Subject: Re: Re: St. Wayne A.J.,Your advice has always been to the point.I consider the loss of Wayne,SirD ,Reed , and, yes, Terry A. to leave a large hole in this listSadly,Hank from FISHWOOL@aol.com Fri Oct 9 09:30:38 1998 Subject: Re: Blackening Guide Feet Chris,I tried this a while back and the black did run-unfortunately I don'tremember the make of permanent marker I used.Hank. from mweber@icscorp.com Fri Oct 9 09:35:50 1998 mgmt-server1.icscorp.com(EMWAC SMTPRS 0.83) with SMTP id ;Fri, 09 Oct 1998 10:29:25 -0400 10:38:39 -0400 Subject: RE: Sanding Blanks =_NextPart_000_01BDF370.F9F1C4E0" ------ =_NextPart_000_01BDF370.F9F1C4E0 It may not be a conventional, or an historically acceptable method, but =I plane down the enamel side of my strips flat just before final =dimensions are reached. This creates a very interesting look to the =cane, and after a couple dozen rods, have seen no detrimental effects to =performance or function. And no fractures or failures. Removing the =enamel and .001 of the outside power fibers does not adversely effect =the overall strength of my rods, IHMO, and allows for a very clean, =sharp edge finish. Remember, there are no rules, only guidelines and history. Have fun. Mike -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Sanding Blanks I think I recall the late Sir D mentioning that he even planed the face =ofrods ... Iank At 02:02 AM 9/10/98 GMT, you wrote:A while back we discussed the pro's and con's of sanding old blanks to = clean them up or alter the taper some. ... some of you with more historical knowledge know to be true, or was it = flippant statement made without any real basis since the book is a = general overview of the entire realm of fishing, and not specific to = rod making. Chris, I've been told that the old timers did, indeed, sand to tune. =I'd love So far most of my rods have come out very fast, but not very pleasant =to cast. I got some good hints at the SRG. Onward. Ian Kearney phone 0064 03 5445556104 Champion Road Fax 0064 03 5440374 New Zealand email inak@ts.co.nz ------ =_NextPart_000_01BDF370.F9F1C4E0 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------ =_NextPart_000_01BDF370.F9F1C4E0-- from mevans@acxiom.com Fri Oct 9 09:54:14 1998 Exchange ServerInternet Mail Connector Version 4.0.996.62) Oct 199809:57:53 -0500 Subject: RE: SRG 4.0.996.62 Harry, Wayne, and all presenters deserve a great thanks for the SRG. It was a very selfless effort which happened at no small expense from some who put it together (particularly Harry) - and to came off very well. As a wannabe, I was very pleased to be warmly greeted by a group of highly congenial and highly skilled craftsmen. Everyone present seemed to remember their 'day' at the beginning of this craft and were very generous and open with their time and knowledge. This all may have been said Monday (my mail was suspended) - but these men deserve our thanks and support for a job well done. I'm looking forward to this as an annual event. Mark Evans---------- Subject: SRG Thanks Preacher Harry.You threw one heck of a party. I hope I can make it again. It was greatfun. I'm bad at names so just let me say that EVERYONE I met were great.Pilots, preachers, Gunsmiths, bamboo importers and all the rest. from Tenn,La., Ark., Ill., and Mo. (Wasn't someone there from TEXAS? Can't forget them!)I'm sure I left someone out. What a great bunch of guys, you got togetherHarry. Of course, the boys from the frozen north had a little troublenavigating when the compass finally thawed out.And I picked up a14 Trout, late Sunday evening, just at the end of ageneration cycle, on the North Fork. On Bamboo. Terry "Sunfish" KirkpatrickSafety Harbor, Fl.(Old Tampa Bay)sats@gte.net from sjstill@iquest.net Fri Oct 9 09:56:45 1998 0000 (209.43.55.197) Subject: 60* router bits I got one from Woodcraft supply last week. Seems decent. About 22.00 orso. Usual disclaimers apply. I believe Woodcraft has a website too www.woodcraft.com That you can order online from. Again, standard disclaimer applies! Steve Steve and Julie Stillabower, Indianapolis, INsjstill@iquest.net from sjstill@iquest.net Fri Oct 9 10:02:04 1998 0000 (209.43.55.197) Subject: 60* bit - addendum It was a Whiteside 60* vee-groove bit from Woodcraft. Steve Steve and Julie Stillabower, Indianapolis, INsjstill@iquest.net from AAARPTRADEUSA@webtv.net Fri Oct 9 10:21:29 1998 101.iap.bryant.webtv.net (8.8.8/ms.gso.08Dec97) with 101.iap.bryant.webtv.net(8.8.8/mt.gso.26Feb98) id IAA19943; Fri, 9 Oct 1998 08:21:27 -0700 ETAsAhRIPi9r/fluJ8W4cMkI7QVvqTCdlAIUfAVyoCAaw3OZU5WoudnrHnUcg3I= Subject: Re: Old broken antique flyrods and other old hex wood deepsea &steelrods Thanks Ian and members,I've spent some time in New Zealand, never had time to fish though. Idid fish off Bora Bora however. I have several hundred old antque rodsand reels. As a kid (13), I'm now 56. I was the junior crew member ona deep sea sport fishing boat in Boynton Beach, Florida. I tiedhundreds of baits for the tourist charters and for other skippers in the50's. I'd wash the blood from the cockpit, clean up the equipment andput it away, wash off the boat, put up with the drunks, customer'sbarfing on each other, fights, trying to earn some fish mountingcommissions, etc. I tied pins, ballyhoo, mullet, bonito striped custom baits with my owncustoms, a few white split seagull feathers and a thin long piece ofyellow yarn and a thin red shiny cloth (18") from my mom's sewing stuff.I'd attach it to the leader and it was ugly but a killer. I made lures from pennies I'd have a train run over. Drill two holes, polish them upbright and tie two hooks end for end with thin strips of waxed papermilk carton I'd color yellow ... another cheap killer lure for mahi andkings. (both surface skippers on the outriggers or with the deepweighted baits.) Three minutes off the south jetty and we'd get sailfish strikes andhookups. I have many five gallon pails full of old salt and fresh waterfishing lures (many still in boxes) and old classic cane (hex) rods withover and under jeweled (ruby) eyes in stainless mounts. I also havemany old steel fishing rods that are fun to look at. I even have afishing pole with two separate reels and rigs. I guess you cast one wayout and then fish the other line from the side of your boat. It's crazybut kinda neat. Somebody's great idea many years ago. ha! All mystuff is so disorganized and a mess. My old personal rod repair equipment is made from felt covered wood andbearings and pulleys ...nothing, high tech..... just clamps andwingnuts, etc. I repaired broken wood rod tips, (I used hardwood minidowels and 2 part weldwood glues. They never broke in the same placeand would still flex OK. I did guides, butts, etc., for myself andfriends for free, but never making new rods. I just thought aboutgetting into this again as a hobby. I have too many hobbies now .......so what's one more, right? I've been able to shoot a very small shotweight into a tire pretty good with a flyrod I have. I try to use the10:00 and 2:00 movement but I end up using 10, 2, 10 ,2 and then finishwith a big 3, 8 to throw the weight far. I read where this pro canthrow a weight very far with control just using his arm as the flyrod.I hit my mark OK but I like to end up with a bigger final arc. I'm justa beginner. I've had a home in St Thomas, USVI now for 26 years and some guys wouldfish for marlin with flyrods off the north shore out of Red Hook. Idon't know how they did with their rig busting fish. I'm surprisedsomeone hasn't gone after a 900 lb tuna off the tip of Long Island witha flyrod. Maybe they have by now!? That's about it or now. Nicetalking with you guys. Thanks, John from michael@wugate.wustl.edu Fri Oct 9 10:29:51 1998 Subject: 60 degree router bits Ralph sayeth...Sears used to sell a 60 degree router bit. I bought a couple a longtime ago, but I don't know if they are currently available I got one at the local Woodcraft. 60 degree router bits is one of those things you rarely use, so...if anyoneis near the country's navel, aka St. Louis, and needs one, you're welcometo come by and borrow mine. Mike - wishing it was 60 degrees...burrrr, sure was chilly this morning - BiondoSt. Louis, MO from rdonnely@webtv.net Fri Oct 9 11:04:45 1998 111.iap.bryant.webtv.net (8.8.8/ms.gso.08Dec97) with 111.iap.bryant.webtv.net(8.8.8/mt.gso.26Feb98) id JAA24688; Fri, 9 Oct 1998 09:04:43 -0700 ETAtAhQYlExS9367yPpymhQ8yWwRKDEQSQIVAJo/DDbH7jhjP+OrRYMWPr34wXBJ Subject: Grooving Plane Wish to purchase a new Record plane. My thought was to mill a groove inthe sole using my vertical mill. Is that practical. If so what depthand width of groove. Ray from jcole10@juno.com Fri Oct 9 12:14:52 1998 13:14:46 EDT Subject: Re: Wooden planing forms -Reply On Fri, 09 Oct 1998 09:16:53 -0400 RON WILHELMwrites:John; It would be a great help if you could provide a source for your 60 degreerouter bit. I have had some trouble in locating one. Any info would beappreciated. Thanks Ron Wilhelm 60 degree router bits can be found at Eagle America 1-800-872-2511John Cole from FISHWOOL@aol.com Fri Oct 9 12:44:24 1998 Subject: Re: RE: Sanding Blanks I, too, have planed and/or sanded the enamel side with no discernableadverseaffects on the rods. Rgards,Hank. from chris@artistree.com Fri Oct 9 13:05:16 1998 LAA26758 Subject: Dirty Little Secrets (Blacking Guides) Hmmmm....O.K....since we are sharing our dirty little secrets I gotanother one for you. While practicing Max's method of straightening tipsections with an iron I accidentally discovered how to do a "controlledburn."It then occurred to me (after a few swear words) that by using the iron onit's highest setting you are able to simulate a flaming pattern to theindividual strips of a section. Works real nice for restoration work. I'lltell ya, these "irons" make even me look like I know what I'm doing!!! :-)--Best Regards, Chris Wohlfordemail: chris@artistree.com Mike Biondo wrote: Actually, since my main wrap color was a dark green, I also took a greensharpie to the guide feet to mask my sometime (oftentimes!) less thangreatwrap job. I'll tell ya, these Sharpies make even me look like I know whatI'm doing!!! :-) Mike - pass the Sharpie - BiondoSt. Louis, MO from LambersonW@missouri.edu Fri Oct 9 13:22:26 1998 (5.5.2232.9) Subject: pressing nodes It seems that irons are becoming a popular rodmaking tool. Has any triedusing an iron to flatten nodes while preparing strips? Bill LambersonColumbia, MO from dhaftel@att.com Fri Oct 9 13:28:04 1998 sender att.com!dhaftel (att.com!dhaftel); Fri Oct 9 13:28 CDT 1998 8.6/EMS-1.2sol2) (5.5.2232.9) Subject: RE: pressing nodes Sounds like a good idea... Set for linen and press hard! I'm going to try that one! Thanks... Dennis Haftel -----Original Message-----From: Lamberson, William R. [SMTP:LambersonW@missouri.edu]Sent: Friday, October 09, 1998 2:22 PM Subject: pressing nodes It seems that irons are becoming a popular rodmaking tool. Has any triedusing an iron to flatten nodes while preparing strips? Bill LambersonColumbia, MO from chris@artistree.com Fri Oct 9 13:28:30 1998 Subject: Re: Old broken antique flyrods and other old hex wood deepsea &steelrods Steven,Although I don't consider myself a restoration expert I would personallyuse the URAC 185 glue instead of the epoxy to glue up the strips. Epoxywasn't used then and URAC might not have been either (could be hide oranimal glue) but I have had very good luck using URAC to bring back olddelaminated rods.--Best Regards, Chris Wohlfordemail: chris@artistree.com p.s.- I should point out a con of URAC (although I consider it a pro) andthat is if you do choose to use URAC you must learn to work quickly andcalmly as it sets up fast. By keeping the glue refrigerated before mixingparts together and by keeping it on ice after mixing it together you cangain extra working time. Dr. Steven A. Weiss wrote: How does one begin to secure the strips, align them, select the glue,properly bind the glued rod for the proper and fishable repair anybreaks in individual strips, etc.? Do you align and glue (epoxy) andthen refinish? from CALucker@aol.com Fri Oct 9 13:38:18 1998 Subject: Re: Granger Reelseat I have a spare Goodwin Granger NS slide band seat. The band has a slighttear, perhaps 1/16th of an inch on the reel foot side. That's why the seatisa spare. Please contact me if you need. I have no internal uplocking Granger stuff,nor do I have W/M Granger. Chris Lucker from Canerods@aol.com Fri Oct 9 14:13:24 1998 Subject: Terminal ISP problems All, I guess my Flyfisher@cmix.com address has gone south for ever - anymessages The ISP guy won't return my calls. IT all started when my bank got boughtoutand the C.C. account # changed so the monthly automatic ISP billingstoppedworking. I updated the account info online in the ISP databank, but I got a post thatthe billing was going to the old C.C. #. Efforts to fix this billing errorseem in vain - the SYSOP is never there and I won't leave my C.C. # on ananswering machine. %$#$%$$%^% Please repost any posts to me @ -----> Canerods@aol.com Sorry for the wasted bandwidth, Don Burns PS - I will try to get a post out to anyone in my old Flyfisher@cmix.comaddress book, but meanwhile I'm looking for a new (and completelystafted)ISP. from FlyTyr@southshore.com Fri Oct 9 14:52:59 1998 (8.8.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id OAA04558 for ;Fri, 9 Oct1998 14:54:10 -0500 Subject: Re: Planing form material Rich,Would it be too much trouble to send them to me,Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com Rich Jezioro wrote: I have some digitized photos of Al's binder taken at Grayling. Contact meoffthe list if you want them. Rich Jezioro At 03:45 PM 9/21/98 -0400, you wrote:Mark, Someone told me Al Port may have a PIC or two. If so maybe Al couldsendthemor post them for all to see. ThanksBob VRobert Venneri'sCustom Components21 Chuck Hill RdSaugerties NY 12477914 246 5882 *________________________________)// Rich Jezioro@ /||/______/_||_________________________________________||/\/ \ > > / \ > from iank@nelson.planet.org.nz Fri Oct 9 14:56:46 1998 ; Sat, 10 Oct 1998 07:56:46 +1200 Subject: Re: Dirty Little Secrets (Blacking Guides) Chris , I understood there are certain tools which are not designed to be used bymales . These include washing machines , dish washers, mops, irons , andmost models of vacunm cleaners . It is my understanding that if these areused by males then disaster is sure to result and it is just not worth therisk. There is a model of vacumn cleaner which can be used in the workshop butitis not the same model as the house model . When I used the house model inthe work shop I had this pointed out to me in rather strong terms beSWMBOas the house model tends to be blocked by bamboo shavings , screws, etc ,and it also eats any special "bits" you have put aside for future use. However it seems that I may now have to look for a male model iron forusein the workshop . I would not dear to use the house model after hearing ofyour experience . Iank At 11:13 AM 9/10/98 -0800, you wrote:Hmmmm....O.K....since we are sharing our dirty little secrets I gotanother one for you. While practicing Max's method of straightening tipsections with an iron I accidentally discovered how to do a "controlledburn."It then occurred to me (after a few swear words) that by using the irononit's highest setting you are able to simulate a flaming pattern to theindividual strips of a section. Works real nice for restoration work. I'lltell ya, these "irons" make even me look like I know what I'm doing!!! :-)--Best Regards, Chris Wohlfordemail: chris@artistree.com Mike Biondo wrote: Actually, since my main wrap color was a dark green, I also took agreensharpie to the guide feet to mask my sometime (oftentimes!) less thangreatwrap job. I'll tell ya, these Sharpies make even me look like I knowwhatI'm doing!!! :-) Mike - pass the Sharpie - BiondoSt. Louis, MO Ian Kearney phone 0064 03 5445556104 Champion Road Fax 0064 03 5440374Richmond New Zealand email inak@ts.co.nz from AAARPTRADEUSA@webtv.net Fri Oct 9 15:01:04 1998 102.iap.bryant.webtv.net (8.8.8/ms.gso.08Dec97) with 102.iap.bryant.webtv.net(8.8.8/mt.gso.26Feb98) id NAA13031; Fri, 9 Oct 1998 13:01:02 -0700 ETAtAhQjWVxcKvxzRwwUd8qiz14QkJ8/igIVAMDjM5Hd5aN5s1R9sVS+aoSTunt/ Subject: Value of antique rods, reels, lures, etc. Hello rodmakers,Is there a website that would give the names of antique flyrods andpoles to check their value? My dad's old flyrods "might" be rare and Idon't know it. They might be junk too. Some he bought with his bestbuddy, Doc Wood from Europe. Are there any special places the famousflyrod makers left their "marks" etc.? Some had old masonic emblems. I don't know the value of old rods, reels and antique wooden lures. Ihave more than 500 of them. Last year I went to take violin lessons onmy dad's antique violin just to learn. I had played 3 seasons in thesymphony with him on trumpet. Anyway, the shop's owner said he wouldgive me $2,000 cash for it as is. I thought it was worth maybe $400based on what my mom had told me, but I told him "No".. Anyway, the violin was a rare Austrian and French design made by afamous violin maker. I spent $500 just to have it preserved and reglued violin and equally rare bow was valued up to $122,000 as is in theoriginal wood case. I learned my lesson and was very lucky I didn'tdump it for $400!! You might have a rare flyrod and don't even know it. A TV program said people in the hills of Tennessee and northernMississippi may well be drinking from coffee cups from this onemanufacturer that are worth over $200 each that look like old cupspurchased from a 5 & 10 cent store in the 40's. I love old fishingpoles but don't know much about "properly" restoring them and I'm tryingto learn more. Thanks, John from richard.nantel@videotron.ca Fri Oct 9 15:02:03 1998 (modemcable70.173.mmtl.videotron.net) sims.3.5.1998.07.14.10.43)with SMTP id for Subject: RE: Planing form material I'd like to see them too. I don't have your e-mail to contact you off thelist, Rich. Thanks Richardrchard.nantel@videotron.ca -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Planing form material Rich,Would it be too much trouble to send them to me,Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com Rich Jezioro wrote: I have some digitized photos of Al's binder taken at Grayling. Contact meoffthe list if you want them. Rich Jezioro At 03:45 PM 9/21/98 -0400, you wrote:Mark, Someone told me Al Port may have a PIC or two. If so maybe Al couldsendthemor post them for all to see. ThanksBob VRobert Venneri'sCustom Components21 Chuck Hill RdSaugerties NY 12477914 246 5882 *________________________________)// Rich Jezioro@ /||/______/_||_________________________________________||/\/ \ > > / \ > from FlyTyr@southshore.com Fri Oct 9 15:12:00 1998 (8.8.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id PAA04914 for ;Fri, 9 Oct1998 15:13:18 -0500 Subject: Re: Planing form material Sorry,This was ment to be off list.Tony Tony Spezio wrote: Rich,Would it be too much trouble to send them to me,Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com Rich Jezioro wrote: I have some digitized photos of Al's binder taken at Grayling. Contactme offthe list if you want them. Rich Jezioro At 03:45 PM 9/21/98 -0400, you wrote:Mark, Someone told me Al Port may have a PIC or two. If so maybe Al couldsendthemor post them for all to see. ThanksBob VRobert Venneri'sCustom Components21 Chuck Hill RdSaugerties NY 12477914 246 5882 *________________________________)// Rich Jezioro@ /||/______/_||_________________________________________||/\/ \ > > > / \ > from dhaftel@att.com Fri Oct 9 15:29:36 1998 sender att.com!dhaftel (att.com!dhaftel); Fri Oct 9 16:20 EDT 1998 8.6/EMS-1.2sol2) (5.5.2232.9) Subject: RE: Dirty Little Secrets (Blacking Guides) Ian, If only I had this explanation for my last girlfriend!! We'd probably havesplit sooner!! Dennis (Still rolling on the floor) Haftel -----Original Message-----From: Ian Kearney [SMTP:iank@nelson.planet.org.nz]Sent: Friday, October 09, 1998 3:57 PM Subject: Re: Dirty Little Secrets (Blacking Guides) Chris , I understood there are certain tools which are not designed to be usedbymales . These include washing machines , dish washers, mops, irons , andmost models of vacunm cleaners . It is my understanding that if theseareused by males then disaster is sure to result and it is just not worth therisk. There is a model of vacumn cleaner which can be used in the workshopbutitis not the same model as the house model . When I used the house modelinthe work shop I had this pointed out to me in rather strong terms beSWMBOas the house model tends to be blocked by bamboo shavings , screws, etc,and it also eats any special "bits" you have put aside for future use. However it seems that I may now have to look for a male model iron forusein the workshop . I would not dear to use the house model after hearingofyour experience . Iank At 11:13 AM 9/10/98 -0800, you wrote:Hmmmm....O.K....since we are sharing our dirty little secrets Igotanother one for you. While practicing Max's method of straightening tipsections with an iron I accidentally discovered how to do a "controlledburn."It then occurred to me (after a few swear words) that by using the irononit's highest setting you are able to simulate a flaming pattern to theindividual strips of a section. Works real nice for restoration work.I'lltell ya, these "irons" make even me look like I know what I'm doing!!!:-)--Best Regards, Chris Wohlfordemail: chris@artistree.com Mike Biondo wrote: Actually, since my main wrap color was a dark green, I also took agreensharpie to the guide feet to mask my sometime (oftentimes!) less thangreatwrap job. I'll tell ya, these Sharpies make even me look like I knowwhatI'm doing!!! :-) Mike - pass the Sharpie - BiondoSt. Louis, MO Ian Kearney phone 0064 03 5445556104 Champion Road Fax 0064 03 5440374Richmond New Zealand email inak@ts.co.nz from mcdowellc@lanecc.edu Fri Oct 9 15:37:34 1998 via smap(4.1) Subject: RE: Value of antique rods, reels, lures, etc. John, I've searched around off and on for bamboo rod sites. I've not yet seen any that were devoted to identifying and appraising. The best bet for a fair appraisal is probably by one of the dealers like Dick Spurr, Bob Corsetti, Len Codella, and others. Michael Sinclair's book "Bamboo Rod Restoration Handbook" deals primarily with the more common productiontype rods frequently encountered in the U.S. I've personally never seen fly rods with Masonic symbols and script so don't know what that is all about unless they were made by a less known rodmaker. If you have specific names or labels of the makers written on the rod somewhere and can relay specific names to the list, someone might know something about them. If they are unmarked it is much more difficult to patterns, ferrule style, reelseat and grip style, guide style, node spacing make identification easy if it was a more common company or maker. With the number of rods you have it would probably be best to contact one of the experts listed above. This site is dedicated to the buying and selling of antique tackle, primarily lures and reels. Whether you will get an honest answer to a value question is debatable based on some of the conversations and posts I've seen their in recent times. You'll need to be prepared to give full detailed descriptions and condition. Give more weight to those that post to the list with a name rather than privately. http://www.streamside.com/chat/antchat.html Chris McDowellmcdowellc@lanecc.edu from 76250.1771@compuserve.com Fri Oct 9 15:52:39 1998 Subject: Payne 204 Taper Don-The following is the Payne 204 taper I have. The rod was measured overvarnish and the rod was either overvarnished or had been badly redonebecause there were some drips in the varnish. The rod was miced by JohnChanner and posted to the list back in Feb. as an 81/2 Payne. John and Ie-mailed back and forth and finally came to the conclusion that it was a204.1 = .068, 5 = .090, 10 = .109, 15 = .129, 20 = .138, 25 = .150, 30 = .160, 32.5 @ ferrule wrap =.168, 35 = .182, 40 = .201, 45 = .218, 50 = .232, 55 = .242, 60 = .256, 64.75 just above the ferrule wrap =.262, 70 = .282, 75 = .294, 80 = .312, 85 = .327, 90 = .358start hookeeper wrap @ 92. Guides 4.5, 9.5, 15.5, 22.5, 29.75, 36.75, 43.5,52, 61, 70.5, 79.5.If the tip and mid taper resembles your 204 then you can probably use thebutt #'s. Hope this helps. Best Dennis from 76250.1771@compuserve.com Fri Oct 9 15:52:47 1998 Subject: Granger Tapers Chrs-The 9' Granger guide spacing I have is 6 3/8, 12 5/8, 20 1/4, 28 1/4, 361/2 butts to tip ferrule, 40 3/8 butts to mid ferrule, 50, 61 1/2, 74 1/8butts to mid ferrule, 83 (stripper). This is from a 1930's Granger Special. Regards Dennis from dr_matro@cyberramp.net Fri Oct 9 15:56:05 1998 ESMTP idPAA03528 Subject: Re: Dirty Little Secrets (Blacking Guides) Ian I remember a guy walking into the fastener company I worked for andwanted 100 ice skate blade retaining screws. I told him that ice skateblade retaining screws were going for $1.50 each, but I could sell him100 4-40 X1/4 slotted brass flathead machine screws for $5. Thedifference-the name. What you want is a thermal tonkin alignment hand unit, which is the samething as a portable ski waxer. Ken from andrew_harsanyi@ibi.com Fri Oct 9 15:57:59 1998 0400 Subject: Re[2]: Dirty Little Secrets (Blacking Guides) The trick I learned with the vaccuum cleaner is to get one that's soPOWERFUL that it doesn't matter if screws or bamboo are involved. The nasty thingthough is that with all that power now I actually LIKE to vaccuum and it hasbecome oneof my house responsibilities....oh well...Andy ______________________________ Reply Separator_________________________________Subject: RE: Dirty Little Secrets (Blacking Guides) Author: at Tcpgate Ian, If only I had this explanation for my last girlfriend!! We'd probably havesplit sooner!! Dennis (Still rolling on the floor) Haftel -----Original Message-----From: Ian Kearney [SMTP:iank@nelson.planet.org.nz]Sent: Friday, October 09, 1998 3:57 PM Subject: Re: Dirty Little Secrets (Blacking Guides) Chris , I understood there are certain tools which are not designed to be usedbymales . These include washing machines , dish washers, mops, irons , andmost models of vacunm cleaners . It is my understanding that if theseareused by males then disaster is sure to result and it is just not worth therisk. There is a model of vacumn cleaner which can be used in the workshopbutitis not the same model as the house model . When I used the house modelinthe work shop I had this pointed out to me in rather strong terms beSWMBOas the house model tends to be blocked by bamboo shavings , screws, etc,and it also eats any special "bits" you have put aside for future use. However it seems that I may now have to look for a male model iron forusein the workshop . I would not dear to use the house model after hearingofyour experience . Iank At 11:13 AM 9/10/98 -0800, you wrote:Hmmmm....O.K....since we are sharing our dirty little secrets Igotanother one for you. While practicing Max's method of straightening tipsections with an iron I accidentally discovered how to do a "controlledburn."It then occurred to me (after a few swear words) that by using the irononit's highest setting you are able to simulate a flaming pattern to theindividual strips of a section. Works real nice for restoration work.I'lltell ya, these "irons" make even me look like I know what I'm doing!!!:-)--Best Regards, Chris Wohlfordemail: chris@artistree.com Mike Biondo wrote: Actually, since my main wrap color was a dark green, I also took agreensharpie to the guide feet to mask my sometime (oftentimes!) less thangreatwrap job. I'll tell ya, these Sharpies make even me look like I knowwhatI'm doing!!! :-) Mike - pass the Sharpie - BiondoSt. Louis, MO Ian Kearney phone 0064 03 5445556104 Champion Road Fax 0064 03 5440374Richmond New Zealand email inak@ts.co.nz from chris@artistree.com Fri Oct 9 16:30:46 1998 OAA18162 Subject: Re: Dirty Little Secrets (Blacking Guides) A "Thermal Tonkin Alignment Hand Unit!!!"Now I'm rolling around on the floor. Geeez...you guys. Chris Wohlfordemail: chris@artistree.com Ken Cole wrote: Ian I remember a guy walking into the fastener company I worked for andwanted 100 ice skate blade retaining screws. I told him that ice skateblade retaining screws were going for $1.50 each, but I could sell him100 4-40 X1/4 slotted brass flathead machine screws for $5. Thedifference-the name. What you want is a thermal tonkin alignment hand unit, which is thesamething as a portable ski waxer. Ken from robert.kope@MCI2000.com Fri Oct 9 16:35:37 1998 with SMTP id forrodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu; Fri, 9 Oct 1998 21:34:59 +0000 (GMT) Subject: Re: pressing nodes That's the method that Sir D uses. Check the archives. He uses the iron toheat a flat steel plate and then presses the strips between the iron andtheplate. Says it takes about 1 minute per strip to flatten and straighten thenodes. I tried it, but didn't feel that I could get the nodes as straight as withthe heat gun/vise method. However, that may just be me. If Sir D recommends it, I tend to believe. Iused his splitting method and got 24 strips from the butt section and 32 from the tip section on my second culm. All but 2 of the tip strips wereuseable, and those 2 were ruined by splintering when I split the culm inhalf, not because of any lack of control using Darryl's splitting method. -- Robert Kope -----Original Message----- Subject: pressing nodes It seems that irons are becoming a popular rodmaking tool. Has any triedusing an iron to flatten nodes while preparing strips? Bill LambersonColumbia, MO from chris@artistree.com Fri Oct 9 16:39:20 1998 OAA19155 Subject: Re: Granger Tapers Dennis, Thanks for your help. :) Chris Wohlfordemail: chris@artistree.com dennis higham wrote: Chrs-The 9' Granger guide spacing I have is 6 3/8, 12 5/8, 20 1/4, 28 1/4,361/2 butts to tip ferrule, 40 3/8 butts to mid ferrule, 50, 61 1/2, 74 1/8butts to mid ferrule, 83 (stripper). This is from a 1930's GrangerSpecial. from jaquin@netsync.net Fri Oct 9 16:54:58 1998 quartz.netsync.net(8.8.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id RAA23258 for ;Fri, 9 Oct1998 17:54:55 -0400 Subject: Re: Wooden planing forms -Reply RON WILHELM wrote: John; It would be a great help if you could provide a source for your 60 degreerouter bit. I have had some trouble in locating one. Any info would beappreciated. Thanks Ron Wilhelmron, i just ordered one from trendlines. however, i left the catalog atwork so can't get you phone # etc. till monday night. maybe someoneelse on the list will respond wih the info. from WILHELM.RON@epamail.epa.gov Fri Oct 9 16:56:53 1998 10 #26439)with SMTP id forrodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu; withNovell_GroupWise; Fri, 09 Oct 1998 17:56:21 -0400 Subject: RE: Wooden planing forms -Reply -Reply Richard; Thanks for the help. Lee Valley has the 60* v groove in stock at a fairprice. Thanks to those who replied.. Steve, Mike, Ralph and John. Ron from cbogart@shentel.net Fri Oct 9 17:04:16 1998 Subject: Smithwick EZ Binder Plans To All: I have now posted Tom's plans for his EZ Binder to my web siteon the tollpageunder his smiling face using it. The file is a reasonable sized PDF file thatprints out justfine and is easy to read. Regards Chris from k5vkq@ix.netcom.com Fri Oct 9 17:37:00 1998 17:36:19 ix14.ix.netcom.comvia smap (V1.3) Subject: Re: Dirty Little Secrets (Blacking Guides) There is an iron that may interest some of you. It is a small iron used toput iron-on covering on model airplanes. It is about 4 inches long with afoot long handle attached. You can get them at most hobby stores andwww.towerhobbies.com. Regards,mOnisk5vkq@ix.netcom.com However it seems that I may now have to look for a male model iron forusein the workshop . I would not dear to use the house model after hearing ofyour experience . from maxs@geocities.co.jp Fri Oct 9 17:42:18 1998 geocities.co.jp (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA00258 for; Sat, 10 Oct 1998 07:42:13 +0900 (JST) Subject: Re: pressing nodes Lamberson, William R. wrote: It seems that irons are becoming a popular rodmaking tool. Has any triedusing an iron to flatten nodes while preparing strips? Bill LambersonColumbia, MO I tried it while final planing. While planing, sometimes a straignennode calls back its memory and return to the original dog leg. I putthe triangle section in the groove of planing form (placed a littlenarrower position to have the sections surface above the edge of plane)and press it by iron oneach side of three flats. It also works. I have not tried to flatten nodes while it is not planed.Looking at the Wayne's video, he showed us to use a steel vise to pressthe nodes of split cane after heating. I guess iron also may work ifboth side of the node are filed flat beforehand since iron is theheater and presser (press power is a little weak in this case). My friend told me that though steel vise can flatten the node part, itwill allow the entire section to have slow bend becasue of its shortspan of control. His recommendation is to try to use a vise which has alonger span such as wood (or steel) plates are attached by screws at theboth of side faces of the vise. I am thinking to try steam iron (a feature of recent clothes iron) whenflatten the nodes next time. If it works, the moisture problem will be cleared since we will put itin oven later. Micro wave oven may also be used for heat treatment of nodelesssections. Has someone tried this? Soon we may be working at kitchen. Max-- Max Satohan Oriental Bamboo Fly Rod Crafteremail:maxs@geocities.co.jpHome Page:http://members.tripod.com/~maxrod/index.html from channer@hubwest.com Fri Oct 9 18:44:01 1998 (SMTPD32-4.02c) id A0151C5D0148; Fri, 09 Oct 1998 17:45:25 MDT Subject: Re: 60 degree router bits At 10:30 AM 10/9/98 -0500, you wrote:Ralph sayeth...Sears used to sell a 60 degree router bit. I bought a couple a longtime ago, but I don't know if they are currently available I got one at the local Woodcraft. 60 degree router bits is one of those things you rarely use, so...if anyoneis near the country's navel, aka St. Louis, and needs one, you're welcometo come by and borrow mine. Mike - wishing it was 60 degrees...burrrr, sure was chilly this morning - BiondoSt. Louis, MO Mike;Poor guy. Its been below 20 at my house in the morning for the last weeandbelow 30 for 2 weeks.The good part is that it is generally 60 or better by10 a.m. and even in the winter, if the sun is out it is nice.John(lovin it in Durango) Channer from channer@hubwest.com Fri Oct 9 18:44:16 1998 (SMTPD32-4.02c) id A0241C5E0148; Fri, 09 Oct 1998 17:45:40 MDT Subject: Re: Payne 204 Taper At 04:48 PM 10/9/98 -0400, you wrote:Don-The following is the Payne 204 taper I have. The rod was measured overvarnish and the rod was either overvarnished or had been badly redonebecause there were some drips in the varnish. The rod was miced by JohnChanner and posted to the list back in Feb. as an 81/2 Payne. John and Ie-mailed back and forth and finally came to the conclusion that it was a204.1 = .068, 5 = .090, 10 = .109, 15 = .129, 20 = .138, 25 = .150, 30 = .160, 32.5 @ ferrule wrap =.168, 35 = .182, 40 = .201, 45 = .218, 50 = .232, 55 = .242, 60 = .256, 64.75 just above the ferrule wrap =.262, 70 = .282, 75 = .294, 80 = .312, 85 = .327, 90 = .358start hookeeper wrap @ 92. Guides 4.5, 9.5, 15.5, 22.5, 29.75, 36.75, 43.5,52, 61, 70.5, 79.5.If the tip and mid taper resembles your 204 then you can probably use thebutt #'s. Hope this helps. Best Dennis Dennis;I thought that model number looked familiar, but I wasn't sure where I hadseen it, it was in my own files all the time. Sorry Don, I could have givenyou the numbers you needed sooner. Is bad short term memory at 46 a signofimpending Alzheimer's? John Channer from jimgentz@earthlink.net Fri Oct 9 18:54:35 1998 Subject: Re: pressing nodes robert.kope wrote: That's the method that Sir D uses. Check the archives. He uses the irontoheat a flat steel plate and then presses the strips between the iron andtheplate. Says it takes about 1 minute per strip to flatten and straightenthenodes. I tried it, but didn't feel that I could get the nodes as straight as withthe heat gun/vise method. However, that may just be me. If Sir D recommends it, I tend to believe. Iused his splitting method and got 24 strips from the butt section and 32 from the tip section on my second culm. All but 2 of the tip strips wereuseable, and those 2 were ruined by splintering when I split the culm inhalf, not because of any lack of control using Darryl's splitting method. -- Robert Kope -----Original Message-----From: Lamberson, William R. Date: Friday, October 09, 1998 11:27 AMSubject: pressing nodes It seems that irons are becoming a popular rodmaking tool. Has anytriedusing an iron to flatten nodes while preparing strips? Bill LambersonColumbia, MOI' sure appreciate it if I could see another post or an E-Mail on Darylssplitting method. Thanks, Jim from richard.nantel@videotron.ca Fri Oct 9 19:55:35 1998 (modemcable70.173.mmtl.videotron.net) sims.3.5.1998.07.14.10.43)with SMTP id for Subject: Lost everything BOUNDARY="Boundary_(ID_SUH4LE1QBCJpiyY7FgZu0A)" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --Boundary_(ID_SUH4LE1QBCJpiyY7FgZu0A) BOUNDARY="Boundary_(ID_/WT1+bqe3t8E7gX6dWRe5g)" --Boundary_(ID_/WT1+bqe3t8E7gX6dWRe5g) I've lost everything in my Microsoft Outlook PST file (past e-mails,addresses, phone numbers, you name it). Could someone please repostDarryl'salterations to Wayne's 7 ft 4 weight taper? Many thanks Richard --Boundary_(ID_/WT1+bqe3t8E7gX6dWRe5g) lost everything in my Microsoft Outlook PST file (past e-mails, = numbers, you name it). Could someone please repost Darryl's alterations = Wayne's 7 ft 4 weight taper? thanks Richard --Boundary_(ID_/WT1+bqe3t8E7gX6dWRe5g)-- --Boundary_(ID_SUH4LE1QBCJpiyY7FgZu0A) mail).vcf" BEGIN:VCARDVERSION:2.1N:Nantel;Richard;;;FN:Richard Nantel (E-mail)ORG:Le groupe MENTOR;TITLE:TEL;WORK;VOICE:(514) 393- 3292TEL;HOME;VOICE:(514) 485-2287TEL;PAGER;VOICE:[1] (514) 111- 1111TEL;WORK;FAX:(514) 393-1483ADR;WORK:;;4374 Old Orchard Avenue;Monteal;Quebec;H4A 3B4;CanadaLABEL;WORK;ENCODING=3DQUOTED- PRINTABLE:4374 Old Orchard =Avenue=3D0D=3D0AMonteal, Quebec H4A 3B4=3D0D=3D0ACanadaADR;HOME:;;4374 Old Orchard Avenue;Monteal;Quebec;H4A 3B4;CanadaLABEL;HOME;ENCODING=3DQUOTED- PRINTABLE:4374 Old Orchard =Avenue=3D0D=3D0AMonteal, Quebec H4A 3B4=3D0D=3D0ACanadaEMAIL;PREF;INTERNET:richard.nantel@videotron.caREV:19980514T133343ZEND:VCARD --Boundary_(ID_SUH4LE1QBCJpiyY7FgZu0A)-- from Fallcreek9@aol.com Fri Oct 9 20:02:38 1998 Subject: Re: Old broken antique flyrods and other old hex wood deepsea&steelrods John: That was a very interesting adventure you took us on and muchappreciated. Thank you for sharing you life of fishing the sea with us. Letus know how we can help if you get the urge to split some cane. Best Regards,Richard Tyree from jkallo@midwest.net Fri Oct 9 20:09:58 1998 Subject: Re: Lost everything At 08:38 PM 10/9/98 -0400, you wrote:I've lost everything in my Microsoft Outlook PST file (past e-mails,addresses, phone numbers, you name it). Could someone please repostDarryl's alterations to Wayne's 7 ft 4 weight taper? Many thanks Richard Attachment Converted: "c:\eudora\attach\Richard Nantel(E-mail)6.vcf" Richard,Add .002 to the 5, 10, and 15 measurements of Wayne's rod. I ambuildingone of the two right now (just came in from the shop for a cup of java). Ijust finished the first stage of final planing on the butt, so I'm going tohave to decide which of the two tapers I am gonna use here pretty soon.Oh,life's rough decisions. Joe Joseph S. KalloDpt. of PhilosophySouthern Illinois University at Carbondale from panlone@cinci.infi.net Fri Oct 9 20:34:58 1998 Subject: RE: Smithwick EZ Binder Plans What is the address of your web page? To All: I have now posted Tom's plans for his EZ Binder to my web site on the toll pageunder his smiling face using it. The file is a reasonable sized PDF file that prints out justfine and is easy to read. Regards Chris from FlyTyr@southshore.com Fri Oct 9 20:37:37 1998 natco.southshore.com (8.8.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id UAA10729 for; Fri, 9 Oct 1998 20:38:56 -0500 Subject: Re: Smithwick EZ Binder Plans Chris,Would post your URL for us new comers.Thanks Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com cbogart wrote: To All: I have now posted Tom's plans for his EZ Binder to my web site onthetoll pageunder his smiling face using it. The file is a reasonable sized PDF filethatprints out justfine and is easy to read. Regards Chris from Collins@uniserve.com Fri Oct 9 20:52:57 1998 Subject: Binder boundary="=====================_908009651==_" --=====================_908009651==_ Gentlemen, I'm new to this hobby/past time/passion of rod binding. Since Ihave read a lot of the past archives I certainly feel a little like anewbie broken record saying, I have bought Garrison, Howell and the bestofthe planing form as well as cane from Demerest. I have finished my binderand I am in the process of making a Sir D rod. I have attached a low resolution JPG picture of my binder to this E-mail.But since I have not seen any such attachments on the list I hope it makesout with this message. If not E-mail me directly and I will send it to youoff the list. The binder construction is interesting as the wheels are made out of MDFboard. I know this sounds weird, being compressed sawdust and all, buttheywork great. I made them on my old Atlas lathe, but a drill press or routercould be used. (this stuff is quit soft) There are two tricks here. Thefirst is using UHMD plastic for the center bearing part of the wheel. Ibought 1 1/2" UHMD plastic rod from the local plastic shop and used it forthe centers of the wheels. (Delrin or glass filled nylon would also work.)The second trick is to coat the wheels with epoxy when they are finished.Iuse Z-POXY FINISHING RESIN (my favorite glue in my pre-rod buildinghobbies) The finishing resin sinks in to the MDF and forms a very hard andtough surface. This binder has a hand crank in the front and a double back wheel so thatit can also work with a sewing machine motor. This binder is modeled of a picture I saw on the internet once and I havenever been able to find again. So if I stole your design please accept myforgiveness. If you would like to find out more information drop me a line. Also the Z-POXY is a very thin epoxy with a long drying time. It isavailiable from most large hobby shops. As I said, I use it for a ton ofnon-rod building hobbies. Anyone else had experiance with it? Doug CollinsI'm also interested in hearing from any other Canadian rod builders on thewest coast. My splitting could sure use some work and any options toreducecross border charges would be greatfully accepted. (My first three culmsmake a lie-Nielsen plane look cheap!)--=====================_908009651==_ x-mac-type="4A504547"; x-mac-creator="4A565752" 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--=====================_908009651==_ --=====================_908009651==_-- from jaquin@netsync.net Fri Oct 9 21:12:04 1998 quartz.netsync.net (8.8.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id WAA12147 for; Fri, 9 Oct 1998 22:12:03 -0400 Subject: Re: pressing nodes JIM GENTZ wrote: robert.kope wrote: That's the method that Sir D uses. Check the archives. He uses the irontoheat a flat steel plate and then presses the strips between the iron andtheplate. Says it takes about 1 minute per strip to flatten and straightenthenodes. I tried it, but didn't feel that I could get the nodes as straight as withthe heat gun/vise method. However, that may just be me. If Sir D recommends it, I tend tobelieve. Iused his splitting method and got 24 strips from the butt section and32 from the tip section on my second culm. All but 2 of the tip stripswereuseable, and those 2 were ruined by splintering when I split the culm inhalf, not because of any lack of control using Darryl's splitting method. -- Robert Kope -----Original Message-----From: Lamberson, William R. Date: Friday, October 09, 1998 11:27 AMSubject: pressing nodes It seems that irons are becoming a popular rodmaking tool. Has anytriedusing an iron to flatten nodes while preparing strips? Bill LambersonColumbia, MOI' sure appreciate it if I could see another post or an E-Mail on Darylssplitting method. Thanks, Jimi would like to see the e-mail on the splitting method also. thanks jerry from jaquin@netsync.net Fri Oct 9 21:13:07 1998 quartz.netsync.net (8.8.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id WAA12242 for; Fri, 9 Oct 1998 22:13:07 -0400 Subject: Re: Lost everything Richard Nantel wrote: I've lost everything in my Microsoft Outlook PST file (past e-mails,addresses, phone numbers, you name it). Could someone please repostDarryl's alterations to Wayne's 7 ft 4 weight taper? Many thanks Richard Name: Richard Nantel (E-mail).vcfPart 1.2 Type: unspecified type (application/octet-stream)Encoding: quoted-printablerichard, add .002 at the 5, 10 & 15 stations jerry from maxs@geocities.co.jp Fri Oct 9 21:20:14 1998 geocities.co.jp (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA12741 for; Sat, 10 Oct 1998 11:20:10 +0900 (JST) Subject: Re: Smithwick EZ Binder Plans Gentlemen, (makers page) then you'll find it. He also posted many useful articles under Tips and archivespage too. Max Tony Spezio wrote: Chris,Would post your URL for us new comers.Thanks Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com cbogart wrote: To All: I have now posted Tom's plans for his EZ Binder to my web site onthetoll pageunder his smiling face using it. The file is a reasonable sized PDF filethatprints out justfine and is easy to read. Regards Chris -- Max Satohan Oriental Bamboo Fly Rod Crafteremail:maxs@geocities.co.jpHome Page:http://members.tripod.com/~maxrod/index.html from ddodd@hrfn.net Fri Oct 9 21:29:09 1998 machine1.hrfn.net(8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id WAA24256 for ;Fri, 9 Oct1998 22:30:02 -0400 Subject: Re: Wayne Cattanach a true gentleman Don, I'm one of the new guys who has decided to fish with only son.The son is moving to Colorado to return to school AND fly fish.He fishes glass now but if I can put together enough smarts in thenext two years, I will hand him his first cane rod when he graduates.I want that rod to be one that I made. I could buy one for him butit would not be the same. This is why I'm in this list ........to listen and learn....and askNewbie Questions. Dave Dodd, ddodd@hrfn.net -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Wayne Cattanach a true gentleman Bret, 100% ditto's from me. Wayne, I've recently returned from a fishing vacation and haven't caughtupwith all the email and don't quite know what the heck is happening, but toWayne (and others too) - thanks for the help and encourgagement. Sorry ifthelist flow doesn't appeal to you anymore. IMHO, if the list is changing it's because the next generation of makersarecoming on-line and they're asking questions that might seem like oldnews.Again, IMHO the greatest thing that the "old-timers" can do for the"younger"set is to hang in there - despite all the "dumb" questions. I for one stillhave a lot of them stored up and unanswered despite not being a memberofthe"youth set" (hit 51 in June) anymore. More than willing to lift a brew (homemade?), or wet a fly, with anyonefromthe list. Don Burns PS - Praying to make Grayrock 99. from maxs@geocities.co.jp Fri Oct 9 21:56:21 1998 geocities.co.jp (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA26986 for; Sat, 10 Oct 1998 11:56:15 +0900 (JST) Subject: Re: Smithwick EZ Binder Plans Sorry, Rodmaker's web is as follows; http://home1.get.net/JFoster/ Max Max Satoh wrote: Gentlemen, (makers page) then you'llfind it. He also posted many useful articles under Tips and archivespage too. Max Tony Spezio wrote: Chris,Would post your URL for us new comers.Thanks Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com cbogart wrote: To All: I have now posted Tom's plans for his EZ Binder to my web siteonthe toll pageunder his smiling face using it. The file is a reasonable sized PDF filethat prints out justfine and is easy to read. Regards Chris --Max Satohan Oriental Bamboo Fly Rod Crafteremail:maxs@geocities.co.jpHome Page:http://members.tripod.com/~maxrod/index.html -- Max Satohan Oriental Bamboo Fly Rod Crafteremail:maxs@geocities.co.jpHome Page:http://members.tripod.com/~maxrod/index.html from richjez@enteract.com Fri Oct 9 22:25:01 1998 0000 Subject: Re: Wooden planing forms -Reply Check out a Blck and Decker store, They have numerous outlet stores. Minewas$6.50Rich At 08:13 AM 10/9/98 -0600, you wrote:Sears used to sell a 60 degree router bit. I bought a couple a longtime ago, but I don't know if they are currently availableRalph Moon *________________________________)// Rich Jezioro @ /||/______/_||_________________________________________|| /\ / \ > > from Canerods@aol.com Fri Oct 9 22:35:17 1998 Subject: RE:Re: Payne 204 Taper In a message dated 10/9/98 4:49:24 PM Pacific Daylight Time,channer@hubwest.com writes: butt #'s. Hope this helps. Best Dennis Dennis;I thought that model number looked familiar, but I wasn't sure where Ihadseen it, it was in my own files all the time. Sorry Don, I could have givenyou the numbers you needed sooner. Is bad short term memory at 46 a signofimpending Alzheimer's? John Channer Dennis (and John), Thanks for the taper. I don't have the sections yet, so I can't match for afew more days. I bought the mid, tip, rodsack and tube for a good price andwould like to add a butt that would match the lost original. I don't want tofool anyone, but it would be nice to have a complete rod. Who's a very goodPayne restorer? Bob Summers? MAybe someone on the list? Please reply ifyoucan do the job. Thanks, Don Burns PS - John, if you've got the big "A" at 46 then do remember to write downinyour will (RIGHT NOW) that all your rods were to go to me. from irish-george@worldnet.att.net Fri Oct 9 23:56:53 1998 (InterMail v03.02.03 118 118 102) with SMTP +0000 Subject: Re: Wooden planing forms -Reply Trendlines owns Post Tools -- so, you can probably get it there as well.(Post Tools seems to sell the entire Trendlines catalog of router bits fromwhat I've seen.) One caveat on Trendlines, it is primarily a marketingcompany, and they seem to think that woodworkers tend to be golfers(anotheritem they market) and put my name on every golf mailing list there is. Ofcourse, I don't play and have no interest in golf. You might want to makeit clear to them whether you do or do not wish to wind up on mailing lists. George Bourke-----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Wooden planing forms -Reply RON WILHELM wrote: John; It would be a great help if you could provide a source for your 60 degreerouter bit. I have had some trouble in locating one. Any info would beappreciated. Thanks Ron Wilhelmron, i just ordered one from trendlines. however, i left the catalog atwork so can't get you phone # etc. till monday night. maybe someoneelse on the list will respond wih the info. from irish-george@worldnet.att.net Sat Oct 10 00:07:47 1998 (InterMail v03.02.03 118 118 102) with SMTP +0000 Subject: Re: Dirty Little Secrets (Blacking Guides) They are made by Seal and sold for photography (tacking irons for tackingdry mount tissue before using the dry mount press). They are also sold byalot of woodworking stores as "edge banding irons" to iron on the self- stickveneer on the edges of wood. Seal makes a couple of different ones, thenicest one has variable temperature and Teflon on the iron surface.Cheapest source I know of (where I bought mine) is B&H Camera in NYC --theyadvertise in all the photo magazines + have a website (don't know theURL). George Bourke All the usual disclaimers, including absolutely no financial interest inwhether you buy this item or a competing item (if one exists) or in whereyou buy it (should you decide to do so).-----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Dirty Little Secrets (Blacking Guides) There is an iron that may interest some of you. It is a small iron used toput iron-on covering on model airplanes. It is about 4 inches long with afoot long handle attached. You can get them at most hobby stores andwww.towerhobbies.com. Regards,mOnisk5vkq@ix.netcom.com However it seems that I may now have to look for a male model iron forusein the workshop . I would not dear to use the house model after hearingofyour experience . from chris@artistree.com Sat Oct 10 01:47:46 1998 XAA16169 Subject: Re: Payne 204 Taper Don,I'm sure there are others out there who can do the job but just a thought.Youmight want to contact Mark at E.F. Payne in Sisters, OR. Phone: (541) 549-1544.Was up at his shop this summer and from talking with him it sounded likehe didrepairs. Really nice guy who did look a bit overworked so it might take awhile.--Best Regards, Chris Wohlfordemail: chris@artistree.com p.s.- All disclaimers apply. Dennis (and John), Thanks for the taper. I don't have the sections yet, so I can't match for afew more days. I bought the mid, tip, rodsack and tube for a good priceandwould like to add a butt that would match the lost original. I don't wanttofool anyone, but it would be nice to have a complete rod. Who's a verygoodPayne restorer? Bob Summers? MAybe someone on the list? Please replyif youcan do the job. Thanks, Don Burns PS - John, if you've got the big "A" at 46 then do remember to write downinyour will (RIGHT NOW) that all your rods were to go to me. from channer@hubwest.com Sat Oct 10 03:17:17 1998 (SMTPD32-4.02c) id A86011CE0150; Sat, 10 Oct 1998 02:18:40 MDT Subject: RE:Re: Payne 204 Taper At 11:34 PM 10/9/98 EDT, you wrote:In a message dated 10/9/98 4:49:24 PM Pacific Daylight Time,channer@hubwest.com writes: butt #'s. Hope this helps. Best Dennis Dennis;I thought that model number looked familiar, but I wasn't sure where Ihadseen it, it was in my own files all the time. Sorry Don, I could have givenyou the numbers you needed sooner. Is bad short term memory at 46 asign ofimpending Alzheimer's? John Channer Dennis (and John), Thanks for the taper. I don't have the sections yet, so I can't match for afew more days. I bought the mid, tip, rodsack and tube for a good priceandwould like to add a butt that would match the lost original. I don't wanttofool anyone, but it would be nice to have a complete rod. Who's a verygoodPayne restorer? Bob Summers? MAybe someone on the list? Please replyif youcan do the job. Thanks, Don Burns PS - John, if you've got the big "A" at 46 then do remember to write downinyour will (RIGHT NOW) that all your rods were to go to me. Don;Sure thing, I'll put it on my list of things not to forget right away.Let's see, 3 rights a left and a right to get to work(don't stop at theriver to fish) 3 lefts a right and a left to get home(don't stop at theriver to fish)and , what was that 3rd thing?John from saltwein@swbell.net Sat Oct 10 06:22:46 1998 gw2adm.rcsntx.swbell.net GAA14203 Subject: Bamboo Fly Rod Magazine Hello All, Is there any more information on the whereabouts of the latest issues? Regards, SteveIndependence, MO from tyoung@perth.dialix.com.au Sat Oct 10 07:23:46 1998 Sat, 10 Oct 1998 20:23:16 +0800 (WST)(envelope- from tyoung) Subject: Re: 60 degree router bits On Fri, 9 Oct 1998, Mike Biondo wrote: Ralph sayeth...Sears used to sell a 60 degree router bit. I bought a couple a longtime ago, but I don't know if they are currently available I got one at the local Woodcraft. 60 degree router bits is one of those things you rarely use, so...if anyoneis near the country's navel, aka St. Louis, and needs one, you're welcometo come by and borrow mine. Mike - wishing it was 60 degrees...burrrr, sure was chilly this morning - BiondoSt. Louis, MO You can use the router bits to make hex shaped rod cases. Just thickness some timber to size then pass them across the router. The angle is milled and all that remains is gluing. The best way to bind the cases is use thin strips of inner tube rubber. Start wraping the case with the rubber and keep going, adding strips as you need. The rubber will create even pressure. Tony /***********************************************************************/Tony Younghttp://www.iinet.net.au/~mainpeak/flyrod.htmlThe Australian connection A computer without windows is like a fish without a bicycle /***********************************************************************/ from tyoung@perth.dialix.com.au Sat Oct 10 07:31:13 1998 Sat, 10 Oct 1998 20:30:44 +0800 (WST)(envelope- from tyoung) Subject: Re: Dirty Little Secrets (Blacking Guides) On Fri, 9 Oct 1998, Onis Cogburn wrote: There is an iron that may interest some of you. It is a small iron used toput iron-on covering on model airplanes. It is about 4 inches long with afoot long handle attached. You can get them at most hobby stores andwww.towerhobbies.com. Regards,mOnisk5vkq@ix.netcom.com As some-one experienced in keeping the little woman happy by giving her lathes, dipping tanks, bluing troughs, mast benches, taking extend sailing trips with open ended return dates so she can mantain her ownspace etc etc I am strongly recomending you all buy this iron and NOT use the domestic model. Using the domestic iron would be the thin edge of the wedge and maycreate marital discord. The domestic iron would certainly do the job, but it isn't *specalised* is it! ;-) Tony /***********************************************************************/Tony Younghttp://www.iinet.net.au/~mainpeak/flyrod.htmlThe Australian connection A computer without windows is like a fish without a bicycle /***********************************************************************/ from cbogart@shentel.net Sat Oct 10 07:45:45 1998 Subject: Re: Smithwick EZ Binder Plans Max Thanks for pointing people in the right direction - I really like peopleto encourage morepeople to use the Rodmakers homepage as a general source of reference - alot ofthe questionspeople ask can be answered using it - especially for info, suppliers,sources, andmakers. I just assumed people were using it or knew to check three. Also I had posed myURL lastweekwith the Medved plans. But here it is (pls bookmark it): http://www.shentel.net/canerodThe plans are linked off the Rodmaking Classes page. I will update mynavigationbar soonand put a direct link to it. Chris On Sat, 10 Oct 1998 11:57:08 +0900, Max Satoh wrote: Sorry, Rodmaker's web is as follows; http://home1.get.net/JFoster/ Max Max Satoh wrote: Gentlemen, (makers page) then you'llfind it. He also posted many useful articles under Tips and archivespage too. Max Tony Spezio wrote: Chris,Would post your URL for us new comers.Thanks Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com cbogart wrote: To All: I have now posted Tom's plans for his EZ Binder to my web siteonthe toll pageunder his smiling face using it. The file is a reasonable sized PDFfilethat prints out justfine and is easy to read. Regards Chris --Max Satohan Oriental Bamboo Fly Rod Crafteremail:maxs@geocities.co.jpHome Page:http://members.tripod.com/~maxrod/index.html -- Max Satohan Oriental Bamboo Fly Rod Crafteremail:maxs@geocities.co.jpHome Page:http://members.tripod.com/~maxrod/index.html Regards Chris from cbogart@shentel.net Sat Oct 10 07:51:39 1998 Subject: Re: Planing form material TonyI have posted pictures of the beveler and the plans (2 different sets)onmy web site - the second set is Al's plans he used to give out but is in the process of updating them with the latest and greatest modifications. check http://www.shentel.net/canerod under the rodmaking class info. BTW- the Al Port pictures are the ones I sent him of Als beveler. Chris On Fri, 09 Oct 1998 13:07:16 -0500, Tony Spezio wrote: Rich,Would it be too much trouble to send them to me,Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com Rich Jezioro wrote: I have some digitized photos of Al's binder taken at Grayling. Contactme offthe list if you want them. Rich Jezioro At 03:45 PM 9/21/98 -0400, you wrote:Mark, Someone told me Al Port may have a PIC or two. If so maybe Al couldsendthemor post them for all to see. ThanksBob VRobert Venneri'sCustom Components21 Chuck Hill RdSaugerties NY 12477914 246 5882 *________________________________)// Rich Jezioro@ /||/______/_||_________________________________________||/\/ \ > > > / \ > Regards Chris from jaquin@netsync.net Sat Oct 10 07:52:04 1998 quartz.netsync.net (8.8.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id IAA04453 for; Sat, 10 Oct 1998 08:52:01 -0400 Subject: Re: Binder Doug & Lynn Collins wrote: Gentlemen, I'm new to this hobby/past time/passion of rod binding. SinceIhave read a lot of the past archives I certainly feel a little like anewbie broken record saying, I have bought Garrison, Howell and the bestofthe planing form as well as cane from Demerest. I have finished mybinderand I am in the process of making a Sir D rod. I have attached a low resolution JPG picture of my binder to this E-mail.But since I have not seen any such attachments on the list I hope itmakesout with this message. If not E-mail me directly and I will send it to youoff the list. The binder construction is interesting as the wheels are made out of MDFboard. I know this sounds weird, being compressed sawdust and all, buttheywork great. I made them on my old Atlas lathe, but a drill press or routercould be used. (this stuff is quit soft) There are two tricks here. Thefirst is using UHMD plastic for the center bearing part of the wheel. Ibought 1 1/2" UHMD plastic rod from the local plastic shop and used itforthe centers of the wheels. (Delrin or glass filled nylon would alsowork.)> The second trick is to coat the wheels with epoxy when they arefinished. Iuse Z-POXY FINISHING RESIN (my favorite glue in my pre-rod buildinghobbies) The finishing resin sinks in to the MDF and forms a very hardandtough surface. This binder has a hand crank in the front and a double back wheel so thatit can also work with a sewing machine motor. This binder is modeled of a picture I saw on the internet once and I havenever been able to find again. So if I stole your design please accept myforgiveness. If you would like to find out more information drop me aline. Also the Z-POXY is a very thin epoxy with a long drying time. It isavailiable from most large hobby shops. As I said, I use it for a ton ofnon-rod building hobbies. Anyone else had experiance with it? Doug CollinsI'm also interested in hearing from any other Canadian rod builders onthewest coast. My splitting could sure use some work and any options toreducecross border charges would be greatfully accepted. (My first three culmsmake a lie-Nielsen plane look cheap!) --------------------------------------------------------------- Name: binder.jpgPart 1.2 Type: JPEG Image (image/jpeg)Encoding: base64 ---------------------------------------------------------------hi doug nice job on the binder!!! from looking at it it appears tobind in both directions at the same time(cross-stitch pattern). am icorrect in this assumption?? from dmcfall@ODYSSEE.NET Sat Oct 10 08:03:52 1998 Subject: Re: Smithwick EZ Binder Plans The correct URL is http://home1.gte.net/JFoster/ Dave M from anglport@con2.com Sat Oct 10 08:18:32 1998 Subject: Re: Planing form material ETC All,It's Art.....ART......Port. I managed to go 53 years as Art (actually, if you want a good laugh it's Arthur Port as in Port, Arthur!) andwith a stroke of his keyboard Bob Venneri rechristens me "Al". It ain'tAL!!!!!I'm presuming that the little anecdote will set it in your mind, butjust for good measure: everybody, Say three times, Art Port, Art Port,Al..er...Art Port. EVERYONE (especially Bob)! Take this in the manner it's intended,have a laugh and CALL ME ART (apologies to Paul Simon),ART BTW, I have the BEVELLER pix but not the binder pix that some arereferringto. I can't figure if they're misstating their requests or if I've sent thewrong pix to a few fellows who asked. Anyone who has trouble gettingbeveller pix, lemme know and I'll fire 'em off. At 08:51 AM 10/10/98 -0400, you wrote:TonyI have posted pictures of the beveler and the plans (2 different sets)onmy web site - the second set is Al's plans he used to give out but is inthe process of updating them with the latest and greatest modifications. check http://www.shentel.net/canerod under the rodmaking class info. BTW- the Al Port pictures are the ones I sent him of Als beveler. Chris On Fri, 09 Oct 1998 13:07:16 -0500, Tony Spezio wrote: Rich,Would it be too much trouble to send them to me,Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com Rich Jezioro wrote: I have some digitized photos of Al's binder taken at Grayling. Contactme offthe list if you want them. Rich Jezioro At 03:45 PM 9/21/98 -0400, you wrote:Mark, Someone told me Al Port may have a PIC or two. If so maybe Al couldsendthemor post them for all to see. ThanksBob VRobert Venneri'sCustom Components21 Chuck Hill RdSaugerties NY 12477914 246 5882 *________________________________)// Rich Jezioro@ /||/______/_||_________________________________________||/\/ \ > > >> / \ > Regards Chris from AAARPTRADEUSA@webtv.net Sat Oct 10 08:47:08 1998 102.iap.bryant.webtv.net (8.8.8/ms.gso.08Dec97) with 102.iap.bryant.webtv.net(8.8.8/mt.gso.26Feb98) id GAA25296; Sat, 10 Oct 1998 06:47:06 -0700 ETAtAhUAh1WmSF4dsZwoh4NCt/8Pg4RNM+wCFFLhQXFFNxrlUFkz7VvbMUfTEl/k Subject: Old what's his name My old Navy buddy was named ALThere's a guy at my church named ALWe have a goof as Vice President named ALMrs. ABAMA named her first son ALThere's a new guy on the rodmakers named AL ......life is funny, choosing your son's first name is now a lost ART. from hokkaido_flyfisher@yahoo.com Sat Oct 10 09:33:57 1998 07:32:57PDT Subject: Re: Bamboo Fly Rod Magazine Steve, It is Christian here in Japan (one of the editors at large). About two weeks ago, I received the May-June issue ... still waiting for the July-August. I spoke with Mark Metcalf (Editor in Chief) in California about a month ago about their "delivery problems". He told me then that the BFRM had problems with their shipper, and were in the process of doing the shipping "in-house". The latest issue should be on its way. Hope this helps. Cheers, Christian ---Steve wrote: Hello All, Is there any more information on the whereabouts of the latest issues? Regards, Steve==Mr. Christian THALACKER Otaru University of CommerceMatsugae 2-6-30 Otaru International Center #253047-0022 Hokkaido JAPAN Midori 3-5-21 Otaru 047 JAPANTel: (81) (134) 22-2671 Tel: (81) (134) 27-5261Fax: (81) (134) 27-5264 http://members.tripod.com/~Nijimasu/0.html_________________________________________________________DO YOU YAHOO!?Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com from gwbarnes@gwi.net Sat Oct 10 10:16:56 1998 Subject: No Telling Where A Casual Comment May Lead While visiting friends in Newcastle, England, I went with my friend topick up a hedge trimmer that he had sharpened. The shop operator had anopen belt drive drill press and I commented it was even older than mine.We both agreed they were still serviceable if you knew their planing forms for cane rods, among other things. There was instantreaction. Seems he is a fly fisherman. Instantly wanted to know if myfriend had taken me to the Hardy plant and museum. That was taken careof the next afternoon, as Alnwick was only 30 miles away. Unfortunatelythe plant tour was held in the morning but the museum was super. A bitdisappointed that the VHS I purchased concentrated more on their reelsthan cane rod construction. Their rods were displayed all assembled andwe were free to flex them. Another misfortune - I'd left my micrometerat home. George Barnes from mbleak@telepath.com Sat Oct 10 11:46:04 1998 telepath.com (8.9.0/8.7.3) with ESMTP id LAA12402 for Subject: Re: Smithwick EZ Binder Plans Thanks so much Chris and Tom for these plans. There are some of us(myself) whofeel the need to haveour hand held and be spoon fed virtually every step of the way.It occurs to me that there may be some unfamiliar with pdf extensions sothis isprovided in the spiritof being helpful. The latest Acrobat reader can be found at:http://www.adobe.com/prodindex/acrobat/readstep.html.I use Netscape and it must be made aware of the new mime type to viewand print.There are variousflavors of netscape but in general you must do the following:Start Netscape. Choose "Options", " General Preferences" and go to the"Helpers"dialog box. Push the"New" button to define a new mime type. Enter Application in the "MimeType" fieldand pdf in the "SubType" field, then push "OK" Now make sure that your new Mime type isselected inthe large list box ofknown types. Once selected, this activates the remaining fields in thisdialogbox. Enter pdf in the"Extensions" field Select the "Launch Application" radio button andfinallyEnterC:\ACROREAD\ACROREAD.EXE (or the path to ACROREAD.EXE you enteredwhen running thesetup utility) inthe "Launch Application" field and push "OK". Note: This is where mostpeople makea big mistake. Whenentering the path to ACROREAD.EXE, make sure you entered the path to theexecutable version, installedduring setup.Many people accidentally enter the path to the temporary downloadedversion!Pdf is an excellent way to convey information through diagram/plans. One lastthing, I have found thatplans are more clear when printed out.Cheers Mike. The Second Coming Turning and turning in the widening gyreThe Falcon cannot hear the falconer:Things fall apart: the centre cannot hold:Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world,The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhereThe ceremony of innocense is drowned:The best lack all conviction, while the worstAre full of passionate intensityW.B.YeatsThis is the best flyfishing listserv bar none and Thank You to all. cbogart wrote: Max Thanks for pointing people in the right direction - I really likepeopleto encourage morepeople to use the Rodmakers homepage as a general source of reference -a lot ofthe questionspeople ask can be answered using it - especially for info, suppliers,sources,and makers. I justassumed people were using it or knew to check three. Also I had posedmy URLlast weekwith the Medved plans. But here it is (pls bookmark it): http://www.shentel.net/canerodThe plans are linked off the Rodmaking Classes page. I will update mynavigationbar soonand put a direct link to it. Chris On Sat, 10 Oct 1998 11:57:08 +0900, Max Satoh wrote: Sorry, Rodmaker's web is as follows; http://home1.get.net/JFoster/ Max Max Satoh wrote: Gentlemen, Yoda(makers page) then you'llfind it. He also posted many useful articles under Tips and archivespage too. Max Tony Spezio wrote: Chris,Would post your URL for us new comers.Thanks Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com cbogart wrote: To All: I have now posted Tom's plans for his EZ Binder to my website onthe toll pageunder his smiling face using it. The file is a reasonable sized PDFfilethat prints out justfine and is easy to read. Regards Chris --Max Satohan Oriental Bamboo Fly Rod Crafteremail:maxs@geocities.co.jpHome Page:http://members.tripod.com/~maxrod/index.html --Max Satohan Oriental Bamboo Fly Rod Crafteremail:maxs@geocities.co.jpHome Page:http://members.tripod.com/~maxrod/index.html Regards Chris from RVenneri@aol.com Sat Oct 10 12:24:56 1998 Subject: Re: Planing form material ETC Sorry I must have had you confused with Art Medved. It will never happenagainyou can bet on that Bob VRobert Venneri's Custom Components21 Chuck Hill RdSaugerties NY 12477914 426 5882rvenneri@aol.com from watson@cape-consult.co.uk Sat Oct 10 14:11:07 1998 (BST) Subject: Nasty Stains! boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0008_01BDF48A.05A670A0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0008_01BDF48A.05A670A0 I am working on an old cane sea rod where the rings had been whipped =with copper wire. Over the years the staining has become quite bad.As I am not using the rod for its original use these satins are visible. =I know that I am unlikely to totally remove them but it would be good to =reduce them a little.I have used Hydrogen Peroxide to 'bleach' stains out of wood in the past =but have never used it on cane.Has anyone else?Any thoughts on how to lessen the stains?Thanks in advanceTim. ------=_NextPart_000_0008_01BDF48A.05A670A0 I am working on an old cane searod = become quite bad.As I am not using the rod for its = these satins are visible. I know that I am unlikely to totally remove = it would be good to reduce them a little.I have used Hydrogen Peroxide to= out of wood in the past but have never used it on cane.Has anyone else?Any thoughts on how to lessen stains?Thanks in advanceTim. ------=_NextPart_000_0008_01BDF48A.05A670A0-- from 76250.1771@compuserve.com Sat Oct 10 16:18:34 1998 Subject: RE: Payne 204 Don-Try Steve Blake, 808 South Pine, Sisters, OR 97759. 503-549- 0110.Steverepairs and restores rods for Len Codella, Marty Keane, etc. He's done tworepairs for me and did a great job, fast and very reasonable. If Stevedoesn't work you could also try Dwight Lyons, 7156 SE 118th Drive,Portland, OR 97226. 503-760-3933....lyons@teleport.com. Dwight's anothermaster restorer.Chris... I thought Dave Holloman had bought the Payne Co. from REC andopened it outside Eugene, OR and then moved to Sisters. Has it sold again? Regards Dennis from channer@hubwest.com Sat Oct 10 17:13:04 1998 (SMTPD32-4.02c) id AC4321A80104; Sat, 10 Oct 1998 16:14:27 MDT Subject: Re: Nasty Stains! At 08:10 PM 10/10/98 +0100, you wrote:I am working on an old cane sea rod where the rings had been whippedwithcopper wire. Over the years the staining has become quite bad.As I am not using the rod for its original use these satins are visible. Iknow that I am unlikely to totally remove them but it would be good toreduce them a little.I have used Hydrogen Peroxide to 'bleach' stains out of wood in the pastbut have never used it on cane.Has anyone else?Any thoughts on how to lessen the stains?Thanks in advanceTim. Attachment Converted: "C:\EUDORA\ATTACH\NastySta.htm" I would like to hear any ideas on this subject myself. I have had severalrods and I have one now with black stains from the guide feet and havebeenwondering if there is any safe way to bleach them out. I would experimentto see if oxalic acid wood bleach or deck brightener works on these stains,but this rod is too good to play with. John Channer from channer@hubwest.com Sat Oct 10 17:14:22 1998 (SMTPD32-4.02c) id AC9221AE0104; Sat, 10 Oct 1998 16:15:46 MDT Subject: Re: Dirty Little Secrets (Blacking Guides) At 08:30 PM 10/10/98 +0800, you wrote:On Fri, 9 Oct 1998, Onis Cogburn wrote: There is an iron that may interest some of you. It is a small iron usedtoput iron-on covering on model airplanes. It is about 4 inches long withafoot long handle attached. You can get them at most hobby stores andwww.towerhobbies.com. Regards,mOnisk5vkq@ix.netcom.com As some-one experienced in keeping the little woman happy by giving her lathes, dipping tanks, bluing troughs, mast benches, taking extend sailing trips with open ended return dates so she can mantain her ownspace etc etc I am strongly recomending you all buy this iron and NOT use the domestic model. Using the domestic iron would be the thin edge of the wedge and maycreate marital discord. The domestic iron would certainly do the job, but it isn't *specalised* is it! ;-) Tony /***********************************************************************/Tony Younghttp://www.iinet.net.au/~mainpeak/flyrod.htmlThe Australian connection A computer without windows is like a fish without a bicycle /***********************************************************************/ Guys;Many years ago I needed to borrow the domestic iron to do some hot meltedge banding for a laminate countertop. When I asked SWMBO if I could usethe iron I was told to take it, get it out of her sight and that she neverwanted to see it again. It has been in the workshop ever since. Just mygood fortune. John Channer from saltwein@swbell.net Sat Oct 10 17:57:56 1998 gw3adm.rcsntx.swbell.net RAA00855 Subject: Upon returning from SRG Hi All, I wanted to share this with you earlier, but there was a lot of hubbubon the list when I got back from Arkansas. Shortly after my brother and I arrived at the house from three days offishing and talking rodmaking, my granddaughter approached me and asked;"Grampa will you take me fishing"? I leaned forward and said, "Honey Iwill take you anywhere you want to go". She immediately realized that nothing was going to happen right away, soshe stepped back from me and spread her arms to take in the whole roomand said, "If anybody wants to take me fishing, my car seat is in mydaddy's car". Naturally we all roared with laughter. She will be three next month. Iwonder if she thinks fishing is like shopping? Regards, SteveIndependence, MO from chris@artistree.com Sat Oct 10 18:52:58 1998 Subject: Re: Payne 204 Dennis,Not sure of the history but Dave Holloman (sorry, original post hadincorrectname) does own the Payne Co. and resides in Sisters OR. Think he told methathe was near Eugene at one time and before that resided in Vermont? Doknowaside from new rods that he had quite a few rods on the bench that were in doingthe Payne metal working forever was still active & supplying parts to him.The original Payne beveler (which is made out of wood) is on display in hislobby and is a neat piece of history. It's not in use anymore as Dave uses amore modern beveler but was told that it does still work and will cutstrips. Not familiar with Steve Blake. I see he also resides in Sisters, wonder ifheworks with Dave on projects or has his own thing going.--Best Regards, Chris Wohlfordemail: chris@artistree.com dennis higham wrote: Don-Try Steve Blake, 808 South Pine, Sisters, OR 97759. 503-549- 0110.Steverepairs and restores rods for Len Codella, Marty Keane, etc. He's donetworepairs for me and did a great job, fast and very reasonable. If Stevedoesn't work you could also try Dwight Lyons, 7156 SE 118th Drive,Portland, OR 97226. 503-760-3933....lyons@teleport.com. Dwight'sanothermaster restorer.Chris... I thought Dave Holloman had bought the Payne Co. from REC andopened it outside Eugene, OR and then moved to Sisters. Has it soldagain? Regards Dennis from sshorb@ozip.net Sat Oct 10 19:01:14 1998 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.2 release 221 ID# 0-55785U1000L100S0V35)with ESMTP id net for ;Sat, 10 Oct 1998 19:01:01 -0500 Subject: Rod identification I have an old cane rod I found in an attic 45 years ago that I wouldlike to identify. It is a 9 ft 3 pc with a red/pink reel seat, lookslike plastic. The ferrules and the rest of the hardware is chromeplated, but it doesn't look like brass, more a dull gray. The ferruleshave a rolled lip and look like they have been pinned and crimped on.The tip has intermediate wraps that are some shade of yellow. The onlyletters on the tiny piece of label left are "A" space "S" or "5" inblack letters on a gold background, just above the letters is whatappears to be a black spincast reel on a red background. The labelappears to have been egg shaped or possibly like a horizon.I don't thinkit's worth much and want to refinish it as I become more involved incane rod construction. Thanks in advance for any information. Skip from robert.kope@MCI2000.com Sat Oct 10 19:21:38 1998 with SMTP id forrodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu; Sun, 11 Oct 1998 00:21:06 +0000 (GMT) Subject: Re: splitting cane (was pressing nodes) Columbia, MOI' sure appreciate it if I could see another post or an E-Mail on Darylssplitting method. Thanks, Jimi would like to see the e-mail on the splitting method also. thanks jerry I'll take a shot at describing the method. There have been a few postingson the subject, but the one that gave the most detail had the methodbackwards I think. I ruined a few strips on my first culm before I got thehang of it. Basically, you split the culm in half, then split the halves into thirds forthe bottom and fourths for the top. Each of the strips you now have willbesplit into quarters. You start a split on the end of a strip, making the two sides as equal asyou can. I recall that Darryl uses a pair of end nippers to start thesplit, but a knife, froe, or meat cleaver will also work. After you startthe split you just split the 2 halves apart using your hands. I grip oneside in each hand and press against the opposite half with each thumb. Youwant to be able to control the rate at which the split travels down thestrip. When the split starts to wander to one side, and it will, it will tend tocontinue toward the thinner side of the split and run off the side of thestrip. The natural tendency is for the split to go toward the side thatbends the most. To bring the split back to the center, you must bend thestrip toward the thicker side of the split. This seemed a littlecounter-intuitive to me because I expected the split to want to gostraight.Pushing toward the thicker side forces the thicker side to bend more andthesplit will go back toward the center. Work your way down the stripkeepingthe split where you can put pressure on it. Once you split a strip in half,repeat the process on each half to make quarters. In order to bend the strip you have to wedge the unsplit end of it so youcan put lateral pressure on it as you're splitting it. Darryl wedges thestrip between a couple of C-clamps that are clamped upside down on thesideof his workbench. I had trouble keeping the strip down when I tried thissoI put a couple of C-clamps with the screws on top about a foot apart andslide the strip through both clamps, between the screw and the back of theclamp. This allows me to put lateral pressure on the strip and I can stillslide it easily as the split travels down the strip. This is the sameprinciple as using a knife or froe clamped in a vise and pushing the thickerside of the split against the side of the blade to bring the split backtoward the center. You press against the thicker side, forcing it to bendmore and the split will travel toward it. The advantage here is that thereare no sharp implements to hurt yourself with while you are splitting. It goes really fast once you get the hang of it, and the real advantage ofsplitting so many strips is not the number of strips, but their size. Withgood control of the splitting process, you can make strips narrower, whichmeans it takes less filing, less time to heat nodes for straightening, lessmaterial to remove in preliminary and final planing - less work ingeneral. -- Robert Kope from Fallcreek9@aol.com Sat Oct 10 19:29:22 1998 Subject: Re: Nasty Stains! In a message dated 10/10/98 2:13:59 PM Central Daylight Time,watson@cape-consult.co.uk writes: Tim: I tried Hydrogen Peroxide full strength on mold stains that hadprogressed thru the bamboo from the inside of the culm to the surface oftheenamel. It had no affect whatsoever on either the mold stains or theenamel. Wishing it had,Richard Tyree from mrbamboo@quik.com Sat Oct 10 20:41:34 1998 Subject: Re: Smithwick EZ Binder Plans If you would like, you can e-mail me the article and plans, and I will postthem on http://www.rodbuilding.com/. Paul Whitely -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Smithwick EZ Binder Plans Max Thanks for pointing people in the right direction - I really like peopleto encourage morepeople to use the Rodmakers homepage as a general source of reference -alot of the questionspeople ask can be answered using it - especially for info, suppliers,sources, and makers. I justassumed people were using it or knew to check three. Also I had posedmyURL last weekwith the Medved plans. But here it is (pls bookmark it):http://www.shentel.net/canerodThe plans are linked off the Rodmaking Classes page. I will update mynavigation bar soonand put a direct link to it. Chris On Sat, 10 Oct 1998 11:57:08 +0900, Max Satoh wrote: Sorry, Rodmaker's web is as follows; http://home1.get.net/JFoster/ Max Max Satoh wrote: Gentlemen, Yoda(makers page) then you'llfind it. He also posted many useful articles under Tips and archivespage too. Max Tony Spezio wrote: Chris,Would post your URL for us new comers.Thanks Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com cbogart wrote: To All: I have now posted Tom's plans for his EZ Binder to my website on the toll pageunder his smiling face using it. The file is a reasonable sized PDFfile that prints out justfine and is easy to read. Regards Chris --Max Satohan Oriental Bamboo Fly Rod Crafteremail:maxs@geocities.co.jpHome Page:http://members.tripod.com/~maxrod/index.html --Max Satohan Oriental Bamboo Fly Rod Crafteremail:maxs@geocities.co.jpHome Page:http://members.tripod.com/~maxrod/index.html Regards Chris from chatterbox@worldnet.att.net Sat Oct 10 21:50:32 1998 (InterMail v03.02.03 118 118 102) with ESMTP +0000 Subject: New England Fly FishingTour What's a MUST see (in the line of fly fishing) while touring NewHampshire,Vermont, and Maine Next week. I've got the museum in Manchester, Vermont on the list. And the Battenkill. Californian -- will be there for the first time. Thanks, RD from ddodd@hrfn.net Sat Oct 10 21:58:14 1998 (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id WAA19359 for ;Sat, 10 Oct1998 22:59:15 -0400 Subject: Re: Dirty Little Secrets (Blacking Guides) This is great.....a "Thermal Tonkin Alignment Hand Unit," or in short... a"TTAHU"is the same as my sons portable GE 1940ish electric iron than he pulls outof hisduffle bag and iron on his ski wax. I would have never known. (By thewas, somelady saw the "iron" and offered him $25.00 for it. It is a rare small,early GE "TravelIron". He still has it. "TTAHU" for real,Dave I remember a guy walking into the fastener company I worked for andwanted 100 ice skate blade retaining screws. I told him that ice skateblade retaining screws were going for $1.50 each, but I could sell him100 4-40 X1/4 slotted brass flathead machine screws for $5. Thedifference-the name. What you want is a thermal tonkin alignment hand unit, which is the samething as a portable ski waxer. Ken from irish-george@worldnet.att.net Sat Oct 10 23:33:55 1998 (InterMail v03.02.03 118 118 102) with SMTP +0000 Subject: Re: Payne 204 You might want to see if Walt Carpenter is still doing restorations...hemayhave built the rod originally at Payne. George Bourke-----Original Message----- Subject: RE: Payne 204 Don-Try Steve Blake, 808 South Pine, Sisters, OR 97759. 503-549- 0110.Steverepairs and restores rods for Len Codella, Marty Keane, etc. He's done tworepairs for me and did a great job, fast and very reasonable. If Stevedoesn't work you could also try Dwight Lyons, 7156 SE 118th Drive,Portland, OR 97226. 503-760-3933....lyons@teleport.com. Dwight'sanothermaster restorer.Chris... I thought Dave Holloman had bought the Payne Co. from REC andopened it outside Eugene, OR and then moved to Sisters. Has it sold again? Regards Dennis from irish-george@worldnet.att.net Sat Oct 10 23:38:28 1998 (InterMail v03.02.03 118 118 102) with SMTP +0000 Subject: Re: Upon returning from SRG Steve - Best fishing story I've heard. George Bourke-----Original Message----- Subject: Upon returning from SRG Hi All, I wanted to share this with you earlier, but there was a lot of hubbubon the list when I got back from Arkansas. Shortly after my brother and I arrived at the house from three days offishing and talking rodmaking, my granddaughter approached me andasked;"Grampa will you take me fishing"? I leaned forward and said, "Honey Iwill take you anywhere you want to go". She immediately realized that nothing was going to happen right away, soshe stepped back from me and spread her arms to take in the whole roomand said, "If anybody wants to take me fishing, my car seat is in mydaddy's car". Naturally we all roared with laughter. She will be three next month. Iwonder if she thinks fishing is like shopping? Regards, SteveIndependence, MO from watson@cape-consult.co.uk Sun Oct 11 03:43:50 1998 (BST) Subject: Re: Nasty Stains! John,I am also in the yachting industry and so thought about a deck brightenertostart with such as TeakBrite - I don't sell it so there is NFI (no financialinterest). I discounted this because all the boats I have worked on theteak brightener has needed plenty of scrubbing along with it - obviouslynotpossible w/o removing the enamel from the sections.I am wondering about Oxalic acid as well - my old text books came up withthis but it is very difficult to find over here (UK).Hope we get an answer on this and help you out at the same timeTim.-----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Nasty Stains! At 08:10 PM 10/10/98 +0100, you wrote:I am working on an old cane sea rod where the rings had been whippedwithcopper wire. Over the years the staining has become quite bad.As I am not using the rod for its original use these satins are visible. Iknow that I am unlikely to totally remove them but it would be good toreduce them a little.I have used Hydrogen Peroxide to 'bleach' stains out of wood in the pastbut have never used it on cane.Has anyone else?Any thoughts on how to lessen the stains?Thanks in advanceTim. Attachment Converted: "C:\EUDORA\ATTACH\NastySta.htm" I would like to hear any ideas on this subject myself. I have had severalrods and I have one now with black stains from the guide feet and havebeenwondering if there is any safe way to bleach them out. I wouldexperimentto see if oxalic acid wood bleach or deck brightener works on thesestains,but this rod is too good to play with. John Channer from watson@cape-consult.co.uk Sun Oct 11 03:48:35 1998 (BST) Subject: Re: Rod identification from the description of the label it sounds like it may be an AllcocksThey had an horizontal oval label with black writing on a gold background.However, the part with the sppincast reel doesn't sound familiar but thenI'm new to this.John Cooper - is this an Allcock variant??Tim.-----Original Message----- Subject: Rod identification I have an old cane rod I found in an attic 45 years ago that I wouldlike to identify. It is a 9 ft 3 pc with a red/pink reel seat, lookslike plastic. The ferrules and the rest of the hardware is chromeplated, but it doesn't look like brass, more a dull gray. The ferruleshave a rolled lip and look like they have been pinned and crimped on.The tip has intermediate wraps that are some shade of yellow. The onlyletters on the tiny piece of label left are "A" space "S" or "5" inblack letters on a gold background, just above the letters is whatappears to be a black spincast reel on a red background. The labelappears to have been egg shaped or possibly like a horizon.I don't thinkit's worth much and want to refinish it as I become more involved incane rod construction. Thanks in advance for any information. Skip from anglport@con2.com Sun Oct 11 06:58:02 1998 Subject: Re: Nasty Stains! Tim,There are "Wood Bleaching Kits" available here in paint stores and I thinkthe active ingredient is oxalic acid. You might be able to find what youneed that way if it's rare to find it alone. Good luck,Art At 09:41 AM 10/11/98 +0100, you wrote:John,I am also in the yachting industry and so thought about a deck brightenertostart with such as TeakBrite I am wondering about Oxalic acid as well - my old text books came upwiththis but it is very difficult to find over here (UK).Hope we get an answer on this and help you out at the same timeTim. from FlyTyr@southshore.com Sun Oct 11 07:04:06 1998 (8.8.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id HAA07207 for ;Sun, 11 Oct1998 07:05:39 - 0500 Subject: Re: Payne 204 About 9 years ago I was up in Vermont at REC rods and got to talking totheowner about bamboo rods. Sorry, I don't remember the name. He took me toa roomthat was loaded with Bamboo culms and machinery.He told me that was all of Jim Payne's tools and bamboo and showed me anapronthat he said was Jim's. At the time I did not appreciate what he wasshowing me.I had heard of Payne rods and had thought of building a bamboo rod afterseeingWayne put on a demo at the Book Fair in Pa. I asked if I could buy a culmand hesold me one for 20.00. After reading up on bamboo rods and seeing nameslikePayne I was wanting to do something special with that cane. I have notsplit ityet, will do after I get at least one rod built. After some medicalproblems, amove to Arkansas, building the necessary tools and a few other thingsover thepast 9 years I am ready to get started. I now have other cane to work withas aresult of the SRG.I had planned to build a Paul Young 6'3" Midge rod but I think I need alongerrod for the river I fish. The White in Arkansas is a big river and we getsomegood wind at times. The fish are pretty fair size and in current, a 4 wt ispretty light. I would like some suggestions and comments from the list.This canbe done off list, as not to take up unnecessary band width. I would alsolike toget some comments on a Payne taper that I can use for the culm that came from hisshop.Thanks,Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com Chris Wohlford wrote: Dennis,Not sure of the history but Dave Holloman (sorry, original post hadincorrectname) does own the Payne Co. and resides in Sisters OR. Think he told methathe was near Eugene at one time and before that resided in Vermont? Doknowaside from new rods that he had quite a few rods on the bench that werein doingthe Payne metal working forever was still active & supplying parts tohim.The original Payne beveler (which is made out of wood) is on display inhislobby and is a neat piece of history. It's not in use anymore as Dave usesamore modern beveler but was told that it does still work and will cutstrips. Not familiar with Steve Blake. I see he also resides in Sisters, wonder ifheworks with Dave on projects or has his own thing going.--Best Regards, Chris Wohlfordemail: chris@artistree.com dennis higham wrote: Don-Try Steve Blake, 808 South Pine, Sisters, OR 97759. 503-549- 0110.Steverepairs and restores rods for Len Codella, Marty Keane, etc. He's donetworepairs for me and did a great job, fast and very reasonable. If Stevedoesn't work you could also try Dwight Lyons, 7156 SE 118th Drive,Portland, OR 97226. 503-760-3933....lyons@teleport.com. Dwight'sanothermaster restorer.Chris... I thought Dave Holloman had bought the Payne Co. from REC andopened it outside Eugene, OR and then moved to Sisters. Has it soldagain? Regards Dennis from channer@hubwest.com Sun Oct 11 07:50:49 1998 (SMTPD32-4.02c) id A9FD83F00E0; Sun, 11 Oct 1998 06:52:13 MDT Subject: Re: Payne 204 At 07:07 AM 10/11/98 -0500, you wrote:About 9 years ago I was up in Vermont at REC rods and got to talking totheowner about bamboo rods. Sorry, I don't remember the name. He took meto aroomthat was loaded with Bamboo culms and machinery.He told me that was all of Jim Payne's tools and bamboo and showed meanapronthat he said was Jim's. At the time I did not appreciate what he wasshowing me.I had heard of Payne rods and had thought of building a bamboo rod afterseeingWayne put on a demo at the Book Fair in Pa. I asked if I could buy a culmand hesold me one for 20.00. After reading up on bamboo rods and seeing nameslikePayne I was wanting to do something special with that cane. I have notsplit ityet, will do after I get at least one rod built. After some medicalproblems, amove to Arkansas, building the necessary tools and a few other thingsoverthepast 9 years I am ready to get started. I now have other cane to workwithas aresult of the SRG.I had planned to build a Paul Young 6'3" Midge rod but I think I need alongerrod for the river I fish. The White in Arkansas is a big river and we getsomegood wind at times. The fish are pretty fair size and in current, a 4 wt ispretty light. I would like some suggestions and comments from the list.This canbe done off list, as not to take up unnecessary band width. I would alsolike toget some comments on a Payne taper that I can use for the culm thatcame from hisshop.Thanks,Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com Tony;The Dickerson 8' 5 wt. is a great casting rod. I haven't made a Payne taperthat size, yet, so I can't recommend one there. I have made the Midge, tho,and it is an exceptional rod, make yourself one when you get a chance, youwon't be sorry. As for fishing a big river with it, I don't think it wouldbe much of a problem, the one I made will throw a line farther than I cancontrol one and has enough backbone to handle most trout. I wish I hadn'tsold it, will have to make one for me as soon as I get a chance. John Channer from TSmithwick@aol.com Sun Oct 11 10:25:42 1998 Subject: RE: Mica Heat Strips In a message dated 10/5/98 3:05:24 PM, you wrote: Dave - Sorry to be so long answering this. I was at Martha's Vineyardgettingmy annual salt water flyfishing fix. This is how I built my oven. TheCalrodunits consist of a thin nichrome element, insulation , and an outer tube ofIncolloy 800. They can be straightened, and will end up about 6 feet long.Youcan use the temperature sensor, and the control from the oven . I builtmineinto a heavily insulated box 7 feet long and 6" square. I run on 120 volts. Ittakes about 10 minutes to warm up, and 10-12 minutes gives me a goodeven heattreat. It works fine, so I haven't changed it. If I wanted something moreelaborate at this point, I would look at fellow listmember Don Anderson'swellthought out design, which I believe was in the Planing Form some monthsago. from jfoster@gte.net Sun Oct 11 11:34:58 1998 Subject: This cannot be Thanks Harry, had a wonderful time WELL, you guys didn't do a very good job of keeping the list stablewhile Mike and I were off fishing...I just got back from my ca., nm.,ark.,co.,wy.,MONTANA,id,or.,ca. little jaunt and what do I find... Wayne and Darryl CAN'T leave AJ we do what we have time for, I know the list also appreciates yourefforts and advise.As for Terry. he hits the list every year, causes some kind of a rukkusand the flee's the scene... not very manly for a manly man, so i havelittle simpathy for his loss.. the most frustrating part of TA'sinvolvement is he has never given one word of advice,support, or otheraid to the beginers with honest questions. they dont need TA to sayfigure it out yourself..We have gotten thin skinned, the water must be too warm.In hope things return to normal jerry Chris, you rascal.. can we have your plans? from jfoster@gte.net Sun Oct 11 13:01:58 1998 Subject: Re: pressing nodes Hi Bill You might try an iron for heating the nodes, or for straightening but idon't think you'll get enough pressure to press nodes with this method.one must screw a vise as tight as one can to effect nodes, and thatdoesn't have a permanent effect in some cases.. regards jerry from jfoster@gte.net Sun Oct 11 13:04:04 1998 Subject: url http://home1.gte.net/jfoster/index.htm if you are looking for the archives.. jer from jkallo@midwest.net Sun Oct 11 14:41:05 1998 Subject: Re: pressing nodes At 11:03 AM 10/11/98 +0000, you wrote:Hi BillYou might try an iron for heating the nodes, or for straightening but idon't think you'll get enough pressure to press nodes with this method.one must screw a vise as tight as one can to effect nodes, and thatdoesn't have a permanent effect in some cases.. regards jerry Hey Jerry, I noticed that sometimes the ol' vice doesn't quite do the trick. Forexample I carefully straightened the nodes on all 12 rough strips, got good60* angles and popped the bound sections in the 1 1/2 iron pipe in whatwasmy first heat treating operation. After an interminable half hour oftorch-waving, I pulled the sections out only to find that EVERY SINGLENODElooked just like it did before I pressed them. I thought of ourconversation outside the fly shop in Mt. Home in which I was bragging thatI straighted a strip without scorching the nodes and to which yourespondedwith a foreboding (I know now) grin and a "the test comes when you heattreat em'". On another note, I found out today that I'll be spending next summerinEureka, so if you find your way up there we should try to wet a line. Ihear the Trinity Alps hold some pretty amazing summer streams. Youmentioned a few other spots when we talked and I have forgotten them all,so if you get a chance let me know what you consider "must fish in n. ca." Joe Joseph S. KalloDpt. of PhilosophySouthern Illinois University at Carbondale from jkallo@midwest.net Sun Oct 11 14:46:56 1998 Subject: sorry about that Sorry for the chat. That was intended for Jerry directly. Joe Joseph S. KalloDpt. of PhilosophySouthern Illinois University at Carbondale from sats@gte.net Sun Oct 11 15:01:45 1998 Subject: Re: The truth of Guide Spacing Russ, Your explanation is very understandable for me.I understood how to position the stripping guide especially by yournote.Thank you very much. Max, An old gentleman, I respected very much suggested 18 in.! from thestripperguide to the center of the reel. On shorter rods this spacing seems to beabout right. On longer rods I find it seems to be to close. It actuallyimpedes casting. on longer rods, I now extend it out to the 28in range. Terry "Sunfish" KirkpatrickSafety Harbor, Fl.(Old Tampa Bay)sats@gte.net from ragnarig@integrityol.com Sun Oct 11 15:28:55 1998 (SMTPD32-4.06) id A7524460084; Sun, 11 Oct 1998 13:38:42 PDT Subject: Cork update OK Gang Here we go. I'm making that order next weekend, so if you want in on it,you'll need to send in your check (MO preferred, but no biggie; I trusty'all) by the weedend. And many thanks to those who sent theirs inalready.Sorry about my absence this past week but I am addicted to volunteeringandI guess we just have to put up with it :-) Just so everybody understands, this is a totally non-profit exercise,although I'm attempting to cut my out-of-pocket expenditure to theminimum,starving student that I am. I wish I could conduct this einsatz as Chris L.did his, but there you go. Also, it's gotten a little bigger than I hadfirst anticipated. The product is 1 1/8 in. cork rings, 1/4 in. hole, 1/2 in. thicknoess, $0.53each. Unless I hear differently, the amount on your check will be deducted$3.00 (unless your order is too big for that to cover) for shipping and therest will go for the above mentioned rings, figuring the 10% tax throughthemagic of al-gebra. If you want their pre-formed grips etc. go to theirwebsite ( http://www.corkgrips.com/email.html ) or catalog and figure itoutlike the rings, adding tax etc. and detail it in your accompanying letter tome. If it doesn't work out on my calculator I'll get ahold of you. Now, the idea behind this thing is to pool everybody's small exploratoryorders into one big economical one and either get a sample so as todetermine whether we wish, individually or collectively, to make bigordersin the future or to try another supplier or whatever. I make no guarantees with no preference toward myself or toward anyone else. I will simplymixthem up good and randomly count out the numbers ordered. If it looks likeaparticular person got an overwhelming number of duds, I will go nutstryingto adjust it all equitably, unless I'm too tired. Then I'll just swap andgive that person mine. Unless they're worse yet. Be advised that I will be informing the supplier as to the precise nature ofour enterprise, so we might get slightly better product than under normalconditions. But then, I think we know who gets their best stuff and wewillneed alot more money on a more regular basis than this order is likely togenerate. That gives me a profound idea but fills me with dread at the of trying to execute it. Might be worth talking about it though. Probablyhave to go visit the people in person, get them dates or something... Nah. To those who have no interest in this venture and resent my taking upbandwidth for it, I offer my humblest apologies, although we all benefit from such things from time to time; and one might keep in mind that alongmilitary career, complete with many sharp blows to the head, has mademesomewhat less responsive to pettiness and criticism than most. Davy Riggs11404 89th Ave. Ct. E.Puyallup, WA 98373 from fbcwin@fsbnet.com Sun Oct 11 16:25:56 1998 0500 Subject: Splicing sections for repair Friends,I'm trying to figure out how to splice two hexagonalsections to extend the broken tip and broken mid sections from an old rod. I've looked at Garrison's and Wayne'sbook, and still can't quite get it straight in my mind.(That's probably the fault of too much fun at the SRG) Idon't want to spend any more money than necessary, as thisrestoration business is NOT going to be a steady diet.Wouldn't have offered to do this one if it didn't belong toa good friend's grandfather. It just doesn't seem nearly assexy as building the entire rod to me.Any suggestions on how best to build a scarfing block Also, does anyone know where I can get some 1" corkrings like were used on inexpensive rods years ago. Thanks in advance,Harry from Canerods@aol.com Sun Oct 11 16:27:29 1998 Subject: Re: Rod identification In a message dated 10/10/98 5:04:34 PM Pacific Daylight Time,sshorb@ozip.netwrites: Skip, This is all pure guessing - The decal might be for a trade rod brand and therefore not much help for silver. If the ferrules aren't serrated then the quality of the rod is inquestion. So look at the cane - is there a node spacing or just ramdom. Ifrandom, then again the quality is in question. The pinning of the ferulesmeans it's not a Granger, IMHO. Same thing if no node spacing pattern.Heddonused random nodes, but didn't crimp their ferrules. So Montague or H-I come to mind. If the female ferrules are bottle shaped (necked) then these two brandsjumpto the forefront. Both used Leonard-style ferrules on their better rods and"bottle" ferrules on the rest. Both used plastic reelseat spacers on theirrods too. Monty used NS ferrules for their better rods, some even hadserrations and were hand-welted and many were rolled-welted. Chromeand Nickelplating was often done too. Plated brass was used for the junk stuff. Thegoldlabel background with black letters "sounds" like a Montague label andMontague labels were oval in shape. So that's my best guess for maker. Don Burns from TSmithwick@aol.com Sun Oct 11 17:27:34 1998 Subject: Re: Splicing sections for repair In a message dated 10/11/98 9:27:34 PM, you wrote: Harry - It's pretty easy. All you need is to have matching 120* grooves inatapered block. I made mine by taking a maple stick and cutting a 60*chamferon one edge. Then I cut it into 4 lengths and glued them up into two blocks.On each block the grooves abut each other, producing the 120* angle. Theblocks are then joined with sliding dowels with the grooves facing eachother.So you now have a block with a groove in it's center. The top of the blockisthen bandsawed to the splice angle in such a way that the groove isintersected by the cut in the center of the block. Smooth up with a planeorbelt sander. I cut the angles with a jointer, but a hand plane is OK. Theangles don't need to be precise, as all the block needs to do is grab thesection. from Canerods@aol.com Sun Oct 11 17:39:26 1998 Subject: Re: Splicing sections for repair In a message dated 10/11/98 2:27:36 PM Pacific Daylight Time,fbcwin@fsbnet.com writes: Harry, You'll lose a few inches from the rod if you don't slice in a new piece. Ifthe rod is a production rod you should be able to find a broken piece to useas a splice. The Garrison splice block works well. The only tricky thing to remember is to measure the section's O.D. at 2pointsand then match these two O.D.'s on the scarf piece. If the break is near oneend or the other, I discard the shorter piece and just scarf a new piece tolonger piece. Double scarfs (splicing in a new piece between the 2 brokenpieces) is much harder because you must end up with the correct finallength,with the single scarf you can cut to length after you finish the scarf. Remember also, that the "skinny" end is the broken end on one piece, whilethe"fat" end of the break is the broken end of the other piece. If you forgetandmeasure in the wrong direction on the new piece to be scarfed to the endthesection will be too thin and also short when you are finished and a lot ofsanding required to hide the scarf joint. (Don't ask - just don't go there) OBTW, I measure each flat-to-flat and average the 3 O.D.'s when measuringaproduction rod. Lot's of +/- "windage" on most of them. I then try to find asecond piece that has the same average, or better yet, the same 3 O.D.'sandmatch O.D. to O.D. as much as possible. Remember measure twice and cutonce. Don Burns from iank@nelson.planet.org.nz Sun Oct 11 19:21:50 1998 ; Mon, 12 Oct 1998 12:21:41 +1200 Subject: Re: Splicing sections for repair Harry, There is a good explanation in Jack Howells book . I have not tried it , butcould understand it ( the pictures help ) whereas I was in a similarposition as you after reading Garrison . It is very similar to Tom's explanation , but with pics , and also explainshow to do the actual join. Iank At 06:26 PM 11/10/98 EDT, you wrote: In a message dated 10/11/98 9:27:34 PM, you wrote: Harry - It's pretty easy. All you need is to have matching 120* grooves inatapered block. I made mine by taking a maple stick and cutting a 60*chamferon one edge. Then I cut it into 4 lengths and glued them up into twoblocks.On each block the grooves abut each other, producing the 120* angle. Theblocks are then joined with sliding dowels with the grooves facing eachother.So you now have a block with a groove in it's center. The top of the blockisthen bandsawed to the splice angle in such a way that the groove isintersected by the cut in the center of the block. Smooth up with a planeorbelt sander. I cut the angles with a jointer, but a hand plane is OK. Theangles don't need to be precise, as all the block needs to do is grab thesection. Ian Kearney phone 0064 03 5445556104 Champion Road Fax 0064 03 5440374Richmond New Zealand email inak@ts.co.nz from sshorb@ozip.net Sun Oct 11 20:06:44 1998 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.2 release 221 ID# 0-55785U1000L100S0V35)with ESMTP id net for ;Sun, 11 Oct 1998 20:06:30 -0500 Subject: Re: Rod identification Don; I went back and looked very closely at the rod again and based on yourreasoning conclude it is very likely a junk Montigue, but it does havethe advantage that it is not broken and will be good for gainingexperience on refinishing. Thanks for your help. Skip from jaquin@netsync.net Sun Oct 11 20:30:46 1998 quartz.netsync.net (8.8.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id VAA28329 for; Sun, 11 Oct 1998 21:30:42 -0400 Subject: Re: Nasty Stains! Art Port wrote: Tim,There are "Wood Bleaching Kits" available here in paint stores and I thinkthe active ingredient is oxalic acid. You might be able to find what youneed that way if it's rare to find it alone. Good luck,Art At 09:41 AM 10/11/98 +0100, you wrote:John,I am also in the yachting industry and so thought about a deckbrightener tostart with such as TeakBriteI am wondering about Oxalic acid as well - my old text books came upwiththis but it is very difficult to find over here (UK).Hope we get an answer on this and help you out at the same timeTim. this maybe far fetched thougth but you may find oxalic acid in yourlocal pharmacy. I think it is the active ingrdient in so wart removers. from ddodd@hrfn.net Sun Oct 11 20:53:06 1998 (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id VAA12290 for ;Sun, 11 Oct1998 21:54:12 -0400 Subject: Re: Rod identification Skip, Just read your note on Montigue Rod. What is a short history ofMontigue?I bought a cane rod butt the other day with a scared decal that has Utica,NYas location of manufacturer. It is inscribed "Tonkin Cane" and 180* out itis labeled "Tonka Queen" Any ideas of what I have? Dave -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Rod identification Don; I went back and looked very closely at the rod again and based on yourreasoning conclude it is very likely a junk Montigue, but it does havethe advantage that it is not broken and will be good for gainingexperience on refinishing. Thanks for your help. Skip from jkallo@midwest.net Sun Oct 11 20:59:26 1998 Subject: Re: Rod identification At 09:53 PM 10/11/98 -0400, you wrote:Skip, Just read your note on Montigue Rod. What is a short history ofMontigue?I bought a cane rod butt the other day with a scared decal that has Utica,NYas location of manufacturer. It is inscribed "Tonkin Cane" and 180* out itis labeled "Tonka Queen" Any ideas of what I have? Dave Dave,That would be the butt of a Horrocks-Ibbotson Tonka Queen. Has areallyswelled section right above the cork, right? A standard production rod,though not a bad one, in my opinion. Joe Joseph S. KalloDpt. of PhilosophySouthern Illinois University at Carbondale from sshorb@ozip.net Sun Oct 11 21:09:45 1998 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.2 release 221 ID# 0-55785U1000L100S0V35)with ESMTP id net for ;Sun, 11 Oct 1998 21:09:31 -0500 Subject: Re: Rod identification Dave; I'm in the same boat you're in and asking questions, I have an old rod Ifound and Don was able to help me. Skip from channer@hubwest.com Sun Oct 11 21:23:01 1998 (SMTPD32-4.02c) id A85713FC00E4; Sun, 11 Oct 1998 20:24:23 MDT Subject: Re: Rod identification At 09:53 PM 10/11/98 -0400, you wrote:Skip, Just read your note on Montigue Rod. What is a short history ofMontigue?I bought a cane rod butt the other day with a scared decal that has Utica,NYas location of manufacturer. It is inscribed "Tonkin Cane" and 180* out itis labeled "Tonka Queen" Any ideas of what I have? Dave -----Original Message-----From: Skip Shorb Date: Sunday, October 11, 1998 9:09 PMSubject: Re: Rod identification Don; I went back and looked very closely at the rod again and based on yourreasoning conclude it is very likely a junk Montigue, but it does havethe advantage that it is not broken and will be good for gainingexperience on refinishing. Thanks for your help. Skip Dave;The Tonka Queen was made by Horrocks-Ibbotson, the "other" largeproductioncompany. Not their best model, but certainly not their worst. I have seenthem advertized in 7'6" and 7'9" lengths. Montague was the largestmanufacturer of bamboo fishing rods in the country from the early part ofthe century until the embargo after WWII brought cane rod production to astandstill. Montague bought out many smaller companies over the yearsand Ithink they eventually bought out South Bend's bamboo rod production. In away ,Montague still lives on, they sold all their stock and equipment toSewell Dunton, who in turn sold out to Thomas and Thomas. John Channer from saweiss@flash.net Sun Oct 11 21:51:24 1998 Subject: Re: Payne 204 -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Payne 204 At 07:07 AM 10/11/98 -0500, you wrote:About 9 years ago I was up in Vermont at REC rods and got to talking totheowner about bamboo rods. Sorry, I don't remember the name. He took meto aroomthat was loaded with Bamboo culms and machinery.He told me that was all of Jim Payne's tools and bamboo and showed meanapronthat he said was Jim's. At the time I did not appreciate what he wasshowing me.I had heard of Payne rods and had thought of building a bamboo rod afterseeingWayne put on a demo at the Book Fair in Pa. I asked if I could buy a culmand hesold me one for 20.00. After reading up on bamboo rods and seeing nameslikePayne I was wanting to do something special with that cane. I have notsplit ityet, will do after I get at least one rod built. After some medicalproblems, amove to Arkansas, building the necessary tools and a few other thingsoverthepast 9 years I am ready to get started. I now have other cane to workwithas aresult of the SRG.I had planned to build a Paul Young 6'3" Midge rod but I think I need alongerrod for the river I fish. The White in Arkansas is a big river and we getsomegood wind at times. The fish are pretty fair size and in current, a 4 wtispretty light. I would like some suggestions and comments from the list.This canbe done off list, as not to take up unnecessary band width. I would alsolike toget some comments on a Payne taper that I can use for the culm thatcame from hisshop.Thanks,Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com Tony;The Dickerson 8' 5 wt. is a great casting rod. I haven't made a Payne taperthat size, yet, so I can't recommend one there. I have made the Midge, tho,and it is an exceptional rod, make yourself one when you get a chance, youwon't be sorry. As for fishing a big river with it, I don't think it wouldbe much of a problem, the one I made will throw a line farther than I cancontrol one and has enough backbone to handle most trout. I wish I hadn'tsold it, will have to make one for me as soon as I get a chance. John Channer To continue John's thread, my second rod is a Dickerson 8013, an 8' 5- wt(13/64 ferrule), and is a fairly strong rod. As John says, it will throw alot of line. Also works fine with a WF6.Steve Weiss from jkallo@midwest.net Sun Oct 11 22:20:54 1998 Subject: Lathe? Richard,I meant to ask you this in my last email: how do you mount ferrules?Doyou have a lathe? The Canemaker's FAQ webpage suggests that you can dotheprocess by hand, but neither the Garrison nor Wayne's book even mentionthat this is possible. Needless to say I don't own a lathe. Should I startlooking for someone who might let me use theirs around here? Can you dothejob by hand? Joe Joseph S. KalloDpt. of PhilosophySouthern Illinois University at Carbondale from Canerods@aol.com Sun Oct 11 22:22:01 1998 Subject: Re: Rod identification In a message dated 10/11/98 7:06:03 PM Pacific Daylight Time,ddodd@hrfn.netwrites: Dave, You've got a quite decent 7'9" H-I Tonka Queen (2 piece) rod, IMHO. Nice quality (for H-I) - NS ferrules and an okay taper if it's one of thelighter line wt. versions. Sinclair's restoration book has some details onthis rod too. Don Burns from Canerods@aol.com Sun Oct 11 22:22:02 1998 Subject: Re: Rod identification In a message dated 10/11/98 6:16:19 PM Pacific Daylight Time,sshorb@ozip.netwrites: Skip, as long as the ferrules are okay, no reason not to restore it. Look forcracks - a real b-i-t-c-h to replace them because most female ferrulesdon'tneck down like the Montague bottle-style ferrules and don't adapt well torepairing this type of rod. (besides they cost too much for the rod's value) Pick up a copy of Michael Sinclair's "Bamboo Rod Restoration Handbook" @~$25.00 --- it's a good source of knowledge. Angler's Workshop (web site)hasa good selection of silk thread to match the original thread colors. Don Burns from jkallo@midwest.net Sun Oct 11 22:32:27 1998 Subject: Re: Lathe? Sorry about that. Once again this was supposed to be private email. Ifanyone has any thoughts about ferrule mounting by hand I'd like to hearthem--I was going to post this question to the list anyway. Thanks Joe At 10:17 PM 10/11/98 -0500, you wrote:Richard,I meant to ask you this in my last email: how do you mount ferrules?Doyou have a lathe? The Canemaker's FAQ webpage suggests that you can dotheprocess by hand, but neither the Garrison nor Wayne's book even mentionthat this is possible. Needless to say I don't own a lathe. Should I startlooking for someone who might let me use theirs around here? Can you dothejob by hand? Joe Joseph S. KalloDpt. of PhilosophySouthern Illinois University at Carbondale Joseph S. KalloDpt. of PhilosophySouthern Illinois University at Carbondale from sshorb@ozip.net Sun Oct 11 22:43:32 1998 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.2 release 221 ID# 0-55785U1000L100S0V35)with ESMTP id net for ;Sun, 11 Oct 1998 22:43:17 -0500 Subject: Re: Rod identification Don; The ferrules seem to be OK and not loose, just beat-up and worn. Thereal seat is the same but I'll have to do something with the guides,tiptop and grip. I "fixed" or replaced them (guiddes and tiptop) when Iwas a kid. I'll look for the book also.Thanks Skip from russettrods@hotmail.com Sun Oct 11 23:57:54 1998 Sun, 11 Oct 1998 21:57:21 PDT Subject: Katskills gathering Hi Was talking to a friend that talked to another friend that said was at the gathering. Said that Digger was there as the featured speaker. Was woondering if this is true as I thought he was retired. thanks ______________________________________________________Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com from tyoung@perth.dialix.com.au Mon Oct 12 00:40:01 1998 Mon, 12 Oct 1998 13:39:11 +0800 (WST)(envelope- from tyoung) Subject: Re: Splicing sections for repair On Sun, 11 Oct 1998, Harry Boyd wrote: Friends,I'm trying to figure out how to splice two hexagonalsections to extend the broken tip and broken mid sections from an old rod. I've looked at Garrison's and Wayne'sbook, and still can't quite get it straight in my mind.(That's probably the fault of too much fun at the SRG) Idon't want to spend any more money than necessary, as thisrestoration business is NOT going to be a steady diet.Wouldn't have offered to do this one if it didn't belong toa good friend's grandfather. It just doesn't seem nearly assexy as building the entire rod to me.Any suggestions on how best to build a scarfing block Also, does anyone know where I can get some 1" corkrings like were used on inexpensive rods years ago. Thanks in advance,Harry A good way to go about this is as follows:take a bock of pine as wide as practical and about 3/4" thick.Draw a line across the block in such a way that there is a slope of around 1:22 which is what I've found to work well.Clamp a pice of wood along this line so you can use it to guide a router along it and use a 6mm router bit to cut a groove 6mm deep into the pine.When the groove is cut, glue a second piece of pine over the block with the groove, cut it all to size, add a small piece of wood to both sides of the block to prevent it falling through the vise during use and you have the scarfing block ready to go. Takes about 10 mins not including glue time. Tony /***********************************************************************/Tony Younghttp://www.iinet.net.au/~mainpeak/flyrod.htmlThe Australian connection A computer without windows is like a fish without a bicycle /***********************************************************************/ from tyoung@perth.dialix.com.au Mon Oct 12 00:58:22 1998 Mon, 12 Oct 1998 13:57:30 +0800 (WST)(envelope- from tyoung) Subject: Re: Lathe? On Sun, 11 Oct 1998, Joseph S.Kallo wrote: Richard,I meant to ask you this in my last email: how do you mount ferrules?Doyou have a lathe? The Canemaker's FAQ webpage suggests that you can dotheprocess by hand, but neither the Garrison nor Wayne's book even mentionthat this is possible. Needless to say I don't own a lathe. Should I startlooking for someone who might let me use theirs around here? Can you dothejob by hand? Joe A lathe makes the job easy and quick but you certainly can mount ferrules Make a jig from wood that in end plan looks like this: I________________III The lower section hooks over the bench. the upper section is used to hold the blank in place while you file it round to size.Take it easy and it'ss work fine. Tony from saltwein@swbell.net Mon Oct 12 06:01:14 1998 gw3adm.rcsntx.swbell.net GAA27307 Subject: Re: Lathe? ........Can you do thejob by hand? Joe, I have done my ferrule mounting by hand on the few rods I have done. Iwas inspired to do it by hand even though I have a lathe because ofFrank Neunneman's remarks (German builder, nice web site). He triedusing his lathe and didn't like the results, so he mounts all of his byhand. I believe the main caveats are to make sure your blank is straight, anduse patience and care to remove material. Obviously hand mounting isnot as precise an operation as machining, but I am of the school thatrod building can be simplified. Regards, SteveIndependence, MO from fbcwin@fsbnet.com Mon Oct 12 08:22:45 1998 0500 Subject: Re: Splicing sections for repair Thanks, Tom, Don, Ian, and Tony,and, Tony, What shape is your 6mm router bit? I'm guessing a 60* bit. I supposewhatI'm asking is, do you groove both boards? And since I'm mathematicallyandmetrically challenged (only a minor in college math) isn't 6mm about.25"??Thanks in advance,Harrysnipped>Clamp a pice of wood along this line so you can use it to guide a routeralongit and >>use a 6mm router bit to cut a groove 6mm deep into the pine. Whenthegroove is cut, >>glue a second piece of pine over the block with the groove,cutit all to size, add a >>small piece of wood to both sides of the block toprevent it falling through the vise >>during use and you have the scarfingblockready to go. Takes about 10 mins not >>including glue time. Tony from richard.nantel@videotron.ca Mon Oct 12 09:10:57 1998 (modemcable70.173.mmtl.videotron.net) sims.3.5.1998.07.14.10.43)with SMTP id for Subject: RE: Lathe? Also on the questions of lathes, do all lathes allow you to put the end ofthe rod through the head of the lathe? Photos of lathes that I've seen (yesI'm on the market for one) seem to have a chuck that doesn't have a hole inthe middle. Thanks Richard -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Lathe? Sorry about that. Once again this was supposed to be private email. Ifanyone has any thoughts about ferrule mounting by hand I'd like to hearthem--I was going to post this question to the list anyway. Thanks Joe At 10:17 PM 10/11/98 -0500, you wrote:Richard,I meant to ask you this in my last email: how do you mount ferrules?Doyou have a lathe? The Canemaker's FAQ webpage suggests that you can dotheprocess by hand, but neither the Garrison nor Wayne's book even mentionthat this is possible. Needless to say I don't own a lathe. Should I startlooking for someone who might let me use theirs around here? Can you dothejob by hand? Joe Joseph S. KalloDpt. of PhilosophySouthern Illinois University at Carbondale Joseph S. KalloDpt. of PhilosophySouthern Illinois University at Carbondale from 76250.1771@compuserve.com Mon Oct 12 09:12:25 1998 Subject: RE:Payne 204 Chris-I met Dave Holloman about 7 years ago when he was selling rods out ofTheCaddis Fly in Eugene. He took me to his house and showed me his rod shopinhis garage. There were culms of bamboo in the ceiling labeled "Payne",Leonard", etc. Later he sent me a note and told me he had bought the PayneCo. from REC. Next time in Eugene he picked me up and took me to the newPayne Co. in Springfield, OR. He had the beveler, records, Jim's desk etc.Dave apparently had some OSHA problems and moved to Sisters. SteveBlake'sbeen in business in Sisters for a long time and I doubt he does anythingwith Dave. Regards, Dennis P.S. The current Payne catalog lists bamboo rods for $1950.00 for 3 pieceor $1875.00 for two piece. from 76250.1771@compuserve.com Mon Oct 12 09:12:30 1998 Subject: Payne 204 George-You're Right! I forgot about Walt Carpenter. Don--- Walt Carpenter, P.O.Box 52, Hunnington Mills, PA 18622. 717-477-3571. Dennis from saweiss@flash.net Mon Oct 12 09:34:15 1998 Subject: Re: Lathe? -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Lathe? Sorry about that. Once again this was supposed to be private email. Ifanyone has any thoughts about ferrule mounting by hand I'd like to hearthem--I was going to post this question to the list anyway. Thanks Joe At 10:17 PM 10/11/98 -0500, you wrote:Richard,I meant to ask you this in my last email: how do you mount ferrules? Doyou have a lathe? The Canemaker's FAQ webpage suggests that you cando theprocess by hand, but neither the Garrison nor Wayne's book even mentionthat this is possible. Needless to say I don't own a lathe. Should I startlooking for someone who might let me use theirs around here? Can youdothejob by hand? Joe Joseph S. KalloDpt. of PhilosophySouthern Illinois University at Carbondale Joseph S. KalloDpt. of PhilosophySouthern Illinois University at Carbondale Joe,You can set ferrules by hand with careful filing. You should have the blankas straight as possible at the ferrule end.Steve from tyoung@perth.dialix.com.au Mon Oct 12 10:03:37 1998 Mon, 12 Oct 1998 23:01:49 +0800 (WST)(envelope- from tyoung) Subject: Re: Splicing sections for repair On Mon, 12 Oct 1998, Harry Boyd wrote: Thanks, Tom, Don, Ian, and Tony,and, Tony, What shape is your 6mm router bit? I'm guessing a 60* bit. I supposewhatI'm asking is, do you groove both boards? And since I'm mathematicallyandmetrically challenged (only a minor in college math) isn't 6mm about.25"??Thanks in advance,Harry The router bit is just a straight sided flat ended bit not 60* and you only rout one board. The second board is glued across the routed face of thefirst.What you end up with is a block with a 6mm square sided groove taperingout to nothing at about 15cm or 6" if you use something like a 1:22 angle.I've found that 6mm will allow you to use the same block for reparing broken tips by scarfing the tip and hex filler pieces as well as make scarfed sections for nodeless work.While writing this it occured to me you could achieve the same thing without the router. Start with a plank about 8" x 3" x 1" thick and draw the line you want for the slope. take a second piece of wood 6mm thick (1/4") and glue it along the line. Get a piece of wood 6mm (1/4") square and lay it along the piece you just glued but don't glue this one as it's just there as a spacer, then glue another piece along this filler piece, remove the filler piece and glue a plank across the whole lot. When it's dry cut it to shape so you have the same as the routed model.This is prob simpler anyhow. 6mm is 1/4" Tony /***********************************************************************/Tony Younghttp://www.iinet.net.au/~mainpeak/flyrod.htmlThe Australian connection A computer without windows is like a fish without a bicycle /***********************************************************************/ from tyoung@perth.dialix.com.au Mon Oct 12 10:06:13 1998 Mon, 12 Oct 1998 23:03:39 +0800 (WST)(envelope- from tyoung) Subject: RE: Lathe? On Mon, 12 Oct 1998, Richard Nantel wrote: Also on the questions of lathes, do all lathes allow you to put the end ofthe rod through the head of the lathe? Photos of lathes that I've seen(yesI'm on the market for one) seem to have a chuck that doesn't have a holeinthe middle. Thanks Richard As far as I know any lathe up to the task of this kind of work will have a hole through the headstock. Possibly jewlers lathes don't but getting one of these would IMHO be a mistake. Tony /***********************************************************************/Tony Younghttp://www.iinet.net.au/~mainpeak/flyrod.htmlThe Australian connection A computer without windows is like a fish without a bicycle /***********************************************************************/ from dhaftel@att.com Mon Oct 12 10:09:10 1998 sender att.com!dhaftel (att.com!dhaftel); Mon Oct 12 11:00 EDT 1998 8.6/EMS-1.2sol2) (5.5.2232.9) Subject: RE: Lathe? Hey Joe, I'm going to try it for the first time very soon. I'll let you know how Imake out. Dennis Haftel -----Original Message-----From: Joseph S.Kallo [SMTP:jkallo@midwest.net]Sent: Sunday, October 11, 1998 11:30 PM Subject: Re: Lathe? Sorry about that. Once again this was supposed to be private email. Ifanyone has any thoughts about ferrule mounting by hand I'd like to hearthem--I was going to post this question to the list anyway. Thanks Joe At 10:17 PM 10/11/98 -0500, you wrote:Richard,I meant to ask you this in my last email: how do you mount ferrules?Doyou have a lathe? The Canemaker's FAQ webpage suggests that you candotheprocess by hand, but neither the Garrison nor Wayne's book even mentionthat this is possible. Needless to say I don't own a lathe. Should Istartlooking for someone who might let me use theirs around here? Can youdothejob by hand? Joe Joseph S. KalloDpt. of PhilosophySouthern Illinois University at Carbondale Joseph S. KalloDpt. of PhilosophySouthern Illinois University at Carbondale from dhaftel@att.com Mon Oct 12 10:21:01 1998 sender att.com!dhaftel (att.com!dhaftel); Mon Oct 12 10:19 CDT 1998 8.6/EMS-1.2sol2) (5.5.2232.9) Subject: RE: Rod identification I agree! That's the real value of the "junky old" bamboo rods, as some havecalled them. I considered my purchase of that old South Bend 59 to be alearning experience. It's certainly not a classic, but a hands on bamboo"surgery" experience like that, IMHO, is priceless. Rack up those experience miles! Dennis Haftel -----Original Message-----From: sshorb@ozip.net [SMTP:sshorb@ozip.net]Sent: Sunday, October 11, 1998 9:08 PM Subject: Re: Rod identification Don; I went back and looked very closely at the rod again and based on yourreasoning conclude it is very likely a junk Montigue, but it does havethe advantage that it is not broken and will be good for gainingexperience on refinishing. Thanks for your help. Skip from GDAVIS@EXODUS.VALPO.EDU Mon Oct 12 10:25:17 1998 #20257) rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu; Mon,12 Oct 1998 10:25:33 CDT Subject: Re: angles I had inconsistent results until I spent $20 for lighting and readingglasses.- Grayson from Fallcreek9@aol.com Mon Oct 12 10:49:05 1998 Subject: Re: Lathe? In a message dated 10/11/98 10:30:39 PM Central Daylight Time,jkallo@midwest.net writes: Joe: You can do it by hand and I have done so many times. Of course, alathemakes it a bit easier. There are a couple of key things to watch. 1. First, insure the cane is straight at the ferrule station, hopefully doingso prior to cutting off the leeway cane. This will help you have a straightrod after joining the two sections together at the ferrule. One canstraighten after the ferrule is on, of course, but if the bend is right at theferrule/bamboo juncture, it is a bit dicier as whatever ferrule glue youusewill be heated along with the bamboo. This can cause ferrule serratedtabs tolift, etc. Been there, done that. 2. Insure that as you file, that you take about as much off each corner asyou bring the bamboo down to a slip fit into the ferrule. What I do (still have to do hand fitting when dealing with quad or 5-siderod)is file the corners with a 6" single cut mill bastard file. All that means isthat I use a hardware or Home Depot bought small file that has only asingleset of lines on the cutting face. Having a set of needle files helps, butnotimperative. I hang the section off the end my planing form and file acorner.Then turn to another corner, and being carefull to use the same pressureandnumber of strokes, file it. Then to the third, fourth, etc. The idea ofcourse is to take a uniform amount off each corner. You can watch theflatsto see that they deminish uniformly, also. If you have not purchased your ferrules, I suggest you select one that is nosmaller than the dimension across the flats of the butt area to be filed.Really, it would be better to leave a bit of flat intact, especially on thetip side. That may not be the most visually pleasing, but it is not so easyto keep the station uniform if you are filing on a rounded section. Not anabsolute, but might help. As a matter of fact, I routinely purchase over-sized ferrules of the Super- SD (step down) ferrule from Classic for 4-side (have made only one) and5-side(have built 4). Chose SD so the oversized would not look too bulky. I dothat so that I do not have to go all the way down to or beyond "roundedbamboo." Not sure I would go the SD route on the first rod, though, as thebamboo that goes down into the male slide portion of the male ferrule hastobe rounded down quite small. On ferrules, I have found it important to thoroughly clean the inside withpaint thinner, or laquer thinner and alcohol to remove all manufacturingfluidresidues. I also have a dentists pick ( a tool with grotesquely bent andsharpened spring wire out each end) and scrape the inside of the ferrule toprovide a toe hold for the epoxy. Another thing that I do is take a needle-nosed pliar and bend the tabs flat.Or, with the ferrule on the shaft, BEFORE gluing, tap the tabs to flattenthem. But, and this is important, after doing that, take pliar or somthingand bend the tabe in just a bit towards the center ( like bringing all yourfingers and thumb of one hand towards together) so that the flattened tabswill grip the bamboo when first put on and glued. This will help preventthetabs from releasing and sticking out, away from the bamboo after glueingandstring removal - a real pain. Often, one or more will unstick. if flattened,when not biased inward. Flattening, especially by tapping with a smallhammer, will curl them out. If any of this is not too clear, just ask for clarification. Joe, thanks for letting me help. I Probably would not have gotten a goodstart if it had not been for the generosity of others in sharing theirknowledge. Glad the books made it ok. Regards,Richard from fbcwin@fsbnet.com Mon Oct 12 11:07:40 1998 0500 Subject: Re: Lathe? Richard, This is the kind of helpful advice that makes this list such awonderful resource. It is obvious that you have put a lot of common sensethoughtinto your rodmaking. I've built 4 rods now, and had never even consideredthenecessity of flattening the rounded ferrule serrations to help them hug theflatsof the rod. I never did cast any of your rods, other than the 2-sidedwonder atthe SRG. Next year I really hope to have the opportunity!Thanks for one more in a long line of good, common sense ideas to helpimprovemy rodmaking. fallcreek9@aol.com wrote: Another thing that I do is take a needle-nosed pliar and bend the tabsflat.Or, with the ferrule on the shaft, BEFORE gluing, tap the tabs to flattenthem. But, and this is important, after doing that, take pliar or somthingand bend the tabe in just a bit towards the center ( like bringing all yourfingers and thumb of one hand towards together) so that the flattenedtabswill grip the bamboo when first put on and glued. This will help preventthetabs from releasing and sticking out, away from the bamboo afterglueing andstring removal - a real pain. Often, one or more will unstick. ifflattened,when not biased inward. Flattening, especially by tapping with a smallhammer, will curl them out. If any of this is not too clear, just ask for clarification. Joe, thanks for letting me help. I Probably would not have gotten a goodstart if it had not been for the generosity of others in sharing theirknowledge. Glad the books made it ok. Regards,Richard from fbcwin@fsbnet.com Mon Oct 12 11:10:34 1998 0500 Subject: Re: Lathe? Richard,This is the kind of helpful advice that makes this list such a wonderfulresource. It is obvious that you have put a lot of common sense thoughtinto yourrodmaking. I've built 4 rods now, and had never even considered thenecessity offlattening the rounded ferrule serrations to help them hug the flats of therod.Inever did cast any of your rods, other than the 2-sided wonder at the SRG. Nextyear I really hope to have the opportunity not only to cast, but to closelyexamineyour rods for more good ideas!Thanks for one more in a long line of good, common sense ideas to helpimprovemy rodmaking.All my best,Harry BTW, I've ordered the v block from the source you mentioned earlier. Cost is$55. fallcreek9@aol.com wrote: Another thing that I do is take a needle-nosed pliar and bend the tabsflat.Or, with the ferrule on the shaft, BEFORE gluing, tap the tabs to flattenthem. But, and this is important, after doing that, take pliar or somthingand bend the tabe in just a bit towards the center ( like bringing all yourfingers and thumb of one hand towards together) so that the flattenedtabswill grip the bamboo when first put on and glued. This will help preventthetabs from releasing and sticking out, away from the bamboo afterglueing andstring removal - a real pain. Often, one or more will unstick. ifflattened,when not biased inward. Flattening, especially by tapping with a smallhammer, will curl them out. If any of this is not too clear, just ask for clarification. Joe, thanks for letting me help. I Probably would not have gotten a goodstart if it had not been for the generosity of others in sharing theirknowledge. Glad the books made it ok. Regards,Richard from stetzer@csd.uwm.edu Mon Oct 12 11:14:44 1998 batch3.csd.uwm.edu (8.8.4/8.6.8) with ESMTP id LAA20703 for (8.8.4/8.6.8)with SMTP id LAA23346 for ; Mon, 12 Oct1998 11:14:42 Subject: Re: Lathe? Blackening the ferrule area with a marker beforehand helps you to see how your filing is progressing. I also use my dial caliperto find the high spots as I file. When its glued and its time to bind down the ferrule tabs, I like fine wire, like 26 or 28 guagecopper wire from the hardware store. You can put on good pressureand it doesn't loosen when you let up.......................................................................Frank Stetzer "...a cheerful comrade is betterstetzer@uwm.edu than a waterproof coat and a Employed by, but not speaking for foot-warmer." Henry Van Dyke,Univ of Wisconsin-Milwaukee, USA "Fisherman's Luck", 1899. In a message dated 10/11/98 10:30:39 PM Central Daylight Time,jkallo@midwest.net writes: Richard,I meant to ask you this in my last email: how do you mount ferrules? Doyou have a lathe? The Canemaker's FAQ webpage suggests that you cando theprocess by hand, but neither the Garrison nor Wayne's book even mentionthat this is possible. Needless to say I don't own a lathe. Should I startlooking for someone who might let me use theirs around here? Can youdo thejob by hand? Jo from thramer@presys.com Mon Oct 12 11:34:41 1998 0000 Subject: Payne A Dave Holloman dropped by my shop several times to find out how taperswere designed and 'problem' solving about construction methods. I alwayswondered who he was. He also sold me some cane one time, what wasdelivered bore only a taxonomic relationship to what was displayed.I always wondered....A.J.Thramer from rmoon@ida.net Mon Oct 12 11:58:29 1998 Subject: Re: Lathe? Harry did I read you right? You cast a "2 sided wonder" at the SRG?I'd like the specs on that!!!Ralph Congratualtions on your successful event. Having done it once are yougame for a second time?Ralph from AAARPTRADEUSA@webtv.net Mon Oct 12 12:33:47 1998 101.iap.bryant.webtv.net (8.8.8/ms.gso.08Dec97) with 101.iap.bryant.webtv.net(8.8.8/mt.gso.26Feb98) id KAA12536; Mon, 12 Oct 1998 10:33:42 -0700 ETAsAhQ+2lwe9b4ps9mx90zM/5c9MVQMegIUfmASZSL20ANVYhErha+n21WaOqI= Subject: Lathe and other rodmaking tools I've been listening on the list but am a beginner with nothing much tooffer. I have flyrod wood tools with centering wheels and felt lined"V" blocks for flyrods. I also have an antique lathe with specialclamps to turn or hold flyrod butts with a stock with a hole andadjustable rollers for the pole to go through. It is three speeds(belts) and very small. It also had a mini cast iron table saw with avery very thin blade and omni (0 to 90 degree) top with a groove to holdstrips of cane to cut at angles. It also has a mini cast iron vise and crimper attachments for the metalends for the rod sections. The crimpers vary in size. It came withboxes and boxes of flyrod hardware, connectors, eyes, reel mounts,dozens of old manual crank and spring loaded flyreels from my dad'sflyrod maker friend. Mom said she put away some all wood flyreels made from lignumvitae (sp?) with mother of pearl inlay that dad liked. Theboxes of unused cork grips are all very old but probably too old (60years) to be used. I have bags of old fly lines in boxes also. I have thousands of wetand dry flies and about 25 pounds of bird fronts, backs, necks, animalfaces, tails, wings and two old rotating tying vises and drawers ofcolor silk threads, little eyes, little sinkers and hooks, etc. I wishI knew what all the tools were for. I will try to restore my dad's oldrods both from europe and the U.S. Some, I haven't even looked at and are all still hanging in theirpouches with bowtie knots closing them as they were when he died in1985. They had been hanging there decades before then because of hisstrokes. I hate to move them because his hands were the last ones totouch them. Both of my folks have died. I guess I'm a little nuts about those kindof things that become treasures even though they aren't worth much toothers. But I'm going to get them out and look at them. I have a badcase of re-current cancer so now is the time before my girlfriend sellsthem all at a yard sale for $5.00! Thanks, John from FISHWOOL@aol.com Mon Oct 12 12:40:42 1998 Subject: Payne taper for #5 from a Payne culm John Channer,In my Altzheimer's mode I deleted the thread on the Payne taper for bigwater. I would suggest the Payne 102-8' for a 5. When I first built it Ididn't like it but when I got used to it it is a powerfull rod of theparabolic group. The taper is in George Maurer's book on rod building.Regards,Hank.P.S. Are you riding any horses these days? I'm still hunting hounds at66-some of us ain't too smart.. from mcdowellc@lanecc.edu Mon Oct 12 12:59:07 1998 via smap(4.1) Subject: RE: Lathe and other rodmaking tools John, I was wondering if you would be interested in adoping me? Chris McDowellmcdowellc@lanecc.edu from AAARPTRADEUSA@webtv.net Mon Oct 12 13:12:34 1998 101.iap.bryant.webtv.net (8.8.8/ms.gso.08Dec97) with 101.iap.bryant.webtv.net(8.8.8/mt.gso.26Feb98) id LAA16483; Mon, 12 Oct 1998 11:12:31 -0700 ETAtAhR5CXdrOMTbN7QQjpheTQlQIsaUEwIVALWDcz0xiJWT3uH6If8YT/sxVeim Subject: RE: Lathe and other rodmaking tools Chris, Ha!! Not unless you have a beautiful headhead Aunt, ordepending on your age .... a pretty unmarried sister. from FlyTyr@southshore.com Mon Oct 12 13:15:14 1998 natco.southshore.com (8.8.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id NAA11045 for; Mon, 12 Oct 1998 13:16:58 -0500 Subject: Re: Lathe and other rodmaking tools John,What you have is a gold mine not only in value but in history.Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com John Schestag wrote: I've been listening on the list but am a beginner with nothing much tooffer. I have flyrod wood tools with centering wheels and felt lined"V" blocks for flyrods. I also have an antique lathe with specialclamps to turn or hold flyrod butts with a stock with a hole andadjustable rollers for the pole to go through. It is three speeds(belts) and very small. It also had a mini cast iron table saw with avery very thin blade and omni (0 to 90 degree) top with a groove to holdstrips of cane to cut at angles. It also has a mini cast iron vise and crimper attachments for the metalends for the rod sections. The crimpers vary in size. It came withboxes and boxes of flyrod hardware, connectors, eyes, reel mounts,dozens of old manual crank and spring loaded flyreels from my dad'sflyrod maker friend. Mom said she put away some all wood flyreels made from lignumvitae (sp?) with mother of pearl inlay that dad liked. Theboxes of unused cork grips are all very old but probably too old (60years) to be used. I have bags of old fly lines in boxes also. I have thousands of wetand dry flies and about 25 pounds of bird fronts, backs, necks, animalfaces, tails, wings and two old rotating tying vises and drawers ofcolor silk threads, little eyes, little sinkers and hooks, etc. I wishI knew what all the tools were for. I will try to restore my dad's oldrods both from europe and the U.S. Some, I haven't even looked at and are all still hanging in theirpouches with bowtie knots closing them as they were when he died in1985. They had been hanging there decades before then because of hisstrokes. I hate to move them because his hands were the last ones totouch them. Both of my folks have died. I guess I'm a little nuts about those kindof things that become treasures even though they aren't worth much toothers. But I'm going to get them out and look at them. I have a badcase of re-current cancer so now is the time before my girlfriend sellsthem all at a yard sale for $5.00!Thanks, John from LambersonW@missouri.edu Mon Oct 12 13:16:48 1998 (5.5.2232.9) Subject: 2 sided wonder (was: Lathe?) Ralph - Indeed, that is correct. Richard Tyree allowed us to cast atwo-strip rod that he had built. Each strip was wedge shaped thus formedafinshed rod that was similar in shape to a quad. It was quite ingeniousandhad a nice action. I expect that Richard could provide more details. Bill Lamberson -----Original Message----- Sent: Monday, October 12, 1998 11:47 AM Subject: Re: Lathe? Harry did I read you right? You cast a "2 sided wonder" atthe SRG?I'd like the specs on that!!!Ralph Congratualtions on your successful event. Having done itonce are yougame for a second time?Ralph from dhaftel@att.com Mon Oct 12 13:30:12 1998 sender att.com!dhaftel (att.com!dhaftel); Mon Oct 12 13:29 CDT 1998 8.6/EMS-1.2sol2) (5.5.2232.9) Subject: Thread tensioner on T. Smithwick's binder OK, I'm almost there. Just need to know how the thread tensioner is held inplace. I can't see any threads inside the mainshaft of the tensioner. Isit held on by a spring (e) clip? I noticed what seems to be a reliefchannel milled into the lower end of the shaft where one might fit. Is thathow it's done? TIA, Dennis Haftel from fbcwin@fsbnet.com Mon Oct 12 13:47:43 1998 0500 Subject: Re: Lathe? Ralph,Guess 2-sided is a little misleading isn't it? Bill had it correct -it is a two-strip rod, but it has four sides. Let's see, what is there inreal life that literally has only two sides? Maybe an outhouse -- insideand outside... To say the least, Richard is Mr. Ingenious! It really didcast rather nicely.And, yes, having had a week to recover from the first annual SouthernRodmakers Gathering I'm willing to rename last week's event the firstANNUAL SRG. I'm going to ask one or two of the participants to help mewith next year's plans. The folks were really great about helping coverthe expenses, but I'd like to plan on a little bit better facilities fornext year, and may thus have to charge a very modest registration fee.This year, being outdoors in 30 mph winds made it tough to do slideshows,and to cast my little 2-weights!Hope to see you next year, if not in Gatlinburg.Harry Ralph W Moon wrote: Harry did I read you right? You cast a "2 sided wonder" at the SRG?I'd like the specs on that!!!Ralph Congratualtions on your successful event. Having done it once are yougame for a second time?Ralph from Jdneufs@aol.com Mon Oct 12 14:13:16 1998 Subject: Re: Katskills gathering Digger was indeed at the Catskill Gathering and was a featured speaker.He also let Bill Fink and myself in on the color the thread trick for tippingwraps.Digger was adament about the marker being non perminent. Dan from TSmithwick@aol.com Mon Oct 12 14:13:53 1998 Subject: Re: Thread tensioner on T. Smithwick's binder Dennis - The tensioner came from Dale Clemens, and was mounted on athreadedshaft. I drilled and tapped into the pulley to put it in place. You may needto come up with another scheme, depending on what your tension devicelookslike. from rmoon@ida.net Mon Oct 12 14:15:30 1998 Subject: Re: Lathe and other rodmaking tools Chris, I am sort of cuddly too, Think John would like two of us?Ralph from rmoon@ida.net Mon Oct 12 14:16:43 1998 Subject: Re: Thread tensioner on T. Smithwick's binder DennisDrill a slightly undersized hole and ream out until you get a snug fit.It works.Ralph from rmoon@ida.net Mon Oct 12 14:18:50 1998 Subject: Re: Lathe? HarryLet's keep our fingers crossed. I understand that Gatlinburg isplanning a second annual bamboo rod symposium. I won't be invilved, butI hope that it flies.Ralph Thanks for the explanation. I was thinking it had only a front and aback from dhaftel@att.com Mon Oct 12 14:31:28 1998 sender att.com!dhaftel (att.com!dhaftel); Mon Oct 12 15:22 EDT 1998 8.6/EMS-1.2sol2) (5.5.2232.9) Subject: RE: Thread tensioner on T. Smithwick's binder Hi Tom, Thanks for the reply. I got my tensioner from D. Clemens as well. I think it cost about $14.00 orso. The top portion is threaded to adjust tension and I was thinking ofmounting it that way, but I don't think the shaft at the top is long enoughto fit through the pulley (same pulley you used) and provide the propertension. (I guess I should have taken a closer look at yours when I had itright in front of me, huh?) I could probably thread the bottom of the shaftand bolt it through the wheel that way. I was just wondering how othershave done this. Thanks again... Dennis -----Original Message-----From: TSmithwick@aol.com [SMTP:TSmithwick@aol.com]Sent: Monday, October 12, 1998 3:13 PM Subject: Re: Thread tensioner on T. Smithwick's binder Dennis - The tensioner came from Dale Clemens, and was mounted on athreadedshaft. I drilled and tapped into the pulley to put it in place. You mayneedto come up with another scheme, depending on what your tension devicelookslike. from mevans@acxiom.com Mon Oct 12 14:34:32 1998 Exchange ServerInternet Mail Connector Version 4.0.996.62) Oct 199814:37:38 -0500 Subject: RE: Lathe and other rodmaking tools 4.0.996.62 John,It strikes me - and I'm sure others, that you are in possession of more than a just a collection. You have a great picture of one aspect of your Dad's life. When some people purchase an old cane rod, they do so with the thought of the connection to the rod's history - from the maker to the original user. You have a great opportunity to preserve not only the collection, but to document how your father used it and some of the pleasures he derived from the sport. If you don't mind me suggesting so, keep the document with the collection and do all you can to keep the collection in tact. Too often, from a sense of fairness, we break up pieces of an inheritance only to lose the completeness of original sets and therefore much of their history. Keep it together and preserve the memory of your father with it - and include you personal perspective on you Dad's heritage. I'd have to believe that you, and others, will find to be it a very satisfying project. ---------- Subject: Lathe and other rodmaking tools I've been listening on the list but am a beginner with nothing much tooffer. I have flyrod wood tools with centering wheels and felt lined"V" blocks for flyrods. I also have an antique lathe with specialclamps to turn or hold flyrod butts with a stock with a hole andadjustable rollers for the pole to go through. It is three speeds(belts) and very small. It also had a mini cast iron table saw with avery very thin blade and omni (0 to 90 degree) top with a groove to holdstrips of cane to cut at angles. It also has a mini cast iron vise and crimper attachments for the metalends for the rod sections. The crimpers vary in size. It came withboxes and boxes of flyrod hardware, connectors, eyes, reel mounts,dozens of old manual crank and spring loaded flyreels from my dad'sflyrod maker friend. Mom said she put away some all wood flyreels made from lignumvitae (sp?) with mother of pearl inlay that dad liked. Theboxes of unused cork grips are all very old but probably too old (60years) to be used. I have bags of old fly lines in boxes also. I have thousands of wetand dry flies and about 25 pounds of bird fronts, backs, necks, animalfaces, tails, wings and two old rotating tying vises and drawers ofcolor silk threads, little eyes, little sinkers and hooks, etc. I wishI knew what all the tools were for. I will try to restore my dad's oldrods both from europe and the U.S. Some, I haven't even looked at and are all still hanging in theirpouches with bowtie knots closing them as they were when he died in1985. They had been hanging there decades before then because of hisstrokes. I hate to move them because his hands were the last ones totouch them. Both of my folks have died. I guess I'm a little nuts about those kindof things that become treasures even though they aren't worth much toothers. But I'm going to get them out and look at them. I have a badcase of re-current cancer so now is the time before my girlfriend sellsthem all at a yard sale for $5.00!Thanks, John from dhaftel@att.com Mon Oct 12 14:48:37 1998 sender att.com!dhaftel (att.com!dhaftel); Mon Oct 12 15:39 EDT 1998 8.6/EMS-1.2sol2) (5.5.2232.9) Subject: RE: Thread tensioner on T. Smithwick's binder ...Sounds like a good idea. I just might try that first, and if I blow it,I can always thread the end and put a nut on it. Thanks, Dennis -----Original Message-----From: Ralph W Moon [SMTP:rmoon@ida.net]Sent: Monday, October 12, 1998 3:05 PM Subject: Re: Thread tensioner on T. Smithwick's binder DennisDrill a slightly undersized hole and ream out until you get a snug fit.It works.Ralph from jczimny@dol.net Mon Oct 12 15:13:22 1998 Subject: Re: Lathe? It is very possible to get very good results by hand. The good point is thathand fitting is not as dangerous as a lathe. All you do is file thecorners - all the while, micing to assure symmetry. When you get close tothe final dimension, sand. If you're careful, you can get better resultsthan by cutting the stations on a lathe.John Zimny-----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Lathe? from AAARPTRADEUSA@webtv.net Mon Oct 12 15:17:34 1998 102.iap.bryant.webtv.net (8.8.8/ms.gso.08Dec97) with 102.iap.bryant.webtv.net(8.8.8/mt.gso.26Feb98) id NAA02157; Mon, 12 Oct 1998 13:17:31 -0700 ETAuAhUAkIDj8Cqlz7tOBK/ks99LM/46FGkCFQCyyiw010ntxS1Nbqr0r/iiIqVVKw== Subject: Fwd: Re: Lathe and other rodmaking tools --WebTV-Mail-2110948460-5990 Ralph, In reference your attached e-mail: Ha! Sorry Chris and Ralph! I never married and have no kids or family........ Being an ex-Navy type (7 yrs), I'm an old 56 year old Baptistboy who still thinks T&A is best ......... boating and fishing are closeseconds, however. You might contact this guy in Congress, Barney Frank,he might adopt you both depending how cuddly you are! :-) (I'm onlyjoking). Thanks anyway. --WebTV-Mail-2110948460-5990 (mailsorter-101.iap.bryant.webtv.net (8.8.8/po.gso.24Feb98) mailsorter-101.iap.bryant.webtv.net (8.8.8/ms.graham.14Aug97) with wugate.wustl.edu(8.8.8/8.8.5) wugate.wustl.edu (8.8.8/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA18955 for; mail.ida.net(8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA12704 for; Subject: Re: Lathe and other rodmaking tools Chris, I am sort of cuddly too, Think John would like two of us?Ralph --WebTV-Mail-2110948460-5990-- from saltwein@swbell.net Mon Oct 12 15:56:48 1998 gw2adm.rcsntx.swbell.net PAA16338 Subject: SRG II And, yes, having had a week to recover from the first annual SouthernRodmakers Gathering I'm willing to rename last week's event the firstANNUAL SRG. Bravo! Count me in on SRG II. Regards, SteveIndependence, MO from FlyTyr@southshore.com Mon Oct 12 16:59:41 1998 (8.8.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id RAA15252 for ;Mon, 12 Oct1998 17:01:24 - 0500 Subject: Re: Thread tensioner on T. Smithwick's binder Just a note, I went to a sewing machine store where they do repairs andboughtfivegood used tensioners for 4.00.He even let me pick them out.Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com Haftel, Dennis Jay wrote: Hi Tom, Thanks for the reply. I got my tensioner from D. Clemens as well. I think it cost about $14.00or from richard.nantel@videotron.ca Mon Oct 12 17:18:13 1998 (modemcable70.173.mmtl.videotron.net) sims.3.5.1998.07.14.10.43)with SMTP id for Subject: Oven BOUNDARY="Boundary_(ID_ox3B0Ac8ZpBa1X3ViCKLAw)" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --Boundary_(ID_ox3B0Ac8ZpBa1X3ViCKLAw) BOUNDARY="Boundary_(ID_9sUXcqcBvZ7NRHwzRX7ziA)" --Boundary_(ID_9sUXcqcBvZ7NRHwzRX7ziA) This may sound too simple to possibly work but has anyone tried buildingaminsulated galvanized duct contraption that would fit snugly against theopendoor of a kitchen oven? Preheat the oven to 375 F and then slide in thespines. Heck, it would even have a timer that would buzz when the bambooiscooked. Richard --Boundary_(ID_9sUXcqcBvZ7NRHwzRX7ziA) may sound too simple to possibly work but has anyone tried building am = galvanized duct contraption that would fit snugly against the open door = kitchen oven? Preheat the oven to 375 F and then slide in the spines. = Richard --Boundary_(ID_9sUXcqcBvZ7NRHwzRX7ziA)-- --Boundary_(ID_ox3B0Ac8ZpBa1X3ViCKLAw) mail).vcf" BEGIN:VCARDVERSION:2.1N:Nantel;Richard;;;FN:Richard Nantel (E-mail)ORG:Le groupe MENTOR;TITLE:TEL;WORK;VOICE:(514) 393- 3292TEL;HOME;VOICE:(514) 485-2287TEL;PAGER;VOICE:[1] (514) 111- 1111TEL;WORK;FAX:(514) 393-1483ADR;WORK:;;4374 Old Orchard Avenue;Monteal;Quebec;H4A 3B4;CanadaLABEL;WORK;ENCODING=3DQUOTED- PRINTABLE:4374 Old Orchard =Avenue=3D0D=3D0AMonteal, Quebec H4A 3B4=3D0D=3D0ACanadaADR;HOME:;;4374 Old Orchard Avenue;Monteal;Quebec;H4A 3B4;CanadaLABEL;HOME;ENCODING=3DQUOTED- PRINTABLE:4374 Old Orchard =Avenue=3D0D=3D0AMonteal, Quebec H4A 3B4=3D0D=3D0ACanadaEMAIL;PREF;INTERNET:richard.nantel@videotron.caREV:19980514T133343ZEND:VCARD --Boundary_(ID_ox3B0Ac8ZpBa1X3ViCKLAw)-- from ddodd@hrfn.net Mon Oct 12 17:38:50 1998 (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id SAA18250 for ;Mon, 12 Oct1998 18:37:12 -0400 Subject: Re: Rod identification John, Thanks for the info. Dave -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Rod identification At 09:53 PM 10/11/98 -0400, you wrote:Skip, Just read your note on Montigue Rod. What is a short history ofMontigue?I bought a cane rod butt the other day with a scared decal that has Utica,NYas location of manufacturer. It is inscribed "Tonkin Cane" and 180* outitis labeled "Tonka Queen" Any ideas of what I have? Dave -----Original Message-----From: Skip Shorb Date: Sunday, October 11, 1998 9:09 PMSubject: Re: Rod identification Don; I went back and looked very closely at the rod again and based on yourreasoning conclude it is very likely a junk Montigue, but it does havethe advantage that it is not broken and will be good for gainingexperience on refinishing. Thanks for your help. Skip Dave;The Tonka Queen was made by Horrocks-Ibbotson, the "other" largeproductioncompany. Not their best model, but certainly not their worst. I have seenthem advertized in 7'6" and 7'9" lengths. Montague was the largestmanufacturer of bamboo fishing rods in the country from the early part ofthe century until the embargo after WWII brought cane rod production to astandstill. Montague bought out many smaller companies over the yearsand Ithink they eventually bought out South Bend's bamboo rod production. In away ,Montague still lives on, they sold all their stock and equipment toSewell Dunton, who in turn sold out to Thomas and Thomas. John Channer from bobbo@buffnet.net Mon Oct 12 17:52:45 1998 bybuffnet4.buffnet.net (8.8.7/8.7.3) with SMTP id SAA23824 for via smap(V2.0) Subject: Re: Rod identification Dave,If it is a 7'6" Tonka Queen it probably has a dramatically swelled butt andcassta 5 weight line nicely. Atleast mine does. I hear that it is a rarety that itdoes, but I know that the builders there were capable when they wanted tobe. Youshould mic it up and we can compare the tapers. A kind of quality control.As forinfo, Michael Sinclair's book is well worth it.Bob At 09:53 PM 10/11/98 -0400, you wrote:Skip, Just read your note on Montigue Rod. What is a short history ofMontigue?I bought a cane rod butt the other day with a scared decal that has Utica,NYas location of manufacturer. It is inscribed "Tonkin Cane" and 180* out itis labeled "Tonka Queen" Any ideas of what I have? Dave -----Original Message-----From: Skip Shorb Date: Sunday, October 11, 1998 9:09 PMSubject: Re: Rod identification Don; I went back and looked very closely at the rod again and based on yourreasoning conclude it is very likely a junk Montigue, but it does havethe advantage that it is not broken and will be good for gainingexperience on refinishing. Thanks for your help. Skip from bobbo@buffnet.net Mon Oct 12 17:54:51 1998 bybuffnet4.buffnet.net (8.8.7/8.7.3) with SMTP id SAA24214 for via smap(V2.0) Subject: Re: Rod identification Sorry,I should have mentioned that the Tonka Queen is an HI rod not Montague. Oops.Bob At 08:56 PM 10/11/98 -0500, you wrote:At 09:53 PM 10/11/98 -0400, you wrote:Skip, Just read your note on Montigue Rod. What is a short history ofMontigue?I bought a cane rod butt the other day with a scared decal that has Utica,NYas location of manufacturer. It is inscribed "Tonkin Cane" and 180* outitis labeled "Tonka Queen" Any ideas of what I have? -----------------------------Bob Maulucci218 Wallace Ave.Buffalo, New York 14216716-836-8297 http://www.buffnet.net/~bobbo/welcome.htm "Establish a better reputation for honesty in your home community; thenyou wonthave to bring in dead fish to prove that your not a liar." - Kenneth Reid from sats@gte.net Mon Oct 12 18:08:03 1998 Subject: Re: 2 sided wonder (was: Lathe?) Ralph - Indeed, that is correct. Richard Tyree allowed us to cast atwo-strip rod that he had built. Each strip was wedge shaped thusformed afinshed rod that was similar in shape to a quad. It was quite ingeniousandhad a nice action. I expect that Richard could provide more details. It was a wonder. I'm trying to remember if the lamination was horizontalorvertical? Terry "Sunfish" KirkpatrickSafety Harbor, Fl.(Old Tampa Bay)sats@gte.net from ljrp@penn.com Mon Oct 12 18:10:36 1998 Subject: Re: Rod identification In good original condition, they bring about 220.00 with one tip. Nicelittlerod!! bob maulucci wrote: Sorry,I should have mentioned that the Tonka Queen is an HI rod not Montague. Oops.Bob At 08:56 PM 10/11/98 -0500, you wrote:At 09:53 PM 10/11/98 -0400, you wrote:Skip, Just read your note on Montigue Rod. What is a short history ofMontigue?I bought a cane rod butt the other day with a scared decal that hasUtica,NYas location of manufacturer. It is inscribed "Tonkin Cane" and 180*out itis labeled "Tonka Queen" Any ideas of what I have? -----------------------------Bob Maulucci218 Wallace Ave.Buffalo, New York 14216716-836-8297 http://www.buffnet.net/~bobbo/welcome.htm "Establish a better reputation for honesty in your home community; thenyou wonthave to bring in dead fish to prove that your not a liar." - Kenneth Reid from iank@nelson.planet.org.nz Mon Oct 12 18:51:23 1998 ; Tue, 13 Oct 1998 11:51:13 +1200 Subject: Re: Oven Richard , You are probably right .. this is too simple . You know that we all like tomake things as complicated as possible in spite of the noble attempts ofTomSmithfield to show us the other way of doing things . It could probably done by taking the glass out of the door and making up ainsulated rack that fitted in the space for the glass. The real debate would be whether the oven should be on fan or just normalheat. After some burning experiences using a hot air fed oven for heatingcane i am convinced that the temeratures , and time used, for ovens withmoving air is less then a static air oven . regards Iank At 06:00 PM 12/10/98 -0400, you wrote: This may sound too simple to possibly work but has anyone tried buildingaminsulated galvanized duct contraption that would fit snugly against theopendoor of a kitchen oven? Preheat the oven to 375 F and then slide in thespines. Heck, it would even have a timer that would buzz when thebamboo iscooked. Ian Kearney phone 0064 03 5445556104 Champion Road Fax 0064 03 5440374Richmond New Zealand email inak@ts.co.nz from MasjC1@aol.com Mon Oct 12 18:54:04 1998 Subject: Re: 2 sided wonder (was: Lathe?) Richard has an article in the most recent Planing Form that arrived onSaturday. Mark Cole from jaquin@netsync.net Mon Oct 12 19:34:39 1998 quartz.netsync.net(8.8.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id UAA24277 for ;Mon, 12 Oct1998 20:34:37 -0400 Subject: Re: Rod identification David Dodd wrote: Skip, Just read your note on Montigue Rod. What is a short history ofMontigue?I bought a cane rod butt the other day with a scared decal that has Utica,NYas location of manufacturer. It is inscribed "Tonkin Cane" and 180* outitis labeled "Tonka Queen" Any ideas of what I have? Dave -----Original Message-----From: Skip Shorb Date: Sunday, October 11, 1998 9:09 PMSubject: Re: Rod identification Don; I went back and looked very closely at the rod again and based on yourreasoning conclude it is very likely a junk Montigue, but it does havethe advantage that it is not broken and will be good for gainingexperience on refinishing. Thanks for your help. Skipmost likely you have a Hoddricks an Ibbotson from FISHWOOL@aol.com Mon Oct 12 20:27:27 1998 Subject: Re: Re: 2 sided wonder (was: Lathe?) Terry,Not having seen it, I would assume from the posts on it that each stripwas aright triangle in cross section making the lamination diagonal to thecastingplane no matter on which side you put the guides. Richard can verify ,I'msure.Regards, Hank. from bacon@idt.net Mon Oct 12 21:17:20 1998 Subject: Re: Bamboo Only Guide Service Survey WayneCatt@aol.com wrote: Jean -Presently there are 3 gals making rods in the US - I know of a coupleothers that are just starting - If you are among them I wish you the bestofluck and I as well as many others of this list would really enjoy talkingabout the craft again - Do you like purple?????Am dying to make a bamboo rod without too much psychological pain..haveexperienced that in my desire to be perfect while building graphite rods(only two, but with much anxiety)...by the way, i bleed purple blood!jean from anglport@con2.com Mon Oct 12 21:29:11 1998 Subject: Re: Bamboo Only Guide Service Survey Jean, You may want to self-bank some before you begin planing. If youdon't get a GOOD pair of gloves or a set of finger-cots you'll be developingmultiple small leaks of that purple stuff you've come to consider soprecious to life! Welcome to the "club". Art At 09:26 PM 10/12/98 -0700, you wrote:WayneCatt@aol.com wrote: Jean -Presently there are 3 gals making rods in the US - I know of a coupleothers that are just starting - If you are among them I wish you thebest ofluck and I as well as many others of this list would really enjoy talkingabout the craft again - Do you like purple?????Am dying to make a bamboo rod without too much psychological pain..haveexperienced that in my desire to be perfect while building graphite rods(only two, but with much anxiety)...by the way, i bleed purple blood!jean from bacon@idt.net Mon Oct 12 22:10:05 1998 Subject: Re: Old broken antique flyrods and other old hex wood deepsea &steelrods John Schestag wrote: Thanks Ian and members,I've spent some time in New Zealand, never had time to fish though. Idid fish off Bora Bora however. I have several hundred old antque rodsand reels. As a kid (13), I'm now 56. I was the junior crew member ona deep sea sport fishing boat in Boynton Beach, Florida. I tiedhundreds of baits for the tourist charters and for other skippers in the50's. I'd wash the blood from the cockpit, clean up the equipment andput it away, wash off the boat, put up with the drunks, customer'sbarfing on each other, fights, trying to earn some fish mountingcommissions, etc. I tied pins, ballyhoo, mullet, bonito striped custom baits with my owncustoms, a few white split seagull feathers and a thin long piece ofyellow yarn and a thin red shiny cloth (18") from my mom's sewing stuff.I'd attach it to the leader and it was ugly but a killer. I made lures from pennies I'd have a train run over. Drill two holes, polish them upbright and tie two hooks end for end with thin strips of waxed papermilk carton I'd color yellow ... another cheap killer lure for mahi andkings. (both surface skippers on the outriggers or with the deepweighted baits.) Three minutes off the south jetty and we'd get sailfish strikes andhookups. I have many five gallon pails full of old salt and fresh waterfishing lures (many still in boxes) and old classic cane (hex) rods withover and under jeweled (ruby) eyes in stainless mounts. I also havemany old steel fishing rods that are fun to look at. I even have afishing pole with two separate reels and rigs. I guess you cast one wayout and then fish the other line from the side of your boat. It's crazybut kinda neat. Somebody's great idea many years ago. ha! All mystuff is so disorganized and a mess. My old personal rod repair equipment is made from felt covered wood andbearings and pulleys ...nothing, high tech..... just clamps andwingnuts, etc. I repaired broken wood rod tips, (I used hardwood minidowels and 2 part weldwood glues. They never broke in the same placeand would still flex OK. I did guides, butts, etc., for myself andfriends for free, but never making new rods. I just thought aboutgetting into this again as a hobby. I have too many hobbies now .......so what's one more, right? I've been able to shoot a very small shotweight into a tire pretty good with a flyrod I have. I try to use the10:00 and 2:00 movement but I end up using 10, 2, 10 ,2 and then finishwith a big 3, 8 to throw the weight far. I read where this pro canthrow a weight very far with control just using his arm as the flyrod.I hit my mark OK but I like to end up with a bigger final arc. I'm justa beginner. I've had a home in St Thomas, USVI now for 26 years and some guyswouldfish for marlin with flyrods off the north shore out of Red Hook. Idon't know how they did with their rig busting fish. I'm surprisedsomeone hasn't gone after a 900 lb tuna off the tip of Long Island witha flyrod. Maybe they have by now!? That's about it or now. Nicetalking with you guys. Thanks, Johndear john,is this a dear john letter?? looking through this terrible maze ofmessages, found yours to be intriguing...have JUST begun to salt waterfly fish in the last year..the NYC area...(views of the twintowers andempire state, as well as coney island parachute jump, just to name afew)..have gotten quite a few large stripers and blues on my own builtrod, (it drove me crazy)...just went for albies off montaulk,,,on aflyrod, caught quite a few, it was awesome, however, your pastexperiences sound even more interesting...thanks for sharing,jean, aka nurse ratchet from irish-george@worldnet.att.net Mon Oct 12 22:45:57 1998 (InterMail v03.02.03 118 118 102) with SMTP +0000 Subject: Re: Lathe? Richard, You need one with a hollow spindle...most engine lathes have that, but notall. Look for the "bore through spindle" spec...make sure it is largeenough. George Bourke-----Original Message----- Subject: RE: Lathe? Also on the questions of lathes, do all lathes allow you to put the end ofthe rod through the head of the lathe? Photos of lathes that I've seen (yesI'm on the market for one) seem to have a chuck that doesn't have a holeinthe middle. Thanks Richard -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Sunday, October 11, 1998 11:30 PM Subject: Re: Lathe? Sorry about that. Once again this was supposed to be private email. Ifanyone has any thoughts about ferrule mounting by hand I'd like to hearthem--I was going to post this question to the list anyway. Thanks Joe At 10:17 PM 10/11/98 -0500, you wrote:Richard,I meant to ask you this in my last email: how do you mount ferrules? Doyou have a lathe? The Canemaker's FAQ webpage suggests that you cando theprocess by hand, but neither the Garrison nor Wayne's book even mentionthat this is possible. Needless to say I don't own a lathe. Should I startlooking for someone who might let me use theirs around here? Can youdothejob by hand? Joe Joseph S. KalloDpt. of PhilosophySouthern Illinois University at Carbondale Joseph S. KalloDpt. of PhilosophySouthern Illinois University at Carbondale from jkallo@midwest.net Tue Oct 13 00:23:32 1998 Subject: Re: 2 sided wonder (was: Lathe?) At 12:07 AM 10/13/98 GMT, you wrote:It was a wonder. I'm trying to remember if the lamination was horizontalorvertical? I am almost positive the seam was horizontal (with the rod held pointedat9 o'clock). I cast it quite a bit and was really impressed with it. Infact, I deliberately neglected to listen to Richard's directions for makingone as it occured to me right off that I could have made one of these formy first rod. I probably would have been fishing with it this afternoon,but then I would have missed the chance to plane away for another eveningon the 12 strips of my current project. Thanks for the help with theferrules. Joe Joseph S. KalloDpt. of PhilosophySouthern Illinois University at Carbondale from ragnarig@integrityol.com Tue Oct 13 00:46:15 1998 (SMTPD32-4.06) id AB677FB0154; Mon, 12 Oct 1998 22:55:51 PDT Subject: Re: Invitation only I don't know if this simplifies things for anyone but you needn't botherincluding me in any "private" lists. Thanks,Davy Riggs -----Original Message----- Subject: Invitation only I too would like to be included on an "invitation only" list - theproblem is, how are you going to know whom to invite? So many of us arequietly grateful for this resource and hope someday to have something ofour own to contribute. (Wayne, I do think you are somewhatover-reacting to Johnny Johnson's post, which I did not read as acriticism of you; rather, I thought he was citing you as an example ofacceptable practice.) I much prefer Max Satoh's excellent suggestion ofa committee or coordinator to warn and then if necessary eject thosewhose chief contribution is ill will or bad manners. My own philosophyhas been that only two things come out of a horse's ass, and neither ofthem is worth fighting over, but I agree that it has been piling uppretty deep around here! from Fallcreek9@aol.com Tue Oct 13 06:37:38 1998 Subject: Re: 2 sided wonder (was: Lathe?) List: Just tuned in and saw the posts concerning the two-strip rod. Thereisto be an article, including drawings, in the next issue of The Planing Formconcerning the making of the rod shown at the SRG. Until that issue isout,here is a very brief sketch. First, Jack Howell mentioned and gave a very brief description of theprocessin his book, The Lovely Reed. I also ran across a mention of it in AJMcClane's book, The Practical Fly Fisherman, Prentice-Hall, 1953, so theconcept is not new. Basically, two strips for each rod section were squared up, straightenedandnodes flattened. The enamel sides were sanded flat, node staggering doneandthe strips cut to length. The pith sides were planed to 1/2 the overalldimensions (of a quad) and the strips glued and bound together, pith sidetopith side. Out of the string the power fiber sides were sanded, and thesections were then planed on alternating edge sides to match the overalldimensions across the power fiber sides. At this point I had the sectionsofa rod with four sides but that was not a quad in the tradidional sense(friendand list member Carsten Jorgensen of Denmark and I call it the pmq, orpoorman's quad). Completed from that point using normal procedures. Theprojectwas to make a concept rod, and the concept proved quite satisfactory. Allinall, a fun project. There are a lot more details, of course, and some drawbacks. Should anyofyou who do not suscribe to The Planing Form wish for more than the above,letme know and I will post an expanded description. Best Regards, Richard Tyree from Fallcreek9@aol.com Tue Oct 13 06:37:56 1998 Subject: Re: Lathe? In a message dated 10/12/98 11:11:17 AM Central Daylight Time,fbcwin@fsbnet.com writes: Thanks, Harry. Really enjoyed the SRG and look forward to 1999. Btw, Ithinkyour 2-wt was really fine and want to build one. If the taper is notproprietary to someone else, would you post it? Best Regards,Richard from Fallcreek9@aol.com Tue Oct 13 06:45:48 1998 Subject: Re: Bamboo Only Guide Service Survey In a message dated 10/13/98 2:25:27 AM Central Daylight Time,bacon@idt.netwrites: Jean - I then take it you are blood type O-Resorcinol. Just kidding, ofcourse.RTyree from harry37@epix.net Tue Oct 13 06:47:07 1998 SMTP idHAA10208 Subject: Re: Oven .....gcane i am convinced that the temeratures , and time used, for ovenswithmoving air is less then a static air oven . regards Iank It would make sense--- Any baking in a convection oven is usually at lower temperatures forshorter times because the moving air provides for more heat transfer.Look at a cookbook that lists baking instructions for both conventionaland convection ovens. interesting idea, though---My wife wuld never let me get away with it!! Greg from sniderja@email.uc.edu Tue Oct 13 06:51:06 1998 Subject: RE: Thread tensioner on T. Smithwick's binder Re the Smithwick binder, I simply used a coping saw and cut out thin woodpanels to fit between the spokes of the pulley. Re the tensioner, I simplydrilled a hole through one of the panels and epoxied the tensioner in place.Jerry Snider.At 03:31 PM 10/12/98 -0400, you wrote:Hi Tom, Thanks for the reply. I got my tensioner from D. Clemens as well. I think it cost about $14.00orso. The top portion is threaded to adjust tension and I was thinking ofmounting it that way, but I don't think the shaft at the top is long enoughto fit through the pulley (same pulley you used) and provide the propertension. (I guess I should have taken a closer look at yours when I had itright in front of me, huh?) I could probably thread the bottom of theshaftand bolt it through the wheel that way. I was just wondering how othershave done this. Thanks again... Dennis -----Original Message-----From: TSmithwick@aol.com [SMTP:TSmithwick@aol.com]Sent: Monday, October 12, 1998 3:13 PM Subject: Re: Thread tensioner on T. Smithwick's binder Dennis - The tensioner came from Dale Clemens, and was mounted on athreadedshaft. I drilled and tapped into the pulley to put it in place. You mayneedto come up with another scheme, depending on what your tension devicelookslike. from TSmithwick@aol.com Tue Oct 13 07:31:33 1998 Subject: Re: Bamboo Only Guide Service Survey In a message dated 10/13/98 7:25:27 AM, you wrote: Jean - Anyone who can land a bunch of Albies on a fly rod ought to have thewrist strength to push a plane. Where are you in the bamboo process now?Doyou have a good how-to book? Started splitting? BTW, we only guaranteephysical pain here, psychological pain is up to you.I just got back from Martha's Vineyard and put a few Albies on the beachmyself, including two on a spey rod. They are a wonderful tool for fightingalong running fish. from richard.nantel@videotron.ca Tue Oct 13 07:34:19 1998 (modemcable31.174.mmtl.videotron.net) sims.3.5.1998.07.14.10.43)with SMTP id for Subject: RE: Oven Greg, The beauty of this idea (if it works) is that the insulated galvanized ductcan be stored in your workshop. When your significant other steps out foranhour, push the contraption up against your open oven and preheat to 375 F.Open the door at the other end of the tunnel, and slide in the boundsplines. Once cooked, wait a little while to cool and then move it all backout of sight. Seems like a non-intrusive way to use a household appliance. Richard -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Oven .....gcane i am convinced that the temeratures , and time used, for ovenswithmoving air is less then a static air oven . regards Iank It would make sense--- Any baking in a convection oven is usually at lower temperatures forshorter times because the moving air provides for more heat transfer.Look at a cookbook that lists baking instructions for both conventionaland convection ovens. interesting idea, though---My wife wuld never let me get away with it!! Greg from SSteinzor@atg.state.vt.us Tue Oct 13 07:52:57 1998 0400 Subject: RE: Wooden planing forms -Reply I got my 60 degree router bit at an industrial/contractors woodworkingequipment shop (with which I am utterly unaffiliated) called RussellSupply at 9 Gregory Drive in South Burlington, Vermont (802-863- 1177).I think they'll probably deliver by mail. It cost about $22. After Igot it, it occurred to me that I could defray part of the cost by usingit to make a centering gauge. Just cut a v-groove across the end grainof some suitable hard wood and then slice off a piece with the grain.Voila. -----Original Message-----From: irish-george [SMTP:irish- george@worldnet.att.net]Sent: Saturday, October 10, 1998 1:02 AM Subject: Re: Wooden planing forms -Reply Trendlines owns Post Tools -- so, you can probably get it there aswell.(Post Tools seems to sell the entire Trendlines catalog of router bitsfromwhat I've seen.) One caveat on Trendlines, it is primarily amarketingcompany, and they seem to think that woodworkers tend to be golfers(anotheritem they market) and put my name on every golf mailing list there is.Ofcourse, I don't play and have no interest in golf. You might want tomakeit clear to them whether you do or do not wish to wind up on mailinglists. George Bourke-----Original Message-----From: Jerry Quinn Date: Friday, October 09, 1998 2:58 PMSubject: Re: Wooden planing forms - Reply RON WILHELM wrote: John; It would be a great help if you could provide a source for your 60degreerouter bit. I have had some trouble in locating one. Any infowould beappreciated. Thanks Ron Wilhelmron, i just ordered one from trendlines. however, i left the catalogatwork so can't get you phone # etc. till monday night. maybe someoneelse on the list will respond wih the info. from FlyTyr@southshore.com Tue Oct 13 08:06:22 1998 (8.8.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id IAA29966 for ;Tue, 13 Oct1998 08:08:14 -0500 Subject: Planing Form .Hi list, Speaking of The Planing Form, I have somehow lost # 30 in my move andwaswondering if someone out there might have a spare or a copy that I mightbe ableto get.Thanks,Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com There are a lot more details, of course, and some drawbacks. Should anyofyou who do not suscribe to The Planing Form wish for more than theabove, letme know and I will post an expanded description. Best Regards,Richard Tyree from AAARPTRADEUSA@webtv.net Tue Oct 13 08:34:31 1998 101.iap.bryant.webtv.net (8.8.8/ms.gso.08Dec97) with 101.iap.bryant.webtv.net(8.8.8/mt.gso.26Feb98) id GAA21460; Tue, 13 Oct 1998 06:34:29 -0700 ETAtAhQjCeTLpWoLzFxqeb3MeS19eMNjqwIVAJ5PiR9pFRqn+UUGt8NKnIdPLVhS Subject: Re: Old broken antique flyrods and other old hex wood deepsea &steelrods Hi Nurse Ratchet, Thanks for your hello. You'll find some big fish offBaltimore in the trench too. I just want to catch Florida mangrovesnapper on light fyrods using brown shrimp flies that I tied. Myfiddler crabs for sheepshead are so so, especially after I see some ofthe nice ones I've seen guys tie. I flew my plane (Beech Bonanza) to Idaho and fished Williams Lake nearthe salmon river. The trout fishing was "too" good. We used eggs,cheese, a piece of waxed paper, even a bare hook ...... the trout werestarved and they tasted like "stockers" too (soft) and we smoked them.When my pop was alive, he broke a couple of his flyrods on a silvertarpon and a shark. He was happy he was using his plain rods and not one of his prize ones from his collection. He was fishing for pan fish and wham! he hookedup two monsters and broke both flyrods he had brought with him. Younever know what you'll hook up in salt water. He put up all of histreasured flyrods after that and he used large hex canes, glass or steelrods after that. I don't know if you'll get this message as I'm having trouble sendingout e- mails on this list. Return a "Hi" if you get this. Thanks, John from GDAVIS@EXODUS.VALPO.EDU Tue Oct 13 10:28:45 1998 #20257) rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu; Tue,13 Oct 1998 10:29:01 CDT Subject: 2 sided wonder Richard, That pmq is intriguing! I remember seeing some eccentric lamination patterns in G.L. Herter's rodmaking book (that book, its author and this reader were all quite eccentric, thank you) that I thought were especially for tuna rods. I am planning (maybe this winter, maybe not) to make a nodeless bamboo spey rod with taped joints instead of ferrules; a pmq might be a way to get there quickly. Maybe a big pmq rod could have 4 laminations (poor man's quad quad?) in the butt, three in the mid and two in the tip. I'm not a Planing Form subscriber and would love some more details about tapering, ferruling and upon which surface you placed the guides. And say, what were those drawbacks you mentioned? -Grayson from caneboy@xtn.net Tue Oct 13 11:38:41 1998 Subject: Gatlinberg Gathering Does anyone know who is behind organizing the rumored gathering atGatlinberg, TN from fbcwin@fsbnet.com Tue Oct 13 12:05:23 1998 0500 Subject: Re: Gatlinberg Gathering Mike,Two rounds of discussion are going on at the same time.First, GGWilliams mentioned on this list the idea of holding aRodmakers Gathering in the Gatlinburg area some time in the future.Second, in June of 1999 the Federation of Fly Fishers NationalConclave will definitely be held in Gatlinburg. At the 1998 FFFConclave, one of our list members hosted a forum on bamboo, and thereare rumors of another bamboo forum for the 1999 Gatlinburg gathering.Hope this clears things up a little.Harry Boydmike fennell wrote: Does anyone know who is behind organizing the rumored gathering atGatlinberg, TN from gwr@seanet.com Tue Oct 13 12:09:06 1998 mx.seanet.com(8.8.8/Seanet-8.7.3) with SMTP id KAA04585 for; Tue, Subject: Re: Gatlinberg Gathering boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000A_01BDF692.013EE880" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000A_01BDF692.013EE880 boundary="----=_NextPart_001_000B_01BDF692.013EE880" ------=_NextPart_001_000B_01BDF692.013EE880 Hi Mike, At the Idaho Falls FFF conclave a fellow named Gene Barrington =handed me his business card as he was promoting the possible east coast =FFF conclave next year. I believe this is the Gatlinberg event you're =referring to.Gene is the FFF VPD SEC (Federation of Fly Fishers, Vice President of =Development, South East Council). His office phone is 770 271 3335. =Hope that helps. Russ Golden Witch Rods - "Tools For Natural Philosophy"Golden Witch Technologies, Inc. - "The Golden Age Is Now"gwr@seanet.comhttp://www.goldenwitch.com -----Original Message-----From: mike fennell Date: Tuesday, October 13, 1998 9:39 AMSubject: Gatlinberg Gathering Does anyone know who is behind organizing the rumored gathering atGatlinberg, TN ------=_NextPart_001_000B_01BDF692.013EE880 Hi Mike, the = FFF conclave a fellow named Gene Barrington handed me his business card= to. the FFF VPD SEC (Federation of Fly Fishers, Vice President of = helps. Russ = "Tools For Natural Philosophy"Golden Witch -----Original = rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= <rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= Tuesday, October 13, 1998 9:39 AMSubject: GatheringDoes anyone know who is behind = rumored gathering atGatlinberg, =TN ------=_NextPart_001_000B_01BDF692.013EE880-- ------=_NextPart_000_000A_01BDF692.013EE880 name="Golden Witch.vcf" filename="Golden Witch.vcf" BEGIN:VCARDN:Gooding;John;R.FN:Golden WitchORG:Golden WitchTITLE:Rod Maker &c.TEL;WORK;VOICE:(425) 787- 6599TEL;PAGER;VOICE:noneTEL;WORK;FAX:noneADR;WORK;ENCODING=3DQUOTED-PRINTABLE:;;16829 6th Ave. =West=3D0D=3D0ASuite #2B=3D0D=3D0A;Lynnwood;WA;98037;USALABEL;WORK;ENCODING=3DQUOTED-PRINTABLE:16829 6th Ave. =West=3D0D=3D0ASuite #2B=3D0D=3D0A=3D0D=3D0ALynnwood, WA =98037=3D0D=3D0AUSAURL:noneURL:http://www.goldenwitch.comEMAIL;PREF;INTERNET:gwr@seanet.comEND:VCARD ------=_NextPart_000_000A_01BDF692.013EE880-- from hall@Summa4.COM Tue Oct 13 12:39:22 1998 custsrv1.vitts.com(Post.Office MTA v3.5 release 215 ID# 0- 52004U700L100S0V35)with SMTP id com for ;Tue, 13 Oct 1998 13:39:20 - 0400 199817:39:20 UT (8.8.5/8.7.1) with ESMTP id NAA27540 for ;Tue, 13 Oct (8.8.5/8.7.1) withESMTP id NAA02193 for ; Tue, 13 Oct 199813:38:37 Subject: Re: Blackening Guide Feet Just this last weekend, I was fishing a friends 8 foot 3 pc F. E. Thomasdirigo which has burgandy wraps. Below each female ferrule, at the"stresspoint", was a few wraps of black thread, to darken/hide how the stressfracuresthe vanish. Typically this area has a white line on the varnish, it appearsthat Thomas rods were addressing this. Anyway, perhaps another use for the Sharpie.... Dan Mike Biondo wrote: snip Recently while struggling with my trim wraps, I happened to glancedown atthe black Sharpie on my bench. Since I was wrapping black trim wraps, Ithought...hmmmmm???? So the next wrap I continued wrapping untilwhere Iwould normally end the guide wrapping. I then picked up the blackmarker,and colored about four inches of the still attached thread. Waited a fewmoments for it to dry. Secured the catch loop, and proceeded to wrap 5morewraps of the newly blacken thread. Instant trim wrap!!! Worked great!!!:-) Actually, since my main wrap color was a dark green, I also took a greensharpie to the guide feet to mask my sometime (oftentimes!) less thangreatwrap job. I'll tell ya, these Sharpies make even me look like I know whatI'm doing!!! :-) Mike - pass the Sharpie - BiondoSt. Louis, MO from jfoster@gte.net Tue Oct 13 13:23:15 1998 Subject: Re: SRG Charles nice SM Chris Does it measure up to your east coast version? jerry from dmanders@ccinet.ab.ca Tue Oct 13 16:44:49 1998 Subject: Glue Strength Guys/Gals, In my newest copy of Lee Valley Catalogue there is a table of the variousglues that Lee Valley sells. Shear strength is one of the characteristicsof a glue that rod makers should be interested. Question 1: What are the shear strengths of Urac and Resorcinol? Question 2: What is the minimum shear strength that a rod makers shouldusein a glue? eg. Titebond II shear is 3750 psi - white glue is 4200 pis - Gi epoxy is15000 psi John Z - you out there? regards, Don from dmanders@ccinet.ab.ca Tue Oct 13 16:47:10 1998 Subject: Bamboo Mag. Guys/Gals, Does anyone know if the mag. is still in business? Don from CALucker@aol.com Tue Oct 13 17:08:38 1998 Subject: Re: Glue Strength In a message dated 10/13/98 2:51:06 PM Pacific Daylight Time,dmanders@ccinet.ab.ca writes: You are right to think in terms of shear strength, but don't worry aboutgetting the highest shear strength. Even hide glue, when made with a gluepot-- not the Franklin ready-in-the-bottle stuff, will give your enough shearstrength to keep your rod together. Be more concerned with which what glue you have most success applyingand becareful that you do not try to glue sanded surfaces. Sanded surfaces don'tglue as well as scraped surfaces. Sanding leaves a surface soft and fuzzy. In terms of gluing ferrules, I recommend Pliobond. After a few days apliobonded ferrule is there to stay. Please wait for a couple of daysthough,because pliobond will remain a bit elastic for that amount of time. Chris Lucker from RVenneri@aol.com Tue Oct 13 17:11:30 1998 Subject: Re: Planing Form Listmembers,I have been told that Ron has mentioned my reel seats in this monthsissue.I am not a subscriber yet. if any one would have a copy and a scanner andwould not mind sending me a scanned copy (preferably as a jpg. or a pdf) Iwould love to see it. TIA Bob Vrvenneri@aol.com from rmoon@ida.net Tue Oct 13 17:45:43 1998 Subject: Re: Gatlinberg Gathering I believe that it was to Gene Barrington whom Russ mentioned that Ispoke to in Idaho Falls about the Bamboo Rod Symposium. It is myunderstanding that this will become an annual event at FFF Conclave, andI am sure that The Conclave in Gatlinburg will have a symposium. I wasgreatly pleased by the response that we had at IF. Surely a agreatgroup of experts on hand and they made it fun for all of us.Ralph from Grhghlndr@aol.com Tue Oct 13 18:17:55 1998 Subject: Re: Re: Planing Form List,I am sending bob a planing form in the mail so you can hold off sending itover the internet. I have some other things I am sending so I will just addit to the box.Bret from jczimny@dol.net Tue Oct 13 18:28:36 1998 Subject: Re: Glue Strength Oh yes, I'm here. I don't have time to look it up. But, I think that Iremember seeing in one of the tech bulletins that Urea formaldehydes arearound 9000 and Resocinals are around 14000. Real phenolic glues used toexceed epoxys. Anything over 3000 is probably OK in most casting inducedshear. But, for me the maker the real problem is not the shear strengh, buthow well does it hold on to the substrate and at what temperature. Both ofthe latter are probably more important considerations as long as one has 4or 5 K strength. Also, temperature induced shear is a real problem.Particularly for steelhead fisherpersons.John Z-----Original Message----- Subject: Glue Strength Guys/Gals, In my newest copy of Lee Valley Catalogue there is a table of the variousglues that Lee Valley sells. Shear strength is one of the characteristicsof a glue that rod makers should be interested. Question 1: What are the shear strengths of Urac and Resorcinol? Question 2: What is the minimum shear strength that a rod makers shouldusein a glue? eg. Titebond II shear is 3750 psi - white glue is 4200 pis - Gi epoxy is15000 psi John Z - you out there? regards, Don from jczimny@dol.net Tue Oct 13 18:48:27 1998 Subject: Re: Glue Strength Here is another example of what is was saying. Rubber based haverelativelypoor shear strength. Even when compared to the hardware store PVA's.But,when all is said and done, they have enough. What they have that too fewglues have, is 1) very, very good adhesion,and 2) good fexibility at coldtemperatures.John Z-----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Glue Strength In a message dated 10/13/98 2:51:06 PM Pacific Daylight Time,dmanders@ccinet.ab.ca writes: Question 2: What is the minimum shear strength that a rod makers shouldusein a glue? eg. Titebond II shear is 3750 psi - white glue is 4200 pis - Gi epoxy is15000 psi You are right to think in terms of shear strength, but don't worry aboutgetting the highest shear strength. Even hide glue, when made with agluepot-- not the Franklin ready-in-the-bottle stuff, will give your enough shearstrength to keep your rod together. Be more concerned with which what glue you have most success applyingandbecareful that you do not try to glue sanded surfaces. Sanded surfaces don'tglue as well as scraped surfaces. Sanding leaves a surface soft andfuzzy. In terms of gluing ferrules, I recommend Pliobond. After a few days apliobonded ferrule is there to stay. Please wait for a couple of daysthough,because pliobond will remain a bit elastic for that amount of time. Chris Lucker from sats@gte.net Tue Oct 13 19:52:29 1998 Subject: Re: Oven It could probably done by taking the glass out of the door and making up ainsulated rack that fitted in the space for the glass. The real debate would be whether the oven should be on fan or justnormalheat. After some burning experiences using a hot air fed oven for heatingcane i am convinced that the temeratures , and time used, for ovens withmoving air is less then a static air oven . My wife and I got a new convection oven to replace the old toaster oventhat hadreached the end of it's life. The convection over takes about 2/3 the time of the old oven, and takeslessheat. When you start blowing very hot air over anything I'd guess it takes lesstimeand lower temps to do the same thing... Terry "Sunfish" KirkpatrickSafety Harbor, Fl.(Old Tampa Bay)sats@gte.net from sats@gte.net Tue Oct 13 19:52:31 1998 Subject: Fish on Bamboo. I don't know how the rest of the SRG made out, fishing. didn't reallyhear.I took a 14in (+/-) Sunday afternoon on the North Fork, just below the boatramp. They'd been generating, but the water was only up about 1 1/2 or2ft. It WAS tearing through the valley though. Kinda reminded me of some ofthewestern rivers. I was fishing a dry on my 7 1/2 ft. Japanese rebuilt. A little heavy,butcloser to what I'm looking for in an action. It was a nice fish. I fishedwith another (graphite) rod builder, for about another hour and got onemorefish on, but lost it. The fella was a nice guy and we had a ball justfishing,without much talk. Just an occasional, "there's one over there."He landed a nice 10in rainbow, not long before I had to leave. A good end of a very nice weekend. I did catch one more smaller trout on the White, on a virgin rod that amemberof FF@ made for me. No longer virgin. Took it on a wet fly just at sunset,at wildcat shoales . Terry "Sunfish" KirkpatrickSafety Harbor, Fl.(Old Tampa Bay)sats@gte.net from ljrp@penn.com Tue Oct 13 20:00:28 1998 Subject: Re: Fish on Bamboo. You guys should fish the Little Juniata River or Spruce Creek here at homeinCentral Pa Terry L. Kirkpatrick wrote: I don't know how the rest of the SRG made out, fishing. didn't reallyhear.I took a 14in (+/-) Sunday afternoon on the North Fork, just below theboatramp. They'd been generating, but the water was only up about 1 1/2 or2ft.It WAS tearing through the valley though. Kinda reminded me of some ofthewestern rivers.I was fishing a dry on my 7 1/2 ft. Japanese rebuilt. A littleheavy,butcloser to what I'm looking for in an action. It was a nice fish. Ifishedwith another (graphite) rod builder, for about another hour and got onemorefish on, but lost it. The fella was a nice guy and we had a ball justfishing,without much talk. Just an occasional, "there's one over there."He landed a nice 10in rainbow, not long before I had to leave. A good end of a very nice weekend. I did catch one more smaller trout on the White, on a virgin rod that amemberof FF@ made for me. No longer virgin. Took it on a wet fly just at sunset,at wildcat shoales . Terry "Sunfish" KirkpatrickSafety Harbor, Fl.(Old Tampa Bay)sats@gte.net from bobbo@buffnet.net Tue Oct 13 20:08:57 1998 bybuffnet4.buffnet.net (8.8.7/8.7.3) with SMTP id VAA11870 for via smap(V2.0) Subject: Re: Bamboo Only Guide Service Survey Jean:Before you experience too much pain, here are some things to look forwardtoo:1. bamboo rod building gives you so much more say in what you get as afinishedrod.2. you can build anything you can dream up.3. the skills of the graphite rod builder are almost all applicable.4. the flat surfaces of a cane rod are easier to apply wraps to.5. you can have first dibs on "The Barney Rod Co." ( since you like purple somuch.)Good luck,Bob At 09:26 PM 10/12/98 -0700, you wrote:WayneCatt@aol.com wrote: Jean -Presently there are 3 gals making rods in the US - I know of a coupleothers that are just starting - If you are among them I wish you thebest ofluck and I as well as many others of this list would really enjoy talkingabout the craft again - Do you like purple?????Am dying to make a bamboo rod without too much psychological pain..haveexperienced that in my desire to be perfect while building graphite rods(only two, but with much anxiety)...by the way, i bleed purple blood!jean from lblan@provide.net Tue Oct 13 20:14:09 1998 Subject: RE: Planing Form Bret; This is probably a good decision. I think sending a planing form viathe internet is a terrific waste of bandwidth. Surely this is much worsethan even .html based e-mail. 5 feet of cold rolled steel... just imagine!:)) Ok, I'll go back to my corner, but I just couldn't help myself..... List,I am sending bob a planing form in the mail so you can hold off sending itover the internet. I have some other things I am sending so Iwill just addit to the box.Bret from WDHCJL@aol.com Tue Oct 13 20:21:36 1998 Subject: Gatlinburg? In a message dated 98-10-12 15:24:24 EDT, you write: I guess I missed that. The Smokys are my "hang out". Any details oneitherthe first one or the possible second get-a-gether? from bdcreek@grand-rapids.crosswinds.net Tue Oct 13 20:48:17 1998 (envelope- from bdcreek@grand-rapids.crosswinds.net) Subject: There goes the apple cart List Buddies- I've been off-line for a couple of weeks due to technicaldifficulties, and am saddened to see that Terry's pissed off (oops, morefrench) yet another crop of very helpful, genuinely nice men. I can'ttake him for long, and left the list for the entire summer after flaminghim last spring.But, I'm back (not that this will ever help anyone besides me) andwe can only hope Wayne, Darryl, etc come to the same conclusion I did,that Terry's only one guy, he's not representative of the list, and thatlife's too short to stay mad.But still, it saddens me that on a forum that teaches and preservesa noble craft and that is usually full of joy in the achievements ofothers and in our own accomplishments, one jerk can run in and throw aserious damper on the whole works for all of us. I applaud the commentsof those of you that say the list needs Terry as well as the rest of themembers, but I don't agree, and I've resolved to delete unread anythingthat he posts from now on. I just don't need the aggravation in the onearea of my life that lowers my blood pressure (well, that and tucking mykids into bed at night ;^)). My $0.02. Brian from AAARPTRADEUSA@webtv.net Tue Oct 13 20:52:06 1998 102.iap.bryant.webtv.net (8.8.8/ms.gso.08Dec97) with 102.iap.bryant.webtv.net(8.8.8/mt.gso.26Feb98) id SAA21579; Tue, 13 Oct 1998 18:52:04 -0700 ETAsAhRi3wG/ZFVXevfzSkF5BxQYdzfToAIUL/YlxFyXAWJWdbiTuCv0yc1ZsoA= Subject: Remove from List This fine list is way out of my league as I am such a beginner. I feelthat my questions sound stupid. I wish all the best to all of you.Please remove me from the mailing list. So long, John from sshorb@ozip.net Tue Oct 13 21:08:31 1998 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.2 release 221 ID# 0-55785U1000L100S0V35)with ESMTP id net for ;Tue, 13 Oct 1998 21:08:10 -0500 Subject: Re: Glue Strength John; A friend of mine uses a glue called Smooth-on ,or EA-40, to laminatelong bows. We are both very interested in making our own cane rods andwondered if this product would work. It spreadable for about 1 hr and isheated during its cure. Skip from briansr@point-net.com Tue Oct 13 21:21:20 1998 0000 Hi John you mentioned yourself "this fine list"Hang in there, there's no such thing as a stupid questionBeginners have everything to gain from this list, believe me. Cheers Brian Sturrock from FISHWOOL@aol.com Tue Oct 13 21:30:55 1998 Subject: Re: Remove from List JOHN,The only dumb questions are those not asked-I've asked a few "dumb "onesmyself. Please don't leave the list-I've enjoyed your posts.Regards,Hank Woolman. from bacon@idt.net Tue Oct 13 21:35:17 1998 Subject: Re: Bamboo Only Guide Service Survey Fallcreek9@aol.com wrote: In a message dated 10/13/98 2:25:27 AM Central Daylight Time,bacon@idt.netwrites: jean >> Jean - I then take it you are blood type O-Resorcinol. Just kidding, ofcourse.RTyreertyree,am to dumb to know what type 0-resourcinol is. but anyone wholives instaten island, new york would know why i bleed purple blood.jeanps (what is it?) from djfinch@sprintmail.com Tue Oct 13 21:50:13 1998 TAA19450 Subject: Re: Remove from List Dear John, please do not leave ! the list is going so well now with allkind's of different questions, and not one of them was stupid ! I too am anewbie and I went and read the archive's and visited all the web sites onthe rodmaker's site and a bunch more..have you checked these out yet ? I Hang in there..regards Greg.John Schestag wrote: This fine list is way out of my league as I am such a beginner. I feelthat my questions sound stupid. I wish all the best to all of you.Please remove me from the mailing list. So long, John from ddodd@hrfn.net Tue Oct 13 21:50:30 1998 (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id WAA01095 for ;Tue, 13 Oct1998 22:58:34 - 0400 Subject: Re: Rod identification List, I have the butt section of the Tonka Queen and am looking for a tip to makethe 7'6" or the 7' 9"rod.Any body have a tip to get rid of. Also List, Some one asked for the mic'd sizes of the rod I have. Lost the EMAIL whenItransfered from officeto home Email. I owe you an answer and don't have an off list address. (Ithought that I could readthrough the "list" during my lunch at my desk, WRONG....this is great.)My Wife is watching theplay-offs (she's a baseball, basketball, hockey, nut) and I'm on the listdoing my thing. Later,"Newbie" Daveddodd@hrfn.net -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Rod identification In good original condition, they bring about 220.00 with one tip. Nicelittle rod!! bob maulucci wrote: Sorry,I should have mentioned that the Tonka Queen is an HI rod not Montague.Oops.Bob At 08:56 PM 10/11/98 -0500, you wrote:At 09:53 PM 10/11/98 -0400, you wrote:Skip, Just read your note on Montigue Rod. What is a short history ofMontigue?I bought a cane rod butt the other day with a scared decal that hasUtica,NYas location of manufacturer. It is inscribed "Tonkin Cane" and 180*out itis labeled "Tonka Queen" Any ideas of what I have? -----------------------------Bob Maulucci218 Wallace Ave.Buffalo, New York 14216716-836-8297 http://www.buffnet.net/~bobbo/welcome.htm "Establish a better reputation for honesty in your home community; thenyou wont have to bring in dead fish to prove that your not a liar." -Kenneth Reid from bacon@idt.net Tue Oct 13 22:03:56 1998 Subject: Re: Bamboo Only Guide Service Survey TSmithwick@aol.com wrote: In a message dated 10/13/98 7:25:27 AM, you wrote: Jean - Anyone who can land a bunch of Albies on a fly rod ought to havethewrist strength to push a plane. Where are you in the bamboo processnow? Doyou have a good how-to book? Started splitting? BTW, we onlyguaranteephysical pain here, psychological pain is up to you.I just got back from Martha's Vineyard and put a few Albies on the beachmyself, including two on a spey rod. They are a wonderful tool forfighting along running fish.don't have a good how-to-book. have only built two graphite rods(three piece 7, and two piece 9) i loved it! did you get the albies FROMthe beach, if so, i'm mightily impressed...i was on a boat with a guideand we were in schools of albies which were lovely...the wrist is prettywimpy though, have started wimp wrist weights for women (aka wwww),buti DID haul them in with a lot of yelling from the gestapo guide. irefused to quit. on a spey rod?!, that's so cool. any info on a simplehow-to book would be appreciated (please not too expensive), i have tosave up for the next fishing trip. thanks,jeanps: the psychological pain of not being perfect when you turn out a rodcan be devastating, don't you agree? from Canerods@aol.com Tue Oct 13 22:08:27 1998 Subject: Re: Fish on Bamboo. In a message dated 10/13/98 6:04:49 PM Pacific Daylight Time,ljrp@penn.comwrites: Dick, Are you near there? My wife's family is from Orefield plus the B-in-L hasjuststarted to fly fish in the area. He's a life long "spinner" that had to learnFF so as to be able to fish the Yellowstone area with me. Don B. from bacon@idt.net Tue Oct 13 22:10:30 1998 Subject: Re: Old broken antique flyrods and other old hex wood deepsea &steelrods John Schestag wrote: Hi Nurse Ratchet, Thanks for your hello. You'll find some big fish offBaltimore in the trench too. I just want to catch Florida mangrovesnapper on light fyrods using brown shrimp flies that I tied. Myfiddler crabs for sheepshead are so so, especially after I see some ofthe nice ones I've seen guys tie. I flew my plane (Beech Bonanza) to Idaho and fished Williams Lake nearthe salmon river. The trout fishing was "too" good. We used eggs,cheese, a piece of waxed paper, even a bare hook ...... the trout werestarved and they tasted like "stockers" too (soft) and we smoked them.When my pop was alive, he broke a couple of his flyrods on a silvertarpon and a shark. He was happy he was using his plain rods and not one of his prize ones from his collection. He was fishing for pan fish and wham! he hookedup two monsters and broke both flyrods he had brought with him. Younever know what you'll hook up in salt water. He put up all of histreasured flyrods after that and he used large hex canes, glass or steelrods after that. I don't know if you'll get this message as I'm having trouble sendingout e- mails on this list. Return a "Hi" if you get this. Thanks, Johngee, another dear john letter...i just returned from colorado, where ifished on top of the grand mesa, (the world's largest flat topmountain)on a float tube...talk about feeling silly, cruising around ina tube with flippers on. i'm really crummy at catching trout, havingonly salt- water experience, but it was fun, and a new experience isalways appreciated. your dad sounds excellent! and maryland isnext...there's just too many fish here in NY, i'm getting bored...(NOT!)jean from anglport@con2.com Tue Oct 13 22:33:44 1998 Subject: Re: Bamboo Only Guide Service Survey Jean,I think you may have two of us mixed up. I'm from SI and Richard issomewhere beyond the Great Divide (if I remember correctly). The jokereferred to resorcinol's color because resorcinol is one of the best gluesto use for rodbulding if you don't mind the purple seams it leaves. As formy understanding YOUR comment, I can come up with only two possibleexplanations:1) You also live on SI and the Fresh Kills Dump has affected your gene poolor2) You live in Manhattan and think that all people who live in the Great 212Area Code are royalty .Careful with the blades,Art At 09:44 PM 10/13/98 -0700, you wrote:Fallcreek9@aol.com wrote: In a message dated 10/13/98 2:25:27 AM Central Daylight Time,bacon@idt.netwrites: jean >> Jean - I then take it you are blood type O-Resorcinol. Just kidding, ofcourse.RTyreertyree,am to dumb to know what type 0-resourcinol is. but anyone wholives instaten island, new york would know why i bleed purple blood.jeanps (what is it?) from bacon@idt.net Tue Oct 13 22:43:37 1998 Subject: Re: Bamboo Only Guide Service Survey bob maulucci wrote: Jean:Before you experience too much pain, here are some things to lookforward too:1. bamboo rod building gives you so much more say in what you get as afinishedrod.2. you can build anything you can dream up.3. the skills of the graphite rod builder are almost all applicable.4. the flat surfaces of a cane rod are easier to apply wraps to.5. you can have first dibs on "The Barney Rod Co." ( since you like purplesomuch.)Good luck,Bob At 09:26 PM 10/12/98 -0700, you wrote:WayneCatt@aol.com wrote: Jean -Presently there are 3 gals making rods in the US - I know of acoupleothers that are just starting - If you are among them I wish you thebest ofluck and I as well as many others of this list would really enjoytalkingabout the craft again - Do you like purple?????Am dying to make a bamboo rod without too much psychologicalpain..haveexperienced that in my desire to be perfect while building graphite rods(only two, but with much anxiety)...by the way, i bleed purple blood!jeanhow about the Barnette rod company?ps..we will also have stylish waders (eg. the crotch doesn't come downto your knees). now, seriously...it's really easier to wrap flat surfaces? can that betrue..i've spend many a night into the wee hours trying to be perfect, (if you have a good magnifier and light it's almost impossible)thanks for your info,jean from stpete@netten.net Tue Oct 13 22:47:22 1998 cedar.netten.net (8.8.8/8.6.12) with SMTP id WAA03581 for Subject: Re: Remove from List John, You should not leave based on the reason you stated. I'm still abeginner 2 years later. But there are some who jump in with both feetand are experienced rodmakers and INNOVATORS at 2 years. If you'reserious about rodmaking, stick around. You won't be sorry. Rick Crenshaw John Schestag wrote: This fine list is way out of my league as I am such a beginner. I feelthat my questions sound stupid. I wish all the best to all of you.Please remove me from the mailing list. So long, John from djfinch@sprintmail.com Tue Oct 13 23:00:39 1998 Subject: Re: 2 sided wonder (was: Lathe?) Dear Richard, I would be interested in a expanded description,ie; moredetails andwhat were the drawbacks?Regards Greg.Fallcreek9@aol.com wrote: List: Just tuned in and saw the posts concerning the two-strip rod. There isto be an article, including drawings, in the next issue of The PlaningFormconcerning the making of the rod shown at the SRG. Until that issue isout,here is a very brief sketch. First, Jack Howell mentioned and gave a very brief description of theprocessin his book, The Lovely Reed. I also ran across a mention of it in AJMcClane's book, The Practical Fly Fisherman, Prentice-Hall, 1953, so theconcept is not new. Basically, two strips for each rod section were squared up, straightenedandnodes flattened. The enamel sides were sanded flat, node staggeringdone andthe strips cut to length. The pith sides were planed to 1/2 the overalldimensions (of a quad) and the strips glued and bound together, pith sidetopith side. Out of the string the power fiber sides were sanded, and thesections were then planed on alternating edge sides to match the overalldimensions across the power fiber sides. At this point I had thesections ofa rod with four sides but that was not a quad in the tradidional sense(friendand list member Carsten Jorgensen of Denmark and I call it the pmq, orpoorman's quad). Completed from that point using normal procedures. Theprojectwas to make a concept rod, and the concept proved quite satisfactory. All inall, a fun project. There are a lot more details, of course, and some drawbacks. Should anyofyou who do not suscribe to The Planing Form wish for more than theabove, letme know and I will post an expanded description. Best Regards,Richard Tyree from swilson1@WHC.NET Tue Oct 13 23:15:55 1998 ; Subject: silk lines My brother has found a silk fly line that was given to me when I wasabout seven years old. I realize that most of the "line restorers" arecurrently (hopefully, temporarily), but there's bound to be someone whocan help. The line is currently in Delaware and I'm in west Texas, so Idon't have much data to go on, but... 1. The line has a "musty" smell, but "looks good"--is there still hope? 2. Is there a standard length for older lines. I hope I didn't choplittle pieces from the line in my youth...(NEVER give a silk fly line toa seven year old who lives in a desert--when there are no fish, childrenhave to find novel uses for such things). 3. How do I determine line weight, taper, etc.. Thanks Scott Wilson from Nodewrrior@aol.com Tue Oct 13 23:19:36 1998 Subject: Re: Oven Forgive me if I missed something, but wouldn't there be a significant riskofvery uneven heat on each end? Rob Hoffhines from bacon@idt.net Tue Oct 13 23:22:20 1998 Subject: Re: Bamboo Only Guide Service Survey Art,Art Port wrote: Jean,I think you may have two of us mixed up. I'm from SI and Richard issomewhere beyond the Great Divide (if I remember correctly). The jokereferred to resorcinol's color because resorcinol is one of the best gluesto use for rodbulding if you don't mind the purple seams it leaves. As formy understanding YOUR comment, I can come up with only two possibleexplanations:1) You also live on SI and the Fresh Kills Dump has affected your genepoolor2) You live in Manhattan and think that all people who live in the Great212Area Code are royalty .Careful with the blades,Art At 09:44 PM 10/13/98 -0700, you wrote:Fallcreek9@aol.com wrote: In a message dated 10/13/98 2:25:27 AM Central Daylight Time,bacon@idt.netwrites: jean >> Jean - I then take it you are blood type O-Resorcinol. Just kidding, ofcourse.RTyreertyree,am to dumb to know what type 0-resourcinol is. but anyone wholives instaten island, new york would know why i bleed purple blood.jeanps (what is it?) Art,did i call you richard? i live on staten island, have been up sincefive a.m., went to spinning class after work, and then playedracquetball..i'm confused...anyhow, i love to flyfish and want to builda canerod! g'nite. jean ps: there are a FEW of us in the 718 area code that are normal, but idon't believe i'm one of them...however 212 definitely does not royaltymake! from k5vkq@ix.netcom.com Tue Oct 13 23:22:37 1998 23:22:04 ix5.ix.netcom.comvia smap (V1.3) Subject: Re: Bamboo Only Guide Service Survey Well, since nothing in the universe is perfect, real happiness comes fromlearning to live with the "warts". Some have few; some of us have morebutas Bob Ross said, "When you finish and you can't see any, it's time to hangit up and quit. You've done as good as you ever will." Regards,Onis PSOne day as I sat lonely and without a friendA voice came to me out of the gloom saying "Cheer up. Things could be worse."So I cheered up and sure enough,Things got worse. Relax: We're all only building fishing poles! ps: the psychological pain of not being perfect when you turn out a rodcan be devastating, don't you agree? from channer@hubwest.com Wed Oct 14 01:33:09 1998 (SMTPD32-4.02c) id A5F230DF0114; Wed, 14 Oct 1998 00:34:26 MDT Subject: Re: Bamboo Only Guide Service Survey At 10:13 PM 10/13/98 -0700, you wrote:TSmithwick@aol.com wrote: In a message dated 10/13/98 7:25:27 AM, you wrote: don't have a good how-to-book. have only built two graphite rods(three piece 7, and two piece 9) i loved it! did you get the albies FROMthe beach, if so, i'm mightily impressed...i was on a boat with a guideand we were in schools of albies which were lovely...the wrist is prettywimpy though, have started wimp wrist weights for women (aka wwww),buti DID haul them in with a lot of yelling from the gestapo guide. irefused to quit. on a spey rod?!, that's so cool. any info on a simplehow-to book would be appreciated (please not too expensive), i have tosave up for the next fishing trip. thanks,jeanps: the psychological pain of not being perfect when you turn out a rodcan be devastating, don't you agree? Jean;The best how-to book for the money is The Lovely Reed by Jack Howell (myappology's to Wayne). You can order it from Amazon.com for about $35.00.Wayne Cattanach's book, Handcrafting Bamboo Fly Rods is already aclassic,plus it has a disk included for designing rod tapers and guide spacing, butit is about $15-$20.00 more money. A Master's Guide to Building BambooFlyRods, by Hoagy Carmichel and Everett Garrison is THE classic, but at$75.00will really dig a hole in your pocket. You mentioned before that you wereinterested in taking a class, George Maurer gives rodmaking classesregularly. He is in Shoemaker, Pa. 610-562-8595. I think that the best wayto start would be to read the rodmaking FAQ's by Bruce Connor and TomPenrose that you can get to thru the Rodmaker's webpage. John Channer from iank@nelson.planet.org.nz Wed Oct 14 02:15:09 1998 ; Wed, 14 Oct 1998 19:14:41 +1200 Subject: Re: silk lines Scott, Darryl and Reed were doing an article for the next or current issue of thebamboo rod magazine so it will probably cover most of what you wish toknow. Reed had two comments on the list setting out restoration techniques inearly October , 1997 . If you look up the archives you should be able tofind these. Silk lines were usually sold in 30 yard standard length for double taperlines , but then there are also some at 25 yards and others at 37 yards.Generally the 37 yard lengths are forward taper and the 25 yard length is generalisation and , particually in heavier weight lines , they were alsosold as 40 yards. These are from post war catologues . The line weight is based on the weight of the first 30 feet of line , ie theaverage casting length . I cannot recall what the various weight for thefirst 30 feet is for each weight number but at a crunch you could weighthefirst 30 feet of a couple of modern lines of known line weight and workoutwhere yours fits in .However I am sure someone else will have thatinformation. regards Iank At 09:21 PM 13/10/98 -0700, you wrote:My brother has found a silk fly line that was given to me when I wasabout seven years old. I realize that most of the "line restorers" arecurrently (hopefully, temporarily), but there's bound to be someone whocan help. The line is currently in Delaware and I'm in west Texas, so Idon't have much data to go on, but... 1. The line has a "musty" smell, but "looks good"--is there still hope? 2. Is there a standard length for older lines. I hope I didn't choplittle pieces from the line in my youth...(NEVER give a silk fly line toa seven year old who lives in a desert--when there are no fish, childrenhave to find novel uses for such things). 3. How do I determine line weight, taper, etc.. Thanks Scott Wilson Ian Kearney phone 0064 03 5445556104 Champion Road Fax 0064 03 5440374Richmond New Zealand email inak@ts.co.nz from saltwein@swbell.net Wed Oct 14 06:12:40 1998 gw3adm.rcsntx.swbell.net GAA12382 Subject: Rodmakers Books Jean;The best how-to book for the money is The Lovely Reed by Jack Howell(myappology's to Wayne). You can order it from Amazon.com for about $35.00.Wayne Cattanach's book, Handcrafting Bamboo Fly Rods is already aclassic,plus it has a disk included for designing rod tapers and guide spacing, butit is about $15-$20.00 more money. A Master's Guide to Building BambooFlyRods, by Hoagy Carmichel and Everett Garrison is THE classic, but at$75.00will really dig a hole in your pocket. You mentioned before that you wereinterested in taking a class, George Maurer gives rodmaking classesregularly. He is in Shoemaker, Pa. 610-562-8595. I think that the bestwayto start would be to read the rodmaking FAQ's by Bruce Connor and TomPenrose that you can get to thru the Rodmaker's webpage. John Channer Jean, Being in NYC, probably all of these books are available at your publiclibrary. Regards, SteveIndependence, MO from TSmithwick@aol.com Wed Oct 14 07:08:07 1998 Subject: Re: Starting out (was Bamboo Only Guide Service Survey) Jean - The Albies were from the beach, but that is a bit easier to do on theVineyard. John Channer's book advice is on the money. I think "The LovelyReed" is user friendly for a true beginner. Read it, and then get a StanleyorRecord 9 1/2 plane and learn how to sharpen it. Then you will be ready tostart. The whole business looks daunting, but it is all a series of smallsteps. If you persevere, you can do it, and it becomes easier with practice. from andrew_harsanyi@ibi.com Wed Oct 14 07:58:51 1998 0400 Subject: Re[2]: Bamboo Only Guide Service Survey Jean...Wayne also has a video version of his book which I actually prefer.That combined with a book is really helpful. The video was around $45 I thinkand wasavailable from several sources including Cabela's...Andy ______________________________ Reply Separator_________________________________Subject: Re: Bamboo Only Guide Service Survey Author: at Tcpgate At 10:13 PM 10/13/98 -0700, you wrote:TSmithwick@aol.com wrote: In a message dated 10/13/98 7:25:27 AM, you wrote: don't have a good how-to-book. have only built two graphite rods(three piece 7, and two piece 9) i loved it! did you get the albies FROMthe beach, if so, i'm mightily impressed...i was on a boat with a guideand we were in schools of albies which were lovely...the wrist is prettywimpy though, have started wimp wrist weights for women (aka wwww),buti DID haul them in with a lot of yelling from the gestapo guide. irefused to quit. on a spey rod?!, that's so cool. any info on a simplehow-to book would be appreciated (please not too expensive), i have tosave up for the next fishing trip. thanks,jeanps: the psychological pain of not being perfect when you turn out a rodcan be devastating, don't you agree? Jean;The best how-to book for the money is The Lovely Reed by Jack Howell (myappology's to Wayne). You can order it from Amazon.com for about $35.00.Wayne Cattanach's book, Handcrafting Bamboo Fly Rods is already aclassic,plus it has a disk included for designing rod tapers and guide spacing, butit is about $15-$20.00 more money. A Master's Guide to Building BambooFlyRods, by Hoagy Carmichel and Everett Garrison is THE classic, but at$75.00will really dig a hole in your pocket. You mentioned before that you wereinterested in taking a class, George Maurer gives rodmaking classesregularly. He is in Shoemaker, Pa. 610-562-8595. I think that the best wayto start would be to read the rodmaking FAQ's by Bruce Connor and TomPenrose that you can get to thru the Rodmaker's webpage. John Channer from sniderja@email.uc.edu Wed Oct 14 08:33:44 1998 Subject: reel seat inserts Have recently been turning my own reel seats on a wood lathe. Whenroutingthe "groove" in the reel seat, some of the woods tend to "burn," especiallyfiddleback maple. I don't have a variable speed router (and suspect thatthis may be the problem).Would purchasing a reostat to control speed beanyhelp? Any suggestions, comments, recommendations? Thanks in advance.Jerry Snider from stetzer@csd.uwm.edu Wed Oct 14 09:40:14 1998 batch3.csd.uwm.edu (8.8.4/8.6.8) with ESMTP id JAA25811 for (8.8.4/8.6.8)with SMTP id JAA29944 for ; Wed, 14 Oct1998 09:40:05 Subject: Re: Glue Strength When I look at a spec sheet for a glue, it is full of strange ancronyms.Like "TG(F) for R/T" and "P/C" and "Tensile Modulus". Does anyone (John Zimny?) have a reference where I can look up what these mean? Whenever we have a question about glues and we say "anyone" werespectfully follow it by "John Zimny?" in parentheses. Its a bounty having him on this list. Maybe this would make an article "Adhesives Update III" for TPF.......................................................................Frank Stetzer "...a cheerful comrade is betterstetzer@uwm.edu than a waterproof coat and a Employed by, but not speaking for foot-warmer." Henry Van Dyke,Univ of Wisconsin-Milwaukee, USA "Fisherman's Luck", 1899. from ljrp@penn.com Wed Oct 14 11:30:56 1998 Subject: Re: Fish on Bamboo. I live in Huntingdon County Pennsylvania near Lake Raystown, The LittleJuniataRiver and Spruce Creek. We are 30 Miles from State College and SpringCreek 40 from Penns Creek. Great trout area Canerods@aol.com wrote: In a message dated 10/13/98 6:04:49 PM Pacific Daylight Time,ljrp@penn.comwrites: You guys should fish the Little Juniata River or Spruce Creek here athome inCentral Pa Dick, Are you near there? My wife's family is from Orefield plus the B-in-Lhas juststarted to fly fish in the area. He's a life long "spinner" that had to learnFF so as to be able to fish the Yellowstone area with me. Don B. from caneboy@xtn.net Wed Oct 14 11:34:50 1998 0400 Subject: Smokies WDHCJL@aol.com,Have you ever taken the boat across Fontanna and fished Hazel Creek? from richjez@enteract.com Wed Oct 14 11:38:20 1998 0000 Subject: Illinois trout Anyone near NE Illinois who is starved for trout can go to Sand Pond in thenorth unit of Illinois Beach State Park. They were stocked last week andthepond opens for trout fishing on 10/17/98. It is usually shoulder to shoulder crowded on opening day with spincasters.There are plenty of left over trout after the weekend that will take a fly. It is amazing the amount of plastic I have found in the trout's stomach. Rich Jezioro *________________________________)// Rich Jezioro @ /||/______/_||_________________________________________|| /\ / \ > > from eric.koehler@meissner-wurst.com Wed Oct 14 12:05:46 1998 user@gateus.meissner-wurst.com 12:08:20 gateus.meissner-wurst.com via smap (4.0a) (5.0.1460.8) Subject: Forbes Article There's an article in Forbes' online magazine which some of you may findinteresting: http://www.forbes.com/forbes/98/1019/6209116a.htm The article, as you'd expect given that it's in Forbes, has a distinctivebusiness slant to it. BTW, I think our server has been acting funny and I've recieved very fewlist messages for more than a day... So if this is redundant, please excusethe repetition. Eck from thramer@presys.com Wed Oct 14 12:11:09 1998 0000 Subject: Re: Rod identification David Dodd wrote: List, I have the butt section of the Tonka Queen and am looking for a tip tomakethe 7'6" or the 7' 9"rod.Any body have a tip to get rid of. Also List, Some one asked for the mic'd sizes of the rod I have. Lost the EMAILwhen Itransfered from officeto home Email. I owe you an answer and don't have an off list address. (Ithought that I could readthrough the "list" during my lunch at my desk, WRONG....this is great.)My Wife is watching theplay-offs (she's a baseball, basketball, hockey, nut) and I'm on the listdoing my thing. Later,"Newbie" Daveddodd@hrfn.net -----Original Message-----From: Dick Fogel Date: Monday, October 12, 1998 7:16 PMSubject: Re: Rod identification In good original condition, they bring about 220.00 with one tip. Nicelittle rod!! bob maulucci wrote: Sorry,I should have mentioned that the Tonka Queen is an HI rod notMontague.Oops.Bob At 08:56 PM 10/11/98 -0500, you wrote:At 09:53 PM 10/11/98 -0400, you wrote:Skip, Just read your note on Montigue Rod. What is a short history ofMontigue?I bought a cane rod butt the other day with a scared decal that hasUtica,NYas location of manufacturer. It is inscribed "Tonkin Cane" and 180*out itis labeled "Tonka Queen" Any ideas of what I have? -----------------------------Bob Maulucci218 Wallace Ave.Buffalo, New York 14216716-836-8297 http://www.buffnet.net/~bobbo/welcome.htm "Establish a better reputation for honesty in your home community;thenyou wont have to bring in dead fish to prove that your not a liar." -Kenneth Reid I don't have a tip but I do have the taper tucked away if that wouldhelp.A.J.Thramer from Fallcreek9@aol.com Wed Oct 14 13:56:34 1998 Subject: Re: Remove from List In a message dated 10/13/98 9:57:48 PM Central Daylight Time,AAARPTRADEUSA@webtv.net writes: John: You have contributed well. Wish you would stick around.Best Regards,Richard from Ed_Estlow%SRM@srminc.com Wed Oct 14 14:39:17 1998 (651.26-10-1998)) id 8625669D.006CABE2 ; Wed, 14 Oct 1998 14:46:58 - 0500 Subject: A Different Survey List, Don't know what is going on. My server is goofy and the list's may beexperiencing problems, too. I hope this request isn't redundant. Thanks forthe tolerance of the bandwidth taken. My ninth grade daughter has an economics project for school that coulduseyour help. She is conducting a survey looking for data on the purchase ofbamboo rods. If anyone who has bought a rod to use for fishing in the lastseveral years (source and maker not important) would plesae fill out thesurvey and e-mail it back to me PRIVATELY, I'd really appreciate it. Thanks in advance. -Ed Estloweestlow@srminc.com SURVEY 1) How much money did you spend on your bamboo fly rod? 2) Do you like the feel and weight of your rod (yes or no)? 3) Are you happy with the performance of your rod (yes or no)? 4) How old is your rod (years/months)? 5) How long have you been using your bamboo rod (years/months)? 6) Was it worth the investment (yes or no)? 7) Did you buy a new or used rod) from richard.nantel@videotron.ca Wed Oct 14 14:43:47 1998 (modemcable31.174.mmtl.videotron.net) sims.3.5.1998.07.14.10.43)with SMTP id for Subject: RE: Oven I'm not sure there would be considering the oven is pre-heated prior toinserting the splines. By then, the temperature may have had a chance tostabilize throughout the oven-tunnel. Richard -----Original Message----- Nodewrrior@aol.com Subject: Re: Oven Forgive me if I missed something, but wouldn't there be a significant riskofvery uneven heat on each end? Rob Hoffhines from jczimny@dol.net Wed Oct 14 14:49:49 1998 Subject: Re: reel seat inserts Check the condition of the cutter. Sounds like it's not sharp.John Z----- Original Message----- Subject: reel seat inserts Have recently been turning my own reel seats on a wood lathe. Whenroutingthe "groove" in the reel seat, some of the woods tend to "burn," especiallyfiddleback maple. I don't have a variable speed router (and suspect thatthis may be the problem).Would purchasing a reostat to control speed beanyhelp? Any suggestions, comments, recommendations? Thanks in advance.Jerry Snider from jczimny@dol.net Wed Oct 14 14:50:31 1998 Subject: Re: Glue Strength Yes, but I can't find it. I've been turning my shop upsidedown for 2 dayslooking for it.Frustrated,John Z-----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Glue Strength When I look at a spec sheet for a glue, it is full of strange ancronyms.Like "TG(F) for R/T" and "P/C" and "Tensile Modulus". Does anyone (John Zimny?) have a reference where I can look up whatthese mean? Whenever we have a question about glues and we say "anyone" werespectfullyfollow it by "John Zimny?" in parentheses. Its a bounty having him onthis list. Maybe this would make an article "Adhesives Update III" for TPF.......................................................................Frank Stetzer "...a cheerful comrade is betterstetzer@uwm.edu than a waterproof coat and aEmployed by, but not speaking for foot-warmer." Henry Van Dyke,Univ of Wisconsin-Milwaukee, USA "Fisherman's Luck", 1899. from RVenneri@aol.com Wed Oct 14 14:53:25 1998 Subject: Re: reel seat inserts Jerry,Getting a reostat will help a little bit. but you will have to slow down thefeed or you will get blow outs of the wood. Here are some of the things tolook for when burning is happening. 1. Don't take the piece right from the lathe and rout it. Some times thewood will be warm let it cool off. 2. Make sure the bit is sharp and clean. No residue on the cutter clean offwith a small stone this also will put a slightly Keener edge also. 3. Try to find some kind of lube to put on the bit or work. Sometimes Iusea little dish soap. There are products you can buy to lubricate with. And of course try to slow the cutter down with a reostat while slowingthefeed rate down to avoid blowouts. Some wood no matter what you do will burn I also have trouble with thisto. Hope this helps Bob VRobert Venneri's Custom Components21 Chuck Hill RdSaugerties NY 12477914 246 5882 from pdcorlis@nidc.edu Wed Oct 14 14:54:38 1998 with Novell_GroupWise; Wed, 14 Oct 1998 12:55:11 -0700 Subject: Re: Remove from List OAA07134 Oh no John... DUMB questions??? Holy cow, I'm so new to this stuff that I can't evenask dumbquestions yet... but I'm sticking around with my mouth shut and my eyesopen...this place is amazing! Phil from rdonnely@webtv.net Wed Oct 14 15:00:06 1998 112.iap.bryant.webtv.net (8.8.8/ms.gso.08Dec97) with 112.iap.bryant.webtv.net(8.8.8/mt.gso.26Feb98) id NAA11519; Wed, 14 Oct 1998 13:00:05 -0700 ETAtAhQSZsgn9GMM3CHYhinn6DaaiwkAEgIVAIjNF4k2cjUil8UtQQS3dGf3m7eF Subject: Re: reel seat inserts --WebTV-Mail-552380082-54 I use a speed controller ( from Trendlines) on my router. Am cuttingapple, pear and cherry.All subject to burning. Most routers are very high speed and controllerwill cut that way down. Will not operate on a motor w/condensor Ray --WebTV-Mail-552380082-54 (mailsorter-101.iap.bryant.webtv.net (8.8.8/po.gso.24Feb98) mailsorter-101.iap.bryant.webtv.net (8.8.8/ms.graham.14Aug97) with wugate.wustl.edu(8.8.8/8.8.5) (8.8.8/8.8.5)with SMTP id OAA12308 for ; Wed, 14Oct Subject: Re: reel seat inserts Check the condition of the cutter. Sounds like it's not sharp.John Z----- Original Message----- Subject: reel seat inserts Have recently been turning my own reel seats on a wood lathe. Whenroutingthe "groove" in the reel seat, some of the woods tend to "burn," especiallyfiddleback maple. I don't have a variable speed router (and suspect thatthis may be the problem).Would purchasing a reostat to control speed beanyhelp? Any suggestions, comments, recommendations? Thanks in advance.Jerry Snider --WebTV-Mail-552380082-54-- from jkallo@midwest.net Wed Oct 14 16:03:42 1998 Subject: binding material All this talk about the acceptability of dumb questions has made me braveenough to ask a question I have been thinking of for a week or so. I amgetting close to doing the final planing of my strips (am working ongetting the last couple tip strips down to within .01 or so) and after thatI'll glue them up as soon as I can. I have decided to bind this one byhand. I have been postulating what I am going to use for bindingthread--whether I should order some, use kite string etc. I keep wonderingabout a material I have never heard anyone suggest for this task: dentalfloss. Here's my case: The stuff is really, really tough. Try taking apiece and breaking it between your hands (have band-aids close by for thecuts it makes). Its is woven loose so it sort of contours when laid oversomething under pressure (like silk winding thread). Its waxed--isn't thisa great boon when pulling the stuff off? Seems to me (never having donethis, of course) that it would work really well. What would be thedrawbacks? Joe Joseph S. KalloDpt. of PhilosophySouthern Illinois University at Carbondale from mcdowellc@lanecc.edu Wed Oct 14 16:20:00 1998 via smap(4.1) Subject: RE: Binding Material Joe, I don't know of any drawbacks except maybe cost and the short lengths the stuff is packaged in. If you could locate a large combat sized roll of dental floss, then that would work. Mint flavored might leave a residue that would enhance the otherwise ugly job of scraping and sanding the blank. The stuff is definitely tough. Chrismcdowellc@lanecc.edu from k5vkq@ix.netcom.com Wed Oct 14 17:06:47 1998 17:06:14 ix14.ix.netcom.comvia smap (V1.3) Subject: Re: binding material Hello Joe. I've been using dental floss in binding my rods. I am using ita little different from what you plan however. I am using "Gore" brandfloss. I pre-bind my rod using the electronic technician method of cablelacing. I arrange the strips on my bench (a couple of pieces of maskingtape or double sided tape to hold them fixed.) Then I brush the glue on (Iuse epoxy). I gather them together, tie the end of the floss to the end ofthe bench, and lace using the lacing shown in old technician text. When Ireach the end, I tie it off and hang the blank from a hook on the cealing.I then wipe off the excess epoxy using a cloth dipped in acetone. I thentake the blank and straighten as best as I can and then run it through mybinder. I have a Milward type of binder. I use a bobin with quiltingthread to attach a wire loop (usually a paper clip) to each end. I thenstraighten it a second time (if you start in the middle and work towardtheend, the blank will straighten easier). Once I have it as straight as Ican, I hang it back on the hook and hang a 15 lb weight to the other endand leave it 24 hours. I am really satisfied with the blanks this way. The disadvantage of the floss is that most is polyxxxx. Heat it and itmelts so you need cotton thread for heat treating. I strip mine off after24 hours and rebind with quilting thread. Hope this helps. Regards,Onisk5vkq@ix.netcom.com At 04:01 PM 10/14/98 -0500, you wrote: All this talk about the acceptability of dumb questions has made mebraveenough to ask a question I have been thinking of for a week or so. I amgetting close to doing the final planing of my strips (am working ongetting the last couple tip strips down to within .01 or so) and after thatI'll glue them up as soon as I can. I have decided to bind this one byhand. I have been postulating what I am going to use for bindingthread--whether I should order some, use kite string etc. I keepwonderingabout a material I have never heard anyone suggest for this task: dentalfloss. Here's my case: The stuff is really, really tough. Try taking apiece and breaking it between your hands (have band-aids close by for thecuts it makes). Its is woven loose so it sort of contours when laid oversomething under pressure (like silk winding thread). Its waxed--isn't thisa great boon when pulling the stuff off? Seems to me (never having donethis, of course) that it would work really well. What would be thedrawbacks? Joe Joseph S. KalloDpt. of PhilosophySouthern Illinois University at Carbondale from paul.york@noble.net Wed Oct 14 17:13:32 1998 (5.5.2232.9) Subject: RE: A Different Survey ----------From: Ed_Estlow%SRM@srminc.com Sent: Wednesday, October 14, 1998 1:21 PM Subject: A Different Survey List, Don't know what is going on. My server is goofy and the list's may beexperiencing problems, too. I hope this request isn't redundant. Thanksforthe tolerance of the bandwidth taken. My ninth grade daughter has an economics project for school that coulduseyour help. She is conducting a survey looking for data on the purchase ofbamboo rods. If anyone who has bought a rod to use for fishing in the lastseveral years (source and maker not important) would plesae fill out thesurvey and e-mail it back to me PRIVATELY, I'd really appreciate it. Thanks in advance. -Ed Estloweestlow@srminc.com SURVEY 1) How much money did you spend on your bamboo fly rod? Have several ranging from 30.00 to 160.00 2) Do you like the feel and weight of your rod (yes or no)?Yes 3) Are you happy with the performance of your rod (yes or no)?Yes 4) How old is your rod (years/months)?Ranging from 110 to 45 years 5) How long have you been using your bamboo rod (years/months)?12 years 6) Was it worth the investment (yes or no)?YES 7) Did you buy a new or used rod)Used Paul York from rmoon@ida.net Wed Oct 14 17:24:36 1998 Subject: Re: binding material boundary="------------EC8AE7EB4F93C616BD5C7D93" --------------EC8AE7EB4F93C616BD5C7D93 Joe, Unwaxed dental floss might be ok, but I will not ever ever use waxedthread or string on my rods. Just remember that varnish will not dryover wax. Glazed cord is far away the best and the price is notprohibitive. You get enough on a spool to last several lifetimes and itis under $20 as I remember. There was a mention just a week or so agoabout a source on the rodlist. Finally. This is just my humble opinionand I probably run counter to a number of other rod makers, but I firmlybelieve that it is impossible to pressure wind a rod by hand. Nor is itpossible to do with bobbins. You want the best glue joint you can getand virtually all adhesives you will be using give a better bond underpressure. Pressure that you cannot achieve with a single thread comingoff your hands Go back and read Garrison. Then go make a bindingmachine. It will take less than $20 and an afternoon of work. Don'tjeopardize good workmanship with half-*** procedures.Ralph --------------EC8AE7EB4F93C616BD5C7D93 Joe, Unwaxed dental floss might be ok, but I will not ever ever use waxed is just my humble opinion and I probably run counter to a number of otherrod makers, but I firmly believe that it is impossible You want the best glue joint you can get and virtually all adhesives you workmanship with half-*** procedures.Ralph --------------EC8AE7EB4F93C616BD5C7D93-- from iank@nelson.planet.org.nz Wed Oct 14 17:28:07 1998 ; Thu, 15 Oct 1998 10:27:59 +1200 Subject: Re: binding material Joe , My somewhat limited experience with binding cord suggests you do nothave tobe overly fussy with what you use . Various books suggest use ofeverything from butchers cord to kite string. The local sewing shops had never heardof"glaced" thread so I bought a roll of cotton weaving thread that lookedabout the right size and it worked fine for the first few rods . When I ranout one Sunday morning I was able to purchase a roll of thin cotton string from the local hardware shop which was open and it was fine except alittlebulky for the butt section going through the pipe in a Tom Smithfieldbinder. I would wonder about dental floss on two counts . Firstly it may not bepurecotton in which case it may not be suitable for binding strips if they areto be heat treated . ie it might soften or melt . There have been mentionsof nice crisscross designs on cane which has been heated with cord whichhasmelted in heating and left burn lines where the cord was.Secondly the waxmay leave some residue which could create some problems whenvarnishing. I follow Jack Howells advice and use a slow hardening epoxy for gluingrods, and then about two days after binding take the binding cord off beforetheepoxy has gone fully hard . The cord just winds off , with the occasionalhelp from a fingernail . regards IankAt 04:01 PM 14/10/98 -0500, you wrote: All this talk about the acceptability of dumb questions has made mebraveenough to ask a question I have been thinking of for a week or so. I amgetting close to doing the final planing of my strips (am working ongetting the last couple tip strips down to within .01 or so) and after thatI'll glue them up as soon as I can. I have decided to bind this one byhand. I have been postulating what I am going to use for bindingthread--whether I should order some, use kite string etc. I keepwonderingabout a material I have never heard anyone suggest for this task: dentalfloss. Here's my case: The stuff is really, really tough. Try taking apiece and breaking it between your hands (have band-aids close by for thecuts it makes). Its is woven loose so it sort of contours when laid oversomething under pressure (like silk winding thread). Its waxed--isn't thisa great boon when pulling the stuff off? Seems to me (never having donethis, of course) that it would work really well. What would be thedrawbacks? Joe Joseph S. KalloDpt. of PhilosophySouthern Illinois University at Carbondale Ian Kearney phone 0064 03 5445556104 Champion Road Fax 0064 03 5440374Richmond New Zealand email inak@ts.co.nz from irvine@bamboorods.org Wed Oct 14 17:58:03 1998 qa022844 for; Wed, 14 Oct 1998 16:00:20 -0700 Subject: Re: binding material Joe, I use waxed dental floss to bind ferrule when i glue them for thereasonsyou mentioned strenght and glue does not stick, so should work fine forbindingyour strips.Chuck Joseph S.Kallo wrote: All this talk about the acceptability of dumb questions has made mebraveenough to ask a question I have been thinking of for a week or so. I amgetting close to doing the final planing of my strips (am working ongetting the last couple tip strips down to within .01 or so) and after thatI'll glue them up as soon as I can. I have decided to bind this one byhand. I have been postulating what I am going to use for bindingthread--whether I should order some, use kite string etc. I keepwonderingabout a material I have never heard anyone suggest for this task: dentalfloss. Here's my case: The stuff is really, really tough. Try taking apiece and breaking it between your hands (have band-aids close by forthecuts it makes). Its is woven loose so it sort of contours when laid oversomething under pressure (like silk winding thread). Its waxed--isn'tthisa great boon when pulling the stuff off? Seems to me (never having donethis, of course) that it would work really well. What would be thedrawbacks? Joe Joseph S. KalloDpt. of PhilosophySouthern Illinois University at Carbondale from fbcwin@fsbnet.com Wed Oct 14 18:50:59 1998 0500 Subject: Re: Gatlinburg? Doug,The FFF National Conclave will be held in Gatlinburg in June 1999. OurownRalph Moon coordinated a Bamboo Rod Symposium at the Conclave in 1998. Thereare rumors of a second Bamboo symposium at the Conclave in Gatlinburg.Hope this helps,Harry Boyd WDHCJL@aol.com wrote: In a message dated 98-10-12 15:24:24 EDT, you write: planning a second annual bamboo rod symposium. >> I guess I missed that. The Smokys are my "hang out". Any details oneitherthe first one or the possible second get-a-gether? from iank@nelson.planet.org.nz Wed Oct 14 19:07:39 1998 ; Thu, 15 Oct 1998 12:07:28 +1200 Subject: Re: Fish on Bamboo. Terry, Down here we do not call then fish unless they are over 15 inches , and donot talk about them unless they are 24".. Sorry ..:)) Iank ps I have the week off and it has been raining none stop and the rivers areall in flood !! At 01:51 AM 14/10/98 GMT, you wrote:I don't know how the rest of the SRG made out, fishing. didn't reallyhear.I took a 14in (+/-) Sunday afternoon on the North Fork, just below theboatramp. They'd been generating, but the water was only up about 1 1/2 or2ft. It WAS tearing through the valley though. Kinda reminded me of some ofthewestern rivers. I was fishing a dry on my 7 1/2 ft. Japanese rebuilt. A little heavy,butcloser to what I'm looking for in an action. It was a nice fish. Ifishedwith another (graphite) rod builder, for about another hour and got onemorefish on, but lost it. The fella was a nice guy and we had a ball justfishing,without much talk. Just an occasional, "there's one over there."He landed a nice 10in rainbow, not long before I had to leave. A good end of a very nice weekend. I did catch one more smaller trout on the White, on a virgin rod that amemberof FF@ made for me. No longer virgin. Took it on a wet fly just at sunset,at wildcat shoales . Terry "Sunfish" KirkpatrickSafety Harbor, Fl.(Old Tampa Bay)sats@gte.net Ian Kearney phone 0064 03 5445556104 Champion Road Fax 0064 03 5440374Richmond New Zealand email inak@ts.co.nz from gc.williams@MCIONE.com Wed Oct 14 19:34:05 1998 with ESMTP id forrodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu; Thu, 15 Oct 1998 00:33:06 +0000 (GMT) Subject: Fw: Southeastern Rodmakers Fall Homecoming 2000 This is the original post I listed back around the first of the month.After receiving input both on and off the list there's definitely enoughinterest in putting an event like this on in the Southeast. I'm notfamiliar with the FFF events, but we don't need to duplicate our efforts soI would suggest that a separate event be entirely different or we pool ourresources. Stay tuned. By the way, thanks for all the support. Gary W.----------From: GGWilliams Subject: Southeastern Rodmakers Fall Homecoming 2000Date: Thursday, October 01, 1998 8:31 PM This is an idea (the name is just something I pulled out of the air) I'vebeen contemplating for a few months and this seems as good a time asanytorun it by the list. We now have rod building conventions, gatherings, conclaves, meetings,etc.in the northwest,northeast, south, and southwest. It only seems fitting that we considerhaving one here in the southeast as well. Basically what I'm proposing is getting together here in the southeastsomewhere such as Gatlinburg, Knoxville, etc. during the fall leaf color(mid-October), with close proximity to the Great Smoky MountainsNationalPark, Cherokee National Forest and the Tennessee Valley Authority lakesandtailwaters, in the year 2000. Of course all the details aren't available that's why I'd like to get thelists comments and determine if there's enough interest among fellowrodbuilders here in the southeast to host such an event. Thanks. from ragnarig@integrityol.com Wed Oct 14 19:34:44 1998 (SMTPD32-4.06) id A56FEE50120; Wed, 14 Oct 1998 17:44:31 PDT Subject: Re: Remove from List JOHN,The only dumb questions are those not asked-I've asked a few "dumb "onesmyself. Please don't leave the list-I've enjoyed your posts.Regards,Hank Woolman. Dear John What he said. Davy from WDHCJL@aol.com Wed Oct 14 19:47:46 1998 Subject: Re: binding material, again here is your source guys Atlanta Thread and SupplyStockbridge, GAThey will ship. Call info for number (or check earlier post) from dickay@alltel.net Wed Oct 14 19:49:02 1998 TAA09994 Subject: Re: Jerry,The cap has been ordered and should be ready by this Friday, October 16,1998. No check is necessary as I will gladly make this contribution forthe help that Wayne has been to me. I will send the cap to Wayne as soon as it is done. It reads: St. WayneRodmaker Patron Dick Fuhrman dickay@alltel.net from WDHCJL@aol.com Wed Oct 14 19:50:28 1998 Subject: Re: binding material Atlanta Thread And Supply695 Red Oak RdStockbridge, GA 30281- 4369Phone: (770) 389-9115 from dpeaston@wzrd.com Wed Oct 14 19:52:29 1998 mail.wzrd.com(8.9.1/8.7.3) with SMTP id UAA25674; Wed, 14 Oct 1998 20:46:23 -0400 Subject: Re: Rod identification At 10:18 AM 10/14/98 -0700, A.J.Thramer wrote:I don't have a tip but I do have the taper tucked away if that wouldhelp.A.J.Thramer I have a good butt section tucked away. The taper would be nice to have. Thanks,Doug EastonTonawanda, NY from emiller257@dataflo.net Wed Oct 14 19:58:55 1998 wddataflo.dataflo.net (8.8.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id UAA16744 for Subject: Re: Illinois trout Rich Jezioro wrote: Anyone near NE Illinois who is starved for trout can go to Sand Pond inthenorth unit of Illinois Beach State Park. They were stocked last week andthepond opens for trout fishing on 10/17/98. It is usually shoulder to shoulder crowded on opening day with spincasters.There are plenty of left over trout after the weekend that will take a fly. It is amazing the amount of plastic I have found in the trout's stomach. Rich Jezioro*________________________________)// Rich Jezioro@ /||/______/_||_________________________________________||/\/ \ > > / \ >Rich, do you need a trout stamp to fish there? I have just aregularIll fish license but I would love to try this spot. from KDLoup@aol.com Wed Oct 14 20:13:37 1998 Subject: Re: binding material Joe,I tried waxed dental floss in my binder, but the floss didn't glidethrough the tensioning devices. Unwaxed may work, but the cotton crochetthread I use works just fine. At glue up, I'll bet waxed floss will workfine Kurt Loup from LECLAIR123@aol.com Wed Oct 14 20:32:33 1998 Subject: Re: reel seat inserts Jerry,Changing the speed of the router won't help. That'snot the problem. You are moving the filler too slow. I havethe same problem if I go too slow. You have to keep the fillermoving across the router blade. I have a fixture made up withan adjustable stop at the end of my router table. I start atthe right end of the filler and buzz right across until I hitthe stop and then pull the filler away from the blade. Also, make sure that your router bit is Sharp. If is the slightestbit dull, it will burn the wood also. Dave L. from thramer@presys.com Wed Oct 14 20:36:20 1998 0000 Subject: Re: binding material Joseph S.Kallo wrote: All this talk about the acceptability of dumb questions has made mebraveenough to ask a question I have been thinking of for a week or so. I amgetting close to doing the final planing of my strips (am working ongetting the last couple tip strips down to within .01 or so) and after thatI'll glue them up as soon as I can. I have decided to bind this one byhand. I have been postulating what I am going to use for bindingthread--whether I should order some, use kite string etc. I keepwonderingabout a material I have never heard anyone suggest for this task: dentalfloss. Here's my case: The stuff is really, really tough. Try taking apiece and breaking it between your hands (have band-aids close by forthecuts it makes). Its is woven loose so it sort of contours when laid oversomething under pressure (like silk winding thread). Its waxed--isn'tthisa great boon when pulling the stuff off? Seems to me (never having donethis, of course) that it would work really well. What would be thedrawbacks? Joe Joseph S. KalloDpt. of PhilosophySouthern Illinois University at CarbondaleHi Joe,I guess we will know who is the culprit when the 'gingivitus' epidemicbreaks out in Illinois.A.J.Thramer from thramer@presys.com Wed Oct 14 20:41:27 1998 0000 Subject: Tonka Queen I will dig up the taper and post it when I get a chance. The one Irefinished cast quite well. Everyone does SOMETHING right:) A bit toofast for my taste though.A.J.Thramer from tyoung@perth.dialix.com.au Wed Oct 14 20:44:34 1998 Thu, 15 Oct 1998 09:43:35 +0800 (WST)(envelope- from tyoung) Subject: Re: Remove from List On Tue, 13 Oct 1998, John Schestag wrote: This fine list is way out of my league as I am such a beginner. I feelthat my questions sound stupid. I wish all the best to all of you.Please remove me from the mailing list. So long, John John,no such thing as a stupid question. Don't feel shy nor intimidated and keep asking. Tony /***********************************************************************/Tony Younghttp://www.iinet.net.au/~mainpeak/flyrod.htmlThe Australian connection A computer without windows is like a fish without a bicycle /***********************************************************************/ from tyoung@perth.dialix.com.au Wed Oct 14 20:50:30 1998 Thu, 15 Oct 1998 09:49:14 +0800 (WST)(envelope- from tyoung) Subject: Re: reel seat inserts On Wed, 14 Oct 1998, Jerry Snider wrote: Have recently been turning my own reel seats on a wood lathe. Whenroutingthe "groove" in the reel seat, some of the woods tend to "burn,"especiallyfiddleback maple. I don't have a variable speed router (and suspect thatthis may be the problem).Would purchasing a reostat to control speed beanyhelp? Any suggestions, comments, recommendations? Thanks in advance.Jerry Snider Jerry,try making the reel seat blank a bit linger than the intended finished size and leave two sides at the "pushing" end square. This way the square sides will prevent the blank from spinning and because the blank is longer you have something to work with. Tony /***********************************************************************/Tony Younghttp://www.iinet.net.au/~mainpeak/flyrod.htmlThe Australian connection A computer without windows is like a fish without a bicycle /***********************************************************************/ from flyrod6@juno.com Wed Oct 14 21:14:11 1998 22:13:03 EDT Subject: Re: A Different Survey Ed Where are you located? I new an Ed Estlow once. Mark HallowellOn Wed, 14 Oct 1998 14:21:25 -0500 Ed_Estlow%SRM@srminc.com writes: List, Don't know what is going on. My server is goofy and the list's may beexperiencing problems, too. I hope this request isn't redundant. Thanks forthe tolerance of the bandwidth taken. My ninth grade daughter has an economics project for school that could useyour help. She is conducting a survey looking for data on the purchase ofbamboo rods. If anyone who has bought a rod to use for fishing in the lastseveral years (source and maker not important) would plesae fill out thesurvey and e-mail it back to me PRIVATELY, I'd really appreciate it. Thanks in advance. -Ed Estloweestlow@srminc.com SURVEY 1) How much money did you spend on your bamboo fly rod? 2) Do you like the feel and weight of your rod (yes or no)? 3) Are you happy with the performance of your rod (yes or no)? 4) How old is your rod (years/months)? 5) How long have you been using your bamboo rod (years/months)? 6) Was it worth the investment (yes or no)? 7) Did you buy a new or used rod) ___________________________________________________________________You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e- mail.Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.comor call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654- 5866] from channer@hubwest.com Wed Oct 14 21:59:34 1998 (SMTPD32-4.02c) id A566D400140; Wed, 14 Oct 1998 21:00:54 MDT Subject: Re: reel seat inserts At 09:30 AM 10/14/98 -0400, you wrote:Have recently been turning my own reel seats on a wood lathe. Whenroutingthe "groove" in the reel seat, some of the woods tend to "burn," especiallyfiddleback maple. I don't have a variable speed router (and suspect thatthis may be the problem).Would purchasing a reostat to control speed beanyhelp? Any suggestions, comments, recommendations? Thanks in advance.Jerry Snider Jerry;It is possible that it will help, but what will work better for you is toapproach full depth gradually, use a series of lighter cute on the woodsthat burn. Also, a steady feed rate is mandatory, he who hesitates burnshis wood. John Channer from robert.kope@MCI2000.com Wed Oct 14 23:21:29 1998 with SMTP id forRODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu;Thu, 15 Oct 1998 04:20:55 +0000 (GMT) Subject: Pliobond ferrule cement boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000D_01BDF7B8.A639F060" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000D_01BDF7B8.A639F060 I've seen several references to using Pliobond for ferrule cement and =also seen this referred to as contact cement. I'm intrigued. Contact =cement is tenacious and flexible, but in most applications, contact =cement is apploied to both surfaces, allowed to dry, and cannot be =repositioned after the two surfaces come in contact with each other. = What is pliobond, and how do you use it? Is this the same pliobond used = this is contact cement, will any contact cement do or is it something =special? Thanks in advance, - Robert Kope ------=_NextPart_000_000D_01BDF7B8.A639F060 I've seen several references to = applications, contact cement is apploied to both surfaces, allowed to = cannot be repositioned after the two surfaces come in contact with What is pliobond, and how do youuse = Is this the same pliobond used for coating line-to-leader knots, or is = = is it something special? Thanks in advance, - Robert =Kope ------=_NextPart_000_000D_01BDF7B8.A639F060-- from HomeyDKlown@worldnet.att.net Wed Oct 14 23:34:35 1998 with SMTP +0000 with last message Subject: Re: Remove from List XAA29334 John, I'll answer your request the same way everyone else has so far by sayingpleasedon't resign from the list! There's a lot to be learned from it and itsparticipants. I have been on it for less than a year and have learned a lot...enough, in fact to try my hand at making my own rod. I consider myself tobe avery basic beginner. Devilshockey game (Thanks Andy!) and should really be in bed right now! Anyway... Stick with it. Ask questions. Enjoy the list. Don't beintimidated bythese folks' discussions. They're a great group and they are very unselfishwithinformation. Hell, I might even be able to chime in with an answer fromtime totime! I consider myself lucky to have stumbled onto this list... We'refortunateto have it. Good luck, good night! Dennis Haftel ----------This fine list is way out of my league as I am such a beginner. I feelthat my questions sound stupid. I wish all the best to all of you.Please remove me from the mailing list. So long, John from sniderja@email.uc.edu Thu Oct 15 06:31:11 1998 Subject: Re: reel seat inserts The cutter is a new one, supposedly ready to use out of the box.J. Snider. At 03:40 PM 10/14/98 -0400, you wrote:Check the condition of the cutter. Sounds like it's not sharp.John Z-----Original Message-----From: Jerry Snider Date: Wednesday, October 14, 1998 9:34 AMSubject: reel seat inserts Have recently been turning my own reel seats on a wood lathe. Whenroutingthe "groove" in the reel seat, some of the woods tend to "burn,"especiallyfiddleback maple. I don't have a variable speed router (and suspect thatthis may be the problem).Would purchasing a reostat to control speed beanyhelp? Any suggestions, comments, recommendations? Thanks in advance.Jerry Snider from sniderja@email.uc.edu Thu Oct 15 06:33:58 1998 Subject: Re: reel seat inserts Thanks a whole bunch. As usual, you folks came through once again ingrandstyle. For me THIS is what the rodmakers list serve is all about, IMHO. J. SniderAt 03:52 PM 10/14/98 EDT, you wrote:Jerry,Getting a reostat will help a little bit. but you will have to slow downthefeed or you will get blow outs of the wood. Here are some of the thingstolook for when burning is happening. 1. Don't take the piece right from the lathe and rout it. Some times thewood will be warm let it cool off. 2. Make sure the bit is sharp and clean. No residue on the cutter cleanoffwith a small stone this also will put a slightly Keener edge also. 3. Try to find some kind of lube to put on the bit or work. Sometimes Iusea little dish soap. There are products you can buy to lubricate with. And of course try to slow the cutter down with a reostat while slowingthefeed rate down to avoid blowouts. Some wood no matter what you do will burn I also have trouble with thisto. Hope this helps Bob VRobert Venneri's Custom Components21 Chuck Hill RdSaugerties NY 12477914 246 5882 from sniderja@email.uc.edu Thu Oct 15 06:39:43 1998 Subject: Re: Great news! Would be happy to conribute.J. Snider. At 07:20 PM 10/14/98 -0500, you wrote:Jerry,The cap has been ordered and should be ready by this Friday, October 16,1998. No check is necessary as I will gladly make this contribution forthe help that Wayne has been to me. I will send the cap to Wayne as soon as it is done. It reads: St. WayneRodmaker Patron Dick Fuhrman dickay@alltel.net Jerry Snidere-mail: Sniderja@email.uc.eduhttp://www.biology.uc.edu/snider/jerry.htm from sniderja@email.uc.edu Thu Oct 15 06:41:01 1998 Subject: Re: reel seat inserts Yet again, thanks!J. Snider.At 09:31 PM 10/14/98 EDT, you wrote:Jerry,Changing the speed of the router won't help. That'snot the problem. You are moving the filler too slow. I havethe same problem if I go too slow. You have to keep the fillermoving across the router blade. I have a fixture made up withan adjustable stop at the end of my router table. I start atthe right end of the filler and buzz right across until I hitthe stop and then pull the filler away from the blade. Also, make sure that your router bit is Sharp. If is the slightestbit dull, it will burn the wood also. Dave L. from sniderja@email.uc.edu Thu Oct 15 06:50:24 1998 Subject: Re: reel seat inserts All of you folks have provided information that I feel will be mosthelpful. ony, regarding your excellent suggestions, for my short rods (andmost of mine are 7' or under) I use reel seats with sliding rings. On thebutt end I turn a small knob with beads and grooves, similar to theBellinger seats, or with a simple tapered swollen end similar to cork reelseats. I suppose this would preclude your recommendations if I undestandthem correctly. Using the jig described in Wayne's book (and again recentlyin The Lovely Bamboo) I don't seem to have a problem with the seat turning(at least for now!). I have no difficulty with walnut or similar woods,only with maple and cherry. I have been told by woodworkers that cherry"burns" easily. I must admit that I don't have much of a problem withstraight cylinders that I build to put end caps over. Only with the seatswith knobs, which may mean that I slow down at the knob and don't removeit from the blade quickly enough? Thanks for the valuable input. It will befiled away for future difficulties!J. Snider.At 09:49 AM 10/15/98 +0800, you wrote:On Wed, 14 Oct 1998, Jerry Snider wrote: Have recently been turning my own reel seats on a wood lathe. Whenroutingthe "groove" in the reel seat, some of the woods tend to "burn,"especiallyfiddleback maple. I don't have a variable speed router (and suspect thatthis may be the problem).Would purchasing a reostat to control speed beanyhelp? Any suggestions, comments, recommendations? Thanks inadvance.Jerry Snider Jerry,try making the reel seat blank a bit linger than the intended finished size and leave two sides at the "pushing" end square. This way the square sides will prevent the blank from spinning and because the blank is longer you have something to work with. Tony /***********************************************************************/Tony Younghttp://www.iinet.net.au/~mainpeak/flyrod.htmlThe Australian connection A computer without windows is like a fish without a bicycle /***********************************************************************/ from sniderja@email.uc.edu Thu Oct 15 06:56:52 1998 Subject: Re: reel seat inserts Thanks, John. Good advice!J. Snider.At 08:43 PM 10/14/98, you wrote:At 09:30 AM 10/14/98 -0400, you wrote:Have recently been turning my own reel seats on a wood lathe. Whenroutingthe "groove" in the reel seat, some of the woods tend to "burn,"especiallyfiddleback maple. I don't have a variable speed router (and suspect thatthis may be the problem).Would purchasing a reostat to control speed beanyhelp? Any suggestions, comments, recommendations? Thanks in advance.Jerry Snider Jerry;It is possible that it will help, but what will work better for you is toapproach full depth gradually, use a series of lighter cute on the woodsthat burn. Also, a steady feed rate is mandatory, he who hesitates burnshis wood. John Channer from richjez@enteract.com Thu Oct 15 07:15:03 1998 0000 Subject: Re: Illinois trout There are two trout stamps in Illinois. An inland and Lake Michigan stamp.Youneed an inland one for Sand Pond.Rich At 08:59 PM 10/14/98 -0700, you wrote:Rich Jezioro wrote: Anyone near NE Illinois who is starved for trout can go to Sand Pond inthenorth unit of Illinois Beach State Park. They were stocked last week andthepond opens for trout fishing on 10/17/98. It is usually shoulder to shoulder crowded on opening day with spincasters.There are plenty of left over trout after the weekend that will take afly. It is amazing the amount of plastic I have found in the trout's stomach. Rich Jezioro*________________________________)// Rich Jezioro@ /||/______/_||_________________________________________||/\/ \ > > > / \ >Rich, do you need a trout stamp to fish there? I have just aregular Ill fish license but I would love to try this spot. *________________________________)// Rich Jezioro @ /||/______/_||_________________________________________|| /\ / \ > > from fiveside@net-gate.com Thu Oct 15 07:50:21 1998 ns1.net-gate.com (8.8.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id IAA01071 for Subject: Re: Glue strength To Chris Lucker and others,We all ponder about what the tech specs mean to cane makers. Experiencecounts for a whole lot in what we do. Since I'm an epoxy fan I wonder whatthat Gi psi number means to me with my Epon. But after 30 years I havereally stopped worrying. I support you 100 percent on robberoid ferulecements. The best ever was Ferruleflex, a product by Reed Tackle in the80's. The best now is Weldwood Contact Cement (Flammable) hardwarestoreproduct. (Also great for attaching felt soles). Forgive me Mike.I do nodeless. I make 40 splices per rod with Titebond II. I use rubberchemical-resistant gloves to make splices. Sometimes I forget to washoffthe Titebond. Later on there is no way in hell that glue can ever be washedoff those gloves.I can sleep nights. Bill from mweber@icscorp.com Thu Oct 15 08:28:30 1998 mgmt-server1.icscorp.com(EMWAC SMTPRS 0.83) with SMTP id ;Thu, 15 Oct 1998 09:21:28 -0400 09:31:20 -0400 Subject: RE: binding material =_NextPart_000_01BDF81E.916A1DC0" ------ =_NextPart_000_01BDF81E.916A1DC0 Fellow Binders, I use 20 pound Dacron backing material, the same stuff I use on my fly =reels. I started using this as a matter of convenience and have never =had a problem, it threads nicely, holds well, and removes with a long =pull after dry time. It may be a little more expensive, but for me it =serves a double purpose, reel backing and binder thread. Works great. Mike -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: binding material Joe, I use waxed dental floss to bind ferrule when i glue them for the =reasonsyou mentioned strenght and glue does not stick, so should work fine for =bindingyour strips.Chuck Joseph S.Kallo wrote: All this talk about the acceptability of dumb questions has made me =braveenough to ask a question I have been thinking of for a week or so. I =amgetting close to doing the final planing of my strips (am working ongetting the last couple tip strips down to within .01 or so) and after =thatI'll glue them up as soon as I can. I have decided to bind this one byhand. I have been postulating what I am going to use for bindingthread--whether I should order some, use kite string etc. I keep =wonderingabout a material I have never heard anyone suggest for this task: =dentalfloss. Here's my case: The stuff is really, really tough. Try taking apiece and breaking it between your hands (have band-aids close by for =thecuts it makes). Its is woven loose so it sort of contours when laid =oversomething under pressure (like silk winding thread). Its waxed--isn't =thisa great boon when pulling the stuff off? Seems to me (never having =donethis, of course) that it would work really well. What would be the =drawbacks? Joe Joseph S. KalloDpt. of PhilosophySouthern Illinois University at Carbondale ------ =_NextPart_000_01BDF81E.916A1DC0 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------ =_NextPart_000_01BDF81E.916A1DC0-- from AHanzich@NA2.US.ML.com Thu Oct 15 08:41:21 1998 JAA29725 Subject: RE: Glue strength Reed Tackle still lives outside Stroudsburg PA. Knowing what he has inbackroom may still have some Ferruleflex mentioned by Bill. If anyone isinterested I will see if they do. Al Hanzich732-878-6567 -----Original Message----- Sent: Thursday, October 15, 1998 8:49 AM Subject: Re: Glue strength To Chris Lucker and others,We all ponder about what the tech specs mean to canemakers. Experiencecounts for a whole lot in what we do. Since I'm an epoxy fanI wonder whatthat Gi psi number means to me with my Epon. But after 30years I havereally stopped worrying. I support you 100 percent onrobberoid ferulecements. The best ever was Ferruleflex, a product by ReedTackle in the80's. The best now is Weldwood Contact Cement (Flammable)hardware storeproduct. (Also great for attaching felt soles). Forgive meMike.I do nodeless. I make 40 splices per rod with Titebond II.I use rubberchemical-resistant gloves to make splices. Sometimes Iforget to wash offthe Titebond. Later on there is no way in hell that glue canever be washedoff those gloves.I can sleep nights. Bill from sniderja@email.uc.edu Thu Oct 15 09:09:07 1998 Subject: Re: Glue strength In using the Weldwood contact cement for ferrules, do you simply followtheinstructions on the bottle/tube? How does one slip the ferrule on theshaft with contact cement? Sounds good, would you please describe yourtechniques for application?J. Snider.At 08:49 AM 10/15/98 -0400, you wrote:To Chris Lucker and others,We all ponder about what the tech specs mean to cane makers.Experiencecounts for a whole lot in what we do. Since I'm an epoxy fan I wonderwhatthat Gi psi number means to me with my Epon. But after 30 years I havereally stopped worrying. I support you 100 percent on robberoid ferulecements. The best ever was Ferruleflex, a product by Reed Tackle in the80's. The best now is Weldwood Contact Cement (Flammable) hardwarestoreproduct. (Also great for attaching felt soles). Forgive me Mike.I do nodeless. I make 40 splices per rod with Titebond II. I use rubberchemical-resistant gloves to make splices. Sometimes I forget to washoffthe Titebond. Later on there is no way in hell that glue can ever bewashedoff those gloves.I can sleep nights. Bill from stetzer@csd.uwm.edu Thu Oct 15 09:22:26 1998 batch3.csd.uwm.edu (8.8.4/8.6.8) with ESMTP id JAA15283 for (8.8.4/8.6.8)with SMTP id JAA26086 for ; Thu, 15 Oct1998 09:22:24 Subject: Re: Pliobond ferrule cement Here is how I use Pliobond for ferrules. This might be from Garrisonor someplace else. Yes, this is the same old Pliobond that you can get at any hardware store. Coat the cane and inside the ferrule, using a toothpick or whatever. Letit dry for about 1/2 hour, until dry to the touch. Give the cane anothercoat. Then, holding the ferrule with a clothespin or similar, heat itbriefly with a heat gun or alcohol lamp. In about 2 seconds the glue insidewill begin to bubble. Press the rod into the ferrule. If it gets stuck outof position or needs to be rotated, heat for a second or two. Bind down theferrule tabs with soft copper wire. In my experience, Pliobind doesn't fully set in 2 days. 2 weeks is more like it. But if you ever have to take something apart, a little heat is all that's required.......................................................................Frank Stetzer "...a cheerful comrade is betterstetzer@uwm.edu than a waterproof coat and a Employed by, but not speaking for foot-warmer." Henry Van Dyke,Univ of Wisconsin-Milwaukee, USA "Fisherman's Luck", 1899. On Wed, 14 Oct 1998, robert.kope wrote: I've seen several references to using Pliobond for ferrule cement andalso seenthis referred to as contact cement. I'm intrigued. Contact cement istenaciousand flexible, but in most applications, contact cement is apploied to bothsurfaces, allowedto dry, and cannot be repositioned after the two surfaces come in contactwitheach other. Clearly this cannot work for mounting ferrules. What is pliobond, and how do you use it? Is this the same pliobond usedforcoating line-to-leader knots, or is this just contact cement? If this iscontactcement, will any contact cement do or is it something special? Thanks in advance, - Robert Kope from rmoon@ida.net Thu Oct 15 09:33:19 1998 Subject: Re: Glue strength Bill I had had remarkable success for ferrule adhesives with Dow CorningUrethane Bond. Unfortunately, it is no longer available under thatname, and I am seriously hoarding my scant remaining stock. There is Iunderstand an alternative available and I regret my old-timer's diseaseprevents me from recalling it. George Hinde on the list may know. Theadvantages of UB are that it is of rather high viscosity, it expandsupon curing, it always retains a little flexibility, and it hastremendous adhesion. In addition cautious heat will enable the ferruleto be removed. It is a personal preference, but I would think that itis worlds above contact adhesives, which appear to be tricky to use. Inaddition I have seen failures in other applications with contactadhesives. George if you read this chime in and remind me what thecurrent look alike for UB is. Ralph from DBURRILL@TELEHUB.com Thu Oct 15 10:38:18 1998 Subject: Para 15 taper... boundary="---- =_NextPart_001_01BDF851.C1FFBCC6" This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does notunderstandthis format, some or all of this message may not be legible. ------ =_NextPart_001_01BDF851.C1FFBCC6 Back in August I was looking for an alternate source for a Para 15taper. My search recently led me to Dwight Lyons who happened to haveone in the shop. He was gracious enough to send me the following taperand description: Here are the tapers for the Para 15 with heavy tip 5/64" tip top 0= .078(actual)5= .09810=.12515=.12520=.14025=.16330=.18835=.19440=.20545=.229just above ferrule=.23750=.246(taken below wrap on butt ferrule @ 50 1/2") maybe .245 @50"55=.26060=.26665=.27370=.27975=.29280=.29785=.30086 1/2"=.300(just above hook keeper wrap)90=.300(assumed)95=.300 "96=.300 " Tapers for second tip with 4 1/2 64ths tip top 0= .070(actual)5= .08710=.12015=.12820=.14025=.16430=.18435=.19340=.20745=.22646 3/4"=.235 just above the ferrule which is 15/64 Super Zeeoxidised. Para 15 guide spacing Butt section from top of ferrule. Two snakes and one mediumPerfectionstripper(med) bright 5 1/2" 14 1/2" 23 3/8" Tip sections from top of tip top. Six bright chrome snakes. 5 1/8" 11 1/8" 18 1/8" 26 1/16" 35 1/4" 44 1/4" The thread is a dark red and it has the spiral up on the ferruleside. These tapers were taken over varnish, so I would allow at least.008. The cork grip is a fairly narrow reverse cigar that tapers fromthe reel seatup towards the front with a thuimb depression on top. This corkgrip is 61/8" long. ------ =_NextPart_001_01BDF851.C1FFBCC6 Para 15 taper... Back in August I was looking for an = gracious enough to send me the following taper and =description: Here are thetapers = 0=3D =.078(actual)5=3D.09810=3D.12515=3D.12520=3D.14025=3D.16330=3D.18835=3D.19440=3D.20545=3D.229just above =ferrule=3D.23750=3D.246(taken =below wrap on butt ferrule @ 50 1/2") maybe .245 @50"55=3D.26060=3D.26665=3D.27370=3D.27975=3D.29280=3D.29785=3D.30086 =1/2"=3D.300(just above hook keeper wrap)90=3D.300(assumed) Tapers forsecond =tip with 4 1/2 64ths tip top 0=3D =.070(actual)5=3D.08710=3D.12015=3D.12820=3D.14025=3D.16430=3D.18435=3D.19340=3D.20745=3D.226463/4"=3D.235 =just above the ferrule which is 15/64 Super Zee oxidised. Para 15 guide =spacing Butt section from =top of ferrule. Two snakes and one medium Perfectionstripper(med) =bright 51/2" 141/2" 233/8" Tip sections from = 51/8" 111/8" 181/8" 261/16" 35 1/4" 441/4" The thread is adark =red and it has the spiral up on the ferrule side. These taperswere =taken over varnish, so I would allow at least .008. The cork grip is a=fairly narrow reverse cigar that tapers from the reel seatup towards the= 1/8" =long. ------ =_NextPart_001_01BDF851.C1FFBCC6-- from CALucker@aol.com Thu Oct 15 12:36:09 1998 Subject: Re: Pliobond ferrule cement In a message dated 10/14/98 11:04:19 PM Pacific Daylight Time,robert.kope@MCI2000.com writes: Apply Pliobond to both surfaces -- ferrule and cane at ferrule station. Don'tuse too much. A thin coat is all you need. Allow to dry to the touch. Heatferrule with alcohol lamp. Quickly seat ferrule as you would if you weresimply using ferrule cement. Pliobond will remain pliable for as long as two days after seating. Inotherwords, you will be able to move the ferrule slightly for at least a dayafterseating. But after that, it's stuck until you apply the alcohol lamp again. the aluminum ferrules as used on a real Paul Young Midge. Paul Young RodCompany used Pliobond and probably still does. Chris Lucker from jczimny@dol.net Thu Oct 15 13:04:29 1998 Subject: Re: Glue strength The Dow Corning Urethane Bond was the best stuff I've ever used forferrules. If anyone can locate a similar product, I'd like to know about it.John Z-----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Glue strength Bill I had had remarkable success for ferrule adhesives with Dow CorningUrethane Bond. Unfortunately, it is no longer available under thatname, and I am seriously hoarding my scant remaining stock. There is Iunderstand an alternative available and I regret my old-timer's diseaseprevents me from recalling it. George Hinde on the list may know. Theadvantages of UB are that it is of rather high viscosity, it expandsupon curing, it always retains a little flexibility, and it hastremendous adhesion. In addition cautious heat will enable the ferruleto be removed. It is a personal preference, but I would think that itis worlds above contact adhesives, which appear to be tricky to use. Inaddition I have seen failures in other applications with contactadhesives. George if you read this chime in and remind me what thecurrent look alike for UB is. Ralph from michael@wugate.wustl.edu Thu Oct 15 13:25:10 1998 Subject: Re: Glue strength John Zimny zeez... :-) The Dow Corning Urethane Bond was the best stuff I've ever used forferrules. If anyone can locate a similar product, I'd like to know about it. John, could the new(?) poly-urethane glues be the same stuff? FromRalph'sdescription, it sounds exactly like the proporties of the Excelpoly-urethane glue I've got... advantages of UB are that it is of rather high viscosity, it expandsupon curing, it always retains a little flexibility, and it hastremendous adhesion. In addition cautious heat will enable the ferruleto be removed. Mike - unglued - BiondoSt. Louis, MO from TSmithwick@aol.com Thu Oct 15 13:33:07 1998 Subject: Re: Pliobond ferrule cement In a message dated 10/15/98 5:39:34 PM, you wrote: Chris, as of a couple years ago that was still true. They have used it foryears and claim they have never gotten a rod back with a loose ferrule. Theonly disadvantage I can see is that there are no gap filling properties, youneed a nice smooth fit to the ferrule station. from sniderja@email.uc.edu Thu Oct 15 13:39:28 1998 Subject: Re: Pliobond ferrule cement Is there more than one type of Pliobond? Carpenters tell me that they useit as a contact cement to lay permanent outdoor type of carpeting. Looksthe same as the Pliobond in the tube/bottle I use to coat knots in the flyline. Always thought it WAS a contact cement. This is in no way meant asacriticism, merely a question to help get myself educated.J. Snider.At 01:35 PM 10/15/98 EDT, you wrote:In a message dated 10/14/98 11:04:19 PM Pacific Daylight Time,robert.kope@MCI2000.com writes: iscontact cement, will any contact cement do or is it something special? >> Apply Pliobond to both surfaces -- ferrule and cane at ferrule station.Don'tuse too much. A thin coat is all you need. Allow to dry to the touch. Heatferrule with alcohol lamp. Quickly seat ferrule as you would if you weresimply using ferrule cement. Pliobond will remain pliable for as long as two days after seating. Inotherwords, you will be able to move the ferrule slightly for at least a dayafterseating. But after that, it's stuck until you apply the alcohol lamp again. seatthe aluminum ferrules as used on a real Paul Young Midge. Paul Young RodCompany used Pliobond and probably still does. Chris Lucker from rmoon@ida.net Thu Oct 15 13:49:54 1998 Subject: Re: Glue strength Mike it is very nearly the same, but the UB has a much heavierviscosity,Ralph from sniderja@email.uc.edu Thu Oct 15 14:09:12 1998 Subject: ferrule attaching cements, etc. I find this thread to be fascinating (especially since several of my rodsare one piecers!!). Would it be permissable to request a brief one or twoline response from you folks with LOTS of experience on what you use forferrule cement and your degree of satisfaction? If it is an unusual brand,the source of purchase? using a heavy duty Duro? "two ton?" epoxy gel with some satisfaction,others seem to say "no way" regarding using epoxies for ferrules, otherssay contact cement, yet others say no way. This thread would prove mosthelpful (regardless of which we decide to choose) for novice rod builders.J. Snider. from thramer@presys.com Thu Oct 15 14:27:15 1998 0000 Subject: Ferrule Cement I still use the old fashioned ferrule cement. Have used epoxy but wasnot satisfied. 2 ton or the 4 part mix that Garrison used. Have goneback to where I started, ferrule cement and a NS pin.A.J.Thramer ps I had not considered Pliobond but it is extremely tenacious stuff.Still would use a pin though. from CALucker@aol.com Thu Oct 15 15:57:09 1998 Subject: Re: Glue strength In a message dated 10/15/98 11:06:13 AM Pacific Daylight Time,jczimny@dol.netwrites: I remember that stuff. I think I used it on my first rods. I think I got it from Thomas and Thomas. I remember they carried it in the late 70'sthroughthe mid 80's.Chris Lucker from jczimny@dol.net Thu Oct 15 16:33:35 1998 Subject: Re: Glue strength Nope. Not at all the same thing.John Z-----Original Message----- rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Subject: Re: Glue strength John Zimny zeez... :-) The Dow Corning Urethane Bond was the best stuff I've ever used forferrules. If anyone can locate a similar product, I'd like to know aboutit. John, could the new(?) poly-urethane glues be the same stuff? FromRalph'sdescription, it sounds exactly like the proporties of the Excelpoly-urethane glue I've got... advantages of UB are that it is of rather high viscosity, it expandsupon curing, it always retains a little flexibility, and it hastremendous adhesion. In addition cautious heat will enable the ferruleto be removed. Mike - unglued - BiondoSt. Louis, MO from sats@gte.net Thu Oct 15 17:14:11 1998 Subject: Re: Fish on Bamboo. Terry, Down here we do not call then fish unless they are over 15 inches , and donot talk about them unless they are 24".. Well, come on up here and I'll put you on some of our little 6 to 8insunfish.Don't let them pull you out of the boat!!! Nasty little guys on light tackle.They like to gang up on you.... ps I have the week off and it has been raining none stop and the rivers areall in flood !! We had ours earlier this year. Weekend after weekend of wet weather. Hope it dries out for you before the cold weather sets in.... Terry "Sunfish" KirkpatrickSafety Harbor, Fl.(Old Tampa Bay)sats@gte.net from k5vkq@ix.netcom.com Thu Oct 15 17:27:06 1998 17:26:18 ix9.ix.netcom.comvia smap (V1.3) Subject: snake guides OK, I've been sucked in again! I going to make the snake guides and tiptop. That takes care of everything but the stripper guide. What's thebest way of doing that? It would seem the simplest way would be to dothesame thing as the snake guides and use two turns instead of one. Anyonehave a better solution? Regards,Onisk5vkq@ix.netcom.com from FlyTyr@southshore.com Thu Oct 15 17:29:47 1998 (8.8.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id RAA25636 for ;Thu, 15 Oct1998 17:29:28 - 0500 Subject: Re: Glue strength If Reed Tackle is still in business please post address. The last time Iwentto his shop it was closed and empty. Nothing saying they moved. This wasseveralyears ago.Thanks,Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com Hanzich, Al (MLPT) wrote: Reed Tackle still lives outside Stroudsburg PA. Knowing what he has inbackroom may still have some Ferruleflex mentioned by Bill. If anyone isinterested I will see if they do. Al Hanzich732-878-6567 -----Original Message----- Sent: Thursday, October 15, 1998 8:49 AM Subject: Re: Glue strength To Chris Lucker and others,We all ponder about what the tech specs mean to canemakers. Experiencecounts for a whole lot in what we do. Since I'm an epoxy fanI wonder whatthat Gi psi number means to me with my Epon. But after 30years I havereally stopped worrying. I support you 100 percent onrobberoid ferulecements. The best ever was Ferruleflex, a product by ReedTackle in the80's. The best now is Weldwood Contact Cement (Flammable)hardware storeproduct. (Also great for attaching felt soles). Forgive meMike.I do nodeless. I make 40 splices per rod with Titebond II.I use rubberchemical-resistant gloves to make splices. Sometimes Iforget to wash offthe Titebond. Later on there is no way in hell that glue canever be washedoff those gloves.I can sleep nights. Bill from fiveside@net-gate.com Thu Oct 15 18:04:40 1998 ns1.net-gate.com (8.8.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id TAA19071 for Subject: Ferrule Cement To AllPliobond is indeed OK. I use it for knots and many other things as well asferrules. But Weldwood Contact Cement (flammable) is better for ferrules(and felt soles). Try any kind of test you please. But make sure theWeldwood product is labeled flammable. The OSHA safe type won't hack it.Andmake sure it's dry to the touch before making the bond. Bill from maxs@geocities.co.jp Thu Oct 15 18:37:54 1998 geocities.co.jp (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA14310 for; Fri, 16 Oct 1998 08:37:48 +0900 (JST) Subject: Re: Para 15 taper... Dean, I am trying to make Para 15 as next rod right after my canes arrive.Your post helps me very much. Is the varnish so thick around when the rod was made? 0.008 inches =2.0mm.1.0mm on one flat. It is hard to look the real rod here.I just want make sure huw much I should subtract from the measurement.If you can let me know, it is very much helpful.Thank you for sharing valuable information. Max -- Max Satohan Oriental Bamboo Fly Rod Crafteremail:maxs@geocities.co.jpHome Page:http://members.tripod.com/~maxrod/index.html Burrill, Dean wrote: Back in August I was looking for an alternate source for a Para 15taper. My search recently led me to Dwight Lyons who happened to haveone in the shop. He was gracious enough to send me the followingtaper and description: Here are the tapers for the Para 15 with heavy tip 5/64" tip top 0= .078(actual)5= .09810=.12515=.12520=.14025=.16330=.18835=.19440=.20545=.229just above ferrule=.23750=.246(taken below wrap on butt ferrule @ 50 1/2") maybe .245 @50"55=.26060=.26665=.27370=.27975=.29280=.29785=.30086 1/2"=.300(just above hook keeper wrap)90=.300(assumed)95=.300 "96=.300 " Tapers for second tip with 4 1/2 64ths tip top 0= .070(actual)5= .08710=.12015=.12820=.14025=.16430=.18435=.19340=.20745=.22646 3/4"=.235 just above the ferrule which is 15/64 Super Zeeoxidised. Para 15 guide spacing Butt section from top of ferrule. Two snakes and one mediumPerfectionstripper(med) bright 5 1/2" 14 1/2" 23 3/8" Tip sections from top of tip top. Six bright chrome snakes. 5 1/8" 11 1/8" 18 1/8" 26 1/16" 35 1/4" 44 1/4" The thread is a dark red and it has the spiral up on the ferruleside. These tapers were taken over varnish, so I would allow at least.008. The cork grip is a fairly narrow reverse cigar that tapers fromthe reel seatup towards the front with a thuimb depression on top. This corkgrip is 6 1/8" long. from bdcreek@grand-rapids.crosswinds.net Thu Oct 15 18:55:03 1998 (envelope- from bdcreek@grand-rapids.crosswinds.net) Subject: Re: reel seat inserts Jerry- Are you making the cut all at once or are you taking 2 - 3 passes toreach final depth? Harder woods will burn when you really try to hogoff the wood. Brian from tyoung@perth.dialix.com.au Thu Oct 15 19:00:18 1998 Fri, 16 Oct 1998 08:00:06 +0800 (WST)(envelope- from tyoung) Subject: Re: snake guides On Thu, 15 Oct 1998, Onis Cogburn wrote: OK, I've been sucked in again! I going to make the snake guides and tiptop. That takes care of everything but the stripper guide. What's thebest way of doing that? It would seem the simplest way would be to dothesame thing as the snake guides and use two turns instead of one. Anyonehave a better solution? Regards,Onisk5vkq@ix.netcom.com Onis,I haven't tried this yet but I was thinking the thing to do would be make a snake as usual and silver solder a ring turned from NS or bronze in my case. This would make a snake striper. Tony /***********************************************************************/Tony Younghttp://www.iinet.net.au/~mainpeak/flyrod.htmlThe Australian connection A computer without windows is like a fish without a bicycle /***********************************************************************/ from bdcreek@grand-rapids.crosswinds.net Thu Oct 15 19:07:23 1998 (envelope- from bdcreek@grand-rapids.crosswinds.net) Subject: Re: Para 15 taper... Guys -I think there's a Para 15 on the rodmakers page as well. Wayne's 8'6 wt looks like a compromise between the .078 and the .070 tips. It'scalled the Force and is described in the archives.I'm building one of these now and am making all three tips so I cancompare and contrast the actions. I also like the idea of having threerods in one tube for traveling! Brian from maxs@geocities.co.jp Thu Oct 15 19:25:48 1998 geocities.co.jp (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA13394 for; Fri, 16 Oct 1998 09:25:44 +0900 (JST) Subject: Re: snake guides (stripper) Onis, It's a good topic to discuss about Stripper guide. I am also veryinterested in making strippers by own hand. If the material of coreportion, it may not be so difficult to make it solder with the bridgedfeet, I guess. The problem is the core, for instance, agate if you wantto useit. It will not be easy to cover the agate by some metal. If wecan turn metal ring which can be used as a ring, we just need to solderit to the bridge which is made by wire.Keep going. There is a nice web page with some photo of tools to make agatestripping guide. Joe Arguello's home page under a rod makers (Yohda mark) of rodmakerspage. http://www.jearguello.com Thanks, Max Onis Cogburn wrote: OK, I've been sucked in again! I going to make the snake guides and tiptop. That takes care of everything but the stripper guide. What's thebest way of doing that? It would seem the simplest way would be to dothesame thing as the snake guides and use two turns instead of one. Anyonehave a better solution? Regards,Onisk5vkq@ix.netcom.com -- Max Satohan Oriental Bamboo Fly Rod Crafteremail:maxs@geocities.co.jpHome Page:http://members.tripod.com/~maxrod/index.html from dpeaston@wzrd.com Thu Oct 15 19:32:56 1998 mail.wzrd.com(8.9.1/8.7.3) with SMTP id UAA02930; Thu, 15 Oct 1998 20:26:59 -0400 Subject: Re: binding material At 09:13 PM 10/14/98 EDT, KDLoup@aol.com wrote:Joe,I tried waxed dental floss in my binder, but the floss didn't glidethrough the tensioning devices. Unwaxed may work, but the cottoncrochetthread I use works just fine. At glue up, I'll bet waxed floss will workfine Kurt Loup Kurt/joe, Waxed floss works great or repair work. I hadnd double wrap ala Kirkfield.Very little difficulty getting it off the rod, and as Joe mentioned it laysflat. Doug EastonTonawanda, NY from ddodd@hrfn.net Thu Oct 15 19:41:39 1998 (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id UAA04993 for ;Thu, 15 Oct1998 20:49:44 -0400 Subject: Re: Remove from List John, Us "New Guy" got to stick together. I'm on the net only three weeks andIhave a two inch pile of notes from the list. Maybe this week end I canstartnotebook that I want that will have all the little tidbits that are not inGarrisonsor Waynes books......ie......how to read glue notes on the boxes.What a great place to learn....and the guy with all the knowledge seemtobe here. Hope too many don't jump ship.....we'll be the only ones left. Newbie Daveddodd@hrfn.net -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Remove from List John, You should not leave based on the reason you stated. I'm still abeginner 2 years later. But there are some who jump in with both feetand are experienced rodmakers and INNOVATORS at 2 years. If you'reserious about rodmaking, stick around. You won't be sorry. Rick Crenshaw John Schestag wrote: This fine list is way out of my league as I am such a beginner. I feelthat my questions sound stupid. I wish all the best to all of you.Please remove me from the mailing list. So long, John from dpeaston@wzrd.com Thu Oct 15 19:54:27 1998 mail.wzrd.com(8.9.1/8.7.3) with SMTP id UAA03993; Thu, 15 Oct 1998 20:48:17 -0400 Subject: Re: Glue strength At 04:55 PM 10/15/98 EDT, CALucker@aol.com wrote:In a message dated 10/15/98 11:06:13 AM Pacific Daylight Time,jczimny@dol.netwrites: ferrules. If anyone can locate a similar product, I'd like to know about it.John Z >>I remember that stuff. I think I used it on my first rods. I think I got it from Thomas and Thomas. I remember they carried it in the late 70'sthroughthe mid 80's.Chris Lucker I used it in the mid 80's for fastening grips to plastic rods. Then Istarted using for all types of repairs at home. Unfortunately the stuffused to set up in the tube. The last two tubes I bought from my favoritehardware store had set up on the store shelf. The people at the store saidthey couldn't get any more because the manufacturer had determined thattheshelf life was too short for ordinary commerce. Doug EastonTonawanda, NY from bacon@idt.net Thu Oct 15 20:02:04 1998 Subject: Re: Bamboo Only Guide Service Survey Onis Cogburn wrote: Well, since nothing in the universe is perfect, real happiness comes fromlearning to live with the "warts". Some have few; some of us have morebutas Bob Ross said, "When you finish and you can't see any, it's time tohangit up and quit. You've done as good as you ever will." Regards,Onis PSOne day as I sat lonely and without a friendA voice came to me out of the gloom saying"Cheer up. Things could be worse."So I cheered up and sure enough,Things got worse. Relax: We're all only building fishing poles! ps: the psychological pain of not being perfect when you turn out a rodcan be devastating, don't you agree?really,i don't get psychological pain from building rods, but just strive tobe better, when i put it all into perspective, i say, what a jerk youare, woman, there are people starving, with disease, etc..then i knowi'm a spoiled brat...thanks for helping me put things back to where theybelong... (after all i am here on the internet talking to strangers,that MUST say something) jean from closenuf@hotmail.com Thu Oct 15 20:05:34 1998 Thu, 15 Oct 1998 18:04:37 PDT Subject: Re: Para 15 taper... Congratulations, you finally got the 'true' taper! Now, the questions is, when the hell are you going to find the time to build this sucker! Mike still hasn't made up his mind which taper he's going to build, you know him. I asked him after our mtn bike ride and he said that he wasn't sure yet, probably will decide at the last minute. The bike ridewas a killer, 12 of us went, 2 women, ages ranged from 22 - 55, Mike and I were the oldest, Mike's son Dana being the youngest. There were some strong riders on this trip, the two guys that came with me are animals! I had to drive down to LA the next day, Sunday, and I was still hurting from the ride, didn't really recover until Wednesday. On Monday, before meeting with Adam's dentist, I got to run over to a old tool store in Santa Monica, really had alot of old tools. Was sorely tempted to buy something, everything was 30% off, but resisted spending any money. Lots of planes, both metal and wooden ones. Drove back on Monday as soon as I was done with the dentist, got back around 7 pm, I=5 is such a drag. One of the guys who went on the mtn bike ride brews beer, brought a six pack with him.Stuff is very good, got a kick to it too. I know that you put your brew in kegs, where did you buy the kegs? I'd like him to brew some stuff brew because he has no room in his apartment to store a keg. Is it easier to put the brew in kegs? Is that why you do it? I have one bottle left, come on over this weekend and try it. Hear from the cork guy? Mike will bring the ferrules when he comes up for the Cal/UCLA game on the 24th. from owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Thu Oct 15 10:18:05 1998 Received: by GURNEE.telehub.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.1960.3) Message-Id: Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1998 10:37:46 -0500 Sender: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduFrom: "Burrill, Dean" Subject: Para 15 taper...MIME-Version: 1.0Content-Type: multipart/alternative;boundary="---- =_NextPart_001_01BDF851.C1FFBCC6"X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.1960.3)X-Listprocessor-Version: 8.0 -- ListProcessor(tm) by CREN Back in August I was looking for an alternate source for a Para 15taper. My search recently led me to Dwight Lyons who happened to haveone in the shop. He was gracious enough to send me the following taperand description: Here are the tapers for the Para 15 with heavy tip 5/64" tip top 0= .078(actual)5= .09810=.12515=.12520=.14025=.16330=.18835=.19440=.20545=.229just above ferrule=.23750=.246(taken below wrap on butt ferrule @ 50 1/2") maybe .245 @50"55=.26060=.26665=.27370=.27975=.29280=.29785=.30086 1/2"=.300(just above hook keeper wrap)90=.300(assumed)95=.300 "96=.300 " Tapers for second tip with 4 1/2 64ths tip top 0= .070(actual)5= .08710=.12015=.12820=.14025=.16430=.18435=.19340=.20745=.22646 3/4"=.235 just above the ferrule which is 15/64 Super Zeeoxidised. Para 15 guide spacing Butt section from top of ferrule. Two snakes and one mediumPerfectionstripper(med) bright 5 1/2" 14 1/2" 23 3/8" Tip sections from top of tip top. Six bright chrome snakes. 5 1/8" 11 1/8" 18 1/8" 26 1/16" 35 1/4" 44 1/4" The thread is a dark red and it has the spiral up on the ferruleside. These tapers were taken over varnish, so I would allow at least.008. The cork grip is a fairly narrow reverse cigar that tapers fromthe reel seatup towards the front with a thuimb depression on top. This corkgrip is 61/8" long. ______________________________________________________Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com from lblan@provide.net Thu Oct 15 20:06:35 1998 Subject: RE: Para 15 taper... Max; 2.0mm is 0.078" -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Thursday, October 15, 1998 7:38 PM Subject: Re: Para 15 taper... Dean, I am trying to make Para 15 as next rod right after my canes arrive.Your post helps me very much. Is the varnish so thick around when the rod was made? 0.008 inches =2.0mm.1.0mm on one flat. It is hard to look the real rod here.I just want make sure huw much I should subtract from themeasurement.If you can let me know, it is very much helpful.Thank you for sharing valuable information. Max -- Max Satohan Oriental Bamboo Fly Rod Crafteremail:maxs@geocities.co.jpHome Page:http://members.tripod.com/~maxrod/index.html Burrill, Dean wrote: Back in August I was looking for an alternate source for a Para 15taper. My search recently led me to Dwight Lyons who happened to haveone in the shop. He was gracious enough to send me the followingtaper and description: Here are the tapers for the Para 15 with heavy tip 5/64" tip top 0= .078(actual)5= .09810=.12515=.12520=.14025=.16330=.18835=.19440=.20545=.229just above ferrule=.23750=.246(taken below wrap on butt ferrule @ 50 1/2") maybe .245 @50"55=.26060=.26665=.27370=.27975=.29280=.29785=.30086 1/2"=.300(just above hook keeper wrap)90=.300(assumed)95=.300 "96=.300 " Tapers for second tip with 4 1/2 64ths tip top 0= .070(actual)5= .08710=.12015=.12820=.14025=.16430=.18435=.19340=.20745=.22646 3/4"=.235 just above the ferrule which is 15/64 Super Zeeoxidised. Para 15 guide spacing Butt section from top of ferrule. Two snakes and one mediumPerfectionstripper(med) bright 5 1/2" 14 1/2" 23 3/8" Tip sections from top of tip top. Six bright chrome snakes. 5 1/8" 11 1/8" 18 1/8" 26 1/16" 35 1/4" 44 1/4" The thread is a dark red and it has the spiral up on the ferruleside. These tapers were taken over varnish, so I would allow at least.008. The cork grip is a fairly narrow reverse cigar that tapers fromthe reel seatup towards the front with a thuimb depression on top. This corkgrip is 6 1/8" long. from bacon@idt.net Thu Oct 15 20:12:04 1998 Subject: Re: Bamboo Only Guide Service Survey john channer wrote: At 10:13 PM 10/13/98 -0700, you wrote:TSmithwick@aol.com wrote: In a message dated 10/13/98 7:25:27 AM, you wrote: don't have a good how-to-book. have only built two graphite rods(three piece 7, and two piece 9) i loved it! did you get the albies FROMthe beach, if so, i'm mightily impressed...i was on a boat with a guideand we were in schools of albies which were lovely...the wrist is prettywimpy though, have started wimp wrist weights for women (akawwww), buti DID haul them in with a lot of yelling from the gestapo guide. irefused to quit. on a spey rod?!, that's so cool. any info on a simplehow-to book would be appreciated (please not too expensive), i have tosave up for the next fishing trip.thanks,jeanps: the psychological pain of not being perfect when you turn out a rodcan be devastating, don't you agree? Jean;The best how-to book for the money is The Lovely Reed by Jack Howell(myappology's to Wayne). You can order it from Amazon.com for about $35.00.Wayne Cattanach's book, Handcrafting Bamboo Fly Rods is already aclassic,plus it has a disk included for designing rod tapers and guide spacing, butit is about $15-$20.00 more money. A Master's Guide to Building BambooFlyRods, by Hoagy Carmichel and Everett Garrison is THE classic, but at$75.00will really dig a hole in your pocket. You mentioned before that you wereinterested in taking a class, George Maurer gives rodmaking classesregularly. He is in Shoemaker, Pa. 610-562-8595. I think that the bestwayto start would be to read the rodmaking FAQ's by Bruce Connor and TomPenrose that you can get to thru the Rodmaker's webpage. John Channerdear john, (i just hate writing these dear john letters) your concise info onthis subject is wonderful, thank you very, very muchly...am still in theprocess of filtering out so much, but am enthusiastic and excited aboutbuilding a rod for my obstreperous (sp?) sister who lives in colorado. ithink i will contact mr. shoemaker, as i have a cabin in NEpennsylvania..(don't know how close that is to him). thanks again,jean from bacon@idt.net Thu Oct 15 20:14:54 1998 Subject: Re: Rodmakers Books Steve wrote: Jean;The best how-to book for the money is The Lovely Reed by Jack Howell(myappology's to Wayne). You can order it from Amazon.com for about$35.00.Wayne Cattanach's book, Handcrafting Bamboo Fly Rods is already aclassic,plus it has a disk included for designing rod tapers and guide spacing,butit is about $15-$20.00 more money. A Master's Guide to BuildingBamboo FlyRods, by Hoagy Carmichel and Everett Garrison is THE classic, but at$75.00will really dig a hole in your pocket. You mentioned before that youwereinterested in taking a class, George Maurer gives rodmaking classesregularly. He is in Shoemaker, Pa. 610-562-8595. I think that the bestwayto start would be to read the rodmaking FAQ's by Bruce Connor and TomPenrose that you can get to thru the Rodmaker's webpage. John Channer Jean, Being in NYC, probably all of these books are available at your publiclibrary. Regards, SteveIndependence, MOsteve,yes they all are in the NYC library, and thanks for the info.independence MO, huh?, pretty neat,jean from bacon@idt.net Thu Oct 15 20:18:48 1998 Subject: Re: Starting out (was Bamboo Only Guide Service Survey) TSmithwick@aol.com wrote: Jean - The Albies were from the beach, but that is a bit easier to do ontheVineyard. John Channer's book advice is on the money. I think "The LovelyReed" is user friendly for a true beginner. Read it, and then get a StanleyorRecord 9 1/2 plane and learn how to sharpen it. Then you will be ready tostart. The whole business looks daunting, but it is all a series of smallsteps. If you persevere, you can do it, and it becomes easier withpractice.TS, from the beach? is this a fish story,ratchetps thanks for all the other information, am sorting it all out from bacon@idt.net Thu Oct 15 20:20:53 1998 Subject: Re: Bamboo Only Guide Service Survey andrew_harsanyi@ibi.com wrote: Jean...Wayne also has a video version of his book which I actually prefer.Thatcombined with a book is really helpful. The video was around $45 I thinkand wasavailable from several sources including Cabela's...Andy ______________________________ Reply Separator_________________________________Subject: Re: Bamboo Only Guide Service SurveyAuthor: at TcpgateDate: 10/13/98 8:16 PM At 10:13 PM 10/13/98 -0700, you wrote:TSmithwick@aol.com wrote: In a message dated 10/13/98 7:25:27 AM, you wrote: don't have a good how-to-book. have only built two graphite rods(three piece 7, and two piece 9) i loved it! did you get the albies FROMthe beach, if so, i'm mightily impressed...i was on a boat with a guideand we were in schools of albies which were lovely...the wrist is prettywimpy though, have started wimp wrist weights for women (akawwww), buti DID haul them in with a lot of yelling from the gestapo guide. irefused to quit. on a spey rod?!, that's so cool. any info on a simplehow-to book would be appreciated (please not too expensive), i have tosave up for the next fishing trip.thanks,jeanps: the psychological pain of not being perfect when you turn out a rodcan be devastating, don't you agree? Jean;The best how-to book for the money is The Lovely Reed by Jack Howell(myappology's to Wayne). You can order it from Amazon.com for about $35.00.Wayne Cattanach's book, Handcrafting Bamboo Fly Rods is already aclassic,plus it has a disk included for designing rod tapers and guide spacing, butit is about $15-$20.00 more money. A Master's Guide to Building BambooFlyRods, by Hoagy Carmichel and Everett Garrison is THE classic, but at$75.00will really dig a hole in your pocket. You mentioned before that you wereinterested in taking a class, George Maurer gives rodmaking classesregularly. He is in Shoemaker, Pa. 610-562-8595. I think that the bestwayto start would be to read the rodmaking FAQ's by Bruce Connor and TomPenrose that you can get to thru the Rodmaker's webpage. John Channerandy,thanksratchet from anglport@con2.com Thu Oct 15 20:40:15 1998 Subject: Re: Para 15 taper... Max,I think you dropped a decimal. 1) .008 " is about the thickness of twopieces of looseleaf paper, and 2)When I did the figuring I came up with .2mm.Check out my figures and good luck with the taper. 25mm = x mm---- ---- I get .2 for x, no?1 in .008" Art At 08:38 AM 10/16/98 +0900, you wrote:Dean, I am trying to make Para 15 as next rod right after my canes arrive.Your post helps me very much. Is the varnish so thick around when the rod was made? 0.008 inches =2.0mm.1.0mm on one flat. It is hard to look the real rod here.I just want make sure huw much I should subtract from the measurement.If you can let me know, it is very much helpful.Thank you for sharing valuable information. Max -- Max Satohan Oriental Bamboo Fly Rod Crafteremail:maxs@geocities.co.jpHome Page:http://members.tripod.com/~maxrod/index.html Burrill, Dean wrote: Back in August I was looking for an alternate source for a Para 15taper. My search recently led me to Dwight Lyons who happened to haveone in the shop. He was gracious enough to send me the followingtaper and description: Here are the tapers for the Para 15 with heavy tip 5/64" tip top 0= .078(actual)5= .09810=.12515=.12520=.14025=.16330=.18835=.19440=.20545=.229just above ferrule=.23750=.246(taken below wrap on butt ferrule @ 50 1/2") maybe .245 @50"55=.26060=.26665=.27370=.27975=.29280=.29785=.30086 1/2"=.300(just above hook keeper wrap)90=.300(assumed)95=.300 "96=.300 " Tapers for second tip with 4 1/2 64ths tip top 0= .070(actual)5= .08710=.12015=.12820=.14025=.16430=.18435=.19340=.20745=.22646 3/4"=.235 just above the ferrule which is 15/64 Super Zeeoxidised. Para 15 guide spacing Butt section from top of ferrule. Two snakes and one mediumPerfectionstripper(med) bright 5 1/2" 14 1/2" 23 3/8" Tip sections from top of tip top. Six bright chrome snakes. 5 1/8" 11 1/8" 18 1/8" 26 1/16" 35 1/4" 44 1/4" The thread is a dark red and it has the spiral up on the ferruleside. These tapers were taken over varnish, so I would allow at least.008. The cork grip is a fairly narrow reverse cigar that tapers fromthe reel seatup towards the front with a thuimb depression on top. This corkgrip is 6 1/8" long. from FlyTyr@southshore.com Thu Oct 15 20:52:47 1998 (8.8.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id UAA30133 for ;Thu, 15 Oct1998 20:53:00 - 0500 Subject: Re: Bamboo Only Guide Service Survey "Digger" Portrait of A Rod Maker is also a good video. He makes it lookverysimpleand does everything on his kitchen table. It is available through ThePlaningForm. Ihave no connection with this video or the Planing form. I also have Wayne'svideo.Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com Jean Conelli wrote: andrew_harsanyi@ibi.com wrote: Jean...Wayne also has a video version of his book which I actuallyprefer.Thatcombined with a book is really helpful. The video was around $45 Ithink andwasavailable from several sources including Cabela's...Andy ______________________________ Reply Separator_________________________________Subject: Re: Bamboo Only Guide Service SurveyAuthor: at TcpgateDate: 10/13/98 8:16 PM At 10:13 PM 10/13/98 -0700, you wrote:TSmithwick@aol.com wrote: In a message dated 10/13/98 7:25:27 AM, you wrote: don't have a good how-to-book. have only built two graphite rods(three piece 7, and two piece 9) i loved it! did you get the albies FROMthe beach, if so, i'm mightily impressed...i was on a boat with a guideand we were in schools of albies which were lovely...the wrist isprettywimpy though, have started wimp wrist weights for women (akawwww), buti DID haul them in with a lot of yelling from the gestapo guide. irefused to quit. on a spey rod?!, that's so cool. any info on a simplehow-to book would be appreciated (please not too expensive), i have tosave up for the next fishing trip.thanks,jeanps: the psychological pain of not being perfect when you turn out a rodcan be devastating, don't you agree? Jean;The best how-to book for the money is The Lovely Reed by Jack Howell(myappology's to Wayne). You can order it from Amazon.com for about$35.00.Wayne Cattanach's book, Handcrafting Bamboo Fly Rods is already aclassic,plus it has a disk included for designing rod tapers and guide spacing,butit is about $15-$20.00 more money. A Master's Guide to BuildingBamboo FlyRods, by Hoagy Carmichel and Everett Garrison is THE classic, but at$75.00will really dig a hole in your pocket. You mentioned before that youwereinterested in taking a class, George Maurer gives rodmaking classesregularly. He is in Shoemaker, Pa. 610-562-8595. I think that the bestwayto start would be to read the rodmaking FAQ's by Bruce Connor and TomPenrose that you can get to thru the Rodmaker's webpage. John Channerandy,thanksratchet from FISHWOOL@aol.com Thu Oct 15 20:55:44 1998 Subject: Re: Re: Para 15 taper... Max,Here is the Para-15 taper:Dry tip:0 "-.070",5"-.086", 10"-.107",15"- .123",20"-.138",25"-.157",30"-.170",35"-.189",40"-.208",45"-.225",50'- .230"Wet tip:0"-.078",5"-.094",10"-.112", 15"-.128", 20"-.141", 25"- .164",30"-.182", 35"-.195", 40"-.208", 45"-.225", 50"-.239"Butt:0"-.239". 55"-.252", 60"-.260", 65"-.268", 70"-.277", 75"-.288",80"-.300", 96"-.300" As you can see the dimensions are in inches not decimals. I hope thishelps.Regards,Hank Woolman. from bacon@idt.net Thu Oct 15 21:19:39 1998 Subject: Re: Bamboo Only Guide Service Survey Jean Conelli wrote: andrew_harsanyi@ibi.com wrote: Jean...Wayne also has a video version of his book which I actuallyprefer.Thatcombined with a book is really helpful. The video was around $45 Ithink andwasavailable from several sources including Cabela's...Andy ______________________________ Reply Separator_________________________________Subject: Re: Bamboo Only Guide Service SurveyAuthor: at TcpgateDate: 10/13/98 8:16 PM At 10:13 PM 10/13/98 -0700, you wrote:TSmithwick@aol.com wrote: In a message dated 10/13/98 7:25:27 AM, you wrote: don't have a good how-to-book. have only built two graphite rods(three piece 7, and two piece 9) i loved it! did you get the albies FROMthe beach, if so, i'm mightily impressed...i was on a boat with a guideand we were in schools of albies which were lovely...the wrist isprettywimpy though, have started wimp wrist weights for women (akawwww), buti DID haul them in with a lot of yelling from the gestapo guide. irefused to quit. on a spey rod?!, that's so cool. any info on a simplehow-to book would be appreciated (please not too expensive), i have tosave up for the next fishing trip.thanks,jeanps: the psychological pain of not being perfect when you turn out a rodcan be devastating, don't you agree? Jean;The best how-to book for the money is The Lovely Reed by Jack Howell(myappology's to Wayne). You can order it from Amazon.com for about$35.00.Wayne Cattanach's book, Handcrafting Bamboo Fly Rods is already aclassic,plus it has a disk included for designing rod tapers and guide spacing,butit is about $15-$20.00 more money. A Master's Guide to BuildingBamboo FlyRods, by Hoagy Carmichel and Everett Garrison is THE classic, but at$75.00will really dig a hole in your pocket. You mentioned before that youwereinterested in taking a class, George Maurer gives rodmaking classesregularly. He is in Shoemaker, Pa. 610-562-8595. I think that the bestwayto start would be to read the rodmaking FAQ's by Bruce Connor and TomPenrose that you can get to thru the Rodmaker's webpage. John Channerandy,thanksratchetjohn,thank you, too?jean (aka ratchet) from tyoung@perth.dialix.com.au Thu Oct 15 21:43:18 1998 Fri, 16 Oct 1998 10:41:55 +0800 (WST)(envelope- from tyoung) Subject: Re: snake guides On Fri, 16 Oct 1998, Tony Young wrote: I forgot to mention, you can get a great little do hicky from Dave L called "The Snake Maker". Makes great snakes. Tony On Thu, 15 Oct 1998, Onis Cogburn wrote: OK, I've been sucked in again! I going to make the snake guides and tiptop. That takes care of everything but the stripper guide. What's thebest way of doing that? It would seem the simplest way would be todo thesame thing as the snake guides and use two turns instead of one. Anyonehave a better solution? Regards,Onisk5vkq@ix.netcom.com Onis,I haven't tried this yet but I was thinking the thing to do would be make a snake as usual and silver solder a ring turned from NS or bronze in my case. This would make a snake striper. Tony /***********************************************************************/Tony Younghttp://www.iinet.net.au/~mainpeak/flyrod.htmlThe Australian connection A computer without windows is like a fish without a bicycle /***********************************************************************/ /***********************************************************************/Tony Younghttp://www.iinet.net.au/~mainpeak/flyrod.htmlThe Australian connection A computer without windows is like a fish without a bicycle /***********************************************************************/ from k5vkq@ix.netcom.com Thu Oct 15 21:49:19 1998 21:48:36 ix14.ix.netcom.comvia smap (V1.3) Subject: Re: snake guides (stripper) Hi Max. Thanks for the URL. I'll take a look at it. I've been solderingand silver soldering for over 40 years but I've never considered it"jeweler's" grade. I'll have to experiment some. I will take a look atthe URL. Regards,Onisk5vkq@ix.netcom.comOnis, It's a good topic to discuss about Stripper guide. I am also veryinterested in making strippers by own hand. If the material of coreportion, it may not be so difficult to make it solder with the bridgedfeet, I guess. The problem is the core, for instance, agate if you wantto useit. It will not be easy to cover the agate by some metal. If wecan turn metal ring which can be used as a ring, we just need to solderit to the bridge which is made by wire.Keep going. There is a nice web page with some photo of tools to make agatestripping guide. Joe Arguello's home page under a rod makers (Yohda mark) of rodmakerspage. http://www.jearguello.com Thanks, Max from k5vkq@ix.netcom.com Thu Oct 15 21:53:35 1998 21:53:01 ix14.ix.netcom.comvia smap (V1.3) Subject: Re: snake guides Hi Tony. Thanks for the suggestion. Sounds like you and Max have similarthoughts. I've been soldering for a long time but I long ago discoveredthe limit of my abilities. Mine is about a #16 fly. The soldering joblooks like a solid #20 to me. Wonder if You could use two turns and letthe ring float. The ring I can make; the soldering is a stretch. Regards,Onisk5vkq@ix.netcom.com Onis,I haven't tried this yet but I was thinking the thing to do would be make a snake as usual and silver solder a ring turned from NS or bronze in my case. This would make a snake striper. Tony /***********************************************************************/Tony Younghttp://www.iinet.net.au/~mainpeak/flyrod.htmlThe Australian connection A computer without windows is like a fish without a bicycle /***********************************************************************/ from k5vkq@ix.netcom.com Thu Oct 15 22:02:31 1998 22:01:56 ix14.ix.netcom.comvia smap (V1.3) Subject: Re: Bamboo Only Guide Service Survey Well, I don't know about psychological pain but I sure do experience somephysical pain. I'm typing this with the forefinger and thumb of my lefthand sticking up in the air; with bandaids on them. I got a brain fart. Iwas making some snake guides and got the bright(?) idea to wind a tightspring using the variable speed drill. I put a 3/16 drill bit in thechuck, reversed so I could wind around the shank. Should have put on mygloves. The drill worked great but I forgot to stop when I got to the endof the music wire; it whipped around and sliced both fingers. Oh well,gives me an excuse to watch the football game. Regards,Onisk5vkq@ix.netcom.com i don't get psychological pain from building rods, but just strive tobe better, when i put it all into perspective, i say, what a jerk youare, woman, there are people starving, with disease, etc..then i knowi'm a spoiled brat...thanks for helping me put things back to where theybelong... (after all i am here on the internet talking to strangers,that MUST say something) jean from k5vkq@ix.netcom.com Thu Oct 15 22:09:24 1998 22:08:52 ix14.ix.netcom.comvia smap (V1.3) Subject: Re: snake guides Yeah, after cutting my fingers doing it the hard way, I wonder if that'snot the best way to go. I enjoy "doing it my way" but sometimes that getsridiculous. Regards,Onisk5vkq@ix.netcom.com I forgot to mention, you can get a great little do hicky from Dave L called "The Snake Maker". Makes great snakes. Tony On Thu, 15 Oct 1998, Onis Cogburn wrote: OK, I've been sucked in again! I going to make the snake guides and tiptop. That takes care of everything but the stripper guide. What's thebest way of doing that? It would seem the simplest way would be todothesame thing as the snake guides and use two turns instead of one. Anyonehave a better solution? Regards,Onisk5vkq@ix.netcom.com Onis,I haven't tried this yet but I was thinking the thing to do would be make a snake as usual and silver solder a ring turned from NS or bronze in my case. This would make a snake striper. Tony /***********************************************************************/Tony Younghttp://www.iinet.net.au/~mainpeak/flyrod.htmlThe Australian connection A computer without windows is like a fish without a bicycle /***********************************************************************/ /***********************************************************************/Tony Younghttp://www.iinet.net.au/~mainpeak/flyrod.htmlThe Australian connection A computer without windows is like a fish without a bicycle /***********************************************************************/ from channer@hubwest.com Thu Oct 15 22:17:25 1998 (SMTPD32-4.02c) id AB1428D20104; Thu, 15 Oct 1998 21:18:44 MDT Subject: Re: snake guides At 09:50 PM 10/15/98 -0500, you wrote:Hi Tony. Thanks for the suggestion. Sounds like you and Max have similarthoughts. I've been soldering for a long time but I long ago discoveredthe limit of my abilities. Mine is about a #16 fly. The soldering joblooks like a solid #20 to me. Wonder if You could use two turns and letthe ring float. The ring I can make; the soldering is a stretch. Regards,Onisk5vkq@ix.netcom.com Onis,I haven't tried this yet but I was thinking the thing to do would be make a snake as usual and silver solder a ring turned from NS or bronze in my case. This would make a snake striper. Tony Onis;Come on now, I tie mostly 24's and 26's and I am a carpenter withpermanently swollen, 60 grit, scarred up, nerve damaged fingers. Surelyyoucan handle something as huge as an 8mm. stripper. John Channer from maxs@geocities.co.jp Thu Oct 15 22:24:18 1998 geocities.co.jp (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA16190 for; Fri, 16 Oct 1998 12:24:14 +0900 (JST) Subject: Re: Para 15 taper Gentlemen, I'm terribly sorry posting wrong calculation of inch vs mm. Yes, it isright 0.008inch is 0.2032mm.Probably I miss typed as 0.08. I am bowing hundred times.Thanks for a lot of reply. Art, Hank and Larry. Sorry Dean for this. Max-- Max Satohan Oriental Bamboo Fly Rod Crafteremail:maxs@geocities.co.jpHome Page:http://members.tripod.com/~maxrod/index.html from flyrod6@juno.com Thu Oct 15 22:41:28 1998 23:40:38 EDT Subject: Re: ferrule attaching cements, etc. If you use this do not use the 5 minute epoxy. I use the the standard 2ton and it works fine, but this philibond is interesting. Any particularbrand? Mark Hallowell On Thu, 15 Oct 1998 15:07:14 -0400 Jerry Snider writes:I find this thread to be fascinating (especially since several of my rodsare one piecers!!). Would it be permissable to request a brief one or twoline response from you folks with LOTS of experience on what you use forferrule cement and your degree of satisfaction? If it is an unusual brand,the source of purchase? mentionedusing a heavy duty Duro? "two ton?" epoxy gel with some satisfaction,others seem to say "no way" regarding using epoxies for ferrules, otherssay contact cement, yet others say no way. This thread would prove mosthelpful (regardless of which we decide to choose) for novice rod builders.J. Snider. ___________________________________________________________________You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e- mail.Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.comor call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654- 5866] from flyrod6@juno.com Thu Oct 15 22:41:46 1998 23:40:38 EDT Subject: Re: Glue strength Let me Know Mark Hallowell On Thu, 15 Oct 1998 09:41:01 -0400 "Hanzich, Al (MLPT)"writes:Reed Tackle still lives outside Stroudsburg PA. Knowing what he has in backroom may still have some Ferruleflex mentioned by Bill. If anyone isinterested I will see if they do. Al Hanzich732-878-6567 -----Original Message-----From: fiveside@net-gate.com Sent: Thursday, October 15, 1998 8:49 AM Subject: Re: Glue strength To Chris Lucker and others,We all ponder about what the tech specs mean to canemakers. Experiencecounts for a whole lot in what we do. Since I'm an epoxy fanI wonder whatthat Gi psi number means to me with my Epon. But after 30years I havereally stopped worrying. I support you 100 percent onrobberoid ferulecements. The best ever was Ferruleflex, a product by ReedTackle in the80's. The best now is Weldwood Contact Cement (Flammable)hardware storeproduct. (Also great for attaching felt soles). Forgive meMike.I do nodeless. I make 40 splices per rod with Titebond II.I use rubberchemical-resistant gloves to make splices. Sometimes Iforget to wash offthe Titebond. Later on there is no way in hell that glue canever be washedoff those gloves.I can sleep nights. Bill ___________________________________________________________________You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e- mail.Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.comor call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654- 5866] from k5vkq@ix.netcom.com Thu Oct 15 23:07:32 1998 23:06:57 ix11.ix.netcom.comvia smap (V1.3) Subject: Re: snake guides Well John, I guess I could use it as my "Persian flaw". If I work realhard and do a good job; hand turned reelseat and insert, hand made snakeguides, beutifully finished bamboo... and finished off with one ugly homadestripper guide. A man's got to know his limitations. Regards,Onisk5vkq@ix.netcom.com Onis;Come on now, I tie mostly 24's and 26's and I am a carpenter withpermanently swollen, 60 grit, scarred up, nerve damaged fingers. Surelyyoucan handle something as huge as an 8mm. stripper. John Channer from anglport@con2.com Thu Oct 15 23:22:04 1998 Subject: Re: Para 15 taper Max,That's why they call us "humans".Art At 12:24 PM 10/16/98 +0900, you wrote:Gentlemen, I'm terribly sorry posting wrong calculation of inch vs mm. Yes, it isright 0.008inch is 0.2032mm.Probably I miss typed as 0.08. I am bowing hundred times.Thanks for a lot of reply. Art, Hank and Larry. Sorry Dean for this. Max-- Max Satohan Oriental Bamboo Fly Rod Crafteremail:maxs@geocities.co.jpHome Page:http://members.tripod.com/~maxrod/index.html from saweiss@flash.net Thu Oct 15 23:45:36 1998 Subject: Re: Para 15 taper... -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Para 15 taper... Dean, I am trying to make Para 15 as next rod right after my canes arrive.Your post helps me very much.Is the varnish so thick around when the rod was made? 0.008 inches =2.0mm.1.0mm on one flat. It is hard to look the real rod here.I just want make sure huw much I should subtract from the measurement.If you can let me know, it is very much helpful.Thank you for sharing valuable information. Max Max, are you sure it's 2.0mm and not .02mm?Steve> from channer@hubwest.com Fri Oct 16 06:34:18 1998 (SMTPD32-4.02c) id AF8957400E2; Fri, 16 Oct 1998 05:35:37 MDT Subject: Re: snake guides At 11:04 PM 10/15/98 -0500, you wrote:Well John, I guess I could use it as my "Persian flaw". If I work realhard and do a good job; hand turned reelseat and insert, hand made snakeguides, beutifully finished bamboo... and finished off with one uglyhomadestripper guide. A man's got to know his limitations. Regards,Onisk5vkq@ix.netcom.com Onis;Come on now, I tie mostly 24's and 26's and I am a carpenter withpermanently swollen, 60 grit, scarred up, nerve damaged fingers. Surelyyoucan handle something as huge as an 8mm. stripper. John Channer Onis;You're right.At the present moment, mine is hardware. As long as otherpeople are willing to sell it to me, i'm going to buy the stuff. John from stetzer@csd.uwm.edu Fri Oct 16 06:57:05 1998 batch3.csd.uwm.edu (8.8.4/8.6.8) with ESMTP id GAA01903 for (8.8.4/8.6.8)with SMTP id GAA03123 for ; Fri, 16 Oct1998 06:57:03 Subject: Re: Glue strength 3M makes several adhesives in small black 1oz tubes. The one you wantis labeled "Super Strength Adhesive". It is the same as the old DowUrethane Bond as far as I can tell, but maybe a wee bit thinner andyou don't have to struggle to get the screw eye out of the top. Verytenacious stuff. I love glue.......................................................................Frank Stetzer "...a cheerful comrade is betterstetzer@uwm.edu than a waterproof coat and a Employed by, but not speaking for foot-warmer." Henry Van Dyke,Univ of Wisconsin-Milwaukee, USA "Fisherman's Luck", 1899. On Thu, 15 Oct 1998, John Zimny wrote: The Dow Corning Urethane Bond was the best stuff I've ever used forferrules. If anyone can locate a similar product, I'd like to know about it.John Z from harry37@epix.net Fri Oct 16 08:14:59 1998 SMTP idJAA18162 Subject: Re: Glue strength--Devcon Gel epoxy? Frank Stetzer wrote: 3M makes several adhesives in small black 1oz tubes. The one you wantis labeled "Super Strength Adhesive". It is the same as the old DowUrethane Bond as far as I can tell, but maybe a wee bit thinner andyou don't have to struggle to get the screw eye out of the top. Verytenacious stuff. I love glue.......................................................................Frank Stetzer "...a cheerful comrade is betterstetzer@uwm.edu than a waterproof coat and aEmployed by, but not speaking for foot-warmer." Henry Van Dyke,Univ of Wisconsin-Milwaukee, USA "Fisherman's Luck", 1899. On Thu, 15 Oct 1998, John Zimny wrote: The Dow Corning Urethane Bond was the best stuff I've ever used forferrules. If anyone can locate a similar product, I'd like to know aboutit.John Z Anyone have long-term results from using Devcon 3000#gel epoxy? Itseems flexible enough to resist shears, especially at ferule stationsand reel seats/handles. I'd appreciate any feedback-- Thanks, Greg from andrew_harsanyi@ibi.com Fri Oct 16 09:38:42 1998 0400 Subject: Re[2]: Bamboo Only Guide Service Survey ..there is also an Art Weiler in Bound Brook NJ that has classes. You essentially end up with a finished rod when you're done (though I don'tthink the class is cheap, it is one night a week for a few months and soundspretty good). Since I am near him I considered it, but decided to do it on my own instead, in close collaboration with a friend of mine (he's actually alwaysa step ahead of me and seems to have a knack for this stuff). Weiler alsoattends the flyfishing show (either Raritan or Somerset) each January so you can see/cast his stuff and judge his abilities for yourself. Lon Blauvelt hasalso been to one of these shows (I don;t remember which) and he has stuff like planing forms, etc. that you can check out...Andy ______________________________ Reply Separator_________________________________Subject: Re: Bamboo Only Guide Service Survey Author: at Tcpgate john channer wrote: At 10:13 PM 10/13/98 -0700, you wrote:TSmithwick@aol.com wrote: In a message dated 10/13/98 7:25:27 AM, you wrote: don't have a good how-to-book. have only built two graphite rods(three piece 7, and two piece 9) i loved it! did you get the albies FROMthe beach, if so, i'm mightily impressed...i was on a boat with a guideand we were in schools of albies which were lovely...the wrist is prettywimpy though, have started wimp wrist weights for women (akawwww), buti DID haul them in with a lot of yelling from the gestapo guide. irefused to quit. on a spey rod?!, that's so cool. any info on a simplehow-to book would be appreciated (please not too expensive), i have tosave up for the next fishing trip.thanks,jeanps: the psychological pain of not being perfect when you turn out a rodcan be devastating, don't you agree? Jean;The best how-to book for the money is The Lovely Reed by Jack Howell(myappology's to Wayne). You can order it from Amazon.com for about $35.00.Wayne Cattanach's book, Handcrafting Bamboo Fly Rods is already aclassic,plus it has a disk included for designing rod tapers and guide spacing, butit is about $15-$20.00 more money. A Master's Guide to Building BambooFlyRods, by Hoagy Carmichel and Everett Garrison is THE classic, but at$75.00will really dig a hole in your pocket. You mentioned before that you wereinterested in taking a class, George Maurer gives rodmaking classesregularly. He is in Shoemaker, Pa. 610-562-8595. I think that the bestwayto start would be to read the rodmaking FAQ's by Bruce Connor and TomPenrose that you can get to thru the Rodmaker's webpage. John Channerdear john, (i just hate writing these dear john letters) your concise info onthis subject is wonderful, thank you very, very muchly...am still in theprocess of filtering out so much, but am enthusiastic and excited aboutbuilding a rod for my obstreperous (sp?) sister who lives in colorado. ithink i will contact mr. shoemaker, as i have a cabin in NEpennsylvania..(don't know how close that is to him). thanks again,jean from michael@wugate.wustl.edu Fri Oct 16 10:16:30 1998 Subject: RODMAKERS Adminstrativia Hello Friends... I have a few IMPORTANT announcements affecting us all on theRODMAKERS list. #1 ... We now have another RODMAKERS Listguy!!! Long time listmember,Jerry Ballard (ballard@zen.wes.army.mil) has most graciously accepted myplea for help. (For you longtime members, Jerry was the one who createdTAPERMAIL, the original email version of Wayne's HEXROD.) So everyoneplease welcome Jerry as our new Listguy-in-Training, and go easy on him,atleast for a few days! ;-) #2 ... The RODMAKERS Guidelines document and Welcome message is nowcomplete! I will be forever thankful to the Reverend Doctor Harry Boyd(fbcwin@fsbnet.com) for his help and patience in generating thesedocuments. The WELCOME message will be automatically distributed toeachperson as they subscribe to the list. The INFO file is an expanded versionof the WELCOME message, and will be sent in response to the LISTPROCcommand: INFO RODMAKERS. The WELCOME message also outlines how toobtainthis file. I will include the WELCOME message at the end of this. PLEASE, please,everyone, take a moment to read through the attached WELCOME message,andto download the INFO file. Read them through, we are genuinely interest inyour thoughts on these documents. Also if you have any suggestions,pleaseforward them to myself, or Harry. Once again, join me in extending my thanks to both Jerry and Harry... Mike BiondoRODMAKERS Listguy~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~WELCOME message~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~Welcome to RODMAKERS!!! The list's main emphasis is Bamboo Rodmaking, Restoring, and Collecting. !!!! PLEASE SAVE THIS MESSAGE!!! You will doubtlessly find occasion to refer to it later. To send mail to the list use the following email address: RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu The maintainers of the list are:Mike Biondo michael@wugate.wustl.eduJerry Ballard ballard@zen.wes.army.mil In addition to this note, there are two additional documents you should know about. An INFO/FAQ file answers many questions about how you can maximize the benefits of the list, and details what is expected of you as a list member. The other document is a HELP file describing useful mail server commands to customize your subscription settings. Please take a moment to download and read these files. You as listmembers areresponsible for their familiarity. LISTPROC@mail.wustl.edu Leave subject line blank, and in the body of the message, type:INFO RODMAKERSHELP If there is anything you do not understand, please feel free to contactone of the list maintainers. The RODMAKERS list began in 1994 with a handful of friends interested in regularly communicating with each other on the subject of rodmaking, and has grown to over 500 makers and lovers of bamboo rods, from worldrenowned experts to complete beginners. People from all over our world find this a valuable resource. Jerry Foster maintains a complete archive of the list at: http://home1.gte.net/jfoster/index.htmEvery post and response to the list since records were kept is stored there for our use. Extensive lists of resources, tapers, and suppliers of rodmaking goodies are catalogued there as well. Questions can often more quickly be answered by referring to the web page, than posting a question to the list. Please take advantage of this resource. To help the list serve your needs best, please: A. Feel free to ask questions, and more importantly, if someone asks a question about which you have information, give freely and willingly of the what you have to offer. "There are no stupid questions except those which remain unasked." B. When replying to a question or statement posted to the list, please include only enough of the original message to indicate the context of your response. If you simply reply to the entire post, reading through the responses gets tedious and clutters the archives with repeatinformation. C. This is a good-natured list. Strong language, spam, and flaming are not welcome. Repeat offenders will be removed from the list. D. Try to keep your posts relevant to the subject of rodmaking. We all wander from time to time, please keep it to a minimum. E. Remember to keep commercial activities as private as possible. Most, if not all, business transactions are more appropriately handled through private email, or through a phone call. If you have any question about the appropriateness of a post by which you might profit, please refer to that section of the INFO file, or contact the list owner for clarification. F. Finally, remember this Listserver operates on the honor system with respect to all these guidelines, so please respect them, enjoy the conversations, and catch a few fish! Again, welcome to RODMAKERS, andenjoy! from DBURRILL@TELEHUB.com Fri Oct 16 10:38:26 1998 Subject: RE: Para 15 taper... boundary="---- =_NextPart_001_01BDF91A.F0939884" This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does notunderstandthis format, some or all of this message may not be legible. ------ =_NextPart_001_01BDF91A.F0939884 I should be able to manage a brief visit on Saturday. Cork has beenordered, but I haven't seen it yet. Kegging is much easier than bottling, but a little pricey...you need arefrigerator that you can drill a hole in for the tap. Used kegs areabout $45, then you need a CO2 cylinder at about $35, a regulator atabout $55, line and couplings at $25 and the taps are about $40. On theflip side there is no begging for bottles, sterilizing bottles, fillingor capping of bottles. After fermentation just dump it in the keg andcharge it with CO2. You are welcome to join me in a brewing sessionsome time. It's easy to do.I've spent the last couple nights working on my old table saw. I builta sturdy wood stand for it, then bought an aftermarket fence andextension that were a bitch to retrofit to the old, small saw. I thinkit will work out ok. -----Original Message-----From: Chester Jung [SMTP:closenuf@hotmail.com]Sent: Thursday, October 15, 1998 6:05 PM Subject: Re: Para 15 taper... Congratulations, you finally got the 'true' taper! Now, thequestions is, when the hell are you going to find the time to build thissucker! Mike still hasn't made up his mind which taper he's going tobuild, you know him. I asked him after our mtn bike ride and he saidthat he wasn't sure yet, probably will decide at the last minute. Thebike ride was a killer, 12 of us went, 2 women, ages ranged from 22 - 55,Mike and I were the oldest, Mike's son Dana being the youngest. Therewere some strong riders on this trip, the two guys that came with me areanimals! I had to drive down to LA the next day, Sunday, and I was stillhurting from the ride, didn't really recover until Wednesday. OnMonday, before meeting with Adam's dentist, I got to run over to a old toolstore in Santa Monica, really had alot of old tools. Was sorely temptedto buy something, everything was 30% off, but resisted spending anymoney. Lots of planes, both metal and wooden ones. Drove back onMonday as soon as I was done with the dentist, got back around 7 pm, I=5is such a drag. One of the guys who went on the mtn bike ride brews beer,brought a six pack with him.Stuff is very good, got a kick to it too. I know that you putyour brew in kegs, where did you buy the kegs? I'd like him to brew somestuff bottles his brew because he has no room in his apartment to store a keg. Isit easier to put the brew in kegs? Is that why you do it? I haveone bottle left, come on over this weekend and try it. Hear fromthe cork guy? Mike will bring the ferrules when he comes up for theCal/UCLA game on the 24th. from owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Thu Oct 15 10:18:05 1998 Received: from gurnee.telehub.com (telehub1.telehub.com 10:38:17 -0500 Received: by GURNEE.telehub.com with Internet Mail Service(5.5.1960.3) Message-Id: Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1998 10:37:46 -0500 Sender: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduFrom: "Burrill, Dean" Subject: Para 15 taper...MIME-Version: 1.0Content-Type: multipart/alternative;boundary="---- =_NextPart_001_01BDF851.C1FFBCC6"X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.1960.3)X-Listprocessor-Version: 8.0 -- ListProcessor(tm) by CREN Back in August I was looking for an alternate source for a Para15taper. My search recently led me to Dwight Lyons who happenedto haveone in the shop. He was gracious enough to send me thefollowing taperand description: Here are the tapers for the Para 15 with heavy tip 5/64"tip top 0= .078(actual)5= .09810=.12515=.12520=.14025=.16330=.18835=.19440=.20545=.229just above ferrule=.23750=.246(taken below wrap on butt ferrule @ 50 1/2")maybe .245 @50"55=.26060=.26665=.27370=.27975=.29280=.29785=.30086 1/2"=.300(just above hook keeper wrap)90=.300(assumed)95=.300 "96=.300 " Tapers for second tip with 4 1/2 64ths tip top 0= .070(actual)5= .08710=.12015=.12820=.14025=.16430=.18435=.19340=.20745=.22646 3/4"=.235 just above the ferrule which is 15/64 SuperZeeoxidised. Para 15 guide spacing Butt section from top of ferrule. Two snakes and onemediumPerfectionstripper(med) bright 5 1/2" 14 1/2" 23 3/8" Tip sections from top of tip top. Six bright chromesnakes. 5 1/8" 11 1/8" 18 1/8" 26 1/16" 35 1/4" 44 1/4" The thread is a dark red and it has the spiral up on theferruleside. These tapers were taken over varnish, so I would allowat least.008. The cork grip is a fairly narrow reverse cigar thattapers fromthe reel seatup towards the front with a thuimb depression on top.This corkgrip is 61/8" long. ______________________________________________________Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------ =_NextPart_001_01BDF91A.F0939884 RE: Para 15 taper... I should be able to manage a brief = Kegging is much easier than bottling,=but a little pricey...you need a refrigerator that you can drill a hole = cylinder at about $35, a regulator at about $55, line and couplings at = begging for bottles, sterilizing bottles, filling or capping of = I've spent the last couple nights = then bought an aftermarket fence and extension that were a bitch to = ok. -----Original=Message----- [SMTP:closenuf@hotmail.com] Thursday, October 15, 1998 6:05 PM Re: Para 15 taper... Congratulations,you = is, when thehell =are you going to find the time to build this sucker! Mike still hasn't=made up his mind which taper he's going to build, you know him. = wasn't sure yet,= was a killer, 12of =us went, 2 women, ages ranged from 22 - 55, Mike and I were theoldest, = strong riders on= I had to drivedown =to LA the next day, Sunday, and I was still hurting from the ride, = meeting withAdam's =dentist, I got to run over to a old tool store in Santa Monica, = something, = Lots of planes,= soon as I wasdone =with the dentist, got back around 7 pm, I=3D5 is such a of =the guys who went on the mtn bike ride brews beer, brought a six pack with=him.Stuff is verygood, = in kegs, wheredid = me = brew because hehas = easier to putthe = bottle left,come = =will bring the ferrules when he comes up for the Cal/UCLA game on the = owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Thu Oct 15 10:18:05 1998 from = wugate.wustl.edu (8.8.8/8.8.5) with SMTP id KAA30219; from = wugate.wustl.edu (8.8.8/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA01131 =GURNEE.telehub.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.1960.3) = 15 =Oct 1998 10:37:46 -0500 rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Para =15 taper... Version: =1.0 Type: =multipart/alternative; boundary=3D"----=3D_NextPart_001_01BDF851.C1FFBCC6" Internet Mail Service (5.5.1960.3) =CREN August =I was looking for an alternate source for a Para 15 search recently led me to Dwight Lyons who happened to have taper description: tapers for the Para 15 with heavy tip 5/64" tip top .078(actual) .098 10=3D.125 15=3D.125 20=3D.140 25=3D.163 30=3D.188 35=3D.194 40=3D.205 45=3D.229 ferrule=3D.237 50=3D.246(taken =below wrap on butt ferrule @ 50 1/2") maybe .245 @ 55=3D.260 60=3D.266 65=3D.273 70=3D.279 75=3D.292 80=3D.297 85=3D.300 1/2"=3D.300(just above hook keeper wrap) 90=3D.300(assumed) second tip with 4 1/2 64ths tip top .070(actual) .087 10=3D.120 15=3D.128 20=3D.140 25=3D.164 30=3D.184 35=3D.193 40=3D.207 45=3D.226 3/4"=3D.235 just above the ferrule which is 15/64 Super Zee =spacing from top of ferrule. Two snakes and one medium =bright 1/2" 1/2" 3/8" 1/8" 1/8" 1/8" 1/16" = 1/4" a =dark red and it has the spiral up on the ferrule =were taken over varnish, so I would allow at least =is a fairly narrow reverse cigar that tapers from seat the = 6 long. ______________________________________________________Get YourPrivate, =Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------ =_NextPart_001_01BDF91A.F0939884-- from DBURRILL@TELEHUB.com Fri Oct 16 10:50:15 1998 Subject: RE: Para 15 taper... boundary="---- =_NextPart_001_01BDF91C.9749053C" This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does notunderstandthis format, some or all of this message may not be legible. ------ =_NextPart_001_01BDF91C.9749053C Damn that reply button...sorry listers. -----Original Message-----From: Burrill, Dean [SMTP:DBURRILL@TELEHUB.com]Sent: Friday, October 16, 1998 8:38 AM Subject: RE: Para 15 taper... I should be able to manage a brief visit on Saturday.=A0 Cork has Kegging is much easier than bottling, but a little pricey...youneed a refrigerator that you can drill a hole in for the tap.=A0 Used =kegsare about $45, then you need a CO2 cylinder at about $35, a regulator =atabout $55, line and couplings at $25 and the taps are about $40.=A0 On =theflip side there is no begging for bottles, sterilizing bottles, fillingor capping of bottles.=A0 After fermentation just dump it in the keg =andcharge it with CO2.=A0 You are welcome to join me in a brewing sessionsome time.=A0 It's easy to do. I've spent the last couple nights working on my old table saw.=A0I built a sturdy wood stand for it, then bought an aftermarket fence =andextension that were a bitch to retrofit to the old, small saw.=A0 I =thinkit will work out ok. =09 ------ =_NextPart_001_01BDF91C.9749053C RE: Para 15 taper... Damn that reply button...sorry =listers. -----Original=Message----- [SMTP:DBURRILL@TELEHUB.com] Friday, October 16, 1998 8:38 AM RE: Para 15 taper... I should be ableto =manage a brief visit on Saturday.=A0 Cork has been ordered, but I =haven't seen it yet.=A0Kegging is mucheasier =than bottling, but a little pricey...you need a refrigerator that you =can drill a hole in for the tap.=A0 Used kegs are about $45, then you =need a CO2 cylinder at about $35, a regulator at about $55, line and =couplings at $25 and the taps are about $40.=A0 On the flip side there =is no begging for bottles, sterilizing bottles, filling or capping of =bottles.=A0 After fermentation just dump it in the keg and charge it =with CO2.=A0 You are welcome to join me in a brewing session some =time.=A0 It's easy to do. I've spent thelast =couple nights working on my old table saw.=A0 I built a sturdy wood =stand for it, then bought an aftermarket fence and extension that were =a bitch to retrofit to the old, small saw.=A0 I think it will work out =ok. ------ =_NextPart_001_01BDF91C.9749053C-- from michael@wugate.wustl.edu Fri Oct 16 15:28:19 1998 Subject: Hook-keeper rings Can anyone think of a reason not to use sterling silver wire as opposed tonickle silver wire for hook-keeper rings. At $0.75/ft for sterling, priceis not a consideration. Is sterling silver wire substancially softer, or more prone to tarnish thannickle silver??? Mike - hi ho Silver - BiondoSt. Louis, MO from gwr@seanet.com Fri Oct 16 15:43:57 1998 mx.seanet.com(8.8.8/Seanet-8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA23954 for; Fri, Subject: Re: Hook-keeper rings boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0014_01BDF90B.7ECA8540" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0014_01BDF90B.7ECA8540 boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0015_01BDF90B.7ECA8540" ------=_NextPart_001_0015_01BDF90B.7ECA8540 Mike, Angler's Workshop (no affiliation) sells a hook tender that is, if I =recall correctly, a sterling ring on a pin. The pin jams into the grip =leaving a loose sterling ring just about where a hook tender would be =wrapped on if you used a standard hook tender of some sort. The ring =looked like it was just a piece of soldered wire. Good luck with the =experiment. Best, Russ Golden Witch Rods - "Tools For Natural Philosophy"Golden Witch Technologies, Inc. - "The Golden Age Is Now"gwr@seanet.comhttp://www.goldenwitch.com -----Original Message-----From: Mike Biondo Date: Friday, October 16, 1998 1:29 PMSubject: Hook-keeper rings Can anyone think of a reason not to use sterling silver wire as =opposed tonickle silver wire for hook-keeper rings. At $0.75/ft for sterling, =priceis not a consideration. Is sterling silver wire substancially softer, or more prone to =tarnish thannickle silver??? Mike - hi ho Silver - BiondoSt. Louis, MO ------=_NextPart_001_0015_01BDF90B.7ECA8540 Mike, Angler's = (no affiliation) sells a hook tender that = leaving a loose sterling ring just about where a hook tender would be = experiment. Best, Russ = "Tools For Natural Philosophy"Golden Witch -----Original = rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= <rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= Friday, October 16, 1998 1:29 PMSubject: Hook- ringsCan anyone think of a reason not to use = silver wire as opposed tonickle silver wire for hook-keeper = At $0.75/ft for sterling, priceis not a consideration.Is = thannickle silver???Mike - hi ho Silver - BiondoSt. = MO ------=_NextPart_001_0015_01BDF90B.7ECA8540-- ------=_NextPart_000_0014_01BDF90B.7ECA8540 name="Golden Witch.vcf" filename="Golden Witch.vcf" BEGIN:VCARDN:Gooding;John;R.FN:Golden WitchORG:Golden WitchTITLE:Rod Maker &c.TEL;WORK;VOICE:(425) 787- 6599TEL;PAGER;VOICE:noneTEL;WORK;FAX:noneADR;WORK;ENCODING=3DQUOTED-PRINTABLE:;;16829 6th Ave. =West=3D0D=3D0ASuite #2B=3D0D=3D0A;Lynnwood;WA;98037;USALABEL;WORK;ENCODING=3DQUOTED-PRINTABLE:16829 6th Ave. =West=3D0D=3D0ASuite #2B=3D0D=3D0A=3D0D=3D0ALynnwood, WA =98037=3D0D=3D0AUSAURL:noneURL:http://www.goldenwitch.comEMAIL;PREF;INTERNET:gwr@seanet.comEND:VCARD ------=_NextPart_000_0014_01BDF90B.7ECA8540-- from k5vkq@ix.netcom.com Fri Oct 16 17:11:33 1998 17:10:58 ix2.ix.netcom.comvia smap (V1.3) Subject: RE: Para 15 taper... RAA17563 I enjoyed reading it. The local homebrew supply here sells reconditioned 5gal. soft drink kegs. Mine are empty right now. Darn, I need to getcaught up on this building long enough to make a batch. Planing would bemore fun if I didn't have to work with a dry throat. Redgards,Onisk5vkq@ix.netcom.com At 10:49 AM 10/16/98 -0500, you wrote:Damn that reply button...sorry listers. -----Original Message----- Burrill, Dean [SMTP:DBURRILL@TELEHUB.com] Friday, October 16, 1998 8:38 AM rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu RE: Para 15 taper... I should be able to manage a brief visit onSaturday. Cork has been ordered, but I haven't seen it yet. Kegging is much easier than bottling, but a little pricey...you need arefrigerator that you can drill a hole in for the tap. Used kegs are about$45, then you need a CO2 cylinder at about $35, a regulator at about $55,line and couplings at $25 and the taps are about $40. On the flip sidethere is no begging for bottles, sterilizing bottles, filling or capping ofbottles. After fermentation just dump it in the keg and charge it withCO2. You are welcome to join me in a brewing session some time. It'seasyto do. I've spent the last couple nights working on my old table saw. Ibuilt a sturdy wood stand for it, then bought an aftermarket fence andextension that were a bitch to retrofit to the old, small saw. I think itwill work out ok. from panlone@cinci.infi.net Fri Oct 16 17:16:58 1998 Subject: Is the list inactive Is the list inactive or is it me. I have not received any e-mail from thelist lately. After getting 45-50 a day I'm getting withdrawal pains! I'm new to bamboo rodmaking and have been reading your postings withgreatanticipation for the day I build my first. from TSmithwick@aol.com Fri Oct 16 17:18:03 1998 Subject: Re: Hook-keeper rings In a message dated 10/16/98 8:42:41 PM, you wrote: Mike - I think the answer is yes in both cases, but the difference isprobablynot enough to worry about in the application. I would try it. Use a diameterwire large enough to hold it's shape when the fly tugs against it. from mcdowellc@lanecc.edu Fri Oct 16 17:26:44 1998 via smap(4.1) Subject: P.U.I. I enjoyed reading it. The local homebrew supply here sellsreconditioned=5 gal. soft drink kegs. Mine are empty right now. Darn, I need to getcaught up on this building long enough to make a batch. Planing would bemore fun if I didn't have to work with a dry throat. Redgards,Onis Be careful Onis, you could be cited on a PUI (Planing under influence of an intoxicating beverage). The bamboo police may drop by and run you through the following sobriety tests. You'll need to plane in a straight line with no wobbling of the plane iron. Then recite all of the famous rodmakers by name in reverse alphabetical order. Finally, you must look up, arms extended and touch the tip of your nose with a wobbly tip strip. If you fail, your planing license may be suspended. Be careful!! Chris from jczimny@dol.net Fri Oct 16 18:38:51 1998 Subject: Re: Hook-keeper rings Yes. It turns black over the winter.John Z.-----Original Message----- Subject: Hook-keeper rings Can anyone think of a reason not to use sterling silver wire as opposed tonickle silver wire for hook-keeper rings. At $0.75/ft for sterling, priceis not a consideration. Is sterling silver wire substancially softer, or more prone to tarnish thannickle silver??? Mike - hi ho Silver - BiondoSt. Louis, MO from LECLAIR123@aol.com Fri Oct 16 19:23:16 1998 Subject: Re: Hook-keeper rings Mike,I use Sterling Silver wire myself for pinning wire, etc. It is a littlesofter thannickel silver wire, but it hasn't caused any problems for me. It also willtake oxidizing very well, just like nickel silver. I don't think that ittarnishes any fasterthan nickel silver. Dave leClair from LECLAIR123@aol.com Fri Oct 16 19:27:07 1998 Subject: Re: Is the list inactive Joe,I'm getting 50 to 100 e-mails per day. If you are not getting them, I'dcheckwith your server. Dave LeClair from saltwein@swbell.net Fri Oct 16 19:36:51 1998 gw3adm.rcsntx.swbell.net TAA29216 Subject: Re: Hook-keeper rings ............. At $0.75/ft for sterling, priceis not a consideration. Mike - hi ho Silver - BiondoSt. Louis, MO Mike, What is your source for the sterling silver wire? Regards, SteveIndependence, MO from Grhghlndr@aol.com Fri Oct 16 19:46:39 1998 Subject: Removal from list Mike,Can you please remove my name from the list. I am tired of wading thrustuffthat is irrelevant to building rods and I am tired of opening a response toaninquiry and finding Thanks for the info. I feel that there is to many thingsthat should be sent privately to people put on the list and to many thingsthat have nothing to do with the subject line when you open the mail. Ihaveenjoyed the things that have been relevant and I hope that any posts that Ihave given on different subjects have helped out but I am to busy to wadethruall the posts that are not useful. I wish you all the best of luck inbuilding rods and I may check back at a later date and see if things havechanged. Tony and anyone else who want to keep in touch please keep myaddress and drop me a line.Bret from jpsnbs@erols.com Fri Oct 16 19:51:33 1998 Joe, I too experienced no email for sometime. At the recommendations ofothergenerous list members I attempted to unsubscribe. Although this did notimmediately work for me, probably due to being technologically limited,eventually it did. After unsubscribing simply re-subscribe and the hitsjust keep on coming. Tight seams, Joe Swam from fbcwin@fsbnet.com Fri Oct 16 20:50:46 1998 0500 Subject: Re: Hook-keeper rings Mike Biondo wrote: Can anyone think of a reason not to use sterling silver wire as opposedtonickle silver wire for hook-keeper rings. >snipped from fbcwin@fsbnet.com Fri Oct 16 20:54:03 1998 Fri, 16 Oct 1998 20:51:38 -0500 Subject: Re: Removal from list Adios, Bret! We'll miss ya... :-) Grhghlndr@aol.com wrote: Mike,Can you please remove my name from the list. >snipped from bdcreek@grand-rapids.crosswinds.net Fri Oct 16 20:59:00 1998 (envelope- from bdcreek@grand-rapids.crosswinds.net) Subject: Re: Hook-keeper rings Mike-If our silver is any indication, one midwest summer can turnuncoated stuff almost black. But it seems plenty hard enough. Try itand let us know. Brian from tyoung@perth.dialix.com.au Fri Oct 16 20:59:53 1998 Sat, 17 Oct 1998 09:59:38 +0800 (WST)(envelope- from tyoung) Subject: Re: Hook-keeper rings On Fri, 16 Oct 1998, Mike Biondo wrote: Can anyone think of a reason not to use sterling silver wire as opposedtonickle silver wire for hook-keeper rings. At $0.75/ft for sterling, priceis not a consideration. Is sterling silver wire substancially softer, or more prone to tarnishthannickle silver??? Mike - hi ho Silver - BiondoSt. Louis, MO I made a rod for a bloke who wanted a stirling silver hook keepr. It seemed to work ok and I've spoken with him several times since and he's never mentioned any problems. Tony /***********************************************************************/Tony Younghttp://www.iinet.net.au/~mainpeak/flyrod.htmlThe Australian connection A computer without windows is like a fish without a bicycle /***********************************************************************/ from k5vkq@ix.netcom.com Fri Oct 16 21:38:09 1998 21:37:35 ix14.ix.netcom.comvia smap (V1.3) Subject: Re: P.U.I. SSchhh. I'm in trouble. I can't do that sober! Regards,Onisk5vkq@ix.netcom.com At 03:26 PM 10/16/98 PDT, you wrote:I enjoyed reading it. The local homebrew supply here sellsreconditioned=5 gal. soft drink kegs. Mine are empty right now. Darn, I need to getcaught up on this building long enough to make a batch. Planing would bemore fun if I didn't have to work with a dry throat. Redgards,Onis Be careful Onis, you could be cited on a PUI (Planing under influence of an intoxicating beverage). The bamboo police may drop by and run youthrough the following sobriety tests. You'll need to plane in a straight line with no wobbling of the plane iron. Then recite all of the famous rodmakers by name in reverse alphabetical order. Finally, you must look up, arms extended and touch the tip of your nose with a wobbly tip strip. If you fail, your planing license may be suspended. Be careful!! Chris from ragnarig@integrityol.com Fri Oct 16 21:43:28 1998 (SMTPD32-4.06) id A66F3300FC; Fri, 16 Oct 1998 19:52:31 PDT Subject: Re: Is the list inactive dear Joe If you haven't gotten anything today (I got several) you've probably beendropped. The best way to get back on is to UNSUBSCRIBE, wait a fewminutes,then SUBSCRIBE. This usually does the trick. Good luck,Davy Riggs -----Original Message----- Subject: Is the list inactive Is the list inactive or is it me. I have not received any e-mail from thelist lately. After getting 45-50 a day I'm getting withdrawal pains! I'm new to bamboo rodmaking and have been reading your postings withgreatanticipation for the day I build my first. from michael@wugate.wustl.edu Sat Oct 17 00:33:06 1998 Subject: Re: Hook-keeper rings Well, the popular concenus seems to be that I can use sterling silverwithout any problem (except maybe some tarnish over the winter)...wow,myrods will have sterling silver fittings!!! Okay, okay so it's just onelittle ring, but hey... :-) Steve asks where I found the wire. I found both nickle silver wire andsterling silver wire at places that sell beads. I had picked up a wholespool of 26 gauge NS wire for about $3.00, but it turned out to be a tadtoo small. After the ring was soldered it held it's shape alright, but Ithought it would look better with a little thicker ring. Went back to thestore looking for 22 gauge which they didn't have, but suggested I try thesterling wire. Thanks for all the input guys... Mike- from russettrods@hotmail.com Sat Oct 17 08:58:18 1998 Sat, 17 Oct 1998 06:57:40 PDT Subject: RE: Para 15 taper... I have one question re this Para15 taper. What line weight is this for? Larry Russett 0= .078(actual)5= .09810=.12515=.12520=.14025=.16330=.18835=.19440=.20545=.229just above ferrule=.23750=.246(taken below wrap on butt ferrule @ 50 1/2") maybe .245 @50"55=.26060=.26665=.27370=.27975=.29280=.29785=.30086 1/2"=.300(just above hook keeper wrap)90=.300(assumed)95=.300 "96=.300 " Tapers for second tip with 4 1/2 64ths tip top 0= .070(actual)5= .08710=.12015=.12820=.14025=.16430=.18435=.19340=.20745=.22646 3/4"=.235 just above the ferrule which is 15/64 Super Zeeoxidised. Para 15 guide spacing Butt section from top of ferrule. Two snakes and one mediumPerfectionstripper(med) bright 5 1/2" 14 1/2" 23 3/8" Tip sections from top of tip top. Six bright chrome snakes. 5 1/8" 11 1/8" 18 1/8" 26 1/16" 35 1/4" 44 1/4" The thread is a dark red and it has the spiral up on the ferruleside. These tapers were taken over varnish, so I would allow at least.008. The cork grip is a fairly narrow reverse cigar that tapers fromthe reel seatup towards the front with a thuimb depression on top. This corkgrip is 6 1/8" long. ______________________________________________________Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com from rada@mibuzon.com Sat Oct 17 09:58:33 1998 Subject: Hello again and some questions. Hello rodmakers, how are you doing? I hope I haven't missed THE FINAL solution. I've been off line forseveral months, but the Spanish stuff is back. By the way, We arestarting a 7' 0'' 4 wt. rod ( a Sir D favorite, thank you Wayne andDarryl) and I have a couple of questions: 1. We are running out of glue and I would like to try an Epoxy.Unfortunately we normally need to straighten the glued blank, so I wouldlike some advice about heat resistance to choose between Shell Epon vsNyatexEpoxy. I would also need the fax number of Miller Stephenson Chemical andBillHulbertIndustrial Howell to order any of these glues. 2. Fax number of Bailey Woods Classic Sporting Enterprises to ordersome ferrules for the Sir D favorite. Regarding this taper would yourecommend truncated ferrules or not? Thank you very much and I'm so happy to contact all of you again, Fernando RadaSpain. from RVenneri@aol.com Sat Oct 17 10:38:56 1998 Subject: Re: Is the list inactive This has also worked for me too. Bob V from jkallo@midwest.net Sat Oct 17 10:44:23 1998 Subject: Golden Trout Hey guys,Okay, this is probably a bit off-topic, so you can reply off-list. Somemention was made a week or two ago about fishing for golden trout. Thismorning I was fishing the newly stocked Devil's Kitchen lake here is s.Illinois and caught a number really bizzare looking 'bows. They were, I kidyou not, bannana yellow. I was told that they were the product of geneticmanipulation and were stocked with the more normal ones to helpfishermanlocate fish. Hmmmm. So are these the golden trout that were spoken of?Theywere really, really odd. Joe Joseph S. KalloDpt. of PhilosophySouthern Illinois University at Carbondale from rmoon@ida.net Sat Oct 17 12:01:55 1998 Subject: Re:test from RVenneri@aol.com Sat Oct 17 14:33:12 1998 Subject: Re: Is the list inactive Test from dickay@alltel.net Sat Oct 17 15:15:38 1998 PAA13322 Subject: Re: Nasty Stains! Tim, John, JerryI thought the active ingredient in wart removers was formic acid. Oxalicacid can be found in photo shops. Hope this helps. Sorry to be so latewith this but I got behind on my E-Mail reading. Dick Fuhrmandickay@alltel.net this maybe far fetched thougth but you may find oxalic acid in yourlocal pharmacy. I think it is the active ingrdient in so wart removers. from sats@gte.net Sat Oct 17 16:02:46 1998 Subject: Re: A Different Survey List, Don't know what is going on. My server is goofy and the list's may beexperiencing problems, too. I hope this request isn't redundant. Thanks forthe tolerance of the bandwidth taken. My ninth grade daughter has an economics project for school that coulduseyour help. She is conducting a survey looking for data on the purchase ofbamboo rods. If anyone who has bought a rod to use for fishing in the lastseveral years (source and maker not important) would plesae fill out thesurvey and e-mail it back to me PRIVATELY, I'd really appreciate it. Thanks in advance. -Ed Estloweestlow@srminc.com SURVEY 1) How much money did you spend on your bamboo fly rod? I own several. those that I bought go from $45 to $225 2) Do you like the feel and weight of your rod (yes or no)? Yes and no. I like them better then graphite, but I'm still looking for "the"rod. 3) Are you happy with the performance of your rod (yes or no)? Yes. Most fish I catch are within 30ft of me. most are sunfish. 4) How old is your rod (years/months)? About 40 to 60 years. It's hard to tell because I got them all second hand. 5) How long have you been using your bamboo rod (years/months)? 2 1/2years. 6) Was it worth the investment (yes or no)? YES! 7) Did you buy a new or used rod)Used. Any new rods I own will be built by me. (both for Economics and pleasure of fishing something I built.) Terry "Sunfish" KirkpatrickSafety Harbor, Fl.(Old Tampa Bay)sats@gte.net from panlone@cinci.infi.net Sat Oct 17 16:34:12 1998 boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0005_01BDF9F4.2E4D5B80" 000000002B8510348054D11195F9688003C1000024932100 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01BDF9F4.2E4D5B80 Thanks to all who helped me get back on line.I've been receiving some mail so I guess it is now working.Joe Panfalonepanlone@cinci.infi.net ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01BDF9F4.2E4D5B80 name="winmail.dat" filename="winmail.dat" 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 ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01BDF9F4.2E4D5B80-- from RVenneri@aol.com Sat Oct 17 17:25:29 1998 Subject: Re: Removal from list Bret Sorry to see you goBob V from LECLAIR123@aol.com Sat Oct 17 17:37:28 1998 Subject: Re: Hook-keeper rings Tony,A do Hicky ?? A Snake Stripper ?? Sure, why not.Just got back from a turkey dinner at the church, we goevery year. Sure was good. It looks like everything is gettingback to normal on the list. Finally!!! I think as long as Terrydoesn't come back again, everything will be just fine. Well, just wanted to say, HI. Take care and watch out Dave L. from channer@hubwest.com Sat Oct 17 18:05:40 1998 (SMTPD32-4.02c) id A31221010132; Sat, 17 Oct 1998 17:06:58 MDT Subject: test did I get bumped or is everyone out for the day? from saltwein@swbell.net Sat Oct 17 18:16:22 1998 gw1adm.rcsntx.swbell.net SAA07775 Subject: test, no msg. from FISHWOOL@aol.com Sat Oct 17 18:46:41 1998 Subject: Re: Re: Hook-keeper rings Mike,Before mounting your sterling silver rings try dipping 'em in polyurethane-that may cut down on the tarnishing. Also, I've had a cap and ringmade in sterling silver for 8 years and it is still untarnished in the box. Imay use it sometime-except I don't like cap and ring.Good luck,Hank. from briansr@point-net.com Sat Oct 17 19:00:03 1998 0000 Subject: Barry Kustin Hello listers Would anyone current wereabouts of Barry KustinThanks. in advance Brian Sturrocke-mail briansr@point-net.com from emiller257@dataflo.net Sat Oct 17 19:09:36 1998 wddataflo.dataflo.net (8.8.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id TAA03374 for Subject: titebond ll A NUMBER OF RODMAKERS THAT ARE CURRENTLY MAKING NODELESS RODSUSE TITEBOND II FOR THE SPLICES. DOES ANYONE CURRENTLY USE TITEBOND IIAS THEIR MAIN ADHESIVE? ANY COMMENTS ARE WELCOME. ED M. from sjstill@iquest.net Sat Oct 17 19:18:47 1998 0000 (209.43.53.208) test Steve and Julie Stillabower, Indianapolis, INsjstill@iquest.net from bacon@idt.net Sat Oct 17 20:29:23 1998 Subject: Re: snake guides Onis Cogburn wrote: Yeah, after cutting my fingers doing it the hard way, I wonder if that'snot the best way to go. I enjoy "doing it my way" but sometimes thatgetsridiculous. Regards,Onisk5vkq@ix.netcom.com I forgot to mention, you can get a great little do hicky from Dave Lcalled "The Snake Maker". Makes great snakes. Tony On Thu, 15 Oct 1998, Onis Cogburn wrote: OK, I've been sucked in again! I going to make the snake guides andtiptop. That takes care of everything but the stripper guide. What's thebest way of doing that? It would seem the simplest way would be todothesame thing as the snake guides and use two turns instead of one. Anyonehave a better solution? Regards,Onisk5vkq@ix.netcom.com Onis,I haven't tried this yet but I was thinking the thing to do would bemakea snake as usual and silver solder a ring turned from NS or bronze inmycase. This would make a snake striper. Tony /***********************************************************************/Tony Younghttp://www.iinet.net.au/~mainpeak/flyrod.htmlThe Australian connection A computer without windows is like a fish without a bicycle /***********************************************************************/ /***********************************************************************/Tony Younghttp://www.iinet.net.au/~mainpeak/flyrod.htmlThe Australian connection A computer without windows is like a fish without a bicycle /***********************************************************************/ Onis,you were MAKING snake guides? how? i'm so impressed, frompaperclipsor what?jean aka "ratchet the beginner" from bacon@idt.net Sat Oct 17 20:31:58 1998 Subject: Re: Para 15 taper Max Satoh wrote: Gentlemen, I'm terribly sorry posting wrong calculation of inch vs mm. Yes, it isright 0.008inch is 0.2032mm.Probably I miss typed as 0.08. I am bowing hundred times.Thanks for a lot of reply. Art, Hank and Larry. Sorry Dean for this. Max--Max Satohan Oriental Bamboo Fly Rod Crafteremail:maxs@geocities.co.jpHome Page:http://members.tripod.com/~maxrod/index.htmlmax,gentlemen and LADIES TOO! please, thank you...jean from bacon@idt.net Sat Oct 17 20:51:15 1998 Subject: Re: Bamboo Only Guide Service Survey andrew_harsanyi@ibi.com wrote: ..there is also an Art Weiler in Bound Brook NJ that has classes. Youessentially end up with a finished rod when you're done (though I don'tthinkthe class is cheap, it is one night a week for a few months and soundsprettygood). Since I am near him I considered it, but decided to do it on my owninstead, in close collaboration with a friend of mine (he's actuallyalways astep ahead of me and seems to have a knack for this stuff). Weiler alsoattendsthe flyfishing show (either Raritan or Somerset) each January so you cansee/cast his stuff and judge his abilities for yourself. Lon Blauvelt hasalsobeen to one of these shows (I don;t remember which) and he has stufflikeplaning forms, etc. that you can check out...Andy ______________________________ Reply Separator_________________________________Subject: Re: Bamboo Only Guide Service SurveyAuthor: at TcpgateDate: 10/15/98 11:21 PM john channer wrote: At 10:13 PM 10/13/98 -0700, you wrote:TSmithwick@aol.com wrote: In a message dated 10/13/98 7:25:27 AM, you wrote: don't have a good how-to-book. have only built two graphite rods(three piece 7, and two piece 9) i loved it! did you get the albies FROMthe beach, if so, i'm mightily impressed...i was on a boat with a guideand we were in schools of albies which were lovely...the wrist isprettywimpy though, have started wimp wrist weights for women (akawwww), buti DID haul them in with a lot of yelling from the gestapo guide. irefused to quit. on a spey rod?!, that's so cool. any info on a simplehow-to book would be appreciated (please not too expensive), i have tosave up for the next fishing trip.thanks,jeanps: the psychological pain of not being perfect when you turn out a rodcan be devastating, don't you agree? Jean;The best how-to book for the money is The Lovely Reed by Jack Howell(myappology's to Wayne). You can order it from Amazon.com for about$35.00.Wayne Cattanach's book, Handcrafting Bamboo Fly Rods is already aclassic,plus it has a disk included for designing rod tapers and guide spacing,butit is about $15-$20.00 more money. A Master's Guide to BuildingBamboo FlyRods, by Hoagy Carmichel and Everett Garrison is THE classic, but at$75.00will really dig a hole in your pocket. You mentioned before that youwereinterested in taking a class, George Maurer gives rodmaking classesregularly. He is in Shoemaker, Pa. 610-562-8595. I think that the bestwayto start would be to read the rodmaking FAQ's by Bruce Connor and TomPenrose that you can get to thru the Rodmaker's webpage. John Channerdear john,(i just hate writing these dear john letters) your concise info onthis subject is wonderful, thank you very, very muchly...am still in theprocess of filtering out so much, but am enthusiastic and excited aboutbuilding a rod for my obstreperous (sp?) sister who lives in colorado. ithink i will contact mr. shoemaker, as i have a cabin in NEpennsylvania..(don't know how close that is to him).thanks again,jeanandy,thanks for the art weiler info, that is much closer to my realworkadayhome.. will check it out..have been to the flyfishing shows for the lastcoupla years, but was only building graphite rods at the time, will nowlook up mr. weiler.. thanks again,jean from bacon@idt.net Sat Oct 17 20:59:27 1998 Subject: Re: P.U.I. onis,i CHRISTOPHER C MCDOWELL wrote: I enjoyed reading it. The local homebrew supply here sellsreconditioned=5 gal. soft drink kegs. Mine are empty right now. Darn, I need to getcaught up on this building long enough to make a batch. Planing wouldbemore fun if I didn't have to work with a dry throat. Redgards,Onis Be careful Onis, you could be cited on a PUI (Planing under influence ofanintoxicating beverage). The bamboo police may drop by and run youthroughthe following sobriety tests. You'll need to plane in a straight line with no wobbling of the plane iron. Then recite all of the famous rodmakers by name in reverse alphabeticalorder. Finally, you must look up, arms extended and touch the tip of your nosewith a wobbly tip strip. If you fail, your planing license may be suspended. Be careful!! Chris onis,i will also check your blood for B.U.I.,nurse ratchet from bacon@idt.net Sat Oct 17 21:04:27 1998 Subject: Re: Hook-keeper rings hHarry Boyd wrote: Mike Biondo wrote: Can anyone think of a reason not to use sterling silver wire as opposedtonickle silver wire for hook-keeper rings. >snipped Mike,I'm afraid I'm ignorant in this case, as in many others. But you got mewondering - How many of us use hook-keepers? Didn't Garrison decidenot toinclude them on his rods? I know I've decided not to use them on myrods,because I fish 9-15 foot leaders on 6-8 foot rods. Using a hook-keeperallowsthe line to leader connection to go beyond the tip-top. I'm clumsy enoughthatI try to never let anything that dangerous to a delicate little tip happenonpurpose.Harryharry,hook keepers are just not cool, that's what i learned, truth or dare?jean from briansr@point-net.com Sun Oct 18 06:02:10 1998 0000 Subject: Barry Kustin Hello list??? Does anyone know the current wereabouts of Barry KustinThanking in advance Brian Sturrock from fquinchat@locl.net Sun Oct 18 07:31:54 1998 (8.9.0/8.7.3) with ESMTP id HAA10175 for ;Sun, 18 Oct Subject: Re: Hook-keeper rings Where can you buy sterling silver wire? Dennis ----------From: TSmithwick@aol.com Subject: Re: Hook-keeper ringsDate: Friday, October 16, 1998 5:42 PM In a message dated 10/16/98 8:42:41 PM, you wrote: nickle silver???>> Mike - I think the answer is yes in both cases, but the difference isprobablynot enough to worry about in the application. I would try it. Use adiameterwire large enough to hold it's shape when the fly tugs against it. from sjstill@iquest.net Sun Oct 18 08:31:25 1998 0000 (209.43.47.90) Subject: test - again Did not get any Rodmaker's mail Saturday! Is this getting thru? I triedun- subbing then re-subbing, but never even got a msg from the listserv!Oh well, life *might* go on Steve from stpete@netten.net Sun Oct 18 09:35:22 1998 cedar.netten.net (8.8.8/8.6.12) with SMTP id JAA01051 for Subject: Test - do not read Test from djfinch@sprintmail.com Sun Oct 18 09:41:11 1998 HAA16642 Subject: ignore test test 123.. from swilson1@WHC.NET Sun Oct 18 10:54:17 1998 ; Subject: test test from gwbarnes@gwi.net Sun Oct 18 12:39:42 1998 Subject: In Need of Help! A friend has asked what weight line should be used with a True TemperNo. C10-9'Senoa (pardon the expression) steel fly rod. I haven't a clue! from FlyTyr@southshore.com Sun Oct 18 13:02:59 1998 natco.southshore.com (8.8.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id NAA23014 for; Sun, 18 Oct 1998 13:03:10 -0500 Subject: Montague Rod I have been offered a Montague Sunbeam 3 pc. two tip rod. The finish isin very good condition so are the guides and wraps. They appear to beoriginal. The decal is intact and very little warping in the tips. Thetips appear to be different, one seems to be stiffer that the other.Both male ferrules are cracked almost the full length though it does notseem the rod has been used much. The cork grip is in very good condition. There is no tube or bag.I want to make him a fair offer on the rod.Any comments would be appreciated OFF LIST unless you feel it wouldbenefit the list.Thanks,Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com from sjstill@iquest.net Sun Oct 18 16:00:51 1998 0000 (209.43.48.150) Subject: Anyone out there? Hi All, Say, could someone shoot me an e-mail off the list. I wonder if this isevengetting out! Steve from fbcwin@fsbnet.com Sun Oct 18 17:22:42 1998 0500 Subject: Leonard 50 DF taper F1103AE9A1561F46E4A87CA8" This is a multi-part message in MIME format.-------------- F1103AE9A1561F46E4A87CA8 Friends,Do any of you have a taper for a Leonard 50 DF? Severalyears ago I had one, and it was one of the nicer castingrods I've felt. I let the rod get away from me, in a deal Istill regret, before I started building rods. I never didmeasure the taper.Now I'd like to build a rod or two on that taper, and ofcourse, don't have it. I do have the taper for a Leonard50, but it is a 6 weight. That's not the same as the 50 DFI don't think. Mine was a 3 piece 5 weight, not a 6weight.Any kindness you might extend would be most appreciated. Thank you,Harry Boyd --------------F1103AE9A1561F46E4A87CA8 begin: vcardfn: Harry Boydn: Boyd;Harryorg: First Baptist Churchemail;internet: fbcwin@fsbnet.comtitle: Pastor version: 2.1end: vcard --------------F1103AE9A1561F46E4A87CA8-- from djfinch@sprintmail.com Sun Oct 18 17:32:39 1998 Subject: list Hello !,My name is Greg Finch and I think I got bumped off the list, Ihave unsubscribed and subscribed twice.I have got nothing from the listsince friday afternoon ? Can you help ? thanks in advance.Regards GregFinch. from maxs@geocities.co.jp Sun Oct 18 19:01:03 1998 geocities.co.jp (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA04695 for; Mon, 19 Oct 1998 09:00:58 +0900 (JST) Subject: No post message arrives Hello list, Suddenly I had received no message from last Saturday. Is anythingwrong there?Unsubscribe/Subscribe trial also responses me no answer yet. If something is happening there, please someone advise me. Thanks, Max -- Max Satohan Oriental Bamboo Fly Rod Crafteremail:maxs@geocities.co.jpHome Page:http://members.tripod.com/~maxrod/index.html from bobbo@buffnet.net Sun Oct 18 19:07:24 1998 bybuffnet4.buffnet.net (8.8.7/8.7.3) with SMTP id UAA05822 for buffnet9.buffnet.net viasmap (V2.0) Subject: list did anyone get sunday pm mail, or did i get bumped off the list?thanks,bob from jourdoktorn@pilot.stjarntv.se Sun Oct 18 19:08:52 1998 with ESMTP id AAA5EE6 for ;Mon, 19 Oct 1998 02:03:23 +0200 Subject: No Contact! Dear fellow rodmakers, I do not know what has happened. Suddenly I received no mail from the list. I did as was suggested earlier to a fellow whoexperienced the same thing, I signed off and then 10 minutes latersubscribed again - BUT NOTHING HAPPENED! I still get no mail andnot even the welcome message! Is there trouble with the listserver? If so please write to me on my private e- mail:jourdoktorn@pilot.stjarntv.se Best,Jan Nystrom, Sweden from dpeaston@wzrd.com Sun Oct 18 19:29:53 1998 mail.wzrd.com(8.9.1/8.7.3) with SMTP id UAA06864 for ;Sun, 18 Oct remove____________(____________|===========================o/ 0 \ / | \__/ \ / Douglas Easton | \ / |\____/ Dpeaston@wzrd.com | |* from satoh@bmc.co.jp Sun Oct 18 21:59:12 1998 (8.6.12+2.5Wb7/3.4Wbeta6-96052715) with SMTP id MAA01286 for; Mon, 19 Oct 1998 12:01:43 +0900 Subject: boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0007_01BDFB57.EB2F15E0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0007_01BDFB57.EB2F15E0 Subscribe Rodmakers Max Satoh ------=_NextPart_000_0007_01BDFB57.EB2F15E0 SubscribeRodmakers = Satoh ------=_NextPart_000_0007_01BDFB57.EB2F15E0-- from gc.williams@MCIONE.com Mon Oct 19 03:16:04 1998 with ESMTP id forrodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu; Mon, 19 Oct 1998 08:15:32 +0000 (GMT) Subject: Test Guess I got kicked off. Just testing. from AHanzich@NA2.US.ML.com Mon Oct 19 08:06:25 1998 JAA01413 Subject: RE: Hook-keeper rings Hope my ignorance doesn't show too much with this question, I varnishrodswith a brush, several times I see "HAND RUBBED VARNISH"! Please help tounderstand how this is accomplished! Thanks. Al Hanzich732-878-6567 -----Original Message----- Sent: Saturday, October 17, 1998 1:36 AM Subject: Re: Hook-keeper rings Well, the popular concenus seems to be that I can usesterling silverwithout any problem (except maybe some tarnish over thewinter)...wow, myrods will have sterling silver fittings!!! Okay, okay soit's just onelittle ring, but hey... :-) Steve asks where I found the wire. I found both nicklesilver wire andsterling silver wire at places that sell beads. I hadpicked up a wholespool of 26 gauge NS wire for about $3.00, but it turned outto be a tadtoo small. After the ring was soldered it held it's shapealright, but Ithought it would look better with a little thicker ring.Went back to thestore looking for 22 gauge which they didn't have, butsuggested I try thesterling wire. Thanks for all the input guys... Mike- from harry37@epix.net Mon Oct 19 08:47:49 1998 SMTP idJAA04162 Subject: Re: Hook-keeper rings Steve wrote: Mike, What is your source for the sterling silver wire? Regards, SteveIndependence, MO Steve, When my father used to make jewelry , he used what he called "findings",which were silver wire rings that could be silver soldered if needed. He got them from jewelry making catalogs--sorry I can't identify asource. If you're looking for a sterling silver hookkeeper, Anglers Workshop hasone that's a ring and pin that you put a drop of super glue on the tipof the pin and push into the cork. I found it worked better if the holewas started before the glue. Personally, I agree with Harry, since theleaders I use with any rod are always longer the rod, and I never put ahookkeeper on the rod near the handle, but rather, I wrap the leaderaround the reel spool, and put the hook through an upper guide. Thisraises a question, though-- Has anyone ever placed a hookkeeper on the upper section, along the sideof the rod, away from the casting plane, to permit wrapping the leaderaround the reel as I described? I don't think another wrap outside ofthe casting plane would afect the action, but I've never done it. Thoughts, anyone? from k5vkq@ix.netcom.com Mon Oct 19 09:23:24 1998 09:22:49 ix16.ix.netcom.comvia smap (V1.3) Subject: Is anyone out there? Is anyone out there? Either the listserver is down or my ISP's link isdown. I have received no Rodmakers email for the last two days and thelistserver doesn't respond to the unsubscribe/subscribe messages. I hadthe reverse last winter; the listserver sent me mail but wouldn't acceptmine! Please respond off list. I am not receiving the list. Thanks. Regards,Onisk5vkq@ix.netcom.com from mcdowellc@lanecc.edu Mon Oct 19 10:23:25 1998 via smap(4.1) Subject: Test, Don't Read xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx from fbcwin@fsbnet.com Mon Oct 19 10:38:57 1998 0500 Subject: Leonard 50 DF taper 60836463EDB5EF1B69E8CC2B" This is a multi-part message in MIME format.-------------- 60836463EDB5EF1B69E8CC2B ---Second try at this one ---Friends,Do any of you have a taper for a Leonard 50 DF? Severalyears ago I had one, and it was one of the nicer castingrods I've felt. I let the rod get away from me, in a deal Istill regret, before I started building rods. I never didmeasure the taper.Now I'd like to build a rod or two on that taper, and ofcourse, don't have it. I do have the taper for a Leonard50, but it is a 6 weight. That's not the same as the 50 DFI don't think. Mine was a 3 piece 5 weight, not a 6weight.Any kindness you might extend would be most appreciated. Thank you,Harry Boyd--------------60836463EDB5EF1B69E8CC2B begin: vcardfn: Harry Boydn: Boyd;Harryorg: First Baptist Churchemail;internet: fbcwin@fsbnet.comtitle: Pastor version: 2.1end: vcard --------------60836463EDB5EF1B69E8CC2B-- from DBURRILL@TELEHUB.com Mon Oct 19 11:03:10 1998 Subject: RE: Para 15 taper... boundary="---- =_NextPart_001_01BDFB79.E11811DC" This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does notunderstandthis format, some or all of this message may not be legible. ------ =_NextPart_001_01BDFB79.E11811DC 5 or 6 depending on who you ask. -----Original Message-----From: Larry Russett [SMTP:russettrods@hotmail.com]Sent: Saturday, October 17, 1998 6:58 AM Subject: RE: Para 15 taper... I have one question re this Para15 taper. What line weight isthis for? Larry Russett 0= .078(actual)5= .09810=.12515=.12520=.14025=.16330=.18835=.19440=.20545=.229just above ferrule=.23750=.246(taken below wrap on butt ferrule @ 50 1/2")maybe .245 @50"55=.26060=.26665=.27370=.27975=.29280=.29785=.30086 1/2"=.300(just above hook keeper wrap)90=.300(assumed)95=.300 "96=.300 " Tapers for second tip with 4 1/2 64ths tip top 0= .070(actual)5= .08710=.12015=.12820=.14025=.16430=.18435=.19340=.20745=.22646 3/4"=.235 just above the ferrule which is 15/64Super Zeeoxidised. Para 15 guide spacing Butt section from top of ferrule. Two snakes and onemediumPerfectionstripper(med) bright 5 1/2" 14 1/2" 23 3/8" Tip sections from top of tip top. Six bright chromesnakes. 5 1/8" 11 1/8" 18 1/8" 26 1/16" 35 1/4" 44 1/4" The thread is a dark red and it has the spiral up onthe ferruleside. These tapers were taken over varnish, so I would allowat least.008. The cork grip is a fairly narrow reverse cigar thattapers fromthe reel seatup towards the front with a thuimb depression on top.This corkgrip is 6 1/8" long. ______________________________________________________Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------ =_NextPart_001_01BDFB79.E11811DC RE: Para 15 taper... 5 or 6 depending on who you =ask. -----Original=Message----- =[SMTP:russettrods@hotmail.com] Saturday, October 17, 1998 6:58 AM RE: Para 15 taper... I have onequestion = for? LarryRussett =ferrule @ 50 1/2") maybe .245 @ hook =keeper wrap) " " 64ths tip top =ferrule which is 15/64 Super Zee Two snakes and one medium the spiral up on the ferrule varnish, so I would allow at least reverse cigar that tapers from cork 1/8" long. ______________________________________________________Get YourPrivate, =Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------ =_NextPart_001_01BDFB79.E11811DC-- from gwr@seanet.com Mon Oct 19 11:11:43 1998 mx.seanet.com(8.8.8/Seanet-8.7.3) with SMTP id JAA14538 for; Mon, Subject: Re: Golden Trout boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000E_01BDFB40.ED9E5FA0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000E_01BDFB40.ED9E5FA0 boundary="----=_NextPart_001_000F_01BDFB40.ED9E5FA0" ------=_NextPart_001_000F_01BDFB40.ED9E5FA0 Hi Joe, I believe they call them "palominos." Back in PA they are visible = Russ Golden Witch Rods - "Tools For Natural Philosophy"Golden Witch Technologies, Inc. - "The Golden Age Is Now"gwr@seanet.comhttp://www.goldenwitch.com -----Original Message-----From: Joseph S.Kallo Date: Monday, October 19, 1998 9:05 AMSubject: Golden Trout Hey guys,Okay, this is probably a bit off-topic, so you can reply off-list. =Somemention was made a week or two ago about fishing for golden trout. =Thismorning I was fishing the newly stocked Devil's Kitchen lake here is =s.Illinois and caught a number really bizzare looking 'bows. They =were, I kidyou not, bannana yellow. I was told that they were the product of =geneticmanipulation and were stocked with the more normal ones to help =fishermanlocate fish. Hmmmm. So are these the golden trout that were spoken =of? They Joe Joseph S. KalloDpt. of PhilosophySouthern Illinois University at Carbondale ------=_NextPart_001_000F_01BDFB40.ED9E5FA0 Hi Joe, in = visible in a lot of the streams on the few days before the season = Russ = "Tools For Natural Philosophy"Golden Witch -----Original = rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= <rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= TroutHey guys,Okay, this is probably a off-topic, so you can reply off-list. Somemention was made a = ago about fishing for golden trout. Thismorning I was fishing = stocked Devil's Kitchen lake here is s.Illinois and caught a = really bizzare looking 'bows. They were, I kidyou not, bannana = was told that they were the product of geneticmanipulation and = stocked with the more normal ones to help fishermanlocate fish. = So are these the golden trout that were spoken of? Theywere = really odd. JoeJoseph S. KalloDpt. = Carbondale ------=_NextPart_001_000F_01BDFB40.ED9E5FA0-- ------=_NextPart_000_000E_01BDFB40.ED9E5FA0 name="Golden Witch.vcf" filename="Golden Witch.vcf" BEGIN:VCARDN:Gooding;John;R.FN:Golden WitchORG:Golden WitchTITLE:Rod Maker &c.TEL;WORK;VOICE:(425) 787- 6599TEL;PAGER;VOICE:noneTEL;WORK;FAX:noneADR;WORK;ENCODING=3DQUOTED-PRINTABLE:;;16829 6th Ave. =West=3D0D=3D0ASuite #2B=3D0D=3D0A;Lynnwood;WA;98037;USALABEL;WORK;ENCODING=3DQUOTED-PRINTABLE:16829 6th Ave. =West=3D0D=3D0ASuite #2B=3D0D=3D0A=3D0D=3D0ALynnwood, WA =98037=3D0D=3D0AUSAURL:noneURL:http://www.goldenwitch.comEMAIL;PREF;INTERNET:gwr@seanet.comEND:VCARD ------=_NextPart_000_000E_01BDFB40.ED9E5FA0-- from richard.nantel@videotron.ca Mon Oct 19 11:23:36 1998 (modemcable31.174.mmtl.videotron.net) sims.3.5.1998.07.14.10.43)with SMTP id for Subject: RE: Golden Trout We've genetically altered fish to make them easier to spot? I think ourracehas gone mad. Richard -----Original Message----- Subject: Golden Trout Hey guys,Okay, this is probably a bit off-topic, so you can reply off-list. Somemention was made a week or two ago about fishing for golden trout. Thismorning I was fishing the newly stocked Devil's Kitchen lake here is s.Illinois and caught a number really bizzare looking 'bows. They were, I kidyou not, bannana yellow. I was told that they were the product of geneticmanipulation and were stocked with the more normal ones to helpfishermanlocate fish. Hmmmm. So are these the golden trout that were spoken of?Theywere really, really odd. Joe Joseph S. KalloDpt. of PhilosophySouthern Illinois University at Carbondale from fbcwin@fsbnet.com Mon Oct 19 11:33:20 1998 0500 Subject: Leonard 50 DF taper D211313AB1FB73932A979430" This is a multi-part message in MIME format.-------------- D211313AB1FB73932A979430 ---This is try number three --- itf they all show up whenthe list comes back up, I sincerely apologize!! Friends,Do any of you have a taper for a Leonard 50 DF? Severalyears ago I had one, and it was one of the nicer castingrods I've felt. I let the rod get away from me, in a deal Istill regret, before I started building rods. I never didmeasure the taper.Now I'd like to build a rod or two on that taper, and ofcourse, don't have it. I do have the taper for a Leonard50, but it is a 6 weight. That's not the same as the 50 DFI don't think. Mine was a 3 piece 5 weight, not a 6 weight.Any kindness you might extend would be most appreciated. Thank you,Harry Boyd--------------D211313AB1FB73932A979430 begin: vcardfn: Harry Boydn: Boyd;Harryorg: First Baptist Churchemail;internet: fbcwin@fsbnet.comtitle: Pastor version: 2.1end: vcard --------------D211313AB1FB73932A979430-- from teekay35@interlynx.net Mon Oct 19 11:58:19 1998 Subject: Re: Is the list inactive I haven't got any messages for several days. Have "unsubscribed" and then"subscribed" and hope this corrects the problem. ----------From: RVenneri@aol.com Subject: Re: Is the list inactiveDate: Saturday, October 17, 1998 11:02 AM This has also worked for me too. Bob V from ljrp@penn.com Mon Oct 19 13:11:07 1998 Subject: Re: Golden Trout probably "palomino" trout as strocked by the Penna Fish Commission?? Joseph S.Kallo wrote: Hey guys,Okay, this is probably a bit off-topic, so you can reply off- list.Somemention was made a week or two ago about fishing for golden trout. Thismorning I was fishing the newly stocked Devil's Kitchen lake here is s.Illinois and caught a number really bizzare looking 'bows. They were, Ikidyou not, bannana yellow. I was told that they were the product of geneticmanipulation and were stocked with the more normal ones to helpfishermanlocate fish. Hmmmm. So are these the golden trout that were spoken of?Theywere really, really odd. Joe Joseph S. KalloDpt. of PhilosophySouthern Illinois University at Carbondale from ljrp@penn.com Mon Oct 19 13:14:43 1998 Subject: Re: RODMAKERS Adminstrativia In regard to the routine postings........when I post no matter what I post itcomes back to me and goes to all on the site.........might be better if it wereeasier to post only to the sender (top line (From) or to all.......can this beprogramed........I think this would help with the irritation of the excesspostings......... Mike Biondo wrote: Hello Friends... I have a few IMPORTANT announcements affecting us all on theRODMAKERS list. #1 ... We now have another RODMAKERS Listguy!!! Long time listmember,Jerry Ballard (ballard@zen.wes.army.mil) has most graciously acceptedmyplea for help. (For you longtime members, Jerry was the one who createdTAPERMAIL, the original email version of Wayne's HEXROD.) So everyoneplease welcome Jerry as our new Listguy-in-Training, and go easy onhim, atleast for a few days! ;-) #2 ... The RODMAKERS Guidelines document and Welcome message is nowcomplete! I will be forever thankful to the Reverend Doctor Harry Boyd(fbcwin@fsbnet.com) for his help and patience in generating thesedocuments. The WELCOME message will be automatically distributed toeachperson as they subscribe to the list. The INFO file is an expanded versionof the WELCOME message, and will be sent in response to the LISTPROCcommand: INFO RODMAKERS. The WELCOME message also outlines how toobtainthis file. I will include the WELCOME message at the end of this. PLEASE, please,everyone, take a moment to read through the attached WELCOME message,andto download the INFO file. Read them through, we are genuinely interestinyour thoughts on these documents. Also if you have any suggestions,pleaseforward them to myself, or Harry. Once again, join me in extending my thanks to both Jerry and Harry... Mike BiondoRODMAKERS Listguy~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~WELCOME message~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~Welcome to RODMAKERS!!! The list's main emphasis is Bamboo Rodmaking, Restoring, andCollecting.!!!! PLEASE SAVE THIS MESSAGE!!!You will doubtlessly find occasion to refer to it later. To send mail to the list use the following email address:RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu The maintainers of the list are:Mike Biondo michael@wugate.wustl.eduJerry Ballard ballard@zen.wes.army.mil In addition to this note, there are two additional documents you shouldknow about. An INFO/FAQ file answers many questions about how you canmaximize the benefits of the list, and details what is expected of youas a list member. The other document is a HELP file describing usefulmail server commands to customize your subscription settings. Pleasetake a moment to download and read these files. You as listmembers areresponsible for their familiarity. LISTPROC@mail.wustl.edu Leave subject line blank, and in the body of the message, type:INFO RODMAKERSHELP If there is anything you do not understand, please feel free to contactone of the list maintainers. The RODMAKERS list began in 1994 with a handful of friends interestedinregularly communicating with each other on the subject of rodmaking,andhas grown to over 500 makers and lovers of bamboo rods, from worldrenownedexperts to complete beginners. People from all over our world find thisavaluable resource. Jerry Foster maintains a complete archive of the list at:http://home1.gte.net/jfoster/index.htm Every post and response to the list since records were kept is storedthere for our use. Extensive lists of resources, tapers, and suppliersof rodmaking goodies are catalogued there as well. Questions can oftenmore quickly be answered by referring to the web page, than posting aquestion to the list. Please take advantage of this resource. To help the list serve your needs best, please: A. Feel free to ask questions, and more importantly, if someone asks aquestion about which you have information, give freely and willinglyof the what you have to offer. "There are no stupid questions exceptthose which remain unasked." B. When replying to a question or statement posted to the list, pleaseinclude only enough of the original message to indicate the context ofyour response. If you simply reply to the entire post, reading throughthe responses gets tedious and clutters the archives with repeatinformation. C. This is a good-natured list. Strong language, spam, and flaming arenot welcome. Repeat offenders will be removed from the list. D. Try to keep your posts relevant to the subject of rodmaking. We allwander from time to time, please keep it to a minimum. E. Remember to keep commercial activities as private as possible. Most,if not all, business transactions are more appropriately handled throughprivate email, or through a phone call. If you have any question aboutthe appropriateness of a post by which you might profit, please referto that section of the INFO file, or contact the list owner forclarification. F. Finally, remember this Listserver operates on the honor system withrespect to all these guidelines, so please respect them, enjoy theconversations, and catch a few fish! Again, welcome to RODMAKERS, andenjoy! from sshorb@ozip.net Mon Oct 19 13:36:53 1998 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.2 release 221 ID# 0-55785U1000L100S0V35)with ESMTP id net for ;Mon, 19 Oct 1998 13:36:21 -0500 Subject: Re: Hello again and some questions. Fernando Rada; You may already have this, Miller Stephenson Chemical have a web page;URL is: http://www.militaryspecifications.com/. They have offices allover the world. Skip from Anachemrpo@aol.com Mon Oct 19 14:02:44 1998 Subject: Check split question Hello listers, I have a new culm (my first 12 footer (thanks Richard!) and un-check- split,)to put a check split in.All the books say to start at the butt end for one's splits. The culm has a couple of 6 inch splits already started at the tip end. Isthere a compelling reason to NOT take advantage of one of this tip- endsplitsas the starting place for my check split, and split toward the butt? Thanks In Advance, Russ Lavigne from ljrp@penn.com Mon Oct 19 14:21:27 1998 Subject: Re: RODMAKERS Adminstrativia Went to a NFLCC meet in Allentown Pa.........Short bamboo prices HeddonsGrangersetc are going through the roof........Great Show and great tackle 300tables?? Mike Biondo wrote: Hello Friends... I have a few IMPORTANT announcements affecting us all on theRODMAKERS list. #1 ... We now have another RODMAKERS Listguy!!! Long time listmember,Jerry Ballard (ballard@zen.wes.army.mil) has most graciously acceptedmyplea for help. (For you longtime members, Jerry was the one who createdTAPERMAIL, the original email version of Wayne's HEXROD.) So everyoneplease welcome Jerry as our new Listguy-in-Training, and go easy onhim, atleast for a few days! ;-) #2 ... The RODMAKERS Guidelines document and Welcome message is nowcomplete! I will be forever thankful to the Reverend Doctor Harry Boyd(fbcwin@fsbnet.com) for his help and patience in generating thesedocuments. The WELCOME message will be automatically distributed toeachperson as they subscribe to the list. The INFO file is an expanded versionof the WELCOME message, and will be sent in response to the LISTPROCcommand: INFO RODMAKERS. The WELCOME message also outlines how toobtainthis file. I will include the WELCOME message at the end of this. PLEASE, please,everyone, take a moment to read through the attached WELCOME message,andto download the INFO file. Read them through, we are genuinely interestinyour thoughts on these documents. Also if you have any suggestions,pleaseforward them to myself, or Harry. Once again, join me in extending my thanks to both Jerry and Harry... Mike BiondoRODMAKERS Listguy~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~WELCOME message~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~Welcome to RODMAKERS!!! The list's main emphasis is Bamboo Rodmaking, Restoring, andCollecting.!!!! PLEASE SAVE THIS MESSAGE!!!You will doubtlessly find occasion to refer to it later. To send mail to the list use the following email address:RODMAKERS@mail.wustl.edu The maintainers of the list are:Mike Biondo michael@wugate.wustl.eduJerry Ballard ballard@zen.wes.army.mil In addition to this note, there are two additional documents you shouldknow about. An INFO/FAQ file answers many questions about how you canmaximize the benefits of the list, and details what is expected of youas a list member. The other document is a HELP file describing usefulmail server commands to customize your subscription settings. Pleasetake a moment to download and read these files. You as listmembers areresponsible for their familiarity. LISTPROC@mail.wustl.edu Leave subject line blank, and in the body of the message, type:INFO RODMAKERSHELP If there is anything you do not understand, please feel free to contactone of the list maintainers. The RODMAKERS list began in 1994 with a handful of friends interestedinregularly communicating with each other on the subject of rodmaking,andhas grown to over 500 makers and lovers of bamboo rods, from worldrenownedexperts to complete beginners. People from all over our world find thisavaluable resource. Jerry Foster maintains a complete archive of the list at:http://home1.gte.net/jfoster/index.htm Every post and response to the list since records were kept is storedthere for our use. Extensive lists of resources, tapers, and suppliersof rodmaking goodies are catalogued there as well. Questions can oftenmore quickly be answered by referring to the web page, than posting aquestion to the list. Please take advantage of this resource. To help the list serve your needs best, please: A. Feel free to ask questions, and more importantly, if someone asks aquestion about which you have information, give freely and willinglyof the what you have to offer. "There are no stupid questions exceptthose which remain unasked." B. When replying to a question or statement posted to the list, pleaseinclude only enough of the original message to indicate the context ofyour response. If you simply reply to the entire post, reading throughthe responses gets tedious and clutters the archives with repeatinformation. C. This is a good-natured list. Strong language, spam, and flaming arenot welcome. Repeat offenders will be removed from the list. D. Try to keep your posts relevant to the subject of rodmaking. We allwander from time to time, please keep it to a minimum. E. Remember to keep commercial activities as private as possible. Most,if not all, business transactions are more appropriately handled throughprivate email, or through a phone call. If you have any question aboutthe appropriateness of a post by which you might profit, please referto that section of the INFO file, or contact the list owner forclarification. F. Finally, remember this Listserver operates on the honor system withrespect to all these guidelines, so please respect them, enjoy theconversations, and catch a few fish! Again, welcome to RODMAKERS, andenjoy! from Anachemrpo@aol.com Mon Oct 19 14:34:20 1998 Subject: Re: Golden Trout Yes they are. I believe they are also referred to as Palamino trout at thehatchery. But... I don't think the Palaminos are what they were talking about. Being fromtheeast I'm not sure, but I believe OutWest they have a critter that is wild (orwhat passes for wild) that is called a Golden trout. Russ L. from saltwein@swbell.net Mon Oct 19 14:34:28 1998 gw3adm.rcsntx.swbell.net OAA21642 Subject: Splitting Hello All, I have been experimenting with splitting after the trip to Arkansas forSRG. I had been doing my splitting with a blade clamped in my workvise, and having fair success forcing the bamboo to compress in thedirection the split needed to go. In Arkansas Mr. Vorstad volunteered to split a piece of cane that was onhand. He used essentially the same technique, except that he compressedthe side the split needed to travel to by grabbing the cane on the offor split side of the knife and pulling it back. This technique is sogood because you can easily control the amount of deflection that isrequired. When I got home I pulled down the last of three pieces of cane that Ihad acquired two years ago. It was smallish, green with growers marksand scorches from being straightened. Almost every flaw known, what isa normal first order of three pieces, I suppose. The cane was split in halves already, so I startedsplitting-halves-halves- halves and halves. I had my end nippers out assomeone mentioned that Darryl Hayashida used them to start his splits. Upon rereading his technique I found that he used them to split the nodesections when he went for 32nds. In Arkansas Mr. Vorstad started hissplits by forcing the cane onto the knife with the heel of his hand, soI used this method. I did use the nippers though, I had used a pair of pliers to remove whatI could of the nodal dam the rest was removed with end nippers when thestrips where in 16ths. They worked like a charm! I now have 64 pieces of evenly split kindling! It was well worth thetime and effort for the experience. The only innovation that I might add to the process outside of thenippers is that I use a compass to measure the cane for the split toquarters. Set it a little bit under the center mark of the cane andmake a scribe line at the node from each side of the cane. Place I linein the center of each pair and connect the dots. Regards, SteveIndependence, Mo from FlyTyr@southshore.com Mon Oct 19 16:13:49 1998 natco.southshore.com (8.8.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id PAA03344 for; Mon, 19 Oct 1998 15:15:04 -0500 Subject: Re: Montague Rod I have been offered a Montague Sunbeam 3 pc. two tip rod. The finish isin very good condition so are the guides and wraps. They appear to beoriginal. The decal is intact and very little warping in the tips. Thetips appear to be different, one seems to be stiffer that the other.Both male ferrules are cracked almost the full length though it does notseem the rod has been used much. The cork grip is in very good condition. There is no tube or bag.I want to make him a fair offer on the rod.Any comments would be appreciated OFF LIST unless you feel it wouldbenefit the list.Thanks,Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com from anglport@con2.com Mon Oct 19 16:35:32 1998 Subject: Re: Is the list inactive All,Are we still having problems? Is St Louis in a disaster zone? Was gibts?Art from maxs@geocities.co.jp Mon Oct 19 17:25:48 1998 HAA12643 (JST) Subject: Re: Para 15 taper... Larry, Para 15 is 8' #6 wts. Max Have built a number of Garrison 8' 6 wts. and some Young Para 15 8' 6wts.Don -- Max Satohan Oriental Bamboo Fly Rod Crafteremail:maxs@geocities.co.jpHome Page:http://members.tripod.com/~maxrod/index.html from maxs@geocities.co.jp Mon Oct 19 17:53:12 1998 HAA03326 (JST) Subject: Re: Hello again and some questions. Fernando Rada Briega wrote: 1. We are running out of glue and I would like to try an Epoxy.Unfortunately we normally need to straighten the glued blank, so Iwouldlike some advice about heat resistance to choose between Shell Epon vsNyatexEpoxy. Welcome back. Handcrafting Bamboo Fly Rod of Wayne has a page (p.89) referring to theheat curing of epoxy glue as;"The unique thing that he was doing with the epoxy glue was heat curingit at 300 degrees. At that temperature the glue was cured in twominutes, yet the glue could set in the application pot for four to sixhours at room temperature." And he recommends to use NyatexEpoxy(10E007/10EH008).I have no information about Shell Epon. As for straightening method, look into my web page. There is an easystraightening procedure where I am using a kind of resin/hardener mixglue called Uloid or Uroid (might be Japanese word). So far, I have hadno problem caused by the heat of "thermal cane straightening hand set"(clothes iron). Hope this help. Max-- Max Satohan Oriental Bamboo Fly Rod Crafteremail:maxs@geocities.co.jpHome Page:http://members.tripod.com/~maxrod/index.html from dpeaston@wzrd.com Mon Oct 19 17:56:13 1998 mail.wzrd.com(8.9.1/8.7.3) with SMTP id SAA08819 for ;Mon, 19 Oct Subject: Re: Is the list inactive At 03:22 PM 10/17/98 EDT, you wrote:Test works for me.____________(____________|===========================o/ 0 \ / | \__/ \ / Douglas Easton | \ / |\____/ Dpeaston@wzrd.com | |* from gjflyfsh@juno.com Mon Oct 19 19:32:19 1998 20:32:05 EDT Subject: Test -Delete ___________________________________________________________________You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e- mail.Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.comor call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654- 5866] from bdcreek@grand-rapids.crosswinds.net Mon Oct 19 19:57:31 1998 (envelope- from bdcreek@grand-rapids.crosswinds.net) Subject: Heat Guns I'm wondering if I should get a new heat gun. I have a Wagner, with avariable setting wheel on the back. The opening is kind of small, andthe spreader tip doesn't spread very wide. Any suggestions? Brian from moucheux@sympatico.ca Mon Oct 19 19:58:33 1998 Subject: Re: test test -- Michel Lajoie from FISHWOOL@aol.com Mon Oct 19 21:03:16 1998 Subject: Re: Golden Trout Joe,These are palomino trout originating in W. Va. The true golden trout areout west in the Sierra mtns.Hank. from bacon@idt.net Mon Oct 19 22:11:41 1998 Subject: Re: Golden Trout Joseph S.Kallo wrote: Hey guys,Okay, this is probably a bit off-topic, so you can reply off- list.Somemention was made a week or two ago about fishing for golden trout. Thismorning I was fishing the newly stocked Devil's Kitchen lake here is s.Illinois and caught a number really bizzare looking 'bows. They were, Ikidyou not, bannana yellow. I was told that they were the product of geneticmanipulation and were stocked with the more normal ones to helpfishermanlocate fish. Hmmmm. So are these the golden trout that were spoken of?Theywere really, really odd. Joe Joseph S. KalloDpt. of PhilosophySouthern Illinois University at Carbondalejoe,that is really kinda CREEPY, would anyone really geneticallymanipulatetrout so fisherman could SEE them, i'm never fishing again!jean from saweiss@flash.net Mon Oct 19 23:37:52 1998 Subject: Re: Para 15 taper... -----Original Message----- Subject: RE: Para 15 taper... I have one question re this Para15 taper. What line weight is thisfor? Larry,I am probably going to do a Para 15 next. My understanding from previousdiscussions (see archives) is that it is a 5-wt that will also do very wellwith a 6-wt.Steve Weiss from RVenneri@aol.com Tue Oct 20 04:43:34 1998 Subject: Re: test test test im getting no post where is everyonebobv from fr.keulen@wxs.nl Tue Oct 20 07:29:28 1998 (Netscape Messaging Server 3.6) with ESMTP id AAAA74 +0200 Subject: list active? Dear Mike, I seem to have a lot of trouble getting my listmail over the past few days.Aything wrong? Did I make a mistake? Is the list inactive, or what? Yours, Rens Oosthoek from harry37@epix.net Tue Oct 20 07:33:40 1998 SMTP idIAA25956 Subject: test My turn to test the list from richard.nantel@videotron.ca Tue Oct 20 08:50:23 1998 (modemcable31.174.mmtl.videotron.net) sims.3.5.1998.07.14.10.43)with SMTP id for Subject: Test BOUNDARY="Boundary_(ID_blI9PENQRAs2jqXHqkXAQw)" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --Boundary_(ID_blI9PENQRAs2jqXHqkXAQw) BOUNDARY="Boundary_(ID_OO4DH3VTGt5CWnmtiUTafQ)" --Boundary_(ID_OO4DH3VTGt5CWnmtiUTafQ) Test --Boundary_(ID_OO4DH3VTGt5CWnmtiUTafQ) Test --Boundary_(ID_OO4DH3VTGt5CWnmtiUTafQ)-- --Boundary_(ID_blI9PENQRAs2jqXHqkXAQw) mail).vcf" BEGIN:VCARDVERSION:2.1N:Nantel;Richard;;;FN:Richard Nantel (E-mail)ORG:Le groupe MENTOR;TITLE:TEL;WORK;VOICE:(514) 393- 3292TEL;HOME;VOICE:(514) 485-2287TEL;PAGER;VOICE:[1] (514) 111- 1111TEL;WORK;FAX:(514) 393-1483ADR;WORK:;;4374 Old Orchard Avenue;Monteal;Quebec;H4A 3B4;CanadaLABEL;WORK;ENCODING=3DQUOTED- PRINTABLE:4374 Old Orchard =Avenue=3D0D=3D0AMonteal, Quebec H4A 3B4=3D0D=3D0ACanadaADR;HOME:;;4374 Old Orchard Avenue;Monteal;Quebec;H4A 3B4;CanadaLABEL;HOME;ENCODING=3DQUOTED- PRINTABLE:4374 Old Orchard =Avenue=3D0D=3D0AMonteal, Quebec H4A 3B4=3D0D=3D0ACanadaEMAIL;PREF;INTERNET:richard.nantel@videotron.caREV:19980514T133343ZEND:VCARD --Boundary_(ID_blI9PENQRAs2jqXHqkXAQw)-- from briansr@point-net.com Tue Oct 20 08:51:22 1998 0000 Subject: ? Anyone still there?Brian from FISHWOOL@aol.com Tue Oct 20 11:52:20 1998 Subject: test,do not read test from djfinch@sprintmail.com Tue Oct 20 13:24:54 1998 Subject: Test: ignore Test 123... from LambersonW@missouri.edu Tue Oct 20 14:55:19 1998 (5.5.2232.9) Subject: test test from jourdoktorn@pilot.stjarntv.se Tue Oct 20 15:47:54 1998 with ESMTP id AAA1172 for ;Tue, 20 Oct 1998 22:42:27 +0200 Subject: Testing Test/Jan from cmj@post11.tele.dk Tue Oct 20 16:35:53 1998 (InterMail v4.0 201-221) with SMTP +0200 Subject: Sv: Is the list inactive QAA32436 Hi guys I have not received any postings the last couple of days. Have tried un- andsubscribing - in vain. If anyone read this, please send me a note. Carsten Jorgensen dania.flyrods@iname.com from fbcwin@fsbnet.com Tue Oct 20 17:28:43 1998 0500 Subject: Leonard 50 DF taper 1BBC6462EE9BD651C01F07CF" This is a multi-part message in MIME format.-------------- 1BBC6462EE9BD651C01F07CF ---This is try number four --- if they all show up whenthe list comes back up, I sincerely apologize!! Friends,Do any of you have a taper for a Leonard 50 DF? Severalyears ago I had one, and it was one of the nicer castingrods I've felt. I let the rod get away from me, in a deal Istill regret, before I started building rods. I never didmeasure the taper.Now I'd like to build a rod or two on that taper, and ofcourse, don't have it. I do have the taper for a Leonard50, but it is a 6 weight. That's not the same as the 50 DF,is it?. Mine was a 3 piece 5 weight, not a 6 weight.Any kindness you might extend would be most appreciated. Thank you,Harry Boyd--------------1BBC6462EE9BD651C01F07CF filename="vcard.vcf" begin: vcardfn: Harry Boydn: Boyd;Harryorg: First Baptist Churchemail;internet: fbcwin@fsbnet.comtitle: Pastor version: 2.1end: vcard --------------1BBC6462EE9BD651C01F07CF-- from teekay35@interlynx.net Tue Oct 20 17:31:41 1998 Subject: Re: test I haven't received any messages for several days and can't seem to geybackon the list.----------From: john channer Subject: testDate: Saturday, October 17, 1998 12:49 PM did I get bumped or is everyone out for the day? from FlyTyr@southshore.com Tue Oct 20 17:43:43 1998 (8.8.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id RAA32224 for ;Tue, 20 Oct1998 17:43:24 - 0500 Subject: Re: Montague Rod I have been offered a Montague Sunbeam 3 pc. two tip rod. The finish is in very good condition so are the guides and wraps. They appear to beoriginal. The decal is intact and very little warping in the tips. Thetips appear to be different, one seems to be stiffer that the other.Both male ferrules are cracked almost the full length though it does notseem the rod has been used much. The cork grip is in very good condition. There is no tube or bag.I want to make him a fair offer on the rod.Any comments would be appreciated OFF LIST unless you feel it wouldbenefit the list.Thanks,Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com from emiller257@dataflo.net Tue Oct 20 18:07:19 1998 wddataflo.dataflo.net (8.8.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id SAA10285 for Subject: Re: list bob maulucci wrote: did anyone get sunday pm mail, or did i get bumped off the list?thanks,bobThe mail has been pretty sparse, Bob. from ragnarig@integrityol.com Tue Oct 20 18:08:56 1998 (SMTPD32-4.06) id AA381410182; Tue, 20 Oct 1998 16:18:16 PDT Subject: Re: Hook-keeper rings hook keepers are just not cool, that's what i learned, truth or dare? Jean Just ask yourself: Would Hemmingway use a hookkeeper? See how simpleitis? Seriously, my short rods always have leaders so long they get loopedaroundthe reel and hook off onto a guide. The only time I use a short enoughleader to allow using a keeper is on my steelhead/salmon rig and then Ifeelcompelled to jab it in the grip. On the other hand, on the very few occasions when I've been persuaded tomake one for sale, the customer has always specified a certain type ofhookkeeper- generally a ring type. I use the little stainless replacementrings for attaching treble hooks to casting plugs. Make the flat part outof shim-stock. Only one person knows and it matters so little to him :-) Davy from FlyTyr@southshore.com Tue Oct 20 18:09:30 1998 natco.southshore.com (8.8.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id SAA00060 for; Tue, 20 Oct 1998 18:09:13 -0500 Subject: Montague Rod I have posted a message about a Montague rod three times and it has notappeared on my computer. Will see if this comes throughTony FlyTyr@southshore.com from dr_matro@cyberramp.net Tue Oct 20 18:17:09 1998 ESMTP idSAA03705 Subject: Re: Hook-keeper rings Something else to snag the fly line. My 2o. Ken Cole from ragnarig@integrityol.com Tue Oct 20 18:17:20 1998 (SMTPD32-4.06) id AC3114E0182; Tue, 20 Oct 1998 16:26:41 PDT Subject: Re: Anyone out there? Steve I've got you loud and clear. Been getting a few others too, so maybe you'dbetter do that "unsubscribe, resubscribe" thing. sure I've got everybody and then I'll send it off! Take care,Davy -----Original Message----- Subject: Anyone out there? Hi All, Say, could someone shoot me an e-mail off the list. I wonder if this iseven getting out! Steve from fbcwin@fsbnet.com Tue Oct 20 18:27:19 1998 0500 Subject: Re: Heat Guns Brian,I'm wondering the same thing. At the Southern Gathering, St. Waynegave a demonstration using a really wide diffuser on his heat gun. Thediffuser was probably 3.5"-4" X 3/4". I think any old heat gun will beokay, after a little experimentation, if I can figure out how to get awide diffuser.Harry Brian Creek wrote: I'm wondering if I should get a new heat gun. I have a Wagner, with avariable setting wheel on the back. The opening is kind of small, andthe spreader tip doesn't spread very wide. Any suggestions? Brian from ragnarig@integrityol.com Tue Oct 20 18:28:57 1998 (SMTPD32-4.06) id AEE996D0086; Tue, 20 Oct 1998 16:38:17 PDT Subject: Re: No post message arrives Max I'm receiveing you- and everybody else. Maybe try the "unsubscribe etc."once more. If that doesn't do it, write Mike Biondo personally, I guess. new way of looking at things. Keep it up! I've been doing this for aboutthirty years, but I've learned more in the past year (since getting on theinternet) than all the rest combined. All the best,Davy Riggs -----Original Message----- Subject: No post message arrives Hello list, Suddenly I had received no message from last Saturday. Is anythingwrong there?Unsubscribe/Subscribe trial also responses me no answer yet. If something is happening there, please someone advise me. Thanks, Max --Max Satohan Oriental Bamboo Fly Rod Crafteremail:maxs@geocities.co.jpHome Page:http://members.tripod.com/~maxrod/index.html from fbcwin@fsbnet.com Tue Oct 20 18:31:34 1998 0500 Subject: Re: Para 15 taper... Steve,I cast one the other day that was designed to be a 6 weight, but wouldreally sling the heck out of a 7 weight line. A well-known authority onPaulYoung rods was standing right beside me. His comment, "The Para-15 is a7weight rod, no question." He's probably cast scores of them, including theoriginals.But, you can always use one of the software programs to scale it downtowhatever line weight you want it to be.Hope this helps,Harry Boyd Dr. Steven A. Weiss wrote: -----Original Message-----From: Larry Russett Date: Monday, October 19, 1998 9:59 AMSubject: RE: Para 15 taper... I have one question re this Para15 taper. What line weight is thisfor? Larry,I am probably going to do a Para 15 next. My understanding from previousdiscussions (see archives) is that it is a 5-wt that will also do verywellwith a 6-wt.Steve Weiss from ragnarig@integrityol.com Tue Oct 20 18:32:13 1998 (SMTPD32-4.06) id AFAF9DA007E; Tue, 20 Oct 1998 16:41:35 PDT Subject: Re: In Need of Help! A friend has asked what weight line should be used with a True TemperNo. C10-9'Senoa (pardon the expression) steel fly rod. I haven't a clue! George I'm not certain, myself. If it's the same taper as my five-iron, I'd sayabout a six wt should do it. Of course, I only use that with dragon nymphs:-) from MICK@welfen-netz.com Tue Oct 20 18:40:47 1998 [195.143.56.1]with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.7.SP3.R) for ; Wed,21 Oct 199801:40:43 +0200 Subject: Re: Heat Guns SAA03481 Hi Brian,Steinel makes excellent heat guns and they have optional different extraspreaders and an adjustment wheel from 50Ÿ to 600Ÿ Celsius.Michael Brian Creek wrote: I'm wondering if I should get a new heat gun. I have a Wagner, with avariable setting wheel on the back. The opening is kind of small, andthe spreader tip doesn't spread very wide. Any suggestions? Brian from MICK@welfen-netz.com Tue Oct 20 18:43:09 1998 [195.143.56.1]with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.7.SP3.R) for ; Wed,21 Oct 199801:42:24 +0200 Subject: Re: ? read you loud and clear here in Germany. :-)Michael Brian Sturrock wrote: Anyone still there?Brian from k5vkq@ix.netcom.com Tue Oct 20 18:43:17 1998 18:42:33 ix9.ix.netcom.comvia smap (V1.3) Subject: withdrawal This list must be habit forming! The server goes down and half the listhas withdrawal pains; me included. Glad it's back up. Regards,Onisk5vkq@ix.netcom.com from MICK@welfen-netz.com Tue Oct 20 18:51:12 1998 [195.143.56.1]with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.7.SP3.R) for ; Wed,21 Oct 199801:50:47 +0200 Subject: Re: Montague Rod loud and clear in Cermany =:-)Mick Tony Spezio wrote: I have posted a message about a Montague rod three times and it has notappeared on my computer. Will see if this comes throughTony FlyTyr@southshore.com from saltwein@swbell.net Tue Oct 20 18:54:58 1998 gw1adm.rcsntx.swbell.net SAA04975 Subject: Splitting Hey All, I sent a missive similar to this earlier. I suspect with the list beingdown that it was lost in the nether regions. If this is a repeat then Ia apologize for the bandwidth. I have been experimenting with splitting since SRG. I had beensplitting by forcing the cane across a knife held in a vise on my bench.I had good results with this method. To correct the path of a split Iwould force the direction the split needed to travel to, in compressionagainst the knife. While in Arkansas I had the occaision to see Morten Lovstad split somecane using a knife in a similar situation. The difference was that toforce one side or the other into compression he would grab the strip onthe other side of the blade and give it a pull. This allows much morecontrol of the split. At home I had the third piece of a bundle of three that I had orderedtwo years ago. It was small, green, had growers marks and scorch marks from straightening. Just about all of the faults a stick can have, Iguess this is a normal first order of three. I decided to experimentusing the procedure that Morten used in Arkansas. I now have 64 pieces of evenly split cane (yes I did the butts too, Icouldn't stop once I got started). I think I really learned a lot aboutsplitting. Teaching the hands, as Jack Howell put it in THE LOVELYREED. The only contributions that I might be able to add to this process ismarking the culm with a compass by setting it a little over half, thenmake a mark from each side at the nodes. You next make a mark in thecenter of the pairs and connect the dots. I had my end nippers on the bench as I was going to use them to startsplits with. I found that I could start the splits easily by placingthe cane on the knife blade at an angle and rapping it with the butt ofmy palm. I ended up using the nippers to trim off the remaining node bumps fromthe pith side when I had gotten to 16ths. The initial nodes were justcleaned out roughly with a pair of pliers, as per Morten Lovstad. Ididn't find that the nodes gave me any problems until I went from 16thsto 32nds. You can read all of the books but there is nothing like getting aroundtalented people to really pick up some good tips. This was not the onlygood info that was garnered on the trip to Arkansas. Regards, SteveIndependence, MO from rmoon@ida.net Tue Oct 20 19:09:44 1998 Subject: Re: Golden Trout . I was told that they were the product of geneticmanipulation and were stocked with the more normal ones to helpfishermanlocate fish. Hmmmm. So are these the golden trout that were spokenof? Theywere really, really odd. Joe Joseph S. KalloDpt. of PhilosophySouthern Illinois University at Carbondalejoe,that is really kinda CREEPY, would anyone really geneticallymanipulatetrout so fisherman could SEE them, i'm never fishing again!jean In Utah a number of years agothere was a genetic strain of rainbow troutthatwascharacterized by albinism. Not really a true white fish, but sort of ayellowishwhite. I do not know if they are still being produced. The Golden Trout isaseparate genetic species and is a real trophy since they grow only in a fewhighmountain lakes. I have fished for them, but never caught one. I did catchsomealbinos thoughRalph Moon from sshorb@ozip.net Tue Oct 20 19:11:50 1998 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.2 release 221 ID# 0-55785U1000L100S0V35)with ESMTP id net for ;Tue, 20 Oct 1998 19:11:24 -0500 Subject: Re: Hello again and some questions. Fernando; This may be a repeat but Miller Stephenson Chemical has a web site at:http://www.militaryspecifications.com. They have offices worldwide.Can't help on the others. Skip from thramer@presys.com Tue Oct 20 19:43:10 1998 0000 Subject: Para 15 Having built more than a few of the 15 tapers there are two problems, the first is the Yound tendency to experiment. a restless attempt toachieve bamboo perfection I think. The second is that the taper respondsvery well to quality cane. Good cane will result in a wf5, wf6, dt6, wf7rod. Poor cane will not have the power that was originally designed intothe taper. Another point is that No rod is perfect with a single line weight, ifthe builder thinks a 5 is the best but you prefer a faster rod thendon't hesitate to use a 4. A.J.Thramer from jaquin@netsync.net Tue Oct 20 19:57:51 1998 quartz.netsync.net(8.8.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id UAA06161 for ;Tue, 20 Oct1998 20:57:36 -0400 Subject: Re: Montague Rod Tony Spezio wrote: I have been offered a Montague Sunbeam 3 pc. two tip rod. The finish isin very good condition so are the guides and wraps. They appear to beoriginal. The decal is intact and very little warping in the tips. Thetips appear to be different, one seems to be stiffer that the other.Both male ferrules are cracked almost the full length though it doesnotseem the rod has been used much. The cork grip is in very goodcondition. There is no tube or bag.I want to make him a fair offer on the rod.Any comments would be appreciated OFF LIST unless you feel it wouldbenefit the list.Thanks,Tony FlyTyr@southshore.comhi tony i just bought a montaque sunbeam mainly to get the enameledsilk line on the reel. the rod is in rougher shape than yours. onetip is broke just above the top snake guide, guides on center sectionare rusted in half. all the ferrules are split, seems to be a commonproblem. so rod needs new snake guides, wraps, and frrules to restore.got a shakespeare 1821 automatic reel and a level enameled silk line.paid forty bucks for the outfit.. so take it from there! from jaquin@netsync.net Tue Oct 20 20:17:13 1998 quartz.netsync.net(8.8.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id VAA08321 for ;Tue, 20 Oct1998 21:17:04 -0400 Subject: Re: In Need of Help! David wrote: A friend has asked what weight line should be used with a True TemperNo. C10-9'Senoa (pardon the expression) steel fly rod. I haven't a clue! George I'm not certain, myself. If it's the same taper as my five-iron, I'd sayabout a six wt should do it. Of course, I only use that with dragonnymphs:-)i've held and flexed one of the true-temper steel rods. the action wasvery close to a moderate flex. i agree with george, start with a sixweight, and depending on your fishing style etc. move up or down aweight till it feels right for you. from bdcreek@grand-rapids.crosswinds.net Tue Oct 20 20:26:00 1998 (envelope- from bdcreek@grand-rapids.crosswinds.net) Subject: Re: Splitting Steve wrote: You can read all of the books but there is nothing like getting aroundtalented people to really pick up some good tips. Amen. Everytime I get around other, better builders, my skills jump upseveral notches thorough the "Ah-ha!" process. Brian from RVenneri@aol.com Tue Oct 20 20:40:08 1998 Subject: Re: Testing Boy I thought it was just me. IM so glad you guys are back. Bob V from RVenneri@aol.com Tue Oct 20 20:44:43 1998 Subject: t hogan rod co I am try in to get a number of a David Eckoff from T Hogan Rods can anyonehelp me with a phone # he is located in WA Bob V from maxs@geocities.co.jp Tue Oct 20 21:14:30 1998 geocities.co.jp (8.9.1-1.1G/8.9.1-GEOCITIES1.1) with ESMTP id LAA25505for; Wed, 21 Oct 1998 11:14:26 +0900 (JST) Subject: moisture in blank Dear list, I just put ferrules for two rods, (Jim Payne 200 and Chrys Bogards'Shenandoah Supreme #4 piece),which were planed last January and being woked on gradually throughrainy season here. This summer, we had many typhoon and many rainydays. When I ironed the blank for straighening, the surface got wet because ofiron heat. And when adjusting the straighteness of a whole length afterconnecting all sections, the blank is easily tend to bend even I force apower without heating it. So I guess that a considerable amount ofmoisture is inside the blank. Have you experienced this? Any advice is appreciated to get rid of the moisture of blank in thissituation. Thanks, Max -- Max Satohan Oriental Bamboo Fly Rod Crafteremail:maxs@geocities.co.jpHome Page:http://members.tripod.com/~maxrod/index.html from ragnarig@integrityol.com Tue Oct 20 21:34:30 1998 (SMTPD32-4.06) id AA70990007A; Tue, 20 Oct 1998 19:44:00 PDT Subject: cork deadline To all who have sent money for corkandTo all who have been meaning to send money for cork but just haven't quitegotten around to it yet I just sent notices out to all whose checks I've received, except for FrankCaruso, so if you've sent money, or are presently sending it, and haven'tgot a notice- and you're not Frank- please write me toot sweet so I holdupon the order. Don't want to leave anybody out, but the time is fastapproaching and I'm already getting death threats. Well not exactly deaththreats but polite inquiries, which is the same thing, except for the threatof death. Please be patient if I don't answer promptly the next couple of days as Iwill not be to the house much. I'll be ah... working.... yeah, that's theticket. Working. Right. Davy from thorstad@primenet.com Tue Oct 20 22:08:25 1998 be"Pthorstad"via SMTP by smtp01.primenet.com, id smtpd007851; Tue Oct 20 20:08:131998 Subject: Re: Heat Guns Although I have yet to make a rod, in preparation of my first I bought aSteinel HG 3002 from a national distributor, Scottsdale Tool & Supply forabout $130. It has variable heat setting and variable air flow. It alsohas (the best part I think) an LCD readout that shows the setpointtemperature when you're adjusting, then the actual temperature as itheatsup and runs. They do have a selection of tips and a website athttp://www.thomasregister.com/olc/steinelamerica. Tim thorstad@primenet.com -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Heat Guns Hi Brian,Steinel makes excellent heat guns and they have optional different extraspreaders and an adjustment wheel from 50Ÿ to 600Ÿ Celsius.Michael Brian Creek wrote: I'm wondering if I should get a new heat gun. I have a Wagner, with avariable setting wheel on the back. The opening is kind of small, andthe spreader tip doesn't spread very wide. Any suggestions? Brian from tyoung@perth.dialix.com.au Tue Oct 20 23:04:39 1998 Wed, 21 Oct 1998 12:03:57 +0800 (WST)(envelope- from tyoung) Subject: Re: Para 15 taper... On Tue, 20 Oct 1998, Harry Boyd wrote: Steve,I cast one the other day that was designed to be a 6 weight, but wouldreally sling the heck out of a 7 weight line. A well-known authority onPaulYoung rods was standing right beside me. His comment, "The Para-15 isa 7weight rod, no question." He's probably cast scores of them, includingtheoriginals.But, you can always use one of the software programs to scale it downtowhatever line weight you want it to be.Hope this helps,Harry Boyd This seems to be one of those perpetual questions, but I would say the Para 15 is a 5 or 6 depending on your style. I like a 5 personaly. Tony from saweiss@flash.net Tue Oct 20 23:10:22 1998 Subject: flaming I tried flaming a culm for the first time and went pretty heavy with thetorch. I flamed until the outer enamel started to blister, and found thatthe charring went pretty deep. The resulting strips had to have a lot ofouter material removed before getting down to sound fibers. The finishedrod(Wayne's 7 1/2 4-wt) came out very well, as a matter of fact, casts a WF5better than a DT4. The color is like tortoise shell, pretty dark, but veryattractive.Even with having removed a lot of outer material, the edges of thestrips were still a bit fragile.The question is, when flaming, how much is enough? Not having seen alotof flamed rods, I don't know what the range of color is from light to dark.Anyone want to take a shot at describing color ranges of flamed rods? from saweiss@flash.net Tue Oct 20 23:11:15 1998 Subject: Re: test -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: test test test im getting no post where is everyonebobv You are coming thru OK, Bob.Steve from dmanders@ccinet.ab.ca Tue Oct 20 23:44:34 1998 Subject: Dave Leclair Dave, You out there - need email address Don from tyoung@perth.dialix.com.au Tue Oct 20 23:57:49 1998 Wed, 21 Oct 1998 12:57:16 +0800 (WST)(envelope- from tyoung) Subject: Re: titebond ll On Sat, 17 Oct 1998, Ed Miller wrote: A NUMBER OF RODMAKERS THAT ARE CURRENTLY MAKING NODELESS RODSUSE TITEBOND II FOR THE SPLICES. DOES ANYONE CURRENTLY USE TITEBOND IIAS THEIR MAIN ADHESIVE? ANY COMMENTS ARE WELCOME. ED M. Ed,please stop yelling.A friend recently made his first rod nodeless (yes, it was a Sir D) with Titebond II and apart from one scarf that is lifting on the back spline in the butt the rod works fine. The lifting scarf may have been the makers fault not the glue as he made the butt first and may not have either scarfed properly, clamped correctly or may have allowed the surface to be contaminated in some way. nodeless rods I use Shell Epon. It's messy, wasteful and all the things about epoxy I don't like but I'll be watching my friend's rod carefuly before I use it for scarfs. TBII seems to impart a different action alsowhen it's used to glue the splines. I guess it's *slightly* more limber. Tony /***********************************************************************/Tony Younghttp://www.iinet.net.au/~mainpeak/flyrod.htmlThe Australian connection A computer without windows is like a fish without a bicycle /***********************************************************************/ from stpete@netten.net Wed Oct 21 00:26:41 1998 cedar.netten.net(8.8.8/8.6.12) with SMTP id AAA24793 for ;Wed, 21 Oct Subject: Re: Para 15 taper... Harry, I'm glad to hear that the Para-15 is a 7 wt. I'm planning to build oneand I happen to have a never been used, old Cortland silk HCH line thatneeds a good rod. Rick Crenshaw Harry Boyd wrote: Steve,I cast one the other day that was designed to be a 6 weight, but wouldreally sling the heck out of a 7 weight line. A well-known authority onPaulYoung rods was standing right beside me. His comment, "The Para-15 isa 7weight rod, no question." He's probably cast scores of them, includingtheoriginals.But, you can always use one of the software programs to scale it downtowhatever line weight you want it to be.Hope this helps,Harry Boyd from channer@hubwest.com Wed Oct 21 01:20:47 1998 (SMTPD32-4.02c) id AD88C070106; Wed, 21 Oct 1998 00:22:00 MDT Subject: Re: Hook-keeper rings At 09:13 PM 10/17/98 -0700, you wrote:Mike,I'm afraid I'm ignorant in this case, as in many others. But you got mewondering - How many of us use hook-keepers? Didn't Garrison decidenot toinclude them on his rods? I know I've decided not to use them on myrods,because I fish 9-15 foot leaders on 6-8 foot rods. Using a hook-keeperallowsthe line to leader connection to go beyond the tip-top. I'm clumsyenough thatI try to never let anything that dangerous to a delicate little tiphappen onpurpose.Harryharry,hook keepers are just not cool, that's what i learned, truth or dare?jean Jean and Harry;FWIW, I like the look of a hookeeper on a rod(hanging ring type). I use theones on my rods to get from one pool to the next, or from the truck to theriver.Harry, do you tie your own leaders, or add on to store bought ones? I haverecently started tying my own and I am interested in any good leaderformula's you might care to recommend, specially if you have one that willturn over a speck of dust ( flies smaller than #18) in the wind. I can'tbring up Dave Eggerbretson's page thru Rodmakers, so that option is out. Itried the formula from A.K. Best in the last issue of BFRM, it works reallywell for me, but I think leaders are like tapers, just can't have too many.John from Rodsofcane@aol.com Wed Oct 21 05:02:20 1998 Subject: glue / adhesive poll ? Once again it is poll time! I am trying to find out what most of you use asfar as glue to put together ? I am getting close to putting my first rodtogether and of course want to use the best. Also something that has agoodshelve life ! Thanx,Kent K. Anderson from ragnarig@integrityol.com Wed Oct 21 06:01:49 1998 (SMTPD32-4.06) id A162F790122; Wed, 21 Oct 1998 04:11:30 PDT Subject: Re: Heat Guns boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000D_01BDFCA7.2FCC5460" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000D_01BDFCA7.2FCC5460 Dear Brian A recent convert to heat guns, I got a similar Milwaukee (and if you =don't think the World is going to hell in a Renault Dauphin... Milwaukee =of all people... made in China... grumble grumble) and in fact, I think =it's maybe the same thing. I just cobbled a wide spreader and = I guess I'd recommend my own plan: work hell out of it 'til it blows =(or fails to, I mean) then take it back to Home Boys and raise what is =this. Davy I'm wondering if I should get a new heat gun. I have a Wagner, with avariable setting wheel on the back. The opening is kind of small, andthe spreader tip doesn't spread very wide. Any suggestions? Brian ------=_NextPart_000_000D_01BDFCA7.2FCC5460 Dear Brian A recent convert to heat guns, I got a = going to hell in a Renault Dauphin... Milwaukee of all = I guess I'd recommend my own = out of it 'til it blows (or fails to, I mean) then take it back to Home = raise what is this. Davy = ------=_NextPart_000_000D_01BDFCA7.2FCC5460-- from frankc@webspan.net Wed Oct 21 06:15:07 1998 Subject: Re: Is anyone out there? 384E73517F7CE1D3B99A38FD" This is a multi-part message in MIME format.-------------- 384E73517F7CE1D3B99A38FD Onis Cogburn wrote: Is anyone out there? Either the listserver is down or my ISP's linkisdown. I have received no Rodmakers email for the last two days andthelistserver doesn't respond to the unsubscribe/subscribe messages. Ihadthe reverse last winter; the listserver sent me mail but wouldn'tacceptmine! Please respond off list. I am not receiving the list. Thanks. Regards,Onisk5vkq@ix.netcom.com OnisI had the same problem yesterday. I think it may just have been a quietday. I unsubscribed and than subscribed and everything seems to be backto normal today.I had 67 messages this AM. Frank Caruso --------------384E73517F7CE1D3B99A38FD begin: vcardfn: FRANKn: ;FRANKemail;internet: frankc@webspan.net end: vcard --------------384E73517F7CE1D3B99A38FD-- from frankc@webspan.net Wed Oct 21 06:32:40 1998 Subject: Re: Anyone out there? 8D724EF07AA7193C69172F11" This is a multi-part message in MIME format.-------------- 8D724EF07AA7193C69172F11 Steve Stillabower wrote: Hi All, Say, could someone shoot me an e-mail off the list. I wonder if thisis even getting out! Steve Your OK - I'm OK Frank --------------8D724EF07AA7193C69172F11 begin: vcardfn: FRANKn: ;FRANKemail;internet: frankc@webspan.net end: vcard --------------8D724EF07AA7193C69172F11-- from sniderja@email.uc.edu Wed Oct 21 06:37:38 1998 Subject: Re: titebond ll My first rod was built entirely of Titebond II. I have used it heavily foronly a year and it is holding together well--no obvious problems. I believethat Sir Darryl built a 7' 4 wt for his father and it has been in use forover 2 years now with apparently no problems. If I am incorrect on thelatter, someone please correct me.Jerry Snider.At 08:10 PM 10/17/98 -0700, you wrote:A NUMBER OF RODMAKERS THAT ARE CURRENTLY MAKING NODELESS RODSUSE TITEBOND II FOR THE SPLICES. DOES ANYONE CURRENTLY USE TITEBOND IIAS THEIR MAIN ADHESIVE? ANY COMMENTS ARE WELCOME. ED M. from AHanzich@NA2.US.ML.com Wed Oct 21 06:45:45 1998 HAA29895 Subject: RE: Anyone out there? Nothing for a few days, than, WAM, 100 e-mails. Guess all is OK now! Al Hanzich732-878-6567 -----Original Message----- Sent: Sunday, October 18, 1998 4:56 PM Subject: Anyone out there? Hi All, Say, could someone shoot me an e-mail off the list. Iwonder if this is even getting out! Steve from ragnarig@integrityol.com Wed Oct 21 07:30:43 1998 (SMTPD32-4.06) id A63AE2B007E; Wed, 21 Oct 1998 05:40:26 PDT Subject: Re: Golden Trout boundary="----=_NextPart_000_004E_01BDFCB2.975A55E0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_004E_01BDFCB2.975A55E0 I think much of the misunderstanding stems from the similarity between ="golden" trout and Dr. Billy Ray Goldblum, whose work in developing =warm-water salmonids at the Joplin Agricultural College KnoblauerSchool =of Horticulture and Institute of Television Technology was almost =universally obscure. Who knows what recreational opportunities there =might have been for the developing world had the federal beaurocracy not=refused to even process Dr. Goldblum's grant applications, citing ="overly tedious and highly improbable name of institution"? And while the project certainly was ambitious, I personally think much =of the cause for failure was the fact that, due to the aforementioned =lack of funding, lab assistants were largely drawn from the Dennis =Weaver School of Psychopharmacology and Video Drama's highly =controversial Cannabis Cultivation and Potency Testing Program. That, =and the tendency of those personnel to experience overpowering hunger =urges while in possession of the keys to Dr. Goldblum's specimen tank. -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Golden Trout Joseph S.Kallo wrote: Hey guys,Okay, this is probably a bit off-topic, so you can reply =off-list. Somemention was made a week or two ago about fishing for golden trout. =Thismorning I was fishing the newly stocked Devil's Kitchen lake here is =s.Illinois and caught a number really bizzare looking 'bows. They were, =I kidyou not, bannana yellow. I was told that they were the product of =geneticmanipulation and were stocked with the more normal ones to help =fishermanlocate fish. Hmmmm. So are these the golden trout that were spoken =of? Theywere really, really odd. Joe Joseph S. KalloDpt. of PhilosophySouthern Illinois University at Carbondalejoe,that is really kinda CREEPY, would anyone really genetically =manipulatetrout so fisherman could SEE them, i'm never fishing again!jean ------=_NextPart_000_004E_01BDFCB2.975A55E0 I think much of the misunderstanding stems from the similarity = "golden" trout and Dr. Billy Ray Goldblum, whose work= developing warm-water salmonids at the Joplin Agricultural College = School of Horticulture and Institute of Television Technology was almost=