from sniderja@email.uc.edu Wed Dec 1 08:16:56 1999 Subject: Re: gorilla glue I am EXTREMELY inexperienced as a rod builder--I state this up front.Saying this, I have used Shell Epon on 13 rods over the past three years.Five of these rods have seen 200+ fishing days on the Missouri River inMontana for the past two years---used in the middle of winter duringheavymidge hatches and in the heat of July during heavy caddis and Tricohatches. They have been used from drift boats and tubing on ranch ponds. Ihad an opportunity to inspect them carefully this past summer and theyareholding up (for all of my own rodbuilding inadequacies) extremely well--nosets, no gaps, etc. These are all short, one-piece rods 4'4", 5'0", 5'6",6'0", and have been used to land fish up to seven pounds. These rods areall nodeless and built using Titebond II for the splices and Epon forgluing up the strips. But who knows, having stated this, my very next rodmay fail?J. Snider At 10:11 AM 12/1/1999 +0800, Tony Young wrote:I'm sorry to have cast doubt about the Shell Epon. I really thing theproblems I had and wrote about are due to a local supplier problem NOTtheglue.As I wrote, I'm not even sure I was supplied with Shell Epon becuase itbehaved so differently to what I expected based on the previous batch Ihad. Tony At 07:44 PM 11/30/99 -0500, bob maulucci wrote:Ready to glue rod one. So far, only a couple cuts to the hands and pretty good strips. I have Gorilla Glue, Tite Bond II, and Shell Epon on hand to choose from. I am afraid the Epoxy will get screwed up in the mix, the Tite Bond II will fail, and the Gorilla Glue will distort the dimensions when it foams out.I will probably hand rub with Tung Oil to seal and then use P&L R-10 to finish off, if that matters. If I use Gorilla Glue for a rod, do I need to wet the surfaces with a spritz of water? Thanks in advance,BobBob Maulucci==================================================downandacross.com productionswebsite, audio, and print designhttp://www.downandacross.com218 Wallace AvenueBuffalo, NY 14216716-836-8297 home716-867-0523 cellularbob@downandacross.com /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html And this our life, exempt from public haunt,Finds tongues in trees, books in running brooks,Sermons in stones, and good in everything. William Shakespeare, As You Like It /*************************************************************************/ from tjtrodmaker@yahoo.com Wed Dec 1 08:34:13 1999 1999 06:33:04 PST Subject: Re: gorilla glue --- Jerry Snider wrote:I am EXTREMELY inexperienced as a rod builder--Istate this up front.Saying this, I have used Shell Epon on 13 rods overthe past three years.Five of these rods have seen 200+ fishing days onthe Missouri River inMontana for the past two years---used in the middleof winter during heavymidge hatches and in the heat of July during heavycaddis and Tricohatches. They have been used from drift boats andtubing on ranch ponds. Ihad an opportunity to inspect them carefully thispast summer and they areholding up (for all of my own rodbuildinginadequacies) extremely well--nosets, no gaps, etc. These are all short, one-piecerods 4'4", 5'0", 5'6",6'0", and have been used to land fish up to sevenpounds. These rods areall nodeless and built using Titebond II for thesplices and Epon forgluing up the strips. But who knows, having statedthis, my very next rodmay fail?J. Snider there are no failures, only opportunities and learningexperiences; or so i've heard it said. at least if itever happens now you can afford to be philosophicalabout it. timothy ====="Gooda' morning mister bear"__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. All in one place.Yahoo! Shopping: http://shopping.yahoo.com from brookside.rod@juno.com Wed Dec 1 09:40:59 1999 09:36:30 EST Subject: Dickerson tapers from Howell While going thru this mornings' mail from the list I managed to confusethe print button with the delete button and lost the post which discussedtwo Dickerson tapers which were published in Howells' book. Wouldanyonecare to paste this message (text) into an email and send it to me offlist? I like to hang onto this sort of Dickerson info and lost this onebefore I could print it. Thanks ___________________________________________________________________Get the Internet just the way you want it.Free software, free e- mail, and free Internet access for a month!Try Juno Web: http://dl.www.juno.com/dynoget/tagj. from gjm80301@yahoo.com Wed Dec 1 10:01:13 1999 1999 07:59:33 PST Subject: Question on Asian (Grizzly/Enco) lathes I have been watching 9-13" lathes go on Ebay for awhile now. South Bend/Atlas lathes go from $800 to$1200 and 13" lathes got from $1200 to $2,000. Theseare for lathes averaging 30 years in age. Some ofthem look like crap. Are these lathes significantly superior to the heaviernew asian lathes for our purposes? Grizzly has a12x36 with 1.5 hp, 1.45 spindle bore that weighs 1,000pounds for $2300 delivered with a cabinet and twoself-centering chucks. (This is the same lathe thatEnco sells for about $500 more). You real metalworkers out there - please advise.__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. All in one place.Yahoo! Shopping: http://shopping.yahoo.com from jon.beckton@asml.nl Wed Dec 1 10:05:54 1999 (MET) (MET) Subject: [Fwd: Bamboo Rod] I'm posting this for a subscriber to a fly-tying list I belong to. Forfurther information, you can contact him direct on: cbrown73@mindspring.com Many thanks, both from me and Carter Jon Beckton Carter Brown wrote: I have just run across a 50 year old bamboo fly rod that has neverbeen used. Can anyone help me figure out how much it could be worth.It is a 9 foot mid flex, made by Kiraku & Co. out of Tokyo. It looksbrand new and is still in the original case. Thanks for the help. Carter from darrell@rockclimbing.org Wed Dec 1 10:09:30 1999 sims.3.5.1999.09.16.21.57.p8)with SMTP id for Subject: Re: gorilla glue You're too modest... it's more fun to "Gehrke It Up" a little... Darrell----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: gorilla glue I am EXTREMELY inexperienced as a rod builder--I state this up front.Saying this, I have used Shell Epon on 13 rods over the past three years.Five of these rods have seen 200+ fishing days on the Missouri River inMontana for the past two years---used in the middle of winter duringheavymidge hatches and in the heat of July during heavy caddis and Tricohatches. They have been used from drift boats and tubing on ranch ponds.Ihad an opportunity to inspect them carefully this past summer and theyareholding up (for all of my own rodbuilding inadequacies) extremely well--nosets, no gaps, etc. These are all short, one-piece rods 4'4", 5'0", 5'6",6'0", and have been used to land fish up to seven pounds. These rods areall nodeless and built using Titebond II for the splices and Epon forgluing up the strips. But who knows, having stated this, my very nextrodmay fail?J. Snider from nobler@satx.rr.com Wed Dec 1 10:30:28 1999 SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.197.19);Wed, 1 Dec 1999 10:30:39 -0600 Subject: Re: Question on Asian (Grizzly/Enco) lathes boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0009_01BF3BE7.1BC2D220" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0009_01BF3BE7.1BC2D220 A Southbend, in decent condition, is easily worth $800. The best of all, = bore, as I recall. The only lower priced Asian product I know of, is the Jet. Jet's come in =at least two quality ranges. The high grade will have a spec sheet with =it, showing run-out at the spindle, etc.. If you will be making nothing =more complicated than ferrules, the lower grade will work fine. I'm just =leery of stuff coming out of mainland China ! If only their =craftsmanship, was up to the standards of their cane ! GMA Sent: Wednesday, December 01, 1999 9:59 AMSubject: Question on Asian (Grizzly/Enco) lathes I have been watching 9-13" lathes go on Ebay for awhile now. South Bend/Atlas lathes go from $800 to$1200 and 13" lathes got from $1200 to $2,000. Theseare for lathes averaging 30 years in age. Some ofthem look like crap. Are these lathes significantly superior to the heaviernew asian lathes for our purposes? Grizzly has a12x36 with 1.5 hp, 1.45 spindle bore that weighs 1,000pounds for $2300 delivered with a cabinet and twoself-centering chucks. (This is the same lathe thatEnco sells for about $500 more). You real metalworkers out there - please advise.__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. All in one place.Yahoo! Shopping: http://shopping.yahoo.com ------=_NextPart_000_0009_01BF3BE7.1BC2D220 A Southbend, in decent condition, is easily= $800. The best of all, for our work, is called a "Light Ten", and has a = 2-1/4" spindle bore, as I recall. The only lower priced Asian product I know of, is the Jet. = come in at least two quality ranges. The high grade will have a spec = more complicated than ferrules, the lower grade will work fine. I'm just = of stuff coming out of mainland China ! If only their craftsmanship, was = the standards of their cane ! GMA ----- Original Message ----- Jerry = = Sent: Wednesday, December 01, = AMSubject: Question on Asian = lathesI have been watching 9-13" lathes go on Ebay for = = twoself-centering chucks. (This is the same lathe thatEnco = advise.__________________________________________________Do = place.Yahoo! Shopping: http://shopping.yahoo.com ------=_NextPart_000_0009_01BF3BE7.1BC2D220-- from rsgould@cmc.net Wed Dec 1 12:04:09 1999 Subject: Spiral rod boundary="----=_NextPart_000_003A_01BF3BE3.64AF7AA0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_003A_01BF3BE3.64AF7AA0 Hi to all,As indicated in a previous posting I've been working on my first spiral =rod. Earlier I finished the butt section and offered a scan of the form =used. Now I've taken the tip section out of the string and have made a =scan of the form modified to do that part of the job. It's too many =bytes to go with this posting but I could send it directly to you if you =wish along with instructions as to how to use it. Wow, what a project, I =hope it's worth the effort!Ray ------=_NextPart_000_003A_01BF3BE3.64AF7AA0 Hi to all,As indicated in a previous posting I've= working on my first spiral rod. Earlier I finished the butt section and = a scan of the form used. Now I've taken the tip section out of the = have made a scan of the form modified to do that part of the job. It's = bytes to go with this posting but I could send it directly to you if you = along with instructions as to how to use it. Wow, what a project, I hope = worth the effort!Ray ------=_NextPart_000_003A_01BF3BE3.64AF7AA0-- from mevans@acxiom.com Wed Dec 1 15:07:13 1999 (router,SLMail V3.2); Wed, 01 Dec 1999 15:11:26 -0600 (router,SLMail V3.2); Wed, 01 Dec 1999 15:07:39 -0600 (204.107.111.23::mail daemon; unverified,SLMail V3.2); Wed, 01 Dec1999 15:07:39-0600 popmail.conway.acxiom.com ; Wed Dec 0115:07:38 1999 -0600 (5.5.2650.21) Subject: Dickerson tapers - Allowing for Varnish In Jack Howell's book, these two Dickerson tapersare listed without stating whether they weretaken over varnish. Ian and I have had a short off list discussion on this and have concluded that we don't know - andquestion how much difference it makes to add or deducta uniform .004 to .006 from this taper. This is my first rod, so obviously I don't know. But, I deducted .006 for the varnish - assuming that a1952 taper was measured over varnish. (I'm also building throw a 6.) I also looked up the 7613 taper a few different places and found three fairly different tapers - so ? I'd appreciate your thoughts ... Sorry to be to long winded ... -----Original Message----- Subject: Dickerson tapers Several people have asked me to post the details of the Dickerson #5 and#7tapers. .... from DNHayashida@aol.com Wed Dec 1 15:50:56 1999 Subject: Re: Dickerson tapers - Allowing for Varnish Graph up the stress curve. It will become evident ifthe varnish is on or not - If you know the line weight.Darryl In Jack Howell's book, these two Dickerson tapersare listed without stating whether they weretaken over varnish. Ian and I have had a short off list discussion on this and have concluded that we don't know - andquestion how much difference it makes to add or deducta uniform .004 to .006 from this taper. This is my first rod, so obviously I don't know. But, I deducted .006 for the varnish - assuming that a1952 taper was measured over varnish. (I'm also building throw a 6.) I also looked up the 7613 taper a few different places and found three fairly different tapers - so ? I'd appreciate your thoughts ... Sorry to be to long winded ... from dellc@nextdim.com Wed Dec 1 16:39:17 1999 (SMTPD32-4.06) id AFB89CA3012E; Wed, 01 Dec 1999 14:22:48 PST Subject: Re: Spiral rod boundary="----=_NextPart_000_023A_01BF3C09.D0357600" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_023A_01BF3C09.D0357600 Hi Ray, I have made 3 spiral rods using Lambuth's method and sorry to =say that I can not see any great difference between them and the same =tapers made without the twist.Dell in digest mode.Dell & Marie CoppockThe Flyfisher& the Quilterhttp://www.trwebsites.com/dell/e-mail dellc@nextdim.comflyfisher@nextdim.com Sent: Wednesday, December 01, 1999 10:04 AMSubject: Spiral rod Hi to all,As indicated in a previous posting I've been working on my first =spiral rod. Earlier I finished the butt section and offered a scan of =the form used. Now I've taken the tip section out of the string and have =made a scan of the form modified to do that part of the job. It's too =many bytes to go with this posting but I could send it directly to you =if you wish along with instructions as to how to use it. Wow, what a =project, I hope it's worth the effort!Ray ------=_NextPart_000_023A_01BF3C09.D0357600 Hi Ray, I have made 3 spiral rods using = and sorry to say that I can not see any great difference between them = same tapers made without the twist.Dell in digest mode.Dell & Marie CoppockThe Flyfisher& the flyfisher@nextdim.com ----- Original Message ----- Ray =Gould = Sent: Wednesday, December 01, = AMSubject: Spiral rod Hi to all,As indicated in a previous posting = working on my first spiral rod. Earlier I finished the butt section = offered a scan of the form used. Now I've taken the tip section out of = string and have made a scan of the form modified to do that part of = It's too many bytes to go with this posting but I could send it = you if you wish along with instructions as to how to use it. Wow, what = project, I hope it's worth the effort!Ray ------=_NextPart_000_023A_01BF3C09.D0357600-- from rmoon@ida.net Wed Dec 1 17:04:44 1999 Subject: Re: Spiral rod What have you made Dell. I foound that my two piece rods didn't reallyexcite me but I have built both a 6' and a 7' one piece that werefantastic. IMHO!!!!~@!Ralph from ROBERT.KOPE@prodigy.net Wed Dec 1 19:25:09 1999 Subject: Luis Marden boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0014_01BF3C21.67587160" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0014_01BF3C21.67587160 I apologize for the bandwidth, but some may be interested in this. National Public Radio aired a segment on the fascinating career of Luis =Marden on Monday, November 29. Marden worked for the National =Geographic as a writer/photographer for something like 60 years, and is =author of the book "The Angler's Bamboo". His article on bamboo in the =October 1980 National Geographic initially piqued my interest in bamboo =and planted the seeds that eventually led me to rodmaking. The segment is about 7 min in length, and ran on NPR's Morning Edition =under the heading of Geographic Century. If you're interested you can = =http://search.npr.org/cf/cmn/cmnpd01fm.cfm?PrgDate=3D11%2F29%2F1999&PrgID==3D3 or go to http://www.npr.org/programs/morning/ and follow the links through their archives. -- Robert Kope ------=_NextPart_000_0014_01BF3C21.67587160 I apologize for the bandwidth, but some may be interested in =this.National Public Radio aired a segment on the fascinating career= as a writer/photographer for something like 60 years, and is author of = = October 1980 National Geographic initially piqued my interest in bamboo = in = and ran on NPR's Morning Edition under the heading of Geographic = If you're interested you can download the audio file and listen to it at = -- Robert Kope ------=_NextPart_000_0014_01BF3C21.67587160-- from EESweet@aol.com Wed Dec 1 19:42:52 1999 Subject: Re: Dickerson tapers - Allowing for Varnish Mark,I was curious about that last night, so entered both of the 8015's and the heavier of the 7613's into Hexrod. What I found with the 8015's stress curves was that the Guide maxed out at 240K with a really even (and fast) drop in the numbers (increase in stiffness), and the Guide Special maxedat 230K with just as fast a drop in the numbers, though with a lumpier curve. I expect that if you were to cast two rods made *exactly* to both specsyou'd be hard pressed to tell a difference. The stress curves would also lead me to believe that these were measured without varnish. The 7613 on the other hand, may well have been measured with varnish. It's stress curve maxed out at 180K with a stress curve very similar to theSir D. Thinking of what Howell said about it being able to take a 6, I charted it that way too and ended up with a max of 245K. All this suggests to methat it would either be VERY powerful as a 5, or underlined, and may be best suited to a 6. Ran out of time or I would have subtracted .006 for the varnish to how much difference that would have made. Keeping in mind that I've made all of ONE rod so far, and it broke, please take the preceding with one huge grain of salt. On an unrelated topic, I just finished building a Smithwick binder. I think it took all of 3-4 hours. What a great design. For those thinking about it, I found everything needed in 1 hour of shopping at Orchard SupplyHardware. Great store, and add the usual disclaimers...Eric In Jack Howell's book, these two Dickerson tapersare listed without stating whether they weretaken over varnish. Ian and I have had a short off list discussion on this and have concluded that we don't know - andquestion how much difference it makes to add or deducta uniform .004 to .006 from this taper. This is my first rod, so obviously I don't know. But, I deducted .006 for the varnish - assuming that a1952 taper was measured over varnish. (I'm also building throw a 6.) I also looked up the 7613 taper a few different places and found three fairly different tapers - so ? I'd appreciate your thoughts ... Sorry to be to long winded ... from TSmithwick@aol.com Wed Dec 1 20:28:29 1999 Subject: Re: Spiral rod rsgould@cmc.net,rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu In a message dated 12/1/99 10:42:00 PM, dellc@nextdim.com wrote: I am suprised to hear you say that Dell. I have seen significant differences every time. The differences are not so apparent with short casts, but in distance casting the spiral rods are always superior. That's the main advantage of them, they don't feel much stiffer in normal short range casting, but they have the reserve power when you need it. from rsgould@cmc.net Wed Dec 1 21:09:52 1999 , Subject: Re: Re: Spiral rod I agree Tom, that the twisted rod is stiffer. In fact a hex rod twisted aninfinite number of times becomes a circular cross section whose diameteristhe distance across the corners of the hex and thus has a cross sectionwhose moment of inertia is greater than that of the inscribed hex.Ray----- Original Message ----- ; Subject: Re: Spiral rod In a message dated 12/1/99 10:42:00 PM, dellc@nextdim.com wrote: can not see any great difference between them and the same tapers madewithout the twist.>> I am suprised to hear you say that Dell. I have seen significantdifferencesevery time. The differences are not so apparent with short casts, but indistance casting the spiral rods are always superior. That's the mainadvantage of them, they don't feel much stiffer in normal short rangecasting, but they have the reserve power when you need it. from dellc@nextdim.com Wed Dec 1 21:50:03 1999 (SMTPD32-4.06) id A88A4D7C0126; Wed, 01 Dec 1999 19:33:30 PST , Subject: Re: Re: Spiral rod I did build one spiral using a Lambuth taper, #26, 8'6" 4 1/2 oz. for 7wt.out of his book that does seem to be quite a strong rod, but not havingbuilt one without the spiral I can't compare.DellDell & Marie CoppockThe Flyfisher& the Quilterhttp://www.trwebsites.com/dell/e-mail dellc@nextdim.comflyfisher@nextdim.com----- Original Message ----- ; Subject: Re: Spiral rod In a message dated 12/1/99 10:42:00 PM, dellc@nextdim.com wrote: can not see any great difference between them and the same tapers madewithout the twist.>> I am suprised to hear you say that Dell. I have seen significantdifferencesevery time. The differences are not so apparent with short casts, but indistance casting the spiral rods are always superior. That's the mainadvantage of them, they don't feel much stiffer in normal short rangecasting, but they have the reserve power when you need it. from djk762@hotmail.com Wed Dec 1 21:54:48 1999 Wed, 01 Dec 1999 19:54:11 PST Subject: Dickerson Mania Rodmakers, Fished a Dickerson taper today. 8013 1951 version from Howell's book. Nymphed with a dropper, swung soft hackles, double hauled dries and delivered them gently on glassy water. Landed 16 inch bows in strong current.I absolutely love this rod. The 8014 and 8015 will be next on the form.David KashubaFair Oaks CA ______________________________________________________Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com from bob@downandacross.com Wed Dec 1 22:09:11 1999 (envelope- from bob@downandacross.com) Subject: NPR redux boundary="=====================_22997343==_.ALT" --=====================_22997343==_.ALT Speaking of NPR and "Morning Edition," there was a segment today aboutcork growers in Portugal. I guess the current trend in wine making is rubber corks. The cork farmers are in danger of being put out of work. It seems the artificial cork does not carry a certain microbe that can ruin the bottled wine. The segment aired 12/1 and can be heard at the NPR website.http://www.npr.org/programs/morning/ Maybe the good cork will be available to rodmakers instead. (Wishful thinking huh) Bob Mauluccibob@downandacross.com --=====================_22997343==_.ALT Speaking of NPR and "Morning Edition," there was a segmenttoday about cork growers in Portugal. I guess the current trend in winemaking is rubber corks. The cork farmers are in danger of being put outof work. It seems the artificial cork does not carry a certain microbethat can ruin the bottled wine. The segment aired 12/1 and can be heardat the NPR website. http://www.npr.org/programs/morning/ Maybe the good cork will be available to rodmakersinstead. (Wishful thinking huh) Bob Mauluccibob@downandacross.com --=====================_22997343==_.ALT-- from rmoon@ida.net Wed Dec 1 22:29:24 1999 0000 rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Spiral Tom I too have noticed a significant difference in a spiral Rod. Allof mine except for the 7' one piece have been 6'. I have been wonderingif short spirals sow the differences more than longer rods. Dells werelonger and that might account for it. My 7' rod was designed for afour. Most who have cast it say is 6 is the better line for it and Ihave had a couple of guys who opted for a 7 or 8. I'd say a six. Ithink that except for the trouble making a spiral they have even betteeraction than a conventional rod. I think that Ray's modification of thetwisting form eliminates a lot of the trouble keeping the rod straight.I am about to make a RG form for the 6' I am making now. Ralph from scan.oest@post.tele.dk Thu Dec 2 05:56:28 1999 (InterMail vM.4.01.02.00 201-229-116) with SMTP Subject: swelled butt boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0018_01BF3CC4.D271E780" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0018_01BF3CC4.D271E780 Fellow listers Last night I browsed a cataloque from Thomas and Thomas, looking at =their canerods. These guys know how to make a gorgeuos finish on a rod. =What they do know, too, is how to make a SWELLED butt. In fact, it is so swelled that I cannot imagine how they make it. Do =they glue on extra pieces of cane, do they bent the cane with steam, or =do they plane away of the outer fibres just before the swelling? Knowledge of this, or Your usual wellfounded opinions are welcome. This =truly amazes me. regards, Carsten ------=_NextPart_000_0018_01BF3CC4.D271E780 New Page 1 Fellow listers Last night I browsed a cataloque from Thomas and Thomas, looking at= canerods. These guys know how to make a gorgeuos finish on a rod. What = know, too, is how to make a SWELLED butt. In fact, it is so swelled that I cannot imagine how they make it. = glue on extra pieces of cane, do they bent the cane with steam, or do = away of the outer fibres just before the swelling? Knowledge of this, or Your usual wellfounded opinions are welcome. = truly amazes me. regards, Carsten ------=_NextPart_000_0018_01BF3CC4.D271E780-- from avyoung@iinet.net.au Thu Dec 2 06:03:52 1999 Thu, 2 Dec 1999 20:03:31 +0800 Subject: Re: swelled butt types="text/plain,text/html";boundary="=====================_16240199==_.ALT" --=====================_16240199==_.ALT This is something that is easy to do nodeless because you just scarf onwidersections than those for the rest of the butt.Otherwise I guess there are just more shavings than usual if made in theconventional way. Tony At 12:57 PM 12/2/99 +0100, scan.oest wrote: Fellow listers Last night I browsed a cataloque from Thomas and Thomas, looking attheircanerods. These guys know how to make a gorgeuos finish on a rod. Whattheydo know, too, is how to make a SWELLED butt. In fact, it is so swelled that I cannot imagine how they make it. Do theyglue on extra pieces of cane, do they bent the cane with steam, or dotheyplane away of the outer fibres just before the swelling? Knowledge of this, or Your usual wellfounded opinions are welcome. Thistrulyamazes me. regards, Carsten /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html And this our life, exempt from public haunt,Finds tongues in trees, books in running brooks,Sermons in stones, and good in everything. William Shakespeare, As You Like It /*************************************************************************/ --=====================_16240199==_.ALT This is something that is easy to do nodeless because you just scarf onwider sections than those for the rest of the butt.Otherwise I guess there are just more shavings than usual if made in theconventional way. Tony At 12:57 PM 12/2/99 +0100, scan.oest wrote: Fellow listers Last night I browsed a cataloque from Thomas and Thomas, looking attheircanerods. These guys know how to make a gorgeuos finish on a rod. Whatthey do know, too, is how to make a SWELLED butt. In fact, it is so swelled that I cannot imagine how they make it. Do theyglue on extra pieces of cane, do they bent the cane with steam, or dothey plane away of the outer fibres just before the swelling? Knowledge of this, or Your usual wellfounded opinions are welcome. Thistruly amazes me. regards, Carsten /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: And this our life, exempt from public haunt,Finds tongues in trees, books in running brooks,Sermons in stones, and good in everything. /*************************************************************************/ --=====================_16240199==_.ALT-- from lars32@gateway.net Thu Dec 2 06:34:56 1999 Subject: Re: Dickerson tapers - Allowing for Varnish Re:Dickerson tapersI have the final coat of varnish on the 8014 (1952) model 8foot 6wt. fromHowell's book.Just wiggling the unvarnished tip section with guidesmountedit was very very stiff indeed. I did not subtract for varnish and built itright from the book. I am sure it is more than a 6 wt. I'll the list know.-----Original Message----- rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Subject: Re: Dickerson tapers - Allowing for Varnish Mark,I was curious about that last night, so entered both of the 8015's and theheavier of the 7613's into Hexrod. What I found with the 8015's stresscurves was that the Guide maxed out at 240K with a really even (andfast)drop in the numbers (increase in stiffness), and the Guide Special maxedat230K with just as fast a drop in the numbers, though with a lumpiercurve.Iexpect that if you were to cast two rods made *exactly* to both specsyou'dbe hard pressed to tell a difference. The stress curves would also leadmeto believe that these were measured without varnish. The 7613 on the other hand, may well have been measured with varnish. It'sstress curve maxed out at 180K with a stress curve very similar to theSirD.Thinking of what Howell said about it being able to take a 6, I charted itthat way too and ended up with a max of 245K. All this suggests to methatit would either be VERY powerful as a 5, or underlined, and may be bestsuited to a 6. Ran out of time or I would have subtracted .006 for thevarnish to how much difference that would have made. Keeping in mind that I've made all of ONE rod so far, and it broke, pleasetake the preceding with one huge grain of salt. On an unrelated topic, I just finished building a Smithwick binder. Ithinkit took all of 3-4 hours. What a great design. For those thinking aboutit,I found everything needed in 1 hour of shopping at Orchard SupplyHardware.Great store, and add the usual disclaimers...Eric In Jack Howell's book, these two Dickerson tapersare listed without stating whether they weretaken over varnish. Ian and I have had a short off list discussionon this and have concluded that we don't know - andquestion how much difference it makes to add or deducta uniform .004 to .006 from this taper. This is my firstrod, so obviously I don't know. But, I deducted .006 for the varnish - assuming that a1952 taper was measured over varnish. (I'm also building throw a 6.) I also looked up the 7613 taper a fewdifferent places and found three fairly different tapers - so ? I'd appreciate your thoughts ... Sorry to be to long winded ... from brookside.rod@juno.com Thu Dec 2 06:44:15 1999 07:43:25 EST Subject: help obtaining Dickerson tapers My thanks to all noted below for sending along a copy of the post whichincluded the tapers. mevans@acxiom.combeaconplumb@earthlink.netanglport@con2.comjhewitt@cmn.netedriddle@mindspring.comrsgould@cmc.netjhat@cbt.netfinney.1@osu.eduLambersonW@missouri.edujon.beckton@asml.nlking@biology.utah.eduPatrick.Coffey@PSS.Boeing.comSeanT@harker.orgmevans@acxiom.comeestlow@srminc.com Gary. . ___________________________________________________________________Get the Internet just the way you want it.Free software, free e- mail, and free Internet access for a month!Try Juno Web: http://dl.www.juno.com/dynoget/tagj. from caneman@clnk.com Thu Dec 2 06:57:39 1999 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35)with SMTP id com; Thu, 2 Dec 1999 06:55:54 -0600 "Rod Makers List Serve" Subject: Re: swelled butt boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0790_01BF3C91.FBDAACC0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0790_01BF3C91.FBDAACC0 Carsten,The rods I make now have no need for a swelled butt, but the ones I =made early on had swelled butts. First, if you are going to have a =radically swelled butt, you need to leave your rough planed strips much =larger than normal (large enough to accomodate the diamter of the =swelled section. Second, it is easy to radically swell the butt if you =have a set of forms set up to do it. I have one set of forms that is =great for this, made by Frank Armbruster of Colorado Bootstrap. In the =area of the form that the butt section is normally planed in, the =stations are 2.5" apart rather than 5". This give you the capability of =radically changing taper dimensions over a very short distance and =really didn't present any problem with planing. The strips would lay =nicely in the form even with the radical change in dimension. Keep in =mind that half of your additional material is on the outside and half on =the inside that way, so the strip still "centers" nicely in the forms, =so there was no need to remove any outer fibers, glue on extra material =or bend the cane in any way.The only problem I ever had with it was that I had to make a change =in binder weights and use 2.5 pound weights for the butt sections on =the swelled butts. I normally use 1.5 pound weights, but they didn't ="always" pull the sections together at the swell because of the rapid =increase in dimension. The 2.5's did a good job. Bob -----Original Message-----From: scan.oest Date: Thursday, December 02, 1999 5:56 AMSubject: swelled butt Fellow listers Last night I browsed a cataloque from Thomas and Thomas, looking at =their canerods. These guys know how to make a gorgeuos finish on a rod. =What they do know, too, is how to make a SWELLED butt. In fact, it is so swelled that I cannot imagine how they make it. Do =they glue on extra pieces of cane, do they bent the cane with steam, or =do they plane away of the outer fibres just before the swelling? Knowledge of this, or Your usual wellfounded opinions are welcome. =This truly amazes me. regards, Carsten ------=_NextPart_000_0790_01BF3C91.FBDAACC0 New Page 1 Carsten, make = need for a swelled butt, but the ones I made early on had swelled = First, if you are going to have a radically swelled butt, you need to = rough planed strips much larger than normal (large enough to accomodate = that is great for this, made by Frank Armbruster of Colorado = the area of the form that the butt section is normally planed in, the = radically changing taper dimensions over a very short distance and = even with the radical change in dimension. Keep in mind that half of = additional material is on the outside and half on the inside that way, = strip still "centers" nicely in the forms, so there was no = way. problem = use 1.5 pound weights, but they didn't "always" pull the = Bob -----Original = Rodmakers Listserv <rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= Thursday, December 02, 1999 5:56 AMSubject: buttFellow listers Last night I browsed a cataloque from Thomas and Thomas, = their canerods. These guys know how to make a gorgeuos finish on a = they do know, too, is how to make a SWELLED butt. In fact, it is so swelled that I cannot imagine how they make = they glue on extra pieces of cane, do they bent the cane with steam, = they plane away of the outer fibres just before the swelling? Knowledge of this, or Your usual wellfounded opinions are = truly amazes me. regards, Carsten ------=_NextPart_000_0790_01BF3C91.FBDAACC0-- from TSmithwick@aol.com Thu Dec 2 07:17:55 1999 Subject: Re: Spiral rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu In a message dated 12/2/99 4:30:32 AM, you wrote: Ralph - The longest I have made is 7 1/2 feet, and there is still a performance difference. In fact, the rods are the longest casting 7 1/2 footers I have ever handled, including graphite. I do tend to think that the increased weight of a cane rod in longer lengths would overwhelm this advantage, however. I just don't know where that point is.Several of my spiral rods have been parts of matched sets with identical straight rods. The spiral rods have always proved to be the better distance casters. from tjtrodmaker@yahoo.com Thu Dec 2 07:34:46 1999 1999 05:34:43 PST Subject: hollow-built rods greetings! i would appreciate knowing if there isanyone in the midwest states that builds hollow rods. i am intrested in building one for myself and havesome questions about the process. if there is someoneclose enough i would be intrested in seeing you in theprocess. is there a better process than whittling oneach spline with a kraft knife? timothy ====="Gooda' morning mister bear"__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. All in one place.Yahoo! Shopping: http://shopping.yahoo.com from caneman@clnk.com Thu Dec 2 07:51:12 1999 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35)with SMTP id com; Thu, 2 Dec 1999 07:49:30 -0600 Subject: Re: Spiral Tim, Ray and anyone else that has built spirals;I have never attempted a spiral rod, even though the idea soundsintriguing, but do have a question. Will the spiral work with just anytaper? In other words, could I take my 7' 4wt taper, spiral it, and itwould still be a 4 wt, or would this change the characteristics of thetaperaltogether? Bob -----Original Message----- ; rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Subject: Re: Spiral In a message dated 12/2/99 4:30:32 AM, you wrote: of mine except for the 7' one piece have been 6'.>> Ralph - The longest I have made is 7 1/2 feet, and there is still aperformance difference. In fact, the rods are the longest casting 7 1/2footers I have ever handled, including graphite. I do tend to think thattheincreased weight of a cane rod in longer lengths would overwhelm thisadvantage, however. I just don't know where that point is.Several of my spiral rods have been parts of matched sets with identicalstraight rods. The spiral rods have always proved to be the betterdistancecasters. from caneman@clnk.com Thu Dec 2 08:01:44 1999 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35)with SMTP id com; Thu, 2 Dec 1999 07:59:56 -0600 "Rod Makers List Serve" Subject: Re: swelled butt boundary="----=_NextPart_000_07DD_01BF3C9A.EDB8BAC0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_07DD_01BF3C9A.EDB8BAC0 A friend of mine was here when I was writing the last post about the =swelled butts. He is a woodworker and made a suggestion. First, he =asked me why I used heavier weights when I made the swelled butts. I =explained to him that the strips were equally swelled from inside apex =to outer flat and that the extra weight was needed to "bend" the strips =down into place so there would be no gap or glue line... He sat around =and we drank a couple of cups of coffee. I thought the conversation was =over, then he said... "Well, why didn't you just heat the strips, bend =them until the apex at the swell was on an even plane with the rest of =the strip, then you wouldn't have to change weights." We talked about =this for a few minutes and he is right! If you heat the strips (heat =gun or alcohol lamp) so that the inner apex at the swell was on the same =plane as the Non-swelled parts of the strip, then there would be no need = each strip. Heat and bend at the beginning of the swell, then heat =again and bend at the end of the swell, and the rod should go together =very nicely, without having to change the binder weights. Bob (the old dog that just learned a new trick)-----Original Message-----From: scan.oest Date: Thursday, December 02, 1999 5:56 AMSubject: swelled butt Fellow listers Last night I browsed a cataloque from Thomas and Thomas, looking at =their canerods. These guys know how to make a gorgeuos finish on a rod. =What they do know, too, is how to make a SWELLED butt. In fact, it is so swelled that I cannot imagine how they make it. Do =they glue on extra pieces of cane, do they bent the cane with steam, or =do they plane away of the outer fibres just before the swelling? Knowledge of this, or Your usual wellfounded opinions are welcome. =This truly amazes me. regards, Carsten ------=_NextPart_000_07DD_01BF3C9A.EDB8BAC0 New Page 1 A friend of mine was here when Iwas = "bend" the strips down into place so there would be no gap or = the conversation was over, then he said... "Well, why didn't you = the strips, bend them until the apex at the swell was on an even plane = strips (heat gun or alcohol lamp) so that the inner apex at the swell = same plane as the Non-swelled parts of the strip, then there would be no = bend at the end of the swell, and the rod should go together very = without having to change the binder weights. Bob (the old dog that just learned a new =trick) -----Original = Rodmakers Listserv <rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= Thursday, December 02, 1999 5:56 AMSubject: buttFellow listers Last night I browsed a cataloque from Thomas and Thomas, = their canerods. These guys know how to make a gorgeuos finish on a = they do know, too, is how to make a SWELLED butt. In fact, it is so swelled that I cannot imagine how they make = they glue on extra pieces of cane, do they bent the cane with steam, = they plane away of the outer fibres just before the swelling? Knowledge of this, or Your usual wellfounded opinions are = truly amazes me. regards, Carsten ------=_NextPart_000_07DD_01BF3C9A.EDB8BAC0-- from tjtrodmaker@yahoo.com Thu Dec 2 08:07:13 1999 1999 06:07:11 PST Subject: Re: swelled butt bob why not make the swelled butt adj to only one sideof the groove in the planing form the the apex isalready on an even plane? i know that's not the wayit's been done before but why nott? timothy --- Bob Nunley wrote:A friend of mine was here when I was writing thelast post about the swelled butts. He is awoodworker and made a suggestion. First, he askedme why I used heavier weights when I made theswelled butts. I explained to him that the stripswere equally swelled from inside apex to outer flatand that the extra weight was needed to "bend" thestrips down into place so there would be no gap orglue line... He sat around and we drank a couple ofcups of coffee. I thought the conversation wasover, then he said... "Well, why didn't you justheat the strips, bend them until the apex at theswell was on an even plane with the rest of thestrip, then you wouldn't have to change weights." We talked about this for a few minutes and he isright! If you heat the strips (heat gun or alcohollamp) so that the inner apex at the swell was on thesame plane as the Non-swelled parts of the strip,then there would be no need for additional weight. This would only take a few seconds to do with eachstrip. Heat and bend at the beginning of the swell,then heat again and bend at the end of the swell,and the rod should go together very nicely, withouthaving to change the binder weights. Bob (the old dog that just learned a new trick)-----Original Message-----From: scan.oest Date: Thursday, December 02, 1999 5:56 AMSubject: swelled butt Fellow listers Last night I browsed a cataloque from Thomas andThomas, looking at their canerods. These guys knowhow to make a gorgeuos finish on a rod. What they doknow, too, is how to make a SWELLED butt. In fact, it is so swelled that I cannot imaginehow they make it. Do they glue on extra pieces ofcane, do they bent the cane with steam, or do theyplane away of the outer fibres just before theswelling? Knowledge of this, or Your usual wellfoundedopinions are welcome. This truly amazes me. regards, Carsten ====="Gooda' morning mister bear"__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. All in one place.Yahoo! Shopping: http://shopping.yahoo.com from caneman@clnk.com Thu Dec 2 08:22:24 1999 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35)with SMTP id com for ;Thu, 2 Dec 1999 08:20:42 -0600 Subject: Fw: hollow-built rods Timothy,It depends on how radical you want to get with hollow built. Mine arewhat you might call semi-hollow. In Garrisons book, Hoagy Carmichaelrecommends planing one pass over the inner apex of each strip to allowtheadhesive to "squeeze" in both directions along the glued flats. Well, Itake a slightly larger amount off of each inner apex in the butt section allthe way downthe strip. So it does leave a "hollow" down the entire length of thestrip, just a very small one. I don't take very much material off of theinner apex of the tips... only one pass with the plane there.In any case, yes, there is a better way than to whittle with a craftknife. Set your plane to take a very light cut. Use a black marker andmark therod on the inner apex, where you want to leave your "dams". Just carefullyplane between the marks and hollow out as much as you want. My opinionisthata scaper or maybe even a drawknife would be better for this, as long asyoucouldcontrol your cut depth with the draw knife. I know a few (well a coupleofppl)who build hollows with the hollow cut flat with a plane and theyrecommendleaving 4 dams in each section... one at each end and two more spacedbetween them. Don't take this proceedure as Gospel, as I have not tried it,but if you have a rod you want to build for yourself, it may be worth givinga shot. That way if it doesn't work you can just use it to beat the goatout of thegarden. Hopefully some others will respond to this and give you a better than this one. Bob -----Original Message-----From: timothy troester Date: Thursday, December 02, 1999 7:36 AMSubject: hollow-built rods greetings! i would appreciate knowing if there isanyone in the midwest states that builds hollow rods.i am intrested in building one for myself and havesome questions about the process. if there is someoneclose enough i would be intrested in seeing you in theprocess. is there a better process than whittling oneach spline with a kraft knife? timothy ====="Gooda' morning mister bear"__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. All in one place.Yahoo! Shopping: http://shopping.yahoo.com from caneman@clnk.com Thu Dec 2 08:31:33 1999 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35)with SMTP id com; Thu, 2 Dec 1999 08:29:50 -0600 "rod 'akers" Subject: Re: swelled butt Tim,Nice thought, but how are you going to get just one side of the form tomove. On conventional planing forms, when you adjust the screws, itpushes(or pulls) both sides of the from from the centerline of the form. I don'tsee how you could adjust the form to do this. If there is a way that I amnot understanding and you did adjust so that your apex was on the sameplane, then you still have the power fibers on the outer flat that arestronger and more resistant to bending than the inner pith, so it wouldseemthat the outers surface would still want to stay straight and flat andresist the bending necessary to pull your strips together in your binder.Maybe I am misunderstanding what you are saying, but I just don't see howyou could set up your forms to leave the inner apex on a plane. Bob -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: swelled butt bob why not make the swelled butt adj to only one sideof the groove in the planing form the the apex isalready on an even plane? i know that's not the wayit's been done before but why nott? timothy --- Bob Nunley wrote:A friend of mine was here when I was writing thelast post about the swelled butts. He is awoodworker and made a suggestion. First, he askedme why I used heavier weights when I made theswelled butts. I explained to him that the stripswere equally swelled from inside apex to outer flatand that the extra weight was needed to "bend" thestrips down into place so there would be no gap orglue line... He sat around and we drank a couple ofcups of coffee. I thought the conversation wasover, then he said... "Well, why didn't you justheat the strips, bend them until the apex at theswell was on an even plane with the rest of thestrip, then you wouldn't have to change weights."We talked about this for a few minutes and he isright! If you heat the strips (heat gun or alcohollamp) so that the inner apex at the swell was on thesame plane as the Non-swelled parts of the strip,then there would be no need for additional weight.This would only take a few seconds to do with eachstrip. Heat and bend at the beginning of the swell,then heat again and bend at the end of the swell,and the rod should go together very nicely, withouthaving to change the binder weights. Bob (the old dog that just learned a new trick)-----Original Message-----From: scan.oest Date: Thursday, December 02, 1999 5:56 AMSubject: swelled butt Fellow listers Last night I browsed a cataloque from Thomas andThomas, looking at their canerods. These guys knowhow to make a gorgeuos finish on a rod. What they doknow, too, is how to make a SWELLED butt. In fact, it is so swelled that I cannot imaginehow they make it. Do they glue on extra pieces ofcane, do they bent the cane with steam, or do theyplane away of the outer fibres just before theswelling? Knowledge of this, or Your usual wellfoundedopinions are welcome. This truly amazes me. regards, Carsten ====="Gooda' morning mister bear"__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. All in one place.Yahoo! Shopping: http://shopping.yahoo.com from tjtrodmaker@yahoo.com Thu Dec 2 08:49:17 1999 1999 06:45:06 PST Subject: Re: swelled butt nice thought but not well thought out. i suppose ahammer is out of the question. timothy --- Bob Nunley wrote:Tim,Nice thought, but how are you going to get justone side of the form tomove. On conventional planing forms, when youadjust the screws, it pushes(or pulls) both sides of the from from thecenterline of the form. I don'tsee how you could adjust the form to do this. Ifthere is a way that I amnot understanding and you did adjust so that yourapex was on the sameplane, then you still have the power fibers on theouter flat that arestronger and more resistant to bending than theinner pith, so it would seemthat the outers surface would still want to staystraight and flat andresist the bending necessary to pull your stripstogether in your binder.Maybe I am misunderstanding what you are saying, butI just don't see howyou could set up your forms to leave the inner apexon a plane. Bob -----Original Message-----From: timothy troester Date: Thursday, December 02, 1999 8:05 AMSubject: Re: swelled butt bob why not make the swelled butt adj to only onesideof the groove in the planing form the the apex isalready on an even plane? i know that's not thewayit's been done before but why nott? timothy --- Bob Nunley wrote:A friend of mine was here when I was writing thelast post about the swelled butts. He is awoodworker and made a suggestion. First, heaskedme why I used heavier weights when I made theswelled butts. I explained to him that thestripswere equally swelled from inside apex to outerflatand that the extra weight was needed to "bend"thestrips down into place so there would be no gaporglue line... He sat around and we drank a coupleofcups of coffee. I thought the conversation wasover, then he said... "Well, why didn't you justheat the strips, bend them until the apex at theswell was on an even plane with the rest of thestrip, then you wouldn't have to change weights."We talked about this for a few minutes and he isright! If you heat the strips (heat gun oralcohollamp) so that the inner apex at the swell was onthesame plane as the Non-swelled parts of the strip,then there would be no need for additionalweight.This would only take a few seconds to do witheachstrip. Heat and bend at the beginning of theswell,then heat again and bend at the end of the swell,and the rod should go together very nicely,withouthaving to change the binder weights. Bob (the old dog that just learned a new trick)-----Original Message-----From: scan.oest Date: Thursday, December 02, 1999 5:56 AMSubject: swelled butt Fellow listers Last night I browsed a cataloque from ThomasandThomas, looking at their canerods. These guysknowhow to make a gorgeuos finish on a rod. What theydoknow, too, is how to make a SWELLED butt. In fact, it is so swelled that I cannotimaginehow they make it. Do they glue on extra pieces ofcane, do they bent the cane with steam, or dotheyplane away of the outer fibres just before theswelling? Knowledge of this, or Your usual wellfoundedopinions are welcome. This truly amazes me. regards, Carsten ====="Gooda' morning mister bear"__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. All inone place.Yahoo! Shopping: http://shopping.yahoo.com ====="Gooda' morning mister bear"__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. All in one place.Yahoo! Shopping: http://shopping.yahoo.com from rsgould@cmc.net Thu Dec 2 09:12:50 1999 "Rodmakers Listserv" Subject: Re: swelled butt boundary="----=_NextPart_000_00ED_01BF3C94.9F3D8A20" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_00ED_01BF3C94.9F3D8A20 New Page 1Hi to all,There are two things to do if you wish to make butt sections with a =really fast swell in them. One is to make the form from pieces of steel =that are taller than they are wide so that the differential screws (or =the push-pull screws) can more easily bend the planing form. Secondly =put some extra screws in the form at 2 1/2" centers on the butt end of =the form where the swell is desired.Ray Sent: Thursday, December 02, 1999 3:57 AMSubject: swelled butt Fellow listers Last night I browsed a cataloque from Thomas and Thomas, looking at =their canerods. These guys know how to make a gorgeuos finish on a rod. =What they do know, too, is how to make a SWELLED butt. In fact, it is so swelled that I cannot imagine how they make it. Do =they glue on extra pieces of cane, do they bent the cane with steam, or =do they plane away of the outer fibres just before the swelling? Knowledge of this, or Your usual wellfounded opinions are welcome. =This truly amazes me. regards, Carsten ------=_NextPart_000_00ED_01BF3C94.9F3D8A20 New Page 1 Hi to all,There are two things to do if you wish= sections with a really fast swell in them. One is to make the form from = of steel that are taller than they are wide so that the differential = the push-pull screws) can more easily bend the planing form. Secondly = extra screws in the form at 2 1/2" centers on the butt end of the form = swell is desired.Ray ----- Original Message ----- scan.oest Sent: Thursday, December 02, = AMSubject: swelled butt Fellow listers Last night I browsed a cataloque from Thomas and Thomas, looking= canerods. These guys know how to make a gorgeuos finish on a rod. What= know, too, is how to make a SWELLED butt. In fact, it is so swelled that I cannot imagine how they make it. = glue on extra pieces of cane, do they bent the cane with steam, or do = plane away of the outer fibres just before the swelling? Knowledge of this, or Your usual wellfounded opinions are = truly amazes me. regards, Carsten ------=_NextPart_000_00ED_01BF3C94.9F3D8A20-- from rsgould@cmc.net Thu Dec 2 09:24:04 1999 Subject: Re: Spiral Hi Bob,Yes, I'd say you could spiral any taper although it may be a little toughwith a rod having a pronounced swell in the butt. The characteristics oftherod should change depending on how it is spiralled. The more the rod istwisted the stiffer it should become so it may fish a line size heavierthanthe straight model. Lambuth twisted his rod about 2 full turns, the rod I'mcurrently making will be twisted 600 degrees.Ray----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Spiral Tim, Ray and anyone else that has built spirals;I have never attempted a spiral rod, even though the idea soundsintriguing, but do have a question. Will the spiral work with just anytaper? In other words, could I take my 7' 4wt taper, spiral it, and itwould still be a 4 wt, or would this change the characteristics of thetaperaltogether? Bob -----Original Message-----From: TSmithwick@aol.com ; rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Date: Thursday, December 02, 1999 7:21 AMSubject: Re: Spiral In a message dated 12/2/99 4:30:32 AM, you wrote: of mine except for the 7' one piece have been 6'.>> Ralph - The longest I have made is 7 1/2 feet, and there is still aperformance difference. In fact, the rods are the longest casting 7 1/2footers I have ever handled, including graphite. I do tend to think thattheincreased weight of a cane rod in longer lengths would overwhelm thisadvantage, however. I just don't know where that point is.Several of my spiral rods have been parts of matched sets with straight rods. The spiral rods have always proved to be the betterdistancecasters. from dhaftel@att.com Thu Dec 2 09:34:17 1999 KAA20299; (8.8.8+Sun/ATTEMS-1.4.1sol2) (5.5.2448.0) Rodmakers Listserv Subject: RE: swelled butt You could also buy a swelled butt form. It has a wider than usual grooveatone end so you don't have to spread the form too drastically. Russ Goodingsells them. No financial interest, blah, blah, blah... Dennis -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: swelled butt Hi to all,There are two things to do if you wish to make butt sections with a reallyfast swell in them. One is to make the form from pieces of steel that aretaller than they are wide so that the differential screws (or the push-pullscrews) can more easily bend the planing form. Secondly put some extrascrews in the form at 2 1/2" centers on the butt end of the form wheretheswell is desired.Ray ----- Original Message ----- Subject: swelled butt Fellow listers Last night I browsed a cataloque from Thomas and Thomas, looking attheircanerods. These guys know how to make a gorgeuos finish on a rod. Whattheydo know, too, is how to make a SWELLED butt. In fact, it is so swelled that I cannot imagine how they make it. Do theyglue on extra pieces of cane, do they bent the cane with steam, or do theyplane away of the outer fibres just before the swelling? Knowledge of this, or Your usual wellfounded opinions are welcome. Thistruly amazes me. regards, Carsten from rsgould@cmc.net Thu Dec 2 09:34:23 1999 Subject: Re: hollow-built rods Hi to all,Here's some more input on hollow rods. Bob's right , it depends on howradical you want to get and how much the rod is hollowed out. The guidelineI've established (thru trail and error) is to to maintain a minimum wallthickness of 0.070" of bamboo. This will provide adequate glue jointstrength. Then if there is to be no graphite insert placed in the core as Ido on some rods, a dam or solid spot (about 1" in length) should be placedevery 2 1/2" along the rod. This is done so that the cross section will notcollapse during bending. Note too that this means that the rod will not behollow when the "d" dimension across the flats is less than 0.140".Ray----- Original Message ----- Subject: Fw: hollow-built rods Timothy,It depends on how radical you want to get with hollow built. Mine arewhat you might call semi-hollow. In Garrisons book, Hoagy Carmichaelrecommends planing one pass over the inner apex of each strip to allowtheadhesive to "squeeze" in both directions along the glued flats. Well, Itake a slightly larger amount off of each inner apex in the butt sectionallthe way downthe strip. So it does leave a "hollow" down the entire length of thestrip, just a very small one. I don't take very much material off of theinner apex of the tips... only one pass with the plane there.In any case, yes, there is a better way than to whittle with a craftknife. Set your plane to take a very light cut. Use a black marker andmark therod on the inner apex, where you want to leave your "dams". Justcarefullyplane between the marks and hollow out as much as you want. My opinionisthata scaper or maybe even a drawknife would be better for this, as long asyoucouldcontrol your cut depth with the draw knife. I know a few (well a coupleofppl)who build hollows with the hollow cut flat with a plane and theyrecommendleaving 4 dams in each section... one at each end and two more spacedbetween them. Don't take this proceedure as Gospel, as I have not triedit,but if you have a rod you want to build for yourself, it may be worthgivinga shot. That way if it doesn't work you can just use it to beat the goatout of thegarden. Hopefully some others will respond to this and give you a better than this one. Bob -----Original Message-----From: timothy troester Date: Thursday, December 02, 1999 7:36 AMSubject: hollow-built rods greetings! i would appreciate knowing if there isanyone in the midwest states that builds hollow rods.i am intrested in building one for myself and havesome questions about the process. if there is someoneclose enough i would be intrested in seeing you in theprocess. is there a better process than whittling oneach spline with a kraft knife? timothy ====="Gooda' morning mister bear"__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. All in one place.Yahoo! Shopping: http://shopping.yahoo.com from leroyt@involved.com Thu Dec 2 09:57:40 1999 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61049U4500L450S0V35)with SMTP id com; Thu, 2 Dec 1999 07:55:35 -0800 Subject: Re: Question on Asian (Grizzly/Enco) lathes boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000C_01BF3C9C.3D3966C0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000C_01BF3C9C.3D3966C0 A good place to get an answer to your question might be found at =www.chaski.com on the Home Machine Shop page. Good source for =information and used machine parts is www.mermac.com ,if you chose to = A 9" South Bend will bring premium prices. For our work look for a Heavy =10 As it has an 1-3/8" hole through or try some Logan's in the 11" =swing. ------=_NextPart_000_000C_01BF3C9C.3D3966C0 =FF=FE=00==0D=00=0A==00=00=00=0D=00=0A==00=00=0D=00=0A==00=00=0D=00=0A==00=00=00=0D=00=0A==00=00=0D=00=0A==00=00=0D=00=0A==00=00=00&=00n=00b=00s=00p=00;=00&=00n=00b=00s=00=p=00;=00&=00n=00b=00s=00p=00;=00 =00A=00 =00g=00o=00o=00d=00 ==00p=00l=00a=00c=00e=00 =00t=00o=00 =00g=00e=00t=00=00=0D=00=0A==00a=00n=00 =00a=00n=00s=00w=00e=00r=00 =00t=00o=00=00y=00o=00u=00r=00 ==00q=00u=00e=00s=00t=00i=00o=00n=00 =00m=00i=00g=00h=00t=00=00b=00e=00 ==00f=00o=00u=00n=00d=00 =00a=00t=00 =00=00w=00w=00w=00.=00c=00h=00a==00s=00k=00i=00.=00c=00o=00m=00=00 =00o=00n=00 ==00t=00h=00e=00 =00H=00o=00m=00e=00=00M=00a=00c=00h=00i=00n=00e=00 ==00S=00h=00o=00p=00 =00p=00a=00g=00e=00.=00 =00=0D=00=0A==00G=00o=00o=00d=00 =00s=00o=00u=00r=00c=00e=00 =00f=00o=00r=00==00i=00n=00f=00o=00r=00m=00a=00t=00i=00o=00n=00 =00a=00n=00d=00==00u=00s=00e=00d=00 =00m=00a=00c=00h=00i=00n=00e=00 ==00p=00a=00r=00t=00s=00 =00i=00s=00 =00=00w=00w=00w=00.=00m=00e=00r==00m=00a=00c=00.=00c=00o=00m=00=00 =00,=00i=00f=00==00y=00o=00u=00 =00c=00h=00o=00s=00e=00 =00t=00o=00 ==00p=00u=00r=00c=00h=00a=00s=00e=00 =00a=00 =00u=00s=00e=00d=00=00=0D=00=0A==00p=00i=00e=00c=00e=00 =00o=00f=00 ==00e=00q=00u=00i=00p=00t=00m=00e=00n=00t=00.=00 ==00=00=00=0D=00=0A==00=00=00A=00 ==009=00"=00 =00S=00o=00u=00t=00h=00 =00B=00e=00n=00d=00 ==00w=00i=00l=00l=00 =00b=00r=00i=00n=00g=00 ==00p=00r=00e=00m=00i=00u=00m=00 =00=0D=00=0A==00p=00r=00i=00c=00e=00s=00.=00 =00F=00o=00r=00 =00o=00u=00r=00==00w=00o=00r=00k=00 =00l=00o=00o=00k=00 =00f=00o=00r=00 =00a=00==00H=00e=00a=00v=00y=00 =001=000=00 =00A=00s=00 =00i=00t=00 ==00h=00a=00s=00 =00a=00n=00 =001=00- =003=00/=008=00"=00 ==00h=00o=00l=00e=00 =00t=00h=00r=00o=00u=00g=00h=00 =00o=00r=00==00t=00r=00y=00 =00=0D=00=0A==00s=00o=00m=00e=00 =00L=00o=00g=00a=00n=00'=00s=00 =00i=00n=00==00t=00h=00e=00 =001=001=00"=00 ==00s=00w=00i=00n=00g=00.=00=00=00=00=00=0D=00=0A==00------ =_NextPart_000_000C_01BF3C9C.3D3966C0-- from darrell@rockclimbing.org Thu Dec 2 10:39:09 1999 sims.3.5.1999.09.16.21.57.p8)with SMTP id for Subject: Re: swelled butt - T & T... Topic #2 H.L. Leonard Catskill boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0047_01BF3CA0.14F074C0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0047_01BF3CA0.14F074C0 New Page 1When I visited the T&T bamboo shop, I was given the full tour = They do not even have a planing form and Tory has never seen a planing =form... it's all done on the old Montague beveller and the Mill... I =can't tell you how, only on what... and yes, they do build beautiful =rods... So... treat those old Monty's with a little more respect... the high end =models are as good as any of the high end production rods of the more =respected makers... Topic #2 I just got a HL Leonard Catskill rod and it is a 4 oz Model 46... My =question is can anyone tell me when they began using model numbers such=as on this rod... by the way, I've never seen such delicate tips on a 9 =foot rod... Measures 48 thous on a varnished tip and a 9/64 tip ferrule =on a 3/2 rod... Darrell Leewww.bamboorods.homepage.com Sent: Thursday, December 02, 1999 3:57 AMSubject: swelled butt Fellow listers Last night I browsed a cataloque from Thomas and Thomas, looking at =their canerods. These guys know how to make a gorgeuos finish on a rod. =What they do know, too, is how to make a SWELLED butt. In fact, it is so swelled that I cannot imagine how they make it. Do =they glue on extra pieces of cane, do they bent the cane with steam, or =do they plane away of the outer fibres just before the swelling? Knowledge of this, or Your usual wellfounded opinions are welcome. =This truly amazes me. regards, Carsten ------=_NextPart_000_0047_01BF3CA0.14F074C0 New Page 1 When I visited the T&T = They do not even have a = Tory has never seen a planing form... it's all done on the old Montague = and the Mill... I can't tell you how, only on what... and yes, they do = beautiful rods... So... treat those old Monty's = little more respect... the high end models are as good as any of the = production rods of the more respected makers... Topic #2 I just got a HL Leonard = it is a 4 oz Model 46... My question is can anyone tell me when they = delicate tips on a 9 foot rod... Measures 48 thous on a varnished tip = Darrell Leewww.bamboorods.homepage.com ----- Original Message ----- scan.oest Sent: Thursday, December 02, = AMSubject: swelled butt Fellow listers Last night I browsed a cataloque from Thomas and Thomas, looking= canerods. These guys know how to make a gorgeuos finish on a rod. What= know, too, is how to make a SWELLED butt. In fact, it is so swelled that I cannot imagine how they make it. = glue on extra pieces of cane, do they bent the cane with steam, or do = plane away of the outer fibres just before the swelling? Knowledge of this, or Your usual wellfounded opinions are = truly amazes me. regards, Carsten ------=_NextPart_000_0047_01BF3CA0.14F074C0-- from arnold.jl@pg.com Thu Dec 2 10:52:23 1999 notes082.na.pg.com[155.125.116.193] 1999 11:50:25 1999)) id8525683B.005CACB4 ; Thu, 2 Dec 1999 11:52:15 -0500 Subject: Leonard Baby Catskill Does anyone have a taper for a Leonard Baby Catskill? I beleive this is a 6'or6' 6" 3 or 4 wt. rod. In the book by A.J. Campbell, Classic Fly Rods andReels,there is a picture of one but no taper info. I am interested in any info orleads you may have on this rod or any other Leonards of this size. Thanks, Jeff from flytyr@southshore.com Thu Dec 2 10:57:49 1999 [12.10.111.59] (may be forged)) Subject: Fitting ferrules I have finally gotten a "Real" lathe and want tofit ferrules using the lathe. I would like someinput as to speeds, type of tool bit and anyprecautions to take other than safety.Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com from mcdowellc@lanecc.edu Thu Dec 2 14:14:17 1999 12:26:23 PST Subject: re: swelled butt Like Darrell said, T&T isn't using planing forms to acquire the dramatically swelled butt. My forms have the 2.5" stations in the butt area but this only aids in making steeper increase in the butt over say 5", not a dramatically swelled butt right at the cork like that of the T&T rods. That thick steel will only bend so far even with the extra stations. The swelled butt forms would be the best way to get the dramaticdiameter increase near the cork, but you would have to do a lot of planing on the remainder of the strip. Chrismcdowellc@lanecc.edu-------------Original Text Fellow listers Last night I browsed a cataloque from Thomas and Thomas, looking attheir canerods. These guys know how to make a gorgeuos finish on a rod. Whatthey do know, too, is how to make a SWELLED butt. In fact, it is so swelled that I cannot imagine how they make it. Do they glue on extra pieces of cane, do they bent the cane with steam, or do they plane away of the outer fibres just before the swelling? Knowledge of this, or Your usual wellfounded opinions are welcome. This truly amazes me. regards, Carsten from TSmithwick@aol.com Thu Dec 2 14:54:48 1999 Subject: Re: Spiral Rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu In a message dated 12/2/99 1:56:10 PM, caneman@clnk.com wrote: If you stick to the Lambuth method, and twist the rod 1/6 turn betweenguide stations, you will certainly still recognize the taper. It will probably feel a little stiffer on short casts, the bigger difference coming into play when the rod is more fully loaded. Most likely the line weight will not change. Ray's caveat about trying this on a taper with an extreme butt swell iswell taken. I think you will get the most effect from a full flexing taper anyway. An easy way for you to try this is simply to make a spiral butt for an existing rod. I believe you will feel the extra stiffness in the butt, and a corresponding increase in the quickness of the rod. When doing the butt section, I always add a lock station halfway between the stripping guide position and the butt. This keeps the spiral a bit more even along the rod length. from nobler@satx.rr.com Thu Dec 2 16:36:55 1999 SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.197.19);Thu, 2 Dec 1999 16:37:04 -0600 Subject: Re: Question on Asian (Grizzly/Enco) lathes boundary="----=_NextPart_000_004E_01BF3CE3.76DCFC60" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_004E_01BF3CE3.76DCFC60 There was a 9" Southbend in our local paper last week, at $700. This =will do most any rod making chore. GMA Sent: Thursday, December 02, 1999 10:07 AMSubject: Re: Question on Asian (Grizzly/Enco) lathes A good place to get an answer to your question might be found at =www.chaski.com on the Home Machine Shop page. Good source for =information and used machine parts is www.mermac.com ,if you chose to = A 9" South Bend will bring premium prices. For our work look for a =Heavy 10 As it has an 1-3/8" hole through or try some Logan's in the 11" =swing. ------=_NextPart_000_004E_01BF3CE3.76DCFC60 Dec 2 17:36:15 1999 (SMTPD32-4.06) id AE3F5B58014C; Thu, 02 Dec 1999 15:18:23 PST Subject: Re: Leonard Baby Catskill This is the taper for 7' Leonard that is a very light rod., only 1 3/4 oz.Excuse the odd layout as I still measure a rod as I was taught.Leonard 7', 1 3/4 oz., 9/64 ferrule for 2/3 wt.Butt from female end: 0"-.140, 5"-.150, 10"-.160, 15"-.170, 20"-.180,25"-.195, 31.5"-.206 34"-.280, 42"-.280Tip from the tip: 0'-.050, 5'-.055, 10"-.065, 15"-.070, 20"-.090, 25"-.105,30"- .115, 35"-.125, 40"-.130, 42"-.140These were taken from an original rod subtracting .003 for varnish. Reelseat wood cap and ring 3 1/4" with 4 1/4" cigar grip.Dell.Dell & Marie CoppockThe Flyfisher& the Quilterhttp://www.trwebsites.com/dell/e-mail dellc@nextdim.comflyfisher@nextdim.com----- Original Message ----- Subject: Leonard Baby Catskill Does anyone have a taper for a Leonard Baby Catskill? I beleive this is a6' or6' 6" 3 or 4 wt. rod. In the book by A.J. Campbell, Classic Fly Rods andReels,there is a picture of one but no taper info. I am interested in any infoorleads you may have on this rod or any other Leonards of this size. Thanks, Jeff from fiveside@net-gate.com Thu Dec 2 18:13:25 1999 ns1.net-gate.com (8.9.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id TAA02898 for; Subject: Epon To the List,Epon experience; Made my first Epon rods in the late 60's. Have made afeweach year since then. Have used nothing else. All these rods are stillfishing as vigorously as I can manage. I exhausted my first 2 quarts ofEpon/hardener in the early 80's. Than bought 2 new quarts which are nowwinding down. I use no special storage provisions. I do gently warm theeponjugs before using. These comments strictly apply ONLY to Epon 828 and Hardener 140 orV40bought from the authorized distributor Miller Stephenson. There are lotsofepoxy formulations out there. This one works well.A related bit of info which I've told before: well over 10 years ago Irepaired a grease-soaked wooden steak knife handle using Epon. This knifehas been through the dish washer cycle a couple of times a week sincethen.Still intact. When that knife comes apart I'll look for another adhesive.Maybe? Bill PS I do use Titebond II for nodeless scarf splices(but not on 2-strippers). from jimgentz@earthlink.net Thu Dec 2 18:25:26 1999 Subject: Re: swelled butt CHRISTOPHER C MCDOWELL wrote: Like Darrell said, T&T isn't using planing forms to acquire thedramatically swelled butt. My forms have the 2.5" stations in the buttarea but this only aids in making steeper increase in the butt over say5",not a dramatically swelled butt right at the cork like that of the T&Trods. That thick steel will only bend so far even with the extra stations.The swelled butt forms would be the best way to get the dramaticdiameterincrease near the cork, but you would have to do a lot of planing on theremainder of the strip. Chrismcdowellc@lanecc.edu-------------Original TextFrom: "scan.oest" , on 12/2/99 4:11 AM:Fellow listers Last night I browsed a cataloque from Thomas and Thomas, looking attheircanerods. These guys know how to make a gorgeuos finish on a rod. Whattheydo know, too, is how to make a SWELLED butt. In fact, it is so swelled that I cannot imagine how they make it. Do theyglue on extra pieces of cane, do they bent the cane with steam, or dotheyplane away of the outer fibres just before the swelling? Knowledge of this, or Your usual wellfounded opinions are welcome. Thistruly amazes me. regards, Carsten What about the method they used when they inserted thin strips of cedarbetween the cane to develop a swelled butt? I always thought those smallslivers of wood were very attractive, but have never thought about howthey did it.Any one have any suggestions? Thanks, Jim from mcdowellc@lanecc.edu Thu Dec 2 18:33:55 1999 16:46:01 PST Subject: Spiral Rod Glue Removal Tom, Dell, Ralph and others that have made the spiral rods, how does scraping the glue off the rod work out? Rather then scraping off a flat that is parallel to the bench top, you have a flat that has a 1/6th twist between every guide, or whatever twist amount you opt to use. Does that make scraping fun? Any tips on this process, or do you just get busy and carefully scrape away. Thanks for sharing your experiences. Chrismcdowellc@lanecc.edu from darrell@rockclimbing.org Thu Dec 2 19:23:48 1999 sims.3.5.1999.09.16.21.57.p8)with SMTP id for Subject: RE: swelled butt I love those swelled butt rods with the strips of cedar inserts... I saw T&Tmade some of those too... Has anybody else made some rods with theinsertsand how? Darrell-----Original Message----- Subject: Re: swelled butt CHRISTOPHER C MCDOWELL wrote: Like Darrell said, T&T isn't using planing forms to acquire thedramatically swelled butt. My forms have the 2.5" stations in the buttarea but this only aids in making steeper increase in the butt over say5",not a dramatically swelled butt right at the cork like that of the T&Trods. That thick steel will only bend so far even with the extrastations.The swelled butt forms would be the best way to get the dramaticdiameterincrease near the cork, but you would have to do a lot of planing on theremainder of the strip. Chrismcdowellc@lanecc.edu-------------Original TextFrom: "scan.oest" , on 12/2/99 4:11 AM:Fellow listers Last night I browsed a cataloque from Thomas and Thomas, looking attheircanerods. These guys know how to make a gorgeuos finish on a rod. Whattheydo know, too, is how to make a SWELLED butt. In fact, it is so swelled that I cannot imagine how they make it. Do theyglue on extra pieces of cane, do they bent the cane with steam, or dotheyplane away of the outer fibres just before the swelling? Knowledge of this, or Your usual wellfounded opinions are welcome. Thistruly amazes me. regards, Carsten What about the method they used when they inserted thin strips of cedarbetween the cane to develop a swelled butt? I always thought those smallslivers of wood were very attractive, but have never thought about howthey did it.Any one have any suggestions?Thanks, Jim from brookie@frii.com Thu Dec 2 19:34:21 1999 Subject: RE: swelled butt I love those swelled butt rods with the strips of cedar inserts... I saw T&T made some of those too... Has anybody else made some rods with the insertsand how? I've haphazardly been following the threads on this, and if someoneprovided a url for images of a swelled butt on a cane, I missed it. Now IAM interested. Anyone care to share some websites ? And the abovedescription of strips of cedar inserts sounds intriquing, any change thereare some images of those ? suecolorado from fquinchat@locl.net Thu Dec 2 19:41:27 1999 corsair.locl.net(8.9.0/8.7.3) with SMTP id UAA12574; Thu, 2 Dec 1999 20:41:17 -0500 Subject: Re: hollow-built rods Tim, I built a 8013 Dickerson (1951 version) last year and hollowed the buttsection for 31 inches. The wall thickness was .078 and I left a fullsection dam every 8 inches. It performed very well this summer. I'm now building a hollow 8615 Dickerson. It is hollowed for 41inches andhas a .058 wall with dams every 7 inches. It looks like it will come inunder 5 oz. I may be pushing the envelope a little on this one but we'llsee. I end up with a scalloped cross section similar to Winston. I have built asmall milling fixture using Dremmel. For tools I use carbide ball millsstarting at .125" dia and going down to .060. Dennis BertramAngola, IN -----Original Message----- Subject: hollow-built rods greetings! i would appreciate knowing if there isanyone in the midwest states that builds hollow rods.i am intrested in building one for myself and havesome questions about the process. if there is someoneclose enough i would be intrested in seeing you in theprocess. is there a better process than whittling oneach spline with a kraft knife? timothy ====="Gooda' morning mister bear"__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. All in one place.Yahoo! Shopping: http://shopping.yahoo.com from bluefin_1999@yahoo.com Thu Dec 2 19:47:24 1999 1999 17:47:22 PST Subject: Please define "swelled butt" TIA__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. All in one place.Yahoo! Shopping: http://shopping.yahoo.com from rsgould@cmc.net Thu Dec 2 20:12:29 1999 Subject: Re: swelled butt Hi Darrell,Yes other rod makers have made butt sections with the cedar strips inbetween the cane strips. I have one made by Conroy, Bisset and Mallesonandthe handle area is truly amazing.Ray----- Original Message ----- Subject: RE: swelled butt I love those swelled butt rods with the strips of cedar inserts... I sawT&Tmade some of those too... Has anybody else made some rods with theinsertsand how? Darrell-----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Thursday, December 02, 1999 4:27 PM Cc: Rodmakers ListservSubject: Re: swelled butt CHRISTOPHER C MCDOWELL wrote: Like Darrell said, T&T isn't using planing forms to acquire thedramatically swelled butt. My forms have the 2.5" stations in the buttarea but this only aids in making steeper increase in the butt over say5",not a dramatically swelled butt right at the cork like that of the T&Trods. That thick steel will only bend so far even with the extrastations.The swelled butt forms would be the best way to get the dramaticdiameterincrease near the cork, but you would have to do a lot of planing on theremainder of the strip. Chrismcdowellc@lanecc.edu-------------Original TextFrom: "scan.oest" , on 12/2/99 4:11 AM:Fellow listers Last night I browsed a cataloque from Thomas and Thomas, looking attheircanerods. These guys know how to make a gorgeuos finish on a rod.Whattheydo know, too, is how to make a SWELLED butt. In fact, it is so swelled that I cannot imagine how they make it. Dotheyglue on extra pieces of cane, do they bent the cane with steam, or dotheyplane away of the outer fibres just before the swelling? Knowledge of this, or Your usual wellfounded opinions are welcome.Thistruly amazes me. regards, Carsten What about the method they used when they inserted thin strips of cedarbetween the cane to develop a swelled butt? I always thought thosesmallslivers of wood were very attractive, but have never thought about howthey did it.Any one have any suggestions?Thanks, Jim from rmoon@ida.net Thu Dec 2 20:20:32 1999 Subject: Re: Please define "swelled butt" boundary="------------A98BF0460131D63E71014F4D" --------------A98BF0460131D63E71014F4D I have included an image in this message that 1. shows a swelled butt,and 2. shows an example of twelve strip construction. I havetentatively dtated the rod in the late 1870's or early 1880's Makerunknown. 5 piece calcutta.Ralph from rsgould@cmc.net Thu Dec 2 20:21:31 1999 Subject: Re: Spiral Rod Glue Removal Hi Chris,Now there's a great question. I just removed the glue from the tip sectionof my first spiral rod the day before yesterday. It isn't easy. I worked itoff in short areas only a couple inches long using a steel block and sandpaper. It's tedious but it can be done. I would think that wiping down theoutside of a freshly glued up and bound rod section with a damp rag wouldbea real work saver especially for spiral rods.Ray----- Original Message - ---- Subject: Spiral Rod Glue Removal Tom, Dell, Ralph and others that have made the spiral rods, how doesscraping the glue off the rod work out? Rather then scraping off a flatthat is parallel to the bench top, you have a flat that has a 1/6th twistbetween every guide, or whatever twist amount you opt to use. Doesthatmake scraping fun? Any tips on this process, or do you just get busy andcarefully scrape away. Thanks for sharing your experiences. Chrismcdowellc@lanecc.edu from arnold.jl@pg.com Thu Dec 2 20:56:18 1999 notes082.na.pg.com[155.125.116.193] 1999 21:54:21 1999)) id8525683C.00101EC0 ; Thu, 2 Dec 1999 21:56:04 -0500 Subject: Re: Leonard Baby Catskill Dell, thanks for the taper info. I have seen some of the light weightLeonardsand I new the tips where thin. Do you know if there is a 6' version of theserods or was 7' the smallest size that they built? Jeff Internet Mail Message Received from host: wugate.wustl.edu [128.252.120.1] Envelope Sender: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Please respond to dellc@nextdim.com Subject: Re: Leonard Baby Catskill This is the taper for 7' Leonard that is a very light rod., only 1 3/4 oz.Excuse the odd layout as I still measure a rod as I was taught.Leonard 7', 1 3/4 oz., 9/64 ferrule for 2/3 wt.Butt from female end: 0"-.140, 5"-.150, 10"-.160, 15"-.170, 20"-.180,25"-.195, 31.5"-.206 34"-.280, 42"-.280Tip from the tip: 0'-.050, 5'-.055, 10"-.065, 15"-.070, 20"-.090, 25"-.105,30"- .115, 35"-.125, 40"-.130, 42"-.140These were taken from an original rod subtracting .003 for varnish. Reelseat wood cap and ring 3 1/4" with 4 1/4" cigar grip.Dell.Dell & Marie CoppockThe Flyfisher& the Quilterhttp://www.trwebsites.com/dell/e-mail dellc@nextdim.comflyfisher@nextdim.com----- Original Message ----- Subject: Leonard Baby Catskill Does anyone have a taper for a Leonard Baby Catskill? I beleive this is a6' or6' 6" 3 or 4 wt. rod. In the book by A.J. Campbell, Classic Fly Rods andReels,there is a picture of one but no taper info. I am interested in any infoorleads you may have on this rod or any other Leonards of this size. Thanks, Jeff from dellc@nextdim.com Thu Dec 2 21:06:19 1999 (SMTPD32-4.06) id AFEBAA5D00A2; Thu, 02 Dec 1999 18:50:19 PST Subject: Re: Leonard Baby Catskill I have heard of others but that is the only one I have. Maybe some body canclarify for me the term "Fairy" when describing a rod?DellDell & Marie CoppockThe Flyfisher& the Quilterhttp://www.trwebsites.com/dell/e-mail dellc@nextdim.comflyfisher@nextdim.com----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Leonard Baby Catskill Dell, thanks for the taper info. I have seen some of the light weightLeonardsand I new the tips where thin. Do you know if there is a 6' version oftheserods or was 7' the smallest size that they built? Jeff Internet Mail MessageReceived from host: wugate.wustl.edu[128.252.120.1] Envelope Sender: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu From: "Dell" on 12/02/99 06:35 PM Please respond to dellc@nextdim.com cc:Subject: Re: Leonard Baby Catskill This is the taper for 7' Leonard that is a very light rod., only 1 3/4 oz.Excuse the odd layout as I still measure a rod as I was taught.Leonard 7', 1 3/4 oz., 9/64 ferrule for 2/3 wt.Butt from female end: 0"-.140, 5"-.150, 10"-.160, 15"-.170, 20"-.180,25"-.195, 31.5"-.206 34"-.280, 42"-.280Tip from the tip: 0'-.050, 5'-.055, 10"-.065, 15"-.070, 20"-.090,25"-.105,30"- .115, 35"-.125, 40"-.130, 42"-.140These were taken from an original rod subtracting .003 for varnish. Reelseat wood cap and ring 3 1/4" with 4 1/4" cigar grip.Dell.Dell & Marie CoppockThe Flyfisher& the Quilterhttp://www.trwebsites.com/dell/e-mail dellc@nextdim.comflyfisher@nextdim.com----- Original Message -----From: Jeff Arnold-JL Sent: Thursday, December 02, 1999 8:52 AMSubject: Leonard Baby Catskill Does anyone have a taper for a Leonard Baby Catskill? I beleive this isa6' or6' 6" 3 or 4 wt. rod. In the book by A.J. Campbell, Classic Fly Rods andReels,there is a picture of one but no taper info. I am interested in any infoorleads you may have on this rod or any other Leonards of this size. Thanks, Jeff from LECLAIR123@aol.com Thu Dec 2 21:40:40 1999 Subject: Re: Fitting ferrules In a message dated 12/02/1999 12:18:38 PM Eastern Standard Time, flytyr@southshore.com writes: Tony,If you are going to "fit" the ferrules, you don't want touse a cutter bit. You want to use either some very fine sandpaper ( 1,000 grit ) or a special file made for fitting ferrules.Russ Gooding sells them (Goldenwitch.com) . As far as the speed,you should run the lathe at a fairly slow speed. Keep checking the fit, every few seconds, or you may remove too much metal. Dave L. from LECLAIR123@aol.com Thu Dec 2 21:43:50 1999 Subject: Re: swelled butt mcdowellc@lanecc.edu In a message dated 12/02/1999 8:30:31 PM Eastern Standard Time, darrell@rockclimbing.org writes: Tom Moran in England also makes some rods with woodstrips, as T & T does. It sure looks good. Dave L. from mrmac@tcimet.net Thu Dec 2 21:46:52 1999 Subject: Re: Please define "swelled butt" I have no financial interest, etc., but I ran across this presentationrod from Jeff Wagner while browsing off the Rodmaker's page. It showssome *very* nice rods, two of which are examples for you of thetriangular insert approach to a swelled butt on an otherwiseconventional (though hardly "ordinary") 6 strip rod. http://www.wagnerrods.com/limited.html regards to all, mac from darrell@rockclimbing.org Thu Dec 2 23:12:12 1999 sims.3.5.1999.09.16.21.57.p8)with SMTP id for Subject: Re: swelled butt Hi Ray, Yes I own several with the cedar inserts... most neophyte collectors seemtoattribute the cedar inserts or "cue stick look" to George Burtis, but MANYclassic rod makers made them including HL Leonard... I'd love to restore acouple of them that I own, but I HATE intermediates and so they sit withvarnish as dark and thick as molasses... I've got one with the Abbey &Imbrie decal... Which brings up another question... What do you restorers use/do to remove some of the dark varnish over thedecals without damaging the decal itself... Anyone got a few tricks uptheirsleeves??? Darrell----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: swelled butt Hi Darrell,Yes other rod makers have made butt sections with the cedar strips inbetween the cane strips. I have one made by Conroy, Bisset and Mallesonandthe handle area is truly amazing.Ray----- Original Message ----- From: Darrell A. Lee Cc: Rodmakers Listserv Sent: Thursday, December 02, 1999 5:13 PMSubject: RE: swelled butt I love those swelled butt rods with the strips of cedar inserts... I sawT&Tmade some of those too... Has anybody else made some rods with theinsertsand how? Darrell-----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Thursday, December 02, 1999 4:27 PM Cc: Rodmakers ListservSubject: Re: swelled butt CHRISTOPHER C MCDOWELL wrote: Like Darrell said, T&T isn't using planing forms to acquire thedramatically swelled butt. My forms have the 2.5" stations in thebuttarea but this only aids in making steeper increase in the butt oversay5",not a dramatically swelled butt right at the cork like that of the T&Trods. That thick steel will only bend so far even with the extrastations.The swelled butt forms would be the best way to get the dramaticdiameterincrease near the cork, but you would have to do a lot of planing ontheremainder of the strip. Chrismcdowellc@lanecc.edu-------------Original TextFrom: "scan.oest" , on 12/2/99 4:11 AM:Fellow listers Last night I browsed a cataloque from Thomas and Thomas, looking attheircanerods. These guys know how to make a gorgeuos finish on a rod.Whattheydo know, too, is how to make a SWELLED butt. In fact, it is so swelled that I cannot imagine how they make it. Dotheyglue on extra pieces of cane, do they bent the cane with steam, or dotheyplane away of the outer fibres just before the swelling? Knowledge of this, or Your usual wellfounded opinions are welcome.Thistruly amazes me. regards, Carsten What about the method they used when they inserted thin strips ofcedarbetween the cane to develop a swelled butt? I always thought thosesmallslivers of wood were very attractive, but have never thought about howthey did it.Any one have any suggestions?Thanks, Jim from mrj@aa.net Fri Dec 3 00:19:45 1999 Thu, 2 Dec 1999 22:19:36 -0800 Subject: Re: hollow-built rods I have built one Hollow rod and really love it. It is an 8 &1/2 fter for a6/7 wt line. really nice to cast for a big rod. I marked the bridgelocations as Richard Tyree suggests in a Planing form article but I did notscrape out the sections. Instead I held the rod and used the edge of a 6inch grinding wheel. Worked great and I was easily able to hold thetolerances to .005 (though I doubt if that close of tolerances on the pithside are necessary). On my next hollow rod I am sure that I could hold thetolerances even closer tolerances. Enough to please even the mostanal-retentive rod builder (G)Martin Jensen----- Original Message ----- Subject: hollow-built rods greetings! i would appreciate knowing if there isanyone in the midwest states that builds hollow rods.i am intrested in building one for myself and havesome questions about the process. if there is someoneclose enough i would be intrested in seeing you in theprocess. is there a better process than whittling oneach spline with a kraft knife? timothy ====="Gooda' morning mister bear"__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. All in one place.Yahoo! Shopping: http://shopping.yahoo.com from Eastkoyfly@aol.com Fri Dec 3 07:31:39 1999 Subject: Re: swelled butt mcdowellc@lanecc.edu Hello All,Jeff Wagner makes very nice swelled butts with different woods JD Wagner Bamboo Rodmaker from Grhghlndr@aol.com Fri Dec 3 08:22:33 1999 Subject: Re: swelled butt/how to add cedar strips jimgentz@earthlink.net,mcdowellc@lanecc.edu List,I had a rod maker show me Two rods with cedar strips in the butt. Ifmemory serves me right he told me to put the cedar strips in your planing form and plane them down just like you do the bamboo and insert them in betweenthe strips just like you are adding additional bamboo. Does this make sense to you. I may not be clear on how I explained this. | | | || | | || | | || | | | Imagine one strip is bamboo and the other here is cedar and that there is also the other strips are layed in here. Of the two rods one had the strips smaller and one had equal size strips to the bamboo. Now remember I amgoing told me that he adjusted the taper a little to accomodate the cedar. You also have to make sure that the cedar strips all come in on the tapered end at the same place on the cane. If someone trys this let the rest of useknow the results. I have some walnut I may try this with and maybe some other woods I have laying around. I hope this makes sense.Bret from SSteinzor@atg.state.vt.us Fri Dec 3 09:08:23 1999 Subject: RE: Please define "swelled butt" What beautiful workmanship. It is interesting to contemplate thedifferencein aesthetics between this and Garrison's approach - according to HoagyCarmichael, Garrison loathed any form of decorative embellishment on hisrods, every detail of which he intended to be purely functional, and he was"impossible to live with" on the rare occasions when he had to do coloredwraps. -----Original Message-----From: Ralph MacKenzie [SMTP:mrmac@tcimet.net]Sent: Thursday, December 02, 1999 9:44 PM Cc: rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Re: Please define "swelled butt" I have no financial interest, etc., but I ran across this presentationrod from Jeff Wagner while browsing off the Rodmaker's page. It showssome *very* nice rods, two of which are examples for you of thetriangular insert approach to a swelled butt on an otherwiseconventional (though hardly "ordinary") 6 strip rod. http://www.wagnerrods.com/limited.html regards to all, mac from rmoon@ida.net Fri Dec 3 09:57:46 1999 Subject: attachment To all members of the list. I want to apologize for breaking the rulesof the list. I suppose that at one time I knew that attachments werenot allowed on the list, but I had forgotton. Since I sent two messagesat virtually the same time I can only suppose that the one that wasdeleted was the second message not the one carrying the attachment.Again I am sorry. Please blame my old timer's disease (extremesenility) Ralph from flytyr@southshore.com Fri Dec 3 10:00:09 1999 [12.10.111.36] (may be forged)) Subject: Re: Fitting ferrules I guess I need to clarify the message below.I should of said " fitting ferrules to the rodblank". It came across that I wanted to fit the maleto the female. No lathe for that, will keep doingthat by hand.Thanks to all that replied off list warning meagainst using a cutting bit to" fit the ferrules"Am still open to replies fitting the ferrule to theblank now that I have clarified the question.Thanks,Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com Tony Spezio wrote: I have finally gotten a "Real" lathe and want tofit ferrules using the lathe. I would like someinput as to speeds, type of tool bit and anyprecautions to take other than safety.Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com from mcdowellc@lanecc.edu Fri Dec 3 12:40:41 1999 10:51:42 PST Subject: Para 15 thread color Does anyone have an original or know which thread colors and tipping were used on the Young Para 15 rods? Thanks. Chrismcdowellc@lanecc.edu from rvenneri@ulster.net Fri Dec 3 14:36:23 1999 Subject: test Have I been kicked off or is it a slow day. Best regardsBob V from Patrick.Coffey@PSS.Boeing.com Fri Dec 3 15:58:28 1999 NAA09709 (5.5.2448.0) is it slow or did I get bumped off again Patrick W. CoffeyAOG Incident Repair PlanningPhone: 425-234-2901Fax: 425-237-0083M-2112 M/C 61-79 from dmanders@telusplanet.net Fri Dec 3 17:12:45 1999 Fri, 3 Dec 1999 14:24:24 -0700 Subject: Re: hollow-built rods Ray, I've used a number of 0.080" for the power fiber depth. Plus, I allowedabout 5" @ the ferrule stations and located my dams where a guide wouldbemounted with each dam about 2.0" long. Built 2 rods from the same culminterspacing the strips and attempting to make them as close a possible.One was hollowed - one not. The hollowed rod casts OK but about 10'shorterthan the solid rod. So, I would think to make a hollowed rod of a taper youlike, you might want to add a little here and there to get a similar action. regards, Don At 07:34 AM 12/2/99 -0800, Ray Gould wrote:Hi to all,Here's some more input on hollow rods. Bob's right , it depends on howradical you want to get and how much the rod is hollowed out. The guidelineI've established (thru trail and error) is to to maintain a minimum wallthickness of 0.070" of bamboo. This will provide adequate glue jointstrength. Then if there is to be no graphite insert placed in the core as Ido on some rods, a dam or solid spot (about 1" in length) should be placedevery 2 1/2" along the rod. This is done so that the cross section will notcollapse during bending. Note too that this means that the rod will not behollow when the "d" dimension across the flats is less than 0.140".Ray----- Original Message -----From: Bob Nunley Sent: Thursday, December 02, 1999 6:18 AMSubject: Fw: hollow-built rods Timothy,It depends on how radical you want to get with hollow built. Mine arewhat you might call semi-hollow. In Garrisons book, Hoagy Carmichaelrecommends planing one pass over the inner apex of each strip to allowtheadhesive to "squeeze" in both directions along the glued flats. Well, Itake a slightly larger amount off of each inner apex in the butt sectionallthe way downthe strip. So it does leave a "hollow" down the entire length of thestrip, just a very small one. I don't take very much material off of theinner apex of the tips... only one pass with the plane there.In any case, yes, there is a better way than to whittle with a craftknife. Set your plane to take a very light cut. Use a black marker andmark therod on the inner apex, where you want to leave your "dams". Justcarefullyplane between the marks and hollow out as much as you want. Myopinion isthata scaper or maybe even a drawknife would be better for this, as long asyoucouldcontrol your cut depth with the draw knife. I know a few (well acoupleofppl)who build hollows with the hollow cut flat with a plane and theyrecommendleaving 4 dams in each section... one at each end and two more spacedbetween them. Don't take this proceedure as Gospel, as I have not triedit,but if you have a rod you want to build for yourself, it may be worthgivinga shot. That way if it doesn't work you can just use it to beat the goatout of thegarden. Hopefully some others will respond to this and give you abetter than this one. Bob -----Original Message-----From: timothy troester Date: Thursday, December 02, 1999 7:36 AMSubject: hollow-built rods greetings! i would appreciate knowing if there isanyone in the midwest states that builds hollow rods.i am intrested in building one for myself and havesome questions about the process. if there is someoneclose enough i would be intrested in seeing you in theprocess. is there a better process than whittling oneach spline with a kraft knife? timothy ====="Gooda' morning mister bear"__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. All in one place.Yahoo! Shopping: http://shopping.yahoo.com from flyman35@home.com Fri Dec 3 19:30:00 1999 (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with ESMTP Subject: ??? I am I unsubscribed? I haven't recieved a single post all day. Matt from domenic1@worldnet.att.net Fri Dec 3 19:59:52 1999 (InterMail v03.02.07.07 118-134) with SMTP Sat, 4 Dec 1999 01:59:19 +0000 Subject: Re: Leonard Baby Catskill Jeff,As I understand it,In the Baby Catskill series of Leonard's There was a 6 footer in a 2 piece this could have been either a 37 ACM at 1 1/2 or a 37L at one ounce.There was also a 38 ACM which is a 7' 2 pc. at 2 1/4 ounces.In my opinionthese ACM (Arthur C.Mills)tapers are some of Leonard's finest.One common characteristic of most Leonard tapers is fine tips. Hope this helps Domenic Croce ----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Leonard Baby Catskill Dell, thanks for the taper info. I have seen some of the light weightLeonardsand I new the tips where thin. Do you know if there is a 6' version oftheserods or was 7' the smallest size that they built? Jeff Internet Mail MessageReceived from host: wugate.wustl.edu[128.252.120.1] Envelope Sender: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu From: "Dell" on 12/02/99 06:35 PM Please respond to dellc@nextdim.com cc:Subject: Re: Leonard Baby Catskill This is the taper for 7' Leonard that is a very light rod., only 1 3/4 oz.Excuse the odd layout as I still measure a rod as I was taught.Leonard 7', 1 3/4 oz., 9/64 ferrule for 2/3 wt.Butt from female end: 0"-.140, 5"-.150, 10"-.160, 15"-.170, 20"-.180,25"-.195, 31.5"-.206 34"-.280, 42"-.280Tip from the tip: 0'-.050, 5'-.055, 10"-.065, 15"-.070, 20"-.090,25"-.105,30"- .115, 35"-.125, 40"-.130, 42"-.140These were taken from an original rod subtracting .003 for varnish. Reelseat wood cap and ring 3 1/4" with 4 1/4" cigar grip.Dell.Dell & Marie CoppockThe Flyfisher& the Quilterhttp://www.trwebsites.com/dell/e-mail dellc@nextdim.comflyfisher@nextdim.com----- Original Message -----From: Jeff Arnold-JL Sent: Thursday, December 02, 1999 8:52 AMSubject: Leonard Baby Catskill Does anyone have a taper for a Leonard Baby Catskill? I beleive this isa6' or6' 6" 3 or 4 wt. rod. In the book by A.J. Campbell, Classic Fly Rods andReels,there is a picture of one but no taper info. I am interested in any infoorleads you may have on this rod or any other Leonards of this size. Thanks, Jeff from domenic1@worldnet.att.net Fri Dec 3 20:20:41 1999 (InterMail v03.02.07.07 118-134) with SMTP Subject: Leonard baby catskill boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0053_01BF3DD5.032136E0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0053_01BF3DD5.032136E0 Jeff,As I understand it,In the Baby Catskill series of Leonard's There was a 6 footer in a 2 =piece this could have been either a 37 ACM at 1 1/2 or a 37L at one ounce.There was also a 38 ACM which is a 7' 2 pc. at 2 1/4 ounces.In my =opinionthese ACM (Arthur C.Mills)tapers are some of Leonard's finest.One common characteristic of most Leonard tapers is fine tips. Hope this helps Domenic P. Croce ------=_NextPart_000_0053_01BF3DD5.032136E0 = Croce ------=_NextPart_000_0053_01BF3DD5.032136E0-- from edriddle@mindspring.com Fri Dec 3 20:28:12 1999 Subject: Trade or Sell To All:Remembering our non-commercial guidelines, please respond off-list. I'd like to trade my "as-new condition" copy of "Classic & Antique FlyFishing Tackle: A Guide for Collectors and Anglers", by A.J. Campbell, for acopy of, "Fundamentals of Building a Bamboo Fly-rod", by George E. Maurer&Bernard P. Elser. Both books are listed at $50.00 ea. new.Ed from morten@flash.net Fri Dec 3 21:21:48 1999 Subject: Re: Please define "swelled butt" Just checking-- 3119 Georgia Pine Dr.Spring, TX 77373(281) 353 5725http://www.flash.net/~morten from yves@dancris.com Fri Dec 3 22:20:31 1999 Is the server down? Dave La Touche from mrj@aa.net Fri Dec 3 23:34:23 1999 Subject: test - delete this I can see my message? from CAIrvinerods@aol.com Sat Dec 4 12:18:59 1999 11:48:24 ESTSubject: test from 76250.1771@compuserve.com Sat Dec 4 12:18:59 1999 Subject: Leonard Baby Catskill Dell-According to Keane in his, "Classic Rods& Rodmakers" the "Fairy Catskill"appeared in 1894. It was 8'2" long and weighed 2oz, and it was3 piece! The"Fairy" designation because of the extreme light weight. Devine made a"Fairy' rod also...came out in 1917. It was a 7'6", three piece thatweighed 2.5 oz. It was advertized as a "lithe little Divine Specialty","the final word in lightweight tackle". Here's a 7', 2piece, 2wt leonard catskill. 0 = .043, 5 = .053, 10 = .070, 15 = .080, 20 = .100, 25 = .110, 30 =.125, 35 = .130, 40 = .140, 45 = .15050 = .165, 55 = .180, 60 = .210, 65 = .225, 70 = .230, 74 = .230, 75 =.245, 76 = .265, 84 = .265 . Howell's book has a 6'6", 3w leonardt taper. Best, Dennis from watson@cape-consult.co.uk Sat Dec 4 12:29:06 1999 Subject: 7' 2wt boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0013_01BF3E55.3E741340" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0013_01BF3E55.3E741340 I have someone who is interested in a 7' 2wt rod. Any sugestions on a =taper?ThanksTim ------=_NextPart_000_0013_01BF3E55.3E741340 I have someone who is interested in a 7' 2wt = sugestions on a taper?ThanksTim ------=_NextPart_000_0013_01BF3E55.3E741340-- from anglport@con2.com Sat Dec 4 12:32:45 1999 (SMTPD32-5.05) id AA67107F028E; Sat, 04 Dec 1999 12:07:51 -0500 Subject: Planes Newbies,I just got a flyer from a "Phillips Bros.' Supply (Construction andIndustrial Supplies) in Buffalo, NY and they're advertising Stanley SP12-920's for $32.95. I think that's about as cheap as you'll find them. I must admit I've NEVER done business with these guys and theshippingcosts sre extra and not stated but I thought I'd let all know. They have asite at www.phillipsbros.com and you can call them at 1-800-888-7271.Hope it pans out for someone.Art *Some people can tell what time it is by looking at the sun, but I never have been able to make out the numbers.* from BambooRods@aol.com Sat Dec 4 12:48:38 1999 Subject: Quad Tapers Question This may seem like an odd question but.... can anyone suggest a source for some tapers for quad rods. Are there any formulas/approaches, etc., to converting 6 strip tapers to quad. Any thoughts would be appreciated.Doug Hall from d_price@global2000.net Sat Dec 4 12:57:20 1999 NAA26823; Subject: Re: Fitting ferrules Tony do you mean fit the ferrels to the bamboo or fit them tothemselves? Dave Tony Spezio wrote: I have finally gotten a "Real" lathe and want tofit ferrules using the lathe. I would like someinput as to speeds, type of tool bit and anyprecautions to take other than safety.Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com from tragich23@juno.com Sat Dec 4 13:18:06 1999 14:18:01 EST Subject: no mail IS IT JUST A REAL SLOW DAY, OR AM I OFF THE LIS T FOR SOME REASON. IHADNO RODMAKERS MAIL FOR 2 DAYS NOW.AI from watson@cape-consult.co.uk Sat Dec 4 13:55:40 1999 Subject: 7' 2wt boundary="----=_NextPart_000_001D_01BF3E91.5A6DF980" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_001D_01BF3E91.5A6DF980 Someone has asked me to do a 7' 2wt for them.Any thoughts or comments on a taper would be appreciated.ThanksTim. ------=_NextPart_000_001D_01BF3E91.5A6DF980 Someone has asked me to do a 7' 2wt for =them. appreciated.ThanksTim. ------=_NextPart_000_001D_01BF3E91.5A6DF980-- from RMargiotta@aol.com Sat Dec 4 14:03:47 1999 Subject: test -- ignore test from rmoon@ida.net Sat Dec 4 14:22:28 1999 0000 Subject: slow I have had no messages for 48 hours. Am I still on?Ralph from tripp@olywa.net Sat Dec 4 15:32:56 1999 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-56662U5000L500S0V35)with SMTP id net for ;Sat, 4 Dec 1999 13:34:00 -0800 Subject: test boundary="----=_NextPart_000_001B_01BF3E5B.DE49FC80" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_001B_01BF3E5B.DE49FC80 Testing the list. No messages for two days... ------=_NextPart_000_001B_01BF3E5B.DE49FC80 days... ------=_NextPart_000_001B_01BF3E5B.DE49FC80-- from cathcreek@hotmail.com Sat Dec 4 16:01:14 1999 Sat, 04 Dec 1999 14:00:38 PST Subject: bumped again Did I get bumped again? No messges for a day or so. Robert Clarkecathcreek@hotmail.com ______________________________________________________Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com from dickay@alltel.net Sat Dec 4 16:30:22 1999 QAA11966 Subject: Test boundary="----=_NextPart_000_004F_01BF3E74.92E876E0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_004F_01BF3E74.92E876E0 Test. Is this a slow day?? Or have I been bumped? ------=_NextPart_000_004F_01BF3E74.92E876E0 bumped? ------=_NextPart_000_004F_01BF3E74.92E876E0-- from bob@downandacross.com Sat Dec 4 18:27:32 1999 (envelope- from bob@downandacross.com) Subject: Depth Gauge Can anyone tell me how to adjust a Mitotoyu Digital Depth Gauge? When Iask this, I mean how do you offset it a couple of .001's to get accurate when you have a standard to judge from. I know mine is off .004 (to shallow a reading), but I can't figure out how to adjust the zero up and down.Thanks, Bob Mauluccibob@downandacross.com from avyoung@iinet.net.au Sat Dec 4 20:32:10 1999 Subject: test test/*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html And this our life, exempt from public haunt,Finds tongues in trees, books in running brooks,Sermons in stones, and good in everything. William Shakespeare, As You Like It /*************************************************************************/ from seanmcs@ar.com.au Sun Dec 5 04:33:19 1999 Subject: Rodmakers list Hello: I have not had a message for two days, and I haveubsubscribed/resubscribed. Any chance to get back on? Sean McSharry from caneman@clnk.com Sun Dec 5 04:59:47 1999 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35)with SMTP id com for ;Sun, 5 Dec 1999 04:58:00 -0600 Subject: Lathe boundary="----=_NextPart_000_00C1_01BF3EDD.0511A440" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_00C1_01BF3EDD.0511A440 FIRST, I have absolutely no financial interest, etc., but if any of you =are looking for a decent starter lathe for a reasonable amount of money, =then check this one out on ebay. Better check quick, tho, because the =auction ends today. Here is the url for the item http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3D211094527 Later,Bob ------=_NextPart_000_00C1_01BF3EDD.0511A440 FIRST, I have absolutely no financial interest, etc., but if any of = looking for a decent starter lathe for a reasonable amount of money, = http://cgi.ebay.com/aw- cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3D211094527= Later,Bob ------=_NextPart_000_00C1_01BF3EDD.0511A440-- from FISHWOOL@aol.com Sun Dec 5 07:09:12 1999 Subject: Re: hollow-built rods RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.edu To all,This is going to be heresy but-When I hollow build I do not leave any dams and I don't hollow the tips. I tape the butt and/or mid sections, slice the tape with a razor as in gluing and open the splines up so I can planethe inner apices so that I wind up with a trapezoidal x-section with the inner flat 1/3-1/2 the width of the outer flat, depending on the size of thestick. So far I haven't had any collapsing tubes or at least no break downs due to same.Regards,Hank. from dmanders@telusplanet.net Sun Dec 5 08:13:17 1999 don") Sun, 5 Dec 1999 07:12:19 -0700 Subject: Tacky Test Am I still alive? Don from Canerods@aol.com Sun Dec 5 08:54:14 1999 Subject: 5 sided scarf repair? All, Anyone know how to make a tip scarf repair on a 5-sider? I was too busy waiting for the replacement ferrule from Dave LeClair to even notice.Darrell Lee happened to stop in yesterday and he noticed it right away. Don Burns from pmgoodwin@earthlink.net Sun Dec 5 09:07:26 1999 FAA02628 Subject: Test It's been more that a day from bob@downandacross.com Sun Dec 5 09:26:52 1999 (envelope- from bob@downandacross.com) Subject: Mitutoyo Digital Depth Gauge Can anyone tell me how to adjust a Mitutoyu Digital Depth Gauge? When Iask this, I mean how do you offset it a couple of .001's to get accurate when you have a standard to judge from. I know mine is off .004 (too shallow a reading), but I can't figure out how to adjust the zero up and down. I don't want to go uncrewing things, and the literature just says to set the "zero" on a flat surface. Maybe I need a translator.Thanks,Bob Maulucci==================================================downandacross.com productionshttp://www.downandacross.com218 Wallace AvenueBuffalo, NY 14216716-836-8297 home716-867-0523 cellularbob@downandacross.com from djfinch@sprintmail.com Sun Dec 5 09:46:39 1999 Subject: test from nobler@satx.rr.com Sun Dec 5 10:07:48 1999 SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.197.19);Sun, 5 Dec 1999 09:59:45 -0600 Subject: Restoratations boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0013_01BF3F08.9D78EF60" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0013_01BF3F08.9D78EF60 I know there are a number of real pro rod restorers here, and I'd =appreciate some advice. I have 5 high quality rods, of which I know the I.D. of two. All of =these have real badly checkered varnish on them. If ever "aligatored" =applied, this is the perfect description ! Three of these have perfect =windings, in all original condition. I'd appreciate any views on saving these wraps, but stripping the =finish, so that they can be re-varnished. GMA ------=_NextPart_000_0013_01BF3F08.9D78EF60 I know there are a number of real pro rod = here, and I'd appreciate some advice. "aligatored" applied, this is the perfect description ! Three of these = perfect windings, in all original condition. I'd appreciate any views on saving these wraps, but = finish, so that they can be re-varnished. GMA ------=_NextPart_000_0013_01BF3F08.9D78EF60-- from rp43640@online-club.de Sun Dec 5 10:19:14 1999 (MET) Subject: Quiet Am I still connected. Everything quiet since friday. Christian from FlyfishT@aol.com Sun Dec 5 10:30:50 1999 Subject: lathes Hi, all. I have a question. I am interested in a 9" South Bend lathe. It's a horizontal drive bench lathe, 24" centers. I was wondering if this lathewill do all the rod work needed, making ferrules, reel seats, etc. The spindle hole, he believes, is less than an inch, like 15/16th. Does the nickel silver come in small enough diameters to do all this work? It's a half-horsepower motor. I have no knowledge about lathes, so any help would be appreciated. HE is asking $750. Is this a good deal or not? Thanks in advance. Tom from rmoon@ida.net Sun Dec 5 11:24:30 1999 Subject: help Rodmakers help me from EESweet@aol.com Sun Dec 5 12:13:39 1999 Subject: test Is the list slow or down or have I been kicked off? from bob@downandacross.com Sun Dec 5 13:05:04 1999 (envelope- from bob@downandacross.com) Can anyone tell me how to adjust a Mitutoyu Digital Depth Gauge? When Iask this, I mean how do you offset it a couple of .001's to get accurate when you have a standard to judge from. I know mine is off .004 (too shallow a reading), but I can't figure out how to adjust the zero up and down. I don't want to go uncrewing things, and the literature just says to set the "zero" on a flat surface. Maybe I need a translator.Thanks,Bob Mauluccibob@downandacross.com from cmj@post11.tele.dk Sun Dec 5 13:14:33 1999 (InterMail vM.4.01.02.00 201-229-116) with SMTP Subject: Sharpes 88 , 1972 boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0004_01BF3F5D.C158E480" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0004_01BF3F5D.C158E480 Fellow Listers I=B4ve got an order for the tip of a Sharpe 88, year 1972.It is an impregnated rod.Does anyone know of this rod, and is a new tip available?The owner broke the tip in two places, so it is beyondrepair. Haven=B4t received mails for two days, so if someone readthis, please answer direct to cmj@post11.tele.dk regards, Carsten ------=_NextPart_000_0004_01BF3F5D.C158E480 Fellow Listers I´ve got an order for the tip= 88, year 1972.It is an = rod.Does anyone know of this rod, andis = available?The owner broke the tip in two = beyondrepair. Haven´t received mails for two days, so if = readthis, please answer direct to cmj@post11.tele.dk regards, Carsten ------=_NextPart_000_0004_01BF3F5D.C158E480-- from Michael.Roberts@health.wa.gov.au Sun Dec 5 18:00:39 1999 (5.5.2650.21) Subject: No messages No messages all weekend. Is the list quiet or have I been "bumped". from oakmere@carol.net Sun Dec 5 21:29:45 1999 Subject: RE: System Down? Hi Folks: I have not had email for two days from the bamboo list. Is the systemdown? FrankFrank Paul, GreyFox2932 North Bayshore DriveSeneca, SC 29672fwpaul@ces.clemson.edu (work)oakmere@carol.net (home) from richjez@enteract.com Sun Dec 5 21:59:56 1999 (envelope- from richjez@enteract.com) Subject: Test Just checking if I have been dropped.*________________________________)// Rich Jezioro@ /||/______/_||_________________________________________||/\/ \ > > from lars32@gateway.net Mon Dec 6 06:52:55 1999 (may be forged)) Subject: List boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0004_01BF3FB6.B50D2AC0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0004_01BF3FB6.B50D2AC0 I have not recieved any thing from the list for two days. Did I get =bumped off? ------=_NextPart_000_0004_01BF3FB6.B50D2AC0 thing = list for two days. Did I get bumped off? ------=_NextPart_000_0004_01BF3FB6.B50D2AC0-- from saweiss@flash.net Mon Dec 6 07:43:15 1999 Subject: no messages boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0021_01BF3FB5.2FAA8CC0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0021_01BF3FB5.2FAA8CC0 test ------=_NextPart_000_0021_01BF3FB5.2FAA8CC0 test ------=_NextPart_000_0021_01BF3FB5.2FAA8CC0-- from oossg@vbe.com Mon Dec 6 08:16:13 1999 Subject: No Activity? I haven't received any messages for a couple of days? Problems?Scott from Anachemrpo@aol.com Mon Dec 6 09:48:29 1999 Subject: Herter Grand Deluxe St. Albans Looking for lineage of a rod I just picked up. It's a 8' Herter Grand Deluxe St. Albans (Made In England sticker on it), 2 piece, 2 tip. It was private labelled for, and sold by Herters up until the mid to late 70's. Partridge? Hardy?Seems really slooow ("traditional British dry-fly action" ?) but I haven't put a line on it yet. I have an old Herter catalog that describes it as 5 or 6 wt. I seemed to have been unsubscribed, so please forward any response to meoff list, too. Thanks in advance, Russ Lavigne from brewer@teleport.com Mon Dec 6 09:51:57 1999 "hamachi"via SMTP by relay1.teleport.com, id smtpdAAA0YE6GU; Mon Dec 607:51:49 1999 Subject: Test - please disregard Attempting to see if I have been dropped from the list. Randy Brewerbrewer@teleport.comhttp://www.teleport.com/~brewer from dati@selway.umt.edu Mon Dec 6 10:02:48 1999 09:02:38 -0700 Subject: test Just a test to see if I am still receiving messages. from tjtrodmaker@yahoo.com Mon Dec 6 10:59:42 1999 1999 08:43:29 PST friends, i'm wondering if i got bumped off the list. i've not been receiving any emails. i read somewherewhat i am suppose to do but cannot now find it ofcourse. can someone send me a hand up? timothy troester ====="Gooda' morning mister bear"__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. All in one place.Yahoo! Shopping: http://shopping.yahoo.com from punky@integratedmillsystems.com Mon Dec 6 11:45:04 1999 Subject: test message - please disregard Apologies. I haven't received any mail from the list since 12/2, so I'mtrying to figure out if I'm still subscribed. from jhewitt@cmn.net Mon Dec 6 13:06:38 1999 Subject: List Down?? Is the list down?? from seanmcs@ar.com.au Mon Dec 6 14:54:29 1999 Subject: List Hello: It seems the list is off air, or is this just a problem for thiscorner of the world? Sean from domenic1@worldnet.att.net Mon Dec 6 16:48:57 1999 (InterMail v03.02.07.07 118-134) with SMTP Subject: JOIN boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0014_01BF4012.EF79F740" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0014_01BF4012.EF79F740 Subscribe rodmakers Domenic Croce ------=_NextPart_000_0014_01BF4012.EF79F740 Subscribe rodmakers Domenic =Croce ------=_NextPart_000_0014_01BF4012.EF79F740-- from Michael.Roberts@health.wa.gov.au Mon Dec 6 20:57:16 1999 E-Mail VirusWallNT); Tue, 07 Dec 1999 10:55:22 +0800 (5.5.2650.21) Subject: Radio silence Hi guys,Tony Young and I seem to have lost contact with the mother ship. Nomessages for four days now. Have tried unsub and resub to no avail. Eerilyquiet in the land of Oz. Please respond. Mike from channer@outerbounds.net Mon Dec 6 20:59:30 1999 taz.outerbounds.net(Rockliffe SMTPRA 3.4.2) with SMTP id;Mon, 6 Dec 1999 19:59:16 -0700 Subject: Morgan Hand mill Hi Darryl;I have been contemplating a MHM and I was wondering if you would mindanswering a few questions about yours. First of all, do you feel it wasworth the cost and does it save you a lot of time? I'm just a working stiffand 2 grand is a real big outlay for me, I would have to use a credit cardand be fairly well assured that I could get a lot more done with it. Ithink that if i can get the rods made that I (or at least the fly shophere)can get them sold and I can make the payments on the mill, but Iwouldlike to think that I can pay it off fairly quickly. Also, can it do swelledbutts? I most of my rods with a swelled butt these days and like theactionof that kind of rod. Thanks a lot for any info you care to pass on to me.John from tomrichard@email.msn.com Mon Dec 6 21:58:26 1999 SMTPSVC;Mon, 6 Dec 1999 19:57:54 -0800 Subject: NO MAIL ARE THE LINES UP OR DOWN? NO MESSAGES LATELY. TOM from briansr@point-net.com Tue Dec 7 04:08:17 1999 Subject: Hello!? List quiet?Or? from rodmaker@becclesworkshop.freeserve.co.uk Tue Dec 7 05:03:411999 helo=default) Subject: Re-subscribe 'cos I've been bumped! boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0019_01BF4098.68587EE0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0019_01BF4098.68587EE0 Subscribe Rodmakers ------=_NextPart_000_0019_01BF4098.68587EE0 Rodmakers ------=_NextPart_000_0019_01BF4098.68587EE0-- from HomeyDKlown@worldnet.att.net Tue Dec 7 06:20:38 1999 with ESMTP id Subject: Anyone out there? Are we slow or did I get kicked off the list again? Dennis from drinkr@voicenet.com Tue Dec 7 06:49:40 1999 0000 (207.103.134.164) Subject: No mail Just checking to see if I've been bumped off. I haven't seen any mail for acouple of days. Incidentally check out Anglers Art if you need a copy of theGarrison Bible. It's on sale this month......... from rodmaker@becclesworkshop.freeserve.co.uk Tue Dec 7 07:16:481999 ([62.136.227.178] helo=default) Subject: Test boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0005_01BF40B5.816B14C0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01BF40B5.816B14C0 Testing, testing, testing........... ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01BF40B5.816B14C0 Testing, testing........... ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01BF40B5.816B14C0-- from BigJohn47@aol.com Tue Dec 7 07:36:08 1999 Subject: mail is the list down or did i get the boot, no mail in 4 days. from gl@msrr.dmso.mil Tue Dec 7 07:56:58 1999Received: from triton.dmso.mil(8.8.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id IAA04971 for ;Tue, 7 Dec 1999 Subject: spey taper wanted i am interested in building a spey rod, in about a 7-8 weight. does anyonehave a suitable taper? tks. gl--------------------gary mischcdr, usn (ret.) from pmgoodwin@earthlink.net Tue Dec 7 08:19:12 1999 09:18:35 -0500 Subject: test boundary="----=_NextPart_000_009C_01BF4094.37380960" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_009C_01BF4094.37380960 ------=_NextPart_000_009C_01BF4094.37380960 ------=_NextPart_000_009C_01BF4094.37380960-- from cathcreek@hotmail.com Tue Dec 7 08:41:03 1999 Tue, 07 Dec 1999 06:40:29 PST Subject: no messages Still no messages, am I bumped? Robert Clarke ______________________________________________________Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com from dati@selway.umt.edu Tue Dec 7 09:23:15 1999 08:23:10 -0700 Subject: test just another test to see if I am still on the list Darin Law from Patrick.Coffey@PSS.Boeing.com Tue Dec 7 10:00:47 1999 IAA03302 (5.5.2448.0) Subject: server is the server down? can anybody read this? haven't received a posting indays. Patrick W. CoffeyAOG Incident Repair PlanningPhone: 425-234-2901Fax: 425-237-0083M-2112 M/C 61-79 from thardy@foxinternet.net Tue Dec 7 12:50:16 1999 mailsite.foxinternet.net(Rockliffe SMTPRA 3.4.5) with ESMTP idfor;Tue, 7 Dec 1999 10:49:14 -0800 Subject: Is the list down? Should I wait it out or resubscribe?Thanks,Tom Hardy from watson@cape-consult.co.uk Tue Dec 7 14:30:35 1999 boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0007_01BF40F1.CC99F100" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0007_01BF40F1.CC99F100 Sorry for the bandwidth but is there anyone out there?I've had nothing for days despite unsub/subscribe a couple of times.I miss all your erudite comments!! ------=_NextPart_000_0007_01BF40F1.CC99F100 there?I've had nothing for days despite unsub/subscribe a = times.I miss all your erudite comments!! ------=_NextPart_000_0007_01BF40F1.CC99F100-- from gjm80301@yahoo.com Tue Dec 7 15:32:14 1999 1999 13:20:40 PST Subject: Fixer-upper metal lathe for sale in Pennsylvania There is an old South Bend lathe on ebay which islocatd in Scranton, PA which the seller will not ship.If you are in the area, this might go cheap. Itlooks old and rough, but looks well-equipped. Shouldgo cheap, but there is a reserve, so maybe the ownerhas an inflated view of the value. Just happened to see this, no personal interest. http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=212811073 That's item 212811073__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. All in one place.Yahoo! Shopping: http://shopping.yahoo.com from fquinchat@locl.net Tue Dec 7 20:09:40 1999 corsair.locl.net(8.9.0/8.7.3) with SMTP id VAA19540; Tue, 7 Dec 1999 21:09:30 -0500 Subject: Re: hollow-built rods This is a test. Not getting any mail.-----Original Message----- ; RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.edu Subject: Re: hollow-built rods To all,This is going to be heresy but-When I hollow build I do not leave anydams and I don't hollow the tips. I tape the butt and/or mid sections,slicethe tape with a razor as in gluing and open the splines up so I can planetheinner apices so that I wind up with a trapezoidal x-section with the innerflat 1/3-1/2 the width of the outer flat, depending on the size of thestick.So far I haven't had any collapsing tubes or at least no break downs due tosame.Regards,Hank. from tragich23@juno.com Tue Dec 7 20:12:30 1999 21:12:03 EST Subject: whats goin on Hello, my name is Andrew Ingram. I was on the rodmakers list for about amonth. I have not had mail in a week and I have resubscribed with noluck. Is the page gone, or was I taken off for some reason I don't know? Andrew J. IngramRodbuilder / OwnerTragic Hex FlyrodsP.O. Box 5922Stateline, Nv. 89449 (530) 318-4044 from rodmaker@becclesworkshop.freeserve.co.uk Wed Dec 8 01:35:221999 helo=default) Subject: unsubscribe boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0008_01BF414E.F9E12680" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0008_01BF414E.F9E12680 unsubscribe ------=_NextPart_000_0008_01BF414E.F9E12680 unsubscribe ------=_NextPart_000_0008_01BF414E.F9E12680-- from seanmcs@ar.com.au Wed Dec 8 03:35:07 1999 Subject: Rodmakers list Hello: Is this Y2K-DEC? SMcS from rodmaker@becclesworkshop.freeserve.co.uk Wed Dec 8 03:38:041999 ([62.136.239.98]helo=default) Subject: subscribe rodmakers boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0004_01BF4160.0306B3E0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0004_01BF4160.0306B3E0 subscribe rodmakers ------=_NextPart_000_0004_01BF4160.0306B3E0 subscribe =rodmakers ------=_NextPart_000_0004_01BF4160.0306B3E0-- from stuart.tod@virgin.net Wed Dec 8 07:09:11 1999 (InterMail vM.4.01.02.00 201-229-116) with SMTP +0000 Subject: test boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0009_01BF417D.6FF974C0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0009_01BF417D.6FF974C0 testing??? ------=_NextPart_000_0009_01BF417D.6FF974C0 testing??? ------=_NextPart_000_0009_01BF417D.6FF974C0-- from harry37@epix.net Wed Dec 8 08:10:53 1999 JAA21692 Subject: list down? haven't gotten any posts for 3 days--was I unsubscribed? Is thelistserver down? Greg from iank@nelson.planet.org.nz Wed Dec 8 11:43:45 1999 sage.ts.co.nz with SMTP id GAA13523; Thu, 9 Dec 1999 06:43:29 +1300 Subject: Re: 9' Phillipson Premium 3/2 5 5/8oz. HCH Ed, I frequently end up with a spare 6 pieces when I split a culm. I usuallyinitial plane and heat treat these in case I need a replacement later on inthe process. This means that sometimes i end up with the six splitsections There is relatively little work to finish these to the final taper and bindthem.So if you do not mind waiting to Feb/March , and can finish off the blanksincluding fit the ferrules, then I can send you a couple of tip sectionsmade from surplus from the rods I am building now. The rods I make are all from non flamed bamboo. I trust the Phillipson isnot a flamed rod. Ian Kearney ps the cost would be postage only . At 11:20 AM 23/11/99 -0500, Ed Riddle wrote:To All:I own one of these with only one tip section and unfortunately that one isdown 5" at the tip. I've been told that other Phillipson model tip-sectionsmight fit, but who has any extras lying around. If anyone is interested inmaking me a tip section, or two, please contact me off list.Also, what should I use to remove masking tape residue from a finishedrodwithout harming the varnish? TIA.Ed-----Original Message-- ---From: CHRISTOPHER C MCDOWELL Date: Monday, November 22, 1999 4:11 PMSubject: 9' Phillipson Premium 3/2 5 5/8oz. HCH Here is one I said I would post from a couple weeks ago. 9' Phillipson premium 3/2 5 5/8 oz. HCH.Black wraps with white tipping and then black tipping. Hammer grip. Blackaluminum "No Rock" downlocking screwlock reelseat. No hookkeeper.Granger/Phillipson style winding check. Ferrules are size 18 butt/med,andsize 12 mid/tip. They are step down design.I would subtract .006 for varnish. I gave all measurements rounded to the nearest .0005" to demonstratehowwell Phillipson production rods were made. 5" station measurementscan'tdo justice to what a beveler can do, but hopefully if you make this rod itwill be similar to Phillipson's design. The measurements on the midsection betwen 60" and 70" are not an error. This was apparently afeaturePhillipson wanted in this taper. Guide spacing is also shown below. The space between the bottom guideonthe tips and the top guide on the mid is only 3 5/8" because there is aguide butted up against either side of the mid/tip ferrule, as wastypicalon some Phillipson and Granger rods. Chris McDowellmcdowellc@lanecc.edu Tip #1 Tip #2 from karenag@earthlink.net Wed Dec 8 14:31:04 1999 Subject: subscription Have I been droped from the list? No postings for a week or so.Steve Gobinkarenag@earthink.net from CAIrvinerods@aol.com Wed Dec 8 17:41:34 1999 Subject: Test Test from mrj@aa.net Wed Dec 8 21:25:43 1999 Subject: test please delete boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0013_01BF41B1.CC71F360" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0013_01BF41B1.CC71F360 ------=_NextPart_000_0013_01BF41B1.CC71F360 ------=_NextPart_000_0013_01BF41B1.CC71F360-- from landeens@home.com Thu Dec 9 00:40:38 1999 with SMTP 0800 Subject: Status boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0005_01BF41CC.EA80B2E0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01BF41CC.EA80B2E0 ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01BF41CC.EA80B2E0 I haven't recieved any messages for the last two = ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01BF41CC.EA80B2E0-- from caneman@clnk.com Thu Dec 9 04:59:08 1999 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35)with SMTP id com for ;Thu, 9 Dec 1999 04:57:20 -0600 Subject: L.N. Scraper boundary="----=_NextPart_000_00A8_01BF4201.97150180" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_00A8_01BF4201.97150180 IF the list ever comes back to life (sorry Mike, couldn't resist the =jab! *S*) there is a Lie-Nielson scraper plane on eBay if anyone needs =one... No financial interest here, of course, and dont know they guy = Look at it at http://cgi.ebay.com/aw- Later,Bob ------=_NextPart_000_00A8_01BF4201.97150180 IF the list ever comes back to life (sorry Mike, couldn't resist = *S*) there is a Lie-Nielson scraper plane on eBay if anyone needs one... = Look at it at cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3D213157740= Later,Bob ------=_NextPart_000_00A8_01BF4201.97150180-- from RBalex@webtv.net Thu Dec 9 05:02:30 1999 232.iap.bryant.webtv.net ESMTP id A3FFE21442 232.iap.bryant.webtv.net(8.8.8-wtv-e/mt.gso.26Feb98) id DAA07474; Thu, 9 Dec 1999 03:02:27 - ETAsAhRaZQ0bZp9yLMWDQimOCtdDpDRX5gIUenOpvs+z4toRTSObvLIZt10KcnM= Subject: question why do I keep getting cut off the list? Alex Wolff from stuart.tod@virgin.net Thu Dec 9 05:53:00 1999 (InterMail vM.4.01.02.00 201-229-116) with SMTP Subject: quiet list boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000C_01BF423C.00196B00" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000C_01BF423C.00196B00 Is the list very quiet or is it down? Two days without any mail - I'm getting withdrawl symptoms.... Help!!! Stuart ------=_NextPart_000_000C_01BF423C.00196B00 Is the list very quiet or is it =down? Two days without any mail - I'mgetting = symptoms.... Tried resigning & rejoining to no = Help!!! Stuart ------=_NextPart_000_000C_01BF423C.00196B00-- from tjtrodmaker@yahoo.com Thu Dec 9 09:28:41 1999 1999 05:01:02 PST are we upand running yet? ====="Gooda' morning mister bear"__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. All in one place.Yahoo! Shopping: http://shopping.yahoo.com from rafick@fwi.com Thu Dec 9 11:32:08 1999 0000 Subject: list Is the list still down ..? R.A.Fick Bamboo Rod Co.The best rods are being made today.www.angelfire.com/in2/rafickrods/ from jpsnbs@erols.com Thu Dec 9 13:51:56 1999 ([207.172.152.185]helo=default) Subject: List Alive? This is a test. Have not received messages for last 4-5 days. Have triedto unsubscribe several times and receive no response. Is anybody outthere?Is this the black hole before the end of all?Joe Swam from dpizza@access1.net Thu Dec 9 14:12:42 1999 (SMTPD32-5.01) id ACE0D7220042; Thu, 09 Dec 1999 12:11:12 PDT Subject: any word on...... ......when the list will be back up ???? TIA David from BigJohn47@aol.com Thu Dec 9 18:07:21 1999 Subject: mail to anybody out there is the list down or is it my problem no mail in aweek.bigjohn47@aol.com from sats@gte.net Thu Dec 9 18:12:58 1999 Subject: Montigue Highland Got one at a flea market a week ago. I thought I'd take a look at it and seewhat a lower end Montigue looked like. 8 1/2 ft long when I got it. in very good shape, it was only missing thetiptop I looked at the end and the tip top was only mounted on about a1/4 ofbamboo, that was cut down to fit . No wonder it came lose and was lost. I put the rod together and started to inspect it. Good reel seat, fair cork,but a very short and slightly small handle. It still has the paper that givesthe make and model on it. "for a 1 HF line." There were only 6 snake guides on the rod. And a total of 6 guides. That'sright, there was no stripper guide on this rod. All rod wraps were ofwhatappeared to be dark olive, until I looked at one of the wraps that wascominglose. The wraps were actually a violet blue! Interesting color. There wasnotrim wraps and the wraps were actually only covering the guide feet andmaybe an1/8 of an inch on each side. Wraps went up to, but did not cover theferrules.The tip and butt sections were straight but the mid section has a dog legin it. After examining the rod I put a dt5 line on it and tried casting. Not bad. Icould reliably get about 75ft out of it and occasionally 80ft. Like manyslowerrods, it didn't like wt. forward. and my distance dropper with it. After casting the rod I again examined it and found that both male ferruleshadcracked. I've heard that this often happened with Montigue rods of lowvalue. I'm replacing the cracked ferrules and the Female Butt ferrule and adding afewmore guides and a stripper guide. To do this I had to remove about 1 1/2to2in. from the length of the rod. I hope to salvage the original finish which is in good shape. I'll keep you informed. Terry "Sunfish" KirkpatrickSafety Harbor, Fl.(Old Tampa Bay)sats@gte.net from Trouts2@aol.com Thu Dec 9 21:22:56 1999 Subject: list I missed a few days here and the list disappeared.I resubscribed and amstill getting nothing....que pasa? Sinnce I don't have a clue as to sending a message I don't think I coould have offended anyone?????? from fcfp@ix.netcom.com Fri Dec 10 08:10:37 1999 Subject: "Old List" What is going on with the "old" list. Is it gone? F --Fred Bohls3519 Ada DriveMechanicsburg, PA 17055(717) 258-3579 MAKE IT A GREAT DAY !!! from canefisher@worldnet.att.net Fri Dec 10 15:48:27 1999 (InterMail v03.02.07.07 118-134) with SMTP +0000 Subject: Rodmakers Listserver boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000B_01BF4315.16AD65E0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000B_01BF4315.16AD65E0 Is the Rodmakers Listserver still running? I haven't received any =messages for about a week & do not even receive a confirmation when =attempting to resubscribe. ------=_NextPart_000_000B_01BF4315.16AD65E0 Is the Rodmakers Listserver still = haven't received any messages for about a week & do not even receive= confirmation when attempting toresubscribe. ------=_NextPart_000_000B_01BF4315.16AD65E0-- from maxs@geocities.co.jp Sat Dec 11 09:15:00 1999 bysv01.geocities.co.jp (8.9.3+3.2W/3.7W) with ESMTP id XAA00985 for; Sat, 11 Dec 1999 23:53:28 +0900 (JST) mail.geocities.co.jp(1.3G-GeocitiesJ-3.3) with SMTP id XAA29749 for; Sat, 11 Dec1999 23:53:27 +0900 (JST) Subject: Problem? Hi the list, If this message arrives at rodmakers ML, would you please someone replytome offlist.No mail comes to me after December 3 nor no reply were returned to myunsubscribe/subscriberequests to listproc these days. Is anything happening there? Max Max Satoh,an oriental Bamboo Fly Rod Makeremail: maxs@geocities.co.jpHome Page:$B%P%s%V! from mrj@aa.net Sat Dec 11 10:33:44 1999 boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0017_01BF43B2.35E80120" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0017_01BF43B2.35E80120 ------=_NextPart_000_0017_01BF43B2.35E80120 ------=_NextPart_000_0017_01BF43B2.35E80120-- from Bambull@webtv.net Sat Dec 11 11:12:54 1999 165.iap.bryant.webtv.net ESMTP id 891B22FFDC 165.iap.bryant.webtv.net(8.8.8-wtv-e/mt.gso.26Feb98) id JAA10484; Sat, 11 Dec 1999 09:11:17 - ETAsAhRnwJTU5JeXEZ4WDmPdDULxpvouIwIUZqUfu5ERr/44VIY/yig+Zzrpehg= Subject: unsubscribe rodmakers from nobler@satx.rr.com Sat Dec 11 11:47:13 1999 SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.197.19);Sat, 11 Dec 1999 11:46:59 -0600 , Subject: Re: swelled butt boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0018_01BF43CD.71C29F00" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0018_01BF43CD.71C29F00 You bring up a subject I really need help with Darrell. I have 5 - =really nice rods, and 3 of them have perfect wraps, but the varnish on =all is really checkered out. Is there any way to get the old varnish =off, and leave the wraps original ? The easiest will be an early Cross, which has at least one extra coat, =of something like molasses slopped all over everything. However there =are 2 Edwards, and a pre-impregnated Orvis, that have a real alligator =finish ! I also want to preserve some original decals, and plan to try to water =sand the varnish over them, with 1200, or finer. I have hopes that being =extra careful, will eliminate most of the yellowing, so a fresh coat =will preserve. Any ideas will be most welcome, GMA Sent: Thursday, December 02, 1999 11:11 PMSubject: Re: swelled butt Hi Ray, Yes I own several with the cedar inserts... most neophyte collectors =seem toattribute the cedar inserts or "cue stick look" to George Burtis, but =MANYclassic rod makers made them including HL Leonard... I'd love to =restore acouple of them that I own, but I HATE intermediates and so they sit =withvarnish as dark and thick as molasses... I've got one with the Abbey &Imbrie decal... Which brings up another question... What do you restorers use/do to remove some of the dark varnish over =thedecals without damaging the decal itself... Anyone got a few tricks up =theirsleeves??? Darrell----- Original Message -----From: "Ray Gould" Cc: "Rodmakers Listserv" Sent: Thursday, December 02, 1999 6:12 PMSubject: Re: swelled butt Hi Darrell,Yes other rod makers have made butt sections with the cedar strips =inbetween the cane strips. I have one made by Conroy, Bisset and =Mallesonandthe handle area is truly amazing.Ray----- Original Message ----- From: Darrell A. Lee Cc: Rodmakers Listserv Sent: Thursday, December 02, 1999 5:13 PMSubject: RE: swelled butt I love those swelled butt rods with the strips of cedar inserts... =I sawT&Tmade some of those too... Has anybody else made some rods with theinsertsand how? Darrell-----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Thursday, December 02, 1999 4:27 PM Cc: Rodmakers ListservSubject: Re: swelled butt CHRISTOPHER C MCDOWELL wrote: Like Darrell said, T&T isn't using planing forms to acquire thedramatically swelled butt. My forms have the 2.5" stations in =thebuttarea but this only aids in making steeper increase in the butt =oversay5",not a dramatically swelled butt right at the cork like that of =the T&Trods. That thick steel will only bend so far even with the =extrastations.The swelled butt forms would be the best way to get the =dramaticdiameterincrease near the cork, but you would have to do a lot of =planing ontheremainder of the strip. Chrismcdowellc@lanecc.edu-------------Original TextFrom: "scan.oest" , on 12/2/99 4:11 AM:Fellow listers Last night I browsed a cataloque from Thomas and Thomas, looking =attheircanerods. These guys know how to make a gorgeuos finish on a =rod. Whattheydo know, too, is how to make a SWELLED butt. In fact, it is so swelled that I cannot imagine how they make =it. Dotheyglue on extra pieces of cane, do they bent the cane with steam, =or dotheyplane away of the outer fibres just before the swelling? Knowledge of this, or Your usual wellfounded opinions are =welcome.Thistruly amazes me. regards, Carsten What about the method they used when they inserted thin strips of =cedarbetween the cane to develop a swelled butt? I always thought those =smallslivers of wood were very attractive, but have never thought about =howthey did it.Any one have any suggestions?Thanks, Jim ------=_NextPart_000_0018_01BF43CD.71C29F00 You bring up a subject I really need help = Darrell. I have 5 - really nice rods, and 3 of them have perfect wraps, = varnish on all is really checkered out. Is there any way to get the old = off, and leave the wraps original ? The easiest will be an early Cross, which has at least one = coat, of something like molasses slopped all over everything. However = 2 Edwards, and a pre-impregnated Orvis, that have a real alligator = ! I also want to preserve some original decals, and plan to = water sand the varnish over them, with 1200, or finer. I have hopes that = extra careful, will eliminate most of the yellowing, so a fresh coat = preserve. Any ideas will be most welcome, GMA ----- Original Message ----- Darrell Lee Cc: Rodmakers Listserv Sent: Thursday, December 02, = PMSubject: Re: swelled buttHi Ray,Yes I own several with the cedar = neophyte collectors seem toattribute the cedar inserts or "cue = to George Burtis, but MANYclassic rod makers made them including = Leonard... I'd love to restore acouple of them that I own, but I = intermediates and so they sit withvarnish as dark and thick as = I've got one with the Abbey &Imbrie decal... Which brings up = question...What do you restorers use/do to remove some of the = varnish over thedecals without damaging the decal itself... Anyone = few tricks up theirsleeves???Darrell----- Original = "Rodmakers Listserv" <rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= = Rodmakers Listserv <rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= = rodmakers@wugate.w= rodmakers@w= fact, it is so swelled that I cannot imagine how they make it. = of this, or Your usual wellfounded opinions are = the cane to develop a swelled butt? I always thought those = slivers of wood were very attractive, but have never thought about = ------=_NextPart_000_0018_01BF43CD.71C29F00-- from edriddle@mindspring.com Sat Dec 11 12:17:11 1999 Subject: Re: Trade or Sell Please disregard.This was originally a 12/3 post. Transaction completed via "AlternateRodmakers" while LIST was down.Ed-----Original Message----- Subject: Trade or Sell To All:Remembering our non-commercial guidelines, please respond off-list. I'd like to trade my "as-new condition" copy of "Classic & Antique FlyFishing Tackle: A Guide for Collectors and Anglers", by A.J. Campbell, foracopy of, "Fundamentals of Building a Bamboo Fly-rod", by George E. Maurer&Bernard P. Elser. Both books are listed at $50.00 ea. new.Ed from DNHayashida@aol.com Sat Dec 11 12:36:17 1999 Hey folks,If I'm not mistaken I see messages from rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduin my in box!!!! Is it back up??? Darryl from gjm80301@yahoo.com Sat Dec 11 12:56:15 1999 0000 1999 10:56:11 PST Subject: test test__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. All in one place.Yahoo! Shopping: http://shopping.yahoo.com from kjc@epix.net Sat Dec 11 13:16:32 1999 OAA14356 Subject: (no subject) I have yet to plane my first strip of cane, but am gradually picking upmaterials to build a cane rod. I have been looking at lathes. Mostappear to be fairly expensive. from what I have read thus far, it seemsthat a metal lathe would be preferable to wood if you decide to workwith metal down the road. Would anyone have any suggestions on a goodlathe that you would likely not need to replace, and could easily beupgraded as needed? Are there any decent lathes that won't cost an armand a leg? from what I can tell, some rod builders use mini-lathes, andsome prefer larger ones. Keith Clinton from mrj@aa.net Sat Dec 11 13:23:40 1999 Sat, 11 Dec 1999 11:23:28 -0800 Subject: RE: It could be just poorly written instructions. As they say, just set it on aflat surface and set it to "0". There is a glass cover over the dialpointer. This should have kind of a knurled outside edge. There is also ascrew that clamps this in place. Loosen the screw and rotate the glasscoverand you will see that the numbers rotate also. Just rotate until they read"0". -----Original Message----- Subject: Can anyone tell me how to adjust a Mitutoyu Digital Depth Gauge? When Iaskthis, I mean how do you offset it a couple of .001's to get accurate whenyou have a standard to judge from. I know mine is off .004 (too shallow areading), but I can't figure out how to adjust the zero up and down. Idon't want to go uncrewing things, and the literature just says to set the"zero" on a flat surface. Maybe I need a translator.Thanks,Bob Mauluccibob@downandacross.com from mrj@aa.net Sat Dec 11 13:23:56 1999 Sat, 11 Dec 1999 11:23:41 -0800 Subject: RE: hollow-built rods How thick do you leave the walls? -----Original Message----- FISHWOOL@aol.com RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Re: hollow-built rods To all,This is going to be heresy but-When I hollow build I do not leave anydams and I don't hollow the tips. I tape the butt and/or mid sections, slicethe tape with a razor as in gluing and open the splines up so I can planetheinner apices so that I wind up with a trapezoidal x-section with the innerflat 1/3-1/2 the width of the outer flat, depending on the size of thestick.So far I haven't had any collapsing tubes or at least no break downs due tosame.Regards,Hank. from rsgould@cmc.net Sat Dec 11 13:41:13 1999 Subject: Re: spey taper wanted Hi Gary,I have the taper of a Leonard 14ft x 3pc x 9wt Spey rod. Would that onedo?Ray----- Original Message ----- Subject: spey taper wanted i am interested in building a spey rod, in about a 7-8 weight. does anyonehave a suitable taper? tks. gl--------------------gary mischcdr, usn (ret.) from flytyr@southshore.com Sat Dec 11 14:21:25 1999 [12.10.111.38] (may be forged)) Sat, 11 Dec 1999 14:22:36 -0600 "rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu" Subject: Re: Fitting ferrules Ray,I have been using this method from your book and have fit up seven rodsthatway. It does work good and I am satisfied with the finished product. Iknow thatlathes have been used to do the fitting and that is what I an hoping to do.TillI do some playing around with cut offs, I will not attempt it on a goodblank. Iwill keep using the method you describe till I am confident that I can do itona lathe.Thanks for that reply.Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com Ray Gould wrote: Hi Tony,There's a pretty good explanation as to how to fit ferruyles onto the rodblank on page 13 of my book "Constructing Cane Rods: Secrets of theBambooFly Rod". This work does not necessarily require a lathe and can be donebyhand scraping and sanding . The critical steps include: remove a littlethe same amount too) from each corner of the hex until the ferrule willjust start to slide on; the ferrule must fit tightly onto the cane, useUrethane Bond adhesive to glue the ferrule in place; the ferrule shouldhaveto be tapped into place by gently driving it home with a wood mallet.Ray----- Original Message -----From: Tony Spezio Sent: Friday, December 03, 1999 7:57 AMSubject: Re: Fitting ferrules I guess I need to clarify the message below.I should of said " fitting ferrules to the rodblank". It came across that I wanted to fit the maleto the female. No lathe for that, will keep doingthat by hand.Thanks to all that replied off list warning meagainst using a cutting bit to" fit the ferrules"Am still open to replies fitting the ferrule to theblank now that I have clarified the question.Thanks,Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com Tony Spezio wrote: I have finally gotten a "Real" lathe and want tofit ferrules using the lathe. I would like someinput as to speeds, type of tool bit and anyprecautions to take other than safety.Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com from landeens@home.com Sat Dec 11 14:26:23 1999 with SMTP ;Sat, 11 Dec 1999 12:26:19 -0800 Subject: Re: 7' 2wt boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0074_01BF43D2.8F50E5E0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0074_01BF43D2.8F50E5E0 The Paul Young Driggs is a great 4wt 7ft 2in rod. I have built 4 and =people have really liked them. The taper is in the taper archives on =RodMakers. Sent: Saturday, December 04, 1999 4:44 AMSubject: 7' 2wt I have someone who is interested in a 7' 2wt rod. Any sugestions on a =taper?ThanksTim ------=_NextPart_000_0074_01BF43D2.8F50E5E0 The Paul Young Driggs is a great 4wt 7ft 2in rod. I = 4 and people have really liked them. The taper is in the taper archives = RodMakers. ----- Original Message ----- Watson's Sent: Saturday, December 04, = AMSubject: 7' 2wt I have someone who is interested in a 7' 2wt = sugestions on a taper?ThanksTim ------=_NextPart_000_0074_01BF43D2.8F50E5E0-- from rsgould@cmc.net Sat Dec 11 15:10:18 1999 Subject: Listless boundary="----=_NextPart_000_00E5_01BF43D9.0BF60520" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_00E5_01BF43D9.0BF60520 Hi to all,Now that the list is back up and running again I can tell you of an =observation discussed with Dr. David Smith also a subscriber. It seems =that many are suffering from a new syndrome called "listlessness". Now =mind you that this may be caused by a virus stealthily placed by email =or otherwise subtlety positioned in rodmakers subconsciousness. There =seems to be no known cure but I'm sure that with enough effort placed =through research channels it may be possible to develop a vaccine. In =the meantime try to stay calm!Ray ------=_NextPart_000_00E5_01BF43D9.0BF60520 Hi to all,Now that the list is back up and = also a subscriber. It seems that many are suffering from a new syndrome = "listlessness". Now mind you that this may be caused by a virus = placed by email or otherwise subtlety positioned in rodmakers = There seems to be no known cure but I'm sure that with enough effort = through research channels it may be possible to develop a vaccine. In = meantime try to stay calm!Ray ------=_NextPart_000_00E5_01BF43D9.0BF60520-- from jczimny@dol.net Sat Dec 11 15:28:58 1999 Subject: Re: lathes If the bearings are OK, then it is an excellent buy.John Z FlyfishT@aol.com wrote: Hi, all. I have a question. I am interested in a 9" South Bend lathe. It's ahorizontal drive bench lathe, 24" centers. I was wondering if this lathewilldo all the rod work needed, making ferrules, reel seats, etc. The spindlehole, he believes, is less than an inch, like 15/16th. Does the nickelsilvercome in small enough diameters to do all this work? It's a half-horsepowermotor. I have no knowledge about lathes, so any help would be appreciated. HE isasking $750. Is this a good deal or not? Thanks in advance. Tom from nobler@satx.rr.com Sat Dec 11 15:29:34 1999 SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.197.19);Sat, 11 Dec 1999 15:29:45 -0600 Subject: Re: Para 15 thread color boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0021_01BF43EC.90B6B8A0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0021_01BF43EC.90B6B8A0 I hope to take photos of one shortly. A friend of mine has one, I just =have to go 40 miles, to get the shots. I'll post to anyone interested, =via attachment when I have them down loaded. GMA Sent: Friday, December 03, 1999 12:50 PMSubject: Para 15 thread color Does anyone have an original or know which thread colors and tipping = used on the Young Para 15 rods? Thanks. Chrismcdowellc@lanecc.edu ------=_NextPart_000_0021_01BF43EC.90B6B8A0 I hope to take photos of one shortly. A = has one, I just have to go 40 miles, to get the shots. I'll post to = interested, via attachment when I have them down =loaded. GMA ----- Original Message ----- MCDOWELL = Sent: Friday, December 03, 1999= PMSubject: Para 15 thread =colorDoes anyone have an original or know which thread = Thanks.Chrismcdowellc@lanecc.edu ------=_NextPart_000_0021_01BF43EC.90B6B8A0-- from nobler@satx.rr.com Sat Dec 11 15:44:18 1999 SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.197.19);Sat, 11 Dec 1999 15:44:33 -0600 Subject: Re: Mitutoyo Digital Depth Gauge boundary="----=_NextPart_000_007B_01BF43EE.A1F61640" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_007B_01BF43EE.A1F61640 It looks like the list is back up. If any of you did not receive the =message. There have been major problems with the university's computer.=It looks like the first messages in several days are staring to come =through. I had 93 show up this afternoon ! GMA Sent: Sunday, December 05, 1999 9:25 AMSubject: Mitutoyo Digital Depth Gauge Can anyone tell me how to adjust a Mitutoyu Digital Depth Gauge? When = this, I mean how do you offset it a couple of .001's to get accurate = you have a standard to judge from. I know mine is off .004 (too = reading), but I can't figure out how to adjust the zero up and down. I = don't want to go uncrewing things, and the literature just says to set = "zero" on a flat surface. Maybe I need a translator.Thanks,Bob Maulucci==3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D==3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= downandacross.com productionshttp://www.downandacross.com218 Wallace AvenueBuffalo, NY 14216716-836-8297 home716-867-0523 cellularbob@downandacross.com ------=_NextPart_000_007B_01BF43EE.A1F61640 It looks like the list is back up. If any of = not receive the message. There have been major problems with the = computer. It looks like the first messages in several days are staring = through. I had 93 show up this afternoon ! GMA ----- Original Message ----- maulucci = Sent: Sunday, December 05, 1999= AMSubject: Mitutoyo Digital Depth = GaugeCan anyone tell me how to adjust a Mitutoyu Digital = Gauge? When I ask this, I mean how do you offset it a couple of = get accurate when you have a standard to judge from. I know mine = .004 (too shallow a reading), but I can't figure out how to adjust = zero up and down. I don't want to go uncrewing things, and the = =Maulucci=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D==3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= Wallace AvenueBuffalo, NY 14216716-836-8297 = cellularbob@downandacross.com ------=_NextPart_000_007B_01BF43EE.A1F61640-- from nobler@satx.rr.com Sat Dec 11 15:53:20 1999 SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.197.19);Sat, 11 Dec 1999 15:53:35 -0600 Subject: Re: Fixer-upper metal lathe for sale in Pennsylvania boundary="----=_NextPart_000_00CD_01BF43EF.E4D3E540" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_00CD_01BF43EF.E4D3E540 I don't think I'd be interested in a south Bend THAT old ! GMA Sent: Tuesday, December 07, 1999 3:20 PMSubject: Fixer-upper metal lathe for sale in Pennsylvania There is an old South Bend lathe on ebay which islocatd in Scranton, PA which the seller will not ship.If you are in the area, this might go cheap. Itlooks old and rough, but looks well-equipped. Shouldgo cheap, but there is a reserve, so maybe the ownerhas an inflated view of the value. Just happened to see this, no personal interest. http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3D212811073 That's item 212811073__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. All in one place.Yahoo! Shopping: http://shopping.yahoo.com ------=_NextPart_000_00CD_01BF43EF.E4D3E540 I don't think I'd be interested in a south = old ! GMA ----- Original Message ----- Jerry = = Sent: Tuesday, December 07, = PMSubject: Fixer-upper metal = in PennsylvaniaThere is an old South Bend lathe on ebay which = ownerhas an inflated view of the value.Just happened to = no personal interest.http://cgi.ebay.com/aw- cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3D21281= item =212811073__________________________________________________Do = place.Yahoo! Shopping: http://shopping.yahoo.com ------=_NextPart_000_00CD_01BF43EF.E4D3E540-- from nobler@satx.rr.com Sat Dec 11 16:13:39 1999 SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.197.19);Sat, 11 Dec 1999 16:05:23 -0600 Subject: Re: Morgan Hand mill boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0272_01BF43F2.B9F8CC20" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0272_01BF43F2.B9F8CC20 Speaking of the Morgan, what sort of planning form is required with this =tool ? GMA Sent: Monday, December 06, 1999 9:03 PMSubject: Morgan Hand mill Hi Darryl;I have been contemplating a MHM and I was wondering if you would mindanswering a few questions about yours. First of all, do you feel it =wasworth the cost and does it save you a lot of time? I'm just a working =stiffand 2 grand is a real big outlay for me, I would have to use a credit =cardand be fairly well assured that I could get a lot more done with it. Ithink that if i can get the rods made that I (or at least the fly shophere)can get them sold and I can make the payments on the mill, but I =wouldlike to think that I can pay it off fairly quickly. Also, can it do =swelledbutts? I most of my rods with a swelled butt these days and like the =actionof that kind of rod. Thanks a lot for any info you care to pass on to =me.John ------=_NextPart_000_0272_01BF43F2.B9F8CC20 Speaking of the Morgan, what sort of = required with this tool ? GMA ----- Original Message ----- channer = Sent: Monday, December 06, 1999= PMSubject: Morgan Hand millHi Darryl;I have been contemplating a MHM and I was= wondering if you would mindanswering a few questions about yours.= all, do you feel it wasworth the cost and does it save you a lot = I'm just a working stiffand 2 grand is a real big outlay for me, I = have to use a credit cardand be fairly well assured that I could = more done with it. Ithink that if i can get the rods made that I = least the fly shophere)can get them sold and I can make the = the mill, but I wouldlike to think that I can pay it off fairly = Also, can it do swelledbutts? I most of my rods with a swelled = days and like the actionof that kind of rod. Thanks a lot for any = care to pass on to me.John ------=_NextPart_000_0272_01BF43F2.B9F8CC20-- from stpete@netten.net Sat Dec 11 17:09:24 1999 Subject: Garrison Book No Financial Interest, etc., etc. Garrison's book is on auction at the Virtual Flyshophttp://www.flyshop.com/marketplace/ There is a reserve, so I don't know if it will be a good deal or not.Only thought that I would mention it. Rick C. from maxs@geocities.co.jp Sat Dec 11 17:30:10 1999 bysv01.geocities.co.jp (8.9.3+3.2W/3.7W) with ESMTP id IAA15130; Sun, 12Dec 1999 08:30:04+0900 (JST) mail.geocities.co.jp(1.3G-GeocitiesJ-3.3) with SMTP id IAA07740; Sun, 12 Dec 1999 08:30:02+0900 (JST) Subject: RE: (how to adjust Mitsutoyo Dial Depth Gauge) Can anyone tell me how to adjust a Mitutoyu Digital Depth Gauge? When Iaskthis, I mean how do you offset it a couple of .001's to get accurate whenyou have a standard to judge from. I know mine is off .004 (too shallow areading), but I can't figure out how to adjust the zero up and down. Idon't want to go uncrewing things, and the literature just says to set the"zero" on a flat surface. Maybe I need a translator.Thanks,Bob Mauluccibob@downandacross.com Bob, I hope this would help. If your question is how to move the pointer of reading up and down,it may be adjusted by turning outer rim of dial clockwise or counterclockwise. When you already know above and hate to do it always, and want to changetheposition of zero ofthe display, unscrew the bolt attached for tightening the base with a rodof the depth gauge andmove the base position up and down for adjustment. Mitsutoyo 7224 type, which I have, required an additionalrod joint to stretch the rod about 10mm to fit with its base length(height). When your question is referring to "how to get a standard zero", it is alittlemore complicated. To my experience, the top of the 60 deg. point would be rounded veryeasilywhilesetting the gauge to zero on the flat and hard surface like on Planing Form.The gap created by this will offset zero setting some 0.00x inches deeperthan thestandard zero. As a result, you may be setting the Planing Form deeperthanstandard value. I made a gauge, called a Baby Sitter, a very simple tool by using lathe.Prepare a flat (on both surface) and round metal (brass in my case) plate.Thickness will do for 0.4 inches.Set it on the scrolling chuck of the lathe and hole it by using "CenterDrill" of the lathe to the required depth1(1/8 inches for instance). Center Drill has 60 degree brade with straight bit at its top.You can make a 60 degree V hole at the center of the metal plate withrequired depth now.Let's make a V hole the depth of which is standard 1/8 inches.You must remember that this Baby Sitter always has1/8 inches depth and you can set the dial reading of depth gauge to 1/8inches when you set need zero setting of the depth gauge. If the depth of the center hole is correct 1/8 inches, it means that youhave already set standard zero gauge. To get a correct depth of the V hole, measure the hole by your depth gaugewhile your 60 deg. point is quite new and after you do zero setting of thedepth gauge on the very flat surface only once at the beginning beforemeasureing the V hole. Max Max Satoh,an oriental Bamboo Fly Rod Makeremail: maxs@geocities.co.jpHome Page:$B%P%s%V! from rcurry@ttlc.net Sat Dec 11 17:41:22 1999 (SMTPD32-5.05) id A258C71C010E; Sat, 11 Dec 1999 18:46:32 -0500 Subject: Re: swelled butt boundary="------------A13F6DF0FAACCA46D0ECD9A1" --------------A13F6DF0FAACCA46D0ECD9A1 Geo.,If the varnish is dry and brittle, the side of a putty knife held at90 degrees will scrape the varnish off. Flakes will be flying. However,sometimes it doesn't scrape well or you want to keep the originalvarnish. In this case I use a mixture we used to use on furniture. Mix 1part turps, 1 Part acetone, and 1 part methyl hydrate (ethynol would bebetter, but you probably drank the last of that). Soak a rag in this andsaturate the rod (stand the rod section upright over the pan of mix, andjust keep wiping gently). Use this in a wel ventilated place. Rubbinggently will start to work the finish off. Sometimes you can take justone coat off and the rod looks great, no revarnishing necessary.Increase acetone or MH for greater cut, increase turps to allowlonger wet time.Again, I have used this approach on many old rods and didn't losethe wraps, but no guarantees. Be sure not to let the cane itselfsaturated with the MH, you'll know when you hit cane.Best regards,Reed nobler wrote: You bring up a subject I really need help with Darrell. I have 5 -really nice rods, and 3 of them have perfect wraps, but the varnish onall is really checkered out. Is there any way to get the old varnishoff, and leave the wraps original ? The easiest will be an earlyCross, which has at least one extra coat, of something like molassesslopped all over everything. However there are 2 Edwards, and apre-impregnated Orvis, that have a real alligator finish ! I also wantto preserve some original decals, and plan to try to water sand thevarnish over them, with 1200, or finer. I have hopes that being extracareful, will eliminate most of the yellowing, so a fresh coat willpreserve. Any ideas will be most welcome, GMA ----- Original Message -----From: Darrell Lee mcdowellc@lanecc.eduCc: Rodmakers ListservSent: Thursday, December 02, 1999 11:11 PMSubject: Re: swelled buttHi Ray, Yes I own several with the cedar inserts... most neophytecollectors seem toattribute the cedar inserts or "cue stick look" to GeorgeBurtis, but MANYclassic rod makers made them including HL Leonard... I'dlove to restore acouple of them that I own, but I HATE intermediates and sothey sit withvarnish as dark and thick as molasses... I've got one withthe Abbey &Imbrie decal... Which brings up another question... What do you restorers use/do to remove some of the darkvarnish over thedecals without damaging the decal itself... Anyone got a fewtricks up theirsleeves??? Darrell----- Original Message -----From: "Ray Gould" Cc: "Rodmakers Listserv" Sent: Thursday, December 02, 1999 6:12 PMSubject: Re: swelled butt Hi Darrell,Yes other rod makers have made butt sections with thecedar strips inbetween the cane strips. I have one made by Conroy, Bissetand Mallesonandthe handle area is truly amazing.Ray----- Original Message ----- From: Darrell A. Lee Cc: Rodmakers Listserv Sent: Thursday, December 02, 1999 5:13 PMSubject: RE: swelled butt I love those swelled butt rods with the strips of cedarinserts... I sawT&Tmade some of those too... Has anybody else made somerods with theinsertsand how? Darrell-----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu JIM GENTZSent: Thursday, December 02, 1999 4:27 PM Cc: Rodmakers ListservSubject: Re: swelled butt CHRISTOPHER C MCDOWELL wrote: Like Darrell said, T&T isn't using planing forms toacquire thedramatically swelled butt. My forms have the 2.5"stations in thebuttarea but this only aids in making steeper increase inthe butt oversay5",not a dramatically swelled butt right at the cork likethat of the T&Trods. That thick steel will only bend so far evenwith the extrastations.The swelled butt forms would be the best way to getthe dramaticdiameterincrease near the cork, but you would have to do a lotof planing ontheremainder of the strip. Chrismcdowellc@lanecc.edu-------------Original TextFrom: "scan.oest" , on 12/2/994:11 AM:Fellow listers Last night I browsed a cataloque from Thomas andThomas, looking attheircanerods. These guys know how to make a gorgeuosfinish on a rod. Whattheydo know, too, is how to make a SWELLED butt. In fact, it is so swelled that I cannot imagine howthey make it. Dotheyglue on extra pieces of cane, do they bent the canewith steam, or dotheyplane away of the outer fibres just before theswelling? Knowledge of this, or Your usual wellfounded opinionsare welcome.Thistruly amazes me. regards, Carsten What about the method they used when they inserted thinstrips of cedarbetween the cane to develop a swelled butt? I alwaysthought those smallslivers of wood were very attractive, but have neverthought about howthey did it.Any one have any suggestions?Thanks, Jim --------------A13F6DF0FAACCA46D0ECD9A1 Geo., putty knife held at 90 degrees will scrape the varnish off. Flakes willbe flying. However, sometimes it doesn't scrape well or you want to keepthe original varnish. In this case I use a mixture we used to use onfurniture.Mix 1 part turps, 1 Part acetone, and 1 part methyl hydrate (ethynol wouldbe better, but you probably drank the last of that). Soak a rag in thisand saturate the rod (stand the rod section upright over the pan of mix,and just keep wiping gently). Use this in a wel ventilated place. Rubbinggently will start to work the finish off. Sometimes you can take just onecoat off and the rod looks great, no revarnishing necessary. turps to allow longer wet time. and didn't lose the wraps, but no guarantees. Be sure not to let the caneitself saturated with the MH, you'll know when you hit cane.Best regards,Reednobler wrote: You bring up a subjectI really need help with Darrell. I have 5 - really nice rods, and 3 ofthem have perfect wraps, but the varnish on all is really checkered out.Is there any way to get the old varnish off, and leave the wraps original leastone extra coat, of something like molasses slopped all over everything.However there are 2 Edwards, and a pre-impregnated Orvis, that have areal decals,and plan to try to water sand the varnish over them, with 1200, or finer.I have hopes that being extra careful, will eliminate most of theyellowing, ----- Original Message ----- From:DarrellLee ; jimgentz@earthlink.net; mcdowellc@lanecc.edu Cc: RodmakersListserv Sent: Thursday, December 02, 199911:11 PM Subject: Re: swelled butt Yes I own several with the cedar inserts... most neophyte collectorsseem toattribute the cedar inserts or "cue stick look" to George Burtis, butMANYclassic rod makers made them including HL Leonard... I'd love torestoreacouple of them that I own, but I HATE intermediates and so they sitwithvarnish as dark and thick as molasses... I've got one with the Abbey&Imbrie decal... Which brings up another question...What do you restorers use/do to remove some of the dark varnish overthedecals without damaging the decal itself... Anyone got a few tricksup theirsleeves???Darrell----- Original Message -----From: "Ray Gould" <rsgould@cmc.net> <jimgentz@earthlink.net>;<mcdowellc@lanecc.edu>Cc: "Rodmakers Listserv" <rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu>Sent: Thursday, December 02, 1999 6:12 PMSubject: Re: swelled butt Hi Darrell,Yes other rod makers have made butt sections with the cedar stripsinbetween the cane strips. I have one made by Conroy, Bisset andMallesonandthe handle area is truly amazing.Ray----- Original Message ----- From: Darrell A. Lee <darrell@rockclimbing.org> <mcdowellc@lanecc.edu>Cc: Rodmakers Listserv <rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu>Sent: Thursday, December 02, 1999 5:13 PMSubject: RE: swelled butt I love those swelled butt rods with the strips of cedar inserts...I sawT&Tmade some of those too... Has anybody else made some rods withtheinsertsand how? Darrell-----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu[ Behalf Of JIM GENTZSent: Thursday, December 02, 1999 4:27 PM Cc: Rodmakers ListservSubject: Re: swelled butt CHRISTOPHER C MCDOWELL wrote: acquire the in thebuttarea but this only aids in making steeper increase in the buttoversay5",not a dramatically swelled butt right at the cork like that ofthe T&T the extrastations. dramaticdiameterincrease near the cork, but you would have to do a lot of planingontheremainder of the strip. Chrismcdowellc@lanecc.edu-------------Original TextFrom: "scan.oest" <scan.oest@post.tele.dk>,on 12/2/99 4:11 AM:Fellow listers Last night I browsed a cataloque from Thomas and Thomas,lookingattheircanerods. These guys know how to make a gorgeuos finish on arod. Whattheydo know, too, is how to make a SWELLED butt. In fact, it is so swelled that I cannot imagine how they makeit. Dotheyglue on extra pieces of cane, do they bent the cane with steam,or dotheyplane away of the outer fibres just before the swelling? Knowledge of this, or Your usual wellfounded opinions arewelcome.Thistruly amazes me. regards, Carsten What about the method they used when they inserted thin stripsof cedarbetween the cane to develop a swelled butt? I always thoughtthosesmallslivers of wood were very attractive, but have never thought abouthowthey did it.Any one have any suggestions?Thanks, Jim --------------A13F6DF0FAACCA46D0ECD9A1-- from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Sat Dec 11 17:51:52 1999 Sat, 11 Dec 1999 15:51:44 -0800 Subject: Re: Planes Hey Art,I was in the local Lowe's Home Center today, and saw bunches ofthem for$29.95. That's not much cheaper, but $3 is $3. Harry Art Port wrote: Newbies,I just got a flyer from a "Phillips Bros.' Supply (Construction andIndustrial Supplies) in Buffalo, NY and they're advertising Stanley SP12-920's for $32.95. I think that's about as cheap as you'll find them.I must admit I've NEVER done business with these guys and theshippingcosts sre extra and not stated but I thought I'd let all know. They have asite at www.phillipsbros.com and you can call them at 1-800-888-7271.Hope it pans out for someone.Art *Some people can tell what time it is by looking at the sun,but I never have been able to make out the numbers.* from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Sat Dec 11 18:10:26 1999 Subject: Re: swelled butt boundary="------------CFFB3B7035CFB6457CCD51AE" --------------CFFB3B7035CFB6457CCD51AE George,On top of Reed's suggestion, you might want to pick up a copy ofMichael Sinclair's "Bamboo Rod Restoration Handbook", as well as StuartKirkfield's book. Between the two you might be able to identify thosemystery rods. Harry reed curry wrote: Geo.,If the varnish is dry and brittle, the side of a putty knife heldat 90 degrees will scrape the varnish off. Flakes will be flying.However, sometimes it doesn't scrape well or you want to keep theoriginal varnish. In this case I use a mixture we used to use onfurniture. Mix 1 part turps, 1 Part acetone, and 1 part methyl hydrate(ethynol would be better, but you probably drank the last of that).Soak a rag in this and saturate the rod (stand the rod section uprightover the pan of mix, and just keep wiping gently). Use this in a welventilated place. Rubbing gently will start to work the finish off.Sometimes you can take just one coat off and the rod looks great, norevarnishing necessary.Increase acetone or MH for greater cut, increase turps to allowlonger wet time.Again, I have used this approach on many old rods and didn't losethe wraps, but no guarantees. Be sure not to let the cane itselfsaturated with the MH, you'll know when you hit cane.Best regards,Reed nobler wrote: You bring up a subject I really need help with Darrell. I have 5 -really nice rods, and 3 of them have perfect wraps, but the varnishon all is really checkered out. Is there any way to get the oldvarnish off, and leave the wraps original ? The easiest will be anearly Cross, which has at least one extra coat, of something likemolasses slopped all over everything. However there are 2 Edwards,and a pre-impregnated Orvis, that have a real alligator finish ! Ialso want to preserve some original decals, and plan to try to watersand the varnish over them, with 1200, or finer. I have hopes thatbeing extra careful, will eliminate most of the yellowing, so afresh coat will preserve. Any ideas will be most welcome, GMA ----- Original Message -----From:Darrell Lee mcdowellc@lanecc.eduCc: Rodmakers ListservSent: Thursday, December 02, 1999 11:11 PMSubject: Re: swelled buttHi Ray, Yes I own several with the cedar inserts... most neophytecollectors seem toattribute the cedar inserts or "cue stick look" to GeorgeBurtis, but MANYclassic rod makers made them including HL Leonard... I'dlove to restore acouple of them that I own, but I HATE intermediates and sothey sit withvarnish as dark and thick as molasses... I've got one withthe Abbey &Imbrie decal... Which brings up another question... What do you restorers use/do to remove some of the darkvarnish over thedecals without damaging the decal itself... Anyone got afew tricks up theirsleeves??? Darrell----- Original Message -----From: "Ray Gould" Cc: "Rodmakers Listserv" Sent: Thursday, December 02, 1999 6:12 PMSubject: Re: swelled butt Hi Darrell,Yes other rod makers have made butt sections with thecedar strips inbetween the cane strips. I have one made by Conroy,Bisset and Mallesonandthe handle area is truly amazing.Ray----- Original Message ----- From: Darrell A. Lee Cc: Rodmakers Listserv Sent: Thursday, December 02, 1999 5:13 PMSubject: RE: swelled butt I love those swelled butt rods with the strips ofcedar inserts... I sawT&Tmade some of those too... Has anybody else made somerods with theinsertsand how? Darrell-----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu JIM GENTZSent: Thursday, December 02, 1999 4:27 PM Cc: Rodmakers ListservSubject: Re: swelled butt CHRISTOPHER C MCDOWELL wrote: Like Darrell said, T&T isn't using planing forms toacquire thedramatically swelled butt. My forms have the 2.5"stations in thebuttarea but this only aids in making steeper increasein the butt oversay5",not a dramatically swelled butt right at the corklike that of the T&Trods. That thick steel will only bend so far evenwith the extrastations.The swelled butt forms would be the best way to getthe dramaticdiameterincrease near the cork, but you would have to do alot of planing ontheremainder of the strip. Chrismcdowellc@lanecc.edu-------------Original TextFrom: "scan.oest" , on12/2/99 4:11 AM:Fellow listers Last night I browsed a cataloque from Thomas andThomas, looking attheircanerods. These guys know how to make a gorgeuosfinish on a rod. Whattheydo know, too, is how to make a SWELLED butt. In fact, it is so swelled that I cannot imagine howthey make it. Dotheyglue on extra pieces of cane, do they bent the canewith steam, or dotheyplane away of the outer fibres just before theswelling? Knowledge of this, or Your usual wellfoundedopinions are welcome.Thistruly amazes me. regards, Carsten What about the method they used when they insertedthin strips of cedarbetween the cane to develop a swelled butt? I alwaysthought those smallslivers of wood were very attractive, but have never>> thoughtabout howthey did it.Any one have any suggestions?Thanks, Jim --------------CFFB3B7035CFB6457CCD51AE George, pickup a copy of Michael Sinclair's "Bamboo Rod Restoration Handbook", as well reed curry wrote:Geo., putty knife held at 90 degrees will scrape the varnish off. Flakes willbe flying. However, sometimes it doesn't scrape well or you want to keepthe original varnish. In this case I use a mixture we used to use onfurniture.Mix 1 part turps, 1 Part acetone, and 1 part methyl hydrate (ethynol wouldbe better, but you probably drank the last of that). Soak a rag in thisand saturate the rod (stand the rod section upright over the pan of mix,and just keep wiping gently). Use this in a wel ventilated place. Rubbinggently will start to work the finish off. Sometimes you can take just onecoat off and the rod looks great, no revarnishing necessary. turps to allow longer wet time. and didn't lose the wraps, but no guarantees. Be sure not to let the caneitself saturated with the MH, you'll know when you hit cane.Best regards,Reednobler wrote: You bring up a subjectI really need help with Darrell. I have 5 - really nice rods, and 3 ofthem have perfect wraps, but the varnish on all is really checkered out.Is there any way to get the old varnish off, and leave the wraps original? The easiest will be an early Cross, which has at leastone extra coat, of something like molasses slopped all over everything.However there are 2 Edwards, and a pre-impregnated Orvis, that have arealalligator finish ! I also want to preserve some original decals,and plan to try to water sand the varnish over them, with 1200, or finer.I have hopes that being extra careful, will eliminate most of theyellowing,so a fresh coat will preserve. Any ideas will be most welcome,GMA ----- Original Message ----- From:DarrellLee ; jimgentz@earthlink.net; mcdowellc@lanecc.edu Cc: RodmakersListserv Sent: Thursday, December 02, 199911:11 PM Subject: Re: swelled butt Yes I own several with the cedar inserts... most neophyte collectorsseem toattribute the cedar inserts or "cue stick look" to George Burtis, butMANYclassic rod makers made them including HL Leonard... I'd love torestoreacouple of them that I own, but I HATE intermediates and so they sitwithvarnish as dark and thick as molasses... I've got one with the Abbey&Imbrie decal... Which brings up another question...What do you restorers use/do to remove some of the dark varnish overthedecals without damaging the decal itself... Anyone got a few tricksup theirsleeves???Darrell----- Original Message -----From: "Ray Gould" <rsgould@cmc.net> <jimgentz@earthlink.net>;<mcdowellc@lanecc.edu>Cc: "Rodmakers Listserv" <rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu>Sent: Thursday, December 02, 1999 6:12 PMSubject: Re: swelled butt Hi Darrell,Yes other rod makers have made butt sections with the cedar stripsinbetween the cane strips. I have one made by Conroy, Bisset andMallesonandthe handle area is truly amazing.Ray----- Original Message ----- From: Darrell A. Lee <darrell@rockclimbing.org> <mcdowellc@lanecc.edu>Cc: Rodmakers Listserv <rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu>Sent: Thursday, December 02, 1999 5:13 PMSubject: RE: swelled butt I love those swelled butt rods with the strips of cedar inserts...I sawT&Tmade some of those too... Has anybody else made some rods withtheinsertsand how? Darrell-----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu[ Behalf Of JIM GENTZSent: Thursday, December 02, 1999 4:27 PM Cc: Rodmakers ListservSubject: Re: swelled butt CHRISTOPHER C MCDOWELL wrote: acquire the in thebuttarea but this only aids in making steeper increase in the buttoversay5",not a dramatically swelled butt right at the cork like that ofthe T&T the extrastations. dramaticdiameterincrease near the cork, but you would have to do a lot of planingontheremainder of the strip. Chrismcdowellc@lanecc.edu-------------Original TextFrom: "scan.oest" <scan.oest@post.tele.dk>,on 12/2/99 4:11 AM:Fellow listers Last night I browsed a cataloque from Thomas and Thomas,lookingattheircanerods. These guys know how to make a gorgeuos finish on arod. Whattheydo know, too, is how to make a SWELLED butt. In fact, it is so swelled that I cannot imagine how they makeit. Dotheyglue on extra pieces of cane, do they bent the cane with steam,or dotheyplane away of the outer fibres just before the swelling? Knowledge of this, or Your usual wellfounded opinions arewelcome.Thistruly amazes me. regards, Carsten What about the method they used when they inserted thin stripsof cedarbetween the cane to develop a swelled butt? I always thoughtthosesmallslivers of wood were very attractive, but have never thought abouthowthey did it.Any one have any suggestions?Thanks, Jim --------------CFFB3B7035CFB6457CCD51AE-- from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Sat Dec 11 18:16:10 1999 Sat, 11 Dec 1999 16:16:03 -0800 Subject: Re: Bamboo Fly Rod Magazine Rodmaker List Darryl,Seems to some folks that Mark spends a lot of time doing thingsotherthan publishing a magazine. I defend Mark every chance I get, but I have toadmit that no magazines for nearly a year does shake my confidence, andI'm afairly patient and understanding sort of fellow. So Mark, if you're reading this, are we ever going to get any moremagazines, or can we start referring to you as "former Editor of the nolongerpublished 'The Bamboo Fly Rod'" magazine? DNHayashida@aol.com wrote: From: DNHayashida@aol.com Mark Metcalf, the editor of "Bamboo Fly Rod Magazine" has starteda Onelist Rodmaker list. --->>>> Snipped by Harry Boyd from darrell@rockclimbing.org Sat Dec 11 18:43:57 1999 sims.3.5.1999.09.16.21.57.p8)with SMTP id for Subject: RE: Kirkfield's & Krieder books... Merry Christmas boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0052_01BF43F6.DACAC1C0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0052_01BF43F6.DACAC1C0 These books are on ebay starting at $10 each without reserve... Here'swhere to find them... http://cgi3.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewListedItems&userid=darrell9 Seems everyone's in the book mood... Darrell-----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Sent: Saturday, December 11, 1999 4:10 PM Subject: Re: swelled butt George,On top of Reed's suggestion, you might want to pick up a copy ofMichael Sinclair's "Bamboo Rod Restoration Handbook", as well as StuartKirkfield's book. Between the two you might be able to identify thosemystery rods.Harry reed curry wrote: Geo.,If the varnish is dry and brittle, the side of a putty knife held at90 degrees will scrape the varnish off. Flakes will be flying. However,sometimes it doesn't scrape well or you want to keep the original varnish.In this case I use a mixture we used to use on furniture. Mix 1 part turps,1 Part acetone, and 1 part methyl hydrate (ethynol would be better, butyouprobably drank the last of that). Soak a rag in this and saturate the rod(stand the rod section upright over the pan of mix, and just keep wipinggently). Use this in a wel ventilated place. Rubbing gently will start towork the finish off. Sometimes you can take just one coat off and the rodlooks great, no revarnishing necessary.Increase acetone or MH for greater cut, increase turps to allowlonger wet time.Again, I have used this approach on many old rods and didn't losethe wraps, but no guarantees. Be sure not to let the cane itself saturatedwith the MH, you'll know when you hit cane.Best regards,Reednobler wrote: You bring up a subject I really need help with Darrell. I have 5 -really nice rods, and 3 of them have perfect wraps, but the varnish on allis really checkered out. Is there any way to get the old varnish off, andleave the wraps original ? The easiest will be an early Cross, which has atleast one extra coat, of something like molasses slopped all overeverything. However there are 2 Edwards, and a pre-impregnated Orvis,thathave a real alligator finish ! I also want to preserve some original decals,and plan to try to water sand the varnish over them, with 1200, or finer. Ihave hopes that being extra careful, will eliminate most of the yellowing,so a fresh coat will preserve. Any ideas will be most welcome, GMA----- Original Message ----- From:Darrell Lee mcdowellc@lanecc.eduCc: Rodmakers ListservSent: Thursday, December 02, 1999 11:11 PMSubject: Re: swelled buttHi Ray,Yes I own several with the cedar inserts... most neophyte collectorsseem toattribute the cedar inserts or "cue stick look" to George Burtis,but MANYclassic rod makers made them including HL Leonard... I'd love torestore acouple of them that I own, but I HATE intermediates and so they sitwithvarnish as dark and thick as molasses... I've got one with the Abbey&Imbrie decal... Which brings up another question... What do you restorers use/do to remove some of the dark varnishoverthedecals without damaging the decal itself... Anyone got a few tricksup theirsleeves??? Darrell----- Original Message -----From: "Ray Gould" Cc: "Rodmakers Listserv" Sent: Thursday, December 02, 1999 6:12 PMSubject: Re: swelled butt Hi Darrell,Yes other rod makers have made butt sections with the cedar stripsinbetween the cane strips. I have one made by Conroy, Bisset andMallesonandthe handle area is truly amazing.Ray----- Original Message ----- From: Darrell A. Lee Cc: Rodmakers Listserv Sent: Thursday, December 02, 1999 5:13 PMSubject: RE: swelled butt I love those swelled butt rods with the strips of cedarinserts... I sawT&Tmade some of those too... Has anybody else made some rods withtheinsertsand how? Darrell-----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu GENTZSent: Thursday, December 02, 1999 4:27 PM Cc: Rodmakers ListservSubject: Re: swelled butt CHRISTOPHER C MCDOWELL wrote: Like Darrell said, T&T isn't using planing forms to acquirethedramatically swelled butt. My forms have the 2.5" stations inthebuttarea but this only aids in making steeper increase in the buttoversay5",not a dramatically swelled butt right at the cork like that ofthe T&Trods. That thick steel will only bend so far even with theextrastations.The swelled butt forms would be the best way to get thedramaticdiameterincrease near the cork, but you would have to do a lot ofplaning ontheremainder of the strip. Chrismcdowellc@lanecc.edu-------------Original TextFrom: "scan.oest" , on 12/2/99 4:11AM:Fellow listers Last night I browsed a cataloque from Thomas and Thomas,looking attheircanerods. These guys know how to make a gorgeuos finish on arod. Whattheydo know, too, is how to make a SWELLED butt. In fact, it is so swelled that I cannot imagine how they makeit. Dotheyglue on extra pieces of cane, do they bent the cane withsteam, or dotheyplane away of the outer fibres just before the swelling? Knowledge of this, or Your usual wellfounded opinions arewelcome.Thistruly amazes me. regards, Carsten What about the method they used when they inserted thin stripsof cedarbetween the cane to develop a swelled butt? I always thoughtthose smallslivers of wood were very attractive, but have never thoughtabout howthey did it.Any one have any suggestions?Thanks, Jim ------=_NextPart_000_0052_01BF43F6.DACAC1C0 find them... http://cgi3.ebay.com/aw- cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewListedItems=&userid=3Ddarrell9 everyone's in the book mood... Darrell BoydSent: Saturday, December 11, 1999 4:10 suggestion, you might want to pick up a copy of Michael Sinclair's = = and brittle, the side of a putty knife held at 90 degrees will = varnish off. Flakes will be flying. However, sometimes it doesn't = well or you want to keep the original varnish. In this case I use a = we used to use on furniture. Mix 1 part turps, 1 Part acetone, and 1 = methyl hydrate (ethynol would be better, but you probably drank the = that). Soak a rag in this and saturate the rod (stand the rod = upright over the pan of mix, and just keep wiping gently). Use this = Sometimes you can take just one coat off and the rod looks great, no = greater cut, increase turps to allow longer wet time. = Again, I have used this approach on many old rods and didn't lose = but no guarantees. Be sure not to let the cane itself saturated with = You bring up a subject I really need help with = have 5 - really nice rods, and 3 of them have perfect wraps, but = varnish on all is really checkered out. Is there any way to get = varnish off, and leave the wraps original ? The = be an early Cross, which has at least one extra coat, of something = molasses slopped all over everything. However there are 2 Edwards, = pre-impregnated Orvis, that have a real alligator finish ! = want to preserve some original decals, and plan to try to water = varnish over them, with 1200, or finer. I have hopes that being = careful, will eliminate most of the yellowing, so a fresh coat = ----- Original Message =-----From:Darrell Lee ; jimgentz@earthlink.net ; mcdowellc@lanecc.eduCc: Rodmakers ListservSent: Thursday, December = 11:11 PM Yes I own several with the cedar inserts... most neophyte = seem to attribute the cedar inserts or "cue stick look" to = Leonard... I'd love to restore a couple of them that I own, = HATE intermediates and so they sit with varnish as dark and = molasses... I've got one with the Abbey & Imbrie = What do you restorers use/do to remove some of the dark = the decals without damaging the decal itself... Anyone got a = Darrell ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ray = "Rodmakers Listserv" <rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= Sent: Thursday, December 02, 1999 6:12 PM Subject: Re: = swelled butt rods with the strips of cedar inserts... I saw = rodmakers@wugate.w= rodmakers@w= = dramatically swelled butt right at the cork like that of the = swelled butt forms would be the best way to get the dramatic = glue on extra pieces of cane, do they bent the cane with steam, = this, or Your usual wellfounded opinions are welcome. This = ------=_NextPart_000_0052_01BF43F6.DACAC1C0-- from trippma@mindspring.com Sat Dec 11 20:29:46 1999 Subject: Don't know what you got 'til it's gone! boundary="----=_NextPart_000_014A_01BF4405.79B69F80" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_014A_01BF4405.79B69F80 After almost a week of no messages, I was getting the shakes, chills, = Good thing I had plenty of cane to split and mill, and a blank ready to =wrap! Thanks to all the great advice from this list, rod # 1 is a couple of =days away from being finished, and numbers 2, and 3 are in the works! Great to have the list back! Mark ------=_NextPart_000_014A_01BF4405.79B69F80 Can't believe how much I missed = After almost a week of no messages, I= the shakes, chills, nausea, and other= Good thing I had plenty of cane to = and a blank ready to wrap! Thanks to all the great advice from = # 1 is a couple of days away from being finished, and numbers 2, and 3 = the works! Great to have the list =back! Mark ------=_NextPart_000_014A_01BF4405.79B69F80-- from avyoung@iinet.net.au Sat Dec 11 21:57:16 1999 Sun, 12 Dec 1999 11:56:51 +0800 Subject: Re: 7' 2wt types="text/plain,text/html";boundary="=====================_588551==_.ALT" --=====================_588551==_.ALT Try a Driggs Tony At 12:44 PM 12/4/99 +0000, Watson's wrote: I have someone who is interested in a 7' 2wt rod. Any sugestions on ataper?ThanksTim /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html And this our life, exempt from public haunt,Finds tongues in trees, books in running brooks,Sermons in stones, and good in everything. William Shakespeare, As You Like It /*************************************************************************/ --=====================_588551==_.ALT Try a Driggs Tony At 12:44 PM 12/4/99 +0000, Watson's wrote: I have someone who is interested ThanksTim /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: And this our life, exempt from public haunt,Finds tongues in trees, books in running brooks,Sermons in stones, and good in everything. /*************************************************************************/ --=====================_588551==_.ALT-- from avyoung@iinet.net.au Sat Dec 11 22:14:07 1999 Sun, 12 Dec 1999 12:13:49 +0800 Subject: NOT ROD RELATED types="text/plain,text/html";boundary="=====================_1604811==_.ALT" --=====================_1604811==_.ALT Now the list is up again I'm glad I got on with catching up with un doneworkbecause I'm sure it'll slow down again.Just wading through all the "Is the list down" messages reminded me ofthe oldmovie "On The Beach"Happily this list being down has a happier ending to the movie. Then again,anything would have a happier end than the movie. Tony At 01:10 PM 12/11/99 -0800, Ray Gould wrote: Hi to all,Now that the list is back up and running again I can tell you of anobservation discussed with Dr. David Smith also a subscriber. It seemsthatmany are suffering from a new syndrome called "listlessness". Now mindyouthat this may be caused by a virus stealthily placed by email orotherwisesubtlety positioned in rodmakers subconsciousness. There seems to be noknowncure but I'm sure that with enough effort placed through researchchannels itmay be possible to develop a vaccine. In the meantime try to stay calm!Ray /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html And this our life, exempt from public haunt,Finds tongues in trees, books in running brooks,Sermons in stones, and good in everything. William Shakespeare, As You Like It /*************************************************************************/ --=====================_1604811==_.ALT Now the list is up again I'm glad I got on with catching up with un donework because I'm sure it'll slow down again.Just wading through all the "Is the list down" messagesreminded me of the old movie "On The Beach"Happily this list being down has a happier ending to the movie. Thenagain, anything would have a happier end than the movie. Tony At 01:10 PM 12/11/99 -0800, Ray Gould wrote: Hi toall,Now that the list is back up and running again I can tellyou of an observation discussed with Dr. David Smith also a subscriber.It seems that many are suffering from a new syndrome called"listlessness". Now mind you that this may be caused by a virusstealthily placed by email or otherwise subtlety positioned in rodmakerssubconsciousness. There seems to be no known cure but I'm sure that withenough effort placed through research channels it may be possible todevelop a vaccine. In the meantime try to stay calm!Ray /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: And this our life, exempt from public haunt,Finds tongues in trees, books in running brooks,Sermons in stones, and good in everything. /*************************************************************************/ --=====================_1604811==_.ALT-- from Eastkoyfly@aol.com Sat Dec 11 22:25:15 1999 Subject: list Is the list back up? from megsnumber1@hotmail.com Sat Dec 11 22:29:32 1999 Sat, 11 Dec 1999 20:29:23 PST Subject: Old Bamboo Rod question Hi everyone. I was wondering if someone could give me a rough idea whatan old bamboo rod was worth. My dad found this rod on a job site that had burned down. Since the rod was in an aluminum case, the rod wasunharmed, and the aluminum wiped clean. The rod is a Brooklure Cardinal, 9'. The rod itself is in mint condition, and I especialy noticed the quality of the cork. I don't know anyone that can find cork this nice anywhere anymore.It is wrapped in a blue with orange trim bag, also in mint condition. Another quality that I noticed was the tip and stripping guide. They appear to be plastic, but on further inspection, they are truly ceramic. The red colorto them threw me. If anyone has an idea what this rod might go for, Iwould be greatly appreciative if you could email me back. Thanks. Rick Koontzrkoontz@andrew.cmu.edumegsnumber1@hotmail.com ______________________________________________________Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Sat Dec 11 23:13:14 1999 Sat, 11 Dec 1999 21:13:07 -0800 Mike Biondo Subject: Re: Don't know what you got 'til it's gone! Mark,Congratulations on rod #1. I hope it will bring you as much joy asmy first brings me. As far as the list, maybe this is a good time for some of us tosay a great big "THANK YOU" to Mike Biondo, owner of this list. I knowI have a hard time when the list is down. On FF @, there was somediscussion not long ago on the size of various email lists. Someonementioned that there are over 600 on this list now, and Mike's articlein TPF would seem to verify that. I think we all owe Mike at least alittle note of appreciation. So this is my way of saying, "THANKS MIKE." Harry Boyd from mrj@aa.net Sun Dec 12 00:15:01 1999 Sat, 11 Dec 1999 22:14:50 -0800 "'Mike Biondo'" Subject: RE: Don't know what you got 'til it's gone! I would like to second this. I didn't really realize how much I lookedforward to this list after a day configuring computers until it was gone. -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Don't know what you got 'til it's gone! Mark,Congratulations on rod #1. I hope it will bring you as much joy asmy first brings me. As far as the list, maybe this is a good time for some of us tosay a great big "THANK YOU" to Mike Biondo, owner of this list. I knowI have a hard time when the list is down. On FF @, there was somediscussion not long ago on the size of various email lists. Someonementioned that there are over 600 on this list now, and Mike's articlein TPF would seem to verify that. I think we all owe Mike at least alittle note of appreciation. So this is my way of saying, "THANKS MIKE." Harry Boyd from chris@artistree.com Sun Dec 12 02:55:22 1999 Sun, 12 Dec 1999 00:35:23 GMT Subject: Re: fly rod List,Can anyone help this gentleman with any info. Maybe the same Herter's ofMinnesota?-- Regards, Chris Wohlford Paul Kline wrote: Can you tell me about a Herter's Grand De-Luxe R.H.8.C. Made inEngland. Paul Klineazgarden@dixie-net.com from rcurry@ttlc.net Sun Dec 12 08:06:21 1999 (SMTPD32-5.05) id AD18247B00EE; Sun, 12 Dec 1999 09:11:36 -0500 Subject: Enamelled silk lines All,I have never had much use for the "enamelled" silk lines ever sinceone I traded to Bogart started breaking up on him. Nevertheless, I hadsome level Gs that were in like new condition, so I took one for atestdrive yesterday. A G is .030" diameter and should feel like a 3wt.(At that diameter, it doesn't seem necessary to have a front and backtaper.)I was very disappointed. Because the line is only finished on theoutside, it lacks the proper weight -- it might have been a 2. If I feelenergetic I may strip one or two of these lines and finish themproperly. I have one spare. If anyone wants one to play with (notresell), still in a coil, just drop me a line, its free.Best regards,Reed from jhat@cbt.net Sun Dec 12 08:22:12 1999 Subject: List Thanks MIKE for getting the list back up!!!!Jim from nobler@satx.rr.com Sun Dec 12 09:44:39 1999 SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.197.19);Sun, 12 Dec 1999 09:44:53 -0600 Subject: Fw: Don't know what you got 'til it's gone! boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0060_01BF4485.8DD13360" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0060_01BF4485.8DD13360 Subject: Re: Don't know what you got 'til it's gone! Yes, maintaining such a list, must be very time consuming, and as we get = Thanks Mike ! GMA Sent: Saturday, December 11, 1999 11:12 PMSubject: Re: Don't know what you got 'til it's gone! Mark,Congratulations on rod #1. I hope it will bring you as much joy =asmy first brings me. As far as the list, maybe this is a good time for some of us =tosay a great big "THANK YOU" to Mike Biondo, owner of this list. I =knowI have a hard time when the list is down. On FF @, there was somediscussion not long ago on the size of various email lists. Someonementioned that there are over 600 on this list now, and Mike's articlein TPF would seem to verify that. I think we all owe Mike at least alittle note of appreciation. So this is my way of saying, "THANKS MIKE." Harry Boyd ------=_NextPart_000_0060_01BF4485.8DD13360 From:nobler = Sent: Sunday, December 12, 1999 9:44 AMSubject: Re: Don't know what you got 'til it's =gone! Yes, maintaining such a list, must be very= Thanks Mike ! GMA ----- Original Message ----- Harry = Makers ; Mike Biondo Sent: Saturday, December 11, = PMSubject: Re: Don't know what = it's gone! maybe this is a good time for some of us tosay a great big "THANK = = 600 on this list now, and Mike's articlein TPF would seem to = Boyd ------=_NextPart_000_0060_01BF4485.8DD13360-- from rsgould@cmc.net Sun Dec 12 10:13:35 1999 Subject: Re: Quad Tapers Question Hi Doug,I see you haven't received any answers copied to the list regarding yourconversion question so I'll take a stab at it. With "d" being the thicknessacross the flats here are three answers to your question:1. Based on equal cross sectional areas "d" square rod = 0.93 "d" hex rod.2. Based on equal deflection "d" square rod = 0.922 "d" hex rod.3. Based on equal section modulus "d" square rod = 0.896 "d" hex rod.So you can take your pick and I'd recommend you use option #1.Ray----- Original Message ----- Subject: Quad Tapers Question This may seem like an odd question but.... can anyone suggest a sourceforsome tapers for quad rods. Are there any formulas/approaches, etc., toconverting 6 strip tapers to quad. Any thoughts would be appreciated.Doug Hall from DNHayashida@aol.com Sun Dec 12 12:44:25 1999 Subject: Re: Enamelled silk lines Mr. Silk,I thought it was just me, especially after that post about how thevarnish should only be on the outside of a silk line. I really don'tknow a lot about silk lines, and I thought I might be doing something wrong. I'm glad you came to the same conclusion I did. All,I have never had much use for the "enamelled" silk lines ever sinceone I traded to Bogart started breaking up on him. Nevertheless, I hadsome level Gs that were in like new condition, so I took one for atestdrive yesterday. A G is .030" diameter and should feel like a 3wt.(At that diameter, it doesn't seem necessary to have a front and backtaper.)I was very disappointed. Because the line is only finished on theoutside, it lacks the proper weight -- it might have been a 2. If I feelenergetic I may strip one or two of these lines and finish themproperly. I have one spare. If anyone wants one to play with (notresell), still in a coil, just drop me a line, its free.Best regards,Reed from DNHayashida@aol.com Sun Dec 12 12:48:09 1999 Subject: Re: Don't know what you got 'til it's gone! Yes Sir,Big thank you from me, my onelist pretender Rodmakers is goingoff line today. I hoped I help a bit by starting it, but if this everhappens again, I'm NOT doing it again.Darryl from KlingB@health.missouri.edu Sun Dec 12 14:26:07 1999 Subject: Thanks Mike Wanted to join those letting you know how much we appreciate whatyou'redoing. I'm a new rod maker (made 4 rods, systematically broke up the lasttwo to diagnose glue joint problems) and I'd still be just thinking about itwithout this list. We manage a busy listserve at work and I know it's a lotof work. from LECLAIR123@aol.com Sun Dec 12 14:34:47 1999 Subject: Re: Fw: Don't know what you got 'til it's gone! Thanks for all your hard work Mike, I look forward to the listevery night. Dave LeClair from LECLAIR123@aol.com Sun Dec 12 14:38:17 1999 Subject: Re: Don't know what you got 'til it's gone! Darryl,A lot of us guys appreciated what you did. Including me. Thanks,Dave LeClair from knflyrod@home.com Sun Dec 12 14:56:12 1999 (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with SMTP Sun, 12 Dec 1999 12:56:08 -0800 Subject: Re: fly rod Herters. I had an 8 ft. Herters Made in England a couple years ago. I was able todetermine it was a Hardy. I don't remember the Hardy model. ( I did notlike the way it cast.) It had red wraps with black tipping. Good luck,Ron----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: fly rod List,Can anyone help this gentleman with any info. Maybe the same Herter's ofMinnesota?--Regards, Chris Wohlford Paul Kline wrote: Can you tell me about a Herter's Grand De-Luxe R.H.8.C. Made inEngland. Paul Klineazgarden@dixie-net.com from rcurry@ttlc.net Sun Dec 12 17:34:55 1999 (SMTPD32-5.05) id A2618FD9009A; Sun, 12 Dec 1999 18:40:17 -0500 Subject: Found a user for enamelled silk line All,I did receive notes from a large number of brave souls willing totry the "G" line. Larry Blan was the first to respond.Larry,I lost your snail mail address. Would you please send it to meoffline. Thanks.Best regards,Reed from fiveside@net-gate.com Sun Dec 12 17:59:28 1999 ns1.net-gate.com (8.9.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id SAA21022; Sun, 12 Dec 199918:59:16 -0500 Subject: Hurrah To the List,We're alive and well, after how many days of awful silence and re- subscribes.To answer Doug Hall: With all due respect to Ray, and I mean that. Hisbook is great. Best analytical approach in print. I think that even Ray willadmit that we don't yet have a precise and dependable math or geometricmeans to translate a rod action really well from hex to quad. Most quadconversions come up slow, which is OK if you like slow, and they willneverbreak because the stresses are so low, but the action is not like theoriginal hex. What we need is a unique quad stress curve, independent of the hexmodel.Some of the current quad builders are doing it. Happy Holidays and Y2K. Bill from canerod@mwt.net Sun Dec 12 18:04:37 1999 Subject: Re: RODMAKERS digest 1532 wondering why I occasionally receive a % of my digest for the day,ie:56% ? I get a full index but only part of the posts. t.i.a. Phil from oakmere@carol.net Sun Dec 12 19:39:38 1999 Subject: RE: Thank You Thanks Mike for this bamboo rodmakers list. The conversation is mostusefuland enlightening. FrankFrank Paul, GreyFox2932 North Bayshore DriveSeneca, SC 29672fwpaul@ces.clemson.edu (work)oakmere@carol.net (home) from FlyfishT@aol.com Sun Dec 12 19:54:42 1999 Subject: Southbend Lathe Hi, all. Thanks to zimney & nobler for their responses. I did not get the 9x24 with quickchange chuck Southbend lathe. It looked a little too worn. I found a local lathe, a 9x18 Southbend. It has manual change gears for threading,but I did check teh bearings. I put a prybar under the spindle shaft with the chuck off. It is maybe 1/4 of thousandths movement or less. I also checked the inside of the chuck hole and had about the same. This leads me to my question. After turning the piece of stock, and running an indicator on it by hand, it's maybe 5/1000th off as I spin it. I was micing the chuck jaws and they are very worn. I was wondering if I canjust invest in new chuck jaws. Will this correct the problem? Are these chuckjaws standard in all three-jaw chucks? Can I get these through MSC? I don'twant to invest in a new chuck,since they start at about $160. rest of the unit looks pretty good, too. Thanks in advance, Tom from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Sun Dec 12 20:11:54 1999 Sun, 12 Dec 1999 18:11:48 -0800 Subject: Re: Southbend Lathe Tom,There are quite a few ways to improve the accuracy of the importedmini-lathes being kicked around on the web. Some of those techniquescouldprobably be adapted to bringing your "new" lathe into a little closertolerance.If you're off by .005", you might well need to move the tailstock one wayor theother. That could take care of a great deal of that inconsistency. Some of the links are:http://www.ai.mit.edu/projects/machine-shop/lathe- class.html http://members.toast.net/thibault//Atlas_Lathe.htm http://www.cctrap.com/~varmint/alath.htm http://www.atsc-army.org/cgi-bin/atdl.dll/tc/9-524/Ch7.htm#top http://www.pioneer.net/~felice/taig.html Again, I know these pages don't all directly apply, but perhaps you'llfind something there that will help. Harry FlyfishT@aol.com wrote: Hi, all. Thanks to zimney & nobler for their responses. I did not get the 9x24withquickchange chuck Southbend lathe. It looked a little too worn. I found alocal lathe, a 9x18 Southbend. It has manual change gears for threading,butI did check teh bearings. I put a prybar under the spindle shaft with thechuck off. It is maybe 1/4 of thousandths movement or less. I alsocheckedthe inside of the chuck hole and had about the same. This leads me to my question. After turning the piece of stock, andrunningan indicator on it by hand, it's maybe 5/1000th off as I spin it. I wasmicing the chuck jaws and they are very worn. I was wondering if I canjustinvest in new chuck jaws. Will this correct the problem? Are thesechuck jawsstandard in all three-jaw chucks? Can I get these through MSC? I don'twantto invest in a new chuck,since they start at about $160. restof the unit looks pretty good, too. Thanks in advance, Tom from drinkr@voicenet.com Sun Dec 12 20:20:41 1999 0000 (209.71.50.13) Subject: Another Thank You Mike,Thanks at this end for all your work while the list was down. More fuelforY2K I guess. Where did I put that flashlight. For all the potentialrodmakers needing a gift this time of year I noticed that Anglers Art hasthe Garrison book on sale. Im hoping for a glamour plane complete withslot from Maine in my stocking. D. Rinker from jczimny@dol.net Sun Dec 12 21:04:03 1999 Subject: Re: Southbend Lathe If you were using a 3-jaw chuck and you were only off 1/2 thou, thenyou're ingood shape. The only way to be really sure is to turn a test piece betweencenters. Most 3-jaw chacks are off much more than 1/2 thou.John Z FlyfishT@aol.com wrote: Hi, all. Thanks to zimney & nobler for their responses. I did not get the 9x24withquickchange chuck Southbend lathe. It looked a little too worn. I found alocal lathe, a 9x18 Southbend. It has manual change gears for threading,butI did check teh bearings. I put a prybar under the spindle shaft with thechuck off. It is maybe 1/4 of thousandths movement or less. I alsocheckedthe inside of the chuck hole and had about the same. This leads me to my question. After turning the piece of stock, andrunningan indicator on it by hand, it's maybe 5/1000th off as I spin it. I wasmicing the chuck jaws and they are very worn. I was wondering if I canjustinvest in new chuck jaws. Will this correct the problem? Are thesechuck jawsstandard in all three-jaw chucks? Can I get these through MSC? I don'twantto invest in a new chuck,since they start at about $160. restof the unit looks pretty good, too. Thanks in advance, Tom from d_price@global2000.net Sun Dec 12 21:11:19 1999 WAA03539; Subject: Re: Southbend Lathe Hi Tom,After you turned something in the lathe and it was 5 mills off I doubtit has anything to do with the chuck, unless there is play in it somehow after the piece is chucked and tightend down. most likely is in theplay that you saw in the head bearings. Does the chuck fit solid againstthe flat on the spindle when spun onto it?. I not that familar with thesouth bend lathes, I have a Atlas that has timken bearings that arepreloaded to a spec, this is done while the lathe is good and warm.Atlas recomends running the lathe for 30 to 60 minutes, then ajust so noplay can be felt then 1/16 turn more on the thrust nut. This is toprevent movement under turning preasure and heat.....Hope this helps,I'm sure you will get a reply from some one that has that model andbrand... Dave Price FlyfishT@aol.com wrote: Hi, all. Thanks to zimney & nobler for their responses. I did not get the 9x24withquickchange chuck Southbend lathe. It looked a little too worn. I found alocal lathe, a 9x18 Southbend. It has manual change gears for threading,butI did check teh bearings. I put a prybar under the spindle shaft with thechuck off. It is maybe 1/4 of thousandths movement or less. I alsocheckedthe inside of the chuck hole and had about the same. This leads me to my question. After turning the piece of stock, andrunningan indicator on it by hand, it's maybe 5/1000th off as I spin it. I wasmicing the chuck jaws and they are very worn. I was wondering if I canjustinvest in new chuck jaws. Will this correct the problem? Are thesechuck jawsstandard in all three-jaw chucks? Can I get these through MSC? I don'twantto invest in a new chuck,since they start at about $160. restof the unit looks pretty good, too. Thanks in advance, Tom from cattanac@wmis.net Sun Dec 12 21:17:01 1999 0000 Subject: Re: Para 15 thread color boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0008_01BF44EF.3B710B80" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0008_01BF44EF.3B710B80 the current color is 541 gudebrod - they - are wrapped with silk - but =today that color only comes in nylon ------=_NextPart_000_0008_01BF44EF.3B710B80 the current color is 541gudebrod = nylon ------=_NextPart_000_0008_01BF44EF.3B710B80-- from d_price@global2000.net Sun Dec 12 22:15:32 1999 XAA08872; Subject: Re: Southbend Lathe Hi JohnI believe what he is stating is that after turning a piece that it isoff center by 5/100's when he measures it with a indicator, and hasnothing to do with the chuck jaws be off center. My three jaw chuck isoff by 15/1000 if I was to put a hardened true shaft in the chuck andmeasure. This has nothing to do with the center of a turned piece. youcould take a square piece and put it in a four jaw chuck and have it wayoff center, then turn a diameter on it and will be centered andcircular. I may not be reading his problem right and if so disregard theabove.... Dave Price "J. C. Zimny" wrote: If you were using a 3-jaw chuck and you were only off 1/2 thou, thenyou're ingood shape. The only way to be really sure is to turn a test piecebetweencenters. Most 3-jaw chacks are off much more than 1/2 thou.John Z FlyfishT@aol.com wrote: Hi, all. Thanks to zimney & nobler for their responses. I did not get the 9x24withquickchange chuck Southbend lathe. It looked a little too worn. I found alocal lathe, a 9x18 Southbend. It has manual change gears forthreading, butI did check teh bearings. I put a prybar under the spindle shaft with thechuck off. It is maybe 1/4 of thousandths movement or less. I alsocheckedthe inside of the chuck hole and had about the same. This leads me to my question. After turning the piece of stock, andrunningan indicator on it by hand, it's maybe 5/1000th off as I spin it. I wasmicing the chuck jaws and they are very worn. I was wondering if I canjustinvest in new chuck jaws. Will this correct the problem? Are thesechuck jawsstandard in all three-jaw chucks? Can I get these through MSC? I don'twantto invest in a new chuck,since they start at about $160. restof the unit looks pretty good, too. Thanks in advance, Tom from nobler@satx.rr.com Sun Dec 12 22:38:58 1999 SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.197.19);Sun, 12 Dec 1999 22:30:31 -0600 "Rodmakers List" Subject: Re: Southbend Lathe boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000D_01BF44F1.B466B420" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000D_01BF44F1.B466B420 If I'm not mistaken all Southbends can be re-bushed, as they don't have =ball or roller bearings. GMA Sent: Sunday, December 12, 1999 10:15 PMSubject: Re: Southbend Lathe Hi JohnI believe what he is stating is that after turning a piece that it =isoff center by 5/100's when he measures it with a indicator, and hasnothing to do with the chuck jaws be off center. My three jaw chuck isoff by 15/1000 if I was to put a hardened true shaft in the chuck andmeasure. This has nothing to do with the center of a turned piece. youcould take a square piece and put it in a four jaw chuck and have it =wayoff center, then turn a diameter on it and will be centered andcircular. I may not be reading his problem right and if so disregard =theabove.... Dave Price "J. C. Zimny" wrote: If you were using a 3-jaw chuck and you were only off 1/2 thou, then =you're ingood shape. The only way to be really sure is to turn a test piece =betweencenters. Most 3-jaw chacks are off much more than 1/2 thou.John Z FlyfishT@aol.com wrote: Hi, all. Thanks to zimney & nobler for their responses. I did not get the =9x24 withquickchange chuck Southbend lathe. It looked a little too worn. I =found alocal lathe, a 9x18 Southbend. It has manual change gears for =threading, butI did check teh bearings. I put a prybar under the spindle shaft =with thechuck off. It is maybe 1/4 of thousandths movement or less. I also =checkedthe inside of the chuck hole and had about the same. This leads me to my question. After turning the piece of stock, =and runningan indicator on it by hand, it's maybe 5/1000th off as I spin it. =I wasmicing the chuck jaws and they are very worn. I was wondering if I =can justinvest in new chuck jaws. Will this correct the problem? Are these =chuck jawsstandard in all three-jaw chucks? Can I get these through MSC? I =don't wantto invest in a new chuck,since they start at about $160. good. The restof the unit looks pretty good, too. Thanks in advance, Tom ------=_NextPart_000_000D_01BF44F1.B466B420 If I'm not mistaken all Southbends can be = as they don't have ball or roller bearings. GMA ----- Original Message ----- Price Sent: Sunday, December 12, 1999= PMSubject: Re: Southbend =Lathe turning a piece that it isoff center by 5/100's when he measures = indicator, and hasnothing to do with the chuck jaws be off center. = three jaw chuck isoff by 15/1000 if I was to put a hardened true = the chuck andmeasure. This has nothing to do with the center of a = piece. youcould take a square piece and put it in a four jaw chuck = have it wayoff center, then turn a diameter on it and will be = andcircular. I may not be reading his problem right and if so = = lathe, a 9x18 Southbend. It has manual change gears for threading, = = chuck jaws. Will this correct the problem? Are these chuck = standard in all three-jaw chucks? Can I get these through MSC? I don't = Tom ------=_NextPart_000_000D_01BF44F1.B466B420-- from Canerods@aol.com Mon Dec 13 07:05:53 1999 Subject: Re: Fw: Don't know what you got 'til it's gone! In a message dated 12/12/99 7:48:11 AM Pacific Standard Time, nobler@satx.rr.com writes: Yes, thanks Mike and thanks to Darrell too. Don Burns from earsdws@duke.edu Mon Dec 13 07:15:18 1999 IAA16691; Subject: Re: Listless boundary="------------E8E4DF83121E5999132BEECE" --------------E8E4DF83121E5999132BEECE Ray,I am concerned, as the nominal psychologist on the rodmakers list, Rodmakers recent Y2K simulation. This is of particular concern becauserumors of widepsread complaints from Rodmakers spouses/significantothers that our listmembers were unable to function in other, "normal"capacities without their daily email fix from WUSTL.To prevent complete familial meltdowns on 1 January should the listgo down again, I might suggest that our at risk colleagues take severalsteps to prevent a repeat of last weeks problems. First, "bank" unreadpostings to a back up disk, or hardcopy in case you use a MS product OSand risk losing your entire system, to be doled out a few each day whileour able webmaster brings us back online.Second, as an alternative method of getting one's daily dose ofbamboo would be to ask the spouse/signifcant other to sprinkle bamboodust (I do recall the health concerns over ingesting the dust, but thisis an emergency!) liberally over corn flakes (BID; titrate to effect).As a final back up measure, a Rodmakers crisis hotline will be setup by December 31 where members will be able to call tollfree and hearpre- recorded Rodmakers messages. George Gehrke has generouslyvoluntered to record the messages. Members are encouraged to send intheir favorite Rodmakers posting ASAP for taping!I hope that if all members pitch in, giving it their all, that thebamboo rod will survive into the next millenium. Good luck folks, I'llhopefully see you all at spring hatch!dws. Ray Gould wrote: Hi to all,Now that the list is back up and running again I can tellyou of an observation discussed with Dr. David Smith also asubscriber. It seems that many are suffering from a new syndromecalled "listlessness". Now mind you that this may be caused by a virusstealthily placed by email or otherwise subtlety positioned inrodmakers subconsciousness. There seems to be no known cure but I'msure that with enough effort placed through research channels it maybe possible to develop a vaccine. In the meantime try to stay calm!Ray --------------E8E4DF83121E5999132BEECE Ray, therodmakers list, by the reports of "listlessness" experienced by our friendsduring the Rodmakers recent Y2K simulation. This is of particular concernbecause rumors of widepsread complaints from Rodmakersspouses/significantothers that our listmembers were unable to function in other, "normal"capacities without their daily email fix from WUSTL. Januaryshould the list go down again, I might suggest that our at risk colleagues First,"bank" unread postings to a back up disk, or hardcopy in case you use aMS product OS and risk losing your entire system, to be doled out a feweach day while our able webmaster brings us back online. daily dose of bamboo would be to ask the spouse/signifcant other tosprinklebamboo dust (I do recall the health concerns over ingesting the dust, butthis is an emergency!) liberally over corn flakes (BID; titrate to effect). hotlinewill be set up by December 31 where members will be able to call tollfree generously in their favorite Rodmakers posting ASAP for taping! luck folks, I'll hopefully see you all at spring hatch! Ray Gould wrote: Hito all,Now that the listis back up and running again I can tell you of an observation discussedwith Dr. David Smith also a subscriber. It seems that many are suffering from a new syndrome called "listlessness". Now mind you that this may becaused by a virus stealthily placed by email or otherwise subtletypositionedin rodmakers subconsciousness. There seems to be no known cure but I'msure that with enough effort placed through research channels it may bepossible to develop a vaccine. In the meantime try to staycalm!Ray --------------E8E4DF83121E5999132BEECE-- from avyoung@iinet.net.au Mon Dec 13 07:49:36 1999 Subject: specials RL,the specials page is complete. It's very hard to decide if it's easier todo what we've done this time or just do as I suggested being make scansofthe individual items (or obtain them on CD).The reason being that using an A3 and scaning halves and re joining themisa bit fiddly. Also the scans in the original scan are 25mb each and ittakes quite a lot of time to simply manipulate files this size.Anyhow the end result it's too bad and depending on which browser you useit's hard to see the join unless you look. MSIE is almost seamless andNetscape is out buy one space. Doing it this way was a 2hr job. TY/*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html And this our life, exempt from public haunt,Finds tongues in trees, books in running brooks,Sermons in stones, and good in everything. William Shakespeare, As You Like It /*************************************************************************/ from nobler@satx.rr.com Mon Dec 13 08:01:01 1999 SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.197.19);Mon, 13 Dec 1999 08:01:06 -0600 Subject: Re: specials boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0024_01BF4540.39435240" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0024_01BF4540.39435240 Very nice site Tony, and your prices are certainly reasonable. I hope =you post some shots of your rods soon. We are talking of making another trip to your great country, in this =next year. Where do you live ? I went to Sydney, Perth, and Adelaide, =the first time, and want to get up to Darwin this trip. GMA Sent: Monday, December 13, 1999 7:57 AMSubject: specials RL,the specials page is complete. It's very hard to decide if it's easier =todo what we've done this time or just do as I suggested being make =scans ofthe individual items (or obtain them on CD).The reason being that using an A3 and scaning halves and re joining =them isa bit fiddly. Also the scans in the original scan are 25mb each and ittakes quite a lot of time to simply manipulate files this size.Anyhow the end result it's too bad and depending on which browser you =useit's hard to see the join unless you look. MSIE is almost seamless andNetscape is out buy one space. Doing it this way was a 2hr job. TY=/************************************************************************=*/ Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html And this our life, exempt from public haunt,Finds tongues in trees, books in running brooks,Sermons in stones, and good in everything. William Shakespeare, As You Like It =/************************************************************************=*/ ------=_NextPart_000_0024_01BF4540.39435240 Very nice site Tony, and your prices are = reasonable. I hope you post some shots of your rods =soon. We are talking of making another trip to your great = trip. GMA ----- Original Message ----- Young Sent: Monday, December 13, 1999= AMSubject: specialsRL,the specials page is complete. It's very hard to = if it's easier todo what we've done this time or just do as I = being make scans ofthe individual items (or obtain them on = reason being that using an A3 and scaning halves and re joining them = bit fiddly. Also the scans in the original scan are 25mb each and = quite a lot of time to simply manipulate files this size.Anyhow = result it's too bad and depending on which browser you useit's = the join unless you look. MSIE is almost seamless andNetscape is = =job.TY/******************************************************= Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~a= this our life, exempt from public haunt,Finds tongues in trees, = running brooks,Sermons in stones, and good in = =It/**************************************************************=***********/ ------=_NextPart_000_0024_01BF4540.39435240-- from tjtrodmaker@yahoo.com Mon Dec 13 08:14:18 1999 0000 1999 06:12:20 PST Subject: RE: Don't know what you got 'til it's gone! i'll third it! --- Martin Jensen wrote:I would like to second this. I didn't really realizehow much I lookedforward to this list after a day configuringcomputers until it was gone. -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Of Harry BoydSent: Saturday, December 11, 1999 9:12 PM Cc: Rod Makers; Mike BiondoSubject: Re: Don't know what you got 'til it's gone! Mark,Congratulations on rod #1. I hope it will bringyou as much joy asmy first brings me. As far as the list, maybe this is a goodtime for some of us tosay a great big "THANK YOU" to Mike Biondo, owner ofthis list. I knowI have a hard time when the list is down. On FF @,there was somediscussion not long ago on the size of various emaillists. Someonementioned that there are over 600 on this list now,and Mike's articlein TPF would seem to verify that. I think we allowe Mike at least alittle note of appreciation. So this is my way of saying, "THANKS MIKE." Harry Boyd ====="Gooda' morning mister bear"__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. All in one place.Yahoo! Shopping: http://shopping.yahoo.com from oossg@vbe.com Mon Dec 13 08:47:06 1999 Subject: Twelve Sided Handle To List,Recently there was some talk about how the handles with the wood inletswere made. I have uncovered a similar style handle and have taken itapart. I have two pictures I can e-mail that might shed some light. Ifinterested e-mail me off list and I will send. I haven't yet made oneof these, only investigated.Scott from darrell@rockclimbing.org Mon Dec 13 09:09:09 1999 sims.3.5.1999.09.16.21.57.p8)with SMTP id for Subject: RE: Listless... Topic #2 Garrison tapers tapers 201E, 202E,204E,206, 206E, 209, 209E boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000A_01BF4538.A94ACD00" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000A_01BF4538.A94ACD00 Was the archives down as well? I suppose people could have gone to thearchives and reviewed the last few years of the list... Can I add my "Me Too's" and on behalf of EVERYBODY.... we all appreciateandwant to thank the efforts of Mike and all who had a hand in creating andmaintaining the RM list... Hopefully we won't get 500 more messages of thanks on the list... howaboutyou thank those deserving offlist... I was rather enjoying the short breakand lower volume of email... In the spirit of Christmas... please don'tflame me... or if you must, please do it offlist... Oh, I have a question... does anyone have any comments on how theylike/dislike the casting & fishing qualities of the Garrison tapers 201E,202E, 204E, 206, 206E, 209, 209E... What's your favorite of these tapers?Why? None of these tapers made the RM top 25 tapers list... Aren't anydeserving??? As long as I'm using bandwidth... Happy Holidays, merry christmas and ahappy new millennium to all... Regards, Darrell Lee -----Original Message----- Smith Subject: Re: Listless Ray,I am concerned, as the nominal psychologist on the rodmakers list, bythe reports of "listlessness" experienced by our friends during theRodmakers recent Y2K simulation. This is of particular concern becauserumors of widepsread complaints from Rodmakers spouses/significantothersthat our listmembers were unable to function in other, "normal" capacitieswithout their daily email fix from WUSTL.To prevent complete familial meltdowns on 1 January should the listgodown again, I might suggest that our at risk colleagues take several stepsto prevent a repeat of last weeks problems. First, "bank" unread postingsto a back up disk, or hardcopy in case you use a MS product OS and risklosing your entire system, to be doled out a few each day while our ablewebmaster brings us back online.Second, as an alternative method of getting one's daily dose of bamboowould be to ask the spouse/signifcant other to sprinkle bamboo dust (I dorecall the health concerns over ingesting the dust, but this is anemergency!) liberally over corn flakes (BID; titrate to effect).As a final back up measure, a Rodmakers crisis hotline will be set up pre-recorded Rodmakers messages. George Gehrke has generouslyvoluntered torecord the messages. Members are encouraged to send in their favoriteRodmakers posting ASAP for taping!I hope that if all members pitch in, giving it their all, that thebamboo rod will survive into the next millenium. Good luck folks, I'llhopefully see you all at spring hatch!dws.Ray Gould wrote: Hi to all,Now that the list is back up and running again I can tell youof an observation discussed with Dr. David Smith also a subscriber. Itseemsthat many are suffering from a new syndrome called "listlessness". Nowmindyou that this may be caused by a virus stealthily placed by email orotherwise subtlety positioned in rodmakers subconsciousness. Thereseems tobe no known cure but I'm sure that with enough effort placed throughresearch channels it may be possible to develop a vaccine. In the meantimetry to stay calm!Ray ------=_NextPart_000_000A_01BF4538.A94ACD00 the archives down as well? I suppose people could have gone to the = reviewed the last few years of the list... add my "Me Too's" and on behalf of EVERYBODY.... we all appreciate and = thank the efforts of Mike and all who had a hand in creating and = RM list... Hopefully we won't get 500 moremessages of = the list... how about you thank those deserving offlist... I was rather = the short break and lower volume of email... In the spirit of = Oh, I have a question... does anyone haveany = on how they like/dislike the casting & fishing qualities of the = tapers 201E, 202E, 204E, 206, 206E, 209, 209E... What's your favorite of = tapers? Why? None of these tapers made the RM top 25 tapers list... = deserving??? As long as I'm using Regards, Darrell Lee owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu = Behalf Of Dr. David W. SmithSent: Monday, December 13, = rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Re: =ListlessRay, = concerned, as the nominal psychologist on the rodmakers list, by the = of "listlessness" experienced by our friends during the Rodmakers = simulation. This is of particular concern because rumors of widepsread = complaints from Rodmakers spouses/significant others that our = unable to function in other, "normal" capacities without their daily = January should the list go down again, I might suggest that our at = in case you use a MS product OS and risk losing your entire system, to = doled out a few each day while our able webmaster brings us back = dose of bamboo would be to ask the spouse/signifcant other to sprinkle = dust (I do recall the health concerns over ingesting the dust, but = will be set up by December 31 where members will be able to call = their favorite Rodmakers posting ASAP for taping! = hope that if all members pitch in, giving it their all, that the = Hi toall,Now that the list is back up and = can tell you of an observation discussed with Dr. David Smith also a = subscriber. It seems that many are suffering from a new syndrome = "listlessness". Now mind you that this may be caused by a virus = subconsciousness. There seems to be no known cure but I'm sure that = enough effort placed through research channels it may be possible to = a vaccine. In the meantime try to stay calm!Ray ------=_NextPart_000_000A_01BF4538.A94ACD00-- from morten@flash.net Mon Dec 13 09:49:33 1999 Subject: Re: Listless... Topic #2 Garrison tapers tapers 201E, 202E,204E,206, 206E, 209, 209E Darrell, I cast a 202E at SRG 99, made by Al Medved and I was veryimpressed.The rod cast very strong, unlike other Garrison's I have cast. The fewGarrisons I have cast has felt like a light semi parabolic. The tapersfeel very smooth.The 202E is on my 'mustmake' list. P.S. Al Medveds 202E was a true masterpiece.Morten-- 3119 Georgia Pine Dr.Spring, TX 77373(281) 353 5725http://www.flash.net/~morten from dan_cooney@attglobal.net Mon Dec 13 09:58:04 1999 SMTP +0000 RODMAKERS Subject: RODMAKERS Listguy Mike, When I met you at the SRG a few weeks ago I told you how much I enjoyedandappreciated the RODMAKERS listserver. As a relative newcomer to thecraft ofrodmaking, I have acquired an immeasurable amount of information fromthisresource. (Thanks, too, to all the knowledgeable contributors who share theirinsightsand experiences. Without all of you Mike's RODMAKERS listserver would beanempty container.) Mike, after what you have just gone through in the aftermath of the hackerattack, that thank you of mine is inadequate and requires an update. Asotherhave so aptly stated, "Don't know what you got 'til it's gone!" -- I didn'trealize how addicted I had become. I really look forward to my daily dosesofgood rodmaking info with a little humor mixed in for good measure. Thanksagain, Mike, for the great service that you provide for so many of us outhere.I really appreciate all your efforts very much. During the recent outage I had a thought that I'll pass by you. About thetimethat the server went belly up I submitted a request tolistproc@wugate.wustl.edu using a"set RODMAKERS" command. Since the server was down, I never did receivearesponse. A thought occurred to me that a set RODMAKERS server testfunctioncould be set up that would give a quick response that the server isoperational. This could be used to tell a user whether or not the server isalive and well without forcing 600 some odd other users to wade throughourtest messages. In spite of your advice that "sending 'This is a test'messageto the list is not considered good net- etiquette." we still get quite a fewtest messages. Just a thought. Thanks again, Mike, for the great service you perform for all of us. Regards,Dan from dati@selway.umt.edu Mon Dec 13 10:06:38 1999 09:06:28 -0700 Subject: Phillipson Smuggler Rodmakers,I have looked through the taper archives and have not found a taper forthe Phillipson Smuggler. If any of you have this taper, do you mindpassing it along? I would really appreciate it. Thanks,Darin Law from SeanT@harker.org Mon Dec 13 10:12:16 1999 Mon, 13 Dec 1999 07:59:31 -0800 Subject: please unsubscribe me Need to take a break. Thanks for the info.!Sean from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Mon Dec 13 10:15:46 1999 0800 Subject: Re: Phillipson Smuggler -- multi-piece rods Speaking of the Smuggler, I was browsing through Doug Kulick's nicewebsite a little while ago, and noticed that he produces quite a fewmulti-piece rods. I've never really thought about rods with more thanthree pieces. Have you folks cast Doug's 4 piece (or more) rods? If so,what do you think? Harry Darin J Law wrote: Rodmakers,I have looked through the taper archives and have not found a taper forthe Phillipson Smuggler. If any of you have this taper, do you mindpassing it along? I would really appreciate it. Thanks,Darin Law from mcdowellc@lanecc.edu Mon Dec 13 10:40:50 1999 8:56:15 PST Subject: RE: Listless... Topic #2 Garrison tapers tapers 201E, 202E, Darrell, I've made the 201e, 202e, and 209e. The 209e taper with a 5 DT is well liked by those who have cast them. I feel that the 201e and 202e arelight,straight tapers. They are delicate casters. The butts are not built up so they flex fully and that gives them a slower action. I can't get the distance from them that I can other tapers, but if you are fishing out to 30' they are fine. If you put the 201/201e, and the 202/ 202e you will find that there is very little difference in the rods. Only .001" difference in several areas, and only up to about .003" in the others. That's not very significant. Chrismcdowellc@lanecc.edu-------------Original Text Was the archives down as well? I suppose people could have gone to thearchives and reviewed the last few years of the list... Can I add my "Me Too's" and on behalf of EVERYBODY.... we all appreciate andwant to thank the efforts of Mike and all who had a hand in creating andmaintaining the RM list... Hopefully we won't get 500 more messages of thanks on the list... howaboutyou thank those deserving offlist... I was rather enjoying the short breakand lower volume of email... In the spirit of Christmas... please don'tflame me... or if you must, please do it offlist... Oh, I have a question... does anyone have any comments on how theylike/dislike the casting & fishing qualities of the Garrison tapers 201E,202E, 204E, 206, 206E, 209, 209E... What's your favorite of these tapers?Why? None of these tapers made the RM top 25 tapers list... Aren't anydeserving??? As long as I'm using bandwidth... Happy Holidays, merry christmas and ahappy new millennium to all... Regards, Darrell Lee -----Original Message----- Smith Subject: Re: Listless Ray,I am concerned, as the nominal psychologist on the rodmakers list, bythe reports of "listlessness" experienced by our friends during theRodmakers recent Y2K simulation. This is of particular concern becauserumors of widepsread complaints from Rodmakers spouses/significantothersthat our listmembers were unable to function in other, "normal" capacitieswithout their daily email fix from WUSTL.To prevent complete familial meltdowns on 1 January should the list godown again, I might suggest that our at risk colleagues take several stepsto prevent a repeat of last weeks problems. First, "bank" unread postingsto a back up disk, or hardcopy in case you use a MS product OS andrisklosing your entire system, to be doled out a few each day while ourablewebmaster brings us back online.Second, as an alternative method of getting one's daily dose of bamboowould be to ask the spouse/signifcant other to sprinkle bamboo dust (I dorecall the health concerns over ingesting the dust, but this is anemergency!) liberally over corn flakes (BID; titrate to effect).As a final back up measure, a Rodmakers crisis hotline will be set up pre-recorded Rodmakers messages. George Gehrke has generouslyvoluntered torecord the messages. Members are encouraged to send in their favoriteRodmakers posting ASAP for taping!I hope that if all members pitch in, giving it their all, that thebamboo rod will survive into the next millenium. Good luck folks, I'llhopefully see you all at spring hatch!dws.Ray Gould wrote: Hi to all,Now that the list is back up and running again I can tell youof an observation discussed with Dr. David Smith also a subscriber. It seemsthat many are suffering from a new syndrome called "listlessness". Nowmindyou that this may be caused by a virus stealthily placed by email orotherwise subtlety positioned in rodmakers subconsciousness. Thereseems tobe no known cure but I'm sure that with enough effort placed throughresearch channels it may be possible to develop a vaccine. In the meantimetry to stay calm!Ray from rsgould@cmc.net Mon Dec 13 11:52:00 1999 Subject: Re: Listless boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0009_01BF454F.A1C15C40" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0009_01BF454F.A1C15C40 Hi David,What a terrific analysis and solution! I love it and I know it'll be =good for the cane industry as well!Ray Sent: Monday, December 13, 1999 5:18 AMSubject: Re: Listless I am concerned, as the nominal psychologist on the rodmakers list, = Rodmakers recent Y2K simulation. This is of particular concern because =rumors of widepsread complaints from Rodmakers spouses/significant =others that our listmembers were unable to function in other, "normal" = To prevent complete familial meltdowns on 1 January should the =list go down again, I might suggest that our at risk colleagues take =several steps to prevent a repeat of last weeks problems. First, "bank" =unread postings to a back up disk, or hardcopy in case you use a MS =product OS and risk losing your entire system, to be doled out a few = Second, as an alternative method of getting one's daily dose of =bamboo would be to ask the spouse/signifcant other to sprinkle bamboo =dust (I do recall the health concerns over ingesting the dust, but this = As a final back up measure, a Rodmakers crisis hotline will be set =up by December 31 where members will be able to call tollfree and hear =pre- recorded Rodmakers messages. George Gehrke has generously =voluntered to record the messages. Members are encouraged to send in = I hope that if all members pitch in, giving it their all, that the =bamboo rod will survive into the next millenium. Good luck folks, I'll = Hi to all,Now that the list is back up and running again I can tell =you of an observation discussed with Dr. David Smith also a subscriber. =It seems that many are suffering from a new syndrome called ="listlessness". Now mind you that this may be caused by a virus =stealthily placed by email or otherwise subtlety positioned in rodmakers =subconsciousness. There seems to be no known cure but I'm sure that with=enough effort placed through research channels it may be possible to =develop a vaccine. In the meantime try to stay calm!Ray ------=_NextPart_000_0009_01BF454F.A1C15C40 Hi David,What a terrific analysis and solution! = and I know it'll be good for the cane industry as well!Ray ----- Original Message ----- Dr.David = Smith Cc: rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= Sent: Monday, December 13, 1999= AMSubject: Re: Listless experienced by our friends during the Rodmakers recent Y2K simulation. = of particular concern because rumors of widepsread complaints from = spouses/significant others that our listmembers were unable to = should the list go down again, I might suggest that our at risk = "bank" unread postings to a back up disk, or hardcopy in case you use = product OS and risk losing your entire system, to be doled out a few = = as an alternative method of getting one's daily dose of bamboo would = the spouse/signifcant other to sprinkle bamboo dust (I do recall the = concerns over ingesting the dust, but this is an emergency!) liberally = up measure, a Rodmakers crisis hotline will be set up by December 31 = members will be able to call tollfree and hear pre-recorded pitch in, giving it their all, that the bamboo rod will survive into = Hi toall,Now that the list is back up and = can tell you of an observation discussed with Dr. David Smith also a = subscriber. It seems that many are suffering from a new syndrome = "listlessness". Now mind you that this may be caused by a virus = subconsciousness. There seems to be no known cure but I'm sure that = enough effort placed through research channels it may be possible to = a vaccine. In the meantime try to stay calm!Ray ------=_NextPart_000_0009_01BF454F.A1C15C40-- from rsgould@cmc.net Mon Dec 13 12:24:17 1999 Subject: Re: Listless... Topic #2 Garrison tapers tapers 201E, 202E,204E,206, 206E,209, 209E boundary="----=_NextPart_000_006F_01BF4554.25E690E0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_006F_01BF4554.25E690E0 Hi Darrell,I've cast the Garrison 212E on a rod actually made by the man himself =and I can tell you it was a delight!Ray Sent: Monday, December 13, 1999 7:07 AMSubject: RE: Listless... Topic #2 Garrison tapers tapers 201E, 202E, =204E,206, 206E, 209, 209E Was the archives down as well? I suppose people could have gone to the = Can I add my "Me Too's" and on behalf of EVERYBODY.... we all =appreciate and want to thank the efforts of Mike and all who had a hand = Hopefully we won't get 500 more messages of thanks on the list... how =about you thank those deserving offlist... I was rather enjoying the =short break and lower volume of email... In the spirit of Christmas... = Oh, I have a question... does anyone have any comments on how they =like/dislike the casting & fishing qualities of the Garrison tapers =201E, 202E, 204E, 206, 206E, 209, 209E... What's your favorite of these =tapers? Why? None of these tapers made the RM top 25 tapers list... =Aren't any deserving??? As long as I'm using bandwidth... Happy Holidays, merry christmas and = Regards, Darrell Lee -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu = SmithSent: Monday, December 13, 1999 5:18 AM Cc: rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Re: Listless I am concerned, as the nominal psychologist on the rodmakers =list, by the reports of "listlessness" experienced by our friends during =the Rodmakers recent Y2K simulation. This is of particular concern =because rumors of widepsread complaints from Rodmakers =spouses/significant others that our listmembers were unable to function=in other, "normal" capacities without their daily email fix from To prevent complete familial meltdowns on 1 January should the =list go down again, I might suggest that our at risk colleagues take =several steps to prevent a repeat of last weeks problems. First, "bank" =unread postings to a back up disk, or hardcopy in case you use a MS =product OS and risk losing your entire system, to be doled out a few = Second, as an alternative method of getting one's daily dose of =bamboo would be to ask the spouse/signifcant other to sprinkle bamboo =dust (I do recall the health concerns over ingesting the dust, but this = As a final back up measure, a Rodmakers crisis hotline will be =set up by December 31 where members will be able to call tollfree and =hear pre- recorded Rodmakers messages. George Gehrke has generously =voluntered to record the messages. Members are encouraged to send in = I hope that if all members pitch in, giving it their all, that =the bamboo rod will survive into the next millenium. Good luck folks, = Hi to all,Now that the list is back up and running again I can =tell you of an observation discussed with Dr. David Smith also a =subscriber. It seems that many are suffering from a new syndrome called="listlessness". Now mind you that this may be caused by a virus =stealthily placed by email or otherwise subtlety positioned in rodmakers =subconsciousness. There seems to be no known cure but I'm sure that with=enough effort placed through research channels it may be possible to =develop a vaccine. In the meantime try to stay calm!Ray ------=_NextPart_000_006F_01BF4554.25E690E0 Hi Darrell,I've cast the Garrison 212E on a rod = Ray ----- Original Message ----- Darrell A. Lee Cc: rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= Sent: Monday, December 13, 1999= AMSubject: RE: Listless... Topic = Garrison tapers tapers 201E, 202E, 204E,206, 206E, 209, 209E the archives down as well? I suppose people could have gone to the = and reviewed the last few years of the list... I add my "Me Too's" and on behalf of EVERYBODY.... we all appreciate = maintaining the RM list... Hopefully we won't get 500 moremessages of = the list... how about you thank those deserving offlist... I was = enjoying the short break and lower volume of email... In the spirit of = Christmas... please don't flame me... or if you must, please do it = Oh, I have a question... does anyone have= comments on how they like/dislike the casting & fishing qualities = Garrison tapers 201E, 202E, 204E, 206, 206E, 209, 209E... What's your = of these tapers? Why? None of these tapers made the RM top 25 tapers = Aren't any deserving??? As long as I'm using = Regards, DarrellLee David = SmithSent: Monday, December 13, 1999 5:18 rsgould@cmc.netCc: = Re: ListlessRay, = am concerned, as the nominal psychologist on the rodmakers list, by = reports of "listlessness" experienced by our friends during the = recent Y2K simulation. This is of particular concern because rumors = widepsread complaints from Rodmakers spouses/significant others that= listmembers were unable to function in other, "normal" capacities = familial meltdowns on 1 January should the list go down again, I = suggest that our at risk colleagues take several steps to prevent a = disk, or hardcopy in case you use a MS product OS and risk losing = entire system, to be doled out a few each day while our able = spouse/signifcant other to sprinkle bamboo dust (I do recall the = concerns over ingesting the dust, but this is an emergency!) = up measure, a Rodmakers crisis hotline will be set up by December 31 = members will be able to call tollfree and hear pre-recorded = pitch in, giving it their all, that the bamboo rod will survive into = Hi toall,Now that the list is back up and = can tell you of an observation discussed with Dr. David Smith also = subscriber. It seems that many are suffering from a new syndrome = "listlessness". Now mind you that this may be caused by a virus = subconsciousness. There seems to be no known cure but I'm sure = enough effort placed through research channels it may be possible = develop a vaccine. In the meantime try to stay =calm!Ray= ------=_NextPart_000_006F_01BF4554.25E690E0-- from dickay@alltel.net Mon Dec 13 15:27:30 1999 PAA25616 Subject: Synthetic Cork? Possible Good News boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0007_01BF457E.40F72DC0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0007_01BF457E.40F72DC0 Listers, Snipped from the Nov. 15th issue of Design News Magazine. "Neocork Technologies has developed a cork (Wine Bottle Cork) made with=AFFINITY polyolefin plastomers (POPs) that, says the company, is tougher=than traditional corks and won't break when pulled out of the bottle." "Dow Plastics (Midland, MI) supplied the material and worked with =Neocork to develop the cork." According to the article 22 wineries are now using the new synthetic =cork. If less tree bark cork is being used by the wineries there should =be more and better cork available for fly rod grips. Maybe we should look into using this product for grips, it is supposed =to be non-absorbent. Nah!! Thought you might like to know. Best Wishes for the Holiday Season Dick Fuhrmandickay@alltel.net ------=_NextPart_000_0007_01BF457E.40F72DC0 Listers, Snipped from the Nov. 15th issue of Design News Magazine. "Neocork Technologies has developed a cork (Wine Bottle Cork) made= AFFINITY polyolefin plastomers (POPs) that, says the company, is tougher= traditional corks and won't break when pulled out of the bottle." "Dow Plastics (Midland, MI) supplied the material and worked with = to develop the cork." According to the article 22 wineries are now using the new = more and better cork available for fly rod grips. Maybe we should look into using this product for grips, it is = be non-absorbent. Nah!! Thought you might like to know. Best Wishes for the Holiday Season Dick Fuhrmandickay@alltel.net ------=_NextPart_000_0007_01BF457E.40F72DC0-- from jczimny@dol.net Mon Dec 13 16:41:47 1999 Subject: Re: Southbend Lathe boundary="------------DE5F7865E154DE0FE1EF0511" --------------DE5F7865E154DE0FE1EF0511 Yes, but very expensive if you get the bearing from South Bend. Thebearing are adjustable allow for "tightening" with a wedge.John Z nobler wrote: If I'm not mistaken all Southbends can be re-bushed, as they don'thave ball or roller bearings. GMA ----- Original Message -----From: Dave Price Sent: Sunday, December 12, 1999 10:15 PMSubject: Re: Southbend LatheHi JohnI believe what he is stating is that after turning a piecethat it isoff center by 5/100's when he measures it with a indicator,and hasnothing to do with the chuck jaws be off center. My threejaw chuck isoff by 15/1000 if I was to put a hardened true shaft in thechuck andmeasure. This has nothing to do with the center of a turnedpiece. youcould take a square piece and put it in a four jaw chuck andhave it wayoff center, then turn a diameter on it and will be centeredandcircular. I may not be reading his problem right and if sodisregard theabove.... Dave Price "J. C. Zimny" wrote: If you were using a 3-jaw chuck and you were only off 1/2thou, then you're ingood shape. The only way to be really sure is to turn atest piece betweencenters. Most 3-jaw chacks are off much more than 1/2thou.John Z FlyfishT@aol.com wrote: Hi, all. Thanks to zimney & nobler for their responses. I did notget the 9x24 withquickchange chuck Southbend lathe. It looked a littletoo worn. I found alocal lathe, a 9x18 Southbend. It has manual changegears for threading, butI did check teh bearings. I put a prybar under thespindle shaft with thechuck off. It is maybe 1/4 of thousandths movement orless. I also checkedthe inside of the chuck hole and had about the same. This leads me to my question. After turning the piece ofstock, and runningan indicator on it by hand, it's maybe 5/1000th off as Ispin it. I wasmicing the chuck jaws and they are very worn. I waswondering if I can justinvest in new chuck jaws. Will this correct the problem?Are these chuck jawsstandard in all three-jaw chucks? Can I get thesethrough MSC? I don't wantto invest in a new chuck,since they start at about $160. pretty good. The restof the unit looks pretty good, too. Thanks in advance, Tom --------------DE5F7865E154DE0FE1EF0511 Yes, but very expensive if you get the bearing from South Bend. The bearingare adjustable allow for "tightening" with a wedge.John Znobler wrote: If I'm not mistakenall Southbends can be re-bushed, as they don't have ball or roller ----- Original Message ----- From:DavePrice ; RodmakersList Sent: Sunday, December 12, 199910:15PM Subject: Re: Southbend Lathe it isoff center by 5/100's when he measures it with a indicator, and hasnothing to do with the chuck jaws be off center. My three jaw chuckisoff by 15/1000 if I was to put a hardened true shaft in the chuck andmeasure. This has nothing to do with the center of a turned piece.youcould take a square piece and put it in a four jaw chuck and have itwayoff center, then turn a diameter on it and will be centered andcircular. I may not be reading his problem right and if so disregardtheabove....Dave Price"J. C. Zimny" wrote: If you were using a 3-jaw chuck and you were only off 1/2 thou, thenyou're ingood shape. The only way to be really sure is to turn a test piecebetweencenters. Most 3-jaw chacks are off much more than 1/2 thou.John Z FlyfishT@aol.com wrote: Hi, all. Thanks to zimney & nobler for their responses. I did not getthe 9x24 withquickchange chuck Southbend lathe. It looked a little too worn.I found alocal lathe, a 9x18 Southbend. It has manual change gears forthreading,butI did check teh bearings. I put a prybar under the spindle shaftwith thechuck off. It is maybe 1/4 of thousandths movement or less. I alsocheckedthe inside of the chuck hole and had about the same. This leads me to my question. After turning the piece of stock,and runningan indicator on it by hand, it's maybe 5/1000th off as I spin it.I wasmicing the chuck jaws and they are very worn. I was wondering ifI can justinvest in new chuck jaws. Will this correct the problem? Are thesechuck jawsstandard in all three-jaw chucks? Can I get these through MSC?I don't wantto invest in a new chuck,since they start at about $160. good. The restof the unit looks pretty good, too. Thanks in advance, Tom --------------DE5F7865E154DE0FE1EF0511-- from mrj@aa.net Mon Dec 13 17:35:16 1999 Mon, 13 Dec 1999 15:34:57 -0800 Subject: RE: Synthetic Cork? Possible Good News boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0015_01BF457F.649961C0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0015_01BF457F.649961C0 I'm thinking that if they get the cork away from the wine, then it willleave more cork for us rod builders!-----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu FuhrmanSent: Monday, December 13, 1999 1:25 PM Subject: Synthetic Cork? Possible Good News Listers, Snipped from the Nov. 15th issue of Design News Magazine. "Neocork Technologies has developed a cork (Wine Bottle Cork) made withAFFINITY polyolefin plastomers (POPs) that, says the company, is tougherthan traditional corks and won't break when pulled out of the bottle." "Dow Plastics (Midland, MI) supplied the material and worked withNeocorkto develop the cork." According to the article 22 wineries are now using the new syntheticcork.If less tree bark cork is being used by the wineries there should be moreand better cork available for fly rod grips. Maybe we should look into using this product for grips, it is supposed tobe non-absorbent. Nah!! Thought you might like to know. Best Wishes for the Holiday Season Dick Fuhrmandickay@alltel.net ------=_NextPart_000_0015_01BF457F.649961C0 thinking that if they get the cork away from the wine, then it will = cork for us rod builders! FuhrmanSent: Monday, December 13, 1999 1:25 = NewsListers, Snipped from the Nov. 15th issue of Design News Magazine. "Neocork Technologies has developed a cork (Wine Bottle Cork) = AFFINITY polyolefin plastomers (POPs) that, says the company, is = traditional corks and won't break when pulled out of the =bottle." "Dow Plastics (Midland, MI) supplied the material and worked with = to develop the cork." According to the article 22 wineries are now using the new = be more and better cork available for fly rod grips. Maybe we should look into using this product for grips, it is = be non-absorbent. Nah!! Thought you might like to know. Best Wishes for the Holiday Season Dick Fuhrmandickay@alltel.net ------=_NextPart_000_0015_01BF457F.649961C0-- from flyman35@home.com Mon Dec 13 18:12:33 1999 (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with ESMTP Subject: acetone Is there any harm in using acetone to remove spots of varnish from animpregnated blank? I've used it to take of remaining spots afterstripping a varnished blank with no problems. Will it affect theimpregnation? Thanks, Matt from nobler@satx.rr.com Mon Dec 13 18:35:12 1999 SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.197.19);Mon, 13 Dec 1999 18:35:28 -0600 Subject: Re: acetone boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0069_01BF4598.D824D020" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0069_01BF4598.D824D020 I would think that turpentine would be better for varnish, since acetone =is such a HOT liquid. It can soften, and curdle varnish, if left on it =very long. Impregnated cane would be a totally different thing, as those =I've seen, are pretty impervious to most solvents. GMA Sent: Monday, December 13, 1999 6:17 PMSubject: acetone Is there any harm in using acetone to remove spots of varnish from animpregnated blank? I've used it to take of remaining spots afterstripping a varnished blank with no problems. Will it affect theimpregnation? Thanks, Matt ------=_NextPart_000_0069_01BF4598.D824D020 I would think that turpentine would be = varnish, since acetone is such a HOT liquid. It can soften, and curdle = if left on it very long. Impregnated cane would be a totally different = those I've seen, are pretty impervious to most =solvents. GMA ----- Original Message ----- MATTHEW = Sent: Monday, December 13, 1999= PMSubject: acetoneIs there any harm in using acetone to remove spots of = =theimpregnation?Thanks,Matt ------=_NextPart_000_0069_01BF4598.D824D020-- from Canerods@aol.com Mon Dec 13 19:27:13 1999 Subject: Re: Para 15 thread color RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.edu In a message dated 12/13/99 12:52:27 AM Pacific Standard Time, cattanac@wmis.net writes: Wayne, Do you have some silk #541 - if you do, send me a short piece and I'll seeif I can match it to some large spools of un-numbered brown silk that I have. Then I can send some to Chris if he needs it. Don Burns from knflyrod@home.com Mon Dec 13 21:08:18 1999 (InterMail v4.01.01.00 201-229-111) with SMTP Mon, 13 Dec 1999 19:08:14 -0800 Subject: Re: Restoratations boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0054_01BF45AE.7AC01D20" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0054_01BF45AE.7AC01D20 A product I use and have used for several years is "The Victorian House" =WOOD REFINISHER. Phone 1-800-572-6270 or 1 918-396-4636. Usingsteel =wool wrapped over a lollipop stick wound tightly, for the varnished cane =and Q-tips for the wraps and the decals. I have found this did not =disturb the glue used to bind the strips. I also have not had any =adverse problems with the three decals I had. It will remove the script =of Heddon, Granger and Orvis. If you are doing intermediates you must =be very gentle. I hope this will work for you. It takes time but the =results are spectacular. Ron Huff Sent: Sunday, December 05, 1999 10:08 AMSubject: Restoratations I know there are a number of real pro rod restorers here, and I'd =appreciate some advice. I have 5 high quality rods, of which I know the I.D. of two. All of =these have real badly checkered varnish on them. If ever "aligatored" =applied, this is the perfect description ! Three of these have perfect =windings, in all original condition. I'd appreciate any views on saving these wraps, but stripping the =finish, so that they can be re-varnished. GMA ------=_NextPart_000_0054_01BF45AE.7AC01D20 A product I use and have used for several years is = wound = tightly, for the varnished cane and Q-tips for the wraps and the = Huff ----- Original Message ----- nobler Sent: Sunday, December 05, 1999= AMSubject: Restoratations I know there are a number of real pro rod= here, and I'd appreciate some advice. "aligatored" applied, this is the perfect description ! Three of these = perfect windings, in all original condition. I'd appreciate any views on saving these wraps, but = finish, so that they can be re-varnished. GMA ------=_NextPart_000_0054_01BF45AE.7AC01D20-- from saweiss@flash.net Mon Dec 13 23:29:17 1999 "Rodmakers List" Subject: Re: Synthetic Cork? Possible Good News boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0017_01BF45B9.87117DC0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0017_01BF45B9.87117DC0 Only wishful thinking. If the market for cork goes down, then the rest =of the cork tree groves will become condos.I'm thinking that if they get the cork away from the wine, then it =will leave more cork for us rod builders!-----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu = FuhrmanSent: Monday, December 13, 1999 1:25 PM Subject: Synthetic Cork? Possible Good News Listers, Snipped from the Nov. 15th issue of Design News Magazine. "Neocork Technologies has developed a cork (Wine Bottle Cork) made =with AFFINITY polyolefin plastomers (POPs) that, says the company, is =tougher than traditional corks and won't break when pulled out of the =bottle." "Dow Plastics (Midland, MI) supplied the material and worked with =Neocork to develop the cork." According to the article 22 wineries are now using the new synthetic =cork. If less tree bark cork is being used by the wineries there should =be more and better cork available for fly rod grips. Maybe we should look into using this product for grips, it is =supposed to be non-absorbent. Nah!! Thought you might like to know. Best Wishes for the Holiday Season Dick Fuhrmandickay@alltel.net ------=_NextPart_000_0017_01BF45B9.87117DC0 Only wishful thinking. If themarket = condos. thinking that if they get the cork away from the wine, then it will = cork for us rod builders! -----Original Message-----From: owner-rodmakers@wugate.w= rodmakers@w= Behalf Of Dick & Kathy FuhrmanSent: Monday, = Possible Good NewsListers, Snipped from the Nov. 15th issue of Design News Magazine. "Neocork Technologies has developed a cork (Wine Bottle Cork) = AFFINITY polyolefin plastomers (POPs) that, says the company, is = than traditional corks and won't break when pulled out of the =bottle." "Dow Plastics (Midland, MI) supplied the material and worked = Neocork to develop the cork." According to the article 22 wineries are now using the new = should be more and better cork available for fly rod grips. Maybe we should look into using this product for grips, it is = to be non-absorbent. Nah!! Thought you might like to know. Best Wishes for the Holiday Season Dick Fuhrmandickay@alltel.net ------=_NextPart_000_0017_01BF45B9.87117DC0-- from Grhghlndr@aol.com Tue Dec 14 07:36:26 1999 Subject: Re: acetone rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu Turpentine wil not be hot enough to cut old varnish off of a rod. from nobler@satx.rr.com Tue Dec 14 07:53:21 1999 SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.197.19);Tue, 14 Dec 1999 07:53:35 -0600 Subject: Re: acetone boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000B_01BF4608.5752F380" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000B_01BF4608.5752F380 I was only referring to getting water spots off. GMA Sent: Tuesday, December 14, 1999 7:35 AMSubject: Re: acetone Turpentine wil not be hot enough to cut old varnish off of a rod. ------=_NextPart_000_000B_01BF4608.5752F380 I was only referring to getting water off. GMA ----- Original Message ----- Grhghlndr@aol.com ; rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= Sent: Tuesday, December 14, = AMSubject: Re: acetoneTurpentine wil not be hot enough to cut old varnish off = rod. ------=_NextPart_000_000B_01BF4608.5752F380-- from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Tue Dec 14 08:59:32 1999 Tue, 14 Dec 1999 06:59:19 -0800 RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Re: Para 15 thread color Don, Chris, and others As I mentioned before, Ron Huff, a member of this list, has quite afewlarge (900 yd.) spools of the silk that Wayne mentioned. His prices arereasonable as I remember. I bought two spools from Ron and have beenwellpleased. He can be reached at knflyrod@home.com No financial interests .... blah, blah, blah, Harry Canerods@aol.com wrote: In a message dated 12/13/99 12:52:27 AM Pacific Standard Time,cattanac@wmis.net writes: today that color only comes in nylon >> Wayne, Do you have some silk #541 - if you do, send me a short piece and I'll seeifI can match it to some large spools of un-numbered brown silk that Ihave.Then I can send some to Chris if he needs it. Don Burns from patrick.w.coffey@boeing.com Tue Dec 14 09:32:04 1999 HAA19115 HAA05542 ESMTP forrodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu; Tue, 14 Dec 1999 07:26:52 -0800 (5.5.2448.0) Subject: FW: Synthetic Cork? Possible Good News Subject: RE: Synthetic Cork? Possible Good News My cousins husband is a cork buyer for the wine industry in Californiaand he ischecking on the possibility of a big cork buy for us. How this would comeabout is stillup in the air as far as buying and distribution. As I find out more I will letthe listknow. I gave him some samples of what size and quality we are looking forand hopefullysomething will come of it. Patrick W. CoffeyAOG Incident Repair PlanningPhone: 425-234-2901Fax: 425-237-0083M-2112 M/C 61-79 ----------From: Martin Jensen[SMTP:mrj@aa.net] Sent: Monday, December 13, 1999 3:33 PM Subject: RE: Synthetic Cork? Possible Good News I'm thinking that if they get the cork away from the wine, then it willleave more cork -----Original Message----- rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu]On Behalf Of Dick & Kathy FuhrmanSent: Monday, December 13, 1999 1:25 PM Subject: Synthetic Cork? Possible Good News Listers, Snipped from the Nov. 15th issue of Design News Magazine. "Neocork Technologies has developed a cork (Wine Bottle Cork) madewith AFFINITYpolyolefin plastomers (POPs) that, says the company, is tougher thantraditional corksand won't break when pulled out of the bottle." "Dow Plastics (Midland, MI) supplied the material and worked withNeocork todevelop the cork." According to the article 22 wineries are now using the newsynthetic cork. Ifless tree bark cork is being used by the wineries there should be more andbetter corkavailable for fly rod grips. Maybe we should look into using this product for grips, it is supposedto benon-absorbent. Nah!! Thought you might like to know. Best Wishes for the Holiday Season Dick Fuhrmandickay@alltel.net from stetzer@csd.uwm.edu Tue Dec 14 10:39:18 1999 batch3.csd.uwm.edu (8.8.4/8.6.8) with ESMTP id KAA02013 for; (8.8.4/8.6.8) withSMTP id KAA19686 for ; Tue, 14 Dec 1999 Subject: Leather wheel honing questions I rigged up a leather stropping wheel over the weekend, following thedirections of Tom Smithwick and others on this list. I ran into a couple small snags and just thought I'd ask for a little advise. My leather is pretty thick with a smooth (finished) outer surface.I went to the new Woodcraft store to get some of the green honingcompound but I let the clerk steer me into buying stuff called "Yellow Stone" (I think that's right) that "everybody is using."I can't seem to get it to stick to the smooth leather. I assume the solution is to get the green stuff, and file the yellow on the pile of items I've bought that didn't work out (otherwiseknown as the workbench.) But before I drive way across town againIthought I'd make sure that the wheel is supposed to be shiny smooth.(I believe carvers hone on felt and rough leather wheels.) My second snag is that I've got a bump where the two ends of the leather come together. They aren't loose at all and the fit is good, but just the lack of tension on the outer surface of theleather makes a little bump at that point. Is that the end of the world? I probably can shave it down with a razor blade and make itless noticeable. Thinner leather would probably be better for thisapplication.......................................................................Frank Stetzer "...a cheerful comrade is betterstetzer@uwm.edu than a waterproof coat and a Employed by, but not speaking for foot-warmer." Henry Van Dyke,Univ of Wisconsin-Milwaukee, USA "Fisherman's Luck", 1899. from Kirk_Brownlee@jdedwards.com Tue Dec 14 10:46:30 1999 VirusWall NT);Tue, 14 Dec 1999 09:44:33 -0700 (Mountain Standard Time) (5.5.2650.21) Subject: Mike Clark Hello, Does anyone have Mike Clarks Phone# in Lions, CO. I need the phone number i need to check on my Rod status and I forget thename of his comp. Something Creek Thanks, Kirk D Brownlee from fbcwin@3g.quik.com Tue Dec 14 11:00:15 1999 Tue, 14 Dec 1999 09:00:05 -0800 Subject: Re: Mike Clark South Creek Ltd.PO Box 981Lyons, CO 80540 (800)354-5050(303)823-6402 "Brownlee, Kirk (Contractor)" wrote: Hello, Does anyone have Mike Clarks Phone# in Lions, CO. I need the phone number i need to check on my Rod status and I forget thename of his comp. Something Creek Thanks, Kirk D Brownlee from rhd360@maine.edu Tue Dec 14 11:47:32 1999 Level 310) via TCPwith SMTP ; Tue, 14 Dec 1999 12:47:11 EST Subject: Re: Leather wheel honing questions Frank, On new leather I dab on some mineral oil and this solves theproblem ofgetting honing compounds to adhere better to the strop. --Bob. At 10:39 AM 12/14/99 -0600, Frank Stetzer wrote:I rigged up a leather stropping wheel over the weekend, following thedirections of Tom Smithwick and others on this list. I ran into acouple small snags and just thought I'd ask for a little advise. My leather is pretty thick with a smooth (finished) outer surface.I went to the new Woodcraft store to get some of the green honingcompound but I let the clerk steer me into buying stuff called"Yellow Stone" (I think that's right) that "everybody is using."I can't seem to get it to stick to the smooth leather. I assume thesolution is to get the green stuff, and file the yellow on thepile of items I've bought that didn't work out (otherwiseknown as the workbench.) But before I drive way across town againI thought I'd make sure that the wheel is supposed to be shiny smooth.(I believe carvers hone on felt and rough leather wheels.) My second snag is that I've got a bump where the two ends of theleather come together. They aren't loose at all and the fit isgood, but just the lack of tension on the outer surface of theleather makes a little bump at that point. Is that the end of theworld? I probably can shave it down with a razor blade and make itless noticeable. Thinner leather would probably be better for thisapplication.......................................................................Frank Stetzer "...a cheerful comrade is betterstetzer@uwm.edu than a waterproof coat and aEmployed by, but not speaking for foot- warmer." Henry Van Dyke,Univ of Wisconsin-Milwaukee, USA "Fisherman's Luck", 1899. Robert M. Milardo, Ph.D.Professor of Family Relations University of MaineOrono, ME 04469(207) 581-3128(207) 581-3120 FAX from mrmac@tcimet.net Tue Dec 14 12:55:51 1999 KAA01160; Subject: Re: Para 15 thread color Perhaps the issue is one of correct size thread or a change in the color ofGudebrod's #541 old vs new, or maybe I'm missing something, but I justwas lookingthrough one of the online rodmaking vendor's thread supply, and they showa #541,medium brown, in Gudebrod size 2/0 silk, FWIW. And a resounding "ME, TOO!" on the thanks to Mike for getting the list backgoing,and the time and trouble it takes to maintain it. I was gettin' the shakesandeverything........it was *awful*.. regards, mac Harry Boyd wrote: Don, Chris, and others As I mentioned before, Ron Huff, a member of this list, has quite afewlarge (900 yd.) spools of the silk that Wayne mentioned. His prices arereasonable as I remember. I bought two spools from Ron and have beenwellpleased. He can be reached at knflyrod@home.com No financial interests .... blah, blah, blah, Harry Canerods@aol.com wrote: In a message dated 12/13/99 12:52:27 AM Pacific Standard Time,cattanac@wmis.net writes: today that color only comes in nylon >> Wayne, Do you have some silk #541 - if you do, send me a short piece and I'llsee ifI can match it to some large spools of un-numbered brown silk that Ihave.Then I can send some to Chris if he needs it. Don Burns from TSmithwick@aol.com Tue Dec 14 13:31:44 1999 Subject: Re: Leather wheel honing questions RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.edu In a message dated 12/14/99 5:53:26 PM, rhd360@maine.edu writes: world? I probably can shave it down with a razor blade and make itless noticeable. >> Frank - I would shave away the raised lip, but don't worry about about absolute concentricity. If the tool vibrates a little bit, it does not seem to hurt the process. from tjtrodmaker@yahoo.com Tue Dec 14 14:16:55 1999 0000 1999 12:11:10 PST Subject: Re: Leather wheel honing questions greetings! you apparently are using the leather wheelso i have a question for you. is it necessary for thewheel to be wider than my plane blade or will a oneinch wheel do? ...and,do you occasionally retrue theblade on a stone? timothy --- TSmithwick@aol.com wrote: In a message dated 12/14/99 5:53:26 PM,rhd360@maine.edu writes: world? I probably can shave it down with a razorblade and make itless noticeable. >> Frank - I would shave away the raised lip, but don'tworry about about absolute concentricity. If the tool vibrates alittle bit, it does not seem to hurt the process. ====="Gooda' morning mister bear"__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. All in one place.Yahoo! Shopping: http://shopping.yahoo.com from conranch@ipeg.com Tue Dec 14 14:50:15 1999 0800 Subject: Yellowstone boundary="----=_NextPart_000_00D3_01BF4631.97917F60" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_00D3_01BF4631.97917F60 Hi List,Just have to put in my 2cents worth in.Having instructed wood carving for many years and teaching students to =properly sharpen all kinds of cutting tools. Have developed some sort of =proficiency. I use water stones or 60 rpm water stone wheels as the first step. We =use the Yellowstone block by shaving a liberal amount onto a strop. I do =not use a hard leather strop. I use a piece of suede leather glued to a =piece of wood about 2" wide by 12" long. After placing the now powder =onto the strop, push the blade away from the cutting edge. (holding at =about a 17 degree angle. This imparts an extremely high polished edge = I have never tried a power strop and as the above method works so well =doubt if I ever will. I can see where the powder might not stay on the = Forgot to mention than I am also a cabinet maker with over 50 years of =experience. I have tried all methods for sharpening but am very =comfortable with the Yellowstone mentioned. Thanks for telling of =another place where one can purchase it. I get mine from a carving = Will be happy to communicate directly with anyone that feels I might be =able to help in any way.RespectfullyDennis ConradCONRANCH HACKLES ------=_NextPart_000_00D3_01BF4631.97917F60 Hi List,Just have to put in my 2cents worth =in.Having instructed wood carving for manyyears = teaching students to properly sharpen all kinds of cutting tools. Have = some sort of proficiency.My method is as follows. I use water stones or 60 rpm water stone = first step. We use the Yellowstone block by shaving a liberal amount = strop. I do not use a hard leather strop. I use a piece of suede leather = to a piece of wood about 2" wide by 12" long. After placing = powder onto the strop, push the blade away from the cutting edge. = about a 17 degree angle. This imparts an extremely high polished edge = now cut cleanly if the angle was proper to begin with. I have never tried a power strop and as the= might not stay on the moving round surface. Forgot to mention than I am also a cabinet = over 50 years of experience. I have tried all methods for sharpening but = comfortable with the Yellowstone mentioned. Thanks for telling of = where one can purchase it. I get mine from a carving supply house. I do = Have no interests, etc. Will be happy to communicate directly with= feels I might be able to help in any way.RespectfullyDennis Conrad conranch@ipeg.com http://www.hot= ------=_NextPart_000_00D3_01BF4631.97917F60-- from tragich23@juno.com Tue Dec 14 14:50:57 1999 15:50:53 EST Subject: taper Anyone have a dryfly taper with a moderate swell at the grip for a 8'5wt.? AI from TSmithwick@aol.com Tue Dec 14 15:16:22 1999 Subject: Re: Leather wheel honing questions In a message dated 12/14/99 8:22:20 PM, tjtrodmaker@yahoo.com writes: Timothy - The wheel need not be as wide as the blade. Use the wheel justlike the grinding wheel on your bench grinder. I made my unit out of a 2X6, so it is 1 1/2 inches wide. If you make the wheel the same diameter as your grinding wheel, you will seldom have to regrind. from Fishnabug@aol.com Tue Dec 14 20:56:00 1999 Subject: Re: taper Al, I have the orginal version of this rod and it's a great all purpose #5, specifiically for dries. Best of luck. I have plenty of others, butrecommend this first.David Maxey Phillipson Pacemaker 8ft 3pc 5wt Design Notes: Phillipson Pacemaker 8ft 3pc 5wt. Posted by Rick Crenshaw on Apr 13, 1998. Note there is a big swell at the butt and a noticable step at the ferrules. 0.008 varnish thickness subtracted. Butt swell not shown; see documentation. Point Dimension Stress (F(b)) Rod Parameters1 0.065 42885 Rod Length 8 ft 0 in (= 96 inches)5 0.077 132540 Action Length 6 ft 10 in (= 82 inches)10 0.088 184835 Line Weight 515 0.101 191485 Pieces 320 0.117 172141 Line Fished 30 ft25 0.129 169001 Tip Factor 1.411435545385230 0.141 164119 Ferrule Type Standard35 0.172 115107 Ferrule #1 Rec. Size 10/64; Wt 0.162 oz.40 0.184 118508 Rod is 9.88/64 inches at 32.0 inches from tip45 0.196 120754 Ferrule #2 Rec. Size 16/64; Wt 0.415 oz.50 0.206 125915 Rod is 15.77/64 inches at 64.0 inches from tip55 0.215 132289 60 0.220 145849 65 0.254 111744 70 0.272 109169 75 0.284 113522 80 0.294 119823 82 0.298 122238 from dati@selway.umt.edu Tue Dec 14 21:10:18 1999 20:10:15 -0700 Just a quick note to see if anyone has a bit of information on the F. E.Thomas rod company. I held a nice F. E. Thomas rod a while back in JohnDufford's Panda Fodder Rod Co. shop. It was a lovely rod in originalcondition with full intermediate wraps. Just curious about the company, thanks. Darin Law from lblove@mo.quik.com Tue Dec 14 23:19:39 1999 Subject: a few culms boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0005_01BF4689.7EB02480" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01BF4689.7EB02480 Is there anyone out there that would be will to sell me a few culms of =bamboo. I have tried a few places and eitherthey have a huge min. sales or they do not reply to my emails or do not =return my telephone calls. Thanks for your time.Bradley Love ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01BF4689.7EB02480 Is there anyone out there that would be will to sell= they have a huge min. sales or they do not reply to = or do not return my telephone calls. Thanks for your time.Bradley Love ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01BF4689.7EB02480-- from tjtrodmaker@yahoo.com Wed Dec 15 07:38:24 1999 1999 05:38:21 PST Subject: test test test ====="Gooda' morning mister bear"__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. All in one place.Yahoo! Shopping: http://shopping.yahoo.com from caneman@clnk.com Wed Dec 15 07:52:38 1999 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35)with SMTP id com for ;Wed, 15 Dec 1999 07:50:44 -0600 Subject: Formula boundary="----=_NextPart_000_01C1_01BF46D0.BB57D260" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_01C1_01BF46D0.BB57D260 I know this is just a little off the rodmaking subject, but does anyone =have a formula for estimating the weight of a fish based on his length =and girth? Sorry to clutter up the board with this, but I figured one =of you would know if there was one. TNX,Bob ------=_NextPart_000_01C1_01BF46D0.BB57D260 I know this is just a little off the rodmaking subject, but does = have a formula for estimating the weight of a fish based on his length = would know if there was one. TNX,Bob ------=_NextPart_000_01C1_01BF46D0.BB57D260-- from rsgould@cmc.net Wed Dec 15 08:02:02 1999 Subject: Re: Hi Darin,There are several good sources for articles and information about theF.E.Thomas Co. In A.J. Campbell's book Fly Fishing Tackle it starts on page129 and in Martin Keane's book Classic Rods and Rodmakers there are abunchof references depending on what you're looking for. On the internet tryhttp://www.gorp.com/cl_angle/canecoun/thomas.htm.Ray----- Original Message ----- Just a quick note to see if anyone has a bit of information on the F. E.Thomas rod company. I held a nice F. E. Thomas rod a while back in JohnDufford's Panda Fodder Rod Co. shop. It was a lovely rod in originalcondition with full intermediate wraps. Just curious about the company, thanks. Darin Law from rsgould@cmc.net Wed Dec 15 08:10:42 1999 Subject: Re: a few culms boundary="----=_NextPart_000_001A_01BF46C3.15657180" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_001A_01BF46C3.15657180 Hi Larry,Try Harold Demarest at the C.H.Demarest Co. email address is =demaralon@aol.com, fax no. is 973-838-6538, telephone is 973-492- 1414=(they're in New Jersey). I have no connection with this company but have =always had excellent service.Ray Sent: Tuesday, December 14, 1999 9:18 PMSubject: a few culms Is there anyone out there that would be will to sell me a few culms of =bamboo. I have tried a few places and eitherthey have a huge min. sales or they do not reply to my emails or do =not return my telephone calls. Thanks for your time.Bradley Love ------=_NextPart_000_001A_01BF46C3.15657180 Hi Larry,Try Harold Demarest at theC.H.Demarest = address is demaralon@aol.com, = 973-838-6538, telephone is 973-492-1414 (they're in New Jersey). I have= connection with this company but have always had excellent =service.Ray ----- Original Message ----- Larry = = Sent: Tuesday, December 14, = PMSubject: a few culms Is there anyone out there that would be will to = eitherthey have a huge min. sales or they do not reply = emails or do not return my telephone calls. Thanks for your time.Bradley Love ------=_NextPart_000_001A_01BF46C3.15657180-- from patrick.w.coffey@boeing.com Wed Dec 15 08:17:09 1999 GAA04975 GAA14845 ESMTP forrodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu; Wed, 15 Dec 1999 06:16:22 -0800 (5.5.2448.0) Subject: help could someone help me, every post I get since the list came back up showsup twice. Is issomething I've done or do I need to get a hold of Mr. Biondo?? Patrick W. CoffeyAOG Incident Repair PlanningPhone: 425-234-2901Fax: 425-237-0083M-2112 M/C 61-79 from caneman@clnk.com Wed Dec 15 10:26:13 1999 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61365U2500L250S0V35)with SMTP id com for ;Wed, 15 Dec 1999 10:24:21 -0600 Subject: Re: Formula Bret... Wow, by that formula, I caught a 39,018 pound trout!!!! LOL -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Formula Bob,Length times girth times PI R Squared. Just kidding I used to know howtodothat and I will be interested in seeing how it is done too. Hope someoneremembers.Bret from avyoung@iinet.net.au Wed Dec 15 10:39:37 1999 Thu, 16 Dec 1999 00:39:09 +0800 Subject: Re: Formula Must have been from NZ ;-) Tony At 10:21 AM 12/15/99 -0600, Bob Nunley wrote:Bret... Wow, by that formula, I caught a 39,018 pound trout!!!! LOL -----Original Message-----From: Grhghlndr@aol.com Date: Wednesday, December 15, 1999 8:20 AMSubject: Re: Formula Bob,Length times girth times PI R Squared. Just kidding I used to know howtodothat and I will be interested in seeing how it is done too. Hope someoneremembers.Bret /*************************************************************************/AV Young Visit my web site at: www.iinet.net.au/~avyoung/flyrod.html And this our life, exempt from public haunt,Finds tongues in trees, books in running brooks,Sermons in stones, and good in everything. William Shakespeare, As You Like It /*************************************************************************/ from tjtrodmaker@yahoo.com Wed Dec 15 10:49:28 1999 1999 08:46:16 PST Subject: Re: Formula could you send that formula to me please? i'm hungry.timothy --- Bob Nunley wrote:Bret... Wow, by that formula, I caught a 39,018pound trout!!!! LOL -----Original Message-----From: Grhghlndr@aol.com Date: Wednesday, December 15, 1999 8:20 AMSubject: Re: Formula Bob,Length times girth times PI R Squared. Justkidding I used to know how todothat and I will be interested in seeing how it isdone too. Hope someoneremembers.Bret ====="Gooda' morning mister bear"__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. All in one place.Yahoo! Shopping: http://shopping.yahoo.com from gholland@navsys.com Wed Dec 15 11:45:31 1999 Rod Makers List Serve Subject: RE: Formula Here's the formula.....for real. Weight = (length * (girth ^ 2))/800 Thus, an 18 inch trout with a 12 inch girth would be 18 * (12 * 12)/800 =3.24 lbs This formula is for trout only....I know there is a slightly different onethat is considered accurate for steelhead and probably others for otherspecies... Greg Holland -----Original Message----- Subject: Formula I know this is just a little off the rodmaking subject, but does anyonehavea formula for estimating the weight of a fish based on his length andgirth?Sorry to clutter up the board with this, but I figured one of you wouldknowif there was one. TNX,Bob from mevans@acxiom.com Wed Dec 15 12:01:18 1999 (router,SLMail V3.2); Wed, 15 Dec 1999 12:06:48 -0600 (router,SLMail V3.2); Wed, 15 Dec 1999 12:01:55 -0600 (204.107.111.23::mail daemon; unverified,SLMail V3.2); Wed, 15 Dec1999 12:01:54-0600 popmail.conway.acxiom.com ; Wed Dec 1512:01:53 1999 -0600 (5.5.2650.21) Rod Makers List Serve Subject: RE: Formula Hi Bob,Here's some additional info that includes other species: The local game and fish prefers to use a general figure based on length averages from their surveys. AGF&C will snail mail you their length to weight averages at no charge: 1-800-364-4263. They saythe formulas, of course, are approximations too. The charts below came from: http://www.rideau- info.com/canal/fishcharts.html . - Canadian site. Forthefunofit - as long as we're off topic - here's a photo of the worldrecord brown: http://www.agfc.com/fishing/state_records/photo_brown_trout.html Personally, I think you should adjust the formula until you get what youwant. No need to spoil our heritage! Species Formula Bass ((length x length) x girth) / 1200 or (length x length x length) / 1600 Walleye (length x length x length) / 2700 N. Pike (length x length x length) / 3500 Trout ((girth x girth) x length) / 800 Length Bass Walleye N. Pike in cm lb kg lb kg lb kg 12 30 1.1 0.5 0.6 0.3 0.5 0.2 13 33 1.4 0.6 0.8 0.4 0.6 0.3 14 36 1.7 0.8 1.0 0.5 0.8 0.4 15 38 2.1 1.0 1.3 0.6 1.0 0.4 16 41 2.6 1.2 1.5 0.7 1.2 0.5 17 43 3.1 1.4 1.8 0.8 1.4 0.6 18 46 3.6 1.7 2.2 1.0 1.7 0.8 19 48 4.3 1.9 2.5 1.2 2.0 0.9 20 51 5.0 2.3 3.0 1.3 2.3 1.0 21 53 5.8 2.6 3.4 1.6 2.6 1.2 22 56 6.7 3.0 3.9 1.8 3.0 1.4 23 58 7.6 3.4 4.5 2.0 3.5 1.6 24 61 8.6 3.9 5.1 2.3 3.9 1.8 25 64 9.8 4.4 5.8 2.6 4.5 2.0 26 66 11.0 5.0 6.5 3.0 5.0 2.3 27 69 12.3 5.6 7.3 3.3 5.6 2.6 28 71 13.7 6.2 8.1 3.7 6.3 2.8 29 74 15.2 6.9 9.0 4.1 7.0 3.2 30 76 16.9 7.7 10.0 4.5 7.7 3.5 31 79 18.6 8.4 11.0 5.0 8.5 3.9 32 81 r 12.1 5.5 9.4 4.2 33 84 e 13.3 6.0 10.3 4.7 34 86 a 14.6 6.6 11.2 5.1 35 89 l 15.9 7.2 12.3 5.6 36 91 l 17.3 7.8 13.3 6.0 37 94 y 18.8 8.5 14.5 6.6 38 97 b 20.3 9.2 15.7 7.1 39 99 i 22.0 10.0 16.9 7.7 40 102 g 23.7 10.8 18.3 8.3 Subject: Formula I know this is just a little off the rodmaking subject, but does anyonehave a formula from par444@webtv.net Wed Dec 15 12:20:36 1999 168.iap.bryant.webtv.net ESMTP id 78F802CA5F 168.iap.bryant.webtv.net(8.8.8-wtv-d/mt.gso.26Feb98) id KAA06244; Wed, 15 Dec 1999 10:20:33 - ETAsAhQ6glk0wTfbZqvzGhJxVRjBGmHDYwIUUgemNaREWZK0Zvicf7H64xIy9ew= Subject: Fwd: a few culms --WebTV-Mail-12060-5 Dear Bradley"This is a phone number of a man who will sellyou first class bamboo: 1-717-738-7330- Ask for Russ Gooding and tellhim I sent you. Joe Stackhouse. --WebTV-Mail-12060-5 storefull-168.iap.bryant.webtv.net with WTV-SMTP; Tue, 14 Dec1999 mailsorter-102-1.bryant.webtv.net (WebTV_Postfix) with ESMTP id wugate.wustl.edu (8.8.8/8.8.5) wugate.wustl.edu(8.8.8/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA05412 for; (8.9.3/8.9.3)with SMTP id VAA75662 for ; Tue, 14Dec1999 21:19:12 -0800 Subject: a few culms boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0005_01BF4689.7EB02480" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01BF4689.7EB02480 Is there anyone out there that would be will to sell me a few culms of =bamboo. I have tried a few places and eitherthey have a huge min. sales or they do not reply to my emails or do not =return my telephone calls. Thanks for your time.Bradley Love ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01BF4689.7EB02480 Is there anyone out there that would be will to sell= they have a huge min. sales or they do not reply to = or do not return my telephone calls. Thanks for your time.Bradley Love ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01BF4689.7EB02480-- --WebTV-Mail-12060-5-- from mevans@acxiom.com Wed Dec 15 12:32:24 1999 (router,SLMail V3.2); Wed, 15 Dec 1999 12:37:51 -0600 (router,SLMail V3.2); Wed, 15 Dec 1999 12:32:56 -0600 (204.107.111.23::mail daemon; unverified,SLMail V3.2); Wed, 15 Dec1999 12:32:56-0600 popmail.conway.acxiom.com ; Wed Dec 1512:32:55 1999 -0600 (5.5.2650.21) Rod Makers List Serve Subject: RE: Formula Come to think of it, I believe a little more accurate formula would be((girth x girth) x length) / 800 x (.141592654 x (# times the story hasbeen told over aslice of pie)). Go ahead - flame me - I deserve it. from gholland@navsys.com Wed Dec 15 12:41:56 1999 "'caneman@clnk.com'",Rod Makers List Serve Subject: RE: Formula My formula was what occurs in a laboratory setting......yours is real life! Two quotes seem appropriate at this point: "A fish story backed by visual evidence is something you don't run intoevery day."- Walter W. Smith "Fishermen ar born honest, but they get over it."- Ed Zern Greg Holland -----Original Message----- Subject: RE: Formula Come to think of it, I believe a little more accurate formula would be((girth x girth) x length) / 800 x (.141592654 x (# times the story hasbeentold over a slice of pie)). Go ahead - flame me - I deserve it. from dati@selway.umt.edu Wed Dec 15 12:59:31 1999 1999 11:59:19 -0700 Subject: F. E. Thomas Rod Co. Thank you to all who sent me information. I appreciate it and apologize that in the future.Thanks,Darin Law from tragich23@juno.com Wed Dec 15 14:14:33 1999 15:14:09 EST Subject: cane handles anyone out there know where to get rattan for caned handles? I can onlyfind it in huge quantity and it's not really worth it to me. Also, ifanyone can give me advice on the subject I would appreciate it.TIAai from tjtrodmaker@yahoo.com Wed Dec 15 14:36:41 1999 0000 1999 12:36:39 PST Subject: book gentlemen, i read somewhere that this book is inprint again now i can't find it. can someone give mea hand up? timothy The Fine Bamboo Fly Rod : A Master's Secrets ofRestoration and Repair ====="Gooda' morning mister bear"__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. All in one place.Yahoo! Shopping: http://shopping.yahoo.com from pmgoodwin@earthlink.net Wed Dec 15 14:53:38 1999 Subject: Re: book -----Original Message----- Subject: *The Fine Bamboo Fly Rod*-2nd Ed.Dear Paul, Your request to Bamboo Fly Rod Magazine for information re: The FineBambooFly Rod-2nd Edition has been referred to me. Ordering information is asfollows: Thank you for your inquiry re: The Second Edition of The Fine Bamboo FlyRod,A Master's Secrets of Restoration and Repair, by Stuart Kirkfield; The Cork&Cane Press, 1999. The copies are only available through the publisher;theyare not sold in stores, at $59.95 or $79.95 for autographed copies (USPriority Mail and Insurance included) plus appropriate State Sales Tax forColorado residents. Sorry, but no credit card orders will be accepted.Payment by Check or Money Order only. Orders received with CertifiedBankCheck or Money Order will be processed immediately. Personal checksmustawait bank clearance prior to shipment. The book is in-print and currentlyin-stock for immediate delivery. Please make Checks or Money Orders payable to The Cork & Cane Press andsend The Cork & Cane Press8140 Spire CourtSuite AColorado Springs, CO 80919 Thank you for your interest,Stuart KirkfieldAuthor----- Original Message ----- Subject: book gentlemen, i read somewhere that this book is inprint again now i can't find it. can someone give mea hand up? timothy The Fine Bamboo Fly Rod : A Master's Secrets ofRestoration and Repair ====="Gooda' morning mister bear"__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. All in one place.Yahoo! Shopping: http://shopping.yahoo.com from chris@artistree.com Wed Dec 15 14:57:43 1999 Subject: Re: cane handles Rockler (www.rockler.com) @ 1-800-279-4441 seems to have a prettygoodselection of natural cane for restoring/repairing chairs. Differentsizes, thickness, and width. Prices range from $2 to $40 depending onlinear feet. Haven't used this cane for a handle but appears to be thesame stuff.-- Regards, Chris Wohlford P.S. - you might want to pick up some Glycerine as well. It makes thecane flexible and much easier to handle. ANDREW J INGRAM wrote: anyone out there know where to get rattan for caned handles? I can onlyfind it in huge quantity and it's not really worth it to me. Also, ifanyone can give me advice on the subject I would appreciate it.TIAai from darrell@rockclimbing.org Wed Dec 15 15:24:08 1999 sims.3.5.1999.09.16.21.57.p8)with SMTP id for Subject: RE: book Hi Tim, The book retails for $79.95 plus shipping... I am auctioning a autographedcopy that is currently at about $53.00. Here's the link. http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=218034439 Regards, Darrell Lee -----Original Message----- Subject: book gentlemen, i read somewhere that this book is inprint again now i can't find it. can someone give mea hand up? timothy The Fine Bamboo Fly Rod : A Master's Secrets ofRestoration and Repair ====="Gooda' morning mister bear"__________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. All in one place.Yahoo! Shopping: http://shopping.yahoo.com from darrell@rockclimbing.org Wed Dec 15 15:32:52 1999 sims.3.5.1999.09.16.21.57.p8)with SMTP id for Subject: RE: cane handles I think Demarest also has rattan too... Darrell Lee -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: cane handles Rockler (www.rockler.com) @ 1-800-279-4441 seems to have a prettygoodselection of natural cane for restoring/repairing chairs. Differentsizes, thickness, and width. Prices range from $2 to $40 depending onlinear feet. Haven't used this cane for a handle but appears to be thesame stuff.-- Regards, Chris Wohlford P.S. - you might want to pick up some Glycerine as well. It makes thecane flexible and much easier to handle. ANDREW J INGRAM wrote: anyone out there know where to get rattan for caned handles? I can onlyfind it in huge quantity and it's not really worth it to me. Also, ifanyone can give me advice on the subject I would appreciate it.TIAai from freaner@gte.net Wed Dec 15 17:35:50 1999 ; id RAA824479 Subject: Re: cane handles At 12:08 PM -0800 on 12/15/99, ANDREW J INGRAM wrote: anyone out there know where to get rattan for caned handles? I can onlyfind it in huge quantity and it's not really worth it to me. Also, ifanyone can give me advice on the subject I would appreciate it.TIAai I'd suggest the quickest might be your local craft store (Michel's, MJ Designs, etc.). My wife makes baskets and has bought stuff there - comes in many different diameters from around 1/16 inch on up. from the few (very) rods I've seen with this type of handle, I'd suggest you look for "reed" as opposed to "cane" - the reed used is actually from a vine and has been pulled through sizing dies to make it a nice uniform thickness and circular diameter. Another source she uses is the Basket Maker's Catalog at http://www.basketmakerscatalog.com/ or by telephone at 1-800-447-7008 Claude from Finanplanr@aol.com Wed Dec 15 18:56:49 1999