke and a VERY sharp blade.Wraps... on the ferrules, be sure to feather the tabs down as thin asyou can at their tips and they'll wrap much smoother. Gaps in the wraps...one word... OPTIVISOR! Middle aged rodmakers best friend. I use a 3.5XOptivisor to wrap with and it makes it much easier to see when the wraps are going on right. Just like the splitting, the more you wrap the betterthey'll get.As for the varnish curing, I think someone on here a couple of weeksago said that if they could press their thumb against the varnish and itdidn't leave a thumbprint, they would cast it. There are a lot of membersout there that know more about varnishes than i do, but I use MOW spar onrestorations and I put them in a drying box for a few days and have neverhad trouble with the varnish after I take them out. I have NEVER waited 3to 6 months to cast a rod or fish with one. Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com- ---- Original Message -----From: Sent: Friday, March 29, 2002 6:30 AMSubject: New guy question This is my first message to the members of the list, but not my firstexposure to it. I started my rod making adventure about six months ago using the George M and Wayne C books. Various steps were modified/changedfor my convenience as I poured throught the archives of the Tips page. Since Iwasn't going to cut any holes in the floors of my house, the Sir D dripmethod really came through for me. I have obvious flaws in my first rod but I made a second one as I went along and it is a little better, but none theless, not perfect. The problems for me have been:1. Getting 24 tip strips from a culm2. Wrapping ferrules3. Gaps in wraps4. My own weak eyesight(55 yrs old) ..you guys/gals in the same boatknowwhat I mean5. Getting that last couple thous. on tip stripsHowever, all that aside, the rods both look good. (to me). this is raterlenghy way to get to a question but Gerge M says 3 to 6 months curing before fishing. Is this what everyone does? I am getting itchy to try them out. I used MOW spar. Bill Bixler from paul.blakley@ntlworld.com Fri Mar 29 14:49:21 2002 g2TKnK413953 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 14:49:20 -0600 Fri, 29 Mar 2002 20:49:18 +0000 Subject: Re: Assistance, please M-D,The company went bust in 1995 !The 'company' was then resurrected by Johnny Fisker in Denmark .Johnny and his brother in law, Torkild Damm got the original reels backinto production and they now wholesale directly.How do I know this........because the UK agent used to be Sparton Tackleand they have the above details in their 2001/2002 catalogue !Tight lines.......Paul Jojo DeLancier wrote: Thanks, Rodent and Johan I contacted them last night, and got a note back from the Pres that Arihad not been involved withthe company for over a year, and they would not be able to help me.Thanks for the info, though. (Nunley, you're just SOL.)Anyone else? M-D From: "Bob Nunley" M-D, his webite address is now http://www.dutchreels.com/ and the emailaddress has changed to info@dutchreels.comGreat reels... I think you should buy me one and send it as a show ofappreciation for sending you this URL! *S* Later,Rat R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com From: "Jojo DeLancier" Guys, Does anyone know how I might contact Ari t'Hart? E-mail will be fine with me. I have a piece of equipment that he personally made quite some years ago, and need some parts information. Thanks! M-D from jojo@ipa.net Fri Mar 29 14:51:25 2002 g2TKpO414440 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 14:51:24 -0600 helo=default) id 16r3LH-0008BH-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 15:51:23 -0500 Subject: Re: Response to Reedwanker These people are called "sociopaths". Do the world some good. Kick somesociopath butt today. M-D Which is one of the reason's he does this from time to time, not mentionthe fun he gets out of getting everybody at each other's throats. It'samazing that one person can consistently get so many people screamingwith so little effort on his part. You got to give the guy credit, hereally knows which buttons to push.john Todd Talsma wrote: All, After thinking about this for a long time and reading all of themessages RE: Reedwanker, I think we should thank him. WHAT!!!! How can I say that????? Look at the discussion that's been generated (after we got done beingdefensive, that is). All of talk about hand planing vs. hand mill vs.mechanized mill alone has been worth the riling up that we've gotten.Yes, most of us will look at the article in a negative light, butthere's a silver lining in every cloud. Choosing to see the bright side on a grey day (it's raining here). ToddTalsma from cristantr@rogers.com Fri Mar 29 15:24:57 2002 g2TLOu417180 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 15:24:56 -0600 (InterMail vM.5.01.04.06 201-253-122-122-106-20020109) with Subject: Test mail.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com from [24.112.204.167] using IDat Fri, 29 Mar 2002 16:24:51 -0500 Test Test from cathcreek@hotmail.com Fri Mar 29 15:41:20 2002 g2TLfK418474 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 15:41:20 -0600 Fri, 29 Mar 2002 13:41:14 -0800 Fri, 29 Mar 2002 21:41:14 GMT Subject: Re: Assistance, please FILETIME=[738ADC70:01C1D76A] They sure are nice looking reels. I did a currency conversion on a couple of them and the price aint bad. Course I am saving for a beveller right now [:)] Rob From: "paul.blakley" CC: Rodmakers discussion group Subject: Re: Assistance, pleaseDate: Fri, 29 Mar 2002 20:46:18 +0000 M-D,The company went bust in 1995 !The 'company' was then resurrected by Johnny Fisker in Denmark .Johnny and his brother in law, Torkild Damm got the original reels backinto production and they now wholesale directly.How do I know this........because the UK agent used to be Sparton Tackleand they have the above details in their 2001/2002 catalogue !Tight lines.......Paul Jojo DeLancier wrote: Thanks, Rodent and Johan I contacted them last night, and got a note back from the Pres that Ari had not been involved with the company for over a year, and they would not be able to help me.Thanks for the info, though. (Nunley, you're just SOL.)Anyone else? M-D From: "Bob Nunley" M-D, his webite address is now http://www.dutchreels.com/ and theemailaddress has changed to info@dutchreels.comGreat reels... I think you should buy me one and send it as a show of appreciation for sending you this URL! *S* Later,Rat R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com From: "Jojo DeLancier" Guys, Does anyone know how I might contact Ari t'Hart? E-mail will be fine with me. I have a piece of equipment that he personally made quite some years ago, and needsome parts information. Thanks! M-D _________________________________________________________________Join the world's largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com from jojo@ipa.net Fri Mar 29 15:50:08 2002 g2TLo8419290 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 15:50:08 -0600 helo=default) id 16r4G7-0007aI-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 16:50:07 -0500 Subject: Re: Assistance, please Rob, He did design some interesting reels, for sure. I have a rod lathe that hemade many years ago forLazlo Elnetti, the Hungarian rodmaker. On that lathe is a beautiful 2" 3-jaw,self-scrolling chuck,and I need another one of those chucks, but can't find one anywhere. Thesmallest I can find is a2.5", and it is much heavier than the chuck on the t'Hart lathe.You may also want to check out www.just-reels.com for otherinteresting/rare/unusual reels. M-D They sure are nice looking reels. I did a currency conversion on a coupleof them and the price aint bad. Course I am saving for a beveller right now[:)] Rob From: "paul.blakley" M-D,The company went bust in 1995 !The 'company' was then resurrected by Johnny Fisker in Denmark .Johnny and his brother in law, Torkild Damm got the original reels backinto production and they now wholesale directly.How do I know this........because the UK agent used to be Sparton Tackleand they have the above details in their 2001/2002 catalogue !Tight lines.......Paul from channer@frontier.net Fri Mar 29 20:58:25 2002 g2U2wP426979 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 20:58:25 -0600 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 19:59:10 -0700 Subject: now this is funny Anybody been to Clarks site today? Take a look at the 'modern makers"thread. It seems that what goes around comes around after all.john from atlasc1@earthlink.net Fri Mar 29 21:29:07 2002 g2U3T6427659 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 21:29:06 -0600 ([209.179.147.121] helo=computer) id 16r9Y1-0003cf-00; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 19:28:58 -0800 Subject: Battle of the rodmaking methods Bob, Opinions are like cowboy hats and hemorrhoids, sooner or later every A- =- hole will have one sooner or later. So hear I am with my cowboy hat =opinion. I originally thought that handplanned rods were more traditional, until =I was informed that it was the tradition of craftsmen and makers of =limited number of rods. The tradition of cane rod manufacturers is one =of mills and bevellers. For some to claim one is better then another is =more of belief and faith then intelligent observation. I am a craftsmen =who enjoys using my hands more and machines less. I do use some machines=to help in the crafting of my rods but the majority of working is by =hand. If I were to choose to make 150+ rods a year I would use more =machinery and less handwork to be able to meet the demand. At this point =I would use my experience as a craftsmen to insure the rods were of the =highest quality even though they came off a mill and assembly line. Any rod milled, hand milled or hand planed is nothing more then cane, =taper, glue and finish. If these aspects of a rod are dialed in then the =rod will cast and catch fish. If one method is better then another I guess we need to determine what =we mean by "Better"? The rods may be different but so is the nature of =fly rods no matter what the medium. Handplaning is a better method for me because the last thing I need is a =bunch of rods waiting to be used or given away. If I am forced to sell =one of my rods to make room for another, so be it. But I am in no hurry =to make a rod and I enjoy the craft. I have more time then rod orders. Mills would be better suited for someone who has less time and more rod =orders. Morgan Hand mill just looks like fun. If I had a rod made with each of the methods and claimed one was better = my forehead for DUMB ASS. This would help eliminate any confusion as to =why I would have that opinion.Now if one prefers on method over another because of personal taste that =is good. But when we get that rod on the stream for its intended purpose =the method of manufacture goes out the window. Adam VigilRiseform RodsChino, CA. "I have learned something from writing this...I have said way to much =on it. BUT, I would like to hear the List's opinions on Hand Milled vs. =Hand Planed vs. Milled.Cordially,"Bob Bob, = sooner or later every A- -hole will have one sooner or later. So hear I = my cowboy hat opinion. I originally thought that handplanned = more traditional, until I was informed that it was the tradition of = manufacturers is one of mills and bevellers. For some to claim = better then another is more of belief and faith then intelligent = am a craftsmen who enjoys using my hands more and machines less. I do = machines to help in the crafting of my rods but the majority of working = hand. If I were to choose to make 150+ rods a year I would use more = and less handwork to be able to meet the demand. At this point I would = experience as a craftsmen to insure the rods were of the highest quality = though they came off a mill and assembly line. Any rod milled, hand milled or hand = nothing more then cane, taper, glue and finish. If these aspects of a = If one method is better then another I = need to determine what we mean by "Better"? The rods may be different = the nature of fly rods no matter what the medium. Handplaning is a better method for me= last thing I need is a bunch of rods waiting to be used or given away. = forced to sell one of my rods to make room for another, so be it. But I = orders. Mills would be better suited for = Morgan Hand mill just looks like =fun. If I had a rod made with each of the = stamp a big "DA"on my forehead for DUMB ASS. This would help eliminate = confusion as to why I would have that opinion.Now if one prefers on method over = of personal taste that is good. But when we get that rod on the stream = intended purpose the method of manufacture goes out the =window. Adam VigilRiseform RodsChino, CA. learned something from writing this...I have said way to much on it. = would like to hear the List's opinions on Hand Milled vs. Hand Planed = Milled.Cordially,"Bob from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Fri Mar 29 21:30:12 2002 g2U3UB427856 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 21:30:11 -0600 (authenticated) Fri, 29 Mar 2002 19:30:07 -0800 Subject: Re: now this is funny Just in case y'all can't find what John is referring to, have a lookhere:http://www.pub12.ezboard.com/fclarksclassicflyrodforumfishingbambooflyrods.showMessage?topicID=492.topic You will definitely have to cut and paste the entire string into yourbrowser. I absolutely loved what culmknocker had to say. Life is good,Harry channer wrote: Anybody been to Clarks site today? Take a look at the 'modern makers"thread. It seems that what goes around comes around after all.john -- -- Harry Boyd --http://www.canerods.com/ -- Bamboo Rods -- http://www.fbcwin.com/ -- Our Church -- from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Fri Mar 29 21:50:01 2002 g2U3o0428525 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 21:50:00 -0600 (authenticated) for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 19:49:58 -0800 Subject: Re: now this is funny --------------1E12606587F4860D4A6E0F78 Lemme try that again. http://pub12.ezboard.com/fclarksclassicflyrodforumfishingbambooflyrods.showMessage?topicID=492.topic -- -- Harry Boyd --http://www.canerods.com/ -- Bamboo Rods -- http://www.fbcwin.com/ -- Our Church -- --------------1E12606587F4860D4A6E0F78 Lemme try that again.http://pub12.ezboard.com/fclarksclassicflyrodforumfishingbambooflyrods.showMessage?topicID=492.topic -- -- Bamboo Rods -- --------------1E12606587F4860D4A6E0F78-- from avyoung@iinet.net.au Fri Mar 29 23:12:29 2002 g2U5CR429708 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2002 23:12:27 -0600 , Subject: Re: Short Station Planing Form WAS Re: Response to Reedwanker Just a thought game with the distance between centres. It is just a mind game to compare a mill and a form. Imagine you have the exact dimensions a finished spline should be at every inch. The spline does nothing between 5 inch centres meaning it just goes from one centre to the next in a smooth way, no savage dips etc.Imagine you set the bed of the mill at every inch to get this finished spline.Imagine you have a form that has 5 inch centres.Imagine you have made these splines. I wonder how the dimensions at every inch of both splines would compare?Logic says they would be the same but I wonder if they in fact would due to movement of the forms between centres. Imagine a taper that is straight from butt to tip. Set it on the form and mill and try the same experiment.I wonder how the dimensions at every inch of both splines would compare?Anyhow, it's just a mind game. Tony At 01:03 PM 3/29/02 -0600, Kurt Clement wrote: Bob, 2.5 inches bewteen stations sounds workable, and should leave space fortheadjusting bolts. You would be able to extrapolate standard tapers easily aswell. But what would it give you? ( Other than the ability to say your rods arebetter than anyone elses becaus you use 2.5" centers? 8-) ) If formsare made well there should be a very linear change from station to stationunless there is a drastic step change in the taper which could introducedistortion farther down the form. KurtNixa, MO /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from avyoung@iinet.net.au Sat Mar 30 00:00:39 2002 g2U60c400483 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 00:00:38 - Subject: Re: Response to Reedwanker Sure, but you don't need to be an Einstein to be an idiot either. Tony At 12:29 PM 3/29/02 -0700, channer wrote: Which is one of the reason's he does this from time to time, not mentionthe fun he gets out of getting everybody at each other's throats. It'samazing that one person can consistently get so many people screamingwith so little effort on his part. You got to give the guy credit, hereally knows which buttons to push.john /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from avyoung@iinet.net.au Sat Mar 30 00:11:24 2002 g2U6BM401020 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 00:11:23 - , Subject: RE: Short Station Planing Form WAS Re: Response to Reedwanker That's more or less what a message I just sent was about. Strictly speaking there would have to be some variation in a form whereas you'd think there would be no such variation on a mill WITHIN a batch of rods made on the mill's settings.BUT these variations would be vanishingly slight no matter what was used provided the proper care and tolerances were achieved and most certainly have no effect on the outcome.If reed wanker is suggesting there is a significant variation when using forms and this variation must be eliminated before you should be regarded as a serious contender he would then need to make several hundred blanks of any taper he makes to guarantee zero variation because there would be variation between batches. If he does not do this he is right back with the guys making rods in forms.He could argue it's a case of numbers but unless he's making hundreds of blanks each run and assuming he is actually selling all these rods punter "a" will most certainly have a different batch rod than punter "x".If this is true the whole argument of eliminating variation is groundless. Tony At 03:04 PM 3/29/02 -0500, Bob Maulucci wrote: Hi Kurt and Tony:I agree wholeheartedly, BUT that was one of ReedWhacker'scomments...that wecould not possibly be handplaning to the exact tapers that the millingmachine guys are. Technically, we could if we had 2 or 3" center forms.Bob PS., I know I promised not to discuss this any more...sorry. /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from avyoung@iinet.net.au Sat Mar 30 00:40:53 2002 g2U6ep401635 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 00:40:51 - "rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu" Subject: Re: now this is funny He's obviously been given enough rope. Tony At 09:49 PM 3/29/02 -0600, Harry Boyd wrote: Lemme try that again. http://pub12.ezboard.com/fclarksclassicflyrodforumfishingbambooflyrods.showMessage?topicID=492.topic >> -- -- Harry Boyd --http://www.canerods.com/ -- Bamboo Rods -- http://www.fbcwin.com/ -- Our Church -- /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from jsschaeffer@hotmail.com Sat Mar 30 07:26:31 2002 g2UDQU405082 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 07:26:30 -0600 Sat, 30 Mar 2002 05:26:24 -0800 Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest FILETIME=[7D2B42E0:01C1D7EE] The list has been entirely too serious of late, and to remedy that I am =hosting the first annual April Fool's Day contest. Mark Twain once =described April 1 as "that day that reminds us of what we really are the =other 364", and in that spirit, here are the rules: Post to the list your best/worst rodmaking failure, screw-up, mistake, =or rod-related shop incident/accident. 1. It has to be true.2. It must have occurred during rodmaking, or preparation of tools and =materials for rodmaking.2. No "how I burned up the rod in the oven" stories. These are too =ubiquitous, and bandwidth would suffer. Unless something else caught =fire.3. No fingers chopped off by the table saw stories. These are too tragic =to be funny in any respect.4. All posts must be made on or before April 1. Posts after midnight on =April 1 are ineligible, though they might be amusing. Your post will be scored for: 1) originality of the mistake, 2) dumbness =given your years of experience, 3) story quality (how you tell the =tale), and 4) consequences to your reputation as a master rodmaker. The winner will receive a handmade nickel silver cap and ring style reel =seat with a walnut filler. As judge and host, I can not win, but here is one of my many potential =contributions: A renowned rodmaker shared one of his personal tapers with me via email. =I planed out the butt section, but when it came time for the tips I =could not get the forms closed far enough. I spent an entire evening =opening and closing the forms trying to duplicate his tip dimensions. =Try as I might, the tip side of my forms was too coarse to produce tips =with those ultra-fine dimensions. This went on and on. I became =convinced that my forms were overcut, and about twice as deep as they =should be when closed. I took the forms apart to check for debris, and =checked the depth at every station. Everything was right on. Glancing up =at the taper sheet, I realized that the tip diameter of 0.33 seemed odd, =and I checked my taper libary and the list archive. Almost all tips were =about 0.70 or larger, and only a few were slightly smaller. It was then =I realized that the taper I had received from him had strip dimensions =(1/2 rod diameter) and not rod diameter. I had divided the strip =dimensions in half, and had spent three evenings planing away on strips =that were smaller than any taper in the history of rodmaking. I tried =making the section into fly tying bodkins, but it was too fine for even =that. And of course it was one of my best culms. The list has been entirely too serious = Mark Twain once described April 1 as= that reminds us of what we really are the other 364", and in that = are the rules: = incident/accident. 1. It has to be true.2. It must have occurred during = preparation of tools and materials for rodmaking.2. No "how I burned up the rod in the = stories. These are too ubiquitous, and bandwidth would suffer. Unless = 3. No fingers chopped off by the table = These are too tragic to be funny in any respect. might be amusing. Your post will be scored for: = quality (how you tell the tale), and 4) consequences to your reputation = master rodmaker. The winner will receive a handmade = cap and ring style reel seat with a walnut filler. As judge and host, I can not win, but = A renowned rodmaker shared one of his= tapers with me via email. I planed out the butt section, but when it = evening opening and closing the forms trying to duplicate his tip = tips with those ultra-fine dimensions. This went on and on. I became = that my forms were overcut, and about twice as deep as they should be = I realized that the tip diameter of 0.33 seemed odd, and I checked my = had received from him had strip dimensions (1/2 rod diameter) and not = diameter. I had divided the strip dimensions in half, and had spent = evenings planing away on strips that were smaller than any taper in the = culms. Jeff = from lblan@provide.net Sat Mar 30 07:47:02 2002 g2UDl1405462 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 07:47:01 -0600 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 08:46:58 -0500 Subject: RE: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest Oh sure, like any of us can top Nunley for mis-adventure or story tellingprowess! [:)] Larry Blan -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2004 10:18 PM Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest The list has been entirely too serious of late, and to remedy that I amhosting the first annual April Fool's Day contest. Mark Twain once describedApril 1 as "that day that reminds us of what we really are the other 364",and in that spirit, here are the rules: Post to the list your best/worst rodmaking failure, screw-up, mistake, orrod-related shop incident/accident. 1. It has to be true.2. It must have occurred during rodmaking, or preparation of tools andmaterials for rodmaking.2. No "how I burned up the rod in the oven" stories. These are tooubiquitous, and bandwidth would suffer. Unless something else caught fire.3. No fingers chopped off by the table saw stories. These are too tragicto be funny in any respect.4. All posts must be made on or before April 1. Posts after midnight onApril 1 are ineligible, though they might be amusing. Your post will be scored for: 1) originality of the mistake, 2) dumbnessgiven your years of experience, 3) story quality (how you tell the tale),and 4) consequences to your reputation as a master rodmaker. The winner will receive a handmade nickel silver cap and ring style reelseat with a walnut filler. As judge and host, I can not win, but here is one of my many potentialcontributions: A renowned rodmaker shared one of his personal tapers with me via email. Iplaned out the butt section, but when it came time for the tips I could notget the forms closed far enough. I spent an entire evening opening andclosing the forms trying to duplicate his tip dimensions. Try as I might,the tip side of my forms was too coarse to produce tips with thoseultra-fine dimensions. This went on and on. I became convinced that myformswere overcut, and about twice as deep as they should be when closed. I tookthe forms apart to check for debris, and checked the depth at every station.Everything was right on. Glancing up at the taper sheet, I realized that thetip diameter of 0.33 seemed odd, and I checked my taper libary and the listarchive. Almost all tips were about 0.70 or larger, and only a few wereslightly smaller. It was then I realized that the taper I had received fromhim had strip dimensions (1/2 rod diameter) and not rod diameter. I haddivided the strip dimensions in half, and had spent three evenings planingaway on strips that were smaller than any taper in the history of rodmaking.I tried making the section into fly tying bodkins, but it was too fine foreven that. And of course it was one of my best culms. Jeff Schaeffer Larry Blan SchaefferSent: Thursday, March 25, 2004 10:18 = RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.eduSubject: Re: rodmaking AprilFool's = ContestThe list has been entirely too = and to remedy that I am hosting the first annual April Fool's Day = Mark Twain once described April 1= that reminds us of what we really are the other 364", and in that = are the rules: = incident/accident. 1. It has to be true.2. It must have occurred during = preparation of tools and materials for rodmaking.2. No "how I burned up the rod in the = 3. No fingers chopped off by the = stories. These are too tragic to be funny in any respect. they might be amusing. Your post will be scored for: = quality (how you tell the tale), and 4) consequences to your = master rodmaker. The winner will receive a handmade = cap and ring style reel seat with a walnut filler. As judge and host, I can not win, but = A renowned rodmaker shared one of his= tapers with me via email. I planed out the butt section, but when it = evening opening and closing the forms trying to duplicate his tip = tips with those ultra-fine dimensions. This went on and on. I became = that my forms were overcut, and about twice as deep as they should be = at every station. Everything was right on. Glancing up at = sheet, I realized that the tip diameter of 0.33 seemed odd, and I = the taper I had received from him had strip dimensions (1/2 rod = not rod diameter. I had divided the strip dimensions in half, and had = three evenings planing away on strips that were smaller than any taper = was one of my best culms. from atlasc1@earthlink.net Sat Mar 30 08:07:12 2002 g2UE7B405889 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 08:07:11 -0600 ([209.179.146.233] helo=computer) id 16rJVT-0001HE-00; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 06:06:59 -0800 Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest Okay here is my rodmaking fool incident. I had chosen a taper from Bob Milwards book. It was a 8'4wt that had =been derived from a para 15 taper. I knew it was going to be a full =flexing parabolic and that was exactly what I wanted for fishing size 22 =tricos. I choose an uplocking venerri box elder slide band reel seat. I =choose the best cork. Had red silk and black tipping. Snake brand guides =and Tony Larsons ferrules. And it was to be of nodeless construction. This rod was for me and it was not being given away or sold. I wanted it =to be beautiful and serve a specific purpose. Every thing was going =fine. I used 2x2 construction and when all was said and done it casted =like a dream. It was soft and it flexed into the grip, it had moderate =power. It would be perfect for big fish on small flies,the rod was all =that I had wanted. Or so I thought. I had just put on a second coat of varnish and it was done drying. My =nephew and I were lawn casting it and testing for accuracy and tracking. =I walked inside the house and he continued casting smiling the whole =time until....."CRACK" oh"SHIT" "dude what the hell happened!?" I walked =outside only to find that the full flexing rod was not compatible with =the nodeless construction. Two of the splices just above the cork were =sticking out like the twin towers. It now sits on my desk in all its glory as a glaring reminder some =things just don't mix. incident. I had chosen a taper from Bob Milwards= a 8'4wt that had been derived from a para 15 taper. I knew it was going = full flexing parabolic and that was exactly what I wanted for fishing = tricos. I choose an uplocking venerri box elder slide band reel seat. I = the best cork. Had red silk and black tipping. Snake brand guides and = Larsons ferrules. And it was to be of nodeless =construction. This rod was for me and it was not = or sold. I wanted it to be beautiful and serve a specific purpose. Every = was going fine. I used 2x2 construction and when all was said and done = like a dream. It was soft and it flexed into the grip, it had moderate = would be perfect for big fish on small flies,the rod was all that I had = Or so I thought. I had just put on a second coat of = was done drying. My nephew and I were lawn casting it and testing for = and tracking. I walked inside the house and he continued casting smiling = whole time until....."CRACK" oh"SHIT" "dude what the hell happened!?" I = glaring reminder some things just don't mix. from bob@downandacross.com Sat Mar 30 08:07:25 2002 g2UE7O405941 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 08:07:24 - Subject: RE: Short Station Planing Form WAS Re: Response to Reedwanker Let's say you want to set the forms to change .008" every 5 inches. Yourforms have a pre-set taper that changes .001 over every inch of the form.Or, like Garrison say the tip bevel of the forms is .030 to .092".If you had your forms made to different specs or had some errors, youwouldhave a different taper between stations than someone who made their formscorrectly or different from yours.On the mill, you may be able to more finely tune the template so that thechanges between are not so influenced by the forms built in taper. (THat isassuming you are using a wooden or metal template for each taper).Bob -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Short Station Planing Form WAS Re: Response to Reedwanker Imagine a taper that is straight from butt to tip. Set it on the form andmill and try the same experiment.I wonder how the dimensions at every inch of both splines would compare?Anyhow, it's just a mind game. Tony from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Sat Mar 30 08:53:25 2002 g2UErO407841 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 08:53:24 -0600 (authenticated) Sat, 30 Mar 2002 06:53:17 -0800 Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest --------------1A82EA8F4E35F7345A6AF82A Larry Blan wrote: Oh sure, like any of us can top Nunley formis-adventure or story telling prowess! :)LarryBlan Larry, I think Nunley ought to be disqualified. Afterall, he's a pro among amateurs, a man among boys.If he's The Lone Ranger, then most of us aren'teven Tonto. Besides, I've never had a rodmaking screw-up,failure, or shop-related accident. (Ha! -- that'smy entry) Just funning,Harry -- -- Harry Boyd --http://www.canerods.com/ -- Bamboo Rods -- http://www.fbcwin.com/ -- Our Church -- --------------1A82EA8F4E35F7345A6AF82A Larry Blan wrote:Ohsure, like any of us can top Nunley for mis-adventure or story telling Blan mostof us aren't even Tonto.Besides, I've never had a rodmaking screw-up, failure, or shop-related Just funning,Harry-- -- Bamboo Rods -- --------------1A82EA8F4E35F7345A6AF82A-- from rmoon@ida.net Sat Mar 30 09:22:12 2002 g2UFMB408371 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 09:22:12 -0600 0000 Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest --------------25093A9542E606045A65DB42 After reading Harry's entry, I am reluctant to try to top it, but if itcan be screwed up, torn, bent broken, bloodied, I've done it. I haveput my arm in the lathe gears, broken rods on the lathe trying to turnthem without stabalizing them, miscalculated my form setting. usednon-drying varnish, Hell, I've done it all, but the most traumatic wasnot my fault. HONESTLY. I made two matched rods side by side, andspent long hours of loving care on them. Finally I was done, and tookthem out to the lawn to cast them, and completely delaminated both rodsin two or three casts. And that was using Nunley's favorite glue. (NOTMINE!!!!!!) Harry Boyd wrote: Larry Blan wrote: Oh sure, like any of us can top Nunley for mis-adventure or storytelling prowess! :)Larry Blan Larry, I think Nunley ought to be disqualified. After all, he's a pro amongamateurs, a man among boys. If he's The Lone Ranger, then most of usaren't even Tonto. Besides, I've never had a rodmaking screw-up, failure, or shop- relatedaccident. (Ha! -- that's my entry) Just funning,Harry -- -- Harry Boyd --http://www.canerods.com/ -- Bamboo Rods -- http://www.fbcwin.com/ -- Our Church -- --http://www.ida.net/users/rmoon --------------25093A9542E606045A65DB42 After reading Harry's entry, I am reluctant to try to top it, but if it put my arm in the lathe gears, broken rods on the lathe trying to turn non-drying varnish, Hell, I've done it all, but the most traumatic was and took them out to the lawn to cast them, and completely delaminated Harry Boyd wrote:Larry Blan wrote:Ohsure, like any of us can top Nunley for mis-adventure or story telling mostof us aren't even Tonto.Besides, I've never had a rodmaking screw-up, failure, or shop-related Just funning,Harry-- -- Bamboo Rods -- --http://www.ida.net/users/rmoon --------------25093A9542E606045A65DB42-- from rmoon@ida.net Sat Mar 30 09:24:09 2002 g2UFO8408607 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 09:24:08 -0600 0000 Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest --------------6F9903E0B4CF501D76A947A4 Hey did I mention slicing my fingers to the bone planing with a dullblade??Ralph Harry Boyd wrote: Larry Blan wrote: Oh sure, like any of us can top Nunley for mis-adventure or storytelling prowess! :)Larry Blan Larry, I think Nunley ought to be disqualified. After all, he's a pro amongamateurs, a man among boys. If he's The Lone Ranger, then most of usaren't even Tonto. Besides, I've never had a rodmaking screw-up, failure, or shop- relatedaccident. (Ha! -- that's my entry) Just funning,Harry -- -- Harry Boyd --http://www.canerods.com/ -- Bamboo Rods -- http://www.fbcwin.com/ -- Our Church -- --http://www.ida.net/users/rmoon --------------6F9903E0B4CF501D76A947A4 Hey did I mention slicing my fingers to the bone planing with a dullblade??RalphHarry Boyd wrote:Larry Blan wrote:Ohsure, like any of us can top Nunley for mis-adventure or story telling mostof us aren't even Tonto.Besides, I've never had a rodmaking screw-up, failure, or shop-related Just funning,Harry-- -- Bamboo Rods -- --http://www.ida.net/users/rmoon --------------6F9903E0B4CF501D76A947A4-- from caneman@clnk.com Sat Mar 30 09:59:06 2002 g2UFx6409227 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 09:59:06 -0600 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35) Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest LMAO... Jeff, Since my taper log is all in strip dimensions, let me =guess who the peckerhead was that sent you that taper and forgot to =mention that was half diameters! Great story! Later,Bob Glancing up at the taper sheet, I realized that the tip diameter of 0.33 =seemed odd, and I checked my taper libary and the list archive. Almost =all tips were about 0.70 or larger, and only a few were slightly =smaller. It was then I realized that the taper I had received from him =had strip dimensions (1/2 rod diameter) and not rod diameter. I had =divided the strip dimensions in half, and had spent three evenings =planing away on strips that were smaller than any taper in the history =of rodmaking. I tried making the section into fly tying bodkins, but it =was too fine for even that. And of course it was one of my best culms. dimensions, let me guess who the peckerhead was that sent you that taper = story! Later,Bob = that the tip diameter of 0.33 seemed odd, and I checked my taper libary = from him had strip dimensions (1/2 rod diameter) and not rod diameter. I = divided the strip dimensions in half, and had spent three evenings = on strips that were smaller than any taper in the history of = culms. from bdcbfr@chartermi.net Sat Mar 30 10:31:23 2002 g2UGVM409777 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 10:31:22 -0600 Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest I had been coating my first few rods with tung oil or brushed varnish, =and just wasn't satisfied (nothing new there, eh?) So I finally decided =I'd break down and build a dip tube set-up in the basement along the =lines of the one Wayne C. uses and describes so well in his book.I went to a friendly plumber and got an 8' piece of leftover 12" pvc, =and bought 4" pipe and fittings at the hardware store. I borrowed =another friends big hammer drill and bought a Hilti bit to punch a bunch =of holes in the slab floor after finding it would cost me $100 to have a = I laid everything out next to an inside wall in the shop, and spent an =entire afternoon drilling holes on the peremeter of a 5" circle drawn on =the floor. Turns out that they did a good job building my house. 6" =slab with welded wire reinforcing. After sweating and cussing I finally =finished drilling and and busted out the center of the hole with a =sledge and wire cutters. Then I used a piece of PVC tube and the shop =vac to make a hole in the sand under my basement floor 5' deep. I set =the pipe and poured cement in the bottom to keep bugs and water out of = Next day I measured and cut the big piece of pipe for the cabinet and =put a piano hinge on the door I made, made a top for the cabinet, hung =the motor and control for pulling the sections, mounted a dozen cup =hooks for hanging sections to dry, and caulked around the bottom and top =to seal out dust.This was probably in september or october, I'm guessing. As I stood =there admiring my resourcefulness and handiness I heard the clicking and =WHOOSH of the gas furnace firing up. Right behind the water heater, =next to my new varnishing cabinet! I hadn't built a varnishing cabinet, =I'd built a bomb in basement!It took another week to tear down the cabinet (breaking the big 12" =piece of pipe in the process) and using a block and tackle fastened to =the floor joists to pull the 5" x 5' pipe out of the ground, fill in the =hole, patch it and build the cabinet in the corner as far from the gas =appliances as possible. It's on and outside wall and takes a while to =heat up with halogen shop lights, but at least my house hasn't been on =the 11 O'clock news! Brian Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest The list has been entirely too serious of late, and to remedy that I =am hosting the first annual April Fool's Day contest. Mark Twain once =described April 1 as "that day that reminds us of what we really are the =other 364", and in that spirit, here are the rules: Post to the list your best/worst rodmaking failure, screw-up, mistake, =or rod-related shop incident/accident. 1. It has to be true.2. It must have occurred during rodmaking, or preparation of tools and =materials for rodmaking.2. No "how I burned up the rod in the oven" stories. These are too =ubiquitous, and bandwidth would suffer. Unless something else caught =fire.3. No fingers chopped off by the table saw stories. These are too =tragic to be funny in any respect.4. All posts must be made on or before April 1. Posts after midnight =on April 1 are ineligible, though they might be amusing. Your post will be scored for: 1) originality of the mistake, 2) =dumbness given your years of experience, 3) story quality (how you tell =the tale), and 4) consequences to your reputation as a master rodmaker. The winner will receive a handmade nickel silver cap and ring style =reel seat with a walnut filler. As judge and host, I can not win, but here is one of my many potential =contributions: A renowned rodmaker shared one of his personal tapers with me via =email. I planed out the butt section, but when it came time for the tips =I could not get the forms closed far enough. I spent an entire evening =opening and closing the forms trying to duplicate his tip dimensions. =Try as I might, the tip side of my forms was too coarse to produce tips =with those ultra-fine dimensions. This went on and on. I became =convinced that my forms were overcut, and about twice as deep as they =should be when closed. I took the forms apart to check for debris, and =checked the depth at every station. Everything was right on. Glancing up =at the taper sheet, I realized that the tip diameter of 0.33 seemed odd, =and I checked my taper libary and the list archive. Almost all tips were =about 0.70 or larger, and only a few were slightly smaller. It was then =I realized that the taper I had received from him had strip dimensions =(1/2 rod diameter) and not rod diameter. I had divided the strip =dimensions in half, and had spent three evenings planing away on strips =that were smaller than any taper in the history of rodmaking. I tried =making the section into fly tying bodkins, but it was too fine for even =that. And of course it was one of my best culms. oil or brushed varnish, and just wasn't satisfied (nothing new there, = So I finally decided I'd break down and build a dip tube set-up in the = book.I went to a friendly plumber and got an= leftover 12" pvc, and bought 4" pipe and fittings at the hardware = borrowed another friends big hammer drill and bought a Hilti bit to = bunch of holes in the slab floor after finding it would cost me $100 to = I laid everything out next to an inside = shop, and spent an entire afternoon drilling holes on the peremeter of a = cussing I finally finished drilling and and busted out the center of the = shop vac to make a hole in the sand under my basement floor 5' = the pipe and poured cement in the bottom to keep bugs and water out of = Next day I measured and cut the big = cabinet, hung the motor and control for pulling the sections, mounted a = cup hooks for hanging sections to dry, and caulked around the bottom and = seal out dust.This was probably in september or = varnishing cabinet, I'd built a bomb in basement!It took another week to tear down the = (breaking the big 12" piece of pipe in the process) and using a block = fastened to the floor joists to pull the 5" x 5' pipe out of the ground, = the hole, patch it and build the cabinet in the corner as far from the = up with halogen shop lights, but at least my house hasn't been on the 11 = news! Brian ----- Original Message ----- Schaeffer Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2004 = PMSubject: Re: rodmaking April = Contest The list has been entirely too = and to remedy that I am hosting the first annual April Fool's Day = Mark Twain once described April 1= that reminds us of what we really are the other 364", and in that = are the rules: = incident/accident. 1. It has to be true.2. It must have occurred during = preparation of tools and materials for rodmaking.2. No "how I burned up the rod in the = 3. No fingers chopped off by the = stories. These are too tragic to be funny in any respect. they might be amusing. Your post will be scored for: = quality (how you tell the tale), and 4) consequences to your = master rodmaker. The winner will receive a handmade = cap and ring style reel seat with a walnut filler. As judge and host, I can not win, but = A renowned rodmaker shared one of his= tapers with me via email. I planed out the butt section, but when it = evening opening and closing the forms trying to duplicate his tip = tips with those ultra-fine dimensions. This went on and on. I became = that my forms were overcut, and about twice as deep as they should be = at every station. Everything was right on. Glancing up at = sheet, I realized that the tip diameter of 0.33 seemed odd, and I = the taper I had received from him had strip dimensions (1/2 rod = not rod diameter. I had divided the strip dimensions in half, and had = three evenings planing away on strips that were smaller than any taper = was one of my best culms. from rcurry@ttlc.net Sat Mar 30 11:03:01 2002 g2UH30410379 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 11:03:01 - User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:0.9.4)Gecko/20011019 Netscape6/6.2 Subject: The True Identity of Reedwhacker All,Reedwhacker, a.k.a. Wayne Cattanach, has been very busy of late. It would seem that the whole purpose of the article and false persona was to inflate the hit count for FAOL. I can't think of any other purpose that was being served, but correct me if I'm wrong on that one, Wayne. Now, Wayne is not the villain of the piece but I'm contributing some teal feathers and someone else has some roofing tar. Grayling should be interesting. Bring your own feathers. In case you have any doubt that Wayne is Reedwhacker, though he doesn't seriously deny it, contact me. I'll show you the proof (fingerprints).:)Best regards,Reedhttp://www.overmywaders.com/ from DCURTIS@satx.rr.com Sat Mar 30 11:21:54 2002 g2UHLr410846 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 11:21:53 - g2UHHQKW018095; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 11:17:26 -0600 Subject: RE: Bamboo splitters Is this the same splitter you are talking about? I found the website today. http://www.wolfplace.com/rwolfrodco/building/splitter.html Darrin -----Original Message----- Subject: Bamboo splitters Hi all, I just got an email from Bamboo Joe. He has spoken with a fellow in Montanawho makes those star splitters that are shown in the Winston Home Watersvideo. They are designed to be inserted into the end of a culm and rammeddown the center to split the thing. As far as I can tell, this is the onlysource for these tools (at least the only source I have heard of so far).If any of you have seen the Winston video, then you know how incredibly coolthe process looks. Fun, too. Kind of like making julienne fries, one punchof the machine, and PRESTO! A whole bundle of nicely split strips. Thewhole thing took maybe 10 seconds from setting the tool to gathering thestrips. Joe tells me that the tool is well made and has removable blades that allow arranged to split 3, 6, 9, 12, 15, or 18 strips). The person who makes thetool usually sells them for $750.00, but Joe says if there are 10 peopleinterested in purchasing one, the can be had for $550.00. Custom tools areusually expensive, but they are often worth the money. Joe has offered to make a group order. If you are interested, please sendan email to Joe: jcbyrd@direct-pest.com. I don't know what the paymentarrangements are like, but Joe will surely explain that at the time ofordering. Regards, Jason from flytyr@southshore.com Sat Mar 30 11:40:09 2002 g2UHe8411355 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 11:40:08 - g2UHe3O14479; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 11:40:03 -0600 "jsschaeffer@hotmail.com" Subject: April Fool Mishap Finishing rod # 1 was one of the greatest things Ithought I had done other than build an airplane from scratch.Well, I let a lot of people cast it.I had over 200 fish on that rod when a list membercame buy one day and I offered it to him to cast.I stripped out some line and handed him the rod.as he picked it up to make the cast I heard a"Crack", About 12" of the tip was was hanging inan odd arc. I found I was standing on the leader.That was not the end of it.I made the repair and fished the rod for sometime. I had a couple of guys that were fishing atmy house one day and showed them around my smallshop.One mentioned he had never seen a bamboo rod tillnow, I offered to let him cast my rod.He made some beautiful casts with it and wassurprised that a bamboo rod could cast so smooth.He had always heard they were soft and mushy.With a big smile on his face he was winding theline back on the reel at a pretty fast pace.When it came to the leader, it looped around thetip top and there was a definite "Crack" and"Pop". About 8" of the tip broke completely off.and was hanging on the leader.I decided it was time to make another tip section.The broken tip section sits in my tying room forall to see. Had a list member here yesterday andwas showing it to him.Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com from MasjC1@aol.com Sat Mar 30 11:44:04 2002 g2UHi3411631 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 11:44:03 -0600 Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest Harry, I thought that one of the rules was that the story had to be true! Mark Cole Harry, I thought that one of the rules was that the story had to be true! Mark Cole from jteft@frontiernet.net Sat Mar 30 12:12:55 2002 g2UICs412384 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 12:12:54 - 0000 Subject: Re: April Fool Mishap ----- Original Message ----- Subject: April Fool Mishap Finishing rod # 1 was one of the greatest things Ithought I had done other than build an airplane from scratch.Well, I let a lot of people cast it.I had over 200 fish on that rod when a list membercame buy one day and I offered it to him to cast.I stripped out some line and handed him the rod.as he picked it up to make the cast I heard a"Crack", About 12" of the tip was was hanging inan odd arc. I found I was standing on the leader. I can vouch for Tony's April Fool Mishap !I know cause I was that "Fool"...:- ((((((My wife Pat and I had stopped for a couple of days to take Tony up on hisgracious offer of fishing the White River and offering a newbie rod buildersome tips. I also got my first lesson in bamboo repair. Jim Td> from rmoon@ida.net Sat Mar 30 12:22:27 2002 g2UIMR412749 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 12:22:27 - Subject: Re: The True Identity of Reedwhacker OK Reed, I'm a doubter. Show me. If you are right, I could contribute apint of turpentine. Ralph Reed Curry wrote: All,Reedwhacker, a.k.a. Wayne Cattanach, has been very busy of late. Itwould seem that the whole purpose of the article and false persona wasto inflate the hit count for FAOL. I can't think of any other purposethat was being served, but correct me if I'm wrong on that one, Wayne. Now, Wayne is not the villain of the piece but I'm contributing someteal feathers and someone else has some roofing tar. Grayling should beinteresting. Bring your own feathers. In case you have any doubt that Wayne is Reedwhacker, though he doesn'tseriously deny it, contact me. I'll show you the proof (fingerprints).:)Best regards,Reedhttp://www.overmywaders.com/ --http://www.ida.net/users/rmoon from jcbyrd@direct-pest.com Sat Mar 30 12:23:58 2002 g2UINv412978 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 12:23:57 - by direct-pest.com [208.27.26.103] for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 13:01:27 -0500 "Rodmakers" Subject: Re: Bamboo splitters Darrin: That is one of the splitters made by Mr. Wandashin in Montana. Btw. I want to make a disclaimer here. I don't own one, I do want one, andI don't have any financial interest in the company. Joe =================================================Lost in the Hills of East Tennessee with a Bamboo Fly Rod in one handand a cigar in the other....."What a Great Life". Visit my bambooflyrod site at http://www.direct-pest.com/rodmaker----- Original Message ----- Subject: RE: Bamboo splitters Is this the same splitter you are talking about? I found the website today. http://www.wolfplace.com/rwolfrodco/building/splitter.html Darrin -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Thursday, March 28, 2002 11:33 PM Subject: Bamboo splitters Hi all, I just got an email from Bamboo Joe. He has spoken with a fellow in Montana who makes those star splitters that are shown in the Winston HomeWatersvideo. They are designed to be inserted into the end of a culm and rammeddown the center to split the thing. As far as I can tell, this is the only source for these tools (at least the only source I have heard of so far).If any of you have seen the Winston video, then you know how incredibly cool the process looks. Fun, too. Kind of like making julienne fries, one punch of the machine, and PRESTO! A whole bundle of nicely split strips. Thewhole thing took maybe 10 seconds from setting the tool to gathering thestrips. Joe tells me that the tool is well made and has removable blades that allow arranged to split 3, 6, 9, 12, 15, or 18 strips). The person who makes the tool usually sells them for $750.00, but Joe says if there are 10 peopleinterested in purchasing one, the can be had for $550.00. Custom tools are usually expensive, but they are often worth the money. Joe has offered to make a group order. If you are interested, please sendan email to Joe: jcbyrd@direct-pest.com. I don't know what the paymentarrangements are like, but Joe will surely explain that at the time ofordering. Regards, Jason from partrick@intrex.net Sat Mar 30 12:35:13 2002 g2UIZC413514 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 12:35:12 - Subject: Varnish Question Folks, I am under the impression that removal rate of a rod from a varnish dip-tankshould be about 4 1/2 inches/min. If that is close to correct, what are thecomplications (implications?) for a withdrawal rate of, say 1"/min or on theother side,6"/min? It would seem to me that surface tension, flow and viscosity would bedetermining factors but it would be nice to have any comment or perhapsstimulate a discussion. Thanks, Jerry from flytyr@southshore.com Sat Mar 30 12:50:12 2002 g2UIoB414088 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 12:50:12 - g2UIoAO15221 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 12:50:10 -0600 Subject: Re: April Fool Mishap You told them who you are not me. LOLCome back and I will let you cast the new tip without a line.That was why I started making two tip rods.Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com Jim Tefft wrote: ----- Original Message -----From: "Tony Spezio" Sent: Saturday, March 30, 2002 12:35 PMSubject: April Fool Mishap Finishing rod # 1 was one of the greatest things Ithought I had done other than build an airplane from scratch.Well, I let a lot of people cast it.I had over 200 fish on that rod when a list membercame buy one day and I offered it to him to cast.I stripped out some line and handed him the rod.as he picked it up to make the cast I heard a"Crack", About 12" of the tip was was hanging inan odd arc. I found I was standing on the leader. I can vouch for Tony's April Fool Mishap !I know cause I was that "Fool"...:- ((((((My wife Pat and I had stopped for a couple of days to take Tony up on hisgracious offer of fishing the White River and offering a newbie rod buildersome tips. I also got my first lesson in bamboo repair. Jim Td> from ChristopherO@epicimaging.com Sat Mar 30 12:53:48 2002 g2UIrl414347 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 12:53:48 - id ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 10:48:41 -0800 Rodmakers Subject: RE: Varnish Question I would suggest no more than 4" per minute; I pull mine out at 2"/minute. Ihave had problems with drips early on (I was pulling twice as fast, nearly4" / min) in cool, but not cold, weather. A heated tube might help (I'msure it would), but don't get in too much of a hurry or you'll end upre-doing all your dipping. My two cents. chris -----Original Message----- Subject: Varnish Question Folks, I am under the impression that removal rate of a rod from a varnish dip-tankshould be about 4 1/2 inches/min. If that is close to correct, what are thecomplications (implications?) for a withdrawal rate of, say 1"/min or on theother side,6"/min? It would seem to me that surface tension, flow and viscosity would bedetermining factors but it would be nice to have any comment or perhapsstimulate a discussion. Thanks, Jerry from flytyr@southshore.com Sat Mar 30 13:10:29 2002 g2UJAS414897 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 13:10:28 - g2UJAQO15425; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 13:10:26 -0600 Subject: Re: Varnish Question Jerry,I can't answer your questions but this might help.I use a drain tube.I find that the thinner the varnish is, the faster I can drain. I do stay about4 1/2" per minuet for the most part. When the varnish is thick, it takeslongerto drain. The flow is slower on the tube wall.As my varnish gets thicker with use, I have to add some thinner.I find I can drain faster for the first rod or two after thinning.I have started warming the room to 80*F with the varnish and rod in theroom fora day before I start varnishing. This brings everything to an equaltemperatureI watch the flow on the tube wall. I find as long as I don't let the varnishdrain faster than the flow on the walls of the tube it comes out just fine. Ihave drained real slow, I would guess 2" a minuet and found no differencethandoing it faster. Stops are made at each wrap and guide.Again, this is my findings, others may of come up with different findings.Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com Jerry Partrick wrote: Folks, I am under the impression that removal rate of a rod from a varnish dip-tankshould be about 4 1/2 inches/min. If that is close to correct, what are thecomplications (implications?) for a withdrawal rate of, say 1"/min or on theother side,6"/min? It would seem to me that surface tension, flow and viscosity would bedetermining factors but it would be nice to have any comment or perhapsstimulate a discussion. Thanks, Jerry from aebersold@ou.edu Sat Mar 30 13:15:17 2002 g2UJFG415210 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 13:15:16 - id ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 13:15:16 -0600 Subject: turpentine I was going to cut my spar with a little turpentine before applying towraps. I can't find turnpentine anywhere. Ace, Lowes, Home Depot. Doesanyone have a handy URL or likely site to find it.dennis aebersold from jerryy@webtv.net Sat Mar 30 13:26:19 2002 g2UJQI415655 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 13:26:18 - by mailsorter-105-2.iap.bryant.webtv.net (WebTV_Postfix) with 2112.public.lawson.webtv.net (8.8.8-wtv-f/mt.gso.26Feb98) id LAA14022; ETAsAhRKd/O6iC2fXgt1Vwuk72K4ndMaZwIUWKRW7K3iE3dweAh8bcYnQGFIJkg= Subject: Re: turpentine Mar 2002 13:15:15 -0600 I buy a good grade of turps at the local Sherwin Williams paint store.When I thin varnish with turps I buy Wiston Binney artist grade from thelocal art supply store. Don't fall for the synthetic "turpelene". Regards, Jerry Young from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Sat Mar 30 13:33:09 2002 g2UJX8416032 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 13:33:08 - (authenticated) for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 11:33:02 -0800 Subject: Re: Varnish Question Jerry, Chris... Withdrawal speed, as you have surmised, depends on several factorsincludingambient temperature, varnish viscosity, and the stage of the moon . Fourinches per minute works for me, at about 85* F. If I withdraw much slowerthanthat, my varnish coat is too thick. Much faster, and it pulls away, or "tears"in places. ("tears"not as in crying, but as in tearing a sheet of paper inhalf) Harry "Christopher A. Obuchowski, MD" wrote: I would suggest no more than 4" per minute; I pull mine out at 2"/minute. Ihave had problems with drips early on (I was pulling twice as fast, nearly4" / min) in cool, but not cold, weather. A heated tube might help (I'msure it would), but don't get in too much of a hurry or you'll end upre-doing all your dipping. -- -- Harry Boyd --http://www.canerods.com/ -- Bamboo Rods -- http://www.fbcwin.com/ -- Our Church -- from rsgould@cmc.net Sat Mar 30 13:53:09 2002 g2UJr8416664 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 13:53:08 -0600 Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest Great idea Jeff, here's my goof and what a pain it was.I'd just finished wrapping a lovely 8ft a 2pc rod and it was time to =varnish the butt section in my dipper. The way I do that is to mask off =the ferrule and dip the whole works in the varnish right up to the =winding check while clamping the hoisting string to a "twistem" taped =onto the reel seat. Everything went fine except that I dropped the =entire butt section 48" long down into a tube of varnish 60" long. Geez, =what a mess!! Varnish all over the cork grip, varnish all over the reel =seat, varnish all over the floor, varnish all over me and then I had to =remove the varnish tube from the floor and fish out the butt section!! =This is strictly not recommended procedure!Ray Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest The list has been entirely too serious of late, and to remedy that I =am hosting the first annual April Fool's Day contest. Mark Twain once =described April 1 as "that day that reminds us of what we really are the =other 364", and in that spirit, here are the rules: Post to the list your best/worst rodmaking failure, screw-up, mistake, =or rod-related shop incident/accident. 1. It has to be true.2. It must have occurred during rodmaking, or preparation of tools and =materials for rodmaking.2. No "how I burned up the rod in the oven" stories. These are too =ubiquitous, and bandwidth would suffer. Unless something else caught =fire.3. No fingers chopped off by the table saw stories. These are too =tragic to be funny in any respect.4. All posts must be made on or before April 1. Posts after midnight =on April 1 are ineligible, though they might be amusing. Your post will be scored for: 1) originality of the mistake, 2) =dumbness given your years of experience, 3) story quality (how you tell =the tale), and 4) consequences to your reputation as a master rodmaker. The winner will receive a handmade nickel silver cap and ring style =reel seat with a walnut filler. As judge and host, I can not win, but here is one of my many potential =contributions: A renowned rodmaker shared one of his personal tapers with me via =email. I planed out the butt section, but when it came time for the tips =I could not get the forms closed far enough. I spent an entire evening =opening and closing the forms trying to duplicate his tip dimensions. =Try as I might, the tip side of my forms was too coarse to produce tips =with those ultra-fine dimensions. This went on and on. I became =convinced that my forms were overcut, and about twice as deep as they =should be when closed. I took the forms apart to check for debris, and =checked the depth at every station. Everything was right on. Glancing up =at the taper sheet, I realized that the tip diameter of 0.33 seemed odd, =and I checked my taper libary and the list archive. Almost all tips were =about 0.70 or larger, and only a few were slightly smaller. It was then =I realized that the taper I had received from him had strip dimensions =(1/2 rod diameter) and not rod diameter. I had divided the strip =dimensions in half, and had spent three evenings planing away on strips =that were smaller than any taper in the history of rodmaking. I tried = making the section into fly tying bodkins, but it was too fine for even =that. And of course it was one of my best culms. Hi to all, Great idea Jeff, here's my goof and = was.I'd just finished wrapping a lovely 8ft = and it was time to varnish the butt section in my dipper. The way I do = to mask off the ferrule and dip the whole works in the varnish right up = onto the reel seat. Everything went fine except that I dropped the = section 48" long down into a tube of varnish 60" long. Geez, what a = Varnish all over the cork grip, varnish all over the reel seat, varnish = the floor, varnish all over me and then I had to remove the varnish tube = the floor and fish out the butt section!! This is strictly not = procedure!Ray ----- Original Message ----- Schaeffer Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2004 = PMSubject: Re: rodmaking April = Contest The list has been entirely too = and to remedy that I am hosting the first annual April Fool's Day = Mark Twain once described April 1= that reminds us of what we really are the other 364", and in that = are the rules: = incident/accident. 1. It has to be true.2. It must have occurred during = preparation of tools and materials for rodmaking.2. No "how I burned up the rod in the = 3. No fingers chopped off by the = stories. These are too tragic to be funny in any respect. they might be amusing. Your post will be scored for: = quality (how you tell the tale), and 4) consequences to your = master rodmaker. The winner will receive a handmade = cap and ring style reel seat with a walnut filler. As judge and host, I can not win, but = A renowned rodmaker shared one of his= tapers with me via email. I planed out the butt section, but when it = evening opening and closing the forms trying to duplicate his tip = tips with those ultra-fine dimensions. This went on and on. I became = that my forms were overcut, and about twice as deep as they should be = at every station. Everything was right on. Glancing up at = sheet, I realized that the tip diameter of 0.33 seemed odd, and I = the taper I had received from him had strip dimensions (1/2 rod = not rod diameter. I had divided the strip dimensions in half, and had = three evenings planing away on strips that were smaller than any taper = was one of my best culms. from bigdug@networld.com Sat Mar 30 14:03:49 2002 g2UK3m417089 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 14:03:48 - 2002 07:41:29 -0700 Subject: test from canazon@mindspring.com Sat Mar 30 14:11:37 2002 g2UKBb417526 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 14:11:37 -0600 helo=oemcomputer) id 16rPCD-00036I-00; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 15:11:29 -0500 Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest sounds like a winner brianmike I heard the clicking and WHOOSH of the gas furnace firing up. Right =behind the water heater, next to my new varnishing cabinet! I hadn't =built a varnishing cabinet, I'd built a bomb in basement!It took another week to tear down the cabinet (breaking the big 12" = sounds like a winner brian ----- Original Message ----- Creek I heard the clicking and WHOOSH of = bomb in basement!It took another week to tear down the = from eamon_lee@hotmail.com Sat Mar 30 14:12:07 2002 g2UKC6417610 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 14:12:06 - Sat, 30 Mar 2002 12:12:01 -0800 Sat, 30 Mar 2002 20:12:00 GMT FILETIME=[26E26560:01C1D827] All-My faux pas would have to be, among others, the time I dipped my richly flamed 6611 with the pencil snake guide witness marks still on the shafts. Ooops. I only had one coat on so no big deal right? Wrong. In all the hustle and bustle and humiliation, I removed the marks from the tip and butt. One problem, it was a two tip rod. That's right varnished again and forgot to take the marks off of the other tip. It came out fine after all, so fine in fact I gave it to Dave Leclair!! ;-)) Hey Dave, you get a chance to fish that stick yet or what? Tight glue lines!Eamon _________________________________________________________________Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com from jerryy@webtv.net Sat Mar 30 14:24:06 2002 g2UKO5418236 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 14:24:05 - by mailsorter-105-1.iap.bryant.webtv.net (WebTV_Postfix) with 2115.public.lawson.webtv.net (8.8.8-wtv-f/mt.gso.26Feb98) id MAA18294; ETAsAhR/fLJ8JEXmUICsz0utygtq40FJZQIUGpenR9XZ1QYKpwf82z92KAUfRpg= rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Re: turpentine Sat, 30 Mar 2002 15:18:07 -0500 Oops !!! Harry Boyd just reminded me. The artist turps is Windsor &Newton. That will be my April Fool Mishap. Obviously age has takenmore than my beauty.Yes Winston - T&S Supply is out on airport hiway. Do you need the specson the cutters? Jerry Young from bamboorules@ns.sympatico.ca Sat Mar 30 14:33:22 2002 g2UKXK418712 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 14:33:20 -0600 Organization: New Scotland Fly Rods Subject: Jerry Foster Jerry,sorry to contact you this way but my mail to you bounced backsaying your addy is over quota. Could you contact me off list please? Thanks, Shawn from jsschaeffer@hotmail.com Sat Mar 30 15:05:19 2002 g2UL5I419569 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 15:05:18 -0600 Sat, 30 Mar 2002 13:05:12 -0800 Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest- important addedum FILETIME=[9552A080:01C1D82E] I have been besieged by off list emails alleging that the contest is =unfair because Bob Nunley would be the automaticwinner under any conceivable circumstances.Well, in ANY real world =contest, there is always the master that one must contend with. All I =can say is that even Tiger Woods was beaten last year. I think. And it = However, in the interest of fairness, and remembering those French =skating judges, I have decided to award Bob a "lifetime achievement =award" to soothe any hurt feelings he may have after being the object of =so much, albeit friendly, derision. He will receive a special (most =likely fermented) prize to be delivered personally by me at Grayrock. =Someone else will win the reel seat. I hope that this decision is satisfactory to all our honorable list =members. Now I must go back to that reel seat that I just cut 1/2 inch too short, =and the hardware that blued with my perfect fingerprintright on the cap. Jeff Schaeffer I have been besieged by off list emails = automaticwinner under any conceivable = ANY real world contest, there is = master that one must contend with. All I can say is that even Tiger = to compete. However, in the interest of fairness, = remembering those French skating judges, I have decided to award Bob a = achievement award" to soothe any hurt feelings he may have after being = object of so much, albeit friendly, derision. He will receive a special = likely fermented) prize to be delivered personally by me at Grayrock. = else will win the reel seat. I hope that this decision is = all our honorable list members. Now I must go back to that reel seat = fingerprintright on the cap. Jeff =Schaeffer from LECLAIR123@aol.com Sat Mar 30 15:14:03 2002 g2ULE2419889 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 15:14:02 - Subject: Re: In a message dated 03/30/2002 3:12:44 PM Eastern Standard Time, eamon_lee@hotmail.com writes: Hi Eamon, I haven't tried it yet, but I'm looking forwardto fishing it this year. It is a very beautiful rod. Thank you verymuch for the gift. Dave check out our new site at- flyandrodroom.com AOL site- http://hometown.aol.com/leclair123/index.html from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Sat Mar 30 15:17:07 2002 g2ULH6420144 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 15:17:06 -0600 (authenticated) Sat, 30 Mar 2002 13:17:02 -0800 Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest- important addedum --------------9C12E42273304A9CEF09DAF3 Jeff, Brilliant idea. Well conceived, flawlesslyexecuted. I'll be happy to pitch in towards thecost of the prize for Mr. Nunley. Harry Jeff Schaeffer wrote: I have been besieged by off list emails allegingthat the contest is unfair because Bob Nunleywould be the automaticwinner under anyconceivable circumstances.Well, in ANY realworld contest, there is always the master thatone must contend with. All I can say is thateven Tiger Woods was beaten last year. I think.And it would not be fair to Bob to not allow himto compete. However, in the interest offairness, and remembering those French skatingjudges, I have decided to award Bob a "lifetimeachievement award" to soothe any hurt feelingshe may have after being the object of so much,albeit friendly, derision. He will receive aspecial (most likely fermented) prize to bedelivered personally by me at Grayrock. Someoneelse will win the reel seat. I hope that thisdecision is satisfactory to all our honorablelist members. Now I must go back to that reelseat that I just cut 1/2 inch too short, and thehardware that blued with my perfectfingerprintright on the cap. Jeff Schaeffer -- -- Harry Boyd --http://www.canerods.com/ -- Bamboo Rods -- http://www.fbcwin.com/ -- Our Church -- --------------9C12E42273304A9CEF09DAF3 Jeff, Jeff Schaeffer wrote:I have beenbesieged would be the automaticwinnerunder any conceivable circumstances.Well, in ANY real world contest, thereis always the master that one must contend with. All I can say is thateven Tiger Woods was beaten last year. I think. And it would not be fair in the interest of fairness, and remembering those French skating judges,I have decided to award Bob a "lifetime achievement award" to soothe anyhurt feelings he may have after being the object of so much, albeit friendly,derision. He will receive a special (most likely fermented) prize to bedelivered personally by me at Grayrock. Someone else will win the reel thisdecision is satisfactory to all our honorable list I must go back to that reel seat that I just cut 1/2 inch too short, andthe hardware that blued with my perfect fingerprintright Schaeffer -- -- Bamboo Rods -- --------------9C12E42273304A9CEF09DAF3-- from lblan@provide.net Sat Mar 30 16:04:30 2002 g2UM4T421155 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 16:04:29 -0600 Subject: RE: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest- important addedum Outstanding idea!Larry Blan -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Saturday, March 30, 2002 4:16 PM Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest- important addedum Jeff,Brilliant idea. Well conceived, flawlessly executed. I'll be happyto pitch in towards the cost of the prize for Mr. Nunley. Harry Jeff Schaeffer wrote: I have been besieged by off list emails alleging that the contest isunfair because Bob Nunley would be the automaticwinner under anyconceivablecircumstances.Well, in ANY real world contest, there is always the masterthat one must contend with. All I can say is that even Tiger Woods wasbeaten last year. I think. And it would not be fair to Bob to not allow himto compete. However, in the interest of fairness, and remembering thoseFrench skating judges, I have decided to award Bob a "lifetime achievementaward" to soothe any hurt feelings he may have after being the object of somuch, albeit friendly, derision. He will receive a special (most likelyfermented) prize to be delivered personally by me at Grayrock. Someone elsewill win the reel seat. I hope that this decision is satisfactory to all ourhonorable list members. Now I must go back to that reel seat that I just cut1/2 inch too short, and the hardware that blued with my perfectfingerprintright on the cap. Jeff Schaeffer-- -- Harry Boyd --http://www.canerods.com/ -- Bamboo Rods -- http://www.fbcwin.com/ -- Our Church -- Outstanding idea!Larry Blan BoydSent: Saturday, March 30, 2002 4:16 RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.eduSubject: Re: rodmaking AprilFool's = Ihave = under any conceivable circumstances.Well, in ANY real world contest, = is always the master that one must contend with. All I can say is = Tiger Woods was beaten last year. I think. And it would not be fair = skating judges, I have decided to award Bob a "lifetime achievement = to soothe any hurt feelings he may have after being the object of so = albeit friendly, derision. He will receive a special (most likely = prize to be delivered personally by me at Grayrock. Someone else = back to that reel seat that I just cut 1/2 inch too short, and the = from tausfeld@frontiernet.net Sat Mar 30 16:21:43 2002 g2UMLh421617 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 16:21:43 - 0000 Subject: Re: The True Identity of Reedwhacker reed, I am convinced. Wayne, what have you to say for yourself??? Confessions, denial???The only other purpose I can see would be to increase awareness aboutbamboo. Think about it, an article that was obviously written to raisehackles and push buttons. Then the fireworks, people start tuning in, andread very good retorts to the article, all the time learning with out evenrealizing it. Thread gets locked and he starts it again under a newthread!! Masterful.... if that's what you had in mind. Otherwise you are acad and Reed you can count on me for a mattress full of down. tom----- Original Message ----- Subject: The True Identity of Reedwhacker All,Reedwhacker, a.k.a. Wayne Cattanach, has been very busy of late. Itwould seem that the whole purpose of the article and false persona wasto inflate the hit count for FAOL. I can't think of any other purposethat was being served, but correct me if I'm wrong on that one, Wayne. Now, Wayne is not the villain of the piece but I'm contributing someteal feathers and someone else has some roofing tar. Grayling should beinteresting. Bring your own feathers. In case you have any doubt that Wayne is Reedwhacker, though he doesn'tseriously deny it, contact me. I'll show you the proof (fingerprints).:)Best regards,Reedhttp://www.overmywaders.com/ from lblan@provide.net Sat Mar 30 16:25:03 2002 g2UMP2421903 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 16:25:02 -0600 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 17:25:00 -0500 Subject: RE: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest Now that we have reached an agreement on the "Nunley advantage", I'll postthis. I had a blank that I ferruled and wrapped quickly to test cast. Outinto the back yard I went. I had recently won an argument with my cableprovider concerning the route the cable took to reach the house, so this wasalso my first opportunity to cast in the back yard without an overheadcable. Since most of my casting is within 30' or so (ok, thats as far as Ican cast) I started trying to throw the entire line. I was met withunparalleled success... the tip separated from the male ferrule, I hadneglected one small item - the glue. If only my casts went as far as thattip, it sailed into my neighbors back yard. The Black Lab that calls theback yard home promptly "retrieved" it for me, with only a bit of chewingbefore giving it back. He seemed rather put off that I wouldn't throw thestick for him again.Larry Blan -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2004 10:18 PM Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest The list has been entirely too serious of late, and to remedy that I amhosting the first annual April Fool's Day contest. Mark Twain once describedApril 1 as "that day that reminds us of what we really are the other 364",and in that spirit, here are the rules: Post to the list your best/worst rodmaking failure, screw-up, mistake, orrod-related shop incident/accident. 1. It has to be true.2. It must have occurred during rodmaking, or preparation of tools andmaterials for rodmaking.2. No "how I burned up the rod in the oven" stories. These are tooubiquitous, and bandwidth would suffer. Unless something else caught fire.3. No fingers chopped off by the table saw stories. These are too tragicto be funny in any respect.4. All posts must be made on or before April 1. Posts after midnight onApril 1 are ineligible, though they might be amusing. Your post will be scored for: 1) originality of the mistake, 2) dumbnessgiven your years of experience, 3) story quality (how you tell the tale),and 4) consequences to your reputation as a master rodmaker. The winner will receive a handmade nickel silver cap and ring style reelseat with a walnut filler. As judge and host, I can not win, but here is one of my many potentialcontributions: A renowned rodmaker shared one of his personal tapers with me via email. Iplaned out the butt section, but when it came time for the tips I could notget the forms closed far enough. I spent an entire evening opening andclosing the forms trying to duplicate his tip dimensions. Try as I might,the tip side of my forms was too coarse to produce tips with thoseultra-fine dimensions. This went on and on. I became convinced that myformswere overcut, and about twice as deep as they should be when closed. I tookthe forms apart to check for debris, and checked the depth at every station.Everything was right on. Glancing up at the taper sheet, I realized that thetip diameter of 0.33 seemed odd, and I checked my taper libary and the listarchive. Almost all tips were about 0.70 or larger, and only a few wereslightly smaller. It was then I realized that the taper I had received fromhim had strip dimensions (1/2 rod diameter) and not rod diameter. I haddivided the strip dimensions in half, and had spent three evenings planingaway on strips that were smaller than any taper in the history of rodmaking.I tried making the section into fly tying bodkins, but it was too fine foreven that. And of course it was one of my best culms. Jeff Schaeffer that we have reached an agreement on the "Nunley advantage", I'll post = had a blank that I ferruled and wrapped quickly to test cast. Out into = yard I went. I had recently won an argument with my cable provider = opportunity to cast in the back yard without an overhead cable. Since = casting is within 30' or so (ok, thats as far as I can cast) I started = throw the entire line. I was met with unparalleled success... the tip = my casts went as far as that tip, it sailed into my neighbors back yard. = Black Lab that calls the back yard home promptly "retrieved" it for me, = only a bit of chewing before giving it back. He seemed rather put off = wouldn't throw the stick for him again.Larry Blan SchaefferSent: Thursday, March 25, 2004 10:18 = RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.eduSubject: Re: rodmaking AprilFool's = ContestThe list has been entirely too = and to remedy that I am hosting the first annual April Fool's Day = Mark Twain once described April 1= that reminds us of what we really are the other 364", and in that = are the rules: = incident/accident. 1. It has to be true.2. It must have occurred during = preparation of tools and materials for rodmaking.2. No "how I burned up the rod in the = 3. No fingers chopped off by the = stories. These are too tragic to be funny in any respect. they might be amusing. Your post will be scored for: = quality (how you tell the tale), and 4) consequences to your = master rodmaker. The winner will receive a handmade = cap and ring style reel seat with a walnut filler. As judge and host, I can not win, but = A renowned rodmaker shared one of his= tapers with me via email. I planed out the butt section, but when it = evening opening and closing the forms trying to duplicate his tip = tips with those ultra-fine dimensions. This went on and on. I became = that my forms were overcut, and about twice as deep as they should be = at every station. Everything was right on. Glancing up at = sheet, I realized that the tip diameter of 0.33 seemed odd, and I = the taper I had received from him had strip dimensions (1/2 rod = not rod diameter. I had divided the strip dimensions in half, and had = three evenings planing away on strips that were smaller than any taper = was one of my best culms. from jojo@ipa.net Sat Mar 30 16:35:16 2002 g2UMZF422265 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 16:35:15 -0600 helo=default) id 16rRRE-0001tR-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 17:35:08 -0500 Subject: Re: The True Identity of Reedwhacker Am I missing something here? The only thing I can say with any degree ofcertainty is that Wayne hasbeen/is a contributor for FAOL. Is there some piece of evidence that I'veoverlooked thatconclusively proves that WC is, in fact, the Reedwanker? Was theresomething on that site to thiseffect but no longer is?Help me here guys, 'cause I'm not making the same leaping conclusion. M-D reed, I am convinced. Wayne, what have you to say for yourself??? Confessions, denial???The only other purpose I can see would be to increase awareness aboutbamboo. Think about it, an article that was obviously written to raisehackles and push buttons. Then the fireworks, people start tuning in, andread very good retorts to the article, all the time learning with out evenrealizing it. Thread gets locked and he starts it again under a newthread!! Masterful.... if that's what you had in mind. Otherwise you are acad and Reed you can count on me for a mattress full of down. tom All,Reedwhacker, a.k.a. Wayne Cattanach, has been very busy of late. Itwould seem that the whole purpose of the article and false persona wasto inflate the hit count for FAOL. I can't think of any other purposethat was being served, but correct me if I'm wrong on that one, Wayne. Now, Wayne is not the villain of the piece but I'm contributing someteal feathers and someone else has some roofing tar. Grayling should beinteresting. Bring your own feathers. In case you have any doubt that Wayne is Reedwhacker, though he doesn'tseriously deny it, contact me. I'll show you the proof (fingerprints).:)Best regards,Reedhttp://www.overmywaders.com/ from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Sat Mar 30 17:30:26 2002 g2UNUP423356 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 17:30:25 -0600 (authenticated) for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 15:30:23 -0800 Subject: Re: The True Identity of Reedwhacker Once again, Back off guys. Wayne isn't the author. We all ought to knowWayne better than that. Wayneis a lot of things, including a friend to Rodmakers everywhere, but aReedwanker isn't one of them. Can we please, please let this drop?Harry Jojo DeLancier wrote: Am I missing something here? The only thing I can say with any degree ofcertainty is that Wayne hasbeen/is a contributor for FAOL. -- -- Harry Boyd --http://www.canerods.com/ -- Bamboo Rods -- http://www.fbcwin.com/ -- Our Church -- from channer@frontier.net Sat Mar 30 17:40:33 2002 g2UNeX423790 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 17:40:33 - for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 16:40:33 - Subject: Re: The True Identity of Reedwhacker Methinks Reed is having us on a bit.john Reed Curry wrote: All,Reedwhacker, a.k.a. Wayne Cattanach, has been very busy of late. Itwould seem that the whole purpose of the article and false persona wasto inflate the hit count for FAOL. I can't think of any other purposethat was being served, but correct me if I'm wrong on that one, Wayne. Now, Wayne is not the villain of the piece but I'm contributing someteal feathers and someone else has some roofing tar. Grayling should beinteresting. Bring your own feathers. In case you have any doubt that Wayne is Reedwhacker, though he doesn'tseriously deny it, contact me. I'll show you the proof (fingerprints).:)Best regards,Reedhttp://www.overmywaders.com/ from Jkvseafood@aol.com Sat Mar 30 17:40:39 2002 g2UNec423797 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 17:40:38 -0600 0330184023; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 18:40:23 -0500 Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest now that sounds like one of my days!!!!!!!! john from channer@frontier.net Sat Mar 30 17:57:15 2002 g2UNvE424486 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 17:57:14 - Subject: Re: turpentine Dennis;find a little mom and pop hardware store, or go to the smallest town inyour area, preferably one out in the country a bit, they'll have some.Old timers just love old timey stuff like turpentine, you got to gowhere they shop.john "Aebersold, Dennis R" wrote: I was going to cut my spar with a little turpentine before applying towraps. I can't find turnpentine anywhere. Ace, Lowes, Home Depot. Doesanyone have a handy URL or likely site to find it.dennis aebersold from Jkvseafood@aol.com Sat Mar 30 18:02:48 2002 g2V02m424787 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 18:02:48 -0600 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 19:02:39 -0500 MAILINID101-0330190239; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 19:02:39 -0500 Subject: Fwd: RE: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest 010203040506" ------_Part_3ca6521f-028e-3a72-010203040506 this could be a tie. the basemant bomb and fetch. ------_Part_3ca6521f-028e-3a72-010203040506 MAILINXE44-0330172530; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 17:25:30 -0500 Sat, 30 Mar 2002 17:25:09 -0500 g2UMP7421928; g2UMP2421903 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 16:25:02 -0600 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 17:25:00 -0500 Subject: RE: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest Now that we have reached an agreement on the "Nunley advantage", I'll postthis. I had a blank that I ferruled and wrapped quickly to test cast. Outinto the back yard I went. I had recently won an argument with my cableprovider concerning the route the cable took to reach the house, so this wasalso my first opportunity to cast in the back yard without an overheadcable. Since most of my casting is within 30' or so (ok, thats as far as Ican cast) I started trying to throw the entire line. I was met withunparalleled success... the tip separated from the male ferrule, I hadneglected one small item - the glue. If only my casts went as far as thattip, it sailed into my neighbors back yard. The Black Lab that calls theback yard home promptly "retrieved" it for me, with only a bit of chewingbefore giving it back. He seemed rather put off that I wouldn't throw thestick for him again.Larry Blan -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2004 10:18 PM Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest The list has been entirely too serious of late, and to remedy that I amhosting the first annual April Fool's Day contest. Mark Twain once describedApril 1 as "that day that reminds us of what we really are the other 364",and in that spirit, here are the rules: Post to the list your best/worst rodmaking failure, screw-up, mistake, orrod-related shop incident/accident. 1. It has to be true.2. It must have occurred during rodmaking, or preparation of tools andmaterials for rodmaking.2. No "how I burned up the rod in the oven" stories. These are tooubiquitous, and bandwidth would suffer. Unless something else caught fire.3. No fingers chopped off by the table saw stories. These are too tragicto be funny in any respect.4. All posts must be made on or before April 1. Posts after midnight onApril 1 are ineligible, though they might be amusing. Your post will be scored for: 1) originality of the mistake, 2) dumbnessgiven your years of experience, 3) story quality (how you tell the tale),and 4) consequences to your reputation as a master rodmaker. The winner will receive a handmade nickel silver cap and ring style reelseat with a walnut filler. As judge and host, I can not win, but here is one of my many potentialcontributions: A renowned rodmaker shared one of his personal tapers with me via email. Iplaned out the butt section, but when it came time for the tips I could notget the forms closed far enough. I spent an entire evening opening andclosing the forms trying to duplicate his tip dimensions. Try as I might,the tip side of my forms was too coarse to produce tips with thoseultra-fine dimensions. This went on and on. I became convinced that myformswere overcut, and about twice as deep as they should be when closed. I tookthe forms apart to check for debris, and checked the depth at every station.Everything was right on. Glancing up at the taper sheet, I realized that thetip diameter of 0.33 seemed odd, and I checked my taper libary and the listarchive. Almost all tips were about 0.70 or larger, and only a few wereslightly smaller. It was then I realized that the taper I had received fromhim had strip dimensions (1/2 rod diameter) and not rod diameter. I haddivided the strip dimensions in half, and had spent three evenings planingaway on strips that were smaller than any taper in the history of rodmaking.I tried making the section into fly tying bodkins, but it was too fine foreven that. And of course it was one of my best culms. Jeff Schaeffer that we have reached an agreement on the "Nunley advantage", I'll post this.= had a blank that I ferruled and wrapped quickly to test cast. Out into the b= yard I went. I had recently won an argument with my cable providerconcernin= opportunity to cast in the back yard without an overhead cable. Since mosto= casting is within 30' or so (ok, thats as far as I can cast) I started tryin= throw the entire line. I was met with unparalleled success... the tip separa= my casts went as far as that tip, it sailed into my neighbors back yard. The= Black Lab that calls the back yard home promptly "retrieved" it for me, with= only a bit of chewing before giving it back. He seemed rather put off that I= wouldn't throw the stick for him again.Larry Blan SchaefferSent: Thursday, March 25, 2004 10:18 RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.eduSubject: Re: rodmaking AprilFool's Day= ContestThe list has been entirely too seriousof= and to remedy that I am hosting the first annual April Fool's Day contest.= Mark Twain once described April 1as "t= that reminds us of what we really are the other 364", and in that are the rules: rod= incident/accident. 1. It has to be true.2. It must have occurred duringrodmaking= preparation of tools and materials for rodmaking.2. No "how I burned up the rod in theove= 3. No fingers chopped off by the tablesa= stories. These are too tragic to be funny in any respect. they might be amusing. Your post will be scored for: quality (how you tell the tale), and 4) consequences to your reputation as= master rodmaker. The winner will receive a handmadenickel= cap and ring style reel seat with a walnut filler. As judge and host, I can not win, buther= A renowned rodmaker shared one of hisper= tapers with me via email. I planed out the butt section, but when it evening opening and closing the forms trying to duplicate his tip dimensio= produ= tips with those ultra-fine dimensions. This went on and on. I became convi= that my forms were overcut, and about twice as deep as they should bewhen= d= at every station. Everything was right on. Glancing up at sheet, I realized that the tip diameter of 0.33 seemed odd, and I the taper I had received from him had strip dimensions (1/2 rod not rod diameter. I had divided the strip dimensions in half, and had spen= three evenings planing away on strips that were smaller than any taper was one of my best culms. ------_Part_3ca6521f-028e-3a72-010203040506-- from rcurry@ttlc.net Sat Mar 30 18:29:02 2002 g2V0T1425407 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 18:29:01 - User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:0.9.4)Gecko/20011019 Netscape6/6.2 Subject: The identity of Reedwhacker --- it ain't W.C. Folks, The indication that pointed to Wayne C. as the author of theReedwhacker article was the explicit attribution that FAOL made to Wayne by showing a link to the article with Wayne as the contributor. This seemed pretty clear to me and many others. When I told Wayne that I had found him out yesterday, he, being quite busy, dashed off a hasty reply that was a whimsical, non-denial. HOWEVER, I was able to speak to Wayne this afternoon. Not only hasWayne nobly disavowed the title of Reedwhacker (and I believe him) but FAOL has changed that link. Deanna sent me a note saying : "Wayne is NOT the author either, nor is Ron Kusse, nor me or JC.My poor maintence of a page 5 years old might be at fault, but not Wayne." Reed from rmoon@ida.net Sat Mar 30 18:54:03 2002 g2V0s2426031 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 18:54:02 - 0000 Subject: Re: The identity of Reedwhacker --- it ain't W.C. Gosh Reed, I thought that that article was this week's not 5 years ago Reed Curry wrote: "Wayne is NOT the author either, nor is Ron Kusse, nor me or JC.My poor maintence of a page 5 years old might be at fault, but not Wayne." Reed --http://www.ida.net/users/rmoon from Lazybee45@aol.com Sat Mar 30 19:18:14 2002 g2V1ID426716 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 19:18:13 -0600 Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest- important addedum In a message dated 3/30/02 3:17:55 PM Central Standard Time, fbcwin@3g.quik.com writes: I would be happy to aid the effort, but :::burp::::unfortunately the beverage I was planning to :::burp:::: contribute, was ::slurp:::unfortunately lost in a.......Flood.. yes that's it a flood, darned Fosters Extra Bitter doesn't float worth a damn. Have to go get another one!...mutter grumble... mark visit Wood Art Custom Designs http://woodartcustom.freeservers.com or http://hometown.aol.com/lazybee45/myhomepage/business.html Hand crafted items made to order! from avyoung@iinet.net.au Sat Mar 30 19:39:15 2002 g2V1dD427211 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 19:39:14 -0600 Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest I had the butt section chucked up in the lathe with the cork handle poking out on the opposite side of the bed.Started to sand the handle with a length of sand paper held between my two hands and sneezed. The sandpaper jambed when I didn't let go fast enough and the rod became what I'd best call a bird cage when the splines de laminated. Tony At 10:18 PM 3/25/04 -0500, Jeff Schaeffer wrote: The list has been entirely too serious of late, and to remedy that I am hosting the first annual April Fool's Day contest. Mark Twain once described April 1 as "that day that reminds us of what we really are the other 364", and in that spirit, here are the rules: Post to the list your best/worst rodmaking failure, screw-up, mistake, or rod-related shop incident/accident. 1. It has to be true.2. It must have occurred during rodmaking, or preparation of tools and materials for rodmaking.2. No "how I burned up the rod in the oven" stories. These are too ubiquitous, and bandwidth would suffer. Unless something else caught fire.3. No fingers chopped off by the table saw stories. These are too tragic to be funny in any respect.4. All posts must be made on or before April 1. Posts after midnight on April 1 are ineligible, though they might be amusing. Your post will be scored for: 1) originality of the mistake, 2) dumbness given your years of experience, 3) story quality (how you tell the tale), and 4) consequences to your reputation as a master rodmaker. The winner will receive a handmade nickel silver cap and ring style reel seat with a walnut filler. As judge and host, I can not win, but here is one of my many potential contributions: A renowned rodmaker shared one of his personal tapers with me via email. I planed out the butt section, but when it came time for the tips I could not get the forms closed far enough. I spent an entire evening opening and closing the forms trying to duplicate his tip dimensions. Try as I might, the tip side of my forms was too coarse to produce tips with those ultra-fine dimensions. This went on and on. I became convinced that my forms were overcut, and about twice as deep as they should be whenclosed. I took the forms apart to check for debris, and checked the depth at every station. Everything was right on. Glancing up at the taper sheet, I realized that the tip diameter of 0.33 seemed odd, and I checked my taper libary and the list archive. Almost all tips were about 0.70 or larger, and only a few were slightly smaller. It was then I realized that the taper I had received from him had strip dimensions (1/2 rod diameter) and not rod diameter. I had divided the strip dimensions in half, and had spent three evenings planing away on strips that were smaller than any taper in the history of rodmaking. I tried making the section into fly tying bodkins, but it was too fine for even that. And of course it was one of my best culms. Jeff Schaeffer /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from bob@downandacross.com Sat Mar 30 20:09:00 2002 g2V28w427743 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 20:08:59 - ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 21:08:52 -0500 Subject: Bench Plane I know several of the listers are big on bench planes for cane work. I havebeen hand planing again while the mill gets going. Today, I was working on aquad and decided to try my grandfather's old Stanley #4 bench plane. What agreat job it did! It was a bit big to go to final dimensions, but I did withgood results.My question is: What would be the ideal Lie Nielsen Bench Plane to use forhand planing? The #1 or the #2? I was going to buy a LN 9.5 copy, but now Iam almost completely sold on the bench planes. Used in conjunction with aclamp, it was heaven. I am going to get one, not sure which one yet oorwhether to have it grooved or not. Any ideas?Thanks,Bob M. from cattanac@wmis.net Sat Mar 30 21:09:09 2002 g2V398428721 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 21:09:08 - Subject: Re: The identity of Reedwhacker --- it ain't W.C. Folks - I have tried to find out what is going on before I made too manycomments - What I have discovered is this - one misunderstanding supportinganother - I quess - first and foremost - I didn't write the article inquestion - I didn't advise on it - I never knew it exsisted until it wascommented on here - and when I do write - whether it is good or bad I putmy own name to it.So am I upset with anyone - NO. Some may ask why - It is simple - anoverlooked link - a misunderstanding here and there - hey - Life moves onand the freindships in all quarters are still solid.In a few days I hope to post the latest of the writing - it is titledBranding - and it shares about the marketing of rods - Dennis Higham askedif I could do a presentation at GrayRock on the subject - and as in the pastI will share here before the information goes elsewhere. Wayne from caneman@clnk.com Sat Mar 30 23:51:09 2002 g2V5p8401168 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 23:51:08 - (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35) Subject: Re: turpentine Dennis, try an art supply or hobby supply store. I get mine at Hobby Lobby.Very clean, very good quality artists turpentine. Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com- ---- Original Message ----- Subject: turpentine I was going to cut my spar with a little turpentine before applying towraps. I can't find turnpentine anywhere. Ace, Lowes, Home Depot. Doesanyone have a handy URL or likely site to find it.dennis aebersold from caneman@clnk.com Sat Mar 30 23:56:30 2002 g2V5uT401466 for ; Sat, 30 Mar 2002 23:56:29 -0600 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35) Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest- important addedum LOL, Believe it or not, I'm having so much fun reading that I'm not the =only one in the lot that screws up that I'm not even going to enter a ="Tale from the Bench"... This is great! So much humor that my bamboo =splinters don't even hurt tonite! *S* Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest- important addedum Brilliant idea. Well conceived, flawlessly executed. I'll be = I have been besieged by off list emails alleging that the contest is =unfair because Bob Nunley would be the automaticwinner under any =conceivable circumstances.Well, in ANY real world contest, there is =always the master that one must contend with. All I can say is that even =Tiger Woods was beaten last year. I think. And it would not be fair to =Bob to not allow him to compete. However, in the interest of fairness, =and remembering those French skating judges, I have decided to award Bob =a "lifetime achievement award" to soothe any hurt feelings he may have =after being the object of so much, albeit friendly, derision. He will =receive a special (most likely fermented) prize to be delivered =personally by me at Grayrock. Someone else will win the reel seat. I =hope that this decision is satisfactory to all our honorable list =members. Now I must go back to that reel seat that I just cut 1/2 inch =too short, and the hardware that blued with my perfect fingerprintright =on the cap. Jeff Schaeffer LOL, Believe it or not, I'm having so much fun = I'm not the only one in the lot that screws up that I'm not even going = splinters don't even hurt tonite! *S* Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com ----- Original Message ----- Harry= Cc: RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu = Sent: Saturday, March 30, 2002 = PMSubject: Re: rodmaking April = Contest- important addedum Ihave = under any conceivable circumstances.Well, in ANY real world contest, = is always the master that one must contend with. All I can say is = Tiger Woods was beaten last year. I think. And it would not be fair = skating judges, I have decided to award Bob a "lifetime achievement = to soothe any hurt feelings he may have after being the object of so = albeit friendly, derision. He will receive a special (most likely = prize to be delivered personally by me at Grayrock. Someone else = back to that reel seat that I just cut 1/2 inch too short, and the = from caneman@clnk.com Sun Mar 31 00:02:01 2002 g2V620401855 for ; Sun, 31 Mar 2002 00:02:00 - (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35) Subject: Re: turpentine Yep, didn't think about that. My "Granny" used to put a drop of turps on mytongue when I had a sore throat... It was used to cure LOTS of ailments!Actually, I don't really know that it helped the sore throat, but it damnsure made you quit complaining about it! Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com- ---- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: turpentine Dennis;find a little mom and pop hardware store, or go to the smallest town inyour area, preferably one out in the country a bit, they'll have some.Old timers just love old timey stuff like turpentine, you got to gowhere they shop.john "Aebersold, Dennis R" wrote: I was going to cut my spar with a little turpentine before applying towraps. I can't find turnpentine anywhere. Ace, Lowes, Home Depot. Does anyone have a handy URL or likely site to find it.dennis aebersold from caneman@clnk.com Sun Mar 31 00:29:59 2002 g2V6Tx402589 for ; Sun, 31 Mar 2002 00:29:59 -0600 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35) Sun, 31 Mar 2002 00:27:30 -0600 Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest I really don't want to enter the Contest, as there are much wilder thingsthan the following that have happened to a lot of rodmakers out there...Like I said, reading these things had put a smile on my face to pleasantlypunctuate an otherwise harrowing day (drove damn near to St. Louis todaytotake a Driveshaft and install it on my son's car that was stranded there),but I'll throw a little one in, not for the Contest, but just a littlelearning experience for those of you that ever think you want to tryimpregnating a rod.About 10 or 12 years ago, I had my first experience with trying toimpregnate a rod. I was not a member of the listserv back then, had neverheard of the Planing Form, and had no idea that anyone had dabbled andfigured a few things out about a "proper" process. My first thought wasthat if I pressurized a vessel with poly in it, that surely the poly wouldimpregnate the rod very well and that I'd get a decent result... So I wasoff to the races. I bought a 4" diameter piece of PVC, put a cap on oneend, a threaded adapter on the other end in which I screwed a sewer typescrew cap (the kind they use for the caps on the cleanouts on Sewersystems), drilled the sides close to the top and put a valve there with afemale air chuck on the valve. I glued up all the joints and let her dryovernight and then filled it with varnish. Being one of those people whothinks that if one aspirin can cure a headache, then 10 must cure cancer, Idecided to just set the pressure regulator on my compressor to 120 PSI andlet 'er rip... Well, let me tell you, after standing there and admiring it,hearing no leaks for about 10 seconds, that's exactly what happened. She"let it rip". That PVC may be rated at 200 psi, but those damn thin plasticscrew on sewer caps are definitely NOT! It sounded like a cannon going off.You'd be shocked how long it takes you to realize that the Varnish Versionof Old Faithful isn't going to quit erupting until you turn the air valveoff... I didn't know what to worry more about, the ringing in my ears, thevarnish dripping from the ceiling of the garage or the near 2 gallons ofvarnish that was in my hair and beard and all over my clothes. I lookedlike I'd been dipped in honey. Then, my hair was about 18" long and thatnight it was not in it's traditional pony tail and I donned a long red beard(no, it hasn't always been white!), so I stood there looking like a drownedrat, beard and hair stuck together and dripping with about $120 worth ofVarmor R-10! I wasn't so worried about the ceiling, but very worried aboutthe rest of me! I gotta say, you can NEVER done anything to yourself moremiserable than stand naked in the middle of a garage on a piece of plasticdrop cloth pouring mineral spirits through your hair trying to get thevarnish out... Oh, and when you think you have it all out, then you get inthe shower and find that you were NOT even close! Water just makes itworse!!! They don't make enough shampoo to get all of it out. So back outto the drop cloth, butt naked again, while my wife (now ex wife... wonderwhy?) goes to wal mart to get a couple of more gallons of mineral spiritswhile I yell at her from the garage "Hurry the hell up before this s#!tdries!!!"Well, she did get back in time, and me... I smelled like a paint factory beard and hair as the varnish is).I guess, of all the screwups I've pulled off, that was probably the oneI've told the least people about... so now you all know my deepest, darkestrodmaking screwup! Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com from dnhayashida@yahoo.com Sun Mar 31 01:21:51 2002 g2V7Lo403412 for ; Sun, 31 Mar 2002 01:21:50 - 30 Mar 2002 23:21:49 PST Subject: Re: Bench Plane "rodmakers@wugate.wustl.e" A grooved #2 will get you from rough planing to finaldimensions quite nicely. If you really want to rip offa lot of bamboo quickly, a #3 or #4 will do the bestjob of rough planing, I give the nod to a #3. A #1would be nice for fine finish planing, but not reallynecessary. Since you already have a #4 for roughplaning, and you already can control it well enough totake strips down to final dimensions, a #1 might helpwith really fine planing. A #2 might be a little moreuseful for more general planing as well as finaldimensions. How's that for waffling? I would give a slight edge to the #2 over the #1, butyou won't go wrong with either.Darryl Hayashida --- Bob Maulucci wrote: I know several of the listers are big on benchplanes for cane work. I havebeen hand planing again while the mill gets going.Today, I was working on aquad and decided to try my grandfather's old Stanley#4 bench plane. What agreat job it did! It was a bit big to go to finaldimensions, but I did withgood results.My question is: What would be the ideal Lie NielsenBench Plane to use forhand planing? The #1 or the #2? I was going to buy aLN 9.5 copy, but now Iam almost completely sold on the bench planes. Usedin conjunction with aclamp, it was heaven. I am going to get one, notsure which one yet oorwhether to have it grooved or not. Any ideas?Thanks,Bob M. __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Greetings - send holiday greetings for Easter, Passoverhttp://greetings.yahoo.com/ from ajthramer@hotmail.com Sun Mar 31 02:22:53 2002 g2V8Mq404238 for ; Sun, 31 Mar 2002 02:22:52 -0600 Sun, 31 Mar 2002 00:22:43 -0800 Sun, 31 Mar 2002 08:22:43 GMT RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.eduSubject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest FILETIME=[3AEB6BE0:01C1D88D] I had the sleeve of my shirt get caught in grip when i was turning a grip and it twisted the butt right off the rest of the rod. Talk about dumbfounded silence followed by anything BUT silence!A.J. From: Tony Young Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day ContestDate: Sat, 30 Mar 2002 23:06:51 +0800 I had the butt section chucked up in the lathe with the cork handle pokingout on the opposite side of the bed.Started to sand the handle with a length of sand paper held between my twohands and sneezed. The sandpaper jambed when I didn't let go fast enoughand the rod became what I'd best call a bird cage when the splines delaminated. Tony At 10:18 PM 3/25/04 -0500, Jeff Schaeffer wrote: The list has been entirely too serious of late, and to remedy that I amhosting the first annual April Fool's Day contest. Mark Twain oncedescribed April 1 as "that day that reminds us of what we really are theother 364", and in that spirit, here are the rules: Post to the list your best/worst rodmaking failure, screw-up, mistake, orrod-related shop incident/accident. 1. It has to be true.2. It must have occurred during rodmaking, or preparation of tools andmaterials for rodmaking.2. No "how I burned up the rod in the oven" stories. These are tooubiquitous, and bandwidth would suffer. Unless something else caught fire.3. No fingers chopped off by the table saw stories. These are too tragicto be funny in any respect.4. All posts must be made on or before April 1. Posts after midnight onApril 1 are ineligible, though they might be amusing. Your post will be scored for: 1) originality of the mistake, 2) dumbnessgiven your years of experience, 3) story quality (how you tell the tale),and 4) consequences to your reputation as a master rodmaker. The winner will receive a handmade nickel silver cap and ring style reelseat with a walnut filler. As judge and host, I can not win, but here is one of my many potentialcontributions: A renowned rodmaker shared one of his personal tapers with me via email.Iplaned out the butt section, but when it came time for the tips I couldnot get the forms closed far enough. I spent an entire evening opening andclosing the forms trying to duplicate his tip dimensions. Try as I might,the tip side of my forms was too coarse to produce tips with thoseultra-fine dimensions. This went on and on. I became convinced that myforms were overcut, and about twice as deep as they should be whenclosed.I took the forms apart to check for debris, and checked the depth ateverystation. Everything was right on. Glancing up at the taper sheet, Irealized that the tip diameter of 0.33 seemed odd, and I checked my taperlibary and the list archive. Almost all tips were about 0.70 or larger,and only a few were slightly smaller. It was then I realized that thetaper I had received from him had strip dimensions (1/2 rod diameter) andnot rod diameter. I had divided the strip dimensions in half, and hadspent three evenings planing away on strips that were smaller than anytaper in the history of rodmaking. I tried making the section into flytying bodkins, but it was too fine for even that. And of course it was oneof my best culms. Jeff Schaeffer /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ _________________________________________________________________MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx from ajthramer@hotmail.com Sun Mar 31 02:38:41 2002 g2V8cf404647 for ; Sun, 31 Mar 2002 02:38:41 -0600 Sun, 31 Mar 2002 00:38:35 -0800 Sun, 31 Mar 2002 08:38:35 GMT Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest FILETIME=[728A1720:01C1D88F] Oh! That kind of disaster is what you are looking for. Too many to go through. If you can assume that you have some sort of misadventure every 10th rod or so then it goes to the law of averages that they have caught up with me a few times.... I was making a matched pair of 7 1/2 ft 4wt rods for an executives twosons. He was driving down from Portland International to pick up the rods on the way to guided trip to the Deschutes. He called first to see if they were ready and they were. BUT I had not put them into their bags and cut the tubes for them, no big deal right? I noticed the the bags seemed a bit overlength, oh well sometimes the bag dimensions change a 1/2 inch, let me dig through the 7 1/2ft 2/2 bag pile. Hmmmm, looking kind of strange, all the bags were the right length. Well, if the bags are the right length then , OH NO! YOU HAVE TO BE KIDDING! Absolutely correct guys! I had cut the blanks off an inch short in some kind of late night fog and had built a matched set of 7' 4" rods! All ended well though as the boys loved the unusual but easier to handle slightly short rods. As a matter of fact they felt so nice I have even made a few more of them on purpose.A.J. From: "Jeff Schaeffer" Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day ContestDate: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 22:18:20 -0500 The list has been entirely too serious of late, and to remedy that I am hosting the first annual April Fool's Day contest. Mark Twain once described April 1 as "that day that reminds us of what we really are the other 364", and in that spirit, here are the rules: Post to the list your best/worst rodmaking failure, screw-up, mistake, or rod-related shop incident/accident. 1. It has to be true.2. It must have occurred during rodmaking, or preparation of tools and materials for rodmaking.2. No "how I burned up the rod in the oven" stories. These are too ubiquitous, and bandwidth would suffer. Unless something else caught fire.3. No fingers chopped off by the table saw stories. These are too tragic to be funny in any respect.4. All posts must be made on or before April 1. Posts after midnight on April 1 are ineligible, though they might be amusing. Your post will be scored for: 1) originality of the mistake, 2) dumbness given your years of experience, 3) story quality (how you tell the tale), and 4) consequences to your reputation as a master rodmaker. The winner will receive a handmade nickel silver cap and ring style reel seat with a walnut filler. As judge and host, I can not win, but here is one of my many potential contributions: A renowned rodmaker shared one of his personal tapers with me via email. I planed out the butt section, but when it came time for the tips I could not get the forms closed far enough. I spent an entire evening opening and closing the forms trying to duplicate his tip dimensions. Try as I might, the tip side of my forms was too coarse to produce tips with those ultra-fine dimensions. This went on and on. I became convinced that my forms were overcut, and about twice as deep as they should be whenclosed. I took the forms apart to check for debris, and checked the depth at every station. Everything was right on. Glancing up at the taper sheet, I realized that the tip diameter of 0.33 seemed odd, and I checked my taper libary and the list archive. Almost all tips were about 0.70 or larger, and only a few were slightly smaller. It was then I realized that the taper I had received from him had strip dimensions (1/2 rod diameter) and not rod diameter. I had divided the strip dimensions in half, and had spent three evenings planing away on strips that were smaller than any taper in the history of rodmaking. I tried making the section into fly tying bodkins, but it was too fine for even that. And of course it was one of my best culms. Jeff Schaeffer _________________________________________________________________Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com from carstenjorgensen@mail.dk Sun Mar 31 02:42:29 2002 g2V8gS404932 for ; Sun, 31 Mar 2002 02:42:29 -0600 Subject: Sv: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest g2V8gT404933 A.J. & Tony You are not alone in this one. I did the same. The discarded butt piece incl. ofhandle etc.Has now been mounted in a frame and hung on the wall in my office - a nowcherishedconversation piece. regards, Carsten Jorgensen ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest I had the sleeve of my shirt get caught in grip when i was turning a grip and it twisted the butt right off the rest of the rod. Talk about dumbfounded silence followed by anything BUT silence!A.J. From: Tony Young Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day ContestDate: Sat, 30 Mar 2002 23:06:51 +0800 I had the butt section chucked up in the lathe with the cork handle pokingout on the opposite side of the bed.Started to sand the handle with a length of sand paper held between mytwohands and sneezed. The sandpaper jambed when I didn't let go fast enoughand the rod became what I'd best call a bird cage when the splines delaminated. Tony from ajthramer@hotmail.com Sun Mar 31 02:44:46 2002 g2V8ik405161 for ; Sun, 31 Mar 2002 02:44:46 - Sun, 31 Mar 2002 00:44:40 -0800 Sun, 31 Mar 2002 08:44:40 GMT Subject: Saw Beveler FILETIME=[4C1D3F80:01C1D890] Thanks to all who asked about the saw beveler. More response than I could ever respond to. I answered numerous phone inquiries in the process of which I was able to talk to many of the list members who are univerally great guys to talk to. Even convinced me that I should attend a few gatherings so I could down a few frosty ones with all of you guys. The beveller seems to have found a happy home where it should be spitting out blanks in a month or so like it was meant to do.A.J. _________________________________________________________________Join the world's largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Sun Mar 31 05:47:23 2002 g2VBlM406816 for ; Sun, 31 Mar 2002 05:47:22 -0600 (authenticated) Sun, 31 Mar 2002 03:47:15 -0800 Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest See why it's not fair for us amateurs to have to compete against theprofessional screw-ups? You did the right thing, Jeff. No doubt. Harry Bob Nunley wrote: I really don't want to enter the Contest, as there are much wilder thingsthan the following that have happened to a lot of rodmakers out there... -- -- Harry Boyd --http://www.canerods.com/ -- Bamboo Rods -- http://www.fbcwin.com/ -- Our Church -- from wendt@kingcrab.nrl.navy.mil Sun Mar 31 06:09:23 2002 g2VC9M407222 for ; Sun, 31 Mar 2002 06:09:22 - g2VC9Fdd005887 for ; Sun, 31 Mar 2002 07:09:16 - Subject: Re: turpentine Good God Bob, I remember that treatment at the hands of me Grandman.... That and castor oil. You were either screaming, running, or both..... Mark At 12:03 AM 3/31/02 -0600, you wrote: Yep, didn't think about that. My "Granny" used to put a drop of turps on mytongue when I had a sore throat... It was used to cure LOTS of ailments!Actually, I don't really know that it helped the sore throat, but it damnsure made you quit complaining about it! Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com- ---- Original Message -----From: "channer" Cc: Sent: Saturday, March 30, 2002 5:58 PMSubject: Re: turpentine Dennis;find a little mom and pop hardware store, or go to the smallest town inyour area, preferably one out in the country a bit, they'll have some.Old timers just love old timey stuff like turpentine, you got to gowhere they shop.john "Aebersold, Dennis R" wrote: I was going to cut my spar with a little turpentine before applying towraps. I can't find turnpentine anywhere. Ace, Lowes, Home Depot. Does anyone have a handy URL or likely site to find it.dennis aebersold from wendt@kingcrab.nrl.navy.mil Sun Mar 31 06:16:12 2002 g2VCGA407525 for ; Sun, 31 Mar 2002 06:16:10 - g2VCG4dd005928 for ; Sun, 31 Mar 2002 07:16:05 - Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest Bob, Quit!!! Stop!!!!! Truly ROFLMAO!!!!! Too funny! Even though the idea of me imagining a grown man, buck naked in the garage, has little or no appeal to me, I just couldn't help it! And not just buck naked, but buck naked with hair and beard covered with varnish. Nightmare on Nunley Street.... Mark At 12:31 AM 3/31/02 -0600, you wrote: I really don't want to enter the Contest, as there are much wilder thingsthan the following that have happened to a lot of rodmakers out there...Like I said, reading these things had put a smile on my face to pleasantlypunctuate an otherwise harrowing day (drove damn near to St. Louis todaytotake a Driveshaft and install it on my son's car that was stranded there),but I'll throw a little one in, not for the Contest, but just a littlelearning experience for those of you that ever think you want to tryimpregnating a rod. from petermckean@netspace.net.au Sun Mar 31 07:11:56 2002 g2VDBs408237 for ; Sun, 31 Mar 2002 07:11:54 - g2VDBib43360; Subject: Re: New guy question Carsten That has always been my objection to finishing the blank before wrapping. But like so many things in life, the solution is easy - tincture of time! Peter from wendt@kingcrab.nrl.navy.mil Sun Mar 31 07:24:18 2002 g2VDOI408643 for ; Sun, 31 Mar 2002 07:24:18 - g2VDO9dd006296 for ; Sun, 31 Mar 2002 08:24:10 - Subject: OT:Slightly - You can't judge a book by it's cover.... A bitlong... Gang, I'm sitting here pondering, just before 8 AM, in front of my computer. Bob Nunley's April Fools post got me thinking and wondering. Much has been written about the evils of the Internet, and some of what they say is true. But on the other hand, it has a lot of good going for it too. Where else can we meet with those folks, who just like me, have a passion to do certain things - for us, bamboo fishing rods, the craft of building them by hand ( even you machinery guys have to do a fair amount of hand work... :^} ). And we accept everybody, seemingly blindly, because of what we do, or will be doing in the future. We're all a bundle of our own decisions, discriminations ( some good,some not so good ), and personalities. How many of us are willing to accept someone in our lives who is completely different than us as a person we can share our past, present and future good, bad and ugly? Our own little microcosm of the world, the rodmakers list, has changed some of my perceptions. I'm ashamed to say, that I'm usually not the person who would go out and talk to someone who's a bit different than myself. I've met only a couple of the folks on this list face to face, but I accept you guys (and gals if there's any out there ) as friends that I'd share a drop or two, fish a bit, tell stories, etc..... And yet, I don't know what you look like, what your voice sounds like, or how you dress. Bob has been pretty up front about what he is like(and, Bob, I mean no disrespect about you at all). Bob mentioned in his April Fools post that at the time of his cannon making, he had long hair, a beard, and from other posts, I know he enjoys tattoo art and motorcycles. That conjures up a vision in my mind of biker gangs. As I mentioned before, I'm ashamed to admit, I stereotype other folks and put them into nice, neat little compartments, of who I'd associate with, and who I wouldn't associate with. The anonymity of the Internet, I think, has given us a vehicle, to be able to get rid of some of those things we hold dear - our preconceptions, our stereotypes, and our valueless discriminations, what we perceive that person to be based on what they look like, or what we think the person may be based on outward appearances. I don't consciously discriminate against anyone, but because of the way I grew up, I have my own value system stamped into my personality. I grew up in German farm country in Upstate New York, and if you weren't of German ancestry, you weren't part of the family. (No, I didn't marry my cousin....) I've been all over the world, in Uncle Sam's Great Fraternal Flying Club, flying some of the most wonderful winged inventions (Yeah, I'm a fighter puke, flown F-4's, F-16's and F-15's), and we're a pretty egotistical bunch. Ya have to be, being the line of business where you're charged with the country's defense, and you're on the pointy end of the sword.... But that's another story(ies...) In those days, if you weren't a fighter puke, you were a trash hauler or bomber puke. And we, as a community of fighter pukes, determined that if you weren't in a fighter, you were in a target. Where was I going with this? Oh yeah, we discriminated against anybody that didn't fit in our nice little box of fighter jocks. Did I miss out on the opportunity to make friends with a bunch of guys, who even though they flew something we considered lower than our station, were still performing the best at defending our country? Yep. I guess the point is, we look at someone, and make a value judgementbased on what they look like. Fair? No. Does it happen? Yep, a lot. Even though I've never met most of you guys in person, I've accepted you as friends, because of the humor, the sadness, and the fact that you all give up information freely, with out a thought as to what I, or anyone else on this list look like. I know a lot of you have gone to the SRG, Grayrock, Catskill, and other gatherings, and met the faces that go with the names, and enjoy each others company. Without this list, or other Internet facilities, how many of you would associate with the myriad of personalities that are out there? Just goes to show you, there can be a silver lining in the dark clouds. And you really can't judge a book by its cover. I look forward to putting faces to many of the names at the SRG this year. And Bob, I welcome the chance to tip a drop or two with you, share laughs and stories. You guys made my day. Thanks. Mark from petermckean@netspace.net.au Sun Mar 31 07:49:43 2002 g2VDnf409070 for ; Sun, 31 Mar 2002 07:49:41 - g2VDnZK47226; Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest Nah! NO story ever has to be true! Peter Nah! NO story ever has to be =true! Peter from eamon_lee@hotmail.com Sun Mar 31 07:55:17 2002 g2VDtG409390 for ; Sun, 31 Mar 2002 07:55:16 - Sun, 31 Mar 2002 05:55:10 -0800 Sun, 31 Mar 2002 13:55:10 GMT Subject: Happy Easter FILETIME=[AC99F760:01C1D8BB] Happy Holiday folks! You guys are the greatest and thanks for all of the selfless advice and sharing over the past year! Lesson for today (and any dayfor that matter); You can't keep a good man down and you can't kill an idea. Peace-Eamon _________________________________________________________________Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer athttp://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp. from Lazybee45@aol.com Sun Mar 31 08:14:07 2002 g2VEE6410070 for ; Sun, 31 Mar 2002 08:14:06 - Subject: Re: OT:Slightly - You can't judge a book by it's cover.... A bit long... In a message dated 3/31/02 7:25:00 AM Central Standard Time, wendt@kingcrab.nrl.navy.mil writes: Mark and all! I know some navy A6 pukes all too well (Baby Brother is an A6 BN) and a lot off Air Force "pilots" as well, also "bikers" hikers and all sorts of questionable characters. The other list I am on is mostly HPV people (Human powered vehicles) bicycles, tricycles, streamliners, Low racers, kickbikes etc. The funny thing is, that the people on that list, with the single exception of the focus of their addiction, could be interchanged with the people on this one. Itoo have many varied interests and really appreceate the rescource that the 'net provides. As I told my mother the other day (she has discovered e-mail too! a Geneology freaknow!) when I handed her a Quena I had made for her, (a bolivian flute, the best are made from Bamboo surprisingly enough. Anyone have some 1/2inch IDcane they want to part with?) "Ah the internet, it ISN'T just for Pornography any more!"Thanks guys! You have all been a big help!* note, Igot my new web site up, take a look if you feel like it. I have pictures this time! mark visit Wood Art Custom Designs http://woodartcustom.freeservers.com or http://hometown.aol.com/lazybee45/myhomepage/business.html Hand crafted items made to order! from Lazybee45@aol.com Sun Mar 31 08:18:13 2002 g2VEIC410524 for ; Sun, 31 Mar 2002 08:18:12 - Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest In a message dated 3/31/02 7:50:14 AM Central Standard Time, petermckean@netspace.net.au writes: The best stories start either, "No shit, you should have seen this..." or "There Iwas, flat on my back at 10,000 feet with nothing betwen me and the ground but a thin blonde..." or "I was walking through the woods, minding my own business when..." or possibly "Once upon a time!...."In the Movie, "The Cowboys" One of the characters tells a fanciful tale to the group of enrapt kids. At the end, one of them breathes, "Gee mister, is that TRUE?" and he answers (truthfully I think) "Well,if it ain't, It Oughta be!" mark visit Wood Art Custom Designs http://woodartcustom.freeservers.com or http://hometown.aol.com/lazybee45/myhomepage/business.html Hand crafted items made to order! from TSmithwick@aol.com Sun Mar 31 08:22:57 2002 g2VEMu410967 for ; Sun, 31 Mar 2002 08:22:56 - Subject: Re: Happy Easter Let me also add my best wishes. My thanks to Bob and Mark for an uplifting start to what will be a busy day around here. If anyone had a lingering doubt that Bob Nunley deserves the lifetime acheivement award...................The man is the Michael Jordan of mishaps.This has got to be the Rev. Boyd's busiest day of the year, so I doubt we'll be hearing much from him today, but I doubt that even the Rev. could top Mark's comments this morning. from atlasc1@earthlink.net Sun Mar 31 08:34:00 2002 g2VEY0411368 for ; Sun, 31 Mar 2002 08:34:00 -0600 ([209.179.146.187] helo=computer) id 16rgP6-0005wM-00; Sun, 31 Mar 2002 06:33:57 -0800 Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest Ummm....Bob, I think we all concede, You win. Long live the KING! Adam Vigil----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest I really don't want to enter the Contest, as there are much wilder thingsthan the following that have happened to a lot of rodmakers out there...Like I said, reading these things had put a smile on my face to pleasantlypunctuate an otherwise harrowing day (drove damn near to St. Louis today to take a Driveshaft and install it on my son's car that was stranded there),but I'll throw a little one in, not for the Contest, but just a littlelearning experience for those of you that ever think you want to tryimpregnating a rod.About 10 or 12 years ago, I had my first experience with trying toimpregnate a rod. I was not a member of the listserv back then, had neverheard of the Planing Form, and had no idea that anyone had dabbled andfigured a few things out about a "proper" process. My first thought wasthat if I pressurized a vessel with poly in it, that surely the poly wouldimpregnate the rod very well and that I'd get a decent result... So I wasoff to the races. I bought a 4" diameter piece of PVC, put a cap on oneend, a threaded adapter on the other end in which I screwed a sewer typescrew cap (the kind they use for the caps on the cleanouts on Sewersystems), drilled the sides close to the top and put a valve there with afemale air chuck on the valve. I glued up all the joints and let her dryovernight and then filled it with varnish. Being one of those people whothinks that if one aspirin can cure a headache, then 10 must cure cancer, I decided to just set the pressure regulator on my compressor to 120 PSIandlet 'er rip... Well, let me tell you, after standing there and admiring it, hearing no leaks for about 10 seconds, that's exactly what happened. She"let it rip". That PVC may be rated at 200 psi, but those damn thin plastic screw on sewer caps are definitely NOT! It sounded like a cannon going off. You'd be shocked how long it takes you to realize that the Varnish Versionof Old Faithful isn't going to quit erupting until you turn the air valveoff... I didn't know what to worry more about, the ringing in my ears, the varnish dripping from the ceiling of the garage or the near 2 gallons ofvarnish that was in my hair and beard and all over my clothes. I lookedlike I'd been dipped in honey. Then, my hair was about 18" long and thatnight it was not in it's traditional pony tail and I donned a long red beard (no, it hasn't always been white!), so I stood there looking like a drowned rat, beard and hair stuck together and dripping with about $120 worth ofVarmor R-10! I wasn't so worried about the ceiling, but very worried about the rest of me! I gotta say, you can NEVER done anything to yourself moremiserable than stand naked in the middle of a garage on a piece of plasticdrop cloth pouring mineral spirits through your hair trying to get thevarnish out... Oh, and when you think you have it all out, then you get inthe shower and find that you were NOT even close! Water just makes itworse!!! They don't make enough shampoo to get all of it out. So back out to the drop cloth, butt naked again, while my wife (now ex wife... wonderwhy?) goes to wal mart to get a couple of more gallons of mineral spiritswhile I yell at her from the garage "Hurry the hell up before this s#!tdries!!!"Well, she did get back in time, and me... I smelled like a paint factory beard and hair as the varnish is).I guess, of all the screwups I've pulled off, that was probably the one I've told the least people about... so now you all know my deepest, darkest rodmaking screwup! Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com from TSmithwick@aol.com Sun Mar 31 08:58:39 2002 g2VEwc411897 for ; Sun, 31 Mar 2002 08:58:38 -0600 Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest Hey Nunley, you left out the important part of the story. How did the rod turn out? from flyrod@pop.digisys.net Sun Mar 31 09:21:49 2002 g2VFLm412500 for ; Sun, 31 Mar 2002 09:21:48 - Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest- important addedum Was there ever any doubt who the likely winner would be?Great storyJim Jim Flinchbaughflyrod@digisys.nethttp://www.digisys.net/users/flyrod from lblan@provide.net Sun Mar 31 09:33:44 2002 g2VFXh412841 for ; Sun, 31 Mar 2002 09:33:43 - for ; Sun, 31 Mar 2002 10:33:41 - Subject: RE: Slightly - You can't judge a book by it's cover.... A bit long... I could gladly give up rod making, fly tying, or even fishing if I wereallowed to keep the friends and memories that I have collected along theway. The only thing I would miss would be the lost opportunities the futureholds. The traditional picnic prior the the Grayrock Gathering has been held at theWhispering Pines Campground in years past. The campground was owned byFrankLove, who left us two years ago. Sam Surre was quoted as saying "Frank andIboth loved guiding, it gave us the opportunity to see people at their best".I think this is what we enjoy via the list. We see people at their best (atleast most of the time). This, I believe, makes it very easy to accept eachother when we have the opportunity to meet. Larry Blan -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Sunday, March 31, 2002 8:25 AM Subject: OT:Slightly - You can't judge a book by it's cover.... A bitlong... Gang, I'm sitting here pondering, just before 8 AM, in front of mycomputer. Bob Nunley's April Fools post got me thinking andwondering. Much has been written about the evils of theInternet, and someof what they say is true. But on the other hand, it has a lot of goodgoing for it too. Where else can we meet with those folks, who just likeme, have a passion to do certain things - for us, bamboo fishingrods, thecraft of building them by hand ( even you machinery guys have todo a fairamount of hand work... :^} ). And we accept everybody, seeminglyblindly,because of what we do, or will be doing in the future. We're all a bundle of our own decisions, discriminations (some good, somenot so good ), and personalities. How many of us are willing to acceptsomeone in our lives who is completely different than us as aperson we canshare our past, present and future good, bad and ugly? Our own littlemicrocosm of the world, the rodmakers list, has changed some of myperceptions. I'm ashamed to say, that I'm usually not the personwho wouldgo out and talk to someone who's a bit different than myself. I've metonly a couple of the folks on this list face to face, but Iaccept you guys(and gals if there's any out there ) as friends that I'd share a drop ortwo, fish a bit, tell stories, etc..... And yet, I don't know what youlook like, what your voice sounds like, or how you dress. Bob has been pretty up front about what he is like(and,Bob, I mean nodisrespect about you at all). Bob mentioned in his April Fools post thatat the time of his cannon making, he had long hair, a beard, and from otherposts, I know he enjoys tattoo art and motorcycles. That conjures up avision in my mind of biker gangs. As I mentioned before, I'm ashamed toadmit, I stereotype other folks and put them into nice, neat littlecompartments, of who I'd associate with, and who I wouldn'tassociate with. The anonymity of the Internet, I think, has given us avehicle, to be ableto get rid of some of those things we hold dear - our preconceptions, ourstereotypes, and our valueless discriminations, what we perceive thatperson to be based on what they look like, or what we think theperson maybe based on outward appearances. I don't consciouslydiscriminate againstanyone, but because of the way I grew up, I have my own value systemstamped into my personality. I grew up in German farm country in UpstateNew York, and if you weren't of German ancestry, you weren't part of thefamily. (No, I didn't marry my cousin....) I've been all over the world,in Uncle Sam's Great Fraternal Flying Club, flying some of the mostwonderful winged inventions (Yeah, I'm a fighter puke, flownF-4's, F-16'sand F-15's), and we're a pretty egotistical bunch. Ya have to be, beingthe line of business where you're charged with the country's defense, andyou're on the pointy end of the sword.... But that's anotherstory(ies...) In those days, if you weren't a fighter puke, you were atrash hauler or bomber puke. And we, as a community of fighter pukes,determined that if you weren't in a fighter, you were in a target. Wherewas I going with this? Oh yeah, we discriminated against anybody thatdidn't fit in our nice little box of fighter jocks. Did I missout on theopportunity to make friends with a bunch of guys, who even thoughthey flewsomething we considered lower than our station, were still performing thebest at defending our country? Yep. I guess the point is, we look at someone, and make a valuejudgement basedon what they look like. Fair? No. Does it happen? Yep, a lot. Eventhough I've never met most of you guys in person, I've accepted you asfriends, because of the humor, the sadness, and the fact that youall giveup information freely, with out a thought as to what I, or anyone else onthis list look like. I know a lot of you have gone to the SRG, Grayrock,Catskill, and other gatherings, and met the faces that go with the names,and enjoy each others company. Without this list, or other Internetfacilities, how many of you would associate with the myriad ofpersonalities that are out there? Just goes to show you, there can be a silver lining in the darkclouds. And you really can't judge a book by its cover. I lookforward toputting faces to many of the names at the SRG this year. And Bob, Iwelcome the chance to tip a drop or two with you, share laughs andstories. You guys made my day. Thanks. Mark from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Sun Mar 31 09:59:22 2002 g2VFxL413279 for ; Sun, 31 Mar 2002 09:59:21 - (authenticated) Sun, 31 Mar 2002 07:59:11 -0800 Subject: Re: Happy Easter Tom, You're almost correct. Christmas Eve is busier than today. Got up earlyandwent to the Sunrise Service. Came back to find Mark's wonderful note. Eamon'scleverness sunk in pretty deep for me. Just read Larry's enlighteningcomments, and while I don't think I'd give up making rods for you guys, I wouldmiss you . I don't have much to add, other than to say I hope today is agreat day for all of you, for whatever reasons you choose. Off to check on the Sunday School classes,Harry TSmithwick@aol.com wrote: Let me also add my best wishes. My thanks to Bob and Mark for an upliftingstart to what will be a busy day around here.If anyone had a lingering doubt that Bob Nunley deserves the lifetimeacheivement award...................The man is the Michael Jordan of mishaps.This has got to be the Rev. Boyd's busiest day of the year, so I doubt we'llbe hearing much from him today, but I doubt that even the Rev. could topMark's comments this morning. --Harry Boyd http://www.canerods.com/ Bamboo Rodshttp://www.fbcwin.com/ Our Church from caneman@clnk.com Sun Mar 31 11:42:22 2002 g2VHgL414952 for ; Sun, 31 Mar 2002 11:42:21 -0600 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35) Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest Actually, after building another tube (a bit stronger cap this time) the rodturned out OK. 10 seconds was not enough to impregnate it the first time.Not great, just OK. Impregnating fully with poly taught me two things..poly weighs a lot more than I though it did, and when you impreg a blankfully with poly, even with a good overnight oven baking, it takes severalweeks for the poly to cure to the core. The rod, a 7'6" 4 wt, is theproperty of a cousin of mine who fishes it constantly. I've personallynever seen him catch a fish on it, but then again, he own's several fly rodsand I've never seen him catch a fish on any of them, so that could beoperator error, not the bad luck associated with that rod! Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com- ---- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest Hey Nunley, you left out the important part of the story. How did the rodturn out? from TSmithwick@aol.com Sun Mar 31 12:14:54 2002 g2VIEs415560 for ; Sun, 31 Mar 2002 12:14:54 -0600 Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu In a message dated 3/31/2 5:43:01 PM, caneman@clnk.com writes: Well - I'm glad the story had a happy ending. No Doubt the story will become a list classic. The only way I could think to improve it is if your mother in law's mint condition Mercedes gull wing coupe was parked in the garage from lblove@omniglobal.net Sun Mar 31 12:47:32 2002 g2VIlV416187 for ; Sun, 31 Mar 2002 12:47:31 -0600 0000 (63.71.237.84) ,RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.eduSubject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest g2VIlW416188 or if she walked in on him in the garage on the dropclothrubbing thinner on himself butt naked... In a message dated 3/31/2 5:43:01 PM, caneman@clnk.com writes: turned out OK. >> Well - I'm glad the story had a happy ending. No Doubt the story willbecome a list classic. The only way I could think to improve it is if your motherin law's mint condition Mercedes gull wing coupe was parked in the garage from goodaple@cox-internet.com Sun Mar 31 15:02:14 2002 internet.com [208.180.118.48] (may be forged)) g2VL2D418672 for ; Sun, 31 Mar 2002 15:02:13 -0600 (InterMail vK.4.03.05.00 201-232-132 license180e1de7f543f89455b24e508f9cca39) Subject: VAC/ Impregnation of reelseats. Happy Easter everyone. What a Beautiful day!!! Just wanted to celebrate =a victory of mine. Over the last month I have been slowly acquiring all =the parts for a large impregnation system another list member shared =with me. It holds about 5 gallons. I just gave it a trial run yesterday. =Opened it up after church today and WOW!!!!!!! I now have some =beautiful, fully saturated fillers. I didn't even turn them down any. =Just put about 75 blanks in, fired up the system, and waited =(impatiently) until today to check the results. I even cut some into pcs =to check the saturation. Each one checked was fully saturated! By the =way, I hope the police don't drive by and look into my shop. They will =think that I have fired up a moonshine still! Anyway, Just wanted to =share this with the list and to send a HUGE thank you to the list member =that willingly shared the idea with me. To that person.I have some free =burl going out in the mail to you tomorrow. Thanks again. Randall R. =Gregory NW Arkansas. By the way, I =still have plenty of burl available if anyone has a need for any.(email = Happy Easter everyone. What aBeautiful = have been slowly acquiring all the parts for a large impregnation system = list member shared with me. It holds about 5 gallons. I just gave it a = beautiful, fully saturated fillers. I didn't even turn them down any. = about 75 blanks in, fired up the system, and waited (impatiently) until = check the results. I even cut some into pcs to check the saturation. = and look into my shop. They will think that I have fired up a moonshine = Anyway, Just wanted to share this with the list and to send a HUGE thank = the list member that willingly shared the idea with me. To that person.I = some free burl going out in the mail to you tomorrow. Thanks = from caneman@clnk.com Sun Mar 31 15:42:39 2002 g2VLgc419695 for ; Sun, 31 Mar 2002 15:42:39 -0600 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35) Subject: Re: VAC/ Impregnation of reelseats. Randall,That's great! Glad it didn't blow up on you! LOL shop and caught up until about 2:30 then drove down to broken bow and =caught a few stockers... sucky day really, but at least at Broken Bow = Well, back to the shop... no Easter Egg Hunt for the Bobster... too =much work! Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com Sent: Sunday, March 31, 2002 3:01 PMSubject: VAC/ Impregnation of reelseats. Happy Easter everyone. What a Beautiful day!!! Just wanted to =celebrate a victory of mine. Over the last month I have been slowly =acquiring all the parts for a large impregnation system another list =member shared with me. It holds about 5 gallons. I just gave it a trial =run yesterday. Opened it up after church today and WOW!!!!!!! I now =have some beautiful, fully saturated fillers. I didn't even turn them =down any. Just put about 75 blanks in, fired up the system, and waited =(impatiently) until today to check the results. I even cut some into pcs =to check the saturation. Each one checked was fully saturated! By the =way, I hope the police don't drive by and look into my shop. They will =think that I have fired up a moonshine still! Anyway, Just wanted to =share this with the list and to send a HUGE thank you to the list member =that willingly shared the idea with me. To that person.I have some free =burl going out in the mail to you tomorrow. Thanks again. Randall R. =Gregory NW Arkansas. By the way, I =still have plenty of burl available if anyone has a need for any.(email = Randall, on you! LOL day, just got back in the shop and caught up until about 2:30 then drove = broken bow and caught a few stockers... sucky day really, but at least = Bow they have a stretch that generation doesn't shut down the fishing = Hunt for the Bobster... too much work! Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com ----- Original Message ----- Randall Gregory Sent: Sunday, March 31, 2002 = PM reelseats. Happy Easter everyone. What a = have been slowly acquiring all the parts for a large impregnation = another list member shared with me. It holds about 5 gallons. I just = trial run yesterday. Opened it up after church today and = now have some beautiful, fully saturated fillers. I didn't even turn = (impatiently) until today to check the results. I even cut some into = I hope the police don't drive by and look into my shop. They will = have fired up a moonshine still! Anyway, Just wanted to share this = list and to send a HUGE thank you to the list member that willingly = = the way, I still have plenty of burl available if anyone has a need = from caneman@clnk.com Sun Mar 31 15:48:13 2002 g2VLmC420081 for ; Sun, 31 Mar 2002 15:48:12 -0600 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35) Sun, 31 Mar 2002 15:45:46 -0600 Subject: Re: VAC/ Impregnation of reelseats. Sorry guys, didn't mean to put the suck ass fishing trip on the list... =my reply and reply to all buttons are side by side and I mis-hit.R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com Sent: Sunday, March 31, 2002 3:43 PMSubject: Re: VAC/ Impregnation of reelseats. Randall,That's great! Glad it didn't blow up on you! LOL the shop and caught up until about 2:30 then drove down to broken bow =and caught a few stockers... sucky day really, but at least at Broken =Bow they have a stretch that generation doesn't shut down the fishing = Well, back to the shop... no Easter Egg Hunt for the Bobster... =too much work! Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com Sent: Sunday, March 31, 2002 3:01 PMSubject: VAC/ Impregnation of reelseats. Happy Easter everyone. What a Beautiful day!!! Just wanted to =celebrate a victory of mine. Over the last month I have been slowly =acquiring all the parts for a large impregnation system another list =member shared with me. It holds about 5 gallons. I just gave it a trial =run yesterday. Opened it up after church today and WOW!!!!!!! I now =have some beautiful, fully saturated fillers. I didn't even turn them =down any. Just put about 75 blanks in, fired up the system, and waited =(impatiently) until today to check the results. I even cut some into pcs =to check the saturation. Each one checked was fully saturated! By the =way, I hope the police don't drive by and look into my shop. They will =think that I have fired up a moonshine still! Anyway, Just wanted to =share this with the list and to send a HUGE thank you to the list member =that willingly shared the idea with me. To that person.I have some free =burl going out in the mail to you tomorrow. Thanks again. Randall R. =Gregory NW Arkansas. By the way, I =still have plenty of burl available if anyone has a need for any.(email = Sorry guys, didn't mean to put the suck ass fishing = mis-hit.R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com ----- Original Message ----- Bob =Nunley internet.com = 'akers Sent: Sunday, March 31, 2002 = PMSubject: Re: VAC/ Impregnation = reelseats. Randall, up on you! LOL day, just got back in the shop and caught up until about 2:30 then = to broken bow and caught a few stockers... sucky day really, but at = Broken Bow they have a stretch that generation doesn't shut down the = Hunt for the Bobster... too much work! Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com ----- Original Message ----- Randall Gregory Sent: Sunday, March 31, 2002 = PMSubject: VAC/ Impregnation of = reelseats. Happy Easter everyone. What a = I have been slowly acquiring all the parts for a large impregnation = another list member shared with me. It holds about 5 gallons. I just = a trial run yesterday. Opened it up after church today and = I now have some beautiful, fully saturated fillers. I didn't even = down any. Just put about 75 blanks in, fired up the system, and = (impatiently) until today to check the results. I even cut some into = way, I hope the police don't drive by and look into my shop. They = that I have fired up a moonshine still! Anyway, Just wanted to share = with the list and to send a HUGE thank you to the list member that = shared the idea with me. To that person.I have some free burl going = = the way, I still have plenty of burl available if anyone has a need = any.(email = from bdcbfr@chartermi.net Sun Mar 31 16:38:10 2002 g2VMc9421063 for ; Sun, 31 Mar 2002 16:38:09 -0600 Subject: sucky fishing and round ball. Bob, have been wrong through the whole tournament!! GO BIG RED! Brian Sent: Sunday, March 31, 2002 4:49 PMSubject: Re: VAC/ Impregnation of reelseats. Sorry guys, didn't mean to put the suck ass fishing trip on the =list... my reply and reply to all buttons are side by side and I =mis-hit.R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com Sent: Sunday, March 31, 2002 3:43 PMSubject: Re: VAC/ Impregnation of reelseats. Randall,That's great! Glad it didn't blow up on you! LOL the shop and caught up until about 2:30 then drove down to broken bow =and caught a few stockers... sucky day really, but at least at Broken =Bow they have a stretch that generation doesn't shut down the fishing = Well, back to the shop... no Easter Egg Hunt for the Bobster... =too much work! Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com Sent: Sunday, March 31, 2002 3:01 PMSubject: VAC/ Impregnation of reelseats. Happy Easter everyone. What a Beautiful day!!! Just wanted to =celebrate a victory of mine. Over the last month I have been slowly =acquiring all the parts for a large impregnation system another list =member shared with me. It holds about 5 gallons. I just gave it a trial =run yesterday. Opened it up after church today and WOW!!!!!!! I now =have some beautiful, fully saturated fillers. I didn't even turn them =down any. Just put about 75 blanks in, fired up the system, and waited =(impatiently) until today to check the results. I even cut some into pcs =to check the saturation. Each one checked was fully saturated! By the =way, I hope the police don't drive by and look into my shop. They will =think that I have fired up a moonshine still! Anyway, Just wanted to =share this with the list and to send a HUGE thank you to the list member =that willingly shared the idea with me. To that person.I have some free =burl going out in the mail to you tomorrow. Thanks again. Randall R. =Gregory NW Arkansas. By the way, I =still have plenty of burl available if anyone has a need for any.(email = Bob, Well, glad to know I'm not the only one = RED! Brian ----- Original Message ----- Bob =Nunley Sent: Sunday, March 31, 2002 = PMSubject: Re: VAC/ Impregnation = reelseats. Sorry guys, didn't mean to put the suck ass = mis-hit.R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com ----- Original Message ----- Bob = internet.com = 'akers Sent: Sunday, March 31, 2002 = PMSubject: Re: VAC/ = reelseats. Randall, up on you! LOL other day, just got back in the shop and caught up until about 2:30 = drove down to broken bow and caught a few stockers... sucky day = at least at Broken Bow they have a stretch that generation doesn't = Hunt for the Bobster... too much work! Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com ----- Original Message ----- = Randall Gregory = Sent: Sunday, March 31, = PMSubject: VAC/ Impregnation = reelseats. Happy Easter everyone. What a = month I have been slowly acquiring all the parts for a large = system another list member shared with me. It holds about 5 = just gave it a trial run yesterday. Opened it up after church = didn't even turn them down any. Just put about 75 blanks in, fired = system, and waited (impatiently) until today to check the results. = cut some into pcs to check the saturation. Each one checked was = into my shop. They will think that I have fired up a moonshine = Anyway, Just wanted to share this with the list and to send a HUGE = you to the list member that willingly shared the idea with me. To = person.I have some free burl going out in the mail to you = = the way, I still have plenty of burl available if anyone has a = from jojo@ipa.net Sun Mar 31 16:48:50 2002 g2VMmo421468 for ; Sun, 31 Mar 2002 16:48:50 -0600 helo=default) id 16ro7w-00056G-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Sun, 31 Mar 2002 17:48:45 -0500 Subject: Re: VAC/ Impregnation of reelseats. Randall, In Arkansas, running a 'shine still would be the least of your worries. =In today's anti-drug crazed society you better hope none of the =neighbors think you're running a meth lab. For those of you who don't =know, Arkansas has a rather large and growing meth lab population. =Wonder why? M-D Happy Easter everyone. What a Beautiful day!!! Just wanted to =celebrate a victory of mine. Over the last month I have been slowly =acquiring all the parts for a large impregnation system another list =member shared with me. It holds about 5 gallons. I just gave it a trial =run yesterday. Opened it up after church today and WOW!!!!!!! I now =have some beautiful, fully saturated fillers. I didn't even turn them =down any. Just put about 75 blanks in, fired up the system, and waited =(impatiently) until today to check the results. I even cut some into pcs =to check the saturation. Each one checked was fully saturated! By the =way, I hope the police don't drive by and look into my shop. They will =think that I have fired up a moonshine still! Anyway, Just wanted to =share this with the list and to send a HUGE thank you to the list member =that willingly shared the idea with me. To that person.I have some free =burl going out in the mail to you tomorrow. Thanks again. Randall R. =Gregory NW Arkansas. By the way, I =still have plenty of burl available if anyone has a need for any.(email = Randall, In Arkansas, running a= would be the least of your worries. In today's anti-drug crazed society = better hope none of the neighbors think you're running a meth lab. For = you who don't know, Arkansas has a rather large and growing meth lab = Wonder why? M-D Randall Gregory Happy Easter everyone. What a = have been slowly acquiring all the parts for a large impregnation = another list member shared with me. It holds about 5 gallons. I just = trial run yesterday. Opened it up after church today and = now have some beautiful, fully saturated fillers. I didn't even turn = (impatiently) until today to check the results. I even cut some into = I hope the police don't drive by and look into my shop. They will = have fired up a moonshine still! Anyway, Just wanted to share this = list and to send a HUGE thank you to the list member that willingly = = the way, I still have plenty of burl available if anyone has a need = from jojo@ipa.net Sun Mar 31 16:57:09 2002 g2VMv8421842 for ; Sun, 31 Mar 2002 16:57:08 -0600 helo=default) for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Sun, 31 Mar 2002 17:57:08 -0500 Subject: T&T Commemorative Bamboo Rod Maulucci posted the link aweek, or so ago, got up to a high bid of $3,550.50, and still the reserve wasnot met. M-D from caneman@clnk.com Sun Mar 31 17:16:24 2002 g2VNGN422746 for ; Sun, 31 Mar 2002 17:16:23 -0600 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35) Subject: Re: VAC/ Impregnation of reelseats. Yeah, Think about it... In Oklahoma, to charge you with running a =Methamphetimine lab, LEGALLY, you only have to have two of the =components to cook methamphetimine... hmmmm... Lets look a a rod shop...=Most of us have acetone, a very important ingredient, Those who use drip =tubes have rubber hose, also necessary according to the Oklahoma State =Bureau of investigation... Alcohol (I think all of us have that in one =form or another), ephidrine or psuedoephidrine (also a must if you run a =Dickerson type mill... it's about the only thing that will clear your =sinuses after making so much dust) Plumbers acid, which I MUST keep =because my damn hair falling out clogs up the shower drain about twice a =month... Hey, almost any of us could be mistaken by Law Enforcement for =drug manufacturers/users... of course, it has been said that we must be =on drugs to enjoy doing this kind of work! *S* Work is done (not really but hit a good stopping point), so I'm going to =Mom's so she won't have her feelings hurt... Everyone else showed up =there on Easter except me. I never could find those damn eggs, anyways, =and at 285 pounds, I look kinda funny carrying a straw basket with fake = Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com Sent: Sunday, March 31, 2002 4:47 PMSubject: Re: VAC/ Impregnation of reelseats. Randall, In Arkansas, running a 'shine still would be the least of your =worries. In today's anti-drug crazed society you better hope none of the =neighbors think you're running a meth lab. For those of you who don't =know, Arkansas has a rather large and growing meth lab population. =Wonder why? M-D Happy Easter everyone. What a Beautiful day!!! Just wanted to =celebrate a victory of mine. Over the last month I have been slowly =acquiring all the parts for a large impregnation system another list =member shared with me. It holds about 5 gallons. I just gave it a trial =run yesterday. Opened it up after church today and WOW!!!!!!! I now =have some beautiful, fully saturated fillers. I didn't even turn them =down any. Just put about 75 blanks in, fired up the system, and waited =(impatiently) until today to check the results. I even cut some into pcs =to check the saturation. Each one checked was fully saturated! By the =way, I hope the police don't drive by and look into my shop. They will =think that I have fired up a moonshine still! Anyway, Just wanted to =share this with the list and to send a HUGE thank you to the list member =that willingly shared the idea with me. To that person.I have some free =burl going out in the mail to you tomorrow. Thanks again. Randall R. =Gregory NW Arkansas. By the way, I =still have plenty of burl available if anyone has a need for any.(email = Yeah, Think about it... In Oklahoma, to charge you = components to cook methamphetimine... hmmmm... Lets look a a rod shop...= us have acetone, a very important ingredient, Those who use drip tubes = Dickerson type mill... it's about the only thing that will clear your = = hair falling out clogs up the shower drain about twice a month... Hey, = manufacturers/users... of course, it has been said that we must be on = enjoy doing this kind of work! *S* Work is done (not really but hit a good stopping = I'm going to Mom's so she won't have her feelings hurt... Everyone else = and at 285 pounds, I look kinda funny carrying a straw basket with fake = it! Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com ----- Original Message ----- Jojo =DeLancier group Sent: Sunday, March 31, 2002 = PMSubject: Re: VAC/ Impregnation = reelseats. Randall, In Arkansas, running a= would be the least of your worries. In today's anti-drug crazed = better hope none of the neighbors think you're running a meth lab. For = of you who don't know, Arkansas has a rather large and growing meth = population. Wonder why? M-D Randall Gregory Happy Easter everyone. What a = I have been slowly acquiring all the parts for a large impregnation = another list member shared with me. It holds about 5 gallons. I just = a trial run yesterday. Opened it up after church today and = I now have some beautiful, fully saturated fillers. I didn't even = down any. Just put about 75 blanks in, fired up the system, and = (impatiently) until today to check the results. I even cut some into = way, I hope the police don't drive by and look into my shop. They = that I have fired up a moonshine still! Anyway, Just wanted to share = with the list and to send a HUGE thank you to the list member that = shared the idea with me. To that person.I have some free burl going = = the way, I still have plenty of burl available if anyone has a need = any.(email = from goodaple@cox-internet.com Sun Mar 31 18:23:15 2002 internet.com [208.180.118.48] (may be forged)) g310NE424213 for ; Sun, 31 Mar 2002 18:23:14 -0600 (InterMail vK.4.03.05.00 201-232-132 license180e1de7f543f89455b24e508f9cca39) Subject: Re: VAC/ Impregnation of reelseats. MD, You're probably right. I probably cleared the sinuses of everyone in =the area from all the acetone fumes.! Randall G. Sent: Sunday, March 31, 2002 4:47 PMSubject: Re: VAC/ Impregnation of reelseats. Randall, In Arkansas, running a 'shine still would be the least of your =worries. In today's anti-drug crazed society you better hope none of the =neighbors think you're running a meth lab. For those of you who don't =know, Arkansas has a rather large and growing meth lab population. =Wonder why? M-D Happy Easter everyone. What a Beautiful day!!! Just wanted to =celebrate a victory of mine. Over the last month I have been slowly =acquiring all the parts for a large impregnation system another list =member shared with me. It holds about 5 gallons. I just gave it a trial =run yesterday. Opened it up after church today and WOW!!!!!!! I now =have some beautiful, fully saturated fillers. I didn't even turn them =down any. Just put about 75 blanks in, fired up the system, and waited =(impatiently) until today to check the results. I even cut some into pcs =to check the saturation. Each one checked was fully saturated! By the =way, I hope the police don't drive by and look into my shop. They will =think that I have fired up a moonshine still! Anyway, Just wanted to =share this with the list and to send a HUGE thank you to the list member =that willingly shared the idea with me. To that person.I have some free =burl going out in the mail to you tomorrow. Thanks again. Randall R. =Gregory NW Arkansas. By the way, I =still have plenty of burl available if anyone has a need for any.(email = MD, You're probably right. I probably = G. ----- Original Message ----- Jojo =DeLancier group Sent: Sunday, March 31, 2002 = PMSubject: Re: VAC/ Impregnation = reelseats. Randall, In Arkansas, running a= would be the least of your worries. In today's anti-drug crazed = better hope none of the neighbors think you're running a meth lab. For = of you who don't know, Arkansas has a rather large and growing meth = population. Wonder why? M-D Randall Gregory Happy Easter everyone. What a = I have been slowly acquiring all the parts for a large impregnation = another list member shared with me. It holds about 5 gallons. I just = a trial run yesterday. Opened it up after church today and = I now have some beautiful, fully saturated fillers. I didn't even = down any. Just put about 75 blanks in, fired up the system, and = (impatiently) until today to check the results. I even cut some into = way, I hope the police don't drive by and look into my shop. They = that I have fired up a moonshine still! Anyway, Just wanted to share = with the list and to send a HUGE thank you to the list member that = shared the idea with me. To that person.I have some free burl going = = the way, I still have plenty of burl available if anyone has a need = any.(email = from bamboorules@ns.sympatico.ca Sun Mar 31 19:17:17 2002 g311HC425275 for ; Sun, 31 Mar 2002 19:17:12 -0600 Organization: New Scotland Fly Rods Subject: Sadly, leaving the list :^( All,the time has come for me to un subscribe, I am leaving tomorrow while away although I will try to at least drop you a line from time totime.I'm truly going through withdrawals and even thought of leaving thelist running so I could come back and wade through 3 months of what hasbecome one of my favorite diversions! Don't know if my ISP would allowit though??I wish you all a happy Easter, good rod building and health. Hopeto see some of you in the near future (Toronto show and if I can maybeeven at Grayling??) Tight (Glue) Lines, Shawn Pineo from rextutor@yahoo.com Sun Mar 31 19:25:34 2002 g311PX425663 for ; Sun, 31 Mar 2002 19:25:33 -0600 31 Mar 2002 17:25:29 PST Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest JeffHere's my account - on my fishermans heart it is alltrue I was doing a demo of bamboo rods at my local flyshop . I always go through the myths of bamboo. Thereare heavy , easily broken etc. There was a 'difficlut' person in the audience who was sure that bamboo flyrods were fragile and heavy and was adding hissarcastic comments every time I paused to draw abreath. I was recommending that if snagged you pull line notyank your rod , no matter what type of rod. He began to speak over me telling all that his Sage(SPL 383 I discovered later ) would not break underthose conditions but any bamboo fly rod I selectedwould break at the tip or ferrule. He didn't stopthere but began to challenge me and I was on the hotspot. I tried to get out of it saying I wouldn't wantto take responsibility for breaking his sage. He saidhe would not be upset because he was sure it wouldn'tbreak. He demanded the test. I had a Montague Flash ( 12ounce pool cue) and a lighter rod I have since soldand forget but lets say it was a Granger.He went first in the test - had a reel on his Sageand had me stand on the tippet. He gave it a goodhonest yank and not much happened. The he handed methe reel , I strung it up on the Montague and he stoodon the tippet and I gave it a good yank or two. Again not much happened except I began to suspect thisguy was on drugs and not the good, happy drugs I haveseen back in the sixties. He was red faced andranting. I was about to ask the guy at the shop ,Mike, to end the demo because this was not going toend pleasantly. I get the reel off and while holding the rod straightup in the air I am handing the guy his reel , whenthis guy decides to take a swing at the bamboo rodwith his plastic rod. It was a target up in the airand this was one of those guys who just can't bewrong. I can only guess he hit the 2nd ferrule as he didn'thit the butt section (.48 inches) but the resultswould have probably been the same. He broke the plastic rod that he was so sure wasstronger than the bamboo. Mike had already seen thelook on his face, knew this guy at least byreputation and hustled him out of there. The group wassure the drug crazed angry guy was a shill as Iremember the demo ended too soon , after the incidentand no one stayed to ask questions and seekrestoration services. Happy April 1 --- Jeff Schaeffer wrote: The list has been entirely too serious of late, andto remedy that I am hosting the first annual AprilFool's Day contest. Mark Twain once described April1 as "that day that reminds us of what we really arethe other 364", and in that spirit, here are therules: Post to the list your best/worst rodmaking failure,screw-up, mistake, or rod-related shopincident/accident. 1. It has to be true.2. It must have occurred during rodmaking, orpreparation of tools and materials for rodmaking.2. No "how I burned up the rod in the oven" stories.These are too ubiquitous, and bandwidth wouldsuffer. Unless something else caught fire.3. No fingers chopped off by the table saw stories.These are too tragic to be funny in any respect.4. All posts must be made on or before April 1.Posts after midnight on April 1 are ineligible,though they might be amusing. Your post will be scored for: 1) originality of themistake, 2) dumbness given your years of experience,3) story quality (how you tell the tale), and 4)consequences to your reputation as a masterrodmaker. The winner will receive a handmade nickel silver capand ring style reel seat with a walnut filler. As judge and host, I can not win, but here is one ofmy many potential contributions: A renowned rodmaker shared one of his personaltapers with me via email. I planed out the buttsection, but when it came time for the tips I couldnot get the forms closed far enough. I spent anentire evening opening and closing the forms tryingto duplicate his tip dimensions. Try as I might, thetip side of my forms was too coarse to produce tipswith those ultra-fine dimensions. This went on andon. I became convinced that my forms were overcut,and about twice as deep as they should be whenclosed. I took the forms apart to check for debris,and checked the depth at every station. Everythingwas right on. Glancing up at the taper sheet, Irealized that the tip diameter of 0.33 seemed odd,and I checked my taper libary and the list archive.Almost all tips were about 0.70 or larger, and onlya few were slightly smaller. It was then I realizedthat the taper I had received from him had stripdimensions (1/2 rod diameter) and not rod diameter.I had divided the strip dimensions in half, and hadspent three evenings planing away on strips thatwere smaller than any taper in the history ofrodmaking. I tried making the section into fly tyingbodkins, but it was too fine for even that. And ofcourse it was one of my best culms. Jeff Schaeffer __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Greetings - send holiday greetings for Easter, Passoverhttp://greetings.yahoo.com/ from goodaple@cox-internet.com Sun Mar 31 19:32:44 2002 g311Wi425994 for ; Sun, 31 Mar 2002 19:32:44 -0600 (InterMail vK.4.03.05.03 201-232-132-103 license180e1de7f543f89455b24e508f9cca39) Subject: Re: Sadly, leaving the list :^( Good Luck Shawn.Hope to see you here in a short while. We'll miss you.Randall R. Gregory NW Arkansas----- Original Message ----- Subject: Sadly, leaving the list :^( All,the time has come for me to un subscribe, I am leaving tomorrow while away although I will try to at least drop you a line from time totime.I'm truly going through withdrawals and even thought of leaving thelist running so I could come back and wade through 3 months of what hasbecome one of my favorite diversions! Don't know if my ISP would allowit though??I wish you all a happy Easter, good rod building and health. Hopeto see some of you in the near future (Toronto show and if I can maybeeven at Grayling??) Tight (Glue) Lines, Shawn Pineo from Grhghlndr@aol.com Sun Mar 31 19:37:49 2002 g311bn426351 for ; Sun, 31 Mar 2002 19:37:49 -0600 Subject: Re: sucky fishing and round ball. YEH GO IU!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I am not a basketball fan but you have to hand it to the guys down there. The herrying Hoosiers!!!!!!!! http://bretsovens.bravepages.com/ YEH GO http://bretsovens.bravepages.com/ from richjez@enteract.com Sun Mar 31 21:16:20 2002 g313GJ428649 for ; Sun, 31 Mar 2002 21:16:20 -0600 "rodmakers@mail.wustl.edu" Subject: Re: Sadly, leaving the list :^( Too bad you have to leave. Do try to make itt to Grayrock. If crossing the border worries you, there are expertise in crossing the border. Just ask Reed or Tony for help. Good luckRich Jezioro At 08:20 PM 3/31/2002, Shawn Pineo wrote: All,the time has come for me to un subscribe, I am leaving tomorrow while away although I will try to at least drop you a line from time totime.I'm truly going through withdrawals and even thought of leaving thelist running so I could come back and wade through 3 months of what hasbecome one of my favorite diversions! Don't know if my ISP would allowit though??I wish you all a happy Easter, good rod building and health. Hopeto see some of you in the near future (Toronto show and if I can maybeeven at Grayling??) Tight (Glue) Lines, Shawn Pineo from flyrod@pop.digisys.net Sun Mar 31 22:06:19 2002 g3146I429777 for ; Sun, 31 Mar 2002 22:06:18 - g3146Dk26169; Subject: Re: VAC/ Impregnation of reelseats./Easter Eggs Well, back to the shop... no Easter Egg Hunt for theBobster... too much work! Later,Bob oooh man, could you imagine what would happen if the Rodent tried to color easter eggs? How many PSi to impregnate eggs Bob?Sorry, couldnt resist [:-)] Jim Jim Flinchbaughflyrod@digisys.nethttp://www.digisys.net/users/flyrod