from reed@speedy.palette.com Wed Mar 8 07:46:54 1995 Subject: Requesting questions I live 5 miles from Sam Carlson, the last of the old-line rodmakers. Only recently have I had the audacity to inflict my presence upon him. I wasdriven to impose upon his goodwill because I have many questions and he hasmany years of experience; fortunately, he generously has, and will, give me of histime. However, in my visits to him I want to make the most of his, and my, time;so if anyone has any cogent questions I can offer please let me know. Thus farhe has shown me his heat-treating methodology, his binding and straightening,beveling strips, etc. I will share anything of interest that I may learn with this list (apart from gossip). reed curry reed@palette.com rcurry@jlc.net from stetzer@csd.uwm.edu Wed Mar 8 08:42:29 1995 Subject: Re: Requesting questions I'm just beginning to get into cane rod building; I've been assembling tools and supplies and will be starting real soon now :-). My latest project has been building a tempering oven 'real cheap'. (This effort is motiviated by an overextended credit card.) I think I've got a workable imitation of the one in Wayne's book One thing I've been wondering about is glues. I gather that the traditional resorcinol glues are losing favor and more 'modern' glues like epoxys and urethanes are popular. My questions are these: does the type of glue affect the action of the finished rod (I assume it must)? And what is the most 'forgiving' glue for a beginner to use? I'm anticipating that my first couple rods won't be planed quite perfectly, and that I will be kind of clutzy getting them bound up after applying the glue. ...................................................................... Frank Stetzer "...a cheerful comrade is better Information and Media Technologies than a waterproof coat and a Univ Wisconsin-Milwaukee, USA foot-warmer." Henry Van Dyke, stetzer@csd.uwm.edu "Fisherman's Luck", 1899. from michael Wed Mar 8 09:11:41 1995 Subject: Re: Requesting questions Reed seez... However, in my visits to him I want to make the most of his, and my, time; so if anyone has any cogent questions I can offer please let me know. Thus far he has shown me his heat-treating methodology, hisbinding and straightening, beveling strips, etc. I will share anything of interest that I may learn with this list (apart from gossip). Reed, I would certainly like to hear more about his heat-treating, and ovens. I am in the process of gathering parts to build an oven along the lines of what Wayne describes in his book. I would like to hear about other designs and techniques also. Thanks... Mike- from WayneCatt@aol.com Wed Mar 8 12:30:08 1995 Subject: Ovens Over the years I've heard of a couple of good ideas on oven alternativesthat I thought I would share. The latest is to build multi piece rods that the sections would be short enough to fit into the normal kitchen oven - which will take pieces of up to about 30". It's unfortunate that rodmaking can't be approached like fly tying in that you can start with a small investment and add as the budget and creativity allows. It's a somewhat all or nothing situation - with the cost of entry being at $700 - $800 and up. I would offer this to those that don't have an oven - get all the sections roughed and bound into bundles and send them along with a few extrastrips (for spares) and I will heat treat them and send them back via UPS. It isn't the best solution but it shouldn't cost much more than 5 or 6 bucks perrod. Wayne Wayne Cattanach 15315 Apple Avenue Casnovia, Mi 49318 from rcurry@jlc.net Wed Mar 8 19:39:28 1995 Subject: Re: Glues Frank said: One thing I've been wondering about is glues. I gather that the traditional resorcinol glues are losing favor and more 'modern' glues like epoxys and urethanes are popular. My questions are these: does the type of glue affect the action of the finished rod (I assume it must)? And what is the most 'forgiving' glue for a beginner to use? I'm anticipating that my first couple rods won't be planed quite perfectly, and that I will be kind of clutzy getting them bound up after applying the glue. I suppose 2 cents is appropriate for my response, given the plungingdollar. My answer is based on my work with other woods, as a conservator and luthier, and conversations with rodmakers. IMHO, the most 'forgiving' glue is hide glue. On the plus side it is easy to disassemble parts bound with this adhesive, it is strong and remarkably durable, it doesn't dampen the action of a rod, and , because it has no gap filling properties, it keeps the workman to honest tolerances. Against it is the task of making a fresh batch and keeping it heated, the use of fungicides, and the care required summer day). reed curry reed@palette.com from rcurry@jlc.net Wed Mar 8 19:53:46 1995 Subject: Re: Requesting questions mike said: Reed, I would certainly like to hear more about his heat-treating, and ovens. I am in the process of gathering parts to build an oven along the lines of what Wayne describes in his book. I would like to hear about other designs and techniques also. Thanks... Mike- I said much of what follows to Terje. Sam Carlson does not use an oven. According to Sam, E.W. Edward's & Sons, where Sam got his start in his youth, used a torch, as did Gene Edwards.Sam uses a propane torch with a large, circular tip which puts out an 8" long 1" diameter blue flame. He passes this flame back and forth over the enamel side of a piece of sawn cane, holding the torch 6" away. This is enough to blacken the cane lightly. All that is really being charred is the outer enamel which would be scraped off later. Then he flips the stick over and really heats the pith side, straightening it by hand or a press be made as he works his way down the length of the stick. The pith is charred extensively, however, most of it is cut off in the beveling. Understand that this cane is pre-WWII, he says he doesn't get any moisture out, but hewould use the same treatment on fresher cane. Sam makes it look pretty easy. If you have ever cast one of his rods, either quad or hex, you would agree with me that the cane had been "welltreated". reed curry reed@palette.com from Rij@aol.com Wed Mar 8 22:18:14 1995 Subject: Re: Glues I ordered the Nyatec glues found in Wayne's book. The results were great. It gave me plenty of time to straighten out any twists and bends. The glue lines are nonexistent (no, I'm not a perfect planer). The glue had a consistancy that let the excess squeeze out during binding. I recommend it highly. from YE67@MUSIC.FERRIS.EDU Thu Mar 9 07:33:28 1995 Subject: Flaming your Bamboo Hi All - Received a note from Mike Biondo about my experiences as a neophyte in flaming my bamboo. I was intimidated so I didn't flame my first attempt. I have tried to do so on my second attempt but between the two, I took the torch (so to speak) to some bamboo waste. I have a regular old propane torch with an adaptor (don't know what it is called but it slips over the torch head and makes a fan shaped flame). Of course, when the flame hits the sharp edge of the split culm, it burns faster and deeper than over the enamel (which is probably why it is best to flame the whole culm and not just the individual split sections). This leaves the edges darker than the center. It is nerve wracking to see the enamel burn and bubble gut after burning, I took the scraper and removed the scorched areas and the effect is very pleasing. I think the main point is to keep the flame moving for even, consistent coloring. Also keep it at a consistent distance. I moved mine at a speed of probably something more than 1"/second and had the flame about 1 1/2" to 2" from the bamboo. I think this flaming business is really a matter of practice and personal preference. It is probably best to make many, many different rods with different flaming techniques then stick with the one you find the most esthetically pleasing. All in all, it still makes me nervous to light the torch and place it against the bamboo. Mike MICHAEL D. ELLS, ASSOCIATE PROFESSOR YE67@MUSIC.FERRIS.EDU INDUSTRIAL AND ENVIRONMENTAL HEALTH MANAGEMENT FERRIS STATE UNIVERSITY BIG RAPIDS, MI 49307-2740 OFFICE (616)592-2295 FAX (616)592-3788 from michael Thu Mar 9 09:59:25 1995 Subject: Re: Requesting questions Reed replies... Sam Carlson does not use an oven. According to Sam, E.W. Edward's &Sons, where Sam got his start in his youth, used a torch, as did Gene Edwards.Sam uses a propane torch with a large, circular tip which puts out an 8" long1" diameter blue flame. He passes this flame back and forth over the enamel side of a piece of sawn cane, holding the torch 6" away. This is enough to blacken the cane lightly. All that is really being charred is the outer enamel which would be scraped off later. Then he flips the stick over and really heats the pith side, straightening it by hand or a press be made as he works his way down the length of the stick. The pith is charred extensively, however, most of it is cut off in the beveling. Understandthat this cane is pre-WWII, he says he doesn't get any moisture out, but hewould use the same treatment on fresher cane. This is interesting! Okay Reed, I've got another question for you: In effect, is Sam saying that latent moisture in the cane is really not that big of a problem with the finished rod???? Also, when Sam says he would use the the same treatment on 'fresher' cane, would he be referring to the same cane that is available to us amateur builders??? And, if so, would he subject it any further seasoning before using it??? Thanks... Mike- from reed@speedy.palette.com Thu Mar 9 10:20:15 1995 Subject: Re: fresh cane Mike said: This is interesting! Okay Reed, I've got another question for you: In effect, is Sam saying that latent moisture in the cane is really not that big of a problem with the finished rod???? Also, when Sam says he would use the the same treatment on 'fresher' cane, would he be referring to the same cane that is available to us amateur builders??? And, if so, would he subject it any further seasoning before using it??? Just what I wanted, some insightful questions! Mike, I will ask him aboutthis. He did mention to me that with the "fresher" cane he could hear themoisture and see the moisture coming off (I would assume steam rising). Again, I didn'task him what he meant by "fresher" cane. How long was the traditional dryingtime? I would assume that it was easy to allow cane to season in the warehouse pre-embargo, while you used only the oldest pieces (he calls them "poles"but says he is learning to call them "culms"); but my assumption is worthless,I will ask. Of note, Sam saws all his cane in approx. 5/8" widths (I didn't measure orask). He does not ever expect to be able to get a single rod from a culm. He saidthat the usual practice was to cut a pile of strips and then sort out pieces.When it came to building the rods, the maker would choose finished sections (butt,mid, tip) from a pile of such based upon coloring, node spacing, etc. (Potassium permanganate was sometimes used for coloring the sticks to match.) This seemingly haphazard approach was the practice which produced the finerods of the top makers (I would assume F.E. Thomas and the Edwards qualify). I know nothing, but I'll ask questions. reed curry reed@palette.com from cbogart@ibm.net Thu Mar 9 19:43:45 1995 Subject: Sawing Cane Reed says Sam saws his cane. I' ve seen several descriptions on splitting cane but haven't seen anything yet on how one would saw cane length ways. On a table saw or band saw? Looks like alot of waste and planing if all pieces are 5/8ths inch wide - especially in tip sections. New question - how does he treat his nodes? Keep asking questions - this is a real insight into some of the "old" master's techniques before we had all this "new" technology. //---------------------------------------------------------------------------- // Regards // Chris Bogart from rcurry@jlc.net Fri Mar 10 20:11:24 1995 Subject: Re: Sawing Cane Chris Bogart said: Reed says Sam saws his cane. I' ve seen several descriptions on splitting cane but haven't seen anything yet on how one would saw cane length ways. On a table saw or band saw? Looks like alot of waste and planing if all pieces are 5/8ths inch wide - especially in tip sections. New question - how does he treat his nodes? Keep asking questions - this is a real insight into some of the "old" master's techniques before we had all this "new" technology. //---------------------------------------------------------------------------- // Regards // Chris Bogart Chris, Sam hasn't demo'd this for me yet but I saw a saw at his shop that was home-made for this job. The circular blade was approx. 4" in diameter and very thin. It would have a small kerf, little waste. from watching Sam straighten a sawn strip, I believe him when he said that there is lesswaste with sawing then splitting, especially if time is considered. He said that all of the makers that he worked with had sawn their strips; yet he never heard of a situation where the rod had splintered or failed as a result of wandering grain. Since Sam does not plane his strips but puts them on the beveler after heating and straightening, the width of the strips is immaterial. from a production perspective, the cost of the cane is slight compared to the cost of labor. Sam's beveler is interesting. He has two sets of (paired) cutters; one for quad rods and one for hex rods. Yet he has only two taper templates (the steel guides which dictate the shape of the final strip) one for the butt and one for the tip. from these two he can build an infinite variety of rods; since the "multiplier" on the beveler can be adjusted as well. He said he once spent a week modifying one of these tapers by hand. They are markered every .5" so that he can make minute adjustments. Treating nodes --- Sam files them off. He showed me a press of the typethat Gene Edwards (or Bill, I can't remember) used for pressing the nodesduring heating; Sam uses a hardwood, rather than metal, version forstraightening strips. reed curry rcurry@jlc.net reed@palette.com from stetzer@csd.uwm.edu Sat Mar 11 13:29:31 1995 Subject: Tempering oven "on the cheap" (long) This is how I built a tempering oven "on the cheap". [I just decided to try making a cane rod this winter, so I started by buying Wayne C's fine book. Which of course revealed to me that there were a few more steps than I had known about. I was keeping track of how much I had spent on this and that on the blank page at the end of the book (don't tell my wife), and when I got to the oven I thought maybe I should scale back a little.] Starting with Wayne's design. His oven is constructed of two rectangular heating ducts forming the inner and outer walls, with fiberglass insulation board in between. The heat is supplied by an (electric) mica heating strip running the length of the oven (inside) and controlled by an oven thermostat. The bound rod strips are supported on a wire mesh rack over the heat element; the strips are inserted from the open end which is closed by a removable rectangle of insulation. ordinary home center store. The inside is 5" and the outside is 6" (I wish I would have made it 7" and used more insulation; I may redo this part). Insulation was from a fiberglass water heater blanket with the plastic sheet peeled off (approx 1" thick plain fiberglass). The ducts come opened making it easy to mount your components inside, then push the seam together and it hooks shut. Their length is just right: 60". I shortened the inner one by 2 inches. A coffee can makes a perfect cap for the 5" duct and for the outer duct was capped with an Xmas gif tin I found at a resale shop. I fabricated an insulated cap for the open end out of another gift tin and some surplus insulation. I got lucky on the heating element; a local store (American Science and Surplus) had 1500 watt elements. They were U-shaped with a soft copper outside and straightened easily to be about 23" long with spade-type connectors on the ends. I bought 2, straightened and mounted them in the 5" duct with little legs of sheet metal and pop rivets, 3 legs to an element. The elements go about 4" from the ends with 4" between them in the middle and about 1" off the bottom of the duct. I hooked them in series so they draw ~750 watts. American Science also supplied a power cord and 3 pronged plug. The inside wiring was high-temp wire from an appliance repair store. I passed the internal wiring thru an electric box cable connector just to act a grommet in the duct. Both ducts are grounded to the line cord ground, and I plan on plugging it into a GFI circuit. I tried to find a cheap thermostatic control, but settled for an on-off switch and a candy thermometer mounted thru the oven wall about in the middle. I made a little sandwich of sheet metal for the thermometer probe to poke into so it doesn't dangle too near the heating elements or poke up where the cane is. The support for the cane is 58"x5" piece of 1/4" hardware cloth, held up by 6 steel wires going thru the inner duct just below the middle. The trickiest part of the whole operation was keeping the hole for the thermometer probe in the inner duct aligned with the hole in the outer duct as I shut the outer duct, but that was due mainly to my clumsiness. The thermometer probe is just below the wire rack. Finally, since the oven is round it is unstable, so I made little legs of steel strap with two blocks of wood for feet. This is what it all cost me: 5" duct .................................... $4 6" duct .................................... 5 2 elements .................................... 8 water heater insulation blanket ............... 6 10' hi-temp wire .............................. 4 insulated electric connectors for elements .... 2 1 pack pop rivets ............................. 1 electric box, switch, plate, 3 cable clamps ... 4 power cord ..................................... 2 2 gift tins .................................... 1 1"x3' strap steel for legs ..................... 2 candy thermometer .............................. 3 ---- $42 Things I had lying around: small pieces of sheet metal, 1/4" hardware cloth, steel wire, wire nut, sheet metal screws, wood blocks, coffee can. I tried it out without any cane, and used an oven thermometer inside on the rack to calibrate. The best heating method is to turn it on for a couple minutes, then off again to let the temp even out, etc., as you sneak up on the desired temp. The two thermometers read about the same after the beast gets warmed up to cooking temp. It made a little thin smoke as the oil on the ductwork cooked off. If anybody wants to try these heating elements, I'll get a pair and mail them to you for $10 total. I'm pleased with the way they worked out. ...................................................................... Frank Stetzer "...a cheerful comrade is better Information and Media Technologies than a waterproof coat and a Univ Wisconsin-Milwaukee, USA foot-warmer." Henry Van Dyke, stetzer@csd.uwm.edu "Fisherman's Luck", 1899. from rcurry@jlc.net Sun Mar 12 09:45:36 1995 Subject: Inert gas Does anyone have a source for a small quantity of inert gas that isheavier than air? I am looking for something I can put in varnish containers; I'm tired of having my varnish ruined after using just a little bit. Thanks. reed curry rcurry@jlc.net from cbogart@ibm.net Sun Mar 12 16:16:44 1995 Subject: Question for Sam Reed - thanks for the answer. I had forgotten Sam had a beveler. Us hand planers just assume things. I understand that Sam has innovativeways to how to attach ferrules to 4 sided rods. I would be interested in how he does attach ferrules without weaking the rod. There may be a fringe element out there who may want to experiment with 4 and 5 Sided rods. this could be some good info since most books only cover 6 sided rods. You should record some of your converstations with Sam for properity. //---------------------------------------------------------------------------- // Regards // Chris Bogart from Bob356@aol.com Mon Mar 13 06:25:41 1995 Subject: Re: Inert gas Reed, try your local liquor store (one specializing in wines). They mayhave the small pressurized cans of nitrogen gas sold to prevent partially-filled bottles of wine from oxidizing. Failing that, find one of the several wine magazines available: they all have mail-order ads for this. Good luck, Bob Joyce Knoxville, Tennessee from JKWOOD@CAS.UNOMAHA.EDU Mon Mar 13 08:58:15 1995 Organization: COLLEGE OF ARTS AND SCIENCES Subject: Re: Inert gas Priority: normal Does anyone have a source for a small quantity of inert gas that isheavier than air? I am looking for something I can put in varnish containers; I'm tired of having my varnish ruined after using just a little bit. Probably the cheapest way to go is to use nitrogen. It is not heavier than air but you can flush the container and quickly put the lid on. Contact the local welders supply for gas suppliers. You will pay demurrage on large cylinders. Jim James K. Wood Professor Department of Chemistry University of Nebraska at Omaha 68182-0109 phone: 402-554-3644 fax: 402-554-3100 jkwood@unomaha.edu "I play bass and fish for bass" from WayneCatt@aol.com Mon Mar 13 10:07:23 1995 Subject: Inert Gas As others have offered the solution of nitrogen gas - perhaps another solution might work and that is to reduce the amount of captive air by filling the can with marbles to increase the liquid level and reduce thevolum e of air. Or a second Idea - If you are using the finish in a dipping tube and then returning it to the quart can after finishing a rod section - consider leaving the finish in the dip tube - The reduced surface areaslows the evaporation rate of the thinner and so reduces the finish drying. Just a thought Wayne from hsc4floo@wwa.com Tue Mar 14 13:30:06 1995 Subject: Re: Tempering oven "on the cheap" (long) Frank Thanks for the insight on how to construct your oven. The cost sure is right. I have acess to a machine shop and could inquire on the cost of having tapering jigs made vs the adjustable ones in Wayne's book. Of course you give up flexibility but how often do you actually use this flexibilty. Us one or two a year builders don't really need it. On the subject of keeping varnish. I like Wayne's marble extending it up and out of the can. This can be messy but effective. When I purchased Wayne's book it was missing pg. 81-82. If anyone out 14551 Burnley Ct. Chesterfield Mo. 63017 I would greatly appreciate it. Tight Lines from cbogart@ibm.net Tue Mar 14 19:03:12 1995 Subject: re: inert gas Reading the mail on this subject, my resident expert (wife) says that her home tip books says that the plastic wrap does the trick best. Just spread it over the surface and up the sides. It effectively seals off the air. I'm now using this for my varnish can and also for my dipping tube when I don't plan on using it for awhile. In addition, one may want to put the varnish into several smaller containers and only use one at a time. //---------------------------------------------------------------------------- // Regards // Chris Bogart from rcurry@jlc.net Wed Mar 15 05:24:49 1995 Subject: Fresh cane Mike asked: This is interesting! Okay Reed, I've got another question for you: In effect, is Sam saying that latent moisture in the cane is really not that big of a problem with the finished rod???? Also, when Sam says he would use the the same treatment on 'fresher' cane, would he be referring to the same cane that is available to us amateur builders??? And, if so, would he subject it any further seasoning before using it??? Thanks... Mike- Mike, I asked Sam last night about what Edwards did with new cane. He saidthat they did not make any distinction between new and old cane; if it justcame in the door and they needed it they used it. He feels that the heat-treating with the torch drives out enough moisture. He had previously told me that F.E.Thomas, which used hide glue, had a tank with warm water where theglued and bound rods were placed awaiting straightening. I would infer from this that latent moisture (bound in the cells) could not represent a seriousproblem. reed from reed@speedy.palette.com Wed Mar 15 09:07:12 1995 Subject: Sawing cane re-visited Last night, Sam Carlson led me through the steps he takes in creating hisfour tapered strips. First he saws a wide strip on his band saw (he regretsbuying the band saw, Edwards used a circular saw and it was much easier), filesthe nodes, passes the strip through a planer to level the pith side, bevels a 15 degree angle on each side of the strip using a thin circular blade mountedin a high speed drill press, heat-treats and straightens the strip, and thenperforms the final beveling on his beveler. reed curry from cbogart@ibm.net Wed Mar 15 17:31:36 1995 Subject: Groved Plane Sole In the current Planing Form there is an article about putting a grove in the plane's sole. Looks like it could extend the life of the iron's edge. Has anyone tried this yet and if so what are the pro's and con's - especially with setting the final form to accomondate the grove. I just wanted some feedback before I try this on my plane. //---------------------------------------------------------------------------- // Regards // Chris Bogart from reed@speedy.palette.com Thu Mar 16 11:03:21 1995 Subject: NE Antique Tackle Show The New England Antique Anglers Show on March 25-26 9:00-4:00 shouldhave quite a bit of cane. Its at the Host Hotel on 111 East (Exit 28 off 495) in, I believe, Boxborough, MA. Will I see any list members there? reed curry reed@palette.com rcurry@jlc.net from sas@opus.xyplex.com Thu Mar 16 11:27:33 1995 Subject: Re: NE Antique Tackle Show Reed said... The New England Antique Anglers Show on March 25-26 9:00-4:00 shouldhave quite>a bit of cane. Its at the Host Hotel on 111 East (Exit 28 off495) in, I believe, Boxborough, MA. Be advised that the Host Hotel, which was formerly the SheratonBoxborough, is now a Holiday Inn. Got all that? :-) Reed was correct about thedirections and the town. (I live off exit 27 and work off exit 29.) - Scott ========== Scott Sminkey email: sasminkey@eng.xyplex.com Sustaining and Specials Engineering voice: 508 952-4792 Xyplex, Inc. fax: 508 952-4887 295 Foster St. (Opinions, comments, etc. are mine, Littleton, MA 01460 not Xyplex's...) from hsc4floo@wwa.com Fri Mar 17 11:43:52 1995 Subject: Re: NE Antique Tackle Show Does anyone on this conference have any info on Antique Angler shows in the St. Louis area in the upcoming months??????? Thanks Bob from MWNR19A@mail.prodigy.com Fri Mar 17 15:31:29 1995 Subject: Re: Heat and Pressure Treating Cane INFO FOR ALL CONCERNED, JED --[ FORWARDED PRIVATE MESSAGE ]-------- From: reed Subject: RE: HEAT AND PRESSURE TREATING CANE Date: 03/17/95 07:58 AM Interesting questions for Sam Did he ever heat temper beveled strips, as did a few rodmakers, for a long period of time say 48hrs and what temp? If so was this done under pressure? Does he prefer tung oil based varnish,Marine, or Polyurethane? What side of the rod (spine) did he put guides on What glue did he use for ferrules, or did he fit tight and use white lead as a lube? Jed, 1/ He never heat-treated beveled strips. His heat-treatment was the straight-forward torch method I described. His experience in the gun-works (he worked for most of the major gun companies) with years of tempering and annealing should have given him some insights re: heat-treatment. 2/ He uses Masury Cosmo Spar Varnish. This is a tung-oil, phenolic resin varnish. He claims that the 4 hour drying time is accurate and that it permits him to work under less than ideal conditions. He NEVER thins his varnish. (His emphasis) 3/ I'll ask about the side he prefers for the guides. Sam is verrrrrry particular about jumps. He has some theories about avoiding them but thinks that he will always get some blanks with jumps. Sam discards any blanks with jumps. 4/ Pliobond glue. He also will build up for ferrules sometimes with individual layers of the coarse brown paper tape used for packages (years ago). He moistens the tape and wraps it all the way around *** but not over itself***. He trims off any excess. This gives him one even layer. Repeat as necessary. He doesn't think thread works well for this. 5/ Ferrules. This will require another message (long). reed P.S. - Please pass this on to the list where it is of general interest. -------- Original message header follows -------- from reed@speedy.palette.com Fri Mar 17 07:59:01 1995 [PIM 3.2-342.56] Subject: Re: Heat and Pressure Treating Cane -------------- End of message --------------- from rcurry@jlc.net Fri Mar 17 19:08:56 1995 Subject: Varnish Paul Urban asks: On another topic, I am sure that many of us would be interested inhearing how he finished his rods (method, varnish used, viscosity, dryingtechnique). Sam Carlson uses the following: 1/ Method - Dipping. He has a rack which can hold up to 6 dip tubes (each approx. 5' high) and a crossbar which is raised by a small electric motor (okay, I forgot where he scavenged the motor and the speed he geared it to; the two most important items...darn). I think he said that it lifts at 6" every 10 seconds; I'll check that. He has a trapdoor in the ceiling which he opens for dipping. *** Important note *** This dipping is done just a few feet from a lathe, saws, 15' from the beveler; just around a corner in his workshop but in no way isolated from the dust. Sam pointed out to me the dust in the air which leads us to 2/ Varnish - Masury Cosmo Spar. Sam swears that this really dries in 4 hours. I have used it with good results. Composition: Phenolic, Linseed, Soya, TungAlkyd Resin -- 50%; Driers -- 1.8%; and Aliphatic Hydrocarbons-- 48.2%. (I hesitated to use it on "conservation" rod projects because the phenolics made it resistant to alcohol; but I will use it on new pieces without hesitation.) 3/ Viscosity - I haven't tested it but Sam says neeeeever thin it; use it straight from the can. 4/ Drying Technique - Hang the pieces out of the way. That's all for now. reed curry rcurry@jlc.net from reed@speedy.palette.com Mon Mar 20 10:11:11 1995 Subject: Bevelers To the list: Does anyone know a source of bevelers? By a beveler, I mean a machinethat, utilizing mill heads or saws, will convert on a single pass, following a template, a straight strip of consistent thickness into a finished tapered strip. (What a mouthful!) Has anyone had experience with the Herter's beveler? reed curry reed@palette.com from reed@speedy.palette.com Wed Mar 22 09:39:48 1995 Subject: Source for potassium permanganate?? Does anyone know of a source in NH or MA for a small quantity of potassium permanganate? Thanks. reed curry reed@palette.com rcurry@jlc.net from reed@speedy.palette.com Thu Mar 23 06:56:50 1995 Subject: Thanks for Potassium Perm. responses A listmember (Lonetown?) shared this: You can get potassium permanganate via mail order from: Haginow Laboratories Inc. 1302 Washington Street Manitowoc, Wis. 54220 You can probably get a phone number from information. It's available in crystals at 99 cents an ounce or as a solution at 96 cents an ounce. Good luck. I might add that all the pharmacies in my area have been absorbed by large chains with the result that simple chemicals which do not come in"blister packs" or require prescriptions are no longer available. I have always had good results from potassium permanganate, tho' it isnot truly color fast under long exposure to UV. Unfortunately alcohol-based anilinedyes are even harder to find in small quantities than potass. perm. Thanks again. reed curry reed@palette.com from ENGERBR@WSUVM1.CSC.WSU.EDU Sun Mar 26 03:33:21 1995 Subject: Names on Rods Hi all, A while back there was a thread concerning how to best write names onrods. For many years I have simply used India ink and a pen. However, on my last rodI tried something that worked very well, and I thought I'd share it witheveryone I used the CLEAR LASER LABELS from Avery (#2660), and simply formattedand printed one on my HP Laser Jet. I wrapped it around the rod, and covered it with the finish I normally use (hand rubbedd True Oil Gunstock Finish). Worked great and looks very good. You can format the fonts any way that pleases you. I used my name inscript and the rest as a normal font. One word of *WARNING* These labels come in mini sheets of 8 labelswhich are each 1" x 2 5/8. I doscovered the HARD WAY that you can only run a sheetthroug h the printer once. That is, you can not print one label, remove it from the sheet, and then print more labels on he same sheet. If you try to do that, labels can peel off and attach to the roller of the toner cartridge--andRUIN IT! I had to replace an almost new $85 cartridge. :-( Fortunately, since they hadn't warned you about this in the insstructionswith the labels, Avery paid for a new cartridge for me--and were very graciousabout it. I expect we'll see some new instruction sheets before too long. At any rate, give the method a try if you have access to a laser printer.Works great! My best to all, Dave Engerbretson engerebr@wsuvm1.csc.wsu.edu from reed@speedy.palette.com Fri Mar 31 06:19:22 1995 Subject: I forgot to mention... Re: Sam's preparing of splines. I neglected to mention an important step. After beveling the strips andjust prior to gluing, Sam cleans each strip of saw marks. To do this he has two scrapers (flat pieces of hard steel e.g. cabinet scrapers) set in a vise and fixed at a 90 degree angle (for quads, 60 for hex). Holding a strip by thebutt he drops it into the V of the scrapers and applying slight pressure on thefar side with a strip of cane held in his left hand, pulls the strip straight back with his right. He will perform this two or three times for each strip untilhe feels no resistance on the pull. The result is a strip clean of any sawmarks. from reed@speedy.palette.com Fri Mar 31 10:49:54 1995 Subject: A winding tip Under those unique conditions when I have not rubbed the rod with varnishbefore installing the guides and I wish to use color preservative, I have foundthat the silk slips on the clean cane. Getting those first few wraps to reallygrab can be difficult. So I have taken to applying, with a bodkin, a small line of thinned lacquer (e.g., head cement, color preservative) on two opposingflats; only on the area to be covered by silk. After the lacquer dries it gives just enough grip to the thread to make winding, if not a joy at least lessannoying. reed curry reed@palette.com rcurry@jlc.net