from avyoung@iinet.net.au Mon Apr 1 02:14:41 2002 g318Ed408330 for ; Mon, 1 Apr 2002 02:14:39 -0600 Subject: Re: Sv: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest g318Ef408332 I didn't treat mine with the same dignity that's for sure. TY At 10:47 AM 3/31/02 +0200, Carsten Jorgensen wrote: A.J. & Tony You are not alone in this one. I did the same. The discarded butt piece incl. of handle etc.Has now been mounted in a frame and hung on the wall in my office - a now cherishedconversation piece. regards, Carsten Jorgensen ----- Original Message -----From: Allen Thramer Sent: Sunday, March 31, 2002 10:22 AMSubject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest I had the sleeve of my shirt get caught in grip when i was turning a gripand it twisted the butt right off the rest of the rod. Talk aboutdumbfounded silence followed by anything BUT silence!A.J. From: Tony Young Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day ContestDate: Sat, 30 Mar 2002 23:06:51 +0800 I had the butt section chucked up in the lathe with the cork handlepokingout on the opposite side of the bed.Started to sand the handle with a length of sand paper held between mytwohands and sneezed. The sandpaper jambed when I didn't let go fastenoughand the rod became what I'd best call a bird cage when the splines delaminated. Tony /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from avyoung@iinet.net.au Mon Apr 1 02:14:43 2002 g318Ef408333 for ; Mon, 1 Apr 2002 02:14:42 -0600 RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest Soo easy to do. One night sitting up keen as mustard to finish my first real programing job in C.It's DOS 4 so no return from accidental file deletions.After almost a week of work late on the night before I was to give the finished prog to the person I'm tidying up the edges and compiling and deleting files more or less in a kind of rhythm then in that stupor that you (I do any how) get when you've done the same thing a hundred times I deleted *.CWhy? Who knows. I sat there with a look like I was hit in he face with a 4 x 2.No the puner wasn't entirely happy with the program which normally wouldn't have been a problem but this time it was.Was there a happy end, no. It wasn't as bad as using a bad batch of epoxy on nodeless rods but it was certainly a good introduction to the problems you can encounter when you're not working on a wage. Tony At 08:38 AM 3/31/02 +0000, Allen Thramer wrote: Oh! That kind of disaster is what you are looking for. Too many to go through. If you can assume that you have some sort of misadventure every 10th rod or so then it goes to the law of averages that they have caught up with me a few times.... I was making a matched pair of 7 1/2 ft 4wt rods for an executives two sons. He was driving down from Portland International to pick up the rods on the way to guided trip to the Deschutes. He called first to see if they were ready and they were. BUT I had not put them into their bags and cut the tubes for them, no big deal right? I noticed the the bags seemed a bit overlength, oh well sometimes the bag dimensions change a 1/2 inch, let me dig through the 7 1/2ft 2/2 bag pile. Hmmmm, looking kind of strange, all the bags were the right length. Well, if the bags are the right length then , OH NO! YOU HAVE TO BE KIDDING! Absolutely correct guys! I had cut the blanks off an inch short in some kind of late night fog and had built a matched set of 7' 4" rods! All ended well though as the boys loved the unusual but easier to handle slightly short rods. As a matter of fact they felt so nice I have even made a few more of them on purpose.A.J. /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from avyoung@iinet.net.au Mon Apr 1 02:14:49 2002 g318El408340 for ; Mon, 1 Apr 2002 02:14:48 -0600 Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest Bob,you are doing yourself such a dis service if you don't get a copy of Backyard Ballistics by William Gurstelle.I haven't read it but apparently it shows how to make a serious potato cannon (note, not gun) rockets and a mortar that shoots tennis balls and a few other reasonably harmless things.Best of all though is the carbide cannon. This doesn't actually shoot anything except air but what a blast it makes. I've heard one of these in action and believe me you and most of all your neighbors need one.All these are made from PVC pipe which you seem pretty keen on.No need to thank me but do keep us up to date with what happens [;-)] Tony Varmor R-10! I wasn't so worried about the ceiling, but very worried aboutthe rest of me! I gotta say, you can NEVER done anything to yourself moremiserable than stand naked in the middle of a garage on a piece of plasticdrop cloth pouring mineral spirits through your hair trying to get thevarnish out... Oh, and when you think you have it all out, then you get inthe shower and find that you were NOT even close! Water just makes itworse!!! They don't make enough shampoo to get all of it out. So back outto the drop cloth, butt naked again, while my wife (now ex wife... wonderwhy?) goes to wal mart to get a couple of more gallons of mineral spiritswhile I yell at her from the garage "Hurry the hell up before this s#!tdries!!!" /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from avyoung@iinet.net.au Mon Apr 1 02:16:22 2002 g318GK408845 for ; Mon, 1 Apr 2002 02:16:20 -0600 "rodmakers@mail.wustl.edu" Subject: Re: Sadly, leaving the list :^( Either don't confess to being an Aussie, EVER or make sure you have a crazed Irianian with you to take the heat. Tony At 09:13 PM 3/30/02 -0600, Rich Jezioro wrote: Too bad you have to leave. Do try to make itt to Grayrock. If crossing the border worries you, there are expertise in crossing the border. Just ask Reed or Tony for help. Good luckRich Jezioro At 08:20 PM 3/31/2002, Shawn Pineo wrote: All,the time has come for me to un subscribe, I am leaving tomorrow while away although I will try to at least drop you a line from time totime.I'm truly going through withdrawals and even thought of leaving thelist running so I could come back and wade through 3 months of what hasbecome one of my favorite diversions! Don't know if my ISP would allowit though??I wish you all a happy Easter, good rod building and health. Hopeto see some of you in the near future (Toronto show and if I can maybeeven at Grayling??) Tight (Glue) Lines, Shawn Pineo /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from avyoung@iinet.net.au Mon Apr 1 02:30:05 2002 g318U4409473 for ; Mon, 1 Apr 2002 02:30:04 -0600 RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest Hey Shawn, cross the border with this guy but make sure the guys with badges know you only picked him up a mile or so back. A demonstrateable lunatic is MUCH better than taking an Aussie with you on a border crossing. Tony At 05:25 PM 3/31/02 -0800, Rex Tutor wrote: JeffHere's my account - on my fishermans heart it is alltrueI was doing a demo of bamboo rods at my local flyshop . I always go through the myths of bamboo. Thereare heavy , easily broken etc. There was a 'difficlut' person in the audience who was sure that bamboo flyrods were fragile and heavy and was adding hissarcastic comments every time I paused to draw abreath.I was recommending that if snagged you pull line notyank your rod , no matter what type of rod.He began to speak over me telling all that his Sage(SPL 383 I discovered later ) would not break underthose conditions but any bamboo fly rod I selectedwould break at the tip or ferrule. He didn't stopthere but began to challenge me and I was on the hotspot. I tried to get out of it saying I wouldn't wantto take responsibility for breaking his sage. He saidhe would not be upset because he was sure it wouldn'tbreak.He demanded the test. I had a Montague Flash ( 12ounce pool cue) and a lighter rod I have since soldand forget but lets say it was a Granger.He went first in the test - had a reel on his Sageand had me stand on the tippet. He gave it a goodhonest yank and not much happened. The he handed methe reel , I strung it up on the Montague and he stoodon the tippet and I gave it a good yank or two.Again not much happened except I began to suspect thisguy was on drugs and not the good, happy drugs I haveseen back in the sixties. He was red faced andranting. I was about to ask the guy at the shop ,Mike, to end the demo because this was not going toend pleasantly.I get the reel off and while holding the rod straightup in the air I am handing the guy his reel , whenthis guy decides to take a swing at the bamboo rodwith his plastic rod. It was a target up in the airand this was one of those guys who just can't bewrong.I can only guess he hit the 2nd ferrule as he didn'thit the butt section (.48 inches) but the resultswould have probably been the same.He broke the plastic rod that he was so sure wasstronger than the bamboo. Mike had already seen thelook on his face, knew this guy at least byreputation and hustled him out of there. The group wassure the drug crazed angry guy was a shill as Iremember the demo ended too soon , after the incidentand no one stayed to ask questions and seekrestoration services.Happy April 1 /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from Lazybee45@aol.com Mon Apr 1 03:44:25 2002 g319iO410443 for ; Mon, 1 Apr 2002 03:44:25 -0600 Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest In a message dated 4/1/02 2:16:06 AM Central Standard Time, avyoung@iinet.net.au writes: Well, I saw a "hairspray cannon" shoot a tennis ball OOS once. It fires a potato(e) a "really long way" and there is always the "Punkin chunkin' " contest each November somewhere out east a ways where they try to shoota round orange gourd as far as they can using junkyard stuff. The record is now over 1/2 mile. I really NEEED to make a carbide cannon too. high school days, using coffee and soup cans. I won't even tell you how that turned out except that the result was a preview of the hairstyle that I have now worn for lo these many years, minus the eyebrows! mark visit Wood Art Custom Designs http://woodartcustom.freeservers.com or http://hometown.aol.com/lazybee45/myhomepage/business.html Hand crafted items made to order! from wendt@kingcrab.nrl.navy.mil Mon Apr 1 05:51:41 2002 g31Bpe411808 for ; Mon, 1 Apr 2002 05:51:40 -0600 g31BpZdd017121 for ; Mon, 1 Apr 2002 06:51:35 -0500 Subject: Re: sucky fishing and round ball. Brian, Grad, Mark At 05:38 PM 3/31/2002 -0500, you wrote:Bob, Well, glad to know I'm not the only one notcatching fish. lov=ethe way the 'experts' have been wrong through the whole Brian Sent: Sunday, March 31, 2002 4:49 PMSubject: Re: VAC/ Impregnation of reelseats. Sorry guys, didn't mean to put the suck ass fishing trip on thelist... my reply and reply to all buttons are side by side and Imis-hit.R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com goodaple@cox-internet.com ;= Sent: Sunday, March 31, 2002 3:43 PMSubject: Re: VAC/ Impregnation of reelseats. Randall, LOL got back in the shop and caught up until about 2:30 then drove down to=broken bow and caught a few stockers... sucky day really, but at least at=Broken Bow they have a stretch that generation doesn't shut down the= the=Bobster... too much work! Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com From: Randall= Sent: Sunday, March 31, 2002 3:01 PMSubject: VAC/ Impregnation of reelseats. Happy Easter everyone. What a Beautiful day!!! Just wanted tocelebrate=a victory of mine. Over the last month I have been slowly acquiring all the=parts for a large impregnation system another list member shared withme.=It holds about 5 gallons. I just gave it a trial run yesterday. Opened it= saturated fillers. I didn't even turn them down any. Just put about 75=blanks in, fired up the system, and waited (impatiently) until today to=check the results. I even cut some into pcs to check the saturation. Each= drive by and look into my shop. They will think that I have fired up a=moonshine still! Anyway, Just wanted to share this with the list and to=send a HUGE thank you to the list member that willingly shared the idea=with me. To that person.I have some free burl going out in the mail to you= way, I=still have plenty of burl available if anyone has a need for any.(email=offlist) from wendt@kingcrab.nrl.navy.mil Mon Apr 1 06:23:37 2002 g31CNa412436 for ; Mon, 1 Apr 2002 06:23:36 -0600 g31CNVdd017777 for ; Mon, 1 Apr 2002 07:23:31 -0500 Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest At 04:44 AM 4/1/2002 -0500, you wrote: Well, I saw a "hairspray cannon" shoot a tennis ball OOS once. It fires apotato(e) a "really long way" and there is always the "Punkin chunkin' "contest each November somewhere out east a ways where they try toshoot around orange gourd as far as they can using junkyard stuff. The record isnow over 1/2 mile. I really NEEED to make a carbide cannon too. Yeah, Mark, they do that here on the Eastern Shore of Maryland. Quite a fun day, too. They get the local vendors out, including some of the local microbrewers, and make a fun day out of it. This past year, we had the Wild Goose Brewery come out and set up a tent, and if you haven't had one of their beers, they are really pretty good. They make an excellent pale ale, and for hop heads like meself, it has a verrrry good little bite of hops to it. In the winter, they make a seasonal brew called Snow Goose. Nice rich, dark, full bodied ale, with a "delightful" hoppy aroma and taste. Quite good! Oh yeah, the punkin' tossing contest is a blast to watch, in between brews..... I don't know why, maybe it's just the sight of huge orange gourds flying a couple hundred feet in the air, with a very satisfying "splootch" at the end, but I just crack up when I watch it. Wish I had one of those guns when I was a kid, for the fall veggie wars in the neighborhood. Can you imagine a rotten punkin', launched about a hundred feet or so, landing in the neighbor kid's fort! Incoming!!!!!!!! high school days, using coffee and soup cans. I won't even tell you how thatturned out except that the result was a preview of the hairstyle that I havenow worn for lo these many years, minus the eyebrows! We used to do that too! Was a lot of fun! What works even better, is to use butane, since it's heavier than air. When you launch it at night, you get about a ten foot flame.... mark The other Mark from avyoung@iinet.net.au Mon Apr 1 08:32:53 2002 g31EWq415976 for ; Mon, 1 Apr 2002 08:32:52 -0600 Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest All this stuff really does sound like required gear to own and that carbide cannon I heard go off was amazing in that way military explosions seem much louder than they seem to require to be sort of compared to mining explosions (intended ones anyhow). I was standing between it and a brick wall when it went off and it was like the feeling sonic boom gives that you feel within you. The bounce back from the wall didn't help, well yes it did actually. It was great window rattling fun. I know I want a cannon that can fire a gourd 1/2 mile.You've got to get this book Bob. Tony At 04:44 AM 4/1/02 -0500, Lazybee45@aol.com wrote: In a message dated 4/1/02 2:16:06 AM Central Standard Time,avyoung@iinet.net.au writes: cannon (note, not gun) rockets and a mortar that shoots tennis balls and afew other reasonably harmless things. >> Well, I saw a "hairspray cannon" shoot a tennis ball OOS once. It fires apotato(e) a "really long way" and there is always the "Punkin chunkin' "contest each November somewhere out east a ways where they try toshoot around orange gourd as far as they can using junkyard stuff. The record isnow over 1/2 mile. I really NEEED to make a carbide cannon too. high school days, using coffee and soup cans. I won't even tell you how thatturned out except that the result was a preview of the hairstyle that I havenow worn for lo these many years, minus the eyebrows! mark visit Wood Art Custom Designshttp://woodartcustom.freeservers.com or http://hometown.aol.com/lazybee45/myhomepage/business.html Hand crafted items made to order! /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from beadman@mac.com Mon Apr 1 08:48:03 2002 g31Em2417025 for ; Mon, 1 Apr 2002 08:48:02 -0600 Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest Tony: here's some info on the subject. Disclaimer: I have never made one, and strongly caution safe operation. http://www.frii.com/~bsimon/backyard.html Claude At 10:39 PM +0800 on 4/1/02, Tony Young wrote about Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest All this stuff really does sound like required gear to own and that carbide cannon I heard go off was amazing in that way military explosions seem much louder than they seem to require to be sort of compared to mining explosions (intended ones anyhow). I was standing between it and a brick wall when it went off and it was like the feeling sonic boom gives that you feel within you. The bounce back from the wall didn't help, well yes it did actually. It was great window rattling fun. I know I want a cannon that can fire a gourd 1/2 mile.You've got to get this book Bob. ***********************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from avyoung@iinet.net.au Mon Apr 1 08:50:36 2002 g31EoY417369 for ; Mon, 1 Apr 2002 08:50:34 -0600 Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest Claude,thanks. Warning clear and understood. They're the best ones !!! Tony At 09:47 AM 4/1/02 -0500, Claude Freaner wrote: Tony: here's some info on the subject. Disclaimer: I have never made one, and strongly caution safe operation. http://www.frii.com/~bsimon/backyard.html Claude At 10:39 PM +0800 on 4/1/02, Tony Young wrote about Re: rodmakingApril Fool's Day Contest All this stuff really does sound like required gear to own and that carbide cannon I heard go off was amazing in that way military explosions seem much louder than they seem to require to be sort of compared to mining explosions (intended ones anyhow). I was standing between it and a brick wall when it went off and it was like the feeling sonic boom gives that you feel within you. The bounce back from the wall didn't help, well yes it did actually. It was great window rattling fun. I know I want a cannon that can fire a gourd 1/2 mile.You've got to get this book Bob. ***********************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from dryfly@erols.com Mon Apr 1 09:10:22 2002 g31FAL418549 for ; Mon, 1 Apr 2002 09:10:21 -0600 ([208.58.202.136] helo=erols.com) id 16s3Rq-0006N9-00; Mon, 01 Apr 2002 10:10:19 -0500 Subject: Re: sucky fishing and round ball. --------------5EE7F5D99493BD3ED6DA38C2 Fear the Turtle, Go Terps! Mark Wendt wrote: Brian, UMD Grad, 84 and 96. Go Terps! Mark At 05:38 PM 3/31/2002 -0500, you wrote: Bob, Well, glad to know I'm not the only one not catching fish. 'experts' have been wrong through the whole tournament!! GO BIGRED! Brian ----- Original Message -----From: Bob Nunley Sent: Sunday, March 31, 2002 4:49 PMSubject: Re: VAC/ Impregnation of reelseats. Sorry guys, didn't mean to put the suck ass fishing trip on thelist... my reply and reply to all buttons are side by side andI mis-hit.R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com----- Original Message -----From: Bob Nunley Sent: Sunday, March 31, 2002 3:43 PMSubject: Re: VAC/ Impregnation of reelseats. Randall,That's great! Glad it didn't blow up on you! LOL back in the shop and caught up until about 2:30 then drove downto broken bow and caught a few stockers... sucky day really,but at least at Broken Bow they have a stretch that generationdoesn't shut down the fishing in.Well, back to the shop... no Easter Egg Hunt for theBobster... too much work! Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com- ---- Original Message -----From: Randall Gregory Sent: Sunday, March 31, 2002 3:01 PMSubject: VAC/ Impregnation of reelseats. Happy Easter everyone. What a Beautiful day!!! Just wanted tocelebrate a victory of mine. Over the last month I have beenslowly acquiring all the parts for a large impregnation systemanother list member shared with me. It holds about 5 gallons. Ijust gave it a trial run yesterday. Opened it up after churchtoday and WOW!!!!!!! I now have some beautiful, fullysaturated fillers. I didn't even turn them down any. Just putabout 75 blanks in, fired up the system, and waited(impatiently) until today to check the results. I even cut someinto pcs to check the saturation. Each one checked was fullysaturated! By the way, I hope the police don't drive by andlook into my shop. They will think that I have fired up amoonshine still! Anyway, Just wanted to share this with thelist and to send a HUGE thank you to the list member thatwillingly shared the idea with me. To that person.I have somefree burl going out in the mail to you tomorrow. Thanks again.Randall R. Gregory NWArkansas. By the way, I stillhave plenty of burl available if anyone has a need forany.(email offlist) --------------5EE7F5D99493BD3ED6DA38C2 Fear the Turtle, Go Terps!Mark Wendt wrote: Mark At 05:38 PM 3/31/2002 -0500, you wrote:Bob,Well, glad to know I'm not the onlyone not catching fish. I just love the way the 'experts' have been wrong through the whole GO BIG RED!Brian ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: VAC/ Impregnation of reelseats. Sorry guys, didn't mean to put the suck ass fishing tripon the list... my reply and reply to all buttons are side by side and Imis-hit. R.L. Nunley, Rodmaker Custom Split Cane Flyrods http://www.caneflyrod.com ----- Original Message ----- internet.com; rod 'akers Subject: Re: VAC/ Impregnation of reelseats. Randall, up on you! LOL day, just got back in the shop and caught up until about 2:30 then drovedown to broken bow and caught a few stockers... sucky day really, but atleast at Broken Bow they have a stretch that generation doesn't shut downthe fishing in. Hunt for the Bobster... too much work! Later, Bob R.L. Nunley, Rodmaker Custom Split Cane Flyrods http://www.caneflyrod.com ----- Original Message ----- Gregory Subject: VAC/ Impregnation of reelseats. Happy Easter everyone. What a Beautifulday!!! Just wanted to celebrate a victory of mine. Over the last monthI have been slowly acquiring all the parts for a large impregnation systemanother list member shared with me. It holds about 5 gallons. I just gave I now have some beautiful, fully saturated fillers. I didn't even turnthem down any. Just put about 75 blanks in, fired up the system, and waited(impatiently) until today to check the results. I even cut some into pcs the way, I hope the police don't drive by and look into my shop. They willthink that I have fired up a moonshine still! Anyway, Just wanted to sharethis with the list and to send a HUGE thank you to the list member thatwillingly shared the idea with me. To that person.I have some free burl GregoryNW --------------5EE7F5D99493BD3ED6DA38C2-- from kenealyj@gwi.net Mon Apr 1 09:20:35 2002 g31FKZ419311 for ; Mon, 1 Apr 2002 09:20:35 -0600 Subject: Re: sucky fishing and round ball. Forget roundball!!! U Maine is playing UNH in the "Frozen Four" this =Thursday afternoon!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Goooooooooooooooooooooooo Black Bears!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! John K Subject: Re: sucky fishing and round ball. Sorry guys, didn't mean to put the suck ass fishing trip on the =list... my reply and reply to all buttons are side by side and I = in the shop and caught up until about 2:30 then drove down to broken bow =and caught a few stockers... sucky day really, but at least at Broken =Bow they have a stretch that generation doesn't shut down the fishing = Well, back to the shop... no Easter Egg Hunt for the = Happy Easter everyone. What a Beautiful day!!! Just wanted to =celebrate a victory of mine. Over the last month I have been slowly =acquiring all the parts for a large impregnation system another list =member shared with me. It holds about 5 gallons. I just gave it a trial =run yesterday. Opened it up after church today and WOW!!!!!!! I now =have some beautiful, fully saturated fillers. I didn't even turn them =down any. Just put about 75 blanks in, fired up the system, and waited =(impatiently) until today to check the results. I even cut some into pcs =to check the saturation. Each one checked was fully saturated! By the =way, I hope the police don't drive by and look into my shop. They will =think that I have fired up a moonshine still! Anyway, Just wanted to =share this with the list and to send a HUGE thank you to the list member =that willingly shared the idea with me. To that person.I have some free =burl going out in the mail to you tomorrow. Thanks again. Randall R. =Gregory NW Arkansas. By the way, I =still have plenty of burl available if anyone has a need for any.(email = the "Frozen Four" this Thursday afternoon!!!!!!!!!!!!!! GooooooooooooooooooooooooBlack = Bears!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! John K ----- Original Message ----- Robert S = Cc: rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= Sent: Monday, April 01, 2002 = PMSubject: Re: sucky fishing and = ball. Well, glad to know I'm not = From: Bob Sorry guys, didn't mean to put the suck ass = trip on the list... my reply and reply to all buttons are side = From: Bob internet.com = other day, just got back in the shop and caught up until about = drove down to broken bow and caught a few stockers... sucky day = but at least at Broken Bow they have a stretch that generation = From: Randall = Happy Easter everyone. = Beautiful day!!! Just wanted to celebrate a victory of mine. = last month I have been slowly acquiring all the parts for a = impregnation system another list member shared with me. It holds = gallons. I just gave it a trial run yesterday. Opened it up = fillers. I didn't even turn them down any. Just put about 75 = fired up the system, and waited (impatiently) until today to = results. I even cut some into pcs to check the saturation. Each = drive by and look into my shop. They will think that I have = moonshine still! Anyway, Just wanted to share this with the list = send a HUGE thank you to the list member that willingly shared = with me. To that person.I have some free burl going out in the = = from gjm80301@yahoo.com Mon Apr 1 09:32:51 2002 g31FWn420061 for ; Mon, 1 Apr 2002 09:32:50 - Mon, 01 Apr 2002 07:32:49 PST Subject: Sadly, a nice day of fishing I hiked up to a favorite cutthroat stream over the weekend. It was agorgeous 70 degree day and I found some open water and caught a fewcutts much earlier than a person has right to. That's the rub. In a normal year, that trail is snowed-in untilearly May. Only a few remnants of snow remained. The stream was very low and the fish were really concentrated in afew pools. On the way home, I notice the branch of the St Vrain thatJohn Geirach lives on is nearly dry. It's going to be a bad summer for the fish in Colarado. __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Greetings - send holiday greetings for Easter, Passoverhttp://greetings.yahoo.com/ from Grhghlndr@aol.com Mon Apr 1 09:35:10 2002 g31FZA420348 for ; Mon, 1 Apr 2002 09:35:10 -0600 Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest http://www.specialtymile.com/southbendreplicas/,check this out if youwant to see some info on cannons. This guy was my freshman English teacher andis an incredible person. Check out his list of customers and the things he has done with this. He has been around the world doing the 1812 Overture with people such as the Moscow symphony and others.Bret http://bretsovens.bravepages.com/ http://www.specialtymile.com/southbendreplicas/,check this out if you want doing the 1812 Overture with people such as the Moscow symphony andothers.Bret http://bretsovens.bravepages.com/ from patrick.w.coffey@boeing.com Mon Apr 1 09:46:47 2002 g31Fkl421136 for ; Mon, 1 Apr 2002 09:46:47 -0600 JAA29232 for ; Mon, 1 Apr 2002 09:46:46 -0600 JAA04881 for ; Mon, 1 Apr 2002 09:46:46 -0600 g31Fkhx14774 for ; Mon, 1 Apr 2002 07:46:43 -0800 (5.5.2650.21) id ; Mon, 1 Apr 2002 07:46:43 -0800 Subject: Bob N. Well I finally quit laughing and my eyes quit tearing long enough to suggestthat bob include a disclaimer in his subject line on his posting. My stomachkilling me and I can't get the image of this whole scenario out of my mind.LONG LIVE THE KING!!!! Patrick W. CoffeyAOG Incident Repair PlanningPhone: 425-234-2901Fax: 425-237-0083M-2112 M/C 61-79 from Harris.James@ev.state.az.us Mon Apr 1 10:53:09 2002 g31Gr8427180 for ; Mon, 1 Apr 2002 10:53:08 -0600 g31GnAH27063 for ; Mon, 1 Apr 2002 09:49:10 -0700 09:51:05 2002 -0700 with Novell_GroupWise; Mon, 01 Apr 2002 09:52:59 -0700 Subject: April Fools Story g31Gr9427182 So there I was chucking up a joint of 1" stainless steel pipe in my DeltaHeavy- 10 lathe. I like stainless hardware and was going to turn out somerings and spacers. After chucking up the piece there was about 3-1/2ft offree pipe extending to the left of the lathe. I thought about moving a rest inunder the pipe to support it but it was just short enough that I thought Icould steady any vibrations with my hand during start up and get to work. Istarted the lathe and the piece began to turn nice and smooth. No problem.OK -Start cutting. I began to remove metal and the force of the cutter wasenough to unbalance the pipe. It started to vibrate badly. As I reached forthe switch to shut down the lathe I was struck in the face by the shelf on thewall and knocked across the shop. The pipe had bent at almost 90 degreesand turned into a 7 ft. propeller. Everything on the shelf was thrown aboutme on the shop floor. I quickly stood up and tried to get to the shutoff !switch but the pipe, now beating a hole through the dry wall, was shaking thelathe around like a wet rag. Tools on the peg board were dropping off thewall into the path of the pipe and being batted across the shop at high speed. I could not get close enough to the lathe to shut it off. Its jumping around sobadly and it's starting to walk down the wall beating the drywall into powderexposing the studs. I can't stop this thing! The power cord is plugged inbehind it so I can't even pull the plug. By now the thing has walked its wayover to my work bench and is beating it away from the wall. Pieces ofmiscellaneous shop stuff are flying everywhere. It finally occurs to me that Igot to hit the main breaker to get this thing stopped but the door from theshop into the house is in the path of the objects being batted across theroom by the pipe. My only way out was through the big garage door but theswitch button is next to the door into the house. Gads! Not only can !I not shut this thing off but I'm trapped in the shop with it! Semanaged to get to it without get smacked and open the big door. Myneighbor Richard is standing there wandering what the hell is going on inthere. The main breaker was just around the corner and the ordeal was overexcept for the cleanup, repairs and the tool replacement. What a mess! Iwas so shook I couldn't do any work in the shop for a couple of days. JimH from jvswan@earthlink.net Mon Apr 1 11:14:59 2002 g31HEw428828 for ; Mon, 1 Apr 2002 11:14:58 -0600 (216.160.236.98) User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/9.0.1.3108Subject: Re: Bamboo splitters YES! That's it. I sent an email to the rod builder, but I haven't heardback from him. I may have overstepped my bounds by asking where he getshistools. At any rate, if you know of a place to get it, keep us posted. I think $550may be a little steep for many of us. Jason On 3/30/02 10:22 AM, "Darrin Curtis" wrote: Is this the same splitter you are talking about? I found the website today. http://www.wolfplace.com/rwolfrodco/building/splitter.html Darrin from douglosey@spectrumenergy.com Mon Apr 1 11:58:07 2002 g31Hw6401583 for ; Mon, 1 Apr 2002 11:58:06 - (216.234.218.119) Subject: Re: Sadly, a nice day of fishing Jerry,That's bad news..that stretch of the St. Vrain is my favorite section. losey from RHOLDER@SMURFIT.COM Mon Apr 1 12:05:32 2002 g31I5V402390 for ; Mon, 1 Apr 2002 12:05:32 -0600 id ; Mon, 1 Apr 2002 12:06:16 -0600 Subject: Photo's List, I am hoping that I am not going to shot myself in the foot here on thisrequest. After looking at my computer screen here at work for hours onenddoing what I think is work the empty desktop and blank screen saver has gotto go. Need a change and would like to see something more enjoyable on mycomputer. So this is where my request comes in. I do have the ability toput together a slid show screen saver which can also changes the desktopeveryday. But I am lacking the photographs to put into this slide show.That is where I am looking for your help. If you have any great fly fishingand cane rod photographs that you are willing to share with me to create acollection of slides for this screen saver please let me know. You can alsoemail them as an attachment to my work email address (rholder@smurfit.com) and don't worry about file size there is aT1 line here at my work. Thank you in advanced to all that might contributeto my boredom dilemma with my computer. Robert H.Work email: rholder@smurfit.com Homeemail: b2g@jps.net > from CALucker@aol.com Mon Apr 1 12:09:47 2002 g31I9l402879 for ; Mon, 1 Apr 2002 12:09:47 -0600 Subject: Re: Response to Reedwanker dnorl@qwest.net, rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu In a message dated 3/29/02 9:55:32 AM Pacific Standard Time, cathcreek@hotmail.com writes: Hey guys, if I wanted to build-let's say 20 rods a year, would a beveller make a huge difference for me in time? Absolutely not. I only mill, and I mill to final. But final milling does not make the work that much faster. Rough milling does save time because I can shove a square of bamboo that is 5/8" wide (or almost any width)through my rougher and get a straight 60 in a single pass of about an inch per second. For me final milling takes two or three passes (not necessary, but better) and more straightening than if you are using planing forms. Remember, if there is a jog in the cane as it goes under the cutters you will probably end up with an open seam in that area of the finished rod. That is one reason why production rods may have bad seams -- lack of attention to details. Dull cutters -- unwillingness to slow production by taking a mill off-line -- will also cause the problem. But production rods where details are attended to, such as Paynes, T&T's, Kusse rods, for example come outjust fine, but not that much faster than hand-planed rods.To explain further, in a mill your hold- downs may be two to four inches from the bottom of the cutting arc, and the cutting action is not self centering when conventional cutting. Therefore, you need a straight piece of cane to keep the strip on track as it goes through the cutters. When you plane, or Morgan Mill cut I suppose, the strip is held down at the point of cutting -- it is physically shoved into place in the forms. Long story short, it is my experience that I need to do more straightening with my milling than when I used to hand plane. from my experience, if you really want to save time, use good straightcane. The time I spend tracking down and selecting my cane has saved me moretime than all my mills. I got cherry picked culms from close to 1,600 12 foot culms that were already hand sorted. I got Wier stuff before Tuxedo Cane (I think) got the balance. I am sure there are other opportunities like that -- just think about who would have good cane. Chris Lucker In a message dated 3/29/02 9:55:32 AM PacificStandard Time, cathcreek@hotmail.com writes: Hey guys, if I wanted tobuild-let's say 20 rods a year, would a beveller make a huge difference for me in time? time because I can shove a square of bamboo that is 5/8" wide (or almostany width) through my rougher and get a straight 60 in a single pass of as it goes under the cutters you will probably end up with an open seam in may have bad seams -- lack of attention to details. Dull cutters -- unwillingness to slow production by taking a mill off-line -- will also cause the such as Paynes, T&T's, Kusse rods, for example come out just fine, butnot that much faster than ha!nd-planed rods.To explain further, in a mill your hold-downs may be two to four inches fromthe bottom of the cutting arc, and the cutting action is not self centering you plane, or Morgan Mill cut I suppose, the strip is held down at the point of short, it is my experience that I need to do more straightening with mymilling than when I used to hand plane. from my experience, if you really want to save time, use good straight are other opportunities like that -- just think about who would have good Chris Lucker from quiet_reed@hotmail.com Mon Apr 1 12:11:26 2002 g31IBQ403216 for ; Mon, 1 Apr 2002 12:11:26 -0600 Mon, 1 Apr 2002 10:11:11 -0800 Mon, 01 Apr 2002 18:11:11 GMT Subject: 2002 NW Bamboo Rod Casting Demo, Salem, OR FILETIME=[9ABEE760:01C1D9A8] Hi: This is the last update on the NW Bamboo Rod Casting Demo to include rodmakers that have contacted me about showing up and some other instructions. Please read this if you are thinking of coming here with your rods. The event will be held as part of the Annual Fly Fishing Fair of the Santiam Fly Casters of Salem, Oregon. The Fair will be held in the Sparks Center (Sports Center) of Willamette University in Salem, Oregon. The date is this Saturday, April 6th, 2002, from 10 AM to 4 PM. The fair includes fly tying demonstration and instruction, fly fishing instruction, and a casting area. In previous years, graphite and fiberglass rods have been a part of thecasting area. This year the Santiam Fly Casters have invited bamboo rod makers in the area to bring their rods and allow interested folk to cast their rods. For many people, the idea of bamboo is linked to heavy, hard to cast rods, or post-second World War rods from Japan. For others, it is the realm of the wealthy, beyond the pale of most fly fishers. This event is meant to dispel both misconceptions. Plus, it will be an opportunity to talk with the rodmakers themselves. Casting may be either in thegymnasium or the playing field outside, depending on weather. This several rodmakers have agreed to bring their rods and talk withvisitors: AJ Thramer (Eugene), Chris McDowell (Eugene), Bill Bennett(Salem), Stephen Kiley (West Linn), and Gary Lohkamp (Gresham). Otherrodmakers, including Cal Hudspeth (Monmouth), Chet Croco (Albany), Tim Stoltz (Salem), a contingent from Portland--Ed Hartzell, Chris Obuchowski, Ken Callaway, Paul Hansen, and Brian Bilhovney--and of course, yours truly will also be in attendance. If you come down, please try to bring suitable reels and lines for your rods. We won't have extra reels for you to put on your rods. If you have silk lines, please try to bring them, since this is another area full of misconceptions. Also, although it is not a selling event, you may bring your business cards or brocheures. I will try to have a followup mailing to those interested in purchasing rods, either directly, through mail order, or through fly shops. This is a trial event. I thought this would be fun for both the rodmaker as well as potential buyers. If it turns out okay, we may try to have another similar event in this area or encourage other organizers to try it elsewhere. I believe that Ralph Moon will have something similar up at the FFF annual meeting in Livingston this year along with a rod building class. Please invite anyone who might be interested to come on down and have agreat time. Send me some email for any other information, or contact anyof the Salem, Oregon fly shops: Creekside Fly Fishing, Fly Country Outfitters, and Valley Fly Fisher. Hope you all can attend. Don ChenQuiet Reed Fly FishingPO Box 1933Corvallis, OR 97339-1933 _________________________________________________________________Join the world's largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com from KyleDruey@aol.com Mon Apr 1 12:49:00 2002 g31Imx405820 for ; Mon, 1 Apr 2002 12:48:59 -0600 MAILINID92-0401134846; Mon, 01 Apr 2002 13:48:46 -0500 Subject: Re: Photo's Hi Robert, This might just be what you are looking for: http://www.webshots.com/homepage.html Check out the "field & stream" button on the left side, then look for the "flyfishing" photos button. I believe webshots if freeware, and they have 49 fly fishing screen saverphotos available. You can have the images randomly rotated at an interval ofyour choosing. I set mine for 10 minutes, makes working in a Dilbertvilletype of environment a little more bearble. Hope this helps, Kyle In a message dated Mon, 1 Apr 2002 1:06:12 PM Eastern Standard Time,"Holder, Robert" writes: List, I am hoping that I am not going to shot myself in the foot here on thisrequest. After looking at my computer screen here at work for hours onenddoing what I think is work the empty desktop and blank screen saver hasgotto go. Need a change and would like to see something more enjoyable onmycomputer. So this is where my request comes in. I do have the ability toput together a slid show screen saver which can also changes the desktopeveryday. But I am lacking the photographs to put into this slide show.That is where I am looking for your help. If you have any great fly fishingand cane rod photographs that you are willing to share with me to create acollection of slides for this screen saver please let me know. You can alsoemail them as an attachment to my work email address (rholder@smurfit.com) and don't worry about file size there is aT1 line here at my work. Thank you in advanced to all that mightcontributeto my boredom dilemma with my computer. Robert H.Work email: rholder@smurfit.com > Homeemail: b2g@jps.net from lblan@provide.net Mon Apr 1 13:22:03 2002 g31JM2407791 for ; Mon, 1 Apr 2002 13:22:02 -0600 for ; Mon, 1 Apr 2002 14:22:01 -0500 Subject: RE: April Fools Story Wow... only two things come to mind. 1 - imagine asking for tales from a bunch of fishermen and getting the"truth" :)) 2 - stay away from Nunley, if you managed to have simultaneous "incidents",the world would never be the same! :)) Great story, glad there was no permanent damage! Larry Blan -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Monday, April 01, 2002 11:53 AM Subject: April Fools Story So there I was chucking up a joint of 1" stainless steel pipe inmy Delta Heavy- 10 lathe. I like stainless hardware and was goingto turn out some rings and spacers. After chucking up the piecethere was about 3-1/2ft of free pipe extending to the left of thelathe. I thought about moving a rest in under the pipe tosupport it but it was just short enough that I thought I couldsteady any vibrations with my hand during start up and get towork. I started the lathe and the piece began to turn nice andsmooth. No problem. OK -Start cutting. I began to remove metaland the force of the cutter was enough to unbalance the pipe. Itstarted to vibrate badly. As I reached for the switch to shutdown the lathe I was struck in the face by the shelf on the walland knocked across the shop. The pipe had bent at almost 90degrees and turned into a 7 ft. propeller. Everything on theshelf was thrown about me on the shop floor. I quickly stood upand tried to get to the shutoff !switch but the pipe, now beating a hole through the dry wall, wasshaking the lathe around like a wet rag. Tools on the peg boardwere dropping off the wall into the path of the pipe and beingbatted across the shop at high speed. I could not get closeenough to the lathe to shut it off. Its jumping around so badlyand it's starting to walk down the wall beating the drywall intopowder exposing the studs. I can't stop this thing! The powercord is plugged in behind it so I can't even pull the plug. Bynow the thing has walked its way over to my work bench and isbeating it away from the wall. Pieces of miscellaneous shopstuff are flying everywhere. It finally occurs to me that I gotto hit the main breaker to get this thing stopped but the door from the shop into the house is in the path of the objects beingbatted across the room by the pipe. My only way out was throughthe big garage door but the switch button is next to the doorinto the house. Gads! Not only can !I not shut this thing off but I'm trapped in the shop with it! Semanaged to get to it without get smacked and open the big door.My neighbor Richard is standing there wandering what the hell isgoing on in there. The main breaker was just around the cornerand the ordeal was over except for the cleanup, repairs and thetool replacement. What a mess! I was so shook I couldn't do anywork in the shop for a couple of days. JimH from channer@frontier.net Mon Apr 1 13:41:41 2002 g31Jff409107 for ; Mon, 1 Apr 2002 13:41:41 - for ; Mon, 1 Apr 2002 12:41:46 - Subject: Re: Sadly, a nice day of fishing I just looked at Mike Mora's San Juan page this morning. Chris Guikemasays the BOR told him that there will mostly likely not be any highflows this spring on the Juan, instead they anticipate having to release800-1000cfs in order to meet the requirement at Shiprock, the Animasisn't expected to contribute it's normal share this year.john Douglas Losey wrote: Jerry,That's bad news..that stretch of the St. Vrain is my favorite section. losey from tjtrodmaker@yahoo.com Mon Apr 1 13:55:42 2002 g31Jtg410104 for ; Mon, 1 Apr 2002 13:55:42 -0600 Mon, 01 Apr 2002 11:55:41 PST Subject: an attack on cane rods http://www.flyanglersonline.com/ i know this is the "site" but this cuts across us all.timothy ====="Gooda' mornin', mister bear!" ...Ride, boldly ride,"The shade replied, -"If you seek for Eldorado!" -- E.A.Poe __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Greetings - send holiday greetings for Easter, Passoverhttp://greetings.yahoo.com/ from tfbinn@mindspring.com Mon Apr 1 14:12:43 2002 g31KCg411277 for ; Mon, 1 Apr 2002 14:12:43 -0600 id 16s8AT-0001Y4-00; Mon, 01 Apr 2002 15:12:41 -0500 dnorl@qwest.net, rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Subject: Re: Response to Reedwanker Chris, I can't compare either hand planing or Morgan Milling to a powered mill, but Ican tell you for sure that the Morgan H/M requires MUCH more of the samekind of attention to straightening you mention than does hand planing. Savingtime isn't the primary reason for a Morgan Mill. Regardless of method used,attention to detail is the only way to achieve good results.Winston On Mon, 1 Apr 2002 13:09:23 EST CALucker@aol.com wrote: In a message dated 3/29/02 9:55:32 AM Pacific Standard Time,cathcreek@hotmail.com writes: Hey guys, if I wanted to build-let's say 20 rods a year, would a beveller make a huge difference for me in time? Absolutely not. I only mill, and I mill to final. But final milling does not makethe work that much faster. Rough milling does save time because I canshove a square of bamboo that is 5/8" wide (or almost any width) throughmy rougher and get a straight 60 in a single pass of about an inch persecond. For me final milling takes two or three passes (not necessary, butbetter) and more straightening than if you are using planing forms. Remember, if there is a jog in the cane as it goes under the cutters you willprobably end up with an open seam in that area of the finished rod. That isone reason why production rods may have bad seams -- lack of attention todetails. Dull cutters -- unwillingness to slow production by taking a mill off- line -- will also cause the problem. But production rods where details areattended to, such as Paynes, T&T's, Kusse rods, for example come out justfine, but not that much faster than ha!nd-planed rods. To explain further, in a mill your hold-downs may be two to four inches fromthe bottom of the cutting arc, and the cutting action is not self centeringwhen conventional cutting. Therefore, you need a straight piece of cane tokeep the strip on track as it goes through the cutters. When you plane, orMorgan Mill cut I suppose, the strip is held down at the point of cutting -- it isphysically shoved into place in the forms. Long story short, it is myexperience that I need to do more straightening with my milling than when Iused to hand plane. from my experience, if you really want to save time, use good straightcane. The time I spend tracking down and selecting my cane has saved memore time than all my mills. I got cherry picked culms from close to 1,60012 foot culms that were already hand sorted. I got Wier stuff beforeTuxedo Cane (I think) got the balance. I am sure there are otheropportunities like that -- just think about who would have good cane. Chris Lucker from rcristant@isgtransport.com Mon Apr 1 14:16:56 2002 g31KGu411713 for ; Mon, 1 Apr 2002 14:16:56 -0600 content-class: urn:content-classes:messageSubject: RE: an attack on cane rods Thread-Topic: an attack on cane rodsThread-Index: AcHZt0nr8cuMNDw2Rby2SCCGpu+odAAAsz1A g31KGu411714 Got me!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! -----Original Message----- Subject: an attack on cane rods http://www.flyanglersonline.com/ i know this is the "site" but this cuts across us all.timothy ====="Gooda' mornin', mister bear!" ...Ride, boldly ride,"The shade replied, -"If you seek for Eldorado!" -- E.A.Poe __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Greetings - send holiday greetings for Easter, Passoverhttp://greetings.yahoo.com/ from flytyr@southshore.com Mon Apr 1 15:00:46 2002 g31L0j417688 for ; Mon, 1 Apr 2002 15:00:45 -0600 g31L0iO15797 for ; Mon, 1 Apr 2002 15:00:44 -0600 Subject: Re: an attack on cane rods Totally unbelievable.Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com Robert Cristant wrote: Got me!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! -----Original Message----- Sent: Monday, April 01, 2002 2:56 PM Subject: an attack on cane rods http://www.flyanglersonline.com/ i know this is the "site" but this cuts across us all.timothy ====="Gooda' mornin', mister bear!" ...Ride, boldly ride,"The shade replied, -"If you seek for Eldorado!" -- E.A.Poe __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Greetings - send holiday greetings for Easter, Passoverhttp://greetings.yahoo.com/ from paul.blakley@ntlworld.com Mon Apr 1 15:07:11 2002 g31L7A418944 for ; Mon, 1 Apr 2002 15:07:10 -0600 Mon, 1 Apr 2002 22:07:08 +0100 Subject: Re: an attack on cane rods Come on chaps yopur surely not that gullible and easillyfooled...............check the date out....APRIL FOOLS....... timothy troester wrote: http://www.flyanglersonline.com/ i know this is the "site" but this cuts across us all.timothy ====="Gooda' mornin', mister bear!" ...Ride, boldly ride,"The shade replied, -"If you seek for Eldorado!" -- E.A.Poe __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Greetings - send holiday greetings for Easter, Passoverhttp://greetings.yahoo.com/ from sats@gte.net Mon Apr 1 17:36:59 2002 g31Naw426656 for ; Mon, 1 Apr 2002 17:36:58 -0600 (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with Subject: Re: an attack on cane rods Come on chaps yopur surely not that gullible and easillyfooled...............check the date out....APRIL FOOLS....... Well, I got about four or five paragraphs into it before I realize that therewere no names attached to the organizations.---------------------------- Terry "Sunfish" KirkpatrickSafety Harbor, Florida(Old Tampa Bay)sats@gte.netMeet me at http://home1.gte.net/sats from dongreife@hotmail.com Mon Apr 1 17:43:30 2002 g31NhU427091 for ; Mon, 1 Apr 2002 17:43:30 -0600 Mon, 1 Apr 2002 15:43:24 -0800 HTTP; Mon, 01 Apr 2002 23:43:24 GMT Subject: Ferrule Polishing Mandrels FILETIME=[03A8E180:01C1D9D7] My search of the archives failedto come up with much in the way of a design for a mandrel for use on a latheto polish NS ferrules, or a discription of the polishing process and materialsrecommended. Can some of you'se guys help me out on these 2problems?Chat with friends online, try MSNMessenger: ClickHere from channer@frontier.net Mon Apr 1 18:08:48 2002 g3208m427986 for ; Mon, 1 Apr 2002 18:08:48 -0600 Subject: Re: an attack on cane rods Crissake Timmy, read the whole damn thing, it's an April Fools joke timothy troester wrote: http://www.flyanglersonline.com/ i know this is the "site" but this cuts across us all.timothy ====="Gooda' mornin', mister bear!" ...Ride, boldly ride,"The shade replied, -"If you seek for Eldorado!" -- E.A.Poe __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Greetings - send holiday greetings for Easter, Passoverhttp://greetings.yahoo.com/ from bdcbfr@chartermi.net Mon Apr 1 19:48:22 2002 g321mL401027 for ; Mon, 1 Apr 2002 19:48:21 -0600 Subject: Re: Ferrule Polishing Mandrels Use drill rod of appropriate size or do Like I do and turn drills around =and use the appropriate size for your ferrule. I bought a set of cheap ="Jobber" Drill bits just for this use. Brian Subject: Ferrule Polishing Mandrels My search of the archives failed to come up with much in the way of a =design for a mandrel for use on a lathe to polish NS ferrules, or a =discription of the polishing process and materials recommended. Can some =of you'se guys help me out on these 2 problems? -------------------------------------------------------------------------=-----Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: Click Here Use drill rod of appropriate size or do = and turn drills around and use the appropriate size for your = bought a set of cheap "Jobber" Drill bits just for this =use. Brian ----- Original Message ----- Greife Sent: Monday, April 01, 2002 = PMSubject: Ferrule Polishing =Mandrels My search of the archives failed to come up with much in the way = discription of the polishing process and materials recommended. Can = you'se guys help me out on these 2 problems? Here from bob@downandacross.com Mon Apr 1 20:12:27 2002 g322CQ401632 for ; Mon, 1 Apr 2002 20:12:26 -0600 1 Apr 2002 21:12:20 -0500 Subject: Re: Response to Reedwanker I agree completely. I just glued up some more quad strips today after handplaning them. They are better than the average results I got on the HandMill. I am rather shocked, but I am starting to get enough proof to see thateven hand planing quads can be more forgiven than poorly prepared strips onthe MHM. It is still a great tool, but I am managing without.Best regards,Bob -----Original Message----- dnorl@qwest.net; rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Re: Re: Response to Reedwanker Chris,I can't compare either hand planing or Morgan Milling to a poweredmill, but I can tell you for sure that the Morgan H/M requires MUCHmore of the same kind of attention to straightening you mentionthan does hand planing. Saving time isn't the primary reason for aMorgan Mill. Regardless of method used, attention to detail is theonly way to achieve good results.Winston from bob@downandacross.com Mon Apr 1 20:14:11 2002 g322EA401729 for ; Mon, 1 Apr 2002 20:14:10 -0600 1 Apr 2002 21:14:04 -0500 Subject: RE: Ferrule Polishing Mandrels Yep, great idea, Brian. That is cheaper than buying drill blanks I think,which I have. I use the backs of drill bits when I am fitting ferrules offthe rod and want something to support the male better with when pulling theferrules apart. It works well.Bob-----Original Message-----From: owner- rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Monday, April 01, 2002 8:48 PM Subject: Re: Ferrule Polishing Mandrels Use drill rod of appropriate size or do Like I do and turn drills aroundand use the appropriate size for your ferrule. I bought a set of cheap"Jobber" Drill bits just for this use. Brian----- Original Message -----From: Don Greife Subject: Ferrule Polishing Mandrels My search of the archives failed to come up with much in the way of adesign for a mandrel for use on a lathe to polish NS ferrules, or adiscription of the polishing process and materials recommended. Can some ofyou'se guys help me out on these 2 problems? ----------------------------------------------------------------------------Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: Click Here use the backs of drill bits when I am fitting ferrules off the rod and = use the Flitz polish Tony Larson sent me and do it in the lathe. It = well.Bob CreekSent: Monday, April 01, 2002 8:48 dongreife@hotmail.com;rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: = Ferrule Polishing MandrelsUse drill rod of appropriate size or = and turn drills around and use the appropriate size for your = bought a set of cheap "Jobber" Drill bits just for this =use. Brian ----- Original Message ----- Greife Sent: Monday, April 01, 2002 = PM Mandrels My search of the archives failed to come up with much in the = discription of the polishing process and materials recommended. Can = you'se guys help me out on these 2 problems? Here from avyoung@iinet.net.au Mon Apr 1 21:06:57 2002 g3236s403208 for ; Mon, 1 Apr 2002 21:06:55 -0600 Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest I just took a quick look at the site. Great site, lawyer jokes & instructions forvarious ballistic devises. I'd love to see his idea of the .220 swift potato gun in action [:-)] Tony At 09:47 AM 4/1/02 -0500, Claude Freaner wrote: Tony: here's some info on the subject. Disclaimer: I have never made one, and strongly caution safe operation. http://www.frii.com/~bsimon/backyard.html Claude At 10:39 PM +0800 on 4/1/02, Tony Young wrote about Re: rodmakingApril Fool's Day Contest All this stuff really does sound like required gear to own and that carbide cannon I heard go off was amazing in that way military explosions seem much louder than they seem to require to be sort of compared to mining explosions (intended ones anyhow). I was standing between it and a brick wall when it went off and it was like the feeling sonic boom gives that you feel within you. The bounce back from the wall didn't help, well yes it did actually. It was great window rattling fun. I know I want a cannon that can fire a gourd 1/2 mile.You've got to get this book Bob. ***********************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from JNL123141@msn.com Mon Apr 1 21:08:40 2002 g3238d403293 for ; Mon, 1 Apr 2002 21:08:39 -0600 Mon, 1 Apr 2002 19:08:30 -0800 "RodmakersPost" Subject: Re: April Fools Story FILETIME=[AA7C07A0:01C1D9F3] Jim,Do you live near Nunley? Maybe its something in the water... ----- Original Message ----- Subject: April Fools Story So there I was chucking up a joint of 1" stainless steel pipe in my Delta=Heavy-10 lathe. I like stainless hardware and was going to turn out som=e rings and spacers. After chucking up the piece there was about 3- 1/2f=t of free pipe extending to the left of the lathe. I thought about movin=g a rest in under the pipe to support it but it was just short enough tha=t I thought I could steady any vibrations with my hand during start up an=d get to work. I started the lathe and the piece began to turn nice and =smooth. No problem. OK -Start cutting. I began to remove metal and the =force of the cutter was enough to unbalance the pipe. It started to vibr=ate badly. As I reached for the switch to shut down the lathe I was str=uck in the face by the shelf on the wall and knocked across the shop. Th=e pipe had bent at almost 90 degrees and turned into a 7 ft. propeller. =Everything on the shelf was thrown about me on the shop floor. I quickly=stood up and tried to get to the shutoff !switch but the pipe, now beating a hole through the dry wall, was shaking=the lathe around like a wet rag. Tools on the peg board were dropping o=ff the wall into the path of the pipe and being batted across the shop at=high speed. I could not get close enough to the lathe to shut it off. =Its jumping around so badly and it's starting to walk down the wall beati=ng the drywall into powder exposing the studs. I can't stop this thing! =The power cord is plugged in behind it so I can't even pull the plug. B=y now the thing has walked its way over to my work bench and is beating i=t away from the wall. Pieces of miscellaneous shop stuff are flying ever=ywhere. It finally occurs to me that I got to hit the main breaker to ge=t this thing stopped but the door from the shop into the house is in the =path of the objects being batted across the room by the pipe. My only wa=y out was through the big garage door but the switch button is next to th=e door into the house. Gads! Not only can !I not shut this thing off but I'm trapped in the shop with it! Semanaged to get to it without get smacked and open the big door. My neigh=bor Richard is standing there wandering what the hell is going on in ther=e. The main breaker was just around the corner and the ordeal was over ex=cept for the cleanup, repairs and the tool replacement. What a mess! I w=as so shook I couldn't do any work in the shop for a couple of days. JimH Jim, ----- Original Message ----- From: James Harris Sent: Monday, April 01, 2002 11:55AM= rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Subject: April Fools up&nbs=p; the piece there was about 3-1/2ft of free pipe extending to the left o= port it but it was just short enough that I thought I could steady any vi= The pipe had bent at almost 90 degrees and turned into a 7 ft. propeller.= p; I quickly stood up and tried to get to the shutoff !switch but the=pipe, now beating a hole through the dry wall, was shaking the lathe aro= ll into the path of the pipe and being batted across the shop at high spe= Its jumping around so badly and it's starting to walk down the wall beat= hit the main breaker to get this thing stopped but the door from the shop=into the house is in the path of the objects being batted across the roo= the switch button is next to the door into the house. Gads! Not only can = Semanaged to get to it without get smacked and open the bigdoor.&nb=sp; My neighbor Richard is standing there wandering what the hell is goin=g on in there. The main breaker was just around the corner and the ordeal=was over except for the cleanup, repairs and the tool replacement. What = ple of days.JimH from atlasc1@earthlink.net Mon Apr 1 21:30:22 2002 g323UK404364 for ; Mon, 1 Apr 2002 21:30:21 -0600 ([209.179.148.13] helo=computer) id 16sEzu-0001wC-00; Mon, 01 Apr 2002 19:30:15 -0800 Subject: Re: April Fools Story What would happen if you were to line up Bob Nunley, Jim Harris and RalphMoon? Would the collective cosmic cane making catastrophic force be enoughto split and heat treat a culm from 20 feet away? Adam----- Original Message ----- Subject: RE: April Fools Story Wow... only two things come to mind. 1 - imagine asking for tales from a bunch of fishermen and getting the"truth" :)) 2 - stay away from Nunley, if you managed to have simultaneous "incidents", the world would never be the same! :)) Great story, glad there was no permanent damage! Larry Blan -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Monday, April 01, 2002 11:53 AM Subject: April Fools Story So there I was chucking up a joint of 1" stainless steel pipe inmy Delta Heavy- 10 lathe. I like stainless hardware and was goingto turn out some rings and spacers. After chucking up the piecethere was about 3-1/2ft of free pipe extending to the left of thelathe. I thought about moving a rest in under the pipe tosupport it but it was just short enough that I thought I couldsteady any vibrations with my hand during start up and get towork. I started the lathe and the piece began to turn nice andsmooth. No problem. OK -Start cutting. I began to remove metaland the force of the cutter was enough to unbalance the pipe. Itstarted to vibrate badly. As I reached for the switch to shutdown the lathe I was struck in the face by the shelf on the walland knocked across the shop. The pipe had bent at almost 90degrees and turned into a 7 ft. propeller. Everything on theshelf was thrown about me on the shop floor. I quickly stood upand tried to get to the shutoff !switch but the pipe, now beating a hole through the dry wall, wasshaking the lathe around like a wet rag. Tools on the peg boardwere dropping off the wall into the path of the pipe and beingbatted across the shop at high speed. I could not get closeenough to the lathe to shut it off. Its jumping around so badlyand it's starting to walk down the wall beating the drywall intopowder exposing the studs. I can't stop this thing! The powercord is plugged in behind it so I can't even pull the plug. Bynow the thing has walked its way over to my work bench and isbeating it away from the wall. Pieces of miscellaneous shopstuff are flying everywhere. It finally occurs to me that I gotto hit the main breaker to get this thing stopped but the door from the shop into the house is in the path of the objects beingbatted across the room by the pipe. My only way out was throughthe big garage door but the switch button is next to the doorinto the house. Gads! Not only can !I not shut this thing off but I'm trapped in the shop with it! Semanaged to get to it without get smacked and open the big door. My neighbor Richard is standing there wandering what the hell isgoing on in there. The main breaker was just around the cornerand the ordeal was over except for the cleanup, repairs and thetool replacement. What a mess! I was so shook I couldn't do anywork in the shop for a couple of days. JimH from avyoung@iinet.net.au Mon Apr 1 21:40:29 2002 g323eR404886 for ; Mon, 1 Apr 2002 21:40:28 -0600 Subject: Re: April Fools Story Maybe but it would certainly set everything on fire. Tony At 07:19 PM 4/1/02 -0800, Adam Vigil wrote: What would happen if you were to line up Bob Nunley, Jim Harris and RalphMoon? Would the collective cosmic cane making catastrophic force beenoughto split and heat treat a culm from 20 feet away? Adam----- Original Message -----From: "Larry Blan" Sent: Monday, April 01, 2002 11:36 AMSubject: RE: April Fools Story Wow... only two things come to mind. 1 - imagine asking for tales from a bunch of fishermen and getting the"truth" :)) 2 - stay away from Nunley, if you managed to have simultaneous "incidents", the world would never be the same! :)) Great story, glad there was no permanent damage! Larry Blan -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Monday, April 01, 2002 11:53 AM Subject: April Fools Story So there I was chucking up a joint of 1" stainless steel pipe inmy Delta Heavy- 10 lathe. I like stainless hardware and was goingto turn out some rings and spacers. After chucking up the piecethere was about 3-1/2ft of free pipe extending to the left of thelathe. I thought about moving a rest in under the pipe tosupport it but it was just short enough that I thought I couldsteady any vibrations with my hand during start up and get towork. I started the lathe and the piece began to turn nice andsmooth. No problem. OK -Start cutting. I began to remove metaland the force of the cutter was enough to unbalance the pipe. Itstarted to vibrate badly. As I reached for the switch to shutdown the lathe I was struck in the face by the shelf on the walland knocked across the shop. The pipe had bent at almost 90degrees and turned into a 7 ft. propeller. Everything on theshelf was thrown about me on the shop floor. I quickly stood upand tried to get to the shutoff !switch but the pipe, now beating a hole through the dry wall, wasshaking the lathe around like a wet rag. Tools on the peg boardwere dropping off the wall into the path of the pipe and beingbatted across the shop at high speed. I could not get closeenough to the lathe to shut it off. Its jumping around so badlyand it's starting to walk down the wall beating the drywall intopowder exposing the studs. I can't stop this thing! The powercord is plugged in behind it so I can't even pull the plug. Bynow the thing has walked its way over to my work bench and isbeating it away from the wall. Pieces of miscellaneous shopstuff are flying everywhere. It finally occurs to me that I gotto hit the main breaker to get this thing stopped but the door from the shop into the house is in the path of the objects beingbatted across the room by the pipe. My only way out was throughthe big garage door but the switch button is next to the doorinto the house. Gads! Not only can !I not shut this thing off but I'm trapped in the shop with it! Semanaged to get to it without get smacked and open the big door.My neighbor Richard is standing there wandering what the hell isgoing on in there. The main breaker was just around the cornerand the ordeal was over except for the cleanup, repairs and thetool replacement. What a mess! I was so shook I couldn't do anywork in the shop for a couple of days. JimH /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from bdcbfr@chartermi.net Mon Apr 1 22:24:28 2002 g324ON405988 for ; Mon, 1 Apr 2002 22:24:23 -0600 Subject: Re: sucky fishing and round ball. I bet Maryland fishes with worms Brian Subject: Re: sucky fishing and round ball. Brian, UMD Grad, 84 and 96. Go Terps! Mark At 05:38 PM 3/31/2002 -0500, you wrote: Bob, 'experts' have been wrong through the whole tournament!! GO BIG RED! Subject: Re: VAC/ Impregnation of reelseats. Sorry guys, didn't mean to put the suck ass fishing trip on the =list... my reply and reply to all buttons are side by side and I = Subject: Re: VAC/ Impregnation of reelseats. in the shop and caught up until about 2:30 then drove down to broken bow =and caught a few stockers... sucky day really, but at least at Broken =Bow they have a stretch that generation doesn't shut down the fishing = Well, back to the shop... no Easter Egg Hunt for the = Subject: VAC/ Impregnation of reelseats. Happy Easter everyone. What a Beautiful day!!! Just wanted to =celebrate a victory of mine. Over the last month I have been slowly =acquiring all the parts for a large impregnation system another list =member shared with me. It holds about 5 gallons. I just gave it a trial =run yesterday. Opened it up after church today and WOW!!!!!!! I now =have some beautiful, fully saturated fillers. I didn't even turn them =down any. Just put about 75 blanks in, fired up the system, and waited =(impatiently) until today to check the results. I even cut some into pcs =to check the saturation. Each one checked was fully saturated! By the =way, I hope the police don't drive by and look into my shop. They will =think that I have fired up a moonshine still! Anyway, Just wanted to =share this with the list and to send a HUGE thank you to the list member =that willingly shared the idea with me. To that person.I have some free =burl going out in the mail to you tomorrow. Thanks again. Randall R. =Gregory NW Arkansas. By the way, I =still have plenty of burl available if anyone has a need for any.(email = I bet Maryland fishes with =worms Brian ----- Original Message ----- Mark Wendt Sent: Monday, April 01, 2002 = AMSubject: Re: sucky fishing and = ball.= PM = -0500, you wrote: I'm not the only one not catching fish. From: Bob Subject: Re: VAC/ Impregnation of reelseats.Sorry guys, didn't mean to put the suck ass fishing trip on = From: Bob internet.com = Subject: Re: VAC/ Impregnation of reelseats. got back in the shop and caught up until about 2:30 then drove = broken bow and caught a few stockers... sucky day really, but at = Broken Bow they have a stretch that generation doesn't shut down = From: Randall= Subject: VAC/ Impregnation of reelseats. celebrate a victory of mine. Over the last month I have been = acquiring all the parts for a large impregnation system another = member shared with me. It holds about 5 gallons. I just gave it a = run yesterday. Opened it up after church today and = have some beautiful, fully saturated fillers. I didn't even turn = (impatiently) until today to check the results. I even cut some = to check the saturation. Each one checked was fully = the way, I hope the police don't drive by and look into my shop. = think that I have fired up a moonshine still! Anyway, Just wanted = this with the list and to send a HUGE thank you to the list member = willingly shared the idea with me. To that person.I have some free = = any.(email offlist) = from dryfly@erols.com Mon Apr 1 22:43:17 2002 g324hH406692 for ; Mon, 1 Apr 2002 22:43:17 -0600 ([208.58.195.141] helo=homeserver) id 16sG8V-0004L1-00; Mon, 01 Apr 2002 23:43:12 -0500 Subject: Re: sucky fishing and round ball. As a Marylander and a Maryland builder, I find that to be a low blow. =Please give respect where it is due! They beat Wisconsin, Kentucky, =Kansas, Connecticut and Indiana to win, all programs that have been =national champions in the past. Bob As a Marylander and = programs that have been national champions in the past. Bob from bdcbfr@chartermi.net Mon Apr 1 23:23:23 2002 g325NN407887 for ; Mon, 1 Apr 2002 23:23:23 -0600 Subject: Re: sucky fishing and round ball. It was a very hard fought game. Maryland played very well, their =defense was outstanding. Perhaps they only fish with cut bait, not live =bait. Just hope Jeffries doesn't go pro next year. Congratulations on your first NCAA Division 1 win! Brian Subject: Re: sucky fishing and round ball. As a Marylander and a Maryland builder, I find that to be a low blow. =Please give respect where it is due! They beat Wisconsin, Kentucky, =Kansas, Connecticut and Indiana to win, all programs that have been =national champions in the past. Bob = year. Congratulations on your first NCAA = win! Brian ----- Original Message ----- Robert S = Sent: Monday, April 01, 2002 = PMSubject: Re: sucky fishing and = ball. As a Marylander and = all programs that have been national champions in the =past. Bob from d.kennedy@paradise.net.nz Tue Apr 2 00:47:34 2002 g326lX409863 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 00:47:33 -0600 id 05F97D15DD; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 18:47:27 +1200 (NZST) +1200 "rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu" Subject: RE: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest-Attention Ian Kearney Ian, I hope you are getting a list of all these names to send special invitationsto the next Real Southern Gathering. It would be a blast! DGK -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest At 04:44 AM 4/1/2002 -0500, you wrote: Well, I saw a "hairspray cannon" shoot a tennis ball OOS once. It fires apotato(e) a "really long way" and there is always the "Punkin chunkin' "contest each November somewhere out east a ways where they try toshoot around orange gourd as far as they can using junkyard stuff. The record isnow over 1/2 mile. I really NEEED to make a carbide cannon too. Yeah, Mark, they do that here on the Eastern Shore of Maryland. Quite a fun day, too. They get the local vendors out, including some of the local microbrewers, and make a fun day out of it. This past year, we had the Wild Goose Brewery come out and set up a tent, and if you haven't had one of their beers, they are really pretty good. They make an excellent pale ale, and for hop heads like meself, it has a verrrry good little bite of hops to it. In the winter, they make a seasonal brew called Snow Goose. Nice rich, dark, full bodied ale, with a "delightful" hoppy aroma and taste. Quite good! Oh yeah, the punkin' tossing contest is a blast to watch, in between brews..... I don't know why, maybe it's just the sight of huge orange gourds flying a couple hundred feet in the air, with a very satisfying "splootch" at the end, but I just crack up when I watch it. Wish I had one of those guns when I was a kid, for the fall veggie wars in the neighborhood. Can you imagine a rotten punkin', launched about a hundred feet or so, landing in the neighbor kid's fort! Incoming!!!!!!!! high school days, using coffee and soup cans. I won't even tell you how thatturned out except that the result was a preview of the hairstyle that I havenow worn for lo these many years, minus the eyebrows! We used to do that too! Was a lot of fun! What works even better, is to use butane, since it's heavier than air. When you launch it at night, you get about a ten foot flame.... mark The other Mark from avyoung@iinet.net.au Tue Apr 2 03:10:08 2002 g329A6411918 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 03:10:06 -0600 Subject: Re: Guillermo's Leaders g329A8411919 I just received a leader made by Guillermo and I must tell the list it's superb.I have to say I'm expecting some leaders from Jim Cramer which I sort of ordered at the same time and these have not arrived so I can't compare but I'm sure his are great too which puts me in the rotten position you often find yourself on this list of wanting to tell people how good something is without knocking all the other people doing every bit as well.Anyhow, Guillermo's are great, really nicely presented (and present really nicely too for that matter) and have a nice little story with the packaging which I like. Tony Making and selling leaders is fun, a hobby for us, and we don't rely on them as our main source of funds.What I mean is, that I deeply appreciate you gentlemen coming to my aid, only it's not necessary to do so. I will be more than happy to sell leaders, but would prefer that you want them as you need them, and not as a "relief effort" [:-)] That is not to say that your efforts on my behalf go unappreciated.I have been a list member for a while, and all this has helped to reasure me of my conviction that you are a great group of people, with whom I am proud to be associated.Thank you friends. Guillermo /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from Grhghlndr@aol.com Tue Apr 2 06:30:42 2002 g32CUf414108 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 06:30:41 -0600 Subject: Re: sucky fishing and round ball. rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Even though I go to IU I still have to hand it to Maryland last night and say congrats for a good game. IU just could not hit in that last 15-20 minutes and it took them down.Still #2 in the nation aint bad.Bret http://bretsovens.bravepages.com/ Even though I go to IU Istill have to hand it to Maryland last night and say congrats for a good down.Still #2 in the nation aint bad.Bret http://bretsovens.bravepages.com/ from wendt@kingcrab.nrl.navy.mil Tue Apr 2 06:58:42 2002 g32Cwf414762 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 06:58:41 -0600 g32CFxdd005220 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 07:16:00 -0500 Subject: Re: sucky fishing and round ball. Mark At 11:24 PM 4/1/02 -0500, you wrote:Ibe=tMaryland fishes with worms Brian From: MarkWendt= rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= Sent: Monday, April 01, 2002 6:51 AMSubject: Re: sucky fishing and round ball. Brian, Mark At 05:38 PM 3/31/2002 -0500, you wrote:Bob, Well, glad to know I'm not the only one not catching fish. Subject: Re: VAC/ Impregnation of reelseats. Sorry guys, didn't mean to put the suck ass fishing trip on the list...= internet.com ;= Subject: Re: VAC/ Impregnation of reelseats. got back in the shop and caught up until about 2:30 then drove down to=broken bow and caught a few stockers... sucky day really, but at least at=Broken Bow they have a stretch that generation doesn't shut down the= the=Bobster... too much work! From: RandallGregory= Subject: VAC/ Impregnation of reelseats. Happy Easter everyone. What a Beautiful day!!! Just wanted tocelebrate=a victory of mine. Over the last month I have been slowly acquiring all the=parts for a large impregnation system another list member shared withme.=It holds about 5 gallons. I just gave it a trial run yesterday. Opened it= saturated fillers. I didn't even turn them down any. Just put about 75=blanks in, fired up the system, and waited (impatiently) until today to=check the results. I even cut some into pcs to check the saturation. Each= drive by and look into my shop. They will think that I have fired up a=moonshine still! Anyway, Just wanted to share this with the list and to=send a HUGE thank you to the list member that willingly shared the idea=with me. To that person.I have some free burl going out in the mail to you= way, I=still have plenty of burl available if anyone has a need for any.(email=offlist) from cfreaner@hq.nasa.gov Tue Apr 2 07:01:55 2002 g32D1t415065 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 07:01:55 -0600 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 08:01:32 -0500 Subject: NASA Photos Sorry about the bandwidth, but I thought some of you might be interested in this. http://grin.hq.nasa.gov/ "GRIN is a collection of over one thousand images of significant historical interest scanned at high-resolution in several sizes. This collection is intended for the media, publishers, and the general public looking Office." from saltwein@worldnet.att.net Tue Apr 2 07:35:00 2002 g32DYx415847 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 07:34:59 -0600 Subject: Varnish cracking at ferrules Hello All, I just did a search in the archives on this problem and to my surprise =there are only about five post. Is there a definitive answer for this =fractures in the varnish at the ferrule? How do the rest of you handle =this problem? Do you just explain that cane rods will fracture in the =varnish wraps with use? I have seen a lot of rods from old time makers, many big names among =them with these casting fractures. I would like to see a discussion on =this and see how the rest of you are handling this or if you even have a =problem. Regards, SteveIndependence, MO Hello All, I just did a search in the archives on = and to my surprise there are only about five post. Is there a definitive = this problem? Do you just explain that cane rods will fracture in the = wraps with use? I have seen a lot of rods from old time= many big names among them with these casting fractures. I would like to = discussion on this and see how the rest of you are handling this or if = have a problem. Regards, SteveIndependence, =MO from jojo@ipa.net Tue Apr 2 08:24:01 2002 g32EO0417306 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 08:24:00 -0600 helo=default) id 16sPCZ-0004G7-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Tue, 02 Apr 2002 09:23:59 -0500 Subject: Re: Ferrule Polishing Mandrels I bought some rod at the local hardware store, cut off pieces from it, thenturned them in colletsto the correct size for holding the ferrules. I can use these to thin theferrule tabs or to polishthe ferrules while turning in the lathe, or I can use them out of the lathe togive me somethingmore to hold on to whilst polishing on my buffing machine. The rod is veryinexpensive, comes inthree feet lengths, and available in a variety of sizes by sixteenths. extensiveness of the polishing, allapplied with multiple sewn cotton wheels stacked against each other to givesome width. M-D My search of the archives failed to come up with much in the way of a design on a lathe to polish NS ferrules, or a discription of the polishing process andmaterialsrecommended. Can some of you'se guys help me out on these 2 problems? from jojo@ipa.net Tue Apr 2 08:57:30 2002 g32EvT419037 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 08:57:29 -0600 helo=default) id 16sPiq-0002Dw-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Tue, 02 Apr 2002 09:57:21 -0500 Subject: Re: Ferrule Polishing Mandrels I have an independent motor I use to turn the buffing wheels. When I polishsomething in the lathe,it is only to bring up the luster of an already highly polished part. Then I use apiece ofpolishing cloth, like from REC, held against the turning part on the mandrel inthe lathe. M-D What are you using to turn the sewn stacked cotton wheels? Do you chuckthem into the lathe andhandhold the ferrule, or do you leave the ferrule chucked in the lathe and usesomething like a Dremeltoolto do the polish? Or...? Jojo DeLancier wrote: extensiveness of the polishing, all applied with multiple sewn cotton wheels stacked against each other togive some width. M-D from Harris.James@ev.state.az.us Tue Apr 2 10:20:27 2002 g32GKQ425453 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 10:20:26 -0600 g32GGQH09978 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 09:16:26 -0700 09:18:26 2002 -0700 with Novell_GroupWise; Tue, 02 Apr 2002 09:20:20 -0700 Subject: Re: April Fools Story g32GKR425454 It's provably a good thing our shops are across the country from each other. I've noticed my neighbors walk faster in front of my garage. If Bob lived near falling over on me, but Nunley,s got me beat in the varnish wearingdepartment. JimH "John Long" 04/01/02 08:09PM >>> Jim,Do you live near Nunley? Maybe its something in the water... john ü from tausfeld@frontiernet.net Tue Apr 2 10:43:15 2002 g32GhE427128 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 10:43:14 -0600 sender ) Subject: Re: Ferrule Polishing Mandrels I used brass rod, turned down to fit snugly in the ferrule. I use =sandpaper soaked with oil, grit - 220 down to 2000. Then polish with = Actually, I do this in my drill press. Mainly because its in the warm =basement not in the cold garage where my lathe lives. tom Subject: Ferrule Polishing Mandrels My search of the archives failed to come up with much in the way of a =design for a mandrel for use on a lathe to polish NS ferrules, or a =discription of the polishing process and materials recommended. Can some =of you'se guys help me out on these 2 problems? -------------------------------------------------------------------------=-----Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: Click Here Don, I used brass rod, turned down to fit snugly in the = warm basement not in the cold garage where my lathe lives. tom ----- Original Message ----- Greife Sent: Monday, April 01, 2002 = PMSubject: Ferrule Polishing =Mandrels My search of the archives failed to come up with much in the way = discription of the polishing process and materials recommended. Can = you'se guys help me out on these 2 problems? Here from pabix@aol.com Tue Apr 2 11:18:31 2002 g32HIU429514 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 11:18:31 -0600 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 12:18:10 -0500 Subject: Fly lines I notice that many of the tapers call for DT lines. Is there a particular reason for this? To date (in the world of plastic) my arsenal consists solely of WF lines. Is there much of a performance difference between the two? Is there a particular brand most like? Currently,I've been using Orvis wonderlines and some Cortlands. Thanks to all for the response to my previous new guy questions. I will give the new rods a shot as soon as I can. in the meantime I will be shopping for magnifiers. from SBDunn@aol.com Tue Apr 2 11:29:13 2002 g32HTD400283 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 11:29:13 -0600 Subject: Planing Form Design Defects First, just for my own peace of mind, let me say that this Reed Wacker/FAOL stuff is getting far more attention than it is worth. Regarding the supposed defect in the design of planing forms that does not allow adjustment between stations, there is a very simple solution. Simply adjust the stations that border the location in question until that location is set the way you want it, then use feeler gauges to shim the forms open at that spot, place a clamp on the form at that spot and then set the regular stations. This would be a hassle if you needed to set every inch, but for an occasional odd setting, I suspect it would work fine. Regards, Steve. from dongreife@hotmail.com Tue Apr 2 11:44:39 2002 g32Hic401387 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 11:44:38 -0600 Tue, 2 Apr 2002 09:44:33 -0800 HTTP; Tue, 02 Apr 2002 17:44:33 GMT Subject: THX for the Ferrule Polishing/Manderel Help Guys, nmsg FILETIME=[0C816970:01C1DA6E] Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com. from channer@frontier.net Tue Apr 2 13:15:39 2002 g32JFc406554 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 13:15:39 -0600 Subject: Re: Varnish cracking at ferrules Steve;It seems that that's one of those things that falls into the catagory of"s--t", as in "s--t happens". The only way I know of for sure to stopthis from happening is to use unshouldered ferrules so there is no wrapover them, therefore,no varnish to crack.john Steve Trauthwein wrote: Hello All, I just did a search in the archives on this problem and to my surprisethere are only about five post. Is there a definitive answer for thisfractures in the varnish at the ferrule? How do the rest of you handlethis problem? Do you just explain that cane rods will fracture in thevarnish wraps with use? I have seen a lot of rods from old time makers, many big names amongthem with these casting fractures. I would like to see a discussion onthis and see how the rest of you are handling this or if you even havea problem. Regards, SteveIndependence, MO from atlasc1@earthlink.net Tue Apr 2 14:35:55 2002 g32KZs410853 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 14:35:54 -0600 ([209.179.149.66] helo=computer) id 16sV0S-00036f-00; Tue, 02 Apr 2002 12:35:52 -0800 Subject: Re: Ferrule Polishing Mandrels What holds them into the homemade collet? Lets see a pict. Adam----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Ferrule Polishing Mandrels I bought some rod at the local hardware store, cut off pieces from it, then turned them in collets to the correct size for holding the ferrules. I can use these to thin the ferrule tabs or to polish the ferrules while turning in the lathe, or I can use them out of the lathe to give me something more to hold on to whilst polishing on my buffing machine. The rod is very inexpensive, comes in three feet lengths, and available in a variety of sizes by sixteenths. extensiveness of the polishing, all applied with multiple sewn cotton wheels stacked against each other to give some width. M-D From: Don Greife My search of the archives failed to come up with much in the way of a design for a mandrel for use on a lathe to polish NS ferrules, or a discription of the polishing process and materials recommended. Can some of you'se guys help me out on these 2 problems? from atlasc1@earthlink.net Tue Apr 2 14:38:52 2002 g32Kcq411177 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 14:38:52 -0600 ([209.179.149.66] helo=computer) id 16sV3G-0007G9-00; Tue, 02 Apr 2002 12:38:46 -0800 Subject: Re: Ferrule Polishing Mandrels Tom, In the powerfibers article I see you are holding the ferrule in some =fixture while slitting the tabs. What is it? Do I buy it or make it. =Your article inspired me and I am getting my gear together to make some =ferrules. Adam Subject: Re: Ferrule Polishing Mandrels I used brass rod, turned down to fit snugly in the ferrule. I use =sandpaper soaked with oil, grit - 220 down to 2000. Then polish with 3m = Actually, I do this in my drill press. Mainly because its in the warm =basement not in the cold garage where my lathe lives. tom Subject: Ferrule Polishing Mandrels My search of the archives failed to come up with much in the way of =a design for a mandrel for use on a lathe to polish NS ferrules, or a =discription of the polishing process and materials recommended. Can some =of you'se guys help me out on these 2 problems? -------------------------------------------------------------------------=---Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: Click Here Tom, In the powerfibers article I see you = the ferrule in some fixture while slitting the tabs. What is it? Do I = make it. Your article inspired me and I am getting my gear together to = ferrules. Adam ----- Original Message ----- and Tom Ausfeld rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= Sent: Tuesday, April 02, 2002 = AM Mandrels Don, I used brass rod, turned down to fit snugly in the = the warm basement not in the cold garage where my lathe lives. tom ----- Original Message ----- Greife Sent: Monday, April 01, 2002 = PM Mandrels My search of the archives failed to come up with much in the = discription of the polishing process and materials recommended. Can = you'se guys help me out on these 2 problems? Here from petermckean@netspace.net.au Tue Apr 2 16:31:23 2002 g32MVK417559 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 16:31:21 -0600 g32MVGP47951 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 08:31:17 Subject: Tung Oil finishes Just a comment here; the constitution in Australia of what purport to be"Tung oil varnishes" may in fact contain NO tung oil at all, or preciouslittle. Using these on a rod confers no benefit at all, and are in fact agreat step backwards, as they tend to fall as a group into the "Indoorpolyurethane" group. In finishing my current rod, I was looking to duplicate the rich, deep lookof an oiled gunstock. What in fact I have done is to apply a base consisting of several coats ofspar, sanded off viciously; followed by many coats of hand rubbed pure tungoil, polished off after 15 minutes or so. The result is beautiful, and will, I hope, be durable. Peter from Grhghlndr@aol.com Tue Apr 2 16:42:20 2002 g32MgJ418238 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 16:42:20 -0600 Subject: two butts rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu I seem to remember that at one time someone had a taper for a rod that had two butts and two tips for making a rod with different actions. If this is true does anyone remember that taper and if this is not true must be oldage creeping up on my memory.Bret http://bretsovens.bravepages.com/ I seem to rememberthat at one time someone had a taper for a rod that had two butts and two anyone remember that taper and if this is not true must be old age creepingup on my memory.Bret http://bretsovens.bravepages.com/ from JNL123141@msn.com Tue Apr 2 16:56:15 2002 g32MuE418987 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 16:56:14 -0600 Tue, 2 Apr 2002 14:56:09 -0800 "Rodmakers discussion group" Subject: Re: Varnish cracking at ferrules FILETIME=[94091840:01C1DA99] Steve,The cracking is due to a concentration of forces where the ferrule meets =the cane. The only two ways I know of to eliminate it is to sand down th=e ferrule tabs until they are to a foil thickness at the edges or sand th=em at the slits and make them "saw-toothed." ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Varnish cracking at ferrules Hello All, I just did a search in the archives on this problem and to my surprise th=ere are only about five post. Is there a definitive answer for this fract=ures in the varnish at the ferrule? How do the rest of you handle this pr=oblem? Do you just explain that cane rods will fracture in the varnish wr=aps with use? I have seen a lot of rods from old time makers, many big names amongthem=with these casting fractures. I would like to see a discussion on this a=nd see how the rest of you are handling this or if you even have a proble=m. Regards, SteveIndependence, MO Steve, The cracking is due to= s until they are to a foil thickness at the edges or sand them at the sli= &n=bsp; =Hello All, rise there are only about five post. Is there a definitive answer for thi=s fractures in the varnish at the ferrule? How do the rest of you handle =this problem? Do you just explain that cane rods will fracture in the var= = from old time makers, many big names among them with these castingfractu=res. I would like to see a discussion on this and see how the rest of you=are handling this or if you even have a problem. ce, MO from goodaple@cox-internet.com Tue Apr 2 17:12:19 2002 g32NCJ419881 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 17:12:19 -0600 (InterMail vK.4.03.05.03 201-232-132-103 license180e1de7f543f89455b24e508f9cca39) Subject: Re: Tung Oil finishes Good for you Peter!! Glad to hear that it turned out well. I'm sure with thelove that you put into the finish that it will do fine. Congrats. Randall R.Gregory NW AR.----- Original Message ----- Subject: Tung Oil finishes Just a comment here; the constitution in Australia of what purport to be"Tung oil varnishes" may in fact contain NO tung oil at all, or preciouslittle. Using these on a rod confers no benefit at all, and are in fact agreat step backwards, as they tend to fall as a group into the "Indoorpolyurethane" group. In finishing my current rod, I was looking to duplicate the rich, deep look of an oiled gunstock. What in fact I have done is to apply a base consisting of several coats ofspar, sanded off viciously; followed by many coats of hand rubbed pure tung oil, polished off after 15 minutes or so. The result is beautiful, and will, I hope, be durable. Peter from rvenneri@ulster.net Tue Apr 2 17:44:01 2002 g32Ni0421000 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 17:44:00 -0600 Organization: Venneri's Custom Components Subject: moisture content Hi Guys,I heve been working on a couple rods. They are varnished and ready towrap. I noticed that if I bend the blank it will stay bent a little whatI let it go. I have never seen this with a finished rod. Did I dosomething wrong? I think the blanks have taken in some moisture but I amnot sure. If this is the case can I fix the problem or should I juststake my tomatoes with the 2 blanks. Best RegardsBob V from goodaple@cox-internet.com Tue Apr 2 17:50:35 2002 internet.com [208.180.118.48] (may be forged)) g32NoZ421500 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 17:50:35 -0600 (InterMail vK.4.03.05.00 201-232-132 license180e1de7f543f89455b24e508f9cca39) Subject: Re: moisture content Robert,Can the sections be re straightened? If so, why not put the blanks ina long pvc tube full of silica gel and let them sit for about a week. Thatought to help remove any moisture without having to resort to reheatingmethods. Or you could wait till summer and lay the blank in the back windowof your car. Talk about slowly heat treating!!! Good luck, Randall R.Gregory NW AR.----- Original Message ----- Subject: moisture content Hi Guys,I heve been working on a couple rods. They are varnished and ready towrap. I noticed that if I bend the blank it will stay bent a little whatI let it go. I have never seen this with a finished rod. Did I dosomething wrong? I think the blanks have taken in some moisture but I amnot sure. If this is the case can I fix the problem or should I juststake my tomatoes with the 2 blanks. Best RegardsBob V from goodaple@cox-internet.com Tue Apr 2 17:52:28 2002 internet.com [208.180.118.48] (may be forged)) g32NqR421735 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 17:52:27 -0600 (InterMail vK.4.03.05.00 201-232-132 license180e1de7f543f89455b24e508f9cca39) Subject: Re: moisture content Forgot to ask what type of glue was used and how was it cured. How long of atime frame since glue-up? Randall----- Original Message ----- Subject: moisture content Hi Guys,I heve been working on a couple rods. They are varnished and ready towrap. I noticed that if I bend the blank it will stay bent a little whatI let it go. I have never seen this with a finished rod. Did I dosomething wrong? I think the blanks have taken in some moisture but I amnot sure. If this is the case can I fix the problem or should I juststake my tomatoes with the 2 blanks. Best RegardsBob V from rmoon@ida.net Tue Apr 2 18:21:40 2002 g330Ld423959 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 18:21:39 -0600 rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Re: two butts --------------0AA3C65D6DF91F328961B895 Bret Walton Powell made such a rod, but I don't know the taper. Ralph Grhghlndr@aol.com wrote: I seem to remember that at one time someone had a taper for a rod thathad two butts and two tips for making a rod with different actions.If this is true does anyone remember that taper and if this is nottrue must be old age creeping up on my memory.Bret http://bretsovens.bravepages.com/ --http://www.ida.net/users/rmoon --------------0AA3C65D6DF91F328961B895 RalphGrhghlndr@aol.com wrote:I seemto remember that at one time someone had a taper for a rod that had two is true does anyone remember that taper and if this is not true must beold age creeping up on my memory.Brethttp://bretsovens.bravepages.com/ --http://www.ida.net/users/rmoon --------------0AA3C65D6DF91F328961B895-- from rmoon@ida.net Tue Apr 2 18:26:34 2002 g330QX424899 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 18:26:33 -0600 Subject: Re: moisture content Bob, Just my unsupported personal opinion, but I would be inclined thoughthink that the blank was not sufficiently heat treated, and there is nothingthat can be done. Heat Treating does cause a definite change in thestructure of the cane, and if properly done, would eliminate your problem.If any take me to task and ask for proof, I don't have any other than my ownobservation,. I think you will just have to eat this one and try again. Ralph Robert Venneri wrote: Hi Guys,I heve been working on a couple rods. They are varnished and ready towrap. I noticed that if I bend the blank it will stay bent a little whatI let it go. I have never seen this with a finished rod. Did I dosomething wrong? I think the blanks have taken in some moisture but I amnot sure. If this is the case can I fix the problem or should I juststake my tomatoes with the 2 blanks. Best RegardsBob V --http://www.ida.net/users/rmoon from rmoon@ida.net Tue Apr 2 18:30:15 2002 g330UE425339 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 18:30:15 -0600 rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Re: two butts --------------12CAB7C53662AF95F08871DD As I recall it was called the Golden Signature rod Ralph "Ralph W. Moon" wrote: Bret Walton Powell made such a rod, but I don't know the taper. Ralph Grhghlndr@aol.com wrote: I seem to remember that at one time someone had a taper for a rodthat had two butts and two tips for making a rod with differentactions. If this is true does anyone remember that taper and ifthis is not true must be old age creeping up on my memory.Bret http://bretsovens.bravepages.com/ --http://www.ida.net/users/rmoon --http://www.ida.net/users/rmoon --------------12CAB7C53662AF95F08871DD As I recall it was called the Golden Signature rodRalph"Ralph W. Moon" wrote: don'tknow the taper.RalphGrhghlndr@aol.com wrote:I seemto remember that at one time someone had a taper for a rod that had two is true does anyone remember that taper and if this is not true must beold age creeping up on my memory.Brethttp://bretsovens.bravepages.com/-- http://www.ida.net/users/rmoon --http://www.ida.net/users/rmoon --------------12CAB7C53662AF95F08871DD-- from cathcreek@hotmail.com Tue Apr 2 18:50:47 2002 g330ok428151 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 18:50:46 -0600 Tue, 2 Apr 2002 16:50:41 -0800 Wed, 03 Apr 2002 00:50:41 GMT Subject: Re: moisture content FILETIME=[94401380:01C1DAA9] Bob, Ralph, could he put it in an oven at a low temp for an extended period to see if that would pull any moisture? I haven't tried it, but I think I have seen others on the list who have. Rob From: "Ralph W. Moon" CC: rodmakers Subject: Re: moisture contentDate: Tue, 02 Apr 2002 17:26:29 -0700 Bob, Just my unsupported personal opinion, but I would be inclined thoughthink that the blank was not sufficiently heat treated, and there is nothingthat can be done. Heat Treating does cause a definite change in thestructure of the cane, and if properly done, would eliminate your problem.If any take me to task and ask for proof, I don't have any other than my ownobservation,. I think you will just have to eat this one and try again. Ralph Robert Venneri wrote: Hi Guys,I heve been working on a couple rods. They are varnished and ready towrap. I noticed that if I bend the blank it will stay bent a little whatI let it go. I have never seen this with a finished rod. Did I dosomething wrong? I think the blanks have taken in some moisture but Iamnot sure. If this is the case can I fix the problem or should I juststake my tomatoes with the 2 blanks. Best RegardsBob V --http://www.ida.net/users/rmoon _________________________________________________________________MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx from dnorl@qwest.net Tue Apr 2 18:58:08 2002 g330w7429236 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 18:58:07 -0600 (63.228.45.29) "Rodmakers discussion group" Subject: Re: Varnish cracking at ferrules Tell them will you Darrell?-----Original Message-----From: John Long discussion group Subject: Re: Varnish cracking at ferrules Steve,The cracking is due to a concentration of forces where the ferrule =meets the cane. The only two ways I know of to eliminate it is to sand =down the ferrule tabs until they are to a foil thickness at the edges or =sand them at the slits and make them "saw-toothed." ----- Original Message -----From: Steve TrauthweinSent: Tuesday, April 02, 2002 8:37 AM Subject: Varnish cracking at ferrules Hello All, I just did a search in the archives on this problem and to my =surprise there are only about five post. Is there a definitive answer = handle this problem? Do you just explain that cane rods will fracture in =the varnish wraps with use? I have seen a lot of rods from old time makers, many big names =among them with these casting fractures. I would like to see a =discussion on this and see how the rest of you are handling this or if =you even have a problem. Regards, SteveIndependence, MO Tell them will you =Darrell? -----Original = saltwein@worldnet.att.net=<saltwein@worldnet.att.net&g= Tuesday, April 02, 2002 4:56 PMSubject: Re: Varnish = at ferrulesSteve,The cracking is due to a concentration of forces where the = or sand them at the slits and make them ="saw-toothed." ----- Original Message =----- Steve TrauthweinSent: Tuesday, April 02, = AM groupSubject: Varnish cracking = ferrules Hello All, I just did a search in the = problem and to my surprise there are only about five post. Is = definitive answer for this fractures in the varnish at the = do the rest of you handle this problem? Do you just explain that = rods will fracture in the varnish wraps with use? I have seen a lot of rods from = makers, many big names among them with these casting fractures. = like to see a discussion on this and see how the rest of you are = handling this or if you even have a problem. Regards, Steve MO from jojo@ipa.net Tue Apr 2 19:02:04 2002 g33123429983 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 19:02:03 -0600 helo=default) id 16sZ9v-0006Ik-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Tue, 02 Apr 2002 20:01:56 -0500 Subject: Re: Ferrule Polishing Mandrels The collets are lathe collets that grip the rod for the turning. Collets tend tobe more accuratethan a chuck. The ferrules are a friction fit on the mandrels. I turn then sothat they are a verysnug fit. No pictures. Just imagine a .250 rod turned down to .1875 forapprox. 1.25". M-D What holds them into the homemade collet? Lets see a pict. Adam I bought some rod at the local hardware store, cut off pieces from it, then turned them in collets to the correct size for holding the ferrules.M-D From: Don Greife My search of the archives failed to come up with much in the way of a design for a mandrel for use on a lathe to polish NS ferrules, or a discription of the polishing process and materials recommended. Can some of you'se guys help me out on these 2 problems? from rmoon@ida.net Tue Apr 2 19:09:23 2002 g3319M401353 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 19:09:22 -0600 Subject: Re: moisture content Rob, I don't know the adhesive he used, but I would not think that that wouldbe feasible. Most epoxies let go a slightly over 200 degrees, and if theproperheat treatment as Bob has pointed out is more like 350, I would expectdelamination. However, it does not hurt to try, since Bob now has a few ofthemost expensive tomato stakes in the Northern Hemisphere. What does hehave tolose?Ralph Robert Clarke wrote: Bob, Ralph, could he put it in an oven at a low temp for an extended periodto see if that would pull any moisture? I haven't tried it, but I think Ihave seen others on the list who have. Rob From: "Ralph W. Moon" CC: rodmakers Subject: Re: moisture contentDate: Tue, 02 Apr 2002 17:26:29 -0700 Bob, Just my unsupported personal opinion, but I would be inclined thoughthink that the blank was not sufficiently heat treated, and there isnothingthat can be done. Heat Treating does cause a definite change in thestructure of the cane, and if properly done, would eliminate your problem.If any take me to task and ask for proof, I don't have any other than myownobservation,. I think you will just have to eat this one and try again. Ralph Robert Venneri wrote: Hi Guys,I heve been working on a couple rods. They are varnished and ready towrap. I noticed that if I bend the blank it will stay bent a little whatI let it go. I have never seen this with a finished rod. Did I dosomething wrong? I think the blanks have taken in some moisture but Iamnot sure. If this is the case can I fix the problem or should I juststake my tomatoes with the 2 blanks. Best RegardsBob V --http://www.ida.net/users/rmoon _________________________________________________________________MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos:http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx --http://www.ida.net/users/rmoon from jsschaeffer@hotmail.com Tue Apr 2 19:13:52 2002 g331Dp401883 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 19:13:52 -0600 Tue, 2 Apr 2002 17:13:46 -0800 Subject: Re: moisture content FILETIME=[CDCD2BD0:01C1DAAC] I agree that you probably did not give them enough heat. I have two rodsthat had the same problem.They fish beautifully, and just take a bit of a set now and then. Jeff Schaeffer from Grhghlndr@aol.com Tue Apr 2 19:20:16 2002 g331KF403007 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 19:20:15 -0600 Subject: Re: moisture content You can always do what I did too if it doesn't work out. I was working on a 5'3" I-PC rod today and one of the strips delaminated on it and broke. I broke it into little pieces and put it in the fireplace and sat and watched it burn. http://bretsovens.bravepages.com/ You can always do what I pieces and put it in the fireplace and sat and watched it burn. http://bretsovens.bravepages.com/ from ChristopherO@epicimaging.com Tue Apr 2 19:22:37 2002 g331Ma403638 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 19:22:36 -0600 id ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 17:17:24 -0800 Subject: RE: moisture content this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. Heat the rod. If it delaminates, so what; clean it up and re-glue it.It's worth a try, you can always just scrap it later. Just a thought. Chris. CleanCleanDocumentEmail MicrosoftInternetExplorer4 table.MsoNormalTable {mso-style-name:"Table Normal"; mso-tstyle- rowband-size:0; mso-tstyle-colband-size:0; mso-style-noshow:yes; mso- style-parent:""; mso-padding-alt:0in 5.4pt 0in 5.4pt; mso-para- margin:0in; mso-para-margin-bottom:.0001pt; mso-pagination:widow- orphan; font-size:10.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman";} Heat the rod.=A0 If it delaminates, so what; clean =it up andre-glue it. It's worth a try,you can always just scrap it later. Just a =thought. Chris. from jsschaeffer@hotmail.com Tue Apr 2 19:27:38 2002 g331Rc404682 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 19:27:38 -0600 Tue, 2 Apr 2002 17:27:28 -0800 Subject: Re: winner of the rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest FILETIME=[B7D10CA0:01C1DAAE] And the winner is ... I declare a tie! Brian Creek for the "bomb in the basement story". Major bonus points =because it sounded EXACTLY like something I would do. Larry Blan for the "attack of the black lab". The thought of that dog =prancing around with a tip in his mouth made me laugh until I cried. A special lifetime achievement award to Bob Nunley for "impregnation =tank explosion". Actually if this had happened to anyone else it would =have been scary, but we who know Bob, well, you just have to know Bob. Brian and Larry, send me your snail mail address for a reel seat.Bob, bring a powerful thirst to the Grayrock picnic.Todd and I are putting together 4/1 contest entries for the tips page, =perhaps listing it under the category "anti-tips". Jeff Schaeffer And the winner is ... I declare a tie! Brian Creek for the "bomb in the = do. Larry Blan for the "attack of the black= thought of that dog prancing around with a tip in his mouth made me = I cried. A special lifetime achievement award to= it would have been scary, but we who know Bob, well, you just have to = Bob. Brian and Larry, send me your snail = Bob, bring a powerful thirst to the = picnic.Todd and I are putting = "anti-tips". Thanks to all those who participated. = Jeff =Schaeffer from jojo@ipa.net Tue Apr 2 19:33:24 2002 g331XN405664 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 19:33:23 -0600 helo=default) id 16sZeK-0007hu-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Tue, 02 Apr 2002 20:33:21 -0500 Subject: Re: winner of the rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest Congratulations to Brian, Larry, and Bob!I like the "Anti-Tips" idea, Jeff. M-D And the winner is ... I declare a tie! Brian Creek for the "bomb in the basement story". Major bonus points =because it sounded EXACTLY like something I would do. Larry Blan for the "attack of the black lab". The thought of that dog =prancing around with a tip in his mouth made me laugh until I cried. A special lifetime achievement award to Bob Nunley for "impregnation =tank explosion". Actually if this had happened to anyone else it would =have been scary, but we who know Bob, well, you just have to know Bob. Brian and Larry, send me your snail mail address for a reel seat.Bob, bring a powerful thirst to the Grayrock picnic.Todd and I are putting together 4/1 contest entries for the tips page, =perhaps listing it under the category "anti-tips". Jeff Schaeffer Congratulations toBrian, = Bob!I like the "Anti-Tips" = Jeff. M-D Schaeffer And the winner is ... I declare a tie! Brian Creek for the "bomb in the = do. Larry Blan for the "attack of the = thought of that dog prancing around with a tip in his mouth made me = until I cried. A special lifetime achievement award = Nunley for "impregnation tank explosion". Actually if this had = anyone else it would have been scary, but we who know Bob, well, you = to know Bob. Brian and Larry, send me your snail = Bob, bring a powerful thirst to the = picnic.Todd and I are putting = "anti-tips". Thanks to all those who participated. = Schaeffer from lblan@provide.net Tue Apr 2 19:50:26 2002 g331oQ407907 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 19:50:26 -0600 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 20:50:23 -0500 Subject: RE: winner of the rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest Wow, imagine being in such stellar company. Ahem, one fine point. At *no*time did that dog prance. It did a straight back retrieve, albeit a bithard- mouthed.Larry Blan -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Tuesday, April 02, 2002 8:29 PM Subject: Re: winner of the rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest Congratulations to Brian, Larry, and Bob!I like the "Anti-Tips" idea, Jeff. M-D From: Jeff Schaeffer And the winner is ... I declare a tie! Brian Creek for the "bomb in the basement story". Major bonus pointsbecause it sounded EXACTLY like something I would do. Larry Blan for the "attack of the black lab". The thought of that dogprancing around with a tip in his mouth made me laugh until I cried. A special lifetime achievement award to Bob Nunley for "impregnationtank explosion". Actually if this had happened to anyone else it would havebeen scary, but we who know Bob, well, you just have to know Bob. Brian and Larry, send me your snail mail address for a reel seat.Bob, bring a powerful thirst to the Grayrock picnic.Todd and I are putting together 4/1 contest entries for the tips page,perhaps listing it under the category "anti- tips". Thanks to all those who participated. Jeff Schaeffer imagine being in such stellar company. Ahem, one fine point. At *no* = hard-mouthed.Larry Blan DeLancierSent: Tuesday, April 02, 2002 8:29 = Rodmakers discussion groupSubject: Re: winner of the = April Fool's Day ContestCongratulations to = and Bob!I like the "Anti-Tips" = Jeff. M-D Schaeffer And the winner is ... I declare a tie! Brian Creek for the "bomb in the = would do. Larry Blan for the "attack of the = The thought of that dog prancing around with a tip in his mouth made = laugh until I cried. A special lifetime achievement = Nunley for "impregnation tank explosion". Actually if this had = anyone else it would have been scary, but we who know Bob, well, you = have to know Bob. Brian and Larry, send me your snail = address for a reel seat.Bob, bring a powerful thirst to the = picnic.Todd and I are putting = contest entries for the tips page, perhaps listing it under the = "anti-tips". Thanks to all those who = Schaeffer from oakmere@carol.net Tue Apr 2 20:00:20 2002 g3320K409817 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 20:00:20 -0600 g3320DT07411 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 21:00:13 -0500 Subject: RE: Varnish Cracking at Ferrules Steve and others: I have had that problem in the past, but I now place a short underwrap atthe ferrule edge before doing the final winding if it must cover theferrule edge. This has seemed to work in several cases. Best, FrankFrank Paul, "GreyFox"TroutBeck Fly and RodBamboo Rod Refinishing and Restoration;Graphite and Glass Rod Repair;Trout Flies, Seneca, SC Summer Residence: Troutbeck Cottage, Waterville, PA; 570-753- 8121fwpaul@ces.clemson.edu (work), Clemson University; 864-656- 7471oakmere@carol.net (home), South Carolina; 864-882-0077 from BambooRods@aol.com Tue Apr 2 20:07:37 2002 g3327a411324 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 20:07:36 -0600 Subject: Re: two butts rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu I believe Wayne has a taper for a 3/5 weight combination and for a 2/4weight combination. They are 1 butt, two mids and two tips. That's right a seven piece. I made the 4 weight side for Jimmy Acord last year.Doug Hall from BambooRods@aol.com Tue Apr 2 20:11:37 2002 g332Ba411844 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 20:11:36 -0600 Subject: Re: two butts rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sorry about my math... It is four tips... that makes seven pieces.Doug from avyoung@iinet.net.au Tue Apr 2 20:12:43 2002 g332Cf412049 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 20:12:41 -0600 Subject: Re: winner of the rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest I realize no arguments to the umpire will be entered into but I rather think the "War Of The Worlds" graphite vs bamboo fencing story was worth something. Tony At 08:32 PM 4/2/02 -0500, Jeff Schaeffer wrote: And the winner is ... I declare a tie! Brian Creek for the "bomb in the basement story". Major bonus points because it sounded EXACTLY like something I would do. Larry Blan for the "attack of the black lab". The thought of that dog prancing around with a tip in his mouth made me laugh until I cried. A special lifetime achievement award to Bob Nunley for "impregnation tank explosion". Actually if this had happened to anyone else it would have been scary, but we who know Bob, well, you just have to know Bob. Brian and Larry, send me your snail mail address for a reel seat.Bob, bring a powerful thirst to the Grayrock picnic.Todd and I are putting together 4/1 contest entries for the tips page, perhaps listing it under the category "anti- tips". Thanks to all those who participated. Jeff Schaeffer /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from harms1@pa.net Tue Apr 2 20:15:44 2002 g332Fh412386 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 20:15:43 -0600 Subject: Re: moisture content Bob, I had this same thing happen to me a couple times several years back, andone of my friends was puzzled when it happened to one of his rods just lastsummer. I cannot know for certain in the case of your rod, but I believethe problem is an inherently weak spot in the cane itself. You can try todry the sections with the oven, as others have suggested, but I'm doubtfulthat this will solve the problem. The problem MAY be that the cane has become sodden, in which case, dryingitcould help. If so, you would not need more than 200 degrees for a couplehours (since actual heat-curing 350+ degrees is not what's called for). ButI suspect this is not the problem. Instead, I think that the culm you usedhad a weak spot in it that you just didn't notice. This can happen, andmost builders I know do not check for it. What I always do now is to test a couple strips just after splitting out theentire culm. Place each hand just beyond a node and bend the inter- nodalarea somewhat severely. Look at the shape of the arc to see that it issmoothly distributed between the two nodes. Then release quickly to see ifthe cane snaps back to its original line. If the internodal-area you justbent is good, it will snap back like steel (though a little residual arcwill remain). Move your hands down to span the next set of nodes and give the strip thesame test. Do this between each set of nodes on at least a two strips taken from opposite sides of the culm. You will not often find a weak area in aculm, but it DOES happen--even in the very finest looking cane. If youshould hit a bad area, you will see (and feel) at once how differently thecane responds to the "bend and relaease" test. The bending will feel like"mush" and the resulting arc will show exactly where that weak spot is.When you release, most of the internodal-area will straighten out except forthat mushy spot. I think that's what you have now, built into the rod youdescribed. If you find one such weak area in a test strip, you will find that theentire culm is affected similarly at that same location--even though all theother inter-nodal areas may be perfectly strong. I don't know what causesthis problem (it's a localized aberation in the fiber structure), but I donot beleive there is anything than can be done to salvage a culm that has aweak area other than to think about building nodeless (cutting out anddiscarding the weak area). Best of luck withj the rod, Bob. Cheers, Bill ----- Original Message ----- Subject: moisture content Hi Guys,I heve been working on a couple rods. They are varnished and ready towrap. I noticed that if I bend the blank it will stay bent a little whatI let it go. I have never seen this with a finished rod. Did I dosomething wrong? I think the blanks have taken in some moisture but I amnot sure. If this is the case can I fix the problem or should I juststake my tomatoes with the 2 blanks. Best RegardsBob V from lblan@provide.net Tue Apr 2 20:31:13 2002 g332VC413040 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 20:31:12 -0600 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 21:31:11 -0500 Subject: RE: winner of the rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest Good point Tony. That one was ugly though. Perhaps he qualifies forhazardous duty pay? Larry Blan -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Tuesday, April 02, 2002 9:20 PM RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.eduSubject: Re: winner of the rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest I realize no arguments to the umpire will be entered into but I ratherthink the "War Of The Worlds" graphite vs bamboo fencing story was worthsomething. Tony At 08:32 PM 4/2/02 -0500, Jeff Schaeffer wrote: And the winner is ... I declare a tie! Brian Creek for the "bomb in the basement story". Major bonus pointsbecause it sounded EXACTLY like something I would do. Larry Blan for the "attack of the black lab". The thought of that dogprancing around with a tip in his mouth made me laugh until I cried. A special lifetime achievement award to Bob Nunley for "impregnation tank explosion". Actually if this had happened to anyone else it would havebeen scary, but we who know Bob, well, you just have to know Bob. Brian and Larry, send me your snail mail address for a reel seat.Bob, bring a powerful thirst to the Grayrock picnic.Todd and I are putting together 4/1 contest entries for the tips page,perhaps listing it under the category "anti- tips". Thanks to all those who participated. Jeff Schaeffer /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from bdcbfr@chartermi.net Tue Apr 2 20:34:16 2002 g332YF413280 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 20:34:15 -0600 Subject: Re: winner of the rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest Hey!! Michigan Builders Rule! (Well, after Nunley) I'd like to thank my agent, my parents, and all the little people that =made this award possible. I will be glad to pitch in to the Beers for =Bob fund in Grayling this June! Brian Subject: Re: winner of the rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest And the winner is ... I declare a tie! Brian Creek for the "bomb in the basement story". Major bonus points =because it sounded EXACTLY like something I would do. Larry Blan for the "attack of the black lab". The thought of that dog =prancing around with a tip in his mouth made me laugh until I cried. A special lifetime achievement award to Bob Nunley for "impregnation =tank explosion". Actually if this had happened to anyone else it would =have been scary, but we who know Bob, well, you just have to know Bob. Brian and Larry, send me your snail mail address for a reel seat.Bob, bring a powerful thirst to the Grayrock picnic.Todd and I are putting together 4/1 contest entries for the tips page, =perhaps listing it under the category "anti-tips". Jeff Schaeffer after Nunley) I'd like to thank my agent, my parents,= the Beers for Bob fund in Grayling this June! Brian ----- Original Message ----- Schaeffer Sent: Tuesday, April 02, 2002 = PMSubject: Re: winner of the = April Fool's Day Contest And the winner is ... I declare a tie! Brian Creek for the "bomb in the = do. Larry Blan for the "attack of the = thought of that dog prancing around with a tip in his mouth made me = until I cried. A special lifetime achievement award = Nunley for "impregnation tank explosion". Actually if this had = anyone else it would have been scary, but we who know Bob, well, you = to know Bob. Brian and Larry, send me your snail = Bob, bring a powerful thirst to the = picnic.Todd and I are putting = "anti-tips". Thanks to all those who participated. = Schaeffer from parataper@hotmail.com Tue Apr 2 21:29:02 2002 g333T1415105 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 21:29:01 -0600 Tue, 2 Apr 2002 19:28:52 -0800 Wed, 03 Apr 2002 03:28:52 GMT FILETIME=[AD5B6020:01C1DABF] I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but there are some stamped superz 13/64 ferrules for sale on ebay and I want everyone to be aware of some moisture welt, only 3 serrations, and one of the 2 I bought was also bent at MPJoin the world's largest e-mailservice with MSN Hotmail. ClickHere from rextutor@yahoo.com Tue Apr 2 22:10:09 2002 g334A8416396 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 22:10:08 -0600 02 Apr 2002 20:10:04 PST Subject: Re: ebay Super Z brass ferrules I tried one of those. He says they are brass in theauction site . The female seperated on me . I guess Igot a real tight fit. I was trying the fit before glueand pulling it back off, real hard, when it seperated.They look good and are accurate. --- mark petrie wrote: Hi I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but thereare some stamped super z 13/64 ferrules for sale onebay and I want everyone to be aware of some problems have no moisture welt, only 3 serrations, and one of They're also kind of loose, but this may be a factor the seller contact me off list. MPJoin the world'slargest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. ClickHere __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTaxhttp://taxes.yahoo.com/ from j.behar@rogers.com Tue Apr 2 22:19:58 2002 g334Jv416827 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 22:19:57 -0600 mail.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com(InterMail vM.5.01.04.06 201-253-122- 122-106-20020109) with User-Agent: Microsoft-Outlook-Express-Macintosh-Edition/5.0.3 Subject: Sharpening Plane Irons mail.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com from [24.103.236.252] using IDat Tue, 2 Apr 2002 23:19:48 -0500 I've been using water stones to sharpen my Hock plane iron for a while.I've noticed that the 1000X stone I'm using has developed a "track" wherethe wheel from my holder for the plane iron runs along the stone. The 4000Xside is fine. I'm thinking of changing my sharpening to wet dry papersrather than water stones. My question is this. How many of you out there have tried this?Are there any benefits/pitfalls I should know about? Joe Beharj.behar@rogers.com There's no point in being grown up if you can't be childish sometimes.-- Doctor Who, in Robot from tedknott@cogeco.ca Tue Apr 2 22:25:22 2002 g334PM417182 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 22:25:22 -0600 Subject: Re: Sharpening Plane Irons I retired all my stones a few years ago. I now use a disk sander with 400grit to periodically true the cutting angle, then use wet/dry papers gluedto glass for the rod -to- rod sharpening, then buff the edge with greencompound on a rotary leather wheel. Works great! from lblan@provide.net Tue Apr 2 22:28:34 2002 g334SX417470 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 22:28:33 -0600 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 23:28:32 -0500 Subject: RE: Sharpening Plane Irons people swear by the SS method. You have to flatten the stones regularlyduring use. The very thing that makes waterstones so effective results inthem wearing in this manner. I've always made a habit of rubbing the stonestogether after use. This seems to keep them nice and flat. Of course, if youonly have one combination stone, this would be rather difficult. You can usethe SS method with coarse paper to flatten the stones too. Larry Blan -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Tuesday, April 02, 2002 11:18 PM Subject: Sharpening Plane Irons I've been using water stones to sharpen my Hock plane iron for a while.I've noticed that the 1000X stone I'm using has developed a "track" wherethe wheel from my holder for the plane iron runs along the stone.The 4000Xside is fine. I'm thinking of changing my sharpening to wet dry papersrather than water stones. My question is this. How many of you out there have tried this?Are there any benefits/pitfalls I should know about? Joe Beharj.behar@rogers.com There's no point in being grown up if you can't be childish sometimes.-- Doctor Who, in Robot from tjtrodmaker@yahoo.com Tue Apr 2 22:45:02 2002 g334j1418125 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 22:45:01 -0600 Tue, 02 Apr 2002 20:45:01 PST Subject: Re: Sharpening Plane Irons now, i straighten the stone on a wheel when needed anduse a leather wheel almost all the time with a whitestick. water stones will cup and they need to beflattened after almost every use. i used dry sandpaperon glass but the wheel on the veritas guide wears downand will wear on the inside around the axis too. iwould replace the wheel but it always whore to oneside or the other and the edge would not be square.after awhile i could no longer straighten it in theplane. i don't like using water or oil or silicon onmy blades as a carrier because i don't want it on mycane. timothy --- Joe Behar wrote: I've been using water stones to sharpen my Hockplane iron for a while.I've noticed that the 1000X stone I'm using hasdeveloped a "track" wherethe wheel from my holder for the plane iron runsalong the stone. The 4000Xside is fine. I'm thinking of changing my sharpeningto wet dry papersrather than water stones. My question is this. How many of you out there have tried this?Are there any benefits/pitfalls I should know about? Joe Beharj.behar@rogers.com There's no point in being grown up if you can't bechildish sometimes.-- Doctor Who, in Robot ====="Gooda' mornin', mister bear!" ...Ride, boldly ride,"The shade replied, -"If you seek for Eldorado!" -- E.A.Poe __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTaxhttp://taxes.yahoo.com/ from TBOWDEN@halcyon.com Tue Apr 2 23:11:05 2002 g335B4418985 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 23:11:04 -0600 for ; Tue, 2 Apr 2002 21:10:58 -0800 Subject: Re: two butts Dawn Holbrook's pamphlet includes a taper for a 9'-9wt with a 2nd short butt section that converts the rod to a 7'9" 8wt. "dry fly rod". A bit heavy by today's standards, even for us Pacific NW guys. But you could probably adjust the taper for smaller lines - e.g. take .010 off for a 9' 7wt and a 7'9" 6wt. Interesting concept. I've been thinking about this & may build one next fall/winter. I think the pamphlet is available on the web somewhere, but if someone wants the taper, let me know. Tom from goodaple@cox-internet.com Wed Apr 3 00:19:39 2002 g336Jd422209 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 00:19:39 -0600 (InterMail vK.4.03.05.03 201-232-132-103 license180e1de7f543f89455b24e508f9cca39) Subject: Sharpening Plane irons. Since no one mentioned this method, I'll throw it in the hat. I use =diamond stones. I went from a sharpening(using waterstones)ordeal to a =much faster process using the double sided DMT stones with the stand. =They do fine for me. Probably don't get the blades as sharp as the =leather wheel method but it's fast and for me I think most lift issues =were solved by changing my blade angles. Rarely lift any nodes any more. =Knock on wood. Just a thought. . Also, I use a double bevel on the edge =of my blades. By the way to flatten your stones, I would lay out a piece =of wet sand paper and work your stone over the surface in a circular =motion until it flattens out(wet it occasionally). To determine if it's =flat yet, wet the stone until saturated. You should be able to tell =pretty easily if is flattened. Like the other list members said , use a =very flat(glass) surface to lay out your sandpaper. Good luck, Randall =R. Gregory NW AR. waterstones)ordeal to a much faster process using the double sided DMT = with the stand. They do fine for me. Probably don't get the blades as = the leather wheel method but it's fast and for me I think most lift = solved by changing my blade angles. Rarely lift any nodes any more. = wood. Just a thought. . Also, I use a double bevel on the edge of my = the way to flatten your stones, I would lay out a piece of wet sand = stone until saturated. You should be able to tell pretty easily if is = Like the other list members said , use a very flat(glass) surface to lay = your sandpaper. Good luck, Randall R. Gregory NW =AR. from petermckean@netspace.net.au Wed Apr 3 05:43:10 2002 g33Bh8425836 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 05:43:08 -0600 g33Bh0Y90370; Subject: Re: Sharpening Plane Irons Joe Have said this before, and will repeat it now. I am a hobbyist. Rodmaking is , for me, a pastime, i.e. "pass time". I am not in a rip tearing hurry to sharpen my irons, but I like to get areally good edge. I use waterstones; have tried some of the other methods,but don't like them as well as the stones. PLEASE NOTE THAT THIS IS JUST MY OWN, PERSONAL OPINION, AND MAYWELL BEWRONG; NOR DO I WANT TO CONVERT ANYONE ELSE, NOR TO OFFEND THEM,NOR TOTRIGGER A JIHAD. THIS IS JUST THE WAY I CHOOSE TO DO IT! I don't like the Veritas jig, and so use a different design, which I thinkmakes it easier to keep the face square to the line of travel. I start with an 800 waterstone, move to a 1200, then to a 6000 (used withaNawara rubbing stone) and finish on an 8000 stone. I use a single bevel of30 deg, and I keep it sharp. I am NOT saying that my blades are sharper than those sharpened with othermethods, but I AM saying that they are certainly AS sharp. I want to see anabsolutely unblemished flat mirror surface, edge to edge, on the bevelbefore I consider the iron to be "done", and I have the backs polished withthe same degree of obsession. I can push them through a cigarette paperwhenthey are first out of the jig, and that is a sharp blade! I actually find it kind of restful, and it certainly provides a break fromthe concentration of final planing - and it's nice in the middle of finalplaning to be able to switch for a while to something that is productive, ano-brainer, and that you cannot conceivably stuff up. When I finish using the 800, I briefly flatten it using the 1200 and rinseit under the tap before I put it back in the water bath; the 1200, the6000, and the 8000 all get the flattening treatment with the 800 stone.Each flattening takes me maybe 20 - 30 secs, and I NEVER have dishedstones. I can sharpen Hock irons and HSS-tipped irons in this way, but admit I amtotally defeated by tungsten carbide blades. But when we were trialsharpening a tungsten tip at a machinist friend's shop, I found that therewas no way that we could get the edge on the TuC steel that I could get onthe HSS, and more so on the Hocks, so who cares? And I don't get many lifts, nor many chipped nodes; and those that I do getare more relative to poor cane strip preparation, or to haste, or tofatigue, than to the blade condition. But I will say that when I first getthe little whisper in the head which says "maybe it's time to give the oldblade a touch up", then it is, and I do! Unless time is of the essence and you have to do things quickly, it seemsto me that the answer to a problem is not to go out and buy a new piece ofequipment - it's to take the time to learn to get the best out of what youalready have. Cheers Peter from wendt@kingcrab.nrl.navy.mil Wed Apr 3 05:47:58 2002 g33Blw426106 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 05:47:58 -0600 g33Blmtx025379 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 06:47:48 -0500 Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest mark, I got a buddy that's a little, well, nuts to say the least. One 4th of July, we were sitting around blowing off fireworks, and he gets this brilliant idea. He's a welder by trade, and has his own shop that he works out of set up in his garage. He's got all the necessary tools, MIG, TIG, arc, gas, spot welders that you can think of. So, as we're sitting around, he gets this idea that one of his big plastic garbage bags will make a great fireworks display. He cracks open the acetylene torch, puts the end in the bag and procedes to fill the bag with the gas. Ties off the open end, after sticking a firecracker with the fuse sticking out of the bag, and takes it out to the middle of his yard. Lights the fuse, runs like hell, and we watch for a few seconds. We hear the crack of the firecracker going off, then, it looks just like the old films of a nuclear bomb going off.... This huge fireball just erupts into the air, with this deafening whoompf, and it goes up into the night sky. We had neighbors from miles away wondering just what in the heck we had done. We were rolling on the ground, laughing so hard, just like a couple of little kids. Kids, don't try this at home. Trained welders were used to re-create the nuclear explosive tests....... Mark At 05:05 PM 4/2/2002 -0500, you wrote: In a message dated 4/1/02 6:24:24 AM Central Standard Time,wendt@kingcrab.nrl.navy.mil writes: better, is to use butane, since it's heavier than air. When you launch itat night, you get about a ten foot flame.... cool! I gotta TRY that! mark visit Wood Art Custom Designshttp://woodartcustom.freeservers.com or http://hometown.aol.com/lazybee45/myhomepage/business.html Hand crafted items made to order! from saltwein@worldnet.att.net Wed Apr 3 06:00:59 2002 g33C0x426472 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 06:00:59 -0600 ;Wed, 3 Apr 2002 12:00:53 +0000 Subject: Re: Varnish Cracking at Ferrules Frank, You wrap up to the ferrule and then do a wrap over that and the ferrule? I have done a double wrap over very well thinned tabs and after extensivecasting with this rod I see the beginnings of a casting fracture. I havealso crowned ferrules and I have snug fits. So far this approach ( how much casting time on this rod), nodes under tabsand shoulder free ferrules are the new ideas. Any more secrets lurking outthere? Regards, SteveIndependence, MO Steve and others: I have had that problem in the past, but I now place a short underwrap atthe ferrule edge before doing the final winding if it must cover theferrule edge. This has seemed to work in several cases. from kenealyj@gwi.net Wed Apr 3 06:36:24 2002 g33CaN427060 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 06:36:23 -0600 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 07:36:18 -0500 Subject: M-D's fixtures Hi All, I finally got a chance to try out M-D's heat treating fixtures. I'd like to say that they have produced the best strips I have yet to =have come out of heat treating.I hadn't changed any of my methods other than using the fixtures. I soak my strips for 4 days, straighten and press nodes, run through the =router-beveler and then bind the strips into the fixtures and heat =treat. I have no monetary interest in these, though M-D has promised me his =first born if he actually makes any money with these. ;o) John K Hi All, I finally got a chance to try out M-D's = treating fixtures. I'd like to say that they have produced= strips I have yet to have come out of heat treating.I hadn't changed any of my methods = the fixtures. I soak my strips for 4 days, straighten= nodes, run through the router-beveler and then bind the strips into the = and heat treat. I have no monetary interest in these, = has promised me his first born if he actually makes any money with = ;o) JohnK from avyoung@iinet.net.au Wed Apr 3 06:47:36 2002 g33ClX427467 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 06:47:34 -0600 Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest At an exploration camps (mining) the usual thing for long term camps is to use a D9 or something there to cut tracks to also dig a huge pit for the camp rubbish.I was once at one such site and a drillers mate (gofor kid) was told to burn the rubbish pit off. The usual thing is to mix 50% petrol with diesel so you get a good hot fire without the petrol flash fire. Anyhow he didn't use diesel. To make it worse he poured about 5-6 gals into the pit all around it then decided to have lunch.An hr later he set it off. Plastic bottles and bags and a few non descript items went ballistic.We lost a hut where the gelignite was stored, the geli of course, a 44 gal drum of more petrol and a few acres of grassland went up in smoke. A land Cruiser looked like it was a gonner but the grass fire raged past it and left it intact which was nice. The same vehicle was later lost at Cape York called Hell (a marketing strategy to sell T Shirts "I've been to Hell and back") where at the time you could only get to by boat or 4 WD along the beach where the tide beat them on their return and swallowed the car. The tides are very big and very fast there.It took a few weeks for his eye brows to grow back and for his hair to look like it did before this event. I wont say normal because his hair was sort of unusual in cut, sort of Mohawk looking and the colour was sort of purple even before the fire.I still remember the Post Office radio schedule report the chief geo made to Cairns base for the telegram to the office in Brisbane and keep in mind this was 15 years before Forest Gump."Camp temporally but completely destroyed. One man mildly injured. Shit Happens."The kid kept his job because it's bloody hard to find kids to do this kind of work for long even before the days of computer games and game boysand Tony At 06:47 AM 4/3/02 -0500, Mark Wendt wrote: mark, I got a buddy that's a little, well, nuts to say the least. One 4th of July, we were sitting around blowing off fireworks, and he gets this brilliant idea. He's a welder by trade, and has his own shop that he works out of set up in his garage. He's got all the necessary tools, MIG, TIG, arc, gas, spot welders that you can think of. So, as we're sitting around, he gets this idea that one of his big plastic garbage bags will make a great fireworks display. He cracks open the acetylene torch, puts the end in the bag and procedes to fill the bag with the gas. Ties off the open end, after sticking a firecracker with the fuse sticking out of the bag, and takes it out to the middle of his yard. Lights the fuse, runs like hell, and we watch for a few seconds. We hear the crack of the firecracker going off, then, it looks just like the old films of a nuclear bomb going off.... This huge fireball just erupts into the air, with this deafening whoompf, and it goes up into the night sky. We had neighbors from miles away wondering just what in the heck we had done. We were rolling on the ground, laughing so hard, just like a couple of little kids. Kids, don't try this at home. Trained welders were used to re-create the nuclear explosive tests....... Mark At 05:05 PM 4/2/2002 -0500, you wrote: In a message dated 4/1/02 6:24:24 AM Central Standard Time,wendt@kingcrab.nrl.navy.mil writes: better, is to use butane, since it's heavier than air. When you launch itat night, you get about a ten foot flame.... cool! I gotta TRY that! mark visit Wood Art Custom Designshttp://woodartcustom.freeservers.com or http://hometown.aol.com/lazybee45/myhomepage/business.html Hand crafted items made to order! /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from wendt@kingcrab.nrl.navy.mil Wed Apr 3 07:00:41 2002 g33D0e427890 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 07:00:40 -0600 g33D0Ztx026635 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 08:00:35 -0500 Subject: It was the Best of times, it was the Worst of times.... Yesterday. Best of Times - My wife returned from her two week trip back to visit her family, relatives and friends in the Philippines. A truly joyous homecoming, both ways. Her arriving back at her family home, and her arriving back here in her adopted homeland. It was great to have her back with me, after a semi-bachelorhood week. My daughter and I managed tostay out of too much trouble for the entire two weeks, and the house was, though not quite up to Momma's standards, at least still standing when shereturned. Worst of Times - I lost my favorite hunting, wrestling, walking, playing companion yesterday. She was getting along in years, had gone blind over the last year or so, but never lost her enthusiasm or spunkiness. She was a little more than 11 years old, and had been my constant companion since we got her when she was 8 weeks old. I've raised Viszla's for over 20 years, but none of them had touched me or my family the way this one did. Her name was Beki, a name borrowed from the Hungarian's, whence she came. She had the sweetest personality of any Viszla I've ever come across. She was my Dad's favorite too. Dad gave up hunting a while ago, due to heart problems, but we spent quite a few fall seasons watching her run through the fields, finding birds for us, letting us "take" them for her, and giving us disgruntled looks when we missed "her" birds.... Dad took care of her for a couple of months while we were in the process of moving from the Left Coast, back here to the East Coast, and became very attached to her. I haven't told him yet. He won't take it very well either. Beki, as I mentioned earlier, had started going blind about a year and a half ago. We didn't think too much of it at the time, took her to the vet, and he determined that she had a mild form of diabetes, which can happen in many dogs. He had us controlling it by diet and exercise, and it seemed to be working pretty well, other than the loss of sight. Over the last week, Beki stopped eating, drank more water than humanly imaginable that didn't complain about much of anything, and just took everything in stride. But you could see she was suffering. After a few sleepless nights, I finally came to the conclusion that I couldn't bear to see her suffer any more. My best four legged buddy went to her final hunting grounds yesterday afternoon. I'm going to miss you girl. Where's the birds?????? mark from wendt@kingcrab.nrl.navy.mil Wed Apr 3 07:57:43 2002 g33Dvg429247 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 07:57:42 -0600 g33Dvatx027671 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 08:57:36 -0500 Subject: Re: It was the Best of times, it was the Worst of times.... This is the first partner that I've ever had to put to sleep. All my other companions died of old age. It was the hardest decision I've ever had to make in my life. I'll probably get another in a while, I just need to put my memories in all the right places. I toasted her with a good bit of Glenfiddich yesterday evening. I had a bottle of the French Cask 12 year stuff, and it had finished many hunts over the last few years with my favorite girl. The 12 year, much like my companion, is naught but a memory now. Mark At 08:35 AM 4/3/2002 -0500, you wrote: My deepest sympathy on your loss. I have a Golden Retreiver that is my walking, hiking, fishing, etc etc. pal. They are with us such a short time, even cats live longer. My advice is to remember the good times and get another one as soon as you can. I can't imagine going through life without such friendship. from Mark.Babiy@stel.tdsb.on.ca Wed Apr 3 08:04:14 2002 g33E4D429669 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 08:04:13 -0600 Subject: Re: Sharpening Plane Irons Joe, I have tried the sandpaper on glass method and it works. Kind of a pain. I gave up on the waterstone as I had problems similar to yours. Eventually, I switched to a leather strop mounted on a 5 to 6" woodenwheel and used the veritas (Lee Valley) green compound that they sell. Generally, I can get the plane blades razor sharp, (use the hair on my armto check sharpness, I know, I know) in a matter of a few minutes. If, Ihave reallly damamged the edge, I regrind it on a white wheel, and then goto the leather powered strop. The whole thing is powered by a 1/3 hrspelectric motor and it is connected to the motor shaft with a mandrel Ibought at a local hardware store. It is the same system that TomSmithwick uses and I believe it is posted on the Tips site undercontraptions. Works well and is quick. Mark from bhoy551@earthlink.net Wed Apr 3 08:04:26 2002 g33E4P429688 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 08:04:25 -0600 Wed, 3 Apr 2002 09:04:20 -0500 Subject: Re: Sharpening Plane Irons FILETIME=[739A3AB0:01C1DB18] Joe & Peter, My solution was to bite the bullet and buy one coarse diamond stone. It works great at truing the plane angles and taking out nicks etc. and it never dishes like water stones. Water stones take forever to remove relatively large amounts of steel. I use the water stones (600 and yellow polishing) work up to the mirror edge. After sharpening, I take the diamond stone and use it to flatten the water stones. Only takes a few seconds. The whole process takes less than five minutes to touch up a moderately dull blade. I don't like the veritas jig either. It's very hard to keep the iron perpendicular to the stone resulting in a skewed edge. The $12 japanese job clamps the blade from the sides forcing the blade square. Bill At 09:40 PM 4/3/2002 +1000, Peter McKean wrote: Joe Have said this before, and will repeat it now. I am a hobbyist. Rodmaking is , for me, a pastime, i.e. "pass time". I am not in a rip tearing hurry to sharpen my irons, but I like to get areally good edge. I use waterstones; have tried some of the other methods,but don't like them as well as the stones. PLEASE NOTE THAT THIS IS JUST MY OWN, PERSONAL OPINION, AND MAYWELL BEWRONG; NOR DO I WANT TO CONVERT ANYONE ELSE, NOR TO OFFEND THEM,NOR TOTRIGGER A JIHAD. THIS IS JUST THE WAY I CHOOSE TO DO IT! I don't like the Veritas jig, and so use a different design, which I thinkmakes it easier to keep the face square to the line of travel. I start with an 800 waterstone, move to a 1200, then to a 6000 (used withaNawara rubbing stone) and finish on an 8000 stone. I use a single bevel of30 deg, and I keep it sharp. I am NOT saying that my blades are sharper than those sharpened withothermethods, but I AM saying that they are certainly AS sharp. I want to see anabsolutely unblemished flat mirror surface, edge to edge, on the bevelbefore I consider the iron to be "done", and I have the backs polished withthe same degree of obsession. I can push them through a cigarette paperwhenthey are first out of the jig, and that is a sharp blade! I actually find it kind of restful, and it certainly provides a break fromthe concentration of final planing - and it's nice in the middle of finalplaning to be able to switch for a while to something that is productive, ano-brainer, and that you cannot conceivably stuff up. When I finish using the 800, I briefly flatten it using the 1200 and rinseit under the tap before I put it back in the water bath; the 1200, the6000, and the 8000 all get the flattening treatment with the 800 stone.Each flattening takes me maybe 20 - 30 secs, and I NEVER have dishedstones. I can sharpen Hock irons and HSS-tipped irons in this way, but admit I amtotally defeated by tungsten carbide blades. But when we were trialsharpening a tungsten tip at a machinist friend's shop, I found that therewas no way that we could get the edge on the TuC steel that I could get onthe HSS, and more so on the Hocks, so who cares? And I don't get many lifts, nor many chipped nodes; and those that I do getare more relative to poor cane strip preparation, or to haste, or tofatigue, than to the blade condition. But I will say that when I first getthe little whisper in the head which says "maybe it's time to give the oldblade a touch up", then it is, and I do! Unless time is of the essence and you have to do things quickly, it seemsto me that the answer to a problem is not to go out and buy a new piece ofequipment - it's to take the time to learn to get the best out of what youalready have. Cheers Peter from jojo@ipa.net Wed Apr 3 08:24:52 2002 g33EOq400888 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 08:24:52 -0600 helo=default) id 16slgr-0006Vg-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Wed, 03 Apr 2002 09:24:45 -0500 Subject: Re: It was the Best of times, it was the Worst of times.... I can't think of a more fitting send-off. A friend of mine had a Chessie that was just the sweetest old man. He hadtaught Nick to do manytricks -- like Jerry would say, "Down." and Nick would go down. Then, Jerrywould say, "On yourback." and Nick would roll onto his back. Jerry would then say, "Show us howthe girls in thewhorehouse do it." and Nick would wiggle all over, shaking his hips, all whileflat on his back.Funniest damn thing you ever saw. Nick got older, down in his hips, and couldbarely walk at all, ifyou wanted to call it that. Well, one day Jerry came in, and asked if I'd dosomething for him and,of course, I said, "Sure. Whatchaneed?" He said he had Nick out in the truckand needed to carry himto KO's (the Vet), but that he couldn't do it. I sure didn't like doing that, andhard as it was onme, it would have been harder for Jerry. Dogs become more a part of us than we care to admit at times -- especiallythose that seem morehuman than some of the people around us -- and they occupy special placesin our hearts and livesthat can never be filled again. M-D ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: It was the Best of times, it was the Worst of times.... This is the first partner that I've ever had to put to sleep. All my othercompanions died of old age. It was the hardest decision I've ever had tomake in my life. I'll probably get another in a while, I just need to putmy memories in all the right places. I toasted her with a good bit ofGlenfiddich yesterday evening. I had a bottle of the French Cask 12 yearstuff, and it had finished many hunts over the last few years with myfavorite girl. The 12 year, much like my companion, is naught but a memorynow. Mark At 08:35 AM 4/3/2002 -0500, you wrote: My deepest sympathy on your loss. I have a Golden Retreiver that is mywalking, hiking, fishing, etc etc. pal. They are with us such a shorttime, even cats live longer. My advice is to remember the good times andget another one as soon as you can. I can't imagine going through lifewithout such friendship. from wendt@kingcrab.nrl.navy.mil Wed Apr 3 09:16:59 2002 g33FGw403589 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 09:16:58 -0600 g33FGrtx029437 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 10:16:53 -0500 Subject: Re: It was the Best of times, it was the Worst of times.... Bret, list, that seem to know exactly what to say, and they've made my day awhole lot better. again guys, it really is a family here.Mark At 10:05 AM 4/3/2002 -0500, you wrote:WOW, I have been through it about 5 times and it is getting to the point where always have though are those memories of the good times with them andthey rely on us for everything, even death and even though it is hard in Brethttp://bretsovens.bravepages.com/ from mcanultj@svm.vetmed.wisc.edu Wed Apr 3 10:05:52 2002 g33G5p406694 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 10:05:51 -0600 743.svm.vetmed.wisc.edu) 2002 10:05:51 -0600 Subject: Re: It was the Best of times, it was the Worst of times.... I think the Irish do it best. The Irish wake to celebrate the life that a person has lived. Since we know our companion animals don't live as long as we do it is important to give them their due for a life well lived rather than mourn for something that cannot be (immortality). I always like to toast them and give thanks for the gift that they have given me by being so unique and that they were able to be a part of my life. Although sad, I look at it as a celebration of something truly special that was a part of my existence, which, like theirs will come to an end one day.Best regards,Jon McAnultyCarving a path through life, one tomato stake at a time. At 08:57 AM 4/3/2002 -0500, Mark Wendt wrote: This is the first partner that I've ever had to put to sleep. All my other companions died of old age. It was the hardest decision I've ever had to make in my life. I'll probably get another in a while, I just need to put my memories in all the right places. I toasted her with a good bit of Glenfiddich yesterday evening. I had a bottle of the French Cask 12 year stuff, and it had finished many hunts over the last few years with my favorite girl. The 12 year, much like my companion, is naught but a memory now. Mark At 08:35 AM 4/3/2002 -0500, you wrote: My deepest sympathy on your loss. I have a Golden Retreiver that is my walking, hiking, fishing, etc etc. pal. They are with us such a short time, even cats live longer. My advice is to remember the good times and get another one as soon as you can. I can't imagine going through life without such friendship. from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Wed Apr 3 10:10:40 2002 g33GAd407143 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 10:10:39 -0600 (authenticated) for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 08:10:36 -0800 Subject: How long can you keep it up? Friends, Sorry for the leading subject line, but SWMNBTFG (SheWho Must Not Be Taken For Granted) and I have been married woman would put up with me for 20 years. All theconversations of the past coupla weeks have made me curioushow long the average rod maker lasts. Perhaps some of you guys were building rods twenty yearsago, back when Tami and I were first married. Though Iwasn't building rods then, I did take a fly rod (fiberglass-- still have it) with me on our honeymoon, and actuallycaught a few native brookies in the mountains of NorthCarolina during daylight hours. Who among us has been building rods for more than 20years? Back when I was a young pup filled with idealism anddelusions of grandeur? Who's been making rods for 30years? Anyone? I built my first bamboo rod in 1997 (first graphite in1993), and in my sixth year of building rods just finishednumber 55, counting blanks. I can see myself doing this foranother 25 or 30 years, and wonder how many of us will stillbe making rods in 2025? Just curious,Harry --Harry Boyd http://www.canerods.com/ Bamboo Rodshttp://www.fbcwin.com/ Our Church from k5vkq@ix.netcom.com Wed Apr 3 10:21:46 2002 g33GLj408150 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 10:21:45 -0600 helo=kermit.psp.pas.earthlink.net) id 16snVw-000503-00; Wed, 03 Apr 2002 08:21:36 -0800 by kermit.psp.pas.earthlink.net (8.10.2+Sun/8.10.2) idg33GLaY26089; Subject: RE: Sharpening Plane Irons If you will add a piece of glass, ~ a foot to a foot and a half long, lay thewaterstone on it to sharpen and periodically scrub it back and forth, thestone will always be flat. The glass takes on a frosted look and is justenough abrasive, to flaten the stone. Regards,Onisk5vkq@ix.netcom.com On Tue, 2 Apr 2002 23:43:31 -0500 Larry Blan wrote: people swear by the SS method. You have to flatten the stones regularlyduring use. The very thing that makes waterstones so effective results inthem wearing in this manner. I've always made a habit of rubbing the stonestogether after use. This seems to keep them nice and flat. Of course, if youonly have one combination stone, this would be rather difficult. You can usethe SS method with coarse paper to flatten the stones too. Larry Blan -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Tuesday, April 02, 2002 11:18 PM Subject: Sharpening Plane Irons I've been using water stones to sharpen my Hock plane iron for a while.I've noticed that the 1000X stone I'm using has developed a "track" wherethe wheel from my holder for the plane iron runs along the stone.The 4000Xside is fine. I'm thinking of changing my sharpening to wet dry papersrather than water stones. My question is this. How many of you out there have tried this?Are there any benefits/pitfalls I should know about? Joe Beharj.behar@rogers.com There's no point in being grown up if you can't be childish sometimes.-- Doctor Who, in Robot from LambersonW@missouri.edu Wed Apr 3 10:21:54 2002 g33GLs408161 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 10:21:54 -0600 Wed, 3 Apr 2002 10:21:49 -0600 content-class: urn:content-classes:message Subject: RE: How long can you keep it up? Thread-Topic: How long can you keep it up?Thread-Index: AcHbKjzCk68FkM9iTPOuGMJyBM1o5wAAH4HA FILETIME=[A86FCB20:01C1DB2B] g33GLs408162 I bought my first bamboo from the Demarests in 1980. I have carried it,along with bars of CRS across the country on various moves. Severalmachinists took the opportunity to ruin the bars of steel, so while looking forone that could actually make a planing form, I occupied myself in rebuildingold rods, etc. When I saw the Morgan Mills advertised, I decided that was theway to go. I sold guns, rods, musical instruments and built a few miles tofence to scrounge enough money to place the order. While I was waiting forit to be delivered I got the old steel bars out and filed out a set of forms,pulled the bamboo from the attic and built a rod. I finished the first rodabout 18 years after I bought the bamboo, so my wife has been putting upwith the stuff for about 22 years now. Bill Lamberson -----Original Message----- Subject: How long can you keep it up? Friends, Sorry for the leading subject line, but SWMNBTFG (SheWho Must Not Be Taken For Granted) and I have been married woman would put up with me for 20 years. All theconversations of the past coupla weeks have made me curioushow long the average rod maker lasts. Perhaps some of you guys were building rods twenty yearsago, back when Tami and I were first married. Though Iwasn't building rods then, I did take a fly rod (fiberglass-- still have it) with me on our honeymoon, and actuallycaught a few native brookies in the mountains of NorthCarolina during daylight hours. Who among us has been building rods for more than 20years? Back when I was a young pup filled with idealism anddelusions of grandeur? Who's been making rods for 30years? Anyone? I built my first bamboo rod in 1997 (first graphite in1993), and in my sixth year of building rods just finishednumber 55, counting blanks. I can see myself doing this foranother 25 or 30 years, and wonder how many of us will stillbe making rods in 2025? Just curious,Harry --Harry Boyd http://www.canerods.com/ Bamboo Rodshttp://www.fbcwin.com/ Our Church from homes-sold@attbi.com Wed Apr 3 10:50:42 2002 g33Gog410388 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 10:50:42 -0600 ;Wed, 3 Apr 2002 16:50:36 +0000 Subject: Re: How long can you keep it up? Congratulations to you and Tami on your anniversary, may you have manymanymore. Though I haven't made nearly as many bamboo rods as you, I did make myfirstone when I was 14, I'll be 70 this summer. I'm not sure if that one reallycounts as a real rod, it was a piece of bamboo 14' long with a tip and a fewguides, about 18' of line tied on at the butt end, a leader and no reel. Iused it to swing, not cast, a fly back in the cat tails for large mouthbass. When a fish was hooked, pull on the line to pull the fish in. If thefish pulled to hard, throw the whole works in the water and retrieve itlater when the fish got tired of pulling it around the lake. Now I've givenaway the fishing secrets of a poor "West Virginia Hillbilly Kid". When myDad found out what I was doing he brought me a real bamboo rod, 9' 3pc 2tip6wt, which I still have. Hope to see you at the FFF in Montana and birthday party this summer. You and Tami have a great day. Don----- Original Message ----- Subject: How long can you keep it up? Friends, Sorry for the leading subject line, but SWMNBTFG (SheWho Must Not Be Taken For Granted) and I have been married from wendt@kingcrab.nrl.navy.mil Wed Apr 3 10:53:03 2002 g33Gr2410692 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 10:53:02 -0600 g33Gqttx001219 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 11:52:55 -0500 Subject: Re: It was the Best of times, it was the Worst of times.... Larry, I guess that's something to keep in mind. I'm always worried that I'll open my mouth, and insert my size 11 by trying to say something that I feel, not have it come out right, and make things worse for the intended purpose. I have a hard time finding the right words on the spur of the moment, but I can usually get something together when I spend a little time thinking of what I really want to say. Unfortunately, sometimes when I think I've finally found the words that I want to say, the moment has passed, and then it seems trite to say what I feel. Thank you all again,Mark At 11:13 AM 4/3/2002 -0500, you wrote: Funny you should mention not being "good" at condolences sosoon after your post about the internet helping toovercome stereotypes. I just flat suck at sendingcondolences. Once upon a time, I would not say anything,feeling it would not really make anyone feel better. Ilike to think that sending notes expressing condolenceshas made it easier for me to do it "live" when it has beennecessary. One more way the internet has had an impact forme personally. The list has indeed been through a lot. We have beenthrough births, deaths, heart bypasses, back operations,graduations and even Reed's daughters suicide. I have cometo realize from the notes I have received back from peoplethat it is not really the content that counts, it is thefact that it matters enough to you to take the time tocare, and to pass your thoughts along. Larry Blan from goodaple@cox-internet.com Wed Apr 3 10:57:45 2002 internet.com [208.180.118.48] (may be forged)) g33Gvi411199 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 10:57:45 -0600 (InterMail vK.4.03.05.00 201-232-132 license180e1de7f543f89455b24e508f9cca39) Subject: How long can you keep it up? I started out restoring rods in 1993. Started out on cheap Monty's and =worked up to Southbends etc. I resold these on a regular basis. I =finally moved up to Heddons and Grangers etc. Still have a few of those =rods. Been contemplating parting with them. Eventually I moved right =into rodmaking. Bought my first forms from Colorado Bootstrap. Couldn't =see restoring rods when making rods seemed more sensible to me. That =way I could try out different tapers to determine the type that was just =right for my fishing style. I've sold a few rods over the past few years =as a result of casual encounters on the river or people wanting a =retirement gift for Corporate Execs.I just never went out of my way to =sell a rod. However if a person really wanted one, I would happily make =it for them. Theses buyers kept telling and showing other people. I =enjoy making my rods. It's my way of self expression. It's my favorite =thing to do. If I can please people along that path, that's even better. =I enjoy the trial and error of developing new tools(Thank you fellow =listmembers for many ideas) to constantly improve upon my skills. I can =easily see myself doing this many years from now because I enjoy the =challenge and the satisfaction that I derive from it. Some of the =articles lately say that a rodmaker must earn his way. What boundaries =limit that area?We all pay our dues through mistakes, failures and/ or =victories. That is the essence of rodmaking. To improve on every rod and =if it is not to standard scrap it and try again. Ya gotta love it. =Keepin to the challenge, Randall R. Gregory NW AR. I started out restoring rods in 1993. = on cheap Monty's and worked up to Southbends etc. I resold these on a = those rods. Been contemplating parting with them. Eventually I moved = rodmaking. Bought my first forms from Colorado Bootstrap. Couldn't see = = different tapers to determine the type that was just right for my = I've sold a few rods over the past few years as a result of casual = the river or people wanting a retirement gift for Corporate Execs.I just = went out of my way to sell a rod. However if a person really wanted one, = people. I enjoy making my rods. It's my way of self expression. It's my = thing to do. If I can please people along that path, that's even better. = the trial and error of developing new tools(Thank you fellow listmembers = myself doing this many years from now because I enjoy the challenge and = satisfaction that I derive from it. Some of the articles lately say = rodmaker must earn his way. What boundaries limit that area?We all pay = through mistakes, failures and/ or victories. That is the essence of = To improve on every rod and if it is not to standard scrap it and try = AR. from edriddle@mindspring.com Wed Apr 3 10:58:47 2002 g33Gwl411466 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 10:58:47 -0600 helo=oemcomputer) id 16so5p-0007vk-00 for rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu; Wed, 03 Apr 2002 11:58:42 -0500 Subject: Fw: How long can you keep it up? I've recently purchased bamboo and am still fine-tuning the #%*x grooves inmy steel form, so I haven't built my first; however, my wife has put up withme for 38 + years. Now I'm wondering if she may have mentioned the latterpart of that in some teddy-bear collectors' "April Fool's Day Contest". Ed from flyfish@gbronline.com Wed Apr 3 11:11:15 2002 g33HBE412765 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 11:11:14 -0600 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:0.9.4.1)Gecko/20020314 Netscape6/6.2.2 Subject: Elgin IL fishing Does anyone know the area? Do you go to Wisconsin to fish?Greg from CAIrvinerods@aol.com Wed Apr 3 11:13:18 2002 g33HDI413115 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 11:13:18 -0600 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 12:12:57 - Subject: Rod ID A friend has emailed a message about a Heddon rod, Pal Mark II, I can find no reference to this rod in either of Sinclairs books. I have not seen the rod so do not know much about it but it is 8 1/2 feet. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks, Chuck A friend has emailed a message about a Heddon rod,Pal Mark II, I can find no reference to this rod in either of Sinclairs books. Ihave not seen the rod so do not know much about it but it is 8 1/2 feet. Anyhelp would be appreciated. Thanks, Chuck from pvansch@wethersfield.k12.ct.us Wed Apr 3 11:15:40 2002 g33HFd413508 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 11:15:39 -0600 Subject: RE: How long can you keep it up? Great, catchy subject line!! Congratulations on twenty years, I haven't built any rods yet, but when Iwork to refinish or build from a blank and disappear for several evenings ata time SWMBO gets to wondering who I'm having an affair with! Congratulations again, Peter -----Original Message----- Subject: How long can you keep it up? Friends, Sorry for the leading subject line, but SWMNBTFG (SheWho Must Not Be Taken For Granted) and I have been married woman would put up with me for 20 years. All theconversations of the past coupla weeks have made me curioushow long the average rod maker lasts. Perhaps some of you guys were building rods twenty yearsago, back when Tami and I were first married. Though Iwasn't building rods then, I did take a fly rod (fiberglass-- still have it) with me on our honeymoon, and actuallycaught a few native brookies in the mountains of NorthCarolina during daylight hours. Who among us has been building rods for more than 20years? Back when I was a young pup filled with idealism anddelusions of grandeur? Who's been making rods for 30years? Anyone? I built my first bamboo rod in 1997 (first graphite in1993), and in my sixth year of building rods just finishednumber 55, counting blanks. I can see myself doing this foranother 25 or 30 years, and wonder how many of us will stillbe making rods in 2025? Just curious,Harry --Harry Boyd http://www.canerods.com/ Bamboo Rodshttp://www.fbcwin.com/ Our Church from ctcaneman@yahoo.com Wed Apr 3 11:30:42 2002 g33HUf414784 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 11:30:41 -0600 Wed, 03 Apr 2002 09:30:40 PST Subject: Re: How long can you keep it up? You must have bamboo in your .... to keep it up fortwenty years! Congrats! Paul--- Harry Boyd wrote: Friends, Sorry for the leading subject line, but SWMNBTFG(SheWho Must Not Be Taken For Granted) and I have beenmarried that anywoman would put up with me for 20 years. All theconversations of the past coupla weeks have made mecurioushow long the average rod maker lasts. Perhaps some of you guys were building rodstwenty yearsago, back when Tami and I were first married. Though Iwasn't building rods then, I did take a fly rod(fiberglass-- still have it) with me on our honeymoon, andactuallycaught a few native brookies in the mountains ofNorthCarolina during daylight hours. Who among us has been building rods for more than20years? Back when I was a young pup filled with delusions of grandeur? Who's been making rods for30years? Anyone? I built my first bamboo rod in 1997 (firstgraphite in1993), and in my sixth year of building rods justfinishednumber 55, counting blanks. I can see myself doingthis foranother 25 or 30 years, and wonder how many of uswill stillbe making rods in 2025? Just curious,Harry --Harry Boyd http://www.canerods.com/ Bamboo Rodshttp://www.fbcwin.com/ Our Church __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTaxhttp://taxes.yahoo.com/ from twilhelm@occasionalrod.com Wed Apr 3 11:36:39 2002 g33Hac415306 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 11:36:38 -0600 Wed, 3 Apr 2002 12:36:37 -0500 Subject: Re: How long can you keep it up? Congratulations Harry. We'll celebrate our 27th in May and married lifehasn't been all that bad, although the Wife that came with it has given metrouble from time to time. As far as rods, I built my first round one in 1983 from an Orvis blank. Ihad hoped to save some money. Yeah, right! I think I've built about 20 since then, most of them given away to friendsor as raffle items. Last year was my first bamboo and I have been slowgetting on to my second. Seems there is as much fun making tools, woodrodtubes, etc. Will say one thing, I can't tell you what the current lineup onTV is anymore. That's one chain that has been broken. Tim ----- Original Message ----- Subject: How long can you keep it up? Friends, Sorry for the leading subject line, but SWMNBTFG (SheWho Must Not Be Taken For Granted) and I have been married woman would put up with me for 20 years. All theconversations of the past coupla weeks have made me curioushow long the average rod maker lasts. Perhaps some of you guys were building rods twenty yearsago, back when Tami and I were first married. Though Iwasn't building rods then, I did take a fly rod (fiberglass-- still have it) with me on our honeymoon, and actuallycaught a few native brookies in the mountains of NorthCarolina during daylight hours. Who among us has been building rods for more than 20years? Back when I was a young pup filled with idealism anddelusions of grandeur? Who's been making rods for 30years? Anyone? I built my first bamboo rod in 1997 (first graphite in1993), and in my sixth year of building rods just finishednumber 55, counting blanks. I can see myself doing this foranother 25 or 30 years, and wonder how many of us will stillbe making rods in 2025? Just curious,Harry --Harry Boyd http://www.canerods.com/ Bamboo Rodshttp://www.fbcwin.com/ Our Church from aport@si.rr.com Wed Apr 3 11:48:14 2002 g33HmE416383 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 11:48:14 -0600 Wed, 3 Apr 2002 12:48:08 -0500 Subject: Re: Sharpening Plane irons. I'm very happy with the Scary Sharp method. I DO use WD40 as a lubricant =and have never found it to be a problem. I think I've seen in =woodworking mags that you can use a cinder block to flatten waterstones =if you don't have two.Art I'm very happy with the Scary Sharp method. I DO use WD40 as a = and have never found it to be a problem. I think I've seen in = that you can use a cinder block to flatten waterstones if you don't have = two.Art from hartzell@easystreet.com Wed Apr 3 11:59:20 2002 g33HxJ417366 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 11:59:19 -0600 g33HxGX21506; Subject: Re: How long can you keep it up? Harry;I built my first bamboo rod in 1963.Ed Harry Boyd wrote: Friends, Sorry for the leading subject line, but SWMNBTFG (SheWho Must Not Be Taken For Granted) and I have been married woman would put up with me for 20 years. All theconversations of the past coupla weeks have made me curioushow long the average rod maker lasts. Perhaps some of you guys were building rods twenty yearsago, back when Tami and I were first married. Though Iwasn't building rods then, I did take a fly rod (fiberglass-- still have it) with me on our honeymoon, and actuallycaught a few native brookies in the mountains of NorthCarolina during daylight hours. Who among us has been building rods for more than 20years? Back when I was a young pup filled with idealism anddelusions of grandeur? Who's been making rods for 30years? Anyone? I built my first bamboo rod in 1997 (first graphite in1993), and in my sixth year of building rods just finishednumber 55, counting blanks. I can see myself doing this foranother 25 or 30 years, and wonder how many of us will stillbe making rods in 2025? Just curious,Harry --Harry Boyd http://www.canerods.com/ Bamboo Rodshttp://www.fbcwin.com/ Our Church from BrooksideNC@aol.com Wed Apr 3 12:07:39 2002 g33I7c418105 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 12:07:38 -0600 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 13:07:29 - Subject: How to get off the list How do I get off this list? All I do is a little restoring and the list is a little more involved with building bamboo rods. A lot of info just not for my doings. Tight Lines, Richard FederationGuide/Fly Fishing Instructor/Custom Tier How do I get off thislist? All I do is a little restoring and the list is a little more involved with Tight Lines, Richard FederationGuide/Fly FishingInstructor/Custom Tier from CALucker@aol.com Wed Apr 3 12:44:33 2002 g33IiX420294 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 12:44:33 -0600 Subject: Re: How long can you keep it up? In a message dated 4/3/02 8:11:07 AM Pacific Standard Time, fbcwin@3g.quik.com writes: Who's been making rods for 30years? Anyone? I have been making rods for 31 years, but that is not very descriptive of my rod building. Dawn Holbrook put on a seminar on cane rod building for about ten of us atmy prep school back in late 1970 or early 1971. My school was near his home. We each made a rod. But I didn't make rods -- even small numbers -- until the 1980s. I guess the political consultant/PR guy in me would say that I have been a rod maker in four decades or in two centuries. My Grandfather made rods for almost sixty years. He learned from Letcher Lambuth. My Grandfather built a mill that he kept in his boathouse on Lake Washington. He made a total of six rods that I know of -- all trolling rods and Tyee Club stuff. I guess he is not a good example of a mill speeding up rod production.Chris Lucker In a message dated 4/3/02 8:11:07 AM PacificStandard Time, fbcwin@3g.quik.com writes: Who's been making rods I have been making rods for 31 years, but that is not very descriptive of my Dawn Holbrook put on a seminar on cane rod building for about ten of us at guy in me would say that I have been a rod maker in four decades or in twocenturies. example of a mill speeding up rod production.Chris Lucker from rextutor@yahoo.com Wed Apr 3 12:52:07 2002 g33Iq6420966 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 12:52:06 -0600 03 Apr 2002 10:52:06 PST Subject: Re: Rod ID Chuck Homel shows a Heddon "Mark II" - it is fiberglass 8-9ft 2/1 c 1966 (value ex mint $40) as well as a Heddon "Pal " fiberglass fly 8 1/2 ft 2/1 c1955 valueex mint $30) . The note on the 2nd edition whichisdated says add 30-40 % .I am guesiing this rod is round therefore fiberglassand Sinclair only deals with bamboo. good luck--- CAIrvinerods@aol.com wrote: A friend has emailed a message about a Heddon rod,Pal Mark II, I can find no reference to this rod in either of Sinclairs books.I have not seen the rod so do not know much about it but it is 8 1/2 feet.Any help would be appreciated. Thanks, Chuck __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTaxhttp://taxes.yahoo.com/ from Dennishigham@cs.com Wed Apr 3 13:12:34 2002 g33JCY422135 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 13:12:34 -0600 Subject: Re: Elgin IL fishing Greg,Since I live 5 miles south of Elgin I guess I'll field this one. Are you moving here or just visiting?? April is a little early for most fly fishing except for steelhead. The first pan fishing usually starts in late April with smallmouth fishing picking up soon after. You can certainly fish now it's just that the water is cold and the fishing slow (except for the steelhead). The Fox river is good for smallmouth and walleye with some Northern and muskie. Try clousers, wooly buggers or any small baitfish streamer. If you see them taking caddis on top try an emerger below a dry...they're almost always taking the emergers. Lots of forest preserve ponds/lakes withpanfish and white bass. The Rock river between Oregon and Grand Detour has a 9mile catch & release area for smallmouth. Kishwaukee river for smallmouth and Northern pike. Kankakee river for smallmouth. WillowSlough (Indianna) for big bluegill on poppers.DuPage River for smallmouth. Saganashkee Slough forbass especially in the weedlines just beyond the timber. Checkout www.chicagolandfishing.com for info on all the local rivers.lakes and ponds (also has a fly fishing forum). By the way a 5lb smallie was taken on the fox about 2 weeks ago just above the St Charles dam (on a mepps spinner). Steelhead are running now...the Root or Pike River in Wisconsin just across the border or 2 1/2 hours to South Bend, Ind. to fish the St. Joseph or the Dowiagic in Mich. 4 hours puts you on the Muskegon. It's a tailwaters with about 70 miles of river full of steelhead right now and big browns the rest of the year (Brett Reiter should write about this one, since he lives there).Steelhead run about 8-12 lbs in this area. There are spring, summer and fall Steelhead runs as well as a fall salmon run.Drive 4 hours west to the spring creeks in SW Wisconsin gives you about 1400 miles of troutstreams (Olaf, want to chime in here?) or 7 hours to get to Grayling.That's a quick overview.Close to home it's smallmouth or walleye. Drive 1-2 hours for steelhead or salmon. Drive 4 hours for trout.contact me off list for more . Dennis from patrick.w.coffey@boeing.com Wed Apr 3 13:16:25 2002 g33JGO422500 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 13:16:24 -0600 LAA04291; NAA24523; g33JElt12535; (5.5.2650.21) id ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 06:40:13 -0800 Subject: RE: Sharpening Plane Irons works great and unlike water stones they don't dish after each stroke. thebest is hard white Arkansas stones and hard black if you want it sharp as ascalpel. It took years before I had to flatten my stones and I did it withsand paper and a plate of glass. Use mineral oil from Safeway and paintthinner mixed 50 /50, that makes Norton's sharpening oil. Patrick W. CoffeyAOG Incident Repair PlanningPhone: 425-234-2901Fax: 425-237-0083M-2112 M/C 61-79 -----Original Message----- Subject: Sharpening Plane Irons I've been using water stones to sharpen my Hock plane iron for a while.I've noticed that the 1000X stone I'm using has developed a "track" wherethe wheel from my holder for the plane iron runs along the stone. The 4000Xside is fine. I'm thinking of changing my sharpening to wet dry papersrather than water stones. My question is this. How many of you out there have tried this?Are there any benefits/pitfalls I should know about? Joe Beharj.behar@rogers.com There's no point in being grown up if you can't be childish sometimes.-- Doctor Who, in Robot from dongreife@hotmail.com Wed Apr 3 13:42:05 2002 g33Jg4424238 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 13:42:04 -0600 Wed, 3 Apr 2002 11:41:59 -0800 HTTP; Wed, 03 Apr 2002 19:41:58 GMT rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Re: Sharpening Plane Irons FILETIME=[9E843530:01C1DB47] I've been thinking about trying a 'DuoSharp' diamond honing stone thatWoodCraft has . It's a two sided steel with 600/1200 grit diamond.Anybodyused one. They are a bit pricey. Don Greife j.behar@rogers.com, Rodmakers List Get your FREE download of MSNExplorer at http://explorer.msn.com. from bob@downandacross.com Wed Apr 3 13:55:00 2002 g33Jsx425189 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 13:54:59 -0600 , Subject: RE: Sharpening Plane Irons I use the Tormek grinder. The water trough keeps the blade cool as it getssharpened. The stone grader allows for coarse and fine grit sharpening onthe same wheel. The real nice part is honing on the leather wheel that theTormek has. Once I get the angles I want, it takes seconds to do themirror-like honing on the leather wheel and get planing again. I rarely haveto use the wetsone side.The Tormek is probably not worth the money if you can rig up a leatherstroping set up for yourself. I usually still go back to my 1000/6000 waterstones to flatten the back of the blades. I use the Tormek's stone grader tolap those waterstones. I use the Tormek to sharpen all kinds of stuff aroundthe house, but it is still a lot at $350.If I had to do it over again, I would get a diamond stone and set up astroping wheel with diamond compound. It would probably cost me $90insteadof 4 times that.Best regards and good luck,Bob -----Original Message----- rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Re: Sharpening Plane Irons I've been thinking about trying a 'DuoSharp' diamond honing stone thatWoodCraft has . It's a two sided steel with 600/1200 grit diamond.Anybodyused one. They are a bit pricey. Don Greife From: timothy troester Subject: Re: Sharpening Plane Irons now, i straighten the stone on a wheel when needed anduse a leather wheel almost all the time with a whitestick. water stones will cup and they need to beflattened after almost every use. i used dry sandpaperon glass but the wheel on the veritas guide wears downand will wear on the inside around the axis too. iwould replace the wheel but it always whore to oneside or the other and the edge would not be square.after awhile i could no longer straighten it in theplane. i don't like using water or oil or silicon onmy blades as a carrier because i don't want it on mycane. timothy --- Joe Behar wrote:I've been using water stones to sharpen my Hockplane iron for a while.I've noticed that the 1000X stone I'm using hasdeveloped a "track" wherethe wheel from my holder for the plane iron runsalong the stone. The 4000Xside is fine. I'm thinking of changing my sharpeningto wet dry papersrather than water stones. My question is this. How many of you out there have tried this?Are there any benefits/pitfalls I should know about? Joe Beharj.behar@rogers.com There's no point in being grown up if you can't bechildish sometimes.-- Doctor Who, in Robot ====="Gooda' mornin', mister bear!" ...Ride, boldly ride,"The shade replied, -"If you seek for Eldorado!" -- E.A.Poe __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTaxhttp://taxes.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------------Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com. Tormek grinder. The water trough keeps the blade cool as it gets = stone grader allows for coarse and fine grit sharpening on the same = real nice part is honing on the leather wheel that the Tormek has. Once = the angles I want, it takes seconds to do the mirror-like honing on the = side. is probably not worth the money if you can rig up a leather stroping set = yourself. I usually still go back to my 1000/6000 water stones to = back of the blades. I use the Tormek's stone grader to lap those = use the Tormek to sharpen all kinds of stuff around the house, but it is = lot at $350. do it over again, I would get a diamond stone and set up a stroping = that. and good luck,Bob owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu = Behalf Of Don GreifeSent: Wednesday, April 03, 2002 Irons I've been thinking about trying a 'DuoSharp' diamond honing stone = WoodCraft has . It's a two sided steel with 600/1200 grit = one. They are a bit pricey. Don Greife Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com. from dongreife@hotmail.com Wed Apr 3 13:58:20 2002 g33JwK425512 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 13:58:20 -0600 Wed, 3 Apr 2002 11:58:07 -0800 HTTP; Wed, 03 Apr 2002 19:58:07 GMT rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: RE: How long can you keep it up? FILETIME=[DFA01370:01C1DB49] Congratulations Harry, on your 20th, and to you W.R. for yourperseverence. I've only been refinishing old cane for about 15 years and justrecently decided to build one,,and "may" have been persuaded to do that. Yousee,,the ol' girl and I have been together for 50 this past February 16. Shewanted me out from under foot so much that she had a new shed built tokeep me and my treasures in. She had it heated and insulated and haspromised to A/C it if I'll stay out there most of the time. She also bought mea culm of cane, planes, a maple form and a bunch of other stuff. Justthought you should know what you could look forward to if you can keep your , "Rodmakers List-serv" have carried it, along with bars of CRS across the country on various moves.Several machinists took the opportunity to ruin the bars of steel, so whilelooking for one that could actually make a planing form, I occupied myself inrebuilding old rods, etc. When I saw the Morgan Mills advertised, I decidedthat was the way to go. I sold guns, rods, musical instruments and built a fewmiles to fence to scrounge enough money to place the order. While I waswaiting for it to be delivered I got the old steel bars out and filed out a set offorms, pulled the bamboo from the attic and built a rod. I finished the firstrod about 18 years after I bought the bamboo, so my wife has been puttingup with the stuff for about 22 years now. married curious still Join the world's largest e-mail servicewith MSN Hotmail. ClickHere from bob@downandacross.com Wed Apr 3 14:17:06 2002 g33KH5426850 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 14:17:05 -0600 Wed,3 Apr 2002 15:16:55 -0500 Subject: Strange Neighborhood/Straight Tapers Something happened to me Tuesday night that I have almost neverencounteredin my neck of the woods. I have had the kids come up to me when casting onthe front lawn, and I have had adults drive by and look at me in disgust. Tuesday was a rainy day here, but I was really excited about getting thelatest quad design out on the front lawn to cast. The rod is based on thePowell straight B tapers, it would be a B 8.5 because I could not decide onwhat to try first, the B8 or B9, I just knew I wanted a slightly faster rod.I may be drastically simplifying the Powell tapers, but let's just say ithas an increase of .0085 over every 6" of the individual splines or .017every 6" over the completed shaft. I was sure that experimenting withstraight tapers would be a good, non-computerized way to get something Iliked, considering that I like many of the rather straight Garrison tapers.I was also extremely impressed by the rod Tom Ausfeld brought over lastsummer, a straight taper for 5 wt. I chose a .060 tip thinking I would comeup with about a 4 weight over 7" of tapering. Needless to say, the rod castfantastic, except for the noted comments on the Powell B series that theycast great but do not throw the tightest loops. This rod is comfortable, butdoesn't give the tighter loops that most of the other quad tapers give.Maybe the line choice (4WF) was not the best either. This would be apleasant rod to fish all day. Wonder how it roll casts. Okay, here's the weird part. I am out standing in the rain with the rodsections duct taped together (using a 16/64 NS tube)and the reel taped on.My neighbor has a nice Lab, and her dog-walker comes over to me toexchangepleasantries. He says he is surprised to meet anyone casting bamboo, letalone making rods, let alone quads which he has never seen before. Then heproceeds to dump 50' of line with no effort, and says, "I got to fish withWalt and Press Powell once about 10 years ago." I had never said a wordabout the rod he was casting or my design ideas on it or anything. He wenton to explain the Powell procedure, varnish, and 3 taper system like I washaving some sort of Twilight Zone episode dream. Totally freaked me out.Guess you will never know who is out there til you spend some time in thefront yard amidst the locals. Anyway, once I get through some orders here, I am going to get this rodtweaked where it does what I like. I have to sort of agree with the Montagnearticle where he implies that his tapers really happened in the tip and werepretty fast and straight otherwise. Once I get the mill going better, I amgoing to try a run of different straight taperes and then build the samewith different tip designs. Take care,Bob M. from bob@downandacross.com Wed Apr 3 14:19:37 2002 g33KJa427180 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 14:19:36 -0600 3 Apr 2002 15:19:24 -0500 "rodmakers@wugate.wustl.e" Subject: RE: Strange Neighborhood/Straight Tapers That should be 4 wt for 7 feet! -----Original Message----- Subject: Strange Neighborhood/Straight Tapers I chose a .060 tip thinking I would comeup with about a 4 weight over 7" of tapering. from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Wed Apr 3 14:27:41 2002 g33KRe427952 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 14:27:40 -0600 (authenticated) for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 12:27:36 -0800 Subject: Re: How to get off the list --------------5A7C449013BC99CB9184A0F9 MD -- You wanna handle this one Harry BrooksideNC@aol.com wrote: How do I get off this list? All I do is a little restoringand the list is a little more involved with buildingbamboo rods. A lot of info just not for my doings. Tight Lines, Richard FederationGuide/Fly Fishing Instructor/Custom Tier --Harry Boyd http://www.canerods.com/ Bamboo Rodshttp://www.fbcwin.com/ Our Church --------------5A7C449013BC99CB9184A0F9 MD -- BrooksideNC@aol.com wrote:How doI get off this list? All I do is a little restoring and the list is a littlemore involved with building bamboo rods. A lot of info just not for mydoings.Tight Lines,RichardFederationGuide/FlyFishingInstructor/Custom Tier --Harry Boyd --------------5A7C449013BC99CB9184A0F9-- from rodwrapp@swbell.net Wed Apr 3 14:28:27 2002 g33KSQ428089 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 14:28:26 -0600 (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 (built May 7 2001)) Subject: Re: Varnish Cracking at Ferrules rodmakers@mail.wustl.edu Try useing a thin coat of Duraglos or Flex Coat over thread wraps and thenvarnish over top.. Thanks dave----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Varnish Cracking at Ferrules Frank, You wrap up to the ferrule and then do a wrap over that and the ferrule? I have done a double wrap over very well thinned tabs and after extensivecasting with this rod I see the beginnings of a casting fracture. I havealso crowned ferrules and I have snug fits. So far this approach ( how much casting time on this rod), nodes under tabs and shoulder free ferrules are the new ideas. Any more secrets lurking outthere? Regards, SteveIndependence, MO Steve and others: I have had that problem in the past, but I now place a short underwrap at the ferrule edge before doing the final winding if it must cover theferrule edge. This has seemed to work in several cases. from dmanders@telusplanet.net Wed Apr 3 14:36:25 2002 g33KaO428965 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 14:36:24 -0600 (InterMail vM.5.01.04.01 201-253-122-122-101-20011014) with Wed, 3 Apr 2002 13:36:18 -0700 Subject: Re: How long can you keep it up? Harry, Congrats - 20 is a long time - beats the odds. I've still got the same one[wife] after 35 years. I finally quit working full time. She's now starting.Figured that the first 35 were on me, the next 35 on her. Gives me moretime for research and development [ fishing ] and building. Made first glassrod in 1969 - first graphite in 1975 and first cane in 1981. Built about a 100or so. catch ya' Don At 10:09 AM 4/3/02 -0600, Harry Boyd wrote: Friends, Sorry for the leading subject line, but SWMNBTFG (She Who Must Not Be Taken For Granted) and I have been married woman would put up with me for 20 years. All the conversations of the past coupla weeks have made me curious how long the average rod maker lasts. Perhaps some of you guys were building rods twenty years ago, back when Tami and I were first married. Though I wasn't building rods then, I did take a fly rod (fiberglass -- still have it) with me on our honeymoon, and actually caught a few native brookies in the mountains of North Carolina during daylight hours. Who among us has been building rods for more than 20 years? Back when I was a young pup filled with idealism and delusions of grandeur? Who's been making rods for 30 years? Anyone? I built my first bamboo rod in 1997 (first graphite in 1993), and in my sixth year of building rods just finished number 55, counting blanks. I can see myself doing this for another 25 or 30 years, and wonder how many of us will still be making rods in 2025? Just curious, Harry -- Harry Boyd http://www.canerods.com/ Bamboo Rods http://www.fbcwin.com/ Our Church ffff,0000,0000http://www.telusplanet.net/public/dmanders/index.html from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Wed Apr 3 14:38:44 2002 g33Kch429278 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 14:38:43 -0600 (authenticated) Wed, 3 Apr 2002 12:38:39 -0800 Rodmakers List-serv Subject: Re: How long can you keep it up? Ed, Congratulations !! So far you've got more stamina than anyone whohas responded. Heck, I was turned 5 years old in October 1963!! Those of you who have been at this a long time - Ed, Bill Harms,Bill Fink, Ralph Moon, Don and a few others who have built many,many rods - really are treasures to us "new kids." I really hopethat we can build on the spirit and inventiveness you guys haveshown and make the bamboo rods of tomorrow even better than thosethe best makers are building today. Accomplishing that goal wouldbe a fine tribute to you guys. Harry Ed Hartzell wrote: Harry;I built my first bamboo rod in 1963.Ed --Harry Boyd http://www.canerods.com/ Bamboo Rodshttp://www.fbcwin.com/ Our Church from patrick.w.coffey@boeing.com Wed Apr 3 14:40:20 2002 g33KeK429590 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 14:40:20 -0600 MAA24591; OAA13835; g33KeDt14084; (5.5.2650.21) id ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 06:49:43 -0800 rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: RE: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest we made acetylene fireworks with Clorox bottles (empty) a little water andcarbide crystals. The kids love them every 4th of July and their cheap andall us adults get moist playing with big blasts. Patrick W. CoffeyAOG Incident Repair PlanningPhone: 425-234-2901Fax: 425-237-0083M-2112 M/C 61-79 -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest mark, I got a buddy that's a little, well, nuts to say the least. One 4th of July, we were sitting around blowing off fireworks, and he gets this brilliant idea. He's a welder by trade, and has his own shop that he works out of set up in his garage. He's got all the necessary tools, MIG, TIG, arc, gas, spot welders that you can think of. So, as we're sitting around, he gets this idea that one of his big plastic garbage bags will make a great fireworks display. He cracks open the acetylene torch, puts the end in the bag and procedes to fill the bag with the gas. Ties off the open end, after sticking a firecracker with the fuse sticking out of the bag, and takes it out to the middle of his yard. Lights the fuse, runs like hell, and we watch for a few seconds. We hear the crack of the firecracker going off, then, it looks just like the old films of a nuclear bomb going off.... This huge fireball just erupts into the air, with this deafening whoompf, and it goes up into the night sky. We had neighbors from miles away wondering just what in the heck we had done. We were rolling on the ground, laughing so hard, just like a couple of little kids. Kids, don't try this at home. Trained welders were used to re-create the nuclear explosive tests....... Mark At 05:05 PM 4/2/2002 -0500, you wrote: In a message dated 4/1/02 6:24:24 AM Central Standard Time,wendt@kingcrab.nrl.navy.mil writes: better, is to use butane, since it's heavier than air. When you launch it at night, you get about a ten foot flame.... cool! I gotta TRY that! mark visit Wood Art Custom Designshttp://woodartcustom.freeservers.com or http://hometown.aol.com/lazybee45/myhomepage/business.html Hand crafted items made to order! from flytyr@southshore.com Wed Apr 3 15:08:41 2002 g33L8f401886 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 15:08:41 -0600 g33L8cO24525 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 15:08:39 -0600 Subject: Re: How long can you keep it up? Don,I have met you and yours, I don't think she didall of that to keep you out from under foot. Ithink she did that because she is a great person.Gee, I would not complain.LOL.Come down and see me, bring her along, some mightrub off on my wife.I have you beat by almost two years, will have my52 nd this year, mine has put up with rodmaking had to contend with including a couple ofHomebuilt Airplanes.Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com Don Greife wrote: Congratulations Harry, on your 20th, and to youW.R. for your perseverence. I've only beenrefinishing old cane for about 15 years and justrecently decided to build one,,and "may" havebeen persuaded to do that. You see,,the ol' girland I have been together for 50 this pastFebruary 16. She wanted me out from under footso much that she had a new shed built to keep meand my treasures in. She had it heated andinsulated and has promised to A/C it if I'llstay out there most of the time. She also boughtme a culm of cane, planes, a maple form and abunch of other stuff. Just thought you shouldknow what you could look forward to if you cankeep your nose clean for another 30. Don Greife From: "Lamberson, William R." Subject: RE: How long can you keep it up?Date: Wed, 3 Apr 2002 10:21:49 - 0600 I bought my first bamboo from the Demarests in 1980. I have carried it, along with bars of CRSacross the country on various moves. Severalmachinists took the opportunity to ruin the barsof steel, so while looking for one that couldactually make a planing form, I occupied myselfin rebuilding old rods, etc. When I saw theMorgan Mills advertised, I decided that was theway to go. I sold guns, rods, musicalinstruments and built a few miles to fence toscrounge enough money to place the order. WhileI was waiting for it to be delivered I got theold steel bars out and filed out a set of forms,pulled the bamboo from the attic and built arod. I finished the first rod about 18 yearsafter I bought the bamboo, so my wife has beenputting up with the stuff for about 22 yearsnow. Bill Lamberson -----Original Message----- Sent: Wednesday, April 03, 2002 10:10 AM Subject: How long can you keep it up? Friends, Sorry for the leading subject line, but SWMNBTFG (She Who Must Not Be Taken For Granted) and I have been married that any woman would put up with me for 20 years. All the conversations of the past coupla weeks have made me curious how long the average rod maker lasts. Perhaps some of you guys were building rods twenty years ago, back when Tami and I were first married. Though I wasn't building rods then, I did take a fly rod (fiberglass -- still have it) with me on our honeymoon, and actually caught a few native brookies in the mountains of North Carolina during daylight hours. Who among us has been building rods for more than 20 years? Back when I was a young pup filled with delusions of grandeur? Who's been making rods years? Anyone? I built my first bamboo rod in 1997 (first graphite in 1993), and in my sixth year of building rods just finished number 55, counting blanks. I can see myself doing this for another 25 or 30 years, and wonder how many of us will still be making rods in 2025? Just curious,Harry --Harry Boyd http://www.canerods.com/ Bamboo Rodshttp://www.fbcwin.com/ Our Church -------------------------------------------------Join the world's largest e-mail service with MSNHotmail. Click Here from caneman@clnk.com Wed Apr 3 15:14:43 2002 g33LEg402423 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 15:14:43 -0600 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35) Subject: Re: How to get off the list Got the info to Richard about how to unsubscribe. Richard is a top =notch guide and will be missed on the list... but I'm keeping in =touch... gonna have him take me after some of those little Brookies one =of these days! Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com Subject: Re: How to get off the list How do I get off this list? All I do is a little restoring and the =list is a little more involved with building bamboo rods. A lot of info = Guide/Fly Fishing Instructor/Custom Tier Got the info to Richard about how to = Richard is a top notch guide and will be missed on the list... but I'm = in touch... gonna have him take me after some of those little Brookies = these days! Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com ----- Original Message ----- Harry= Cc: rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= Sent: Wednesday, April 03, 2002 = PMSubject: Re: How to get off the = list BrooksideNC@aol.com = get off this list? All I do is a little restoring and the list is a = more involved with building bamboo rods. A lot of info just not for = Tight = Richard = Instructor/Custom Tier from tedknott@cogeco.ca Wed Apr 3 15:24:38 2002 g33LOb403339 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 15:24:38 -0600 Subject: Re: How long can you keep it up? I got married in 1958, so we are coming up for 44 years this fall. My wifeis from New Brunswick and we planned our first vacation around a trip to herhome town. I wanted to fish for Atlantic salmon and found out only flyfishing was allowed, so went out and bought my first fly rod, so my start infly fishing is coming up for 43 years next month. I had made a few fibreglass rods from blanks, but it wasn't until the early 70's that I made myfirst bamboo rod. It took me a year to assemble the tools. The planingform was the biggest delay. I persuaded a machine shop teacher friend toassign the form to a senior machine shop student. The student did this as abonus project whenever his regular studies were up to date. I used Herter'sbook as a guide and it took me all winter to make the first rod. I made arod a year for several years, then two, and it snowballed from there. I'mstill trying to get my wife interested in fly fishing. Last summer we tooka fly fishing course with the Elderhostel Program which was offered on theCrowsnest in Alberta. She enjoyed that and wants to accompany me on atripto the York River in Gaspe' this June for Salmon. So there is hope for heryet! from rmoon@ida.net Wed Apr 3 16:03:42 2002 g33M3f406006 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 16:03:41 -0600 Rodmakers List-serv Subject: Re: How long can you keep it up? Thanks HarryI finished my first rod in 1972, but it took about a year for me tobuild it. I don't know what constitutes "rod building" for your terms,but I first became interested in building in 1952, and spent the nexttwenty years vainly searching for information, materials, and tools. Itfinally came together in the very early 70"s.Pat and I have been married only 18 years, but she has always supportedmy rod building (never helping, only supporting), However she did onetime when a rod of mine on an auction was really dragging, bid $275 andhad me pay for it. Thats what I mean by support!!! Really, length oftime is not very material. I know dozens of guys who make better rodsthan I who have been at it only a few years, and I have always been ableto learn something new from darned near any rod builder I talk to.You are a great bunch of guys. Ralph Harry Boyd wrote: Ed, Congratulations !! So far you've got more stamina than anyone whohas responded. Heck, I was turned 5 years old in October 1963!! Those of you who have been at this a long time - Ed, Bill Harms,Bill Fink, Ralph Moon, Don and a few others who have built many,many rods - really are treasures to us "new kids." I really hopethat we can build on the spirit and inventiveness you guys haveshown and make the bamboo rods of tomorrow even better than thosethe best makers are building today. Accomplishing that goal wouldbe a fine tribute to you guys. Harry Ed Hartzell wrote: Harry;I built my first bamboo rod in 1963.Ed --Harry Boyd http://www.canerods.com/ Bamboo Rodshttp://www.fbcwin.com/ Our Church --http://www.ida.net/users/rmoon from rsgould@cmc.net Wed Apr 3 16:22:30 2002 g33MMT407195 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 16:22:29 -0600 Subject: Re: How long can you keep it up? Hi to all,Sue and I have been married for 52yrs. I've been a fly fisherman since the1940's and a cane rod builder for the last 24 yrs and I ain't done yet!Ray----- Original Message ----- Subject: How long can you keep it up? Friends, Sorry for the leading subject line, but SWMNBTFG (SheWho Must Not Be Taken For Granted) and I have been married woman would put up with me for 20 years. All theconversations of the past coupla weeks have made me curioushow long the average rod maker lasts. Perhaps some of you guys were building rods twenty yearsago, back when Tami and I were first married. Though Iwasn't building rods then, I did take a fly rod (fiberglass-- still have it) with me on our honeymoon, and actuallycaught a few native brookies in the mountains of NorthCarolina during daylight hours. Who among us has been building rods for more than 20years? Back when I was a young pup filled with idealism anddelusions of grandeur? Who's been making rods for 30years? Anyone? I built my first bamboo rod in 1997 (first graphite in1993), and in my sixth year of building rods just finishednumber 55, counting blanks. I can see myself doing this foranother 25 or 30 years, and wonder how many of us will stillbe making rods in 2025? Just curious,Harry --Harry Boyd http://www.canerods.com/ Bamboo Rodshttp://www.fbcwin.com/ Our Church from richjez@enteract.com Wed Apr 3 18:32:00 2002 g340W0412175 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 18:32:00 -0600 Subject: Re: Elgin IL fishing The Fox river flows right through Elgin. It has assorted freshwater fish, including some small mouths. No trout. The nearest trout are Lake Michigan or Wisconsin. Let me know if you want more info.Rich Jezioro At 11:03 AM 4/3/2002, Greg Kuntz wrote: Does anyone know the area? Do you go to Wisconsin to fish?Greg from rvenneri@ulster.net Wed Apr 3 18:35:29 2002 g340ZS412441 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 18:35:28 -0600 Organization: Venneri's Custom Components Subject: Re: moisture content Randall Gregory wrote: Forgot to ask what type of glue was used and how was it cured. How longof atime frame since glue-up? Randall----- Original Message -----From: "Robert Venneri" Sent: Tuesday, April 02, 2002 8:43 PMSubject: moisture content Hi Guys,I heve been working on a couple rods. They are varnished and ready towrap. I noticed that if I bend the blank it will stay bent a little whatI let it go. I have never seen this with a finished rod. Did I dosomething wrong? I think the blanks have taken in some moisture but Iamnot sure. If this is the case can I fix the problem or should I juststake my tomatoes with the 2 blanks. Best RegardsBob V Here is more info on the process I used to make these rodsI flamed , heat treated at 350 for 25 minsThe glue was urac it was glued up about 2 or 3 weeks ago and it wasnever heat set. it happened to 3 blanks from 2 diferent culms and I useda spirial node spacing. Can I bind again and heat treat some more? What temp would be safe not to harm the varnish and how long at thattemp temp. Best RegartdsBob V from bob@downandacross.com Wed Apr 3 19:17:16 2002 g341HE413558 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 19:17:15 -0600 3 Apr 2002 20:17:08 -0500 Subject: RE: moisture content Hi Bob:Sounds like you did a lot of heat treating. I would suspect that the glue isat fault. I ruined 2 good blanks before switching to the Ammonium Chlorideto kick the glue. I was using the Borden equivelent and I never had successwith the walnut flower. Have made many rods since with the kicker only. Notone failure yet.Also, you should not be glueing up with Urac if under 70 degrees. It causesit to weaken.You might try to cure it in the oven, but when it happened to me I justchucked them.Best regards,Bob ps. Got the package today. Thanks a million. Here is more info on the process I used to make these rodsI flamed , heat treated at 350 for 25 minsThe glue was urac it was glued up about 2 or 3 weeks ago and it wasnever heat set. it happened to 3 blanks from 2 diferent culms and I useda spirial node spacing. Can I bind again and heat treat some more?What temp would be safe not to harm the varnish and how long at thattemp temp. Best RegartdsBob V from TSmithwick@aol.com Wed Apr 3 19:28:36 2002 g341SZ414075 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 19:28:35 -0600 Subject: Re: moisture content In a message dated 4/4/2 12:37:32 AM, rvenneri@ulster.net writes: Bob - It's hard to imagine you have a moisture problem after this regimen. Are you absolutey sure that you don't have a glue failure? The problem may have been that the cane was too dry, and you don't have a good bond.. Take one of the rods out and cast it hard, then look at the seams for any sign of cracks in the varnish. from blitzenrods@yahoo.com Wed Apr 3 19:30:27 2002 g341UR414331 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 19:30:27 -0600 Wed, 03 Apr 2002 17:30:26 PST Subject: Marvin Hedge I'm refinishing an 8 1/2' 3pc. Heddon "Marvin Hedge"rod and would like to know more about him. I know hewas from Portland, Oregon and was involved in castingtournaments, introduced the double haul to thetournaments, and set a distance record in the 30's.Anyone know of additional information sources orpersonal knowledge of Marvin? __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTaxhttp://taxes.yahoo.com/ from blitzenrods@yahoo.com Wed Apr 3 19:37:59 2002 g341bw415486 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 19:37:58 -0600 Wed, 03 Apr 2002 17:37:57 PST Subject: Heddon Baitcaster ferrule sleeves One of the recent suggestions to alleviate the varnishstress line at the ferrule junction was to spike thesleeves. I've seen this on some contemporary bamboorods with a clear wrap over to reveal the detail andthought it was a clever touch, and good looking. I was surprised to see that a Heddon Baitcasting rodrecently received has that very same feature. Translucent yellow wraps over bright nickel silver.The ferrule sleeves are spiked. This rod is turn ofthe century vintage. While the finish is tired andneeds to be re-done, there weren't stress lines at theferrules. I've worked on other Heddon Baitcasters that were evenof higher quality which did not have the spikedsleeves, so I don't think it was a process they alwaysused, but apparently in the time frame of this rod itwas their practice to spike the sleeves. __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTaxhttp://taxes.yahoo.com/ from bob@downandacross.com Wed Apr 3 19:39:19 2002 g341dI415919 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 19:39:18 -0600 3 Apr 2002 20:38:54 -0500 Subject: RE: Marvin Hedge Hi Chris:I believe there is info in The Wise Fishermen's Encyclopedia on Hedge. Alsoa little in Osten's book on tournament casting. Look at the Golden GateCasting Club site as well. A lot of the times I see Hedge's name mentioned,it is in relation to the silk line tapers he worked so hard on. Interestingstuff.Take care.Bob -----Original Message----- Subject: Marvin Hedge I'm refinishing an 8 1/2' 3pc. Heddon "Marvin Hedge"rod and would like to know more about him. I know hewas from Portland, Oregon and was involved in castingtournaments, introduced the double haul to thetournaments, and set a distance record in the 30's.Anyone know of additional information sources orpersonal knowledge of Marvin? __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTaxhttp://taxes.yahoo.com/ from patrick.w.coffey@boeing.com Wed Apr 3 19:41:50 2002 g341fo416481 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 19:41:50 -0600 TAA12272 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 19:41:48 -0600 TAA08365 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 19:41:48 -0600 g341flt24784 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 17:41:47 -0800 (5.5.2650.21) id ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 08:33:44 -0800 Subject: test Patrick W. CoffeyAOG Incident Repair PlanningPhone: 425-234-2901Fax: 425-237-0083M-2112 M/C 61-79 from cristantr@rogers.com Wed Apr 3 19:47:08 2002 g341l7416906 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 19:47:07 -0600 (InterMail vM.5.01.04.06 201-253-122-122-106-20020109) with Subject: Bronze snake guides mail.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com from [24.112.204.167] using IDat Wed, 3 Apr 2002 20:46:58 -0500 Does anyone know where I might obtain bronze snake guides. Also if =anyone has opinions on the bronze guides vs. what is commercially =available today, those opinions would be greatly appreciated. Robert Does anyone know where I might obtain= appreciated. Robert from jsschaeffer@hotmail.com Wed Apr 3 20:11:16 2002 g342BG417750 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 20:11:16 -0600 Wed, 3 Apr 2002 18:11:10 -0800 Subject: Re: Sharpening Plane Irons FILETIME=[FD1066B0:01C1DB7D] You can rub the two stones together under running water, and they will stayflat.I do it about every other time I sharpen. Jeff Schaeffer from tjtrodmaker@yahoo.com Wed Apr 3 20:12:09 2002 g342C8417861 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 20:12:08 -0600 Wed, 03 Apr 2002 18:12:03 PST Subject: Re: Bronze snake guides http://snakeguides.com/ these are top notch! timothy --- Robert Cristant wrote: Does anyone know where I might obtain bronze snakeguides. Also if anyone has opinions on the bronzeguides vs. what is commercially available today,those opinions would be greatly appreciated. Robert ====="Gooda' mornin', mister bear!" ...Ride, boldly ride,"The shade replied, -"If you seek for Eldorado!" -- E.A.Poe __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTaxhttp://taxes.yahoo.com/ from canazon@mindspring.com Wed Apr 3 20:46:45 2002 g342ki419029 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 20:46:44 -0600 helo=oemcomputer) id 16sxGa-0004nk-00; Wed, 03 Apr 2002 21:46:25 -0500 Subject: Re: moisture content bob,novice maker here. i had the same problem with my first rod. when iflexed the blank, they just stayed put.it looked like one of those mustadshrimp hooks. no return. they were bad and i was pretty disappointed. i didnot varnish them for some time after glue up, urac 185 and ammoniumchloride, and heat. i thought i had moisture re-entry and tried all the heatregimens. put it in my drying cabinet for a week at 95*. no good. then iheat treated it at 125 for half hour, then 1 hour. i did this twice withslight improvement.i was going to can it, or watch it burn like brett, but i didn't want torisk running it upstairs to the fireplace and having a heart attack. so ifigured i'd practice seating ferrules and wrapping. i don't know whathappened but i wrapped the guides on, then varnished, and i have a decentflyrod. it recovers very nicely, no set.i only heat treated the rod for 7 or 8 minutes at 325, but i am surethat i overcooked the rod because my oven wasn't right and i had hot spotsin it. i am not sure if overcooking or poor hand planing and bad anglescontributed to the set. i used a 3x3 stagger and i believe that (havingthree weak spots in one place) contributed to the problem. my sets weredeadon the nodal areas of the rod. it doesn't sound as though your problem is asnearly as bad as mine was.my guides are placed on or very close to the nodes. i don't know ifguide placement or the varnish has stiffened the rod, but i can cast it allday without a set. since it's your first rod, i'd try putting it in a dryingcabinet for a few days or give it low heat in the oven, and then wrap it.tomorrow i'll let you know how it holds up under the strain of an 8"stockie. if i'm lucky.mike from crmitchell@ocsonline.com Wed Apr 3 20:47:22 2002 g342lK419126 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 20:47:20 -0600 helo=ocsonline.com) id 16sxFg-0004Wo-00 for rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu; Wed, 03 Apr 2002 21:45:28 -0500 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:0.9.4)Gecko/20011128 Netscape6/6.2.1 Subject: re: How long can you keep it up? Just celebrated the 34th anniversary; guess she's stuck with me. As in another post, she likes for me to have a hobby that absorbs most of my free time; she just finished looking through the real estate ads for another house where I can enlarge the shop (and her kitchen, etc.). I'm still working on the first bamboo, but keep being distracted by all those interesting things that come before such as the tools. Fascinated since I got the key to the machine shop in a previous job and learned to build silencers. Started fly fishing with bamboo around age 10 (1954), when granddad gave me an old HI. (still have some of it). Couldn't afford a line, so, not understanding that it is weight rather than stiffness that makes it work, put beeswax on a black nylon casting line and went to the creek. Later, around 1955, an uncle took pity and gave me a South Bend 359 which was magnificent. Fished with that for years, took it to college, Europe and back, and could then afford a new plastic rod, so it was retired. In the mid 70's found it again behind the hot water heater. It had delaminated completely. Having absolutly no idea how to go about it, dissassembled, scraped glue off, removed the varnish, and reglued it with wood glue. Wrapped with cotton cord, and hung a 10 lb. weight to have it dry straight. Wrapped with what looks to be rayon from the sewing store. Polished up the hardware, varnished, etc. Presented it back to the uncle for Christmas in 1985 - 30 years later. He broke down and cried - until his wife walked in and he showed it to her, whereupon she grabbed the tube and started screaming and beating him with it. Seems he forgot she had given it to him on their first anniversary in 1950 and never knew he had given it away! Last week he asked me to look at a loose ferrule, so I intend to strip it down and restore it right this time. Another uncle gave me a bamboo spinning rod and reel in the mid 50's; he got it in France post war. Restored it fully (horrible action) and gave it back for his 80th birthday a couple of years ago. My cousin has it on display in his office. Several years ago got the urge for another SB 359 just like I started with, the bug bit and the real fun began. Love restoring bamboo, especially trying to get them to look and feel like new and have done about 20. Love to fish the antiques. Showed up on the Bighorn with one 2 years ago and the guide nearly croaked when he learned it was almost exactly 100 years old. Caught one fish and retired it. Will get serious about finishing the first from scratch when I complete the 3 in progress. Many thanks to the list for all the info and entertainment. Can't wait to review every night. from atlasc1@earthlink.net Wed Apr 3 21:31:43 2002 g343Vg420360 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 21:31:42 -0600 ([209.179.147.66] helo=computer) id 16sxyL-0005yT-00 for rodmakers@mail.wustl.edu; Wed, 03 Apr 2002 19:31:37 -0800 Subject: Re: How long can you keep it up? How long can I keep it up?! That is kind of personal. So I will talk aboutCane rodmaking instead. One year ago this month I read an article on Rod and Reel magazine. I neededsomething that would keep me active instead of sitting in front of the T.V.I had experience in working wood, plastics, leather, silver and just lovedworking with my hands. I alway said if I wasnt a chiropractor I would be amachinist. My machinist patients tell me I made the right choice. Anyway...I was sitting in my office between patients and I read an article on Bamboorodmaking. It was lunch time so I told my wife "I am going to make bambooflyrods, we are going to Marriotts to buy a book!" Drove the 30 minutes toget to the fly fishing store. Looked at Garrisons book and said "what thehell? there has to be an easier way." I ended up getting WC book and tapes. Now it is one year later. 5 rods under my belt. Found the list and built myfirst cane rod. I had never even fished a cane rod before. Now after fishing25 years with the best technology advertised those rods sit in my closetgiving way to the future of flyfishing "good cane rods". I find my self with3 rod orders to fill. I am working slower because the pleasure for me iscreating the rod not selling it. In fact I have a 3pc. 8' 5wt hollow builtinternally taper rod on the drawing table that will have the ferrules, reelseat made in my shop. I did the snake maker...did not like it...so I buythose. I think I will be able to keep it up for quite sometime. My wife willbe happier. Adam Vigil from rcrensha@midsouth.rr.com Wed Apr 3 22:28:24 2002 g344SN425625 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 22:28:23 -0600 g344SL900437; Subject: Re: How long can you keep it up? Harry,Congratulations to you and Tami. I built my first rod a few monthsafter you built yours (you might recall your encouraging mails to me backthen). I didn't know a soul who built rods - just bought the book (thenbought WAYNE'S book) then built a rod with the books and the help of thelist. So I guess we have another 15 years to make 20 in rodmaking. BTW,seems we are on similar timetables. Susan and I will hit our 20th thisAugust 14th. Reckon I won't be fishing that day. Rick----- Original Message ----- Subject: How long can you keep it up? Friends, Sorry for the leading subject line, but SWMNBTFG (SheWho Must Not Be Taken For Granted) and I have been married woman would put up with me for 20 years. All theconversations of the past coupla weeks have made me curioushow long the average rod maker lasts. Perhaps some of you guys were building rods twenty yearsago, back when Tami and I were first married. Though Iwasn't building rods then, I did take a fly rod (fiberglass-- still have it) with me on our honeymoon, and actuallycaught a few native brookies in the mountains of NorthCarolina during daylight hours. Who among us has been building rods for more than 20years? Back when I was a young pup filled with idealism anddelusions of grandeur? Who's been making rods for 30years? Anyone? I built my first bamboo rod in 1997 (first graphite in1993), and in my sixth year of building rods just finishednumber 55, counting blanks. I can see myself doing this foranother 25 or 30 years, and wonder how many of us will stillbe making rods in 2025? Just curious,Harry --Harry Boyd http://www.canerods.com/ Bamboo Rodshttp://www.fbcwin.com/ Our Church from Jfoster@sunset.net Wed Apr 3 22:42:18 2002 g344gH426140 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 22:42:18 -0600 g344gBEx018985 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 20:42:12 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:0.9.4)Gecko/20011130 Netscape6/6.2.1 Subject: Re: NASA Photos Thanks Claude That GRIN site is WOW. Jerry from dongreife@hotmail.com Wed Apr 3 23:12:06 2002 g345C5426940 for ; Wed, 3 Apr 2002 23:12:05 -0600 Wed, 3 Apr 2002 21:11:51 -0800 HTTP; Thu, 04 Apr 2002 05:11:51 GMT Subject: Re: How long can you keep it up? FILETIME=[3B039640:01C1DB97] Tony, Nothing would please me more than to visit with you,,and i'm givingyou fair warning that I will do so just as soon as I get a few chores takencare of. It may be late in the summer or early this fall. There is little doubt inmy mind that you 'mama' takes good care of you as well, and you know theyhave to have a soft spot for 'old kids' just to have cooked for us and endured keep it up? MSN Photos is the easiest way toshare and print your photos: Click Here from KyleDruey@aol.com Thu Apr 4 00:14:43 2002 g346Eg428312 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 00:14:42 -0600 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 01:14:35 -0500 Subject: Uslan Mill If anyone has a spare 3 grand rattling around in their pocket they can purchase that 5 strip milling machine you've always wanted off of ebay: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1818502041 I thought this was interesting. Have a great day, Kyle from ajthramer@hotmail.com Thu Apr 4 01:56:12 2002 g347uC400193 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 01:56:12 -0600 Wed, 3 Apr 2002 23:56:06 -0800 Thu, 04 Apr 2002 07:56:06 GMT Subject: Re: How long can you keep it up? FILETIME=[2CE71A20:01C1DBAE] I have always maintained that a wife who understands the bond that cane has with some of us and is not threatened is one of the most valuable assets we can have in pursuing rodmaking. I am apparently one of the young guys, only 44 and married 18yrs. Married to cane for 20. I am unusually blessed in that I can live and breath cane whenever I want to. Had an idea at 3:30 AM and got up went to the shop and worked until 5. What a joy to own your life! Almost up to 800 rods now.A.J. From: Harry Boyd Subject: How long can you keep it up?Date: Wed, 03 Apr 2002 10:09:39 - 0600 caught a few native brookies in the mountains of North> Harry --Harry Boyd http://www.canerods.com/ Bamboo Rodshttp://www.fbcwin.com/ Our Church _________________________________________________________________Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com from avyoung@iinet.net.au Thu Apr 4 02:04:16 2002 g3484E400536 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 02:04:14 -0600 rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Subject: Re: How long can you keep it up? Whoa! Had an idea at 3:30 AM and got up went to the shop and worked until 5. What a joy to own your life! Almost up to 800 rods now.A.J. /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from horsesho@ptd.net Thu Apr 4 05:35:02 2002 g34BZ2403069 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 05:35:02 -0600 by uid 50002 with qmail-scanner-1.10 (uvscan: v4.1.60/v4194. .Clear:0. Processed in 1.079918 secs); 04 Apr 2002 11:35:01 -0000 sender ) User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:0.9.4)Gecko/20011019 Netscape6/6.2 Subject: Re: Rod ID --------------060303030309070800040101 The Heddon Pal Mark II is a fiberglass rod . Worh about $20. Marty CAIrvinerods@aol.com wrote: A friend has emailed a message about a Heddon rod, Pal Mark II, I can find no reference to this rod in either of Sinclairs books. I have not seen the rod so do not know much about it but it is 8 1/2 feet. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks, Chuck --------------060303030309070800040101 The Heddon Pal Mark II is a fiberglass rod . Worh about $20. Marty CAIrvinerods@aol.com wrote: A friend has emailed a message about a Heddon rod, Pal Mark II, I can findno reference to this rod in either of Sinclairs books. I have not seen therod so do not know much about it but it is 8 1/2 feet. Any help would beappreciated. Thanks, Chuck --------------060303030309070800040101-- from wendt@kingcrab.nrl.navy.mil Thu Apr 4 05:40:28 2002 g34BeR403395 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 05:40:27 -0600 g34BeLtx015182 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 06:40:21 -0500 Subject: Re: How long can you keep it up? Harry, You're 1 year, 1 month older than me. I wanted to start building 'boo rods back in the late 70's, when I picked up the "Bible" ( Garrison's book ), hot off the presses, in it's first printing. I was a fly fishing freak back then, (not much has changed...) and my Dad had an old Monty 9 footer, (which he already told me was mine when he leaves us), and I loved to cast that old rod. I couldn't find any body back then that could make up a set of forms for me, because 1- I was in college, 2 - related to #1, didn't have a lot of extra spare change, and 3 - girls.... I kept the book, however, fished a bunch in between then and now, spent a good time in the military, and last year, was going through some old boxes in the attic, and came across the book again. One of my close friends and I have assembled plastic rods for a number of years, and one night while we were chewing the fat, tying some flies, I said, hey, why don't we try to create a 'boo rod. He looked at me like I was kinda nuts, but I eventually talked him into it. We've been slowly accumulating the stuff to start building, and hopefully, by summer, we'll start planing. Mark At 02:37 PM 4/3/2002 -0600, you wrote: Ed, Congratulations !! So far you've got more stamina than anyone whohas responded. Heck, I was turned 5 years old in October 1963!! Those of you who have been at this a long time - Ed, Bill Harms,Bill Fink, Ralph Moon, Don and a few others who have built many,many rods - really are treasures to us "new kids." I really hopethat we can build on the spirit and inventiveness you guys haveshown and make the bamboo rods of tomorrow even better than thosethe best makers are building today. Accomplishing that goal wouldbe a fine tribute to you guys. Harry Ed Hartzell wrote: Harry;I built my first bamboo rod in 1963.Ed --Harry Boyd http://www.canerods.com/ Bamboo Rodshttp://www.fbcwin.com/ Our Church from wendt@kingcrab.nrl.navy.mil Thu Apr 4 05:59:15 2002 g34BxE404008 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 05:59:14 -0600 g34Bx8tx015392 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 06:59:08 -0500 Subject: Re: rodmaking April Fool's Day Contest Heh, Heh, Kinda hard to deny, when it's in your own back yard.... Mark At 07:15 PM 4/3/2002 -0500, you wrote: In a message dated 4/3/02 7:20:21 AM Central Standard Time,wendt@kingcrab.nrl.navy.mil writes: weren'thowever... Not sure if they were pissed, just wondered what the hell hadhappened. I think they thought a gas main or something had blown! All you would have to say was, "Who? me? what explosion! It wasn't me,andI was in disguise at the time anyway!" mark visit Wood Art Custom Designshttp://woodartcustom.freeservers.com or http://hometown.aol.com/lazybee45/myhomepage/business.html Hand crafted items made to order! from dpeaston@wzrd.com Thu Apr 4 06:30:56 2002 g34CUt404632 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 06:30:55 -0600 Subject: Re: moisture content Hi mike, My experience has been that rods that have poor bonding between splines stiffen if the splines are kept from creeping by one another. Ferrules and wraps can temporarily hide the poor lamination but eventually you get failure. Often rods that I restore have partial de laminations that do not show up until I have the guides and/or ferrules off. When I do not find these problems first they will show up later as serious de lamination or breakage. At 09:46 PM 4/3/2002 -0600, mike canazon wrote: bob,novice maker here. i had the same problem with my first rod. when iflexed the blank, they just stayed put.it looked like one of those mustadshrimp hooks. no return. they were bad and i was pretty disappointed. i didnot varnish them for some time after glue up, urac 185 and ammoniumchloride, and heat. i thought i had moisture re-entry and tried all the heatregimens. put it in my drying cabinet for a week at 95*. no good. then iheat treated it at 125 for half hour, then 1 hour. i did this twice withslight improvement.i was going to can it, or watch it burn like brett, but i didn't want torisk running it upstairs to the fireplace and having a heart attack. so ifigured i'd practice seating ferrules and wrapping. i don't know whathappened but i wrapped the guides on, then varnished, and i have a decentflyrod. it recovers very nicely, no set.i only heat treated the rod for 7 or 8 minutes at 325, but i am surethat i overcooked the rod because my oven wasn't right and i had hot spotsin it. i am not sure if overcooking or poor hand planing and bad anglescontributed to the set. i used a 3x3 stagger and i believe that (havingthree weak spots in one place) contributed to the problem. my sets weredeadon the nodal areas of the rod. it doesn't sound as though your problem is asnearly as bad as mine was.my guides are placed on or very close to the nodes. i don't know ifguide placement or the varnish has stiffened the rod, but i can cast it allday without a set. since it's your first rod, i'd try putting it in a dryingcabinet for a few days or give it low heat in the oven, and then wrap it.tomorrow i'll let you know how it holds up under the strain of an 8"stockie. if i'm lucky.mike Doug EastonTonawanda, NY from twilhelm@occasionalrod.com Thu Apr 4 06:43:15 2002 g34ChE405036 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 06:43:14 -0600 Thu, 4 Apr 2002 07:42:52 -0500 Subject: Re: Uslan Mill Kyle, If I am not mistaken, that mill has been up for auction before. It did notmeet it's reserve at that time. Some pre-embargo cane was also includedthat last time. I wonder where that bamboo went? Tim----- Original Message ----- Subject: Uslan Mill If anyone has a spare 3 grand rattling around in their pocket they canpurchase that 5 strip milling machine you've always wanted off of ebay: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1818502041 I thought this was interesting. Have a great day, Kyle from bdcbfr@chartermi.net Thu Apr 4 06:45:35 2002 g34CjY405302 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 06:45:34 -0600 Subject: Re: Uslan Mill Didn't this sell on E-Bay a couple of years ago from Nat's daughter in lawor some-such? Brian----- Original Message ----- Subject: Uslan Mill If anyone has a spare 3 grand rattling around in their pocket they canpurchase that 5 strip milling machine you've always wanted off of ebay: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1818502041 I thought this was interesting. Have a great day, Kyle from harms1@pa.net Thu Apr 4 07:13:41 2002 g34DDe406141 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 07:13:40 -0600 Subject: moisture content Hi Bob, I didn't realize, upon reading your first email, that there were twodifferent culms involved in the bending problems you encountered with yoursections. Considering this, I think it is unlikely that my earliersuggestions are applicable. Instead, I would agree with Bob Maulucci (andothers) that the problem is probably with glue failure. Even so, I would still strongly recommend testing strips from each culm yousplit out before proceeding farther with the building process. You willfind culms, from time to time, that may look great but are unsuitable fornoded rods. You can use a very bright desk light and a good pair of "Optivisors" toexamine the glue lines. Space your hands about six-eight inches apart, flexthe joint slightly, and then roll it slowly between your fingers. Do thisall along the length. Sometimes you can see the openings, and sometimesyoucan also feel them slipping over one another. Use a single-edge razor blade to probe a suspicious glue line. When youfind an opening, there are probably others in the same area. Once spreadwith the razor blade, slide a pin into the opening and move it up or down inthe open glue joint until you meet with the resistance of good glue. Thenposition a pin in similar fashion at the other end of the open joint. Dothis everywhere you find a problem, even until the joint looks like aporcupine. Then use Titebond II (or Brownell's Accra Glass epoxy) and workit deep into the openings with the razor blade. When you're satisfied thatall areas have been slathered, run the section through your binder again. An alternative to this may be to heat-treat the section to cause completedelamination, and then return each strip to your planing forms just toclean-up the glue surfaces. You can take it from there with an alternativeglue to what you had used previously. Cheers, Bill from canazon@mindspring.com Thu Apr 4 07:38:52 2002 g34Dcq406848 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 07:38:52 -0600 helo=oemcomputer) id 16t7Rl-0007K2-00; Thu, 04 Apr 2002 08:38:38 -0500 "Douglas P. Easton" Subject: Re: moisture content doug,i had never considered bonding as a problem, but you're probably right.my rod has serious issues regarding glue lines and such. i am sure the tipsection is going to break, and am preparing to make new tips for thatreason.i don't quite understand how a rod that has poor bonding would stiffenthe rod. also do you think you can get too much or too little glue to causethis "event".thanks dougmike Hi mike, My experience has been that rods that have poor bonding between splinesstiffen if the splines are kept from creeping by one another. > from canazon@mindspring.com Thu Apr 4 07:40:47 2002 g34Del407070 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 07:40:47 -0600 helo=oemcomputer) id 16t7Ti-0000VP-00; Thu, 04 Apr 2002 08:40:39 -0500 Subject: Re: Uslan Mill reedwanker got it!mike If I am not mistaken, that mill has been up for auction before. It did not meet it's reserve at that time. Some pre-embargo cane was also includedthat last time. I wonder where that bamboo went? from Grnmtrds@aol.com Thu Apr 4 07:44:45 2002 g34Dii407392 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 07:44:44 -0600 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 08:44:28 -0500 Subject: test test tye testtesttest from wendt@kingcrab.nrl.navy.mil Thu Apr 4 07:53:01 2002 g34Dr0407822 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 07:53:00 -0600 g34Dqstx017154 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 08:52:54 -0500 Subject: SRG Anybody have any insight as to when the registration for this year's SRG is going to start? Mark from dnorl@qwest.net Thu Apr 4 08:09:22 2002 g34E9L408536 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 08:09:21 -0600 (63.228.45.84) Subject: Re: How long can you keep it up? Harry,I married my childhood sweetheart, the girl up the block 51 years ago. I waslucky! She is still around after a stint in the Army during the Korean warand 40 years on the Fire Departmant.I made my first rod with a kit fromn Herters in my junior year of highschool. That was in 1946. I have never tired of it. I have made a gazillionglass and graphite rods for flyfishing, baitcasting, spinning, you name it.Bamboo rods# 47 and 48 are soaking ready to plane. Everyone I know hasoneor more of my creations. At 71 years of age I still love to hunt, fish trainmy dogs and build rods ,and am physically able to do it.I have been richly blessed.Dave-----Original Message----- Subject: How long can you keep it up? Friends, Sorry for the leading subject line, but SWMNBTFG (SheWho Must Not Be Taken For Granted) and I have been married woman would put up with me for 20 years. All theconversations of the past coupla weeks have made me curioushow long the average rod maker lasts. Perhaps some of you guys were building rods twenty yearsago, back when Tami and I were first married. Though Iwasn't building rods then, I did take a fly rod (fiberglass-- still have it) with me on our honeymoon, and actuallycaught a few native brookies in the mountains of NorthCarolina during daylight hours. Who among us has been building rods for more than 20years? Back when I was a young pup filled with idealism anddelusions of grandeur? Who's been making rods for 30years? Anyone? I built my first bamboo rod in 1997 (first graphite in1993), and in my sixth year of building rods just finishednumber 55, counting blanks. I can see myself doing this foranother 25 or 30 years, and wonder how many of us will stillbe making rods in 2025? Just curious,Harry --Harry Boyd http://www.canerods.com/ Bamboo Rodshttp://www.fbcwin.com/ Our Church from patrick.w.coffey@boeing.com Thu Apr 4 08:12:40 2002 g34ECe408877 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 08:12:40 -0600 IAA11170 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 08:12:38 -0600 GAA23229 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 06:12:38 -0800 g34ECbt08929 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 06:12:37 -0800 (5.5.2650.21) id ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 06:12:36 -0800 Subject: how long I was taught how to build bamboo rods by Dawn Holbrook in 1965 and I wasjust a punk kid of 20, god how time flies when you're having fun!! Patrick W. CoffeyAOG Incident Repair PlanningPhone: 425-234-2901Fax: 425-237-0083M-2112 M/C 61-79 from avyoung@iinet.net.au Thu Apr 4 08:15:35 2002 g34EFW409240 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 08:15:33 -0600 Subject: Re: moisture content I was once asked by this guy who I must say I have no hard feelings over to refurbish an old English rod with I think about 250 odd intermediates, that's what it seemed like anyhow.It was a little #7 that surprisingly wasn't a bad little casting rod. I tried it before removing all the wraps then again after and it was a completely different rod without the intermediates, really sloppy.Quite a good lesson on just what a difference the wraps do make actually even considering all the extra weight the wraps must pick up with the varnish filling them. Tony At 07:30 AM 4/4/02 -0500, Douglas P. Easton wrote: Hi mike, My experience has been that rods that have poor bonding between splines stiffen if the splines are kept from creeping by one another. Ferrules and wraps can temporarily hide the poor lamination but eventually you get failure. Often rods that I restore have partial de laminations that do not show up until I have the guides and/or ferrules off. When I do not find these problems first they will show up later as serious de lamination or breakage. At 09:46 PM 4/3/2002 -0600, mike canazon wrote: bob,novice maker here. i had the same problem with my first rod. when iflexed the blank, they just stayed put.it looked like one of those mustadshrimp hooks. no return. they were bad and i was pretty disappointed. i didnot varnish them for some time after glue up, urac 185 and ammoniumchloride, and heat. i thought i had moisture re-entry and tried all the heatregimens. put it in my drying cabinet for a week at 95*. no good. then iheat treated it at 125 for half hour, then 1 hour. i did this twice withslight improvement.i was going to can it, or watch it burn like brett, but i didn't want torisk running it upstairs to the fireplace and having a heart attack. so ifigured i'd practice seating ferrules and wrapping. i don't know whathappened but i wrapped the guides on, then varnished, and i have a decentflyrod. it recovers very nicely, no set.i only heat treated the rod for 7 or 8 minutes at 325, but i am surethat i overcooked the rod because my oven wasn't right and i had hotspotsin it. i am not sure if overcooking or poor hand planing and bad anglescontributed to the set. i used a 3x3 stagger and i believe that (havingthree weak spots in one place) contributed to the problem. my sets weredeadon the nodal areas of the rod. it doesn't sound as though your problem isasnearly as bad as mine was.my guides are placed on or very close to the nodes. i don't know ifguide placement or the varnish has stiffened the rod, but i can cast it allday without a set. since it's your first rod, i'd try putting it in a dryingcabinet for a few days or give it low heat in the oven, and then wrap it.tomorrow i'll let you know how it holds up under the strain of an 8"stockie. if i'm lucky.mike Doug EastonTonawanda, NY /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from canazon@mindspring.com Thu Apr 4 08:15:42 2002 g34EFf409251 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 08:15:41 -0600 helo=oemcomputer) id 16t81V-0002u8-00; Thu, 04 Apr 2002 09:15:33 -0500 Subject: Re: Marvin Hedge chris,the silk line bob refers to is called a hedge 7 taper. i bought one onebay. i have yet to clean it up, but i am very interested to see how well(or poorly) i can throw a line with it.i have a book that he is mentioned in, but i can't seem to find it. ifi do i'll let you know.mike from rcurry@ttlc.net Thu Apr 4 08:29:08 2002 g34ET7410337 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 08:29:07 -0600 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:0.9.4)Gecko/20011019 Netscape6/6.2 Subject: Re: moisture content Tony, http://www.overmywaders.com/extracts/campimproving.html speaksof the use of intermediates for stiffening the rod. Of course some, like Divine, carried it a bit too far.Best regards,Reedhttp://www.overmywaders.com/ Tony Young wrote: I was once asked by this guy who I must say I have no hard feelings over to refurbish an old English rod with I think about 250 odd intermediates, that's what it seemed like anyhow.It was a little #7 that surprisingly wasn't a bad little casting rod. I tried it before removing all the wraps then again after and it was a completely different rod without the intermediates, really sloppy.Quite a good lesson on just what a difference the wraps do make actually even considering all the extra weight the wraps must pick up with the varnish filling them. Tony At 07:30 AM 4/4/02 -0500, Douglas P. Easton wrote: from jojo@ipa.net Thu Apr 4 08:39:52 2002 g34Edp410981 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 08:39:51 -0600 helo=default) id 16t8Oq-0008Jc-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Thu, 04 Apr 2002 09:39:40 -0500 Subject: Re: Uslan Mill The current owner was/is a List member. Tim is correct that it was on eBaysome time earlier w/bamboo. I recall Nunley bidding on this at that time, too. ;o) M-D Didn't this sell on E-Bay a couple of years ago from Nat's daughter in lawor some-such? Brian If anyone has a spare 3 grand rattling around in their pocket they canpurchase that 5 strip milling machine you've always wanted off of ebay: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1818502041 I thought this was interesting. Have a great day, Kyle from jojo@ipa.net Thu Apr 4 08:41:44 2002 g34Efi411260 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 08:41:44 -0600 helo=default) id 16t8Qm-00086P-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Thu, 04 Apr 2002 09:41:40 -0500 Subject: Re: SRG If history repeats, the boys should post something this month. M-D Anybody have any insight as to when the registration for this year's SRG is going to start? Mark from bob@downandacross.com Thu Apr 4 08:42:10 2002 g34Eg9411378 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 08:42:10 -0600 4 Apr 2002 09:45:02 -0500 Subject: Nice article on cryogenic treatments of metals Guys:Found this while researching some bench planes. Very interesting. I may sendsome milling cutters out to see if this will work on them as well. They arein need of resharpening, so according to the article, this would be theright time for it.http://www.lie-nielsen.com/pdf/cryo.pdf BTW, I decided to go with the LN #2, and I am anxiously awaiting itsarrival. I am not taking calls this weekend. Okay!Best regards,Bob from wendt@kingcrab.nrl.navy.mil Thu Apr 4 09:01:41 2002 g34F1f412804 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 09:01:41 -0600 g34F1Ztx018329 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 10:01:35 -0500 Subject: Re: SRG Awaiting with bated breath..... Mark At 08:31 AM 4/4/2002 -0600, you wrote: If history repeats, the boys should post something this month. M-D From: "Mark Wendt" Anybody have any insight as to when the registration for this year's SRG isgoing to start? Mark from jojo@ipa.net Thu Apr 4 09:19:17 2002 g34FJG413730 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 09:19:16 -0600 helo=default) id 16t918-0007PQ-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Thu, 04 Apr 2002 10:19:15 -0500 Subject: Latest Research Yesterday, scientists for Health Canada cautioned that men should take alook at their beerconsumption, considering the results of a recent analysis that revealed thepresence of femalehormones in beer. The theory is that drinking beer makes men turn intowomen, or at least morefeminine. To test the theory, 100 men were fed 6 pints of beer each. It wasthen observed that 100%of the men:1. Gained weight.2. Talked excessively without making sense.3. Became overly emotional.4. Couldn't drive.5. Failed to think rationally.6. Argued over nothing.7. And, refused to apologize when wrong. No further testing is planned. from JNL123141@msn.com Thu Apr 4 09:23:26 2002 g34FNP414169 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 09:23:25 -0600 Thu, 4 Apr 2002 07:23:16 -0800 "RodmakersPost" Subject: Re: Marvin Hedge FILETIME=[A4F32ED0:01C1DBEC] Mike,The Wise Fisherman's Encyclopedia has a great dissertation by Hedge on fl=y lines. The book will have to be found in a used book store or flea mar=ket though. ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Marvin Hedge chris,the silk line bob refers to is called a hedge 7 taper. i bought one onebay. i have yet to clean it up, but i am very interested to see how well(or poorly) i can throw a line with it.i have a book that he is mentioned in, but i can't seem to find it. =ifi do i'll let you know.mike dissertati= = ----- Original Message ----- From: mike canazon Sent:Thursda= ought one onebay. i have yet to clean it up, but i am very interested= from JNL123141@msn.com Thu Apr 4 09:32:49 2002 g34FWn415016 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 09:32:49 -0600 Thu, 4 Apr 2002 07:32:43 -0800 Subject: Re: Marvin Hedge FILETIME=[F6B3B8B0:01C1DBED] Chris,You might find out more from the American Casting Association web site or= from the Golden gate Casting Club in S.F. CA. Don't have a website addr=ess but the names should eventually get you there. ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Marvin Hedge I'm refinishing an 8 1/2' 3pc. Heddon "Marvin Hedge"rod and would like to know more about him. I know hewas from Portland, Oregon and was involved in castingtournaments, introduced the double haul to thetournaments, and set a distance record in the 30's.Anyone know of additional information sources orpersonal knowledge of Marvin? __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTaxhttp://taxes.yahoo.com/ Chris, You might find out more from the American Casting Association websit= site address but the names should eventually get you there.&n= Original Message ----- From: Chris McDowell Sent: Wednesday, April 03, 2002 8:33 PM ike to know more about him. I know hewas from Portland, Oregon andwa=s involved in castingtournaments, introduced the double haul to thetournaments, and set a distance record in the 30's.Anyone know ofa=dditional information sources orpersonal knowledge ofMarvin?=__________________________________________________DoYou Yahoo!?Y=ahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTaxhttp://taxes.yahoo.com/= from JNL123141@msn.com Thu Apr 4 09:34:57 2002 g34FYv415365 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 09:34:57 -0600 Thu, 4 Apr 2002 07:34:51 -0800 Subject: Re: Marvin Hedge FILETIME=[43136B10:01C1DBEE] Chris,How about micing and weighing (to see if it is hollow) the rod when it is=bare and sharing the taper? ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Marvin Hedge I'm refinishing an 8 1/2' 3pc. Heddon "Marvin Hedge"rod and would like to know more about him. I know hewas from Portland, Oregon and was involved in castingtournaments, introduced the double haul to thetournaments, and set a distance record in the 30's.Anyone know of additional information sources orpersonal knowledge of Marvin? __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTaxhttp://taxes.yahoo.com/ Chris, How about micing and weighing (to see if it is hollow) the rod when i= john&= - From: Chris McDowell Se= an =8 1/2' 3pc. Heddon "Marvin Hedge"rod and would like to know moreabou=t him. I know hewas from Portland, Oregon and was involved in casting=tournaments, introduced the double haul to thetournaments, andse=t a distance record in the 30's.Anyone know of additional information=sources orpersonal knowledge ofMarvin?_____________________=_____________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! TaxCenter - on=line filing withTurboTaxhttp://taxes.yahoo.com/= from JNL123141@msn.com Thu Apr 4 09:46:47 2002 g34Fkl416499 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 09:46:47 -0600 Thu, 4 Apr 2002 07:46:41 -0800 "RodmakersPost" Subject: Re: How long can you keep it up? FILETIME=[EA414FA0:01C1DBEF] ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: How long can you keep it up? In a message dated 4/3/02 8:11:07 AM Pacific Standard Time,fbcwin@3g.qui=k.com writes: Who's been making rods for 30years? Anyone? Bill Waara made rods for over 60 years, no idea how many, but all were pl=aned by hand. He never sold a rod. Donated and gave them away.john ----- Original Message ----- From: CALucker@aol.com Sent:Wed= nesday, April 03, 2002 1:48 PM T=o: fbcwin@3g.quik.com; rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Subject: Re: How long can you keep itup?= Paci=fic Standard Time, fbcwin@3g.quik.com writes:Who's been making rods for30years= over 60 = john from blitzenrods@yahoo.com Thu Apr 4 10:03:40 2002 g34G3d418007 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 10:03:39 -0600 Thu, 04 Apr 2002 08:03:36 PST Subject: Re: Marvin Hedge I'll mic it when I get the varnish off and weigh italso. It's a rod with some very interesting features. It hasthe walnut/pyralin downlock screwlock Heddon seat, andthe Heddon grip except it has holes drilled veryevenly spaced throughout the grip and a thumbplatform. I suppose this promotes gripping and aircirculation around the hand. I read somewhere thatMarvin used the thumb on top grip, so the indentedplatform stabilized the thumb position. The platformis formed of some malleable material that may havebeen custom made for the caster. The ferrules are belled at the welt and the veryslight welt is machined into them. The inside tapersso that the male seats smoothly, but their is space atthe top around the belled welt area. Very reinforcedferrules with a knurled surface. I can see wherethese might have been used to stand up to the highstress of distance casting, with the bell shape at thetop to allow some flex and diminish the chance ofcracking a welt. The rod is labeled: "A Marvin E. Hedge Rod""Medium Weight Trout""Made By Heddon" --- John Long wrote: Chris,How about micing and weighing (to see if it ishollow) the rod when it is bare and sharing thetaper? john ----- Original Message -----From: Chris McDowellSent: Wednesday, April 03, 2002 8:33 PM Subject: Marvin HedgeI'm refinishing an 8 1/2' 3pc. Heddon "Marvin Hedge"rod and would like to know more about him. I know hewas from Portland, Oregon and was involved incastingtournaments, introduced the double haul to thetournaments, and set a distance record in the 30's.Anyone know of additional information sources orpersonal knowledge of Marvin? __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTaxhttp://taxes.yahoo.com/ __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTaxhttp://taxes.yahoo.com/ from pvansch@wethersfield.k12.ct.us Thu Apr 4 11:21:12 2002 g34HLB422759 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 11:21:11 -0600 Subject: Rod Maker ID My long time fishing buddy who now lives in NC owns a cane rod that he sayssmells likes oranges every time you open the tube. He thinks the orange ispart of the makers "Signature". He can't remember the maker, the rod isherein CT so he can't just look. He thinks the maker is from VT or NH. Anyone have an idea who this might be? Thanks in advance, Pete from CALucker@aol.com Thu Apr 4 11:24:41 2002 g34HOe423219 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 11:24:40 -0600 Subject: Re: Bronze snake guides In a message dated 4/3/02 5:47:47 PM Pacific Standard Time, cristantr@rogers.com writes: Does anyone know where I might obtain bronze snake guides. Also ifanyone has opinions on the bronze guides vs. what is commercially available today, those opinions would be greatly appreciated. I only use bronze snake guides that I have been lucky enough to find over the years in old sporting goods and hardware stores. My best hit was I finding four gross in the tennis shop in Westwood Village (Los Angeles) that had (still has) a corner dedicated to fishing. The guides were still in their unopened Perfection wrappers. I do not think the old guides are better or worse than what is made today. I just think they look better. The tighter bend of some of the old guides and the smaller loop tip tops may cut casting distance a bit, but I do not care. I like the look of small guides on a rod. Bob Summers just completed a rod on it. It looks nicer than David Seidler's identical rod with new guides and casts the same as far as we could tell. Unfortunately, I may be lucky enough to wear my guides out in my lifetime, whereas Seidler will probably not wear out his modern snakes.The real struggle using the old guides is keeping them sorted out. DO NOT MAKE THE MISTAKE I DID. DO NOT DUMP YOUR OLD GUIDES INTO THE SAMECONTAINERS BECAUSE. PERFECTION'S 1/0 SNAKE IN 1936 (years chosen for examplepurposes only) HAS A DIFFERENT SHAPE THAN PERFECTION'S 1/0 IN 1956. It gets even worse if you mix Mildrums or other brand in with Perfections. Because I failed to incubate or isolate each of my guide finds I think I spend more time sorting through a pile of guides that are supposed to be the same size trying to match color, bend and foot length than I do actually wrapping. I can imagine that the tooling that held the pieces of wire got worn and changed the shape of the snake bends. Many of you may remember how theeye bend changed on many Mustad hooks at the end of the paper box era -- theeyes went from having a bend of 30 - 40 degrees to 70 - 80 degrees.Anyone know who made the old Herter's guides? They seem to be different from the Varmac's, Perfections, Spencers and Mildrums.Chris Lucker In a message dated 4/3/02 5:47:47 PM PacificStandard Time, cristantr@rogers.com writes: Does anyone know where bronze guides vs. what is commercially available today, those opinions wouldbe greatly appreciated. I only use bronze snake guides that I have been lucky enough to find over the finding four gross in the tennis shop in Westwood Village (Los Angeles) that I do not think the old guides are better or worse than what is made the old guides and the smaller loop tip tops may cut casting distance a bit, Summers just completed a rod for me and I had him use my old snake guides lifetime, whereas Seidler will probably not wear out his modern snakes. (years chosen for example purposes only) HAS A DIFFERENT SHAPE THAN each of my guide finds I think I spend more time sorting through a pile ofguides that are supposed to be the same size trying to match color, bend tooling that held the pieces of wire got worn and changed the shape of the on many Mustad hooks at the end of the paper box era -- the eyes went fromhaving a bend of 30 - 40 degrees to 70 - 80 degrees. different from the Varmac's, Perfections, Spencers and Mildrums.Chris Lucker from avyoung@iinet.net.au Thu Apr 4 11:25:38 2002 g34HPa423372 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 11:25:36 -0600 "Rodmakers List-serv" Subject: Re: How long can you keep it up? Who could ask for more than a contented long life? TY At 08:13 AM 4/4/02 -0600, Dave Norling wrote: Harry,I married my childhood sweetheart, the girl up the block 51 years ago. I waslucky! She is still around after a stint in the Army during the Korean warand 40 years on the Fire Departmant.I made my first rod with a kit fromn Herters in my junior year of highschool. That was in 1946. I have never tired of it. I have made a gazillionglass and graphite rods for flyfishing, baitcasting, spinning, you name it.Bamboo rods# 47 and 48 are soaking ready to plane. Everyone I know hasoneor more of my creations. At 71 years of age I still love to hunt, fish trainmy dogs and build rods ,and am physically able to do it.I have been richly blessed.Dave /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from avyoung@iinet.net.au Thu Apr 4 11:28:31 2002 g34HST423937 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 11:28:30 -0600 Subject: Re: moisture content That's it in a nut shell. Makes you think about just how much the fibers, glue and splines are moving laterally during use. Tony At 09:34 AM 4/4/02 -0500, Reed Curry wrote: Tony,http://www.overmywaders.com/extracts/campimproving.html speaks of the use of intermediates for stiffening the rod. Of course some, like Divine, carried it a bit too far.Best regards,Reedhttp://www.overmywaders.com/ Tony Young wrote: I was once asked by this guy who I must say I have no hard feelings over to refurbish an old English rod with I think about 250 odd intermediates, that's what it seemed like anyhow.It was a little #7 that surprisingly wasn't a bad little casting rod. I tried it before removing all the wraps then again after and it was a completely different rod without the intermediates, really sloppy.Quite a good lesson on just what a difference the wraps do make actually even considering all the extra weight the wraps must pick up with the varnish filling them.Tony At 07:30 AM 4/4/02 -0500, Douglas P. Easton wrote: /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from avyoung@iinet.net.au Thu Apr 4 11:30:14 2002 g34HUD424300 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 11:30:13 -0600 Subject: Re: Latest Research How was reverse parking affected? [:-)] TY At 09:08 AM 4/4/02 -0600, Jojo DeLancier wrote: Yesterday, scientists for Health Canada cautioned that men should take a look at their beerconsumption, considering the results of a recent analysis that revealed the presence of femalehormones in beer. The theory is that drinking beer makes men turn into women, or at least morefeminine. To test the theory, 100 men were fed 6 pints of beer each. It was then observed that 100%of the men:1. Gained weight.2. Talked excessively without making sense.3. Became overly emotional.4. Couldn't drive.5. Failed to think rationally.6. Argued over nothing.7. And, refused to apologize when wrong. No further testing is planned. /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from avyoung@iinet.net.au Thu Apr 4 11:32:50 2002 g34HWm424748 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 11:32:49 -0600 Subject: Re: Marvin Hedge Anybody out there know if somebody is stocking both Snake Brand guidesand Mildrum strippers? I know of a couple who do one or the other but I need to get some and would prefer to keep it in one order.My catalogues are a bit out of date. Tony /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from rcristant@isgtransport.com Thu Apr 4 11:34:40 2002 g34HYd425132 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 11:34:39 -0600 content-class: urn:content-classes:messageSubject: RE: Bronze snake guides Thread-Topic: Bronze snake guidesThread-Index: AcHb/bFZm8EDaMssQgCGvCRVFDpakQAATaFA Thanks to all for their help in this matter. Robert -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Bronze snake guides In a message dated 4/3/02 5:47:47 PM Pacific Standard Time,cristantr@rogers.com writes: Does anyone know where I might obtain bronze snake guides. Also ifanyone has opinions on the bronze guides vs. what is commerciallyavailable today, those opinions would be greatly appreciated. I only use bronze snake guides that I have been lucky enough to findover the years in old sporting goods and hardware stores. My best hitwas I finding four gross in the tennis shop in Westwood Village (LosAngeles) that had (still has) a corner dedicated to fishing. The guides I do not think the old guides are better or worse than what is madetoday. I just think they look better. The tighter bend of some of theold guides and the smaller loop tip tops may cut casting distance a bit,but I do not care. I like the look of small guides on a rod. BobSummers just completed a rod for me and I had him use my old snakeguides and small Perfection stripper on it. It looks nicer than DavidSeidler's identical rod with new guides and casts the same as far as wecould tell. Unfortunately, I may be lucky enough to wear my guides outin my lifetime, whereas Seidler will probably not wear out his modernsnakes.The real struggle using the old guides is keeping them sorted out. DONOT MAKE THE MISTAKE I DID. DO NOT DUMP YOUR OLD GUIDES INTO THESAMECONTAINERS BECAUSE. PERFECTION'S 1/0 SNAKE IN 1936 (years chosen forexample purposes only) HAS A DIFFERENT SHAPE THAN PERFECTION'S 1/0 IN1956. It gets even worse if you mix Mildrums or other brand in withPerfections. Because I failed to incubate or isolate each of my guidefinds I think I spend more time sorting through a pile of guides thatare supposed to be the same size trying to match color, bend and footlength than I do actually wrapping. I can imagine that the tooling thatheld the pieces of wire got worn and changed the shape of the snakebends. Many of you may remember how the eye bend changed on manyMustadhooks at the end of the paper box era -- the eyes went from having abend of 30 - 40 degrees to 70 - 80 degrees.Anyone know who made the old Herter's guides? They seem to be different from the Varmac's, Perfections, Spencers and Mildrums.Chris Lucker CleanDocumentEmail MicrosoftInternetExplorer4 table.MsoNormalTable {mso-style-name:"Table Normal"; mso-tstyle- rowband-size:0; mso-tstyle-colband-size:0; mso-style-noshow:yes; mso- style-parent:""; mso-padding-alt:0in 5.4pt 0in 5.4pt; mso-para- margin:0in; mso-para-margin-bottom:.0001pt; mso-pagination:widow- orphan; font-size:10.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman";} Thanks to all = help in this matter. Robert -----Original =Message-----From: CALucker@aol.com Sent: Thursday, April 04,=200212:24 PM cristantr@rogers.com;rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Re: Bronze snake=guides In a message dated 4/3/02 =5:47:47 PMPacific Standard Time, cristantr@rogers.com writes: Does anyone know where I =might bronzeguides vs. what is commercially available today, those opinions would begreatly appreciated. I only use bronze snake guides that I have been lucky enough to find =over the finding four gross in the tennis shop in Westwood Village (Los Angeles) =that still in I do not think the old guides are better or worse than what is made some ofthe old guides and the smaller loop tip tops may cut casting distance a =bit, BobSummers just completed a rod for me and I had him use my old snake =guides and Seidler's Unfortunately, I may be lucky enough to wear my guides out in my =lifetime,whereas Seidler will probably not wear out his modern snakes. DO NOT SAME chosen =forexample purposes only) HAS A DIFFERENT SHAPE THAN PERFECTION'S 1/0 IN= It gets even worse if you mix Mildrums or other brand in with guidefinds I think I spend more time sorting through a pile of guides that =aresupposed to be the same size trying to match color, bend and foot length =than I pieces youmay remember how the eye bend changed on many Mustad hooks at the endof =thepaper box era -- the eyes went from having a bend of 30 - 40 degrees to =70 - 80degrees. different from the Varmac's, Perfections, Spencers and Mildrums.Chris Lucker =00 from blitzenrods@yahoo.com Thu Apr 4 11:39:01 2002 g34Hd0425655 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 11:39:00 -0600 Thu, 04 Apr 2002 09:39:00 PST Subject: Re: Rod Maker ID A friend of mine who has a vast collection said thatsome Payne rods have an orange scent to the varnish. --- Peter Van Schaack wrote: My long time fishing buddy who now lives in NC ownsa cane rod that he sayssmells likes oranges every time you open the tube. He thinks the orange ispart of the makers "Signature". He can't rememberthe maker, the rod is herein CT so he can't just look. He thinks the maker is from VT or NH. Anyone have an idea who this might be? Thanks in advance, Pete __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTaxhttp://taxes.yahoo.com/ from avyoung@iinet.net.au Thu Apr 4 11:41:18 2002 g34HfG426034 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 11:41:16 -0600 "Rod Makers \(E-mail\)" Subject: e: Rod Maker ID Sounds like orange or mandarin essence oil. You can get it in the kinds of shops that sell incense and crystals and such run by people with names like 12 Green stones and Moon unit. TY At 12:23 PM 4/4/02 -0500, Peter Van Schaack wrote: My long time fishing buddy who now lives in NC owns a cane rod that he sayssmells likes oranges every time you open the tube. He thinks the orange ispart of the makers "Signature". He can't remember the maker, the rod isherein CT so he can't just look. He thinks the maker is from VT or NH. Anyone have an idea who this might be? Thanks in advance, Pete /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from douglosey@spectrumenergy.com Thu Apr 4 11:42:12 2002 g34HgB426217 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 11:42:11 -0600 Subject: Re: Latest Research M-D... That's cold man....forwarded this to the new wife....She is going to beat myA** when I get home.... losey from avyoung@iinet.net.au Thu Apr 4 11:45:10 2002 g34Hj9426773 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 11:45:09 -0600 Subject: Snake brand and Mildrum Strippers Thanks guys I've had a few replies. Tony ************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from Harris.James@ev.state.az.us Thu Apr 4 11:55:55 2002 g34Hts427706 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 11:55:55 -0600 g34HphH13012 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 10:51:43 -0700 10:53:54 2002 -0700 with Novell_GroupWise; Thu, 04 Apr 2002 10:55:48 -0700 Subject: oil and vinegar g34Htt427707 GuysI've been having a intermittent problem with the application of my varnish. Iuse a drip tube and MOW gloss. I've been getting an occasional separation between the varnish and the surface of the bamboo. The varnish initiallycoats the entire surface but later the smooth even coating will separate inplaces, exposing the unfinished bamboo. The bamboo and varnish are actinglike oil and vinegar. It usually occurs on the butt section near the grip andpulls back from the edges. This is what I've tried so far:Purchased new varnishSwitched from mineral spirits to alcohol for the final rubdown.Switched from alcohol to alcohol and shellac mixture for final rubdown (thishelped a bit)Purchased new non-oiled steel wool.Thinned the varnish with mineral spirits to about 80% varnish. (Varnishtemperature is not an issue here in Phoenix, except in storage) Other observations that may or may not be a factor are:This never occurs on the tip sections.This never happened when I was using URAC 185. I use PU these days.It usually does not occur if I filter the varnish just prior to filling the tube.It seems to happen more frequently on darker flamed rods. Have any of you had this problem and if so how did you solve it?Any recommendations? Thanks,JimH from avyoung@iinet.net.au Thu Apr 4 12:06:32 2002 g34I6T428498 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 12:06:30 -0600 Subject: Re: oil and vinegar Are you using a T shirt to wipe the rod down at any time?I ask because silicon in fabric softener never washes out and that (silicon) will cause these sorts of problems. Tony At 10:55 AM 4/4/02 -0700, James Harris wrote: GuysI've been having a intermittent problem with the application of my varnish. I use a drip tube and MOW gloss. I've been getting an occasional separation between the varnish and the surface of the bamboo. The varnish initially coats the entire surface but later the smooth even coating will separate in places, exposing the unfinished bamboo. The bamboo and varnish are acting like oil and vinegar. It usually occurs on the butt section near the grip and pulls back from the edges. This is what I've tried so far:Purchased new varnishSwitched from mineral spirits to alcohol for the final rubdown.Switched from alcohol to alcohol and shellac mixture for final rubdown (this helped a bit)Purchased new non-oiled steel wool.Thinned the varnish with mineral spirits to about 80% varnish. (Varnish temperature is not an issue here in Phoenix, except in storage) Other observations that may or may not be a factor are:This never occurs on the tip sections.This never happened when I was using URAC 185. I use PU these days.It usually does not occur if I filter the varnish just prior to filling the tube.It seems to happen more frequently on darker flamed rods. Have any of you had this problem and if so how did you solve it?Any recommendations? Thanks,JimH /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from Harris.James@ev.state.az.us Thu Apr 4 12:10:55 2002 g34IAs428943 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 12:10:54 -0600 g34I6hH13449 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 11:06:43 -0700 11:08:53 2002 -0700 with Novell_GroupWise; Thu, 04 Apr 2002 11:10:48 -0700 Subject: Re: oil and vinegar g34IAt428944 Yes I have been. Very good observation Tony Tony Young 04/04/02 11:13AM >>> Are you using a T shirt to wipe the rod down at any time?I ask because silicon in fabric softener never washes out and that (silicon) will cause these sorts of problems. Tony At 10:55 AM 4/4/02 -0700, James Harris wrote: GuysI've been having a intermittent problem with the application of my varnish. I use a drip tube and MOW gloss. I've been getting an occasional separation between the varnish and the surface of the bamboo. The varnish initially coats the entire surface but later the smooth even coating will separate in places, exposing the unfinished bamboo. The bamboo and varnish are acting like oil and vinegar. It usually occurs on the butt section near the grip and pulls back from the edges. This is what I've tried so far:Purchased new varnishSwitched from mineral spirits to alcohol for the final rubdown.Switched from alcohol to alcohol and shellac mixture for final rubdown (this helped a bit)Purchased new non-oiled steel wool.Thinned the varnish with mineral spirits to about 80% varnish. (Varnish temperature is not an issue here in Phoenix, except in storage) Other observations that may or may not be a factor are:This never occurs on the tip sections.This never happened when I was using URAC 185. I use PU these days.It usually does not occur if I filter the varnish just prior to filling the tube.It seems to happen more frequently on darker flamed rods. Have any of you had this problem and if so how did you solve it?Any recommendations? Thanks,JimH /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was onlyever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from avyoung@iinet.net.au Thu Apr 4 12:21:20 2002 g34ILJ429795 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 12:21:19 -0600 Subject: Re: oil and vinegar Oldie but a goodie [:-)] Tony At 11:10 AM 4/4/02 -0700, James Harris wrote: Yes I have been. Very good observation Tony Tony Young 04/04/02 11:13AM >>> Are you using a T shirt to wipe the rod down at any time?I ask because silicon in fabric softener never washes out and that(silicon) will cause these sorts of problems. Tony /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from johanyga@online.no Thu Apr 4 12:21:53 2002 g34ILo429895 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 12:21:51 -0600 Thu, 4 Apr 2002 20:21:38 +0200 (MET DST) "Rod Makers (E-mail)" Subject: SV: Rod Maker ID Peter,The following is an extract from M J. Keane's Classic Rods and Rodmakers; "Its sweet pungent odor, not unlike the smell of slightly burned orangeskins, is both pleasant and immediately recognized as a Payne trade mark.Collectors can identify a Payne with original finish right off the bat, butjust taking a sniff when opening the rod tube. Of course, absence of theheady aroma raises suspicion that the finish, or the container/bag, is notoriginal.regardsJohan-----Opprinnelig melding-----Fra: owner- rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sendt: 4. april 2002 19:23Til: Rod Makers (E-mail)Emne: Rod Maker ID My long time fishing buddy who now lives in NC owns a cane rod that he sayssmells likes oranges every time you open the tube. He thinks the orange ispart of the makers "Signature". He can't remember the maker, the rod isherein CT so he can't just look. He thinks the maker is from VT or NH. Anyone have an idea who this might be? Thanks in advance, Pete from d.weatherston@ntlworld.com Thu Apr 4 12:34:41 2002 g34IYf400946 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 12:34:41 -0600 Subject: Advice -choosing a maker All, I am a U.K flyfisher who has been using an edward Barder rod for =the past couple of seasons and am now sold on canr rods. I want to buy =another cane rod, how do I go about locating a manufacturer. here in the =U.K hardly anybody uses cane rods and its difficult assessing how =good/bad the few that are available are?Any advice would be welcome.David All, I am a U.K flyfisher who has been = edward Barder rod for the past couple of seasons and am now sold on canr = want to buy another cane rod, how do I go about locating a manufacturer. = the U.K hardly anybody uses cane rods and its difficult assessing how = the few that are available are?Any advice would be =welcome.David from tedknott@cogeco.ca Thu Apr 4 12:56:52 2002 g34Iup402331 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 12:56:52 -0600 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 13:56:50 -0500 Subject: CC deFrance and Lee Wulff Midge Values? I've been offered two rods for purchase, but I'm out of touch with currentre- sale values. What's a fair valuation for:Hardy CC de France, 8' 0", 2 piece, 1 tip rod in good overall shape. Rodshould have a little varnish touch-up here and there, and some straighteningof the tip. Has normal wear and tear for this age of rod. Farlows Lee Wulf Midge, 6' 0", 1 7/8 ozs, 2 piece, 2 tips, serial #1354.Good, straight over-all condition. Guide wraps starting to show somedeteriation, but still in fishable condition. from carstenjorgensen@mail.dk Thu Apr 4 12:59:08 2002 g34Ix7402660 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 12:59:07 -0600 ;Thu, 4 Apr 2002 20:59:05 +0200 Subject: Sv: Advice -choosing a maker Hi David Welcom aboard. I seem to remember that there are at least a couple of =british rodmakers on the list. Hopefully they will come forward. If not, =I visited Farlows on Pall Mall last year, and they had a few new =canerods, proudly showing their own name. You will be able to find a =british rod, if You so desire. regards, Carsten JorgensenDenmark Subject: Advice -choosing a maker All, I am a U.K flyfisher who has been using an edward Barder rod for =the past couple of seasons and am now sold on canr rods. I want to buy =another cane rod, how do I go about locating a manufacturer. here in the =U.K hardly anybody uses cane rods and its difficult assessing how =good/bad the few that are available are?Any advice would be welcome.David Hi David Welcom aboard. I seem to remember that there areat = couple of british rodmakers on the list. Hopefully they will come = not, I visited Farlows on Pall Mall last year, and they had a few new = proudly showing their own name. You will be able to find a british rod, = so desire. regards, Carsten JorgensenDenmark ----- Original Message ----- d.weatherston Sent: Thursday, April 04, 2002 = PMSubject: Advice -choosing a =maker All, I am a U.K flyfisher who has = edward Barder rod for the past couple of seasons and am now sold on = I want to buy another cane rod, how do I go about locating a = here in the U.K hardly anybody uses cane rods and its difficult = good/bad the few that are available are?Any advice would be =welcome.David from jvswan@earthlink.net Thu Apr 4 14:03:26 2002 g34K3P408582 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 14:03:25 -0600 (209.181.151.236) User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/10.0.0.1429Subject: 1/4" cork rings Hi all, Can someone point me in the direction for high quality 1/4" thick corkrings? I remember getting some from somewhere in the past, but I don'trecall where. It might have been Angler's Workshop, but they aren't listedin the 2002 catalog, unless I am just blind. I do recall that the grip thatI made with them was pretty nice. It looked a lot clearer. Any help wouldreally be appreciated. Also, has anyone been thinking about a group cork ring order lately? Imissed the boat the last time, and I am now down to nearly none. BTW, hasanyone ever received cork from Pace Industries (www.pacecork.com)? Theirweb site says that they supply the cork for Sage rods and others, but ringsand handles were not listed in their on-line catalog. Just curious. Sagerods usually have nice cork. Might be a good source. Thanks, Jason from paul.blakley@ntlworld.com Thu Apr 4 14:43:31 2002 g34KhU411167 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 14:43:31 -0600 Thu, 4 Apr 2002 21:43:29 +0100 Subject: Re: Marvin Hedge Try reading 'An Anglers Cast' by Captain TL Edwards and EricHorsfall- Turner.This is a most excellent book on tournament casting thatfeatures a lengthy article on Mr Hedge and his breaking of the thenworld record by a massive margin way back I forget when ......Paul Chris McDowell wrote: I'm refinishing an 8 1/2' 3pc. Heddon "Marvin Hedge"rod and would like to know more about him. I know hewas from Portland, Oregon and was involved in castingtournaments, introduced the double haul to thetournaments, and set a distance record in the 30's.Anyone know of additional information sources orpersonal knowledge of Marvin? __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTaxhttp://taxes.yahoo.com/ from Troy.Miller@BakerOilTools.com Thu Apr 4 14:58:34 2002 g34KwY412237 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 14:58:34 -0600 (bhihdcimc01.bakerhughes.com [204.253.245.34] (may be forged)) (5.5.2653.19) id ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 14:42:15 -0600 rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: RE: Advice -choosing a maker David -- I've not met them personally, but we have at least two UK makers that areregular contributors to this list. Paul Blakely and Ian Martin are both atyour backdoor, and I would not hesitate to purchase a fine cane rod fromeither of these gentlemen. Let me know if you would like me to forwardtheir e-mail addresses to you. Best regards -- TAM-----Original Message----- Subject: Advice -choosing a maker All, I am a U.K flyfisher who has been using an edward Barder rod for thepast couple of seasons and am now sold on canr rods. I want to buy anothercane rod, how do I go about locating a manufacturer. here in the U.K hardlyanybody uses cane rods and its difficult assessing how good/bad the fewthatare available are?Any advice would be welcome.David from dpeaston@wzrd.com Thu Apr 4 17:38:12 2002 g34NcB421524 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 17:38:11 -0600 Subject: Re: moisture content Mike, What I meant to say was that when you put on the guides and ferrules you prevented the splines from creeping when the rod bends. This would give the rod stiffness for a while. Later, with continued flexing, de lamination will probably occur between the guides and failure can result. I had not had my morning coffee when I wrote the first message. -Doug At 08:38 AM 4/4/2002 -0600, mike canazon wrote: doug,i had never considered bonding as a problem, but you're probably right.my rod has serious issues regarding glue lines and such. i am sure the tipsection is going to break, and am preparing to make new tips for thatreason.i don't quite understand how a rod that has poor bonding would stiffenthe rod. also do you think you can get too much or too little glue to causethis "event".thanks dougmike Hi mike, My experience has been that rods that have poor bonding between splinesstiffen if the splines are kept from creeping by one another. > Doug EastonTonawanda, NY from Jkvseafood@aol.com Thu Apr 4 18:22:01 2002 g350M0423626 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 18:22:00 -0600 Subject: Re: oil and vinegar hey jim,it could be that you touched something with silicon and it transferred to the blank. nothing will cover that if that's the case. may be able to lightly sand and then refinish john from kenealyj@gwi.net Thu Apr 4 18:39:12 2002 g350dC426557 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 18:39:12 -0600 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 19:39:09 -0500 Subject: You guys from Michigan and Minnesota...... had better watch out!!!!!!! My University of Maine Black Bears whupped up on the #1 ranked =University of New Hampshire this afternoon 7-2 in the frozen four and =they are coming after the winner of the Minnesota- Michigan game. Seriously, it could be the college sports story of the year, if not the =decade! Maine lost their coach(Shawn Walsh) to cancer at the start of =the season and the team was taken over by the assistant coach who just =one coach of the year. They weren't expected to do anything this year, =but it is a true show of character that these young men have come =together to do so well. Sorry for the bandwidth, but as a U Maine grad and old hockey player, I =just had to share!!! John K had better watch =out!!!!!!! My University of Maine Black Bears = the #1 ranked University of New Hampshire this afternoon 7-2 in the = game. Seriously, it could be the college = cancer at the start of the season and the team was taken over by the = this year, but it is a true show of character that these young men have = together to do so well. Sorry for the bandwidth, but as a U = old hockey player, I just had to share!!! JohnK from jvswan@earthlink.net Thu Apr 4 19:30:12 2002 g351UB402525 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 19:30:11 -0600 (63.225.56.215) User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/10.0.0.1429Subject: FW: Cork inventory and pricing Hi all, I got an email from C & D this afternoon giving me a price quote of $350 per1000 1/4" thick 5 star rings. I'll be placing an order with another person,but we only want 500 rings between the two of us. Anyone out there want apiece of this order? 35 cents for a five star 1/4" isn't too bad, as Iunderstand it. I'll probably place the order tomorrow afternoon if anyonewants to jump in. Please let me know and I'll order the rings. You can payme when you receive them. Thanks, and let me know. Jason ------ Forwarded Message Subject: Re: Cork inventory and pricing Dear Jason SwanWe carry five star quality cork rings.We have it in two sizes. they come 1,000 pcs bags only.1 1/4 x 1/2 x 1/4 bore $ 700.00 per thousand1 1/4 x 1/4 x 1/4 bore$ 350.00 per thousandMaster & Visa cardsWe thank you in advance.Christ Kishish ------ End of Forwarded Message from crmitchell@ocsonline.com Thu Apr 4 19:40:47 2002 g351ek403357 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 19:40:46 -0600 helo=ocsonline.com) id 16tIgk-0005cs-00; Thu, 04 Apr 2002 20:38:50 -0500 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:0.9.4)Gecko/20011128 Netscape6/6.2.1 Subject: Re: How long can you keep it up? Good God - I've been fly fishing for 45 years and haven't even cast that many rods !!!! Allen Thramer wrote: I have always maintained that a wife who understands the bond that cane has with some of us and is not threatened is one of the most valuable assets we can have in pursuing rodmaking. I am apparently one of the young guys, only 44 and married 18yrs. Married to cane for 20. I am unusually blessed in that I can live and breath cane whenever I want to. Had an idea at 3:30 AM and got up went to the shop and worked until 5. What a joy to own your life! Almost up to 800 rods now.A.J. From: Harry Boyd Subject: How long can you keep it up?Date: Wed, 03 Apr 2002 10:09:39 - 0600 caught a few native brookies in the mountains of North> Harry -- Harry Boyd http://www.canerods.com/ Bamboo Rodshttp://www.fbcwin.com/ Our Church _________________________________________________________________Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com from crmitchell@ocsonline.com Thu Apr 4 19:48:49 2002 g351mm403713 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 19:48:48 -0600 helo=ocsonline.com) id 16tIoT-0005mB-00; Thu, 04 Apr 2002 20:46:49 -0500 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:0.9.4)Gecko/20011128 Netscape6/6.2.1 Subject: Re: oil and vinegar --------------010402000708040702000408 My first thought. Silicones are typically soluble in alcohol. Try wiping with methyl (wood or denatured) alcohol, which runs about 98%, rather than the drugstore stuff, isopropyl, which is 30% water. James Harris wrote: Yes I have been. Very good observation Tony Tony Young 04/04/02 11:13AM >>> Are you using a T shirt to wipe the rod down at any time?I ask because silicon in fabric softener never washes out and that (silicon) will cause these sorts of problems. Tony At 10:55 AM 4/4/02 -0700, James Harris wrote: GuysI've been having a intermittent problem with the application of my varnish. I use a drip tube and MOW gloss. I've been getting an occasional separation between the varnish and the surface of the bamboo. The varnish initially coats the entire surface but later the smooth even coating will separate in places, exposing the unfinished bamboo. The bamboo and varnish are acting like oil and vinegar. It usually occurs on the butt section near the grip and pulls back from the edges. This is what I've tried so far:Purchased new varnishSwitched from mineral spirits to alcohol for the final rubdown.Switched from alcohol to alcohol and shellac mixture for final rubdown (this helped a bit)Purchased new non-oiled steel wool.Thinned the varnish with mineral spirits to about 80% varnish. (Varnish temperature is not an issue here in Phoenix, except in storage) Other observations that may or may not be a factor are:This never occurs on the tip sections.This never happened when I was using URAC 185. I use PU these days.It usually does not occur if I filter the varnish just prior to filling the tube.It seems to happen more frequently on darker flamed rods. Have any of you had this problem and if so how did you solve it?Any recommendations? Thanks,JimH /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html >There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ --------------010402000708040702000408 wipingwith methyl (wood or denatured) alcohol, which runs about 98%, rather than James Harris wrote: Yes I have been. Very good observation Tony Are you using a T shirt to wipe the rod down at anytime?I ask because silicon in fabric softener never washes out and that(silicon) will cause these sorts of problems.TonyAt10:55 AM 4/4/02 -0700, James Harris wrote: GuysI've been having a intermittent problem with theapplication of my varnish. I use a drip tube and MOW gloss. I've beengetting an occasional separation between the varnish and the surfaceof the bamboo. The varnish initially coats the entire surface but laterthe smooth even coating will separate in places, exposing the unfinishedbamboo. The bamboo and varnish are acting like oil and vinegar. Itusually occurs on the butt section near the grip and pulls back from theedges.This is what I've tried so far:Purchased newvarnishSwitched from mineral spirits to alcohol for the finalrubdown.Switched from alcohol to alcohol and shellac mixture for finalrubdown (this helped a bit)Purchased new non-oiled steelwool.Thinned the varnish with mineral spirits to about 80% varnish. (Varnish temperature is not an issue here in Phoenix, except instorage)Other observations that may or may not be a factor are:This never occurs on the tipsections.This never happened when I was using URAC 185. I use PUthese days.It usually does not occur if I filter the varnish just prior tofilling the tube.It seems to happen more frequently on darkerflamed rods.Have any of you had this problem and if so how did yousolve it?Any recommendations?Thanks,JimH /*************************************************************************/AV YoungVisit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man inParlament and he was Guy FawkesPatrickMoore/*************************************************************************/ --------------010402000708040702000408-- from crmitchell@ocsonline.com Thu Apr 4 19:53:57 2002 g351rv404014 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 19:53:57 -0600 helo=ocsonline.com) id 16tItT-0005tm-00; Thu, 04 Apr 2002 20:52:00 -0500 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:0.9.4)Gecko/20011128 Netscape6/6.2.1 Subject: Re: oil and vinegar --------------070709080702010303060708 Also avoid using spray lubricants such as WD40 and others anywhere in the vicinity of anything you intend to finish. After use wipe hands thoroughly with alcohol. James Harris wrote: Yes I have been. Very good observation Tony Tony Young 04/04/02 11:13AM >>> Are you using a T shirt to wipe the rod down at any time?I ask because silicon in fabric softener never washes out and that (silicon) will cause these sorts of problems. Tony At 10:55 AM 4/4/02 -0700, James Harris wrote: GuysI've been having a intermittent problem with the application of my varnish. I use a drip tube and MOW gloss. I've been getting an occasional separation between the varnish and the surface of the bamboo. The varnish initially coats the entire surface but later the smooth even coating will separate in places, exposing the unfinished bamboo. The bamboo and varnish are acting like oil and vinegar. It usually occurs on the butt section near the grip and pulls back from the edges. This is what I've tried so far:Purchased new varnishSwitched from mineral spirits to alcohol for the final rubdown.Switched from alcohol to alcohol and shellac mixture for final rubdown (this helped a bit)Purchased new non-oiled steel wool.Thinned the varnish with mineral spirits to about 80% varnish. (Varnish temperature is not an issue here in Phoenix, except in storage) Other observations that may or may not be a factor are:This never occurs on the tip sections.This never happened when I was using URAC 185. I use PU these days.It usually does not occur if I filter the varnish just prior to filling the tube.It seems to happen more frequently on darker flamed rods. Have any of you had this problem and if so how did you solve it?Any recommendations? Thanks,JimH /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html >There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ --------------070709080702010303060708 Also avoid using spray lubricants such as WD40 and others anywhere in the thoroughlywith alcohol. James Harris wrote: Yes I have been. Very good observation Tony Are you using a T shirt to wipe the rod down at anytime?I ask because silicon in fabric softener never washes out and that(silicon) will cause these sorts of problems.TonyAt10:55 AM 4/4/02 -0700, James Harris wrote: GuysI've been having a intermittent problem with theapplication of my varnish. I use a drip tube and MOW gloss. I've beengetting an occasional separation between the varnish and the surfaceof the bamboo. The varnish initially coats the entire surface but laterthe smooth even coating will separate in places, exposing the unfinishedbamboo. The bamboo and varnish are acting like oil and vinegar. Itusually occurs on the butt section near the grip and pulls back from theedges.This is what I've tried so far:Purchased newvarnishSwitched from mineral spirits to alcohol for the finalrubdown.Switched from alcohol to alcohol and shellac mixture for finalrubdown (this helped a bit)Purchased new non-oiled steelwool.Thinned the varnish with mineral spirits to about 80% varnish. (Varnish temperature is not an issue here in Phoenix, except instorage)Other observations that may or may not be a factor are:This never occurs on the tipsections.This never happened when I was using URAC 185. I use PUthese days.It usually does not occur if I filter the varnish just prior tofilling the tube.It seems to happen more frequently on darkerflamed rods.Have any of you had this problem and if so how did yousolve it?Any recommendations?Thanks,JimH /*************************************************************************/AV YoungVisit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man inParlament and he was Guy FawkesPatrickMoore/*************************************************************************/ --------------070709080702010303060708-- from dpvbkjs@somtel.com Thu Apr 4 19:59:12 2002 g351xB404344 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 19:59:11 -0600 Subject: Re: How long can you keep it up? Harry and all Kathy and I have been married 26 years (together even longer). I made myfirst bamboo rod in 1998 and it was a given to her. My second one went toa very good friend that I have know about as long. One of these days Iwill have to make one for myself. David (and Kathy) from kenealyj@gwi.net Thu Apr 4 20:19:55 2002 g352Js404938 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 20:19:54 -0600 Subject: Re: How long can you keep it up? Hary et al, Jill and I aren't married(yet) and I haven't been making cane rods all thatlong. (I've been tying flies for 28 years, if that counts). BUT, I'm planning on keeping up with all three for as long as God willpermit me. John K----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: How long can you keep it up? Harry and all Kathy and I have been married 26 years (together even longer). I made myfirst bamboo rod in 1998 and it was a given to her. My second one went toa very good friend that I have know about as long. One of these days Iwill have to make one for myself. David (and Kathy) from KyleDruey@aol.com Thu Apr 4 21:14:54 2002 g353Er406276 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 21:14:54 -0600 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 22:14:39 -0500 Subject: Re: How long can you keep it up? This whole thread made me wonder what you long time hobby rod makersthink of the new guys of today who can tool up and build their first bamboo fly rod in less than 3 months? Do you gray hairs think the newbies are getting off too easy now since wepay our dues measured in months and not years? I can easily see how it would have taken 3 years to complete that first rod if starting out in the hobby before the Garrison book, before the List, before the internet, before the one stop shopping suppliers, etc. Kyle Sorry if this already posted, aol has just launched a new webmail client and it is having problems. from bob@downandacross.com Thu Apr 4 21:33:04 2002 g353X3406828 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 21:33:03 -0600 Subject: RE: How long can you keep it up? Kyle:There is no replacement for experience, but some people catch on reallyfast. I feel like I am not a quick learner, but I try hard. Also, somepeople get driven to work on rods and put a lot of hours in. I have beenmaking rods from scratch for about 4 years now, and I put in at least 20 to30 hours a week working on rods in addition to keeping a real job to paythe bills. In the summer and on those extended teacher vacations thatdoubles.The info out there has really helped people progress quickly. But, bydeciding you want to build rods and doing it, you stumble across some greatstuff too.Best regards,Bob -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: How long can you keep it up? Do you gray hairs think the newbies are getting off too easy nowsince we payour dues measured in months and not years? from tausfeld@frontiernet.net Thu Apr 4 21:38:52 2002 g353cp407184 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 21:38:51 -0600 sender ) Subject: Re: Ferrule Polishing Mandrels Adam, Sorry I didn't reply sooner, I got called away for business, logged 1000 = As for the fixture, ha ha ha knowledge is power!!! It is a piece of =brass hex stock that when placed in my tool holder, the center is at the =center of chuck rotation. The center is has a 3/8" hole drilled in to =it. Then I took another piece of hex stock 1.5" long, (same size) and =turned down a 1/2" of it so that it fits snuggly in the 3/8" hole. =Drilled and tapped a screw in the first piece to lock it down. For male =ferrules: In the second piece, center drill a hole slightly bigger than =the ferrule piece you want to slit. Go only as deep as the slide. I =wrap masking tape around the ferrule so that it fits in the hole very =snuggly, very little play. Now line up the two hex piece, slit. Rotate =to the next flat, etc.... and made a tapered hole, wrap the ferrule with some tape so it fits in = I have two female jigs, and three male jigs. About two sizes per jig. Now I'm sure there are many questions as to my explaination is weak due =to being road weary. Ask away, I'll answer them.. I believe there may =be an article in an early Powerfiber issue. This is not my design, just =my adaptation. Thanks to the originator. Subject: Re: Ferrule Polishing Mandrels Tom, In the powerfibers article I see you are holding the ferrule in some =fixture while slitting the tabs. What is it? Do I buy it or make it. =Your article inspired me and I am getting my gear together to make some =ferrules. Adam Subject: Re: Ferrule Polishing Mandrels I used brass rod, turned down to fit snugly in the ferrule. I use =sandpaper soaked with oil, grit - 220 down to 2000. Then polish with 3m = Actually, I do this in my drill press. Mainly because its in the =warm basement not in the cold garage where my lathe lives. tom Subject: Ferrule Polishing Mandrels My search of the archives failed to come up with much in the way =of a design for a mandrel for use on a lathe to polish NS ferrules, or a =discription of the polishing process and materials recommended. Can some =of you'se guys help me out on these 2 problems? -------------------------------------------------------------------------=-Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: Click Here Adam, Sorry I didn't reply sooner, I got called away for = brass hex stock that when placed in my tool holder, the center is at the = Then I took another piece of hex stock 1.5" long, (same size) and turned = piece, center drill a hole slightly bigger than the ferrule piece you = snug. jig. Now I'm sure there are many questions as to my explaination is weak = ----- Original Message ----- Vigil Sent: Tuesday, April 02, 2002 = PM Mandrels Tom, In the powerfibers article I see you = the ferrule in some fixture while slitting the tabs. What is it? Do I = or make it. Your article inspired me and I am getting my gear together = some ferrules. Adam ----- Original Message ----- Jill and Tom Ausfeld = Sent: Tuesday, April 02, 2002 = AMSubject: Re: Ferrule = Mandrels Don, I used brass rod, turned down to fit snugly in = ferrule. I use sandpaper soaked with oil, grit - 220 down to = Then polish with 3m perfect-it fine and machine polish on = the warm basement not in the cold garage where my lathe lives. tom ----- Original Message ----- = Greife Sent: Monday, April 01, = PM Mandrels My search of the archives failed to come up with much in the = design for a mandrel for use on a lathe to polish NS ferrules, or = discription of the polishing process and materials recommended. = of you'se guys help me out on these 2 problems? Here from kenealyj@gwi.net Thu Apr 4 21:44:47 2002 g353ik407502 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 21:44:46 -0600 Subject: Re: How long can you keep it up? Bob, I agree with you and I'd like to add- Yup, I've only been making cane rods Grap^&*# rods over the past 20 years or so.I 've also studied making cane rods since George Barnes' book first came outand I've thoroughly studied the Carmichael/Garrison book. My point is this-how much homework counts? Is it more valuable to fiddle fart around in thedark or to find the information, soak it up and get at it?I don't give a Cra%* about dues- what is the final product? That is whatcounts, isn't it?????? I've know people who have tied flies for 20 years and have paid their "dues"but they still can't tie a fishable fliy! John K----- Original Message ----- Subject: RE: How long can you keep it up? Kyle:There is no replacement for experience, but some people catch on reallyfast. I feel like I am not a quick learner, but I try hard. Also, somepeople get driven to work on rods and put a lot of hours in. I have beenmaking rods from scratch for about 4 years now, and I put in at least 20 to 30 hours a week working on rods in addition to keeping a real job to paythe bills. In the summer and on those extended teacher vacations thatdoubles.The info out there has really helped people progress quickly. But, bydeciding you want to build rods and doing it, you stumble across some great stuff too.Best regards,Bob -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu KyleDruey@aol.comSent: Thursday, April 04, 2002 10:15 PM Subject: Re: How long can you keep it up? Do you gray hairs think the newbies are getting off too easy nowsince we payour dues measured in months and not years? from atlasc1@earthlink.net Thu Apr 4 21:52:58 2002 g353qv407864 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 21:52:58 -0600 ([209.179.148.72] helo=computer) id 16tKmV-0000bB-00; Thu, 04 Apr 2002 19:52:56 -0800 Subject: Re: How long can you keep it up? Kyle, Not all new rodmakers can make their first rod in 3 months. All of us come from differant backgrounds and if a maker has experience in wood working itmakes it a lot easier. I would have to say the things that helped me themost was WC book, the ability to buy forms and the list and about 25 yearsof working with my hands. After studying Neurology and Pathology andstudying endless other text I was quick to realize Garrisons book was onemans vision of rodmaking and not necessarily quick to the point. If I hadmade my first rod by "THE BOOK" I think I would still be scratching my headlooking at stress graphs. For some makers it only takes them 5 days tomaketheir first rod...they take a class and get a rod done by the end of it. Nowthat is fast. But as we all learn in rodmaking it is not the destination butthe journey that is important. Here we have guys who have made rods over20years and they are still "tweaking" the art of rodmaking. Now that is a Hobby. Adam Vigil----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: How long can you keep it up? This whole thread made me wonder what you long time hobby rod makersthink of the new guys of today who can tool up and build their first bamboo fly rod in less than 3 months? Do you gray hairs think the newbies are getting off too easy now since we pay our dues measured in months and not years? I can easily see how it would have taken 3 years to complete that first rod if starting out in the hobby before the Garrison book, before the List,before the internet, before the one stop shopping suppliers, etc. Kyle Sorry if this already posted, aol has just launched a new webmail client and it is having problems. from tausfeld@frontiernet.net Thu Apr 4 21:53:31 2002 g353rU407928 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 21:53:30 -0600 sender ) Subject: Re: How long can you keep it up? I can only think of one gray hair it bothers, I won't mention his name herebut he mentioned alot lately. tom ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: How long can you keep it up? This whole thread made me wonder what you long time hobby rod makersthink of the new guys of today who can tool up and build their first bamboo fly rod in less than 3 months? Do you gray hairs think the newbies are getting off too easy now since we pay our dues measured in months and not years? I can easily see how it would have taken 3 years to complete that first rod if starting out in the hobby before the Garrison book, before the List,before the internet, before the one stop shopping suppliers, etc. Kyle Sorry if this already posted, aol has just launched a new webmail client and it is having problems. from KyleDruey@aol.com Thu Apr 4 22:03:28 2002 g3543R408542 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 22:03:27 -0600 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 23:03:19 -0500 Subject: Fwd: How long can you keep it up? I reread my post and I hope I didn't come across as implying that I have arrived or anything. Far from it! I am just very appreciate of all the help I received, and will continue to receive, from all the great folks on this list and the archives. I never could have done it on my own, especially 30 years ago, thats for sure! It amazes me to read of the guys on the list who started out in this hobby during the 1940s, 1950s, and 1960s andpersevered over the years to learn the bamboo rod making craft. Kyle In a message dated 04/04/2002 7:14:38 PM Pacific Standard Time, KyleDruey writes: rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Full-name: Kyle Druey Subject: Re: How long can you keep it up? This whole thread made me wonder what you long time hobby rod makersthink of the new guys of today who can tool up and build their first bamboo fly rod in less than 3 months? Do you gray hairs think the newbies are getting off too easy now since wepay our dues measured in months and not years? I can easily see how it would have taken 3 years to complete that first rod if starting out in the hobby before the Garrison book, before the List, before the internet, before the one stop shopping suppliers, etc. Kyle Sorry if this already posted, aol has just launched a new webmail client and it is having problems. from channer@frontier.net Thu Apr 4 22:06:36 2002 g3546a408816 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 22:06:36 -0600 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 21:06:42 -0700 Subject: Re: How long can you keep it up? Yup! Experience only counts if you learn something from it.john John Kenealy wrote: Bob, I agree with you and I'd like to add- Yup, I've only been making cane rods Grap^&*# rods over the past 20 years or so.I 've also studied making cane rods since George Barnes' book first cameoutand I've thoroughly studied the Carmichael/Garrison book. My point is this-how much homework counts? Is it more valuable to fiddle fart around inthedark or to find the information, soak it up and get at it?I don't give a Cra%* about dues- what is the final product? That is whatcounts, isn't it?????? I've know people who have tied flies for 20 years and have paid their "dues"but they still can't tie a fishable fliy! John K----- Original Message -----From: "Bob Maulucci" Sent: Thursday, April 04, 2002 10:32 PMSubject: RE: How long can you keep it up? Kyle:There is no replacement for experience, but some people catch on reallyfast. I feel like I am not a quick learner, but I try hard. Also, somepeople get driven to work on rods and put a lot of hours in. I have beenmaking rods from scratch for about 4 years now, and I put in at least 20 to 30 hours a week working on rods in addition to keeping a real job to paythe bills. In the summer and on those extended teacher vacations thatdoubles.The info out there has really helped people progress quickly. But, bydeciding you want to build rods and doing it, you stumble across some great stuff too.Best regards,Bob -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu KyleDruey@aol.comSent: Thursday, April 04, 2002 10:15 PM Subject: Re: How long can you keep it up? Do you gray hairs think the newbies are getting off too easy nowsince we payour dues measured in months and not years? from caneman@clnk.com Thu Apr 4 22:33:18 2002 g354XH412058 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 22:33:17 -0600 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35) Subject: Re: How long can you keep it up? I can't chime in for the Gray Hairs, but can for the No-Hairs. I don't carehow long someone has been making rods! What I care about is what the rodperforms like and what it looks like. Granted, one can make a great castingrod without it being a beautiful rod (great if you just make them for yourpersonal use), or a cosmetically nice rod that won't cast a line 10 feet,the true rodmaker learns to a good casting machine that's pleasing to theeye, free of mistakes, perfect wraps, no glue lines, no bumps in thevarnish, consistent in flat to flat dimension, etc. etc. etc... Now if amaker can make a rod like that, I don't care if he's been doing it for 3years or 3 decades, then he is a maker.There's only thing that worries me. With all the books, material andadvice available today, I'm in fear that some may hit the point after a fewrods where they think they know everything there is to know aboutrodmaking.The books have a lot of information in them, but all of them combined don'thave "everything". There is so much to learn, and I, quickly approaching400 rods, learn something new almost daily. I have an aquaintence, whosename I won't use here, but you would DEFINITELY recognize it if I did, thathas made over 3000 rods in his life... a very long career... he will stilltell you that he learns something new all the time, and that he'll always belearning this craft.My Dad always told me that the reason they say doctors are "practicing"medicine, is because their entire career is like practicing for something.In practice you LEARN!!! This is how our careers as rodmakers should be.We should always "practice" rodmaking and maybe like the Dr's, if wepractice enough, maybe we'll get it right someday! Sorry, as an engineer,i put up with a lot of jokes in here... I had to pick on somebody and thepreacher (Harry) ain't around... left him at the Mountain Fork River a fewhours ago, so all of my Physician friends (tooth docs included) on the list,forgive me!!! *eg*In short, if you "Got It", then make the hell out of those rods. Sellthem, give them away, fish them, whatever you want to do, but if the daycomes where you don't think you can learn anymore, then take a step back,because even the past masters learned until the day they died. Soapbox mode off! Nite all,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com- ---- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: How long can you keep it up? I can only think of one gray hair it bothers, I won't mention his name here but he mentioned alot lately. tom ----- Original Message -----From: Sent: Thursday, April 04, 2002 10:14 PMSubject: Re: How long can you keep it up? This whole thread made me wonder what you long time hobby rod makers think of the new guys of today who can tool up and build their first bamboo fly rod in less than 3 months? Do you gray hairs think the newbies are getting off too easy now since we pay our dues measured in months and not years? I can easily see how it would have taken 3 years to complete that first rod if starting out in the hobby before the Garrison book, before the List,before the internet, before the one stop shopping suppliers, etc. Kyle Sorry if this already posted, aol has just launched a new webmail client and it is having problems. from avyoung@iinet.net.au Thu Apr 4 22:34:36 2002 g354YU412387 for ; Thu, 4 Apr 2002 22:34:30 -0600 Subject: Re: How long can you keep it up? It's like a lot of things these days, information is simply everywhere it's just a case of filtering and keeping what you need and rejecting the rest.The Garison book was a tomb with far more info than you needed to start making rods and as a beginner there was no way of filtering the wheat from the chaff so the nephrite had to treat every single (often un necessary) step as being as important as the steps that are nesessary.Just collecting the is it 9 planes? to begin would have had a lot of people wondering if this project will ever get going. The other thing too is comparing yourself with those who've gone before you and knowing if that person can make a rod so can I which is of course true.Rock climbing again. 20 years back the best climbing boots were PA's, had been for 50 years named after Pierre Allen in France. Basically gym boots with a hard sole and car tyre sort of rubber. There are many different grades used around the world to indicate the difficulty of a climb, here in Australia it's an open ended system starting at 1 but anything that you need to actually climb using hands and feet begins at about 12.Using PA's people could spend every week end climbing, training like an Olympic athlete and one day dream of climbing 20's.A brand came along called Feray. It was basically the same gym boot but the rubber is sticky. So sticky in fact if you rub the soles of the boots together fast enough and press them together they'll stick.Wearing these a person dreaming of 20's could climb then suddenly climb 21s and 22s etc. Beginners suddenly start climbing middle grades like 16-18 routes within weeks of starting and thinking those old guys were pretty useless since they took so long to get to this point or maybe the new wave are a superior breed? Anyhow, obviously it's all what's available and who's around to advise that matters no matter what and rodmaking has certainly become a filtered activity due to all the books and this list and materials are now pretty easy to get which is why people can make rods right from the start and be pretty damn nice. Tony At 10:14 PM 4/4/02 -0500, KyleDruey@aol.com wrote: This whole thread made me wonder what you long time hobby rod makersthink ofthe new guys of today who can tool up and build their first bamboo fly rod inless than 3 months? Do you gray hairs think the newbies are getting off too easy now since wepayour dues measured in months and not years? I can easily see how it would have taken 3 years to complete that first rodif starting out in the hobby before the Garrison book, before the List,before the internet, before the one stop shopping suppliers, etc. Kyle Sorry if this already posted, aol has just launched a new webmail client andit is having problems. /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from saweiss@flash.net Fri Apr 5 00:25:25 2002 g356PP415188 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 00:25:25 -0600 g356PN2143818 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 01:25:23 -0500 Subject: Re: How long can you keep it up? Organization: Prodigy Internet Right John, for some, experience means repetition of the same mistakes. Anexpert is someone who has made those mistakes longer than other people.Hecan then become a consultant by traveling away from home to tell othershowto make those mistakes.Steve (experienced expert consultant) Yup! Experience only counts if you learn something from it.john from caneman@clnk.com Fri Apr 5 01:06:53 2002 g3576q416059 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 01:06:52 -0600 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35) Fri, 5 Apr 2002 01:04:41 -0600 Subject: OT---Fishing with Harry Well, I sneaked out for a few hours this afternoon and terrorized thetrouties with Harry Boyd and his friend Jud on the Lower Mountain ForkRiver. Nice afternoon of fishing with friends and the trout were definitelyon the move.I got to Jud's camp at about 12:30 and Harry was about 30 minutes behindme. We were in the water by 2pm, although I had to head out at 5 to getback for my youngest son's solo singing gig in the 6th grade school play.Can't really tell you how many trout we caught, but there were plenty.I think Jud caught the biggest and the most. One was beautiful, and I havepics of him. Biggest I caught was a nice at bow, about 15" long (went tothe first node above my signature wraps) and I think I caught the smallestbrown at about 6". All in all a great afternoon. I had to leave early tocome back for a school play followed by a lot of section sanding, but I'mglad I went. 2 hours in the water is better than none at all...Only sad thing about the day, was Jud had caught a very nice bow in thesecond pool we fished. I mean a VERY nice one. As we walked upstream, afather and son baitfisher team rolled into the pool. At one point it lookedlike the Dad had the big trout on, but he lost him. On my way back to thecar, the son hooks the big trout, hauls him out of the water and startsbashing him in the head with a rock so he won't flop around and get away.Just thought it was a shame to kill the old gentleman. You don't reach thatsize in an open fishery like this, without dodging a lot of bullets... hedidn't dodge the rock. I guess, since I won't be able to make it back tothe river tomorrow, Harry will find out about this when he gets home onSaturday.Thanks Harry... Great to see you again, and i really enjoyed theafternoon..... all except the last part with the old blackbacked bow. and NO ACCIDENTS!!! *S* Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com- ---- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: How long can you keep it up? I can't chime in for the Gray Hairs, but can for the No-Hairs. I don't care how long someone has been making rods! What I care about is what the rodperforms like and what it looks like. Granted, one can make a great casting rod without it being a beautiful rod (great if you just make them for yourpersonal use), or a cosmetically nice rod that won't cast a line 10 feet,the true rodmaker learns to a good casting machine that's pleasing to theeye, free of mistakes, perfect wraps, no glue lines, no bumps in thevarnish, consistent in flat to flat dimension, etc. etc. etc... Now if amaker can make a rod like that, I don't care if he's been doing it for 3years or 3 decades, then he is a maker.There's only thing that worries me. With all the books, material andadvice available today, I'm in fear that some may hit the point after a few rods where they think they know everything there is to know about rodmaking. The books have a lot of information in them, but all of them combined don't have "everything". There is so much to learn, and I, quickly approaching400 rods, learn something new almost daily. I have an aquaintence, whosename I won't use here, but you would DEFINITELY recognize it if I did, that has made over 3000 rods in his life... a very long career... he will stilltell you that he learns something new all the time, and that he'll always be learning this craft.My Dad always told me that the reason they say doctors are "practicing" medicine, is because their entire career is like practicing for something.In practice you LEARN!!! This is how our careers as rodmakers should be.We should always "practice" rodmaking and maybe like the Dr's, if wepractice enough, maybe we'll get it right someday! Sorry, as an engineer, i put up with a lot of jokes in here... I had to pick on somebody and thepreacher (Harry) ain't around... left him at the Mountain Fork River a fewhours ago, so all of my Physician friends (tooth docs included) on the list, forgive me!!! *eg*In short, if you "Got It", then make the hell out of those rods. Sellthem, give them away, fish them, whatever you want to do, but if the daycomes where you don't think you can learn anymore, then take a step back,because even the past masters learned until the day they died. Soapbox mode off! Nite all,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com- ---- Original Message -----From: "Jill and Tom Ausfeld" Sent: Thursday, April 04, 2002 9:54 PMSubject: Re: How long can you keep it up? I can only think of one gray hair it bothers, I won't mention his name here but he mentioned alot lately. tom ----- Original Message -----From: Sent: Thursday, April 04, 2002 10:14 PMSubject: Re: How long can you keep it up? This whole thread made me wonder what you long time hobby rodmakers think of the new guys of today who can tool up and build their first bamboo fly rod in less than 3 months? Do you gray hairs think the newbies are getting off too easy now since we pay our dues measured in months and not years? I can easily see how it would have taken 3 years to complete that first rod if starting out in the hobby before the Garrison book, before the List, before the internet, before the one stop shopping suppliers, etc. Kyle Sorry if this already posted, aol has just launched a new webmail client and it is having problems. from Michael.Roberts@health.wa.gov.au Fri Apr 5 01:16:25 2002 g357GN416408 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 01:16:24 -0600 Mail VirusWall NT); Fri, 05 Apr 2002 15:15:16 +0800 (5.5.2653.19) id ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 15:15:15 +0800 rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: RE: OT---Fishing with Harry What Bob? No accidents!! You'd better get a few dark ales under your belt: ) Mike -----Original Message----- Subject: OT---Fishing with Harry Well, I sneaked out for a few hours this afternoon and terrorized thetrouties with Harry Boyd and his friend Jud on the Lower Mountain ForkRiver. Nice afternoon of fishing with friends and the trout were definitelyon the move.I got to Jud's camp at about 12:30 and Harry was about 30 minutes behindme. We were in the water by 2pm, although I had to head out at 5 to getback for my youngest son's solo singing gig in the 6th grade school play.Can't really tell you how many trout we caught, but there were plenty.I think Jud caught the biggest and the most. One was beautiful, and I havepics of him. Biggest I caught was a nice at bow, about 15" long (went tothe first node above my signature wraps) and I think I caught the smallestbrown at about 6". All in all a great afternoon. I had to leave early tocome back for a school play followed by a lot of section sanding, but I'mglad I went. 2 hours in the water is better than none at all...Only sad thing about the day, was Jud had caught a very nice bow in thesecond pool we fished. I mean a VERY nice one. As we walked upstream, afather and son baitfisher team rolled into the pool. At one point it lookedlike the Dad had the big trout on, but he lost him. On my way back to thecar, the son hooks the big trout, hauls him out of the water and startsbashing him in the head with a rock so he won't flop around and get away.Just thought it was a shame to kill the old gentleman. You don't reach thatsize in an open fishery like this, without dodging a lot of bullets... hedidn't dodge the rock. I guess, since I won't be able to make it back tothe river tomorrow, Harry will find out about this when he gets home onSaturday.Thanks Harry... Great to see you again, and i really enjoyed theafternoon..... all except the last part with the old blackbacked bow. and NO ACCIDENTS!!! *S* Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com- ---- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: How long can you keep it up? I can't chime in for the Gray Hairs, but can for the No-Hairs. I don't care how long someone has been making rods! What I care about is what the rodperforms like and what it looks like. Granted, one can make a great casting rod without it being a beautiful rod (great if you just make them for yourpersonal use), or a cosmetically nice rod that won't cast a line 10 feet,the true rodmaker learns to a good casting machine that's pleasing to theeye, free of mistakes, perfect wraps, no glue lines, no bumps in thevarnish, consistent in flat to flat dimension, etc. etc. etc... Now if amaker can make a rod like that, I don't care if he's been doing it for 3years or 3 decades, then he is a maker.There's only thing that worries me. With all the books, material andadvice available today, I'm in fear that some may hit the point after a few rods where they think they know everything there is to know about rodmaking. The books have a lot of information in them, but all of them combined don't have "everything". There is so much to learn, and I, quickly approaching400 rods, learn something new almost daily. I have an aquaintence, whosename I won't use here, but you would DEFINITELY recognize it if I did, that has made over 3000 rods in his life... a very long career... he will stilltell you that he learns something new all the time, and that he'll always be learning this craft.My Dad always told me that the reason they say doctors are "practicing" medicine, is because their entire career is like practicing for something.In practice you LEARN!!! This is how our careers as rodmakers should be.We should always "practice" rodmaking and maybe like the Dr's, if wepractice enough, maybe we'll get it right someday! Sorry, as an engineer, i put up with a lot of jokes in here... I had to pick on somebody and thepreacher (Harry) ain't around... left him at the Mountain Fork River a fewhours ago, so all of my Physician friends (tooth docs included) on the list, forgive me!!! *eg*In short, if you "Got It", then make the hell out of those rods. Sellthem, give them away, fish them, whatever you want to do, but if the daycomes where you don't think you can learn anymore, then take a step back,because even the past masters learned until the day they died. Soapbox mode off! Nite all,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com- ---- Original Message -----From: "Jill and Tom Ausfeld" Sent: Thursday, April 04, 2002 9:54 PMSubject: Re: How long can you keep it up? I can only think of one gray hair it bothers, I won't mention his name here but he mentioned alot lately. tom ----- Original Message -----From: Sent: Thursday, April 04, 2002 10:14 PMSubject: Re: How long can you keep it up? This whole thread made me wonder what you long time hobby rodmakers think of the new guys of today who can tool up and build their first bamboo fly rod in less than 3 months? Do you gray hairs think the newbies are getting off too easy now since we pay our dues measured in months and not years? I can easily see how it would have taken 3 years to complete that first rod if starting out in the hobby before the Garrison book, before the List, before the internet, before the one stop shopping suppliers, etc. Kyle Sorry if this already posted, aol has just launched a new webmail client and it is having problems. from petr.pavel@medicon.cz Fri Apr 5 04:54:07 2002 g35As6418516 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 04:54:06 -0600 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 12:54:05 +0200(CEST) for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 13:10:18 +0200(CEST) Subject: greenheart I would love to write an article for Czech flyfishermen about split cane =rods. Working on some historical review, I am not able to figure out, =what greenheart is: Greenheart was a wood(?) that a lot of rods were =built out before the advent of bamboo. Some insist it came mostly from =Europe (?)Does anyone know what greenheart is? (was?) None of dictionaries work.Many thanks, Peter Hi all, I would love to write an article = flyfishermen about split cane rods. Working on some historical review, I = able to figure out, what greenheart is: Greenheart was a wood(?) that a = mostly from Europe (?)Does anyone know what greenheart= None of dictionaries work.Many thanks, =Peter from wendt@kingcrab.nrl.navy.mil Fri Apr 5 06:03:46 2002 g35C3j419358 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 06:03:45 -0600 g35C3dtx002219 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 07:03:39 -0500 Subject: Re: You guys from Michigan and Minnesota...... Go Bears!Mark (an old hockey player and fan from way back when) At 07:44 PM 4/4/2002 -0500, you wrote:hadbetter watch out!!!!!!! My University of Maine Black Bears whupped upon the #1 ranked University of New Hampshire this afternoon 7-2 in thefrozen four and they are coming after the winner of the Minnesota-Michigan game. Seriously, it could be the college sports story to cancer at the start of the season and the team was taken over by the expected to do anything this year, but it is a true show of characterthat these young men have come together to do so well. Sorry for the bandwidth, but as a U Maine gradand old hockey player, I just had to share!!! John K from Nodewrrior@aol.com Fri Apr 5 07:45:15 2002 g35DjE420926 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 07:45:14 -0600 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 08:45:02 -0500 Subject: Re: greenheart 'Bout all I know it is a very resilient wood. I saw that the hull of Shackleton's ship was sheathed with it to be able to smash through ice floes. Must be tough stuff. Rob Hoffhines from DCURTIS@satx.rr.com Fri Apr 5 07:52:29 2002 g35DqS421278 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 07:52:29 -0600 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 07:47:42 -0600 Subject: RE: greenheart This site said it is used in fishing rods. The site also includes otherproperties of the wood.http://www.durablewoods.com/greenheart.htm Darrin -----Original Message----- Nodewrrior@aol.com Subject: Re: greenheart 'Bout all I know it is a very resilient wood. I saw that the hull ofShackleton's ship was sheathed with it to be able to smash through icefloes.Must be tough stuff. Rob Hoffhines from paul.blakley@ntlworld.com Fri Apr 5 08:22:30 2002 g35EMT422395 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 08:22:29 -0600 Fri, 5 Apr 2002 15:22:28 +0100 Subject: Re: greenheart Greenheart is a tropical hardwood from South America with a verystraight grain .It's primary use was in the construction of lock gatesand harbours etc etc.......anywhere that a waterproof and hardwearing/decay resistant material was required.The last UK rodmaker who used the material was one George Wilkins ofRedditch in England and he ceased production sometime in the70's...........his remaining stock of greenheart and associatedmachinery ( e.g rounding machines ) were sold onto Partidges of Redditchand are now probably decaying away somewhere through decades ofneglect............Paul Petr Pavel wrote: Hi all,I would love to write an article for Czech flyfishermen about splitcane rods. Working on some historical review, I am not able to figureout, what greenheart is: Greenheart was a wood(?) that a lot of rodswere built out before the advent of bamboo. Some insist it camemostly from Europe (?)Does anyone know what greenheart is? (was?) None of dictionaries work.Many thanks, Peter from rodsupstream@exploremaine.com Fri Apr 5 08:42:10 2002 g35EgA423311 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 08:42:10 -0600 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 09:42:06 -0500 Subject: How long can you keep it up: Good Day List: Who cares how fast or how slow it takes someone, It only adds to thesurvival of the rod making. Talking as a gray hair, it is my responsibilityto pass this knowledge on to the next generation so that this craft goes onand it should be this list responsibility to do the same. So far IMHO thislist get a A+ in doing that, take care, Tim. Upstream Always, Tim DoughtyRod MakerUpstream Custom Rods name="winmail.dat" filename="winmail.dat" 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 from patrick.w.coffey@boeing.com Fri Apr 5 08:46:29 2002 g35EkS423750 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 08:46:28 -0600 IAA02694; IAA09868; g35EkOt25522; (5.5.2650.21) id ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 06:46:24 -0800 Rodmakers Subject: RE: 1/4" cork rings would send me a sample and/or let me know who sells their cork retail. Patrick W. CoffeyAOG Incident Repair PlanningPhone: 425-234-2901Fax: 425-237-0083M-2112 M/C 61-79 -----Original Message----- Subject: 1/4" cork rings Hi all, Can someone point me in the direction for high quality 1/4" thick corkrings? I remember getting some from somewhere in the past, but I don'trecall where. It might have been Angler's Workshop, but they aren't listedin the 2002 catalog, unless I am just blind. I do recall that the grip thatI made with them was pretty nice. It looked a lot clearer. Any help wouldreally be appreciated. Also, has anyone been thinking about a group cork ring order lately? Imissed the boat the last time, and I am now down to nearly none. BTW, hasanyone ever received cork from Pace Industries (www.pacecork.com)? Theirweb site says that they supply the cork for Sage rods and others, but ringsand handles were not listed in their on-line catalog. Just curious. Sagerods usually have nice cork. Might be a good source. Thanks, Jason from patrick.w.coffey@boeing.com Fri Apr 5 08:54:44 2002 g35Esh424350 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 08:54:43 -0600 GAA25356; GAA07018; g35Esbt08887; (5.5.2650.21) id ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 06:54:37 -0800 rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: RE: How long can you keep it up? I for one think it's great. It gets more people making rods and increasespeoples awareness of cane rods. Patrick W. CoffeyAOG Incident Repair PlanningPhone: 425-234-2901Fax: 425-237-0083M-2112 M/C 61-79 -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: How long can you keep it up? This whole thread made me wonder what you long time hobby rod makersthinkof the new guys of today who can tool up and build their first bamboo fly rodin less than 3 months? Do you gray hairs think the newbies are getting off too easy now since wepay our dues measured in months and not years? I can easily see how it would have taken 3 years to complete that first rod if starting out in the hobby before the Garrison book, before the List, before the internet, before the one stop shopping suppliers, etc. Kyle Sorry if this already posted, aol has just launched a new webmail client and it is having problems. from rextutor@yahoo.com Fri Apr 5 08:57:17 2002 g35EvG424720 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 08:57:16 -0600 05 Apr 2002 06:57:15 PST Subject: 70s rod making- pre Garrison books question I have been reading with interest the discussion ofwhen people started making rods, and the books andsources of information. I really enjoy books as wellas rod making. I note that Garrison / Carmicheal published in the 70s but there were books before thisthat appear easier to read and launch a rod with . Claude Kreider "The Bamboo Rod " 1951 and Garrison's mentor Dr Holden's "The Idyl of theSplit - Bamboo rod" , 1920. I was wondering if thesebooks were available during the 60s ? I never hearthem mentioned . Perhaps they were hard to find inpre Garrison times. Any gray hairs ( I am a gray-hairbut just late to rod building ) start with these orother pre Garrison books ? __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTaxhttp://taxes.yahoo.com/ from rcristant@isgtransport.com Fri Apr 5 08:57:55 2002 g35Evr424849 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 08:57:54 -0600 content-class: urn:content-classes:messageSubject: SW Varnish Thread-Topic: SW VarnishThread-Index: AcHcskPR3Im75m/iRqGDL5l5pJ6irQ== I have read quite a bit on how wonderful Sutherland Wellesvarnish is for finishing. My question is, whether or not it is worththe expense? Also if some of the members have used it on theirprojects, is it a product used for completely finishing the rod orshould it be used only for finishing the wraps. Any help would beappreciated. Robert CleanCleanDocumentEmail =0=0 MicrosoftInternetExplorer4 table.MsoNormalTable {mso-style-name:"Table Normal"; mso-tstyle- rowband-size:0; mso-tstyle-colband-size:0; mso-style-noshow:yes; mso- style-parent:""; mso-padding-alt:0in 5.4pt 0in 5.4pt; mso-para- margin:0in; mso-para-margin-bottom:.0001pt; mso-pagination:widow- orphan; font-size:10.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman";} Hello all, have read quite a bit on how wonderful Sutherland Welles have used iton their projects, is it a product used for completely finishing the rod =or appreciated. Robert =00 from aebersold@ou.edu Fri Apr 5 09:03:28 2002 g35F3R425711 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 09:03:27 -0600 id ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 09:03:27 -0600 Subject: Off topic this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. Has anyone had experience with bamboo flooring? We are about to do someremodeling and my wife, Jane, said last night let's do a bamboo floor. Itwould be very different and special. I found some companies on the net thatsell it and I can't think of anything that would look cooler. Anyway if anyof you have first hand experience I'd like to hear from you.-dDennis Aebersold Off topic Has anyone had experience withbamboo = Anyway if any of you have first hand experience I'd like to hear from =you. Dennis Aebersold from rmoon@ida.net Fri Apr 5 09:03:35 2002 g35F3Y425730 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 09:03:34 -0600 Subject: Re: greenheart Paul It is my understanding that some Greenheart Rods are still beingproduced. And if I can ever get off my duff, I will be making one. Igreat supporter of the flyfishermen world over once gave me a box ofgreenheart that was packed away in the 19th century. It is all set forrounding. Tapered, very well aged. I also have a plank of greenwood thatis about a 1x12x6'. It is a gorgeous piece of wood and I keep resisting theneed to cut it into billets,. Perhaps some day I'll bite the bullet and doit,. Ralph "paul.blakley" wrote: Greenheart is a tropical hardwood from South America with a verystraight grain .It's primary use was in the construction of lock gatesand harbours etc etc.......anywhere that a waterproof and hardwearing/decay resistant material was required.The last UK rodmaker who used the material was one George Wilkins ofRedditch in England and he ceased production sometime in the70's...........his remaining stock of greenheart and associatedmachinery ( e.g rounding machines ) were sold onto Partidges of Redditchand are now probably decaying away somewhere through decades ofneglect............Paul Petr Pavel wrote: Hi all,I would love to write an article for Czech flyfishermen about splitcane rods. Working on some historical review, I am not able to figureout, what greenheart is: Greenheart was a wood(?) that a lot of rodswere built out before the advent of bamboo. Some insist it camemostly from Europe (?)Does anyone know what greenheart is? (was?) None of dictionaries work.Many thanks, Peter --http://www.ida.net/users/rmoon from paul.blakley@ntlworld.com Fri Apr 5 09:09:20 2002 g35F9J426605 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 09:09:19 -0600 Fri, 5 Apr 2002 16:09:18 +0100 Subject: Re: greenheart Ralph........go do it !Tight lines.................Paul "Ralph W. Moon" wrote: Paul It is my understanding that some Greenheart Rods are still beingproduced. And if I can ever get off my duff, I will be making one. Igreat supporter of the flyfishermen world over once gave me a box ofgreenheart that was packed away in the 19th century. It is all set forrounding. Tapered, very well aged. I also have a plank of greenwood thatis about a 1x12x6'. It is a gorgeous piece of wood and I keep resisting theneed to cut it into billets,. Perhaps some day I'll bite the bullet and doit,. Ralph "paul.blakley" wrote: Greenheart is a tropical hardwood from South America with a verystraight grain .It's primary use was in the construction of lock gatesand harbours etc etc.......anywhere that a waterproof and hardwearing/decay resistant material was required.The last UK rodmaker who used the material was one George Wilkins ofRedditch in England and he ceased production sometime in the70's...........his remaining stock of greenheart and associatedmachinery ( e.g rounding machines ) were sold onto Partidges of Redditchand are now probably decaying away somewhere through decades ofneglect............Paul Petr Pavel wrote: Hi all,I would love to write an article for Czech flyfishermen about splitcane rods. Working on some historical review, I am not able to figureout, what greenheart is: Greenheart was a wood(?) that a lot of rodswere built out before the advent of bamboo. Some insist it camemostly from Europe (?)Does anyone know what greenheart is? (was?) None of dictionarieswork.Many thanks, Peter --http://www.ida.net/users/rmoon from tausfeld@frontiernet.net Fri Apr 5 09:10:23 2002 g35FAM426843 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 09:10:22 -0600 sender ) , Subject: Ferrule serrator I forgot to mention how I center the cuts. I turn a small piece of =brass to the size of the ferrule opening (i.e. - where the bamboo fits =in). Then I turned the tip really small, like .010". When I'm ready to =go, I insert brass piece, line up the tip to the blade, remove the brass =piece and go. I double check center on each cut. tom Subject: Re: Ferrule Polishing Mandrels Adam, Sorry I didn't reply sooner, I got called away for business, logged = As for the fixture, ha ha ha knowledge is power!!! It is a piece of =brass hex stock that when placed in my tool holder, the center is at the =center of chuck rotation. The center is has a 3/8" hole drilled in to =it. Then I took another piece of hex stock 1.5" long, (same size) and =turned down a 1/2" of it so that it fits snuggly in the 3/8" hole. =Drilled and tapped a screw in the first piece to lock it down. For male =ferrules: In the second piece, center drill a hole slightly bigger than =the ferrule piece you want to slit. Go only as deep as the slide. I =wrap masking tape around the ferrule so that it fits in the hole very =snuggly, very little play. Now line up the two hex piece, slit. Rotate =to the next flat, etc.... piece and made a tapered hole, wrap the ferrule with some tape so it = I have two female jigs, and three male jigs. About two sizes per jig. Now I'm sure there are many questions as to my explaination is weak =due to being road weary. Ask away, I'll answer them.. I believe there =may be an article in an early Powerfiber issue. This is not my design, =just my adaptation. Thanks to the originator. Subject: Re: Ferrule Polishing Mandrels Tom, In the powerfibers article I see you are holding the ferrule in some =fixture while slitting the tabs. What is it? Do I buy it or make it. =Your article inspired me and I am getting my gear together to make some =ferrules. Adam Subject: Re: Ferrule Polishing Mandrels I used brass rod, turned down to fit snugly in the ferrule. I use =sandpaper soaked with oil, grit - 220 down to 2000. Then polish with 3m = Actually, I do this in my drill press. Mainly because its in the =warm basement not in the cold garage where my lathe lives. tom Subject: Ferrule Polishing Mandrels My search of the archives failed to come up with much in the way =of a design for a mandrel for use on a lathe to polish NS ferrules, or a =discription of the polishing process and materials recommended. Can some =of you'se guys help me out on these 2 problems? ------------------------------------------------------------------------Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: Click Here small piece of brass to the size of the ferrule opening (i.e. - where = ready to go, I insert brass piece, line up the tip to the blade, remove = cut. tom ----- Original Message ----- and Tom Ausfeld ; dongreife@hotmail.com ; rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu = Sent: Thursday, April 04, 2002 = PM Mandrels Adam, Sorry I didn't reply sooner, I got called away for = brass hex stock that when placed in my tool holder, the center is at = turned down a 1/2" of it so that it fits snuggly in the 3/8" = ferrules: In the second piece, center drill a hole slightly bigger = masking tape around the ferrule so that it fits in the hole very = next flat, etc.... and made a tapered hole, wrap the ferrule with some tape so = snug. jig. Now I'm sure there are many questions as to my explaination is = ----- Original Message ----- Vigil = Sent: Tuesday, April 02, 2002 = PMSubject: Re: Ferrule = Mandrels Tom, In the powerfibers article I see = holding the ferrule in some fixture while slitting the tabs. What is = I buy it or make it. Your article inspired me and I am getting my = together to make some ferrules. Adam ----- Original Message ----- = Jill and Tom Ausfeld Sent: Tuesday, April 02, = AMSubject: Re: Ferrule = Mandrels Don, I used brass rod, turned down to fit snugly in = ferrule. I use sandpaper soaked with oil, grit - 220 down to = Then polish with 3m perfect-it fine and machine polish on = in the warm basement not in the cold garage where my lathe =lives. tom ----- Original Message ----- = Greife Sent: Monday, April 01, = PMSubject: Ferrule = Mandrels My search of the archives failed to come up with much in = a design for a mandrel for use on a lathe to polish NS ferrules, = discription of the polishing process and materials recommended. = of you'se guys help me out on these 2 problems? =Here from jvswan@earthlink.net Fri Apr 5 09:37:46 2002 g35Fbj428764 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 09:37:45 -0600 (63.225.56.215) "Grayson Davis" ,"Jerry Madigan" , "Lee Koeser","raymond t. todd" ,"Darrin Curtis" ,"Geert Poorteman" ,"Davesrods" , Notsooyoun@aol.com,"Robert S Williams" , Troutgetter@aol.com,Eastkoyfly@aol.com, "Larry Blan" ,"chad wigham" , "john barber" ,"Douglas Losey" User-Agent: Microsoft- Entourage/10.0.0.1429Subject: Cork rings Hi all, Just a quick update on the 1/4" cork rings. We currently have orders for atleast 4000 rings. So, I called up C&D to see what their shipping turnaroundis. Turns out that they only have a couple of thousand rings left. Theyare expecting more at the beginning of next month. I'm not too sure howtheir sorting and shipping process works, but I'm not all that comfortableordering the very last of their stock, the bottom of the cork barrel, so tospeak. As an alternative, however, I gave Pace industries a call. Their web sitementions that they sell cork to Sage (700,000 per year, it turns out). Ialso had one list member tell me that it was really nice cork. So, Mike atPace tells me that he has three grades: Special (the best), Extra, andSuper. The special he sells to Winston, the Extra he sells to Sage, etc.He dropped a bunch of other names like Clemens (that may be where I got mylast bunch of 1/4" cork that was so nice) and some other cane rod makersthat I didn't recognize. At any rate, he tells me that he can ship as much cork as we need withinfour weeks. But here's the kicker... He will first send me samples to makesure it meets with my approval, and he said the rest of the cork isguaranteed to match the samples! So, I asked him how much. He said a 1/2"ring is $898 per 1000 (C&D sells their top quality for $700 per 1000). Hedidn't have a price for quarter inch rings. But, that means his bestquality (Super) is 20 cents more for half inch rings than C&D's best. Ifthey cut the price in half for 1/4" (that is what C&D did) then the pricewould go from 35 cents per ring to 45 cents per ring. Still, not too bad. So, I hate to complicate things, but it looks like we may have to wait a bit contacted me for cork rings. I'm happy to do whatever you guys want.Personally, I'm inclined to give Pace cork a try. But it may depend on howmuch the Super grade cork rings cost when things all shake out. I don'tknow how much they will be. Still, Mike was VERY enthusiastic about thequality of their Super grade cork. So, everyone who wanted some cork, please let me know what you would liketodo. If you want the C&D cork, I'll do that. If you want the Pace cork,I'll do that too. It may be interesting to compare the two. But if one ismuch better than the other, I, for one, might feel a bit put off for havingto use the lower quality cork. So, please let me know what you want. Ifanyone is in a real hurry, I'll find out by noon today how much cork C&D canship immediately. As of yesterday, though, they only had 2000 rings left instock. Thanks, Jason from rmoon@ida.net Fri Apr 5 10:07:14 2002 g35G7D400967 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 10:07:13 -0600 Subject: Re: Off topic --------------1C89C2F1B080B796B1DDE74F Dennis, Andy Royer has been selling flooring for some time. I wouldgive him an e-mail and ask him about it. Ralph andy@w-link.net "Aebersold, Dennis R" wrote: Has anyone had experience with bamboo flooring? We are about to dosome remodeling and my wife, Jane, said last night let's do a bamboofloor. It would be very different and special. I found somecompanies on the net that sell it and I can't think of anything thatwould look cooler. Anyway if any of you have first hand experienceI'd like to hear from you. -dDennis Aebersold --http://www.ida.net/users/rmoon --------------1C89C2F1B080B796B1DDE74F andy@w-link.net "Aebersold, Dennis R" wrote: Has anyone had experience withbamboo first hand experience I'd like to hear from you. DennisAebersold --http://www.ida.net/users/rmoon --------------1C89C2F1B080B796B1DDE74F-- from rmoon@ida.net Fri Apr 5 10:14:44 2002 g35GEh401905 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 10:14:43 -0600 Subject: Re: 70s rod making- pre Garrison books question Rex I knew of these books before the 70's but never ran across them. I amsure they were around, but I didn't know where to look. The only book Ifound and this was in the early fifty's was George Leonard Herter's bookon Bamboo Rod Building,. It was (and is) a good primer , but it goesinto very little detail. However it was all I had. Rod builders ofthe period were very close mouthed, even to the point of rippingtelephones off the wall. Holden's book is so outdated that today it isalmost not worth the problem, and before its republishing certainly notworth its expense. George Barnes' book, was good too, but for me it wasa little more elementary than I liked. Thank your lucky stars that youare around today, with plentiful information, all materials supplies andtools available, and a magnificent data source like this rod list. Ralph Rex Tutor wrote: I have been reading with interest the discussion ofwhen people started making rods, and the books andsources of information. I really enjoy books as wellas rod making. I note that Garrison / Carmichealpublished in the 70s but there were books before thisthat appear easier to read and launch a rod with .Claude Kreider "The Bamboo Rod " 1951and Garrison's mentor Dr Holden's "The Idyl of theSplit - Bamboo rod" , 1920. I was wondering if thesebooks were available during the 60s ? I never hearthem mentioned . Perhaps they were hard to find inpre Garrison times. Any gray hairs ( I am a gray-hairbut just late to rod building ) start with these orother pre Garrison books ? __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTaxhttp://taxes.yahoo.com/ --http://www.ida.net/users/rmoon from jvswan@earthlink.net Fri Apr 5 10:17:22 2002 g35GHL402393 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 10:17:21 -0600 (63.225.56.215) "Grayson Davis" ,"Jerry Madigan" , "Lee Koeser","raymond t. todd" ,"Darrin Curtis" ,"Geert Poorteman" ,"Davesrods" , Notsooyoun@aol.com,"Robert S Williams" , Troutgetter@aol.com,Eastkoyfly@aol.com, "Larry Blan" ,"chad wigham" , "john barber" ,"Douglas Losey" ,"Ralph MacKenzie" User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/10.0.0.1429Subject: Cork rings Hi all, Well, here I am complicating things again. I got a call from Chris at C&D.He checked with his guy in the warehouse and it turns out he has 4250 cork1/4" rings left. He said that some people love them and some people sendthem back. He told me that if they aren't better than I expect I can shipthem back, but I would rather not make that choice for everyone. I have had seven or eight people email me back and tell me that if Pace willsell the rings for 50 cents or less they will want to wait and get those. Ihave also had a couple who want the Pace rings no matter what the price. Ihave had a couple of people say they don't care. One person would like toknow what the samples are like before ordering, and doesn't want to order from C&D. So far, no one has said anything about preferring to order fromC&D. So, here's what I'm going to do. I'm going to submit an invoice to Pace for5000 rings and see if I can get an exact price. We can always do a splitorder if anyone would rather pay the 35 cents for cork from C&D. I'll behappy to do what I can to accommodate the list. After all the help I havehad from the group, it is only fair. I'll let you know how it goes. Jason from James.Hatch@METROKC.GOV Fri Apr 5 10:23:20 2002 g35GNJ403308 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 10:23:19 -0600 id ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 08:23:18 -0800 Subject: RE: Off topic this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. There is a place here in Seattle that sells it called the Environmental HomeCenter. We're doing a remodel also and my wife wants to use it in ourkitchen. I know several people that have it and they all really like it -wears well, looks cool, etc. -----Original Message----- Subject: Off topic Has anyone had experience with bamboo flooring? We are about to do someremodeling and my wife, Jane, said last night let's do a bamboo floor. Itwould be very different and special. I found some companies on the net thatsell it and I can't think of anything that would look cooler. Anyway if anyof you have first hand experience I'd like to hear from you. -d Dennis Aebersold Off topic There is a place here in Seattle that sells it called the Environmental Home kitchen. I know several people that have it and they all really like it - wears -----Original Message-----From: Aebersold, Dennis R Off topicHas anyone had experience with bamboo said first hand experience I'd like to hear from you. Aebersold from rextutor@yahoo.com Fri Apr 5 10:37:12 2002 g35GbB406484 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 10:37:11 -0600 05 Apr 2002 08:37:10 PST Subject: Re: 70s rod making- pre Garrison books question Thanks ralphthat's interestingDo you mean the Herters rod Building Manual ? Or isthere another Herter title ?--- "Ralph W. Moon" wrote: Rex I knew of these books before the 70's but never ranacross them. I amsure they were around, but I didn't know where tolook. The only book Ifound and this was in the early fifty's was GeorgeLeonard Herter's bookon Bamboo Rod Building,. It was (and is) a goodprimer , but it goesinto very little detail. However it was all I had.Rod builders ofthe period were very close mouthed, even to thepoint of rippingtelephones off the wall. Holden's book is sooutdated that today it isalmost not worth the problem, and before itsrepublishing certainly notworth its expense. George Barnes' book, was goodtoo, but for me it wasa little more elementary than I liked. Thank yourlucky stars that youare around today, with plentiful information, allmaterials supplies andtools available, and a magnificent data source likethis rod list. Ralph Rex Tutor wrote: I have been reading with interest the discussion of when people started making rods, and the books andsources of information. I really enjoy books as well as rod making. I note that Garrison / Carmichealpublished in the 70s but there were books before this that appear easier to read and launch a rod with . Claude Kreider "The Bamboo Rod " 1951and Garrison's mentor Dr Holden's "The Idyl of theSplit - Bamboo rod" , 1920. I was wondering if these books were available during the 60s ? I never hearthem mentioned . Perhaps they were hard to find in pre Garrison times. Any gray hairs ( I am a gray-hair but just late to rod building ) start with these or other pre Garrison books ? __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTaxhttp://taxes.yahoo.com/ --http://www.ida.net/users/rmoon __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTaxhttp://taxes.yahoo.com/ from LambersonW@missouri.edu Fri Apr 5 10:44:18 2002 g35GiI407188 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 10:44:18 -0600 Fri, 5 Apr 2002 10:44:17 -0600 content-class: urn:content-classes:message Subject: RE: 70s rod making- pre Garrison books question Thread-Topic: 70s rod making- pre Garrison books questionThread-Index: AcHcwLTjwPCgckiyEdaKgABglD88hQAAKvmw FILETIME=[209AA890:01C1DCC1] g35GiI407189 I started with George Barnes and Letcher Lambuth's books as well as read acopy of Garrison borrowed from the library. My wife eventually bought acopy for me directly from Hoagy Carmichael. It was less easy to findbuilders in those days, perhaps especially in the center of the country. Iknew of one in Omaha, but he would share little information. I did learn thathe used bamboo that came in the center of rolls of Oriental carpets andrugs. It was very large and thick walled. Communication was not as easy then either. It is not so easy and certainlynot as fast to communicate by letter as by email. Although letters were abit more tangible, I still have some of the ones from Hoagy. The phonewasn't so cheap to use either. The first reasonably decent (Workable?) strips that I made were on a"former". I don't remember where I got the idea, but I cut 60 degreetriangular boards from maple on the table saw, then smoothed them on theplaner. I removed the corners with a hand plane incorporating a taper (ofunknown dimension) and glued the bamboo strips to the corner. I then used arouter with a pattern forming bit to cut the bamboo. I suppose it was a veryprimitive form of mill, and it worked after a fashion. I never did build a rodof those strips. It wasn't too long after that experience that I gave up onmachinists and filed my own planing form and then got a Morgan Mill. Bill Lamberson from bob@downandacross.com Fri Apr 5 11:00:55 2002 g35H0s409185 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 11:00:54 -0600 5 Apr 2002 12:00:44 -0500 "Grayson Davis" ,"Jerry Madigan" , "Lee Koeser","raymond t. todd" ,"Darrin Curtis" ,"Geert Poorteman" ,"Davesrods" , ,"Robert S Williams" , ,, "Larry Blan" ,"chad wigham" , "john barber" ,"Douglas Losey" Subject: RE: Cork rings Jason:Hi, I am about to confuse things even further, sorry.Standard rings are usually 1/2" thick, aren't they? You will need a lot of1/4" corks to make a grip, although it may look nicer.I just recieved some sample from Chesapeke Cork Products in MD. The bestprice they offer on 1/2" #1 best grade cork (unbelieveably nice) is $1.55.Their #2 is $1.20 for 525-1000 pieces and it is comparable to the best ofthe .95 rings we got from REC last year. Their claim is that they do thesorting so that you do not need to throw away a lot of cork. If Pace givesyou that same guarantee, they sound like a good deal even at .898 a ring.Always get the best quality you can.People on the list have recieved cork from C&D, what do they think? .70sounds pretty good.Best regards,Bob -----Original Message----- t. todd; Darrin Curtis; Geert Poorteman; Davesrods; Notsooyoun@aol.com;Robert S Williams; Troutgetter@aol.com; Eastkoyfly@aol.com; Larry Blan;chad wigham; john barber; Douglas LoseySubject: Cork rings Hi all, Just a quick update on the 1/4" cork rings. We currently have orders for atleast 4000 rings. So, I called up C&D to see what their shipping turnaroundis. Turns out that they only have a couple of thousand rings left. Theyare expecting more at the beginning of next month. I'm not too sure howtheir sorting and shipping process works, but I'm not all that comfortableordering the very last of their stock, the bottom of the cork barrel, so tospeak. As an alternative, however, I gave Pace industries a call. Their web sitementions that they sell cork to Sage (700,000 per year, it turns out). Ialso had one list member tell me that it was really nice cork. So, Mike atPace tells me that he has three grades: Special (the best), Extra, andSuper. The special he sells to Winston, the Extra he sells to Sage, etc.He dropped a bunch of other names like Clemens (that may be where I got mylast bunch of 1/4" cork that was so nice) and some other cane rod makersthat I didn't recognize. At any rate, he tells me that he can ship as much cork as we need withinfour weeks. But here's the kicker... He will first send me samples to makesure it meets with my approval, and he said the rest of the cork isguaranteed to match the samples! So, I asked him how much. He said a 1/2"ring is $898 per 1000 (C&D sells their top quality for $700 per 1000). Hedidn't have a price for quarter inch rings. But, that means his bestquality (Super) is 20 cents more for half inch rings than C&D's best. Ifthey cut the price in half for 1/4" (that is what C&D did) then the pricewould go from 35 cents per ring to 45 cents per ring. Still, not too bad. So, I hate to complicate things, but it looks like we may have to wait a bit contacted me for cork rings. I'm happy to do whatever you guys want.Personally, I'm inclined to give Pace cork a try. But it may depend on howmuch the Super grade cork rings cost when things all shake out. I don'tknow how much they will be. Still, Mike was VERY enthusiastic about thequality of their Super grade cork. So, everyone who wanted some cork, please let me know what you would liketodo. If you want the C&D cork, I'll do that. If you want the Pace cork,I'll do that too. It may be interesting to compare the two. But if one ismuch better than the other, I, for one, might feel a bit put off for havingto use the lower quality cork. So, please let me know what you want. Ifanyone is in a real hurry, I'll find out by noon today how much cork C&D canship immediately. As of yesterday, though, they only had 2000 rings left instock. Thanks, Jason from gjm80301@yahoo.com Fri Apr 5 11:09:54 2002 g35H9s410103 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 11:09:54 -0600 05 Apr 2002 09:09:53 PST Subject: RE: Cork rings Rodmakers Grayson Davis , Jerry Madigan,Lee Koeser ,"raymond t. todd" ,Darrin Curtis ,Geert Poorteman , Davesrods,Notsooyoun@aol.com, Robert S Williams ,Troutgetter@aol.com, Eastkoyfly@aol.com, Larry Blan ,chad wigham , john barber ,Douglas Losey I believe that I have some from each. I bought 1000 from paceprobably 8-9 years ago. I got some from the groupd REC order and Ibought some 1/4" rings from Wayne at Grayrock 2000 that I believe are from C&D. Based on my samples, Pace was the best overall quality - probably 60%are what I'd call prime. The C&D 1/4" rings would be next - probablymore like 40% prime, BUT the 1/4" format makes the rings work bettersince any imperfections are only 1/4" long and tend to get lost. RECis not far behind at about 30-35% prime stuff. That is why I toldJason that I'm a big buyer if Pace will sele their best stuff in 1/4"rings. I plan to sell off my non-prime corks to graphite guys once I haveenough in- house to sort and keep on the prime stuff. Jerry --- Bob Maulucci wrote: Jason:Hi, I am about to confuse things even further, sorry.Standard rings are usually 1/2" thick, aren't they? You will need alot of1/4" corks to make a grip, although it may look nicer.I just recieved some sample from Chesapeke Cork Products in MD. Thebestprice they offer on 1/2" #1 best grade cork (unbelieveably nice) is$1.55.Their #2 is $1.20 for 525-1000 pieces and it is comparable to thebest ofthe .95 rings we got from REC last year. Their claim is that theydo thesorting so that you do not need to throw away a lot of cork. IfPace givesyou that same guarantee, they sound like a good deal even at .898 aring.Always get the best quality you can.People on the list have recieved cork from C&D, what do they think?.70sounds pretty good.Best regards,Bob -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Friday, April 05, 2002 10:38 AM Cc: Coffey, Patrick W; Grayson Davis; Jerry Madigan; Lee Koeser;raymondt. todd; Darrin Curtis; Geert Poorteman; Davesrods;Notsooyoun@aol.com;Robert S Williams; Troutgetter@aol.com; Eastkoyfly@aol.com; LarryBlan;chad wigham; john barber; Douglas LoseySubject: Cork rings Hi all, Just a quick update on the 1/4" cork rings. We currently haveorders for atleast 4000 rings. So, I called up C&D to see what their shippingturnaroundis. Turns out that they only have a couple of thousand rings left.Theyare expecting more at the beginning of next month. I'm not toosure howtheir sorting and shipping process works, but I'm not all thatcomfortableordering the very last of their stock, the bottom of the corkbarrel, so tospeak. As an alternative, however, I gave Pace industries a call. Theirweb sitementions that they sell cork to Sage (700,000 per year, it turnsout). Ialso had one list member tell me that it was really nice cork. So,Mike atPace tells me that he has three grades: Special (the best), Extra,andSuper. The special he sells to Winston, the Extra he sells toSage, etc.He dropped a bunch of other names like Clemens (that may be where Igot mylast bunch of 1/4" cork that was so nice) and some other cane rodmakersthat I didn't recognize. At any rate, he tells me that he can ship as much cork as we needwithinfour weeks. But here's the kicker... He will first send mesamples to makesure it meets with my approval, and he said the rest of the cork isguaranteed to match the samples! So, I asked him how much. Hesaid a 1/2"ring is $898 per 1000 (C&D sells their top quality for $700 per1000). Hedidn't have a price for quarter inch rings. But, that means hisbestquality (Super) is 20 cents more for half inch rings than C&D'sbest. Ifthey cut the price in half for 1/4" (that is what C&D did) then thepricewould go from 35 cents per ring to 45 cents per ring. Still, nottoo bad. So, I hate to complicate things, but it looks like we may have towait a bit people havecontacted me for cork rings. I'm happy to do whatever you guyswant.Personally, I'm inclined to give Pace cork a try. But it maydepend on howmuch the Super grade cork rings cost when things all shake out. Idon'tknow how much they will be. Still, Mike was VERY enthusiasticabout thequality of their Super grade cork. So, everyone who wanted some cork, please let me know what youwould like todo. If you want the C&D cork, I'll do that. If you want the Pacecork,I'll do that too. It may be interesting to compare the two. Butif one ismuch better than the other, I, for one, might feel a bit put off to use the lower quality cork. So, please let me know what youwant. Ifanyone is in a real hurry, I'll find out by noon today how much cork C&D canship immediately. As of yesterday, though, they only had 2000rings left instock. Thanks, Jason Sent using the Entourage X Test Drive. __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTaxhttp://taxes.yahoo.com/ from tedknott@cogeco.ca Fri Apr 5 11:11:10 2002 g35HB9410386 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 11:11:09 -0600 Subject: Re: 70s rod making- pre Garrison books question Herters was my first book. My second was A. J. McClanes "wise Fisherman'sEncyclopedia" section on bamboo rod making. Its one I would stillrecommend. Over the years I've managed to collect most of the older andcurrent significant books on bamboo rod making. They each have somethingtooffer. For anyone starting up I would recommend the Cattenach and/orMaurerbooks. from harms1@pa.net Fri Apr 5 11:19:22 2002 g35HJM411380 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 11:19:22 -0600 Subject: Re: Off topic Dennis, I haven't used it for flooring, but I'm using it to make hex rod cases. Thestuff is as tough as freaking nails, and I can't imagine any hardwood floorthat would be more durable. It's really good stuff! Get the baked,caramel-toned product, but avoid manufacturers that use only a bambooveneer. Cheers, Bill ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Off topic Has anyone had experience with bamboo flooring? We are about to dosomeremodeling and my wife, Jane, said last night let's do a bamboo floor. Itwould be very different and special. I found some companies on the net that sell it and I can't think of anything that would look cooler. Anyway if any of you have first hand experience I'd like to hear from you.-dDennis Aebersold from jojo@ipa.net Fri Apr 5 11:19:56 2002 g35HJs411512 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 11:19:55 -0600 helo=default) id 16tXNR-0003wG-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Fri, 05 Apr 2002 12:19:53 -0500 Subject: Re: Cork rings Those prices from Chesapeake sound as though they are retail prices. Actually, on the group buy we did, we paid $.80 per ring, shipping both waysincluded, but becausewe initially were buying a smaller quantity we ponied up $.95 per ring, butreceived enough rings toactually bring the cost down to $.80. We had to order 5,000 rings to get it atthat price, too. I've never been happy with cork that came from C&D. M-D Jason:Hi, I am about to confuse things even further, sorry.Standard rings are usually 1/2" thick, aren't they? You will need a lot of1/4" corks to make a grip, although it may look nicer.I just recieved some sample from Chesapeke Cork Products in MD. The bestprice they offer on 1/2" #1 best grade cork (unbelieveably nice) is $1.55.Their #2 is $1.20 for 525-1000 pieces and it is comparable to the best ofthe .95 rings we got from REC last year. Their claim is that they do thesorting so that you do not need to throw away a lot of cork. If Pace givesyou that same guarantee, they sound like a good deal even at .898 a ring.Always get the best quality you can.People on the list have recieved cork from C&D, what do they think? .70sounds pretty good.Best regards,Bob Hi all, Just a quick update on the 1/4" cork rings. We currently have orders for atleast 4000 rings. So, I called up C&D to see what their shipping turnaroundis. Turns out that they only have a couple of thousand rings left. Theyare expecting more at the beginning of next month. I'm not too sure howtheir sorting and shipping process works, but I'm not all that comfortableordering the very last of their stock, the bottom of the cork barrel, so tospeak. As an alternative, however, I gave Pace industries a call. Their web sitementions that they sell cork to Sage (700,000 per year, it turns out). Ialso had one list member tell me that it was really nice cork. So, Mike atPace tells me that he has three grades: Special (the best), Extra, andSuper. The special he sells to Winston, the Extra he sells to Sage, etc.He dropped a bunch of other names like Clemens (that may be where I got mylast bunch of 1/4" cork that was so nice) and some other cane rod makersthat I didn't recognize. At any rate, he tells me that he can ship as much cork as we need withinfour weeks. But here's the kicker... He will first send me samples to makesure it meets with my approval, and he said the rest of the cork isguaranteed to match the samples! So, I asked him how much. He said a 1/2"ring is $898 per 1000 (C&D sells their top quality for $700 per 1000). Hedidn't have a price for quarter inch rings. But, that means his bestquality (Super) is 20 cents more for half inch rings than C&D's best. Ifthey cut the price in half for 1/4" (that is what C&D did) then the pricewould go from 35 cents per ring to 45 cents per ring. Still, not too bad. So, I hate to complicate things, but it looks like we may have to wait a bit contacted me for cork rings. I'm happy to do whatever you guys want.Personally, I'm inclined to give Pace cork a try. But it may depend on howmuch the Super grade cork rings cost when things all shake out. I don'tknow how much they will be. Still, Mike was VERY enthusiastic about thequality of their Super grade cork. So, everyone who wanted some cork, please let me know what you would liketodo. If you want the C&D cork, I'll do that. If you want the Pace cork,I'll do that too. It may be interesting to compare the two. But if one ismuch better than the other, I, for one, might feel a bit put off for havingto use the lower quality cork. So, please let me know what you want. Ifanyone is in a real hurry, I'll find out by noon today how much cork C&D canship immediately. As of yesterday, though, they only had 2000 rings left instock. Thanks, Jason from rmoon@ida.net Fri Apr 5 11:47:12 2002 g35HlC413431 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 11:47:12 -0600 Subject: Re: 70s rod making- pre Garrison books question --------------330AB0FA88AB9C5AB5046F95 Yes Rex The manualRalph Rex Tutor wrote: Thanks ralphthat's interestingDo you mean the Herters rod Building Manual ? Or isthere another Herter title ?--- "Ralph W. Moon" wrote: --http://www.ida.net/users/rmoon __________________________________________________ --http://www.ida.net/users/rmoon --------------330AB0FA88AB9C5AB5046F95 RalphRex Tutor wrote:Thanks ralphthat's interestingDo you mean the Herters rod Building Manual ? Or isthere another Herter title ?--- "Ralph W. Moon" <rmoon@ida.net> wrote:--http://www.ida.net/users/rmoon __________________________________________________ --http://www.ida.net/users/rmoon --------------330AB0FA88AB9C5AB5046F95-- from jvswan@earthlink.net Fri Apr 5 11:48:04 2002 g35Hm3413605 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 11:48:04 -0600 (63.225.56.215) User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/10.0.0.1429Subject: Re: Cork rings Thanks a lot, Bob! As if I wasn't confused enough as it is... Pace will guarantee that the rings they ship will be as good or better thanthe samples they send out first. Personally, I'm not to interested inmaking a judgment call with other people's money at stake. I would rathertake our group's best recommendation, order the stuff, stick unsortedhandfuls of the cork in mailing boxes, and let everyone settle for what theyget. I know that sounds cranky, but I don't want anyone to feel ripped off.When I asked C&D how their cork looks, Chris said that some would love itand some would want to return it. Didn't give me a lot of confidence. As far as those who have contacted me go, I have heard some really nicethings about Pace. Nothing negative yet. People who have commented onC&Dhave been lukewarm at best (well, to be honest there were maybe one or twowho said they have been happy with their cork, but I don't remember forsure) and negative otherwise. Personally, I'm not a cork crank, so I wouldprobably not be too disappointed by C&D unless it was obviously bad. Heck,I probably wouldn't even know any better. But since I have started thisbeast, I have learned a bit about cork and that some outfits can providebetter quality, more consistently, than others. Besides, since I'm notselling bamboo rods yet, I don't want to put down an awful lot of moneybecause it all comes from my pocket instead of a down payment. So, for theprice C&D sounds fine to me. But if we can get better, more consistentquality cork from Pace for 10 to 15 cents or so more per ring, then I'm all Since we're talking at least 5,000 rings (probably 6,000 the way things aregoing) I would rather just get what I get from the best source I can thenbox it up one night while watching Star Trek or something. One other thing about Pace, too. They offer unbleached cork. That would bereally cool. I would really like some unbelievably nice cork rings, though. Does thatMaryland outfit sell in smallish quantities? What about 1/4" rings forthose of us who don't want to bother cutting them? Jason On 4/5/02 10:00 AM, "Bob Maulucci" wrote: Jason:Hi, I am about to confuse things even further, sorry. from rmoon@ida.net Fri Apr 5 11:50:18 2002 g35HoI414058 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 11:50:18 -0600 Subject: Re: 70s rod making- pre Garrison books question Bill, I am curious as to the source of your former. I had a guy come to me wholives far back in the hills and showed me such a device. However, he planed. The rods were rough. and of course the tapers were pure instinct. But Ihave always wondered where he got the idea. Ralph "Lamberson, William R." wrote: I started with George Barnes and Letcher Lambuth's books as well as reada copy of Garrison borrowed from the library. My wife eventually bought acopy for me directly from Hoagy Carmichael. It was less easy to findbuilders in those days, perhaps especially in the center of the country. Iknew of one in Omaha, but he would share little information. I did learn thathe used bamboo that came in the center of rolls of Oriental carpets andrugs. It was very large and thick walled. Communication was not as easy then either. It is not so easy and certainlynot as fast to communicate by letter as by email. Although letters were abit more tangible, I still have some of the ones from Hoagy. The phonewasn't so cheap to use either. The first reasonably decent (Workable?) strips that I made were on a"former". I don't remember where I got the idea, but I cut 60 degreetriangular boards from maple on the table saw, then smoothed them on theplaner. I removed the corners with a hand plane incorporating a taper (ofunknown dimension) and glued the bamboo strips to the corner. I then used arouter with a pattern forming bit to cut the bamboo. I suppose it was a veryprimitive form of mill, and it worked after a fashion. I never did build a rodof those strips. It wasn't too long after that experience that I gave up onmachinists and filed my own planing form and then got a Morgan Mill. Bill Lamberson --http://www.ida.net/users/rmoon from CAIrvinerods@aol.com Fri Apr 5 11:52:27 2002 g35HqQ414423 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 11:52:27 -0600 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 12:52:09 -0500 Subject: Off Topic, Bamboo Flooring I installed a bamboo floor for my son in Athena Oregon, we did the dinning room Kitchen and entry/laundry room. The stuff we did was like three layers of laminated bamboo, went down really nice but it will dent if you drop something on it. I thought about making rod cases out of the stuff left over but it was too thick but! Hope this helps a little, let me know if you have any questions. Tight Lines, Chuck I installed a bamboo floor for my son in AthenaOregon, we did the dinning room Kitchen and entry/laundry room. The stuffwe did was like three layers of laminated bamboo, went down really nice but itwill dent if you drop something on it. I thought about making rod cases out ofthe stuff left over but it was too thick but! Hope this helps a little, let me know if you have any questions. Tight Lines, Chuck from CAIrvinerods@aol.com Fri Apr 5 11:56:19 2002 g35HuJ415046 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 11:56:19 -0600 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 12:56:04 -0500 Subject: Rod ID Thanks again for help on the Heddon Mark II. I know this one is bamboo but can't find it in any of my references. Anyone know about a rod called Union Brook, brass ferrules, nothing fancy. Thanks, Chuck Thanks again for help on the Heddon Mark II. I know know about a rod called Union Brook, brass ferrules, nothing fancy. Thanks, Chuck from baconrod@gsmrinc.com Fri Apr 5 12:07:49 2002 g35I7n415921 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 12:07:49 -0600 by uid 10599 with qmail-scanner-1.10 (uvscan: v4.1.40/v4195. .Clear:0. Processed in 0.701679 secs); 05 Apr 2002 15:11:46 -0000 (216.153.210.138) Subject: Re: 70s rod making- pre Garrison books question Rex.I started building rods back in 1962 after graduating from HighSchool. Back in the mid 1950's my grandfather and I toured most of the rodbuilding shops in the U.S. and a few in Europe. He gave me a Herters kit ongraduation. He also introduced me to Wes Jordan of Orvis. Wes hired me towork at Orvis on summer breaks during College. Books, I purchased Kridersbook and the Herters book on Bamboo rod building. When I have time I willtell you about the Hawes and Payne shops which I owned for many years.Best Hal.----- Original Message ----- Subject: 70s rod making- pre Garrison books question I have been reading with interest the discussion ofwhen people started making rods, and the books andsources of information. I really enjoy books as wellas rod making. I note that Garrison / Carmichealpublished in the 70s but there were books before thisthat appear easier to read and launch a rod with .Claude Kreider "The Bamboo Rod " 1951and Garrison's mentor Dr Holden's "The Idyl of theSplit - Bamboo rod" , 1920. I was wondering if thesebooks were available during the 60s ? I never hearthem mentioned . Perhaps they were hard to find inpre Garrison times. Any gray hairs ( I am a gray-hairbut just late to rod building ) start with these orother pre Garrison books ? __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTaxhttp://taxes.yahoo.com/ from tedknott@cogeco.ca Fri Apr 5 12:10:14 2002 g35IAE416192 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 12:10:14 -0600 Subject: Re: 70s rod making- pre Garrison books question The use of a former is described in at least two books that I remember. Oneis G. Lawtom Moss' book "How to to Build Your Own Split Bamboo Rod", 1954Moss also describes the use of layers of paper to create a taper. The otherbook is J. B. Walker's book "Rods: How to Make Them", 1959 from bdcbfr@chartermi.net Fri Apr 5 12:12:05 2002 g35IC5416524 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 12:12:05 -0600 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 13:12:01 -0500 Subject: Hardy Perfect 3 5/8" Hi guys, I just bought a Hardy Perfect 3 5/8" reel. It's new in the box with =cards. Came from the Hardy store in London in the 1960's. Agate line =guard is perfect, finish is perfect. Anybody have an idea what this =thing should be worth? Also, I have a chance to buy a spere spool for =it in the same new condition. Would this have much effect on the value? Thanks! Brian, "I don't know beans about reels" Creek I just bought a Hardy Perfect 3 5/8" = on the value? Thanks! Brian, "I don't know beans about reels"= Creek from homes-sold@attbi.com Fri Apr 5 12:18:48 2002 g35IIl417229 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 12:18:47 -0600 ;Fri, 5 Apr 2002 18:18:42 +0000 Subject: Re: 70s rod making- pre Garrison books question Rex,My first book on Bamboo Rod Building was George Leonard Herter's. I'mguessing but it must have been in the early 60's. I do know that I got it from the old Herter's Catalog which was a wonderful book in its self.Couldn't wait for the new one to come out each year. Always had a write-upabout nearly every item and always ended with "It will last a lifetime" Imoved so many times in the corporate world that eventually it and all thecatalogs got lost in the shuffle.:>(Don----- Original Message ----- Subject: 70s rod making- pre Garrison books question I have been reading with interest the discussion ofwhen people started making rods, and the books andsources of information. I really enjoy books as wellas rod making. I note that Garrison / Carmichealpublished in the 70s but there were books before thisthat appear easier to read and launch a rod with .Claude Kreider "The Bamboo Rod " 1951and Garrison's mentor Dr Holden's "The Idyl of theSplit - Bamboo rod" , 1920. I was wondering if thesebooks were available during the 60s ? I never hearthem mentioned . Perhaps they were hard to find inpre Garrison times. Any gray hairs ( I am a gray-hairbut just late to rod building ) start with these orother pre Garrison books ? __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTaxhttp://taxes.yahoo.com/ from edriddle@mindspring.com Fri Apr 5 12:22:24 2002 g35IMO417646 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 12:22:24 -0600 helo=oemcomputer) id 16tYLk-000052-00; Fri, 05 Apr 2002 13:22:13 -0500 Subject: Re: Rod ID Chuck:Didn't see it listed in Sinclair's Heddon book. However, there's =mention of Heddon making rod(s) for Union Hardware (Conn.), might be a =Union rod.Ed Subject: Rod ID Thanks again for help on the Heddon Mark II. I know this one is bamboo =but can't find it in any of my references. Anyone know about a rod =called Union Brook, brass ferrules, nothing fancy. Chuck:Didn't see it listed in Sinclair's = (Conn.), might be a Union rod.Ed ----- Original Message ----- CAIrvinerods@aol.com Sent: Friday, April 05, 2002 = PMSubject: Rod IDThanks again for help on the Heddon Mark II. I = about a rod called Union Brook, brass ferrules, nothing = Chuck from hartzell@easystreet.com Fri Apr 5 12:31:52 2002 g35IVp418410 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 12:31:51 -0600 g35IVn827128; Subject: Re: 70s rod making- pre Garrison books question Rex,I started with Kreider in '63, but had to search for a used copy.There is still some good stuff in that book.Ed Rex Tutor wrote: I have been reading with interest the discussion ofwhen people started making rods, and the books andsources of information. I really enjoy books as wellas rod making. I note that Garrison / Carmichealpublished in the 70s but there were books before thisthat appear easier to read and launch a rod with .Claude Kreider "The Bamboo Rod " 1951and Garrison's mentor Dr Holden's "The Idyl of theSplit - Bamboo rod" , 1920. I was wondering if thesebooks were available during the 60s ? I never hearthem mentioned . Perhaps they were hard to find inpre Garrison times. Any gray hairs ( I am a gray-hairbut just late to rod building ) start with these orother pre Garrison books ? __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTaxhttp://taxes.yahoo.com/ from homes-sold@attbi.com Fri Apr 5 12:31:54 2002 g35IVs418414 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 12:31:54 -0600 ;Fri, 5 Apr 2002 18:31:45 +0000 Subject: Re: Off topic Off topicDennis,Crosscut Hardwoods here in Seattle has it. It comes in two patterns, =laminated so you see the edge grain and flat so you see the nodes. Looks =cool.Don Subject: Off topic Has anyone had experience with bamboo flooring? We are about to do some=remodeling and my wife, Jane, said last night let's do a bamboo floor. =It would be very different and special. I found some companies on the =net that sell it and I can't think of anything that would look cooler. =Anyway if any of you have first hand experience I'd like to hear from =you. Off topic Dennis,Crosscut Hardwoods here in Seattle has= in two patterns, laminated so you see the edge grain and flat so you see = nodes. Looks cool.Don From:Aebersold, = Sent: Friday, April 05, 2002 7:03 AMSubject: Off topic Has anyone had experience with bamboo = We are about to do some remodeling and my wife, Jane, said last night = companies on the net that sell it and I can't think of anything that = from you. Aebersold from Mark.Sargent@state.vt.us Fri Apr 5 12:34:16 2002 g35IYF418877 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 12:34:15 -0600 id ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 13:34:15 -0500 Subject: test from Mark.Sargent@state.vt.us Fri Apr 5 12:41:35 2002 g35IfY419442 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 12:41:34 -0600 id ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 13:41:34 -0500 Subject: Chubb rod Gentleman, (I hope that I haven't offended anyone...) I am new to the listand have enjoyed reading your notes and responses....I have also learned athing or two.....I have a question regarding a Chubb rod that my dadhas.....the grip is cane wrapped...the rod itself seems to be round and isabout 10' or 11' in length...there are three sections...I was curious as towhat the approximate vintage might be and if the rod is wood or cane...Idon't believe the rod is cane as there is some figure to it as well as someiridescence??? Mark Sargent from carstenjorgensen@mail.dk Fri Apr 5 12:45:59 2002 g35Ijw419838 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 12:45:58 -0600 Subject: Sv: Hardy Perfect 3 5/8" Dont know exactly what it=B4s worth, but will gladly take off Your hands = Buy that spare spool!!! regards, Carsten "I only fish Hardy reels" Jorgensen www.daniaflyrods.com Subject: Hardy Perfect 3 5/8" Hi guys, I just bought a Hardy Perfect 3 5/8" reel. It's new in the box with =cards. Came from the Hardy store in London in the 1960's. Agate line =guard is perfect, finish is perfect. Anybody have an idea what this =thing should be worth? Also, I have a chance to buy a spere spool for =it in the same new condition. Would this have much effect on the value? Thanks! Brian, "I don't know beans about reels" Creek Dont know exactly what it=B4s worth, but will gladly= Your hands for a hundred pounds:-)Buy that spare spool!!! regards, Carsten "I only fish Hardy reels" =Jorgensen www.daniaflyrods.com ----- Original Message ----- Creek Sent: Friday, April 05, 2002 = PMSubject: Hardy Perfect 3 =5/8" I just bought a Hardy Perfect 3 5/8" = have much effect on the value? Thanks! Brian, "I don't know beans about = Creek from hartzell@easystreet.com Fri Apr 5 12:51:47 2002 g35Ipk420436 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 12:51:46 -0600 Subject: Re: How long can you keep it up? Kyle,Just because one is old and learned before the books and e-mail doesn'tmeanthat he then or now makes better rods than the newcomers who are reallyseriousabout their craft. I can name many people who started after I did who aremakingbetter rods than I.Ed Hartzell KyleDruey@aol.com wrote: This whole thread made me wonder what you long time hobby rod makersthink ofthe new guys of today who can tool up and build their first bamboo fly rodinless than 3 months? Do you gray hairs think the newbies are getting off too easy now since wepayour dues measured in months and not years? I can easily see how it would have taken 3 years to complete that first rodif starting out in the hobby before the Garrison book, before the List,before the internet, before the one stop shopping suppliers, etc. Kyle Sorry if this already posted, aol has just launched a new webmail client andit is having problems. from caneman@clnk.com Fri Apr 5 13:05:59 2002 g35J5w421328 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 13:05:58 -0600 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35) Subject: Re: Chubb rod Mark,First, welcome to the list! Glad to have you aboard!On the rod, if it is a true Thomas H. Chubb Rod Co. rod, then it wouldhave to be pre-1890, but there is about 40 year of room for error there andhere's why. Montague bought out the Chubb Rod Co. in 1890, however,readingin Michael Sinclair's "Bamboo Rod Restoration Handbook", Chubb Rods werestill made in the Vermont factory after the aquisition of Chubb by Montague, from 1890 until 1932. Montague considered the Chubbs to be their "top ofthe line" rods. I'm sure there's someone who knows more about Chubb Rodsthan I do, but judging from the description of the rod (that it is roundand most likely wood and not bamboo), my opinion, without seeing the rod, isthat it was probably a Pre- Montague era Chubb Rod. Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com- ---- Original Message ----- Subject: Chubb rod Gentleman, (I hope that I haven't offended anyone...) I am new to the listand have enjoyed reading your notes and responses....I have also learned athing or two.....I have a question regarding a Chubb rod that my dadhas.....the grip is cane wrapped...the rod itself seems to be round and isabout 10' or 11' in length...there are three sections...I was curious as to what the approximate vintage might be and if the rod is wood or cane...Idon't believe the rod is cane as there is some figure to it as well as some iridescence??? Mark Sargent from caneman@clnk.com Fri Apr 5 13:07:06 2002 g35J75421509 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 13:07:05 -0600 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35) "rodmakers@wugate.wustl.e" Subject: Re: Hardy Perfect 3 5/8" Brian,Carsten doesn't need it... he has too much nice stuff! Mail it to =me for evaluation and I'll get back to you in a couple of decades! Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com Subject: Sv: Hardy Perfect 3 5/8" Dont know exactly what it=B4s worth, but will gladly take off Your =hands for a hundred pounds:-)Buy that spare spool!!! regards, Carsten "I only fish Hardy reels" Jorgensen www.daniaflyrods.com Subject: Hardy Perfect 3 5/8" Hi guys, I just bought a Hardy Perfect 3 5/8" reel. It's new in the box with =cards. Came from the Hardy store in London in the 1960's. Agate line =guard is perfect, finish is perfect. Anybody have an idea what this =thing should be worth? Also, I have a chance to buy a spere spool for =it in the same new condition. Would this have much effect on the value? Thanks! Brian, "I don't know beans about reels" Creek Brian, = a couple of decades! Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com ----- Original Message ----- Carsten J=F8rgensen = Sent: Friday, April 05, 2002 = PMSubject: Sv: Hardy Perfect 3 =5/8" Dont know exactly what it=B4s worth, but will = Your hands for a hundred pounds:-)Buy that spare spool!!! regards, Carsten "I only fish Hardy reels" =Jorgensen www.daniaflyrods.com ----- Original Message ----- Creek Sent: Friday, April 05, 2002 = PMSubject: Hardy Perfect 3 =5/8" I just bought a Hardy Perfect 3 = value? Thanks! Brian, "I don't know beans about = Creek from carstenjorgensen@mail.dk Fri Apr 5 13:26:39 2002 g35JQb422837 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 13:26:38 -0600 ;Fri, 5 Apr 2002 21:26:36 +0200 "rodmakers@wugate.wustl.e" Subject: Sv: Hardy Perfect 3 5/8" Brian Don=B4t listen to that Nunley person. My soul crave another Hardy reel, =and then another, and..............I am what I think is termed as a compulsive Hardy reel buyer. Thats why =I GOTTA HAVE that regards, Carsten "gimme more reels" Jorgensen Subject: Re: Hardy Perfect 3 5/8" Brian,Carsten doesn't need it... he has too much nice stuff! Mail it to =me for evaluation and I'll get back to you in a couple of decades! Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com Subject: Sv: Hardy Perfect 3 5/8" Dont know exactly what it=B4s worth, but will gladly take off Your =hands for a hundred pounds:-)Buy that spare spool!!! regards, Carsten "I only fish Hardy reels" Jorgensen www.daniaflyrods.com Subject: Hardy Perfect 3 5/8" Hi guys, I just bought a Hardy Perfect 3 5/8" reel. It's new in the box =with cards. Came from the Hardy store in London in the 1960's. Agate =line guard is perfect, finish is perfect. Anybody have an idea what =this thing should be worth? Also, I have a chance to buy a spere spool = value? Thanks! Brian, "I don't know beans about reels" Creek Brian Don=B4t listen to that Nunley person. My soul crave= Hardy reel, and then another, and..............I am what I think is termed as a compulsive Hardy = Thats why I GOTTA HAVE thatreel. Bob? He=B4d just fish it. regards, Carsten "gimme more reels"Jorgensen ----- Original Message ----- Bob =Nunley ; rodmakers@wugate.wustl.e = Sent: Friday, April 05, 2002 = PMSubject: Re: Hardy Perfect 3 =5/8" Brian, you in a couple of decades! Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com ----- Original Message ----- Carsten J=F8rgensen = Sent: Friday, April 05, 2002 = PMSubject: Sv: Hardy Perfect 3 =5/8" Dont know exactly what it=B4s worth, but will = off Your hands for a hundred pounds:-)Buy that spare spool!!! regards, Carsten "I only fish Hardy reels" =Jorgensen www.daniaflyrods.com ----- Original Message ----- Creek Sent: Friday, April 05, = PMSubject: Hardy Perfect 3 =5/8" I just bought a Hardy Perfect 3 = value? Thanks! Brian, "I don't know beans about = =Creek from gwclark.vernmhp@state.ut.us Fri Apr 5 14:21:39 2002 g35KLc426191 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 14:21:38 -0600 with Novell_GroupWise; Fri, 05 Apr 2002 13:21:31 -0700 Subject: Re: oil and vinegar g35KLd426192 Back in the days that I built and restored furniture, I religiously added aproduct called "Fish-Eye Flowout" to my laquer when spraying refinishedfurniture. Fish-Eyes in laquer are also caused from silicone contamination. I'm not sure whether the stuff would be compatible with varnish however. Ithink some experimentation would be in order here. It doesn't take much tooffset the effects of the silicone. Anyway, hope this helps. Gary W. Clark - NB7BNetwork AdministratorNortheastern Counseling CenterPOB 1908 Vernal, UT 84078OFC: 435-789-6326FAX: 435-789- 6325gwclark.vernmhp@state.ut.us "If everything is going great, don't try to figure it out" crmitchell 04/04/2002 9:50:04 PM >>> My first thought. Silicones are typically soluble in alcohol. Try wiping with methyl (wood or denatured) alcohol, which runs about 98%, rather than the drugstore stuff, isopropyl, which is 30% water. James Harris wrote: Yes I have been. Very good observation Tony Tony Young 04/04/02 11:13AM >>> Are you using a T shirt to wipe the rod down at any time?I ask because silicon in fabric softener never washes out and that (silicon) will cause these sorts of problems. Tony At 10:55 AM 4/4/02 -0700, James Harris wrote: GuysI've been having a intermittent problem with the application of my varnish. I use a drip tube and MOW gloss. I've been getting an occasional separation between the varnish and the surface of the bamboo. The varnish initially coats the entire surface but later the smooth even coating will separate in places, exposing the unfinished bamboo. The bamboo and varnish are acting like oil and vinegar. It usually occurs on the butt section near the grip and pulls back from the edges. This is what I've tried so far:Purchased new varnishSwitched from mineral spirits to alcohol for the final rubdown.Switched from alcohol to alcohol and shellac mixture for final rubdown (this helped a bit)Purchased new non-oiled steel wool.Thinned the varnish with mineral spirits to about 80% varnish. (Varnish temperature is not an issue here in Phoenix, except in storage) Other observations that may or may not be a factor are:This never occurs on the tip sections.This never happened when I was using URAC 185. I use PU these days.It usually does not occur if I filter the varnish just prior to filling the tube.It seems to happen more frequently on darker flamed rods. Have any of you had this problem and if so how did you solve it?Any recommendations? Thanks,JimH /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html >There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from Dkenney94@cs.com Fri Apr 5 14:56:24 2002 g35KuN427945 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 14:56:23 -0600 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 15:56:09 -0500 Subject: Re: oil and vinegar " Back in the days that I built and restored furniture, I religiously added a product called "Fish-Eye Flowout" to my laquer when spraying refinished furniture. Fish-Eyes in laquer are also caused from silicone contamination" Don't do this!! The only place for Fish Eye Additives is for refinishing furniture. Even then its better to spray a spit coat of shellac,which isn't bothered by silicone first. These additives are basically silicone themselves so all you wind up doing is pre contaminating your finish. Yes it will work but you cannot ever stop using it. Everything that your finish touches will then be contaminated with silicone permanently. Incidentaly most cases of "Silicone Contamination" in finishing are misdiagnosed, its actually quite rare. D furniture, I religiously added a product called "Fish-Eye Flowout" to my laquer caused from silicone contamination" Don't do this!! The only place for Fish Eye Additives is for refinishingfurniture. Even then its better to spray a spit coat of shellac,which isn'tbothered by silicone first. These additives are basically silicone themselvesso all you wind up doing is pre contaminating your finish. Yes it will work butyou cannot ever stop using it. Everything that your finish touches will thenbe contaminated with silicone permanently. Incidentaly most cases of"Silicone Contamination" in finishing are misdiagnosed, its actually quite rare. from caneman@clnk.com Fri Apr 5 15:08:19 2002 g35L8I429419 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 15:08:18 -0600 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35) "rodmakers@wugate.wustl.e" Subject: Re: Hardy Perfect 3 5/8" Carsten... i wouldn't fish it! I promise! I don't even own a fishing =rod! Ask Harry.... I was Hand Lining, yesterday! *S* Bob (who wishes he had a Classic Hardy) R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com Subject: Sv: Hardy Perfect 3 5/8" Brian Don=B4t listen to that Nunley person. My soul crave another Hardy =reel, and then another, and..............I am what I think is termed as a compulsive Hardy reel buyer. Thats =why I GOTTA HAVE that regards, Carsten "gimme more reels" Jorgensen Subject: Re: Hardy Perfect 3 5/8" Brian,Carsten doesn't need it... he has too much nice stuff! Mail it =to me for evaluation and I'll get back to you in a couple of decades! Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com Subject: Sv: Hardy Perfect 3 5/8" Dont know exactly what it=B4s worth, but will gladly take off Your =hands for a hundred pounds:-)Buy that spare spool!!! regards, Carsten "I only fish Hardy reels" Jorgensen www.daniaflyrods.com Subject: Hardy Perfect 3 5/8" Hi guys, I just bought a Hardy Perfect 3 5/8" reel. It's new in the box =with cards. Came from the Hardy store in London in the 1960's. Agate =line guard is perfect, finish is perfect. Anybody have an idea what =this thing should be worth? Also, I have a chance to buy a spere spool = value? Thanks! Brian, "I don't know beans about reels" Creek *S* Bob (who wishes he had a ClassicHardy) R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com ----- Original Message ----- Carsten J=F8rgensen = Sent: Friday, April 05, 2002 = PMSubject: Sv: Hardy Perfect 3 =5/8" Brian Don=B4t listen to that Nunley person. My soul = Hardy reel, and then another, and..............I am what I think is termed as a compulsive Hardy = buyer. Thats why I GOTTA HAVE thatreel. Bob? He=B4d just fish it. regards, Carsten "gimme more reels"Jorgensen ----- Original Message ----- Bob = =rodmakers@wugate.wustl.e = Sent: Friday, April 05, 2002 = PMSubject: Re: Hardy Perfect 3 =5/8" Brian, to you in a couple of decades! Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com ----- Original Message ----- = Carsten J=F8rgensen = Sent: Friday, April 05, = PMSubject: Sv: Hardy Perfect = 5/8" Dont know exactly what it=B4s worth, but will = off Your hands for a hundred pounds:-)Buy that spare spool!!! regards, Carsten "I only fish Hardy reels" =Jorgensen www.daniaflyrods.com ----- Original Message ----- D. Creek Sent: Friday, April 05, = PMSubject: Hardy Perfect 3 =5/8" I just bought a Hardy Perfect 3 = value? Thanks! Brian, "I don't know beans = =Creek from alan.grombacher@pioneer.com Fri Apr 5 15:09:10 2002 g35L99429580 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 15:09:09 -0600 5 Apr 2002 16:08:39 -0500 id ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 15:08:38 -0600 "rodmakers@wugate.wustl.e" Subject: RE: Hardy Perfect 3 5/8" this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. Brian, Hardy Perfect 3 5/8 reel new in box never been fished - $250US. Sparespool- 100CDN or 100US depending on what side of the border you buy it on. I gotmine and the 2 spools for the above prices last fall. The guy that I got mine from, bought 4 Hardy Perfect 3 5/8 reels. He putthree away and used one. Mine has never had a line on it, but that is soonto be remedied. It will be ready for the spring steelhead trip to B.C. onApril 19th. Cheers, Alberta Al -----Original Message----- Subject: Hardy Perfect 3 5/8" Hi guys, I just bought a Hardy Perfect 3 5/8" reel. It's new in the box with cards.Came from the Hardy store in London in the 1960's. Agate line guard isperfect, finish is perfect. Anybody have an idea what this thing should beworth? Also, I have a chance to buy a spere spool for it in the same newcondition. Would this have much effect on the value? Thanks! Brian, "I don't know beans about reels" Creek Brian, Hardy spool - I got mine and the 2 spools for the above prices last fall. The three be 19th. Cheers, Alberta Al -----Original Message-----From: Brian D. Creek 1:12 Hardy Perfect 3 5/8" I just bought a Hardy Perfect 3 5/8" in this have much effect on the value? Thanks! Brian, "I don't know beans about reels" Creek from bob@downandacross.com Fri Apr 5 15:11:12 2002 g35LBB429931 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 15:11:11 -0600 Subject: RE: Cork rings Jason:I do not know about 1/4" rings from Chesapeake. They say 1.25x.5x.25".Therephone is 1-800-486-3337. I talked to Streett Whiteford. Seemed nice. I haveno financial interest, but the samples they sent were rather nice.Bob -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Cork rings Thanks a lot, Bob! As if I wasn't confused enough as it is...I would really like some unbelievably nice cork rings, though. Does thatMaryland outfit sell in smallish quantities? What about 1/4" rings forthose of us who don't want to bother cutting them? from tausfeld@frontiernet.net Fri Apr 5 15:13:24 2002 g35LDL400354 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 15:13:22 -0600 "rodmakers@wugate.wustl.e" Subject: Re: Hardy Perfect 3 5/8" Carsten, A hundred pounds of what??? ; ) tom Subject: Sv: Hardy Perfect 3 5/8" Dont know exactly what it=B4s worth, but will gladly take off Your =hands for a hundred pounds:-)Buy that spare spool!!! regards, Carsten "I only fish Hardy reels" Jorgensen www.daniaflyrods.com Subject: Hardy Perfect 3 5/8" Hi guys, I just bought a Hardy Perfect 3 5/8" reel. It's new in the box with =cards. Came from the Hardy store in London in the 1960's. Agate line =guard is perfect, finish is perfect. Anybody have an idea what this =thing should be worth? Also, I have a chance to buy a spere spool for =it in the same new condition. Would this have much effect on the value? Thanks! Brian, "I don't know beans about reels" Creek Carsten, ) tom ----- Original Message ----- Carsten J=F8rgensen Sent: Friday, April 05, 2002 = PMSubject: Sv: Hardy Perfect 3 =5/8" Dont know exactly what it=B4s worth, but will = Your hands for a hundred pounds:-)Buy that spare spool!!! regards, Carsten "I only fish Hardy reels" =Jorgensen www.daniaflyrods.com ----- Original Message ----- Creek Sent: Friday, April 05, 2002 = PMSubject: Hardy Perfect 3 =5/8" I just bought a Hardy Perfect 3 = value? Thanks! Brian, "I don't know beans about = Creek from patrick.w.coffey@boeing.com Fri Apr 5 15:15:24 2002 g35LFN400738 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 15:15:23 -0600 NAA06981; PAA26774; g35LFFt17953; (5.5.2650.21) id ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 13:15:15 -0800 =?iso-8859-1?Q?Carsten_J=F8?= =?iso-8859-1?Q?rgensen?= ,"rodmakers@wugate.wustl.e" Subject: RE: Hardy Perfect 3 5/8" this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. tell you what gentleman, I'll settle this for you!! Just give me the =reelthen neither one of you have to worry about it!!!! -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Hardy Perfect 3 5/8" Carsten... I wouldn't fish it! I promise! I don't even own a fishing =rod!Ask Harry.... I was Hand Lining, yesterday! *S* Bob (who wishes he had a Classic Hardy) R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrods rodmakers@wugate.wustl.e Subject: Sv: Hardy Perfect 3 5/8" Brian Don=B4t listen to that Nunley person. My soul crave another Hardy reel, =andthen another, and..............I am what I think is termed as a compulsive Hardy reel buyer. Thats why =IGOTTA HAVE that regards, Carsten "gimme more reels" Jorgensen Subject: Re: Hardy Perfect 3 5/8" Brian,Carsten doesn't need it... he has too much nice stuff! Mail it to =me Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrods Subject: Sv: Hardy Perfect 3 5/8" Dont know exactly what it=B4s worth, but will gladly take off Your =hands for ahundred pounds:-)Buy that spare spool!!! regards, Carsten "I only fish Hardy reels" Jorgensen Subject: Hardy Perfect 3 5/8" Hi guys, I just bought a Hardy Perfect 3 5/8" reel. It's new in the box with =cards.Came from the Hardy store in London in the 1960's. Agate line guard isperfect, finish is perfect. Anybody have an idea what this thing =should beworth? Also, I have a chance to buy a spere spool for it in the same =newcondition. Would this have much effect on the value? Thanks! Brian, "I don't know beans about reels" Creek you!! Just give me the reel then neither one of you have to worry about = it!!!! Patrick W.Coffey =AOG Incident Repair Planning =Phone: 425-234-2901 = = 5/8" yesterday! *S* Bob (who wishes he had a Classic =Hardy) R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com ----- Original Message ----- Carsten J=F8rgensen Sent: Friday, April 05, 2002 = PMSubject: Sv: Hardy Perfect 3 =5/8" Brian Don=B4t listen to that Nunley person. My soul = Hardy reel, and then another, and..............I am what I think is termed as a compulsive = buyer. Thats why I GOTTA HAVE thatreel. Bob? He=B4d just fish it. regards, Carsten "gimme more reels" =Jorgensen ----- Original Message ----- Bob= rodmakers@wugate.wustl.e= Sent: Friday, April 05, = PMSubject: Re: Hardy Perfect = 5/8" Brian, to you in a couple of decades! Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com ----- Original Message ----- = Carsten J=F8rgensen = Sent: Friday, April 05, = PMSubject: Sv: Hardy = 5/8" Dont know exactly what it=B4s worth, but = take off Your hands for a hundred pounds:-)Buy that spare spool!!! regards, Jorgensen www.daniaflyrods.com ----- Original Message ----- D. Creek Sent: Friday, April = PMSubject: Hardy Perfect = 5/8" I just bought a Hardy = value? Thanks! Brian, "I don't know beans = =Creek from peterharbottle@hotmail.com Fri Apr 5 15:39:22 2002 g35LdL402322 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 15:39:21 -0600 Fri, 5 Apr 2002 13:39:12 -0800 Fri, 05 Apr 2002 21:39:12 GMT Subject: CC de France and Lee Wulf Midge Values FILETIME=[53AC18D0:01C1DCEA] TedThis may be of limited help as it applies to UK prices but at auction last week I bought a Farlows Midge 6' 2 piece 1 tip for £120. It needs a little bit of work but I think this is what you would expect to pay here.At the same auction 2 8' CC de France rods were sold for £125 (1960) and £200 (1952). Again both rods needed some work.There is another auction tomorrow in London with 2 8' CC de France both restored rods by Edward Barder (a respected UK maker)with catalogue estimates of £300-500 and £300-400. Regards Peter _________________________________________________________________MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx from jvswan@earthlink.net Fri Apr 5 15:42:17 2002 g35LgG402707 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 15:42:16 -0600 (63.225.56.215) User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/10.0.0.1429Subject: Cork, again... Hi all, Just to let you know, I got a fax from Mike at Pace. He said they will getme pricing and shipping info on Monday or Tuesday. I'll pass along the infoas soon as I get it. Have a good weekend, Jason-- Jason Swan Instructional Designer Alamo Learning Systems (435) 753-3367 jswan@alamols.com Sent using the Entourage X Test Drive. >Fromgoodaple@cox-internet.com Fri Apr 5 15:42:46 2002 Received: from g35Lgj402839 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 15:42:45 internet.com (InterMail vK.4.03.05.00 201-232-132 license for; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 15:44:05 -0600 Message-ID:From: "Randall Subject: Al Medved Date: Fri, 5 Apr 2002 rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu X-Listprocessor- Version:8.2.09/990901/11:28 -- ListProc(tm) by CREN This is a multi-part message printable Does anyone have Al Medved's phone number they could email me?Thanks in = advance. Randall R. Gregory ------ Does anyone have Randall R. = Gregory ------ carstenjorgensen@mail.dk Fri Apr 5 15:46:04 2002 Received: from ; Fri, 5Apr 2002 23:46:02 +0200 Message-ID:From: =?iso-8859- Ausfeld" , "rodmakers@wugate.wustl.e"References: Subject: Sv: Hardy carstenjorgensen@mail.dk Sender: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu X- Listprocessor-Version: 8.2.09/990901/11:28 -- ListProc(tm) by CREN This dare say, old chap, ridiculing the good ol=B4 british currency is not becomingof a gentleman, which I presume You would like to be:-) Me? I just wanna buymyself a cheap Perfect....... Twice a year, or something like that, I catch afish worth mentioning. I simply LOVE that sound of a classic pawl =B4nratchet wheel having ripped line off the spool. Nothing quite like it. regards Friday, April 05, 2002 1:51 PM Subject: Sv: Hardy Perfect 3 5/8" Dont knowexactly what it=B4s worth, but will gladly take off Your = hands for ahundred pounds:-) Buy that spare spool!!! regards, Carsten "I only fish Hardyreels" Jorgensen www.daniaflyrods.com ------ Tom is not becoming of a gentleman, which I presume Perfect....... Twice a year, orsomething like that, I catch = a fish line off the spool. Nothing quite like Jorgensen -- ; rodmakers@wugate.wustl.e = Sent: Friday, April Carsten, ----- Original Message ----- Dont know exactly what it=B4s ) Buy that spare from goodaple@cox-internet.com Fri Apr 5 15:48:22 2002 g35LmL403685 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 15:48:21 -0600 (InterMail vK.4.03.05.03 201-232-132-103 license180e1de7f543f89455b24e508f9cca39) Subject: Al Medved I think I sent this the wrong way a minute ago. Does anyone have Al =Medved's phone number by chance? Thanks, Randall R. Gregory I think I sent this the wrong way a = Gregory from rperry@suffolk.lib.ny.us Fri Apr 5 16:54:07 2002 g35Ms6406680 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 16:54:06 -0600 g35Ms3518626; Subject: Re: Hardy Perfect 3 5/8" On Fri, 5 Apr 2002, Brian D. Creek wrote: Hi guys, I just bought a Hardy Perfect 3 5/8" reel. It's new in the box with cards. Came from the Hardy store in London in the 1960's. Agate lineguard is perfect, finish is perfect. Anybody have an idea what thisthing should be worth? That's a nebulous question so the nebulous answer is it's worth what somelunatic collector is willing to pay. I've seen NIB sell on eBay foraround $350. If you need any more info, just email. I've bought and solda few. Be aware that sometimes the seller says it has an agate guide butit may have the reddish-brown non-agate guide. Regards, BobFly Suppliesaflyshop.com from darrell@vFish.net Fri Apr 5 16:56:59 2002 g35Muw406989 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 16:56:58 -0600 Fri, 5 Apr 2002 16:56:54 -0600 Subject: RE: Marvin Hedge There's two books by Cliff Netherton selling on abebooks... The History of the Sport of Casting vol 1 & 2 http://dogbert.abebooks.com/abe/BookDetails?bi=112057014 http://dogbert.abebooks.com/abe/BookDetails?bi=112057012 These books are awesome for info on the 19th century rod makers. You'd besurprised to see how much great info there is in these book. Bios on Hawes,Leonard, Varney and many more... I believe Marvin Hedge is in there as well.Also casting national and world records in the books. In the two books thereare about 8 references in the indexes on Hedge... Yes, I am selling them and now have a store on abebooks too... The infocontained in these books is awesome. Regards, Darrell LeeAnglers Collectibles Exchangehttp://www.vfish.netInfo & Int'l Line: (323)465-4551 ==================Angling, collecting & rod making books at:http://www.vfish.net/files/acebooks7.PDF================== -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Marvin Hedge Try reading 'An Anglers Cast' by Captain TL Edwards and EricHorsfall- Turner.This is a most excellent book on tournament casting thatfeatures a lengthy article on Mr Hedge and his breaking of the thenworld record by a massive margin way back I forget when ......Paul Chris McDowell wrote: I'm refinishing an 8 1/2' 3pc. Heddon "Marvin Hedge"rod and would like to know more about him. I know hewas from Portland, Oregon and was involved in castingtournaments, introduced the double haul to thetournaments, and set a distance record in the 30's.Anyone know of additional information sources orpersonal knowledge of Marvin? __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTaxhttp://taxes.yahoo.com/ from harms1@pa.net Fri Apr 5 17:01:36 2002 g35N1Z407313 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 17:01:36 -0600 "rodmakers@wugate.wustl.e" Subject: Re: Hardy Perfect 3 5/8" Brian, If you're intent upon retaining maximum value for your reel, do not removeit from its box. Buy the extra spool as well. Wear cotton gloves to avoidcontamination from skin oils and acids, and clean the reel and spoolsthoroughly. Then coat all with a light application of Rangoon Oil, andstore in a room with constant temp. and humidity control. Also, to preservethe original colors of the box and the reel, do not expose anything to UV. On the other hand, if you are a fisherman, just use the damn thing, takegood care of it and enjoy! Let somebody else worry about its market value. Cheers, Bill ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Hardy Perfect 3 5/8" Hi guys, I just bought a Hardy Perfect 3 5/8" reel. It's new in the box with cards.Came from the Hardy store in London in the 1960's. Agate line guard isperfect, finish is perfect. Anybody have an idea what this thing should beworth? Also, I have a chance to buy a spere spool for it in the same newcondition. Would this have much effect on the value? Thanks! Brian, "I don't know beans about reels" Creek from rextutor@yahoo.com Fri Apr 5 18:01:16 2002 g3601F409590 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 18:01:15 -0600 05 Apr 2002 16:01:14 PST Subject: Re: 70s rod making- pre Garrison books question RodMakers Listserve DonWhat happened to Herters ? I see manuals and catalogs --- Don Schneider wrote: Rex,My first book on Bamboo Rod Building was GeorgeLeonard Herter's. I'mguessing but it must have been in the early 60's. Ido know that I got it from the old Herter's Catalog which was a wonderfulbook in its self.Couldn't wait for the new one to come out each year.Always had a write-upabout nearly every item and always ended with "Itwill last a lifetime" Imoved so many times in the corporate world thateventually it and all thecatalogs got lost in the shuffle.:>(Don----- Original Message -----From: "Rex Tutor" Sent: Friday, April 05, 2002 6:57 AMSubject: 70s rod making- pre Garrison books question I have been reading with interest the discussion ofwhen people started making rods, and the books andsources of information. I really enjoy books as wellas rod making. I note that Garrison / Carmichealpublished in the 70s but there were books beforethisthat appear easier to read and launch a rod with .Claude Kreider "The Bamboo Rod " 1951and Garrison's mentor Dr Holden's "The Idyl of theSplit - Bamboo rod" , 1920. I was wondering if thesebooks were available during the 60s ? I never hearthem mentioned . Perhaps they were hard to find inpre Garrison times. Any gray hairs ( I am agray-hairbut just late to rod building ) start with these orother pre Garrison books ? __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTaxhttp://taxes.yahoo.com/ __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTaxhttp://taxes.yahoo.com/ from ldboyko@cpinternet.com Fri Apr 5 18:11:10 2002 g360B9410085 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 18:11:09 -0600 g360B6sV001135 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 18:11:07 -0600 Subject: bamboo strips Help: I took me bamboo strips which I squared to 1/4 inch back to the =work bench to straighten the node areas some more. I took a piece of =3/4 inch plywood, and cut a half moon circle, about 25 inches wide, to =put strip on. I clamp one end of strip on plywood and then can work on =the nodes. today I laid a strip on this holding jig and as I bent the =strip over, the strip cracked about 4 inches from a node area. the crack =is not the length of the strip but rather across the width of the strip =and about 1/16 inch deep, I have enough bamboo left ( from enamel to =start of crack) to still make the strip, but what happened here. This =occured on 4 strips. The crack was as if you took a raqzor and cut =across the bam boo and down about 1/16". how come, why do I keep on =going, or junk the whole culm and start with a new culm. Lew =ldboyko@cpinternet.com also, this is to be a 7ft 6 inch rod, I am =making my strips 55 inch long to start planning on, is this to long. =help to 1/4 inch back to the work bench to straighten the node areas some = I took a piece of 3/4 inch plywood, and cut a half moon circle, about 25 = wide, to put strip on. I clamp one end of strip on plywood and then can = strip over, the strip cracked about 4 inches from a node area. the crack = the length of the strip but rather across the width of the strip and = inch deep, I have enough bamboo left ( from enamel to start of crack) to = make the strip, but what happened here. This occured on 4 strips. The = as if you took a raqzor and cut across the bam boo and down about 1/16". = come, why do I keep on going, or junk the whole culm and start with a = is to be a 7ft 6 inch rod, I am making my strips 55 inch long to start = from ldboyko@cpinternet.com Fri Apr 5 18:19:40 2002 g360Jd410530 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 18:19:39 -0600 g360JasV008335 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 18:19:37 -0600 Subject: straightening bamboo nodes Attention Tony Spezio: Hi Tony, do you have a second, contact off line =in regards to flatening nodes.. Lew ldboyko@cpinternet.com Attention Tony Spezio: Hi Tony, do you= ldboyko@cpinternet.com from rextutor@yahoo.com Fri Apr 5 18:22:29 2002 g360MT410800 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 18:22:29 -0600 05 Apr 2002 16:22:28 PST Subject: Re: Chubb rod All the (3 ) chubbs I have seen were not Tonkin Canebut were Calcutta cane . They have alot more color-spots . I have never heard of a round one but I knowthat some makers rounded rods in the 1890 era. --- Bob Nunley wrote: Mark,First, welcome to the list! Glad to have youaboard!On the rod, if it is a true Thomas H. Chubb RodCo. rod, then it wouldhave to be pre-1890, but there is about 40 year ofroom for error there andhere's why. Montague bought out the Chubb Rod Co.in 1890, however, readingin Michael Sinclair's "Bamboo Rod RestorationHandbook", Chubb Rods werestill made in the Vermont factory after theaquisition of Chubb by Montague, from 1890 until 1932. Montague considered theChubbs to be their "top ofthe line" rods. I'm sure there's someone who knowsmore about Chubb Rodsthan I do, but judging from the description of therod (that it is roundand most likely wood and not bamboo), my opinion,without seeing the rod, isthat it was probably a Pre- Montague era Chubb Rod. Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com- ---- Original Message -----From: "Sargent, Mark" Sent: Friday, April 05, 2002 12:41 PMSubject: Chubb rod Gentleman, (I hope that I haven't offended anyone...) I am new to the list and have enjoyed reading your notes and responses....I have also learned a thing or two.....I have a question regarding a Chubb rod that my dad has.....the grip is cane wrapped...the rod itself seems to be round and is about 10' or 11' in length...there are three sections...I was curious asto what the approximate vintage might be and if the rod is wood or cane...I don't believe the rod is cane as there is some figure to it as well assome iridescence??? Mark Sargent __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTaxhttp://taxes.yahoo.com/ from dongreife@hotmail.com Fri Apr 5 19:10:48 2002 g361Am411764 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 19:10:48 -0600 Fri, 5 Apr 2002 17:10:42 -0800 HTTP; Sat, 06 Apr 2002 01:10:42 GMT Subject: Re: 70s rod making- pre Garrison books question FILETIME=[DF61C240:01C1DD07] Rex, I have a copy of the Kreider (1950circa) book and I think a personwould have a pretty difficult time learning to build a cane rod from the words Greife RodMakers Listserve Get your FREE download of MSNExplorer at http://explorer.msn.com. from cw@vanion.com Fri Apr 5 20:03:18 2002 g3623H413373 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 20:03:17 -0600 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 19:08:22 -0700 Subject: Hardy Reels There's a guy on Virtual Fly Shop selling "30 Classic Reels", most of =them Hardys. There's a nice 3" 3 screw St George with Agate LG, my =favorite. There's a guy on Virtual Fly Shop = "30 Classic Reels", most of them Hardys. There's a nice = screw St George with Agate LG, myfavorite. from Lazybee45@aol.com Fri Apr 5 20:11:17 2002 g362BH413697 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 20:11:17 -0600 Subject: Re: How long can you keep it up? rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu In a message dated 4/4/02 9:54:30 PM Central Standard Time, tausfeld@frontiernet.net writes: I would not worry about grey hair. I would LIKE to worry about grey hair. I would like to worry about ANY hair at all! mark visit Wood Art Custom Designs http://woodartcustom.freeservers.com or http://hometown.aol.com/lazybee45/myhomepage/business.html Hand crafted items made to order! from caneman@clnk.com Fri Apr 5 20:23:13 2002 g362NC414101 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 20:23:12 -0600 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35) Subject: Re: bamboo strips sounds like the cane may be fracturing during the straightening or =pressing process. Smooth breaks like that are unusual in good cane. =Are you sure you're getting the cane hot enough to get it "rubbery" when =you're straightening and pressing? Just curious, estimate how long it =takes you to get the cane hot enough to straighten (slower is better, =IMHO). I may be wrong, but it sounds like something is going wrong in =your pressing straightening procedure and that, rather than bending, the =fibers may be shearing.55 inches is definitely not too long. I've made 6' one piece rods, =and worked much longer strips many many times. Do you bend test the =strips before you start straightening? I always do this on my cane, =because sometimes you'll find one that has a flat spot (doesn't bend =right) or a weak spot in it. If you do this and the cane bends at a =fairly consistent arc before you pressed and straightened the nodes, =then I'd say your problem doesn't lie in the cane itself. If it doesn't =fail before you straighten and press, then it should fail afterwards. Hope this helps,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com Sent: Friday, April 05, 2002 8:32 PMSubject: bamboo strips Help: I took me bamboo strips which I squared to 1/4 inch back to the =work bench to straighten the node areas some more. I took a piece of =3/4 inch plywood, and cut a half moon circle, about 25 inches wide, to =put strip on. I clamp one end of strip on plywood and then can work on =the nodes. today I laid a strip on this holding jig and as I bent the =strip over, the strip cracked about 4 inches from a node area. the crack =is not the length of the strip but rather across the width of the strip =and about 1/16 inch deep, I have enough bamboo left ( from enamel to =start of crack) to still make the strip, but what happened here. This =occured on 4 strips. The crack was as if you took a raqzor and cut =across the bam boo and down about 1/16". how come, why do I keep on =going, or junk the whole culm and start with a new culm. Lew =ldboyko@cpinternet.com also, this is to be a 7ft 6 inch rod, I am =making my strips 55 inch long to start planning on, is this to long. =help Lew, estimate how long it takes you to get the cane hot enough to straighten = wrong in your pressing straightening procedure and that, rather than = the fibers may be shearing. always do this on my cane, because sometimes you'll find one that has a = cane bends at a fairly consistent arc before you pressed and = afterwards. Hope this helps,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com ----- Original Message ----- boyko Sent: Friday, April 05, 2002 = PMSubject: bamboo strips squared to 1/4 inch back to the work bench to straighten the node = about 25 inches wide, to put strip on. I clamp one end of strip on = as I bent the strip over, the strip cracked about 4 inches from a node = the crack is not the length of the strip but rather across the width = strip and about 1/16 inch deep, I have enough bamboo left ( from = start of crack) to still make the strip, but what happened here. This = on 4 strips. The crack was as if you took a raqzor and cut across the = and down about 1/16". how come, why do I keep on going, or junk the = this is to be a 7ft 6 inch rod, I am making my strips 55 inch long to = help from channer@frontier.net Fri Apr 5 20:49:49 2002 g362nm414680 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 20:49:48 -0600 Subject: Re: 70s rod making- pre Garrison books question Don;I started with Kreider's book, then I got Wayne's and Garrison, but itwas Kreider who made me think I could actually build a bamboo rodmyself. By the time I got around to building my first rod, it wasKreider on the bench, not Garrison.john Don Greife wrote: Rex, I have a copy of the Kreider (1950circa) book and I think aperson would have a pretty difficult time learning to build a cane rod from the words in his book. Just simply not enough detail,,IMHO. DonGreife from Jfoster@sunset.net Fri Apr 5 21:01:23 2002 g3631M415072 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 21:01:22 -0600 g3631KqJ013384 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 19:01:20 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:0.9.4)Gecko/20011130 Netscape6/6.2.1 Subject: Url Claude, could you send me your new url again. thanks jerry from avyoung@iinet.net.au Fri Apr 5 21:43:53 2002 g363hp415783 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 21:43:52 -0600 Subject: Re: Off topic It looks great. The stuff I've seen looks like a blond rod with the nodes filed. The sections were about 6 feet long.This stuff looked very easy to lay because it was tongue and grooved but not all flooring may be like that.Tony At 09:03 AM 4/5/02 -0600, Aebersold, Dennis R wrote: Has anyone had experience with bamboo flooring? We are about to do some remodeling and my wife, Jane, said last night let's do a bamboo floor. It would be very different and special. I found some companies on the net that sell it and I can't think of anything that would look cooler. Anyway if any of you have first hand experience I'd like to hear from you. -dDennis Aebersold /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from Soignier54@aol.com Fri Apr 5 22:49:38 2002 g364nc416936 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 22:49:38 -0600 Subject: re:Bamboo strips Bob, I liked the answer you gave to Lew, and I do it myself, but (give me a ballpark here) how much are you bending your strips? I have been checking mine after spliting and then again over the course of construction/planning. After initial splitting, I'll check the strip over the whole length with one good long serious gradual bend (dry). Lots of it, almost into a circle for a 60" piece 1/4" square, slowly, and only 1 time looking over the course of the whole strip. And then once more after the straightening gymnastics. And then....after the heat treating, I'll check each specific node by bending the strip not much more than I think it would be torqued during the casting motion of the finished blank. During the final planning, I'll try and do once and a while when I can remember (mostly the tips at this point). Any faults, and I would reject the strip if it showed any weakness/irregularities (I haven't had any failures in the strips of the 2 rods I've made so far). So, back to my original question, how much do you bend these things? AndI'm flexible with node distances...Thanks for all your continued advise-Brian Smith Bob, I liked the answer you gave to Lew, and I do it myself, but (give me a checking mine after spliting and then again over the course of it, almost into a circle for a 60" piece 1/4" square, slowly, and only 1 time the straightening gymnastics. And then....after the heat treating, I'll checkeach specific node by bending the strip not much more than I think it would final planning, I'll try and do once and a while when I can remember (mostlythe tips at this point). Any faults, and I would reject the strip if it showedany weakness/irregularities (I haven't had any failures in the strips of the 2rods !I've made so far). So, back to my original question, how much do you bend Thanks for all your continued advise-Brian Smith from Jfoster@sunset.net Sat Apr 6 01:56:58 2002 g367uu419517 for ; Sat, 6 Apr 2002 01:56:56 -0600 g367unqJ001478 for ; Fri, 5 Apr 2002 23:56:50 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:0.9.4)Gecko/20011130 Netscape6/6.2.1 Subject: url Thanks Larry I downloaded all the cosmos stuff for my desktop changer jer from ajthramer@hotmail.com Sat Apr 6 03:20:09 2002 g369K8420534 for ; Sat, 6 Apr 2002 03:20:08 -0600 Sat, 6 Apr 2002 01:20:03 -0800 Sat, 06 Apr 2002 09:20:03 GMT Subject: Re: bamboo strips FILETIME=[3BC16E70:01C1DD4C] Sounds like the cane is not hot enough, 1/4" is super wide for a tip strip and wider strips take alot more heat to soften. My tip strips are split at .150" and the butts are .190-.200 for a standard and .260 for a swelled butt rod. I always use just my bare hands to straighten, after a bit of practice you can feel if the strip is not pliable. The use of some kind of jig to straighten escapes me. From: "lew boyko" Subject: bamboo stripsDate: Fri, 5 Apr 2002 18:32:29 -0800 Help: I took me bamboo strips which I squared to 1/4 inch back to the work bench to straighten the node areas some more. I took a piece of 3/4 inch plywood, and cut a half moon circle, about 25 inches wide, to put strip on. I clamp one end of strip on plywood and then can work on the nodes. today I laid a strip on this holding jig and as I bent the strip over, the strip cracked about 4 inches from a node area. the crack is not the length of the strip but rather across the width of the strip and about 1/16 inch deep, I have enough bamboo left ( from enamel to start of crack) to still make the strip, but what happened here. This occured on 4 strips. The crack was as if you took a raqzor and cut across the bam boo and down about 1/16". how come, why do I keep on going, or junk the whole culm and start with a new culm. Lew ldboyko@cpinternet.com also, this is to be a 7ft 6 inch rod, I am making my strips 55 inch long to start planning on, is this to long. help _________________________________________________________________Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com from jvswan@earthlink.net Sat Apr 6 10:00:33 2002 g36G0W424463 for ; Sat, 6 Apr 2002 10:00:33 -0600 (63.225.56.215) User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/10.0.0.1429Subject: Cork All right, I know I am asking for trouble, so here goes... After corresponding with Bob and A.J. about cork from Chesapeake I gaveStreett Whiteford a call. Couldn't ask for a nicer guy to do business with.He has what he calls #1 cork rings (1/2" thick) that "almost look artificialthey are so free of flaws." That from a well known and respected rod makerand list member. So, in addition to the order from Pace I'm going to place an order withChesapeake. If nothing else, just for myself. The reason for the dualorder? Well, Streett won't sell me more than 1,500 rings, tops. At firsthe wouldn't let me order more than 500, but I told him that there may beseveral people who want to order with me. He keeps pretty tight control ofhis inventory because of the scarcity of that quality of cork. So, if anyone is interested in unbelievably clear cork for $1.55 per ring(1/2" thick), please let me know. He does not do 1/4" rings. I have had afew guys who wanted 1/2" rings. This will be the only 1/2" I will order.Sorry. My new goal is to place the order by Tuesday for the 1/4" rings. I gotemail from C&D with photos of the cork rings they want to sell me. He ispushing pretty hard and wants to send me 1,000 right away, offering to letme send them back if I'm not happy with them. The photo he sent was onlyabout 150px X 150 px, so I couldn't tell much. He also sent a letterannouncing a new, higher quality cork ring that will sell for $.92. I don'tknow if that is retail or wholesale, though. Pace will contact me on Mondayor Tuesday, and then I'll decide and place the order. I hope no one is irritated by the emails and the delays. I just want tomake sure everyone knows what is going on so no one is concerned thatsomething shifty is going on. I also want to make sure we get the best cork In the next day or two, I'll send out an updated order sheet so people canconfirm their orders. If there are any inaccuracies or changes, just let meknow after you take a look. Also, let me know about the 1/2" rings fromChesapeake. Thanks, Jason from rcurry@ttlc.net Sat Apr 6 11:19:28 2002 g36HJR426124 for ; Sat, 6 Apr 2002 11:19:27 -0600 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:0.9.4)Gecko/20011019 Netscape6/6.2 Subject: April Contest on Rodmakers Another silk line will be awarded for the winner in April. The correct answer to Mapril's question "Who first wrote of the practice of enticing trout by a small movement of a dry fly, just "the sudden inch"?" was Leonard Wright. In his book "Fishing the Dry Fly as a Living Insect", Wright titled chapter III "The Sudden Inch". Definitely a worthwhile read. The Mapril contest winner was W. Kifer. -- Best regards, Reed http://www.overmywaders.com/ >From "Rodmakers" References:Subject: Re: Cork Date: Sat, 6 Apr MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 harms1@pa.net Sender: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu X- Listprocessor-Version: 8.2.09/990901/11:28 -- ListProc(tm) by CRENJason, Well, you're surely correct about the sincerity of Street Whitford atChesapeake Cork. And the quality of his #1 cork is astonishing (he sent mesome samples as well), but, holy smokes, $1.55 per ring adds up to a LOT ofmoney! Street's #2 cork is also looks excellent, but it doesn't seem torepresent a great savings. Street's claim is that you will not need to sort hiscork, and that every piece is of equal quality. If this turns out to be true itcould change the picture, however, because I usually wind up pitching outabout 30% or more of most of the cork I've ordered from other sources(60%of the last stuff I got). Cheers, Bill ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jason Sent: Saturday, April 06, 2002 11:00 AMSubject: Cork All right, I know I am asking for trouble, so here goes... After corresponding with Bob and A.J. about cork from Chesapeake I gaveStreett Whiteford a call. Couldn't ask for a nicer guy to do business with. He has what he calls #1 cork rings (1/2" thick) that "almost look artificial they are so free of flaws." That from a well known and respected rod maker and list member. So, in addition to the order from Pace I'm going to place an order withChesapeake. If nothing else, just for myself. The reason for the dualorder? Well, Streett won't sell me more than 1,500 rings, tops. At firsthe wouldn't let me order more than 500, but I told him that there may beseveral people who want to order with me. He keeps pretty tight control of his inventory because of the scarcity of that quality of cork. So, if anyone is interested in unbelievably clear cork for $1.55 per ring(1/2" thick), please let me know. He does not do 1/4" rings. I have had a few guys who wanted 1/2" rings. This will be the only 1/2" I will order.Sorry. My new goal is to place the order by Tuesday for the 1/4" rings. I gotemail from C&D with photos of the cork rings they want to sell me. He ispushing pretty hard and wants to send me 1,000 right away, offering to letme send them back if I'm not happy with them. The photo he sent was onlyabout 150px X 150 px, so I couldn't tell much. He also sent a letterannouncing a new, higher quality cork ring that will sell for $.92. I don't know if that is retail or wholesale, though. Pace will contact me on Monday or Tuesday, and then I'll decide and place the order. I hope no one is irritated by the emails and the delays. I just want tomake sure everyone knows what is going on so no one is concerned thatsomething shifty is going on. I also want to make sure we get the best cork In the next day or two, I'll send out an updated order sheet so people canconfirm their orders. If there are any inaccuracies or changes, just let me know after you take a look. Also, let me know about the 1/2" rings fromChesapeake. Thanks, Jason Sent using the Entourage X Test Drive. from rcrensha@midsouth.rr.com Sat Apr 6 12:29:15 2002 g36ITF427722 for ; Sat, 6 Apr 2002 12:29:15 -0600 g36ITE911905 for ; Sat, 6 Apr 2002 12:29:14 -0600 Subject: "Culled" cork If you guys don't mind, after you get your cork orders, I'd be =interested in talking to a couple of you about buying some of the culled =cork from you super anal retentive types who buy the top stock and cull =out 30- 60% of your stuff. I don't sell my rods, but I don't want junk =either. I may well be amenable to taking very good cork off your hands =if you are the type that wants only perfect cork. Hell, my rods don't =deserve such cork. They are generally butt-ugly fishing sticks. As =many of you have seen first hand, I don't even sand between varnish =coats. You rod sellers are safe with me. Rick (average rods for an average fisherman) Crenshaw If you guys don't mind, after you get = orders, I'd be interested in talking to a couple of = some of the culled cork from you super anal retentive types who buy the = cork off your hands if you are the type that wants only perfect = me. Rick (average rods for an average = Crenshaw from caneman@clnk.com Sat Apr 6 12:33:53 2002 g36IXq428064 for ; Sat, 6 Apr 2002 12:33:52 -0600 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35) Subject: re:Bamboo strips Brian,First thing I do after I split a culm is bend test the cane. This =doesn't seem obvious, but if you can't touch 72" strips end to end =without them breaking, then they won't hold up in a rod. I bend test =again after straightening and pressing. I don't bend as extreme here, =just until the ends in either hand are parallel. That 180=B0 arc is more =bending than the finished rod will ever be subjected to. I don't just =bend to see if it fails, but bend to make sure that the arc of the bend =is consistent, in other words, that there are no exceptionally weak or =strong areas in the strip. You'd be surprised how many of those I =find... strips with those, get tossed in the floor, and sometime over =the next week or so, get put in the corner with a few hundred other bad =strips. Also, at that point, if there is a hidden place, like an =interior rot or a worm hole that isn't obvious, you can tell it when you =bend the strip. Many times, a seemingly good strip will snap, and sure =enough, in the center of the strip (seems like those work holes or rots =are always in the middle of a strip... never in the middle of a split = After that, I don't bend test anymore. If it held up to the rigors =of being cranked around as a fresh split, then as one that has been =through the rigors of heating, straightening and pressing, then I figure = One more thing, and this is hard to describe, as it's more a "feel" =thing than anything else. Sometimes, I get strips from what I thought =to be a great culm, with great cosmetics, good power fiber density, =etc., and even though the arc is smooth and consistent, they just DO NOT =feel right when you bend them. They have a weak feeling, so to speak... =too easy to bend into a half circle or touch end to end... Does that =make sense? I guess what I'm saying is regardless of how the power =fibers look and how good the cane looked, it just didn't "feel" like a =piece of bamboo that would make a good rod, so I pitch them into the =Scrap strip pile on the floor.Just to give you an idea of how much cane I reject during this =process, Billie, my girlfriend, was helping me clean out the shop last =night to make room for a new piece of machinery that's coming soon. She =took all the reject strips home, saying she's going to do some craft =stuff with them... I did a good cleanout just before Christmas and =burned all the "reject" strips an pieces (which also burned Billie's =ass, because she, being more business minded than I, said that it was =craft supplies, potential bodkins, tool handles, etc, and NOT scrap and =could be turned into money). Last night, Billie hauled off somewhere =between 75 and 100 pounds of cane strips between 72" and 40" long. That =was only a 4 month collection of rejects from culms that I had chosen = Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com Subject: re:Bamboo strips I liked the answer you gave to Lew, and I do it myself, but (give me a =ballpark here) how much are you bending your strips? I have been =checking mine after spliting and then again over the course of =construction/planning. After initial splitting, I'll check the strip =over the whole length with one good long serious gradual bend (dry). =Lots of it, almost into a circle for a 60" piece 1/4" square, slowly, =and only 1 time looking over the course of the whole strip. And then =once more after the straightening gymnastics. And then....after the heat =treating, I'll check each specific node by bending the strip not much =more than I think it would be torqued during the casting motion of the =finished blank. During the final planning, I'll try and do once and a =while when I can remember (mostly the tips at this point). Any faults, =and I would reject the strip if it showed any weakness/irregularities (I =haven't had any failures in the strips of the 2 rods I've made so far). =So, back to my original question, how much do you bend these things? = Brian, strips end to end without them breaking, then they won't hold up in a = extreme here, just until the ends in either hand are parallel. That = consistent, in other words, that there are no exceptionally weak or = with those, get tossed in the floor, and sometime over the next week or = Also, at that point, if there is a hidden place, like an interior rot or = split, then as one that has been through the rigors of heating, = = strips from what I thought to be a great culm, with great cosmetics, = feeling, so to speak... too easy to bend into a half circle or touch end = the power fibers look and how good the cane looked, it just didn't = piece of bamboo that would make a good rod, so I pitch them into the = pile on the floor. reject during this process, Billie, my girlfriend, was helping me clean = craft stuff with them... I did a good cleanout just before Christmas and = all the "reject" strips an pieces (which also burned Billie's ass, = being more business minded than I, said that it was craft supplies, = bodkins, tool handles, etc, and NOT scrap and could be turned into = of rejects from culms that I had chosen from bales that I thought were = Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane =Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com ----- Original Message ----- Soignier54@aol.com Cc: rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu=; ldboyko@cpinternet.com = Sent: Friday, April 05, 2002 = PMSubject: re:Bamboo stripsBob,= the answer you gave to Lew, and I do it myself, but (give me a = spliting and then again over the course of construction/planning. = initial splitting, I'll check the strip over the whole length with one = 60" piece 1/4" square, slowly, and only 1 time looking over the course = then....after the heat treating, I'll check each specific node by = strip not much more than I think it would be torqued during the = and a while when I can remember (mostly the tips at this point). Any = and I would reject the strip if it showed any weakness/irregularities = haven't had any failures in the strips of the 2 rods I've made so = back to my original question, how much do you bend these things? = flexible with node distances... Thanks for all your continued = Smith from eamon_lee@hotmail.com Sat Apr 6 13:05:34 2002 g36J5X428855 for ; Sat, 6 Apr 2002 13:05:34 -0600 Sat, 6 Apr 2002 11:05:28 -0800 Sat, 06 Apr 2002 19:05:27 GMT Subject: Re: Cork FILETIME=[03F406E0:01C1DD9E] Anyone have Streets phone number? I had an order with him but I forgot to tie it up and lost his #.TIA,Eamon _________________________________________________________________MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx from jojo@ipa.net Sat Apr 6 13:59:17 2002 g36JxH429792 for ; Sat, 6 Apr 2002 13:59:17 -0600 helo=default) id 16twL8-00055d-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Sat, 06 Apr 2002 14:59:11 -0500 Subject: Re: oil and vinegar This is as I was always taught, too. We used to use the additive in sign paintswhen lettering, andcould not get the substrate clean, despite multiple washings with solvents,scrubbing with Bon-Ami,etc. The Fish Eye Remover was a last-ditch effort. M-D " Back in the days that I built and restored furniture, I religiously added aproduct called"Fish-Eye Flowout" to my laquer when spraying refinished furniture. Fish-Eyes in laquer are alsocaused from silicone contamination" Don't do this!! The only place for Fish Eye Additives is for refinishingfurniture. Even then itsbetter to spray a spit coat of shellac,which isn't bothered by silicone first.These additives arebasically silicone themselves so all you wind up doing is pre contaminatingyour finish. Yes it willwork but you cannot ever stop using it. Everything that your finish toucheswill then becontaminated with silicone permanently. Incidentaly most cases of "SiliconeContamination" infinishing are misdiagnosed, its actually quite rare. D from wlwalter77us@yahoo.com Sat Apr 6 14:10:42 2002 g36KAf400210 for ; Sat, 6 Apr 2002 14:10:41 -0600 Sat, 06 Apr 2002 12:10:40 PST Got a little problem with nodes popping back afterheat-treating and when I try to heat and straightenthey still aren't getting as straight as I'd like,guess its mainly because I'm being careful to notscortch or over torque the strips in pressing. Wouldit be a good idea to soak them for a day or two andthen try to straighten them out. I know that this isgoing to be critical when I go to final tapering onthe handmill. __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTaxhttp://taxes.yahoo.com/ from RTeeter@carolina.rr.com Sat Apr 6 14:24:11 2002 g36KOA400727 for ; Sat, 6 Apr 2002 14:24:10 -0600 Sat, 6 Apr 2002 15:23:27 -0500 Subject: new environmentally improved finishes I'm a new guy to rodmakers. I have just gotten around to using one of =the new marine spar varnishes. Had to finally throw out the old =formula. I thinned with mineral spirits 1 part to 10 parts and dipped =the rod section. I sanded and repeated. My rod section was rough and = I later found out from the manufacturer thinning is no longer =recommended. I checked with several other companies and got the same = I'm a new guy to rodmakers. I have just= thinning is no longer recommended. I checked with several other = from lblan@provide.net Sat Apr 6 14:25:12 2002 g36KPB400879 for ; Sat, 6 Apr 2002 14:25:11 -0600 for ; Sat, 6 Apr 2002 15:25:10 -0500 Subject: RE: oil and vinegar Well... I just know I'm going to regret this, but here goes. First of all,let me state that I have spent my entire life in the automotive business,including a stint as supervisor of our body shop. I am only to familiar withthe evils of silicone and finishes.http://www.carronind.com/classics/index.htmlI will second the caution against using fish-eye eliminator though. The post With that said, there are several people on one of the woodworking boardsthat use a silicone product on their cast iron equipment on a regular basis.More than one is a full time professional cabinetmaker. Every time thesubject comes up, the thread deteriorates into something that resembles avisit here from TA. They swear that if it is rubbed in, it not only keepsthe tops of their equipment rust-free and slick, it causes no ill effectswith their finishes. This strays a far piece from conventional wisdom, I'lladmit. Now, I'm not about to start using it myself, I do far to many thingsthat involve some kind of finish or glue, and if I took it to work, I'd bestrung up. To many people have had this problem to attribute it to siliconecontamination. Every one that has been through it has cleaned, changedvarnish, changed tubes, avoided fabric softeners, etc. without any realsuccess. I don't know what is causing the problem, but I just have a hardtime believing it is silicone. Larry Blan -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Saturday, April 06, 2002 2:36 PM Subject: Re: oil and vinegar This is as I was always taught, too. We used to use the additivein sign paints when lettering, andcould not get the substrate clean, despite multiple washings withsolvents, scrubbing with Bon-Ami,etc. The Fish Eye Remover was a last-ditch effort. M-D From: Dkenney94@cs.com " Back in the days that I built and restored furniture, Ireligiously added a product called"Fish-Eye Flowout" to my laquer when spraying refinishedfurniture. Fish-Eyes in laquer are alsocaused from silicone contamination" Don't do this!! The only place for Fish Eye Additives is forrefinishing furniture. Even then itsbetter to spray a spit coat of shellac,which isn't bothered bysilicone first. These additives arebasically silicone themselves so all you wind up doing is precontaminating your finish. Yes it willwork but you cannot ever stop using it. Everything that yourfinish touches will then becontaminated with silicone permanently. Incidentaly most cases of"Silicone Contamination" infinishing are misdiagnosed, its actually quite rare. D from ajthramer@hotmail.com Sat Apr 6 17:21:32 2002 g36NLV403839 for ; Sat, 6 Apr 2002 17:21:31 -0600 Sat, 6 Apr 2002 15:21:26 -0800 Sat, 06 Apr 2002 23:21:25 GMT Subject: Re: new environmentally improved finishes FILETIME=[C5D51FB0:01C1DDC1] They don't want you to thin because it adds to the VOC's. Different formulas flow out like the old ones did, but they can be made to work.A.J. From: "Richard Walter Teeter" Subject: new environmentally improved finishesDate: Sat, 6 Apr 2002 15:16:41 -0500 I'm a new guy to rodmakers. I have just gotten around to using one of the new marine spar varnishes. Had to finally throw out the old formula. I thinned with mineral spirits 1 part to 10 parts and dipped the rod section. I sanded and repeated. My rod section was rough and pitted.I later found out from the manufacturer thinning is no longer recommended. I checked with several other companies and got the same answer. Anybody else had this problem? _________________________________________________________________Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer athttp://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp. from Dkenney94@cs.com Sat Apr 6 18:52:47 2002 g370ql405275 for ; Sat, 6 Apr 2002 18:52:47 -0600 for ; Sat, 6 Apr 2002 19:52:39 -0500 Subject: Re: oil and vinegar Larry Blan wrote: "With that said, there are several people on one of the woodworking boardsthat use a silicone product on their cast iron equipment on a regular basis.More than one is a full time professional cabinetmaker. Every time thesubject comes up, the thread deteriorates into something that resembles avisit here from TA. They swear that if it is rubbed in, it not only keepsthe tops of their equipment rust-free and slick, it causes no ill effectswith their finishes. This strays a far piece from conventional wisdom, I'lladmit. Now, I'm not about to start using it myself, I do far to many thingsthat involve some kind of finish or glue, and if I took it to work, I'd bestrung up." This is absolutely true. I have sprayed silicone on outfeed beds of planers &molders, run a piece thru & then finished the piece just to demonstrate this. Also I have sprayed & waxed the edge grain of boards & glued them up succesfully. Incidentally cheap sand paper & some of the stearated papers can causesome finishes to appear to fisheye. And is much more common than silicone contamination.Dave Larry Blan wrote: "With that said, there are several people on one of the woodworkingboardsthat use a silicone product on their cast iron equipment on a regularbasis.More than one is a full time professional cabinetmaker. Every time thesubject comes up, the thread deteriorates into something thatresembles avisit here from TA. They swear that if it is rubbed in, it not only keepsthe tops of their equipment rust-free and slick, it causes no ill effectswith their finishes. This strays a far piece from conventional wisdom, I'lladmit. Now, I'm not about to start using it myself, I do far to manythingsthat involve some kind of finish or glue, and if I took it to work, I'd bestrung up." This is absolutely true. I have sprayed silicone onoutfeed beds of planers & molders, run a piece thru & then finishedthe piece just to demonstrate this. Also I have sprayed & waxed theedge grain of boards & glued them up succesfully. Incidentally cheap sand paper & some of the stearated papers cancause some finishes to appear to fisheye. And is much more common thansilicone contamination. from rkrees@mcn.net Sat Apr 6 19:51:25 2002 g371pO406072 for ; Sat, 6 Apr 2002 19:51:25 -0600 helo=rkrees.mcn.net) id 16u1py-0000Ty-00; Sat, 06 Apr 2002 17:51:22 -0800 Subject: Re: oil and vinegar area of my Laundromat and I not only did rods in there but more than a =few doors and tables. I can tell you that it had to be one of the =dustiest places to work with the back of the dryers exposed. There must =be hundreds of loads with all kinds of softeners used and I never had a =problem with fish eyes. Ron = my Laundromat and I not only did rods in there but more than a few doors = tables. I can tell you that it had to be one of the dustiest places to = the back of the dryers exposed. There must be hundreds of loads with all = of softeners used and I never had a problem with fish eyes.Ron from jojo@ipa.net Sat Apr 6 19:56:41 2002 g371ue406356 for ; Sat, 6 Apr 2002 19:56:41 -0600 helo=default) id 16u1v4-0002IX-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Sat, 06 Apr 2002 20:56:38 -0500 Subject: Re: oil and vinegar About a year and a half ago, Harry Boyd had a fish-eye problem in his =finishing. It was finally determined that the anti-clog stearated =sandpaper was the culprit. M-D "With that said, there are several people on one of the woodworking = that use a silicone product on their cast iron equipment on a regular = More than one is a full time professional cabinetmaker. Every time the = subject comes up, the thread deteriorates into something that = visit here from TA. They swear that if it is rubbed in, it not only = the tops of their equipment rust-free and slick, it causes no ill = with their finishes. This strays a far piece from conventional wisdom, = admit. Now, I'm not about to start using it myself, I do far to many = that involve some kind of finish or glue, and if I took it to work, = This is absolutely true. I have sprayed silicone on outfeed beds of =planers & molders, run a piece thru & then finished the piece just to =demonstrate this. Also I have sprayed & waxed the edge grain of boards & = Incidentally cheap sand paper & some of the stearated papers can cause =some finishes to appear to fisheye. And is much more common than = About a year and a = Harry Boyd had a fish-eye problem in his finishing. It was finally = that the anti-clog stearated sandpaper was the =culprit. M-D Larry Blan wrote: "With= there are several people on one of the woodworking boards that use = silicone product on their cast iron equipment on a regular basis. = than one is a full time professional cabinetmaker. Every time the = comes up, the thread deteriorates into something that resembles a = here from TA. They swear that if it is rubbed in, it not only keeps = tops of their equipment rust-free and slick, it causes no ill effects = their finishes. This strays a far piece from conventional wisdom, I'll = admit. Now, I'm not about to start using it myself, I do far to = things that involve some kind of finish or glue, and if I took it = I'd be strung up." This is absolutely true. I have sprayed silicone on = of planers & molders, run a piece thru & then finished the = to demonstrate this. Also I have sprayed & waxed the edge grain of = & glued them up succesfully. Incidentally cheap sand paper = some of the stearated papers can cause some finishes to appear to = = from rmoon@ida.net Sat Apr 6 20:06:16 2002 g3726F406683 for ; Sat, 6 Apr 2002 20:06:15 -0600 Subject: Re: oil and vinegar MD and Ronnie Just my observations. I have been using fo-fil snadpapers for neaarly twenty years. No fish eyes. Ralph "Ronnie L. Rees" wrote: area of my Laundromat and I not only did rods in there but more than afew doors and tables. I can tell you that it had to be one of thedustiest places to work with the back of the dryers exposed. Theremust be hundreds of loads with all kinds of softeners used and I neverhad a problem with fish eyes. Ron --http://www.ida.net/users/rmoon from irish-george@chartermi.net Sat Apr 6 20:22:04 2002 g372M3407158 for ; Sat, 6 Apr 2002 20:22:03 -0600 Subject: Re: 70s rod making- pre Garrison books question The very first rodmaking book I ever read was Claude Kreider's ("The BambooRod") around 1971-2. (It was hard to find then and I bought a copy from LenCodella...expensive, too...close to the current value of the first editionbut other sources were even more difficult to obtain.) George Bourke BTW--Not gray-haired as I was a teenager when I read the book. ----- Original Message ----- Subject: 70s rod making- pre Garrison books question I have been reading with interest the discussion ofwhen people started making rods, and the books andsources of information. I really enjoy books as wellas rod making. I note that Garrison / Carmichealpublished in the 70s but there were books before thisthat appear easier to read and launch a rod with .Claude Kreider "The Bamboo Rod " 1951and Garrison's mentor Dr Holden's "The Idyl of theSplit - Bamboo rod" , 1920. I was wondering if thesebooks were available during the 60s ? I never hearthem mentioned . Perhaps they were hard to find inpre Garrison times. Any gray hairs ( I am a gray-hairbut just late to rod building ) start with these orother pre Garrison books ? __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTaxhttp://taxes.yahoo.com/ from jojo@ipa.net Sat Apr 6 20:49:44 2002 g372nh407718 for ; Sat, 6 Apr 2002 20:49:43 -0600 helo=default) id 16u2kO-000598-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Sat, 06 Apr 2002 21:49:41 -0500 Subject: Re: oil and vinegar After Ralph's post I got to looking, and apparently there are two types =of treated sandpaper. Most of the anti-clog papers are zinc stearate =treated, but there is an anti-clog treatment for silicon carbide paper =that apparently is not zinc stearate and does not cause problems as it = You might be right, Larry. I always sand with the use of raw linseed =oil. M-D The list of people who have had this problem is long and =distinguished, including D. Higham and A. Medved. The one that sticks in =my mind the most involved Dr. Ken Rongey. He and Wayne worked on his =finish problem over a couple of months. I don't know that they ever came =up with "the cure", but I can tell you they went as far as exchanging =tubes. Ken still had the problem, Wayne did not. There is a mysterious =varnish bug out there somewhere... my bet goes to overzealous use of to =fine a grade of sandpaper. I feel that the varnish is being burnished =rather than sanded and does not have enough "tooth" to keep the varnish =film intact. Just supposition of course, but I have yet to hear anything =that changes my mind. On Behalf Of Jojo DeLancier About a year and a half ago, Harry Boyd had a fish-eye problem in =his finishing. It was finally determined that the anti-clog stearated =sandpaper was the culprit. M-D "With that said, there are several people on one of the = that use a silicone product on their cast iron equipment on a = More than one is a full time professional cabinetmaker. Every time = subject comes up, the thread deteriorates into something that = visit here from TA. They swear that if it is rubbed in, it not = the tops of their equipment rust-free and slick, it causes no ill = with their finishes. This strays a far piece from conventional = admit. Now, I'm not about to start using it myself, I do far to = that involve some kind of finish or glue, and if I took it to = This is absolutely true. I have sprayed silicone on outfeed beds =of planers & molders, run a piece thru & then finished the piece just to =demonstrate this. Also I have sprayed & waxed the edge grain of boards & = Incidentally cheap sand paper & some of the stearated papers can =cause some finishes to appear to fisheye. And is much more common than = After Ralph's post Igot = and apparently there are two types of treated sandpaper. Most of the = papers are zinc stearate treated, but there is an anti-clog treatment = silicon carbide paper that apparently is not zinc stearate and does not = problems as it is made specifically for sanding wood. = You might be right, = sand with the use of raw linseed oil. M-D Larry = list of people who have had this problem is long and distinguished, = Dr. Ken Rongey. He and Wayne worked on his finish problem over a = months. I don't know that they ever came up with "the cure", but I can = you they went as far as exchanging tubes. Ken still had the problem, = not. There is a mysterious varnish bug out there somewhere... my bet = overzealous use of to fine a grade of sandpaper. I feel that the = being burnished rather than sanded and does not have enough "tooth" to = the varnish film intact. Just supposition of course, but I have yet to = anything that changes my mind. Larry Blan On Behalf Of Jojo DeLancierAbout a year and a = culprit. M-D Dkenney94@cs.com Larry Blan wrote: = said, there are several people on one of the woodworking boards = use a silicone product on their cast iron equipment on a regular = More than one is a full time professional cabinetmaker. Every = resembles a visit here from TA. They swear that if it is = not only keeps the tops of their equipment rust-free and = causes no ill effects with their finishes. This strays a far = from conventional wisdom, I'll admit. Now, I'm not about to = using it myself, I do far to many things that involve some = finish or glue, and if I took it to work, I'd be strung up." = This is absolutely true. I have sprayed silicone = beds of planers & molders, run a piece thru & then = piece just to demonstrate this. Also I have sprayed & waxed = grain of boards & glued them up succesfully. = cheap sand paper & some of the stearated papers can cause some= finishes to appear to fisheye. And is much more common than = = = from goodaple@cox-internet.com Sat Apr 6 21:04:25 2002 g3734P408073 for ; Sat, 6 Apr 2002 21:04:25 -0600 (InterMail vK.4.03.05.03 201-232-132-103 license180e1de7f543f89455b24e508f9cca39) Subject: New website Hey everyone. Finally got my site up! Would some of you take a peek and =give me some feedback. I can handle the criticism so go for it. Let me =know if anything looks strange, out of place, or just plain funky! = Hey everyone. Finally got my site up! = you take a peek and give me some feedback. I can handle the criticism so = from jojo@ipa.net Sat Apr 6 21:06:39 2002 g3736c408324 for ; Sat, 6 Apr 2002 21:06:38 -0600 helo=default) id 16u30l-00030g-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Sat, 06 Apr 2002 22:06:35 -0500 Subject: Re: New website A URL might be handy for evaluational purposes. ;o) M-D Hey everyone. Finally got my site up! Would some of you take a peek =and give me some feedback. I can handle the criticism so go for it. Let =me know if anything looks strange, out of place, or just plain funky! = A URL might be handy purposes. ;o) M-D Randall Gregory Hey everyone. Finally got my site up! = of you take a peek and give me some feedback. I can handle the = from rextutor@yahoo.com Sat Apr 6 21:09:09 2002 g37398408577 for ; Sat, 6 Apr 2002 21:09:08 -0600 06 Apr 2002 19:09:07 PST Subject: Re: 70s rod making- pre Garrison books question thanks for all the interesting comments- I added 2 newbooks to my list . I find many of these books at thepublic librarythanks, ----- Original Message -----From: "Rex Tutor" Sent: Friday, April 05, 2002 9:57 AMSubject: 70s rod making- pre Garrison books question I have been reading with interest the discussion of when people started making rods, and the books andsources of information. I really enjoy books as well as rod making. I note that Garrison / Carmichealpublished in the 70s but there were books before this that appear easier to read and launch a rod with . Claude Kreider "The Bamboo Rod " 1951and Garrison's mentor Dr Holden's "The Idyl of theSplit - Bamboo rod" , 1920. I was wondering if these books were available during the 60s ? I never hearthem mentioned . Perhaps they were hard to find in pre Garrison times. Any gray hairs ( I am a gray-hair but just late to rod building ) start with these or other pre Garrison books ? __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTaxhttp://taxes.yahoo.com/ __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTaxhttp://taxes.yahoo.com/ from goodaple@cox-internet.com Sat Apr 6 21:09:34 2002 g3739X408681 for ; Sat, 6 Apr 2002 21:09:33 -0600 (InterMail vK.4.03.05.03 201-232-132-103 license180e1de7f543f89455b24e508f9cca39) Subject: New website URL Sorry!!!! Here it is. Tell me what you think. I can take it. =www.rifflewaterrods.com Thanks in advance. Randall G. NW AR = Thanks in advance. Randall G. NW AR from goodaple@cox-internet.com Sat Apr 6 21:21:15 2002 g373LF409228 for ; Sat, 6 Apr 2002 21:21:15 -0600 (InterMail vK.4.03.05.03 201-232-132-103 license180e1de7f543f89455b24e508f9cca39) Subject: Re: New website URL Rex, My lovely wife did it!! Boy, was she ready to pull MY hair out!!!Thanks guys. Randall G.----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: New website URL Generally looks professionalI would suggest you drop the fancy cursive font asnice as it looks it is harder for older guys ( theones with the cash) to read .Nice work though - you do it ?--- Randall Gregory wrote: Sorry!!!! Here it is. Tell me what you think. Ican take it. www.rifflewaterrods.com Thanks inadvance. Randall G. NW AR __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTaxhttp://taxes.yahoo.com/ from avyoung@iinet.net.au Sat Apr 6 21:21:19 2002 g373LI409233 for ; Sat, 6 Apr 2002 21:21:18 -0600 Subject: RE: oil and vinegar Are you saying you'd use an old T shirt for example? I'm not attempting to bait you but this you've said below is so against all I've believed though I admit I've come to believe it because that's what was drilled into me.When I was a kid learning boatbuilding old T shirts weren't allowed anywhere at all except if you wore one or in the slips yard, if the leading hand or god forbid owner saw one anyplace near wood work to be bright finished there was an arse to be kicked. Tony At 03:40 PM 4/6/02 -0500, Larry Blan wrote: Well... I just know I'm going to regret this, but here goes. First of all,let me state that I have spent my entire life in the automotive business,including a stint as supervisor of our body shop. I am only to familiar withthe evils of silicone and finishes.http://www.carronind.com/classics/index.htmlI will second the caution against using fish-eye eliminator though. The post With that said, there are several people on one of the woodworking boardsthat use a silicone product on their cast iron equipment on a regular basis.More than one is a full time professional cabinetmaker. Every time thesubject comes up, the thread deteriorates into something that resembles avisit here from TA. They swear that if it is rubbed in, it not only keepsthe tops of their equipment rust-free and slick, it causes no ill effectswith their finishes. This strays a far piece from conventional wisdom, I'lladmit. Now, I'm not about to start using it myself, I do far to many thingsthat involve some kind of finish or glue, and if I took it to work, I'd bestrung up. To many people have had this problem to attribute it to siliconecontamination. Every one that has been through it has cleaned, changedvarnish, changed tubes, avoided fabric softeners, etc. without any realsuccess. I don't know what is causing the problem, but I just have a hardtime believing it is silicone. Larry Blan -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Saturday, April 06, 2002 2:36 PM Subject: Re: oil and vinegar This is as I was always taught, too. We used to use the additivein sign paints when lettering, andcould not get the substrate clean, despite multiple washings withsolvents, scrubbing with Bon-Ami,etc. The Fish Eye Remover was a last-ditch effort. M-D From: Dkenney94@cs.com " Back in the days that I built and restored furniture, Ireligiously added a product called"Fish-Eye Flowout" to my laquer when spraying refinishedfurniture. Fish-Eyes in laquer are alsocaused from silicone contamination" Don't do this!! The only place for Fish Eye Additives is forrefinishing furniture. Even then itsbetter to spray a spit coat of shellac,which isn't bothered bysilicone first. These additives arebasically silicone themselves so all you wind up doing is precontaminating your finish. Yes it willwork but you cannot ever stop using it. Everything that yourfinish touches will then becontaminated with silicone permanently. Incidentaly most cases of"Silicone Contamination" infinishing are misdiagnosed, its actually quite rare. D /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from ttalsma@macatawa.org Sat Apr 6 21:27:10 2002 g373R8409776 for ; Sat, 6 Apr 2002 21:27:09 -0600 Subject: Re: "Culled" cork I'm with Rick here. Any of you guys want to get rid of rings, just letme know. Rick & I just want to offer a service here, right Rick? Todd (just trying to help out) Talsma Rick Crenshaw wrote: If you guys don't mind, after you get your cork orders, I'd beinterested in talking to a couple of you about buying some of theculled cork from you super anal retentive types who buy the top stockand cull out 30- 60% of your stuff. I don't sell my rods, but I don'twant junk either. I may well be amenable to taking very good cork offyour hands if you are the type that wants only perfect cork. Hell, myrods don't deserve such cork. They are generally butt-ugly fishingsticks. As many of you have seen first hand, I don't even sandbetween varnish coats. You rod sellers are safe with me. Rick(average rods for an average fisherman) Crenshaw --Todd Talsma8412 North Maple CourtZeeland MI 49464------ web design business home: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo Rodmaking Tips site: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo/Bamboo Rodmaking Sources site:http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo_Sources/home page: http://external.sligh.com/~toddt/index.htmgenealogy home page: Under Construction from lblan@provide.net Sat Apr 6 21:40:24 2002 g373eN410287 for ; Sat, 6 Apr 2002 21:40:23 -0600 for ; Sat, 6 Apr 2002 22:40:21 -0500 Subject: RE: oil and vinegar Of course you aren't going to bait me... I'll hide all the good beer inGrayling and only leave the Foster's. Well, I don't think I'd use a t-shirt because of the lint, but I don'tbelieve I'd be afraid of any silcone contamination. I prefer to use softshop towels made for use with finishes. However, everything I have readindicates that the silicone thing is way, way overrated. See Dave Kenney'spost for an example. I don't know how new, scrap t-shirt material isprocessed, but I will tell you that I have ordered several hundred poundsover the years for our body shops. Now, as far as spray automotive finishes go, that is another story. I dohave to tell you that fish-eyes are not near the problem with the newfinishes as they were with the old laquer or enamel finishes. Now, this is kinda like spitting into the wind... I don't do that either, ifI can help it. I'm not advocating that we add a bit of silicone to theregimen by any means, but that it might not the bad guy as often as we havebeen led to believe. Larry Blan -----Original Message----- Sent: Saturday, April 06, 2002 10:28 PM Subject: RE: oil and vinegar Are you saying you'd use an old T shirt for example? I'm notattempting tobait you but this you've said below is so against all I'vebelieved thoughI admit I've come to believe it because that's what was drilled into me.When I was a kid learning boatbuilding old T shirts weren't allowedanywhere at all except if you wore one or in the slips yard, ifthe leading hand or god forbid owner saw one anyplace near wood work to be brightfinished there was an arse to be kicked. Tony At 03:40 PM 4/6/02 -0500, Larry Blan wrote: Well... I just know I'm going to regret this, but here goes. First of all, let me state that I have spent my entire life in the automotive business,including a stint as supervisor of our body shop. I am only to familiar with the evils of silicone and finishes.http://www.carronind.com/classics/index.htmlI will second the caution against using fish-eye eliminator though. The post With that said, there are several people on one of the woodworkingboardsthat use a silicone product on their cast iron equipment on a regular basis. More than one is a full time professional cabinetmaker. Every time thesubject comes up, the thread deteriorates into something that resemblesavisit here from TA. They swear that if it is rubbed in, it not only keepsthe tops of their equipment rust-free and slick, it causes no ill effectswith their finishes. This strays a far piece from conventional wisdom, I'll admit. Now, I'm not about to start using it myself, I do far to many things that involve some kind of finish or glue, and if I took it to work, I'd be strung up. To many people have had this problem to attribute it to siliconecontamination. Every one that has been through it has cleaned, changedvarnish, changed tubes, avoided fabric softeners, etc. without any realsuccess. I don't know what is causing the problem, but I just have a hardtime believing it is silicone. Larry Blan -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu DeLancierSent: Saturday, April 06, 2002 2:36 PM Subject: Re: oil and vinegar This is as I was always taught, too. We used to use the additivein sign paints when lettering, andcould not get the substrate clean, despite multiple washings withsolvents, scrubbing with Bon-Ami,etc. The Fish Eye Remover was a last-ditch effort. M-D From: Dkenney94@cs.com " Back in the days that I built and restored furniture, Ireligiously added a product called"Fish-Eye Flowout" to my laquer when spraying refinishedfurniture. Fish-Eyes in laquer are alsocaused from silicone contamination" Don't do this!! The only place for Fish Eye Additives is forrefinishing furniture. Even then itsbetter to spray a spit coat of shellac,which isn't bothered bysilicone first. These additives arebasically silicone themselves so all you wind up doing is precontaminating your finish. Yes it willwork but you cannot ever stop using it. Everything that yourfinish touches will then becontaminated with silicone permanently. Incidentaly most cases of"Silicone Contamination" infinishing are misdiagnosed, its actually quite rare. D /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from jojo@ipa.net Sat Apr 6 21:58:24 2002 g373wO410732 for ; Sat, 6 Apr 2002 21:58:24 -0600 helo=default) id 16u3os-00036x-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Sat, 06 Apr 2002 22:58:23 -0500 Subject: Re: oil and vinegar I buy scrap T-shirt and bloomer material that is sold as gun cleaning patches,2" x 2", by the 1000.I go through a bunch of them, too. I use them for every cleaning chore on arod, from wiping theblank down with alcohol, wiping between varnish coats, to cleaning ferrules,removing adhesive,etc., and I've yet to have any problem with finish adhesion, whatsoever. Thisis all new materialand, like Larry, I have no idea how it may be processed. M-D Of course you aren't going to bait me... I'll hide all the good beer inGrayling and only leave the Foster's. Well, I don't think I'd use a t-shirt because of the lint, but I don'tbelieve I'd be afraid of any silcone contamination. I prefer to use softshop towels made for use with finishes. However, everything I have readindicates that the silicone thing is way, way overrated. See Dave Kenney'spost for an example. I don't know how new, scrap t-shirt material isprocessed, but I will tell you that I have ordered several hundred poundsover the years for our body shops. Now, as far as spray automotive finishes go, that is another story. I dohave to tell you that fish-eyes are not near the problem with the newfinishes as they were with the old laquer or enamel finishes. Now, this is kinda like spitting into the wind... I don't do that either, ifI can help it. I'm not advocating that we add a bit of silicone to theregimen by any means, but that it might not the bad guy as often as we havebeen led to believe. Larry Blan Are you saying you'd use an old T shirt for example? I'm notattempting tobait you but this you've said below is so against all I'vebelieved thoughI admit I've come to believe it because that's what was drilled into me.When I was a kid learning boatbuilding old T shirts weren't allowedanywhere at all except if you wore one or in the slips yard, ifthe leadinghand or god forbid owner saw one anyplace near wood work to be brightfinished there was an arse to be kicked. Tony At 03:40 PM 4/6/02 -0500, Larry Blan wrote: Well... I just know I'm going to regret this, but here goes. First of all, let me state that I have spent my entire life in the automotive business,including a stint as supervisor of our body shop. I am only to familiar with the evils of silicone and finishes.http://www.carronind.com/classics/index.htmlI will second the caution against using fish-eye eliminator though. The post With that said, there are several people on one of the woodworkingboardsthat use a silicone product on their cast iron equipment on a regular basis. More than one is a full time professional cabinetmaker. Every time thesubject comes up, the thread deteriorates into something that resemblesavisit here from TA. They swear that if it is rubbed in, it not only keepsthe tops of their equipment rust-free and slick, it causes no ill effectswith their finishes. This strays a far piece from conventional wisdom, I'll admit. Now, I'm not about to start using it myself, I do far to many things that involve some kind of finish or glue, and if I took it to work, I'd be strung up. To many people have had this problem to attribute it to siliconecontamination. Every one that has been through it has cleaned, changedvarnish, changed tubes, avoided fabric softeners, etc. without any realsuccess. I don't know what is causing the problem, but I just have a hardtime believing it is silicone. Larry Blan From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu This is as I was always taught, too. We used to use the additivein sign paints when lettering, andcould not get the substrate clean, despite multiple washings withsolvents, scrubbing with Bon-Ami,etc. The Fish Eye Remover was a last-ditch effort. M-D From: Dkenney94@cs.com " Back in the days that I built and restored furniture, Ireligiously added a product called"Fish-Eye Flowout" to my laquer when spraying refinishedfurniture. Fish-Eyes in laquer are alsocaused from silicone contamination" Don't do this!! The only place for Fish Eye Additives is forrefinishing furniture. Even then itsbetter to spray a spit coat of shellac,which isn't bothered bysilicone first. These additives arebasically silicone themselves so all you wind up doing is precontaminating your finish. Yes it willwork but you cannot ever stop using it. Everything that yourfinish touches will then becontaminated with silicone permanently. Incidentaly most cases of"Silicone Contamination" infinishing are misdiagnosed, its actually quite rare. D from avyoung@iinet.net.au Sat Apr 6 23:19:39 2002 g375Jc411859 for ; Sat, 6 Apr 2002 23:19:38 -0600 Subject: RE: oil and vinegar Nothing like a bit of confusion to add to the fun I guess.And leave the Guinness alone please. One thing I do know is fosters will strip any finish you care to apply it to. That's what it was originally made for but there are people here who'll drink anything to the point there are laws in some states specifically prohibiting the storage of metholated spirits in refrifgerators and found it could probably be sold off shore given enough advertising [:-)] Personally I think fosters IS metholated spirits with boot polish favouring and a shot of CO2 to make it kind of fizzy. I'd rather eat sawdust and wash it down with strawberry wine at $1.98 a bottle thank you.The can looks OK though. Tony At 10:55 PM 4/6/02 -0500, Larry Blan wrote: Of course you aren't going to bait me... I'll hide all the good beer inGrayling and only leave the Foster's. Well, I don't think I'd use a t-shirt because of the lint, but I don'tbelieve I'd be afraid of any silcone contamination. I prefer to use softshop towels made for use with finishes. However, everything I have readindicates that the silicone thing is way, way overrated. See Dave Kenney'spost for an example. I don't know how new, scrap t-shirt material isprocessed, but I will tell you that I have ordered several hundred poundsover the years for our body shops. Now, as far as spray automotive finishes go, that is another story. I dohave to tell you that fish-eyes are not near the problem with the newfinishes as they were with the old laquer or enamel finishes. Now, this is kinda like spitting into the wind... I don't do that either, ifI can help it. I'm not advocating that we add a bit of silicone to theregimen by any means, but that it might not the bad guy as often as wehavebeen led to believe. Larry Blan -----Original Message----- Sent: Saturday, April 06, 2002 10:28 PM Subject: RE: oil and vinegar Are you saying you'd use an old T shirt for example? I'm notattempting tobait you but this you've said below is so against all I'vebelieved thoughI admit I've come to believe it because that's what was drilled into me.When I was a kid learning boatbuilding old T shirts weren't allowedanywhere at all except if you wore one or in the slips yard, ifthe leadinghand or god forbid owner saw one anyplace near wood work to be brightfinished there was an arse to be kicked. Tony At 03:40 PM 4/6/02 -0500, Larry Blan wrote: Well... I just know I'm going to regret this, but here goes. First of all, let me state that I have spent my entire life in the automotivebusiness,including a stint as supervisor of our body shop. I am only to familiar with the evils of silicone and finishes.http://www.carronind.com/classics/index.htmlI will second the caution against using fish-eye eliminator though. The post With that said, there are several people on one of the woodworkingboardsthat use a silicone product on their cast iron equipment on a regular basis. More than one is a full time professional cabinetmaker. Every time thesubject comes up, the thread deteriorates into something thatresembles avisit here from TA. They swear that if it is rubbed in, it not only keepsthe tops of their equipment rust-free and slick, it causes no ill effectswith their finishes. This strays a far piece from conventional wisdom, I'll admit. Now, I'm not about to start using it myself, I do far to many things that involve some kind of finish or glue, and if I took it to work, I'd be strung up. To many people have had this problem to attribute it to siliconecontamination. Every one that has been through it has cleaned, changedvarnish, changed tubes, avoided fabric softeners, etc. without any realsuccess. I don't know what is causing the problem, but I just have a hardtime believing it is silicone. Larry Blan -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu DeLancierSent: Saturday, April 06, 2002 2:36 PM Subject: Re: oil and vinegar This is as I was always taught, too. We used to use the additivein sign paints when lettering, andcould not get the substrate clean, despite multiple washings withsolvents, scrubbing with Bon-Ami,etc. The Fish Eye Remover was a last-ditch effort. M-D From: Dkenney94@cs.com " Back in the days that I built and restored furniture, Ireligiously added a product called"Fish-Eye Flowout" to my laquer when spraying refinishedfurniture. Fish-Eyes in laquer are alsocaused from silicone contamination" Don't do this!! The only place for Fish Eye Additives is forrefinishing furniture. Even then itsbetter to spray a spit coat of shellac,which isn't bothered bysilicone first. These additives arebasically silicone themselves so all you wind up doing is precontaminating your finish. Yes it willwork but you cannot ever stop using it. Everything that yourfinish touches will then becontaminated with silicone permanently. Incidentaly most cases of"Silicone Contamination" infinishing are misdiagnosed, its actually quite rare. D /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from caneman@clnk.com Sun Apr 7 01:26:22 2002 g377QL413494 for ; Sun, 7 Apr 2002 01:26:21 -0600 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35) Subject: Re: oil and vinegar I just go to Wal Mart and buy a couple of yards of Tee Shirt material, washit a couple of times, NO FABRIC SOFTENER, and cut it up for shop clothes.No problems with fisheye or lint or anything else, but I would never use a'used' T-shirt for a cloth to wipe down a rod. Later,bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com- ---- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: oil and vinegar I buy scrap T-shirt and bloomer material that is sold as gun cleaning patches, 2" x 2", by the 1000. I go through a bunch of them, too. I use them for every cleaning chore on a rod, from wiping the blank down with alcohol, wiping between varnish coats, to cleaning ferrules, removing adhesive, etc., and I've yet to have any problem with finish adhesion, whatsoever. This is all new material and, like Larry, I have no idea how it may be processed. M-D From: "Larry Blan" Of course you aren't going to bait me... I'll hide all the good beer inGrayling and only leave the Foster's. Well, I don't think I'd use a t-shirt because of the lint, but I don'tbelieve I'd be afraid of any silcone contamination. I prefer to use softshop towels made for use with finishes. However, everything I have readindicates that the silicone thing is way, way overrated. See Dave Kenney'spost for an example. I don't know how new, scrap t-shirt material isprocessed, but I will tell you that I have ordered several hundred poundsover the years for our body shops. Now, as far as spray automotive finishes go, that is another story. I dohave to tell you that fish-eyes are not near the problem with the newfinishes as they were with the old laquer or enamel finishes. Now, this is kinda like spitting into the wind... I don't do that either, if I can help it. I'm not advocating that we add a bit of silicone to theregimen by any means, but that it might not the bad guy as often as we have been led to believe. Larry Blan Are you saying you'd use an old T shirt for example? I'm notattempting tobait you but this you've said below is so against all I'vebelieved thoughI admit I've come to believe it because that's what was drilled into me.When I was a kid learning boatbuilding old T shirts weren't allowedanywhere at all except if you wore one or in the slips yard, ifthe leadinghand or god forbid owner saw one anyplace near wood work to be brightfinished there was an arse to be kicked. Tony At 03:40 PM 4/6/02 -0500, Larry Blan wrote: Well... I just know I'm going to regret this, but here goes. First of all, let me state that I have spent my entire life in the automotive business, including a stint as supervisor of our body shop. I am only to familiar with the evils of silicone and finishes.http://www.carronind.com/classics/index.htmlI will second the caution against using fish-eye eliminator though. The post With that said, there are several people on one of the woodworking boards that use a silicone product on their cast iron equipment on a regular basis. More than one is a full time professional cabinetmaker. Every time thesubject comes up, the thread deteriorates into something thatresembles a visit here from TA. They swear that if it is rubbed in, it not only keeps the tops of their equipment rust-free and slick, it causes no ill effects with their finishes. This strays a far piece from conventional wisdom, I'll admit. Now, I'm not about to start using it myself, I do far to many things that involve some kind of finish or glue, and if I took it to work, I'd be strung up. To many people have had this problem to attribute it to siliconecontamination. Every one that has been through it has cleaned, changedvarnish, changed tubes, avoided fabric softeners, etc. without any realsuccess. I don't know what is causing the problem, but I just have a hard time believing it is silicone. Larry Blan From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu This is as I was always taught, too. We used to use the additivein sign paints when lettering, andcould not get the substrate clean, despite multiple washings withsolvents, scrubbing with Bon-Ami,etc. The Fish Eye Remover was a last-ditch effort. M-D From: Dkenney94@cs.com " Back in the days that I built and restored furniture, Ireligiously added a product called"Fish-Eye Flowout" to my laquer when spraying refinishedfurniture. Fish-Eyes in laquer are alsocaused from silicone contamination" Don't do this!! The only place for Fish Eye Additives is forrefinishing furniture. Even then itsbetter to spray a spit coat of shellac,which isn't bothered bysilicone first. These additives arebasically silicone themselves so all you wind up doing is precontaminating your finish. Yes it willwork but you cannot ever stop using it. Everything that yourfinish touches will then becontaminated with silicone permanently. Incidentaly most cases of"Silicone Contamination" infinishing are misdiagnosed, its actually quite rare. D from carstenjorgensen@mail.dk Sun Apr 7 03:50:24 2002 g378oN414854 for ; Sun, 7 Apr 2002 03:50:23 -0500 ;Sun, 7 Apr 2002 10:50:15 +0200 "Rodmakers discussion group" Subject: Sv: oil and vinegar g378oO414855 Tony et al I've got a big box full of old T-shirts, bedlinen etc that I use forrodmaking. Only had the fish-eyes problem once,years ago.Never found out what caused the problem, though.Tony: Sorry to shatter Your personal idiosyncrasies. rgards, Carsten Jorgensen ----- Original Message ----- Subject: RE: oil and vinegar Are you saying you'd use an old T shirt for example? I'm not attempting to bait you but this you've said below is so against all I've believed though I admit I've come to believe it because that's what was drilled into me.When I was a kid learning boatbuilding old T shirts weren't allowed anywhere at all except if you wore one or in the slips yard, if the leading hand or god forbid owner saw one anyplace near wood work to be bright finished there was an arse to be kicked. Tony At 03:40 PM 4/6/02 -0500, Larry Blan wrote: Well... I just know I'm going to regret this, but here goes. First of all,let me state that I have spent my entire life in the automotive business,including a stint as supervisor of our body shop. I am only to familiar withthe evils of silicone and finishes.http://www.carronind.com/classics/index.htmlI will second the caution against using fish-eye eliminator though. Thepost With that said, there are several people on one of the woodworkingboardsthat use a silicone product on their cast iron equipment on a regularbasis.More than one is a full time professional cabinetmaker. Every time thesubject comes up, the thread deteriorates into something that resemblesavisit here from TA. They swear that if it is rubbed in, it not only keepsthe tops of their equipment rust-free and slick, it causes no ill effectswith their finishes. This strays a far piece from conventional wisdom, I'lladmit. Now, I'm not about to start using it myself, I do far to many thingsthat involve some kind of finish or glue, and if I took it to work, I'd bestrung up. To many people have had this problem to attribute it to siliconecontamination. Every one that has been through it has cleaned, changedvarnish, changed tubes, avoided fabric softeners, etc. without any realsuccess. I don't know what is causing the problem, but I just have a hardtime believing it is silicone. Larry Blan -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu DeLancierSent: Saturday, April 06, 2002 2:36 PM Subject: Re: oil and vinegar This is as I was always taught, too. We used to use the additivein sign paints when lettering, andcould not get the substrate clean, despite multiple washings withsolvents, scrubbing with Bon-Ami,etc. The Fish Eye Remover was a last-ditch effort. M-D From: Dkenney94@cs.com " Back in the days that I built and restored furniture, Ireligiously added a product called"Fish-Eye Flowout" to my laquer when spraying refinishedfurniture. Fish-Eyes in laquer are alsocaused from silicone contamination" Don't do this!! The only place for Fish Eye Additives is forrefinishing furniture. Even then itsbetter to spray a spit coat of shellac,which isn't bothered bysilicone first. These additives arebasically silicone themselves so all you wind up doing is precontaminating your finish. Yes it willwork but you cannot ever stop using it. Everything that yourfinish touches will then becontaminated with silicone permanently. Incidentaly most cases of"Silicone Contamination" infinishing are misdiagnosed, its actually quite rare. D /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from petermckean@netspace.net.au Sun Apr 7 05:07:06 2002 g37A74415580 for ; Sun, 7 Apr 2002 05:07:05 -0500 g37A6st41146; Subject: Re: How long can you keep it up? That's fine, so long as the dues are actually getting PAID, and not justgoing on the Amex. [:-)] Peter from avyoung@iinet.net.au Sun Apr 7 05:35:12 2002 g37AZA416001 for ; Sun, 7 Apr 2002 05:35:10 -0500 ,"Rodmakers discussion group" Subject: Re: Sv: oil and vinegar g37AZC416002 Well, there's still Santa and the Easter Bunny to comfort me anyhow. Tony At 10:55 AM 4/7/02 +0200, Carsten Jorgensen wrote: Tony et al I've got a big box full of old T-shirts, bedlinen etc that I use forrodmaking. Only had the fish-eyes problem once,years ago.Never found out what caused the problem, though.Tony: Sorry to shatter Your personal idiosyncrasies. rgards, Carsten Jorgensen /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from petermckean@netspace.net.au Sun Apr 7 05:46:14 2002 g37AkC416315 for ; Sun, 7 Apr 2002 05:46:13 -0500 g37AhVb46757; Subject: Re: Hardy Perfect 3 5/8" I sold a mint Hardy "Perfect" 3 5/8 inch to a friend of mine the other day,with a spare spool, for Australian $350. My opinion of Hardy reels is pretty clear to those who know me, and I was soeager to get it into Neil's hands that I bloody near gave myself a whiplash! I went off down to the "Essential Fly Fisher" and spent the money on a 1.5Lamson "Velocity". Am I happy? Happy as a pig in mud! Peter from avyoung@iinet.net.au Sun Apr 7 06:29:25 2002 g37BTM416801 for ; Sun, 7 Apr 2002 06:29:23 -0500 Subject: Re: Hardy Perfect 3 5/8" Hardy, fosters. Could make a commercial about them involving the Crockdaile Hunter playing out an especially nasty crock that's just taken a whole chicken lure attached to a Hardy Princess bolted to the gunwale of his trusty Aluminium run-about (tinnie) while pouring a fosters down his throat yelling something with that fake English accent people like Pierce Brosnan (I think he's Irish) uses to completely confuse the issue like, "crickey, this is great" or something deep and immensely meaningful like that.I can see it now....Could be the basis of a whole TV series. "The Crockadile Hunter Goes Fishing" or "I'm The Crockadile Hunter And You'reNot". Tony At 08:42 PM 4/7/02 +1000, Peter McKean wrote: I sold a mint Hardy "Perfect" 3 5/8 inch to a friend of mine the other day,with a spare spool, for Australian $350. My opinion of Hardy reels is pretty clear to those who know me, and I wassoeager to get it into Neil's hands that I bloody near gave myself a whiplash! I went off down to the "Essential Fly Fisher" and spent the money on a 1.5Lamson "Velocity". Am I happy? Happy as a pig in mud! Peter /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from wendt@kingcrab.nrl.navy.mil Sun Apr 7 06:38:31 2002 g37BcU417129 for ; Sun, 7 Apr 2002 06:38:30 -0500 g37BcJtx025726 for ; Sun, 7 Apr 2002 07:38:20 -0400 Subject: re:Bamboo strips Bob, mayseem like a dumb question, but when you bend the strips, are you bendingthem with the enamel to the outside?Mark At 12:31 PM 4/6/02 -0600, you wrote:Brian, touch 72" strips end to end without them breaking, then they won't either hand are parallel. That 180=B0 arc is more bending than the finished fails, but bend to make sure that the arc of the bend is consistent, inother words, that there are no exceptionally weak or strong areas in the those, get tossed in the floor, and sometime over the next week or so, that point, if there is a hidden place, like an interior rot or a worm Many times, a seemingly good strip will snap, and sure enough, in thecenter of the strip (seems like those work holes or rots are always inthe middle of a strip... never in the middle of a split where you can see fresh split, then as one that has been through the rigors of heating, Sometimes, I get strips from what I thought to be a great culm, withgreat cosmetics, good power fiber density, etc., and even though the arcis smooth and consistent, they just DO NOT feel right when you bend guess what I'm saying is regardless of how the power fibers look and howgood the cane looked, it just didn't "feel" like a piece ofbamboo that would make a good rod, so I pitch them into the Scrap strippile on the floor. caneI reject during this process, Billie, my girlfriend, was helping me cleanout the shop last night to make room for a new piece of machinery that's going to do some craft stuff with them... I did a good cleanout justbefore Christmas and burned all the "reject" strips an pieces(which also burned Billie's ass, because she, being more business mindedthan I, said that it was craft supplies, potential bodkins, tool handles, Billie hauled off somewhere between 75 and 100 pounds of cane strips collection of rejects from culms that I had chosen from bales that I Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Sun Apr 7 06:57:09 2002 g37Bv8417479 for ; Sun, 7 Apr 2002 06:57:08 -0500 (authenticated) Sun, 7 Apr 2002 04:57:03 -0700 Subject: Re: oil and vinegar --------------81AA540AA0F6D24C258B8ED3 MD, No, I thought that was the problem, but itturned out to be a bad gallon of varnish. harry Jojo DeLancier wrote: About a year and a half ago, Harry Boyd had afish-eye problem in his finishing. It wasfinally determined that the anti-clog stearatedsandpaper was the culprit. M-D From: Dkenney94@cs.comLarry Blan wrote: "With that said, there are severalpeople on one of the woodworkingboardsthat use a silicone product on theircast iron equipment on a regularbasis.More than one is a full timeprofessional cabinetmaker. Every timethesubject comes up, the threaddeteriorates into something thatresembles avisit here from TA. They swear that ifit is rubbed in, it not only keepsthe tops of their equipment rust-freeand slick, it causes no ill effectswith their finishes. This strays a farpiece from conventional wisdom, I'lladmit. Now, I'm not about to startusing it myself, I do far to manythingsthat involve some kind of finish orglue, and if I took it to work, I'd be strung up." This is absolutely true. I havesprayed silicone on outfeed beds ofplaners & molders, run a piece thru &then finished the piece just todemonstrate this. Also I have sprayed& waxed the edge grain of boards &glued them up succesfully. Incidentally cheap sand paper & someof the stearated papers can cause somefinishes to appear to fisheye. And ismuch more common than siliconecontamination.Dave -- -- Harry Boyd --http://www.canerods.com/ -- Bamboo Rods -- http://www.fbcwin.com/ -- Our Church -- --------------81AA540AA0F6D24C258B8ED3 MD, out to be a bad gallon of varnish. Jojo DeLancier wrote: Abouta year and a half ago, Harry Boyd had a fish-eye problem in his finishing.It was finally determined that the anti-clog stearated sandpaper was the From:Dkenney94@cs.com wrote:"With that said, there areseveral people on one of the woodworking boardsthat use a silicone producton their cast iron equipment on a regular basis.More than one is a fulltime professional cabinetmaker. Every time thesubject comes up, thethreaddeteriorates into something that resembles avisit here from TA. Theyswear that if it is rubbed in, it not only keepsthe tops of their equipmentrust-free and slick, it causes no ill effectswith their finishes. Thisstrays a far piece from conventional wisdom, I'lladmit. Now, I'm not aboutto start using it myself, I do far to many thingsthat involve some kind offinish or glue, and if I took it to work, I'd bestrung up." This is absolutely true.I have sprayed silicone on outfeed beds of planers & molders, run apiece thru & then finished the piece just to demonstrate this. AlsoI have sprayed & waxed the edge grain of boards & glued them upsuccesfully.Incidentally cheap sand paper& some of the stearated papers can cause some finishes to appear tofisheye. And is much more common than siliconecontamination. Dave -- -- Bamboo Rods -- --------------81AA540AA0F6D24C258B8ED3-- from jcbyrd@direct-pest.com Sun Apr 7 07:25:21 2002 g37CPK417933 for ; Sun, 7 Apr 2002 07:25:20 -0500 by direct-pest.com [208.27.26.103] for ; Sun, 07 Apr 2002 07:49:39 -0400 Subject: Re: New website URL Looks good. I agree about the fancy script font. Keep it for yourheadlines like your company name, and then change the other to like an Arialfont. Great job April. Joe =================================================Lost in the Hills of East Tennessee with a Bamboo Fly Rod in one handand a cigar in the other....."What a Great Life". Visit my bambooflyrod site at http://www.direct-pest.com/rodmaker----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: New website URL Rex, My lovely wife did it!! Boy, was she ready to pull MY hair out!!!Thanks guys. Randall G.----- Original Message -----From: "Rex Tutor" Sent: Saturday, April 06, 2002 9:14 PMSubject: Re: New website URL Generally looks professionalI would suggest you drop the fancy cursive font asnice as it looks it is harder for older guys ( theones with the cash) to read .Nice work though - you do it ?--- Randall Gregory wrote: Sorry!!!! Here it is. Tell me what you think. Ican take it. www.rifflewaterrods.com Thanks inadvance. Randall G. NW AR __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTaxhttp://taxes.yahoo.com/ from eamon_lee@hotmail.com Sun Apr 7 08:40:02 2002 g37De1418676 for ; Sun, 7 Apr 2002 08:40:01 -0500 Sun, 7 Apr 2002 06:39:56 -0700 Sun, 07 Apr 2002 13:39:55 GMT Subject: Quad Forms FILETIME=[B4280BB0:01C1DE39] Listers-Have any of you folks made your own set of quad forms? Bob M. sent me ademo quad that he has (nice work BTW Bob! Great taper!) and I am hooked. I was looking at the Best of the Planing Form and was checking out the plans for Irgens forms. Has anyone built a set of these or some other configuration? How do they work? I am on the waiting list at Grindstone Anglers for a set, but while I wait, I was entertaining trying to make a set anyway. I have some thoughts on different designs, both roughing and finishing, but would like to hear your experience before I roll up my sleves.Thanks a bunch folks!EamonPS Don't forget to spring ahead! _________________________________________________________________Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com from bob@downandacross.com Sun Apr 7 08:52:08 2002 g37Dq7418995 for ; Sun, 7 Apr 2002 08:52:07 -0500 7 Apr 2002 09:51:59 -0400 "rod 'akers" Subject: RE: New website URL Randall:I like the site and the info as well. Nice impregnation chamber and greatburls. I would like to set a long one up to try one blanks.Just a word of caution, those Front Page generated navigation bars may notwork on everyone's machine. I do not know why, but some people who haveolder browsers cannot even see them. I would add some simple text links onthe bottom or somewhere. Personally, I think they look great and use themmyself, but every once in a while someone e-mails me that they cannotnavigate the site.You and your talented wife should be proud. from jojo@ipa.net Sun Apr 7 10:27:23 2002 g37FRM419888 for ; Sun, 7 Apr 2002 10:27:23 -0500 helo=default) id 16uEZZ-0000l3-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Sun, 07 Apr 2002 11:27:18 -0400 Subject: Re: oil and vinegar See, this is exactly how rumors and rodmaking myths get started! ;o) M-D No, I thought that was the problem, but it turned out to be a bad = About a year and a half ago, Harry Boyd had a fish-eye problem in =his finishing. It was finally determined that the anti-clog stearated = See, this is exactlyhow = rodmaking myths get started! ;o) M-D Harry= About a year and a half = Boyd had a fish-eye problem in his finishing. It was finally = from wlwalter77us@yahoo.com Sun Apr 7 14:05:36 2002 g37J5a423251 for ; Sun, 7 Apr 2002 14:05:36 -0500 Sun, 07 Apr 2002 12:05:35 PDT Subject: Re: --- Robert Kope wrote: Bill, I believe that the resistance of strips tostraightening after heat treatingstems from them being so dry. Try binding thestrips with nylon for heattreating. I know this is heresy, but I've done itwith no problems. Thestretch in the nylon keeps tension on the nodeswhile heat treating. Thiskeeps the nodes from popping back up. You probably think the nylon will melt, ruin yourstrips, make a mess ofyour oven, etc. To put your mind at ease, trybinding up some junk stripsand doing the tests yourself. The only problems Ianticipate would result from radiant heat if you have a heating elementexposed to the strips insidethe oven. I have a heat gun oven so there is noradiant heat. -- Robert ----- Original Message -----From: "Bill Walters" Cc: "Morgan_Hand_Mill" Sent: Saturday, April 06, 2002 1:10 PM Got a little problem with nodes popping back afterheat-treating and when I try to heat and straighten they still aren't getting as straight as I'd like,guess its mainly because I'm being careful to notscortch or over torque the strips in pressing. Would it be a good idea to soak them for a day or two and then try to straighten them out. I know that this is going to be critical when I go to final tapering on the handmill. __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTaxhttp://taxes.yahoo.com/ __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTaxhttp://taxes.yahoo.com/ from wlwalter77us@yahoo.com Sun Apr 7 14:06:50 2002 g37J6o423415 for ; Sun, 7 Apr 2002 14:06:50 -0500 Sun, 07 Apr 2002 12:06:49 PDT Subject: Post heat-treating problem Robert, I like your idea for my future strips and amgoing to give it a try. Right now, though I'm tryingto deal with the small bends that came back afterheat-treating. So far no one has gotten back to meabout post heat- treating soaking and if its a workable Martin-Darrell's heat-treating fixture so I'm going toremove the remaining enamel, bind the strips into thefixture and put it into the water bath. After I takeit out of the bath, I'll unbind heat and press thenodes and then rebind and dry at low heat in the oven.Hopefully, things will come out straight enough to dofinish tapering on the mill. Bill W. --- Robert Kope wrote: Bill, I believe that the resistance of strips tostraightening after heat treatingstems from them being so dry. Try binding thestrips with nylon for heattreating. I know this is heresy, but I've done itwith no problems. Thestretch in the nylon keeps tension on the nodeswhile heat treating. Thiskeeps the nodes from popping back up. You probably think the nylon will melt, ruin yourstrips, make a mess ofyour oven, etc. To put your mind at ease, trybinding up some junk stripsand doing the tests yourself. The only problems Ianticipate would result from radiant heat if you have a heating elementexposed to the strips insidethe oven. I have a heat gun oven so there is noradiant heat. -- Robert ----- Original Message -----From: "Bill Walters" Cc: "Morgan_Hand_Mill" Sent: Saturday, April 06, 2002 1:10 PM Got a little problem with nodes popping back afterheat-treating and when I try to heat and straighten they still aren't getting as straight as I'd like,guess its mainly because I'm being careful to not scortch or over torque the strips in pressing. Would it be a good idea to soak them for a day or two and then try to straighten them out. I know that this is going to be critical when I go to final tapering on the handmill. __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTaxhttp://taxes.yahoo.com/ __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTaxhttp://taxes.yahoo.com/ from carstenjorgensen@mail.dk Sun Apr 7 14:14:30 2002 g37JET423824 for ; Sun, 7 Apr 2002 14:14:29 -0500 ;Sun, 7 Apr 2002 21:14:28 +0200 Subject: Sv: Post heat-treating problem g37JEU423825 Post heat-treating is certainly possible.I Flame my culms whole, then split and soak,drying in drying cabinet for a week.and then finish taper planing..No problems. It works perfectly . rgards, Carsten Jorgensen from Jkvseafood@aol.com Sun Apr 7 14:39:54 2002 g37Jdr424686 for ; Sun, 7 Apr 2002 14:39:53 -0500 Sun, 07 Apr 2002 15:39:31 -0500 RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu ("Rodmakers discussion group")Subject: RE: oil and vinegar silicone could be in an arisol can of spray lubricant might also cause thespotty type of finish problem. used any spray lubricants in your shop lately?john from dongreife@hotmail.com Sun Apr 7 15:46:40 2002 g37Kkd426143 for ; Sun, 7 Apr 2002 15:46:39 -0500 Sun, 7 Apr 2002 13:46:30 -0700 HTTP; Sun, 07 Apr 2002 20:46:29 GMT Subject: Impregnating Problem FILETIME=[4B6E6330:01C1DE75] How come my Acetone/Plexaglass syrup is a milky color when it gets dry..Doesn't look real good on a GreifeMSN Photos is the easiest way toshare and print your photos: Click Here from jojo@ipa.net Sun Apr 7 16:06:19 2002 g37L6J426675 for ; Sun, 7 Apr 2002 16:06:19 -0500 helo=default) id 16uJrd-0002zN-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Sun, 07 Apr 2002 17:06:18 -0400 Subject: Re: Impregnating Problem Have you tried buffing it, Don? M-D How come my Acetone/ Plexaglass syrup is a milky color when it getsdry..Doesn't look real good on aburl walnut reel seat insert. Any help will be appreciated. Don Greife from goodaple@cox-internet.com Sun Apr 7 16:25:25 2002 g37LPO427244 for ; Sun, 7 Apr 2002 16:25:24 -0500 (InterMail vK.4.03.05.03 201-232-132-103 license180e1de7f543f89455b24e508f9cca39) Subject: Re: Impregnating Problem Don, Once I turn the blank into a reelseat filler I sand to a grade of =1200 grit sandpaper and then I run it through the router for the =mortise. Lastly Don, Once I turn the blank into a = sand to a grade of 1200 grit sandpaper and then I run it through the = the mortise. Lastly< I still coat the reelseat with a coat of = designed for Hardwood floors. Let dry, then sand lightly, then add one = coat. This creates a nice mirror like finish, Why do I do this to an = seat? Because I like to have a top quality appearance as well as the = know the impregnation process will help to avoid swelling etc if the = ----- Original Message ----- Greife Sent: Sunday, April 07, 2002 = PMSubject: Impregnating =Problem How come my Acetone/ Plexaglass syrup is a milky color when it = dry..Doesn't look real good on a burl walnut reel seat insert. Any = Here from wendt@kingcrab.nrl.navy.mil Sun Apr 7 17:44:52 2002 g37Mip428670 for ; Sun, 7 Apr 2002 17:44:51 -0500 g37Miitx029721 for ; Sun, 7 Apr 2002 18:44:45 -0400 Subject: re:Bamboo strips Bob, kinda what I figured, but since I'd heard you were kind of a ruggedindividualist........ Mark At 11:25 AM 4/7/02 -0500, you wrote:Mark, out, but if you put the pith side out, it will snap at any slightuneveness in the pith. later,BobR.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com From: MarkWendt= rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= Sent: Sunday, April 07, 2002 6:39 AMSubject: re:Bamboo strips Bob, seem like a dumb question, but when you bend the strips, are you bending=them with the enamel to the outside? Mark At 12:31 PM 4/6/02 -0600, you wrote:Brian, 72"=strips end to end without them breaking, then they won't hold up in a= don't bend as extreme here, just until the ends in either hand are=parallel. That 180=B0 arc is more bending than the finished rod will ever= make sure that the arc of the bend is consistent, in other words, that= be surprised how many of those I find... strips with those, get tossed in=the floor, and sometime over the next week or so, get put in the corner= a hidden place, like an interior rot or a worm hole that isn't obvious, you= strip will snap, and sure enough, in the center of the strip (seems like=those work holes or rots are always in the middle of a strip... never in=the middle of a split where you can see them!) there will be a= held up to the rigors of being cranked around as a fresh split, then as one=that has been through the rigors of heating, straightening and pressing,= it's= strips from what I thought to be a great culm, with great cosmetics, good=power fiber density, etc., and even though the arc is smooth and= have=a weak feeling, so to speak... too easy to bend into a half circle or touch= regardless of how the power fibers look and how good the cane looked, it=just didn't "feel" like a piece of bamboo that would make a good=rod, so I pitch them into the Scrap strip pile on the floor. during this process, Billie, my girlfriend, was helping me clean out the=shop last night to make room for a new piece of machinery that's coming= some craft stuff with them... I did a good cleanout just before Christmas=and burned all the "reject" strips an pieces (which also burned=Billie's ass, because she, being more business minded than I, said that it=was craft supplies, potential bodkins, tool handles, etc, and NOT scrap and= between 75 and 100 pounds of cane strips between 72" and40"= had chosen from bales that I thought were the "best of the= Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com from dannyt@frisurf.no Sun Apr 7 17:50:26 2002 g37MoP429114 for ; Sun, 7 Apr 2002 17:50:25 -0500 User-Agent: Microsoft-Outlook-Express-Macintosh-Edition/5.02.2022 Subject: Re: Quad Forms g37MoQ429115 Hi, I too are hooked on quads, after casting Bob N. quad in New Zealand thisMarch. I'm also planning to make me a set of quad forms when I get back toNorway in 9-10 months time. At the moment I've just finished a set ofwoodenhex form, so I'm able to built a few rods while I'm here.If anybody have some info on building quad forms, I'd like to here yourexperience.............TIA,danny 'ü'˜...>.˜'ü'˜..˜'ü'˜.>.˜'ü'˜.. ,....˜'ü'˜..>>.˜'ü'˜..˜'ü'˜...>.˜'ü'˜.. ,. Danny Twang94 Bayswater ave.Bayswater, AucklandNew Zealand dannyt@frisurf.no+64 9 445 8949 from rvenneri@ulster.net Sun Apr 7 18:15:53 2002 g37NFq429834 for ; Sun, 7 Apr 2002 18:15:52 -0500 Organization: Venneri's Custom Components Subject: results of moisture content Hi guys,After reading all the post I received on this subject I have come tothe conclusion that i had some kind of glue failure. I think I narrowedit down to 2 things. One, maybe the garage was not at 70 degrees whilegluing and the temp of the glued blank may have droped below 70 degreesbefore curing. Two , that my blanks were to dry and caused porr bond ogglue. Now how do you know if the cane is too dry ,too wet or just right -- Robert Venneri Venneri's 21 Chuck Hill Rd., Saugerties, NY 12477 (845)246-5882 rvenneri@ulster.net http://www.ulster.net/~rvenneri/index.html from Troutgetter@aol.com Sun Apr 7 18:41:41 2002 Received: from imo- (mail_out_v32.5.) id g.1aa.54cfd4 (17082) for Troutgetter@aol.com Message-ID: Date: rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu X-Listprocessor- Version:8.2.09/990901/11:28 -- ListProc(tm) by CREN -- Montclair, CA http://www.mshaybamboo.gq.nu/ -- Troutgetter@aol.com Full-name: Troutgetter Message-ID:Date: Sun, 7 Apr 2002 19:39:46 EDT Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 118 Bob, I amprobably talking out of my drunken butt, but, I don't think you should have toworry about all those conditions being "just right" in the shop! You might try adifferent glue if you really think that is the problem, but I haven't heardanyone talk about simply placing your glued up blanks in a drying cabinet for aweek or so and see if that fixes your problem. It seems to have fixed thesame problem with a good friends rod who also uses Epon. Best to you, MikeShay Mike's Bamboo Rod Shop Montclair, CA - > from bdcbfr@chartermi.net Sun Apr 7 19:08:02 2002 Received: fromproxy1-grandhaven0.chartermi.net (24.247.15.39.gha.mi.chartermi.net From: "Brian D. Creek" References: Subject: Re: results of moisture content Date: Sun, 7 Apr 2002 20:08:04 - 8.2.09/990901/11:28 -- ListProc(tm) by CREN I always mist my strips justbefore applying glue (I use perkins L-100 with ammonium something andCascoset) with distilled H2O. I don't think the cold garage would pose aproblem unless it was really cold. You could always cure the strips in youroven. It's what works for me. Brian ----- Original Message ----- From: "Robert Sent: Sunday, April 07, 2002 10:14 PMSubject: results of moisture content Hi guys,After reading all the post I received on this subject I have come tothe conclusion that i had some kind of glue failure. I think I narrowedit down to 2 things. One, maybe the garage was not at 70 degrees whilegluing and the temp of the glued blank may have droped below 70 degreesbefore curing. Two , that my blanks were to dry and caused porr bond ogglue. Now how do you know if the cane is too dry ,too wet or just right --Robert VenneriVenneri's21 Chuck Hill Rd.,Saugerties, NY 12477(845) 246- 5882rvenneri@ulster.nethttp://www.ulster.net/~rvenneri/index.html from Troutgetter@aol.com Sun Apr 7 19:19:07 2002 g380J6401702 for ; Sun, 7 Apr 2002 19:19:07 -0500 Subject: Re: results of moisture content hey guys,Randall says there is an attachment to the reponce I just sent.DON"T OPEN IT!I didn't send an attachmentMike Mike's Bamboo Rod ShopMontclair, CAhttp://www.mshaybamboo.gq.nu/ from jojo@ipa.net Sun Apr 7 19:26:14 2002 g380QD402063 for ; Sun, 7 Apr 2002 19:26:13 -0500 helo=default) id 16uMz6-0005ot-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Sun, 07 Apr 2002 20:26:12 -0400 Subject: Re: results of moisture content Yes, you did. I opened it, and it was your forwarded response to Bob's glue- upproblem. That happenssometimes with you. I just figured that, in your own words, you were doingthings out of yourdrunken butt. ;o) M-D hey guys,Randall says there is an attachment to the reponce I just sent.DON"T OPEN IT!I didn't send an attachmentMike Mike's Bamboo Rod ShopMontclair, CAhttp://www.mshaybamboo.gq.nu/ from caneman@clnk.com Sun Apr 7 19:27:33 2002 g380RW402288 for ; Sun, 7 Apr 2002 19:27:32 -0500 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35) Subject: Re: results of moisture content Mike,I checked it and opened it. It just looks like when you sent, you sentit as "Forward as attachment" instead of just "Forward". Was no big dealand was not a virus. Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com- ---- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: results of moisture content hey guys,Randall says there is an attachment to the reponce I just sent.DON"T OPEN IT!I didn't send an attachmentMike Mike's Bamboo Rod ShopMontclair, CAhttp://www.mshaybamboo.gq.nu/ from bob@downandacross.com Sun Apr 7 19:28:59 2002 g380Sw402535 for ; Sun, 7 Apr 2002 19:28:58 -0500 7 Apr 2002 19:54:31 -0400 Subject: Qaud Forms Dear List:I am having some new quad forms made up by my local expert machinist androdenthusiast. He has seen the Grindstone Angler's forms as well as my Blauveltquad forms, and we will be using the best elements from each to create thenew forms. The forms will be made out of stressed relieved steel andsurfaceground dead flat. A few others are in on this with me and I hope to keep thecosts at around $600 before shipping. If anyone out there is interested andwilling to make a very firm commitment, I would be glad to add on to theorder if you let me know by this Tuesday, April 9.Short of the nearly $1300 forms, no one else has quad forms available atpresent. Otherwise, I would not be stepping in here. These forms will besold at cost, and I am not making money on this, just trying to be helpful.Every set will be perfect to our specs or they will not be accepted. I willknow the final costs before shipping when the number of forms is solid onTuesday night.Please respond off-list if interested and thanks for the bandwith.Thanks,Bob from Troutgetter@aol.com Sun Apr 7 19:31:09 2002 g380V8402833 for ; Sun, 7 Apr 2002 19:31:08 -0500 Subject: Re: results of moisture content OK!Glad to hear I'm just drunk and not really stupid!Mike Mike's Bamboo Rod ShopMontclair, CAhttp://www.mshaybamboo.gq.nu/ from goodaple@cox-internet.com Sun Apr 7 19:33:56 2002 g380Xt403138 for ; Sun, 7 Apr 2002 19:33:56 -0500 (InterMail vK.4.03.05.03 201-232-132-103 license180e1de7f543f89455b24e508f9cca39) Subject: Virus scare Mike, Sorry. Didn't mean to create a virus panic. Sounds like the guys =figured out what it was. Now you guys know haw I react when I see =attached files!! :>) Randall G. Mike, Sorry. Didn't mean to create a = Sounds like the guys figured out what it was. Now you guys know haw I = G. from flyfish@gbronline.com Sun Apr 7 19:59:22 2002 g380xM403749 for ; Sun, 7 Apr 2002 19:59:22 -0500 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:0.9.4.1)Gecko/20020314 Netscape6/6.2.2 Subject: rodmakers site Has anyone tried to connect to the rodmakers page? I'm getting a message that "the connection was refused", and I can't get to the page> from LECLAIR123@aol.com Sun Apr 7 20:02:40 2002 g3812d404007 for ; Sun, 7 Apr 2002 20:02:39 -0500 Subject: Re: rodmakers site Yes, your right. I just tried it and I can't get on either. Must be they are having some sort of problem? Dave check out our new site at- flyandrodroom.com AOL site- http://hometown.aol.com/leclair123/index.html from lblan@provide.net Sun Apr 7 20:03:48 2002 g3813m404196 for ; Sun, 7 Apr 2002 20:03:48 -0500 for ; Sun, 7 Apr 2002 21:03:43 -0400 Subject: RE: rodmakers site I got there late last week. Chris' host might be down. Try again later. Larry Blan -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Sunday, April 07, 2002 9:01 PM Subject: rodmakers site Has anyone tried to connect to the rodmakers page? I'm getting a message that "the connection was refused", and I can't get to the page> from jojo@ipa.net Sun Apr 7 20:08:54 2002 g3818r404596 for ; Sun, 7 Apr 2002 20:08:53 -0500 helo=default) id 16uNeO-0003X7-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Sun, 07 Apr 2002 21:08:53 -0400 Subject: Re: rodmakers site I got on there Friday night, but now it's the same here. Agreed, sounds asthough the server isdown. M-D I got there late last week. Chris' host might be down. Try again later. Larry Blan From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Has anyone tried to connect to the rodmakers page? I'm getting amessage that "the connection was refused", and I can't get to the page> from flyfish@gbronline.com Sun Apr 7 20:10:05 2002 g381A4404838 for ; Sun, 7 Apr 2002 20:10:04 -0500 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:0.9.4.1)Gecko/20020314 Netscape6/6.2.2 Subject: Re: rodmakers site Thanks--At least I know it's not my ISP this time.Does anyone have Wayne's guide spacing formula handy? I can't get to the archives to search for it.Thanks!Greg LECLAIR123@aol.com wrote: Yes, your right. I just tried it and I can't get on either. Must be they are having some sort of problem? Dave check out our new site at- flyandrodroom.com AOL site- http://hometown.aol.com/leclair123/index.html from utzerath@execpc.com Sun Apr 7 20:45:03 2002 g381j2405898 for ; Sun, 7 Apr 2002 20:45:02 -0500 g381j1156396; g381j0J64908; Subject: Re: results of moisture content Bob,Just to be safe, I always wipe the strips down with rubbing alcohol about 15minutes before gluing to degrease and wet them. There's about 10% waterinthat stuff. Be sure you didn't measure out the catalyst wrong; I did once.Jim U----- Original Message ----- Subject: results of moisture content Hi guys,After reading all the post I received on this subject I have come tothe conclusion that i had some kind of glue failure. I think I narrowedit down to 2 things. One, maybe the garage was not at 70 degrees whilegluing and the temp of the glued blank may have droped below 70 degreesbefore curing. Two , that my blanks were to dry and caused porr bond ogglue. Now how do you know if the cane is too dry ,too wet or just right --Robert VenneriVenneri's21 Chuck Hill Rd.,Saugerties, NY 12477(845) 246- 5882rvenneri@ulster.nethttp://www.ulster.net/~rvenneri/index.html from richjez@enteract.com Sun Apr 7 20:47:11 2002 g381lB406273 for ; Sun, 7 Apr 2002 20:47:11 -0500 Subject: Re: rodmakers site I'am having a problem getting into it too.Rich Jezioro At 08:01 PM 4/7/2002, Greg Kuntz wrote: Has anyone tried to connect to the rodmakers page? I'm getting a message that "the connection was refused", and I can't get to the page> from KyleDruey@aol.com Sun Apr 7 21:27:34 2002 g382RX407442 for ; Sun, 7 Apr 2002 21:27:33 -0500 Subject: Re: Quad Forms g382RX407445 Ya, I built some a few months ago, my post is in the archives. It was not fun but they work well. Kyle In a message dated 04/07/2002 3:50:41 PM Pacific Daylight Time, dannyt@frisurf.no writes: Hi,I too are hooked on quads, after casting Bob N. quad in New Zealand thisMarch. I'm also planning to make me a set of quad forms when I get back toNorway in 9-10 months time. At the moment I've just finished a set of wooden hex form, so I'm able to built a few rods while I'm here.If anybody have some info on building quad forms, I'd like to here yourexperience.............TIA,danny'ü'˜...>.˜'ü'˜..˜'ü'˜.>.˜'ü'˜.. ,....˜'ü'˜..>>.˜'ü'˜..˜'ü'˜...>.˜'ü'˜.. ,.Danny Twang94 Bayswater ave.Bayswater, AucklandNew Zealanddannyt@frisurf.no+64 9 445 8949----------------------- Headers --------------------------------Return-Path: Received: from rly-xg04.mx.aol.com (rly-xg04.mail.aol.com Sun, 07 Apr 2002 18:50:41 1900 rly- Sun, 07 Apr 2002 18:50:17 -0500 g37Mog429155; Received: from mta2-rme.xtra.co.nz (mta2-rme.xtra.co.nz g37MoP429114 User-Agent: Microsoft-Outlook-Express-Macintosh-Edition/5.02.2022Date: Mon, 08 Apr 2002 10:48:29 +1200Subject: Re: Quad FormsFrom: Danny Twang Message-ID: g37MoQ429115 Sender: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduX-Listprocessor-Version: 8.2.09/990901/11:28 -- ListProc(tm) by CRENContent-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable g37Mog429155 from saweiss@flash.net Sun Apr 7 22:11:42 2002 g383Bf408457 for ; Sun, 7 Apr 2002 22:11:41 -0500 g383BdL34608 for ; Sun, 7 Apr 2002 23:11:39 -0400 Subject: Re: results of moisture content Organization: Prodigy Internet Robert,If you are using Epon, you Should probably not add moisture. I glue mineright out of the drying cabinet. After initial set ( 8-10 hours), Istraighten thoroughly, hang to set for another day, then put them into thedrying cabinet with the heat up to about 160 for a couple of days. Thecritical variable with epoxy is thorough curing. It will ultimately happenover time without heat, but the heat accelerates it. Hi guys,After reading all the post I received on this subject I have come tothe conclusion that i had some kind of glue failure. I think I narrowedit down to 2 things. One, maybe the garage was not at 70 degrees whilegluing and the temp of the glued blank may have droped below 70 degreesbefore curing. Two , that my blanks were to dry and caused porr bond ogglue. Now how do you know if the cane is too dry ,too wet or just right --Robert VenneriVenneri's21 Chuck Hill Rd.,Saugerties, NY 12477(845) 246- 5882rvenneri@ulster.nethttp://www.ulster.net/~rvenneri/index.html from rodwrapp@swbell.net Mon Apr 8 02:14:48 2002 g387EY413065 for ; Mon, 8 Apr 2002 02:14:38 -0500 (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 (built May 7 2001)) Subject: Re: Quad Forms I talked to Tony Larson a couple of Days ago and he is makeing Quad Formsand Hex forms, I think he had a couple sets forsale.. I think his web siteis www.rushriverrods.comThanks dave----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Quad Forms Ya, I built some a few months ago, my post is in the archives. It was notfun but they work well. Kyle In a message dated 04/07/2002 3:50:41 PM Pacific Daylight Time,dannyt@frisurf.no writes: Hi, I too are hooked on quads, after casting Bob N. quad in New Zealand this March. I'm also planning to make me a set of quad forms when I get back to Norway in 9-10 months time. At the moment I've just finished a set of wooden hex form, so I'm able to built a few rods while I'm here.If anybody have some info on building quad forms, I'd like to here yourexperience.............TIA,danny 'ü'˜...>.˜'ü'˜..˜'ü'˜.>.˜'ü'˜.. ,....˜'ü'˜..>>.˜'ü'˜..˜'ü'˜...>.˜'ü'˜.. ,. Danny Twang94 Bayswater ave.Bayswater, AucklandNew Zealand dannyt@frisurf.no+64 9 445 8949 ----------------------- Headers --------------------------------Return-Path: Received: from rly-xg04.mx.aol.com (rly-xg04.mail.aol.com 0407185041; Sun, 07 Apr 2002 18:50:41 1900 by rly- 0407185017; Sun, 07 Apr 2002 18:50:17 -0500 g37Mog429155; Received: from mta2-rme.xtra.co.nz (mta2-rme.xtra.co.nz g37MoP429114 +1200 User-Agent: Microsoft-Outlook-Express-Macintosh-Edition/5.02.2022Date: Mon, 08 Apr 2002 10:48:29 +1200Subject: Re: Quad FormsFrom: Danny Twang Message-ID: wugate.wustl.edu g37MoQ429115 Sender: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduX-Listprocessor-Version: 8.2.09/990901/11:28 -- ListProc(tm) by CRENContent-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable wugate.wustl.edu g37Mog429155 from harms1@pa.net Mon Apr 8 07:11:49 2002 g38CBm416067 for ; Mon, 8 Apr 2002 07:11:48 -0500 for ; Mon, 8 Apr 2002 08:06:05 -0400 Subject: Epon and fluting All, I'm wondering if some of you might help me out with a glue-up issue.Recently, I switched from URAC to Epon, but because I keep my shop atsomething just less than 70 degrees, the viscosity of the Epon is ratherlike molasses. This is ok for ordinary glue-ups, as I just slather the glueon with a toothbrush, and let the binding process squegee out the excess. But now I'm working on a set of quads that have been hollow-fluted and I amworried about how to avoid having this heavy glue clog up the fluted areas.My question is, will warming the Epon help to get its consistency more likemotor oil and less like molasses, or is there some other procedure you mightrecommend? Thanks in advance,Bill from channer@frontier.net Mon Apr 8 07:24:22 2002 g38COL416453 for ; Mon, 8 Apr 2002 07:24:21 -0500 for ; Mon, 8 Apr 2002 06:24:56 -0600 Subject: Re: Epon and fluting Bill;You can warm the Epon before you mix it and keep it warm while you'regluing up, or you can thin it just a little with lacquer thinner. Don'tbelieve the can of acetone, you don't want to use it with epon, it willtake forever to set up and you will most likely have to heat set it toget it to go off. I don't know about you, but I don't think acetone andheat sources are a very good mix. You can also run your heat gun overyour strips after you get the glue slathered on them, but be sure tobang any crud out of the heat gun first, mine picks up dust off thebench and blows it out again when I tip the nozzle down. The downside toheating epon is that it doesn't stay warm very long and you arebeginning the heat setting process as soon as you warm it. john WILLIAM HARMS wrote: All, I'm wondering if some of you might help me out with a glue-up issue.Recently, I switched from URAC to Epon, but because I keep my shop atsomething just less than 70 degrees, the viscosity of the Epon is ratherlike molasses. This is ok for ordinary glue-ups, as I just slather the glueon with a toothbrush, and let the binding process squegee out the excess. But now I'm working on a set of quads that have been hollow-fluted and Iamworried about how to avoid having this heavy glue clog up the fluted areas.My question is, will warming the Epon help to get its consistency more likemotor oil and less like molasses, or is there some other procedure youmightrecommend? Thanks in advance,Bill from caneman@clnk.com Mon Apr 8 08:36:10 2002 g38Da9418417 for ; Mon, 8 Apr 2002 08:36:09 -0500 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35) Mon, 8 Apr 2002 08:34:09 -0500 Subject: a NEW bamboo article! Guys,About to head out to the Dentist, but before I go, wanted to post aboutsomething...Harry Boyd has an article posted to Flyanglers Online called "Why RollYour Own?"... boy, now last time I said there was a bamboo article atwww.flyanglersonline.com I got accused of being a s#!t stirrer! Imaginethat!!! LOLSeriously, good article, even though it doesn't completely agree with myphilosophy of rodmaking, it is very interesting reading and a LOT calmerthan the recent exchanges on FAOL were! *S* Good job Harry (just trying to decide if I should post to FAOL or not! LOL), Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com from pvansch@wethersfield.k12.ct.us Mon Apr 8 09:03:38 2002 g38E3b419775 for ; Mon, 8 Apr 2002 09:03:37 -0500 Subject: RE: a NEW bamboo article! Great article!! Peter -----Original Message----- Subject: a NEW bamboo article! Guys,About to head out to the Dentist, but before I go, wanted to post aboutsomething...Harry Boyd has an article posted to Flyanglers Online called "Why RollYour Own?"... boy, now last time I said there was a bamboo article atwww.flyanglersonline.com I got accused of being a s#!t stirrer! Imaginethat!!! LOLSeriously, good article, even though it doesn't completely agree with myphilosophy of rodmaking, it is very interesting reading and a LOT calmerthan the recent exchanges on FAOL were! *S* Good job Harry (just trying to decide if I should post to FAOL or not! LOL), Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com from jojo@ipa.net Mon Apr 8 09:39:23 2002 g38EdN421871 for ; Mon, 8 Apr 2002 09:39:23 -0500 helo=default) id 16uaIR-0002e3-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Mon, 08 Apr 2002 10:39:17 -0400 Subject: Re: a NEW bamboo article! So, it doesn't completely agree with your philosophy, huh? Sounds like acomment begging forcontroversy to me, and here you are posting again about an article on FAOL.This looks like apattern to me, Bob. M-D ----- Original Message ----- Subject: a NEW bamboo article! Guys,About to head out to the Dentist, but before I go, wanted to post aboutsomething...Harry Boyd has an article posted to Flyanglers Online called "Why RollYour Own?"... boy, now last time I said there was a bamboo article atwww.flyanglersonline.com I got accused of being a s#!t stirrer! Imaginethat!!! LOLSeriously, good article, even though it doesn't completely agree with myphilosophy of rodmaking, it is very interesting reading and a LOT calmerthan the recent exchanges on FAOL were! *S* Good job Harry (just trying to decide if I should post to FAOL or not! LOL), Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com from blitzenrods@yahoo.com Mon Apr 8 10:34:51 2002 g38FYo424460 for ; Mon, 8 Apr 2002 10:34:50 -0500 Mon, 08 Apr 2002 08:34:48 PDT Subject: Santiam Fly Casters bamboo demo debriefing I wanted to say thank you to Don Chen of this list andany other members of the Santiam Fly Casters thatmight be signed on. Bamboo rodmakers were invited tocome to their annual Fly Fishing Fair in Salem Oregonand talk about bamboo rodmaking and make rodsavailable for attendees to cast. I think it was agreat success. I have no idea how many people werethere, but steady casting went on all day long in theWillamette University gymnasium, and a steady streamof people made the rounds asking questions and makingcomments. I was able to cast some of Steve Kiley's powerhouserods, one based on an 8015 Guide taper and one on aGillum 8 wt. taper. They were so smooth and powerful,and begged to shoot line. Beautiful rods. Also Tim Stoltz's 7'6" 5 wt. with a silk line. Abeautiful blonde rod and smooth caster. Dan and Kelly Brock brought a line up of the classicsand let us cast an original Garrison 212, WinstonLittle Feller, F.E. Thomas 7' 7 wt. Atlantic SalmonMidge rod, and probably others I missed out on. There were some fantastic casters present, and theyreally showed me what can be done with a fly rod. Also several young kids were able to cast bamboo, andsome did an excellent job and showed some great skill. I had a great time, although I talked way more thanI'm used to, and those in charge of the fair did agreat job hosting the event. Chris McDowell __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTaxhttp://taxes.yahoo.com/ from bdcbfr@chartermi.net Mon Apr 8 10:41:17 2002 g38FfH424917 for ; Mon, 8 Apr 2002 10:41:17 -0500 for ; Mon, 8 Apr 2002 11:41:13 -0400 Subject: Re: a NEW bamboo article! Harry, Nice job. But you were way too nice. That won't generate all the hits thatthe original did for FAOL! ;^) Brian----- Original Message ----- Subject: a NEW bamboo article! Guys,About to head out to the Dentist, but before I go, wanted to post about something...Harry Boyd has an article posted to Flyanglers Online called "Why RollYour Own?"... boy, now last time I said there was a bamboo article atwww.flyanglersonline.com I got accused of being a s#!t stirrer! Imaginethat!!! LOLSeriously, good article, even though it doesn't completely agree with my philosophy of rodmaking, it is very interesting reading and a LOT calmerthan the recent exchanges on FAOL were! *S* Good job Harry (just trying to decide if I should post to FAOL or not! LOL), Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com from k5vkq@ix.netcom.com Mon Apr 8 11:37:23 2002 g38GbM402659 for ; Mon, 8 Apr 2002 11:37:22 -0500 helo=ernie.psp.pas.earthlink.net) id 16uc8v-0006Jo-00; Mon, 08 Apr 2002 09:37:21 -0700 by ernie.psp.pas.earthlink.net (8.10.2+Sun/8.10.2) id g38GbL822328; Subject: Re: a NEW bamboo article! Really good article Harry. Good job. Onisk5vkq@ix.netcom.com On Mon, 8 Apr 2002 08:33:19 -0500 Bob Nunley wrote: Guys,About to head out to the Dentist, but before I go, wanted to post aboutsomething...Harry Boyd has an article posted to Flyanglers Online called "Why RollYour Own?"... boy, now last time I said there was a bamboo article atwww.flyanglersonline.com I got accused of being a s#!t stirrer! Imaginethat!!! LOLSeriously, good article, even though it doesn't completely agree with myphilosophy of rodmaking, it is very interesting reading and a LOT calmerthan the recent exchanges on FAOL were! *S* Good job Harry (just trying to decide if I should post to FAOL or not! LOL), Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com from BambooRods@aol.com Mon Apr 8 12:05:18 2002 g38H5H404386 for ; Mon, 8 Apr 2002 12:05:17 -0500 for ; Mon, 8 Apr 2002 13:04:58 -0400 Subject: Twist thru full rod section Well guys,Leave it to me, I have a constant twist running the whole length of both the butt and tip section of a rod that I have just finished final planing. A full quarter turn from one end to the other. It was roughed on a new rough beveler so I am not sure if the twist was introduced by that or not. I have not glued up yet and was wondering... would a possible approach (at least with some benefit) be to take two vises placed at a distance between each other that would allow me to take the rod section from the oven (during heat treating) and place the ends in each vise with a "counter twist" in it and allow it to cool. I hope to glue up tonight or tomorrow. Doug from tedknott@cogeco.ca Mon Apr 8 12:11:03 2002 g38HAr404904 for ; Mon, 8 Apr 2002 12:10:53 -0500 "Joe Behar" , "Carl O'connor","Ted Knott" , "Ken Simpson" ,"Sam Paonessa" ,"Roy DeGiusti" , "R Blades","Paul Schlote" ,"Mike Rowan" ,"Jorge Carcao" , "Joe Amaral","James Bond" , "Mark Babiy" ,"Allan Salvador" ,"Peter Repath" Subject: Rodmaking Demos, 26th Annual Canadian Fly Fishing Forum I'm just sitting here and reflecting on two wonderful days at the Forumdemonstrating bamboo rod making. We had an ideal location at the entranceto the show so that everyone passed by us on their way in. Immediatelybehind us was a casting lane to try rods. Covering the booth and explainingor demonstrating the art of bamboo rod making were area rodmakers PaulSchlote, who hosts a weekly rodmaking session at his home, Joe Behar, whoisworking one his second rod, Ted Armstrong working on his first, big MikeRowan working on his third rod for his daughter, Peter Repath, who took timeaway from the heavy load at the registration desk. Alan taylor who has yetto make his first rod, but is making HSS blades for the planes. Alan is atoolmaker by trade, and showed up with his latest creation, a beautifulblock plane. Alan has loaned me the plane to try, and I've promised to useit on a dozen or so rods (joke) and get it right back to him. Joe Amaralbrought one of his superb Quads for us to admire and try out on the castinglane. Thanks also to Mark Babiy, James Bond and Ken Simpson for coveringthe booth and answering so many questions. The demos attracted a lot ofinterest and there was a steady crowd around the booth for two days. Shawn Pineo, from Nova Scotian showed up on Saturday with one of hissuperbrod creations. Its always nice to meet another list member and be able toput a face to someone you know only by list messages. Overall the bamboo rod demos were very popular and generated a lot ofinterest. Great work Guys! from kenealyj@gwi.net Mon Apr 8 12:18:04 2002 g38HI4405641 for ; Mon, 8 Apr 2002 12:18:04 -0500 for ; Mon, 8 Apr 2002 13:18:02 -0400 Subject: Guillermo's Leaders Revisited Hi All, I just received a shipment of leaders from Guillermo.They look really good!He sent 2 sizes: 5'0" for small streams/rods and 6'8" for general pupose = If anyone is interested, please contact me off list and I'll give you = Sincerely, John K Hi All, I just received a shipment of leaders = Guillermo.They look really good!He sent 2 sizes: 5'0" for small = 6'8" for general pupose use. If anyone is interested, please contact= Sincerely, JohnK from Harris.James@ev.state.az.us Mon Apr 8 12:21:04 2002 g38HL3406014 for ; Mon, 8 Apr 2002 12:21:03 -0500 g38HGRH23625 for ; Mon, 8 Apr 2002 10:16:27 -0700 10:18:57 2002 -0700 with Novell_GroupWise; Mon, 08 Apr 2002 10:20:53 -0700 Subject: Oil and Vinegar g38HL3406016 A big 'thank you' to all for your help. I was busy in the shop all weekend and didn't check the list until this morning(mon). It was nice to find that so many of you had responded to thisfinishing problem. I see I'm not alone. It was also nice to see that when thetopic digressed, it had morphed into beer.I'm 'almost' sure the cause of my intermittent fisheye problems are/wererelated to sanding. One list member pointed out, that if I was using 0000steelwool to final the rod before dipping (which I was), that I was polishing thesurface and not giving the varnish anything to adhere to. I tried sanding therod back down and stopping at 400 grit. This did the trick. Well at least onthis rod it solved the problem. The finish is just as smooth, as if I had used0000 SW, and no fisheyes. We'll see what happens next time. Thanks you guys, your the best!JimH from rcristant@isgtransport.com Mon Apr 8 12:23:06 2002 g38HN5406310 for ; Mon, 8 Apr 2002 12:23:05 -0500 content-class: urn:content-classes:messageSubject: RE: Rodmaking Demos, 26th Annual Canadian Fly Fishing Forum Thread-Topic: Rodmaking Demos, 26th Annual Canadian Fly Fishing ForumThread-Index: AcHfIInQwBnappAvRl+ariPGPMt6/gAALQCw g38HN5406311 I couldn't agree more. I think that this demonstration at the forum wasprobably the most popular, and by far the most visited. Ted, you provedonce again to be quite helpful with answering questions (there weremany) and once again the craft of bamboo fly rod building is lucky tohave you as one of its ambassadors. P.S. Thanks for pointing out that my rod would be better suited with aDT 4 wt line. Robert -----Original Message----- Ted Knott; Ken Simpson; Sam Paonessa; Roy DeGiusti; R Blades; PaulSchlote; Mike Rowan; Jorge Carcao; Joe Amaral; James Bond; Mark Babiy;Allan Salvador; Peter RepathSubject: Rodmaking Demos, 26th Annual Canadian Fly Fishing Forum I'm just sitting here and reflecting on two wonderful days at the Forumdemonstrating bamboo rod making. We had an ideal location at theentranceto the show so that everyone passed by us on their way in. Immediatelybehind us was a casting lane to try rods. Covering the booth andexplainingor demonstrating the art of bamboo rod making were area rodmakers PaulSchlote, who hosts a weekly rodmaking session at his home, Joe Behar,who isworking one his second rod, Ted Armstrong working on his first, big MikeRowan working on his third rod for his daughter, Peter Repath, who tooktimeaway from the heavy load at the registration desk. Alan taylor who hasyetto make his first rod, but is making HSS blades for the planes. Alan isatoolmaker by trade, and showed up with his latest creation, a beautifulblock plane. Alan has loaned me the plane to try, and I've promised touseit on a dozen or so rods (joke) and get it right back to him. JoeAmaralbrought one of his superb Quads for us to admire and try out on thecastinglane. Thanks also to Mark Babiy, James Bond and Ken Simpson forcoveringthe booth and answering so many questions. The demos attracted a lot ofinterest and there was a steady crowd around the booth for two days. Shawn Pineo, from Nova Scotian showed up on Saturday with one of hissuperbrod creations. Its always nice to meet another list member and be abletoput a face to someone you know only by list messages. Overall the bamboo rod demos were very popular and generated a lot ofinterest. Great work Guys! from ChristopherO@epicimaging.com Mon Apr 8 12:23:06 2002 g38HN5406309 for ; Mon, 8 Apr 2002 12:23:05 -0500 id ; Mon, 8 Apr 2002 10:17:43 -0700 rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: RE: Oil and Vinegar A lot of steel wool is treated with oil to prevent rust.You might be rubbing oil into the rod. chris -----Original Message----- Subject: Oil and Vinegar A big 'thank you' to all for your help. I was busy in the shop all weekend and didn't check the list until thismorning (mon). It was nice to find that so many of you had responded tothis finishing problem. I see I'm not alone. It was also nice to see thatwhen the topic digressed, it had morphed into beer.I'm 'almost' sure the cause of my intermittent fisheye problems are/wererelated to sanding. One list member pointed out, that if I was using 0000steelwool to final the rod before dipping (which I was), that I waspolishing the surface and not giving the varnish anything to adhere to. Itried sanding the rod back down and stopping at 400 grit. This did thetrick. Well at least on this rod it solved the problem. The finish is justas smooth, as if I had used 0000 SW, and no fisheyes. We'll see whathappens next time. Thanks you guys, your the best!JimH from goodaple@cox-internet.com Mon Apr 8 12:31:40 2002 g38HVe407220 for ; Mon, 8 Apr 2002 12:31:40 -0500 (InterMail vK.4.03.05.00 201-232-132 license180e1de7f543f89455b24e508f9cca39) Subject: RE:New article Yep, nice article Harry. Randall G. G. from caneman@clnk.com Mon Apr 8 12:34:30 2002 g38HYT407581 for ; Mon, 8 Apr 2002 12:34:29 -0500 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35) Subject: Re: Twist thru full rod section Doug,That would probably work, but have you thought about just raising yourbinder tension for heat treating and work the twist out before you heattreat. What I mean is, that if you raise your binder tension where it'shard to move the strips in the string, then once you do get them moved,maybe they'll stay in place during heat treating and hold their straightnesswhen they cool.I've been using the Bellenger Roughing mill for a long time, and puncheda lot of sections out in it for both planing forms and the MHM, and I'venever had a problem with a section twisted like that. No idea why ithappened, but you should be able to get it cured before you glue up. Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com- ---- Original Message ----- Subject: Twist thru full rod section Well guys,Leave it to me, I have a constant twist running the whole length of both the butt and tip section of a rod that I have just finished final planing. A full quarter turn from one end to the other. It was roughed on a new rough beveler so I am not sure if the twist was introduced by that or not. I have not glued up yet and was wondering... would a possible approach (at least with some benefit) be to take two vises placed at a distance betweeneach other that would allow me to take the rod section from the oven (during heat treating) and place the ends in each vise with a "counter twist" in it and allow it to cool. I hope to glue up tonight or tomorrow. Doug from tedknott@cogeco.ca Mon Apr 8 12:39:08 2002 g38Hd7408437 for ; Mon, 8 Apr 2002 12:39:07 -0500 Subject: Re: Rodmaking Demos, 26th Annual Canadian Fly Fishing Forum Alain, the event was held at the Annual canadian Fly Fishing Forum,Exhibition Grounds, Automotive Building, Toronto. Its an annual eventorganized by the IWFFC. We were just one item in a large program. The next Bamboo Rod Gathering will be held in the spring of 2003, in fergus,Ont., on the Grand River, usually June, to coincide with the USA MemorialDay holiday weekend. Info about the Gathering will be posted on theRodmakers List probably in late fall, 2002. from rextutor@yahoo.com Mon Apr 8 13:24:56 2002 g38IOt411104 for ; Mon, 8 Apr 2002 13:24:55 -0500 08 Apr 2002 11:24:54 PDT Subject: Re: a NEW bamboo article! How refreshing to read a pleasant article there withthe authors real name and contact info attached. Ireally enjoyed the constructive , positive content ofthe article. __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTaxhttp://taxes.yahoo.com/ from jvswan@earthlink.net Mon Apr 8 15:38:22 2002 g38KcK423633 for ; Mon, 8 Apr 2002 15:38:20 -0500 User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/10.0.0.1429Subject: Darrin Curtis email Sorry to send this to the list. Darrin, can you send me an email. The address I have isDCURTIS@satx.rr.com. All of my replies to your email requests for corkhavebeen returned to me undeliverable. Thanks, Jason from rextutor@yahoo.com Mon Apr 8 18:22:31 2002 g38NMU400930 for ; Mon, 8 Apr 2002 18:22:30 -0500 08 Apr 2002 16:22:29 PDT Subject: impregnation of bamboo I am preparing to make an Orvis 1 piece. I amconsidering impregnating it with acetone / plexiglass\.Where do you get the plexiglass ? Didn't Bob N writethis process up in powerfibers ? I looked in thearchive as well as powerfibers and got nothing (unlessit is the issue with a pass word that I can't open)thanks, __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTaxhttp://taxes.yahoo.com/ from jojo@ipa.net Mon Apr 8 19:08:02 2002 g39080402318 for ; Mon, 8 Apr 2002 19:08:01 -0500 helo=default) id 16ujAy-00022B-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Mon, 08 Apr 2002 20:07:56 -0400 Subject: Re: impregnation of bamboo Some hardware stores, and most lumber yards sell it in various sizes. M-D I am preparing to make an Orvis 1 piece. I amconsidering impregnating it with acetone / plexiglass\.Where do you get the plexiglass ? Didn't Bob N writethis process up in powerfibers ? I looked in thearchive as well as powerfibers and got nothing (unlessit is the issue with a pass word that I can't open)thanks, from channer@frontier.net Mon Apr 8 19:12:48 2002 g390Cl402645 for ; Mon, 8 Apr 2002 19:12:47 -0500 for ; Mon, 8 Apr 2002 18:13:29 -0600 Subject: Re: Twist thru full rod section Doug;If the sections aren't glued up yet, what makes you think they aretwisted?? If they are just taped together for binding, or bound prior toheat treating, then either the tape or the binding job is twistingthem. Just figure out why and fix it before you glue, or face having tountwist the glued sections with heat. I have had lots of twists in thepast(I think Ihave that problem figured out now, knock on wood), andthey can be straightened, it just isn't any fun.john BambooRods@aol.com wrote: Well guys,Leave it to me, I have a constant twist running the whole length of boththe butt and tip section of a rod that I have just finished final planing. Afull quarter turn from one end to the other. It was roughed on a new roughbeveler so I am not sure if the twist was introduced by that or not. I have not glued up yet and was wondering... would a possible approach (atleast with some benefit) be to take two vises placed at a distance betweeneach other that would allow me to take the rod section from the oven(duringheat treating) and place the ends in each vise with a "counter twist" in itand allow it to cool. I hope to glue up tonight or tomorrow. Doug from dannyt@frisurf.no Mon Apr 8 19:35:53 2002 g390Zp403797 for ; Mon, 8 Apr 2002 19:35:52 -0500 User-Agent: Microsoft-Outlook-Express-Macintosh-Edition/5.02.2022 Subject: OT, exploding chestnut g390Zq403799 Hi List, I've always wanted to taste chestnut, so the other day I found it in a shophere in Auckland. I told the kids, and they too was exited to tastesomething new. I bought a bag and heated the stove, spread nuts on a plateand in they went. After a while I hard something popping in the kitchen, andI rushed in to see what it was. It turned out to be the chestnut poppinglike popcorn, only with much harder impact!! I told the kids to get out, andI headed for the stove. Quikly turning the heat off, carfully taking thetray out. They still popping and made a mess out of the kitchen. So my question to you guys: how do you roast the chestnuts? TIA,danny'ü'˜...>.˜'ü'˜..˜'ü'˜.>.˜'ü'˜.. ,....˜'ü'˜..>>.˜'ü'˜..˜'ü'˜...>.˜'ü'˜.. ,. Danny Twang94 Bayswater ave.Bayswater, AucklandNew Zealand dannyt@frisurf.no+64 9 445 8949 from KyleDruey@aol.com Mon Apr 8 19:48:44 2002 g390mh406196 for ; Mon, 8 Apr 2002 19:48:43 -0500 for ; Mon, 8 Apr 2002 20:48:26 -0400 Subject: Re: a NEW bamboo article! g390mh406198 There's also an article in there about Sowbug and a picture of Nunley. Didn't know Bob had a mustache, I thought he was the taller guy on the left but that dude was was way too svelte! [:)] Kyle In a message dated Mon, 8 Apr 2002 9:36:52 AM Eastern Daylight Time,"Bob Nunley" writes: Guys,About to head out to the Dentist, but before I go, wanted to post aboutsomething...Harry Boyd has an article posted to Flyanglers Online called "Why RollYour Own?"... boy, now last time I said there was a bamboo article atwww.flyanglersonline.com I got accused of being a s#!t stirrer! Imaginethat!!! LOLSeriously, good article, even though it doesn't completely agree with myphilosophy of rodmaking, it is very interesting reading and a LOT calmerthan the recent exchanges on FAOL were! *S* Good job Harry (just trying to decide if I should post to FAOL or not! LOL), Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com from DCURTIS@satx.rr.com Mon Apr 8 19:49:16 2002 g390nF406357 for ; Mon, 8 Apr 2002 19:49:15 -0500 for ; Mon, 8 Apr 2002 19:44:20 -0500 Subject: RE: Darrin Curtis email (off topic) Jason, I sent you an email back. If you can't send it back let me know onthe list. Sorry folks. Darrin -----Original Message----- Subject: Darrin Curtis email Sorry to send this to the list. Darrin, can you send me an email. The address I have isDCURTIS@satx.rr.com. All of my replies to your email requests for corkhavebeen returned to me undeliverable. Thanks, Jason from bob@downandacross.com Mon Apr 8 19:53:54 2002 g390rr407447 for ; Mon, 8 Apr 2002 19:53:53 -0500 8 Apr 2002 20:52:14 -0400 Subject: RE: impregnation of bamboo Rex:http://www.powerfibers.com/powerfibers4.pdfIt is in the article on making bamboo ferrules. There should be no passwordon the final copies of any issue. That idea did not go over well, so it wasdropped. Some of you may have not been notified because you were not onthelist at the time.All the issues are available on CD, they are too big to have all of them onthe site and not use up the small disc quota. I will leave issue 4 up for afew days. The latest CDs have articles on there from out of print magazinesabout Paul Young and EC Powell as well as catalog excerpts from Orvis andBill Edwards (quadrates only).Please feel free to contact me directly about anything related to themagazine, as I will be glad to accomodate you in any way I can. I think thatmost everyone who has asked for any of the info has found that to workbest.I am sorry that sometimes the magazine has been inconvenient, butsometimesthe hard work is inconvenient to us as well, and it still gets done.Thanks,Bob ps. For anyone who had the issue with the password protection, thepasswordwas salmon. -----Original Message----- Subject: impregnation of bamboo I am preparing to make an Orvis 1 piece. I amconsidering impregnating it with acetone / plexiglass\.Where do you get the plexiglass ? Didn't Bob N writethis process up in powerfibers ? I looked in thearchive as well as powerfibers and got nothing (unlessit is the issue with a pass word that I can't open)thanks, __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTaxhttp://taxes.yahoo.com/ from TSmithwick@aol.com Mon Apr 8 20:00:24 2002 g3910N408736 for ; Mon, 8 Apr 2002 20:00:23 -0500 Subject: Re: OT, exploding chestnut Danny - It's been a long time, but if memory serves, poking through the skins with a knife point will eliminate the fireworks from bob@downandacross.com Mon Apr 8 21:36:37 2002 g392aa413901 for ; Mon, 8 Apr 2002 21:36:37 -0500 Subject: RE: impregnation of bamboo Oops. I am reposting that now. The server was acting funny, and I think Iexceeded the 50MB of storage again.Sorry,Bob -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: impregnation of bamboo Bob, I get the message that the file is damaged and can not be opened. Brian----- Original Message ----- http://www.powerfibers.com/powerfibers4.pdf from bob@downandacross.com Mon Apr 8 21:44:05 2002 g392i4414272 for ; Mon, 8 Apr 2002 21:44:04 -0500 ; Mon, 8 Apr 2002 22:43:58 -0400 Subject: LN #2 I just wanted to publically thank Carsten (I did not forget you telling meabout this long ago), Darryl H., and Tom S. for their discussion on benchplanes for cane. I received my Lie-Nielsen #2 today, and I have been inNirvana planing out a quad tonight. It is the nicest little plane. My smallhands fit around the handle well, and just the weight alone allows you toget a beautiful curl of cane everytime. I am very impressed by its abilityto take off a lot or a wisp of cane.Thanks guys,Bob from flytyr@southshore.com Mon Apr 8 21:59:29 2002 g392xS414819 for ; Mon, 8 Apr 2002 21:59:28 -0500 g392xOO22673; Mon, 8 Apr 2002 21:59:24 -0500 Subject: Re: OT, exploding chestnut Tom,That is the way we used to do it years ago when we had a coal stove.Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com TSmithwick@aol.com wrote: Danny - It's been a long time, but if memory serves, poking through theskinswith a knife point will eliminate the fireworks from tausfeld@frontiernet.net Mon Apr 8 22:19:44 2002 g393Ji415612 for ; Mon, 8 Apr 2002 22:19:44 -0500 Subject: Re: OT, exploding chestnut Over an open fire.....tom (wise as#) So my question to you guys: how do you roast the chestnuts? TIA,danny'ü'˜...>.˜'ü'˜..˜'ü'˜.>.˜'ü'˜.. ,....˜'ü'˜..>>.˜'ü'˜..˜'ü'˜...>.˜'ü'˜.. ,. Danny Twang94 Bayswater ave.Bayswater, AucklandNew Zealand dannyt@frisurf.no+64 9 445 8949 from jojo@ipa.net Mon Apr 8 23:19:52 2002 g394Jp417098 for ; Mon, 8 Apr 2002 23:19:51 -0500 helo=default) id 16un6f-00041B-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Tue, 09 Apr 2002 00:19:45 -0400 Subject: Re: OT, exploding chestnut I really wish you guys had kept this to yourselves. I've been keeping myselfamused all evening withthoughts of Danny running wild through his kitchen, dodging explodingchestnuts. I'm still LMAO.Sounds as though the Brit's descendents have gotten a little revenge ontheir Norse invader.Geez, you just crack me up, Danny! M-D Danny - It's been a long time, but if memory serves, poking through the skinswith a knife point will eliminate the fireworks from avyoung@iinet.net.au Mon Apr 8 23:29:38 2002 g394TZ417576 for ; Mon, 8 Apr 2002 23:29:36 -0500 Subject: Re: OT, exploding chestnut g394Tb417577 This sounds exactly like my attempt at roast Bunya nuts. These things only grow in certain mountain old volcanic regions of Southern Queensland and when they were ripe enough to collect the aboriginals came from hundreds of miles around to eat them.They grow on trees that are about 150 feet high, pretty good timber to. The nuts themselves grow in gigantic clusters that weigh about 60-70 lbs around a central core very much like mussels growing around a pier. When it's time these clusters fall in one piece to the ground and upon impact explode and spread the nuts all around the place which is obviously how the trees spread. To my knowledge nobody has ever been killed by one of these bombs but it must have happened at some time and must some time in the future because there are national parks with walkways running right through these forests and you see the remains of these bombs on tracks all over the place and hear it happening from time to time as you wander about the tracks. Trees and their seeds do make a huge noise when they fall regardless of if people are there to hear them believe me.Anyhow when the kids were small they were taught about the Aboriginals and these seeds and how it was just like Europeans eating chestnuts so we took some seeds home and had the very same experience as Danny.In the end I roasted them in the oven being a confined space and after attacking them with a pr of Cresant fencing pliers to open them they tasted like flour glue but worse.The thought did cross my mind that possibly the husk was what you ate and threw the nut part out. I've never tried chestnuts but hopefully they aren't the same "acquired" taste of Bunya nuts. When I saw Crockadile Dundee I this whole experience came to mind with the line "It taste's like shit but you can live on it", I guess it's possible anyhow. Tony At 12:34 PM 4/9/02 +1200, Danny Twang wrote: Hi List, I've always wanted to taste chestnut, so the other day I found it in a shophere in Auckland. I told the kids, and they too was exited to tastesomething new. I bought a bag and heated the stove, spread nuts on a plateand in they went. After a while I hard something popping in the kitchen, andI rushed in to see what it was. It turned out to be the chestnut poppinglike popcorn, only with much harder impact!! I told the kids to get out, andI headed for the stove. Quikly turning the heat off, carfully taking thetray out. They still popping and made a mess out of the kitchen. So my question to you guys: how do you roast the chestnuts? TIA,danny'ü'˜...>.˜'ü'˜..˜'ü'˜.>.˜'ü'˜.. ,....˜'ü'˜..>>.˜'ü'˜..˜'ü'˜...>.˜'ü'˜.. ,. Danny Twang94 Bayswater ave.Bayswater, AucklandNew Zealand dannyt@frisurf.no+64 9 445 8949 /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from jojo@ipa.net Mon Apr 8 23:37:00 2002 g394b0417963 for ; Mon, 8 Apr 2002 23:37:00 -0500 helo=default) id 16unNH-0003ib-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Tue, 09 Apr 2002 00:36:56 -0400 Subject: Re: OT, exploding chestnut Tony, In my experience and opinion, Chestnuts surely must be the smaller cousin tothe Bunya nut, as yourcomparison of flour glue, only worse, holds forth for the Chestnut. M-D This sounds exactly like my attempt at roast Bunya nuts.SNIPIn the end I roasted them in the oven being a confined space and afterattacking them with a pr of Cresant fencing pliers to open them they tastedlike flour glue but worse.The thought did cross my mind that possibly the husk was what you ate andthrew the nut part out. I've never tried chestnuts but hopefully they aren't the same "acquired"taste of Bunya nuts. When I saw Crockadile Dundee I this whole experiencecame to mind with the line "It taste's like shit but you can live on it", Iguess it's possible anyhow. Tony At 12:34 PM 4/9/02 +1200, Danny Twang wrote: SNIP So my question to you guys: how do you roast the chestnuts? TIA,danny'ü'˜...>.˜'ü'˜..˜'ü'˜.>.˜'ü'˜.. ,....˜'ü'˜..>>.˜'ü'˜..˜'ü'˜...>.˜'ü'˜.. ,. Danny Twang94 Bayswater ave.Bayswater, AucklandNew Zealand dannyt@frisurf.no+64 9 445 8949 from avyoung@iinet.net.au Mon Apr 8 23:45:40 2002 g394jb418397 for ; Mon, 8 Apr 2002 23:45:37 -0500 Subject: Re: OT, exploding chestnut g394jd418398 You can buy chestnuts here but I've been strangely reluctant to try them. Tony At 11:35 PM 4/8/02 -0500, Jojo DeLancier wrote: Tony, In my experience and opinion, Chestnuts surely must be the smaller cousin to the Bunya nut, as yourcomparison of flour glue, only worse, holds forth for the Chestnut. M-D From: "Tony Young" This sounds exactly like my attempt at roast Bunya nuts.SNIPIn the end I roasted them in the oven being a confined space and afterattacking them with a pr of Cresant fencing pliers to open them theytastedlike flour glue but worse.The thought did cross my mind that possibly the husk was what you ate andthrew the nut part out. I've never tried chestnuts but hopefully they aren't the same "acquired"taste of Bunya nuts. When I saw Crockadile Dundee I this whole experiencecame to mind with the line "It taste's like shit but you can live on it", Iguess it's possible anyhow. Tony At 12:34 PM 4/9/02 +1200, Danny Twang wrote: SNIP So my question to you guys: how do you roast the chestnuts? TIA,danny'ü'˜...>.˜'ü'˜..˜'ü'˜.>.˜'ü'˜.. ,....˜'ü'˜..>>.˜'ü'˜..˜'ü'˜...>.˜'ü'˜.. ,. Danny Twang94 Bayswater ave.Bayswater, AucklandNew Zealand dannyt@frisurf.no+64 9 445 8949 /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from geert.poorteman@undp.org Tue Apr 9 01:30:42 2002 g396Uf420645 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 01:30:41 -0500 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 02:30:37 -0400 0400 Tue, 9 Apr 2002 08:23:03 +0200 Subject: Re: OT, exploding chestnut Hi Danny,when we were kids, we used to eat them raw. You can peel off the whitishskin underthe brown peel when they're still fresh.And, by the way, we never bought them... We all knew a tree somewhere!Geert Tony Spezio a Äcrit: Tom,That is the way we used to do it years ago when we had a coal stove.Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com TSmithwick@aol.com wrote: Danny - It's been a long time, but if memory serves, poking through theskinswith a knife point will eliminate the fireworks from geert.poorteman@undp.org Tue Apr 9 01:35:07 2002 g396Z6420914 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 01:35:06 -0500 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 02:35:05 -0400 Tue, 9 Apr 2002 08:28:23 +0200 Subject: Re: OT, exploding chestnut Danny,another way to eat them is :cut the peel of each nut crosswise and boil them in water with celery added.Peel them and mash them like you would mashed potatoes. Goes very wellwith gamemeat.Actually in the Cevennes mountains, in the south of France and in Corsica,chestnuts were staple food.Geert from dnhayashida@yahoo.com Tue Apr 9 01:40:54 2002 g396er421297 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 01:40:53 -0500 08 Apr 2002 23:40:53 PDT Subject: Re: LN #2 It is difficult to convey how much easier planing iswith a bench plane. Let me put it this way - if youare using a block plane you are working too hard, nodoubt about it. A #2 is a bit pricey, a Stanley #3 canbe bought for $32.00 from Sears. A #3 can be used toplane to final dimensions almost as easily as with a#2. Get a bench plane. You won't regret it.Darryl Hayashida --- Bob Maulucci wrote: I just wanted to publically thank Carsten (I did notforget you telling meabout this long ago), Darryl H., and Tom S. fortheir discussion on benchplanes for cane. I received my Lie-Nielsen #2 today,and I have been inNirvana planing out a quad tonight. It is the nicestlittle plane. My smallhands fit around the handle well, and just theweight alone allows you toget a beautiful curl of cane everytime. I am veryimpressed by its abilityto take off a lot or a wisp of cane.Thanks guys,Bob __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTaxhttp://taxes.yahoo.com/ from avyoung@iinet.net.au Tue Apr 9 02:16:57 2002 g397Gt422099 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 02:16:55 -0500 Subject: Re: LN #2 This is absolutely correct. I'm not concerned with the mechanics of it all enough to look into it too deeply, well actually I am and I think the fact the bench plane iron is sharpened at a lesser pitch combined with the chip breaker that can be set to varying distances from the edge of the iron that creates the bump that breaks the chip as it passes through the mouth which is adjusted with the frog assuming it's correctly adjusted which they most often aren't incidentally that behaves exactly like the adjustable throat of a block plane combined with the angle of attack due to the angle of the frog all combine to allow much easier planing and a hell of a lot less sharpening even with the tin foil plane iron offerings Stanley sell with their planes which would make that guy from Canada very happy to read even though this is in a different context to his normal argument so if a decent iron was used the results would be even better from a time between sharpening point of view. Add to this you're pushing with both hands and you'll be using a lot less effort to achieve the same results as with a block plane at this stage. Another advantage of using a bench plane and not a mini one but a decent sized one used in carpentry like a #3-#4 is after the strips are straightened a few passes with a bench plane level the whole strip which makes it sit in the forms much easier sooner into the whole operation. If the strips are over sized it only takes a couple of passes and that little problem is solved right away.I'm only new to this noded rod stuff but I straighten the strips and press the nodes at the same time using an alcohol lamp then clamp the strip to my bench and make a couple of passes with my bench plane just to make oneface level then plane the other face in the intermediate form. There is no need you've finished in about 3 mins then put the strip in the final form and do the same up to where you're confident of not over doing things before heat treating.I heat treat then finish with a 9-1/2. It's quite amazing just how much faster things go with a lot less effort.I've made a plane in the same dimensions as the 9-1/2 but designed as a bench plane. It's likely to be similar in size to the smallest plane or smaller LN make but I'm not certain.I wanted this for the final planing hence the small size. The angle of attack is higher than a bench plane, somewhere between a bench plane and the LN scraper, the iron is HSS.It works very well, just as expected but due to the increased angle of attack the resistance even with a sharp edge is difficult to handle so unless I can come up with an easy means of holding the strip the advantages may not be more than the disadvantages of using a 9-1/2 with a very sharp edge for the final planing. There's no reason to be surprised by all this though. Block planes aren't designed to plane along grain. Bench planes are. Block planes are well designed so if used with enough care and a sharp iron they obviously do work but they aren't ideal for the task. Tony At 11:40 PM 4/8/02 -0700, Darryl Hayashida wrote: It is difficult to convey how much easier planing iswith a bench plane. Let me put it this way - if youare using a block plane you are working too hard, nodoubt about it. A #2 is a bit pricey, a Stanley #3 canbe bought for $32.00 from Sears. A #3 can be used toplane to final dimensions almost as easily as with a#2. Get a bench plane. You won't regret it.Darryl Hayashida /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from avyoung@iinet.net.au Tue Apr 9 02:33:45 2002 g397Xi422526 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 02:33:44 -0500 Subject: Re: LN #2 Something I forgot to mention is the chip breaker must fit absolutely flush with the iron. There must be no gap or lip else the chips will foul in the gap and tear forward of the mouth rather than curl and shear.The best way to do this is sharpen the chip breaker just as you would the iron except unless you drop it on a cement floor it really only needs doing once a decade or so.When you do this be very careful and take just a few passes as you go and try it. If you are sharpening at the wrong angle or over do it you'll create a huge problem where you were originally just wanting to correct a minor one.LN planes may come without the need to do this as his gear is so good but it's worth a look.Also, while I'm at it the distance the chip breaker is set from the edge of the iron makes a difference too. It's a trial and error thing but basically there is a relationship between the depth of cut and the distance this is set just like the setting of the mouth in a block plane and lastly and no less importantly set the frog correctly.The frog setting adjusts the width of the mouth exactly the same way the adjustment of the mouth of a block plane works and is just as important except the iron is set forward or aft rather than a slot as per the block plane.If the frog isn't set right nothing else will work as well as it should. The frog also adjusts the centre of lateral iron adjustment and I like mine set slightly skewed of centre.A block plane "looks" more high tech and adjustable and is neat to use because of the way it fits your hand but the bench plane really *is* high tech even though the design is quite old and is actually a fine instrument when properly tuned. Tony At 03:23 PM 4/9/02 +0800, Tony Young wrote: This is absolutely correct. I'm not concerned with the mechanics of it all enough to look into it too deeply, well actually I am and I think the fact the bench plane iron is sharpened at a lesser pitch combined with the chip breaker that can be set to varying distances from the edge of the iron that creates the bump that breaks the chip as it passes through the mouth which is adjusted with the frog assuming it's correctly adjusted which they most often aren't incidentally that behaves exactly like the adjustable throat of a block plane combined with the angle of attack due to the angle of the frog all combine to allow much easier planing and a hell of a lot less sharpening even with the tin foil plane iron offerings Stanley sell with their planes which would make that guy from Canada very happy to read even though this is in a different context to his normal argument so if a decent iron was used the results would be even better from a time between sharpening point of view. Add to this you're pushing with both hands and you'll be using a lot less effort to achieve the same results as with a block plane at this stage. /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from OSEGAL@glcc.com Tue Apr 9 05:12:12 2002 g39ACB424267 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 05:12:11 -0500 with Novell_GroupWise; Tue, 09 Apr 2002 06:12:02 -0400 Subject: SHOP LAYOUT PLANS Does anyone on the list has a scale drawing/plan of a good Layout for a =highly efficient rod maker's work shop. An electronic version that could =be sent via mail would be very useful. Thanks and best regards, Oscar Does anyone on the list has a scale drawing/plan of a= Layout for a highly efficient rod maker's work shop. An electronic version = could be sent via mail would be very useful. Thanks and best regards, Oscar from petermckean@netspace.net.au Tue Apr 9 06:09:10 2002 g39B98425007 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 06:09:09 -0500 g39B8s162197; Subject: Re: OT, exploding chestnut Danny On the charcoal barbecue, my friend; in a pot they become grenades! IMHO, when you have cooked them properly and done a great job of gettingthered-hot shells off, they still taste like broiled wet wood, or, if you haveadded enough butter, like broiled wet wood with butter. [:-)] Peter from petermckean@netspace.net.au Tue Apr 9 06:21:35 2002 g39BLX425329 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 06:21:34 -0500 g39BLRu64773; Subject: chestnuts Danny I meant to ask this in my last note, but forgot. Are those bloody Kiwis MAKING you eat their damned chestnuts? No wonder we get so many coming over here; but only the smarter ones, I'mafraid. Recite them this mantra : "I have my rights,I know I got 'em;Stick your nutsRight up your bottom!" You will actually find that this suggestion does not produce as muchrepugnance among Kiwis as you might expect. Cheers Peter from petermckean@netspace.net.au Tue Apr 9 06:27:40 2002 g39BRc425612 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 06:27:38 -0500 g39BRUu66018; Subject: Re: SHOP LAYOUT PLANS Oscar I can assure you that if it doesn't have your wife's old Mazda parked =square in the middle of it, an old photo enlarger, a tomato drying =cabinet, the home brewing apparatus, a bed for the cat, a hi-fi, and a =shotshell reloader, it isn't even in the hunt! Cheers Peter Oscar I can assure you that if it doesn't = wife's old Mazda parked square in the middle of it, an old photo = tomato drying cabinet, the home brewing apparatus, a bed for the cat, a = and a shotshell reloader, it isn't even in the hunt! Cheers Peter from OSEGAL@glcc.com Tue Apr 9 06:36:16 2002 g39BaF425936 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 06:36:16 -0500 with Novell_GroupWise; Tue, 09 Apr 2002 07:36:03 -0400 Subject: Re: SHOP LAYOUT PLANS Peter, It will be build from the ground up. Brand new stuff mate! The old lady =gave me the O.K. to spend the dough and I am not going to miss the =opportunity. By the way, the home brewing apparatus is going on the =mezzanine floor!! Cheers to you too! Oscar "Peter McKean" 04/09/02 08:25AM Oscar I can assure you that if it doesn't have your wife's old Mazda parked =square in the middle of it, an old photo enlarger, a tomato drying =cabinet, the home brewing apparatus, a bed for the cat, a hi-fi, and a =shotshell reloader, it isn't even in the hunt! Cheers Peter Peter, It will be build from the ground up. Brand new stuff = old lady gave me the O.K. to spend the dough and I am not going to miss = opportunity. By the way, the home brewing apparatus is going on the = floor!! Cheers to you too! Oscar Oscar I can assure you that if it doesn't have= wife's old Mazda parked square in the middle of it, an old photo enlarger, = tomato drying cabinet, the home brewing apparatus, a bed for the cat, a = and a shotshell reloader, it isn't even in the hunt! Cheers Peter from bdcbfr@chartermi.net Tue Apr 9 06:51:20 2002 g39BpK426388 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 06:51:20 -0500 Subject: Re: LN #2 Woah! Have some de-caf, mate! I went into oxygen debt reading that secondparagraph. ;^) Brian----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: LN #2 This is absolutely correct. I'm not concerned with the mechanics of it allenough to look into it too deeply, well actually I am and I think the factthe bench plane iron is sharpened at a lesser pitch combined with the chipbreaker that can be set to varying distances from the edge of the iron that creates the bump that breaks the chip as it passes through the mouthwhichis adjusted with the frog assuming it's correctly adjusted which they mostoften aren't incidentally that behaves exactly like the adjustable throatof a block plane combined with the angle of attack due to the angle of thefrog all combine to allow much easier planing and a hell of a lot lesssharpening even with the tin foil plane iron offerings Stanley sell withtheir planes which would make that guy from Canada very happy to readeventhough this is in a different context to his normal argument so if a decent iron was used the results would be even better from a time betweensharpening point of view. Add to this you're pushing with both hands andyou'll be using a lot less effort to achieve the same results as with ablock plane at this stage. Another advantage of using a bench plane and not a mini one but a decentsized one used in carpentry like a #3-#4 is after the strips arestraightened a few passes with a bench plane level the whole strip whichmakes it sit in the forms much easier sooner into the whole operation. Ifthe strips are over sized it only takes a couple of passes and that littleproblem is solved right away.I'm only new to this noded rod stuff but I straighten the strips and pressthe nodes at the same time using an alcohol lamp then clamp the strip to my bench and make a couple of passes with my bench plane just to make one face level then plane the other face in the intermediate form. There is no need you've finished in about 3 mins then put the strip in the final form and do the same up to where you're confident of not over doing things before heattreating.I heat treat then finish with a 9-1/2. It's quite amazing just how muchfaster things go with a lot less effort.I've made a plane in the same dimensions as the 9-1/2 but designed as abench plane. It's likely to be similar in size to the smallest plane orsmaller LN make but I'm not certain.I wanted this for the final planing hence the small size. The angle ofattack is higher than a bench plane, somewhere between a bench plane andthe LN scraper, the iron is HSS.It works very well, just as expected but due to the increased angle ofattack the resistance even with a sharp edge is difficult to handle sounless I can come up with an easy means of holding the strip the advantages may not be more than the disadvantages of using a 9-1/2 with a verysharpedge for the final planing. There's no reason to be surprised by all this though. Block planes aren'tdesigned to plane along grain. Bench planes are. Block planes are welldesigned so if used with enough care and a sharp iron they obviously dowork but they aren't ideal for the task. Tony At 11:40 PM 4/8/02 -0700, Darryl Hayashida wrote: It is difficult to convey how much easier planing iswith a bench plane. Let me put it this way - if youare using a block plane you are working too hard, nodoubt about it. A #2 is a bit pricey, a Stanley #3 canbe bought for $32.00 from Sears. A #3 can be used toplane to final dimensions almost as easily as with a#2. Get a bench plane. You won't regret it.Darryl Hayashida /*************************************************************************/ AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from wendt@kingcrab.nrl.navy.mil Tue Apr 9 07:13:18 2002 g39CDH427018 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 07:13:17 -0500 g39CDAtx027897 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 08:13:10 -0400 Subject: Was Re: SHOP LAYOUT PLANS Now: Homebrewing Stuff! Mark At 07:30 AM 4/9/2002 -0400, you wrote:Peter, It will be build from the ground up. Brand new stuff mate!The old lady gave me the O.K. to spend the dough and I am not going tomiss the opportunity. By the way, the home brewing apparatus is going onthe mezzanine floor!! Cheers to you too! Oscar Oscar I can assure you that if it doesn't have yourwife's old Mazda parked square in the middle of it, an old photoenlarger, a tomato drying cabinet, the home brewing apparatus, a bed forthe cat, a hi-fi, and a shotshell reloader, it isn't even in thehunt! Cheers Peter from wendt@kingcrab.nrl.navy.mil Tue Apr 9 07:18:56 2002 g39CIt427309 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 07:18:55 -0500 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 08:18:47 -0400 Subject: Re: LN #2 g39CIt427310 Brian, Dang, ya beat me to it. I was starting to black out from B-LOC! That's a play on words from my old Air Force days - They had an acronym (military has an acronym for just about everything..) called G-LOC, stood for "G" induced Loss Of Consciousness, where aircrews would black out from too many "G's" on the aircraft, and not doing the anti-G straining maneuver correctly. We changed it to B-LOC, stood for Briefing induced Loss of Consciousness, where certain individuals (usually non-flyers...) would come in with their 150 page slide or Power Point presentation, and put everyone to sleep..... ;^? At 07:51 AM 4/9/2002 -0400, you wrote: Woah! Have some de-caf, mate! I went into oxygen debt reading thatsecondparagraph. ;^) Brian----- Original Message -----From: "Tony Young" Sent: Tuesday, April 09, 2002 3:23 AMSubject: Re: LN #2 This is absolutely correct. I'm not concerned with the mechanics of it allenough to look into it too deeply, well actually I am and I think the factthe bench plane iron is sharpened at a lesser pitch combined with thechipbreaker that can be set to varying distances from the edge of the iron that creates the bump that breaks the chip as it passes through the mouthwhichis adjusted with the frog assuming it's correctly adjusted which theymostoften aren't incidentally that behaves exactly like the adjustable throatof a block plane combined with the angle of attack due to the angle ofthefrog all combine to allow much easier planing and a hell of a lot lesssharpening even with the tin foil plane iron offerings Stanley sell withtheir planes which would make that guy from Canada very happy to readeventhough this is in a different context to his normal argument so if a decent iron was used the results would be even better from a time betweensharpening point of view. Add to this you're pushing with both hands andyou'll be using a lot less effort to achieve the same results as with ablock plane at this stage. Another advantage of using a bench plane and not a mini one but adecentsized one used in carpentry like a #3-#4 is after the strips arestraightened a few passes with a bench plane level the whole strip whichmakes it sit in the forms much easier sooner into the whole operation. Ifthe strips are over sized it only takes a couple of passes and that littleproblem is solved right away.I'm only new to this noded rod stuff but I straighten the strips and pressthe nodes at the same time using an alcohol lamp then clamp the strip to my bench and make a couple of passes with my bench plane just to make one face level then plane the other face in the intermediate form. There is noneed you've finished in about 3 mins then put the strip in the final form and do the same up to where you're confident of not over doing things beforeheattreating.I heat treat then finish with a 9-1/2. It's quite amazing just how muchfaster things go with a lot less effort.I've made a plane in the same dimensions as the 9-1/2 but designed as abench plane. It's likely to be similar in size to the smallest plane orsmaller LN make but I'm not certain.I wanted this for the final planing hence the small size. The angle ofattack is higher than a bench plane, somewhere between a bench planeandthe LN scraper, the iron is HSS.It works very well, just as expected but due to the increased angle ofattack the resistance even with a sharp edge is difficult to handle sounless I can come up with an easy means of holding the strip the advantages may not be more than the disadvantages of using a 9-1/2 with a verysharpedge for the final planing. There's no reason to be surprised by all this though. Block planes aren'tdesigned to plane along grain. Bench planes are. Block planes are welldesigned so if used with enough care and a sharp iron they obviously dowork but they aren't ideal for the task. Tony At 11:40 PM 4/8/02 -0700, Darryl Hayashida wrote: It is difficult to convey how much easier planing iswith a bench plane. Let me put it this way - if youare using a block plane you are working too hard, nodoubt about it. A #2 is a bit pricey, a Stanley #3 canbe bought for $32.00 from Sears. A #3 can be used toplane to final dimensions almost as easily as with a#2. Get a bench plane. You won't regret it.Darryl Hayashida /*************************************************************************/ AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from lblan@provide.net Tue Apr 9 07:38:38 2002 g39Ccc428059 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 07:38:38 -0500 with HTTP id 17467759 for ; Tue, 09 Apr2002 07:38:37 -0500 Subject: Re: LN #2 Awwww... come on Brian. Imagine that paragraph after half adozen cocktails, then add on a few more for Tony, then addthe accent.... that was relatively easy! Larry Blan On Tue, 9 Apr 2002 07:51:10 -0400"Brian D. Creek" wrote: Woah! Have some de-caf, mate! I went into oxygen debtreading that secondparagraph. ;^) Brian----- Original Message -----From: "Tony Young" Sent: Tuesday, April 09, 2002 3:23 AMSubject: Re: LN #2 This is absolutely correct. I'm not concerned with the mechanics of it all enough to look into it too deeply, well actually I am and I think the fact the bench plane iron is sharpened at a lesser pitch combined with the chip breaker that can be set to varying distances from the edge of the ironthat creates the bump that breaks the chip as it passes through the mouth which is adjusted with the frog assuming it's correctly adjusted which they most often aren't incidentally that behaves exactly like the adjustable throat of a block plane combined with the angle of attack due to the angle of the frog all combine to allow much easier planing and a hell of a lot less sharpening even with the tin foil plane iron offerings Stanley sell with their planes which would make that guy from Canada very happy to read even though this is in a different context to his normal argument so if adecent iron was used the results would be even better from a time between sharpening point of view. Add to this you're pushing with both hands and you'll be using a lot less effort to achieve the same results as with a block plane at this stage. Another advantage of using a bench plane and not a mini one but a decent sized one used in carpentry like a #3-#4 is after the strips are straightened a few passes with a bench plane level the whole strip which makes it sit in the forms much easier sooner into the whole operation. If the strips are over sized it only takes a couple of passes and that little problem is solved right away.I'm only new to this noded rod stuff but I straighten the strips and press the nodes at the same time using an alcohol lamp then clamp the strip tomy bench and make a couple of passes with my bench plane just to make oneface level then plane the other face in the intermediate form. There is no need with a bench plane you've finished in about 3 mins then put the strip in the final form anddo the same up to where you're confident of not over doing things before heat treating.I heat treat then finish with a 9-1/2. It's quite amazing just how much faster things go with a lot less effort.I've made a plane in the same dimensions as the 9-1/2 but designed as a bench plane. It's likely to be similar in size to the smallest plane or smaller LN make but I'm not certain.I wanted this for the final planing hence the small size. The angle of attack is higher than a bench plane, somewhere between a bench plane and the LN scraper, the iron is HSS.It works very well, just as expected but due to the increased angle of attack the resistance even with a sharp edge is difficult to handle so unless I can come up with an easy means of holding the strip theadvantages may not be more than the disadvantages of using a 9-1/2 with a very sharp edge for the final planing. There's no reason to be surprised by all this though. Block planes aren't designed to plane along grain. Bench planes are. Block planes are well designed so if used with enough care and a sharp iron they obviously do work but they aren't ideal for the task. Tony At 11:40 PM 4/8/02 -0700, Darryl Hayashida wrote: It is difficult to convey how much easier planing iswith a bench plane. Let me put it this way - if youare using a block plane you are working too hard, nodoubt about it. A #2 is a bit pricey, a Stanley #3 canbe bought for $32.00 from Sears. A #3 can be used toplane to final dimensions almost as easily as with a#2. Get a bench plane. You won't regret it.Darryl Hayashida /*************************************************************************/ AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from avyoung@iinet.net.au Tue Apr 9 07:40:06 2002 g39Ce4428278 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 07:40:04 -0500 Subject: Re: LN #2 Touch typing. You can type just ahead of think when in karma mode and there is direct conduit from brain to keyboard [:-)] TY At 07:51 AM 4/9/02 -0400, Brian D. Creek wrote: Woah! Have some de-caf, mate! I went into oxygen debt reading thatsecondparagraph. ;^) Brian----- Original Message -----From: "Tony Young" Sent: Tuesday, April 09, 2002 3:23 AMSubject: Re: LN #2 This is absolutely correct. I'm not concerned with the mechanics of it allenough to look into it too deeply, well actually I am and I think the factthe bench plane iron is sharpened at a lesser pitch combined with thechipbreaker that can be set to varying distances from the edge of the iron that creates the bump that breaks the chip as it passes through the mouthwhichis adjusted with the frog assuming it's correctly adjusted which theymostoften aren't incidentally that behaves exactly like the adjustable throatof a block plane combined with the angle of attack due to the angle ofthefrog all combine to allow much easier planing and a hell of a lot lesssharpening even with the tin foil plane iron offerings Stanley sell withtheir planes which would make that guy from Canada very happy to readeventhough this is in a different context to his normal argument so if a decent iron was used the results would be even better from a time betweensharpening point of view. Add to this you're pushing with both hands andyou'll be using a lot less effort to achieve the same results as with ablock plane at this stage. Another advantage of using a bench plane and not a mini one but adecentsized one used in carpentry like a #3-#4 is after the strips arestraightened a few passes with a bench plane level the whole strip whichmakes it sit in the forms much easier sooner into the whole operation. Ifthe strips are over sized it only takes a couple of passes and that littleproblem is solved right away.I'm only new to this noded rod stuff but I straighten the strips and pressthe nodes at the same time using an alcohol lamp then clamp the strip to my bench and make a couple of passes with my bench plane just to make one face level then plane the other face in the intermediate form. There is noneed you've finished in about 3 mins then put the strip in the final form and do the same up to where you're confident of not over doing things beforeheattreating.I heat treat then finish with a 9-1/2. It's quite amazing just how muchfaster things go with a lot less effort.I've made a plane in the same dimensions as the 9-1/2 but designed as abench plane. It's likely to be similar in size to the smallest plane orsmaller LN make but I'm not certain.I wanted this for the final planing hence the small size. The angle ofattack is higher than a bench plane, somewhere between a bench planeandthe LN scraper, the iron is HSS.It works very well, just as expected but due to the increased angle ofattack the resistance even with a sharp edge is difficult to handle sounless I can come up with an easy means of holding the strip the advantages may not be more than the disadvantages of using a 9-1/2 with a verysharpedge for the final planing. There's no reason to be surprised by all this though. Block planes aren'tdesigned to plane along grain. Bench planes are. Block planes are welldesigned so if used with enough care and a sharp iron they obviously dowork but they aren't ideal for the task. Tony At 11:40 PM 4/8/02 -0700, Darryl Hayashida wrote: It is difficult to convey how much easier planing iswith a bench plane. Let me put it this way - if youare using a block plane you are working too hard, nodoubt about it. A #2 is a bit pricey, a Stanley #3 canbe bought for $32.00 from Sears. A #3 can be used toplane to final dimensions almost as easily as with a#2. Get a bench plane. You won't regret it.Darryl Hayashida /*************************************************************************/ AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from wendt@kingcrab.nrl.navy.mil Tue Apr 9 07:58:12 2002 g39CwB428860 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 07:58:12 -0500 g39Cw3tx028573 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 08:58:03 -0400 Subject: Re: LN #2 Oooohhhhhmmmm, aaaaaooooohhhhhhmmmmm....... Gotta keep thatpyramid away from the keyboard.... ;^} mark At 08:46 PM 4/9/2002 +0800, you wrote: Touch typing. You can type just ahead of think when in karma mode and there is direct conduit from brain to keyboard [:-)] TY At 07:51 AM 4/9/02 -0400, Brian D. Creek wrote: Woah! Have some de-caf, mate! I went into oxygen debt reading thatsecondparagraph. ;^) Brian from avyoung@iinet.net.au Tue Apr 9 08:31:39 2002 g39DVa400217 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 08:31:37 -0500 Subject: Re: LN #2 Nah, pyramids are out, crystals mate, crystals [:-)] Tony At 08:58 AM 4/9/02 -0400, Mark Wendt wrote: Oooohhhhhmmmm, aaaaaooooohhhhhhmmmmm....... Gotta keep thatpyramid away from the keyboard.... ;^} mark At 08:46 PM 4/9/2002 +0800, you wrote: Touch typing. You can type just ahead of think when in karma mode and there is direct conduit from brain to keyboard [:-)] TY At 07:51 AM 4/9/02 -0400, Brian D. Creek wrote: Woah! Have some de-caf, mate! I went into oxygen debt reading thatsecondparagraph. ;^) Brian /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from julielamb@iinet.net.au Tue Apr 9 08:54:50 2002 g39Dsm401561 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 08:54:48 -0500 Subject: Re: LN #2 I actually keep a crystal ball at work, (for real) unfortunately sometimesit doesn't work. Ps. Forgot to mention about your waders. I have seen them & they lookintact. They were brown weren't they. That's how they turned out afterfumigation at Sydney Air Port.:~) When are you getting them back??Julie----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: LN #2 Nah, pyramids are out, crystals mate, crystals [:-)] Tony At 08:58 AM 4/9/02 -0400, Mark Wendt wrote: Oooohhhhhmmmm, aaaaaooooohhhhhhmmmmm....... Gotta keep thatpyramid away from the keyboard.... ;^} mark At 08:46 PM 4/9/2002 +0800, you wrote: Touch typing. You can type just ahead of think when in karma mode andthere is direct conduit from brain to keyboard [:-)] TY At 07:51 AM 4/9/02 -0400, Brian D. Creek wrote: Woah! Have some de-caf, mate! I went into oxygen debt reading that second paragraph. ;^) Brian /*************************************************************************/ AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from avyoung@iinet.net.au Tue Apr 9 09:02:54 2002 g39E2q402064 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 09:02:53 -0500 Subject: Re: LN #2 Ps. Forgot to mention about your waders. I have seen them & they lookintact. They were brown weren't they. That's how they turned out afterfumigation at Sydney Air Port.:~) When are you getting them back??Julie Bloody hell, I hope not! They began life as green. What did Mike do to make them treat them so much they changed colour? On second thoughts don't tell me, this is a family list. Tony /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from avyoung@iinet.net.au Tue Apr 9 09:14:31 2002 g39EES402893 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 09:14:29 -0500 Subject: Re: LN #2 Oh well that's a bit unfair don't you reckon Larry? Sometimes you've just got to strike when the iron's hot [:-)] TY At 07:38 AM 4/9/02 -0500, lblan@provide.net wrote: Awwww... come on Brian. Imagine that paragraph after half adozen cocktails, then add on a few more for Tony, then addthe accent.... that was relatively easy! Larry Blan On Tue, 9 Apr 2002 07:51:10 -0400"Brian D. Creek" wrote: Woah! Have some de-caf, mate! I went into oxygen debtreading that secondparagraph. ;^) /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from saweiss@flash.net Tue Apr 9 11:12:29 2002 g39GCT410472 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 11:12:29 -0500 g39GCRK112932 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 12:12:27 -0400 Subject: Re: SHOP LAYOUT PLANS Organization: Prodigy Internet Hey Oscar,How about a pencil sketch by a highly inefficient rodmaker of a =littered, inefficient workshop?Steve Does anyone on the list has a scale drawing/plan of a good Layout for =a highly efficient rod maker's work shop. An electronic version that =could be sent via mail would be very useful. Thanks and best regards, Oscar HeyOscar,How about a pencilsketch = inefficient rodmaker of a littered, inefficient workshop?Steve Does anyone on the list has a scale drawing/plan = Layout for a highly efficient rod maker's work shop. An electronic = that could be sent via mail would be very useful. Thanks and best regards, Oscar from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Tue Apr 9 11:33:32 2002 g39GXV412262 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 11:33:31 -0500 (authenticated) for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 09:33:28 -0700 Subject: Test --Harry Boyd http://www.canerods.com/ Bamboo Rodshttp://www.fbcwin.com/ Our Church from rcristant@isgtransport.com Tue Apr 9 11:42:14 2002 g39GgD413052 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 11:42:13 -0500 content-class: urn:content-classes:messageSubject: Setting Forms Thread-Topic: Setting FormsThread-Index: AcHf5YHxazDCubUuQlaAC9JYKNCIiA== Can anyone point me in the right direction? I am looking for thearticle on setting your depth gauge for accurate measurement. Thissystem uses steel rods, a dial caliper and the planning forms. Then asimple calculation and that's it. I know it has been posted before andI am sorry for asking, but it is probably the most accurate way to doit. Please reply off list. Thank youRobert CleanCleanDocumentEmail =0=0 MicrosoftInternetExplorer4 table.MsoNormalTable {mso-style-name:"Table Normal"; mso-tstyle- rowband-size:0; mso-tstyle-colband-size:0; mso-style-noshow:yes; mso- style-parent:""; mso-padding-alt:0in 5.4pt 0in 5.4pt; mso-para- margin:0in; mso-para-margin-bottom:.0001pt; mso-pagination:widow- orphan; font-size:10.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman";} setting your This system uses steel rods, a dial caliper and the planning = that’s postedbefore and I am sorry for asking, but it is probably the most accurate =way to list. Thank you Robert =00 from stoltz10@attbi.com Tue Apr 9 11:44:53 2002 g39Giq413370 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 11:44:52 -0500 Subject: Millward roughing beveller Has anyone made and used the roughing beveller from Bob Millward's book? =If so what are you opinions, it looks really easy to make. Thanks, Tim Has anyone made and used the roughing= make. Thanks,Tim from wiles@stargate.net Tue Apr 9 11:53:04 2002 g39Gr4414249 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 11:53:04 -0500 Subject: Re: Test Can anyone tell me if there is a list similar to this, but deals w/graphite type rods? At 11:32 AM 4/9/2002 -0500, you wrote: --Harry Boyd http://www.canerods.com/ Bamboo Rodshttp://www.fbcwin.com/ Our Church -->GaRRyDa'Burgh, PAIs It Fishin' Time Yet? from stoltz10@attbi.com Tue Apr 9 11:56:27 2002 g39GuR414621 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 11:56:27 -0500 Subject: Re: Santiam Fly Casters bamboo demo debriefing Chris is correct, it was a great time with a good turn out. It was fun tosee so many people out there casting bamboo for the first time. There were a lot of rods there to cast as well. It was exciting to cast somany rods including some of Dan and Kelly Brock's classics. As Chris said, Steve Kiley's power rods were a lot of fun and now I want tomake one for steelhead fishing. Chris also had some beautiful rods there as well including his fine casting7' of his own taper that has wonderful full wells grip which was inspired byan old Heddon rod. Thanks Don and Chris and the Santiam Fly Casters for such a great time. Tim Stoltz----- Original Message ----- Subject: Santiam Fly Casters bamboo demo debriefing I wanted to say thank you to Don Chen of this list andany other members of the Santiam Fly Casters thatmight be signed on. Bamboo rodmakers were invited tocome to their annual Fly Fishing Fair in Salem Oregonand talk about bamboo rodmaking and make rodsavailable for attendees to cast. I think it was agreat success. I have no idea how many people werethere, but steady casting went on all day long in theWillamette University gymnasium, and a steady streamof people made the rounds asking questions and makingcomments. I was able to cast some of Steve Kiley's powerhouserods, one based on an 8015 Guide taper and one on aGillum 8 wt. taper. They were so smooth and powerful,and begged to shoot line. Beautiful rods. Also Tim Stoltz's 7'6" 5 wt. with a silk line. Abeautiful blonde rod and smooth caster. Dan and Kelly Brock brought a line up of the classicsand let us cast an original Garrison 212, WinstonLittle Feller, F.E. Thomas 7' 7 wt. Atlantic SalmonMidge rod, and probably others I missed out on. There were some fantastic casters present, and theyreally showed me what can be done with a fly rod. Also several young kids were able to cast bamboo, andsome did an excellent job and showed some great skill. I had a great time, although I talked way more thanI'm used to, and those in charge of the fair did agreat job hosting the event. Chris McDowell __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTaxhttp://taxes.yahoo.com/ from lblan@provide.net Tue Apr 9 12:18:31 2002 g39HIU416165 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 12:18:30 -0500 with HTTP id 17494450; Tue, 09 Apr 2002 12:18:30 -0500 Subject: Re: Setting Forms That article was on Chris Bogart's site.www.canerod.com Larry Blan On Tue, 9 Apr 2002 12:42:16 -0400"Robert Cristant" wrote: Can anyone point me in the right direction? I am looking article on setting your depth gauge for accuratemeasurement. Thissystem uses steel rods, a dial caliper and the planningforms. Then asimple calculation and that's it. I know it has beenposted before andI am sorry for asking, but it is probably the mostaccurate way to doit. Please reply off list.Thank youRobert from jvswan@earthlink.net Tue Apr 9 12:32:37 2002 g39HWa417259 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 12:32:36 -0500 User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/10.0.0.1429Subject: Cork order Last call for cork! I got the quote from Pace today. $461 per thousand1/4" rings. That translates into 46.1 cents per ring of their top-of-lineselect quality cork. I will be placing an order for 6,000 rings today.That will leave about 500 extra for whomever would like to buy them. I have list because I made a mistake or if you haven't contacted me, please do soas soon as you can. I will also be ordering 925 1/2" cork rings from Chesapeake. I can't overorder those because of the $1.55 per ring expense. So, if you want any ofthose, please let me know today. I'll place both orders around 2:30 PM MDT today. Thanks to everyone who has contacted me. As soon as the cork comes in, I'lldivvy it up and ship it out. Thanks, Jason from k5vkq@ix.netcom.com Tue Apr 9 12:47:35 2002 g39HlZ418657 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 12:47:35 -0500 helo=kermit.psp.pas.earthlink.net) id 16uziP-0002Qm-00; Tue, 09 Apr 2002 10:47:33 -0700 by kermit.psp.pas.earthlink.net (8.10.2+Sun/8.10.2) id g39HlXV01164; Subject: Re: impregnation of bamboo Make sure it is Plexiglass. Home Depot sells Plexiglass and Lowes sells Lexanor something like that and will substitute if you don't emphasize Plexiglas. The stuff at Lowes won't work. Regards,Onisk5vkq@ix.netcom.com On Mon, 8 Apr 2002 19:06:39 -0500 Jojo DeLancier wrote: Some hardware stores, and most lumber yards sell it in various sizes. M-D I am preparing to make an Orvis 1 piece. I amconsidering impregnating it with acetone / plexiglass\.Where do you get the plexiglass ? Didn't Bob N writethis process up in powerfibers ? I looked in thearchive as well as powerfibers and got nothing (unlessit is the issue with a pass word that I can't open)thanks, from rextutor@yahoo.com Tue Apr 9 13:52:00 2002 g39Ipx425511 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 13:51:59 -0500 09 Apr 2002 11:51:55 PDT Subject: Re: Test GarryYes there is a message board on rodmaker magazineseehttp://www.rodbuilding.org/list.php?f=2good luck--- "Garry V. Wiles" wrote: Can anyone tell me if there is a list similar tothis, but deals w/graphite type rods? At 11:32 AM 4/9/2002 -0500, you wrote: --Harry Boyd http://www.canerods.com/ Bamboo Rodshttp://www.fbcwin.com/ Our Church -->GaRRyDa'Burgh, PAIs It Fishin' Time Yet? __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTaxhttp://taxes.yahoo.com/ from jojo@ipa.net Tue Apr 9 14:10:17 2002 g39JAF428720 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 14:10:16 -0500 helo=default) id 16v10N-0008Kk-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Tue, 09 Apr 2002 15:10:12 -0400 Subject: Re: impregnation of bamboo Good point, Onis. Plexiglas is an acrylic, Lexan is a polycarbonate. M-D Make sure it is Plexiglass. Home Depot sells Plexiglass and Lowes sells Lexanor something likethat and will substitute if you don't emphasize Plexiglas. The stuff at Loweswon't work. Regards,Onisk5vkq@ix.netcom.com On Mon, 8 Apr 2002 19:06:39 -0500 Jojo DeLancier wrote: Some hardware stores, and most lumber yards sell it in various sizes. M-D I am preparing to make an Orvis 1 piece. I amconsidering impregnating it with acetone / plexiglass\.Where do you get the plexiglass ? Didn't Bob N writethis process up in powerfibers ? I looked in thearchive as well as powerfibers and got nothing (unlessit is the issue with a pass word that I can't open)thanks, from jojo@ipa.net Tue Apr 9 14:12:23 2002 g39JCL429224 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 14:12:21 -0500 helo=default) id 16v12Q-0007uK-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Tue, 09 Apr 2002 15:12:19 -0400 Subject: Re: Test There is also one at www.rodguild.com and another at the Rodcrafter's site. Idon't have the URL forthat one, and it is a new board. You can get the URL from the Rodguild boardas there was a recentpost about this. M-D GarryYes there is a message board on rodmaker magazineseehttp://www.rodbuilding.org/list.php?f=2good luck --- "Garry V. Wiles" wrote: Can anyone tell me if there is a list similar tothis, but deals w/graphitetype rods? from wlwalter77us@yahoo.com Tue Apr 9 15:10:34 2002 g39KAX405162 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 15:10:33 -0500 Tue, 09 Apr 2002 13:10:33 PDT Subject: Lifespan of Polyurethane Does anyone know if a study has ever been done on thelifespan of poly? What's the longest anyone has had arod that is finished with Poly? Are the lifespansdifferent for different brands of Poly? Bill W. __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTaxhttp://taxes.yahoo.com/ from bob@downandacross.com Tue Apr 9 15:21:55 2002 g39KLs406070 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 15:21:54 -0500 9 Apr 2002 16:27:05 -0400 Subject: Quad Forms, last call Guys:Thanks to those who responded. I would like to make a last call forinterested parties by tonight, Tuesday.Thanks,Bob from partrick@intrex.net Tue Apr 9 16:03:21 2002 g39L3K408871 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 16:03:20 -0500 Subject: depth guage Please post replies to the list... I would like to know also... Thanks, Jerry Can anyone point me in the right direction? I am looking for the article on setting your depth gauge for accurate measurement. This system usessteel rods, a dial caliper and the planning forms. Then a simplecalculation and that's it. I know it has been posted before and I am sorry off list. Thank you Robert from atlasc1@earthlink.net Tue Apr 9 17:30:25 2002 g39MUP413311 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 17:30:25 -0500 ([209.179.148.247] helo=computer) id 16v486-00027E-00; Tue, 09 Apr 2002 15:30:23 -0700 Subject: Re: Millward roughing beveller Tim,Check out my bevler plans on Todds Site. It is very easy to make Adam Subject: Millward roughing beveller Has anyone made and used the roughing beveller from Bob Millward's =book? If so what are you opinions, it looks really easy to make. Thanks, Tim Tim,Check out my bevler plans on Todds = easy to make Adam ----- Original Message ----- Tim = Sent: Tuesday, April 09, 2002 = AMSubject: Millward roughing =beveller Has anyone made and used the roughing= easy to make. Thanks, =Tim from cristantr@rogers.com Tue Apr 9 17:52:11 2002 g39MqA414073 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 17:52:10 -0500 (InterMail vM.5.01.04.06 201-253-122-122-106-20020109) with Tue, 9 Apr 2002 18:52:00 -0400 Subject: Re: Millward roughing beveller mail.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com from [24.112.204.167] using IDat Tue, 9 Apr 2002 18:52:00 -0400 Robert Subject: Re: Millward roughing beveller Tim,Check out my bevler plans on Todds Site. It is very easy to make Adam Subject: Millward roughing beveller Has anyone made and used the roughing beveller from Bob Millward's =book? If so what are you opinions, it looks really easy to make. Thanks, Tim I'm not familiar with Todd's site, can = the url. Robert ----- Original Message ----- Vigil Sent: Tuesday, April 09, 2002 = PM beveller Tim,Check out my bevler plans on Todds = very easy to make Adam ----- Original Message ----- Tim= = Sent: Tuesday, April 09, 2002 = AM beveller Has anyone made and used the = easy to make. Tim from DCURTIS@satx.rr.com Tue Apr 9 18:19:33 2002 g39NJW416379 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 18:19:33 -0500 g39NJS15001859; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 18:19:28 -0500 Subject: RE: depth guage I think this may be what you are looking for. http://www.canerod.com/Articles/Index.html Darrin -----Original Message----- Subject: depth guage Please post replies to the list... I would like to know also... Thanks, Jerry Can anyone point me in the right direction? I am looking for the article on setting your depth gauge for accurate measurement. This system usessteel rods, a dial caliper and the planning forms. Then a simplecalculation and that's it. I know it has been posted before and I am sorry off list. Thank you Robert from jojo@ipa.net Tue Apr 9 19:22:27 2002 g3A0MQ420812 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 19:22:26 -0500 helo=default) id 16v5sW-000682-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Tue, 09 Apr 2002 20:22:25 -0400 Subject: Re: Millward roughing beveller http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo/ M-D Robert Tim,Check out my bevler plans on Todds Site. It is very easy to make Adam Has anyone made and used the roughing beveller from Bob Millward's =book? If so what are you opinions, it looks really easy to make. Thanks, Tim http://www.webbizbuilders.=com/Bamboo/ M-D Cristant I'm not familiar with Todd's site, = post the url. Robert Vigil Tim,Check out my bevler plans on Todds = very easy to make Adam Stoltz Has anyone made and used the = looks really easy to make. Tim from TSmithwick@aol.com Tue Apr 9 19:48:05 2002 g3A0m4424219 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 19:48:04 -0500 Subject: Re: LN #2 A couple weeks ago I had some correspondence with Ted Knott on holdingstrips of 2 sided carpet installers tape on the butt end of the strip to hold it in place. It seems to work. Once you get the strip in shape and start seriously planing, put about two inches of the stuff on the strip end, and push it firmly into the groove. I think there is a high tack version of the tape, which would probably be best. Obviously, don't plane down to the formswhere the tape is, get the rest of the strip to dimension, remove the tape, and finish planing that area. from harms1@pa.net Tue Apr 9 19:59:44 2002 g3A0xh426026 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 19:59:43 -0500 Subject: Re: Lifespan of Polyurethane Bill, I don't know what the lifespan of poly might be, but I still fish two rodsregularly that I built in 1974. These (and all my rods) were finished withpolyurethane and still look great, so I suppose the stuff is ok. Cheers, Bill ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Lifespan of Polyurethane Does anyone know if a study has ever been done on thelifespan of poly? What's the longest anyone has had arod that is finished with Poly? Are the lifespansdifferent for different brands of Poly? Bill W. __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTaxhttp://taxes.yahoo.com/ from weakley.hollow@gte.net Tue Apr 9 20:00:31 2002 g3A10T426240 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 20:00:30 -0500 Tue, 9 Apr 2002 21:00:22 -0400 Subject: Re: Setting Forms the article is a bit hidden. go to http://www.shentel.net/canerod/HTML/ClassIndex.html , and select the "rodmaking tools" link. it's at the top of the page. glm That article was on Chris Bogart's site.www.canerod.com -- -------------------- gary misch cdr, usn (ret.) "freedom is not free" >Frombob@downandacross.com Tue Apr 9 20:01:00 2002 Received: from g3A10x426443 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 From: "Bob Maulucci" , Subject: RE: depthguage Date: Tue, 9 Apr 2002 20:58:14 -0400 Message- ID: Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: 8.2.09/990901/11:28 -- ListProc(tm) by CREN Okay, time for Bob's stupidquestion of the nite. If you use the drill rod method for setting forms orchecking your gauges, what factor do you multiply by. Chris's article says tomultiply the drill rod diamter by 1.5. I have had pretty good results with a 45degree tip and my dial indicator, but why not get better accuracy? Greatreading for sure, as is everything on Chris's site. Thanks in advance. Bob -----Original Message----- From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Subject: RE: depth guage I think this may be what you are looking for.http://www.canerod.com/Articles/Index.html Darrin >Fromtedknott@cogeco.ca Tue Apr 9 20:09:01 2002 Received: from From: "Ted" , References:Subject: Re: LN #2 Date: Tue, 9 Apr MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 tedknott@cogeco.ca Sender: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu X- Listprocessor-Version: 8.2.09/990901/11:28 -- ListProc(tm) by CRENFurther to Tom's idea of tape I am going to try a thin, 2" long, coat ofpliobond on the planing form at the point where the strip's end would sit. Ithink this will provide enough friction to prevent the strip from slipping andcan easily be cleaned off with acetone. Since this part of the strip is cut offafter gluing I'm not going to worry about planing it a little undersize. >Fromjojo@ipa.net Tue Apr 9 20:15:25 2002 Received: from g3A1FO427562 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 (Exim 3.33 #1) id 16v6hj-00006S-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Tue,09 Apr 2002 21:15:20 -0400 Message-ID:From: "Jojo DeLancier" Subject: Re: Depth Gauge Date: Tue, 9 Apr rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu X-Listprocessor- Version:8.2.09/990901/11:28 -- ListProc(tm) by CREN This is a multi-part message the risk of raising some ire, here's a drawing I posted to the = List about twoyears ago. M-D From: "Bob Maulucci" Okay, time setting forms or checking your gauges, what factor do you multiply by.Chris's article says to multiply the drill rod diamter by = 1.5. I have hadpretty good results with a 45 degree tip and my dial = indicator, but why notget better accuracy? Great reading for sure, as is = everything on Chris'ssite. Thanks in advance. Bob ------ here's a drawing I posted to the List about two years = M-D advance.Bob ------ name="Image19.gif" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Content- Disposition:attachment; 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 ------ BambooRods@aol.com Tue Apr 9 20:16:20 2002 Received: from imo- g3A1GJ427686 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 r10.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v32.5.) id u.3a.24e3f7da (4363); Tue, 9 Apr 2002 Subject: Re: impregnation of bamboo Bob,Can you provide some info on about how much plexi and acetone. Also.what do you use as the storage while soaking. Rod tube ?Doug from tedknott@cogeco.ca Tue Apr 9 20:24:09 2002 g3A1O9428174 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 20:24:09 -0500 "Rodmakers List" , Subject: Re: depth guage You can't trust the point of your dial indicator to be a "perfect" point.I've checked mine and its short .008". The 1.5 figure used with a round pin is a function of the geometry of anequilateral triangle. With the pin sitting in the 60degree groove thedistance from the bottom of the groove to the top of the pin is always 1.5 xthe pin dia. This is true if the pin is tangent to the sides of the veegroove. A pin has an effective range of .75 dia to 1.5 diameter, so youneed different sizes. from rsgould@cmc.net Tue Apr 9 20:25:40 2002 g3A1Pd428391 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 20:25:39 -0500 Subject: Re: Lifespan of Polyurethane Hi Bill,Like many a fisherman I have a couple of favorite rods. Both were finishedwith Pratt and Lambert R10 Polyurethane varnish. One was made in 1984 theother in 1989 and the finish is still ok. More than likely the determiningfactor for how long the varnish lasts is how much the rod gets dinged up byconstant use and being banged around in the boat.Ray----- Original Message ----- Subject: Lifespan of Polyurethane Does anyone know if a study has ever been done on thelifespan of poly? What's the longest anyone has had arod that is finished with Poly? Are the lifespansdifferent for different brands of Poly? Bill W. __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTaxhttp://taxes.yahoo.com/ from rsgould@cmc.net Tue Apr 9 20:33:51 2002 g3A1Xo428923 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 20:33:50 -0500 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 18:33:15 -0700 Subject: Good news Hi Gang,Well finally the sun has broken through and I've gotten some good news = you might want to watch for it.Ray Hi Gang,Well finally the sun has broken through= gotten some good news for a change. I've just signed a contract with = Publications for my second book on cane rods. This one is due out early = year so you might want to watch for it.Ray from tausfeld@frontiernet.net Tue Apr 9 20:34:54 2002 g3A1Yr429076 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 20:34:53 -0500 0000 ,"Rodmakers List" , Subject: Re: depth guage I love math as much as the next guy, but.... I just set my forms a couple ofthou big, plane, mic, then make the appropriate adjustments. Even when all my stuff was bang on, I still needed to make adjustments. tom ----- Original Message ----- ; Subject: Re: depth guage You can't trust the point of your dial indicator to be a "perfect" point.I've checked mine and its short .008". The 1.5 figure used with a round pin is a function of the geometry of anequilateral triangle. With the pin sitting in the 60degree groove thedistance from the bottom of the groove to the top of the pin is always 1.5 x the pin dia. This is true if the pin is tangent to the sides of the veegroove. A pin has an effective range of .75 dia to 1.5 diameter, so youneed different sizes. from Grnmtrds@aol.com Tue Apr 9 20:40:55 2002 g3A1es429511 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 20:40:55 -0500 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 21:40:34 -0400 Subject: good news Ray, I am fairly new to rod making. I've read book No.1 3 or 4 times. It is very good and I am wondering how you are going to improve on that. Good luck,Jim from fcfp@ix.netcom.com Tue Apr 9 20:42:36 2002 g3A1gZ429737 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 20:42:35 -0500 helo=0zlaw.ix.netcom.com) id 16v784-0008G1-00 for rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu; Tue, 09 Apr 2002 21:42:33 -0400 Subject: LN #2 -- Scraper adaptation --=====================_2365259==_.ALT Given the discussion of the LN #2 and the Stanley #3 / #4, etc, I'm wondering what the reaction is to the "Veritas Scraping Plane Insert" as found on page 51 of the Lee Valley catalog. For planes using a 2" to 2 3/8" blade, it seems like a reasonable scraper option. The usual "no interest" bur curious disclaimer. f. _________________________Fred Bohls3519 Ada DriveMechanicsburg, PA 17050-2213 Home: (717) 732-5050Fax: (717) 732-2414 MAKE IT A GREAT DAY !!!!!! --=====================_2365259==_.ALT Given the discussion of the LN #2 and the Stanley #3 / #4, etc, I'mwondering what the reaction is to the "Veritas Scraping Plane reasonable scraper option.The usual "no interest" bur curious disclaimer. _________________________FredBohls3519 Ada DriveMechanicsburg, PA 17050-2213 MAKEIT A GREAT DAY !!!!!! --=====================_2365259==_.ALT-- from stoltz10@attbi.com Tue Apr 9 21:13:40 2002 g3A2Da400854 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 21:13:39 -0500 Subject: Fw: depth guage ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: depth guage At the risk of being beat up, why use a depth gauge in the first place?Test strips are cheaper, potentially more accurate and you are using yourcaliper for setting the depth of you forms and for measuring the finalstrips so you have consistency of your measuring device.----- Original Message -----From: "Ted" List"; Sent: Tuesday, April 09, 2002 6:21 PMSubject: Re: depth guage You can't trust the point of your dial indicator to be a "perfect" point. I've checked mine and its short .008". The 1.5 figure used with a round pin is a function of the geometry of anequilateral triangle. With the pin sitting in the 60degree groove thedistance from the bottom of the groove to the top of the pin is always 1.5 x the pin dia. This is true if the pin is tangent to the sides of the veegroove. A pin has an effective range of .75 dia to 1.5 diameter, so youneed different sizes. from channer@frontier.net Tue Apr 9 21:47:02 2002 g3A2l1402004 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 21:47:01 -0500 "rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu" Subject: Re: depth guage Tom;Thank you, you have restored my faith in mandkind and the power ofcommon sense!john Jill and Tom Ausfeld wrote: I love math as much as the next guy, but.... I just set my forms a couple ofthou big, plane, mic, then make the appropriate adjustments. Even when all my stuff was bang on, I still needed to make adjustments. tom ----- Original Message -----From: Ted ; Sent: Tuesday, April 09, 2002 9:21 PMSubject: Re: depth guage You can't trust the point of your dial indicator to be a "perfect" point.I've checked mine and its short .008". The 1.5 figure used with a round pin is a function of the geometry of anequilateral triangle. With the pin sitting in the 60degree groove thedistance from the bottom of the groove to the top of the pin is always1.5 x the pin dia. This is true if the pin is tangent to the sides of the veegroove. A pin has an effective range of .75 dia to 1.5 diameter, so youneed different sizes. from rmoon@ida.net Tue Apr 9 21:48:31 2002 g3A2mU402038 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 21:48:30 -0500 0000 Subject: Re: Fw: depth guage Good Tim. Why make things tougher than necessary. Test strips do the jobandare replaceable ad nauseum Ralph Tim Stoltz wrote: ----- Original Message -----From: "Tim Stoltz" Sent: Tuesday, April 09, 2002 7:12 PMSubject: Re: depth guage At the risk of being beat up, why use a depth gauge in the first place?Test strips are cheaper, potentially more accurate and you are usingyourcaliper for setting the depth of you forms and for measuring the finalstrips so you have consistency of your measuring device.----- Original Message -----From: "Ted" List"; Sent: Tuesday, April 09, 2002 6:21 PMSubject: Re: depth guage You can't trust the point of your dial indicator to be a "perfect" point. I've checked mine and its short .008". The 1.5 figure used with a round pin is a function of the geometry ofanequilateral triangle. With the pin sitting in the 60degree groove thedistance from the bottom of the groove to the top of the pin is always 1.5 x the pin dia. This is true if the pin is tangent to the sides of the veegroove. A pin has an effective range of .75 dia to 1.5 diameter, so youneed different sizes. --http://www.ida.net/users/rmoon from jvswan@earthlink.net Tue Apr 9 22:34:07 2002 g3A3Y6403422 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 22:34:06 -0500 User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/10.0.0.1429Subject: Re: Depth Gauge understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. --B_3101232841_7417612 Not being much of a geometry whiz, the formula didn=B9t make too muchsense,until I saw the picture. Thanks. Jason On 4/9/02 7:13 PM, "Jojo DeLancier" wrote: Okay, at the risk of raising some ire, here's a drawing I posted to the L= ist about two years ago. M-D --B_3101232841_7417612 Re: Depth Gauge Not being much of a geometry whiz, the formuladidn= Jason wrote: Okay, at the =risk of raising some ire, here's a drawing I posted to the List about two ye=ars ago. M-D Sent using the Entourage X Test Drive. --B_3101232841_7417612-- from jojo@ipa.net Tue Apr 9 23:18:29 2002 g3A4IS404698 for ; Tue, 9 Apr 2002 23:18:28 -0500 helo=default) id 16v9Yw-0004X9-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 00:18:27 -0400 Subject: Re: Depth Guage Re: Depth GaugeYou may thank my engineer/rodmaker friend in Sweden, =G=F6ran Eriksson, for that drawing, as he provided it to me. M-D Not being much of a geometry whiz, the formula didn't make too much =sense, until I saw the picture. Thanks. Jason On 4/9/02 7:13 PM, "Jojo DeLancier" wrote: Okay, at the risk of raising some ire, here's a drawing I posted to =the List about two years ago. M-D Sent using the Entourage X Test Drive. Re: Depth Gauge You may thank my = me. M-D Swan Not being much of a geometry whiz, the formula = much sense, until I saw the picture. = wrote:Okay, at the= raising some ire, here's a drawing I posted to the List about two = ago.M-DSent using the Entourage X Test =Drive. from petermckean@netspace.net.au Wed Apr 10 06:20:04 2002 g3ABK1409807 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 06:20:02 - g3ABJqc09918; Subject: Re: LN #2 That's fine, and will probably work beautifully. But it is as positive and at least as simple just to use a spring clamp tohold the strip; it makes for easy turning of the strip, and has theadvantage of being instantly relocatable on the strip. You can plane thewhole strip in one sweep, just as you would if you were holding it with yourfingers. All you have to do is elevate the planing forms an inch or two, which hasenough benefits that it is pretty well worth doing even without the springclamps. Cheers Peter from petermckean@netspace.net.au Wed Apr 10 06:28:08 2002 g3ABS6410133 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 06:28:06 - g3ABS0c11255; Subject: Re: depth guage Personally, I like the .1155" technique, using the calipers; I can doublecheck it any way I choose, and it seems to come out precise. There is no doubt that the points are not accurate for long. However, they may well be more accurate than my planing; but that'sanotherstory, isn't it? Cheers Peter from wendt@kingcrab.nrl.navy.mil Wed Apr 10 07:07:52 2002 g3AC7p410787 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 07:07:51 - g3AC7htx015742 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 08:07:43 - Subject: Honing Jigs Well, since I was never that great at sharpening my whittlin' knife whenI was a boy scout, ( got it sharp enough to slice fingers, though ) I figured I'd add a bit of precision to my plane sharpening techniques. I was on the Lee Valley page this morning, and wsa looking at the Veritas Sharpening System. Anybody out there have one of these? Pros? Cons? Should I look at other honing jigs? What other ones are available? Looks like I'd have to order it online, since none of the local hardware emporiums even knew what I was talking about, and had special order policies that'd make your head spin at the price gouging they commit..... Thanks,Mark from snooker_e@yahoo.com Wed Apr 10 07:19:40 2002 g3ACJe411210 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 07:19:40 - 10 Apr 2002 05:19:39 PDT Subject: Re: depth guage Would someone mind posting the .1155" technique again? I know I read itonce and thought I had saved it. But after reading Peter's post I lookedaround and couldn't find it anywhere. thanks,Eric --- Peter McKean wrote: Personally, I like the .1155" technique, using the calipers; I candoublecheck it any way I choose, and it seems to come out precise. There is no doubt that the points are not accurate for long. However, they may well be more accurate than my planing; but that'sanotherstory, isn't it? Cheers Peter =====New Smyrna Beach, FL __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Yahoo! Tax Center - online filing with TurboTaxhttp://taxes.yahoo.com/ from bhoy551@earthlink.net Wed Apr 10 07:46:43 2002 g3ACkg412148 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 07:46:42 -0500 Wed, 10 Apr 2002 08:46:34 -0400 ,, "Rodmakers List" , Subject: Re: Precision: Was depth guage FILETIME=[BF5B8060:01C1E08D] Hi, Tom, But how do you measure accurately? No matter how gentle I am, I can't measure a strip and get consistent results. The apex is just too delicate not to compress a few thou. I've used calipers with a light touch, a micrometer and a vee-block. Same inconsistent results. I never precisely know what the blank is going to measure until after sanding off the glue. It's usually close, but rarely dead-on. After 10 or so rods, I still haven't developed that touch that allows me to precisely measure strips. So I rely on precise setting of the forms. Problem is, I still haven't gotten the hang of knowing when to stop planing. Using a plane or a scraper, I get chatter from the iron scraping on the metal forms, resulting in oversize strips and uneven edges. Using a razor blade for the last few thou, I usually end up with undersize strips (somebody explain to me how THAT happens!). I hesitate to post this because I'm nowhere near the point of being within +- .001 on my finished blanks that so many strive for. Am I the only one who has to resort to the sanding block to get close? Bill At 09:35 PM 4/9/2002 -0400, Jill and Tom Ausfeld wrote: I love math as much as the next guy, but.... I just set my forms a couple ofthou big, plane, mic, then make the appropriate adjustments. Even when all my stuff was bang on, I still needed to make adjustments. tom ----- Original Message -----From: Ted ; Sent: Tuesday, April 09, 2002 9:21 PMSubject: Re: depth guage You can't trust the point of your dial indicator to be a "perfect" point.I've checked mine and its short .008". The 1.5 figure used with a round pin is a function of the geometry of anequilateral triangle. With the pin sitting in the 60degree groove thedistance from the bottom of the groove to the top of the pin is always1.5 x the pin dia. This is true if the pin is tangent to the sides of the veegroove. A pin has an effective range of .75 dia to 1.5 diameter, so youneed different sizes. from homes-sold@attbi.com Wed Apr 10 07:49:40 2002 g3ACne412445 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 07:49:40 -0500 ;Wed, 10 Apr 2002 12:49:31 +0000 ,, "Rodmakers List" , Subject: Re: depth guage Tom,I'm with you. I like things simple, matches my brain. Try this for simple:Drill a hole through your forms, tip side to butt side. Ream the hole to.100" With a 60Ÿ tip on your DI place the tip in the hole. Set the DI to.0866" Calibration done !Advantages:Don't have to look for the calibration tool. Its readily available no matterwhich side of the forms you are using.Works for me.Don----- Original Message ----- ;"Rodmakers List" ; Subject: Re: depth guage I love math as much as the next guy, but.... I just set my forms a couple ofthou big, plane, mic, then make the appropriate adjustments. Even when all my stuff was bang on, I still needed to make adjustments. tom from edriddle@mindspring.com Wed Apr 10 07:51:40 2002 g3ACpe412664 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 07:51:40 -0500 helo=oemcomputer) id 16vHZX-00064M-00 for rodmakers@mail.wustl.edu; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 08:51:35 -0400 Subject: Fw: 60 degree points (re: .1155) This is what I had saved re: .1155.Ed----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: 60 degree points Tim,The point on the 60* is only good if it is perfect. It is hard to keep it that way so I don't use the point tip at all. Set your calipers to .1155. Set the point in the .1155 space with the block flat on the caliper jaws, zero the depth gauge. This will give you accurate readings of the groove depth.Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com Tim Wilhelm wrote: In all the books and frequently on the list, mention is made that the 60degree point on your depth indicator can be quite fragile and needs to be in good condition inorder to remain accurate. I haven't seen any discussion on the list that would give me an idea of how frequently most of you arereplacing your points. I'm sure some of you bought your first and onlypoint from Noah's Shipbuilding and Industrial Supply - no financialinterest. (Sorry, I couldn't resist that one.) Others, I'm sure, may go through several a year. So, how often do most of you replace your points so I can get a feel for how "expendable" 60 degree points are? ThanksTim from dnorl@qwest.net Wed Apr 10 07:58:01 2002 g3ACw0413000 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 07:58:00 - 0000 (63.228.44.12) Subject: Lew Boyko Lew,Have a bad e-mail address,Call me!Dave Lew,Have a bad e-mail =address,Call me!Dave from wendt@kingcrab.nrl.navy.mil Wed Apr 10 08:02:02 2002 g3AD22413286 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 08:02:02 - g3AD1ttx016681 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 09:01:55 - Subject: Re: honing jigs Tom, It's about $31 from Lee Valley, and I was thinking about ordering system, I don't recall them ever mentioning creating a secondary the secondary bevel idea? Mark At 08:51 AM 4/10/2002 -0400, you wrote:Hello, that the first has a blade angle guide and the second consists of a nice is that once you have set an angle on the first and locked yourblade into the second, you can change the position of the roller to once set like this you are only sharpening a bevel on the blade that is a from saltwein@worldnet.att.net Wed Apr 10 08:02:26 2002 g3AD2P413355 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 08:02:26 - ;Wed, 10 Apr 2002 13:02:14 +0000 Subject: Re: LN #2/Clamping That's fine, and will probably work beautifully. But it is as positive and at least as simple just to use a spring clamp tohold the strip;.................... I use a toggle clamp that is screwed to the 2x6 that my form nests in on topof my work bench. This setup gives me a good height to work from and I canclamp the strip at virtually any location. Flipping the strip is very easyalso. With any kind of glue or tape I would be concerned about gumming up myplane. Regards, SteveIndependence, MO from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Wed Apr 10 08:14:34 2002 g3ADEX414549 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 08:14:33 - (authenticated) Wed, 10 Apr 2002 06:14:27 -0700 Subject: Re: Honing Jigs Mark, The plane blade holder is very nice. The little jig to help you set the anglesisnext to useless. (I've got one you can buy cheap) What else was in the"system"? Mark Wendt wrote: I figuredI'd add a bit of precision to my plane sharpening techniques. I was on theLee Valley page this morning, and wsa looking at the Veritas SharpeningSystem. -- -- Harry Boyd --http://www.canerods.com/ -- Bamboo Rods -- http://www.fbcwin.com/ -- Our Church -- from JNL123141@msn.com Wed Apr 10 08:20:34 2002 g3ADKX415156 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 08:20:33 - Wed, 10 Apr 2002 06:20:23 -0700 Subject: Re: Honing Jigs FILETIME=[78D16380:01C1E092] Mark,I agree with Harry. The blade holder is great but the angle setting jig =is like a pair of crutches with training wheels. I will sell mine cheap=er than Harry! ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Honing Jigs Mark, The plane blade holder is very nice. The little jig to help you set =the angles isnext to useless. (I've got one you can buy cheap) What else was in the "s=ystem"? Mark Wendt wrote: I figuredI'd add a bit of precision to my plane sharpening techniques. I was on= the Lee Valley page this morning, and wsa looking at the Veritas SharpeningSystem. -- -- Harry Boyd --http://www.canerods.com/ -- Bamboo Rods -- http://www.fbcwin.com/ -- Our Church -- rom: Harry Boyd Sent:We=dnesday, April 10, 2002 9:17 AM = ig to help you set the angles isnext to useless. (I've got one you ca=n buy cheap) What else was in the "system"?Mark Wendt http://www.canerods.com/&nb= -- from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Wed Apr 10 08:20:43 2002 g3ADKg415161 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 08:20:42 -0500 (authenticated) Wed, 10 Apr 2002 06:20:37 -0700 Subject: Re: Precision: Was depth guage Bill, Not long ago I was in the same boat. One thing that has helped memeasureaccurately is a set of calipers which slide very smoothly and easily. Ihesitateto mention that they are cheap digital calipers, from China, via Lea Valley. Butthey are very accurate.Using the ratchet mechanism, again set very lightly, on my micrometeralsoworks well.Use a light touch, and practice repeatedly. You might practice for a fewminutes trying to get repeatable measurements on something solid like a drillbit. I know that's got to be a frustrating problem for you. Keep looking for asolution and you will find it. Harry Bill Hoy wrote: Hi, Tom, But how do you measure accurately? No matter how gentle I am, I can'tmeasure a strip and get consistent results. The apex is just too delicatenot to compress a few thou. I've used calipers with a light touch, amicrometer and a vee-block. Same inconsistent results. I never preciselyknow what the blank is going to measure until after sanding off the glue.It's usually close, but rarely dead-on. After 10 or so rods, I stillhaven't developed that touch that allows me to precisely measure strips.SoI rely on precise setting of the forms. Problem is, I still haven't gottenthe hang of knowing when to stop planing. Using a plane or a scraper, I getchatter from the iron scraping on the metal forms, resulting in oversizestrips and uneven edges. Using a razor blade for the last few thou, Iusually end up with undersize strips (somebody explain to me how THAThappens!). I hesitate to post this because I'm nowhere near the point of being within+- .001 on my finished blanks that so many strive for. Am I the only onewho has to resort to the sanding block to get close? Bill At 09:35 PM 4/9/2002 -0400, Jill and Tom Ausfeld wrote: I love math as much as the next guy, but.... I just set my forms a coupleofthou big, plane, mic, then make the appropriate adjustments. Even when all my stuff was bang on, I still needed to make adjustments. tom ----- Original Message -----From: Ted List; Sent: Tuesday, April 09, 2002 9:21 PMSubject: Re: depth guage You can't trust the point of your dial indicator to be a "perfect" point.I've checked mine and its short .008". The 1.5 figure used with a round pin is a function of the geometry ofanequilateral triangle. With the pin sitting in the 60degree groove thedistance from the bottom of the groove to the top of the pin is always1.5 x the pin dia. This is true if the pin is tangent to the sides of the veegroove. A pin has an effective range of .75 dia to 1.5 diameter, so youneed different sizes. -- -- Harry Boyd --http://www.canerods.com/ -- Bamboo Rods -- http://www.fbcwin.com/ -- Our Church -- from wendt@kingcrab.nrl.navy.mil Wed Apr 10 08:30:39 2002 g3ADUc416035 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 08:30:38 - g3ADUVtx017153 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 09:30:31 - Subject: Re: Honing Jigs Harry, According to the web site, it included the jig, angle guide and instructions. The angle guide did look a little cheesy, but the holder did look very nice. Is it all metal, or combination of metal and plastic? Mark At 08:11 AM 4/10/2002 -0500, you wrote: Mark, The plane blade holder is very nice. The little jig to help you set the angles isnext to useless. (I've got one you can buy cheap) What else was in the "system"? Mark Wendt wrote: I figuredI'd add a bit of precision to my plane sharpening techniques. I was on theLee Valley page this morning, and wsa looking at the Veritas SharpeningSystem. -- -- Harry Boyd --http://www.canerods.com/ -- Bamboo Rods -- http://www.fbcwin.com/ -- Our Church -- from tausfeld@frontiernet.net Wed Apr 10 08:48:13 2002 g3ADmC417160 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 08:48:12 -0500 sender ) ,, "Rodmakers List" , Subject: Re: Precision: Was depth guage Bill,If you measure consistently, any small errors can be factored in. If youhave a mic with a vee machined into one side, you should not be crushing theapex with a light touch. I just use a micrometer (no vee) with a lighttouch, keeping an eye on the apex. After a couple of rods you find out yourglue and manufactoring factors addition. I think mine is .005". When planing I plane all the strips to my taper +.010". Then reset theforms to my taper. Set plane to take a .001-.002" shaving. Plane the strip.Mic the strip, make adjustments, re-mic, make adjustments, etc. When allset, I plane all of them, mic them all touching up as needed. I plane untilI just start to see shavings of metal.Honestly, IMHO, .001" accuracy does not need to be attained on the finishedrod, strived for - yes, required -no. On the strips, definately, its notthat difficult to achieve. There are some factors during the gluing process( thickness, binder set up,etc), and the subsequent sanding that effect the rod's final dimensions.But, I believe unless something whacky happens, it should not have greateffect on the action of the rod. I would never change a dimension on afinished rod, by sanding or otherwise, unless the rod cast horrible and Iwas attempting a salvage mission. After each rod, I sit down with a magnifying glass and go over it as if Iwas about spend big bucks on it. I write down all the "flaws". These arethe things I try to improve on during the next rod. Accuracy never came up. regardstom ----- Original Message ----- ; ; Rodmakers List; Subject: Re: Precision: Was depth guage Hi, Tom, But how do you measure accurately? No matter how gentle I am, I can'tmeasure a strip and get consistent results. The apex is just too delicatenot to compress a few thou. I've used calipers with a light touch, amicrometer and a vee-block. Same inconsistent results. I never preciselyknow what the blank is going to measure until after sanding off the glue.It's usually close, but rarely dead-on. After 10 or so rods, I stillhaven't developed that touch that allows me to precisely measure strips. So I rely on precise setting of the forms. Problem is, I still haven't gottenthe hang of knowing when to stop planing. Using a plane or a scraper, I get chatter from the iron scraping on the metal forms, resulting in oversizestrips and uneven edges. Using a razor blade for the last few thou, Iusually end up with undersize strips (somebody explain to me how THAThappens!). I hesitate to post this because I'm nowhere near the point of being within+- .001 on my finished blanks that so many strive for. Am I the only onewho has to resort to the sanding block to get close? Bill At 09:35 PM 4/9/2002 -0400, Jill and Tom Ausfeld wrote: I love math as much as the next guy, but.... I just set my forms a couple of thou big, plane, mic, then make the appropriate adjustments. Even when all my stuff was bang on, I still needed to make adjustments. tom ----- Original Message -----From: Ted List; Sent: Tuesday, April 09, 2002 9:21 PMSubject: Re: depth guage You can't trust the point of your dial indicator to be a "perfect" point. I've checked mine and its short .008". The 1.5 figure used with a round pin is a function of the geometry of an equilateral triangle. With the pin sitting in the 60degree groove thedistance from the bottom of the groove to the top of the pin is always 1.5 x the pin dia. This is true if the pin is tangent to the sides of the vee groove. A pin has an effective range of .75 dia to 1.5 diameter, so you need different sizes. from atlasc1@earthlink.net Wed Apr 10 09:13:55 2002 g3AEDt418592 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 09:13:55 -0500 ([209.179.147.105] helo=computer) id 16vIr6-0007LG-00; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 07:13:48 -0700 ,, , Archive rodmakers, file log0204.Part 1/1 (subpart 23/91), total size 5931474 bytes: ------------------------------ Cut here ------------------------------"Rodmakers List" , Subject: Re: Precision: Was depth guage Bill, This is how I do it. This comes from John Bokstrom. My dial indicator basehas a slot mill into it that sits over the strip. I use the flat surface ofthe tip of the dial indicator and place it on a glass plate or the surfaceof a the table saw to set the dial indicator to zero. While the strip sitsin the form you place the slot of the dial indicator over the strip and itwill measure the amount of the strip that protrudes over the surface of theform. When the dial indicator indicates zero you are right on the money. Younever have to use the caliper on the strip which means you do not have tolift the strip. This method also allows you to measure every inch of thestrip and not just at the stations. Hope this helps Adam Vigil----- Original Message ----- ; ; "Rodmakers List"; Subject: Re: Precision: Was depth guage Hi, Tom, But how do you measure accurately? No matter how gentle I am, I can'tmeasure a strip and get consistent results. The apex is just too delicatenot to compress a few thou. I've used calipers with a light touch, amicrometer and a vee-block. Same inconsistent results. I never preciselyknow what the blank is going to measure until after sanding off the glue.It's usually close, but rarely dead-on. After 10 or so rods, I stillhaven't developed that touch that allows me to precisely measure strips. So I rely on precise setting of the forms. Problem is, I still haven't gottenthe hang of knowing when to stop planing. Using a plane or a scraper, I get chatter from the iron scraping on the metal forms, resulting in oversizestrips and uneven edges. Using a razor blade for the last few thou, Iusually end up with undersize strips (somebody explain to me how THAThappens!). I hesitate to post this because I'm nowhere near the point of being within+- .001 on my finished blanks that so many strive for. Am I the only onewho has to resort to the sanding block to get close? Bill At 09:35 PM 4/9/2002 -0400, Jill and Tom Ausfeld wrote: I love math as much as the next guy, but.... I just set my forms a couple of thou big, plane, mic, then make the appropriate adjustments. Even when all my stuff was bang on, I still needed to make adjustments. tom ----- Original Message -----From: Ted List; Sent: Tuesday, April 09, 2002 9:21 PMSubject: Re: depth guage You can't trust the point of your dial indicator to be a "perfect" point. I've checked mine and its short .008". The 1.5 figure used with a round pin is a function of the geometry of an equilateral triangle. With the pin sitting in the 60degree groove thedistance from the bottom of the groove to the top of the pin is always 1.5 x the pin dia. This is true if the pin is tangent to the sides of the vee groove. A pin has an effective range of .75 dia to 1.5 diameter, so you need different sizes. from homes-sold@attbi.com Wed Apr 10 09:26:06 2002 g3AEQ6419429 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 09:26:06 - ;Wed, 10 Apr 2002 14:26:00 +0000 Subject: Re: Honing Jigs Mark, Everything in the package is made of metal. The honung jig is very well madeand works well. The angle guide is also made of metal. How accurate is it? I have no idea,but it does give you a place to start. I use the 15, 5 & 0.5 micron SiC PSA micro-abrasives mounted on a glassblock to hone the edge. I've found a shot of WD-40 on the abrasive helpskeep it clean. Having the secondary bevel speeds up the touch-up sharping, cutting lessmetal on the blade. I'm pleased with the whole system.Don----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Honing Jigs Harry, According to the web site, it included the jig, angle guide andinstructions. from jojo@ipa.net Wed Apr 10 09:36:53 2002 g3AEaq421333 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 09:36:52 -0500 helo=default) id 16vJDO-000391-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 10:36:51 -0400 Subject: Re: Honing Jigs What are you guys whining about? I never had any problems with the angle = I used the secondary bevel on blades. 35=B0 plus another 2=B0. Takes =more effort to plane, though. M-D Mark,I agree with Harry. The blade holder is great but the angle setting =jig is like a pair of crutches with training wheels. I will sell mine =cheaper than Harry! From: Harry Boyd Mark, The plane blade holder is very nice. The little jig to help you =set the angles isnext to useless. (I've got one you can buy cheap) What else was in =the "system"? Mark Wendt wrote: I figuredI'd add a bit of precision to my plane sharpening techniques. I =was on theLee Valley page this morning, and wsa looking at the Veritas =SharpeningSystem. What are you guys whiningabout? I = to use. I used the secondary bevel on = plus another 2=B0. Takes more effort to plane, =though. M-D John = Mark, mine cheaper than Harry! Harry Boyd the angles isnext to useless. (I've got one you can buy cheap) = System. from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Wed Apr 10 09:38:25 2002 g3AEcO421797 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 09:38:24 - (authenticated) Wed, 10 Apr 2002 07:38:19 -0700 Rodmakers List-serv ,Lew Boyko Subject: Re: Honing Jigs Mark, Lew... The Veritas jig is made from good metal; two types - brass and steel, Isuppose. Some folks do have a hard time getting repeatable angles. I madea crudejig similar to the one in Wayne's book; or the elegant one on Chris Bogart'swebsite. Using that jig seems to help keep things repeatable. In the last week or so someone mentioned another blade holder thatsqueezes from the sides, making it simpler to keep things parallel. I've seen them inthecatalogs but not used them. In theory, that setup looks good to me. Now, you might want to take all that I say with a grain of salt. I only usesharpening stones for roughing in the angles on my blades. 99% of mysharpening isdone on a leather wheel with diamond paste. Since I use the carbide tippedbladesthat I had specially made, I find that I only sharpen about every 36-48 strips.Just recently finished planing three 2/2 rods. I sharpened before starting,andprobably should sharpen again now that I am through. I work down to .005"oversized with one plane, then switch to a second plane and blade for thatlastlittle bit. No stopping to sharpen in between. Ever. Yes, I am bragging. But it's the truth.Harry Mark Wendt wrote: Harry, According to the web site, it included the jig, angle guide andinstructions. The angle guide did look a little cheesy, but the holder didlook very nice. Is it all metal, or combination of metal and plastic? Mark At 08:11 AM 4/10/2002 -0500, you wrote: Mark, The plane blade holder is very nice. The little jig to help you setthe angles isnext to useless. (I've got one you can buy cheap) What else was in the"system"? Mark Wendt wrote: I figuredI'd add a bit of precision to my plane sharpening techniques. I was ontheLee Valley page this morning, and wsa looking at the VeritasSharpeningSystem. -- -- Harry Boyd --http://www.canerods.com/ -- Bamboo Rods -- http://www.fbcwin.com/ -- Our Church -- --Harry Boyd http://www.canerods.com/ Bamboo Rodshttp://www.fbcwin.com/ Our Church from Grayson.Davis@valpo.edu Wed Apr 10 10:10:16 2002 g3AFAF424427 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 10:10:15 - g3AFAEo22344 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 10:10:14 - M2002041010101320352 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 10:10:13 - Subject: Re: impregnation of bamboo On Tue, 09 Apr 2002 10:47:33 -0700 k5vkq@ix.netcom.com wrote: Make sure it is Plexiglass. Home Depot sells Plexiglass and Lowes sellsLexan or something like that and will substitute if you don't emphasizePlexiglas. The stuff at Lowes won't work. Regards,Onisk5vkq@ix.netcom.com OK, I found some clear, unlabeled plastic which I believed to be Plexiglass. I made a syrup of it in acetone, and I'm soaking some wood in it now. How could I tell if this is actually Lexan? - Grayson -----------------------------------------Grayson DavisEmail: Grayson.Davis@valpo.eduValparaiso University from bhoy551@earthlink.net Wed Apr 10 10:13:32 2002 g3AFDW424678 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 10:13:32 - Wed, 10 Apr 2002 11:13:25 -0400 Subject: Re: Honing Jigs FILETIME=[42E54510:01C1E0A2] Mark, Lew, Harry, I use the side clamping jib that costs about $11. I have used the Veritas, but it has a screw that clamps the blade from the top and even with a jig to position the blade, it's very hard to keep it square to the stone. The veritas jig is very well made, and the eccentric wheel for secondary angles is nice. You do have to remember to return it to the primary position every time you use it tho. If you want to hone a secondary angle with the side clamp jig, I just put a shim under the wheel, on the stone, to raise it a few degrees. I keep an old worn out plane blade handy for this purpose. It only takes a few strokes on the gold stone to get a nice sharp secondary angle. Bill At 09:37 AM 4/10/2002 -0500, you wrote: Mark, Lew... The Veritas jig is made from good metal; two types - brass and steel, Isuppose. Some folks do have a hard time getting repeatable angles. I made a crudejig similar to the one in Wayne's book; or the elegant one on Chris Bogart's website. Using that jig seems to help keep things repeatable. In the last week or so someone mentioned another blade holder that squeezes from the sides, making it simpler to keep things parallel. I've seen them in thecatalogs but not used them. In theory, that setup looks good to me. Now, you might want to take all that I say with a grain of salt. I only usesharpening stones for roughing in the angles on my blades. 99% of my sharpening isdone on a leather wheel with diamond paste. Since I use the carbide tipped bladesthat I had specially made, I find that I only sharpen about every 36-48 strips.Just recently finished planing three 2/2 rods. I sharpened before starting, andprobably should sharpen again now that I am through. I work down to .005"oversized with one plane, then switch to a second plane and blade for that lastlittle bit. No stopping to sharpen in between. Ever. Yes, I am bragging. But it's the truth.Harry Mark Wendt wrote: Harry, According to the web site, it included the jig, angle guide andinstructions. The angle guide did look a little cheesy, but the holder didlook very nice. Is it all metal, or combination of metal and plastic? Mark At 08:11 AM 4/10/2002 -0500, you wrote: Mark, The plane blade holder is very nice. The little jig to help you setthe angles isnext to useless. (I've got one you can buy cheap) What else was in the"system"? Mark Wendt wrote: I figuredI'd add a bit of precision to my plane sharpening techniques. I was on the Lee Valley page this morning, and wsa looking at the VeritasSharpeningSystem. -- -- Harry Boyd --http://www.canerods.com/ -- Bamboo Rods -- http://www.fbcwin.com/ -- Our Church -- --Harry Boyd http://www.canerods.com/ Bamboo Rodshttp://www.fbcwin.com/ Our Church from goodaple@cox-internet.com Wed Apr 10 10:21:37 2002 g3AFLa425566 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 10:21:36 -0500 (InterMail vK.4.03.05.03 201-232-132-103 license180e1de7f543f89455b24e508f9cca39) Subject: Re: impregnation of bamboo Lexan is a lot tougher. The glass place tells me that if you score(try tocut part way through) the plexiglass will break at the cut much easier.Lexan is, again, a lot tougher so it is harder to break.Hope this helps alittle. Good luck, Randall R. Gregory check out the system I use toimpregnate(www.rifflewaterrods.com in the shop shots section)----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: impregnation of bamboo On Tue, 09 Apr 2002 10:47:33 -0700 k5vkq@ix.netcom.comwrote: Make sure it is Plexiglass. Home Depot sells Plexiglass and Lowes sells Lexan or something like that and will substitute if you don't emphasizePlexiglas. The stuff at Lowes won't work. Regards,Onisk5vkq@ix.netcom.com OK, I found some clear, unlabeled plastic which I believedto be Plexiglass. I made a syrup of it in acetone, and I'msoaking some wood in it now. How could I tell if this isactually Lexan? - Grayson -----------------------------------------Grayson DavisEmail: Grayson.Davis@valpo.eduValparaiso University from MasjC1@aol.com Wed Apr 10 10:24:00 2002 g3AFNx425813 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 10:23:59 - for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 11:23:49 - Subject: Re: Honing Jigs Mark, The angle setting jig is so poorly constructed that it flexes and does not allow a repeatable setting. Avoid it. A better way to set the blade angle is in Wayne's book using a depth jig. The blade holder works reasonable well especially after I glued a piece of fine sand paper to the circular hold down. Prior to this fix I would get a slipping blade occasionally. Mark Cole Mark, The angle setting jig is so poorly constructed that it flexes and doesnot allow a repeatable setting. Avoid it. A better way to set the blade angle well especially after I glued a piece of fine sand paper to the circular holddown. Prior to this fix I would get a slipping blade occasionally. Mark Cole from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Wed Apr 10 10:24:52 2002 g3AFOp425879 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 10:24:52 - (authenticated) Wed, 10 Apr 2002 08:24:48 -0700 Subject: Re: Honing Jigs Bill, Do you remember where the side clamping jig came from? Harry Bill Hoy wrote: I use the side clamping jib that costs about $11. --Harry Boyd http://www.canerods.com/ Bamboo Rodshttp://www.fbcwin.com/ Our Church from stoltz10@attbi.com Wed Apr 10 10:42:22 2002 g3AFgL427582 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 10:42:22 - Wed, 10 Apr 2002 15:42:16 +0000 Subject: Re: Honing Jigs Hi mark that is what I use and have been very happy with it.----- Original Message ----- Subject: Honing Jigs Well, since I was never that great at sharpening my whittlin' knife when Iwas a boy scout, ( got it sharp enough to slice fingers, though ) I figured I'd add a bit of precision to my plane sharpening techniques. I was on the Lee Valley page this morning, and wsa looking at the Veritas SharpeningSystem. Anybody out there have one of these? Pros? Cons? Should I lookat other honing jigs? What other ones are available? Looks like I'd haveto order it online, since none of the local hardware emporiums even knewwhat I was talking about, and had special order policies that'd make yourhead spin at the price gouging they commit..... Thanks,Mark from stoltz10@attbi.com Wed Apr 10 11:08:20 2002 g3AG8K429285 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 11:08:20 - Wed, 10 Apr 2002 16:08:14 +0000 Subject: Re: Precision: Was depth guage I am certainly no expert and my technique may be a little unorthodox buthere is what I do. As I mentioned before I have wood forms and use teststrips to set them. I purchased some digital calipers which I think help meget better reading because it is easier to read. I plane my strips till mystrips are with in .01 of final target, then I go to a hand held scraperusually a sharp plane blade and work from station to station scraping it tofinal dimension. Once all of the strips are done I tape them together andas I would a final blank. I measure each station across all three flats,write them down and average them. I them compare them to my target andhaveeither a plus or minus for each station, then go and make corrections asneeded. I do not think my system is the fast method, but it seem to workpretty good for me. I finished a butt section yesterday day and it measuredwith in .002 of my target at each station. Tim ----- Original Message ----- ; ; "Rodmakers List"; Subject: Re: Precision: Was depth guage Hi, Tom, But how do you measure accurately? No matter how gentle I am, I can'tmeasure a strip and get consistent results. The apex is just too delicatenot to compress a few thou. I've used calipers with a light touch, amicrometer and a vee-block. Same inconsistent results. I never preciselyknow what the blank is going to measure until after sanding off the glue.It's usually close, but rarely dead-on. After 10 or so rods, I stillhaven't developed that touch that allows me to precisely measure strips. So I rely on precise setting of the forms. Problem is, I still haven't gottenthe hang of knowing when to stop planing. Using a plane or a scraper, I get chatter from the iron scraping on the metal forms, resulting in oversizestrips and uneven edges. Using a razor blade for the last few thou, Iusually end up with undersize strips (somebody explain to me how THAThappens!). I hesitate to post this because I'm nowhere near the point of being within+- .001 on my finished blanks that so many strive for. Am I the only onewho has to resort to the sanding block to get close? Bill At 09:35 PM 4/9/2002 -0400, Jill and Tom Ausfeld wrote: I love math as much as the next guy, but.... I just set my forms a couple of thou big, plane, mic, then make the appropriate adjustments. Even when all my stuff was bang on, I still needed to make adjustments. tom ----- Original Message -----From: Ted List; Sent: Tuesday, April 09, 2002 9:21 PMSubject: Re: depth guage You can't trust the point of your dial indicator to be a "perfect" point. I've checked mine and its short .008". The 1.5 figure used with a round pin is a function of the geometry of an equilateral triangle. With the pin sitting in the 60degree groove thedistance from the bottom of the groove to the top of the pin is always 1.5 x the pin dia. This is true if the pin is tangent to the sides of the vee groove. A pin has an effective range of .75 dia to 1.5 diameter, so you need different sizes. from wendt@kingcrab.nrl.navy.mil Wed Apr 10 11:09:21 2002 g3AG9K429347 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 11:09:20 - g3AG9Dtx020129 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 12:09:13 - Subject: Re: Honing Jigs Lew, That's one of the things I was looking at. I was hoping the angle setting device would be something useful, but from the comments I've seen so far, the cheesy thing is pretty well worthless. So, Fellas, what other honing jigs would you recommend? Mark At 09:40 AM 4/10/2002 -0700, you wrote: Hi Mark, just talked to Harry, I not happy with my Veritas System, hard toget blade back on holder in same position as last time when resharpening.hold off in buying legts see what the soltion to this it. Lew from wendt@kingcrab.nrl.navy.mil Wed Apr 10 11:19:42 2002 g3AGJe400303 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 11:19:40 - g3AGJVtx020467 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 12:19:32 - Subject: Re: Honing Jigs Harry, I saw one at the Lee Valley web site:http://www.leevalley.com/wood/page.asp?page=33003&category=1,43072,43078&abspage=1&ccurrency=2&SID= Mark At 10:23 AM 4/10/2002 -0500, you wrote: Bill, Do you remember where the side clamping jig came from? Harry Bill Hoy wrote: I use the side clamping jib that costs about $11. --Harry Boyd http://www.canerods.com/ Bamboo Rodshttp://www.fbcwin.com/ Our Church from bhoy551@earthlink.net Wed Apr 10 11:28:00 2002 g3AGRx401065 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 11:28:00 - Wed, 10 Apr 2002 12:27:53 -0400 Subject: Re: Honing Jigs FILETIME=[A9D57560:01C1E0AC] Harry, Believe it or not, I got it from the Lee Valley/Veritas site. Item #60M07.01 A picture is at http://www.leevalley.com/wood/page.asp?page=33003&category=1,43072,43078&abspage=1&ccurrency=2&SID= Now costs $12.75. I've seen them at Lowes etc. bill At 10:23 AM 4/10/2002 -0500, Harry Boyd wrote: Bill, Do you remember where the side clamping jig came from? Harry Bill Hoy wrote: I use the side clamping jib that costs about $11. --Harry Boyd http://www.canerods.com/ Bamboo Rodshttp://www.fbcwin.com/ Our Church from bhoy551@earthlink.net Wed Apr 10 11:39:43 2002 g3AGdg402483 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 11:39:42 - Wed, 10 Apr 2002 12:39:36 -0400 Subject: Re: Honing Jigs FILETIME=[4CC5FE60:01C1E0AE] Lee Valley also used to sell a brass wheel thingy that has angles milled into the edge. You can use it to roughy determine the angle you want to aim for. After you get the angle by trial and error, make a jig that puts the blade at the correct exposure to get the angle you want. Jigs are described in some of the books and at Chris Bogart's site. I just use a thick piece of wood with the correct depth rabbet milled into one side.bill At 08:11 AM 4/10/2002 -0500, Harry Boyd wrote: Mark, The plane blade holder is very nice. The little jig to help you set the angles isnext to useless. (I've got one you can buy cheap) What else was in the "system"? Mark Wendt wrote: I figuredI'd add a bit of precision to my plane sharpening techniques. I was on theLee Valley page this morning, and wsa looking at the Veritas SharpeningSystem. -- -- Harry Boyd --http://www.canerods.com/ -- Bamboo Rods -- http://www.fbcwin.com/ -- Our Church -- from Darryl.Hayashida@phs.com Wed Apr 10 11:42:32 2002 g3AGgV402908 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 11:42:31 - pri.pacificare.com 2002 16:46:55 UT (Tumbleweed ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 09:41:25 -0700 Subject: RE: Honing Jigs Go to www.woodcraft.com, do a search for Honing GuideDarryl -----Original Message----- Sent: Wednesday, April 10, 2002 8:24 AM Cc: rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Re: Honing Jigs Bill, Do you remember where the side clamping jig came from? Harry Bill Hoy wrote: I use the side clamping jib that costs about $11. --Harry Boyd http://www.canerods.com/ Bamboo Rodshttp://www.fbcwin.com/ Our Church This electronic message transmission, including any attachments, containsinformation from PacifiCare Health Systems Inc. which may be confidentialor privileged. The information is intended to be for the use of the individualor entity named above. If you are not the intended recipient, be aware thatany disclosure, copying, distribution or use of the contents of thisinformation is prohibited. If you have received this electronic transmission in error, please notify thesender immediately by a "reply to sender only" message and destroy allelectronic and hard copies of the communication, including attachments. from bhoy551@earthlink.net Wed Apr 10 11:54:23 2002 g3AGsM404212 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 11:54:22 -0500 Wed, 10 Apr 2002 12:54:16 -0400 Subject: Re: Precision: Was depth guage FILETIME=[596FF560:01C1E0B0] Thanks, Harry. My $100 mitutoyo digital caliper does have a very stiff action. Maybe I should have invested less. The ratchet mechanism on my micrometer is still way too stiff not to compress fibers. I can get a much better reading with a very light touch, but it isn't repeatable A tech at Starrett offered to adjust the ratchet ordered a vee-block which I had high hopes for. With either a caliper or a micrometer, you still have the problem of making sure that the anvils are absolutely square to the strip. Any skewing will result in a bad reading. Hard to keep it straight when you are balancing a long strip, especially at the tip. I need another hand and much better eyes. The Vee-block just didn't work for me, though I'll admit I probably didn't give it as much of a workout as I should have. Fiddly to set up, and you had to take it off every time you wanted to measure something else. As you can see, I've invested a lot of money in trying to solve this problem. I hope it will resolve itself as I invest more time. bh At 08:17 AM 4/10/2002 -0500, you wrote: Bill, Not long ago I was in the same boat. One thing that has helped me measureaccurately is a set of calipers which slide very smoothly and easily. I hesitateto mention that they are cheap digital calipers, from China, via Lea Valley. Butthey are very accurate.Using the ratchet mechanism, again set very lightly, on my micrometer alsoworks well.Use a light touch, and practice repeatedly. You might practice for a fewminutes trying to get repeatable measurements on something solid like a drill bit. I know that's got to be a frustrating problem for you. Keep looking solution and you will find it. Harry Bill Hoy wrote: Hi, Tom, But how do you measure accurately? No matter how gentle I am, I can'tmeasure a strip and get consistent results. The apex is just too delicatenot to compress a few thou. I've used calipers with a light touch, amicrometer and a vee-block. Same inconsistent results. I never preciselyknow what the blank is going to measure until after sanding off the glue.It's usually close, but rarely dead-on. After 10 or so rods, I stillhaven't developed that touch that allows me to precisely measure strips.SoI rely on precise setting of the forms. Problem is, I still haven't gottenthe hang of knowing when to stop planing. Using a plane or a scraper, Igetchatter from the iron scraping on the metal forms, resulting in oversizestrips and uneven edges. Using a razor blade for the last few thou, Iusually end up with undersize strips (somebody explain to me how THAThappens!). I hesitate to post this because I'm nowhere near the point of being within+- .001 on my finished blanks that so many strive for. Am I the only onewho has to resort to the sanding block to get close? Bill At 09:35 PM 4/9/2002 -0400, Jill and Tom Ausfeld wrote: I love math as much as the next guy, but.... I just set my forms a couple of thou big, plane, mic, then make the appropriate adjustments. Even when all my stuff was bang on, I still needed to make adjustments. tom ----- Original Message -----From: Ted List; Sent: Tuesday, April 09, 2002 9:21 PMSubject: Re: depth guage You can't trust the point of your dial indicator to be a "perfect" point. I've checked mine and its short .008". The 1.5 figure used with a round pin is a function of the geometry of an equilateral triangle. With the pin sitting in the 60degree groove thedistance from the bottom of the groove to the top of the pin is always 1.5 x the pin dia. This is true if the pin is tangent to the sides of the vee groove. A pin has an effective range of .75 dia to 1.5 diameter, so you need different sizes. -- -- Harry Boyd --http://www.canerods.com/ -- Bamboo Rods -- http://www.fbcwin.com/ -- Our Church -- from lkoeser@ceva.net Wed Apr 10 12:08:12 2002 g3AH8A405455 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 12:08:11 -0500 Wed, 10 Apr 2002 07:50:46 -0400 ,, ,"Rodmakers List" , Subject: Re: Precision: Was depth guage Hi, BillUsing a razor blade, which is flexible, there is a tendency for a curve todevelop which will cut below the planing form. Use a Sears scraping toolwhich has a rigid blade. You may get better results.Lee Koeser from canazon@mindspring.com Wed Apr 10 12:14:13 2002 g3AHEC405997 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 12:14:13 -0500 helo=oemcomputer) id 16vLfY-0002BN-00; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 13:14:04 -0400 Subject: Re: Precision: Was depth guage bill,i have two calipers. i leave the v block on one. the only problem i havewith the block, is taking measurements smaller than 35 thou. anybody knowwhy that is?mike----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Precision: Was depth guage Thanks, Harry. My $100 mitutoyo digital caliper does have a very stiff action. Maybe Ishould have invested less. The ratchet mechanism on my micrometer is still way too stiff not tocompress fibers. I can get a much better reading with a very light touch,but it isn't repeatable A tech at Starrett offered to adjust the ratchet ordered a vee-block which I had high hopes for. With either a caliper or amicrometer, you still have the problem of making sure that the anvils areabsolutely square to the strip. Any skewing will result in a bad reading.Hard to keep it straight when you are balancing a long strip, especially at the tip. I need another hand and much better eyes. The Vee-block just didn't work for me, though I'll admit I probably didn'tgive it as much of a workout as I should have. Fiddly to set up, and youhad to take it off every time you wanted to measure something else. As you can see, I've invested a lot of money in trying to solve thisproblem. I hope it will resolve itself as I invest more time. bh At 08:17 AM 4/10/2002 -0500, you wrote: Bill, Not long ago I was in the same boat. One thing that has helped memeasureaccurately is a set of calipers which slide very smoothly and easily. Ihesitateto mention that they are cheap digital calipers, from China, via LeaValley. Butthey are very accurate.Using the ratchet mechanism, again set very lightly, on my micrometer alsoworks well.Use a light touch, and practice repeatedly. You might practice for a few minutes trying to get repeatable measurements on something solid like adrill bit. I know that's got to be a frustrating problem for you. Keep looking solution and you will find it. Harry Bill Hoy wrote: Hi, Tom, But how do you measure accurately? No matter how gentle I am, I can'tmeasure a strip and get consistent results. The apex is just too delicate not to compress a few thou. I've used calipers with a light touch, amicrometer and a vee-block. Same inconsistent results. I never precisely know what the blank is going to measure until after sanding off the glue. It's usually close, but rarely dead-on. After 10 or so rods, I stillhaven't developed that touch that allows me to precisely measure strips. So I rely on precise setting of the forms. Problem is, I still haven't gotten the hang of knowing when to stop planing. Using a plane or a scraper, I get chatter from the iron scraping on the metal forms, resulting in oversize strips and uneven edges. Using a razor blade for the last few thou, Iusually end up with undersize strips (somebody explain to me how THAThappens!). I hesitate to post this because I'm nowhere near the point of being within +- .001 on my finished blanks that so many strive for. Am I the only one who has to resort to the sanding block to get close? Bill At 09:35 PM 4/9/2002 -0400, Jill and Tom Ausfeld wrote: I love math as much as the next guy, but.... I just set my forms a couple of thou big, plane, mic, then make the appropriate adjustments. Even when all my stuff was bang on, I still needed to make adjustments. tom ----- Original Message -----From: Ted List; Sent: Tuesday, April 09, 2002 9:21 PMSubject: Re: depth guage You can't trust the point of your dial indicator to be a "perfect" point. I've checked mine and its short .008". The 1.5 figure used with a round pin is a function of the geometry of an equilateral triangle. With the pin sitting in the 60degree groove the distance from the bottom of the groove to the top of the pin is always 1.5 x the pin dia. This is true if the pin is tangent to the sides of the vee groove. A pin has an effective range of .75 dia to 1.5 diameter, so you need different sizes. -- -- Harry Boyd --http://www.canerods.com/ -- Bamboo Rods -- http://www.fbcwin.com/ -- Our Church -- from Darryl.Hayashida@phs.com Wed Apr 10 12:21:37 2002 g3AHLa406648 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 12:21:36 - pri.pacificare.com 2002 17:26:00 UT (Tumbleweed ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 10:20:26 -0700 Subject: RE: Honing Jigs I have both, the Veritas top clamp style and the side clamp style. The sideclamp style doesn't allow you to sharpen a LN scraper at 60 degrees, wherethe top clamp style does. The side clamp is a lot better for plane blades,the top clamp style is the only one I have found that can sharpen thethicker plane bodied scraper blades.Darryl Hayashida -----Original Message----- Sent: Wednesday, April 10, 2002 9:17 AM Cc: rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: RE: Honing Jigs Go to www.woodcraft.com, do a search for Honing GuideDarryl -----Original Message----- Sent: Wednesday, April 10, 2002 8:24 AM Cc: rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Re: Honing Jigs Bill, Do you remember where the side clamping jig came from? Harry Bill Hoy wrote: I use the side clamping jib that costs about $11. --Harry Boyd http://www.canerods.com/ Bamboo Rodshttp://www.fbcwin.com/ Our Church This electronic message transmission, including any attachments, containsinformation from PacifiCare Health Systems Inc. which may be confidentialor privileged. The information is intended to be for the use of theindividual or entity named above. If you are not the intended recipient,be aware that any disclosure, copying, distribution or use of the contentsof this information is prohibited. If you have received this electronic transmission in error, please notifythe sender immediately by a "reply to sender only" message and destroy allelectronic and hard copies of the communication, including attachments. This electronic message transmission, including any attachments, containsinformation from PacifiCare Health Systems Inc. which may be confidentialor privileged. The information is intended to be for the use of the individualor entity named above. If you are not the intended recipient, be aware thatany disclosure, copying, distribution or use of the contents of thisinformation is prohibited. If you have received this electronic transmission in error, please notify thesender immediately by a "reply to sender only" message and destroy allelectronic and hard copies of the communication, including attachments. from quiet_reed@hotmail.com Wed Apr 10 12:22:32 2002 g3AHMW406722 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 12:22:32 - Wed, 10 Apr 2002 10:22:27 -0700 Wed, 10 Apr 2002 17:22:27 GMT Subject: Re: casting demo FILETIME=[49C49680:01C1E0B4] Hi: Chris' report is better than I could say. Besides, I still didn't get a chance to cast all the rods so maybe we'll have to do this again for me to catch up. The rodmakers that showed up were great. I am and was amazed at the confidence they had in allowing anyone who chose to cast their rods. So thanks to Chris McDowell, Tim Stoltz, Bill Bennett, Stephen Kiley, Gary Lohkamp and Bob Rehwalt. Also a special thanks to Dan and Kelley Brock for bringing their collection of antique rods and reels. An aspect that hasn't been touched on is the fact that the three fly shops in Salem also brought a collection of their graphite and fibreglass rods for people to cast. I really believe that people were given the broadest opportunity to compare the three types of rods as well as within each grouping. And it was fun for everyone. It was an amazing sight to see people in the gymnasium - as many as 20-25 casters on each sideline - casting rods throughout the morning and afternoon. I believe that the Santiam Fly Casters would like to repeat this event with the bamboo rod community. Also, there was some talk that similar events could be held in other parts of Oregon, perhaps Bend/Sunriver, Eugene, Portland, or Medford/Ashland. If you are interested, please give me a call or email and we can talk about it. Thanks to everyone who helped. Don _________________________________________________________________Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com from lblan@provide.net Wed Apr 10 12:36:03 2002 g3AHa2407711 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 12:36:02 - with HTTP id 17614846; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 12:36:02 -0500 Subject: Re: Honing Jigs I'm rather partial to the Fasttrak fixture. They sell adepth gauge made for use with the system that is actuallyan adjustable version of the homemade jigs we use. Thisfixture is made to work in conjuction with a grindingwheel, but works well for plane and chisel blades. Thereare several different ways of clamping the blade to thefixture as well http://www.woodworkingfasttrak.com/detail.asp?pid=92&parid=10 Larry Blan On Wed, 10 Apr 2002 12:09:14 -0400Mark Wendt wrote: Lew, That's one of the things I was looking at. I washoping the angle setting device would be something useful, but from thecomments I've seen so far, the cheesy thing is prettywell worthless. So, Fellas, what other honing jigswould you recommend? Mark At 09:40 AM 4/10/2002 -0700, you wrote: Hi Mark, just talked to Harry, I not happy with my Veritas System, hard to get blade back on holder in same position as last time when resharpening. hold off in buying legts see what the soltion to this it. Lew from caneman@clnk.com Wed Apr 10 13:38:31 2002 g3AIcV411870 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 13:38:31 - (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35) Subject: Re: impregnation of bamboo Grayson,If it melted in the Acetone, then it's plexi... Lexan doesn't cooperate! Later,Bob R.L. Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Cane Flyrodshttp://www.caneflyrod.com- ---- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: impregnation of bamboo On Tue, 09 Apr 2002 10:47:33 -0700 k5vkq@ix.netcom.comwrote: Make sure it is Plexiglass. Home Depot sells Plexiglass and Lowes sells Lexan or something like that and will substitute if you don't emphasizePlexiglas. The stuff at Lowes won't work. Regards,Onisk5vkq@ix.netcom.com OK, I found some clear, unlabeled plastic which I believedto be Plexiglass. I made a syrup of it in acetone, and I'msoaking some wood in it now. How could I tell if this isactually Lexan? - Grayson -----------------------------------------Grayson DavisEmail: Grayson.Davis@valpo.eduValparaiso University from rcristant@isgtransport.com Wed Apr 10 14:27:52 2002 g3AJRp415746 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 14:27:51 - content-class: urn:content-classes:messageSubject: Test Thread-Topic: TestThread-Index: AcHgxc/ODg8oaqwmSxK4aH1B38y7Eg== TEST CleanCleanDocumentEmail =0=0 MicrosoftInternetExplorer4 table.MsoNormalTable {mso-style-name:"Table Normal"; mso-tstyle- rowband-size:0; mso-tstyle-colband-size:0; mso-style-noshow:yes; mso- style-parent:""; mso-padding-alt:0in 5.4pt 0in 5.4pt; mso-para- margin:0in; mso-para-margin-bottom:.0001pt; mso-pagination:widow- orphan; font-size:10.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman";} TEST =00 from flytyr@southshore.com Wed Apr 10 15:11:31 2002 g3AKBU419275 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 15:11:30 - g3AKBPO21957 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 15:11:25 -0500 Subject: Lew Boyko Lew,I replied to your earlier message did not hearback from you. Don't know if you received it.Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com from flytyr@southshore.com Wed Apr 10 15:47:59 2002 g3AKlw421535 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 15:47:58 - g3AKluO31478 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 15:47:56 -0500 Subject: Holding the strip for planening Someone mentioned using double sided tape. Iplaned on getting back to you off list but I guessI d keyed the message. Don't remember who it was.I tried this sometime last year but found it wasonly good for about two strips before it startedslipping.What I wanted to know what brand of tape you areusing and how long does it last. I may give itanother try. As for now the spring clamp isworking pretty well.Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com from rcrensha@midsouth.rr.com Wed Apr 10 16:04:02 2002 g3AL41422476 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 16:04:02 -0500 g3AL3w907025; "Harry Boyd ;" , Subject: Re: Precision: Was depth guage The best set up I've found on the V-block (which I love) is to put it on adigital caliper with a memory function. The caliper I use is the MititoyoDigicalc Absolut (not sure of model #). It is not the top of the line butstill costs about $100 bucks on sale in the tool flyers which you willrecieve every two weeks if you buy anything. I think there are fine digitalcalipers for less, perhaps someone will speak out. a. Mount the V-block taking time to ensure that the top of the caliperwhich goes into the V-block is 'square' to the 60* triangle (notnecessarily the bottom of the slot!). It took awhile to set it up right andI never take it off.b. Now put a known test strip in the block and zero the caliper. (example:Using a .200" strip, put it in then zero. Should now read 0.0000" with thestrip in)c. Take the test strip out and run the caliper down to the negative numberof the test strip. (example: pull the strip, run the caliper down till itreads - 0.2000")d. WITHOUT MOVING IT, Zero it again.(ex.: zero it to read 0.000")e. Measure the test strip again and the calipers should read themeasurementof the test strip. (ex.: should now read 0.2000" with the test strip in.) OR, use a ground drill rod or ground dowel pin and use trigonometry tocalculate what the reading should be (like you would in setting forms with adowel/drill rod). Use the method above only substitute the rod for the teststrip. Of course my rods look like hell. Rick C. from TSmithwick@aol.com Wed Apr 10 17:18:39 2002 g3AMIc425834 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 17:18:38 - Subject: Re: Holding the strip for planening In a message dated 4/10/2 8:48:40 PM, flytyr@southshore.com writes: Tony - I was only using about 2" of tape. I don't have any problem with replacing it every couple strips. I don't know the brand I was using, It's just something I had around. I think I have seen versions of it that are "high tack strength". I'm going to try to find some next time around. I don't see this as the total answer, just a way to avoid messing with clamps when final planing and speeding up the process a bit. from saltwein@worldnet.att.net Wed Apr 10 17:20:01 2002 g3AMK1426054 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 17:20:01 -0500 Subject: test test from channer@frontier.net Wed Apr 10 17:45:40 2002 g3AMjd427075 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 17:45:39 -0500 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 16:45:38 -0600 Subject: Re: Precision: Was depth guage Bill;You will get much more accurate readings from even the cheapest dialcaliper if you don't even bother measureing the strips from the enamelside to the pith apex. This is the softest section of the stip and ameasurement there is pretty much meaningless. Measure with the two sidesas the base of the triangle and a side/enamel corner as the apex. Itwill also help you to get your finsihed section dimensions where youwant them if you make your sections long enough to trim them where thenumbers match the taper you are looking for. I typically make mine atleast 2" longer at each end, if not more at the but end. This is enough,with the glue I use and the tolerances I try to maintain, to let me getas close as I want to the desired taper, unless I think it could do witha bit more "wood", in which case I just trim em where I feel like it andto blazes with the original. Most old tapers need a bit more gumption john Bill Hoy wrote: Thanks, Harry. My $100 mitutoyo digital caliper does have a very stiff action. Maybe Ishould have invested less. The ratchet mechanism on my micrometer is still way too stiff not tocompress fibers. I can get a much better reading with a very light touch,but it isn't repeatable A tech at Starrett offered to adjust the ratchet ordered a vee-block which I had high hopes for. With either a caliper or amicrometer, you still have the problem of making sure that the anvils areabsolutely square to the strip. Any skewing will result in a bad reading.Hard to keep it straight when you are balancing a long strip, especially atthe tip. I need another hand and much better eyes. The Vee-block just didn't work for me, though I'll admit I probably didn'tgive it as much of a workout as I should have. Fiddly to set up, and youhad to take it off every time you wanted to measure something else. As you can see, I've invested a lot of money in trying to solve thisproblem. I hope it will resolve itself as I invest more time. bh At 08:17 AM 4/10/2002 -0500, you wrote: Bill, Not long ago I was in the same boat. One thing that has helped memeasureaccurately is a set of calipers which slide very smoothly and easily. Ihesitateto mention that they are cheap digital calipers, from China, via LeaValley. Butthey are very accurate.Using the ratchet mechanism, again set very lightly, on my micrometeralsoworks well.Use a light touch, and practice repeatedly. You might practice for a fewminutes trying to get repeatable measurements on something solid like adrill bit. I know that's got to be a frustrating problem for you. Keep looking solution and you will find it. Harry Bill Hoy wrote: Hi, Tom, But how do you measure accurately? No matter how gentle I am, I can'tmeasure a strip and get consistent results. The apex is just toodelicatenot to compress a few thou. I've used calipers with a light touch, amicrometer and a vee-block. Same inconsistent results. I neverpreciselyknow what the blank is going to measure until after sanding off theglue.It's usually close, but rarely dead-on. After 10 or so rods, I stillhaven't developed that touch that allows me to precisely measurestrips. SoI rely on precise setting of the forms. Problem is, I still haven't gottenthe hang of knowing when to stop planing. Using a plane or a scraper, Igetchatter from the iron scraping on the metal forms, resulting inoversizestrips and uneven edges. Using a razor blade for the last few thou, Iusually end up with undersize strips (somebody explain to me how THAThappens!). I hesitate to post this because I'm nowhere near the point of beingwithin+- .001 on my finished blanks that so many strive for. Am I the onlyonewho has to resort to the sanding block to get close? Bill At 09:35 PM 4/9/2002 -0400, Jill and Tom Ausfeld wrote: I love math as much as the next guy, but.... I just set my forms a couple of thou big, plane, mic, then make the appropriate adjustments. Even when all my stuff was bang on, I still needed to makeadjustments. tom ----- Original Message -----From: Ted List; Sent: Tuesday, April 09, 2002 9:21 PMSubject: Re: depth guage You can't trust the point of your dial indicator to be a "perfect" point. I've checked mine and its short .008". The 1.5 figure used with a round pin is a function of the geometry of an equilateral triangle. With the pin sitting in the 60degree groove thedistance from the bottom of the groove to the top of the pin is always 1.5 x the pin dia. This is true if the pin is tangent to the sides of the vee groove. A pin has an effective range of .75 dia to 1.5 diameter, so you need different sizes. -- -- Harry Boyd --http://www.canerods.com/ -- Bamboo Rods -- http://www.fbcwin.com/ -- Our Church -- from jojo@ipa.net Wed Apr 10 18:24:20 2002 g3ANOK428269 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 18:24:20 -0500 helo=default) id 16vRRr-0005a4-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 19:24:19 -0400 Subject: Re: impregnation of bamboo You will have a fine time trying to break Lexan. The stuff can be literallybullet-proof.Any plastic you buy for windows should say whether it is acrylic. Acrylics canbe readily broken,and dissolve in acetone/MEK. The same cannot be said of polycarbonates,though they are solvent to alesser degree. M-D Lexan is a lot tougher. The glass place tells me that if you score(try tocut part way through) the plexiglass will break at the cut much easier.Lexan is, again, a lot tougher so it is harder to break.Hope this helps alittle. Good luck, Randall R. Gregory check out the system I use toimpregnate(www.rifflewaterrods.com in the shop shots section) On Tue, 09 Apr 2002 10:47:33 -0700 k5vkq@ix.netcom.comwrote: Make sure it is Plexiglass. Home Depot sells Plexiglass and Lowes sells Lexan or something like that and will substitute if you don't emphasizePlexiglas. The stuff at Lowes won't work. Regards,Onisk5vkq@ix.netcom.com OK, I found some clear, unlabeled plastic which I believedto be Plexiglass. I made a syrup of it in acetone, and I'msoaking some wood in it now. How could I tell if this isactually Lexan? - Grayson from jojo@ipa.net Wed Apr 10 18:34:24 2002 g3ANYO428721 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 18:34:24 -0500 helo=default) id 16vRbX-0001NS-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 19:34:19 -0400 Subject: Re: Precision: Was depth guage Same here. Actually, I have three sets of dial calipers. The solar powered,digital Mitutoyo isdedicated to the V-block. The others are dial readouts. A caliper is normallyonly good for gettingone in the ballpark, as there is much room for error. The less expensiveChinese calipers are justfine, and won't break the bank buying them. I can't imagine taking the V- blockoff and on all thetime.I recently received Tom Morgan's nifty 3-in-1 V- block. I set it up on thecalipers, used a drill rodto calibrate it, and was done. I checked the drill rod diameter using a .0001-reading micrometer,then extrapolated the necessary information. When it was all said and done,the V- block andmicrometer agreed within .0002. Close enough for this rodmaker.Mike, I suspect that perhaps the cut-out for the caliper jaw extends too farpast the V-groove, thuspreventing you from measuring beyond that. I've never had a problemmeasuring small strips, whetheron the Waara or the Morgan V-block. M-D bill,i have two calipers. i leave the v block on one. the only problem i havewith the block, is taking measurements smaller than 35 thou. anybody knowwhy that is?mike Thanks, Harry. The Vee-block just didn't work for me, though I'll admit I probably didn'tgive it as much of a workout as I should have. Fiddly to set up, and youhad to take it off every time you wanted to measure something else. bh At 08:17 AM 4/10/2002 -0500, you wrote: Bill, Not long ago I was in the same boat. One thing that has helped memeasureaccurately is a set of calipers which slide very smoothly and easily. Ihesitateto mention that they are cheap digital calipers, from China, via LeaValley. Butthey are very accurate.Using the ratchet mechanism, again set very lightly, on my micrometer alsoworks well.Use a light touch, and practice repeatedly. You might practice for a few minutes trying to get repeatable measurements on something solid like adrill bit. I know that's got to be a frustrating problem for you. Keep looking solution and you will find it. Harry Bill Hoy wrote: from mrmac@tcimet.net Wed Apr 10 18:57:45 2002 g3ANvi429458 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 18:57:44 - for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 20:22:12 - Subject: wet sanding ' Evenin', everybody - Got 4 coats of spar on some wraps and am ready to do touch up sandingprior to the last coat or two. I've been using linseed oil as thelubricant when I wet sand with 1000/1200 grit paper. It works prettygood, and I haven't had any problems with additional coats or dipping,but it's gotten where I don't much care for the smell of the linseedoil, sooooo, I was wonderin' what do some of you guys use instead?Suggestions? Thanks, guys - I appreciate the help. mac from edriddle@mindspring.com Wed Apr 10 19:05:07 2002 g3B056429834 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 19:05:06 - helo=oemcomputer) id 16vS5E-0005qL-00; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 20:05:01 -0400 Subject: Re: Honing Jigs I got mine from the local Woodworker's Supply, cat # 522012, $9.99 plustax.Ed ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Honing Jigs Harry, Believe it or not, I got it from the Lee Valley/Veritas site. Item #60M07.01 A picture isat http://www.leevalley.com/wood/page.asp?page=33003&category=1,43072,43078&abspage=1&ccurrency=2&SID= Now costs $12.75. I've seen them at Lowes etc. bill At 10:23 AM 4/10/2002 -0500, Harry Boyd wrote: Bill, Do you remember where the side clamping jig came from? Harry Bill Hoy wrote: I use the side clamping jib that costs about $11. --Harry Boyd http://www.canerods.com/ Bamboo Rodshttp://www.fbcwin.com/ Our Church from Jkvseafood@aol.com Wed Apr 10 19:12:32 2002 g3B0CV400328 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 19:12:32 - Subject: Re: rodmakers site rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu someone has used the rodmakers.com site to advertise for a gambling site. dirty b*^#@:*s. from bob@downandacross.com Wed Apr 10 19:15:24 2002 g3B0FN400604 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 19:15:24 - 10 Apr 2002 20:15:14 -0400 Subject: RE: wet sanding Olive oil. It was suggested by a friend and it works well enough for me, Ikeep using it. -----Original Message----- Subject: wet sanding ' Evenin', everybody - Got 4 coats of spar on some wraps and am ready to do touch up sandingprior to the last coat or two. I've been using linseed oil as thelubricant when I wet sand with 1000/1200 grit paper. It works prettygood, and I haven't had any problems with additional coats or dipping,but it's gotten where I don't much care for the smell of the linseedoil, sooooo, I was wonderin' what do some of you guys use instead?Suggestions? Thanks, guys - I appreciate the help. mac from lblan@provide.net Wed Apr 10 19:18:58 2002 g3B0Iv400922 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 19:18:57 - for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 20:18:56 - Subject: RE: wet sanding Paraffin Oil Larry Blan -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Wednesday, April 10, 2002 8:14 PM Subject: RE: wet sanding Olive oil. It was suggested by a friend and it works well enough for me, Ikeep using it. -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Thursday, April 11, 2002 7:58 AM Subject: wet sanding ' Evenin', everybody - Got 4 coats of spar on some wraps and am ready to do touch up sandingprior to the last coat or two. I've been using linseed oil as thelubricant when I wet sand with 1000/1200 grit paper. It works prettygood, and I haven't had any problems with additional coats or dipping,but it's gotten where I don't much care for the smell of the linseedoil, sooooo, I was wonderin' what do some of you guys use instead?Suggestions? Thanks, guys - I appreciate the help. mac from jojo@ipa.net Wed Apr 10 19:19:22 2002 g3B0JL400997 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 19:19:21 -0500 helo=default) id 16vSJ6-000087-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 20:19:20 -0400 Subject: Re: rodmakers site Well, the good news is that the Rodmakers site is back up and running,though it took a bit to makethe connection, probably because everyone is rushing there to check on it.When I went towww.rodmakers.com a page comes up that says the name is for sale, buthttp://rodmakers.com does givethe casino site. I suppose that whomever owns the name can put upwhatever they wish. M-D someone has used the rodmakers.com site to advertise for a gambling site.dirty b*^#@:*s. from jojo@ipa.net Wed Apr 10 19:29:13 2002 g3B0TC401727 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 19:29:12 -0500 helo=default) id 16vSSc-0007ZF-00 for RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 20:29:11 -0400 Subject: Re: wet sanding I remember Nunley suggesting olive oil, once before.What about plain ol' water?What about you guys quit whining about everything related to rodmaking?How about that? First it'sHarry and John about the Veritas sharpening system, and now Ralph and thesmell of linseed oil.What's next, the smell of bamboo? The feel of silk? The smell of varnish?Maybe cork just gives youthe willies, huh? }B^)> M-D Olive oil. It was suggested by a friend and it works well enough for me, Ikeep using it. ' Evenin', everybody - Got 4 coats of spar on some wraps and am ready to do touch up sandingprior to the last coat or two. I've been using linseed oil as thelubricant when I wet sand with 1000/1200 grit paper. It works prettygood, and I haven't had any problems with additional coats or dipping,but it's gotten where I don't much care for the smell of the linseedoil, sooooo, I was wonderin' what do some of you guys use instead?Suggestions? Thanks, guys - I appreciate the help. mac from aport@si.rr.com Wed Apr 10 19:34:36 2002 g3B0YZ402150 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 19:34:35 -0500 Wed, 10 Apr 2002 20:34:33 -0400 Subject: Re: rodmakers site There was a story on the News the other night about "mousetrapping" =I think they called it. This lowlife gets paid for every hit he gives =companies (usually porn) and does so by linking "near-misses" to them. =That is, he takes sites like www.disney.com and creates just =//Disney.com and www.disey.com and www.diney.com and when you type in a=URL and get it slightly wrong, Zzzzzap! you're at somebody's XXX porn =site. Once there, they keep sending you to others and others and this =creep gets some remuneration for every GD site you wind up in. They = My son's an exec VP in a stock brokerage firm and he got trapped =into one of these things one day and darn near died when a coworker =walked in as he was trying to deal with it. As he started to explain, =the guy said: "Thank God it happened to you too. It happened to me the =other day and I thought I was going nuts!"Perhaps Rodmakers isn't up YET?Art "mousetrapping" I think they called it. This lowlife gets paid for every = gives companies (usually porn) and does so by linking "near-misses" to = and creates just //Disney.com and www.disey.com and www.diney.com and when you type in a= it slightly wrong, Zzzzzap! you're at somebody's XXX porn site. Once = remuneration for every GD site you wind up in. They said you often have = reboot the computer to get out of the cycle. trapped into one of these things one day and darn near died when a = walked in as he was trying to deal with it. As he started to explain, = said: "Thank God it happened to you too. It happened to me the other day = thought I was going nuts!" Art from aport@si.rr.com Wed Apr 10 19:39:21 2002 g3B0dK402886 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 19:39:20 -0500 Wed, 10 Apr 2002 20:39:18 -0400 Subject: Re: wet sanding Hey Jo-Jo, time for a time-out there Buddy! I think you got too close to =the acetone in the impregnation stuff there guy.Art I know, nobody rose to the last "whine" rant you posted so you're =trolling for fresh meat, right? Hey Jo-Jo, time for a time-out there Buddy! I think you got too = the acetone in the impregnation stuff there guy.Art from lblan@provide.net Wed Apr 10 19:40:39 2002 g3B0ec403091 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 19:40:38 - for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 20:40:37 - Subject: RE: rodmakers site Art; the Rodmaker's page is just fine, at www.canerod.com, right where ithas lived all along. The www.rodmakers.com page has links to casino pages,but it is not and never has been "the" Rodmaker's Page.Larry Blan -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Wednesday, April 10, 2002 8:32 PM Subject: Re: rodmakers site There was a story on the News the other night about "mousetrapping" Ithink they called it. This lowlife gets paid for every hit he givescompanies (usually porn) and does so by linking "near-misses" to them. Thatis, he takes sites like www.disney.com and creates just //Disney.com andwww.disey.com and www.diney.com and when you type in a URL and get itslightly wrong, Zzzzzap! you're at somebody's XXX porn site. Once there,they keep sending you to others and others and this creep gets someremuneration for every GD site you wind up in. They said you often have toreboot the computer to get out of the cycle.My son's an exec VP in a stock brokerage firm and he got trapped intoone of these things one day and darn near died when a coworker walked in ashe was trying to deal with it. As he started to explain, the guy said:"Thank God it happened to you too. It happened to me the other day and Ithought I was going nuts!"Perhaps Rodmakers isn't up YET?Art the Rodmaker's page is just fine, at www.canerod.com, right where ithas = along. The www.rodmakers.com = links to casino pages, but it is not and never has been "the" Rodmaker's = Page.Larry Blan PortSent: Wednesday, April 10, 2002 8:32 jojo@ipa.net; Rodmakers discussion groupSubject: Re: = site "mousetrapping" I think they called it. This lowlife gets paid for = he gives companies (usually porn) and does so by linking "near-misses" = them. That is, he takes sites like www.disney.com and creates just = and www.disey.com and www.diney.com and when you type ina = get it slightly wrong, Zzzzzap! you're at somebody's XXX porn site. = there, they keep sending you to others and others and this creep = some remuneration for every GD site you wind up in. They said you = to reboot the computer to get out of the cycle. got trapped into one of these things one day and darn near died when a = coworker walked in as he was trying to deal with it. As he started to = the guy said: "Thank God it happened to you too. It happened to me the = day and I thought I was going nuts!" Art from kenealyj@gwi.net Wed Apr 10 19:51:12 2002 g3B0pB403646 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 19:51:11 -0500 Subject: Re: wet sanding Plain ol' water!!!!!!!!!! Have you ever gotten near that stuff!!! (probably not being from AR);o)uggggggggggggggghhhhh!!!!!!!I use Guinness, that way, when I get tired of sanding............. ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: wet sanding I remember Nunley suggesting olive oil, once before.What about plain ol' water?What about you guys quit whining about everything related to rodmaking? How about that? First it's Harry and John about the Veritas sharpening system, and now Ralph andthe smell of linseed oil. What's next, the smell of bamboo? The feel of silk? The smell of varnish? Maybe cork just gives you the willies, huh? }B^)> M-D From: "Bob Maulucci" Olive oil. It was suggested by a friend and it works well enough for me, Ikeep using it. ' Evenin', everybody - Got 4 coats of spar on some wraps and am ready to do touch up sandingprior to the last coat or two. I've been using linseed oil as thelubricant when I wet sand with 1000/1200 grit paper. It works prettygood, and I haven't had any problems with additional coats or dipping,but it's gotten where I don't much care for the smell of the linseedoil, sooooo, I was wonderin' what do some of you guys use instead?Suggestions? Thanks, guys - I appreciate the help. mac from Jfoster@sunset.net Wed Apr 10 20:07:22 2002 g3B17I404264 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 20:07:22 -0500 g3B172t3008074 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 18:07:03 -0700 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC; en-US; rv:0.9.4)Gecko/20011130 Netscape6/6.2.1 Subject: ?? I thought they had it confused with Franks Page''Thanks Larry And a big Thank you to Hank..i built your 7'6" #3 and it throws a #5 like it's meant to.. jerry from channer@frontier.net Wed Apr 10 20:26:07 2002 g3B1Q6404894 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 20:26:06 - for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 19:26:14 - Subject: Re: wet sanding spit Ralph MacKenzie wrote: ' Evenin', everybody - Got 4 coats of spar on some wraps and am ready to do touch up sandingprior to the last coat or two. I've been using linseed oil as thelubricant when I wet sand with 1000/1200 grit paper. It works prettygood, and I haven't had any problems with additional coats or dipping,but it's gotten where I don't much care for the smell of the linseedoil, sooooo, I was wonderin' what do some of you guys use instead?Suggestions? Thanks, guys - I appreciate the help. mac from HomeyDKlown@att.net Wed Apr 10 20:54:53 2002 g3B1sq405674 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 20:54:52 -0500 ;Thu, 11 Apr 2002 01:54:46 +0000 Subject: RE: wet sanding That SMELL... I love the smell of nepalm in the morning... ...Charlie don't surf! heh heh heh... -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: wet sanding I remember Nunley suggesting olive oil, once before.What about plain ol' water?What about you guys quit whining about everything related to rodmaking?Howabout that? First it'sHarry and John about the Veritas sharpening system, and now Ralph and thesmell of linseed oil.What's next, the smell of bamboo? The feel of silk? The smell of varnish?Maybe cork just gives youthe willies, huh? }B^)> M-D Olive oil. It was suggested by a friend and it works well enough for me, Ikeep using it. ' Evenin', everybody - Got 4 coats of spar on some wraps and am ready to do touch up sandingprior to the last coat or two. I've been using linseed oil as thelubricant when I wet sand with 1000/1200 grit paper. It works prettygood, and I haven't had any problems with additional coats or dipping,but it's gotten where I don't much care for the smell of the linseedoil, sooooo, I was wonderin' what do some of you guys use instead?Suggestions? Thanks, guys - I appreciate the help. mac from oakmere@carol.net Wed Apr 10 21:02:45 2002 g3B22i406039 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 21:02:44 -0500 g3B22bm10374 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 22:02:38 -0400 Subject: RE: New Book Hi Ray: Have enjoyed reading and thinking about the first book. I will look forwardto your second one. Best, FrankFrank Paul, "GreyFox"TroutBeck Fly and RodBamboo Rod Refinishing and Restoration;Graphite and Glass Rod Repair;Trout Flies, Seneca, SC Summer Residence: Troutbeck Cottage, Waterville, PA; 570-753- 8121fwpaul@ces.clemson.edu (work), Clemson University; 864-656- 7471oakmere@carol.net (home), South Carolina; 864-882-0077 from oakmere@carol.net Wed Apr 10 21:22:37 2002 g3B2Ma406676 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 21:22:36 -0500 g3B2MU131145 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 22:22:30 -0400 Subject: RE: Sharpening Jigs Hi Harry and others: I have both the Veritas and the side clamping sharpening jig. I like theside sharpening jig best. It is more repeatable for me when I use it. Ipurchased it from Harbor Freight some time ago. The way I use it is to setthe angle and then mark an edge on the blade to reset it for resharpening.Of course as the blade wears from sharpening, one has to correct the markon the blade for keeping the correct angle. Best, FrankFrank Paul, "GreyFox"TroutBeck Fly and RodBamboo Rod Refinishing and Restoration;Graphite and Glass Rod Repair;Trout Flies, Seneca, SC Summer Residence: Troutbeck Cottage, Waterville, PA; 570-753- 8121fwpaul@ces.clemson.edu (work), Clemson University; 864-656- 7471oakmere@carol.net (home), South Carolina; 864-882-0077 from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Wed Apr 10 21:24:45 2002 g3B2Oi406889 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 21:24:44 - (authenticated) Wed, 10 Apr 2002 19:24:37 -0700 Subject: Re: wet sanding Lubricants? KY Jelly is hard to beat. Just kidding,Harry Ralph MacKenzie wrote: ' Evenin', everybody - Got 4 coats of spar on some wraps and am ready to do touch up sandingprior to the last coat or two. I've been using linseed oil as thelubricant when I wet sand with 1000/1200 grit paper. It works prettygood, and I haven't had any problems with additional coats or dipping,but it's gotten where I don't much care for the smell of the linseedoil, sooooo, I was wonderin' what do some of you guys use instead?Suggestions? Thanks, guys - I appreciate the help. mac -- -- Harry Boyd --http://www.canerods.com/ -- Bamboo Rods -- http://www.fbcwin.com/ -- Our Church -- from stetzer@csd.uwm.edu Wed Apr 10 22:03:43 2002 g3B33h409486 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 22:03:43 - WAA31624 for ; Wed, 10 Apr 2002 Subject: Re: Precision: Was depth guage I made my own V-block from 2 short pieces of drill rod and some trig.My purpose was to find out hou much I crush the apex without it.I concluded that its about .001; that is, my strips measured .001under the true size without the V-block. As has been mentioned on this list before, a V-block is onlyaccurate if your angles are dead-on 60 degrees. Depending on thedesign of the V-block, a 57 deg or 63 deg angle will introduce alot more error than crushing the apex by a typical 0.001. IMHO,I get better measurements without a V-block and adding .001 thanrelying on all my angles to always be 60 deg. My angles get betterwith each rod, but there are always places where they are not perfect.......................................................................Frank Stetzer "...a cheerful comrade is betterstetzer@uwm.edu than a waterproof coat and aEmployed by, but not speaking for foot-warmer." Henry Van Dyke,Univ of Wisconsin-Milwaukee, USA "Fisherman's Luck", 1899. from avyoung@iinet.net.au Thu Apr 11 00:46:27 2002 g3B5kO413553 for ; Thu, 11 Apr 2002 00:46:25 -0500 "Rodmakers discussion group" Subject: Re: rodmakers site That happened here in the state bank just a few months back.PART of the story made it to a PC magazine about the perils of porn during working hrs on the company PC.This guy was named and the story went that he was surfing porn because all his web activity was being logged. At the end of the week all his screen shots were looked and he was summarily sacked.As it happens I know this guy and although I wouldn't doubt his looking if he happened upon a site I couldn't believe he was spending the time surfing all the sites he was accused of at work.Whht happened was he was searching for a new BMW and (I think) there is a http://bmw.com out there or similar. Once he hit that site it was exactly as you say it is.I think he told me he we was logged as hitting about 30 sites before he gave the PC the old three finger salute (ctrl/alt/del).He got his job back but he was given the run around and named in a fairly up market magagine. Tony At 08:31 PM 4/10/02 -0400, Art Port wrote: There was a story on the News the other night about "mousetrapping" I think they called it. This lowlife gets paid for every hit he gives companies (usually porn) and does so by linking "near-misses" to them. That is, he takes sites like www.disney.com and creates just //Disney.com and www.disey.com and www.diney.com and when you type in a URL andget it slightly wrong, Zzzzzap! you're at somebody's XXX porn site. Once there, they keep sending you to others and others and this creep gets some remuneration for every GD site you wind up in. They said you often have to reboot the computer to get out of the cycle.My son's an exec VP in a stock brokerage firm and he got trapped into one of these things one day and darn near died when a coworker walked in as he was trying to deal with it. As he started to explain, the guy said: "Thank God it happened to you too. It happened to me the other day and I thought I was going nuts!"Perhaps Rodmakers isn't up YET?Art /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html There was only ever one good man in Parlament and he was Guy Fawkes Patrick Moore /*************************************************************************/ from utzerath@execpc.com Thu Apr 11 05:56:29 2002 g3BAuS418317 for ; Thu, 11 Apr 2002 05:56:28 - g3BAuR107323; g3BAuPJ79519; Subject: Re: Precision: Was depth guage Very good point, Frank.Were you getting the crush you estimated with a micrometer or caliper?One other point, which might be obvious, is that the V- block will helppredict the final width of the hexagon whether it be strip height or angleerror.Jim U----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Precision: Was depth guage I made my own V-block from 2 short pieces of drill rod and some trig.My purpose was to find out hou much I crush the apex without it.I concluded that its about .001; that is, my strips measured .001under the true size without the V-block. As has been mentioned on this list before, a V-block is onlyaccurate if your angles are dead-on 60 degrees. Depending on thedesign of the V-block, a 57 deg or 63 deg angle will introduce alot more error than crushing the apex by a typical 0.001. IMHO,I get better measurements without a V-block and adding .001 thanrelying on all my angles to always be 60 deg. My angles get betterwith each rod, but there are always places where they are not perfect.......................................................................Frank Stetzer "...a cheerful comrade is betterstetzer@uwm.edu than a waterproof coat and aEmployed by, but not speaking for foot-warmer." Henry Van Dyke,Univ of Wisconsin-Milwaukee, USA "Fisherman's Luck", 1899. from petermckean@netspace.net.au Thu Apr 11 06:19:35 2002 g3BBJX418775 for ; Thu, 11 Apr 2002 06:19:33 - g3BBJEj13032; Subject: Re: Precision: Was depth guage Harry I have 2 micrometers, one digital, one analogue. The digital instrumentportends to offer measurements in .00001", and the variation on repeatcanemeasurements is usually of the order of 5/10000". The analogue itemdependson me for the final reading, and thus does not encourage me to think interms of tenths, let alone hundredths. What usually happens is that I do all the pedestrian measurements withdigital calipers, and I only read 3 decimal places; when I am feelingobsessive, I check with the micrometers. Perhaps not surprisingly, themeasurements are not often out to any significant degree, and then not dueto any equipment error. It is my considered opinion that if a rodmaker is working with bamboo, thesehypersuperyoubeaut micrometers are about as much use as a hip pocket in asinglet. Different thing for those amongst us who do a lot of precision work usingmetal as an adjunct to their actual bamboo work. But I, for one, cannoteven conceptualise a hundred thousandth of an inch, let alone do somethingwith one. I think that calipers are about ten times as accurate as I am. Cheers Peter from petermckean@netspace.net.au Thu Apr 11 06:33:03 2002 g3BBX1419183 for ; Thu, 11 Apr 2002 06:33:02 - g3BBWuw15766; Subject: Re: Honing Jigs Harry The one I have came from Woodcraft; and I'll swear that you won't make mineflex. Mine was made in Poland, and is a beautifully finished tool. Peter from ttalsma@macatawa.org Thu Apr 11 07:06:41 2002 g3BC6e419846 for ; Thu, 11 Apr 2002 07:06:40 - Thu, 11 Apr 2002 08:06:00 -0400 Subject: Re: rodmakers site FILETIME=[3F088C90:01C1E151] Even better are the porn sites that troll for expired domains. Theseguys get lists of domains that have recently expired, register them andthen put up porn sites under the "new" domain names. Their favoritetargets are faith- based organizations. Lots of churches, missions, etchave had this happen to them. Big warning for all you web site owners,if you have a domain name and don't know when you have to renew it,better find out so your domain isn't "stolen." -- Todd Talsma 8412 North Maple Court Zeeland MI 49464 ------ email: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/ Bamboo Tips site:http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo/ Bamboo Sources site:http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo_Sources/ home page:http://external.sligh.com/~toddt/ genealogy pages: Under construction from tausfeld@frontiernet.net Thu Apr 11 07:11:52 2002 Received: from g3BCBq420130 for ; Thu, 11 Apr 2002 Apr 2002 12:11:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO oemcomputer) ; 11 Apr 2002 12:11:51 -0000 Message-ID:From: "Jill and Tom References: Subject: Re: wet sanding 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu X-Listprocessor- Version:8.2.09/990901/11:28 -- ListProc(tm) by CREN M-D, I think my lathe is tooloud, the smell of the vanish is a bit much, cleaning up after gluing is a pain. Ihate the cuts I get when splitting. I dislike the burns on my fingers fromstraightening, and sometimes I get hand cramps if I do alot of it. I won't evenget into having to stop planing to re-sharpen.... Incidently, I love the smell ofbamboo, cork does not give me the willies and I love the feel of silk, especiallywhen my wife is wearing it. ; ) tom ----- Original Message ----- From: Jojo Sent: Wednesday, April 10, 2002 8:27 PMSubject: Re: wet sanding I remember Nunley suggesting olive oil, once before.What about plain ol' water?What about you guys quit whining about everything related to rodmaking? How about that? First it's Harry and John about the Veritas sharpening system, and now Ralph andthe smell of linseed oil. What's next, the smell of bamboo? The feel of silk? The smell of varnish? Maybe cork just gives you the willies, huh? }B^)> M-D From: "Bob Maulucci" Olive oil. It was suggested by a friend and it works well enough for me, Ikeep using it. ' Evenin', everybody - Got 4 coats of spar on some wraps and am ready to do touch up sandingprior to the last coat or two. I've been using linseed oil as thelubricant when I wet sand with 1000/1200 grit paper. It works prettygood, and I haven't had any problems with additional coats or dipping,but it's gotten where I don't much care for the smell of the linseedoil, sooooo, I was wonderin' what do some of you guys use instead?Suggestions? Thanks, guys - I appreciate the help. mac from harms1@pa.net Thu Apr 11 07:14:06 2002 g3BCE5420380 for ; Thu, 11 Apr 2002 07:14:05 - Subject: Re: Precision: Was depth guage Peter, It's true. Almost ANY caliper (dial or digital) will give readings that arebetter than the tolerances we can maintain through our planing and/orsanding efforts. The variations in caliper readings ( from theleast-to-the-most expensive instrument) are so subtle that they cannot berendered serviceable by even the best rod maker. It's the care you take as a maker, and not caliper variations in the orderof .0002" that distinguish the best rod. Think about it--even if yourcaliper regularly misreads by as much as .005" (extremely unlikely), thiswould tanslate into an "error" in your finished rod of only .001". On the other hand, if you can consistently build rods whose 5" stationmeasurements and flat-to-flat dimensions are within O 002" of your taperdesign, you are great maker! And it's not because you have a greatcaliper. Cheers, Bill ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Precision: Was depth guage Harry I have 2 micrometers, one digital, one analogue. The digital instrumentportends to offer measurements in .00001", and the variation on repeat cane measurements is usually of the order of 5/10000". The analogue item depends on me for the final reading, and thus does not encourage me to think interms of tenths, let alone hundredths. What usually happens is that I do all the pedestrian measurements withdigital calipers, and I only read 3 decimal places; when I am feelingobsessive, I check with the micrometers. Perhaps not surprisingly, themeasurements are not often out to any significant degree, and then notdueto any equipment error. It is my considered opinion that if a rodmaker is working with bamboo, these hypersuperyoubeaut micrometers are about as much use as a hip pocket inasinglet. Different thing for those amongst us who do a lot of precision work usingmetal as an adjunct to their actual bamboo work. But I, for one, cannoteven conceptualise a hundred thousandth of an inch, let alone do somethingwith one. I think that calipers are about ten times as accurate as I am. Cheers Peter from rperry@suffolk.lib.ny.us Thu Apr 11 07:35:39 2002 g3BCZc420954 for ; Thu, 11 Apr 2002 07:35:38 - g3BCZYp05444 for ; Thu, 11 Apr 2002 08:35:34 - Subject: Re: Precision: Was depth guage Hi RMers, Does anyone have the Leonard 36 Baby Catskill taper? TIA, Bob from lblove@omniglobal.net Thu Apr 11 08:02:47 2002 g3BD2k421830 for ; Thu, 11 Apr 2002 08:02:46 -0500 0000 (12.162.144.88) "Rodmakers discussion group" Subject: Re: wet sanding g3BD2l421831 virgin, extra virgin, or that select stuff that is not fit to feed the dog?Brad *********** REPLY SEPARATOR *********** On 4/10/02 at 7:27 PM Jojo DeLancier wrote: I remember Nunley suggesting olive oil, once before.What about plain ol' water?What about you guys quit whining about everything related to rodmaking?How about that? First it'sHarry and John about the Veritas sharpening system, and now Ralph and thesmell of linseed oil.What's next, the smell of bamboo? The feel of silk? The smell of varnish?Maybe cork just gives youthe willies, huh? }B^)> M-D From: "Bob Maulucci" Olive oil. It was suggested by a friend and it works well enough for me, Ikeep using it. ' Evenin', everybody - Got 4 coats of spar on some wraps and am ready to do touch up sandingprior to the last coat or two. I've been using linseed oil as thelubricant when I wet sand with 1000/1200 grit paper. It works prettygood, and I haven't had any problems with additional coats or dipping,but it's gotten where I don't much care for the smell of the linseedoil, sooooo, I was wonderin' what do some of you guys use instead?Suggestions? Thanks, guys - I appreciate the help. mac from Jkvseafood@aol.com Thu Apr 11 08:16:53 2002 g3BDGq422385 for ; Thu, 11 Apr 2002 08:16:52 - for ; Thu, 11 Apr 2002 09:16:39 - Subject: silk thread size A hello group,i could use your opinions. is size A silk thread to heavy for wraps on bamboo can i use this or should i use a smaller diameter stuff (0 or 00)? thanks, john from JNL123141@msn.com Thu Apr 11 08:42:41 2002 g3BDge423557 for ; Thu, 11 Apr 2002 08:42:40 -0500 Thu, 11 Apr 2002 06:42:27 -0700 "Rodmakers discussion group" Subject: Re: wet sanding FILETIME=[B8145440:01C1E15E] M-D,Touchy! Touchy! Did you sleep by a crack and wake up with a stiff neck? john ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: wet sanding virgin, extra virgin, or that select stuff that is not fit to feed the dog?Brad *********** REPLY SEPARATOR *********** On 4/10/02 at 7:27 PM Jojo DeLancier wrote: I remember Nunley suggesting olive oil, once before.What about plain ol' water?What about you guys quit whining about everything related to rodmaking?How about that? First it'sHarry and John about the Veritas sharpening system, and now Ralph and thesmell of linseed oil.What's next, the smell of bamboo? The feel of silk? The smell of varnish?Maybe cork just gives youthe willies, huh? }B^)> M-D From: "Bob Maulucci" Olive oil. It was suggested by a friend and it works well enough for me, Ikeep using it. ' Evenin', everybody - Got 4 coats of spar on some wraps and am ready to do touch up sandingprior to the last coat or two. I've been using linseed oil as thelubricant when I wet sand with 1000/1200 grit paper. It works prettygood, and I haven't had any problems with additional coats or dipping,but it's gotten where I don't much care for the smell of the linseedoil, sooooo, I was wonderin' what do some of you guys use instead?Suggestions? Thanks, guys - I appreciate the help. mac M- ----- Original Message ----- From: Brad Love Sent: Thursday, April 11, 2002 9:07 =discussion group Subject:Re= stuff that is not fit to feed the dog?Brad***********REPLY = DeLancier w= before.= a= rodm= Even= = ha= was wonderin' what do some of you guys use from MasjC1@aol.com Thu Apr 11 09:00:04 2002 g3BE03424616 for ; Thu, 11 Apr 2002 09:00:03 -0500 for ; Thu, 11 Apr 2002 09:59:54 -0400 Subject: Re: Good news Ray, Can you give us some insight on the contents or do we have to wait for its release? Mark Cole Ray, Can you give us some insight on the contents or do we have to wait forits release? Mark Cole from bhoy551@earthlink.net Thu Apr 11 09:03:44 2002 g3BE3h425133 for ; Thu, 11 Apr 2002 09:03:43 - Thu, 11 Apr 2002 10:03:36 -0400 Subject: Re: rodmakers site FILETIME=[AC3AB350:01C1E161] I serve as a sort of make-do webmaster for county government in Virginia. One of our links was for the Explore Park, a frontier museum located here. There was a link to it on our links page: explorepark.com. The domain name expired and was taken up by a raunchy hardcore site. One day, our County Treasurer (matronly, 60ish) clicked on the link and dam near expired. I had a lot of explainin' to do. I check my links often now. Bill At 08:06 AM 4/11/2002 -0400, Todd Talsma wrote: Even better are the porn sites that troll for expired domains. Theseguys get lists of domains that have recently expired, register them andthen put up porn sites under the "new" domain names. Their favoritetargets are faith- based organizations. Lots of churches, missions, etchave had this happen to them. Big warning for all you web site owners,if you have a domain name and don't know when you have to renew it,better find out so your domain isn't "stolen." --Todd Talsma8412 North Maple CourtZeeland MI 49464------ web design business page: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo Tips site: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo/Bamboo Sources site: http://www.webbizbuilders.com/Bamboo_Sources/home page: http://external.sligh.com/~toddt/genealogy pages: Under construction from stoltz10@attbi.com Thu Apr 11 09:17:15 2002 g3BEHF426141 for ; Thu, 11 Apr 2002 09:17:15 - Thu, 11 Apr 2002 14:17:09 +0000 Subject: Re: silk thread size A I like using size A at the ferrules, but it probably would work just fine ----- Original Message ----- Subject: silk thread size A hello group,i could use your opinions. is size A silk thread to heavy for wraps on bamboo can i use this or should i use a smaller diameter stuff (0 or 00)? thanks, john from eamon_lee@hotmail.com Thu Apr 11 09:57:05 2002 g3BEv4428446 for ; Thu, 11 Apr 2002 09:57:04 - Thu, 11 Apr 2002 07:56:54 -0700 Thu, 11 Apr 2002 14:56:54 GMT Subject: Re: silk thread size A FILETIME=[1EE8BF30:01C1E169] I love using Size A Silk, especially vintage Belding-Corticelli, Paragon, Richardson, etc...The only problem is nailing a color that you can get a bunch of. ($$$) It's easy to work with and I usually tip with Naples or Gossamer. Get on ebay, but be warned, bidding against those grizzled sewing chicks can be brutal! Eamon _________________________________________________________________MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx from partrick@intrex.net Thu Apr 11 09:59:03 2002 g3BEx3428678 for ; Thu, 11 Apr 2002 09:59:03 - Subject: Books.. If you want a very good read... try Chris Camuto's "A Fly Fisherman's BlueRidge." What beautiful, lyrical prose... come to think of it... I need tore- read that.... regards, Jerry from lblove@omniglobal.net Thu Apr 11 10:25:26 2002 g3BFPP400654 for ; Thu, 11 Apr 2002 10:25:25 - 0000 (12.162.144.88) Subject: bench planes Hey listmembers,have any of you heard of Mastercraft bench planes?if so how do they compare with the new #3 UK built Stanley product? Are the blades interchangable? I've been trolling the used tool sellers and was thinking ofgetting a #3 Mastercraft to replace my #4 Stanley. tiaBradhttp://lblove.users.omniglobal.net from Soignier54@aol.com Thu Apr 11 10:25:37 2002 g3BFPa400677 for ; Thu, 11 Apr 2002 10:25:36 - for ; Thu, 11 Apr 2002 11:25:09 - Subject: re:wet sanding Good morning all,With 4 coats of spar on the thread, they should be sealed just fine. I've just used water and 1500 grit. If you want or must have some lubricant try any liquid soap diluted 75% with water. It's a lot easier to clean up than the previously mentioned oils and it will provide the "slip" you're probably looking for. I also use the soap and water mix when I'm touching up my plane irons with the "scary" sharpening method before I hone. I got the idea from an old chef I used to work for years ago, and he used it with the old "oil" stones (gads)!. It works, save your extra virgin for cooking.... Brian Smith Good morning all,With 4 coats of spar on the thread, they should be sealed just fine. I'vejust used water and 1500 grit. If you want or must have some lubricant tryany liquid soap diluted 75% with water. It's a lot easier to clean up than thepreviously mentioned oils and it will provide the "slip" you're probably looking irons with the "scary" sharpening method before I hone. I got the idea froman old chef I used to work for years ago, and he used it with the old "oil"stones (gads)!. It works, save your extra virgin for cooking.... Brian Smith from Darryl.Hayashida@phs.com Thu Apr 11 10:36:27 2002 g3BFaQ401752 for ; Thu, 11 Apr 2002 10:36:26 - pri.pacificare.com 2002 15:40:51 UT (Tumbleweed ; Thu, 11 Apr 2002 08:35:13 -0700 Subject: RE: bench planes The #3 bench plane sold by Sears is actually a Stanley. As long as you don'tmind the blue and red Craftsman paint scheme, it's only $32.00Darryl -----Original Message----- Sent: Thursday, April 11, 2002 8:21 AM Subject: bench planes Hey listmembers,have any of you heard of Mastercraft bench planes?if so how do they compare with the new #3 UK built Stanley product? Are the blades interchangable? I've been trolling the used tool sellers and was thinking ofgetting a #3 Mastercraft to replace my #4 Stanley. tiaBradhttp://lblove.users.omniglobal.net This electronic message transmission, including any attachments, containsinformation from PacifiCare Health Systems Inc. which may be confidentialor privileged. The information is intended to be for the use of the individualor entity named above. If you are not the intended recipient, be aware thatany disclosure, copying, distribution or use of the contents of thisinformation is prohibited. If you have received this electronic transmission in error, please notify thesender immediately by a "reply to sender only" message and destroy allelectronic and hard copies of the communication, including attachments. from pabix@aol.com Thu Apr 11 13:24:29 2002 g3BIOS411333 for ; Thu, 11 Apr 2002 13:24:28 - Subject: Re: silk thread size A Since we are on the subject of thread, has anyone had any experience with Clover/Tire silk thread? It is readily available through Goldenwitch but is size 50. There are many colors to choose from. Not knowing much aboutsizes, How does 50 compare? Too big? from saltwein@worldnet.att.net Thu Apr 11 13:31:00 2002 g3BIV0411897 for ; Thu, 11 Apr 2002 13:31:00 -0500 Subject: Planing Forum Is it still just $15 for a subscription? Regards, Steve subscription? Regards, =Steve from rcristant@isgtransport.com Thu Apr 11 13:50:48 2002 g3BIol415220 for ; Thu, 11 Apr 2002 13:50:47 - content-class: urn:content-classes:messageSubject: Help Thread-Topic: HelpThread-Index: AcHhic0Jj8/+v50lTEa3OaTmet1XtQ== Can anyone send me Adam Vigil's email address off list? Or Adam if youare out there send me a reply, I need to ask you a question about yourconvection oven. Robert CleanCleanDocumentEmail =0=0 MicrosoftInternetExplorer4 st1\:*{behavior:url(#default#ieooui) } table.MsoNormalTable {mso-style-name:"Table Normal"; mso-tstyle- rowband-size:0; mso-tstyle-colband-size:0; mso-style-noshow:yes; mso- style-parent:""; mso-padding-alt:0in 5.4pt 0in 5.4pt; mso-para- margin:0in; mso-para-margin-bottom:.0001pt; mso-pagination:widow- orphan; font-size:10.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman";} Can anyone send me =Adam =Vigil’s email address = send me areply, I need to ask you a question about your convection =oven. Robert =00 from rcristant@isgtransport.com Thu Apr 11 14:05:47 2002 g3BJ5k417575 for ; Thu, 11 Apr 2002 14:05:46 - content-class: urn:content-classes:messageSubject: RE: Help Thread-Topic: HelpThread-Index: AcHhic0Jj8/+v50lTEa3OaTmet1XtQAAgSzg Thanks to everyone who replied with Adam's email. Robert -----Original Message----- Subject: Help Can anyone send me Adam Vigil's email address off list? Or Adam if youare out there send me a reply, I need to ask you a question about yourconvection oven. Robert CleanDocumentEmail =0=0 MicrosoftInternetExplorer4 st1\:*{behavior:url(#default#ieooui) } table.MsoNormalTable {mso-style-name:"Table Normal"; mso-tstyle- rowband-size:0; mso-tstyle-colband-size:0; mso-style-noshow:yes; mso- style-parent:""; mso-padding-alt:0in 5.4pt 0in 5.4pt; mso-para- margin:0in; mso-para-margin-bottom:.0001pt; mso-pagination:widow- orphan; font-size:10.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman";} Thanks to everyone who replied with =Adam’semail. Robert -----Original =Message-----From: Robert Cristant = Sent: =Thursday,April 11, 2002 2:51 =PM rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: =Help Can anyone send me Adam Adam if you are out there send me a reply, I need to ask you a question =aboutyour convection oven. Robert =00 from RMargiotta@aol.com Thu Apr 11 15:29:15 2002 g3BKTE425505 for ; Thu, 11 Apr 2002 15:29:14 - Subject: Re: silk thread size A Size 50 is roughly equivalent to Size A. I did some tests several months ago. I marked off about 1/2" on a wooden dowel and counted the number of revoultions it took with each size ofthread. I repeated the test with different spools of thread, but the results were almost exactly the same. Here's what I found: Silk Wraps/0.5" Index Gossamer 108 0.67YLI #100 (3/0) 103 0.70Naples 87 0.83 Rice 00 (old stock) 84 0.86 Belding Corticelli A 78 0.92 Tire #50 75 0.96 YLI #50 72 1.00 Janome #50 72 1.00 Gudebrod 00 (modern) 72 1.00 --Rich from Grhghlndr@aol.com Thu Apr 11 16:00:57 2002 g3BL0p427274 for ; Thu, 11 Apr 2002 16:00:51 - for ; Thu, 11 Apr 2002 17:00:28 - Thu, 11 Apr 2002 17:00:24 -0400 Subject: Fwd: Shining Up to Heaven 4f954c4a34adc1cc4f954c4a34adc1cc this is cool check itout.bret ---------4f954c4a34adc1cc4f954c4a34adc1cc MAILINXB21-0411124801; Thu, 11 Apr 2002 12:48:01 -0500 MAILRELAYINXB19-0411124457; Thu, 11 Apr 2002 12:44:57 -0400 Apr 11 11:42:50 2002 -0500 Thu, 11 Apr 2002 11:44:48 -0500 with Novell_GroupWise; Thu, 11 Apr 2002 11:44:47 -0500 ,, , ,, ,, ,, ,, Subject: Shining Up to Heaven FILETIME=[3176D100:01C1E178] This is really nice! Jennifer ReiterWinston & Strawn35 W. Wacker DriveChicago, IL 60601(312) 558-5244jereiter@winston.com