from rmoon@ida.net Sun Mar 1 07:13:31 1998 Subject: Re: test Is the list very slow, or do I have problems. 2 messages in 24 hours? from Fallcreek9@aol.com Sun Mar 1 07:24:42 1998 Subject: Re: Annotated Archives on CD? In a message dated 98-02-25 21:04:26 EST, you write: Hello Fernando - happy to see you are still involved in the art of bamboorodbuilding.Best Regards,Richard from saltwein@swbell.net Sun Mar 1 08:18:02 1998 Subject: Gluing/urac 185 I was looking at the side of the resin can, urac 185, and it stated thatyou could remove clamping in 1.5 hours. For our purposes how longshould I leave the rod section in the drying tube with the 100 watt bulbheating it. Gluing up day has arrived! Regards, SteveIndependence, MO from channer@frontier.net Sun Mar 1 08:33:55 1998 Subject: test Ralph;I was wondering the same thing, until your message came thru. Everyonemustbe out fishing,which is a real good idea, I'm on my way out the door to theSan Juan right now,Bye.John Channer from channer@frontier.net Sun Mar 1 08:39:45 1998 Subject: gluing,urac185 Steve;Glue up today,strip string and sand after work tomorrow. It won't hurt toheat treat tomorrow at 200d for 4-5 min.BTW, did you get the Am Cl I Good Luck and Strait sections to you!!!John Channer from TSmithwick@aol.com Sun Mar 1 08:39:53 1998 Subject: Re: Re: brush varnishing In a message dated 3/1/98 3:59:12 AM, you wrote: Ian -- It is no accident that I have a good supply of shot glasses from mstevens@ptdprolog.net Sun Mar 1 08:40:03 1998 0000 Subject: "Radio" rod ID Hi, Can anyone ID a rod called: "RADIO" trademark reg. US Patent Office This info stamped on the NS reel seat. It seems to be calcutta cane andwell made. NS fittings thru-out. 9' one tip with perfection type top andone with a tiny agate top. The agate topped tip is slightly lighter. Tipscontained in a quality aluminum tip tube with brass cap. This rod seems to be one of the Catskill type. Long and very light line. Itwill be for sale after I get an ID. Thanks for any help. Mike Michael StevensRR 1 Box 307CEffort PA 18330 610 681 5670 mstevens@ptdprolog.net Stevens Sight & Tool CoMaker of fine sights for antique single shot target rifles Collector of Heddon and other bamboo flyrods and casting rods. HeddonRiverRunt Spooks and Coxe baitcasting reels. from d_price@global2000.net Sun Mar 1 09:02:08 1998 mail1.global2000.net (8.9.6/SecureMode) with SMTP id KAA01276 for; Sun, 1 Mar 1998 10:01:58 -0500 Subject: Vacuum Bagging Hi All,just finnished tapering all my strips and thinking about the glueingstraitening process...Anybody try vacuumbagging instead ofbinding....Iwould think if you where going to place them in your steelform while drying the binding cord could create some problems....while awrap of 6 mil plastic would have a constant thikness and would help itto slip into the proper seat in the forms, also protect fromglue....All you would have to do is apply the glue and take like a threeinch strip of the plastic and fold over the length of the rod and sealthe edges with tape, insert the vacuum hose in the end and tape pullsome vacuum on it....and make sure to push the rod to one side while thevaccum is pulling down...Then place in your form with a peice of steelon top and heat....you have have accesss to a vacuum pump that wouldpull like 25" of mercury, and I'm shure there would be anough clampingto do the jobJust an Idea!!!! (anybody want a neat binder???)Dave Price from jfoster@gte.net Sun Mar 1 09:13:32 1998 Subject: Re: Vacuum Bagging Dave Sounds like a great idea, let us know how it turns out. Jerry from Fallcreek9@aol.com Sun Mar 1 09:16:55 1998 Subject: Re: test In a message dated 98-03-01 08:15:57 EST, you write: Ralph : seems to have slowed quite a bit, but not that slow. Abour 1/4thto1/3d speed at this address compared to 4-5 days ago. RTyree from plipton@sunvalley.net Sun Mar 1 09:31:44 1998 0700 (208.14.167.24) Subject: Bamboo and I Robert: Wayne's 6'3" rod is my personal favorite. I have built it both as a twopiece and as a three piece. I prefer the two piece but for travelingfellows, a case 2'1" long is very handy. I consider this a dry fly rod and casting to them. This rod has a delicate presentation. The shortlength is easy to handle hiking through the trees and it does not getwrapped up in overhanging limbs when casting. It is also fun todemonstrate to my graphite buddies that size is not everything. Afinesse rod can land very big fish. When conditions change to windy days and big water, I change rods. The6'3" rod does not have the length I need to mend my line on long driftsthrough rough water. It also lacks the backbone to chuck and duck. Imean nymphing with split shot and indicators - not that I do thatmyself. There are no witnesses and you couldn't prove I did it. Phil ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ PO Box 1003, Sun Valley, ID 83353208-726-9559, 208-622-8585 Fax 208- 726-0191~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ from flyfisher@cmix.com Sun Mar 1 09:52:33 1998 Subject: RE:"Radio" rod ID RO>Hi, RO>Can anyone ID a rod called: RO> "RADIO" RO>Mike Mike, Dick Spurr had a "Radio" rod listed back in his winter 95 list.Blk/yellow tipped yellow wraps. He said it was by an unknown earlyrodmaker. Dick's was a 4/5 wt and he called it had a "dainty slowaction". With the one agate tiptop and calcutta cane - your's soundsearly too. Sorry but that the only info. I have. Don Burns from saltwein@swbell.net Sun Mar 1 10:09:56 1998 Subject: first section glued To All, I used urac 185. I bound my strips by hand with a small jig to supportthe rod, hold the thread and thread tensioner. To say this was an experience would be an understatement! The gluestarted getting tacky a lot quicker than I expected. My 15 or so testruns, dry, were great, but dry and wet is a totally different thing. I had worked out a little procedure to tension my thread after knottingon the strips. Worked great until I grabbed my thread spool with a handfull of glue. I got through the glue up ok but had to spin a lot ofthread off of that spool to make it viable for another go. I believe I am going to have to build a binder if I am to continue usingurac. I have some questions for those more experienced with this glue: As I sit here writing this it has been an hour since I mixed my glue. The residue is setting in a coffee can, in an ice bath, and is a nicecarmel texture. It seems as if you could still use it. When I actually applied it to the strips it felt as though it wastacking in about 3-4 minutes. This glue will not cure without somewarmth 65* up. If you were working at that temperature would you haveunlimited open time? Has anyone tried a higher (used 4 to 1) concentration of resin topowder? On the time table of twenty minutes I had about five minutes ofstraightening time. I didn't feel that this was adequate, but time willtell. The section didn't seem too bad when I put it in the toaster. I am going to wait to see what happens to this section before I do theother two. I may be building a binder before I planned to. Comments? Regards, SteveIndependence, MO from c.max.j@vip.cybercity.dk Sun Mar 1 10:37:04 1998 (CET)(envelope- from c.max.j@vip.cybercity.dk) vip.cybercity.dk (8.8.3/8.8.2) with ESMTP id RAA17046 for; Sun, 1 Mar 1998 17:10:31 +0100 (CET) Subject: Re: test ----------From: Ralph W Moon Subject: Re: testDate: 1. marts 1998 13:59 Is the list very slow, or do I have problems. 2 messages in 24 hours? Ralph I think You got a problem. Out of bitter experience: try unsubscribing andthe subscribing again. This might solve Your problem. I had to do thismyself a couple of days ago Yours truly Carsten from rmoon@ida.net Sun Mar 1 12:37:11 1998 Subject: Re: test Thanks to all who replied. It seems ok now. 14 in just a couple ofhours. I have had some problems and talked to Jerry about it. Think Ihve solved everything. HA!!! from knut@shaw.fidalgo.net Sun Mar 1 12:41:01 1998 Subject: Re: test Hello I live in germany and i am looking fro a planing from can anybody give mesome hints where i can get one ? Thank you Knut Schubert from mcreek@sirus.com Sun Mar 1 13:31:55 1998 Subject: Re: test you may be experiencing technical difficulty. I've had 30. Brian from mcreek@sirus.com Sun Mar 1 13:39:28 1998 Subject: Re: first section glued I built a variation of the binder Bob Crompton has in the FAQ page onRodmakers. Works well. I think any binder is going to require somefussing before it works right, no matter how simple or ornate. Andbuilding the binder is pretty fun! Brian from hexagon@odyssee.net Sun Mar 1 13:54:56 1998 (205.236.248.99) Subject: beveller I am interested in if any of the members have invested in the Bellingerbeveller? I have just visited the web site. from what I can gather is that the cane must be split, straightened andthe nodes flatened and a 60 deg angle planed on before the strip ispassed through. The strip must then be planed to the correct dimensionsas the beveller does not finish to size. that it is the the operations that the beveller does not do are the onesthat take the time.Terry Ackland from Grhghlndr@aol.com Sun Mar 1 16:05:36 1998 Subject: Re: Re: smooth it out No it shouldn't that glue takes a stronger or hotter solvent to be effected.sorry for the delay in answering as I just got back from Tennessee. Wentdowntrout fishing for 4 days.Bret from Grhghlndr@aol.com Sun Mar 1 16:41:55 1998 Subject: Re: Re: Why? GW,I am glad that you stuck it out and showed those a--holes at Orifice thatyoucan build a better bamboo rod than they could ever hope for. I have anOrifice 8' 6wght Battenhell that is pure junk. They never have built a rodthat i thought could cast without falling down on the job after 30 ft.Bret from jfoster@gte.net Sun Mar 1 16:44:49 1998 Subject: Re: beveller Terrance Welcome Back. We've missed you. I looked over your page again lastweek. I have to update your link. You just bevel to get 60's don't you? regards Jerry from rmoon@ida.net Sun Mar 1 17:53:23 1998 Subject: Re: beveller Terry I just finished making Bob Milward's beveler, at a total cost ofabout $30 and I think it will do all that the $3000 one will, still,one has to hand split, smooth the nodes triangulate then bevel with themachine, then plane to final taper. I admit that Bob shows a way ofattaining the final taper with the beveler, which I have not tried yet.beyond some slight help in getting rid of some of the surplas cane, Idon't think it adds too much. Ralph from anglport@con2.com Sun Mar 1 18:25:43 1998 admin.con2.com (8.7.4/8.7.3) with SMTP id TAA04741 for Subject: Re: beveller At 04:39 PM 3/1/98 -0700, you wrote:Terry I just finished making Bob Milward's beveler, at a total cost ofabout $30 and I think it will do all that the $3000 one will, still,one has to hand split, smooth the nodes triangulate then bevel with themachine, then plane to final taper. I admit that Bob shows a way ofattaining the final taper with the beveler, which I have not tried yet.beyond some slight help in getting rid of some of the surplas cane, Idon't think it adds too much. Ralph Ralph,OK, where'd you see the plans for a homebuilt beveller? I've seenthe Milward binder and if his beveller is half as ingenious as his binder Iwant to see it!! I tried to come up with his idea for counter-rotatingwheels on and off for about 5 YEARS (even enlisted a fellow who was atopology freak to try to turn it into some other shape so I could attack it from a new prospective) and came up empty! I never considered putting thespools on the wheels!If Mr Milward doesn't have pix of his on-line (and it's notviolating copyright laws) you've GOT to get yours out there.PLEASE!Art from tyoung@perth.dialix.com.au Sun Mar 1 18:36:46 1998 Mon, 2 Mar 1998 08:35:50 +0800 (WST)(envelope- from tyoung) Subject: Re: first section glued On Sun, 1 Mar 1998, Steve Trauthwein wrote: I used urac 185. I bound my strips by hand with a small jig to supportthe rod, hold the thread and thread tensioner. To say this was an experience would be an understatement! The gluestarted getting tacky a lot quicker than I expected. My 15 or so testruns, dry, were great, but dry and wet is a totally different thing. I had worked out a little procedure to tension my thread after knottingon the strips. Worked great until I grabbed my thread spool with a handfull of glue. I got through the glue up ok but had to spin a lot ofthread off of that spool to make it viable for another go. It does get a little tacky but I don't use any means of supporting the blank while binding, I just hold it either verticaly or horizontaly depending on how it wants to hang for the section I'm up to.I use a large bobbin holder to hold the spool and a cup hook that I wrap the thread around a couple of times clamped to my bench for tension on thethread. Tony /***********************************************************************/Tony Younghttp://www.iinet.net.au/~mainpeak/flyrod.htmlThe Australian connection/***********************************************************************/ from hexagon@odyssee.net Sun Mar 1 18:47:14 1998 (205.236.248.236) Subject: Re: beveller Jerry Foster wrote: Terrance Welcome Back. We've missed you. I looked over your page again lastweek. I have to update your link. You just bevel to get 60's don't you? regards Jerry Thanks Jerry,I find that getting the strip straight and the nodes flat and anaccurate 60 deg. angle is where all the work is, The rest is fun.I use a beveller to add the 60deg angle to a strip that has beenmachined to a rectangular cross section. It takes very little arm workto add the taper.PS Beveller or beveler? one L just does not look right to me. I knowthat in the UK we visit a jeweller. I guess an L got lost on the way. from Ragnarig@aol.com Sun Mar 1 18:53:17 1998 Subject: Re: test Knut Schubert writes: Dear Knut Colorado Bootstrap, according to Frank Neunemann, will ship to Germany.http://home.earthlink.net/~bootstrap/fishing/ Frank's homepage is :http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/FNeunemann/BZBambooMain.html Which part of Germany is your home. I take it you are visiting somebody inmyarea, as I've never heard the names "Fidalgo" and "Shaw" ( from your e-mailaddress) anywhere else! Davy Riggs from FISHWOOL@aol.com Sun Mar 1 19:10:04 1998 Subject: Re: Re: dickfurhman (best planing form) Jerry,Hoching it? tsk, tsk!Hank. from rmoon@ida.net Sun Mar 1 19:28:21 1998 Subject: Re: beveller sorry I did not mean to be so long winded, but I didn't know how toget it to you any fasterRalph from DrBamboo@aol.com Sun Mar 1 19:43:14 1998 Subject: Re: Bamboo and I Phil;Got a 6' 3 " 4 wt. that'll blow your socks off.George from DrBamboo@aol.com Sun Mar 1 19:51:37 1998 Subject: Re: beveller Terry;The machine saves me ~ 8 hours per rod.I've been building rods for 10years.Can'timprove on times at most operations,and can't stop arthritis or carpalstunnel.I lovemy new machine.I do this for a living, not just for fun.George from jfoster@gte.net Sun Mar 1 19:59:04 1998 Subject: Re: Bamboo and I Was that a teaser George? Jerry from rmoon@ida.net Sun Mar 1 20:03:09 1998 Subject: Re: beveller Sorry the message rejected, Too big. I'll have to try againRalph from FISHWOOL@aol.com Sun Mar 1 20:07:48 1998 Subject: Re: Re: beveller Terry,We colonials don't know how to spell. Look at how we spell color,etc.Regards,Hank. from FISHWOOL@aol.com Sun Mar 1 20:08:16 1998 Subject: Re: Re: Why? Amen, BretHankP.S. Someone on the list said they're made to last ,not to cast. from mcreek@sirus.com Sun Mar 1 20:08:35 1998 Subject: Splitting I just tried Darryl's C-clamp splitting method. It works so slick Ican't believe it. Had big growers mark on the butt, and a leaf scar onthe tip, but still got 26 good strips from the tip. If you haven'ttried this and have any trouble splitting evenly, you owe it to yourselfto give it a go. Brian from FISHWOOL@aol.com Sun Mar 1 20:09:09 1998 Subject: Re: Re: plane blades To all,Why groove your plane when by setting you taper shallower than yourfinaldimensions by .002" or .003" and careful planing and micrometer use youwon'ttouch the form? Just my $.01/2.Hank. from FISHWOOL@aol.com Sun Mar 1 20:13:12 1998 Subject: Re: Re: test Ralph,I've rec'd so many messages-about 50/day that I'm consideringunsubscribing.Regards,Hank. from FISHWOOL@aol.com Sun Mar 1 20:16:43 1998 Subject: Re: Re: first section glued Steve,If you get glue on any spool of binding thread you're going to haveproblems,binder or not-I've been there.Hank. from mcreek@sirus.com Sun Mar 1 20:19:06 1998 Subject: Dickerson 8615 Guide Does anyone have this taper from Dickerson notes, not from a mic-edrod? I want to build a nice, fast, biggish rod for shooting size 10 Hexspinners from a moving boat. Has anyone built the 8615 in the taperarchive? Thanks for the help. Brian from hexagon@odyssee.net Sun Mar 1 20:40:37 1998 (205.236.249.174) Subject: Re: beveller DrBamboo wrote: Terry;The machine saves me ~ 8 hours per rod.I've been building rods for 10years.Can'timprove on times at most operations,and can't stop arthritis or carpalstunnel.I lovemy new machine.I do this for a living, not just for fun.George Dr.If you are genuinely managing to make a living from making bambooflyrodswithout any other means of support you have my deepest admiration. Ihavebeen building rods for over 15 years and it was once my dream to be arodmaker but I decided to stick to tool and die making.You have to make a lot of rods to cover 7 weeks vacation, sick pay, freemedical and dental plus a pension.I had 10 weeks total off work with pay for operations for carpal tunnel, ifI had been a rodmaker working for myself it would have been devastating.The last time I saw a true professional rodmaker friend of mine hiselectricity had been cut off and his bamboo supplier would not re-supplyhimuntil he had paid for his last shipment.All I am hoping for now is to try to keep the interest going until I take mypension whereby knocking out a few rods pays for a nice vacation.Terry from Fallcreek9@aol.com Sun Mar 1 21:10:48 1998 Subject: Re: beveller Art : The Milward device is included in The Best of the Planing Form. Itwasoriginally in Planing Form Issue # 6, Nov/Dec, 1990RTyree from anglport@con2.com Sun Mar 1 21:25:19 1998 admin.con2.com (8.7.4/8.7.3) with SMTP id WAA15249 for Subject: Re: beveller At 10:05 PM 3/1/98 EST, you wrote:Art : The Milward device is included in The Best of the Planing Form. Itwasoriginally in Planing Form Issue # 6, Nov/Dec, 1990RTyree Thanks. My wife is ordering "The Best..." for my B'day present. That shouldgive me some MORE reading to occupy my time. Art from d_price@global2000.net Sun Mar 1 21:34:18 1998 mail1.global2000.net (8.9.6/SecureMode) with SMTP id WAA00472 for; Sun, 1 Mar 1998 22:34:11 -0500 Subject: Re: beveller DrBamboo wrote: Terry;The machine saves me ~ 8 hours per rod.I've been building rods for 10years.Can'timprove on times at most operations,and can't stop arthritis or carpalstunnel.I lovemy new machine.I do this for a living, not just for fun.George How can a machine save 8 hours on a job that takes less than 3hours todo by hand (beveling one side to 60 deg)Dave Price from jfoster@gte.net Sun Mar 1 22:02:40 1998 Subject: archives Feb. archives on line.. jerry from Ragnarig@aol.com Sun Mar 1 22:48:22 1998 Subject: Re: beveller Terry Ackland wrote: You have to make a lot of rods to cover 7 weeksvacation... from Nodewrrior@aol.com Sun Mar 1 23:36:01 1998 Subject: Re:C-clamp Splitting I tried it and it didn't go very smothly. I must've missed something in thedescription which I still have printed out here somewhere. Maybe if I canseeit done in person at Grayrock this year I'll catch on. Rob from tedgodfreys@erols.com Mon Mar 2 00:21:29 1998 Subject: Re: Re: test -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: test Ralph,I've rec'd so many messages-about 50/day that I'm consideringunsubscribing.Regards,Hank. Hank, Please don't. That would be a big loss to us all!! ted from tyoung@perth.dialix.com.au Mon Mar 2 02:32:50 1998 Mon, 2 Mar 1998 16:32:23 +0800 (WST)(envelope- from tyoung) Subject: Re: beveller On Sun, 1 Mar 1998, FISHWOOL wrote: Terry,We colonials don't know how to spell. Look at how we spell color,etc.Regards,Hank.You mean colour don't you? /***********************************************************************/Tony Younghttp://www.iinet.net.au/~mainpeak/flyrod.htmlThe Australian connection/***********************************************************************/ from tyoung@perth.dialix.com.au Mon Mar 2 02:39:36 1998 Mon, 2 Mar 1998 16:39:14 +0800 (WST)(envelope- from tyoung) Subject: Re: test On Sun, 1 Mar 1998, FISHWOOL wrote: Ralph,I've rec'd so many messages-about 50/day that I'm consideringunsubscribing.Regards,Hank. Don't do that Hank, it wont last. Tony /***********************************************************************/Tony Younghttp://www.iinet.net.au/~mainpeak/flyrod.htmlThe Australian connection/***********************************************************************/ from jcooper@interalpha.co.uk Mon Mar 2 03:28:30 1998 post.interalpha.net (8.8.7/8.6.11) with SMTP id JAA28033 for; Mon, 2 Mar 1998 09:30:53 GMT Subject: Re: Vacuum Bagging At 10:02 01/03/98 -0800, you wrote:Hi All,just finnished tapering all my strips and thinking about the glueingstraitening process...Anybody try vacuumbagging instead ofbinding....Iwould think if you where going to place them in your steelform while drying the binding cord could create some problems....while awrap of 6 mil plastic would have a constant thikness and would help itto slip into the proper seat in the forms, also protect fromglue....All you would have to do is apply the glue and take like a threeinch strip of the plastic and fold over the length of the rod and sealthe edges with tape, insert the vacuum hose in the end and tape pullsome vacuum on it....and make sure to push the rod to one side while thevaccum is pulling down...Then place in your form with a peice of steelon top and heat....you have have accesss to a vacuum pump that wouldpull like 25" of mercury, and I'm shure there would be anough clampingto do the jobJust an Idea!!!! (anybody want a neat binder???)Dave Price Clever idea this. I've done similar things in boat building with Westsystemepoxy, and it works. Room for serious lift in technique with some experimentation. John Cooper (England) from jaw12@health.state.ny.us Mon Mar 2 08:38:53 1998 (InterLock SMTP Gateway 3.0 for rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu);Mon, 2 Mar 1998 09:38:20 -0500 Subject: Applying varnish by hand Okay, Here is my poor man's technique for varnish. I think it is awhole lot easier than brushing and you don't have to make any diptubes. (BTW: this isn't original, I read about it on the ManhattanCustom Tackle web page and said no way... the I tried it. It worksgreat.) I hang the rod pieces in the shop. I used warm varish or actuall I havebeen coating using Flexicoat epoxy... Get surgical glove. If it hastalcum on it as a preservative (you'll see it) slip the gole on andrinse you hands in water. Now dry up. This is you applicator. Load youfingeres with your coating. Start at the top of the rod, wrap yourfingers around, and then slide you hand down. The glove will start todrag when you are running low with coating. Try changing you grip orreload you hand with coating. When you get to the bottom, go back tothe top and try to squiggy the coating off with you hand. You want evenresistance from top to bottom. I can do two sections in 15 minutes with setup and cleanup. You canworking the coating thin and do three coats with light sanding between. It works so well, I haven't bothered to do anything else. P.S. The flexicoat epoxy can be colored with epoxy pigments. Troanslucent or opaque tones are possible. The best source for this(that I have found) is bumming some from a shop that does fiberglassboat repairs... from dryfly@erols.com Mon Mar 2 11:46:50 1998 Subject: Re: beveller David Price wrote: DrBamboo wrote: Terry;The machine saves me ~ 8 hours per rod.I've been building rods for 10years.Can'timprove on times at most operations,and can't stop arthritis or carpalstunnel.I lovemy new machine.I do this for a living, not just for fun.George How can a machine save 8 hours on a job that takes less than 3hours todo by hand (beveling one side to 60 deg)Dave Price Dave I think there has been some misunderstanding between a beveller and amilling machine. The beveller cuts the straightened strips to untaperedequilateral triangles while the milling machine tapers the strips. Bothmachines combined save considerable time and ultimately reduce theamoutof time spent in final handplaning. I've seen both machines in actionand they are slick but pricey. Just my $.02Bob from Grhghlndr@aol.com Mon Mar 2 12:28:25 1998 Subject: Re: RE: Why???? Matt,I enjoyed what you said about bamboo and let me add I am glad you arestillwith us and I'm sure your parents thank God every day for the same. Myownson is 16 and him and I have been flyfishing together since he was 5. Ibought him a graphite rod to start out with and have since given him 3bamboorods to go with his collection. He always told me that he wanted to fishbamboo since we started because that is what dad fishes with. He brokehisfirst bamboo rod on a Muskegon River Rainbow 2 years ago and I thoughtthepoor little kid was going to die from a broken heart, but I told him don'tworry dad can fix it for you. He comes down to my shop and just stares at the culms of bamboo and Ican tellthat he is getting ready to start making rods any time now.Just like his dad and my dad before me I can tell that he just loves thesmellof a cane rod as it comes out of the tube. You guys know the smell it isthebest smell in the world. Sometimes we just sit and look the rods overwithouta word being spoken, but you can see it in our eyes the love of bamboo. Now Ifish alot with guys who just give me H for sticking with cane but I justdon'tlike anything else. I was down in Tennessee this past week with Carl Richards and he justloves agood graphite rod (is there such a thing?) and he asked me " why don't youfish graphite so you can get some distance in your casts" I just smiled andthought to myself a girl is just a girl but a good cigar is a great smoke.Bret from Fallcreek9@aol.com Mon Mar 2 14:36:10 1998 Subject: Re: Applying varnish by hand John - it sounds so logical that one wonders why it hasn't been mentionedbefore. Sounds like it meets the most important criterion, it works. Btw,what is the url for the Manhattan Custom Tackle web page? Sounds likeitmight be interesting. Best Regards,Richard from ISHIKAWA@ipmet1.ipmet.unesp.br Mon Mar 2 14:43:53 1998 4.1/UCB5.64/4.03) Subject: Re: UF glue and Nodeless Chris,Thanks for the advice. I called Franklin in USA and they directed to theirrepresentatives here in Brazil. They told me they sell TITEBOND-II butonlyin 500 lbs bucket. Then I asked if I could have a sample. Kind guys!. :)Tomorrow I give details about the glues I have tested.Regards,Sergio On Sat, 28 Feb 1998, Chris Bogart wrote: SergioHow wet do you plan to get your rods? You will have varnishon them - the cork grip will prob utilize the same glue - so if it getsthatwet - then you will have other problems - big ones. Waterproof is nicebut it is like the discussions on hide glue - it got to get very wet andstaywet - so if you plan to be a responsible rod owner - you will be ok.I would try the yellow first. Also note in Garrison book he didsome of his repairs with white glue.Chris On Fri, 27 Feb 1998 13:27:53 +0000, Sergio Hiroshi ISHIKAWA wrote: Chris,Borden has a plant here in Brazil, I bought two glues from them.One is named "wood glue" (in Portuguese) and it's yellow andanother is "Cascorez Extra" and is white. I glued some splicesas a test and will get the results by tomorrow.Probably they aren't water proof, otherwise I think they wouldadvertise on the label, problems?Sergio Chris Bogart wrote: SergioYou prob have an equivalent glue. Franklin makes the stuff I use but itsimilarto most woodworking yellow glues - It will give you a quick grab andset upand youcan unclamp in a hour - but don't stress for 24hrs. Borden has anequivalent glue.Hard to guess brand names in Brazil - but look around. Chris Regards Chris from ISHIKAWA@ipmet1.ipmet.unesp.br Mon Mar 2 14:47:14 1998 4.1/UCB5.64/4.03) Subject: Re: beveller Terry,Wellcome back to the list. Now I'm in Brazil.Regards,Sergio Dr.If you are genuinely managing to make a living from making bambooflyrodswithout any other means of support you have my deepest admiration. Ihavebeen building rods for over 15 years and it was once my dream to be arodmaker but I decided to stick to tool and die making.You have to make a lot of rods to cover 7 weeks vacation, sick pay, freemedical and dental plus a pension.I had 10 weeks total off work with pay for operations for carpal tunnel,ifI had been a rodmaker working for myself it would have beendevastating.The last time I saw a true professional rodmaker friend of mine hiselectricity had been cut off and his bamboo supplier would not re-supplyhimuntil he had paid for his last shipment.All I am hoping for now is to try to keep the interest going until I takemypension whereby knocking out a few rods pays for a nice vacation.Terry from dhaftel@att.com Mon Mar 2 15:16:40 1998 8.6/EMS-1.2sol2) Server InternetMail Connector Version 4.0.995.52) 16:17:00-0500 Subject: RE: Lathe Wizards 4.0.995.52 To All, The URL for South Bend Lathes is: http://www.southbendlathecorp.com Cool site, btw. Enjoy... Dennis Haftel -----Original Message-----From: LECLAIR123 [SMTP:LECLAIR123@aol.com]Sent: Saturday, February 28, 1998 3:03 PM Subject: Re: Lathe Wizards Dave,Try contacting PKE Inc. at 847-362-0014 or try Barry Aronson at 516-798-6330 for South Bend Lathe Parts.I know South Bend Latheshas a web sight.I'm not sure of the address. Try www.South Bend.com ,ifthat doesn't work, maybe some one on the list has there URL Good luck, Dave L. from rclarke@eou.edu Mon Mar 2 15:22:56 1998 Subject: Re: Why? I hate to admit it, but I have an Orvis 2wt graphite that is a blast tofish with. Robert Clarke ----------From: Grhghlndr Subject: Re: Why?Date: Sunday, March 01, 1998 2:22 PM GW,I am glad that you stuck it out and showed those a--holes at Orifice thatyoucan build a better bamboo rod than they could ever hope for. I have anOrifice 8' 6wght Battenhell that is pure junk. They never have built arodthat i thought could cast without falling down on the job after 30 ft.Bret from DBURRILL@TELEHUB.com Mon Mar 2 15:37:27 1998 Subject: RE: Lathe Wizards There are two South Bend lathe books for sale on eBay. (www.ebay.com)They are both titled "How to Run a Lathe" and are reasonably priced sofar. Item #'s 6900213 and 7123712. -----Original Message-----From: Haftel, Dennis, CT [SMTP:dhaftel@att.com]Sent: Monday, March 02, 1998 1:17 PM Subject: RE: Lathe Wizards To All, The URL for South Bend Lathes is: http://www.southbendlathecorp.com Cool site, btw. Enjoy... Dennis Haftel -----Original Message-----From: LECLAIR123 [SMTP:LECLAIR123@aol.com]Sent: Saturday, February 28, 1998 3:03 PM Subject: Re: Lathe Wizards Dave,Try contacting PKE Inc. at 847-362-0014 or tryBarry Aronson at 516-798-6330 for South Bend Lathe Parts.I know South BendLathes has a web sight.I'm not sure of the address. Try www.SouthBend.com ,if that doesn't work, maybe some one on the list has there URL Good luck, Dave L. from GDAVIS@EXODUS.VALPO.EDU Mon Mar 2 16:06:48 1998 #20257) rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu; Mon,2 Mar 1998 16:08:05 CST Subject: varnish tube I'd like to use a plug to close my dipping tube. I have a choice of black rubber, silicone rubber or cork. Opinions? - Grayson from plipton@sunvalley.net Mon Mar 2 17:06:01 1998 forged)) 0700 (208.14.167.33) Subject: beveller Terry: I have one of Al Bellinger's machines. I call it a milling machine todistinguish it from another machine I got from George Maurer. Thebeveler from George cuts a 60 degree angle on one side of a bamboostrip. The strip has to be flipped from side to side on successivepasses. When the strips are cleaned up, straight and flat, then they cango onto Al's milling machine and it will cut a 60 degree angle on bothsides at once as it cuts a taper towards the tip. You need the bevelerto prepare strips for the milling machine. There is a lot of money tied up in two machines. You can build rodswithout them. I agree with George's (DrBamboo) estimate that it savesabout 8 hours of planing. That is a full days work, longer if you haveto split up your time. Getting my strips on to the 60 degree angle inthe form is the most tedious and onerous part of the task - to me. Hereis a way to get it exactly right in short order. Is it worth it? Maybe,I am not selling my setup. The downside to the milling machine is that the strips it produces arenot ready to glue. You still need to do the last 50 thousands in theplaning form. For all that money, you would think you could get it righton the mark. I hope there is a refinement coming down the road that willdo that. Phil ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ PO Box 1003, Sun Valley, ID 83353208-726-9559, 208-622-8585 Fax 208- 726-0191~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ from jlintvet@clarityconnect.com Mon Mar 2 17:55:09 1998 mail.clarityconnect.com with SMTP (Eudora Internet Mail Server 2.0.1);Mon, 2Mar 1998 18:56:04 -0500 Subject: Silk Line I am sorry for taking bandw idth but I guess this is bamboo related. I wanted to try restoring a silk line so I stopped by a antique shop. The only line they had was on a H&I automatic reel. Anyone know if these are really common or worth a little money. He wanted $30, but I didn't need a reel that isn't really functional for me. These side mounted it looks like. Anyhow...I was wondering if anyone out here had a old line I could buy/trade for. Just wanted to try something else. Thanks in advance. Jon Lintvet12B College Circle Ithaca, NY 14850(800) 836- 7558 (607) 277-9781 from saltwein@swbell.net Mon Mar 2 18:18:18 1998 Subject: custom tackle/tenn Does anyone have a phone number for Custom Tackle in Tenn. I mailed arequest for a catalog and received no answer from them. Thanks. Regards, Steve from rclarke@eou.edu Mon Mar 2 18:40:21 1998 Subject: Re: Silk Line Jon, I have 2 or 3 lines that look weaved with a plastic-like coating onthem. I think someone mentioned a similar line earlier. Not sure if theyare silk. Anyone know? Robert Clarkerclarke@eou.edu ----------From: Jon Lintvet Subject: Silk LineDate: Monday, March 02, 1998 10:55 AM I am sorry for taking bandw idth but I guess this is bamboo related. I wanted to try restoring a silk line so I stopped by a antique shop. The only line they had was on a H&I automatic reel. Anyone know if these are really common or worth a little money. He wanted $30, but I didn't need a reel that isn't really functional for me. These side mounted it looks like. Anyhow...I was wondering if anyone out here had a old line I could buy/trade for. Just wanted to try something else. Thanks in advance. Jon Lintvet12B College Circle Ithaca, NY 14850(800) 836- 7558 (607) 277-9781 from thramer@presys.com Mon Mar 2 19:14:57 1998 0000 Subject: Re: beveller Philip Lipton wrote: Terry: I have one of Al Bellinger's machines. I call it a milling machine todistinguish it from another machine I got from George Maurer. Thebeveler from George cuts a 60 degree angle on one side of a bamboostrip. The strip has to be flipped from side to side on successivepasses. When the strips are cleaned up, straight and flat, then they cango onto Al's milling machine and it will cut a 60 degree angle on bothsides at once as it cuts a taper towards the tip. You need the bevelerto prepare strips for the milling machine. There is a lot of money tied up in two machines. You can build rodswithout them. I agree with George's (DrBamboo) estimate that it savesabout 8 hours of planing. That is a full days work, longer if you haveto split up your time. Getting my strips on to the 60 degree angle inthe form is the most tedious and onerous part of the task - to me. Hereis a way to get it exactly right in short order. Is it worth it? Maybe,I am not selling my setup. The downside to the milling machine is that the strips it produces arenot ready to glue. You still need to do the last 50 thousands in theplaning form. For all that money, you would think you could get it righton the mark. I hope there is a refinement coming down the road that willdo that. Phil ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ PO Box 1003, Sun Valley, ID 83353208-726-9559, 208-622-8585 Fax 208- 726-0191~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ A true one step beveler would have to cost 3-4 times as much as aBellinger. A.J.Thramer from channer@frontier.net Mon Mar 2 19:19:15 1998 Subject: McKenzie lines All;Does anyone know anything about the McKenzie Bamboo fly linesadvertized inthe Bamboo Fly Rod magazine? Such as how much are they, are they worthitand can I order them from someplace that is online or has e-mail(I hate tomake a long distance phone call if I can get out of it). Thanks in advance.John Channer from cbogart@shentel.net Mon Mar 2 19:19:28 1998 199820:19:25 -0500 Subject: Re: UF glue and Nodeless SergioIt will be interesting to see your results - it pays to search around abit. Chris On Mon, 2 Mar 1998 17:44:27 +0000, Sergio Hiroshi ISHIKAWA wrote: Chris,Thanks for the advice. I called Franklin in USA and they directed to theirrepresentatives here in Brazil. They told me they sell TITEBOND-II butonlyin 500 lbs bucket. Then I asked if I could have a sample. Kind guys!. :)Tomorrow I give details about the glues I have tested.Regards,Sergio On Sat, 28 Feb 1998, Chris Bogart wrote: SergioHow wet do you plan to get your rods? You will have varnishon them - the cork grip will prob utilize the same glue - so if it getsthatwet - then you will have other problems - big ones. Waterproof is nicebut it is like the discussions on hide glue - it got to get very wet andstaywet - so if you plan to be a responsible rod owner - you will be ok.I would try the yellow first. Also note in Garrison book he didsome of his repairs with white glue.Chris On Fri, 27 Feb 1998 13:27:53 +0000, Sergio Hiroshi ISHIKAWA wrote: Chris,Borden has a plant here in Brazil, I bought two glues from them.One is named "wood glue" (in Portuguese) and it's yellow andanother is "Cascorez Extra" and is white. I glued some splicesas a test and will get the results by tomorrow.Probably they aren't water proof, otherwise I think they wouldadvertise on the label, problems?Sergio Chris Bogart wrote: SergioYou prob have an equivalent glue. Franklin makes the stuff I use butitsimilarto most woodworking yellow glues - It will give you a quick grab andsetup and youcan unclamp in a hour - but don't stress for 24hrs. Borden has anequivalent glue.Hard to guess brand names in Brazil - but look around. Chris Regards Chris from brookside.rod@juno.com Mon Mar 2 19:29:30 1998 20:28:12 EST Subject: Re: bevelers Terry; While we're on the subject of bevelers and mills I might as well chimein. I use a modified hand mill down here to do a couple different operations. Setup one uses plain milling cutters to thickness plane the strips. Setup two employs altered double angle cutters to bevel. Strips are still finished in the forms. Currently working on an Edwardsstyle beveler. Its' being built on a long, recycled bed from a 16 inch lathe. Plentyof mass, shouldwork well. Currently dealing with power out feeds construction. Themachinespermit me to keep a focus on the important detail work. Gary Dabrowski _____________________________________________________________________You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e- mail.Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.comOr call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654- 5866] from anglport@con2.com Mon Mar 2 19:32:16 1998 admin.con2.com (8.7.4/8.7.3) with SMTP id UAA12427 for Subject: Re: custom tackle/tenn At 06:19 PM 3/2/98 -0800, you wrote:Does anyone have a phone number for Custom Tackle in Tenn. I mailed arequest for a catalog and received no answer from them. Thanks. Regards, Steve Steve,Try 615-684-6164. I don't know if a FAX would be any help but theirs is:615-684-1755. Good luck, they have pretty good resources available.Art from d_price@global2000.net Mon Mar 2 19:52:30 1998 mail1.global2000.net (8.9.6/SecureMode) with SMTP id UAA21766 for; Mon, 2 Mar 1998 20:52:26 -0500 Subject: Re: beveller Philip Lipton wrote: Terry: I have one of Al Bellinger's machines. I call it a milling machine todistinguish it from another machine I got from George Maurer. Thebeveler from George cuts a 60 degree angle on one side of a bamboostrip. The strip has to be flipped from side to side on successivepasses. When the strips are cleaned up, straight and flat, then they cango onto Al's milling machine and it will cut a 60 degree angle on bothsides at once as it cuts a taper towards the tip. You need the bevelerto prepare strips for the milling machine. There is a lot of money tied up in two machines. You can build rodswithout them. I agree with George's (DrBamboo) estimate that it savesabout 8 hours of planing. That is a full days work, longer if you haveto split up your time. Getting my strips on to the 60 degree angle inthe form is the most tedious and onerous part of the task - to me. Hereis a way to get it exactly right in short order. Is it worth it? Maybe,I am not selling my setup. The downside to the milling machine is that the strips it produces arenot ready to glue. You still need to do the last 50 thousands in theplaning form. For all that money, you would think you could get it righton the mark. I hope there is a refinement coming down the road that willdo that. Phil ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ PO Box 1003, Sun Valley, ID 83353208-726-9559, 208-622-8585 Fax 208- 726-0191~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ don't know where you get these times from, went from 1/4 by 3/16 squarenodless stips to finish planing and measuring to verify accuracy in lessthan 8 hours on waynes 7' 4wt.2 pc. and glued the butt....just finishgluing the tip and all within + or - .00075 may be two spots on one ofthe six faces is .00125..after glueing...granted that nodless allows youto have a deeper grove in your plane and not have tareout problems(deepcuts with each pass and the nodless strips where planed with vertully nocross grain)Dave Price from vjwilson@micron.net Mon Mar 2 20:03:05 1998 Subject: Re: McKenzie lines i ordered one in dt4 that arrived last week. the jury'sstill out on whether i'm completely satisfied. the finishseems a bit rough and they ARE definitely limp. first timei fished it i was not very impressed, but i was so anxiousto try it out i did not treat it. gave it a good treatmentwith some s.a. stuff i had and the next experience wasbetter. i will have to say that the caramel color doesreally look good against cane. cost $40 + $3 usps prioritymail. i used an 800 # that was left on this service quite awhile ago (1-800-437- 3597). leonard in idaho from lblan@provide.net Mon Mar 2 20:20:23 1998 Subject: Re: RE: Why???? Bret; if you ever run into Sam Surre, ask him to tell you the story of thefirst trip out west with "The Force" (the rod on the front cover of Wayne'sbook). He got into a "casting contest" with a fellow on the river who wassporting a graphite rod..... -----Original Message----- I was down in Tennessee this past week with Carl Richards and he justlovesagood graphite rod (is there such a thing?) and he asked me " why don't youfish graphite so you can get some distance in your casts" from cbogart@shentel.net Mon Mar 2 20:27:00 1998 199821:26:51 -0500 Subject: Re: Silk Line JonThe line was worth more than the reel in this case - not a badprice for a silk line - plus a free reel - cannot go wrong. Can yougo back and buy the line for me and I am sure the reel would makea nice display piece in the shop. Chris On Mon, 2 Mar 1998 18:55:22 +0000, Jon Lintvet wrote: I am sorry for taking bandw idth but I guess this is bamboo related. I wanted to try restoring a silk line so I stopped by a antique shop. The only line they had was on a H&I automatic reel. Anyone know if these are really common or worth a little money. He wanted $30, but I didn't need a reel that isn't really functional for me. These side mounted it looks like. Anyhow...I was wondering if anyone out here had a old line I could buy/trade for. Just wanted to try something else. Thanks in advance. Jon Lintvet12B College Circle Ithaca, NY 14850(800) 836- 7558 (607) 277-9781 from cbogart@shentel.net Mon Mar 2 20:37:23 1998 199821:37:13 -0500 Subject: RE: Why???? Larry You. are right - where did this great myth come from that bamboodoesn't have power or make long casts? I have embarrassed peoplewith the power in a bamboo rod when I needed to do so - but thatis not why I build them. Furthermore, I do not need to fish 20+ feetinto my backing! I like to get them on the other end of the scale - askthem to cast leader only - then work their way out. Chris .On Mon, 2 Mar 1998 21:16:00 -0500, Larry Blan wrote: Bret; if you ever run into Sam Surre, ask him to tell you the story of thefirst trip out west with "The Force" (the rod on the front cover ofWayne'sbook). He got into a "casting contest" with a fellow on the river who wassporting a graphite rod..... -----Original Message-----From: Grhghlndr I was down in Tennessee this past week with Carl Richards and he justlovesagood graphite rod (is there such a thing?) and he asked me " why don'tyoufish graphite so you can get some distance in your casts" from FarAndFine@aol.com Mon Mar 2 20:40:01 1998 Subject: Re: bevelers In a message dated 3/2/98 9:26:27 PM Eastern Standard Time,brookside.rod@juno.com writes: And as the owner of one of your rods Gary - (7 1/2 ' 5 wt) I must say it ispaying off - Al WoodardManchester NH from CALucker@aol.com Mon Mar 2 20:42:02 1998 Subject: Re: bevelers I have built several mills myself, and wish you the best with the Edwards- style beveler. My one try at a beveler never worked very well. I used two lathe headsfromTaig with slitting saw arbors and slitting saws. Well, you can guess whatthematter was. The saw blades were not stiff enough, and of course theyweredesigned to cut metal, not wood. They flexed too much. The saw bladesneededto be stiffer. The Leonard saw blades, according to Kusse, were about thesixe of a Ritz Cracker and shaped like a discus -- thicker in the middle andtapering toward the perimeter.Anyway, I have made a couple of older Winston-style mills, but couldnever geta good finish cut with them. My best mill, and the one I use now isbasicallymade from salvaged parts from a regular metal milling machine. millcan be made from an old cast iron six inch planer -- just replace the shaftinside to one that will use your 60 degree cutters and add some heavyspring-loaded guides and a fence, and some MDF for the bed so that the tips of thecutters have something to chew into when you lower them. Use a one hpmotorand DO NOT CLIMB CUT ON YOUR ROUGH MILL.The best and easiest finish mills can be made with a big Dumore Grinderhead,or a milling machine head, or a millimg attachment for a big lathe, oranything precision that goes up and down at a precise and controllablerate.Go to the used tooling stores -- the light bulb will go off in your head.Keep it simple and heavy. Cast iron is great for killing vibration -- thebiggest enemy to good milling.Sorry I got going on this subject, but I have made more mills the past fouryears than rods.Chris Lucker from tyoung@perth.dialix.com.au Mon Mar 2 21:08:39 1998 Tue, 3 Mar 1998 11:08:31 +0800 (WST)(envelope- from tyoung) Subject: RE: Why???? On Mon, 2 Mar 1998, Larry Blan wrote: Bret; if you ever run into Sam Surre, ask him to tell you the story of thefirst trip out west with "The Force" (the rod on the front cover ofWayne'sbook). He got into a "casting contest" with a fellow on the river who wassporting a graphite rod..... -----Original Message-----From: Grhghlndr I agree with this. I was fishing on a river called the "Blackwood" with a giude and without intending to we both realised we were competing for distance as we were both casting to the same spot in the same riffle.He had a decent graphite rod (I don't remember what but it cost) and I was armed with a Driggs. Distance wise there was nothing in it, but I got the fish. Tony /***********************************************************************/Tony Younghttp://www.iinet.net.au/~mainpeak/flyrod.htmlThe Australian connection/***********************************************************************/ from DrBamboo@aol.com Mon Mar 2 21:29:51 1998 Subject: Re: beveller In a message dated 98-03-02 21:48:07 EST, you write: David;Do that every day of your life without fail.See how your hands andshouldershold upMaybe you're a superman for a few years,but you reach a point when you'renotanimmortal anymore,and each day you've got to get up and do it again,.GEM from Fallcreek9@aol.com Mon Mar 2 21:49:16 1998 Subject: Re: varnish tube In a message dated 98-03-02 18:24:35 EST, you write: Grayson: I have a dip tube as described in Wayne's book except nothingabovethe reducer coupler epoxied to the top of the tube. I tried one of theexpandable black rubber, or neoprene, plugs sold at plumbing supplyhouses,and the varnish ate it. Used a wooden plug turned on a lathe, but as timewent on, bits and pieces of the varnish that had dried on the plug began tocontaminate the varnish in the tube (was unable to avoid varnish gettingontoand drying on the plug) . Now I simply take a small square of doubled alumfoil, squeeze it over the tube opening, twist it down a bit and secure withastrong rubber band. No problems since. A bit simplistic, but it works.Regards,Richard from hexagon@odyssee.net Mon Mar 2 21:57:00 1998 (205.236.248.114) Subject: Re: Applying varnish by hand John A. Whitaker wrote: Okay, Here is my poor man's technique for varnish. I think it is awhole lot easier than brushing and you don't have to make any diptubes. (BTW: this isn't original, I read about it on the ManhattanCustom Tackle web page and said no way... the I tried it. It worksgreat.) I hang the rod pieces in the shop. I used warm varish or actuall I havebeen coating using Flexicoat epoxy... Get surgical glove. If it hastalcum on it as a preservative (you'll see it) slip the gole on andrinse you hands in water. Now dry up. This is you applicator. Load youfingeres with your coating. Start at the top of the rod, wrap yourfingers around, and then slide you hand down. The glove will start todrag when you are running low with coating. Try changing you grip orreload you hand with coating. When you get to the bottom, go back tothe top and try to squiggy the coating off with you hand. You want evenresistance from top to bottom. I can do two sections in 15 minutes with setup and cleanup. You canworking the coating thin and do three coats with light sanding between. It works so well, I haven't bothered to do anything else. P.S. The flexicoat epoxy can be colored with epoxy pigments.Troanslucent or opaque tones are possible. The best source for this(that I have found) is bumming some from a shop that does fiberglassboat repairs... John,the mandate of this list is to make rodmaking as difficult as possible andoffering simple solutions is highly frowned upon.Great idea, even though none of us will try it!Terry from mcreek@sirus.com Mon Mar 2 22:18:10 1998 Subject: Re: Applying varnish by hand Terry -Great to have you back on the list. Missed your insightfulcommentary. I have a question for the machinist in you. I bought a nice littlescraper made in England, but it certainly isn't a Sheffield steelblade. If I were to build my own 1/8" x 1/2 " blade, what kind of steeldo I want to buy? Brian from FISHWOOL@aol.com Mon Mar 2 23:02:04 1998 Subject: Re: RE: Why???? Bret,Who says you can't get distance with a cane rod? Carl should knowbetter.Hank. from Ragnarig@aol.com Tue Mar 3 00:43:20 1998 Subject: Re: Applying varnish by hand In a message dated 98-03-02 23:05:09 EST, you write: Actually, one of us just did. Pretty cool. Got a little thick with the firstsection but the next one (the butt) was pretty impressive. Thankee John!Davy Riggs from channer@frontier.net Tue Mar 3 01:55:10 1998 Subject: McKenzie lines Leonard;Thanks for the info. Does it float comparable to a 444?John Channer from Grhghlndr@aol.com Tue Mar 3 06:48:01 1998 Subject: Re: RE: Why???? Larry,I have proved many times to graphite guys ( including Carl ) that I can castmy boo as far as most of them can cast their graphite crap.Bret from tom@cet-inc.com Tue Mar 3 07:25:22 1998 0000 Subject: Re: McKenzie lines I've been using the McKenzie lines for a few months now and find the 4wtinDT and WF to work very well on cane rods. They definately need a gooddressing. Russ Peak from McKenzie is excellent. I've also ordered severallines for my friends. The only negative I can find is that below freezingthe line gets a little kinky, but so do many others in similar conditions.Tom Whittle---------- from jaw12@health.state.ny.us Tue Mar 3 07:35:29 1998 (InterLock SMTP Gateway 3.0 for rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu);Tue, 3 Mar 1998 08:34:55 -0500 Subject: Re: Applying varnish by hand Fallcreek9 wrote: John - it sounds so logical that one wonders why it hasn't beenmentionedbefore. Sounds like it meets the most important criterion, it works. Btw,what is the url for the Manhattan Custom Tackle web page? Sounds likeitmight be interesting. Best Regards,RichardManhattan custom tackle can be found at - http://fishdoc.com/ There focus is plastic rods but good advive that would apply to bamboo. Also, REC components, guides, all sorts of stuff. from vjwilson@micron.net Tue Mar 3 08:05:55 1998 Subject: Re: McKenzie lines john, well, when i didn't treat it, after a while it kindastarted to 'take on water'. when treated it was fine. onlyother trouble was that the plastic coating is so soft i hada little trouble with my nail knot ripping it off. i mayhave been a little over zealous pulling on them though. tomis right, they do need to be dressed and mine did notstraighten out like i wanted at first (but then the watertemp was about 38).leonard from bairdart@burgoyne.com Tue Mar 3 09:33:11 1998 Subject: Re: Why???? Grhghlndr wrote: Larry,I have proved many times to graphite guys ( including Carl ) that I cancastmy boo as far as most of them can cast their graphite crap.BretBret, No disrespect intended, but isn't the idea of fly fishing to stalk,trick, and catch fish, and then if your into it, put the fish back only as good as the person on the other end of it. Just my .02cts worth. from rmoon@ida.net Tue Mar 3 09:33:31 1998 Subject: Re: test boundary="------------1A483FCEBF78A4F8314B0FF7" --------------1A483FCEBF78A4F8314B0FF7 Hank: You wrote: Ralph,I've rec'd so many messages-about 50/day that I'm consideringunsubscribing.Regards,Hank. You bring up a point that has bothered me for some time. I know I wascomplaining about too few messages, but that was a glitch, I think in myserver. Fifty a day does seem to be excessive and when the content is analyzedit really is excessive. At the risk of being shot down in flames, Iwould like to point out that a year or so ago, the list had far fewermessages, but they all seemed to be pertinent, and I even welcomed a fewmore than usual. Recently it seems that the list has become more like achat room than a serious forum for rodbuilders. We have had a number oflong drawn out threads that have cluttered the rodlist. The "lady" downunder with her use of the F word, the interminable posting of unusualplace names etc, are but a couple of examples of what I mean. I don'twant to come across as an old Fogy, and a little fun is ok, but I simplydon't have the time to wade through a mass of material that is at bestonly 50% valuable to me. I am making no accusations against anyone onthe list. I know that I too have been guilty of what I am worriedabout, but as the list increases in numbers (over 400 now) this problemcould grow to unmanageable proportions. I would like to propose that we each, indivdually, try to keep the chitchat down and use the rodlist primarily for the purpose that it wasformulated. I would hate to take the drastic step you proposed, and Ihope that you don"t take it either, but I may have to in self defense My apologies if I have offended any one. It was not my intention. Ralph --------------1A483FCEBF78A4F8314B0FF7 Ralph, consideringunsubscribing. Hank. I was complaining about too few messages, but that was a glitch, I thinkin my server. Fifty a day does seem to be excessive and when the content is analyzed I would like to point out that a year or so ago, the list had far fewermessages, but they all seemed to be pertinent, and I even welcomed a few posting of unusual place names etc, are but a couple of examples of what fun is ok, but I simply don't have the time to wade through a mass ofmaterial what I am worried about, but as the list increases in numbers (over 400now) this problem could grow to unmanageable proportions. I would like to propose that we each, indivdually, try to keep the chitchat down and use the rodlist primarily for the purpose that it was I would hate to take the drastic step you proposed, and I hope that youdon"t take it either, but I may have to in self defense Ralph --------------1A483FCEBF78A4F8314B0FF7-- from rclarke@eou.edu Tue Mar 3 10:30:04 1998 Subject: Re: Bamboo and I Thanks for the info Phil. Did some rough planing last night and still planto do the 6'3" 3wt. I got my ferrules the other day. Tiny! Robert Clarkerclarke@eou.edu ----------From: Philip Lipton Subject: Bamboo and IDate: Sunday, March 01, 1998 7:31 AM Robert: Wayne's 6'3" rod is my personal favorite. I have built it both as a twopiece and as a three piece. I prefer the two piece but for travelingfellows, a case 2'1" long is very handy. I consider this a dry fly rod and casting to them. This rod has a delicate presentation. The shortlength is easy to handle hiking through the trees and it does not getwrapped up in overhanging limbs when casting. It is also fun todemonstrate to my graphite buddies that size is not everything. Afinesse rod can land very big fish. When conditions change to windy days and big water, I change rods. The6'3" rod does not have the length I need to mend my line on long driftsthrough rough water. It also lacks the backbone to chuck and duck. Imean nymphing with split shot and indicators - not that I do thatmyself. There are no witnesses and you couldn't prove I did it. Phil ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ PO Box 1003, Sun Valley, ID 83353208-726-9559, 208-622-8585 Fax 208- 726-0191~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ from thramer@presys.com Tue Mar 3 10:57:39 1998 0000 Subject: Re: test Ralph W Moon wrote: Hank: You wrote: Ralph,I've rec'd so many messages-about 50/day that I'm consideringunsubscribing.Regards,Hank. You bring up a point that has bothered me for some time. I know I wascomplaining about too few messages, but that was a glitch, I think inmy server. Fifty a day does seem to be excessive and when the content is analyzedit really is excessive. At the risk of being shot down in flames, Iwould like to point out that a year or so ago, the list had far fewermessages, but they all seemed to be pertinent, and I even welcomed afew more than usual. Recently it seems that the list has become morelike a chat room than a serious forum for rodbuilders. We have had anumber of long drawn out threads that have cluttered the rodlist. The>"lady" down under with her use of the F word, the interminableposting of unusual place names etc, are but a couple of examples ofwhat I mean. I don't want to come across as an old Fogy, and a littlefun is ok, but I simply don't have the time to wade through a mass ofmaterial that is at best only 50% valuable to me. I am making noaccusations against anyone on the list. I know that I too have beenguilty of what I am worried about, but as the list increases innumbers (over 400 now) this problem could grow to unmanageableproportions. I would like to propose that we each, indivdually, try to keep thechit chat down and use the rodlist primarily for the purpose that itwas formulated. I would hate to take the drastic step you proposed,and I hope that you don"t take it either, but I may have to in selfdefense My apologies if I have offended any one. It was not my intention. RalphYeah Ralph! I have but one word as example HELL!A.J. from mcreek@sirus.com Tue Mar 3 11:27:53 1998 Subject: Re: test It doesn't take me long to wade through the daily postings. If youleave your pointer on the delete icon you can buzz through the crap inshort order! Brian from ISHIKAWA@ipmet1.ipmet.unesp.br Tue Mar 3 11:56:40 1998 4.1/UCB5.64/4.03) Subject: Re: UF glue and Nodeless Hi All! YES AGAIN! I appologize for returning to this topic. Acording to Borden's representative there are european norms (DIN EN203and EN204) that defines the quality degree and resistance of glues forwoodwork. In general when considering wood working glues the maximumtemperatureis at about 60C (158F) when considering termal resistance it is at about 120C (293F), then: D1 - general purpose wood working glue;D2 - termal resistance and a slight degree of humidity resistance;D3 - water resistance;D4 - termal resistance and water proof I understand that the sample is not so representative, but for additionaltestI have to wait for my next Tonkin cane bundle, otherwise I won't be able to even build one rod. Type Fails No Fail Strips Maker Classification-------------------- --------------------------------------------------Araldite 2 1 3 Ciba GeigeResourcinol 0 3 3 DAP WeldwoodUF Cascamite 2 3 5 Custom Pack/BordenYellow PVA 3 2 5 Alba/Borden D2White PVA 3 2 5 Alba/Borden D1 No fails mean the splice broke on the enamel side with some splintering. "Fails" mean enamel side broke without splintering, in this case thethickness of the enamel side is at about 1 to 2mm.I would like to know if anybody have any insights about the results andmeanto improve the acuracy and reliability of this test. This is still incomplete, I plan to add tests for TITEBOND-II as well as redoing the test Regards,Sergio PS1: What you guys think about a patwork lucking nodeless bamboo rod? PS2: I don't have any link with the industries mentioned and don'trecommend any use of this information beyond this newsgroup. PS3: Sorry for using so much bandwith. from tedgodfreys@erols.com Tue Mar 3 12:01:56 1998 Subject: Re: test -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: test It doesn't take me long to wade through the daily postings. If youleave your pointer on the delete icon you can buzz through the crap inshort order! Brian Brian, I once received a message to the effect "someone has WAY to much time . .." telling me to shut-up. BEST MESSAGE I ever received on the list!!Perhaps someother mouthy people might appreciate receiving that kind ofmessage as well?! ted g. from dhaftel@att.com Tue Mar 3 12:29:08 1998 8.6/EMS-1.2sol2) Server InternetMail Connector Version 4.0.995.52) 13:28:17-0500 Subject: RE: UF glue and Nodeless 4.0.995.52 Sergio, Do not apologize for returning to a topic if you have information thatyou feel is valuable to the members of the list (which you obvoiuslydo!). Hopefully the favor can be returned some day... Dennis Haftel -----Original Message-----From: Sergio Hiroshi ISHIKAWA [SMTP:ISHIKAWA@ipmet1.ipmet.unesp.br]Sent: Tuesday, March 03, 1998 9:55 AM Subject: Re: UF glue and Nodeless Hi All! YES AGAIN! I appologize for returning to this topic. Acording to Borden's representative there are european norms (DIN EN203and EN204) that defines the quality degree and resistance of glues forwoodwork. In general when considering wood working glues the maximumtemperatureis at about 60C (158F) when considering termal resistance it is at about 120C (293F), then: D1 - general purpose wood working glue;D2 - termal resistance and a slight degree of humidity resistance;D3 - water resistance;D4 - termal resistance and water proof I understand that the sample is not so representative, but for additionaltestI have to wait for my next Tonkin cane bundle, otherwise I won't be ableto even build one rod. Type Fails No Fail Strips Maker Classification--------------------- -------------------------------------------------Araldite 2 1 3 Ciba GeigeResourcinol 0 3 3 DAP WeldwoodUF Cascamite 2 3 5 Custom Pack/BordenYellow PVA 3 2 5 Alba/Borden D2White PVA 3 2 5 Alba/Borden D1 No fails mean the splice broke on the enamel side with some splintering. "Fails" mean enamel side broke without splintering, in this case thethickness of the enamel side is at about 1 to 2mm.I would like to know if anybody have any insights about the results andmeanto improve the acuracy and reliability of this test. This is still incomplete, I plan to add tests for TITEBOND-II as well as redoing thetest Regards,Sergio PS1: What you guys think about a patwork lucking nodeless bamboo rod? PS2: I don't have any link with the industries mentioned and don'trecommend any use of this information beyond this newsgroup. PS3: Sorry for using so much bandwith. from ISHIKAWA@ipmet1.ipmet.unesp.br Tue Mar 3 13:20:19 1998 4.1/UCB5.64/4.03) Subject: RE : Annotated Archives on CD? Darryl,what exactly you mean about "annotated" ? Sergio from SalarFly@aol.com Tue Mar 3 13:49:13 1998 Subject: Non Rodmaker Content (Was: test) I would like to propose that we each, indivdually, try to keep thechit chat down and use the rodlist primarily for the purpose that itwas formulated. I would hate to take the drastic step you proposed,and I hope that you don"t take it either, but I may have to in selfdefense My apologies if I have offended any one. It was not my intention. Ralph I will agree heartily with this. The reason I signed off of the FF@ listwas the content more than the number of posts. I think I could dealwith the hundred or so posts from that list if they all dealt with flyfishing. On the other hand there probably wouldn't be a hundredposts if they all had something to do with the subject. I wouldhate to see this list become what the the FF@ list has become. But, this is a democracy. If the majority wants to chit chat, then nothing I can do can stop them. The only thing I can do is quit the list like Hank and Ralph are considering. Darryl Hayashida from thramer@presys.com Tue Mar 3 14:51:21 1998 Subject: glue I have built many rods with URAC, and rescorcinol. A few with weldwood.Good results with URAC mixed 4:1. Weldwood unacceptable. No heatresistance. The best glue irrespective of glue lines would berescorcinol, to which I have returned.A.J.Thramer from hexagon@odyssee.net Tue Mar 3 15:52:55 1998 (205.236.248.115) Subject: Re: Applying varnish by hand Brian & Michelle Creek wrote: Terry -Great to have you back on the list. Missed your insightfulcommentary. I have a question for the machinist in you. I bought a nice littlescraper made in England, but it certainly isn't a Sheffield steelblade. If I were to build my own 1/8" x 1/2 " blade, what kind of steeldo I want to buy? Brian Brian,thanks.You need some 'ground flat stock' made by many manufacturers butprobablythe most common in the states is Starrett brand. it is available in 18 inchlengths and a wide variety of cross sections. it is an oil hardening steelbut water is easier if you just heat the first 1 inch to a cherry red andplunge it in the water. Should not need to draw it back.I am positive this is the steel the guy at hock uses, just a good qualityinexpensivetool steel to which he adds a very fancy price.Terry from c.max.j@vip.cybercity.dk Tue Mar 3 17:03:54 1998 (CET)(envelope- from c.max.j@vip.cybercity.dk) byvip.cybercity.dk (8.8.3/8.8.2) with ESMTP id XAA26200 for; Tue, 3 Mar 1998 23:03:19 +0100 (CET) Subject: Re: Non Rodmaker Content (Was: test) ----------From: SalarFly . The only thing I can do is quit the list like Hank and Ralph are considering. Darryl Hayashida Sir D, and others thinking of unsubscribing Please stay tuned to this channel. Eventually the small talk willdissapear, I trust. Best regards Carsten from mcreek@sirus.com Tue Mar 3 17:30:41 1998 Subject: Re: test I stand accused from mcreek@sirus.com Tue Mar 3 17:35:04 1998 Subject: Re: Applying varnish by hand Terry-MSC list an A2 steel, a D2 steel and several others. I'm guessing Iwant a high carbon content? Brian from Grhghlndr@aol.com Tue Mar 3 17:45:14 1998 Subject: Re: Re: Why???? Bairdart,You missed the point. I wasn't saying anything about the idea of flyfishingIwas just stating that when graphite guys have made comments aboutbamboo notbeing any good for distance I have shown them that is not true by castingasfar as they can. Oh and by the way I don't kill any trout, salmon etc. forany reason. Even if hooked deep I feel they deserve to die in their onelement. And you are right the equipment Is only as good as the personbehindit and that goes for anything not just fishing. No disrespect taken,opinionsare like nose, everyone has one.Bret from Grhghlndr@aol.com Tue Mar 3 17:48:47 1998 Subject: Re: Re: test Ralph,I think you have a valid point here about to much BS that doesn't need to behere. I too know I have been guilty of same so here is my pledge to thelist.I for one will take it upon myself to not clutter the list anymore with nonbamboo rod related stuff. This will be my last such post. If I slipsomeoneplease chastise me (off list). And maybe that is the way we should allhandleany such further e-mails not pertaining to the art of bamboo rod making. Ihope this does not offend anyone out there and if it does please tell me offlist.Bret from cbogart@shentel.net Tue Mar 3 18:01:21 1998 TAA17834;Tue, 3 Mar 1998 19:01:01 -0500 boundary="_=_=_=IMA.BOUNDARY.HTML_4845056=_=_=_"Subject: Re: test --_=_=_=IMA.BOUNDARY.HTML_4845056=_=_=_ Ralph / Hank This is a valid point that I hope some people take to heart. I don'tmind sharing information and ideas - At times I now cringe when I logon and there is 58 messages to down load - tonight was mild - only 38but I find myself not reading a lot of them and simply deleting themunread. Like an old professor I had used to say "cut to the chase".A lot of reply are really not worth the bandwidth they take up. Thewould be best left unsent or sent privately to the originator. Chris --Original Message Text--- =FF Hank:=FF You wrote: Ralph, =FF=FF I've rec'd so many messages-about 50/day that I'm considering unsubscribing. =FF=FF=FF=FF=FF=FF Regards, =FF=FF=FF=FF=FF=FF=FF=FF=FF=FF=FF=FF=FF=FF=FF=FF Hank. You bring up a point that has bothered me for some time.=FF I know I was=complaining about too few messages, but that was a glitch, I think in my server. Fifty a day does seem to be excessive and when the content is analyzed i=t really is excessive.=FF At the risk of being shot down in flames,=FF I would like to point out that a year or s=o ago, the list had far fewer messages, but they all seemed to be pertinent, and I even welcomed a few more than=usual.=FF Recently it seems that the list has become more like a chat room than a serious forum for rodbuilde=rs.=FF We have had a number of long drawn out threads that have cluttered the rodlist.=FF The "lady" down un=der with her use of the F word,=FF the interminable posting of unusual place names etc, are but a couple of exa=mples of what I mean.=FF I don't want to come across as an old Fogy, and a little fun is ok, but I simply don'=t have the time to wade through a mass of material that is at best only 50% valuable to me.=FF I am making=no accusations against anyone on the list.=FF I know that I too have been guilty of what I am worried abo=ut, but as the list increases in numbers (over 400 now) this problem could grow to unmanageable proportions. I would like to propose that we each, indivdually, try to keep the chit =chat down and use the rodlist primarily tic step you proposed, and I hope that you don"t take it either, but I may have to in self defense My apologies if I have offended any one.=FF It was not my intention. Ralph --_=_=_=IMA.BOUNDARY.HTML_4845056=_=_=_ Ralph / Hank This is a valid point that I hope some people take to heart. I don'=tmind sharing information and ideas - At times I now cringe when I logon and there is 58 messages to down load - tonight was mild - only38but I find myself not reading a lot of them and simply deleting them= unread. Like an old professor I had used to say "cut to the chase".= A lot of reply are really not worth the bandwidth they take up. The= would be best left unsent or sent privately to the originator. Chris --Original Message Text---From: Ralph W MoonDate: Tue, 03 Mar 1998 08:19:00 -0700 Ralph, conside=ring unsubscribing. as complaining about too few messages, but that was a glitch, I think in=my server. Fifty a day does seem to be excessive and when the content is analyzed i= sp;I would like to point out that a year or so ago, the list had far few=er messages, but they all seemed to be pertinent, and I even welcomed a = mor= d a number of long drawn out threads that have cluttered the rodlist.&nb= le posting of unusual place names etc, are but a couple of examples of w= e fun is ok, but I simply don't have the time to wade through a mass of = uilty of what I am worried about, but as the list increases in numbers (=over 400 now) this problem could grow to unmanageable proportions. I would like to propose that we each, indivdually, try to keep the chit =chat down and use the rodlist primarily for the purpose that it was form= ope that you don"t take it either, but I may have to in self defense Ralph --_=_=_=IMA.BOUNDARY.HTML_4845056=_=_=_-- from d_price@global2000.net Tue Mar 3 18:04:32 1998 mail2.global2000.net (8.9.6/SecureMode) with SMTP id TAA16557 for; Tue, 3 Mar 1998 19:04:27 -0500 Subject: Re: beveller DrBamboo wrote: In a message dated 98-03-02 21:48:07 EST, you write: David;Do that every day of your life without fail.See how your hands andshouldershold upMaybe you're a superman for a few years,but you reach a point whenyou're notanimmortal anymore,and each day you've got to get up and do it again,.GEM I"ve done it every day for 25 years (master woodworker)Dave Price from rcurry@top.monad.net Tue Mar 3 18:12:35 1998 Subject: Re: Silk line?? Brian & Michelle Creek wrote: I just bought 4 oldish reels ( a big ole' Medalist, an Ocean City, aPflueger 'Gem" and a south bend that looks like a St George) One lineis very obviously silk, two of the others are obviously 333's and thefourth has me scratchin' my head. It is a nice golden color, extremelysupple, looks braided, but has a plastic cover. Could this be silk?? BrianBrian,Is the braid tapered? If the braid is tapered and the coating uniform,it may be (probably is) silk, but nevertheless, will have many of thepleasant properties of silk. I have such a line and truly enjoy it. I amloath to strip the coating off the end and apply the match test, but ifyou must know, that is the way to find out.Best regards,Reed from flyfisher@cmix.com Tue Mar 3 18:31:11 1998 Subject: Don't go - please stay - Here's an idea !-Re: test RO>Ralph / Hank RO> This is a valid point that I hope some people take to heart. Idon'tRO>mind sharing information and ideas - At times I now cringe when I logRO>on and there is 58 messages to down load - tonight was mild - only 38RO>but I find myself not reading a lot of them and simply deleting themRO>unread. Like an old professor I had used to say "cut to the chase".RO> A lot of reply are really not worth the bandwidth they take up. TheRO>would be best left unsent or sent privately to the originator. RO> Chris I'd hate to see people leave do to too many messages (so I'm adding to #of postings) - maybe a better solution would be for all of us to taketime and spell out what each post is all about - where it will allow useof the "D" key - in the message header. IE - If someone wants to know about glue - don't post a "Help" header -say something like: "Novice needs help with URAC use." Also, start a new thread if you've gone off on a tangent - vs adding to"why" or "Re: test". Please stick around - wait until fishing season starts, the message loadwill go down. Don Burns from LECLAIR123@aol.com Tue Mar 3 19:07:04 1998 Subject: Re: custom tackle/tenn Try-- 615-684-6164 phone 615-684-1755 fax Custom Tackle Supply Dave LeClair from channer@frontier.net Tue Mar 3 19:07:06 1998 Subject: McKenzie lines Len and Tom;Thanks for the response guys, I'll probably give one a try. I spend moretime on the San Juan than anywhere else and my 444 takes a dozen or morecasts before it limbers up, too. The water there runs between 38 and 44year around. $40 for a fly line is pretty reasonable if its 90' and notjunk, I don't think you can get a 57' line at K-Mart for that. One lastquestion and then I promise to drop the subject, what do you recomendtreating it with. Thanks again.John Channer from channer@frontier.net Tue Mar 3 19:10:11 1998 Subject: bakelite reel seat All;Any good ideas for removing a well glued bakelite reel seat would be muchappreciated. Tried boiling water, but didn't budge it, my only other ideais to chuck it up in the lathe and turn it off. T.I.A.John Channer from jfoster@gte.net Tue Mar 3 19:13:17 1998 Subject: web Just added a couple of links to Jon lintvet's new page,, one undermakers, the other under suppliers, check it out, he clams to have glacecotton of the correct? sizes for those of you who were asking for asource. other goodies too. hope this isn't chat. Jerry from LECLAIR123@aol.com Tue Mar 3 19:29:55 1998 Subject: Re: bakelite reel seat John,I've had some real hard cases. Usually if I heat it long enoughwith an alcohol flame ,so it's too hot to grab, then I grab it with a rag and pullit straight off. I wouldn't twist it, as it may twist the cane under the reel seat andmaybebreak it off. If all else fails, you may have to use your lathe. Yet, here isanother idea. I've removed quite a few by first removing the metal at the rear andthen Ilay the reel seat on my large belt sander,with a very coarse belt, and tookoffdown to the cane. Then using my jack knife, I pry the rest off.It usually popsright off. Hope this helps, Dave LeClair from saltwein@swbell.net Tue Mar 3 19:32:02 1998 Subject: Milward Binder/Unsubscribing How is the rod propelled through the Milward binder? Is it pushedthrough by hand or does the action of the thread impel it through? I must have missed the flare ups of the posts being off of the mark. Ihope I haven't been guilty with my progress reports. I know what Darrylis talking about at the FF@ list, there is a lot of chaff there but alsosome wonderful "grain". I hope none of the people who have considered leaving do, I am very muchindebted to you for where I am now. I look forward to gleaning whatinfo I can every evening prior to going into the shop. If anyone doesdecide to leave they will be sorely missed. Regards, SteveIndependence, MO from rkovalak@bright.net Tue Mar 3 20:01:50 1998 sparticus.bright.net (8.8.7/8.8.7/FNG) with ESMTP id UAA08782; Tue, 3Mar 1998 Subject: Bamboo Pie Splitters (Hida Tool) ListServ: I have ordered a six-section pie splitter to use on the Demarest cane Ireceived recently. If anyone on the list has used this 'apparatus' andis willing to share experience/tips on use please respond off-list todiscuss. I would hate to ruin this beautiful cane [for which I waitedwell over a year to get]. Thanks in advance.--Ron KovalakEmail: rkovalak@bright.net from hexagon@odyssee.net Tue Mar 3 20:18:52 1998 (205.236.249.89) Subject: Re: Applying varnish by hand Brian & Michelle Creek wrote: Terry-MSC list an A2 steel, a D2 steel and several others. I'm guessing Iwant a high carbon content? Brian You should look for an O-1 steel ( pronounced like oh 1) D1 and D2 steelsare air hardening so cannot be done at home.Terry from hood@hpesdah.fc.hp.com Tue Mar 3 20:20:12 1998 (1.38.193.4/15.5+IOS 3.22) id AA23515; Tue, 3 Mar 1998 19:20:08 -0700 Subject: Re: Hollow Built rods Dean,I have a spreadsheet that has an input for hollowing factor and cancalculate the stress curve for you. I have not yet prepared sufficientdocumentation such that someone else could drive these equations, butif you would like to send me the information for your rod I will beglad to return a stress curve. Please include the taper (includingany varnish allowances) the line weight and length and the hollowingat each point.Davidhood@fc.hp.com from jfoster@gte.net Tue Mar 3 20:30:03 1998 Subject: Re: Bamboo Pie Splitters (Hida Tool) Please respond to Ron ON the list, this is the stuff we ARE interestedin. Jerry from mcreek@sirus.com Tue Mar 3 20:44:21 1998 Subject: Re: steel for blades Thanks, Terry. Looks like it costs about $7 for 18". Brian from hexagon@odyssee.net Tue Mar 3 20:52:02 1998 (205.236.249.89) Subject: Re: Non Rodmaker Content (Was: test) SalarFly wrote: I would like to propose that we each, indivdually, try to keep thechit chat down and use the rodlist primarily for the purpose that itwas formulated. I would hate to take the drastic step you proposed,and I hope that you don"t take it either, but I may have to in selfdefense My apologies if I have offended any one. It was not my intention. Ralph I will agree heartily with this. The reason I signed off of the FF@ listwas the content more than the number of posts. I think I could dealwith the hundred or so posts from that list if they all dealt with flyfishing. On the other hand there probably wouldn't be a hundredposts if they all had something to do with the subject. I wouldhate to see this list become what the the FF@ list has become.But, this is a democracy. If the majority wants to chit chat, thennothing I can do can stop them. The only thing I can do is quit thelist like Hank and Ralph are considering. Darryl Hayashida I was on the ff list a couple of years ago and found that a group of oldscrotums thought that they ran the list and got very annoyed if youmanagedto get a long thread going . They would only reply to each others postingsand would constantly congratulate each other for being so smart.There is only so much you can discuss in rodmaking and fly fishing and alittle diversion now and again can be amusing. It is easy enough to delete If you know that a regular contributor usually deals in private chit chat oris perhaps self serving, then delete whatever he posts. Works great forme.Terry from vjwilson@micron.net Tue Mar 3 21:23:57 1998 Subject: Re: McKenzie lines john, my line's too new to have given much of a test. as isaid i fished it 2 days, one untreated (don't do that) andone with s.a. fly line dressing (which seemed to work ok).anxious to see what tom has to say.leonard from tedgodfreys@erols.com Tue Mar 3 22:00:37 1998 Subject: Re: test -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: test I stand accused It doesn't take me long to wade through the daily postings. If youleave your pointer on the delete icon you can buzz through the crap inshort order! Brian Brian,I once received a message to the effect "someone has WAY to much time . .." telling me to shut-up. BEST MESSAGE I ever received on the list!!Perhaps someother mouthy people might appreciate receiving that kind ofmessage as well?!ted g. Brian,I neglected to say when posting the above that the above is definitely NOTdirected toward you in anyway, shape or form!!!. I was awkwardly tryingtosay that for some of us, using the delete button gets old after a while andperhaps a more direct method could work - worked for me (except that Ihaveposted two messages on this non-rod building subject today!). Most Respectfully, Ted Godfrey from jlintvet@clarityconnect.com Tue Mar 3 23:04:21 1998 mail.clarityconnect.com with SMTP (Eudora Internet Mail Server 2.0.1);Wed, 4Mar 1998 00:05:13 -0500 Subject: Re: web Thanks for the kind comments...before you all waste your time looking, you should know there is not a lot there. Take care. Jon Lintvet12B College Circle Ithaca, NY 14850(800) 836- 7558 (607) 277-9781 from skyboss@ibm.net Tue Mar 3 23:11:09 1998 out2.ibm.net (8.8.5/8.6.9) with SMTP id FAA147532 for; Wed, 4 Mar 1998 05:11:05 GMT Subject: Re: Non Rodmaker Content (Was: test) Terry wrote: I was on the ff list a couple of years ago and found that a group of oldscrotums thought that they ran the list and got very annoyed if youmanagedto get a long thread going . They would only reply to each others postingsand would constantly congratulate each other for being so smart. Terry ******************************************************************** Thanks for masking me laugh but sometimes the truth hurts....... ex FF@ Ken Holder from tom@cet-inc.com Wed Mar 4 06:40:37 1998 0000 Subject: Re: McKenzie lines Russ Peak's Line Dressing is also distributed by McKenzie and works verywell on the Bamboo line. I didn't realize that the San Juan stayed that coldyear round. Best of luck.Tom---------- Subject: McKenzie lines Len and Tom;One last question and then I promise to drop the subject, what do yourecomendtreating it with. Thanks again.John Channer from harry37@epix.net Wed Mar 4 07:26:51 1998 IAA13730 Subject: Re: bakelite reel seat john channer wrote: All;Any good ideas for removing a well glued bakelite reel seat would bemuchappreciated. Tried boiling water, but didn't budge it, my only other ideais to chuck it up in the lathe and turn it off. T.I.A.John Channer John, If your heat source has softened the bakelite, and you're notinterested in saving it, try nibbling pieces of it away with a pair of12" channel lock pliers. If the bakelite is soft enough, you'll be ableto bite off sections with the pliers, and then clean off any leftoverglue with a little sandpaper. I've had good results with the two orthree reel seats I tried this on when nothing else seemed to work, and Irealized that I didn't want the old seat anyway. Greg Kuntz from Fallcreek9@aol.com Wed Mar 4 07:44:18 1998 Subject: Re: test In a message dated 98-03-03 23:07:19 EST, you write: Ted - I do not remember seeing the above comment , but did wonder whereyouhad gone. Missed your insightful and pertinent comments and dialog. Ipersonally encourage you to speak out. Have been on this list for only two years, but have noticed some trends. Thenew guys often come on strong with youth (to the list, anyway), vim andvitality and contribute a lot because of enthusiasm and energy. A lot ofgoodstuff comes from that. Ex., reference your posting about taper hex pins. I bamboo'snatural radius, which can be maintained quite a bit in the wider flats nearthe hand grip. Actually, should be maintained if true adherence to notharming the top layer of power fibers is maintained. So, hope you do notkeeptoo hidden. Best Regards,Richard from tyoung@perth.dialix.com.au Wed Mar 4 08:02:41 1998 Wed, 4 Mar 1998 22:02:31 +0800 (WST)(envelope- from tyoung) Subject: Scrotums, Occum's(sp?) razor and Shell epon epoxy. On Tue, 3 Mar 1998, Terence Ackland wrote: I was on the ff list a couple of years ago and found that a group of oldscrotums thought that they ran the list and got very annoyed if youmanagedto get a long thread going . They would only reply to each others postingsand would constantly congratulate each other for being so smart.There is only so much you can discuss in rodmaking and fly fishing and alittle diversion now and again can be amusing. It is easy enough todelete If you know that a regular contributor usually deals in private chit chatoris perhaps self serving, then delete whatever he posts. Works great forme.Terry So what you're saying is that because there is a finite way of splitting, planing, gluing, scraping, binding etc and *unless* you are an uncouth, foul mouthed, grits/Vegimite eating Kiwi from HELL a little diversionary I agree. Don Burns has the right idea. If the subject line is altered upon a change of thread it's easy enough to delete if you're only interested in hard core rodbuilding stuff.Admitedly much of the latest has been deleteable but a lot of the best threads have begun that way, though I am truely sorry for starting the hell thread. Now for some genuine rod stuff.I glued a tip section using Shell Epon today as I used it to glue the scarfs and all the right people recomended I use the same glue to glue the splines to avoid heat related problems rather than use UF orResorcinol.I bind sections by hand and I found that because the glue dosn't become tacky for quite a while I was able to bind carefuly then straighten to satisfaction before hanging the section to cure. I very much doubt I'll need to do any heat straightening at all as there are no kinks or twists.Anybody having problems with straightening may like to try nodles construction and hand binding using Shell Epon. Tony /***********************************************************************/Tony Younghttp://www.iinet.net.au/~mainpeak/flyrod.htmlThe Australian connection/***********************************************************************/ from eestlow@srminc.com Wed Mar 4 08:25:45 1998 1997)) id862565BD.004ED1A4 ; Wed, 4 Mar 1998 08:20:54 -0600 Subject: Hollow Built Rod Mechanics David, I'd be interested in your spreadsheet if at some point you get itdocumented. If nothing else, I'd like to see the theory behind it, assumingyou don't consider it proprietary. I'm interested from a rod mechanicsstandpoint. Contact me off-list if you prefer (with respect to the recentdiscussion about irrelevant material making it to the list, with which Iheartily agree). Best regards,Ed Estlow "David A. Hood" on 03/03/98 08:20:08 PM Please respond to rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Subject: Re: Hollow Built rods Dean,I have a spreadsheet that has an input for hollowing factor and cancalculate the stress curve for you. I have not yet prepared sufficientdocumentation such that someone else could drive these equations, butif you would like to send me the information for your rod I will beglad to return a stress curve. Please include the taper (includingany varnish allowances) the line weight and length and the hollowingat each point.Davidhood@fc.hp.com from plipton@sunvalley.net Wed Mar 4 08:28:05 1998 forged)) 0700 (208.14.167.29) Subject: Bamboo Pie Splitters (Hida Tool) Ron: I have one of these splitters and they are easy to use. You can get itstarted by tapping the splitter point into a culm with a mallet.. Ittends to run easily until you get to a node, then it needs some force.The splitter has two handles, one on each side. By cutting a culm downto a six foot length, I could grab hold of both handles and tap thesplitter through a node by gently striking the culm on the floor. There were a couple of problems I had using a star splitter. On someculms the check split opens up quite a bit. When you push it through thesplitter, you will have an odd size strip. This is no big deal, justtake it into account. I bought a seven section splitter because oftenthe seventh section is the size of the check split so I end up with sixequal sections. Do you flame your bamboo? I do. I prefer to split a culm in half and usea torch. Now that it is split, the star cutter is no big help. Someculms have several splits in them. There may be leaf nodes, growersmarks or other blemishes. I let the bamboo tell me where it needs to besplit. Rarely is that where the star splitter has its fin. Phil ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ PO Box 1003, Sun Valley, ID 83353208-726-9559, 208-622-8585 Fax 208- 726-0191~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ from DrBamboo@aol.com Wed Mar 4 08:55:43 1998 Subject: Re: Bamboo Pie Splitters (Hida Tool) Have tried the splitter and like anything has it's good and bad points.Ifyou've ever seen the Winston video it's identical to what Lew Stoner cameupwith.It's a fast way of sectioning the culm.That's the plus.It does notfollowthe grain necessarily orgive you sections that are equal in size.If speed is the only criteria andyoudon't mind wasting a lot of bamboo,after all it really is cheap,it's O.K. Idon't use mine at all. George from bairdart@burgoyne.com Wed Mar 4 10:06:34 1998 Subject: list use To all list subscribers, I have been on the the list for six months and have managed three or four posts. I have been amazed at the high level of knowledge and the sharing of same that has taken place on this list. Sure there has been some B.S. that has taken place but more than that I have seen help where help is needed. I have seen pros helping novices for nothing more than the gratifcation of seeing to it that they have good imformation and avoid frustration. I have been in the Art Glass Restoration business for 26 yrs. In that time i have learned that some of the best ideas and techniques come from inpromtu conversations among proffessionals. I for one have learned some very good info on this list. I would hate to see most of you folkes leave the list, it would be a loss to us all. As for some of the goofey subjects that come up, levity is a good balance to a good life. Happy rod building and fly fishing to all of you. Thanks Bob Baird from TSmithwick@aol.com Wed Mar 4 10:55:33 1998 Subject: Re Shell epon epoxy. In a message dated 3/4/98 2:08:33 PM, you wrote: Tony - If you take the rod out of the string in 12-24 hours, you will findthat the Epon is not 100% cured, and you can do a bit of cold straighteningifyou need to. You will also find it easy to remove the cord and get the glueoff the blank. I can see Bill Fink grinning now. He tried for 15 years to getme to use the stuff, and I would'nt listen. He was right, this is a greatglue from eric.koehler@meissner-wurst.com Wed Mar 4 11:45:06 1998 11:36:30 gateus.meissner-wurst.com via smap (4.0a) with SMTP id AAA334 for ;Wed, 4 Mar 1998 11:52:06 -0600 (IMA Internet Exchange 2.1 Enterprise) id 00004F55; Wed, 4 Mar 9812:47:10-0600 Subject: Shell Epon Ratio Question Based on recent rave reviews, I've requested samples of Shell Epon 828 resin and 3140 Hardener. The supplier (Stephenson) tells me to use a 2:1 ratio, by weight, of resin to curing agent. They also told me that there's a wide range of ratios that are acceptable, including 1:1. anyone have a "by volume" ratio for this stuff? Thanks in advance,Eck from dhaftel@att.com Wed Mar 4 12:18:37 1998 8.6/EMS-1.2sol2) Server InternetMail Connector Version 4.0.995.52) 13:19:01-0500 Subject: RE: Bamboo Pie Splitters (Hida Tool) 4.0.995.52 Phil, You touched on an interesting topic... Flamed cane. Could you pleaseexpand on that a bit? For example, how do you keep that under control?Is it a "feel" kind of thing? Or have you experimented with time,distance from the torch (plain old propane?), etc.? Also, do you end uphaving to heat treat your sections after you've flamed the culm? I think I would like to try flaming my cane, but I'm basically afraid(chicken!) of ruining what little bamboo I have, and would welcome your Thanx, Dennis Haftel -----Original Message-----From: Philip Lipton [SMTP:plipton@sunvalley.net]Sent: Wednesday, March 04, 1998 9:28 AM Subject: Bamboo Pie Splitters (Hida Tool) Ron: I have one of these splitters and they are easy to use. You can get itstarted by tapping the splitter point into a culm with a mallet.. Ittends to run easily until you get to a node, then it needs some force.The splitter has two handles, one on each side. By cutting a culm downto a six foot length, I could grab hold of both handles and tap thesplitter through a node by gently striking the culm on the floor. There were a couple of problems I had using a star splitter. On someculms the check split opens up quite a bit. When you push it through thesplitter, you will have an odd size strip. This is no big deal, justtake it into account. I bought a seven section splitter because oftenthe seventh section is the size of the check split so I end up with sixequal sections. Do you flame your bamboo? I do. I prefer to split a culm in half and usea torch. Now that it is split, the star cutter is no big help. Someculms have several splits in them. There may be leaf nodes, growersmarks or other blemishes. I let the bamboo tell me where it needs to besplit. Rarely is that where the star splitter has its fin. Phil ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ PO Box 1003, Sun Valley, ID 83353208-726-9559, 208-622-8585 Fax 208- 726-0191~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ from FISHWOOL@aol.com Wed Mar 4 12:24:06 1998 Subject: Re: Hollow Built Rod Mechanics Ed, Unless the spread sheet mechanics are proprietary some of us on thelistmay be interested in the math, etc. of hollow building stresses so I, foronewould like to see it on list. Regards,Hank. from FISHWOOL@aol.com Wed Mar 4 12:26:34 1998 Subject: Re: Re: test Chris,I think if we take the time to converse off list on non cane topics thebandwidth would narrow cosiderably. I know I've been guilty at times,morefromlaziness-just hitting "reply" rather than composing a new letter. In anycaseunless it gets a lot worse I'll stick around.Regards,Hank. from eestlow@srminc.com Wed Mar 4 12:50:38 1998 1997)) id862565BD.00671138 ; Wed, 4 Mar 1998 12:45:46 -0600 Subject: Re: Hollow Built Rod Mechanics Hank and all, I imagine several people would be interested. I'm imagining (pardon mypresumptuousness, David) a downloadable template similar to the HEXRODLotus 123/Excel template on Jerry's website. Do-able? Best regards,Ed Estlow FISHWOOL on 03/04/98 12:23:12 PM Please respond to rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Subject: Re: Hollow Built Rod Mechanics Ed,Unless the spread sheet mechanics are proprietary some of us on thelistmay be interested in the math, etc. of hollow building stresses so I, foronewould like to see it on list.Regards,Hank. from jaw12@health.state.ny.us Wed Mar 4 13:14:58 1998 (InterLock SMTP Gateway 3.0 for rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu);Wed, 4 Mar 1998 14:13:45 -0500 Subject: Re: Hollow Built Rod Mechanics FISHWOOL wrote: Ed,Unless the spread sheet mechanics are proprietary some of us on thelistmay be interested in the math, etc. of hollow building stresses so I, foronewould like to see it on list.Regards,Hank. As would I.. But I certainly understand the work involved and canapprecite the desire to keep it proprietary if they exist. I for one don't think the list is overly chatty. Many times these chatsresult in something intersting. We have had a couple of wild threadslately, but for the most part the list seems to stay on topic. Far moreso than any other list I know. The information exchanged here isexcellent and I have learned a great deal from Rodmakers. If anything,this list has reinforced FF and rodmaking as a life long persuit becauseof the people associated with it. from Fishstink@aol.com Wed Mar 4 14:41:40 1998 Subject: Re: test To everyone,On the topic of "chit-chat", being knew to the list and not aware of pastproblems, I don't think that there is a chat problem. I haven't been involvedlong making rods, so problems that I run into must surely have beencoveredmany times in the past by the list. I recently had a problem getting brushstrokes out after varnishing. I received a lot of really good suggestionsfroma LOT of people. I'm sure this is a topic that has been covered many times,and to someone who has been making rods for 15 to20 years it probablyseemedlike chit-chat to them, but to me it was information I needed right now.Myguess is, there will always be a lot of repetitive information on the list.There will always be someone new to the craft to ask these questions and,hopefully, there will always be someone on the list who will take the timetorespond. But if my only source of info is to be Garrison's book, I willobviously be missing out on more modern, effective techniques, and thehumancontact that makes this work fun.$.02Mike Shay from anglport@con2.com Wed Mar 4 14:49:39 1998 admin.con2.com (8.7.4/8.7.3) with SMTP id PAA01919 for Subject: Re: Non Rodmaker Content (Was: test) All,I've probably been on this list as short a time as anyone and I wasbeginning to wonder about the "wild" threads. I didn't join the ff@ listbecause a friend who belonged told me in the same breath how great itwasand that he was receiving 90 (!) messages a day! So far, this group hasbeenWAY more helpful than problematic. I certainly hope that the "Masters"willnot even consider dropping out and the "just learning" fellows willcontinueto post questions and "why-nots". I learned about things I had neverconsidered as problems OR solutions from looking at both Qs and As. Justthegive and take is probably responsible for some new concepts beingformulatedand tried by someone or other. I have seen solutions to problems which Ihave mulled over, literally, for years! I have also seen some ideas whichhave prompted me to take a new tack or modification on somebody else'scontribution. Certainly it would be beneficial to better label our contributionsbut I've noticed that often the main idea of an e-mail is not the mostinteresting part of the thing for me! The asides are sometimes the bestpart! It took me awhile to decide whether to thank people on line for theirhelp or just not return anything. I finally decided to use their homeaddresses to avoid the whole server. It also never occurred to me to startanew thread so I've been guilty of straying quite a ways off topic.Since we all seem to be people of good intention, it would probablybe enough (and very helpful to newcomers) to put up a reminder every fewweeks (clearly marked) so that people who are unaware (or who haveforgotten) can find out how things are supposed to work.Comments? (And forgive me if THIS is too wordy)Art At 09:11 PM 3/3/98 -0800, you wrote:Terry wrote: I was on the ff list a couple of years ago and found that a group of oldscrotums thought that they ran the list and got very annoyed if youmanagedto get a long thread going . They would only reply to each others postingsand would constantly congratulate each other for being so smart. Terry ******************************************************************** Thanks for masking me laugh but sometimes the truth hurts....... ex FF@ Ken Holder from dpeaston@wzrd.com Wed Mar 4 15:19:52 1998 mail.wzrd.com (8.8.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id QAA10587 for Subject: Bandwith I have always wondered about and been iritated by personal messages onthelistserver. For example:Sam, your clums are ready. Come and pick them up next week. Brief as themessage is, I must open it because it contains a Subject line such as: Re:Varnishing by hand We all must have e- mail, so why not use it for thissortof stuff. Regards, Doug EastonTonawanda, NY from flyfisher@cmix.com Wed Mar 4 16:35:04 1998 Subject: RE:Bandwith - NO email address RO>I have always wondered about and been iritated by personal messageson theRO>listserver. For example:RO>Sam, your clums are ready. Come and pick them up next week. Brief astheRO>message is, I must open it because it contains a Subject line such as:Re:RO>Varnishing by hand We all must have e- mail, so why not use it for thissortRO>of stuff. RO>Regards, RO>Doug EastonRO>Tonawanda, NYRO>> > > Doug, My ISP's software doesn't show both the display of the poster's emailaddress and the list-serv's "rodmaker......" I get the email address only if it comes directly from a poster. Sosometimes I can't reply off-list unless the person includes his emailaddress in his subscript! Just like trying to reply to this post could only be done on-list. I'd be willing to bet this is a reason for many of the "Sam, your clumsare ready" posts. Don BurnsFlyfisher@cmix.comcanerods@aol.com from mcreek@sirus.com Wed Mar 4 16:57:34 1998 Subject: Re: Bandwith - chat room A year or so ago some listmembers met at a ffm chatroom at 10:00 am,saturday mornings. Does this still happen? Could the AOL instantmessenger serve to satisfy our chattier nature while leaving the list Brian from jourdoktorn@pilot.stjarntv.se Wed Mar 4 17:59:41 1998 with ESMTP id AAA10519 for ;Thu, 5 Mar 1998 00:59:45 +0100 Subject: Re: McKenzie lines Did find McKenzie homepage and found his lines but could not find a linenamed"Bamboo line". What line is that?Jan, Sweden Tom wrote: Russ Peak's Line Dressing is also distributed by McKenzie and works verywell on the Bamboo line. I didn't realize that the San Juan stayed thatcoldyear round. Best of luck.Tom----------From: john channer Subject: McKenzie linesDate: Tue, 03 Mar 1998 16:53:59 Len and Tom;One last question and then I promise to drop the subject, what do yourecomendtreating it with. Thanks again.John Channer from tyoung@perth.dialix.com.au Wed Mar 4 18:18:50 1998 Thu, 5 Mar 1998 08:18:43 +0800 (WST)(envelope- from tyoung) Subject: Re: Shell Epon Ratio Question On Wed, 4 Mar 1998, eric.koehler wrote: Based on recent rave reviews, I've requested samples of Shell Epon828 resin and 3140 Hardener. The supplier (Stephenson) tells me to use a 2:1 ratio, by weight, of resin to curing agent. They also told me that there's a wide range of ratios that are acceptable, including 1:1. anyone have a "by volume" ratio for this stuff? Thanks in advance,Eck There seems to be a little laditude in the ratio but not as much as in some other epoxies around. While testing on scarfs I found it failed completely unless you mix fairly close the the correct ratio.I'm using 1: 0.66 ratio by volume which is close to the 2:1 you mention.I haven't tried 1:1. Tony /***********************************************************************/Tony Younghttp://www.iinet.net.au/~mainpeak/flyrod.htmlThe Australian connection/***********************************************************************/ from tyoung@perth.dialix.com.au Wed Mar 4 18:46:05 1998 Thu, 5 Mar 1998 08:45:53 +0800 (WST)(envelope- from tyoung) Subject: Re: Re Shell epon epoxy. On Wed, 4 Mar 1998, TSmithwick wrote: In a message dated 3/4/98 2:08:33 PM, you wrote: to do any heat straightening at all as there are no kinks or twists.>> Tony - If you take the rod out of the string in 12-24 hours, you will findthat the Epon is not 100% cured, and you can do a bit of coldstraightening ifyou need to. You will also find it easy to remove the cord and get the glueoff the blank. I can see Bill Fink grinning now. He tried for 15 years togetme to use the stuff, and I would'nt listen. He was right, this is a greatglue John Zimny suggested I do that when he first gave me the drum on what to get and where to try looking for it. You and John are correct as the binding cord just unzips right off the section as easily as if I was using UF or Resorcinol. Assuming this glue works in the field and I have no doubt it does and using Chris Bogarts sugestion that I use vinegar to clean up which also works to the extent I could clean the brush I used to apply the glue which suprised me, I can't see any problems with this glue.My main objection to trying it for gluing splines was the mess and the not an issue.Thanks guys. Tony /***********************************************************************/Tony Younghttp://www.iinet.net.au/~mainpeak/flyrod.htmlThe Australian connection/***********************************************************************/ from hexagon@odyssee.net Wed Mar 4 19:23:17 1998 (205.236.249.214) Subject: Re: Bandwith Douglas P. Easton wrote: I have always wondered about and been iritated by personal messages onthelistserver. For example:Sam, your clums are ready. Come and pick them up next week. Brief asthemessage is, I must open it because it contains a Subject line such as:Re:Varnishing by hand We all must have e- mail, so why not use it for thissortof stuff. Regards, Doug EastonTonawanda, NY surely no worse than 'AMEN'Terry from JDemp1@aol.com Wed Mar 4 19:26:40 1998 Subject: Re: best planing forms? Mark I also like your style, hang in there and most of all have fun !!!!Jed from hexagon@odyssee.net Wed Mar 4 20:13:43 1998 (205.236.248.252) Subject: life after list I would like to suggest that members that have been threatening to quitthe list probably need the break and should quit for a while and buildsome rods.I personally cannot take more than two months in one whack and some ofyou guys have been on here for as long as three years.It was the same thing on the FF, guys wanted to get out yet felt thatthey were locked in somehow. They ended up blaming newbies for spoilingthe list and they were to quit.It is not a weakness to take a break and the list will go on. Memberswith just as much knowledge can step in to fill the void.This list or any list for that matter is not real life and should not betreated as such.Terry from jfoster@gte.net Wed Mar 4 21:05:11 1998 Subject: [Fwd: (Kein Bezug)] 59AE70CB48DBF0D2273DFBEB" This is a multi-part message in MIME format.-------------- 59AE70CB48DBF0D2273DFBEB Can anyone assist this guy? Jerry --------------59AE70CB48DBF0D2273DFBEB (Intermail v3.1 117 234) with ESMTP Subject: (Kein Bezug) Dear Mr. Foster In the Book from C.M.Kreider i`ve found an article from HertersSteel Planing forms - one was made for five Strip-, the otherone for six strip rods. On the Pitcures in Kreiders Book the formshas four parallel grooves.In the foreword, Jim Schaaf said that Herter is no more in Business.Have you any Idee or Tip, where i can find a planing form like these,mabye an original? Thanks and best regards Sincerly Stefan GrauE-Mail: gespliesst@bluewin.ch (private)grau@BuchLang.com (office) --------------59AE70CB48DBF0D2273DFBEB-- from jlintvet@clarityconnect.com Wed Mar 4 21:14:11 1998 mail.clarityconnect.com with SMTP (Eudora Internet Mail Server 2.0.1);Wed, 4Mar 1998 22:15:15 -0500 Subject: Re: Shell Epon Ratio Question I have always (three rods) mixed it 1:1 . Maybe I have been doing it wrong. Seemed to cure though in two of the cases. Chris? Jon Lintvet12B College Circle Ithaca, NY 14850(800) 836- 7558 (607) 277-9781 from richjez@enteract.com Wed Mar 4 22:06:33 1998 (147.126.253.18) Subject: Re: test Just wait until there are a few warm days. Everyone will go fishing andtheposts will become "test". List members will be trying to see if they havebeen dropped from the list the traffic will be so low. That happened lastsummer.Rich Jezioro At 01:23 PM 3/4/98 EST, you wrote:Chris,I think if we take the time to converse off list on non cane topics thebandwidth would narrow cosiderably. I know I've been guilty attimes,morefromlaziness-just hitting "reply" rather than composing a new letter. In anycaseunless it gets a lot worse I'll stick around.Regards,Hank. *_________________________________)// Rich Jezioro @ / /|| ________________________________________________|| /\/ \ > > > from Leessinker@aol.com Wed Mar 4 22:08:13 1998 Subject: Mckenzie/silk Noticed all the comment on Mckenzie's new Bamboo Line.Does anyone know how the diameters of the respective lines compare tothat ofthe same weight silk lines?I have an old custom rod with the original agite stripper guide, the modernlines being larger in diameter prevents shooting line as well as it wouldwithsilk.Has anyone seen the prices of the new silk from England (which btw iswherethe Mckenzie Bamboo line originates)? Dewayne from irish-george@worldnet.att.net Thu Mar 5 00:24:10 1998 mtigwc05.worldnet.att.net(post.office MTA v2.0 0613 ) with ESMTP id AAA28191 Subject: Re: [Fwd: (Kein Bezug)] Possibly. I got mine from Len Codella (a rare one that has 6 strip on oneside and 5 strip on the other).Len told me that he periodically gets one or the other in stock and sellsit but mine is the only combo onehe has seen in 20+ years (mine is NOT for sale). You might check with LenCodella, Dick Spurr, Bob Corsetti,Martin Keane, and Carmine Lisella and see if any of them have one...maybethey'll even keep an eye out might try posting an ad in someMinnesota newspapers...also watch E-Bay website, Herter's stuff has beenpopping up on a regular basis(fly tying vises, catalogs, St. Albans bamboo fly rods, lures, books,etc.).Good luck and you will probably have to be patient. George W. Bourke ----------From: Jerry Foster Subject: [Fwd: (Kein Bezug)]Date: Wednesday, March 04, 1998 6:04 PM Can anyone assist this guy? Jerry from TSmithwick@aol.com Thu Mar 5 07:50:14 1998 Subject: Re: Shell Epon Ratio Question In a message dated 3/4/98 5:49:54 PM, you wrote: Eric- 50-50 by volume will give you a slow, reliable cure. Tony - Use a toothbrush to apply the stuff, and discard it when you aredone.The work will go faster. from tyoung@perth.dialix.com.au Thu Mar 5 09:20:36 1998 Thu, 5 Mar 1998 23:20:26 +0800 (WST)(envelope- from tyoung) Subject: Re: Shell Epon Ratio Question On Thu, 5 Mar 1998, TSmithwick wrote: In a message dated 3/4/98 5:49:54 PM, you wrote: anyone have a "by volume" ratio for this stuff? >> Eric- 50-50 by volume will give you a slow, reliable cure. Tony - Use a toothbrush to apply the stuff, and discard it when you aredone.The work will go faster. That sounds a good idea. A brush dosn't realy carry enough to be useful. Tony /***********************************************************************/Tony Younghttp://www.iinet.net.au/~mainpeak/flyrod.htmlThe Australian connection/***********************************************************************/ from ISHIKAWA@ipmet1.ipmet.unesp.br Thu Mar 5 12:30:50 1998 4.1/UCB5.64/4.03) Subject: Filtering UF glue and Nodeless Hi All! Did anybody try to "filter" an UF glue?I was reading GLUE UPDATE 2 by John Zimny on the last TPF and he notedthe major part (99%) of UF glue is Walnut flour. He also says he doesn'tuse walnut flour in his formulation. Then I started to think in eliminating the walnut that has gap filling properties. I made someexperiences "filtering" the mixed glue throuth an old piece of cottonT-shirt and got a tinner glue - in color and consistency - actually it takes no more than 1 minute for this operation. After gluing the splices and let it dry for 24h it worked just fine. I don't know if there are some side efects, but the solid part is very brittle and can be broke Sergio from jcooper@interalpha.co.uk Thu Mar 5 13:45:46 1998 post.interalpha.net (8.8.7/8.6.11) with ESMTP id TAA18130 for; Thu, 5 Mar 1998 19:48:36 GMT Subject: Re:Brushmarks ----------From: Fishstink Subject: Re: testDate: 04 March 1998 20:27 To everyone,On the topic of "chit-chat", being knew to the list and not aware of pastproblems, I don't think that there is a chat problem. I haven't beeninvolvedlong making rods, so problems that I run into must surely have beencoveredmany times in the past by the list. I recently had a problem gettingbrushstrokes out after varnishing. I received a lot of really good suggestionsfroma LOT of people. I'm sure this is a topic that has been covered manytimes,and to someone who has been making rods for 15 to20 years it probablyseemedlike chit-chat to them, but to me it was information I needed right now.Myguess is, there will always be a lot of repetitive information on thelist.There will always be someone new to the craft to ask these questionsand,hopefully, there will always be someone on the list who will take thetime torespond. But if my only source of info is to be Garrison's book, I willobviously be missing out on more modern, effective techniques, and thehumancontact that makes this work fun.$.02Mike Shay Several times on the list, I've mentioned the fact that I 'brush ' onvarnish with USA made Epifanes foam brushes. No-one seems to havepicked upon this, or replied that they too are using them. If you're a brusher, thenI would recommend that you try these things. They have improved mybrushedfinish tremendously. Now, I promise not to mention them again. John Cooper (England) from flyfisher@cmix.com Thu Mar 5 13:57:56 1998 Subject: Copy of an Obit. - copied from FF@ from CALucker@aol.com Thu Mar 5 14:20:02 1998 Subject: Re: small agate stripper/modern line Don't worry about your small agate stripper from CALucker@aol.com Thu Mar 5 14:28:00 1998 Subject: Re: small agate stripper/modern lines Don't worry about the efficacy of the old agate stripper with modern sizedflylines. Sure, silk shoots better through those old small agates, however, Imake steelhead casts with SA floaters with my EC Powells without anyshootingproblems. EC's have tiny agate strippers. BTW, the only silk lines I have are four and five weights (custom Phoenixlines and an old Transpar). When I want the feel of silk for steelhead, Iuseone of those amber Orvis intermediates. They are skinny and don't mindbeingstepped on as much as a silk line. Chris Lucker from thramer@presys.com Thu Mar 5 15:04:06 1998 Subject: Tapers I would like to discuss taper types with the other members of the group.I build three types of tapers, the Px- a semi para derived fromGranger(just look at the taper archives of the 4wt and the WM) which isstill my favorite to use. A bit slower than alot of the current workbeing done. Others in the taper archives who like that style of rodwould appear to be Cris Bogart in the Shenandoah Supreme models and thePayne 200. Another style that accounts for the majority of the commercial rodsthat I sell is the Dx series. It has been described as a "Catskill Dry"type of taper, progressively loading from the tip to the butt. Easy tocast, readily can be sped up or slowed down. It seems to be the besttype of taper to transition from graphite to bamboo. I seem to provide alot of rods to people transitioning which may account for the popularityof the taper style.The last type is the true Para rods (designated "para" on the rod,quite a bit of imagination , no?). My para rods are characterized by theflex into the cork. I don't like to sell these rods "over the counter"as they are a specialized taper. They require extremely precise timingand can be easily damaged due to the extremely high stresses in thecane. The y come back with blown up butts and hook digs in the tips.If anyone has an interest in discussing my favorite subject of taperdesign, hot dog! I would be quite happy to provide one of my tapers tosuit another listmembers interest.Happy tapering,A.J.Thramerthramer@presys.com from ishikawa@ipmet1.ipmet.unesp.br Thu Mar 5 15:56:29 1998 Subject: Filtering UF glue and Nodeless Hi All! Did anybody try to "filter" an UF glue?I was reading GLUE UPDATE 2 by John Zimny on the last TPF and he notedthe major part (99%) of UF glue is Walnut flour. He also says he doesn'tuse walnut flour in his formulation. Then I started to think in eliminating the walnut that has gap filling properties. I made someexperiences "filtering" the mixed glue throuth an old piece of cottonT-shirt and got a tinner glue - in color and consistency - actually it takes no more than 1 minute for this operation. After gluing the splices and let it dry for 24h it worked just fine. I don't know if there are some side efects, but the solid part is very brittle and can be broke Sergio from SalarFly@aol.com Thu Mar 5 17:53:36 1998 Subject: Re: Tapers I made an experimental taper about a year ago ona short (6'3") 3wt. I was trying to find out if a tapercould affect the tightness of the loop in the flyline.I moved the area of highest stress (designing witha stress curve) the closest to the tip that I could.With the set screws being 5 inches apart, 6 inches from the tip was the closest due to the way thestresses are calculated. Real or not I don't know. It seemed to have worked. The rod casts a tightloop no matter what I do. I have to really try to casta wide loop with this rod. One problem - I cannotrollcast with it. When I try to roll cast, I get somereally severe waves in the flyline right by the tip. Darryl Hayashida from fiveside@net-gate.com Thu Mar 5 18:35:17 1998 ns1.net-gate.com (8.8.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id TAA04476 for Subject: Pocono Gathering To the ListPer Bob Reid the Pocono Gathering is shaping up for the weekend of Sept12-13. Bob is hoping to join us on the list soon. Would be nice. Bill from tyoung@perth.dialix.com.au Thu Mar 5 18:46:13 1998 Fri, 6 Mar 1998 08:46:06 +0800 (WST)(envelope- from tyoung) Subject: Re: Filtering UF glue and Nodeless On Thu, 5 Mar 1998 ishikawa@ipmet1.ipmet.unesp.br wrote: Hi All! Did anybody try to "filter" an UF glue?I was reading GLUE UPDATE 2 by John Zimny on the last TPF and he notedthe major part (99%) of UF glue is Walnut flour. He also says he doesn'tuse walnut flour in his formulation. Then I started to think in eliminating the walnut that has gap filling properties. I made someexperiences "filtering" the mixed glue throuth an old piece of cottonT-shirt and got a tinner glue - in color and consistency - actually it takes no more than 1 minute for this operation. After gluing the splices and let it dry for 24h it worked just fine. I don't know if there are some side efects, but the solid part is very brittle and can be broke Sergio Sergio,have you tried getting hold of some liquid UF? Borden make it and it's what I've been using until now when I'll prob favour epon. Tony /***********************************************************************/Tony Younghttp://www.iinet.net.au/~mainpeak/flyrod.htmlThe Australian connection/***********************************************************************/ from mcreek@sirus.com Thu Mar 5 19:02:02 1998 Subject: Tapers AJ (et. al)- As I've mentioned, I just finished my first rod after fussing withit for 15 months. Except for the guide wraps it came out way beyond mywildest hopes. (Being anal pays off sometimes.) It is a PH Young Para14 taper, and it casts sooo nicely. But for my next rod I want to buildsomething at the other end of the spectrum, and am thinking about aDickerson 8615 from the taper archives. Looking at the stress curves ofthe Para 14, The Force, and the 8615, I think they cover the 3 types ofrod you refered to in your earlier post. I'm wondering, however, what happens if I start adding andsubtracting wood in the butt section of these rod tapers. Can you speedup a para taper by stiffening the lower 1/3 of the rod? Where can youplay around with the dimensions of a taper to speed-up or slow down theaction, and how can you tell (without building the rod, if possible) ifyour alterations will work or not? Is there any rule of thumb fordimensional variations relative to the length of the rod (like a ratio)that is a good, safe amount to vary, or above which you're headed forheart-ache? My current plan is to build a fast, stiffer rod next, then amoderately fast rod, and then start playing with the tapers, but I'dlike to understand some of the theory first. (Plus I'm trying to writea question to get Hank and Chris fired-up.) I hope that this is something we can discuss without getting deepinto physics equations, 'cause I was out behind the dorm smoking weedwhen I should have been studying that stuff. Brian from thramer@presys.com Thu Mar 5 19:50:32 1998 0000 Subject: Tapers-rollcasting Hi Darryl,I have noticed that the more limber the butt of the rod the better therod rollcasts. IE a parabolic taper rollcasts very well and the rod asyou describe with a soft tip tends to let the roll collapse.A.J.Thramer from thramer@presys.com Thu Mar 5 19:58:10 1998 0000 Subject: Re: Tapers-modified Brian & Michelle Creek wrote: AJ (et. al)- As I've mentioned, I just finished my first rod after fussing withit for 15 months. Except for the guide wraps it came out way beyond mywildest hopes. (Being anal pays off sometimes.) It is a PH Young Para14 taper, and it casts sooo nicely. But for my next rod I want to buildsomething at the other end of the spectrum, and am thinking about aDickerson 8615 from the taper archives. Looking at the stress curves ofthe Para 14, The Force, and the 8615, I think they cover the 3 types ofrod you refered to in your earlier post. I'm wondering, however, what happens if I start adding andsubtracting wood in the butt section of these rod tapers. Can you speedup a para taper by stiffening the lower 1/3 of the rod? Where can youplay around with the dimensions of a taper to speed-up or slow down theaction, and how can you tell (without building the rod, if possible) ifyour alterations will work or not? Is there any rule of thumb fordimensional variations relative to the length of the rod (like a ratio)that is a good, safe amount to vary, or above which you're headed forheart-ache? My current plan is to build a fast, stiffer rod next, then amoderately fast rod, and then start playing with the tapers, but I'dlike to understand some of the theory first. (Plus I'm trying to writea question to get Hank and Chris fired-up.) I hope that this is something we can discuss without getting deepinto physics equations, 'cause I was out behind the dorm smoking weedwhen I should have been studying that stuff. BrianYou have to be very care