from Ed.Estlow@co.hennepin.mn.us Thu Apr 1 08:23:00 1999 1999 14:22:24 UT 16-1998)) id86256746.004EBFA4 ; Thu, 1 Apr 1999 08:20:08 -0600 Subject: Re: Trim the pith apex prior to gluing? Alas, Bill, a hollow tube does not have greater resistance to bendingforcesthan a solid tube of the same diameter. The stiffness of a beam of circularcross section is proportional to the fourth power of the outer diameter. Iftherod is hollow, the stiffness is propostrional to the fourth power of theouterdiameter MINUS the fourth power of the inner diameter. This is, of course,alower number than the fourth power of the outer diameter alone. Thus ahollowrod will not be as stiff as a solid one. In the spirit of demistifying the (engineering) solid mechanics of fly rods,Best regards,-Ed Estlow -SNIP- The absolute center of a rod where the six strips meet is, indeed, deadcenter, with the operative word here being "dead." Nothing at all iscontributed to the flexing characteristics of a rod by whatever material islocated at this dead center, since that material is never either incompression or tension. It just moves with the rod, contributing nothingbut its mass (that is, contributing nothing). Over the decades, variousbuilders have made "hollow-built" rods in an attempt to remove thisuseless material and to lighten the rod overall -- trusting the flexingcharacteristics of the taper to the integrity of wall thickness alone. (Bysome quirk of geometry, a hollow tube of a certain wall thickness hasgreater resistance to bending forces than a solid tube of the samediameter). So, if you wish to remove the apex at the center of your sections, feelfree to do so without worry that you might be negatively affecting thefinished rod. Cheers, Bill -SNIP- from BThoman@neonsoft.com Thu Apr 1 08:28:55 1999 Subject: Filtering Varnish Does anyone know of a way to filter varnish to remove smallcontaminants?Cheesecloth? Gauze? Any good way to do it without introducing moredust orfabric particles would be great help. Brian from dpeaston@wzrd.com Thu Apr 1 08:43:46 1999 Thu, 1 Apr 1999 09:43:09 GMT Subject: Re: Filtering Varnish At 07:24 AM 4/1/1999 -0700, Thoman, Brian wrote:Does anyone know of a way to filter varnish to remove smallcontaminants?Cheesecloth? Gauze? Any good way to do it without introducing moredust orfabric particles would be great help. Brian Brian,Most good paint stores carry filter cones with a mesh for filteringvarnish. I sometimes use Cheeze cloth, but it absorbs a lot of varnish, isa bit too coarse and can leave lint. It is, however, adequate to Remove thedog hair which often contaminates my finishes. -Doug from jclove@cysource.com Thu Apr 1 09:09:46 1999 Thu, 1 Apr 1999 09:09:24 -0600 Subject: Re: Filtering Varnish mac-creator="4D4F5353" Brian, An excellent varnish filter may be had by procuring (methods left toyour discretion and local availability) a supply of nylon stockings.Snip the stocking to a suitable length above the heel and stretch itaround the lid of your "clean" can. Works great and will provide moreand better stories than a trip to the paint store! Jeff from SalarFly@aol.com Thu Apr 1 11:34:36 1999 Subject: Hollow rods (Was:Trim the pith apex prior to gluing?) Alas, Bill, a hollow tube does not have greater resistance to bendingforcesthan a solid tube of the same diameter. The stiffness of a beam ofcircularcross section is proportional to the fourth power of the outer diameter.Ifthe rod is hollow, the stiffness is propostrional to the fourth power ofthe outer diameter MINUS the fourth power of the inner diameter. This is, of course, a lower number than the fourth power of the outer diameteralone. Thus a hollow rod will not be as stiff as a solid one. I knew Engineer Ed would come through on this one. Ed and I have beenhere before. Ed is right as usual, but one thing I would like to add is that there is a perception that a hollow rod is stiffer because of the reducedweight. A hollow rod stops and reverses direction quicker because it islighter. To most people casting the rod it feels like it is stiffer. Darryl from mcdowellc@lanecc.edu Thu Apr 1 11:44:35 1999 via smap (4.1) 9:56:02 PST Subject: RE: Filtering Varnish The paint store filters that Doug talked about are very good. You can get the cones and pour directly into your tube, but I like the 1 and 5 gallon bags. The mesh on them seems to be finer, which makes sense because the varnish or paint is pouring through a larger surface area rather then a small screened area at the bottom of a cone. Ultimately I tape a small square to a plastic funnel anyway so the flow into the tube is slow and takes some time, but again the filtering qualities are very good. A 5 gallon bag cut up into small squares to be taped on the bottom of a plastic cone filter will last for many filtering sessions if you find it necessary. Also important is the type of cap you use on your dip tube. A.J. tipped me off to the rubber caps with the hose clamp to cap off a dip tube, also Reed has mentioned these. Basically you do away with any threads that maycause dried remnants of varnish to fall into your tube if your using a screw lid. I have used one of these caps for almost a year and have never had a surface skim over and never have contaminates in the varnish. In order to periodically mix the varnish in the tube you will need to remove the cap and replace it with a seal of some kind so you can turn the tube over and back to mix. I simply use a folded over piece of plastic wrap and the palm of my hand to seal. It's simple, it works, and I have no contaminates in the varnish, and no skim over. When you remove the rubber cap from the tube there is actually a hiss from the vaccum pressure created. Chris McDowellmcdowellc@lanecc.edu from mcdowellc@lanecc.edu Thu Apr 1 11:53:41 1999 via smap (4.1) 10:04:53 PST Subject: RE: heddon 17 wraps David, The YLI sold via Anglers Workshop in Orange #143 is a good match if you preserve the color with clear lacquer. These 200 meter spools are $5.95 plus shipping. Chris McDowellmcdowellc@lanecc.edu from dmanders@telusplanet.net Thu Apr 1 11:55:47 1999 don") byedtnps05.telusplanet.net with SMTP id ; Thu, 1 Apr 199910:51:01 - 0700 Subject: Re: Hollow rods (Was:Trim the pith apex prior to gluing?) Darryl, And from the comparisons that I've done - a hollow rod will not cast asfaras the same taper built solid. Don At 12:33 PM 4/1/99 EST, SalarFly@aol.com wrote: Alas, Bill, a hollow tube does not have greater resistance to bendingforcesthan a solid tube of the same diameter. The stiffness of a beam ofcircularcross section is proportional to the fourth power of the outerdiameter. Ifthe rod is hollow, the stiffness is propostrional to the fourth power ofthe outer diameter MINUS the fourth power of the inner diameter. This is,of course, a lower number than the fourth power of the outer diameteralone. Thus a hollow rod will not be as stiff as a solid one. I knew Engineer Ed would come through on this one. Ed and I have beenhere before. Ed is right as usual, but one thing I would like to add is that there is a perception that a hollow rod is stiffer because of the reducedweight. A hollow rod stops and reverses direction quicker because it islighter. To most people casting the rod it feels like it is stiffer. Darryl from Patrick.Coffey@PSS.Boeing.com Thu Apr 1 11:56:02 1999 (5.5.2407.0) "'mcdowellc@lanecc.edu'" Subject: RE: Filtering Varnish check out the dip tube caps on the dip tubes that goldenwitch sells, nothreads-a rubber ?type seal and no threads. Once again I have no financial interest in thecompany. ----------From: mcdowellc@lanecc.edu[SMTP:mcdowellc@lanecc.edu] Sent: Thursday, April 01, 1999 9:46 AM Subject: RE: Filtering Varnish The paint store filters that Doug talked about are very good. You can get the cones and pour directly into your tube, but I like the 1 and 5 gallon bags. The mesh on them seems to be finer, which makes sense becausethe varnish or paint is pouring through a larger surface area rather then a small screened area at the bottom of a cone. Ultimately I tape a small square to a plastic funnel anyway so the flow into the tube is slow and takes some time, but again the filtering qualities are very good. A 5 gallon bag cut up into small squares to be taped on the bottom of aplastic cone filter will last for many filtering sessions if you find it necessary. Also important is the type of cap you use on your dip tube. A.J. tipped me off to the rubber caps with the hose clamp to cap off a dip tube, alsoReed has mentioned these. Basically you do away with any threads that maycause dried remnants of varnish to fall into your tube if your using a screw lid. I have used one of these caps for almost a year and have never had a surface skim over and never have contaminates in the varnish. In order to periodically mix the varnish in the tube you will need to remove the cap and replace it with a seal of some kind so you can turnthe tube over and back to mix. I simply use a folded over piece of plastic wrap and the palm of my hand to seal. It's simple, it works, and I haveno contaminates in the varnish, and no skim over. When you remove the rubber cap from the tube there is actually a hiss from the vaccum pressure created. Chris McDowellmcdowellc@lanecc.edu from measter@sdcoe.k12.ca.us Thu Apr 1 12:31:00 1999 Subject: NS Tubing mac-creator="4D4F5353" Hi There,It appears that Mr. LeClair's supply of reel seat tubing has dried up. Iam in need of about 5 ft of 720x650. If anyone can help please reply offlist.Thanks,Marl from rmoon@ida.net Thu Apr 1 12:34:19 1999 Subject: Thanks To all of you who offered help on Wayne's Hexrod98, my sincere thanks.I got it up and going just computer stupidity that's all. Ralph from CALucker@aol.com Thu Apr 1 13:13:00 1999 Subject: Re: Lambuth book In a message dated 3/31/99 10:34:21 AM Pacific Standard Time,richard.nantel@videotron.ca writes: Lining up the guides is not really difficult. You simply bend the guide feetto match the twists on the blank. That way you put the guids where youwantthem, not where the twists dictate. Chris Lucker from mcdowellc@lanecc.edu Thu Apr 1 13:18:41 1999 via smap (4.1) 11:30:00 PST Subject: Heddon 8' 1 3/4f taper This taper was taken from a Heddon #125 8' three piece with a 1 3/4f ferrule. Varnish removed. Chris McDowellmcdowellc@lanecc.edu tip #1 tip #2 1 .072,.073,.075 .073,.074,.0755 .087,.088,.089 .088,.089,.09210 .100,.104,.106 .098,.101,.10215 .114,.114,.115 .116,.119,.12020 .127,.128,.131 .129,.130,.13825 .140,.143,.143 .143,.144,.14630 .155,.157,.161 .158,.163,.165Ferrule35 .166,.167,.16840 .185,.186,.18745 .200,.202,.20250 .217,.217,.21955 .229,.234,.23560 .248,.250,.251Ferrule66 .261,.263,.26370 .270,.270,.27275 .285,.285,.28880 .298,.300,.302 (Butt swell begins here)85 .404,.410,.41185 3/4 .415,.422,.423 (Max swell before winding check) from mcs@fastlane.net Thu Apr 1 14:31:42 1999 Subject: Other Rod Building Lists I am new to this list and I was wondering if there are any other rodbuilding lists that deal with rods other than bamboo? Thanks all. from chris@artistree.com Thu Apr 1 15:05:02 1999 Subject: Re: Hollow rods (Was:Trim the pith apex prior to gluing?) mac-creator="4D4F5353" I'm having hard time with this statement. Although, I haven't done any realfield comparisons like Don has (and I will), I've seen guys cast my hollowrods(7' - 8') down into the backing. I mean how much further do you want togo? At this point in time I really feel it's dependent on the skill of the casterand to some extent the taper (yes, I said some extent). I'm lucky to live inarea that sports some really top notch casters and have seen some thingsdone oncane rods that has blown me away. So much so that this has inspired me topractice my casting as often as I can. --Regards, Chris Wohlfordemail: chris@artistree.com Don & Sandy Andersen wrote: Darryl, And from the comparisons that I've done - a hollow rod will not cast asfaras the same taper built solid. from fbcwin@fsbnet.com Thu Apr 1 15:15:53 1999 (Post.Office MTA v3.1.2 release (PO205-101c) Thu, 1 Apr 1999 15:15:39 -0600 Subject: Re: Thanks Ralph,After you've played with it a while, you find out that it's prettyneat. Does all the things others do, plus side by side comparisons of tworods. That makes a pretty neat way to compare, say a Gillum and aDickerson.When you figure out some of the other neat things, fill us in. Harry from HARMS1@prodigy.net Thu Apr 1 17:18:32 1999 Thu, 1 Apr 1999 18:18:27 -0500 Subject: Re: Trim the pith apex prior to gluing? =_NextPart_000_01BE7C6B.BFA59F80" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_01BE7C6B.BFA59F80 Ed, Thanks for the clarification. I'm the last to claim expertise in geometry,as anyone can tell. But I must say, I am truly surprised to hear thisexplanation. Oh well. I wasn't going to build a hollow rod anyhow. Cheers, Bill ----------From: Ed.Estlow@co.hennepin.mn.us Subject: Re: Trim the pith apex prior to gluing?Date: Thursday, April 01, 1999 6:19 AM Alas, Bill, a hollow tube does not have greater resistance to bendingforcesthan a solid tube of the same diameter. The stiffness of a beam ofcircularcross section is proportional to the fourth power of the outer diameter.If therod is hollow, the stiffness is propostrional to the fourth power of theouterdiameter MINUS the fourth power of the inner diameter. This is, ofcourse, alower number than the fourth power of the outer diameter alone. Thus ahollowrod will not be as stiff as a solid one. In the spirit of demistifying the (engineering) solid mechanics of flyrods,Best regards,-Ed Estlow -SNIP- The absolute center of a rod where the six strips meet is, indeed, deadcenter, with the operative word here being "dead." Nothing at all iscontributed to the flexing characteristics of a rod by whatever materialislocated at this dead center, since that material is never either incompression or tension. It just moves with the rod, contributing nothingbut its mass (that is, contributing nothing). Over the decades, variousbuilders have made "hollow-built" rods in an attempt to remove thisuseless material and to lighten the rod overall -- trusting the flexingcharacteristics of the taper to the integrity of wall thickness alone. (Bysome quirk of geometry, a hollow tube of a certain wall thickness hasgreater resistance to bending forces than a solid tube of the samediameter). So, if you wish to remove the apex at the center of your sections, feelfree to do so without worry that you might be negatively affecting thefinished rod. Cheers, Bill -SNIP- ------=_NextPart_000_01BE7C6B.BFA59F80 Ed,Thanks for the = rod is hollow, the stiffness is propostrional to the fourth power of the = center, with the operative word here being "dead." = = some quirk of geometry, a hollow tube of a certain wall thickness = ------=_NextPart_000_01BE7C6B.BFA59F80-- from TSmithwick@aol.com Thu Apr 1 17:41:17 1999 SalarFly@aol.com Subject: Re: Re: Hollow rods (Was:Trim the pith apex prior to gluing?) In a message dated 4/1/99 6:01:05 PM, dmanders@telusplanet.net wrote: Don - That is true up to a point. As the rod gets bigger and longer it mightbe possible that the caster might run out of the strength it takes to handleaheavy rod. In that case he could probably cast the hollow version farther,even though the solid version is more powerful. from HARMS1@prodigy.net Thu Apr 1 17:58:09 1999 Thu, 1 Apr 1999 18:58:01 -0500 Subject: Re: Hollow rods (Was:Trim the pith apex prior to gluing?) =_NextPart_000_01BE7C71.47712A60" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_01BE7C71.47712A60 Yes, I'm sure that a hollow-built rod would seem stiffer because of itsreduced mass and relatively quicker recovery time. But wouldn't thereduced mass be almost entirely in the lower two-thirds of the rod -- thus,leaving the rod feeling "tip-heavy"? And, as a side note, I would still affirm that in a non-hollow-built rod,the small amount of cane one removes from the apex of the six strips isindeed at a rod's "dead center," and can be taken away without concern foraffecting the action. Cheers, Bill ----------From: SalarFly@aol.com Subject: Hollow rods (Was:Trim the pith apex prior to gluing?)Date: Thursday, April 01, 1999 9:33 AM Alas, Bill, a hollow tube does not have greater resistance to bendingforcesthan a solid tube of the same diameter. The stiffness of a beam ofcircularcross section is proportional to the fourth power of the outerdiameter. Ifthe rod is hollow, the stiffness is propostrional to the fourth powerofthe outer diameter MINUS the fourth power of the inner diameter. This is,of course, a lower number than the fourth power of the outer diameteralone. Thus a hollow rod will not be as stiff as a solid one. I knew Engineer Ed would come through on this one. Ed and I have beenhere before. Ed is right as usual, but one thing I would like to add isthat there is a perception that a hollow rod is stiffer because of the reducedweight. A hollow rod stops and reverses direction quicker because it islighter. To most people casting the rod it feels like it is stiffer. Darryl------=_NextPart_000_01BE7C71.47712A60 Yes, I'm sure that a =hollow-built rod would seem stiffer because of its reduced mass and = =almost entirely in the lower two-thirds of the rod -- thus, leaving the =rod feeling "tip-heavy"?And, as a side note, I would =still affirm that in a non-hollow-built rod, the small amount of cane =one removes from the apex of the six strips is indeed at a rod's = = = there is a perception that a hollow rod is stiffer because of the = ------=_NextPart_000_01BE7C71.47712A60-- from chris@artistree.com Thu Apr 1 18:18:47 1999 Subject: Hollow rods mac-creator="4D4F5353" Guys,I'm under the impression that:Lighter Weight (hollow) + Increased Stiffness (taper & other methods) = afasterline speed. Have I been hanging out with the graphite guys too much? On another note, I hear the graphite rod manufactures are finally startingtoslow their tapers down. Looks taper/action design is coming around fullcircle. --Best Regards, Chris Wohlfordemail: chris@artistree.com ....but one thing I would like to add is that there is a perception that ahollow rod is stiffer because of the reduced weight. A hollow rod stopsandreverses direction quicker because it islighter. To most people casting the rod it feels like it is stiffer. Darryl from chris@artistree.com Thu Apr 1 18:30:55 1999 Subject: Re: Hollow rods mac-creator="4D4F5353" Bill,I thought of this when I started hollow building but it turned out notto be the case. Nearest I can figure is the remaining mass (afterhollowing) in the lower 2/3 rds is still much greater than the mass ofthe upper 1/3 rd of the rod (i.e. tip section). I think it would take areally big tip diameter to throw this off. --Best Regards, Chris Wohlfordemail: chris@artistree.com WILLIAM A HARMS wrote: Yes, I'm sure that a hollow-built rod would seem stiffer because ofits reduced mass and relatively quicker recovery time. But wouldn'tthe reduced mass be almost entirely in the lower two-thirds of the rod-- thus, leaving the rod feeling "tip-heavy"? from plantboy@siu.edu Thu Apr 1 18:31:07 1999 Thu, 1 Apr 1999 18:30:40 -0600 Thu, 1 Apr 1999 18:33:08 -0600 Subject: Re: Hollow rods boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0027_01BE7C6E.16000760" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0027_01BE7C6E.16000760 Chris Wohlford wrote: "On another note, I hear the graphite rod manufactures are finally =starting toslow their tapers down. Looks taper/action design is coming around full =circle." Your right, unless you've been fishing a Winston graphite. They've been =using the IM6 graphite for years while sage et al. have moved up into =the 'crazy fast' series III and IV graphites. Interesting to note that =Winstons top of the line is the IM6 and Sage's entry series is IM6. As =a friend told me, "It just goes to show you that the taper makes all the =difference". Soon to be a bamboo convert, Eric -----Original Message-----From: Chris Wohlford Cc: RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.edu Date: Thursday, April 01, 1999 4:23 PMSubject: Hollow rods Guys,I'm under the impression that:Lighter Weight (hollow) + Increased Stiffness (taper & other =methods) =3D a fasterline speed. Have I been hanging out with the graphite guys too much? On another note, I hear the graphite rod manufactures are finally =starting toslow their tapers down. Looks taper/action design is coming around =full circle. --Best Regards, Chris Wohlfordemail: chris@artistree.com ....but one thing I would like to add is that there is a =perception that ahollow rod is stiffer because of the reduced weight. A hollow rod =stops andreverses direction quicker because it islighter. To most people casting the rod it feels like it is =stiffer. Darryl ------=_NextPart_000_0027_01BE7C6E.16000760 Chris Wohlford wrote: "On another note, I hear the graphite rod manufactures are = starting toslow their tapers down. Looks taper/action design is = around full circle." been using the IM6 graphite for years while sage et al. have moved up = Winstons top of the line is the IM6 and Sage's entry series is = friend told me, "It just goes to show you that the taper makes all = difference". Soon to be a bamboo convert, Eric -----Original = rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= <rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.edu= <RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.edu= rodsGuys,I'm under the impression = Weight (hollow) + Increased Stiffness (taper & other methods) = fasterline speed. Have I been hanging out with the graphite guys = much?On another note, I hear the graphite rod manufactures = finally starting toslow their tapers down. Looks taper/action = coming around full circle.--Best ....but one thing I would like to add is that there is a perception = To most people casting the rod it feels like it is = Darryl ------=_NextPart_000_0027_01BE7C6E.16000760-- from rclarke@eou.edu Thu Apr 1 18:39:30 1999 16:49:01 -0800 "rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu" Subject: RE: Hollow rods How about a hollow built twisted rod? I think Tom Smithwick or Ralph Moon would be the best people to attemptit. Robert Clarke -----Original Message----- Subject: Hollow rods Guys,I'm under the impression that:Lighter Weight (hollow) + Increased Stiffness (taper & other methods) = afasterline speed. Have I been hanging out with the graphite guys too much? On another note, I hear the graphite rod manufactures are finally startingtoslow their tapers down. Looks taper/action design is coming around fullcircle. --Best Regards, Chris Wohlfordemail: chris@artistree.com ....but one thing I would like to add is that there is a perception that ahollow rod is stiffer because of the reduced weight. A hollow rod stopsandreverses direction quicker because it islighter. To most people casting the rod it feels like it is stiffer. Darryl from HomeyDKlown@worldnet.att.net Thu Apr 1 18:53:31 1999 with ESMTP id ;Fri, 2 Apr 1999 00:52:58 +0000 Subject: Re: Other Rod Building Lists Hey TF, There aren't any other lists that I know of that deal with rodmaking inother materials. I would suggest you lurk for a while. There are a lotof parallels here. I also don't think anyone here would mind answeringa basic graphite question or two (although I have been known to be wrongin the past ). You can also e-mail me offlist with any specific questions if you like. I'd be happy to help if I can... Dennis TF wrote: I am new to this list and I was wondering if there are any other rodbuilding lists that deal with rods other than bamboo? Thanks all. from anglport@con2.com Thu Apr 1 22:10:38 1999 Subject: Re: Other Rod Building Lists I sent this directly to the questioner, but there don't seem to be anyothers who know of these so I'm reposting it here.Art From: Art Port Subject: Re: Other Rod Building Lists Try: http://www.flyshop.com/Bulletin/rod_board.htmlhttp://www.Rodbuilding.com./http://members.xoom.com/mleider/rodlink2.html I think you'll find something of interest.Art At 02:30 PM 4/1/99 -0600, you wrote:I am new to this list and I was wondering if there are any other rodbuilding lists that deal with rods other than bamboo? Thanks all. from Nodewrrior@aol.com Thu Apr 1 23:50:36 1999 Subject: Re: dip tube cap Chris,Could you kindly describe in a little more depth the rubber cap with a hose clamp you mentioned? Varnish skin is one of my top 20 or so pet peeves. Thanks, Rob Hoffhines from iank@nelson.planet.org.nz Fri Apr 2 01:35:09 1999 sage.ts.co.nz with SMTP id TAA09471 for ;Fri, 2 Apr 199919:35:01 +1200 Subject: Re:rod marking pens There was some recent comment regarding pens/ink for writing on rods . I have recently used a "Artline" Drawing System felt tiped drafting pen forseveral rods and it is excellent. It is a specialist drafting pen , cost around $6 at a technical stationarysupplier , and I have used it on unvarnished bamboo, it did not show anytendancy to "bleed " into the bamboo, and on varnish where it took verywell. I use the 0.1 size , but it is available in a number of sizes. The description on the pen says it is pigment ink , water based , and ismade by Scachihata in Japan . Description EK-231. Iank from chris@artistree.com Fri Apr 2 02:06:00 1999 Subject: Re: rod marking pens mac-creator="4D4F5353" Ian,I know exactly what you mean. I am now using a similar felt tip pen aswell.It's called a "Millennium" by Zig, size 01, pigment ink, made in Japan.Excellent results. Bought it in a craft store in the wood crafts section ofallplaces. I have many brands of technical pens from my early career as adraftsmanand IMHO they don't work on bamboo nearly as well as these new small felttippens.--Regards, Chris Wohlfordemail: chris@artistree.com Ian Kearney wrote: There was some recent comment regarding pens/ink for writing on rods . I have recently used a "Artline" Drawing System felt tiped drafting penforseveral rods and it is excellent. It is a specialist drafting pen , cost around $6 at a technical stationarysupplier , and I have used it on unvarnished bamboo, it did not show anytendancy to "bleed " into the bamboo, and on varnish where it took verywell. I use the 0.1 size , but it is available in a number of sizes. The description on the pen says it is pigment ink , water based , and ismade by Scachihata in Japan . Description EK-231. Iank from sniderja@email.uc.edu Fri Apr 2 06:37:00 1999 Subject: Re: rod marking pens Will give these a try. My experiences with felt tip pens of the types thathave been described have all been disappointing. For me they do not givethe crisp edges to letters that "hard nosed" drafting pens give, and theink appears "dull." However, will give the Zig pen a try--anything to keep from cleaning those Rapidiograph tips (although they do letter nicely)!J. Snider. At 12:10 AM 4/2/99 +0000, Chris Wohlford wrote:Ian,I know exactly what you mean. I am now using a similar felt tip pen aswell.It's called a "Millennium" by Zig, size 01, pigment ink, made in Japan.Excellent results. Bought it in a craft store in the wood crafts sectionof allplaces. I have many brands of technical pens from my early career as adraftsmanand IMHO they don't work on bamboo nearly as well as these new smallfelt tippens.--Regards, Chris Wohlfordemail: chris@artistree.com Ian Kearney wrote: There was some recent comment regarding pens/ink for writing on rods. I have recently used a "Artline" Drawing System felt tiped drafting penforseveral rods and it is excellent. It is a specialist drafting pen , cost around $6 at a technical stationarysupplier , and I have used it on unvarnished bamboo, it did not show anytendancy to "bleed " into the bamboo, and on varnish where it took verywell. I use the 0.1 size , but it is available in a number of sizes. The description on the pen says it is pigment ink , water based , and ismade by Scachihata in Japan . Description EK-231. Iank from BThoman@neonsoft.com Fri Apr 2 08:51:15 1999 Subject: RE: Filtering Varnish Thanks to all for their replies. Brian from mcdowellc@lanecc.edu Fri Apr 2 10:25:37 1999 via smap (4.1) 8:27:40 PST Subject: Re: dip tube cap Rob, It's a flexible, rubber hood cap that fits over the tube. A.J. Thramer suggested I try it several months ago. I think it is called "Kwik Cap". I can't recall the manufacturer, but I bought mine at Home Depot. It has the shape of a thermos lid with a lip around the open base to keep the hose clamp from sliding off when it's not tight. The diameter is about 1/2"more then the dip tube in my case, and the caps come in a variety of diameters. When you tighten the hose clamp you get a good seal. The hose clamp acts as a belt around the waist of the cap. After sitting a while the top of the cap will actually recess into the tube a little, like a canning jar. It has never skimmed over, and I've left it sealed for up to a month at a time in a 72 degree room. The dip tube I use is one of those old "one size fits all" lightweight aluminum ribbed tubes. It has a plastic cap at the bottom and a plastic collar. I cut the collar off at the top and sealed the seam at the bottom with Devcon epoxy. Chris McDowellmcdowellc@lanecc.edu from rmoon@ida.net Fri Apr 2 12:07:59 1999 0000 Subject: Rod ID I just had a gentleman bring a rod to me for examination. It is a 12'3/2 calcutta sold as a Frost's Kelso. I know that Frost did not makerods, but sold them. Some of his rods were made by Divine and some byKosmic. The rod can be pretty well dated as 1895 to 1900. It has afull n/s slide band reel seat, good quality n/s ferrules (not the Kosmictype) and tunnel guides. Full intermediates but rather large nearly1/8" wide. One tip appears to be a factory replacement, and varies fromthe original in that the intermediates are only about 5-6 turns ofthread. My impression is that the rod looks more like divine thanKosmic, but it is my impression that the Kelso was the high end line forFrost. Any ideas and anyone want to take a flying leap on value. Therod is in good condition. No breaks no hook digs. It does appear thatsomeone has overcoated a few of the spots where the varnish has beenchipped, but the finish is in good condition. The man also had a rare reel. A Yawman and Erbe that is apparantly thefirst model of automatic in that it shows the patent dates of 1880 and1881 of Loomis Plumb and Company. I have pretty well established thatdate of the reel between 1885 and 1891. It is is perfecct workingorder. Any ideas of its value?? Thanks for any help Ralph from andrew_harsanyi@ibi.com Fri Apr 2 12:48:18 1999 0500 Subject: David LeClaire's phone Does anyone have David LeClaire's business telephone number? Thanksin advance... from jkallo@midwest.net Fri Apr 2 12:56:25 1999 Subject: Waves Hi all, I have a question for the list concerning the action of rods. I havenoticed that the tips of certain rods will, when cast, vibrate for a secondor two after the forward cast throwing a series of waves into the line.This is even more observable when taking these rods and giving them awiggle: some rods will come to rest almost as soon as your hand stopsmoving them while others will carry on the series of vibrations for acouple of seconds. I have seen this phenomenon in both plastic and cane--itdoesn't seem related to the material the rods are made from, in fact Ithink Orvis's Trident rods are supposed to be designed to eliminate justthis sort of thing. My question for the list is this: what causes a rod to continue vibratingafter hand motion ceases? I see several possibilities: 1. Craftsmanship: Somewhere in Garrison there is a passage about Garytaking all new rods out and casting them to see if they exhibit thistendency. Krieder says outright that accuracy in planing helps achieve a'good' rod--i.e. a rod which comes to rest quickly. (23)2. Materials: Perhaps internal inconsistencies in the cane allow theoscillations to occur?3. Taper: The rod I really noticed this in was Wayne's Force while my rodbuilt to Chris's Shennendoah Sweetheart comes to rest the quickest. Thetaper on these two rods is pretty similar, however. I have a really slowFenwick glass rod which comes to rest quickly while an Orvis Superfine Ifished recently would continue to vibrate for seconds4. Casting ability: I've noticed that I can actually cause some rods whichhave the tendency to wiggle after the forward cast to actually come torestmore quickly by using a more loose grip on the cork--I guess allowing myhand to dampen the motion. Sorry for the long-windedness but this is something I find veryinteresting. I'd rather fish a rod which comes to rest as quickly aspossible as it really seems to improve the accuracy of a cast as well assimply feeling more 'there'-- maybe this is what Krieder was talking aboutwhen he refers to a rod's "life" or "backbone." Best,Joe Joseph S. KalloDpt. of PhilosophySouthern Illinois University at Carbondale from rmoon@ida.net Fri Apr 2 14:11:18 1999 0000 Subject: Re: Waves Joe What a can of worms !!! This is the sort of discussion that can go on forever, but it is thekind I like. So here goes. Just some observations and no real data for support. 1. I have found the the modulus of elasticity plays a part. Generallythe higher the modulus the quicker recovery. I have found thatfiberglass rods generally are most prone to prolonged oscillation 2. I know design plays a major part 3. I know casting stroke plays a major part. I am going to tell you a couple of stories to let you know why I thinkso. I built an 8' rod once that had a rather fine tip. I was pleasedwith the rod. It threw a long line and the line left the rod straight.The guy who got the rod was distinctly unhappy. Why?? Every time hecast he cast a bundle of sine waves. I told him he was casting too hardand should relax and let the rod do the job. No help, yet I showed himthat it would cast a straight line. Culmination I had to make him abaseball sized tip that wouldn't deflect under his stroke. It ruinedthe rod. One of my early rods was an extreme parabolic 8' I loved it! I couldback cast, and read one of Lamb's essays before I had to start theforward cast. The line had a bow of only 8-10" and sped like a bullet.I had an accomplished casting instructor cast it, which he did in .3567Seconds. The line was all over him. After two more tries he turned tohe and said "No damned good" A good friend of mine tried it last summerfell in love with the rod and bought it against my protests. a fewweeks later at home he outcast a Sage and went well into the backingwith only a couple of false casts. Perhaps you can see why I think that we won't get the subject solved.. Ralph from hhholland@erols.com Fri Apr 2 14:38:32 1999 Subject: Re: David LeClaire's phone Dave's phone no. is 315-689-7896. He's home evenings and weekends.Hank H. -----Original Message----- Subject: David LeClaire's phone Does anyone have David LeClaire's business telephone number? Thanksinadvance... from chris@artistree.com Fri Apr 2 14:44:22 1999 Subject: Re: rod marking pens mac-creator="4D4F5353" Jerry,You might also want to try burnishing the area you intend to write on withthefinest steel wool. This seems to smooth out the surface and leave a slightoilyreside that fills in the pores? I used to rub a bit of olive oil in then Iswitched to the steel wool. It makes surface easier to write and clean upif youmake a mistake. Might not matter as much for block lettering but I'mlettering ina script. Hope it works for you. --Best Regards, Chris Wohlfordemail: chris@artistree.com Jerry Snider wrote: Will give these a try. My experiences with felt tip pens of the types thathave been described have all been disappointing. For me they do not givethe crisp edges to letters that "hard nosed" drafting pens give, and theink appears "dull." However, will give the Zig pen a try--anything to keep from cleaning those Rapidiograph tips (although they do letter nicely)!J. Snider. from TSmithwick@aol.com Fri Apr 2 14:52:56 1999 Subject: Re: Waves jkallo@midwest.net In a message dated 4/2/99 8:13:17 PM, rmoon@ida.net wrote: I don't think so either, but for what it's worth I also think it is a function of material, taper and casting technique. For example, whencasting my Garrison tapers, I get the little single wave he talks about in the book, and I can't make it go away no matter what I do. But when casting thehollow built DeLespinay, which is very stout, I can't get the wave if I try. In this case it's the taper.Joe, the technique of relaxing the hand to help the rod damp is animportant one, you should be doing it all the time. Your grip should gradually tighten as you make a power stroke, but as soon as you stop the rod, your handshould relax a bit. This will help damp the rod, and also keep your arm from becoming tired. The best explanation I have ever seen of muscle control in casting is in Charles Ritz's "A Flyfisher's Life". I highly recommend it. from jaquin@netsync.net Fri Apr 2 19:29:59 1999 Subject: Re: Waves Joseph S.Kallo wrote: Hi all, I have a question for the list concerning the action of rods. I havenoticed that the tips of certain rods will, when cast, vibrate for asecondor two after the forward cast throwing a series of waves into the line.This is even more observable when taking these rods and giving them awiggle: some rods will come to rest almost as soon as your hand stopsmoving them while others will carry on the series of vibrations for acouple of seconds. I have seen this phenomenon in both plastic and cane--itdoesn't seem related to the material the rods are made from, in fact Ithink Orvis's Trident rods are supposed to be designed to eliminate justthis sort of thing. My question for the list is this: what causes a rod to continue vibratingafter hand motion ceases? I see several possibilities: 1. Craftsmanship: Somewhere in Garrison there is a passage about Garytaking all new rods out and casting them to see if they exhibit thistendency. Krieder says outright that accuracy in planing helps achieve a'good' rod--i.e. a rod which comes to rest quickly. (23)2. Materials: Perhaps internal inconsistencies in the cane allow theoscillations to occur?3. Taper: The rod I really noticed this in was Wayne's Force while my rodbuilt to Chris's Shennendoah Sweetheart comes to rest the quickest. Thetaper on these two rods is pretty similar, however. I have a really slowFenwick glass rod which comes to rest quickly while an Orvis SuperfineIfished recently would continue to vibrate for seconds4. Casting ability: I've noticed that I can actually cause some rods whichhave the tendency to wiggle after the forward cast to actually come torestmore quickly by using a more loose grip on the cork--I guess allowing myhand to dampen the motion. Sorry for the long-windedness but this is something I find veryinteresting. I'd rather fish a rod which comes to rest as quickly aspossible as it really seems to improve the accuracy of a cast as well assimply feeling more 'there'-- maybe this is what Krieder was talkingaboutwhen he refers to a rod's "life" or "backbone." Best,Joe Joseph S. KalloDpt. of PhilosophySouthern Illinois University at Carbondalehi joe, your loose grip experimentation is interesting. it's justopposite of what the salt-water graphite boys have to say about roddampening. the quickest way to dampen the rod and not throw waves inyour line is to tighten your grip. of course they're throwing 8 t0 12wt lines or shooting heads long distances. but hey it works for them!jerry from jaquin@netsync.net Fri Apr 2 19:33:10 1999 Subject: Re: Waves Ralph W Moon wrote: Joe What a can of worms !!! This is the sort of discussion that can go on forever, but it is thekind I like. So here goes. Just some observations and no real data for support. 1. I have found the the modulus of elasticity plays a part. Generallythe higher the modulus the quicker recovery. I have found thatfiberglass rods generally are most prone to prolonged oscillation 2. I know design plays a major part 3. I know casting stroke plays a major part. I am going to tell you a couple of stories to let you know why I thinkso. I built an 8' rod once that had a rather fine tip. I was pleasedwith the rod. It threw a long line and the line left the rod straight.The guy who got the rod was distinctly unhappy. Why?? Every time hecast he cast a bundle of sine waves. I told him he was casting too hardand should relax and let the rod do the job. No help, yet I showed himthat it would cast a straight line. Culmination I had to make him abaseball sized tip that wouldn't deflect under his stroke. It ruinedthe rod. One of my early rods was an extreme parabolic 8' I loved it! I couldback cast, and read one of Lamb's essays before I had to start theforward cast. The line had a bow of only 8-10" and sped like a bullet.I had an accomplished casting instructor cast it, which he did in .3567Seconds. The line was all over him. After two more tries he turned tohe and said "No damned good" A good friend of mine tried it last summerfell in love with the rod and bought it against my protests. a fewweeks later at home he outcast a Sage and went well into the backingwith only a couple of false casts. Perhaps you can see why I think that we won't get the subject solved.. Ralphhi ralph wonderful story! how about posting the dimensions for thatrod. i assumed you built another one! tia jerry from saweiss@flash.net Fri Apr 2 20:39:12 1999 Subject: Re: Waves Hi all, I have a question for the list concerning the action of rods. I havenoticed that the tips of certain rods will, when cast, vibrate for a secondor two after the forward cast throwing a series of waves into the line. Group,No one yet has commented on changing line weight. Several rods that Icast(a couple of mine included) that cast waves off the tip responded verywellwhen I increased the line one weight. Even became dramatically better,casttighter loops with higher lines speed and less casting force required.Any comments on matching line weight? This undoubtedly is a variableassociated with casting style as well.Steve from rsgould@cmc.net Fri Apr 2 21:44:48 1999 Subject: Waves Hi Joe,The questions you pose about wave action and rod vibration are ones thathave plagued rod builders for years. One of the advantages of using bambooin the first place was to utilize its self dampening characteristics yetthe problem persists. I'd like to refer you to two articles addressing thisproblem at least in part. The first is "The Masters Guide to Building aBamboo Fly Rod" on pages 272-277 and the second is a short piece in mybook"Constructing Cane Rods:..." on page 34. The essence is that the situationcan be addressed by the taper design and though it may seem a bit complexthe solutions are not too difficult. Basically the correction seems to beto choose a stress curve that is a light parabolic or something closer tothe straight line stress curve. You can select the type of stress curve youwant very nicely by inputing the appropriate stresses when using WayneCattanach's rod design program. The result will be a reduction orelimination of the wave action.Ray from dpeaston@wzrd.com Sat Apr 3 09:32:33 1999 Subject: Re: Waves At 07:44 PM 4/2/1999 -0800, Ray Gould wrote:Hi Joe,The questions you pose about wave action and rod vibration are ones thathave plagued rod builders for years. One of the advantages of usingbambooin the first place was to utilize its self dampening characteristics yetthe problem persists. I'd like to refer you to two articles addressing thisproblem at least in part. The first is "The Masters Guide to Building aBamboo Fly Rod" on pages 272-277 and the second is a short piece in mybook"Constructing Cane Rods:..." on page 34. The essence is that the situationcan be addressed by the taper design and though it may seem a bitcomplexthe solutions are not too difficult. Basically the correction seems to beto choose a stress curve that is a light parabolic or something closer tothe straight line stress curve. You can select the type of stress curve youwant very nicely by inputing the appropriate stresses when using WayneCattanach's rod design program. The result will be a reduction orelimination of the wave action.Ray GLUE? Do the new plastic glues reduce the damping or increase it? Seemstome the harder the glue, eg. some epoxies, the worse the waves. Wholethingshould be temperature dependant. Higher tempe better damping. JMHO,-DougDoug EastonTonawanda, NY from WmFMack@aol.com Sat Apr 3 15:42:41 1999 Subject: Re: Slapping cane Do you slap it down like you are stopping a cast at the surface of thetable? from stpete@netten.net Sat Apr 3 15:53:31 1999 Subject: Lathe newbie OK, I've gone and done it! I got tired of seeing beautiful rods that tookoff to the left or right at the ferrule due to hand fitting the ferrules(I'm not a patient man). After searching the archives for informatinoand the want ads for lathes, I broke down and bought one. I just camehome from the Grizzly Imports Distribution Center in Memphis with a7"x10" mini- lathe. It's the same one that Harbor Freight sells for$399. Grizzly has them on close out for $349 and I picked up a returnedunit for $244 new. The archives listed a thread that had a hobbyist's evaluation of thethis same unit from when he first set it up and used it. He also hadanother evaluation of it a year later. He had good things to say aboutit overall. The owner returned this particular unit because the head stock andtailstock did not line up well at all. I took the tailstock off andlooked under the slide 'V' and found a 1/8" thick wad of what appearedto be polishing compound stuck to the metal. I picked that off with myfingernail, stuck the tailstock back on, tightened it, and voila! itlined up perfectly to the naked eye. I talked to a tech in their PAcenter, he says you just about have to fine tune the things anyway. My questions: (1) does anyone recommend a good book to get started on running a metallathe? I have an old South bend book. (2) any other advice or website info on getting started? (3) what tool does one use to turn down ferrule stations? (4) anyone else use this lathe - any other tips? (5) how would you finish trueing up the headstock to the tailstock? Thanks, Rick C. from rsgould@cmc.net Sat Apr 3 19:07:16 1999 Subject: Glue effect on waves Hi Doug, You pose an interesting question as to the effect of a particular glue onthe wave propagation for a rod section. I suspect a glue that has elasticproperties close to that of the cane itself would be the most desireable,so that the tendency of the strips to slide past each other under loadwould be uniform with that of the cane. I suppose testing would be verydifficult although one might rig up a bench deflection test and check thenatural frequency of vibration for identical sections using various glues. from my observations I'm going to stay with Urac 185 for all the otherreasons such as color, hardness compatibility, strength, water resistance,and a long history of success.Ray from rcurry@ttlc.net Sat Apr 3 20:10:25 1999 (SMTPD32-5.01 EVAL) id A9F728BC0106; Sat, 03 Apr 1999 21:09:59 EST Subject: Re: Slapping cane Bill,I took the section by the butt and used a good forearm swing, todevelop centrifugal force. In the final few inches making sure it is almostparallel to the table before releasing it; the butt should strike first,but not by much, just a hair. This was the way I was told by an oldtimerthat it was done, and it works. If there is a slight bow to one side afterthefirstthrow, turn it 90 degrees (so that the bow is down) and do it again.Best regards,Reed WmFMack@aol.com wrote: Do you slap it down like you are stopping a cast at the surface of thetable? from chris@artistree.com Sun Apr 4 01:27:40 1999 Subject: Re: Lathe newbie mac-creator="4D4F5353" Rick,Good for you. Go tohttp://www.artistree.com/SplitCaneLibrary/videos.htmand scroll down to "Other" to locate the U.S Army Manual on setting up andusing a lathe. One of the best intro guides I've ever seen. Regards,Chris Rick Crenshaw wrote: (2) any other advice or website info on getting started? from rmoon@ida.net Sun Apr 4 10:15:11 1999 0000 Subject: quiet? Just wondering if I have been bumped or if everybody is just quiet?Ralph from RVenneri@aol.com Sun Apr 4 10:19:48 1999 Subject: Re: quiet? Ralph,It is very quiet. But I got your post. I thought I was bumped too. Happy Easter to all.Best regards,Bob VVenneri's21 Chuck Hill RdSaugerties NY 12477rvenneri@aol.com914 246 5882http://hometown.aol.com/RVenneri/index.html from cotner@novagate.com Sun Apr 4 10:43:24 1999 Subject: Re: quiet? Ralph - Your message came through for me so you must not be bumped. Easter,looming tax deadlines, etc., may cut into the list's participationtoday.Regards,Roger CotnerGrand Haven, Michigan Ralph W Moon wrote: Just wondering if I have been bumped or if everybody is just quiet?Ralph from maxs@geocities.co.jp Sun Apr 4 11:10:36 1999 bysv01.geocities.co.jp (8.9.3+3.2W/3.7W) with ESMTP id BAA08725; Mon, 5Apr 1999 01:10:22 +0900(JST) mail.geocities.co.jp (1.3G-8.9.3/GeocitiesJ-3.0) with ESMTP id BAA18058;Mon, 5 Apr 199901:10:21 +0900 (JST) Subject: Re: quiet? Ralph, I received your message. You may not be bumped but list is just quiet.Max Ralph W Moon wrote: Just wondering if I have been bumped or if everybody is just quiet?Ralph -- Max Satohan Oriental Bamboo Fly Rod Crafteremail: maxs@geocities.co.jpHome Page:http://www.geocities.co.jp/Colosseum- Acropolis/2169http://members.tripod.com/~maxrod from LECLAIR123@aol.com Sun Apr 4 11:39:09 1999 Subject: Re: Lathe newbie Rick,The best way to true the tail stock to the head stock is,to mount a bar into the lathe, steel, N/S or Brass, doesn'tmatter. Turn the length of bar from end to end. Measure the bar at both ends. If the right side is Smaller than the left sideadjust the tail stock away from you. If the right side is largerthan the left side, adjust the tail stock towards you. Keepdoing this until Both ends are exactly the same diameter.There should be set screws on the front and back of thetail stock. By loosening one and tightening the other one,you can adjust the tail stock back and forth. This will line up the tail stock exactly with the head stock. Dave LeClair from LECLAIR123@aol.com Sun Apr 4 11:43:19 1999 Subject: Re: quiet? Ralph,I'm reading you OK. The list is a little slow today.I've only had around 15 e-mails. If you didn't get any, youmay have been bumped off. Try getting off the list and thensign back on. Dave L. from rmoon@ida.net Sun Apr 4 12:52:53 1999 Subject: Re: quiet? Dave I must be off. All I have received are answers to inquiry and theone message on Lathes that you sent out. I will try to unsubscribe andresubscribe. Thanks everybodyRalph from gaff@carol.net Sun Apr 4 13:13:14 1999 Sun, 4 Apr 1999 14:13:05 -0400 Subject: Re: quiet? Ralph W Moon wrote: Dave I must be off. All I have received are answers to inquiry and theone message on Lathes that you sent out. I will try to unsubscribe andresubscribe. Thanks everybodyRalphit appears that is all i recieved too- might be a slow day--wil from jczimny@dol.net Sun Apr 4 14:22:20 1999 0400 "stpete@netten.net","rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu" Subject: RE: Lathe newbie Right Dave. That is the time honored method of aligning head and tailstocks. HoweverBrownell's sells two buttons that make this process a snap. The operatorinserts the twobuttons between two centers then measures the diameter of the twobuttons together. Since thediameter of the buttons is exactly the same, any increase in the diametermeasured togetherindicates that the two stocks are out of alignment. The process is fast andvery accurate.John Z -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Lathe newbie Rick,The best way to true the tail stock to the head stock is,to mount a bar into the lathe, steel, N/S or Brass, doesn'tmatter. Turn the length of bar from end to end. Measure the bar at both ends. If the right side is Smaller than the left sideadjust the tail stock away from you. If the right side is largerthan the left side, adjust the tail stock towards you. Keepdoing this until Both ends are exactly the same diameter.There should be set screws on the front and back of thetail stock. By loosening one and tightening the other one,you can adjust the tail stock back and forth. This will line up the tail stock exactly with the head stock. Dave LeClair from gink@valint.net Sun Apr 4 17:42:29 1999 (206.107.176.142) Subject: Bas*tard Greetings Just looking in on all of you old folks. Paul Whitely and I (Mr. G.)have been out in the Rod Lab tweaking the New Bas*tard tapers that havemany interested. We are in production as we speak. We hope you allhave a great weekend and Easter. Incidentally, a picture of the firstBas*tard Bamboo Fly Rod will be on my web site soon. www.gink.comThanks all --- George & Paul -- Visit: http://www.gink.comhttp://www.xink.comhttp://www.rodbuilding.comhttp://www.rodbuilder.com All Writings & Rights Reserved1999 by George GehrkeNo writings or quotes may beused whole or in part withoutthe specific permission ofthis author. from rsgould@cmc.net Sun Apr 4 22:38:32 1999 Subject: Orvis Taper Thought you might like to add another taper to your collection. This one is made by Wes Jordan himself and is an impregnated rod with a cork gripwherethe diameter at the front is turned right down to the rod diameter and thereel seat is a standard Orvis down lock.0 - .0755 - .09410 - .11115 - .12220 - .13325 - .14130 - .15235 - .16440 - .18045 - .19750 - .20955 - .21860 - .23065 - .24570 - .262 extrapolated75 - .277 extrapolated79 - .292 extrapolatedIf you plot a graph of this data you'll see two little humps in the curvetypical of other Orvis rod I've checked. Ray from richjez@enteract.com Sun Apr 4 22:48:29 1999 Does anyone know where i can get a 60 degree rourter bit? ThanksRich Jezioro *________________________________)// Rich Jezioro @ /||/______/_||_________________________________________|| /\ / \ > > from iank@nelson.planet.org.nz Mon Apr 5 02:07:36 1999 sage.ts.co.nz with SMTP id TAA17689 for ;Mon, 5 Apr 199919:07:24 +1200 Subject: Re: Bas*tard Greetings LOL... now this should get the list humming when everyone returns fromtheirEaster break . Iank At 03:42 PM 4/04/99 -0700, Mr. G wrote:Just looking in on all of you old folks. Paul Whitely and I (Mr. G.)have been out in the Rod Lab tweaking the New Bas*tard tapers that havemany interested. We are in production as we speak. We hope you allhave a great weekend and Easter. Incidentally, a picture of the firstBas*tard Bamboo Fly Rod will be on my web site soon. www.gink.comThanks all --- George & Paul -- Visit: http://www.gink.comhttp://www.xink.comhttp://www.rodbuilding.comhttp://www.rodbuilder.com All Writings & Rights Reserved1999 by George GehrkeNo writings or quotes may beused whole or in part withoutthe specific permission ofthis author. from richard.nantel@videotron.ca Mon Apr 5 07:38:49 1999 Internet Mail Serversims.3.5.1998.03.08.20.27)with SMTP id forrodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu; Mon, Subject: RE: Hi Rich, I ordered mine from Lee Valley tools at 1 (800) 267-8767. The partnumberis: 16j14.01 and the cost was $23.75 Cdn, that's about $15.75 U.S. Richard -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Sunday, April 04, 1999 11:46 PM Subject: Does anyone know where i can get a 60 degree rourter bit?ThanksRich Jezioro*________________________________)// Rich Jezioro@ /||/______/_||_________________________________________||/\/ \ > > / \ > from emiller257@dataflo.net Mon Apr 5 08:05:05 1999 wddataflo.dataflo.net(8.8.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id IAA06114; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 08:18:00 -0500 Subject: Re: Bas*tard Greetings Ian Kearney wrote: LOL... now this should get the list humming when everyone returns fromtheirEaster break . Iank At 03:42 PM 4/04/99 -0700, Mr. G wrote:Just looking in on all of you old folks. Paul Whitely and I (Mr. G.)have been out in the Rod Lab tweaking the New Bas*tard tapers thathavemany interested. We are in production as we speak. We hope you allhave a great weekend and Easter. Incidentally, a picture of the firstBas*tard Bamboo Fly Rod will be on my web site soon. www.gink.comThanks all --- George & Paul -- Visit: http://www.gink.comhttp://www.xink.comhttp://www.rodbuilding.comhttp://www.rodbuilder.com All Writings & Rights Reserved1999 by George GehrkeNo writings or quotes may beused whole or in part withoutthe specific permission ofthis author. He sure has a pile of nerve.I think the best we could all do is ignore Mr. Bas*tard and let him go belly up with his tapers where they belong. Ed Miller. from jkallo@midwest.net Mon Apr 5 11:43:56 1999 Subject: ferrules Hey Tony, I am considering ordering four sets of ferrules from you for rods I have inprogress. I am wondering what sort of schedule you are working onnow(i.e.how long should it take for me to receive the ferrules in the central USafter placing the order). I would need two sets of 9/64, a set of 13/64,and a 14/64. I forgot to ask if you did them when we last conversed aboutthis but I'd a truncated size if you are able to make them that way. I'd beable to provide you a credit card for payment (easing the problem of theexchange rate). Thanks,Joe Joseph S. KalloDpt. of PhilosophySouthern Illinois University at Carbondale from BThoman@neonsoft.com Mon Apr 5 11:55:16 1999 Subject: Home Grown Bamboo I made a mention a while back about a guy I work with who said he hadlotsof bamboo growing at home in Pennsylvania. He came over last night andsawmy supply of bamboo and said that the stuff on his farm is identical. Itold him I wanted bamboo with node spacing from eight to twenty inchesandhe said none of it's really closer than a foot. His dad said they havestuff growing right now that is a minimum of three inches in diameter atthebase and over two inches at the top and that some is as high at 18 feetalthough it averages 15. His dad makes a fireline and burns the stuff, it'slike a weed! It was planted about ten years ago as cover for his ducks (he has a penwithevery puddle duck in N. America). He's going back home in two months andsaid he'll bring some back in the moving van. He's going to try to get hisdad to get some close up pictures to mail me. I told him that if it's whathe says it is that there will be a market for it. He said if his dad canget money for it he'll let it grow over 50-100 acres! When I find out moreI'll let you know. Brian ThomanThe Chattahoochee River Rod CompanyParker, Coloradohttp://www.bambooflyrods.com(303) 805-5733 from fbcwin@fsbnet.com Mon Apr 5 14:54:49 1999 (Post.Office MTA v3.1.2 release (PO205-101c) Mon, 5 Apr 1999 14:54:46 -0500 "rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu" Subject: Re: Home Grown Bamboo Brian,Here in Louisiana, bamboo grows wild - acres and acres of it. As youmightguess, there's a story here.About 18 months ago, I cut about a pickup truck sized load of the localcane. I thought I could make rod cases out of it if nothing else. The more Ilooked at it, the more suitable it seemed for rodmaking. It was 2"-3" indiameter, had beautiful color after drying, and what looked to me likesufficient power fibers to make a rod. The nodes were 6" - 16" in a 12footpiece.When the Southern Rodmakers Gathering got going last fall, I decided totake a little of the local cane with me so others might see it. Severalguysgathered around it and said they thought it would make a rod. Even thoughnoneof us could tell the Louisiana cane from Tonkin, apparently none of usreallyknew our cane.The instant Harold Demarest walked up and saw my cane, he said,"What'sthat?" Being naturally sarcastic, I said, "Bamboo, of course." Haroldimmediately said, "Well, it's not Tonkin Cane, and it's not going to be anygood manner totell me more than I every dreamed there was to know about Tonkin Cane.The local cane does make a nice rod case, but after Harold'sinstructions, Iprobably won't waste the time necessary to make a rod out of it. Yourcane maybe different, but I'd be suspicious. The best way to identify it is takesometo a local University and ask their plant folks for help.Just trying to help,Harry from Ed.Estlow@co.hennepin.mn.us Mon Apr 5 15:29:16 1999 1999 20:28:30 UT 16-1998)) id8625674A.007049B0 ; Mon, 5 Apr 1999 15:26:28 -0500 Subject: Re: Home Grown Bamboo Harry, At the risk of asking you to write a small novel to the list, could you giveashort explanation of Mr. Demarest's criteria for "good cane for makingrods" andwhy he found yours lacking? I'm sure I'm not the only one on the list who'scurious. As an addendum to the request, I believe I can recall a few others on thelistdiscussing making rods with other than Tonkin cane. Respectfully and only curious, and withBest regards,-Ed Estlow Harry Boyd on 04/05/99 02:54:36 PM Please respond to fbcwin@fsbnet.com cc: Subject: Re: Home Grown Bamboo Brian,Here in Louisiana, bamboo grows wild - acres and acres of it. As youmightguess, there's a story here.About 18 months ago, I cut about a pickup truck sized load of the localcane. I thought I could make rod cases out of it if nothing else. The more Ilooked at it, the more suitable it seemed for rodmaking. It was 2"-3" indiameter, had beautiful color after drying, and what looked to me likesufficient power fibers to make a rod. The nodes were 6" - 16" in a 12footpiece.When the Southern Rodmakers Gathering got going last fall, I decided totake a little of the local cane with me so others might see it. Severalguysgathered around it and said they thought it would make a rod. Even thoughnoneof us could tell the Louisiana cane from Tonkin, apparently none of usreallyknew our cane.The instant Harold Demarest walked up and saw my cane, he said,"What'sthat?" Being naturally sarcastic, I said, "Bamboo, of course." Haroldimmediately said, "Well, it's not Tonkin Cane, and it's not going to be anygood manner totell me more than I every dreamed there was to know about Tonkin Cane.The local cane does make a nice rod case, but after Harold'sinstructions, Iprobably won't waste the time necessary to make a rod out of it. Yourcane maybe different, but I'd be suspicious. The best way to identify it is takesometo a local University and ask their plant folks for help.Just trying to help,Harry from jkallo@midwest.net Mon Apr 5 16:09:24 1999 Subject: Sorry Old email+the reply button= stupid mistakes Joe Joseph S. KalloDpt. of PhilosophySouthern Illinois University at Carbondale from mschaffer@mindspring.com Mon Apr 5 16:13:14 1999 Subject: Doing it with sole. Ok guys, I know, bad pun but the list has been a little slow. Besides, I'ma rookie---that's my story and I'm sticking to it! :^) Anyway, I started to work on my hand plane blades last night using 400,600,and 1500 grit wet or dry sandpaper (used dry). Wow what a difference! Istill have to go at them with my wet stones, but I was wondering if thisshould also be the way to do the soles of the planes themselves, andshouldthe soles be taken all the way to 8000 grit on a wet stone. I didn't have apiece of glass to use as a backing plate so I used my surface plate which Iknow to be flat within .00001 inches. Any help would be muchoappreciated!! Mike Doc (Mike Shaffer)(mschaffer@mindspring.com) from brookie@frii.com Mon Apr 5 16:32:10 1999 Subject: One piece cane Hello rodmakers, I was looking in my file for this rodmakers list, searching for the postingaddress, and noted your listmeister has said, " there are no stupidquestions, just those not asked ... " . The problem is, I've not been onthe list very long, so imagine that this next two sets of questions HAVEbeen asked and discussed. Selfishly, would be interested in answers.If you prefer, drop me a private line. For those of you that have seenthis post on another list, apologies. First one, I'm the person that was in need to minor repair to a cane thathad separted from it's ferrule. Happy to report the fortunate conclusionto that story. I drove up to Mike Clark's place in Lyons this a.m. topick up my Constable. She's looking good and happy. So happy ? We'reheaded to the Vrain tomorrow. Tell you rightly, Mike did a nice job,pinned the ferrule back on, revarnished, and straightened the slight bendhe said I had in the upper section . Whatta deal . And for very cheapbill, and done quickly, a week. When I first called and got his assistanta week ago, she and I hadn't met, so she was giving me the standard rapthat it might be two months before he could get to it ... arrrgh. While there I was chatting with him about shorter cane rods. Asked himif he did the 6'6" size and he said, "yes, as matter of fact, there's anew one piece I'm working on ". It was 6'6" and 3 wt. and it was a beautyof a one piece !! I don't feel comfortable milling around in his shopbecause I know he's busy, and he and I know that *I* will never be able toafford one of his rods, but today, I managed a few extra minutes.Intrigued and knowing nothing about one pieces, I asked him for theadvantages. Quick answer : wonderful smooth casting, with no intermediary ferrule(s)to break the motion. Makes total sense to me. Some canes, move like abreeze, fluid, and should think a one piece would be perhaps more like that. "Disadvantage?", I ask. "Transporting it ", he says. "No kidding ! " Actually the same chap he is building the 6'6" for has another one, larger,one piece 5 wt 7'6". The smooth action intriques me though. He DID have some other onepiecersout front in the rack, but those things are old cane that sells for alotand I wouldn't dare pick it up and cast it. Not to say in thefuture I wouldn't. Why I remember just two years ago I was fretting andwhining about casting ANY cane ! and here I am now, with my favorite rodmade from panda-fodder ! :-))) Bottom line here ? What do some of you makers think of one piece canerods? Have any yourself, how do they fish ? As well as it sounds they might? As I said, private emails are fine. suecolorado, the northern tier from brookie@frii.com Mon Apr 5 16:38:57 1999 Subject: Replicating a cane, in the future And post number two :realizing that most canebuilders might at one timeor another 'copy'tapers and measurements of other makes, as well as coming up with theirown. looking down the line, if I should lose or break my cane, I'll kick myself find another of the original builder's rods in same model, size, etc. back to replication by another builder however -- this IS possible yes ?( rhetorical somewhat ). I guess the question would be, is it futile toexpect that although a builder would match the measurements/taper, thattherod would not be very close to the one I have ? things like hardware orthat particular cut of cane might affect it such that it would NOT performas I know the 'original' ? in the graphites I don't see that much difference between likemodels/weights. If I buy a 3 wt xyz, buy another a year later, same same,it WILL act and perform as the first one did. is it so with cane ? planning ahead, it wouldn't be a bad idea to put together some savings tohave a favorite cane replicated, BEFORE something untoward happens... suecolorado from rsgould@cmc.net Mon Apr 5 16:46:34 1999 Subject: Home Grown Bamboo Hi Harry,If you do go to the trouble of taking some of that Louisiana cane to alocal university for identification it might also be a good idea to asktheir engineering testing materials lab to run some tests for you todetermine the physical properties of the cane as compared to ArundinariaAmabalis. Have them test both and determine the density, hardness, thenumber of power fibers per square inch adjacent to the enamel, the tensilestrength and the modulus of elasticity. Then you could compare the twomaterials on a scientific basis.Ray from jpsnbs@erols.com Mon Apr 5 16:49:34 1999 Subject: Local Bamboo I started making rods in 1991 and to date only have completed 26 rods,however, the first four(4) I made were built using bamboo harvested fromMaryland. The exact species is unknown but I fish two of them exclusivelyand they are comparible to any I have made with Tonkin. Don't overlookother cane alternatives for those who are just starting out. You will savea few bucks, can proceed with a little for energy and confidence withoutfear of screwing up the few culms of tonkin you have and you will end upwith fishable and unique rods.Just my $.02Joe Swam from rsgould@cmc.net Mon Apr 5 17:13:17 1999 Subject: One piece rods Hi Sue,Glad to hear you have the old "Constable" repaired and back in actionagain. There's nothing quite as good as fishing with a favorite fly rod,it's kind of like putting on an old pair of slippers- they're justcomfortable!As to the one piece rod question it's true that the rod will flex a littlemore uniformly and will be a little lighter weight. The actual stresses inthe rod that are caused by the weight of ferrule are about 7% of the totalstress in the rod. So as far as stress is concerned it's not a big factorbut it is something. The portability factor is in my estimation much moreimportant. It is simply easier to deal with a rod case that's four to fourand one half feet long than one that's seven to nine foot long. I'mthinking of packing the vehicle for a trip, going back packing or going onan airplane. I do however make most of my rods with only one ferrule justto keep the weight down and for simplicity sake. What you have done hascaused me to think it is time we started work on some light weightferrules Ray from gwbarnes@gwi.net Mon Apr 5 17:30:53 1999 Subject: Old Time Reel Does anyone have any information on old Bishop Auckland Reels? I've notyet seen the one in question but it's reported to be all brass, acquiredat an estate auction in Massachusetts, probably 40 to 50 years ago. George from Paradise52@aol.com Mon Apr 5 17:50:45 1999 Subject: Re: Bas*tard Greetings Hum, Hum Hum!Mark from Paradise52@aol.com Mon Apr 5 17:53:41 1999 Subject: Re: Bas*tard Greetings All,I especially enjoyed the copyright notice!M. from SalarFly@aol.com Mon Apr 5 18:27:29 1999 Subject: Re: Home Grown Bamboo You won't know for sure until you try it. Do it! Darryl from FISHWOOL@aol.com Mon Apr 5 19:08:22 1999 Subject: Re: Re: Home Grown Bamboo rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu As Darryl says."Do it!". Joe Swam makes some nice rods and if he's madesome comparable to Tonkin, who knows,we might have a local source. Don't letthe "experts" deter you. Just my $.02,Hank W. from HomeyDKlown@worldnet.att.net Mon Apr 5 19:55:47 1999 with ESMTP id Subject: Low gloss finish Hi all, I know there has been some talk a while ago about tung oil finishes onbamboo rods. I think it was Darryl that said a customer told him to"call him after it was finished" when he showed him the tung oilfinish. Anyway... I am sitting here knocking down the gloss on the second coatof varnish on my first attempt and was wondering: Has anyone ever gone even used a satin varnish? Maybe it's just me, but I think that looksrather nice on a light colored rod like mine and you still get thequalities of a varnish finish. Just curious... TIA, Dennis from djk762@hotmail.com Mon Apr 5 22:30:17 1999 Mon, 05 Apr 1999 20:27:58 PDT Subject: Heat gun tempering oven. Rodmakers,I am in the planning stages of building a tempering oven that will utilize the heat gun that I will be using for node straightening. Any suggestions on design or comments about the concept of moving hot air Thanks all.Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com from WmFMack@aol.com Mon Apr 5 22:53:13 1999 Subject: Re: RE: Lathe newbie rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu One of the mail order catalogs I get advertises a two ended #2 Morse taper that is supposed to help you align the tail stock. Anyone have experience with one of those, pro or con? from jfoster@gte.net Mon Apr 5 23:19:56 1999 Subject: [Fwd: spinning rods 8 and 9 feet] boundary="------------4F17225131B1ACEEC025C048" This is a multi-part message in MIME format.-------------- 4F17225131B1ACEEC025C048 mac-creator="4D4F5353" --------------4F17225131B1ACEEC025C048 (InterMail v03.02.04 118 119) with ESMTP Mon, 5 Apr 1999 14:33:43 -0500 Organization: Rijksuniversiteit Groningen Subject: spinning rods 8 and 9 feet I am looking for a taper of a splitcane spinning rodof 8 feet, casting lures up to 15 grams and for a taper 9 feet splitcanespinning rod, casting up to 20 grams.Pezon et Michel is known for it's famous spinning rods, I am justlooking for tapers of this brand. Could you help me?I can get you some interesting tapers back. 5 feet 1-pcs #3/4. regards from the Netherlands, L.H.Design bamboo flyrods titanium flyreels, Leen Huisman. E-mail: L.H.flyrod_reel@freemail.com.au --------------4F17225131B1ACEEC025C048-- from bmayer@teleport.com Tue Apr 6 00:15:15 1999 (216.26.60.93) Subject: An EC Edwards Anyone know where I can find an EC Edwards Mod 71 8 1/2' 3 piece rod? Ibought one from the widow of Mike Kennedy, a well known Northwest flyfisherman who had a fine collection of cane rods. This was a rod Iprized for its performance and character and that it belonged to Mikealthough Ruthie fished it more than he did. I seem to have lost it lastsummer as it has turned up missing from my small collection and I wouldlike to replace the cane at least, if not the history. Would appreciateany leads.Please respond to my email as I will be signing off the list for a weekof vacation.Barry Mayer from chris@artistree.com Tue Apr 6 01:40:27 1999 Subject: Re: Heat gun tempering oven. mac-creator="4D4F5353" David,I'm of the school of thought that the Hot Air method is (IMHO) the bestway to evenly treat cane. There are virtually no hot spots because theair is constantly moving much like a convection oven. But having nowsaid that I would caution you that there is a potential hot spot inthese hot air type ovens. This hot spot can exist inside the chamber atthe point where the air exits the oven (the exhaust pipe area if youwish). The hot air can be backed up here while trying to escape throughthe narrower exhaust pipe. So you might want to do one of the following:1) Incorporate an extra 6" to 8" of length to the exhaust end of theoven where the cane would not be placed.2) Design a funnel shaped end piece leading to the exhaust pipe (againthe cane would not be placed in this area).3) Use a larger exhaust pipe or one that provides an adjustable output.4) Rotate the cane end to end while treating and count on your goodluck. Just some ideas and I personally use #1 above. Hope this is some help toyou. Chris Wohlfordemail: chris@artistree.com David Kashuba wrote: Rodmakers,I am in the planning stages of building a tempering oven that willutilize the heat gun that I will be using for node straightening. Anysuggestions on design or comments about the concept of moving hot air from gink@valint.net Tue Apr 6 01:58:21 1999 (206.107.176.165) Subject: First Production 7.5' 4WT Tip! boundary="------------9AF79ED4E1DC9D579583E2D8" --------------9AF79ED4E1DC9D579583E2D8 _________ Ladies & Gentlemen: A dream has come true. By the clock, ittook exactly 1:31 minutes from start of splitting, to finished gluingand racked to dry, Mr. Paul Whitely and Mr. George Gehrke, President ofthe Bastard Bamboo Fly Rod Company, made George's first tip for the 7.5'4 WT Bastard. It was so easy that the astronomical savings in laborwill be a direct benefit to all Americans who have always wanted to owna bamboo fly rod but couldn't because of their high cost. [Image] This particular taper is one of many in the archive files of the newBastard Bamboo Fly Rod Company. It is only one of many that we believehave been long overdue to the American Sportsmen abroad the landscapesof this world. The particular trademark or personality of Bastard Fly Rods will be theestablishment of their very firm and fast actions. Tomorrow morning wewill be applying our new 'Signature Wraps' that will identify us forwhat we are. Who has more fun then people? Mr. G.-- http://www.rodbuilder.com All Writings & Rights Reserved1999 by George GehrkeNo writings or quotes may beused whole or in part withoutthe specific permission ofthis author outside this group. --------------9AF79ED4E1DC9D579583E2D8 boundary="------------B75AAE97D230BCE276D2D58F" --------------B75AAE97D230BCE276D2D58F finished gluing and racked to dry, Mr. Paul Whitely and Mr. George Gehrke,President of the Bastard Bamboo Fly Rod Company, made George's first tip savingsin labor will be a direct benefit to all Americans who have always wantedto own a bamboo fly rod but couldn't because of their high cost. This particular taper is one of many in the archive files of the new believehave been long overdue to the American Sportsmen abroad the landscapesof this world.The particular trademark or personality of Bastard Fly Rods will be morningwe will be applying our new 'Signature Wraps' that will identify us forwhat we are.Who has more fun then people?Mr. G.-- http://www.rodbuilder.comAll Writings & Rights Reserved© 1999 by George GehrkeNo writings or quotes may beused whole or in part withoutthe specific permission ofthis author outside this group. --------------B75AAE97D230BCE276D2D58F --------------B75AAE97D230BCE276D2D58F-- --------------9AF79ED4E1DC9D579583E2D8-- from stpete@netten.net Tue Apr 6 04:12:32 1999 Tue, 6 Apr 1999 04:16:33 -0500 Subject: Re: Heat gun tempering oven. David, Check the archives for last year. It's easy with Frank Stetzer's newsearch engine. There are good descriptions of how to build a hot airoven. I built a simple one with 6" and 4" duct pipe from the local HomeDepot. Wrap that puppy in insulation and it does a pretty fair job ofmaintaining an even temperature. Rick C. David Kashuba wrote: Rodmakers,I am in the planning stages of building a tempering oven that willutilize the heat gun that I will be using for node straightening. Anysuggestions on design or comments about the concept of moving hot air Thanks all.Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com from stpete@netten.net Tue Apr 6 04:13:34 1999 Tue, 6 Apr 1999 04:17:35 -0500 Subject: Re: Lathe newbie WmFMack, I have no experience with this product and I am as green as they comewith this piece of equipment. Rick C. WmFMack@aol.com wrote: One of the mail order catalogs I get advertises a two ended #2 Morsetaperthat is supposed to help you align the tail stock. Anyone have experiencewith one of those, pro or con? from maxs@geocities.co.jp Tue Apr 6 04:55:06 1999 bysv01.geocities.co.jp (8.9.3+3.2W/3.7W) with ESMTP id SAA25136; Tue, 6Apr 1999 18:55:02 +0900(JST) mail.geocities.co.jp (1.3G-8.9.3/GeocitiesJ-3.0) with ESMTP id SAA01834;Tue, 6 Apr 199918:55:01 +0900 (JST) Subject: Re: First Production 7.5' 4WT Tip! TO Whom you say Mr. G, Who are you talking to?This is a rodmakers list, where we exchange the rod making ideas.If you want to sell your rod, go out to a different place. List doesnot permit to make business, make commercial here.If you want to contribute to this list, please post a meaningful orhelpful idea for us.I am not interested in your post. Max Mr. G wrote: _________ Ladies & Gentlemen: A dream has come true. By the clock,it took exactly 1:31 minutes from start of splitting, to finishedgluing and racked to dry, Mr. Paul Whitely and Mr. George Gehrke,President of the Bastard Bamboo Fly Rod Company, made George's firsttip for the 7.5' 4 WT Bastard. It was so easy that the astronomicalsavings in labor will be a direct benefit to all Americans who havealways wanted to own a bamboo fly rod but couldn't because of theirhigh cost. [Image] This particular taper is one of many in the archive files of the newBastard Bamboo Fly Rod Company. It is only one of many that webelieve have been long overdue to the American Sportsmen abroad thelandscapes of this world. The particular trademark or personality of Bastard Fly Rods will bethe establishment of their very firm and fast actions. Tomorrowmorning we will be applying our new 'Signature Wraps' that will Who has more fun then people? Mr. G.-- -- Max Satohan Oriental Bamboo Fly Rod Crafteremail: maxs@geocities.co.jpHome Page:http://www.geocities.co.jp/Colosseum- Acropolis/2169http://members.tripod.com/~maxrod from jcbyrd@direct-pest.com Tue Apr 6 05:37:08 1999 with SMTP(MDaemon.v2.7.SP6i.R) for ; Tue, 06 Apr1999 06:36:47 -0400 Subject: Re: First Production 7.5' 4WT Tip! boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000B_01BE7FF7.CCD03780" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000B_01BE7FF7.CCD03780 This is the exact reason I quit reading ROFF. As Max said this is a = There are many quality rod builders who participate on this list whom do =not try to sell their rods or products to other members. If you want to participate on this list I would recommend the following: 1. Send all your text in plain form not html.2. Do not send file attachments.3. Quit trying to sell your products here.4. Sit back and learn for a while.5. Quit SPAMMING Sent: Tuesday, April 06, 1999 2:58 AMSubject: First Production 7.5' 4WT Tip! _________ Ladies & Gentlemen: A dream has come true. By the clock, =it took exactly 1:31 minutes from start of splitting, to finished gluing =and racked to dry, Mr. Paul Whitely and Mr. George Gehrke, President of =the Bastard Bamboo Fly Rod Company, made George's first tip for the 7.5' =4 WT Bastard. It was so easy that the astronomical savings in labor =will be a direct benefit to all Americans who have always wanted to own= This particular taper is one of many in the archive files of the new =Bastard Bamboo Fly Rod Company. It is only one of many that we believe =have been long overdue to the American Sportsmen abroad the landscapes = The particular trademark or personality of Bastard Fly Rods will be =the establishment of their very firm and fast actions. Tomorrow morning=we will be applying our new 'Signature Wraps' that will identify us for = ------=_NextPart_000_000B_01BE7FF7.CCD03780 There are many quality rod builders who participate on this list = not try to sell their rods or products to other members. following: html. here. ----- Original Message ----- Mr. G = Sent: Tuesday, April 06, 1999 = AMSubject: First Production 7.5' = Tip! dream = splitting, to finished gluing and racked to dry, Mr. Paul Whitely and = George Gehrke, President of the Bastard Bamboo Fly Rod Company, made = astronomical savings in labor will be a direct benefit to all = have always wanted to own a bamboo fly rod but couldn't because of = This particular taper is one of many in the archive files of the = have been long overdue to the American Sportsmen abroad the landscapes= The particular trademark or personality of Bastard Fly Rods will be = will be applying our new 'Signature Wraps' that will identify us for = = All Writings & Rights Reserved =A9 1999 by George Gehrke = writings or quotes may be used whole or in part without the = ------=_NextPart_000_000B_01BE7FF7.CCD03780-- from gaff@carol.net Tue Apr 6 06:10:49 1999 Subject: Re: First Production 7.5' 4WT Tip! Max Satoh wrote: TO Whom you say Mr. G, Who are you talking to?This is a rodmakers list, where we exchange the rod making ideas.If you want to sell your rod, go out to a different place. List doesnot permit to make business, make commercial here.If you want to contribute to this list, please post a meaningful orhelpful idea for us.I am not interested in your post. Max Mr. G wrote:max,don't beat around the bush max. tell us what you think about the bastard(rod)advertisment.wil from iank@nelson.planet.org.nz Tue Apr 6 06:51:04 1999 sage.ts.co.nz with SMTP id XAA07827; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 23:50:51 +1200 Subject: Re: Heat gun tempering oven. David, I used the basic design as shown in the "Best of Planning Form".Modifications included :- as has been suggested , putting an aditional larger diameter pipe forinsulation ( with fibreglass insulation in the gap), this raised thetemperature in the "cooking" tube by about 50 degrees.- adding a 1 inch diameter pipe about 3'6" long which the nozzle ofthe heat gun is put into so that the hot air is delivered near the bottom ofthe "cooking" pipe. This had the affect of making the temperature in thecooking pipe much more even from top to bottom , but I still turn thestripshalf way through the cooking time . - My oven starts to turn the cane very very black after about 9 minutes ,and I have now settled on 7.5 minutes which is less then somerecommendations , but quite close to Garrison's suggestions. regards Iank- At 08:27 PM 5/04/99 PDT, David Kashuba wrote:Rodmakers,I am in the planning stages of building a tempering oven that will utilize the heat gun that I will be using for node straightening. Any suggestions on design or comments about the concept of moving hot air Thanks all.Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com from iank@nelson.planet.org.nz Tue Apr 6 06:51:04 1999 sage.ts.co.nz with SMTP id XAA07813; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 23:50:48 +1200 Subject: Re: Old Time Reel George, Bishop Auckland ( sometimes spelt Aukland) was started by an Englishfishingtackle maker William Cummins in 1857. The firm went out of existanceabout1960. I have seen a number of flyboxes with the Bishop Auckland nameonly ,but reels tend also to have the Cummins name on them. If there is an address of the maker on the reel I can probably give you arough idea of the age . Iank At 06:31 PM 5/04/99 -0400, George Barnes wrote:Does anyone have any information on old Bishop Auckland Reels? I've notyet seen the one in question but it's reported to be all brass, acquiredat an estate auction in Massachusetts, probably 40 to 50 years ago. George from maxs@geocities.co.jp Tue Apr 6 07:07:07 1999 bysv01.geocities.co.jp (8.9.3+3.2W/3.7W) with ESMTP id VAA03684; Tue, 6Apr 1999 21:06:58 +0900(JST) mail.geocities.co.jp (1.3G-8.9.3/GeocitiesJ-3.0) with ESMTP id VAA16237;Tue, 6 Apr 199921:06:57 +0900 (JST) Subject: Re: First Production 7.5' 4WT Tip! Wil, As I said, I am not interested in your advertisement. I am just making my own bamboo rods by receiving many helpful advisesoffriends in US.Since I make my own rods, I have no need to purchase a rod because of low price.Cheap and machine cut rod is not the subject of mine. I respect realworkmanship of such professionals who spent his/her time to learn andmake a quality and beautiful product. There is such a tradition to love excelllent workmanship or art here inJapan. I may buy such a person's specialties and techniques even if itsexpensive. I am not interested in an expensive machine cut rod either. As for the advertisement, there should be no one who does it onthe list. Max w.d. gatliff wrote: Max Satoh wrote: TO Whom you say Mr. G, Who are you talking to?This is a rodmakers list, where we exchange the rod making ideas.If you want to sell your rod, go out to a different place. List doesnot permit to make business, make commercial here.If you want to contribute to this list, please post a meaningful orhelpful idea for us.I am not interested in your post. Max Mr. G wrote:max,don't beat around the bush max. tell us what you think about the bastard(rod)advertisment.wil -- Max Satohan Oriental Bamboo Fly Rod Crafteremail: maxs@geocities.co.jpHome Page:http://www.geocities.co.jp/Colosseum- Acropolis/2169http://members.tripod.com/~maxrod from channer@hubwest.com Tue Apr 6 07:35:29 1999 (SMTPD32-4.06) id AFF155C01C8; Tue, 06 Apr 1999 06:37:05 MST Subject: replies Guys;Before we all flood this list with replies to a certain post, might Isuggest that any replies be sent direct to the original sender. It mightalso help if the list guys send him a copy of the list's rules ofetiquette, he doesn't seem to have paid attention when he subscribed.John from cbogart@shentel.net Tue Apr 6 07:52:53 1999 "HomeyDKlown@worldnet.att.net" Subject: Re: Low gloss finish DennisYou will find out that just about everything you can think of hasbeen tried before as a finish at one time or the other. If you do not like a high gloss - then use Paraffin Oil and Rottenstoneon a felt block and you can rub out the gloss - then you can wax or polishtothe sheen you like. If you like tung oil - try Moser's tung oil varnishes for a hand rubfinish.Use the high gloss for a really nice finish - also works well on silk lines. Iuse it Chris On Mon, 05 Apr 1999 21:09:40 -0700, Dennis Haftel wrote: Hi all, I know there has been some talk a while ago about tung oil finishes onbamboo rods. I think it was Darryl that said a customer told him to"call him after it was finished" when he showed him the tung oilfinish. Anyway... I am sitting here knocking down the gloss on the second coatof varnish on my first attempt and was wondering: Has anyone ever gone even used a satin varnish? Maybe it's just me, but I think that looksrather nice on a light colored rod like mine and you still get thequalities of a varnish finish. Just curious... TIA, Dennis Regards Chris from SSteinzor@atg.state.vt.us Tue Apr 6 08:36:40 1999 Tue, 6 Apr 1999 09:36:36 -0400 rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: RE: Doing it with sole. I used the wet/dry sandpaper method on the plane sole before I started onmyblade. I could not believe how quick and easy it was to get a uniformmirror-like finish over the entire surface. Sounds like your surface plateshould be fine. I used an old piece of marble countertop. I think the main throat, so as to reduce the risk of tear-out. Also, a flat sole is a slicksole, but I think this is a secondary factor because when you're planing abamboo strip you're in contact with so little of the sole there shouldn't bemuch resistance - for a contrast, try planing a tabletop smooth with anold,untuned jack plane and you'll see what I mean! -----Original Message-----From: michael w. shaffer [SMTP:mschaffer@mindspring.com]Sent: Monday, April 05, 1999 5:14 PM Subject: Doing it with sole. Ok guys, I know, bad pun but the list has been a little slow. Besides,I'ma rookie---that's my story and I'm sticking to it! :^) Anyway, I started to work on my hand plane blades last night using 400,600,and 1500 grit wet or dry sandpaper (used dry). Wow what a difference! Istill have to go at them with my wet stones, but I was wondering if thisshould also be the way to do the soles of the planes themselves, andshouldthe soles be taken all the way to 8000 grit on a wet stone. I didn't haveapiece of glass to use as a backing plate so I used my surface plate whichIknow to be flat within .00001 inches. Any help would be muchoappreciated!! Mike Doc (Mike Shaffer)(mschaffer@mindspring.com) from tyoung@perth.dialix.com.au Tue Apr 6 09:47:31 1999 Tue, 6 Apr 1999 22:46:44 +0800 (WST)(envelope- from tyoung@perth.dialix.com.au) Subject: Re: First Production 7.5' 4WT Tip! wugate.wustl.edu id JAA01398 Mr G., we're all interested in the rods and all but could you please not postimages on the list. On Mon, 5 Apr 1999, Mr. G wrote: _________ Ladies & Gentlemen: A dream has come true. By the clock,ittook exactly 1:31 minutes from start of splitting, to finished gluingand racked to dry, Mr. Paul Whitely and Mr. George Gehrke, President ofthe Bastard Bamboo Fly Rod Company, made George's first tip for the 7.5'4 WT Bastard. It was so easy that the astronomical savings in laborwill be a direct benefit to all Americans who have always wanted to owna bamboo fly rod but couldn't because of their high cost. [Image] This particular taper is one of many in the archive files of the newBastard Bamboo Fly Rod Company. It is only one of many that we believehave been long overdue to the American Sportsmen abroad the landscapesof this world. The particular trademark or personality of Bastard Fly Rods will be theestablishment of their very firm and fast actions. Tomorrow morningwewill be applying our new 'Signature Wraps' that will identify us forwhat we are. Who has more fun then people? Mr. G.-- http://www.rodbuilder.com All Writings & Rights Reserved1999 by George GehrkeNo writings or quotes may beused whole or in part withoutthe specific permission ofthis author outside this group. /***********************************************************************/ Q. How many cockroaches does it take to change a lightbulb? A. Nobody knows, they all scatter when the light goes on. A Bug's Life. Tony Younghttp://www.iinet.net.au/~mainpeak/flyrod.html /***********************************************************************/ from sshorb@ozip.net Tue Apr 6 10:41:01 1999 Tue, 6 Apr 1999 10:43:42 -0500 Subject: Re: First Production 7.5' 4WT Tip! Mr. G.;I am interested in the methods you used to complete it so quickly. Didyou make or purchase your tooling? Did you heat treat the rough stripsprior to final planing? What kind of oven? In fact, did you final planethe strips before glue up, if so what kind of plane did you use? Whatglue did you use? Which binder? Where did you get your bamboo? Did youhave trouble with the nodes or blank straightness? What kind of problemsdid you have and what were the fixes? How many attempts did it take tocome up with something acceptable? What kind of hardware are you goingto use? What finish is going to be applied and how? What taper did youdecide to use and where did you get it? I am asking these questionsbecause I'm new at this art also and this list is where I go to get thistype of question answered, tell of my achievements, admit my failures,and make suggestions when I feel I can contribute something useful;where I'm at in the learning process. So, I'm happy to hear you finishedyour first TIP. When you finish your first BUTT section, I'll be gladto read about it. When this first rod is completed I would be interestedin reading about how it casts or doesn't. I understand from reading theposts on the list that first rods have a tendency to be somewhatmediocre at best and clubs at worst. I am interested in how you madeyour rod, any problems encountered and the fixes, tools/equipment used,and honest appraisals of the final result. I am NOT interested inreading your spam.Skip from Ed.Estlow@co.hennepin.mn.us Tue Apr 6 11:01:52 1999 1999 16:01:05 UT 16-1998)) id8625674B.0057CE86 ; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 10:59:05 -0500 Subject: Re: First Production 7.5' 4WT Tip! Hmmm........ I must say, the members of this list excel at sarcasm. Are wesowounded that we must resort once again to a child's pissing contest? Iwouldask, once again, the point of such a contest. It is entertaining for a whiletowatch, but mostly sad - one side baiting the other. I know this may be anunpopular attitude and the wrong forum in which to express it, but I getquitetired of reading these posts. Skip, don't you have a taper archive? I do, constructed of the tapers postedhere, the appendices of Wayne's book and Garrison/Carmichael, and atleast twoor three different sites on the World Wide Web. Come on guys. The guy's making rods (or isn't and is baiting you forentertainment's sake). Get over it. -Ed Estlow from saweiss@flash.net Tue Apr 6 11:47:29 1999 Subject: Re: First Production 7.5' 4WT Tip! type="multipart/alternative";boundary="---- =_NextPart_000_001A_01BE801A.DABBD340" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_001A_01BE801A.DABBD340 boundary="----=_NextPart_001_001B_01BE801A.DABBD340" ------=_NextPart_001_001B_01BE801A.DABBD340 George,It's so much fun to read your messages. You have a great sense of humor.Steve _________ Ladies & Gentlemen: A dream has come true. By the =clock, it took exactly 1:31 minutes from start of splitting, to finished =gluing and racked to dry, Mr. Paul Whitely and Mr. George Gehrke, =President of the Bastard Bamboo Fly Rod Company, made George's first tip= in labor will be a direct benefit to all Americans who have always = This particular taper is one of many in the archive files of the new =Bastard Bamboo Fly Rod Company. It is only one of many that we believe =have been long overdue to the American Sportsmen abroad the landscapes = The particular trademark or personality of Bastard Fly Rods will be =the establishment of their very firm and fast actions. Tomorrow morning=we will be applying our new 'Signature Wraps' that will identify us for = ------=_NextPart_001_001B_01BE801A.DABBD340 George,It's so muchfun = messages. You have a great sense of humor.Steve took exactly 1:31 minutes from start of splitting, to finished = racked to dry, Mr. Paul Whitely and Mr. George Gehrke, President of = Bastard Bamboo Fly Rod Company, made George's first tip for the 7.5' = a direct benefit to all Americans who have always wanted to own a = This particular taper is one of many in the archive files of the = have been long overdue to the American Sportsmen abroad the = The particular trademark or personality of Bastard Fly Rods will = will be applying our new 'Signature Wraps' that will identify us for = = All Writings & Rights Reserved © 1999 by George = No writings or quotes may be used whole or in part without = specific permission of this author outside this group. = ------=_NextPart_001_001B_01BE801A.DABBD340-- ------=_NextPart_000_001A_01BE801A.DABBD340 ------=_NextPart_000_001A_01BE801A.DABBD340-- from chris@artistree.com Tue Apr 6 15:36:33 1999 Subject: Re: Heat gun tempering oven. mac-creator="4D4F5353" I have found that the roughed blank will start to turn black after about 15- 20 mins at 325 degrees (at sea level to complicate things even more). Thisisof course is probably dependent on the size of the roughing strips. Minemightbe much larger than Ian's. Smaller diameter tip bundles are the ones youhaveto watch carefully.--Best Regards, Chris Wohlfordemail: chris@artistree.com Ian Kearney wrote: David,.- My oven starts to turn the cane very very black after about 9 minutes ,and I have now settled on 7.5 minutes which is less then somerecommendations , but quite close to Garrison's suggestions. from TBUTLER@HEWM.COM Tue Apr 6 15:53:52 1999 [206.189.208.11] (may be forged)) bymail01-oak.pilot.net with SMTP id NAA00205 for; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 (WorldSecureServer SMTP Relay(WSS) v3.2); Tue, 06 Apr 99 13:53:16 - 0700 ; Tue, 6 Apr 1999 13:53:47 -0700 Subject: Does Size Matter? Here's a question from a bamboo rod neophyte. A friend (really,this is for a friend, not me, honest!) wants to order a "pack rod" becausehe has been impressed with a recently acquired 7'6" 4-wt 2-piece rod. Iwondered whether making the same length and weight rod in three or fourpieces so as to be "packable" would be practical. Not knowing the correctterminology, I wondered if the action would suffer from the increasednumberof ferrules, the shortened length of the bamboo fibers in each section orsimilar arcane problems. If anyone has insight, experience or othercomment, I would be pleased to pass them along. from chris@artistree.com Tue Apr 6 15:58:23 1999 Subject: Re: Heat gun tempering oven. mac-creator="4D4F5353" One more thing and then I'll shut up:) Ralph Moon has made good point about a certain smell that comes from theheattreating of the cane. I have noticed a certain smell that comes out of theexhaust at a point in the process that triggers my instincts to startthinkingabout taking the cane out even if the timer hasn't gone off yet. Asunscientificas it sounds I have started to rely on that smell a lot more. --Best Regards, Chris Wohlfordemail: chris@artistree.com from FISHWOOL@aol.com Tue Apr 6 17:38:02 1999 Subject: Re: Low gloss finish rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Dennis,I've found that saleability depends on high gloss. Yes, I've used tung oil and satin finishes and even my wife complained (she should know better).So I no longer use anything but high gloss poly spar as I'm in the business to sell rods. As far as myself I used tung oil 'til I found that I needed more moisture protection and have used satin but was dissatisfied with its flowability and returned to high gloss and polishing out the shine if necessary. You can experiment with various makes of satin varnishes and dilutions and you may find something that works for you.Good luck.Regards,Hank W. from HARMS1@prodigy.net Tue Apr 6 17:56:53 1999 Tue, 6 Apr 1999 18:56:48 -0400 "'rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu'" Subject: Re: Does Size Matter? =_NextPart_000_01BE805E.E6D432A0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_01BE805E.E6D432A0 Tim, Generally, the greater number of ferrules, the stiffer the action and theheavier the rod -- and in a four-piece rod, especially, that added weightwould be distributed from the middle out toward the tip (where youdefinitely would not want that weight). Having said this, however, it'spossible to design the rod so that it can use truncated ferrules -- thussaving unwanted weight, and interrupting the action somewhat less. Also,as a seven-foot rod for a four-weight line is a somewhat delicate rodanyway, even in four pieces, it could probably be kept that way. You will not be able to duplicate the action and "feel" of the two-piecerod, but one should be able, nevertheless, to come up with a dandy rod. Iam certain someone has already "solved" this little challenge, and I toowould be interested in hearing of the results. cheers, Bill ----------From: Butler, Timothy H. Subject: Does Size Matter?Date: Tuesday, April 06, 1999 1:56 PM Here's a question from a bamboo rod neophyte. A friend (really,this is for a friend, not me, honest!) wants to order a "pack rod"becausehe has been impressed with a recently acquired 7'6" 4-wt 2-piece rod. Iwondered whether making the same length and weight rod in three orfourpieces so as to be "packable" would be practical. Not knowing the correctterminology, I wondered if the action would suffer from the increasednumberof ferrules, the shortened length of the bamboo fibers in each section orsimilar arcane problems. If anyone has insight, experience or othercomment, I would be pleased to pass them along. ------ =_NextPart_000_01BE805E.E6D432A0 Tim,Generally, the =greater number of ferrules, the stiffer the action and the heavier the =rod -- and in a four-piece rod, especially, that added weight would be =distributed from the middle out toward the tip (where you definitely = possible to design the rod so that it can use truncated ferrules -- thus = = delicate rod anyway, even in four pieces, it could probably be kept that = would be interested in hearing of the results.cheers, = = a friend, not me, honest!) wants to order a "pack rod" = = same = =terminology, I wondered if the action would suffer from the increased = ------=_NextPart_000_01BE805E.E6D432A0-- from rsgould@cmc.net Tue Apr 6 18:43:22 1999 Subject: Back pack rod Hi Tim,I see you've already gotten a good answer about how to minimize theeffectsof three ferrules on a 4 piece rod by using truncated ferrules but here'sanother idea. I've done a lot of back packing myself where we each carrieda weeks supplies, camping gear and a small raft to go on a fishing trip toa string of remote lakes. Weight is of the utmost importance when you'recarrying 60-70 lbs. I found that it worked well for me to take an 8ft ft x2pc rod in an aluminum tube and fix the aluminum tube with a rubber padonthe bottom and use it as a walking stick. It can also then be used to propup the pack at rest stops. Another benefit is there is more room in thepack.Ray from TSmithwick@aol.com Tue Apr 6 19:41:54 1999 Subject: Re: Back pack rod TBUTLER@hewm.com I have no quarrel with Ray's solution, but would take it one step further myself. Basically, I think you could make a one piece 6 footer that would cast as well as anything with 4 ferrules in it. That way you can use a1/14" OD aluminium tube as the case. It makes a reasonable walking staff, and a standard rubber cap for furniture legs fits on the tube as a base. from saweiss@flash.net Tue Apr 6 20:32:52 1999 Subject: Re: Heat gun tempering oven. Great points, Chris.Heat treating has to be one of the more subjective processes, althoughprobably having some some very finite chemical things going on inside thecane at the molecular level. Using one's nose as well as judging the colorgives some indicator of "doneness". So many people's ovens are givingdifferent time requirements. I use my hot air oven horizontally andmeasurethe temperature with two electronic probe thermometers. I can heat at350 that smell that Ralph mentioned.Steve One more thing and then I'll shut up:) Ralph Moon has made good point about a certain smell that comes fromtheheattreating of the cane. I have noticed a certain smell that comes out of theexhaust at a point in the process that triggers my instincts to startthinkingabout taking the cane out even if the timer hasn't gone off yet. Asunscientificas it sounds I have started to rely on that smell a lot more. --Best Regards, Chris Wohlfordemail: chris@artistree.com from BambooRods@aol.com Tue Apr 6 21:16:19 1999 Subject: Re: First Production 7.5' 4WT Tip! How exciting! You have your first tip section. I can't wait to see the bastards butt, maybe we already have. (tongue in cheek?). from jczimny@dol.net Tue Apr 6 21:42:56 1999 0400 =?iso-8859-1?Q?=22ro?==?iso-8859- 1?Q?dmakers=40wugate=2Ewustl=2Eedu_=2A=A1=22?= Subject: RE: Heat gun tempering oven. Me too.John Z -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Heat gun tempering oven. One more thing and then I'll shut up:) Ralph Moon has made good point about a certain smell that comes from theheattreating of the cane. I have noticed a certain smell that comes out of theexhaust at a point in the process that triggers my instincts to startthinkingabout taking the cane out even if the timer hasn't gone off yet. Asunscientificas it sounds I have started to rely on that smell a lot more. --Best Regards, Chris Wohlfordemail: chris@artistree.com from LECLAIR123@aol.com Tue Apr 6 21:47:44 1999 Subject: Re: Lathe newbie In a message dated 4/4/99 12:23:34 PM Pacific Daylight Time,jczimny@dol.net writes: You know, I've seen them in the catalog and wondered howgood they worked. It sounds like it is a lot faster than my oldtime method. I'll have to give it a try. Thanks John from FISHWOOL@aol.com Wed Apr 7 11:12:54 1999 Subject: Re: Does Size Matter? rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu TButler,What I'm about to say may be heresy to some but here goes-I've made a number of 3 pc. rods on 2 pc. tapers WITHOUT adjusting the taper forferrule wgt. and placement. My experience is that,depending a little on the type of taper, that there is only a small difference in action. With parabolictapers the action seems stiffer, whereas with straightline tapers the actionsoftens somewhat.Just my $.02,Hank Woolman. from briansr@point-net.com Wed Apr 7 11:35:38 1999 0000 Subject: Fw: re 1st production 7.54wt tip Congratulationg Mr(s) G .However MY milling-planing machine justproduced8tip sections in 2 MINUTES FLAT.That being said it took me 6hrs and 22minutes to pull the tip sections out of the wall opposite themilling- planing machine!! 43 strips were damaged beyond repair ! 6 wereperfect and the others might be good only for a 12 sided rod. I'm going toglue these up to see what they look likeCheers BS from dmanders@telusplanet.net Wed Apr 7 15:25:46 1999 don") byedtnps05.telusplanet.net with SMTP id ; Wed, 7 Apr 199914:25:29 - 0600 Subject: Re: Does Size Matter? rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu At 12:01 PM 4/7/99 EDT, FISHWOOL@aol.com wrote:TButler,What I'm about to say may be heresy to some but here goes-I've made a number of 3 pc. rods on 2 pc. tapers WITHOUT adjusting the taper forferrule wgt. and placement. My experience is that,depending a little on the typeof taper, that there is only a small difference in action. With parabolictapers the action seems stiffer, whereas with straightline tapers the actionsoftens somewhat.Just my $.02,Hank Woolman. Hank, Tried the same and found the same. Don from fbcwin@fsbnet.com Wed Apr 7 18:10:22 1999 (Post.Office MTA v3.1.2 release (PO205-101c) 0500 Subject: Thread for Heddon Friends,I'm trying to locate enough Blue/White variegated (is thatwhat we mean by jasper) thread to re-wrap an old Heddon Bluewaterrod for a friend. Do any of you have any idea where I might findsome? Obviously I'm willing to pay what it costs. Thanks in advance,Harry Boydhboyd@fbcwin.com from mcdowellc@lanecc.edu Wed Apr 7 18:54:33 1999 via smap (4.1) 16:57:53 PDT Subject: Re: Thread for Heddon Harry, Go to this website (Belvoirdale). http://www.belvoirdale.com/elephant.html They have photos of the blue/white thread and maybe you can tell if it's what you want. I've ordered other varigated threads from Belvoirdale. The difficult partseems to be getting the correct size. The website says the 100/3 is the big stuff and the 50/3 is the small stuff. My experience has been to order exactly the opposite. The 100/3 is the smallest they have and it is about size A, at least according to the labels on the rolls I've bought. This size mix-up has been the subject of controversy for at least a couple of years. I don't know. Good luck. Chrismcdowellc@lanecc.edu from HARMS1@prodigy.net Wed Apr 7 19:07:24 1999 Wed, 7 Apr 1999 20:06:58 -0400 , Subject: Re: Back pack rod =_NextPart_000_01BE8131.E227EAC0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_01BE8131.E227EAC0 Or you could build a five-foot one-piece for 8-weight line. Leave the tubeat home and use the rod itself for a staff. Or, again, you could leave therod at home and fill the tube/staff with Snickers bars. We got LOTS ofsolutions. Cheers, Bill ----------From: TSmithwick@aol.com TBUTLER@hewm.comCc: rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Re: Back pack rodDate: Tuesday, April 06, 1999 5:31 PM I have no quarrel with Ray's solution, but would take it one step further myself. Basically, I think you could make a one piece 6 footer that would cast as well as anything with 4 ferrules in it. That way you can use a1/14" OD aluminium tube as the case. It makes a reasonable walking staff, anda standard rubber cap for furniture legs fits on the tube as a base. ------ =_NextPart_000_01BE8131.E227EAC0 Or you could build a = Basically, I think you could make a one piece 6 footer that would = furniture legs fits on the tube as a base. ------=_NextPart_000_01BE8131.E227EAC0-- from FISHWOOL@aol.com Wed Apr 7 21:38:06 1999 Subject: Re: Re: Heat gun tempering oven. rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Chris,I use a mica strip oven with an oven thermometer in the middle of it, It reads slightly above the thermostat setting. I've found that 375 deg. F. for 20 min. gives me a honey blonde color on the non-flamed sticks. Of course with no air being moved I'm not getting the drying that a heat gun ovendoes.FWIW,Regards,Hank W. from FISHWOOL@aol.com Wed Apr 7 21:40:04 1999 Subject: Re: Re: Heat gun tempering oven. rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Chris,Yep , that smells better than a thermometer.Hank from FISHWOOL@aol.com Wed Apr 7 21:41:04 1999 Subject: Re: Re: First Production 7.5' 4WT Tip! rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu What Ed said. Come on guys.Hank W. from Patrick.Coffey@PSS.Boeing.com Thu Apr 8 08:21:28 1999 GAA06662; (5.5.2407.0) rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu, "'FISHWOOL@aol.com'" Subject: RE: Heat gun tempering oven. I tried the temperatures Walt Powell gave me and it worked like a charm.250 degrees for 11/2 hours to get the moisture out without it turning to steam andrupturing the cell wall aswater boils at a slightly higher temperature at my altitude, then 300degrees for 1 hour and375 degrees till it gets the right color 15-30 minutes. Worked like acharm especially the250 degrees, the moisture came out of my oven in nice clouds. ----------From: FISHWOOL@aol.com[SMTP:FISHWOOL@aol.com] Sent: Wednesday, April 07, 1999 7:37 PM rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Re: Heat gun tempering oven. Chris,I use a mica strip oven with an oven thermometer in the middle of it,It reads slightly above the thermostat setting. I've found that 375 deg. F. 20 min. gives me a honey blonde color on the non-flamed sticks. Ofcourse with no air being moved I'm not getting the drying that a heat gun ovendoes.FWIW,Regards,Hank W. from richard.nantel@videotron.ca Thu Apr 8 09:43:56 1999 Internet Mail Serversims.3.5.1998.03.08.20.27)with SMTP id forrodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu; Thu, Subject: test from mschaffer@mindspring.com Thu Apr 8 13:57:21 1999 Subject: Wayne's book Sorry to bother you guys, but does anyone know for sure who has a copy ofWayne Cattanach's book still in stock and for sale? A website or phonenumber would be most appreciated! TIA, Doc (Mike Shaffer)(mschaffer@mindspring.com) from Ed.Estlow@co.hennepin.mn.us Thu Apr 8 16:08:29 1999 1999 21:07:33 UT 16-1998)) id8625674D.0073DA7A ; Thu, 8 Apr 1999 16:05:25 -0500 Subject: Re: Wayne's book Cabela's and Angler's Art are two places which I believe have Wayne'sbook. Ithink the Fly Factory in Grayling also has it. Can't remember any URL's buttheyare on Jerry Foster's website (Rodmakers). -Ed Estlow "michael w. shaffer" on 04/08/99 01:57:50PM Please respond to mschaffer@mindspring.com cc: Subject: Wayne's book Sorry to bother you guys, but does anyone know for sure who has a copy ofWayne Cattanach's book still in stock and for sale? A website or phonenumber would be most appreciated! TIA, Doc (Mike Shaffer)(mschaffer@mindspring.com) from cbogart@shentel.net Thu Apr 8 16:37:26 1999 Subject: Re: Wayne's book Ed How can you forget an URL like: http://www.troutbums.com for TheFly Factory web site. Some are easier to remember than others and this iseasy.Give Steve a call and I am sure they have the book. Chris On Thu, 8 Apr 1999 16:04:37 -0500, Ed.Estlow@co.hennepin.mn.us wrote: Cabela's and Angler's Art are two places which I believe have Wayne'sbook. Ithink the Fly Factory in Grayling also has it. Can't remember any URL's buttheyare on Jerry Foster's website (Rodmakers). -Ed Estlow "michael w. shaffer" on 04/08/99 01:57:50PM Please respond to mschaffer@mindspring.com cc: Subject: Wayne's book Sorry to bother you guys, but does anyone know for sure who has a copy ofWayne Cattanach's book still in stock and for sale? A website or phonenumber would be most appreciated! TIA, Doc (Mike Shaffer)(mschaffer@mindspring.com) from dellc@nextdim.com Thu Apr 8 17:09:48 1999 (SMTPD32-4.06) id A7E1DA00150; Thu, 08 Apr 1999 15:04:17 PST Subject: Re: Thread for Heddon Harry , it is called space dyed. It can be copied by dyeing white thread bywraping the thread around the appopiate size dowel and marking one halfofthe circumference with a blue waterproof marker. I did this one time anditcame out quite well.DellDell & Marie Coppock"The Flyfisher & the Quilter"http://www.trwebsites.com/dell/e-mail flyfisher@nextdim.com----- Original Message----- Subject: Thread for Heddon Friends,I'm trying to locate enough Blue/White variegated (is thatwhat we mean by jasper) thread to re-wrap an old Heddon Bluewaterrod for a friend. Do any of you have any idea where I might findsome? Obviously I'm willing to pay what it costs. Thanks in advance,Harry Boydhboyd@fbcwin.com from Turbotrk@aol.com Thu Apr 8 18:41:07 1999 Subject: Re: Local Bamboo I hope I am not repeating what someone else has already posted as I havebeen out fishing. (hint) My cost for cane is about $25 for a culm. If I am sloppy I will get one very good rod out of it. What are we striving for? I will just live with the cost of a good product and work on my planningjust a little bit more. from teekay35@interlynx.net Thu Apr 8 22:37:23 1999 Subject: Grand Rod Gathering, Fergus, Ontario, May 29, 30, 1999 =_NextPart_000_01BE8218.9BFE1AA0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_01BE8218.9BFE1AA0 The 3rd "Grand" Gathering is shaping up well. Our capacity is 70 persons,and last year we had that many people in attendance, so you shouldregistersoon. Some of the speakers confirmed include Jerry Kustich, WinstonRods;George Maurer, Sweetwater Rods; Ron Barch, Planing form; and others. Wewill have the usual workshops for the beginning rod maker. For moredetails about our program, guest speakers, topics, and registrationinformation, see the paper clipped items.If you are on our mailing list thesame information will be mailed to you shortly. ------=_NextPart_000_01BE8218.9BFE1AA0 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Anybody just starting on a set shouldget a quality tap instead of a hardware store brand(I broke 4 off). Anyway, looking towards my first rod I am contemplating hardware. Doeseveryone use either Mildrum or agate style strippers. I think the H&Hstrippers look nice even though they have the ceramic insert. Hasanyone used these on their rods. I'll probably use the Mildrum becauseof tradition, but I am interested in whether anybody has used the H&Hs. Thanks,Brian from bills@nwlink.com Thu Apr 8 23:21:33 1999 Subject: Re: Stripping guides Brian,REC has both. www.reccomponents.comGoldenwitch Technologies has agate strippers www.goldenwitch.com Bill-----Original Message----- Subject: Stripping guides I am nearing completion of my forms and if I never tap another hole inmy life I will be a happy man. Anybody just starting on a set shouldget a quality tap instead of a hardware store brand(I broke 4 off). Anyway, looking towards my first rod I am contemplating hardware. Doeseveryone use either Mildrum or agate style strippers. I think the H&Hstrippers look nice even though they have the ceramic insert. Hasanyone used these on their rods. I'll probably use the Mildrum becauseof tradition, but I am interested in whether anybody has used the H&Hs. Thanks,Brian from dickfuhrman@rheemote.com Fri Apr 9 08:04:32 1999 Subject: Does Size Matter? Tim,A while back A.J. Thramer posted a taper for a 4'3" 4Wt. 2 Piece rod. Iwould think that that would make a great "Pack Rod". Those that havemade it, have said that it is a sweet rod. Just a thought. I'm at workcatching up on my E-Mail after being off for a week or I would look upand repost the taper for you. Dick Fuhrmandickay@alltel.net from teekay35@interlynx.net Fri Apr 9 09:39:27 1999 Subject: 3rd Grand Rod builders Gathering I will be away for