Subject: RE:Re: Hinges and Rollcasts RO>Don, come to think of it,the winters can be quite nasty here.But,not asbaRO>as RO> when I was young.I remember the snow banks were so high,they usedto use RO> a huge snow blower instead of a plow. So they could get the newsnow upRO>over RO> the banks.I'm glad they aren't THAT bad anymore. Or was it that I wasjusRO>so RO> small,that they LOOKED THAT BIG.DUNNO.I'm too old to rememberback that RO> far. RO> P.S. Give me your new address when you get to Alaska. RO> Dave Dave, I went through the blizzard of '77 (200+" of snow - Buffalo) plusremember the many "snow days" back in the 1950's/'60's - things aresomewhat better now. But wait until El Nino goes away - I'll bet it'sjust a cycle. Don B. PS - When LA gets to be a suburb of Fairbanks, I'll drop you an email.Maybe Piru Creek will have a salmon run we can fish by then. from Nodewrrior@aol.com Fri Aug 14 23:15:14 1998 Subject: Re: Gillum Heat treating I've been asked to make an extra therefore fishable tip for a GillumSalmonrod. The rod is the darker than Payne in color, a dark honey I'd call it. Thisis the standard shade of all but one of the Gillums I've seen.Any advice on how to acheive it?. Of course, I'll post the taper. Rob Hoffhines from tyoung@perth.dialix.com.au Sat Aug 15 00:33:18 1998 Sat, 15 Aug 1998 13:32:56 +0800 (WST)(envelope- from tyoung) Subject: Re: Re; Tasmanian nature trail to hell You've got to remember these crocs are salt water crocks and will eatyou so the guy is a nut.If you ever get over here to do some Barrumundi fishing all thewarnings about not falling out of the boat and not putting hands in the water *are NOT* jokes. Tony Tony;You have to feel sorry for his wife, she would like to be a sensible girl,but he keeps dragginf her off into the bush to chase God knows what. Ihopeshe keeps the premiums paid up.I would love to go to Australia to go barramundi fishing, as a matter offact, it's one of the very first things I'm going to do when I win thelottery. See you then.John You're on. Tony /***********************************************************************/Tony Younghttp://www.iinet.net.au/~mainpeak/flyrod.htmlThe Australian connection A computer without windows is like a fish without a bicycle /***********************************************************************/ from dryfly@erols.com Sat Aug 15 00:36:36 1998 Subject: Receiving Now Thanks for the help guys. I unsubscribed and then subscribed and all isworking well. Thanks again. Bob from irish-george@worldnet.att.net Sat Aug 15 00:44:50 1998 (InterMail v03.02.03 118 118 102) with SMTP +0000 Subject: Re: Varnish supplier for rods Just curious on this point...wouldn't varnishes for musical instrumentsNOTbe too likely to provide good enough resistance to water??? (I know tonecan change with humidity, but I doubt they would expect that your guitarmight get dunked in the river!) George W. Bourke-----Original Message----- Subject: Varnish supplier for rods A friend of mine loaned me his catalog fromStewart-MacDonald Guitar Shop Supply (www.stewmac.com).This catalog has a good variety of varnish supplies (1000 - 6000 grit), and polishing compounds for varnish don't have access to good paint/varnish stores locallythis catalog could be a good resource to use. On an other note, if your wife complains about allthe equipment needed for rodmaking, you should showher all the thousands of little doo-dads need to makeguitars.. -Jerry BallardVicksburg, MS from jcooper@interalpha.co.uk Sat Aug 15 03:35:06 1998 post.interalpha.net (8.8.7/8.6.11) with SMTP id JAA05236 for; Sat, 15 Aug 1998 09:45:55 +0100 Subject: Re: maker At 14:21 11/08/98 -0700, you wrote:does anyone know how to get ahold of Tom Moran thanks jerry Jerry, I was talking to Edward Barder the other day (an event in itself) and hewassaying that Tom is about to move from the town of New Milton, which iswestof Southampton, up to the (I think he said) Newbury area, which is about35miles SW of London. I believe Edward and Tom are close friends. There's certainly little tochoose between their finished rods. John Cooper from gwbarnes@gwi.net Sat Aug 15 06:37:13 1998 Subject: Seeking Information Does anyone know where Andrew Ingram is now located? E-mail to hisaddress of a month ago is now returned. George Barnes from ragnarig@integrityol.com Sat Aug 15 07:12:19 1998 (SMTPD32-4.04) id AD143270150; Sat, 15 Aug 1998 05:20:36 PDT Subject: Re: Varnish supplier for rods Just curious on this point...wouldn't varnishes for musical instrumentsNOTbe too likely to provide good enough resistance to water??? (I know tonecan change with humidity, but I doubt they would expect that your guitarmight get dunked in the river!) Good point, George Spirit varnishes- those made from shellac dissolved in alcohol- whileveryquick to dry and easy to sand, are also soluble in water and, of course,alcohol. These actually have been used on rods and the results are evident.If you see an old production rod with original wraps still intact but novarnish, or very little, remaining on the rod, it was probably finished withshellac. And while I expect that some oil varnishes (very elastic with UV filtersandeverything) intended for fiddles would be great on a rod, I know thatcertain spar varnishes are good, so I'll probably stick with them. Also,most violiin varnishes are pigmented. Davy from gc.williams@MCIONE.com Sat Aug 15 09:48:50 1998 with ESMTP id forrodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu; Sat, 15 Aug 1998 14:48:18 +0000 (GMT) Subject: E6000 Anyone ever tried an adhesive called E6000 for reelseats and cork grips.Mywife uses this stuff in her frame shop and I'm impressed with theworkability, curing time, shelf life, consistency, availability, etc. Thisis industrial strength stuff and I was just curious if any otherrodbuilders have tried it. Gary W. from jpsnbs@erols.com Sat Aug 15 09:57:18 1998 Subject: No Mail Hi, Is anybody out there? I haven't gotten any mail from the rodmakers' list Thanks, Joe from fbcwin@fsbnet.com Sat Aug 15 11:15:17 1998 0500 Subject: Re: E6000 Gary,My wife has a business that makes jewelry from antique buttons. Theyuse E6000 to glue buttons to jewelry findings, and it works very well. Theyuse about 2 tubes per day. The one problem is with bracelets being wornwhilewashing dishes. Does that tell us something about its usefulness forrodbuilding? I'm not sure if the problem is sheer strength or lack ofwaterresistance. Probably sheer strength - see below.I actually did use it once for gluing the reel seat on a plastic rod,and have had no problems. You can thin the stuff and make exactly thesamehead cement as Dave's Flexament. (Must be water resistant after all) Infact,it's the same basic ingredient as Shoe Goo and several other similarproducts,only in differing strengths. from what I've found, E6000 is the strongestavailable over the counter.Be very careful when using it without adequate ventilation. Governmentofficials get crazy over the fumes from this stuff. Bad News! It will getyoudead! Also, unopened shelf life is no problem, but once the tube has beenopened, the whole tube begins to set, no matter how tightly capped. Buy atube, use it for 2 weeks, then throw out 99% because it gets too thick tohandle.Too many other glues work well for reelseats and grips. Although Ihave used it, I probably will not do so again. Harry Boyd GGWilliams wrote: Anyone ever tried an adhesive called E6000 for reelseats and cork grips.Mywife uses this stuff in her frame shop and I'm impressed with theworkability, curing time, shelf life, consistency, availability, etc. Thisis industrial strength stuff and I was just curious if any otherrodbuilders have tried it. Gary W. from fbcwin@fsbnet.com Sat Aug 15 11:22:20 1998 0500 Subject: Re: Arkansas Rod builder Barton? Rick, Terry, et alThere is a builder in the Mountain Home area I've never met, but who hasbeendescribed to me as "an older gentleman who has been making a few rods ayear for along time." I saw two of his rods in the fly shop near Gaston's, and theylooknice- blond, resorcinol glue lines, Garrison like tapers. I cast an 8 foot 6weight,and it was a nice rod. I don't know his name, and have never met him. Someonesuggested I ask Dale Clemens of Blue Ribbon Flies to look him up andinvite him tothe gathering, and I have done so via snail mail. Maybe this is Mr. Barton. Ifso,I really hope he will come by the gathering on October 1. I'm sure he hasmuchinsight to offer.Hope this helps. If you learn more, let me know. I'll be sure to invitehimtojoin us. Harry Rick Crenshaw wrote: I've never heard of him, but I'll ask around as I am in Memphis and theFF Club here is very active with the Arkansas contingent. If I hearanything I'll let you know. Meanwhile, Terry, if you need specific directions to Mountain Home orQuarry Park, let me know where you are driving from and I'll give youdirections. I'm going up a day or two early. If you want to go up onthe 28th or 29th of September, I'll be glad to give you a lift. Rick CrenshawMemphis Terry L. Kirkpatrick wrote: My cousin, Bob Byer of Rolla, Mo. Keeps asking If I know an Arkansas Rodbuilder named Barton (spelling is a guess) He read an article aboutthisbuilder, about a year or two ago. My cousin says he's from northArkansas somaybe he'll be at the SRC? Is he on the list, Terry "Sunfish" KirkpatrickSafety Harbor, Fl.(Old Tampa Bay)sats@gte.net from SalarFly@aol.com Sat Aug 15 11:39:33 1998 Subject: Re: Hinges and Rollcasts In a message dated 8/14/98 5:22:41 PM Pacific Daylight Time,LECLAIR123@aol.com writes: So tell me, what are you gonna do when THE BIG ONE hits and California breaks off and goes in the ocean? When the big one hits California will be left and therest of the United States will sink into the ocean! ;-) Darryl from ragnarig@integrityol.com Sat Aug 15 11:59:07 1998 (SMTPD32-4.04) id A01B3870142; Sat, 15 Aug 1998 10:06:35 PDT Subject: Re: Hinges and Rollcasts Darryl If the first part of this prophecy is fulfilled, I can only hope the balancecomes true as well :-) Davy When the big one hits California will be left and therest of the United States will sink into the ocean! ;-) Darryl from gc.williams@MCIONE.com Sat Aug 15 12:08:21 1998 with ESMTP id forrodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu; Sat, 15 Aug 1998 17:07:49 +0000 (GMT) Subject: Re: E6000 Harry, Thanks for the info, good advice. My original interest in this productstems from my dissatisfaction with epoxy as an adhesive for cork gripsandreel seats. My experience after several years of rod building andmonitoring the longevity of epoxy used on my first rod (1990) is that theepoxy is most likely to break free during extreme hot or cold situationsi.e. leaving the rod in a hot car or outside in sub-freezing conditions.I've intentionally abused this rod under conditions that only a person whobuilds them would be crazy enough to do. As a matter of fact I learned howto complete a splice repair after our black lab sat on the tip. Now Irealize that it's not likely that someone who owns and cherishes a canerodis intentionally going to do that, but accidents do happen! Gary W. ----------From: Harry Boyd Subject: Re: E6000Date: Saturday, August 15, 1998 12:12 PM Gary,My wife has a business that makes jewelry from antique buttons. Theyuse E6000 to glue buttons to jewelry findings, and it works very well. Theyuse about 2 tubes per day. The one problem is with bracelets being wornwhilewashing dishes. Does that tell us something about its usefulness forrodbuilding? I'm not sure if the problem is sheer strength or lack ofwaterresistance. Probably sheer strength - see below.I actually did use it once for gluing the reel seat on a plasticrod,and have had no problems. You can thin the stuff and make exactly thesamehead cement as Dave's Flexament. (Must be water resistant after all) Infact,it's the same basic ingredient as Shoe Goo and several other similarproducts,only in differing strengths. from what I've found, E6000 is thestrongestavailable over the counter.Be very careful when using it without adequate ventilation. Governmentofficials get crazy over the fumes from this stuff. Bad News! It willget youdead! Also, unopened shelf life is no problem, but once the tube hasbeenopened, the whole tube begins to set, no matter how tightly capped. Buyatube, use it for 2 weeks, then throw out 99% because it gets too thick tohandle.Too many other glues work well for reelseats and grips. AlthoughIhave used it, I probably will not do so again. Harry Boyd GGWilliams wrote: Anyone ever tried an adhesive called E6000 for reelseats and corkgrips. Mywife uses this stuff in her frame shop and I'm impressed with theworkability, curing time, shelf life, consistency, availability, etc.Thisis industrial strength stuff and I was just curious if any otherrodbuilders have tried it. Gary W. from irvine@bamboorods.org Sat Aug 15 16:02:37 1998 da013549 for; Sat, 15 Aug 1998 14:04:55 -0700 Subject: Re: Gillum Heat treating Rob,I have been able to get the dark honey color by capping a two inch blackplasticpipe with a cup or two on household ammonia in the bottom and suspendingthestrips of bamboo rough planned and wrapped in the pipe and placing asandwich bagover the top tied down for a week or two or three in the sun. The longeryou leaveit the darker it gets, depending of course on how hot the sun is, Chuck Nodewrrior@aol.com wrote: I've been asked to make an extra therefore fishable tip for a GillumSalmonrod. The rod is the darker than Payne in color, a dark honey I'd call it.Thisis the standard shade of all but one of the Gillums I've seen.Any advice on how to acheive it?.Of course, I'll post the taper. Rob Hoffhines from channer@hubwest.com Sat Aug 15 16:15:10 1998 (SMTPD32-4.02c) id AAC1902A014E; Sat, 15 Aug 1998 15:16:49 MDT Subject: Re: Hinges and Rollcasts At 12:38 PM 8/15/98 EDT, you wrote:In a message dated 8/14/98 5:22:41 PM Pacific Daylight Time,LECLAIR123@aol.com writes: So tell me, what are you gonna do when THE BIG ONE hits and California breaks off and goes in the ocean? When the big one hits California will be left and therest of the United States will sink into the ocean! ;-) Darryl Darryl;I suppose you never get accused of being an incurable optimist,do you?John from fiveside@net-gate.com Sat Aug 15 19:26:58 1998 ns1.net-gate.com (8.8.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id UAA10519 for Subject: Hinges, Rollcasts and Related Subjects To The ListGot many interesting responses, mostly dealing with locations andresidentwildlife. Can't help but to add comments relative to New Jersey. We don'thave crocodiles or snowdrifts or even much trout fishing but we areknown asthe 4-Tee-state because we have an abundance of trash, ticks, traffic andtaxes. Bill from gjones1@ix.netcom.com Sat Aug 15 19:29:09 1998 19:28:37 ix1.ix.netcom.comvia smap (V1.3) Subject: Re: Arkansas Rod builder Barton? Harry Boyd wrote: Rick, Terry, et alThere is a builder in the Mountain Home area I've never met, but whohasbeendescribed to me as "an older gentleman who has been making a few rodsa year foralong time." I saw two of his rods in the fly shop near Gaston's, and theylooknice- blond, resorcinol glue lines, Garrison like tapers. I cast an 8 foot 6weight,and it was a nice rod. I don't know his name, and have never met him. Someonesuggested I ask Dale Clemens of Blue Ribbon Flies to look him up andinvite himtothe gathering, and I have done so via snail mail. Maybe this is Mr. Barton. Ifso,I really hope he will come by the gathering on October 1. I'm sure he hasmuchinsight to offer.Hope this helps. If you learn more, let me know. I'll be sure to invitehim tojoin us. Harry Harry:I saw the same rods on a trip to the White earlier this year. Theygave thebuilders name as Phillip Geffken, 225 Redbud Lane, Mountain Home, Ark.Phone501-425-2725. I wanted to get by and visit with him but ran out of timeand had tocomeback to the real world of working for a living.I would like to make it to the gathering in October but I don't know if myworkschedulewill allow, I am just starting on putting together the stuff I need to getintothe artof making bamboo rods and would love to learn more on rodmaking. I havethreerods thatI am working on restoring to begin with, the last one I picked up is a 8 1/2foot4 1/2oz. three piece with extra tip, H-I Governor. I have done some preliminarysearching forinformation on the Governor but haven't found anything on it. Does anyoneknowanythingabout this rod. Wannabe RodmakerGary JonesSt. Louis, MO from ragnarig@integrityol.com Sat Aug 15 19:50:36 1998 (SMTPD32-4.04) id AEA839A00FA; Sat, 15 Aug 1998 17:58:16 PDT Subject: personal mail To the list If anyone on the list has e-mailed me in the past twenty-four hours or so,would you please contact me? I have made a stupid error involving thedelete button and cast several unread messages into outer darkness. Anyonewho would like to return to the days of carrier pigeons, please contact mealso. :-) Davy from Domenic1@ix.netcom.com Sat Aug 15 19:58:15 1998 19:57:41 ix9.ix.netcom.comvia smap (V1.3) Subject: Re: 209E Mathematically the 209E is designed to handle a dt 5. Domenic-----Original Message----- Subject: Re: 209E Chris, Does someone know the target line wt. for the Garrison 209E taperlistedonJerry Foster's webpage. I assume 4 or 5, but if someone has made a rod from this taper what works well for you? Thanks. According to the info my 'teacher' gave me, the G209E is a 7'-6" 6wt. HTH SteveSteve and Julie StillabowerIndianapolis, INsjstill@iquest.net from anglport@con2.com Sat Aug 15 20:28:43 1998 Subject: Re: Arkansas Rod builder Barton? Gary,There isn't a lot out there on H-I. You can forget Campbell ("Classic andAntique Fishing Tackle"), Keane ( "Classic Rods and Rodmakers")andSchwiebert's "Trout". I just went through all three and they haveextremelylittle on H-I and nothing on a Governor model. The co is not even in theindex of Allan Liu's book, "The American Sporting Collector's Handbook".Harmon Henkin mentions the co in one paragraph and you probably don'twantto know what he thinks of their product's quality (although he did specifythe NINE footers for being "dogs";"some of the smaller ones weren't bad").The others who did mention them weren't handing out any encomiumseither.Sorry to be the bearer of (doubly) bad news. Really started out hoping Icould make your day. Hope 8 1/2 foot is "one of the smaller ones" Henkinwastalking about or that you didn't pay too much for it. What the hell, if it IS a dog you don't have to worry about ruining a pieceof history when you learn your craft. I found a rod at a flea market thatdidn't even look like a rod except it had ferrules and was dirt cheap andwhen I got done with it it didn't look bad at all, though it cast just thesame as it always did. You might try Len Codella @ You can email him at: len@codella.com or call (352) 637-5420 - FAX(352) 637-5454 or write him at: Heritage Sporting Collectibles2201 South Carnegie DriveInverness, Florida 34450 (with apologies to Don Burns whosee-mail of last week I cut and pasted) Good luck,Art (huge snip)I have three rods thatI am working on restoring to begin with, the last one I picked up is a 81/2 foot 4 1/2oz. three piece with extra tip, H-I Governor. I have done some preliminarysearching forinformation on the Governor but haven't found anything on it. Does anyoneknow anythingabout this rod. Wannabe RodmakerGary JonesSt. Louis, MO from stpete@netten.net Sat Aug 15 22:15:34 1998 cedar.netten.net (8.8.8/8.6.12) with SMTP id VAA00550 for Subject: Re: Arkansas Rod builder Barton? Gary C. Jones wrote: ... the last one I picked up is a 8 1/2 foot 4 1/2oz. three piece with extra tip, H-I Governor. I have done somepreliminarysearching forinformation on the Governor but haven't found anything on it. Does anyoneknowanythingabout this rod. Gary, I just looked in Michael Sinclair's book 'Bamboo Rod RestorationHandbook' and there is some info on the Govenor. Seems it was made fromthe 1930's to the 50's. It was a mid/lower end rod, going for about $12in the 30's while the top rods sold for $50 and the lowest rods sold forabout $5. (One rod sold for $1.75 and another for $2.25, but we won'tget into that!) If you will tell me the color of the wraps and tipping,if any, and the decal and writing, if any, I can tell you a morespecific date. Hopefully everything is still original, but lots ofthose old fishermen where like my Grandad and did home repairs andrefinishing with what ever they had on hand. Describing the reelseatand ferrules would help a lot since those were rarely changed. H-I rods are not considered high quality, but I have a Tonka Princewhich casts fairly nice indeed. The cane work is not topnotch, but it'spretty good. I've seen other Tonka Princes which were not half as nice,so I think it depends on what year, who did the work, etc. Same withother production rods I guess. I have a Southbend 357 which is nicework, but a 359 I bought for cheap is the pits! The nodes are bulgedout so far its a wonder anyone would let something like that out of theshop!. Good Luck.Rick from Nodewrrior@aol.com Sun Aug 16 00:22:02 1998 Subject: Re: Fishhawk silk I found a source for Fish hawk 3/0 silk.Has anybody seen the stuff/If so, how'd you like it? Rob Hoffhines from gjones1@ix.netcom.com Sun Aug 16 00:48:05 1998 00:47:26 ix8.ix.netcom.comvia smap (V1.3) Subject: Re: Arkansas Rod builder Barton? Rick Crenshaw wrote: Gary, I just looked in Michael Sinclair's book 'Bamboo Rod RestorationHandbook' and there is some info on the Govenor. Seems it was madefromthe 1930's to the 50's. It was a mid/lower end rod, going for about $12in the 30's while the top rods sold for $50 and the lowest rods sold forabout $5. (One rod sold for $1.75 and another for $2.25, but we won'tget into that!) If you will tell me the color of the wraps and tipping,if any, and the decal and writing, if any, I can tell you a morespecific date. Hopefully everything is still original, but lots ofthose old fishermen where like my Grandad and did home repairs andrefinishing with what ever they had on hand. Describing the reelseatand ferrules would help a lot since those were rarely changed. H-I rods are not considered high quality, but I have a Tonka Princewhich casts fairly nice indeed. The cane work is not topnotch, but it'spretty good. I've seen other Tonka Princes which were not half as nice,so I think it depends on what year, who did the work, etc. Same withother production rods I guess. I have a Southbend 357 which is nicework, but a 359 I bought for cheap is the pits! The nodes are bulgedout so far its a wonder anyone would let something like that out of theshop!. Good Luck.Rick Rick:The decal is in good shape, says Genuine Tonkin Cane, Fish H-I Rod,Governor ishand writtenin gold ink, the reelseat is gray marblized plastic. The guides have beenrewrapped ratherpoorly. I knew that the H-I rods are not high quality, but I hadn't heard ofthisGovernor.The cane work is fairly good for this type of rod and the action isn't bad. Ifigure at thegarage sale price I paid it would be a good rod to practice on. Thanks forall oftheinformation. Gary Jones from dpeaston@wzrd.com Sun Aug 16 08:44:33 1998 mail.wzrd.com(8.9.1/8.7.3) with SMTP id JAA02370; Sun, 16 Aug 1998 09:39:38 -0400 Subject: Re: Arkansas Rod builder Barton? At 09:47 PM 8/15/98 -0500, Rick Crenshaw wrote: Gary C. Jones wrote: ... the last one I picked up is a 8 1/2 foot 4 1/2 oz. three piece with extra tip, H-I Governor. I have done somepreliminary searching for information on the Governor but haven't found anything on it. Doesanyone know anything about this rod. ------------------------>snip-----------------------------------> H-I rods are not considered high quality, but I have a Tonka Prince which casts fairly nice indeed. The cane work is not topnotch, butit's pretty good. I've seen other Tonka Princes which were not half asnice, so I think it depends on what year, who did the work, etc. Same with other production rods I guess. I have a Southbend 357 which is nice work, but a 359 I bought for cheap is the pits! The nodes are bulged the shop!. Good Luck. Rick __________________________________________________________________________ Gary, These descriptions and prices (Below)are from Dick Spurr's Classic AnglerSite.[ http://www.gorp.com/cl_angle/bamboo.htm ] The "Favorite" is rightnext to your Governor in price/quality. Your rod is shorter and for alighter line (these are positives). Dick's asking prices for these rodstend to be a bit high, but do reflect the differences in rods. The mostimportant determinants of price are: 1. Maker (quality) 2. Condition 3.Length (shorter is better) 4. Model (trim level; esthetics; finishquality). Most of the production rod makers had a wide range of models.The top quality rods from Montegue, H&I, South Bend etc. are good rods,fish well and look good. Bottom of the line rods are, as oft said,trash. 11910 HORROCKS-IBBOTSON - 9' for #6 =96 3/2. 6 oz. Med/Fast. Full metalwith siding band. Red tipped black. Amateur refinish of a standardproduction rod. Wraps and varnish are adequate; partial label retained onshaft. Cork grip quite soiled; dings in metal reel seat. Male ferrule onMid section damaged, repaired with a screw but works okay. Mid and tipsshort 1-1=BD" with original hardware. Flykeeper, agate stripper. R =96$80 12041 HORROCKS-IBBOTSON Tonka Queen - 7'9" for #5 - 2/1. 4=BD oz.Med/Fast.Green bakelite D/L. Gold tipped red. A nice rod with a dramatic swelledbutt. Good decal and writing on shaft. Lightly soiled grip, good cork.Original wraps all intact and sound; varnish fine for fishing. Bag andfiber tube, no cap. 12070 UNMARKED Favorite - 9' for #7/8 - 3/1. 6=BDoz. Med/Fast. Bakelite D/L. Red tipped white. An inexpensiveproduction rod that appears to have been made by Horrocks-Ibbotson; has typical model name white inked writingonshaft. Wide-ring cork grip with some damage on top edge; brass platedferrules, watermarked cane. Wraps all intact; varnish intact but shows age andwear. Tip section has distinct reverse set. Bag only. A =96 $70 12169 HORROCKS-IBBOTSON Adirondack - 9' for #6 - 3/2. 6 oz. Med/Fast.Plated with sliding band. Black/Red/Black. High end early H-I rod with beautiful original decal of fish logo label on shaft; agate stripper andtiptop on one tip section. Quality cork grip is only moderately soiled.All wraps original and intact; fine varnish for a rod of this vintage.Nice swelled butt, quality plated ferrules, flykeeper; different originaltiptips on the 2 tip sections. Comes with small bag and aluminum tiptube; fits with other sections in a canvas bag. G/E =96 $240 Regards, Doug Easton Tonawanda, NY from fbcwin@fsbnet.com Sun Aug 16 10:01:52 1998 0500 Subject: Re: Arkansas Rod builder Barton? Gary,Thanks for passing the information along. I'll contact Mr. Gefken inhopes that hemight join us in October. Hope to see you there as well. I suspect thatthesekinds ofgatherings are really helpful to those contemplating the rodbuildingprocess.Regarding workschedules, good luck. I've planned this time off for several months. Thanks again, Harry Gary C. Jones wrote: Harry Boyd wrote: Rick, Terry, et alThere is a builder in the Mountain Home area I've never met, but whohasbeendescribed to me as "an older gentleman who has been making a few rodsa year long time." I saw two of his rods in the fly shop near Gaston's, andtheylook nice- blond, resorcinol glue lines, Garrison like tapers. I cast an 8 foot 6weight,and it was a nice rod. I don't know his name, and have never met him.Someonesuggested I ask Dale Clemens of Blue Ribbon Flies to look him up andinvitehim tothe gathering, and I have done so via snail mail. Maybe this is Mr.Barton.If so,I really hope he will come by the gathering on October 1. I'm sure hehasmuchinsight to offer.Hope this helps. If you learn more, let me know. I'll be sure toinvitehim tojoin us. Harry Harry:I saw the same rods on a trip to the White earlier this year. Theygavethebuilders name as Phillip Geffken, 225 Redbud Lane, Mountain Home, Ark.Phone501-425-2725. I wanted to get by and visit with him but ran out of timeand hadto comeback to the real world of working for a living.I would like to make it to the gathering in October but I don't know if myworkschedulewill allow, I am just starting on putting together the stuff I need to getintothe artof making bamboo rods and would love to learn more on rodmaking. Ihave threerods thatI am working on restoring to begin with, the last one I picked up is a 81/2foot 4 1/2oz. three piece with extra tip, H-I Governor. I have done somepreliminarysearching forinformation on the Governor but haven't found anything on it. Does anyoneknowanythingabout this rod. Wannabe RodmakerGary JonesSt. Louis, MO from stpete@netten.net Sun Aug 16 10:14:20 1998 cedar.netten.net (8.8.8/8.6.12) with SMTP id KAA06002 for Subject: Re: Arkansas Rod builder Barton? The decal is in good shape, says Genuine Tonkin Cane, Fish H-I Rod,Governor ishand writtenin gold ink, the reelseat is gray marblized plastic. The guides have beenrewrapped ratherpoorly. I knew that the H-I rods are not high quality, but I hadn't heard ofthis Governor.The cane work is fairly good for this type of rod and the action isn't bad. Ifigure at thegarage sale price I paid it would be a good rod to practice on. Thanks forallof theinformation. Gary Jones Gary, According to Sinclair the rod you have was made from 1945-1950. Thedecal you described was used these years. (red letters 'H-I' on whitebackground, yellow banner with black letters 'Fish Rod', torquoisebanner below with 'Genuine Tonkin Cane in black letters below). Thereel seats were usually solid colors pre-war and marblized post-war. If you want to make the rod more original, Sinclair indicates that theGovernor of that era had wraps of "Red #10" with no tipping. Havingnever seen one in person, that's all I can tell you about the rod - andthat was determined from the book. Good Luck,Rick from saweiss@flash.net Sun Aug 16 15:48:03 1998 Subject: Re: Agatine Strippers, was Re: Single foot snake guides Russ,I would like to have 10 agatine guides, 5 each of 8.5 & 9.5, if possible.Let me know what you need from me, as far as payment .Thanks,Steve Weiss from richjez@enteract.com Sun Aug 16 16:43:33 1998 0000 (147.126.253.18) Subject: Magazine Does anyone have the email address for the Bamboo Rod Magizine? I cannotget the link on their page to work to send them mail.Thanks Rich Jezioro *________________________________)// Rich Jezioro @ /||/______/_||_________________________________________|| /\ / \ > > from gwr@seanet.com Sun Aug 16 17:13:28 1998 mx.seanet.com(8.8.8/Seanet-8.7.3) with SMTP id PAA19040 for; Sun, Subject: Re: Agatine Strippers, was Re: Single foot snake guides Russ,I would like to have 10 agatine guides, 5 each of 8.5 & 9.5, if possible.Let me know what you need from me, as far as payment .Thanks,Steve Weiss Thanks for your order Steve. Daryll & I both appreciate your business.We can supply the guides you'd like and will have them ready by mid-late Golden Witch Rods16829 6th Ave. WestSuite #2BLynnwood, WA 98037 As I'm almost out the door to go fishing, there is no need to sendpayment until the first of September - your check will just linger at thepost office. Thanks again & best regards, Russ Goodinggwr@seanet.comhttp://www.goldenwitch.com from flyfisher@cmix.com Sun Aug 16 17:45:48 1998 Subject: RE:H-I Gov was RE: Arkansas Rod builder Barton? RO>I am working on restoring to begin with, the last one I picked up is a 81/2RO>oz. three piece with extra tip, H-I Governor. I have done somepreliminary sRO>information on the Governor but haven't found anything on it. Doesanyone knRO>about this rod. RO>Wannabe RodmakerRO>Gary JonesRO>St. Louis, MO Gary, Depending upon the reelseat, your rod could be from the 1930's throughthe end of cane production. If you have a plastic/bakelite or aluminiumspacer in the reelseat then the rod is one of the later rods. The 1930'srods had a nickel-silver C&R reelseat and sounds like a nicer (looking)rod. It would be harder to restore too. Don Burns from fiveside@net-gate.com Sun Aug 16 18:03:58 1998 ns1.net-gate.com (8.8.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id TAA18273; Sun, 16 Aug 199819:04:25 Subject: Re: 209E To the List:Am not sure who originated the question so am sending to the list: ForGarrison's 209E taper as per Pg 280, my Histand software says that for 50foot casts and with Garrison's standard stress curve a weight 6 DTfloatingline is a near perfect match. I built one and my experience agrees exceptthat I don't often make 50 foot casts. Bill from RMargiotta@aol.com Sun Aug 16 18:28:39 1998 Subject: Model 209E weight. --Rich from Millsx5@aol.com Sun Aug 16 19:22:24 1998 Subject: Re: Magazine Rich,I got this e-mail address from the Bamboo Rod Magazine web site. Ihopeitworkes for you. Bam-fly@Pacbell.net Mike Mills from saweiss@flash.net Sun Aug 16 22:40:27 1998 Subject: Re: Agatine Strippers, was Re: Single foot snake guides Hey Folks,Pardon my error, I didn't mean to place the order on the list's space.Computer error (I screwed up).Steve weiss from saweiss@flash.net Sun Aug 16 22:50:52 1998 Subject: 8' 6" taper Anyone have a suggestion or a taper for a lightweight 8'6"?I have a friend who's favorite medium-to-small stream rod is a 386 SageLLand he would love to have a lightweight ( 3, 4, or 5-wt.)bamboo under 4 oz,but wants the length because he likes to flip and dap his dries and keepsalmost all of the leader off the water rather than cast.Am I asking for the impossible? Would the taper result in a limp rod?Steve Weiss from ragnarig@integrityol.com Mon Aug 17 00:20:45 1998 (SMTPD32-4.04) id AFA29E40102; Sun, 16 Aug 1998 22:29:06 PDT Subject: Re: 8' 6" taper Dear Steve The Granger in the RM taper archive is an awfully good rod, as would bethePayne 101. I've got a Thomas 9-footer that casts 4wt plastic very nicely.Sometimes they come up for sale at bargain prices if you don't want tobuildone. Davy Anyone have a suggestion or a taper for a lightweight 8'6"?I have a friend who's favorite medium-to-small stream rod is a 386 SageLLand he would love to have a lightweight ( 3, 4, or 5-wt.)bamboo under 4oz,but wants the length because he likes to flip and dap his dries and keepsalmost all of the leader off the water rather than cast.Am I asking for the impossible? Would the taper result in a limp rod?Steve Weiss from channer@hubwest.com Mon Aug 17 01:15:53 1998 (SMTPD32-4.02c) id AAFEB37011C; Mon, 17 Aug 1998 00:17:34 MDT Subject: Re: 8' 6" taper At 10:04 PM 8/16/98 -0600, you wrote:Anyone have a suggestion or a taper for a lightweight 8'6"?I have a friend who's favorite medium-to-small stream rod is a 386 SageLLand he would love to have a lightweight ( 3, 4, or 5- wt.)bamboo under 4oz,but wants the length because he likes to flip and dap his dries and keepsalmost all of the leader off the water rather than cast.Am I asking for the impossible? Would the taper result in a limp rod?Steve Weiss Steve;I have a taper for an 8'6" 4wt., but I can't promise you that itcomes inunder 4 oz. I won't be able to weigh it until the end of next week(it'scoming back, the guy can't pay for a couple months).It might weigh thatwith a cork/slide band seat, this rod has a burl/uplock on it that puts alittle more weight behind your hand. John from iank@nelson.planet.org.nz Mon Aug 17 06:03:12 1998 ; Mon, 17 Aug 1998 23:03:01 +1200 Subject: Re: Re; Tasmanian nature trail to hell At 10:22 PM 14/08/98 +0800, you wrote:On Fri, 14 Aug 1998, Ian Kearney wrote: Davy , We once had a Prime Minister who made the following response to theAustralians complaining about NZers going over to Australia to live onthedole while surfing on the Gold Coast . " It is good for both New Zealand and Australia as the effect is toimprovethe average IQ of the residents in both country's " :)) That must have been David Longey(sp?) He was an inteligent guy even fora politician (and a Kiwi) ;-)He prob started the joke about Australians liking to wear elastic sided boots 'cause we can't tie our shoe laces. Tony Tony , It was Rob Muldoon , about the only true and/or intelligent statement heever made .., but then he may have stolen it off someone else like Langewhowas intelligent , as you say . regards Iank ps the country is in mourning after the last football match. pps sorry about the bandwidth fellows , but when an international tragedyhappens like the All Blacks ( NZ's football team ) get beaten by both SouthAfrica and Australia for the first time in 50 years it is hard toconcentrate .Ian Kearney phone 0064 03 5445556104 Champion Road Fax 0064 03 5440374Richmond New Zealand email inak@ts.co.nz from tyoung@perth.dialix.com.au Mon Aug 17 07:21:19 1998 Mon, 17 Aug 1998 20:21:11 +0800 (WST)(envelope- from tyoung) Subject: Re: Re; Tasmanian nature trail to hell Ian, Tony , It was Rob Muldoon , about the only true and/or intelligent statement heever made .., but then he may have stolen it off someone else like Langewhowas intelligent , as you say . regards Iank ps the country is in mourning after the last football match. pps sorry about the bandwidth fellows , but when an internationaltragedyhappens like the All Blacks ( NZ's football team ) get beaten by bothSouthAfrica and Australia for the first time in 50 years it is hard toconcentrate . I pointedly avoided mentioning the games being something akin to a deathin the family or some b*****d daming a perfectly good stream but as you mention it, my condolances....... well, as much as I can muster, you know. Tony /***********************************************************************/Tony Younghttp://www.iinet.net.au/~mainpeak/flyrod.htmlThe Australian connection A computer without windows is like a fish without a bicycle /***********************************************************************/ from richard.nantel@videotron.ca Mon Aug 17 07:48:54 1998 withESMTP id ; Mon, 17 Aug 1998 08:48:42 -0400 munin.request.net withSMTP id ; Mon, 17 Aug 1998 08:48:35 -0400 Subject: 2 tips boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0005_01BDC9B9.D9273500" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01BDC9B9.D9273500 Do most of you bother building a second tip for your rods even if they are have only broken one rod in all that time, a high-modulus graphite thatexploded at the butt when I fell on it. Apart from the tradition of two-tips(which I understand to be an important factor for people buying bamboo),itseems the rodmaker has the luxury of building a second tip later if the tipon a favorite rod were to break. Richard ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01BDC9B9.D9273500 name="Richard Nantel (E-mail).vcf" filename="Richard Nantel (E-mail).vcf" BEGIN:VCARDVERSION:2.1N:Nantel;Richard;;;FN:Richard Nantel (E-mail)ORG:Le groupe MENTOR;TITLE:TEL;WORK;VOICE:(514) 393- 3292TEL;HOME;VOICE:(514) 485-2287TEL;PAGER;VOICE:[1] (514) 111- 1111TEL;WORK;FAX:(514) 393-1483ADR;WORK:;;4374 Old Orchard Avenue;Monteal;Quebec;H4A 3B4;CanadaLABEL;WORK;ENCODING=3DQUOTED- PRINTABLE:4374 Old Orchard =Avenue=3D0D=3D0AMonteal, Quebec H4A 3B4=3D0D=3D0ACanadaADR;HOME:;;4374 Old Orchard Avenue;Monteal;Quebec;H4A 3B4;CanadaLABEL;HOME;ENCODING=3DQUOTED- PRINTABLE:4374 Old Orchard =Avenue=3D0D=3D0AMonteal, Quebec H4A 3B4=3D0D=3D0ACanadaEMAIL;PREF;INTERNET:richard.nantel@videotron.caREV:19980514T133343ZEND:VCARD ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01BDC9B9.D9273500-- from andrew_harsanyi@ibi.com Mon Aug 17 08:37:45 1998 0400 Subject: Re: 2 tips I suspect that as long as you keep enough of the original culm to be able to create a replacement should you need it, it probably doesn't matter. Then again, I don't know if there is such a thing as a rod 'breaking in'. This would mean that a brand new tip on an older rod may not have the same action. Maybe that's why I've been told by some to alternate use of tips (when I have two). You're making me rethink whether I should make two tips for the rod I am working on (my first). Perhaps the more experienced makers herecan clarify this for both of us... Andy ______________________________ Reply Separator_________________________________Subject: 2 tips Author: at Tcpgate Do most of you bother building a second tip for your rods even if they are have only broken one rod in all that time, a high-modulus graphite thatexploded at the butt when I fell on it. Apart from the tradition of two-tips(which I understand to be an important factor for people buying bamboo),itseems the rodmaker has the luxury of building a second tip later if the tipon a favorite rod were to break. Richard from Nodewrrior@aol.com Mon Aug 17 08:41:02 1998 Subject: Re: 2 tips All my personal rods are "one tip wonders" ecxept for my copy of the para15woth both tips.It's not like my rods will ever have the collector cachet of, let's sayGillumwhere a one tip personal rod would be a let-down. Anybody remember the$14,00071/2' that was in Keane's catalog that belonged to Mrs. Gillum? Rob from jlintvet@clarityconnect.com Mon Aug 17 10:11:31 1998 mail.clarityconnect.com with SMTP (Eudora Internet Mail Server 2.2b4);Mon, 17Aug 1998 11:19:04 -0400 Subject: Re: 2 tips I'm pretty new to this also and my thoughts are pretty straight forward. I wanted to build as many rods as I could (has turned out to not be that many) to feel the tapers and actions. Up to date i have only built one tip rods because I wasn't sure if I would like the rod. Now I know the action I like and build two tips. Just my $.02Jon Lintvet140 East Spencer StreetIthaca, NY 14580(800) 836-7558(607) 277-4510 http://www.clarityconnect.com/webpages4/jlintvet/ from richard.nantel@videotron.ca Mon Aug 17 10:24:29 1998 (modemcable236.173.mmtl.videotron.net LAA25389 for Subject: RE: 2 tips Hi Jon. You echo my thinking on this exactly. I personally want to try asmany tapers and fish as many rods as possible. Perhaps when I create arod Ilove to bits, it would then make sense to build a second tip. Would it makethat big a difference if the tip weren't made from the same culm? Richardrichard.nantel@videotron.ca -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: 2 tips I'm pretty new to this also and my thoughts are pretty straightforward. I wanted to build as many rods as I could (has turned outto not be that many) to feel the tapers and actions. Up to date ihave only built one tip rods because I wasn't sure if I would likethe rod. Now I know the action I like and build two tips. Just my$.02Jon Lintvet140 East Spencer StreetIthaca, NY 14580(800) 836-7558(607) 277- 4510http://www.clarityconnect.com/webpages4/jlintvet/ from saweiss@flash.net Mon Aug 17 13:08:24 1998 Subject: Re: 2 tips -----Original Message----- Subject: 2 tips Do most of you bother building a second tip for your rods even if they are andhave only broken one rod in all that time, a high-modulus graphite thatexploded at the butt when I fell on it. Apart from the tradition oftwo-tips(which I understand to be an important factor for people buying bamboo),itseems the rodmaker has the luxury of building a second tip later if thetipon a favorite rod were to break. Richard Richard,I have broken several, the most recent a nice Orvis Battenkill. The otherswere graphites. Maybe I'm just clumsy, or you just don't fish enough.All of mine were broken while fishing, one when landing a 24" rainbow(therod probably had a ding on it) and the others in falls in some very roughcanyons.Steve Weiss from mcdowellc@lanecc.edu Mon Aug 17 13:13:29 1998 via smap(4.1) Subject: Test / No Message Hey you looked!!! Shame on you!!! You can get help for that, you know. Chrismcdowellc@lanecc.edu from rclarke@eou.edu Mon Aug 17 13:23:56 1998 Subject: summer runn steelie Caught my first steelhead yesterday-Summer run, about 18-19". It was anative, and caught him on a bamboo rod! Heddon Peerless #35. Hope tocatch another soon on a rod of my own construction. It was a blast andboth parties were released unharmed. Robert ClarkeLa Grande, ORrclarke@eou.edu from richard.nantel@videotron.ca Mon Aug 17 13:33:47 1998 (modemcable236.173.mmtl.videotron.net OAA12637 for Subject: RE: 2 tips Hi Steve, I get away on the stream about twice a week from April until October. (Iwish it were much more.) Usually in a season, I'll catch 2-3 20-inch plusbrowns or brookies. (I wish it were much more.) Most trout are in the 10to16 inch range. Perhaps my north-eastern freestone streams are a bit moregentle to wade than those fabulous western waters many of you get tofish.Also, the bamboo rods I've been using for trout are both 5-weights. Notexactly the lightest tackle in these days of 2-3 weights. Also, I'm stillusing a graphite 7-weight for bass, pike, muskie, etc. I look forward to the day when I break a rod on a good fish, Steve. As JohnGierach says, every flyfisher should have that happen at least once in hisor her life. Aren't bamboo rods less likely to break on a good fish thanultra-stiff graphite? Richard -----Original Message----- Weiss Subject: Re: 2 tips -----Original Message----- Subject: 2 tips Do most of you bother building a second tip for your rods even if they are andhave only broken one rod in all that time, a high-modulus graphite thatexploded at the butt when I fell on it. Apart from the tradition oftwo-tips(which I understand to be an important factor for people buying bamboo),itseems the rodmaker has the luxury of building a second tip later if thetipon a favorite rod were to break. Richard Richard,I have broken several, the most recent a nice Orvis Battenkill. The otherswere graphites. Maybe I'm just clumsy, or you just don't fish enough.All of mine were broken while fishing, one when landing a 24" rainbow(therod probably had a ding on it) and the others in falls in some very roughcanyons.Steve Weiss from WDHCJL@aol.com Mon Aug 17 13:36:06 1998 Subject: Re: Brian Thoman info? Brian just e-mailed me a few days back. He has moved to Denver.Try him at: flyfisher@bambooflyrods.com later,doug hall from lcdr.hallowell@smtp.cnet.navy.mil Mon Aug 17 13:44:53 1998 (1.38.193.4/16.2) id AA14141; Mon, 17 Aug 1998 13:46:06 -0500 R8.00.01) Subject: Re[2]: Southern Rodmaker Gathering I missed some of the mail over this. When and where is it? I may by transferring early from Great Lakes and it may just have to be on the way! Mark Hallowell ______________________________ Reply Separator_________________________________Subject: Re: Southern Rodmaker Gathering Author: at INTERNET Jon,Memphis is about 4 hours. Little Rock about 2 hours. The siteslisted below, especially the first, should give you plenty of info on the area. According to the page, there are deaily connecting flights to Dallas and St. Louis into Mt. Home. Maybe this will peak a little curiosity! Harry http://www.crl.com/~ozark/mtnhome/trout.html http://www.ozarkangler.com/index.html Jon Lintvet wrote: Any airports near by? Just curious! Jon Lintvet140 East Spencer Street Ithaca, NY 14580(800) 836-7558(607) 277- 4510http://www.clarityconnect.com/webpages4/jlintvet/ from thramer@presys.com Mon Aug 17 13:45:30 1998 0000 Subject: Re: 8' 6" taper Dr. Steven A. Weiss wrote: Anyone have a suggestion or a taper for a lightweight 8'6"?I have a friend who's favorite medium-to-small stream rod is a 386 SageLLand he would love to have a lightweight ( 3, 4, or 5-wt.)bamboo under 4oz,but wants the length because he likes to flip and dap his dries and keepsalmost all of the leader off the water rather than cast.Am I asking for the impossible? Would the taper result in a limp rod?Steve WeissI made a taper for a semi para 9ft 4wt if you have an interest.A.J.Thramer from SalarFly@aol.com Mon Aug 17 13:54:30 1998 Subject: Re: 2 tips I make two tips for most of my rods. I like the extra insuranceagainst a ruined trip if one should break. True, as others have said, as a rod maker I can always make another should thefirst one break, but that doesn't help if you are 1000 miles fromhome, and you have got a few days left of your fishing trip. Sowhy the heck am I going on a fishing trip with only one rod - many of my trips are backpacking trips where bringing an extra rod is mighty inconvenient. As a matter of fact, I was thinking about making a 3 piece rod with two mid sections as well as two tips. And taking this idea to a logical conclusion, how about a different mid section on a 3 piece to convert a 7' rod into an 8' rod? I think Wayne Cattanach has already made somethinglike this. I like the concept, though. A 3 piece backpacking rod with two tips,and two mid sections, fitting together to make different length rods. Darryl from richard.nantel@videotron.ca Mon Aug 17 14:12:17 1998 (modemcable236.173.mmtl.videotron.net PAA22958 for Subject: RE: 2 tips I love that idea too. Please post the tapers if ever you go ahead withbuilding this perfect travel rod. Richard -----Original Message----- SalarFly@aol.com Subject: Re: 2 tips I make two tips for most of my rods. I like the extra insuranceagainst a ruined trip if one should break. True, as others havesaid, as a rod maker I can always make another should thefirst one break, but that doesn't help if you are 1000 miles fromhome, and you have got a few days left of your fishing trip. Sowhy the heck am I going on a fishing trip with only one rod - many of my trips are backpacking trips where bringing an extrarod is mighty inconvenient. As a matter of fact, I was thinkingabout making a 3 piece rod with two mid sections as well as twotips. And taking this idea to a logical conclusion, how about adifferent mid section on a 3 piece to convert a 7' rod into an 8'rod? I think Wayne Cattanach has already made somethinglike this. I like the concept, though. A 3 piece backpacking rod with two tips,and two mid sections, fitting together to make different length rods. Darryl from fbcwin@fsbnet.com Mon Aug 17 14:17:36 1998 0500 Subject: Re: Southern Rodmaker Gathering Mark, Here's a re-post of my message from a few days ago. I hope you cansomehowmanage to make this "on your way"! Harry BoydFriends,The Southern Rodmakers Gathering is picking up steamevery day. Already 20 people are signed up to attend, and Ihear from someone new almost every day. Sounds to me likewe're going to have a good group and quite a good time. I'mstill a little surpised that our Missouri and Texascontingents are a little slow to respond. - (yes, that'sbait!)I hope more and more of you will make plans to joinus October 1. Below is the original publicity flyer I put out; listsof demonstrations and workshops, and current attendees list--.SOUTHERN BAMBOO RODMAKERS GATHERING A Southern Rodmakers Gathering will be held prior to theSouthern Council Federation of Fly Fishers Conclave atMountain Home, Arkansas, October 2- 4,1988.This will be an informal gathering held at the Riverside Pavillion of Quarry State Park on the Norfork River,Thursday October 1, 1988. Plans are to gather 30+ rodmakerstogether, cast each other's rods, hear and see presentations from any and all volunteers, split some culms, plane somestrips, demonstrate tools, swap equipment, ask questions,brag, laugh, eat, drink, and fish one of the best troutstreams in the world.All Rodmakers and potential rodmakers should make plansto attend. Bring all your rods and what tools you cancarry, and learn from the other Rodmakers present. Ifyou've never built a rod but want to learn more, we wouldlove to have you join us.The Pavillion is equipped with a large BBQ pit available to anyone who wants to cook. Bring your own food and drink, or make a quick run to the small town of Norfork to eat atone of the cafes.Hopes are that this will be the forerunner of moreformal gatherings in days to come. Many talented rodmakerslive and work in the Southern United States and have littleopportunity to attend similar gatherings in other parts ofthe country. By holding this first informal gathering wehope to develop an annual time and place for gathering oneweekend each year.All rodmakers planning to attend are asked to registerwith:Harry Boyd507 Highland StreetWinnsboro, LA 71295e-mail (fbcwin@fsbnet.com)(318)435-4359 - days(318)435-2278 - eveningsOnly those registered will be eligible for door prizes. Harold and Eileen Demarest of Charles H. Demarest, Inc., the premier importers of fine Tonkin Cane for Rodbuilding,will share an informative presentation on their adventuresin securing Bamboo from China. Other demonstrations include: The Morgan Hand Mill by Bill Lamberson, The George Barnes/Tom Smithwick plane iron sharpening method by Harry Boyd,Making your own ferrules and reelseats, and historicallyaccurate restoration techniques by Leo Eck, An assemble your own scraper wokshop by Kurt Loup, A demo on making your own forms, binders, and necessary tools by Tony Spezio, andRichard Tyree will do a demonstration on some of his veryinnovative ideas for rodmaking tools. Any maker interestedin giving a presentation or demonstrating any area of bamboo rodmaking, please contact Harry Boyd at address above. Attendee list as of August 12:Harry Boyd, Kurt Loup, Tony Spezio, Bill Lamberson, DonLaurenza, Rick Crenshaw, Jody Titone, Jerry Ballard, JohnCole, Eric Koehler, Harold and Eileen Demarest, RichardTyree, Dan Cooney, Terry Kirkpatrick, Barry Ericson, RalphQuinn, Leo Eck, Jim Freeman, Scott Wilson (possible) andothersas the list continues to grow! LCDR HALLOWELL wrote: I missed some of the mail over this. When and where is it? I may bytransferring early from Great Lakes and it may just have to be on theway! Mark Hallowell ______________________________ Reply Separator_________________________________Subject: Re: Southern Rodmaker GatheringAuthor: at INTERNETDate: 8/13/98 10:53 AM Jon,Memphis is about 4 hours. Little Rock about 2 hours. The siteslisted below, especially the first, should give you plenty of info onthe area. According to the page, there are deaily connecting flightsto Dallas and St. Louis into Mt. Home. Maybe this will peak a little curiosity! Harry http://www.crl.com/~ozark/mtnhome/trout.html http://www.ozarkangler.com/index.html Jon Lintvet wrote: Any airports near by? Just curious!Jon Lintvet140 East Spencer StreetIthaca, NY 14580(800) 836-7558(607) 277- 4510http://www.clarityconnect.com/webpages4/jlintvet/ from fbcwin@fsbnet.com Mon Aug 17 14:20:00 1998 0500 Subject: Re: Brian Thoman info? Thanks Doug,Guess Brian can't be considered "Southern" any more, andthat's a shame, isn't it? I'll get in touch with him soon,Harry Boyd WDHCJL@aol.com wrote: Brian just e-mailed me a few days back. He has moved to Denver.Try him at: flyfisher@bambooflyrods.comlater,doug hall from fbcwin@fsbnet.com Mon Aug 17 14:36:21 1998 0500 Subject: Re: 8' 6" taper A.J.,I'd love to see this taper as well as hear your thoughts about itsvirtues.I'm thinking on making one of the tapers you've posted over the last fewmonths Thanks,Harry Boyd A.J.Thramer wrote: Dr. Steven A. Weiss wrote: Anyone have a suggestion or a taper for a lightweight 8'6"?I have a friend who's favorite medium-to-small stream rod is a 386Sage LLand he would love to have a lightweight ( 3, 4, or 5-wt.)bamboo under 4oz,but wants the length because he likes to flip and dap his dries andkeepsalmost all of the leader off the water rather than cast.Am I asking for the impossible? Would the taper result in a limp rod?Steve WeissI made a taper for a semi para 9ft 4wt if you have an interest.A.J.Thramer from ragnarig@integrityol.com Mon Aug 17 14:39:27 1998 (SMTPD32-4.04) id A8BAFAC013A; Mon, 17 Aug 1998 12:47:06 PDT Subject: Re: 8' 6" taper I made a taper for a semi para 9ft 4wt if you have an interest.A.J.Thramer Dear A. J. I, for one, would be very interested to see this taper! This is an areatoward which I've devoted a great deal of time and I would reallyappreciateseeing how you've done it. Thanks,Davy from richard.nantel@videotron.ca Mon Aug 17 15:01:16 1998 (modemcable236.173.mmtl.videotron.net QAA04842 for boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0002_01BDC9F6.2DC40200" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0002_01BDC9F6.2DC40200 Does anyone know of a rodmaker who lives near Hamilton, Ontario namedTedKnott. If so, would you have coordinates? Thanks RichardRichard.nantel@videotron.ca ------=_NextPart_000_0002_01BDC9F6.2DC40200 name="Richard Nantel (E-mail).vcf" filename="Richard Nantel (E-mail).vcf" BEGIN:VCARDVERSION:2.1N:Nantel;Richard;;;FN:Richard Nantel (E-mail)ORG:Le groupe MENTOR;TITLE:TEL;WORK;VOICE:(514) 393- 3292TEL;HOME;VOICE:(514) 485-2287TEL;PAGER;VOICE:[1] (514) 111- 1111TEL;WORK;FAX:(514) 393-1483ADR;WORK:;;4374 Old Orchard Avenue;Monteal;Quebec;H4A 3B4;CanadaLABEL;WORK;ENCODING=3DQUOTED- PRINTABLE:4374 Old Orchard =Avenue=3D0D=3D0AMonteal, Quebec H4A 3B4=3D0D=3D0ACanadaADR;HOME:;;4374 Old Orchard Avenue;Monteal;Quebec;H4A 3B4;CanadaLABEL;HOME;ENCODING=3DQUOTED- PRINTABLE:4374 Old Orchard =Avenue=3D0D=3D0AMonteal, Quebec H4A 3B4=3D0D=3D0ACanadaEMAIL;PREF;INTERNET:richard.nantel@videotron.caREV:19980514T133343ZEND:VCARD ------=_NextPart_000_0002_01BDC9F6.2DC40200-- from tomchandler@earthlink.net Mon Aug 17 15:11:21 1998 Subject: Re: 2 tips As a matter of fact, I was thinkingabout making a 3 piece rod with two mid sections as well as twotips. And taking this idea to a logical conclusion, how about adifferent mid section on a 3 piece to convert a 7' rod into an 8'rod? I think Wayne Cattanach has already made somethinglike this. I seem to remember Walton Powell did something similar only with twodifferent butt sections and two identical tips. Not as portable as a 3- pcrod I guess... Tight lines,TC from iank@nelson.planet.org.nz Mon Aug 17 15:48:41 1998 ; Tue, 18 Aug 1998 08:48:32 +1200 Subject: Re: 2 tips Darryl I have in my collection a two piece English rod , Walker Brampton , whichhas two tips , one of weight 6 and the other weight 7 .If anyone is interested I can run a measure over it . The maker is a middlequality production rodmaker and I must confess I have not cast thisparticular rod . I am not in my workshop at the moment but fromrecollectionit is an 8 foot rod . Iank At 02:52 PM 17/08/98 EDT, you wrote: I make two tips for most of my rods. I like the extra insuranceagainst a ruined trip if one should break. True, as others have I like the concept, though. A 3 piece backpacking rod with two tips,and two mid sections, fitting together to make different length rods. deleted Darryl Ian Kearney phone 0064 03 5445556104 Champion Road Fax 0064 03 5440374Richmond New Zealand email inak@ts.co.nz from mcdowellc@lanecc.edu Mon Aug 17 17:06:47 1998 via smap(4.1) Subject: Tiny Flyrods Is there a point at which a fly rod is too short? I've seen 4'4" tapers and rods in the catalogs and single piece 5 footers. Has anyone seen something even shorter in the 3'-3 1/2' range or something in a threepiece variety that totals 4'-5' in length. Has anyone experimented or read of results of making rods in 3'-5' length as far as casting and playing fish goes? Thanks. P.S. I am serious Chrismcdowellc@lanecc.edu from emiller257@dataflo.net Mon Aug 17 18:16:59 1998 wddataflo.dataflo.net (8.8.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id SAA28248 for Subject: Re: 209E Bill Fink wrote: To the List:Am not sure who originated the question so am sending to the list: ForGarrison's 209E taper as per Pg 280, my Histand software says that for50foot casts and with Garrison's standard stress curve a weight 6 DTfloatingline is a near perfect match. I built one and my experience agrees exceptthat I don't often make 50 foot casts. BillBill, now that you've built the209E, can you give us your comments on this rod and any other Garrison tapers that you may be familiar with. It seems as though these dont get much mention on the List. Thanks, Ed M. from jlintvet@clarityconnect.com Mon Aug 17 19:04:20 1998 mail.clarityconnect.com with SMTP (Eudora Internet Mail Server 2.2b4);Mon, 17Aug 1998 20:12:16 -0400 Subject: RE: 2 tips While I am sure I will get slammed on this one here it goes: Nope! I do believe every culm has a distinct character but if you break a tip and don't have anymore usable bamboo from the original culm, I would still like to fish the rod. On another note, how many rods are being restored...building new tips from a modern culm? A bunch! Build as many rods as you can, as best you can every time, and by the time you are ready to build another tip for a rod you built nine months ago, you'll want to build the same rod again because you are nine months better at it. Just my $.02 of course. Hi Jon. You echo my thinking on this exactly. I personally want to try asmany tapers and fish as many rods as possible. Perhaps when I create arod Ilove to bits, it would then make sense to build a second tip. Would itmakethat big a difference if the tip weren't made from the same culm? Jon Lintvet140 East Spencer StreetIthaca, NY 14850(800) 836-7558(607) 277-4510 http://www.clarityconnect.com/webpages4/jlintvet/ from rmoon@ida.net Mon Aug 17 19:33:12 1998 Subject: Re: Southern Rodmaker Gathering HarryA friendly word of warning. Your rodbuilder's affair may get out ofhand. The Bamboo Rod Symposium at the Idaho Falls Conclave was asurprise to me. I had expected about a hundred rodmakers. We had abouttwo hundred at the morning panel forum session, and I would estimate (noway to count) that we had about three hundred during the afternoonsession of demonstrations. Some of the areas that drew a great deal ofinterest (although it is unfair to single out any as all were very good)Tom Morgan's Beveler, John Dufford's nodeless technique. (This is amust see for any one interested in nodeless-- mind bogeling!) MartyKarstetter's hollowbuilding, renovation and restoration techniques, JohnZimny, Richard Sherman's rod building machines. Frank Armbruster andsome new tools, and Mark Metcalf etc. I expect that some of thesepeople may not be able to come, but I am sure that you will have somelike them. I was very pleased at the response. If I can help You any, let me know Ralph from jlintvet@clarityconnect.com Mon Aug 17 19:40:56 1998 mail.clarityconnect.com with SMTP (Eudora Internet Mail Server 2.2b4);Mon, 17Aug 1998 20:48:11 -0400 Subject: Driggs So I entered the Driggs into Hexrod on the web under "driggs" I used the original 6" spacing given to me by Tony Young and then looked at the stress graph and 5" spacing dimensions. Take a look if anybody is interested. When looking at the dimension graph I was a bit surprised by the drop off at around the 30" mark. I went back and checked the numbers but everything was right. Maybe I am missing something or that drop off makes the rod work. Jon Lintvet140 East Spencer StreetIthaca, NY 14850(800) 836- 7558(607) 277-4510 http://www.clarityconnect.com/webpages4/jlintvet/ from MasjC1@aol.com Mon Aug 17 19:52:17 1998 Subject: Re: Tiny Flyrods In July I completed a A. J Thramer 4'4" rod 1 pc for a 4 wt. It is a greatsmall stream rod. I caught 50 browns and cutthroats with it. I was able tocast approximately 30' (guess, not measured) when I needed to, but wasmuchmore comfortable at shorter distances. This rod could be built as a 2 piecebut I chose to build it as a 1 piece, as it is not much longer that most 2pieces when they are broken down. It is a lot of fun to fish with a small reel loaded with a 3 wt line. The 3wtwas a bit more friendly to cast for me, but the rod handled both lineweights.After spending a few hours casting the 4' 4", then picking up my 7', the 7'sure felt like it weighed a ton. A feeling that quickly passed after a fewcasts got me back into the rhythm of the 7' All in all this is a great small rod that I would not hesitate to recommendtosmall rod aficionados. Mark R. Cole from ghinde@inconnect.com Mon Aug 17 20:26:50 1998 0000 Subject: Re: Tiny Flyrods I once built an 18" graphite rod just so I could practice casting whenstuck in a traffic jam. It actually thew a 7wt. line with a nice tightloop. However, when I took it to a local fly shop everyone had to see howmuch line they could cast with it. It cast 35' just great, but at 36' itbecame a 2 piece rod just at the cork. Now when the traffic stops all I cando is wave my arm back and forth.George ----------From: CHRISTOPHER C MCDOWELL Subject: Tiny FlyrodsDate: Monday, August 17, 1998 3:43 PM Is there a point at which a fly rod is too short? I've seen 4'4" tapers and rods in the catalogs and single piece 5 footers. Has anyone seen something even shorter in the 3'-3 1/2' range or something in a threepiece variety that totals 4'-5' in length. Has anyone experimented or read of results of making rods in 3'-5' length as far as casting and playing fish goes? Thanks. P.S. I am serious Chrismcdowellc@lanecc.edu from cbogart@shentel.net Mon Aug 17 21:02:57 1998 head.globalcom.net (8.6.12/8.6.10) with SMTP id WAA22657; Mon, 17 Aug199822:01:42 -0400 Subject: Re: 2 tips Richard I think some people missed where the two tips come from in the past.Thesewere not two identical tips. You would find one dry fly tip and one wet flytip.This wouldaccomplish two types of fishing. In the great Catskill streams spring wasa timeforreally good hatches and then in summer . . . get out the wets and nownymphs. Thethought ofone being an "insurance policy" is really a modern myth - there waspracticalreason customer fishing he desired. I try and educate some of my customers that the tipsdo notand should not be the same. Chris On Mon, 17 Aug 1998 08:33:18 -0400, Richard Nantel wrote: Do most of you bother building a second tip for your rods even if they are andhave only broken one rod in all that time, a high-modulus graphite thatexploded at the butt when I fell on it. Apart from the tradition of two-tips(which I understand to be an important factor for people buying bamboo),itseems the rodmaker has the luxury of building a second tip later if thetipon a favorite rod were to break. Richard from Ted-Mullin@worldnet.att.net Mon Aug 17 21:04:12 1998 (InterMail v03.02.03 118 118 102) with SMTP +0000 Subject: mailing list PLEASE TAKE ME OFF YOUR MAILING LIST. I ENJOY THE MESSAGES BUT ICANNOTHANDLE ALL THE TRAFFIC. THANKSTED MULLINTed Mullin from Nodewrrior@aol.com Mon Aug 17 21:43:05 1998 Subject: Re: Driggs The Driggs river has been one of my most sucessful rods I've made todate- Ilove the thing!My numbers differ however. I ran the numbers as you did, from Tony's(Thanksagain!) converting them to 5" stations.It made a GREAT rod! Now I'm not saying I have the definitive version, but a certain author of apopular rodmaking book who I understand has made some Driggs for thePHY Co(Gentlemen, PLEASE forgive me if I'm wrong here) cast it at Grayrock andseemed satisfied that it was A Driggs or at least close to it.I put my numbers as:dr(no caps or periods-for "Driggs River") on the online hexrod.I initalyy ran the thing so long ago that I'm at a loss why the variation as Ithink we did the same thing. Rob Hoffhines from richard.nantel@videotron.ca Mon Aug 17 21:47:56 1998 (modemcable236.173.mmtl.videotron.net WAA04702 for Subject: RE: 2 tips Chris. This is totally fascinating. I never realized this was the initialpurpose of the second tip. Richard -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: 2 tips Richard I think some people missed where the two tips come from in the past.Thesewere not two identical tips. You would find one dry fly tip and one wet flytip. This wouldaccomplish two types of fishing. In the great Catskill streams spring wasatime forreally good hatches and then in summer . . . get out the wets and nownymphs. The thought ofone being an "insurance policy" is really a modern myth - there waspractical reason customer for thefishing he desired. I try and educate some of my customers that the tipsdonot andshould not be the same. Chris On Mon, 17 Aug 1998 08:33:18 -0400, Richard Nantel wrote: Do most of you bother building a second tip for your rods even if they are andhave only broken one rod in all that time, a high-modulus graphite thatexploded at the butt when I fell on it. Apart from the tradition oftwo-tips(which I understand to be an important factor for people buying bamboo),itseems the rodmaker has the luxury of building a second tip later if thetipon a favorite rod were to break. Richard from tyoung@perth.dialix.com.au Mon Aug 17 22:31:26 1998 Tue, 18 Aug 1998 11:31:17 +0800 (WST)(envelope- from tyoung) Subject: RE: 2 tips On Mon, 17 Aug 1998, Jon Lintvet wrote: While I am sure I will get slammed on this one here it goes: Nope! I do believe every culm has a distinct character but if you break a tip and don't have anymore usable bamboo from the original culm, I would still like to fish the rod. On another note, how many rods are being restored...building new tips from a modern culm? A bunch! Build as many rods as you can, as best you can every time, and by the time you are ready to build another tip for a rod you built nine months ago, you'll want to build the same rod again because you are nine months better at it. Just my $.02 of course. that's the spirit!! Tony /***********************************************************************/Tony Younghttp://www.iinet.net.au/~mainpeak/flyrod.htmlThe Australian connection A computer without windows is like a fish without a bicycle /***********************************************************************/ from tyoung@perth.dialix.com.au Mon Aug 17 22:36:17 1998 Tue, 18 Aug 1998 11:36:07 +0800 (WST)(envelope- from tyoung) Subject: Re: Tiny Flyrods On Mon, 17 Aug 1998, George wrote: I once built an 18" graphite rod just so I could practice casting whenstuck in a traffic jam. It actually thew a 7wt. line with a nice tightloop. However, when I took it to a local fly shop everyone had to see howmuch line they could cast with it. It cast 35' just great, but at 36' itbecame a 2 piece rod just at the cork. Now when the traffic stops all Icando is wave my arm back and forth.George George,let me get this straight. You take a rod to practice during trafic jams?? Are these jams normal or just when the occasional oil taker rolls at an intersection?Sure sounds like there are a LOT of cars out your way, you poor devil. Tonyhttp://www.iinet.net.au/~mainpeak/flyrod.htmlThe Australian connection A computer without windows is like a fish without a bicycle /***********************************************************************/ from saweiss@flash.net Mon Aug 17 23:46:27 1998 Subject: Re: 2 tips -----Original Message----- Subject: RE: 2 tips Hi Steve, I get away on the stream about twice a week from April until October. (Iwish it were much more.) Usually in a season, I'll catch 2-3 20-inch plusbrowns or brookies. (I wish it were much more.) Most trout are in the 10to16 inch range. Perhaps my north-eastern freestone streams are a bitmoregentle to wade than those fabulous western waters many of you get tofish.Also, the bamboo rods I've been using for trout are both 5-weights. Notexactly the lightest tackle in these days of 2-3 weights. Also, I'm stillusing a graphite 7-weight for bass, pike, muskie, etc. I look forward to the day when I break a rod on a good fish, Steve. As JohnGierach says, every flyfisher should have that happen at least once in hisor her life. Aren't bamboo rods less likely to break on a good fish thanultra-stiff graphite? Richard I don't think that a ding on a bamboo will result in a potential fracturesite like it can on a graphite. The one that I broke on the big fishfractured cleanly without splintering.Yes, we do have some rough places here in the West. Lots of steep canyons,boulders, loose rock. I get into trouble when I try to fish and walk at thesame time. When I fell and broke the Battenkill, I thought that I hadbroken my leg. Luckily it was only the rod that broke. I never had thoughtthat I could be lucky in breaking a rod!Steve Weiss from saweiss@flash.net Mon Aug 17 23:48:51 1998 Subject: Re: 8' 6" taper -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: 8' 6" taper Dr. Steven A. Weiss wrote: Anyone have a suggestion or a taper for a lightweight 8'6"?I have a friend who's favorite medium-to-small stream rod is a 386SageLLand he would love to have a lightweight ( 3, 4, or 5-wt.)bamboo under 4oz,but wants the length because he likes to flip and dap his dries and keepsalmost all of the leader off the water rather than cast.Am I asking for the impossible? Would the taper result in a limp rod?Steve WeissI made a taper for a semi para 9ft 4wt if you have an interest.A.J.Thramer A.J.,Yes, I am interested. What was the action like and what would you say therod would weigh?Steve Weiss from ghinde@inconnect.com Tue Aug 18 00:10:16 1998 0000 Subject: Re: Tiny Flyrods Tony;I live in Salt Lake City, which has the misfortune of hosting the 2002Winter Olympics. The day after the anouncment naming Salt Lake City astheOlympic Host ALL roads in the city, and most roads in the state, were tornup for reconstruction. It literally became one huge traffic jam. Ourstate flower is now the orange barrier cone. These things blossomedeverywhere! There is a whole lot of you can't get there from here, nomatter where you want to go. If the rod had not died a sudden death thinkof all the VW's I could have caught! ---------From: Tony Young Cc: rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Re: Tiny FlyrodsDate: Monday, August 17, 1998 9:36 PM On Mon, 17 Aug 1998, George wrote: I once built an 18" graphite rod just so I could practice casting whenstuck in a traffic jam. It actually thew a 7wt. line with a nice tightloop. However, when I took it to a local fly shop everyone had to seehowmuch line they could cast with it. It cast 35' just great, but at 36'itbecame a 2 piece rod just at the cork. Now when the traffic stops all Icando is wave my arm back and forth.George George,let me get this straight. You take a rod to practice during trafic jams?? Are these jams normal or just when the occasional oil taker rolls at an intersection?Sure sounds like there are a LOT of cars out your way, you poor devil. Tony /***********************************************************************/Tony Younghttp://www.iinet.net.au/~mainpeak/flyrod.htmlThe Australian connection A computer without windows is like a fish without a bicycle /***********************************************************************/ from iank@nelson.planet.org.nz Tue Aug 18 02:49:23 1998 ; Tue, 18 Aug 1998 19:48:41 +1200 Subject: Re: Tiny Flyrods George , What is traffic jam ? We do not have that flavour here in New Zealand :)) Iank At 07:23 PM 17/08/98 -0600, you wrote:I once built an 18" graphite rod just so I could practice casting whenstuck in a traffic jam. It actually thew a 7wt. line with a nice tightloop. However, when I took it to a local fly shop everyone had to see howmuch line they could cast with it. It cast 35' just great, but at 36' itbecame a 2 piece rod just at the cork. Now when the traffic stops all Icando is wave my arm back and forth.George ----------From: CHRISTOPHER C MCDOWELL Subject: Tiny FlyrodsDate: Monday, August 17, 1998 3:43 PM Is there a point at which a fly rod is too short? deleted P.S. I am serious Chrismcdowellc@lanecc.edu Ian Kearney phone 0064 03 5445556104 Champion Road Fax 0064 03 5440374Richmond New Zealand email inak@ts.co.nz from jcooper@interalpha.co.uk Tue Aug 18 07:11:48 1998 post(8.8.7/8.6.11) with SMTP id NAA12434 for ;Tue, 18 Aug1998 13:12:47 +0100 Subject: Re: 2 tips At 08:48 18/08/98 +1200, you wrote:Darryl I have in my collection a two piece English rod , Walker Brampton , whichhas two tips , one of weight 6 and the other weight 7 .If anyone is interested I can run a measure over it . The maker is a middlequality production rodmaker and I must confess I have not cast thisparticular rod . I am not in my workshop at the moment but fromrecollectionit is an 8 foot rod . Iank Ian This maker is WALKER BAMPTON (not Brampton). Their rods are very nearlytopline. Most of the workers were trained at Hardy's, in the same town. Don'tunder-rate what is probably a very fine rod. If it isn't a Rolls Royce, it'scertainly a top of the line Jaguar. I have three Walker Bamptons, and they AIN'T for sale. John Cooper from dickfuhrman@rheemote.com Tue Aug 18 07:44:07 1998 (may beforged)) Subject: Re: 2 tips Chris,Being new to this Art/Craft, please explain more. How do the two tipsdiffer to aid dry fly and nymphing? I have seen plenty of two tipbamboo rods but did not notice a difference between tips. I think Isuspected something like this, but have been told it was insurance, asDarryl mentioned, to keep from spoiling a trip. I want to know more!TIADick Fuhrman from tyoung@perth.dialix.com.au Tue Aug 18 08:15:33 1998 Tue, 18 Aug 1998 21:15:25 +0800 (WST)(envelope- from tyoung) Subject: Re: Tiny Flyrods On Mon, 17 Aug 1998, George wrote: Tony;I live in Salt Lake City, which has the misfortune of hosting the 2002Winter Olympics. The day after the anouncment naming Salt Lake City astheOlympic Host ALL roads in the city, and most roads in the state, weretornup for reconstruction. It literally became one huge traffic jam. Ourstate flower is now the orange barrier cone. These things blossomedeverywhere! There is a whole lot of you can't get there from here, nomatter where you want to go. If the rod had not died a sudden deaththinkof all the VW's I could have caught! --------- Orange barrier cone :-)) I like that. You may have heard the Olympics or Oilypigs as my little girl used to call it is being held in Sydney in 2000. Things will likely be a bit like that there soon but happily and not only because of the oilypigs I'm on the exact opposite side of the continent. Dave L, are you still making Snake Makers? Tony /***********************************************************************/Tony Younghttp://www.iinet.net.au/~mainpeak/flyrod.htmlThe Australian connection A computer without windows is like a fish without a bicycle /***********************************************************************/ from lcdr.hallowell@smtp.cnet.navy.mil Tue Aug 18 08:47:06 1998 (1.38.193.4/16.2) id AA12477; Tue, 18 Aug 1998 08:48:24 -0500 R8.00.01) Subject: Re[2]: Southern Rodmaker Gathering Thanks Harry, Will let you know. I'm moving to TX (Corpus area). are great on a fly. Let me know off line if you are going to be in the area at 512-643-3870 or . For the Grayrock brethren I will miss coming up and the great trout fishing. Catch one Mark Hallowell ______________________________ Reply Separator_________________________________Subject: Re: Southern Rodmaker Gathering Author: at INTERNET Mark, Here's a re-post of my message from a few days ago. I hope you cansomehowmanage to make this "on your way"! Harry BoydFriends,The Southern Rodmakers Gathering is picking up steamevery day. Already 20 people are signed up to attend, and I hear from someone new almost every day. Sounds to me like we're going to have a good group and quite a good time. I'm still a little surpised that our Missouri and Texas contingents are a little slow to respond. - (yes, that's bait!)I hope more and more of you will make plans to joinus October 1. Below is the original publicity flyer I put out; listsof demonstrations and workshops, and current attendees list --.SOUTHERN BAMBOO RODMAKERS GATHERING A Southern Rodmakers Gathering will be held prior to theSouthern Council Federation of Fly Fishers Conclave at Mountain Home, Arkansas, October 2- 4,1988.This will be an informal gathering held at the Riverside Pavillion of Quarry State Park on the Norfork River, Thursday October 1, 1988. Plans are to gather 30+ rodmakers together, cast each other's rods, hear and see presentations from any and all volunteers, split some culms, plane some strips, demonstrate tools, swap equipment, ask questions, brag, laugh, eat, drink, and fish one of the best trout streams in the world.All Rodmakers and potential rodmakers should make plansto attend. Bring all your rods and what tools you can carry, and learn from the other Rodmakers present. If you've never built a rod but want to learn more, we would love to have you join us.The Pavillion is equipped with a large BBQ pit available to anyone who wants to cook. Bring your own food and drink, or make a quick run to the small town of Norfork to eat at one of the cafes.Hopes are that this will be the forerunner of moreformal gatherings in days to come. Many talented rodmakers live and work in the Southern United States and have little opportunity to attend similar gatherings in other parts of the country. By holding this first informal gathering we hope to develop an annual time and place for gathering one weekend each year.All rodmakers planning to attend are asked to registerwith:Harry Boyd507 Highland StreetWinnsboro, LA 71295e-mail (fbcwin@fsbnet.com)(318)435-4359 - days(318)435-2278 - eveningsOnly those registered will be eligible for door prizes. Harold and Eileen Demarest of Charles H. Demarest, Inc., the premier importers of fine Tonkin Cane for Rodbuilding, will share an informative presentation on their adventures in securing Bamboo from China. Other demonstrations include: The Morgan Hand Mill by Bill Lamberson, The George Barnes/ Tom Smithwick plane iron sharpening method by Harry Boyd, Making your own ferrules and reelseats, and historically accurate restoration techniques by Leo Eck, An assemble your own scraper wokshop by Kurt Loup, A demo on making your own forms, binders, and necessary tools by Tony Spezio, and Richard Tyree will do a demonstration on some of his very innovative ideas for rodmaking tools. Any maker interested in giving a presentation or demonstrating any area of bamboo rodmaking, please contact Harry Boyd at address above. Attendee list as of August 12:Harry Boyd, Kurt Loup, Tony Spezio, Bill Lamberson, Don Laurenza, Rick Crenshaw, Jody Titone, Jerry Ballard, John Cole, Eric Koehler, Harold and Eileen Demarest, Richard Tyree, Dan Cooney, Terry Kirkpatrick, Barry Ericson, Ralph Quinn, Leo Eck, Jim Freeman, Scott Wilson (possible) and othersas the list continues to grow! LCDR HALLOWELL wrote: I missed some of the mail over this. When and where is it? I may by transferring early from Great Lakes and it may just have to be on the way! Mark Hallowell ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________Subject: Re: Southern Rodmaker GatheringAuthor: at INTERNET Date: 8/13/98 10:53 AM Jon,Memphis is about 4 hours. Little Rock about 2 hours. The sites listed below, especially the first, should give you plenty of info on the area. According to the page, there are deaily connecting flights to Dallas and St. Louis into Mt. Home. Maybe this will peak a little curiosity! Harry http://www.crl.com/~ozark/mtnhome/trout.html http://www.ozarkangler.com/index.html Jon Lintvet wrote: Any airports near by? Just curious! Jon Lintvet140 East Spencer Street Ithaca, NY 14580(800) 836-7558 (607) 277- 4510http://www.clarityconnect.com/webpages4/jlintvet/ from santos@esinet.net Tue Aug 18 08:55:17 1998 09:55:13 Subject: Re: Tiny Flyrods Chris, I mostly build small rods and have built perhaps a dozen 4'4'' rodscalled banty rods and made popular by Jim Payne back in the 1950s. I'vebuilt both one piece and two tip rods. There serious rods though I would recommend that only good castersuse them. I built one 4'4'' one piece rod that I took up to a Minnesota lakeand tried to break on big bass and pike. I still have the rod. It's toughand throws a 3-4 weight line.I've never heard of any rod shorter than a 4'4''. I think under thatlenght and you might was well just use your arm. Carlos SantosIs there a point at which a fly rod is too short? I've seen 4'4" tapers and rods in the catalogs and single piece 5 footers. Has anyone seen something even shorter in the 3'-3 1/2' range or something in a threepiece variety that totals 4'-5' in length. Has anyone experimented or read of results of making rods in 3'-5' length as far as casting and playing fish goes? Thanks. P.S. I am serious Chrismcdowellc@lanecc.edu from jlintvet@clarityconnect.com Tue Aug 18 09:47:38 1998 mail.clarityconnect.com with SMTP (Eudora Internet Mail Server 2.2b4);Tue, 18Aug 1998 10:55:33 -0400 Subject: Hexrod I was playing around and had a question I do not remember being discussed. What length of line do people use with hexrod for a given line weight. For example 7' 4wt, 40ft? Just curious. Another one...if the dimension at the ferrule station is 13.72/64 what size ferrule do you all use? .72/64 seems like a lot of material to remove.Jon Lintvet140 East Spencer StreetIthaca, NY 14850(800) 836-7558(607) 277- 4510 http://www.clarityconnect.com/webpages4/jlintvet/ from jlintvet@clarityconnect.com Tue Aug 18 09:47:39 1998 mail.clarityconnect.com with SMTP (Eudora Internet Mail Server 2.2b4);Tue, 18Aug 1998 10:55:35 -0400 Subject: Re: Driggs I went back and looked and I had entered the rod as 7'6" When looking at your numbers I also noticed the 6" stations which match up with a 5" station did not have the same dimension. Who knows? I am sure you have a great rod in front of you. I ran the numbers through again and seems to have worked out. I also made a 7',7'6", and 8' modification to it. I have 3 bazillion rod tubes, none of which are 7'2" Take care, Jon Lintvet140 East Spencer StreetIthaca, NY 14850(800) 836-7558(607) 277-4510 http://www.clarityconnect.com/webpages4/jlintvet/ from dmanders@ccinet.ab.ca Tue Aug 18 10:01:58 1998 Subject: Re: Tiny Flyrods At 19:23 17/08/98 -0600, you wrote:I once built an 18" graphite rod just so I could practice casting whenstuck in a traffic jam. It actually thew a 7wt. line with a nice tightloop. However, when I took it to a local fly shop everyone had to see howmuch line they could cast with it. It cast 35' just great, but at 36' itbecame a 2 piece rod just at the cork. Now when the traffic stops all Icando is wave my arm back and forth.George George, I've tried the tiny stuff too. Built 2 rods that were 12" long - 6strippers - they were to match 2 replica Hardy reels that a friendmachined that seemed appropriate with the reel size. There was no room forbacking.Suspect about a 5 would've worked. Don from eestlow@srminc.com Tue Aug 18 10:10:58 1998 86256664.0053FD38 ; Tue, 18 Aug 1998 10:17:23 -0500 Subject: Re: Tiny Flyrods Don, I'd like to see a photo if you have one to post! This kind of stufffascinates me. -Ed Estlow Don Andersen on 08/18/98 03:35:20 AM Please respond to rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Subject: Re: Tiny Flyrods At 19:23 17/08/98 -0600, you wrote:I once built an 18" graphite rod just so I could practice casting whenstuck in a traffic jam. It actually thew a 7wt. line with a nice tightloop. However, when I took it to a local fly shop everyone had to see howmuch line they could cast with it. It cast 35' just great, but at 36' itbecame a 2 piece rod just at the cork. Now when the traffic stops all Icando is wave my arm back and forth.George George, I've tried the tiny stuff too. Built 2 rods that were 12" long - 6strippers - they were to match 2 replica Hardy reels that a friendmachined that seemed appropriate with the reel size. There was no room forbacking.Suspect about a 5 would've worked. Don from sjstill@iquest.net Tue Aug 18 10:15:44 1998 0000 (209.43.54.145) Subject: Did I miss it? Hi All, I just 'finished' reading Wayne's book [fantastic]. Was really interestedin his dip tube set up. But did I miss what he uses to hold the rod sectionitself? He mentions the kite string, pulley and motor set up. Nada on the'terminal tackle'! I have a couple ideas of my own [scary], but wonder what the rest of youfellows use when you dip. I sorta roughed out a dip tube idea that maywork Regards, SteveSteve and Julie StillabowerIndianapolis, INsjstill@iquest.net from sjstill@iquest.net Tue Aug 18 10:19:21 1998 0000 (209.43.54.145) Subject: Traffic (was tiny rods) When I drove a tractor trailer, I was 'lucky' enough to tak a load intoWashington, DC :-( Traffic on the Beltway was mostly at a standstill. from my vantage point, I saw quite a bit of stuff - reading, dressing,makeup,etc, but no flycasting! Great idea though! SteveSteve and Julie StillabowerIndianapolis, INsjstill@iquest.net from stetzer@csd.uwm.edu Tue Aug 18 10:38:20 1998 batch3.csd.uwm.edu (8.8.4/8.6.8) with ESMTP id KAA17421 for (8.8.4/8.6.8)with SMTP id KAA24783 for ; Tue, 18 Aug1998 10:38:06 Subject: Re: Tiny Flyrods I've got a vague plan to build a 3 ft rod to keep at the office,like the golf nuts keep a putter. Maybe with a small, old brass reel.I could cast out in the hallway when its slow.......................................................................Frank Stetzer "...a cheerful comrade is betterstetzer@uwm.edu than a waterproof coat and a Employed by, but not speaking for foot- warmer." Henry Van Dyke,Univ of Wisconsin-Milwaukee, USA "Fisherman's Luck", 1899. from mcdowellc@lanecc.edu Tue Aug 18 10:46:14 1998 via smap(4.1) Subject: RE: Did I miss it? Steve, If I'm dipping a mid section I plug the female ferrule with tape wrapped to the appropriate size around a dowell, used paintbrush stem etc. thenuse addtional tape to make a flat attachment to the extruding plug. I poke a hole with a nail in the flat part of the tape. To the end of the line I tie a paper clip, bent to form some kind of hook. The hook goes through the hole in the tape. The line feeds through a hook in the ceiling and down to the weighted reel I use to wind the section out of the tube. Of course everything is tied up and ready to go before I submerge the section into the tube. I make a tape attachment to the tiptop. section etc. etc. So in answer to your question, I use masking tape and a paper clip. This may not be sufficient for a book grade definition of terminal hardware,but it works. Chrismcdowellc@lanecc.edu from johanyga@online.no Tue Aug 18 10:56:52 1998 (METDST) Subject: PHY tapers I have built four PHY copies; The Driggs, The Martha Marie, The TexasGeneral, and The Para 17. I like them all, and I wonder if anyone is ableto supply me with the tapers of The Encampment (Boat) Rod and The Para16? Johan Nygaardsvold from andrew_harsanyi@ibi.com Tue Aug 18 11:14:14 1998 0400 Subject: 2 Tips Here is a slightly different but related question. Can someone clarify the significance of having 2 "mirror" tips? What exactly are they and why would they be advantageous? Andy from fbcwin@fsbnet.com Tue Aug 18 11:21:33 1998 0500 Subject: Re: Did I miss it? Steve, with,I would strongly suggest that your setup have some sort of rigging thatcannot possibly slip off and leave you trying to fish asection to happen. swivel a piece of string taped securely to a ferrule on other sections. Steve Stillabower wrote:Hi All, interested rod section Nada on the'terminal tackle'! I have a couple ideas of my own [scary], but wonder what the rest ofyou that may work SteveSteve and Julie StillabowerIndianapolis, INsjstill@iquest.net< from Anachemrpo@aol.com Tue Aug 18 11:23:17 1998 Subject: Dip tube rod holders,was Did I miss it... I think that I got this from "The Book". What I use is spring loaded clothes pins with a groove filed in the "lip" ofthe pin to accomodate the rod section. Then I put a loop of string throughthespring of the clothes pin and can then use a safety pin, paper clip of evendirectly tie the draw string to that loop. Russell Lavigne from rclarke@eou.edu Tue Aug 18 11:25:55 1998 Subject: Re: Did I miss it? Wasn't Sir D talking a while back about using a particle accelerator for amotor on one of these things? :) Robert Clarkerclarke@eou.edu ----------From: CHRISTOPHER C MCDOWELL Subject: RE: Did I miss it?Date: Tuesday, August 18, 1998 8:40 AM Steve, If I'm dipping a mid section I plug the female ferrule with tape wrapped to the appropriate size around a dowell, used paintbrush stem etc. thenuse addtional tape to make a flat attachment to the extruding plug. I poke a hole with a nail in the flat part of the tape. To the end of the line I tie a paper clip, bent to form some kind of hook. The hook goes through the hole in the tape. The line feeds through a hook in the ceiling and down to the weighted reel I use to wind the section out of the tube. Of course everything is tied up and ready to go before I submerge thesection into the tube. or I make a tape attachment to the tiptop. section etc. etc. So in answer to your question, I use masking tape and a paper clip. This may not be sufficient for a book grade definition of terminal hardware,but it works. Chrismcdowellc@lanecc.edu from lcdr.hallowell@smtp.cnet.navy.mil Tue Aug 18 12:04:02 1998 (1.38.193.4/16.2) id AA22172; Tue, 18 Aug 1998 12:05:23 -0500 R8.00.01) Subject: Re[2]: Tiny Flyrods Does anyone have the taper on this 4'4" Rod? Mark Hallowell ______________________________ Reply Separator_________________________________Subject: Re: Tiny Flyrods Author: at INTERNET Chris, I mostly build small rods and have built perhaps a dozen 4'4'' rodscalled banty rods and made popular by Jim Payne back in the 1950s. I've built both one piece and two tip rods. There serious rods though I would recommend that only good castersuse them. I built one 4'4'' one piece rod that I took up to a Minnesota lake and tried to break on big bass and pike. I still have the rod. It's tough and throws a 3-4 weight line.I've never heard of any rod shorter than a 4'4''. I think under thatlenght and you might was well just use your arm. Carlos SantosIs there a point at which a fly rod is too short? I've seen 4'4" tapers and rods in the catalogs and single piece 5 footers. Has anyone seen something even shorter in the 3'-3 1/2' range or something in a threepiece variety that totals 4'-5' in length. Has anyone experimented or read of results of making rods in 3'-5' length as far as casting and playing fish goes? Thanks. P.S. I am serious Chrismcdowellc@lanecc.edu from eestlow@srminc.com Tue Aug 18 12:10:35 1998 86256664.005EEB3F ; Tue, 18 Aug 1998 12:16:46 -0500 Subject: Re: Tiny Flyrods - Re: 4'4" 4wt 453 This is the AJ Thramer taper which he posted in April. He also postedguidespacing I believe. I'll repost that as well.-Ed "A.J.Thramer" on 04/02/98 11:49:48 AM Please respond to rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Subject: 4'4" 4wt 453 Someone asked for a 4'4" 2pc 4wt 0- .0685- .08410- .09615- .11420- .12825- .14430- .15835- .17640- .19245- .220to52- .220 It uses an 11/64 ferrule based on a D taper 1 7/16ozFeel free to use a 3wt alsoA.J.Thramer from eestlow@srminc.com Tue Aug 18 12:10:36 1998 86256664.005EF346 ; Tue, 18 Aug 1998 12:17:06 -0500 Subject: Re: 4'4" Guide Spacing "A.J.Thramer" on 05/06/98 12:05:08 PM Please respond to rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Subject: 4'4" Guide Spacing A bit of housecleaning today.... The guide spacing for the 4'4" taper from a couple of months ago 4.00" 1/08.25" 1/013.50" #120.00" #228.00" Strip Guide A.J.Thramer from eestlow@srminc.com Tue Aug 18 12:17:07 1998 86256664.005F8A72 ; Tue, 18 Aug 1998 12:23:33 -0500 Subject: Tiny Flyrods - Re: Payne (?) Banty Boundary="0__=OqLkjQDTAn7JnTNwiJ9eahOQhrFuLAbQTWjDqjFXzuAPJuZBrlqugRiH" --0__=OqLkjQDTAn7JnTNwiJ9eahOQhrFuLAbQTWjDqjFXzuAPJuZBrlqugRiH Here's a potential Payne Banty. There was some debate as to whetherthesenumbers represented form settings or diameters. Tough to believe they'rediameters, but I plead ignorance.-Ed "Larry Blan" on 07/16/98 06:37:57 PM Subject: Payne (?) Banty ok....... we'll try this again, this time I'll even attach the file. Sorryabout that! Larry Blan TSmithwick@aol.com Subject: Payne Banty ? In response to recent requests, I checked back into The Planing Form. Ithought I had seen this taper listed. In fact I found the following,submitted Paynetaper, however. It is referred to as the 4' 4" Banty taper only. The factthatthe taper is only given to the 45" mark leads one to believe the taper came from an existing rod, so perhaps this is the Payne taper, but I don't knowforsure. 0 - .0385 - .04610 - .05915 - .06220 - .06925 - .077 Butt 26 - .07930 - .08435 - .08940 - .09445 - .101 -----Original Message----- Sent: Thursday, July 16, 1998 9:23 AM Subject: RE: Flea Taper Larry, Thansk for the response, but no taper came through. Did I misssomething? -Ed --0__=OqLkjQDTAn7JnTNwiJ9eahOQhrFuLAbQTWjDqjFXzuAPJuZBrlqugRiH name="Payne Banty .txt" RnJvbTogb3duZXItcm9kbWFrZXJzQHd1Z2F0ZS53dXN0bC5lZHUgb24gYmVoYWxmIG9mIFRTbWl0aHdpY2tAYW9sLmNvbQ0KU2VudDogV2VkbmVzZGF5LCBKdWx5IDA4LCAxOTk4IDU6MDcgUE0NClRvOiByb2RtYWtlcnNAd3VnYXRlLnd1c3RsLmVkdQ0KU3ViamVjdDogUGF5bmUgQmFudHkgPw0KDQpJbiByZXNwb25zZSB0byByZWNlbnQgcmVxdWVzdHMsIEkgY2hlY2tlZCBiYWNrIGludG8gVGhlIFBsYW5pbmcgRm9ybS4gSQ0KdGhvdWdodCBJIGhhZCBzZWVuIHRoaXMgdGFwZXIgbGlzdGVkLiBJbiBmYWN0IEkgZm91bmQgdGhlIGZvbGxvd2luZywgc3VibWl0dGVkDQpieSBSLiBIb2Vja3JzdHJhIEluIGlzc3VlICMgMTguIEhlIGRvZXMgbm90IHNwZWNpZmljYWxseSBzYXkgaXQgaXMgdGhlIFBheW5lDQp0YXBlciwgaG93ZXZlci4gSXQgaXMgcmVmZXJyZWQgdG8gYXMgdGhlIDQnIDQiIEJhbnR5IHRhcGVyIG9ubHkuIFRoZSBmYWN0IHRoYXQNCnRoZSB0YXBlciBpcyBvbmx5IGdpdmVuIHRvIHRoZSA0NSIgbWFyayBsZWFkcyBvbmUgdG8gYmVsaWV2ZSB0aGUgdGFwZXIgY2FtZQ0KZnJvbSBhbiBleGlzdGluZyByb2QsIHNvIHBlcmhhcHMgdGhpcyBpcyB0aGUgUGF5bmUgdGFwZXIsIGJ1dCBJIGRvbid0IGtub3cgZm9yDQpzdXJlLg0KMC0gLjEzOA0KNS0gLjA0Ng0KMTAtLjA1OQ0KMTUtLjA2Mg0KMjAtLjA2OQ0KMjUtIC4wNzcNCg0KQnV0dA0KMjYtLjA3OQ0KMzAtLjA4NA0KMzUtLjA4OQ0KNDAtLjA5NA0KNDUtLjEwMQ0KDQo= --0__=OqLkjQDTAn7JnTNwiJ9eahOQhrFuLAbQTWjDqjFXzuAPJuZBrlqugRiH-- from anglport@con2.com Tue Aug 18 12:27:58 1998 Subject: Re: 4'4" Guide Spacing Ed,I've got to start reading ALL my mail before I re: to stuff. I've put allthe tapers that have been posted in a Word file (Attn: Johan!!!!No para 16'sin there!!!)and when you said you thought AJ posted the spacings, I wentimmediately racing off to help out by adding them to the info. Alas, when Ireturned to post them, I read your second message. Ah, well, I had nothingto do for 5 mins anyway!Be talking to ya,Art 28.00" Strip Guide A.J.Thramer from flyfisher@cmix.com Tue Aug 18 12:52:27 1998 Subject: Re: Tiny Flyrods RO>George , RO>What is traffic jam ? We do not have that flavour here in NewZealand :) RO>Iank Ian, LA's traffic jam smells somewhat like good old toe jam. We've got lot's,so come'on over and I'll get you some. Don Burns from rclarke@eou.edu Tue Aug 18 13:30:33 1998 Subject: Re: Hexrod Jon, I use 35 ft in Hexrod-not sure if that is correct. I think you round up on ferrules on anything greater than .50 Robert Clarkerclarke@eou.edu ----------From: Jon Lintvet Subject: HexrodDate: Tuesday, August 18, 1998 3:47 AM I was playing around and had a question I do not remember being discussed. What length of line do people use with hexrod for a given line weight. For example 7' 4wt, 40ft? Just curious. Another one...if the dimension at the ferrule station is 13.72/64 what size ferrule do you all use? .72/64 seems like a lot of material to remove.Jon Lintvet140 East Spencer StreetIthaca, NY 14850(800) 836-7558(607) 277- 4510 http://www.clarityconnect.com/webpages4/jlintvet/ from gwr@seanet.com Tue Aug 18 13:38:30 1998 mx.seanet.com(8.8.8/Seanet-8.7.3) with SMTP id LAA13593 for; Tue, Subject: silk check Hi Chris, I was just doing my books and noticed that you hadn't cashed my check received it, then please let me know and I'll cut you another. Today (8/18)is my last morning in front of the computer for nearly two weeks as I'moffto PA for an extended and varied fishing trip, however, if you do need asecond check I'll get you one as soon as I return. Thanks again for the silk. I'm working on a few blanks that will bewrapped with it. Russ Goodinggwr@seanet.com from SalarFly@aol.com Tue Aug 18 13:50:37 1998 Subject: Re: Did I miss it? In a message dated 8/18/98 9:28:54 AM Pacific Daylight Time,rclarke@eou.eduwrites: Wasn't Sir D talking a while back about using a particle accelerator for amotor on one of these things? :) No, that was a linear accelerator! Everyone knows you usea particle accelerator for vacuum plasma coating pure diamondonto your snake guides! Darryl from fbcwin@fsbnet.com Tue Aug 18 14:02:33 1998 0500 Subject: Re: Tiny Flyrods - Re: Payne (?) Banty Wow, if these are tapers, can you imagine planing tips down to .019"?? Thebutts of most of my leaders are ...019." I'm working on a couple of lightrods, and the .027" tip measurements seems awfully fragile to me. I'msure itcould be done, but I thought it might be a good idea to run this through oneofthe computer generated stress programs to see what you would get.I'm pretty ignorant when it comes to stresses. When I played withthesedimensions stretched to a 5.0' (so it would work in Frank's Hexrod) 1piece, 2weight casting 25 feet of line, the numbers got way out of hand quickly. Isaved them as "bant_tri". 1 0.038 1103375 0.046 32176910 0.059 31882715 0.062 43220120 0.069 43890725 0.077 41496930 0.079 48528535 0.084 49586240 0.094 42592845 0.101 40728750 0.107 401755My conclusion is that these must be form settings, not dimensions.Somebody jump in here and show me the error of my ways.Harry Boyd Ed Estlow wrote: Here's a potential Payne Banty. There was some debate as to whetherthesenumbers represented form settings or diameters. Tough to believethey'rediameters, but I plead ignorance.-Ed "Larry Blan" on 07/16/98 06:37:57 PM cc:Subject: Payne (?) Banty ok....... we'll try this again, this time I'll even attach the file. Sorryabout that! Larry Blan From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu on behalf ofTSmithwick@aol.comSent: Wednesday, July 08, 1998 5:07 PM Subject: Payne Banty ? In response to recent requests, I checked back into The Planing Form. Ithought I had seen this taper listed. In fact I found the following,submitted Paynetaper, however. It is referred to as the 4' 4" Banty taper only. The factthatthe taper is only given to the 45" mark leads one to believe the tapercame from an existing rod, so perhaps this is the Payne taper, but I don't knowforsure. 0 - .0385 - .04610 - .05915 - .06220 - .06925 - .077 Butt 26 - .07930 - .08435 - .08940 - .09445 - .101 -----Original Message----- Sent: Thursday, July 16, 1998 9:23 AM Subject: RE: Flea Taper Larry, Thansk for the response, but no taper came through. Did I misssomething? -Ed ------------------------------------------------------------ Name: Payne Banty .txtPayne Banty .txt Type: Plain Text (text/plain)Encoding: base64Description: Text - character set unknown from gwr@seanet.com Tue Aug 18 14:10:27 1998 mx.seanet.com(8.8.8/Seanet-8.7.3) with SMTP id MAA16220 for; Tue, Subject: Re: silk check - sorry Sorry guys for sending that to the list. Same for yesterday's faux pax.I've got private emails on my "to" column but some seem to send off to thelist. I'll try and get this problem sorted out ASAP. from CALucker@aol.com Tue Aug 18 14:34:14 1998 Subject: Re: silk check from CALucker@aol.com Tue Aug 18 14:42:27 1998 Subject: Re: silk check I have received a couple of E-mails from folks who sent me checks for thecustom order of silk I did in June and July. I am sorry if I am messing up your check ledgers, but I have not cashed anyofthe checks yet. I was giving you guys some time to determien if you arereally happy with the silk. As you know, I don't want any money from anyofyou unless you are happy with the thread. And, it is human nature to beexcited about the new toy you receive in the mail, but often theexcitementturns to disappointment after you become more familiar with the new toy. Mostof you sent the check immediately upon receiving the silk. I appreciatethat,but I want all of you to have a fair "get acquainted period" with the silk --especially since you have 8,800 yards of the stuff! As always, if you don't like the silk thread, you don't pay me anything andyou keep the thread anyway. Chris Lucker from TSmithwick@aol.com Tue Aug 18 15:15:38 1998 Subject: Re: Tiny Flyrods In a message dated 8/17/98 10:14:17 PM, you wrote: Chris - I think the practical limit is about 5 feet. I have cast shorterrods, but it seems to me that the casting effort increases to the pointthatthe effect of the lower weight is negated. It seems to me that the wholepointof what we do is to provide yourself or someone else with a fishing toolthatwill have an effortless feel in use. If you get too short, or too long, youlose that quality. The length of line you expect to fish has a lot to do withthis, also. The 5 1/2 foot rod I have on the rodmakers web site, forexample,is great out to the 30-40 foot range. It will cast 50-60 feet, but takes anextra false cast or two to do it. It doesn't take long for the extra effort tostart adding up. from rmoon@ida.net Tue Aug 18 16:21:45 1998 Subject: Re: Did I miss it? HarryI just tried your dipped handle idea a few weeks ago. Only my problemwas that the screw eye I used as a fixed pulley came out of the wall.FUN! Also in regard to the tiny rods. I made a perfectly workable flamedthreefooter that with a hand made gold colored reel and a #2 line was apretty good casting tool. However, mine ended up as part of a fly platethat was donated to the Henry's Fork Foundation. for fund raising. Thewhole thing raised in excess of $1000 Ralph from cbogart@shentel.net Tue Aug 18 18:28:46 1998 Aug 199819:28:16 -0400 Subject: Re: 2 tips Dick I think the best example for you to look at is on the Rodmakershompageand go to the Paul Young tapers and pull up the Para-15. It has both thewet anddry tips tapers posted. Look at the tapers and you will see the difference. The dry is a fastlightertip and the dry is a slower heavier tip. Then build them and fish them andthe reasons become evident in what characteristics you need in the rod. Chris On 18 Aug 1998 09:28:34 EDT, dickfuhrman@rheemote.com wrote: Chris,Being new to this Art/Craft, please explain more. How do the two tipsdiffer to aid dry fly and nymphing? I have seen plenty of two tipbamboo rods but did not notice a difference between tips. I think Isuspected something like this, but have been told it was insurance, asDarryl mentioned, to keep from spoiling a trip. I want to know more!TIADick Fuhrman from cbogart@shentel.net Tue Aug 18 18:31:15 1998 Aug 199819:30:25 -0400 Subject: Re: 2 Tips Andy If you fish often and hard - you rotate tips to avoid the infamous"set". Chris On Tue, 18 Aug 1998 10:43:40 -0400, andrew_harsanyi@ibi.com wrote: Here is a slightly different but related question. Can someone clarify the significance of having 2 "mirror" tips? What exactly are they and why would they be advantageous? Andy from cbogart@shentel.net Tue Aug 18 18:35:53 1998 Aug 199819:35:46 -0400 Subject: Re: Dip tube rod holders,was Did I miss it... RussellToo complicated and takes up too much space. Use a paper clipbent in horseshoe shape - using making tape and tape it to male ferruleand tie string to it - save a lot space - especially if you start running outofspace in your dipping enclosure. I used to use the clothespin but gave upon it. Chris On Tue, 18 Aug 1998 12:22:25 EDT, Anachemrpo@aol.com wrote: I think that I got this from "The Book". What I use is spring loaded clothes pins with a groove filed in the "lip" ofthe pin to accomodate the rod section. Then I put a loop of string throughthespring of the clothes pin and can then use a safety pin, paper clip of evendirectly tie the draw string to that loop. Russell Lavigne from flyfisher@cmix.com Tue Aug 18 18:47:06 1998 Subject: Re: silk check RO>I have received a couple of E-mails from folks who sent me checks fortheRO>custom order of silk I did in June and July. RO>I am sorry if I am messing up your check ledgers, but I have not cashedanyRO>the checks yet. I was giving you guys some time to determien if youareRO>really happy with the silk. As you know, I don't want any money fromany ofRO>you unless you are happy with the thread. And, it is human nature to beRO>excited about the new toy you receive in the mail, but often theexcitementRO>turns to disappointment after you become more familiar with the newtoy. MoRO>of you sent the check immediately upon receiving the silk. I appreciatethaRO>but I want all of you to have a fair "get acquainted period" with thesilk -RO>especially since you have 8,800 yards of the stuff! RO>As always, if you don't like the silk thread, you don't pay me anythingandRO>you keep the thread anyway. RO>Chris Lucker Chris, Could you give me your address again - my check is here and I've notbeen able to find your address. Don Burnsflyfisher@cmix.com from CALucker@aol.com Tue Aug 18 19:25:28 1998 Subject: Custom Order Silk To provide assurance to others who may be considering a custom order ofanything, I thought it might be helpful to let everyone know how mycustomsilk order went. I paid for the five pounds of silk myself and shipped the 26 three ouncespools to the first 26 folks who requested being part of the order. I divided the cost of the silk equally among all participants, includingmyself. Payment terms asked each recipient to pay their share of $21.89ONLYIF THEY WERE HAPPY with the silk. If they were not happy, they could keepthesilk free of charge. Over the past month I have received 22 of 26 checks and today I receivedword from a couple more guys that payment is on its way. So, if my order may be used as an indication of how upstanding the listmembers are, any of you who wish to pursue a custom order of somethingmaytrust the group to help you fulfill your order. Thank you list members for helping with my order. You surprised me. Iexpected checks from only about half of you. Chris Lucker from fbcwin@fsbnet.com Tue Aug 18 20:27:36 1998 Tue, 18 Aug 1998 20:25:00 -0500 Subject: Re: Southern Rodmaker Gathering Thanks for the friendly advice, Ralph. I guess it's possible this couldget out of hand, but I strongly suspect that the attendance at the nationalFFF conclave was much higher than the 400-600 expected at our SouthernCouncil Conclave. So far we have 20-25 registered. I will be shocked tosee more than 60. Because Arkansas seems like the middle of nowhere tosome, they will not make the effort to attend. Too bad. Sounds like we'regoing to have a great time. One of my local friends is even trying tofigure out how to get his wife to stay home so he can drink a few beerswithout all the nagging! from the level of interest expressed, it looks like we have thepotential to turn this into an annual meeting. Obviously next time weshould try to do this on a weekend. The folks at Gaston's Resort on theWhite River have been a big help. Next time we meet perhaps we can usetheir facilities or somewhere with similar accomodations. That and otherchanges might prompt a few more to attend.Wish you could join us, but I know it is a long way from home for you.I'm glad you had such success at National. If you do it again next yearat Gatlinburg, go ahead and put me down to help in some way. Couldn'tmakeit this year, but I won't miss it next year.ThanksHarry Ralph W Moon wrote: HarryA friendly word of warning. Your rodbuilder's affair may get out ofhand. The Bamboo Rod Symposium at the Idaho Falls Conclave was asurprise to me. I had expected about a hundred rodmakers. We had abouttwo hundred at the morning panel forum session, and I would estimate(noway to count) that we had about three hundred during the afternoonsession of demonstrations. Some of the areas that drew a great deal ofinterest (although it is unfair to single out any as all were very good)Tom Morgan's Beveler, John Dufford's nodeless technique. (This is amust see for any one interested in nodeless-- mind bogeling!) MartyKarstetter's hollowbuilding, renovation and restoration techniques, JohnZimny, Richard Sherman's rod building machines. Frank Armbruster andsome new tools, and Mark Metcalf etc. I expect that some of thesepeople may not be able to come, but I am sure that you will have somelike them. I was very pleased at the response. If I can help You any, let me know Ralph from jwilcox@netsync.net Tue Aug 18 21:12:40 1998 quartz.netsync.net (8.8.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id WAA17253 for; Tue, 18 Aug 1998 22:12:35 -0400 Subject: vacation boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0004_01BDCAF5.361B50C0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0004_01BDCAF5.361B50C0 SET RODMAKERS MAIL POSTPONE ------=_NextPart_000_0004_01BDCAF5.361B50C0 POSTPONE ------=_NextPart_000_0004_01BDCAF5.361B50C0-- from Nodewrrior@aol.com Tue Aug 18 21:47:28 1998 Subject: Re: PHY Boat Rod Taper I've refinished a Boat Rod model that is the one old rod I own, had alot todowith why I started all this...It's a stong butted 8' 6wt. Contrasts the para 15 nicely in the Young line-up.I've seen one on a rod list with two different tips (wet and dry), mine are Measurements taken on unfinished cane:01 .07405 .09210 .11615 .12520 .143 25 .16630 .18935 .194 40 .20745 .22650 .23655 .26860 .28065 .29270 .30775 .325 80 .341 85 .35690 .35696. 356I understand only about 12 of these rods were made in the Paul Young"classic"era. Rob Hoffhines from irish-george@worldnet.att.net Tue Aug 18 22:44:47 1998 (InterMail v03.02.03 118 118 102) with SMTP +0000 Subject: Re: Tiny Flyrods I hate to confuse matters (with another George), but the post belowcontradicts official information from your Department of Tourism...I'veseenthe poster..."Rush Hour in New Zealand" with the roads literally jam-packedwith sheep! 8^) It is my favorite tourism poster. George W. Bourke-----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Tiny Flyrods George , What is traffic jam ? We do not have that flavour here in New Zealand:)) Iank from andy@w-link.net Tue Aug 18 23:44:01 1998 Subject: Back to Seattle All, A family situation has put my wife and I back in Seattle after anall-too-short stay in Livingston, MT. I apologize for any confusion. I dostill have plenty of high quality tonkin available in Seattle. Thank you. Nomadically, Andy RoyerThe Bamboo Brokerbamboo@w-link.net(206) 935-4414 ph(206) 935-5515 fax from tyoung@perth.dialix.com.au Wed Aug 19 00:43:56 1998 Wed, 19 Aug 1998 13:43:49 +0800 (WST)(envelope- from tyoung) Subject: Re: PHY tapers On Tue, 18 Aug 1998, Johan Nygaardsvold wrote: I have built four PHY copies; The Driggs, The Martha Marie, The TexasGeneral, and The Para 17. I like them all, and I wonder if anyone is ableto supply me with the tapers of The Encampment (Boat) Rod and The Para16? Johan Nygaardsvold Johan,can't help with those tapers but what was the Martha Marie like, ie. how does it compare with the Driggs allowing of course that it is longer? Tony /***********************************************************************/Tony Younghttp://www.iinet.net.au/~mainpeak/flyrod.htmlThe Australian connection A computer without windows is like a fish without a bicycle /***********************************************************************/ from tyoung@perth.dialix.com.au Wed Aug 19 00:50:24 1998 Wed, 19 Aug 1998 13:50:17 +0800 (WST)(envelope- from tyoung) Subject: Re: Custom Order Silk On Tue, 18 Aug 1998 CALucker@aol.com wrote: To provide assurance to others who may be considering a custom order ofanything, I thought it might be helpful to let everyone know how mycustomsilk order went. I paid for the five pounds of silk myself and shipped the 26 three ouncespools to the first 26 folks who requested being part of the order. I divided the cost of the silk equally among all participants, includingmyself. Payment terms asked each recipient to pay their share of $21.89ONLYIF THEY WERE HAPPY with the silk. If they were not happy, they couldkeep thesilk free of charge. Over the past month I have received 22 of 26 checks and today I receivedword from a couple more guys that payment is on its way. So, if my order may be used as an indication of how upstanding the listmembers are, any of you who wish to pursue a custom order of somethingmaytrust the group to help you fulfill your order. Thank you list members for helping with my order. You surprised me. Iexpected checks from only about half of you. Chris Lucker Chris, you need to keep in mind it's not that often people are given the chance to be as honest and upstanding as you've writen. I didn't get in on this order but thankyou for the gentlemanly way you conducted it. Tony /***********************************************************************/Tony Younghttp://www.iinet.net.au/~mainpeak/flyrod.htmlThe Australian connection A computer without windows is like a fish without a bicycle /***********************************************************************/ from lcdr.hallowell@smtp.cnet.navy.mil Wed Aug 19 07:35:37 1998 (1.38.193.4/16.2) id AA19133; Wed, 19 Aug 1998 07:37:01 -0500 R8.00.01) Subject: Re[2]: Custom Order Silk Chris Thanks for trusting us and a good job to you. Thanks Mark H ______________________________ Reply Separator_________________________________Subject: Re: Custom Order Silk Author: at INTERNET On Tue, 18 Aug 1998 CALucker@aol.com wrote: To provide assurance to others who may be considering a custom order ofanything, I thought it might be helpful to let everyone know how mycustom silk order went. I paid for the five pounds of silk myself and shipped the 26 three ounce spools to the first 26 folks who requested being part of the order. I divided the cost of the silk equally among all participants, includingmyself. Payment terms asked each recipient to pay their share of $21.89ONLY IF THEY WERE HAPPY with the silk. If they were not happy, they couldkeep thesilk free of charge. Over the past month I have received 22 of 26 checks and today I receivedword from a couple more guys that payment is on its way. So, if my order may be used as an indication of how upstanding the listmembers are, any of you who wish to pursue a custom order of somethingmay trust the group to help you fulfill your order. Thank you list members for helping with my order. You surprised me. I expected checks from only about half of you. Chris Lucker Chris, you need to keep in mind it's not that often people are given the chance to be as honest and upstanding as you've writen. I didn't get in on this order but thankyou for the gentlemanly way you conducted it. Tony /***********************************************************************/ Tony Younghttp://www.iinet.net.au/~mainpeak/flyrod.html The Australian connection A computer without windows is like a fish without a bicycle /***********************************************************************/ from Fishinstix@aol.com Wed Aug 19 07:45:03 1998 Subject: tung oil finish Hi Guys,I would like to finish a rod with tung oil and am wondering what the orderofoperation is as far as guide thread finish is concerned. 1) Do you wrap and coat the guide threads before or after you apply thetung oil? 2) If you put the guides on after the tung oil finish, do you get a goodbond with the thread finish? 3) What kind of thread finish would be compatable with tung oil. I do notuse color preserver but would like to retain as much color as possible onsilk.4) It seems that to put the guides on the bare bamboo would provide thebestthread bond but it would be a nightmare to replace if needed. Am I wrong?Thanks in advance, Mark Mills from jlintvet@clarityconnect.com Wed Aug 19 09:24:19 1998 mail.clarityconnect.com with SMTP (Eudora Internet Mail Server 2.2b4);Wed, 19Aug 1998 10:32:16 -0400 Subject: Re: Custom Order Silk I was planning on going ahead with the other order...I was wondering what the Java beige color code is. I have still yet to get Patricia on the phone but expect to speak with her today and want to get moving. Any info I should know to specify the color exactly?Thanks in advance, Jon Lintvet140 East Spencer StreetIthaca, NY 14850(800) 836-7558(607) 277-4510 http://www.clarityconnect.com/webpages4/jlintvet/ from stetzer@csd.uwm.edu Wed Aug 19 10:17:52 1998 batch3.csd.uwm.edu (8.8.4/8.6.8) with ESMTP id KAA25750 for (8.8.4/8.6.8)with SMTP id KAA14365 for ; Wed, 19 Aug1998 10:17:48 Subject: Swelled butts: more than a pretty face? On my first few rods I didn't consider a swelled butt because itseemed like a complication I could live without. I understand how they could change the feel of a lighter rod by "stopping"the action ahead of the grip, but do they really offer any advantage in casting, or is it a cosmetic thing like agate stripperguides?......................................................................Frank Stetzer "...a cheerful comrade is betterstetzer@uwm.edu than a waterproof coat and a Employed by, but not speaking for foot-warmer." Henry Van Dyke,Univ of Wisconsin-Milwaukee, USA "Fisherman's Luck", 1899. from Anachemrpo@aol.com Wed Aug 19 11:03:34 1998 Subject: "Me Ol' Bamboo" :-) from the film Chitty Chitty Bang Bang Ever since my kids came down into my workshop singing it (knowing thatI'mtrying to make a "fishing pole" out of bamboo), I can't stop the tune fromrunning around through my head. While it doesn't specifically refer to fishing rods, it is a rousing goodsong, and a bit of a chuckle when one thinks of rodmakers singing it... If my kids will let me take the tape for a little while I'll post all thelyrics, but the chorus is something like "You can have my boots,and my bumbershoot,but you never, ever bother with me ol' bamboo" :-) Be of good cheer, Russ Lavigne from Grhghlndr@aol.com Wed Aug 19 13:02:38 1998 Subject: Re: Re: 2 tips List,I have a rod built by Ron Barch that has two different tips, one for wet andone for dry. Both tips have a different taper, IE one is softer.Bret from bobbo@buffnet.net Wed Aug 19 13:11:24 1998 bybuffnet4.buffnet.net (8.8.7/8.7.3) with SMTP id OAA05931 for via smap(V2.0) Subject: Re: PHY tapers Could someone please send or direct me to the Driggs taper? I have heardgreat things about it. Anyone familiar with it that could help?Thanks,BobAt 01:43 PM 8/19/98 +0800, you wrote:On Tue, 18 Aug 1998, Johan Nygaardsvold wrote: I have built four PHY copies; The Driggs, The Martha Marie, The TexasGeneral, and The Para 17. I like them all, and I wonder if anyone is ableto supply me with the tapers of The Encampment (Boat) Rod and ThePara 16? Johan Nygaardsvold Johan,can't help with those tapers but what was the Martha Marie like, ie. how does it compare with the Driggs allowing of course that it is longer? Tony /***********************************************************************/Tony Younghttp://www.iinet.net.au/~mainpeak/flyrod.htmlThe Australian connection A computer without windows is like a fish without a bicycle /***********************************************************************/ -----------------------------Bob Maulucci218 Wallace Ave.Buffalo, New York 14216716-836-8297 http://www.buffnet.net/~bobbo/welcome.htm "Don't be a truck!" from jlintvet@clarityconnect.com Wed Aug 19 13:17:00 1998 mail.clarityconnect.com with SMTP (Eudora Internet Mail Server 2.2b4);Wed, 19Aug 1998 14:20:59 -0400 Subject: YLI Looking for a number for YLI, silk company?Jon Lintvet140 East Spencer StreetIthaca, NY 14850(800) 836-7558(607) 277-4510 http://www.clarityconnect.com/webpages4/jlintvet/ from johanyga@online.no Wed Aug 19 13:24:38 1998 +0200 (METDST) Subject: PHY tapers Thank you Rob for the Boat Rod taper!! Tony,I built the Driggs two years ago and I liked so much that I wanted to buildwhat I thought would be its big brother, the Martha Marie. There are ofcourse, similarities between the two rods, but the MMs tip feels a bitstiffer. The difference between the rods when it comes to power andfeeling, at least to me, seems bigger than the four inches difference inlength should indicate. I must add that the Driggs is a blonde, and theMM is flamed, this fact makes, of course, a comparison between the Driggsand the Martha Marie more difficult. Johan from CALucker@aol.com Wed Aug 19 13:34:16 1998 Subject: Re: Custom Order Silk The Belding Corticelli number for Java Beige is 5115. Pat has a sample of authentic Java Beige on file. I sent it to her last Mayor June. Please use it. Good Luck Chris Lucker from bobbo@buffnet.net Wed Aug 19 13:36:07 1998 bybuffnet4.buffnet.net (8.8.7/8.7.3) with SMTP id OAA08053 for via smap(V2.0) Subject: Sylph taper I just picked up a South Bend Single Built Cross Sylph model that is agreatcasting rod. However, it is dramatically different in taper from the rod inthe taper archives. Can someone explain this? I thought that Wes Jordankept everything pretty close to specs. Or else, is the taper archive rodmisnamed. Anyway, if someone wants the taper here goes:This is listed without the varnish. I subtracted .005 already.7'6" 2/1 DT5Action length 81"1 .0755 .086 10 .107 15 .11920 .145 25 .16430 .185 35 .196 40 .205 45 .21350 .21855 . 238 60 . 257 65 . 281 70 . 300 75 .33680 .376 -bob from SalarFly@aol.com Wed Aug 19 13:52:56 1998 Subject: Re: tung oil finish Some tung oil finishes labeled Tung Oil are tung oil / varnishmixes. To find out dab some on a piece of wood, and touch itabout 20 minutes later. If it is sticky and seems to have "set up"there is varnish in it. Tung oil takes hours to overnight to dry.Also, pure 100% tung oil does not dry to a gloss or even semigloss finish. Allowed to dry on it's own it's a dull matte finish. Atung oil finish needs to be rubbed out and waxed to have ashiny surface. the tung oil to the rag, fold the rag over your bamboo blank, and wipe on with moderate pressure. Rub back and forth briskly, building up frictional heat. The blank should get fairly warm to the touch. After several coats of tung oil the finish will have a flat gloss finish. That is the glossiest finish you will be able to achieve with 100% Tung Oil. The finish will be shinier when (not if!) you apply a good quality carnuba based wax. BE CAREFUL!!! When doing this to the tip sections. They are easily broken if you get the tip hung up in the rag and you keep pushing the section through. To answer some of your questions, it is very difficult to do this if the guides are already wrapped on, so I would say if you are going to do a pure tung oil finish, the tung oil goes on, rubbed out, the guides get wrapped and coated with your favorite coating, varnish or flexcoat, then it gets waxed. Darryl from SalarFly@aol.com Wed Aug 19 13:53:07 1998 Subject: Re: 2 Tips In a message dated 8/18/98 9:16:10 AM Pacific Daylight Time,andrew_harsanyi@ibi.com writes: Here is a slightly different but related question. Can someone clarify the significance of having 2 "mirror" tips? What exactly are they and why would they be advantageous? That means two identical tips. It's usually refered to as two "mirrorimage" tips. Darryl from RMargiotta@aol.com Wed Aug 19 13:58:44 1998 Subject: Re: Sylph taper Hmmm. I thought the Cross Sylph was a 7'0" rod. Maybe you havesomethingunique. Is it marked "Sylph'? --Rich from sjstill@iquest.net Wed Aug 19 14:03:00 1998 0000 (209.43.49.225) Subject: Re: Sylph taper Bob, The man I am learning from learned at South Bend. The taper listed in thearchive is a "Bataviakill", not a "real" Cross Sylph. He has the Sylphtaper from the Herter's book and in his stuff from the old days. Bob wasvery emphatic when he told me that the Sylph model listed in the taperarchives is not the original Slyph taper(s). I casted one of his Slyphmodels and was hard pressed to choose between it and the Garrison 209. TheSylph will be the next one I build, just because it is supposed to be a5/6/7 wt depending upon which of the 2 tips are used! HTH, SteveSteve and Julie StillabowerIndianapolis, INsjstill@iquest.net from jfoster@gte.net Wed Aug 19 14:40:38 1998 Subject: Re: PHY tapers I forgot to include these as i don't have them posted yet page from wayne cattanach As I said earlier the Driggs or Driggs River Special was a 7' 2" rod-named for a UP stream - I have cast the original when it was in theshop. AllYoungs were made on 6" center spacings starting at the butt so theoriginallisting is as follows: 0" - 203"6" - 190"12" - 160"18" - 150"24" - 138"30" - 115"36" - 095"42" - .070" 0" - 265"6" - 265"12" - 265"18" - 260"24" - 245"30" - 225"36" - 215"42" - 205" or Hi all, How many patterns are there for the "Driggs" and variants?Followingare the two that I have built.7'2" "Driggs" 7'2" Variant0"-.068" 0"-.0645"-.082" 5"-.080"10"- .103" 10"-.100"15"-.115" 15"-.110"20"-.138" 20"-.134"25"-.147" 25"-.142"30"-.158" 30"-.154"35"- .175" 35"-.170"40"-.195" 40"-.190"43"-.200" 43"-.200"0"-.207" 0"-.204"5"-.215" 5"-.210"10"- .225" 10"-.220"15"-.240" 15"-.236"20"-.253" 20"-.250"25"-.263" 25"-.262"30"-.270" 30"-.270"35"- .270" 35"-.270"40"-.270" 40"-.270"43"-.270" 43"-.270"Have fun,Dell CoppockSpokane, WA from chris@artistree.com Wed Aug 19 15:22:24 1998 NAA15226 Subject: Re: YLI Jon, That number is as follows: YLI Corporation161 West Main StreetRock Hill, SC 29730phone: 1-803-985- 3100 or 1-800-296-8139 --Best Regards, Chris Wohlfordemail: chris@artistree.com Jon Lintvet wrote: Looking for a number for YLI, silk company?Jon Lintvet140 East Spencer StreetIthaca, NY 14850(800) 836-7558(607) 277- 4510http://www.clarityconnect.com/webpages4/jlintvet/ from andrew_harsanyi@ibi.com Wed Aug 19 15:30:33 1998 0400 Subject: Re[2]: 2 Tips Thanks Darryl Andy p.s. I know you're far away but I thought I heard you'll be at the Catskills gathering...is that true?______________________________ Reply Separator_________________________________Subject: Re: 2 Tips Author: at Tcpgate In a message dated 8/18/98 9:16:10 AM Pacific Daylight Time,andrew_harsanyi@ibi.com writes: Here is a slightly different but related question. Can someone clarify the significance of having 2 "mirror" tips? What exactly are they and why would they be advantageous? That means two identical tips. It's usually refered to as two "mirrorimage" tips. Darryl from bobbo@buffnet.net Wed Aug 19 15:37:52 1998 bybuffnet4.buffnet.net (8.8.7/8.7.3) with SMTP id QAA18468 for via smap(V2.0) Subject: Re: Sylph taper The rod is marked Model #1500. I the Wes Jordan bio it lists the 1500 inthecatalog as being a Sylph model. Am I totally confused? Bob At 02:57 PM 8/19/98 EDT, you wrote:Hmmm. I thought the Cross Sylph was a 7'0" rod. Maybe you havesomethingunique. Is it marked "Sylph'? --Rich -----------------------------Bob Maulucci218 Wallace Ave.Buffalo, New York 14216716-836-8297 http://www.buffnet.net/~bobbo/welcome.htm "Don't be a truck!" from mcdowellc@lanecc.edu Wed Aug 19 15:46:04 1998 via smap(4.1) Subject: RE: Cross Sylph I restored a Cross model #1500 Singlebuilt. The specs. were written in cursive along with the South Bend name. Black with white tipping, blonde cane. The fella who owns the rod is in the know on this stuff, has many old catalogs and he also referred to it as a Cross Sylph. Chrismcdowellc@lanecc.edu from gjflyfsh@juno.com Wed Aug 19 17:01:13 1998 17:59:17 EDT Subject: Re: Custom Order Silk JonIf you put together an order please keep me informed. I would like to beincluded. Have also indicated the same to Chris. TIAjerry _____________________________________________________________________You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e- mail.Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.comOr call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654- 5866] from RMargiotta@aol.com Wed Aug 19 19:17:29 1998 Subject: Cross Sylph The Herter's book lists a taper for a Cross Sylph (no model number) that is7'0". Also, a recent Len Codella list had another 7'0" Cross Sylph. Now,adding to the confusion, Dick Spurr (Classic Chronicle) in the "Value Guide"section lists the 7'0" Cross Sylph as Model 1500 (same as yours). I'm notsure what's going on here. --Rich from Canerods@aol.com Wed Aug 19 19:36:46 1998 Subject: Re: YLI In a message dated 98-08-19 14:18:20 EDT, you write: Angler's Workshop sells their silk thread. Don Burns from jefffly@choice.net Wed Aug 19 20:09:07 1998 VAA15626 Subject: Knurls boundary="----=_NextPart_000_009B_01BDCBB6.67FC0D20" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_009B_01BDCBB6.67FC0D20 Someone on the list had a questions about finding knurls that had a high =tooth per inch count. I have recently been searching for the best source = 1-800-521-9520. They have a large selection of knurls that go as high as=80 TPI. Please excuse this response if your question has already been =answered, I have had email problems over the last couple of weeks. =Thanks, Jeff Arnold ------=_NextPart_000_009B_01BDCBB6.67FC0D20 Someone on the list had aquestions = finding knurls that had a high tooth per inch count. I have recently = searching for the best source for such knurls. I have purchased some = J&L Industrial Supply at 1-800-521-9520. They have a largeselection = knurls that go as high as 80 TPI. Please excuse this response if your = has already been answered, I have had email problems over the last = Arnold ------=_NextPart_000_009B_01BDCBB6.67FC0D20-- from Nodewrrior@aol.com Wed Aug 19 20:12:59 1998 Subject: Re: "Me Ol' Bamboo" :-) from the film Chitty Chitty Bang Bang That movie is second only to Mary Poppins in songs that torture me todeath bygetting stuck in my head. And they both star Dick Van Dyke.The the intro music to his show was a little too catchy too...Hmm... "Ohhhhhh Robb" from WayneCatt@aol.com Wed Aug 19 20:18:23 1998 Subject: Re: Did I miss it? Clothes pin - old wooden one from sjstill@iquest.net Wed Aug 19 20:29:21 1998 0000 (209.43.55.167) Subject: YLI Jon et.al. I called YLI a while back. They referred me to Anglers World. Phonenumber334-943-4491. Sold under the Fish hawk brand. Don't know if stock #'sarethe same, I would think so. HTH Steve Steve and Julie StillabowerIndianapolis, INsjstill@iquest.net from jlintvet@clarityconnect.com Wed Aug 19 20:32:46 1998 mail.clarityconnect.com with SMTP (Eudora Internet Mail Server 2.2b4);Wed, 19Aug 1998 21:38:41 -0400 Subject: New Silk Order First let me say thanks to Chris Lucker for taking the time to do the first custom silk order. The silk was amazing and rodmakers everywhere now chant his name when he enters a room. :) Now down to business...I have placed the order for the Java Beige #5115 and will be accepting names in the same fashion Chis did. These 3oz spools will wrap oh....200 rods, plus or minus. First to respond will be given priority. Same terms apply except for one change. Since most of you know me and my status as a student, I cannot front the money as Chris did. For this order, all money will be collected prior to shipping. As much as I liked the security offered by paying only if satisfied, after arrival, the quality of the last batch offers no reason to expect anything but the same top quality silk. Of course, if you are not satisfied with the quality of silk return it and I will refund your money. I am estimating the price at $23.00 a spool, including shipping, to be on the safe side. I hope these terms are acceptable. Just as Chris's effort was not Take care, Jon Lintvet140 East Spencer StreetIthaca, NY 14850(800) 836-7558(607) 277-4510 http://www.clarityconnect.com/webpages4/jlintvet/ from flyfisher@cmix.com Wed Aug 19 20:36:26 1998 Subject: Attention - my ISP is FUBAR All, Only one email from the list all day (tonight) - thank God I didn'tremove my sub. from AOL the other day. So I know there where more. If anyone has tried to reach me in the last couple of days (?) - pleaserepost to the following address: Canerods@aol.com Seems the ISP is out to lunch lately. Thanks, Don BurnsFlyfisher@cmox.com (for now)Canerods@aol.com (Good Grief - it's more reliable) PS - Chris L.(or anyone with his address) -- I need your address tomail the check for the silk thread off to you. from rclarke@eou.edu Wed Aug 19 20:40:24 1998 Subject: Re: YLI and assorted silk questions List, will be at Angler's Workshop in Washington state on Friday. Plan topick up some silk, and assorted goodies. Does anyone know if they carryanything similar to that Payne Brown that was being ordered for folks awhile back? Robert Clarkerclarke@eou.edu ----------From: Steve Stillabower Subject: YLIDate: Wednesday, August 19, 1998 6:29 PM Jon et.al. I called YLI a while back. They referred me to Anglers World. Phonenumber334-943-4491. Sold under the Fish hawk brand. Don't know if stock #'sarethe same, I would think so. HTH Steve Steve and Julie StillabowerIndianapolis, INsjstill@iquest.net from sats@gte.net Wed Aug 19 21:00:27 1998 Subject: Re: tung oil finish - broken tip. BE CAREFUL!!! When doing this to the tip sections. They are easily broken if you get the tip hung up in the rag and you keep pushing the section through. Been there, done that. I mount the tiptop, then put it over an S shaped piece of coat hanger,securedto my workbench. Then I put slight pressure on the tiptop while I workthe oilinto bamboo. I mount the tiptop, ferrules, reel seat and grip first. Then oil, followed byguides. It also gives me a chance to move the guides around (held in placebymasking tape. Remove it after you've got your guide spacing to prevent thetape from attaching itself too well.) Terry "Sunfish" KirkpatrickSafety Harbor, Fl.(Old Tampa Bay)sats@gte.net from dickay@alltel.net Wed Aug 19 21:40:23 1998Received: from VAA00421 Subject: Re: Did I miss it? Darryl, Is a plane blade to big to get into the Particle Accelerator? What wouldhappen if we could coat the edge of the plane blade with pure diamond? Nomore sharpening! Either that or it would be extremely hard to sharpen! :-) Dick Fuhrman ----------From: SalarFly@aol.com Subject: Re: Did I miss it?Date: Tuesday, August 18, 1998 1:49 PM In a message dated 8/18/98 9:28:54 AM Pacific Daylight Time,rclarke@eou.eduwrites: Wasn't Sir D talking a while back about using a particle accelerator motor on one of these things? :) No, that was a linear accelerator! Everyone knows you usea particle accelerator for vacuum plasma coating pure diamondonto your snake guides! Darryl from flyfisher@cmix.com Wed Aug 19 21:44:00 1998 Subject: RE:Re: YLI and assorted silk questions Robert, Best guess is #824 (copper) then maybe #123 or then again maybe #815 -- all in 3/0. Plus #100 is a darker brown. Don Burns PS - Angler's #78 is close to the "Payne" gold that was recentlyordered, but has a bit more orange in it. Or maybe it's just a bitdarker. RO>List, will be at Angler's Workshop in Washington state on Friday. PlantoRO>pick up some silk, and assorted goodies. Does anyone know if theycarryRO>anything similar to that Payne Brown that was being ordered for folksaRO>while back? RO>Robert ClarkeRO>rclarke@eou.edu RO>----------RO>> From: Steve Stillabower RO>> Subject: YLIRO>> Date: Wednesday, August 19, 1998 6:29 PMRO>>RO>> Jon et.al.RO>>RO>> I called YLI a while back. They referred me to Anglers World. PhoneRO>numberRO>> 334-943-4491. Sold under the Fish hawk brand. Don't know if stock#'sRO>areRO>> the same, I would think so.RO>>RO>> HTHRO>>RO>> SteveRO>> Steve and Julie StillabowerRO>> Indianapolis, INRO>> >sjstill@iquest.net>RO>> from channer@hubwest.com Wed Aug 19 21:50:25 1998 (SMTPD32-4.02c) id AF5415C9011C; Wed, 19 Aug 1998 20:52:04 MDT Subject: Re: YLI and assorted silk questions At 06:39 PM 8/19/98 -0700, you wrote:List, will be at Angler's Workshop in Washington state on Friday. Plan topick up some silk, and assorted goodies. Does anyone know if they carryanything similar to that Payne Brown that was being ordered for folks awhile back? Robert Clarkerclarke@eou.edu Robert;I don't know if it is a good match for the old Payne brown or not, but thecopper color silk from Angler's Workshop turns a very nice opaque brownwhen treated with poly first, then varnished. Their medium brown turnsouta little bit darker, but is a good color, also. The chestnut turns almostblack. The copper is my favorite.If you like gold and didn't get any fromChris, the antique gold and the goldenrod are both nice, but if you want tocolor preserve them, be sure to get enough on, they will blotch verynoticeably. Any of the many colors they have to offer are worth trying out,I like this brand much better than Gudebrod. Hope this helps. John Channer from SalarFly@aol.com Thu Aug 20 02:21:28 1998 Subject: Re: Re[2]: 2 Tips In a message dated 8/19/98 1:32:57 PM Pacific Daylight Time,andrew_harsanyi@ibi.com writes: p.s. I know you're far away but I thought I heard you'll be at the Catskillsgathering...is that true? Strange, you aren't the first to mention that they heard I'm going to be at some gathering or another, but to answer your question, no I'm not going to be there. I wonder how those rumors get started. I have no plans to go toany rod makers gathering at this time. I would like to, but my day job andmy family budget prevents me from indulging in that extravagance. Darryl from Molly1011@aol.com Thu Aug 20 02:46:00 1998 Subject: Re: Did I miss it? steve, my wive used to have some plastic hangers with two clips forholding pants. they have rubber jaws and hold much tighter than clothespins. i dip with the male end of the ferrule in the "clip jaw". I dip thebut section before i glue the reel seat. bye bye erik from Molly1011@aol.com Thu Aug 20 02:52:18 1998 Subject: Re: Custom Order Silk jon, if you need another to commit to silk count me in. I'm happy to dropyou a check as soon as you need. erik from tyoung@perth.dialix.com.au Thu Aug 20 03:10:15 1998 Thu, 20 Aug 1998 16:08:47 +0800 (WST)(envelope- from tyoung) Subject: Re: PHY tapers On Wed, 19 Aug 1998, Johan Nygaardsvold wrote: Thank you Rob for the Boat Rod taper!! Tony,I built the Driggs two years ago and I liked so much that I wanted tobuildwhat I thought would be its big brother, the Martha Marie. There are ofcourse, similarities between the two rods, but the MMs tip feels a bitstiffer. The difference between the rods when it comes to power andfeeling, at least to me, seems bigger than the four inches difference inlength should indicate. I must add that the Driggs is a blonde, and theMM is flamed, this fact makes, of course, a comparison between theDriggsand the Martha Marie more difficult. Johan Johan,thanks for the description. I must make one and see for myself. Tony /***********************************************************************/Tony Younghttp://www.iinet.net.au/~mainpeak/flyrod.htmlThe Australian connection A computer without windows is like a fish without a bicycle /***********************************************************************/ from Canerods@aol.com Thu Aug 20 06:51:29 1998 Subject: Silk thread Jon, I would like to get the biege silk. Sorry for being late on this - ISP pickeda great time to have email problems. Don Burnscanerods@aol.com and (for now) flyfisher@cmix.com from tyoung@perth.dialix.com.au Thu Aug 20 07:21:59 1998 Thu, 20 Aug 1998 20:21:39 +0800 (WST)(envelope- from tyoung) Subject: Re: Swelled butts: more than a pretty face? On Wed, 19 Aug 1998, Frank Stetzer wrote: On my first few rods I didn't consider a swelled butt because itseemed like a complication I could live without. I understand how they could change the feel of a lighter rod by "stopping"the action ahead of the grip, but do they really offer any advantage in casting, or is it a cosmetic thing like agate stripperguides?...................................................................... To use WC's 7625 as an example I made one of these as per the book a couple of years ago and so it has been a rod used by a few people to tryout.Although I like it as it is a couple of comments have been that it could do with some beefing up at the butt for handling bigger fish so I made one with a swollen butt.Although it's basicaly the same taper up to about 6" in front of the cork where it begins to swell the rod is a totaly different rod as a result.It feels a lot like a soft graphite rod being more tippy and so dosn't have the feeling of the line of the original, nor does it seem to cast as far, however it may once you get into it more but it does control fish betterand newbies to cane like it more than the original.So what I'm coming to is IMHO the swollen butt makes a difference. Tony /***********************************************************************/Tony Younghttp://www.iinet.net.au/~mainpeak/flyrod.htmlThe Australian connection A computer without windows is like a fish without a bicycle /***********************************************************************/ from gjflyfsh@juno.com Thu Aug 20 13:17:02 1998 14:16:37 EDT Subject: Re: New Silk Order Jon Please put me on your list for thread. TIAgerald(jerry)johnson _____________________________________________________________________You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e- mail.Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.comOr call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654- 5866] from rclarke@eou.edu Thu Aug 20 13:40:01 1998 Subject: Re: RE:Re: YLI and assorted silk questions Thanks Don and John. I will try your suggestions. Looking forward tochecking this place out in person. Robert Clarkerclarke@eou.edu ----------From: flyfisher@cmix.com Subject: RE:Re: YLI and assorted silk questionsDate: Wednesday, August 19, 1998 6:43 PM Robert, Best guess is #824 (copper) then maybe #123 or then again maybe #815-- all in 3/0. Plus #100 is a darker brown. Don Burns PS - Angler's #78 is close to the "Payne" gold that was recentlyordered, but has a bit more orange in it. Or maybe it's just a bitdarker. RO>List, will be at Angler's Workshop in Washington state on Friday. Plan toRO>pick up some silk, and assorted goodies. Does anyone know if theycarryRO>anything similar to that Payne Brown that was being ordered forfolksaRO>while back? RO>Robert ClarkeRO>rclarke@eou.edu RO>----------RO>> From: Steve Stillabower RO>> Subject: YLIRO>> Date: Wednesday, August 19, 1998 6:29 PMRO>>RO>> Jon et.al.RO>>RO>> I called YLI a while back. They referred me to Anglers World. PhoneRO>numberRO>> 334-943-4491. Sold under the Fish hawk brand. Don't know ifstock#'sRO>areRO>> the same, I would think so.RO>>RO>> HTHRO>>RO>> SteveRO>> Steve and Julie StillabowerRO>> Indianapolis, INRO>> >sjstill@iquest.net RO>>RO>> from gwbarnes@gwi.net Thu Aug 20 13:42:27 1998 Subject: Re: 2 tips Chris Bogart wrote: Dick I think the best example for you to look at is on the Rodmakershompageand go to the Paul Young tapers and pull up the Para-15. It has both thewet anddry tips tapers posted. As another example of what Chris pointed out, just did a copy of a 9- 1/2footThomasSpecial with two tips. They may look the same but when miced aredecidedlydifferent andfeel nothing the same. As for the same culm syndrome, those who gonodeless couldreallycare less.George from jlintvet@clarityconnect.com Thu Aug 20 14:01:45 1998 mail.clarityconnect.com with SMTP (Eudora Internet Mail Server 2.2b4);Thu, 20Aug 1998 15:09:43 -0400 Subject: Silk Stuff... I am sorry for the screw up but while I was moving all the e-mails you sent a request please send one again. Sorry guys, And some other details. The recent silk was 6/0, however I think the consensus is the silk really is about 4/0. Just so you all know. Jon Lintvet140 East Spencer StreetIthaca, NY 14850(800) 836-7558(607) 277-4510 http://www.clarityconnect.com/webpages4/jlintvet/ from mcdowellc@lanecc.edu Thu Aug 20 14:03:57 1998 via smap(4.1) Subject: Re: 2 tips All this talk of the intentions of two tip rods has me wondering why the makers didn't always mark one tip as heavier or lighter than the other. Most of the old two tip rods I've seen have no such markings and if the taper difference is subtle it would seem like a terrific hassle for the fisherman to decipher which is which when on an outing. I've also seen rods that were very specifically marked as two separate tips either via silk colors or script. But the majority of old rods I see are two tips with no notation of a difference. Maybe both reasons are correct. Some makers provided two tips of a different taper and some provided two in case you fall on your rod andneed a spare. If I was to throw out another guess it would be that the higher end rods are more often the ones with the separate taper tips and themass produced rods were the ones more often with spares. Given the variation seen in contemporary times, for example three tips, or two butts, or two tips of varying tapers, or two tips of the same taper, or two mids and four tips with a single butt it's not hard for me to believe that these are not new ideas and were also practiced 50-80 years ago. What do the rest of you think? Do you see the same possiblities? Chrismcdowellc@lanecc.edu from LambersonW@missouri.edu Thu Aug 20 14:38:22 1998 (5.5.1960.3) Subject: RE: 2 tips George - Would you expand on your latter comment which I interpret tomean that it may be less important for sections of nodeless rods tocome from the same culm as sections of rods with nodes intact? On a similar vein, should the scarfs of strips in a nodeless rodbe staggered in the same fashion that nodes would be? Bill LambersonColumbia, Missouri -----Original Message----- Sent: Thursday, August 20, 1998 4:28 PM Subject: Re: 2 tips Chris Bogart wrote: Dick I think the best example for you to look at ison the Rodmakers hompageand go to the Paul Young tapers and pull up thePara-15. It has both the wet anddry tips tapers posted. As another example of what Chris pointed out, just did acopy of a 9-1/2 foot ThomasSpecial with two tips. They may look the same but whenmiced are decidedly different andfeel nothing the same. As for the same culm syndrome,those who go nodeless could reallycare less.George from bobbo@buffnet.net Thu Aug 20 15:16:56 1998 bybuffnet4.buffnet.net (8.8.7/8.7.3) with SMTP id QAA17997 for via smap(V2.0) Subject: webbased hexrod Hope these questions haven't been answered previously:1. Does anyone else have trouble printing out the graphs from the WebbasedHexrod? I get no lines, just the x and y axis labels. 2. Also, has there been an update on the disk from Wayne Cattanach's book.My copy says "Revision 7-92" on the label. I would really like an easy way to compare rods based on the stresseswithout having to draw up the graphs by hand, and I would like a hard copyof them.Thanks in advance,Bob-----------------------------Bob Maulucci218 Wallace Ave.Buffalo, New York 14216716-836-8297 http://www.buffnet.net/~bobbo/welcome.htm "Establish a better reputation for honesty in your home community; thenyouwont have to bring in dead fish to prove that your not a liar." - KennethReid from jlintvet@clarityconnect.com Thu Aug 20 15:47:22 1998 mail.clarityconnect.com with SMTP (Eudora Internet Mail Server 2.2b4);Thu, 20Aug 1998 16:55:20 -0400 Subject: Re: webbased hexrod I have the same problem with the web based application. As for your version of Waynes, there is a 96 I think on the Rodmakers page and a windows version is on its way. Jon Lintvet140 East Spencer StreetIthaca, NY 14850(800) 836-7558(607) 277-4510 http://www.clarityconnect.com/webpages4/jlintvet/ from jlintvet@clarityconnect.com Thu Aug 20 15:47:23 1998 mail.clarityconnect.com with SMTP (Eudora Internet Mail Server 2.2b4);Thu, 20Aug 1998 16:55:22 -0400 Subject: RE: 2 tips As far as pieces in nodeless being from the same culm, I think you would have a hard time selling a rod if they were not. People like the idea that the rod made a transition from a single culm. However, if I have a box load of 12" strips from different culms, looks like a rod to me. I do believe, as well as most everyone else, that the scarfs should be staggered. I use a 3x3 pattern. Jon Lintvet140 East Spencer StreetIthaca, NY 14850(800) 836-7558(607) 277-4510 http://www.clarityconnect.com/webpages4/jlintvet/ from tom@cet-inc.com Thu Aug 20 16:25:45 1998 0000 Subject: Re: webbased hexrod Bob,I experienced the same problem when I switched to a new network printer.Ididn't have a problem with a post script printer connected to my computer.Idownloaded the program from the rodmakers home page and it prints ok.Tom Whittle -----Original Message----- Subject: webbased hexrod Hope these questions haven't been answered previously:1. Does anyone else have trouble printing out the graphs from the WebbasedHexrod? I get no lines, just the x and y axis labels.2. Also, has there been an update on the disk from Wayne Cattanach'sbook.My copy says "Revision 7-92" on the label.I would really like an easy way to compare rods based on the stresseswithout having to draw up the graphs by hand, and I would like a hardcopyof them.Thanks in advance,Bob-----------------------------Bob Maulucci218 Wallace Ave.Buffalo, New York 14216716-836-8297 http://www.buffnet.net/~bobbo/welcome.htm "Establish a better reputation for honesty in your home community; thenyouwont have to bring in dead fish to prove that your not a liar." - KennethReid from channer@hubwest.com Thu Aug 20 16:31:45 1998 (SMTPD32-4.02c) id A6261E97011C; Thu, 20 Aug 1998 15:33:26 MDT Subject: Re: webbased hexrod At 04:46 PM 8/20/98 +0000, you wrote:I have the same problem with the web based application. As for your version of Waynes, there is a 96 I think on the Rodmakers page and a windows version is on its way. Jon Lintvet140 East Spencer StreetIthaca, NY 14850(800) 836-7558(607) 277-4510 http://www.clarityconnect.com/webpages4/jlintvet/ Jon and Bob;Are you guys using Frank Stetzer's version, or the download of Wayne'sprogram?I have no trouble with Frank's program and the compare feature is reallynice.And, I finally figured out how to save it to file and be able to callit back up again. My computer can't read it unless I change it to an htmfile. If you haven't played with Frank's program yet, give it a try, it hasa lot of great features.John Channer from rcurry@top.monad.net Thu Aug 20 17:07:47 1998 Subject: Re: 2 tips Jon Lintvet wrote: As far as pieces in nodeless being from the same culm, I think youwould have a hard time selling a rod if they were not. People likethe idea that the rod made a transition from a single culm. However,if I have a box load of 12" strips from different culms, looks like arod to me. Jon,I don't know the same people as you, I guess. The folks I know wouldtake a Payne, F.E. Thomas, Leonard, etc., even tho' none of those came from a single culm.IMHO, using a single culm is counter productive since the power fiberis never evenly distributed. Perhaps Dickerson had a better approach,choosing his strips from the same position on 6 different culms?Best regards,Reed from TSmithwick@aol.com Thu Aug 20 17:15:09 1998 Subject: Re: webbased hexrod In a message dated 8/20/98 8:23:32 PM, you wrote: If you have access to the Excel spreadsheet program, download theexcellentExcel version of the hexrod program from the rodmakers website. It willautomatically give you gauge and stress charts, and is also very userfriendly. from rcurry@top.monad.net Thu Aug 20 17:23:01 1998 Subject: Re: 2 Tips SalarFly@aol.com wrote:I have no plans to go toany rod makers gathering at this time. I would like to, but my day job andmy family budget prevents me from indulging in that extravagance. DarrylDarryl,Please do not use the word "extravagance" in speaking of thegatherings. If that should get out to spouses...Best regards,Reed from CALucker@aol.com Thu Aug 20 17:41:23 1998 Subject: Re: 2 Tips In a message dated 8/20/98 3:24:47 PM Pacific Daylight Time,rcurry@top.monad.net writes: I have no plans to go toany rod makers gathering at this time. I would like to, but my day jobandmy family budget prevents me from indulging in that extravagance. DarrylDarryl,Please do not use the word "extravagance" in speaking of thegatherings. If that should get out to spouses...Best regards,Reed >> Hey Reed, don't even use the word "spouses!" You know they scan our mailforsuch references. from now on we should simply refer to s______ as"Those veryclose to us yet outside the craft," or TVCTUYOTC. Chris Lucker from channer@hubwest.com Thu Aug 20 18:05:11 1998 (SMTPD32-4.02c) id AC0C1F40011C; Thu, 20 Aug 1998 17:06:52 MDT Subject: Re: 2 Tips At 06:40 PM 8/20/98 EDT, you wrote:In a message dated 8/20/98 3:24:47 PM Pacific Daylight Time,rcurry@top.monad.net writes: I have no plans to go toany rod makers gathering at this time. I would like to, but my day jobandmy family budget prevents me from indulging in that extravagance. DarrylDarryl,Please do not use the word "extravagance" in speaking of thegatherings. If that should get out to spouses...Best regards,Reed >> Hey Reed, don't even use the word "spouses!" You know they scan our mailforsuch references. from now on we should simply refer to s______ as"Thoseveryclose to us yet outside the craft," or TVCTUYOTC. Chris Lucker Guys;Carsten Jorgensen refers to his as "she who must be obeyed"; applies atmyhouse, too. I would suggest SWMBO, its shorter.John from fbcwin@fsbnet.com Thu Aug 20 19:56:58 1998 0500 Subject: Re: 2 Tips john channer wrote:At 06:40 PM 8/20/98 EDT, you wrote:In a message dated 8/20/98 3:24:47 PM Pacific Daylight Time,rcurry@top.monad.net writes: << SalarFly@aol.com wrote:I have no plans to go toany rod makers gathering at this time. I would like to, but myday job andmy family budget prevents me from indulging in that extravagance. DarrylDarryl, "extravagance"in speaking of thegatherings. If that should get out to spouses...Best regards,Reed >> scanour mail for s______as "Thoseveryclose to us yet outside the craft," or TVCTUYOTC. Chris Lucker Guys;Carsten Jorgensen refers to his as "she who must be obeyed"; appliesat myhouse, too. I would suggest SWMBO, its shorter.John on the family this year in Salt Lake City, I'm not that kind of Salt Lake City group made an addition to our Statement of Faith whichstatesin part, "...wives are to graciously submit to their husbands." was boughtthat answer so I pressed her, "Mrs. Laverne, what kind of major decisions married (SWMBO)to accept all my decisions about the Southern Rodmakers Gathering inearly Or, .... I may need some help here. Harry Boyd from WDHCJL@aol.com Thu Aug 20 20:33:45 1998 Subject: Re: Swelled butts: more than a pretty face? My thought is that you may feel a difference, but reality is that it isbecause you are "not connected" to the remainder of the taper. Whatshould beevaluated is the feel versus the action of the taper. Just a thought.doug from richard.nantel@videotron.ca Thu Aug 20 21:06:43 1998 (modemcable75.173.mmtl.videotron.net WAA12994 for Subject: Ordering Bamboo boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0001_01BDCC84.9DC191E0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0001_01BDCC84.9DC191E0 I've read the books, amassed a bunch of tools and gadgets, and cleaned outthe basement. I'm ready to order Tonkin Cane. Is Demarest the best place from which to order? If I order, say, 6 culms can I expect all of them to beOK or is there a percentage of bad ones in every order? Many thanks Richard Nantel richard.nantel@videotron.ca ------=_NextPart_000_0001_01BDCC84.9DC191E0 name="Richard Nantel (E-mail).vcf" filename="Richard Nantel (E-mail).vcf" BEGIN:VCARDVERSION:2.1N:Nantel;Richard;;;FN:Richard Nantel (E-mail)ORG:Le groupe MENTOR;TITLE:TEL;WORK;VOICE:(514) 393- 3292TEL;HOME;VOICE:(514) 485-2287TEL;PAGER;VOICE:[1] (514) 111- 1111TEL;WORK;FAX:(514) 393-1483ADR;WORK:;;4374 Old Orchard Avenue;Monteal;Quebec;H4A 3B4;CanadaLABEL;WORK;ENCODING=3DQUOTED- PRINTABLE:4374 Old Orchard =Avenue=3D0D=3D0AMonteal, Quebec H4A 3B4=3D0D=3D0ACanadaADR;HOME:;;4374 Old Orchard Avenue;Monteal;Quebec;H4A 3B4;CanadaLABEL;HOME;ENCODING=3DQUOTED- PRINTABLE:4374 Old Orchard =Avenue=3D0D=3D0AMonteal, Quebec H4A 3B4=3D0D=3D0ACanadaEMAIL;PREF;INTERNET:richard.nantel@videotron.caREV:19980514T133343ZEND:VCARD ------=_NextPart_000_0001_01BDCC84.9DC191E0-- from maxs@geocities.co.jp Thu Aug 20 21:13:25 1998 (3.2) Subject: Re: tung oil finish Mark, I am a Japanese amateur rodmaker and a fun of tung oil finish. Joinedthis list just recently. My way is almost same to yours like below; 1. Start with the blank with Ferrule and the topguide attached butwithout cork nor reel sheetThis is to avoid oil stains the cork or reel sheet. 2. Place tung oil onto the blank using brush, then rub the oil using therag from butt to top.Rubbing it in the direction from butt to top will never break thetip. But a special care is needed anyway. It will take about 90 minto dry up.3 Repeat 2 several times. I usually do it twice if I need to make itshine, or three times whenI want semi gloss finish. To get a full gloss, I will varnish itlater after wrapping.4. Attach shaped cork, winding check, finished reel sheet and wrap allthe guides.5. Apply color reserver over the wrap and make it dry.6. Apply thinned epoxy over the wrap and make it dry. (epx A : epx B :thinner=1:1:4). 7. Using a brush, coat the wrap with the same tung oil. A special careis needed to avoidthe oil will flow over the wrap boundary. Turn the rod on the morterspinner and justattach the brush onto the wrap and do not move the brush. Repeat 2-3times after it dries.Here, the semi gloss oil finish is completed.8. For full gloss, I will give the last thin coat by the brush over thesurface of entire sections (incl. wraps).Use the same tung oil which is thinned (50% thinned, oil : thinner =1:1) This should be done with rotating the rod on the spinner.When the rod is dried up, it has the same effect to the one which isdipped. I hope this will help. The tung oil I referred above is the mixture ofurethane and natural oil, usuallysold at the shop for semi-gloss oil finish.Our country has a very old traditional surface finishing technologyusing "Urushi", the naturaloil. Usually it is applied to traditional wooden cup, plate, boxes withthe decoration of pieces ofthin sliced shell (of the shellfish), thin gold flakes, etc. It cansurvive more than some hundred yearswith the same quality shine.Some Japanese rodmakers are using Urushi for bamboo rod.The only bad thing of urushi is that if it is touched to the skin, itwill cause allergy, get itch withreddished skin for a week or so.The method of application is exactly same to this tung oil finish. Max Satoh Fishinstix@aol.com wrote: Hi Guys,I would like to finish a rod with tung oil and am wondering what theorder ofoperation is as far as guide thread finish is concerned.1) Do you wrap and coat the guide threads before or after you apply thetung oil?2) If you put the guides on after the tung oil finish, do you get a goodbond with the thread finish?3) What kind of thread finish would be compatable with tung oil. I donotuse color preserver but would like to retain as much color as possible onsilk.4) It seems that to put the guides on the bare bamboo would provide thebestthread bond but it would be a nightmare to replace if needed. Am Iwrong?Thanks in advance, Mark Mills from cphisey@neca.com Thu Aug 20 22:09:04 1998 Subject: Re: New Silk Order At 09:30 PM 8/19/98 +0000, you wrote:First let me say thanks to Chris Lucker for taking the time to do the first custom silk order. The silk was amazing and rodmakers everywhere now chant his name when he enters a room. :) Now down to business...I have placed the order for the Java Beige #5115 and will be accepting names in the same fashion Chis did.SNIPHi Jon,Put me down for one if there is room on the list,Sorry for thebandwith,butI couldn't get thru off line or thru Jon's website.Charlie Hiseycphisey@neca.com from saweiss@flash.net Thu Aug 20 22:50:53 1998 Subject: Re: Ordering Bamboo -----Original Message----- Subject: Ordering Bamboo I've read the books, amassed a bunch of tools and gadgets, and cleaned outthe basement. I'm ready to order Tonkin Cane. Is Demarest the best place from which to order? If I order, say, 6 culms can I expect all of them tobeOK or is there a percentage of bad ones in every order? Many thanks Richard Nantel richard.nantel@videotron.ca Richard,Another good source: Andy Royer231 S. 2ndLivingston, MT59047bamboo@ycsi.net(406) 222-1415 ph(406) 222-1582 fx Regards,Steve Weiss from tyoung@perth.dialix.com.au Thu Aug 20 23:03:37 1998 Fri, 21 Aug 1998 12:02:58 +0800 (WST)(envelope- from tyoung) Subject: Re: 2 Tips On Thu, 20 Aug 1998, Harry Boyd wrote: Or, .... I may need some help here. Harry Boyd Only one real choice realy, get the lathe, she'll love it. I know these things. Tony /***********************************************************************/Tony Younghttp://www.iinet.net.au/~mainpeak/flyrod.htmlThe Australian connection A computer without windows is like a fish without a bicycle /***********************************************************************/ from teekay35@interlynx.net Thu Aug 20 23:34:19 1998 Subject: Re: Ordering Bamboo I've received 3 bales of cane (65 culms) from Demarest over the the last18months. All of it was useable. These were ordered for the June "GrandRiver" rod builders gatherings and for personal use. ----------From: Richard Nantel Subject: Ordering BambooDate: Thursday, August 20, 1998 9:50 PM I've read the books, amassed a bunch of tools and gadgets, and cleanedoutthe basement. I'm ready to order Tonkin Cane. Is Demarest the best place from which to order? If I order, say, 6 culms can I expect all of them tobeOK or is there a percentage of bad ones in every order? Many thanks Richard Nantel richard.nantel@videotron.ca from cmj@post11.tele.dk Fri Aug 21 00:35:03 1998 (InterMail v4.0 217-106) with SMTP +0200 Subject: Sv: 2 Tips boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0011_01BDCCD6.84DEBF20" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0011_01BDCCD6.84DEBF20 I have forced my wife (SWMBO) to accept all my decisions about the = HarryI´ll bet Your voice faltered, face perhaps becoming = subject finally dropped. SWMBO just giving You THAT look.In due time You will end up suggesting a new sewingmachine, or = new roses for the garden, or........Harry, am sorry to say You are a lost case. SWMBO did it =againregards,Carsten ------=_NextPart_000_0011_01BDCCD6.84DEBF20-- from maxs@geocities.co.jp Fri Aug 21 01:40:43 1998 (3.2) Subject: Stress Curve Hello guys, Would you please someone explain me how to evaluate stress curveingeneral?I know some pc software are uploaded on rodmaker homepage but have adifficulty toevaluate it or feel it.When the curve goes up and down, what does it mean? or when the curve isflat how about it?How are you looking at the graph?Please advise if there is something to read too.Max Satoh from TSmithwick@aol.com Fri Aug 21 07:22:37 1998 Subject: Re: Stress Curve In a message dated 8/21/98 6:47:32 AM, you wrote: Max - In the FAQ section of the Rodmakers web site, there is anexplanation ofhow the stress curves are derived. There is also a lot of information in thearchives. In general the curve is a prediction of how the rod will bendwhenloaded with a certain ammount of line. Where the stresses are high, therodbends more, where they drop, it bends less, A flat spot should indicate anarea of uniform bend. Once you understand the principles, the best way togeta feel for the curves is to cast a number of different rods and compare theperceived action with the stress curve of the taper. When you get the feelofthe system, you will find it very useful in rod design and modification. from destinycon@mindspring.com Fri Aug 21 07:22:40 1998 Subject: Re: 2 Tips At 12:02 PM 8/21/98 +0800, you wrote:Only one real choice realy, get the lathe, she'll love it. I know these things. Tony Harry,I believe it was Tony that sugested the new dip tube for my wife'sbirthday. She's having another next month, we are back on a first namebases again, and the dip tube is working like a charm. I think I'm going Gary H. from eestlow@srminc.com Fri Aug 21 08:04:36 1998 86256667.00486EC6 ; Fri, 21 Aug 1998 08:11:09 -0500 Subject: Re: Ordering Bamboo I believe Andy's back in Seattle, per his post of a few days ago. -Ed Estlow from eestlow@srminc.com Fri Aug 21 08:07:08 1998 86256667.0048A611 ; Fri, 21 Aug 1998 08:13:31 -0500 Subject: Re: Sv: Stress curves? Max and the list, Once again, Sir D's treatise on stress curves. Perhaps this should be onthe Rodmakers page, Jerry? Best,-Ed---------------------- Forwarded by Ed Estlow/SRM/US on 08/21/9808:09 AM--------------------------- SalarFly@aol.com on 07/22/98 10:14:47 AM Please respond to rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Subject: Re: Sv: Stress curves? In a message dated 7/22/98 6:44:59 AM Pacific Daylight Time,cmj@post11.tele.dk writes: I Asked the same questions about stress curves not so long ago, and SirD,asusual, gave a precise and clear answer, which I take to be a very goodstarting point when it comes to understanding stress curves. I herewithask> Sir D if I can publish his explanation. Sir D, are You there? This is something I posted a long time ago. I saved it since this questionseems to come up every once and a while.Darryl*************************************************************************** In it's most basic use a stress curve shows you how close a split cane rodistobreaking with the weight and length of line you specified. Garrisonbelieved200,000ounces per square inch was a good, safe upper level. In reality you can goupto230,000 or 250,000 without any problems. Garrison himself went up to220,000onhis lighter rods. Garrison believed that below the 140,000 point thebamboostoppedflexing. Some basic information on stress curves: The X axis is rod length, with the tip on the left and thehandle on the right. The Y axis is ounces per square inch. This sounds likea pressure, as in psi, but it is really a stress measurement.The square inch refers to the area of the cross section ofthe rod at that point. The higher the stress curve goes, the more the rod will bend,taking the curve as a whole. I say this because a reading of200,000 near the tip, where the rod is thin in diameter is goingto bend more than a reading of 200,000 near the handle wherethe bamboo is thicker. But, if you compare a whole stress curveof one rod to the whole stress curve of another rod, the rod witha higher reading at the same point along the length will bend moreat that point. A stress curve means nothing if you can't relate it to something.The only way you can start to see how a stress curve can helpyou is to graph up the stress curves of real rods and cast them.In my case I didn't have a bunch of rods to try. I had to makethem. I now have a bunch of experimental rods lying around,but fotunately I was able to sell a few of the better experiments.I was also lucky in accidentally making a rod I really like ( aCattanach taper) on my third attempt, and being able to contrastthat to a rod I really didn't like (a Garrison taper). As you get deeper into stress curves you can begin to pick out certaincharacteristics that tell you what kind of action the rod has, or will haveifit hasn't been made yet. A Garrison rod, which I consider to be slow, has awellrounded "hump" near the tip and a fairly slow drop off as it goes towardsthehandle.Let's see if I can do this with ASCII art. || * *| * * *| * * *| * * *| * * *| *| *| *| *| *_*______________________________________________ The rod that I'm always raving about, the Cattanach 7' 0"4 wt, I consider to be fairly fast. It has a stress curve like this: || *| * *| * *| * *| * *| * * *| * * * * * * *| *| *| *_*______________________________________________ The blip near the handle is the Cattanach hinge, and it greatly enhancesrollcasting.Don't forget to put it in. I did and the rod I made was a terrible rollcaster. Itisn't as necessary on longer rods, but on shorter rods it's definitelyneeded. A Paul Young Para 15, what is described as a parabolic action looks likethis: || * * * *| * * * *| * * * *| * * * *| * * * *| *| *| *| *| *|*______________________________________________ Looking at this rod, and never having cast one, I would guess that it wouldfeel fairlyslow, due to the enhanced bending near the handle, but able to throw a lotofline, dueto the stiff mid section. I would also guess that it could roll cast reallywell. There are as many variations of stress curves as there are rodmakers.Thiscovers theslow, fast and parabolic actions. from gwbarnes@gwi.net Fri Aug 21 08:42:16 1998 Subject: Re: 2 tips Lamberson, William R. wrote: George - Would you expand on your latter comment which I interpret tomean that it may be less important for sections of nodeless rods tocome from the same culm as sections of rods with nodes intact? May well be just another of my own idiosyncracies but I started out payingparticular attention to the location of the individual strips from a culm.As time went on, I tried mixing both culms and location. With mysomewhatblundering casting ability, I see no difference in the action or theappearance. I tend to attribute this to the adhesion of Epon epoxy wihichwas first recognized by Bill Fink. On a similar vein, should the scarfs of strips in a nodeless rodbe staggered in the same fashion that nodes would be? Again, I believe due to the Epon, I've come to pay less than strictattention to location of splices. I usually make the rough strips 10 incheslonger than the finished strip, 5 on each end. Have less trouble withwrapping the very end, especially of a tip section. When cutting strips tothis pre-length the splices may end up slightly staggered but I really don'tpay a great deal of attention to them. So far the only failure has resulted from a fall that bridged two rocks andthat failure was at the ferrule, not a splice. George from fbcwin@fsbnet.com Fri Aug 21 09:52:36 1998 0500 Subject: Re: 2 Tips Heidt wrote: At 12:02 PM 8/21/98 +0800, you wrote:Only one real choice realy, get the lathe, she'll love it. I know thesethings. Tony Harry,I believe it was Tony that sugested the new dip tube for my wife'sbirthday. She's having another next month, we are back on a first namebases again, and the dip tube is working like a charm. I think I'm going Gary H. Gary,You're right. I can see Tony's wisdom. Anyone that would lureTasmanian devils to a friend's tent must be a sharp man. But withallthe rods I'm building, and since I already have a nice lathe, maybe I couldget her a few Ballan reels. Or one of the Hardy commemorative specials inthewooden box. Or maybe a mint first edition copy of one of the fewrodbuldingbooks not already in my library. She would see that as a wise investment.Or maybe, just maybe, season tickets to the theater and symphony,alongwith a guarantee that I'll be in town for every performance, a dozen rosesinhand, and a nice dinner out before each evening. I'm just not sure. I'll getmy eleven year old daughter and fishing partner to feel her (SWMBO) out onthis.Boy, these theological questions are taxing to a feeble mind like mine! Harry from watson@cape-consult.co.uk Fri Aug 21 10:54:29 1998 (BST) Subject: Re: 6 Days Fishing Silk Darryl,John Cooper suggested I talk to you.I have been given a tapered silk line and need to restore it (its still onits reel - a Hardy StGeorge).I have searched some of the archives but have been unlucky in finding thetrail. from what I read earlier (I've come back from vacation to nearly 600emails!!) you gave great advice to Reed Curry. Could you either forwardyour info or give me some idea on what month I should be looking - I'd bevery gratefulThanksTim-----Original Message----- Subject: 6 Days Fishing Silk Last week on my yearly week-long fishing excursion I usedthe 7 ft. Sir D Favorite lined with the silk line I restored. Thiswas the stress test of the restoration I did on the silk line. Ididn't use anything else. I didn't even bring a graphite rodon the trip with me, and my other cane rods never evengot taken out of their cases. I wiped the line down with Mucilin every evening and againonce a day at lunch time. The silk line performed flawlessly, still looks like it was justrestored, and still floats like a cork. I caught a lot during theweek, and the line was used between 6 to 10 hours a day.I had zero problems with it. I even nymphed with it. Hooksets were more positive because the line doesn't stretchas much as plastic line, the silk line shoots through theguides easier than a plastic line. I'll take the silk line over aplastic line any day (as long as I don't have to buy a new one.They go for $200 a pop). Darryl from sjstill@iquest.net Fri Aug 21 11:16:57 1998 0000 (209.43.48.190) Subject: The Monster That's the name I've bestowed upon #1! Got to split some more yesterday,taking the 6 strips down smaller for tips and butts. Only managed to workthru 3 in about 2 hours! Nothing split straight. Got a couple seriousdog-legs and not really from nodes either! Although this *could* turn meinto a nodeless kind of guy . Was wondering at one point if Demerastwould take this culm back (just joking - it was VERY nerve wrackingthough)! Bob told me that I really chose a great culm to learn with - I'll get allthe problems out of the way with this one. Hope to finish up the roughstuff Saturday cause we will be on vacation for 2 weeks starting Monday! SteveSteve and Julie StillabowerIndianapolis, INsjstill@iquest.net from jfoster@gte.net Fri Aug 21 11:51:17 1998 Subject: Re: Sv: Stress curves? I agree Ed.. do you mind if i post your explanation Darryl? regards jerry from SalarFly@aol.com Fri Aug 21 12:04:12 1998 Subject: Re: 6 Days Fishing Silk In a message dated 8/21/98 9:00:04 AM Pacific Daylight Time,watson@cape- consult.co.uk writes: from what I read earlier (I've come back from vacation to nearly 600emails!!) you gave great advice to Reed Curry. Could you either forwardyour info or give me some idea on what month I should be looking - I'd bevery grateful We should get this straight - Reed Curry gave great advice to me.Reed has been doing this a lot longer than I have. Darryl from SalarFly@aol.com Fri Aug 21 12:07:09 1998 Subject: Re: Sv: Stress curves? In a message dated 8/21/98 9:57:34 AM Pacific Daylight Time,jfoster@gte.netwrites: I agree Ed.. do you mind if i post your explanation Darryl? Let me clean it up a bit. That post was from a long time ago.Also I'd like to put real illustrations in it instead of thosefunky ascii drawings. Darryl from andy@w-link.net Fri Aug 21 12:20:43 1998 Subject: Re: Ordering Bamboo Steven, Thanks for the plug. However, as noted in my email posted on 8-18, I havemoved back to Seattle. Below is my contact information. I do have plentyof tonkin available. Regards, Andy RoyerThe Bamboo Brokerbamboo@w-link.net(206) 935-4414 ph(206) 935-5515 fax -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Ordering Bamboo -----Original Message-----From: Richard Nantel Date: Thursday, August 20, 1998 9:09 PMSubject: Ordering Bamboo I've read the books, amassed a bunch of tools and gadgets, and cleanedoutthe basement. I'm ready to order Tonkin Cane. Is Demarest the best place from which to order? If I order, say, 6 culms can I expect all of them tobeOK or is there a percentage of bad ones in every order? Many thanks Richard Nantel richard.nantel@videotron.ca Richard,Another good source: Andy Royer231 S. 2ndLivingston, MT59047bamboo@ycsi.net(406) 222-1415 ph(406) 222-1582 fx Regards,Steve Weiss from jfoster@gte.net Fri Aug 21 12:40:27 1998 Subject: Re: Sv: Stress curves? no problem sir d sometime.. regards jerry from mcdowellc@lanecc.edu Fri Aug 21 15:02:53 1998 via smap(4.1) Subject: Ferrule Shims? I'm restoring an early Hardy Marvel rod. I notice at the ferrules there are thin bamboo shims protruding out 1/8" from under the ferrule sleeves and tapering down smoothly to the blank. I wonder if this was a means to prevent the wear mark that sometimes crops up at the bamboo to ferrule location or if it was a means to use a larger diameter ferrule? These ferrules are very tiny Leonard style on this rod. When I get the varnish off I'll post the taper for those interested. This is a 7 1/2' three piece rod. I would guess a 3 or 4 wt. from flexing although I haven't cast it. Chrismcdowellc@lanecc.edu from JBeardsle@aol.com Fri Aug 21 17:36:16 1998 Subject: Silk Line I have old rods and reels I am refurbishing and need to find old silk line. Can anyone help? Thanks,James from DBURRILL@TELEHUB.com Fri Aug 21 17:44:25 1998 Subject: RE: First Rod taper search List,Back in May, I asked for suggestions for tapers for my firstrod. The consensus was the Para-15. I completed that first rod about amonth ago and am very pleased. However, along the way I began to havemydoubts about the Para-15 taper on the Rodmakers site. I sent the taper tothe people at the PHY Rod Company and they confirmed that the taper waswrong, and then stated they don't publish their tapers. Does anyone outthere have a reliable Para-15 taper, or an actual Para-15 they couldmeasureand post to the list? I'd like my second rod to really be a Para-15. from mcdowellc@lanecc.edu Fri Aug 21 17:57:49 1998 via smap(4.1) Subject: RE: First Rod taper search Dean, I too just finished the blank on the Paul Young Para 15 taper listed in the Rodmakers website. I haven't finished out the rod yet. Does it cast a 5DT wt. nicely? To answer your question, it's my understanding that the Young tapersvaried over the years. Improvements? Style changes? Machine wear? I don'tknow,but from what I hear two original rods of the same model could have different tapers. I know a collector who won't touch them because he can't tell what he's really got. At least you were able to talk to the Paul Young Rod Company. I e- mailed a question regarding parts and never heard back. Chrismcdowellc@lanecc.edu from fiveside@net-gate.com Fri Aug 21 18:02:41 1998 ns1.net-gate.com (8.8.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id TAA09024 for Subject: Mortal Sins? To the listI support George Barnes' position that at least for nodeless, the relativeposition or origin of the strips is of little importance provided care istaken to match up the power fiber densities, heavier in the butt, and lessso toward the tip. I also agree with Sir D in that it is not a mortal sin toremove some power fibers provided there is plenty remaining in thefinishedblank. Bill from DBURRILL@TELEHUB.com Fri Aug 21 18:06:55 1998 Subject: RE: Para-15's (was 'First Rod taper search') boundary="---- =_NextPart_001_01BDCD58.51020A4A" This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does notunderstandthis format, some or all of this message may not be legible. ------ =_NextPart_001_01BDCD58.51020A4A Chris,My rod ended up being a very nice 6wt due to my poor planing. Iused it for a week on the Henry's Fork, Madison, and Silver Creek. Itproved to be a very effective all-around rod. -----Original Message-----From: CHRISTOPHER C MCDOWELL [SMTP:mcdowellc@lanecc.edu]Sent: Friday, August 21, 1998 5:59 PM Subject: RE: First Rod taper search Dean, I too just finished the blank on the Paul Young Para 15 taperlisted in the Rodmakers website. I haven't finished out the rod yet. Does itcast a 5DT wt. nicely? To answer your question, it's my understanding that the Youngtapers varied over the years. Improvements? Style changes? Machine wear? Idon't know,but from what I hear two original rods of the same model couldhave different tapers. I know a collector who won't touch them because he can't tellwhat he's really got. At least you were able to talk to the Paul YoungRod Company. I e- mailed a question regarding parts and never heard back. Chrismcdowellc@lanecc.edu ------ =_NextPart_001_01BDCD58.51020A4A RE: Para-15's (was 'First Rod taper search') Chris, -----Original=Message----- C =MCDOWELL [SMTP:mcdowellc@lanecc.edu] Friday, August 21, 1998 5:59 PM RE: First Rod taper search Dean, I too justfinished =the blank on the Paul Young Para 15 taper listed in the Rodmakers = 5DT wt. To answer your =question, it's my understanding that the Young tapers varied over the = what = different =tapers. I know acollector =who won't touch them because he can't tell what he's really I e-mailed a =question regarding parts and never heard back. Chrismcdowellc@lanecc.edu ------ =_NextPart_001_01BDCD58.51020A4A-- from SalarFly@aol.com Fri Aug 21 18:10:01 1998 Subject: Re: First Rod taper search In a message dated 8/21/98 3:48:11 PM Pacific Daylight Time,DBURRILL@TELEHUB.com writes: I sent the taper tothe people at the PHY Rod Company and they confirmed that the taperwaswrong, and then stated they don't publish their tapers You are going to have problems trying to exactly duplicate a taper. Most of the time, unless you are doing a total restoration and you strip the varnish off, you have to measure the diameter over a varnishcoating. The thickness of the varnish has to be estimated and subtractedfromyour diameter measurements. Even if you strip the varnish off, try measuring from flat to flat acrossthree flats at the same point. You won't get the same diameter all theway around. You can go a step further and get two authentic rods ofthe same model and measure both of them. You won't get the samemeasurements. Even if you use the same rod and have two peoplemeasure it you won't get the same measurements. so where doesthat leave us as rodmakers? Enjoying a handcrafted product whereno two rods cast exactly alike. As for your Para-15, enjoy it. It probably casts as well as any other authentic Para-15 out there. Darryl from WayneCatt@aol.com Fri Aug 21 21:05:36 1998 Subject: Re: Para-15's (was 'First Rod taper search') The Para - 15 is definately a DT - 6 - as far as the folks at PHY - Toddisn'tgoing to help out much with list members from tyoung@perth.dialix.com.au Fri Aug 21 21:18:23 1998 Sat, 22 Aug 1998 10:18:16 +0800 (WST)(envelope- from tyoung) Subject: Re: 2 Tips On Fri, 21 Aug 1998, Heidt wrote: At 12:02 PM 8/21/98 +0800, you wrote:Only one real choice realy, get the lathe, she'll love it. I know these things. Tony Harry,I believe it was Tony that sugested the new dip tube for my wife'sbirthday. She's having another next month, we are back on a first namebases again, and the dip tube is working like a charm. I think I'm going Gary H. I'm just on old softy when it comes to keeping the women folk happy. Tony /***********************************************************************/Tony Younghttp://www.iinet.net.au/~mainpeak/flyrod.htmlThe Australian connection A computer without windows is like a fish without a bicycle /***********************************************************************/ from tyoung@perth.dialix.com.au Fri Aug 21 21:32:11 1998 Sat, 22 Aug 1998 10:32:04 +0800 (WST)(envelope- from tyoung) Subject: Re: Mortal Sins? On Fri, 21 Aug 1998, Bill Fink wrote: To the listI support George Barnes' position that at least for nodeless, therelativeposition or origin of the strips is of little importance provided care istaken to match up the power fiber densities, heavier in the butt, and lessso toward the tip. I also agree with Sir D in that it is not a mortal sin toremove some power fibers provided there is plenty remaining in thefinishedblank. Bill I've been messing about quite a bit with this very thing starting initialy would on a conventional noded spline, then mixed in no particular order except each piece came from the next section up from the one previous tousing up an entire cylinder of cane before moving to the next cylinder.It all works fine.I have a Sir D from the first era and a recent one from the last era and they are basicaly as identical as two cane rods of the same taper can be.Do what ever you think makes sence. Tony /***********************************************************************/Tony Younghttp://www.iinet.net.au/~mainpeak/flyrod.htmlThe Australian connection A computer without windows is like a fish without a bicycle /***********************************************************************/ from stetzer@csd.uwm.edu Sat Aug 22 01:01:04 1998 batch3.csd.uwm.edu (8.8.4/8.6.8) with ESMTP id BAA08537 for (8.8.4/8.6.8)with SMTP id BAA32753 for ; Sat, 22 Aug1998 01:01:02 Subject: Re: webbased hexrod Yes, a few other people have reported problems printing out the graphs from the web version of hexrod. The graphs appear fine on the screenbut when printed just the axes appear. I have no idea what causes this,or how to fix it. Since the graph appears on the screen your computerand browser obviously get the graph OK, but something goes wrong in the print process. I've tried Netscape versions 2, 3, and 4 and Internet Explorer versions3 and 4 and am always able to print the graphs. What browser programare you using?......................................................................Frank Stetzer "...a cheerful comrade is betterstetzer@uwm.edu than a waterproof coat and a Employed by, but not speaking for foot-warmer." Henry Van Dyke,Univ of Wisconsin-Milwaukee, USA "Fisherman's Luck", 1899. On Thu, 20 Aug 1998, robert maulucci wrote: Hope these questions haven't been answered previously:1. Does anyone else have trouble printing out the graphs from the WebbasedHexrod? I get no lines, just the x and y axis labels. 2. Also, has there been an update on the disk from Wayne Cattanach'sbook.My copy says "Revision 7-92" on the label. I would really like an easy way to compare rods based on the stresseswithout having to draw up the graphs by hand, and I would like a hardcopyof them.Thanks in advance,Bob-----------------------------Bob Maulucci218 Wallace Ave.Buffalo, New York 14216716-836-8297 http://www.buffnet.net/~bobbo/welcome.htm "Establish a better reputation for honesty in your home community; thenyouwont have to bring in dead fish to prove that your not a liar." - KennethReid from iank@nelson.planet.org.nz Sat Aug 22 03:24:29 1998 ; Sat, 22 Aug 1998 20:24:01 +1200 Subject: Re: 2 tips Chris The older Walker Bampton rod I have with two tips , has each tip a quitedifferent shade . The light coloured tip is a 6 and the dark tip , which isthe same colour as the butt, is a 7. The bag has a carefully writtennotation pointing this out .This is one way to differentiate but I am not too sure about theappearancewhen the light tip is with the darker butt. Iank At 11:58 AM 20/08/98 PDT, you wrote:All this talk of the intentions of two tip rods has me wondering why the makers didn't always mark one tip as heavier or lighter than the other. Most of the old two tip rods I've seen have no such markings and if the taper difference is subtle it would seem like a terrific hassle for the fisherman to decipher which is which when on an outing. I've also seen rods that were very specifically marked as two separate tips either via silk colors or script. But the majority of old rods I see are two tips with no notation of a difference. Maybe both reasons are correct. Some makers provided two tips of a different taper and some provided two in case you fall on your rod andneed a spare. If I was to throw out another guess it would be that the higher end rods are more often the ones with the separate taper tips and themass produced rods were the ones more often with spares. Given the variation seen in contemporary times, for example three tips,or two butts, or two tips of varying tapers, or two tips of the same taper,or two mids and four tips with a single butt it's not hard for me to believe that these are not new ideas and were also practiced 50-80 years ago. What do the rest of you think? Do you see the same possiblities? Chrismcdowellc@lanecc.edu Ian Kearney phone 0064 03 5445556104 Champion Road Fax 0064 03 5440374Richmond New Zealand email inak@ts.co.nz from anglport@con2.com Sat Aug 22 07:25:31 1998 Subject: RE: 2 tips All,No one has mentioned what I have always supposed was the reason for thetwo especially if your rodmaker was a "one-off" kinda guy, you were looking atsome serious down-time on your fishing schedule (Hey, look at the waittimeseven today among our busier colleagues!). If the tips were different, youcould still fish, I suppose, but if they were truly for different purposesthe resulting rod would not do the job you wanted in its ideal form. I cancertainly see an argument for both arrangements.Art from rcurry@top.monad.net Sat Aug 22 07:48:34 1998 Subject: Re: 2 tips Art Port wrote: All,No one has mentioned what I have always supposed was the reason forthe two especially if your rodmaker was a "one-off" kinda guy, you were lookingatsome serious down-time on your fishing scheduleAl,If you were really cautious, you packed a tip repair outfit, with a 6"spring steel tip extension that you could bind to the broken tip. Thesewere sold in neat canvas rolls with all the supplies you would require:silk thread, wax, varnish, glue, pins, tiptops, steel extension tiptop,etc.Best regards,Reed from rcurry@top.monad.net Sat Aug 22 07:55:03 1998 Subject: Re: Silk Line JBeardsle@aol.com wrote: I have old rods and reels I am refurbishing and need to find old silk line. Can anyone help? Thanks,JamesJames,When is the next large flea market in your area? Does you wife try toget you into antique shops? If so, look for old fly reels carrying silkline in the size you need, buy the reel and you can discard it whenyou're done. Restore the line (a simple process which will bedemonstrated at the Catskills gathering) and enjoy.Best regards,Reed from flyfisher@cmix.com Sat Aug 22 08:00:10 1998 Subject: Short Montague rods All, just how I thought high-end Montagues were bargains based upon low pricevalues in published guides. That is if one could find one on today'sclassic rod lists. Well, the chance to purchase a 2nd Fishkill one occured the other dayand to make a long story, short (shorter) - what arrived was a 7'6"Montague Fishkill and it is a piece of $%^&. The rest of the story for those who want to know: Where my 1st rod has tight invisible glue lines and nice cane work ofthe "hand-made" rod dep't of Montague, while the new one has "classic"ugly resorcinal wide glue lines and a few very very wide gluelines ofthe "slap'em together" production dep't. Where my 1st rod has the very nice titelock reelseat - the new one hasthe only reelseat that I've seen that is crappier than a Heddon plasticreelseat. The 2 rods differ in taper and length (couple of inches) plus the latestrod has flamed cane. Different grips too. The only things that are incommon are the NS ferrules and the green/gold wrap pattern. In whole,two completely different rods. Seems the later rod must be one produced just before the end ofMontague's cane rod production, made out of their std. productioncomponents plus the last of the good ferrules. Don Burns from channer@hubwest.com Sat Aug 22 08:43:14 1998 (SMTPD32-4.02c) id AB5610B014A; Sat, 22 Aug 1998 07:44:54 MDT Subject: Re: Short Montague rods At 05:59 AM 8/22/98 -0600, you wrote:All, just how I thought high-end Montagues were bargains based upon lowpricevalues in published guides. That is if one could find one on today'sclassic rod lists. Well, the chance to purchase a 2nd Fishkill one occured the other dayand to make a long story, short (shorter) - what arrived was a 7'6"Montague Fishkill and it is a piece of $%^&. The rest of the story for those who want to know: Where my 1st rod has tight invisible glue lines and nice cane work ofthe "hand-made" rod dep't of Montague, while the new one has "classic"ugly resorcinal wide glue lines and a few very very wide gluelines ofthe "slap'em together" production dep't. Where my 1st rod has the very nice titelock reelseat - the new one hasthe only reelseat that I've seen that is crappier than a Heddon plasticreelseat. The 2 rods differ in taper and length (couple of inches) plus the latestrod has flamed cane. Different grips too. The only things that are incommon are the NS ferrules and the green/gold wrap pattern. In whole,two completely different rods. Seems the later rod must be one produced just before the end ofMontague's cane rod production, made out of their std. productioncomponents plus the last of the good ferrules. Don Burns Don;I am just finishing the wraps on an 8'6" Fishkill. It is also wrapped ingreen/gold with green border wraps spaced about 1/2" away from theguidewraps. This rod has a green bakelite seat with black threads and whatappear to be black nickle silver ferrules, altho the ferrules look likethey might have been painted. It has as nice cane work as I have seen onany production rod, tight glue lines, sharp corners and no nodes next toanother. I was about to change my mind about Montagues, but maybe thesewell made rods were the exception rather than the rule. I have seen dozensof Montagues at flea markets and antique stores, but this is the only onethat looks like someone gave a s--t when they put it together. I got 3 rodsin to re-finish yesterday, a Heddon #17, an H-I Favorite, and an unmarkedrod with about 6 different wrap colors and a rather strange looking reelseat of nickle silver with a wide screw lock and captured sleeve. Wouldn'tyou know that the only one that is not broken anywhere is the H-I. This rodlives up to all my expectations, but the owner wants it done anyway. Oh,well, its his money. The Heddon is very strange, it is well marked, withall the writing clearly visisble, but it is almost blond cane, I thoughtall Heddons were the brown ammonia tempered color. Are Heddon ferrluseavailable anywhere, or should I just have Dave LeClair make one for me? Itis missing the mid section female. John from anglport@con2.com Sat Aug 22 08:58:32 1998 Subject: Re: 2 tips Yeah, but did you fish with that arrangement 'til the end of the season?Youhad to give up that tip at SOME time or you'd always have a jury- riggedrod.BTW, where'd you find out about those repair kits? I was pretty smug inmyflyfishing lore and never even knew they existed! Ya loin sumpin' neweveryday! Thanks for the education, Reed.ART At 08:51 AM 8/22/98 -0400, you wrote:Art Port wrote: All,No one has mentioned what I have always supposed was the reason forthe two especially if your rodmaker was a "one-off" kinda guy, you were lookingatsome serious down-time on your fishing scheduleAl,If you were really cautious, you packed a tip repair outfit, with a 6"spring steel tip extension that you could bind to the broken tip. Thesewere sold in neat canvas rolls with all the supplies you would require:silk thread, wax, varnish, glue, pins, tiptops, steel extension tiptop,etc.Best regards,Reed from flyfisher@cmix.com Sat Aug 22 09:14:56 1998 Subject: RE:Re: Short Montague rods RO>I am just finishing the wraps on an 8'6" Fishkill. It is also wrapped inRO>green/gold with green border wraps spaced about 1/2" away from theguideRO>wraps. This rod has a green bakelite seat with black threads and whatRO>appear to be black nickle silver ferrules, altho the ferrules look likeRO>they might have been painted. It has as nice cane work as I have seenonRO>any production rod, tight glue lines, sharp corners and no nodes next toRO>another. I was about to change my mind about Montagues, but maybetheseRO>well made rods were the exception rather than the rule. I have seendozensRO>of Montagues at flea markets and antique stores, but this is the onlyoneRO>that looks like someone gave a s--t when they put it together. I got 3rodsRO>in to re-finish yesterday, a Heddon #17, an H-I Favorite, and anunmarkedRO>rod with about 6 different wrap colors and a rather strange lookingreelRO>seat of nickle silver with a wide screw lock and captured sleeve.Wouldn'tRO>you know that the only one that is not broken anywhere is the H-I. ThisrodRO>lives up to all my expectations, but the owner wants it done anyway.Oh,RO>well, its his money. The Heddon is very strange, it is well marked,withRO>all the writing clearly visisble, but it is almost blond cane, I thoughtRO>all Heddons were the brown ammonia tempered color. Are HeddonferrluseRO>available anywhere, or should I just have Dave LeClair make one forme? ItRO>is missing the mid section female. RO>John John, I guess the way to select a Montague is to look for the Scrulockreelseat - the one that you discribed. My better Fishkill has one too.These rods are as good as any production rods, IMHO. Not many around, Iguess. The ferrules should be darkened by oxidizing, but they might have beenpainted (japaned) by an owner to cover up wear. Heddon japaned (blacklacquer) many of their lower-end rods to save money. Your Black Beauty (#17 Heddon) might have been refinished earlier, Ihave a Heddon #14 that was refinished by Sewell Dutton and it it hasvery light cane too. The kind of wood stripper that they used back thenmight be the reason. Don't know for sure. BUT any Heddon looks lighterafter refinishing - whatever brand varnish they used gets very dark withage. Heddon ferrules are available (about as often as hen's teeth ) - bestto buy one. I need 3 female mid section ferrules for 2F rods myself.Seems these ferrules are often missing or that the rods are broken inthis same area. But Heddon used 3 different suppliers of ferrules and the welts differs welting made to match. Maybe we can order several from Dave and save afew bucks? Email me off list -- Flyfisher@cmix.com or Canerods@aol.com OR - Do as I have done in the past, I found that the Cortland NSferrules almost match one of the 3 Heddon welt designs. (need to belucky) You'll need to find which size Cortland (Swiss design) ferrule isclosest to the Heddon size (Leonard design) ferrule. If you are luckyone will almost be of the correct size. Don't forget to save theCortland male ferrules to fill up your parts bins. Don Burns PS - The H-I is in the best shape because nobody ever wanted to fish it. from bobbo@buffnet.net Sat Aug 22 09:39:19 1998 bybuffnet4.buffnet.net (8.8.7/8.7.3) with SMTP id KAA11480 for via smap(V2.0) Subject: Re: webbased hexrod I am using Internet Explorer 4.0 Bob At 01:01 AM 8/22/98 -0500, you wrote:Yes, a few other people have reported problems printing out the graphs from the web version of hexrod. The graphs appear fine on the screenbut when printed just the axes appear. I have no idea what causes this,or how to fix it. Since the graph appears on the screen your computerand browser obviously get the graph OK, but something goes wrong in the print process. I've tried Netscape versions 2, 3, and 4 and Internet Explorer versions3 and 4 and am always able to print the graphs. What browser programare you using?......................................................................Frank Stetzer "...a cheerful comrade is betterstetzer@uwm.edu than a waterproof coat and a Employed by, but not speaking for foot-warmer." Henry Van Dyke,Univ of Wisconsin-Milwaukee, USA "Fisherman's Luck", 1899. On Thu, 20 Aug 1998, robert maulucci wrote: Hope these questions haven't been answered previously:1. Does anyone else have trouble printing out the graphs from the WebbasedHexrod? I get no lines, just the x and y axis labels. 2. Also, has there been an update on the disk from Wayne Cattanach'sbook.My copy says "Revision 7-92" on the label. I would really like an easy way to compare rods based on the stresseswithout having to draw up the graphs by hand, and I would like a hardcopyof them.Thanks in advance,Bob-----------------------------Bob Maulucci218 Wallace Ave.Buffalo, New York 14216716-836-8297 http://www.buffnet.net/~bobbo/welcome.htm "Establish a better reputation for honesty in your home community; thenyouwont have to bring in dead fish to prove that your not a liar." - KennethReid -----------------------------Bob Maulucci218 Wallace Ave.Buffalo, New York 14216716-836-8297 http://www.buffnet.net/~bobbo/welcome.htm "Establish a better reputation for honesty in your home community; thenyouwont have to bring in dead fish to prove that your not a liar." - KennethReid from rcurry@top.monad.net Sat Aug 22 11:44:06 1998 Subject: Re: Short Montague rods flyfisher@cmix.com wrote:John, I guess the way to select a Montague is to look for the Scrulockreelseat - the one that you discribed. My better Fishkill has one too.These rods are as good as any production rods, IMHO. Not many around, Iguess. Don,I had a 9' Fishkill years ago. It had a superb fine thread brassdownlock with NS rings and cap and a cedar spacer. The rod was very wellconstructed, with wraps as you described and blackened NS ferrules.However, the rod had more wood than necessary. I believe that mostofthe Montagues had less than optimum tapers, in order to compensate fortheir sanding approach to cleanup.That said, I'm still delighted with my 9' 3wt. Montague.Monogrammed,blackened NS, Landman reelseat, etc. They did make some great rods.Best regards,Reed from WDHCJL@aol.com Sat Aug 22 12:42:02 1998 Subject: ID Help I have a rod that I am unsure of the maker. Description: 3 piece 8 foot (Ithink I have not measured it). Red/ruby color wraps (with lots ofintermediates). The only marking is at the top of the alum. reel seat justbelow the handle. Its is a diamond shape with the initials DF (could be DE,it is worn), there is an arrow thru the initials with the word trade abovetheinitials and mark below. It has as a "case", a large dowel with indentionsmilled out to accomodate the pieces and two ties that hold the pieces tothecase. The two tips have different tip tops, one reasonably standard theothervery thick and does not angle forward but rather stands straight up (itseemsto be too thick ti simply have been bent). Thanks in advance.doug from WDHCJL@aol.com Sat Aug 22 13:30:29 1998 Subject: ID Help, PS I just noticed that the wraps also have some yellow accent wraps.doug from WayneCatt@aol.com Sat Aug 22 13:55:03 1998 Subject: Re: webbased hexrod In a message dated 98-08-22 10:46:01 EDT, you write: My copy says "Revision 7-92" on the label. >> There is a Windows version almost complete - well it is being tested - theproblem is that the compressed files are around 3.5 - 5 meg - AOL onlyallows distributethe new program - I would prefer to do it by web because I know thattherewill need to be a few polish areas. The new program does what the olddoes -however it stores tapers to files and it prints out stress graphs both toscreen and hardcopy on a consistant grid. Wayne from flyfisher@cmix.com Sat Aug 22 14:12:11 1998 Subject: RE:ID Help RO>I have a rod that I am unsure of the maker. Description: 3 piece 8 foot(IRO>think I have not measured it). Red/ruby color wraps (with lots ofRO>intermediates). The only marking is at the top of the alum. reel seatjustRO>below the handle. Its is a diamond shape with the initials DF (could beDE,RO>it is worn), there is an arrow thru the initials with the word tradeabove tRO>initials and mark below. It has as a "case", a large dowel withindentionsRO>milled out to accomodate the pieces and two ties that hold the piecesto theRO>case. The two tips have different tip tops, one reasonably standard theothRO>very thick and does not angle forward but rather stands straight up (itseemRO>to be too thick ti simply have been bent). Thanks in advance.RO>doug Doug, Sinclair has a "Diamond Edge" logo rod with an arrow through a "DE"listed in his "Bamboo Rod Restoration Handbook" - listed as a Montaguebuilt trade rod. The rod's selling company was Norvell-Shapleigh Hardware of St. Loius,Mo. The one shown in the book was a Chubb-Montague rod. Chubb was a company that Montague purchased that had been makingqualityrods. By the time Montague folded, Chubb rods were at all levels ofquality and many rods were made up from old leftover rod hardware and soa rod's age is hard to fix. Don Burns from iank@nelson.planet.org.nz Sat Aug 22 14:56:23 1998 ; Sun, 23 Aug 1998 07:56:15 +1200 Subject: Re: Ferrule Shims? Chris, Hardy used to glue thin strips of bamboo to the flats under the ferrules sothat it was not necessary to remove any of the power fibres to fit theferrule . You are probably correct that it may reduce the tendancy to causea break in the wrap at this point . If you let me have the number on the rod I will be able to tell you the yearof manufacture regards Iank At 12:59 PM 21/08/98 PDT, you wrote:I'm restoring an early Hardy Marvel rod. I notice at the ferrules there are thin bamboo shims protruding out 1/8" from under the ferrule sleeves and tapering down smoothly to the blank. I wonder if this was a means to prevent the wear mark that sometimes crops up at the bamboo to ferrule location or if it was a means to use a larger diameter ferrule? These ferrules are very tiny Leonard style on this rod. When I get the varnish off I'll post the taper for those interested. This is a 7 1/2' three piece rod. I would guess a 3 or 4 wt. from flexing although I haven't cast it. Chrismcdowellc@lanecc.edu Ian Kearney phone 0064 03 5445556104 Champion Road Fax 0064 03 5440374Richmond New Zealand email inak@ts.co.nz from WayneCatt@aol.com Sat Aug 22 16:20:29 1998 Subject: Re: webbased hexrod theprogram needs to be collected from 3 sites and assembled into one filefolder members.aol.com/hexrod/dsk1.zip (disk1)members.aol.com/planecane1/dsk2.zip (disk2)members.aol.com/rodmaker01/dsk3.zip I shoud have another dsk available shortly - it will include all the tpr(tapers) files that will work with either dos version c or hexrod 98. remember the program is still in a beta version and there are still acoupleof features that I want to add - I just need some time to work on it Later Dudes (Dudettes)Wayne from SalarFly@aol.com Sat Aug 22 17:34:50 1998 Subject: Re: webbased hexrod In a message dated 8/22/98 11:58:08 AM Pacific Daylight Time,WayneCatt@aol.com writes: I am considering getting a CD-r as to distributethe new program I've got a CD-R, if I can be of any help just let me know. Darryl from SalarFly@aol.com Sat Aug 22 17:41:00 1998 Subject: Opportunity Knocks It isn't often that opportunity knocks, and it it is even rarer thatsomebody tells you about it as it is happening. Mark Metcalf, the editor of Bamboo Fly Rod Magazine hasasked me to pass this on to the Rodmakers list. Next year's magazines ( Yes there is going to be at least anotheryear for you doubting Thomases ) in each issue Mark wants topresent 3 to 5 short profiles of unknown or relatively little knownrodmakers. The only requirement is that you are currently offering your rods for sale, or will be next year. If you are a bamboo rodmaker, and you are selling your rods, this is an excellent opportunity to get some worldwide exposure for free. Contact Mark at: bam-fly@pacbell.net if you want to be includedin these profiles, or write him a snail mail letter at: The Bamboo Fly Rod1442 East Lincoln AvenueSuite 318Orange, CA92865 If you are trying to sell your rods and you don't take Markup on this - well, the coffee is brewed, all you need to do isinhale. Darryl Hayashida from mrbamboo@quik.com Sat Aug 22 18:09:14 1998 Subject: Re: webbased hexrod -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: webbased hexrod In a message dated 98-08-22 10:46:01 EDT, you write: My copy says "Revision 7-92" on the label. >> There is a Windows version almost complete - well it is being tested - theproblem is that the compressed files are around 3.5 - 5 meg - AOL onlyallows distributethe new program - I would prefer to do it by web because I know thattherewill need to be a few polish areas. The new program does what the olddoes -however it stores tapers to files and it prints out stress graphs both toscreen and hardcopy on a consistant grid. Wayne Wayne, If you would like, I can put it on my web site. I have 10 megs of space,just let me know. Paul Whitely from Canerods@aol.com Sat Aug 22 18:15:43 1998 Subject: Re: Short Montague rods John, What's broken on the Heddon? (besides the missing ferrule) What sizeferruleis the Heddon? (IE - 2F, 2-1/2F ....) I've do have a few Heddon ferrules plus I also scarf repair broken sectionsifI have the spare broken rod section material. If you plan to order ferrules from Dave, I'll go in with you for a quanitydiscount. Don Burns from flyfisher@cmix.com Sat Aug 22 18:22:09 1998 Subject: Ooopppsss! Sorry my last was supposed to go to John Don B. from channer@hubwest.com Sat Aug 22 18:26:59 1998 (SMTPD32-4.02c) id A42FB20140; Sat, 22 Aug 1998 17:28:47 MDT Subject: Re: webbased hexrod At 04:05 PM 8/22/98 -0000, you wrote: If you would like, I can put it on my web site. I have 10 megs of space,just let me know. Paul Whitely Paul;How can I get to your website these days? I keep getting the dread Error404 when I try to get there thru Cane Rod Links or my bookmark. Has youraddress changed? I really appreciate your tip about straightening nodes bypressing for 5 seconds, then turning the strip in the vise, this has madenode straightening much less frustrating for me. I am looking forward tothe rest of your plans for the beveler, also. John Channer from mrbamboo@quik.com Sat Aug 22 18:39:50 1998 Subject: Re: webbased hexrod -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: webbased hexrod At 04:05 PM 8/22/98 -0000, you wrote: If you would like, I can put it on my web site. I have 10 megs ofspace,just let me know. Paul Whitely Paul;How can I get to your website these days? I keep getting the dread Error404 when I try to get there thru Cane Rod Links or my bookmark. Has youraddress changed? I really appreciate your tip about straightening nodesbypressing for 5 seconds, then turning the strip in the vise, this has madenode straightening much less frustrating for me. I am looking forward tothe rest of your plans for the beveler, also. John Channer John, My sight is at http://www.irvine.quik.com/mrbamboo/index.html. The badthing is that just as I was switching servers, my system crashed. I losteverything!!! Now I have an old page / site up, and plan on working on automation, guidebuilding, etc.. at a new sight I am working on. It's url is rodbuilder.comand rodbuilding.com (IP address 207.121.124.131 . I just got it, and havenot had a chance to get internic to redirect yet, but hopefully within thenext few days they will redirect the url to the IP address. Paul from channer@hubwest.com Sat Aug 22 20:18:28 1998 (SMTPD32-4.02c) id AE4D1300116; Sat, 22 Aug 1998 19:20:13 MDT Subject: Re: Short Montague rods At 07:15 PM 8/22/98 EDT, you wrote:John, What's broken on the Heddon? (besides the missing ferrule) What sizeferruleis the Heddon? (IE - 2F, 2-1/2F ....) I've do have a few Heddon ferrules plus I also scarf repair brokensections ifI have the spare broken rod section material. If you plan to order ferrules from Dave, I'll go in with you for a quanitydiscount. Don Burns Don;It has one tip down about 4" and the mid section has lost about 3/4 wherethe female broke off. It looks like it broke at the pin, so maybe there isa case for not pinning ferrules.It is a 2 1/2 f, I am not sure what the midto tip size is, I will have to dig out Mike's Heddon book and look itup.The rod is an HCH or D, which is a little heavy for around here, I wasgoing to just put a larger tip on the broken section, the owner can'treally afford a scarf repair right noe. If he wants to later, I can alwaysdo it.He wanted to change the wrap colors and put new cork and modernreelseat on it, but I wouldn't stand for it, he finally agreed to let me do itthe right way. I told him I would do whatever he wanted to to the H-I andthe unknown(obviously cheap production rod,5 guides on a 9' rod and crosscut 1" corks). I was a little surprized at the lack of quality in the H-I,it is a Favorite, which is a mid quality level rod, I would have thought ismerited decent cork and better cane work, which is awful,BTW, if my firstrod had turned out that bad I might not have made any more. I don't know ifI can hold up my end of a volume order, what did you have in mind? I amgoing to need some sets for upcoming new rods, so maybe we can mix themallin together. Let me know what it will take. Thanks John from channer@hubwest.com Sat Aug 22 20:21:04 1998 (SMTPD32-4.02c) id AEEB2B80152; Sat, 22 Aug 1998 19:22:51 MDT Subject: Re: webbased hexrod At 04:35 PM 8/22/98 -0000, you wrote: -----Original Message-----From: john channer Date: Saturday, August 22, 1998 11:31 PMSubject: Re: webbased hexrod Paul;How can I get to your website these days? I keep getting the dread Error404 when I try to get there thru Cane Rod Links or my bookmark. Hasyouraddress changed? I really appreciate your tip about straightening nodesbypressing for 5 seconds, then turning the strip in the vise, this has madenode straightening much less frustrating for me. I am looking forward tothe rest of your plans for the beveler, also. John Channer John, My sight is at http://www.irvine.quik.com/mrbamboo/index.html. The badthing is that just as I was switching servers, my system crashed. I losteverything!!! Now I have an old page / site up, and plan on working on automation, guidebuilding, etc.. at a new sight I am working on. It's url is rodbuilder.comand rodbuilding.com (IP address 207.121.124.131 . I just got it, andhavenot had a chance to get internic to redirect yet, but hopefully within thenext few days they will redirect the url to the IP address. Paul Paul;Thanks for the update, I , and I am sure everyone else, can't wait. Hopeeverything goes smoothle for you. John from andy@w-link.net Sat Aug 22 21:14:16 1998 Subject: Where is Christian? Hello! Does anyone have an idea of Christian's(the American who lives inJapan) location? I met him at the conclave in Idaho Falls and have lost hiscontact information. Any help at all would be greatly appreciated. Thank You,Angel RoyerThe Bamboo Brokerbamboo@w-link.net(206) 935-4414 ph(206) 935-5515 fax from WDHCJL@aol.com Sat Aug 22 21:32:00 1998 Subject: ID Help, PS, 2 Also, the cork on the handle seems to have been a flat piece that waswrapedaround the handle. This as there is a "joint" running down from top tobottomwhich I assume was were it was glued up.doug from tyoung@perth.dialix.com.au Sat Aug 22 21:53:03 1998 Sun, 23 Aug 1998 10:52:56 +0800 (WST)(envelope- from tyoung) Subject: Re: webbased hexrod On Sat, 22 Aug 1998 WayneCatt@aol.com wrote: In a message dated 98-08-22 10:46:01 EDT, you write: My copy says "Revision 7-92" on the label. >> There is a Windows version almost complete - well it is being tested- theproblem is that the compressed files are around 3.5 - 5 meg - AOL onlyallows distributethe new program - I would prefer to do it by web because I know thattherewill need to be a few polish areas. The new program does what the olddoes -however it stores tapers to files and it prints out stress graphs both toscreen and hardcopy on a consistant grid. Wayne Wayne and all interested persons,further to the discussion re removeable media for the purpose of file distribution you could consider a "floptical" drive.I just installed on on my personal machine and it's great.The drive itself replaces the 1.44mb drive you'd already have on your machine and can use either garden variety 1.44mb diskettes OR what Imation (formaly 3M) call Laser Servo Technology diskets which hold120mb.The drive itself works out which diskette you've shoved in.The disketes cost about $25 and the drive is around $120.IMHO these will become standard on machines *unless* rewritable CD's become more viable for the purpose very soon. Tony /***********************************************************************/Tony Younghttp://www.iinet.net.au/~mainpeak/flyrod.htmlThe Australian connection A computer without windows is like a fish without a bicycle /***********************************************************************/ from WayneCatt@aol.com Sun Aug 23 00:18:10 1998 Subject: HexRod98 dsk3.zipagain - had a block in the dimensions part of the execute program Wayne members.aol.com/rodmaker01/dsk3.zip from cmj@post11.tele.dk Sun Aug 23 05:50:08 1998 (InterMail v4.0 217-106) with SMTP +0200 Subject: Sv: HexRod98 FAA16938 dsk3.zipagain - had a block in the dimensions part of the execute program Wayne members.aol.com/rodmaker01/dsk3.zip Wayne Still can't get it to function. Messages say Hexrod98 is installed, but whenpushingthe exe-file, an icon pops up, which leads to a blank screen when pushed.Any ideas? or am I just an ignorant? (Yep, I know, but CAN manage to push a button) Technical help will be appriciated regards Carsten from johanyga@online.no Sun Aug 23 05:59:38 1998 (METDST) Subject: Heavy Leonards A friend of mine, the German rodbuilder Wolfram Schott, recently bought a16' Leonard rod at an auction in Germany. He believes the rod is from the1920's. I promised him to search for any information about Leonardsbetween14' and 16' long. If anyone has any knowledge concerning these rod, I wouldbe very grateful. Johan from richard.nantel@videotron.ca Sun Aug 23 09:25:06 1998 (modemcable75.173.mmtl.videotron.net KAA25980 for Subject: Nodeless info please boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0001_01BDCE7E.482F4320" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0001_01BDCE7E.482F4320 Can anyone point me in the right direction to get information aboutnodelessconstruction? The two books I own (Cattanach's and Howell's) don't coverthis. I like the idea of heating the 18-inch strips in my own oven insteadof building a long oven. Thanks Richard Nantelrichard.nantel@videotron.ca ------=_NextPart_000_0001_01BDCE7E.482F4320 name="Richard Nantel (E-mail).vcf" filename="Richard Nantel (E-mail).vcf" BEGIN:VCARDVERSION:2.1N:Nantel;Richard;;;FN:Richard Nantel (E-mail)ORG:Le groupe MENTOR;TITLE:TEL;WORK;VOICE:(514) 393- 3292TEL;HOME;VOICE:(514) 485-2287TEL;PAGER;VOICE:[1] (514) 111- 1111TEL;WORK;FAX:(514) 393-1483ADR;WORK:;;4374 Old Orchard Avenue;Monteal;Quebec;H4A 3B4;CanadaLABEL;WORK;ENCODING=3DQUOTED- PRINTABLE:4374 Old Orchard =Avenue=3D0D=3D0AMonteal, Quebec H4A 3B4=3D0D=3D0ACanadaADR;HOME:;;4374 Old Orchard Avenue;Monteal;Quebec;H4A 3B4;CanadaLABEL;HOME;ENCODING=3DQUOTED- PRINTABLE:4374 Old Orchard =Avenue=3D0D=3D0AMonteal, Quebec H4A 3B4=3D0D=3D0ACanadaEMAIL;PREF;INTERNET:richard.nantel@videotron.caREV:19980514T133343ZEND:VCARD ------=_NextPart_000_0001_01BDCE7E.482F4320-- from fbcwin@fsbnet.com Sun Aug 23 10:09:17 1998 0500 Subject: Re: Nodeless info please Richard,Although I haven't built nodeless, to get a good understanding of theprocess, try the tips, tools, and faq's section of Jerry's webpage at:http://home1.gte.net/jfoster/index.htm. Look for the info from ChrisBogart andHans Kohl. The information you will find there is second to none. Youmightalso look at Bruce Conner's FAQ, although the url escapes me right now. (Thereis a link from Jerry's page.)Hope this helps,Harry Boyd Richard Nantel wrote: Can anyone point me in the right direction to get information aboutnodelessconstruction? The two books I own (Cattanach's and Howell's) don't coverthis. I like the idea of heating the 18-inch strips in my own oven insteadof building a long oven. Thanks Richard Nantelrichard.nantel@videotron.ca ------------------------------------------------------------ Richard Nantel (E-mail) VOICE:(514) 393-3292Le groupe MENTOR Richard Nantel (E-mail)VOICE:(514) 393-3292 Le groupe MENTOR4374 Old Orchard Avenue Home Voice: (514) 485-2287Monteal Voice Pager: [1] (514) 111-1111Quebec Work Fax: (514) 393- 1483H4A 3B4CanadaAdditional Information:Version 2.1Last Name NantelFirst NameRichardLabel Work4374 Old Orchard Avenue Monteal, Quebec H4A 3B4 CanadaLabel Home4374 Old Orchard Avenue Monteal, Quebec H4A 3B4 CanadaRevision 19980514T133343Z from jourdoktorn@pilot.stjarntv.se Sun Aug 23 10:12:12 1998 with ESMTP id AAA63FB for ;Sun, 23 Aug 1998 17:08:13 +0200 Subject: Re: Heavy Leonards Johan,in the 1920 to 1935 W. Mills & Son catalog the H.L. Leonard Salmon rod noA,16' is present. In the 1941 catalog it is gone. Because I miss thecatalogsin between I can not tell exactly when it dissapears. The rods were allmade inthree pieces, had an extra tip, and solid metall reel seat, with the pat.reellock and with cork handle grasps. from 1920 they were furnished witheitherregular rod rings or snake rings but in the 1933 catalog they all had snakerings. 1920 tips were put in a hollow bamboo case but later in the 1933theywere put in strong aluminium cases only. The entire rod was thendelivered in aquality bag.Hope this helpsJan Nystrom, Sweden Johan Nygaardsvold wrote: A friend of mine, the German rodbuilder Wolfram Schott, recently boughta16' Leonard rod at an auction in Germany. He believes the rod is from the1920's. I promised him to search for any information about Leonardsbetween14' and 16' long. If anyone has any knowledge concerning these rod, Iwouldbe very grateful. Johan from cbogart@shentel.net Sun Aug 23 10:17:13 1998 head.globalcom.net (8.6.12/8.6.10) with SMTP id LAA23720; Sun, 23 Aug199811:17:09 -0400 Subject: Re: Nodeless info please Richard Go to the Rodmakers homepage (http://home1.gte.net/jfoster and gottoTips, Tools, and FAQ's and you will find my articles on it. I am in theprocess upupdatingthe article with a lot more pictures to be included in a PDF file. Chris On Sun, 23 Aug 1998 10:10:37 -0400, Richard Nantel wrote: Can anyone point me in the right direction to get information aboutnodelessconstruction? The two books I own (Cattanach's and Howell's) don't coverthis. I like the idea of heating the 18-inch strips in my own oven insteadof building a long oven. Thanks Richard Nantelrichard.nantel@videotron.ca Regards Chris from MasjC1@aol.com Sun Aug 23 11:39:38 1998 Subject: Morgan Hand Mill Has anyone had any experience with the Morgan Hand Mill? If so, what arethepros and cons? Thanks. Mark Cole from saltwein@swbell.net Sun Aug 23 12:19:17 1998 gw2adm.rcsntx.swbell.net MAA20882 Subject: Southern Rodmakers Gathering I haven't saved any messages about it because I did not think I would beable to attend. I have since wrangled a few days of annual and will bein Mountain Home on Wednesday. If I have it correct the gathering is at the State Park at Norfork Damon the morning of the first of October. I would appreciate it ifsomeone who has saved the info would respond. Regards, SteveIndependence, MO from rmoon@ida.net Sun Aug 23 12:52:24 1998 Subject: Re: Nodeless info please RichardJohn Dufford of Missoula Mt has one of the best step by step approachesto nodeless existing. John Dufford3021 Queen St.Missoula, MT59801406-549-5382 Call him and talk it over it is worth the price of a phone call. He hasa handout that I think he will give you. Ralph Moon Tell him Ralph sent you,. from fbcwin@fsbnet.com Sun Aug 23 13:11:56 1998 0500 Subject: Re: Southern Rodmakers Gathering Steve,You've got the basics down pat. Below is some more information. Iassume you're familiar with the area, since your from Missouri. If not,I'll be glad to pass further directions along. Hope this helps,Harry Steve wrote: I haven't saved any messages about it because I did not think I would beable to attend. I have since wrangled a few days of annual and will bein Mountain Home on Wednesday. If I have it correct the gathering is at the State Park at Norfork Damon the morning of the first of October. I would appreciate it ifsomeone who has saved the info would respond. Regards, SteveIndependence, MO Below is the original publicity flyer I put out; listsof demonstrations and workshops, and current attendees list--.SOUTHERN BAMBOO RODMAKERS GATHERING A Southern Rodmakers Gathering will be held prior to the SouthernCouncilFederation of Fly Fishers Conclave at Mountain Home, Arkansas, October2-4,1988.This will be an informal gathering held at the Riverside Pavillion ofQuarry State Park on the Norfork River, Thursday October 1, 1988. Plansareto gather 30+ rodmakerstogether, cast each other's rods, hear and see presentations from any andall volunteers, split some culms, plane some strips, demonstrate tools,swapequipment, ask questions,brag, laugh, eat, drink, and fish one of the best trout streams in theworld.All Rodmakers and potential rodmakers should make plans to attend.Bring all your rods and what tools you can carry, and learn from the otherRodmakers present. Ifyou've never built a rod but want to learn more, we would love to have youjoin us.The Pavillion is equipped with a large BBQ pit available to anyone whowants to cook. Bring your own food and drink, or make a quick run to thesmall town of Norfork to eat at one of the cafes.Hopes are that this will be the forerunner of more formal gatherings indays to come. Many talented rodmakers live and work in the SouthernUnitedStates and have littleopportunity to attend similar gatherings in other parts of the country. Byholding this first informal gathering we hope to develop an annual timeandplace for gathering oneweekend each year.All rodmakers planning to attend are asked to register with:Harry Boyd507 Highland StreetWinnsboro, LA 71295e-mail (fbcwin@fsbnet.com)(318)435-4359 - days(318)435-2278 - eveningsOnly those registered will be eligible for door prizes. Harold and Eileen Demarest of Charles H. Demarest, Inc., the premierimporters of fine Tonkin Cane for Rodbuilding, will share an informativepresentation on their adventuresin securing Bamboo from China. Other demonstrations include: The MorganHandMill by Bill Lamberson, The George Barnes/Tom Smithwick plane ironsharpening method by Harry Boyd, Making your own ferrules by Leo Eck, Anassemble your own scraper workshop by Kurt Loup, A demo on making yourownforms, binders, and necessary tools by Tony Spezio, and Richard Tyree willdo a demonstration on some of his veryinnovative ideas for rodmaking tools. Any maker interested in giving apresentation or demonstrating any area of bamboo rodmaking, pleasecontactHarry Boyd at address above. Attendee list as of August 23Harry Boyd, Kurt Loup, Tony Spezio, Bill Lamberson, Don Laurenza, RickCrenshaw, Jody Titone, Jerry Ballard, John Cole, Eric Koehler, Harold andEileen Demarest, RichardTyree, Dan Cooney, Terry Kirkpatrick, Barry Ericson, Ralph Quinn, Leo Eck,Jim Freeman, Jim Hatfield, Skip Schorb, Steve Saltwein, and possiblyScottWilson, Terry Finger, and Mark Hallowell and others as the list continuestogrow! from fiveside@net-gate.com Sun Aug 23 18:11:01 1998 ns1.net-gate.com (8.8.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id TAA11756 for Subject: 193 Stress Curves To the List,Had occasion last week to fish a bit with Tom Smithwick's 193 copy, aniceexperience indeed. Got my rodmaker's juices flowing. But of course minemustbe a one piece nodeless five strip model so I fired up Histand's softwaretomake the conversion and to look at stresses. What I found was thatGarrison's 193 is a near perfect match for a wt 3 line for 50 foot casts.Everett must have been a heck of a good caster. When I ran the sameprogram verycomfortable. What is it they say? - distance lends enchantment _ it alsoadds stress pretty quick. Thought this might be of interest to somebodyoutthere. Bill from maxs@geocities.co.jp Sun Aug 23 21:08:28 1998 (3.2) Subject: Re: Where is Christian? Andy, I am living in Japan. I'd like to help you but it is difficult withouta little more information aboutthe Christian. Though it's not sure that I can help you actually,please give me some other info.about him, if you know.Is Christian name of the person? Is he a flyfisher or rodmaker? Wherehe lives, Tokyo, Osaka? Do you remember full name?I would try to search Yellow book or consult to NT&T phone directory ifI could have full name and the name of city.Thanks,Max Andy Royer wrote: Hello! Does anyone have an idea of Christian's(the American who lives inJapan) location? I met him at the conclave in Idaho Falls and have losthiscontact information. Any help at all would be greatly appreciated. Thank You,Angel RoyerThe Bamboo Brokerbamboo@w-link.net(206) 935-4414 ph(206) 935-5515 fax from bobbo@buffnet.net Sun Aug 23 21:16:54 1998 bybuffnet4.buffnet.net (8.8.7/8.7.3) with SMTP id WAA23987 for buffnet9.buffnet.net viasmap (V2.0) Subject: Re: Morgan Hand Mill No, but I got the brochure and it looks pretty neat. I read that PerBrandin demoed it at the Corbett Lodge meeting. It was in "The BambooFlyrod" issue 3.BobAt 12:38 PM 8/23/98 EDT, you wrote:Has anyone had any experience with the Morgan Hand Mill? If so, what arethepros and cons? Thanks. Mark Cole -----------------------------Bob Maulucci218 Wallace Ave.Buffalo, New York 14216716-836-8297 http://www.buffnet.net/~bobbo/welcome.htm "Establish a better reputation for honesty in your home community; thenyouwont have to bring in dead fish to prove that your not a liar." - KennethReid from sjstill@iquest.net Sun Aug 23 21:28:08 1998 0000 (209.43.48.214) Subject: Where is Christian? answer Here is his e-mail. But I think he is still stateside. hokkaido_flyfisher@YAHOO.COM HTH, SteveSteve and Julie StillabowerIndianapolis, INsjstill@iquest.net from bobbo@buffnet.net Sun Aug 23 23:19:26 1998 bybuffnet4.buffnet.net (8.8.7/8.7.3) with SMTP id AAA04522 for via smap(V2.0) Subject: Handmill There are many items about the Handmill in the May 98 archives, includinganexplanation by Mr. Morgan. . I scrolled through using the "find" (ctrl F)function.Good luck,Bob from destinycon@mindspring.com Mon Aug 24 06:57:50 1998 Subject: Re: Where is Christian? Andy,Mr. Christian ThalackerMatsugae 2-6-30 Otaru047-002 Hokkaido Japan Otaru University of CommerceInternational Center #253Midori 3-5-21 Otaru047 Hokkaido Japan http://members.tripod.com/~Nijimasu/0.html This was correct as June 98. Hope it helps.Gary H. At 07:16 PM 8/22/98 -0700, you wrote:Hello! Does anyone have an idea of Christian's(the American who lives inJapan) location? I met him at the conclave in Idaho Falls and have losthiscontact information. Any help at all would be greatly appreciated. Thank You,Angel RoyerThe Bamboo Brokerbamboo@w-link.net(206) 935-4414 ph(206) 935-5515 fax from jlintvet@clarityconnect.com Mon Aug 24 09:54:11 1998 mail.clarityconnect.com with SMTP (Eudora Internet Mail Server 2.2b4);Mon, 24Aug 1998 11:01:53 -0400 Subject: Test TestJon Lintvet140 East Spencer StreetIthaca, NY 14850(800) 836- 7558(607) 277-4510 http://www.clarityconnect.com/webpages4/jlintvet/ from SalarFly@aol.com Mon Aug 24 10:07:00 1998 Subject: Re: Morgan Hand Mill In a message dated 8/23/98 7:19:03 PM Pacific Daylight Time,bobbo@buffnet.netwrites: No, but I got the brochure and it looks pretty neat. I read that PerBrandin demoed it at the Corbett Lodge meeting. It was in "The BambooFlyrod" issue 3. It was in the "New Products" column. Stay tuned for an in depthfull evaluation in the BFR Magazine. Darryl from jlintvet@clarityconnect.com Mon Aug 24 13:42:20 1998 mail.clarityconnect.com with SMTP (Eudora Internet Mail Server 2.2b4);Mon, 24Aug 1998 14:50:21 -0400 Subject: Silk Order More Details Regarding the Java Beige #5115 3oz 6/0 silk order, I have received orders for 32 spools. As most of you know I only have space for about 23. So here are the options. Either I notify the first 23 people orders and say sorry to the rest of you all, or I can encourage you all to order more than one spool and tell everyone you know off the list about the order. If we could get a bit closer to a 60 spool order I would be very happy. Take care, and I will let everyone know, either way by Wed. morning. I would like to have it done for Roscoe. Jon Lintvet140 East Spencer StreetIthaca, NY 14850(800) 836-7558(607) 277-4510 http://www.clarityconnect.com/webpages4/jlintvet/ from dmanders@ccinet.ab.ca Mon Aug 24 13:59:37 1998 Subject: Re: Morgan Hand Mill At 11:05 24/08/98 EDT, you wrote:In a message dated 8/23/98 7:19:03 PM Pacific Daylight Time,bobbo@buffnet.netwrites: No, but I got the brochure and it looks pretty neat. I read that PerBrandin demoed it at the Corbett Lodge meeting. It was in "The BambooFlyrod" issue 3. The Morgan Hand mill was demonstrated @ the Merritt get-together. Tomobviously spent a lot of time thinking about the best way to create bamboostrips without using a true hand plane. Tom's extensive bamboo experiencewas reflected in the quality of the strips that came off the mill. Theworkmanship on the mill was excellent. As Darryl says - wait for the review. Hope the review is done by someoneexperienced enough to comment on the qualities of the mill. Don from r.schiller@worldnet.att.net Mon Aug 24 15:35:56 1998 (InterMail v03.02.03 118 118 102) with SMTP +0000 Subject: Nickel Silver tubing boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000E_01BDCF7D.2CD72200" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000E_01BDCF7D.2CD72200 Several weeks ago someone placed a note on the list saying that someone= Could that person please send me the name and phone number of the =seller. I mistakenly erased the address message from my files before I had a =chance to reply. (Not to bright a move, eh) Dick ShillerCrestwood KY ------=_NextPart_000_000E_01BDCF7D.2CD72200 Several weeks agosomeone = Could that person please= name and phone number of the seller. I mistakenly erased the= from my files before I had a chance to reply. (Not to bright a = eh) DickShillerCrestwood =KY ------=_NextPart_000_000E_01BDCF7D.2CD72200-- from brookside.rod@juno.com Mon Aug 24 17:16:58 1998 18:16:35 EDT Subject: Re: Silk Order More Details If you're lookimg for more volume for this silk order you may put me down Gary Dabrowski _____________________________________________________________________You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e- mail.Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.comOr call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654- 5866] from mevans@acxiom.com Mon Aug 24 17:29:17 1998 Exchange ServerInternet Mail Connector Version 4.0.996.62) Aug 199817:24:56 -0500 Subject: Mentoring Advice for a Beginner 4.0.996.62 RAA05036 To anyone who'd like to respond: After reading a Krieder's book on rod building - which I understand to be a bit out of date - I think I'm about to jump head long into bamboo rod making - and stay there! I am an absolute beginner - a serious wannabe! So I'd like to ask the question: Looking back to your day at square one, what advice would you now pass on to someone wanting to get started? Anything is fair game: I'm not quite sure what questions to ask, below are some starters. (In addition to being pointed to some books, I am looking forward to collecting your advice ...). ˜ Should you find a mentor(s) to help you get started?˜ Recommended sources? - Classes/workshops, books, folks who liketo share their knowledge, etc?˜ How to choose your first tapers when you have no idea which will produce the action you want!?˜ Common beginner's mistakes to avoid - and how to do so?˜ If you're a reasonably skilled woodworker, is it a good idea to build your own jigs for wrapping, etc? Are plans available?˜ What are your recommended approaches to setting up shop. - What is in the list of essential equipment; any advice on obtaining effective tools without sacrificing the kid's Christmas? (maybe the wife's Easter dress can go.) e.g. Do you need to spend top dollar on planes or learn how to tune a Stanley. Recommendations one specific tools and/or sources of supply? What do you need to know before purchasing you first cane? Morgan's Mill? Worth the investment?˜ How best to try out different types of bamboo rods to best understand what you want to do? (I live in central Arkansas and don't have the luxury of local shops marketing bamboo rods.)˜ Etc. Any info you have to share is greatly appreciated. I hope to meet several of you at the Southern Rodmaker's Gathering in October. Mark Evans from cmj@post11.tele.dk Mon Aug 24 18:05:16 1998 (InterMail v4.0 217-106) with SMTP +0200 Subject: Sv: Mentoring Advice for a Beginner