from LambersonW@missouri.edu Mon Nov 1 07:47:12 1999 (5.5.2650.21) Subject: SRG Thanks Harry, cooks, presenters and others for making the SRG II such asuccess. It was great to have an opportunity to see and cast so manybeautiful rods. The ideas and tools that were demonstrated were veryinnovative. You were all very inspirational. I came home, set up the shop,and already milled another quad! Bill Lamberson from saweiss@flash.net Mon Nov 1 09:16:22 1999 Subject: ammonium carbonate boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0024_01BF2441.704C8380" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0024_01BF2441.704C8380 Frank,Like you, I am experimenting with NH4CO3 and have a way to go before I =can get consistent results, I use a hot air oven in a horizontal =position and put the chemical in a 4-ft. piece of aluminum channel under =the wire rack that the cane rests on. Like Ray Gould says, it looks like =higher temperatures may be the key. Another suspicion I have is that a =hot spot in the oven will result in a darker area on the strips, not =only because the cane gets more toasted, but maybe because the heat of =the cane determines the uptake of the carbonate.Anyone have any ideas on this topic?Steve Can you explain how you used the ammonium carbonate and what color =you achieved.I've tried using it in a heated cast iron pipe I use for tempering =but only changed the color slightly. I was trying to match a Folsum rod =which is a rich medium brown. I have been told that an ammonium =carbonate method was used to get the color. I have tried to match the = Frank ------=_NextPart_000_0024_01BF2441.704C8380 Frank,Like you, I am = with NH4CO3 and have a way to go before I can get consistent results, I = hot air oven in a horizontal position and put the chemical in a 4-ft. = aluminum channel under the wire rack that the cane rests on. Like Ray = says, it looks like higher temperatures may be the key. Another = is that a hot spot in the oven will result in a darker area on the = only because the cane gets more toasted, but maybe because the heat of = determines the uptake of the carbonate.Anyone haveany = topic?Steve Can you explain how you used the ammonium carbonate and what = achieved.I've tried using it in a heated cast iron pipe I use for = carbonate method was used to get the color. I have tried to match = Frank ------=_NextPart_000_0024_01BF2441.704C8380-- from barry@barryblessing.com Mon Nov 1 09:36:04 1999 with SMTP id 58265973; Mon Nov 01 07:30 PST 1999 Subject: Re: RE:Re: Bishop Gathering Can someone tell me what the Bishop Gathering is? Thanks,Barry -----Original Message----- rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Subject: RE:Re: Bishop Gathering Chuck, Thanks for hosting the 1st annual Bishop Gathering, you and your wifedeservea big "at-a-boy"!! Nice shop! Want to reveal where you hide the keys? It was great to be able meet all the attendees and to be able tosee, totouchand to cast one whole lot of very nice rods. Then there was "Bastard" rodonloan to Mark Metcalf - not much to write home about as it was, but if thequality issues are solved. - quite an undertaking. I'll start working on a chili recipe for BG2. Don Burns from barry@barryblessing.com Mon Nov 1 09:39:13 1999 Mon, 1 Nov 1999 07:39:09 -0800 with SMTP id 58266050; Mon Nov 01 07:33 PST 1999 Subject: Re: invisible wraps boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0061_01BF244E.5D464AC0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0061_01BF244E.5D464AC0 Bob, Sorry that I'm not able to answer your question. Where can I obtain the Angler's Workshop catalogue? Barry-----Original Message-----From: Bob Nunley Date: Sunday, October 31, 1999 2:01 PMSubject: RE: invisible wraps I use 00 white silk, and if you pack it tight and varnish it, it =will almost completely disappear. I have thought about using 000 to get =it to lay down tighter, just never got around to it. I have used a light brown 00, and on flamed or browntoned rods it =looks great. Bob -----Original Message-----From: Ray Gould Date: Sunday, October 31, 1999 11:55 AMSubject: invisible wraps Hi to all,I'd like to see some discussion about repairing splintered rod =sections and just exactly what type and size of thread and finish is =most sucessful in producing an almost "invisible" wrap over a repaired =area.It seems I've read that white silk with varnish over it is the =standard but I've also found that tan nylon #290 as shown in the =Angler's Workshop catalogue (no personal connection) turns almost =transparent when coated with varnish. Any suggestions?Ray ------=_NextPart_000_0061_01BF244E.5D464AC0 Bob, Sorry that I'm not able to answer your =question. Where can I obtain the Angler's = catalogue? Barry -----Original = = Makers List Serve <rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= Sunday, October 31, 1999 2:01 PMSubject: RE: = wraps I use 00 white silk, and if you = thought about using 000 to get it to lay down tighter, just never = to it. I have used a light brown 00, and on flamed or = rods it looks great. Bob rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= <rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= Sunday, October 31, 1999 11:55 AMSubject: = wrapsHi to all,I'd like to see some discussion = repairing splintered rod sections and just exactly what type and = "invisible" wrap over a repaired area.It seems I've read that white = varnish over it is the standard but I've also found that tan = as shown in the Angler's Workshop catalogue (no personal = suggestions?Ray ------=_NextPart_000_0061_01BF244E.5D464AC0-- from saweiss@flash.net Mon Nov 1 09:46:39 1999 Subject: Fw: The Force ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: The Force Barry,This taper is in Wayne Cattanach's book. I, as many others, am "hooked"onmany of his tapers.I think that Wayne Needs to get some legal advice. He may be the evilinfluence behind the upsurge in the incidence of paraholism, a diseasethatleads to brain damage from loss of sleep, as rodmakers spend their vitalrest hours in basements, garages, and workshops. In some cases, peoplehavebeen found collapsed on cold concrete floors with Stanley planes grippedintheir fingers. Carpal tunnel syndrome from repetitive arm motion alsohasbecome epidemic among rodmakers. Mental obsession is commonplace.Bamboodust is causing acute allergic reactions. I see a class action suit in thefuture, as soon as the lawyers are through with the cigarette makers andthegun makers.Steve Would you please let me know how to find the taper, if it's available?Thissounds like a rod I need to build. Barry Kling -----Original Message----- Sent: Saturday, October 30, 1999 11:16 PM Subject: The Force I finished my first copy of the"Force". It's experimental in a fewregards,my first rod fumed with ammonium carbonate, my first glued up withresorcinal, and the first time I've tried a Garrison type grip.I was teaching a beginner's flyfishing course today and at the end oftheday decided to try the rod. I put on a size 6 conehead wooly bugger andmadeat least 70' casts with no problem. This rod will hold what seems like50'of a WF6F in the air, and easily picked up 50' of line off the water andshot the rest with no false cast. To cap it off, I hooked and landed abigrainbow, at least 5 pounds. What a way to christen the rod.Thanks, Wayne, for your improvement of a taper that already had agreatreputation!Steve from avyoung@iinet.net.au Mon Nov 1 10:16:00 1999 Tue, 2 Nov 1999 00:15:44 +0800 Subject: Re: Fw: The Force That'saboutthe sizeofit. It is a good taper. Tony At 08:46 AM 11/1/99 -0700, Steven Weiss wrote: ----- Original Message -----From: Steven Weiss Sent: Monday, November 01, 1999 8:44 AMSubject: Re: The Force Barry,This taper is in Wayne Cattanach's book. I, as many others, am "hooked"onmany of his tapers.I think that Wayne Needs to get some legal advice. He may be the evilinfluence behind the upsurge in the incidence of paraholism, a diseasethatleads to brain damage from loss of sleep, as rodmakers spend theirvitalrest hours in basements, garages, and workshops. In some cases, peoplehavebeen found collapsed on cold concrete floors with Stanley planesgrippedintheir fingers. Carpal tunnel syndrome from repetitive arm motion alsohasbecome epidemic among rodmakers. Mental obsession is commonplace.Bamboodust is causing acute allergic reactions. I see a class action suit in thefuture, as soon as the lawyers are through with the cigarette makersandthegun makers.Steve Would you please let me know how to find the taper, if it's available?Thissounds like a rod I need to build. Barry Kling -----Original Message----- Sent: Saturday, October 30, 1999 11:16 PM Subject: The Force I finished my first copy of the"Force". It's experimental in a fewregards,my first rod fumed with ammonium carbonate, my first glued up withresorcinal, and the first time I've tried a Garrison type grip.I was teaching a beginner's flyfishing course today and at the end oftheday decided to try the rod. I put on a size 6 conehead wooly bugger andmadeat least 70' casts with no problem. This rod will hold what seems like50'of a WF6F in the air, and easily picked up 50' of line off the water andshot the rest with no false cast. To cap it off, I hooked and landed abigrainbow, at least 5 pounds. What a way to christen the rod.Thanks, Wayne, for your improvement of a taper that already had agreatreputation!Steve /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html And this our life, exempt from public haunt,Finds tongues in trees, books in running brooks,Sermons in stones, and good in everything. William Shakespeare, As You Like It /*************************************************************************/ from michael@wugate.wustl.edu Mon Nov 1 10:32:57 1999 Subject: SRG-Canefest-Foodfest-BSfest 99 I too want to add my thanks to Harry Boyd, Rick Crenshaw, and CharlieCurro. As the main organizers behind SRG99, they did a fantastic job ofplanning yet another great Rodmakers Gathering. I know how many behindthescenes hours go into putting something like this together, and I know Ispeak for all in attendance, it was all really appreciated. Also special thanks to all those who helped feed us all throughout theweekend. Just to give you an idea: Thursday evening mega-pizza feed;Friday lunch, mega-sized hamburgers with all the fixin's; homemadegumbo &rice; and a pot of the best dang lima beans I've ever tasted (and I *hate*lima beans!). Friday evening, out come the fish fryers, and *FORTYPOUNDS*of catfish are put on along with hushpuppies, and french fries. Saturdayafternoon, out comes the kettles for Kurt Loup's promised "Gen-U-IneCajunGumbo". (Now Kurt is a guy who considers anyone living north ofShreveporta Yankee, so you get some idea here! :-) There was definitely no shortagefood, let me tell ya! A special gastronomical thanks to all those whohelped. from the cooks to those scrubbing the pots - my belt stretchingTHANKS!!! Now that I've torn myself away from the food for a bit...as always withthese Gatherings, it is such a pleasure to see old friends again. It'salways seems way too long since we last all got together. Add to that,meeting a whole new batch of "old friends" for the first time. Folks thatyou enjoyed electronically conversing with over the years, and folksyou'vemet for the very first time. We all share a common interest, and thatspecial little weirdness that allows us to enjoy playing with a stick ofbamboo. One of the most enjoyable "programs" from any Gathering, is the"program" that typically starts about 9:00 or 10:00PM. It starts with afew folks in small group, enjoying a beer and conversation. The groupslowly grows well into the night. With the laughter & conversation, yousuddenly realize the bond that makes these Gatherings so enjoyable. It isindeed a good feeling. If you ever have the chance to attend a RodmakersGathering, do yourself a favor and make it a point to attend. You'll neverregret it. Many have already talked about all the great rods and informativepresentations - I add my thanks to those who offered their time and effortto give the presentation. I never fail to see something of interest, ormarvel at the ingeniousness of fellow rodmakers. Once again, special thanks to Harry, Charlie, and Rick...you guys doneGOOD!!! :-) See ya'all next year... Mike - pass me some more Gumbo, and a beer please - BiondoSt. Louis, MO from darrell@rockclimbing.org Mon Nov 1 11:46:54 1999 sims.3.5.1999.09.16.21.57.p8)with SMTP id for Subject: Re: RE:Re: Bishop Gathering It was last weekend... It was an informal gathering of rodmakers andnewbieswho gathered in Bishop at Chuck Irvine's wonderful home and even betterworkshop in the town of Bishop, CA for any persons interested in building,restoring bamboo rods. We all got to cast many rods that the people had built as well as a fewclassics that some brought such as THREE Hiram Hawes rods!!! Plus agreat7.5' Edwards rod. Chuck Irvine was a most gracious host and chili chef extraordinaire! I alsocooked a pot of chili and I was surprised how hungry the group was! EdMiller donated MANY delicious loaves of hearty bread! We also had a Demarest display of some photos of the tonkin cane in Chinaplus a few demos of bevelers and we got to look at some of Chuck'sscienceprojects! We fished a little bit and a few caught some trout in the OwensRiver. Mucho elbow raising and many photos were taken... Will post some ofthe photos I took and will give a url so all can view them! Mark Metcalf of the Bamboo Fly Rod Magazine was there and brought a neattimeline he's been working on that shows the history of bamboo rods andAmerican Angling starting around 1848.... and yes, he's hoping the nextissue will be ready by next month... please don't email him asking when themag will be ready... leave him alone so he can work on the mag instead ofanswering emails... Also was pleased to meet Jerry Foster and all the others that attended...I've left out many people's names and while not trying to slight anyone, Ithought the others that I didn't mention would add their two cents... Everyone commented how nice the Demarest cane quality looked and howstraight it was too. There's still a few extra pieces available. Pleaseemail me off list if anyone is interested. I went ahead and put a split inthe cane to minimize additional splitting. Can't wait till next year! Darrell Leewww.bamboorods.homepage.com ----- Original Message ----- Subject: RE:Re: Bishop Gathering Can someone tell me what the Bishop Gathering is? Thanks,Barry -----Original Message-----From: Canerods@aol.com rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Date: Sunday, October 31, 1999 3:57 PMSubject: RE:Re: Bishop Gathering Chuck, Thanks for hosting the 1st annual Bishop Gathering, you and your wifedeservea big "at-a-boy"!! Nice shop! Want to reveal where you hide the keys? It was great to be able meet all the attendees and to be able tosee, totouchand to cast one whole lot of very nice rods. Then there was "Bastard"rodonloan to Mark Metcalf - not much to write home about as it was, but ifthequality issues are solved. - quite an undertaking. I'll start working on a chili recipe for BG2. Don Burns from saltwein@swbell.net Mon Nov 1 11:47:08 1999 (Sun Internet Mail Server sims.3.5.1999.09.16.21.57.p8)with ESMTP id for Subject: SRG 99 Hello All, I just read Mike Biondo's post and want to second all of hisobservations and add a few. I want to thank the people who spent thetime cooking, George, Ron, Harry, Rick, Jerry. I hope I haven't leftanyone out. These people were tireless and the efforts were mammoth! I would also like to express my deepest thanks to all who put rods inthe cast off. This was my first experience with this event and it madethe whole trip worthwhile. A special thanks to Dennis Higham for sharingsome special rods and their tapers. I feel very fortunate to have been able to share time with the greatbuilders, crafters, inventors and personalities in attendance at SRG 99and hope I can be present next year. Way to go, Harry, Charlie and Rick! I also have a request. I had an item that did not make it back toIndependence with me. A little 5-1/2 by 8 burgundy covered note pad. Itwas an early rod journal and taper log. Really has no value but thereare some flies in it for anyone who might have rescued it. My name is oninner pages in signature practices. Regards, SteveIndependence, MO from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Mon Nov 1 12:25:33 1999 Subject: Southern tears boundary="------------205B4B76E862FE593F681F2F" --------------205B4B76E862FE593F681F2F Time for a little heartfelt emotion. Hit "Delete" now if you don't wantto read a little creative writing. Southern Tears Who is the fellow who makes bamboo rods? Who is the fellow who makes bamboo rods? The stereotype portrays him(or her) as a lone wolf. He hibernates in his shop for hours at atime. Strange sounds and smells eminate from within. Passers bystartle at the crack of popping nodes and shrieks of pain from "themother of all paper cuts". Bamboo roasting with the delicacy of almondsmingles in ones mind with the caustic fumes of high tech glues andsolvents and noxious ammonia fumes. Crumpled graph paper withscribbledpoints and figures and computer printouts accumulate in the trash shovedoutside the shop to make room for planing "just one more strip." Smoke from an old burned out pipe circles his head constantly as he ruminatesover how to solve a problem or work out the latest challenge. Who is the fellow who makes bamboo rods? Usually the rodmaker is talllike Bob N. or Bill L. -- or, short like me. Often he is wiry and thinlike Rick C. or Miles T. -- or pudgy like me. He is barrel-chested likeKen C.. or Kurt L -- or weak like me. He is clean cut like Jerry B. orAlan G.-- or scruffy looking like me. He is quiet like Henry and Onis,or a loudmouth like me. He's got a full head of hair, like Joe -- orhe is bald, like me. His work is artful, his creativity amazing, likeAl M. -- or bumbling like mine. He is intelligent and intense, focusedand filled with energy, like Wayne, -- or lazy, like _______. He's IBMlike Dan, or Apple like Ron. He makes his own beer like Mike, -- ordoesn't drink at all, like me. ;-) He's from "South of Interstate 10"like Jody -- or "Northville", like John L. and Bill W. He's from thewest coast like Cary -- or the east coast like Harold. He's from Norway He's young and old, good looking and ugly, quiet and loud, blue collarand white, Democrat and Republican, Buddhist, Baptist, and everything inbetween. And he was at the Southern Rodmakers Gathering. -------------------- As the party known as "SRG 99" finally broke up just beforedaylight yesterday morning, I shook hands with Rick Crenshaw, MilesTiernan, Mike Biondo, Wayne Cattanach, Dennis Higham and a couple ofothers; kissed Eileen Demarest, and hugged Charlie Curro. I wanted tolinger just a few minutes longer but instead hustled behind theprotection of the tinted windows of my van, so no one would see thetears of joy and sadness overflow my eyes. Real joy is spending an hoursitting on a rock in the middle of a river with a close friend I hadnever laid eyes on before last years gathering. A real friend who isalso a trusted counselor and advisor. Real sadness is a friend moving1000 miles away, knowing that your contact will be more limited in thefuture. Real joy is the magnanimous Harold Demarest. Real sadness isthat we lose friends every year. Joy is Miles' "smooooooothing ataper." Sadness is that Grayrock is eight long months down the road.Words can't express my appreciation for all of you who made thisyear's SRG special. This was by far the best gathering I've everattended. (Of course, I've only been to two and organized them both.)Dozens of you gave of your time, energy and money to make this happen.Most of all you gave yourselves. That's what makes it good.Twenty years ago rodmakers were known for their secretiveness.Then a little guy from Ca*&%$via got a bunch together, and look what hashappened. I won't mention many names, but this gathering would not havetaken place without the efforts and encouragement of Rick Crenshaw andCharlie Curro, my co-conspirators. Thank you, Rick. Thank you,Charlie.A committee is being formed to put SRG 2000 together, and wewill fill you all in on the details soon. Suffice it to say, "Nextyear, same time, same place." My sincere thanks and best to all, Harry --------------205B4B76E862FE593F681F2F want to read a little creative writing. Southern Tears portrays Passers almondsmingles in ones mind with the caustic fumes of high tech glues andsolvents pointsand figures and computer printouts accumulate in the trash shoved outside froman old burned out pipe circles his head constantly as he ruminates overhow to solve a problem or work out the latest challenge. cut like Jerry B. or Alan G.-- or scruffy looking like me. He is quiet intelligent and intense, focused and filled with energy, like Wayne, -- He makes his own beer like Mike, -- or doesn't drink at all, like me. ;- and old, good looking and ugly, quiet and loud, blue collar and white,Democrat and Republican, Buddhist, Baptist, and everything in And he was at the Southern Rodmakers Gathering.-------------------- "SRG 99" finally broke up just before daylight yesterday morning, I shookhands with Rick Crenshaw, Miles Tiernan, Mike Biondo, Wayne Cattanach, Demarest, longerbut instead hustled behind the protection of the tinted windows of my van, Real joy is spending an hour sitting on a rock in the middle of a riverwith a close friend I had never laid eyes on before last years gathering. Real sadness is a friend moving 1000 miles away, knowing that yourcontact Harold is eight long months down the road. appreciation That's what makes it good. rodmakers Ca*&%$viagot a bunch together, and look what has happened. names,but this gathering would not have taken place without the efforts andencouragement formedto put SRG 2000 together, and we will fill you all in on the details Suffice it to say, "Next year, same time, same place." bestto all, --------------205B4B76E862FE593F681F2F-- from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Mon Nov 1 12:28:40 1999 Mon, 1 Nov 1999 10:28:28 -0800 "rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu" Subject: Re: SRG 99 Long, hard, evil, LAUGH. I've got your notebook. What will you pay to getit back? Guess who's got the Heddon taper now!!! Ha, ha, ha, Harry PS ---- I'll put it in the mail when I dig through all my stuff and findit. Steve Trauthwein wrote: Hello All, I just read Mike Biondo's post and want to second all of hisobservations and add a few. I want to thank the people who spent thetime cooking, George, Ron, Harry, Rick, Jerry. I hope I haven't leftanyone out. These people were tireless and the efforts were mammoth! I would also like to express my deepest thanks to all who put rods inthe cast off. This was my first experience with this event and it madethe whole trip worthwhile. A special thanks to Dennis Higham forsharingsome special rods and their tapers. I feel very fortunate to have been able to share time with the greatbuilders, crafters, inventors and personalities in attendance at SRG 99and hope I can be present next year. Way to go, Harry, Charlie and Rick! I also have a request. I had an item that did not make it back toIndependence with me. A little 5-1/2 by 8 burgundy covered note pad. Itwas an early rod journal and taper log. Really has no value but thereare some flies in it for anyone who might have rescued it. My name is oninner pages in signature practices. Regards, SteveIndependence, MO from tjtrodmaker@yahoo.com Mon Nov 1 13:10:59 1999 1999 11:10:56 PST Subject: Re: SRG 99 STOP! before you give up that notebook...i'm looking --- Harry Boyd wrote:Long, hard, evil, LAUGH. I've got your notebook. What will you pay to getit back? Guess who's got the Heddon taper now!!! Ha, ha, ha, Harry PS ---- I'll put it in the mail when I dig throughall my stuff and findit. Steve Trauthwein wrote: Hello All, I just read Mike Biondo's post and want to secondall of hisobservations and add a few. I want to thank thepeople who spent thetime cooking, George, Ron, Harry, Rick, Jerry. Ihope I haven't leftanyone out. These people were tireless and theefforts were mammoth! I would also like to express my deepest thanks toall who put rods inthe cast off. This was my first experience withthis event and it madethe whole trip worthwhile. A special thanks toDennis Higham for sharingsome special rods and their tapers. I feel very fortunate to have been able to sharetime with the greatbuilders, crafters, inventors and personalities inattendance at SRG 99and hope I can be present next year. Way to go,Harry, Charlie and Rick! I also have a request. I had an item that did notmake it back toIndependence with me. A little 5-1/2 by 8 burgundycovered note pad. Itwas an early rod journal and taper log. Really hasno value but thereare some flies in it for anyone who might haverescued it. My name is oninner pages in signature practices. Regards, SteveIndependence, MO ====="Gooda' morning mister bear"__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Mon Nov 1 13:30:57 1999 Mon, 1 Nov 1999 11:30:28 -0800 Subject: Re: SRG 99 Timothy,Let me read through Steve's notes. :-) If this is thefeatherweight, I'll be glad to steal it from Steve and share it withyou. To be honest, I think this was a 7' 4 weight Folsom, made byHeddon. Harry timothy troester wrote: STOP! before you give up that notebook...i'm looking --- Harry Boyd wrote:Long, hard, evil, LAUGH. I've got your notebook.What will you pay to getit back? Guess who's got the Heddon taper now!!! Ha, ha, ha, Harry PS ---- I'll put it in the mail when I dig throughall my stuff and findit. Steve Trauthwein wrote: Hello All, I just read Mike Biondo's post and want to secondall of hisobservations and add a few. I want to thank thepeople who spent thetime cooking, George, Ron, Harry, Rick, Jerry. Ihope I haven't leftanyone out. These people were tireless and theefforts were mammoth! I would also like to express my deepest thanks toall who put rods inthe cast off. This was my first experience withthis event and it madethe whole trip worthwhile. A special thanks toDennis Higham for sharingsome special rods and their tapers. I feel very fortunate to have been able to sharetime with the greatbuilders, crafters, inventors and personalities inattendance at SRG 99and hope I can be present next year. Way to go,Harry, Charlie and Rick! I also have a request. I had an item that did notmake it back toIndependence with me. A little 5-1/2 by 8 burgundycovered note pad. Itwas an early rod journal and taper log. Really hasno value but thereare some flies in it for anyone who might haverescued it. My name is oninner pages in signature practices. Regards, SteveIndependence, MO ====="Gooda' morning mister bear"__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com from jkallo@midwest.net Mon Nov 1 13:36:57 1999 Subject: SRG There is not much I can add to the notes posted about SRG--I've printedthemall out and tucked them in the fishing journal. I would like to add mythanksto Harry, Rick and Charlie. You guys did one hell of a job. Not even lockingmykeys in the car or breaking yet another rod as I was getting ready to leave(Iprobably shouldn't even mention it--I'm gonna start getting banned fromthecasmic-castoff with my record) dimmed the great time I had. I lookforward toseeing you all next year. Best,Joe Joseph S. Kallo Dpt. of PhilosophySouthern Illinois University at Carbondale from saltwein@swbell.net Mon Nov 1 13:41:38 1999 (Sun Internet Mail Server sims.3.5.1999.09.16.21.57.p8)with ESMTP id for Subject: Re: SRG 99 I am going to post it to the list as soon as I can crunch the numbers.Dennis has it also, if he gets them worked before I do, he may postthem. I would like to see a comparison of approaches on raw data anyway.It would be nice to see what three or four approaches come up with. Regards, SteveIndependence, Mo Harry Boyd wrote: Timothy,Let me read through Steve's notes. :-) If this is thefeatherweight, I'll be glad to steal it from Steve and share it withyou. To be honest, I think this was a 7' 4 weight Folsom, made byHeddon. Harry timothy troester wrote: STOP! before you give up that notebook...i'm looking --- Harry Boyd wrote:Long, hard, evil, LAUGH. I've got your notebook.What will you pay to getit back? Guess who's got the Heddon taper now!!! Ha, ha, ha, Harry PS ---- I'll put it in the mail when I dig throughall my stuff and findit. Steve Trauthwein wrote: Hello All, I just read Mike Biondo's post and want to secondall of hisobservations and add a few. I want to thank thepeople who spent thetime cooking, George, Ron, Harry, Rick, Jerry. Ihope I haven't leftanyone out. These people were tireless and theefforts were mammoth! I would also like to express my deepest thanks toall who put rods inthe cast off. This was my first experience withthis event and it madethe whole trip worthwhile. A special thanks toDennis Higham for sharingsome special rods and their tapers. I feel very fortunate to have been able to sharetime with the greatbuilders, crafters, inventors and personalities inattendance at SRG 99and hope I can be present next year. Way to go,Harry, Charlie and Rick! I also have a request. I had an item that did notmake it back toIndependence with me. A little 5-1/2 by 8 burgundycovered note pad. Itwas an early rod journal and taper log. Really hasno value but thereare some flies in it for anyone who might haverescued it. My name is oninner pages in signature practices. Regards, SteveIndependence, MO ====="Gooda' morning mister bear"__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com from Kirk_Brownlee@jdedwards.com Mon Nov 1 13:51:37 1999 VirusWall NT);Mon, 01 Nov 1999 12:49:54 -0700 (Mountain Standard Time) (5.5.2448.0) Subject: RE: SRG 99 Does the #14 feather weight have red wraps and a sliding band cork realseat? I have a Heddon not sure what model but it has Red Wraps and the slidingcorkreal seat. It's a 7'6 5 weight that I bought with one tip down and I lovetheheck out of this rod. If the above mentioned Rod is the the Heddon #14 feather weight I towouldlove to have the tapper. Thanks,Kirkkdbrownlee@msn.com or kirk_brownlee@jdedwards.com -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: SRG 99 STOP! before you give up that notebook...i'm looking from 76250.1771@compuserve.com Mon Nov 1 14:32:03 1999 Subject: Heddon 7',4wt I wasn't going to post this without Steve's permission, but, since he justdid that...here goes... Heddon "Folsum" 7', 4wt., 2 piece, 12/64 ferrule 1" = .067, 5" = .079, 10" = .088, 15" = .108, 20" = .123, 25" = .141, 30" =.155, 35" = .169, 40" = .180, 45" = .186, 50" = .202, 55" = .22060" = .234, 65" = .248, 70" = .265, 75" = .335 I averaged the rough # Steve gave me and subtracted .004 for varnish(bestguess). Guides @ 5, 11 1/4, 17 5/8, 24 1/8, 31 7/8, 39 1/8, 48 5/8, 581/2(stripper) Still Catching Up On Sleep, Dennis from Canerods@aol.com Mon Nov 1 15:41:24 1999 Subject: Trip report - 1st Annual Bishop Gathering All, Just returned from the first Bishop Gathering of bamboo rodmakers and collectors. A great time was had by all. Chuck Irvine's well outfitted rodmaking shop, just outside of Bishop, was the meeting place. On Saturday, there was several hours of looking at bamboo rods, casting bamboo rods and generally BS'ing about bamboo rods. We got to see a bamboo rough tapering mill in operation. It sure madequick work of roughing out a strip. Plus Darrell Lee had 40 culms of bamboo for sale that he just received from the east-coast importer (Demerest) of tonkin cane. There were just too many very very nice rods to cast and talk about and so I'll just say that all the rods were well liked and cast by all. One other highlight - looking at and casting the "Happy Hooker" rod. -better known as Mr. Gink's "Bastard" rod - S/N 41 of 1000. Mark Metcalf of TBFR brought it along to show off. It was a mess in the finishing dep't, but the cane work wasn't too bad - on the scale of 1 -10, well it was on the scale. It had a nice reelseat, well made ferrules and what looked like apreformed "Western" cork grip and mounted a bit off center, IMHO. But if they get the varnishing process down (totally missing in spots),maybe get a better rod taper too - then look out! The rod will never be 5-Star, but it would be as good as a 1950's production rod. As it was, I'd buy the old production rod first or spend a few more dollars and buy a lower-priced modern maker rod. OBTW, the Chris McDowell 7'6" 4/5 wt rod (his 1st commercially sold rod)that I brought along was a big hit with the attending makers and it's light-years ahead of the above "B" rod. All of us agreed that Chris turns out one pretty rod. The many many rod restorations that Chris has done prior to turning rodmaker means that his rod finish is just short of being unbelievable.Chez "bastard" should hire him to teach their people how to finish a rod! Back to the BG1 -- Well, soon we were off to find water and try out one or more of ourfavorite rods. The Owens River below the gorge was the place that several of us went. I bummed a ride with Ed Miller and his pickup truck. A good thing too - the road soon turned to spring breaking bottom busting paths that lead to the river. I tried out my Tony Young built PHY "Driggs" 7'2" 5wt. As I was stringingup the rod, I realized that I had grabbed a reel with a 4DT line, this just after I decided that I liked it with a 5wt line - the 5 wt line and reel were still in the truck of my car at Chuck's. @#$& Well, if I got 30 plus feet of line out it didn't cast the 4wt all that badly. But 40' meant that I was casting into the brush on the other side of the stream. We fished for a couple of hours and found out that the brownies weren't active. Too late (well past sunrise) or way too early! About dinner time we needed to get back to Chuck's for the chili cookoffand general BS'ing. A local tackle shop owner/guide was supposed to be givinga slide show, but he didn't show! After the chili was gone and Darrell Lee and I stopped fondling Chuck's 2 nice taper forms the meeting was over. Sunday morning I got up and drove home so I would be home in time for Holloween - which was a pact I made with my wife. I saw a herd of tule elk out in the pasture at the elk preserve as I drove down Hwy 395. So that along with the beautiful senery of the SierraNevada Mt's including all the hardwood trees showing off in their fall colors (plus being far far away from LA) would have made the trip very pleasant even without the rodmaker gathering. Don Burns PS - I'd like to thank Chuck and his lovely wife for putting up with us. PPS - Sorry about not getting the parallel port up and running Chuck!Anyone one know how to drive a HP printer from an ECP parallel port? from stpete@netten.net Mon Nov 1 17:02:29 1999 Mon, 1 Nov 1999 17:08:26 -0600 Subject: Re: SRG-Joe Kallo Joe, You are one genuinely fine fellow - a pleasure to be around, good senseof humor, a heartwarming smile. I'd lend you a rod any day (especiallysince I know you can build one), but SURELY you have earned a newmoniker here. Therefore, with the powers vested in by as a shiftless SouthernRodmaker, I hereby make this Proclaimation: WHEREAS, you, Joe Kallo have participated in the making and fishing ofmultiple Bamboo Fly Rods, and WHEREAS, you have also used, abused and generally put said Rods throughextreme hardship and duress, and WHEREAS, you have the uncanny ability to render said Rods into morepieces than originally planned, THEREFORE, rise, Joe Kallo, Henceforth, you will be granted the HonoraryTitle of, and will be known as, FOUR-PIECE Rodmaker, Fisher of Dry Flies, and Lord of the Cringing Snap. A toast to Four-Piece!Rick C. Joe Kallo wrote: There is not much I can add to the notes posted about SRG--I've printedthemall out and tucked them in the fishing journal. I would like to add mythanksto Harry, Rick and Charlie. You guys did one hell of a job. Not even lockingmykeys in the car or breaking yet another rod as I was getting ready toleave (Iprobably shouldn't even mention it--I'm gonna start getting banned fromthecasmic-castoff with my record) dimmed the great time I had. I lookforward toseeing you all next year. Best,Joe Joseph S. KalloDpt. of PhilosophySouthern Illinois University at Carbondale from knflyrod@home.com Mon Nov 1 17:59:47 1999 (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with SMTP Mon, 1 Nov 1999 15:59:44 -0800 Subject: Re: SRG 99 kIRK, Does your rod have a swelled butt? Does it have the hookkeeperwithan open wrap. Describe the ferrules if you would.The only Heddon rod Ihaveever seen or worked on that has a cork reel seat is the #51 Princess. Howis the Heddon written? On one flat or across three flats. This would helpdetermine the time your rod was built.. It sounds like a neat rod. RonHuff----- Original Message ----- Subject: RE: SRG 99 Does the #14 feather weight have red wraps and a sliding band cork realseat? I have a Heddon not sure what model but it has Red Wraps and the slidingcorkreal seat. It's a 7'6 5 weight that I bought with one tip down and I lovetheheck out of this rod. If the above mentioned Rod is the the Heddon #14 feather weight I towouldloveto have the tapper. Thanks,Kirkkdbrownlee@msn.com or kirk_brownlee@jdedwards.com -----Original Message----- Sent: Monday, November 01, 1999 12:11 PM Subject: Re: SRG 99 STOP! before you give up that notebook...i'm looking from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Mon Nov 1 19:24:18 1999 U) Subject: Lost and found at SRG Fellow SRG'ers,Someone left a nice frying basket with a black handle at theSRG. Also left was a large pot and a bag of cork rings. If any of themare yours, please contact me off list so that I can get them to you.Also, if any of you got home with something that wasn't yours,please let the rest of us know.Thanks,Harry from dan_cooney@attglobal.net Mon Nov 1 22:21:18 1999 SMTP +0000 Subject: SRG 99 Thank you Harry for pulling together one great event. Thanks also toRick, Charlie for a truly outstanding job of putting all the piecestogether. You guys made it look easy, but I know better. I know that weall appreciate the countless hours that went into planning andpreparation. It sure is neat when the plan comes together -- did itever!! Harry, I'm glad you decided not to retire just yet! Many thanks to Wayne, Harold and Eileen, Tony, Leo, Al Medved, Morten,Bill and all the guys who presented. A wealth of knowledge was impartedduring those three days. The food - well all I can say is I'm salivating right now thinking aboutit!! I could go for one of Ken's monster burgers right now, with a sideof Harry's catfish, and finish off with a bowl of Kurt's gumbo. UMMM-UMMM GOOD! Thanks to everyone who helped with the cooking. Thanks to everyone who offered their beautiful rods in the "CosmicCastoff.". So many rods to build - so little time! What I will treasure most is all the wonderful new friends. Thanks toeveryone for making it a really memorable three days. See you next year.Dan Cooney from caneman@clnk.com Mon Nov 1 23:11:20 1999 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35)with SMTP id com; Mon, 1 Nov 1999 23:10:02 -0600 Subject: Re: Lost and found at SRG Harry,hmmmmm... no cork rings or cooking utensiles missing from the Nunleyinventory, however, I did seem to lose track of about $200 dollars while Iwas there... Didn't find that did you?!?!? LOL Bob -----Original Message----- Subject: Lost and found at SRG Fellow SRG'ers,Someone left a nice frying basket with a black handle at theSRG. Also left was a large pot and a bag of cork rings. If any of themare yours, please contact me off list so that I can get them to you.Also, if any of you got home with something that wasn't yours,please let the rest of us know.Thanks,Harry from cathcreek@hotmail.com Tue Nov 2 01:58:43 1999 Mon, 01 Nov 1999 23:58:10 PST Subject: Re: Trip report - 1st Annual Bishop Gathering Nice to see Chris getting some well deserved praise. He is one heck of a perfectionist, and one heck of a nice guy. He also lives and breathes this stuff and I owe him a lot for showing my wife that I am not as obsessiveas she thought I was. Glad to hear Bishop was a success. I know Chris, Randy Brewer and I all wanted to make it and have a strong Oregon showing. Maybe next year?? Robert Clarkecathcreek@hotmail.com OBTW, the Chris McDowell 7'6" 4/5 wt rod (his 1st commercially soldrod) thatI brought along was a big hit with the attending makers and it's light- yearsahead of the above "B" rod. All of us agreed that Chris turns out one prettyrod. The many many rod restorations that Chris has done prior to turningrodmaker means that his rod finish is just short of being unbelievable. Chez"bastard" should hire him to teach their people how to finish a rod! ______________________________________________________Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com from EESweet@aol.com Tue Nov 2 08:16:53 1999 Subject: Crooked strips & translucent wraps Hi All, Just wondering if anyone might have some advice on the best placement of crooked strips? Howell's book says to put the straightest strips in thebutt section, but that seems counterintuitive to me. Does everyone concurwith that? Also, I'm planning to use polyurethane varnish, brushed on, will this result in translucent wraps or act as a color preserver? TIA. Eric Sweet from caneman@clnk.com Tue Nov 2 08:29:24 1999 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35)with SMTP id com; Tue, 2 Nov 1999 08:28:09 -0600 Subject: Re: Crooked strips & translucent wraps Eric,As far as the crooked strips, that is a question I really can't answer.I spend so much time straightening my strips that I don't worry aboutwhatto do with crooked strips. A little time in front of the heat gun oralcohol lamp and you should have 18 "arrow straight" strips laying on yourbench ready to plane.As for the poly, now when you brush it on, if you dont have a poly thatflashes off too fast, it should penetrate the wraps and give you thatinvisible look. It should not act as a color preserver, but, to saveyourself some disappointment, just in case, wrap a scrap bamboo sectionwiththe thread you are going to use, brush your poly on it and see whathappened. If it does NOT soak completely into the wraps, you might tryputting the rod on a rodturner and doing the wraps by themselves first.Apply your poly to the wraps with a toothpick and be careful to stay onjustthe wraps and not get any on the rod. Some poly's and varnishes will leavea definite visible "paint line" under your other coats if you get it off thewraps and on the blank. Good luck, Bob -----Original Message----- Subject: Crooked strips & translucent wraps Hi All, Just wondering if anyone might have some advice on the best placementofcrooked strips? Howell's book says to put the straightest strips in thebuttsection, but that seems counterintuitive to me. Does everyone concurwiththat? Also, I'm planning to use polyurethane varnish, brushed on, willthisresult in translucent wraps or act as a color preserver? TIA. Eric Sweet from noblur@stic.net Tue Nov 2 08:30:41 1999 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0- 60503U15500L11000S0V35)with SMTP id net; Tue, 2 Nov 1999 08:30:38 - 0600 Subject: Re: Crooked strips & translucent wraps boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0056_01BF250C.7FA1AB00" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0056_01BF250C.7FA1AB00 So far, any type of varnish I've used, produces the translucent wraps. I =prefer this, as it's more durable, and years later, the color preserver =will have cracked to some extent, while the varnish impregnated wraps =never do ! I also like the look better, personally. GMA Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 1999 8:16 AMSubject: Crooked strips & translucent wraps Hi All, Just wondering if anyone might have some advice on the best placement = crooked strips? Howell's book says to put the straightest strips in = section, but that seems counterintuitive to me. Does everyone concur = that? Also, I'm planning to use polyurethane varnish, brushed on, = result in translucent wraps or act as a color preserver? TIA. Eric Sweet ------=_NextPart_000_0056_01BF250C.7FA1AB00 So far, any type of varnish I've used, produces the = wraps. I prefer this, as it's more durable, and years later, the color = will have cracked to some extent, while the varnish impregnated wraps = ! I also like the look better, personally. GMA ----- Original Message ----- = Sent: Tuesday, November 02, = AMSubject: Crooked strips & = wrapsHi All,Just wondering if anyone might havesome = I'm planning to use polyurethane varnish, brushed on, will this = Sweet ------=_NextPart_000_0056_01BF250C.7FA1AB00-- from caneman@clnk.com Tue Nov 2 08:36:44 1999 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35)with SMTP id com for ;Tue, 2 Nov 1999 08:35:22 -0600 Subject: Straight Strips? type="multipart/alternative";boundary="---- =_NextPart_000_006E_01BF250C.C10AA9C0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_006E_01BF250C.C10AA9C0 boundary="----=_NextPart_001_006F_01BF250C.C10AA9C0" ------=_NextPart_001_006F_01BF250C.C10AA9C0 OK, the email I just responded to from Eric just brought another =question to mind concerning part of that subject.How many of you straighten your strips. I know we all straighten =the nodes, but do any of the other of you straighten the entire strip. =I always have because... well, I guess my thinking is the straighter the =strip, the easier the planing and binding process go, and the =straightening process after the binding. Any opinions? Bob+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ R.L. "Bob" Nunley, Rodmaker = + Custom Split Bamboo Fly Rods+ http://members.clnk.com/caneman/images/flystuff/caneindex.htm++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ ------=_NextPart_001_006F_01BF250C.C10AA9C0 OK, the email I just responded to from Eric just brought another = to mind concerning part of that subject. = all straighten the nodes, but do any of the other of you straighten the = straighter the strip, the easier the planing and binding process go, and = straightening process after the binding. Bob+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ + Custom Split Bamboo Fly Rods+ ht=tp://members.clnk.com/caneman/images/flystuff/caneindex.htm++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ ------=_NextPart_001_006F_01BF250C.C10AA9C0-- ------=_NextPart_000_006E_01BF250C.C10AA9C0 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------=_NextPart_000_006E_01BF250C.C10AA9C0-- from punky@integratedmillsystems.com Tue Nov 2 08:50:23 1999 01.ix.netcom.com (1.61/SMTP) for Subject: 60 degree contact point follow up Hello all, A few weeks back a few people (myself included) inquired about sourcesfor60 degree contact points. Just wanted to provide an update in case anyoneelse is still looking. I ended up getting a Starrett point from McMaster-Carr(www.mcmaster.com).It isn't a stock item for them, and they told me it would take 2-3 weeks.In reality, it only took around a week. A couple of other plusses: 1. No minimum order2. Shipping was less than $3 The McMaster part number is 21085A745. I don't have an 800 number forthem,but they have local phone numbers on their website. The Cleveland/Akronarea number is 330-995-5500. Usual disclaimers, no affiliation, etc., etc. Hope this helps. Keith from edriddle@mindspring.com Tue Nov 2 08:52:48 1999 Subject: Re: Crooked strips & translucent wraps The Poly I used (Minwax brand), without color preserver, darkened thewraps.Ed-----Original Message----- Subject: Crooked strips & translucent wraps Hi All, Just wondering if anyone might have some advice on the best placementofcrooked strips? Howell's book says to put the straightest strips in thebuttsection, but that seems counterintuitive to me. Does everyone concurwiththat? Also, I'm planning to use polyurethane varnish, brushed on, willthisresult in translucent wraps or act as a color preserver? TIA. Eric Sweet from tjtrodmaker@yahoo.com Tue Nov 2 08:58:17 1999 1999 06:58:13 PST Subject: Re: Straight Strips? i've decided that the best way to deal with crookedstrips is to pick perfect culms of bamboo. perfectculms would produce zero variationsno straighteningand no node flattening. i'm looking for a source now.timothy p.s. i'm still looking! --- Bob Nunley wrote:OK, the email I just responded to from Eric justbrought another question to mind concerning part ofthat subject.How many of you straighten your strips. I knowwe all straighten the nodes, but do any of the otherof you straighten the entire strip. I always havebecause... well, I guess my thinking is thestraighter the strip, the easier the planing andbinding process go, and the straightening processafter the binding. Any opinions? Bob+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ R.L. "Bob" Nunley, Rodmaker + Custom Split Bamboo Fly Rods+ http://members.clnk.com/caneman/images/flystuff/caneindex.htm++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ ====="Gooda' morning mister bear"__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com from noblur@stic.net Tue Nov 2 09:01:02 1999 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0- 60503U15500L11000S0V35)with SMTP id net; Tue, 2 Nov 1999 09:00:59 - 0600 Subject: Re: 60 degree contact point follow up boundary="----=_NextPart_000_00AE_01BF2510.BD423340" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_00AE_01BF2510.BD423340 I found several in the Travers catalog, ranging from $4, up to $9.95, =depending on the size of Morse taper. GMA Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 1999 8:44 AMSubject: 60 degree contact point follow up Hello all, A few weeks back a few people (myself included) inquired about sources=for60 degree contact points. Just wanted to provide an update in case =any oneelse is still looking. I ended up getting a Starrett point from McMaster-Carr =(www.mcmaster.com).It isn't a stock item for them, and they told me it would take 2-3 =weeks.In reality, it only took around a week. A couple of other plusses: 1. No minimum order2. Shipping was less than $3 The McMaster part number is 21085A745. I don't have an 800 number for=them,but they have local phone numbers on their website. The =Cleveland/Akronarea number is 330-995-5500. Usual disclaimers, no affiliation, etc., etc. Hope this helps. Keith ------=_NextPart_000_00AE_01BF2510.BD423340 I found several in the Travers catalog, ranging from $4, up= $9.95, depending on the size of Morse taper. GMA ----- Original Message ----- Keith Brewster = Sent: Tuesday, November 02, = AMSubject: 60 degree contact = upHello all,A few weeks back a few people(myself = included) inquired about sources for60 degree contact = wanted to provide an update in case any oneelse is still = ended up getting a Starrett point from McMaster-Carr (www.mcmaster.com).Itisn't a = was = 330-995-5500.Usual disclaimers, no affiliation, etc., = this helps.Keith ------=_NextPart_000_00AE_01BF2510.BD423340-- from edriddle@mindspring.com Tue Nov 2 09:12:52 1999 Subject: Fw: Crooked strips & translucent wraps I should have added: Wraps will be translucent, but of a darker shade.Ed----- Original Message----- Subject: Re: Crooked strips & translucent wraps The Poly I used (Minwax brand), without color preserver, darkened thewraps.Ed-----Original Message-----From: EESweet@aol.com Date: Tuesday, November 02, 1999 9:18 AMSubject: Crooked strips & translucent wraps Hi All, Just wondering if anyone might have some advice on the best placementofcrooked strips? Howell's book says to put the straightest strips in thebuttsection, but that seems counterintuitive to me. Does everyone concurwiththat? Also, I'm planning to use polyurethane varnish, brushed on, willthisresult in translucent wraps or act as a color preserver? TIA. Eric Sweet from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Tue Nov 2 09:26:51 1999 Tue, 2 Nov 1999 07:26:29 -0800 Subject: Re: 60 degree contact point follow up boundary="------------5952447E4B378FC2D5FC1274" --------------5952447E4B378FC2D5FC1274 George,I think the points referred to are for a dial indicator depthgauge. They usually have a fine screw attachement. Is it possible thatyou are referring to a different kind of point? The Starrett points arethe only ones I've ever seen that work correctly. Harry "George M. Aldrich" wrote: I found several in the Travers catalog, ranging from $4, up to $9.95,depending on the size of Morse taper. GMA ----- Original Message -----From: Keith Brewster Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 1999 8:44 AMSubject: 60 degree contact point follow upHello all, A few weeks back a few people (myself included) inquiredabout sources for60 degree contact points. Just wanted to provide an updatein case any oneelse is still looking. I ended up getting a Starrett point from McMaster-Carr(www.mcmaster.com).It isn't a stock item for them, and they told me it wouldtake 2-3 weeks.In reality, it only took around a week. A couple of otherplusses: 1. No minimum order2. Shipping was less than $3 The McMaster part number is 21085A745. I don't have an 800number for them,but they have local phone numbers on their website. TheCleveland/Akronarea number is 330-995-5500. Usual disclaimers, no affiliation, etc., etc. Hope this helps. Keith --------------5952447E4B378FC2D5FC1274 George, indicator The Starrett points are the only ones I've ever seen that work correctly. "George M. Aldrich" wrote: I found several in the Traverscatalog, ranging from $4, up to $9.95, depending on the size of Morse ----- Original Message ----- From:KeithBrewster Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 19998:44AM Subject: 60 degree contact pointfollowup A few weeks back a few people (myself included) inquired aboutsourcesfor case any oneelse is still looking.I ended up getting a Starrett point from McMaster-Carr (www.mcmaster.com).It isn't a stock item for them, and they told me it would take 2-3weeks. number Cleveland/Akronarea number is 330-995-5500.Usual disclaimers, no affiliation, etc., etc.Hope this helps.Keith --------------5952447E4B378FC2D5FC1274-- from andrew_harsanyi@ibi.com Tue Nov 2 09:29:09 1999 0500 Subject: Planing form adjustment using slotted plane My plane has a .005" groove in it. Any recommendations on what to set theformto on the very final planing? I can use the force and do a lot of measuring,butwas wondering if anyone had a preferred technique to get around the factthatthere was that .005" play to deal with. Icould set the form to, say, .047 (.047 + .005 = .052 if the blade is flushwiththe top/inside of the groove) and by measuring the shavings and the strip Icould make sure that I don't overdo it. But this still seems a bitimprecise... Thanks...Andy from noblur@stic.net Tue Nov 2 09:36:39 1999 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0- 60503U15500L11000S0V35)with SMTP id net; Tue, 2 Nov 1999 09:36:35 - 0600 Subject: Re: 60 degree contact point follow up boundary="----=_NextPart_000_001A_01BF2515.B67AB820" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_001A_01BF2515.B67AB820 My error, as I thought this was referring to 60 deg. centers, as for =head, and tail stock, in the lathe. GMA Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 1999 9:28 AMSubject: Re: 60 degree contact point follow up I think the points referred to are for a dial indicator depth =gauge. They usually have a fine screw attachement. Is it possible that =you are referring to a different kind of point? The Starrett points are = I found several in the Travers catalog, ranging from $4, up to = ----- Original Message -----From: Keith Brewster Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 1999 8:44 AMSubject: 60 degree contact point follow up A few weeks back a few people (myself included) inquired about = 60 degree contact points. Just wanted to provide an update in = I ended up getting a Starrett point from McMaster-Carr = It isn't a stock item for them, and they told me it would take 2-3 = In reality, it only took around a week. A couple of other = The McMaster part number is 21085A745. I don't have an 800 number = but they have local phone numbers on their website. The = ------=_NextPart_000_001A_01BF2515.B67AB820 My error, as I thought this was referring to 60 deg. = GMA ----- Original Message ----- Harry = Cc: punky@integratedmillsystems.com ; rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= Sent: Tuesday, November 02, = AMSubject: Re: 60 degree contact = follow up I found several in the Travers catalog, ranging from $4, up to = ----- Original Message ----- Keith Brewster Sent: Tuesday, November 02, = AMSubject: 60 degree contact = A few weeks back a few people (myself included) inquired about = I ended up getting a Starrett point from McMaster-Carr (www.mcmaster.com). It= item for them, and they told me it would take 2-3 weeks. In = ------=_NextPart_000_001A_01BF2515.B67AB820-- from Kirk_Brownlee@jdedwards.com Tue Nov 2 09:56:47 1999 VirusWall NT);Tue, 02 Nov 1999 08:54:57 -0700 (Mountain Standard Time) (5.5.2448.0) Subject: RE: SRG 99 Ron, No it has no hook keep or any Heddon marks looks like it was completelyrefinished... I bought it from Mike Clark from his shop and he saidhe thought it was a Heddon Bill Stanley's favorite feather weight butwas not sure if that was the correct model but he did know it was aHeddon. It is a fabulous Rod. It is beautiful caramel color cane, dark red raps,nickel silver hardware, and a cork reel seat. And it casts like a dreamif all Heddons where like this I would be broke from buying them all. I have never mic'd a rod but I'll give it a shot if someone cantell me where on the rod I measure. Kirk -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: SRG 99 kIRK, Does your rod have a swelled butt? Does it have the hookkeeperwithan open wrap. Describe the ferrules if you would.The only Heddon rod Ihaveever seen or worked on that has a cork reel seat is the #51 Princess. Howis the Heddon written? On one flat or across three flats. This would helpdetermine the time your rod was built.. It sounds like a neat rod. RonHuff----- Original Message ----- Subject: RE: SRG 99 Does the #14 feather weight have red wraps and a sliding band cork realseat? I have a Heddon not sure what model but it has Red Wraps and the slidingcorkreal seat. It's a 7'6 5 weight that I bought with one tip down and I lovetheheck out of this rod. If the above mentioned Rod is the the Heddon #14 feather weight I towouldloveto have the tapper. Thanks,Kirkkdbrownlee@msn.com or kirk_brownlee@jdedwards.com -----Original Message----- Sent: Monday, November 01, 1999 12:11 PM Subject: Re: SRG 99 STOP! before you give up that notebook...i'm looking from sniderja@email.uc.edu Tue Nov 2 10:13:05 1999 Subject: Re: Fw: Crooked strips & translucent wraps I have tested perhaps 5-6 types of poly on wraps (as well as spar varnish). I used a variety of colors (9-10) including three shades of red, burgundy, yellow and a couple of golds and all of the tans through chestnuts. With each poly I used I obtained transparent (translucent?) wraps, but in all cases, except red and white, the colors darkened considerably. Tansbecame beiges, beiges became browns, browns became chestnut browns, andchestnut browns turned black (almost). White became completely transparent, andthe reds brightened up considerably. The yellow turned completely transparent with just a TINGE of color. Antique gold turned a lt. tan color, and bright (flour.?) gold turned a pleasant translucent pale gold. Interestingly, I used a copper ( from Anglers Workshop) in two different thread sizes andobserved two completely different shades upon varnishing. The finer silk took on aJava Beige coloration whereas the heavier thread turned chestnut (using thesame varnishes). These colors also changed somewhat depending upon how darkly flamedthe bamboo was. Indeed, on a striped flamed shaft, the colors changed slightly depending upon whether they were on a dark region or a lighter region. It is likely that more experienced builders have had different experiencesand will take exception to these observations. However, I can say that I have been a tad anal about this topic and have spent considerable effort wrapping sample, after sample, after sample.... J. Snider At 11:10 AM 11/2/1999 -0500, Ed Riddle wrote:I should have added: Wraps will be translucent, but of a darker shade.Ed-----Original Message-----From: Ed Riddle Cc: rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Date: Tuesday, November 02, 1999 10:50 AMSubject: Re: Crooked strips & translucent wraps The Poly I used (Minwax brand), without color preserver, darkened thewraps.Ed-----Original Message-----From: EESweet@aol.com Date: Tuesday, November 02, 1999 9:18 AMSubject: Crooked strips & translucent wraps Hi All, Just wondering if anyone might have some advice on the best placementofcrooked strips? Howell's book says to put the straightest strips in thebuttsection, but that seems counterintuitive to me. Does everyone concurwiththat? Also, I'm planning to use polyurethane varnish, brushed on, willthisresult in translucent wraps or act as a color preserver? TIA. Eric Sweet from saweiss@flash.net Tue Nov 2 10:44:35 1999 Subject: Re: Planing form adjustment using slotted plane Andrew,Your groove is .005 but you would not be cutting if the blade were set. 005deep in the plane. You set the blade to cut at the desired thickness ofshaving. If the shaving is .003, then the blade is only .002 above theforms, so you would set your forms a bit tighter. I plane my first stripwith the forms set at 1/2 the rod dimensions, then go back and re-set andfinal-plane or scrape at each station until I get the desired stripdimension. Then I go ahead and plane all of the strips. Finally, I use mydepth micrometer on the adjusted forms and note the actualmeasurements inmy taper book for future reference.Steve My plane has a .005" groove in it. Any recommendations on what to settheformto on the very final planing? I can use the force and do a lot ofmeasuring, butwas wondering if anyone had a preferred technique to get around the factthatthere was that .005" play to deal with. strip, Icould set the form to, say, .047 (.047 + .005 = .052 if the blade is flushwiththe top/inside of the groove) and by measuring the shavings and the stripIcould make sure that I don't overdo it. But this still seems a bitimprecise...Thanks...Andy from KlingB@health.missouri.edu Tue Nov 2 11:10:02 1999 Subject: RE: Planing form adjustment using slotted plane I'm a rookie but isn't the main point of the .005 groove to permit the bladeto be positioned barely touching the form, so that in the final passes onetakes off all the excess material without scraping steel (or wood...) withthe blade? Barry Kling -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Planing form adjustment using slotted plane Andrew,Your groove is .005 but you would not be cutting if the blade were set. 005deep in the plane. You set the blade to cut at the desired thickness ofshaving. If the shaving is .003, then the blade is only .002 above theforms, so you would set your forms a bit tighter. I plane my first stripwith the forms set at 1/2 the rod dimensions, then go back and re-set andfinal-plane or scrape at each station until I get the desired stripdimension. Then I go ahead and plane all of the strips. Finally, I use mydepth micrometer on the adjusted forms and note the actualmeasurements inmy taper book for future reference.Steve My plane has a .005" groove in it. Any recommendations on what to settheformto on the very final planing? I can use the force and do a lot ofmeasuring, butwas wondering if anyone had a preferred technique to get around the factthatthere was that .005" play to deal with. strip, Icould set the form to, say, .047 (.047 + .005 = .052 if the blade is flushwiththe top/inside of the groove) and by measuring the shavings and the stripIcould make sure that I don't overdo it. But this still seems a bitimprecise...Thanks...Andy from andrew_harsanyi@ibi.com Tue Nov 2 11:38:52 1999 0500 Subject: RE: Planing form adjustment using slotted plane My understanding is that the groove allows you to set the blade within thegroove so that it does not touch the planing forms at all. This then leavesthequestion of how far into the groove the blade is really projecting whenplaning,and hence how to get an accurate strip width ...Andy -----Original Message----- Subject: RE: Planing form adjustment using slotted plane I'm a rookie but isn't the main point of the .005 groove to permit the bladeto be positioned barely touching the form, so that in the final passes onetakes off all the excess material without scraping steel (or wood...) withthe blade? Barry Kling from tjtrodmaker@yahoo.com Tue Nov 2 12:12:21 1999 1999 10:12:18 PST Subject: RE: Planing form adjustment using slotted plane i see! that's just one more reason i'm not putting agroove in an otherwise good plane. timothy--- andrew_harsanyi@ibi.com wrote:Thanks for the message Timothy...tgroove he onlyproblem is that the blade willextend into that .005" and depending on how much,the measurement will be off.With a flat sole, the planing form itself actuallykeeps you from going too farinto the cane...the cane ends up fluch with theform. With the groove, whenyou're done, the cane will actually be protruding abit into thegroove...question is how to get it to protrude justthe right amount...Andy -----Original Message-----From: timothy troester Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 1999 11:18 AM Subject: Re: Planing form adjustment using slottedplane andy, if you make a .005" adj in your plane youhaveto make a .005" adj in how you set your form. personally i'm not convinced it is possible toaccurately measure a shaving. some believe it ispossible but i'm simply not convinced. timothy --- andrew_harsanyi@ibi.com wrote:My plane has a .005" groove in it. Anyrecommendations on what to set the formto on the very final planing? I can use the forceand do a lot of measuring, butwas wondering if anyone had a preferred techniquetoget around the fact thatthere was that .005" play to deal with. number of .050" on a strip, Icould set the form to, say, .047 (.047 + .005 =.052if the blade is flush withthe top/inside of the groove) and by measuring theshavings and the strip Icould make sure that I don't overdo it. But thisstill seems a bit imprecise... Thanks...Andy ====="Gooda' morning mister bear"__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com ====="Gooda' morning mister bear"__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com from tjtrodmaker@yahoo.com Tue Nov 2 12:28:12 1999 1999 10:28:08 PST Subject: Re: Fw: Crooked strips & translucent wraps At 08:31 AM 11/2/1999 -0800, you wrote:i wrapped a rod with small flytying floss beforeandal'tho this too had a translucence the color stayedthe same. the result was magnificent. has any oneelse tried floss? --- Jerry Snider wrote:I have tested perhaps 5-6 types of poly on wraps(aswell as spar varnish). I used a variety of colors (9-10) including threeshades of red, burgundy, yellow and a couple of golds and all of the tansthrough chestnuts. With each poly I used I obtained transparent(translucent?) wraps, but in all cases, except red and white, the colors darkenedconsiderably. Tans became beiges, beiges became browns, browns becamechestnutbrowns, and chestnut browns turned black (almost). White becamecompletely transparent, and the reds brightened up considerably. The yellowturnedcompletely transparent with just a TINGE of color. Antique gold turned alt. tan color, and bright (flour.?) gold turned a pleasanttranslucentpale gold. Interestingly, I used a copper ( from Anglers Workshop) in two differentthread sizes and observed two completely different shades upon varnishing.Thefiner silk took on a Java Beige coloration whereas the heavier threadturnedchestnut (using the same varnishes). These colors also changed somewhat depending uponhow darkly flamed the bamboo was. Indeed, on a striped flamed shaft,thecolors changed slightly depending upon whether they were on a dark regionora lighter region. It is likely that more experienced builders havehaddifferent experiences and will take exception to these observations.However,I can say that I have been a tad anal about this topic and have spentconsiderable effort wrapping sample, after sample, after sample.... J. Snider At 11:10 AM 11/2/1999 -0500, Ed Riddle wrote:I should have added: Wraps will be translucent,but of a darker shade.Ed-----Original Message-----From: Ed Riddle Cc: rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Date: Tuesday, November 02, 1999 10:50 AMSubject: Re: Crooked strips & translucent wraps The Poly I used (Minwax brand), without colorpreserver, darkened thewraps.Ed-----Original Message-----From: EESweet@aol.com Date: Tuesday, November 02, 1999 9:18 AMSubject: Crooked strips & translucent wraps Hi All, Just wondering if anyone might have someadviceon the best placement ofcrooked strips? Howell's book says to put thestraightest strips in thebuttsection, but that seems counterintuitive tome. Does everyone concur withthat? Also, I'm planning to use polyurethanevarnish, brushed on, willthisresult in translucent wraps or act as a colorpreserver? TIA. Eric Sweet ====="Gooda' morning mister bear"__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com ====="Gooda' morning mister bear"__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com from KlingB@health.missouri.edu Tue Nov 2 13:07:56 1999 Subject: RE: Planing form adjustment using slotted plane It may be beginners luck, but I used it as described below, with the formset to the final dimension, and came within 0.003 consistently on a 3-piece2-tip rod requiring 24 strips. Not sure if you'd consider that goodaccuracy, but I was pleasantly surprised. pieces of 0.005 thick steel (I scrounged mine from an old spark plug gapfeeler gauge set) along both sides of the plane. Not hard to remove if youquit fishing to take up an honest craft. Barry -----Original Message----- Subject: RE: Planing form adjustment using slotted plane My understanding is that the groove allows you to set the blade within thegroove so that it does not touch the planing forms at all. This then leavesthequestion of how far into the groove the blade is really projecting whenplaning,and hence how to get an accurate strip width ...Andy -----Original Message----- Subject: RE: Planing form adjustment using slotted plane I'm a rookie but isn't the main point of the .005 groove to permit the bladeto be positioned barely touching the form, so that in the final passes onetakes off all the excess material without scraping steel (or wood...) withthe blade? Barry Kling from ctracy@ckan.com Tue Nov 2 13:15:21 1999 (EudoraInternet Mail Server 2.2.2); Tue, 2 Nov 1999 14:24:45 -0600 Subject: Lathe Threading Tool Hello to all on the list, I've been lurking and learning here for quite a while. During thistime, I've been putting together the basic tools and other items thatare needed to begin construction of my first rod. While I am almostthere, I've run into a bit of a problem and so I am turning here forsome more of your valuable information and advice. I'm having difficulty acquiring the 60 degree lathe threading toolneeded to make a set of adjustable planing forms. I have the formsdrilled and ready to go, I just need to get the tool to cut the groove. I know that the advice of this group has been to go to a local machinetool supply shop and get this tool, but that is part of the problem. Ilive in a rural agricultural-based community in the middle of Kansas.Therefore, there is no such animal in this neck of the woods. Theclosest machine tool supply shop is 2 - 3 hours away. Last weekend Imade it to a Grainger store in Topeka and was able to get a couple ofitems I was missing but got a blank stare when I asked about the lathethreading tool. Here comes the question, does anyone know of an on-line source where Ican order the tool? I've looked at McMaster-Carr, MSC and Grainger buthave been unable to identify what I'm looking for. I know that it'sprobably at one of these places, and I've probably looked right at itbut, as a total neophyte, haven't been able to properly identify it.Any help you can give (possibly including a part number) would begreatly appreciated. Thanks in advance for your help and thanks for all of the wonderful tipsand insightful conversation that the list has offered so far. Chuck from freaner@gte.net Tue Nov 2 13:40:15 1999 Subject: Plane Cutter Adjusting I have a question that I've been unable to find the answer for in thearchives: On a standard Stanley 9 1/2 plane, if you make one revolution of the cutteradjustment wheel, how much does that adjust the cutter (change inthicknessof a shaving)? Claude from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Tue Nov 2 13:41:05 1999 Tue, 2 Nov 1999 11:40:57 -0800 Subject: Re: Lathe Threading Tool Chuck,Looked one up in an old Enco catalog I have behind my desk at work. TryEnco at (800)873-3626, and ask for a catalog. I've bought quite a bit ofstuff from them and never been disappointed.The part # for a 1/2" 60* lathe cutting bit is: 383-4032 in C-2(which should do fine), and 383-4035 in C-5 (higher grade). The cost is$2.56. I don't think you need a lathe bit as large as the one mentionedabove, but that's just for reference.I used the 3/8" bit for cutting most of the material off my forms,then cleaned them up with a triangular file. The 3/8" bit numbers are:383-4022 in C-2, and 383-4025 in C-5. Cost is $1.86. Shipping will bemorethan the part!! hope this helps,Harry Chuck Tracy wrote: Hello to all on the list, I've been lurking and learning here for quite a while. During thistime, I've been putting together the basic tools and other items thatare needed to begin construction of my first rod. While I am almostthere, I've run into a bit of a problem and so I am turning here forsome more of your valuable information and advice. I'm having difficulty acquiring the 60 degree lathe threading toolneeded to make a set of adjustable planing forms. I have the formsdrilled and ready to go, I just need to get the tool to cut the groove. I know that the advice of this group has been to go to a local machinetool supply shop and get this tool, but that is part of the problem. Ilive in a rural agricultural-based community in the middle of Kansas.Therefore, there is no such animal in this neck of the woods. Theclosest machine tool supply shop is 2 - 3 hours away. Last weekend Imade it to a Grainger store in Topeka and was able to get a couple ofitems I was missing but got a blank stare when I asked about the lathethreading tool. Here comes the question, does anyone know of an on-line source where Ican order the tool? I've looked at McMaster-Carr, MSC and Grainger buthave been unable to identify what I'm looking for. I know that it'sprobably at one of these places, and I've probably looked right at itbut, as a total neophyte, haven't been able to properly identify it.Any help you can give (possibly including a part number) would begreatly appreciated. Thanks in advance for your help and thanks for all of the wonderful tipsand insightful conversation that the list has offered so far. Chuck from flytyr@southshore.com Tue Nov 2 15:04:06 1999 [205.167.143.104] (may beforged)) Tue, 2 Nov 1999 15:02:20 -0600 Subject: Re: Southern tears E90C6B1F9AE1E8E1152ED0A6" --------------E90C6B1F9AE1E8E1152ED0A6 Harry,How true!!!!Thanks for having this event. It is a highlight ofthe year.Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com Harry Boyd wrote: Time for a little heartfelt emotion. Hit"Delete" now if you don't want to read a littlecreative writing. SouthernTears Who is the fellow who makes bamboo rods? Who is the fellow who makes bamboo rods? Thestereotype portrays him (or her) as a lonewolf. He hibernates in his shop for hours at atime. Strange sounds and smells eminate fromwithin. Passers by startle at the crack ofpopping nodes and shrieks of pain from "themother of all paper cuts". Bamboo roasting withthe delicacy of almonds mingles in ones mindwith the caustic fumes of high tech glues andsolvents and noxious ammonia fumes. Crumpledgraph paper with scribbled points and figuresand computer printouts accumulate in the trashshoved outside the shop to make room for planing"just one more strip." Smoke from an old burnedout pipe circles his head constantly as heruminates over how to solve a problem or workout the latest challenge. Who is the fellow who makes bamboo rods?Usually the rodmaker is tall like Bob N. or BillL. -- or, short like me. Often he is wiry andthin like Rick C. or Miles T. -- or pudgy likeme. He is barrel-chested like Ken C.. or Kurt L-- or weak like me. He is clean cut like JerryB. or Alan G.-- or scruffy looking like me. Heis quiet like Henry and Onis, or a loudmouthlike me. He's got a full head of hair, likeJoe -- or he is bald, like me. His work isartful, his creativity amazing, like Al M. -- orbumbling like mine. He is intelligent andintense, focused and filled with energy, likeWayne, -- or lazy, like _______. He's IBM likeDan, or Apple like Ron. He makes his own beerlike Mike, -- or doesn't drink at all, like me.;-) He's from "South of Interstate 10" likeJody -- or "Northville", like John L. and BillW. He's from the west coast like Cary -- or theeast coast like Harold. He's from Norway by wayof Texas like Morten. He's mean like Phil andkind like Dennis. He's young and old, goodlooking and ugly, quiet and loud, blue collarand white, Democrat and Republican, Buddhist,Baptist, and everything in between. And he wasat the Southern Rodmakers Gathering. -------------------- As the party known as "SRG 99" finallybroke up just before daylight yesterday morning,I shook hands with Rick Crenshaw, Miles Tiernan,Mike Biondo, Wayne Cattanach, Dennis Higham anda couple of others; kissed Eileen Demarest,and hugged Charlie Curro. I wanted to lingerjust a few minutes longer but instead hustledbehind the protection of the tinted windows ofmy van, so no one would see the tears of joy andsadness overflow my eyes. Real joy is spendingan hour sitting on a rock in the middle of ariver with a close friend I had never laid eyeson before last years gathering. A real friendwho is also a trusted counselor and advisor.Real sadness is a friend moving 1000 miles away,knowing that your contact will be more limitedin the future. Real joy is the magnanimousHarold Demarest. Real sadness is that we losefriends every year. Joy is Miles'"smooooooothing a taper." Sadness is thatGrayrock is eight long months down the road.Words can't express my appreciation forall of you who made this year's SRG special.This was by far the best gathering I've everattended. (Of course, I've only been to two andorganized them both.) Dozens of you gave ofyour time, energy and money to make thishappen. Most of all you gave yourselves.That's what makes it good.Twenty years ago rodmakers were known Ca*&%$via got a bunch together, and look whathas happened. I won't mention many names, but thisgathering would not have taken place without theefforts and encouragement of Rick Crenshaw andCharlie Curro, my co-conspirators. Thank you,Rick. Thank you, Charlie.A committee is being formed to put SRG2000 together, and we will fill you all in onthe details soon. Suffice it to say, "Nextyear, same time, same place." My sincere thanks and best to all, Harry --------------E90C6B1F9AE1E8E1152ED0A6 Harry,How true!!!!Thanks for having this event. It is a highlight of the year. Harry Boyd wrote: Hit "Delete" now if you don't want to read a little creative writing. Southern Tears portrays Passers almondsmingles in ones mind with the caustic fumes of high tech glues andsolvents pointsand figures and computer printouts accumulate in the trash shoved outside froman old burned out pipe circles his head constantly as he ruminates overhow to solve a problem or work out the latest challenge. cut like Jerry B. or Alan G.-- or scruffy looking like me. He is quiet intelligent and intense, focused and filled with energy, like Wayne, -- He makes his own beer like Mike, -- or doesn't drink at all, like me. ;- and old, good looking and ugly, quiet and loud, blue collar and white,Democrat and Republican, Buddhist, Baptist, and everything in And he was at the Southern Rodmakers Gathering. -------------------- "SRG 99" finally broke up just before daylight yesterday morning, I shookhands with Rick Crenshaw, Miles Tiernan, Mike Biondo, Wayne Cattanach, Demarest, longerbut instead hustled behind the protection of the tinted windows of my van, Real joy is spending an hour sitting on a rock in the middle of a riverwith a close friend I had never laid eyes on before last years gathering. Real sadness is a friend moving 1000 miles away, knowing that yourcontact Harold is eight long months down the road. appreciation That's what makes it good. rodmakers Ca*&%$viagot a bunch together, and look what has happened. names,but this gathering would not have taken place without the efforts andencouragement formedto put SRG 2000 together, and we will fill you all in on the details Suffice it to say, "Next year, same time, same place." bestto all, --------------E90C6B1F9AE1E8E1152ED0A6-- from rmoon@ida.net Tue Nov 2 15:07:14 1999 0000 Subject: Re: Plane Cutter Adjusting ClaudeWith the slack present in that adjustment, I don't think that you canhave any confidence. I have found that often I may make as little as aquarter of a turn and still the shaving was too thick and other times2-3 turns before I can even register a change. Personally I fail to seeany need for this information.Ralph from tjtrodmaker@yahoo.com Tue Nov 2 15:35:43 1999 1999 13:35:35 PST Subject: Re: Plane Cutter Adjusting adjusting the plane just right is alot like tinkeringisn't it? timothy --- Ralph W Moon wrote:ClaudeWith the slack present in that adjustment, I don'tthink that you canhave any confidence. I have found that often I maymake as little as aquarter of a turn and still the shaving was toothick and other times2-3 turns before I can even register a change. Personally I fail to seeany need for this information.Ralph ====="Gooda' morning mister bear"__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com from TSmithwick@aol.com Tue Nov 2 16:11:15 1999 Subject: Re: Re: Plane Cutter Adjusting In a message dated 11/2/99 9:14:10 PM, rmoon@ida.net wrote: In a message dated 11/2/99 9:14:10 PM, you wrote: I have to agree with you Ralph. The best thing Claude can do for himself is learn how to set the blade by eye. All you have to do is turn the plane upside down and sight down the sole while you hold it level with your eye. The edge of the blade will appear as a thin protrusion from the sole. Youcan now set the side to side adjustment to square the blade with the sole. Observe how much of the blade sticks out from the sole and take practice cuts while adjusting to the proper depth. Then observe the sole and theblade again. You will soon be able to set the blade very close to final adjustment from rmoon@ida.net Tue Nov 2 16:30:24 1999 0000 rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Re: Plane Cutter Adjusting Tom I am very partial to those high tech procedures. I smell my oven,feel my bamboo and like you sight the bottom of my plane. I also bouncea culm of bamboo, listen to the rasp of a sharp plane blade. Funny Inever did feel the need for a depth guage.Ralph from noblur@stic.net Tue Nov 2 16:40:00 1999 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0- 60503U15500L11000S0V35)with SMTP id net; Tue, 2 Nov 1999 16:39:50 - 0600 Subject: Re: Lathe Threading Tool boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0053_01BF2550.D77BF620" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0053_01BF2550.D77BF620 Will someone please explain how a 60 deg. lathe threading tool is used =to cut a groove ?????? Or, is this some other type a groove, than in the =planning form ? GMA Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 1999 1:22 PMSubject: Lathe Threading Tool Hello to all on the list, I've been lurking and learning here for quite a while. During thistime, I've been putting together the basic tools and other items thatare needed to begin construction of my first rod. While I am almostthere, I've run into a bit of a problem and so I am turning here forsome more of your valuable information and advice. I'm having difficulty acquiring the 60 degree lathe threading toolneeded to make a set of adjustable planing forms. I have the formsdrilled and ready to go, I just need to get the tool to cut the =groove. I know that the advice of this group has been to go to a local machinetool supply shop and get this tool, but that is part of the problem. =Ilive in a rural agricultural-based community in the middle of Kansas.Therefore, there is no such animal in this neck of the woods. Theclosest machine tool supply shop is 2 - 3 hours away. Last weekend Imade it to a Grainger store in Topeka and was able to get a couple ofitems I was missing but got a blank stare when I asked about the lathethreading tool. Here comes the question, does anyone know of an on-line source where Ican order the tool? I've looked at McMaster-Carr, MSC and Grainger =buthave been unable to identify what I'm looking for. I know that it'sprobably at one of these places, and I've probably looked right at itbut, as a total neophyte, haven't been able to properly identify it.Any help you can give (possibly including a part number) would begreatly appreciated. Thanks in advance for your help and thanks for all of the wonderful =tipsand insightful conversation that the list has offered so far. Chuck ------=_NextPart_000_0053_01BF2550.D77BF620 Will someone please explain how a 60 deg. lathe threading = used to cut a groove ?????? Or, is this some other type a groove, than = planning form ? GMA ----- Original Message ----- Chuck =Tracy Sent: Tuesday, November 02, = PMSubject: Lathe Threading =ToolHello to all on the list,I've been lurking and = the basic tools and other items thatare needed to begin = and so I am turning here forsome more of your valuable information= advice.I'm having difficulty acquiring the 60 degree lathe = formsdrilled and ready to go, I just need to get the tool to cut = groove.I know that the advice of this group has been to go to = machinetool supply shop and get this tool, but that is part of the = able to get a couple ofitems I was missing but got a blank stare = asked about the lathethreading tool.Here comes the = looked at McMaster-Carr, MSC and Grainger buthave been unable to = what I'm looking for. I know that it'sprobably at one of these = I've probably looked right at itbut, as a total neophyte, haven't = able to properly identify it.Any help you can give (possibly = part number) would begreatly appreciated.Thanks in advance= far.Chuck ------=_NextPart_000_0053_01BF2550.D77BF620-- from caneman@clnk.com Tue Nov 2 17:38:47 1999 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35)with SMTP id com; Tue, 2 Nov 1999 17:37:32 -0600 Subject: Re: Crooked strips & translucent wraps Ed, I guess I should have said that too. all poly's, varnishes, etc... anyfinish will darken anything but a light colored silk or nylong. That wasanother reason for doing a test strip. When you got it done, you wouldknowexactly what color your wraps were going to be. Bob -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Crooked strips & translucent wraps The Poly I used (Minwax brand), without color preserver, darkened thewraps.Ed-----Original Message-----From: EESweet@aol.com Date: Tuesday, November 02, 1999 9:18 AMSubject: Crooked strips & translucent wraps Hi All, Just wondering if anyone might have some advice on the best placementofcrooked strips? Howell's book says to put the straightest strips in thebuttsection, but that seems counterintuitive to me. Does everyone concurwiththat? Also, I'm planning to use polyurethane varnish, brushed on, willthisresult in translucent wraps or act as a color preserver? TIA. Eric Sweet from jkallo@midwest.net Tue Nov 2 18:00:31 1999 Subject: Re: SRG-Joe Kallo I should have known better I suppose. (grin) Maybe if I just made the dang things in four pieces it would be simplifytheprocess of remaking sections that I destroy. hmmm.... Joe Joseph S. KalloDpt. of PhilosophySouthern Illinois University at Carbondale On Mon, 01 Nov 1999, you wrote:Joe, You are one genuinely fine fellow - a pleasure to be around, good senseof humor, a heartwarming smile. I'd lend you a rod any day (especiallysince I know you can build one), but SURELY you have earned a newmoniker here. Therefore, with the powers vested in by as a shiftless SouthernRodmaker, I hereby make this Proclaimation: WHEREAS, you, Joe Kallo have participated in the making and fishing ofmultiple Bamboo Fly Rods, and WHEREAS, you have also used, abused and generally put said Rods throughextreme hardship and duress, and WHEREAS, you have the uncanny ability to render said Rods into morepieces than originally planned, THEREFORE, rise, Joe Kallo, Henceforth, you will be granted the HonoraryTitle of, and will be known as, FOUR-PIECE Rodmaker, Fisher of Dry Flies, and Lord of the Cringing Snap. A toast to Four-Piece!Rick C. Joe Kallo wrote: There is not much I can add to the notes posted about SRG--I've printedthemall out and tucked them in the fishing journal. I would like to add mythanksto Harry, Rick and Charlie. You guys did one hell of a job. Not evenlocking mykeys in the car or breaking yet another rod as I was getting ready toleave (Iprobably shouldn't even mention it--I'm gonna start getting banned fromthecasmic-castoff with my record) dimmed the great time I had. I lookforward toseeing you all next year. Best,Joe Joseph S. KalloDpt. of PhilosophySouthern Illinois University at Carbondale from Davidhray1@aol.com Tue Nov 2 18:19:03 1999 Subject: Constable Wisp Taper Does anyone have a Constable Wisp taper that they would share? Thanks, David H. Ray from channer@hubwest.com Tue Nov 2 18:23:05 1999 (SMTPD32-4.06) id A0E31EC30036; Tue, 02 Nov 1999 17:25:07 MST Subject: Re: Plane Cutter Adjusting At 01:35 PM 11/02/1999 -0800, timothy troester wrote:adjusting the plane just right is alot like tinkeringisn't it? timothy No, Timothy, it IS tinkering. That's what rodmaking is all about. Who doyou think built the first hexagonal rod?, tinkers of courseJohn from channer@hubwest.com Tue Nov 2 18:30:27 1999 (SMTPD32-4.06) id A29E30300DC; Tue, 02 Nov 1999 17:32:30 MST Subject: Re: Plane Cutter Adjusting At 05:09 PM 11/02/1999 EST, TSmithwick@aol.com wrote: In a message dated 11/2/99 9:14:10 PM, rmoon@ida.net wrote: any need for this information.>> In a message dated 11/2/99 9:14:10 PM, you wrote: any need for this information.>> I have to agree with you Ralph. The best thing Claude can do for himselfis learn how to set the blade by eye. All you have to do is turn the plane upside down and sight down the sole while you hold it level with youreye. The edge of the blade will appear as a thin protrusion from the sole. Youcan now set the side to side adjustment to square the blade with the sole. Observe how much of the blade sticks out from the sole and take practice cuts while adjusting to the proper depth. Then observe the sole and theblade again. You will soon be able to set the blade very close to finaladjustment Geez Tom, I always set mine by feel, if I take a nice smooth shaving offmythumb, then it is just right, if it digs in and makes a bloody mess, thenit is too deep. John from djk762@hotmail.com Tue Nov 2 18:36:09 1999 Tue, 02 Nov 1999 16:35:36 PST Subject: Re: Trip Report:First annual Bishop Gathering Rodmakers, Four rods in particular really impressed me at Bishop.Chris Mcdowell's cast as good as it looked- I think Don Burns said it was a Thramer taper.Jerry Foster brought a spiral Smithwick with a slightly ellipticalhandle- very light in the hand, terrific medium fast.Darrell Lee strung up a Pezon et Michael he got on his latest buying trip - great combination of smoothness and speed. This was my favorite of the small rods.Doug from Utah had his version of a 5 wt. 7'6" Payne. I really liked the feel of this stick- felt like the whole rod was casting, and without any sluggishness.Thanks to all for participating in this years gathering especially our host-Chuck Irvine.David Kashuba. ______________________________________________________Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com from saltwein@swbell.net Tue Nov 2 18:53:42 1999 (Sun Internet Mail Server sims.3.5.1999.09.16.21.57.p8)with ESMTP id for Subject: Re: Straight Strips? boundary="------------ABC6A07EA1EFD81EA55503BC" --------------ABC6A07EA1EFD81EA55503BC Bob, I straighten right up to the time I start final planing. Regards, SteveIndependence, MO Bob Nunley wrote: OK, the email I just responded to from Eric just brought anotherquestion to mind concerning part of that subject. How many of youstraighten your strips. I know we all straighten the nodes, but doany of the other of you straighten the entire strip. I always havebecause... well, I guess my thinking is the straighter the strip, theeasier the planing and binding process go, and the straighteningprocess after the binding. Anyopinions? Bob+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ R.L. "Bob" Nunley, Rodmaker+ Custom Split Bamboo Fly Rods+ http://members.clnk.com/caneman/images/flystuff/caneindex.htm++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ --------------ABC6A07EA1EFD81EA55503BC boundary="------------79400FE5199C8A3040CEADBE" --------------79400FE5199C8A3040CEADBE Bob,I straighten right up to the time I start final planing.Regards, SteveIndependence, MOBob Nunley wrote: OK,the email I just responded to from Eric just brought another question to because... well, I guess my thinking is the straighter the strip, the easierthe planing and binding process go, and the straightening process after + Custom Split Bamboo Fly Rods+ http://members.clnk.com/caneman/images/flystuff/caneindex.htm++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++> from saltwein@swbell.net Tue Nov 2 19:22:27 1999 (Sun Internet Mail Server sims.3.5.1999.09.16.21.57.p8)with ESMTP id for Subject: Re: SRG 99 Kirk, I put the rod together in a secure area and lay it on the floor then use aneyebrow pencil (white, they are very soft) to mark off, with a little tick,every five inches or as close to it as I can get. I also make note of thesemeasurements as I go. I like to use a micrometer rather than a caliper to get my measurements.If youuse a caliper put tape on the blades and reset 0 with the tape in place.Thatway you won't damage the varnish. When you have the rod marked off take it apart and sit in a comfortableplacewith good light. Take the measurements from the top to the bottom. Take ameasurement on each flat and write each set down as you go. The firstmeasurement will be around the 1 to 1-1/2 inch mark because of thetiptop. I personally like to take the first measurement in the casting plane. I holdthetip with the guides up and the tiptop facing me. I mic' that flat first andthengo clockwise to get the next two. This way if there is a discrepancy in thefigures I will always know which set was in the casting plane. Try to keepyourmicrometer or caliper square to the rod section you are mic'ing. Good Luck.Practice helps in this endeavor. Take your time, better if you are in a quietarea. Regards, SteveIndependence, MO "Brownlee, Kirk" wrote: Ron, No it has no hook keep or any Heddon marks looks like it was completelyrefinished... I bought it from Mike Clark from his shop and he saidhe thought it was a Heddon Bill Stanley's favorite feather weight butwas not sure if that was the correct model but he did know it was aHeddon. It is a fabulous Rod. It is beautiful caramel color cane, dark red raps,nickel silver hardware, and a cork reel seat. And it casts like a dreamif all Heddons where like this I would be broke from buying them all. I have never mic'd a rod but I'll give it a shot if someone cantell me where on the rod I measure. Kirk -----Original Message----- Sent: Monday, November 01, 1999 4:59 PM Cc: 'RODMAKERS'Subject: Re: SRG 99 kIRK, Does your rod have a swelled butt? Does it have the hookkeeperwithan open wrap. Describe the ferrules if you would.The only Heddon rod Ihaveever seen or worked on that has a cork reel seat is the #51 Princess. Howis the Heddon written? On one flat or across three flats. This wouldhelpdetermine the time your rod was built.. It sounds like a neat rod. RonHuff----- Original Message -----From: Brownlee, Kirk Sent: Monday, November 01, 1999 1:50 PMSubject: RE: SRG 99 Does the #14 feather weight have red wraps and a sliding band corkrealseat? I have a Heddon not sure what model but it has Red Wraps and theslidingcorkreal seat. It's a 7'6 5 weight that I bought with one tip down and I lovetheheck out of this rod. If the above mentioned Rod is the the Heddon #14 feather weight I towouldloveto have the tapper. Thanks,Kirkkdbrownlee@msn.com or kirk_brownlee@jdedwards.com -----Original Message----- Sent: Monday, November 01, 1999 12:11 PM Subject: Re: SRG 99 STOP! before you give up that notebook...i'm looking from TSmithwick@aol.com Tue Nov 2 19:27:51 1999 Subject: Re: Plane Cutter Adjusting rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu In a message dated 11/3/99 12:35:35 AM, channer@hubwest.com wrote: John - That is a very poor method. Blood is highly corrosive, and will ruin your blade. Of course, you could go on a low salt diet, that might help a bit. from pmgoodwin@earthlink.net Tue Nov 2 19:39:05 1999 Subject: Help For the novice Hi, As I get ready to build my first bamboo rod(s) I find that there are manythings that one needs. But what do I really need? Could I as the list to respond with what the first time builder needs, whatwould be nice to have, and the things you don't really need. TIAPaul from stpete@netten.net Tue Nov 2 19:43:57 1999 Tue, 2 Nov 1999 20:50:12 -0600 Subject: Re: Lathe Threading Tool Chuck, This tool is a standard carbide bit available from Harbor Freight, MSC,any tool supply. I bet there is a place around the corner from youwhere you can pick one up. Get one or two 1/2" or 5/8" tools - thebigger the better. Should cost you about $4-5. If you have trouble,contact a local machine shop, they probably have some sitting around. Make the block just like on Bruce Conner's page via Rodmakers. WARNING: cut the tip side first and use a triangle file put on a blockevery few strokes. The lathe tool is hard to keep centered if you tryto cut more than a few thousands at a time. So the triangle file everyso often will even things out and make for a smooth continous cut. Leave some room to finish with the triangle file alone to remove thechatter you will get with the lathe bit. Use cutting oil. GO SLOW!! If you start on the butt side, you will undoubtedly cut too deep agroove in the tip side and then you have to start over or start planingmetal off the top to get down to the right size. Good Luck,Rick C.Chuck Tracy wrote: Hello to all on the list, I've been lurking and learning here for quite a while. During thistime, I've been putting together the basic tools and other items thatare needed to begin construction of my first rod. While I am almostthere, I've run into a bit of a problem and so I am turning here forsome more of your valuable information and advice. I'm having difficulty acquiring the 60 degree lathe threading toolneeded to make a set of adjustable planing forms. I have the formsdrilled and ready to go, I just need to get the tool to cut the groove. I know that the advice of this group has been to go to a local machinetool supply shop and get this tool, but that is part of the problem. Ilive in a rural agricultural-based community in the middle of Kansas.Therefore, there is no such animal in this neck of the woods. Theclosest machine tool supply shop is 2 - 3 hours away. Last weekend Imade it to a Grainger store in Topeka and was able to get a couple ofitems I was missing but got a blank stare when I asked about the lathethreading tool. Here comes the question, does anyone know of an on-line source where Ican order the tool? I've looked at McMaster-Carr, MSC and Grainger buthave been unable to identify what I'm looking for. I know that it'sprobably at one of these places, and I've probably looked right at itbut, as a total neophyte, haven't been able to properly identify it.Any help you can give (possibly including a part number) would begreatly appreciated. Thanks in advance for your help and thanks for all of the wonderful tipsand insightful conversation that the list has offered so far. Chuck from flytyr@southshore.com Tue Nov 2 20:09:33 1999 (may be forged)) Subject: Re: Straight Strips? A941A051256011EC1A05793A" --------------A941A051256011EC1A05793A I straighten several times at different stages.After I start the 60* angle, if the strip lookscrooked it gets straightend again.Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com Steve Trauthwein wrote: Bob, I straighten right up to the time I start finalplaning. Regards, SteveIndependence, MO Bob Nunley wrote: OK, the email I just responded to from Ericjust brought another question to mindconcerning part of that subject. How manyof you straighten your strips. I know we allstraighten the nodes, but do any of the otherof you straighten the entire strip. I alwayshave because... well, I guess my thinking isthe straighter the strip, the easier theplaning and binding process go, and thestraightening process after the binding.Any opinions?Bob++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ + R.L. "Bob" Nunley, Rodmaker+ Custom Split Bamboo Fly Rods+ http://members.clnk.com/caneman/images/flystuff/caneindex.htm++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ --------------A941A051256011EC1A05793A A1658F790E21C6BF331C1EC4" --------------A1658F790E21C6BF331C1EC4 I straighten several times at different stages. After I start the 60* angle,if the strip looks crooked it gets straightend again. Steve Trauthwein wrote: I straighten right up to the time I start final planing. Regards, SteveIndependence, MO Bob Nunley wrote: OK,the email I just responded to from Eric just brought another question to because... well, I guess my thinking is the straighter the strip, the easierthe planing and binding process go, and the straightening process after Bob++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ + Custom Split Bamboo Fly Rods+ http://members.clnk.com/caneman/images/flystuff/caneindex.htm++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ --------------A1658F790E21C6BF331C1EC4 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--------------A941A051256011EC1A05793A-- from EESweet@aol.com Tue Nov 2 20:26:10 1999 Subject: Many Thanks (Crooked Strips...) Hi All, Thanks everyone for all the advice, I'll be running out for some varnish tomorrow, and doing some test wraps shortly after. As for the strips, I'm afraid to heat and flex them much as I'm doing a nodeless rod (yes, avisitor from the dark side ) and am worried about the effect that might have on the splices. I'd hate to screw up this far along! Thanks again. Eric from mrj@aa.net Tue Nov 2 20:54:58 1999 Tue, 2 Nov 1999 18:54:44 -0800 Subject: RE: Straight Strips? boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0028_01BF2563.64A52DC0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0028_01BF2563.64A52DC0 boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0029_01BF2563.64A52DC0" ------=_NextPart_001_0029_01BF2563.64A52DC0 I used to spend a lot more time straightening my strips then I do now. Inowstraighten only until the strip will stay in the groove when planed. If thestrip has a bend in it and flops out of the groove but when I push the planeup the spline, the spline moves back into the groove, I consider that goodenough. Now kinks, are a different matter, these sharp bends have to bedealt with.As long as I can plane the section, that is all I care about. When I amdone and all glued up I will check for straightness and correct to asabsolute straight as possible. Martin Jensen -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: November 02, 1999 6:32 AM Subject: Straight Strips? OK, the email I just responded to from Eric just brought another questionto mind concerning part of that subject.How many of you straighten your strips. I know we all straighten thenodes, but do any of the other of you straighten the entire strip. I alwayshave because... well, I guess my thinking is the straighter the strip, theeasier the planing and binding process go, and the straightening processafter the binding. Any opinions? Bob+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ R.L. "Bob" Nunley, Rodmaker+ Custom Split Bamboo Fly Rods+ http://members.clnk.com/caneman/images/flystuff/caneindex.htm++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ ------=_NextPart_001_0029_01BF2563.64A52DC0 BODY {COLOR: #000000; FONT-FAMILY: arial; FONT-SIZE: 12pt; MARGIN- LEFT:8em} I used tospend = time straightening my strips then I do now. I now straighten only until = strip will stay in the groove when planed. If the strip has a bend in it = flops out of the groove but when I push the plane up the spline, the = moves back into the groove, I consider that good enough. Now kinks, are = different matter, these sharp bends have to be dealt =with. long = plane the section, that is all I care about. When I am done and all = will check for straightness and correct to as absolute straight as = Martin Jensen ServeSubject: Straight Strips?OK, the email I just responded to from Eric just brought another = to mind concerning part of that subject. = we all straighten the nodes, but do any of the other of you straighten = straighter the strip, the easier the planing and binding process go, = straightening process after the binding. Bob+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ = + Custom Split Bamboo Fly Rods+ ht=tp://members.clnk.com/caneman/images/flystuff/caneindex.htm=++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ ------=_NextPart_001_0029_01BF2563.64A52DC0-- ------=_NextPart_000_0028_01BF2563.64A52DC0 name="ATT00019.jpg" 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------=_NextPart_000_0028_01BF2563.64A52DC0-- from dmanders@telusplanet.net Tue Nov 2 20:56:13 1999 don") Tue, 2 Nov 1999 19:58:50 -0700 Subject: For all you old guys out there Guys, Just got through talking to John Bokstrom about the efforts that largebuilders went through to get the strips straight for milling. We consideredvarious methods - power planning, scraping, power sanding etc. It wouldseem that if you were going from a preliminary taper to final in one passof the mill, the strips better be flat on the enamel side. Anybody have aclue just what was done.I know that I straighten strips or portions of strips several times duringthe planning process. I just can't figure out how it was done for a mill. Iwould suspect some type of power plane to take off about 0.020" or betterto make sure the nodes were flat. Any thoughts? Don from flytyr@southshore.com Tue Nov 2 20:59:42 1999 (may be forged)) Tue, 2 Nov 1999 20:58:03 -0600 Subject: Re: Lathe Threading Tool Chuck,This may help.I did not use a lathe cutting tool on my forms.Smooth, drill and tap the bars first.I laid out the taper as in Wayne's book. You can start with .015 as long asyou add .005 at each station. Scribe the lines on top and on the inside ofthe bars. This gave me a taper reference line. Took a small 4" grinder andremoved metal almost up to the lines scribed.Put the forms together. Using a feeler gauge, start with the butt (big) endof the taper with about .060, add. .005 between the bars at each 5" stationas you would if you were setting up for planing. Mount the triangle file ina block of wood that is good and flat. Try to get a file that will be aboutthe depth of the groove. The size of the file will determine your startinggap, the larger the file the larger the starting gap. As you work the filein the groove it will take out all the high spots. When it is smooth closethe formes and take depth measurements with a depth guage and reset theforms for the finish depth. At this point you should have +.005 at eachstation. You may have to open or close the forms a couple of times. Do thetip first, if you get it too deep then make it the butt. When you do it thisway, the wide gap side will have the least amount of metal removed. Thatwill then be the small end of the taper. With the bars spread .005 at eachstation the file remains flat so that the strip of wood that holds the filerides on the surface of the forms.If it is not clear enough feel free to contact me. It only took me threeevenings to put the taper in my forms.It is easier to do than to type out.Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com Chuck Tracy wrote: Hello to all on the list, I've been lurking and learning here for quite a while. During thistime, I've been putting together the basic tools and other items thatare needed to begin construction of my first rod. While I am almostthere, I've run into a bit of a problem and so I am turning here forsome more of your valuable information and advice. I'm having difficulty acquiring the 60 degree lathe threading toolneeded to make a set of adjustable planing forms. I have the formsdrilled and ready to go, I just need to get the tool to cut the groove. I know that the advice of this group has been to go to a local machinetool supply shop and get this tool, but that is part of the problem. Ilive in a rural agricultural-based community in the middle of Kansas.Therefore, there is no such animal in this neck of the woods. Theclosest machine tool supply shop is 2 - 3 hours away. Last weekend Imade it to a Grainger store in Topeka and was able to get a couple ofitems I was missing but got a blank stare when I asked about the lathethreading tool. Here comes the question, does anyone know of an on-line source where Ican order the tool? I've looked at McMaster-Carr, MSC and Grainger buthave been unable to identify what I'm looking for. I know that it'sprobably at one of these places, and I've probably looked right at itbut, as a total neophyte, haven't been able to properly identify it.Any help you can give (possibly including a part number) would begreatly appreciated. Thanks in advance for your help and thanks for all of the wonderful tipsand insightful conversation that the list has offered so far. Chuck from mrj@aa.net Tue Nov 2 21:00:13 1999 Tue, 2 Nov 1999 19:00:07 -0800 Subject: RE: Plane Cutter Adjusting It will be different depending how much pressure is applied and how sharpthe blade it and possibly depending on the type of wood. Why don't you just"mike" up a couple of shavings to find out this information? Martin Jensen -----Original Message----- Subject: Plane Cutter Adjusting I have a question that I've been unable to find the answer for in thearchives: On a standard Stanley 9 1/2 plane, if you make one revolution of the cutteradjustment wheel, how much does that adjust the cutter (change inthicknessof a shaving)? Claude from mrj@aa.net Tue Nov 2 21:02:07 1999 Tue, 2 Nov 1999 19:01:57 -0800 "Rodmakers" Subject: RE: Lathe Threading Tool boundary="----=_NextPart_000_002F_01BF2564.66758B80" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_002F_01BF2564.66758B80 probably talking about a bevel cutting wheel for a mill. Martin Jensen -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu AldrichSent: November 02, 1999 2:40 PM Subject: Re: Lathe Threading Tool Will someone please explain how a 60 deg. lathe threading tool is used tocut a groove ?????? Or, is this some other type a groove, than in theplanning form ? GMA----- Original Message -----From: Chuck Tracy Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 1999 1:22 PMSubject: Lathe Threading Tool Hello to all on the list, I've been lurking and learning here for quite a while. During thistime, I've been putting together the basic tools and other items thatare needed to begin construction of my first rod. While I am almostthere, I've run into a bit of a problem and so I am turning here forsome more of your valuable information and advice. I'm having difficulty acquiring the 60 degree lathe threading toolneeded to make a set of adjustable planing forms. I have the formsdrilled and ready to go, I just need to get the tool to cut the groove. I know that the advice of this group has been to go to a local machinetool supply shop and get this tool, but that is part of the problem. Ilive in a rural agricultural-based community in the middle of Kansas.Therefore, there is no such animal in this neck of the woods. Theclosest machine tool supply shop is 2 - 3 hours away. Last weekend Imade it to a Grainger store in Topeka and was able to get a couple ofitems I was missing but got a blank stare when I asked about the lathethreading tool. Here comes the question, does anyone know of an on-line source where Ican order the tool? I've looked at McMaster-Carr, MSC and Grainger buthave been unable to identify what I'm looking for. I know that it'sprobably at one of these places, and I've probably looked right at itbut, as a total neophyte, haven't been able to properly identify it.Any help you can give (possibly including a part number) would begreatly appreciated. Thanks in advance for your help and thanks for all of the wonderful tipsand insightful conversation that the list has offered so far. Chuck ------=_NextPart_000_002F_01BF2564.66758B80 probably talking about a bevel cuttingwheel = mill. Martin Jensen M. = ToolWill someone please explain how a 60 deg. lathe threading= used to cut a groove ?????? Or, is this some other type a groove, than = planning form ? GMA ----- Original Message ----- Chuck = Sent: Tuesday, November 02, = PMSubject: Lathe Threading =ToolHello to all on the list,I've been lurking = putting together the basic tools and other items thatare needed = into a bit of a problem and so I am turning here forsome more of = valuable information and advice.I'm having difficulty = 60 degree lathe threading toolneeded to make a set of adjustable = forms. I have the formsdrilled and ready to go, I just need to = tool to cut the groove.I know that the advice of this group = to go to a local machinetool supply shop and get this tool, but = in the middle of Kansas.Therefore, there is no such animal in = able to get a couple ofitems I was missing but got a blank stare = asked about the lathethreading tool.Here comes the = does anyone know of an on-line source where Ican order the = I've looked at McMaster-Carr, MSC and Grainger buthave been = places, and I've probably looked right at itbut, as a total = appreciated.Thanks in advance for your help and thanks for = the wonderful tipsand insightful conversation that the list has = sofar.Chuck ------=_NextPart_000_002F_01BF2564.66758B80-- from flytyr@southshore.com Tue Nov 2 21:06:51 1999 [205.167.143.178] (may beforged)) Subject: Re: Trip Report:First annual Bishop Gathering Darrel, Can you contact me off list, would like some information on the Pezon.Don'thave your E address.Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com Darrell Lee strung up a Pezon et Michael he got on his latest buying trip- great combination of smoothness and speed. This was my favorite ofthesmall rods. from mrj@aa.net Tue Nov 2 21:15:34 1999 Tue, 2 Nov 1999 19:15:29 -0800 Subject: RE: Help For the novice you need a: plane, a form, a phone book, an empty Whiskey glass, Thread,heavy thread, masking tape, sharpening stone for the plane blade, kitchenknife, razor blade, Band-Aids, gloves, needle nose tweezers, bamboo, tapemeasurer, pencil, fine blade saw (hack saw?), 0" to 1" micrometer orcaliper. Browse around and see if someone in the area will give you a lesson.Whatever the cost it will be worth it. I can explain the above items if no one else does it. These are probably thebare minimum. I personally would not want to undertake a project likebuilding a bamboo rod without at least the above. You might want to drainthe Whiskey glass yourself. Martin Jensen -----Original Message----- Subject: Help For the novice Hi, As I get ready to build my first bamboo rod(s) I find that there are manythings that one needs. But what do I really need? Could I as the list to respond with what the first time builder needs, whatwould be nice to have, and the things you don't really need. TIAPaul from channer@hubwest.com Tue Nov 2 21:34:14 1999 (SMTPD32-4.06) id ADB213630052; Tue, 02 Nov 1999 20:36:18 MST Subject: Re: Plane Cutter Adjusting At 08:26 PM 11/02/1999 EST, TSmithwick@aol.com wrote: In a message dated 11/3/99 12:35:35 AM, channer@hubwest.com wrote: it is too deep.>> John - That is a very poor method. Blood is highly corrosive, and will ruin your blade. Of course, you could go on a low salt diet, that might help abit. Tom;I never put salt on anything, it's bad for you. This method keeps thecalluses down so I can tell what I'm doing. Also, I flame my cane so thestains hardly show up at all.Seriously, I grooved the bottom of both myplanes, so I set them so the blade just clears the form. My rough plane isa regular Stanley (non-adjustable throat) grooved to about .008" and my 91/2 is grooved to .004". I can either hog off a pretty good shaving withthe one, or make a finer cut with the other. It's a good method for guys aslazy as I am who hate to sharpen blades more often than necessary.John from bigdug@inconnect.com Tue Nov 2 21:35:53 1999 Subject: Bishop gathering I would like to thank Chuck and his Wife for all their hospitality.The chili was great.I really injoyed casting all those wonderful rod's.Thank's to allDoug from channer@hubwest.com Tue Nov 2 21:52:57 1999 (SMTPD32-4.06) id A215155C0148; Tue, 02 Nov 1999 20:55:01 MST Subject: Re: For all you old guys out there At 07:57 PM 11/02/1999 -0700, Don & Sandy Andersen wrote:Guys, Just got through talking to John Bokstrom about the efforts that largebuilders went through to get the strips straight for milling. Weconsideredvarious methods - power planning, scraping, power sanding etc. It wouldseem that if you were going from a preliminary taper to final in one passof the mill, the strips better be flat on the enamel side. Anybody have aclue just what was done.I know that I straighten strips or portions of strips several times duringthe planning process. I just can't figure out how it was done for a mill. Iwould suspect some type of power plane to take off about 0.020" orbetterto make sure the nodes were flat. Any thoughts? Don Don;Amongst the equipment that Lori Lohman had for sale was a heated,hydraulicstrip straightener, a very large heavy machine made out of steel I- beams.Also, I have heard that Granger used a contraption with many V-grooves init to straighten many rough planed strips at once. I don't know what theothers did, but i am pretty sure they all had a method to straighten stripsbefore final planing.John from jimgentz@earthlink.net Tue Nov 2 22:17:19 1999 Subject: Re: Bishop gathering Doug, I agree, please add my thanks to all.Hopefully this will be an annual event.Thanks, Jim Gentz Douglas D.Sandberg wrote: I would like to thank Chuck and his Wife for all their hospitality.The chili was great.I really injoyed casting all those wonderful rod's.Thank's to allDoug from dati@selway.umt.edu Tue Nov 2 22:39:13 1999 Subject: Re: Help For the novice Hi, I am a first time builder as well and have been going at it for quite afew months and have yet to finish my first rod. My budget is verylimited so I try to get by with as little as possible. I have found thatwhat you need depends on whether you are building a nodeless rod or arod leaving the nodes intact. 1. Some scarfing jigs and a vise to hold them.2. A block plane (Stanley 9.5 is a popular model).3. A honing guide and a hone or >= 600 grit sandpaper.4. A system for glueing the scarfs together to form the strips, some bindthem with thread others use small spring clamps.5. An intermediate planing form.6. A final planing form.7. A micrometer or dial caliper.8. A dial depth gage.9. A center gage.note a heat treating oven is not necessary because the bamboo pieces areshort enough, after cutting out the nodes, to fit in your home oven. One needs all of the above less the scarfing jigs plus a file to file thenodes flat. A file can also be used to take off the final thousands of the scarfs in the aforementioned list. Some things to think about that may increase the necessary tools are: howyou are going to bind the splines together to form the rod blank? and ifyou want to flame the rod? There is a wealth of information on thesetopics under the archives of the rodmakers site. I have found these tools to be absolutely necessary to build a rod thatyou can be pleased with. I have tried to cut corners and keep things assimple as possible but found the above list to be very necessary.One other thing, a good friend with a kind heart who builds bamboo rods isworth a lot as well. D.L.Tue, 2 Nov 1999, PMG wrote: Hi, As I get ready to build my first bamboo rod(s) I find that there are manythings that one needs. But what do I really need? Could I as the list to respond with what the first time builder needs,whatwould be nice to have, and the things you don't really need. TIAPaul from stpete@netten.net Tue Nov 2 22:39:59 1999 Tue, 2 Nov 1999 23:46:13 -0600 Subject: Re: Lathe Threading Tool George, go to the Rodmakers Page and look up Bruce Conners page and hiswooden form making tools. You'll see a diagram. Rick C. George M. Aldrich wrote: Will someone please explain how a 60 deg. lathe threading tool is usedto cut a groove ?????? Or, is this some other type a groove, than inthe planning form ? GMA from stpete@netten.net Tue Nov 2 22:55:52 1999 Subject: [Fwd: Re: Lathe Threading Tool] (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35)with SMTP id com for ;Tue, 2 Nov 1999 22:49:10 -0600 Subject: Re: Lathe Threading Tool You can also get them at O'Reilly's Auto parts or about any parts storethat has a brake lathe. My son works at OReilly's here and got me a couple.They keep them in their warehouse for all the stores to order for theirbrake turning lathes. I'm sure any parts store that turns brake rotorswould be able to get them for you. Bob -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Lathe Threading Tool Chuck, This tool is a standard carbide bit available from Harbor Freight, MSC,any tool supply. I bet there is a place around the corner from youwhere you can pick one up. Get one or two 1/2" or 5/8" tools - thebigger the better. Should cost you about $4-5. If you have trouble,contact a local machine shop, they probably have some sitting around.Make the block just like on Bruce Conner's page via Rodmakers. WARNING: cut the tip side first and use a triangle file put on a blockevery few strokes. The lathe tool is hard to keep centered if you tryto cut more than a few thousands at a time. So the triangle file everyso often will even things out and make for a smooth continous cut.Leave some room to finish with the triangle file alone to remove thechatter you will get with the lathe bit. Use cutting oil. GO SLOW!!If you start on the butt side, you will undoubtedly cut too deep agroove in the tip side and then you have to start over or start planingmetal off the top to get down to the right size. Good Luck,Rick C.Chuck Tracy wrote: Hello to all on the list, I've been lurking and learning here for quite a while. During thistime, I've been putting together the basic tools and other items thatare needed to begin construction of my first rod. While I am almostthere, I've run into a bit of a problem and so I am turning here forsome more of your valuable information and advice.I'm having difficulty acquiring the 60 degree lathe threading toolneeded to make a set of adjustable planing forms. I have the formsdrilled and ready to go, I just need to get the tool to cut the groove. I know that the advice of this group has been to go to a local machinetool supply shop and get this tool, but that is part of the problem. Ilive in a rural agricultural-based community in the middle of Kansas.Therefore, there is no such animal in this neck of the woods. Theclosest machine tool supply shop is 2 - 3 hours away. Last weekend Imade it to a Grainger store in Topeka and was able to get a couple ofitems I was missing but got a blank stare when I asked about the lathethreading tool. Here comes the question, does anyone know of an on-line source where Ican order the tool? I've looked at McMaster-Carr, MSC and Grainger buthave been unable to identify what I'm looking for. I know that it'sprobably at one of these places, and I've probably looked right at itbut, as a total neophyte, haven't been able to properly identify it.Any help you can give (possibly including a part number) would begreatly appreciated. Thanks in advance for your help and thanks for all of the wonderful tipsand insightful conversation that the list has offered so far. Chuck from darrell@rockclimbing.org Wed Nov 3 05:31:55 1999 sims.3.5.1999.09.16.21.57.p8)with SMTP id for Subject: Re: Trip Report:First annual Bishop Gathering Hi, The Pezon et Michel rod is a very nice rod... it was unmarked so I don'tknow the model of the rod. It is a 7' 2/1 rod with a cork reelseat andaluminum Payne style butt cap and a simple sliding ring. It is stampedwiththe makers name on the butt cap. Oxidized English style bronze ferrulesandweighs less than 3 oz.There was a note from the guy I bought it from thatitwas a St. Leonard blank??? Blonde cane. Hope that helps. Darrell ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Trip Report:First annual Bishop Gathering Darrel, Can you contact me off list, would like some information on the Pezon.Don'thave your E address.Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com Darrell Lee strung up a Pezon et Michael he got on his latest buyingtrip- great combination of smoothness and speed. This was my favorite ofthesmall rods. from SSteinzor@atg.state.vt.us Wed Nov 3 08:05:54 1999 Wed, 3 Nov 1999 09:05:51 -0500 rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: RE: Planing form adjustment using slotted plane Barry - This sounds a lot better than the auto body repair tape I've beenusing, which has a tendency to bunch up and scrape off. What kind of gluedo you use? - Seth -----Original Message-----From: Kling, Barry W. [SMTP:KlingB@health.missouri.edu]Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 1999 2:08 PM Subject: RE: Planing form adjustment using slotted plane pieces of 0.005 thick steel (I scrounged mine from an old spark plug gapfeeler gauge set) along both sides of the plane. Not hard to remove if youquit fishing to take up an honest craft. Barry from KlingB@health.missouri.edu Wed Nov 3 08:13:46 1999 Subject: RE: Planing form adjustment using slotted plane Seth - So far I've just used superglue. The strips have falled off a couple oftimes, but epoxy was worse (I just used 5 min stuff) and it only takes aminute to reglue them (after filing off old glue). I'd love to know of abetter glue for this. BK -----Original Message----- Subject: RE: Planing form adjustment using slotted plane Barry - This sounds a lot better than the auto body repair tape I've beenusing, which has a tendency to bunch up and scrape off. What kind of gluedo you use? - Seth -----Original Message-----From: Kling, Barry W. [SMTP:KlingB@health.missouri.edu]Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 1999 2:08 PM Subject: RE: Planing form adjustment using slotted plane pieces of 0.005 thick steel (I scrounged mine from an old spark plug gapfeeler gauge set) along both sides of the plane. Not hard to remove if youquit fishing to take up an honest craft. Barry from arnold.jl@pg.com Wed Nov 3 08:20:52 1999 notes082.na.pg.com[155.125.116.193] 1999 09:18:48 1999)) id8525681E.004EC6CD ; Wed, 3 Nov 1999 09:20:27 -0500 Subject: RE: Straight Strips? Boundary="0__=scPbM4X55U3sgeGHYj7wv6etyX7YGEqnVuMoRaBBtELt93whgHBoQV7q" --0__=scPbM4X55U3sgeGHYj7wv6etyX7YGEqnVuMoRaBBtELt93whgHBoQV7q Straight Strips? I have never had a problem with my strips being crooked.Ibuild nodeless....is this message for the builders that build noded rods?Wheredo the strips go crooked? Is it in the node or the internodal region of thestrip? Jeff Internet Mail Message Received from host: wugate.wustl.edu [128.252.120.1] Envelope Sender: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Please respond to mrj@aa.net Subject: RE: Straight Strips? I used to spend a lot more time straightening my strips then I do now. Inowstraighten only until the strip will stay in the groove when planed. If thestrip has a bend in it and flops out of the groove but when I push the planeup the spline, the spline moves back into the groove, I consider that goodenough. Now kinks, are a different matter, these sharp bends have to bedealt with.As long as I can plane the section, that is all I care about. When I amdone and all glued up I will check for straightness and correct to asabsolute straight as possible. Martin Jensen -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: November 02, 1999 6:32 AM Subject: Straight Strips? OK, the email I just responded to from Eric just brought another questionto mind concerning part of that subject.How many of you straighten your strips. I know we all straighten thenodes, but do any of the other of you straighten the entire strip. I alwayshave because... well, I guess my thinking is the straighter the strip, theeasier the planing and binding process go, and the straightening processafter the binding. Any opinions? Bob+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ R.L. "Bob" Nunley, Rodmaker+ Custom Split Bamboo Fly Rods+ http://members.clnk.com/caneman/images/flystuff/caneindex.htm++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ --0__=scPbM4X55U3sgeGHYj7wv6etyX7YGEqnVuMoRaBBtELt93whgHBoQV7q name="att1.htm" 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--0__=scPbM4X55U3sgeGHYj7wv6etyX7YGEqnVuMoRaBBtELt93whgHBoQV7q- - from tjtrodmaker@yahoo.com Wed Nov 3 08:23:13 1999 1999 06:23:05 PST Subject: RE: Planing form adjustment using slotted plane greetings comrads! you can also use pieces of mylartape. the tape is .005" thick has it's own stickyandcomes in a roll so you can share with your friends.i'll ask my friend where he got it. timothy --- "Kling, Barry W." wrote: Seth - So far I've just used superglue. The strips havefalled off a couple oftimes, but epoxy was worse (I just used 5 min stuff)and it only takes aminute to reglue them (after filing off old glue).I'd love to know of abetter glue for this. BK -----Original Message-----From: Seth Steinzor Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 8:08 AM rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: RE: Planing form adjustment using slottedplane Barry - This sounds a lot better than the auto body repairtape I've beenusing, which has a tendency to bunch up and scrapeoff. What kind of gluedo you use? - Seth -----Original Message-----From: Kling, Barry W.[SMTP:KlingB@health.missouri.edu]Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 1999 2:08 PM Subject: RE: Planing form adjustment using slottedplane the plane. You can gluepieces of 0.005 thick steel (I scrounged mine froman old spark plug gapfeeler gauge set) along both sides of the plane.Not hard to remove if youquit fishing to take up an honest craft. Barry ====="Gooda' morning mister bear"__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com from KlingB@health.missouri.edu Wed Nov 3 08:42:34 1999 Subject: RE: Planing form adjustment using slotted plane Long live the dictatorship of the proletariat, comrad! That Mylar sounds excellent. Do you find that it wears down rapidly or isitfairly durable? BK -----Original Message----- Subject: RE: Planing form adjustment using slotted plane greetings comrads! you can also use pieces of mylartape. the tape is .005" thick has it's own stickyandcomes in a roll so you can share with your friends.i'll ask my friend where he got it. timothy --- "Kling, Barry W." wrote: Seth - So far I've just used superglue. The strips havefalled off a couple oftimes, but epoxy was worse (I just used 5 min stuff)and it only takes aminute to reglue them (after filing off old glue).I'd love to know of abetter glue for this. BK -----Original Message-----From: Seth Steinzor Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 8:08 AM rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: RE: Planing form adjustment using slottedplane Barry - This sounds a lot better than the auto body repairtape I've beenusing, which has a tendency to bunch up and scrapeoff. What kind of gluedo you use? - Seth -----Original Message-----From: Kling, Barry W.[SMTP:KlingB@health.missouri.edu]Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 1999 2:08 PM Subject: RE: Planing form adjustment using slottedplane the plane. You can gluepieces of 0.005 thick steel (I scrounged mine froman old spark plug gapfeeler gauge set) along both sides of the plane.Not hard to remove if youquit fishing to take up an honest craft. Barry ====="Gooda' morning mister bear"__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com from tjtrodmaker@yahoo.com Wed Nov 3 08:49:13 1999 1999 06:49:09 PST Subject: RE: Planing form adjustment using slotted plane i suppose if your planing form is scuffed up enoughyou could turn up some edges. i wouldn't use agrooved plane or the tape for the final planing. ithink there are a number of problems with it. i'd usethe tape or groove utill the last few thousandths thenpickup another plane. so the thickness wouldn't be ascritical as consistant thickness. timothy --- "Kling, Barry W." wrote: Long live the dictatorship of the proletariat,comrad! That Mylar sounds excellent. Do you find that itwears down rapidly or is itfairly durable? BK -----Original Message-----From: timothy troester Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 8:23 AM Subject: RE: Planing form adjustment using slottedplane greetings comrads! you can also use pieces ofmylartape. the tape is .005" thick has it's own stickyandcomes in a roll so you can share with yourfriends.i'll ask my friend where he got it. timothy --- "Kling, Barry W." wrote: Seth - So far I've just used superglue. The strips havefalled off a couple oftimes, but epoxy was worse (I just used 5 minstuff)and it only takes aminute to reglue them (after filing off old glue).I'd love to know of abetter glue for this. BK -----Original Message-----From: Seth Steinzor Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 8:08 AM rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: RE: Planing form adjustment using slottedplane Barry - This sounds a lot better than the auto bodyrepairtape I've beenusing, which has a tendency to bunch up and scrapeoff. What kind of gluedo you use? - Seth -----Original Message-----From: Kling, Barry W.[SMTP:KlingB@health.missouri.edu]Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 1999 2:08 PM Subject: RE: Planing form adjustment usingslottedplane the plane. You can gluepieces of 0.005 thick steel (I scrounged minefroman old spark plug gapfeeler gauge set) along both sides of the plane.Not hard to remove if youquit fishing to take up an honest craft. Barry ====="Gooda' morning mister bear"__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com ====="Gooda' morning mister bear"__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com from noblur@stic.net Wed Nov 3 08:59:10 1999 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0- 60503U15500L11000S0V35)with SMTP id net; Wed, 3 Nov 1999 08:59:05 - 0600 Subject: Re: Planing form adjustment using slotted plane boundary="----=_NextPart_000_009C_01BF25D9.A45DB9C0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_009C_01BF25D9.A45DB9C0 Several machine tool suppliers carry Mylar shim stock, in various =thicknesses. Many used it where metal is not wanted. GMA Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 8:42 AM Long live the dictatorship of the proletariat, comrad! That Mylar sounds excellent. Do you find that it wears down rapidly or =is itfairly durable? BK -----Original Message----- Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 8:23 AM greetings comrads! you can also use pieces of mylartape. the tape is .005" thick has it's own stickyandcomes in a roll so you can share with your friends.i'll ask my friend where he got it. timothy --- "Kling, Barry W." wrote: So far I've just used superglue. The strips havefalled off a couple oftimes, but epoxy was worse (I just used 5 min stuff)and it only takes aminute to reglue them (after filing off old glue).I'd love to know of abetter glue for this. -----Original Message-----From: Seth Steinzor Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 8:08 AM rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: RE: Planing form adjustment using slotted Barry - This sounds a lot better than the auto body repairtape I've beenusing, which has a tendency to bunch up and scrapeoff. What kind of gluedo you use? - Seth -----Original Message-----From: Kling, Barry W.[SMTP:KlingB@health.missouri.edu]Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 1999 2:08 PM Subject: RE: Planing form adjustment using slotted the plane. You can gluepieces of 0.005 thick steel (I scrounged mine froman old spark plug gapfeeler gauge set) along both sides of the plane.Not hard to remove if youquit fishing to take up an honest craft. Barry =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D"Gooda' morning mister bear"__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com ------=_NextPart_000_009C_01BF25D9.A45DB9C0 Several machine tool suppliers carry Mylar shim stock, in = thicknesses. Many used it where metal is not wanted. GMA ----- Original Message ----- Kling, Barry W. = Sent: Wednesday, November 03, = AMSubject: RE: Planing form = using slotted plane comrad!That Mylar sounds excellent. Do you find that it wears = <KlingB@health.missouri.edu= = rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= mister =bear"__________________________________________________Do Yahoo!?Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com ------=_NextPart_000_009C_01BF25D9.A45DB9C0-- from brewer@teleport.com Wed Nov 3 10:18:38 1999 "hamachi"via SMTP by relay1.teleport.com, id smtpdAAASNLoq_; Wed Nov 308:18:25 1999 Subject: Re: Plane Cutter Adjusting Another trick that works well is to adjust the blade depth by sight andthenrun your thumb over it (in a direction perpendicular to the blade, please).You can get the correct feel of it and that works somewhat better for fineadjustment than my aging eyes! Mr. Thramer taught me this trick. from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Wed Nov 3 10:30:58 1999 Wed, 3 Nov 1999 08:30:51 -0800 Subject: Re: Plane Cutter Adjusting Another trick that works for me is to lightly tap the front of the planewith,say, the rubber handle of a screwdriver, to move the blade forward just askosh. Move it back by tapping the back of the plane. A few taps is all ittakes to learn just how hard to hit. Harry Randy Brewer wrote: Another trick that works well is to adjust the blade depth by sight andthenrun your thumb over it (in a direction perpendicular to the blade, please).You can get the correct feel of it and that works somewhat better forfineadjustment than my aging eyes! Mr. Thramer taught me this trick. from avyoung@iinet.net.au Wed Nov 3 10:40:08 1999 Thu, 4 Nov 1999 00:39:51 +0800 Subject: Re: Plane Cutter Adjusting If you hold the plane up to your eye against a light source sole up andlooking from the back you can see the depth the iron is set to, then makesure the throat is adjusted to suit the depth of cut. Tony At 08:15 AM 11/3/99 -0800, Randy Brewer wrote:Another trick that works well is to adjust the blade depth by sight andthenrun your thumb over it (in a direction perpendicular to the blade, please).You can get the correct feel of it and that works somewhat better forfineadjustment than my aging eyes! Mr. Thramer taught me this trick. /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html And this our life, exempt from public haunt,Finds tongues in trees, books in running brooks,Sermons in stones, and good in everything. William Shakespeare, As You Like It /*************************************************************************/ from jfoster@gte.net Wed Nov 3 11:38:51 1999 Subject: update The archives are updated..have added some makers..check out theresites..if you don't like what i say about you, please send me the textyou want to see and i'll change it..if you want to be added to the makers page, EMAIL me and i'll add you,sometime. regards jerry from jfoster@gte.net Wed Nov 3 11:42:15 1999 Subject: gwg Harry (you whimp) would like to have made it to your SRG but Chuck's little gathering wasgreat..mainly..rodmakers are great people.. glad to have met some newfolks jerry from pdcorlis@nidc.edu Wed Nov 3 11:51:07 1999 with Novell_GroupWise; Wed, 03 Nov 1999 09:53:41 -0800 Subject: Re: update A big public thank you to Jerry for maintaining this amazing resource forall bamboonuts. By the way, I'm ordering some culms tomorrow! Phil "cheap trick" Corlis from caneman@clnk.com Wed Nov 3 11:56:02 1999 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35)with SMTP id com; Wed, 3 Nov 1999 11:54:42 -0600 "Rod Makers List Serve" Subject: Re: Straight Strips? boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0023_01BF25F2.11942CA0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0023_01BF25F2.11942CA0 Jeff,Man, I need some of YOUR cane. I consistently find strips in my =pile with big sweeps in the internodal region. Bob-----Original Message-----From: Jeff Arnold-JL Cc: caneman@clnk.com ; Rod Makers List Serve = Date: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 9:22 AMSubject: RE: Straight Strips? Straight Strips? I have never had a problem with my strips being =crooked. Ibuild nodeless....is this message for the builders that build noded =rods? Wheredo the strips go crooked? Is it in the node or the internodal region =of thestrip? Jeff Envelope Sender: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu From: "Martin Jensen" on 11/02/99 09:52 PM Please respond to mrj@aa.net cc: (bcc: Jeff Arnold-JL/PGI)Subject: RE: Straight Strips? I used to spend a lot more time straightening my strips then I do =now. I nowstraighten only until the strip will stay in the groove when planed. =If thestrip has a bend in it and flops out of the groove but when I push =the planeup the spline, the spline moves back into the groove, I consider =that goodenough. Now kinks, are a different matter, these sharp bends have to =bedealt with.As long as I can plane the section, that is all I care about. When I =amdone and all glued up I will check for straightness and correct to =asabsolute straight as possible. Martin Jensen -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: November 02, 1999 6:32 AM Subject: Straight Strips? OK, the email I just responded to from Eric just brought another =questionto mind concerning part of that subject.How many of you straighten your strips. I know we all =straighten thenodes, but do any of the other of you straighten the entire strip. =I alwayshave because... well, I guess my thinking is the straighter the =strip, theeasier the planing and binding process go, and the straightening =processafter the binding. Any opinions? Bob+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ R.L. "Bob" Nunley, Rodmaker+ Custom Split Bamboo Fly Rods+ http://members.clnk.com/caneman/images/flystuff/caneindex.htm++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ ------=_NextPart_000_0023_01BF25F2.11942CA0 Jeff, some = internodal region. Bob -----Original = Serve <rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= Wednesday, November 03, 1999 9:22 AMSubject: RE: = Strips?Straight Strips? I have never had a = my strips being crooked. Ibuild nodeless....is this message for = builders that build noded rods? Wheredo the strips go crooked? = = = = = = rodmakers@wugate.w= caneman@clnk.com, "Rod = Serve" <rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= Strips?I used to spend a lot more time = strips then I do now. I nowstraighten only until the strip will = the groove when planed. If thestrip has a bend in it and flops = the groove but when I push the planeup the spline, the spline = into the groove, I consider that goodenough. Now kinks, are a = matter, these sharp bends have to bedealt with.As long as I = plane the section, that is all I care about. When I amdone and = up I will check for straightness and correct to asabsolute = rodmakers@wugate.w= rodmakers@w= I guess my thinking is the straighter the strip, theeasier the = =++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++= ------=_NextPart_000_0023_01BF25F2.11942CA0-- from jfoster@gte.net Wed Nov 3 11:57:31 1999 Subject: Re: update Their, their, their from tjtrodmaker@yahoo.com Wed Nov 3 12:17:30 1999 1999 10:17:28 PST Subject: Re: update phil, nuts? bamboo nuts? is this something i don'thave yet? where can i get some? what do we do withthem? it doesn't matter what they cost. i'll justhave to find some more drawer space. timothy --- Philip Corlis wrote:A big public thank you to Jerry for maintaining thisamazing resource for all bamboo nuts. By the way,I'm ordering some culms tomorrow! Phil "cheap trick" Corlis ====="Gooda' morning mister bear"__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com from jfoster@gte.net Wed Nov 3 12:35:02 1999 Subject: taper does anyone have this taper??? I have a 8 1/2 foot SouthBend #359 that I am preparing to rebuild thetip for,right now it is about 10 inches short of original. The problem I amhavingis finding the original taper for the tip, I know that I can extrapolatefromwhat I have left but I really would like to find the originalmeasurements.Paul NelsonNCTROUTER@aol.com from anglport@con2.com Wed Nov 3 13:24:27 1999 (SMTPD32-5.05) id ABB542340250; Wed, 03 Nov 1999 14:23:33 -0500 "rod 'akers" Subject: Re: Plane Cutter Adjusting tinkers of courseJohn And I always thought it was Evers....or Chance...... from hexagon@odyssee.net Wed Nov 3 14:38:11 1999 Subject: Re: For all you old guys out there just about all volume rodmakers sawed their strips to size. channer wrote: At 07:57 PM 11/02/1999 -0700, Don & Sandy Andersen wrote:Guys, Just got through talking to John Bokstrom about the efforts that largebuilders went through to get the strips straight for milling. Weconsideredvarious methods - power planning, scraping, power sanding etc. It wouldseem that if you were going from a preliminary taper to final in onepassof the mill, the strips better be flat on the enamel side. Anybody have aclue just what was done.I know that I straighten strips or portions of strips several timesduringthe planning process. I just can't figure out how it was done for a mill.I> >would suspect some type of power plane to take off about 0.020" orbetterto make sure the nodes were flat. Any thoughts? Don Don;Amongst the equipment that Lori Lohman had for sale was a heated,hydraulicstrip straightener, a very large heavy machine made out of steel I-beams.Also, I have heard that Granger used a contraption with many V-groovesinit to straighten many rough planed strips at once. I don't know what theothers did, but i am pretty sure they all had a method to straightenstripsbefore final planing.John from stetzer@csd.uwm.edu Wed Nov 3 15:46:16 1999 batch3.csd.uwm.edu (8.8.4/8.6.8) with ESMTP id PAA00131 for; (8.8.4/8.6.8) withSMTP id PAA12489 for ; Wed, 3 Nov 1999 Subject: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers Rodmaker Don Schroeder of Janesville WI spoke at our TU chapterlast week. (He quit his day job about 5 years ago to concentrateon rodmaking, after somebody ordered 12 rods. He makes ~45 rods a year and does lots of restorations.) Anyway, although he tapers his strips on a milling machine, he still scrapes the enamel by hand with a utility knife blade held with his fingers. His operation seems a curious mix of high tech and no tech. And he said designing rod tapers with a computer was a lot of BS :-) The good news, for me, was that my best efforts don't really LOOKthat bad compared to Don's. Didn't have a chance to cast them though. Don's got a web page at http://www.inwave.com/~schroede/ , FYI.......................................................................Frank Stetzer "...a cheerful comrade is betterstetzer@uwm.edu than a waterproof coat and a Employed by, but not speaking for foot-warmer." Henry Van Dyke,Univ of Wisconsin-Milwaukee, USA "Fisherman's Luck", 1899. from jczimny@dol.net Wed Nov 3 16:31:12 1999 Subject: Re: For all you old guys out there I know that in one shop strips were heated in a retort and pressed in amodified metal break. This was a two man job. I don't think that this wasused John Z Don & Sandy Andersen wrote: Guys, Just got through talking to John Bokstrom about the efforts that largebuilders went through to get the strips straight for milling. Weconsideredvarious methods - power planning, scraping, power sanding etc. It wouldseem that if you were going from a preliminary taper to final in onepassof the mill, the strips better be flat on the enamel side. Anybody have aclue just what was done.I know that I straighten strips or portions of strips several times duringthe planning process. I just can't figure out how it was done for a mill. Iwould suspect some type of power plane to take off about 0.020" orbetterto make sure the nodes were flat. Any thoughts? Don from flyman35@home.com Wed Nov 3 16:45:16 1999 (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with ESMTP Subject: wood source does anybody have a source for figured stock for turning reel seatinserts? any help would be appreciated. Thanks, MAtt from brewer@teleport.com Wed Nov 3 17:15:49 1999 "hamachi"via SMTP by relay1.teleport.com, id smtpdAAA0088fq; Wed Nov 315:15:45 1999 Subject: Re: wood source Here's one source if you don't have a local source: http://www.woodcraft.com/ -----Original Message----- Subject: wood source does anybody have a source for figured stock for turning reel seatinserts? any help would be appreciated. Thanks, MAtt from cattanac@wmis.net Wed Nov 3 17:49:15 1999 Subject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers And he said designing rod tapers with a computer was a lot of BS :-) Frank -This is not the first time that I have heard the same words - and thereare others that focus to different techniques and ideas. Time has taughtmethat it is a very small world out there in rodmaking land. At times I feelas if it is a toe stubbing - but I also have been hurtful to some as well.The Reality is that in most cases it is best to just go fishing and let someone else take notes..... from hsilver@pyx.net Wed Nov 3 17:54:18 1999 Subject: RE: Planing form adjustment using slotted plane On Wed, 3 Nov 1999, Kling, Barry W. hath penned; Seth - So far I've just used superglue. The strips have falled off a couple oftimes, but epoxy was worse (I just used 5 min stuff) and it only takes aminute to reglue them (after filing off old glue). I'd love to know of abetter glue for this. BK I like the idea of using 0.005 feeler gauge leafs from an auto spark gapadjuster. I think I will attempt to use this method myself. But I thinkI would use a 0.003 or 0.004 leaf instead of the 0.005 in order tocompensate for the 0.001 or 0.002 thickness of the epoxy or superglue. Until now, I've been using to thin strips of copper folded over the edge of each side of the blade. One item I'm determined to integrateinto the block plane is the handle over the top so I can get betterleverage on the plane and seems far less fatiguing to the finger tipsto maintain the pressures necessary to ensure fine work. Also, I have two block planes. One is a "Low Angle 22.5 degree" Stanleyused for making one inch wide per sheet scarf joints from one eighth inchOkume plywood in Kayak manufacture. The other is an off the shelf Stanleyblock plane. It seems to me that the Low Angle block plane would removefar less bamboo and would be reasonable for very fine tip section work.Whereas, the regular Stanley block would seem appropriate for generalfinishing. As I am still working on the butt section of my Harley Number0.0000001, [Hey, we all had to start sometime !] I suppose over time I'llget a better feel for what's appropriate. Harley SilverVictus, libertas et possessio. Its really not any more complicated. from if6were9@bellsouth.net Wed Nov 3 18:29:21 1999 TAA24542; Subject: Re: wood source D18C768BFC331BB29A04BB92" --------------D18C768BFC331BB29A04BB92 MATTHEW TROPP wrote: does anybody have a source for figured stock for turning reel seatinserts? any help would be appreciated. Thanks, MAtt Here are a few places you can check.Cocobolo Inc., RareTropical HardwoodsJacobs MillClaro Walnut, Black Walnut, Walnut Burl, Hardwood Supply Good luckPat --------------D18C768BFC331BB29A04BB92 MATTHEW TROPP wrote:does anybody have a source for figured stock forturning reel seat Thanks, MAtt Here are a few places you can check. RareTropicalHardwoods Walnut,Black Walnut, Walnut Burl, Hardwood Supply Good luckPat --------------D18C768BFC331BB29A04BB92-- from Davidhray1@aol.com Wed Nov 3 18:45:25 1999 Subject: Constable Wisp from the Stan Smartt Collection was heavily varnished and I havesubtracted .004 from the measurements. Constable Wisp 6' 2pc. 3wt 1 .0825 .09210 .10915 .11921 .14425 .14531 .16135 .16737.5 .18540 .19146 .21250 .22155 .24163 .251 Guide Spacing 4.5, 11 1/8, 20 1/8, 30 1/8, But Stripper 9" from ferrule. One of Stan's Favorite rods. I wanted another taper to make sure this oneis correct. David H. Ray from brewer@teleport.com Wed Nov 3 18:50:55 1999 "hamachi"via SMTP by relay1.teleport.com, id smtpdAAAsnQeL_; Wed Nov 316:50:44 1999 Subject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers Just to fan the flames a little... I am puzzled as to why someone would advertise their rods using awebsiteand yet fail to see a computer's value when making calculations (that WASwhy they were invented). Perhaps using a computer to calculate compoundinterest or plot the trajectory of a spacecraft is "BS", too! Hey, wasn'tthe Tacoma Narrows Bridge designed without the benefit of a computer? :-) I'm not saying that using a computer is for everyone. But I think Wayne hasdone us all a service by making his software available to those whochooseto use it. I continually see posts to this list by people who are verypleased with Wayne's tapers. That says it all for me! -Randy Brewer -----Original Message----- Subject: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers Rodmaker Don Schroeder of Janesville WI spoke at our TU chapterlast week. (He quit his day job about 5 years ago to concentrateon rodmaking, after somebody ordered 12 rods. He makes ~45 rodsa year and does lots of restorations.) Anyway, although he tapershis strips on a milling machine, he still scrapes the enamel byhand with a utility knife blade held with his fingers. His operationseems a curious mix of high tech and no tech. And he said designing rod tapers with a computer was a lot of BS :-) The good news, for me, was that my best efforts don't really LOOKthat bad compared to Don's. Didn't have a chance to cast them though. Don's got a web page at http://www.inwave.com/~schroede/ , FYI.......................................................................Frank Stetzer "...a cheerful comrade is betterstetzer@uwm.edu than a waterproof coat and aEmployed by, but not speaking for foot-warmer." Henry Van Dyke,Univ of Wisconsin-Milwaukee, USA "Fisherman's Luck", 1899. from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Wed Nov 3 18:53:52 1999 Wed, 3 Nov 1999 16:53:29 -0800 Subject: Re: Planing form adjustment using slotted plane Harley,I understand your desire to make this simpler, and raising the planeis a good idea. I used to use a variation of it myself. I'm not trying inany way to pick on you, but the one thing that makes planing both easy andaccurate is a plane blade sharper than most folks can imagine. Razorsharpisn't even close. Try several different methods, from waterstones to"scarysharp," to leather wheels and buffing compound. When you hit on one thatworks for you, you'll know it. The light will come on, and you will havefound bamboo nirvana. Well, almost. Still gotta deal with nodes. Harry hsilver@pyx.net wrote: On Wed, 3 Nov 1999, Kling, Barry W. hath penned;Seth - So far I've just used superglue. The strips have falled off a couple oftimes, but epoxy was worse (I just used 5 min stuff) and it only takesaminute to reglue them (after filing off old glue). I'd love to know of abetter glue for this. BK I like the idea of using 0.005 feeler gauge leafs from an auto spark gapadjuster. I think I will attempt to use this method myself. But I thinkI would use a 0.003 or 0.004 leaf instead of the 0.005 in order tocompensate for the 0.001 or 0.002 thickness of the epoxy or superglue. Until now, I've been using to thin strips of copper folded over theedge of each side of the blade. One item I'm determined to integrateinto the block plane is the handle over the top so I can get betterleverage on the plane and seems far less fatiguing to the finger tipsto maintain the pressures necessary to ensure fine work. Also, I have two block planes. One is a "Low Angle 22.5 degree" Stanleyused for making one inch wide per sheet scarf joints from one eighthinchOkume plywood in Kayak manufacture. The other is an off the shelfStanleyblock plane. It seems to me that the Low Angle block plane would removefar less bamboo and would be reasonable for very fine tip section work.Whereas, the regular Stanley block would seem appropriate for generalfinishing. As I am still working on the butt section of my Harley Number0.0000001, [Hey, we all had to start sometime !] I suppose over time I'llget a better feel for what's appropriate. Harley SilverVictus, libertas et possessio. Its really not any more complicated. from k5vkq@ix.netcom.com Wed Nov 3 19:06:39 1999 "rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu" Subject: Re: Southern tears Wonderful Harry. I think I'll print it and frame it. Notwithstanding Ihad a terific time and enjoyed meeting everyone. I am looking forward tonext year. Regards,Onisk5vkq@ix.netcom.com Hit "Delete" now if you don't want to read a little creative writing. Southern Tears Who is the fellowwho makes bamboo rods? Smoke from an old burned out pipe circleshis head constantly as he ruminates over how to solve a problem or workoutthe latest challenge. And he was at the SouthernRodmakers Gathering. -------------------- Sadness is that Grayrock is eight long months down theroad. That's what makes it good. &%$via got a bunch together, and look what has happened. Thank you, Charlie. Suffice it to say, "Next year, same time, same place." Mysincere thanks and best to all, Harry from saltwein@swbell.net Wed Nov 3 19:12:20 1999 (Sun Internet Mail Server sims.3.5.1999.09.16.21.57.p8)with ESMTP id for Subject: Re: Constable Wisp I love to amass tapers. A little history is a nice thing too. Pleaseenlighten meif you have more info. Who was Constable Wisp? Thanks and Regards, SteveIndependence, MO Davidhray1@aol.com wrote: from the Stan Smartt Collection was heavily varnished and I havesubtracted.004 from the measurements. Constable Wisp 6' 2pc. 3wt 1 .0825 .09210 .10915 .11921 .14425 .14531 .16135 .16737.5 .18540 .19146 .21250 .22155 .24163 .251 Guide Spacing 4.5, 11 1/8, 20 1/8, 30 1/8, But Stripper 9" from ferrule. One of Stan's Favorite rods. I wanted another taper to make sure thisone iscorrect. David H. Ray from noblur@stic.net Wed Nov 3 19:36:57 1999 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0- 60503U15500L11000S0V35)with SMTP id net for ;Wed, 3 Nov 1999 19:36:53 -0600 Subject: Identification boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0043_01BF2632.BE4E8360" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0043_01BF2632.BE4E8360 I have today, received delivery of an "unknown" bamboo rod. I frankly =was shocked, as I was expecting something on the order of a Monty, or =H-I ! In D.B. Homel's book, he has a photo of an F.E. Edwards salmon rod. The =rod I have, is 9'-7", with two tips, and except for some varnish aging, =is in extremely good condition. It has tiny guides and tip tops. The tip =tops are very nice agate. The reason I point out the Edwards rod, is =that the wraps, are identical to the rod in the book. Does anyone know =what color he used, or did he even have a standard color ? All the =fittings are lovely nickel silver, with a sliding band reel seat. There =is not a name or stamping of any type ! There are 9 intermediates, =between the guides and winding check. One tip has varied intermediate =wraps, on one tip, that alternate from a deep maroon, and a very dark =green, or black. It has a swelled butt, ala Heddon, and the tips are very fine. This =leads me to believe it is a dry fly action. To say I am pleased with the buy, is putting it mildly, as it is a real =pro's rod ! Has anyone got any clues ? GMA ------=_NextPart_000_0043_01BF2632.BE4E8360 I have today, received delivery of an "unknown" bamboo rod.= frankly was shocked, as I was expecting something on the order of a = H-I ! In D.B. Homel's book, he has a photo of an F.E. Edwards = The rod I have, is 9'-7", with two tips, and except for some varnish = in extremely good condition. It has tiny guides and tip tops. The tip = very nice agate. The reason I point out the Edwards rod, is that the = even have a standard color ? All the fittings are lovely nickel silver, = sliding band reel seat. There is not a name or stamping of any type ! = 9 intermediates, between the guides and winding check. One tip has = intermediate wraps, on one tip, that alternate from a deep maroon, and a = dark green, or black. It has a swelled butt, ala Heddon, and the tips are very = leads me to believe it is a dry fly action. To say I am pleased with the buy, is putting it mildly, as = real pro's rod ! Has anyone got any clues ? GMA ------=_NextPart_000_0043_01BF2632.BE4E8360-- from stpete@netten.net Wed Nov 3 20:15:24 1999 Wed, 3 Nov 1999 21:21:31 -0600 Subject: Re: Planing form adjustment using slotted plane Guys, It's not that hard to put a .003 or .004 groove down the middle ofa plane sole. Check out Frank Neuneman's page. If you are using theglued on strips regularly, I'd just sand a groove in my plane. You canalways sand the groove away again on a plate glass just like you weretruing the plane sole up the first time. Popping a superglued on shimin the middle of a strip sucks big time. Ask me how I know. Rick C. hsilver@pyx.net wrote: On Wed, 3 Nov 1999, Kling, Barry W. hath penned;Seth - So far I've just used superglue. The strips have falled off a couple oftimes, but epoxy was worse (I just used 5 min stuff) and it only takesaminute to reglue them (after filing off old glue). I'd love to know of abetter glue for this. BK I like the idea of using 0.005 feeler gauge leafs from an auto spark gapadjuster. I think I will attempt to use this method myself. But I thinkI would use a 0.003 or 0.004 leaf instead of the 0.005 in order tocompensate for the 0.001 or 0.002 thickness of the epoxy or superglue. Until now, I've been using to thin strips of copper folded over theedge of each side of the blade. One item I'm determined to integrateinto the block plane is the handle over the top so I can get betterleverage on the plane and seems far less fatiguing to the finger tipsto maintain the pressures necessary to ensure fine work. Also, I have two block planes. One is a "Low Angle 22.5 degree" Stanleyused for making one inch wide per sheet scarf joints from one eighthinchOkume plywood in Kayak manufacture. The other is an off the shelfStanleyblock plane. It seems to me that the Low Angle block plane would removefar less bamboo and would be reasonable for very fine tip section work.Whereas, the regular Stanley block would seem appropriate for generalfinishing. As I am still working on the butt section of my Harley Number0.0000001, [Hey, we all had to start sometime !] I suppose over time I'llget a better feel for what's appropriate. Harley SilverVictus, libertas et possessio. Its really not any more complicated. from hexagon@odyssee.net Wed Nov 3 20:42:01 1999 RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Re: Constable Wisp Clifford Constable was a British rodmaker from Bromley, Kent. I do notrecallConstable Wisp, he has never felt my collar. Steve Trauthwein wrote: I love to amass tapers. A little history is a nice thing too. Pleaseenlighten meif you have more info. Who was Constable Wisp? Thanks and Regards, SteveIndependence, MO Davidhray1@aol.com wrote: from the Stan Smartt Collection was heavily varnished and I havesubtracted.004 from the measurements. Constable Wisp 6' 2pc. 3wt 1 .0825 .09210 .10915 .11921 .14425 .14531 .16135 .16737.5 .18540 .19146 .21250 .22155 .24163 .251 Guide Spacing 4.5, 11 1/8, 20 1/8, 30 1/8, But Stripper 9" fromferrule. One of Stan's Favorite rods. I wanted another taper to make sure thisone iscorrect. David H. Ray from hexagon@odyssee.net Wed Nov 3 20:52:02 1999 Subject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers If a guy says he finds a computer unnecessary to design a rod then hefinds itunnecessary. How is that wrong.Making fishing poles may be rocket science to some but to others it is not. Randy Brewer wrote: Just to fan the flames a little... I am puzzled as to why someone would advertise their rods using awebsiteand yet fail to see a computer's value when making calculations (thatWASwhy they were invented). Perhaps using a computer to calculatecompoundinterest or plot the trajectory of a spacecraft is "BS", too! Hey, wasn'tthe Tacoma Narrows Bridge designed without the benefit of a computer? :-) I'm not saying that using a computer is for everyone. But I think Waynehasdone us all a service by making his software available to those whochooseto use it. I continually see posts to this list by people who are verypleased with Wayne's tapers. That says it all for me! -Randy Brewer -----Original Message-----From: Frank Stetzer Date: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 1:53 PMSubject: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers Rodmaker Don Schroeder of Janesville WI spoke at our TU chapterlast week. (He quit his day job about 5 years ago to concentrateon rodmaking, after somebody ordered 12 rods. He makes ~45 rodsa year and does lots of restorations.) Anyway, although he tapershis strips on a milling machine, he still scrapes the enamel byhand with a utility knife blade held with his fingers. His operationseems a curious mix of high tech and no tech. And he said designing rod tapers with a computer was a lot of BS :-) The good news, for me, was that my best efforts don't really LOOKthat bad compared to Don's. Didn't have a chance to cast them though. Don's got a web page at http://www.inwave.com/~schroede/ , FYI.......................................................................Frank Stetzer "...a cheerful comrade is betterstetzer@uwm.edu than a waterproof coat and aEmployed by, but not speaking for foot-warmer." Henry Van Dyke,Univ of Wisconsin-Milwaukee, USA "Fisherman's Luck", 1899. from Nodewrrior@aol.com Wed Nov 3 20:59:27 1999 Subject: Re: Don Schroeder fan There are alot od Don's fine rods around the Chicago area. He's got some great tapers-wonderful rods! A swell guy too. Rob Hoffhines from drinkr@voicenet.com Wed Nov 3 21:16:12 1999 0000 (209.71.50.156) Subject: more requests Request .....Ive been upgrading my dipping system in the shop and I need afew items that I can't find. The first is where to find valve of some typeto drain the varnish from the tube (I use 11/2 diameter copper). And thesecond is a suggestion from any one familiar with AC or DC motors thatwillmove forward and reverse in variable speed lets say 1to 4 revolutions perminute. I have been looking over the H and R catalogue at possibilities butI cant get enough info to decide a good route .Lastly, I bought Ray Goulds book at B&Noble months ago and waswonderingif it was supposed to contain some software for rod design. Let me knowifI have been sold short.Thanks in AdvanceD. Rinker from rsgould@cmc.net Wed Nov 3 21:17:28 1999 Subject: Re: Identification boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0029_01BF2630.0AADA0E0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0029_01BF2630.0AADA0E0 Hi George,I am currently working on an F.E. Edwards 8 1/2 ft x 3pc x 5wt rod. It =has brown wraps (fairly dark) that are the same color as other =F.E.Thomas rods I've worked on. The signature wrap starting next to the =winding check wrap is 3 intermediates, space, then 7 intermediates, =space, then 3 intermediates, space then 1 intermediate. Then winding =check brown wrap is tipped with red. This rod has a swelled butt and is =just wonderful to cast.Ray Gould Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 5:36 PMSubject: Identification I have today, received delivery of an "unknown" bamboo rod. I frankly =was shocked, as I was expecting something on the order of a Monty, or =H-I ! In D.B. Homel's book, he has a photo of an F.E. Edwards salmon rod. =The rod I have, is 9'-7", with two tips, and except for some varnish =aging, is in extremely good condition. It has tiny guides and tip tops. =The tip tops are very nice agate. The reason I point out the Edwards =rod, is that the wraps, are identical to the rod in the book. Does =anyone know what color he used, or did he even have a standard color ? =All the fittings are lovely nickel silver, with a sliding band reel =seat. There is not a name or stamping of any type ! There are 9 =intermediates, between the guides and winding check. One tip has varied =intermediate wraps, on one tip, that alternate from a deep maroon, and a =very dark green, or black. It has a swelled butt, ala Heddon, and the tips are very fine. This =leads me to believe it is a dry fly action. To say I am pleased with the buy, is putting it mildly, as it is a =real pro's rod ! Has anyone got any clues ? GMA ------=_NextPart_000_0029_01BF2630.0AADA0E0 Hi George,I am currently working on an F.E. = x 3pc x 5wt rod. It has brown wraps (fairly dark) that are the same = other F.E.Thomas rods I've worked on. The signature wrap starting next = winding check wrap is 3 intermediates, space, then 7 intermediates, = 3 intermediates, space then 1 intermediate. Then winding check brown = cast.Ray Gould ----- Original Message ----- George M. = Sent: Wednesday, November 03, = PMSubject: Identification I have today, received delivery of an "unknown" bamboo = frankly was shocked, as I was expecting something on the order of a = H-I ! In D.B. Homel's book, he has a photo of an F.E. Edwards = rod. The rod I have, is 9'-7", with two tips, and except for some = aging, is in extremely good condition. It has tiny guides and tip = tip tops are very nice agate. The reason I point out the Edwards rod, = the wraps, are identical to the rod in the book. Does anyone know what = he used, or did he even have a standard color ? All the fittings are = nickel silver, with a sliding band reel seat. There is not a name or = of any type ! There are 9 intermediates, between the guides and = One tip has varied intermediate wraps, on one tip, that alternate from = maroon, and a very dark green, or black. It has a swelled butt, ala Heddon, and the tips are very = This leads me to believe it is a dry fly action. To say I am pleased with the buy, is putting it mildly, = a real pro's rod ! Has anyone got any clues ? GMA ------=_NextPart_000_0029_01BF2630.0AADA0E0-- from bob@downandacross.com Wed Nov 3 21:20:48 1999 (envelope- from bob@downandacross.com) Subject: first rod misfirings (pun intended) Hi guys,I am still in the pre planing stages of building my first nodeless rod. The splices would be done if I could afford more Pony clamps. I was planningon a 7'2" Driggs, but I did not flame the rod. (Only heat treated in oven so far.) Is the Driggs taper a poor choice because of the lack of additional heat/flaming? If so, what do you suggest? The strips are about theperfect size for a 7'2" rod at tops. Maybe a 7' for 4wt. Dickerson 7012?Anyone want to tackle that? I would be using this for light trouting on non-windy days, fishing various length leaders (9-15'), and making shortto medium length casts, less than 50'.Thanks,Bob Maulucci==================================================downandacross.com productionswebsite, audio, and print designhttp://www.downandacross.com218 Wallace AvenueBuffalo, NY 14216716-836-8297 home716-867-0523 cellularbob@downandacross.com from knflyrod@home.com Wed Nov 3 21:47:15 1999 (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with SMTP Wed, 3 Nov 1999 19:47:12 -0800 Subject: Re: more requests David, Try Grangers. I bought mine there . It is 1 rpm and reversible. Iam more than happy with it. Good luck, Ron Huff----- Original Message ----- Subject: more requests Request .....Ive been upgrading my dipping system in the shop and I need afew items that I can't find. The first is where to find valve of sometypeto drain the varnish from the tube (I use 11/2 diameter copper). And thesecond is a suggestion from any one familiar with AC or DC motors thatwillmove forward and reverse in variable speed lets say 1to 4 revolutionsperminute. I have been looking over the H and R catalogue at possibilitiesbutI cant get enough info to decide a good route .Lastly, I bought Ray Goulds book at B&Noble months ago and waswonderingif it was supposed to contain some software for rod design. Let meknowifI have been sold short.Thanks in AdvanceD. Rinker from stpete@netten.net Wed Nov 3 21:59:33 1999 Wed, 3 Nov 1999 23:05:44 -0600 Subject: Re: first rod misfirings (pun intended) Bob, I like my Driggs very much and I think it would be a wonderful test ofyour splicing capabilities as it bends deeply into the butt and wellinto the grip on long casts. Hook up with a 18" fish in a fast riffleand you'll soon see how well your splices hold up. I swear that rodwill bend to the reelseat! You couldn't ask for more excitement thanthe mix of emotions which occurs when you are grinning ear to ear over agood fish, and sweating about whether the tippet or the rod butt isgoing to bust first. Rick C.bob maulucci wrote: Hi guys,I am still in the pre planing stages of building my first nodeless rod. Thesplices would be done if I could afford more Pony clamps. I was planningona 7'2" Driggs, but I did not flame the rod. (Only heat treated in oven sofar.) Is the Driggs taper a poor choice because of the lack of additionalheat/flaming? If so, what do you suggest? The strips are about theperfectsize for a 7'2" rod at tops. Maybe a 7' for 4wt. Dickerson 7012?Anyone want to tackle that? I would be using this for light trouting onnon-windy days, fishing various length leaders (9-15'), and making shorttomedium length casts, less than 50'.Thanks,Bob Maulucci==================================================downandacross.com productionswebsite, audio, and print designhttp://www.downandacross.com218 Wallace AvenueBuffalo, NY 14216716-836-8297 home716-867-0523 cellularbob@downandacross.com from FISHWOOL@aol.com Wed Nov 3 22:24:57 1999 Subject: Re: For all you old guys out there John, et al.,How about ironing the strips while in the rough form?Hank. from brewer@teleport.com Wed Nov 3 23:15:40 1999 (216.26.32.230) Subject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers You may have missed my point, Terry. It is obviously not necessary to useacomputer. I just find it ironic that someone with a nice website sellingrods over the Internet might feel that "designing rod tapers with acomputerwas a lot of BS". That statement seems a little harsh, that's all, sincemost of use whatever tools are at our disposal. -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers If a guy says he finds a computer unnecessary to design a rod then hefinds itunnecessary. How is that wrong.Making fishing poles may be rocket science to some but to others it isnot. Randy Brewer wrote: Just to fan the flames a little... I am puzzled as to why someone would advertise their rods using awebsiteand yet fail to see a computer's value when making calculations (thatWASwhy they were invented). Perhaps using a computer to calculatecompoundinterest or plot the trajectory of a spacecraft is "BS", too! Hey, wasn'tthe Tacoma Narrows Bridge designed without the benefit of acomputer?:-) I'm not saying that using a computer is for everyone. But I think Waynehasdone us all a service by making his software available to those whochooseto use it. I continually see posts to this list by people who are verypleased with Wayne's tapers. That says it all for me! -Randy Brewer -----Original Message-----From: Frank Stetzer Date: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 1:53 PMSubject: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers Rodmaker Don Schroeder of Janesville WI spoke at our TU chapterlast week. (He quit his day job about 5 years ago to concentrateon rodmaking, after somebody ordered 12 rods. He makes ~45 rodsa year and does lots of restorations.) Anyway, although he tapershis strips on a milling machine, he still scrapes the enamel byhand with a utility knife blade held with his fingers. His operationseems a curious mix of high tech and no tech. And he said designing rod tapers with a computer was a lot of BS :-) The good news, for me, was that my best efforts don't really LOOKthat bad compared to Don's. Didn't have a chance to cast them though. Don's got a web page at http://www.inwave.com/~schroede/ , FYI.......................................................................Frank Stetzer "...a cheerful comrade is betterstetzer@uwm.edu than a waterproof coat and aEmployed by, but not speaking for foot-warmer." Henry Van Dyke,Univ of Wisconsin-Milwaukee, USA "Fisherman's Luck", 1899. from mrj@aa.net Thu Nov 4 00:22:05 1999 Wed, 3 Nov 1999 22:21:46 -0800 Subject: RE: Straight Strips? both Martin Jensen -----Original Message----- Subject: RE: Straight Strips? Straight Strips? I have never had a problem with my strips being crooked.Ibuild nodeless....is this message for the builders that build noded rods?Wheredo the strips go crooked? Is it in the node or the internodal region of thestrip? Jeff Internet Mail MessageReceived from host: wugate.wustl.edu[128.252.120.1] Envelope Sender: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Please respond to mrj@aa.net Subject: RE: Straight Strips? I used to spend a lot more time straightening my strips then I do now. Inowstraighten only until the strip will stay in the groove when planed. If thestrip has a bend in it and flops out of the groove but when I push the planeup the spline, the spline moves back into the groove, I consider that goodenough. Now kinks, are a different matter, these sharp bends have to bedealt with.As long as I can plane the section, that is all I care about. When I amdone and all glued up I will check for straightness and correct to asabsolute straight as possible. Martin Jensen -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: November 02, 1999 6:32 AM Subject: Straight Strips? OK, the email I just responded to from Eric just brought another questionto mind concerning part of that subject.How many of you straighten your strips. I know we all straighten thenodes, but do any of the other of you straighten the entire strip. I alwayshave because... well, I guess my thinking is the straighter the strip, theeasier the planing and binding process go, and the straightening processafter the binding. Any opinions? Bob+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ R.L. "Bob" Nunley, Rodmaker+ Custom Split Bamboo Fly Rods+ http://members.clnk.com/caneman/images/flystuff/caneindex.htm++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ from RMargiotta@aol.com Thu Nov 4 02:51:35 1999 Subject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers Randy: I'm not sure what Don S. really meant, but I assume it is the stress curve method of rod design that he feels is BS. --Rich from caneman@clnk.com Thu Nov 4 04:40:38 1999 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35)with SMTP id com for ;Thu, 4 Nov 1999 04:39:18 -0600 Subject: New site for bamboo enthusiasts. type="multipart/alternative";boundary="---- =_NextPart_000_0021_01BF267E.6E4F78A0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0021_01BF267E.6E4F78A0 boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0022_01BF267E.6E4F78A0" ------=_NextPart_001_0022_01BF267E.6E4F78A0 I just ran across a new site that I was very impressed with. It is more = rodmaker, but it is very interest and well built to say the least. I =just thought I would post the URL for it here so those of you who want =to see it could go there. This guy has free classifieds, free =appraisals, and page to promote rodmakers... free of charge by the way!Anyways, the url is http://members.xoom.com/fishcane/ Go check it =out and give this guy a few hits on his counter. Bob R.L. "Bob" Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Bamboo Fly Rodshttp://members.clnk.com/caneman/images/flystuff/caneindex.htm ------=_NextPart_001_0022_01BF267E.6E4F78A0 thought I would post the URL for it here so those of you who want to see = to promote rodmakers... free of charge by the way! Go check it out and give this guy a few hits on his counter. Bob Rodsht=tp://members.clnk.com/caneman/images/flystuff/caneindex.htm--- ---=_NextPart_000_0021_01BF267E.6E4F78A0-- from tjtrodmaker@yahoo.com Thu Nov 4 07:31:20 1999 1999 05:31:17 PST Subject: Re: first rod misfirings (pun intended) bob, i expect you'll like the driggs. timothy --- bob maulucci wrote:Hi guys,I am still in the pre planing stages of building myfirst nodeless rod. The splices would be done if I could afford more Ponyclamps. I was planning on a 7'2" Driggs, but I did not flame the rod. (Onlyheat treated in oven so far.) Is the Driggs taper a poor choice because ofthe lack of additional heat/flaming? If so, what do you suggest? The stripsare about the perfect size for a 7'2" rod at tops. Maybe a 7' for 4wt.Dickerson 7012?Anyone want to tackle that? I would be using this non-windy days, fishing various length leaders(9-15'), and making short to medium length casts, less than 50'.Thanks,Bob Maulucci==================================================downandacross.com productionswebsite, audio, and print designhttp://www.downandacross.com218 Wallace AvenueBuffalo, NY 14216716-836-8297 home716-867-0523 cellularbob@downandacross.com ====="Gooda' morning mister bear"__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com from Eastkoyfly@aol.com Thu Nov 4 08:15:09 1999 Subject: varnish Hi guyshas any one used, or know the effects of using fast drying polyurethaneon blanks. Good & bad points etc. from darrell@rockclimbing.org Thu Nov 4 08:37:33 1999 sims.3.5.1999.09.16.21.57.p8)with SMTP id for Subject: Re: New site for bamboo enthusiasts. boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0021_01BF268F.067B83C0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0021_01BF268F.067B83C0 boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0022_01BF268F.068324E0" ------=_NextPart_001_0022_01BF268F.068324E0 He had shut his page down for the summer while he went fishing but that =site, which has been around for a few years belongs to Clark Davis, an =avid collector and he does have a great site... he gets about 500 hits = I believe it's all in the meta tags... I'm still trying to figure it all =out... my site is now averaging about 55/day and climbing... my site is =similar but certainly not as refined... work in progress... Darrellwww.bamboorods.homepage.com Sent: Thursday, November 04, 1999 2:38 AMSubject: New site for bamboo enthusiasts. I just ran across a new site that I was very impressed with. It is =more for the enthusiast or the collector of fine cane rods than for the =rodmaker, but it is very interest and well built to say the least. I =just thought I would post the URL for it here so those of you who want =to see it could go there. This guy has free classifieds, free =appraisals, and page to promote rodmakers... free of charge by the way!Anyways, the url is http://members.xoom.com/fishcane/ Go check it =out and give this guy a few hits on his counter. Bob R.L. "Bob" Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Bamboo Fly Rodshttp://members.clnk.com/caneman/images/flystuff/caneindex.htm ------=_NextPart_001_0022_01BF268F.068324E0 BODY {COLOR: #000000; FONT-FAMILY: arial; FONT-SIZE: 12pt; MARGIN- LEFT:8em} He had shut his page down for= while he went fishing but that site, which has been around for a few = belongs to Clark Davis, an avid collector and he does have a great = gets about 500 hits per day... I believe it's all in the meta= still trying to figure it all out... my site is now averaging about = progress... Darrellwww.bamboorods.homepage.com ----- Original Message ----- Bob =Nunley Makers List Serve Sent: Thursday, November 04, = AM enthusiasts. I just ran across a new site that I was very impressed = more for the enthusiast or the collector of fine cane rods than for = rodmaker, but it is very interest and well built to say the = just thought I would post the URL for it here so those of you who want = page to promote rodmakers... free of charge by the way! Go check it out and give this guy a few hits on his counter. Bob Rodsht=tp://members.clnk.com/caneman/images/flystuff/caneindex.htm ------=_NextPart_001_0022_01BF268F.068324E0-- ------=_NextPart_000_0021_01BF268F.067B83C0 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------=_NextPart_000_0021_01BF268F.067B83C0-- from edriddle@mindspring.com Thu Nov 4 10:06:01 1999 Subject: Re: varnish I applied one flat at a time using a 1" foam brush ("not for shellac orlacquer" printed on handle) and was generally pleased. Applied 4 coats. spirits,stir and let set for bubbles to disappear. Wait 24 hours between coats.Lightly buff w/ 0000 steel wool after first 3 coats. Use tack cloth aftereach buffing to clense any debris. Wait a week after final coat beforemoving on. One Drawback; Clear polyurethane I used left "ambering"effect;i.e., cane darkened slightly with reddish tone. Contact me offline for moreparticulars.Ed-----Original Message----- Subject: varnish Hi guyshas any one used, or know the effects of using fast drying polyurethaneonblanks. Good & bad points etc. from arnold.jl@pg.com Thu Nov 4 10:08:16 1999 notes082.na.pg.com[155.125.116.193] 1999 11:06:13 1999)) id8525681F.00572AC8 ; Thu, 4 Nov 1999 10:52:05 -0500 Subject: RE: Straight Strips? O.K.......Maybe what I see as a sweep may be viewed by others as crooked. Ifitlays in the form when I run the plane over it, then it is straight to me. Thanks for the replies, Jeff Internet Mail Message Received from host: wugate.wustl.edu [128.252.120.1] Envelope Sender: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Please respond to mrj@aa.net Subject: RE: Straight Strips? both Martin Jensen -----Original Message----- Subject: RE: Straight Strips? Straight Strips? I have never had a problem with my strips being crooked.Ibuild nodeless....is this message for the builders that build noded rods?Wheredo the strips go crooked? Is it in the node or the internodal region of thestrip? Jeff Internet Mail MessageReceived from host: wugate.wustl.edu[128.252.120.1] Envelope Sender: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Please respond to mrj@aa.net Subject: RE: Straight Strips? I used to spend a lot more time straightening my strips then I do now. Inowstraighten only until the strip will stay in the groove when planed. If thestrip has a bend in it and flops out of the groove but when I push the planeup the spline, the spline moves back into the groove, I consider that goodenough. Now kinks, are a different matter, these sharp bends have to bedealt with.As long as I can plane the section, that is all I care about. When I amdone and all glued up I will check for straightness and correct to asabsolute straight as possible. Martin Jensen -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: November 02, 1999 6:32 AM Subject: Straight Strips? OK, the email I just responded to from Eric just brought another questionto mind concerning part of that subject.How many of you straighten your strips. I know we all straighten thenodes, but do any of the other of you straighten the entire strip. I alwayshave because... well, I guess my thinking is the straighter the strip, theeasier the planing and binding process go, and the straightening processafter the binding. Any opinions? Bob+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ R.L. "Bob" Nunley, Rodmaker+ Custom Split Bamboo Fly Rods+ http://members.clnk.com/caneman/images/flystuff/caneindex.htm++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ from tjtrodmaker@yahoo.com Thu Nov 4 10:21:06 1999 1999 08:21:02 PST Subject: RE: Straight Strips? maybe the answer to this issue will rest, in the end,with genetic engineering. large heavy culms, 6'between nodes. timothy troester --- Jeff Arnold-JL wrote:O.K.......Maybe what I see as a sweep may be viewed lays in the form when I run the plane over it, thenit is straight to me. Thanks for the replies, Jeff Internet Mail Message Received from host: wugate.wustl.edu [128.252.120.1] Envelope Sender: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu From: "Martin Jensen" on 11/04/99 01:19AM Please respond to mrj@aa.net cc: caneman@clnk.com, "Rod Makers List Serve" Subject: RE: Straight Strips? both Martin Jensen -----Original Message----- Sent: November 03, 1999 5:34 AM Cc: caneman@clnk.com; Rod Makers List ServeSubject: RE: Straight Strips? Straight Strips? I have never had a problem with mystrips being crooked. Ibuild nodeless....is this message for the buildersthat build noded rods?Wheredo the strips go crooked? Is it in the node or theinternodal region of thestrip? Jeff Internet Mail MessageReceived from host: wugate.wustl.edu[128.252.120.1] Envelope Sender: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu From: "Martin Jensen" on 11/02/99 09:52PM Please respond to mrj@aa.net cc: (bcc: Jeff Arnold-JL/PGI)Subject: RE: Straight Strips? I used to spend a lot more time straightening mystrips then I do now. I nowstraighten only until the strip will stay in thegroove when planed. If thestrip has a bend in it and flops out of the groovebut when I push the planeup the spline, the spline moves back into thegroove, I consider that goodenough. Now kinks, are a different matter, thesesharp bends have to bedealt with.As long as I can plane the section, that is all Icare about. When I amdone and all glued up I will check for straightnessand correct to asabsolute straight as possible. Martin Jensen -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Of Bob NunleySent: November 02, 1999 6:32 AM Subject: Straight Strips? OK, the email I just responded to from Eric justbrought another questionto mind concerning part of that subject.How many of you straighten your strips. Iknow we all straighten thenodes, but do any of the other of you straighten theentire strip. I alwayshave because... well, I guess my thinking is thestraighter the strip, theeasier the planing and binding process go, and thestraightening processafter the binding. Any opinions? Bob +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ R.L. "Bob" Nunley, Rodmaker+ Custom Split Bamboo Fly Rods+ http://members.clnk.com/caneman/images/flystuff/caneindex.htm ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ ====="Gooda' morning mister bear"__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com from eestlow@srminc.com Thu Nov 4 11:09:37 1999 Subject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers 1999) at 11/04/9911:03:43 AM Actually, I believe the Tacoma Narrows bridge fell because about half ofthe structure was left out for economic purposes, not for lack of acomputer. Your point is well taken, however, and I heartily agree with youon Wayne's contribution. Best,-Ed "Randy Brewer" Sent by: cc:owner-rodmakers@wugate Subject: Re: Don Schroeder;Was:Old timers .wustl.edu 11/03/99 06:47 PMPlease respond tobrewer Just to fan the flames a little... I am puzzled as to why someone would advertise their rods using awebsiteand yet fail to see a computer's value when making calculations (that WASwhy they were invented). Perhaps using a computer to calculate compoundinterest or plot the trajectory of a spacecraft is "BS", too! Hey, wasn'tthe Tacoma Narrows Bridge designed without the benefit of a computer? :-) I'm not saying that using a computer is for everyone. But I think Wayne hasdone us all a service by making his software available to those whochooseto use it. I continually see posts to this list by people who are verypleased with Wayne's tapers. That says it all for me! -Randy Brewer -----Original Message----- Subject: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers Rodmaker Don Schroeder of Janesville WI spoke at our TU chapterlast week. (He quit his day job about 5 years ago to concentrateon rodmaking, after somebody ordered 12 rods. He makes ~45 rodsa year and does lots of restorations.) Anyway, although he tapershis strips on a milling machine, he still scrapes the enamel byhand with a utility knife blade held with his fingers. His operationseems a curious mix of high tech and no tech. And he said designing rod tapers with a computer was a lot of BS :-) The good news, for me, was that my best efforts don't really LOOKthat bad compared to Don's. Didn't have a chance to cast them though. Don's got a web page at http://www.inwave.com/~schroede/ , FYI.......................................................................Frank Stetzer "...a cheerful comrade is betterstetzer@uwm.edu than a waterproof coat and aEmployed by, but not speaking for foot-warmer." Henry Van Dyke,Univ of Wisconsin-Milwaukee, USA "Fisherman's Luck", 1899. from darrell@rockclimbing.org Thu Nov 4 12:09:44 1999 sims.3.5.1999.09.16.21.57.p8)with SMTP id for Subject: Re: taper for South Bend 359 8.5' 3/2 I have a SB 359 8.5' 3/2 rod... do you still need the taper? I just sold therod today so let me know if you still want the taper ASAP... Darrell Leewww.bamboorods.homepage.com ----- Original Message ----- Subject: taper does anyone have this taper??? I have a 8 1/2 foot SouthBend #359 that I am preparing to rebuild thetip for,right now it is about 10 inches short of original. The problem I amhavingis finding the original taper for the tip, I know that I can extrapolatefromwhat I have left but I really would like to find the originalmeasurements.Paul NelsonNCTROUTER@aol.com from rsgould@cmc.net Thu Nov 4 13:01:15 1999 Subject: Re: more requests Hi David,The floppy disk showing the taper design program was not included withthebook by the publisher. You can obtain one from me or from John Bokstrom.Ray----- Original Message ----- Subject: more requests Request .....Ive been upgrading my dipping system in the shop and I need afew items that I can't find. The first is where to find valve of sometypeto drain the varnish from the tube (I use 11/2 diameter copper). And thesecond is a suggestion from any one familiar with AC or DC motors thatwillmove forward and reverse in variable speed lets say 1to 4 revolutionsperminute. I have been looking over the H and R catalogue at possibilitiesbutI cant get enough info to decide a good route .Lastly, I bought Ray Goulds book at B&Noble months ago and waswonderingif it was supposed to contain some software for rod design. Let meknowifI have been sold short.Thanks in AdvanceD. Rinker from andrew_harsanyi@ibi.com Thu Nov 4 15:01:30 1999 0500 Subject: RE: varnish and temperature sensitivity Can varnish take temperatures that might go below freezing? I know notto use itunless it's warmed to room temp, but if I keep my dip tube (and I keep itloaded)in my non-heated garage and outside temps get down to, say, singledigits, will the varnish be ruined? Thanks. from hexagon@odyssee.net Thu Nov 4 15:28:38 1999 Subject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers Some builders do not need computers, they have the experience andjudgment to beable to produce tapers out of their heads.Bullshit, next to useless or a valuable tool can be used to describe roddesignprogrammes. It just depends on the individual.I have noticed over the years that most of the punters on this list arecomputery types that feel uncomfortable out of the glare of a computerscreenand very few actually get to make rods. Randy Brewer wrote: You may have missed my point, Terry. It is obviously not necessary touse acomputer. I just find it ironic that someone with a nice website sellingrods over the Internet might feel that "designing rod tapers with acomputerwas a lot of BS". That statement seems a little harsh, that's all, sincemost of use whatever tools are at our disposal. -----Original Message-----From: TERENCE ACKLAND Cc: RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.edu Date: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 6:59 PMSubject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers If a guy says he finds a computer unnecessary to design a rod then hefinds itunnecessary. How is that wrong.Making fishing poles may be rocket science to some but to others it isnot. Randy Brewer wrote: Just to fan the flames a little... I am puzzled as to why someone would advertise their rods using awebsiteand yet fail to see a computer's value when making calculations (thatWASwhy they were invented). Perhaps using a computer to calculatecompoundinterest or plot the trajectory of a spacecraft is "BS", too! Hey, wasn'tthe Tacoma Narrows Bridge designed without the benefit of acomputer?:-) I'm not saying that using a computer is for everyone. But I think Waynehasdone us all a service by making his software available to those whochooseto use it. I continually see posts to this list by people who are verypleased with Wayne's tapers. That says it all for me! -Randy Brewer -----Original Message-----From: Frank Stetzer Date: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 1:53 PMSubject: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers Rodmaker Don Schroeder of Janesville WI spoke at our TU chapterlast week. (He quit his day job about 5 years ago to concentrateon rodmaking, after somebody ordered 12 rods. He makes ~45 rodsa year and does lots of restorations.) Anyway, although he tapershis strips on a milling machine, he still scrapes the enamel byhand with a utility knife blade held with his fingers. His operationseems a curious mix of high tech and no tech. And he said designing rod tapers with a computer was a lot of BS :-) The good news, for me, was that my best efforts don't really LOOKthat bad compared to Don's. Didn't have a chance to cast them though. Don's got a web page at http://www.inwave.com/~schroede/ , FYI.......................................................................Frank Stetzer "...a cheerful comrade is betterstetzer@uwm.edu than a waterproof coat and aEmployed by, but not speaking for foot-warmer." Henry Van Dyke,Univ of Wisconsin-Milwaukee, USA "Fisherman's Luck", 1899. from edriddle@mindspring.com Thu Nov 4 16:09:28 1999 Subject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers There are DOERS and there are DOERS who are willing to SHARE / TEACH /HELPothers. I don't disparage either, but the latter are more appreciated byseekers of knowlege. Their free-offerings to the informed / uninformedarethere to be accepted or rejected. Why all the grunt and growl?Ed-----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers Some builders do not need computers, they have the experience andjudgmentto beable to produce tapers out of their heads.Bullshit, next to useless or a valuable tool can be used to describe roddesignprogrammes. It just depends on the individual.I have noticed over the years that most of the punters on this list arecomputery types that feel uncomfortable out of the glare of a computerscreenand very few actually get to make rods. from edriddle@mindspring.com Thu Nov 4 16:21:38 1999 Subject: Fw: varnish I was remiss in failing to mention in the attached that most of this infowas gleaned from an article I read written by David Klausmeyer.Ed-----Original Message---- - RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.edu Subject: Re: varnish I applied one flat at a time using a 1" foam brush ("not for shellac orlacquer" printed on handle) and was generally pleased. Applied 4 coats. spirits,stir and let set for bubbles to disappear. Wait 24 hours between coats.Lightly buff w/ 0000 steel wool after first 3 coats. Use tack cloth aftereach buffing to clense any debris. Wait a week after final coat beforemoving on. One Drawback; Clear polyurethane I used left "ambering"effect;i.e., cane darkened slightly with reddish tone. Contact me offline formoreparticulars.Ed-----Original Message-----From: Eastkoyfly@aol.com Date: Thursday, November 04, 1999 9:21 AMSubject: varnish Hi guyshas any one used, or know the effects of using fast drying polyurethaneonblanks. Good & bad points etc. from anglport@con2.com Thu Nov 4 17:20:55 1999 (SMTPD32-5.05) id A49C21E03CE; Thu, 04 Nov 1999 18:19:56 -0500 Subject: RE: Straight Strips? Works for me!Art At 08:34 AM 11/04/1999 -0500, Jeff Arnold-JL wrote:O.K.......Maybe what I see as a sweep may be viewed by others as crooked.If itlays in the form when I run the plane over it, then it is straight to me. Thanks for the replies, Jeff Internet Mail Message Received from host: wugate.wustl.edu [128.252.120.1] Envelope Sender: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu From: "Martin Jensen" on 11/04/99 01:19 AM Please respond to mrj@aa.net cc: caneman@clnk.com, "Rod Makers List Serve" Subject: RE: Straight Strips? both Martin Jensen -----Original Message----- Sent: November 03, 1999 5:34 AM Cc: caneman@clnk.com; Rod Makers List ServeSubject: RE: Straight Strips? Straight Strips? I have never had a problem with my strips being crooked.Ibuild nodeless....is this message for the builders that build noded rods?Wheredo the strips go crooked? Is it in the node or the internodal region of thestrip? Jeff Internet Mail MessageReceived from host: wugate.wustl.edu[128.252.120.1] Envelope Sender: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu From: "Martin Jensen" on 11/02/99 09:52 PM Please respond to mrj@aa.net cc: (bcc: Jeff Arnold-JL/PGI)Subject: RE: Straight Strips? I used to spend a lot more time straightening my strips then I do now. Inowstraighten only until the strip will stay in the groove when planed. If thestrip has a bend in it and flops out of the groove but when I push theplaneup the spline, the spline moves back into the groove, I consider that goodenough. Now kinks, are a different matter, these sharp bends have to bedealt with.As long as I can plane the section, that is all I care about. When I amdone and all glued up I will check for straightness and correct to asabsolute straight as possible. Martin Jensen -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: November 02, 1999 6:32 AM Subject: Straight Strips? OK, the email I just responded to from Eric just brought anotherquestionto mind concerning part of that subject.How many of you straighten your strips. I know we all straighten thenodes, but do any of the other of you straighten the entire strip. I alwayshave because... well, I guess my thinking is the straighter the strip, theeasier the planing and binding process go, and the straightening processafter the binding. Any opinions? Bob+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ R.L. "Bob" Nunley, Rodmaker+ Custom Split Bamboo Fly Rods+ http://members.clnk.com/caneman/images/flystuff/caneindex.htm++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ from HARMS1@prodigy.net Thu Nov 4 19:05:41 1999 Thu, 4 Nov 1999 20:05:27 -0500 Subject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers boundary="----=_NextPart_000_00AD_01BF26FF.6342C760" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_00AD_01BF26FF.6342C760 Computers are fine for designing rods, I suppose, but they certainly are =not necessary. If you like advanced physics and electronic stuff, knock =yerself out, but I'm sticking with my graph paper, thanks. cheers, Bill Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 6:55 PMSubject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers If a guy says he finds a computer unnecessary to design a rod then he =finds itunnecessary. How is that wrong.Making fishing poles may be rocket science to some but to others it is =not. Randy Brewer wrote: Just to fan the flames a little... I am puzzled as to why someone would advertise their rods using a =websiteand yet fail to see a computer's value when making calculations =(that WASwhy they were invented). Perhaps using a computer to calculate =compoundinterest or plot the trajectory of a spacecraft is "BS", too! Hey, =wasn'tthe Tacoma Narrows Bridge designed without the benefit of a =computer? :-) I'm not saying that using a computer is for everyone. But I think =Wayne hasdone us all a service by making his software available to those who =chooseto use it. I continually see posts to this list by people who are =verypleased with Wayne's tapers. That says it all for me! -Randy Brewer -----Original Message-----From: Frank Stetzer Date: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 1:53 PMSubject: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers Rodmaker Don Schroeder of Janesville WI spoke at our TU chapterlast week. (He quit his day job about 5 years ago to concentrateon rodmaking, after somebody ordered 12 rods. He makes ~45 rodsa year and does lots of restorations.) Anyway, although he tapershis strips on a milling machine, he still scrapes the enamel byhand with a utility knife blade held with his fingers. His =operationseems a curious mix of high tech and no tech. And he said designing rod tapers with a computer was a lot of BS :-) The good news, for me, was that my best efforts don't really LOOKthat bad compared to Don's. Didn't have a chance to cast them =though. Don's got a web page at http://www.inwave.com/~schroede/ , FYI.=......................................................................Frank Stetzer "...a cheerful comrade is =betterstetzer@uwm.edu than a waterproof coat and aEmployed by, but not speaking for foot-warmer." Henry Van Dyke,Univ of Wisconsin-Milwaukee, USA "Fisherman's Luck", 1899. ------=_NextPart_000_00AD_01BF26FF.6342C760 Computers = like advanced physics and electronic stuff, knock yerself out, but I'm = with my graph paper, thanks. Bill ----- Original Message ----- ACKLAND Cc: RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.edu= Sent: Wednesday, November 03, = PMSubject: Re: Don Schroeder; = timersIf a guy says he finds a computer unnecessary to design= = saying that using a computer is for everyone. But I think Wayne = <RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.edu= = = = "Fisherman's = 1899. ------=_NextPart_000_00AD_01BF26FF.6342C760-- from HARMS1@prodigy.net Thu Nov 4 19:10:12 1999 Thu, 4 Nov 1999 20:10:01 -0500 Subject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers boundary="----=_NextPart_000_00C4_01BF2700.056128C0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_00C4_01BF2700.056128C0 Frankly, I don't see the irony at all. A website is marketing. =Designing tapers one likes is something else. I'm not sure what, but I =think it's closer to smoke and mirrors than science. cheers, Bill Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 9:16 PMSubject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers You may have missed my point, Terry. It is obviously not necessary to =use acomputer. I just find it ironic that someone with a nice website =sellingrods over the Internet might feel that "designing rod tapers with a =computerwas a lot of BS". That statement seems a little harsh, that's all, =sincemost of use whatever tools are at our disposal. -----Original Message-----From: TERENCE ACKLAND Cc: RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.edu Date: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 6:59 PMSubject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers If a guy says he finds a computer unnecessary to design a rod then =hefinds itunnecessary. How is that wrong.Making fishing poles may be rocket science to some but to others it =is not. Randy Brewer wrote: Just to fan the flames a little... I am puzzled as to why someone would advertise their rods using a =websiteand yet fail to see a computer's value when making calculations =(that WASwhy they were invented). Perhaps using a computer to calculate =compoundinterest or plot the trajectory of a spacecraft is "BS", too! Hey, =wasn'tthe Tacoma Narrows Bridge designed without the benefit of a =computer?:-) I'm not saying that using a computer is for everyone. But I think =Waynehasdone us all a service by making his software available to those whochooseto use it. I continually see posts to this list by people who are =verypleased with Wayne's tapers. That says it all for me! -Randy Brewer -----Original Message-----From: Frank Stetzer Date: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 1:53 PMSubject: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers Rodmaker Don Schroeder of Janesville WI spoke at our TU chapterlast week. (He quit his day job about 5 years ago to concentrateon rodmaking, after somebody ordered 12 rods. He makes ~45 rodsa year and does lots of restorations.) Anyway, although he tapershis strips on a milling machine, he still scrapes the enamel byhand with a utility knife blade held with his fingers. His =operationseems a curious mix of high tech and no tech. And he said designing rod tapers with a computer was a lot of BS =:-) The good news, for me, was that my best efforts don't really LOOKthat bad compared to Don's. Didn't have a chance to cast them =though. Don's got a web page at http://www.inwave.com/~schroede/ , FYI.=......................................................................Frank Stetzer "...a cheerful comrade is =betterstetzer@uwm.edu than a waterproof coat and aEmployed by, but not speaking for foot-warmer." Henry Van =Dyke,Univ of Wisconsin-Milwaukee, USA "Fisherman's Luck", 1899. ------=_NextPart_000_00C4_01BF2700.056128C0 Frankly, I don'tsee = closer to smoke and mirrors than science. Bill ----- Original Message ----- Brewer Cc: RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.edu= Sent: Wednesday, November 03, = PMSubject: Re: Don Schroeder; = timersYou may have missed my point, Terry. It is obviously = necessary to use acomputer. I just find it ironic that someone = website sellingrods over the Internet might feel that "designing = tapers with a computerwas a lot of BS". That statement seems a = disposal.-----Original Message-----From: TERENCE = brewer@teleport.com RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.edu=<RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.edu= Wednesday, November 03, 1999 6:59 PMSubject: Re: Don Schroeder; = = = or plot the trajectory of a spacecraft is "BS", too! Hey, = RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.edu= <RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.edu= page at http://www.inwave.com/~schroede= = = Luck", ------=_NextPart_000_00C4_01BF2700.056128C0-- from Canerods@aol.com Thu Nov 4 19:30:19 1999 Subject: Small lathe homepage All, Anyone interestedin owning a small metal lathe (Harbor Freight, Taig, Sherline & etc.) should look over this web page and the links from it. There's also some very look links for anyone that owns a larger lathe,IMHO. Don Burns URL - http://www.pioneer.net/~felice/taig.html from dpeaston@wzrd.com Thu Nov 4 19:54:02 1999 Subject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers At 04:32 PM 11/4/1999 -0500, TERENCE ACKLAND wrote:Some builders do not need computers, they have the experience andjudgmentto beable to produce tapers out of their heads.Bullshit, next to useless or a valuable tool can be used to describe roddesignprogrammes. It just depends on the individual.I have noticed over the years that most of the punters on this list arecomputery types that feel uncomfortable out of the glare of a computerscreenand very few actually get to make rods. Some tings to think about: 1. No computer program ever designed a rod; nor do I think it ever will.2. Programs are no more bullshit than are calipers, graph paper pencils andthe like.3. The "stress curve" is old tryed and true civil engeineeing, not rocketscience.4. All the programs do is rationally magnify in graphic form where thestresses are likley to be in a rod. It is up to the maker to use thisinformation for good or evil.5. Most of the tapers being made today are in some way derived fromtapersmade before. Vanity! Vanity, there are no completeley radical new rodsunder the sun. JMHO -Doug EastonDoug EastonTonawanda, NY from hexagon@odyssee.net Thu Nov 4 20:41:31 1999 Subject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers When I first got hold of Garrisons book I read all the rod building sectionandwhen I got to the stress curves I was not convinced that a generalizationandrounding off that disregarded so much would work. I decided to build acouple ofGarrison tapers and if they had some merit then I would involve myself inhismath.I do not make garrison tapers and I have never touched the adding up stuff. Douglas P. Easton wrote: At 04:32 PM 11/4/1999 -0500, TERENCE ACKLAND wrote:Some builders do not need computers, they have the experience andjudgmentto beable to produce tapers out of their heads.Bullshit, next to useless or a valuable tool can be used to describe roddesignprogrammes. It just depends on the individual.I have noticed over the years that most of the punters on this list arecomputery types that feel uncomfortable out of the glare of a computerscreenand very few actually get to make rods. Some tings to think about: 1. No computer program ever designed a rod; nor do I think it ever will.2. Programs are no more bullshit than are calipers, graph paper pencilsandthe like.3. The "stress curve" is old tryed and true civil engeineeing, not rocketscience.4. All the programs do is rationally magnify in graphic form where thestresses are likley to be in a rod. It is up to the maker to use thisinformation for good or evil.5. Most of the tapers being made today are in some way derived fromtapersmade before. Vanity! Vanity, there are no completeley radical new rodsunder the sun. JMHO -Doug EastonDoug EastonTonawanda, NY from KlingB@health.missouri.edu Thu Nov 4 20:42:52 1999 Subject: RE: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers So let's see, if you use a computer to help choose a taper, you're either ahapless rookie or a foolish dreamer. But what are you if you use a computer to send needlessly hostilemessagesthat on any other board would start a fire? Of course I wouldn't use acomputer for that because I have the experience and judgement regardingonline discussions to be able to produce civil messages.... -----Original Message----- Sent: Thursday, November 04, 1999 3:32 PM Cc: RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers Some builders do not need computers, they have theexperience and judgment to beable to produce tapers out of their heads.Bullshit, next to useless or a valuable tool can be used todescribe rod designprogrammes. It just depends on the individual.I have noticed over the years that most of the punters onthis list arecomputery types that feel uncomfortable out of the glare ofa computer screenand very few actually get to make rods. Randy Brewer wrote: You may have missed my point, Terry. It is obviously notnecessary to use acomputer. I just find it ironic that someone with a nicewebsite sellingrods over the Internet might feel that "designing rodtapers with a computerwas a lot of BS". That statement seems a little harsh,that's all, sincemost of use whatever tools are at our disposal. -----Original Message-----From: TERENCE ACKLAND Cc: RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.edu Date: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 6:59 PMSubject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers If a guy says he finds a computer unnecessary to design arod then hefinds itunnecessary. How is that wrong.Making fishing poles may be rocket science to some but toothers it is not. Randy Brewer wrote: Just to fan the flames a little... I am puzzled as to why someone would advertise theirrods using a websiteand yet fail to see a computer's value when makingcalculations (that WASwhy they were invented). Perhaps using a computer tocalculate compoundinterest or plot the trajectory of a spacecraft is"BS", too! Hey, wasn'tthe Tacoma Narrows Bridge designed without the benefitof a computer?:-) I'm not saying that using a computer is for everyone.But I think Waynehasdone us all a service by making his software availableto those whochooseto use it. I continually see posts to this list bypeople who are verypleased with Wayne's tapers. That says it all for me! -Randy Brewer -----Original Message-----From: Frank Stetzer Date: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 1:53 PMSubject: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers Rodmaker Don Schroeder of Janesville WI spoke at our TUchapterlast week. (He quit his day job about 5 years ago toconcentrateon rodmaking, after somebody ordered 12 rods. He makes~45 rodsa year and does lots of restorations.) Anyway,although he tapershis strips on a milling machine, he still scrapes theenamel byhand with a utility knife blade held with his fingers.His operationseems a curious mix of high tech and no tech. And he said designing rod tapers with a computer was alot of BS :-) The good news, for me, was that my best efforts don'treally LOOKthat bad compared to Don's. Didn't have a chance tocast them though. Don's got a web page athttp://www.inwave.com/~schroede/ , FYI. ......................................................................Frank Stetzer "...a cheerfulcomrade is betterstetzer@uwm.edu than a waterproofcoat and aEmployed by, but not speaking for foot- warmer."Henry Van Dyke,Univ of Wisconsin-Milwaukee, USA "Fisherman'sLuck", 1899. from hexagon@odyssee.net Thu Nov 4 20:54:47 1999 Subject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers 35E4E0DF267EF18B77F5CE08" --------------35E4E0DF267EF18B77F5CE08 Bill,the perfect rod means different things to different people. It is amatter of personal choice, not what a computer suggests you should becasting with.I have noticed that it is the newbies that find comfort in computergenerated tapers which usually passes quickly.terry WILLIAM A HARMS wrote: Frankly, I don't see the irony at all. A website is marketing.Designing tapers one likes is something else. I'm not sure what, butI think it's closer to smoke and mirrors than science. cheers, Bill ----- Original Message -----From: Randy Brewer Cc: RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.eduSent: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 9:16 PMSubject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timersYou may have missed my point, Terry. It is obviously notnecessary to use acomputer. I just find it ironic that someone with a nicewebsite sellingrods over the Internet might feel that "designing rod taperswith a computerwas a lot of BS". That statement seems a little harsh,that's all, sincemost of use whatever tools are at our disposal. -----Original Message-----From: TERENCE ACKLAND Cc: RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.edu Date: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 6:59 PMSubject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers If a guy says he finds a computer unnecessary to design arod then hefinds itunnecessary. How is that wrong.Making fishing poles may be rocket science to some but toothers it is not. Randy Brewer wrote: Just to fan the flames a little... I am puzzled as to why someone would advertise their rodsusing a websiteand yet fail to see a computer's value when makingcalculations (that WASwhy they were invented). Perhaps using a computer tocalculate compoundinterest or plot the trajectory of a spacecraft is "BS",too! Hey, wasn'tthe Tacoma Narrows Bridge designed without the benefit ofa computer?:-) I'm not saying that using a computer is for everyone. ButI think Waynehasdone us all a service by making his software available tothose whochooseto use it. I continually see posts to this list by peoplewho are verypleased with Wayne's tapers. That says it all for me! -Randy Brewer -----Original Message-----From: Frank Stetzer Date: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 1:53 PMSubject: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers Rodmaker Don Schroeder of Janesville WI spoke at our TUchapterlast week. (He quit his day job about 5 years ago toconcentrateon rodmaking, after somebody ordered 12 rods. He makes~45 rodsa year and does lots of restorations.) Anyway, althoughhe tapershis strips on a milling machine, he still scrapes theenamel byhand with a utility knife blade held with his fingers.His operationseems a curious mix of high tech and no tech. And he said designing rod tapers with a computer was alot of BS :-) The good news, for me, was that my best efforts don'treally LOOKthat bad compared to Don's. Didn't have a chance to castthem though. Don's got a web page at http://www.inwave.com/~schroede/, FYI. ...................................................................... Frank Stetzer "...a cheerfulcomrade is betterstetzer@uwm.edu than a waterproofcoat and aEmployed by, but not speaking for foot-warmer."Henry Van Dyke,Univ of Wisconsin- Milwaukee, USA "Fisherman's Luck",1899. --------------35E4E0DF267EF18B77F5CE08 Bill,the perfect rod means different things to different people. It is amatter of personal choice, not what a computer suggests you should becastingwith.I have noticed that it is the newbies that find comfort in computergenerated tapers which usually passes quickly.terry WILLIAM A HARMS wrote: Frankly, but I think it's closer to smoke and mirrors than Bill ----- Original Message ----- From:RandyBrewer Cc: RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 19999:16 PM Subject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Oldtimers to use acomputer. I just find it ironic that someone with a nice websitesellingrods over the Internet might feel that "designing rod tapers with acomputerwas a lot of BS". That statement seems a little harsh, that's all,sincemost of use whatever tools are at our disposal. -----Original Message-----From: TERENCE ACKLAND <hexagon@odyssee.net> <brewer@teleport.com>Cc: RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.edu<RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.edu>Date: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 6:59 PMSubject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers then hefinds itunnecessary. How is that wrong.Making fishing poles may be rocket science to some but to others itis not. Randy Brewer wrote: Just to fan the flames a little... I am puzzled as to why someone would advertise their rods usinga websiteand yet fail to see a computer's value when making calculations(that WASwhy they were invented). Perhaps using a computer to calculatecompoundinterest or plot the trajectory of a spacecraft is "BS", too! Hey,wasn'tthe Tacoma Narrows Bridge designed without the benefit of acomputer?:-) I'm not saying that using a computer is for everyone. But I thinkWaynehasdone us all a service by making his software available to thosewhochooseto use it. I continually see posts to this list by people who areverypleased with Wayne's tapers. That says it all for me! -Randy Brewer -----Original Message-----From: Frank Stetzer <stetzer@csd.uwm.edu> <RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.edu>Date: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 1:53 PMSubject: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers Rodmaker Don Schroeder of Janesville WI spoke at our TU chapterlast week. (He quit his day job about 5 years ago to concentrate rods tapershis strips on a milling machine, he still scrapes the enamel by operationseems a curious mix of high tech and no tech. And he said designing rod tapers with a computer was a lot of BS:-) The good news, for me, was that my best efforts don't really LOOK though. Don's got a web page at http://www.inwave.com/~schroede/, FYI.......................................................................Frank "...a cheerful comrade is better than a waterproof coat and a Henry Van Dyke, "Fisherman'sLuck", 1899. --------------35E4E0DF267EF18B77F5CE08-- from d_price@global2000.net Thu Nov 4 21:02:30 1999 WAA04744 Subject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers Kling, Barry W. wrote: So let's see, if you use a computer to help choose a taper, you're either ahapless rookie or a foolish dreamer. But what are you if you use a computer to send needlessly hostilemessagesthat on any other board would start a fire? Of course I wouldn't use acomputer for that because I have the experience and judgement regardingonline discussions to be able to produce civil messages.... ---Barry, If you haven't realized by now Terence is a jealous old fart, and hispost's should be ignoredread everything he has written in the last year Vern from cadams46@juno.com Thu Nov 4 21:22:57 1999 22:22:15 EST Subject: Garrison Tapers I am about to begin in on a rod (my 6th by the way). I was planing onuseing the 8', 2 piece trout taper in the back of Garrison's book and wascurious if anyone else has tryed that taper or a Garrison taper and whatthey thought of it. Seems to me he calls the taper a 212E. Thanks inadvance.C.R. Adams from FISHWOOL@aol.com Thu Nov 4 21:36:20 1999 Subject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers Gentlemen,This computer thing is getting out of hand. The hexrod program has produced some fine rods. I use it to compare different tapers I've derived from graph paper and experience (some good, some bad). Some of my tapershave been outside the recommended stress values without breakdowns (so far).It all depends on what you like.Hank. from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Thu Nov 4 21:57:50 1999 Subject: Epon heat setting Friends,Got some Epon from Bingham Projects, and glued a rod with it a fewminutes ago. Directions say heat set at 180* for 4 hours. I'm planningon waiting till morning (10pm now) to heat set. Any suggestions? Do Ineed to fire up the oven tonight, or can I go ahead and get a goodnight's sleep? Thanks in advance,Harry from sshorb@ozip.net Thu Nov 4 22:38:21 1999 Subject: Taper design How did the "classical" rod makers; Payne, Young, Dickerson and theothers, develop their tapers? Did they just cut and try or did they havesome design system or systems? I'm curious because everything I seen orheard about seems to be a spin off of the Garrison process in some form.I know that some of you use the Garrison style to develop your tapers,others use "seat of the pants" design based on a lot of experience andI'm sure many have mixed the two. What does the graph paper and pencilmethod involve? What are other ways to design a taper? I've played withthe Hexrod program but would like to learn other design methods also.Please excuse me for asking so many questions, I just HAD to ask them. Skip from Mlee5107@aol.com Thu Nov 4 23:35:27 1999 Subject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers Hello everyone! I'm really a newbie! I just joined a week or so ago. I've been reading the archives for a while as well. I've been learning primarily by 'passive' effusion, but I had to break in. Are such arguments a commonplace here? I just want to learn a littlewisdom in the rodmaking art, and to eventually 'add' to it. OK, I feel better now. I'll be quiet again. Respectfully submitted, Mark Mark C. Lee, MDRochester, MN from rmoon@ida.net Thu Nov 4 23:53:33 1999 0000 Subject: Re: Epon heat setting It will wait for you Harry. It will be still sticky as all get out.Good Luck my friend from mrj@aa.net Fri Nov 5 00:05:59 1999 Thu, 4 Nov 1999 22:05:08 -0800 "rod 'akers" Subject: RE: Straight Strips? that would be really nice! Martin Jensen -----Original Message----- Subject: RE: Straight Strips? maybe the answer to this issue will rest, in the end,with genetic engineering. large heavy culms, 6'between nodes. timothy troester --- Jeff Arnold-JL wrote:O.K.......Maybe what I see as a sweep may be viewed lays in the form when I run the plane over it, thenit is straight to me. Thanks for the replies, Jeff Internet Mail Message Received from host: wugate.wustl.edu [128.252.120.1] Envelope Sender: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu From: "Martin Jensen" on 11/04/99 01:19AM Please respond to mrj@aa.net cc: caneman@clnk.com, "Rod Makers List Serve" Subject: RE: Straight Strips? both Martin Jensen -----Original Message----- Sent: November 03, 1999 5:34 AM Cc: caneman@clnk.com; Rod Makers List ServeSubject: RE: Straight Strips? Straight Strips? I have never had a problem with mystrips being crooked. Ibuild nodeless....is this message for the buildersthat build noded rods?Wheredo the strips go crooked? Is it in the node or theinternodal region of thestrip? Jeff Internet Mail MessageReceived from host: wugate.wustl.edu[128.252.120.1] Envelope Sender: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu From: "Martin Jensen" on 11/02/99 09:52PM Please respond to mrj@aa.net cc: (bcc: Jeff Arnold-JL/PGI)Subject: RE: Straight Strips? I used to spend a lot more time straightening mystrips then I do now. I nowstraighten only until the strip will stay in thegroove when planed. If thestrip has a bend in it and flops out of the groovebut when I push the planeup the spline, the spline moves back into thegroove, I consider that goodenough. Now kinks, are a different matter, thesesharp bends have to bedealt with.As long as I can plane the section, that is all Icare about. When I amdone and all glued up I will check for straightnessand correct to asabsolute straight as possible. Martin Jensen -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Of Bob NunleySent: November 02, 1999 6:32 AM Subject: Straight Strips? OK, the email I just responded to from Eric justbrought another questionto mind concerning part of that subject.How many of you straighten your strips. Iknow we all straighten thenodes, but do any of the other of you straighten theentire strip. I alwayshave because... well, I guess my thinking is thestraighter the strip, theeasier the planing and binding process go, and thestraightening processafter the binding. Any opinions? Bob +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ R.L. "Bob" Nunley, Rodmaker+ Custom Split Bamboo Fly Rods+ http://members.clnk.com/caneman/images/flystuff/caneindex.htm ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ ====="Gooda' morning mister bear"__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com from mrj@aa.net Fri Nov 5 00:20:06 1999 Thu, 4 Nov 1999 22:19:11 -0800 Subject: RE: Garrison Tapers I made the Garrison 212 which I think is not too far off of the 212E. It isa nice medium slow rod. I like slow action rods so it is an action that Ilike. I could describe it as a little bit tip heavy. BTW my taper is withinmaybe .007 at the most of the Garrison taper so it might be a little off ofwhat the author designed. sorry, did the best I could. Martin Jensen -----Original Message----- Subject: Garrison Tapers I am about to begin in on a rod (my 6th by the way). I was planing onuseing the 8', 2 piece trout taper in the back of Garrison's book and wascurious if anyone else has tryed that taper or a Garrison taper and whatthey thought of it. Seems to me he calls the taper a 212E. Thanks inadvance.C.R. Adams from mrj@aa.net Fri Nov 5 00:29:39 1999 Thu, 4 Nov 1999 22:28:46 -0800 Subject: RE: Straight Strips? Yea, I have changed my opinion of what is crooked also. You know, you canstraighten a strip, then plane it and you relieve stresses in it and itbends all over again. I finally decided that if I could plane it without toomuch work then it wasn't really crooked! Martin Jensen -----Original Message----- Subject: RE: Straight Strips? O.K.......Maybe what I see as a sweep may be viewed by others as crooked. Ifitlays in the form when I run the plane over it, then it is straight to me. Thanks for the replies, Jeff Internet Mail MessageReceived from host: wugate.wustl.edu[128.252.120.1] Envelope Sender: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Please respond to mrj@aa.net Subject: RE: Straight Strips? both Martin Jensen -----Original Message----- Subject: RE: Straight Strips? Straight Strips? I have never had a problem with my strips being crooked.Ibuild nodeless....is this message for the builders that build noded rods?Wheredo the strips go crooked? Is it in the node or the internodal region of thestrip? Jeff Internet Mail MessageReceived from host: wugate.wustl.edu[128.252.120.1] Envelope Sender: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Please respond to mrj@aa.net Subject: RE: Straight Strips? I used to spend a lot more time straightening my strips then I do now. Inowstraighten only until the strip will stay in the groove when planed. If thestrip has a bend in it and flops out of the groove but when I push the planeup the spline, the spline moves back into the groove, I consider that goodenough. Now kinks, are a different matter, these sharp bends have to bedealt with.As long as I can plane the section, that is all I care about. When I amdone and all glued up I will check for straightness and correct to asabsolute straight as possible. Martin Jensen -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: November 02, 1999 6:32 AM Subject: Straight Strips? OK, the email I just responded to from Eric just brought another questionto mind concerning part of that subject.How many of you straighten your strips. I know we all straighten thenodes, but do any of the other of you straighten the entire strip. I alwayshave because... well, I guess my thinking is the straighter the strip, theeasier the planing and binding process go, and the straightening processafter the binding. Any opinions? Bob+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ R.L. "Bob" Nunley, Rodmaker+ Custom Split Bamboo Fly Rods+ http://members.clnk.com/caneman/images/flystuff/caneindex.htm++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ from mrj@aa.net Fri Nov 5 00:30:18 1999 Thu, 4 Nov 1999 22:28:43 -0800 Subject: RE: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers yes. Martin Jensen -----Original Message----- Mlee5107@aol.com Subject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers Are such arguments a commonplace here? from watson@cape-consult.co.uk Fri Nov 5 02:25:40 1999 Fri, 5 Nov 1999 08:25:32 GMT Subject: Re: varnish and temperature sensitivity Andrew,The best thing to do is to contact the manufacturer and ask for one oftheirdata sheets on the varnish you use. They nearly always have theseavaliableand contain a wealth of information. Past experience with some of thevarnishes I have used - although not the one I use now - shows that thevarnish can get small crystalline bits in it once its frozen and thawed (noits not ice!!) which then do not go.Bearing in mind all those unheated warehouses around the world they'reboundto have that info available.T----- Original Message ----- Subject: RE: varnish and temperature sensitivity Can varnish take temperatures that might go below freezing? I know nottouse itunless it's warmed to room temp, but if I keep my dip tube (and I keep itloaded)in my non-heated garage and outside temps get down to, say,singledigits, will the varnish be ruined? Thanks. from scan.oest@post.tele.dk Fri Nov 5 04:20:55 1999 (InterMail vM.4.01.02.00 201-229-116) with SMTP +0100 Subject: Sv: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers from caneman@clnk.com Fri Nov 5 05:21:05 1999 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35)with SMTP id com; Fri, 5 Nov 1999 05:19:47 -0600 Subject: Re: varnish Ed,If you don't mind, could I make a suggestion. When you prep the finishbetween coats, use a sanding block and 1000 grit sandpaper instead ofsteelwool. This will leave the corners of your finish as crisp as the corners ofyour blank. Using steel wool is faster for sure, but it does tend to roundthe corners. Later,Bob -----Original Message----- RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.edu Subject: Re: varnish I applied one flat at a time using a 1" foam brush ("not for shellac orlacquer" printed on handle) and was generally pleased. Applied 4 coats. spirits,stir and let set for bubbles to disappear. Wait 24 hours between coats.Lightly buff w/ 0000 steel wool after first 3 coats. Use tack cloth aftereach buffing to clense any debris. Wait a week after final coat beforemoving on. One Drawback; Clear polyurethane I used left "ambering"effect;i.e., cane darkened slightly with reddish tone. Contact me offline formoreparticulars.Ed-----Original Message-----From: Eastkoyfly@aol.com Date: Thursday, November 04, 1999 9:21 AMSubject: varnish Hi guyshas any one used, or know the effects of using fast drying polyurethaneonblanks. Good & bad points etc. from caneman@clnk.com Fri Nov 5 05:37:41 1999 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35)with SMTP id com for ;Fri, 5 Nov 1999 05:36:19 -0600 Subject: Cane spinning rod?????? boundary="----=_NextPart_000_00BB_01BF274F.859B2460" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_00BB_01BF274F.859B2460 I have a very good friend that wants me to make a special rod for him. =He wants a split cane spinning rod, medium fast, 6 to 7 ft long. I have =no idea whatsoever how to even begin to taper for a spinning rod. Does =anyone have any spinning rod tapers you could send me? This will be a =once in a lifetime thing, done only because this good friend is going to =continue to be a pain in the butt until I do this for him, but I don't =know where to begin. Thanks, in advance,Bob R.L. "Bob" Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Bamboo Fly Rodshttp://members.clnk.com/caneman/images/flystuff/caneindex.htm ------=_NextPart_000_00BB_01BF274F.859B2460 This will be a once in a lifetime thing, done only because this good = going to continue to be a pain in the butt until I do this for him, but = know where to begin. Thanks, in advance,Bob Rodsht=tp://members.clnk.com/caneman/images/flystuff/caneindex.htm ------=_NextPart_000_00BB_01BF274F.859B2460-- from caneman@clnk.com Fri Nov 5 05:54:13 1999 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35)with SMTP id com for ;Fri, 5 Nov 1999 05:52:55 -0600 Subject: tooling boundary="----=_NextPart_000_00D0_01BF2751.D6E30660" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_00D0_01BF2751.D6E30660 The other day we were in a discussion about tooling for lathes. I =mentioned a 60 degree tool that my son got me from O'Reilly's Auto =Parts. I just found the package it came in under my keyboard, so here =is what it was... AMMCO Tools, Inc.Hennessy IndustriesLavergne, TN Part # 21250 Just used it late last nite to turn the outside of 3 cap and ring reels =seats and it works great. Bob R.L. "Bob" Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Bamboo Fly Rodshttp://members.clnk.com/caneman/images/flystuff/caneindex.htm ------=_NextPart_000_00D0_01BF2751.D6E30660 The other day we were in a discussion about tooling for = = what it was... Tools, Inc. Industries Lavergne, TN 21250 Just used it late last nite to turn the outside of 3 cap and ring seats and it works great. Bob Rodsht=tp://members.clnk.com/caneman/images/flystuff/caneindex.htm ------=_NextPart_000_00D0_01BF2751.D6E30660-- from andrew_harsanyi@ibi.com Fri Nov 5 08:04:14 1999 0500 Subject: RE: varnish and temperature sensitivity Thanks for everyone's input... from saweiss@flash.net Fri Nov 5 08:04:26 1999 Subject: Re: Cane spinning rod?????? boundary="----=_NextPart_000_001E_01BF275C.0AA31E40" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_001E_01BF275C.0AA31E40 I have a very good friend that wants me to make a special rod for him. =He wants a split cane spinning rod, medium fast, 6 to 7 ft long. I =have no idea whatsoever how to even begin to taper for a spinning rod. = from THE ARCHIVES: The listing below is part one of those spin, spincast, and casting rod =tapers I have. Hope you get some good from them:1. 5'-6", 2-pc, ultra light spin rod, # 11 F and # 4.5 tip top0" through 60" @ 5" increments, sans varnish070 - 092 - 104 - 110 - 124 - 144 - 166 - 182 - 188 - 206 - 236 - 250=-2502. 5'-0", 2-pc, UL spin rod, # 11 F and # 5 tip top0" through 60" @ 5" increments, sans varnish072 - 074 - 092 - 104 - 110 - 124 - 144 - 166 - 182 - 188 - 206 - 236=- Note: 1. and 2. actually are two different rods. Have built # 2 and it =is a fine taper.3. 7'-0" spin rod for 6 - 10 # monofilament, 2-pc, # 15 F and # 6 tip = from 1.5" through 70", random due to guides. Note: recommend graphing = 1.5-100 ; 4.5-115 ; 6.5 - 120 ; 10 - 132 ; 15 - 146 ; 19 - 134 ; 21.5 =-167 ; 25 - 179 ; 30 - 194 ; 35 - 206 ; 40.5 - 214 ; 44.5 - 238 ; 50 - =252 ; 55 - 267 ; 60 - 280 ; 65 - 294 ; 70 - 3084. 73" Spin cast, 2-pc with F between 41.5" and 45" dimensions, but =could be placed wherever the builder wants. This rod had permanent, =straight handle, but could be made for off-set handle as well. A fairly =slow action, too slow for traditional (1940's and 50's) casting type =reels but ok for spin cast or modern small reels such as Spidermite and =light mono or spiderwire and 1/4-oz or smaller lures. Random = 1.25 - 080 ; 5 - 090 ; 10 - 111 ; 19.5 - 144 ; 25 - 156 ; 29 - 168 ; =31- 173 ; 35 - 181 ; 39.5 - 197 ; 41.5 - 200 ; 45 - 217 ; 49-7/8 - 237 ; =55 - 270 ; 60 - 288 ; 65 - 307 ; 73 - 322More later, RTyree Here is another taper for a bamboo spin rod. This 6' rod is light =action, up to 1/4-oz. Bends well into the butt. Originally built as =1-pc, then ferruled with no apparent change of response.1.25 - 083; 5 - 085; 10 - 100; 15 - 123; 20 - 138; 25 - 155; 30 - 165; = 60 - 245; 62.5 - 250; 65 72 - 255Note: Reduce by 003/004 due to measuring with varnish; unable to =locate ------=_NextPart_000_001E_01BF275C.0AA31E40 I have a very good friend that wants me to make a special rod for = ARCHIVES:The listing below is part one of those spin, spincast, and casting = tapers I have. Hope you get some good from them:1. 5’-6", = light spin rod, # 11 F and # 4.5 tip top0" through 60" @ 5" = sans varnish070 - 092 - 104 - 110 - 124 - 144 - 166 - 182 - 188 -= 236 - 250 -2502. 5’-0", 2-pc, UL spin rod, # 11 F and #= top0" through 60" @ 5" increments, sans varnish072 - 074 - 092= 110 - 124 - 144 - 166 - 182 - 188 - 206 - 236 -250 - 250Note: = taper.3. 7’-0" spin rod for 6 - 10 # monofilament, 2-pc, # = tip top from 1.5" through 70", random due to guides. Note: = graphing for 5" increments. 1.5-100 ; 4.5-115 ; 6.5 - 120 ; 10 - = - 146 ; 19 - 134 ; 21.5 -167 ; 25 - 179 ; 30 - 194 ; 35 - 206 ; = ; 44.5 - 238 ; 50 - 252 ; 55 - 267 ; 60 - 280 ; 65 - 294 ; 70 - = Spin cast, 2-pc with F between 41.5" and 45" dimensions, but could be = wherever the builder wants. This rod had permanent, straight handle, = be made for off-set handle as well. A fairly slow action, too slow for = traditional (1940's and 50's) casting = ok for spin cast or modern small reels such as Spidermite and light = spiderwire and 1/4-oz or smaller lures. Random measurements due to = ferrule. 1.25 - 080 ; 5 - 090 ; 10 - 111 ; 19.5 - 144 ; 25 - 156 ; = 168 ; 31- 173 ; 35 - 181 ; 39.5 - 197 ; 41.5 - 200 ; 45 - 217 ; = RTyreeHere is another taper for a bamboo spin rod. This 6' rod is light = up to 1/4-oz. Bends well into the butt. Originally built as 1-pc, then = ferruled with no apparent change of response.1.25 - 083; 5 - 085; = 100; 15 - 123; 20 - 138; 25 - 155; 30 - 165; 34.5 - 175; 38.25 - = 196; 44.75 - 207; 50 - 220; 55 - 235; 60 - 245; 62.5 - 250; 65 72 = 255Note: Reduce by 003/004 due to measuring with varnish; unable = locateoriginal taper. RTyree ------=_NextPart_000_001E_01BF275C.0AA31E40-- from edriddle@mindspring.com Fri Nov 5 08:08:02 1999 Subject: Re: varnish Thanks Bob. Good point!Ed-----Original Message----- Eastkoyfly@aol.com; RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.edu Subject: Re: varnish Ed,If you don't mind, could I make a suggestion. When you prep the finishbetween coats, use a sanding block and 1000 grit sandpaper instead ofsteelwool. This will leave the corners of your finish as crisp as the cornersofyour blank. Using steel wool is faster for sure, but it does tend to roundthe corners. Later,Bob from darrell@rockclimbing.org Fri Nov 5 08:21:27 1999 sims.3.5.1999.09.16.21.57.p8)with SMTP id for Subject: Re: Cane spinning rod?????? Rod Makers List Serve boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0094_01BF2755.EF213EA0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0094_01BF2755.EF213EA0 I have a Lyon & Coulson Spinning rod made by Heddon that might be a good=taper. It's an unusual rod as Heddon only made spinning rods maybe one =or two years. It's a 7' 2/1 rod. Let me know if you want the taper. Darrellwww.bamboorods.homepage.com Sent: Friday, November 05, 1999 6:04 AMSubject: Re: Cane spinning rod?????? I have a very good friend that wants me to make a special rod for =him. He wants a split cane spinning rod, medium fast, 6 to 7 ft long. =I have no idea whatsoever how to even begin to taper for a spinning rod. = from THE ARCHIVES: The listing below is part one of those spin, spincast, and casting =rod tapers I have. Hope you get some good from them:1. 5'-6", 2-pc, ultra light spin rod, # 11 F and # 4.5 tip top0" through 60" @ 5" increments, sans varnish070 - 092 - 104 - 110 - 124 - 144 - 166 - 182 - 188 - 206 - 236 - =250 -2502. 5'-0", 2-pc, UL spin rod, # 11 F and # 5 tip top0" through 60" @ 5" increments, sans varnish072 - 074 - 092 - 104 - 110 - 124 - 144 - 166 - 182 - 188 - 206 - =236 - Note: 1. and 2. actually are two different rods. Have built # 2 and =it is a fine taper.3. 7'-0" spin rod for 6 - 10 # monofilament, 2-pc, # 15 F and # 6 = from 1.5" through 70", random due to guides. Note: recommend = 1.5-100 ; 4.5-115 ; 6.5 - 120 ; 10 - 132 ; 15 - 146 ; 19 - 134 ; =21.5 -167 ; 25 - 179 ; 30 - 194 ; 35 - 206 ; 40.5 - 214 ; 44.5 - 238 ; 50 =- 252 ; 55 - 267 ; 60 - 280 ; 65 - 294 ; 70 - 3084. 73" Spin cast, 2-pc with F between 41.5" and 45" dimensions, but =could be placed wherever the builder wants. This rod had permanent, =straight handle, but could be made for off-set handle as well. A fairly =slow action, too slow for traditional (1940's and 50's) casting type =reels but ok for spin cast or modern small reels such as Spidermite and =light mono or spiderwire and 1/4-oz or smaller lures. Random = 1.25 - 080 ; 5 - 090 ; 10 - 111 ; 19.5 - 144 ; 25 - 156 ; 29 - 168 ; =31- 173 ; 35 - 181 ; 39.5 - 197 ; 41.5 - 200 ; 45 - 217 ; 49-7/8 - 237 =; 55 - 270 ; 60 - 288 ; 65 - 307 ; 73 - 322More later, RTyree Here is another taper for a bamboo spin rod. This 6' rod is light =action, up to 1/4-oz. Bends well into the butt. Originally built as =1-pc, then ferruled with no apparent change of response.1.25 - 083; 5 - 085; 10 - 100; 15 - 123; 20 - 138; 25 - 155; 30 - = 60 - 245; 62.5 - 250; 65 72 - 255Note: Reduce by 003/004 due to measuring with varnish; unable to =locate ------=_NextPart_000_0094_01BF2755.EF213EA0 I have a Lyon & Coulson = made by Heddon that might be a good taper. It's an unusual rod as = made spinning rods maybe one or two years. It's a 7' 2/1 rod. Let me = want the taper. Darrellwww.bamboorods.homepage.com ----- Original Message ----- Steven= Makers List Serve Sent: Friday, November 05, 1999= AM rod?????? I have a very good friend that wants me to make a special rod = ARCHIVES:The listing below is part one of those spin, spincast, and = tapers I have. Hope you get some good from them:1. 5’-6", = light spin rod, # 11 F and # 4.5 tip top0" through 60" @ 5" = sans varnish070 - 092 - 104 - 110 - 124 - 144 - 166 - 182 - 188= 236 - 250 -2502. 5’-0", 2-pc, UL spin rod, # 11 F and = top0" through 60" @ 5" increments, sans varnish072 - 074 - = - 110 - 124 - 144 - 166 - 182 - 188 - 206 - 236 -250 - 250 = and 2. actually are two different rods. Have built # 2 and it is a = taper.3. 7’-0" spin rod for 6 - 10 # monofilament, 2-pc, # = tip top from 1.5" through 70", random due to guides. Note: = graphing for 5" increments. 1.5-100 ; 4.5-115 ; 6.5 - 120 ; 10 - = 15 - 146 ; 19 - 134 ; 21.5 -167 ; 25 - 179 ; 30 - 194 ; 35 - 206 = - 214 ; 44.5 - 238 ; 50 - 252 ; 55 - 267 ; 60 - 280 ; 65 - 294 ; 70 = 3084. 73" Spin cast, 2-pc with F between 41.5" and 45" = could be placed wherever the builder wants. This rod had permanent, = handle, but could be made for off-set handle as well. A fairly slow = type reels but ok for spin cast or modern small reels such as = light mono or spiderwire and 1/4-oz or smaller lures. Random = due to guides and ferrule. 1.25 - 080 ; 5 - 090 ; 10 - 111 ; = ; 25 - 156 ; 29 - 168 ; 31- 173 ; 35 - 181 ; 39.5 - 197 ; 41.5 - = 45 - 217 ; 49-7/8 - 237 ; 55 – 270 ; 60 - 288 ; 65 - 307 ; 73 = later, RTyreeHere is another taper for a bamboo spin rod. This 6' rod is light = up to 1/4-oz. Bends well into the butt. Originally built as 1-pc, = ferruled with no apparent change of response.1.25 - 083; 5 - = 100; 15 - 123; 20 - 138; 25 - 155; 30 - 165; 34.5 - 175; 38.25 - = - 196; 44.75 - 207; 50 - 220; 55 - 235; 60 - 245; 62.5 - 250; 65 = 255Note: Reduce by 003/004 due to measuring with varnish; unable= locateoriginal taper. RTyree ------=_NextPart_000_0094_01BF2755.EF213EA0-- from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Fri Nov 5 08:22:48 1999 Fri, 5 Nov 1999 06:22:29 -0800 Subject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers Mark,To answer your question, we need a definition of "commonplace... ." Forthemost part, we're like a big family, spread all over the world. Every familyhasa few folks that are more difficult to love than others. If you'll read theposts concerning both of the gatherings this past weekend, I think you willseethat most of us get along amazingly well. Don't hole up in lurker mode. Thebest way to learn is to ask questions. Answers are free on this list. Andtheanswers are almost always worth more than you pay for them. HarryMlee5107@aol.com wrote: Hello everyone! I'm really a newbie! I just joined a week or so ago. I've been reading thearchives for a while as well. I've been learning primarily by 'passive'effusion, but I had to break in. Are such arguments a commonplace here? I just want to learn a littlewisdomin the rodmaking art, and to eventually 'add' to it. OK, I feel better now. I'll be quiet again. Respectfully submitted, Mark Mark C. Lee, MDRochester, MN from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Fri Nov 5 08:23:39 1999 Fri, 5 Nov 1999 06:23:32 -0800 Subject: Re: Epon heat setting Thanks Ralph. It seems to be set quite nicely this morning. Wasn't ityou that recommended the Bingham Epon in the first place? If so, do youheat set it at all? Thanks,Harry Ralph W Moon wrote: It will wait for you Harry. It will be still sticky as all get out.Good Luck my friend from KlingB@health.missouri.edu Fri Nov 5 08:37:41 1999 "'Rod Makers List Serve'" Subject: RE: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers Terry - Glad you didn't take offense. As for what I do with my laptop, that's reallya personal thing between me and my wife, don't you think? But maybe I'mtheexception that proves your rule. I've been lurking for only about 2 monthsand I have managed to make a 3-piece 7'6" rod (not surprisingly, I used ataper from that other laptop jockey Mr. Cattanach) and just split up somecane for my second. The first one turned out much better than I had anyright to expect - not least because of the generous sharing done by you andthe other ancient ones. Barry -----Original Message----- Sent: Thursday, November 04, 1999 9:07 PM Subject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers Barry,you guys come and go on the list without ever making a rod.It's about playingon your laptops, right? Kling, Barry W. wrote: So let's see, if you use a computer to help choose ataper, you're either ahapless rookie or a foolish dreamer. But what are you if you use a computer to send needlesslyhostile messagesthat on any other board would start a fire? Of course Iwouldn't use acomputer for that because I have the experience andjudgement regardingonline discussions to be able to produce civilmessages.... -----Original Message-----From: TERENCE ACKLAND Sent: Thursday, November 04, 1999 3:32PM Cc: RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was:Old timers Some builders do not need computers, theyhave theexperience and judgment to beable to produce tapers out of their heads.Bullshit, next to useless or a valuabletool can be used todescribe rod designprogrammes. It just depends on theindividual.I have noticed over the years that most ofthe punters onthis list arecomputery types that feel uncomfortableout of the glare ofa computer screenand very few actually get to make rods. Randy Brewer wrote: You may have missed my point, Terry. Itis obviously notnecessary to use acomputer. I just find it ironic thatsomeone with a nicewebsite sellingrods over the Internet might feel that"designing rodtapers with a computerwas a lot of BS". That statement seems alittle harsh,that's all, sincemost of use whatever tools are at ourdisposal. -----Original Message-----From: TERENCE ACKLAND Cc: RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.edu Date: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 6:59PMSubject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Oldtimers If a guy says he finds a computerunnecessary to design arod then hefinds itunnecessary. How is that wrong.Making fishing poles may be rocketscience to some but toothers it is not. Randy Brewer wrote: Just to fan the flames a little... I am puzzled as to why someone wouldadvertise theirrods using a websiteand yet fail to see a computer'svalue when makingcalculations (that WASwhy they were invented). Perhapsusing a computer tocalculate compoundinterest or plot the trajectory of aspacecraft is"BS", too! Hey, wasn'tthe Tacoma Narrows Bridge designedwithout the benefitof a computer?:-) I'm not saying that using a computeris for everyone.But I think Waynehasdone us all a service by making hissoftware availableto those whochooseto use it. I continually see posts tothis list bypeople who are verypleased with Wayne's tapers. Thatsays it all for me! -Randy Brewer -----Original Message-----From: Frank Stetzer Date: Wednesday, November 03, 19991:53 PMSubject: Don Schroeder; Was: Oldtimers Rodmaker Don Schroeder of JanesvilleWI spoke at our TUchapterlast week. (He quit his day job about5 years ago toconcentrateon rodmaking, after somebody ordered12 rods. He makes~45 rodsa year and does lots ofrestorations.) Anyway,although he tapershis strips on a milling machine, hestill scrapes theenamel byhand with a utility knife blade heldwith his fingers.His operationseems a curious mix of high tech andno tech. And he said designing rod tapers witha computer was alot of BS :-) The good news, for me, was that mybest efforts don'treally LOOKthat bad compared to Don's. Didn'thave a chance tocast them though. Don's got a web page athttp://www.inwave.com/~schroede/ , FYI. ......................................................................Frank Stetzer"...a cheerfulcomrade is betterstetzer@uwm.eduthan a waterproofcoat and aEmployed by, but not speaking forfoot-warmer."Henry Van Dyke,Univ of Wisconsin-Milwaukee, USA"Fisherman'sLuck", 1899. from KlingB@health.missouri.edu Fri Nov 5 08:48:28 1999 Rod Makers List Serve Subject: RE: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers I don't think Terry took it badly, as other messages show. Personally I likeold farts, hope to be one eventually, and greatly value his (and others')views. So guys, keep it up! But if he has the right to be bearish the samegoes for me. Barry -----Original Message----- Sent: Friday, November 05, 1999 4:22 AM Subject: Sv: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers from stetzer@csd.uwm.edu Fri Nov 5 09:07:35 1999 batch3.csd.uwm.edu (8.8.4/8.6.8) with ESMTP id JAA00485 for; (8.8.4/8.6.8) withSMTP id JAA20882 for ; Fri, 5 Nov 1999 Subject: Cross Sylph taper There is 7.5 foot Cross Sylph taper in the archives ( from whichI built a very nice casting rod last winter), and _The Planing Form_ has a 7.0 foot Sylph. I wonder if someone knows more about therods originally made with the Sylph taper...Were there a lot oflengths and weights?......................................................................Frank Stetzer "...a cheerful comrade is betterstetzer@uwm.edu than a waterproof coat and a Employed by, but not speaking for foot-warmer." Henry Van Dyke,Univ of Wisconsin-Milwaukee, USA "Fisherman's Luck", 1899. from TSmithwick@aol.com Fri Nov 5 09:14:39 1999 Subject: Re: Taper design rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu In a message dated 11/5/99 4:41:47 AM, sshorb@ozip.net wrote: In a message dated 11/5/99 4:41:47 AM, you wrote: Skip -I believe every good taper I have ever cast has been designed empirically. What I mean is, a knowing builder cast an existing rod and decided it needed a little more here, or a little less there. In so doing he developed a taper or stress curve he liked, and then used that experienceto help design a rod, or many rods. A computer can be a huge help in roddesign, but it can't design one without your input. The graph method is also effective, but again the input has to come from you. The only way to learnis You don't have to be Steve Rajeff, but knowing how to cast different typesof rods is also a big help. So much has been said about the stress curve method around here, thatthere isn't much I could add. Check the archives. John Bokstrom's articles in issues 7 and 45 of "The Planing Form" offersome great insights into the chart method. So does Lambuth's The Anglers Workshop", if you are so fortunate as to posess a copy. from dmanders@telusplanet.net Fri Nov 5 11:10:38 1999 don") Fri, 5 Nov 1999 10:13:06 -0700 Subject: Digital Cameras First off let me say that this is not rod building but I need some help. Guys, Am interested in getting a digital camera. Price is, of course, importantas well as service, battery life, accessories etc. Anybody out there gotany ideas where to start to get some info. regards, Don from sshorb@ozip.net Fri Nov 5 11:11:16 1999 Fri, 5 Nov 1999 11:16:58 -0600 Subject: Re: Taper design I just read a post in the archives from Wayne referencing the use of adeflection board in taper design. What are they and how are they used?Skip from bhoy@inmind.com Fri Nov 5 11:46:53 1999 Fri, 5 Nov 1999 12:18:24 -0500 "rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu" Subject: Re: Epon heat setting Hi, I thought one of the advantages of epon was that it doesn't require heatsetting/treating.Does it benefit from heat treating? I plan to use epon for my first rod(nodeless) in conjunction w/titebond II for the nodes. One of my concernsis that titebond might fail before the epon softens up if I have tostraighten by heat later. I've read what I could in the archives aboutthis, but never came upon a definitive answer. Would heat treatingincreasethe softening temp (I don't know the technical phrase) of epon even more? Thanks in Advance. I've been quietly absorbing wisdom from this list, thebooks and trial and error for a year+ now, and I'm finally planing cane.I've found that my questions are usually answered here at about the sametime they occur to me, so I've kept my questions to a minimum. But nowthatmy first rod is under way, I guess I'd better ask before I screw somethingup! Bill HoyAt 09:59 PM 11/04/1999 -0600, Harry Boyd wrote:Friends,Got some Epon from Bingham Projects, and glued a rod with it a fewminutes ago. Directions say heat set at 180* for 4 hours. I'm planningon waiting till morning (10pm now) to heat set. Any suggestions? Do Ineed to fire up the oven tonight, or can I go ahead and get a goodnight's sleep? Thanks in advance,Harry * * * * ** * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * Bill HoyBedford County Webmeister/PIOVA USAw.hoy@co.bedford.va.us(bhoy@inmind.com) from rmoon@ida.net Fri Nov 5 12:38:26 1999 "rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu" Subject: Re: Epon heat setting BillThe Epon that Harry is referring to is Epon 826 with the VersamidHardener. There are other formulations out there, but this material isdesigned for archery bows and by extension works well for Cane. Thistype of Epon very definitly needs to heat cure 4 hours at 180 degrees.The advantages are that you can be working on the rod the same day youglue. It is less likely to break down with heat. I have seen someepoxies that will let go if you kiss your girlfriend near them. I wouldnot like to guess how the interaction of TB II and Epon Versamid is inpost cured heat straightening. I can hnestly say that I have never hada delamination failure from heat with any of the adhesives I have used.But that is because I am very critical about the amount of heat it takesto straighten a section. I am firmly convinced that those whostraighten with a blasting heat gun or electric toaster or stove elementare setting themselves up for problems. And particularly those whothink that they can straighten a set in one application of heat andbending. I have worked as long as two hours to straighten a tip set.The key I think is that the temperature has to be even throughout thesection. If the outside is hotter than the inside I think you are introuble. Heat very very slowly for long periods of time. from drodgers@ddaccess.net Fri Nov 5 12:44:42 1999 ddasvr1.ddaccess.comwith SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2232.9) Subject: Planing Form boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0004_01BF2793.F3230EA0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0004_01BF2793.F3230EA0 I have a problem and maybe someone can help. I have a planing form that =I purchased from Munro Rod Co. that will not close down to less than =.030 on the tip side. Any suggestions on how I can use this planing form =or modify it to make a rod with a tip less than 060". thanks,Dan ------=_NextPart_000_0004_01BF2793.F3230EA0 I have a problem and maybesomeone = have a planing form that I purchased from Munro Rod Co. that will not = to less than .030 on the tip side. Any suggestions on how I can use this = form or modify it to make a rod with a tip less than =060". thanks,Dan ------=_NextPart_000_0004_01BF2793.F3230EA0-- from weehughie@home.com Fri Nov 5 12:55:12 1999 (InterMail v4.01.01.02 201-229-111-106) with SMTP Fri, 5 Nov 1999 10:53:17 -0800 Subject: RE: Digital Cameras You might want to contact the webmaster of The Virtual Fly Box. Herecentlyposted a similar message to his list, and my understanding is that he did apretty comprehensive product comparison, and made a purchase based onthat.The website is http://www.virtualflybox.com Ian ScottPoisoning Our Water - Save the environment by killing the trout. It'shappening and its government sanctioned.http://flyfishing.about.com/library/weekly/aa101899.htm -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu AndersenSent: November 5, 1999 8:57 AM Subject: Digital Cameras First off let me say that this is not rod building but I need some help. Guys, Am interested in getting a digital camera. Price is, of course, importantas well as service, battery life, accessories etc. Anybody out there gotany ideas where to start to get some info. regards, Don from darrell@rockclimbing.org Fri Nov 5 12:57:19 1999 sims.3.5.1999.09.16.21.57.p8)with SMTP id for Subject: Heddon spinning rod taper boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0132_01BF277B.9D2A02A0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0132_01BF277B.9D2A02A0 Okay, you guys have twisted my arm enough... I'll try to measure it next week and post it here. The rod's for sale on =my web site if you don't want to build one but would like to own one... Regards, Darrell Lee www.bamboorods.homepage.com ------=_NextPart_000_0132_01BF277B.9D2A02A0 Okay, you guys have twistedmy = enough... I'll try to measure it next = it here. The rod's for sale on my web site if you don't want to build = would like to own one... Regards, Darrell Lee www.bamboorods.homepage.com ------=_NextPart_000_0132_01BF277B.9D2A02A0-- from iank@nelson.planet.org.nz Fri Nov 5 13:13:30 1999 sage.ts.co.nz with SMTP id IAA26860; Sat, 6 Nov 1999 08:11:27 +1300 Subject: Re: Epon heat setting "rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu" Ralph, You have got me worried. I have straightened a number of rods with a carefull blast of the heat gunand a tweak with the fingers . Generally I have not had much trouble withstraightening , although I do put the heat gun on low heat then graduallywarm the section. ( some wise advise that I saw on here at some pasttime..my acknowledgements to the providor whose name I do not recall)However my gradual warming means I take about 3-4 minutes instead of1-2 . My real question is that I have not had any problems during thisstraightening process ( possibly by good luck), BUT , I was uncertainwhereyour note was suggesting that I can expect problems with that rod in thefuture ? regards Ian Kearney At 11:34 AM 5/11/99 -0700, Ralph W Moon wrote:BillThe Epon that Harry is referring to is Epon 826 with the VersamidHardener. There are other formulations out there, but this material isdesigned for archery bows and by extension works well for Cane. Thistype of Epon very definitly needs to heat cure 4 hours at 180 degrees.The advantages are that you can be working on the rod the same day youglue. It is less likely to break down with heat. I have seen someepoxies that will let go if you kiss your girlfriend near them. I wouldnot like to guess how the interaction of TB II and Epon Versamid is inpost cured heat straightening. I can hnestly say that I have never hada delamination failure from heat with any of the adhesives I have used.But that is because I am very critical about the amount of heat it takesto straighten a section. I am firmly convinced that those whostraighten with a blasting heat gun or electric toaster or stove elementare setting themselves up for problems. And particularly those whothink that they can straighten a set in one application of heat andbending. I have worked as long as two hours to straighten a tip set.The key I think is that the temperature has to be even throughout thesection. If the outside is hotter than the inside I think you are introuble. Heat very very slowly for long periods of time. from jfoster@gte.net Fri Nov 5 13:20:05 1999 Subject: ? Patrick every time you post a message it really skrews up my browser..date at12/31/69.. anyone else??? don't have a clue where the problem is.. this isn't aimed at you it's a machine problem (unix at work?)jerry from arnold.jl@pg.com Fri Nov 5 13:24:48 1999 notes082.na.pg.com[155.125.116.193] 1999 14:23:01 1999)) id85256820.006AA013 ; Fri, 5 Nov 1999 14:24:37 -0500 "rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu" Subject: Re: Epon heat setting Bill, heat treating a section glued up with Epon came to a surprise to mealso.My rods are also nodeless with splices made up of Titebond II and thestripsglued with Shell Epon epoxy. I haven't heat treated the glued up stripseither. List whats the story with this latest news of Epon het treating? Jeff Internet Mail Message Received from host: wugate.wustl.edu [128.252.120.1] Envelope Sender: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Please respond to bhoy@inmind.com Subject: Re: Epon heat setting Hi, I thought one of the advantages of epon was that it doesn't require heatsetting/treating.Does it benefit from heat treating? I plan to use epon for my first rod(nodeless) in conjunction w/titebond II for the nodes. One of my concernsis that titebond might fail before the epon softens up if I have tostraighten by heat later. I've read what I could in the archives aboutthis, but never came upon a definitive answer. Would heat treatingincreasethe softening temp (I don't know the technical phrase) of epon even more? Thanks in Advance. I've been quietly absorbing wisdom from this list, thebooks and trial and error for a year+ now, and I'm finally planing cane.I've found that my questions are usually answered here at about the sametime they occur to me, so I've kept my questions to a minimum. But nowthatmy first rod is under way, I guess I'd better ask before I screw somethingup! Bill HoyAt 09:59 PM 11/04/1999 -0600, Harry Boyd wrote:Friends,Got some Epon from Bingham Projects, and glued a rod with it a fewminutes ago. Directions say heat set at 180* for 4 hours. I'm planningon waiting till morning (10pm now) to heat set. Any suggestions? Do Ineed to fire up the oven tonight, or can I go ahead and get a goodnight's sleep? Thanks in advance,Harry * * * * ** * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *Bill HoyBedford County Webmeister/PIOVA USAw.hoy@co.bedford.va.us(bhoy@inmind.com) from Patrick.Coffey@PSS.Boeing.com Fri Nov 5 13:26:54 1999 LAA18788; (5.5.2448.0) Subject: RE: ? boy you got me on that one, I'm just using my computor at work andemailing throughexchange, I think the latest version here at Boeing. I'll ask the computerGuido's andsee if they know why. Patrick W. CoffeyAOG Incident Repair PlanningPhone: 425-234-2901Fax: 425-237-0083M-2112 M/C 61-79 ----------From: Jerry Foster[SMTP:jfoster@gte.net] Sent: Tuesday, October 05, 1999 11:19 AM Subject: ? Patrick every time you post a message it really skrews up my browser..date at12/31/69.. anyone else??? don't have a clue where the problem is.. this isn't aimed at you it's a machine problem (unix at work?)jerry from rp43640@online-club.de Fri Nov 5 13:33:47 1999 Fri, 5 Nov 1999 20:33:38 +0100 (MET) Subject: Re: Planing Form Dan,did you try to disassemble the bars and clean thoroughly the inside ofthe bars sometimes there might be some dirt preventing to close themmore. Christian drodgers schrieb: I have a problem and maybe someone can help. I have a planing formthat I purchased from Munro Rod Co. that will not close down to lessthan .030 on the tip side. Any suggestions on how I can use thisplaning form or modify it to make a rod with a tip less than060". thanks,Dan from anglport@con2.com Fri Nov 5 13:37:33 1999 (SMTPD32-5.05) id A1BF44C031A; Fri, 05 Nov 1999 14:36:31 -0500 Subject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers Terry, Shouldn't a computer be the way to go if you have a 6ft 4 wt thatsomeonelikes the action of and they want it in a 7 1/2 fter (or vice versa)? Thatseems to be the prime advantage of such equipment. Not to necessarilyDESIGN a taper but to make the alteration of it easier or in a morepredictable way?Just one man's opinion.....Art At 09:58 PM 11/04/1999 -0500, TERENCE ACKLAND wrote:Bill, the perfect rod means different things to different people. It is a matterof personal choice, not what a computer suggests you should be castingwith. I have noticed that it is the newbies that find comfort in computergenerated tapers which usually passes quickly. terry WILLIAM A HARMS wrote: I'm not sure what, but I think it'scloser to smoke and mirrors than science. cheers, Bill -- --- Original RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 9:16PM Subject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers You may have missed mypoint,Terry. It is obviously not necessary to use a computer. I just find it ironic that someone with a nice website selling rods over the Internet might feel that "designing rod tapers with acomputer was a lot of BS". That statement seems a little harsh, that's all, since most of use whatever tools are at our disposal. -----Original Message----- Cc: RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.edu Date: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 6:59 PM Subject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers then he finds it unnecessary. How is that wrong. Making fishing poles may be rocket science to some but to others it isnot. Randy Brewer wrote: Just to fan the flames a little... I am puzzled as to why someone would advertise their rods using awebsite and yet fail to see a computer's value when making calculations (thatWAS why they were invented). Perhaps using a computer to calculatecompound interest or plot the trajectory of a spacecraft is "BS", too! Hey, wasn't the Tacoma Narrows Bridge designed without the benefit of acomputer? :-) I'm not saying that using a computer is for everyone. But I think Wayne has done us all a service by making his software available to those who choose to use it. I continually see posts to this list by people who are very pleased with Wayne's tapers. That says it all for me! -Randy Brewer -----Original Message----- Date: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 1:53 PM Subject: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers Rodmaker Don Schroeder of Janesville WI spoke at our TU chapter last week. (He quit his day job about 5 years ago to concentrate He makes ~45 rods Anyway, although he tapers his strips on a milling machine, he still scrapes the enamel by His operation seems a curious mix of high tech and no tech. And he said designing rod tapers with a computer was a lot of BS :-) The good news, for me, was that my best efforts don't really LOOK Didn't have a chance to cast them though. Don's got a web page at http://www.inwave.com/~schroede/ , FYI. ...................................................................... "...a cheerful comrade is better stetzer@uwm.edu than a waterproof coat and a Henry Van Dyke, "Fisherman's Luck", 1899. from michael@wugate.wustl.edu Fri Nov 5 14:01:43 1999 Subject: Re: Planing Form Dan, if you really want to plane tips that small, you'll have to drawfile thelast 8 -10" of your forms until you get the tip dimensions thatyou are looking for. In other words, taking some metal off the topsurface of the forms, has the effect of reducing the depth of groove. Mike - groovy, man! - Biondo St. Louis, MO I have a problem and maybe someone can help. I have aplaning form that I purchased from Munro Rod Co. that will not close downto less than .030 on the tip side. Any suggestions on how I can use thisplaning form or modify it to make a rod with a tip less than 060". thanks, Dan from rmoon@ida.net Fri Nov 5 14:30:08 1999 "rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu" Subject: Re: Epon heat setting 3B0F945BBC8D472918C22972" --------------3B0F945BBC8D472918C22972 Ian Sorry if I worry you. Not intentional. My point is that too rapidheating and manipulating will cause trouble. If you get away with itgreat! You probably won't have any further trouble. But somewhere andsometime you will be working on that irreplacable rod and bam it willbreak or delaminate or scorch. You may get away with it dozens of timesbut it will catch up with you. I wish I had some hard evidence to giveyou, but all I have is a lot of years experience with a few tears andheartaches from getting impatient. I'm one of those old farts and like Terry entitled to my own opinion,but one thing I try to emphasize with all of my students is the factthat if you make a mistake the chances are good you can't undo it. So doeverything with due deliberation at a lesser intensity than you thinknecessary. Luck Ralph --------------3B0F945BBC8D472918C22972 Ian too rapid heating and manipulating will cause irreplacable some hard evidence to give you, but all I have is a lot of years experiencewith a few tears and heartaches from getting impatient. I'm one of those old farts and like Terry entitled to my own opinion,but one thing I try to emphasize with all of my students is the fact thatif you make a mistake the chances are good you can't undo it. So doeverythingwith due deliberation at a lesser intensity than you think necessary. --------------3B0F945BBC8D472918C22972-- from caneman@clnk.com Fri Nov 5 15:00:16 1999 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35)with SMTP id com; Fri, 5 Nov 1999 14:58:56 -0600 Subject: Re: Planing Form boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0017_01BF279E.26215D20" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0017_01BF279E.26215D20 Dan,You basically have two choices. You can either take the forms to a =machine shop and have them level surface grind it to what you need, OR =you can draw file it yourself. The machine shop is gonna charge you an =arm and a leg, tho, so you might consider just draw filing them =yourself. It is very accurate and is really something you need to learn =to do anyways. You can go to =http://www.geocities.com/SoHo/Coffeehouse/5262/forms.htm and thereis a =set of very comprehensive instructions on making your planing forms. It =also has a good explanation of how to draw file them to get them tuned. Later,Bob -----Original Message-----From: drodgers Date: Friday, November 05, 1999 12:50 PMSubject: Planing Form I have a problem and maybe someone can help. I have a planing form =that I purchased from Munro Rod Co. that will not close down to less =than .030 on the tip side. Any suggestions on how I can use this planing =form or modify it to make a rod with a tip less than 060". thanks,Dan ------=_NextPart_000_0017_01BF279E.26215D20 Dan, = level surface grind it to what you need, OR you can draw file it = The machine shop is gonna charge you an arm and a leg, tho, so you might = and there is a set of very comprehensive instructions on making your = tuned. Later,Bob -----Original = Rodmakers list <rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= Friday, November 05, 1999 12:50 PMSubject: FormI have a problem and maybe = I have a planing form that I purchased from Munro Rod Co. that will = close down to less than .030 on the tip side. Any suggestions on how = use this planing form or modify it to make a rod with a tip less = 060". thanks,Dan ------=_NextPart_000_0017_01BF279E.26215D20-- from dellc@nextdim.com Fri Nov 5 16:07:37 1999 (SMTPD32-4.06) id A13963C9011E; Fri, 05 Nov 1999 13:50:49 PST , Subject: Re: RODMAKERS digest 1503 Hi Don, unless you are going to be doing a lot of professional quality typeof photos I don't think that a top of the line camera is needed. I have hada Epson P C 600 for about 2 years and although it is maybe obsolete nowlikeanything else electronic after 6 months, it does every thing that I need itfor. It is a bottom of the line camera that cost me $299. and more bellsandwhistles than I will ever use.Dell, In digest mode.Dell & Marie CoppockThe Flyfisher& the Quilterhttp://www.trwebsites.com/dell/e-mail dellc@nextdim.comflyfisher@nextdim.com----- Original Message ----- ;and Collecting Subject: RODMAKERS digest 1503 RODMAKERS Digest 1503 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) RE: varnish and temperature sensitivity 2) Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers 3) Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers 4) Fw: varnish 5) RE: Straight Strips? 6) Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers 7) Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers 8) Small lathe homepage 9) Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers 10) Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers 11) RE: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers 12) Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers 13) Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers 14) Garrison Tapers 15) Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers 16) Epon heat setting 17) Taper design 18) Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers 19) Re: Epon heat setting 20) RE: Straight Strips? 21) RE: Garrison Tapers 22) RE: Straight Strips? 23) RE: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers 24) Re: varnish and temperature sensitivity 25) Sv: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers 26) Re: varnish 27) Cane spinning rod?????? 28) tooling 29) RE: varnish and temperature sensitivity 30) Re: Cane spinning rod?????? 31) Re: varnish 32) Re: Cane spinning rod?????? 33) Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers 34) Re: Epon heat setting 35) RE: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers 36) RE: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers 37) Cross Sylph taper 38) Re: Taper design 39) Digital Cameras 40) Re: Taper design 41) Re: Epon heat setting 42) Re: Epon heat setting 43) Planing Form 44) RE: Digital Cameras 45) Heddon spinning rod taper 46) Re: Epon heat setting 47) ? 48) Re: Epon heat setting 49) RE: ? 50) Re: Planing Form 51) Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers 52) Re: Planing Form 53) Re: Epon heat setting from bob@downandacross.com Fri Nov 5 16:17:21 1999 (envelope- from bob@downandacross.com) Subject: Re: Cross Sylph taper Frank,I posted the South Bend /Cross Sylph from my small collection. It is a 7'6" 2 pc rod that is missing the extra tip. I think it throws a 5wt nicely. They were made by Wes Jordan both at the original Cross Rod Co. and later as the top of the line South Bend models. The Sylph is a single built rod unlike the doublebuilt heavier line models. It has black wraps with gold trim, and has a cigar grip and cork skeleton reel seat. The rod is marked Model 1500. The South Bend catalog has it listed as 7 feet 2 1/2 oz. and selling at $35. Page 38 of Dick Spurr's book "Wes Jordan:Profile of a Rodm,ker" shows the rod grip and ferrules. (Liek mine) I know no reasonwhy mine is 7'6", but I know it is a great rod.Bob Maulucci At 09:07 AM 11/5/99 -0600, you wrote:There is 7.5 foot Cross Sylph taper in the archives ( from whichI built a very nice casting rod last winter), and _The Planing Form_has a 7.0 foot Sylph. I wonder if someone knows more about therods originally made with the Sylph taper...Were there a lot oflengths and weights?......................................................................Frank Stetzer "...a cheerful comrade is betterstetzer@uwm.edu than a waterproof coat and aEmployed by, but not speaking for foot-warmer." Henry Van Dyke,Univ of Wisconsin-Milwaukee, USA "Fisherman's Luck", 1899. Bob Mauluccibob@downandacross.com from darrell@rockclimbing.org Fri Nov 5 16:45:50 1999 sims.3.5.1999.09.16.21.57.p8)with SMTP id for Subject: Re: Digital Cameras rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Just got an HP C200 digital camera. It's pretty neat, it's on sale for $500plus you get a HP Deskjet color printer and a $100 rebate so it costs atotal of $400 for both... The camera alone retails for $300 I think. Thedownside of the camera is it eats batteries, an AC adaptor is $50 extrabutthe plus points is it's a one megapixel camera, built in flash, can userechargeable alkaline batteries, good photo quality, LCD viewer, 8mbstorage it through it's paces to say that I can recommend it yet... Darrell Leewww.bamboorods.homepage.com ----- Original Message ----- Subject: RE: Digital Cameras You might want to contact the webmaster of The Virtual Fly Box. Herecentlyposted a similar message to his list, and my understanding is that he didapretty comprehensive product comparison, and made a purchase based onthat.The website is http://www.virtualflybox.com Ian ScottPoisoning Our Water - Save the environment by killing the trout. It'shappening and its government sanctioned.http://flyfishing.about.com/library/weekly/aa101899.htm -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu AndersenSent: November 5, 1999 8:57 AM Subject: Digital Cameras First off let me say that this is not rod building but I need some help. Guys, Am interested in getting a digital camera. Price is, of course,importantas well as service, battery life, accessories etc. Anybody out there gotany ideas where to start to get some info. regards, Don from mark_lang@tnb.com Fri Nov 5 16:51:56 1999 with Novell_GroupWise; Fri, 05 Nov 1999 16:51:48 -0600 Subject: First Rod Hi Folks, Well if you haven't figured it out, I am a "NEWBIE". I am currentlycollecting my toolsand materials to make my first rod. My question (for now) is what shouldbe my first rod(taper) to make? I currently fish the tailwaters in Arkansas which is alot of nymphfishing with a little bit of dry fly. I would like to have an 8' or 8 1/2' rodto start.Since most of my fishing has been with a medium action graphite rod (Iknow an uglyword), I would like a taper to graduate into easily. So does anyone have agoodrecomendation for me? Thanks, A misplaced Florida Gator. Mark from GLohkamp@aol.com Fri Nov 5 16:55:16 1999 Subject: Re: Planing Form Dan l would be very careful about taking the forms apart for cleaning if they are the differential screw type and not a push pull. Putting Garrison style forms back together can get to be alittle tricky you run the risk of stripping the threads if not done right.l would also use caution about making very thin tips, anything less than . 060 is getting scary for me. Payne and Young both made rods with tip dia, less than . 060 l think these were the exception to every rule. Gary Lohkamp from rsgould@cmc.net Fri Nov 5 16:59:30 1999 Subject: Re: Cross Sylph taper Hi Bob,Your posting about the #1500 South Bend/Cross Syph rod was interestingandgot me to wondering where on earth the word "sylph" came from. Lo andbehold, I found the answer in the dictionary. A sylph is an imaginary beinginhabiting the air and also means a slender, graceful woman. Now thequestion becomes: which one of these meanings properly describes yourrod?Ray----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Cross Sylph taper Frank,I posted the South Bend /Cross Sylph from my small collection. It is a7'6"2 pc rod that is missing the extra tip. I think it throws a 5wt nicely.They were made by Wes Jordan both at the original Cross Rod Co. andlateras the top of the line South Bend models. The Sylph is a single built rodunlike the doublebuilt heavier line models. It has black wraps with goldtrim, and has a cigar grip and cork skeleton reel seat. The rod is markedModel 1500. The South Bend catalog has it listed as 7 feet 2 1/2 oz. andselling at $35. Page 38 of Dick Spurr's book "Wes Jordan:Profile of aRodm,ker" shows the rod grip and ferrules. (Liek mine) I know no reasonwhymine is 7'6", but I know it is a great rod.Bob Maulucci At 09:07 AM 11/5/99 -0600, you wrote:There is 7.5 foot Cross Sylph taper in the archives ( from whichI built a very nice casting rod last winter), and _The Planing Form_has a 7.0 foot Sylph. I wonder if someone knows more about therods originally made with the Sylph taper...Were there a lot oflengths and weights?......................................................................Frank Stetzer "...a cheerful comrade is betterstetzer@uwm.edu than a waterproof coat and aEmployed by, but not speaking for foot-warmer." Henry Van Dyke,Univ of Wisconsin-Milwaukee, USA "Fisherman's Luck", 1899. Bob Mauluccibob@downandacross.com from rmoon@ida.net Fri Nov 5 17:07:54 1999 0000 Subject: Re: Planing Form amen and amen Gary! I just finished tuning up my Carson form (differential screws) and itis not the easiest thing to do. Ralph from jfoster@gte.net Fri Nov 5 17:20:29 1999 Subject: [Fwd: FRANCIS J DEGERE PASSED] boundary="------------BA2713924E41FD81A64F8E0B" This is a multi-part message in MIME format.-------------- BA2713924E41FD81A64F8E0B --------------BA2713924E41FD81A64F8E0B (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with ESMTP Subject: FRANCIS J DEGERE PASSED Im currently not in the listserv.. to busy building rods.. Please passthe word along. I know Digger had many friends that are rod makers andare on the listserv.ThanksLarry RussettP.S. Let me know either way please I will forward to as many as I canpersonally if I have to. Francis J Degere 77 (Digger)Adams, MA Francis Johnson Degere, 77, of 6 Plunkett Lane died Thurs. 4 Nov 1999after a brie Illness. Born Oct. 17 1922 in Adams he attended localschools, including the former Adams High School. He left high schoolbefore graduating to go to work for Berkshire fine spinning Co..He was a W.W.II Army veteran serving with n anti air craft unit. Afterthe war h, he worked for LL.. Brown Paper Co of Adams, Mr Degere was known throughout the Northeast for his fabrication ofcustom bamboo fly rods for fishing. He was featured in a video filmmade by a producer affiliated with National Geographic Magazine, Hewas also noted for his manufacture of fine flies for fly fishing. Heoperated the former Degere Fly Shop, Mr. Degere also manufacturedsnowshoes.A member of a local band for many years, he was a guitar player ofnote. He dabbled in acrylic and charcoal painting with his specialtybeing landscapes and wildlife scenes. He was a member of troutUnlimited for many years.Besides his brother Robert Mr. Degere leaves two other brothers RichardW. Degere of Adams And James Degere of Williamstown and two sisters,Mrs. Helen Milne of Lexington and Mrs. Shirley Remillard of North Adams,MA A Liturgy of Christian Burial will be celebrated Saturday Nov. 6 at 2P.M. in Notre Dame Church with Rev. Daniel J Boyle, Pastor.Donations are suggested to VNA Hospice of North Berkshire 535 CurranHighway, North Adams, MA 01247. --------------BA2713924E41FD81A64F8E0B-- from bob@downandacross.com Fri Nov 5 17:46:37 1999 (envelope- from bob@downandacross.com) Subject: RE: Digital Cameras I for one like the quality and convenience of the Sony Mavicas. The higher res modes and macro options take some good pics. I can send you a coupleif you'd like. You can get into one at just over $500, I think. Luckily, I have access to one at the school I teach at.Bob At 02:01 PM 11/5/99 -0500, you wrote:You might want to contact the webmaster of The Virtual Fly Box. Herecentlyposted a similar message to his list, and my understanding is that he didapretty comprehensive product comparison, and made a purchase based onthat.The website is http://www.virtualflybox.com Ian ScottPoisoning Our Water - Save the environment by killing the trout. It'shappening and its government sanctioned.http://flyfishing.about.com/library/weekly/aa101899.htm -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu AndersenSent: November 5, 1999 8:57 AM Subject: Digital Cameras First off let me say that this is not rod building but I need some help. Guys, Am interested in getting a digital camera. Price is, of course,importantas well as service, battery life, accessories etc. Anybody out there gotany ideas where to start to get some info. regards, Don Bob Mauluccibob@downandacross.com from bob@downandacross.com Fri Nov 5 17:54:11 1999 (envelope- from bob@downandacross.com) Subject: Re: Cross Sylph taper I don't know. It can get a bunch of line in the "air", and it is nice to look at. Both definitions work for me. The cork handIe does have some nice curves, though.Bob At 02:59 PM 11/5/99 -0800, you wrote:Hi Bob,Your posting about the #1500 South Bend/Cross Syph rod was interestingandgot me to wondering where on earth the word "sylph" came from. Lo andbehold, I found the answer in the dictionary. A sylph is an imaginary beinginhabiting the air and also means a slender, graceful woman. Now thequestion becomes: which one of these meanings properly describes yourrod?Ray----- Original Message ----- From: bob maulucci Cc: Sent: Friday, November 05, 1999 2:16 PMSubject: Re: Cross Sylph taper Frank,I posted the South Bend /Cross Sylph from my small collection. It is a7'6"2 pc rod that is missing the extra tip. I think it throws a 5wt nicely.They were made by Wes Jordan both at the original Cross Rod Co. andlateras the top of the line South Bend models. The Sylph is a single built rodunlike the doublebuilt heavier line models. It has black wraps with goldtrim, and has a cigar grip and cork skeleton reel seat. The rod ismarkedModel 1500. The South Bend catalog has it listed as 7 feet 2 1/2 oz. andselling at $35. Page 38 of Dick Spurr's book "Wes Jordan:Profile of aRodm,ker" shows the rod grip and ferrules. (Liek mine) I know no reasonwhymine is 7'6", but I know it is a great rod.Bob Maulucci At 09:07 AM 11/5/99 -0600, you wrote:There is 7.5 foot Cross Sylph taper in the archives ( from whichI built a very nice casting rod last winter), and _The Planing Form_has a 7.0 foot Sylph. I wonder if someone knows more about therods originally made with the Sylph taper...Were there a lot oflengths and weights?......................................................................Frank Stetzer "...a cheerful comrade is betterstetzer@uwm.edu than a waterproof coat and aEmployed by, but not speaking for foot-warmer." Henry Van Dyke,Univ of Wisconsin-Milwaukee, USA "Fisherman's Luck", 1899. Bob Mauluccibob@downandacross.com Bob Maulucci==================================================downandacross.com productionswebsite, audio, and print designhttp://www.downandacross.com218 Wallace AvenueBuffalo, NY 14216716-836-8297 home716-867-0523 cellularbob@downandacross.com from mschaffer@mindspring.com Fri Nov 5 17:54:51 1999 Subject: Newbie at the SRG Having just attended my first ever rodmakers meeting, I want to thankeveryone involved for all their work in setting the whole thing up.Additionally, I want to say that I , for one, had a real blast at themeeting: Putting faces to names, meeting new people, and just eyeballingallthe really neat stuff that went on.The demos were great and very informative, as were all thedemonstrators-who, without exception, were more than willing to take the time toexplainanything anyone had a question about--IT WAS FANTASTIC!!Harry, it was great to finally meet you, Mike and the rest of the gang whohave been so patient helping myself and others starting out!I feel sorry though for Wayne C. because I know I talked his ear off--hemust have the patience of Job!!The chance to try all the other rods was really a blast, and although Iwanted to try the silk line, the fault for not trying it was totally myown--guess I'll just have to come back next year! :^) THANKS to everyone for a great time! Mike from fiveside@net-gate.com Fri Nov 5 18:05:38 1999 ns1.net-gate.com (8.9.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id SAA16228 for; Subject: Epon To the List,Sounds like a bit of loose talk on this subject. Epon is the trademark ofthe Shell Co and is mainly available from Miller Stephenson. The type mostof us use is Epon 828 with v40 or 140 hardener. This cures at room tempin afew hours but the specs say it performs even better with heat cure. Thereare many different epoxy types. Best to be specific as to type and brandsince they may very well perform differently. Guess we need John Zimny'sexpertise here. Bill from HARMS1@prodigy.net Fri Nov 5 18:16:44 1999 Fri, 5 Nov 1999 19:16:27 -0500 Subject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0020_01BF27C1.B3D33D00" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0020_01BF27C1.B3D33D00 Terry, True enough. In all the different rods I've built, there has never been =one that suited me just right. It's not that I'm such a great caster =(or builder, either, for that matter), it's just that we all have our =own preferences and casting rhythms. So, I wind up "tweaking" nearly = Computer programs can get someone with little experience "in the =ballpark" pretty quickly, but in the end, only trial and error and =experience can produce what one really wants. For myself, I would =rather start out with some of my own design ideas and graph paper than a=computer-generated set of numbers. cheers, Bill Sent: Thursday, November 04, 1999 6:58 PMSubject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers the perfect rod means different things to different people. It is a =matter of personal choice, not what a computer suggests you should be = I have noticed that it is the newbies that find comfort in computer = Frankly, I don't see the irony at all. A website is marketing. =Designing tapers one likes is something else. I'm not sure what, but I = ----- Original Message -----From: Randy Brewer Cc: RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.eduSent: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 9:16 PMSubject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timersYou may have missed my point, Terry. It is obviously not = computer. I just find it ironic that someone with a nice website = rods over the Internet might feel that "designing rod tapers with = was a lot of BS". That statement seems a little harsh, that's all, = If a guy says he finds a computer unnecessary to design a rod = Making fishing poles may be rocket science to some but to others = I am puzzled as to why someone would advertise their rods using = and yet fail to see a computer's value when making calculations = why they were invented). Perhaps using a computer to calculate = interest or plot the trajectory of a spacecraft is "BS", too! = the Tacoma Narrows Bridge designed without the benefit of a = I'm not saying that using a computer is for everyone. But I = done us all a service by making his software available to those = to use it. I continually see posts to this list by people who = Rodmaker Don Schroeder of Janesville WI spoke at our TU chapter = last week. (He quit his day job about 5 years ago to = on rodmaking, after somebody ordered 12 rods. He makes ~45 = a year and does lots of restorations.) Anyway, although he = his strips on a milling machine, he still scrapes the enamel by = hand with a utility knife blade held with his fingers. His = And he said designing rod tapers with a computer was a lot of = The good news, for me, was that my best efforts don't really = that bad compared to Don's. Didn't have a chance to cast them = Don's got a web page at http://www.inwave.com/~schroede/ , FYI. = = Frank Stetzer "...a cheerful comrade is = stetzer@uwm.edu than a waterproof coat = Employed by, but not speaking for foot-warmer." Henry Van = Univ of Wisconsin-Milwaukee, USA "Fisherman's Luck", 1899. = ------=_NextPart_000_0020_01BF27C1.B3D33D00 Terry, True Computerprograms can = with little experience "in the ballpark" pretty quickly, but in the end, = myself, I would rather start out with some of my own design = paper than a computer-generated set of numbers. Bill ----- Original Message ----- ACKLAND Cc: brewer@teleport.com ; RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.edu= Sent: Thursday, November 04, = PMSubject: Re: Don Schroeder; = timersBill, the perfect rod means different things to = people. It is a matter of personal choice, not what a computer = should be casting with. I have noticed that it is the newbies that = comfort in computer generated tapers which usually passes quickly. = Frankly, I don't = ----- Original Message ----- Brewer Cc: RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.eduSent: Wednesday, November = 9:16 PMSubject: Re: Don Schroeder; = necessary to use a computer. I just find it ironic that = nice website selling rods over the Internet might feel that = rod tapers with a computer was a lot of BS". That statement = little harsh, that's all, since most of use whatever tools are = -----Original Message----- From: TERENCE ACKLAND Cc: RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.edu= <RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.edu= Date: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 6:59 PM Subject: Re: = why someone would advertise their rods using a website = yet fail to see a computer's value when making calculations (that = Bridge designed without the benefit of a computer? :-) = continually see posts to this list by people who are very = <RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.edu= Don Schroeder of Janesville WI spoke at our TU chapter = week. (He quit his day job about 5 years ago to concentrate = news, for me, was that my best efforts don't really LOOK = = = ------=_NextPart_000_0020_01BF27C1.B3D33D00-- from HARMS1@prodigy.net Fri Nov 5 18:19:52 1999 Fri, 5 Nov 1999 19:19:44 -0500 Subject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers boundary="----=_NextPart_000_002D_01BF27C2.2963AC80" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_002D_01BF27C2.2963AC80 Vern, Well, I don't know about all that. Terry lacks tact from time to time, =but I haven't noticed that he is wrong very often. He's built one hell =of a lot of rods, and I can't think there's much for him to be jealous =of. cheers, Bill Sent: Thursday, November 04, 1999 7:00 PMSubject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers Kling, Barry W. wrote: So let's see, if you use a computer to help choose a taper, you're =either ahapless rookie or a foolish dreamer. But what are you if you use a computer to send needlessly hostile =messagesthat on any other board would start a fire? Of course I wouldn't use =acomputer for that because I have the experience and judgement =regardingonline discussions to be able to produce civil messages.... --- If you haven't realized by now Terence is a jealous old fart, and hispost's should be ignored.read everything he has written in the last =year Vern ------=_NextPart_000_002D_01BF27C2.2963AC80 Vern, Well, I don't know= there's much for him to be jealous of. Bill ----- Original Message ----- Price = Sent: Thursday, November 04, = PMSubject: Re: Don Schroeder; = timers = = ---Barry, If you haven't realized by now Terence is a jealous = fart, and hispost's should be ignored.read everything he has = the last yearVern ------=_NextPart_000_002D_01BF27C2.2963AC80-- from HARMS1@prodigy.net Fri Nov 5 18:51:58 1999 Fri, 5 Nov 1999 19:51:49 -0500 Subject: Re: Taper design boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0040_01BF27C6.A505ECA0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0040_01BF27C6.A505ECA0 Skip, The graph paper and pencil (eraser being more important than point) =technique is really very simple. One scales the half-thickness of a =given rod (in thousandths of an inch) along the vertical plane, while =its length is scaled in inches (five-inch increments) along the =horizontal plane. Then you draw a picture of the rod you want. The =only pertinent question is, what "should" it look like? You have to =start with something as your basis, and for this, only experience will =help. (It's sort of like getting hired for your first job in that, you =already have to be able to do it. It's a Catch-22. And this is why =computer programs are so helpful for the new builder.) You start with the rod length you want, and then pencil-in dots (in =accordance with the vertical scale) for the butt-diameter, ferrule-size =and tip-top that you think might produce a rod for the weight of line =you wish to cast. This is where experience (and/or other rods you =already know helps). And now you begin to fill in the five-inch =horizontal increments between the sections' ends with more pencil dots =(representing the shape of the overall taper that you are after), and =then you just connect the dots to create the "picture" of the rod. Once =you can see the rod in profile, you can critique its taper, and it is at =this point that your eraser will get a workout. There is really nothing more one can say about the process itself, =because it is at this point that everything depends upon the designer's =own preferences, principles and past experiences. There is no "how-to" =manual here--you're on your own. cheers, Bill Sent: Thursday, November 04, 1999 8:43 PMSubject: Taper design How did the "classical" rod makers; Payne, Young, Dickerson and theothers, develop their tapers? Did they just cut and try or did they =havesome design system or systems? I'm curious because everything I seen =orheard about seems to be a spin off of the Garrison process in some =form.I know that some of you use the Garrison style to develop your tapers,others use "seat of the pants" design based on a lot of experience andI'm sure many have mixed the two. What does the graph paper and pencilmethod involve? What are other ways to design a taper? I've played =withthe Hexrod program but would like to learn other design methods also.Please excuse me for asking so many questions, I just HAD to ask them. = Skip ------=_NextPart_000_0040_01BF27C6.A505ECA0 Skip, The graph paperand = builder.) You start with the= And now you begin to fill in the five-inch horizontal increments between = sections' ends with more pencil dots (representing the shape of the = taper that you are after), and then you just connect the dots to create = workout. There is really = can say about the process itself, because it is at this point that = own. Bill ----- Original Message ----- Skip =Shorb Sent: Thursday, November 04, = PMSubject: Taper designHow did the "classical" rod makers; Payne, Young, = theothers, develop their tapers? Did they just cut and try or did = havesome design system or systems? I'm curious because everything= orheard about seems to be a spin off of the Garrison process in = form.I know that some of you use the Garrison style to develop = tapers,others use "seat of the pants" design based on a lot of = andI'm sure many have mixed the two. What does the graph paper and= pencilmethod involve? What are other ways to design a taper? I've = withthe Hexrod program but would like to learn other design = also.Please excuse me for asking so many questions, I just HAD to = them. Skip ------=_NextPart_000_0040_01BF27C6.A505ECA0-- from anglport@con2.com Fri Nov 5 19:22:43 1999 (SMTPD32-5.05) id A2BF8DD02E8; Fri, 05 Nov 1999 20:22:07 -0500 Subject: Re: Cross Sylph taper I didn't go to my dictionary, but can't sylph and nymph have similar uses? Art At 06:53 PM 11/05/1999 -0500, bob maulucci wrote:I don't know. It can get a bunch of line in the "air", and it is nice to look at. Both definitions work for me. The cork handIe does have somenice curves, though.Bob At 02:59 PM 11/5/99 -0800, you wrote:Hi Bob,Your posting about the #1500 South Bend/Cross Syph rod wasinteresting andgot me to wondering where on earth the word "sylph" came from. Lo andbehold, I found the answer in the dictionary. A sylph is an imaginarybeinginhabiting the air and also means a slender, graceful woman. Now thequestion becomes: which one of these meanings properly describes yourrod?Ray----- Original Message ----- From: bob maulucci Cc: Sent: Friday, November 05, 1999 2:16 PMSubject: Re: Cross Sylph taper Frank,I posted the South Bend /Cross Sylph from my small collection. It is a7'6"2 pc rod that is missing the extra tip. I think it throws a 5wt nicely.They were made by Wes Jordan both at the original Cross Rod Co. andlateras the top of the line South Bend models. The Sylph is a single builtrodunlike the doublebuilt heavier line models. It has black wraps withgoldtrim, and has a cigar grip and cork skeleton reel seat. The rod ismarkedModel 1500. The South Bend catalog has it listed as 7 feet 2 1/2 oz.andselling at $35. Page 38 of Dick Spurr's book "Wes Jordan:Profile of aRodm,ker" shows the rod grip and ferrules. (Liek mine) I know noreasonwhymine is 7'6", but I know it is a great rod.Bob Maulucci At 09:07 AM 11/5/99 -0600, you wrote:There is 7.5 foot Cross Sylph taper in the archives ( from whichI built a very nice casting rod last winter), and _The Planing Form_has a 7.0 foot Sylph. I wonder if someone knows more about therods originally made with the Sylph taper...Were there a lot oflengths and weights?......................................................................Frank Stetzer "...a cheerful comrade is betterstetzer@uwm.edu than a waterproof coat and aEmployed by, but not speaking for foot-warmer." Henry Van Dyke,Univ of Wisconsin-Milwaukee, USA "Fisherman's Luck", 1899. Bob Mauluccibob@downandacross.com Bob Maulucci==================================================downandacross.com productionswebsite, audio, and print designhttp://www.downandacross.com218 Wallace AvenueBuffalo, NY 14216716-836-8297 home716-867-0523 cellularbob@downandacross.com from anglport@con2.com Fri Nov 5 19:30:45 1999 (SMTPD32-5.05) id A49A3A302BC; Fri, 05 Nov 1999 20:30:02 -0500 Subject: Re: Planing Form Ralph,I had some bad screws in mine and a friend was able to get somemade toreplace them ( No small favor). He was quite surprised when I put off ( foralmost a month) dis- and re-assembling the thing to swap them in. When Itold him it took me several hours and a REAL neuralgia of the dorsalextremities the LAST time I knocked the thing down, he sneered, but Iremembered when! If you EVER have to take one apart, do yourself a favorand carefully measure the separation when the last threads leave the barsand try to have everything separated by that amount when you put 'er back.That, along with turning each screw a turn or two before attacking thenext(and the next) might enable you to do it in one try!Otherwise you get eithera) tight screws with separated bars, orb) tight bars with screw threads only barely seated, asking to be stripped. Good luck helps a lot too,Art At 04:03 PM 11/05/1999 -0700, Ralph W Moon wrote:amen and amen Gary! I just finished tuning up my Carson form (differential screws) and itis not the easiest thing to do. Ralph from hexagon@odyssee.net Fri Nov 5 19:54:25 1999 RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers Art,if that is the case why not build just 7 ft rods and let the computer tell ushow tomake them cast like the whole range. We would only need one tube andsack size andthe same guide spacing. Just joking.I remember an old Scot that built cane rods here in Montreal years ago andhe saidthat if a customer requires,say, a 7ft 6 #4 you show him just one design.If you showhim 2 different tapers he will waggle one, then the other and becomeconfused andwalk away without buying a rod.I think we can get too smart for our own good.I build rods that I can cast with, I dont have the patience with customstuff .TerryArt Port wrote: Terry,Shouldn't a computer be the way to go if you have a 6ft 4 wt thatsomeonelikes the action of and they want it in a 7 1/2 fter (or vice versa)? Thatseems to be the prime advantage of such equipment. Not to necessarilyDESIGN a taper but to make the alteration of it easier or in a morepredictable way?Just one man's opinion.....Art At 09:58 PM 11/04/1999 -0500, TERENCE ACKLAND wrote:Bill,the perfect rod means different things to different people. It is amatterof personal choice, not what a computer suggests you should be castingwith.I have noticed that it is the newbies that find comfort in computergenerated tapers which usually passes quickly.terry WILLIAM A HARMS wrote: I'm not sure what, but I think it'scloser to smoke and mirrors than science. cheers, Bill -- --- Original RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 19999:16 PMSubject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers You may have missed mypoint,Terry. It is obviously not necessary to use acomputer. I just find it ironic that someone with a nice website sellingrods over the Internet might feel that "designing rod tapers with acomputerwas a lot of BS". That statement seems a little harsh, that's all, sincemost of use whatever tools are at our disposal.-----Original Message----- Cc: RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.eduDate: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 6:59 PMSubject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timersthen hefinds itunnecessary. How is that wrong.Making fishing poles may be rocket science to some but to others it isnot. Randy Brewer wrote: Just to fan the flames a little... I am puzzled as to why someone would advertise their rods using awebsiteand yet fail to see a computer's value when making calculations (thatWASwhy they were invented). Perhaps using a computer to calculatecompoundinterest or plot the trajectory of a spacecraft is "BS", too! Hey,wasn'tthe Tacoma Narrows Bridge designed without the benefit of acomputer?:-) I'm not saying that using a computer is for everyone. But I thinkWaynehasdone us all a service by making his software available to those whochooseto use it. I continually see posts to this list by people who are verypleased with Wayne's tapers. That says it all for me! -Randy Brewer -----Original Message----- Date: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 1:53 PMSubject: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers Rodmaker Don Schroeder of Janesville WI spoke at our TU chapterlast week. (He quit his day job about 5 years ago to concentrateHe makes ~45 rodsAnyway, although he tapershis strips on a milling machine, he still scrapes the enamel byHis operationseems a curious mix of high tech and no tech. And he said designing rod tapers with a computer was a lot of BS :-) The good news, for me, was that my best efforts don't really LOOKDidn't have a chance to cast them though. Don's got a web page at http://www.inwave.com/~schroede/ , FYI......................................................................."...a cheerful comrade is betterstetzer@uwm.edu than a waterproof coat and aHenry Van Dyke,"Fisherman's Luck", 1899. from freaner@gte.net Fri Nov 5 19:56:55 1999 Subject: Differential screws; was: Planing Form At 8:30 PM -0500 on 11/5/99, Art Port wrote: Ralph,I had some bad screws in mine and a friend was able to get somemade toreplace them ( No small favor). He was quite surprised when I put off (foralmost a month) dis- and re-assembling the thing to swap them in. When Itold him it took me several hours and a REAL neuralgia of the dorsalextremities the LAST time I knocked the thing down, he sneered, but Iremembered when! If you EVER have to take one apart, do yourself a favorand carefully measure the separation when the last threads leave thebarsand try to have everything separated by that amount when you put 'erback.That, along with turning each screw a turn or two before attacking thenext(and the next) might enable you to do it in one try!Otherwise you geteithera) tight screws with separated bars, orb) tight bars with screw threads only barely seated, asking to bestripped. Can one actually buy the differential screws somewhere, or do they havetobe made, along with making the forms? Claude from jfreeman@cyberport.com Fri Nov 5 20:06:06 1999 ,"'Rod Makers List Serve'" Subject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers Hey Terence, I realize that poking results in ---- well, results - we get a reaction. How'bout we get on down the road with this and stop screwing around. Some ofusdon't really give a rat's ass about achieving spectacular results --- we'rejust trying to get a little satisfaction from life before the curtain comesdown. The goal of building a beautiful rod isn't something that goes withthe mainstream. No one is here for the money, or maybe bigger fool he thatis. Personally, I think you have a lot to contribute as does everybody else.I've followed what you have to say for over a year now, and I takeeverything you say seriously. You know what you're talking about, and Ithink most on this list respect what you have to say. I think your problem has to do with the phases of the moon - have you hadanose bleed lately? You really don't make 30 days, but you do seem to comeonabout once a quarter. Geez man, I love you. Can't wait for the reply. Jim----- Original Message ----- Subject: RE: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers Terry - Glad you didn't take offense. As for what I do with my laptop, that'sreallya personal thing between me and my wife, don't you think? But maybe I'mtheexception that proves your rule. I've been lurking for only about 2 monthsand I have managed to make a 3-piece 7'6" rod (not surprisingly, I used ataper from that other laptop jockey Mr. Cattanach) and just split up somecane for my second. The first one turned out much better than I had anyright to expect - not least because of the generous sharing done by youandthe other ancient ones. Barry -----Original Message----- Sent: Thursday, November 04, 1999 9:07 PM Subject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers Barry,you guys come and go on the list without ever making a rod.It's about playingon your laptops, right? Kling, Barry W. wrote: So let's see, if you use a computer to help choose ataper, you're either ahapless rookie or a foolish dreamer. But what are you if you use a computer to send needlesslyhostile messagesthat on any other board would start a fire? Of course Iwouldn't use acomputer for that because I have the experience andjudgement regardingonline discussions to be able to produce civilmessages.... -----Original Message-----From: TERENCE ACKLAND Sent: Thursday, November 04, 1999 3:32PM Cc: RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was:Old timers Some builders do not need computers, theyhave theexperience and judgment to beable to produce tapers out of their heads.Bullshit, next to useless or a valuabletool can be used todescribe rod designprogrammes. It just depends on theindividual.I have noticed over the years that most ofthe punters onthis list arecomputery types that feel uncomfortableout of the glare ofa computer screenand very few actually get to make rods. Randy Brewer wrote: You may have missed my point, Terry. Itis obviously notnecessary to use acomputer. I just find it ironic thatsomeone with a nicewebsite sellingrods over the Internet might feel that"designing rodtapers with a computerwas a lot of BS". That statement seems alittle harsh,that's all, sincemost of use whatever tools are at ourdisposal. -----Original Message-----From: TERENCE ACKLAND Cc: RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.edu Date: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 6:59PMSubject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Oldtimers If a guy says he finds a computerunnecessary to design arod then hefinds itunnecessary. How is that wrong.Making fishing poles may be rocketscience to some but toothers it is not. Randy Brewer wrote: Just to fan the flames a little... I am puzzled as to why someone wouldadvertise theirrods using a websiteand yet fail to see a computer'svalue when makingcalculations (that WASwhy they were invented). Perhapsusing a computer tocalculate compoundinterest or plot the trajectory of aspacecraft is"BS", too! Hey, wasn'tthe Tacoma Narrows Bridge designedwithout the benefitof a computer?:-) I'm not saying that using a computeris for everyone.But I think Waynehasdone us all a service by making hissoftware availableto those whochooseto use it. I continually see posts tothis list bypeople who are verypleased with Wayne's tapers. Thatsays it all for me! -Randy Brewer -----Original Message-----From: Frank Stetzer Date: Wednesday, November 03, 19991:53 PMSubject: Don Schroeder; Was: Oldtimers Rodmaker Don Schroeder of JanesvilleWI spoke at our TUchapterlast week. (He quit his day job about5 years ago toconcentrateon rodmaking, after somebody ordered12 rods. He makes~45 rodsa year and does lots ofrestorations.) Anyway,although he tapershis strips on a milling machine, hestill scrapes theenamel byhand with a utility knife blade heldwith his fingers.His operationseems a curious mix of high tech andno tech. And he said designing rod tapers witha computer was alot of BS :-) The good news, for me, was that mybest efforts don'treally LOOKthat bad compared to Don's. Didn'thave a chance tocast them though. Don's got a web page athttp://www.inwave.com/~schroede/ , FYI. ......................................................................Frank Stetzer"...a cheerfulcomrade is betterstetzer@uwm.eduthan a waterproofcoat and aEmployed by, but not speaking forfoot-warmer."Henry Van Dyke,Univ of Wisconsin-Milwaukee, USA"Fisherman'sLuck", 1899. from FISHWOOL@aol.com Fri Nov 5 20:07:12 1999 Subject: Re: Garrison Tapers What I'm about to say may upset some people but here goes.I made several of Garrison's tapers early on in my rod building. I found them to be "slower" than I liked and have modified and/or newly designed tapers to suit my taste. Now some of my rod making friends like "slower"rods and the 212E is on the top 25 list of all time favorites posted a whileback. All of which just means "you makes yo pick 'n takes yo choice". Go for it.Regards,Hank W. from anglport@con2.com Fri Nov 5 20:36:12 1999 (SMTPD32-5.05) id A3FD5370334; Fri, 05 Nov 1999 21:35:41 -0500 Subject: Re: Differential screws; was: Planing Form Claude,I don't know of anywhere that "carries" them. They must have twodifferentthreads dead-on axially (or they'll cause the bars to rise and fallrelatively to one another as they turn) and are useful for only ONE thing.I don't see them appearing at your local Home Depot any time soon.When I was dealing with one machinist, he was going to make themasthreaded rods and supply nuts to epoxy and pin to their ends. Said it wouldbe easier that way and I couldn't see a down-side to it. Art At 08:54 PM 11/05/1999 -0500, Claude Freaner wrote:At 8:30 PM -0500 on 11/5/99, Art Port wrote: Ralph,I had some bad screws in mine and a friend was able to get somemade toreplace them ( No small favor). He was quite surprised when I put off (foralmost a month) dis- and re-assembling the thing to swap them in. WhenItold him it took me several hours and a REAL neuralgia of the dorsalextremities the LAST time I knocked the thing down, he sneered, but Iremembered when! If you EVER have to take one apart, do yourself afavorand carefully measure the separation when the last threads leave thebarsand try to have everything separated by that amount when you put 'erback.That, along with turning each screw a turn or two before attacking thenext(and the next) might enable you to do it in one try!Otherwise you geteithera) tight screws with separated bars, orb) tight bars with screw threads only barely seated, asking to bestripped. Can one actually buy the differential screws somewhere, or do they havetobe made, along with making the forms? Claude from hexagon@odyssee.net Fri Nov 5 20:55:05 1999 "'Rod Makers List Serve'" Subject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers Jim,all that any one ever needs to know about rodmaking is in the archives.Thatleaves nothing left to say, other than a little winding up now and again tokeepthings interesting.Actually I have not had a nosebleed since I have been taking the bloodpressurepills.I have never been an advocate of building perfect rods, I don't have thepatience.Cane rod making is not difficult....convincing punters that after buildingfor2 years your rods are worth $1K + is where it gets hard.Terry Jim & Sally Freeman wrote: Hey Terence, I realize that poking results in ---- well, results - we get a reaction.How'bout we get on down the road with this and stop screwing around. Someof usdon't really give a rat's ass about achieving spectacular results ---we'rejust trying to get a little satisfaction from life before the curtaincomesdown. The goal of building a beautiful rod isn't something that goes withthe mainstream. No one is here for the money, or maybe bigger fool hethatis. Personally, I think you have a lot to contribute as does everybodyelse.I've followed what you have to say for over a year now, and I takeeverything you say seriously. You know what you're talking about, and Ithink most on this list respect what you have to say. I think your problem has to do with the phases of the moon - have youhad anose bleed lately? You really don't make 30 days, but you do seem tocome onabout once a quarter. Geez man, I love you. Can't wait for the reply. Jim----- Original Message -----From: Kling, Barry W. Sent: Friday, November 05, 1999 7:37 AMSubject: RE: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers Terry - Glad you didn't take offense. As for what I do with my laptop, that'sreallya personal thing between me and my wife, don't you think? But maybeI'mtheexception that proves your rule. I've been lurking for only about 2monthsand I have managed to make a 3-piece 7'6" rod (not surprisingly, I usedataper from that other laptop jockey Mr. Cattanach) and just split upsomecane for my second. The first one turned out much better than I had anyright to expect - not least because of the generous sharing done by youandthe other ancient ones. Barry -----Original Message----- Sent: Thursday, November 04, 1999 9:07 PM Subject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers Barry,you guys come and go on the list without ever making a rod.It's about playingon your laptops, right? Kling, Barry W. wrote: So let's see, if you use a computer to help choose ataper, you're either ahapless rookie or a foolish dreamer. But what are you if you use a computer to send needlesslyhostile messagesthat on any other board would start a fire? Of course Iwouldn't use acomputer for that because I have the experience andjudgement regardingonline discussions to be able to produce civilmessages.... -----Original Message-----From: TERENCE ACKLAND Sent: Thursday, November 04, 1999 3:32PM Cc: RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was:Old timers Some builders do not need computers, theyhave theexperience and judgment to beable to produce tapers out of their heads.Bullshit, next to useless or a valuabletool can be used todescribe rod designprogrammes. It just depends on theindividual.I have noticed over the years that most ofthe punters onthis list arecomputery types that feel uncomfortableout of the glare ofa computer screenand very few actually get to make rods. Randy Brewer wrote: You may have missed my point, Terry. Itis obviously notnecessary to use acomputer. I just find it ironic thatsomeone with a nicewebsite sellingrods over the Internet might feel that"designing rodtapers with a computerwas a lot of BS". That statement seems alittle harsh,that's all, sincemost of use whatever tools are at ourdisposal. -----Original Message-----From: TERENCE ACKLAND Cc: RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.edu Date: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 6:59PMSubject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Oldtimers If a guy says he finds a computerunnecessary to design arod then hefinds itunnecessary. How is that wrong.Making fishing poles may be rocketscience to some but toothers it is not. Randy Brewer wrote: Just to fan the flames a little... I am puzzled as to why someone wouldadvertise theirrods using a websiteand yet fail to see a computer'svalue when makingcalculations (that WASwhy they were invented). Perhapsusing a computer tocalculate compoundinterest or plot the trajectory of aspacecraft is"BS", too! Hey, wasn'tthe Tacoma Narrows Bridge designedwithout the benefitof a computer?:-) I'm not saying that using a computeris for everyone.But I think Waynehasdone us all a service by making hissoftware availableto those whochooseto use it. I continually see posts tothis list bypeople who are verypleased with Wayne's tapers. Thatsays it all for me! -Randy Brewer -----Original Message-----From: Frank Stetzer Date: Wednesday, November 03, 19991:53 PMSubject: Don Schroeder; Was: Oldtimers Rodmaker Don Schroeder of JanesvilleWI spoke at our TUchapterlast week. (He quit his day job about5 years ago toconcentrateon rodmaking, after somebody ordered12 rods. He makes~45 rodsa year and does lots ofrestorations.) Anyway,although he tapershis strips on a milling machine, hestill scrapes theenamel byhand with a utility knife blade heldwith his fingers.His operationseems a curious mix of high tech andno tech. And he said designing rod tapers witha computer was alot of BS :-) The good news, for me, was that mybest efforts don'treally LOOKthat bad compared to Don's. Didn'thave a chance tocast them though. Don's got a web page athttp://www.inwave.com/~schroede/ , FYI. ......................................................................Frank Stetzer"...a cheerfulcomrade is betterstetzer@uwm.eduthan a waterproofcoat and aEmployed by, but not speaking forfoot-warmer."Henry Van Dyke,Univ of Wisconsin-Milwaukee, USA"Fisherman'sLuck", 1899. from mrj@aa.net Fri Nov 5 21:39:14 1999 Fri, 5 Nov 1999 19:39:06 -0800 Subject: RE: ? Can you elaborate a bit more on this issue? When I open up Pats e-mail tothe list it is dated properly. Do you mean that the date on the e-mail iswrong? Or do you mean that the date on you computer changes to 1969?Soundslike you have a bios battery that is going out and it is defaulting to thatdate.I don't think that Pat's e-mail has anything to do with it. Martin Jensen -----Original Message----- Subject: ? Patrick every time you post a message it really skrews up my browser..date at12/31/69.. anyone else??? don't have a clue where the problem is.. this isn't aimed at you it's a machine problem (unix at work?)jerry from mrj@aa.net Fri Nov 5 21:46:05 1999 Fri, 5 Nov 1999 19:46:00 -0800 Subject: RE: First Rod My suggestion is to make an 8 ft 6 wt. for your first rod. this is not toodelicate of a taper and should be easier than say a 7 ft 4 wt for a firstrod. that would have really small dimensions o the tip and you wouldprobably break a spline or 2 before you get done. You will probably break aspline or 2 any way come to think of it but that is OK. It will just giveyou more practice with planing, which a first rod is all about. there are somany to choose from it really doesn't matter and there is no real way totell if you like a rod if you haven't cast it or at least one like it. Seeif you can find one to cast and if you like it, fine the taper to it. Iguarantee that you will like your first rod. Martin Jensen -----Original Message----- Subject: First Rod Hi Folks, Well if you haven't figured it out, I am a "NEWBIE". I am currentlycollecting my tools and materials to make my first rod. My question (fornow) is what should be my first rod (taper) to make? I currently fish thetailwaters in Arkansas which is a lot of nymph fishing with a little bit ofdry fly. I would like to have an 8' or 8 1/2' rod to start. Since most ofmy fishing has been with a medium action graphite rod (I know an uglyword),I would like a taper to graduate into easily. So does anyone have a goodrecomendation for me? Thanks,A misplaced Florida Gator. Mark from sshorb@ozip.net Fri Nov 5 21:56:11 1999 Subject: Guides I'm preparing to get guides for my first rod. How do you select guidesize?Skip from georgewb@pacbell.net Fri Nov 5 22:58:04 1999 sims.3.5.1999.09.16.21.57.p8)with SMTP id for Subject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers You do bring up a valid point...computer programs and mathematical modelsare just that, models. If one doesn't actually build and refine the modelAND gain consistency in building, it doesn't mean much. George Bourke -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers Some builders do not need computers, they have the experience andjudgmentto beable to produce tapers out of their heads.Bullshit, next to useless or a valuable tool can be used to describe roddesignprogrammes. It just depends on the individual.I have noticed over the years that most of the punters on this list arecomputery types that feel uncomfortable out of the glare of a computerscreenand very few actually get to make rods. Randy Brewer wrote: You may have missed my point, Terry. It is obviously not necessary touseacomputer. I just find it ironic that someone with a nice website sellingrods over the Internet might feel that "designing rod tapers with acomputerwas a lot of BS". That statement seems a little harsh, that's all, sincemost of use whatever tools are at our disposal. -----Original Message-----From: TERENCE ACKLAND Cc: RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.edu Date: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 6:59 PMSubject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers If a guy says he finds a computer unnecessary to design a rod then hefinds itunnecessary. How is that wrong.Making fishing poles may be rocket science to some but to others it isnot. Randy Brewer wrote: Just to fan the flames a little... I am puzzled as to why someone would advertise their rods using awebsiteand yet fail to see a computer's value when making calculations (thatWASwhy they were invented). Perhaps using a computer to calculatecompoundinterest or plot the trajectory of a spacecraft is "BS", too! Hey,wasn'tthe Tacoma Narrows Bridge designed without the benefit of acomputer?:-) I'm not saying that using a computer is for everyone. But I thinkWaynehasdone us all a service by making his software available to those whochooseto use it. I continually see posts to this list by people who are verypleased with Wayne's tapers. That says it all for me! -Randy Brewer -----Original Message-----From: Frank Stetzer Date: Wednesday, November 03, 1999 1:53 PMSubject: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers Rodmaker Don Schroeder of Janesville WI spoke at our TU chapterlast week. (He quit his day job about 5 years ago to concentrateon rodmaking, after somebody ordered 12 rods. He makes ~45 rodsa year and does lots of restorations.) Anyway, although he tapershis strips on a milling machine, he still scrapes the enamel byhand with a utility knife blade held with his fingers. His operationseems a curious mix of high tech and no tech. And he said designing rod tapers with a computer was a lot of BS :-) The good news, for me, was that my best efforts don't really LOOKthat bad compared to Don's. Didn't have a chance to cast them though. Don's got a web page at http://www.inwave.com/~schroede/ , FYI.......................................................................Frank Stetzer "...a cheerful comrade is betterstetzer@uwm.edu than a waterproof coat and aEmployed by, but not speaking for foot-warmer." Henry Van Dyke,Univ of Wisconsin-Milwaukee, USA "Fisherman's Luck", 1899. from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Fri Nov 5 23:16:54 1999 Fri, 5 Nov 1999 21:16:42 -0800 Subject: Re: First Rod Mark,Martin's ideas are right on the mark, but you are fishing the samewaters I am. Iwould strongly suggest that you consider a Payne 101 7'6" 5 weight, 2piece. I've made 4of them; Rick Crenshaw's made a couple, and everyone that casts themseems to like them.It has plenty of backbone to handle the kind of rig you throw on theWhite/Norfork/Little Red. If you need the taper, let me know. And if you want a fishingpartner upthat way, just yell. Harry Boyd Mark Lang wrote: Hi Folks, Well if you haven't figured it out, I am a "NEWBIE". I am currentlycollecting mytools and materials to make my first rod. My question (for now) is whatshould be myfirst rod (taper) to make? I currently fish the tailwaters in Arkansaswhich is a lot ofnymph fishing with a little bit of dry fly. I would like to have an 8' or 81/2' rod tostart. Since most of my fishing has been with a medium action graphiterod (I know anugly word), I would like a taper to graduate into easily. So does anyonehave a goodrecomendation for me? Thanks,A misplaced Florida Gator. Mark from drinkr@voicenet.com Sat Nov 6 00:05:12 1999 0000 (207.103.93.229) Subject: stepper motors If anyone is in need of a stepper motor Herbach and Rademan has a greatdealon a recycled model marked down from $100 to $9.00. I was talking tothem part just thought I would pass it on. Contact me off list and I willsupply the serial number. David Rinker from iank@nelson.planet.org.nz Sat Nov 6 02:02:12 1999 sage.ts.co.nz with SMTP id VAA09446; Sat, 6 Nov 1999 21:00:19 +1300 Subject: Re: Epon heat setting "rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu" Ralph , thanks for the advise. I will undoubtly remember it when it happens to me.Your advise may help me prevent it. regads Ian Kearney At 01:26 PM 5/11/99 -0700, Ralph W Moon wrote:Ian Sorry if I worry you. Not intentional. My point is that too rapidheating and manipulating will cause trouble. If you get away with itgreat! You probably won't have any further trouble. But somewhere andsometime you will be working on that irreplacable rod and bam it willbreak or delaminate or scorch. You may get away with it dozens of timesbut it will catch up with you. I wish I had some hard evidence to giveyou, but all I have is a lot of years experience with a few tears andheartaches from getting impatient. I'm one of those old farts and like Terry entitled to my own opinion,but one thing I try to emphasize with all of my students is the factthat if you make a mistake the chances are good you can't undo it. So doeverything with due deliberation at a lesser intensity than you thinknecessary. Luck Ralph Ian too rapid heating and manipulating will cause irreplacable away some hard evidence to give you, but all I have is a lot of years experiencewith a few tears and heartaches from getting impatient. I'm one of those old farts and like Terry entitled to my own opinion,but one thing I try to emphasize with all of my students is the fact thatif you make a mistake the chances are good you can't undo it. So doeverythingwith due deliberation at a lesser intensity than you think necessary. from KlingB@health.missouri.edu Sat Nov 6 07:00:13 1999 rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: RE: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers Terry - I have to say you're right, though I hate to admit that to a genuine oldperson. Most good things in my life (not excepting rod tapers) are at leastpartly accidental. As for difficulty, I think what you said applies to lots of things. Few ofthe steps along the way are inherently difficult, if you can followdirections. For me the most important thing is to have an image of what Iwant in the end. This reminds me of photography, another interest of mine. Glad to know I only have to wait about 20 more months before my rods areworth $1,000. I better get to work on my web site. Barry -----Original Message----- Sent: Friday, November 05, 1999 8:26 PM Subject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was: Old timers Barry,not that difficult is it, I mean, to make a rod? If it didnot measure out asplanned when finished, there is a good chance it couldactually suit you better! It is just a handicraft.Terry Kling, Barry W. wrote: Terry - Glad you didn't take offense. As for what I do with mylaptop, that's reallya personal thing between me and my wife, don't you think?But maybe I'm theexception that proves your rule. I've been lurking foronly about 2 monthsand I have managed to make a 3-piece 7'6" rod (notsurprisingly, I used ataper from that other laptop jockey Mr. Cattanach) andjust split up somecane for my second. The first one turned out much betterthan I had anyright to expect - not least because of the generoussharing done by you andthe other ancient ones. Barry -----Original Message-----From: TERENCE ACKLAND Sent: Thursday, November 04, 1999 9:07PM Subject: Re: Don Schroeder; Was:Old timers Barry,you guys come and go on the list withoutever making a rod.It's about playingon your laptops, right? Kling, Barry W. wrote: So let's see, if you use a computer tohelp choose ataper, you're either ahapless rookie or a foolish dreamer. But what are you if you use a computerto send needlesslyhostile messagesthat on any other board would start afire? Of course Iwouldn't use acomputer for that because I have theexperience andjudgement regardingonline discussions to be able to producecivilmessages.... -----OriginalMessage-----From: TERENCE ACKLAND Sent: Thursday,November 04, 1999 3:32PM brewer@teleport.comCc:RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Re: DonSchroeder; Was:Old timers Some builders do notneed computers, theyhave theexperience and judgment to beable to produce tapersout of their heads.Bullshit, next touseless or a valuabletool can be used todescribe rod designprogrammes. It justdepends on theindividual.I have noticed over theyears that most ofthe punters onthis list arecomputery types thatfeel uncomfortableout of the glare ofa computer screenand very few actuallyget to make rods. Randy Brewer wrote: You may have missed mypoint, Terry. Itis obviously notnecessary to use acomputer. I just findit ironic thatsomeone with a nicewebsite sellingrods over the Internetmight feel that"designing rodtapers with a computerwas a lot of BS". Thatstatement seems alittle harsh,that's all, sincemost of use whatevertools are at ourdisposal. -----OriginalMessage-----From: TERENCE ACKLAND brewer@teleport.com Cc:RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.edu Date: Wednesday,November 03, 1999 6:59PMSubject: Re: DonSchroeder; Was: Oldtimers If a guy says hefinds a computerunnecessary to design arod then hefinds itunnecessary. How isthat wrong.Making fishing polesmay be rocketscience to some but toothers it is not. Randy Brewer wrote: Just to fan theflames a little... I am puzzled as towhy someone wouldadvertise theirrods using a websiteand yet fail to seea computer'svalue when makingcalculations (that WASwhy they wereinvented). Perhapsusing a computer tocalculate compoundinterest or plotthe trajectory of aspacecraft is"BS", too! Hey, wasn'tthe Tacoma NarrowsBridge designedwithout the benefitof a computer?:-) I'm not saying thatusing a computeris for everyone.But I think Waynehasdone us all aservice by making hissoftware availableto those whochooseto use it. Icontinually see posts tothis list bypeople who are verypleased withWayne's tapers. Thatsays it all for me! -Randy Brewer -----OriginalMessage-----From: Frank Stetzer RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.edu Date: Wednesday,November 03, 19991:53 PMSubject: DonSchroeder; Was: Oldtimers Rodmaker DonSchroeder of JanesvilleWI spoke at our TUchapterlast week. (He quithis day job about5 years ago toconcentrateon rodmaking, aftersomebody ordered12 rods. He makes~45 rodsa year and doeslots ofrestorations.) Anyway,although he tapershis strips on amilling machine, hestill scrapes theenamel byhand with a utilityknife blade heldwith his fingers.His operationseems a curious mixof high tech andno tech. And he saiddesigning rod taperswitha computer was alot of BS :-) The good news, forme, was that mybest efforts don'treally LOOKthat bad comparedto Don's. Didn'thave a chance tocast them though. Don's got a webpage athttp://www.inwave.com/~schroede/ , FYI. ......................................................................Frank Stetzer"...a cheerfulcomrade is betterstetzer@uwm.eduthan a waterproofcoat and aEmployed by, butnot speaking forfoot-warmer."Henry Van Dyke,Univ ofWisconsin-Milwaukee, USA"Fisherman'sLuck", 1899. from cbogart@shentel.net Sat Nov 6 08:11:23 1999 "Rod Makers List Serve" boundary="_=_=_=IMA.BOUNDARY.HTML_4862704=_=_=_"Subject: Re: Cane spinning rod?????? --_=_=_=IMA.BOUNDARY.HTML_4862704=_=_=_ Bob First ask him what is he going to fish for - Spining rods are"weighted" byhow heavy the "Lure" is. If he will be using this for pan fish that is onething but ifhe is going for Large Bass or Pike and Muskie then you need somethingelse. Second - think of a Spining rod as a rejected fly rod. now you canmatchthe length with a weight to get the thing into the ball park. I would startwith a 4 wt Chris --Original Message Text--- I have a very good friend that wants me to make a special rod for him. Hewants a splitcane spinning rod, medium fast, 6 to 7 ft long. I have no idea whatsoever how to even begin to taper for a spinning rod. Does anyonehave any spinningrod tapers you could send me? This will be a once in a lifetime thing, done only because this good friend is going to continue to be a painin the buttuntil I do this for him, but I don't know where to begin. Thanks, in advance,Bob R.L. "Bob" Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Bamboo Fly Rodshttp://members.clnk.com/caneman/images/flystuff/caneindex.htm --_=_=_=IMA.BOUNDARY.HTML_4862704=_=_=_ Bob First ask him what is he going to fish for - Spining rods are "weighted"byhow heavy the "Lure" is. If he will be using this for pan fish that is onething butifhe is going for Large Bass or Pike and Muskie then you need somethingelse. Second - think of a Spining rod as a rejected fly rod. now you canmatchthe length with a weight to get the thing into the ball park. I would startwith a 4wt Chris --Original Message Text---From: Bob NunleyDate: Fri, 5 Nov 1999 05:35:08 - 0600 I have a very good friend that wants me to make a special rod for him. Hewants a splitcane spinning rod, medium fast, 6 to 7 ft long. I have no idea whatsoeverhow to evenbegin to taper for a spinning rod. Does anyone have any spinning rod tapersyou couldsend me? This will be a once in a lifetime thing, done only because thisgood friend isgoing to continue to be a pain in the butt until I do this for him, but I don'tknowwhere to begin. Thanks, in advance,Bob R.L. "Bob" Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Bamboo Fly Rodshttp://members.clnk.com/caneman/images/flystuff/caneindex.htm --_=_=_=IMA.BOUNDARY.HTML_4862704=_=_=_-- from Denali598@aol.com Sat Nov 6 08:26:40 1999 Subject: Found Bamboo Rod I am real new to bamboo and this list so let me thank all those who help in advance. I just found an old Bamboo rod but I cannot find any info on it. It has the name Horrock Cirrotson on it in some type of old English scriptthat is hard to read. It is a three piece 9.5 foot or so. Does this rod have a value? Can I fish with it? Or should I just hang it on the wall? All help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks again.Richard from leroyt@involved.com Sat Nov 6 09:00:28 1999 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61049U4500L450S0V35)with SMTP id com; Sat, 6 Nov 1999 06:58:21 -0800 Subject: Re: Differential screws; was: Planing Form boundary="----=_NextPart_000_003A_01BF2825.CD6AE920" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_003A_01BF2825.CD6AE920 Just a thought, how about trying Munro Rod Co. or Goldenwitch since they =are supplying forms? Leroy............... ------=_NextPart_000_003A_01BF2825.CD6AE920 =FF=FE=00==0D=00=0A==00=00=00=0D=00=0A==00=00=0D=00=0A==00=00=0D=00=0A==00=00=00=0D=00=0A==00=00=0D=00=0A==00=00=0D=00=0A==00=00=00J=00u=00s=00t=00 =00a=00 ==00t=00h=00o=00u=00g=00h=00t=00,=00 =00h=00o=00w=00 ==00a=00b=00o=00u=00t=00 =00t=00r=00y=00i=00n=00g=00 ==00M=00u=00n=00r=00o=00 =00=0D=00=0A==00R=00o=00d=00 =00C=00o=00.=00 =00o=00r=00 ==00G=00o=00l=00d=00e=00n=00w=00i=00t=00c=00h=00=00s=00i=00n=00c=00e=00 ==00t=00h=00e=00y=00 =00a=00r=00e=00 ==00s=00u=00p=00p=00l=00y=00i=00n=00g=00 ==00f=00o=00r=00m=00s=00?=00&=00n=00b=00s=00p=00;=00=00=0D=00=0A==00L=00e=00r=00o=00y=00.=00.=00.=00.=00.=00.=00.=00.=00.=00.=00.=00.=00.=00=.=00.=00=00=00=00=00=0D=00=0A==00------=_NextPart_000_003A_01BF2825.CD6AE920-- from leroyt@involved.com Sat Nov 6 09:08:48 1999 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61049U4500L450S0V35)with SMTP id com; Sat, 6 Nov 1999 07:06:43 -0800 "Rod Makers List Serve" Subject: Re: Cane spinning rod?????? boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0041_01BF2826.F88383A0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0041_01BF2826.F88383A0 Hurter's old book, the one that has a 20 plus word title, has various = Chris is right on about where to start as some of the guys that Steelhd =fish out here use a 9' 7wt for summers. Leroy....................... ------=_NextPart_000_0041_01BF2826.F88383A0 =FF=FE=00==0D=00=0A==00=00=00=0D=00=0A==00=00=0D=00=0A==00=00=0D=00=0A==00=00=00=0D=00=0A==00=00=0D=00=0A==00=00=0D=00=0A==00=00=00H=00u=00r=00t=00e=00r=00'=00s=00 ==00o=00l=00d=00 =00b=00o=00o=00k=00,=00 =00t=00h=00e=00=00o=00n=00e=00 ==00t=00h=00a=00t=00 =00h=00a=00s=00 =00a=00 =002=000=00=00=0D=00=0A==00p=00l=00u=00s=00 =00w=00o=00r=00d=00=00t=00i=00t=00l=00e=00,=00 ==00h=00a=00s=00 =00v=00a=00r=00i=00o=00u=00s=00=00t=00y=00p=00e=00s=00 ==00o=00f=00 =00t=00a=00p=00e=00r=00s=00 =00i=00n=00=00i=00t=00.=00 ==00=00=00=0D=00=0A==00=00=00C=00h=00r=00i=00s=00=00i=00s=00 ==00r=00i=00g=00h=00t=00 =00o=00n=00 =00a=00b=00o=00u=00t=00 ==00w=00h=00e=00r=00e=00 =00t=00o=00 =00s=00t=00a=00r=00t=00=00=0D=00=0A==00a=00s=00 =00s=00o=00m=00e=00 =00o=00f=00 =00t=00h=00e=00 ==00g=00u=00y=00s=00 =00t=00h=00a=00t=00=00S=00t=00e=00e=00l=00h=00d=00 ==00f=00i=00s=00h=00 =00o=00u=00t=00 =00h=00e=00r=00e=00=00u=00s=00e=00 ==00a=00 =009=00'=00 =007=00w=00t=00 =00f=00o=00r=00 ==00s=00u=00m=00m=00e=00r=00s=00.=00&=00n=00b=00s=00p=00;=00=00=0D=00=0A==00L=00e=00r=00o=00y=00.=00.=00.=00.=00.=00.=00.=00.=00.=00.=00.=00.=00.=00=.=00.=00.=00.=00.=00.=00.=00.=00.=00.=00=00=00=00=00==0D=00=0A==00------ =_NextPart_000_0041_01BF2826.F88383A0-- from HomeyDKlown@worldnet.att.net Sat Nov 6 09:26:33 1999 with ESMTP id ;Sat, 6 Nov 1999 15:25:58 +0000 Subject: Re: Found Bamboo Rod Richard, Sounds like you have a Horrocks Ibbotson. They were production rodsmade in upstate New York. If is't in good shape fish it and enjoy. Dennis Denali598@aol.com wrote: I am real new to bamboo and this list so let me thank all those who helpinadvance. I just found an old Bamboo rod but I cannot find any info on it. Ithas the name Horrock Cirrotson on it in some type of old English scriptthatis hard to read. It is a three piece 9.5 foot or so. Does this rod have avalue? Can I fish with it? Or should I just hang it on the wall? All helpwould be greatly appreciated. Thanks again.Richard from cadams46@juno.com Sat Nov 6 18:30:21 1999 19:30:10 EST Subject: Garrison Tapers Thanks guys for the advice on the 212. Was much appreciated.Sincerely,C.R. Adams from amcsmith@nlis.net Sat Nov 6 19:02:57 1999 Sat, 6 Nov 1999 20:02:36 -0500 Subject: Re: Guides skip,if you don't have a book you can startherechris smithhttp://www.fishdoc.com/rod101/rod101.htm At 09:56 PM 11/5/99 -0600, Skip Shorb wrote:I'm preparing to get guides for my first rod. How do you select guidesize?Skip from Denali598@aol.com Sun Nov 7 06:55:45 1999 Subject: Found Horrocks Ibbotson I wanted to thank all of you that had responded to my email about the Horrocks Ibbotson. I am now better informed about this rod and can make a better choice as to what to do with this rod and what to offer the manthat has it. Thanks.Richard from dmanders@telusplanet.net Sun Nov 7 09:39:23 1999 don") Sun, 7 Nov 1999 08:38:44 -0700 Subject: Digital Cameras To all those that responded, My thanks - just gotta figure out what I'm going to use the thing for andthen the choices get easier. catch ya' Don from GLohkamp@aol.com Sun Nov 7 13:50:00 1999 Subject: Re: Digital Cameras I was wondering if any have experience with the AGFA digital camera.Am having download problems. Gary Lohkamp from dellc@nextdim.com Sun Nov 7 15:28:39 1999 (SMTPD32-4.06) id AB7714CD020C; Sun, 07 Nov 1999 13:13:27 PST Subject: Re: Digital Cameras I also had down load problems with my camera until I learned to close allprograms before trying to download.DellDell & Marie CoppockThe Flyfisher& the Quilterhttp://www.trwebsites.com/dell/e-mail dellc@nextdim.comflyfisher@nextdim.com----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Digital Cameras I was wondering if any have experience with the AGFA digital camera.Amhaving download problems.Gary Lohkamp from pmgoodwin@earthlink.net Sun Nov 7 22:11:40 1999 "Rodmakers" Subject: Re: Guides One word of caution about the guide sizes at Manhattan Custom Tackle,I used their chart to order guides for an 8' 6wt I wrapped and the guideswere all about 2 sizes to big. Looked strange on a bamboo to have suchlargeguides. Paul ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Guides skip,if you don't have a book you can startherechris smithhttp://www.fishdoc.com/rod101/rod101.htm At 09:56 PM 11/5/99 -0600, Skip Shorb wrote:I'm preparing to get guides for my first rod. How do you select guidesize?Skip from EESweet@aol.com Mon Nov 8 01:06:12 1999 Subject: Angler's Workshop Ferrules Hi all, I bought truncated super swiss ferrules from Angler's Workshop, they're supposed to already be fitted, but I've just mounted them to my first rod, and they seem a bit tight. They go in about 2/3 to 3/4 of the way andstick. Is this just air pressure and nothing to worry about? Should I just push a little harder? Or do I need to break out the 1000 grit sandpaper and get to work? As always, TIA. Eric Sweet from watson@cape-consult.co.uk Mon Nov 8 06:33:17 1999 Subject: New website boundary="----=_NextPart_000_006C_01BF29E5.564252E0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_006C_01BF29E5.564252E0 All,Just launched my very first site - ranks close to having a baby I think!Any constructive thoughts, comments and additions would be gratefully =received. You can find it on www.watsonsrods.co.uk.Special thanks to Ray Gould and Lorraine at Amato Books for the =inclusion of some of Ray's book.Thanks ------=_NextPart_000_006C_01BF29E5.564252E0 All,Just launched my very first site - ranks close to = baby I think!Any constructive thoughts, comments and additions would= Special thanks to Ray Gould and Lorraine at = Thanks ------=_NextPart_000_006C_01BF29E5.564252E0-- from utzerath@execpc.com Mon Nov 8 06:34:40 1999 Subject: Re: Re: guides boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0004_01BF29B3.287F9D40" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0004_01BF29B3.287F9D40 I've had a lot of conversation about the Manhattan (but they moved) =Custom Tackle guide size recommendations, but not on cane before. The =general consensus in the world of graphite seems to be that if it casts =5 feet further, go with it. In this regard, I'm glad that MCT did what =they did. To summarize: MCT uses the conventional number of guides with 1 or 2 at=the tip down to a 5 or 6 at the stripper(s) which can be as large as =16mm. Their recommendation for #3/4 is about a size down. IMHO the tiptop and the stripper are the keys. Unless you are blessed =with a source of tiptops with small loops (????) a 1 snake is about as =small as I like to go. Similarly I pick the biggest stripper that works =(probably 10 or 12 for cane) and do a trial layout of snakes and a =static stress for placement. If you can find the material to achieve a =classic look, bless you. Just my 2c. ------=_NextPart_000_0004_01BF29B3.287F9D40 I've had a lot of conversationabout = Manhattan (but they moved) Custom Tackle guide size recommendations,but = MCT did what they did. To summarize: MCT uses the conventional number of= 1 or 2 at the tip down to a 5 or 6 at the stripper(s) which can be as = down. = you are blessed with a source of tiptops with small loops (????) a 1 = works (probably 10 or 12 for cane) and do a trial layout of snakes and a = look, bless you. Just my 2c. ------=_NextPart_000_0004_01BF29B3.287F9D40-- from Eastkoyfly@aol.com Mon Nov 8 07:28:39 1999 Subject: Re: Angler's Workshop Ferrules I had the same thing happen to me. I just buffed the male end very little with 1000 grit paper, be veeerrrry careful and check the fit often from tjtrodmaker@yahoo.com Mon Nov 8 07:39:15 1999 1999 05:39:12 PST Subject: making planing form greetings! i'm sorry i must have not been listeninggood. some one mentioned a website that has how-toinstructions for planing forms. would soone re-emailthat address to me. thankyou! timothy ====="Gooda' morning mister bear"__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com from watson@cape-consult.co.uk Mon Nov 8 07:39:37 1999 Mon, 8 Nov 1999 13:39:26 GMT Subject: Re: Angler's Workshop Ferrules IMHO I think that 1000 is too coarse for this.I would use 0000 or 00000 wire wool and bring it down that way. It willundoubtably take a little longer but the anguish at finding you've gone toofar is too hard to bear!!T.----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Angler's Workshop Ferrules I had the same thing happen to me. I just buffed the male end very littlewith 1000 grit paper, be veeerrrry careful and check the fit often from stpete@netten.net Mon Nov 8 08:25:15 1999 Mon, 8 Nov 1999 09:25:08 -0600 Subject: Re: making planing form Timothy, Go to the Rodmaker's webpage. from there, click on Tips, Tools & FAQS.Once there, click on Thomas Penrose's page. You'll have to 'go home'once you are on his page, but from there you can get to the MakingPlaning Forms page. If you still have trouble, let me know and I'llsearch out the actual address. Rick C. timothy troester wrote: greetings! i'm sorry i must have not been listeninggood. some one mentioned a website that has how-toinstructions for planing forms. would soone re-emailthat address to me. thankyou! timothy ====="Gooda' morning mister bear"__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com from sshorb@ozip.net Mon Nov 8 08:58:07 1999 Mon, 8 Nov 1999 08:58:34 -0600 Subject: Re: Guides Thanks to all of you that contributed to my education on guide sizes.I've chosen the following points to direct my efforts concerning guidesize:1. The sizes (and placement) wrapped on the original rod, if listed.2. Silk line will probably use a size smaller than synthetic line.3. The various charts available on the net and in print, allowing forthe fact that the charts available on the net are usually for graphiterods (may be a size or two too large).4. Personal taste, temporarily install and try various combinationsuntil I'm satisfied with the results.5. The tip top size may affect the size selection, why use a guide thatis smaller than the tip top. 6. At least three standard sets, based on line size, e.g..: 2-3, 4-5,and 6 and up, can probably be developed for a specific range of rodlengths.Skip from brewer@teleport.com Mon Nov 8 10:03:45 1999 "hamachi"via SMTP by relay1.teleport.com, id smtpdAAA0nIqDV; Mon Nov 8 08:03:361999 Subject: Re: Digital Cameras I ditto that recommendation. The Sony Mavica (not the bottom of the line,but the next one up) I have access to is very nice. I particularly like thefact that it stores images on floppy disks, instead of a custom card. Thisgives me unlimited storage, and I can archive the pics on the floppies andload them on any PC. It takes a nice picture, and 1 minute movies withsound, too. ----- Original Message ----- Subject: RE: Digital Cameras I for one like the quality and convenience of the Sony Mavicas. The higherres modes and macro options take some good pics. I can send you a coupleifyou'd like. You can get into one at just over $500, I think. Luckily, Ihave access to one at the school I teach at.Bob At 02:01 PM 11/5/99 -0500, you wrote:You might want to contact the webmaster of The Virtual Fly Box. Herecentlyposted a similar message to his list, and my understanding is that he didapretty comprehensive product comparison, and made a purchase based onthat.The website is http://www.virtualflybox.com Ian ScottPoisoning Our Water - Save the environment by killing the trout. It'shappening and its government sanctioned.http://flyfishing.about.com/library/weekly/aa101899.htm -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu AndersenSent: November 5, 1999 8:57 AM Subject: Digital Cameras First off let me say that this is not rod building but I need some help. Guys, Am interested in getting a digital camera. Price is, of course,importantas well as service, battery life, accessories etc. Anybody out there gotany ideas where to start to get some info. regards, Don Bob Mauluccibob@downandacross.com from rsgould@cmc.net Mon Nov 8 10:08:48 1999 Subject: Re: Angler's Workshop Ferrules Hi Eric,If you haven't tried it already, a little coating of light machine oilbefore working down the fit can make the difference.Ray----- Original Message ----- Subject: Angler's Workshop Ferrules Hi all, I bought truncated super swiss ferrules from Angler's Workshop, they'resupposed to already be fitted, but I've just mounted them to my first rod,and they seem a bit tight. They go in about 2/3 to 3/4 of the way andstick.Is this just air pressure and nothing to worry about? Should I just pushalittle harder? Or do I need to break out the 1000 grit sandpaper and gettowork? As always, TIA. Eric Sweet from k5vkq@ix.netcom.com Mon Nov 8 11:11:04 1999 1999 12:11:03 -0500 Subject: Re: Re: making planing form While you are there(tips and tools and FAQs), be sure to also click on'Bruce Connersgreat page". Bruce's page contains instructions for a wooden form. Regards,Onisk5vkq@ix.netcom.comstpete@netten.net wrote:Timothy,Go to the Rodmaker's webpage. from there, click on Tips, Tools & FAQS.Once there, click on Thomas Penrose's page. You'll have to 'go home'once you are on his page, but from there you can get to the MakingPlaning Forms page. If you still have trouble, let me know and I'llsearch out the actual address. Rick C. timothy troester wrote: greetings! i'm sorry i must have not been listeninggood. some one mentioned a website that has how-toinstructions for planing forms. would soone re-emailthat address to me. thankyou! timothy ====="Gooda' morning mister bear"__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com from flyman35@home.com Mon Nov 8 11:41:05 1999 (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with ESMTP Subject: RE: making planing forms You can check out Bruce Connor or Thomas Penrose's page throughrodmakers. If your looking for plans and written instructions forwooden forms, I can send you a set via email that includes pics. i useda slightly modified version of Bruce Connors. Contact me off list if youare interested. Matt from oossg@vbe.com Mon Nov 8 11:44:46 1999 Subject: Cane Handles Hello list, I am interested in having a cane handle on my next rod project. Cananyone give me some guidance or point me in the right direction? Scott from mcdowellc@lanecc.edu Mon Nov 8 12:15:43 1999 10:20:14 PST Subject: Walker reels Is there a Walker fly reel other then the A.F. Walker's that are worth quite a lot? My Dad, who knows almost nothing about fly reels, said hesaw a Walker fly reel at an antique shop for a very low price. It was described to me as black and silver with a wider spool then typical. Yeah, I'm salivating too. I won't be able to get there until Thursday. I assume it's some other Walker, anyone know of cheap Walker's. Thanks. Chrismcdowellc@lanecc.edu from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Mon Nov 8 15:14:22 1999 Mon, 8 Nov 1999 13:14:13 -0800 Subject: Re: Walker reels Chris,You didn't say where the antique shop was. Why not? :-) Harry CHRISTOPHER C MCDOWELL wrote: Is there a Walker fly reel other then the A.F. Walker's that are worthquite a lot? My Dad, who knows almost nothing about fly reels, said hesawa Walker fly reel at an antique shop for a very low price. It wasdescribed to me as black and silver with a wider spool then typical.Yeah,I'm salivating too. I won't be able to get there until Thursday. I assumeit's some other Walker, anyone know of cheap Walker's. Thanks. Chrismcdowellc@lanecc.edu from bob@downandacross.com Mon Nov 8 18:08:32 1999 (envelope- from bob@downandacross.com) Subject: rod one HI all:My nodeless Driggs is coming along well. I would like to thank everyone their help and support so far. One tip I found so far was to use a chisel to get the bulk of the splice done and then plane it. Good advice from the archives. Of my 6 strips so far, I have two strips that I roughed down to .060 bigger than my largest butt dimension. The angles are not dead on. Should I make up two more strips or will I be able to easily correct them when I take off more cane? Is the problem more likely to be from incorrect plane angle during the cut or form a bend in the strip? I assumed that the strip was just slightly bent because of its 4' length. Thanks, Bob Mauluccibob@downandacross.com from HARMS1@prodigy.net Mon Nov 8 19:28:36 1999 Mon, 8 Nov 1999 20:28:30 -0500 Subject: Re: Cane Handles boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0011_01BF2A27.400DCA80" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0011_01BF2A27.400DCA80 Scott, Do you mean the rattan material that is wound on over the cork? This =can be purchased, I believe, in most craft stores--or, alternatively, =through specialty wicker/rattan furniture dealers. cheers, Bill Sent: Monday, November 08, 1999 9:40 AMSubject: Cane Handles Hello list, I am interested in having a cane handle on my next rod project. Cananyone give me some guidance or point me in the right direction? Scott ------=_NextPart_000_0011_01BF2A27.400DCA80 Scott, Do you mean the = craft stores--or, alternatively, through specialty wicker/rattan = dealers. Bill ----- Original Message ----- ScottGrady = = Sent: Monday, November 08, 1999= AMSubject: Cane HandlesHello list,I am interested in having a cane = the right direction?Scott ------=_NextPart_000_0011_01BF2A27.400DCA80-- from TSmithwick@aol.com Mon Nov 8 19:43:44 1999 Subject: Re: rod one rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu In a message dated 11/9/99 12:09:51 AM, bob@downandacross.com wrote: In a message dated 11/9/99 12:09:51 AM, you wrote: Bob - If the strip is just slightly bent, the trouble is in your technique. You should have enough material to clean this up, but it depends on how far off you are. If you are close, you may be able to bring things to right just off, you will need to tilt the plane in the proper direction for a few passes to regain control. If you really messed up, try whittling the angles with a knife. It sound crude, but sometimes a miracle save is possible. Guess howI know all this. BTW, the chisel suggestion was mine. Tony Young suggested trying a shipbuilders slick. The slick is a long, two handed chisel. I have used one in the past to chamfer masts and oars for small boats. I found an oldchisel with a long enough handle to use it two handed. Tony is right, it's the way to go. I honestly believe you could develop enough skill that the planewould not even be necessary. from EESweet@aol.com Mon Nov 8 21:14:34 1999 Subject: Re: rod one Hi Bob, I read that tip about the chisel somewhere also, and can't thank whoever wrote it enough, it cut the time to do the splices by 75% or so. Not to mention the effort. I just finished putting the ferrules on my first blank, so this is definately not the voice of experience talking, but I found that for me, getting the angles right depended entirely on plane angle. I had a couple of stripswith significant sweeps in them and they came out fine...well, as well as the others at least. I also found that even some of your straight strips will end up curving as you plane them, so you can either stop and straightenthem or just deal with it. I would think you could correct the angle on the two strips that are off, taking thin shavings and checking your progress often. Good LuckEric HI all:My nodeless Driggs is coming along well. I would like to thank everyone their help and support so far. One tip I found so far was to use a chisel to get the bulk of the splice done and then plane it. Good advice from the archives. Of my 6 strips so far, I have two strips that I roughed down to .060 bigger than my largest butt dimension. The angles are not dead on. Should Imake up two more strips or will I be able to easily correct them when I take off more cane? Is the problem more likely to be from incorrect plane angle during the cut or form a bend in the strip? I assumed that the strip was just slightly bent because of its 4' length. Thanks, Bob Mauluccibob@downandacross.com from rosegene@uswest.net Mon Nov 8 22:40:43 1999 (207.225.88.201) Subject: Re: Angler's Workshop Ferrules i like to use a small piece of hard arkansas stone when i get that closeto the fit. I agree, there is just too much work invested to go beyond. from TSmithwick@aol.com Mon Nov 8 22:55:16 1999 Subject: Re: rod one rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu OBTW - I should have said that the way to avoid this problem is to takesome extra time at the rough planing stage and make sure the angles are correctat the beginning. It's much easier to maintain them than it is to correct them. In general, you will find that extra time spent at the beginning of the process will be more than repaid later on. from EESweet@aol.com Mon Nov 8 22:58:11 1999 Subject: Re: Angler's Workshop Ferrules Well, after all the voices of caution I grabbed a piece of 2000 grit automotive sandpaper and 10 very careful minutes later had ferrules thatfit. They're still pretty tight, but that's better than loose I suppose. Thanks to everyone for the advice. Eric i like to use a small piece of hard arkansas stone when i get that closeto the fit. I agree, there is just too much work invested to go beyond. from scan.oest@post.tele.dk Tue Nov 9 01:43:26 1999 (InterMail vM.4.01.02.00 201-229-116) with SMTP +0100 Subject: Sv: Walker reels Chris wrote Is there a Walker fly reel other then the A.F. Walker's that are worth quite a lot? My Dad, who knows almost nothing about fly reels, said hesaw a Walker fly reel at an antique shop for a very low price. It was described to me as black and silver with a wider spool then typical. Yeah, I'm salivating too. I won't be able to get there until Thursday. I assume it's some other Walker, anyone know of cheap Walker's. Thanks. Chrismcdowellc@lanecc.edu Chris Could it be a trotting reel? Since trotting is very much an englishpastime,perhaps one of our brit listers could provide some answers? regards, Carsten from utzerath@execpc.com Tue Nov 9 06:29:16 1999 Subject: Flaming patterns? I'm thinking about my third cane rod and would like to experiment withflaming; can any offer some suggestions? I've not flamed (bamboo) before and have only examined a handful of verynice rods that were. But I have the idea in my head that I'd like to shadethe blank in some systematic pattern, i.e. a light butt darkening towardthetip or darker between guides. Does anyone do this and have some advice? Since you can't flame the intact culm to get a pattern to continue acrossflats (or can you?), how can I flame the staggered staves without burningup the edges completely? I'm thinking about bundling the staves andpackingsome kind of grout into the gaps. I should just try it but it takes so longto see the result. Thanks in advance. from caneman@clnk.com Tue Nov 9 09:21:30 1999 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35)with SMTP id com for ;Tue, 9 Nov 1999 09:20:06 -0600 Subject: sanding sections boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0023_01BF2A93.70099AE0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0023_01BF2A93.70099AE0 Every since my first rod, I always thought it was very important =to sand my completed sections after scraping the glue and string off to =the point that it looked "polished" before I started varnishing. I =always started with 600, then 1000, then 1200... Well, with all the talk =and demonstrations of planing wet strips at the SRG, I started =thinking.... (yeah, dangerous, I know, but it happens sometimes) "If wet =planing works so well, then why not wet sanding?". So, yesterday, I =glued up a set of 6 unmatched scrap strips and gave it a try this = Only problem I can see with it is that it is just way too easy. =I used just enough water to carry off dust created by the sanding of the =enamel and when I was finished, which was about half the time it =normally takes me to sand a section, it shined like a new penny... just = At this point my only concern was "How much water penetrated the =bamboo?" Well, I knew that even though it probably felt dry, that it =may have retained a little water, so I marked and measured it every 5 =inches, recorded these measurements on all flats (which I marked for =reference) and put it in my drying box (the one I use for varnish at =100*F) Left it for about 2 hours. I just got it out about 45 minutes =ago, remeasured all the marked areas and there was absolutely NO =SHRINKAGE!!! The section maintained it's size without deviation at each = Next step was to see if there was really any residual moisture =that would affect my varnish, so I taped a piece of string to it, and =ran it through my varnishing setup... Of course the varnish is still =wet, but it didn't go on any different than it does on my sections that =I normally dry sand. If it does screw up as it cures, I will post more, =if not, you won't hear from me on this again... it looks like it is =going to do great. Question... Does doing stuff like this mean I have WAY too much time =on my hands? LOL Later,BobR.L. "Bob" Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Bamboo Fly Rodshttp://members.clnk.com/caneman/images/flystuff/caneindex.htm ------=_NextPart_000_0023_01BF2A93.70099AE0 always thought it was very important to sand my completed sections after= 600, then 1000, then 1200... Well, with all the talk and demonstrations = planing wet strips at the SRG, I started thinking.... (yeah, dangerous, = but it happens sometimes) "If wet planing works so well, then why = strips and gave it a try this morning. = dust created by the sanding of the enamel and when I was finished, which= about half the time it normally takes me to sand a section, it shined = was "How much water penetrated the = Well, I knew that even though it probably felt dry, that it may have = little water, so I marked and measured it every 5 inches, recorded these = measurements on all flats (which I marked for reference) and put it in = box (the one I use for varnish at 100*F) Left it for about 2 = got it out about 45 minutes ago, remeasured all the marked areas and = if = was really any residual moisture that would affect my varnish, so I = piece of string to it, and ran it through my varnishing setup... Of = varnish is still wet, but it didn't go on any different than it does on = post more, if not, you won't hear from me on this again... it looks like = going to do great. LOL Later,Bob Bamboo = Rodsht=tp://members.clnk.com/caneman/images/flystuff/caneindex.htm ------=_NextPart_000_0023_01BF2A93.70099AE0-- from mcdowellc@lanecc.edu Tue Nov 9 10:34:27 1999 8:39:18 PST Subject: re: Flaming patterns? Jim, You should be able to develope a specific flaming pattern if you use a 3x3 node spacing. Stagger the halves or sixths of the split culm appropriately and then flame evenly across the area you want dark. Chrismcdowellc@lanecc.edu-------------Original Text I'm thinking about my third cane rod and would like to experiment withflaming; can any offer some suggestions? I've not flamed (bamboo) before and have only examined a handful of verynice rods that were. But I have the idea in my head that I'd like to shadethe blank in some systematic pattern, i.e. a light butt darkening toward thetip or darker between guides. Does anyone do this and have some advice? Since you can't flame the intact culm to get a pattern to continue acrossflats (or can you?), how can I flame the staggered staves without burningup the edges completely? I'm thinking about bundling the staves and packingsome kind of grout into the gaps. I should just try it but it takes so longto see the result. Thanks in advance. from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Tue Nov 9 10:41:46 1999 Tue, 9 Nov 1999 08:41:34 -0800 Subject: Re: sanding sections boundary="------------F44397206B8BF65A95DB9BDD" --------------F44397206B8BF65A95DB9BDD Bob,Gotta coupla questions: How much enamel do you leave on untilafter gluing- all of it, most of it, or just a little? Did you thinkabout weighing the blank before and after wet sanding. An accuratescale would surely tell the tale. Does wet sanding give you particularadvantages? Is it easier to sand? Paper last longer? Better finish?Just curious.Like you, the SRG started me thinking about lots of things.Someone asked me if I had any trouble with the poly-varnish I use; and Ihad to admit that I did. Sometimes I get little spots, kinda likefish-eyes, where the poly just doesn't cover.Like you, I've always made the blank almost shiny before puttingit in the dip tube. Now I'm wondering -- Can it be that I get thefinish so smooth that the poly-varnish can't stick? Should I insteadsand to 320, or 400 grit, then stop?Well I don't have as much time on my hands to experiment as youdo. But I've got a rod almost ready for varnishing that I only tookdown to 400 grit smoooothness. Guess I'll know in a week or so if thathelps the varnish stick any better. Harry Bob Nunley wrote: Every since my first rod, I always thought it was veryimportant to sand my completed sections after scraping the glue andstring off to the point that it looked "polished" before I startedvarnishing. I always started with 600, then 1000, then 1200... Well,with all the talk and demonstrations of planing wet strips at the SRG,I started thinking.... (yeah, dangerous, I know, but it happenssometimes) "If wet planing works so well, then why not wet sanding?".So, yesterday, I glued up a set of 6 unmatched scrap strips and gaveit a try this morning. Only problem I can see with it is thatit is just way too easy. I used just enough water to carry off dustcreated by the sanding of the enamel and when I was finished, whichwas about half the time it normally takes me to sand a section, itshined like a new penny... just as nice as if it were done dry.At this point my only concern was "How much water penetrated thebamboo?" Well, I knew that even though it probably felt dry, that itmay have retained a little water, so I marked and measured it every 5inches, recorded these measurements on all flats (which I marked forreference) and put it in my drying box (the one I use for varnish at100*F) Left it for about 2 hours. I just got it out about 45 minutesago, remeasured all the marked areas and there was absolutely NOSHRINKAGE!!! The section maintained it's size without deviation ateach stations that I had measured before. Next step was to seeif there was really any residual moisture that would affect myvarnish, so I taped a piece of string to it, and ran it through myvarnishing setup... Of course the varnish is still wet, but it didn'tgo on any different than it does on my sections that I normally drysand. If it does screw up as it cures, I will post more, if not, youwon't hear from me on this again... it looks like it is going to dogreat. Question... Does doing stuff like this mean I have WAY toomuch time on my hands? LOL Later,BobR.L. "Bob" Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Bamboo Fly Rodshttp://members.clnk.com/caneman/images/flystuff/caneindex.htm --------------F44397206B8BF65A95DB9BDD Bob, How much enamel do you leave on until after gluing- all of it, most of started trouble SometimesI get little spots, kinda like fish-eyes, where the poly just doesn't cover. made wondering -- Can it be that I get the finish so smooth that the poly-varnish much ready for varnishing that I only took down to 400 grit Guess I'll know in a week or so if that helps the varnish stick any better. Bob Nunley wrote: Every since my first rod, I always thought it was very important to sandmy completed sections after scraping the glue and string off to the point startedwith 600, then 1000, then 1200... Well, with all the talk anddemonstrationsof planing wet strips at the SRG, I started thinking.... (yeah, dangerous,I know, but it happens sometimes) "If wet planing works so well, then why scrap strips and gave it a try this used just enough water to carry off dust created by the sanding of theenamel and when I was finished, which was about half the time itnormallytakes me to sand a section, it shined like a new penny... just as nice thispoint my only concern was "How much water penetrated the Well, I knew that even though it probably felt dry, that it may haveretaineda little water, so I marked and measured it every 5 inches, recorded thesemeasurements on all flats (which I marked for reference) and put it inmy drying box (the one I use for varnish at 100*F) Left it for about 2 maintained it's size without deviation at each stations that I hadmeasured if there was really any residual moisture that would affect my varnish,so I taped a piece of string to it, and ran it through my varnishing setup...Of course the varnish is still wet, but it didn't go on any different than up as it cures, I will post more, if not, you won't hear from me on thisagain... it looks like it is going to do great. Question... Does LOL Custom Split Bamboo Fly Rods http://members.clnk.com/caneman/images/flystuff/caneindex.htm --------------F44397206B8BF65A95DB9BDD-- from tjtrodmaker@yahoo.com Tue Nov 9 10:47:43 1999 1999 08:47:36 PST Subject: re: Flaming patterns? chris, this is a good idea. why didn't i think ofthat?(no answer necessary) is this idea of your owninvention? timothy --- CHRISTOPHER C MCDOWELL wrote:Jim, You should be able to develope a specific flamingpattern if you use a 3x3 node spacing. Stagger the halves or sixths of thesplit culm appropriately and then flame evenly across the area you want dark. Chrismcdowellc@lanecc.edu ====="Gooda' morning mister bear"__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com from caneman@clnk.com Tue Nov 9 10:58:46 1999 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35)with SMTP id com for ;Tue, 9 Nov 1999 10:57:17 -0600 Subject: Fw: sanding sections boundary="----=_NextPart_000_009F_01BF2AA1.0341AC00" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_009F_01BF2AA1.0341AC00 Harry,1. When I set my forms I allow a particular amount for my enamel =removal and do not remove anyprior to gluing. 2. Don't have a scale that would accurately enough measure the =difference in weight of a section thatsmall. Just went by the measurements at 5 inch stations. I =don't think, no more water than was exposedto the section that it would have "soaked" in an appreciable =amount, anyways. 3. Advantages... Using water, I sanded all six flats with one =piece of 600 and it was working just asgood on flat #6 as it was on flat #1. I think I could have used =that same piece to sand three rod sectionsbefore moving on to my next grit. MUCH easier to sand. VERY = was left after scraping. The enamel came off very very easy. =And the finish was fantastic. Now, as far as getting the finish so smooth that the varnish won't =stick... Well, I don't know, because when I am finished with my sanding =process, I usually hand rub a coat of tung oil onto my sections so they =won't absorb any moisture out of the air before I get them to the =varnishing stage. Now, prior to doing this, I put them in a "drying =box" which is nothing more than a wooden box I made with a 100 watt =light bulb in the bottom, and a vent (old bar-b-que type vent) on top to =regulate the temp inside. This helps drive out any residual moisture in =the sections before sealing them off. In any case, with the tung oil =base, I have never had any trouble with varnish sticking to or staying =on my rods. Also, I put three coats of varnish on every rod... each one =I watersand away to nearly nothing. These are basically what you might =call "sealer coats" They fill any microscopic voids, etc., I sand these =coats with 600 grit so there is no trouble with each successive coat =adhering to the previous one. When I am finished, I hit the LAST coat =with 1200, then polish it with 3M Perfecta II polish. At this point, =the varnish is actually not much thicker, if as thick, as a single coat, =and is very stable and extremely smoothe. the dash" rod. Was kinda embarrassed with the way it looked after =seeing how everyone else actually took care of their personal rods LOL. =Looks a LOT different now! cya later,Bob -----Original Message-----From: Harry Boyd Cc: Rod Makers List Serve Date: Tuesday, November 09, 1999 10:40 AMSubject: Re: sanding sections Gotta coupla questions: How much enamel do you leave on =until after gluing- all of it, most of it, or just a little? Did you =think about weighing the blank before and after wet sanding. An =accurate scale would surely tell the tale. Does wet sanding give you =particular advantages? Is it easier to sand? Paper last longer? = Like you, the SRG started me thinking about lots of things. =Someone asked me if I had any trouble with the poly-varnish I use; and I =had to admit that I did. Sometimes I get little spots, kinda like = Like you, I've always made the blank almost shiny before =putting it in the dip tube. Now I'm wondering -- Can it be that I get =the finish so smooth that the poly-varnish can't stick? Should I = Well I don't have as much time on my hands to experiment as =you do. But I've got a rod almost ready for varnishing that I only took =down to 400 grit smoooothness. Guess I'll know in a week or so if that = Every since my first rod, I always thought it was very =important to sand my completed sections after scraping the glue and =string off to the point that it looked "polished" before I started =varnishing. I always started with 600, then 1000, then 1200... Well, =with all the talk and demonstrations of planing wet strips at the SRG, I =started thinking.... (yeah, dangerous, I know, but it happens sometimes) ="If wet planing works so well, then why not wet sanding?". So, =yesterday, I glued up a set of 6 unmatched scrap strips and gave it a =try this morning. Only problem I can see with it is that it is =just way too easy. I used just enough water to carry off dust created = half the time it normally takes me to sand a section, it shined like a =new penny... just as nice as if it were done dry. At this point =my only concern was "How much water penetrated the bamboo?" Well, I =knew that even though it probably felt dry, that it may have retained a =little water, so I marked and measured it every 5 inches, recorded these =measurements on all flats (which I marked for reference) and put it in =my drying box (the one I use for varnish at 100*F) Left it for about 2 =hours. I just got it out about 45 minutes ago, remeasured all the =marked areas and there was absolutely NO SHRINKAGE!!! The section =maintained it's size without deviation at each stations that I had =measured before. Next step was to see if there was really any =residual moisture that would affect my varnish, so I taped a piece of =string to it, and ran it through my varnishing setup... Of course the =varnish is still wet, but it didn't go on any different than it does on =my sections that I normally dry sand. If it does screw up as it cures, =I will post more, if not, you won't hear from me on this again... it =looks like it is going to do great. Question... Does doing stuff like =this mean I have WAY too much time on my hands? LOL Later,BobR.L. "Bob"= http://members.clnk.com/caneman/images/flystuff/caneindex.htm ------=_NextPart_000_009F_01BF2AA1.0341AC00 Harry, set my forms I allow a particular amount for my enamel removal and do = any to gluing. Don't have a scale that would accurately enough measure the difference = of a section that think, no more water than was exposed the section that it would have "soaked" in an appreciable = anyways. and it was working just as to sand three rod sections = little effort removed the tell-tale glue that = finish was fantastic. = finished with my sanding process, I usually hand = prior to doing this, I put them in a "drying box" which is = more than a wooden box I made with a 100 watt light bulb in the bottom, = helps drive out any residual moisture in the sections before sealing = varnish on every rod... each one I watersand away to nearly = microscopic voids, etc., I sand these coats with 600 grit so there is no = finished, I hit the LAST coat with 1200, then polish it with 3M Perfecta = thick, as a single coat, and is very stable and extremely =smoothe. way, I have, since the SRG, stripped and refinished my "on the = = different now! cya later,Bob -----Original = = Makers List Serve <rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= Tuesday, November 09, 1999 10:40 AMSubject: Re: = How much enamel do you leave on until after gluing- all of it, most = I get little spots, kinda like fish-eyes, where the poly just = = wondering -- Can it be that I get the finish so smooth that the = ready for varnishing that I only took down to 400 grit = Guess I'll know in a week or so if that helps the varnish stick any = always thought it was very important to sand my completed = demonstrations of planing wet strips at the SRG, I started = (yeah, dangerous, I know, but it happens sometimes) "If wet = glued up a set of 6 unmatched scrap strips and gave it a try = water to carry off dust created by the sanding of the enamel and = was finished, which was about half the time it normally takes me = a section, it shined like a new penny... just as nice as if it = dry, that it may have retained a little water, so I marked and = it every 5 inches, recorded these measurements on all flats = marked for reference) and put it in my drying box (the one I use = about 45 minutes ago, remeasured all the marked areas and there = if there was really any residual moisture that would affect my = so I taped a piece of string to it, and ran it through my = setup... Of course the varnish is still wet, but it didn't go on = different than it does on my sections that I normally dry = it does screw up as it cures, I will post more, if not, you = Question... Does doing stuff like this mean I have = ht=tp://members.clnk.com/caneman/images/flystuff/caneindex.htm ------=_NextPart_000_009F_01BF2AA1.0341AC00-- from mcdowellc@lanecc.edu Tue Nov 9 11:00:13 1999 9:05:03 PST Subject: re: Flaming patterns? This is a good opportunity for me to say that virtually everything I've learned was through the guidance of A.J. Thramer. I was very fortunate to learn rodmaking hands on from him. Chrismcdowellc@lanecc.edu -------------Original Text chris, this is a good idea. why didn't i think ofthat?(no answer necessary) is this idea of your owninvention? timothy --- CHRISTOPHER C MCDOWELL wrote:Jim, You should be able to develope a specific flamingpattern if you use a 3x3 node spacing. Stagger the halves or sixths of thesplit culm appropriately and then flame evenly across the area you want dark. Chrismcdowellc@lanecc.edu ====="Gooda' morning mister bear"__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com from tjtrodmaker@yahoo.com Tue Nov 9 11:20:05 1999 1999 09:20:02 PST Subject: Re: Fw: sanding sections greetings harry! i have had some of those fish eyespots. i've usually found a speck of something when ilook close thru a magnifier. the speck is usually toosmall for the resulting marr, but there it is. itseems to me some things don't show up until the firstcoat of varnish. i now make a practice ofreinspecting after the first varnish and am preparedto do some more sanding if need be(i've made a mentalnote and added a step). this has taken care of thefish-eye syndrom for me. i usually don't sand beyond400 grit. i have on occasion used 600. timothytroester ====="Gooda' morning mister bear"__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com from andrew_harsanyi@ibi.com Tue Nov 9 11:20:18 1999 0500 Subject: RE: sanding sections I've only done one rod, but I like sanding most (not all) off right beforefinal planing. I set the strip in the forms enamel up and sand with a flatblock using 220. This flattens the enamel side so it fits better in theforms, it's closer to actual width, and it minimizes how much sanding(withfiner paper)is needed after gluing. With Epon, and maybe other glues, Idon't know, extra glue removal is very easy. Seems to work for me, thoughothers may disagree... from caneman@clnk.com Tue Nov 9 11:28:37 1999 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35)with SMTP id com for ;Tue, 9 Nov 1999 11:27:12 -0600 Subject: stuff! boundary="----=_NextPart_000_00BD_01BF2AA5.314D8E80" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_00BD_01BF2AA5.314D8E80 Anyone out there make a lot of 3 piece rods? If so, mail me off list. =I think I have some ferrules you might be interested in. Too small for =what I do. Maybe a little trading! *S* Later,Bob R.L. "Bob" Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Bamboo Fly Rodshttp://members.clnk.com/caneman/images/flystuff/caneindex.htm ------=_NextPart_000_00BD_01BF2AA5.314D8E80 Later,Bob Rodsht=tp://members.clnk.com/caneman/images/flystuff/caneindex.htm ------=_NextPart_000_00BD_01BF2AA5.314D8E80-- from Grhghlndr@aol.com Tue Nov 9 12:09:54 1999 Subject: Re: sanding sections Harry,When I do a gun stock I always get the finish of the wood to the pointwhere it is so shiny that a tree frog would slide down it. I have no trouble with my finishes. It sounds to me like you have oil from your hands on the surface of yoyr cans. When I get close to my final sanding stages i startto wear surgical or cotton gloves so I don't contaminate it with skin oils.Bret from grandriverangler@sprint.ca Tue Nov 9 16:36:49 1999 Subject: need a taper for a good steelhead rod boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0035_01BF2AD8.E2C7A320" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0035_01BF2AD8.E2C7A320 Does anyone have a taper for a 9' 7wt Granger or Heddon that I might try = Would like the rod to be about 9' in lenght. Any help would be appreciated. Mark Babiy ------=_NextPart_000_0035_01BF2AD8.E2C7A320 Does anyone have a taper for a 9' 7wt Granger or = lenght. Any help would be appreciated. Mark Babiy ------=_NextPart_000_0035_01BF2AD8.E2C7A320-- from watson@cape-consult.co.uk Tue Nov 9 16:56:30 1999 Subject: Enamel boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0041_01BF2B05.8DB148A0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0041_01BF2B05.8DB148A0 What does everyone use to get the enamel off the culms.I'm making some float cases from 3-4" stock and would like some advice.ThanksTim. ------=_NextPart_000_0041_01BF2B05.8DB148A0 culms.I'm making some float cases from 3-4" stock and = some advice.ThanksTim. ------=_NextPart_000_0041_01BF2B05.8DB148A0-- from mcdowellc@lanecc.edu Tue Nov 9 17:27:19 1999 15:32:22 PST Subject: re: need a taper for a good steelhead rod Mark, I have a 9' 7 wt. Phillipson Premium I can take a taper from. The rod is marked at 5 5/8 oz. and I'm not sure that includes the reelseat. The seat is light aluminum, so is not much either way. If Mike Leithieser is still signed on to this list he can give the casting characteristics of this particular rod....Mike??? I'll try to take the taper as soon as I can and post back to the list. Chrismcdowellc@lanecc.edu-------------Original Text Does anyone have a taper for a 9' 7wt Granger or Heddon that I might try Would like the rod to be about 9' in lenght. Any help would be appreciated. Mark Babiy from flyman35@home.com Tue Nov 9 17:50:58 1999 (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with ESMTP Subject: polishing varnish what is a good method for polishing varnish? thanks in advance for anyhelp. Matt from bob@downandacross.com Tue Nov 9 18:15:46 1999 (envelope- from bob@downandacross.com) Subject: angles Thanks for help with my angles. Got the mirror out and fixed them. Yes it was me that screwed them up. That's what rod one is for. Hurrah!Anyway, did someone post today that they used a hand rubbed layer of Tung Oil to seal the blank, and then they dipped later? Does that really work. If so, what kind of varnish? Thanks.Bob Mauluccibob@downandacross.com from GLohkamp@aol.com Tue Nov 9 18:15:51 1999 Subject: Taper Question Hello all,l have been fooling around with some tapers and was wondering if anyonecared to try and tell me what they thought of the following taper. What l wish to know is how you would class this taper, Para,semipara,straight,something else? It is a 7.5 ft for a 5wt. Let me know what you think. Oh yeah sixstrip.Thanks, Gary Lohkamp0 0.066 5 0.074 10 0.08833 15 0.10299 20 0.11798 25 0.1333 30 0.14895 35 0.16493 40 0.18124 45 0.19788 50 0.2148555 0.23149 60 0.2481 65 0.26468 70 0.28123 75 0.29775 80 0.31424 85 0.3307 90 0.34713 from Michael.Roberts@health.wa.gov.au Tue Nov 9 18:29:56 1999 (5.5.2448.0) Rod Makers List Serve Subject: RE: sanding sections Bob,if that means you have way too much time on your hands, what do youthink of someone like me who has reared a thousand or so silkworms inorderto make my own silk fly lines? I'll post again when the laughter stops. Cheers Mike Question... Does doing stuff like this mean I have WAY too much time onmy hands? LOL Later,BobR.L. "Bob" Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Bamboo Fly Rodshttp://members.clnk.com/caneman/images/flystuff/caneindex.htm from cbogart@shentel.net Tue Nov 9 18:30:03 1999 (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with SMTP Tue, 9 Nov 1999 16:29:57 -0800 "owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu" ,"rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu" ,"TSmithwick@aol.com" Subject: Re: rod one Tom It is amazing that finding angles is hard for people. Giving theclassesI have learned not to take anything for granted. Reading the Center Gaugeandusing it to find your angle and then techniques to maintain the angles arenotintuitive. Agree with finding angles early and maintaining is the best coursebutI find people do not get the angles and have little or no clue on how tomaintainthem. Sounds like fodder for another article. Chris On Mon, 8 Nov 1999 23:54:08 EST, TSmithwick@aol.com wrote: OBTW - I should have said that the way to avoid this problem is to takesome extra time at the rough planing stage and make sure the angles arecorrect at the beginning. It's much easier to maintain them than it is to correctthem. In general, you will find that extra time spent at the beginning of the process will be more than repaid later on. from iank@nelson.planet.org.nz Tue Nov 9 18:47:10 1999 sage.ts.co.nz with SMTP id MAA24941; Wed, 10 Nov 1999 12:47:48 +1300 Subject: Re: need a taper for a good steelhead rod Mark , I know you are looking for a 9' rod but I have built the 8'Dickerson"Guide" from Jack Howells book and it is a very powerful #7 rod and greattouse. I have several Hardy's and Brampton Walker rods in the 9' and 10' sizeat #7 and #8 but consider the Dickerson to be a better rod to use. Ian Kearney At 05:35 PM 9/11/99 -0500, Mark and Tracey wrote:Does anyone have a taper for a 9' 7wt Granger or Heddon that I might try Wouldlike the rod to be about 9' in lenght. Any help would be appreciated. Mark Babiy Does anyone have a taper for a 9' 7wt Granger orHeddonthat I lenght. Any help would be appreciated. Mark Babiy from hexagon@odyssee.net Tue Nov 9 19:52:53 1999 "owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu" ,"rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu" ,"TSmithwick@aol.com" Subject: Re: rod one Once a perfect equilateral triangle is put on the strip, including removingtheradius from the the outside it is possible to taper the strip by removingall thecane from one side only. Right? Chris Bogart wrote: Tom It is amazing that finding angles is hard for people. Giving theclassesI have learned not to take anything for granted. Reading the Center Gaugeandusing it to find your angle and then techniques to maintain the angles arenotintuitive. Agree with finding angles early and maintaining is the best coursebutI find people do not get the angles and have little or no clue on how tomaintainthem. Sounds like fodder for another article. Chris On Mon, 8 Nov 1999 23:54:08 EST, TSmithwick@aol.com wrote: OBTW - I should have said that the way to avoid this problem is to takesomeextra time at the rough planing stage and make sure the angles arecorrect atthe beginning. It's much easier to maintain them than it is to correctthem.In general, you will find that extra time spent at the beginning of theprocess will be more than repaid later on. from hexagon@odyssee.net Tue Nov 9 19:58:52 1999 Subject: Re: Enamel 450C9246BB5ECCA74F4A6DDE" --------------450C9246BB5ECCA74F4A6DDE Float cases on the list? you might as well ask for the best recipe forSpotted Dick or Toad in the Hole! Tim & Jilly Watson wrote: What does everyone use to get the enamel off the culms.I'm makingsome float cases from 3-4" stock and would like some advice.ThanksTim. --------------450C9246BB5ECCA74F4A6DDE Tim & Jilly Watson wrote: What does everyoneuse to get the enamel off the culms.I'm makingsomefloat cases from 3-4" stock and would like some advice.ThanksTim. --------------450C9246BB5ECCA74F4A6DDE-- from cbogart@shentel.net Tue Nov 9 20:06:41 1999 (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with SMTP Tue, 9 Nov 1999 18:06:29 -0800 "owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu" ,"rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu" ,"TSmithwick@aol.com" Subject: Re: rod one Terry Yes it is possible to do. I would add one thing after getting thetriangles is to plane the side that goes down in the form flat - Be able tomake one longpass down that side with the plane prior to putting it in the form - thatwill eliminategapscause by scallops in the planing. It insures that side is flat and then allyou have toconcentrate on is getting the "numbers" right. Chris On Tue, 09 Nov 1999 20:56:41 -0500, TERENCE ACKLAND wrote: Once a perfect equilateral triangle is put on the strip, including removing theradius from the the outside it is possible to taper the strip by removingall thecane from one side only. Right? Chris Bogart wrote: Tom It is amazing that finding angles is hard for people. Giving theclassesI have learned not to take anything for granted. Reading the CenterGauge andusing it to find your angle and then techniques to maintain the anglesare notintuitive. Agree with finding angles early and maintaining is the best coursebutI find people do not get the angles and have little or no clue on how tomaintainthem. Sounds like fodder for another article. Chris On Mon, 8 Nov 1999 23:54:08 EST, TSmithwick@aol.com wrote: OBTW - I should have said that the way to avoid this problem is to takesomeextra time at the rough planing stage and make sure the angles arecorrect atthe beginning. It's much easier to maintain them than it is to correctthem.In general, you will find that extra time spent at the beginning of theprocess will be more than repaid later on. from TSmithwick@aol.com Tue Nov 9 20:21:26 1999 Subject: Re: Re: rod one rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu In a message dated 11/10/99 1:53:09 AM, hexagon@odyssee.net wrote: Yes it is. As long as the angles are correct I don't see a downside. It's a good way to go if you have an unworkable node on one side of a strip. from stpete@netten.net Tue Nov 9 20:48:02 1999 Tue, 9 Nov 1999 20:47:40 -0600 Subject: Re: Enamel Exactly Terry!! I'll be the one to fess up here. What in tarnation isa float case?? As far as that goes, what or who is Spotted Dick andToad in the Hole?? One confused SR (Southern Rodmaker). Rick C. TERENCE ACKLAND wrote: Float cases on the list? you might as well ask for the best recipe Tim & Jilly Watson wrote: What does everyone use to get the enamel off the culms.I'mmaking some float cases from 3-4" stock and would like someadvice.ThanksTim. from mrj@aa.net Tue Nov 9 20:48:03 1999 Tue, 9 Nov 1999 18:47:54 -0800 Subject: Re: Taper Question Yea Gary, I'm thinking I would call this a straight taper. I graphed it andit looks pretty straight to me. The variation seemed very slight. Have youbuilt a rod like this?----- Original Message ----- Subject: Taper Question Hello all,l have been fooling around with some tapers and was wondering if anyonecaredto try and tell me what they thought of the following taper. What l wishtoknow is how you would class this taper, Para,semipara,straight,somethingelse? It is a 7.5 ft for a 5wt. Let me know what you think. Oh yeah sixstrip.Thanks,Gary Lohkamp0 0.0665 0.07410 0.0883315 0.1029920 0.1179825 0.133330 0.1489535 0.1649340 0.1812445 0.1978850 0.2148555 0.2314960 0.248165 0.2646870 0.2812375 0.2977580 0.3142485 0.330790 0.34713 from mrj@aa.net Tue Nov 9 20:51:40 1999 Tue, 9 Nov 1999 18:51:27 -0800 , Subject: Re: rod one I agree with Chris here. Terry, how come I feel like you were baitingsomeone with this question here (G)?----- Original Message ----- ; Subject: Re: rod one Once a perfect equilateral triangle is put on the strip, includingremoving theradius from the the outside it is possible to taper the strip by removingall thecane from one side only. Right? Chris Bogart wrote: Tom It is amazing that finding angles is hard for people. Giving theclassesI have learned not to take anything for granted. Reading the CenterGauge andusing it to find your angle and then techniques to maintain the anglesare notintuitive. Agree with finding angles early and maintaining is the bestcourse butI find people do not get the angles and have little or no clue on how tomaintainthem. Sounds like fodder for another article. Chris On Mon, 8 Nov 1999 23:54:08 EST, TSmithwick@aol.com wrote: OBTW - I should have said that the way to avoid this problem is totakesomeextra time at the rough planing stage and make sure the angles arecorrect atthe beginning. It's much easier to maintain them than it is to correctthem.In general, you will find that extra time spent at the beginning of theprocess will be more than repaid later on. from d_price@global2000.net Tue Nov 9 21:09:46 1999 WAA21218 Subject: Re: Enamel Tim & Jilly Watson wrote: What does everyone use to get the enamel off the culms.I'm making some float cases from 3-4" stock and would like someadvice.ThanksTim. Tim, sanding from maybe 150grit down to 280 grit will take it off,,,butit depends on what finish if any you plan to use.... from nobler@satx.rr.com Tue Nov 9 21:16:57 1999 SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.197.19);Tue, 9 Nov 1999 21:16:59 -0600 Subject: Wet sanding boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0031_01BF2AF7.B8579720" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0031_01BF2AF7.B8579720 The product I couldn't recall, is Sikken's M-600, for wet sanding. It's =a degreaser as well. I've never wet sanded wood, much less cane, and =would think that wet sanding the dry varnish would be the way to go. The =would be a tough order, when wrapped though. This product is available =at auto paint supply stores. About the most gentle, high gloss polishing compound, known to man, is =Gorham's Silver Polish. This is the final polish of those 32 coat =lacquer paint jobs ! GMA ------=_NextPart_000_0031_01BF2AF7.B8579720 The product I couldn't recall, is Sikken's = wet sanding. It's a degreaser as well. I've never wet sanded wood, much = cane, and would think that wet sanding the dry varnish would be the way = The would be a tough order, when wrapped though. This product is = auto paint supply stores. About the most gentle, high gloss polishing= known to man, is Gorham's Silver Polish. This is the final polish of = coat lacquer paint jobs ! GMA ------=_NextPart_000_0031_01BF2AF7.B8579720-- from FISHWOOL@aol.com Tue Nov 9 21:39:17 1999 Subject: Re: Taper Question Gary,After a cursory look at your taper, with the exception of the first 25", it looks to be a fairly straight taper and a fairly steep one at that, running around .016" between 5" increments (I often use John Bokstrom's values, i.e., .014" for 7 1/2', .012" for 8' , etc. ). In any case it should cast a wf5f with some authority. I used a similar tip behavior for a 3weight and it turned out very well.Regards,Hank W. from pmgoodwin@earthlink.net Tue Nov 9 21:41:20 1999 Subject: Re: need a taper for a good steelhead rod boundary="----=_NextPart_000_008C_01BF2B02.F2851480" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_008C_01BF2B02.F2851480 Hi, deduct for varnish. Paul in. guide left right average1 0.102 0.102 0.102 0.1025 0.110 0.110 0.110 0.11010 0.134 0.134 0.134 0.13415 0.150 0.150 0.154 0.15120 0.165 0.161 0.161 0.16325 0.181 0.181 0.177 0.18030 0.197 0.197 0.197 0.19735 0.205 0.205 0.205 0.20540 0.236 0.228 0.232 0.23245 0.252 0.252 0.252 0.25250 0.264 0.268 0.272 0.26855 0.272 0.272 0.272 0.27260 0.283 0.283 0.283 0.28365 0.291 0.291 0.291 0.29170 0.299 0.299 0.299 0.29975 0.327 0.327 0.327 0.32780 0.343 0.343 0.343 0.34385 0.354 0.354 0.354 0.35490 0.362 0.362 0.362 0.36295 0.374 0.374 0.374 0.374 Sent: Tuesday, November 09, 1999 5:35 PMSubject: need a taper for a good steelhead rod Does anyone have a taper for a 9' 7wt Granger or Heddon that I might =try for a steelehad rod? If not, maybe there are some other =suggestions. Would like the rod to be about 9' in lenght. Any help would be appreciated. Mark Babiy ------=_NextPart_000_008C_01BF2B02.F2851480 Hi,The table below shows the numbers Itook = W&M heaver = ounce version not the lighter weight GA9050 9' 5 = rod. The table left = face to the right. The last = average. I DID NOT ----- Original Message ----- Mark and Tracey = Sent: Tuesday, November 09, = PMSubject: need a taper for a = steelhead rod Does anyone have a taper for a 9' 7wt Granger or = lenght. Any help would be appreciated. MarkBabiy ------=_NextPart_000_008C_01BF2B02.F2851480-- from tragich23@juno.com Wed Nov 10 00:31:04 1999 01:30:07 EST Subject: company logo copyrights anyone out there know how to go about getting a company copyright ontheir logo? i keep running into roadblocks. ai from flyh2o@worldnet.att.net Wed Nov 10 01:42:17 1999 mtiwmhc01.worldnet.att.net(InterMail v03.02.07.07 118-134) with SMTP Wed, 10 Nov 1999 07:41:26 +0000 Subject: re: need a taper for a good steelhead rod The Phillipson handles well with a DT7 (444SL) and is a reasonable singlespey rod for intensive steelheading. I have a 9ft Granger that worksbetter(IMHO) with a WF8 than a 7, but I haven't tuned into the rod wellenough to consistently single spey with the authority I can get from otherrods. I found the Granger to be more pleasant to fish a long line with forhours at a time...fatigue can be a factor and I think the tip on thePhillipson was a bit lighter and when tired you can get a bit sloppy withyour stroke. Couple the lighter tip with a high wind and tailing loopsmagically appear. The Granger can pick more line up off the water than Ican handle on the forward stroke. Both rods (my Granger and Chris'sPhillipson) have taken Deschutes steelhead with no problems...I have evenfished Leeches (spark plugs with a bit of rabbit strip) on them fairlyefficiently. I have yet to build a rod, but think that something along thelines of a PHY Para 17 would be a good taper for steelhead...believe AJrecently built a 9 ft 8 wt, but he used a modified Granger taper(Would likea chance to cast the next one Chris or AJ, hint, hint) In "Colorado Classic Cane" there is a reprint of a small newspaper article from the August 6, 1922 Denver Post giving the results of the Denver PostCasting Tournament..The distance event was taken by one Goodwin Grangerwith an average cast of 103.6 ft, longest cast was 116 ft. I believe hewas using a 9 footer....that would be an interesting taper to build, don'tthink they were using shooting heads in the 20s so I assume standard(silk)lines were being used. Granger (and Wright-McGill) listed 2 andsometimes3 different 9 footers...anyone have a clue as to which rod may have beenthe one used in 1922? At 03:27 PM 11/9/99 PST, CHRISTOPHER C MCDOWELL wrote:Mark, I have a 9' 7 wt. Phillipson Premium I can take a taper from. The rod is marked at 5 5/8 oz. and I'm not sure that includes the reelseat. The seat is light aluminum, so is not much either way. If Mike Leithieser is still signed on to this list he can give the casting characteristics of this particular rod....Mike??? I'll try to take the taper as soon as I can and post back to the list. Chrismcdowellc@lanecc.edu-------------Original TextFrom: "Mark and Tracey" , on 11/9/99 2:53PM:Does anyone have a taper for a 9' 7wt Granger or Heddon that I might try Would like the rod to be about 9' in lenght. Any help would be appreciated. Mark Babiy Mike Leitheiser "When the trout are lost, smash the state."Tom McGuane from stuart.tod@virgin.net Wed Nov 10 02:59:40 1999 (InterMail v4.01.01.02 201-229-111-106) with SMTP Wed, 10 Nov 1999 08:54:22 +0000 Subject: Re: Enamel boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0036_01BF2B5A.FD0864E0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0036_01BF2B5A.FD0864E0 Terry - My Missus won't make me Spotted Dick - says it's too fattening. Any recipies you may have would be gratefully recieved - I can make them=in my cane oven when she's gone to work.... Stuart Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 1999 2:02 AMSubject: Re: Enamel Float cases on the list? you might as well ask for the best recipe = What does everyone use to get the enamel off the culms.I'm making =some float cases from 3-4" stock and would like some advice.ThanksTim. ------=_NextPart_000_0036_01BF2B5A.FD0864E0 Terry - My Missus won't make me Spotted Dick- = too fattening. Any recipies you may have would be = work.... Stuart ----- Original Message ----- ACKLAND Cc: Rodmakers Sent: Wednesday, November 10, = AMSubject: Re: Enamel culms.I'm making some float cases from 3-4"= ------=_NextPart_000_0036_01BF2B5A.FD0864E0-- from caneman@clnk.com Wed Nov 10 05:36:43 1999 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35)with SMTP id com for ;Wed, 10 Nov 1999 05:35:16 -0600 Subject: Link page boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000C_01BF2B3D.3D174D80" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000C_01BF2B3D.3D174D80 Everyone,I just added a link page to my web site. If you have a homepage and =want it on there, please send me the URL and I will put it up today =sometime... or as soon as you send it to me. If you don't have a web =site and would like to be listed, I am going to build a page with the =Names, addresses and phone numbers of rodmakers that don't have web =sites, so if you will send me that info, I will put those up for those = Email me offlist and I'll get this done as soon as I can, Thanks,Bob R.L. "Bob" Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Bamboo Fly Rodshttp://members.clnk.com/caneman/images/flystuff/caneindex.htm ------=_NextPart_000_000C_01BF2B3D.3D174D80 Everyone, have a homepage and want it on there, please send me the URL and I will = web site and would like to be listed, I am going to build a page with = addresses and phone numbers of rodmakers that don't have web sites, so = will send me that info, I will put those up for those without a = can, Thanks,Bob Rodsht=tp://members.clnk.com/caneman/images/flystuff/caneindex.htm ------=_NextPart_000_000C_01BF2B3D.3D174D80-- from channer@hubwest.com Wed Nov 10 06:18:19 1999 (SMTPD32-4.06) id A31640100FC; Wed, 10 Nov 1999 05:20:38 MST Subject: Re: sanding sections At 09:18 AM 11/09/1999 -0600, Bob Nunley wrote:"" "" So, yesterday, I glued up a set of 6 unmatched scrap strips and gave it a try this morning. At this pointmy only concern was "" If it does screw up as it cures, Iwill post more, if not, you won't hear from me on this again... it lookslike it is going to do great. too much time on my hands? LOL Later, Bob "" Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Bamboo Fly Rodshttp://members.clnk.com/caneman/images/flystuff/caneindex.htm Bob;The only problem that I can forsee is that the varnish may not stick to therod, not because of the water, but because you have polished it too muchand the rod has no "tooth" for the varnish to stick to.Furniture finisherswill only go so fine on bare wood before varnishing, further polishing isdone to the coats of finish themselves as there will also be a chemicalbond as well as a physical bond. I have stripped some old rods that lokkedvery nice in the few places the finish was still intact, but when I got allthe varnish off the surface looked to be sanded no finer than 150 grit. Igo finer, down to about 450(50 micron,whatever the equivalent is) andhavetested to see if I can flake the cured varnish off with my fingernail, itstayed on very well, but I have noticed that if I go to 1200 grit first,the varnish will come off with little effort.John from edriddle@mindspring.com Wed Nov 10 06:28:08 1999 Subject: Re: company logo copyrights Find yourself a local Patent Attorney and ply him/her with a few "SingleMalts" :-)Ed-----Original Message----- Subject: company logo copyrights anyone out there know how to go about getting a company copyright ontheir logo? i keep running into roadblocks. ai from caneman@clnk.com Wed Nov 10 06:56:28 1999 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35)with SMTP id com; Wed, 10 Nov 1999 06:54:58 -0600 Subject: Re: sanding sections John,I have never had any problem with my varnish sticking to my rodsections. I have always sanded down to a 1200 grit. I know on wood thisisnot standard, but bamboo isn't wood.... technically, it is a grass and doesreact different to varnish than wood does. I was a violin maker before Iwas a rodmaker, and i never went finer than 600 on a violin back (maple)or400 on a top (sitka spruce) but since my first rod, many many years ago, Ihave always gone to 1200 on my cane sections, and no trouble yet. Ofcourse, I am very meticulous in my varnishing. I have a dustproofvarnishing room and setup, wear latex gloves when handling the sectionsbefore varnishing and after thoroughly cleaning and degreasing withdenatured alcohol. On bamboo, I think the key to getting the varnish tostay on the section, isn't so much the texture of the surface, as it is withwood, but the cleanliness of the surface.Just my opinion, of course. Bob-----Original Message----- Subject: Re: sanding sections At 09:18 AM 11/09/1999 -0600, Bob Nunley wrote:"" "" So, yesterday, I glued up a set of 6 unmatched scrapstrips and gave it a try this morning. At this pointmy only concern was "" If it does screw up as it cures, Iwill post more, if not, you won't hear from me on this again... it lookslike it is going to do great. too much time on my hands? LOLLater, Bob "" Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Bamboo Fly Rodshttp://members.clnk.com/caneman/images/flystuff/caneindex.htmBob;The only problem that I can forsee is that the varnish may not stick totherod, not because of the water, but because you have polished it too muchand the rod has no "tooth" for the varnish to stick to.Furniture finisherswill only go so fine on bare wood before varnishing, further polishing isdone to the coats of finish themselves as there will also be a chemicalbond as well as a physical bond. I have stripped some old rods that lokkedvery nice in the few places the finish was still intact, but when I got allthe varnish off the surface looked to be sanded no finer than 150 grit. Igo finer, down to about 450(50 micron,whatever the equivalent is) andhavetested to see if I can flake the cured varnish off with my fingernail, itstayed on very well, but I have noticed that if I go to 1200 grit first,the varnish will come off with little effort.John from darrell@rockclimbing.org Wed Nov 10 09:02:48 1999 sims.3.5.1999.09.16.21.57.p8)with SMTP id for Subject: Re: need a taper for a good steelhead rod I think the Heddon 9-9.5' rod 2 3/4F taper was mentioned in the top 25 listas a fav... Darrellwww.bamboorods.homepage.com ----- Original Message ----- Subject: re: need a taper for a good steelhead rod The Phillipson handles well with a DT7 (444SL) and is a reasonablesinglespey rod for intensive steelheading. I have a 9ft Granger that worksbetter(IMHO) with a WF8 than a 7, but I haven't tuned into the rod wellenough to consistently single spey with the authority I can get fromotherrods. I found the Granger to be more pleasant to fish a long line with forhours at a time...fatigue can be a factor and I think the tip on thePhillipson was a bit lighter and when tired you can get a bit sloppy withyour stroke. Couple the lighter tip with a high wind and tailing loopsmagically appear. The Granger can pick more line up off the water than Ican handle on the forward stroke. Both rods (my Granger and Chris'sPhillipson) have taken Deschutes steelhead with no problems...I haveevenfished Leeches (spark plugs with a bit of rabbit strip) on them fairlyefficiently. I have yet to build a rod, but think that something alongthelines of a PHY Para 17 would be a good taper for steelhead...believe AJrecently built a 9 ft 8 wt, but he used a modified Granger taper(Wouldlikea chance to cast the next one Chris or AJ, hint, hint) In "Colorado Classic Cane" there is a reprint of a small newspaperarticle from the August 6, 1922 Denver Post giving the results of the DenverPostCasting Tournament..The distance event was taken by one GoodwinGrangerwith an average cast of 103.6 ft, longest cast was 116 ft. I believe hewas using a 9 footer....that would be an interesting taper to build, don'tthink they were using shooting heads in the 20s so I assume standard(silk)lines were being used. Granger (and Wright-McGill) listed 2 andsometimes3 different 9 footers...anyone have a clue as to which rod may have beenthe one used in 1922? At 03:27 PM 11/9/99 PST, CHRISTOPHER C MCDOWELL wrote:Mark, I have a 9' 7 wt. Phillipson Premium I can take a taper from. The rodismarked at 5 5/8 oz. and I'm not sure that includes the reelseat. Theseatis light aluminum, so is not much either way. If Mike Leithieser isstillsigned on to this list he can give the casting characteristics of thisparticular rod....Mike??? I'll try to take the taper as soon as Icanand post back to the list. Chrismcdowellc@lanecc.edu-------------Original TextFrom: "Mark and Tracey" , on 11/9/99 2:53PM:Does anyone have a taper for a 9' 7wt Granger or Heddon that I might try Would like the rod to be about 9' in lenght. Any help would be appreciated. Mark Babiy Mike Leitheiser "When the trout are lost, smash the state."Tom McGuane from sshorb@ozip.net Wed Nov 10 10:02:56 1999 0600 Subject: Re: rod one and none on the other.Skip from briancreek@crosswinds.net Wed Nov 10 10:23:15 1999 (envelope- from briancreek@crosswinds.net) Subject: Heddon Signature wraps Howdy, I'm restoring a pair of 9' Heddons for a friend (a #14 and a #20) thatwere stripped of all wraps and guides before I saw them. Bummer. I'vegot the original hardware, correct thread, and can see where thread usedto was, but I have no clue what the signature wraps looked like. Can any of you gracious gentlemen e-mail me a picture of the sig wrapsor a good detailed description of them for these rods? Any assistance would be greatly appreciated. TIA, Brian from caneman@clnk.com Wed Nov 10 10:59:00 1999 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35)with SMTP id com for ;Wed, 10 Nov 1999 10:57:31 -0600 Subject: Fw: tapers Tom,The best way to see it to go to the Rodmakers page, go to tapers andlook at Paul Youngs taper for the Parabolic 15. It has both wet and dry tipdimensions and stress curves. Bob -----Original Message----- Subject: tapers I am a novice rod maker and have a question about tips. Here it goes.Whenyou make a 2 tip rod you said one tip is for dry flies and the other fornymphs. What are the differences in dimensions? Thanks in advance for the advice. I am having a lot of fun building mytoolsand equipment, (just finished my oven over the weekend, and shouldfinishmydip tank this weekend) and am just about ready to start making rods.ThanksTomTCromp@aol.com from caneman@clnk.com Wed Nov 10 11:03:01 1999 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35)with SMTP id com; Wed, 10 Nov 1999 11:01:26 -0600 Subject: Re: rod one I think it is OK to taper on one side of the strip as long as you haveSTARTED the taper on the other side first. In other words... make a fewpasses to get your taper started on one side. Once you have thatprogression started on one side of the strip, then you gain nothing byflopping the strip form side to side to finish the taper. Since you alreadyhave started your taper on the "down" side, then keeps the power fibersdownthe center of the strip in tact as much as possible, so there would be nomore cutting across power fibers than if you constantly flipped the strip. Bob -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: rod one and none on the other.Skip from edriddle@mindspring.com Wed Nov 10 12:09:08 1999 Subject: Fw: company logo copyrights -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: company logo copyrights Generally, just marking something as copyrighted makesit copyrighed immediately. Subsequent registratonjust helps in lawsuits defending it and can be doneanytime. Not a lawyer, but have asked one before. --- Ed Riddle wrote:Find yourself a local Patent Attorney and plyhim/her with a few "SingleMalts" :-)Ed-----Original Message-----From: ANDREW J INGRAM Cc: TragicH23@juno.com Date: Wednesday, November 10, 1999 1:34 AMSubject: company logo copyrights anyone out there know how to go about getting acompany copyright ontheir logo? i keep running into roadblocks. ai ===== __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com from rmoon@ida.net Wed Nov 10 12:47:06 1999 0000 Subject: Texas General I have been asked to build a Young Texas General. I found a taper withFrank Stetzer that was from a submission by Larry Blan. I am somewhatconfused by the dimensions . There is a indication in Frank's Taper ofmeasurments without varnish adjustment. Larry's taper mentions thewordblank which would indicate no varnish. Anyone out there have a TexasGeneral Taper or can explain the difference in Franks and Larrys/ Thank You Ralph from watson@cape-consult.co.uk Wed Nov 10 13:06:43 1999 Wed, 10 Nov 1999 19:06:29 GMT Subject: Re: Enamel Dear oh Dear!What a sad lot - not only don't you know what a float case is but SpottedDick and Toad in the Hole!! Culinary Sacrilige.A float case is a length of culm, normally about 3-4" in diameter. Theculmis cut just below the node so that the tube has a base, and then cut about9 - 12" above the node. A nice hardwood stopper is made for the open endand the whole thing is varnished to within a thou of perfection. Into thistube are placed floats, as in fishing floats.They look great.Now as to Spotted Dick..........well I'm not sure I now y'all well enoughyet!T----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Enamel Exactly Terry!! I'll be the one to fess up here. What in tarnation isa float case?? As far as that goes, what or who is Spotted Dick andToad in the Hole?? One confused SR (Southern Rodmaker). Rick C. TERENCE ACKLAND wrote: Float cases on the list? you might as well ask for the best recipe Tim & Jilly Watson wrote: What does everyone use to get the enamel off the culms.I'mmaking some float cases from 3-4" stock and would like someadvice.ThanksTim. from knflyrod@home.com Wed Nov 10 13:11:12 1999 (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with SMTP ;Wed, 10 Nov 1999 11:11:08 -0800 Subject: Re: Heddon Signature wraps Brian, Heddon had three and four phases they went through with each onebeing different in rod detailing. To help in determining the phase, wewould need to know.....Reel seat....Size rings in the grip.....How theHeddon was written.( across three flats or along one flat ) How and whereis the model identified. I have several different model #17's and threedifferent wrap and identification patterns. Let us know and I will try tohelp. Thanks, Ron Huff----- Original Message ----- Subject: Heddon Signature wraps Howdy, I'm restoring a pair of 9' Heddons for a friend (a #14 and a #20) thatwere stripped of all wraps and guides before I saw them. Bummer. I'vegot the original hardware, correct thread, and can see where thread usedto was, but I have no clue what the signature wraps looked like. Can any of you gracious gentlemen e-mail me a picture of the sig wrapsor a good detailed description of them for these rods? Any assistance would be greatly appreciated. TIA, Brian from stetzer@csd.uwm.edu Wed Nov 10 13:16:46 1999 batch3.csd.uwm.edu (8.8.4/8.6.8) with ESMTP id NAA02170 for; (8.8.4/8.6.8) withSMTP id NAA26091 for ; Wed, 10 Nov 1999 Subject: BRe: Texas General Ralph, I assumed from the way Larry wrote his note that this was from an unvarnished rod, so I didn't subtract anything for varnish. Larry will have to confirm this. What I've got in my hexrod and what Larry posted should be the same, except that I show the dimensions starting at the 1 inch point while Larry started at measuring at 0 (others have questioned me about starting at 1 and they are right, it is confusing). And I have 0.289 at the 55 inch station where it should be 0.288; that is a typo on my part and I'llfix it someday.......................................................................Frank Stetzer "...a cheerful comrade is betterstetzer@uwm.edu than a waterproof coat and a Employed by, but not speaking for foot-warmer." Henry Van Dyke,Univ of Wisconsin-Milwaukee, USA "Fisherman's Luck", 1899. On Wed, 10 Nov 1999, Ralph W Moon wrote: I have been asked to build a Young Texas General. I found a taper withFrank Stetzer that was from a submission by Larry Blan. I am somewhatconfused by the dimensions . There is a indication in Frank's Taper ofmeasurments without varnish adjustment. Larry's taper mentions thewordblank which would indicate no varnish. Anyone out there have a TexasGeneral Taper or can explain the difference in Franks and Larrys/ Thank You Ralph from tjtrodmaker@yahoo.com Wed Nov 10 13:24:19 1999 1999 11:24:14 PST Subject: Re: Enamel i'm sorry but i'm still confused...and you're notgoing to get to know me any better until i know what aspotted dick and toad in the hole is. timothy --- Tim & Jilly Watson wrote:Dear oh Dear!What a sad lot - not only don't you know what afloat case is but SpottedDick and Toad in the Hole!! Culinary Sacrilige.A float case is a length of culm, normally about3-4" in diameter. The culmis cut just below the node so that the tube has abase, and then cut about9 - 12" above the node. A nice hardwood stopper ismade for the open endand the whole thing is varnished to within a thou ofperfection. Into thistube are placed floats, as in fishing floats.They look great.Now as to Spotted Dick..........well I'm not sure Inow y'all well enoughyet!T----- Original Message -----From: Rick C. Cc: ; Rodmakers Sent: 10 November 1999 02:48Subject: Re: Enamel Exactly Terry!! I'll be the one to fess up here. What in tarnation isa float case?? As far as that goes, what or whois Spotted Dick andToad in the Hole?? One confused SR (Southern Rodmaker). Rick C. TERENCE ACKLAND wrote: Float cases on the list? you might as well ask Tim & Jilly Watson wrote: What does everyone use to get the enameloff the culms.I'mmaking some float cases from 3-4" stock andwould like someadvice.ThanksTim. ====="Gooda' morning mister bear"__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com from chris@artistree.com Wed Nov 10 13:25:03 1999 "rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu =?iso-8859-1?Q?=2A=A1?=" Subject: Re: company logo copyrights Well, I'm not an attorney but I think what you want here is a"Trademark" or if it applies to your business, the new "Servicemark."These symbols are: Circle R, TM or SM. These apply to your company name& logo. These need to be registered with the US Patent and TrademarkOffice. ( http://www.uspto.gov/ ) Copyright is something all together different and I believe applies tothings created like, writing, music & images. In this country the lawswere changed so that whatever you created is automatically copyrightedwhen you "create" it. Hence, no need to register and/or include thecircle C with your work anymore. It's automatically assumed. Chris "out-on-a-limb, here" Wohlford ANDREW J INGRAM wrote: anyone out there know how to go about getting a company copyright ontheir logo? i keep running into roadblocks. ai -- Regards, Chris Wohlfordemail: chris@artistree.com from gknight@propoint.com Wed Nov 10 15:49:39 1999 (may be forged)) (5.5.2448.0) Subject: SRG1999 To All, As a newcomer, I was very impressed. I wish I had the time tothank everyone there. and will in time. But I believe that the SRG99, wasa change for My future, Thank you one and all. George Knight from watson@cape-consult.co.uk Wed Nov 10 15:52:52 1999 Wed, 10 Nov 1999 21:52:34 GMT "rod 'akers" Subject: Re: Enamel boundary="----=_NextPart_000_00C0_01BF2BC5.B7E5B6E0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_00C0_01BF2BC5.B7E5B6E0 OK,Sorry aboout this.Toad in the hole is batter and sausages and Spotted Dick is a pudding. Foranyone who is interested I've attached the recipes.Apologies to those not interested in the bandwidth----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Enamel i'm sorry but i'm still confused...and you're notgoing to get to know me any better until i know what aspotted dick and toad in the hole is. timothy --- Tim & Jilly Watson wrote:Dear oh Dear!What a sad lot - not only don't you know what afloat case is but SpottedDick and Toad in the Hole!! Culinary Sacrilige.A float case is a length of culm, normally about3-4" in diameter. The culmis cut just below the node so that the tube has abase, and then cut about9 - 12" above the node. A nice hardwood stopper ismade for the open endand the whole thing is varnished to within a thou ofperfection. Into thistube are placed floats, as in fishing floats.They look great.Now as to Spotted Dick..........well I'm not sure Inow y'all well enoughyet!T> > ----- Original Message -----From: Rick C. Cc: ; Rodmakers Sent: 10 November 1999 02:48Subject: Re: Enamel Exactly Terry!! I'll be the one to fess up here.What in tarnation isa float case?? As far as that goes, what or whois Spotted Dick andToad in the Hole?? One confused SR (Southern Rodmaker). Rick C. TERENCE ACKLAND wrote: Float cases on the list? you might as well ask Tim & Jilly Watson wrote: What does everyone use to get the enameloff the culms.I'mmaking some float cases from 3-4" stock andwould like someadvice.ThanksTim. ====="Gooda' morning mister bear"__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com ------=_NextPart_000_00C0_01BF2BC5.B7E5B6E0 name="Toad.doc" filename="Toad.doc" 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------=_NextPart_000_00C0_01BF2BC5.B7E5B6E0-- from pfduffy@widowmaker.com Wed Nov 10 16:04:36 1999 Subject: Re: Heddon Signature wraps Brian, My Heddon #14,is an 81/2, 21/2 F, with one blank flat, then Heddon,another blank flat, then,Thorbred. Best of my knowledge all the wraps areoriginal, except a couple I have replaced in dark Chinese red that matchvery nicely, especially since I put some color into the first two coats ofvarnish on the wraps. If my wraps are not correct I would appreciatesomeone telling me. PhilHope this helps.-----Original Message----- Subject: Heddon Signature wraps Howdy, I'm restoring a pair of 9' Heddons for a friend (a #14 and a #20) thatwere stripped of all wraps and guides before I saw them. Bummer. I'vegot the original hardware, correct thread, and can see where thread usedto was, but I have no clue what the signature wraps looked like. Can any of you gracious gentlemen e-mail me a picture of the sig wrapsor a good detailed description of them for these rods? Any assistance would be greatly appreciated. TIA, Brian from HARMS1@prodigy.net Wed Nov 10 18:16:08 1999 Wed, 10 Nov 1999 19:15:56 -0500 Subject: Re: sanding sections boundary="----=_NextPart_000_005C_01BF2BAF.7248AD60" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_005C_01BF2BAF.7248AD60 All, There is no need whatever to go all the way down to 1200-grit before = will easily hide the "tooth" left from high quality wet-or-dry 400-grit =paper. Finer grits are nothing but overkill on bamboo, accomplishing =nothing in the quality of the finish. If you were dealing with wood, =that would be a different matter, as wood has pores in its grain, and =miniscule fibers that may fuzz-up. Bamboo, however, causes neither of =these problems. cheers, Bill Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 1999 4:54 AMSubject: Re: sanding sections John,I have never had any problem with my varnish sticking to my rodsections. I have always sanded down to a 1200 grit. I know on wood =this isnot standard, but bamboo isn't wood.... technically, it is a grass and =doesreact different to varnish than wood does. I was a violin maker =before Iwas a rodmaker, and i never went finer than 600 on a violin back =(maple) or400 on a top (sitka spruce) but since my first rod, many many years =ago, Ihave always gone to 1200 on my cane sections, and no trouble yet. Ofcourse, I am very meticulous in my varnishing. I have a dustproofvarnishing room and setup, wear latex gloves when handling the =sectionsbefore varnishing and after thoroughly cleaning and degreasing withdenatured alcohol. On bamboo, I think the key to getting the varnish =tostay on the section, isn't so much the texture of the surface, as it =is withwood, but the cleanliness of the surface.Just my opinion, of course. Bob-----Original Message-----From: channer Date: Wednesday, November 10, 1999 6:22 AMSubject: Re: sanding sections At 09:18 AM 11/09/1999 -0600, Bob Nunley wrote:"" "" So, yesterday, I glued up a set of 6 unmatched =scrapstrips and gave it a try this morning. At this =pointmy only concern was "" If it does screw up as it =cures, Iwill post more, if not, you won't hear from me on this again... it =lookslike it is going to do great. too much time on my hands? LOLLater, Bob "" Nunley, RodmakerCustom Split Bamboo Fly Rodshttp://members.clnk.com/caneman/images/flystuff/caneindex.htmBob;The only problem that I can forsee is that the varnish may not stick =to therod, not because of the water, but because you have polished it too =muchand the rod has no "tooth" for the varnish to stick to.Furniture =finisherswill only go so fine on bare wood before varnishing, further =polishing isdone to the coats of finish themselves as there will also be a =chemicalbond as well as a physical bond. I have stripped some old rods that =lokkedvery nice in the few places the finish was still intact, but when I =got allthe varnish off the surface looked to be sanded no finer than 150 =grit. Igo finer, down to about 450(50 micron,whatever the equivalent is) and =havetested to see if I can flake the cured varnish off with my =fingernail, itstayed on very well, but I have noticed that if I go to 1200 grit =first,the varnish will come off with little effort.John ------=_NextPart_000_005C_01BF2BAF.7248AD60 All, need = will easily hidethe = problems. Bill ----- Original Message ----- Bob =Nunley Makers List Serve Sent: Wednesday, November 10, = AMSubject: Re: sanding =sections wood.... technically, it is a grass and doesreact different to = = never went finer than 600 on a violin back (maple) or400 on a top = spruce) but since my first rod, many many years ago, Ihave always = setup, wear latex gloves when handling the sectionsbefore = after thoroughly cleaning and degreasing withdenatured = bamboo, I think the key to getting the varnish tostay on the = isn't so much the texture of the surface, as it is withwood, but = course.Bob-----Original Message-----From: channer = rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu=<rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= = = = ------=_NextPart_000_005C_01BF2BAF.7248AD60-- from HARMS1@prodigy.net Wed Nov 10 18:20:13 1999 Wed, 10 Nov 1999 19:19:45 -0500 ,"rod 'akers" Subject: Re: Enamel boundary="----=_NextPart_000_00A6_01BF2BAF.F9DACB00" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_00A6_01BF2BAF.F9DACB00 Ok. So, since we're wasting bandwidth anyhow, what is "bubble and =squeak"? cheers, Bill Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 1999 1:51 PMSubject: Re: Enamel OK,Sorry aboout this.Toad in the hole is batter and sausages and Spotted Dick is a pudding. =Foranyone who is interested I've attached the recipes.Apologies to those not interested in the bandwidth----- Original Message -----From: timothy troester Sent: 10 November 1999 19:24Subject: Re: Enamel i'm sorry but i'm still confused...and you're notgoing to get to know me any better until i know what aspotted dick and toad in the hole is. timothy --- Tim & Jilly Watson wrote:Dear oh Dear!What a sad lot - not only don't you know what afloat case is but SpottedDick and Toad in the Hole!! Culinary Sacrilige.A float case is a length of culm, normally about3-4" in diameter. The culmis cut just below the node so that the tube has abase, and then cut about9 - 12" above the node. A nice hardwood stopper ismade for the open endand the whole thing is varnished to within a thou ofperfection. Into thistube are placed floats, as in fishing floats.They look great.Now as to Spotted Dick..........well I'm not sure Inow y'all well enoughyet!T----- Original Message -----From: Rick C. Cc: ; Rodmakers Sent: 10 November 1999 02:48Subject: Re: Enamel Exactly Terry!! I'll be the one to fess up here.What in tarnation isa float case?? As far as that goes, what or whois Spotted Dick andToad in the Hole?? One confused SR (Southern Rodmaker). Rick C. TERENCE ACKLAND wrote: Float cases on the list? you might as well ask Tim & Jilly Watson wrote: What does everyone use to get the enameloff the culms.I'mmaking some float cases from 3-4" stock andwould like someadvice.ThanksTim. =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D"Gooda' morning mister bear"__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com ------=_NextPart_000_00A6_01BF2BAF.F9DACB00 squeak"? Bill ----- Original Message ----- & Jilly Watson troester ; rod 'akers Sent: Wednesday, November 10, = PMSubject: Re: EnamelOK,Sorry aboout this.Toad in the hole is batter = I've attached the recipes.Apologies to those not interested in the = bandwidth----- Original Message -----From: timothy troester = <watson@cape-consult.co.uk&g= 'akers <RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.edu= consult.co.uk&g= consult.co.uk&g= = use = = morning = ------=_NextPart_000_00A6_01BF2BAF.F9DACB00-- from channer@hubwest.com Wed Nov 10 18:22:56 1999 (SMTPD32-4.06) id ACE3B17013E; Wed, 10 Nov 1999 17:25:07 MST Subject: Re: sanding sections At 06:54 AM 11/10/1999 -0600, Bob Nunley wrote:John,I have never had any problem with my varnish sticking to my rodsections. I have always sanded down to a 1200 grit. I know on wood thisisnot standard, but bamboo isn't wood.... technically, it is a grass and doesreact different to varnish than wood does. I was a violin maker before Iwas a rodmaker, and i never went finer than 600 on a violin back (maple)or400 on a top (sitka spruce) but since my first rod, many many years ago, Ihave always gone to 1200 on my cane sections, and no trouble yet. Ofcourse, I am very meticulous in my varnishing. I have a dustproofvarnishing room and setup, wear latex gloves when handling the sectionsbefore varnishing and after thoroughly cleaning and degreasing withdenatured alcohol. On bamboo, I think the key to getting the varnish tostay on the section, isn't so much the texture of the surface, as it is withwood, but the cleanliness of the surface.Just my opinion, of course. Bob Bob;If it works, that's all that counts! John from seanmcs@ar.com.au Wed Nov 10 18:32:09 1999 Subject: Southern Hemisphere Gathering List: If small is sometime beautiful, this inaugural SHG was a real goodlooker!The reception offered by Ian Kearney at Nelson on the South Island ofNew Zealand was as warm as the weather was capricious. That allowedtheconcentration of the mind and time on the main topics - thepracticalities and personal experiences of rod making. As well there wasopportunity to sample the several recent rods made by Ian, whoseprincipal characteristics were great casting qualities for a range oflengths and lines. Their appearance was sober and functional, inlow-gloss finish. Some old and not so old rods by such as Hardy, Pezon &Michel and Winston were sampled for comparison, and the Kearney museumof old cane, non-n cane and pre-cane rods and a host of reels admired.The minimal group allowed the preparation from rough of a tip for an 8foot special, through gluing to sanding off. Plus a bit of ferrulemaking and consideration of the several tools, binders and other stuffput together by the Professor himself. recalling that those of us in the Southern Hemisphere are few and farapart, so a chance to go through with one another from whoa to go wasjust grand. Ian's workshop is nothing if not practical and all is inplace to get on with the job in a brisk and enjoyable fashion. Thanks Ian for the great hospitality and maybe you would be willing tothink of another Gathering again if there is interest. Incidentally theNelson region is about the sunniest part of NZ, has miles of fine riversof various sizes with excellent public access; the shellfish and seafishchoice is amazing, and the wines from this region are super. Even thebeer is not at all bad, and helps in understanding the Newzullandtalksometimes! Sean McSharry from hexagon@odyssee.net Wed Nov 10 18:54:50 1999 Subject: Re: Enamel Tim,I am not sure they know what a float is over here. We have "bobbers" whichareround moulded plastic things about 11/2 in dia that require a church roofloadof lead to stop them blowing around. Used to suspend a worm at about afoot fromthe surface.Terry Tim & Jilly Watson wrote: Dear oh Dear!What a sad lot - not only don't you know what a float case is but SpottedDick and Toad in the Hole!! Culinary Sacrilige.A float case is a length of culm, normally about 3-4" in diameter. Theculmis cut just below the node so that the tube has a base, and then cut about9 - 12" above the node. A nice hardwood stopper is made for the openendand the whole thing is varnished to within a thou of perfection. Into thistube are placed floats, as in fishing floats.They look great.Now as to Spotted Dick..........well I'm not sure I now y'all well enoughyet!T----- Original Message -----From: Rick C. Cc: ; Rodmakers Sent: 10 November 1999 02:48Subject: Re: Enamel Exactly Terry!! I'll be the one to fess up here. What in tarnation isa float case?? As far as that goes, what or who is Spotted Dick andToad in the Hole?? One confused SR (Southern Rodmaker). Rick C. TERENCE ACKLAND wrote: Float cases on the list? you might as well ask for the best recipe Tim & Jilly Watson wrote: What does everyone use to get the enamel off the culms.I'mmaking some float cases from 3-4" stock and would like someadvice.ThanksTim. from hexagon@odyssee.net Wed Nov 10 19:07:44 1999 owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu, rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu,TSmithwick@aol.comSubject: Re: rod one Martin,a planed tip section will only have, theoretically, an unbroken length offibersrunning the whole length equivalent to the narrowest width of the tipsectionwhich when plane in the constant turning technique, will be in the middle.Ifplaned all from one side the unbroken fibers will be along one edge and notinthe middle.Just an observation, not trying to trick anyone.terry Martin Jensen wrote: I agree with Chris here. Terry, how come I feel like you were baitingsomeone with this question here (G)?----- Original Message -----From: TERENCE ACKLAND Cc: ; ;; Sent: Tuesday, November 09, 1999 5:56 PMSubject: Re: rod one Once a perfect equilateral triangle is put on the strip, includingremoving theradius from the the outside it is possible to taper the strip byremovingall thecane from one side only. Right? Chris Bogart wrote: Tom It is amazing that finding angles is hard for people. Giving theclassesI have learned not to take anything for granted. Reading the CenterGauge andusing it to find your angle and then techniques to maintain the anglesare notintuitive. Agree with finding angles early and maintaining is the bestcourse butI find people do not get the angles and have little or no clue on how tomaintainthem. Sounds like fodder for another article. Chris On Mon, 8 Nov 1999 23:54:08 EST, TSmithwick@aol.com wrote: OBTW - I should have said that the way to avoid this problem is totakesomeextra time at the rough planing stage and make sure the angles arecorrect atthe beginning. It's much easier to maintain them than it is to correctthem.In general, you will find that extra time spent at the beginning oftheprocess will be more than repaid later on. from ccurrojr@voyager.net Wed Nov 10 19:08:13 1999 Subject: SRG 99 pictures Listers Finally got the Southern Rodmakers website updated with this year'sphotos of nodely fun and frolic. Wish you all could have been there. Here's the address: http://www.curro.net/srg99 cc from hexagon@odyssee.net Wed Nov 10 19:30:16 1999 ,"rod 'akers" Subject: Re: Enamel F8E5450E598A9F1686FD8D45" --------------F8E5450E598A9F1686FD8D45 Bill,Bubble and Squeak is the food of gods, you have to taste it toappreciate it.WILLIAM A HARMS wrote: Ok. So, since we're wasting bandwidth anyhow, what is "bubble andsqueak"? cheers, Bill ----- Original Message -----From: Tim & Jilly Watson Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 1999 1:51 PMSubject: Re: EnamelOK,Sorry aboout this.Toad in the hole is batter and sausages and Spotted Dick isa pudding. Foranyone who is interested I've attached the recipes.Apologies to those not interested in the bandwidth----- Original Message -----From: timothy troester Sent: 10 November 1999 19:24Subject: Re: Enamel i'm sorry but i'm still confused...and you're notgoing to get to know me any better until i know what aspotted dick and toad in the hole is. timothy --- Tim & Jilly Watson wrote:Dear oh Dear!What a sad lot - not only don't you know what afloat case is but SpottedDick and Toad in the Hole!! Culinary Sacrilige.A float case is a length of culm, normally about3-4" in diameter. The culmis cut just below the node so that the tube has abase, and then cut about9 - 12" above the node. A nice hardwood stopper ismade for the open endand the whole thing is varnished to within a thou ofperfection. Into thistube are placed floats, as in fishing floats.They look great.Now as to Spotted Dick..........well I'm not sure Inow y'all well enoughyet!T----- Original Message -----From: Rick C. Cc: ; Rodmakers Sent: 10 November 1999 02:48Subject: Re: Enamel Exactly Terry!! I'll be the one to fess up here.What in tarnation isa float case?? As far as that goes, what or whois Spotted Dick andToad in the Hole?? One confused SR (Southern Rodmaker). Rick C. TERENCE ACKLAND wrote: Float cases on the list? you might as well ask Tim & Jilly Watson wrote: What does everyone use to get the enameloff the culms.I'mmaking some float cases from 3-4" stock andwould like someadvice.ThanksTim. ====="Gooda' morning mister bear"__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com --------------F8E5450E598A9F1686FD8D45 Bill,Bubble and Squeak is the food of gods, you have to taste it toappreciateit.WILLIAM A HARMS wrote: So, since we're wasting bandwidth anyhow, what is "bubble and Bill ----- Original Message ----- From:Tim& Jilly Watson troester ; rod'akers Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 19991:51 PM Subject: Re: Enamel Sorry aboout this.Toad in the hole is batter and sausages and Spotted Dick is a Foranyone who is interested I've attached the recipes.Apologies to those not interested in the bandwidth----- Original Message -----From: timothy troester <tjtrodmaker@yahoo.com> consult.co.uk>;rod 'akers <RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.edu>Sent: 10 November 1999 19:24Subject: Re: Enamel i'm sorry but i'm still confused...and you're notgoing to get to know me any better until i know what a --- Tim & Jilly Watson <watson@cape-consult.co.uk>wrote:Dear oh Dear!What a sad lot - not only don't you know what afloat case is but Spotted A float case is a length of culm, normally about is cut just below the node so that the tube has abase, and then cut about made for the open endand the whole thing is varnished to within a thou of tube are placed floats, as in fishing floats.They look great.Now as to Spotted Dick..........well I'm not sure Inow y'all well enoughyet!T----- Original Message -- ---From: Rick C. <stpete@netten.net> Cc: <watson@cape- consult.co.uk>;Rodmakers<rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu>Sent: 10 November 1999 02:48Subject: Re: Enamel What in tarnation is is Spotted Dick andToad in the Hole?? One confused SR (Southern Rodmaker). Rick C. TERENCE ACKLAND wrote: Tim & Jilly Watson wrote: everyoneuse to get the enameloff the culms.I'm 3-4" stock andwould like some ====="Gooda' morning mister bear"__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com --------------F8E5450E598A9F1686FD8D45-- from hexagon@odyssee.net Wed Nov 10 19:36:47 1999 Subject: Re: Enamel 5507499E08F7A9B68D315975" --------------5507499E08F7A9B68D315975 I dunno Stu, I cannot remember grossly overweight people when I was akid, back when we ate spotted dick with golden syrup.terry Stuart Tod wrote: Terry - My Missus won't make me Spotted Dick - says it's toofattening. Any recipies you may have would be gratefully recieved - Ican make them in my cane oven when she's gone to work.... Stuart ----- Original Message -----From: TERENCE ACKLAND Cc: RodmakersSent: Wednesday, November 10, 1999 2:02 AMSubject: Re: EnamelFloat cases on the list? you might as well ask for thebest recipe for Spotted Dick or Toad in the Hole! Tim & Jilly Watson wrote: What does everyone use to get the enamel off theculms.I'm making some float cases from 3-4" stock andwould like some advice.ThanksTim. --------------5507499E08F7A9B68D315975 I dunno Stu, I cannot remember grossly overweight people when I was akid,back when we ate spotted dick with golden syrup.terry Stuart Tod wrote: Missus won't make me Spotted Dick - says it's too recipies you may have would be gratefully recieved - I can make them in ----- Original Message ----- From:TERENCEACKLAND Cc: Rodmakers Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 19992:02 AM Subject: Re: Enamel recipe for Spotted Dick or Toad in the Hole! Tim & Jilly Watson wrote: What does everyoneuse to get the enamel off the culms.I'm making some float cases from 3-4"stock and would like some advice.ThanksTim. --------------5507499E08F7A9B68D315975-- from wgray@uidaho.edu Wed Nov 10 19:56:54 1999 RAA00575; "Clay & Mary Ann Robinson" SMTP; 11 Nov1999 02:08:33 UT Subject: (Fwd) If you haven't heard... ------- Forwarded message follows -------Date sent: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 08:22:04 -0700Subject: If you haven't heard...Priority: normal VBS/Bubbleboy is a NEW type of worm: Unlike previous worms transmitted through email, this new type of worm does not come as an executable attachment. Instead, VBS/Bubbleboy infects PCs as soon as the transmitting email message is opened. This is a VERY significant innovation! Virus researchers have long assured the public that it is not possible to contract a virus or worm merely and VBS/Bubbleboy marks the beginning of a more dangerous computing environment. VBS/Bubbleboy is transmitted through an email message with the subject heading "Bubbleboy is back!" It will ONLY infect PCs running Windows 98 with Internet Explorer 5 and Outlook or Outlook Express. PCs using Outlook are infected upon opening the email message, while Outlook Express users may be infected by viewing the message with Outlook's "Preview Pane" feature! When the email is opened, the worm creates a file called UPDATE.HTA. The next time the PC is booted up, the worm sends itself embedded in an email to EVERY address in EVERY MS Outlook address book on the local system. It does this only once. ------- End of forwarded message ------- *********************************************************** A government which robs Peter to pay Paul can always depend on the support of Paul. George Bernard Shaw,1944******************************************************** C. Wilson Gray Ph 208.736.3622P O Box 1827 Fax 736.0843Twin Falls, ID 83303-1827 UI, Twin Falls R&E Center email wgray@uidaho.edu ******************************************************** from stpete@netten.net Wed Nov 10 20:25:01 1999 Wed, 10 Nov 1999 20:24:54 -0600 Subject: Re: SRG 99 pictures Thanks Charlie, Great job! AND I can even let my wife see this. You are an excellentfellow with a fine sense of discretion ... I don't care what HB saysabout you. Rick Charles Curro wrote: Listers Finally got the Southern Rodmakers website updated with this year'sphotos of nodely fun and frolic. Wish you all could have been there. Here's the address: http://www.curro.net/srg99 cc from DNHayashida@aol.com Wed Nov 10 20:27:36 1999 Subject: (no subject) Surfing the web I came across www.bamboopoles.comThey are about 20 miles away from me, so I'm goingover there on Saturday to have a look at their stock. I'll keep you posted.Darryl from HomeyDKlown@worldnet.att.net Wed Nov 10 20:30:27 1999 with ESMTP id +0000 Subject: Cork Grip Forming Tip A while ago somsone asked the question of how to rapidly cut cork toform a grip. I just got done making mine for rod number two. I got mycork chucked on a threaded rod and sent it spinning. I then took mytrusty half round compound wood rasp and had at it. Ten minutes andfour grits (80, 120, 220 and 400) of sandpaper later, I had a nicelittle 6" coke bottle grip for my Thramer 444. Cheers, Dennis from DNHayashida@aol.com Wed Nov 10 20:31:24 1999 Subject: New source of Tonkin cane Sorry about the blank subject line on the previous message Surfing the web I came across www.bamboopoles.comThey are about 20 miles away from me, so I'm goingover there on Saturday to have a look at their stock. I'll keep you posted.Darryl from HomeyDKlown@worldnet.att.net Wed Nov 10 20:35:03 1999 with ESMTP id ;Thu, 11 Nov 1999 02:34:19 +0000 timothy troester ,"rod 'akers" Subject: Re: Enamel ...and if made properly (with lard, that is) don't have your cholesterolchecked for a while! Dennis TERENCE ACKLAND wrote: Bill,Bubble and Squeak is the food of gods, you have to taste it toappreciate it.WILLIAM A HARMS wrote: Ok. So, since we're wasting bandwidth anyhow, what is "bubble andsqueak"? cheers, Bill ----- Original Message -----From: Tim & Jilly Watson Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 1999 1:51 PMSubject: Re: EnamelOK,Sorry aboout this.Toad in the hole is batter and sausages and Spotted Dickis a pudding. Foranyone who is interested I've attached the recipes.Apologies to those not interested in the bandwidth----- Original Message -----From: timothy troester Sent: 10 November 1999 19:24Subject: Re: Enamel i'm sorry but i'm still confused...and you're notgoing to get to know me any better until i know what aspotted dick and toad in the hole is. timothy --- Tim & Jilly Watson wrote:Dear oh Dear!What a sad lot - not only don't you know what afloat case is but SpottedDick and Toad in the Hole!! Culinary Sacrilige.A float case is a length of culm, normally about3-4" in diameter. The culmis cut just below the node so that the tube has abase, and then cut about9 - 12" above the node. A nice hardwood stopper ismade for the open endand the whole thing is varnished to within a thou ofperfection. Into thistube are placed floats, as in fishing floats.They look great.Now as to Spotted Dick..........well I'm not sure Inow y'all well enoughyet!T----- Original Message -----From: Rick C. Cc: ; Rodmakers Sent: 10 November 1999 02:48Subject: Re: Enamel Exactly Terry!! I'll be the one to fess up here.What in tarnation isa float case?? As far as that goes, what or whois Spotted Dick andToad in the Hole?? One confused SR (Southern Rodmaker). Rick C. TERENCE ACKLAND wrote: Float cases on the list? you might as well ask Tim & Jilly Watson wrote: What does everyone use to get the enameloff the culms.I'mmaking some float cases from 3-4" stock andwould like someadvice.ThanksTim. ====="Gooda' morning mister bear"__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Wed Nov 10 20:44:58 1999 Wed, 10 Nov 1999 18:44:48 -0800 Subject: Re: SRG 99 pictures Thanks Charlie,Again, without you and Rick urging me on, this wouldn't havebeen nearly so much fun. Great job on the site and the pictures. Onlyproblem is, you're not in any of them. I don't care what Rick says,you're okay in my book. Where's a good smallmouth bass photo when youneed it?If any of you need help identifying someone in the pictures,just let me know. I got most of the names down. I might get one or twoof the first-timers confused, but I got most of them. Looking forward to future gatherings, Da Rev' Charles Curro wrote: Listers Finally got the Southern Rodmakers website updated with this year'sphotos of nodely fun and frolic. Wish you all could have been there. Here's the address: http://www.curro.net/srg99 cc from Canerods@aol.com Wed Nov 10 20:47:50 1999 Subject: Re: Heddon Signature wraps Brian, Ron Huff is correct - you need to provide more details. Don Burns from mevans@acxiom.com Wed Nov 10 21:19:50 1999 (router,SLMail V3.2); Wed, 10 Nov 1999 21:23:14 -0600 (router,SLMail V3.2); Wed, 10 Nov 1999 21:21:18 -0600 (204.107.111.23::mail daemon; unverified,SLMail V3.2); Wed, 10 Nov1999 21:21:17-0600 popmail.conway.acxiom.com ; Wed Nov 1021:21:16 1999 -0600 (5.5.2650.21) GENE.P.HOLLAND@usa.conoco.com, mevans - Mark Evans,lstockett@mpan.com, stockett ,tim treadwell, tom wells ,jeanie riley, rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Crooked Creek Legislation On a little more serious note , for these interested, here's a timely update on the Arkansas Crooked Creek problem - a few minutes to show your support, especially if you use this fishery, goes a long way... (American River has listed Crooked Creek as the 15th most endangered river in America: See: http://www.amrivers.org/20-15.html ) A photo was published today in the Arkansas Flyline showing a section of Crooked Creek. Gravel Mining has obliterated a previous channel, maybe 100 ft. wide, into several thousand square yards or so of gravel slush with no visible river channel. These problems have led the Arkansas Pollution Control and Ecology commission (PCEC) to implement new emergency regulations which are now up for permanent approval in the state senate. There is strong opposition as the mining is backed by very deep pockets and politically influential individuals. A few key concessions have already been made to Reg. 15 to keep it alive. The regulation goes to subcommittee If you 'd like to show some support for this legislation, you can contact:Governor Mike Huckabee: Arkansas State Capital, Little Rock, AR 72201Phone: (501) 682 1382 PCEC, 101 E. Capital, Suite 205, Little Rock, AR 72201Phone (501) 682-7890, Fax (501) 682-7891 from mrj@aa.net Wed Nov 10 21:39:56 1999 Wed, 10 Nov 1999 19:39:50 -0800 Subject: Re: rod one Yes it would do this but then again, what about nodeless rods ( not that Ihave ever built one!)? or sawing?. Also when you make a taper all you aredoing is cutting across the power fibers, or any fibers for that matter. Infact, you are probably cutting across fewer fibers if you planed only oneside of the strip as mentioned (not that I would ever bother to do it. Martin Jensen ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: rod one and none on the other.Skip from EESweet@aol.com Wed Nov 10 21:56:01 1999 Subject: First rod Hi Everyone, So I'm taking a break from wrapping the guides on my first cane rod andjust thought I'd ask; how many of you finished your first rod and thought "This didn't turn out quite as well as I'd hoped..."? I remember reading on the list a while back where someone said they were working on their secondrod, the first one being hidden away in the attic, so I know I'm not alone. Anyone out there have any first rod horror stories they'd like to share so I don't feel like a completely inept tool user? Help!! Ashamed and embarassed in Oakland, Eric Sweet from caneman@clnk.com Wed Nov 10 22:24:25 1999 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35)with SMTP id com; Wed, 10 Nov 1999 22:22:56 -0600 Subject: Re: SRG 99 pictures The pics were great... one question! Something wrong with yourcamera????It didn't do a very good job of picking up the hair on mine and Wayne'sheads! Bob -----Original Message----- Subject: SRG 99 pictures Listers Finally got the Southern Rodmakers website updated with this year'sphotos of nodely fun and frolic. Wish you all could have been there. Here's the address: http://www.curro.net/srg99 cc from caneman@clnk.com Wed Nov 10 22:27:05 1999 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35)with SMTP id com; Wed, 10 Nov 1999 22:25:38 -0600 Subject: Re: First rod Eric,Keep that first rod and don't look back at it til you have a few underyour belt. Many times I thought about stripping down and re-doing myfirstone... but instead, just keep it as a reminder of how things haveprogressed... Whew... my first one... WHAT A DISASTER! But it will all cometogether! Congrats, by the way, on finishing your first! Bob -----Original Message----- Subject: First rod Hi Everyone, So I'm taking a break from wrapping the guides on my first cane rod andjustthought I'd ask; how many of you finished your first rod and thought "Thisdidn't turn out quite as well as I'd hoped..."? I remember reading on thelist a while back where someone said they were working on their secondrod,the first one being hidden away in the attic, so I know I'm not alone.Anyone out there have any first rod horror stories they'd like to share soIdon't feel like a completely inept tool user? Help!! Ashamed and embarassed in Oakland, Eric Sweet from sshorb@ozip.net Wed Nov 10 22:39:23 1999 0600 Subject: Re: rod one Well, we shore whupped up on that one. Come on Terry, toss outanother'n.Skip from anglport@con2.com Wed Nov 10 22:44:23 1999 (SMTPD32-5.05) id A95732A70308; Wed, 10 Nov 1999 23:43:03 -0500 "Clay & Mary Ann Robinson" Subject: Re: (Fwd) If you haven't heard... I just got an update from McAfee which says it'll stop it. If you're usingViruscan, you can get it at: McAfee.com Sounds like we are all at risk if one of us gets it!Art I find I can download more successfully (and faster) if I connect to amirror that's LITERALLY half-way 'round the world. Those people areasleepwhile I want it and vice versa. At 06:58 PM 11/10/1999 -0700, wgray@uidaho.edu wrote: ------- Forwarded message follows -------Date sent: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 08:22:04 -0700Subject: If you haven't heard...Priority: normal VBS/Bubbleboy is a NEW type of worm: Unlike previous worms transmitted through email, this new type of worm does not come as an executable attachment. Instead, VBS/Bubbleboy infects PCs as soon as the transmitting email message is opened. This is a VERY significant innovation! Virus researchers have long assured the public that it is not possible to contract a virus or worm merely and VBS/Bubbleboy marks the beginning of a more dangerous computing environment. VBS/Bubbleboy is transmitted through an email message with the subject heading "Bubbleboy is back!" It will ONLY infect PCs running Windows 98 with Internet Explorer 5 and Outlook or Outlook Express. PCs using Outlook are infected upon opening the email message, while Outlook Express users may be infected by viewing the message with Outlook's "Preview Pane" feature! When the email is opened, the worm creates a file called UPDATE.HTA. The next time the PC is booted up, the worm sends itself embedded in an email to EVERY address in EVERY MS Outlook address book on the local system. It does this only once. ------- End of forwarded message ------- *********************************************************** A government which robs Peter to pay Paul can always depend on the support of Paul. George Bernard Shaw,1944******************************************************** C. Wilson Gray Ph 208.736.3622P O Box 1827 Fax 736.0843Twin Falls, ID 83303-1827 UI, Twin Falls R&E Center email wgray@uidaho.edu ******************************************************** *Some people can tell what time it is by looking at the sun, but I never have been able to make out the numbers.* from anglport@con2.com Wed Nov 10 22:48:21 1999 (SMTPD32-5.05) id AA67CAA0348; Wed, 10 Nov 1999 23:47:35 -0500 Subject: Re: First rod Eric,My first rod was a beaut, for about 5 or 6 months. When itdelaminated, itcame cleanly apart into 18 strips (Wrong mix of Urac). Still have thestrips, don't call 'em a rod anymore though.Art At 10:55 PM 11/10/1999 EST, EESweet@aol.com wrote:Hi Everyone, So I'm taking a break from wrapping the guides on my first cane rod andjust thought I'd ask; how many of you finished your first rod and thought "This didn't turn out quite as well as I'd hoped..."? I remember reading on the list a while back where someone said they were working on their secondrod, the first one being hidden away in the attic, so I know I'm not alone. Anyone out there have any first rod horror stories they'd like to share soI don't feel like a completely inept tool user? Help!! Ashamed and embarassed in Oakland, Eric Sweet *Some people can tell what time it is by looking at the sun, but I never have been able to make out the numbers.* from EESweet@aol.com Thu Nov 11 02:26:30 1999 Subject: First Rod Thanks for all the encouraging words everyone. It's nice to know the first couple can be less than perfect and still not be failures. The catalog of mistakes I made will come in handy for making the next one better. Except for a coat of wax, it's done. I can't wait to cast it, warts and all. Thanks to everyone who offered advice along the way, this would havebeen a much more painful journey otherwise. Seeing as tomorrow has crept up on me, guess I'll call it a night. Or I could get started on that Sir D I've been wanting... Eric from Michael.Roberts@health.wa.gov.au Thu Nov 11 03:35:48 1999 (5.5.2448.0) rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: RE: SRG1999 Welcome aboard George! I wasn't there because I live in the land of Oz(Australia) which is sooooo far away you'd get a headache thinking aboutit.Glad you all had a good time. Mike -----Original Message----- Subject: SRG1999 To All, As a newcomer, I was very impressed. I wish I had the time tothank everyone there. and will in time. But I believe that the SRG99, wasa change for My future, Thank you one and all. George Knight from dan_cooney@attglobal.net Thu Nov 11 05:40:52 1999 SMTP +0000 Subject: SRG 99 Photos Super job, Charlie. The shot of Clara on the cover page is great. Ireally appreciate the job you did with the website and the pictures.Next year we've got to get you in some of the photos. Thanks.Dan Cooney from earsdws@duke.edu Thu Nov 11 06:35:22 1999 HAA22561; Subject: Re: First rod Eric et al.,Only be ashamed and embarassed if you did NOT try building a rod frombamboo rods,it takes a real man to face failure in making one from bamboo. Keep inmind thatno matter how bad the rod looks, it will still be useful on anyone whomightpoint out it's cosmetic flaws.dws. EESweet@aol.com wrote: Hi Everyone, So I'm taking a break from wrapping the guides on my first cane rod andjustthought I'd ask; how many of you finished your first rod and thought "Thisdidn't turn out quite as well as I'd hoped..."? I remember reading on thelist a while back where someone said they were working on their secondrod,the first one being hidden away in the attic, so I know I'm not alone.Anyone out there have any first rod horror stories they'd like to share soIdon't feel like a completely inept tool user? Help!! Ashamed and embarassed in Oakland, Eric Sweet from tjtrodmaker@yahoo.com Thu Nov 11 06:46:07 1999 1999 04:46:04 PST Subject: Re: First Rod eric, they can all be less than perfect and none befailures. timothy troester --- EESweet@aol.com wrote:Thanks for all the encouraging words everyone. It'snice to know the first couple can be less than perfect and still not befailures. The catalog of mistakes I made will come in handy for making thenext one better. Except for a coat of wax, it's done. I can't waitto cast it, warts and all. Thanks to everyone who offered advice along theway, this would have been a much more painful journey otherwise. Seeing as tomorrow has crept up on me, guess I'llcall it a night. Or I could get started on that Sir D I've been wanting... Eric ====="Gooda' morning mister bear"__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com from jackdale@uswest.net Thu Nov 11 08:49:19 1999 (209.180.254.227) Subject: Re: Fw: company logo copyrights True, as far as it goes, but the real reason you need to register yourmark is this: If a large corporation wants to use the same mark and youhaven't registered it, their lawyers will do the Alabama Dick Dance allover your common law copyright or trademark, relying on the fact thatyou can't outspend them in court. Registration discourages this oldAmerican tradition. Sad, but true.Jack Dale Ed Riddle wrote: -----Original Message-----From: Jerry Madigan Date: Wednesday, November 10, 1999 10:55 AMSubject: Re: company logo copyrights Generally, just marking something as copyrighted makesit copyrighed immediately. Subsequent registratonjust helps in lawsuits defending it and can be doneanytime. Not a lawyer, but have asked one before. --- Ed Riddle wrote:Find yourself a local Patent Attorney and plyhim/her with a few "SingleMalts" :-)Ed-----Original Message-----From: ANDREW J INGRAM Cc: TragicH23@juno.com Date: Wednesday, November 10, 1999 1:34 AMSubject: company logo copyrights anyone out there know how to go about getting acompany copyright ontheir logo? i keep running into roadblocks. ai ===== __________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com from caneman@clnk.com Thu Nov 11 08:54:59 1999 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35)with SMTP id com; Thu, 11 Nov 1999 08:53:27 -0600 Subject: Re: SRG 99 pictures Tony,They say a photo adds 15 pounds to you... I was just hoping that a poundor so of it might be on my head and not all on my stomache! Bob-----Original Message----- Subject: Re: SRG 99 pictures What Hair, He did not use a microscope.Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com Bob Nunley wrote: The pics were great... one question! Something wrong with yourcamera????It didn't do a very good job of picking up the hair on mine and Wayne'sheads! Bob -----Original Message-----From: Charles Curro Date: Wednesday, November 10, 1999 7:18 PMSubject: SRG 99 pictures Listers Finally got the Southern Rodmakers website updated with this year'sphotos of nodely fun and frolic. Wish you all could have been there. Here's the address: http://www.curro.net/srg99 cc from LambersonW@missouri.edu Thu Nov 11 09:06:54 1999 (5.5.2650.21) ,Donald Newton ,GENE.P.HOLLAND@usa.conoco.com,lstockett@mpan.com, stockett ,tim treadwell, tom wells ,jeanie riley, rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: RE: Crooked Creek Legislation Governor Huckabee's email address is: mike.huckabee@state.ar.us -----Original Message----- Evans; lstockett@mpan.com; stockett; tim treadwell; tom wells; jeanieriley; rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Crooked Creek Legislation On a little more serious note , for these interested, here's a timely update on the Arkansas Crooked Creek problem - a few minutes to show your support, especially if you use this fishery, goes a long way... (American River has listed Crooked Creek as the 15th most endangered river in America: See: http://www.amrivers.org/20-15.html) A photo was published today in the Arkansas Flyline showing a section of Crooked Creek. Gravel Mining has obliterated a previous channel, maybe 100 ft. wide, into several thousand square yards or so of gravel slush with no visible river channel. These problems have led the Arkansas Pollution Control and Ecology commission (PCEC) to implement new emergency regulations which are now up for permanent approval in the state senate. There is strong opposition as the mining is backed by very deep pockets and politically influential individuals. A few key concessions have already been made to Reg. 15 to keep it alive. The regulation goes to subcommittee If you 'd like to show some support for this legislation, you can contact:Governor Mike Huckabee: Arkansas State Capital, Little Rock, AR 72201Phone: (501) 682 1382 PCEC, 101 E. Capital, Suite 205, Little Rock, AR 72201Phone (501) 682-7890, Fax (501) 682-7891 from mrj@aa.net Thu Nov 11 09:30:20 1999 Thu, 11 Nov 1999 07:29:59 -0800 Subject: Re: First rod I almost quit rod making after me first rod. I hated (still do )straightening, I just couldn't figure out how to get 60 degree angles andwhen done my measurements were .040 off in some places.. I broke 2splineswhile planing and ended up with a tip section that has 4 nodes right nexttoeach other. I thought it would break on the first cast (it didn't). I hadbuilt lots of Graphite rods before so my finishing skills were adequatethough. I fish a WF7 line with it. Have caught 4 LB Kamloops trout with itand I like it better than the original. The .040 extra gave it a little morebackbone in places that needed it. (The original flexed into the handle, Idon't like that).----- Original Message - ---- Subject: First rod Hi Everyone, So I'm taking a break from wrapping the guides on my first cane rod andjustthought I'd ask; how many of you finished your first rod and thought "Thisdidn't turn out quite as well as I'd hoped..."? I remember reading on thelist a while back where someone said they were working on their secondrod,the first one being hidden away in the attic, so I know I'm not alone.Anyone out there have any first rod horror stories they'd like to share soIdon't feel like a completely inept tool user? Help!! Ashamed and embarassed in Oakland, Eric Sweet from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Thu Nov 11 09:57:24 1999 Thu, 11 Nov 1999 07:57:07 -0800 Subject: Re: Southern Hemisphere Gathering Sean,Sounds like y'all had a good time. I'm really getting into theGatherings.Maybe I can join you one of these days. Maybe when I retire, in 2024 AD. Harry Boyd Sean McSharry wrote: List: If small is sometime beautiful, this inaugural SHG was a real goodlooker!The reception offered by Ian Kearney at Nelson on the South Island ofNew Zealand was as warm as the weather was capricious. That allowedtheconcentration of the mind and time on the main topics - thepracticalities and personal experiences of rod making. As well there wasopportunity to sample the several recent rods made by Ian, whoseprincipal characteristics were great casting qualities for a range oflengths and lines. Their appearance was sober and functional, inlow-gloss finish. Some old and not so old rods by such as Hardy, Pezon &Michel and Winston were sampled for comparison, and the Kearneymuseumof old cane, non-n cane and pre-cane rods and a host of reels admired.The minimal group allowed the preparation from rough of a tip for an 8foot special, through gluing to sanding off. Plus a bit of ferrulemaking and consideration of the several tools, binders and other stuffput together by the Professor himself. recalling that those of us in the Southern Hemisphere are few and farapart, so a chance to go through with one another from whoa to go wasjust grand. Ian's workshop is nothing if not practical and all is inplace to get on with the job in a brisk and enjoyable fashion. Thanks Ian for the great hospitality and maybe you would be willing tothink of another Gathering again if there is interest. Incidentally theNelson region is about the sunniest part of NZ, has miles of fine riversof various sizes with excellent public access; the shellfish and seafishchoice is amazing, and the wines from this region are super. Even thebeer is not at all bad, and helps in understanding the Newzullandtalksometimes! Sean McSharry from k5vkq@ix.netcom.com Thu Nov 11 10:29:25 1999 1999 11:29:22 -0500 timothy troester ,"rod \'akers" Subject: Re: Re: Enamel Do you eat it while running from a Goyonder or share it with a Mugwump ora Mylarmorebird? Regards,Onisk5vkq@ix.netcom.com hexagon@odyssee.net wrote: Bill,Bubble and Squeak is the food of gods, you have to taste it to appreciateit.WILLIAM A HARMS wrote: Ok. So, since we're wasting bandwidth anyhow, what is "bubble andsqueak"? cheers,Bill ----- Original Message ----- Tim& Jilly Watson troester ; rod'akers 1:51 PM Subject: Re: EnamelOK,Sorry aboout this.Toad in the hole is batter and sausages and Spotted Dick is a pudding. Foranyone who is interested I've attached the recipes.Apologies to those not interested in the bandwidth----- Original Message -----From: timothy troester tjtrodmaker@yahoo.com> consult.co.uk>;rod 'akers RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.edu>Sent: 10 November 1999 19:24Subject: Re: Enamel i'm sorry but i'm still confused...and you're notgoing to get to know me any better until i know what aspotted dick and toad in the hole is. timothy --- Tim & Jilly Watson watson@cape-consult.co.uk>wrote:Dear oh Dear!What a sad lot - not only don't you know what afloat case is but SpottedDick and Toad in the Hole!! Culinary Sacrilige.A float case is a length of culm, normally about3-4" in diameter. The culmis cut just below the node so that the tube has abase, and then cut about9 - 12" above the node. A nice hardwood stopper ismade for the open endand the whole thing is varnished to within a thou ofperfection. Into thistube are placed floats, as in fishing floats.They look great.Now as to Spotted Dick..........well I'm not sure Inow y'all well enoughyet!T----- Original Message -----From: Rick C. stpete@netten.net> Cc: watson@cape- consult.co.uk>;Rodmakersrodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu>Sent: 10 November 1999 02:48Subject: Re: Enamel Exactly Terry!! I'll be the one to fess up here.What in tarnation isa float case?? As far as that goes, what or whois Spotted Dick and